Copyright: Vintage 11-Feb-2002 © 2002 NoteWorthy Software, Inc.
Citation: Copyright © 2002 by NoteWorthy Software, Inc.


Introduction
Welcome!

Welcome to the NoteWorthy Composer Offline Forum.

You can use this offline version of the forum to browse through the forum information without being connected online. Use the browse buttons, labelled as << and >>, to quickly move through the forum topics. You can also use the Go Online button to visit our corresponding web page related to the current content.

Much of the content of this offline forum is based on contributions from the online NoteWorthy Composer community. The ideas and opinions included within the forum does not necessarily reflect the ideas and opinions of NoteWorthy Software.

This file contains all of the online forum content that was present as of 11-Feb-2002. You can check for newer editions of this offline forum by going visiting our web site. Just press the Go Online button whenever you want to visit our web site.

Note: Some of the topics in the forum were started long ago, and may not be relevant to the latest version of the NoteWorthy Composer product. Please keep this in mind as you browse through the topics in this forum.

License and distribution: This help package is made available as freeware. As such, you may use it at no charge, but you do so at your own risk.

You may also freely distribute this package, provided that you do not alter its contents in any way.

See also: http://noteworthycomposer.com

Copyright ©  2002 by NoteWorthy Software, Inc.

All rights reserved.


Index
NoteWorthy Composer Offline Forum Index

The following topics are included in this offline version of the forum. Click on any topic to read its contents.

• #2: How do I edit members of an existing chord?

• #3: How do I change the key signature of an existing staff?

• #4: How to: Change the clef for an existing staff or selection

• #5: How to: Get started using the product

• #6: selecting

• #7: WISH LIST

• #8: How do we notate cres. and decres. as symbols???

• #9: Percussion Support

• #10: Please explain...

• #13: Fermata

• #16: Chord containing a rest

• #17: WISH LIST

• #18: Putting .nwc on website

• #20: Tip: Creating Voice Activated NWC Commands

• #21: Sending Noteworthy files via e-mail

• #22: Endings

• #24: How to handle pentoles (five notes per unit) ?

• #26: Appoggiaturas

• #27: Good theoretical Music Tutorial Sought

• #29: More voices on one staff

• #31: 'NTW True-Type Font Error'

• #32: Appogiaturae (Grace Notes)

• #33: Alla Breve

• #34: Combining rests and notes

• #35: Adding a staff... or suppressing one for printing

• #36: Tie across meter change.

• #38: NoteWorty 2 ?

• #39: "Stuck" Notes

• #40: deletion of fermata

• #42: "Pick up" Lyrics

• #43: MIDI File Creation

• #44: Possible additions

• #45: printing niceties

• #47: lyric for second ending

• #49: Double stems

• #50: Midi import and triplets?

• #51: Quintruplets!!

• #52: Duplets

• #53: Swiss Style Drumming staffs & Scottish Drumming Music

• #54: use of score editeur

• #55: cadenza

• #57: Midi Volume and Note Velocity

• #58: Trills

• #59: Rests Grouped with Notes

• #60: What's MIDI?

• #61: Separate durations on a staff

• #62: Looking for Music of "Michel Polnareff" Title "On ira tous."

• #64: Copy-to-file bug?

• #67: Is there any way to add acciaccatura's ..?

• #68: Question about MIDI files

• #69: Bodgy fix for Arpeggios

• #70: Set key signature after MIDI import

• #71: Yet another MIDI import demand

• #72: Combining staves

• #73: Exporting Midi Files

• #74: Transposition

• #75: Back-to-back repeated sections?

• #76: Global change of speed of execution

• #78: Different Notes on the same bar

• #79: transposition

• #80: What's Fermata with me?

• #81: Next Upgrade

• #82: importing midi tracks

• #83: Tonal Harmony

• #84: Default zoom level

• #85: Octave Above and Octave Below

• #86: Note Stems and Beams

• #87: NWC font

• #88: Musical symbols in song titles

• #91: Midi Imports

• #93: Putting NWC files on your web page

• #94: Putting two stems on a single note.

• #95: Pasting from Clipboard

• #96: Up and down bow symbols.

• #97: Printing Problem

• #98: Foot mouse ???

• #100: audition problems

• #102: Copyright symbol

• #103: Incorrect enharmonic spellings in minor keys

• #104: NWC Macros (Windows 3.x)

• #105: Drum Set sounds and bending pitches

• #106: Lazy forum...

• #107: Percussion on different scores

• #109: Guitar and Mandolin Tab from Noteworthy

• #110: Formatting for printing - HELP!

• #112: WHAT NOTES ARE WHAT FOR DRUMS

• #113: Musical symbols in song titles or on song tile pages

• #114: MIDI type 0 to type 1 converter?

• #115: Problems with Flow Control and Refrains

• #116: Non-GM Drum Mappings

• #117: Converting Scores to .GIF

• #118: Delayed chords

• #119: Dots 'n' beams

• #120: Congratulations!

• #121: How do I get two words on a single note?

• #122: Transposing

• #123: Printing Problems

• #126: Another Drum Question

• #128: Keyboard entry

• #129: Bar Numbers

• #130: Bar Numbers

• #131: multi-measure rests in parts, movements.

• #132: Bar lines on 32 notes

• #133: Ragtime, Dixieland, and Popular Music from 1890-1930

• #134: Creating a multiple movement piece

• #136: Maximum number of staffs?

• #137: Sustain (peddle on/off) notation in score printouts

• #138: Keyboard Entry

• #139: BUGS

• #140: Copy to .bmp

• #141: Fiendish Accuracy in Recording from MIDI

• #142: Editing Text

• #144: Double Beaming (Dumbie Question #2:))

• #145: Multiplets and Glissando

• #146: Text author name

• #147: Click and drag notes to pitch

• #148: Copyright Symbol information

• #150: Keyboard entry with SB16

• #151: Controlling Width and Number of Measures per Line?

• #152: Cue notes for other instruments

• #153: MIDI MIDI MIDI Aaaaah!

• #154: Adding an instrument??

• #155: Pitch Bend

• #156: Drum Notation

• #157: crescendo and decrescendo signs for PostScript printers

• #159: Staff length and layout

• #162: Re: Staff Length and Layout

• #163: Can you BEAM across a rest

• #164: Can a tie cross a change of time signature?

• #165: Changing TeXt font & size

• #166: Crescendo/Decrescendo signs (4 PostScript) html page

• #167: How to enrich the simbols

• #168: Piano fingering

• #169: Drum Roll

• #170: Importing MIDI pitch bends?

• #171: Hesitation on Playback on 32-Bit (Win95) NWC

• #172: Printing Multi Staves

• #173: PRINTING Multi Staves

• #174: Cannot Make Step Record Work

• #175: Grace Notes

• #176: Beats/min vs different tempi

• #177: Can I control the position of a SLUR mark

• #180: Few notes not sounding on playback

• #181: Downloading forum msgs.

• #182: Best Keyboard?

• #183: Lyric font size & editing

• #184: Connecting a MIDI Keyboard

• #185: Multi note passages

• #188: crescendo and decrescendo signs (for PostScript printer), II

• #189: Big Band, Jazz and Pop

• #190: Pitch Bend

• #191: 2 voice on 1 line ?

• #193: Resolution

• #194: Transposition

• #195: Need help on "sections(?)"

• #196: Composing for Fife

• #197: "triplet tool" number

• #198: Rudimental Drumming

• #199: assigning tempo?

• #200: Archive of Classical Music

• #203: Beaming Quavers (eighth notes)

• #204: Entering Notes - what's the best way to do it ?

• #205: NWC with Terratec Maesstro card -> More instruments

• #206: Can certian note patterns be entered?

• #207: Suggestion of improvement

• #208: Forum User E-Mail address

• #209: Adding a line-break to a Stave

• #210: Noteworthy versus Passport Designs

• #211: Noteworthy versus Passport Designs

• #212: Noteworthy versus Passport Designs

• #213: stereo panning

• #214: Track Structure of Exported Files

• #215: Using various TTF Fonts

• #216: Staff Wraparound

• #217: 5 beats in a 4 beat measure?

• #218: Tie to Coda

• #221: 4 notes in 3 beat group (6/8 time)

• #222: Trills, tremollos and mordents

• #223: lyrics

• #224: Conflicting Objectives of NWC

• #225: Dynamics

• #226: NWC an overall view

• #227: Conflicting objectives of NWC

• #228: MusiXTeX Converter?

• #229: Use of Laptop Speaker

• #230: Help!

• #231: Text

• #232: Editing Staff

• #233: Labelling the Staff

• #234: Playback

• #235: Sound Quality

• #238: Writing measure numbers on a score (version 1.31d)

• #239: Sound Quality

• #240: Weird notation--Is there a representation in NWC?

• #241: Display of notation

• #242: Sound Quality

• #243: Playback of Transposing instruments

• #244: Playback tempo

• #245: Library?

• #246: Comments on 131d

• #247: A good MIDI & synth glossary on the Web

• #248: Crossing Parts

• #249: NWC Support

• #251: transposing clefs

• #252: workaround for bug when editing clef

• #253: Chord with rest

• #254: Recording from a keyboard

• #255: I love NoteWorthy Composer

• #256: Comment Field and Font

• #257: Fonts: A language perspective

• #258: Jazz/pop chart writing symbols

• #259: Fermatas not exported

• #261: What is the best sound card?

• #262: glissando - possible?

• #263: Exporting Graphics

• #265: AWE64 Soundfonts

• #266: NIF - Notation Interchange Format

• #268: Octave Sign &

• #270: Importing Long Rests

• #273: triplet bracketing

• #274: Adding reverb to playback

• #275: Digital Archives

• #276: Drums, Drums, and more Drums!

• #278: 2 against 3 or 3 against 4

• #279: Problem with Noteworthy

• #282: problem pre-viewing a print and printing on demo of 1.31

• #283: About import note and rest values...

• #285: Highlighting staves

• #286: Two part staves

• #287: Hearing Single Staff

• #288: Midi Keyboard

• #289: Pauses During Playback

• #290: Export, modify & print: nearly all you wish for!

• #292: Recording Problems

• #293: Weird Sounds

• #294: How to do a Bridge

• #295: SB16 no sound - FYI

• #296: Importing triplets

• #298: How Do I Add A Glissando

• #299: Supressing Empty Staves

• #300: New version...?

• #301: Downloading NWC files from the internet

• #302: Programmed composition?

• #304: How do I reset my "seen map"

• #306: Problem using Soundbanks in NWC 1.31d

• #307: Hints on using this forum

• #308: Getting the whole forum

• #309: Keyboard/computer setup

• #310: Bug in Audit Accidentals?

• #311: Multi-bar rests.

• #312: using stereo in midis

• #313: NWC to MID

• #314: NWC32.EXE Command Line Options

• #315: Selecting alternate drum sets

• #316: Octaves

• #317: Instrument Choices

• #318: importing/recording chords

• #319: lyrics

• #320: Exporting

• #321: playback doesn't line up with the notes

• #322: Copying from a bitmap into NoteWorthy

• #323: Drum Rudiments

• #324: Chords containing the same note.

• #325: NWC32

• #327: Keyboard Macros

• #328: converting piano on multiple MIDI channels

• #329: Input via Midi Keyboard and AWE64 Sound Card

• #330: chord names above the staff

• #331: Bar lines in orchestral scores

• #332: "hard" returns

• #334: Play Won't Play

• #335: Congratulation

• #336: Grace notes added in 1.5 beta NWC

• #337: changing instrument problems. . .

• #338: Bug in Stem Up/Stem down???

• #339: Note ties (Bug?)

• #340: Staff display when printing

• #341: Timeing

• #344: What measure am I on?

• #346: newsgroup

• #347: no sound

• #348: newsgroup

• #350: Sound "Quality" ?

• #351: Support for GS and/or XG

• #352: Wish List or ?

• #353: Different staffs during choir song

• #354: Newsgroup access

• #355: transpose to another instrument

• #356: Several (perhaps already asked) questions......

• #357: 4part div. to 8 part harmony

• #358: Another Wish List

• #359: OCR and NWC

• #363: 1.5  16-bit version

• #365: Page layout

• #370: Wish List Items in this Forum

• #371: How to concatenate compositions

• #372: How To Find the Wish List

• #373: WOW! I don't believe it; NWC CAN'T PLAY JAZZ TRAX!

• #374: so while i wait

• #375: Transpose for an E flat instrument

• #376: From Treble clef to Bass clef

• #377: Timing and triplets

• #378: Version 1.5 16 bit comments.

• #379: Missing Double Dot Icon in 1.5 Beta 3

• #380: Missing Specify Zoom Level in Beta 3

• #382: A black Yamaha keyboard

• #383: Grace notes

• #384: drum sounds

• #386: move staff

• #387: drum notation

• #388: WinGroove

• #390: AWE64 Gold

• #392: keyboard accuracy

• #393: Grouping rests into a block

• #395: Blue Bar and Zoom Function in NWC 1.50 Beta !!!

• #396: Notes of different values at the same time!!

• #397: Fermata

• #399: rest in chord member?

• #400: is it possible to print out a non-english title??

• #401: my wish to wish list

• #403: Wishes: Crescendo Symbols; Rests in Chords

• #404: Suggestion for multiple rests

• #405: NoteWorthy and Mac/OS

• #406: Wish for more objects to be hideable.

• #407: what's grace notes?

• #408: Toooo Staccato?

• #409: Importing recording..... Help!?!?

• #410: Brush Set revisited...

• #411: Stick with NWC or go with Steinberg Cubasis?

• #412: Print Layout

• #413: Noteworthy areas on AOL

• #414: meter conversion

• #415: Can you combine rests?

• #417: 3 Note Chords to 3 Tracks

• #418: ornaments in NoteWorthy Composer

• #419: groupings other than triplets

• #420: flexible location of a rest

• #421: MIDI Playback

• #422: Staves Covering Text

• #423: Beaming problems.

• #424: Control on printing.

• #425: Lyric Editor

• #426: Print Preview and Zooming

• #427: Editing non-preserved width text, etc.

• #428: Printing Bug???

• #429: NoteWorthy Player 1.5

• #430: File conversion: NWC or MIDI to .wav

• #431: Copy from Print Preview to Clipboard (32-bit)

• #434: moonlight sonata

• #435: Player command line

• #436: Recording enhancement desired

• #437: Value for Money

• #438: Swing wish list item

• #439: fake notes for finger snapping or talking

• #440: Forum Files

• #442: Ties

• #443: Special characters in fonts (ie: shape notes, etc)

• #444: Just bought this fabulous book!

• #445: Several bar rests.

• #446: Rejected yet again

• #447: WinGroove concerns.

• #448: Lyricist/composer info

• #449: Right Mouse Button

• #450: Global Changes

• #451: Timing errors?

• #452: Keyboard and NotheWorthy

• #453: Auto Generation of Chord Names

• #455: Solution!! 5 notes in the time of 4

• #456: cue notes

• #457: Tacit

• #458: font size for notes

• #459: Beaming with Stems Up and Down

• #460: Pitch Bend Questions

• #461: layering

• #462: Quantising

• #463: Add a Staff only for part of piece

• #464: Audio to MIDI conversion?

• #466: Sharing the audio device

• #468: Strange attractors (Ties running wild)

• #469: DS al Fine vs. Repeats

• #471: Please help (request)

• #472: Converting keyboard files to midi

• #473: Starting tempo

• #474: Measure numbers

• #475: Placing rests between beamed notes

• #476: Hairpins etc.

• #477: NWC file association not possible

• #478: NWC 1.5 difficulties

• #479: Hanging Notes After Transposition

• #480: Putting a little swing into the thing

• #484: Printing Problem - NWC 1.5

• #485: Importing NIFF files

• #487: Printing Problems with 1.5

• #489: Printing and Transposing MIDI Files

• #490: More Wishes

• #491: Copying Lyrics

• #492: Fermata placement

• #493: Noteworthy Player

• #494: Problem with staccato?

• #495: ABC to noteworthy, tune archives

• #496: Wrong measure-numbers after repeat

• #497: addition to the nwc roles--also MIDI

• #498: Transpose Viola Clef to Tebble Clef

• #499: Decorated Bar Lines

• #500: Increase note spacing in combination with a rest

• #501: Newsgroup

• #503: G Sharp or A Flat?

• #504: Unequal temperaments

• #505: Transposing from one key to other!!??? :o)

• #506: Drums Scoring

• #507: Downloading Crescendo Plug-In to NT

• #508: recent activity

• #509: exporting to MIDI?

• #510: Sustain Pedal has no effect on playback

• #511: Copyrights

• #512: Printing

• #513: Broken chords & Blank Manuscript

• #514: Disappearing Staff Groups

• #517: keyboard entry

• #518: NWC fonts

• #519: Lost Sound

• #520: Crashing Net Browser

• #521: Bug in Netscape Version 4.04

• #522: 1.5 playback problems after printing

• #523: Unexpected keychange after mpc

• #524: Upcoming features?

• #525: Drums and General MIDI

• #526: Lyrics for 1Chorus, Many verses

• #527: The other NoteWorthy?

• #528: Moving songs  into Word

• #529: Screen Set-up

• #530: MIDI file imports to NWC

• #531: To trumpets, clarinets and saxophones

• #532: Converting .syx to .mid

• #533: Importing midis - why doesn't it work good?

• #534: Exporting midi file type 0

• #535: Brass instruments/AWE64 sound fonts

• #536: Size of staffs and notes

• #537: Two Voices on a Staff

• #538: Fine problems

• #539: Does a French Version exist ?

• #540: Midi channel note volume

• #541: C sharp to D flat?

• #543: Suggestions for all to consider

• #544: grace notes or flams

• #545: D.S. al Coda  gets lost

• #546: NWC Offline Forum

• #547: opening 2-staff files

• #548: stupid question

• #549: transposing from another clef

• #550: transposing...again

• #552: Assembling sets of tunes

• #553: Problems with Chording

• #554: Bar Lines and Insertion Points

• #555: MIDI OCR software - Does it exist?

• #556: Importing Midi File

• #557: set percussion patterns

• #558: connecting to a midi keyboard

• #559: Change keys mapping on computer keyboard

• #560: printing piano music

• #561: Percussion

• #562: MS Intellimouse wheel

• #563:  Suggestion:repeat prev bar symbol

• #564: DLS

• #565: Trills

• #566: line of text under title

• #569: Chinese Seventh's (Inverted Notes/flags)

• #571: Converting between ABC format and NoteWorthy

• #572: Two suggestions to wishlist

• #573: n-uplets

• #574: Still more suggestions and a few questions

• #575: IDFEdit and Drum Patches

• #576: Printing

• #577: lyrics and repeats

• #578: Selective Silence on a Staff

• #579: some questions

• #580: ZOOMing

• #581: Notes un-joined by teXt

• #582: my wishes

• #584: Printing Help

• #585: .wav file import ?

• #588: Printing with dot matrix printers

• #589: Bends and Glissandos

• #590: triplet in 6/8

• #591: printing

• #592: Text  Chord Symbols

• #593: Transposeing

• #594: Tremelos and Arpeggiated Chords

• #595: "x" note heads

• #596: glissandos

• #597: suppressed lines in printing

• #598: controlling note placement in chords

• #599: General Midi Instrument Numbers

• #600: Printing Problems (single pages)

• #601: guitar tablature notation

• #602: forced page break?

• #603: Scanners

• #604: Classical guitar specific notation

• #605: Classical guitar specific notation

• #606: Merging staffs for vocal scores

• #607: Importing rests with a quarter note resolution

• #608: Guitar Harmonics...

• #609: Glossary

• #610: Writing versus recording melodies

• #611: Notes dropping out

• #614: writing chord

• #615: 'Live' Performance

• #616: Pauses

• #617: Printing From Explorer

• #618: MIDI controllers

• #619: Making records

• #620: Change midi instrument sounds

• #621: Soundfonts

• #622: Now to Add a note?

• #623: Lyric Placement

• #624: Beaming

• #625: Page setup window

• #626: Noteworthy 1.51a

• #627: Chord names/symbols!

• #628: Importing/Splitting

• #629: Great things about NoteWorthy

• #630: Running the Offline forum from Windows 3.1 / 3.11

• #631: Layering

• #632: Moonlite - NWC Samples

• #633: Accents

• #634: SB AWE32 Full duplex?

• #635: Beamed Notes

• #636: Problem with drum staff

• #637: Extra midi controllers

• #641: Feedback

• #642: Noteworthy on a Notebook.

• #643: Stem direction

• #645: Compiling?

• #646: Instrument patches

• #647: Can you change the stem size?

• #648: Measures

• #649: exporting

• #652: Muting a range of notes

• #653: Q: repear bar inside a measure?

• #654: Converting midis to wav files

• #655: soundfont

• #656: Finding the wish list

• #657: space-wasting measure bars

• #658: Space-consuming dashes in lyrics

• #659: Floating lyrics

• #660: Accidental alignment

• #661: Noteworthy Player-Printer? Portable Scores

• #662: Beamed Notes & Chord Symbols

• #663: Breath mark

• #664: last bar line

• #665: Moving an item up

• #666: Frustrated  ~:(

• #667: arpagio

• #668: Polish version of NoteWorthy Composer

• #669: Enormous fonts

• #670: Notes

• #671: Saving as a MIDI

• #672: Help me, please!

• #673: Irritation

• #674: One Quick Question

• #675: Rolls

• #676: 1.51a/HP500C Print Problem

• #677: Save me hours please :)

• #678: accidentals/key signatures

• #679: copying between clefs

• #680: overlapping syllables

• #681: 1.51a/hp500c still a problem!

• #682: Message Numbers

• #683: Newbie help

• #684: Can a voice change staffs?

• #685: Instrument/Voice identifiers

• #687: Measures and Lines

• #688: Useful fonts

• #689: What do you think of these ideas?

• #690: Noteworthy-Source-Code !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

• #692: Multiple Voices

• #693: Keyboards

• #694: channels

• #695: notes above the staff

• #697: Greetings, Anne-Sophie again !!

• #698: Swing 8ths

• #700: Score Print Preview

• #701: 1.51a/HP500C Problem Solved

• #702: Insert/Text expression/Staff Position

• #703: Broken Triplets

• #704: evaluating - questions and comments

• #706: HELP please new MIDI driver doesn't play right

• #708: Sibelius Cometh (or not?)

• #710: Grace Notes

• #711: zooming in Preview

• #712: Measure numbers every 5 measures

• #713: Publishing Scores

• #714: musical terms

• #715: WAV to MIDI conversion

• #716: Octave change indicator

• #717: share arrangements?

• #719: 2 fonts for lyrics

• #720: Great !

• #721: help no notes

• #723: NWC NewsGroup in your mailbox :-)

• #724: De-install?

• #725: Non printing rests

• #726: Grace notes?

• #727: Pedal and Dynamics for multi staves

• #728: NoteWorthy Composer 1.51a (windows 95)

• #729: page layout, clef changes, chords

• #731: Importing syncopated 4-4

• #732: Drum Flams

• #733: crescendos

• #734: Soundfont use

• #735: importing MIDI & controlling choice of staff

• #736: Non listed instruments in the patch list

• #737: pitch bends w/out joystick

• #738: Beaming triplets with grace notes

• #739: printing problems

• #740: Trills

• #741: Single-line staves

• #742: Blank score paper

• #743: hiding items when printing

• #744: duplets

• #745: Center Fermata above Note

• #746: Sound cards

• #747: Problems !

• #748: Odd (?) use of Fermata

• #749: gliss

• #750: NW version 1.51a

• #751: drums

• #752: Printing Music

• #753: Panasonic KX-P4410 problems

• #754: Got Grace notes, now to turn BMW files into NWC

• #755: Transposing from C major/A minor

• #756: upgrade to 1.52

• #757: Multi-Point Controllers

• #758: shifting position of notes

• #759: importing midi file

• #760: NWC files on GeoCities web sites

• #761: old DOS music notation software

• #762: Key signature in midi imports

• #763: Transpose Bass -> treble clef???

• #764: Upgrade to Version 1.52

• #765: Fingering does not print correctly

• #766: Importing midi in NWC to piano part + vocal only!

• #767: Jpg files of musical notation

• #769: soundfonts & SF2

• #770: Midi beginner questions

• #771: print a medly on a page

• #772: Turtle Beach ??

• #773: Midi won't play all tracks

• #774: Preserving Dynamics during Import

• #775: NW Composer and Player

• #776: Information

• #777: Playback speed

• #778: Chaning the Clefs + Notes

• #779: blank staff with notated staff

• #780: Joining staves

• #781: Suggested Enhancement

• #782: no space between repeat and author

• #783: Little question to the Forum:

• #785: Hallo Forum!

• #786: Accidentals during Midi Input

• #787: converting midi files in proper staff notations

• #789: Noteworthy simply rules

• #791: Music Font

• #792: joint projects

• #793: Adding expression to a note doesn't make differenc

• #794: Seeking MIDI help

• #795: Printing Music from Clickbooks

• #796: Roland GS Patches

• #797: MIDI wind

• #799: Archive Navigation

• #800: Soundfonts

• #801: Postscript Files

• #802: Piano Part.  How low is too low???

• #803: Rests.

• #805: Copying Lyrics

• #807: Slurring the Notes During play Back

• #808: Repeat at End of Staff

• #809: Trills/Glisando

• #810: Free MIDI to Text Converter

• #811: Boxmarks - Music Font

• #812: NWC1.52 bugs

• #813: Still a "Time signature bug" - second time

• #814: Counting your Items!

• #815: measures per line?

• #816: problem

• #817: Automatic unbeam ?

• #818: Sound Quality

• #820: NWC 1.52a

• #821: NIFF (Music Notation proposed standard)

• #822: NWC to PDF conversion

• #823: Notes hanging...

• #824: two questions about beaming

• #825: Midi recording

• #826: Copyright

• #827: Copyright

• #828: Grace notes

• #829: Nylon string guitar sounds like an organ.

• #830: NWC 1.52a and Screen Savers

• #831: sounds

• #832: Guitar Lesson (re: 829, 831)

• #833: Auto save

• #834: Composing & Orchestration Tutorials?

• #835: Importing MIDI files with Triplets. . . .

• #836: Getting more soundfonts/playback devices-how to?

• #837: balance

• #838: Breves (double whole note duration)

• #841: New instrument patch won't play

• #842: Suggested improvement

• #843: Combining Staffs

• #844: Localization of NoteWorthy Composer

• #845: Sound Patches?

• #846: Extending last line to right margin

• #847: Experimental Layering Patch

• #848: NWC and Cakewalk MIDI files

• #849: .BAK files

• #850: Measure Numbers

• #851: Importing Cakewalk Files to NWC

• #852: repeat signs/playback/breathmarks

• #853: midi keyboard trouble

• #854: Trouble with  hearing the playing of a score

• #855: Clusters

• #856: Translation from MusicTime De Luxe

• #857: Ending with Repeat Close

• #858: Note Groupings

• #859: exporting MIDI files

• #860: How to enlarge the printed score

• #861: Midiscan. Any happy user?

• #862: midi keyboard and awe64

• #863: guitar tabs + drum tracks

• #865: "Bug" report

• #866: Bar lines

• #867: Automatic beaming tool doesn't work.

• #868: Can I Get Beautiful Image of Score

• #869: Maximum Number of Staves

• #870: how can i change the lead instrument?

• #871: Print Preview Staff Lines are uneven...

• #872: New Web Site Layout

• #873: Note spacing

• #874: preview- staff lines mess up

• #875: The forum is back online

• #876: Maximizing Active Screen

• #877: AWE 64 users only

• #879: Articulations?

• #880: Copied staff is off-pitch from original

• #881: Chord with note and rest of same duration?

• #882: Multiplr bar rests

• #884: MIDI Controllers

• #885: Strange mark in score

• #886: Audit Accidentals Tool

• #887: Noteworthy

• #889: Groupings

• #893: slurs

• #894: Printing problems

• #895: Pitch bend

• #896: Inputting Notes From Piano Keyboard

• #897: Musical truncation at end of MIDI files

• #898: Help: Splitting Piano Parts at mC

• #899: how do I (text)

• #900: NWC Command Reference

• #901: inporting MIDI

• #902: I cant export to a midi

• #903: choral parts in one stave

• #905: Pitch bend

• #906: Solo staffs leading into choral staffs

• #907: Rhythm tensions with choral parts

• #908: Quick Tip - Rest Characters

• #909: Duplet (?) timing???

• #910: Hanging File

• #911: Any way to control the placement of slurs/ties?

• #912: Placement of slurs and ties

• #913: Umlauts in lyrics

• #914: Gliss.

• #916: Crescendo/diminuendo signs

• #917: ties, slurs etc. with layering feature

• #918: Placing a rest over existing notes

• #919: Cue notation

• #920: scroll lock

• #921: Playback devices

• #922: Harp (celtic) & dulcimer (lap/mountain)

• #923: multiple tracks

• #924: Reassigning channel 10

• #925: NWC Scriptorium open for business!

• #926: Bar lines move when converted to midi

• #927: values of tempo terms

• #928: MIDI to CD audio format

• #929: Cyber Hymnal

• #930: Sound without a soundcard

• #931: new software for WP

• #932: How to configure the midi

• #933: Complete Command Reference Now Available.

• #934: How do I use repeats?

• #935: drum partitions

• #936: WYSIWYG

• #937: Jazz NWC Files?

• #938: lyrics

• #939: Transposing from Eb to Db

• #940: NoteWorthy Player playback quality

• #941: NWP playback quality - rev. for correct spelling

• #942: tied notes on 3rd staff line

• #943: Cakewalk to NoteWorthy?

• #944: Pause for a rest

• #945: Meaning of numbers

• #946: Play-Only Mode for Copyright Protection

• #947: New to Noteworthy

• #948: Vers. 1.55  Experimental

• #949: Is midi banks turned off in the demo?

• #950: importing .mid files - what's wrong with this one?

• #951: Player Crashes in NT 4

• #952: Why does IE4 mark unread replies as read?

• #953: Scriptorium update

• #954: Lyric font in NWC

• #955: Harmonic notation revisited

• #956: forcing midi tracks to one staff?

• #957: Highlighted notes during playback

• #958: US Copyright laws RE/printed music & Performance

• #959: Musictime?

• #961: help me!!

• #962: Printing

• #963: Continous Horizontal Staff - must pan to see?

• #964: Experimental Rest Positions (1.55a)

• #965: thanx

• #966: Beamed notes with a rest between them?

• #967: Chord notation

• #968: Pedal for each clef?

• #969: Exporting to midi

• #970: Performer controlled midi sequencer available

• #972: Key Changes

• #973: New with keyboards

• #974: How do I match a key sig to my voice?

• #975: printing many staves

• #976: Midi export hint

• #977: Duplets

• #978: Flow directon marks

• #979: Pedal Sustain/Release

• #980: MIDI keyboard controlling note duration?

• #983: Loss of font

• #984: Glissandos

• #985: Chords containing rests

• #986: Midi convertion in triplets

• #987: Arpeggio.

• #988: Staves displaced

• #990: Mozart Piano Sonata K.310

• #991: OCR

• #992: Sound Card

• #994: Crescendo within one note

• #995: WAV file conversion

• #996: stuck keys

• #997: Strange Timing

• #999: How about answering some dumb questions?

• #1001: What kind of *Sound* to buy?

• #1003: Convert MIDI into WAV?

• #1004: Downloading music files

• #1006: Help Me!  Br3 - File Problem

• #1007: How do I access voices above 128?

• #1008: Korg N364 General MIDI bank selection

• #1009: Differing Time Signatures

• #1010: Note Duration From PSR 225 to NWC

• #1011: New Year

• #1012: NWC from Linux ????

• #1013: Poor quality instrument patches...

• #1014: Bug?  No Opening Bar Line for Single Staff Song

• #1015: lyrics in repeats

• #1016: voyetra and harmony software

• #1017: Synchronization problem

• #1018: Chord Alignment

• #1019: Export to .mid in XG mode

• #1020: Special endings in layered staves

• #1021: Media Playlist entries?

• #1022: Changing the default copyright notices?

• #1023: Connecting To Keyboard.

• #1024: Measures with Chords of mixed duration

• #1025: How to format lyrics in repeat sections?

• #1026: Notation from Midi input

• #1027: Author Field

• #1028: Suggestion for NWC Forum.

• #1029: Multiple Measure Rests

• #1032: Score outlay

• #1033: Printing on One Page

• #1034: Recovering FIle

• #1036: Numbing Measures, Need Help

• #1037: Maximum Volume & Note Accents

• #1038: Vibrato and other effects

• #1039: How do I make a note stem up & down ?

• #1040: How do I represent Breve (an 8 beat note) ?

• #1041: File Associations on the web?

• #1042: Search William Tell Overture full in NWC

• #1043: How to "Beam" both Melody and Alto notes ?

• #1044: The Scriptorium is now a hundred!

• #1045: I want a player like NWPlayer, except...

• #1046: Pitch Bend

• #1047: Fermata Delay

• #1048: Printing/Time signature on each page.

• #1049: Wird Sounds on large number of staves

• #1050: MPC Cancel

• #1051: Numbering verses

• #1052: New Users - Melbourne, Australia

• #1054: An old and, sadly, forgotten way to enter music

• #1055: Features

• #1056: MIDI in/out with Notebooks

• #1057: Inserting scores into other files

• #1058: Inserting Pauses!

• #1059: In praise of Noteworthy

• #1060: SoundBlaster Live and MIDI Effects

• #1061: Printing the signature just in the first line

• #1062: Messiah Project or ?????

• #1063: NoteWorthy Composer vs. Alternatives

• #1064: Scanning in Music

• #1066: select a stave in one shot ?

• #1067: Swing?

• #1068: Midi Files

• #1069: Three questions...

• #1070: Using soundcard extra midi controllers

• #1071: Looking for Tchaikovsky's "Dance of the Swans"

• #1072: Transposing

• #1073: Shaped Notes

• #1074: Drum music

• #1075: Arpeggio (sp) and Trills

• #1076: Wish about the wish list

• #1077: Beaming On The Top and Bottom

• #1079: Recording onto Mini Discs

• #1080: To bar or not to bar

• #1081: Reverb

• #1082: Adding drums to a song.

• #1083: Drum Kits

• #1084: phrasing

• #1085: Adding more sounds to playback list

• #1086: chants

• #1087: Cresendos/Decresendos

• #1088: Can't get scores to come up in NWC

• #1089: importing midi files into nwc

• #1090: Better Printer Control (WYSYWIG)

• #1091: Getting drums on different staffs

• #1092: Print Preview Screen Size

• #1093: Honourable Mention in BBC Music Mag

• #1094: How to get trill effects

• #1095: Semiquver rests

• #1096: Pitch for Playback

• #1097: Multiple scores on one page

• #1098: NWC Offline Forum

• #1099: NWC format? Some API for it?

• #1100: Instruments for NWC

• #1101: How do I get the lyrics out of a MIDI file?

• #1102: Computer doesn't recognize my keyboard

• #1103: Per-note performance dynamics - please!

• #1104: Your Wish Is Too Large ...?

• #1105: Glissandos

• #1106: ties and slurs

• #1107: NWC Offline Forum Using WindoZe 3.11

• #1108: Transposing only part of a staff

• #1109: Crescendos and ritardandoes

• #1110: Problems with Notating Piano Fingering

• #1111: Irreversible merging

• #1112: Master staff

• #1113: Two-line titles

• #1114: GMI?

• #1115: Print Preview tip

• #1116: Importing Triplets - a proposal

• #1117: Running this past everyone prior to wish listing

• #1118: Split chords

• #1119: Beamed Notes Spanning Bar Lines

• #1120: Per-note performance dynamics - please! (2)

• #1121: notes without stems

• #1124: Is there a way to make a Jazz Tempo

• #1125: using yamaha sw60xg voices

• #1126: I can't get "Decresendo" to work...

• #1127: Drum Scores

• #1128: Lyric Placement for Choral Scores

• #1129: how do I get banks from alesis nanosynth

• #1130: Making an Audio CD of NWC Music Files

• #1131: NWC on a Mac?

• #1132: fermatas and grace notes

• #1133: Queen Of Sheba

• #1134: Grace Notes

• #1135: Looking for certain sound help?

• #1136: http access to newsgroup ?

• #1138: drum questions (multiple channels/stereo)

• #1139: Grace Notes & Printout

• #1140: NoteWorthy Player

• #1141: Users of Internet Explorer 5.0

• #1142: copy/paste functions

• #1143: Bug or feature?

• #1144: Downloading & Printing MIDI files.

• #1145: Chords,Separate Ties,Beams, Timing!!!

• #1146: Timing

• #1147: number...number...

• #1148: V 1.55b

• #1149: Length of piece no longer displayed

• #1150: upgrade

• #1151: Font error when launching NWC32

• #1152: Mixing Symbols and Letters for Chords

• #1153: Web Publishing on Compuserve

• #1154: string notation

• #1155: Melody Switching From Right Hand to Left

• #1156: sforzando alignment

• #1157: In Appreciation

• #1158: Midi file importing

• #1159: NWC info and comments exported?

• #1160: Reading music from a CD

• #1161: Flow Control and Two Lyric Lines

• #1162: missing dynamics

• #1164: Lyric Lines

• #1165: What software should I buy?

• #1167: Deleting Chord Text above notes

• #1168: Fur Elise would like transcribes for nwc!

• #1170: installation

• #1171: joined staves...how to unjoin

• #1173: 'Pea soup' drum sound

• #1174: MIDI playback

• #1175: Notes On Note Worthy Composer

• #1176: Help!

• #1177: Decresendo over multiple bars and tied chords

• #1178: Hairpins!

• #1180: staff playback synchronization

• #1181: Link with music scanning software

• #1182: Publishing on the Net

• #1183: Copying preview to clipboard

• #1184: Slur (and tie) location

• #1186: DS and flow problems

• #1187: Lyrics in MIDI file

• #1188: How to get an Empty Staff ???

• #1189: A thought

• #1190: Staff layering and note stems

• #1191: Help...Copyrigth...

• #1192: New User with no instructions

• #1193: Stem Length for Beamed Notes

• #1194: no playback when iconized or playback

• #1195: Jazz chords

• #1196: Search and replace

• #1197: Chord or accompaniment

• #1198: keyboard vs NWC

• #1199: Changing key in the middle.

• #1201: Two notes but play only one

• #1202: Publishing

• #1203: Do I give up now?

• #1205: How do I get a "pause" ?

• #1206: Spacing between bar and the first note

• #1207: midi files to wav files

• #1208: recording NWC files onto CD

• #1209: trill

• #1210: playback question & slurs comment

• #1211: Notation for upper octaves

• #1213: Hidden

• #1214: Hearing Sound

• #1215: Player Note Resolution

• #1216: Hidden notes for a specified section

• #1217: burning a CD

• #1218: help...Lyric

• #1219: Classical music discussion forums?

• #1220: How to get copyright for your own arrangement?

• #1221: printing

• #1222: Second time only

• #1223: Where is The Scriptorium?

• #1224: At my own pace....

• #1225: A partner

• #1226: Need a composer to write in music to a song

• #1227: Key Signature when recording

• #1228: guitar fret noise

• #1229: convert ncw file- midi

• #1230: reset MIDI controllers?

• #1231: 1812 Overture

• #1232: Duplets

• #1233: trills

• #1234: GM Instrument Patch for MIDInight Express

• #1235: Please Help!

• #1236: MP3 to MIDI

• #1237: Trills?

• #1239: Files Wiped Out!  Help

• #1240: Is anyone interested in......

• #1241: Making The Notes Diffrent From A Bb Instrument To

• #1242: What do these Dynamic Markings mean?

• #1243: MIDI output volume.

• #1244: Controller Numbers

• #1245: What's that percentage in the corner?

• #1247: hiding a staff

• #1248: Spoken words

• #1249: I don't want my midi stolen!

• #1250: Midi tempering program

• #1251: Using PGMusic's Band-In-A-Box for harmonization

• #1252: Some Essential Copyright Information

• #1253: Tenor to bass clef

• #1254: Im not sure, But I could use some help.

• #1256: Playing songs through the PC's speaker...

• #1257: Metafile Output

• #1259: recording taped songs on to CD.

• #1260: blank spaces for unmeasured piano music

• #1262: Timpani Drum Roll

• #1263: Layering and Slurs

• #1264: Using the extra Midi controllers of the soundcards

• #1265: New Music OCR Program

• #1266: Guitar Soundfont snooping

• #1267: Flanging with SB64!

• #1268: Looking for cooperation...

• #1269: How do you make...

• #1270: Solo Line?

• #1271: New user needs help to format staff display

• #1272: repeats cause verse skip.

• #1273: Change of Key when importing from midi

• #1274: Printing 500 songs

• #1275: transferring midi from Noteworty to Band-in-abox

• #1276: how can I change the dinamics?

• #1277: NWC Library

• #1278: How to move a staff after the beginning?

• #1279: Sound font ftp site open

• #1280: strange effect of breath marks on playback

• #1281: quarter tone

• #1283: Rachmaninoff

• #1284: Bad format when using Pick Up Notes

• #1285: Player piano

• #1289: Detuning Noted from within NWC

• #1290: Fermata on the bar line

• #1291: Bagpipe music gracenotes

• #1292: Chord Progression Theory.

• #1293: Hymn Verses

• #1294: Importing Triplets

• #1295: uneven lines in preview and export.

• #1296: poor preview image...

• #1297: Cents

• #1298: In search of a song: Jesse

• #1299: Help! I can't see!

• #1300: Notes sound as though accented - cure??

• #1302: Sound Quality

• #1303: Autochording

• #1304: A#/Bb accidentals

• #1305: Guitarmusic

• #1306: Editing Lyrics

• #1307: Easy MIDI keyboard record

• #1308: Beamed notes and gracenotes

• #1309: Gliscendo (Default values for Pitch Bend)

• #1311: Multiple Notes

• #1313: Rolls for notes...

• #1314: SB PCI128's 10 Drum Kits

• #1315: Recording output of Sound Canvas into WAV

• #1319: Upgrading problem

• #1320: triplets, quitlets, ecet. and gace notes

• #1321: bug

• #1322: Symbols for Fermata, DalSegno, etc

• #1323: transposing a hymn

• #1325: TRANSPOSING INSTRUMENTS

• #1326: Different rhythms on same staff

• #1327: gliscendo

• #1328: 'Record' does not work for me!

• #1329: recording and playing back on cd

• #1330: MIDI to Wave - interference.

• #1331: Problem with Composer

• #1332: Section Transposition

• #1334: How do I do Trombone slides?

• #1335: Noteworthy 2000?

• #1336: moving notes or passages

• #1338: Mp3

• #1339: Hearing the keyboard input

• #1340: Extracting parts from "C" score to print parts

• #1341: downloading a score to print

• #1342: beam button

• #1343: Harmoniserr

• #1344: exporting error

• #1345: Note Velocity when using MIDI keyboard

• #1347: converting tracks from a cd to a midi file

• #1348: Beaming conventions?

• #1350: New Thread: Percussion Sounds

• #1351: printing multiple tunes

• #1352: transposing a piece of music

• #1353: Symbol {

• #1354: remembering options

• #1355: simplifying tunes

• #1357: Corrupted Data

• #1358: printing glitch with boxmarks

• #1359: ...problems...

• #1360: How could I get fixed-width measure?

• #1361: Why won't the guiro sound work?

• #1362: Printing problem

• #1364: Fee for Arranging

• #1365: Playback while inputting

• #1366: "Octavo" mark

• #1367: Scriptorium update

• #1369: Copying sections and inserting them

• #1370: Display notes in real-time

• #1371: flageolettes

• #1372: Boxmarks will be back... soon

• #1373: polyrythms (3 against 2...)

• #1375: Sound Card

• #1376: recording mp3's onto a tape

• #1377: MIDI Multi-Point Controller

• #1378: mf2t source code

• #1379: MPC... Please HELP!!!

• #1380: Type 1 MIDI --> Type 0 MIDI...?

• #1381: Overide default MIDI volume

• #1383: Instruments & Human Voices

• #1384: sharp and flat

• #1385: burning CD's

• #1386: My TAB key has flipped out!

• #1387: I need some help with .wav to cd conversion....

• #1388: Ritardando Question

• #1389: What I need...

• #1390: What is "Override default note velocity"?

• #1392: Suggesting a midi keyboard...

• #1394: Help needed with repeats

• #1395: Making a bunch of staffs into one

• #1397: tie  &  slur

• #1398: How do you make quintuplets?

• #1399: J B L Pro Audio & Noteworthy

• #1400: following the notes while playing

• #1401: How do I add reverb or chorus to my MIDI file?

• #1402: guitar chord symbols

• #1403: Using "record" feature to key-in parts

• #1404: Changing font size

• #1407: Voice in staff one is not right

• #1409: Triplet chord

• #1410: Spacing of notes

• #1412: Drum Fills

• #1413: Fantasie Impromtu

• #1414: Chord diagrams

• #1416: Merging NWC files w/ a voice file?

• #1418: Newer NWC Songs

• #1419: A wish: Header and Footnotes

• #1421: NWC-friendly Web Servers

• #1422: Trills

• #1423: pause in looped MIDI

• #1424: Audio recording n'worthy files

• #1425: Printing features

• #1426: Problem with lyrics

• #1427: Tremolo/Mandolin Parts

• #1428: More than 16 channels?

• #1430: Hiding a Staff

• #1434: What's the easiest way to...?

• #1435: Multiple MIDI output

• #1436: pls help.. newbie

• #1437: Need help!!!

• #1438: Well-Tempered Clavier in mp3 format

• #1439: Crescendo/Decrescendo during a long note... help!

• #1440: Convert wav into cd-audio

• #1441: How do I make trills?

• #1442: Master Repeat Closed and Master Repeat Open

• #1443: Override default MIDI volume

• #1444: Flow Direction with Repeat as Last Bar Line

• #1445: swing 8th notes

• #1446: Printer problem

• #1447: fermata position

• #1448: Noteworthy Player

• #1450: Roland GS

• #1451: Stereo Pan - What is right?

• #1452: Differant Keys

• #1454: v1.70h beta and SBLive

• #1455: midi to mp3

• #1456: Albert Ammons Shout for Joy Sheet Music

• #1457: Recording Drums from Keyboard

• #1458: non-metrical music

• #1459: mute one voice in a staff?

• #1460: Font for Pedal Markings

• #1461: How do I access other banks on Roland XP-80?

• #1462: Notate a drum track?!

• #1463: recording piano to treble and bass cleft as played

• #1464: Triplets

• #1465: Getting Piano.exe to work with NWC

• #1466: Songfile Concatenation

• #1467: Arpegio's

• #1468: noise in WAV recording

• #1469: Track splitting.

• #1470: Rehearsal Numbers/Score

• #1471: Gong?

• #1472: adding song titles

• #1473: adding a heading

• #1474: Updates

• #1475: Sustained Note Fade

• #1476: Noteworthy to Finale?

• #1477: Pitch Bend over an Octave

• #1478: Guitar Cords

• #1479: just a simple New line

• #1481: Choosing Music Notation Software

• #1482: A Quicker Way of Converting Midi into Wave

• #1483: Legato: how long does the effect last?

• #1484: Sound Recording

• #1485: adding Russian and Greek true fonts

• #1486: Bach's Badinerie

• #1487: note duration values stuck?

• #1488: Using the noteworthy software

• #1490: Problem (Bug?)

• #1491: Lyrics - adding several verses

• #1492: More sounds

• #1493: Using NWC teaching music

• #1494: Drum notation

• #1495: 10 Instrument Orchestration Layout in Noteworthy??

• #1496: More Realistic Timpani

• #1497: adjust position of rests within staff

• #1498: MIDI notes and acoustic notes

• #1499: Trombone voice too soft?

• #1500: Glissendo ?

• #1501: Accessing additional percussion banks in soundfont

• #1502: Using layering - is there a better way?

• #1503: Exporting a fermata...

• #1504: Bells Used Chart

• #1505: slurs/ties

• #1506: Netscape 6 Preview Crash

• #1508: newbie: What is...

• #1510: Printing 2 or more staff

• #1511: A song...

• #1513: Classical music in lead sheet form

• #1514: MP3 or WAV to MIDI

• #1515: Override main key signature

• #1516: convert winamp files to wav. files

• #1517: SoundFonts and external banks

• #1518: How can I add phrase marks above the music??

• #1519: error in sound recording

• #1520: Instrumentations

• #1521: Bar numbers / Metronome marks / Pauses / Fingering

• #1522: More on MIDI to NWC Conversion

• #1523: Hairpins!

• #1524: SharpEye Lyrics/XG Playback/Quad Playback

• #1525: My tempo won't change!

• #1526: Recording Midi files from external instruments

• #1528: Recording Both Voice and Music At The Same Time

• #1530: Changing from 2 staves to 1.

• #1531: MIDIFILES

• #1532: Reconding from Yamaha PSR530

• #1533: Forcing Carriage Returns in Lyrics

• #1534: MDA to MIDI file format

• #1535: Measure-numbering Concatenated Songfiles

• #1536: Why does it sound awful???

• #1538: hiding a part of a staff

• #1539: beaming notes

• #1540: More than triplets

• #1541: duplets?!?!?

• #1542: Sheet Music

• #1543: Automatic creation of natural accidental

• #1544: Delete text above bar line

• #1545: Optimizing import function

• #1546: Trade jazz fakes

• #1547: Enharmonic Transposition???

• #1549: 3 Minor (Key) Problems

• #1551: Where can I find a good beat?

• #1552: pitch band

• #1554: I am stuck

• #1555: Fusing staffs together?

• #1556: Which is the best synthesizer to use?

• #1557: Running NWC under Linux

• #1559: Widening note spacing / fingering spacing.

• #1560: just wondering...

• #1561: Widening note spacing to make room for lyrics etc.

• #1563: RE:  Widening note spacing to make room for lyrics

• #1564: Pedal release not executed when immediate down

• #1566: Importing MIDIs-Stacatos

• #1569: Right Lyric Order with Repeats in Melody

• #1570: Staff layering

• #1571: How can I convert midi to wave?

• #1572: Quantizing and recording

• #1573: What can I do with this SoundPack?

• #1577: transposing for a b-flat instrument

• #1578: A dumb question...

• #1580: midi keyboard entry onto stave

• #1581: Document Exchange Format

• #1582: anyone have standards in Eb and Bb?

• #1585: Making a chart look like a chart

• #1586: Writing Marches

• #1587: The NWC History list

• #1588: Tablature

• #1589: staves with chord name and rhythm without note

• #1590: Recording live performances with dynamics??

• #1592: Using NWC with Organ

• #1593: NWC Forum or NWC Newsgroup

• #1594: How to improve upon the violin's sound?

• #1596: Search function

• #1597: Wish list

• #1600: Bulletin: ntworthy.nwc newsgroup status

• #1602: Wish on special long notes used in psalms

• #1603: Writing A Symphony?

• #1604: Too BIG notes

• #1605: 1.70 has been released

• #1606: Breath marks positions

• #1607: nwc crash

• #1608: How do I handle slight verse variations?

• #1609: Gooey stuff!  Oops, I mean GUI stuff!

• #1610: Thanks for 1.7, & system breaks question

• #1611: Problem beaming chords

• #1612: Expression placement

• #1613: Fermata & Breath Mark in new toolbar

• #1614: File-Open Default

• #1615: NWC to Mac

• #1616: compatibility

• #1617: guitar chord symbols

• #1618: Printing layered composition.

• #1619: Hidden bar lines in 1.70

• #1620: Layering and vertical size

• #1621: Danny Boy

• #1622: how to hide

• #1623: lyrics and fonts

• #1624: text editor

• #1625: um... don't know what to call it so just read....

• #1626: Exporting to a word document

• #1627: Default settings: help

• #1628: Lyric offset: bug?

• #1629: SAT (3voices)instead of SATB

• #1630: multiple instruments

• #1631: Wish List

• #1632: NWC to PDF again

• #1633: Improving placement of slurs (and ties?)

• #1634: Odd playback delay on one particular file

• #1635: Printing partialy entered song

• #1636: Parameters of layered staves

• #1637: guitar links

• #1638: Notra Dame Victory March

• #1639: Dynamic Variance bug?

• #1640: User Fonts #1 to 6

• #1641: Alto Sax Range

• #1642: Double-Whole notes

• #1643: missing notes?

• #1644: Drum notation

• #1645: More parts (melodies) in one staff

• #1646: Layering in Player

• #1647: c:\windows\nwc.ini and 1.70

• #1648: zooming in on lyrics

• #1649: Accents marks for two voices on one staff

• #1650: NWC to PDF -- advanced users only, try this!

• #1651: Multiple Licences?

• #1652: nested triplets

• #1653: System Breaks

• #1655: How to make bitmap, GIF, JPG from NWC

• #1656: The Wish List

• #1657: NCW Player

• #1658: Drum-head notes: see my reply 12 re PDF

• #1659: The 'bars rest' problem

• #1660: Scriptorium has a new look

• #1661: vibrato

• #1662: STAFF

• #1663: Piano: Partitures

• #1664: Sound Blaster Live!...

• #1665: OK, I need help on something

• #1666: Deleting  several measures at a time

• #1667: Centering lyric syllables under the note

• #1668: I don't know how to print

• #1669: NWC Music has been posted on MP3.com!

• #1670: Repaint Text Problem

• #1671: Help!

• #1672: Song Title on multiple pages

• #1673: Any NWC experts in Yorkshire, England?

• #1674: Special Endings and Bar Lines

• #1675: Image print drivers

• #1676: SUSTIAN PEDAL SCREWS TIES ON OTHER STAVES

• #1677: Setting slur direction on chords containing rests

• #1678: Channel surfing?

• #1679: the whole rest

• #1680: SB 64 vs SB 128

• #1681: Special Endings

• #1682: How to get rich with Noteworthy

• #1683: Best soundcard for NWC/midi files...

• #1684: Extra Channels?

• #1685: Question about Banks and Instruments on SBLive!

• #1686: My Roland JV-1010

• #1687: Cyber Hymnal

• #1688: Ties and slurs

• #1689: MAC Compatibility

• #1690: chord with rest for part of duration

• #1691: Gershwin

• #1692: tee pee thing

• #1693: Can changing video cards change audio properties?

• #1694: show a limited portion of the accompanyment staff

• #1695: re-beaming, differently

• #1696: NoteWorthy Composer for a friend.

• #1697: Break barlines

• #1698: Pedal glitches

• #1700: Flow direction anomaly

• #1701: What is a "waveset"?

• #1702: notes without staves

• #1703: Effects

• #1704: XG/GM MIDI Instrument Sets

• #1706: how do turn NWC files to wave files?

• #1707: opening old NWC files

• #1708: opening zipped NWC files

• #1709: Single/multiple stave lines

• #1710: Installing on Windows 2000

• #1711: Strange bug in 1.70

• #1712: noteworthy plays 1/2step to high

• #1713: Display problem

• #1714: Music from Cape Breton

• #1715: Beta Testing

• #1716: Instrument Percent

• #1717: First line indentation

• #1718: Please help!

• #1719: deleting tempo markings

• #1720: Writing for Organ

• #1721: saving chords with ties as midi

• #1722: Just for interest, which soundcard do you use?

• #1723: Sound Font Help

• #1724: Adding two notes without chord member command

• #1725: Everything's blank after installing 1.70!!

• #1726: convert cd to mp3

• #1727: How I can add beats...

• #1728: How about this for a wish: lyrics that sing!

• #1729: NWC developer network?

• #1730: Triplet bracket placement

• #1731: Chord member insertion

• #1732: 1.70 review.

• #1733: staff titles

• #1734: GM Drums

• #1735: need to know a notation symbol

• #1736: Illustration for workbook

• #1737: special notations

• #1738: Copy from Print Preview

• #1739: blank staff (lines only, no notes)

• #1740: boxmarks font

• #1741: Sheet Music?

• #1742: trade combo charts

• #1743: Playing back tenuto

• #1744: Wishing for leger lines

• #1745: fit to page

• #1746: Ya know...the one that goes like...

• #1747: Back to vacation

• #1748: Notation of notes that should be played one octave

• #1750: mid to cd audio

• #1751: Specifing  midi sounds on a certain line..

• #1752: Is it possible...

• #1753: sound card disaster

• #1754: violin bow movement notation

• #1755: Vertical alignment of staves

• #1756: Inserting lyrics

• #1758: Key Transposition

• #1759: Copy and Paste score to send E-mail.

• #1760: Notation Soft with MIDI support of pitch and durat

• #1761: Text Chords

• #1762: Noteworthy on Mac's

• #1763: Edit song title

• #1764: User's Guide Online

• #1765: New, excellent method for GIF images from NWC

• #1766: New excellent method revisited

• #1767: How do I...

• #1768: Notation across Staves

• #1769: point size vs page size

• #1770: NWC Songs

• #1771: [Linux] NWC success under Wine

• #1772: Handwritten font

• #1773: NWC to MS Word

• #1774: Why does the midi sound so mono?

• #1775: lyrics ( underline)

• #1776: Performance style -( brackets)

• #1777: Suspended Cymbal

• #1778: Octives and Chords

• #1779: Percussion

• #1780: I use Noteworthy for...

• #1781: Changing Instruments

• #1782:  HELP ME!!!!!

• #1783: Version 1.55a and Windows Me - compatible?

• #1784: BIRD TWEETING YOUR MUSIC

• #1785: tremolo

• #1786: gospel music composers

• #1787: Midi files

• #1788: Repeats

• #1789: Yet another method for NWC to PDF

• #1790: Importing Dynamics

• #1791: Instrument to Trombone and then have it PLAY it?

• #1792: XG controls

• #1794: natural signs

• #1795: copywrite

• #1797: Where to sell my sheet music online?

• #1798: Tempo variance in MIDI exports

• #1799: Non-contiguous 1/8 beams

• #1800: Reinstalling Windows

• #1802: non-pitched note notation

• #1803: Uneven reproduction

• #1804: notation

• #1805: Music without bar lines

• #1806: grace note duration

• #1807: Connecting keyboard to PC

• #1808: text

• #1809: Railroad Tracks symbol

• #1810: program help

• #1811: convert midi's to piano sheet music

• #1812: Free, original font

• #1813: Noteworthy Scriptorium update

• #1814: Play before transcribe

• #1815: 1.7 text expression is awful!

• #1816: The lyric box is tiny! Who can see it?

• #1817: Wish List

• #1819: Andy's question 1818 ?

• #1820: Dynamcis

• #1821: Alto Notation Help

• #1822: SP1 and SP2

• #1823: Cannot record real time performance

• #1824: Tremolo notation

• #1825: Opening a midi file

• #1827: vertical scrolling while playback

• #1828: FILE FORMAT

• #1829: Drum-head notation in WMF: possible.

• #1830: Change in articulation marks?

• #1831: When you wish upon a .........

• #1832: Help!

• #1833: Placement of dynamics etc.

• #1834: Accents like this: ^  --before it's too late!

• #1835: Women's and Men's Parts

• #1836: Searching for Friends

• #1837: Do I need software drivers for my Midi keyboard?

• #1838: MPU-401

• #1839: TR

• #1840: NWC Version 1.70 Plug-in for Winamp

• #1841: Men's Quartet arrangements

• #1842: realistic instrument sounds HeLp!

• #1843: Dynamic Variances

• #1845: Multi-Bar Rest - Urgent question

• #1846: InStRuMeNt SoUnD pAtChEs

• #1847: Instruments and chords

• #1848: Beams and rests

• #1849: Dynamics placement

• #1850: MP3 to VQF

• #1851: Piano notation (pedal)

• #1852: Force System Break?

• #1853: Announcement - New Command Summary

• #1854: Please help me with slurs!

• #1855: Getting bars to line up

• #1856: keyboard to computer

• #1857: Ghostly notes

• #1858: driver for printer

• #1859: using sounds off keyboard!

• #1860: music notation

• #1861: Leaving no trace

• #1862: Best-vOICE-chOICE

• #1863: Missing bars on first measure

• #1864: writing scores

• #1865: beam note tool

• #1866: Chromatic scales

• #1867: MIDI and Visual Basic

• #1868: Length

• #1869: Layering

• #1870: Moving a staff

• #1871: adjust volume of a MIDI file

• #1872: It's time for hidden slurs, accents, staccatti...

• #1873: Installation Problem - lost note display in 1.7

• #1874: Notes with letters inside

• #1876: transposition

• #1877: Port Usage and Creative Live SoundCard

• #1878: Re: MIDI Programming

• #1879: need expert help

• #1880: Scanning Sheet Music

• #1881: Instrument Numbers?

• #1882: Combining Staves?

• #1883: Postscript Printer Driver for W98SE

• #1884: Roland XP-30

• #1885: Hearing notes while editing

• #1886: Need help!

• #1887: [un]synchronized playback with master repeats

• #1888: how do i get it to play "swing"

• #1889: confusion, confusion.....!

• #1890: sb16 and soundfont

• #1891: I am willing to pay for version 2.x....

• #1892: order of instruments

• #1893: printer properties

• #1894: Page contents

• #1895: Music Composition Contests

• #1896: "The Messiah Project" complete!

• #1897: Roland Sound Canvas vs. Audio PCI vs. Wingroove

• #1898: Sound card help!

• #1899: Forum Status: Name and E-mail Cookie

• #1900: Wav

• #1901: musical software

• #1902: Repeat patterns

• #1903: How can I get a tril?

• #1904: Flats, Sharps, Accidentals...

• #1905: wanted:  transcriber

• #1906: arranging for orchestra

• #1907: solo part on piano score

• #1908: sb live 1024

• #1909: Big City in NWC-format

• #1910: Pitch

• #1911: Alesis QS7 keyboard & recording

• #1912: looking for Classic Rock Songs

• #1913: How to delay the start of an embedded midi?

• #1914: crescendo, chord, compressed rests

• #1915: 2 rhythms

• #1916: Barbershop Quartet Songs

• #1917: Transposition and enharmonics

• #1918: Midi Input

• #1919: Best sound card...

• #1920: NWC above other similar softwares

• #1921: Differences between SB AWE 64 and AWE 64 gold?

• #1922: lost file associations

• #1923: noteworthy to cd's

• #1924: beaming

• #1925: Wishes...

• #1926: No FTP! very important!

• #1927: sites to submit

• #1928: Printing problem

• #1929: Fitting staffs on to One Page

• #1930: size of compressed rests

• #1931: Fun with math?

• #1932: More Instruments

• #1934: note spacing vs syllable spacing

• #1935: removing special endings

• #1936: NWC browser plug-in

• #1937: Selecting an existing dynamic

• #1938: Instrument - and pitch - changes!

• #1939: brass quintet music

• #1940: Fonts for lyrics

• #1941: Wav to midi

• #1942: Duplets, Cues

• #1943: Lyrics in repeat after key change

• #1944: fermatas in browser plug-in

• #1945: different number of staves, same song

• #1946: What is the function of the plug-in? n/t

• #1947: Editing .wmfs, deleting unused staves

• #1948: korg 05R/W instruments definition

• #1949: newbie simple  editing question

• #1950: Drum X-head font for NWC -- here it is -- maybe!

• #1952: Microtones

• #1953: Midi stuff

• #1954: Soundblaster Live Cards

• #1955: adding slash marks

• #1956: Layering, Slur and Tie direction

• #1957: Sheetmusic on the net

• #1958: Triplets

• #1959: Sound Canvas SC-15 DB - With PCI ?

• #1960: Treble to Bass clef from PDF files

• #1961: sound modules

• #1962: Shaped Notes

• #1963: Create folders?

• #1964: sound modules and keyboards

• #1965: transposing notes

• #1966: Keyboard Shortcut

• #1967: Automatic file backup

• #1968: Another NWC wishlist

• #1969: Effects - DSP, Reverb, Chorus

• #1970: What's happening lately with Noteworthy Software?

• #1971: problems with recording

• #1972: Conversion from abc

• #1973: print page eject

• #1974: Can slurs and ties be hidden?

• #1975: I must be stupid

• #1976: Why???

• #1977: Soprano, Alto, Tenor, or whatever

• #1978: guitar chord letters

• #1979: Re WHY???

• #1980: Announcing New NWC Service Pack  and Plug-in

• #1982: Piano.exe revisited

• #1983: Ever Wondered?

• #1984: Teepee accents

• #1985: Channel 10

• #1986: Stereo Pan and Channel Sharing semi-Bug

• #1987: MP3 to MWA

• #1988: newbie's wishlist

• #1989: SHUFFLE ???

• #1990: Help!  Centering rest, etc.

• #1991: Rest directly below a note,below the staff etc

• #1992: MIDI Instruments

• #1993: NWC 1.0

• #1994: bar ending

• #1995: iMac and PC playback

• #1996: Drum Stuff

• #1997: anyway I can convert MIDI's into mp3's or Waves

• #1998: Lyrics, clefs

• #1999: nwc samples

• #2001: Using Media Player files in NWC

• #2002: Replying to forum messages

• #2003: NWC Review Posted on Ciao.com

• #2004: Better midi-playback.

• #2005: Noteworthy and VST Plugins

• #2007: noteworthy midi

• #2008: Melon Collie

• #2009: Drum Notation

• #2010: Transposition

• #2011: Scanning Software for Music

• #2012: NWC and winamp plugin

• #2013: sheet music

• #2014: teno notes

• #2015: Multipoint controller??

• #2016: midi exports, but no sound

• #2017: layers and rests

• #2018: MIDI to WAVE - instructions for wavetable synths

• #2019: midi problem

• #2020: Nashville Number System

• #2021: Adding key shortcuts

• #2023: Printing from NoteWorthy Composer 1.70 to PDF

• #2024: fractal music

• #2025: WAVE or AIFF to MIDI Posibble?

• #2026: NoteWorthy Player wishes

• #2027: mute list suggestion

• #2028: Where can I buy legal rock midis?

• #2029: *.wav

• #2030: Lyric Lines

• #2031: Newsgroup trouble

• #2032: NoteWorthy Composer Service Pack 4

• #2033: Change of melody line.

• #2034: Staff style

• #2035: New Dell Computers - SB Live! Platinum 5.1 (NOT)

• #2036: Drum X head font revisited

• #2037: WAV to Real Audio

• #2038: NWC Web Service Pack 5

• #2039: Spacing problem

• #2040: lyrics with diacriticals

• #2041: Setup Program

• #2042: Drums in NWC

• #2043: Web Service Release Packs

• #2044: file conversion

• #2045: Composer <--> Sibelius file conversion?

• #2046: Lines in lyrics for sustained notes

• #2047: auditing bar lines

• #2048: OT: Request; some effects or sounds

• #2049: Printing problem

• #2050: Eastern Tone System (Was: Microtones)

• #2051: Adding Percussion into my compositions, what #?

• #2052: Please listen all the capabilities of NoteWorthy

• #2053: Transposing from Eb major to Db major

• #2054: Help with my Roland XP-80!

• #2055: Service Pack 7 Announcement

• #2057: Clarification on Updates

• #2058: Searching Forum (Archives Included)

• #2059: Remove a tempo notation

• #2060: MIDI instrument assignment limitation

• #2061: Repeat programming

• #2062: Help File

• #2063: PDF guru needed

• #2064: help with soundfonts and such

• #2065: again, soundfonts...

• #2066: What is "MOONLITE", included in the NWC samples?

• #2067: More fonts

• #2068: pb with the connection of my external keyboard

• #2069: help help please i'm begging now!

• #2070: Notes on Eastern Tone System II

• #2071: ABC@win

• #2072: New Instruments

• #2073: Percussion already

• #2074: Scan input

• #2075: Can't open file!! Help!

• #2077: Harpsichord

• #2078: albinoni's piece

• #2080: display staff names

• #2081: yay! i did it!

• #2082: Percussion volume

• #2083: Polish chars

• #2084: Midi and NWC Files

• #2085: Max 3 staffs?

• #2086: New lyricfont: does regular, italics, diacriticals

• #2087: "Staff position" control needed for slurs

• #2089: .mid to piano score

• #2090: Continuing on to next measure..???

• #2091: Simple Problem, please help!

• #2092: missing staves after first "page"

• #2093: Bad MIDI files

• #2094: Text  - SATB and Piano brackets

• #2095: where can i get prg patches?

• #2096: Auto Rest Fill-in Command Available?

• #2097: NWC on disk

• #2098: Mid files

• #2099: EMAIL my music to a non-nwc email person

• #2100: It's done!

• #2101: xg patch/bank list

• #2102: "passing notes"

• #2103: Chord Names

• #2104: emailing glitch

• #2105: Font file

• #2106: Yamaha PSS-780 MIDI problems

• #2107: Mordents

• #2108: Lead Sheet

• #2109: Overture 1812 criticism

• #2110: Does anyone know how to notate a "pickslide?"

• #2111: Deleting Text & Creating New Unconnected Staves

• #2112: Roll Markings, "X" notes, Glissandos, Trills.

• #2113: Long Measure Rests

• #2115: Mac version?

• #2116: I can't get any percussion working!

• #2117: Problem with midi for Casio WK-1600

• #2118: Number of staves

• #2120: I Can't Print To File in NWC!

• #2121: News server trouble again??

• #2122: Repeat Last Measure(s) Symbols

• #2123: Percussion Notation

• #2124: repeats

• #2125: Tempo changes

• #2126: Cut sign

• #2127: total cost is $39?

• #2128: NWC forum oddity?

• #2129: Simplified music notation

• #2130: Bell choir notation

• #2131: Sound latency when recording with keyboard

• #2132: Forte Piano

• #2133: Anthony Wilson

• #2134: Lyrics: font size?

• #2135: How do I make font files?

• #2136: NWC version 1.70.8 available

• #2137: Trouble w. volume change after loop

• #2138: Noteworthy Browser Plug-In

• #2139: Quintuplets etc

• #2141: MIDI files

• #2142: printing book format

• #2143: Rogues Gallery

• #2144: nwc 12 for windows 3.1

• #2145: Stabat Mater -Dvorak

• #2146: Hidden Staff

• #2147: How to change playback instrument on staff

• #2148: hearing notes when you place them down

• #2149: Expression Placement Defaults?

• #2150: NWC Browser Plug-In

• #2151: Hear notes

• #2152: Just how many registered users of NWC are there?

• #2153: please help!

• #2154: lyrics at bar 16?

• #2155: NWC 1.70.9

• #2156: Problems with NWC's Midi

• #2157: New Version vs. previous files

• #2158: problem with sustained passing tones

• #2159: Mallet Rolls

• #2160: Rogues Gallery - Names announced

• #2161: Guitar notation

• #2162: Noteworthy Command reference version 1.70

• #2163: Tonal Quality?

• #2165: importing midi and note resolution

• #2166: Sleigh Bells

• #2168: Newsgroup trouble again ;(

• #2169: Trying to figure out midi import options.

• #2170: Playback cancels out notes?

• #2173: varying note lengths

• #2174: Rhythm Guitar

• #2175: Plugin formatting

• #2176: Instrument Patches

• #2177: Some Roguish answers

• #2178: entering Turkish lyrics

• #2179: Annoying Rogue Note

• #2180: Midi save dosent work?

• #2182: Help! w/ importing midi file in another sequencer

• #2183: using samples as patches

• #2184: Hidden Staff

• #2185: PDF and searching

• #2187: tape to wav is slow for others to download

• #2188: Opening songs maximized

• #2189: Win2K compatibility

• #2190: Offline forum

• #2191: score notes without spacing and measures

• #2192: Wish List Addition

• #2193: GREAT NEWS - NEW NEWSGROUP SERVER

• #2195: upgrade #9 crash

• #2196: changing pitch value of existing note(s)

• #2197: Spaces

• #2198: Notes on Eastern Tone System III

• #2199: How do you do a roll on NWC?

• #2200: NWC vs. Sibelius

• #2201: Enlarge Printout

• #2202: chord symbols

• #2203: Sound cards, sound fonts, .nwc --> CD-R burning:

• #2204: ...Tempo...

• #2206: Yamaha PSR 420 - Recording  real-time

• #2207: Transposing for a Concert Band from a MIDI file

• #2208: yamaha psr 420  real time input.

• #2209: ... TEMPO 2...

• #2210: Track length-cd burning

• #2211: Unwanted percussion sounds

• #2212: Music of the Spheres ???

• #2213: Using soundfonts in Composer

• #2215: Rogues Gallery - the answers

• #2216: PLEASE HELP!

• #2217: Roland XP80

• #2218: Asistance required (Notation)

• #2219: Still trying to convert MIDI to WAV

• #2220: Quick question about my XP-30, think you can help?

• #2221: HELP! Is there anyway to make it play softer?

• #2222: dynamic variance on sustained notes

• #2223: midi input and key signatures - HELP PLEASE

• #2224: Help! How can I add the "tr" to a note

• #2225: Is there anymore instruments I can choose besides

• #2226: SoundBlaster Live! EAX Technology

• #2227: Server Move

• #2228: sound fonts

• #2229: Inverted G clef

• #2230: Noteworth Visability

• #2231: Percussion Notation and Diddles

• #2232: New Playback Instruments

• #2233: "x" notes

• #2234: More control over layout

• #2235: using roland expansion card

• #2237: Help with Yamaha PSR-340/MIDI Mapper

• #2238: Prismer sequencer

• #2239: American National Anthem

• #2240: Fifths

• #2241: Yet another newsgroup trouble

• #2242: Playback

• #2243: I can't get percussion

• #2245: multiple flow direction commands

• #2247: Ellington conference in Hawaii

• #2249: Forum Changes

• #2250: Writing Cresc & Dim signs (< and >)

• #2251: "bank" of accompaniments

• #2252: Poor sound quality trying to record from NWC to CD

• #2253: Lyrics begin part way through a song

• #2254: MIDI keyboard displaying numbers instead of notes!

• #2256: Yamaha XG1000 Patch Info for NWC  .ini file?

• #2257: Opinions on best General MIDI Soundfont?

• #2258: NWC for Mac!

• #2259: Notation

• #2260: exporting nwc files into text documents

• #2261: Variant melody/rhythm for verses

• #2262: Web Update 9

• #2263: OT: VQF.com down

• #2264: BSOD

• #2265: Winamp file, convert to Midi?

• #2266: Web Update 10

• #2267: New to composing for male vocal groups...

• #2268: Suggestions for the next version of NWC

• #2269: Orchestral Parts Notation

• #2270: Placement of accents

• #2271: Slurs and ties

• #2272: New NGs on Digital Audio, Soundcards and Soundfont

• #2273: Scriptorium (or vadu.com) down ??

• #2275: Blues Bass

• #2276: Rossini's Petite Messe solennelle

• #2277: string section instrument patch

• #2278: NWC on Linux

• #2279: note on - note off in real time

• #2280: WinXP and NWC

• #2281: searching the online forum

• #2282: portamento,appogiatura

• #2283: Control of Highlight

• #2284: Choir Aahs

• #2285: using a keyboard to notate?

• #2286: Lyric Refrain - Note Chasing

• #2287: words of the song

• #2288: note chasing highlighter

• #2289: How do I hide the entire staff?

• #2290: e-mail group

• #2291: Eb Tuba in Bass Clef --> Bb Bass in Treble clef

• #2292: Character Map Pro

• #2293: confused about concert keys

• #2294: MIDI / MP3

• #2295: New to Noteworthy-Sop., Alto line Writing

• #2296: midi

• #2297: Two-line author information

• #2298: Noteworthy Composers Webring

• #2299: No visible note appearing on NWC in Windows 2000

• #2300: recording autorhthm

• #2301: Preventing download of audio file?

• #2302: Looking for NWC player for MAC

• #2303: How to generate a MIDI file from NWC

• #2304: Second ending following master repeat

• #2305: question about 1812 overture

• #2306: Multiple tunes on a page

• #2307:  Help! 5-lets and duplets

• #2308: Laszlo Kalmar Midi's

• #2309: mac support?

• #2310: jpeg file to noteworthy

• #2311: helo

• #2312: Slur preferences

• #2314: Note stem width

• #2315: Lyrics on top of staff

• #2316: converting analog music to wav

• #2317: Best Simple Keyboard?

• #2318: Truncate printing

• #2319: Virtual Piano and NWC HELP!

• #2320: Autocomplete cookies

• #2321: "No Viewer Available"

• #2322: Spacing between lyric lines

• #2323: Midi to Wave to CD

• #2324: The browser plug-in

• #2325: Imputting Notation with Guitar

• #2326: overlapping scores

• #2327: Yet another percussion question !!  Mallet Rolls

• #2329: yamaha psr 170

• #2330: slight problem....

• #2331: advanced search in this forum

• #2332: ancient music : noteshapes

• #2333: Improved WMF to images in IV

• #2334: soundfonts

• #2335: Generating chords from melody.

• #2336: playing a string of MIDI files

• #2337: version 2!

• #2338: big band arranging

• #2339: Yamaha Motif 8

• #2340: how do i put an mp3 onto a cd?

• #2341: radio shack midi keyboard HELP!

• #2342: S--- vs. F---- vs. NWC et. al.

• #2343: Digital Ear

• #2344: recording sound  from Media Player

• #2345: two or more instruments playing in unison

• #2346: File Conversion

• #2347: my great idea

• #2348: Recording to CD

• #2349: Instrumental Solos

• #2350: having a song ascend as it is repeated

• #2351: Converting A WAV Into A MIDI

• #2352: Newsgroup problems

• #2353: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

• #2354: Where can I find and MIDI Cable?

• #2355: Wav to Mp3

• #2357: Yamaha PSR-340

• #2358: midi mapper won't open

• #2359: Instrument Patch - ntwpatch.ini

• #2360: Creating a classical guitar midi file

• #2362: Windows XP and Printers

• #2363: How do I add Trills in the form of a letter?

• #2364: How to create instrumentals

• #2365: Noteworthy vs Encore4.5?

• #2366: Multiple bars with rests

• #2367: Scanning sheet music

• #2368: MIDI Playback disabled

• #2369: MIDI Keyboard will not record

• #2370: help for rhythm

• #2371: Crystal Soundfusion Sound Card Problem?

• #2372: insert a 1/2 duration note on a 1/4 chord member

• #2373: velocity to compression ratio

• #2374: on play

• #2375: Layering

• #2376: Text size

• #2377: getting started

• #2378: Setting individual staff sizes

• #2379: Stuck Notes

• #2380: soprano clef

• #2381: mpc

• #2383: Notation for spoken parts in a song

• #2384: Editing Text above staff

• #2385: help

• #2386: Please give me some tips...

• #2387: how to submit your own nwc files to the database?

• #2388: New font on Scripto: Bongos

• #2389: mpc help

• #2390: Goldberg Variations

• #2391: FM synth implementation of chorus effect

• #2393: Transposing Imported Midi Files

• #2394: Different Line Thickness in printing Metafiles

• #2395: Update now available 1.70.11

• #2396: Hammond B3

• #2397: Keyboard to sound card plug

• #2398: Sound Blaster Audigy Platinum Ex

• #2401: What are you favorite original *.nwc files?

• #2403: Harmonic Analyser V2.3 released

• #2404: excess space after first note under slur

• #2405: Transposing and note markings

• #2406: Orchestral reduction for piano

• #2408: NWC vs PrintMusic

• #2409: Synchronizing sound and score highlight

• #2410: comping slashes

• #2411: bar lines and whole rests

• #2413: NWC-files ==> MP3


#2: How do I edit members of an existing chord?
How do I edit members of an existing chord?

(2)

Submitted by: support@ntworthy.com on 08 Nov 1996

After I create a chord, is there any way to change the members in the chord without rebuilding the chord? I just want to change one note from A# to A natural.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 08 Nov 1996

You can selectively remove chord members by pressing Ctrl+Backspace while the insertion point is immediately to the right of the target chard member. The Ctrl+Backspace command essentially performs the reverse operation from the Ctrl+Enter command.

You can find other useful keystrokes in the help file, section Keyboard Guide.

Regards, Support Staff

Reply 2 offered by: risto.kuusisto@valmet.com on 18 Dec 1996

The given solution is only partial. There should actually be something like "vertical selection" in addition to the existing horizontal selection possibility.

Reply 3 offered by: Antoine on 14-Jul-1999

I recently download NWC as an evaluation. It works great but I wonder how can I add accompaniment over the staves. I mean something like A, Dm, F, B etc.

Thanks in advance.

Antoine

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-Jul-1999

Chords can be added as text at a point above the staff.
They need to be placed just ahead of a note with the preserve width attribute off.
It may be necessary to add some padding with spaces before the text to align the chord with the note.
Use # and b for sharps and flats.

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 8 offered by: Marco Losavio on 01-Feb-2000

I too am evaluating NoteWorthy. How can I modify an inserted text? I'm not more able to select it.
Thanks for your attention
Marco Losavio

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 01-Feb-2000

You should be able to select the text simply by moving the cursor to the left or right of the text insertion point and typing <Shift><right-arrow> or <Shift><left-arrow> respectively. Once the text is selected you can delete using <Delete>.

If you want simply to delete without selecting, move the cursor to the left or right of the text insertion point and type <Delete> or <Backspace> respectively.

Reply 10 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Feb-2000

If you have Preserved Width OFF then you have to select the small diamond symbol representing the insertion point.
Grant's tip above is the easiest way to select the symbol.

Reply 11 offered by: Jimmy on 21-Mar-2000

hey is there a way, when importing midis, change all of the midi triplets to noteworthy triplets

Reply 12 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Mar-2000

Triplets are imported incorrectly, but consistently. They can be fixed using keyboard macros. See http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Macros in the Noteworthy Scriptorium.

Reply 13 offered by: Jer's on 13-Jun-2000

When I want to import midi file with the lastest versin of NoteWorthy, what do should I do to do that ???

Reply 14 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Jun-2000

File --> Open --> select a midi file. The new version is smart enough to know that you want to import it, and you're taken through the import dialog.

Reply 15 offered by: Billy Bob on 14-Jun-2000

I have a question for everyone...if anyone is in here. How do you create a trill on the shareware version of Note Worthy Composer???

Thank you

Reply 16 offered by: Grant on 14-Jun-2000

It's the same in any version:

1) for the look of a trill, use the Boxmarks font available from the Scriptorium (www.vadu.com/nwc)

2) for the sound of a trill, write out all the little notes. Copy & paste can be helpful here.

3) for both, create a visible but muted staff that looks right and an audible but hidden staff that sounds right.

Reply 17 offered by: David Potvin on 12-Sep-2000

Interesting chat, in here! I use Noteworthy Composer for professional use (yes, I'm registered!) and it works great! As easy to use as a text editor! My only problem comes when I get to print my stuff, and most characters I cheat with (Staccatos, trills, multiple bar rests, etc), I have to re-edit them all the time and it eats in my schedule - takes too much time! Now what I'd REALLY need is functions, not fonts! Now, Mr. SysOp, will there be any improvements in that direction in future upgrades?

Reply 18 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 12-Sep-2000

I mentioned this once before, but it's worth mentioning again:

A Windows metafile from NWC (File>Print Preview>Copy to file)can be opened and edited in some drawing programs. This is great for fine-tuning the appearance of sheet music to be printed. Of course, it does nothing whatever to the "sound" music.

I realize that's not the same as editing within NWC, but I have a couple of expensive programs to compare it to, and neither of them is very useful for within-program appearance editing.

Reply 19 offered by: David Potvin on 20-Sep-2000

Yes, and by the way - to all users - Metafiles are great when you have to send files to someone - as long as he has the Noteworthy font on his computer! (Question marks in my head concerning copyrights...)

As to the appearance of the charts, with all the add-ons and fonts in the User's Help section, it's great! Although I might suggest - for those fonts - to add a couple more characters which might be useful to the pop-jazz domain of writing! Noteworthy's real close to entering in the big competitive market alongside the ones mainly used in the big music schools! Its interface - as I mentioned earlier - which is more reminiscent of a text editor makes it a MUCH EASIER program to use that the others...

But I can't help but mention that functions will always have a step over fonts! Especially when it comes to printing your pages and the adjusting of text characters take time...

Reply 20 offered by: alex on 17-Sep-2001

I just need to insert rests into chords. Any tips?

Reply 21 offered by: Grant on 17-Sep-2001

Can't be done, AFAIK. You can insert chords into rests, though, as long as the chord's duration is longer than the rest's.

The general all-purpose way to get around these limitations is to insert the rest as a text item in the NWCV15 font. Set one of the User fonts (in File/Page Setup/Fonts) to NWCV15. The appropriate font size for NWCV15 varies with the staff point size (in File/Page Setup/Options); for a staff size of 16 it looks like a font size of 20 is about right. When you insert the text item, set the Display Font to the one you mapped NWCV15 to (e.g., User 1); rests are mapped to the characters "lmnopqr", starting with the whole rest. "z" maps to a dot.


#3: How do I change the key signature of an existing staff?
How do I change the key signature of an existing staff?

(3)

Submitted by: support@ntworthy.com on 08 Nov 1996

I have an existing staff in the key of C. I want to change the staff to the key of G. Can I do this without having to enter all of the notes again?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 08 Nov 1996

The following should help:

Change Key Procedure:

1. From the Tools menu, select Force Accidentals

2. Select the key signature, and change it using Ctrl+E (Edit Selection) (if no key exists, then use Insert Key Signature at the beginning of the staff)

3. Press OK. The Key Signature is now changed.

4. Select Transpose, and specify an interval of "0". This will re-spell the staff based on the new key signature

You now have completed the key change.


#4: How to: Change the clef for an existing staff or selection
How to: Change the clef for an existing staff or selection

(4)

Submitted by: support@ntworthy.com on 08 Nov 1996

If you want to change an existing clef, the following procedure is a good way to do it.

Clef Change Procedure:

1. Select the clef, press Ctrl+E, and change it as necessary

2. Now, press Home, then Shift+End, which selects the whole staff (you can also try this procedure on smaller selections, where appropriate)

3. Press Shift+Ctrl+Up/Down arrow until the notes are at the proper position for the new clef

4. Press F9 to update the key signatures (this performs an audit of the internal score data)

You now have completed the clef change.


#5: How to: Get started using the product
How to: Get started using the product

(5)

Submitted by: support@ntworthy.com on 08 Nov 1996

The following are some useful areas in the help file for learning the system:

1. Getting Started, especially "Working in the Score Editor" (you can search for "Introduction to the Notation Editor")

2. Keyboard Guide

3. Answers to Common Questions

This is in a question, followed by answer format. Each question has hypertext links to the corresponding answer.


#6: selecting
selecting

(6)

Submitted by: Neil Baker on 13 Nov 1996

To select notation items to end of staff, press Shift +<End> To select notatation items to beginning of staff, press Shift+<Home>

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 26 Nov 1996

...and to select from the beginnig of the measure, press Shift-Ctrl-Left, and Shift-Ctrl-Right to the end of it...

Generally speaking, the mouse is slow and the keyboard quick. Hopefully I'm left-handed ;-) !


#7: WISH LIST
WISH LIST

(7)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 16 Nov 1996

Hey! I'll bite! I think a thread on desired features for NWC might make for some great discussion about where Noteworthy Artware's devoted followers (I am one) would like to see the products go. Here's some starters:

1) I'd love to be able to extend the text facility so that I could insert musical symbols that aren't yet supported by NWC (eg trills, mordants, appogiaturas, arpeggios, etc). I think Noteworthy would need to supply the font, though, so that things would be consistent when sending files from Beijing to Belize.

2) I'd be overjoyed if the above musical diddlies (crushed notes, trills and arpeggios especially) were supported by NWC. That would be a world- first! (I imagine it's also pretty hard).

3) Some form of global control of dynamics. Either a) a conductor stave, which other staves obey if not told otherwise, or b) a cut/paste facility that only pulls specific events, and overlays when pasting. This second one could be good for stripping controllers, or even separating and merging voices (if implemented in a good generic fashion)

That's enough for now, or it'll get so big you won't read it.

Andrew

Reply 1 offered by: bangs@cet.com on 10 Dec 1996

Two more wishes. Retrograde and inversion

Reply 2 offered by: Carl Bangs - Fenwick Parva Press on 23 Nov 1996

I too would like to add ornaments to the text mode. I have published two collections of 18th century carillon music, and have had to put anything but "~" in by hand. More than 250 pieces of music!

Reply 3 offered by: Damien Hall on 22 Nov 1996

Here is an addition: 1) Ability to create a special staff for drums ( I don't quite know the word for it, but here is a picture below). |-------------------|------------------| 2) Wizards when you start a new file (choose staves, clefs, etc.)

3) Ability to customize title bar

4) MIDI imput support.

That's all for now, I'll give you more later.

Reply 4 offered by: Kenneth Kurtz on 17 Nov 1996

On that note ... I've been beggin' for the option of playback in "swing tempo" since version 1.0. It's unreasonable, if I'm arranging in 4/4, to have to reconstruct a copy in 12/8 just to get a jazz tune to sound like a jazz tune. But other than that, I have absolutely no problem with Composer in the slightest.

Reply 5 offered by: John Ford on 20 Nov 1996

My wish list would include the ability to enter chord letters (currently entered as text) above the staff, such that if you transpose the staff to a different key, the chord letters follow the key change. I like to notate the music in its original key, then transpose it to a more guitar friendly chord (since they hate those flat keys). But I have to then manually change the text for each guitar chord above the staff. I would like to do something like "Insert Chord", and have it accept A through G with modifiers like #, b (flat), 6, 7, maj, min, dim, etc.

Reply 6 offered by: Chris Clark on 25 Nov 1996

Lots of great ideas (especially the chords)!

Add the following to the list:

1) Graphical crescendos, diminuendos, etc. 2) Allow rests of any size to be put into chords of any size 3) Allow notes with stems pointing down to be higher than notes with stems pointing up (possibly do this with several layers of music so I can have a measure in piano music where one hand is playing octave whole note C's and a quarter note melody in between) 4) Support multi-measure rests when printing out subsets of a score

-Chris

Reply 7 offered by: Alan Macy on 13 Dec 1996

This wish list item is a small change that will make a big difference:

I want it to be easier and quicker to put notes on the staff. Here's one way it could be done:

Be able to drag a note from the toolbar to the staff. You click on the note you want (half, quarter, eighth, etc), and drag it to the proper position.

Currently, you must click on the note in the toolbar, right click on the position, release, then right click on the popup menu.

If you think "Big deal, not much difference." try it. Imagine that you can click and drag, and you'll pretend to notate a song. You'll immediately see how much nicer it is.

- Alan

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 26 Nov 1996

Great idea for multi-measure rests.
But what would be really useful too is the ability to add a staff in the middle of the score, typically when a Tenor voice suddenly splits into 2 voices...
Currently I'm duplicating the staff...
But I know this would be much work to do it.
Thanx for such a program !

Reply 9 offered by: Ed Kolb on 24-Oct-1997

I have two suggestions:

1) Grace Notes

2) Drum Rudiments

Reply 10 offered by: Don Urquhart on 02-Nov-1997

With regard to a quicker way of entering notes, I have a few suggestions. I am blind, and therefore compose by ear and have a bias for the keyboard rather than the mouse. One way to enter notes faster with the keyboard is to enter the letters of the notes. This technique may cause conflicts with shortcuts such as "c" to insert a cleff, but most functions are available from menus or the toolbar anyway, so it wouldn't be too big a problem. Another solution is the use of macros. Has anyone been able to successfully use a keyboard macro program to, for example, play a note on entry, or enter and play a relatively complex musical phrase?

Reply 11 offered by: Jim Gary on 10-Nov-1997

I would like to see the ability to insert a multi-measure rest for printing individual instrument parts. The only way I have found is to either insert a separate masure for each rest (looks rather stupid to have 8 full measure rests in a row) or to draw it in by hand in place of a single measure rest.

Reply 12 offered by: Adam Hill on 11-Nov-1997

Let's see... (Sorry if I'm repeating anything)

1] Guitar tab.
2] Guitar symbols to go with tab (As with Encore V4)
3] Cresc. & Dim. hairpins.
4] Shortcut for marcato changed to Ctrl and something -
I keep missing the shift key!
5] Compressed rests.
6] 'Select All' feature for any given staff.
7] Staff Wizard for instruments, style etc.
8] Control over which fonts are used for text and stuff.
9] Going back to the tab - it could work in a similar
way to lyrics, i.e. unless otherwise stated one number
could be for one note / chord.

PS If this message has ended up in the wrong place could
someone please tell me where to send all this. Cheers.

Reply 13 offered by: Joe Befumo on 11-Jan-1998

I KNOW I've posted this one before, but i'll add it again -- the ability to add at least chord names, and maybe even the guitar fingering symbols (like Cakewalk). They don't even have to be 'smart' (i.e. -- transpose themselves with the music) -- just decorations.

I was just responding to a question in the music.theory newsgroup that was looking for a notation program recommendation. As always, I recommended Noteworthy composer very highly, but again, as always, had to add that my one reservation was that it does not support this VERY common requirement.

As far as Im concerned, if they add this, I'll throw out Cakewalk. (And, if they add tab and n-tuples -- I can throw out Finale as well).

Reply 14 offered by: Warren Barnett on 15-Jan-1998

Great grace notes, but if you want to put them in a beamed group it splits up the group. Is there a chance of adding them without splitting the group. Also adding boxed or circled letters (or numbers) for reference points ( "Let's take it from 2 bars before letter C" ). Currently you can add the letters or numbers above the staff, but you can't box or circle them. I have a font of boxed numbers but once you get into double or triple digits it looks pretty foolish. And don't forget about attaching diddle slashes or other musical symbols to notes (they don't necessarily have to play back, just print out(this is after all mainly supposed to be a scripting program not a playback program)).Simply a notation for multi-bar rests even if it plays back like a single bar of rests. A symbol for a crescendo and diminuendo (possible different lengths). Again the don't have to play, only print. The ability to change the appearance of the ending bar line. If you want to repeat, say, an exercise, then the repeat bar line is printed then the closing bar line. The zoom on the print preview is great, but it would be nice to be able to maximize the window in order to see the whole line at the same time. also nice would be the ability to edit in preview mode but I realize that I'm really pushing it on this one.
Whew!!! I could go on and on if I really tried but this is from someone who just registered and now I'm going crazy with suggestions. Really just a huge list of characters, symbols, chord names, chord symbols, etc, etc, etc, that could be placed in the score (but don't have to play)

Thanks long-winded-ly

Warren Barnett
wbarnett@yesic.com

Reply 15 offered by: Warren Barnett on 15-Jan-1998

I forgot to add notes with different head shapes ( x, circled x, etc, etc, to denote different pecussion stuff (rimshots, playing on cymbals, stick clicks, playing on rims or shells, plus a miriad of other possibilities for other instruments).

Warren Barnett
wbarnett@yesic.com

Reply 16 offered by: Lionel Modra on 26-Jan-1998

My current wish list:-
More flexibility in adding rests, like being able to use rests with the same, or greater duration than the associated note
Ability to force ties and slurs either above or below the note, regardless of the stem direction.

Reply 17 offered by: Johannes Linstead on 29-Jan-1998

Slashes with stems to denote rhythm as opposed to pitch for chord charts.

Reply 18 offered by: Karl Haakonsen on 03-Feb-1998

I entered this in the wish list link, but I'll put it here too.

I'd like to be able to force a fixed length for measures so I can
force a fixed (usually four) number of measures to print on a line, thus
making the form of the song easier to follow when reading (AABA, or whatever).

Reply 19 offered by: Kev on 05-May-1998

Couple of things I would like to see, or to get info from others who have thoughts on these subjects....

1) Using a MIDI map which will allow me to write drum kit parts on a bass clef stave with notes in the correct locations! example...first space on stave (A) should be bass brum and 3rd space (E) should be snare. I guess Microsoft MIDI mapper will help, but how....?

2) It would be nice if, when printing a single part (rather than a multi-part score) consecutive measures (that's bars to me) would be printed as a single measure with a number over it. A soloist part with 32 bars rest is a bit of a nightmare to follow!!!

3) Back to drums. ANY help from anybody about rudiments will help...!!!


#8: How do we notate cres. and decres. as symbols???
How do we notate cres. and decres. as symbols???

(8)

Submitted by: Bill Myers on 19 Nov 1996

How do you notate cres. as ""?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 19 Nov 1996

Graphical crescendo/decrescendo are not currently supported in NWC. For now, only the text versions of these instructions can be directly placed into a NWC score.

Regards, Support Staff


#9: Percussion Support
Percussion Support

(9)

Submitted by: Paul G. McLaughlin on 20 Nov 1996

I recall that MIDI channels 9-16 (?) are for percussion, and indeed, I can "almost" get percussion in NoteWorthy by using Score Builder to make a new score and set its MIDI channel properly.

When I do this, one note becomes a tom-tom, another is a cymbal, etc. However, after a bit, something changes and the whole score plays as a piano (I think).

Anyway, is there already a way I can get NoteWorthy to consistently give me percussion support. Also, ideally, NWC would show me a list of percussion instruments when I pick the right MIDI channels.

Thanks, Paul

(e-mail: pgmac@aol.com)

Reply 1 offered by: marsupilami@ThePentagon.com on 26 Nov 1996

Well, I thought that it was channel 10 and 16, not 9... What I currently have (and gives me no trouble is to set the channel to 10, patch to 16, and instrument to None. Try this and tell me if you still got pbms with that.

About 'instrument' list though, you can check in any midi documentation, or try this : in windoze (3.x) Control Panel, choose the Midi Mapper, then select _K_ey Maps and click on edit. There you'll find the list. Not easy to transform into a text file (otherwise I'd have pasted it), but it you use a program such as BigDesk (virtual multi-screen tool) no need to Alt-Tab all the time... You also could print the list (Alt-PrintScrenn, PaintBrush, Paste, Print...)

HTH !

Reply 2 offered by: marsupilami@ThePentagon.com on 26 Nov 1996

Well, I thought that it was channel 10 and 16, not 9... What I currently have (and gives me no trouble is to set the channel to 10, patch to 16, and instrument to . Try this and tell me if you still got pbms with that.

HTH !

Reply 3 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 22 Nov 1996

Percussion sounds are almost always mapped to notes on MIDI channel 10. In some rare cases on older cards, channel 16 was used instead. If your card supports the drum sounds on channel 10, and you setup your drum staves to use channel 10, you should consistently hear drum sounds in response.

A list of the General MIDI mapping for drum sounds can also be found in the NoteWorthy Composer help file, in the Common Questions section, item number 6.

Also, thanks for the suggestion about showing drum instruments. We will take it into consideration as we plan for future development.

Regards,

support@ntworthy.com


#10: Please explain...
Please explain...

(10)

Submitted by: Damien Hall on 22 Nov 1996

multi point controllers and instrument patches. your help file barely touches on this.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 24 Nov 1996

I have version 1.30d and there is a heap of on-line help available by getting up the dialog (by pressing "L" or Choosing Insert | Multipoint Controller from the menu), and then pressing the [HELP] button.

It has more info than what I could care to type in here.

If you do have more questions, though, please ask again.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen on 04-May-1998

I spent two months writing a piano sonata on noteworthy composer that I had saved about 200 times, but when I tried to bring it up today, all that came up was a single, black staff.

Reply 3 offered by: Sergei on 04-May-1998

A piece of music I composed using NWC that I had saved many times has been deleted from my computer, although the filename is still intact, and a blank staff still appears. It was one of my better compositions and I think it may still be somewhere in the machine.

If anyone has any knowledge of how I might go about finding it in the machine, please let me know.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 11-Jun-1998

Maybe you saved you file with an older (1.21 ?) version than the one you try to open it with. The last version (1.51a) is now correct, but a previous one (1.50 ?) did what you describe. To be sure, try to look (without saving!!) at your score in raw format. If you can find it it the text items that you should, and if the file has not a null length, try to upgrade to the last version if not yet done.
Hint: to look at ANY type of file, you can use WindowsCommander which replaces explorer, winfile, zip programs and ftp all at once. I use it for its grand convenience. You can freely download it at http://www.ghisler.com : it is a shareware that I guess any one who tries it wants to register. As NWC :-)

Hope this helps.
                  MAD


#13: Fermata
Fermata

(13)

Submitted by: Daniel Shinkle on 25 Nov 1996

Is it possible to place a fermata above a note?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 27 Nov 1996

Yes, this is possible. The fermata is located on the Tempo Variance item. You may have difficulty aligning it over a note in some circumstances, but you can, at least, get the graphic into your score, and have it influence playback as well (using the delay value).

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Chris Clark on 25 Nov 1996

It usually works OK for me if I just uncheck the Preserve Width box. The fermata isn't perfectly centered over the notehead, but it's close enough for my purposes right now. If you have accidentals in front of the note/chord, things look a little strange, but the fermata is still over the note/chord.

Can we expect a fix for this in the near future? (possibly implement fermatas in a similar manner to accents and staccatos?)

-Chris

Reply 3 offered by: B6494 on 25-Feb-1998

While we're touching on fermatas ... it would be nice if their attributes could be exported to a MIDI file just like everything else seems to be.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Feb-1998

This subject is covered in one of the other threads, but is covered here in asnwer to your post. Fermata (ie. a delay in the music not related to tempo) is not supported in the MIDI standard, so cannot be exported into a MIDI file. If you want a MIDI file to sound better, you should use 0 delay in the NWC fermata, and switch to tempo changes to simulate the fermata (tempo changes will export to MIDI). We have found that the absolute value setting in the multi-point controller can be an effective way to simulate a "fermata like" playback, even when exported to a MIDI file.


#16: Chord containing a rest
Chord containing a rest

(16)

Submitted by: DuVal Hicks on 26 Nov 1996

Noteworthy 1.3F help reads: "A chord containing a rest is created by first placing the rest, and then adding one or more notes to that rest. The duration of the rest must be smaller than that of the notes that are added to it."

I have found that I can add a rest and then a note that is larger than the rest and not have the chord member command work. In fact it sometimes works and sometimes it doesn't. I have need for a piano score with different voicings and it is difficult to handle the rest with chords. Can anyone help ?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 27 Nov 1996

Are you using the stem direction tools? It is important to note that NWC considers a rest to have a "stem direction" when you are combining it with notes. If the rest has a stem direction, and the note is given the same stem direction, the add attempt will fail. This is also true for notes with differing durations but the same stem direction.

If this does not resolve the problem, perhaps you can provide a scenario that fails, and sent it to us.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#17: WISH LIST
WISH LIST

(17)

Submitted by: Barry Graham (Australia) on 27 Nov 1996

1. Multiple bar rests 2. Section Open Flags (bar no. or letter) 3. Rhythm note heads (vergules) with same midi status as rests 4. Cymbal note heads for remapped drum parts.

I'll bet your sorry you started this!!

Reply 1 offered by: John E. Taylor on 07-Feb-1998

Some actions lend themselves to global action. In most cases a key change is a global change whether you're working on a piano chart with only two staves or a concert arrangment with 16 or 20 staves. The ability to select a global change will save a lot of time. Tme signatures usually have the same global impact. The ability to make a change from 3/4 to 4/4, for example, will save a lot of time and key strokes. Thanks for any consideration.

Reply 2 offered by: Ryan on 30-Jul-1998

You need to add a better way of doing drum rolls!


#18: Putting .nwc on website
Putting .nwc on website

(18)

Submitted by: Darlene Marquardt (dmaring@orednet.org) on 27 Nov 1996

Hi.. I have put some .nwc files on my web site and for some reason they want to load up as text rather than binary.. I notice some of the others have had the same problem.. my system administrator is looking into it.. he says it is not a common file extension.. what did others do to solve?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Bacher <seb@draper.com> on 18 Dec 1996

And, of course, if all you're interested in is the playback capability, the simplest approach is to export your .nwc file as a MIDI (.mid) file and put that on your Web site. Then just about any Web surfer will be able to play your masterpiece.

- seb

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 3 offered by: apurdam@pcug.org.au (Andrew Purdam) on 18 Dec 1996

I still think there is a step missing, and that's telling our Webserver to tell the rest of the web that the file it's about to send is an application/nw-composer

I believe that it is just defaulting to text/html or something similar, as when I click on my links to NWC files, they end up in my window as text (not much text in a NWC file, is there?:-)

Is there anyone who can explain this whole procedure fully so that when people click on my NWC files they will get Noteworthy Player playing it?

Of course, the next step is to have NW Player as a plugin, and then we can EMBED the files!!!! Scarey thought!

Andrew

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 29 Nov 1996

Netscape, in reply to the question "Why doesn't my web page work when I upload it to my ISP's server?" say (amongst other things) "If you have composed a web page locally on your hard drive and it works, but once uploaded sound files don't play, etc., read on.

The web functions on MIME types. For every document transmitted, the server includes a 'header' which instructs the receiver (web browser) as to what *kind* of data is being sent. The format is type/sub-type.

When a sound clip or video applet doesn't run, it is usually related to MIME types on either or both the client (Navigator) and the server. Example: Server is sending application/midi, when the client is expecting audio/x-midi. The fix: contact your service provider (ISP) for help to correct the mismatch. "

I was calling mine application/x-nwc, but perhaps Noteworthy Artware would like to choose a standard that we could all use before going off to out ISPs to get our files recognised.

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: marsupilami@ThePentagon.com on 27 Nov 1996

Yes, it seems that .NWC files are recognized as text files (on NN3 at least, didn't try on MSIE or any other).

2 Solutions :
First is to upload them as zipped files. For speed sake it's better too ;
Second is to use ftp instead, setting it up into binary mode.

If someone can properly download a(ny) .nwc file(s), let us know !

Hope this helps,
Dominique

Reply 7 offered by: AlexanderT@bigfoot.com on 27 Nov 1996

Even though I have never tried what I am about to say, I think it should work...

I know it's possible to do this with Netscape Navigator 3 but I think same technique can be applied to other browsers, ie MSIE.

First of all d/l NWC PLayer, and then setup .nwc application as a helper app (in Netscape, under Options|General Preferences|Helper Apps), so that as soon as you click on a .nWC file it will automatically launch the player.

When uploading the .NWC file to your web site (ftp) use binary file transfer.

I am pretty sure one could get this to work, but it's just in theory

Reply 8 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Feb-1999

You must setup the MIME type for NWC files such that Netscape receives NWC files as binary data. On our servers, we added the following line to our .htaccess file:

AddType application/octet-stream nwc

This forced NWC files to be treated as a binary MIME type. If you are adding NWC files to your web site, consult with your web server documentation for the appropriate method for achieving this.

Reply 10 offered by: walid on 24-Jul-2000

send me partitures of j.s bach for guitar

Reply 11 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 24-Jul-2000

Regarding downloading a *.nwc file: Has anyone tried the right-click and "Save Target As" or "Save Link As" on your web browser? It depends which browser you have. I know this works for some things. For example, it can be used to save a MIDI file without playing it immediately. Unfortunately I cannot try it for *.nwc on my current machine, as the Windows NT system that I am using has that function blocked.

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 25-Jul-2000

I moved to another computer ...

Using Netscape on a Windows machine, it is possible to download a *.nwc file as a file to disk, without the machine attempting to open it as text. Right-click on the link, and "Save Link As..." Later, you can open the saved *.nwc file in Noteworthy Player.

Of course, you can also zip the file. Then, anyone with an un-zipper can get it. Or, if your audience has Windows machines (and I suppose they do), then you may be able to make a Windows self-executable file to enclose your *.nwc, if you have the software.

Reply 13 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Jul-2000

It should also be noted that version 1.70 of both NWC and the Player include a mechanism which attempts to correct for an *.nwc file that has been incorrectly retrieved as an ASCII file.

Reply 14 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 26-Jul-2000

Ah, yes! Thank you very much for that ASCII versus binary feature, NWC. In fact, on my system, when I right-click and "Save Link As" it DOES retrieve it as ASCII, and the NWC software DOES give a warning message and (so far, successfully) converts the file to the necessary binary.

Reply 15 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Feb-2001

In the interest of progress, the best way to put nwc files on the web would be to integrate use of the NWC browser plug-in. See http://noteworthycomposer.com/plugin.htm for details.

Reply 16 offered by: Eamonn FitzPatrick on 07-Feb-2001

This reply probably belongs more correctly under the discussion on the new browser plug-in. However, since Noteworthy has introduced here, let me say that I have added the plug-in to Netscape and it works a treat. Well done Noteworthy for another super piece of kit. I accessed Fred's "Caverns" to try it out and was delighted with the results. A right click allowed me to save the file to disk. However, when I opened the file in Noteworthy it just didn't look the same. The staves were stretched out across the screen and no longer had the usual nice neat appearance of Noteworhty files. This is a minor inconvenience and in no way interferes with the intended use of the plug-in.

Reply 17 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Feb-2001

Fred makes extensive use of hidden items to control the overall sound that is created in Caverns. Obviously, these items are visible in the editor. Fred has done a great job in improving the overall presentation of the piece when viewed in the browser plug-in and the player.

Reply 18 offered by: Eamonn FitzPatrick on 08-Feb-2001

I couldn't agree more. My comments were intended to be in praise of both the Noteworthy browser plug-in AND of Fred, and not as a criticism.

Reply 19 offered by: Joel Sappington on 19-Nov-2001

Hello, I am Joel Sappington, a percussionist, brass player, strings, and woodwind player. I am in a High School band, I play xylophone for marching band. Me and my friend, Joe Gatlin, are wondering if we can make a public presentation of your, "Caverns" we will use nothing but real instruments, kind of like a ensamble, consisting of about from 5 to 15 musicians. This will include, bells, tubular bells, various brass instruments, vibes, and several "toys"

We may only get together and do this for fun, but we will ask to be able to perform it at a concert, for the symphonic band.

Joe and I, are composers also, so we understand if you do not wish to give us permission to use your peice. Email me back at adder5000@hotmail.com to give me your permission, denial, or whatever you may choose to tell me. A quick response would be appreciated.

Thank you very much,
-Joel Sappington

Reply 20 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Nov-2001

Joel, you need to contact the author, Fred Nachbaur, directly.


#20: Tip: Creating Voice Activated NWC Commands
Tip: Creating Voice Activated NWC Commands

(20)

Submitted by: BrownBeeS@AOL.com on 01 Dec 1996

Steve Pearson submitted a tip about the above subject. The program he used was a limited working version of Dragon Dictate available on the CD-ROM version of WordPerfect 6.1. I have WP 6.1 on floppies and Dragon Dictate is not on them. I have WP 7.0 on CD, but a different speech recognition demo is on it without the same flexibility that Dragon Dictate apparently has. Do you know how or where I can get the demo version of Dragon Dictate, even though I don't have the CD version of 6.1? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 28 Dec 1996

I gave what limited info I could to Beth at Noteworthy. Let me know if she got in touch with you. My only known source is Dragon Dictate on the Novell WP 6.1 disk. Dragon Dictate (personal) has a "relatively" low cost program. Additionally, VoicePad (the full version) may have some possibilities. A demo can be downloaded off the web. I tried the IBM program on the Corel WP 7.0 CD ROM and was underwhealmed. Steve Pearson

Reply 2 offered by: mikel  on 03-Mar-1998

could someone send me an e-mail with a url to the page that i could download a working version of any dictating program im looking very hard for one of the such


#21: Sending Noteworthy files via e-mail
Sending Noteworthy files via e-mail

(21)

Submitted by: bangs@cet.com on 03 Dec 1996

How can I send NWC and midi files via e-mail?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 17 Dec 1996

If your system supports MIME, our best advice is to compress the files first into a *.zip package. In general, e-mail systems understand how to encode these files and transmit them over the internet.

If your e-mail system does not support MIME enclosures, then you will need to convert your binary files into an ascii coded version prior to sending them. This process is generally referred to as UUENCODE on the internet. The recipient them UUDECODEs the e-mail to recover the original binary files.

There are freeware utilities around that will do the UUENCODE/UUDECODE work for you. I recommend using a software search engine such as www.shareware.com.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Charles Socci on 04 Dec 1996

Its just a file, send it as an attachment.

Reply 3 offered by: Carl Bangs on 06 Dec 1996

I have done this. Perhaps the question should be, "What must I do to read these files?" My corres[pondents say that all they get is garbage.


#22: Endings
Endings

(22)

Submitted by: CNAlberga@aol.com on 06 Dec 1996

I'm a very new user, and I don't have any MIDI stuff, just an SB 16. Is there any easy way to keep the end of a piece sound natural, rather than being cut off? I'm mostly using piano, and to make things more complicated the scores often end with a local repeat close followed by a master repeat close, so I don't know how to provide a special ending for the final bit.

I would like the piano to die away at the end, rather than stop dead.

Any suggestions?

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 1 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 02 Jan 1997

I was having the same problem. The "tie-over" did not seem to resolve the situation. Instead, what I have done is go to "Insert", "Multi Controller", and then select volume, linear sweep, and at the bottom of the menu screen, provide for a reducing volume at each beat with a "zero" volume on the final beat of the played note. The keyboard shortcut for the multivolume controller is "L". Hope this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 06 Dec 1996

I don't know about previous versions, but NWC 1.30f will let you score a tie over a repeat bar. eg.

repeat-open tied-minim tie-symbol rebeat-close-bar tied-to-minim

This will play as minim, followed by a minim tied to another minim. You can then just notate a tied note to a final bar which will allow the notes time to decay.

A second method would be to use special endings on the last bar of your repeats. Your first special ending would be just as normal, with the repeat close at the end of it, but your second could add an extra bar and tie the notes to get the extra sound.

Hope this helps,

Andrew

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 09 Dec 1996

Well, I tried to add ties over repeat bars, but NWC refused to allow them. I'm using the latest down-load, too. If there is any secret to making them "stick" PLEASE tell me.

In general, I am finding that a score for display has to be different from a score for listening. Trills and other ornaments are the obvious cases. Is there any may to keep to scores co-ordinated, so the print and play don't get out of sync?

Also, while I'm at it, is there any way to get better MIDI import? I have noted two phenomena, first, export and import are NOT symetric. What comes back does not look like what went out. I don't know where the differences are introduced, but this would seem to limit the ability to share scores with people using other software. Second, MIDI files which I have downloaded sound distinctly different when I play them directly, say with QuickPlay, or when I import them into NWC and play them there. Generally, the result in NWC is very poor. What (if anything) can be done about these cases?

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 5 offered by: marsupilami (also at cerix@club-internet.fr) on 11 Dec 1996

You're right Cyril, some export/import don't look the same.

If you want notes to have their full length, use the 'Legato' style on each staff (does anyone know how to HIDE it ? I superimpose them for now), this will improve export quality ; for triplets, I'm afraid they often are badly translated (at import time??) but what I use is a macro (with the goold old macro Recorder(.Exe) of Win3.1) to restore it as a real triplet. (I often use macros, I'll upload them asap !)

I did some other tricks in the past, but can't remind of them for now.

Hope this helps, Dominique 'Marsu'

Reply 6 offered by: on 11 Dec 1996

Reply 7 offered by: CNAlberga@aol.com on 07 Dec 1996

Thanks for the note. I'll try the ties. I don't think special will work in the cases of the local immediatly followed by the major repeat closes, as local's don't take special endings, and it would have to apply only on the last local repetition of the last major repetition, which is probably much too much to ask.

Thanks again Cyril


#24: How to handle pentoles (five notes per unit) ?
How to handle pentoles (five notes per unit) ?

(24)

Submitted by: E.C.Peter on 09 Dec 1996

How to handle pentoles (five notes per unit) like trioles (three notes per unit) or in NWC called triplets ?

I know the answer from NoteWorthy- support, but I am not happy about that. What kind of Composer' s help does not support more than triplets ? (like in Beethoven's 5th concert for piano, first movement!)

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 17 Dec 1996

Dear Mr. Peters,

If you send me your email address I will send you a short example of the technique I describe in the previous note. I know it's ugly, but it does seem to work.

cnalberga@aol.com

Reply 2 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 17 Dec 1996

Hi, this may be a case of the blind leading the blind, I'm a rank beginner, myself.

You may have noted my comment about scores for printing and scores for playing. The apparently have to be different. In some cases at least it should be possible to get the sound of a pentole (and a septole, if there is such a word), although the score will look like a mess. It all depends on the fact that notes are based on a binary number system.

Assume you are writting in 4/4 time, with a tempo of 1/2 = 100. When you reach the measure which is to include a pentole you change to 5/4 time and set the tempo to 1/2 = 125. Now, any 1/4 note in the measure must be written as 1/4 + 1/16, any 1/8 as 1/8 + 1/32, etc. As you can see, the smallest note you can have is a 1/16. These will sound for the correct duration, due to the change in tempo. The pentole is written with "ordinary" notes. Five 1/8 notes will play in the duration of 4 in the rest of the score, etc.

If you switch to 7/4 time, tempo 1/2 = 175, then use double-dotted notes in place of there un-dotted equivalent, you can produce septoles.

The relationships between the different notes allows you to retain the same bar structure (and hence accents in play-back) only if the time signature is 2/x, 4/x, etc. If you are in 3/8, 6/4, or anything else things get messy. I havn't figured those out, and I can't think of any way to keep the bar structure, unless you could have fractional time signature, you know, like 2.5/8, but that seem a bit much to ask. (More than true support of pentoles etc.)

I must warn you that this is all theoretical. I've done the math, but I haven't tried it out.

Yours, Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 3 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 09 Dec 1996

As you indicate, NWC does not currently support note groupings beyond triplets. Your question seems to indicate that you are aware of this limitation. Are you asking something else as well?

I hope this helps.

Eric,

support@ntworthy.com


#26: Appoggiaturas
Appoggiaturas

(26)

Submitted by: Fantini@cmu.unige.ch on 09 Dec 1996

How can I add appoggiaturas to the notes ? thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 09 Dec 1996

As far as I can tell, NWC doesn't do them, though I wish it did, as well as mordants, turns, trills and arpeggios. I imagine that they could all be done using the same sort of "engine", but that's a software problem for Noteworthy to solve.

In the meantime, the closest I've got is:

If you want it to SOUND right, you need to explicitly enter the notes eg a double dotted quaver followed by a demisemiquaver instead of a crotchet followed by the appoggiatura. This is a real pain.

If you want it to LOOK right, either export the page from the print dialog (in Print preview) either as a Windows Metafile or bitmap, and edit in what you need. As soon as NWC has alternative fonts for text, (and I think I heard that it is coming, but you'd need to check) this visual side will become much easier.

Andrew

of a crotchet on the previous


#27: Good theoretical Music Tutorial Sought
Good theoretical Music Tutorial Sought

(27)

Submitted by: Ray Vermey (rvermey@hiscom.nl) on 11 Dec 1996

Hi!

I am looking for a good Music tutor on the Net. One which explains the different Keys, transposing, chord etc etc. Thanx in advance!

Ray

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 17 Dec 1996

I just spent some time wading through search results, and I did not come up with anything worthy of reporting in this reply. If you have a community library in your area, you might be surprised at what you can find simply by asking for help there. After wading through some of the vast number of sites that make references to many musical terms, it appears that the traditional information search may be best in this case.

If you do find a good site, please feel free to share it with us.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Glade Diviney on 21 Jan 1997

I would recommend my first-year music theory textbook: "Tonal Harmony" by Kostka and Payne.

I think a web site representation of this kind of information would have to contain about 60MB of pictures of staves!

Reply 3 offered by: Donell Meadows on 13-Nov-1997

Since my music theory teacher quit on me,I've been looking for the same thing. What I've found on the net has not been very helpful. You may want to try Elderly Instruments,I think you can reach them at Elderly.com. They have music theory books & tape combos that may be useful. I intend to try them,myself.

D

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 06-Nov-1998

I've found a site that is of great interest, and especially to reply this thread look at http://hyperion.advanced.org:80/15413/theory/theory.htm
...for english-talking people.

Note that for composer biographies, you can link to http://hyperion.advanced.org:80/15413/history/music-history.htm ; so bad that don't have (or i didn't find) a search tool. But you still can use lycos or whatever you use, to look for a special composer + on this site :-)

Otherwise I found this link looking for Monteverdi's "Lamento d'Arianna", does someone have it on his disk in midi or nwc form ?

NWCly yours
Dominique

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 06-Nov-1998

I found another intersting link : for composers' bios, take a look at http://www.hnh.com:80/qcomp.htm :-)

Reply 6 offered by: Subodh Dash on 31-May-2000

The link http://hyperion.advanced.org:80/15413/theory/theory.htm provided by Marsu is real cool. I found a similar online theory which you can find at http://www.mibac.com/ Go to the 'Theory Reference' section and you have a whole bunch of stuff to read.

Byt the way, does anybody do any recording with yamaha PSR540 keyboard ?

Reply 7 offered by: Joan Ko on 09-Nov-2000

I found some links to basic music theory:
http://datadragon.com/education/reading
http://www.teoria.com

Check out this link, too.
http://nuinfo.nwu.edu/musicschool/links/projects/scoreScan/pages/links.htm

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Nov-2000

One that I like:

http://www.musictheory.halifax.ns.ca/


#29: More voices on one staff
More voices on one staff

(29)

Submitted by: Michel PONSARD on 18 Dec 1996

How may i write with NWC two or more voices on the same staff? It would be useful for writing fugues played with the piano, for instance.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam apurdam@pcug.org.au on 18 Dec 1996

This question is answered (and asked!) in Common Questions (Q3) on this website.

In a nutshell, to add more than one voice to a staff, use Ctrl-Enter. To delete a voice from a chord, use Ctrl-Delete.

Note that you can add notes of different lengths to a chord, but there are some restrictions. These are discussed in the online help which came with Noteworthy Composer, assuming you have a fairly recent version. Search for help on "Chord". This would have answered your initial query, too :-).

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Michael Natal on 13 Jan 1997

I think the initial message may refer to something more complex than simply using ctrl-enter to add notes. I have also tried to write 4-part contrapuntal music on 2 staves, and it is quite difficult, due to the "restrictions" referred to in the first response. (Examples sent upon request). My question, more for the program developers, is whether these restrictions will be removed in future versions.


#31: 'NTW True-Type Font Error'
'NTW True-Type Font Error'

(31)

Submitted by: George Szymanski (UK) on 24 Dec 1996

When I try to run NWC I hit an error :- "NWC True-Tupe font cannot be found on the system"

I have installed version 1.5f and still hit the problem.

Any suggestions for a solution ?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 30 Dec 1996

Version 1.30f directly installs the font into the system. You should not need to do anything to make it work.

For earlier 1.30 versions, the following should help:

You can try the following, in order:

1. Delete the nwcv13.fot file, then restart NWC. The font should be rebuilt and all should be well.

If not, then

2. Delete the nwcv13.fot file if it exists. Reboot your system, then restart NWC. The font should be rebuilt and all should be well.

If not, then

3. For Windows 95, move the nwcv13.ttf file to \windows\font, or for Windows 3.1, install the font from the control panel. Now, open the file \windows\nwc.ini, and change the line

AddFontOnStartup=1

- to -

AddFontOnStartup=0

Now start NWC, and all should be well.

If not, then the font file is probably corrupted, and needs to be replaced all together.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 28 Dec 1996

Final correction (hopefully): ignore my comment regarding the Chopin.ttf file. I erroneously moved a copy of that into my NWC program file when I had a problem. The file actually relates to another music program. Secondly, if you reinstall to a temporary directory, you may want to copy the new .ttf file to the windows font directory and to the regular nwc directory. If all else fails, and you have Windows95, try reinstalling the font through the control panel, fonts, file, install font command. Then go to the directory which has the NWCv13 file.

Reply 3 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 28 Dec 1996

Re my last message. If you have an email address, I could try emailing a non-corrupted NWCV13A.ttf file to you. Let me know. Steve Pearson.

Reply 4 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 28 Dec 1996

I had the same problem. Reinstallation of the program did not help because of a corrupted font file that was not being overwritten. I forget what Eric Heile had me do, but try the following: (1) locate the NWCV13A.ttf file whereever you have your window font files located; (2) Move that file (and any Chopin.ttf files) to a backup directory (as a safety precaution); (3) Either fully extract the NWCV13A.ttf file from your installation disk and copy it in to the font directory used by your Windows program or (4) if you do not have an appropriate extraction utility, temporarily install a new NWC program into a temporary working directory. I suspect the installation will reinstall the NWCV13A.ttf file in your windows directory. You may have to restart windows and nwc to have the font rebuilt. I vaguely remember that Eric Heile had a simpler solution, so you may just want to ask him. However, the foregoing may work if you cannot wait.

Reply 5 offered by: SooYoun on 16-Aug-1998

I need the font file "nwcv15.ttf" urgently.
When I try to open the NWC, it says "NWC True-Tupe font cannot
be found on the system". Waiting for your prompt amswer.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Aug-1998

SooYoun: The nwc 1.5 font is installed by the NWC setup program. It is in your system if you installed from the setup routine. You may, however, need to reboot your system in order to make it available. It is also possible that you have too many fonts installed on your system, and some will have to be removed before new fonts can be used (such as the NWCV15 font).


#32: Appogiaturae (Grace Notes)
Appogiaturae (Grace Notes)

(32)

Submitted by: Tavish Donahue on 30 Dec 1996

For all you distance runners (like me) these are small (in type size) notes that appear in front of regular size notes to which they are connected by a slur mark. If a grace note looks like a miniature 1/8th note it is intended to be played for 1/2 the value of the following full size note and then to be strongly slurred into that note which is held for only half its value. If the miniature 1/8th note has a slash mark across the upper part of its stem it should be held for only 1/4 the value of the following note and strongly slurred into that note which is to be held for only 3/4 of its value. Sooo- when your sheet of music has this miniature 1/8th looking note slurred to a full sized note: 1. On your NWC staff put the cursor on the staff at the position of the grace note, push slur, push a note value half the regular sized note's value, push enter. Position the cursor to the full sized note's staff position, select a note value equal to half the full sized note's value, push enter. Won't look like a grace note but will play like one whether NWC plays it or a human plays it from a ptintout. (It's just a silly convention invented by Medieval monks, anyway, just like the rest of musical notation.) If the slash mark was present on the stem of the grace note use 1/4 and 3/4 values instead of 1/2 and 1/2. Double and triple appogiaturae, shakes, turns, and trillo are left to another day.

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 31 Dec 1996

From a number of references I have gotten the impression that, in general, a grace note (at least the "slashed" variaty) steals its duration from the preceeding note, not the following, while the following note retains its full value. Thus, a grace note before the first "true" note in a measure actually should be placed in the measure before.

Cyril N. Alberga

(Now is a case in which I wish I could attach GIF and NWC files, as examples.)

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 31 Dec 1996

To be honest, I've seen grace notes interpreted both ways (ie borrowing note length from the preceding, OR the following note). eg My Mozart music was annotated to interpret grace notes as borrowing from the following note. My Beethoven I've heard played the other way.

I think that if NWC implements grace notes (PLEASE!), it will have to consider both.

I was interested by the interpretation of slashes on the stem. I'd not heard that before, but it sounds like a good idea.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Tavish Donahue on 07 Jan 1997

Universal Method for Saxophone by Paul de Ville, page 9: grace placed before, plain grace is half duration, slashed grace is quarter duration. Oboe Method by A.M.R. Barrett ,page 15: grace placed more frequently before than after the principal note, notation examples show plain grace at half duration, slashed grace at quarter duration. Celebrated Method for Clarinet, by H. Klose', page 100: placed before, grace is half duration unless the principal is pointed (accented) in which case it is two thirds duration, no discussion of slashed versus plain. ** The slur related the grace and principal note in every case.** (Now all three claim a gruppetto always steals from the prior note .... Thanks for complicating my simple Saxist's answer, guys, back to distance running...

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 08 Jan 1997

Can I muddy the waters with my own understanding of grace notes and other decorations (and yes, please can they be implemented!).

The appoggiatura (plural '_turi' or '_turas'?) or simple grace note up to Mozart's time at least always stole from the following note. Very often what was to be played as four semiquavers would be written as appoggiatura, quaver, semiquaver, semiquaver. This usage died out early in the romantic period.

Groups of appoggiaturas were increasingly used from the classical period to replace symbols for turns (~) etc which had been used by Bach and Handel. Before the romantic period they would be played after the beat but gradually (Schubert, Chopin etc) came to be played before the beat, although there is not universal agreement even now as to any specific interpretation being correct for any particular piece.

Acciacaturas (slashed notes) are always before the beat, and are played as fast as possible. But some composers used appoggiaturas when they really meant acciacaturas! As always the way these grace notes are played must be dictated by musical considerations, and I don't believe there are truly hard and fast rules.

Reply 5 offered by: Yves Grasset on 11-Nov-1999

Just to add a little more confusion and despair, I wanted to say that in the Grove Dictionary (THE Reference) there is 120 pages about the ornaments (grace notes, trills, and the likes) and how they should be played.

In the baroque era, the performer had a lot of liberty about how to play a piece. The ornaments were intended to be freely played, according to the performer's taste.

Since many performers had (and stil have :-)) a bad taste, it progressively disapeared.

Moral: No need to fuss, ornaments were intended to be ambiguous, and I spend a lot of time trying different combinations, looking for the one that sounds good.

Couperin's works are wonderful to listen to, but are a nightmare to transcribe.


#33: Alla Breve
Alla Breve

(33)

Submitted by: Cyril N. Alberga on 01 Jan 1997

A question:

Alla Breve (cut time) is defined as designating either 2/2 or 2/4 time (in a rather poor source I have). I have a collection of old music in which it is used for either 4/2 or 2/1 (I can't be sure which). Can anyone tell me the REAL meaning of Alla Breve?

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 1 offered by: J. Zelonis on 01 Jan 1997

According to the Schirmer Pronouncing Pocket Manual of Musical Terms, "alla breve", in modern music, means, "a meter of 2/2; i.e., two beats per measure with the half note carrying the beat; also called "cut time." The implication is of a faster tempo than 4/4."

Reply 2 offered by: Jim Gary on 10-Nov-1997

As I recall "alla breve" literally translated means "by the half-note" or 2/2 time.


#34: Combining rests and notes
Combining rests and notes

(34)

Submitted by: Robin Bowes on 02 Jan 1997

I am trying to write a piano left-hand part which has a "lower" part in crotchets/quavers and an "upper" part in demi-semi-quavers. I want to insert a quaver rest in the "lower" part directly below a note in the "upper" part.

I can insert a quaver note, ie make a chord, but I can't figure out how to add in the rest.

Any suggestions?

RObin

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 03 Jan 1997

The only way to combine notes and rests is to enter the rest first and then combine the note using the control-enter combination. Note also that whilst rests don't show whether they are stem up or stem down, NWC still interprets them with that quality. SO if you have trouble combining a note with a rest, it may be that you need to "flip" your rest. If I want a note to be above the rest, but still fairly low in a stave, I've found that sometimes it helps to enter the note way above, and then transpose that note down using Ctrl-Shift-Down.

Hope this helps.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Robin Bowes on 20 Jan 1997

What I want to do is not currently supported (ie, combining a rest with a note of shorter duration)

I have submitted a request to the wish list.

Robin

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP


#35: Adding a staff... or suppressing one for printing
Adding a staff... or suppressing one for printing

(35)

Submitted by: Chris on 06 Jan 1997

I'm a new user of Noteworthy Composer, and enjoying it !

I write and arrange for an 8-part close-harmony group and need to be able to add and remove parts (preferably on their own staves) as we progress through a piece. Otherwise I only get one system per page !

Is there an option to add or remove a staff partway through a piece, either and preferably in the score editting window, or in the printed score.

Thanks,

Chris.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 06 Jan 1997

Hi Chris:

At the moment, there is not any way to make the number of staves per system dynamic as a printout progresses from one system to the next. If you would like to request this type of functionality, you may do so from our wish list form at /composer/wishlist.htm.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#36: Tie across meter change.
Tie across meter change.

(36)

Submitted by: Cyril N. Alberga on 07 Jan 1997

I have a score in which notes on either side of a time signature change (4/4 to 3/4) must be tied. The tie crosses the bar line, but the time signature seems to break it. How do I enter this?

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 09 Jan 1997

Currently (as of NWC V1.30f), ties acorss a change in time signature will be split into a left side and a right side, and will not pass through the signature. You can wish for changes from our wish list form.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#38: NoteWorty 2 ?
NoteWorty 2 ?

(38)

Submitted by: Chris on 13 Jan 1997

I saw an advert in CMQ for NoteWorthy 2. Is this a new version of NoteWorty Composer... or something else ?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 14 Jan 1997

Our latest NWC release is version 1.30f. Your official source for announcements about our products is from our press releases, published first right here on our web site.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Chris on 22 Jan 1997

So what was the advert in the recent Church Music Quaterly about ? Is it not your product... in which case the advert is very mis-leading ?

Reply 3 offered by: firstformula@btinternet.com on 09 Feb 1997

I also saw the ad for Noteworthy 2 in a recent issue of Classical Music magazine and, being a true convert to Noteworthy Composer, thought I had missed out on an upgrade. So I telephoned the company concerned only to find that it is a completely different product - the main difference apparently being that it does not play back from the score. It would also seem to be more restrictive in its capabilities than "our" Noteworthy. Hope this helps!

Reply 4 offered by: firstformula@btinternet.com on 09 Feb 1997

I also saw the ad for Noteworthy 2 in a recent issue of Classical Music magazine and, being a true convert to Noteworthy Composer, thought I had missed out on an upgrade. So I telephoned the company concerned only to find that it is a completely different product - the main difference apparently being that it does not play back from the score. It would also seem to be more restrictive in its capabilities than "our" Noteworthy. Hope this helps!

Reply 5 offered by: djp on 27-Jan-1998

I use NWC fairly often. Great program, particularly since the licence was so reaonable. I'm running version 1.30b Couple of fixes I would like to see include
(a) Dynamic keyboard command d would be easier to use if the dynamic window opened right away, instead of having to click on it.
(b) Would like to have toggle to have middle line note stems default to the down position - this is often easier to read, is more common in band music. It's a nuisance to have to change the stems on each B.
(c) Any chance of getting a tent accent sometime?
(d) Any chance of formatting grace notes so they aren't as pronounced as normal notes?
(e) Any way to insert multi-bar rests in one bar? No good for full score, but great for individual parts.
(f) Any chance of being able to force a line break (- may require proportional spacing like "justifying" in a word processor)
(g) There are only 12 tempo text expressions - many more are needed for modern music.
(h) Now I'm getting fancy - any way to draw dynamics such as cresc. and dim.?

(g) Any chance of being able to use other fonts in "insert text" and of inserting bar numbers without having them count from the beginning -i.e. if I write a part with a eight bar rest starting in bar 9, if I ask Scorebuilder to insert bar numbers, the next bar will be bar 10, not 17.
(h) Can we get a single bar repeat and double bar repeat symbol, please?
(i) More dynamic expressions, please, such as fp sfz etc.


#39: "Stuck" Notes
"Stuck" Notes

(39)

Submitted by: Michael Natal on 13 Jan 1997

I have written a phrase in version 1.30d that, when played, produces "stuck" notes. Basically, it is the following:

b-flat maj. chord c-flat maj. chord b-flat maj. chord

spelled out, one chord per measure. The notes of the c-flat chord hold-over into subsueqent measures, producing vile dissonance.

Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 14 Jan 1997

Try using the Score Audit on the F9 key. If you have note ties across bar lines, make sure that all of the notes have the proper accidental assigned to them, as this is required for NWC to interpret the ties correctly.

Lastly, you can read the explanations in Common Question Number 3 in the Help file.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Michael Natal on 13 Jan 1997

CLARIFICATION: I have checked the on-line help and none of those conditions causing stuck notes appears to exist in my case.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher <seb@draper.com> on 15 Jan 1997

Having had a related problem - perhaps this is yours too - I have a complaint.

In my case, I was working on a score for 4 voices and piano accompaniment. I had sustain pedal down and sustain pedal up indications in my score. When I played back the entire score, all was well. However, when I muted the piano staves in order to hear the voices by themselves, the sustain pedal insertions still took effect. The result was that I got horrible-sounding stuck voices. I had to delete the sustain pedal bits from the piano score in order to avoid this.

So, I would like the Noteworthies to consider this a bug and look into it...?

pedual

Reply 4 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 15 Jan 1997

In your message, you write:

However, when I muted the piano staves in order to hear the voices by themselves, the sustain pedal insertions still took effect. The result was that I got horrible-sounding stuck voices. I had to delete the sustain pedal bits from the piano score in order to avoid this.

This is exactly the point. NWC only mutes the actual note events, which enables you to hear the other parts exactly as they sound when the muted part is actually playing. If the sustain pedal marks are making one of your other parts sound bad, then muting the part with the sustain pedal marks will enable you to hear just how bad the sound is effected by the marks in the other parts that use the same MIDI channel. If the other parts use a different MIDI channel, there should not be any impact, regardless of the mute setting.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#40: deletion of fermata
deletion of fermata

(40)

Submitted by: Trent Hall on 14 Jan 1997

I am completing an original compostion, and in the final measure I have misplaced a fermata, with the "preserve width" checkbox left on.

I have been unable to delete this fermata with my present knowledge of how to use the software (NWC 1.30e) I have attempted to delete the fermata itself, notes before it and after it, tried to mark the measure and delete, and the notes will delete, but not the fermata. It remains no matter what.

Please help. Thanks. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 14 Jan 1997

Trent:

Please see my e-mail reply of earlier today. Your fermata is actually located in the second staff, although it displays in the third staff because it was inserted so far under the second staff. Removing it is a simply matter of deleting it out of the end of the second staff.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#42: "Pick up" Lyrics
"Pick up" Lyrics

(42)

Submitted by: JBLarson@aol.com on 16 Jan 1997

My main use for NWC is 4 part choral-type arrangements, which I do on a 2 staff system. I have a problem putting lyrics with pick up notes that are not in the melody line (and not on the same staff as the lyrics). Is there an easy way to do this?

Jim Larson

Reply 1 offered by: Glade Diviney on 21 Jan 1997

The tricks I use are:

* Underscores in the lyric lines (which compress several syllables into one spot...even if the display isn't technically correct, musicians can usually figure it out. Even singers :-)

* Slurring (ctrl+u) notes lets you skip placement of a syllable

* Adding text (X) when there's a "do-wop" or something.

* Giving up and breaking out to four bars when it gets too complicated.

It would be nice if there was a way to automatically "compress" independent bars into a standard piano system, but this feature would be difficult to implement. Maybe I should submit to the wish list: implement and publish a plug-in architecture!

-=G

Reply 2 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 18 Jan 1997

Jim:

I am not exactly clear on what you are trying to do. In general, tricks in manipulating the lyric are based on using the underscore to either connect two different lyric syllables, thus making them one, or to create empty syllables that skip some notes in a score. Consult the help file for details on these characters and what they do.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#43: MIDI File Creation
MIDI File Creation

(43)

Submitted by: Lynne Scott on 17 Jan 1997

I have just downloaded a copy of Noteworthy Composer v1.3f.

The program looks really fantastic, and i am keen to try out some of the editing on it. However, I do not wish to use the standard edit functions for creating scores, as I would much rather use my electronic keyboard to play the music and transfer the details to the computer as a MIDI file.

I have a Soundblaster 16 card, but obviously need some software to receive the MIDI information from the keyboard.

Noteworthy does not do this. Can anyone suggest a suitable program to capture the MIDI data frommm where it can be imported into Noteworthy. Alternatively, can you suggest where I might search.

Thanks very much.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 18 Jan 1997

There are some inexpensive sequencers on the market, and a few programs can be found on the net. try a search engine to look around.

By the way, the next release of NWC will include some rudimentary MIDI input. Stay tuned to this site for more details as we make them available. Even so, it is not a bad idea to have a MIDI sequencer in your portfolio of compositional tools.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP


#44: Possible additions
Possible additions

(44)

Submitted by: Roy Seaton (sent by Michael) on 18 Jan 1997

I would like to suggest the following additions to future versions of Noteworthy Composer: -

(1) An option to replace several rests (particulary those lasting one bar each) with a breve symbol and the number of bars to wait [would be useful when typing parts which have long gaps between playing (such as a triangle!)] (2) Facilities to add appogiaturas and acciaciaturas to music so they can be PRINTED (not necessarily played) [I would like this to be done so I don't have to write them in later] (3) Options to add trill, mordent, turn and strum marks to music [see comment for suggestion 2 above]

These would all be very useful additions for many musicians, especially orchestral musicians such as myself.

Thanks for reading!

Michael Seaton (16 years)

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 18 Jan 1997

Please use our wish list form for suggestions.

Regards,

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: John E. Peterson on 01-Feb-1998

See MY note at the top of the list about the missing fonts to do these items. It's only a handful. All we gotta do is BURY NoteWorthy in requests to implement them! I've been requesting SOME of these items for over a year now. For the same reasons too... ORCHESTRA SCORES!

John


#45: printing niceties
printing niceties

(45)

Submitted by: jelley@sydney.net on 18 Jan 1997

dumb question from new user: how do you make the last bar not look fat and empty when printed out? as all the bars are of equal length it looks funny.. also what is the word for this? It's sort of like justifying.. ps great program, answer to a maiden's prayer... fran jelley

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 22 Jan 1997

Adding to prior message: The last system extension option is also found on the Page Setup dialog. You can set it there, or do it directly from the Print dialog.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 22 Jan 1997

In the Print dialog, there is - in the other options section - a box that says Extend Last System. Make sure that this box is cleared. Use Preview to see the results. If the box doesn't exist, then you should get a later version.

Andrew


#47: lyric for second ending
lyric for second ending

(47)

Submitted by: rkeefer@cvn.net on 24 Jan 1997

I have a song with two verses. When I try to add a second ending, I can't get the ending of the second verse to appear in the second ending. It shows up under the end of the first verse, in the first ending. How can I get it to end up where it belongs?

Thanks!

bob k.

Robert Keefer Gettysburg, PA

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 25 Jan 1997

You can add empty syllables with the underscore character, which will enable the second line to skip the notes in the first ending. Another alternative is to add the lyrics for the second ending in the first lyric, thus enabling it to line up on the same vertical plane within the special endings.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Heinz Haverkamp (hhaverka@mathematik.uni-marburg.de) on 24 Jan 1997

Look into the "God save the Queen"-example, as it's done there. Briefly, you add "empty" lyrics below the first ending. (Had the same problem when I did my only score so far.)

Heinz

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP


#49: Double stems
Double stems

(49)

Submitted by: MrDaveD@AOL.COM on 27 Jan 1997

Is it posssible to place up and down stems on a note to indicate that the note is to be sung by both voices on a staff (ie Tenor and Bass when written on 1 staff)?

Reply 1 offered by: Paul Gould on 29 Jan 1997

I am having exactly the same problem and was forced to consume more paper by creating separate SATB parts and well as the accompanyment. This means 4 staves plus the Grand Upper and Lower staff equalling six in all.

The other situations that are problematic are occasions when I need to split parts for a few bars (for clarity) and then return to SATB. For example, on occasions where there are two Sop. and two Bass parts. As NWC now is, this means 2+1+1+2+2=10 staves!

NWC Support: how about adding this feature to the next version of NWC?

Reply 2 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 29 Jan 1997

This is not yet possible. The exact rules regarding chords are listed in the help file section for Chord Members (under the Insert command help).

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher <seb@draper.com> on 29 Jan 1997

In the demo version of NWC that I got off the net before I purchased it, it was possible to have an up and a down stem on the same note, with different note value. I even had composed some scores with that property.

When I bought the product (I think it was NWC12), that feature disappeared and I couldn't do that anymore.

It was a disappointment. Sometimes you need it.

- seb


#50: Midi import and triplets?
Midi import and triplets?

(50)

Submitted by: smcarey@pconline.com on 28 Jan 1997

A couple quick questions --

Why doesn't composer recognize and correctly transcribe triplets when importing from a MIDI file? Most similar products I've seen do this with no problem.

Other than that, Composer is the best notation program I've found for the money. I'm just wondering how far we are from the end of the beta cycle on the 32-bit version and whether I should wait to register. Everything seems pretty stable so far.

Thanks!

-Sean

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 29 Jan 1997

As you point out, triplets are not currently detected during MIDI import. If this changes, we will announce it from this web site via an upgrade.

The 32-bit beta will probably be completed next month. The upgrade will be made available at this site, as well as our other typical upload centers.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#51: Quintruplets!!
Quintruplets!!

(51)

Submitted by: Roderick M Westwood on 29 Jan 1997

Is there any way that in Noteworthy (version 1.30f) that you can use quintruplets? (5 notes in the time of 4?) PLEASE REPLY - SOMEBODY!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Nigel Pendrey on 29 Jan 1997

As far as I am aware it is not feasible in Noteworty. I, and it seems many others are having the same preblem. I am sure Noteworthy is aware of the problem. When I have to write such 5 beats in the time of 4 I now write 3 as a triplet and tippex the part after printing.

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP


#52: Duplets
Duplets

(52)

Submitted by: Paul Gould on 29 Jan 1997

It does not seem possible with NWC 1.30f to write duplets (two notes in the timing of 3). In my case two sets of duplet notes in a time signature of 6/8.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Bacher <seb@draper.com> on 04 Feb 1997

You can do duplets (2 over 3) by using dotted note values. E.g., over 3 8th notes you can do 2 dotted eighths.

OK, this won't solve the quintuplet problem, but it helps.

- seb


#53: Swiss Style Drumming staffs & Scottish Drumming Music
Swiss Style Drumming staffs & Scottish Drumming Music

(53)

Submitted by: jhayden@solinet.net on 30 Jan 1997

Hello:

I moderate a list that discusses various aspects of Scottish Style drumming and two or three times a year the question comes up "Is there/ What is the best music notation software for scores for Scottish style drumming?"

Several of the more expensive software products are always mentioned, but here's the catch; We write for a monitonic instrument, the "side"(snare) drum using Swiss notation format; specifically ONE LINE staffs. Notes on top of the line are played with the right hand, notes under the line with the left.

So question #1 Can this be done with NoetWorthy?

The second item is that our music is FULL of embellishments. For example three to six notes preceeding the primary note. DWould NoteWorthy allow such overloading a beat much less a measure?

Side drummers all around the world are wondering.

Please reply to my email address

Thanks

JJH

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 04 Feb 1997

I do not know whther NWC dan do what you are asking. The percussion clef and percussion noteheads are not currently supported, so this may answer your question.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: wilco van den heuvel on 28-May-1998

I'm looking for the partiture of Drummer's Salute by D.G. McCroskie. Who knows where I can find it on the net?

Reply 3 offered by: Silas King on 13-Jun-1998

I'm a drummer and would like to get more information on this.

Reply 4 offered by: Marcos on 10-Apr-2000

I´m a drummer from Argentina and I would like to find somewhere scores of scottish drumming, so if you can help me somehow I´ll be thankful. Our band is growing up but we have already a nice level of score reading. What we need is mostly hornpipes tunes and 4/4 marching tunes. thank´s again

yours sincerely
Marcos

Reply 5 offered by: drummer boy on 11-Apr-2000

yeah, we all need drums!
drum notation has been a wish for ages.
I am sure that noteworthy has looked at this as they already have a great program. is adding drums on the horizon for noteworthy?

i Have many friends who would buy noteworthy with drum features even though they have more expensive notation programs.
I love noteworthy for what it does for me already.
thank you and best wishes.


#54: use of score editeur
use of score editeur

(54)

Submitted by: lrizzo@hol.fr on 01 Feb 1997

Helo, I'm a regular user of Noteworthy composer and i have some questions on your software ; can you answer them ? :

1) how creating a complete blank stave ? 2) how creating a non complete bar staves'score 3) how superimposing a note and a rest ?

My adress is lrizzo@hol.fr.

Thanks you

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 04 Feb 1997

In your post, you asked:

1) how creating a complete blank stave?

In NWC, a blank staff is simply an empty staff. You cannot use NWC to simply print blank pages, as the staff only expands when notes, rests, and other elements are added.

2) how creating a non complete bar staves'score

Staves are added from the Score Builder, on the Tools menu. You can add notes, rests, bar lines, and other items as you see fit from the Insert menu.

3) how superimposing a note and a rest ?

A note and rest can be combined into a chord by first placing the rest. Note that rests are considered to have a stem direction in this scenario. Details are in the help file section for Insert Chord Member.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Kevin Barth on 09 May 1997

However, I highly recommend a Freeware product called Guido for printing of blank manuscript paper. The version I have is designed to work with A4 paper, but is easily adjusted to work with 8.5x11" if that's what you're using. Guido allows you to set the number of staves per system, the number of systems per page, and the margins, and it sets up the page very nicely for you.

You should be able to locate Guido by doing a Websearch. I got it on a CD-ROM, so don't have a URL to provide. If you can't find it, though, email me and I will arrange to get you a copy.

Kevin Barth kbarth@qrc.com


#55: cadenza
cadenza

(55)

Submitted by: johnlbreyer@juno.com on 02 Feb 1997

Is there a standard way to create a cadenza in Noteworthy? I have searched, but found nothing.

Reply 1 offered by: apurdam@pcug.org.au (Andrew Purdam) on 05 Feb 1997

This may sound a bit bodgy, but why not just print out the normal score, and a separate cadenza, use the good old scissors and glue (I'm hoping your cadenza is at the end, otherwise this will get too complicated) to cut and paste in the cadenza. Then you could even use a smaller print size for the notes!!!

You may find that you can do the cutting and pasting using something like Corel Draw, or a similar sort of draw program.

I think the music typesetting programs that do this for you are some several hundreds of dollars. So if you need to do it LOTS, maybe consider upgrading.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 04 Feb 1997

NWC does not currently support varying number of staves in a single score print. You are free to compose a cadenza, or any other passage, but you are forced to print a common number of staves per system in the entire printout.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 3 offered by: Marco Voli <voli@cineca.it> on 20 May 1997

Can you add partitures with variable number of staves to your to-do list? This can often reduce the pages to print and to turn over.

Thanks


#57: Midi Volume and Note Velocity
Midi Volume and Note Velocity

(57)

Submitted by: Paul Dann on 03 Feb 1997

Midi Volume & Note Velocity

I do not understand the difference, so far as Noteworthy Composer is concerned, between MIDI Volume and Note Velocity. Both can be used to control the loudness of a note, but neither appears to affect any other note parameter. The only difference in function which I have found is that MIDI Volume seems to give a more evenly graded change in loudness than Note Velocity when using Dynamic Variances (eg crescendo), especially when a fairly rapid change is called for. One might assume that Note Velocity also affects attack time, but this doesn't appear to be the case.

Is there something I have missed, or is there a recommended preference for one or the other?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 28 Feb 1997

Andrew did a good job of explaining volume versus velocity in earlier replies. Thanks Andrew. I just wanted to addd that the dynamic variance using MIDI velocity changes has been fixed in the next NWC upgrade, which is version 1.30g. Look for details from this web site in March.

One other point: this fix will not impact the nature of how your sound card actually responds to volume versus velocity changes. Different synthesizers use different logical implentations for responding to MIDI note and volume commans which are beyond the control of MIDI sequencing and play back software such as NoteWorthy Composer.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 03 Feb 1997

Volume is just that, like a volume control. I think it applies to a whole channel. Note velocity applies to each note down (MIDI also has a note up velocity but nobody ever used it).

The difference is that most good MIDI boxes will alter note timbre with velocity. So a piano for instance will sound more percussive and brighter the harder (higher velocity) it is played.

You noticed , as many of us have, that MIDI Volume seems to give a more evenly graded change in loudness than Note Velocity when using Dynamic Variances (eg crescendo). Noteworthy explained that the problem is with accumulated rounding in getting the maths right. I personally would like to see that part of the program rewritten so that it works as expected.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Paul Dann on 09 Feb 1997

I am particularly interested in entering and playing Classical style piano but am presently limited to using a PC and associated software. Does software exist that will change the "note timbre" with Note Velocity? It seems that such a capability has to be provided outside Noteworthy (or does it?). If so, it would be also helpful to know of a "good MIDI box" (at a knock down price).

Paul

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 12 Feb 1997

Paul Dann said: "Does software exist that will change the "note timbre" with Note Velocity?"

Not exactly. Most new sound cards have moved away from FM synthesis, and are now using "wavetables" ie samples of the real sound. They then crossfade from a low-velocity sample to a high velocity sample as the midi velocity increases. This sort of technology has been on (keuboard-based) samplers for years, but is now firmly esconced in many midi boxes.

He went on to say "It seems that such a capability has to be provided outside Noteworthy (or does it?)."

Yes. Though sseyo's algorithm-driven machine can do similar things in software if you have enough memory.

And lastly "It would be also helpful to know of a "good MIDI box" (at a knock down price)."

I'd suggest going to your nearest music store, asking what's on special and giving it a good listen to. They'll normally happily link a midi box to a keyboard for you. Pay attention to instruments you are most likely to use. Mine (a GoldStar GS1000R) has a good set of pianos, but the dulcimer is detuned. Very annoying for me as my dulcimer player doesn't play like that.

You could also try on board sound cards. Again, find your favourite supplier, bring along a good couple of midi files, and ask for a go.

Cheers,

Andrew

Reply 5 offered by: Paul C on 17-Dec-2001

If you want software that allows you to change note velocity, and sounds like a piano, try microsoft direct music producer. Its bundled as part of DirectX 8 development kit from msdn.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 17-Dec-2001

Just a question: what do you need (processor, version of window$, memory amount) at least to have DirectX 8 working properly? I have no intention to lose my working version for a recent-and-not-working ( à la XP ) DirectX version.

BTW, I had the sensation that this kinf of difference was audible with Yamaha SoftSynth 50; am I wrong? Or did I extrapolate it from the differnce I experienced versus SB16 :)
...
HTH

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Dec-2001

marsu -

DirectMusic was included with DirectX versions as early as 6.something, but was buggy and not really usable until V7.0a. I've not seen (heard) a significant difference in V8.0, I think most of the improvements in V8 have to do with web stuff, streaming and so on. I've noticed no significant changes in "upgrading" from V7.0a to V8.0, and we have V8.0 installed on our teenager's P133 with no ill effects. (It even plays DX-Ball with no trouble.)

If all you want to do is listen to midi files using DirectMusic, you don't need the whole DM Producer (big download, about 25 megs IIRC) or SDK (even bigger, about 100 megs). You can just get a DM midi player. A very simple one from the SDK is available here. There's others available also.

And yes, the SoftSynths will indeed attack differently at various velocities, but only AFAIK on percussive instruments such as piano. You can try it out yourself, play a note at fff and a note a p, and adjust channel volume so that the loudness is about the same.
HTH
Fred

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Dec-2001

PS - One of the tracks on my CD were done specifically using DirectMusic. The midi file is here if you want to test out your DM system and player.

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Dec-2001

PPS (sorry about the multiple posts) - All our systems here are on Win95c (aka OSR 2.5) and do fine on DX8.0.

Intel PII/400, 256 meg RAM
AMD K6-II/500, 192 meg RAMIntel P133, 24 meg RAM

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 20-Dec-2001

Fred, thx for the answers! I'll try it asap.
If DX-Ball runs fine, then ok. I looooooove that game :)

No NWC in 16bits on your PCs then? Am I the last one with my Win3.11 in this terrifying world that competes to GHz ?

CUL8r

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Dec-2001

No marsu, you're not the only anachronist. My main machine (K6-II/500) is dual boot, using a separate D drive that can be booted into DOS 6.22/Win3.11 by changing boot drive in bios. My shop computer is the trusty old 486-DXII, complete with NWC for those times when I need to take a break from building valve amplifiers. (You see, I'm an anachronist in other ways too!) :)

Fred


#58: Trills
Trills

(58)

Submitted by: MDzialo@Internet-95.com on 05 Feb 1997

Is there a tool to add trills (tr) to a note?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 05 Feb 1997

NoteWorthy Composer does not natively support trills at this time. The effect can be achieved by actually notating it, and some have achieved a close approximation of the look using text, but none of this is an actual trill assignment.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 05 Feb 1997

If you want BOTH the TRILL SOUND (achieved through manual scoring at this stage), but also a score that prints WITHOUT the notes, but a TR. above the note 1) add the tr. using text, placing it where you would like it to go 2) create a new stave with the appropriate time and key sigs and fill with empty bars (use whole rests) up to the bar you need the trill. 3) add the appropriate notes to do the trill.

The only trills that this won't work too well on are those that "borrow time" from the main note, and don't start with that note (eg D C B C, as opposed to, say C D C B C). This is because the main note (C in this case, which will be in the original staff) will sound at the same time as the first auxiliary note (D in the first case, and a nice unison C in the decond case). This makes much more sense having tried it out.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 05 Feb 1997

I forgot to add step 4! When printing, simply exclude the new staff from those to be printed.

A


#59: Rests Grouped with Notes
Rests Grouped with Notes

(59)

Submitted by: ttodd@computime.bc.ca on 05 Feb 1997

Is there a way to write two parts on a single staff, such that a rest can exist underneath or on top of a note? An example would be a quarter note rest grouped with a quarter note. I thought it would have been useful to be able to put a note on the staff and then use Ctrl-Enter to place the rest on top or underneath the note, similar to the way chords are handled in Noteworthy. Cassical Guitar music uses this kind of notation all the time.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 06 Feb 1997

You can combnine a note and a rest by first placing the rest, then adding the note. The exact rules for this are outlined in the help file section for the Insert Chord Member command (the rest must be smaller duration than the note(s)). Note that rests are considered to have a stem direction when performing this operation. You can use this to control whether the rest is on top or bottom in the chord.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#60: What's MIDI?
What's MIDI?

(60)

Submitted by: Stephen Randall on 06 Feb 1997

Can anyone recommend a good book on the terminology and workings of MIDI.

Music I understand. Computers I understand. Now I'd like to find out about the bit in between.

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 12 Feb 1997

OK, I've found it myself.

I had looked on the web before with little succes. However, a couple of days after posting my query I came across www.eeb.ele.tue.nl/midi/intro.html which gives a good basic description of MIDI in language I can understand.

Perhaps a link to this page could be included on the NoteWorthy site for other MIDI newbies.

SR

Reply 2 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 17 Feb 1997

I am glad that you found a site. A web search is always a good ideam as well as visits to local libraries and book stores. Inlucding your link, here are two links that have intro MIDI information:

http://midiworld.com/mw_basic.htm

http://www.eeb.ele.tue.nl/midi/intro.html

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#61: Separate durations on a staff
Separate durations on a staff

(61)

Submitted by: cconnelly@yesvirtual.com on 07 Feb 1997

I would like to arrange separate voices on a staff with their own note durations & rests. I understand how to enter a chord, but how do I enter chord notes (and particularly rests) of a different duration?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 08 Feb 1997

NWC does not support more than one independent voice on a staff. You can create split-stem chords which create the appearance of 2 voices, but only one is actually used in the formatting and playback logic in determining the relative position of the notes that follow a split stem chord. For more details, review the help section asociated with the Insert Chord Member command, as well as related entries on this topic in this forum.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#62: Looking for Music of "Michel Polnareff" Title "On ira tous."
Looking for Music of "Michel Polnareff" Title "On ira tous."

(62)

Submitted by: 100450.3104@Compuserve.com on 10 Feb 1997

I am looking for the music of "On ira tous au Paradis, to help us play it for our pianist."

We are a group of students planning to sing this song for a student festival. We are having trouble knowing when to sing on what note and beat, just with the album.

We would appreciate any help... Thank you

VK

Reply 1 offered by: François on 05-May-1998

We are just trying to sing the same song here in france and we are also searching when to sing and the chords.
If you had an answer, can you give it to us.
Thank you

François

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 06-May-1998

In case it can help you, this song exists in karaoke.
o Vendor: Star Karaoke
o Volume: 008
o Face: A
o Track: 1

If you live in France, you will probably find it in many
karaoke places. I can even give you some addresses if you
are in Paris (if it is the case, you can mail me in french!)

If you plan to buy this laser disk (too bad it doesn't seem
to exist in cassette), I found the reference here:
http://www.dci-entertainment.com


#64: Copy-to-file bug?
Copy-to-file bug?

(64)

Submitted by: somalley@voyager.cns.ohiou.edu on 11 Feb 1997

When I copy a file to the clipboard (from print preview) in either the 16 or 32 bit version of NWC, I am unable to use that image. Photoshop crashes with an invalid page fault when I switch to it after the copy action. I have to clear the clipboard by copying something from another app before Photoshop will start again without the error. With Windows95's paint program, I can switch over okay, but when I try to paste the image, the program stops responding.

Under the 16bit version, if I save the image to a file, I can open it in either program; however, the score doesn't always look right. For example, using this method with the Mozart sample results in the clef and key signature information being "fragmented" and superimposed over each other. The 32 bit version doesn't give me the option of saving to a file.

If it matters, I'm running a P133 with 48 meg of RAM.

Other than the above problem, I like what I've seen so far from NWC...

--sean

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 12 Feb 1997

The clipboard and file data saved with the copy command is legitimate. However, not all programs handle the data very well. For bitmaps, I very much recommend reducing the page size (with margins) to reduce the size of the bitmap. For metafiles, this is not a real issue, but still may help some of your programs.

For the clipboard stuff, you can use the clipboard viewer to see that it is legitimate. For the meta files (.wmf), you can use QuickView in Windows 95 too see that it is legitimate.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#67: Is there any way to add acciaccatura's ..?
Is there any way to add acciaccatura's ..?

(67)

Submitted by: Jehan Rajendra, 100415.2431@compuserve.com.uk on 16 Feb 1997

I wish to know the method for adding acciaccatura's and appoggiatura's; Also I wish avoid overlapping in printing.

Reply 1 offered by: apurdam@pcug.org.au (Andrew Purdam) on 17 Feb 1997

Jehan,

Currently there is no neat way to do acciacaturas, appogiaturas, turns or trills in NWC, though many people are hoping... :-)

One work around is to "hard code" it, that is enter the notes EXACTLY AS THEY ARE TO BE PLAYED. This often involves halving and then dotting or double dotting the fundamental notes to make enough space for the ornament to be played. (So an quaver may become a dotted semiquaver with a preceding ornamental note).

After a while, this becomes fairly easy as you work out what sounds good.

Another method which makes for better printouts is to put the ornaments on a separate staff and then hide that staff when printing. Directions for performers can be made in English (eg. tr.), or using tildes (for turns) or W's for mordants.

This probably wasn't the answer you were looking for... :-)

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen <O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr> on 17 Feb 1997

I've just found another way for making trills.
You can use a Multi-point Controller {mpc} for pitch bend.

Let's take an example.
You want a trill on a C note (duration: Half), that sounds thus:
- a D for the duration of an Eighth
- a C for the duration of a Sixteenth
- a B for the duration of a Sixteenth
- a C for the rest of the note

Just before the note, insert a Multi-point Controller.
Choose "Pitch Bend" for the controller type, "Absolute" for the style,
"Sixteenth" for the time offset multiplier.
Then activate each settings, with following values:
- Initial: Time offset = 0, Controller value = 8191
- Setting 2: Time offset = 2, Controller value = 0
- Setting 3: Time offset = 1, Controller value = -4096
- Setting 4: Time offset = 1, Controller value = 0

If you need more settings, I suppose that you can use more than one
{mpc}, but I didn't tried it.

This was for "sounding" the note ok. For a correct printing, simply
add a ~ character using the text insertion.

Since this feature already exists with {mpc}, maybe a real "trill"
command could be easily implemented in a next version of NoteWorthy
Composer ?

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 17 Feb 1997

This is brilliantly simple!

It works superbly for guitar hammer-on, and sounds okay for organ and harpsichord.

I'm afraid it still doesn't sound quite right on piano, but the neatness and "copyability" of this effect could well outweigh this little problem.

Bon pense, Olivier! (or is that bonne?)

Reply 4 offered by: Carl Peter on 28-Feb-1998

I often print baroque music parts and would like to see ornamentation added to future updates of NWC.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 28-Feb-1998

I would too, though not as much as I used to (I'm working on different musical genres at the moment).

We can implement them with special text characters (a bit fiddly, but once you've got them all set up in a "pallette" file, yu can just copy and paste). They can also then be implemented in a hidden staff exactly as you want them played.

That's the best us users can do for now.

Andrew


#68: Question about MIDI files
Question about MIDI files

(68)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen <O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr> on 17 Feb 1997

I don't know if the NWC forum is the best place for posting a MIDI question, but I don't know where to post it.

In several documents on the web, I read that the hex code FF (binary 11111111) means "System Real-Time Message: Reset" and is followed by no other data byte.

But in the XXX.MID files generated by NoteWorthy Composer (by Export command), I found following syntaxes:

FF 01 "Title"

FF 02 "Copyright"

FF 03 "Text"

FF 04 "Text"

FF 58 04 04 02 18 08

FF 51 03 07 A1 20

FF 21 01 00

Could someone help me to understand these codes, and why it doesn't correspond to documentation found at various places ?

Thanks in advance !

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 17 Feb 1997

Events starting with FF in a standard MIDI file are "Meta Events", including various text items and things like sysex. Refer to the MIDI specification for details.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP


#69: Bodgy fix for Arpeggios
Bodgy fix for Arpeggios

(69)

Submitted by: apurdam@pcug.org.au (Andrew Purdam) on 17 Feb 1997

After working on transcribing some Albeniz, I had a real need for arpeggiating chords (you know, that little squiggly symbol in front of a chord, meaning "ripple up").

Well, the best work around I've found is to

1) go to sixty-fourth notes

2) run the chord up in a run of individual notes, and bar them together to make them look neater. If you have three or six notes, you may want to tripletize them to make them a little faster. If you have five notes, you could tripletize just the first three.

3) Work out how much time you have left in the chord and enter the chord using notes of that length. This will probably require dotting and maybe even double dotting or (rarely) tying of two individual chords to get the right note length.

4) Tie (using the "/" key) each arpeggio note to its corresponding chord member.

5) Press "F9" to implement all the ties.

6) Press "F5" and be amazed!

This works well, though if you are using very fast tempi you may wish to increase the note length of your "arpeggiators".

Now all we need to do is work out some way of automating it for arbitrary chords, hey Eric? :-)

Andrew

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 19 Feb 1997

I, also, need to enter arpeggios, and went to a bit more trouble. The process you discribe seems to involve notes being tied where the duration of the combination is greater than the sum of the notes. E.g., in a three note chord, the first "ripple" note is followed by a second short note, but the note the first is tied to starts after that, not immediatly after the note at the origin of the tie. (There must be some easier way of saying that!) So, why does it work? Does NWC "fill in" the missing time? And if so, why should one expect it to.

Yours truly Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 22 Feb 1997

Cyril,

Assume I have the arpeggiated (rippled) chord CEG, nontated C,E,G,CEG. The C ties to the C in the chord, the E to the E and the G to the G. The tie from C to C is in no way bothered by the intervening E and G. Noteworthy have kindly posted an example in the User Tips area.

Andrew


#70: Set key signature after MIDI import
Set key signature after MIDI import

(70)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 18 Feb 1997

Sometimes, the MIDI files don't set the correct key signature, and all # and b are accidentals. I know that I can set the key signature with following procedure: first Force Accidentals on each staff, then add key signatures, then Audit Accidentals on each staff.

In order to speed up this procedure, I wonder if it would be possible to Force Accidentals at once on whole score, and the same for Audit Accidentals. Should I write this demand to the wish list ?

Olivier.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20 Feb 1997

Yes, you certainly can submit this item. However, at present this would not be considered a high priority item. If you have a sequencer, you can edit the MIDI file directly to include the proper key signature (most sequencers support this).

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 18 Feb 1997

One easy way to facilitate this is to use a macro recorder and player-back of key presses and mouse movements. If you have or had Windows 3.1 you can use RECORDER.EXE. Apparently it wasn't bundled with Win 95.

I've asked M$ about this, asking also if I can redistribute this program that they obviously think is redundant. Of course, I've received no reply. :-(

Andrew


#71: Yet another MIDI import demand
Yet another MIDI import demand

(71)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 18 Feb 1997

I'm sorry if I monopolize this forum...

I would like to know if it's possible, as an import option, to import: initial volume, volume changes, initial pan, pan changes, initial velocity and velocity changes ?

Yes, I know that velocity is not a channel characteristic, and we can have a chord with notes of different velocities. But we could, for example, choose the higher velocity if this occurs.


#72: Combining staves
Combining staves

(72)

Submitted by: Steve Bacher on 19 Feb 1997

Is there a way to combine staves?

For example, I've laid out a four-part choral piece with S/A/T/B staves. Now, being a lazy sight-reader, I would like to generate a piano score from this so that I can accompany my choir. In other words, a pair of treble/bass staves with S/A on top and T/B on the bottom.

I tried exporting the 4-parter as a MIDI file and then importing it, but it "remembered" the number of staves. Is there a way to combine multiple staves into a single staff for this purpose?

Reply 1 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 19 Feb 1997

The sequencing program I use allows staves to be combined. One could export the midi, bring it up in the sequencing program, combine and then reimport back into NWC. I doubt that the notes will have proper stem directions, but . . . The particular program I use is an inexpensive one (Microsoft Studio) and I pretty much only use it for midi input due to its limitations. However, there may be other sequencing programs out there (shareware or otherwise) that give the same option. Perhaps the new version of NWC will also allow the option, given that it will have some sequencing capabilities.

Reply 2 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20 Feb 1997

The next version, 1.30g, will not explicitly allow merging 4 staves into two staves. However, it will support Exporting Type 0 files. By muting two staves at a time, and then exporting the score, you can combine each two staff pair into their own type 0 MIDI files. These could then separately be imported. However, as was pointed out, the stem direction information, and in many cases the actual performance, will not exactly be correct, as import recognizes only one independent voice.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#73: Exporting Midi Files
Exporting Midi Files

(73)

Submitted by: insider@win.bright.net on 19 Feb 1997

I downloaded the shareware version of Noteworthy Composer. Does the shareware version have a midi export function.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20 Feb 1997

This is on the File menu, appropriately called Export.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#74: Transposition
Transposition

(74)

Submitted by: Daniel Pancer on 21 Feb 1997

I am currently arranging a pachelbel canon duet for two violins. I was wondering how I could go about transposing one of the parts so that It can be a duet for clarinet and violin. I never understood how to transpose for b flat instruments so the harmony works... Thanks you in advance for you help.

Reply 1 offered by: Carl Bangs bangs@cet.com on 21 Feb 1997

Copy the part you wish to transpose to a new staff. Transpose that staff up 2 half steps using transpose in Tools. Proof read for proper accidentals in the new key.

Reply 2 offered by: Daniel Pancer on 21 Feb 1997

If I am transposing from D major what is the new key if I go up two half steps for clarinet?

Reply 3 offered by: Carl Bangs bangs@cet.com on 22 Feb 1997

The new key would be E. You might consider transposing up 3 half steps for clarinet in A, yielding a part in F for an A-clarinet.

Reply 4 offered by: Jack Johnson on 04-Feb-1998

When you finish the Violin part could you send it to me? Thanks

Johnson

Reply 5 offered by: john kim on 29-Jun-1998

Where can you obtain the first violin sheet for Canon in D?


#75: Back-to-back repeated sections?
Back-to-back repeated sections?

(75)

Submitted by: Bill Thacker <wbt@cbemg.lucent.com> on 21 Feb 1997

I'm scoring a tune that has two simple repeated sections, back-to-back. I end the first section with a decorated "Master repeat end" bar, then begin the next section with a "Master repeat begin" bar. This creates an empty bar between the two repeats.

That doesn't affect playback, but it's unsightly and somewhat confusing to instrumentalists. Is there some way to produce a single bar with repeat dots on both sides?

- Bill

Reply 1 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen, beibmepk@ibmmail.com on 25 Apr 1997

Glad to see it's not just me who has this problem. Now there are twice as many people asking for normal-looking repeats let's hope the question will be addressed twice as quickly <grin>

Reply 2 offered by: Arthur Morgan <ArtMorgan1@aol.com> on 28 Apr 1997

Care to make that triple? I'd like to see a fix for that, too, since I'm working on a couple of marches which have back-to-back repeat sections. My current approach is to use first and second endings, but that's just a hack as far as I'm concerned, and not a true answer.


#76: Global change of speed of execution
Global change of speed of execution

(76)

Submitted by: Alain Falcoz on 23 Feb 1997

Is it possible to change globally the speed of a song, without editing each tempo change ? This would be very usful for reherseals

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 28 Feb 1997

Hi Alain: There is not currently an easy method to change the effect of a large number of tempo changes without revisiting each and every change. We will give this some thought for the future, but for now this would be a manual process (changing each tempo, one at a time).

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 24 Feb 1997

Not sure if it can be done with the current version of NWC. However, if you have some type of sequencing program, you could export to that program and use its global tempo adjustment bars. Could then perhaps reimport into NWC if needed. Hope that helps.

Reply 3 offered by: A. Falcoz afalcoz@compuserve.com on 25 Feb 1997

Good solution, but I hope that Eric Heile will read that and will give an imbedded solution ! Thanks


#78: Different Notes on the same bar
Different Notes on the same bar

(78)

Submitted by: Howard Chambers <hchambrs@briercrest.ca> on 24 Feb 1997

On problem I have had is getting different notes to be put on the same bar same stave. I have been able to do a chord but one piece I have require the first beat with a 1/2 note on the top and a 1/4 on the bottom That was easy. This was followed however by a 1/2 note on the bottom and then a 1/4 note on the top which was following the first half note on top I was unable get do this.

eg [ 1/2 1/4 ] [ 1/4 1/2 ]

These are all on the same bar and same staff. Does anyone have and answer for this.

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 26 Feb 1997

I think I understand your problem, and I know a solution but this solution is not very elegant.

The problem is the following: when you try to add the second quarter note on the top, this one follows the first quarter note instead of following the first half note.

The bad solution is the following: add a quarter rest ! The procedure is then: (1) do the initial chord, (2) add a quarter rest after the chord, (3) Ctrl-add the second half note, (4) add the second quarter note.

But the good solution is the one proposed by Andrew: use tied quarter notes.

I hope this helps.

Olivier.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam <apurdam@pcug.org.au> on 26 Feb 1997

Howard,

I'm not sure I understand your problem. To make notes of different lengths in a two note chord, just make the bottom one's tail point down, and the top one's point up. This normally is dealt with automagically.

wrt: [1/2 1/4] [1/4 1/2], how can the second pair be a chord if one is being played 1/2 note after the 1st chord, and one being played 1/4 note after.

If what you mean is [1/2 1/4] [1/2] [1/4], (which is what I tried and I think I now understand, you want the total length to be 3, not 4, right?) why not use tied notes? It may even be easier to read.

Hope I'm on the right track.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Howar on 27 Feb 1997

Yes my message did not come up like I had planed it I orginally wante 3/4 times in the case where [1/2 1/4] [1/4 1/2 ]

both on the same bar and same staff. I thought I would try this again to see if it would come through correctly.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam <apurdam@pcug.org.au> on 26 Feb 1997

Howard,

I'm not sure I understand your problem. To make notes of different lengths in a two note chord, just make the bottom one's tail point down, and the top one's point up. This normally is dealt with automagically.

wrt: [1/2 1/4] [1/4 1/2], how can the second pair be a chord if one is being played 1/2 note after the 1st chord, and one being played 1/4 note after.

If what you mean is [1/2 1/4] [1/2] [1/4], (which is what I tried and I think I now understand, you want the total length to be 3, not 4, right?) why not use tied notes? It may even be easier to read.

Hope I'm on the right track.

Andrew

Reply 5 offered by: Howard on 28 Feb 1997

I made an attempt and it does not work. What I was looking for is a 3 beat bar. On the first beat is a 1/2 note on the tope of the chord and a 1/4 note on the bottom of the chord. The second beat has a 1/2 note on the bottom while the first 1/2 note carries through. The third beat has a 1/4 on the top while the second beats half note carries through. This was not possible with that last beat it adds another beat to the bar. I hoep that explains the situation.

Reply 6 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 7 offered by: ron_e@juno.com on 03 Mar 1997

I believe I had the same problem a few months back. The solution I hit upon was basically what I think Andrew was suggesting.

Instead of the [1/2 1/4] [1/4 1/2] combo, you need something more along the lines of [1/4(tie) 1/4] [1/4(ends tie) 1/4(tie)] [1/4 1/4(ends tie)].

I didn't think it looked as nice, but it's probably more a matter of taste than anything.

-Ron

Reply 8 offered by: hchambers@briercrest.ca on 14 Jun 1997

Yes I think that would be the answer althought it does not look as nice. Thanks


#79: transposition
transposition

(79)

Submitted by: Tim Novembre <tcn12@eden.rutgers.edu> on 26 Feb 1997

I have recently acquired this programme and wish to know how not only accidental notes, but key signatures as well can be adjusted to the transposed key. To clarify, if I were to transpose a compsition in C major down one half step, how could I get the key signature for B major to appear, and the new accidentals to disappear.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam <apurdam@pcug.org.au> on 26 Feb 1997

Transpose staff will transpose any key signatures as well as notes. If there is no key signature, it will use a lot of forced accidentals if necessary.

If you don't have a key sig at the start, you can insert one, it'll come up as one F natural, implying C major. Then I expect Transpose staff will work as you expect it to.

Andrew


#80: What's Fermata with me?
What's Fermata with me?

(80)

Submitted by: Matt Hakes on 26 Feb 1997

When ever I write a piece with a fermata it plays well as a noteworthy composition, but as an exported midi the fermata is ignored. Is it me or is this common? Suggestions appreciated mth@notnow.com

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam <apurdam@pcug.org.au> on 27 Feb 1997

I asked Eric about this. Basically, there is no MIDI equivalent of fermata, so NWC doesn't (at this stage) produce anything to achieve the effect.

The work-around is fairly simple, though it doesn't look so nice. Just tie however many notes (or rests on staffs that have the fermata over a rest) as you need onto the end of the chord/note/rest. No need to change the length of the bar, as that is just cosmetic anyway. Worked fine for me in quick-and-dirty mode.

I'd be intersted if it doesn't work for you though.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 27 Feb 1997

There is another work-around, that I find less dirty because it doesn't change the number of beats per bar: change the tempo for the duration of this note.

It can be realized either with two tempo changes, or with one single {mpc}.

Reply 3 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 27 Feb 1997

Adding a tempo change is the recommended way of accomplishing a psuedo fermata when exporting to MIDI. Our next release, 1.30g, also includes some fixes for exporting mpc and tempo variance changesinto the proper conductor track of a MIDI file (tempo changes exported by earlier versions of NWC may not be recognized by all MIDI players).

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#81: Next Upgrade
Next Upgrade

(81)

Submitted by: Lee McHugh leemus1400@aol.com on 26 Feb 1997

When will your next upgrade be availiable? I am looking forward to it.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 27 Feb 1997

version 1.30g is going into beta testing soons. Its release schedule is predicated on a successful beta period. Details, as always, will be available from our "new stuff" page.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Howard Starks on 13-Feb-1998

The growth and development of Noteworthy composer has been exciting and I look forward to each upgrade with anticipation!


#82: importing midi tracks
importing midi tracks

(82)

Submitted by: rforest@flex.net on 26 Feb 1997

is it possible to import new tracks to a score that you are writing. i.e. i have some nice drum track midis that i would like to use on songs that i am writing in noteworthy. thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam <apurdam@pcug.org.au> on 27 Feb 1997

Couldn't you just import the track into a new score, create a new stave in your song and copy/paste what you need into that stave?

A

Reply 2 offered by: rick forester (rforest@flex.net) on 27 Feb 1997

Andrew, your tip worked great. thanks. sometimes the obvious answer is just under the brain.


#83: Tonal Harmony
Tonal Harmony

(83)

Submitted by: JSands on 27 Feb 1997

What kind of chord would you use to lead into a vi, similar to the way you use a VII to lead into a IV?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 28 Feb 1997

You could try III 7th. So in the key of G the progression would be B7 to Emin. You could get to the B7 from Dmaj by sharpening the D and adding the B.

This must be fairly common in folk music because my Melodeon (a sort of button accordion) has only six base chords to fit the keys of G and D. These are C, G, D and A as expected, and then Emin and B7 which are unexpected but obviously historically of more than trivial importance.


#84: Default zoom level
Default zoom level

(84)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 28 Feb 1997

Is it possible to specify the default zoom level, for instance in nwc.ini file ? The default level is 8, and the "zoom in" and "zoom out" buttons increment or decrement the value of 4, but I like the value 6 ! Thus I must use the other button, "specify zoom level" for each new score.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 28 Feb 1997

The zoom level is saved with the file. At the moment, you would need to manually set this to 6 for each new file. However, once you save it, the zoom level is retained in the file.

In the upcoming version 1.30g, you can set all of your favorite defaults in a song template, and then start your new songs from a template (thus eliminating the need to re-enter it each time).

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#85: Octave Above and Octave Below
Octave Above and Octave Below

(85)

Submitted by: Alexander Trent on 02 Mar 1997

I'm only (so far) interested in NOTATION, not MIDI.

Any neat ways of representing 8va and its friend for Octave below? I'm up to my armpits in ledger lines at the moment!

Reply 1 offered by: Carl Bangs bangs@cet.com on 02 Mar 1997

You can choose the octava designation when you choose the clef sign. I also use "text" to insert "8va....." and "loco" so I don't miss them visually.

Reply 2 offered by: Alexander Trent (alex@trent.powernet-int.co.uk) on 02 Mar 1997

Looks 70% of the way there to me. I never spotted that one!!!

I would be VERY happy if it inserted 8va and Loco in addition.

Thanks for helping.


#86: Note Stems and Beams
Note Stems and Beams

(86)

Submitted by: Lee McHugh (leemus1400@aol.com on 02 Mar 1997

Is there any way to write on one staff simultanious 8th (or 16th, etc) notes with the stems and beaming for one melodic line pointed up and stems and beams for the other line pointed down?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 03 Mar 1997

NWC does not currently support true dual-voice staff arrangements. You cannot have more than one beam, slur, or independent voice at any particular position in a staff. This would require two staves at the moment.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#87: NWC font
NWC font

(87)

Submitted by: Polar_Bare@geocities.com on 02 Mar 1997

I'm trying to start up NoteWorty Composer but it says I don't have the default NoteWorty Composer font, to install it, reboot and then re-start my computer. Where can I get this font? I know this probably sounds stupid, but I have NO idea! Thanks in advance!

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 03 Mar 1997

Version 1.30f installs the NWC font automatically into your system. You should see it in the Windows\System or \Windows\Fonts folder, depending on your system.

If you are using an older 1.30 version, then the procedure to follow is already here in this forum and in the info sources of our web site. I have reprinted it here in case it help:

Version 1.30 through 1.30e font repair procedure:

You can try the following, in order:

1. Delete the "nwcv13.fot" file, then restart NWC. The font should be rebuilt and all should be well.

If not, then

2. Delete the "nwcv13.fot" file if it exists. Reboot your system, then restart NWC. The font should be rebuilt and all should be well.

If not, then

3. For Windows 95, move the nwcv13.ttf file to \windows\font, or for Windows 3.1, install the font from the control panel. Now, open the file "\windows\nwc.ini", and change the line

AddFontOnStartup=1

- to -

AddFontOnStartup=0

Now start NWC, and all should be well.

If not, then the font file is probably corrupted, and needs to be replaced all together.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Graham Stoppani, 100111.265@compuserve.com on 04 Mar 1997

>> Version 1.30f installs the NWC font automatically into your system. You should see it in the Windows\System or \Windows\Fonts folder, depending on your system. I have the problem that I deleted the whole of my windows directory along with the noteworthy font file for version 1.30f. I no longer have the upgrade file for 1.30e to 1.30f. How do I dig myself out of this whole I've made?

regards

Graham

Reply 3 offered by: xavier on 23-May-1998

send nwcv15.ttf

Reply 4 offered by: Tyler St. John on 29-Jun-1998

i need the nwcv15.tff file for nwc
i would greatlt appreciate it if u send it 2 me
thankz
tyler

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 29-Jun-1998

These files are part of the NWC release. Reinstalling NWC will create the files again.

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: Jeremy on 26-Aug-1998

I NEED THE TTF FONT NAMES NWCV15.TTF. I DELETED THE FONT BY ACCIDENT AND I NEED ANOTHER COPY. I WOULD APPRECIATE IT IF SOMEONE WOULD SEND ME ONE. THANKS !!!!

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Aug-1998

done.

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Aug-1998

Run the setup program to get the font installed.

Reply 9 offered by: Arnaud on 05-Aug-2000

Please, send me nwcv15.ttf

Reply 10 offered by: Samuel on 20-Aug-2000

I also need the nwcv15.ttf file, because too many fonts are installed. I would like to install it manually, could someone send me the file?

Thanks

Reply 11 offered by: Artur on 20-Aug-2000

Nw could have a place in support that has many files for replacement.

Reply 12 offered by: tim metcalf on 02-Sep-2000

Hey, has anyone actually FOUND this phreaking nwcv15.ttf file?!?!? I need it also, and cannot locate it anywarez.

Reply 13 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Sep-2000

How hard did you look? See the earlier replies in this thread, especially reply 8. The message that is displayed when you try to run NWC or NWP also explains the situation.

See also: msg #1151, msg #31, msg #983


#88: Musical symbols in song titles
Musical symbols in song titles

(88)

Submitted by: dedics@dircon.co.uk on 04 Mar 1997

Does anyone know how to get proper musical symbols into titles (eg, # (sharp) and b (flat)) which are not the normal ASCII characters?

Ian Dedic

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 05 Mar 1997

All text in NWC is based on the Times New Roman font. This font does not include characters for the flat and sharp symbol, so this cannot currently be done directly within NWC.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Bob Lim (lim@nca.bbc.co.uk) on 05 Mar 1997

Now that the Noteworthy font is installed with other TTF fonts in the system, it can be called up e.g. from within Microsoft Word. This would enable you to make up a title which included the correct symbol, which can then be "cut and pasted", or if you don't mind taking up disc space, import the first page of the score as a bitmap and then add the title. For info., lowercase d corresponds to "sharp" lowercase e corresponds to "natural" lowercase f corresponds to "flat" You need to use a much larger point size than the normal (alphanumeric) font for best appearance.

I hope this helps.

Reply 3 offered by: Alex on 16-Apr-1998

Does anyone know if there's a musical symbol for a Melody?


#91: Midi Imports
Midi Imports

(91)

Submitted by: Justin Shapleski on 06 Mar 1997

Does anyone else have probs importing classical midi files? Like if I import a Beethoven midi file like the second movement of the 'Pathetic' sonata, through NoteWorthy Player it imports perfectly. BUT! If I import the exact same file through NoteWorthy Composer, it doesn't import very well, no matter what I try to do, in the lines of Automatic beaming, smallest rest, smallest note, Tempo changes etc... I've tried every combination possible. but it just doesn't import it like NoteWorthy player. Can anyone help me???

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 06 Mar 1997

What sort of problems do you encounter ?

There are some limitations in the NWComposer import feature, because it must interpret the MIDI file as a score. Some of the limitations can be worked around in various ways explained in this forum or in "User Tips & Tricks" part. Some other require enhancements of the product and we all hope to have them in a future release!

Reply 2 offered by: Justin Shapleski on 09 Mar 1997

Hmm.. well! When I try to import a Chopin Nocturne, they have to be played quite espressively so they can contain very complex tempo markings, which NWC doesn't seem to import very well, because they come out, all out of beat & unpedaled, even though pedal markings are in the score. And if I try to import a piece, which contains rapid ascending or decending semi-quavers, they seem to sometimes import, as semiquaver - dotted quaver - semiquaver. Instead of semiquaver - semiquaver - semiquaver. And thats just a few of them. Then sometime's when I import a piece, the notation is all out of whack. Where say a crochet should be it imports as 2 tied quavers. Yet if I import any of these files through NoteWorthy player, I have no trouble at all. I'm quite impressed how it does import classical midi files, so I wonder how it does it so well, yet it's counterpart NWC, is so hopeless! Could you possibly tell me how NoteWorthy player imports midi files, probaly be the solution to all my troubles!!! Thanx man! (=

Reply 3 offered by: Paul A. Denton on 23 May 1997

I was about to post the same exact question today! Since it's been almost 90 days since your last posting I would assume that there is no answer/solution available. But I agree with you that if the Player can do it, why not the composer. This is really very frustrating.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Feb-1998

NWC can always import a performance as well, if not better, than the player. You might need to play with the import wizard options a bit, but in the end, it should not be a problem to achieve a better result when working with NWC (due to its higher degree of flexibility).


#93: Putting NWC files on your web page
Putting NWC files on your web page

(93)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 10 Mar 1997

Jeroen DOnker's User Tip (see latest User Tips) for having NWC files interpreted by your Internet Service Provider as MIME type application/nwc works wonderfully!

If you configure NetScape (or IE) to use Noteworthy Player as a Helper Application for files of MIME type application/nwc, you will then have automatic playing of NWC files from your browser!

So I strongly suggest that we set a worldwide standard and urge our webmasters to configure their websites so that NWC files are all interpreted as MIME type application/nwc

Andrew

Thanks again Jeroen for the last piece to finish the puzzle.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Feb-1999

See also: msg #18 (reply 9)


#94: Putting two stems on a single note.
Putting two stems on a single note.

(94)

Submitted by: matt@xenon.cchem.berkeley.edu on 10 Mar 1997

I am starting to work with NoteWorthy, and am arranging some choir music with it. Is there a way to have a not with both an up and a down stem so show that both Soprano and Alto should sing the same note?

Matt Asplund matt@xenon.cchem.berkeley.edu

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 17 Mar 1997

Overlapping notes are not currently supported by NWC. This is spelled out in the chord member section of the help file. This has always been the case, although an earlier version of NWC failed to prevent a second note added to the same note position on a staff. It also very often GPFd when this oversight was exploited.

We are still looking into providing support for this in the future. This is a popular wish list item, and as such, will be given priority status as we upgrade the product.

Stay tuned.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Bob Lim (lim@nca.bbc.co.uk) on 12 Mar 1997

This convention is also widely used in piano music, to say nothing of the violin etc. when adjacent strings of the instrument are played in unison to re-inforce certain notes.

I think I know what Eric's reply will be, though.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher on 14 Mar 1997

I also think I know what the reply will be... but, as I noted earlier, the product used to support two stems on a note, or at least two notes of differing value but the same pitch on the same staff - and then that feature was eliminated.


#95: Pasting from Clipboard
Pasting from Clipboard

(95)

Submitted by: Tom Gilland (GBCAMTG1@IBMMAIL.COM) on 12 Mar 1997

I want to be able to put the pause symbol above a note. I have found this symbol in the character map and copied it to the clipboard but I cannot find a way to paste this into the music.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 12 Mar 1997

You don't need to use external symbols for pauses, as NWC has it already. What you want to do is insert JUST BEFORE the note concerned a tEmpo variation called Fermata. Looking up Fermata in help will probably yield some info for you too.

Andrew


#96: Up and down bow symbols.
Up and down bow symbols.

(96)

Submitted by: Tom Gilland (GBCAMTG1@IBMMAIL.COM) on 12 Mar 1997

I would like to be able to include the symbols for up and down bow strokes in my music. The up bow can be done by inserting text with a value of 'V' but I cannot find a way of including a down bow symbol.

Reply 1 offered by: Bob Lim (lim@nca.bbc.co.uk) on 12 Mar 1997

Here's a "bodgy" fix for a downbow that seems to work in Windows 3.1. Open the "text expression" window; select bold font and preserve width off; then in the Expression box hold the "alt" key down and type 0124 on the numeric keypad. Release the "alt" key. This should produce a vertical line. Repeat the procedure using 0175. This produces a horizontal line at the top of the vertical line. Repeat the "0124" for the final vertical. The symbol generated should be quite recognizeable to string players. You can then copy and paste the symbol in other parts of the score to save time.

I hope this helps.

Bob Lim


#97: Printing Problem
Printing Problem

(97)

Submitted by: shand@shand.reo.dec.com on 13 Mar 1997

I'm having a strange printing problem. I've been using Noteworthy for some time on a WIN 3.1 system with no problems, but I have recently upgraded to WIN95 (on a new system) and I am having printing problems. The notes appear to be surrounded by blocks of white-space which obscure the lines, or whatever else is around them.

I can't be sure, but I *think* that it worked fine when I first installed it, but then I lost my hard disk and had to re-install everything from scratch, and it hasn't worked since.

I'm useing a registered copy of 1.30f WIN95 OSR2 (installed from scratch, not over win3.1) A canon Bj10ex, using the microsoft WIN95 drivers

I'm using the 32bit version of Noteworthy, but the 16 bit version suffers the same problem.

The old (shareware) version on the win3.1 system still prints OK (using the same printer).

The problem exists on ALL printing from noteworthy. Other printing (e.g. word, powerpoint etc. seems just fine).

Any suggestions? Resolutions, things to try?

Oh I tried re-installing Noteworthy, with no effect.

Mike Shand

Reply 1 offered by: Philip Allwood (philip@allwood.demon.co.uk on 16 Mar 1997

I had similar problems when I bought a new PC. The fault lies in the graphics drivers supplied with some video cards. In my case this is a Matrox Mystique. The problem was only brought to light on the Microsoft Knowledge Base on 18 February. The fix with the Matrox card is to turn off the use of the PowerGDI Acceleration in the display control panel MGA settings. No need to reboot for the correction to work. It affected any program which prints text (the notes in Noteworthy) over graphics (the staves).

I hope this helps

Phil

Reply 2 offered by: Mike Shand on 21 Apr 1997

Just for the record, I just loaded MAtrox's latest drivers for the Mystique (3.41) and that appears to have fixed the problem. i.e. I can turn on GDI acceleration with no problems.

Mike

Reply 3 offered by: shand@shand.reo.dec.com on 17 Mar 1997

Spot on. Thanks Phil. I would never have figured that one out. It looks like my duaghter was right, and it DID work at first. I vaguely remember I might have set the switch when I re-installed the Matrox drivers. Just goes to show you should make a note of *everything* you do.

Mike


#98: Foot mouse ???
Foot mouse ???

(98)

Submitted by: afalcoz@compuserve.com on 13 Mar 1997

My feet stay idle whereas my hands are busy on the keyboard. Does a genius hardware hacker has some idea to access the tools menu (for instance to change the note duration) with my feet ?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 19 Mar 1997

Do you have a foot controller for MIDI modulation? If so, the upcoming version 1.31 may help. It will respond to some MIDI controller changes by adjusting the duration settings. By using a foot controller, you will be able to do more changes fast. Rests and bar lines will still need to be entered manually for now, though. More details on this will be available in the package when it is released.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: A. Falcoz afalcoz@compuserve.com on 20 Mar 1997

MIDI foot controler looks attractive ! Would you recommend some model ? Thanks

Alain

Reply 3 offered by: ron_e@juno.com on 15 Mar 1997

I can't imagine myself being co-ordinated enough to do that! What I have found works for me is just to learn all the keyboard shortcuts (computer keyboard that is). The number keys are assigned in a logical order and adjust the time values very nicely. Pull down the Notes menu from the main menu bar and all the shortcut values will be shown to the right of the time values. Not the answer you asked for, but I hope it helps. -Ron

Reply 4 offered by: don@ccti.net on 17 May 1997

Being an organist and used to using my feet as well as my hands, I'd love something like that!

Reply 5 offered by: Alain Falcoz afalcoz@compuserve.com on 15 Mar 1997

Ron, thank you for the trick. Anyway, organ players play with hands and feet ! Regards Alain

Reply 6 offered by: Charlie Sullivan on 11-Jul-1998

I use a standard Kensington trackball with my feet, not for
playing music but just for normal computer use. I love it. YMMV.

Reply 7 offered by: Charlie Sullivan on 11-Jul-1998

I also just found out that there's a new product made for this,
the "Nohands" Mouse, which uses two foot-operated pedals--one for the
cursor, the other for "clicks". Hunter Digital, (310) 471-5852.
The "introductory" price is $199.95.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 11-Jul-1998

It's a long time I dream of a foot mouse. Having learned to play drums, (and as a marsupilami :-)) I feel better when I also use my feet... So I'm gonna "finalize" an old project : using my left foot to move the pointer, and the right to click... I already "customized" a mouse to play GrandPrixwith a _real_ wheel (I just put the mouse on a cylinder which rolls on the wheel axis). Well, it is not so hard ! But I'll need a chair that doesn't move :-) !!
Happy to know that I'm not the only one to thik of this kinda device. 200$ is too much though!!

Mad, happy left-handed guitarist

Reply 9 offered by: Donaji Herrera on 15-Nov-1999

I have to do a foot mouse for a school project and i was lookeing for some ideas, but I thougth that there were many of them in the market .

I hope some of you help to me to do this interfaz ..
Greetings..


#100: audition problems
audition problems

(100)

Submitted by: christian.wollin@swipnet.se on 13 Mar 1997

I can´t use either the command F9 (audit curently active score) or the Ctrl + F9 (audit currently active staff) By pushing the playbutton in the window or the F5 I can hear the whole score, but I don´t know how to hear one staff at a time, except by going in and out of the scorebuilder and mute all the other voices, which is quite timeconsuming. The F9 button work alright with all other programmes Could someone help me please? I am a registered user using Version 1.30f Regards! Christian

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 17 Mar 1997

As others have said, the audit is used to simply clean up some internal data for a staff or score. It makes the key signature match the clef, whole measure rests match the time signature, and stuff like that.

As for mute, we are adding a Mute command to a new menu called Staff. This will be available in the upcoming version 1.31. This might help to speed up your mute actions, although it lacks the overall summary of muted staves that is available in the Score Builder.

You may want to request a "featured play" for just one staff from our wish list.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: afalcoz@compuserve.com on 14 Mar 1997

Hello Christian, Audit does not mean Play, but perform an audit, i.e. correct the defects. But your idea of playing just the selected voice is great, and would be very useful for choirs. Then, I pass the idea to Eric Heile, who reads often the forums Regards

Alain Falcoz

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 13 Mar 1997

The problem is in your expectation of what the audit button does.

Audit instructs NWC to go through the stave and fix things like Accelerandos, Diminuendos, tied notes etc, so that they'll play back correctly (and also display correctly).

Unfortunately, for the moment, to mute (and solo) staffs is still only achievable from the Score Builder. This is note quite so bad though, if you click in the list of staves, you can then just use the up and down arrows to move, and the Alt-M keys to toggle muting.

If that is still too hard (and if you have to do it a LOT, I can understand you wanting to streamline it) put in a request to the wish list.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: afalcoz@compuserve.com Alain Falcoz on 14 Mar 1997

Sorry, Andrew, I was too fast, and answered to Christian before reading your message. You said before me the same thing, and in better english...

Regards


#102: Copyright symbol
Copyright symbol

(102)

Submitted by: Steve Bacher on 14 Mar 1997

How do you enter a copyright symbol (you know, that "c" in a circle) in the song info? When song info comes up, there is a copyright symbol already sitting there - but if I delete it and then want to put one in, how do I do it?

Reply 1 offered by: ron_e@juno.com on 15 Mar 1997

With every version of Windows I've seen, from 3.0 to Windows 95, to WIndows NT 4.0, is a useful little utility in the Accessories group/folder called "Character Map". If you start it, and select the font you are working with, it will show all the characters in the font. You can then select the particular character(s) you want by double clicking. They will move into a little selection box, which you can then copy to the clipboard, and paste into the document you are working with. It also tells you the keyboard code and a blown up picture of the current character the mouse is over. In the case of the copyright symbol, most Windows fonts put the © at 169. You should be able to also hold down the Alt key, and, using the numeric keyboard, type 0169 to get the same result. It's still easier never to delete it, but if you do, there is hope. -Ron

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson mrbanjo@bright.net on 15 Mar 1997

The paste function for clipboard information cannot be accessed from the Song Author Info window.

The best solution in my opinion is deleting only the information to the right of the symbol leaving the copyright (symbol) standing alone and adding information to it.

Reply 3 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 17 Mar 1997

By the way, the paste function is available in ALL edit boxes of NWC, including title, author, copyright, lyrics, text expression, etc. Simply press Ctrl+V when the focus is in any edit window, and the clipboard contents will be pasted, provided that the contents is text. This will work in most other programs too, unless they are very mis-behaved (ie. do not follow standard conventions).

Here is the full list of clipboard functions that work in edit boxes: Ctrl+X is cut, Ctrl+C is copy, and Ctrl+V is paste. All work in NWC edit boxes of the dialogs.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ferguson mrbanjo@bright.net on 14 Mar 1997

Select all information to the right of the "copyright" symbol and delete only that part of the copyright information. That will leave only the copyright word with symbol. Then add the copyright dates and copyright holders to the line.

There might be a copyright symbol in the character maps if you want to check.

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 25 Mar 1997

Use the following keystoke combinations to use characters from the character map:- Alt/0169 Copyright symbol Alt/0176 Diminished chord (degree) symbol Alt/0216 Minor seventh b5th (half diminished) chord symbol Can be used in adding text in Noteworthy. Search around - there may be other useful combinations.

Reply 6 offered by: Shawn on 21-Jan-2002

type 0134 with alt and you get the symbol of true love and sacrifice. God † Bless!


#103: Incorrect enharmonic spellings in minor keys
Incorrect enharmonic spellings in minor keys

(103)

Submitted by: John Gillings gillings@gidday.enet.dec.com on 17 Mar 1997

Try this - create a new song, insert a treble clef, now insert a key signature of d minor, finally insert a C# crotchet. Now choose "Transpose Staff" from the "Tools" menu and transpose by 0 semitones. The C# will become a Db.

I assume this is because the transpose logic says that in flat keys, flat accidentals are preferred. That may be the case in major keys, but it definitely isn't for minor keys. In this example, no one would ever notate a Dd when the key is d minor!

When transposing long staves, this is a rather large headache as it is necessary to individually correct each occurrance of the "misspelled" note, including implicit instances. Force accidentals helps, but there doesn't seem to be any way to do a "global substitution".

Perhaps there should be a sub option on transpose staff in which preferred enharmonic spellings can be set?

Have I missed an easier way to fix this problem?

John Gillings, Sydney Australia

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 19 Mar 1997

There is no way around this behaviour at this time. NWC always favours the accidental direction based on the key (flats in a flat key, sharps in a sharp key). If and when a change to this technique is offered in an upgrade, it would be in the form of a re-spelling function, allowing you designate the preferred enharmonic spelling for each note. Until such a thing is offered, manual changes are required to get the spelling the way you like it.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 20 Mar 1997

I'm afraid it really doesn't help! In a long piece the probability of making a mistake when re-spelling the notes is quite high.

Your proposed solution is also convoluted and unnecessarily invasive. If the composer has written an enharmonic spelling then that should be preserved if possible and my suggestion in my previous reply does that, and very simply too!

To recap i) Work out from how many degrees on the clef you have to move the notes by comparing the two key signatures. So to move up a minor third in the key of C you would move up two degrees to Eb (rather than one degree to D#).

ii) Move all the notes by the same amount.

iii) Re-spell them as necessary.

Easy really and everyone's :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 19 Mar 1997

I noticed the problem when I tried to transpose a diminished seventh chord (say F# A C Eb where all the intervals are minor thirds) up a semitone.

It becomes G A# C# E and the first interval is now written as an augmented second. This in music theory is a dastardly crime, and I believe (???) that a violinist would actually play a slightly different note.

If the transposition were made so that all the notes moved up (or down) by a fixed number of lines and spaces (thus preserving their relative intervals) and the accidentals were adjusted accordingly then the problem would go away!

Having said that, it is conceivable that on occasion you would need a treble flat or sharp and the rule would have to be broken, but the music would have to be rather oddly written in the first place for that to happen.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 18 Mar 1997

Why not do the transpose 0 trhing again? That should change them back again, no?

A

Reply 5 offered by: John Gillings, gillings@gidday.enet.dec.com on 19 Mar 1997

Andrew, Thanks for the suggestion, but it doesn't work that way. It's a trapdoor transformation. Even if it were a toggle, there would always be cases where some accidentals were "correct" and others incorrect. :-(

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 19 Mar 1997

John then said: "It's a trapdoor transformation. Even if it were a toggle, there would always be cases where some accidentals were "correct" and others incorrect. :-( "

Maybe the way to do it (I hope you're reading, Eric), is to make it a trapdoor the first time, and then toggle once all possibly enharmonic notes are being presented in the same way.

A

PS: Did that make any sense?


#104: NWC Macros (Windows 3.x)
NWC Macros (Windows 3.x)

(104)

Submitted by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 17 Mar 1997

I use a set of macros with Noteworthy when transcribing downloaded midi-files. Some of the tasks include, tidying up eighth and quarter triplets, coverting bass to treble and treble to bass clefs, transpositions - trumpet, alto, tenor, baritone, etc,etc. If any user would like a copy of these Windows 3.x macros drop me an Email and I'll try to reply promptly. The zip-file includes descriptions and the macros are documented in the Recorder file.

Regards Barry

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1998

I know this msg is rather old (!), but I'm still interested in it. Altthough I bet that I'll need to use Ctrl-Alt-F1 to switch back to US-kbd-layout... If you still have your .rec file, please send it ! Or maybe you could add it on your page ?

MAD


#105: Drum Set sounds and bending pitches
Drum Set sounds and bending pitches

(105)

Submitted by: Paul Chesterton (caf44@theworks.com) on 20 Mar 1997

I'm interested in having more drum (esp. drum set) sounds available for use in Noteworthy, but I haven't been able to figure it out. I use Win95 and I downloaded the IDF Edit, but I couldn't quite figure out how to make it allow me to use the percussion sounds (ie. bass drum, ride cymbal, ect.). If anyone has gotten this to work and could help me out, could ya please share some advice? Also I was wondering if there's a way to bend pitches in Noteworthy, or add vibrato, anyone know? Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 20 Mar 1997

1. Drum Set sounds

General MIDI traditionally affects channel #10 to drums. You can set channel number for one staff in the Score Builder.

2. Bending pitches

You can insert a Multi-point Controller for Bend Pitch. Press L key or choose Multi-point Controller in Insert menu, then play with the buttons to see all possibilities.

Reply 2 offered by: Michael Steele on 22-Apr-1998

Where can I get IDF Edit?


#106: Lazy forum...
Lazy forum...

(106)

Submitted by: A. Falcoz afalcoz@compuserve.com on 20 Mar 1997

Noteworthy site response time is good, except when I look at responses in forums. Do you meet the same problem ? Eric, are you aware of that ? Sometimes, I stop the transfer, start again and get a faster response.

But I can live with that...

Alain

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20 Mar 1997

I am sure that this is traffic related. Since the forum changes dynamically, your cache cannot assist in improving the performance of accessing it. Each time you open the primary index, the page is retrieved from the web. Web response time is a complex subject, dependent on your ISP, the location of your ISP, the routing of your web transactions, time of day, and day of week. All of this influences that experience when a page must be downloaded from the web (such as is usually the case in a forum such as this).

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#107: Percussion on different scores
Percussion on different scores

(107)

Submitted by: Paul Chesterton (caf44@theworks.com) on 21 Mar 1997

I got the percussion to work on Noteworthy, now I was wanting to know if there's a way to put the percussion on more than one score. I tried sending two scores through channel 10, but it dramatically lowered the overall volume of the two scores, and when I put all of the percussion on one score, the cymbals usually drown out the drums (bass drum and snare mainly). So if I could have percussion on even just two scores, I could set the volumes more accurate. Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Warren Barnett on 06-Jan-1998

You should be able to produce many staffs using channel 10 or 16 or both. One thing you might try is to pan the parts on on staff to the left, another to the right, one in the middle, etc. to cut down on the apparent conflicts in volume. It probably on seems that way as every thing is coming at you at once. try separating the staffs in this way. Worth a try at least.


#109: Guitar and Mandolin Tab from Noteworthy
Guitar and Mandolin Tab from Noteworthy

(109)

Submitted by: pmckeown@mojo.europe.dg.com on 25 Mar 1997

I'm seriously looking at purchasing Noteworthy as it does what I want it to do except.... I want to be able to easily produce tab for Guitar and Mandolin from music entered. Can this be done with Noteworthy or from Noteworthy via some other software Thanks Paul

Reply 1 offered by: mbryant@ismi.net on 30 Mar 1997

Yes, there is a program called TAB-IT which will allow import of midi.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 26 Mar 1997

Paul,

The most obvious method for me would be to export a midi version and convert that.

Try wwwing to altavista.digital.com and entering +"midi to guitar tab" conversion (that's two arguments, the compulsory phrase "midi to guitar" and the optional "conversion". This should give you a list of about nine sources to track down. They all seem to be preoccupied with the old ASCII output, but you may strike it lucky somewhere.

I imagine that a program that produces both tabulature AND score notation would be quite expensive.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Cory Miller on 03-Feb-2000

I have seen a program called Tabledit. I found it at www.tabledit.com. It allows you to enter music in standard notation and will plot tablature and fretboard locations for most stringed instruments. Registration is $55.00. I haven't checked, but I assume that it will import MIDI files.

Hope this helps.

Reply 4 offered by: Daddy-0 on 03-Feb-2000

Yo Andy,

You're right bud'.

The ones I've checked out haven't got the legs to do it.

Though Noteworthy will kick if they could add guitar tabs (as like, part of its like functionality man).

Kiss Me,
Daddy-O


#110: Formatting for printing - HELP!
Formatting for printing - HELP!

(110)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 28 Mar 1997

A friend and I are in the process of producing some volumes of music for publication. We've been using NWC for our in-house arrangements and printing of parts, and have been very happy with it. It was perfect for our needs.

Now that we are moving to self-publishing (for reasons of cost) we're a bit more concerned about the limitations in NWC's printing. Specifically

1) Inability to spread staves horizontally so that the last one will fill full width. I guess this would need an algorithm that would "borrow" bars from higher staves to fill up the lower one and share things around a bit more. (Eric, if there is some sort of number used for spacing, couldn't we be allowed to tweak it?)

2) Lack of control over title formatting. (Not so important, but it would be nice).

3) Inability to add characters from other fonts (Oh please, please, can't teXt be enhanced?)

Can anyone out there who has a reasonable work-around for these please respond? Or can Noteworthy give a timeline for when these features would be included? It would be a shame to move our publishing platform off NWC, as I'm otherwise extremely happy with it, but we may have no choice.

Andrew

Reply 1 offered by: Myself on 30 Mar 1997

Okay,

One method I've found useful for spreading notes in lines to get bars spaced where I want then is: inserting blanks between notes to spread a line out. This has worked fairly well under limited testing. Its several drawbacks are

1) difficulty in altering spacing if the notes are changed (ie, do this only when you are COMPLETELY FINISHED with your editing).

2) difficulty in pulling the blanks out later, as they don't readily show up in the editing window either.

3) how tedious it is to have to do so.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 28 Mar 1997

Andrew Purdam wrote:

1) Inability to spread staves horizontally so that the last one will fill full width. I guess this would need an algorithm that would "borrow" bars from higher staves to fill up the lower one and share things around a bit more. (Eric, if there is some sort of number used for spacing, couldn't we be allowed to tweak it?)

Oh yes, there is a real need to control the position of the bars. In my humble opinion, the best thing would be to be able to change the position of each bar line within "Print preview", just before actual printing. I will add it to the wish list.


#112: WHAT NOTES ARE WHAT FOR DRUMS
WHAT NOTES ARE WHAT FOR DRUMS

(112)

Submitted by: mbryant@ismi.net on 30 Mar 1997

I was wondering if someone could e-mail me what percussion instrument each not on the staff is. I'm really interested in the main ones like open and closed hi-hat, ride cymbol, splash and crash cymbols, all the Toms, the base, and the snare. I would really appreciate it and if you could e-mail it to mbryant@ismi.net that would be even better. Thanks, Tim

Reply 1 offered by: mrbanjo@bright.net on 30 Mar 1997

1. Load in NWC help files. 2. Go to "Answers to Common Questions" 3. Go to Question #6. 4. Print out Topic.

The printout should show a listing of Key #'s associated with a percussion sound.

I use a Casio CTK-530 Midi Keyboard. The number 60 corresponds with my MIDDLE C. Numbers go up or down in half steps on the keyboard depending upon the number direction. I.E. 48 = C octave below middle C. 36 = C two octaves below middle C.

Fill in the key number line with the correct note by half steps and you should have all the info you need. See NOTE: under General MIDI Drum List heading regarding your equipment

Hope this helps.

Don F.


#113: Musical symbols in song titles or on song tile pages
Musical symbols in song titles or on song tile pages

(113)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson mrbanjo@bright.net on 31 Mar 1997

The subject was originally entered by Ian Dedic on 3/4, replied to by Eric at Noteworthy on 3/5 and Bob Lim on 3/5.

As stated by Eric all text in NWC is based upon the Times New Roman Font which does not include musical characters.

I have a font of musical symbols called COMPOSER that I use to decorate title pages. I use Win 3.1 PFS:Windowworks Version 2 under Win95. I have developed a lookup table for the COMPOSER font which lists the musical characters available with the correct keystroke. The table also references the treble clef and # characters in the NWCV13A font (although the # character from the keyboard could be used), and the keystrokes required for the © character from the TIMES NEW ROMAN font. Between the three fonts there are about 75 musical symbols available for use. Font point sizes will need to be adjusted much larger than normal for best appearance on the printed sheets.

TITLE PAGE ONLY - NO SCORE PRINTING

You must have a sheet feeder printer. Begin with a blank sheet with your word processor. Compose your title page using the appropriate font. After printing the title page reinsert the printed title page into the printer so that the unprinted side becomes the next printable page. Begin printing your score after previewing the pages. In essence the title page is page 1 and the score print is page 2(back to back) etc. until the whole score is printed.

TITLE PAGE WITH SCORE PRINTING

Determine the margins for your score and develop title information or decoration in your word processor OUTSIDE of the margins set for the score. For example, if you set the score print top margin to 1.00 inches then your word processor should enter information into only the top 1.00 inch of the word processor window. The same idea applies to the sides and bottom margins if you want to put some information in those areas. Remember to unchech the title page info in the score print window and set margins after going back to NOTEWORTHY. Insert the completed and printed title page in your printer so that the printed title page becomes the next printable page. Print your score from NOTEWORTHY.

If you would like to have my files on the COMPOSER font, the lookup table, and a rough copy of a decorated title page then please E-Mail your request to me at Thanks for letting me share my efforts with you.

Don Ferguson 4-String Plectrum Banjo Player 901 Hackney 24 year member Barbershop Harmony Socieity (SPEBSQSA) St. Marys, OH 45885 14 year Tenor in a performing quartet in Lima, OH 419 394-5493


#114: MIDI type 0 to type 1 converter?
MIDI type 0 to type 1 converter?

(114)

Submitted by: Roberto Mariottini on 04 Apr 1997

Las year I've seen somewhere a program to convert type 0 MIDI files to type 1 ones. I've forgotten where it was. Does someone knows of it, have it? It's difficult to do?

Thanks in advance

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 18 Apr 1997

A type 0 to type 1 converter is no longer necessary for use with NWC import. As of the new version 1.31, the MIDI import wizard handles this conversion automatically during import.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com;

Reply 2 offered by: Steven Stewart on 06 Apr 1997

I use a great program called WavMaker which does conversions of many types, including MIDI 0 to 1. It also "converts" or renders Midi files to WAV. It's fairly cheap, and a sharware version is available. After converting the files, you'll find that they will import properly into NWC (to the best of its abilities, that is).

WAVMAKER http://www.abc.se/~m9303/

Steven Stewart brandx_sts@hotmail.com http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Set/1161/


#115: Problems with Flow Control and Refrains
Problems with Flow Control and Refrains

(115)

Submitted by: Andrew Ballard <mdiv2b@chicago.avenew.com> on 04 Apr 1997

I've been working with a song that plays verse 1, verse 2, refrain, verse 3, refrain, verse 4.

I've tried various methods of flow control and repeats, but so far the best it plays back as verse 1, verse 2, refrain, verse 2, refrain (without the first bar).

Any ideas, short of copying and pasting the passages in the correct order without repeats?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 07 Apr 1997

If you send your file to us as an attachment, we will try to help. Include a description of what you are trying to notate, in terms of the section sequence (eg. ABBCCDDA, or something like that). Without this, it is nearly impossible to understand what you are trying to do.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#116: Non-GM Drum Mappings
Non-GM Drum Mappings

(116)

Submitted by: Ron Emmert (ron_e@juno.com) on 15 Apr 1997

I'm trying to import some MIDI sequences from an Ensoniq ASR into NWC. Unfortunately, the Drum track uses a drum sample set that is not General MIDI, and the drum track sounds pretty bizzarre. Not being the Musician who performed the sequences in the first place, I don't know what particular percussion is being used.

Is there a good resource somewhere where I could find out which MIDI note matches which percussion sound? I've found all sorts of fascinating things about MIDI in my search, but not this.

Thanks for any help in advance - Ron ron_e@juno.com

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 15 Apr 1997

Ron,

The same question was asked and answered about five questions down from this one.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Ron (ron_e@juno.com) on 15 Apr 1997

The previous thread answered what the General MIDI standard assignments for percussion are. I've actually found that in several places. My question though has to do with some non-standard mappings. I know what to map them to now thanks to that previous thread, I just don't know what to map them from. :-)

I've spent some time surfing to various places, but haven't found my particular answer yet. I may have to just reserve some time with the keyboard and guess (percussion is not my strong point), but if anyone knows a good source, I'd rather get it right.

Thanks - Ron

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 16 Apr 1997

Yes. I see that I didn't answer your question. Sorry if I sounded a bit flippant :~(

have you tried surfing at www.ensoniq.com? From there you should be able to pose your question to someone who can help you.

Hope THIS helps! :-)

Andrew


#117: Converting Scores to .GIF
Converting Scores to .GIF

(117)

Submitted by: Darcy Watkins, <dwatkins@uniserve.com> on 16 Apr 1997

Using the 16 bit program, go to Print Preview, then press the Copy button. Answer "No" and save it as a .BMP file. Use LView to read in the .BMP file. Reduce the size to 50% or less, crop off the margins, set the transparent GIF color to "white" and then Save As a .GIF-89a file. Embed this into your web page.

I crop off the title and the copyright info and then add it back to the web page using HTML and just embed the big .GIF file in the middle.

Since the .GIF file is two color (black and white [background]) the size of the file is actually quite small.

Hope this inspires someone.

Darcy


#118: Delayed chords
Delayed chords

(118)

Submitted by: Richard Schmidt <rschmidt@merlin.net.au> on 16 Apr 1997

I want a delayed chord, (ie. [1/2] beat note on top, with a [1/4] beat rest, followed by a [1/4] beat note of a lower pitch) I currently have to have a [1/4] beat note tied to a [1/4] beat chord. I believe this can get rather unsightly. Is there an alternative?

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 16 Apr 1997

Just enter your quarter rest, and then add your top note (correct length) as a chord member. NWC copes with rests as a topmost or bottommost chord member, but you must enter the rest first. The following note will be placed - timewise - after the shortest note.

Hope this makes sense.

Andrew


#119: Dots 'n' beams
Dots 'n' beams

(119)

Submitted by: Steve Bacher on 17 Apr 1997

I recently sent an NWC score to a pianist, who responded with much helpful commentary. Among other things, he made several comments about the notation.

The most unsightly thing he found was the unnatural length of the partial beams in sixteenth notes beamed to dotted eighth notes. He said they would be confusing to a performer, as they looked too much like full 16th-note beams.

Why does NWC generate such long partial beams? Can this be fixed?

- seb

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 18 Apr 1997

I am not exactly clear on your question. Are you referring to a group of beamed notes that are, for example, comprised of different durations. For example, a dotted eighth note beamed with a following sixteenth would seem to be what you are describing. In this case, NWCD extends the 16th note portion of the beam for half the distance to the 8th note. In situations like this, NWC always uses half the distance between the two notes of differing number of stem flags.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com;

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Bacher on 23 Apr 1997

Yes, you understood me: I was referring to a dotted eighth beamed to a sixteenth.

Your formula, using half the length where the duration difference is half, etc., doesn't seem standard to me. Printed notation almost never uses a half length - more like a quarter at most. I would be happy to see this formula changed.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards (Peter_e@issolutions.co.uk) on 25 Apr 1997

Noteworthy Composer is an excellent product especially for its price but it does have elementary typographical flaws, easily corrected I'm sure, that detract from its usefulness. Many have been mentioned in this forum and it is disappointing that the recent release has not fixed them.

My own bugbears are:

1) Subsidiary beams should only be about the same size as a note-head, not half the length of the main beam. It really does make the score look ugly at the moment.

2) In chords, if two notes are on consecutive line and space (or vice versa) they should be written so that the lower note is on the left of the stem and the higher on the right. And it doesn't matter which way the stem goes! NWC produces some weird chord shapes which are far harder to recognize than chords written in the conventional way.

3) Simultaneous chords (on different clefs) should be aligned headnote to headnote, and not on the leftmost notes as at present.

4) The font size for lyrics is too small for practical use in dimly lit churches or for anyone with less than 20-20 vision.

5) Back-to-back Master Repeat bar lines look ridiculous with the empty pseudo-bar between them.

Is there any chance of these problems being fixed, or even a comment that you don't agree?


#120: Congratulations!
Congratulations!

(120)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 20 Apr 1997

At last! I can now say "Congratulations on your new version!"

I'm so relieved at some of the bugs fixes, and can see the new midi keyboard input facilities could be very nifty.

A great job! Keep up the good work (hint, hint...)

Andrew


#121: How do I get two words on a single note?
How do I get two words on a single note?

(121)

Submitted by: fuldrich@flash.net on 20 Apr 1997

How do I go about putting two words on a single note? If I use a space between words, then I get the words spread across two notes.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 21 Apr 1997

Use the underscore (_) between words instead of the space. This IS in the help file, but is two paragraphs after where you would expect to find it. (ie the list of special characters).

That should do the trick.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Don Pool on 03 May 1997

This keyboard symbol "~" inserted in place of a hyphen will also position two words on a single note.


#122: Transposing
Transposing

(122)

Submitted by: Jos Briers on 22 Apr 1997

When I try to transpose a staff that has no keysignature only some notes are transposed, the staff does not receive a keysignature (as it should). Is this a bug or am I missing something? I solved it myself by putting the right keysignature in front and re-doing the transpose with 0 semitones.

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings, gillings@gidday.enet.dec.com on 22 Apr 1997

Jos, since the key signature itself is an "object" Noteworthy can't change it unless it exists. You can insert a key signature of C maj (which will be displayed as an F natural) before transposing the staff in order to give Noteworthy something to change.


#123: Printing Problems
Printing Problems

(123)

Submitted by: bbbean@beancotton.com on 25 Apr 1997

I'm running Composer 1.31a under Win/OS2, and whenever I try to print a score on my Epson EPL 7500 I get a blank page followed by an error page that reads:

Offending Command= Error=nametype:undefined this name is not defined in a dictionary Stack=

My other truetype fonts print just fine, as do all postscript fonts. Composer printed fine for me until version 1.30e.

I've uninstalled and then reinstalled, thinking I might have a corrupted font file, but this doesn't work.

I've also uninstalled the font NWCV13A and re-installed it, but still error messages.

Any ideas?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 30 Apr 1997

We will handle problems like this individually via e-mail support.

Regards,

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Henk Hanoeman on 14-Jun-1998

Hello,

I have problems with my epl-7500. Printing the testpage under Windows 95 gives only random asci characters.
Whats the solution???

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jun-1998

Henk, it is not clear what kind of test page you are referring to in your question. If your printer has a "test page" function, it may very well be printing a series of ascii characters as its test. If you are getting ascii characters when printing from NWC, but notation appears on your screen, then you probably have a buggy printer driver. Your best bet is too look for a newer print driver from the printer manufacturer.

Reply 4 offered by: Guenter Sengeis on 23-Jun-1998

Hey,

i have problems with printing pages in landscape. I get
only lines, with the HP emulation mode and the original
WIN95 HP Laserjet IIP driver.

my second problem is the entry roller. sometimes the printer
can´t retract the paper. i cleand up the roller with
alcohol but it´s steady.

when i'am printing grafics i get only pictures with less
quality, with the HP emulation mode and the EPSON mode.

I'am very pleased to get some tips.
h.a.n.d.
guenna


#126: Another Drum Question
Another Drum Question

(126)

Submitted by: Neeraj Mathur prsnhome@gncom.com on 26 Apr 1997

HI, I'm guessing that you're probably bored of hearing percussion questions again, but I really need some help.

I am trying to create a score to print, which includes percussion parts. I also would like to be able to hear the piece as MIDI. My problem is, if I write the percussion parts so that they look right, my MIDI gets screwed up, and if I create them to sound right, then it looks screwed up and no-one could play it. How can I do both: have a score which is visiually and audially pleasing? Using transpose doesn't work because every note would have to be transposed differently.

Thanks a lot in advance,

Neeraj Mathur

P.S. Why did they make General MIDI like that? If standards were being made, souldn't they have been just a little more sympathetic to people like me?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 30 Apr 1997

You can control the pitches used for drum/percussion sounds by setting up a custom "Key Map" for your MIDI Mapper device. In Windows 3.1, this is a feature in the MIDI Mapper control panel applet.

In Windows 95, this feature is not directly available, but can be created using a program called "IDFEdit", which allows you to create and edit IDF files (which I think means something like Instrument Definition Files). The IDFEdit utility is provided by Microsoft. I downloaded it a long time ago, so I am not sure where to get it. I recommend trying www.hotfiles.com, www.download.com, and/or www.shareware.com. Once you have this program, you can create a custom instrument that includes your custom key map for drum sounds.

BEWARE: If you use custom patch or key maps, you will not be able to successfully share your songs with others in a MIDI or NWC file format, since your songs will no longer comply with the standard. You could still share your songs, but they will not sound properly on other machines, unless they too use your custom instrument map.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com;

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 30 Apr 1997

Neeraj said: >My problem is, if I write the percussion parts so that they >look right, my MIDI gets screwed up, and if I create them to sound right, then it looks >screwed up and no-one could play it. How can I do both: have a score which is visiually and >audially pleasing? I'm sure someone dealt with this problem SOMEWHERE, but I can't find it in the NWC history. I thought there WAS a way of configuring a new midi instrument which remapped the notes on the channel using (I presume) some sort of instrument definition file.

Looking up Win95's (I hope you're using Win 95) help was totally fruitless. You may find something in the www.microsoft.com q&a things. Search with keywords like midi and definition.

Failing that, you can (though I know you'd prefer not to :-) create two staffs (staves?). Have one which looks right, which is muted, and the other, which sounds right, in another partition (not absolutely necessary), so that it's automatically ignored when printing.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Andrew

PS: Make a wish on the wish list. I'm sure Eric loves to keep busy! ;-)


#128: Keyboard entry
Keyboard entry

(128)

Submitted by: Hans Schneider<johnny@geko.net.au> on 02 May 1997

Is anybody out there using a keyboard to enter music? I am trying to use a Roland PC-200 dumb keyboard but can't get the length of the notes right. Would like to here from somebody who has more experience.

I am also having problems with sound not cutting off when keys are released but that is probably a hardware problem?

Thanks for help

J

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 05/03/97 To: johnny@geko.net.au

Per your e-mail of the same subject, here is the reply that we sent to you:

Hi:

> How can I control the length of the notes from the keyboard?

Currently, note length can be selected either from your computer, or remotely via MIDI. See the help file section for the MIDI Input Active command for more details.

> is rather clumsy. I would like to have the notes appear exactly as played.

If you want to play a performance and have it notated, then use the Record command, rather than remote "step entry".

> Sometimes, when I press a keyboard note, the sound continues on when I > release the key but I guess that is not a Noteworthy problem but some setup > conflict? Can you give me an idea what to do?

Are you using the Echo feature? If so, is the stuck note on your computer sound card or on the keyboard? Do not setup an echo feature to bounce incoming MIDI back out to your external synth. This could cause stuck notes. If your external keyboard includes a synth, then you do not need to use the echo feature.

In any case, stuck notes can be cleared by pressing the Stop button when nothing is playing.

I hope this helps.

Regards,

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 02 May 1997

Johnny,

I've experimented with using the a musical keyboard to enter notes, but found I was still quicker working from the computer keyboard.

you say: "I am trying to use a Roland PC-200 dumb keyboard but can't get the length of the notes right. "

Note lengths can be adjusted lots of ways. Mod wheel, Pitch wheel, data slider. These will adjust the note length (crotchet, minim, etc). If you twiddle whilst the key is held down, you will rotate through dotted and double dotted notes.

Doesn't this happen with your keyboard? Does the PC-200 HAVE a pitch or mod wheel?

"Would like to here from somebody who has more experience." Sorry! :-)

"I am also having problems with sound not cutting off when keys are released but that is probably a hardware problem?"

Hmm. Can't tell, as NWC only echoes percussion on my setup. Can't tell what I'm doing wrong.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Hans Schneider on 02 May 1997

Andrew, thanks for your msg. Yes, the Roland has a mod wheel and it shifts between crotchets, quavers etc. I find it clumsy to use and as you said, it is faster to enter music directly from the computer kb. I am testing two demo software packages, one from Micrologic and the other from Steinberg (Cubase). With either, you can enter notes from the Roland and they play back OK but look wrong on the screen. Eg. you enter 4 quavers and the screen shows several combinations of notes, making up the correct length, interspersed with rests I didn't put in. My guess is that I am not 100% on the beat...

Regards

J

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 03 May 1997

Not wanting to sound like a salesman, but... :-)

In NWC, when you import your midi recording, you can set it up to round to the nearest quarter, eighth, sixteenth or whatever note.

I'm interested in your testing CuBase as well. Isn't that in the multi-$100 mark? I'd be interested in your views as to how well NWC stands up to these other guys. And I hope Eric would be intersted, too! :-)

Regards, Andrew


#129: Bar Numbers
Bar Numbers

(129)

Submitted by: Nigel Pendrey (ndp@globalnet.co.uk) on 02 May 1997

The bar numbering dialogue seems to have disappeared. Does anybody know where it is ( or am I just being stupid?)

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 03 May 1997

Bar numbering moved to the Page Setup options on the File menu.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#130: Bar Numbers
Bar Numbers

(130)

Submitted by: Nigel Pendrey (ndp@globalnet.co.uk) on 02 May 1997

The bar numbering dialogue seems to have disappeared in version 1.31a. Does anybody know where it is ( or am I just being stupid?)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 03 May 1997

No you're not being stupid. It wasn't really well advertised that the bar number facility has been moved to the page setup dialog. This sort of makes, sense, though I wish there was a shortcut to it from the print preview dialog!

Hope this helps.

Andrew "Not a Noteworthy Employee" Purdam

Reply 2 offered by: A. Marcelin on 04-Sep-1998

Can you explain me the methodology for attributing bar code numbers? How do they process?

Reply 3 offered by: ÿüK on 08-Sep-1998

bar code ? in music ?? what kind of ?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Sep-1998

Not bar codes as in UPC, but rather "bar number" indications as in "which bar are we on"?

Noteworthy Composer allows you to turn this feature on or off, in the edit view all bars are numbered, and in the printed score only the first bar of every line is numbered.


#131: multi-measure rests in parts, movements.
multi-measure rests in parts, movements.

(131)

Submitted by: S. Ritz on 03 May 1997

Anyone know a way to collapse multiple-measure rests into standard single-measure notation (i.e., a thick horizontal line mid-staff with the number of measures rest indicated above) when printing parts? A lot of space is wasted, and it causes confusion at readings. Thanks! Also, is there any way to print measure numbers on parts in places other than the left side of each staff? Finally, I've written a sonata with two movements, but the only convenient way to do this is to keep the movements in separate files. The finished product looks a bit awkward. Is there a better way to do this? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 03 May 1997

"Anyone know a way to collapse multiple-measure rests into standard single-measure notation"

Nope. About the best you can do is use a full measure rest surrounded by local repeat bars with the appropriate number of bars indicated. Unfortunately, you'll need to do this manually to switch from printing a full score to printing parts. One thing that may help here is to have a separate file containing just the 33 empty bars in both formats, and copying and pasting what is required. Alternately, keep them in a separate partition in the same file.

"Also, is there any way to print measure numbers on parts in places other than the left side of each staff?"

Nope. But you can use the funny section letter (the S with a line through it) followed by a letter (A,B,C) and label important sections directly onto the score. OR if you know you are not going to change the bar numbers (a BIG problem if using the previous suggestion for collapsing multi-measure rests), you could use plain text for the bar numbers and put them wherever you like.

"Finally, I've written a sonata with two movements, but the only convenient way to do this is to keep the movements in separate files. The finished product looks a bit awkward. Is there a better way to do this?"

Hmm. It depends on what you're really wanting for the final product. Most works will start new movements on a new page. In which case you just need to adapt the title a bit. NWC definitely needs more felxibility in this area. If you want to space out bars so that they fill a page, the only way to do it is by inserting text SPACES into the bars. This is very tedious, but can achieve some good results. Caveat emptor. Keep an original (unspaced) copy, as they are very hard to find once inserted.

Andrew Member, PC Users Groups, Canberra Users Helping Users

Reply 2 offered by: One further thing from Andrew on 05 May 1997

About funny bar numbering once you've got the huge repeats on an empty bar. You can alter the bar numbering to start from any number (>= 0) you wish.

This may help you over that sticky point.

Andrew


#132: Bar lines on 32 notes
Bar lines on 32 notes

(132)

Submitted by: GBCAMTG1@IBMMAIL.COM on 05 May 1997

When entering an eighth note folowed by a thirty second note followed by a sixteenth note and adding a bar line to link them the top two bar lines on the thirty second note point to the left instead of the right. Is this a problem? Thanks, Tom

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 05 May 1997

Maybe a better way to look at the problem is that the flag direction is determined by the note value and its place in the beamed group. Try other combinations. Note that no flags point to the left on the leftmost note or point to the right on the rightmost note in a group of beamed notes. Note also that each note will have its proper number of flags depending on its value. If all flags were pointing to the right (as if not beamed) you could not determine the note value of the inside notes because the flags would run together.

Maybe there is someone out there that will submit a clearer and different explanation.

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 05 May 1997

Note flags will always point to the inside of a group of beamed notes regardless of the note combinations. I don't see a problem unless someone else points out some technical reason that it should be otherwise. It would look strange to have a flag on either end of the beamed notes pointing away from the center of the beamed notes.


#133: Ragtime, Dixieland, and Popular Music from 1890-1930
Ragtime, Dixieland, and Popular Music from 1890-1930

(133)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net> on 06 May 1997

I have notated about 50 songs of the period 1890-1930 which cover ragtime, dixieland, and popular music of the period. If you are interested in obtaining some of my notated arrangement then send me an E-Mail request and I will E-Mail you a listing of songs available and how they were notated and how they may be used as a learning tool for instrument players.

Reply 1 offered by: Chuck Geyer on 24-Nov-1997

Sometime mid to late 1988, we expect to assist in forming a dixieland band. Kindly provide information re music from the era you advertise. We obviously have no budget as yet, so just seeking information at this time. Thanks!!

Reply 2 offered by: Dustin Horrillo on 24-Feb-1998

Can you please send me some notes or even some essays of the History of French Chamber music 1890 to 1930. As i am doing a music project on that era. Thank you I will apriciate you response as soon as possible.

My e mail address is astor@gibnynex.gi
If you don't mind this information ergues me, i mean its quite important for me. It is very urgent for me and for my project. Thank you D. Horrillo

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 24-Feb-1998

Altavista popped this up at number 29. Have you also tried Yahoo!, which lets you search by subject. Also, some of the larger CD shops on the net have explanations/reviews of musical genres. You could also try the newsgroup rec.arts.music.classical. Have you been to a library?

Links I found:
LA VIE DE CHATEAU : LE XIXth AND LES ARTS DECORATIFS LE XIXth AND LES ARTS DECORATIFS. Nineteenth Century France the Historical Setting. The Decorative Arts in Nineteenth-Century France. The Evolution of...
http://www.cfce.fr/chateau/anglais/chp6_f.htm
Unfortunately, the link was dead, but the info may be out there somewhere.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Jeremy Hasenbuhler on 14-May-1998

I need info on ragtime for a project

Reply 5 offered by: Betty Nordstrom on 02-Sep-1998

One of my adopted daughters asked for music from the 30's
or 40's about "Pink Elephants" because her grandmother used
to sing it to her when she was a little girl. She asked if
I could find it on the Net. I have some words to it.
"Yesterday a traveling salesman came to my house.
He was just as timid and nervous as a mouse.
He said "I'd been to a party, didn't break up till four.
When I woke up this morning what do you think I saw?
Pink Elephants on the ceiling,
Pink Elephants on the chair,
Pink Elephants in the doorway,
Pink Elephants everywhere."
There are other verses but she doesn't remember much.
We would like to get this in sheet music or just the verses
if possible. We would appreciate any help or suggestions
you might have. Thank You very much.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Sep-1998

To briefly summarize previous traffic on this subject... See http://www.lyrics.com and/or http://www.lyrics.ch

Reply 7 offered by: John Micklos on 11-Mar-2000

I am looking for sheet music to a song called "FIGITS" don't know who wrote it, I used to play it in school band about 25yrs ago

Reply 8 offered by: ralph tait on 07-Nov-2000

I'm looking for sheet music for "banjo pickers ball". My father is an avid player and he would like to find the music for his small combo to play.I have looked through many web sights and have had no luck. Thanks.


#134: Creating a multiple movement piece
Creating a multiple movement piece

(134)

Submitted by: Alex trent (Alex@trent.powernet-int.co.uk) on 11 May 1997

I'm trying to open a second movement.

At present, all I can spot is a SECTION END and SECTION START bar line.

How do I leave a decent GAP in the score to publish it correctly? My concern is notation rather than MIDI performance - I need to issue parts to artists to play.

Reply 1 offered by: J.C. on 09-Jan-1998

You are not the only one with this problem. :)
I have always found it easier to simply keep each movement
as a seperate file.


#136: Maximum number of staffs?
Maximum number of staffs?

(136)

Submitted by: Jos Briers on 14 May 1997

I didn't found this in the help-file: Is there a maximum number of staffs that can be set in in a single piece of music? I got a GPF after trying to put in 10 staffs (I wanted to put the different theme-parts on different staffs for a study).

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20 May 1997

A song can have up to 255 staves, but only about 30 can be displayed at a time. Beyon 30 parts, you will need to create multiple partitions with the parts.

When you get a GPF, write down the address of the fault, and then write us at support. If possible, attach the file that causes the failure. This helps us to tighten the system in an effort to avoid future GPFs.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings gillings@gidday.enet.dec.com on 14 May 1997

Since I'm primarily interested in concert band arrangements, the ability to handle a large number of staffs was one of my deciding factors in choosing NoteWorthy. Although it can only *display* 32 staffs, there seems to be no limit to the number you can define (apart from system resources). I've got a file with around 40 staves and had no trouble creating about 10 more. I was able to print 20 staves at a time without any difficulty.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 14 May 1997

Hmm. Just tried it on my version (1.31b for Win95) and was still going strong at about 30 staffs!

Which version are you using and which operating system?

Andrew

PS: Even with the old systems (1.30 something), I've been able to import the Barber of Seville midi which has about 13 staves. (Scratches head and frowns).

Reply 4 offered by: Jos Briers (jos.briers@ibm.net) on 15 May 1997

I'm using 1.31b on Windows 3.11. I was doing some odd things: The first line was a normal piece of music (16 bars) The next lines were the parts of which the music was composed without putting the clef again in front. When I tried to "preview print" this it once worked but returned with a GPF. I removed some stafs (until only 10 remained) and got the same thing but this time after returning from the "print" action. I got a print but it lacked 2 of the staffs. I know this is not a normal way of using NWC. Maybe thats why it failed.

I didn't know of the 32-limit. Nice to know how to circumvent it. Jos

Reply 5 offered by: Bob Lim (lim@nca.bbc.co.uk) on 14 May 1997

I was wondering when someone would raise this one. When importing the Dukas "Sorcerer's Apprentice" midi (39 staves) the system would only display (and scroll between) 32 staves in the finished .nwc file. However, it still played all the staves. I solved the problem by putting the strings into a separate "strings" partition and was then able to work on each and every staff at will. I agree that 32 is probably a practical limit as far as ease of editing is concerned, but I think this should be stated somewhere... (where are you, Eric?)


#137: Sustain (peddle on/off) notation in score printouts
Sustain (peddle on/off) notation in score printouts

(137)

Submitted by: Kevin_Gene_Pammett@Bigfoot.com on 14 May 1997

I imported a .mid file and have subsequently mucked with the score (a lot), but am now finding that the Sustain (peddle on/off) notation really "messes up" the score printouts.

Is it true that if I delete the notation throughout the score that the music will not sound the same in playback?

Assuming yes, I don't want to do that. But I would like to be able to print the score without taking up space for that. Can I ? That is, is it true that the spacing of the score will be differernt without this notation ?

Final question: am I right that this is the proper way to ask a question like this... as opposed to the MailTo link on the Web page where (I assume) the question just goes directly to NoteWorthy support ?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 15 May 1997

>>>Is it true that if I delete the [Pedal] notation throughout the score that the music will not sound the same in playback? <<<

Yes, so long as your midi box is implementing pedal ups and downs. One thing you may want to try (I am not certain this will work, depending upon whether pedals on one channel affect another channel) is this:

Move all the pedal markings onto another staff, (this is a very tedious process depending upon how complicated your pedalling is). Then you can just exclude that staff from printing. Now IF the Pedalling is not global (I _think_ this is MIDI box specific) you could tell that staff to map onto the same channel (midi tab in Staff Properties) as the original staff.

>>>is it true that the spacing of the score will be differernt without this notation ?<<<

Probably yes, though it may not be a big difference, depending upon the number of Pedal markings. You could probably insert a single or double space (using the Text command) to pad things out if you need. The pedal markings ARE important to anyone who wants to play the piece as you would like it to be played (Heathen that I am, I normally pedal where I like :-P )

>>>Final question: am I right that this is the proper way to ask a question like this... as opposed to the MailTo link on the Web page where (I assume) the question just goes directly to NoteWorthy support ? <<< Eric would certainly answer this question (I hope!) if you e-mailed him, and may eventually answer it here next time he visits the forum. The forum just lets nosey parkers like me get in first ;-)

Regards,

Andrew

PC Users Group, Canberra, Users Helping Users

Reply 2 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 15 May 1997

If you want to add sustain pedal instructions for playback purposes only, then the best way is by placing them in a separate staff that uses the same MIDI channel. You can even make an exact copy of the other staff, including all of the notes, and then insert the pedal marks where needed. By then muting this staff, all the note events will no longer play from this second staff, but the pedal marks will still be passed to the MIDI channel.

In your case, I would make a duplicate copy of your staff before removing any pedal marks (this is easy with Copy and Paste). Make the duplicate staff use the same MIDI device and channel, and then mark it as Muted. Now remove the pedal marks from the original staff. Play back will still include the pedal instructions from the Muted staff, as the mute only disables the notes, not the other items.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#138: Keyboard Entry
Keyboard Entry

(138)

Submitted by: Charles Givre on 14 May 1997

I have a Yamaha CS1x keyboard with a Midiman 2x2 interface. Noteworthy does not play or record when I set Midiman as the output device. I have checked all the connections several times, and the configuration in Noteworthy. I am stuck. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Charles Givre

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 15 May 1997

Hi Charles:

I am not sure of the cause of your problem. My advice would be to concentrate on playback first, then try to get recording working. Are you using Windows 3.1 or Windows 95? What device drivers are listed in the "available devices" box in the NWC MIDI tab of Options? Are you using both a sound card and a separate MIDI card? If so, there may be IRQ conflicts between the two. In general, I suggest trying one device at a time in the NWC "Devices used by playback" list, and see if you can get one of them to play back to your external keyboard. I can confirm that, when set up properly, NWC willl happily send and recive MIDI events to an external device. May users are now taking advantage of this. The trick is to get your system configured properly.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 15 May 1997

Charles,

>>>I have a Yamaha CS1x keyboard with a Midiman 2x2 interface. Noteworthy does not play or record when I set Midiman as the output device. <<< Does anything else play back on your midi keyboard? (eg MPLAYER). Check in "Common Questions" (two up from Forum in the menu on the left) for the question "How do I get my songs to play back?" Most times, things won't play back in Noteworthy because they won't play back ANY midi at all.

>>>I have checked all the connections several times, and the configuration in Noteworthy. <<< Testing with another player will confirm whether your connections and system config are okay. If so, check the MIDI tab in Noteworthy's Tools | Options dialog. The devices used in play back are in the RIGHT column.

Are you using MIDI Mapper, or the direct midi output? If you are using midi mapper, make sure that it is configured properly via the control panel. This should have shown up above, though.

If that works, then maybe the song you are playing has different port settings for the instruments. These are found in the MIDI tab in Staff Properties (assuming your using the latest version of NWC, otherwise "edit" the staff from the Score Builder).

If you get all that working for playback, and recording still doesn't work, in Tools | Options, make sure that port usage is always on, so that NWC will read from the MIDI In port all the time.

Hope this makes sense. If not, read it a couple of times. If it still doesn't, e-mail me.

Regards,

Andrew

PC Users Group Canberra - Users Helping Users

Reply 3 offered by: Kelly McKenna on 27-Jan-1998

What do I need to hook up a MIDI keyboard to my IBM
Thinkpad 360 laptop. I don't have a sound card and
therefore don't have a MIDI interface. I can buy a sound
card via PCMCIA slot but they don't have a MIDI connector/cable/interface. Please help.


#139: BUGS
BUGS

(139)

Submitted by: Nigel Pendrey (ndp@globalnet.co.uk on 16 May 1997

I have found two possible problems with version 1.31b. 1. The double lined left bracket in the orchestral partition is now reduced to one line. 2. When loading an NWC file wriiten with a previous version, occasionally whole bar rests (i.e. semibreves) in three four time are misread as minim rests. This can be corrected by replacing the rest with one representing the true rest i.e. a dotted minim, 3 crotchet rests etc. It would be nice and more correct to write a whole bar rest in any time signiture with a semibreve rest.

Has anyone else had problems here?

Suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20 May 1997

As I mentioned in my reply to your email of the same subject, I do not understand your point #1. As for point 2, the first thing to try is the Refresh command on the View menu. In general, a whole rest that appears alone in a bar will assume the value of a whole bar based on the time signature.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Neeraj Mathur prsnhome@gncom.com on 20 May 1997

For point 1: In an empty file create a new staff. Note that at the very beginning of that staff there are two lines. Now change that staff's appearance to from standard to orchestral in the properties dialogue (I beleive it is in the tab marked "Visual" or something like that). You will notice that the two lines have been reduced to one. If you open up an old file, made with the previous version that already has it in orchestral format, you will see that there are two lines. If you add a new staff to this file and make it orchestral though, it will show only one line. If you change one of those old staves to standard and then back to orchestral, you have the same problem. In a proper score fro a publisher, though, there will always be two lines. I beleive that this is the problem trying to be described earlier.

Neeraj Mathur


#140: Copy to .bmp
Copy to .bmp

(140)

Submitted by: don@ccti.net on 17 May 1997

I recently upgraded my computer to Win95. I have also upgraded tothe new 1.31 NoteWorthy Composer. In the Win3.1 version when in print preview screen, I was able to click on "copy" and was given a dialog that saved a HUGE file to disk. On this new version, when I click on copy, a file is saved to the clipboard. The resolution of the file saved to the clipboard is very low. Lines in the staff become double width while others disappear completely. I almost want to pull out the diskette and load the old version back in. Any suggestions? Also, the help button on the print dialog says "The topic does not exist. Contact your vendor for an updated help file. (129)"

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20 May 1997

The Copy command in Print Preview is different between the 16-bit and 32-bit editions. In the 16-bit program you can select between bitmap, WMF, or clipboard graphics. In the 32-bit edition, you get the clipboard format (which is essentially WMF format). The 32-bit edition has always worked this way.

By the way, the clipboard format is not a low resolution. It is, in fact, just the opposite. Unlike bitmaps, a metafile is not subject to distortion as the size changes. Unfortunately, programs do not always expand and contract the metafile in a way that avoids distortion. In these cases, the 16-bit program can be used to build the *.BMP files, provided your system has enough memory to handle it.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 19 May 1997

Don said: <<<In the Win3.1 version when in print preview screen, I was able to click on "copy" and was given a dialog that saved a HUGE file to disk.>>> That was the bitmap, right?

<<<On this new version, when I click on copy, a file is saved to the clipboard. The resolution of the file saved to the clipboard is very low. Lines in the staff become double width while others disappear completely.>>>

Hmm. From what I've seen of how NWC works now, they dropped the save-to-bitmap from the 32 bit version. I guess NWC wanted to let the user sort it out by pasting pictures (being sets of drawing commands as opposed to a raster image) into their programs (or whatever). The nice thing about this new method of drawings is that they are scaleable. The nasty thing seems to be that if you ungroup them, they no longer work. I've tried it in both Corel Draw 4 and Word 97. Neither seem to keep the lines together properly. This hasn't bothered me too much since I don't use this method anyway.

Alex's suggestion was really cool! Didn't know that trick! (btw: have you had the cliboard viewer open and maximised and tried it?!!! ;-)

If you a copying just a small amount of stuff, try selecting it and using special copy. The usefulness of these suggestions will depend on why you are actually copying, anyway. ie what size snippets you want.

<<<Also, the help button on the print dialog says "The topic does not exist. Contact your vendor for an updated help file. (129)>>>

Let Eric know directly at support@ntworthy.com

Regards,

Andrew

PCUG Canberra, Users Helping Users

Reply 3 offered by: Alex Trent on 17 May 1997

Quick & Dirty answer:

Try Alt plus Print Screen, then PASTE into (eg) Paintshop Pro (www.shareware.com).

Probably a better answer lurks somewhere, but better than nothing.

Also an EXCELLENT method for fault reporting - you can send your screendumps as (eg) a word document with embedded stuff!


#141: Fiendish Accuracy in Recording from MIDI
Fiendish Accuracy in Recording from MIDI

(141)

Submitted by: Alex Trent (alex@trent.powernet-int.co.uk) on 17 May 1997

I've just acquired a MIDI keyboard, and am amazed at the horrible accuracy when recording my playing

Is there a way of "suggesting" that a bit of tempo rubato is appropriate? How do I avoid my slight tempo slips giving me demi hemi demi semi quavers(!?)

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20 May 1997

You have two options:

1 - Change the Import note and rest resolution options. this will also impact your other import operations, so be advised.

2 - Manually import your recorded performances from the Import Recording command on the Staff menu. This will let you specify the resolution that best matches your last performance. This also is good to use if you want to fine tune the import of your last recorded performance, but do not want to re-perform it.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 19 May 1997

Alex said <<<I've just acquired a MIDI keyboard, and am amazed at the horrible accuracy when recording my playing>>>

This is a function mainly of speed of response of your computer, I guess coupled with lag times and also human beings' tendency not to play exactly like clockwork. I actually went back to manual input for most things, though MIDI keyboard is superb for notating arpeggios and chords.

<<<Is there a way of "suggesting" that a bit of tempo rubato is appropriate? How do I avoid my slight tempo slips giving me demi hemi demi semi quavers(!?) >>>

YES! That is, if I understand your question. You want your "near enough" (timewise) notes to notate exactly, right? In Tools | Options, there is an Import Tab which is used by the record function (record actually records firstly into a "raw" midi stream, and then imports that stream). Simply adjust the note resolution to what you feel is the best compromise between accuracy and embarrassment! ;-) If you're only getting hemi demi semi quavers, then you shouldn't have to adjust too far!

Regards,

Andrew


#142: Editing Text
Editing Text

(142)

Submitted by: Harold on 21 May 1997

How do you edit text that has been entered above the staff, e.g., chord symbols, instructions, etc.?

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 21 May 1997

Items can be edited individually. You must first select just the one item, and then press Ctrl+E, or the Edit Selection command. If the item does not preserve its width, you need to select only the diamond that appears to its left. In these cases, selection is best done with the computer keyboard using the Shift key (hold it down) while moving forward or back across ther one item using the arrow keys.

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com


#144: Double Beaming (Dumbie Question #2:))
Double Beaming (Dumbie Question #2:))

(144)

Submitted by: Harold on 21 May 1997

How about beaming BOTH voices on a staff? I seem to be able to only beam either the top voice or the bottom voice in a "chord" (intersecting voices). Thank you. I'm reading the help files furiously so I don't ask too many dumb newbie q's.

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 21 May 1997

I assume you mean the beaming of chords which have opposing note stems. At the present time NWC will not beam both stem directions. Being able to beam opposing note stems would be a good upgrade suggestion.


#145: Multiplets and Glissando
Multiplets and Glissando

(145)

Submitted by: Tim Reichard on 21 May 1997

Another suggestion for the next upgrade of NoteWorthy Composer is for it to support duplets, quadruplets, quintuplets, etc. It is currently rather annoying to notate, for example, a sixteenth note quintuplet by entering a sixteenth note and four dotted thirty-second notes--and you cannot place a 5 above the group without breaking the beams! Furthermore, it is just as annoying to import a piece that contains eighth note triplets, since they are interpreted as a dotted sixteenth note, sixteenth, dotted sixteenth group. This makes for a very jerky playback, especially at a slow tempo. Fixing this problem may also make glissandos easier to notate, whether they appear as multiplets, or better, with a diagonal wavy line connected the initial and final notes. Finally, these multiplets ought to be able to beamed to other groups, e.g., a sixteenth note triplet beamed to two sixteenth notes for a 4/4 piece. I hope that others would appreciate these changes and that they will be considered in the next upgrade.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 30 May 1997

Tim said: and you cannot place a 5 above the group without breaking the beams!

This is indeed a pain. One thing you CAN do as a workaround, is add the text before the quintuplet, turn off preserve width (who doesn't?) and pad out to the right with spaces.

Furthermore, it is just as annoying to import a piece that contains eighth note...

I encountered this problem a long time ago (er hem...) and work around it by using a Recorder macro. The macro is a series of keystrokes which adjusts the incorrectly timed triplet to the correct timing. (I called it "Tripletize").

Recorder was created by Microsoft in Windows 3.0 but is no longer supported in Win 95. However, it still exists as a legacy file if you upgraded from 3.1 to Win 95. Otherwise, scan the web for some other macroing facility. If you have Recorder, look in the "Users Tricks and Tips" page for my .REC file which has the required macro

I hope that others would appreciate these changes...

I hope so too.

Regards,

Andrew


#146: Text author name
Text author name

(146)

Submitted by: Jeffrey DeLay on 21 May 1997

Is there a way to print the name of the lyric author at its traditional place to the upper-left of the score, under the title?

Reply 1 offered by: Ooh. Ooh! Another solution! (Nope, forget it) on 30 May 1997

How about simply putting both all on the one line with a huge lot of spaces between one and the other so that it LOOKS like the lyricist is on the left hand side?

Aw SPIT!

Just tried it and the composer doesn't have enough space to do it (48 characters in total).

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 30 May 1997

Whilst we're at quick fixes for more flexibility, if you're finding importing into word processors a little hard, you may want to try double printing onto a page. It may even be quicker in the long run.

Print out your normal title page. Now measure where the new title info should go. Now mock that up in your favourite word processor or presentation program. Now print it on the original piece of paper. Barring the inevitable problems with trying this method (misalignment, paper the wrong way round, cooking the paper if it's a laser printer, smearing the ink otherwise, the possibilities are endless...) your should now have the correct info in the correct spot.

Andrew

PS: An extension of this method, would be to print out one's score, and then use some graphics package to create all the markups that are missing on that page and run it through. (Sigh) What a lot of work! I thought computers were supposed to SAVE time!

Reply 3 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 22 May 1997

In addition to the route suggested by Dan Ferguson, you can also deselect title info for printing, create an image of the score instead of printing, and then bring up the copy as a graphic into your wordprocessor. You can then add the title and other information there. Hope that helps.

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net> on 21 May 1997

It is not possible to do what you want in NWC Song Author Info. One way to do it that I have used on occasion is to make the Title, words by, and music by on a word processor where you can format the the information as a heading to the music. You would have to set the top margin of your word processor to conform to the space required for the staff printing, print a page with the information, and then reinsert the page with the headings back into the printer and print the score. I find in some instances that I can print more staffs on a page with this technique.

Reply 5 offered by: Anne O'Malley@hud.gov on 02 Jul 1997

In addition to the many good suggestions - I have used Powerpoint and just pasted the score copied from NWC Print Preview. You can control the size of the score and use the graphical capabilities of Powerpoint to add any notation you wish including titles, authors, etc. Only thing I have found is that in order for the score to print properly NWC must be running in the background.

Reply 6 offered by: Ian Samson on 24-Mar-2000

Is there any way to edit the Copyright information after it has been created on a new file? What happens if one has made a spelling mistaek and one wants to go back afterwards to corrkt them?

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Mar-2000

In the File menu click on Info.
If that's what you mean.

Reply 8 offered by: Sue Morton on 24-Mar-2000

Re: Putting more info up in the "title" areas.

A reasonable workaround can be effected by using the 'insert text' command on the top staff. You can define your own size with one of the user font options.

Which measure to insert the text at, and how high up the staff, just has to be experimented with. You can place the author and lyricist info just where you want it with a little trial and error.

HTH,

Sue

Reply 9 offered by: Blair Dowden on 24-Mar-2000

The 1.70 Beta can make inserting titles easier by using the new text alignment options (eg. Center or Right justified).


#147: Click and drag notes to pitch
Click and drag notes to pitch

(147)

Submitted by: Kevin T. Kelly on 21 May 1997

When editing imported music, I like to use the mouse (or pen) to drag notes into place, or click and drag them off to the garbage.

Also, in addition to a menu bar, I would like an option to place a note on a ledger line, followed by a pop-up menu of durations, so that entry is more fluid.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Bacher on 28 May 1997

Please don't implement this, except perhaps as a user option. One of the main reasons I chose NoteWorthy over other software was that the click and drag paradigm made it nearly impossible for me to enter music. Every time I clicked on a note in Brand X notator, it would change the pitch or the duration; or I would click in between notes and it would insert notes and change the surrounding notes. NWC's paradigm is much cleaner and simpler.

On the topic of changing the duration of a note after you enter it, it's easy in NWC; just select the note(s) and click (or type) the desired duration value on it/them.

- seb


#148: Copyright Symbol information
Copyright Symbol information

(148)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 22 May 1997

For those of you that might be interested in the rules and how-to's of copyrighting your song should check out web site http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/circs/circ01.html#pon>;


#150: Keyboard entry with SB16
Keyboard entry with SB16

(150)

Submitted by: Meg Doyle on 24 May 1997

I am having some trouble setting up my keyboard with a SB16 card. When I record all I get is a load of rubbish, and I cannot get the single note option to work at all.

I ahve contacted NW support and they suggested getting hold of the latest driver, which I have done. They also suggested checking the midi input. I used the echo feature, with the keyboard sound switched off, to put the keyboard oouput on to the sound card.

This also produced a load of rubbish. If a single key was pressed a note sounded, but not the right one. If I pressed the same note repeatedly I got different notes. If I held a note down until it had stopped sounding I frequently, not always, got a note when I relsed the key.

Does anyone know a solution to this? Your help would be much appreciated.

PS My system is a DX266 with 16Mb ram running W95.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

Meg: I hope you have been able to resolve the problem on your system Just to reiterate, this clearly sounds like either a software driver problem, or just as likely, a hardware problem or failure. The failure may be in the card otself, the cables connecting the keyboard to the card, or in the keyboard. In general, you will need to test each piece independently until the source of the problem is isolated.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)


#151: Controlling Width and Number of Measures per Line?
Controlling Width and Number of Measures per Line?

(151)

Submitted by: John Wendt : j_wendt@acm.org on 25 May 1997

Can I control the printed width of measures? Specifically, can I get NWC 1.31b (32-bit) to print exactly four measures on each line, each the same width? For teaching beginning violin students, this is pretty important. If a measure is narrower than the rest, they think they can go faster...

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 30 May 1997

In version 1.31, the File | Page Setup dialog has a switch saying "Increase note spacing for notes of longer durations". Make sure that is checked.

The other thing you can do (which becomes extremely tedious) is add spaces as Text. These of course should have the Preserve Width attribute turned ON. These will pad out notes. They give you fairly good control, but are very tedious to put in, check, adjust, check, add some more...

Andrew


#152: Cue notes for other instruments
Cue notes for other instruments

(152)

Submitted by: Jim Lendvay, Coventry, CT on 25 May 1997

I use NoteWorthy Composer to write for my brass quintet and often wish to show "other" parts as cues. For instance, I would show a trumpet cue on a trombone part to help the trombonist with an entrance after a long period of rests.

Cues are labelled with the name of the instrument playing them, and are about half the size of normal notes.

Is there a way to make this happen in Composer?

If not, I would find this a useful enhancement in future versions.

Thanks,

Jim L.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 01 Jun 1997

Jim said: <<< Cues are labelled with the name of the instrument playing them, and are about half the size of normal notes.

Is there a way to make this happen in Composer? >>>

In short, no. I've been thinking about this problem as it is very similar to the "small type" problem I've been trying to solve from within NWC for "Trills, Glissandi Etc" (the generic name for an ongoing request that I'm sure Eric would love to see the end of).

You could try using some sort of metafile reading editor to superimpose slightly shrunk snippets onto your score. The only problem then being that the lines in the score will be slightly closer together. However, this may suffice.

As with most of my suggestions, this is very fiddly :-)

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Alex Trent (Alex@trent.powernet-int.co.uk) on 31 May 1997

You aren't going to like the "solution":

Copy the relevant parts to a muted stave which is mostly REST filled, and annotate with Insert Text (checking the preserve/don't preserve width parts

You aren't going to get a partially shrunk print (Yet, please Eric - or I mean: "Soon, please Eric"

Put this on the Wish List page!


#153: MIDI MIDI MIDI Aaaaah!
MIDI MIDI MIDI Aaaaah!

(153)

Submitted by: Damon Youn (masapo@hotmail.com) on 26 May 1997

You know what? After using Noteworthy Composer, I discovered that composing using a score sheet is MUCH MUCH more complicated than I thought. I also found out that MIDI files are more complicated than I thought. Sheesh.

At least I learned A LOT about composing on score sheets.

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 26 May 1997

Composing to a blank score is always difficult at first, but I've been using Noteworthy Composer now for 2 months, and I've got to say I've never found a notating program that's easier to use. I churned out a full score of Thick as a Brick, by Jethro Tull in the equivalent of about 15 hours. It can't get much easier than that!

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 30 May 1997

Adam said:

<<<I churned out a full score of Thick as a Brick, by Jethro Tull in the equivalent of about 15 hours. It can't get much easier than that!>>>

Man! I'd be VERY interested to see that! I LOVE Thick as a Brick! I rank it with Stand Up, Aqualung and Songs From the Wood as my favs.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Mike on 11-Dec-2001

i found this site on google so i have no idea how mew this is or anything but i was looking for the full midi of thick as a brick. and a copy of it would be greatly appreciated. i need to learn the entire song on keyboard soon and i'm looking for the sheet music or a midi. if you wouldn't mind sparing me a few minutes of your time i would love a copy.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 11-Dec-2001

Mike,

you'll find TAAB on the scriptorium site : http://www.vadu.com/cgi-bin/nwc/txt2html.cgi?src=rock/tulltaab.txt . There is also Passion Play : search the scripto for them.

The score is in NWC format, and you can download free NWPlayer or NWPlug-in. A plug-in for Winamp is also available!! You can even download NWComposer and try it, and see how wonderful that tool is!

HTH,
Marsu (happy reg'd user of NWC)

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 11-Dec-2001

Oops! Forgot the link for NWComposer :^)


#154: Adding an instrument??
Adding an instrument??

(154)

Submitted by: Adam Pringle on 26 May 1997

How do I add an instrument? apringle@hotmail.com

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 30 May 1997

Adam said:

<<<How do I add an instrument?>>>

If you're using version 1.31, you press the [+] button.

If you're using an earlier version, you should probably upgrade.

Basic questions are answered rather well in the NWC help file.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: David on 20-Oct-1997

No-one answers basic questions when it comes to computer
sound (or so it seems). I'm a bassist and I love NWC
because I don't have to be a Keyboards/synth player to
write music on my computer. I too, would like to add new
sounds to my instrument list but what is a bank? Is it a
collection of patches? What is the difference between a
patch and an instrument? What is a channel? Is it the
same as a track? What's the difference. What is polyphony?
How does all this relate to the "voices" my sound card is
supposed to have. The real question is 'Where do I learn?"


#155: Pitch Bend
Pitch Bend

(155)

Submitted by: Neeraj Mathur prsnhome@gncom.com on 26 May 1997

Is it possible to do a pitch bend in NoteWorthy? I do not understand how to use the mpc command, and the help file doesn't make it much easier. How would I, for example, go from middle C to the C above it in 1 beat? 2beats? 1/2 a beat?

Thanks.

Neeraj Mathur

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 30 May 1997

Neeraj said: <<<Is it possible to do a pitch bend in NoteWorthy?>>>

yes.

<<<I do not understand how to use the mpc command, and the help file doesn't make it much easier.>>>

The numbers in the mpc pitch bend dialog (-8192...8192) correspond to standard MIDI pitch control parameters. These are actually defined on your midi box (normally the Global Pitch Bend) which can be modified normally with some sort of SysEx (System Exclusive) command.

Most Pitch Bend range will default to to 2 semitones in either direction (so you can normally pitch bend from 2 semitones below to to semitones above).

<<<How would I, for example, go from middle C to the C above it in 1 beat? 2beats? 1/2 a beat?>>>

You can't. But most midi boxes can't do it either unless you can change the Global Pitch Bend). This is more correctly implemented as portamento, a great little effect from the old monophonic synths of the 70's.

Best simulation is to use an instrument of very smooth attack and just do a very fast run of semitones up (or down). Someone did a fabulously worked version of Tubular Bells using this (as well as many other) really nifty work around.

Regards,

Andrew


#156: Drum Notation
Drum Notation

(156)

Submitted by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 27 May 1997

Would you like to print out a part for a kit drummer in a readable form. NWC 13.1 now allows you to separate the kit (B2-B4) from the latin stuff (C5 and above). If you have a copy of QBasic in your DOS directory I have a small program that will make the conversion from midi notes to standard notes in a few seconds. If you would like a copy drop me an Enote - bargrah@hotmail.com

Reply 1 offered by: Paul Ingrey on 24-Nov-1997

We can do drumscore with NWC! I've tried but not to sucessfully due to lack of symbols for cymbals/closed hi hat etc. can I have a copy of your programme?

Reply 2 offered by: dennis on 12-Feb-1998

please send that file seeya

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Feb-1998

It is unlikely that Barry will see responses to this post. You may want to use direct email, per his message.

Reply 4 offered by: kentd dugan on 13-Feb-1998

He'll see it. He's an NWC junkie, like the rest of us.

Reply 5 offered by: justin bishop on 22-Mar-1998

I am a beginer drummer and i nedd free notation wich i can actually read .

do you now of any more links on the www ?

Reply 6 offered by: Eelke on 24-Mar-1998

Would you please send me some information about the notation
of drums?
I can't find any software for this, but it must exists!

thanks,

Reply 7 offered by: Eelke on 24-Mar-1998

I've just got exactly the same problem. If you got any solutions please send
me an E-mail. You would help me very much.

yours sincerely

Eelke

Reply 8 offered by: Srdjan Ajkalo on 28-Apr-1998

If anybody have an idea of notation of rudiments
(I'm not sure about the name in English) please
send it to me.

Bye.

Reply 9 offered by: Regal on 15-Jun-1998

Send me the file please
thankx
regal

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 16-Jun-1998

Interested too :-)

Reply 11 offered by: Ray on 30-May-2000

Hello,
I am looking for a site that sells VERY cheap cymbals but i cant seem to find one i only need 2 cymbals (a splash & a ride ) But i cant find any....can someone send me a URL...please...thanks :)


#157: crescendo and decrescendo signs for PostScript printers
crescendo and decrescendo signs for PostScript printers

(157)

Submitted by: marsupilami@ThePentagon.com (redirected to my office) on 29 May 1997

I finally found a solution to make NWC print what I need, namely the '<' and '>' designs. The solution I adopted is to use 'magic strings' which are '[<' and '=]', '[=' and '>]' respectively. Then I print the score to a postscript file, using the print manager (select typically any postscript printer, I use HP LaserJet IIIP (which I don't have) and in Options specify 'redirect into postscript file'). Then I use a script which replaces the magic strings into correct postscript instructions (moveto, lineto, stroke), "et voila". The current limitation is : it does work under Unix. I'm working on make it work under Dos/Windows. (Note that copying the result to the 'prn' file under a Dos session works perfectly well). For more information (and if you're intersted in the script (uses sh, vi and bc) email me. I think I'll put it on one of my pages soon. Well, for non-postscript printers, if someone has documentation on PCL... !

NWCly yours, Dominique 'MAD' Portier (happy reg. user)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 30 May 1997

Dear Eric,

I hope you take note of the extraordinary lengths some of us will go to to keep using Noteworthy Composer!

It is a great product which some of us really like, but these short-comings keep coming back up.

However, given your track record of response to user-input, I'm confident that these things will come. Just, PLEASE MAKE IT SOON! ;-)

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Bacher on 04 Jun 1997

I just want to echo Andrew Purdam's comment.

NWC is a great product, and I recommend it to people on the 'net whenever I can. It's worth having to kludge up the missing bells and whistles - up to a point. Without making the product as expensive as Finale or Encore, it should be easy to make it even more powerful. Here's to that!

- seb

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 07-Jul-2000

As badly stated in msg #166 , the correct link for the (updated) page is:
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/cresdecr.html

If you got troubles, please tell me so! I'll try to fix this asap.
After boxmarks though.

HTH,

Marsu


#159: Staff length and layout
Staff length and layout

(159)

Submitted by: Moray McConnachie <cerberus@ermine.ox.ac.uk> on 03 Jun 1997

Is there any easy way to put the staff equivalent of a new paragraph into the score? I am doing some liturgical settings, very short sequences, and I need each sequence to begin on a new line. I have experimented with blank text entries, but this is unsatisfactory because the staff continues on to the end of the line, after the music, and after the section close. All advice gratefully received. Yours, Moray McConnachie

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 04 Jun 1997

Moray, if your sequences are REALLY short, perhaps you could try pasting snippet-by-snippet into some sort of Picture compatible word processor (M$ Word springs to mind as an example).

Select your snippet, and then use Edit | Copy Special. You can then specify if you want to copy just one staff or all of them. Then just paste into your WP doc and arrange as you wish.

The next step (listening, Eric?) would be for Noteworthy Composer to register itself as an OLE server, and then we would side-step the book-keeping nightmare this method creates.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Pahaska@ibm.net on 03 Jun 1997

I second this request. In transcribing music for our banjo club, I would like to have the ability to insert a break so that the chorus is separate and distinct. i.e. I would like not only a staff break function, but even a page break as well so that I can put the chorus on a separate page if doing so doesn't result in excess pages.

I realize that I can provide a page break between verse and chorus by using two separate scores, but this results in a very complex library to maintain. nightmare.


#162: Re: Staff Length and Layout
Re: Staff Length and Layout

(162)

Submitted by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 03 Jun 1997

Staff Length - If you mean the staff extends to the full width of the page - click off extend last system in the Page Layout dialogue. About requiring sections starting on separate lines - if you intend to print the full score in sections - create it that way and print each separately, adjusting page numbers and omitting titles as required. If you intend to produce individual parts with sections starting on a separate line - then try Cut Special and paste into software like Microsoft Publisher. You may have to add closing bar lines using the Line Tool in Pub to finish of a staff. Hope I understood!


#163: Can you BEAM across a rest
Can you BEAM across a rest

(163)

Submitted by: Stuart Rance on 04 Jun 1997

I could do this with two beamed notes, then a rest and then two more beamed notes but it looks much better with the 4 notes beamed together and a rest in the middle.

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 05 Jun 1997

No. that subject is discussed in the BEAM NOTE COMMAND in the NWC help file


#164: Can a tie cross a change of time signature?
Can a tie cross a change of time signature?

(164)

Submitted by: Stuart Rance on 04 Jun 1997

Subject explains it all! If I try to tie together two notes which have a change of time signature in between then the notes are tied to the time signature.

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 05 Jun 1997

As an example notate 4 quarter notes in 4/4 time in measure 1. In measure 2 notate 4 eighth notes. Tie the last quarter note in measure 1 to the first eight note in measure 2. Insert 2/4 time at beginning of measure 2. Note how the tie curve(s) are shown. Looks funny but seems to play correctly timewise. The answer is YES in my opinion if you don't object to the way it looks on the screen or printout.


#165: Changing TeXt font & size
Changing TeXt font & size

(165)

Submitted by: jon.featherstone@medtronic.com on 06 Jun 1997

I regularly inclue guitar chords with my music, and am surprised that there seems to be no way to change the font or size of the text when using the TeXt option. The default is too large, and complicated chords that change every note run into each other (eg: Fm7/C F#dim/E). Suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson<mrbanjo@bright.net> on 09 Jun 1997

Several chord symbols can be entered in the TEXT expression box. The entries are shown in a fixed position above the note/staff. In some instances the group of chord symbols will overlap to the next measure. LYRIC entries below the staff increase the distance between notes depending upon the word length. If only a whole note is involved in the measure than pad a line of periods (.............) to force the measure to increase its width to include the chord symbols. In other words use lyric words and/or padded periods (...........)as a way to increase the horizontal distance between notes. You may have to tweak both the TEXT expression and the LYRIC line to obtain the best lineup.

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net> on 06 Jun 1997

One option is to use the first lyric line as the chord line. I have several old song books which show the chords below the melody staff. This is one way if you don't mind the position of the chord. You can use lines 2 and up for lyrics if you need to.

If you still want to use TEXT and put chord names above the melody staff make sure you use the BOLD font. Minimize the use of letters in the chord name by using M = Major m = minor, - = dim, + = aug.

I too have several notated arrangement which have a chord change on each note in a measure. Primarly occurs in an ending or other measure where the held note is also a part of other chords. I use bold text and put all chords in the text expression line such as Bb7 Eb Eb7 is an example covering 3 notes. You will have to juggle the spacing to see how it looks on the screen. You should be able to come pretty close. If the measure is an ending measure then make sure that EXTEND LAST SYSTEM is check in the GENERAL Page setup. Hope I have helped you, but then again maybe others can come up with a more satisfactory answer. However, I have found that the printout of only the melody line will squish the three chord symbols together. This will not occur if there is another staff with notes on it and you print both staffs at the same time. I will send you an example if you send me an E-Mail request.

Reply 3 offered by: Don Ferguson<mrbanjo@bright.net> on 06 Jun 1997

Another way to handle the problem occurred to me.

1. Enter all the chord names in the text expression box (i.e Bb Eb B7). uncheck preserve width. Choose Bold Font.

2. use either line 1 or line 2 in the lyrics (assuming there are lyrics) and pad an unobtrusive character in one of the lines(I use a period) which will increase the distance between notes. You will have to fiddle with the spacing to allow for the space required for your text expression showing several chord changes on successive notes.

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net> on 06 Jun 1997

One option is to use the first lyric line as the chord line. I have several old song books which show the chords below the melody staff. This is one way if you don't mind the position of the chord. You can use lines 2 and up for lyrics if you need to.

If you still want to use TEXT and put chord names above the melody staff make sure you use the BOLD font. Minimize the use of letters in the chord name by using M = Major m = minor, - = dim, + = aug.

I too have several notated arrangement which have a chord change on each note in a measure. Primarly occurs in an ending or other measure where the held note is also a part of other chords. I use bold text and put all chords in the text expression line such as Bb7 Eb Eb7 is an example covering 3 notes. You will have to juggle the spacing to see how it looks on the screen. You should be able to come pretty close. If the measure is an ending measure then make sure that EXTEND LAST SYSTEM is check in the GENERAL Page setup. Hope I have helped you, but then again maybe others can come up with a more satisfactory answer. However, I have found that the printout of only the melody line will squish the three chord symbols together. This will not occur if there is another staff with notes on it and you print both staffs at the same time. I will send you an example if you send me an E-Mail request.


#166: Crescendo/Decrescendo signs (4 PostScript) html page
Crescendo/Decrescendo signs (4 PostScript) html page

(166)

Submitted by: marsu@ThePentagon.com on 07 Jun 1997

if you are interested in having < and > signs at will on your scores, just have a look at the page i designed for this, located at http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/cresdecr.htm

Do not hesitate to write me for details whenever you want some, or to ask me to do it for dos/Windows more quickly...

NWCly yours, Marsu

...and sorry for being short, I got a 2400bps modem ! (stolen from a prehistoric museum??)

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 13-Sep-2000

http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/cresdecr.html
is the correct link.
Sorry!

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Bacher on 13-Sep-2000

Marsu, your web page says at the bottom that your way of
saying "thank you" prevents GeoCities from popping up one
of their annoying ads. Sorry, but it wasn't true for me.
I still got one - and they won't go away. They even print
out over the image when you print the screen.

- seb

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Sep-2000

GeoCities changed how their popup ad works. Now you can't move it, but it is supposed to be smaller and less obnoxious.

As for crescendo signs, the Crescendo font (at http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Fonts ) is a lot easier to use, more portable, and works well enough for me.


#167: How to enrich the simbols
How to enrich the simbols

(167)

Submitted by: dimiter@harare.iafrica.com on 07 Jun 1997

I need to know if it's possible to write simbols for dounbow and upbow when editing music for string instruments, graphic crescendo and decrescendo, simbol for stoped harmonics. Simbol for thumb when writing for cello and dublebass.

Reply 1 offered by: Gigi on 27-Aug-1998

I need a simbols of the sun (expecially historic USA indian or maya simbols)
thanks a lot

Reply 2 offered by: Gigi on 28-Aug-1998

I need to know where I can download simbols that I can
use to get an idea to make a tatoo.
I like expecially indian's simbols or maya's simbols.
Thank you a lot.

Reply 3 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 31-Aug-1998

You can try at www.symbols.com. They have almost all known symbols available there. I think you can download them by using right click of the mouse and it will downlad as a GIF file.

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 offered by: joanaserrano on 26-Apr-2001

i would like you to send me some indian simbols. I want to make a tatoo wiht an indian simbol. I appreciate very much.as soon as possible please.thank you

Reply 6 offered by: Alberto Katsumiti on 23-Aug-2001

I would like you to send me some simbols of the sun in every cultures than you have for a university work. I appreciate very much as soon as possible please. Thank you

Reply 7 offered by: Daniel gunnarsson on 30-Dec-2001

I would like you to send me some indian simbols. I want to make a tatoo wiht an indian simbolor picture . I appreciate very much.as soon as possible please.thank you

Reply 8 offered by: Soledad on 09-Feb-2002

I´m looking for Indian symbols... if someone knows about it PLEASE send me !!!!


#168: Piano fingering
Piano fingering

(168)

Submitted by: Phil Tompkins on 08 Jun 1997

How can I indicate piano fingering? When I insert finger numbers as text, numbers for several notes struck at once may not line up vertically. When I want to erase only a finger number, the note may disappear.

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson<mrbanjo@bright.net on 08 Jun 1997

Configure STAFF LYRICS for a maximum of (5) lyric lines under each staff where you want to show fingering. Configure for LESS LINES if fewer fingers will be used in a clef. As an example,in the treble clef Line 5 would be thumb, line 4 would be 2d finger, Line 3 would be 3rd finger, Line 2 would be fourth finger, and line 1 would be little finger. In the bass clef it would be the opposite.

Print out your score then MANUALLY put in the finger numbers lined up vertically under the note(s)on the proper line. Not all lines need to be used at your discretion. When you are finished you have essentially written a lyric line of finger numbers(there may be some blank spots).

Enter each lyric lines into the STAFF LYRIC window as you would a lyric word. When you are through entering all the lyric lines (finger numbers) you should have the finger numbers vertically under the selected note(s)for each finger.

If there are lyrics then add another line. If you are using 5 fingers on a staff then the thumb would be line 6 and the lyric would be line one. You should be able to figure out the combinations and the lyric lines needed.

You must be satified with the finger numbers BELOW THE STAFF.

Reply 2 offered by: Phil Tompkins on 08 Jun 1997

I appreciate Don Ferguson taking the time for a detailed reply. However, I'm used to seeing the finger numbers quite close to the notes: close above the notes in the treble clef, and close below the notes in the bass clef, except perhaps in the opposite position relative to notes for inner voices and for notes close to the bottom of the treble clef and close to the top of the bass clef.

I think the reason for such positioning is to facilitate taking in both a note or chord and its corresponding fingering in one quick glance at one position on the page. This suggests to me that the program must associate the position of fingering on a staff with the position of the corresponding notes in a manner somewhat analogous to the way, say, accent or staccato marks are handled.

Phil Tompkins


#169: Drum Roll
Drum Roll

(169)

Submitted by: SteveH5863@aol.com on 08 Jun 1997

OK, I figured out how to add percussion, but how do you produce a drum roll, either on snare or timpani? Would appreciate any help. Steve

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 10 Jun 1997

For snare drums, at least, there is a specific "note" which produces a drum role, at least on my machine. I don't, off hand, remember which note, but I know it works.

Cyril

Reply 2 offered by: SteveH5863@aol.com on 14 Jun 1997

If anyone can fill me in on what note accomplishes this, I'd really appreciate it. Steve

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 14 Jun 1997

Low F.

That is, the F four lines below the bass staff.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 09 Jun 1997

Wouldn't a drum roll simply be a whole lot of sixteenth, 32nd or 64th notes one after the other? You could even use triplets if you wanted a roll rate that was in between. Try 'em out and see which sounds best in the circumstances. It doesn't take much effort to change the lengths of a whole string of notes.

Regards,

Andrew


#170: Importing MIDI pitch bends?
Importing MIDI pitch bends?

(170)

Submitted by: Len Spencer (Lenspencer@aol.com) on 08 Jun 1997

I have some MIDI files with pitch bends in them. How do I import them and retain the bends?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

Controller changes, such as pitch bends, are not imported by NWC. There is not any way to import these items into NWC. You can add pitch bend yourself later using the Multi-point Controller item on the Insert menu.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)


#171: Hesitation on Playback on 32-Bit (Win95) NWC
Hesitation on Playback on 32-Bit (Win95) NWC

(171)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 09 Jun 1997

I had been experiencing noticeable hesitation on playback when the screen redraws the next set of notes/staffs. I asked Eric H. about this matter.

His reply was "The 32-bit edition of NWC will not perform as well as the 16-bit edition. Why? This is because the Windows 95 timer services in 32-bit land are not very good. The 16-bit timer services work better when in Windows 95. When playback reliability is the critical factor, you should use the 16-bit edition. When safety, extra dialog help, and multi- tasking are the key factors, then the 32-bit edition is the one to use. On Windows NT, it seems best to use the 32-bit edition exclusively, as far as I know."

I compared several of my notated arrangements in both 16-bit and 32-bit mode. 16-Bit playback in Win95 indeed corrected the problem.

If you perceive hesitations in your playback of NWC arrangement then using 16-Bit in Win95 may be the answer. It was for me.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

FYI - Although not technically a fix, we are working on a resolution to this phenomenon when using the 32-bit package on Windows 95. The trade-off is likely to be a binary that is not strictly 32-bit, but it should improve the playback performance anyway. Please stay tuned, and by all means, for now, use the 16-bit version when playback performance is the essential factor on a Windows 95 system.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 12 Jun 1997

I had the same problems before I contacted Eric for the solution. I might note that I recently got a new system with Windows 95B. The problem has not been fixed with the latest version of Windows.


#172: Printing Multi Staves
Printing Multi Staves

(172)

Submitted by: CHoar@hotmail.com on 09 Jun 1997

How can I print out a score which has several staves, and where not all staves are used (i.e. there are rests in the music) not print that particular stave on that page, but then continue printing it when the instrument comes in again? (If you understand my gibberish!)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

It is not currently possible to selectively suppress staff inclusion in some systems and not others. A staff is either always in the system when printing, or never present.

--- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)


#173: PRINTING Multi Staves
PRINTING Multi Staves

(173)

Submitted by: CHoar@hotmail.com on 10 Jun 1997

When printing a four-part vocal score with piano accompaniment, there are several pages that one part or another are not singing. Is it possible not to print these parts for the appropriate pages but still keep the bars in line, so when the part re-enters on the next pages I do not get bars printed more than once or missed out all together? (If anybody can understand my wierd descriptions!) Try it and see what I mean!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 11 Jun 1997

How about printing as normal, and covering up the parts you don't want with white paper? No? ;-)

Okay, the only other solution I can think of is to work it out page by page. ie.

Print page one, working out which bar you are up to.

Delete those bars (keep a complete copy handy somewhere).

Print out page 2, with the appropriate vocal parts excluded.

Delete the page 2 bars.

And so on, adding and removing parts as necessary.

The totally wrong thing with this approach is the supposition that parts are going to stop and start at convenient page boundaries. Chances of that are roughly equivalent to a snowflake's chance in hell, but you MAY BE LUCKY! :-)

I guess you should ask yourself what exactly you are expecting it to look like. You may find it harder to read if parts disappear and reappear. I have a friend who has to highlight his part with a pen as it is, so that he won't lose it!

LAST SOLUTION. When printing parts, I normally print 1 full score (the "conductor's score", though we don't have a conductor) and separate parts for all players. It seems to work well.

There are times, when - for brevity - I will condense parts onto one stave. So that - f'rinstance - the pianist will have their two staves and a third vocal stave above it (gets a bit hard when you're using four vocal parts, though).

Hope some of these ideas will work for you.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 11 Jun 1997

How about printing as normal, and covering up the parts you don't want with white paper? No? ;-)

Okay, the only other solution I can think of is to work it out page by page. ie.

Print page one, working out which bar you are up to.

Delete those bars (keep a complete copy handy somewhere).

Print out page 2, with the appropriate vocal parts excluded.

Delete the page 2 bars.

And so on, adding and removing parts as necessary.

The totally wrong thing with this approach is the supposition that parts are going to stop and start at convenient page boundaries. Chances of that are roughly equivalent to a snowflake's chance in hell, but you MAY BE LUCKY! :-)

I guess you should ask yourself what exactly you are expecting it to look like. You may find it harder to read if parts disappear and reappear. I have a friend who has to highlight his part with a pen as it is, so that he won't lose it!

LAST SOLUTION. When printing parts, I normally print 1 full score (the "conductor's score", though we don't have a conductor) and separate parts for all players. It seems to work well.

There are times, when - for brevity - I will condense parts onto one stave. So that - f'rinstance - the pianist will have their two staves and a third vocal stave above it (gets a bit hard when you're using four vocal parts, though).

Hope some of these ideas will work for you.

Andrew


#174: Cannot Make Step Record Work
Cannot Make Step Record Work

(174)

Submitted by: m.radtke@bull.com on 10 Jun 1997

Hello,

I am a registered user and I am sending this directly as well as posting it to the user forum.

I am a new user of Noteworthy and would like to use step record. I believe that the MIDI hardware and MSW'95 driver software is working correctly since I am able to use record mode (real time) successfully from my MIDI keyboard. However, when I select "MIDI Input Active" and press keys on the MIDI device, nothing happens on the computer screen.

Where should I look for the problem?

Thanks, Mike

Michael A. Radtke - Z74 Voice: 602-862-4897 Bull FAX: 4853 13430 N. Black Canyon Hwy.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11 Jun 1997

This one caught me out too!

Check the Midi tab in Tools | Options.

Port Usage should be set to WhileActive or Always, so that the Midi Input port is active. My bet is that you've (very thoughtfully) set it to WhilePlaying.

If this doesn't help, you'll need to send more information.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: m.radtke@bull.com on 11 Jun 1997

Andrew,

Thanks for your response.

I wish it were that easy. The port usage _is_ set to always. I have not tried any other setting.

I am on 1.31, not a or b. Is that a problem?

I also tried the 16 and 32 bit versions ... no difference.

I am using a Gallant 8000 sound card. The drivers are MPU401 and MSWindows sound system. Since record works fine, I am most suspicious of Noteworthy rather than other system components. What other information can you use?

Thanks, Mike

Reply 3 offered by: m.radtke@bull.com on 16 Jun 1997

Andrew,

The problem is not Noteworthy.

Just in case you have to troubleshoot a similar problem:

1) I found that step (input) worked if another application was using the MPU401 (output).

2) I found that several inputs would be buffered (by?) and would shift out for each output note sent.

3) I found that input/output control sequences had no apparent effect demonstrated in #1 and #2.

4) Abandoning the OEM MPU401 driver in favor of the generic Microsoft MPU401 driver solved the problem.

Thanks for your response.

Mike

Michael A. Radtke - Z74 Voice: 602-862-4897 Bull FAX: 4853 13430 N. Black Canyon Hwy. Phoenix, AZ 85029 Email: m.radtke@bull.com

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

Mike:

Thanks for the update. Hopefully this will help others. All too often, a poorly behaved driver prevents users from getting good (or any) results on recording and other MIDI input.

---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)


#175: Grace Notes
Grace Notes

(175)

Submitted by: jan_hjelm@hotmail.com on 10 Jun 1997

How do I notate grace notes? I keep stumbling over them all the time, and I am at a loss. For now I just leave them out. Will there be a fix?

P.S. Compared to Cubase Noteworthy still wins! D.S.

Reply 1 offered by: on 18 Jun 1997

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 11 Jun 1997

NWC doesn't support or recognise grace notes, though so many people have asked for it (and trills, mordants, etc), that I imagine that Eric would be considering it!

Sometimes, you can just enter the notes straight in. They will look as big as the normal notes, but apart from that, will behave closely to how you would expect. The biggest problem you will come up with doing it this way is matching up the bar lines of different staves, this is because the extra notes make the bars longer (obviously). One thing to do is to change the length of the preceding note to accomodate the auxiliary note. This ends up looking very messy, but with prudent use of copy/paste and moving notes up and down, becomes very easy to enter.

We're all expectantly waiting with bated breath (baited breath smells bad) for Eric to pull some electronic rabbit out of his hat.

Regards,

Andrew


#176: Beats/min vs different tempi
Beats/min vs different tempi

(176)

Submitted by: jan_hjelm@hotmail.com on 10 Jun 1997

Is there any convention as to how many beats per minute Adagio means? Anyone got a table for the different Italian tempi signatures and their equivalence in beats per minute for, say a quarter-note? Maybe something for NW:s Helpfile?

JH

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11 Jun 1997

I thought there was something somewhere, but I can't find it. Here's a few settings I've used before...

Largo 40-60

Larghetto 60-66

Adagio 66-76

Andante 76-108

Moderato 108-120

Allegro 120-168

Presto 168-208

hope this gets you started...

Regards,

Andrew


#177: Can I control the position of a SLUR mark
Can I control the position of a SLUR mark

(177)

Submitted by: Stuart Rance on 11 Jun 1997

Sometimes it appears above the notes and sometimes below. I would like to be able to select which of these I get.

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 11 Jun 1997

Slur position is controlled by the stem direction of the first note in the sequence of slurred notes. The slur position will be the OPPOSITE of the stem direction of the first note. You can still change stem direction in the remaining note(s) in the slur if you need to.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards (peter_e@issolutions.co.uk) on 12 Jun 1997

Wouldn't it be nice if they could slope diagonally to follow the shape of the note sequence more closely?


#180: Few notes not sounding on playback
Few notes not sounding on playback

(180)

Submitted by: Kevin O'Brien (kob@pchelp.gen.nz) on 15 Jun 1997

I have a small song (syhn voice & piano) where a few non-consequtive notes do not sound when being played back (F5).

All three staves can be played separetely OK.

One inelegant fix is to copy the vocal stave, delete it and add a new one below the piano then paste back the original. Making a new version with the vocal staff as the first staff does not work.

Version 1.31b & c.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Bacher on 20 Jun 1997

I've noticed a similar problem. If I have two staves (two voices), one of which has, say, a whole note and the other of which has a quarter note of the same pitch, when I play back the piece the quarter note's termination overrides the whole note. In other words, you hear only the quarter note and not the whole note.

Sometimes I have to make temporary edits to the score in order to get the ensemble to play back correctly.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

As pointed out in another message, this is a typical behaviour if both parts are on the same MIDI channel. However, this is not always the case. Many professional synthesizers will successfully play back multiple strikes of the same note in the same channel. Most sound cards, on the other hand, will generally turn the note off when any of the strikes is shut off. In the professional stuff, you can often hear the extra note of the same pitch literally layer into overall audio mix.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 20 Jun 1997

Steve Bache wrote:

"If I have two staves (two voices), one of which has, say, a whole note and the other of which has a quarter note of the same pitch, when I play back the piece the quarter note's termination overrides the whole note. In other words, you hear only the quarter note and not the whole note."

This shouldn't occur if both staves are on separate MIDI channels. If they are on the same channel, this is normal.


#181: Downloading forum msgs.
Downloading forum msgs.

(181)

Submitted by: Brian on 16 Jun 1997

How do I download all these files and read them off line and how can I just pick up the new msgs each time I check here. We used to be able to do that with the old primitive BBSs. Thanks. Brian

Reply 1 offered by: Phil Tompkins on 19 Jun 1997

Well, you could get a little fancy if you had a terminal program with a scripting language like Hayes Smartcom, Procomm, or the like. "Just" write a little script with a loop to go through and save each message until you come to the first one you previously saved.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 17 Jun 1997

Brian said: <<How do I download all these files and read them off line >>

Er... well it's not easy.

Let's say you have Netscape Navigator. Things will be similar for IE, or whichever browser you use.

1) Create a temporary directory. Save the main forum index in it.

2) Create a subdirectory called _forum1 This is where you'll save each message.

3) Now, for each message you want to read (yes, that's right, this is the icky part where you realise you still have to point at each message - but hey! look on the bright side, at least you can weed out the things you don't want to read!) for each message you want to read Right-Click with the mouse and select save as, and save the messages you want in _forum1.

4) Go off-line. Open the saved file (in the top temporary directory), and it should now happily point to the files in your _forum1 directory.

5) Don't blame me if it doesn't work! :-)

<<<and how can I just pick up the new msgs each time I check here. >>>

That will normally work automatically with your reader. I think Eric and Beth must've rearranged the file area and rendered all our histories obsolete (sigh).

<<<We used to be able to do that with the old primitive BBSs. >>>

Still can, see above.

PSST, ERIC! Maybe it's time to move to something a little more user-friendly, like a mailing list or newsgroup!

Hope this all helped.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net (continued message) on 17 Jun 1997

Follow instructions in help file and select FILE in the Print To The Following Port box.

When you print the forum message it will print to a file which you name with an extention of .PRN. You have to have a program that will read it. I cannot find anything in WIN95 that will recognize .PRN. If anyone knows of some way to print out a file with an extension .PRN I would like to know.

New messages are shown as the latest entered but answers may be several days later and could appear farther down as new messages are entered.

In Netscape Communicator and I assume in other browsers when you enter a file the color changes so that you know in subsequent visits to a site that you have looked at a particular file. You can also scroll down the list and watch for entries that have not changed color (file not yet entered) or dates.

Hope that helps on the list

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 17 Jun 1997

To download a file to be read at a later time requires you to change the port your printer is connected to.

See WIN95 help file. When Windows help file appears type in "print to file" (ignore ")in box 1.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Dec-1998

Click the Go Offline link on any forum page to get the latest offline version of the forum.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Dec-1998

> I cannot find anything in WIN95 that will recognize .PRN. If anyone knows of some way to print out a file with an extension .PRN I would like to know.

1) Install "Applewriter Plus" or other PostScript printer driver. Instead of assigning to a port, assign it to "File".

2) Use Printer Setup to enable this "virtual printer". Create *.prn files to your heart's content. Then rename them to *.ps. You can now use GSview/Ghostscript to read them. (See the User Tips on "Converting to PS of PDF format for info on where to get this.)

This is a long way around, and probably not practical for something as simple as a forum or newgroup, but there it is...

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Dec-1998

> I cannot find anything in WIN95 that will recognize .PRN. If anyone knows of some way to print out a file with an extension .PRN I would like to know.

PS - if your *.prn file was created with your default printer "connected" (i.e. enabled in your Printers applet in Control Panel,) you can print it to that printer later by going to DOS prompt, then

COPY /B [filename.prn] LPT1 {or whatever port it's connected to}

There may be a way of doing it from within Windows using drag-and-drop, but I haven't tried... anyone else know about this?


#182: Best Keyboard?
Best Keyboard?

(182)

Submitted by: gillc@nmaa.org on 17 Jun 1997

Can anyone recommend a keyboard that I could use to inport into Noteworthy MIDI files? How is this done? I am a novice at MIDI, but I think Noteworthy can convert what I play into notation. Any recommendations? I want a keyboard that I will be happy with for a long time.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

There is not any single, correct answer for this question. My best advice is to visit a music store or retail outlet where one or more MIDI keyboards are on display. Find one or more that fit your budget, and see how you like them. If you are working on a tight budget, or have a good quality sound card and speaker setup already, then you may want to consider a simple "MIDI out only" keyboard that has no synthesizer built into it. We have one here that cost about US $100, and it works well when combined with the echo and recording features in NWC version 1.31. If you want a more professional system, or want to be able to play and hear the keyboard without the aid of your computer, then you need to look at those which have synthesizers built in. In this case, you can spend anywhere from US $250 to well over $10,000, depending on how professional you want to be.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)


#183: Lyric font size & editing
Lyric font size & editing

(183)

Submitted by: royahilt@ns1.uconect.net on 18 Jun 1997

Me too! I would like to be able to control the font size. And horz scrolling would be helpful when editing the lyrics for mistakes

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

I am not sure what you mean by horizontal scrolling, but lyric fot control is a popular request. You can add your vote from our wish list, as we do officially track suggestions, but only from that official place.

---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)


#184: Connecting a MIDI Keyboard
Connecting a MIDI Keyboard

(184)

Submitted by: Jay Fischer on 19 Jun 1997

can i connect a MIDI keyboard so that when i press a note on the keyboard, it appears on the screen in noteworthy. If not, what are my options with Noteworthy. I havw just purchased a MIDI controller and know very little about it. Please post to this forum and please e-mail me at jaybar@walrus.com. Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 6/21/97

We ultimately worked out the problem that Jay was having in setting up MIDI input. For others trying to do this and are experiencing problems, there is a lesson that I can share. When you are hooking up a MIDI keyboard to your sound card, make sure that you connect the proper cable connection to the MIDI output of your keyboard. Most MIDI adapters provide both MIDI input and output connectors, and the label on the connectors is not always obvious (for example, the label "Out" could either be from the computer perspective or the keyboards). If your input is not working, and you think it should be, then your cable connections may be crossed (as in this case).

I hope this helps.

Eric, support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 19 Jun 1997

Yes, absolutely! That's what the latest versino of NWC introduced. I'm still toying with whether it's quicker for me or not. I tend to think not, but other users may find it much easier.

If not, what are my options with Noteworthy...

I just enter from the computer keyboard, making great use of the up and down arrows, the enter key and the shift key. You can do it bloody fast after some practice!

> I havw just purchased a MIDI controller and know very little about it.
Well what did you buy it for?! :-)

I suggest you read NWC's documentation (their help file) to get as many hints about using a midi keyboard, and then see how you can use YOUR midi keyboard to effect that.

Unfortunately, NWC won't yet read things like mod wheels or pitch bend off MIDI, MIDI keyboards simply become note-enterers.

There are two ways to do it. The cutest is using RECORD, where you play along with - say - a beat track, adding line after line. Once you have tweaked the timing sensitivity of the MIDI Importer, you can get fairly good results, though you'll still have to go back to edit dynamics and tempo changes.

The second way it stepwise entering. This is much easier to do and to control.

As I said before, at some stage, it'll help to read the online help. :-)

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Max on 28-Jul-1998

I want to thank the support for the information about
crossing midi out-in cables. You solved my problem!
I was getting fool and cannot understand what was
wrong with my keyboard. Thanks also to the internet for
this precious information!
All the best.

Reply 4 offered by: Michal Baranay on 10-Aug-1998

Where can I get free sinthetizer software for my midi keyboard. I mean some software, which can I use like remote program for my keyboard. Make realtime changeable chords, bass, drums,... I have only Cakewalk home studio. I can't do this things with this software.
I have a little problem: My sustain pedal don't work.
Could you help me?
Just a one question: Do you know, how to make synthetizer for my midi keyboard at home? Can I do it?

Please write me......(It's urgent)

Michal Baranay
(Bratislava, Slovakia,
Europe, Earth, universe)

Reply 5 offered by: Jane on 19-Nov-1999

I have a General music keyboard and I was wondering what I need to connect it to my Toshiba computer. Would you be able to tell me that. Also I would like to know if there is a software program for transposing music. Thanks jane

Reply 6 offered by: Allistair on 23-Nov-1999

Hello Jane,

MoteWorthy Composer is a good program for transposing. I have just finished doing just that for a small group who was given music in G-flat major, and the organist announced he was playing in F-major. (Can't say I blamed him!). I enterd the small piece, then transposed each stave down a semi-tone and there it was. Some enharmonics needed to be changed to show modulations correctly, but were minor.

MOst MIDI sequence programs also will transpose up or down however much you need it - it depends on what form your music is in.

Reply 7 offered by: Oria Paz on 18-Jul-2000

Hello,I'm having a problem with my midi connection because I bougth a music program:piano&keyboard workshop by Magix.My computer is an Emachines window 98 the soundcard is Crystal sound fusion,I have a midi 15pin male cable connected one end to the computer in the joystick port.This cable has two exits one for in and other is out, the set up is as follows: Device Manager Sound,video and game controllers:Crystal soundfusion (tm) game device, Crystal soundfusion (tm)joystickand Crystal soundfusion (tm) PCI Audio Acceletormu. In Control pannel multimedia properties MIDI tab:single instrument:Crystal soundfusion(tm) FM ,Soundfusion (tm) External midi (this has been selected) .In Piano& keyboard Workshop midi setupSelect devices:inputs A:\SoundFusion (tm) External midi GS ,outputs C:\SoundFusion (tm) External midi GS. I have used two different Midi keyboards: Casio CT-650, and the other is Concertmate 990. I have the cables in the right places and the program only works with the screen keypoard. The program is to be used in both ways. I send several fax and E-mail to Magix but only answered once and it was wrong,I have been trying to find somebody who help me throu the internet but nothing. I arrived to this place and I hope you can help me. Thank you. Oria

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Jul-2000

You didn't say exactly how the cables are connected, so please excuse if this is obvious: the one marked OUT should go to the keyboard's IN, and the one marked IN goes to the keyboard's OUT.

Hope this helps...

Reply 9 offered by: oria paz on 19-Jul-2000

Hi, Thanks for your tip about the cables,I did it but I only got to listen the program through my real keyboard when I use the screen keyboard. I think I am close because this is something. I will appreciate if you have other idea. Please write me because I'm trying to use the program with my piano students and the screen keyboard is so little and is difficult for them to work there. Thanks again. Oria

Reply 10 offered by: Oria Paz on 21-Jul-2000

To: FRED NACHBAUR.

Please , read my last message about connectig a midi keyboard. I'll be very happy if you can help me.
If somebody else can help me ,please don't hesitate to do. I have bought the music program 1 month ago and I couldn't use it because the problem that I explained the 19 of July.I'll be waiting for some answer. Thanks. Oria

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Jul-2000

FYI: Oria, this area is NOT a Magix support forum.

Reply 12 offered by: James on 25-Oct-2000

Ok everyone, go easy on me. I am taking a midi recording class at school, and they use macs. I have a pc at home and my dad has a Korg Trinity V3 keyboard with midi ports in the back of it. I want to know what I need to buy in order to hook this keyboard up to my computer. I have a HP Pavilion 8480Z. I was surfing the net and i saw the "USB Midisport 4x4" by midiman. Would I be able to connect the usb port and then just run the midi cables from the keyboard to the midiman? Any help would be MUCH appreciated! Thanks in advance!

-James

Reply 13 offered by: AndK on 23-Nov-2000

Got new CTK651, connected to Simens computer with Crystal 4238b Sound-chip on board. No midi gets played back form CTK651 thru Crystal from computer?

Anyone any idea why?
(And I have got the wires the rightway round... I think so!)

andy

Reply 14 offered by: Eduardo di Iorio on 10-Mar-2001

AndK: Connecting a Keyboard to your (Crystal) Sound Card requires you to assign an IRQ to your sound card. The problem I have is that there are not enough free IRQ's or just the wrong ones (like # 10; for some reason the sound card will accept only 4 or 5 specific IRQ's). A dirty way to get around this problem is to (previously) load a midi debug program that is able to do a permanent OUTPUT to the midi keyboard, such as timing signals or so, which won't do any harm to the keyboard. This maintains the sound driver alert so it will pick up the inputs already in the buffer that without an IRQ will never interrupt and so remain forgotten.
Eduardo

Reply 15 offered by: JAYMZ HUGHES  on 30-Jul-2001

I HAVE THE SAME BOARD (CTK-651) AND THE RIGHT WIRES AND HE RIGHT WAY CONNECTED, BUT I CANNOT GET THE DAMN THIG TO WORK! ... I WANT TO USE THE KEYBOARDS SOUND TO PLAY MY MIDI FILES THROUGH , I HAVE LIKE 200 SONGS AND WANT THEM TO SOUND GOOD ... USING THE CAKEWALK INTERFACE,IT GIVES A LIMITED SET OF SOUNDS ... THE DRUMS SOUND REALLY CHEESY.. BUT WHEN I PREVIIEWED THE ACTUAL MIDI FILE ONLINE IT SOUNDED REAL NICE, THE INSTRUMENTS SOUNDED REAL.... BUT ONCE DOWNLOADED AND PLAYED THROUGH THE CAKEWALK PROGRAM ... IT LOSES ALL THE SWEET INSTRUMENTAL SOUND.... THUS MAKING IT SOUND LIKE ELEVATOR MUZAKK CAN YOU OR ANYONE HELP???

Reply 16 offered by: David Palmquist on 31-Jul-2001

Jaymz writes:
...BUT ONCE DOWNLOADED AND PLAYED THROUGH THE CAKEWALK PROGRAM ... IT LOSES ALL THE SWEET INSTRUMENTAL SOUND....

Mm-hmm. This is a Noteworthy site, last I checked. Probably the question should be addressed to the Cakewalk people?

Reply 17 offered by: Kewik on 15-Aug-2001

Need help on connecting two midi keyboards to the computer together. a single keyboard workd fine but i am unable to connect two keyboards. Both of keyboards have midi in and midi out ports but no midi thru port.

Reply 18 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Aug-2001

When you want to connect multiple MIDI keyboards into a MIDI setup, it is best to use a MIDI router, which supports flexible routing of multiple MIDI inputs to multiple output ports, and vice versa.

Reply 19 offered by: PigBucket on 21-Aug-2001

This caught me out the other day... Connected a Roland ep85 to my computer and connected the cables the right way. Set the midi input device to MPU-401 and also the midi output device to MPU-401. Everything looked sweet. Loaded a midi file and could play it and it came out the speakers in the keyboard.. Wow I thought - this is cool...

Tried to record and play along on the keyboard but after about 3 seconds after pressing record the program went back to normal mode and would not record anything. After trying just about everything for about 2 hours, I gave up.

Further investigation the next day revealed :

1. I was using sound built in to the motherboard. CM-830 or something like that.

2. The standard 'audio' software supplied was not installed by the shop where I bought it.

3. I installed the 'audio rack' software and one of the programs it installed was a program to either 'enable' or 'disable' the MPU-401 Midi Input.

I ran the program to enable it and everything now works fine. Why only Midi input is anybody's guess.

Just something to look out for....

Peter

Reply 20 offered by: David Lazarus on 12-Dec-2001

I also have a Casio CTK531 that I am trying to hook up to my PC. I have Soundblaster Live and the midi cables are the right way round. The keyboard is set to 'local off' as per the instructions but alas nothing. I have been unable to sort this for over a year now and getting depressed. Please if anyone has any suggestions that a non-tecchie can understand <sighs> Thanks in advance

David

Reply 21 offered by: David Lazarus on 12-Dec-2001

Sorry for the typo, the above post should read 'Casio CTK631'

Reply 22 offered by: RAS on 29-Dec-2001

Thxs so much for the cross in and out line responce, that was the problem. just to say it one more time, on the back of your keyboard place the OUT line in the IN port, and the IN line in the OUT port, And all is well, thxs again


#185: Multi note passages
Multi note passages

(185)

Submitted by: tommilesjr@geocities.com on 19 Jun 1997

Can I use 7 tuplets (7 notes in one beat) in Noteworthy?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 6/21/97

The short answer is that note groupings beyond triplets are not currently supported by NWC. You can approximate them, but you cannot get exactly the grouping that you want.

---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: Tim Reichard on 19 Jun 1997

You can approximate multiplets such as septuplets by using more complex rhythms that are close. I'll assume you want seven notes to a quarter note. I'll try to describe a method for approximating: There are 16 64th notes to the quarter note. Divide by 7--you get 2 64th notes (a 32nd note) seven times, with 2 64th notes left over. This means you will have seven 32th notes with two of them tied to a left-over 64th note. It's good to spread out the remaining 64th notes. This gives you this rhythm: 32nd, dotted 32nd (32nd tied to 64th), 32nd, 32nd, 32nd, dotted 32nd, 32nd. I hope this has made sense. Sometimes you can split the quarter note down to 128th notes for more accuracy. Although NoteWorthy doesn't support 128th notes, somtimes it will work out with dotted 64th notes, as it does in this case. There are 32 128th notes to the quarter note, and dividing by 7 gives you 4 128th notes tied together (a 32nd note) seven times, with 4 128th notes left over. The rhythm is then dotted 64th tied to another 64th (a 32th note tied to a 128nd), 32nd, dotted 64th tied to 64th, 32nd, dotted 64th tied to 64th, 32nd, and another dotted 64th tied to 64th. These rhythms can get compicated as you can see, and they will look nasty in print, but they work very well for audio purposes.

If you aren't concerned with printing music, then you could just place 7 16th notes in a 7/16 bar and adjust the tempo accordingly so that they will play at the correct speed. For example, a one 16th note septuplet at 120 bpm could be played as normal 16th notes at 120 bpm * 7/4 = 210 bpm. The 7/4 factor is 7 notes in the time of 4. This way is simpler rhythmically and more accurate.

I hope this hasn't confused more than helped. Multiplets are on the wish list, so let's keep our fingers crossed.

Tim Reichard

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 20 Jun 1997

Firstly, I must commend Tim on his wonderful reply! If I ever need it that accurate (say in a slow piece), I'll keep it in mind.

Shame that NWC workarounds always end up complicated!

A quick and dirty workaround for fast music is to just approximate with (say) 4 x 64th notes plus a triplet of 32nd notes which altogether add up to one eight note.

This is much more legible on the page, too, though still not as nice as [______7______] (which, by the way, is a textual approximation that you may wish to consider, using the TEXT object, only problem would be obliterating the triplet's "[3]").

So if you're going for audio accuracy, try Tim's method, otherwise you may wish to consider this one for reading ease.

Sometimes the best thing to do for readers is use the good ol' white out!

Andrew


#188: crescendo and decrescendo signs (for PostScript printer), II
crescendo and decrescendo signs (for PostScript printer), II

(188)

Submitted by: marsu@ThePentagon.com on 21 Jun 1997

Here it is, for you who waited for it !
As I wrote it before, THER IS A WAY to print < and > signs with NoteWorthy composer. The trick is to add some special text items, and to convert the printer's input with a converter that I wrote.<BR> Go to www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/cresdecr.html and you'll know all about this.<BR> ...And, Yes, Andrew, some users go far in their effort to use NWC !! But it's ...worthy indeed !!! Well, do not hesitate to contact me if you got questions. Hope this solution will satisfy you...till Eric gives us the pleasure to add it to his so great software !! Bons baisers de Paris, France !


#189: Big Band, Jazz and Pop
Big Band, Jazz and Pop

(189)

Submitted by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 24 Jun 1997

The new forum looks so bare I thought it needed a new message. Are there any users out there that share my musical interests? If so drop me a line so we can share techniques, resources, scores.

Barry

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 14 Aug 1997

Just looked back and saw your message. I'm a big band musician. What do you want to talk about? I'm still trying to set up for keyboard entry. Appears the midi cable I bought was no good. Took me 2 weeks to conclude that. Meantime, I've entered a Kenton arrangement (a short one), and am trying to massage the parts to my satisfaction. Also experimenting with transposition.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Reilly (warlordinc@tinet.ie) on 28 Jul 1997

Yes, I use NWC for printing out hand written parts, that the brass & reed band i'm in use.

Our conductor writes out music, which can be hard at imes to read.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 25 Jun 1997

FYI: You can click the Archive link on the index page to go to older messages.

---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 4 offered by: K.C. Dooley on 24-May-1998

I'm a big band musician and came to your page while checking out various Big band sites. I've currently put the big band piece I'm writing on the back burner to work on something for a smaller ensemble: two trumpets, two reeds, two trombones and a rhythm section.

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-May-1998

Would be interested in whatever you produce.
I have done some arrangements for a similar line up.

Reply 6 offered by: dazza & bazza on 06-Jun-1998

We need information on big bands. Do you know Craig Schneider?!?
we just love him!!!!!

xoxox

Reply 7 offered by: bazza & dazza on 06-Jun-1998

the previous letter we wrote was terminated. WHERE IS IT!!!

:(
HAVE YOU TAKEN IT HOSTAGE???

Reply 8 offered by: Susan de Sousa on 09-Jun-1998

I have recently discovered the Big Band sound and am now totally hooked. Can anyone give me more information abour the genre????

Reply 9 offered by: Alberto Tridade Correa on 18-Jun-1998

I'd like to know if it's possible to get some big band's music scores in the internet
my best wishes for both of you(sorry for my english mystakes)

Reply 10 offered by: merill on 13-Jul-1998

This is a long shot, but I'm looking for a song called "Afternoon of the African," a jazz tune from the 20's or 30's.....any info would be appreciated!

Reply 11 offered by: Duane Lawrence on 04-Sep-1998

I'm a vocalist from San Francisco performing with two of the hottest big bands in the area. The Contemporary Jazz Orchestra under the direction of Christopher Pitts; performing every Monday night at Jazz at Pearl's, (North Beach) in San Francisco. The band will be making it's first appearance at the Monterey Jazz Festival on Saturday, Sept 19, 1998 at 4:30pm at the Clubhouse. I'm looking for big band vocal charts (16-18 piece).

Reply 12 offered by: Dr. Alan Mandel on 27-Feb-2001

Looking for old Maynard Ferguson arrangements for an upcoming spring concert.

La Fiesta
Chameleon
Give it One
Birdland

etc.etc.

Willing to pay for copies, as these are out of print...know about Sierra music and the charts they have...want the older stuff...

Thanks! :)

Reply 13 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Feb-2001

I have midi files of La Fiesta (Herman- Big Band) and Birdland (Weather Report)that might be suitable for transcription.


#190: Pitch Bend
Pitch Bend

(190)

Submitted by: Andre' Rogers trumpet-boy@geocities.com on 25 Jun 1997

I've been writting a few jazz tunes, and I've been needing a couple of pitch bends for a fall here and there. Could anyone tell me how?

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 25 Jun 1997

Pitch bend is controlled by the Multi-point controller. Access the controller by INSERT/MULTI-CONTROLLER.

When you have the Midi Multi-Controller Window, then click on HELP which will bring up the HELP for multi-controller command. You may want to print it out for easy reference.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 25 Jun 1997

But just to answer the next question, the MPC Pitch controller works with values from -8000ish to +8000ish. This corresponds to the default pitch wheel range, which is normally two semitones.

Best thing to do is to fiddle with all the switches and see what works best, but be aware that if you make the step interval too small (if you are using a linear sweep, which you prob'ly will for a bent note), you'll end up flooding your midi device with too many pitch change messages. A quick sweep may only need about 10 or even fewer in-between steps.

Hope this cryptic suggestion helps.

Andrew


#191: 2 voice on 1 line ?
2 voice on 1 line ?

(191)

Submitted by: Alexander (jur94ffo@rzaix340.rz.uni-leipzig.de on 25 Jun 1997

I want to create a song with the same outfit like the Noteworthy-Demosong "Nowell". But is there anywhere an explination about how to make it possible ?? I tryed to do it, but I can only write one Note on one place (or a chord, but thats not the needed thing). How can I write the 2 voices on one Score-line ? Is there a special configuration needed ? Thanks for answering !

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 25 Jun 1997

Use the Stem Direction tools, in conjunction with the Insert Chord Member command, to construct "split stem" chords. Please review the rules, as outlined in the Help file, for chord constructs of this type. For example, no two notes can be placed on the same staff line in a chord (members cannot overlap). Full details are in the help section. You can get there fast by highlighting the Chord Member command in the Insert menu, then pressing F1.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 25 Jun 1997

If you want to make notes of different lengths sound at the same time, it is exactly like making a chord, except that you change the length of the notes.

For example:

1) Enter a quarter note (crotchet) on D.

2) Change note length to eighth note (quaver) and put on F# using the control key and enter to "add" the note.

3) Now you have two notes, one a crotchet on D, the other a quaver on F#. If you add a note AFTER these two, it will play after the quaver.

NOW! If you tried this and had trouble, there are a few things to keep in mind.

1) NWC needs to take notice of stem directions (up/down) when adding notes of different lengths. Normally it will do this automatically for you without you having to worry.

2) NWC will only work with groups of notes of two different lengths (covering 99.99% of known music). That is you can't combine a crotchet, a quaver AND a breve. Also, if you have more than two notes, extra notes must be with their partners, ie. you couldn't have crotchet, quaver, crotchet.

3) If you want a rest, you must enter the rest FIRST. You may also need to flip the rest's "tail", so that it is "pointing" the right way.

Hope all this helps!

Andrew


#193: Resolution
Resolution

(193)

Submitted by: Greg (gregw@harborside.com) on 28 Jun 1997

When I import a midi file to Noteworthy 1.31d, the program asks for note and rest resolution. Can anybody provide a simplified answer to what note and rest resolutions are?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 30 Jun 1997

The note resolution should be set to roughly the smallest note length that will typically occur in the song. If you are importing a slow waltz, you would probably want a larger duration here, like 8th or 16th notes. It also depends on the source materials accuracy. If the MIDI file was machine generated (by some other composition program), then this value can be made to a smaller duration and still yield good import results. In general, smaller values yield more complicated scores using lots of small notes.

The rest resolution value should be set to as large a vlue as you think that you can stand. This will allow NWC to minimize the number of rests that appear in the song, thus keeping the note density down. If you make this a small duration, NWC will make such things as 32nd rests in the middle of a note run, which most players would rather not see or attempt to play (because performance of short rests are more of a "feel thing" at that speed anyway).

My best advice is to experiment until you get the best possible results.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)


#194: Transposition
Transposition

(194)

Submitted by: John Shore (jshore@rmplc.co.uk on 29 Jun 1997

This sounds a silly question but neither I nor a friend have been able to solve it: When I transpose a staff in C major up a semitone it appears in C sharp major. How can I force it to appear in D flat??

Reply 1 offered by: Tim Reichard on 29 Jun 1997

You can solve this problem in 4 steps:

1. Transpose the staff up 1 semitone (from C major to C# major).

2. Choose Force Accidentals from the Tools menu. This places an accidental with every note on the staff, whether it is taken care of by the key signature or not.

3. Replace the C# key signature with a Db signature.

4. Transpose the staff up (or down) 0 (zero) semitones.

This should allow transposition to the key of Db major and can be applied to the similar dilemmas of transposing to Gb and Cb.

Good luck.

Tim Reichard


#195: Need help on "sections(?)"
Need help on "sections(?)"

(195)

Submitted by: Thomas Rackers <rackers-t@worldnet.att.net> on 30 Jun 1997

I need some help in using NoteWorthy Composer 1.31c (have just downloaded 1.31d, haven't installed yet). I have a song for which I need to create printed music for my church choir. The song has a refrain at the beginning, therefore only one line of lyrics. The collection of 6 verses follow the refrain. How can I divide the song such that I can have 1 lyric line in the first half (the refrain) and 6 in the second half (the verses)?

In similar fashion, I have another piece which starts out with only a treble staff (women singing solo), followed by treble and bass staves when the men join in. How can I get the song to be divided up in such a way?

Thanks in advance for your answers.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 30 Jun 1997

The only way to do your lyric setup is to set up 6 lyric lines. Use this for the refrain and the first verse. Use underscores separated by spaces to skip over the refrain section in the lower five lyric lines, then add the verses as needed.

--> How can I get the song to be divided up in such a way?

This is not currently supported by NWC. The other staff will have to use whole measure rests, but it will still be visible in all systems.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 30 Jun 1997

For the first situation, and on the second and further verses, I will insert a sufficient number of "space underline space, etc" positions to match the number of notes on the refrain and insert those before each verse. Only need to do it once (for the second verse) and then simply "copy" and "paste" to the third and following verses.

Not sure if I understand the second question, but you may simply need to have two staffs, and simply have the one staff filled with rest notes until that voice comes in. Someone else may have a better idea. Maybe you could have two songs (one with the single part and one with both parts), not have any title information on the second "song" and have the page numbering pick up where the last one ended.

Hope that helps.


#196: Composing for Fife
Composing for Fife

(196)

Submitted by: Anne_O'Malley@hud.gov on 30 Jun 1997

I teach the fife which is historically a B-flat instrument. When composing multi-part tunes, the instrument patches on the Composer do not seem to produce the effect I am trying to achieve. What instrument patch would you recommend I use? And is it possible in the future upgrades to include this woodwind in your instrument patches?

Reply 1 offered by: ddonahue@awod.com on 01 Jul 1997

I got the feeling from the phrasing you used that you are mentally transposing and writing music that a b flat player could play straight up in harmony with the music you did not mentally transpose when writing for the c player. I.E., a d was written on the b flat score and expected to be the same pitch as the c written on the c score. But MIDI and NWC GM instruments are all c instruments. Pitches will not transpose as you change 'playback instrument'. (Also note a piccolo will play bass clef in MIDI/NWC). The experiment-compose a one note song; play, change instrument, play; note that timbre may chage but pitch does not.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 30 Jun 1997

Anne, the sounds generated by NWC are a function of your sound card. The instrument patches generally used by most sound cards are referred to as General MIDI instruments. This is a set of 128 standard instruments supported by almost all sound cards. If you are unhappy with the sound quality of one or more, perhaps a different sound card (or just another patch) may help. An important note here is that the quality varies with the equipment. Only those users with the same equipment as your computer will have exactly the same sensory experience when listening to a particular NWC song.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 3 offered by: ddonahue@awod.com on 03 Jul 1997

One particular card, the Sound Blaster AWE-32 wavetable under Windows 95 and NoteWorthy with playback selected to 'Midimapper' (under tools/options/midi), gives a dissonant effect. With midi playback selected to AWE32 Synthesizer(620) the harmony is much better. My experience is limited to the one card but avoiding midi mapper may be a good idea for all cards under Win95.


#197: "triplet tool" number
"triplet tool" number

(197)

Submitted by: Ivan Rojas on 30 Jun 1997

How can I change the number "3" over the triplet symbol when I use this tool with 6 notes instead of 3?

Reply 1 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 03 Jul 1997

An interim working solutions from the standpoint of printing a score would be to simply not use the triplet tool as such and rather use a slur with the notes in question with a "6" added over the slur through use of the "text" function under the insert menu.

This would obviously not work for "playback" purposes. It would also not work even for score printing purposes if there are multiple staffs at that point, some of which do not contain the sextuplets, since measure bars would then undoubtedly be off.

I agree with the comment that a program alteration could be useful with some added flexibility. The foregoing, however, might occasionally allow an interim working fix for score printing purposes.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Bacher on 09 Jul 1997

The suggestion of a text-inserted number with a slur in the score can even work for playback under some circumstances. If there are no other staves or voices with notes in the normal rhythm, then you can get playback to "work" by inserting hidden tempo changes before and after the Xtuplet notes.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher on 03 Jul 1997

Ivan's questions suggests a possible NWC enhancement: Why not have the "triplet tool" generate a number equal to the number of equal-duration notes that the user selected? In the case of notes of unequal duration, use the shortest duration and compute the number of notes of that duration that would fill out the time. e.g. selecting over one eighth note and three 16th notes would produce a "5" for the implied five 16th notes over 4. (Is this clear?)

Reply 4 offered by: on 01 Jul 1997

Reply 5 offered by: Jane Sugrue on 06 Sep 1997

When I have to beam more than 3 notes (triplets), I highlight the amount of notes to be beamed and press control B. This gives you the correct number of notes with a beam, but you would have to write in the number, or use text insert.


#198: Rudimental Drumming
Rudimental Drumming

(198)

Submitted by: Anne O'Malley@hud.gov on 02 Jul 1997

I arrange for a fife & drum corps (field music) which incorporates fife (previously discussed) and snare and bass drum played rudimentally. I was wondering has anyone out there come of with a way to right the rudimental drum parts so that the play back is as close to the true instrument as possible. If so, could you please share your information with me. THANK YOU!!!!


#199: assigning tempo?
assigning tempo?

(199)

Submitted by: stargate@worldnet.att.net on 02 Jul 1997

There seems to be no difference in tempo between, say quarter note=120and eighth note=240.Why would one change the defining note?It is just a convention...based on key signature...based on the time signature...based on the prevalentnote in the composition???Is this notation used primarily for the musician who'splaying the piece?If my only purpose for creating the piece, is to listen to it from my computer, it seems to make no differencewhat the defining interval is. Is this correct?Thanks for your time.Gordon Isbell

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 21 Jul 1997

Traditionally, the note used for indicating the tempo is the one that represents one beat. For example, you could have :

3/8 : eight note = 240

2/4 or 4/4 : quarter note = 120

2/2 : half note = 60

6/8 or 12/8 : dotted quarter = 80

Reply 2 offered by: Adam Bodkin <boddo@tig.com.au> on 08 Jul 1997

If you have a VERY slow piece in, say, 2/4, the conducter would conduct in 4. If that is the case, the conducter would most likely enjoy the convenience of a tempo marking in the beat they are conducting. Conducters are notorious for not being able to do maths, which explains why they are so lazy, they can't simply double the quarter note tempo marking. :)))

Reply 3 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 07 Jul 1997

From a neophite--

I don't think it is just the time signature, but also the beat pattern. For example, in 6/8 time one would use a quarter note if the music is played with three beats to the bar, but a dotted quarter if it is two beats to the bar. At least, that's what I do. I'm happy to accept corrects from the experts out there.

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 06 Jul 1997

Gordon said: <<<There seems to be no difference in tempo between, say quarter note=120and eighth note=240.>>>

That's correct!

<<<Why would one change the defining note? ...based on the time signature?...based on the prevalent note in the composition???>>>

I don't know for sure, but probably more strictly the first, though I'd feel inclined to use the second reason as well. It is used by composers who want to give a strict tempo for musicians.

<<<If my only purpose for creating the piece, is to listen to it from my computer, it seems to make no difference what the defining interval is. Is this correct?>>>

Correct. It'll make no perceivable difference. (I'm not sure if it alters the timer intervals or whatever, but I expect not). It really is just for the musos so that they don't stuff around with the tempo and do anything too "interpretive".

Regards,

Andrew


#200: Archive of Classical Music
Archive of Classical Music

(200)

Submitted by: Jan hjelm on 06 Jul 1997

Greetings!

I am wondering about the legal aspects concerning the use of copyrighted material and more so about old music where the composer has been dead for more than a hundred years. Perhaps some legal eagle out there would like to comment.

Let´s take an exmple: W. A. Mozart, is his music absolutely free to use as MIDI-files in multimedia-presentations and similar applications or do you have to pay royalties to someone?

If it is free to use as I want, are there any limitaions if I want to publish his music in the form of Noteworthy files?

Why I ask and what I am driving at is a thought that I have got. I would like to publish as much of the classical composers music as possible without taking eny credit for it personally. I want to publish it on the Internet for everybody to copy, use, modify and play at their own leisure. I do not intend to accept any payment for my part in this and I do not want the scores or sheet-music to be subject to any copyright infringements at all.

It is my belief that the classical music should belong to the whole world, and if it is too old to give the composer or his surviving relatives royalties, why should publishing companies earn money by selling the composers scores at the steep prices as they tend to do.

I want to give the world a free source from which to collect free music, music that should never be forgotten. Direct access to a small part of the worlds inheritance.

(I hope someone will say that it is OK to go ahead, just follow these little rules of thumb so that the courts can´t get to you.)

Please feel free to comment on this.

Sincerely

Jan Hjelm Strömnäs SWEDEN

Reply 1 offered by: Karl Albert on 24 Aug 1997

It's really a wonderful idea you have. The copyright laws differ from land to land. But - the longest possible copyright worldwide is 75 years. This affects all countries in the European Community. Therefore - you can publish without any problem music of composers who died more than 75 years ago. The only exception is is you are using scores which are so-called "critical editions" or new versions of the piece because in these cases the scores are under a new copyright. When publishing vocal music you have also to look for the copyright of the author and/or translator of the text because these are also under copyright (of the same 75 years in the European community)

Now - good luck for your plan. I completely agree with your opinion regarding editors. And I am very interesed in your archive.

Best wishes

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 12 Jul 1997

Click on http://www.supnik.com/ It is a site by an attorney that discusses international copyright laws and might give you some help. Search the net under "International Copyright Law" for other sources. That is how I found the referenced site.

It looks like "International Copyright Law" might be a specialty in the legal field.

Good Luck and hope Jan doesn't get discouraged by all the possible legal implications he might find or is pointed by by other forum users.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher on 09 Jul 1997

Before you go ahead, consider this: where are you obtaining the source material for the scores? If you don't have access to the composer's original manuscripts, then you must be working from a published edition. Published editions are protected by the copyright of the publisher. You could find yourself in big trouble if you copy these editions and make them available for free.

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 09 Jul 1997

Check web site <http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/>; for US Copyright Office. Should give you some guidance.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 10 Jul 1997

Except the Jan is in Sweden (and so, presumably, is his ISP), and will be subject only to Sweden's copyright laws. There are critical things like the date of publication of the music being used to consider, as well.

I think Pierre Schwob can produce the midi versions because the music being presented has no exclusive publishers (there are some exceptions) and so only a class action by the publishers would probably work, and hey! as far as I can see, Jan's and Pierre's visions are of great public service. I'm sick of these #@*&^%! publishing houses thinking they own the last word on the music. I bet you that they don't always go to the Liepzig University Archives - or wherever - before they publish.

I'll get off my soapbox now. ;-#)# (Beard and mo).

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 09 Jul 1997

Try this URL for US Copyright Office. http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 06 Jul 1997

As far as PLAYING classical music. See http://www.prs.com/midi.html This is Pierre Schwab's Classical Midi Archives, probably the most comprehensive collection of classical music on the net. I would suggest you visit there first, and maybe talk to Pierre about your project. He has probably had to deal with a lot of the problems you may encounter and may have some good rules of thumb for you to consider.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 8 offered by: J.C. on 09-Jan-1998

To stay safe, simply use pre-wwII editions of the scores, and no one will complain. Ultimately, most editions are standard anyway, since altering the music would defeat the purpose.


#203: Beaming Quavers (eighth notes)
Beaming Quavers (eighth notes)

(203)

Submitted by: Ken Stanton (kstanton@e-mail.com) on 07 Jul 1997

This is probably a result of my rusty theory ! I am transcribing some of our Musical Director's scribblings. These are Big Band arrangements. I have just completed one and have a query. I have a bar (in 4/4 key of C)which consists of 4 pairs of eighth notes on chord members followed by an eighth rest and a dotted quarter note (G). The 1st and 3rd pairs are C and E, the 2nd pair are Db and F, the 4th pair are A and C. The previous bar ends with another pair of chord membered eighth notes C and E. There is a slur from the last pair in the previous bar to the eighth rest in the main bar. Now the question, why can I not beam all the notes together, the program will beam the 1st and 2nd pairs in the main bar but not the 3rd and 4th pairs. I hope that all makes sense ! Is there a rule that I have forgotten ?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Bacher on 09 Jul 1997

Check the score for dynamic markings, text or other stuff that may be sitting between some of the notes that you are trying to beam together.

I've run into this problem, which is quite frustrating when you want to specify a dynamic or expressive marking in the middle of a beamed set of notes.


#204: Entering Notes - what's the best way to do it ?
Entering Notes - what's the best way to do it ?

(204)

Submitted by: ray Vermey (rvermey@hiscom.nl) on 08 Jul 1997

Hello all,

i would like your opinion: Most of the time i 'type over' sheetmusic in NWC. Now i do that as follows: i bring all the notes in as a quarter or an eight note and afterwards by selecting with the mouse i change that note to its wright tempo. Is there a better way ??

Also: inputing 3 notes in one and if one is a half note and the other 2 are quarternotes i just cant get these notes all three in. NWC changes the duration of the hal;f note every time.... ;((( Any idea how to do this ?

Answering via e-mail too is appreciated.

Thanx!!

Ray

Reply 1 offered by: Tim Reichard on 08 Jul 1997

I find that entering notes with their correct durations and accidentals is the fastest way for me, especially using the keyboard to select durations and accidentals. I ignore articulations, dynamics, pedal markings, etc. and add them afterward. I do enter clefs, tempos, and time and key signatures as I go so that I can playback the piece every so often.

When entering chords of notes of different durations, stick to two durations and select them (include dots or double dots) before pressing Enter or Ctrl+Enter.

Also, the notes of one duration must all be above or below the notes of the second duration. Eg., in a chord of quarter notes and half notes, the quarter notes must all be above or below all of the half notes. You can't enter a half note between two quarter notes. To get around this you can enter the half note as a quarter note in the chord and tied to another quarter note. This fix can also be applied to needing three or more durations in the same chord.

I hope I've helped.

Tim Reichard

Reply 2 offered by: Tim Reichard on 09 Jul 1997

I stand corrected.

Don Ferguson pointed out to me through e-mail with an example that indeed you can enter a note of one duration between notes of another duration all in the same chord.

Thanks, Don. It looks like I haven't figured out all that one can and can't do with NWC.

Tim Reichard

Reply 3 offered by: Tim Reichard on 09 Jul 1997

I stand corrected.

Don Ferguson pointed out to me through e-mail with an example that indeed you can enter a note of one duration between notes of another duration all in the same chord.

Thanks, Don. It looks like I figured out all that one can and can't do with NWC.

Tim Reichard

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 10 Jul 1997

Awww, Tim (or Don)! Please do tell us how!

A

Reply 5 offered by: Tim Reichard on 11 Jul 1997

I haven't played with this much, but here's an example:

1. Place a quarter note on a staff with stem down. 2. Add a half note (stem up) as a chord member above the quarter note. 3. Add another quarter note (stem up) above the half note. or 3. Add another half note (stem down) below the quarter note.

You should now have a chord of a half note between quarter notes or vice versa.

You may notice that both step-3's won't both work simultaneously.

Experimentation may yield countless other possibilities.

Thanks again to Don Ferguson for enlightening us on this topic.

Tim Reichard


#205: NWC with Terratec Maesstro card -> More instruments
NWC with Terratec Maesstro card -> More instruments

(205)

Submitted by: Ray Vermey (rvermey@hiscom.nl) on 08 Jul 1997

I am planning to buy a new soundcard, the terratec Maestro 32/96 It has 400 standard instruments so it says. My question is: are these instruments available as a patch or will NWC only use the 128 standard midi instruments ?

Anwers by email will be appreciated!

Cheers

Ray

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 07/08/97 To: rvermey@HISCOM.NL

This post was also duplicated in an e-mail to support. Here is the answer that we provided by e-mail:

Ray:

NWC can select more than 128 instruments if, and only if, the card or synthesizer accepts the MIDI Bank Select messages for this purpose. The bank select is done via the Instrument Patch command in NWC. NWC sends controller changes for CC0 and CC32, in case you need the precise technical description of how NWC supports multiple sound banks.

I hope this helps.

Regards,

Eric,


#206: Can certian note patterns be entered?
Can certian note patterns be entered?

(206)

Submitted by: Cyril N. Alberga on 08 Jul 1997

There are certian note patterns in the scores I have been entering which I have not found any way to represent gracefully. A typical example would be a 4/4 measure containing a: Two half notes b: One quarter note, one half note, one quarter note The only way I have been able to do this is to split the half note in the second group into a pair of tied quarter notes. UGLY!

Is there anything else I can do?

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net> on 15 Jul 1997

Yes, but it is still ugly. In a spirited exchange with Mr Ferguson one of his examples led me to experiment with unobvious (to me) combinations of multi-value chords. Let me attempt to present the results for a single measure.

On a 2/2 staff combine two polyphonic lines, one consisting of 1/2 notes, C followed by D, the other consisting of a 1/4 rest, a 1/2 note on G, and a 1/4 note on F#.

My first attempt was: a chord made up of the 1/4 rest and the 1/2 C; a 1/4 G tied; a chord made up of a 1/4 G and the 1/2 D; the 1/4 F. This works, but is marred by the tie (to my eye, at least).

The alternative is: a chord made up of the 1/4 rest and the 1/2 C; a chord made up of a 1/4 rest and the 1/2 G; a chord made up of a 1/4 rest and the 1/2 D; the 1/4 F. This, also, works, but the aesthetics are not much (if any) better, with two seemingly irrelivant 1/4 rests intruding. In fact if the second and third rests could be made invisible one would have exactly what is realy wanted.

I had not realized, although it is implied in the documentation, that one could cascade such multi- value chords in this way. I wonder if this is an anticipated side-effect, or if it will (however strange looking) remain a property of the system.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards (peter_e@issolutions.co.uk on 16 Jul 1997

Watch out for a bug in cascading chords.

In your first example (with the tied quarter G) try chording a half note (C say) with the final F# quarter note. The length of the bar stays the same, even though the top voice is now five quarter notes long!

Reply 3 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 16 Jul 1997

Yes, sorry I forgot to mention that interesting case. It is one of the reasons that I worry about the whole feature vanishing. In fact, I am going to experiment, to see if I can actually use that behavior in a score where two notes are tied across a change in time signature, which doesn't work in WNC. I would end the previous measure with a 1/2 note (or whatever) paired with a 1/4 rest, and start the new measure with a 1/4 rest. Of course, while it will sound right, it will print totally incorrectly!

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 09 Jul 1997

To clarify: Yes, what I have are multiple voices on one staff of a keyboard score. In the current case, I am trying to enter some of the pieces from the Fitzwilliam Virginal Book (which has other problems, as well, but more of those anon).

Unfortunately, I am a one-finger piano player, but the original scores look perfectly clear to me-- just too hard for me to play.

I have run into many of the same cases in the Cecil Sharp English Country Dance arrangement, and in scores from Chappell's Old English Popular Music.

Reply 5 offered by: Tim Reichard on 08 Jul 1997

I've encountered this problem countless times.

Breaking a half note into two quarter notes tied together is one alternative.

The only other alternative I know is to use two staffs. This will look less ugly, but it's not always a desirable solution.

There is no great fix for this. I suggest you submit this problem to the wish list and cross your fingers.

Sincerely,

Tim Reichard

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 08 Jul 1997

I've been fiddling with this, and looking at the score on NWC. To be honest, I'm not sure that what Cyril wants is the most readable form anyway. Can't say that I've seen it, except maybe in quarter notes and eighth notes.

One other alternative would be to use quarter note chords all the way and tie the appropriate notes to get the desired effect.

Cyril's example looks quite pretty and wavey when done this way. Though legibility is arguable.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Edwards on 09 Jul 1997

Can't say that I've seen it, except maybe in quarter notes and eighth notes.

It's very common in piano scores - which have to be on only two staves. A typical example is when the left hand plays a semibreve at the start of a bar (which lasts the whole bar) and then fills in a middle part of shorter higher notes later on in the same bar. It would look silly (and unreadable) to have to break the long note down into tied notes corresponding to the upper note lengths.

Some time ago NWC pointed out that one had to fake independent voices on the same staff and this does lead to the problems we are encountering. Wouldn't it be nice to be able to assign notes to different voices on the staff? I would envisage giving each note a property similar to stem up/down. A note's position in the bar would calculated only by reference to preceding notes with the same property.

Could a similar problem could also be solved at the same time. NWC won't let you put a rest of the same length or longer than another chord member in a chord. I can't see any practical reason for this, and it makes faking even harder!

Reply 8 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 08 Jul 1997

Example not clear. Send me a sample of the measures as an attachment to an E-Mail message and include your E-Mail address and I will contact you directly. Your explanation of the pattern looks like it covers two measures of 4/4 time.


#207: Suggestion of improvement
Suggestion of improvement

(207)

Submitted by: jan_hjelm@hotmail.com on 08 Jul 1997

Suggestion:

Why not let the Status bar in NWC show not only which part, and it´s name, I´m editing but also which bar I curently have the cursor placed in? This would make editing of orchestral scores so much easier...

Greetings JH

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11 Jul 1997

Please post suggestions via the NoteWorthy Composer wish list page.

Regarding your point, for now you can press Ctrl+G at any time to find out what bar is currently visible at the insertion point. The Goto command automatically shows the current bar when it opens.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson<mrbanjo@bright.net on 08 Jul 1997

The name of the staff you are working on will show in the status bar. 1. Select staff. 2. Click on staff in top row(below blue line). 3. Go to staff properties/general. 4. Put name you want in Name box. Follow same procedure for all staffs which you want to name.

Go to Page Setup. Select measure numbers and measure start.

You should now be able to see the staff name in the status box and the measure number on your screen. Remove the measure numbers if you wish after you are through editing.

Reply 3 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 09 Jul 1997

Look in the help files under GOTO COMMAND. It will explain how to use the command to see which measure you are in if you can't see the measure numbers that you put in your score.

Put the cursor in the measure, Press CONTROL+G and the window for the GOTO command will appear with the measure number of the cursor position. Used with the already showing staff name will help you to keep track of where you are during editing of multiple staff scores.

Eric: The measure number might be easy to add to the status line to the right of the staff name. Adding the beat number as suggested by Andrew Purdom might be a little more difficult. Both suggestions are good.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 08 Jul 1997

yes, but you can't see the bar numbers if your four or five staves down from the top!

Personally, I'd like to see bar number and position within the bar (like beat number + some fraction, or something that would make sense) as well. I must post it to the wish list...

Andrew


#208: Forum User E-Mail address
Forum User E-Mail address

(208)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 09 Jul 1997

Many forum users do not include their E-Mail address in their submission.

I have answered several queries directly. I find direct contact preferable to submitting to the forum because of the length of my explanations and attachments of NWC files to illustrate my reply. It would be nice to be able to attach NWC song files to forum replies. "A picture is worth a thousand words". What say, Eric?

I would suggest to forum users that they include their E-Mail address on all submissions. They could also state in their message if they would or would not want a direct reply.

The forum serves a valuable purpose in bringing NWC users together and my suggestion is intended only improve the communication between NWC users.

I would like to see comments in the forum and in E-Mail messages to me.

Thanks for listening!!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11 Jul 1997

Here are a couple of points that I can contribute:

- We do not currently plan to support file attachments via this forum technology. We may in the future provide a different forum technology that would make this possible, but for now the text only mode is all that we make available.

- As for e-mail addresses, I would recommend to potential posters that an email address is included. If someone feels that they do not want to share an e-mail address (for privacy reasons or whatever), the risk is that a complete answer may not be forthcoming. We leave this decision up to the poster, which I think is the most appropriate approach.

- Lastly, regarding e-mail attachments for NWC files. It is important that the attachment be binary encoded. If an NWC attachment is not handled properly by the mailer, you can try either encoding the file yourself (tools still exist to do this manually), or try zipping the file, as the *.ZIP file type may be handled better by the mailer. This has the added advantage of making the file smaller as well.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net> on 10 Jul 1997

I may be the guilty party, initiating this thread. I never noticed the absence of e-mail addresses, sorry.

Speaking of attachments. When Mr. Furgason exchanged missives with me I found, to my dismay, that the mailer I am using, Netscape 3.1 Mailer, sorely mishandles NWC file, attempting to attach them as text, the result being gibberish, at best. I was successful in sending NWC files only after ZIPing them. Is this a known problem with Netscape, or do I have some private glitch?

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 10 Jul 1997

A keen forum listener, here.

I'm wondering if we should move to a (moderated, or perhaps even unmoderated) newsgroup, or mailing list.

Then attachments are handled by the mail program, we can organise what we want to keep. If it were a mailing list, I would only suggest that the list be echoed onto the forum somehow, that the list be kept private (easiest done if maintained by nwc), and there is a very easy way of adding your name to the list and enquiring if you are on the list from the website.

Regards,

Andrew ($0.02 worth) Purdam

Reply 4 offered by: jan_hjelm@hotmail.com on 13 Jul 1997

The idea of a moderated newsgroup sounds interesting. Especially if there is some means to maintain a sort of file archive where composers can post works that are in progress for comments and suggestions.

Don´t forget to mail me when it is in the air...

Jan Hjelm

Reply 5 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 14 Jul 1997

A voice of concern over converting the forum to a usenet group.

When absolutely needed (i.e. no other options), I will go to usenet groups for information. In the past I have found that platform (1) to be cluttered by bunch of chatter by a limited number of individuals and/or (2) impacted by occasional flaming.

Conversely, I have been impressed by the helpfulness, courtesy and professionalism displayed in the NWC "web-based" forum platform. I wonder if part of quality reflects that the platform invites something more cogent than chatter?

In any event, I am not sure of others' experiences with usenet, but would be personally concerned with a change in format if "in lieu of" the current forum. If folks wanted to create a separate usenet group, certainly that may be possible. Additionally, it would seem that one could request an email address in the forum for more personalized deliveries and attachments if that information is not provided.

Again, simply a concern and input. Steve Pearson

Reply 6 offered by: alanmacrae@enterprise.net on 04 Sep 1997

I disagree with all of the above for reasons of money. Here in UK we are charged horrendous amounts for telephone calls. Using Internet Mail (or any other which allows downloading and off-line reading) shortens the amount of time actually connected to an ISP and hence reduces my telephone bill.

I'm all for converting to a USENET Newsgroup. I would definetely subscribe.

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 13 Jul 1997

One thing I would like, if we went this way, (of using a newsgroup) would be for ntworthy.com to be available as a worldwide newshost for that newsgroup (I'm sure it can be done, though ISPs with firewalls may prevent such a thing).

The reason is that news is notorious for

i) delayed propagation (taking several days to reach all corners of the Internet)

ii) non-propagation (news items may expire before they are delivered)

iii) huge amounts of spam in unmoderated groups, though this is contained mainly to the alt.* newsgroups, which don't have a charter.

A mailing list would be easier and more reliable in this effect, though Noteworthy may wish to somehow feed into something more public (maybe simply an archive on the web) for better PR.

Both methods allow attachments. Maybe a mailing list would be more inclusive of AOL members. (I'd still love to see the AOL archive of nearly 2000 NWC files!!!)

To let users get "in" to a mailing list from the web simply needs a fairly easy web-form that mails the user's e-mail address to the list manager (human or robot) which then verifies it and adds it to the list. By using a verified list as the only allowed posters, we can avoid a fair bit of spam.

Hope this is food for thought,

Andrew (2-cents) Purdam

Reply 8 offered by: Anonymous on 30-Dec-1997

This is a Noteworthy Test!


#209: Adding a line-break to a Stave
Adding a line-break to a Stave

(209)

Submitted by: jhorne@nortel.com on 10 Jul 1997

Greetings,

I was trying out your evaluation copy of noteworthy and have been unable to figure out how to add a line-break to a stave. The stave just keeps growing to the right. Print preview has it going right off the side of the page.

There's probably some obvious command that I am overlooking....

Cheers,

Jay

Reply 1 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 11 Jul 1997

System breaks are placed automatically by NWC. At the moment, there is no way to manually insert a system break. The system breaks will only occur at a bar line. If your printout goes off the right side of the page, you may need to add bar lines. A tool exists to do this automatically, on the Tools menu.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 3 offered by: Thomas Kendon on 11-Nov-1997

If your bar lines go off the edge of the page you need to adjust the margins so that all the music is within the margins of your printer.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jul-2000

As of version 1.70, bar lines can be configured to force a system break in the top most staff of a system.

Bar lines must be present in order for NWC to print a staff or system. If you do not want bar lines in your final printout, then you can hide the bar lines so they only appear in the editor, and are used only in print formatting.


#210: Noteworthy versus Passport Designs
Noteworthy versus Passport Designs

(210)

Submitted by: mrns@istar.ca on 11 Jul 1997

I use Passport Designs notation but recently using Noteworthy demo and really impressed. Does anyone have any comments on advantages of Noteworthy. I am almost sold on it and would like opinions before I commit. Thanks from Brian.

Reply 1 offered by: Jim on 06-Jun-1998

I also have used Passport Designs and I recently tried Noteworthy.
I must say that the interface is excellent and so much better than
that of Passport's. I will be using NoteWorthy Composer from now on.

Reply 2 offered by: Ronald T. Belanger on 10-Jun-1998

I use Encore from Passport Designs, but they are are out
of business. So, I am looking for a replacement. I have a
Macintosh computer and was wondering if you plan on
making your software available on the Mac.

Thanx,
Ron Belanger

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Jun-1998

We do not offer a Mac version of NoteWorthy Composer.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 11-Jun-1998

I use NWComposer since 1995 (or 94?). What I can tell you about it is that you can easily make scores from scratch or for copy, even compose directly with it, make sing-along midi files (for help-learning tools), and all of this really quickly, easily, and happily.
Some features doesn't exist (yet ;-)) but NWC is continuously enhanced (I registered my copy when it started to allow lyrics notation --just at the time I needed this feature). It is not (yet) a perfet, complete score notator, cannot do every thing that a sequencer does (though I do not need any sequencer since I use NWC (reading music is so much simpler!).
And NWC is WYSIWYH (H=Hear). Not WYSIWYPrint, but better : you do not have to take care about page layout for each and every score. The same file can be used to print a "conducteur" (all scores with all staves) or solo part, just a few keystrokes (or clicks) are enough.

PDNHTCM if you need some more comments.

              Marsu

Reply 5 offered by: Lowell Bromeyer on 11-Jun-1998

I composed a number of songs in Musictime 1.2, and exported them into MIDI files with the export feature. However, when I attempted to play them on Win95 PCs, the setup is lost and the parts sound like tin cans.

I subsequently spoke to Guitar Center in Hollywood, CA, who informed me that the problem is that Musictime 1.2 loses some system file that must be maintained if it is to play properly on a Win95 setup. They also said, that Musictime Deluxe should solve my problem, since it works in Win3.1 or 95 invironments.

So, the problem has become finding a copy of Musictime Deluxe (3.5 disk version). Of course, with Passport out of biz, you know the rest.

Can you help me find a copy of Musictime Deluxe?

Reply 6 offered by: Savio D'Souza on 25-Jul-1998

Am unable to get to Passport Designs. Need some help on ENCORE 3.0. How does one enter the lyrics of the song after the song is notated?

Please help

Thanks

Reply 7 offered by: Drake Donahue on 26-Jul-1998

Import to NWC, Edit/Lyrics, type in the lyrics.

Reply 8 offered by: Hey what? on 26-Jul-1998

Lowell said: "Of course, with Passport out of biz, you know the rest."
I didn't know passport was out of biz. So, what's the rest?

A

Reply 9 offered by: Narelle Close on 31-Jul-1998

I have been using Encore for a couple of years now on my Mac, and although I am very happy with it generally, I find that after using it for a short time (maybe ten minutes) the screen freezes, so that if I do not save each line of my work, I lose it. Anyone else had this problem? any suggestions.

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 01-Aug-1998

I would not be very happy with software that hangs every ten minutes.

Reply 11 offered by: Bill Gates on 04-Aug-1998

so Blair, youmust be happy with some µ$ products that freeze every 30 minutes :-)

Reply 12 offered by: G. Miller on 05-Aug-1998

I have been using Encore v. 4.2 and cannot get the program to write the music as I play it on my keyboard. I have the MIDI cable set up such that I can play music from Encore to the keyboard. The record setup has a SB 16 Audio In device driver listed. This driver is actually for audio recording. Since Passport Designs is out of business or may be bought by MidiSoft this year, what do I do? Buy another program such as NoteWorthy? Thanks!

Reply 13 offered by: Blair Dowden on 06-Aug-1998

My µ$ products last a little longer than 30 minutes. Noteworthy, on the other hand, has never let me down. On the issue of switching from another product, Noteworthy is cheap, easy to use and reliable, but it may not give as much control over the printout as the other product can do, as you can see by reading this forum. So the question is what do you really need? Some people with demanding printing requirements find it easier to use Noteworthy and patch up the output with a paint program than to use other software. There are a lot of very satisified customers, such as myself.

Reply 14 offered by: Leo Matheos on 17-Aug-1998

I've been using Encore for years, especially in writing scores by Step-Time. Since Passport Designs is out of biz, I would need advice if NoteWorthy Composer can also do Step Time as good and easy as Encore does? What about NWC printing result? Thanks.

Reply 15 offered by: Max Sterling on 25-Jan-1999

What kind of device (soundcard-synthesizer?)can I use with Noteworthy that playsback with realistic sounds from instruments of an orchestra? I'm not impressed with the cheesy sounds most midis produce or its control of dynamics.
I would like to hear a real cello section, collengo on violins, a Bartok slap included in my orchestrations. Am I just complaining or are there really devices like that out there that can give me a quality orchestra?

Reply 16 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jan-1999

Tall order... especially things like col legno... In a word, the answer to your question is "no." But if you're willing to do a little (or a lot) of fiddling around (pun intended) you may be able to approximate some of these effects using a good DB50XG-based sound card, or perhaps the software equivalent "XG SoftSynth."

The next step beyond that would be something like Turtle Beach, but I'm not sure if the greatly increased cost would result in a comparable increase in sound quality / flexibility.

One difficulty with high-end cards is that though you can make it sound great in your living room, it won't necessarily sound anything like that when you e-mail it to your friend or post it on the web.

Fred


#211: Noteworthy versus Passport Designs
Noteworthy versus Passport Designs

(211)

Submitted by: rmns@istar.ca on 11 Jul 1997

I use Passport Designs notation but recently using Noteworthy demo and really impressed. Does anyone have any comments on advantages of Noteworthy. I am almost sold on it and would like opinions before I commit. Thanks from Brian.

Reply 1 offered by: Michael Wolfindale on 13-Jun-1998

I first used NoteWorthy before Encore 3.0, but I think that NoteWorthy Composer is easier to use, and I am sending wish tips to NoteWorthy, so in NoteWorthy I can use things like trills and crescendo arrows. I think NoteWorthy is one of the easiest music programs I have used, and it is geting better - it is also the cheapest program I have heard about (I think).

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 15-Jun-1998

If you use a Laser Printer, download !www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/nwcconvl.exe after having checked !www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/cresdecr.html : I explain there how you can print > and < signs with NWC.
As you'll be able to see, it's a long-time wish !!!

Hope this helps

Note : Also refer to msg #157, msg #188, msg #166.

                        Dominique


#212: Noteworthy versus Passport Designs
Noteworthy versus Passport Designs

(212)

Submitted by: rmns@istar.ca on 11 Jul 1997

I use Passport Designs notation but recently using Noteworthy demo and really impressed. Does anyone have any comments on advantages of Noteworthy. I am almost sold on it and would like opinions before I commit. Please delete previous dupes. This has correct email address. Sorry. Thanks from Brian.

Reply 1 offered by: taco.rensink@reuters.com on 15 Jul 1997

I have been experimenting with cakewalk for the last couple of month and it is difficult to create songs note by note. Cakewalk , as most other midi programs. has advantages on the midi part but not on staff notation. Last week I downloaded the demo version of noteworthy 1.30d and I am impressed. NoteWorthy is so easy to use and gives me all the flexibility to create songs, in the correct notation. ( like triplets ..etc.) like you I am nearly convinced to buy Noteworthy.

Reply 2 offered by: rmns@istar on 17 Jul 1997

Yes, Noteworthy is impressive. I use it and I also use Music@Passport. (Cant afford Encore of same company). Cant beat Noteworthy for price. The main advantage of Passport products is the page layout. You can set up each page with number of staves and how many measures per stave so that it looks like the score you are copying in. However, when it comes to bells and whistles you have to have Encore to come anywhere close to the facilities offered by Noteworthy.

Reply 3 offered by: on 11 Jul 1997

Reply 4 offered by: on 11 Jul 1997

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 11 Jul 1997

In general, it is a good idea to try software for yourself and draw your own conclusions. We have an evaluation version of NoteWorthy Composer available on this site. In the end, a good software solution depends largely on what you are trying to do. Give the evaluation a try, and see if it does what you want.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)


#213: stereo panning
stereo panning

(213)

Submitted by: on 13 Jul 1997

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 16 Jul 1997

In NWC, the only way to change the stereo position is via the Pan control. This is on a per MIDI channel basis. In many cases, the percussion kits that are supported by a sound card are preconfigured with stereo imaging, where different percussion instruments appear in different parts of the stereo image. Beyond this, NWC does not offer any additional control over this.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: Andre' on 13 Jul 1997

I don't think you can stereo pan 2+ instruments on a single channel. I've tried that with other channels but they didn't work.


#214: Track Structure of Exported Files
Track Structure of Exported Files

(214)

Submitted by: Neeraj Mathur prsnhome@gncom.com on 15 Jul 1997

Is it possible, while exporting, to specify which track in the MIDI file each staff will go to? For instance, when notating a piece which has three Bb Trumpet parts on separate staves, can I put those three staves in one track in the MIDI file? So far, the closest I have found to this is using a type 0 file, but that puts everything in one.

Thanks for your help.

Neeraj Mathur prsnhome@gncom.com

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 16 Jul 1997

As you point out, the options allow you to create either a type 0 MIDI file, or a type 1 MIDI file. In type 0 files, all performance data is exported to a single track. If you mute all staves except the three that you want to combine, then export, the three parts will appear in the single track of the type 0 file. The track will also contain any tempo and other controller changes found in all of the song, even the muted parts.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 16 Jul 1997

Neeraj said: <<Is it possible, while exporting, to specify which track in the MIDI file each staff will go to? For instance, when notating a piece which has three Bb Trumpet parts on separate staves, can I put those three staves in one track in the MIDI file?>>

Yes. In NWC 1.31, just go to Staff Properties (either on right-mouse-button menu or Staff|Properties, or power-users can press F2!) and on the Midi Tab alter the channel number so that they are all the same.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: on 25 Aug 1997


#215: Using various TTF Fonts
Using various TTF Fonts

(215)

Submitted by: Ashwin Batish on 16 Jul 1997

I'd like to know if I can use other styles of fonts. I haven't been able to trigger this. Are there future plans to allow other TTF fonts to be included in Noteworthy?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 16 Jul 1997

We are working on a facility to allow some user selectable fonts for the text used in NWC. The actual font used for notation, however, is likely to continue to be the proprietary NWCV13A font.

Fornow, none of the fonts used in NWC can be customized in their typeface. The sizes change with the notation size, except for authoring info on a printout, which is proportional to the page size.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: RAMON LOPEZ on 03-Apr-1998

i want many fonts true type.
i want kidprint font please
tanks

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 04-Apr-1998

Try the newsgroup alt.binaries.fonts, or do a search on the web using altavista, using keywords like font and kidprint

A

Reply 4 offered by: Pete Bowers on 06-Apr-1998

If anyone is interested:

There are two True Type Fonts available for free download from http://www.efn.org/~bch/aboutfonts.html

These fonts were designed for use with another product but work fine with any application using True Type fonts. They have some features that might be useful such as a glissando.

Reply 5 offered by: xande on 20-May-1998

I`m Brazilian and I need fonts ttf???


#216: Staff Wraparound
Staff Wraparound

(216)

Submitted by: Ashwin Batish on 16 Jul 1997

I noticed that the staff keeps its horizontal nature and doesn't wraparound. Although in print preview it looks right. Is there a way to make the screen page look like the print page so everything can be viewed without scrolling to the right?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 17 Jul 1997

The editor dispalys each staff horizontally along a single horizontal axis over time. System level views are only possible when printing or previewing a printout.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Hood on 09-Jan-1998

We note your response to Ashwin Batish and regard it as most
unhelpful. In our opinion many song writers
folk musicians and teachers require the facility to layout
the page exactly as they wish so that particular problems
can be highlighted or to make performance easier.

In particular we would like to print folk tunes 4 bars to a
line, no more no less.

We can force the layout to what we want by using new staff
but we then lose the ability to play back.

Reluctantly we are unable to order your software solely due
to the lack of this facility. If you have rectified this
problem we will be happy to place an order and recommend
it to our friends and colleagues.
regards Peter Hood and John Ashurst the Banjax Banjo Band


#217: 5 beats in a 4 beat measure?
5 beats in a 4 beat measure?

(217)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 17 Jul 1997

I have been corresponding with a forum user and we are unable to agree that a five beat count can be in a four beat measure that has a split stem chord. This is possible because of the way NWC counts beats when there are split stem chords in a measure.

For the purpose of an example notate the following on a single treble clef staff in 4/4 time.

Note 1. Enter an upstem 1/2 note on B.

Note 2. Attached a downstem middle C to note 1 as a chord member to make a split chord.

Note 3. An upstem 1/4 note B with tie.

Note 4. An upstem 1/4 note B (will tie to previous 1/4 note B

Note 5. A downstem 1/2 note Middle C attached as a chord member to Note 4 to form a split chord.

Note 6. An upstem 1/4 note B.

Your measure should begin with a split chord containing an upstem 1/2 note B and a downstem 1/4 note middle C. To the right of the split chord should be a single upstem 1/4 note B with tie. To the right of that note should be a split chord containing a 1/4 note B tied back to the preceding B and a downstem 1/2 note middle C attached to form a split chord. as a split stem chord. To the right of that split stem chord should be an upstem 1/4 note B.

Pardon me if I overdid my description of the measure.

Now, if you saw that measure on a printed sheet and a 1/2 note is 2 beats and a 1/4 note is 1 beat, then how many beats are in the measure?

Looking for your answers in the forum.

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net on 18 Jul 1997

Being the disagreeable (? well, I hope not, lets say the unconvinced) user I would like to throw in my two cents (to coin a phrase).

I think the problem here is what we mean by a measure. To me, a measure is not the space between two vertical bars, after all you could put them between every pair of notes, but a sequence of notes comprising the number of beats defined by the time signature. So, by definition a measure in 4/4 time can not contain more (or less) than four beats. What we are discussing here is simply a non-standard representation.

Two further tests are called for.

First, (after changing the B to something more euphonious) add a bass staff, set it to channel 10 and fill it with 1/4 notes, to establish a beat. Then run the bar-line audit on the result. You will find that NWC doesn't think the fifth beat (the last 1/4 note) belongs in the measure, it will move it to the following measure. The first measure still looks odd, with the trailing 1/2 note (as discussed in a previous thread), certianly not "normal" notation. Now, play the result. If you listen closely you will hear the 1/2 note in question sound during the last beat of the first measure and the first beat of the following (added by audit) measure. Thus, while it LOOKS as if there are five beats, there are really only four.

Second, replace the offending 1/2 note by a pair of tied 1/4 notes. The music hasn't changed, but now all is well in the notation department. Do this to the pre-audited staff and the audit will leave you with a absolutely correct result.

I won't get into the pros and cons of this peculiarity of NWC (for selfish reasons I hope it presists due to the inability to tie across a key signature change--not time as I erroniously stated in an earlier posting), but one should consider what is happening when the "play" button is clicked. As I understand it (and I am sure I will be corrected if I am wrong, please do) a MIDI command tells the machinery to start producing a defined sound at a given time, for a given duration. MIDI knows nothing of measures or bar lines. Thus, NWC launchs the 1/2 note at the end of its measure and leaves it to the mercy of the MIDI sequencer. It is interesting that if you export this example to MIDI and then import it certian information is lost, in particular the second of the tied 1/4 notes is missing, as it the second "half" of the final (bar-spanning) 1/2 note. I suspect this is an error.

So, certianly by my abstract definition of a measure, one can never have five beats in a four beat measure, and by the evidence of my ear this is true, dispite the evidence of my eye. It may look that way, but it just ain't so.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 17 Jul 1997

This behaviour is a function of how NWC handles split chords. NWC does not truly support two voices in a single staff. However, it will allow you to construct a split stem chord, with differing durations in the upward stem notes verses downward stem notes. This technique allows a notation that will appear to support two voices per staff. However, NWC will only actually use the lesser duration in a split stem chord. So, an upward stem quarter note combined with a downward stem half note will be treated exactly the same as a quarter note by itself (in the alignment, formatting, and playback positioning of notes that follow it).

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards (peter_e@issolutions.co.uk on 17 Jul 1997

See 'Can Certain Note Patterns be Entered?' earlier in the Forum where we've already agreed that this phenomenon exists!


#218: Tie to Coda
Tie to Coda

(218)

Submitted by: Tim Reichard on 17 Jul 1997

I'm trying to enter a piece that has a coda. The note before the To Coda command is tied to the following note, but not to the first note of the coda like I want. On playback the first note of the coda is resounded, but I want it to be tied and not resounded. Any suggestions?

Tim Reichard

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 17 Jul 1997

Tim:

Please submit your file for review to our support@ntworthy.com account. If you explain what you are trying to do, we will look into it.

I hope this helps. ---- Eric (support@ntworthy.com)

Reply 2 offered by: Tim Reichard on 21 Jul 1997

Here's the basic structure of the piece my question refers to:

1. A Segno sign appears before an opening master repeat bar line.

2. Then, several measures.

3. In the last half beat of the next measure, an eighth note on middle C with a tie.

4. Immediately after the eighth note, a "To Coda" flow direction.

5. Next, a bar line, and a whole note (middle C) tied to the previous eighth note.

6. Then, several more measures.

7. Then, a first ending bar with a closing master repeat bar line.

8. Next, a second ending bar followed by a few measures and then a "D.S. al Coda" flow direction.

9. A "Coda" flow direction followed by another whole note on middle C.

On playback, the eighth note before the "To Coda" command appears and sounds tied to the whole note of the following measure during the first two times it is encountered (no problem so far).

However, the third time through (after reaching the "D.S. al Coda" and repeating back to the "Segno" sign) the eighth note is to be tied to the whole note that begins the Coda. But this doesn't happen, neither visually or audioly; the whole note is resounded (rearticulated).

I want the whole note of the coda to be tied (not resounded) to the eighth note preceding the "To Coda" command on playback.

Any suggestions?

Thanks, Tim Reichard


#221: 4 notes in 3 beat group (6/8 time)
4 notes in 3 beat group (6/8 time)

(221)

Submitted by: leonard_rosten@compuserve.com on 21 Jul 1997

I can write the 4 semiquavers in a beamed group, but when I add a 4 (in text) over the group, the beaming splits into 2 sq's, 4 sq's and another 2 sq's.

Any advice from out there please?

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan (kentd@dataworks.com) on 01 Aug 1997

My problem is a group of 5 sixteenth notes. You have to group 2 + a triplet, because if you have 4 quarter notes in one bar, and 17 sixteenths in another part, then the bar lines don't line up. Midi always seems to want to give full value to a sixteenth,

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 22 Jul 1997

Q&D (quick and dirty):

insert the text to the left of the group, turn off preserve width, and insert as many spaces as you need to move the 4 into position.

Andrew


#222: Trills, tremollos and mordents
Trills, tremollos and mordents

(222)

Submitted by: leonard_rosten@compuserve.com on 21 Jul 1997

I can find no information on these in the Help notes. Can anyone advise?

Reply 1 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 22 Jul 1997

Basically, they are not directly supported by NWC. However, as people keep asking, it must come on board someday (SOON, I hope!) ;-)

In the mean time, you can fudge several things as described on the user tips page.

/composer/usertips.htm

Also, some of us users have used pitch controllers to similar effect, depending upon which voice you are using and attack/decay characteristics.

Regards, Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 21 Jul 1997

See Andrew Purdam's submissions to User Tips.

Andrew, Andrew, where are you

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Gill on 16-Jan-1998

I once had this problem, too. Sorry, there is no way to get
trills on NWC, but you can sub by having 32nd notes in it's
place. Sure, it's tedious, but, hey! That's life.
I sure hope NWC comes out with trills soon.

From, the not-so-famous songwriter,
Foolio Pepper (a.k.a. Joe Gill)

Reply 5 offered by: leigh latchum on 21-May-1998

help!!!!i am looking up data on trills, mordent, ornaments, apoggiaturas, anything to help me better teach in my private music studio....i happened upon this site, but i am mostly in need of direction to a site that will clearly educate me on teaching ornaments in regards to baroque vs classical vs romantic vs modern periods. Any suggestions? My instrument is violin. Thanks...will chk for response daily. Leigh


#223: lyrics
lyrics

(223)

Submitted by: Geoff Freed on 23 Jul 1997

I want to add lyrics to my score. The problem is, the lyrics don't start until well into the piece. Is there a way to skip whole sections of the score before adding the lyrics, or do I have to insert an underline (skip note symbol) under each and every note before inserting my lyrics? Thanks. Geoff Freed

Reply 1 offered by: Fabricio gómez on 08-Nov-1997

Send me some accordion tango pieces by e-mail

Reply 2 offered by: fabricio on 08-Nov-1997

Send me some lyrics of some accordion tango pieces.

Reply 3 offered by: Martti Pesso on 16-Dec-1997

You should use the underline with a space between the
underlines. That has worked for me. You can always cut
and paste the long empty lines of underlines to second
and third and so on verses too.


#224: Conflicting Objectives of NWC
Conflicting Objectives of NWC

(224)

Submitted by: leonard_rosten@compuserve.com on 23 Jul 1997

There is a conflict of purpose inherent in NWC.

It will produce very attractive scores and it offers aural playback, but the playback requirement overrules elegant part production.

There is a lack of available options for producing fully articulated instrumental parts. Trills and other ornaments have to be fudged, for example.

The most serious I have yet discovered is losing the bar count when introducing extended tacit bars.

Better options should be provided for Titling, and a short title should be printed as a Header on subsequent pages. Not all of us use American foolscap and there should be a page size option.

Overall there is a need for two distinct versions. One for part production and a second for MIDI playback

Best regards

Leonard Rosten

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin <boddo@tig.com.au> on 25 Jul 1997

I think we have forgotten something here. The difference between $50 and $1500. I know what I would prefer, and it's on my computer now, doing a perfect job.

Reply 2 offered by: christian wollin on 24 Jul 1997

I agree with some of the points mentioned in the discussion, but unfortunately I think Andrew is right about what you want is a much more expensive program like for example Cubase. I am a musicteacher and I use NWC as a complement to a sequenser like Cakewalk. I record in realtime and then import the music and the VERY basic notation to NMC via midi and fix it up as good as NWC is capable of. Of course there are things like thrills and mordent and other stuff that I would like NWC to handle better, but Eric must know by now what the users are wishing for. All in all I think NWC is OK. Keep the discsuusion going since I think it´s good for all of us to hear different aspects on different problems. Regards Christian

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 23 Jul 1997

Leonard has addressed some good key issues here. Admittedly, they are ones that we've covered before, and to be frank (and possibly unfair) I'm a little disappointed that they haven't hey been addressed. But read on:

<<<There is a conflict of purpose inherent in NWC.>>>

I believe that NWC was created to address that exact issue. I also believe that it hasn't got there yet, for the same reasons you give below.

<<<It will produce very attractive scores and it offers aural playback, but the playback requirement overrules elegant part production.>>>

This is true for the embellishments that we ALL keep harping on about, but as Jan and Gordon point out, it is brilliant as long as we keep it simple.

I hope fervently that Eric is addressing the "twiddles" problem (see below), as I know there are a lot of us out here that want to be able to score twiddles easily, AND have them play back accurately. (All in all, a big ask that I imagine - not sure - that only expensive things like Cubase pro can deal with at the moment).

<<<There is a lack of available options for producing fully articulated instrumental parts. Trills and other ornaments have to be fudged, for example. The most serious I have yet discovered is losing the bar count when introducing extended tacit bars.>>>

Can you detail this (I _think_ I know what you mean) and send it to Eric. Sounds like an easy one to fix.

Fudging of trills can also be improved, printwise, by having an extra stave which implements the sound of the trills, but doesn't print out. I know, this doesn't always work.

<<<Better options should be provided for Titling, and a short title should be printed as a Header on subsequent pages. >>>

Or footer.

<<<Not all of us use American foolscap and there should be a page size option. >>>

Hmm. I thought it took page size off the printer defaults.

<<<Overall there is a need for two distinct versions. One for part production and a second for MIDI playback >>>

No no no no no no please no! We are so close here to a REALLY good integrated product. We all just need Eric to sleep less and program more! :-)

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net> on 23 Jul 1997

I seem to have a foot in each camp. I, too, am not a musician. I can read a score at a piano, but not in "real time". However, the stuff I have been trying to enter is sometimes rife with trills, arppegios and mordents, and sometimes symbols that I can't identify! It also may contain polyphonic voices in the piano scores, some of which can be delt with by odd uses of rests (see my question and associated postings, below--I forget the subject), but others, such as "double-stem" notes, often of differing values, can only be entered by splitting the piano score into three, four, and sometimes more staffs. For listening, this is okay, although a bit harder for me to follow. If I get to printing these out, though, it is not good at all.

So: I would like to be able to watch the score I cribed from go by as I listen. I guess I'm asking for more notation support, but a split isn't obviously the answer for me.

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 5 offered by: jan_hjelm@hotmail.com on 23 Jul 1997

No conflict exists as far as I am concerned. I am not a musician, nor a composer, I can´t play any instrument, I can´t read a score in realtime and play any instrument from it. Maybe you wonder why I use the program at all? I´ll tell you. I use Noteworthy because it is the only possible way for me to get in personal contact with music. It is very easy to use, there is no stress as I don´t have to record the music via a sequenser and get a sloppy result in the score - like Music-Time or Cakewalk. I can get an excellent output on an ordinary laserprinter if I need it. Let me give you an example: A friend of mine got married this midsummer. I wanted to give her something special as a weding gift. I found a march by Schumann, and old score. I typed it in to NWC and listened. The piece was beatiful, and perfect to use as a weddingmarch. I shortened it, changed the tempo and corrected an obvious typo from the original score and printed it. I gave it to the girl a week before the wedding and the organist in the church could play the piece from the score I had produced. And the best of all - it sounded as I had thought it would when I sat in front of the computer. A program that can do such marvellous things, I wouldn´t have it split in two different programs.

Please excuse me if I have been at bit verbose in this comment, but NWC is a matter of the heart for me as it has openend a hitherto closed world for me...

Jan Hjelm

Reply 6 offered by: stargate@worldnet.att.net on 23 Jul 1997

I must vote with Jan. I have no musical talent; only an abiding love of music. I find old songbooks and notate them into NWC. I'm working through a treasury of Stephen Foster now. When a song's all done, I assign the tempo and voices I want and play them for the enjoyment of me and my wife. This enables us to hear old songs we would never again have the opportunity to listen to. I have tried MusicTime Deluxe, Cakewalk, Finale, and Midi Workshop, and for my purposes, NWC is perfect!Gordon

Reply 7 offered by: Craig Butcher on 12-Jan-1998

This is going to be a teaching tool "toy" especially for my girls.

They will write stuff and produce scores and we will play it

We will use the transposition element to produce Bflat accompaniments

The $700 Finale packages are more capable but too complicated for
educational use at this (middle school) level.

Still we need to see some basic embellishments, esp. crescendos,
and the other markings the girls are seeing (in Suzuki Piano).

Little by little we'll get there. I evaluated this package a year
and a half ago and it wasn't good enough...today it's far
advanced and I bought it! I am looking forward to its
development.


#225: Dynamics
Dynamics

(225)

Submitted by: Tavish Donahue on 23 Jul 1997

Does fff correspond to 127 "Part Volume" as written on the "Midi" tab? What is the numerical difference from ppp to pp to p etc? I have a piece that runs from ppp to ff where ff is comfortably audible but by pp the sounds of silence are playing. But then it is a Soundblaster AWE 32 I'm using.

Reply 1 offered by: stargate@worldnet.att.net on 23 Jul 1997

Yes. The numbers assigned to each velocity is shown in a chart in the manual. But, if you don't like, them, change them. The help file explains how.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 23 Jul 1997

Gordon, (I presume it's you),

I couldn't find the velocities in my manual, but they were in the on-line help (always useful to look there, using the Find facility in Help 95).

The values are

ppp 10

pp 30

p 45

mp 60

mf 75

f 92

ff 108

fff 127

In reply to Tavish, <<<Does fff correspond to 127 "Part Volume" as written on the "Midi" tab? >>>

Yes.

<<<What is the numerical difference from ppp to pp to p etc? >>>

See above

<<<I have a piece that runs from ppp to ff where ff is comfortably audible but by pp the sounds of silence are playing. But then it is a Soundblaster AWE 32 I'm using. >>>

This will vary a lot according to what midi box you're using, how noisy your room is, what volume settings are being used, whether you're using headphones. I have a piece (http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/carmen.mid) which uses ppp as well as fff. The ppp sounds fine on mine, (albeit very quiet) so long as I've had a fair pp (no funny smirks, now...) before hand.

Regards,

Andrew

PS: Have a play of the above file and tell me what you think...) I also have all of Mozart's Piano Sonata XI (K.331), which finishes with the Rondo Alla Turca at http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/mzrtk331.mid and more to look at at http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html

Cheers

Reply 3 offered by: on 24 Jul 1997


#226: NWC an overall view
NWC an overall view

(226)

Submitted by: leonard-rosten on 25 Jul 1997

I seem to have raised a hornet's nest from some of your clients. This was certainly not my intention.

I have had this software for less than a week and my first impression was that it was miraculous! My present opinion is no less impressive. Surely I am allowed to ask "If only...."

I can well understand that my requirements may be a little different from others, but the printed parts are so beautiful, I would like them to be even more so and not need to be overwritten by hand.

Don Ferguson was good enough to show me that spaces could be added after the insertion point when adding text to a staff. This simple explanation has overcome most of my problems with producing instrumental parts for a symphonic wind band.

In suggesting two separate versions, this would only require an extension to the present (non playable0 character setin the Text option. I do not want to see any changes to the playback version which gives great delight to your followers. I just want to produce beautiful working instrumental parts.

Is everybody happy :-)

Leonard


#227: Conflicting objectives of NWC
Conflicting objectives of NWC

(227)

Submitted by: kob@pchelp.gen.nz on 25 Jul 1997

Real value for money. The ornaments are not much of a problem as many are performed differently at different tempi and may may vary from performance to performance. For midi they need to be written out in full. All that is really needed is a few signs for them (perhaps additions to the text character set).

More easier handling of multiple voices on a single stave would be helpful as would being able touse double tails.

I would like to be able to use slurs in a vocal work without having tied to the vocal line.

NWC as it is is good compromise of features and program complexity. The author is to be commended for its elegance.

Kevin O'Brien

Reply 1 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen, ciw323@be.ibm.com on 28 Jul 1997

Andrew Purdam is right, imho, when he says we should keep encouraging and chivvying NoteWorthy to make their good product even better. * Implementing trills and other ornaments as symbols with no MIDI meaning would satisfy the user who need to see this sort of information in their scores and leave people who know more about midi free to tweak their scores for exactly the results they want. * Giving us more control over text fonts, titles and an option for headers and footers shouldn't be that big a challenge, surely? * Sorting out notational errors (like double bars for repeats that show up with a space between them) and omissions (like collapsing multiple-bar rests when printing single parts) should be a matter of self-respect <grin> In general, there is no competition for NoteWorthy; but if you look back through the forum and the archives you see the same requests and suggestions coming up time after time. At the moment, you can't notate (say) a Mozart piano sonata or a four-part hymn setting on two staves correctly. Go for it, Eric!

Niels Grundtvig Nielsen, ISDC Technical Author (in real life musician, cook, wordsmith and tram-lover)

Reply 2 offered by: kob@pchelp.gen.nz on 29 Jul 1997

Neils Neilsen highlights the conflicting user interests. I too would like the fonts, enhanced parts writing and other fixes too.

It may be possible to make the program more useable quickly for some of us by simply adding signs to the text character set (if there is such a thing thing as a "simple" program mod.) The implementation of a midi trill is not simple. Each one would have to be user defined to fit the musical context although there are some general rules which could be shown in a style pick list. Effectively we would end up hidden notation attached to a sign.

Kevin O'Brien


#228: MusiXTeX Converter?
MusiXTeX Converter?

(228)

Submitted by: John Wendt j_wendt@acm.org on 26 Jul 1997

Is there a utility that will convert from .nwc files to input for MusiXTeX? NWC is great for input, as far as it goes, but it doesn't go far enough, and for publication the lack of spacing control is a problem.

Reply 1 offered by: lronard rosten on 26 Jul 1997

You have summed up the problem admirably!

Regards

Leonard


#229: Use of Laptop Speaker
Use of Laptop Speaker

(229)

Submitted by: R.McLemore on 30 Jul 1997

I would like to take NWC on the road with my laptop but do not have any midi capability. Can I get NWC to playback through the PC speaker in order to do rough layouts?

Reply 1 offered by: Adrie <bouwmstr@worldonline.nl> on 25 Aug 1997

No a PC speaker is not meant to produce sounds from a midi device. You need an external sound device e.g. the Yamaha MU10. This functions on the serial port of your laptop and works fine.

Reply 2 offered by: Steven Stewart on 08 Sep 1997

Yes, but my idea would still work :)

Reply 3 offered by: Steven Stewart (brandx@dunraven.com) on 30 Jul 1997

I haven't heard of a MIDI PC Speaker driver, however, there is a PC Speaker Driver that supports 8-bit 11KHz wav files. You could download that (for windows, by the way) from Microsoft Software Library, or search for it, and install it. Then, download WAVMaker for Windows 2.5 which will convert MIDI files to WAV files.

The process you would go through is to export to a MIDI file from NWC, then convert it to a wav file with the appropriate settings, then listen to it through PC Speaker. Note: If you use Sound Rec., it will only load files that are "so" big, based on your amount of RAM.

WAVMaker can be found at www.shareware.com, search for it under win3.1 or win95.


#230: Help!
Help!

(230)

Submitted by: Leonard Rosten on 30 Jul 1997

Has anyone found that the Help facility is not particularly helpful.

Rather than explain how a feature is employed it merely confirms that the feature exists, and you have to experiment to find out how it actually works.

Not having a separate manual means demands a more useful Help system.

HELP!

Sorry, if all that sounds a bit tough :-)

Leonard

Reply 1 offered by: Any tips on spacing rests? on 01 Aug 1997

My biggest problems stem from having instruments out for 16 bars, then another 8, etc. Spacing these so that they lay our right is giving me fits. The standard (for dance band music) is 4 bars across. That means that the default spacing sometimes leaves you with a pickup bar starting on the right edge of the page, which is visually unpleasing and also hard to read. I've tried added spaces with the text feature, but the bar lines don't line up then. At present, I can have my score, but I can't print parts from that without re-editing and cleaning up all the single bar rests. Any ideas?

Of course, I have to merge with a word processor to print instrument parts on the top left of the page, and to include Music/Lyrics/and Arranger credits on the right. This is tiresome, but at least it looks right.

Any tips appreciated.

Reply 2 offered by: Kent Dugan kentd@dataworks.com on 01 Aug 1997

I'm having trouble with the midi lingo. Been in music for a long time, but somehow the setup for midi just doesn't tell me anything. 1 good example of something that works would be better than throwing around terms that mean little. As far as midi goes, at least. I see the midi options, but I still can't set it up with out trial and error. Sorry about the blank message. My mouse spasm'ed out.

Reply 3 offered by: Kent Dugan on 01 Aug 1997

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 02 Aug 1997

Kent said: <<I have an old sound blaster pro. ...all of the slick games out there put out really slick sound on my card, and I'm thinking "why can't I get that here where I really need it?" There must be a way. It has to be a better driver, because the games all come with proprietary drivers, and they sound great. >>

I think you're right about drivers. I'm not sure how the SBPro card works, but the AWE cards (Advanced Wave E... er.. Eccentricity?!) can load samples into the sound chip and play them like wave table chips. So you can have a chorus of chickens singing "In the mood" if you want.

HOWEVER, this is getting into proprietry (System Exclusive) formats which are much better dealt with by more MIDI specific sequencers.

BUT it would be great if NWC would allow us to include AT OUR OWN RISK arbitrary midi data ANYWHERE in a score. Maybe INSERT MIDI FILE... or something. and then we can take responsibility for System Exclusive stuff.

YET there are improved drivers for General midi.

You may wish to explore Cerative Labs Web site http://www.ctlsg.creaf.com/zonemenu.html Follow your nose down Tech | Drivers and look for the drivers appropriate to your card. Be warned! Sometimes they'll also have OLDER drivers!

WHAT COULD NWC DO ABOUT THIS GENERAL PROBLEM? In my opinion, it's not Noteworthy's fault if we have crappy General Midi cards. However, a list of up-to-date drivers which give the best sound for popular cards would be VERY HELPFUL.

Hope I helped.

Andrew

Reply 5 offered by: kentd@dataworks.com on 05 Aug 1997

Most interesting... I've played In The Mood since 1960, yet I'd never really considered a chorus of chickens. Maybe a gaggle. Worth investigating. Do the AWE cards (or the soundblaster with a daughtercard) produce really nice midi sounds (like the aforementioned games?). Anyone know the answer to this? So far, I can't get Midi in to the card recognized, so I'm still in trial an error mode. Can get NWC to play the keyboard, but not the other way around. By starting the NWC32 version and going to the midi tab, trying to leave this area tells me that my midi device is not responding. I don't have a clue what's expected here. Why isn't it responding? How do I test for this?If a keyboard is plugged in properly and set up, should I be able to play the keyboard and hear it through the computer? Is it that simple when it's working right? And have I asked my limit of questions yet? Sorry, but this is frustrating. I bought a midi cable, but I can't even prove it works, let alone the keyboard midi out.

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew on 06 Aug 1997

KD: Most interesting... I've played In The Mood since 1960, yet I'd never really considered a chorus of chickens. Maybe a gaggle.

Me: Ha ha! But seriously, there was a hit a while ago which was just that! Truely!

KD: Do the AWE cards (or the soundblaster with a daughtercard) produce really nice midi sounds (like the aforementioned games?).

AP: Mine does, but I'm using external midi. The AWE cards need the right driver, otherwise they'll probably sound like tinny FM synths.

KD: So far, I can't get Midi in to the card recognized, so I'm still in trial an error mode.

AP: Try playing a straight midi file from somewhere that traditionally worked for you, like MPLAYER, and make sure that works. Check your configuration for your card (I mentioned this in a Forum reply to Leonard very recently).

KD: Can get NWC to play the keyboard, but not the other way around.

AP: Make sure the input cable is plugged in! If you've got midi out working, then possible errors have already been greatly reduced! Next check that the Options|MIDI tab has Port Usage set for while active or Always (otherwise it can't READ the midi device at a useful time). Lastly, make sure that TOOLS|Midi Input Active is ... er... active. Really lastly, press a key and hope like hell.

KD: By starting the NWC32 version and going to the midi tab, trying to leave this area tells me that my midi device is not responding. I don't have a clue what's expected here. Why isn't it responding? How do I test for this?

AP: Hmm. This is for your internal midi, right? Sounds like the driver isn't working. Either that or another program was using the midi device.

KD: If a keyboard is plugged in properly and set up, should I be able to play the keyboard and hear it through the computer?

AP: If you have Echo midi input turned on. This is in Options|Record

KD: Is it that simple when it's working right?

AP: Yes.

KD: And have I asked my limit of questions yet?

AP: Yes. er. no

KD: Sorry, but this is frustrating. I bought a midi cable, but I can't even prove it works, let alone the keyboard midi out.

AP: Sounded like you had it going out to the kb okay. For both directions, you'll need two cables, won't you?

Regards,

Andrew

PS: Feel free to ask more questions! ;-)

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 31 Jul 1997

You have my sympathy Leonard. I remember having similar problems getting started without any primers to help me. The "Getting Started" section is a good starting point, though.

Using Help's Search mechanism was useful, though using Win95's FIND is much better, as it will find any use of a particular word, not just index entries.

Cheers.

Andrew


#231: Text
Text

(231)

Submitted by: Nicole (magrupt@hotmail.com) on 30 Jul 1997

Is there any way to write a small paragraph about the piece you just wrote underneath the music? It is important because we are using it at school and credit needs to be given to the person who wrote that arrangement or composition. Thankyou.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 31 Jul 1997

In the Song Author Info Dialog (File|Info, or Ctrl-I), the Copyright notices 1&2 are printed below the music on the first page. This may be exactly what you want. It gives you two lines' worth.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 31 Jul 1997

Your comments can be added by a word processor.

You will have to experiment with the margins in page setup in NWC and set according to the amount of space you will need. Unchecking the Title Page Info on General Page Set-up will give you additional space to play with at the top of your page. As long as you are going to use a word processor anyway you could also have a fancy looking title if you wanted to.

Experiment with top and bottom margins. Print your composition and see how much space is available at the top and bottom of the page. Insert the printed page back into your printer, go to your word processor and compose and print out your text in the blank space available.


#232: Editing Staff
Editing Staff

(232)

Submitted by: Alex Lubman on 31 Jul 1997

I'm a new user, and I bet this is simple but I am stumped. I foolishly entered a piano piece on two separate staves and want to convert them into a grand staff. Long piece, I don't want to re-enter it. Thanks for any help.

Alex alubman@wvu.edu

Reply 1 offered by: Tim Reichard on 31 Jul 1997

This isn't so foolish. All you need to do is change the visual staff styles:

Choose Score Review (press R).

Double-click the right hand staff in the dialog box to change Staff Properties. Click on the Visual tab. Change the Style to Upper Grand Staff. Click OK.

Similarly, change the left hand staff style to Lower Grand Staff.

You probably will want any pedal markings to show only in the LH staff yet include the RH staff on playback. You can do this by assigning the same channel to both staffs. This is done through the Midi tab of the Staff Properties dialog box. If the staffs have different channels, then you'd have to enter pedal markings in both staffs.

Hope I've helped, Tim Reichard

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards (peter_e@issolutions.co.uk) on 01 Aug 1997

Marginally quicker is:-

Right Click staff Left Click properties Select style

And remember you can always select an entire staff, and cut and paste it to a new staff, so there is no need to re-enter what you've already got!

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 01 Aug 1997

Tim said <<You probably will want any pedal markings to show only in the LH staff yet include the RH staff on playback. You can do this by assigning the same channel to both staffs. This is done through the Midi tab of the Staff Properties dialog box. If the staffs have different channels, then you'd have to enter pedal markings in both staffs. >>

Tim! That's a brilliant little tip! I think that should go in user tips (unless it's already documented somewhere).

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Tim Reichard on 01 Aug 1997

Andrew writes: >Tim! That's a brilliant little tip! I think that should go in user tips (unless it's already documented somewhere).

It's a very helpful tip for piano scores.

One of the forum messages since April or so of this year either stated this pedal markings tip, or else said enough that I figured it out. I know that whichever message it was mentioned channels (possibly Andrew's "Re: Track Structure of Exported Files"?).

If anybody knows if the pedal markings tip (that I mentioned two levels up in this thread) is in this forum somewhere, please let me know. I'd love to submit it as a User Tip, but I don't want to take credit for it if I don't deserve it.

Thanks.

Tim Reichard <dennisr@postoffice.ptd.net>

If this message doubles, it's because submitting it the first time gave me a "Document contains no data" error.


#233: Labelling the Staff
Labelling the Staff

(233)

Submitted by: Nicole again!!! on 01 Aug 1997

If you're doing like an orchestral (conductors!) score, is there any way that you can label each line of music with the appropriate name?? I can't find out how to do it anywhere.

Reply 1 offered by: Tim Reichard on 01 Aug 1997

Hi again, Nicole.

Staffs can be labelled:

Right-click the staff and choose Staff Properties. Click the General tab. Enter the staff name. Click OK.

The score editor displays the name of the current staff in the status bar at the bottom of the screen.

Use Page Setup (File menu) to choose where staff labels will print.

Hope I've helped,

Tim Reichard

Reply 2 offered by: Derek on 02-Jan-1998

However, when you have a piano part, and you want to label it, you can't label "piano" in between the two staves.


#234: Playback
Playback

(234)

Submitted by: Loenard Rosten on 01 Aug 1997

There is a vast array of instruments available for playback but they all sound like 'comb and paper' mouth organs.

Is it NWC?

Is it my sound card?

Or is there something I ought to know about?

Leonard

PS thank you Andrew for your help

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan (kentd@dataworks.com) on 01 Aug 1997

I had to laugh. My sentiments exactly! I have an old sound blaster pro. I know I shouldn't have to buy a $200 sound card, because all of the slick games out there put out really slick sound on my card, and I'm thinking "why can't I get that here where I really need it?" There must be a way. It has to be a better driver, because the games all come with proprietary drivers, and they sound great.

Reply 2 offered by: Antoine Delle Donne on 30 Aug 1997

If you have any sound card that is SoundBlaster Compatible then I suggest you get WinGroove, a Wave Table Emulator.

WinGroove was written by a Japonese Musician and it is just Unbelievable. Simply select wingroove as the midi driver. you must try it. Here is the link

http://www.cc.rim.or.jp/~hiroki/english/

Works on Win3.1 or Win95.

Reply 3 offered by: Nigel Horne on 02 Oct 1997

Well I tried wingroove as suggested. The good news: 1) It sounds great 2) It plays all the notes (the creative labs s/w gives up with complicated passages) The bad news:

1) The start-up module fails to load - it claims there's not enough memory with 16Mb and by definition at start up, nothing else running 2) Finale only plays through it 50% of time time, probably due to the memory problem discussed above 3) I often had it crash my PC

So I'd give it a rating of 5/10. Pity really because when it works it does sound so much better.

-Nigel

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 01 Sep 1997

I've tried Wingroove and it really is good, and inexpensive, but you need a swift machine for best results. My poor old 486-33 dragged it's feet -(evaluated as 15% of a computer by Wingroove - gasp!).

Reply 5 offered by: Dave on 04-Dec-1997

I have a lot of diefferent midi sequencers on my computer, but i always play back on WinGroove. You must hear it to believe it....oh and definatly worth the reg fee.

Reply 6 offered by: Gerbil on 10-Jan-2000

Breathtaking. The drum sounds alone are worth the cost. My only complaint is, due to the fact that wingroove uses .wav files, my windows sound scheme quadrupled in volume. This is not pleasant to one's ears. But otherwise, it is a wonderful program. I will never use another MIDI file without it.


#235: Sound Quality
Sound Quality

(235)

Submitted by: Leonard Rosten on 02 Aug 1997

Hi Kent

Thanks for your advice, but can I have it from someone who has made all the changes.

It is just possible that I could get what I need (it dosen't have to be CD quality) by tweaking a few commands.

Leonard

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net> on 03 Aug 1997

How about the software wavetable synthisizer (sp?) that is (or recently was) avalible for beta-test from Yamaha? It's main disadvantage, besides a limited shelf life, is that it interposes a ~5 sec. delay between NWC highlighting a note, and the sound coming from your speakers. Look at:

http://www.yamaha.co.jp/english/xg/

Last time I looked they were giving a three month trial (I think), but they were doing that last fall, and I haven't seen it turn into a product yet. Since it bypasses the FM generator on the SB16, it sounds very good, to my poor ears.

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 2 offered by: on 07 Aug 1997

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 02 Aug 1997

Leonard.

What MIDI device are you using? What drivers are you using? Operating system - Windows 95, NT or 3.1? Unfortunately, these are all important bits of info if you want a useful reply.

Andrew

PS: There are external "MIDI Boxes" you can obtain for a coupla hundred dollars (Aus, probly about $100US) which use wave tables to produce the sound and sound very good. Ask in your local music store.

I use a GoldStar MIDI ART GS100R and whilst some of the sounds grate, the piano is top notch.

I also use my Yamaha keyboard occasionally. It's a PSR-520 (again, Wave-table).

If you only have FM Synthesis for your midi device, in my opinion, you will never get realistic sound, even if the FM device was a Yamaha DX-10.

If you're feeling strong and interested, I can go more into how the General Midi drivers use FM (or used to 8 years ago when I was researching all that stuff). But I think it really still boils down to obtaining some good wave table sounds and using them.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 02 Aug 1997

I suggest you invest in a MIDI keyboard if you do not now have one. I was also dissatified with the sound quality of my Sound Blaster Card playing thru the computer speakers.

I purchased a Casio CTK-530 MIDI keyboard from a Meijer Store for $199.00 on sale. It only covers 63 of the 127 available MIDI sounds but it suits my purpose. It reproduces everything I have found on the NET and does so with good sound quality. My only regret is that I did not buy a keyboard that had all 127 MIDI sounds on it. Too expensive for me. Besides, now that NWC has MIDI input, my notating is considerably faster. Kudos to NWC for MIDI input. A valuable asset (MIDI) to an excellent music program.


#238: Writing measure numbers on a score (version 1.31d)
Writing measure numbers on a score (version 1.31d)

(238)

Submitted by: PlPierret@aol.com on 02 Aug 1997

How can I add the measure numbers on a score like in 1.21 version "score builder"? Thank you for your help!

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 02 Aug 1997

Measure numbers and style are assigned in Page Setup which can be accessed thru Score Print (Printer Icon) or File/Page setup.


#239: Sound Quality
Sound Quality

(239)

Submitted by: Leonard Rosten on 03 Aug 1997

Andrew

How naive can one be?

I do not know what MIDI device I am using; I shall have to go back to a textbook

The same applies to the drivers!

I am operating on Windows 95.

It is clear that I have a lot to learn.

However, I realise that the sound qualities are produced by Fourier synthesis. I presume that NWC carries the code for such synthesis but the actual work is carried out in the drivers.

So, where are the drivers?

Best regards

Leonard

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 03 Aug 1997

I'll comment on some of Cyril's points here as well. CAVEAT 1: I am not a GURU of any sort, and also hope to be corrected for any misunderstandings I may have, especially any I may propagate!

CAVEAT 2: I've tries to be careful in wording the following steps, so it looks longer than it should.

Leonard said << How naive can one be? >>

Well... :-)

<<< I do not know what MIDI device I am using; I shall have to go back to a textbook >>>

Nah! Not a text book. Whoever supplied you with your computer should know what sound card they put in (often the system itself won't tell you 'cos there are generic drivers for Soundblaster and SB-like cards). Otherwise, if you are good at opening up computers and rummaging around, then you'll REALLY know.

<<<The same applies to the drivers!>>>

Okay. To find your MIDI drivers in Win 95:

1. Go to the Control Panel (off Settings on the Start Menu), and open Multimedia. ("Sounds" is for linking sounds to Windows events.

2. Click on the "MIDI" tab and see which alternatives you have to choose from for Single Instrument. (Probably just one, Internal Synthesis or something like that, from the sounds of it.) Remember the description of which driver you are using (the highlighted one).

3. Click on the "Advanced" tab (that's right, but you won't break anything. ;-) and open Midi Devices and Instruments. So far so good. You will probably find one (maybe two) drivers. Double click on the one that was highlighted in the Midi Tab.

4. Now depending on the driver, you may get some information (try the settings button if they have one). If you have a driver like mine, it will only tell you something like "Internal OPL2/OPL3 Synthesis"

5. The end.

<<<It is clear that I have a lot to learn.>>>

Sounds like you want to improve your sound quality. One way is to take it back to your supplier and say "Make it better". The other is to learn so that you know how.

<<<However, I realise that the sound qualities are produced by Fourier synthesis. >>>

Not exactly. Again, it depends on the sound card. There are two main types being used now (the old additive synthesis, using Voltage Controlled Oscillators (VCOs) etc going out of fashion about fifteen years ago).

1. FM Synthesis. This uses modulation of the frequencies generated on the card (adding harmonics etc) to produce sounds closer to reality than the old VCOs. Most good FM synths use at least 4 operators (modulators) to get a good, rich, more natural sound. Most SB cards use 2 or 3 operators, and sound, as you say like comb-and-paper.

2. Most General MIDI devices have now gone digital, using Wavetables (samples) to generate the tone. Cyril, the better cards will model changes in timbre according to velocity, either by gradually mixing in a sample of a note being played hard, or bending the pitch a bit, there a lots of cutes you can do. The pitch thing is probably only on the big workstation synths.

<<<I presume that NWC carries the code for such synthesis but the actual work is carried out in the drivers. >>> I think (please correct me if I'm wrong) that NWC only tells the driver (more or less) what note to play on what channel and at what velocity.

Hope this helps. It may need a few readings to digest.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net on 03 Aug 1997

Not really--FM synthesis uses a Fourier anaylsis, but the better cards use so-called wave tables. These may be digitalized samples of real instraments, or made up out of wholecloth. I'm not enought of a hardware person to understand how pitch, attack and decay are modelled for different pitches and durations, so I'll leave that for one of the real Gurus to expositate on. With the exception of some special drives (such as the Yamaha XG software synthesiser mentioned in my previous post), all the wave generation is done on the card. The MIDI stream just tells the card which "voice" to use, how load and when to start it and when to stop it. NWC translates its propriatary data into MIDI, and ships that off to whatever MIDI driver you tell it to use.

I trust that if I have muddled any of the details (not impossible), that I will be gently but firmly corrected.

Cyril N. Alberga


#240: Weird notation--Is there a representation in NWC?
Weird notation--Is there a representation in NWC?

(240)

Submitted by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net> on 03 Aug 1997

I have an odd configuration of notes in a score that I am attempting to enter in NWC. This is from the Fitzwilliam Virganal Book, a hotbed of hard to do stuff! In this instance, there are two voices in a staff, which I have been splitting between two staffs. (I would rather keep everything as written, but some things are impossible to do. I would like to retain as much of the original structure as possible, though.)

Anyway--one voice has four 1/2 notes, while the other has six 1/2 notes, grouped into two triplets. The problem is that the fifth of the six notes in the second voice (the middle note of the second triplet) is tied to the last note in the second voice. Obviously, when I split the voices I can't tie between staffs. But if I try to combine them the triplets "eat" the notes of the first voice. In fact, because of the structure, this seems to be one of the things one CAN'T DO in NWC. The only solution I can see is to add a second note to the final member of the offending triplet, at the same pitch as the middle member, and tie THOSE notes. This would sound "right", but a note from the score would be lost, and part of one voice would be transfured to the other.

I admit the case is pathalogical, probably reflecting a somewhat looser notation of an earlier day. In fact, the second note in the tie is commencing before the end of the first note, which probably didn't bother good old John Bull (the composer), but would probably give a sound card fits.

Is anyone else out there wrestling with earlier notations? I sure could use some advice!

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 03 Aug 1997

Cyril,

From my experience (I've transcribed one piece), the Fitzwilliam Virginal Book is full of - as you say - pathological cases. The one you describe, as I understand it, would not pass a music composition exam, and I think its probably asking a bit much to expect NWC to have to cope with it.

<<<Anyway--one voice has four 1/2 notes, while the other has six 1/2 notes, grouped into two triplets. The problem is that the fifth of the six notes in the second voice (the middle note of the second triplet) is tied to the last note in the second voice. Obviously, when I split the voices I can't tie between staffs. >>>

Don't you mean you're wanting to tie the middle note from the triplet to the final note of the duplet? I know that doesn't make sense, but otherwise I don't see a problem.

<<<Is anyone else out there wrestling with earlier notations? I sure could use some advice! >>>

When I did "The Bells", I just made some editorial judgment, balancing readability with what one would hear. Also, since I was doing an arrangement, I saw no need to quote the notation verbatim. I think I changed key, for a start.

Regards,

Andrew


#241: Display of notation
Display of notation

(241)

Submitted by: HSkidmore@aol.com on 03 Aug 1997

As a new "evaluator" of the shareware version of Noteworthy, it is not clear to me why notation is not shown on the screen the same way as it would be printed. In other words, why is it noted in one long continuous line rather than by wrapping each line as a word processor would? It would be much easier to see where you were in the score when editing or playing back. Is this the way it is in the full version? Are there any upgrades planned along the way to change this?

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net> on 04 Aug 1997

I would add that once you get beyond two, or at most three, staffs in a score any wrap-around is pretty useless. Unless you shrink the score down to the point where it is hard to see where your cursor is, you will only see, at best, part of the "next" line.

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings, gillings@gidday.enet.dec.com on 03 Aug 1997

HSkidmore asks why Noteworthy isn't a full WYSIWYG editor. Before purchasing Noteworthy, I had purchased another product which was "full WYSIWYG" (names supressed to protect the guilty). Apart from some rather unfortunate choices in the user interface, such as moving notes by point and drag and strict spacing proportional to duration (arrgghh!), the third worst feature was WYSIWYG. Each time I pointed to select a note, unless I was exceptionally careful, the mouse would wobble a bit and the program think I'd moved it and would recalculate the ENTIRE SCORE. By the time I'd entered 4 voices with 200 bars each, the recalc would take 20 seconds (timed, not estimated) for each and every change anywhere. That was on a 64MB Pentium 166. Since I was planning on expanding to 32 voices for that project, I changed to Noteworthy. It was either $50 for Noteworthy or $50,000 to purchase a few Alphas to handle the compute load. Noteworthy dealt with the multiple voices with no trouble at all, even on a 486. Although Noteworthy could certainly do with a bit more control over the printed output (such as user selectable page turns), I for one would protest very loudly at any attempt to go WYSISYG.


#242: Sound Quality
Sound Quality

(242)

Submitted by: Leonard Rosten on 03 Aug 1997

Thank you Cyril

It is pretty clear that I shall have to get a new sound card. I have looked at the spec for SoundBlaster Gold and this seems a good option. I am not looking for accoustical wizardry, all I want to do is replicate the sounds of orchestral instruments.

Leonard

Reply 1 offered by: Steven Stewart on 05 Aug 1997

I recommend purchasing an actual orchestra. I bought one for $89.99 at a bargain warehouse and they live in the basement. You have to feed them twice a day (unfortunately), but their sound quality far exceeds that of a sound card.

Good luck,

Steven Stewart http://www.dunraven.com/~brandx/

Reply 2 offered by: Janne on 04 Aug 1997

When I was about to buy my sound-card I was fortunate enough to get a Cd-ROM included with a computer magazine. It contained samples of the same midi-files played on 12 different sound-cards. The absolutely best quality came from a Roland SoundCanvas - absolutely no background noice, but the price was 5 times higher than I could afford. I settled for the - in my ears - second best: Soundblaster AWE32. The Soundblaster AWE64 Gold is a much more sophisticated card than the AWE32 so I think you are on the right track there. The important thing is to avoid the cards that are improperly shielded from the computers oscillating crystals. These can make the cards sound as if there is a slow breeze blowing through the speakers. If you choose a card with Wave-effects synthesis you will get instruments that are recorded from the playing of actual instruments, - like the old Mellotrone - but with proper attack, reverb, sustain and all the other parameters. I hope you find your ideal sound-card; listen around...

Jan Hjelm

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 03 Aug 1997

Leonard said <<<I have looked at the spec for SoundBlaster Gold and this seems a good option. >>>

Don't just look at specs, though. Go to a supplier and HEAR what it sounds like.

You may find it worthwhile looking at external midi boxes, too (these can also be driven from a midi keyboard, but again please check that it works as expected before buying). Don't forget that you'll need to get a cable adapter for it. Ask them to throw one in for free.

A


#243: Playback of Transposing instruments
Playback of Transposing instruments

(243)

Submitted by: Nicole (magrupt@hotmail.com) on 03 Aug 1997

How do I get transposed instruments to sound at concert pitch when played back. It doesn't sound to good when saxophones, trumpets, and pianos are playing back in their own key!!

Reply 1 offered by: Adrie bouwmstr@worldonline.nl on 25 Aug 1997

I have the same problem. When I enter a staff e.g. for Trumpet, and try to play a note on trumpet, they don't sound the same height. What causes this ? I must enter -1 in the midi-box at the staff properties to make the computer to sound the same as the trumpet.

Reply 2 offered by: Adrie bouwmstr@worldonline.nl on 25 Aug 1997

I have the same problem. When I enter a staff e.g. for Trumpet, and try to play a note on trumpet, they don't sound the same height. What causes this ? I must enter -1 in the midi-box at the staff properties.

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings, gillings@gidday.enet.dec.com on 04 Aug 1997

Nicole, Are you entering music at concert pitch or already transposed?

Select the staff in question, and choose the MIDI tab. The "Transposition" field specifies how many semitones to transpose up or down on playback. For instance -2 for Bb a trumpet or clarinet, -9 for an Alto Sax and -21 for a baritone sax. When set correctly, the playback will be in the correct key but the notes won't actually change.

There is also a "Transpose Staff" function in the "Tools" menu which will change the notes. You can select the number of semitones to transpose up or down. This can be used to enter notes in concert pitch, then transpose into another key. You should "Force Accidentals" before using it. Also be aware that you may end up with some strange choices for enharmonic spelling, especially in minor keys.

Look in HELP under TRANSPOSE for more information.


#244: Playback tempo
Playback tempo

(244)

Submitted by: Richard Burdett on 04 Aug 1997

Whilst I realise NWC is not a sequencing package, is there any way to adjust the tempo (ie metronome marking) during playback? Thanks Richard Burdett

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 04 Aug 1997

Not as such. Of course, you can alter the tempo settings anywhere in the piece by inserting a tempo marker ("T" from the keyboard, or, Insert|Tempo, I think).

A


#245: Library?
Library?

(245)

Submitted by: Nigel Horne on 05 Aug 1997

Is there a database on-line of NWC files? In particular I'm interested in orchestral scores.

Reply 1 offered by: Jim Schellhase on 17-Oct-1997

I've never found a "library" of files <filename.nwc> however
you can access a virtually unlimited supply of midi files
<filename.mid>, import them, and save them as ".nwc".

Reply 2 offered by: CESAR ESTEBAN ORTIZ ACEVEDO on 23-Feb-1998

Me interesa recibir información sobre dónde puedo encontrar archivos .*nwc sobre todo si son orquestaciones le agradeceré la información al respecto y me gustaría estar en contacto frecuente con usted mi nombre es:
César Esteban Ortiz Acevedo
Calle Doce No. 4828
Col. Burócratas Federales
64380 Monterrey, N. L
México

Reply 3 offered by: Fernando Guillén G on 16-Mar-1998

no creo que encuentres un directorio de puros archivos *.NWC, pero hay algo de esos archivos en ntworthy.com
Eso de importar archivos MIDI no es muy bueno, porque no todas las secuencias MIDI se hicieron en NWC, o sea que te puede importar con variaciones de tiempos, valores no reales, etc.
yo tengo algnos arhivos NWC, si te interesa, podemos intercambiar.


#246: Comments on 131d
Comments on 131d

(246)

Submitted by: Steve Bacher on 06 Aug 1997

Just upgraded from 1.30 to 1.31d. The MIDI input feature is great to have - I hadn't thought that I would use it, having gotten by so well without it, and having had bad experiences with other software's MIDI input - but NWC's works very well. The only complaint I have about it is that I wish it wouldn't stop recording at the end of the staff. If I tget inspired and start playing my heart out, I end up losing everything past the nth bar with no warning. Since my keyboard is to the left of my computer, I can't just watch the screen while in the throes of the Muse.

Also, I was disappointed in the way the Print menus were changed. Why did you put the print size on Page Setup and the staves-per-page display on the Print menu, so that I can no longer see them at the same time? It was extremely convenient - nay, essential - to be able to adjust the font size and watch the estimated number of systems per page to change (even though NWC got it wrong sometimes). Now it is a big pain in the butt.

Also, for some reason I had the idea that it would be possible to remember the staff position for dynamic markings, tempo variances, etc. from menu to menu. That isn't the case. Allow me to request that I be able to set a default value. Generally I want to put all my ff, pp, cresc, dim in the same position relative to the staff, NOT where I happen to have my mouse pointed. Since I use the computer keyboard for entry almost exclusively, this is very important to me.

Well, thanks for listening, and for continuing to enhance a marvelous product.


#247: A good MIDI & synth glossary on the Web
A good MIDI & synth glossary on the Web

(247)

Submitted by: Andrew on 07 Aug 1997

Whilst looking for water in the vast web desert, I stumbled across http://www.ctlsg.creaf.com/wwwnew/music/school/mms04.html which is a glossary page put out by Creative Labs. It covers a lot of the questions that have been asked recently.

Andrew

Reply 1 removed by: SYSOP


#248: Crossing Parts
Crossing Parts

(248)

Submitted by: MrDaveD@AOL.COM on 07 Aug 1997

I am writing a choral piece and need to have a tenor note below the bass note on the same staff. I cant get the stems to go in the correct direction (ie: tenor C stem up below bass e stem down.)

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 07 Aug 1997

Sorry. NWC will not allow you to do that according to Rule 4 of CHORD MEMBER COMMAND help section.

I am also a barbershopper and opposing voices (Stem direction) notation is also required. There are instances when the tenor note (stem up) is below the lead (Stem Down) and this problem sometimes involves the Baritone(Stem Up) and Bass (Stem down). This problem is a wish list item.

Reply 2 offered by: Gail Barrena on 26 Aug 1997

Hi,

I do barbershop arrangements as well, and I find that I have to just put in the higher note with the stem down, and then after printing, write in the lower note with the stem up!

Reply 3 offered by: Dave D MrDaveD@AOL.COM on 07 Aug 1997

Don, Thanks for the response. The wish list is getting to be quite long! I think it's time for Santa to fill his bag (:


#249: NWC Support
NWC Support

(249)

Submitted by: Adam Bodkin <boddo@tig.com.au> on 08 Aug 1997

Has anyone noticed that NWC Support havn't been around here for a while? It looks like they are leaving tips and advice to the experts like Andrew Purdham and Don Ferguson. Hopefully they are so busy fulfilling the wish-list they havn't had time to answer the questions :))

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Oct-1997

Although we do not guarantee personal response on this forum, we will make every effort to visit periodicallt and give answers.

Reply 2 offered by: PTang on 22-Dec-1997

I can't get my noteworthy to work with my Midi Port. Under Tools and Option and then Record. I can not enter an input device.
All music is coming out of the soundblaster speakers instead of my Keyboard.

I comnnect my PC to the Keyboard via the Soundcard port.

Please help. Thanks

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 22-Dec-1997

There seems to be a bit of confusion here. The Tools Options Record is for when you want to play from your keyboard directly into Noteworthy.
To get the Noteworthy to play back to a keybopard you should be looking at Tools Options MIDI.
From there you should have at least two options to select .
One will be MIDI OUT. Select this in order to make Noteworthy to play back to your keyboard.
The may be other Options such as Midi Mapper which will force Noteworthy to play back according to the instructions in the MIDI MAPPER setup in the control panel.
The number of options here really depends on your sound carg.
Hope this helps.

Richard

Reply 4 offered by: Nick Baldassarre on 14-May-1998

I brought a noteworthy modem but it did not come with a driver so when 95 see the modem it looks for the software but it didn't come with any. How can I download the driver

Reply 5 offered by: SingStimmer on 14-May-1998

Oh Oh

Nothing to do with Noteworthy Composer - suggest you look for other 'Noteworthy' companies on the net.Bet they're not as good as this one though


#251: transposing clefs
transposing clefs

(251)

Submitted by: Lucas Gonze on 09 Aug 1997

I often need to cut and paste stuff from a staff written in one clef to a staff in another. So far it's been hit and miss, with a lot of misses. Anybody know a way to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Lucas Gonze on 09 Aug 1997

Well, I found a way to transpose from bass clef to treble.

1) tools->transpose staff dialog to transpose part up into the usual range for a treble clef part 2) export to midi 3) import from midi.

you'll have a part in treble clef. The same kind of procedure works for going from treble clef to bass clef. Now I just need a way to get to and from tenor clef. Anybody?

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 09 Aug 1997

Would've been nice to get a little more info on what exactly the problem is, but I'll have a shot.

It seems your wanting to cut and paste from one staff to another, and have the notes transposed to the correct key. I'm pretty sure the exporting and importing is unnecessary.

What I do is as follows:

1) Set up the clef and key on the recipient staff, either by cutting and pasting the key sig from the donor staff, or just entering the key using the K command.

2) Select the appropriate notes fromthe donor staff, copy and go to the insertion point or the recipient staff and insert

3) Now SELECT the notes in question (selecting a whole staff is easy, HOME key, hold down shift, and press END key).

4) Move all the notes up or down as follows:

a) Treble to Bass: Up five

b) Bass to treble: Down five

c) Bass to tenor: Up three

d) Tenor to bass: Down three

e) Treble to tenor: Up one

f) Tenor to treble: Down one

I never use the alto clef (actually I don't use the tenor clef, either) but you get the idea.

Hope this hit the nail on the head.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings, gillings@gidday.enet.dec.com on 10 Aug 1997

The only thing I'd add to Andrews list of instructions is "Force Accidentals" before moving the notes and "Audit Accidentals" afterwards. To copy between staves with different clefs, you may want to make multiple copies of the notes, each with a different clef.

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen (O.Miakinen@frcl.bull.fr) on 13 Aug 1997

I do the same as Andrew, and I don't agree with you, John. If the key signature is the same in both keys, there is no need to Force/Audit the accidentals.

But it may be useful to audit the note stems.


#252: workaround for bug when editing clef
workaround for bug when editing clef

(252)

Submitted by: Lucas Gonze on 09 Aug 1997

FWIW, here's a bug report and workaround. If you select a clef, do control-e to edit it, and change the clef, the key signature won't change to reflect the new clef. I know this a bug and not a feature, since the help claims that the key signature does change along with the clef.

The workaround is change the clef as above, then select the incorrect key signature, cut and paste it. After the paste it will be correct.

Reply 1 offered by: Tim Reichard on 10 Aug 1997

There's another fix for this:

Press F9 (Refresh Score).

Tim Reichard


#253: Chord with rest
Chord with rest

(253)

Submitted by: Tuan Pham (tuan.pham@unsw.edu.au) on 10 Aug 1997

Dear friends

How do you have a rest (of different value) as part of a chord?

Regards Tuan Pham

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 11 Aug 1997

See REST COMMAND and CHORD MEMBER COMMAND in NWC help files. Special rules apply to rests. Too much details to explain in this forum reply.

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 11 Aug 1997

See REST COMMAND and CHORD MEMBER COMMAND in NWC help files. Special rules apply to rests. Too much details to explain in this forum reply.


#254: Recording from a keyboard
Recording from a keyboard

(254)

Submitted by: Paul Sinclair on 11 Aug 1997

I am evaluating NWC and so far am very happy with it. The one thing I havent been able to do is to record from my keyboard. I read something that made me think that the unregistered version doesn't do this. I suspect that my midi port on my sound card is not working. Can someone suggest a method for me to verify that the midi port is working.

PS. Please email your reply as I may not get a chance to check this forum.

Reply 1 offered by: Paul Sinclair on 25 Aug 1997

Paul - Yes you can record from keyboard. Please email me at 101360,2204@compuserve.com if you're still stuck. Tell me which version you're using. Margaret

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 11 Aug 1997

What is your E-Mail address? What system, sound card, and keyboard specs are you Using?


#255: I love NoteWorthy Composer
I love NoteWorthy Composer

(255)

Submitted by: jackmearl@volcano.net on 13 Aug 1997

I have struggled with Passport, Cakewalk, and Music Sculpture. Finally I tried NoteWorthy Composer and it fits my needs perfectly. Plus it is so much easier to learn. And the price is right. Thanks to the folks at ArtWare.

Reply 1 offered by: Adrian Strybos on 14-Dec-1997

I've just finished writing some Christmas music for church and I find your product wonderful & easy to use . Especially since i used to do it by hand! Keep up the good work.

Reply 2 offered by: Becky on 19-Dec-1999

I absolutely adore NoteWorthy Composer! The MidiSoft Recording Studio was a bit tricky to learn, and had I not received it as a Christmas gift, I suspect it would have been far out of my price range as well. When I tried the shareware version from ZDNet, I was amazed--within five minutes, I was recording songs that sounded as if they took years to compose. That is a mark of how easy it is to use this program. Just a few days ago, I finally registered my copy of NoteWorthy Composer, and look forward to using it for a long time to come. Thank you so much for creating such a wonderful program, and keep up the good work!

Reply 3 offered by: Sean on 07-Jun-2000

I've tried cakewalk and some other more expensive composing programs and honestly, noteworthy composer seems higher quality and MUCH easier to use! It seems that one would be turned off by a program being "easy" to use, as that would make one think it's "juvenile," but noteworthy composer is really the most proffesional composing program that I have run into!

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP


#256: Comment Field and Font
Comment Field and Font

(256)

Submitted by: chris d'Aquino on 13 Aug 1997

Hi All,

I love noteworthy and use it continually in the madrigal group I am a member of.

What I would love is a) to be able to increase the size of the lyric font, b) reduce the size of the header font and c) especially be able to include the comment field under the title of the song. Most of our music is not in english we put the translation in the comment field so as to be able to email the piece but of course we can't print it - is there any hope in the next edition to include these things??? thanks chris

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 13 Aug 1997

Go back to forum pages for replies dated 7/31 from Andrew Purdam and myself to TEXT question (Nichole) dated 7/30. Might give you some clues on how to do what you want. E-Mail me DIRECT if I can clarify or explain more fully.

Don F


#257: Fonts: A language perspective
Fonts: A language perspective

(257)

Submitted by: Tuan Pham on 14 Aug 1997

RE: FONTS

It is really frustrating to see such a glaring defect in a potentially great product.

Does NWC realise that while maybe 30% of the world's people use English in everyday communication, probably less than 10% write songs in English (mainly the native anglo-saxons)? Most people, even if they are fluent in English as a 2nd language, write songs and poems in their own.

Until NWC fixes this problems then all Russian, Croatians, Indian etc. songwriters won't be able to publish songs using their own fonts. So NWC is cutting off 90% of people from using their software.

Regards Tuan Pham

Reply 1 offered by: paul.nordgren@fhinst.se on 18 Aug 1997

I fully agree - I have no problems with the Swedish letters, but I would also like to be able to use e.g. Russian (Cyrillic) letters, and - above all - to increase the SIZE of the lyrics text.

I urge everyone who agrees to add this issue to the Wish List - the place which Noteworthy actually monitors for this kind of suggestions.

Best wishes

Paul Nordgren

Reply 2 offered by: Jan Hjelm, Sweden on 15 Aug 1997

I have to agree, regretfully. Even though my problem is small compared to those of them who uses a completely different alphabet. I use codepage 850 because our alphabet uses the letters å, ä, and ö. (It will be a test right now if they will show up correctly in the forum when post this). So, please include support for languages and codepages for the whole world. Jan_Hjelm@hotmail.com

Reply 3 offered by: Tim Reichard on 16 Aug 1997

Windows 95 supports the full ASCII character set, which includes å, ä, and ö.

Open the Character Map (one of the Accessories). All the characters for each font are shown, along with shortcut keys to type them.

To type å, hold down Alt and type 0229, then release Alt. For ä, use 0228 instead. For ö, use 0246.

The Character Map may show other shortcut keys for special characters, but I think these are dependent on the keyboard language settings in the Control Panel. The Alt+number codes above should work regardless on Windows 95.

If you don't have Windows 95, maybe there's still a way.

Tim Reichard

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga <alberg1@ibm.net> on 17 Aug 1997

Actually, using code page 850 seems to be even easier in WIN 3.1 Before I switched to '95 my DOS programs came up in the proper code page (I use 850 in order to catalog books and records published outside the U.S.) but I still haven't figured out how to get that to work in WIN95. Paradox and WordPerfect seem to remember that I want to use cp850, but when I launch a DOS text editor it just gives me 437.

The special characters showed up fine for me, too, but then I MAY have 850 enabled in NetScape--but I don't know how to tell!

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 16 Aug 1997

Jan said <<å, ä, and ö. (It will be a test right now if they will show up correctly in the forum when post this)>>

Looks like an a with a circle above (what are they called, Jan?), an a-umlaut and o-umlaut.

Probably look nothing like it on a Mac, but then there probably aren't many Mac users on this Forum, are there? :-)

A

Reply 6 offered by: John Gillings gillings@mail.dec.com on 17 Aug 1997

>>Probably look nothing like it on a Mac, but then there probably aren't many Mac users on this Forum, are there? :-)

I read this forum from Netscape on OpenVMS/Alpha System and the fonts look correct here. I also moved the file over to a Mac (via a rather circuitous route) and they look fine there too. Rather surprising that *some* things "just work" in this environment ;-)

Reply 7 offered by: Jan Hjelm, Sweden on 15 Aug 1997

I have to agree, regretfully. Even though my problem is small compared to those of them who uses a completely different alphabet. I use codepage 850 because our alphabet uses the letters å, ä, and ö. (It will be a test right now if they will show up correctly in the forum when post this. So, please include support for languages and codepages for the whole world. Jan_Hjelm@hotmail.com

Reply 8 offered by: Jan Hjelm, Sweden on 15 Aug 1997

I have to agree, regretfully. even though my problem is small compared to those of them who uses a completely different alphabet. I use codepage 850 because our alphabet uses the letters å, ä, and ö. (It will be a test right now if they will show up correctly in the forum when post this. So, please include support for languages and codepages for the whole world. Jan_Hjelm@hotmail.com

Reply 9 offered by: Ola Johansson, Sweden on 11 Oct 1997

Andrew said: >Looks like an a with a circle above (what are >they called, Jan?), an a-umlaut and o-umlaut.

"Umlaut" is the German (and international?) name for the two dots above the letters. I don't know what the circle is called, an "a with a circle above" is simply another character in Swedish, very different from the "a". It is BTW pronounced like "aw" in "saw".

Reply 10 offered by: Zdenek Hladik on 29-Nov-1997

Once again I must repeat that problem of Lyrics font in NWC
is FUNDAMENTAL for European countries and solution is only
on NWC programmers side by adding possibility of font name
modification!!

Without this is impossible create readable lyrics. How you
can feel if previous text look like this:

Oxce atain I mrust rapeat teat prxbem ov bycics....

Zdenek Hladik


#258: Jazz/pop chart writing symbols
Jazz/pop chart writing symbols

(258)

Submitted by: Bill Ward on 16 Aug 1997

There desperately needs to be basic chord comping [/] and measure repeat [%] symbols which are recognized as a one beat space and one or more measure space respectively. -So one doesn't have to keep writing (and more importantly instrumentalist need not read)repeditive phrases over and over. Most all pop, rock and jazz charts are written in this way. Please add these in the next version.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 20 Aug 1997

Yes - and to that add multi bar rests, drum and rhythm note heads, section open rehearsal letters/numbers, lip ups, fall offs and grace notes. They dont have to be MIDI (playable) items - just graphic (printable options). I'd happily pay another registration for these. If you also want these features add them to the Wish List at this site.

Reply 2 offered by: kent dugan (kentd@dataworks.com) on 22 Aug 1997

Good point about not needing the frills to work with midi. I'm dealing with actual parts for performance, and I don't need the midi capability at all. None of our 500 charts are mid-capable, and that doesn't stop us from playing. As a notation program, really the paper is the proof.

Reply 3 offered by: kent dugan on 18 Aug 1997

I second that. A basic repeat bar and most likely, a two-bar repeat would be nice. More than that, In order to type in chord names (as text), you have to guess at the number of spaces you need in order to get them to look nice on paper. We could sure use a slash rhythm marker that occupies either a beat or a half-beat (gotta have that anticipation at slow tempos) where we could type in chord symbols and keep a nice spacing. The larger problem is that when typing in chord symbols as text, a Cm doesn't take any space at all, but after an F#m13 (b5 -9), the spacing to the rest of the score is pretty well trashed, because there are big white spaces around the beat. It's impossibly time-consuming to enter a bass line and chords over it. Should be able to create that, and then copy the chords over to a guitar part so that we don't have to re-invent the wheel. I've been on hold for a while trying to get a new midi cable. Seems mine was broken fresh out of the package, so the above observations are all based on note entry the hard way. I can do generally nice instrument parts, but rhythm parts are a real test. Looks like I'll be trying to create them somewhere else, convert to midi file, then import back into NWC. Wish we could keep it all in NWC. Maybe soon.

Reply 4 offered by: Nikki MacLeod on 03 Sep 1997

Hi...I agree with everything that everyone says about chord symbols. NWC is fantastic, especially for the price but itreally does need much better chord symbol handling, probably in theform of a separate module...and most important of all entered chord symbols should be transposable along with the stave other wise they simply have to be re-entered which is a complete pain. This is especially vital if your writing for a jazz band/group where people on transposing instruments need to improvise over the changes. This extra wish already sent to wish list....

Nikki


#259: Fermatas not exported
Fermatas not exported

(259)

Submitted by: Tuan Pham on 19 Aug 1997

Hi

I don't think fermatas export properly from NWC. When played back on a MIDI player they are ignored.

Tuan pham

Reply 1 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 2 offered by: Tim Reichard on 19 Aug 1997

No, fermatas are not exported. Neither are breath marks.

But there's a fix for these. Put the fermata before the note with no specified delay and hide a tempo marking before the note, either before or after the fermata.

MIDI will recognize the tempo change, yet any printouts will show the fermata instead.

Similarly, use a breath mark and tempo marking with a rest to pause in a piece. If no rest is conveniently there, perhaps you could add one just for the purpose of exporting to MIDI format and afterward remove it.

These seem like smaller items that could be easily fixed in the next NWC update.

Tim Reichard

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 19 Aug 1997

Tim said:

<<<These seem like smaller items that could be easily fixed in the next NWC update. >>>

Perhaps. It's not quite that easy. If I recell an e-conversation I had with Eric about this about 6 months ago, MIDI does not support fermata or breath marks. So to implement it, NWC would need to basically do the workaround Tim mentioned.

I wonder what effect that would have on bar lengths and such. It may be that it is no problem, but I'm not sure.

Anyone else know?

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Tuan Pham on 20 Aug 1997

>>>>Perhaps. It's not quite that easy. If I recell an e-conversation I had with Eric about this about 6 months ago, MIDI does not support fermata or breath marks. So to implement it, NWC would need to basically do the workaround Tim mentioned.

I don't understand. When you play from NWC, you send msgs to the MIDI mapper. When you export, you send the same signals to a file. So why the different behaviors? (Should be like printing to a file and to a printer respectively)

Tuan

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew again on 20 Aug 1997

I said:Perhaps. It's not quite that easy. If I recell an e-conversation I had with Eric about this about 6 months ago, MIDI does not support fermata or breath marks. So to implement it, NWC would need to basically do the workaround Tim mentioned.

Tuan said: I don't understand. When you play from NWC, you send msgs to the MIDI mapper. When you export, you send the same signals to a file. So why the different behaviors? (Should be like printing to a file and to a printer respectively)

I say: I thought the same thing having already posted. But I'm still not sure how it is implemented. There could well be differences between what NWC sends to the Midi device and what is exported to a midi file. The bottom line I guess is that I shouldn't need to know and it'd be nice if NWC could export them in a future release.

All the things we've asked Eric to do will probably keep him busy for the next few years! If NW Artware can hold the price down AND implement these many changes (esp. generic trills, glissandi, etc) they will have an ASTONISHING PRODUCT with NO EQUAL.

How long do we have to wait, Eric :-) ?

Andrew


#261: What is the best sound card?
What is the best sound card?

(261)

Submitted by: davio@icanect.net on 21 Aug 1997

I recently purchased NWC and I am totally amazed at its capabilities and potential. I would like to utilize this product to its fullest with the best sound card available. I have called all the local stores and it seems they all say that the particular cards they carry are the best. So far, I've heard about AWE64 Gold, Diamond 3D, Diamond Monster 3D, etc. Does anyone know what the best is? I'd really appreciate any advice. Thanks, DR.

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin <boddo@tig.com.au> on 23 Aug 1997

I have heard that the AWE Gold is the best soundcard available. I actually have some wierd card that is part of a package called 'PCA Pro' which is like a computerised telephone. It has a soundblaster compatable card built in, and although it only has 24 note polyphony, it sounds great, even for concert band/orchestral arrangements. I have it hooked up through a small stereo, not the PC speakers, and this adds better tone to the sound output (more highs and lows etc) I have no idea how much PCA Pro costs, as it came with the computer as a package deal, so I guess it wouldn't cost that much. BTW, I hope to get an AWE soon, as I'm sure it can do a better job, it's just a bit expensive.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 24 Aug 1997

I'm not too great on AWEs guts, but it seems to me that you need extra memory on your AWE card to use Sound Fonts, which is I think where emusic is turning.

ie. The BEST AWE general midi instruments are on the Sound Fonts, which require extra memory. A friend has an AWE card without, and whilst the sounds are good, they are often no better than a $200 external midi box.

Also, some of the AWE effects also need onboard memory. Lookup Creative on the web at http://www.ctlsg.creaf.com/zonemenu.html and follow your nose to product descriptions for the AWE card.

Andrew

FYI: I have a SB16 card, which only has internal FM synthesis - which is crap - and an external midi driver, through the game port, which I use to run either a Goldstar MIDI ART GS1000R General Midi box, or a Yamaha PSR-520 keyboard. Each have their pluses and minuses.

PPS: If you do want to use Soundfonts, then definitely use an AWE card or similar - A

Reply 3 offered by: dilbertcn@aol.com on 22 Aug 1997

I know I love my SB AEW64 Gold, although I haven't tried any of the others you listed.

Reply 4 offered by: Tom Johnson on 26-Oct-1997

Get the SB AEW64 Gold -- You can't go wrong.

Reply 5 offered by: Scott Pratt on 30-Nov-1997

I recently got a Sony PCV240, with a sound card called ESS
Maestro. It offers 64 note polyphony and is on the PCI bus.
The card has nice effects (reverb, chorus). However, the
sound lacks depth. The bass does not reverberate(also called
resonance) and the drums are dull. I'm comparing this with
my old Ensonic daughterboard which had acceptable sound.
I don't now who ESS is, but I would not reccommend their
cards. The computer was returned because it has an
extremely loud cooling fan.

Reply 6 offered by: Vladimire Costromyn on 12-Mar-1998

I still can`t get what is the best card...
(no doubt AWE is a crap, even if it is gold.)

Cmmn, tell us about your REALY good PCI card.
We still are lookin` for the one.

Reply 7 offered by: Chris Hirby on 18-Apr-1998

I used to have an AWE64 value card...but I just sold it,
because I want to buy a VideoLogic Sonicstorm card. It has
a 500 MIPS Digital Sound Processor, hardware wavetable, and
it uses an ESS Maestro-2 chip. I hear from Boot magazine
that the ESS chip sounds crappy with the current drivers,
but it is expected to kick ass later on. It has hardware
acceleration on many formats, such as directsound, aureal 3d,
qsound...I think there are more. But the AWE64 value sounded
great! I just despise the idea of ISA, so I'm gonna go the
PCI route. The Ensoniq AudioPCI thing is supposed to sound
awesome compared with the maestro, but it doesn't have a DSP

I dunno...if you can find a awe64 for like 50 bucks, do that...
otherwise wait for the PCI hurd to come rolling in.

Reply 8 offered by: Chris Hirby on 18-Apr-1998

silly me...the SonicStorm uses the Maestro-1 chip not the
Maestro-2...that is for notebooks or something...but it's
still 500 MIPS (= ? MHz) I heard somewhere that that is like
50 MHz

who cares

Reply 9 offered by: Tom Slaboszewski on 19-May-1998

The best soundcard that i know of is Terratec EWS 64 XL
which costs about $ 500 - awesome card !
Wait for the new PCI card from creative labs and EMU -
- should cost about $ 500 - 700

Reply 10 offered by: Jason Munski on 24-Aug-1998

I just bought the PCI128 from SoundBlaster and I think it's descent. Midi files sound quite a bit better than the AWE64, but it also requires more from your system. If you want to use the 8Mb waveset, it's recomended that you have 64Mb SDRAM. I think it's well worth the $100 it costs, but I can't wait to get a hold of the SoundBlaster Live! card.

Reply 11 offered by: Adam Schauer on 24-Aug-1998

I have a Yamaha OPL-3 fm card and if somebody has the need
to hear something really awfull, tell me! I think the AWE 64
is really a usable solution, but i will see - we got a interesting card today at my company - Soundradio 64+FM PCI
with ESS Maestro II chip and i will test it tomorow and tell u then the results. I hope it will work, i need really
a new card.

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Aug-1998

No one has mentioned the AWE 32.
I recently acquired one as a gift with 8Mb of RAM on board.
I think it's great - you can load up a huge soundfont and pick your own sounds.
It's much cheaper than the 64 and uses stock 30pin memory - unlike the 64 where you have to use Creative's proprietary memory.
I think the AWE 32 provides most of what you need without burning a hole in your pocket.

Reply 13 offered by: Felipe P. (Chile) on 18-Feb-2000

For my, the best sound card is my Sound Blaster Live!, I love this card, in special if it is Creative Labs.

Reply 14 offered by: Sean on 27-Feb-2000

I don't know what the best card is, but i can tell you my SB 16 sucks.

Reply 15 offered by: Blair Dowden on 27-Feb-2000

If you have a decent computer, you might try the Yamaha software sound driver, found at http://www.yamaha.co.uk/xg/download/syxg50/xg50us.zip

Reply 16 offered by: Musicman on 04-Mar-2000

The bst card in the market is the SB Live! It has wonderful normal sound but also has a feature which allows it to recreate the certain acoustic characteristics of different rooms and locations and applys them to your music and all other sounds.
Good speakers though are essential to ensure good sound no matter how up class your sound card.

Reply 17 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Mar-2000

This is as good a place as any to point out that the top-of-the-line Dell computers are being supplied with Turtle Beach 'Montego' cards. Perhaps (hopefully) this is an indication of a trend away from the mediocre offerings from Creative.

Reply 18 offered by: Grant on 06-Mar-2000

>>the top-of-the-line Dell computers are being supplied with Turtle Beach 'Montego' cards

True. But if I read their literature correctly, the SoundBlaster Live! Value card is offered as a $60 *upgrade* from the Turtle Beach card (and Creative currently prices the Value card $100 less than the regular Live!). Is this a ripoff or does Dell really think the Creative cards are better?

Reply 19 removed by: SYSOP


#262: glissando - possible?
glissando - possible?

(262)

Submitted by: Richard Berthelsdorf (rfbdorf@pacifier.com) on 25 Aug 1997

Does anyone have suggestions for generating and/or notating a glissando effect with Noteworthy?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 25 Aug 1997

For more info on glissing/arpeggiating, try /composer/usertips.htm#arpeggio

These are tips/workarounds I've used a lot to (I think :) fairly good effect. The more you use them, the less fiddly they seem.

Andrew


#263: Exporting Graphics
Exporting Graphics

(263)

Submitted by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 25 Aug 1997

I'm attempting to export individual parts to a vector graphics program so that I can create and add the ornaments missing in the NWC set. I've tried Coreldraw but grand stave braces and small ties dont import correctly! Also tried Top Draw (my shareware favourite) but notes are displaced vertically on the staff! Metafiles and clipboard inport beautifully into MS Publish but thats not a vector graphics package and symbols drawn using the tools available dont scale well (like graphic crescendo). Has anyone had success with a graphics program I haven't tried.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 25 Aug 1997

Barry said <<Metafiles and clipboard inport beautifully into MS Publish but thats not a vector graphics package and symbols drawn using the tools available dont scale well (like graphic crescendo). Has anyone had success with a graphics program I haven't tried.>>

No, but if MSPublisher is working for you, why not use CorelDraw to turn the glissandi etc. from their Music symbols into drawing objects which can then be exported via WMF files (or copied and pasted) into Publisher?

A

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 27 Aug 1997

Thanks Andrew that works fine. But I'd still like to know if there is a graphics package around that has no problem importing NWC .wmf's.

Reply 3 offered by: Hugo Hoff (HugoHoff@compuserve.com) on 29 Aug 1997

I tried importing the score as a postscript file into Corel Draw. First you have to install a postscript printer which is connected to file. Now when you print to this printer, you are asked for a file name. Give a name with the extension ps. After this you are able to import this file into Corel as vectors. Now you have the hole page as one group in Corel Draw.

Hope this helps,

Reply 4 offered by: Keith Markham on 10-Nov-1997

I use Adobe Pagemaker 6.5 and find this takes the WMF 'copy' from the clipboard (taken from the NWC 'preview') quite acceptably. Some problem with getting the staves on different pages all the same size, but the graphic can be re-sized easily.

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP


#265: AWE64 Soundfonts
AWE64 Soundfonts

(265)

Submitted by: Joe Winter (winterj@mindspring.com) on 27 Aug 1997

There is an option in NoteWorthy that allows me to select a separate user bank for an AWE32/64, but so far I have been unable to get it to work. Are there any special settings either in my soundcard software or on NoteWorthy to get it so that it can play back soundfonts that I have loaded in my user banks?

Reply 1 offered by: christian.wollin@swipnet.se on 28 Aug 1997

Have you tried with number 128 for the first bank and 256 for the second bank and so forth....

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Winter on 30 Aug 1997

Using 128 as the first bank worked. It's annoying how that works, but it worked. Thanks! :)

Joe

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 28 Aug 1997

I don't have an AWE card, but my first question would be "how have you configured the soundfonts"? Do they come in as alternative banks? Is so, how are they numbered? Have you double checked to see that the numbers assigned are the same as those you've assigned in Noteworthy?

Maybe an OBOE (out by one error)?

Don't you hate it when it _should_work_???

A

Reply 4 offered by: quiet on 15-Feb-1998

gfy

Reply 5 offered by: Oliver Tarantino on 18-Mar-1998

I had the same problem

first load your bank and try to create a new instrument !

Reply 6 offered by: assaf on 24-Mar-1998

IF YOU HAVE THE SOUNDFONTS FILES SEND ME

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Mar-1998

The soundfont files are included on the setup disk, which comes with the card. The SFBANK folder contains the soundfont files, which are loaded using the AWE Control program. You may want to visit http://www.soundblaster.com to see if any other new soundfont offerings are available.

Reply 8 offered by: Pedro Alonso Pablos on 01-Apr-1998

Well, I've come to this site to look for new soundfonts and what do I find?
Everything except soundfonts. I'd like to know the way to get some soundfonts for my personal use without paying
Do we have to pay?
Thanks.

Reply 9 offered by: Drake Donahue on 01-Apr-1998

http://www.creaf.com
http://www.lysator.liu.se/awe/
http://www.taeback.kornet.nm.kr/~chaos
some freebies at each above
http://dejanews.com search "soundfont" for more leads
http://www.emu.com to pay for play
Pick up a copy of NoteWorthy Composer while you're here.

Reply 10 offered by: Oliver D. on 09-Apr-1998

Hi, i'm an AWE64Gold user and fond of synthesizers moreover.
Do you know a better software than Vienna soundfont editor
to deal with my soundbanks ? Vienna is boring and not as flexible
as I would like . To you know how to get it ?
Would you please indicate me where I could get techno Soundfounts
anywhere on the WEB ???
Thanks for your help
OLI (from Paris)

Reply 11 offered by: gooroo on 19-Apr-1998

Well i got conned into getting a AWE64 Value.....!

Reply 12 offered by: Ilpo Luodes on 09-May-1998

Can somebody tell me,where i can find good gm bank for my awe64????
please,email me!!

Reply 13 offered by: Max Frasca on 28-May-1998

Could somebody help me? I tryied for the first time to load and use Soundblaster soundfonts.Unfortunately the don't sound as I'd need for my productions (drum&bass and Jungle).
I'm actually sequencing using Cubase Vst. Does somebody know if the internal VST plugins effect work on soundfonts too? I've been trying for two days without success.

Reply 14 offered by: Tarek Tawakol on 28-May-1998

Hi .. My name is Tarek and I'm from Egypt - I deal mainly
with Oriental Music. I have quite a load of SF2's
( Mainly Rare Oriental Percussion, drums etc.) I also have a vast library
that suits various needs. If you need anything from my library
you're more than welcome - Just send me a message :
tawakol@intouch.com

Reply 15 offered by: Gary Gerber on 29-May-1998

Hi there
I recently purchased AWE64 Value and find that it works extremely well with Cakewalk Home Studio. Please let me know if there are any sites available on the net where I can download extra soundfonts. I'm looking for some new ones.
Thanks

Reply 16 offered by: Frank Brady on 18-Jun-1998

If you want to use the plug-ins in Cubase VST on a soundfont
you must record the soundfont onto an audio track To do this
record your soundfont midi track then select an audio track
mute all other tracks (except the sound font track) and
record (in real time) on the audio track
you should then be able to use the audio plug ins on the
soundfont sound (which is now in fact an audio track)

Reply 17 offered by: Marcel on 18-Jul-1998

Who can tell me where I can download a few soundfonts.
I'm not a awe user , I use the EWS64 XL, so if there are people on this planet who can tell me where to find 94b dream or TTS soundbanks , I would really like to know.

Reply 18 offered by: Ilpo Luodes on 02-Aug-1998

Can somebody tell me where i can find chaos 4mb bank for awe?
Please mail me soon... =) if u know any other good soundbanks... mail me

Reply 19 offered by: David (|\|eur0N) on 23-Aug-1998

I´m a young violinist and I want a real violin sound font for AWE 64... please

Reply 20 offered by: Ian Kearns on 25-Aug-1998

I've just bought an AWE64 Gold. I can handle this soundfont business
but does anyone know how use soundfonts in Cakewalk v6? I hope it is
not as complicated sounding as using SF's in Cubase.

Reply 21 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Aug-1998

Load your AWE with soundfonts in the appropriate banks.
Run Cakewalk.
Double click on the patch name in the track list.
Select bank and program number in the dialogue that appears.
Be sure to select the AWE Synth in your list of MIDI devices.
OR ( and I would recommend this)
Use the Event List - (right click on the track)
Insert a couple of new events at the start of the track.
Enter Controller 0 then Bank Number.
Follow this with any Program Change.

To change Bank and Patch within the track you need the same two events.

Reply 22 offered by: DJSANNY on 26-Aug-1998

I need some good sounds for Freestyle and Black Music.please e-mail me and tell me were i can get this.
Were can i found some especialy sounds (not usely sounds).I need sf2 or sbk.
Thanx for your informations.

DJSANNY

Reply 23 offered by: DJSANNY on 26-Aug-1998

I need some good sounds for Freestyle and Black Music.please e-mail me and tell me were i can get this.
Were can i found some especialy sounds (not usely sounds).I need sf2 or sbk.
Thanx for your informations.

DJSANNY

Reply 24 offered by: Andrew on 26-Aug-1998

Try !ftp://ftp.lysator.liu.se/pub/awe32

A

Reply 25 offered by: Mike D on 01-Sep-1998

I´ve got one Problem!

When I load User Banks into my AWE 64 RAM, and then assign
a Instrument of one Soundbank in Cubase XT to a track or part
it functions properly until i "rewind" the song to the start.
When I push the PLAY-Button after rewinding, the AWE 64 plays
only the GM-Sounds instead of the ones I assigned before.
Now the best: The Sounds are still assigned to the track/part,
and Cubase will only play them correctly, if I assign all of them
again. The next time I rewind, the story begins from a new.
It doesn´t only happen in Cubase. When I play a .MID file
with the Mediaplayer (or any other Player), that needs Instruments
from a User bank, it only plays correctly for the first time.
Then I have to reload the Player.

Now my Question: why is this, and how can I prevent from it?

I anyone can help: Email me : michael.kaplan@siemens.at

Reply 26 offered by: bozo on 11-Dec-1999

Check in list Edit that ther is not a program change event in the track, for instance at the beginning, and get rid of it

Reply 27 offered by: DJ Assert on 15-Dec-1999

im after sf banks of any format for my hip hop or jungle tracks, basses pads ect. nice vibe sounds and especialy an 808 909 drum kit. also how do i set up drumkits???

Reply 28 offered by: Jan Krakowski on 31-Jan-2000

Welcome to my home page!
http://home.sol.no/~jkrakows/

Reply 29 offered by: P.Apokremiotis on 08-Mar-2001

HI!! I RECENTLY BOUGHT A SB LIVE AND I'M TRYING TO USE SOUNDFONTS WITH CAKEWALK 6.0 . IT WONT WORK!!!
PLEASE CAN ANY ONE INSTRUCT ME? OR LET ME KNOW OF A SITE THAT REFERS TO MY PROBLEM.
THANKS ANYWAY.

Reply 30 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Mar-2001

Check out the Live Centre:
http://listen.to/sblive
You will find links to Midi and Soundfonts and there is a section devoted to using soundfonts with Cakewalk.
Browse around the site there is a lot there for Live users.

Reply 31 offered by: GEOFF HILL on 14-Nov-2001

HI!! I RECENTLY BOUGHT A SB LIVE AND I'M TRYING TO USE SOUNDFONTS WITH CAKEWALK 6.0 . IT WONT WORK!!!
PLEASE CAN ANY ONE INSTRUCT ME? OR LET ME KNOW OF A SITE THAT REFERS TO MY PROBLEM.
THANKS ANYWAY.

I HAVE FOUND THAT I NEED TO LOAD THE SOUND FONTS THROUGH THE SB LAUNCHER SF MANAGER,
AND THEN MANAGE THEM FROM THEM (RELOAD) THEM IN CAKEWALK. THIS WILL THEN WORK FOR YOU - CRAP EH!.
BECAUSE OF THIS PROB AND MORE WITH CAKEWALK , I CHANGED OVER TO CUBASE VST. tHE MIDI FACILITY IS BRILLIANT. i WRITE MUSIC MAINLY FOR TV ADVERTS AND YOU CAN'T GO WRONG.

YOU'LL FIND MANAGING SF BANKS ARE A DODDLE TO.

Reply 32 offered by: Grant on 14-Nov-2001

Please don't shout.

This forum is dedicated to NoteWorthy Software products, so I'm not sure how much Cakewalk help you can expect to get here.

What's a doddle?


#266: NIF - Notation Interchange Format
NIF - Notation Interchange Format

(266)

Submitted by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 01 Sep 1997

I've read about it - but I cant find a spec. Does anyone out there know any details. Who owns the format - what software implements it?

Reply 1 offered by: jon.featherstone@medtronic.com on 01 Sep 1997

A very good starting point is the following page:

http://www.musitek.com/niff.html

Regards.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Butcher on 10-Nov-1997

I know Midiscan supports NIFF files. It would be great if
NTC did also. I wonder if NTC has plans along these lines?

Reply 3 offered by: John Landrigan on 23-Nov-1997

If possible please consider implementing NIFF into
Noteworthy ASAP. I am using Midiscan and the Lime software sucks.
The lastest release of Noteworthy does a much
better job importing the midi files that Midiscan produces.
I have no music background but I am doing an ongoing project of transcribing
the sheet music collection at Yellowstone National Park.
Noteworthy has been the best compromise for the PC. Notescan
for the Mac has all the features that I would want, but I'm not going to
invest in it at this point. I'll hope that glissandri, grace notes,
and tremelos will eventually show up. The learning curve on this
software is very fast and thus much more preferable to me compared to
Finale and Encore.


#268: Octave Sign &
Octave Sign &

(268)

Submitted by: Debbie Branco <debbie_branco@lotus.com> on 01 Sep 1997

Is there any way to put an "octave symbol" over a note? I'm not sure I am using the correct terminology, but I'm talking about the symbol used to indicate a note is played an octave higher than it's written.

Also, is there any way to indicate a broken chord?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Winter (winterj@mindspring.com) on 01 Sep 1997

There is a tip on arpeggiating chords in the User Tips section.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam (apurdam@pcug.org.au) on 01 Sep 1997

Visually:

Use the text tool and insert the text with Preserve Width turned OFF. Use spaces etc to align it properly and the text "8va ...."

Aurally:

Insert a new clef modified with Octave up.

Hope these help.

Andrew


#270: Importing Long Rests
Importing Long Rests

(270)

Submitted by: Tim Reichard on 01 Sep 1997

I recently imported from MIDI format a song that uses time signatures such as 5/2, 6/2, 7/2, and 8/2.

Whole measure rests in the 7/2 and 8/2 measures were misinterpreted.

I found that the 7/2 rest was interpreted as a whole rest followed by a half rest (as though it were a 3/2 measure); 8/2 as two whole rests; and, through experimentation, 9/2 and 10/2 as whole rest followed by dotted whole rest.

Is there a fix for this other than manually changing the rests to single whole measure rests, or using smaller time signatures?

Thanks,

Tim Reichard

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Winter (winterj@mindspring.com) on 01 Sep 1997

Since I don't work for NoteWorthy, I can't say what will be fixed and what won't, but you can make these suggestions on the wish list page located at /composer/wishlist.htm

Joe


#273: triplet bracketing
triplet bracketing

(273)

Submitted by: kentd@dataworks.com on 10 Sep 1997

Anyone noticed that if you have 2 consecutive sets of eighth note triplets, that the first will have a 3 and a brace, but that the second will have only the digit 3 (and a different font, at that)? Any way to get the brace on the second set? Barry, if you answer, I'll owe you a Blatt's (if they're still in business - it sounds funnier than a Foster's anyhow).

Reply 1 offered by: kentd@dataworks.com on 12 Sep 1997

Hate to respond to my own mail, but couldn't find exactly what I was looking for. Didn't realize that quarter note triplets get a bracketed three, and braced eighth notes get only the digit 3. If you select the notes from left to right, and give a control-T, this will work. IF, on the other hand, you happen to swipe from right to left [!] and hit control-T, you won't get the triplet figure at all. Nothing will happen. Must have been what I did. Why, you ask? If you find out, let me know.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 11 Sep 1997

Sorry - couldnt resist. How do you do it - you should volunteer as a beta tester. If you select three 1/8 notes then press Crtl/T you get a triplet - OK. If you then press Ctrl/B you unbeam them but get a triplet brace. Do it again to get an unbraced, but beamed triplet again. You get the prize - I cant get both. Six pack enclosed!

Reply 3 offered by: kent dugan on 15 Sep 1997

the trick was to swipe them from left to right and do a control-T, and you get triplets above them. If you swipe the same notes from right to left and control-T, you won't get triplets. This is maybe understandable, but then again, maybe not. As for beta testing, this is how my customers try to trick me. After awhile, you start to think like them. {Let's see, what's the worst I could do that no one ever thought anyone would EVER do? - How can I break it?}


#274: Adding reverb to playback
Adding reverb to playback

(274)

Submitted by: Dave Dunseath on 12 Sep 1997

Is there a way to add a reverb effect to the playback of a composition to simulate 'performance space' and create less of a 'flat' sound?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 14 Sep 1997

There are a few ways to add reverb, depending mainly on your card.

Many midi keyboards (if that's what you're playing back onto) and the AWE cards (and cards of that ilk) have digital effects that can be turned on and off for playback. These almost always include reverb. So you can try that.

If you don't have such capabilities on your midi instrument, and have only two or three staves, try this (messy) idea.

For each staff:

1) Copy it to a new staff.

2) Pick the smallest note, a 64th. And insert a rest at the start of that staff. This will delay every note by that length (which will vary according to tempo, I'm afraid).

3) Turn the volume of that staff down to the right sort of level according to taste. You may even want to pan the original staff off centre, and put the "echo" track a little to the other side, for a more spatial sound.

If anyone (Adam B?) has any better ideas, please present them!

Hope this is useful.

Regards,

Andrew mailto:apurdam@pcug.org.au

Reply 2 offered by: Dave Dunseath on 14 Sep 1997

Thanks for the suggestions. I'll try them.


#275: Digital Archives
Digital Archives

(275)

Submitted by: Tony_Parsons@compuserve.com on 12 Sep 1997

Hello,

I recently bought NW Composer 1.3d and was very impressed. The reason that I bought it is that my children are learning the piana (and my wife has restarted playing) and I thought NWC would be an excellent way of producing sheet music for their use and also to record performances (when I get a MIDI keyboard).

I was wondering (as I am not musically trained - I am just teh tech. support) whether there are any NWC archives in the same way as there are MIDI archives

i.e the Classical MIDI Archive

http://www.prs.net/midi.html

The problems I have found importing MIDI is that they appear to be generated by MIDI import (i.e. performance) and it can produce some verrry strange scores.

Any advice appreciated,

Tony P.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham bargrah@hotmail.com on 17 Sep 1997

Tony

Perhaps you could try some of the user sites - within the Noteworthy homepage follow the various links to new stuff and user sites. I have no idea what sort of music NWC users produce but there could be some piano scores.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew P. on 14 Sep 1997

Tony,

Apparently there is an AOL forum or archive which contains many NWC compositions. Check /aol.htm

Unfortunately for many of us, it is only available if you have AOL access. I thought I heard that some effort was being made to make at least some of these available on the net, but nothing has been forthcoming yet. Possibly copyright is an issue, here.

Importing midi files is visually hazardous.

Buying the appropriate music is also an option :-) Especially if three people can play the one piece! There are lots of really good duet pieces for four hands at one piano.

Regards,

Andrew

mailto:apurdam@pcug.org.au


#276: Drums, Drums, and more Drums!
Drums, Drums, and more Drums!

(276)

Submitted by: Damien Hall on 13 Sep 1997

I am having a huge problem with drums. Could someone send me a chart of some kind of what each note is in the key of C? I know about the stuff in the NWC Help file and it managed to confuse me more. Please send and reply to ddementia@aol.com because I never get a chance to read this board. Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: nicole (magrupt@hotmail.com) on 17 Sep 1997

Yeah, send something to me too. In fact is there something on the net that can help?? Ta. Nicole

Reply 2 offered by: Ron on 19-Oct-1997

There is a help file on this within NWC, but I will send you both an e-mail on it. If anyone else wants a response, let me know! :-)

-roncli

Reply 3 offered by: snedegar on 26-Dec-1997

Actually, the help on this is "hidden" under faqs and really
hard to find. Once there, you see:
Key	Percussion Sound

35	Acoustic Bass Drum
36	Bass Drum 1	(Note = C)
37	Side Stick
38	Acoustic Snare
39	Hand Clap
40	Electric Snare
41	Low Floor Tom
42	Closed High Hat
43	High Floor Tom
44	Pedal High Hat
45	Low Tom
46	Open High Hat
47	Low-Mid Tom
48	High-Mid Tom	(Note = C)
49	Crash Cymbal 1
50	High Tom
51	Ride Cymbal 1
52	Chinese Cymbal
53	Ride Bell
54	Tambourine
55	Splash Cymbal
56	Cowbell
57	Crash Cymbal 2
58	Vibraslap
59	Ride Cymbal 2
60	High Bongo	(Note = C)
61	Low Bongo
62	Mute High Conga
63	Open High Conga
64	Low Conga
65	High Timbale
66	Low Timbale
67	High Agogo
68	Low Agogo
69	Cabasa
70	Maracas
71	Short Whistle
72	Long Whistle
73	Short Guiro
74	Long Guiro
75	Claves
76	High Wood Block
77	Low Wood Block
78	Mute Cuica
79	Open Cuica
80	Mute Triangle
81	Open Triangle

the numbers are pretty meaningless since you can't USE them
for anything, but I made a score with each note in turn
given a measure of eighths, and you can then "hear" what
each of these things "sound" like and decide better what you
want to use . . .

Copyright ® 1996,1997 by NoteWorthy ArtWare, Inc.

Reply 4 offered by: Ron on 26-Mar-1998

60 is middle C, you can adjust from there.

-roncli

Reply 5 offered by: Drake Donahue on 28-Mar-1998

Has anyone seen any software anywhere that will take a channel 10 midi percussion track and/or a couple of specific GM percussion instuments and output printed scores that God's sweet but simple percussion children can read? I have a couple that do drum grids and drum maps but then seem to only allow standard midi representation.


#278: 2 against 3 or 3 against 4
2 against 3 or 3 against 4

(278)

Submitted by: Sukita1@aol.com on 16 Sep 1997

How do you enter 2 beats in the right hand, against 3 beats in the left hand? Or 3 against 4? Or 4 against 3? etc. etc. Also, how does one bracket 4, like in a triplet? When I put a bracketed 4 (manually) in the right hand, with 3 against it in the left, the bar lines go crazy. Hope this makes sense.

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 16 Sep 1997

It makes sense, but there's nothing no can do about it. NWC isn't sophisticated enough for that. If you talking piano music, I don't hink you can fix this. If you're talking individual parts, then print out the parts and touch them up by hand. Other alternatives - print out as a file and touch up in word or Ami Pro. I had groups of 7 16th notes against 2 eighths, and I couldn't resolve it. With an odd group of 5 or 7, you'll have to brace 2 + 3 or 4+3, and put a triplet figure over the group of three in order to make this line up with other parts. Then again, the price is right.

Reply 2 offered by: Ron on 19-Oct-1997

In 4 4 time:

2 against 3: 2 quarter notes against 3 triplet quarter notes

3 against 4 (or 4 against 3): 3 triplet quarter notes against 4 eighth notes (or 4 eighth notes against 3 triplet quarter notes)

In 3 4 time: (NO TRIPLETS NEEDED)

2 against 3: 2 dotted quarter notes against 3 quarter notes

3 against 4 (or 4 against 3): 3 quarter notes against 4 dotted eighth notes (or 4 dotted eighth notes against 3 quarter notes)

As Kent said, anything past 4 is pretty much impossible for NWC. I hope that helps with your problem!

thanx
-roncli

Reply 3 offered by: 92 (kuni) on 13-Aug-1998

I'm Kuni.
Please visit my site.
The address is
http://www.i2.i-2000.com/~kunijetm
It's a new idea for the core of modern culture.
It can change the way people feel.

Sincerely,

92 (Kuni)


#279: Problem with Noteworthy
Problem with Noteworthy

(279)

Submitted by: David Sheppard (Email: oldshep@msn.com) on 17 Sep 1997

When I come to commence writing a Coda in a composition, I would like to have the Coda starting on a new stave. Does anyone know if this is possible. If so, how do I do it?? Would love to hear from someone.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 17 Sep 1997

David,

<<When I come to commence writing a Coda in a composition, I would like to have the Coda starting on a new stave. Does anyone know if this is possible. If so, how do I do it?? >>

I'm afraid the answer is no. Noteworthy basically saves all its pagination and "line-breaks" formatting until you actually print. And there is no way of forcing breaks, spreading lines (but see below), or anything like that. I'm afraid you'd need Finale, or even Lime. I've tried both of these products recently, and they both provide means for correct formatting. However, neither have good computer keyboard interfaces, and both keep crashing on my machine.

The best you can do is, if it's one or two staves, use spaces (turn Preserve Width OFF) to pad out the lines and force a bar to the next line. This is extremely tedious, and only works for one or two bars.

Regards,

Andrew


#282: problem pre-viewing a print and printing on demo of 1.31
problem pre-viewing a print and printing on demo of 1.31

(282)

Submitted by: Bobb Craig on 19 Sep 1997

i installed the 1.31 version from this sight as a demo and can not get it to preview and print properly nor print properly. Is this a restriction in the demo or a installation problem?

Does anyone else out there want NW to add tablature? It would be of great benifit ... as of now I am needing to cut and paste in a graphics program to print what I need ... and this is keeping me from buying much of any program.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 24 Sep 1997

Gary, you'll have to provide some more details.

You said <<<i installed the 1.31 version from this sight as a demo and can not get it to preview and print properly nor print properly. Is this a restriction in the demo or a installation problem?>>>

It always previewed and printed properly for me, even as a demo. Check that your printer setup and page setup look sensible (abot 12 points for print-outs looks good).

More than that I can't say without more info.

Regards,

Andrew mailto:apurdam@pcug.org.au

Reply 2 offered by: isaac on 05-Apr-1998

This would be an awsome program if only it had tablature!!


#283: About import note and rest values...
About import note and rest values...

(283)

Submitted by: kent dugan(kentd@dataworks.com) on 24 Sep 1997

Is anyone able to give a reasonably intelligent discussion of the effects of the note and values when importing? Both in midi import, and in recording. Not that I'd understand it of course, but I am rather curious. While in record mode, I'm usually at a loss to guesstimate where to set these values. Sometimes I get a couple of bars that are exactly what I thought I was playing, and other times, it seems I've been to la-la land, and I'm left with something that looks like it was played by my cat. Then the gibberish left in the record buffer looks to be from Mars. Or maybe France. Same thing. Or is it just too simple to see? (Hah!) Waiting with baited breath (yeah, yeah, with a worm on my tongue, I know).

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew mailto:apurdam@pcug.org.au on 25 Sep 1997

Kent said: <<<Is anyone able to give a reasonably intelligent discussion of the effects of the note and values when importing? Both in midi import, and in recording. Not that I'd understand it of course, but I am rather curious.>>>

Okay. I'll bite. I'm brave enough :-)

<<<While in record mode, I'm usually at a loss to guesstimate where to set these values. Sometimes I get a couple of bars that are exactly what I thought I was playing, and other times, it seems I've been to la-la land, and I'm left with something that looks like it was played by my cat. Then the gibberish left in the record buffer looks to be from Mars. Or maybe France. Same thing.>>>

Hey! We have some nice Fench people who read this forum! (Forgive him, Marsu... :-)

Okay, here goes... Got your bottle of scotch? From what I understand, note resolution is basically the smallest length note that will be used to represent the notes being scanned in (either from the midi buffer after being played, or from a midi file). This will dictate how accurately complex passages are translated, the ultimate simplification being runs of sixteenth notes being swallowed into a quarter note chord!

The rest resolution - I _think_ - dictates the smallest rests to be used, and will have an effect on "staccatoness" of notes. eg if you play a note for three-eights, but only have quarter-note rest resolution, the note will have to resolve to either a full quarter note, or a half-note, because you've disallowed eighth note rests.

SO! The upshot is: if you want your notes to be mainly eighth notes, shoot for eighth note note-resolution (ie, granularity of note-on). If you're a show-off, make it smaller. If you want to track note LENGTHS more accurately, (ie granularity of note-off), then make the rest size smaller.

There! Enjoy your scotch? %-)

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: kent dugan on 08 Oct 1997

Nicely put. In other words, it only works for a few bars, then it breaks down. But it works. Thanks. I was afraid I understood that. It's just as awkward as I feared.


#285: Highlighting staves
Highlighting staves

(285)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 25 Sep 1997

I want to print out instrumental duets so that each player sees his own staff in black and the accompanying part is in light grey. Can this be done?

Reply 1 offered by: <NWC-Support> on 14-Oct-1997

NWC does not support color selection in a staff, or per staff, when you are printing.

<Eric>


#286: Two part staves
Two part staves

(286)

Submitted by: cjsteele@sjfn.nb.ca on 26 Sep 1997

I was asked by my choir to convert regular sheet music to MIDI format for playback. 4 hours later, I had 16 pages of music each with 6 staves. The music really only had 3 staves but had two parts per staff. Is there any way of putting two voices (parts ie. sop and alto) on one staff??

Reply 1 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 27 Sep 1997

If you (or a friend) has an inexpensive sequencing program such as midisoft, you can export as a midi file, then combine tracks, then reimport into Noteworthy (unless you want to print out the Midisoft score). Only problem: will not be able to have "up" and "down" note stems for the various voices on a particular staff. Hope that helps. P.S. may be able to simply download a shareware sequencing program for a one time effort.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 27 Sep 1997

To put more than one part per stave, it's just a matter of entering more than one note, using the Ctrl-Enter combination. If notes are of different length, the higer pitched note will have its tail up, and the lower will have its tail down. NWC does not yet implement two voices sharing the same pitch, nor voices crossing over each other (ie tails pointing "inside".

Hope this answers the question.

Andrew

btw: If you implemented this, you would have only had 8 pages to show for your 4 hours work! ;-) (Actually still pretty good!)


#287: Hearing Single Staff
Hearing Single Staff

(287)

Submitted by: Arthur W. Schulze on 27 Sep 1997

Is there any fast way of playing back a single staff of a twelve-staff score without going to the Score Builder and muting the eleven other staves? This would be useful in hearing each part individually.

Reply 1 offered by: Kend Dugan on 02 Oct 1997

Highlight the staff you want to play, then hit Alt-F5 to just play that one. Or is it shift-F5?

Reply 2 offered by: Tim Reichard on 27 Sep 1997

NWC v1.31 has a Staff Play command in the Tools menu. The shortcut is Shift+F5. This will playback a single staff.

Hope this helps,

Tim Reichard

Reply 3 offered by: spearson@ptialaska.net on 27 Sep 1997

The latest versions of Noteworthy have a "mute" button. Just activate a staff and hit the mute. Much simpler than the older way. Hope that helps.

Reply 4 offered by: Arthur W. Schulze on 27 Sep 1997

Thanks to Tim Reichard and Spearson.

I downloaded the latest version of NWC, and there it was: single staff playing.

Many Thanks again, Art (schulze@yankton.com)


#288: Midi Keyboard
Midi Keyboard

(288)

Submitted by: Rod Westwood - rwestwood@geocities.com on 28 Sep 1997

I need to get a midi keyboard for noteworthy. What is the best one to get?????

Reply 1 offered by: Alex Trent (alex@trent.powernet-int.co.uk) on 01 Oct 1997

Put simply, one which fits your budget, and with the tone and facilities which are important to YOU. NWC isn't fussy, so just go for something with facilities you need. I'm happy with a Casio CTK-601, but even this has more facilities than I need.

Using MIDI as direct input is fun though! You'll find it both frustrating and rewarding, then revert to mouse and keyboard!

Reply 2 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 16-Oct-1997

One of the possible use of a midi keyboard is the step by step
entry of notes. It's very usefull for average to good score readers.
But it has to be "ergonomic" to really speed up the entry
compared to the PC keyboard.
The solution i've implemented is a mini-midi keyboard which
fits exactly before the pc kbd (Width 70cm/30", depth 15cm/6"). It allows me to have the screen in front
and to continue to use the PC kbd for note length, shortcuts and various
menu access.
Its a passive midi kbd which costs around 100$ in France. You may easily
find an equivalent one anywhere.You may access directly to only five octaves
but there's a key to shift up or down . Main advantages: price, size and simplicity.
For the sound output, I did choose an external expander (Yamaha TG100)
associated to a good HIFI system.

Good luck
Bruno

Reply 3 offered by: Ellie on 24-Apr-1998

Well I don't really know anything about the keybard but I'm sure that any one with black and white keys would be good. HA HA HA HA HA

Reply 4 offered by: John Frings on 15-Jul-1998

Hey!

I´m currently makin music in fasttracker but I´m thinking of starting to use midi.. I think I am going to buy a MC-303 Drumbox (even thou its kinda expensive) and a midi keyboard. The big question is: How much am I supposed to pay for a such a thing and what brand should i go for???
If you think you can help me out or tell me about your own equipment please send me a mail...

Oh, by the way.. I want to continue to make techno-ish music..

Greetings From Sweden: John

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 15-Jul-1998

This has been discussed before (a search through the newsgroup and the Offline Forum may help you here).
I think keyboards should be around $US100-150 and midi boxes about the same, or just put a really good card (Ensoniq or SW AWE64 Gold or the good Roland card about $US200-300?) and good speakers in your PC

Andrew


#289: Pauses During Playback
Pauses During Playback

(289)

Submitted by: jetboy@bellsouth.net on 28 Sep 1997

I just downloaded NoteWorthy and was wondering if anyone else is experiencing the same problem. When I play back songs, the software seems to hesitate on various notes. I'm sure it shouldn't be doing this. I am running the 32-bit version on a 133 MHz 586 computer.

Reply 1 offered by: jetboy@bellsouth.net on 29 Sep 1997

Thanks for the info. I re-installed the 16-bit version and everything plays like it should. Thanks again.

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson <mrbanjo@bright.net on 28 Sep 1997

See Forum archives. See my subject: Hesitation on Playback on 32-bit (Win95)NWC dated 9 June 1997 and Eric (NWC support) response of Jun 21. Playback in 16-bit mode is better than 32-Bit mode.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

High performance playback in the 32-bit version of NWC will be provided in the next NWC release. We will be announcing some more details about the next release at this web site when they are official.


#290: Export, modify & print: nearly all you wish for!
Export, modify & print: nearly all you wish for!

(290)

Submitted by: Kevin O'Brien kob@ihug.co.nz on 29 Sep 1997

When exporting WMF files Publisher does'nt work well and only limited changes can be made.

See how it can be done with Ulead's PhotoImpact. http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/Stage/6416/


#292: Recording Problems
Recording Problems

(292)

Submitted by: Craig Davis on 02 Oct 1997

Great program so far, but I can't record yet. I have a Roland Piano and a sb16 card. When I hit record it records for about 1 second and then turns off immediately. I does seem to record whatever I play before record turns off. I can use the keyboard to 'edit' a score but this seems different since only quarter notes appear on the page.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Newbee,

Craig Davis

Reply 1 offered by: seb@draper.com on 08 Oct 1997

That sounds like what happens when you don't have a long enough existing score. This is the one biggest pain with the current implementation of MIDI recording: it goes only as long as the length of the existing score. If you want your imagination to run wild, you need to create a dummy score and pad it out (e.g. with rests) to as long as you think your inspiration can hold out.

- seb

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 03 Oct 1997

Craig said <<<Great program so far, but I can't record yet. I have a Roland Piano and a sb16 card. When I hit record it records for about 1 second and then turns off immediately. I does seem to record whatever I play before record turns off.>>>

Hmm. Have you got MIDI port usage (in Options) set to Always or While Active? If not, it will only read in when your playing (While Playing). That would probably give rise to the above phenomenon, though probably not the one below, so I'm not too sure.

<<<I can use the keyboard to 'edit' a score but this seems different since only quarter notes appear on the page. >>>

Don't forget the 1 to 6 keys to change the note length.

Regards, Andrew Purdam mailto:apurdam@pcug.org.au

Also at http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

The easiest way to start recording is to use the FIle New command. Select one of the Rhythm templates, which you can use as a metronome while you play your parts. Other settings in the Tools> Options also effect this.


#293: Weird Sounds
Weird Sounds

(293)

Submitted by: ultra_sword@geocities.com on 04 Oct 1997

When I am using Note Worthy Player, a song sounds Perfect, but when loaded up on Note Worthy Composer... UGH!!! It only does this on a few songs. Why? Please respond at ultra_sword@geocitis.com;

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

You can make playback in NWC work exactly like what the Player does. Simply select the MIDI Mapper in the MIDI Devices Used by Playback, and no other devices. This effectively forces NWC to playback in the same way as the player.

Reply 2 offered by: Daniel Hopkinson on 02-Dec-1997

About two years ago I was able to get the update for Note Worthy Composer. My computer crashed about a few months ago and I've looking for the update eve since I got my computer fixed. I haven't found it yet. I was wondering if you could tell me wher I could get it, or if you could send it to me via E-Mail.

Thank you for your time,
Daniel Hopkinson


#294: How to do a Bridge
How to do a Bridge

(294)

Submitted by: Philip Humphrey (pjgraphics@compuserve.com) on 05 Oct 1997

I'm using NoteWorthy to learn new songs in our church. Some of these scores are written with a Bridge (a part of the tune is skipped at say the 3rd repeat). How do I get these in and working in NoteWorthy. Thanks in anticipation Philip.

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 08 Oct 1997

Not sure what a 'bridge' means in your context, but you have all of the available endings, and also DC, DS, Coda, Signs, and everything else you need. This just takes some planning. See the sample data on repeats to get some ideas.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 06 Oct 1997

To work out how to change "flow" in the music, look up Flow Direction Symbol Command in the online help, and refer to the Repeat*.NWC files in the Samples directory.

If you're still stuck, call again.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: seb@draper.com on 08 Oct 1997

A general comment about composing software: Sometimes it's better to take advantage of the power of the computer and write the whole piece out than to try to economize on paper and ink by using the various encodings we've developed over the centuries to show repeats, da capo's, etc.

With cut and paste, this can be really easy. It also saves your choristers some headaches, as they don't have to flip around the music several times during a rehearsal or performance.

That said, I would be happier if there were a way to copy/paste all the staves at once, instead of having to copy/paste the Soprano part, then the Alto part, then the... etc.

- seb

Reply 4 offered by: snedegar on 26-Dec-1997

Just a historic note of sorts . . . the term "bridge" mostly
comes from tin-pan alley tunesmiths who wrote scores of
scores a DAY and had a formula of 1. intro, 2. chorus,
3. bridge, 4. chorus, and 5. coda.

Not all songs contained all parts of course, but if you look
say at the old Benny Goodman piece, "Memories of You" you
find the format most usually followed by jazz and swing
players of chorus-bridge-chorus, and quite often you hear
musicians asking, "I remember the piece, but how does the
BRIDGE go?"

In this context a "bridge" might have been a "verse" which
preceded each "chorus" but a "verse" would be more at the
changing words preceding each standard "chorus" such as
"Roll me over, in the clover, roll me over, lay me down, etc."

For something like "Somewhere Over the Rainbow" the "chorus"
would be the "Somewhere over the rainbow, way up high, etc.",
and the "bridge" would be "Someday I'll wish upon a star, and
wake up where the clouds are far . . .etc."

Most of the jazz musicians I've ever talked with only know two
parts of a song---chorus and bridge. The main theme is the
chorus, and whatever else there might be, whether intro or
verse, or something else entirely, still ends being called
"the bridge."

Classical musicians for the most part don't have any idea
what comprises a bridge, or in fact what the term, "progression"
might mean either. The progression was mostly a standard in
Tin Pan Alley, as well, implying that the chords in the song
would follow the circle of sevenths just as surely as the
Spring would follow the Winter and so on . . . if you couldn't
ANTICIPATE that way, the singers couldn't sing and the players
couldn't play . . . and the songwriters couldn't SELL.

Incidentally, most classical music DOES "progress" along the
same circle of 7ths, it just isn't advertised to the player.

Sned

Reply 5 offered by: Derek on 02-Jan-1998

The special endings do not print out the way it should. The DC al Coda (or something like that) should be at the end of the current line, and the Coda should start at a new line. And the To Coda does not have a preserve width!! so you get a blank space below the To Coda


#295: SB16 no sound - FYI
SB16 no sound - FYI

(295)

Submitted by: jon.featherstone@medtronic.com on 06 Oct 1997

FYI, I installed Noteworthy 16-bit version on Win 95. Everything OK except no sound on playback. Finally found problem in Soundblaster 16 'Mixer' control panel - Midi volume was set to zero!

Regards, Jon Featherstone

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Fila on 02-Nov-1997

I had my midi device running, but I had no sound. I think volume
is down but mixer wont work with Sound Blaster 8-bit so I
can't turn it up!!!!

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 3 offered by: Jason Bass on 21-Nov-2000

Yeah I'm having the Same Problem I have the old sound Blaster and the driver but my volume conytrol in my windows 95 Says that It Doesn't have in Active Mixer??Arrgggg...
I've been fighting with this for 2 days laugh even with the
Drivers I can't get it to work arggg..Any Thoughts I could use the help Please email back Thanx Anyone!!
Krunchy.


#296: Importing triplets
Importing triplets

(296)

Submitted by: Andrew Lutley on 08 Oct 1997

When importing a midi file which contains triplets, I find that Noteworthy converts the triplets. For example a quaver triplet in the midi file will be converted into two dotted semiquavers and a semiquaver in the NWC file.

Does anyone know why this is happening?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 08 Oct 1997

This question was asked and answered only 18 days ago. Admittedly, is is now in the most recent archive, with a dumb name (I think the posting mechanism was having trouble), but I managed to find it using the "SEARCH" facility on the Forum "command bar".

In answer to your question, goto /forums/_forum1/0000036a.htm for a full explanation.

Regards,

Andrew Purdam mailto:apurdam@pcug.org.au

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

Bottom line: NWC does not support the import of triplets as triplets. It rounds them into a conventional meter.


#298: How Do I Add A Glissando
How Do I Add A Glissando

(298)

Submitted by: Tony Johnson (tonemeistr@aol.com) on 09 Oct 1997

How do I input a glissando into my staff?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 10 Oct 1997

For more on how to add glissandi in Noteworthy read /composer/usertips.htm#arpeggio

The idea's the same. As far as reducing the note size, I'm afraid I can't help you. Hopefully a future release of NWC will address this problem.

Regards,

Andrew mailto:apurdam@pcug.org.au http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam


#299: Supressing Empty Staves
Supressing Empty Staves

(299)

Submitted by: MichaelL65@msn.com on 12 Oct 1997

Does anyone knnow if there is a way to supress (keep from printing) staves that are empty? Many of my songs have parts that are silent for quite some time, and it would be nice if a staff would be removed from the system if it is empty clear across the page. (Example: most published vocal/piano scores do not have the vocal staff in the system during the intro/ending/interlude/whatever if the vocal staff would be empty clear across the page for that particular system)

I've started combining staves if the parts do not play simultaniously anywhere in the composition, which reduces some of the staves per system, but that isn't always an option.

Can it be done with NWC yet? If not, I hope it will be soon!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

NWC does not currently support staff suppression in different printed systems.

Reply 2 offered by: Jim Gary on 10-Nov-1997

Supressing empty staves when printing is a concern of mine as well. I hope this feature will be added soon.

I would also like to be able to insert a graphic dynamic variance instead of the words crescendo, decrescendo etc.

Reply 3 offered by: Martti Pesso on 24-Nov-1997

I have the same problem with soloist/choir during verses
and choruses too much space is spent with rest-filled
staffs appearing along with the solo-verses.

Reply 4 offered by: Elliot Vernon on 16-Jan-2001

I just want an empty stave so I can write my own music!

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 16-Jan-2001

You can get what you want by filling up a staff with rests and barlines and then hiding everything. (Select everything and hit <Ctrl-E> to edit. In the "Visibility" tab set "Show on printed page" to "Never".)

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 16-Jan-2001

You could try transferring you composition as WMF into a word processing program, then crop out what you don't want. Then print it from the word processor.


#300: New version...?
New version...?

(300)

Submitted by: Alan Horne (raven906@aol.com) on 13-Oct-1997

Noteworthy Composer has come a long way since its beginnings, but I have noticed lately that there is (apparently) no plan for future versions. Is there a future version planned? If so, what features can be expected?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

A new version of NWC is absolutely under development. HOWEVER, we are not publishing the new feature content or schedule at this time. We will publish any official announcement on this web site as soon as such a statement is available.


#301: Downloading NWC files from the internet
Downloading NWC files from the internet

(301)

Submitted by: tomgil@hotmail.com on 13-Oct-1997

I have created a web page which contains various NWC files which I would like people to be able to download. Unfortunately, when you click with the left button it does not say it is downloading it replaces the web page with various symbols and letters from the file. Any idea what I have done wrongly. The source for my page looks just the same as those of other people. Tom

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 13-Oct-1997

Tom, this is an extract of an old e-mail I sent to Eric a long time ago when I was investigating this for my web page http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html (which has exactly what you are attempting, so might be worth a peek).

<<<Netscape, in reply to the question "Why doesn't my web page work when I upload it to my ISP's server?" say (amongst other things) "If you have composed a web page locally on your hard drive and it works, but once uploaded sound files don't play, etc., read on.

The web functions on MIME types. For every document transmitted, the server includes a 'header' which instructs the receiver (web browser) as to what *kind* of data is being sent. The format is type/sub-type.

When a sound clip or video applet doesn't run, it is usually related to MIME types on either or both the client (Navigator) and the server. Example: Server is sending application/midi, when the client is expecting audio/x-midi. The fix: contact your service provider (ISP) for help to correct the mismatch. " >>>

I imagine your ISP won't have anything for .NWC files, so suggest something like application/x-nwc or application/nwx, and then things should go just fine.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Joonas Linkola on 28-Oct-1997

This can be solved in at least two ways:

First, you can pack the .NWC files with something like WinZip or ARJ,
and upload the archives to your site. Most browsers should recognize
ZIP-archives.

Secondly, you can RIGHT-click on the file, and choose "Save file as..."
The file should download properly. This applies to all files.

Reply 3 offered by: Bjorn Heimir Bjornsson on 04-Nov-1997

In an 1 year old article ntworthy.com recommended mime type "application/nw-composer".

To that I would like to add that I believe that the mime standard specifies that an "x-" has to be prefixed since this is not a universally recognized mime type.
It would then become "application/x-nw-composer" and ntworthy.com should make this its standard.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Nov-1997

Out bottom line: Your web server's mime type setting for *.nwc files is significant only in that it recognizes NWC files as binary encoded data. You may use whatever setting you like, as long as it meets your needs. Defining the NWC data as application specific on the server is generally all that is required to get it to send the file data in binary encoded form.

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Feb-1999

See also: msg #18 (reply 9)

Reply 7 offered by: jae duk lee on 31-Jan-2001

first faced with nwc files
so i need nwc files..i want to study compositing music.

Reply 8 offered by: Fred on 31-Jan-2001

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/userlinks.htm

Have fun! :)


#302: Programmed composition?
Programmed composition?

(302)

Submitted by: jclarke@hursley.ibm.com on 13-Oct-1997

I am too lazy to decide which notes I want to use. Being a C++ keeny as well as a musician, I'd like to write a program to choose my notes for me (within parameters). Would the .h file for the nwmidi.dll file, plus a little documentation from you, help me write such a program?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

We do not publish the interface for our play back engine. However, Microsoft does publish a multimedia API that might help you. Refer to your Microsoft developer materials for details on the API (MMSYSTEM).

Reply 2 offered by: John Clarke on 20-Oct-1997

Thanks for that pointer!


#304: How do I reset my "seen map"
How do I reset my "seen map"

(304)

Submitted by: John Gillings on 13-Oct-1997

In the changeover to this new style forum, my web browser
has lost track of what forum entries I've already read. Is
there any way I can set them all to "seen"?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

There is no facility in a web based forum to filter messages in a manner such as you describe.

However, most browsers keep a cache of web pages that you have previously viewed. In thisa case, the browser may show these previously cached pages in a different link color. However, the pages in this new forum are just that: NEW. The files from our previous forum no longer exist. Your browser will not have any cached versions of files in this new forum, as they did not exist until today.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 14-Oct-1997

And how will I be able to keep track of new replies?
They used to come up in a different colour before.

Also, what about hlinks in my text, like
http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam ??? I guess
I'll find out once I've posted this reply... :-)

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 14-Oct-1997

Hmmm. Two steps forward and one backwards. It seems we've lost:
1) the ability to monitor new replies in a thread, (see below)
2) the ability to insert hyperlinks into our pages (okay, so not many of us did that anyway :-)

But we've gained:
1) better control over formatting,
2) the ability to download a whole thread in one file,
3) more consistent interface to email addressing

Okay. I just read the instructions (forumfaq.htm)!!! Apparently I'll be notified of new replies to a thread! That should be fun! C'mon! Can someone reply to this to see how it works?

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

Only the original author of a post will be notified when replies are offered. This also is not working completely at the moment, as far as I can tell.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

The email mechanism should now be working properly. The original message author should receive a notification of new replies as they arrive.

Reply 6 offered by: John Gillings on 14-Oct-1997

Yikes, it's worse than I thought!

Although I did get a mail message informing me that there
was a reply, I found I had to refresh the contents page
in order to see the change in reply count (never had to do
that before). I also found that I had to refresh the message
page as well to see replies. That means it's now impossible
to detect new postings. Added to the lack of a "read next new
posting" button, it really makes the forum unuseable.
What is the "intended" mode of use? I used to read all
new postings in the old forum daily. Can't do it any more.

Reply 7 offered by: re: Yikes! on 15-Oct-1997

I must agree. This system begs for some (cookie based?) mechanism to keep track of new messages.

Andrew

Reply 8 offered by: John Gillings on 04-Nov-1997

I've tried this new system for the last month and I'm afraid
it just doesn't work for me. I like to be able to keep up
without having to reread or manually track what I've already
read.
From today I will stop reading the forum on a regular basis.
I'll probably visit from time to time if I have a specific
question. It's a dissapointment, but I guess that's "progress"

Reply 9 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Jan-1998

Unfortunately, there is not much point in replying to a
message this far down in the forum. The originator will get
a mail message, no one else will notice. Suggestions:

1) Some way to access messages chronologically, so we can
look at the recent ones.

2) The e-mail notification for the originator is good. How
about notifying everybody who participated in the thread?
You get a better response starting a new thread than responding
to an old one, which spreads out information and makes it
harder to find. For example, there are many threads about
grace notes - it would be better if there was only one.

Hope somebody finds this. I will post these ideas to the wish list.


#306: Problem using Soundbanks in NWC 1.31d
Problem using Soundbanks in NWC 1.31d

(306)

Submitted by: Per Pettersson on 14-Oct-1997

Something is going very wrong when I try to direct soundbanks to a staff/instrument. I select the "Send patch bank" (or what it says, I can't recall) I am supposed to select, and I check that I've uploaded a soundbank to my SB AWE 64's DRAM. It all seems to be running smoothly...

But what happens? When I'm trying to use my own drum sounds it sounds like a piano (as if the soundbank wasn't loaded)...
Seems kind of funny, when this works perfectly fine in NWC 1.2...

Is this a bug or am I just comitting a fatal error? Please help me out on this!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 15-Oct-1997

Hmm. I thought I'd already replied to this. Anyhow, here's another go...
Check out /nwcforum/265.htm and see if that helps you. In a nutshell, multiply your bank number by 128.

Regards,
Andrew


#307: Hints on using this forum
Hints on using this forum

(307)

Submitted by: NWC-Support on 14-Oct-1997

As you may have noticed, the forum has changed substantially. We made these changes for several reasons:

1 - Improved performance

The original forum, built with FrontPage, was a poor performer when adding new messages (it was very slow), and generated index listings that were much larger than necessary.

2 - Easier maintenance

We can now support the forum better, because of a more logical archival mechanism and easier maintenance approach.

3 - Usability

The original author of a message can optionally be notified of new replies to an original post by simply adding their email address to the post.

In the past, each message (whether an original post, or a reply) was added to the forum as a new file. In the new forum, message replies are inserted into the same file with the original message. This means that you will need to probably need to refresh your browser display when looking for replies to earlier messages.

You can use the number of replies listed in the forum index to guage whether a pre-existing message has new replies. If you are an original author for a message, and you provide an e-mail address, you may also receive an e-mail notice when replies are added to your message file (when everything is working correctly). You will still have to visit the forum, however, as the actual reply content is not sent in any email notifications (although the URL of the message will be listed in the email).

We hope you enjoy the new forum! Please report any problems here in the forum, or by email if you are unable to work in the forum.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 15-Oct-1997

Perhaps you could put the "Last Modified" date next to the number of replies.

Perhaps you could even sort the files by this date so that all the files to be read are at the top!

Just an idea %<)

Reply 2 offered by: Wayne Daniel on 17-Jan-1998

A keword search function would also be wonderful.
Thanks for the good work to date.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Apr-1998

Here are a couple of new tips on using this forum.

Have you ever wanted to insert a link to a previous forum message in your forum post or reply? Well, now you can. Once you know the message thread number of the existing forum post, you can create a hypertext link to that message simply by prefixing the message number with an exclamation point (!). For example, if you type "!308" (without the quotes) in a forum post, the forum will replace the quoted text with a "msg #308" link automatically.

Have you ever wanted to insert a web link in the form of a hypertext link? Now you can. The exclamation point also works for web addresses that use the standard http:// prefix. For example, you can insert a hypertext link to our web site by inserting " !http://www.ntworthy.com " into your forum post (without the quotes, but should be separated by spaces or a new line).

Have you ever wanted to do a comprehensive, indexed search of the forum files? Well, if you are using Windows 95 or NT 4.0, now you can. Simply download a copy of the offline version of this forum ( available at http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm ), then press the Find button.

**NOTE: The first time you initiate a find on the offline forum, WinHelp will dynamically construct an index of all information in the forum. This process will only be necessary the first time that you use the find procedure. The process will also need to be repeated if you upgrade the offline forum to a newer vintage.


#308: Getting the whole forum
Getting the whole forum

(308)

Submitted by: Alain Falcoz on 15-Oct-1997

Is there a way to get the whole forum from internet in one shot, to print it quietly at home ?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Oct-1997

We do not currently provide a mechanism for this, but will consider making such a thing available in the future. For now, we offer it only in the browsable form that you are currently using.

Reply 2 offered by: M. Steverink on 22-Oct-1997

There are programs available that download entire websites or parts of it. Maybe this is an option for you?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Apr-1998

The NoteWorthy Composer forum is now available offline!

Click the "View Offline" link at the top of either the Recent-100 or Contents page for details (or go directly to http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm).


#309: Keyboard/computer setup
Keyboard/computer setup

(309)

Submitted by: Gordon Ganderton on 17-Oct-1997

Hi, I have finally registered.
Many queries I find relate to the setup of your system. For example, I have full size piano keyboard in front of me with the computer keyboard in a pull out tray below. My piano is high up and I sit on a high chair. Now all I do is enter notes with right hand on piano kybd while entering hot keys with left hand on cmptr kybd. This is for right hand treble music. Now - for left hand bass staff I enter notes with left hand on piano kybd and use the number keypad plus hot keys with right hand on cmptr kybd. One main feature that switched me from Passport Encore to Noteworthy was the use of space bar for rests in Noteworthy. In Encore, you have to press the R on keyboard, then press a piano key, then press the R on cmptr to get back to notes. Not very convenient and rather annoying. Am now reading all past forum msgs and will have lots of questions and suggestions soon.
Rgds. Gordon.


#310: Bug in Audit Accidentals?
Bug in Audit Accidentals?

(310)

Submitted by: Jools on 17-Oct-1997

Hi, I finally registered too!
I'm having a problem with the audit accidentals feature. When you have put an accidental on a note, it seems to be acting like a key change (affecting notes in all octaves) rather than just changing the notes on that one line.
As a result, it is deleting the accidental symbols from the other notes in the bar. Is it correct to do this (I'm not gifted with be a trained musician, but my wife gives me stick when I ask her to play the printed scores!).
If an example would help, it makes a hideous mess of the bass part in Bach's Air. The notes should be D D' C#' C# but it insists on removing the # from the second C#. (And yes I know it should be in D, but I was making an example!!)
Has anyone else found this - I didn't spot it whilst reading through the faqs / previous problems.

}B->

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 17-Oct-1997

>The notes should be D D' C#' C# but it
There is a convention that accidentals cover all octaves. Most people will put one in as a reminder though. Audit accidentals will take them out, though. It would be nice to have an option allowing for them to stay.

Two options:
1) don't use audit accidentals anymore, or
2) Use the text feature to add (#) in front of the note.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 20-Oct-1997

Sorry to disagree Andrew, but the rule is that accidentals only affect subsequent notes in the bar AT THE SAME PITCH. Quite specifically they do NOT affect notes at the octave.

Coincidentally I had written to Noteworthy only a few days ago on this very subject. How come it has only just surfaced? And in several places at once!

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 20-Oct-1997

Hmm. Okay, maybe I first saw the octave thingy with Noteworthy, and came to take it as gospel. Just goes to show you can't believe everything on the net that you read. :-)
I guess its only just surfacing now is just a cosmic thing, and of no other significance ;-)

- A

Reply 4 offered by: Jools on 20-Oct-1997

I checked up with a friendly conductor who confirmed that my initial impression about accidentals was accurate (at least that's what he'd been going by for many years)
My problem isn't so much when inputting the music from the PC keyboard, but more when I import a midi file and print out the score.

cheers,

jools }B->

Reply 5 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20-Oct-1997

NWC does apply acccidentals in all octaves of a note in a measure. This is not strictly the proper way to interpret the accidentals, but it is the way NWC works at the moment. For now, it is best to add accidentals to all notes in differing octaves after the first in a measure that is not in key. This ,ight help the player as well, in cases where it might be confusing without them.


#311: Multi-bar rests.
Multi-bar rests.

(311)

Submitted by: Jools on 17-Oct-1997

Another question.
I have been recently keying in music for a recorder orchestra, and printing out both a complete conductor's score and scores for individual parts.
Is there a way in the individual parts to input a multi-bar rest with the number of bars written on top rather than that number of complete bars with a rest in each?
I don't particularly want to edit the score as the conductor's score and the overall playback will be messed up.
(could this be one for the wishlist?)

}B->

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 19-Oct-1997

My pet whinge - Please add yours to the wishlist!!

Reply 2 offered by: support@ntworthy.com on 20-Oct-1997

We are currently evaluating a substitution scheme that would allow dynamic replacement of multiple rests with a multi-measure rest when printing individual parts. However, NWC does not support multi-measure rests at this time. It is on our wish list as a popular item, so is given due consideration in our development cycle. The most popular wish list items are considered first in our development cycle, but the choice is up to you as to whether you cast your vote.

Reply 3 offered by: kent dugan on 20-Oct-1997

Currently, you can make a copy of your score. I call mine xxxpts.nwc (for parts). I go into this one and delete all repeated measure rests. It will never play right, but you'll only get one bar out instead of 20 or 30 empty bars. Then after printing, write the correct figure above the bar.
I've used the text function (x & the number or bars), but even if you set the number of bars in parentheses, they're too small for a player to sight-read. Since the font is limited to one for the entire page, it'll never look right unless you notate by hand.
Like the man said, go put in a request on the wish list. We really need this feature.

Reply 4 offered by: Lorraine Peter on 28-Feb-1998

I wish to add my vote to your wish list for multi-measure rests.


#312: using stereo in midis
using stereo in midis

(312)

Submitted by: Preston Robler on 17-Oct-1997

Is it at all possible to make midis with NWC in stereo format? Thanks for your help in advance. Please send via email.
~MagicToads
http://members.aol.com/nortoads/index.html

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 17-Oct-1997

For each staff, you can specify in Midi tab of Staff Properties... (F2, or off the right mouse button, or under the Staff menu) the Stereo pan of the staff. 0 is left. 127 is right. 64 is centre.
I often pan out my parts. It gives the pieces a much more spatial feel.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Oct-1997

If your sound card supports stereo, then it is not a problem. You can set the pan position for a steff in the MIDI staff properties. Many lesser expensive cards only support left, center, and right side imaging, if they support it at all, so keep this in mind.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 29-Nov-1997

I do have a card that currently upport only left, center and right positions
for midi settings. but there is a way to 'pan' the voice
exactly where you want to : just duplicate the wanted voice
(NOT on the same channel) and adjust the midi VOLUME (not
velocity, as velocity is used for p, pp, fff stuff).
for example for 4 voices, you will set (in SATB choir)
S at 0 (left) position,
A at 0 (left) position and duplicated A on 63 (middle) with a half-volume settings
T at 127 (right) and duplicated T on 63 (middle) with a half-volume settings
B at 127 (right) position.

Or place it otherwise, now you got the idea. (I often add solo voices at 63 (middle) just between other voices.

Hope this helps !


#313: NWC to MID
NWC to MID

(313)

Submitted by: Max Comess on 17-Oct-1997

Does anyone know a way (or a program) to convert your
standard .nwc files to MIDI, ones with an extention .mid.
Any help is appreciated.

Max

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 17-Oct-1997

In the File menu choose "Export"

A

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Oct-1997

This functionality is built into NoteWorthy Composer. use the File Export command to do this. You can control whether Type 0 or Type 1 files are exported via the Tools, Options command.


#314: NWC32.EXE Command Line Options
NWC32.EXE Command Line Options

(314)

Submitted by: Ron on 19-Oct-1997

I am attempting to get Windows 95 to import .MID files to NWC32.exe if I select the "Open" option from the menu.... This involves a whole set of DDE (Dynamic Data Exchange) options which I have absolutely no clue how to set!!

If anyone can help with this, e-mail me back and let me know! :-)~¤~

thanx
-roncli

Reply 1 offered by: Dave Dunseath on 20-Oct-1997

Ron,
Unless I misunderstand what you are trying to do, you can import .MID files by selecting IMPORT from the file menu in Noteworthy Composer. When the dialog box opens, just navigate to the folder or disk that contains the MID file you want. The IMPORT funcyion defaults to MID format, but if it doesn't, just select MID in the scroll box at the bottom of the IMPORT window.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Oct-1997

You can also set NWC up in the Send To menu if you have Windows 95, or simply drag and drop your MIDI files onto NoteWorthy Composer after it is open. An Option (on Tools menu) also allows you to control whether the Import Wizard is automatically run when you drop files this way.

Reply 3 offered by: Ron on 20-Oct-1997

Thank you both for your responses, but I think I need to rephrase...

What I want to do in Windows 95 is to be able to take a .MID file, right-click on it, and select "Open" from the pop-up menu that appears. When I do this, it should import itself into NoteWorthy Composer.

thanx
-roncli

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 20-Oct-1997

Well, in that case:
1) Open Explorer and select Options... from the View menu.
2) In the File Types tabs, scroll down to your Midi file entry (probably under "M")
3) Double click it, or select it and press Edit (or type Alt-E)
4) In the Edit File Type dialog, press the New button
5) Name the Action (Open with NWC)
6) Use the Browser to find and select NWC as the application to perform the action
6a) Ignore the DDE (or see 6b below)
7) Press OK
8) Press OK!
9) Press OK!!

Now when you select a MIDI file in the browser, you should get "Open with NWC" as a right-mouse menu option.
Try it out. If you don't get the file importing, add a "%1" after the Netscape pathname at Step 6.

Now, if you really want to use DDE as well...
6b) Select the Use DDE option
6c) DDE Message is [Open("%1")]
6d) Application is NWC
6e) Not running is left blank
6f) Topic is System

THIS SHOULD DO IT!!!! :-)

Regards,

Andrew

PS: Eric, wanna add this to the tips page?

Reply 5 offered by: Ron on 21-Oct-1997

Still not working... but I believe that screen you refered to is the correct screen I need to be on... I tried using [Import("%1")], and that didn't work. Perhaps someone at NWC knows a little more DDE than I?

thanx for your help, Andrew
-roncli

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Oct-1997

NWC does not support an "Import" DDE command, although as Andrew points out, you can use the current Open command (as used by *.nwc files) to create an Open or Import menu item for *.mid files, exactly as he describes.


#315: Selecting alternate drum sets
Selecting alternate drum sets

(315)

Submitted by: Andy Martinez on 19-Oct-1997

I am running Windows 95, have a Creative Labs Sound Blaster
AWE32 to which I have added 8mb of memory. I have a need to
use the Brush set, Program #41, but cannot figure out how to
do it. I'm using channel ten as required, then under the
Midi tab, clicked Change, and turned on 'Select...' and
entered both 41 and 5248 (41*128, as I read in a Forum
entry). I still cannot get the brush sounds. Could someone
please provide explicit and details for getting these
sounds? I'll apologize in advance if I've missed them in a
Forum entry or Help File. Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: christian wollin on 20-Oct-1997

Hi!
I had the same problem, but the answer I got was that you got to get a new soundcard. Are you teting chanel 16 instead of 10. I refer to Andrew or Eric who usually knows most of these matters
Good luck!
Christian

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Oct-1997

I am not familiar with the AWE32, so I cannot explicitly say what is required. Does the AWE32 manual/documentation indicate that MIDI Bank Select is used to access the brush set? If so, version 1.31d or later of NWC should work using the procedure described. Have you tried exporting to MIDI and see if it works? Do you have an example MIDI file that demonstrates what you want? If you, it would help if you could send it in an e-mail to us.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Oct-1997

Per the manual (listed below):

"In the GS synthesizer mode, you can select any drum kit out of a selection of 10 drum kits (which include s the Standard drum kit) to play through MIDI channel 10. The choice of more drum kits offers you the flexibility to listen to songs with a wider variety of percussion instruments.

"Each drum kit is essentially an instrument that you can select in the same way you select a melodic instrument. For example, to select the TR-808 drum kit, all you need to do is specify the Prg# as 26 in MIDI channel 10. All percussion sounds will then be played back using the TR-808 drum kit."

If the AWE32 manual is correct, you should not be using Bank Select, as you descroibe above. Rather, you should simply be sending a patch change to the drum channel, which will trigger the necessary drum kit. You do this in the same way as any other instrument patch on the other channels. Simply select the 0 or 1 based patch list in order to select by number.

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP


#316: Octaves
Octaves

(316)

Submitted by: Mark Lucia on 21-Oct-1997

How do you make NoteWorthy play notes an octave below written?
You know, like "8va________". Is there a command, or what?

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson on 21-Oct-1997

1. Select staff. 2. Enter shortcut key "c" which will
bring up window for octave selection. 3. Click on octave
shift which will bring up octave up or down selection.
Choose what you want to do

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson on 21-Oct-1997

1. Select staff. 2. Enter shortcut key "c" which will
bring up window for octave selection. 3. Click on octave
shift which will bring up octave up or down selection.
Choose what you want to do

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Oct-1997

An alternative to Don's suggestion - if you dont want an 8va clef on the score is to set the staff transposition in Staff Properties - Midi to +12 or -12.

Reply 4 offered by: Mark on 22-Oct-1997

Thank you very much!


#317: Instrument Choices
Instrument Choices

(317)

Submitted by: David Moderate on 22-Oct-1997

I love NWC but I'm pretty new to electronic composition. I
composed a piece of music that I thought was beeeeeutiful!!!
(On my sound card, that is). I exported it to MIDI and e-mailed
it to a friend. I have an AWE32, he has a SB16. At a later
time, while at his house, I heard his playback - It was monstrous.
Worse than that, other friends reported the same thing!
Could someone please enlighten me? Am I missing something?
Are some instruments consistent across different sound cards? Does
Noteworthy Player do something to the GM set that MIDI players
don't? How do you stop strings from turning into piano accordians?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Oct-1997

Trouble is - you composed on a Porsche and your friends played back on a Volkswagen.
You have wavetable synthesis and they dont.
Buy'em an AWE64 for Xmas.
They'll love your composition then!

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Oct-1997

Here's a cheap solution - Get your friends to download Wingroove - great shareware wave synthesis - only $20US.
At http://www.cc.rim.or.jp/~hiroki/english

Reply 3 offered by: David Moderate on 22-Oct-1997

Thanks Barry:) But what about the net? I'm setting up a music site. Do I only compose using piano or can I convert midi to another waveband-friendly format? MPEG3 looks promising but finding inexpensive 'drag & drop' software is proving difficult. Now wouldn't "export NWC to MPEG3" be a nice addition.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Oct-1997

When creating a composition for electronic distribution, there is no way to guarantee the performance level of the equipment in which your piece will be played. You should probably construct your song such that it uses General MIDI patch assignments, and then test it in this configuration. When distributing it, state that General MIDI support is required to get satisfactory playback results. In the end, your piece will almost always sound better on premium equipment, and authors of MIDI files will always be faced with trade-off decisions based on the target audience of their song, and the minum level of MIDI equipment required to hear a MIDI work as the author intended it to be experienced. Good luck.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 22-Oct-1997

I think "NWC->MPEG3" would not be the way to go.
Think of midi as a file of musical instructions; what instrument to play, when to play it and how loud, etc... Now depending on the quality of the sound card (and let's face it, they're getting better all the time), you can get some very very very good sounds.
MPEG, WAV and AU digitise sound, much like - say - a CD. Let's say it's 16bits per sample (8 is too noisy), and recorded at 20,000 samples per second (less is too noisy). That would make an uncompressed file size of 40kbytes per SECOND!
That's why most WAV files are very large for only a few seconds of low quality sound, and MIDIs are (normally) fairly small (~10K for several minutes of music but this varies ENORMOUSLY) with music that is only limited in quality by
a) the composer
b) the sound card.
That's why everyone should buy good sound cards! ;-)
Hope that partially explains your Newsgroup posting, as well.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: David Moderate on 22-Oct-1997

Thankyou all, and yes, Andrew your comments on file size have cleared that up. Unfortunately, amongst most people I know, the sound card is the last thing on there list. Oh, by the way, nice site Andrew - If you and your ensembles ever burn a CD, post the news. :).

Reply 7 offered by: kent dugan on 22-Oct-1997

At the risk of being redundant, even a cheap SBPro turns out terrific sounds when you play games. Get someone to write a decent driver for us, and the sound should be game quality. What do they do, set up a virtual disk? Just a custom driver? It's done all the time, and the sound is great. Or am I missing something here? Any gamer/programmers out there?
I've always said, hire a 14 year old programmer or two, and they'll solve the problem (If if relates to games or sounds, they'll get it done). Offer a prize.
Sorry about my attitude, but I think the approach is always backwards on these issues. Maybe I'm wrong. At least it's a creative approach, yes?

Reply 8 offered by: Roy Pineau on 22-Jan-1998

Most of the really great music you get from games comes
from the programmers using WAV files which are digitized
versions of recorded music. This simply doesn't work
with a compostiion program such as NoteWorthy. You are
left with few options. Your sound card can either use
FM synthesis (ugh!) or a MIDI output to a MIDI instrument
if it is a non-wavetable card. For MIDI output to sound
good, it has to use some form of a Wavetable "look-up".
What this does is select the desired instrument, go to the
table, find the instrument's patch, select the pitch, and
play it. If your card has a wavetable ROM, this is done in
hardware and all you have to do is set it up in Control Panel.
If you don't have the ROM (SB16 equiv.), you have to do it
by loading a software look-up table. This is what Wingroove
does. It simulates the wavetable lookup in RAM. Granted,
it is no perfect substitute for the hardware, but it has the
virtue of being cheap. Take a look at my web music page:
www.cst.net/~rpineau/musicpg.htm
There is a subpage I put there where you can test your card
and hopefully make the right adjustments.


#318: importing/recording chords
importing/recording chords

(318)

Submitted by: Paolo Faure Ragani on 22-Oct-1997

I've noticed some problems importing or recording files having chords with notes of different length.
For example if I export and then inport one of the sample songs
having this kind of chords (this implies that the song has two or more
voices on the same staff) I can't get the same song!
How can I solve this problem?

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Oct-1997

NWC only supports the import of one voice per track of a MIDI file. You can set split points to import multiple staves like left and right hand in a grand staff that appear in a single track. However, you cannot extract arbitrary notes that are a part of multiple voices.


#319: lyrics
lyrics

(319)

Submitted by: Mark on 22-Oct-1997

I want to add lyrics to my score. The problem is, the lyrics
don't start until well into the piece. Is there a way to
skip whole sections of the score before adding the lyrics?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 23-Oct-1997

Don't know of any way to skip whole sections. I frequently create a line of underscore/spaces and then simply copy/paste, paste, paste as needed to fill the voids. Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 13-Dec-2001

Now you can select all the notes that won't have any lyrics, and specify it no to have any lyrics. Exit the tons of underscores.
(Select the notes, Ctrl+E or Alt+Enter, in "Notes" tab, select "Never" in Lyric Syllable list.)


#320: Exporting
Exporting

(320)

Submitted by: Perry Baird on 24-Oct-1997

When I export a file, the "percussion staff" sounds right in Noteworthy, but not in my regular midi file. It sounds like a different instrument. I have the staff channel set on 10.

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Oct-1997

You have not provided very much info, but I will try to help. If you are playing back your MIDI file through something like the Windows' Media Player, then the MIDI Mapper is used for playback. If you are using a different device driver for play back in NWC, then this might explain the difference. You can either change to using the MIDI Mapper in NWC (from the Options, MIDI Tab), or adjust your MIDI Mapper settings. The main point is that you should generally use the General MIDI percussion standard when composing a drum track, so it sounds correctly on all General MIDI equipment. The standard General MIDI drum assignments are in the NWC Help file Common Questions section.


#321: playback doesn't line up with the notes
playback doesn't line up with the notes

(321)

Submitted by: Paul on 26-Oct-1997

I'm having a problem with the playback coming from the speakers lining up with the notes that are highlighted on the screen. The highlighted notes go ahead before the note is actually sounded through the speakers. I've tried both versions (16 & 32 bit) and both have the same problem. I'm using WinGroove as my playback device, and maybe that might have something to do with it...anyone know how to fix this???

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 27-Oct-1997

Is WinGroove that driver that does real-time (read compute-intensive) blending of digital sounds to play through the speaker device?

If so, I'd imagine that the driver is needing so much CPU time that it can't keep up with the demands placed on it. What CPU is in your computer?

..in which case the fix is
1) Get a soundcard that can produce the quality output you want without involving the CPU or
2) Get a faster CPU!!!

Hope this helps...

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Oct-1997

Here is a guess:

The WinGroove driver waits until the "note off" instruction before rendering the actual audio for a particular note event. If it did this, then it would always lag tha actual NWC play back by at least one note sequence.

Reply 3 offered by: Neeraj Mathur on 27-Oct-1997

I have noticed the exact same problem with Yamaha's SYG20XG software synthesizer. This problem comes no matter which program I use that tracks the file. It is simply due to the processor speed or memory.

You can hear it lag if you send some channels through your regular sound card and some through Wingroove - the channels will not play together, and Wingroove will always be just slightly behind the soundcard, and NoteWorthy will track what you hear through the soundcard. The delay between the soundcard and Wingroove will always be exactly the same.

The music you are playing back will not be affected - just look away from the screen, minimize or do something when ou play a file so you don't go crazy trying to work it out.

Neeraj Mathur

Reply 4 offered by: Jay on 14-Nov-1997

I've been working with Noteworthy Composer and thinking of
ordering it, to be used in setting up four part harmony for
my barbershop quartet. Is anyone out there using NC for bar-
bershop work? I am having trouble getting two notes that are
the same. Can't seem to combine an up and down staff together
so they can be sung, one by the lead, and one by the tenor at
the same time. If I can't get it to do that, I'm dead in the
water. Also, being barely able to read music myself, I'd like
to hear the playbacks in different instruments from time to
time, but keep hearing the same sound when I choose different
playback instruments. What do I need to buy next? Also, I don't
understand what the Noteworthy Player would do for a neophyte
like me. Thanks for any ideas, as I am learning a lot by
working with NC. Jay

Reply 5 offered by: KC Jones on 24-Apr-2001

I noticed exactly the same thing when I upgraded my computer. The new motherboard has the sound card on it. The problem is not the speed of the CPU since 950 mhz is much faster than the previous one of 300 mhz. The problem is way the new sound card handles the midi mapper. The way I have learned to handle the mismatch is to make the highlighted notes the same color as the display and then you can actually watch the screen with the music playing and not go crazy. Hope this helps someone else.

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 24-Apr-2001

Jay's comment from 1997 suddenly re-emerges!

Since then, NWC has added the capability to merge staffs. That's just the ticket for harmony, if you want upper-track notes with stems up, lower-track notes with stems down, on the same staff. So if there are any prospective new Barbershop composers out there, give NWC a try.


#322: Copying from a bitmap into NoteWorthy
Copying from a bitmap into NoteWorthy

(322)

Submitted by: Neeraj Mathur on 27-Oct-1997

Is it possible to copy part of a bitmap file (like Windows Paint) to the clipboard and then pasting it into NoteWorthy as a text event? One could use this for symbols like the cutoff or crescendo / decrescendo symbols. Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 28-Oct-1997

See the newsgroup's announcement for a release of NWC 1.5 on November 11, which will include user-definable fonts, so you can then use a "music thingies" font which will have these and enter them as text (I HOPE).

Regards,

Andrew


#323: Drum Rudiments
Drum Rudiments

(323)

Submitted by: Ed Kolb on 31-Oct-1997

Can anyone tell me how to insert a flam, ruff, or a long roll. I've been putting thirty-second notes together for the roll, and it just doesn't sound right.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 31-Oct-1997

Whilst it's not in the GM Drum Kits, you may find at F29
(or F17... a low F, anyway) a drum roll sound. Note that
this will not be as portable as using standard midi.

Perhaps you could look at two drum tracks and alternate between
then to see if they'll let the drum roll sound a little more natural.

Otherwise, look at changing the length of the notes (try triplets
or 64ths).

Hope one of these works for ya.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Brad on 26-Mar-2001

Agreed with Andrew. Use short notes. 7 ticks in MIDI. Put them at tick markers 0,7,15,22,etc... adding 7 and 8 every other time. This will be close to 64ths and keep the velocity of all but the first note low. That's all!


#324: Chords containing the same note.
Chords containing the same note.

(324)

Submitted by: Steve Mackison on 31-Oct-1997

Please forgive me if I'm not talking the talk musically, I'm quite the neophyte.

Here's my problem:
I am trying to enter the same note in a chord.
eg., Soprano part sings a G as does the alto.
Is there any way to have NoteWorthy Composer make (or at least display) this chord with two identical notes in the same chord.

Any suggestions wouyld be appreciated.

SIncerely,

Steve

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 31-Oct-1997

Yes, this is an annoying one. What you need, I think, is the ability to put tails up and
tails down on the same note. I have not been able to get NWC to do this.
Maybe in the next version ? Roll on November 11th ?

NWC is still the best music authoring program around - so no complaints from me
about small problems !!!

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 31-Oct-1997

Yes, this is an annoying one. What you need, I think, is the ability to put tails up and
tails down on the same note. I have not been able to get NWC to do this.
Maybe in the next version ? Roll on November 11th ?

NWC is still the best music authoring program around - so no complaints from me
about small problems !!!

Richard

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 31-Oct-1997

This is the 2nd time I've tried to reply but I'm not sure if the 1st
one got through.(I'm new to forums etc)

I don't think NWC will allow tails up and tails down on the same note
which I think is what you need.

I have tried to get it to do this as well.

Still the best music authoring software around though so no complaints from me

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 01-Nov-1997

This forum is a bit of a trap for the unwary. You need to reload the article to see your reply, otherwise you may be led to believe it didn't get received.

A

Reply 5 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 01-Nov-1997

Thanks Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: Nick Wastell on 25-Nov-1997

Rather a late post script, but...

The problem goes beyond tails in both directions. I have often needed to have two parts singing the same semibreve - my only solution has been to separate the two parts to individual staves.

N.

Reply 7 offered by: Keith Rogers on 01-Dec-1997

Add this to the wish list. I need this when transcribing
fiddle tunes, e.g., where the same note is played on two
strings, so it's not just a "vocal" thing. And, it really
doesn't work to write it out in two staves in my case, since
it's only a single instrument playing the two notes. It
wouldn't have to be a chord notation change, just let me
set the tail up, down, or *both* for any note(s).

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Dec-1997

The final release of version 1.50 will support a two notes in the same position on the staff, provided all remaining notes in the chord with their stem up are above all stem down notes. In other words, you will be able to form a chord that contains a single note with two stems; one going up and one going down.


#325: NWC32
NWC32

(325)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 01-Nov-1997

I attemped to use NWC32.exe on a Windows for workgroups platform with Win32s running.
All appeared to be OK when composing/amending but when I tried to play the song, I received an error message box
with the title of Patch Cache.
The message said

An attempt to cache patches failed.

No sound or playing was heard although the first chords in the music changed colour is if to sound. There it stayed although
the program had not crash and F6 (stop) stopped the attempt to play.

Anyone any ideas about this ??

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: A on 02-Nov-1997

I would forward this onto support@ntworthy.com, if I were you.

A

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Nov-1997

The 32-bit edition of NWC is not supported on Win32s. The necessary multimedia support is not available on Win32s, so we are unable to support it. The 16-bit edition continues to be supported for use with Windows 3.1, including the Win32s variant.


#327: Keyboard Macros
Keyboard Macros

(327)

Submitted by: Don Urquhart on 02-Nov-1997

I'm evaluating NWC, and so far am quite happy with it. It's the only composer I've found that comes close to being accessible to a blind amateur musician. I have a keyboard macro program, "Macromania", with which I am experimenting, in order to enter notation more quickly. If it worked, I would use the Alt-number keys to quickly enter and play notes--forinstance, Alt-1 enters the first note in the scale, moves the insertion point left one position, plays the note (F5), and repositions for the next entry. My macro didn't work, but rather somehow got me into the Multipoint Controllers dialogue.qHas anyone successfully used keyboard macros in this way to enter music?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Nov-1997

Many NWC users employ macros with some success.
I use the old Windows 3.1 Macro Recorder and I haven't experienced any difficulties.
Avoid the keyboard shortcut hot-keys where possible.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 02-Nov-1997

Keyboard macros usually work fine. I don't know about Macromania, but if it normally works for you, then persist with it.
The only ways to get to multipoint controllers that I know of are either through Alt-I (for insert) then L (controllers), or using the keyboard shortcut L.
Maybe using another set of keys, for instance, Control + Shift.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Steve on 03-Nov-1997

I have mentioned once before that I use Dragon Dictate to enter notes, rests, sharps, flats, naturals, endings, etc. I wonder if the program might not be of particular interest in this setting?


#328: converting piano on multiple MIDI channels
converting piano on multiple MIDI channels

(328)

Submitted by: James E.Ray on 03-Nov-1997

Hi!
I have a MIDI file I'm trying to import where the piano has been split into 10 midi channels. I would like to print out the score with the piano part in 2 staffs. Any ideas on how to do this? Your help is greatly appreciated and excuse me if this is simple - - I'm new to MIDI!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Nov-1997

I am not exactly clear on what you are trying to do, but in general, the "Maximum single track chord size" field in the MIDI File Import wizard is available to have Import automatically split a piano track into two staves. You can also manually set the split points by manually editing the list of import instructions in step 3 of the Import.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 03-Nov-1997

Just import it to 10 channels first. This should give you ten staffs.
Make a note of which ones are "left hand" and which are "right".
Use the MIDI import wizard again, and this time try and map all the different channels onto two channels.
I think this will do what you want to achieve. I can't run through it on my machine right now, so you'll just have to fiddle to get it working.

Andrew


#329: Input via Midi Keyboard and AWE64 Sound Card
Input via Midi Keyboard and AWE64 Sound Card

(329)

Submitted by: Brett Myatt on 04-Nov-1997

Can anyone help with my little problem. Have just hooked up
a Roland ep7IIe keyboard connected via a AWE64 sound card
so I can use the Noteworthy record function etc to input
notes into the staff...

Well, I get notes on the noteworthy staff when the keyboard
is played but they are not the same as played on the
keyboard ! Some are wrong note, some seem to be missed or
combined into a chord when single notes were played.

Everything seems to be setup ok, must have missed something
Can anyone help !

Thanks

Brett

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Nov-1997

This sounds suspiciously like a setup problem or hardware fault, but more details are needed before I can confirm this. What happens when you enter notes in step time (ie. via the "MIDI Input Active" mechanism, rather than through "Record")? If the same unusual behaviour is exhibited, this indicates a setup or hardware problem. If, on the other hand, step entry works fine, then you may need to set your import options to better match your keyboard chops.

Reply 2 offered by: Brett Myatt on 05-Nov-1997

When I use MIDI Input Active, the notes come up on the staff
but it is as I described the notes are not correct. Thought
that there may be a few people who have setup a Creative
AWE64 card for midi input (and hopefully using with Noteworthy) ?
Tools/Options/Record Tab setup shows:
Input Device : AWE64 MIDI In[330]
MIDO Through/Echo is not selected
Tools/Options/MIDI Tab setup has Port Usage Always

OR could it be on the Roland Digital Piano end ?

Any ideas/hints would be appreciated.

Thanks
Brett

Reply 3 offered by: Jim Polchlopek on 30-Nov-1997

I've run into the same prob w/ a yamaha kbd. Also have the prob w/ other sequencing progs. I think it's some kind of a driver prob, though I haven't located any info about it.

Reply 4 offered by: Brett Myatt on 02-Dec-1997

Forget my problem, I found that I had a flakey cable
or the wrong type of cable. Now I have a good cable..
no worries !

Reply 5 offered by: Craig Butcher on 12-Jan-1998

I keep getting weird output. A half note will show up as a bunch of dotted eighth notes with ties, for instance.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Christen on 27-May-1998

I hooked up a Yamaha Keyboard to my AWE64 Soundcard. The soundcard works all fine but I can't find a driver for my Keyboard.
When I installed Cakewalk I got a driver for the virtual piano which works fine.
Does somebody know where I get this driver or how it is called, just in case it's
somewhere in the system already.

Reply 7 offered by: Mick on 09-Jun-1998

I've got exactly the same problen with a MIDIPRO keyboard and AWE64/Yamaha SW60XG running Cakewalk (or anything else) MIDI input is always detected on a keypress, but the octave/pitch of the notes is completely random! I've tried several cables and 2 other keyboards with same result. It used to work just fine!! HELP!!!!! The chaps at ResRocket are starting to thing I'm taking a bit too much musicians lubruicant!

Reply 8 offered by: Mick on 09-Jun-1998

Please ignore my problem above.

I've just discovered that (for some unknown reason) the resource settings for the SB card were wrong. If you're having a similar problem, go to device manager (c.panel>system>device manager tab) select sound video + game controllers and click on Creative AWE 64 (SB 16 compatible))In the resources setting, choose the Input/output range with a value of 301-whatever (I think) and change it to 330-331. Everything works just fine after this. I don't really understand how I got any sound at all with a setting not=330, but thats how it was!

Regards,

MICK

Reply 9 offered by: Basil Brush on 30-Jul-1998

How do I interface my Yammy sy85, AWE64 and Cubasis Audio
together so that they can all 'talk' to each other. I've no
problems composing with Cubasis via the AWE control, however,
the compositions i've made on the sy85, I am unable to
transfer to the cubassis programme. Has someone been able to
remedy this problem ?

Regards

basilbrush

Reply 10 offered by: Basil Brush on 30-Jul-1998

How do I interface my Yammy sy85, AWE64 and Cubasis Audio
together so that they can all 'talk' to each other. I've no
problems composing with Cubasis via the AWE control, however,
the compositions i've made on the sy85, I am unable to
transfer to the cubassis programme. Has someone been able to
remedy this problem ?

Regards

basilbrush

Reply 11 offered by: adriano santos on 04-Sep-1998

can i connect an external keyboard to AWE64 joystick port,
without a midi adapter?

if so, how can I do?

Reply 12 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Sep-1998

Well, actually you can, if you're electronically inclined. There are projects for this all over the net. The circuit is relatively simple, involving an optocoupler, a transistor, and a few resistors and capacitors.

That being said, I have to agree that the far easier method is to buy a cable already made up. (And that's coming from an electronicist by trade.)


#330: chord names above the staff
chord names above the staff

(330)

Submitted by: Gert Van Heghe on 04-Nov-1997

I am evaluating NoteWorthy Composer for printing songs with different verses and guitar chord names.
I very much like the ability to add up to 8 lyric lines below the staff,
but I haven't found yet a way to easily add the chord names above
the staff
Any solution ?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Nov-1997

Add them as Text - but you will have to have a note or rest pattern in the staff to hang the text on.
Try writing or copying a bass line into the staff then add chords as text without preserving width - position the text to the left of the note to which it applies and it should appear above the note..

Reply 2 offered by: Kent Dugan on 14-Nov-1997

Barry and I have both played with this. For something like an Am7b5b9, you'll have to go to the text "x" function and go to a higher offset to put the b5 on the next line up. It's awkward, but doable. It's one of those tedious chores that isn't worth it until you've actually completed it.
I'd like to see a setting so that you could set a temporary default height for adding text/chords to the score all at once.
And it'd really be nice to be able to lock it into text mode and tab it to the next chord positions. Maybe soon. Anyone else like this idea?

Reply 3 offered by: Nikki MacLeod on 24-Nov-1997

I'd like to chip into this debate yet again with a plea for an in-built system for chord symbols, and please make it transposable so that when the relevant stave is transposed, the chord symbols are transposed by the same amount. Oh and the use of a proper "flat" synbol instead of a lower case "b" would also be nice too.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Befumo on 05-Jan-1998

Chord notation is the one thing that keeps me from finally dumping Cakewalk Pro altogether. Even just chord names, without transposition would suffice. I love Noteworthy, and absolutely LOATHE Cakewalk, but without the ability to notate chords I always wind up having to do my final cut on Cakewalk.

Reply 5 offered by: holbrook,ken on 03-Feb-1998

notes for diminished chord with c# as the third.

Reply 6 offered by: Armen on 01-Aug-1998

Hi


#331: Bar lines in orchestral scores
Bar lines in orchestral scores

(331)

Submitted by: John Higgs on 05-Nov-1997

I am trying to create a score for small orchestra, and have encountered a slight problem. I can't get the printed score to follow the convention that bar lines are drawn connecting all the staffs within each section - i.e. woodwind, brass, percussion, strings - but not right through the whole score. Using 'Orchestral' as the type of staff always seems to connect all the staffs in the score, even when I try using the partitions feature. Or am I missing something?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Nov-1997

John - you're not missing anything - that's the way it works.
But I agree - wouldn't it be nicer if the barlines and decorated corners were only applied to each partition rather than the whole score.
It would certainly be more readable!

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 05-Nov-1997

Add it to the wish list, and see if Eric can whip something up by mid-November's release! ;-)

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Derek on 02-Jan-1998

Also Noteworthy is missing braces for orchestral scores to group the woodwinds, brass, and strings.


#332: "hard" returns
"hard" returns

(332)

Submitted by: kevin bass on 05-Nov-1997

does anyone know how to make NW execute a "hard return" immediately
after a measure? The problem I'm trying to avoid is having a new line of
music begin in the middle of a measure.

I would like also to avoid the single long score line and get to
a WYSIWYG format. any help?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 05-Nov-1997

NWC works in a "long-scroll" format for editing (it doesn't have any other views - except page preview in the print dialog), but will set out the page with "line-breaks" at the end of a bar ("justifying" the "text" to give a smooth right edge). You can see what this will look like by pressing the Preview button in the Print dialog.

hth

Andrew


#334: Play Won't Play
Play Won't Play

(334)

Submitted by: Walter Rimler on 08-Nov-1997

I have been using Noteworthy for a couple of weeks. Suddenly, today, the "play" function has stopped and I can't hear sounds for any composition. My speakers are working and I can hear sounds when I use other programs, but not Noteworthy. I've re-installed the program, but the problem persists.

Any help will be appreciated.

--Walter Rimler

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 09-Nov-1997

A few questions (for more information).
Does your computer play other midi files okay (like with - say - mplayer.exe)?
Does NWC export midi files that are then playable by Mplayer?
Have you adjusted your midi devices recently? (Mplayer always plays to the Midi Mapper device. NWC can choose other midi devices as well)

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Walter Rimler on 09-Nov-1997

Andrew--

Thanks for your reply. I'm no computer expert (obviously), so, here's the best I can do in answering your questions.

My computer does not play other midi files when I use mplayer.exe.

I don't have any idea if NWC exports midi files that are playable by mplayer.

I don't think I have adjusted any midi divices recently. If I did, it was inadvertent. I have been trying tro find midi mapper to choose it for mplayer but don't know how.

--Walt

Reply 3 offered by: Walter Rimler on 09-Nov-1997

Andrew--

Hello again. I got the sound working by turning the volume up mplayer. I have no idea how it got turned down, but thanks for pointing me in the right direction.

By the way, one other problem I've been having is that when I click on the help file nothing is there. I know I have a help file because I see it listed as one of the Noteworthy files. But I can't get it to open. If you have any suggestions about that, I'd be grateful.

--Walt

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew P on 09-Nov-1997

Hmm. Do you see the help file in your NWC folder?
What happens if you double click on it (or is this what you meant when you say "click on the help file?",
in which case happens when you select help from the NWC help menu?
When you say "nothing is there" do you get ABSOLUTELY NO response?

Andrew

PS: That's great about the volume slider. Learn something new everyday, and all that. And there's so much to learn on these "wee bisties."

Reply 5 offered by: Walter Rimler on 10-Nov-1997

Andrew--

When I select help from the toolbar, I get a drop down menu that offers several choices, including contents, search for, did you know?, etc. No matter how much I click or double click, none of these opens except for 'did you know.'

--Walt

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew on 10-Nov-1997

Hmmm. Can you look in the NWC folder and tell me if you see any help files?
If you using Windows 95, in Explorer, go to View (menu) | Options (selection) | View (tab) and turn on extensions for all files so that you can see the full filenames.
There should be a file called NWC.HLP which, when double clicked, should start the help.
Is it there? And what happens when you click it?

A

Reply 7 offered by: Walter Rimler on 10-Nov-1997

Andrew--

I did as you said and didn't find any help file. I opened Windows Explorer, went to view, selected options, then view, then file types, i found a help icon and double clicked and got something about editing file type, i found the noteworthy composer song icon and double clicked but it said nothing about a help file.

--Walt

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Nov-1997

You can confirm the existence of your help file exactly as Andrew says. Open an explorer window and go to C:\Program Files\NoteWorthy Composer, assuming you installed using the defaults. You should see the following files (among others):

"NWC.EXE" This is the 16-bit program
"NWC32.EXE" This is the 32-bit program
"NWC.HLP" This is the help file
"NWC.CNT" This is the help contents file

If you do not see any of these files, then you are looking in the wrong folder. You need to look in the folder where you installed NoteWorthy Composer, wherever that might be. Generally speaking, you should never move the files once you have installed them, and should certainly never separate them, as then the program links will not work correctly.

Once you find the program files listed above, it should be a straight forward process to simply double-click the NWC help file (NWC.HLP).

Reply 9 offered by: Walter Rimler on 11-Nov-1997

Well...I did as you said and found a file called nwc (it shows no .hlp extension when looked at in explorer, but I do see it as nwc.hlp when I look at it using WordPerfect's list files). When I double-click (or single-click) the icon (a book with a question mark) nothing happens.

If you have any other suggestions, please let me know.

--Walt

Reply 10 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Nov-1997

Did you do as Andrew suggested? You need to set your View options in the Explorer in order to see the file extensions. As he explained, this is done as:

- In Explorer, go to View menu, then Options
- Click the View tab
- Select "Show All files"
- Uncheck "Hide MS-DOS file extensions for file types that are registered"
- Press OK

You should now see all file extensions. You should see two important files to deal with help. These are "nwc.hlp" and "nwc.cnt", and they should appear in the same directory. If you double-click on "nwc.hlp" and nothing happens, you may have a system level problem on your computer. Can you view other Windows help files? For example, when you select "Help" on the Start menu, what happens? If this stuff does not work, your system setup is messes up, and may require a reinstall of Windows 95.


#335: Congratulation
Congratulation

(335)

Submitted by: Pavel Kovac on 12-Nov-1997

Congratulation on NWC 1.50 Beta Preview! I'v been evaluating the previous version for a couple of weeks. I've found many of my wishes in NWC forum. I'm glad that many of them came true in NWC 1.50. I think it's great. As a church choir conductor I especially appreciate the font and staff features (font type, style, size, script, staff size, etc.) And these are just the first quick impressions after running the NWC 1.50 for the first time! Unfortunately some expected and wished features are still missing e.g. a note with its stem going downward cannot be combined with a lower note which has its stem going upward. Can I hope it'll be there in the future? Best wishes.
Pavel

Reply 1 offered by: nigel pendrey on 12-Nov-1997

Does the 1.5 release in Windows 95 imply the death of upgrades for Windows 3.1?

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 12-Nov-1997

To quote from Eric's newsgroup release...
"The next release of NoteWorthy Composer will be version 1.50. A first preview will be made available at our web site on 11-Nov-1997. This first preview release will be accessible only to registered users who are currently using Windows 95 or Windows NT. It will be made available as a download from our web site. The 16-bit edition will also be made available later in the month for users of Windows 3.1."

I think that answers your question, no?

A

Reply 3 offered by: Tuan Pham on 12-Nov-1997

Could someone tell me how to select fonts for lyrics?
Thanks

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 13-Nov-1997

Enter the File - Page Setup dialogue - select Fonts tab - highlight Staff Lyric - click on Modify - select a font and style - click OK.
All Lyrics on your score should be updated and displayed in the selected font. Good Luck!


#336: Grace notes added in 1.5 beta NWC
Grace notes added in 1.5 beta NWC

(336)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson on 12-Nov-1997

I am disappointed that the grace note is not heard in playback.

In many composition the grace note is an important part of
the score and it's interpretation. Playback of the grace
lends authenticity. I can see it's usefulness in a printed
score that one would read and play on an instrument, but I
would like to hear it on playback. I find it hard to accept
that this was the most requested wish and yet it does not
playback. Is this what the requesters for a grace note
capability wanted? Print out of score only? Hmmm

Eric: Fix for final 1.5 version?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 13-Nov-1997

Don your comment again raises the question:- What are the aims of NWC?
Is it sound reproduction or is it printed parts for performance.
I think the answer lies in the eye of the beholder.
I use NoteWorthy to produce arrangements for a dance band and it can never reproduce the swing feel I want but it can produce presentable written notation.
If I feel the chart is worth the production of a MIDI file I have to export to a package that can swing quantize the notation and then it doesn't matter how the music looks - only how it sounds.
Adding grace notes, glissandos and fall offs to a sound file can be as ugly as you like.
I vote for print out every time - my wish list grows longer and longer.

Where have you been? - We've missed your voice of reason on the forum!

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 13-Nov-1997

I, too, use Noteworthy mainly for arranging, rather than for note perfect production (but see my attempts on http://www.tip.net.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html). Looking at the user pages, I'm sure many others do too. I can get very nice output now, due to the advances made in this latest version.

I agree that I was also disappointed that grace notes didn't play, but PROGRESS HAS BEEN MADE. At least I can see the way forward in future releases, and you must agree, we have seen a fairly good response from Eric and NWA in that respect.

I'm looking forward to the day when NWC will play arpeggiated chords, mordants, trills and turns AND any manner of grace notes. Maybe we're asking too much, though. How much would you be willing to pay for this ability? In the meanwhile, I must keep two versions (which I do in the one file), one for printing and one for playing (when I need it).

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Nov-1997

Grace notes will support play back in the next preview release. However, there are always occasions where it may be necessary to manually construct your desired note sequences in a separate, hidden partition, in order to get the simplicity of a visual staff that can be understood by a true, live performer. NWC allows you this flexibility in cases where it is necessary.

Reply 4 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 13-Nov-1997

I suppose we do buy and use NWC for many reasons. I bought it to enter old folk songs and hymns, and then listen to them. I never print the scores. I want the playback and nothing but the playback.
It's great that you folks that want to print scores are happy.
When I saw grace notes added to the program, I never dreamed they would not be enabled on playback; however, in the help files for MusicTime Deluxe, it is mentioned that implementing grace notes is a *big deal*, so perhaps the playback function is hard to do.

On another subject, the new robust MIDI driver is pure gold! My old Yamaha PSR-500 never sounded so good. Andrew's Toreador will blow your socks off.
Regards,
Gordon

Reply 5 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 14-Nov-1997

I've been off line for a couple of months, when I get a chance to
down load the new stuff I'll have better comments. BUT--when grace
notes start sounding (HURRAY!), will I have the choice of whether they
have there own duration or half that? and whether they borrow time
from the preceding or following note?

Cyril

Reply 6 offered by: Don Ferguson on 15-Nov-1997

Hi Cyril

Grace notes borrow from the following note.

If I wrong I'm sure I'll hear about it.

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Nov-1997

The next beta preview will support grace note playback, but they will always steal time from the next note (rather than the previous). If you need something fancier, you should manually notate it, constructing it from the existing note capabilities of NWC.

Reply 8 offered by: Steve Bacher on 19-Nov-1997

Grace note playback practice varies with musical style
and period of the piece. I think that NWC should offer
options wrt grace note playback. Best if these options
could be stored along with the piece, so that Baroque
compositions could have grace notes played one way,
Late Romantic pieces another, etc.

Reply 9 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Nov-1997

Grace Note:

For whatever we are about to receive may we all be truly thankfull!!

Reply 10 offered by: Jan Hjelm on 26-Nov-1997

As I can´t play what is printed, I will be thrilled when I can hear the grace notes playing, but if there is a chance that they will sound strange due to which ordinary note it is borrowing from, let us say Grace ;-) that there will be an on/off button, and with that I end this message in a friendly tone...

Reply 11 offered by: Jan Hjelm on 26-Nov-1997

As I can´t play what is printed, I will be thrilled when I can hear the grace notes playing, but if there is a chance that they will sound strange due to which ordinary note it is borrowing from, let us say Grace ;-) that there will be an on/off button, and with that I end this message in a friendly tone...

Reply 12 offered by: Kris Stoll on 26-Dec-1997

I think that everybody is making too big a deal about grace notes. Now, if this thing could interpret swing, now were talking. Not to mention a competitor, but Finale will swing it for you. I don't know the in's and outs of MIDI code, but it has been done. There is hope!


#337: changing instrument problems. . .
changing instrument problems. . .

(337)

Submitted by: Shadowfax on 13-Nov-1997

when i import a midi file, and try to change the playback instrument for a staff, it won't change.
I've even tried changing it from the orig. piano to a drum just to see if it would do anything. . .still plays piano.
Am I doin something wrong?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 13-Nov-1997

You might want to check if the staff has a midi instrument controller in it. I think that is how midi defines the "playback instrument". In which case find the definition and delete it.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 13-Nov-1997

You might want to check if the staff has a midi instrument controller in it. I think that is how midi defines the "playback instrument". In which case find the definition and delete it.

Andrew


#338: Bug in Stem Up/Stem down???
Bug in Stem Up/Stem down???

(338)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson on 13-Nov-1997

Version 1.31d had a stem up selector button AND a stem down
selector button. A user could pre-select a stem direction
before entering a note. Version 1.31d could also select the
proper stem direction by default with the stems down on
notes below B and stems up on B (3rd ledger line) and above
on the treble clef. The same action holds true on the bass
clef with stems going down on D(3rd ledger line) and up on
C or lower.

A User could edit and change stem direction by clicking
on either of the stem direction buttons depending on the
change being made. Another way to change stem direction was
using the SHIFT/UP ARROW or SHIFT/DOWN ARROW.

I have found that Version 1.5 has only ONE stem direction
select button showing the stem direction always UP. I have
found that if a note is entered as an A in the 2d space that
NWC defaults the stem direction to up. Using the stem
direction button shown (up only) will not change the stem
direction (nor should it if it is only an up-stem button).
Using the Shift/UP ARROW and the Shift/DOWN ARROW will
change the stem direction.

However any note entered as a B (3rd ledger line)or above
can have its stem direction changed by clicking on the stem
direction button (stem up) or using the Shift/UP ARROW and
the shift/DOWN ARROW.

To pull all this together for what I think is a bug? or just
something that needs to be corrected in Beta 1.5 are the
following observations.

1. Stem direction for a note cannot be preselected in Beta
1.5 as in version 1.31d.

2. Default stem direction for A and below cannot be
selectively changed with the (ONLY) stem direction
button in 1.5. It can only be selectively changed with
the Shift/UP ARROW and Shift/DOWN ARROW.

3. Default stem direction for B and above can be selectively
changed by EITHER the only stem (up) direction button or
the Shift/UP ARROW and Shift/ DOWN ARROW.

4. It would be confusing to users (until they always
remember) what commands to use to edit and change
stem direction depending on where the note lies on the
staff.

5. I think we need BOTH an up and down stem direction
button which indicated the preselected stem direction
and can be used to selectively change stem direction.
It gets very confusing if entering a lot of split note
chords.

I think I have accurately identified what I think is a problem
in 1.5. There are strange things going on regarding stem
direction, pre-selection, and NWC default direction.

HAS ANYONE ELSE RUN INTO THE SAME SITUATION IN 1.5?

HAVE I MISSED SOMETHING???

Reply 1 offered by: Pavel Kovac on 14-Nov-1997

Don, there IS a stem down button but it's behind the right edge of the screen...Try to drag the Styles toolbar to another position or change your monitor resolution from 640x480 to higher.

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson on 14-Nov-1997

Thanks Pavel

I DID MISS SOMETHING. No one should have to change their
display resolution for just this one program. I handled the
problem by redocking the tool bars. Not satisfied with the
new layout of tool bars since I lose music editing space. I
guess I can get used to it. I still prefer all tool bars
lined up in two rows at the top of the editing window.

Again I say why should anyone have to change monitor
resolution? Did'nt have to do that for 1.31d.

Any comments from other users?

Can the tool bar icons be made smaller to accomodate the
down stem icon and the other icon?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Nov-1997

If, during the beta installation, you specify that you are using another copy of NWC, and want its settings to be preserved, the toolbar docking of the new beta will compete with the older copy settings. If you let the 1.5 installer reset your system configuration, the toolbars will redock and show everything. Version 1.5 includes new tools making the old two line display impossible in standard VGA resolution. We are working on a toolbar user customization technique, but for now (in the beta preview 1) you must live with the way they are formatted.

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ferguson on 14-Nov-1997

Thanks for the explanation by NWC support. I'm sure the
problem will be corrected in the final copy. I am looking
forward to the final 1.5 version. Upgrades have been super.
Keep it up.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Dec-1997

Beta preview 2 addresses this issue. The toolbars can now be customized, thus you can alter them to fit whatever screen/window size is easiest for you.


#339: Note ties (Bug?)
Note ties (Bug?)

(339)

Submitted by: John Irwin on 14-Nov-1997

version 1.5 Beta

In a second ending, I have a time signature change from
3/4 time to cut time. To allow for a pick up note in the
cut time section, I placed a time signature change
between a tied whole note and a dotted half.

The problem is that there are two ties displayed.
One from the whole note to the cut-time symbol and a
second tie from the cut-time symbol to the dotted half note
following. This sure looks wierd. Can this be the correct
notation?

Reply 1 offered by: Per Pettersson on 14-Nov-1997

I know, I am experiencing the same problem. Perhaps it IS the correct notation, but it sure looks awful.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Nov-1997

This is just the way NWC works at the moment (and has done so since slurs and ties were supported). This is done, in general, to keep slurs and ties from reaching past a time signature at the beginning of a section or excerpt. We will explore ways to do this better, but for now this is how it works.


#340: Staff display when printing
Staff display when printing

(340)

Submitted by: Per Pettersson on 14-Nov-1997

I have only tried this with NWC 1.2, since I have troubles working with the interface in 1.31d... in my opinion it has just gone worse.

When I'm going to print a rock score (two guitars, bass, voice), I find it VERY irritating that the voice staff, even if it is no notes in it, is printed in it's full length.

What I'm saying: I have a 16-measure intro that occupy 3 pages. All these measures cointain no voice. But the whole rests in the voice staff are printed, a type of notation I never seen in a *real* rock score. This is just a huge waste of paper - is there any trick or another way I can do it so I will get the printouts as I want them to be?

Reply 1 offered by: KENT DUGAN on 14-Nov-1997

Afraid that's the way it works. Understand that NWC is an inexpensive notation product that is currently in development. This item is on our wish list, also. If you have to have that feature, I know where you can spend $500 and get it. But the extra time involved in learning the other products is prohibitive. It'll cost you 3 months of your life for 8 hrs a day.
Sure, there are limitations, but I can actually create so much faster here, that if I have to live with blank staves, I can really live with that. It's not as pretty, but I like the company I'm keeping here.
Let's also remember there just isn't a product that will do EVERYthing you want. No matter who you are, you can always think of things you would like done your way.
One of the other things we've put on our wish list is collapsible bar rests. That's now in evaluation, and we're hoping.
Hope this lets you feel better about the limitations you're seeing. It's nothing but a misdemeanor, anyhow.

Reply 2 offered by: Matthew on 05-Mar-1998

Does any one know the transpositon for an eletric guitar and a bass guitar I have all the other transpositons I need? If any one needs them for marching or concert bands let me know.

Reply 3 offered by: Matthew on 05-Mar-1998

The e-mail address on the one above is wrong sorry 'bout that.


#341: Timeing
Timeing

(341)

Submitted by: Howard Chambers on 15-Nov-1997

I had noticed that with the pragram in Windows 3.1 it will
display a the timing of the song where the clock was. However in Windows 95 it doesn't do this anymore and I was wondering if there was something to do to get back agian.

Reply 1 offered by: Per Pettersson on 17-Nov-1997

It doesn't?
I believe it does... on 1.2 and 1.31d it works fine.

Perhaps it's just your Windows 95 Start-menu that's in your way.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Nov-1997

Playback time is still shown in both the 32-bit and 16-bit editions.

Reply 3 offered by: Howard Chambers on 23-Nov-1997

I found out that the problem was with my windows 95 program and reinstalling the programs set everything straight again.


#344: What measure am I on?
What measure am I on?

(344)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson on 16-Nov-1997

If you have multiple staffs and cannot see all of them at
the same time in your edit window then pressing CTRL+G will
tell you what measure you are in.

An alternative solution that works for me is to make the
top staff the melody line (or enough measures of whole note
rests to complete your composition), go to page setup and
add measure numbers. Then go to STAFF/MOVE STAFF and click
on the staff number where you are working (and cannot see)
and rearrange the staff numbers so you can see the staff
with the measure numbers (the top staff). Measure numbers
do not move with the staff.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 29-Nov-1997

Right, these two solutions work well. Another that you'll appreciate is the
'custom view' in the 1.50 version... just look at it (note that if you use
win3.x and have te Win32s addons the 32bit version will work except for preview and playings)

hope this helps

Reply 2 offered by: Minh on 02-May-1998

How about what note I am on? Sometimes I can't tell especially if I get down below middle C. I am entering notes using a computer keyboard.

Is there an option to display a note in letter as well as in musical note?

I would appreciate any help.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-May-1998

If you have difficulty in figuring out where you are when the cursor is way below or way above the current staff you could try this.
Position the cursor on the note you require within the staff - then hold down CTRL and press the UP or DOWN ARROW to move the cursor up or down one octave.

Reply 4 offered by: Minh on 05-May-1998

Thank you Barry, that is a good idea.


#346: newsgroup
newsgroup

(346)

Submitted by: Lee McHugh on 17-Nov-1997

How can I access this newsgroup that's highlighed at the top
of the forum screen? Each time I click on it I get a message box saying "Invalid Newsgroup" followed by the AOL
newsgroups screen.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 17-Nov-1997

I just checked, and interestingly, the only contributors to the newsgroup from aol.com are Noteworthy Support!
I suggest you send an email to support@ntworthy.com and ask them how they do it.
Eric, if you read this, could you respond to the forum please?

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Nov-1997

AOL does not directly support private NNTP newsgroups. However, if you are using the Windows 95 (32-bit) version of AOL, you can access the web, and our NNTP newsgroup, using a web browser suite external to the AOL interface, but while connected to AOL. For example, if you have the Internet Explorer Suite installed on your system, you can:

- Connect to AOL using the AOL 3.0 for Win 95 program
- Start Internet Explorer (double-click "The Internet" on your desktop)
- Goto this forum
- Click the newsgroup link

If you have the Microsoft Internet News installed on your system (it comes with the Internet Explorer 3.0 suite), then it will open and connect to our newsgroup.


#347: no sound
no sound

(347)

Submitted by: Tommy S on 18-Nov-1997

Wonder if anyone can give a clue

I've just installed NoteWorthy 1,31d. I use SoundScape
Elite soundcard.
Before I had win3,11 NoteWorthy and it worked well.
But now since I began with win 95 and downloaded 1,31d version I can not get any sound on playback.
I've followed the instructions for configuration (go to options via tool and choose mididevice) but still no sound
(the soundcard works fine with everything else in the computer)
When I installed win95 I also downloaded a package of
drivers etc that should suit my soundscape card.

Tommy

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Nov-1997

Goto /composer/faq.htm#PlayBack for details on diagnosing playback problems. This information is also in the NWC help file.


#348: newsgroup
newsgroup

(348)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 19-Nov-1997

I also can't have access to private newsgroups.

Would it be possible to have a mailing list instead ?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Nov-1997

We offer this web forum for those that do not have, or do not wish to use, the private newsgroup.

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Horne on 24-Nov-1997

If there was enough demand I'd be happy to host a mailing
list.

Reply 3 offered by: Nigel Horne on 25-Nov-1997

> We offer this web forum for those that do not have,
>or do not wish to use, the private newsgroup.

But a mailing list would be better for customers as it
can be dealt with off-line thus reducing their `phone bills.

Reply 4 offered by: seb on 03-Dec-1997

Since the forum in its new format makes it difficult to
see new replies, and I also have trouble accessing
other news servers, I also would like to see a NoteWorthy
mailing list. Add my name to the list of interested parties.

- seb

Reply 5 offered by: Nigel Horne on 04-Dec-1997

Done.

-Nigel

Reply 6 offered by: mad on 11-Jun-1998

Add me too please !
If you still got the ida in mind ... :-)
Thx


#350: Sound "Quality" ?
Sound "Quality" ?

(350)

Submitted by: Jason Cowperthwaite on 19-Nov-1997

heya.. noteworthy is great, but my computer sound is junk. what do you all suggest to improve sound quality? I assume it will be in the way of a new sound card but I have no idea which one.

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 19-Nov-1997

Hi all,
After reading the newsgroup and seeing a message re sound playback, someone mentioned Wingroove. I tried it, and it actually leaves my midi sequencer for dead! The only problem is notes sound about 1/2 a second after the note highlights in NWC, but it's worth it to finally hear *all* the notes in my arrangements. Just a thought :)

Reply 2 offered by: Wayne Wilson on 21-Nov-1997

I have a Yamaha SW60XG Sound card. This is a sample card that complements your digital WAV card eg Sound blaster etc. It supports General Midi with Great! quality samples and it also goes way beyond General Midi with the XG standard Hundreds of patches. Even Clasical Music sounds Orchestral (Not as good as a real Orchestra but better than the Roland Sound canvas "RAP 10" and "Ensoniq Elite" sample cards I have been useing!)

Yamaha have a virtual Sample software that works well and supports GM and XG see WWW.YAMAHA.CO.UK for details. You will need a MMX Pentium for this to work with no latency. It could be a very low cost and excellent solution. It should sound as good as the SW60XG as it offers the same Patches.

Reply 3 offered by: Nigel Horne on 24-Nov-1997

I'd think 2ce about Wingroov - see my review of it on this
forum about a month ago.

-Nigel

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Belton on 05-Jan-1998

My playback sounded terrible until I began running my computers sound
output into my stereo amplifier/mixer and hi-fi speakers.
The change was incredible, even for a crappy computer.

Reply 5 offered by: Roy Pineau on 13-Jan-1998

Whatever you may try, there is no perfect substitute
for a good wavetable sound card. However, if you,
for instance, have a notebook computer with a built-in
sound card, it will normally be only a non-wavetable one.
In this case, the most viable solution is WinGroove.
I tried virtually everything I could find on the net,
and nothing worked so well... especially in the
shareware category. It's not perfect, but it is better
than FM synthesis for MIDI output.

Reply 6 offered by: kim horton on 17-Mar-2000

hi i am wondering how u doing?

Reply 7 offered by: Ajcorny on 29-May-2000

Wingroove makes my midi files better than sex!!! I advise you all to get it!!!

Ajcorny

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-May-2000

Agreed. Sex makes lousy midi files. :)


#351: Support for GS and/or XG
Support for GS and/or XG

(351)

Submitted by: Wayne Wilson on 21-Nov-1997

Does or will Noteworthy support the extra instrument patches in sound modules and cards from Yamaha (XG) and/or Roland (SG). I as many people do not understand the underlying MIDI messages enough to select the instruments by inserting apropriate messages intop the midifile longhand.

Tanks Wayne

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Nov-1997

Often extra instrument patches are selected by choosing another bank. This is set on Staff | Playback Instrument and typing appropriately in the Bank Select section of the dialog.
The same dialog is used for inserting Instrument patches in the staff as the music is playing, if that is your bent.
The tricky bit is the meaning of the word appropriate, as banks will vary according to the implementation of the midi device. For instance, AWE Soundfonts are often multiples of 16 or 128. I don't know why. I'm still learning.

So to answer your question, I _think_ so, but you'll need to read your midi card documentation to find out which patch bank you should select.

Regards,

Andrew


#352: Wish List or ?
Wish List or ?

(352)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 22-Nov-1997

First off, Kudos to NWC staff for a terrific piece of software that is totally affordable, and for the excellent e-mail support they gave me when I first started using NWC. I asked a lot of dumb questions (some were already answered in the HELP, but I didn't find it), and always I received thorough answers. I have had a ball using NWC, can't thank them enough for it.

I've read several posts on this forum, and although I'm about to ask for a few additional features as others have, I also have to remind myself, this software does NOT cost $500, so if some things are the way they are, well, look at what you already have!

Wish List (someone please tell me if there is a way to do any of these already):

1. I'd like to be able to choose where measure number notation appears in the viewed and printed score. I mainly use NWC for music for my church choir, and I currently pencil in measure numbers where I might like the choir and piano to restart.

2. In lyrics, NWC uses an underscore to hold a space in the score. I would like to use underscores as they are printed on most choral music I see -- to notate the carry over of a word across ties or multiple notes (when there are not multiple syllables). For instance, the word "saints" may be sung across two or three notes, so it would be written as "saints___________" to indicate this. I currently use hyphens (e.g. "saints--------"), it accomplishes the purposes but does not look quite right.

3. In printed choral music, all staves are connected with a single bar line. The solo (top stave) only has the single bar line, the next two staves (SATB choir) are marked together with Orchestral staff, then the final two (piano) staves are marked with the Grand Staff. In NWC, I am only able to connect all staves with the Orchestral staff, and then additionally mark the piano staves with Grand Staff. If possible, I would like the ability to more closely match traditional printed choral music.

4. At a key change, NWC prints naturals (to nullify the previous key) and then prints the new key signature. I would like a way to not print the naturals, only the new key signature.

5. I would also like to be able to "hide" (not print) portions of staves that are all rests (e.g. during piano solo, don't print vocal staves; when a vocal solo occurs in the middle of the piece, don't print the staves before and after it).

Again, thanks for all the wonderful things the software DOES do, and at a very affordable price! If some of my wishes can come true, well, that's terrific too!

Sue Morton

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 22-Nov-1997

Sue,
Like you, I am a relative newcomer to Noteworthy, and although I own other software which does some of the things you ask for (numbers 2 and 3 of your list) I still find Noteworthy the best music software even though it's cheaper and doesn't have as many possibilities in printing musical symbols as my other software.

As far as question 5 is concerned, the only way I have found to do it is through printing selected pages and adding spaces to bars in order to bring the required bar to the top of a page.

Here follows a wordy example ....

I have a version of a carol which starts with Soprano solo, trumpet and organ. 21 bars on, the full choir comes in and out goes the trumpet. To achive a good printed copy, I selected the soprano, trumpet and organ staves which took up 20 bars. The first 18 covered two pages. I then selected all staves except the trumpet and the 19th bar was three bars before the end of page four. I therefore added alot of spaces to bar 18 so that bar 19 came to the top of page 5. I could then print from page 5 onwards. I applied the same sort of technique to later on when the trumpet came back in.

This is a fiddle and takes a bit of time and patience - but it works. - Where there's a will .... etc.

Enjoy Noteworthy - it's a treasure.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 29-Nov-1997

Sue,

About your point 4, (key changes), I'm sorry to tell you
that NWC does it well. Any strict musician would agree with this
way of writing key changes.
About 'vanishing' staves sometimes, add it to the wish list
and for the moment proceed like told on the 'Differents staff...' point.
For point 2, you may try to use Alt+0150 and Alt+0151 instead of
the hyphen. it may look better. Otherwise I see a solution : adding marks that
a program i'd write changes into the desired lines... as I currently do for
(de)crescendo signs. (restriction : PostScript print)

Hope this helps !

and enjoy NWC, it's really a treasure.

Reply 3 offered by: david rayner on 02-Dec-1997

Me too! (relative newcomer!)

Point 2 (carrying a single syllable across words) can
be accomplished by placing a slur (not a tie) over/under the
notes that are to be used for the word. I've also found that
a hyphen can be used as a placeholder. Not only does it represent a
syllable(note), but it also prints out under the appropriate note.

Noteworthy appears to be so damn good, that it applies single syllable lyrics to an
entire slur. I've done an arrangement of "Jesus is Coming Again", a Vineyard song (talk about
a baptism of fire!) which really stretched this area (it's in 6/8, which a Gaelic double
time feel). If you want to mail me, I'll send it to you.

I have to agree with you, this software is absolutely brilliant! For $US39, it
is completely stunning. Best value software that I've ever seen. Like you, I got it
to do arrangements for church. Those old hymns just don't work these days!

To all the guys at Noteworthy, keep it up. What you need is a feedback mail ID.

Bet you'd get heaps, all positive!


#353: Different staffs during choir song
Different staffs during choir song

(353)

Submitted by: Martti Pesso on 24-Nov-1997

How to do the following:
I have the verses of the song sung by soloist and
the choruses by four-voice choir under the soloist.
Is there a way to write the notation so that only the
soloist staff appears for the verses (not with rests
appearing below) and then during the choruses I have
three staffs:the soloist,soprano/alto,bass/tenor.
The usual way fills three pages and this variation should
fill only two pages of paper.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 24-Nov-1997

Add your voice to the wish list, Martti.
For now, some people have done some interesting things with two goes at printing, one with and one without all parts.
Seems silly, but for now, scissors and paper may yield a very good result.
Once you've photocopied, no one will know (except you).

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Keith Markham on 25-Nov-1997

I have managed with two different printings. To avoid the use of scissors and paste, copy the appropriate page on to the clipboard from the 'preview' option, then paste into a DTP progam. You can then position two separate 'graphic' pieces of the music so no one would notice.
For DTP I use Pagemaker 6.5, and the pasting from the clipboard need to be special, as 'windows metafile'.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 29-Nov-1997

It is also possible to use any text editor that
supports .WMF format. I did this on a score which
had three different formats of scores, and I put it in
a simple Word document. The small inconvenient is that
the margins are counted twice (one to preview-print into
a .wmf (use copy in preview window) and a second time when
printing the document (MSWord at elast is silly about this
(and about many others too))

Hope this helps.
But yes, it could be much more easier if directly possible in NWC ! :-)
The question is, in what form to allow this (being as convenient as
the GUI is until now may no be easy !)

NWCly yours,
Dominique P.

Reply 4 offered by: Martti Pesso on 16-Dec-1997

I am aware of the cutting and glueing stuff especially when
I try to fit the entire song with keyboard staffs to a page
with no keyboard staffs.
I try to apply the word-processor phase to my routine of
making soloist movements in a score.
Thanks


#354: Newsgroup access
Newsgroup access

(354)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 24-Nov-1997

When I click on Newsgroup in the forum I get the reply "Internet Explorer cannot open this helper application for news........the protocol specified in the address is not valid". Is there any way round this?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 24-Nov-1997

Check the program tab in IE's View|Options.
What is your newsreader there? I found that when it was Forte's Agent, it didn't work, but when I made it Internet News, things worked fine.
If it still doesn't work after Internet News is selected and sorted out, then maybe you're ISP won't allow news messages to other than its own newshost. If you are using Agent, it can be configured to read news from multiple hosts (though it's a little messay to set up).

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Crossley on 25-Nov-1997

Thanks Andrew. I am using Compuserve so I have no direct control over Explorer.

Regards
Peter


#355: transpose to another instrument
transpose to another instrument

(355)

Submitted by: Amy Metzger on 24-Nov-1997

I am trying to write parts for my musicians. I have the original in "C" and after I typed it into the program I wanted to transpose it to a B flat and an F instrument. When I Hit the transpose key, it just made a lot of changes to the notes, but did not do what it should have done.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Nov-1997

Amy :-
Did you put a C key signature in the staff before you did the transposition?
If you didn't add the C key signature it will be treated as though there is no key signature.
If you did - the transpose should work as expected - notes and key signature up 2 semitones to D for the Bb part.


#356: Several (perhaps already asked) questions......
Several (perhaps already asked) questions......

(356)

Submitted by: Kelly Cunningham on 24-Nov-1997

OK- I haven't had a chance to check out NWC's online forum for a while so here are my specific questions:
1. Since I last asked about grace notes (at the time I just wrote them in), from what I can tell, there is a way to notate them now? What do I have to do to get this feature? Do I download something?
2. I am currently taking a jazz arranging course. How do I notate at the top that I want something swung beyong writing "swing." I'm looking for a means of writing beamed eigth notes equal quarter/ eighth under a triplet beam. Is this possible?
3. Again related to the jazz course..... when I write piano, bass, or guitar parts, is there a way for me to write the slashes (////) under the chord instead of putiing a whole rest in every measure and writing in the slashes?
4. I also have a few specific percussion questions. I have figured a means to put the percussion clef (||) at the beginning of the piece. How do I get it to be at the beginning of every staff? Is there a way to make it an "official" clef?
5. (I think this is the last one)How so I notate the noteheads (x)with a stem when writing for percussion?

I want to let you know that I really like this product. I have spent a lot of time working with Finale, and not only is it outrageously expensive, but it leaves me with too much room for error. My final printouts (which is the important part) on NWC are MUCH better!!!! Thanks for your help and for tolerating my dumb questions. -Kelly

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 24-Nov-1997

>1. Since I last asked about grace notes (at the time I just wrote them in), from what I can tell, there is a way to notate them now? What do I have to do to get this feature? Do I download something?

Yes. Download the beta for version 1.5 from www.ntworthy.com
(Look for the star ... sorry couldn't resist at this time of year :)

>2. I am currently taking a jazz arranging course. How do I notate at the top that I want something swung beyong writing "swing." I'm looking for a means of writing beamed eigth notes equal quarter/ eighth under a triplet beam. Is this possible?

Actually 1.5 lets you use different fonts for text, so you could now do it textually, though it may in fact be easier to notate it in grace notes in the first space above the stave (with an interstitial "=" using the text tool), and turn the volume down before it and back up again afterwards. Of course, the drawback here is having the times all screwed up, though with grace notes, you may be lucky and have no trouble). The grace notes funciton was also intended for cue notes.

>3. Again related to the jazz course..... when I write piano, bass, or guitar parts, is there a way for me to write the slashes (////) under the chord instead of putiing a whole rest in every measure and writing in the slashes?

Nope, though related requests have been logged on the wish list. SO ya never know.

>4. I also have a few specific percussion questions. I have figured a means to put the percussion clef (||) at the beginning of the piece.

Yeah? Please share it!

>How do I get it to be at the beginning of every staff? Is there a way to make it an "official" clef?

Now isn't that funny, 'cos I thught I'd read somewhere that new clefs were to be added, but I can't see any evidence in this beta release.

>5. (I think this is the last one)How so I notate the noteheads (x)with a stem when writing for percussion?

Not possible yet, though it seems an easy thing to retrofit. Put it on the wish list to make sure that Eric knows that someone wants it.

>Thanks for your help and for tolerating my dumb questions.

Hey, I can _answer_ those ones! :-)

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Nov-1997

Kelly - I agree that NoteWorthy Composer makes notation easier than some of those higher priced products.
But it does lack a few important symbols and options necessary for the production of dance band,jazz and swing parts.
Please add all your wishes to the wish list - it seems the most wished-for items are the most likely to be included in future upgrades.
Your wishes wont be ignored - the support staff do try to satisfy user needs.
Do you have any scores that you have created - interested in trading?


#357: 4part div. to 8 part harmony
4part div. to 8 part harmony

(357)

Submitted by: cat on 25-Nov-1997

I have a choir piece that I have notated several pages as
4 part harmony on 4 staves. How can I add, move, staves to
show voices on One staff Div. into Sop1, Sop2, etc, into
two staves?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Dec-1997

You cannot currently combine two NWC staves into a single printed staff. You can export them, and then import them into just two staves, but the results will not be what you are looking for, since each voice will be collapsed into single-stem chords.


#358: Another Wish List
Another Wish List

(358)

Submitted by: Kelly Cunningham on 25-Nov-1997

1. I would like to be able to notate rhythm section slashes (for under chords) (////) instead of printing a whole rest and hand writing the slashes.

2. Percussion noteheads.....

3. A real percussion clef

4. A million dollars (Oh, wrong wish list.....)

Thanks for your consideration! -Kelly

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Nov-1997

Just curious - is the percussion clef a new innovation in jazz, swing bands?
I've been reading and copying dance band charts for over 40 years and have never seen other than bass clef drum parts.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe  on 17-Apr-1998

HAHAH.....I have much better wishes....no oboes in band, a act of congress banning any such importation of above mentioned devices.


#359: OCR and NWC
OCR and NWC

(359)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 27-Nov-1997

Can Noteworthy be used to edit the output from any music OCR packages?
There is a package called Musitek MIDIScan which interfaces with notation packages using a file transfer format called Notation Interchange File Format (NIFF). Is this something which could eventually be compatible with NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 27-Nov-1997

At this time, be sure to save the midiscan file into a .mid format.

When working with midiscan, I sometimes find it easiest to make the broad brush editing (key, time, clef) initially thru midiscan, save the result in a .mid format, and then import into Noteworthy for the "finer" editing. Noteworthy is a bit more user friendly.

Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 28-Nov-1997

I'd be interested if Noteworthy considered NIFF the way to go.
Whilst it looks like a good broadbased and open file format,
not many companies have decided to use it yet.

Any comments, Eric?

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Dec-1997

We are currently reviewing the NIFF spec. however, we have no specific comment on it at this time.

Reply 4 offered by: Fab on 20-Feb-1998

I should be nice if newer versions of Noteworthy Composer
could Open/Save Niff File Format...

Reply 5 offered by: George Martin on 22-Feb-1998

Come on Noteworthy! A free-standing piece of software to convert NIFF to NWC would be a great asset don't you think ?

Reply 6 offered by: George Martin on 22-Feb-1998

Come on Noteworthy! A free-standing piece of software to convert NIFF to NWC would be a great asset don't you think ?

Reply 7 offered by: kurt on 29-Apr-1998

forget noteworthy composer...I want it converted into Encore .enc files

Reply 8 offered by: jon on 01-Jun-1998

if anyone has a copy of noteworthy can they please send one to me. thanks, jonathan

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew on 04-Jun-1998

jon,
you can download it from the links on this site.
Follow your nose from !www.ntworthy.com

Andrew

Reply 10 offered by: M Veuger on 09-Sep-1998

Where can I get a free! music OCR program, Please help me

Martijn

Reply 11 offered by: Software Developer on 09-Sep-1998

Send me a FREE computer and I'll tell you!!

Reply 12 offered by: SoftWare Developer (another one) on 10-Sep-1998

if you really want one, go to the dark side of the planet


#363: 1.5  16-bit version
1.5  16-bit version

(363)

Submitted by: L. McHugh on 29-Nov-1997

Got any idea when the 16-bit version of 1.5 will be available?

Reply 1 offered by: Nigel Horne on 01-Dec-1997

If it counts for more to have more people ask for it, I am
also waiting for it.

-Nigel

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Dec-1997

We are still internally testing the 16-bit edition. You can rest assured that it will be available soon (less than a week from now, so by 09-Dec-1997).

Reply 3 offered by: L. McHugh on 02-Dec-1997

Well, OK !!!!. Thanks much.

Reply 4 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 09-Dec-1997

In England it is 23.13 on 9 December and I can't find the 16 bit version Arghhhh!!!!

What time and date is it in Fuquay-Varina ?

Richard

(eagerly waiting)


#365: Page layout
Page layout

(365)

Submitted by: Gord  on 30-Nov-1997

Before I put my request in Wishlist I would like the feedback from others because this wish of mine does not seem to be particularly requested. I would like to see a page format. I will give an example to show what I mean. I get a request from an orchestra member who wants a certain piece transposed but for the layout to remain the same. Please bear with me if I use Passport's Encore just as an example. I would indicate how many measure per staff I require, how many staffs per page and if it uses up all my pages, I would add a page. Then I would add measure numbers. I would then check that the measures and layout exactly match the piece I am copying in. When this is completed, I just have to enter in all the notes and change keys, time, etc accordingly. Then I save as midi and enter into Noteworthy to fill in details, dynamics, etc. Without this initial formatting of the score in Noteworthy, I find it very difficult to know exactly where I am in the score. This is why I would request something similar in the Wishlist. Any comments?
Thanks from Gord.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 01-Dec-1997

I think many of us come to Noteworthy with this mind set of needing things to fit into that framework. Looking at some of the old scores (esp. for piano) though, not many publishers bothered being so dogmatic.
It may be a case of loosening up, to go with Noteworthy's flow, as it were. By all means, put your submission to the list, but I think Noteworthy made a fairly conscious decision to NOT look like all the other editors, and so were able to dispense with the baggage that went with that. Of course, this has minuses when we DO want things to fit neatly... :-)
Whilst you're at it, maybe you'd like to wish for being able to say where a stave should start "on the next line". With the appropriate routines, this sort of approach could emulate the behaviour that you wish for, but would allow more scope for those of us who don't mind being more sloppy, but still need critical breaks in certain places.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Gord on 01-Dec-1997

Thanks Andrew. I see your point and if I put this request in the Wishlist, I will also mention about being able to start a stave on a new line. I notice that Finale uses a similar style of scoring as you go as does NWC, and they are supposed to be the big time notator. I will have to try to change my mindset but what do I say when I return a transposed piece to my colleagues and have them say "But it doesnt look like the original". It would be nice to have the option. Thanks.
Gord.

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 04-Dec-1997

Maybe I didn't understand all because your message is long
and I do not have a perfect command of english language.

But I think you ask for two things.
First, a WYSIWYG interface for entering scores, so that you
can control what you are entering.
Second, a "staff break", so that you can control how you
print scores.

Personnally, I don't need the first demand. If it can exist
as an option, it can be a fine feature. But I would strongly
disagree to have a WYSIWYG interface in place of the current
one.

But about the second demand, I would place it in first
position in the wish list. I thought that I already done
it, but I'm not sure because my system crashed at the
same time and I haven't the courage to do it again.
Anyway, I thought this feature would be included in 1.5,
or am I wrong ?


#370: Wish List Items in this Forum
Wish List Items in this Forum

(370)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 02-Dec-1997

I have been most pleased with NWC forum, including the replies I've got to my own post a short time back about Wish List Items or my own inadequacy in using the product (glad to find it wasn't typically the latter!). Thanks everyone for the help posted.

A question: I see that NWC Support is watching this forum, are Wish List items discussed here automatically added to the NWC Wish List? I mentioned four in my last post, do I need to go to the Wish List page and add them there, too?

Thanks again for a great program. Love it.

Sue Morton

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Dec-1997

Everyone can share their ideas and suggestions in this forum, but they are NOT automatically included in the wish list. A suggestion only enters our system when it is posted directly to the Wish List.


#371: How to concatenate compositions
How to concatenate compositions

(371)

Submitted by: Gary Grosso on 03-Dec-1997

What is the easiest way to combine several NWC files together one after the other so I can export a single MIDI file with more than one song. This seems especially difficult with multi-part arrangements and different instrumentation, but maybe I'm overlooking something.

Thanks for any ideas.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Dec-1997

When chaining songs together into one midi file, you should make sure that tempo, dynamic, and instrument patch settings are all set at the beginning of each song/section, so that different, independent sections do not interfere with eachother.

Reply 2 offered by: Kent Dugan on 04-Dec-1997

So do we export various songs or movements to a common midi file and it appends, or do we combine the NWC files by pasting (appended) one line at a time to the NWC file and then export to a single midi file?

Reply 3 offered by: Jubal Baca on 29-Dec-1997

I'm a musician an a user's NWC. Is posible append 2 movement of clasic music into a 1 file ? Please, explainme pas to pas.Thank you very much... and HAPPY HOLIDAYS

Reply 4 offered by: snedegar on 24-Jan-1998

I suspect that this isn't the correct program for "stringing"
midi files together unless you are going from one piano piece
to another or from one same size orchestra to another.

You COULD continue on only those staves which apply to a
second song, but if you had to create NEW ones, to accomodate
MORE instruments, then you'd have to paste BOTH into an
orchestral "template" with enough "blanks" to accomodate the
channels you required.

There has to be a better way . . .

Sned


#372: How To Find the Wish List
How To Find the Wish List

(372)

Submitted by: Barry Graham on 04-Dec-1997

A lot of wishes are lying dead on the floor of the forum because many new users dont know how to access the wish list.
On the Home Page there is a heading Products followed by a page link to Noteworthy Composer.
The Wish List is on the NoteWorthy Composer page.
It's important to record your wish - so the support team knows what features we users require.
Dont throw your wish down the well.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 04-Dec-1997

I thought for a wonderful moment that you were going to tell us how to look at the wishes so that we can add our support (or criticise).
At the moment the wishes do seem to disappear into a black hole, and unless NWC actually implement them we never see whether other people support them, or if they have been considered, or if they stood more chance of happening if modified in some way.
It really would be nice to have some feedback.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 04-Dec-1997

Crikey, Peter! It's not THAT hard to find! As Barry said, it's on the Noteworthy Composer page, on the index on the left.
The URL is /composer/wishlist.htm

Personally, I consider the forum for discussion, but I think it is fair for NWC to separate out the role of the Wishlist. It means that their monitoring of and input to the forum (which can be spasmodic at times, but generally hasbeen pretty good) needn't be a high priority, as the wishlist takes on that role.
Here are my hints for use of the forum and wishlist:

1) If you have an idea for an enhancement, bring it up on the forum

2) Hopefully, others will respond, generating refinements or generalisations, and _more_importantly_ interest.

3) Settle on a suggestion - your own, but hopefully incorporating what you thought was good from others' suggestions. I tend to be specific as I used to be a programmer, but I'm sure that Eric and Beth know how to interpret arm-waving!

4) Use the wish-list page to formally register your "nomination and vote".
NB: You may vote as many times as you wish :-)

As far as whether NWC listen, check out
/composer/wishtrue.htm for a list of which wishes "made it". It hasn't added Eric's most recent changes - available in the beta - user definable fonts, grace notes, etc... as the release isn't official yet.

I hope Barry's and my exhortations here will help promote more discussion and constructive "wishing"!

Regards,

Andrew

PS: A lot of discussion is happening on the usenet newsgroup. If people want to use it but can't access it, WRITE HERE, saying which news-reader program you are using, so that someone can (hopefully) help you out.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 08-Dec-1997

Andrew, I think we are cross purposes.
What I am saying is that the wish List is 'Write Only', so you can never see what is in it.
Of course we can tell what has been implemented, just by looking at the new versions as they come out, but sadly my wishes are never there %~(

You are quite right about the Forum being the place for discussion, and we don't need a proliferation of sites (on which point I have to confess that having a newsgroup as well seems to me to be a duplication, but please could someone explain their different purposes to an innocent).
What I would like is a somewhat more formal means of having my wishes rejected.
e.g. 'Wrong Headed', 'Unnecessary', 'Too complex', or 'RTFM', then I could sleep at night and not worry that my Princess seemed a bit late arriving!

Reply 4 offered by: Sue Morton on 25-Dec-1997

Peter and Andrew,

Agreed, the forum is the best place to broach wishes BEFORE posting them to the wish list, in case others have found a way to do what is desired, or it is really RTFM, etc.

Peter, you have brought forth an excellent idea. I, too, would like to peruse the "wish list" to see what others are looking for in NWC... and I'd like to know NWC Support's evaluation of these ideas as well.

Perhaps we should post the desired changes to the wish list ON the wish list? :>

Sue

Reply 5 offered by: Rev. Robert E. Leno on 01-Mar-1998

I am looking for the Hymns that will help me during lent.
I am currently using the United Methodist Hymnal.
I was told by Cyber Hymnal or Cyber Hymnist that 40 days and 40 nights would serve me well. However I am unable to find it .

Can you help?

Pastor Bob Leno

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Mar-1998

We do not know anything about a product called Cyber Hymnal. Maybe someone else will have some information about it. In general, your best bet would be to try a search, such as those possible from www.search.com.


#373: WOW! I don't believe it; NWC CAN'T PLAY JAZZ TRAX!
WOW! I don't believe it; NWC CAN'T PLAY JAZZ TRAX!

(373)

Submitted by: Fokey on 04-Dec-1997

Can anyone out there see my predictament?
I have two different versions of NWC and they can't play jazz MIDI files at all.
PLEASE help me, anybody, I need suggestions by the end of the month.
Otherwise please tell me a software program that CAN load jazz files

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 06-Dec-1997

Note from NoteWorthy Support : This message had been corrupted, and was detected as such on 05 April 1998. The corrupted areas have been removed, and repairs made to the extent that they are possible. The remainder of this message is the results of the recover effort.
(syncopation, you know) and print USEABLE scores from ts track, check out my web page on noteworthy, http://www.tip.net.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html
or drop me a line.

An alternative may be that in interpreting the MIDI file, you have inappropriate settings for Note Resolution (See Tools|Options Midi tab).
Experiment with that a bit. You may find that by simply adjusting the note resolution, you can get exactly what you want. As you didn't specify what that was, I can only guess... :-]

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 07-Dec-1997

NoteWorthy Composer doesn't swing. - Sorry Eric but you know what I mean.
The notation determines the sound output - what you see is what you hear.
You will have this problem with most notation software if you intend to notate swing MIDI files.
I have the same problem but with some editing I can produce VERY readable parts a lot easier than I could with other packages - it just takes a bit of effort.
I suggest you wait a decade or so until direct conversion from disk to paper becomes a reality.
By then all the working swing musicians in the world will have starved to death - so there wont be anyone around to read the parts!

Reply 3 offered by: Johnti on 07-Dec-1997

Dear Guys,
Thanks so much for your responses. To clarify my problem I will illustrate.

Reply 4 offered by: Kent Dugan on 12-Dec-1997

May be talking apples and oranges here. There are two issues, not related.
1) Getting midi to swing. - You can create a triplet (8th note + 16th note, grouped as a triplet). This is the usual approximation of swing rhythm. In reality, this is not quite true to performance. Neither is the dotted 8th-16th. If you make the rhythm part (drums, that is) play a swing feel, then notate the horns and things with straight eightth notes. The problem it that this will play pretty stilted. In fact, downright funky, since only the drum part will sound like it's swinging.
I understand you can quantize the midi file in some of the studio programs. But that will only let you hear swing when you PLAY the midi file.
2) Swing parts (printed) - You should realize that NO one writes the swing into an instrumental part. You print the style at the top (swing, blues, etc), and the musicians then interpret it. The parts typically only have straight 8th notes.

Can you get a midi file to play swing? Sure, if you recorded it with swing. It will faithfully record what you play into it.
Can you make a non-swing midi file swing? I hear it can be done, but I haven't tried.
Can you print parts that swing? Sure. But you shouldn't expect to see the 'swing' in print, because it's not done that way. The performer provides that.
Whether you can learn all you need in the next month, I don't know. If you got the gig to do this, and you're trying to learn it in time to pick up a paycheck, you should consider another line of work. This is no slam-dunk. And the other programs out there you can't learn at all without keeping the reference manuals by your side for ready reference.
As far as playing midi files, NWC doesn't. You have to import it (convert it) first, then play the NWC file. Use the finest definition you can (32nds, not quarter note resolution). This should play authentically, but will be largely unreadable by musicians.
YOU will have to convert it to something readable. For that, import it again, but use a 'coarse' definition in the import function (16th or smaller for notes, quarter for rests) and then prepare to spend time converting it to something 'useable.' THAT'S what you get the big bucks for.
BTW, what was the gibberish you printed twice?
Andrew and Barry, ya could'a stopped me before I wrote a book here.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 16-Dec-1997

Wonderful explanation, Kent.
One more note/suggestion.
Using a keyboard macro program (a la MS's RECORDER.EXE, a W3.1 relic not available on new W95, but obtainable from any good museum...:-) you can define a macro to:
1) select the first note of a pair,
2) double it's note length
3) select both and "tripletise" them
4) move right one
Attach this macro to a hotkey, say Ctl-Shift-S, then:
1) Copy the staff to do (retaining a Muted straight one for printing)
2) Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, Ctl-Shift-S, ...
Depending on the length of the staff, it may take only ONE MINUTE!!!!!
Small price to pay for a functional workaround.

A

PS: One last question, do you need the swing feel to play back as a demo?

Reply 6 offered by: Bob Anibal on 20-Dec-1997

I don't know much about it but maybe Band-In-A-Box may be able to play jazz. I like Noteworthy for what I do which is church music abd ballads.

Reply 7 offered by: Colin Charman on 23-Jan-1998

I have Passport's Encore which has a "swing quantise". It's ok, but far from perfect.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 06-Nov-1998

Now NWC can play jazz. (Note that in fact, it could since a long time ;-) but the hard part to find the better way)

Look at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip6.htm#jazz !

Lemme know of what ou think of it (repeat bars are better imho, but may lead to illegible scores)

NWCly yours,
                MAD

Reply 9 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 09-Nov-1998

Yeah! Great idea, Marsu.

Reply 10 offered by: DCI KING on 02-Jul-2001

I got nwc mine play jazz and swing good.


#374: so while i wait
so while i wait

(374)

Submitted by: Fokey on 08-Dec-1997

Hullo, so while I and many other people wait for noteworthy to implement a way of doing [even simple] jazz feature, i like to know how many programming people there are at noteworthy. i think it a very good program but a main use for me is tnot there.

good day,
Fokey.
[Chile]

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 08-Dec-1997

Fokey, the tone of your message sounds like you're impatient for Noteworthy to add a feature. It's still not clear to me what exactly you want it to do, but I'll guess and say that you're after a swung playback for duplets that are written "straight".
I've not heard of this as a planned feature, so it may be a while (say at least six months to a year) before it got implemented, if Eric saw it as a popularly requested feature.
I understand your frustration, and have myself felt that I was twiddling my thumbs whilst waiting for things I needed to be implemented, but they HAVE arrived, for a large part.
If you really need a notator that reads duplets as swing, I'm afraid you should look around a bit more and see what you can find. I think you'll find them fairly rare at this price, and I think may also find the level of support wanting, but good luck to you.

Regards,

Andrew

PS: Some of your previous posts appear garbled on my viewer. Do they do the same on yours?

Reply 2 offered by: James Franklin on 22-Dec-1997

There is a shareware product called 'Mozart' written by a swing sax player/computer programmer that allows you to vary the swing feel of straight eighths on Midi playback. I tried it out, but frankly think NWC is a much better product.

From your questions I think you don't really understand what you're looking for. Playback of swing eighths is a seperate issue from syncopated rhythms. I have no problem writing syncopated rhythms with NWC. Swing eighths are rarely strictly written, and are usually notated as a 'style' which is to be interpeted. Kent Dugans reply to you was a very good explanation of swing eighths and the issues involved in incorporating them into midi playback and notation software. The only thing I'd add is that pulse/beat accents on the off beat are a part of the swing feel; and that the swing eighth feel varies with the tempo, more pronounced at slower tempos, less pronounced at fast tempos. The aforementioned author of 'Mozart' allowed variable quantification of swing eighths for that reason.


#375: Transpose for an E flat instrument
Transpose for an E flat instrument

(375)

Submitted by: Amy Metzger on 09-Dec-1997

I have music in C and I need to transpose to an E flat instrument. How many semitones up or down do I need to go?
Is there somewhere I can find out all the instruments and how many semitones to transpose each one. My music group keeps adding
people who play different instruments and the music we have to work with is all in C.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Dec-1997

Amy - Here's a few.
Alto Sax +9
Tenor Sax +14
Trumpet/Clarinet +2
Baritone Sax +21

Brass Band instruments are bit more difficult with Bb Eb octave transpositions.
Remember to place a C key signature in the staff before transposing.

Reply 2 offered by: Tavish Donahue on 11-Dec-1997

I'll be ponderous 'cause I get confused.
Before you start make that nice c music safe somewhere and use a copy with a new name.
Assuming:
You wrote the music for a c instrument.
You printed it out and the c instrument played from the printed copy and the sound was right.
The c instrument played from your screen and the sound was right.
The computer played the piece and the sound was right.

Then proceed as follows:
Select the staff to transpose.
Tools/Force Accidentals (Should eliminate any key signature problems without rekeying to c)
Tools/Transpose Staff
Select plus 2 for any b flat instrument.(soprano,tenor sax)
Select plus 9 for any e flat instrument.(alto,baritone sax)
Select plus 11 for any f instrument.
Select plus 8 for any d instrument.
(If you have some other variant, say g, count f to g =2, add 11 + 2, get 13, subtract 12, get plus 1.)
Okay

If you have the computer play the transposed staff it should sound exactly the same as it did before you transposed although the notes will have moved.
If the non c player plays the transposed staff he should sound the same pitches as the computer and or c player playing the original staff. EXCEPT

The transposed staff may extend above or below the range of the non c instrument.
One of the following may apply:
1.Tools\Transpose Staff\ select plus or minus 12 to move all notes up or down an octave.
2.Move a few offending notes an octave to stay on scale.
3.Move all notes up by octave(s) to be on or above scale and tell the player to learn altissimo!

Make clef and key changes as needed.
Audit acidentals.
/desired and print.

Reply 3 offered by: Don Cooper on 08-Jan-1998

A very comprehensive set of instructions Tavish. Two minor
comments;

> Tools/Force Accidentals (Should eliminate any
> key signature problems without rekeying to c)

If the music is in the key of C major you DO need to insert
the key signature (NWC signifies this with an F-natural)
before Force Accidentals - transpose - audit accidentals.
If you don't, when you audit accidentals in your transposed
music, NWC leaves the key as C major with the appropraite
accidentals notated in every bar.

> Make clef and key changes as needed.

NWC WILL automatically update the key signature when you
transpose and audit accidentals.


#376: From Treble clef to Bass clef
From Treble clef to Bass clef

(376)

Submitted by: Amy Metzger on 09-Dec-1997

I have music in the Treble clef that I want my Cellos to be able to play
How do I transpose it to the bass clef. When I try to transpose it down a full octave,
it won't put it into the bass clef, it just writes the lines below the treble staff. What am I doing wrong?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Crossley on 09-Dec-1997

Just highlight the treble clef sign and change it to the bass clef using Ctrl+E then highlight all the notes and move them up or down en bloc to your desired position using the ctrl+shif+up/down arrow keys. Then change your key signature accordingly. See page 18 of the latest instruction manual under change notes to a new clef or help screens.

Good Luck
Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Crossley on 09-Dec-1997

Just highlight the treble clef sign and change it to the bass clef using Ctrl+E then highlight all the notes and move them up or down en bloc to your desired position using the ctrl+shif+up/down arrow keys. Then change your key signature accordingly. See page 18 of the latest instruction manual under change notes to a new clef or help screens.

Good Luck
Peter

Reply 3 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 10-Dec-1997

It has been my experience, when changing to tenor or alto clef, that the key signature is automaticly corrected when you change the clef.
I will say that I have never checked what happens to later changes to signature, that is whether the adjustment propagates through out the staff.

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 offered by: hamda jama on 07-May-2001

I would like to know what the Treble Clef and Bass Clef is. I want the answer to my quistion.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-May-2001

Treble clef looks like a fancy script "G" and has middle C on the first leger line at the bottom. Bass clef looks sort of like a "9" with two dots and has middle C on the first leger line at the top.

If this doesn't answer your question try Gary Ewer's Easy Music Theory

Reply 7 offered by: Beqah on 30-May-2001

Well I can read treble cleff, I've been playing clarinet for over 8 years, but now my boyfriend is interested in playing cello and I need to figure out how to read bass clef so I can help him figure it out. How in the world do you read it?!~?!?!

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 30-May-2001

The bass clef was originally a stylized "F" with the two horizontal lines straddling the line assigned to F below middle C. These horizontals evolved into the dots of today's bass clef.

Another way to look at it is that the note on the first ledger line above the bass staff is middle C.

Once you've located one of these pitches, all the other notes can be found by counting up or down the appropriate number of lines and spaces (just as with treble clef). After that, it's just practice, practice, practice.

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen Randall on 01-Jun-2001

I took up the tuba a couple of years ago having played nothing but clarinet for about thirty years. After a couple of weeks reading bass clef was no problem.

My starting point was that the middle line is D. Also I remembered the ditties from school All Cows Eat Grass - that's the spaces in ascending order. And the lines in ascending order are remembered by "Good Boys Deserve Fourpence Allways".

Just get some music out and give it a go and don't get discouraged or embarassed by the initial bum notes. As Grant says practice, practice, practice. At least the cello is a bit more neighbour friendly than the tuba!

Then, watch out for the tenor clef in the cello parts!

Stephen

Reply 10 offered by: Lindsey on 03-Jan-2002

I have been playing flute for about 6 or so years now, and have just started to teach myself piano, but I have a dillema! The bottow part is always written in bass clef, and I have no idea how to transpose it! If there is any one that can tell me how many steps treble and bass are apart, it would be greatly appreciated!
~Lindsey

Reply 11 offered by: Grant on 03-Jan-2002

The question isn't quite clear to me, but here are some guidelines:

1. Middle C is the first ledger line above the bass staff.
2. The C below middle is the second space (counting upwards from the bottom).

A consequence of (1) is that the top line of the bass staff is 4 diatonic steps below the bottom line of the treble staff.

A consequence of (2) is that if you read a note as if it were in treble clef, then shift up a 3rd and down 2 octaves, you'll get the name of the same note in bass clef. For example, the middle line of the treble staff represents B above middle C, but the same line of the bass staff represents D below middle C.

Reply 12 offered by: Robin Withey on 04-Jan-2002

The short answer is to shift up a line (and down 2 octaves). For example, the note on the bottom line of the stave is G, which would be on the second line up if you were using the treble clef.

I still find myself doing this sometimes, despite the fact that I've been singing off the bass clef since my voice broke (more years ago than I care to admit!)

Robin

Reply 13 offered by: Peter Edwards on 04-Jan-2002

Another way to look at it is to draw a horizontal line mid way between the two staves. This represents middle C. The space above it is D and the space below it is B and you actually have a continuum from G at the bottom of the Bass Clef to F at the top of the Treble Clef.

Peter

Reply 14 offered by: David Palmquist on 15-Jan-2002

Peter's answer is elegantly simple. A quick way to transpose from one clef to the other is only a couple of steps long. Go to the existing clef, replace it with the desired clef - any key signature will move up or down appropriately. Then highlight the entire section you wish to write in the other clef. Use shift and up arrow 12 times if you want to change a treble clef to bass; use shift and down arrow 12 times to change bass clef to treble. Sorry I don't know anything about alto and tenor clefs...


#377: Timing and triplets
Timing and triplets

(377)

Submitted by: Joe Crossett on 11-Dec-1997

I've downloaded Noteworthy Composer 1.30b and was trying it
out for a song my daughter wrote (with the help of her piano teacher
and my wife) and I've run into a problem with the timing of
the song. I'm not a musician, so please excuse any incorrect
terms. The song is in 6/8 time and the first two measures in the
treble and base clef have 2 triplets and match up fine. But
in the next measure the triplets continue in the base clef, but
the treble clef has a quarter note, eighth note, then a dotted
quarter note. Noteworthy Composer doesn't consider the Treble and
base clef to have equal timing. It seems like it is assigning
3 beats to the quarter note in the measure instead of two which
is what all the musicians in the family have told me. They tell
me that two triplets in a measure give the the 6 beats and the
quarter note (2 beats), eighth note(1 beat),dotted quarter note
(3 beats) for the 6 beats. It doesn't play the song correctly
as written, but I can change the notes to make it sound right
and line up the measures, but am told that isn't the way the
song goes. I've shown them the program and they like it but
will not consider it if it can't handle the above problem. Any
help would be appreciated.

Thanks

Joe Crossett

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Dec-1997

In 6/8 time, a dotted quarter is tyically considered "the beat", and two beats are present per measure. In this configuration, it is very unusual to see an actual notated triplet, as three adjacent 8th notes are played as triplets (since the beat is a dotted quarter). In NWC, the important thing to know about measure alignment is that the sum of the durations in a measure must be equal in all staff parts (for that measure). As long as you follow this rule, all parts should line up. If you are having trouble, feel free to send us a sample in an email attachment, and we will review it.

- support@ntworthy.com

Reply 2 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 11-Dec-1997

It seems to me that you have got the number of notes in the measure slightly wrong. If the bar is in 6/8 time and there are only two sets of triplets in the first two measures you are short by 1 beat in the first two bars. Remember that a triplet is three notes played in the time of two. The first two bars would measure (no pun intended) up since there are the same number of triplets in both the treble and bass clefs. In the next measure however - in the bass clef has two triplets (two beats) while the treble clef has notes which add up to three beats. I suspect that, rather than triplets, you should only be using standard eith notes.

Hope this helps

Richard


#378: Version 1.5 16 bit comments.
Version 1.5 16 bit comments.

(378)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 13-Dec-1997

Noteworthy -
Thanks for the 16 bit 1.5 preview. Here are a number of comments / strange goings on .

Dot cycling

The cycling action between dot, double dot and no dot seems to no longer work.
It now only works with dot and no dot even if the double dot is configured on the tool bar.
There appears to be no keyboard method of selecting the double dot.
This worked O.K. on the 32 bit preview 2.

Split tail (2 notes on the same vertical position)

If you have two eighth notes tails up (for example) connected by a beam and you add a tails
down to the first note, the second note also goes tails down but one tail only. If you then
try to add a tails up to the second note you can't because it is really a tails up note already.
In this instance you can therefore add a tails down note to a note that already looks
tails down and end up with a proper tails up and down chord.

Beamed tails up and tails down notes look very strange since beamed notes of this nature should
really have the beam on both the up and down tails on this type of chord.
If you could program this it would look better and also form the basis for a cure for the minor
fault described above. You will of course be aware that general beamed chords where the split is
not on the same vertical position also would look better if the beam could be applied to both the
notes pointing up as well as those pointing down. Any chance Eric?

Help notes.

In the help notes, within the new features section, you state that the grace notes are not heard on playback.
This may have been true on preview 1 but they sure sound now ! - Please keep it like that! We want them to sound.

Chord member command in the help notes the first para (1) will need to be amended to allow for split stem
chords.

Song Author Info
This always used to be available during play but no longer seems to be.

Version Banner
The version banner which gives the info on who the software is licensed to and also which version
is being used no longer appears on loading the program.

Richard

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew P on 14-Dec-1997

Richard,
Could you forward these to beta@ntworthy.com? They are all things that Eric should be made immediately aware of.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson on 14-Dec-1997

The double dot icon does not show on the tool bar
in 1.5 Beta 3 32-bit. Can be accessed by Note menu.

NWC does not support the beaming of opposite stems. One
solution for Richard is to enter the split tail (2 notes on
the same vertical position)sequence of notes and then beam
the group. See Beam command in help menu. NOTES MUST BE
ENTERED FIRST and then beamed.

Licensing information (version banner) is available thru
help/about in 1.5 Beta 3. I don't really see an advantage
on having the licensing info show up on loading the program.
My opinion only. It is info for the user only.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodorffe on 14-Dec-1997

Andrew

I have posted an E-mail to Noteworthy. But I also think that these comments are useful in the forum since others will then know that the problem has been raised and not bombard Noteworthy with the same errors.

R

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ferguson on 14-Dec-1997

Try customizing your tool bars and you should find the
double dot. See my comments in the Newsgroup/Forum.
Check for the Select Zoom Icon which also may not show in 16 bit
but should be accessible thru customizing tool bars.

I got caught on a similar situation several weeks ago when
I could not find the down note arrow. That makes two times.
Tsk Tsk

Reply 5 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 14-Dec-1997

Don,
I know about customising the double dot. What I am trying to point out is that the cycling action where you hit the full stop key on your keyboard and Noteworthy will cycle selection through dot, double dot and no dot doesn't happen any more EVEN IF THE DOUBLE DOT IS CUSTOMISED and there appears now to be no KEYBOARD selection of the double dot.

Richard

Reply 6 offered by: Derek on 02-Jan-1998

I rather like the bug without the cycling through the double dot. I think most music scores do not need a double dot, and when you want to cancel a dot, you had to press it twice.


#379: Missing Double Dot Icon in 1.5 Beta 3
Missing Double Dot Icon in 1.5 Beta 3

(379)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson on 14-Dec-1997

Double Dot Icon missing from tool bar. Can still access from note selection menu.
Is this a bug?

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson on 14-Dec-1997

Cancel my comment on the missing Double Dot Icon. It is there
if you CUSTOMIZE the tool bars which is a new feature.

I got caught on that same kind of problem several weeks ago
when I found the down arrow missing from the tool bars.

Tsk Tsk I'm still learning about 1.5


#380: Missing Specify Zoom Level in Beta 3
Missing Specify Zoom Level in Beta 3

(380)

Submitted by: Donald Ferguson on 14-Dec-1997

The Specify Zoom level icon in Beta 3 is missing. However,
the function can be accessed in the view menu and by Alt/=
BUG or INTENTIONAL?

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson on 14-Dec-1997

Cancel my comment on the missing Zoom Level Icon. It is there
if you CUSTOMIZE the tool bars which is a new feature.

I got caught on that same kind of problem several weeks ago
when I found the down arrow missing from the tool bars.

Tsk Tsk I'm still learning about 1.5


#382: A black Yamaha keyboard
A black Yamaha keyboard

(382)

Submitted by: Jonathan Guernon on 14-Dec-1997

Hi !,
I have a Yamaha PSS-680 and I want to record music in Note Worthy. But when I record music all the channel are recorded in one staff and all the notes are quarter notes !
Do I need a driver with my SB16 card ?
Can you help my with that ?

Thanks
(-: Jonathan :-)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 15-Dec-1997

Johnathon,

Look at the Midi Import Options for how to fiddle both the channel splitup and also the note granularity.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Dec-1997

You are probably using the step time facility, rather than the Record facility. When recording, open a file that you want to play back while you are playing your new performance. Now, press Record, and start to play your performance. When you press Stop (F6), the performance will automatically be imported, using the default import options. You can also manually import the performance and override your default import options using the Import command on the Staff menu.

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP


#383: Grace notes
Grace notes

(383)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 14-Dec-1997

I noted an exchange recently in which NWC remarked that release 1.5 would implement grace notes which stole time from the following note. In the case of trills they steal from the preceding note. Is this to be supported also?
Regards
Peter

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Dec-1997

In NWC, grace notes will always steal time from the note that follows. When more advanced constructs are needed, we recommend muting the viewable staff, then making a hidden staff in another partition that constructs the music in whatever way you need.

Reply 2 offered by: Warren Barnett on 18-Dec-1997

In percussion parts a grace note ALWAYS steals time from the note before. Flams and ruffs always steal from the note before.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Crossley on 30-Dec-1997

Thanks for the replies. I will enter it in the wish list. Regards and a Happy New Year.


#384: drum sounds
drum sounds

(384)

Submitted by: Dale on 15-Dec-1997

According to the help file on drum sounds: "Drum sounds are
typically assigned to a dedicated channel on the sound card,
usually channel 10 or channel 16 (in some devices, drum kits
are assigned to an instrument patch, rather than to a
dedicated channel). In General MIDI, different note pitches
equate to different percussive sounds."

Can someone explain to me, step by step, how to use this
feature?
Thank so much...

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 15-Dec-1997

Start noteworthy.
file
new
ok
ok
staff
staff properties
midi
{channel}: 10
ok
enter
down arrow
enter
down arrow
etc , (Keep goin' till your staff has a bunch of different notes on it)
play (If you get whistles thuds bangs PERCUSSION then your setup dedicates channel 10 to percussion)
(if not: repeat above except {channel}:16 no need to enter notes if play gives percussion then your setup dedicates 16 to percussion
if neither 10 nor 16 percusses then use the instrument patch list.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 16-Dec-1997

Let us know if it works or not. What card are you using?

A

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Dec-1997

The Rhythm templates shown when you select File New may also be helpful, since they provide drum samples on midi channel 10.

Reply 4 offered by: snedegar on 26-Dec-1997

Key	Percussion Sound (ch 10 or 16)

35	Acoustic Bass Drum
36	Bass Drum 1	(Note = C)
37	Side Stick
38	Acoustic Snare
39	Hand Clap
40	Electric Snare
41	Low Floor Tom
42	Closed High Hat
43	High Floor Tom
44	Pedal High Hat
45	Low Tom
46	Open High Hat
47	Low-Mid Tom
48	High-Mid Tom	(Note = C)
49	Crash Cymbal 1
50	High Tom
51	Ride Cymbal 1
52	Chinese Cymbal
53	Ride Bell
54	Tambourine
55	Splash Cymbal
56	Cowbell
57	Crash Cymbal 2
58	Vibraslap
59	Ride Cymbal 2
60	High Bongo	(Note = C)
61	Low Bongo
62	Mute High Conga
63	Open High Conga
64	Low Conga
65	High Timbale
66	Low Timbale
67	High Agogo
68	Low Agogo
69	Cabasa
70	Maracas
71	Short Whistle
72	Long Whistle
73	Short Guiro
74	Long Guiro
75	Claves
76	High Wood Block
77	Low Wood Block
78	Mute Cuica
79	Open Cuica
80	Mute Triangle
81	Open Triangle

Copyright ® 1996,1997 by NoteWorthy ArtWare, Inc.

Reply 5 offered by: Dennis Couch on 29-Dec-1997

I've created a a Noteworthy file that contains all of the drum sounds, labelled as to what they are. I keep it open along with the actual song I'm working on, and use it to both see what note I need to use for a particular sound as well as try out percussion sounds to see what fits best. I created it using the Noteworthy help file section on percussion, but I'd be willing to send it to anyone who'd like a copy. Note to Noteworthy support: I think this would be a helpful file to ship with future Noteworthy releases!

Reply 6 offered by: J. E. Taylor on 01-Jan-1998

Dennis: I'd love to have a copy of your NWC drum file.

Reply 7 offered by: David Barklin on 12-May-1998

Hi I am very interested in what you have, please send me
some stuff.

Reply 8 offered by: S³oik on 21-Jun-1998

35 Acoustic Bass Drum
36 Bass Drum 1 (Note = C)
37 Side Stick
38 Acoustic Snare
39 Hand Clap
40 Electric Snare
41 Low Floor Tom
42 Closed High Hat
43 High Floor Tom
44 Pedal High Hat
45 Low Tom
46 Open High Hat
47 Low-Mid Tom
48 High-Mid Tom (Note = C)
49 Crash Cymbal 1
50 High Tom
51 Ride Cymbal 1
52 Chinese Cymbal
53 Ride Bell
54 Tambourine
55 Splash Cymbal
56 Cowbell
57 Crash Cymbal 2
58 Vibraslap
59 Ride Cymbal 2
60 High Bongo (Note = C)
61 Low Bongo
62 Mute High Conga
63 Open High Conga
64 Low Conga
65 High Timbale
66 Low Timbale
67 High Agogo
68 Low Agogo
69 Cabasa
70 Maracas
71 Short Whistle
72 Long Whistle
73 Short Guiro
74 Long Guiro
75 Claves
76 High Wood Block
77 Low Wood Block
78 Mute Cuica
79 Open Cuica
80 Mute Triangle
81 Open Triangle

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Jun-1998

Please see the file "Drumref.nwc" inthe NWC distribution.


#386: move staff
move staff

(386)

Submitted by: christian wollin on 16-Dec-1997

I wonder if there´s a bug in the new Beta version of NWC.5.0(3) It´s impssible for me to use the "move staff" command, all I get is a General Protection Fault
Anyone else experience this. Can Support please give a comment.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Dec-1997

See the preview 3 patch on the beta page. This corrects the bug that you have found.

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 17-Dec-1997

Idle curiosity: was this bug hardware dependent? Seemed like some had it bad, some a little, and us lucky folk not at all.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Dec-1997

Windows' reactions to a misbehaving program vary in their severity, but in this case, the general bug should show a GPF. Any 16-bit program on Win 95 and Win 3.1 will get away with more flaws, without an immediate GPF (but will become unstable). The 32-bit OS and programs are more likely to fail immediately when a gross error is detected (because it is actually detected by the OS).

Bottom line: the staff move problem was a software bug which triggered a memory fault. The net effect can sometimes vary...

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 18-Dec-1997

Crashed every time for me (32 bit version, and in Australia, where all the bits are upsidedown..;).
The new fix ... well ... fixed it. Thanks Eric for your prompt response.

Andrew


#387: drum notation
drum notation

(387)

Submitted by: Perrin on 20-Dec-1997

How is it possible to edit a drum notation (ride, hit hat..aso)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Dec-1997

I may not understand your question, but you can look at the drum sections of some of the song templates for an example of how to add drum sounds. There is also a section in the help file that documents the note pitches used to trigger General MIDI drumn sounds.

Reply 2 offered by: Johannes Hedin on 29-Dec-1997

Click with right mousebutton on the staff and choose
"Staff properties...", then go to the MIDI-section and set the Channel at number 10.
You can find the drumsonds in the Help-section
Good Luck!


#388: WinGroove
WinGroove

(388)

Submitted by: Jason on 22-Dec-1997

Hey, for those of you that know WinGroove, could you please give me a hand? When I use WinGroove as my driver, it sends the music to my speakers at an incredably high level. This causes a great ammount of distortion. Is there any way to customize Wingroove to take care of this? Or is there something that i need to do in noteworthy? Noteworthy is not the only program that i run into this problem with, but it is the only one without volume controls to lower output levels.

thanks,
Jason

Reply 1 offered by: Kent Dugan on 23-Dec-1997

For WIN95, create a shortcut for your volume control or mixer and put it in your start up menu. Then task-switch (alt-tab) to flip over to your mixer and set the volume.
I asked for a volume control on the wish list, but on WIN95, there is one on the task bar. But WIN95's is slow.
For win3.1, open the mixer or task-switch to the program manager and pick the group that has the mixer, adjust the volume, then switch back.

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Horne on 24-Dec-1997

The best thing to do with WinGroov is chuck it in the bin -
see the problems I posted about it to this forum in October.

Reply 3 offered by: Jason Cowperthwaite on 24-Dec-1997

ok.. so I put it away in the roundfile, but what do I substitute it with? The prog greatly improves my computers sound, and my computer, if unaided, frankly, sucks.

Reply 4 offered by: Nigel Horne on 03-Jan-1998

What sound card are you using?

Reply 5 offered by: Ken Stanton on 02-Feb-1998

Nigel, October's Forum notes are not available in the archive. I've downloaded WinGroove with a view to using it, but your note has me concerned. I have a 486DX4 100Mhz machine with 20 Mb of memory. I'm operating under Windows for Workgroups 3.11 and I have an SB16 soundcard. I have the latest NWC V1.50. I do not have a midi-card. Could I ask you to reiterate your issues with WinGroove ? and let me know what I need to do to 'hear' the sound of NWC files to some degree of accuracy (at least to hear flutes differently to the piano! and not like a "comb and paper"). If it is because I have not set up NWC or the Sound-card properly I would appreciate some guidance.

Reply 6 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 8 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 9 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 10 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 11 removed by: SYSOP


#390: AWE64 Gold
AWE64 Gold

(390)

Submitted by: Nigel Horne on 24-Dec-1997

I know, I know I'm a mug. I believed the hype about the
so called 'CD quality' of the AWE64 Gold, and how it's
sounds are in distinguishable from the real stuff. Yeah
right. Forget it.

-Nigel

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 25-Dec-1997

Well, Nigel, I think what you (and I) are missing here are some good soundfont patches for our AWE 64s.
I agree that the sounds that come with it are a bit Mickey Mouse (single violin and flute for example).
These are all fixed with a good patch. Creative provide some with their installation (in CTSND\SFBNK) but I still haven't found one to really make me say "What a great buy!" :-(
I think there are some good patches out there somewhere, but haven't found them yet.

Andrew

PS: Please let me know if you find some.

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Horne on 26-Dec-1997

Andrew,

How to I use this CTSND\SFBNK you mention?

-Nigel

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 26-Dec-1997

Start AWE Control (this is in the Sound Blaster AWE 64 Gold Menu/Group)
Click the Synth Tab
Select General Midi as the available synth
Select Browse and hunt around for the Sound Font Banks (in my system, they're at Program Files\Creative\ctsnd\sfbnk, which answers your question)
Choose a Sound Font. The 2gm and 4gmgsmt.sf2 files indicate 2Meg and 4Meg of card memory respectively. Sample shows how the waves can be dogs, cats, anything.
Choose Okay
Choose Apply (and wait a little for the two and four meg banks, as they take a little longer to load).
Start an app and see what happens! You should now have better sounds.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Nigel Horne on 27-Dec-1997

I went into Creative Wave/Synth control and it only listed
a few (unuseful) instruments. How do I add some new ones?

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 28-Dec-1997

Can you describe a bit more clearly what you are seeing?
-A

Reply 6 offered by: Nigel Horne on 28-Dec-1997

Err, not really without a screen dump. I go into 'Creative Wave/Synth Control',
click on the tab marked 'Waveguide' and only a few instruments
such as Electric Piano, Harpsichord etc. appear. No instrument
that I want do.

-Nigel

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 28-Dec-1997

That explains it! We're talking about two different programs!
The one I want you to use is normally called AWE Control and should be the first in the list.

Failing that look in the the folder for awe32cp.exe
If you installed it using the defaults, this is in
c:\Program Files\Creative\ctsnd\Programs

If you are using Win 3.1, this is all going to be a little difficult... :-}

A

Reply 8 offered by: Don Cooper on 29-Dec-1997

Looks like Santa brought you an AWE64 for Christmas Nigel!
With the sound fonts loaded, the output is superior to
anything else I've heard (that doesn't cost more than the
PC) - that's if you're writing for piano, orchestra or dance
band. For brass-band enthusiasts like you and I, the cornet,
tenor horn etc sounds are sadly lacking and can't really be
substituted by trumpet, french horn etc. Still, it's an
improvement on the SB16 where everything seemed to sound
like a harpsichord.

So, how do we make a soundfont for brass band instuments?
Any suggestions?

Don

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew on 29-Dec-1997

Make some good samples, and then use Vienna (...SOMEHOW, I've not used it, yet) to turn it into a sound font bank.
I'm planning to do it for dulcimers and maybe tabla this year for the same reasons as above.

Andrew

Reply 10 offered by: Drake Donahue on 01-Jan-1998

http://soback.kornet.nm.kr/~chaos/sbawe32/sbawe32.htm
And download the chaos 8 or 12 MB soundbank if you have put the extra memory on your AWE 32/64 sound card. Pretty good stuff including best brass samples i've heard. Price same as NWC 1.x upgrade--free.

Reply 11 offered by: Nigel Horne on 03-Jan-1998

Unfortunately I only have 4Mb on my sound card and I'm loath
to spend the money on the extra memory unless I know if
the chaos stuff will get me closer to the sound I (and Don)
want.

Reply 12 offered by: Nigel Horne on 03-Jan-1998

Try http://www.lysator.liu.se/awe/. Not the answer to my
prayers, but a least a few things including free sound
fonts.

I've set my Midi playback device to 'SB AWE64G MIDI Synth'
in the NWC options screen. Is that correct?

-Nigel

Reply 13 offered by: Drake Donahue on 04-Jan-1998

Absolutely.
I assume you have loaded and selected a 4mb soundbank?
When/if you add sound card memory--fill it up--I added 8 MB and regret it now. At the time 4 MB was a big commercial bank leaving 4 MB for me to play with. I thought ..

Reply 14 offered by: Neil Mogensen on 09-May-1998

Reading the preceeding thread brought memories of trying to figure
figure out CL's not very clear instructions on how to use the
AWE 64. I now have an AWE 64 Gold both at home and in my
office, one with a medium-sized Yamaha keyboard attached, the
other with a Roland digital piano. One of the boards has
the 4-meg memory module, the other an 8-meg. I can't tell
much difference between them. The best sounds are in an 8-meg
level sound font file. It is on the CD that comes with the upgrade.
By

Reply 15 offered by: DJ Obelix on 20-Jun-1998

Please, where i can find jungle/dub groove banks?


#392: keyboard accuracy
keyboard accuracy

(392)

Submitted by: Carmen on 30-Dec-1997

I'm sure this is something simple, but here goes...

I just downloaded the trial version, and attached it to a Yamaha SHS-10
keyboard (pretty inexpensive). Whenever I play on the keyboard, the notes show up
as all the same timing. Regardless of what I play, eighth notes (or sixteens, etc.) are all I get.
The software seems to ignore any timing. I can't imagine that I'd need to add all timing later?!
Oddly, when I add a new staff, I get to play whatever I want, and the notes show up correctly! Problem is that I then can't get rid of the earlier stuff I played, even when I delete the staff.

Needless to say, I must be doing something wrong. Isn't there a simple way to record what I play, and play it back without further editing?

Also - can I lower the sensativity? Even slightly sloppy playing (can't hear it, but it gets picked up) shows up as chords...

Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew P on 30-Dec-1997

I'm probably not the best person to answer this, as I use the computer keyboard to enter notes, but I'll have a go and hope someone will enhance it if it needs it.

"Whenever I play on the keyboard, the notes show up as all the same timing. Regardless of what I play, eighth notes (or sixteens, etc.) are all I get. The software seems to ignore any timing."

If this is during step entry, then that makes perfect sense. If it is during "Record", then I can't explain it.

"Oddly, when I add a new staff, I get to play whatever I want, and the notes show up correctly! Problem is that I then can't get rid of the earlier stuff I played, even when I delete the staff."

What happens when you delete the first staff?

"Needless to say, I must be doing something wrong. Isn't there a simple way to record what I play, and play it back without further editing?"

For something rhythmic, create a new file using a Rhythm template (they're on the Song Templates dialog when you select File | New).
Then press Record and awaaaaay you go!

"Also - can I lower the sensativity? Even slightly sloppy playing (can't hear it, but it gets picked up) shows up as chords..."

Yes. Fiddle with the Import tab in Tools | Options.

As Eric would say, "Hope this helps."

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Emerson Scott on 02-Jan-1998

Both of you are already way ahead of me in scoring from the keyboard. I have an 88-key Roland EP-9 and an old 486 IBM PS/1 66Mhz PC with 24 megs of RAM. The sound card came with a diagnostics tool. I have tested both midi-in and midi-out (in Dos) but when I boot up NWC, I'm not able to even 'step' input. (The score will play on the piano though - midi-out.) I've checked the help screens in NWC, but I'm still stuck.
Any suggestions?

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 03-Jan-1998

Two things to check:
1) Tools | Options.
Record tab.
Input device.
2) Midi Input Active is turned on.

Possible (3). I don't know if this has been changed, but in Tools | Options | Midi tab, you may need to check if Port Usage is set to Always or While Active to be able to read from the midi device. This may be a limitation due to Window's implementation of generic midi port usage, I'm not sure.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Mark on 15-Jan-1998

My problem is similar but no matter what I do, the timing is always the same!!!!!! The "Record mode" won't stay on for more than about 1
second, and I don't know why! I created a new staff and
it's still on quarter (or whatever) timing. I have a Casio CTK-581 I input with.
Help!!! :(

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jan-1998

The record feature is built on top of the playback feature, as explained in the help file, excerpted below:

The recording feature of NWC is built on top of the existing play back capabilities in the application. This feature allows a MIDI performance received from the MIDI input device to be recorded and captured while the current score is playing back. Recording is only possible when a score is open and is playing. If the current song is only three bars in length, then starting a recording will only allow up to three bars to be recorded. This is because recording and play back will both stop when the current song play back is finished.


#393: Grouping rests into a block
Grouping rests into a block

(393)

Submitted by: Tim on 01-Jan-1998

I'm writing orchestral scores, and a lot of parts have many
consecutive measures of rests. When printing parts, is there
any way to have it group these into a block? For example, if
a part has 100 measures of rest, can I print it out so that they're
grouped into this notation: |-- 100 --| instead of many pages of
nothing but rests?

Thanks!

Tim

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson on 01-Jan-1998

One solution would be to use local repeats. How you would keep track of each
instrument and where they are at in the score depending on the number of rests is a
separate problem.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 02-Jan-1998

The orchestral scores I have seen have all the rests written out - someone somewhere in the band is generally doing something while the rest are resting and the parts need to keep up so that they match up when others join in. So the problem only arises when extracting the individual parts.

To get individual parts printed with muli-bar rests I insert text such as

| --27-- |

into an empty bar. However, this will not play correctly. It is also tedious if you have to go through all the parts in a large score.

What we need is a facility to automatically identify mutli-bar rests and compress them when individual staffs are printed out. Oh yes, and we need have a lower limit (which we can specifcy?) before the compression kicks in. That is we maybe don't two or three bar rests to be compressed. And can we have a facility to break up automatic multi-bar rests so that we can insert rehearsal marks. And another thing. We would need to be able to handle multi-bar rests in, for example, piano parts with more then one staff where the mult-bar rests do not occur in the same place in both staves.

It all gets horribly complicated doesn't it when you try to work out how these things should be impemented.

Reply 3 offered by: Nigel Horne on 03-Jan-1998

In a nutshell this is why I eventually dropped NWC for anything
more serious than trying a few sounds on my computer. Sadly
Eric failed (and still fails) to realise that this (not
grace notes!) is the biggest draw back to the software.
So I saved up my 700 quid and bought finale - yes it is *that*
important to me.

Reply 4 offered by: John taylor on 07-Jan-1998

Aman to that Nigel!

Reply 5 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 27-Jan-1998

I'm afraid I have to agree that collapsed rests in single
parts (with, indeed, an option to break them into chunks
before and after a specific bar) are something very
important that even the beta still lacks.

And while Eric's at it, we'd need small-font notes for cues
in rest bars as well.

Reply 6 offered by: Kevin Petersen on 06-Feb-1998

Ditto. Multi-bar rests in extracted parts is absolutely critical to me. I agree that it will take a few rules to correctly group rests for parts, but without them it looks amateurish to pass out a part with 2/3 of a page filled with single bar rests. As well as offering a trecherous opportunity to mis-count and come in early/late.

Otherwise, an excellent program (I love you dearly, but ...)


#395: Blue Bar and Zoom Function in NWC 1.50 Beta !!!
Blue Bar and Zoom Function in NWC 1.50 Beta !!!

(395)

Submitted by: manni on 03-Jan-1998

1.) Isn't that blue bar - marking the actual staff - disturbing, is it?
Why isn't there any option to inactivate this bar??????

2.) With the exception of small arrangements (Jingle Bells i.e.)
the zoom function is very unsuitable to overview
a conductor's score. It is either to small or to big.
(configurable zoom steps would be better)

Reply 1 offered by: christian wollin on 03-Jan-1998

For step-zooming look under view/zoom
regards
christian

Reply 2 offered by: christian wollin on 03-Jan-1998

Look under View/Zoom for zooming in steps.
Regards
Christian

Reply 3 offered by: manni on 03-Jan-1998

But this steps don't solve the problem, because the view
is either to small or too big, try it, if you have a conductor's
score (about 20 staffs and more)!

Reply 4 offered by: Don Cooper on 03-Jan-1998

Manni,

"that blue bar - marking the actual staff" can be removed
by selecting Options from the Tool menu, click on the
Editor tab and de-select the "Active Staff Frame" option.

Reply 5 offered by: John Taylor on 08-Jan-1998

Perhaps it's the color of the "bar - marking the active staff" that you don't like, Manni. Use the Editor to change it. Click on Tools/Options/Editor. The Editor Tab will only work if a song file is loaded. Good Luck!

Reply 6 offered by: Eamonn Fitzpatrick on 19-Jan-1998

I agree with Manni. Even setting the zoom step to 2
results in a reduction in the on-screen size from slightly
too big to microscopically small. In previous versions it
was possible to increase or decrease the size in small steps
until one achieved the best setting for the job in hand. Is
there a way to do this in the latest release?

Reply 7 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 27-Jan-1998

Erm ... unless I've misunderstood somewhere, sounds like
you're looking for the 'set zoom' function. This is
accessible from one of the menus (guess who's writing from
work and doesn't have NoteWorthy in front of him) and by
the keyboard shortcut Alt+ =

I still wish the preferred zoom factor could be set as a user
preference isntead of score by score, though.

Reply 8 offered by: Eamonn FitzPatrick on 11-Feb-1998

With respect Niels, I think you have misunderstood. I am aware
of the ways in which one can set the zoom rate but even at
the lowest setting (2) the screen goes from four staves
per screen to twelve staves! Four is just a little too big
for most purposes and twelve is far too small to read them.
That is what we are getting at. Perhaps there is some other
way of correcting that and I would be obliged to you for
pointing it out to us.


#396: Notes of different values at the same time!!
Notes of different values at the same time!!

(396)

Submitted by: Jeremy Legat on 03-Jan-1998

How can I insert say a mim and then two crotchets at the same time in the music but on the same line??
I've seen this done in the sample of 'The First Nowell'!!

JEREMY

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 03-Jan-1998

First, enter the minim with say tails down selected. Then select tails up and then a crotchet. Position the cursor to the right of the minim at the note value that you want the first crotchet.
Hold down the control key and press the enter key.
This method can be used to build up a chord. For the second crotchet, follow the second part of this procedure again.

There ara a few rules to building up a chord such as - you can't have more than two note values in one chord and (in versions prior to the beta 1.5) you cannot have two notes at the same vertical position.
These are all documented in the help file so have a browse through .

Richard


#397: Fermata
Fermata

(397)

Submitted by: Jeremy Legat on 03-Jan-1998

How do I add a fermata (you know, the semi-circle with a dot in the middle of it), above a note. It refuses to add it. Yet It is well and truely above the last note in NWC's sample of 'The First Nowlell'
Help!!

JEREMY

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 03-Jan-1998

Try removing the 'preserve width' cross in the display characteristics box before clicking on OK to enter the fermata.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Jan-1998

The fermata is on the Tempo Variance item. You can either insert this yourself, or copy and paste the item from the sample song.


#399: rest in chord member?
rest in chord member?

(399)

Submitted by: Elaine on 04-Jan-1998

I am a chinese and a newbie in this software, hope that what I say here is understandable.
Basically, I know how to put a rest in a chord member. My question is this:
let say, there is a chord of 3 notes in the lower staff; the lowest note is played by left hand and the upper 2 are played by right hand;
The lowest note is half duration but the upper ones are quarter duration and I want to put a rest after the upper notes
(I don't have note after the half note, so I guess I can't put a rest as if it is in a chord).
How can I put the rest so that it is placed more or less the same level as the upper notes on the staff?
Is it possible to do so? All I can see is the default position of the rest,
which is in the middle of the staff.
If you don't understand my question, please kindly reply and tell me.
Thanks a million.

Reply 1 offered by: Elaine on 04-Jan-1998

Is it called the staff?? I mean the five lines thing..
sorry that I am not good at english.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Jan-1998

At the moment, a rest placed by itself will appear in the standard center position on the staff. If a rest is combined with a larger note, then the rest will shift to make room for the note, if necessary.


#400: is it possible to print out a non-english title??
is it possible to print out a non-english title??

(400)

Submitted by: Elaine on 04-Jan-1998

I posted this in newsgroup but I decide to post it here again.
I tried to put a title in chinese and could see it using preview, but when I printed it out,
there's nothing for the title (I checked the box for title info already).
what's the problem about this?

Reply 1 offered by: Ha Huy Minh, http://www.orc.ru/~psalms on 05-Jan-1998

Once I had the same problem. It seems that when you use
a very small margin, like 0.20 inches, the titles in big
letters cannot be printed out.

Also, you may need to install NWC 1.50 beta. You can use
any Windows font you like by setting the new Page Setup
options under menu File.

Hope this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Jan-1998

What version are you using? If it is pre 1.50 beta, then you must use characters from the Times New Roman font that ships with Windows. In 1.50 beta and beyond, you can specify what font should be used for the title.


#401: my wish to wish list
my wish to wish list

(401)

Submitted by: Elaine on 04-Jan-1998

Hi,
kinda active recently to this forum. Just wondering if this wish is constructive?
anyone think it would be good if whenever we place a note, we can hear the pitch of that note?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 08-Jan-1998

<<anyone think it would be good if whenever we place a note, we can hear the pitch of that note?>>

Yeah, probably. Could be setup as another part of in the echo part of the Record tab in Options.
Don't think that'd be too hard to implement. Simply put out the note for the length specified by the note length.
It would help those of us who compose from the keyboard rather than from the ... er ... keyboard. ;-)

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Batchman on 14-Jan-1998

I wouldn't want to hear the note echoed for the length of
the actual note. A short, pitched beep would be enough.
It could be a pain, entering a series of whole notes and
having to wait for each one to finish echoing.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Jan-1998

I think this would be a useful optional feature. For serious
notation entry it would drive you crazy, but for a beginner
trying to compose simple music it would be very helpful.

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ruckman on 25-Mar-1998

Useful, but definately OPTIONAL.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Mar-1998

Although not exactly what you want, here is a reminder:

Don't forget about the Play "from insertion point" option (Tools, Options, Midi), which lets you press F5 at any time to hear play from your current editing position in the song.

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew on 26-Mar-1998

Wha? Eric! Don't think I've ever seen it before! When did you slip that one in? This'll be useful for transcriptions of Satie's Gnossienne! (Written without bars, I believe!)

A

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Mar-1998

Be careful with music without bars. NWC requires that bars be inserted in order to format the music when printing. It also needs them for navigation in the editor.

FYI: We added the relative play feature years ago, in version 1.1. It is mentioned at:

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/history.htm

as "Configurable starting point for play to begin".

Reply 8 offered by: David Read on 17-Apr-1998

Andrew,

Satie's Gnossiennes are available in MIDI format from the Classical Music Archives, http://mic3.hensa.ac.uk/ftp.prs.net/midi.html

Just in case this saves you time...

David


#403: Wishes: Crescendo Symbols; Rests in Chords
Wishes: Crescendo Symbols; Rests in Chords

(403)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 08-Jan-1998

My biggest wish is for < and > crescendo symbols.
I have seen the suggestion of using text with a "music thingy" font.
If this is the way to do it, could someone make such a font available?

The other problem I encounter is trying to hold a note on a staff while
other notes play. This can be done by make a chord with two notes
in the same place (eg whole note and quarter node). Most music
I see would put a quarter rest under the whole note, which
looks nicer. So the wish is to place rests in chords.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 08-Jan-1998

I agree with your first wish !

Re your second problem, this is possible now and you don't need to wish for it.

Enter the rest first (also assigning a stem direction even though a rest does not have one)
Then enter the second note as you would a normal chord member (Ctrl and enter) making sure that the stem direction is the opposite to the one selected for the rest.

You will now have a chord consisting of a rest and a note.

As Eric says - Hope this helps.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 09-Jan-1998

In my experience, this works only if the note is longer than
the rest. Have I missed something?

Paul

Reply 3 offered by: Nick Wastell on 15-Jan-1998

I also agree with the < and > symbols, especially if they are working models, i.e., they will cause a gradual change between levels inserted before and after the symbols.

Reply 4 offered by: Marcel Bock on 16-Jan-1998

The problem of writing crescendo and decrescendo signs can
be solved by using the drawing capabilities of an other
program. I use Word 6.
The principle is :
- preview the page where you want to add cresc and decresc
signs
- select "copy" to copy this page to the windows clipboard
- open a new document with Word
- paste the saved page on this new document
- the drawing of the cresc and decresc signs needs a good
practice of the drawing tools of Word and lot of patience
but the result is quite good.
Good luck.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 16-Jan-1998

It is a lot faster to draw the symbols on the paper by hand.
I am really hoping there is some way to get them in a font.
I wish they were done correctly.

This is a wonderful product! This is the only significant
limitation I have found.

Reply 6 offered by: Marcel Bock on 18-Jan-1998

I agree.
The ability of writing hairpins should be included in a
future version of NWC. Waiting for this future version, the
bypass I describe may help people who need very clean
printouts today.
I agree with your last statement : nwc is a wonderfull
product.

Reply 7 offered by: Alex Bellamy on 21-Jan-1998

The program is very good, especially now v 1.5 is out. All that it needs is the ability to put hairpins in!

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Jan-1998

Hairpins could be done the same way as slurs: mark a group of notes, and pick Crescendo or Decrescendo. They are drawn the same way as slurs - a stretched shape. (Slurs should really tilt with the position of the notes, but what we have is good enough for me.) The only difference is the user must select the position, which would be the insertion point before the selecting began.

Easy for me to say, but it does not look too hard, or anything really new.

Reply 9 offered by: Michael LaBeau on 22-Jan-1998

Downloaded my first NWC program earlier this evening; it's now 2:00am and I can't stop reading these messages...have barely scratched the surface on what this thing can do, but am learning lots just reading right here!

Dumb newbie question: what's a hairpin??!!

Is this forum too advanced for beginning MIDI questions? I downloaded this thing just so I could notate a few lines of music...now it looks like it may cover most if not all of my needs for my Alesis synth, but I'm barely getting started and know NOTHING!! Maybe I'd better start a special reply section for myself...

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Jan-1998

"Hairpin" is a term used in this forum for crescendo and decrescendo symbols (< and >). I guess they look like slightly opened hairpins. NWC does not do them. It should.

Reply 11 offered by: Jason Schindler on 09-Mar-1998

Yes, I agree with the use of hairpins, I've always drawn them in with my scanner and paint shop pro

Reply 12 offered by: Don Ruckman on 25-Mar-1998

HAIRPINS Cresendo- Diminuendo(Decresendo)
Let me suggest a method to implement, similiar to another composing program I have used.
Since line drawing capability is in NWC, as seen in Bar Lines al-be-it about twice as wide as needed for hairpins, let's draw the hairpins with perhaps the following procedure:
INSERT
Cresendo
Diminuendo Select one
Let's select Cresendo -- Cresendo Dialog Box 1 appears
Select Start Point(position)
Lower insert cursor to a point below the start note
Hit Enter A . will indicate point.
Cresendo Dialog Box 2 appears
Select End Point (position)
Position insert cursor to righr of start point and
above or below the start point position
Hit Enter NWC will now draw 2 lines from the
start point to the endpoint above and below the
start point (example: 2 cursor positions above
and 2 cursor positions below
For Diminuendo (Decresendo) Reverse process for drawing
the 2 lines.

Example for Cresendo:
. End point selected
Start point selected . draw 2 lines
. End point determined

If this seems reasonable, perhaps NWC could implement actually quite easily.

Don Ruckman email ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 13 offered by: Don Ruckman on 25-Mar-1998

HAIRPINS Cresendo- Diminuendo(Decresendo)
Let me suggest a method to implement, similiar to another composing program I have used.
Since line drawing capability is in NWC, as seen in Bar Lines al-be-it about twice as wide as needed for hairpins, let's draw the hairpins with perhaps the following procedure:
INSERT
Cresendo
Diminuendo Select one
Let's select Cresendo -- Cresendo Dialog Box 1 appears
Select Start Point(position)
Lower insert cursor to a point below the start note
Hit Enter A . will indicate point.
Cresendo Dialog Box 2 appears
Select End Point (position)
Position insert cursor to righr of start point and
above or below the start point position
Hit Enter NWC will now draw 2 lines from the
start point to the endpoint above and below the
start point (example: 2 cursor positions above
and 2 cursor positions below
For Diminuendo (Decresendo) Reverse process for drawing
the 2 lines.

Example for Cresendo:
. End point selected
Start point selected . draw 2 lines
. End point determined

If this seems reasonable, perhaps NWC could implement actually quite easily.

Don Ruckman email ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 14 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Mar-1998

This seems a little complicated, and does not follow the NWC style of doing things. NWC should know what a crescendo symbol is and how to draw it. The user tells NWC where it should go. Selecting the range of notes should be sufficient.

The dialog should have the standard hide-when-printing and position spin control options. In addition, you should be able to specify the dynamic level (eg. piano, forte) at the end of the crescendo.

Reply 15 offered by: Don Ruckman on 26-Mar-1998

Blair, I agree with you that NWC should treat the cresendo, decresendo as any other element once it is formed.
The only reason for suggesting this 'draw' method is that it allows for long narrow cresendos(de...),covering many measures or notes, and/or short fat symbols covering as little as one note or measure. This should not preclude the insertion of dynamics at cursor positions before and/or after the symbol. Yes, the dynamic levels, could be asked for in the dialog boxes for start(if any desired), and for ending(if any desired). Sorry about my above example, the formatting of the reply did not match as input here in the reply box.

Don Ruckman ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 16 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Mar-1998

The length could be determined by selecting the notes the same way it is done for a tie or slur. Vertical position determined by where the insertion point was before the select, and can be changed in the dialog that pops up after the crescendo command is picked.

Reply 17 offered by: Don Ruckman on 26-Mar-1998

Blair, Selection of notes and initial (verticle)position by where insertion point is before select is fine; are you then assuming the opening of the symbol to always be the same(at beginning or end) which is probably OK. We have all seen cresendos/decresendos with variable openings, depending upon dymanics at start and end. Probably not necessary with dynamics at beginning and end.

I agree, let's get it done.
Don Ruckman ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 18 offered by: Andrew on 26-Mar-1998

I think de/cresc. would fit nicely on top of the select-the-notes-and-add-the-attribute model. Note, though, that a de/cresc. is not really a note attribute like slurs (more like a channel-wide attribute, like volume, though really it affects the velocity of the notedown event), but could be treated as such for ease of use. I'd prefer to do this over - say - dragging the mouse, as horizontal scrolling could become a real nuisance, esp. on the really fast machines.

Andrew


#404: Suggestion for multiple rests
Suggestion for multiple rests

(404)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 08-Jan-1998

Many people (including me) find having to enter multiple
bars with rests inconvenient. I also find it annoying that
a small change can throw off the alignment of lyrics to notes
for the entire score.

A solution for these problems is to provide the ability to
tie a point in the lyrics to a specific note. So, for example,
if the lyrics start 20 bars after the rest of the music, you
would tie the start of the lyrics to the start of bar 21.

A new notation option, similar to text, would let the user
place a non-printing symbol above a note. In the lyric
editor the same symbol would be placed before the the lyric
to be tied. For example, the lyric line might look like

<1> The lyr-ic line...

It would be even better if the symbol was entered by selecting
the symbols entered in the score from a drop list. But this
would be a departure from using a simple edit control for
the lyric editor, with cut & paste problems, etc.

Reply 1 offered by: Roy on 11-Jan-1998

Why not allow some way of specifying the bar number at which
lyrics should start. Maybe via a skip symbol to indicate the
number of bars to skip. This could be entered in the lyrics
in much the same way as the underscore eg 56*_ to indicate
skipping 56 beats before starting the lyrics.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jan-1998

Good idea, and simple to implement. It does not conflict with anchored lyrics, which would be even nicer, but a lot more difficult to implement.


#405: NoteWorthy and Mac/OS
NoteWorthy and Mac/OS

(405)

Submitted by: Richard Blauvelt on 08-Jan-1998

Has any body out there had any success tranfering NWC files
to a Mac environment. I am new to using NoteWorthy and am
hoping that this small set back of a program written exclusively
for Windows has been overcome by someone in the past.
Any success stories out there
Rich

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Jan-1998

NWC files can be made available to a MAC user in one of two ways:

1) Graphically: A digital copy of the printed score can be made available by printing the song to a postscript file, or any other graphic format that can be recognized by the MAC user.

2) Musically: The musical performance can be made available to a variety of computer platforms by exporting the file to MIDI format (the File Export command in NWC). Standard MIDI Files are recognized by most computer music programs across all computer platforms and operating systems. Examples of MIDI files exist everywhere on the web, and the internet and electronic mail are good vehicles for providing a MIDI song to others.

Good luck.

Reply 2 offered by: Matt on 26-Apr-1998

NWC is a great program to use, espically when i have to practice my own music scores, ican make my own so i can practice, now i ca nadd words, now i need to find is a whole list of song it offers to me.


#406: Wish for more objects to be hideable.
Wish for more objects to be hideable.

(406)

Submitted by: Andrew on 08-Jan-1998

I just posted the following to the Wish list and the newsgroup. Wonder what comments you lot have...
=================================
Could the following "controls" also have the hidden attribute, for
a) consistency over all entities
b) better presentation, ie being able to hide effects which use other textual notation, or are an assumed characteristic of an instrument or voice

i) Legato and staccato (and tenuto if it's implemented) performance styles. (PS: There are MANY more phrases one could add here, the list is a little arbitrary, no?)

ii) Clef (so that one can do 8ve changes a little more neatly).

iii) Sustain (for my dulcimers... :)

iv) Tempo Variance (I know this can be put in a conductor track, but whilst we're here...)

v) Dynamic Variance (PLEASE, so we can then use hairpins for cresc. and decresc.)

If NWC is implemented in C++ or some other OO language, it shouldn't be too hard to move the Hidden attribute into them. (Famous last words... :-)
===============================================

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 09-Jan-1998

Fully agree, in fact on the basis that I believe someone (if not Noteworthy) will come up with a wide enough font to use hairpins in v 1.5, I has also requested this for dynamic variance in the wish list.

Happy new year to all out there

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Batchman on 14-Jan-1998

I have no objection, but I'd prefer to ask for what one
really wants - i.e. crescendo/decrescendo hairpins.

Unlike text font fake-outs, real hairpins can extend for
a specified length over the score, so you have finer
control over where the cresc/decresc starts and ends
without having to add hidden dynamic markings.

It would also be nice to have an analogous technique for
ritards and accelerandos (though there's no associated
symbolism for it).

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 15-Jan-1998

"It would also be nice to have an analogous technique for ritards and accelerandos (though there's no associated symbolism for it)."

Yes. Dots... What we really need I guess are
accel...., rit..... and < > where
1) we can specify starting and ending position
2) we can specify starting and ending tempo or velocity.

THAT would be a REAL PLUS.

Andrew


#407: what's grace notes?
what's grace notes?

(407)

Submitted by: Elaine on 08-Jan-1998

could someone plz tell me what's a grace note? I am not good at musical terms in english. thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 08-Jan-1998

There are three types of grace notes.
taken from the italian:

appoggiatura-notation:a reduced size eighth note slurred to a normal size main note-the grace note and the main note are both played in the time allotted to the main note and very strongly slurred--in modern usage the accaciatura takes one half the time
accaciatura-notation:a reduced size eighth note with a slash on the stem slurred to a normal size main note-the grace note and the main note are both played in the time allotted to the main note and very strongly slurred--in modern usage the accaciatura takes one fourth the time
double appoggiatura (appogiatura doppia)-notation:two reduced size eighth notes beamed and slurred to a normal size main note-the grace notes and the main note are all played in the time allotted to the main note and very strongly slurred--in modern usage the double appogiatura takes half the time with the two of equal duration

in most current music the grace note is slurred to the note following, history is not so consistent..

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 09-Jan-1998

But there are other instances of grace notes.
Three grace notes are used by Mozart in his Rondo "Alla Turca" from Sonata XI. Again, they borrow time from the note being "graced".
Liszt, Moussorgsky and Gershwin and many others make huge use of grace notes as leading arpeggios to the "graced" note. These normally end up with the graced note being ON the beat (ie the grace notes borrow from the preceding note).
This is impossible to implement in NWC at the moment without resorting to using an "implementation" stave. ie you have one (mute) staff that looks right, and one messy (hidden) staff that plays right.

So the grace note is in high demand! I wish its implementation was general enough to allow either method scope. However, I understand that it may be very awkward to implement the latter.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Drake Donahue on 09-Jan-1998

.oops..
fourth line in my effort above should have ended
--in modern usage the APPOGGIATURA takes one half the time
sorry

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Crossley on 11-Jan-1998

Grace notes are small notes used to indicate musical embellishments and drawing their rythmic value from the note to which they are attached. See turns, trills, and all the technical terms mentioned above.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jan-1998

I still don't really understand what grace notes are meant
to be. What it means to me is that now I can put little
notes on my score. In vocal music, little notes are used to
fill in extra notes when some lyric lines have more syllables than others, or for optional notes.

Of course, this use violates the intention of grace notes.
(When you add a feature to software, it gets used in ways
the author never intended.) Problems I have are:

1) A grace note entered between two tied notes picks up
the tie. Correct, I suppose, but not what I want.

2) I can add a grace note to a chord, but it does not
display properly. The stem is detached from the note. This
is a bug.

Ideally, I would like to add these little notes and have them ignored except visually. If other vocal music users feel the same way, maybe an option to do this could be added.

Reply 6 offered by: phillipa on 02-Jul-2001

which of the grace notes comes before the beat?
one is played before the note, one is played during the notes' time value
If this makes any sense to anyone, pls reply.


#408: Toooo Staccato?
Toooo Staccato?

(408)

Submitted by: Stephen Randall on 09-Jan-1998

Does anyone else find the staccato produced by NWC a tad on the short side?

My musical dictionary tells me that staccato notes are "detached". As I see it (and play it), the note duration may vary according to context and style. Perhaps I could put a wish forward for variable length staccato i.e. the fraction of a written duration a staccato should be. Options for implementation include:

1 a global definition - i.e. all statccato notes in a file have the same fractional duration which can be specified in a menu somewhere.

2 a marker (style mark?) which can be inserted in the staff to change the fractional duration from that point forwards.

3 definition of more than one staccato style simultaneously (with appropriate notations) to allow staccatissimo and ... (what is it called when you have a staccato dot and a tenuto score on the same note?) and staccato within slurs as well as plain vanilla staccato

Any comments?

Stephen Randall

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 10-Jan-1998

After some exporting and importing (with very high precision on note lengths), I found a quarter note will:

on staccato, come back as a 16th note (ie note's length is quartered)
on slurred staccato, come back as 9/64ths (ie note's length is just over half)

One can also here differences when playing back slurred and unslurred (sounds right to my ears, well for piano, anyway) though import couldn't pick up the difference (maybe that it automatically simplifies what it's reading... I dunno).

I agree, it'd be nice (and I would have thought easy) to make these settings (staccato, staccatissimo and slurred staccato) at least globally definable. Another for the wish list.
I THOUGHT (but can't remember where I read it) that staccato made a note play half its written length.
Anyone know for SURE?

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: PCrossley on 11-Jan-1998

I agree. One composer's staccato is another's detache. The articulation signs often have a meaning known only to the composer. This applies also as you say to tenuto, marcato and sforzando. There needs to be a look-up to tell the computer what each should mean in a given piece of music.

Reply 3 offered by: Kent Dugan on 12-Jan-1998

I think I always learned that staccato called for about half the length of the original note. It was only to be detached. Of course, A string detahced is much longer than a wind instrument, since the decay is longer. Midi staccato is actually short, it seems, which only actually is called for in contemporary music, where, more often than not, it's downright ugly. As well as loud and strident.
The tenuto marking WITH a staccato should make it better, but shouldn't be necessary.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Silverman on 14-Jan-1998

Agreed, I often find staccato is too short. I would like half to three quarters duration but a variable facility would be nice.


#409: Importing recording..... Help!?!?
Importing recording..... Help!?!?

(409)

Submitted by: Kelly Cunningham on 10-Jan-1998

I am attempting to transcribe a jazz trio with rhythm section by Gery Mulligan. Since I am unable to locate a lead sheet or any music whatsoever, I decided to try to take my CD and put in on NWC from there. Is this possible? If so how do I do it? The directions are confusing, and I'm not sure if I can do what I am attempting. I am trying to place the CD in my computer's CD Rom drive and record it from there. Can anyone help me?
Thanks, Kelly

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson on 10-Jan-1998

Sorry, Kelly

NWC will import MIDI files. A CD recording is not a MIDI
file.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 11-Jan-1998

The newsgroup comp.music.midi talks about this a bit (converting sampled music to midi).
I guess it is a little like speech recognition, but I think the general consensus is that it is still in the theoretical stage.
The best way may be to sample it 30seconds at a time, change to half speed, and transcribe it by ear and hand.
Not very helpful, I know, but computers aren't quite THAT smart yet.

I find with transcriptions that sitting at a piano/keyboard and getting the chords first helps immensely.
After that, get the main part of the melody. The improvs you should improvise... ;-)

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Kent Dugan on 15-Jan-1998

Computers may not be that smart, but the Japanese are. They have software which will take a recording of a big band and create all of the parts. It's reputed to run about $20,000. Out of my budget.


#410: Brush Set revisited...
Brush Set revisited...

(410)

Submitted by: Andy Martinez on 10-Jan-1998

Some time ago, I posted a message about accessing the Brush
set on my AWE32. The manual states how 'easy' it is to
select the other GS drum kit mappings, yet I have tried and
tried to no avail. Though I got some suggestions from tech
support and some other gooroos in this forum, I still have
not been able to get any other drum kits to work. Surely
someone out there has an AWE32 (or even AWE64) with some
added DRAM (I have 8mb), is running NoteWorthy Composer,
and has used other drum kits.

If you are out there, please reply to my e-mail address.

Thanks in advance...
Andy

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 11-Jan-1998

Copy of what I sent to Andy (for public interest):
====================
Andy,
It just so happens I am using altenate drum kits with an AWE64 with 4Meg
memory.
Stick to channel 10, but designate a different Patch (instrument).
It's a bit of hit and miss, but the brush set is 41 (Violin).

Andrew
==========================


#411: Stick with NWC or go with Steinberg Cubasis?
Stick with NWC or go with Steinberg Cubasis?

(411)

Submitted by: Chuck on 12-Jan-1998

I am contemplating the purchase of a Yamaha PSR-530 or 630 keyboard. I want to use it for composing.
Yamaha has a special package deal where they will sell me the keyboard, cables, and
Steinberg Cubasis recording and notation software all together.
I have found Noteworthy Composer to be an excellent product for
manually writing music, but how good will it be when I use the
new keyboard? This Yamaha keyboard uses an extension of General Midi,
although they claim it is compatable with General Midi.
I would like to hear from anyone who has had experience
(good or bad) using a Yamaha keyboard to record and produce
notation with Noteworthy Composer.

Reply 1 offered by: Kent Dugan on 12-Jan-1998

As long as it has midi out, you shouldn't have any problem. The bells and whistles added are up to you. I used a junky little thing for awhile. Whatever I played got captured just as my setups told it to. Don't think there are any glaring incompatibilities as long as you've got midi in/out.
Are you looking to capture special features? 128 note chords?

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 13-Jan-1998

Must be my week for coincidences...
I bought a PSR 520 about 10 months ago and am very happy with it.
I used it with Noteworthy (I didn't get the free offer of Cubase, but then again, I may have got it cheaper... :-) for many months until I got my AWE 64 card (I was upgrading my computer, and went the whole hog... ya never know when you'll want to download the midi-sound to replace the one that you can't stand).

Like Kent with his "junky little thing", I could use the keyboard with Noteworthy no problem. I just prefer the method of entering from the computer keyboard. Must be a right brain thing...

Andrew

I think you'll come up against the same limitations with CuBase as with NWC. That of how accurately the software listens to you (which on a fast CPU is VERY accurate) vs. how much you want it to cover up for you.
Why not get Cubase, if it is part of the package? It may help with those nasty little things you need to do.

$64000 question. What are your needs?

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Jan-1998

We have a Yamaha PSR-520, and it works well with most MIDI software, including NWC. On the other side of the spectrum, one of our systems includes an inexpensive MIDI device that gets its power from the sound card, and is MIDI out only. It includes a pitch bend wheel, mod wheel, sustain pedal, and data entry slider. It cost us about $100, allowing us to put more money into a better sound card on that system. In the end, it is all about what you are looking for in a system. If you want to be able to play without your computer powered on, then a stand alone keyboard works well. If you want better sounds from your computer, and only need to use a MIDI keyboard when your computer is on, the money may be better spent on higher quality computer components.

Reply 4 offered by: Greg on 09-Jul-1998

Thanks for the feedback on the PSR620. It was just what I was looking for.


#412: Print Layout
Print Layout

(412)

Submitted by: Wayne Daniel on 13-Jan-1998

Can I change the print layout to 2 half-pages up so that I can enlarge them?
This is in an effort to overcome the non-scaleable lyric font problem.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Jan-1998

What is the "the non-scaleable lyric font problem" that you refer to in your message? As of version 1.50, the lyric font size can be set to whatever you want.

Reply 2 offered by: Wayne Daniel on 13-Jan-1998

Oops!
I was looking at an earlier thread on fonts, and ass-u-me'd they were correct when they said scaling couldn't be done.

Some direction on doing so would be appreciated, as would information on my original print layout question.

Thanks

Reply 3 offered by: Keith on 14-Jan-1998

I have found it quite workable to 'copy' from the print preview (to clipboard) and put in a DTP program where it is easily scalable. I use Pagemaker 6.5 and it needs to be in Windows Metafile format.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 15-Jan-1998

Try ClickBook which is available in demo form on the web and costs about $40.

It intercepts the print stream and scales and puts the pages into booklet form in lots of different ways.

I print all my stuff on double sided A3 with two pages of music to a side and that works very well.

Reply 5 offered by: Wayne Daniel on 22-Jan-1998

Thanks for your comments. A helpful lady @ NoteWorthy clued me in that I had the wrong version. After downloading again to get V 1.5, I saw that it actually does have good fonts for lyrics, staff notes, etc.


#413: Noteworthy areas on AOL
Noteworthy areas on AOL

(413)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 14-Jan-1998

Under the aol members page there are indications of storage areas for NWC files that only aol members can access.

Can anyone tell me - what are these and can they be downloaded from an ftp address by non aol mortals ?

There seem to be two areas that caught my attention - NoteWorthy Composer file area and NoteWorthy Composer Songs.

Why is it that only aol members should have this facility - what about the rest of us ?

Richard

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jan-1998

The areas on AOL belong to AOL. As a provider of service, they have chosen to only allow their subscribers to have access to their areas. They provide a whole music and sound area, including proprietary music files, such as those developed by users of NWC. AOL develops and makes this area available. AOL is responsible for its content. It is not related to NoteWorthy ArtWare, Inc. in any way.


#414: meter conversion
meter conversion

(414)

Submitted by: Rich on 14-Jan-1998

Does any one know of an easy way to convert all of the
notes in a manuscript to match a changed time signature.
If a piece is originally written in 4/4 time and is then
changed to 4/8 time is there a global command to change
all 1/4 notes to 1/8 notes and all 1/8 notes to 1/16 notes
etc. Thanks for any input on this question.
Rich

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jan-1998

This kind of facility is not currently available in NWC. You can try to export to MIDI and then halve the note lengths, but this is the only approach that I can think of that might automate this task.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 29-Oct-2001

just thought you'd be pleased to know that it's now (since version 1.55??) feasible: select the part you want to "double" or "halve" and press "+" or "-".

Be careful to where wholes are when using "+" though. They need to be manually doubled.

And don't forget to modify the time signature :)

HTH!


#415: Can you combine rests?
Can you combine rests?

(415)

Submitted by: Joe Eidson on 14-Jan-1998

I have an arrangement that has a lot of rests in a few
parts, and it looks ugly to have like 3 lines of whole
rests. Is there any way to combine the rests so it is one
measure with a # on top of it?
Thanks.
Joe

Reply 1 offered by: Gord on 14-Jan-1998

This is only possible by making the bar a repeat bar and adding a number on top. The facility you mention has been much requested. Add it to the wishlist. The more requests for it, the sooner we will see it incorporated in NWC. It is possible. Passport Encore uses it.
Gord.

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 14-Jan-1998

insert
decorated bar line
local repeat open
ok
select whole note
insert rest
insert
decorated bar line
local repeat close
set number 2 to 200
ok

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Jan-1998

Multi bar rests are my most wished for feature.
There is nothing worse than an arrangement with heaps of empty bars.
I've tried all the work arounds and they are either ugly - an obvious work-around - or they upset the bar numbering.
Multi bar rests are standard notation and should be implemented.
It seems that not enough people add this feature to the wish list - I guess they dont print out parts.
I really like NWC and promote it among all my musical contacts - but the lack of this feature above all else defeats my efforts to encourage musicians to use the software.

Reply 4 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 25-Feb-1998

My most wished-for feature, too, though closely followed by
grace notes for cues: I use NoteWorthy mostly for making four-
or five-part transcriptions, which I always hand over as score
plus parts.

An earlier thread pointed out that you also need to be able
to chunk (say) twelve bars' rest into four plus twelve if
you want to use section letters for navigation.

Eric - spring into action!

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Randall on 26-Feb-1998

Yes, chunking multi-bar rests would be a good feature. However, when you start looking at how it would actually be implemented it gets rather complicated and there is plenty of scope to get it wrong. I suggest that following areas need thinking about:

1 Chunking is not needed for scores. It is only required for indviidual parts. Therefore sometimes the rests should be chunked and sometimes unchunked. How should the change from unchunked to chunked and vice versa be controlled?

2 Should areas for chunking be identified automatically or by the user? If rests have to chunked manually when swapping between displaying a score and displaying an individual part, this offers little benefit over the current situation - except that perhaps the bar numbering could be sorted out.

3 If rests get chunked automatically - for example when printing or displaying an indivdual part - controls need to be included to allow the chunks to be split up to allow rehearsal marks to be added at strategic points.

4 Special treatment is required for individual parts with more than one staff - for example piano parts - where there may be multi-bar rests in left or right hand only or both. Only the sections where both hands are resting need to be chunked.

5 It would be nice to have a (variable?) lower limit on the number of bars to chunk - I sometimes prefer to see two bars full of rests than one two-bar rest.

How does Passport Encore handle these items?

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Feb-1998

Would it be sufficient to have as a Staff Property "Suppress Line if Empty"? By "line" I mean a line in the printout. If this was set, any line that contained nothing but rests would not be printed. Any notation (rehearsal mark) would prevent the line from being suppressed. Display would not be affected. Of course, you still have to enter all the rests by hand. Piano parts could be handled if both piano staves are marked - suppress both, not one, only if both are empty.

Reply 7 offered by: Stephen Randall on 26-Feb-1998

Just deleting "empty" lines would be a disaster! The rest bars which are removed need to be counted and then replaced with a bar containing one rest and an appropriate number.

I need the numbers so that when I'm sitting cuddling my tuba going one hundred and twenty seven - two - three - four, I know when I've forgotten to come in.

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Feb-1998

I was assuming there were multiple staves, and the goal was to reduce wasted printed space. You know when to come back in by looking at the other staves.

It sounds you have only your tuba music. We need another solution for that. Is there some standard notation for multiple rests? Does the trick with local repeats suggested above work?

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Feb-1998

There are two issues when a particular player or instrument has a long silence period:

1 - The individual player would rather see an abbreviated notation for the silent period, typically in the form of a multi-measure rest.

2 - The conductor does not want to see a staff for an instrument that is not playing, so it should drop out.

We understand both of these needs, but at the moment, neither are natively supported in NWC. You can build a fake multi-measure rest for an individual part, and you can construct complex score views using the Preview Copy feature, but these are just work arounds. If and when we natively support the rest, we will let you know here at this web site.

Reply 10 offered by: Valerie Bradley on 27-May-1998

First of all, I must praise this software. It is so simple to use and the printouts are lovely! But I would also like to add to the wish list the ability to have multibar rests. My primary use for this is to take marching band and/or concert band parts that have been Xeroxed too many times or have been copied by hand and are thus illegible, and "rewriting" them so they're legible again. I don't use the MIDI function, yet. :)

I thought of a semi-workaround in the mean time... I place a whole rest on the staff and then use Insert Text to place a number above it. Granted, it's not the most beautiful solution and it doesn't preserve the measure numbering correctly, but it seems to get the message across to the players.

Reply 11 offered by: Mark Davey on 17-Jan-2002

In Encore 3 and ( I assume ) above, just select the empty bars you want to chunk together, choose the "Measures" menu,choose "Compressed rests" and there you are!
Or have I missed a point somewhere?
Obviously, this only works on individual parts, not really in scores...........

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 17-Jan-2002

Yes, now you can avoid empty (rests?) measures, have a look at the thread 2366 ("Multiple bars with rests"), particularly from msg #2366 (reply 2) :)

HTH!

P.S. Available for multi-staves also, provided that the "rests mesaures" are vertically aligned :)


#417: 3 Note Chords to 3 Tracks
3 Note Chords to 3 Tracks

(417)

Submitted by: D & W on 14-Jan-1998

I have recorded a track using at most 3 note chords, (the violins) and I need to split the track into 3, where there is one note at a time. How do I do it?
The reason why I record the 1st, 2nd & 3rd violin tracks together is so they all play in sync. (but I cannot split them)
If you can help me I'd absolutely love it!

Thankyou.

Reply 1 offered by: John Taylor on 15-Jan-1998

With a three note cord, try this.
Enter the second and third parts on their own staff before you do any thing else. That finished, make the staff with the three part cords the active staff. Place the cursor to the RIGHT of the cord and with the arrow keys, move the cursor to the same line as the note you wish to remove. With the cursor on the same line and to the RIGHT of the note to be removed, hold the control key down and press the back space key. If you delete the entire triad you didnot have the control key down. If nothing happens, the cursor is not in the correct position. If you delete a triad by mistake, use the undelete feature in the Edit menu. Remember, the deletes are held in a lifo stack and you can go back, oh I don't remember for sure, maybe as far back as the last fifty deletes. Good Look!

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1998

D&W,
I think this is not implemented yet. May be you could add it in the wishlist, some wishes do come true :-)
John,
just some precisions : the "lifo stack" can be up to 99 items long. By item I mean a single note action (adding, lifting, ...) or even "Tools/Audit Bar Lines" action or such.
This (the stack depth) is set up in the Options window.
By the way, Alt+Backspace (which is the standard since the 1st 'Windows') is quicker than Edit/Undo ... You can use Ctrl-Z also. refer to keyboard reference in the online help.
To "undo the undo", use Ctrl-Y (not the same usage as repeated F4 in Word/XL for instance)

P.S. LIFO: Last In First Out. Also called a pile (of dishes or whatever)

MAD


#418: ornaments in NoteWorthy Composer
ornaments in NoteWorthy Composer

(418)

Submitted by: Anne Dubrofsky on 15-Jan-1998

Now that we can select the fonts at will, I discovered that it is possible to use the Bach font to add ornaments such as mordents, turns, Schleifers etc to the score. I selected Bach as the font of choice for Staff Italic. The font uses the alt key and the number pad for the symbols, as well as offering a normal querty keyboard. The font can be downloaded from winsite and simtelnet archives.

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 16-Jan-1998

Where do I find winsite and simtelnet archives?

Reply 2 offered by: Tom Chamberlain on 16-Jan-1998

You can find the Bach font at
http://www.winsite.com/info/pc/win3/fonts/bach30pc.zip/

Reply 3 offered by: Marcel Bock on 19-Jan-1998

In the same manner you can, now, use the MusicalSymbol font
built in NWC to bypass the limitations of NWC in writing
chords with rests, or chords where the note sung by the
lower voice is higher than the note sung by the higher
voice. You just have to find the ASCII code corresponding to
each note or musical sign by using a program like Word.
This ASCII codes should be available in NWC help files; I
put this query in NWC wish list.
To add notes as text it's preferable to use the font
built in NWC, rather than the Bach font, as the notes
of the built in font are exactly similar to those written
by NWC (of course).

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Jan-1998

Nice trick. But you can then forget about putting regular text above the lyric line.

We need a text font with music symbols added in as special characters. Especially a selection of < and > crescendo and decrescendo ("hairpin") symbols.


#419: groupings other than triplets
groupings other than triplets

(419)

Submitted by: Anne Dubrofsky on 15-Jan-1998

Is there a way to produce groupings other than triplets in NWC? For example, I need to bracket 7- 16th notes as one beat, and have NWC accept this.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jan-1998

NWC only allows grouping of triplets. Other groupings are not currently supported.

Reply 2 offered by: kent dugan on 15-Jan-1998

You can group them as far as barring, but you can't associate them to a number. If they are 16th notes, then 7 of them will occupy the real-time space of 7 16th notes, or 1 3/4 beats. If you have another stave in the same music, then the bars lines will not line up because of this. If you print parts, then manually add the 7 above the grouping, and it will look OK.
In fact, you can add text above the grouping to include the "7". You'll have to play with it to get the height right.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 16-Jan-1998

One (not very good) way around this problem is to divide the beat into two halves and have 4 1/32 notes in the first half beat followed by 3 triplet 1/32 notes in the second half beat - or vice versa. I'm not used to the half, quarter etc terminology having been brought up on good old british minims, crotchets and quavers (not to mention pounds shilling and pence; stones, pounds and ounces; miles, furlongs and chains etc.) so I may have got the note lengths wrong. Anyway, I hope you get the idea. It sounds OK in some circumstances and is playable.

I think that implementation of n-tuplets ought to go top of the list for addiing to version 1.5+.

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 16-Jan-1998

Yes, yes, yes!!!

I have on score I am itching to enter which has groupings of
4, 5, 6 and 7. Another has 2 (duplets?)

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew P on 18-Jan-1998

Duplets in triple or six time can be emulated by using dotted notes.
Not exactly what we want, but actually very logical, and not too hard to read.

A

Reply 6 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 19-Jan-1998

That's what I've done, I'm just unhappy--no, to strong--slightly bothered, that I can't replicate the original score.
I really do love NWC, I just want it to be perfect.

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Brangwin on 28-Jan-1998

Most of the sollutions that have been presented so far have dealt with writting a score. If you wish to get NWC to play these brackets then you will have to play with he tempo and time signiture. It takes a little math but it is possible.


#420: flexible location of a rest
flexible location of a rest

(420)

Submitted by: Elaine Au on 17-Jan-1998

I encountered problem with rest again. I think it's better to have the flexibility to place a rest, especially when I want the left hand to play from the lower staff to the upper (also the right hand to play the lower staff, etc). I always ended up the number of beats on the upper staff not meeting the lower staff due to the location of the rest.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Jan-1998

At the moment, NWC does not allow you to specify the vertical position of a rest. If combined with a note into a chord, the rest will be moved as necessary, but this is an automatic feature.

In piano parts, it is important to note that NWC treats the two staves separately. Each staff should be written such that each vertically aligned measure has equal time values.

Reply 2 offered by: Eric Black on 22-Feb-1998

Regarding the fact that NWC treats the two staves of a piano part seperately: it would be great if it didn't. A great deal of piano music is unnecessarily cluttered. If you're playing something in the right hand while the left hand remains silent, you would have to notate a lot of rests for the left hand. Leaving the left hand staff blank seems to be a convention that I have seen in some modern printed music.
<P>Also, the ability of notes in a piano part to be bracketed across the top and bottom staves is one that NoteWorthy Composer does not support but would be helpful in creating readable piano parts.


#421: MIDI Playback
MIDI Playback

(421)

Submitted by: Linda Roy on 18-Jan-1998

I'm having a problem getting my Yamaha PSR-220 keyboard to playback a NWC song. I used to be able to do it, but have since had to re-install Windows 95 because of another problem. Any ideas!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 18-Jan-1998

Will your keyboard playback ANY midi files?
Try playing Canyon.mid, or something, through Mplayer and see what happens.
Most likely problem is simply a configuration thing on your midi playback.
Check Control Panel's Multimedia | Midi settings,
and NWC's Midi options.

Actually the most likely problem is the cables being plugged incorrectly. It gets me every time. ;-)

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Jan-1998

You may have to reinstall your soundcard software as well. If your sound works, then stops working after installing or reinstalling Win 95, the fix is almost always to reinstall the soundcard drivers from the soundcard's setup diskette or CD.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 19-Jan-1998

or from new drivers from their website.

Reply 4 offered by: Bryan A. Pringles on 17-Jun-1998

I need the midi drivers for the Magicwave 32 Voice wavetable audio DR-SW801

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 18-Jun-1998

Have you tried http://www.altavista.digital.com/cgi-bin/query?pg=q&kl=XX&q=%2Bmagicwave+%2Bwavetable ?

A

Reply 6 offered by: chelsey on 02-Aug-1998

I need help! I cannot play any midi related sounds...
I have tried uninstalling and re-installing the sound card,
but that didn't work! My sound card is an opti, but i get
nowhere at their site any ideas?

Reply 7 offered by: Cecile on 09-Nov-1999

Help... I don't know what to do. I can play midi and wave files but I am unable to play songs that I write and record. What do I do?

Reply 8 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 09-Nov-1999

Chelsey - Have you tried to see if Canyon.mid will play?
Try double clicking on it from My Computer.

Cecile - Have a look at Tools Options Midi and change the right hand window. Make sure that it has only Midi Mapper in.

Failing that try an option from the left hand window that has FM in the title.

Rich

Reply 9 offered by: Brett Hope on 10-Nov-1999

Could it be something as simple as you have MIDI sound muted? Go to the system "Settings" then to "Multimedia". On the left-most tab, labeled "Audio" is a little speaker, and a box to check if you want these settings to appear on your system toolbar. Check this box, and the little speaker will appear on your tool bar all the time.

Double click (be sure to double click) the little speaker, and a screen will come that enables you to set volume control for a number of audio options, including MIDI. Be sure the "Mute" box under MIDI is not checked, and that the volume is set properly.

Reply 10 offered by: Fox Palmer on 24-Nov-1999

All of you dont seem to know how to solve a problem as complex as I will be giving... I have the yamaha psr 220 and a soundblaster live. I also have midisoft recording session and cakewalk 5.0. My keyboard does not respond to my pc in any way what so ever. Yes the in is in and the out is out. I have added the external midi device in my sound card configuration. I feel that the problem rests whithin the keyboard its self... Any sugestions? Fox Palmer

Reply 11 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Nov-1999

"In is In and Out is Out"
But in and out of where?

The cable marked 'In' means into the computer and should plug into your keyboard midi-OUT.

The cable marked 'Out' means out of the computer and should plug into your keyboard midi-IN.

If that's how your set up then I'm sorry I've told what you already know.

Reply 12 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Nov-1999

Usually, this failure is a result of one of the following, in order of most to least likely:

- input/output crossed at the keyboard end
- improper MIDI input driver setup on the computer
- faulty MIDI cable
- faulty port on the sound card (some sound cards fail to support MIDI input right out of the box)
- faulty keyboard

Your best bet is to separate your components and test them individually until you locate the fault. Test the keyboard, computer, and cable separately with other MIDI hardware that is known to work.

You might want to add NoteWorthy Composer to your list of apps that you use, as well.

Reply 13 offered by: Giulio on 24-Dec-1999

What do you mean as 'improper MIDI Input driver setup' ? How can I setup a Midi input driver ?

Thanks in advance
Giulio

Reply 14 offered by: John on 30-Jan-2000

Is there a step by step resource for configuring the Yamaha PSR-220 keyboard into a win 95 box.

Have played abit with Midi settings in Control Panel =>Multimedia

Individually each works fine, wires correctly attached, but can't record to Micrsoft default recorder.

PS => Not planning on being a PSR expert or Midi freak. Just need to sample a couple notes.

Many Thanks

John


#422: Staves Covering Text
Staves Covering Text

(422)

Submitted by: David on 18-Jan-1998

Dear Friends,

I printed out a score with fifteen staves in landscape mode, and the copyright text at the bottom, my name, and the title was covered up by the staves.
It's probably my fault that all the text is covered by the staves (because of the number of staves) but there is enough space for them to printed.
Can you see a quick fix?
I'm using version 1.50.
(the staves were printed in size 11 - any smaller would be too little)

Your useful feedback would be loved.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Jan-1998

This indicates that you are trying to print more than will fit on a page. You have several choices:

- reduce the staff point size (from File Page Setup)

- reduce the veryical size of one or more staves (Staff Properties)

- reduce the size or turn off the title page info (this may make enough room, depending on how close you are to making it all fit)

Reply 2 offered by: Anne Dubrofsky on 29-Jan-1998

You can also try printing on legal size sheets. I did this recently. I set the lower margin for 1 inch to 1.5 inches, so that the final copy was actually in a space of 8.5 in x 12 in, instead of 8.5 x 11 in. The extra inch gave me the needed room, while the page was not too tall for my taste. Clearly, if you enjoy legal size, go ahead and take advantage of the extra space. You can adjust the ultimate length to suit your own needs.


#423: Beaming problems.
Beaming problems.

(423)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 19-Jan-1998

Last month, I:
1) bought a new computer
2) changed from Windows 3.11 to Windows 95
3) changed from NoteWorthy 1.31 to NoteWorthy 1.50 beta

I noticed an old beaming problem that still exists, and
also a new problem.

1) The old problem.
Several months ago, the default stem direction for notes
on the third line on the staff changed from "up" to "down".
This is ok for notes that are not beamed together. But
when we beam them, the default changes and the stem goes up.
This is also the case if you have for instance in Treble
Clef: C B A B. While not beamed, only the A has stem up,
but when beamed they all go up instead of going down.

2) The new problem.
I have two beamed notes, with stem down. I make a chord
on one note, at the same pitch, but with stem up. Suddendly,
the "beam" goes up, whilst the note figure stays to the
right of the stem... very strange!

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jan-1998

Another beaming problem: If I try to insert text (or anything else) between beamed notes, they become un-beamed. This is a real problem when I want to do piano fingering. I want to put a number above each note, but I can't do it. Grouping the numbers before the beamed group does not work well because they do not print out above the notes they are supposed to with out a lot of fiddling.

Even better (here comes another wish) would be direct support for fingering. Select a note and request the fingering option, and the number would be placed above the note. Multiple numbers would be stacked vertically above a chord.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 20-Jan-1998

I just noticed yesterday that the non-beta 1.50 version
was available. I tried it, and I was happy to see that the
"old" problem has disappeared.

Nevertheless, there is still a problem when we try to do
the second thing.

Reply 3 offered by: Ray Pepalis on 20-Jan-1998

I enter fingering notations for guitar as follows:
First, complete the composition, perform all staff adjustments, page layout, staff sizing, margins etc.
Next, use "Insert Text", be sure to uncheck "Preserve Width"
Place the blinking cursor to the left of the beamed note group, and type in a sufficient number of spaces prior to the fingering number to allow the insertion in the proper place within the field of the beamed note group. With a little practice, you may find that it works pretty well.
Be warned that any changes to margins, page layout, staff etc. after you enter fingerings - will probably change the location of your fingering notations.

Reply 4 offered by: Martin Cassell on 16-Feb-1998

Not so much a problem, more a case of new expectations being raised by new features.
Grace notes are wonderful and I've already made good use of them since installing version 1.5. There are many cases where I would like to indicate ornamentation with one or more grace notes, and have to sacrifice beaming groups of quavers (eighth notes) in order to do so. Ideally it would also be possible to beam a group of grace notes independently, even in between two beamed notes.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Feb-1998

> I have two beamed notes, with stem down. I make a chord
> on one note, at the same pitch, but with stem up.

This is a gray area in NWC at the moment, since it only allows a beam on (by its own definition) the lesser duration in a split chord. You can, at the moment, get around this by adding all three notes first, with the stem down property set for the lone note (not in a chord). If you select the pair and add the beam you can avoid the problem that you describe. You can also audit Note Stems to correct, but you may not get the result that you intended (the beam may end up with stem up).

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Feb-1998

One more point: The exact behaviour that you describe in point 2 will be corrected in version 1.50b. Look for it by the end of the month, 28-Feb-1998 or so.

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Feb-1998

Version 1.50b is available now. Goto http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/upgnwc.htm to get it.


#424: Control on printing.
Control on printing.

(424)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 19-Jan-1998

I thought that 1.50 version fixed MY greatest problem,
but I can't find how. Maybe I misunderstood the sentences
that dealt with print mechanism because of my bad command
of english language.

What I need is to be able to reject one or more measures
to the next system when printing. This is very similar
to the possibility in a word processor to add a "line
break" or "page break" where we want, when printing.

Also, when I choose "extend last system", I would like
that the measures of the last system be proportionally
spaced, instead of simply adding a big space to the last
measure.

Do these features belong to NoteWorthy 1.50, or shall I add
them to the wish list ?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 19-Jan-1998

I think you need to add them to the wish list. Total control over the print position of a bar is a big wish, and many of us would like to have this feature.
As far as the last item is concerned, may I suggest that you check via the print preview to see how many bars (measures) are on the last line of music and then prgressively add a space to each measure in turn until the desired effect is obtained.

Do you understand what I mean ?

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 20-Jan-1998

All right, I will add them to the wish list.

About your proposal, I also supposed that I could do as
you suggest, but it would be too much pain. I will try
to live with a ugly last "bar" (thank you also for the
translation!) until a new version fixes it.

Many thanks for your reply.

Olivier.

Reply 3 offered by: John Irwin on 20-Jan-1998

I recently asked for a similar function that would be very
comparable to a paragraph break in a word processor. Our
band plays a lot of medleys, and I would like to be able to
start each successive song on a new staff while still keeping
the medleys as a single edited file. I added this request
to the wish list some time ago.

It would seem that this would not be terribly hard to add
to the program. The main problem, it seems, would be to
choose and display a representation in the editor to mark
the break point on the continuous editor staff.

Reply 4 offered by: Kent Dugan on 20-Jan-1998

As far as one or two last measures on a page, It's kind of a pain, but I'll adjust the page font to either make that bar creep back to the previous page, or extend more bars to the last page. It's not pretty. And it's a pain when you have 15 to 20 parts, all with a different number of measures.
Also, the page size is not saved (or wasn't in release 1.31.


#425: Lyric Editor
Lyric Editor

(425)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jan-1998

When the lyric editor is opened, or a new tab is selected, focus should be set to the lyric edit control. The first time I click on a lyric nothing seems to happen (really focus is being set to the edit control).

Even better, it would be nice if each lyric tab remembered where the insertion point was the last time it was used.

Better still (yes, another wish) if the editor would place the insertion point at the same place that I am working at on the staff. It can be hard to find the right place, especially with repetitive lyrics.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Jan-1998

The lyric configuration tab control accepts the focus like any other control in the dialog box. YOu must move the focus to the edit control when working with any of the lyric lines. You can do this either with the mouse or by pressing the Tab key.

Reply 2 offered by: Marwin on 26-Apr-1998

Hello all together,
I need the lyrics to -IF YOU KNEW ME BETTER-
from Head East !
Who can help me ?

Reply 3 offered by: Amanda Hawkins on 27-Apr-1998

Hello,
I would like to request the lyrics to -
"I Know The Master of The Wind"
Thank you.
Amanda

Reply 4 offered by: Scott Smith on 29-Apr-1998

Putting the cursor at the same position in the lyric editor as the cursor in the staff would be good. However, I believe the ability to edit the lyric directly in the staff would be even better.

Wish, wish, wish...

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 29-Apr-1998

Not sure. This would not be "clean" to edit lyrics onto the staves.
But when switching to Lyrics (^L), what a great improvement it would be to have the cursor just at the matching position of the note cursor in the staff...

Wish again...

Reply 6 offered by: Catherine  on 15-Aug-1998

I need the lyrics to Money A'int A Thang

Reply 7 offered by: Trena on 21-Aug-1998

I am trying to find lyrics to songs that were sung to me as a child. "Down In the Valley"

Reply 8 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 24-Aug-1998

Catherine and Trena,

This was not the original subject of this thread, and I
think you shouldn't get responses to your requests in
this forum. Better try http://www.lyrics.com/

Regards,
Olivier.

Reply 9 offered by: Paul on 26-Aug-1998

Another good source is

http://www.lyrics.ch/

Reply 10 offered by: Tammy Craney on 26-Aug-1998

I need the lyric to Have you ever By Brandy and monica

Reply 11 offered by: Olivier on 02-Sep-1998

Same response as before...

Reply 12 offered by: jaylen on 29-Dec-1999

I'm trying to find lyrics to Angie Stone New song "Nomore rain in this Cloud"

Reply 13 offered by: chelsy on 23-Jan-2000

hello
iwould like to know the song lyrics to santa lucia
thank you

Reply 14 offered by: Kimberly Jones  on 27-Jan-2000

I would like to where can i find the lyric to angie stone song no more rain in this cloud can anyone help me with that song please e-mail the lyrics

Reply 15 offered by: Annette Ratliff on 01-Mar-2000

I need the lyrics to "No More Rain" by Angie Stone.
Who can help me?

Reply 16 offered by: Peter Vasey on 06-Mar-2000

Back to the original subject. I seem to recall in the dim and distant past of version 1.3 that on entering the lyric editor, the first click positioned the cursor at the mouse position. The current version needs two clicks, and I have more than once overwritten existing text when working quickly - thank goodness for undo. But is my memory playing tricks or does the new (beta) version correct this again? And if this is being worked on, why not incorporate an optional link to the staff cursor position as suggested, before the beta is finalised. Or is this too difficult to program - there's a challenge for the powers that be.

Reply 17 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Mar-2000

Yes. I was often annoyed by the mouse behaviour in 1.55b, but that having-to-doubleclick thing is gone in 1.70. (Thank goodness!) :)

Reply 18 offered by: marsu on 10-Mar-2000

hey, this means I'll have to change some macros :-)
But anyway it's much better.
btw, the refresh of the score is better either (no back-to-start any more)

Reply 19 offered by: Annette Ratliff on 25-Mar-2000

I would like to know the lyrics to "Left, Right, Left" by the group called Drama.

Reply 20 offered by: Mesha on 26-Apr-2000

I WOULD LIKE THE LYRICS TO ANGIE STONE "COULD OF BEEN YOU". CAN SOMEONE HELP??????

Reply 21 offered by: Tina Castellanos on 28-May-2000

Hi I would really like it if I can get the lyrics to Drama "Left Right Left" and Trick Daddy "Shut Up"!!! PLEASE HELP
Thank you.

Reply 22 offered by: Kari on 06-Jun-2000

I need the lyrics to Drama "Left Right Left". Can someone peaz help??? Thanx!

Reply 23 offered by: Denise on 05-Aug-2000

i don't know if anyone can help me with this or not...but does anyone know what the name of the song is and who its by that goes "so look around your world pretty baby is it everything you hoped it would be, the wrong guy the wrong situation, the right time to roll to me" please help!! thanks :)

Reply 24 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Aug-2000

For all your lyrics try:-
http://lyrics.natalnet.com.br/summer.html
Search by Title, Artist or Phrase

Reply 25 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Aug-2000

Here's another lyrics resource:

http://www.karaokevision.com/pages/3_Lyrics/

Reply 26 offered by: Karnelly jnr. on 07-Aug-2000

Greetings punks!
For your guys and chicks who are writing songs please stop by the rec.music.makers.songwriting newsgroup. Share your work there and we'll get more songwriters using Noteworthy. I reckon this is the best program for notating songs - who feels the same way? You can also access the songwriting newsgroup through deja.com. http://www.deja.com/usenet
Just wanted to share this with you all.
Cheers, and may songs flow from your hearts like wine.
Karnelly jnr.


#426: Print Preview and Zooming
Print Preview and Zooming

(426)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jan-1998

Print preview is much improved in 1.5! I like zooming by left or right clicking on the view. But it would be nicer if it would zoom centered around the place I click rather than reset the scrolling position to the top left corner. I try to zoom to get a closer look at something, and it disappears from view.

Another little thing, it would be nice to access print preview from the print dialog as well.

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 19-Jan-1998

"it would be nice to access print preview from the print dialog as well."

Right! It was possible in previous version. I agree that it
is great to have Print Preview from Page Setup, but it would
be even greater to have it in both places (Page Setup -and-
Print Dialog).

Reply 2 offered by: bruce marcot on 19-Jan-1998

Another print preview wish: I work in 1024x768, and when
I zoom into a Print Preview page it doesn't fill up the
screen; instead, I have to scroll right and left. It should
fill the screen at any resolution. A wish-list item? Or
is there a fix?

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jan-1998

You want a sizable dialog for print preview. And maybe for the lyric editor as well.

Reply 4 offered by: Michael Pena on 05-May-1998

To whom ever get's this message,

I don't know where I'm at right now, but if this has anything to do with satellites,

I would like for you to reply with info. on how to zoom in from satellites like they do

on movie like Men in Black, etc. THANKS


#427: Editing non-preserved width text, etc.
Editing non-preserved width text, etc.

(427)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jan-1998

If I preserve width, I can select and edit text, etc. with Ctrl-E. If width is not preserved (which I always do), there does not seem to be a way for me to selected the text.

Also, it would be nice if selected text (etc.) could be moved using Ctrl-Shift-arrow, just like notes can.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 19-Jan-1998

With width preserved you can highlight the text and use CTRL-E
When the width is not preserved, you will see a little diamond to the left of the text.
If you highlight this diamond and then use CTRL-E all will be ok and you will be in edit mode for the text next to the diamond.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Jan-1998

Thank you! And I can move the text position with the spin control. This problem is solved.


#428: Printing Bug???
Printing Bug???

(428)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jan-1998

Sometimes when I print the notes come out as large letters. It looks like the wrong font gets loaded. The only happens when I print a number of songs in quick succession.

Anybody else notice this?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Jan-1998

Do you have any other information about this? What kind of system are you using? When does it happen? Are other apps running? What kind of printer is it? Can it be reproduced at will? Any other info would be a great help.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Jan-1998

I am running on NT, and printing over a network. Lots of other apps are running (MS Word, Visual Studio, Microsoft Exchange, etc.) I don't think it can be reproduced easily. I just noticed that it happened (three times) only when I was printing several songs in quick succession.

I know this isn't much to go on. If it keeps happening to me I will let you know. I just wanted to know if anyone else had this problem.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Jan-1998

I can reproduce this bug every time now.
On NT, load up two songs into memory. Print one, then as
soon as possible print the other. The second song always
has the wrong font used to draw the notes. A large Arial
font is used instead. For example, a quarter note is
printed as a lower case "k", which is almost the height
of the staff.

The workaround is easy - wait between printing.


#429: NoteWorthy Player 1.5
NoteWorthy Player 1.5

(429)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 21-Jan-1998

Great to get the version 1.5 compatible NoteWorthy Player.
This useful program doesn't get much of a mention in this forum so here is a wish that I am posting to the wish list.

It would be great if Noteworthy Player could accept a 'Play list' and automatically cycle through the list.

What's the view out there ?

Richard

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Jan-1998

It is nice to have a player that can play my new files. Also one that deals with crescendos properly (been a long time... ;-)
I normally use NWC to play things on my machine, and suggest to users that they download Noteworthy Player if they don't have NWC.
It can be configured as a helper application in netscape, which is sort of neat. Be nice to have it as a plug in... then we could do karaoke web pages!!!

Playlist could be retrofitted from the commandline p'raps?
Otherwise it becomes a pain to handle.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Jan-1998

Unfortunately, the new Noteworthy Player does not make any sound for me on Windows NT. NWC works fine on NT, and so did the old player. The new player also works fine on the same machine under Win 95.

Is this a general problem, or is it just my system?

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Jan-1998

I reported this problem, and they acknowledge I am not the only one. Guess its a bug.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Jan-1998

This is a bug. I have posted a fix for the Windows NT problem on our newsgroup. It will also appear on our web site in the next several days.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Jan-1998

I picked up the fix. It works. Thank you.

Reply 6 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 23-Jan-1998

I have just discovered what appears to be an undocumented 'funny' between NoteWorthy Composer and NoteWorthy Player.

If in the Composer, you define a group as Hidden in page setup, Noteworthy Player will totally ignore this UNLESS the group NAME is also called 'Hidden'

Also funnily enough, if the group name is Hidden BUT it is not defined as hidden in the page set up, the group is still invisible to NoteWorthy Player.

Summary -

If you want to stop noteworthy Player from displaying a group, just call it 'Hidden' - you don't need to worry about page set up.

Richard

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Jan-1998

The "Hidden" feature is covered in detail in the help for authors in the NoteWorthy Player package.

Reply 8 offered by: Richard W on 25-Jan-1998

Sorry, I was looking for it in the Composer help file !!!!

Richard

Reply 9 offered by: snedegar on 27-Jan-1998

Funny, I'm just looking for a way to play ONE song and don't
have the command line options. Someone wants to play a list
of them, and I think that's great, but could we just get one
song going first?

Reply 10 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 11-Mar-1998

Just to update you on the very first item, I have just downloaded a shareware windows command line processor which has enabled me to get the same effect as if NWP had a play list.
The command line processor is available from www.simtel.net/simtel.net and the filename is wcl810.zip. The processor works in 16 and 32 bit modes.
What it enables you to do is to enter a list into a sort of batch file. If the list takes the form of ..

ew c:\path\nwplayer c:\path\music1.nwc /play /close
ew c:\path\nwplayer c:\path\music1.nwc /play /close
etc.

for however many nwc files you want to play. You therefore effectively have your play list.
The EW stands for ExecWait which instructs the processor to wait until the current command is finished before going onto the next command.

The “/play”and “/close” force NoteWorthy Player to automatically play and then close down when finished.
(In order for this to work, the autoplay setting within NoteWorthy Player should NOT be selected and there should be NO file association linking NWC files to NoteWorthy Player.
In all probability, the file association will be pointing to NoteWorthy Composer anyway).

I shall be testing this out further over the next few days before deciding if to purchase a license. Of course the better approach would be for NWP to have a play list (sorry snedegar!) but in the absence of this functionality .....

If anyone else has a go at this, let the forum know how you get on.

Richard

Reply 11 offered by: Andrew on 11-Mar-1998

Have you tried using a DOS batch file? They're FREE!
In Win 95 (and most likely WinNT), you can execute Windows programs from DOS commands. However, I'm not sure if there is a way to wait for the program to finish (it does wait until the program has finished its initialisation before moving on).

A

Reply 12 offered by: Richard on 11-Mar-1998

You put your finger on it - it will not wait until the current music has finished and sets
up a new NWP process before the current one is finished.
The whole thing ends up in a shambels because the first NWP has grabbed the MIDI drivers etc.

This Windows Command line processor is the first one that I've come across where you can configure it to wait until the current batch line is finished before going onto the next.

Unless you know different !!!!

.....

Reply 13 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Mar-1998

Are you running Windows 95? If so, this capability is available free. Using your example, just do the following:

start /wait c:\path\nwplayer c:\path\music1.nwc /play /close
start /wait c:\path\nwplayer c:\path\music2.nwc /play /close

While in a DOS session, you can help on the "Start" command by running "Start /?" on the command line.

Reply 14 offered by: Richard on 14-Mar-1998

Not using '95 so this is not available to me. But I'm sur many 95 users will be grateful for your tip.
Thanks

Richard

Reply 15 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Nov-2000

See also: msg #1840


#430: File conversion: NWC or MIDI to .wav
File conversion: NWC or MIDI to .wav

(430)

Submitted by: Bill O'Toole on 21-Jan-1998

Are there any utilities for converting NWC or MIDI files to
.wav files?

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Jan-1998

Most cards come with sampling software (or even use Microsoft's crappy Sound OLE), or purchase something really groovy like CoolEdit.
Then it is simply a case of recording the sample and playing your NWC or midi file.
Points to remember:
1) Make sure that you have set up your mixer so that you can record from your midi player (either on-board card or external midi player plugged back into the soundcard's line-in)
2) If it is a long piece, you may need to reduce the sampling rate to keep the resulting wav file small enough
3) Ditto for "stereo-ness", ie you may need to record in mono to halve the size of the resultant file
4) Best signal-noise ratio is obtained with onbard midi cards, but most external midi players plugged back in will still be fairly noise free. Avoid recording with a microphone.
If any of this is confusing, it really comes down to using some software to do a wave recording whilst playing the midi file.
If you have any further questions, feel free to ask.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: djp on 27-Jan-1998

I don't suppose there's anyway to copy a .wav file to nwc or to midi, is there?

Reply 3 offered by: Per Pettersson on 27-Jan-1998

Answer to dip's question:
---------------------------------------

No, I have a hard time believing there is. The two data styles for Wave and MIDI/NWC are totally different. MIDI/NWC gives signals to the sound card to play a certain note with a certain instrument, while Wave format just is the way it all sounds. And since a Wave file as well could contain noise or speech, I doubt there is a way to do this. I might be wrong, since I am no sound engineer or anything, but to me it all seems impossible.

You could, if you have a Sound Blaster AWE card, merge Wave files into your MIDI's with the SoundFont technology. This is cool stuff.
Also, if you have Cakewalk sequencer software, I've heard that you could combine Wave and MIDI signals without SoundFonts. But I've also heard that Cakewalk is EXPENSIVE. NWC isn't.

Per

Reply 4 offered by: snedegar on 27-Jan-1998

There is some English software which converts miked sounds to
midi, and thus will develop pitch and duration from your own
voice singing into the mike, and so it follows that your input
could be a symphony, though how well this could resolve the
chords and instruments is open. I believe the price is about
a hundred bucks, and I think Phil Collins is named as one of
the principals in this outfit . . . I found them once under
midi via a Yahoo search . . . I have not tried it or heard
from anyone else who has . . .

Reply 5 offered by: Alister Marsh on 12-Feb-1998

I have had great success using a shareware utility called
'WAVmaker', which converts MIDI files into brilliant sounding
WAV files.
When I last looked, the homepage of this software was:
http://www.abc.se/~m9303/index.html
The shareware version will only convert MIDIs using a few
instruments: strings, piano, drums, slap bass. It sounds
brilliant though, so it might be worth a try.

Reply 6 offered by: AL9000 on 04-Apr-2000

The best programs to convert midi to wav are:
WavMaker
Akoff Music Recognition

Reply 7 offered by: artzmusic on 07-Dec-2000

I have great success using Steinberg's Cubasis VST sequencer. Import the midi file with all its various parts. The midi sound bank output(i.e. midi keyboard) should be plugged into your sound card's mic/line in. (you can pan the midi to the left if using the left output cable.) Create a new midi track adding just a click for a second. This can be any note from a drum bank, for example. This momentary "click" track will be played along with each midi track one by one to allow you to line up all the .wav's in perfect time once recorded.
Select an audio track on which to record. Then play one midi track and the "click" at a time until you have an audio track for each midi track. Use Cool Edit to edit the wave files, deleting everything in front of the click, then silencing the click, and import them one by one back into a new song in Cubasis. Your computer and software need to be able to accommodate the number of audio tracks you will end up with. For help on editing the .wav's feel free to e-mail.

Reply 8 offered by: Brometheius on 16-Jul-2001

I'm having trouble creating a good wav from midi. I have Cakewalk music Creator which allows me to make wavs and mp3's, But the files record like an old cassette on its last dying attempt to play (speeds up, slows down). I have Cool Edit and it works great for minor glitches, velocity changes however, I wouldn't know how to begin. Could someone tell me if its my computer(good files play back fine-and I've tried every possible setting I can think), or my program... or the way I go about recording. Maybe better still, is there a program out there that lets you convert midi to wav without playing it to record? Thanks to you who responds!

Reply 9 offered by: Syaoran Li on 26-Sep-2001

Well, go to www.google.com go to serch box, then type turn midi into wav, and wala, sites for you to choose

Reply 10 offered by: Gary Shannon on 26-Sep-2001

The best possible solution is to buy GigaStudio. MP3 samples of the sounds produced are here:
http://www.nemesysmusic.com/sounds/mp3.html

This program will directly write to a wav file with sound quality WAY beyond anything a sound card can produce. Just listen to the samples and see for yourself.

I just received my copy two days ago, so I'm still learning how to use it, but so far it's just blowing me away!!! The sound quality is way better than my Korg N5 external synth.

Especially listen to DDSSDEMO.mp3, fanfare.mp3 and track01.mp3. Actually, they're all really well worth listening to. And they show you EXACTLY what the program can produce because they were actually produced by the program.

Reply 11 offered by: Joe Music on 26-Sep-2001

I once came across a development version of a program that worked this way: It had its own MIDI reader, its own sound fonts, and its own MP3 converter. You simply read the MIDI file, and the program would read its own sound fonts, electronically create the WAV file, then (if requested) compress it to MIDI. It was all done digitally, meaning that your computer did not even need a sound card in order to create the files. Since no "music" was played at any point, there was no problem with speeding up or slowing down due to program interruptions.

I don't know what happened to it (I have no need for it), but that's the way to go.

Reply 12 offered by: Block on 26-Dec-2001

Try timidity++ if you are computer-geeky. Great drum sounds, tenor sax, strings, brass sections - great - the acoustic piano sounds nice but not fabulous.


#431: Copy from Print Preview to Clipboard (32-bit)
Copy from Print Preview to Clipboard (32-bit)

(431)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 22-Jan-1998

Several items in this forum suggest improving the score layout by copying it to the clipboard and using another application to edit the bitmap. When I try to copy a print preview page to the clipboard, it comes out at screen resolution, which is useless. I need it to be copied at printer resolution.

The help file mentions a difference between the 16-bit and 32-bit version. I use the 32-bit version. Does the 16-bit version really copy at printer resolution? Is there a way to make the 32-bit version do this?

I suppose I could download and run the 16-bit version if it does do clipboard copy properly.

Reply 1 offered by: Marcel Bock on 22-Jan-1998

I use the 32 bit version of NWC 1.50 and when I copy a print
preview page to the clipboard I can paste it without problem
into a blank document of Word 6, to add some symbols like
hairpins, and so on. The printout is quite good.
Pasting to a Amipro document is also OK.
I had the problem you mentionned when I tried to paste into
photoshop.
With Corel draw some signs, like dotted notes, become big
ink spots.
I think the result depends on the program you use.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Jan-1998

The 32-bit program copies pages from Print Preview using a resolution independent metafile format. Graphics are stored as vecors, true type fonts, etc, and do not carry a specific resolution in their contents (unlike a bitmap, for example).

The 16-bit program allows you to create a bitmap file or a metafile, but the clipboard metafile format of the 32-bit program is usually the best way to go. The bitmap mechanism is dangerous, especially at high resolutions (memory issues abound), and there is always the problem of resolution distortion when using bitmaps.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Jan-1998

You are right. I was pasting into Paintshop Pro. I get much better resolution pasting into Word.

Reply 4 offered by: djp on 27-Jan-1998

Son of a gun !!! I had no idea you could copy the print preview to a MSWord file. Thanks everyone, it looks like it'll work !!!

Reply 5 offered by: JDL on 29-Jan-1998

How do you copy the print preview and open it in MSWord?

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 30-Jan-1998

Do print preview, press the copy button. Then open MS Word,
go to where you want the song, and select Paste from the Edit menu. You don't get much control over the size,
but it works pretty well. If you want the whole song, you
have to copy it page by page.

This is easy. I have not found a good way to edit the score
with the tools I have.

Reply 7 offered by: Michael LaBeau on 01-Feb-1998

I just tried the copy/paste operation for the first time...the image in Word is HUGE!! How do I get it down to a manageable size? I can't work with it that big...

Reply 8 offered by: David Veit on 05-Feb-1998

My problem is that when I adjust the margins to so that the piece of music is the right size (say for a music program where part of it needs to be on one page and the rest on the next) the last letters of the words on the right hand side get cut off, i.e. if ends in "trouble" the last word looks like "troubl" any suggestions????????????


#434: moonlight sonata
moonlight sonata

(434)

Submitted by: Rahman  on 25-Jan-1998

In Moonlight Sonata that comes with noteworthy1.50
there are 2 hidden staffs, if you unhide these staffs with score review you can't hide them again. Am I doing something worng ? Can anybody tell me how to do this?
Is it a bug? Thanks.

p.s. I am new using noteworthy, but it is very good.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 25-Jan-1998

I think that what yoou have done is to go to staff properties via score review and then you have probably changed the group name
from Hidden to something else.

What you need to do to put it back exactly as it was is to go to staff properties (F2) and then on the general tab, change the group name back to Hidden for the two that should be hidden (those with a name starting with the underscore character)
After doing that, you need to go to page setup (click on the open book)
and from there (in the contents tab)remove the cross from the hidden group.

The group name does not need to be Hidden to hide from NoteWorthy Composer
but it does to be hidden from NoteWorthy player (this IS documented in the NoteWorthy player help file
as I was told by NoteWorthy support in another forum letter !)

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Rahman on 26-Jan-1998

Thanks Richard that solved the problem.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew P on 26-Jan-1998

I didn't even know that file was there!
It's a pity the pedal markings are not in the playback staffs.
Also needs a bit of tempo adjustment to sound less meechanical.
But it's a good starter example on how to make "serious" music with Noteworthy.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Jan-1998

The staff parts which are shown in NWC are controlled via Page Setup, on the Contents tab. At the oment, if you go to Score Review and edit a staff which is not shown in the editor, it ends up being displayed. You can reverse this effect by hiding it again in Page Setup.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve on 14-Feb-1998

Just a quick question about this song. What exactly is it supposed to be. It sure doesn't sound like the Moonlight Sonata that Beethoven is famous for, or am I wrong. I don't know too much (almost nothing) about music, but when I printed out the first page to show my music teacher, he called it "some kind of computer bastardization"! I wouldn't call it that, but any MIDI file I have downloaded called Moonlight Sonata has been an entirely different song.

Any help would be appreciated.

-Steve

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Feb-1998

Beethoven's full "Sonatina Quasi una Fantasia" (ie. Moonlight Sonata) is made of several movements. A version of the third is found as an NWC interpretation in the samples folder of version 1.50 (compliments of Randy Williams). FOr those unfamiliar with this Sonata, a good overview can be found at:

http://pw1.netcom.com/~bvtelvis/classical/beet.html

Reply 7 offered by: Christian on 17-Apr-1998

Hey does anyone know of any good sites for the shhet music (Free) of Beethoven's works????? Tell me !!!!

Reply 8 offered by: CLAVIER on 18-Apr-1998

you can find many classical MIDI files in this link. I think that you can found theMoonlignt Sonate in it. Try . . . and ear . . .

Reply 9 offered by: Clavier on 18-Apr-1998

Here is the link ...
http://www.prs.net/midi.html

Reply 10 offered by: Shaun Gallant on 28-Apr-1998

I have been looking for the notes for this song, and I have not been able to find them anywhere. It would be much appreciated if you could help me out.

Reply 11 offered by: marsu on 29-Apr-1998

Did you try this search site :
http://www.prs.net/cgi-bin/search.cgi ??
It's the best I know for the moment. Maybe Andrew knows a better one ?... Tell me then :-)
HTH.
MAD

Reply 12 offered by: jenny on 31-Mar-2000

HELP Does anyone know the name of the cd that contains the version of moonlight sonata where there is a woman singing in the background

Reply 13 offered by: Alan Bowers on 02-Mar-2001

If anybody has heard Claudio Arrau's recording of the Moonlight, please let me know what they thought of it and why they liked it.

Thank you,

Alan Bowers

Reply 14 offered by: Robert on 06-May-2001

That 'women singing record' is, I think, the version by Glenn Gould.
Robert

Reply 15 offered by: Njd on 22-Nov-2001

ive tried to learn to play moonlight sonata from a cd and have managed to get the right hand but i just cant manage to get the left, i cant read music so has any one got any links to a site(s) that can help me please.

thanks.

Reply 16 offered by: Jessica on 14-Jan-2002

I am 17 years old and I've been playing the Piano ever since I was in third grade. I love the song Moonlight sonata, and I can butcher it by ear. I wish I could play the whole song, and I'm actually thinking about learning this song for my senior project. I don't read notes, but I've looked at some keyboards that have songs on them and when they play theres a little screen that shows what notes are being played. This has helped me alot. My friend has one and I play it everychance i can and I've learned alot from it, seeing and listening to the music. Alas, I cannot find a keyboard that has moonlight sonata programmed into it. If anyone knows about a keyboard that has Moonlight sonata on it, please tell me what company made it. I think this should help other people on this site that want to learn the song too. Help me in my search = ) thank you. Please email me


#435: Player command line
Player command line

(435)

Submitted by: Snedegar on 27-Jan-1998

Is there a way to open Player and load a song
which then begins to play? My intention is to
have a copy of player on a web site which can
be loaded and will play and show the song and
"bouncing ball" without downloading a complete
copy of the Player to the user's computer. If
the browser supports exe files and such will
open and present the user with Player, then all
he needs is a song . . .

Of course the alternative is to give him the
Player software (or URL for same) and let him
download that which can then be programmed to
open in his browser's "helper apps" when he
comes on a nwc file, but is there a simpler way?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Jan-1998

The player now support /play and /close arguments on the command line. You still must install the program on a user's machine, however (in order to install the font, setup associations and uninstall capability, etc). The command arguments are covered in the Technical help of the player, under the "Starting playback as soon as a file is loaded" section.


#436: Recording enhancement desired
Recording enhancement desired

(436)

Submitted by: Chuck on 28-Jan-1998

The instructions say I must have a song open in NWC in order to
record, and that recording will stop at the end of the last measure
of the notation that is opened. My question is WHY? When I
want to record a new song from my Yamaha into NWC, I don't
know how many measures it will take. Couldn't this be an
enhancement to NWC? Am I missing something here?

Chuck

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Jan-1998

Using one of the Rhythm templates as a start, it is easy to create an underlying metronome pattern of your choice for use in recording. You do not really need to know how long your performance will be in the end. Simply set up your metronome pattern to be long enough to hold your performance. You can setup a local repeat that is fairly long, as shown in the provided Rhythm templates. Feel free to create your own and add them to the current templates.

If you add your own templates, you might want to consider setting up your own template folder. See the Tools, Options, Folders tab for details.


#437: Value for Money
Value for Money

(437)

Submitted by: Ken Stanton on 29-Jan-1998

I registered my copy of V1.30a back in 1996 and have enjoyed the benefit of updates through 1.30d and 1.30l, plus a lot of help from Noteworthy and from other users. I've just downloaded V1.50 and see that a lot (if not all) the wants from many people have been incorporated. To me, this represents excellent value for money. Just wanted to say that and to say "thank you" to all at Noteworthy.

Reply 1 offered by: Chuck on 29-Jan-1998

I agree with Ken, NWC is a great deal. I downloaded the
shareware version a while back, liked it so much I asked
my wife to get it for my birthday. This has been a much
appreciated gift. In addition, my 13 year old son is using
it alot as well. Composing is a great way to learn music.
(as an augmentation to piano lessons). It is also something
that my teenage son and I can share. Thanks to NWC for
making a reasonably priced program that us common-folk can
afford and enjoy.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 29-Jan-1998

I bought NWC so I could print out sheet music for my
daughter's choir, but it does so much more for me. I am not
a very good pianist - learning a new piece is difficult. NWC
lets me hear how it should sound, especially the timing, which
is a big help. When I think I know the piece, I put my
notebook computer on the piano and play along. This is much
better than a metronome - it really shows me what parts I am
not playing correctly.

My daughter sings solo pieces. It takes weeks for me to learn
a piece well enough to accompany her, but I can "teach" it
to NWC in one or two hours. Seeing the words and notes turn red
as they are played helps her with her timing. For accompaniments
that do not follow the melody, I can play the melody line
while she is learning the piece, then mute it so she can
learn to sing with the real accompaniment.

Also, she uses NWC to compose her own music on the piano,
which is a great way to reinforce music theory.

NWC is an incredible value. It does all this for me, it is
inexpensive, it works (almost bug free - very professional),
and it even runs on older computers (not much does these days.)

Reply 3 offered by: John E. Taylor on 31-Jan-1998

Kudos to Ken for what he said and mega kudos to Eric, Beth and the whole team at NoteWorthy ArtWare, Inc. for what they do. As a retired Senior Field Engineer (hardware and software) for AT&T Technical Services(and longtime amateur and professional musician), I looked long and hard for a music product that would permit me to marry my former vocation and avocation at a price I could afford (no I'm not going to sing The Retirees Blues). I looked long and hard and found some products that required an investment of upwards of five thousand dollars. Then I found Noteworthy Player which lead me to Noteworthy Player. I stopped looking.

What a great product! I only have two (2) questions. (1.) How can the company give-a-way an evaluation copy which has no restrictions?(I am a registered user). (2.) At only 39 bucks a pop, how do these fine people make a living.

Thanks for letting me be a part of the Noteworthy family.

Reply 4 offered by: Caleb Fong on 02-Feb-1998

With NWC, I consider myself in possession of a private orchestra for accompanying my concerto pieces. It is just a matter of time to put all the notes and parts together on my computer to drive the MIDI gears. NWC is great!
I have the same two questions as John E. Taylor has posted, and I am interested in knowing the answers from the folks at NoteWorthy.
For your information, I am not yet a registered user and I would register one day.

Reply 5 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 03-Feb-1998

I thought NWC demo *did* have restrictions. I seem to remember that one could only use the Save function 10 times, or something like that.
I don't remember for sure, because I DL'ed the app, fell in love with it, and faxed my order the next day!
I've tried most of the sequencers and notation apps out there, and for $39 or $390, my choice is NWC.
I have a copy of Passport's Pro Audio 6 on my machine right now, just taking up room.
I love NWC because it will let me enter what *I* want, then go back and change to my heart's content.
Some apps want to protect you from yourself, so they restrict how you can enter material. Not NWC.
Try step recording with Pro Audio, then check the speed of entry with NWC.
I could go on all night, but I'll just say: "Long live NWC."
Gordon

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Crossley on 04-Feb-1998

Just to add my thanks to NWC for the elegant implementation of grace notes.

Reply 7 offered by: Roy Pineau on 05-Feb-1998

Couldn't agree more! I have told everyone I know who loves
music about NWC. I'd classify it as one of the best
commercial music programs I've seen.

One use I've found which I haven't seen mentioned is related
to other links on the web such as the Classical Music Archives.
All the music listed for playing is "downloadable" as MIDI
files by right-clicking on them. Then you can import them
into NWC and view/play/print all or parts of them in
score format. My daughter plays the cello and had difficulty
obtaining printed sheet music for certain classical pieces.
Now with NWC it's a snap!

Many thanks to all.
J.R.P.

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Gentry on 05-Feb-1998

NWC is a very rare beast. An elegant and useful program that doesn't consume vast amounts of computer resource but does provide vast amounts of utility. I am full of admiration so much so as to register and not even mind paying the UK Vaule Added Tax. Well done all imvolved in producing NWC.

Reply 9 offered by: Tom Gurak on 06-Feb-1998

If I didn't know better (being an extremely satisfied NWC customer myself), I'd think this thread was phony. I have used NWC to help me learn choral music for the church group I sing with. It has been an absolute lifesaver. I have raved about it to every music-oriented person I know. Now, most of the other members in my church group are also NWC owners as well. One of us will enter a new piece and e-mail or "sneaker net" the piece to the other members. It makes our rehearsals much easier!

I'd especially like to thank the authors for a great job on 1.50. I was truly pleased with the earlier versions, but 1.50 has gone well beyond my expectations. Everything just seems so much easier to do! And being able to change the size of the lyric font is fantastic,

Thanks,
Tom

Reply 10 offered by: Ola Johansson on 08-Feb-1998

I just wanted to add to the praise of this wonderful piece of software! I tried it out a few months ago, and when I seriously started singing in a quartet in our barbershop chorus we needed something to enter music into to learn the music more easy.

Since then at least two other guys in the chorus have bought (or are seriously considering buying) NoteWorthy Composer. It's a great tool for learning music and to have a nice printout with our own interpretation of the song.

What I miss (I think) is the possibility to enter four different staffs, one for each part in the song (for separation of the parts when making a "practise tape") and then merge them two by two to create a printout with tenor+lead in one staff and baritone+bass in the other. If the merging isn't possible we'll just have to do with twice the staffs in the printout. We could live with that... :-)

Thanks a lot for a great value for money software! It was so easy to order the software from Sweden, Europe, and it arrived with manual and the latest version on diskette within a week!

Best wishes,
// Ola

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Feb-1998

Regaeing the four different staff parts (referenced in Ola's contribution above), NWC does include an experimental feature that you can play with in version 1.50. It allows you to overlap staff parts, as is commonly done in SATB arrangements (as you mention). At the moment, the files needed to activate the experimental feature are available from the NWC Newsgroup (linked from the main forum index). We will also be making it available from this web site. Check the news for details.

Reply 12 offered by: Charles Martin on 28-Feb-1998

I also would like to add my appreciation to the Noteworthy
staff.
I am a low voice singer and have trouble finding pieces
that I would like to sing written for low voice. I can use
NWC and transpose the original music to fit my voice and
then record it on tape and use it as accompaniment.
Great Job! Great Price! Great Software!
Charles

Reply 13 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 06-Mar-1998

I can't quite remember when I registered my copy of NWC (it was long ago), but I have never looked back.

I sing in a male voice choir and also play guitar, and with NWC I can practice my voice parts to my hearts content without frustrating an accompinist.

I do not have much formal training in music and I have found that since I started entering music on NWC my musical theory has improved by leaps and bounds.

Also my appreciation goes to the Noterworthy staff when I lost my registration details through a disk crash, for getting going again.

Greetings form South Africa
Roelie


#438: Swing wish list item
Swing wish list item

(438)

Submitted by: Andy Treder on 29-Jan-1998

Noteworthy is wonderful, have been a user since 1.20b (I think). My one main wish list item remaining is:
could you please incorporate a "swing" switch, i.e. playing eighth notes in a 2::1 ratio.
I currently go through the pain of doubling-up the first note with a tie, then making a triplet out of the three notes.
I realise that timing measured in thirds is tricky with computers based upon binary ticks but I think the trick would be:
make a quarter note = 3 ticks, create a "tick tempo" of +50% Tempo,
make the "odd numbered" eighth notes = 2 ticks, "even numbered" eighth notes = 1 tick, a quarter note = 3 ticks,
[the ticks would have to be subdivisible by powers of two, to accommodate sixty-fourths, etc]
but hide all of this behind the GUI. [This approach is extendable to support any swing ratio, e.g. 3:2, with the right arithmetic]
Exporting to MIDI would be tricky (see what happens when you export triplets)
but this could be overcome if implemented as a "playback-time" interpreter

For myself, I would gladly pay my licence fee over again for this one enhancement! [I'd even code it if I could]
FYI my primary use of NWC is to assist learning the saxophone and jazz rhythms. I play much better when I know what it should sound like.

Is anybody else willing to apply a bit of pressure here?

Reply 1 offered by: Anders Westlund on 29-Jan-1998

I don't know how much pressure this is, but I've seen ABC playback programs that can do what you want NWC to, in the way it should be done. One example is Henrik Norbeck's ABCMUS,at http://home1.swipnet.se/~w-11382/abcmus/

(FYI: ABC is an ascii format for notation, much use by TeX people; see http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/ )

The swing style can be set as a ratio for each note. For instance, a jig in 6/8 time, can be set to play back with the ratio 13:11:12 for 1/8:s. That is a very slight lengthening of the first note in each group of three 1/8 notes, at the expense of the second note. It *does* sound better like that.

In your example, the "swing" would be set as 2:1 for 1/8s.

Once you're implementing this, the next step would be irregular rhythms. (That too, can be set in Henrik's package)

This occurs for instance in a style of playing polskas in Sweden and Norway. The 3/4-rhythm has a "long two", the second beat comes earlier than in an even 3/4-rhythm. The beat length would be something like 3:5:4 for 1/4-notes.

I envision the swing/beat settings as an extension to the time signature. Not necessarily printed (I don't know of any standard).

I don't agree that there would have be a problem with MIDI export. But import of a "swinged" MIDI file definitely would be.

By the way, an import/export of ABC files would be nice. Of course, there are complications. An ABC file can contain many tunes. I suppose one would have to choose which tune(s) to import. NWC also supports many things that ABC doesn't: chords with split duration, multiple parts and clefs etc, so export wouldn't always work. On the other hand, ABC supports quadruplets, quintuplets and so on. Still, the vast majority of abc-tunes could easily be imported.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew P on 29-Jan-1998

I love ALL those suggestions. I think it comes down to a generic set of instructions:
"Play duplets with THIS time ratio, triplets with THIS time ratio, etc. etc." and simply becomes an attribute of the song.
I don't think it would be TOO hard to implement. Simply as the NWC-Midi converter is working out this next note and calculating note-up events, it would simply need to calculate a different note-up event time.

What a lot of things I need to add to the wish list.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: roy on 01-Feb-1998

What _I_ want is the abilty to set a 4/4 stave against a 12/8
and have them both play back together in time. It should be
simply a matter af setting a flag to indicate that all bars
have the same duration of elapsed time ie a dotted crotchet
in this staff = a single crotchet in this staff.

I had to set a song like this where two counter-melodis were sung together.
One was in 12/8 and the other in 4/4. I finished up putting both in
12/8 which meant dotting just about everything in one staff.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Feb-1998

I too would like my arrangements to swing - I have to export to other software to achieve this.
This feature would require quite a bit of engineering by the NWC team.
It seems that MIDI data is stored strictly as displayed unlike some other software where the MIDI data is stored in raw form and the display is quantized according to user needs.
It might not be easy to implement if this is the case.
If you think NWC can achieve this - add the request to the wish list


#439: fake notes for finger snapping or talking
fake notes for finger snapping or talking

(439)

Submitted by: David Carson on 29-Jan-1998

I don't know what these notes are called, but I'm talking
about notes that have a stem attached to an 'X' rather than
a normal circular base.

I believe I have seen them used in vocal arrangements for
things like finger snapping or talking in time.

I would like to know if NWC supports these notes.
Specifically, can such a note be entered so that it takes
a syllable of the lyrics? This would be my preference.

I imagine that even if there is no specific support, I
could enter it as text. If this is my only option,
could someone point me to a font that has these
whatchamacallits. I tried to find one today, looking in
several music fonts, but found nothing like what I want.

And, if I have to use text, how should I put a 'lyric' in
for that beat?

David

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew P on 29-Jan-1998

I think this would be a fantastic thing, and is really just a change of note head from blobs to Xs, and hence just another note attribute. Add it to the wish list. Do you know how half notes (minims) and whole notes (semibreves) are written? Or are they ignored?

I don't know how you could enter it as text to make it look right, as the only way to extend a staff is by entering notes or rests, which would get in the way of your "beats".
You could do them OFF the stave (say, hanging below). This wouldn't look too bad. But since text is attached to staffs and placed (somehow) in the stream of objects, you may have trouble with alignment.

Have you looked at the NWCV15 font, that comes with NWC? It has the double-sharp character which would work okay. It has tails, too! And they could be pasted in (laboriously) using the Character Map program.

Ideally, this should all be done "in hardware", ie by NWC as a note attribute.

As Eric would say, Hope this helps.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Feb-1998

What you want are rhythm noteheads.
These could be used as you suggest, for drum cymbals and provide anchors for chords in rhythm parts.
In the last instance they could be implemented with the same MIDI status as rests - perhaps as an alternative type of rest.
I agree - would all the above add it to the NWC Wish List PLEASE!!

Reply 3 offered by: Anne Dubrofsky on 11-Feb-1998

This was actually something that I had to do recently. I ended up by superimposing an x over the relevant noteheads, using the text editor (x), and disabling the Preserve width function.

I was creating practice midi files for my voice students. So that they could use the files to learn their parts, I chose pitches which were part of the chord, in the midi file - this prevented terrible dissonances. In the actual printed score, I made sure that the notes were x-ed. This is a temporary solution - it would be lovely to have this capablitily.

Reply 4 offered by: Eric Black on 22-Feb-1998

The ability to show notes as beamed X's instead of beamed blobs is useful for vocal music and certain percussion parts. A feature like this integrated into NoteWorthy Composer would be greatly appreciated.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Crosby on 07-Mar-1998

The idea of note with an X as a head is good for jazz charts as well as everything else. In jazz, a ghost note is an X as well as the drums, and claps and snaps for vocals and jazz

Reply 6 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 17-Mar-1998

This feature is an excellent idea! I have looked for these but couldn't ifnd them. Another thing I'm looking for is something that will let you have a normal staff, but then add an *extra measure* so to speak that will only be played the SECOND time around. When I first saw the grace note feature, I thought that's what it was, but then found out that they were just grace notes. Of course, grace notes are good for guitar slides, hamer-ons, and pull-offs. I don't know what you call these smaller ntoes (usually are in parenthises and have a "2x" or "D.S." next to them. I have achieved this with the Special Ending feature and just added an extra couple of measures, having the first in one (1.), the second in another (2.), and then showing 1., 2. where they both play. Pain in the butt too! THis would help a lot!


#440: Forum Files
Forum Files

(440)

Submitted by: John E. Taylor on 30-Jan-1998

Are the various Forum messages available as a text or zip file? It sure would be nice to read and refer to Forum items off-line (what with the cost of connect time). Think of the bandwith we could save on the web.

Reply 1 offered by: andrew on 31-Jan-1998

Wouldn't save bandwidth unless it was zipped, as the same volume would have to be downloaded anyway.
It would save your connect time (vastly).
But no, the forum messages aren't (yet) available as a bundle.
Perhaps some kind soul (not me!) would like to bundle them and zip them and make it available from the newsgroup or from their webpage.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: John E. Taylor on 01-Feb-1998

But only downloaded Once. New posts could then be added on a weekly or bi-weekly basis. BIG SAVINGS. It would be a major job for someone with more time and connect facillities than I have. I is just a thought that could be a help to a growing number of Noteworthy users.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Feb-1998

We are considering a bundled zip file that includes a collection of the forum messages. This would not, however, help someone who wants to actually interact in the forum. If you want easy offline usage and interaction, consider using the newsgroup instead (most news readers provide for offline/online usage to save on connect time).

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Apr-1998

The NoteWorthy Composer forum is now available offline!

Click the "View Offline" link at the top of either the Recent-100 or Contents page for details (or go directly to http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm).


#442: Ties
Ties

(442)

Submitted by: Drake Donahue on 31-Jan-1998

Piano players:
If piano is the instrument and I tie (e.g.) two whole notes in NWC the first note plinks and the second is never heard. Is this how you piano folk folk use ties? ((if so silence can be more directly implemented)) Wind instrument does a "nomal" tie with a steady two whole note blow. A glitch or failure to read the directions?

Reply 1 offered by: andrew p on 31-Jan-1998

When you play a piano, the key strikes the string, and the damping felt is raised. It stays raised until you release the key, at which time the note is muffled.
So it is not silence, but the continued decay of the note which is being directed for with a tie.
So a piano tie is "played" the same way as a wind instrument tie, it's just that the instruments generate sounds in completely different fashions, one through a single percussion, the other through continued excitation.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 01-Feb-1998

Thanks for the nice clear explanation.
The word plink was deliberately chosen though.
General midi patch 001, acoustic grand piano, Sound Blaster AWE 32, two tied whole notes in 4/4 d=70 are giving me on pitch sound (plink, fade) for about 1 beat and high resonances (fading) for about another beat then about six beats of silence.
(This is not the way I hear whole notes on real pianos, nice to now know the mechanics.)
Since posting, I've tried this in Finale and gotten the same results so NWC, if guilty, has co-conspirators.
Questions:
Is what I describe what real piano players get on real pianos?
Is what I describe the correct(normal) midi/NWC result?
If no and no, what card/synth? FM or wavetable? What sound font?
Do sound font pianos have felts effects built in? (Would think fades/stops would be left to midi commands.)

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew again on 01-Feb-1998

>>General midi patch 001, acoustic grand piano, Sound Blaster AWE 32, two tied whole notes in 4/4 d=70 are giving me on pitch sound (plink, fade) for about 1 beat and high resonances (fading) for about another beat then about six beats of silence. (This is not the way I hear whole notes on real pianos, nice to now know the mechanics.)<<

When I tried this (not sure what d=70 was I presumed quarter note=70), I got about 3 beats at mp, and about 6 at fff.

>>Questions:
>>Is what I describe what real piano players get on real pianos?<<

Not the right time of night for me to test this question, I'm afraid. I _expect_ we get a longer decay on a real piano, as the decay on even an AWE device will be implemented with a (very cleanly) looped sample and a volume envelope.
You can probably even tweak this envelope using Vienna. (GOOD LUCK!)

>>Is what I describe the correct(normal) midi/NWC result?<<

I expect so.

>>If no and no, what card/synth? FM or wavetable? What sound font?<<

I think you've got it. You may want to try some other sound fonts (hunt around for "soundfont" and piano, there are some free ones around, including several at Creative).
Forget FM, it'll never do pianos better than a sample. NEVER.

>>Do sound font pianos have felts effects built in? (Would think fades/stops would be left to midi commands.)<<

You don't actually hear the felts. Most midi cards won't have a note-up sound. My old Ensoniq EPS used to have the thunk of a harpsichord quill returning, but it actually got annoying after a while. I think they'd made it too loud.

Sounds like your main issue here is you don't think your AWE 32 piano sounds right. Hunt around for some other pianos. How much memory on your card? You'll need 4M for some of the larger soundfonts!

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Feb-1998

By definition, two notes tied together result in only one audible, continuous note played by the performer (whether that performer is actually software or a live person). If you want to actually hear the sound attack on the second note, perhaps you should be using a slur rather than a tie.

Reply 5 offered by: Drake Donahue on 01-Feb-1998

Thanks, Andrew, right on point as usual.
Curiously, just as I was reading you, the background noise from the tube was a piano doing a slow and melodic piece which went to a sustained left hand chord that held for seconds--at least 3 full measures while the right hand melodied. So something is rotten with both our "virtual pianos" and mine is worse than yours.
For Support, no, I really am just looking to get a nice long slow fade on my virtual piano as i just heard from a real piano. Pedal does not seem to affect this.
The piece in question is "My Heart Will Go On" from the big sinking ship movie. The sheet music is for piano/voice/guitar (desired end result was piano/alto sax for play along). The piano plinks don't make it as accompanyment to such a slow melodic piece. So bad, I've put a flute on the piano right and a basson may follow for the left.
BTW if anyone wants to play with what I've got (and send back an improved version), just holler.

Reply 6 offered by: Drake Donahue on 06-Feb-1998

Some partial answers specifically applicable to SoundBlaster AWE 32(AWE 64 probably?). Open AWE Control Panel. Select the Playback tab.
Playback bank:000-General MIDI;
Instrument:000-Piano 1;
MIDI controllers: {here the fun starts} click the arrow, make a choice of controller
Controller value: {here the fun is} pull the switch back and forth to get a lot(right) or a little(left) of the selected controller. This appears to set a base value of the effect for a note it further seems that the effect can be turned off but not set higher or turned on by midi/NWC playback. Play with controller settings click a note, play, click, find behavior that sounds right to you.
Currently I like:
Piano 1 at Modulator Wheel 020; Main volume 127; Pan Position 64; Expression 127; Sustain Pedal 127; Reverb Depth 127; Chorus Depth 6
The other instruments were not hurt to my tin ear.
Vienna SoundFont Studio also has hold and sustain and decay controls which effect note play at the SoundFont Studio keyboard but have little effect on midi/NWC playback (probably because AWE 32 Control Panel settings take precedence.
A rant :)
BTW, it appears most of the memory the soundbank uses is kinda wasted. The sample is an actual note sounded by the instrument and is saved from inception to 2000 to 3000 time units (milliseconds?). Of the total sample, typically sone 50 time units late in the sample is looped and played with amplifiers and filters shaping a sound envelope. So as 50 is to 2500 so useful storage seems to be to waste. And all that real attack, decay, hold sustain data is approximated instead of played. Sound FONT is correct terminology.

Reply 7 offered by: Eric Black on 22-Feb-1998

The length of sustain of a piano patch will vary with the synthesizer or the sound card, in my experience.


#443: Special characters in fonts (ie: shape notes, etc)
Special characters in fonts (ie: shape notes, etc)

(443)

Submitted by: John E. Peterson on 01-Feb-1998

Oh, I suppose... if someone were to ask REALLY nice, I might be persuaded to create a .ttf set with some of the special characters people are asking for like trill signs, "finger snapping notes" (the x with a stem) etc.... There are only a handfull of these missing, so if they were CREATED already, maybe, JUST MAYBE Noteworthy would add them to their special font that is already supplied with composer. I have a need for some special repeat symbols when doing single parts from orchestra scores. I guess if I do the dirty work, it's more likely to get done, huh?

Any request, send 'em to me and I'll try to put some together in the next couple of weeks. True Type fonts are quite easy to create.

John E. Peterson

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 02-Feb-1998

Let's hope you haven't bitten off more than you can chew...

My personal wish list (and it is my fervent wish that they WOULD be incorporated into the NWC font, for portability... are

a) arpeggio (you know, the vertical squiggly line). This would need to be in several sizes, say 4 lines, 5 lines and six lines long.

b) trill sign (the horizontal squiggly line). Should be able to be placed end to end (like sausages!) to make longer ones.

c) Percussion notes would need up and down flags for at least quarter, eighth, and sixteenth notes (really, this is a "head-job", so to speak).

d) Assorted length/direction hairpins for cresc/decresc, but I would hope that Eric's already working on that. (Cross fingers).
Marsu from France did this with post processing on PostScript files quite a while ago. See the forum archives for a description.
Again, this is something best done in software.

PS: Some of these signs already exist in fonts out there. Only they're not all in one font, except for some copyright fonts.

Regards,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 02-Feb-1998

This sounds great! If I understand correctly, these symbols
would be inserted using the Text command. But if the
Noteworthy font is used, we will then be unable to write
characters. I think it might be better to pick a standard
text font (eg. Arial), and replace the special characters
with the musical symbols. You could dump in the entire
Noteworthy font.

Creating TT fonts is easy? Is there software equivalent to
NWC for doing this?

Reply 3 offered by: John E. Taylor on 02-Feb-1998

Flute and Horn players (and clarinet to some extent) are bugging me about the short length of the note stems when the notes go well above and below the staff. Seems like anything above high E and anything below low F. They would like to see a longer note stem which they say makes it easier to read. I don't know how to impliment this, but it is a wish. Any way of adding an extension?

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Feb-1998

Coreldraw has the ability to export TT fonts.
Although it seems that you can only define the first 127 characters.
I hope someone can correct me on this.
I did post a font in the newsgroup before Xmas, BOXES.zip, to add boxed letters, multibar rest, repeat and beat marker symbols that may prove useful - and I hope to add more marks to this font in time but I'm beginning to doubt the merit of this approach.
There are another 128 characters that can be accessed by holding down ALT while typing in the ASCII code for the character.
Like ALT/0176 for the diminished or degree symbol for example.
So there is space above the normal set for music symbols if these where added to the NWC font but it would need to be engineered at the NWC end.
Using fonts to add marks to a NWC score does create problems.
You need either a note or a rest to hang them on.
If you make a beat marker / or a rhythm notehead as text to add chords to you still need a measure rest in each bar or the text spills out of the display.
There is a big heap of text characters piled up on my desk just to the right of the screen!!!!
The real answer is to provide the marks in software - and thats a big ask - probably means starting from scratch.
We know this feature is implemented in other software but what does it cost you.
We all have Porsche appetites on a VW income which is probably why we are here.
In the meantime I'll add the marks by hand.
Anyone need the services of a gun copyist????

Reply 5 offered by: David on 04-Feb-1998

Good on you guys!

BTW is there a NTW mailing list?

Reply 6 offered by: David on 04-Feb-1998

I only ask if there is a NTW mailing list as I would like to know about any info to NTW straight away.
Also because we could discuss in much greater detail with a mailing list.

JUST wondering! :-)

Reply 7 offered by: John E. Peterson on 04-Feb-1998

True Type characters are easy to create (I use Corel as obviously does Barry Graham). Of course I'm a computer nerd with CAD background and a programmer by trade.

ACTUALLY, using a TT font is much more common than one might expect even in the OTHER softwares. You just don't realize what they have done! The TTF files are buried in the .exe or a .dll. Literal DRAWING of notes, etc requires absolutely HUGE overhead in software and is VERY VERY slow compared to simply using SCALEABLE tt fonts. If it is a windows music package, it is almost gauranteed that they are using a ttf or other similar font. If you don't, scaling (size) and indirection (print to ANY device) becomes almost impossible.

No, no NTW mailing list. BUT! Just because THEY don't have one doesn't mean that a LIST can't be started.

Clarinet players with short notes? Use a bass clarinet. It's longer anyways.... (ha ha). Flute players? I assume you mean ledger line notes since 8va isn't directly supported. Hmm..... Does a Pic use something like 80va? Or do their ledger lines simply extend to the ceiling? (as in "Mr Conductor... What note is the 57th ledger line above the staff?")

Oh... and inserting the things I'm talking about as text? Nope. If NWC won't add the code, this stuff is almost useless. Multibar Rests for instance. Just printing the text in one measure to indicate 10 measures of rest will skew you with everyone else. And NWC won't play 10 measures of rest. It HAS to be coded. I'm just suggesting creating the fonts to make NoteWorthy's job easier. (ha ha -- THIS is the EASY part anyway!).

There seems to be just a handfull of critical (to orchestral work) items missing. If we form a gang, and threaten, MAYBE?

I should note --- Beth has always been VERY good about answering mail, but always suggests putting this stuff in the wish list box. I've been putting some of these there for well over a year. And the messages HERE tend to indicate many others requesting the same things. Sigh.... Maybe if we offered to send in some little programming elves at night?

John

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew P on 05-Feb-1998

David, don't forget the newsgroup. It is much easier to carry on to-fro discussions there, and can be read off-line with most useful news programs.
John is right. Multi bar rests really need to be coded by NWC, as they should only occur where all parts in a VIEW have them lined up. Otherwise you'll NEVER get all the parts to line up.
When you think about it, a multibar rest is only used when one or at most two staffs (okay, maybe a section) are being shown/printed. Otherwise they make no sense at all. ie, if people only get multi bar rests 'cos someone else is playing. So on a full score, you need to expand the multibar rests anyway.
I think your text idea though does have merit as a stop gap in that users can then delete nine bars of rests and put in a multibar rest.

Re programming for him. Yes, it seems there are several of us willing. If only Eric would send us the stub code and the interface spec, we could add all these neat little features...
I truly wish Eric would take on another programmer, but then he probably wishes to have enough income so that he can eat... :-)

Cheers,

Andrew

Reply 9 offered by: Blair Dowden on 05-Feb-1998

We seem to be talking about several different things in this
discussion. What I am hoping for, and I don't think is too
difficult, is a simple way to place the symbols I want on
the score, using the insert text command. This would be
done by taking a standard text font and adding musical symbols
suggested by Andrew in the second item in this discussion.
It does not solve all problems, and has no effect on playback,
but could easily be done and does not have to involve
Noteworthy.

It would make me very happy.

Reply 10 offered by: John Peterson on 05-Feb-1998

Blair,

I assume you are talking about the ability to more or less simply type a character and drag/drop it at ANY postion on the page? That WOULD be nice. I haven't used the "insert your own text" function so I don't know how well (or badly) it performs.

I would LOVE to use the newsgroup, but my server doesn't carry it!

John

Reply 11 offered by: Blair Dowden on 06-Feb-1998

You haven't used insert text? This explains my confusion.
I mainly use it for those non-technical hints at the beginning
of a song, like "Brightly". I have also used it for piano
fingering, and people use it for guitar chords.

The text is tied to a note position, so it can be placed
anywhere on a staff (or above or below it). I never thought of placing it anywhere
on the page. Maybe I could use it to put author information
at the top left corner of the page, like most songs do and
I wish Noteworthy supported. Good idea, I should try this!

The only thing that does not work is placing text between
beamed notes. It breaks the beam. I think this is a bug.
It makes it tough to put piano fingering above each note in
a rapidly played sequence.

So it could be used to place music symbols on the staff. You
would tie it to the previous note, use leading blanks, and
turn on the "preserve width" option. So this is why I want
a standard text font with music symbols added in.

It would be a dream come true.

Reply 12 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Feb-1998

On second thought, we do not need a music notation and text
characters in the same font. Insert Text can use many fonts,
including the four User1 to User4 fonts. So just extending
the Noteworthy font would do the job.

Reply 13 offered by: Warren Barnett on 11-Feb-1998

You can put symbols between beamed notes if you can squeeze them in by inserting the text at the left of the beamed group and then using spaces to move the position of the text to the right

Reply 14 offered by: Blair Dowden on 11-Feb-1998

Yes, but it is hard to place them exactly above the notes.
The display does not match the printout. You have to go
back and forth between Print Preview.

It would be better if inserting non-note type obects between
beamed notes did not break the beam.

Reply 15 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 17-Mar-1998

Mulit-bar rests can be acheived by using the Local Repeats. For example:
||: •• :|| (3) Where ||: & :|| are the repeat signs and the (3) is the # to the top right of the closing bar. This will not Show it as one LONG bar wiht a # on top, but it serves the same purpose and is really easy to uinderstand :)

Reply 16 offered by: Joseph Hanche on 17-Mar-1998

I would like to see any chord grid fonts as well. Chords (for guitar) show up in many peices and even just the grid would be useful. Yes, you can tell that it uses fonts because (either in the NWC directory or the Windows Fonts directory) there is a font called nwc15.ttf and if you use this to type text, it is music symbols.

Reply 17 offered by: Tom Farnsworth on 18-Mar-1998

Add my name to the list. One of a very few things I'd love to see in Noteworthy.


#444: Just bought this fabulous book!
Just bought this fabulous book!

(444)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 04-Feb-1998

Dear Eric and Newsgroup,

Just wanted to mention that I just purchased a really useful book called "Essential Dictionary of Music Notation", by Tom Gerou and Linda Lusk, its published by Alfred, ISBN 0-88284-730-9, 1996
It was $11.95 Aus (~$8US?)
It includes answers to many of our burning questions and issues, eg what instruments to score for concert band, stage band, orchestra, (and general order) , STEM LENGTH, articulations (like tenuto, sforzando/ato, staccatissimo), arpeggios, etc.
Anyone designing fonts (or notation programs :-) could well do with a look at this book. At the very least it will help us in defining a common terminology that is consistent at least with Alfreds Publishing (one of the larger music publishers in the world).

Regards,

Andrew

PS: I'll also post this on the newsgroup.
PPS: I am not an employee of Alfred's!

Reply 1 offered by: John Peterson on 04-Feb-1998

Isn't Alfred the guy who cleans the BAT-CAVE?
John

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Bacher on 12-Feb-1998

Perhaps this book will convince the NWC designers that
a beam connecting an 8th note to a 16th note should not
have a 16th-note beam half the length of the full beam?

I've already had a pianist *AND* a composition instructor
criticize me (me!) for that notational "feature".
Seems like a no-brainer to change it.

- seb

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Feb-1998

Steve (seb): The exact behaviour that you describe with note beams will be changed in version 1.50b. Look for it by the end of the month, 28-Feb-1998 or so.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Feb-1998

Version 1.50b is available now. Goto http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/upgnwc.htm to get it.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

Andrew, do you know if some translation of this book exist ?
Eric, I dunno for 1.50b version but in 1.51a it seems that the beam is still too long on the 1-th note... And I ain't sure of the stem length. Looks sometimes very long though. But I have no idea on what it should be.

NWCly yours,
                    MAD

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Jun-1998

What is a "1-th note" in your post? As for the book, I would recommend a book seller as a better source for the question, such as amazon.com. -> Eric

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Jun-1998

As for the beam issue described above, the length of the smaller note's beam is exactly one notehead now, per standard notation conventions.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 11-Jun-1998

1. Sorry for miscased keystroke. "1-th" was meant to be 16th. Released shift key too early. And beam's length is ok. Still wonder on stem's one.
2. Thanx for the amazon.com address. I quickly found the reference for "Essential Dictionary of Music Notation". It seems that only an english version exist, but I think it may be worth the price.

Dominique


#445: Several bar rests.
Several bar rests.

(445)

Submitted by: David on 04-Feb-1998

Is it possible with NoteWorthy to place in a symbol to show several bar rests?
e.g:
---4---

This is for printing separate parts for instrumental solos in orchestral pieces where one instrument may not play anything for a while.

(when I print my scores I copy each staff into a separate file - that's why that symbol would be useful)

Thanks all!

PS: Does NoteWorthy make an "I love Noteworthy" badge?

Reply 1 offered by: John Peterson on 04-Feb-1998

See my note about fonts.

I LOVE the "I Love Noteworthy" idea! If someone creates it, it can be PRINTED! As in using your deskjet with the correct ink to print it on a T-Shirt!

I personally like the idea of an honest to goodness USERS group.

Oh.... The several bar rest and the several bar repeat are the first fonts I am creating. I am DESPERATE for these!

John

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Feb-1998

I have posted a zip file called Boxes.zip which contains the multi-bar rest markers, and boxed letters for section opens on the newsgroup.
You may have to use the file option More Messages in the newsgroup to get back to it.
The boxed letters are required to provide rehearsal marks because you lose the sequence of measure numbers when you compress multi-bar rests to one bar for part print out.
If you use this font always leave a measure rest in the bar and cover it with the left hand multibar rest marker otherwise - BIG problems.
If you cant find the news item - Email me and I'll post.
I intend to expand this font with other goodies but I'm up to my neck in crocs just at the moment - draining the swamp will have to wait!!!

Reply 3 offered by: David on 08-Feb-1998

Hey Team,

You know how NoteWorthy has a great Page Setup menu screen with the tabs, and how if you change something in one, it updates the other info (like the preview, etc)?

Consider too that the several bar rests option will only be useful when previewing (to copy) and printing.

So if they stuck in an option box in the Options tab, that when clicked, went through the staves and replaced a series of bar rests with a line and number, this addition would be successfully implemented.

:-)

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew P on 09-Feb-1998

I think this is a very good way to implement it, since lining up staffs is probably easier to consider at the printing stage.

A

Reply 5 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 16-Mar-1998

One way to do this is to set up local repeats. For example:
||: = :||(4) Where = is a whole rest and the (4) is the # to the upper right of the repeat. This is not the same as it should be printed with a LONG rest and a number printed above it, but it would be easy to figure out :)


#446: Rejected yet again
Rejected yet again

(446)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 05-Feb-1998

I am using Compuserve to connect to the NWC pages and every time I click on the Newsgroup I get the message " Internet Explorer cannot open this helper application for new://news.internet-company.com/ntworthy.com
The protocol specified in this address is not valid.
Make sure the address is correct and try again."

This has been my lot for the last three months. What can be done to enable me to get through?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 05-Feb-1998

This happens to me too. With Netscape I get
URL not regognized
news://news.internet-company.com/ntworthy.nwc

With Internet Explorer, it tells me the server has disconnected
me.

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 05-Feb-1998

Try adding news.internet-company manually
Old netscape ~3.0x (from browser window)
Window
Netscape News
File
Open news host
-Enter the URL above in the dialog window-
ok
double click news.internet-company.com in the news server window
Options
Show all newsgroups
find ntworthy.nwc put check in the box

Netscape Communicator--from the browser:
Communicator
Collabra Discussion Groups
File
New Discussion Group Server
enter news.internet-company.com in the dialog box
right click news.internet-company.com when it appears in the message center box
Subscibe to Discussion Groups
find and double click ntworthy.nwc

Explorer 4--from the browser:
Mail
Read News
Tools
Accounts
Add
News
follow directions: enter news.internet-company.com in the dialog box for NNTP(newsserver)
Close
Yes
find and double click ntworthy.com
When you want NWC newsgroup use normal news reading procedure.
On a guess y'all use MSN or AOL or Compuserve and the service blocks you from using rival dedicated information servers

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew P on 05-Feb-1998

Thanks Drake for your detailed help. Hope it helps the other guys.
I find that if I click on the button, NetScape navigator 3.0 does exactly as it should.
Perhaps Compuserve has a firewall for news?

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Drake Donahue on 05-Feb-1998

Exactly my thought.
Providing dedicated bulletin boards/chat rooms/newsgroups was exactly what Compuserve started up to do.
I suspect they hope their clients don't find other resources.
Just a year or so ago there remained companies with sweetheart deals with Compuserve who only provided support via compuserve. Required joining and paying for premium connection.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Crossley on 15-Feb-1998

Thanks everyone but I dont think a conspiracy theory is much help especially as Compuserve denies the blocking tactics you allege. Is there someone using Compuserve who has solved the problem?

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Feb-1998

Are you using CIM 3.0? Are you connecting via a WinSock connection? Do you have a news reader installed on your system (in IE 4, this is Outlook Express/in IE 3 it is called Internet News, along with Internet Mail)? If the answer to all three of these is Yes, then you should be able to connect to our newsgroup without problems.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Crossley on 18-Feb-1998

Thanks for some relevant comment. I am using Compuserve version 3.04 UK I am dialling in directly to the UK node and I would not know a WinSock if it hit me. I have no Internet Explorer reader on my machine since I am timesharing on the Compuserve system. Does this mean I cannot view your Newsgroup?

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Feb-1998

Your dialing properties (where you include the phone number that is dialed), there might be a "Use Winsock Connection" checkbox(or something of a similar name). If you are connecting this way, you should get an additional program started when you connect, called the CompuServe Dialer. You must be using this CompuServe Dialer before you have any chance at connecting to our newsgroup (or any other NNTP newsgroup, for that matter). In addition, you must have a newsreader installed. One is included with the full suite versions of Internet Explorer and Netscpe Navigator. There are also other newsreaders available, but I am not an expert on these (others may have some recommendations in this area).

Bottom Line: When using CompuServe or AOL, you need to be browsing the web from an outside application (Internet Explorer, Netscape Navigator, etc), not the browser integrated in WinCIM and the AOL program. In the case of CompuServe, this means that you must be using the CompuServe Dialer.

Reply 9 offered by: Peter Crossley on 22-Feb-1998

Many thanks for the advice. I will try it out.


#447: WinGroove concerns.
WinGroove concerns.

(447)

Submitted by: Ken Stanton on 06-Feb-1998

There has been some dialogue regarding this piece of shareware. I posted a note in response to a reply to another message. Nigel Horne is the person who has said that he has issues with WinGroove and I'd like to know what they are when I consider using it. The request I posted is as follows: >>> Nigel, October's Forum notes are not available in the archive. I've downloaded WinGroove with a view to using it, but your note has me concerned. I have a 486DX4 100Mhz machine with 20 Mb of memory. I'm operating under Windows for Workgroups 3.11 and I have an SB16 soundcard. I have the latest NWC V1.50. I do not have a midi-card. Could I ask you to reiterate your issues with WinGroove ? and let me know what I need to do to 'hear' the sound of NWC files to some degree of accuracy (at least to hear flutes differently to the piano! and not like a "comb and paper"). If it is because I have not set up NWC or the Sound-card properly I would appreciate some guidance. <<<< Nigel Horne, could you assist please ?

Reply 1 offered by: Nigel Horne on 06-Feb-1998

I attempted to run with WfW and an SB16 like you. Wingroov
kept crashing my PC and losing my settings. The author did
not respond to any e-mails from me. Often when hitting play
from NWC, or other S/W such as finale or mozart, the nothing
would play - it would just abort. I also got lots of 'out
of memory' messages - I have 32Mb, though I suspect Wingroov
may be hitting the 640K problem. It was fustration with this
bug which caused me to ditch it (manually - the author
doesn't supply an un-install program or instructions). Pity
really, the sound quality on the few times it worked, is
very impressive. I now have an AEW64Gold card. This has
also had some problems - see my earlier messages here, and
the brass sounds awful, but `tis a far better alternative
to Wingroov if a little pricey at well over £100.

Reply 2 offered by: Ken Stanton on 06-Feb-1998

Nigel, thanks for taking the time to reply. Much appreciated.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 06-Feb-1998

Ken,

I also tried using Wingroove and couldn't get rid of it fast enough.

I had some of the same problems as Nigel but aside from that, I actually thought that my portable with its Yamaha sound card sounded better.
(The portable is a pentium with Windows for workgroups)

I also have a SB16 on a 486, 66MHz runing W4WG but this was too slow to drive wingrove without the
Noteworthy display being way ahead of the Wingroove sound.

I also objected to the fact that there was no uninstal feature and I was certainly glad that I had taken the precaution of backing up Windows INI's and the MIDI mapper before installing.

I will not try this product again.

Richard

Reply 4 offered by: Jon Featherstone on 09-Feb-1998

I have a Pentium 90 laptop, 16Mb (WFW) with built-in "comb and paper" 16b sound card.
With no slot to plug in a good sound card, I have been delighted with Wingroove 1.09e and had but joy with the excellent sound quality it produces.
Considering the amount of real-time signal processing it does, I am not surprised it glitches on slower machines - I get the impression it is already "limit" with my Pentium 90 as sometimes I hear a crackling sound, or it may miss a beat in a heavy section with lots of parts.
Reducing the sampling rate from 44 to 33 fixes this (Wingroove setup).
For a registration fee of $20, I'm a happy customer.

Reply 5 offered by: Nigel Horne on 10-Feb-1998

Jon,

My machine was not a slower machine, it is also a Pentium 90.

-Nigel

Reply 6 offered by: Steve on 14-Feb-1998

Just last night I downloaded Wingroove from the suggestion of a
friend of mine. It does sound pretty good, but it does not play
complicated pieces very well, and it is also annoying to hear
the notes in Noteworthy a second after they are shown as red notes.

Overall, I have found that the best overall way to get fairly
good quality is to plug in a MIDI-capable PCM keyboard. The
instruments don't sound as real in some cases as Wingroove, but
it plays quicker and considerably more accurate.

Any ideas on how to delete it? I am using Win95.

-Steve

Reply 7 offered by: Dan Greenwald on 14-Apr-1998

I have found Wingroove to be great, but I'll admit, the old
delete when the shareware expires and reinstall method
doesn't work with this software. I am getting sick of my
MIDIs being interrupted every 10 seconds so I was
wondering... does anybody know how I could register? I've
e-mailed the author and KAGI and have gotten no responses.

Dan

Reply 8 offered by: Agnes Walker on 27-Apr-1998

I just hate the options that you are given to register this program.
You can give them all of the personal information including your
credit card numbers and information that is found upon it, knowing
that anyone can access this email to the owner. Why don't they have
a 1-800 (toll free) phone number that you can call like other companies?
I would love to register this program, but refust to want the "couple to
three weeks" to receive the password via snail mail, which in this case
seems more secure.

Reply 9 offered by: John Gross on 29-May-1998

I have had no problems with WinGroov. Send me an e-mail and I will tell you how to remove it! I am currently using a
K6-233 CPU on a Mustang R581A motherboard with only 16 Meg
on board ram. Before that, a Pentium 75, which followed a 486 DX. No problems with WinGroov on any of'em. Hard Drive-
MORE than adequate!!!

J.G.

Reply 10 offered by: Ben Hanson on 16-Jul-1998

Use ROLAND VSC-55 It works more accruate than WinGroov

Reply 11 offered by: Master Disaster on 05-Jan-2000

I've no problems with WinGroove. It runs great on my P120 (16 Mb RAM) and on my 386-33 (4 Mb RAM), well, I have to turn all the settings down as low as possible on the 386, but it seems to run fairly stable, although it's quite slow. Personally, I'd choose this program over a new sound card. Long live the 'Groove! :)

Reply 12 offered by: psyche620 on 11-Jul-2000

I downloaded Wingroove and thought it was pretty cool. The sound quality was better than Windows Media Player. On one midi I have Wingroove added a drumbeat that I KNOW was not supposed to be there. Even though it sounded cool, that dosent mean it will sound as good. Also it changed the way all the midis sounded in WMP, until I got rid of it. By the way if u need to know how to uninstall go to lycos.com and search wingroove got to Nakayama(?)' s homepage it tells u how.

Reply 13 offered by: takahiro tamiya on 13-Jul-2000

I'm WinGroover user from Ver 0.A1. I have used at 486DX100MHz with unknown soundcard, Pentium 100MHz with SB16 compativle, Cerlon 400MHz with Yamaha YF274 and On board ESS-solo. I liked its strings and Pf sound .

WinGroove requires 486 above. ( recomend Pentium 100 MHz ) and about 1.5 Mega Byte Memory and sound-card ( includes inner sound chip ) and about 2 Megabyte
Fix Disk Drive.

At english site
( http://www.cc.rim.or.jp/~hiroki/english/wgdl.html),
the latest verstion is 0.9E beta3. But, in real, the latest version is 0.A2.

And I searched at japanese site(http://www.wg7.com/) . From 0.9E to 0.A2 ,

- WinNT4.0/2000 - speed up ( x 1.7 ) for Pentium
- fit to MMX CPU - expand maximum voice 128
- new reverve and chorus - controls of delay of sing.
- have UNINSTALL program - bug fix. ( win3.1 ) etc.

I think ungoodness someone has is owing to ver 0.9E .
So I think one had better update to ver 0.A2 . It's font is Japanese. But, the Author ( Nakayama ) has written
'Runing Japanese WinGroove ver-0.A2 under non-Japanese Windows'
http://www.cc.rim.or.jp/~hiroki/english/v0a2jp/

takahiro

Reply 14 offered by: Brad on 17-Oct-2000

I have a 400 mhz machine with 192 mb of RAM. I have an SB16 as my sound card. I installed Wingroove and nothing has been the same ever since. My machine keeps crashing and I've never been able to get sound from my computer ever again. I rebuilt the machine and even installed the sound card driver multiple times. Anyone know how to get my sound back? Wingroove simply does not work with SB16.

Reply 15 offered by: Brad on 17-Oct-2000

An interesting thread... reminds me of the time when I was hiking through Europe. I made the terrible mistake of making the round trip around Europe instead of doing the usual capital city center to capital city center routine, you know, Paris, Berlin, and so on. Anyway I was in Italy at the time and wanted to see Turkey (this was several months after the earthquakes). So I got to the border and the security were going through my bags and the one of the guys was rummaging through and pulled out my general computer CDs (I usually travel with a Compaq 486 - how's that for a high-tech backpacker?). Anyway the guy said, "How much do you want for these?" And I said, "No sorry buddy they're not for sale." He pointed his handgun at me and said, "How much you want?" So I said "Okay you can have them for nothing." Anyway the second guy there pulled out a CD with 'brad's Noteworthy stuff' written on it. And so I called out, "NO! You'll have to shoot me for that one!"

Reply 16 offered by: Barry Graham on 18-Oct-2000

You may have to reinstall Wingroove before you can uninstall it's drivers!!!! (this is mentioned in the documentation).
If you just uninstall Wingroove the driver remains to wreak havoc on your system.
Reload Wingroove and follow the instructions to disable the driver then reboot and uninstall Wingroove.
And it does work with an SB16!

Reply 17 offered by: arakned on 15-Nov-2001

Ok, wanna uninstall Wingroove (0.9E)? Here's how:

1.) Go into the little configuration utility (it's called setup, and can be located on the "Start" menu). Uncheck the option of having Wingroove as a device driver. A message box will pop up confirming that you did so.

2.) Restart Windows.

3.) Go to C:\WINDOWS\Start Menu\Programs

4.) Delete the Wingroove folder

5.) Go to the your main hard drive (usually C:).

6.) Delete the Wingroov Folder.

7.) There you have it, folks!

By the way, if you don't want to go through the trouble of emptying the recycling bin, hold down the Shift key before you hit delete. That'll skip the recycling bin altogether. Also, don't delete the Wingroove.ini file in the Windows directory, unless you don't want to use it again.


#448: Lyricist/composer info
Lyricist/composer info

(448)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 06-Feb-1998

In the post about fonts, Blair said
"The text is tied to a note position, so it can be placed
anywhere on a staff (or above or below it). I never thought of placing it anywhere
on the page. Maybe I could use it to put author information
at the top left corner of the page, like most songs do and
I wish Noteworthy supported. Good idea, I should try this!"

This raises a small issue for me. As far as I can see, we should be able to have the lyricist on the left, (translator underneath), and the composer on the right (arranger underneath). I would be very pleased to have this sort of generalised ability.

It's off to the wish list for me.

Andrew

Reply 1 offered by: David on 08-Feb-1998

Hey Guys, WAIT!

NoteWorthy has already got something MUCH better than adding the feature to stick text wherever you like.

What you do is get a program like Word, etc, that can import the metafile format from the clipboard.

Make a template with your title, and copyright info, etc, and leave a big space for the music.

Go to Print Preview in NoteWorthy, Click the copy button, tab over to your program, paste it, and Wacko, it's done.

Did you like my idea?! Please see if you can use anything on our website:
http://www.flexi.net.au/~acelogix/index.htm

Let me know how my template idea goes.

David.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Feb-1998

I tried adding author information on the left side using the
Insert Text facility. It seems to work. I use the Page Text
font, and place it at the beginning of the staff (Preserve
Width turned off). I have to scroll it off the screen, but
can get at it by doing Home, Shift-arrow (to select it) and
Ctrl-E to edit it. I have to go back and forth between
Print Preview and Ctrl-E to get it right. I think I will
add this to the tip page. Yes, your wish would be a lot nicer!

As for pasting into Word - I assume you leave title and author
fields blank. There is a problem with margins, so you would
have to do all the pages in Word to make it look consistant.
If all you want is a line of text at the left, my suggestion
is a little easier, especially if you don't have Word or
something like it.

Reply 3 offered by: Eric Black on 22-Feb-1998

The ability to copy notation onto the Clipboard from the Page Preview screen of NoteWorthy Composer is a great feature, one which is present only other, very expensive notation software. Bravo for that.

Furthermore, this ability would allow a fix to any sort of shortcomings which NoteWorthy Composer may have in regards to certain aspects of notation. The inability to add trills and hairpins ("<" and ">") can indeed be overcome by using Microsoft Word, Adobe PageMaker, and other WP/DP programs. However, perhaps some of these shortcomings can be addressed within the NoteWorthy Composer software itself.


#449: Right Mouse Button
Right Mouse Button

(449)

Submitted by: Bentley Smith on 06-Feb-1998

Is the drop down menu from the right mouse button editable? Sure would be nice to be able to double click with the left button (select a measure), click right to copy, double click another measure to select, the right and select paste. This would be the easiest way to move measures around.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew P on 08-Feb-1998

As far as I could tell, we can nearly do that now. There just isn't the paste-to-replace entry on the RMB. At the moment the procedure would be
LMBx2 to select, RMB copy, LMBx2 to select another bar, RMB clear, RMB paste.

Andrew


#450: Global Changes
Global Changes

(450)

Submitted by: John E. Taylor on 07-Feb-1998

After spending a good bit of time working on an arrangment with 16 staves, I found myself wishing for the ability to make some changes on a global basis. For example...a key change. In almost every case, when you make a key change, it's a global change. Think of the time saving and workload reduction if you could make your key change and have it apply on a global basis. Same for time signitures, Do it once, click on "global change" and it's changed for every staff or system. I also had a case where because of range, it was necessary to transpose a section down a third. It was necessay to do it 16 times. With a global command, once would have done it.
Thoughts?
Yes, I have placed it on the wish list.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew P on 08-Feb-1998

I, too find myself doing a lot of repetitive stuff over many staves (sometimes up to 12 or so) and I still believe a macro facility would be of great use.
The problem with macroing, though, is that NWC is not always consistent in where it places you on the next staff.
However, a "do this last action to every staff" command could be smart enough to find what was last changed (perhaps changing a bar to a double bar, changing key, adding a master repeat open) and perform that on every staff.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 09-Feb-1998

I like this idea too.
An efficient way to implement this feature could be a dedicated check mark in each specialized insertion window.
For some notations like time signature, bar lines, special endings, the "global change" option could be the default.
On other option could be a "global change" icon that you would have to press before applying a series of changes you
want to apply globally.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Feb-1998

An alternative would be to allow multiple selection of
staves. This would work for tools like transposing, staff line
auditing etc. Things like key changes and time signatures
are individual items. Multiple staff select could possibly
work for these only if they were all in the same column.

Reply 4 offered by: John E. Taylor on 09-Feb-1998

These are all great thoughts. Personally, the how part of making global changes is immaterial. I'd just like the option available in some form. It seems to me the reason we got these boxes (read that CPU) in the first place was to make repetitive operations easy. In other words, let's let the code do it.

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-Feb-1998

I love all these ideas. I just added my vote for that in the
Wish List.

Reply 6 offered by: kentd dugan on 13-Feb-1998

Second the motion on the selection of more than one staff. I put in a wish list item for being allowed to select, say, the sax section for a least a vertical note to be able to make articulation changes to all 5 at once. For situations like that (and instruments are always doubling parts), if you can select the staves you want and make the changes to just one (I know, that's what you guys said), then I'd be a happy camper. The reason is that the real playing articulation and the midi playback articulation are not exactly compatible.

Reply 7 offered by: Steve Bacher on 23-Feb-1998

Third the motion on selection of more than one staff.
It would make copy and paste much easier, when you
have a section of music that's repeated, sometimes
with minor changes. Having to select the same large
chunk of score N times, once for each stave (and try
to remember the location where each piece of staff
begins and ends), is a pain.

Reply 8 offered by: Eric Black on 23-Feb-1998

I agree with Steve. We should have a way of "globally" selecting the same measures of music in different staves, as is common in sequencers. Perhaps a score overview that would allow us to select certain measures of the entire score as blocks, and then copy and paste them, would be very helpful.

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew on 23-Feb-1998

Hear hear! (or is that "Here here"?)
I think we could just select the bars on our staff just like normal, and then Edit | Copy Block (Ctrl-Shift-C?)
to copy ALL staves. Then we go to wherever we want, Paste Block (Ctrl-Shift-V). I think using normal Paste for pasting a block may become confusing. (Open to argument, here).
Lastly, would it make any sense to only copy and paste the staves in a view? I think that could become extremely confusing, but then again, imagine you've set a drum beat which is all sorted out using repeats, and then you copy and paste the block. On the other hand, pasting a block changes the length of the piece, so all parts probably need doctoring anyway.
On the other hand... :-)

Andrew

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 24-Feb-1998

Multiple select removes the need for multiple cut and paste
modes. It also resolves the second part of your response.
You do not necessarily want to operate on all staves at once.

You want a quick way to multiple select all staves, because that
would be the most common action. The standard Ctrl-A is
already taken. Select the top, shift select the bottom would
be workable.


#451: Timing errors?
Timing errors?

(451)

Submitted by: David on 08-Feb-1998

Has anyone out there had the same problem as this:

. I import a MIDI file with 8th note and 8th rest settings.

. In the score, a note that should be an eighth, is displayed as a 64th (or something) with a dotted 8th rest after it and a 32nd or something rest.

This occurence is rather frustrating.
Part of the problem is that I've told it to only go to 8ths but it does 32nds and stuff.

Wierd.

Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: barry Graham on 09-Feb-1998

It's how NWC import works but set the rest resolution to quarter.
You wont get eighth resolution unless the source file has been written in eighth resolution exactly.
The best you can do is reduce the resolution to sixteenth or even thirty-second resolution until the notation is relatively clean.
Software that produces midi files from recorded input will give the worst results.
Notation programs like NWC will record data that is more strict in time and will import more cleanly.
The only advice I can give is experiment to get the best result.
I prefer to import at eighth resolution for notes and quarter resolution for rests this allows the notes to fill the gaps.
If this does not produce clean notation I use sixteenth for notes and retain quarter for rests this seems to produce the best - but not perfect result.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Feb-1998

When NWC imports a piece, it evaluates the performance using the note resolution that you specify in the import wizard. However, if you tell it to use 8th note resolution, but a note run in the piece actually uses shorter durations, NWC will force some notes to smaller durations in order to fit the run into the proper time. NWC will not combine two notes into a chord that actually play separately in the performance. If the note resolution has to be reduced to avoid this, it will temporarily do so for runs that contain too many individual note events to fit using the default resolution. This may sometimes cause a very short note to appear in the imported results. The best solution is to try reducing the resolution, for example from 8th to 16th, and see if that helps.


#452: Keyboard and NotheWorthy
Keyboard and NotheWorthy

(452)

Submitted by: Ulf Holt on 09-Feb-1998

A friend of mine is planning to get him self software for
reading notes from his Roland keyboard (don't know what modell)
He has been talking about Musicator or Finale, which both
have posibilities for entering notes from a keyboard, but
does anyone know if these two products offers so much more
in note writing capabilities that it is worth the huge
difference in price? As you may understand, the main purpose
is writing notes via his Roland keyboard.

Cheers

Ulf Holt

(Who hasn't got a keyboard, but loves NoteWorthy)

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Feb-1998

The answer is it depends on what you want to produce.
If I were publishing my music I would use an expensive product like Finale so that I could produce all the notation marks that NoteWorthy lacks.
But my purpose is to produce readable scores and parts for the big bands I play with and NoteWorthy almost makes it for that purpose and at a considerably cheaper price.
There are demo versions of both these products available - try Harmony-Central on the web - I've tried both demos.
I suggest your friend tries the demos and makes up his own mind.
You need to weigh up cost, ease of use, ease of printing and output results from each package.
I chose NWC because I believe it wins on most counts.

Reply 2 offered by: kent dugan on 09-Feb-1998

It's not worth the overhead to go to finale. You'll need 30 days (8 hrs a day) just learn the basics. And you'll still need to refer frequently to their encyclopedia of how-tos. It's a tough progrram to learn.

Reply 3 offered by: Phil on 10-Feb-1998

For quick, quality, musician-friendly results go NoteWorthy.

Reply 4 offered by: Johann Aeschlimann on 13-Jun-1998

Seems that Note Worthy is what I am looking for. I only want to write scores for me and my kids. However, I use a Macintosh. Can you tell me a) whether there is a Mac version and b) how much it costs and c) where NoteWorthy is available (I am living in Bonn, Germany, but it is no problem for me to get somthing in the US. Thanks

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 14-Jun-1998

Eric is the best person to answer this question, but NWC is not available for the Mac at this time. I don't know if it is being planned for the future. You could try PC emulation on your Mac (though for the price of the extra hardware you could probably buy Cubase!) or buying/finding a cheap 486 PC with soundcard, Win 3.11 and NWC for 1.51 for Win 3.11. Others on this forum use NWC under Win 3.11 quite happily.

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 15-Jun-1998

For PC emulation on a McIntosh, I'd recommand RealPC. It allows you to emulate a Multimedia PC hardware correctly, and you can choose yourself which software to install : Dos, Win3.x, Win95, ... Dos6.22 is included. I guess this works even on a 68040, but you may need some extra memory.
Otherwise Andrew's right, buy an old PC (second hand maybe).

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 15-Jun-1998

For PC emulation on a McIntosh, I'd recommand RealPC. It allows you to emulate a Multimedia PC hardware correctly, and you can choose yourself which software to install : Dos, Win3.x, Win95, ... Dos6.22 is included. I guess this works even on a 68040, but you may need some extra memory.
Otherwise Andrew's right, buy an old PC (second hand maybe).
Hope this helps.


#453: Auto Generation of Chord Names
Auto Generation of Chord Names

(453)

Submitted by: John on 10-Feb-1998

Being very much a novice to NoteWorthy - if I import a Midi file, is there an application which will automatically assign a chord name for a given key signature? In most cases I am only tackling simple three or four note chords.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Feb-1998

NWC does not offer automate chord analysis. You would have to do this manually by looking at the imported notation.


#455: Solution!! 5 notes in the time of 4
Solution!! 5 notes in the time of 4

(455)

Submitted by: Warren Barnett on 11-Feb-1998

This is long and involved and longwinded but I just want to be precise, with little chance of anyone misinterpreting the directions.

When you need to beam a group of 2, 4, 5, 6,7,8 or whatever in the time of another, say 2 in the time of 3 or 5 in the time of 4, although noteworthy doesn't let you do it directly, you can work around the problem. I had this difficulty along with several other situations where things wouldn't line up and I was bound and determined to find a solution.

For a group of beamed notes, just beam them together in the normal method. Position the cursor to the left of the group of notes as well as at the height above the beam that you want. Press " X " (without the quotes) to invoke the 'insert text' mode. Enter a couple of spaces and then the number of notes in the group so that the actual text field looks something like
" 5".
Make sure that "Preserve Width" is NOT turned on. For FONTS choose "Staff Italic" so that it will be the size and shape of other things, such as triplet markings, that display. When you click on OK the number sould now appear somewhere over the middle of your group of notes. Don't just trust this to be where it will actaully print in your final printout. HERE IS THE IMPORTANT PART. When Noteworthy prints a line of print on a page, it positions the bar lines at the begining and ends of the line, so that everything on that line looks nice and pretty. However it also means that a group of 16th notes on one line is probably spaced differently than a group of sixteenths on another line. However, any text that you enter will always print at the same distance, no matter which line. Wait until your printout is ready to print. All of your notes must be entered, etc. Now click on FILE - PRINT PREVIEW. Noteworthy will display how the page will look when it does print. ZOOM ALL THE WAY IN, AND MAKE SURE THAT YOU CLICK ON THE LITTLE BUTTON TO MAXIMIZE THE DISPLAY, BECAUSE THERE IS A ZOOM FACTOR THAT OCCURS HERE AS WELL. You can't see very much of the page here but you can see EXACTLY what the spacing will be. Unless you zoom ALL THE WAY you won't see the exact spacing. Now scroll through the page untill you can see the part of the bar that has the little group of beamed notes. If your number now displays over the center of your group then you're laughing. If it doesn't line up, try to figure out how many more or less spaces would be needed to align things. Click on DONE to get out of Print Preview mode. Highlight the little diamond that is used as a handle for the text you inserted for the number over the notes. Once it is selected press CTRL-E and up pops the editor for the text already in the printout. Add or delete the number of spaces you figured out before, click OK, and go back into Print Preview mode to check the new spacing. DON"T FORGET TO ZOOM ALL THE WAY IN INCLUDING MAXIMIZING THE PREVIEW WINDOW. If everything lines up, great. If not, go back and add or delete any spaces. You can also adjust the height above the beamed group that it prints. Voila, you're done.

Except that the next bar line of the staff that you're working on has moved over because ther are too many notes in the bar. You will have to go to all other staffs and insert blank spaces with "Preserve Width" turned on, in order to make the bar lines line up again.

I know that this seems like a whole lot of trouble to go to. Once you have done it once or twice, however, you get the hang of it quickly. The results are well worth it. If you have a pentium you can scroll through Print Preview nice and quickly. But, if you're using a 386 it scolls DEATHLY slow.

Now you are faced with the problem of playback. I haven't tried this with more than 1 staff at a time, but I know that it works with one staff. You need to select the entire contents of the staff, copy it to the clipboard, Insert a new blank staff, and then paste the contents of the clipboard to the new staff. Don't forget to set up the staff properties for your instument choice. Mute the original staff which now looks correct. In the new staff goto the bar with the unusual time feature. Let's say that the tune is in 4/4 time and the tempo is quarter note = 100. How's you math? At that tempo, a sixteenth = 400. Except that now you have 5 in the space of 4. The sixteent note value must now be = 500. At quarter =120 a regular sixteenth = 500. So for the duration of your special feature you must change the tempo to quarter = 120. But only for 5 sixteenths. Any part of the bar before or after needs to be at the original tempo. You need to change the tempo just before the unusual beat and then change it back right after. Wow, listen to that cool lick.

This method for adjusting the display of notes works well for putting things such as accent markings ABOVE a stem pointing up. Just decide on your font size, and whether you want it bold or not.

Hope this helps anybody with this problem.

Warren Barnett
wbarnett@yesic.com

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Bacher on 13-Feb-1998

You'll find that, as you may have expected, this won't
work with more than 1 staff. I haven't tried it either,
but I know what will happen.

Because tempo applies to all the staves, you'll end up
altering the tempo of the other staves that contain
"normal" note values.

The only way to get around this problem is to really do
the math and compute the actual note values. This could
involve getting down to the 64th note level. If it takes
more, you can change the base note value and change the
tempo to make it sound right.

For example, 5 against 4 eighth notes could be done by
5 occurrences of 4 32nd notes each against 4 occurrences of
5 32nd notes each (appropriately tied to one another),
with the tempo adjusted to make the total of 20 32nd notes
occupy the same time period as 16 of them normally would.

Or something like that.

- seb


#456: cue notes
cue notes

(456)

Submitted by: John E. Taylor on 11-Feb-1998

After butting my head against a stone wall for two days, I think it's time to ask for help!
I need a way to include "cues" in the printed parts I generate. Some way to include notation in a smaller size than the point size used for the regular notation of the part. Does anyone have any ideas?

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Stanton on 11-Feb-1998

John, a technique I've used with V1.50 to add a 'swing' indication on Big Band Scores is to assign one of the USER fonts to be NWC15 and then used a bit of experimentation with Word 6 to determine that capital 'G' is a quarter note (crotchet) or that carital 'G' is an eighth note (quaver) etc. and use it as inserted text. The draw back is that I can't find a "space" because the space bar gives a chunk of stave !. But it allows all the notes to be positioned at whichever size and place that you wish. Hope that this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew P on 11-Feb-1998

John,
Have you tried using grace notes? They are cue-size. Unfortunately, I think maybe half and whole notes are note available, I don't know why.
They don't take time from a bar, but DO sound. If you are not worried about playback, this won't be a problem, otherwise you can mute the notes with hidden ppp dynamics.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Ken Stanton on 16-Feb-1998

It has been pointed out to me that a combination of brain-fade and bad typing made my previous reply a little difficult to follow. When I mentioned "Capital G" I was referring to "upper-case 'g'". I was trying to get over that using certain letters as inserted text with NWC15 assigned to a user font will create Musical Symbols of varying size. Some experimentation is required to determine which symbols will result from which keystrokes.

Reply 4 offered by: Carl Peter on 28-Feb-1998

When I upgrade to 1.50 I realize that I can substitute grace notes for cue notes, but I would like to be able to do so for all note values.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 28-Feb-1998

Unfortunately, v1.50b still hasn't addressed grace/cue note size for whole and half notes. Maybe a quick note to Eric would be helpful, here.

A

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Mar-1998

This is not possible in 1.50. This kind of change requires changes to the NWC font, which will not be done until the next major upgrade.

Reply 7 offered by: Cem Gülbay on 11-May-1999

I want to get more notes of songs but I can't find any of it. how do I get it?

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 11-May-1999

Cem, I do not understand your question??
(note: current version of NWC is 1.55b, I remind this because this thread is rather old).
"grace" notes are still all available but half and whole notes.
What is your trouble? Finding NWC files ? entering notes into scores?

see you soon,
NWCly yoursn, Marsu


#457: Tacit
Tacit

(457)

Submitted by: Richard Lee on 11-Feb-1998

Is there some "tacit" marking in dynamics?
I think it would be easy to implement and convenient. Sure,
I can ask NWC to *mute* an entire staff, but sometimes I want
the piece to be played but with leaving out the a couple of measures
in one part (for comparision, e.g.)

Also, I sure would like to be able to have a relatively
larger font for lyrics (relatively = without the notes
also getting larger).

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Feb-1998

I do not understand your question about a "tacit" marking, so perhaps you could elaborate.

As for larger lyric text, this is now fully supported, as of version 1.50. You now control the lyric text font typeface, style, and size. This is independent of the notation size. This is true for other text types as well. Goto Page Setup for full details.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew P on 11-Feb-1998

For muting sections, try embedding a ppp (which you can modify to volume or velocity 0 if you want).

For fonts, version 1.5 gives font control in the Fonts tab of the Page Setup dialog.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Dane on 19-Feb-1998

If for example you were writing a piece of big band music and wanted the trumpets to play of beat chords on the second repeating of a phrase this is what I would do.

Write out the score as normal with first and second time repeats with the text "tacet/tacit(sp?) 1st time)" Then mute that staff.
Then create another staff with eaxactly the same music on it but instead of the using repeats just put long bars rest were you want the tacet to go.
You then don't print this staff in the final version. This means that you have one staff for your computer to play and another to print out.

I think there was an example file with version 1.50 which showed how to use different staffs for different parts. (except that was showing how to do trills)

Robert Dane http://www.netcomuk.co.uk/~sjdane/rjdane/home.html


#458: font size for notes
font size for notes

(458)

Submitted by: Carl Bangs on 11-Feb-1998

What is the equivalence in font sizes between NWC1.31 and 1.50? Specifically what is the old size 12 equal to in the new version?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Feb-1998

Carl - I had the same problem at first - I assumed that the staff font definition was the same in both versions.
Eric explained that the staff font size now refers to the spacing between the staff lines.
To produce a similar appearance as the v1.3 12 point I now must use 18-20 point. This produces about 10-12 staves per page.
Ask Eric what the new definition is his explanation would be better than mine.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Feb-1998

In version 1.31, the point size specified in Page Setup defined the size, in points, for the italic text that appeared in the staff. All other elements, including the notation, staff width, bold text, and lyric text were size adjusted based on this value. In version 1.50, you control your own sizes for all text used on the staff (as well as typeface, etc.). The new Staff Size option in Page Setup allows you to specify the distance, in points, that extends from the E line to the F line in a treble clef staff (minus all ledger lines).


#459: Beaming with Stems Up and Down
Beaming with Stems Up and Down

(459)

Submitted by: Stan on 12-Feb-1998

Help!

Is there a way to create beams on the same note
going up and down using quarter notes and up?
Or beaming with two notes on the same stem but one going up
and the other down? I am currently using NWC 1.5.

Thanks for any solutions.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 12-Feb-1998

I don't understand the first question.

You can control beam direction using the stem direction tools.
For example, to put two stems on a quarter note, place the
first note, look at the stem direction, push the stem direction
tool for the other direction, then press Ctrl-Enter.

For two notes with stems going in different directions, do
the same thing, except move the cursor to where you want
the note to be.

You can combine rests with notes in a chord this way too.
The trick is that the rest has a "virtual" stem. The note
you chord it with must be longer than the rest. What you
do is push stem up, place quarter rest, push stem down, place
half note where you want it, push the stem tool to turn it
off.

Whole notes have virtual stems as well.

WARNING - You should make sure the stem tools are off (not
pushed down) when you are finished, or NoteWorthy will not do default stem direction
anymore.

Reply 2 offered by: Stan on 12-Feb-1998

Thanks Blair for your input. Clarification on thefirst question.

Is there a way to create beams on the same note on a measure
that may have more than one note on a stem to indicate that
there are more than one instrument playing that stem? It might
also be a single note on that stem that more than one instrument
might play. In other words, beaming in both directions at the
same measure for the same note.

Hope that clarifies that first question.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Feb-1998

You cannot beam quarter notes at any time. You can add a single beam to 8th notes and smaller. You cannot add both a beam up and a beam down on the same notes in a staff.

Reply 4 offered by: Ken Stanton on 13-Feb-1998

I'm not sure if this echoes the original question. But if you position 2 or more notes that occupy different positions vertically on the stave, but are part of a chord. You can select, before operating the chord member (CTRL-ENTER)addition, select stem direction. Is it possible, if one section of a series of say, 3 or 4 'quaver based' chords is stem up and the other section is stem down, to beam both the up stem parts and the down stem parts of the same chords? Does that make sense ? it did when I wrote it !

Reply 5 offered by: Paul Heichelheim on 13-Feb-1998

I too would like to be able to beam chorded notes of opposite stem direction, but NoteWorthy will only allow beaming in one direction at a time. It looks funny to have a mixture of beamed and flagged notes, so I end up having to either use no beams or set all the stems to the same direction. It would be better if we could beam the notes on both stem directions.

Would this be considered a bug?

Reply 6 offered by: Eric Black on 22-Feb-1998

I would like to echo the concern about beaming notes in both stem directions. It's very strange to see the notes beamed only one way. Possible issue to address.

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Feb-1998

While we are beaming in two directions, how about beaming
across two different staves. Piano arpeggios that require
both hands are often written this way. It saves a lot of
messy rests.

Implementing this in NWC will not be trivial. You would have
to multiple-select the two staves, which would cause beamed
note entry to span the staves. Non-beamed notes would not
be allowed. This would be nice, but there are a lot of more
basic missing features that should be done first (eg. hairpins,
trills, ripple ups, etc.)

Reply 8 offered by: Bob De Vivo on 31-Mar-1998

I'll further echo the request to be able to beam notes of a chord in opposite stem directions. I do a lot of part writing for voice,
and whenever 2 parts share a stave it's important to give each part a consistent stem direction. The inconsistency in beaming looks very
confusing to the singer.

Reply 9 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Mar-1998

Beaming chords in opposite directions for two voices on a staff:
Yes, we want it. But how to do it? It might work like this:
Write the first set of notes, force their stems up, and beam them.
Chord in the next set of notes with stems forced down.
Select that set and beam them.
The rule would be that if some notes were already beamed, and other notes with stems in the opposite direction were beamed, then only those notes get beamed in the opposite direction.
Would this simple rule be sufficient, or are other cases I have not thought of?


#460: Pitch Bend Questions
Pitch Bend Questions

(460)

Submitted by: Alister Marsh on 12-Feb-1998

I am very interested in bending notes; I understand
MIDI multi-point controllers well enough, but my problem
is that I can't figure out how to pitch-bend a certain
note to another given note - in other words, I can bend
the pitch of a note, but not to what I want it to.
How do I know what value to set the sliders to? This is
a real pain.
If, for example, I wanted to use pitch bend to go from a C
to a D, how would I do this?
Thanks. I hope this isn't an annoyingly dumb question.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Feb-1998

The exact implementation of Pitch Bend is "synthesizer dependent", because not all equipment performs the same. Many soundcards implement a two semitone range, both up and down from the current note. If your soundcard is one of these, you can bend from C to D by:

1 - Start a C-Note playing
2 - Sweep the pitch bend to the largest possible value

Try it out and see if it works with your system. It should, as most soundcards seem to do it this way by default.

Reply 2 offered by: Joseph hansche on 16-Mar-1998

Yes. The extent of each side of the middle is around 8000 something... That is 2 halfsteps, a whole step or two semitones (however you want to put it) It is a pain that you cannot bend further than a step.

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 17-Mar-1998

You can bend two steps (4 semitones). For instance, if you
want bend from C to E:

1 - Start a D-Note playing with pitch bend to the smallest possible value
2 - Sweep the pitch bend to the largest possible value

Or use a synthesizer that has a configurable pitch bend,
if it exists.


#461: layering
layering

(461)

Submitted by: Meg Doyle on 13-Feb-1998

I have been struggling for ages to write choral music in NWC where soprano / alto, and tenor / base parts are written on the same stave. I have been doing it using chords but it was rather messy, and some things you could not do at all. The new layering feature which you have released on an experimental basis gets round all the difficulties. Please can you ensure that the layering feature or something similar is supported in future upgrades as I would not want to see it dropped.

Reply 1 offered by: Pete Collins on 17-Feb-1998

I would have to agree with you. The staff layering is a great idea. If it were possible to "hide" or make notes invisible, particlularly rests, that would also be helpful.

Reply 2 offered by: Richard Burdett on 18-Feb-1998

Can I echo Meg Doyle's request that this feature be kept and
enhanced in future versions - it's much needed!

Thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: Marcel Bock on 23-Feb-1998

The layering feature is essential for all those who have to
write multi voice staves, as it permits to write and play
back each voice separately, and then superimpose them on
for printing.
This feature solves a lot of existing problems, often
discussed in this forum, like beamed notes stem up and
stem down, and so on.
This feature should appear as the most asked feature in
the wish list.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 23-Feb-1998

It's also a very elegant solution to the problem. I imagine the problem with rests overlaying in the wrong spot could be solved either by NWC grabbing the bull by the horns and putting in some smarts in to move rests where they overwrite another note or rest, moving up for the higher (stem up) part, down otherwise.; or allowing user control of rest placement, which would help users who need to put rests near notes that are far away from the middle of the staff. I'm wondering how this whole overlay part would work for piano pieces where - say - the right hand plays chords and a melody at the same time.

Andrew

Reply 5 offered by: John Gillings on 23-Feb-1998

Could someone please give a blow by blow description on how
to do this layering? The docs say the feature is enabled
by editting a file which uses the feature. Can you spell
CATCH-22?

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Feb-1998

See either of the following locations:

1 - the NWC newsgroup

2 - the NWC User Tips section of our web site

3 - or download directly from http://www.ntworthy.com//composer/files/xprmntl.zip

The zip includes two experimental files that you can use as the basis for trying it out.

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Feb-1998

Oops! The address should read as:

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/files/xprmntl.zip

Reply 8 offered by: Glynn Fluitt on 15-Apr-1998

This is the only missing feature that has kept me from
purchasing and registering this product. In arranging
Barbershop music for amature musicians, it is not acceptable
to explain to them that the Tenor is the TOP of the
collection of four staves. I don't want to learn the
complexities of Finale because Noteworthy is every bit
the package I need, the simplicity I look for, but did not
allow me to superimpose to voices when printing. Please
make it available and keep it in all forthcoming versions.

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 11-Jun-1998

Glynn,
I can't figure out why the tenor should be the top staff. Unless you're talking of male choirs of course.
And can't imagine why tenor singers would be uncapable to read THIS staff ?? Unless you use the tenor clef, of course ;-)

However, try the experimental staff layering feature thanx to http://www.ntworthy.com/////composer/files/xprmntl.zip (the link works with a normal webbrowser. If not, try http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/files/xprmntl.zip instead. :-)

MAD
Choir singer, soloist, flutist, composer, ... and HappyReg'dUser of NWC


#462: Quantising
Quantising

(462)

Submitted by: Phil Green on 14-Feb-1998

I am new to MIDI and am having problems when playing a keyboard for input into V.1.5
When entering 4 crotchets in invariably get a mixture of quavers tied to various semis and demi-semis. Can anyone
recommend a way around this. I am aware that I can use the computer keyboard but obviously this is a slower way of entry.

Thanks in advance.

Phil.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Feb-1998

You have two options:

1. Go to Tools, Options, and make the Note Resolution value a larger value (for example, change from 32nd notes to 8th notes).

2. You can change these settings on the fly by recording your performance, and then manually importing it using the Staff, Import Recording command. This allows you to set the import options specifically targetted at your last performance.


#463: Add a Staff only for part of piece
Add a Staff only for part of piece

(463)

Submitted by: Wayne Daniel on 14-Feb-1998

I'd like to add a staff for a soprano descant but have it appear only on a couple of pages toward the end of the piece.

How can I do that in NoteWorthy Composer 1.50?

Reply 1 offered by: Geoff Allan on 15-Feb-1998

As far as I'm aware you can't with nwc printout but..

What I tend to do is to score the various different staff setups
as different nwc scores then when I wish to print copy the
printout as bitmap files (from print preview) then assemble the
final score in a DTP package (in my case Page Plus).
I did this quite successfully for a set of Anglican responses I
wrote last year.

Hope this helps,

Geoff Allan

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Feb-1998

NWC does not currently support score systems with varying staff contents in a single printout. As Geoff points out, you can manually build different systems and construct them, but there is not way to do this just with NWC Vercion 1.50 and a single print command.

Reply 3 offered by: Warren Barnett on 10-Jun-1998

You might try dividing the score up as separate files for single pages to be printed. (For example... "song_pg1", "song_pg2", etc.) You could then add the single staff for the page or pages required and then remove them when they are finished. They would print on the entire page but it would do the trick.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

In your case, (a staff more in last pages) you can divide your complete score into 2 parts only :
the 1st part with the "normal score";
the 2nd with the soprano+normal score. You may have to add some empty measure before the sop. really starts though to match a complete page.
Do not forget to set the 1st page number in the 2nd file :-)

HTH, MAD


#464: Audio to MIDI conversion?
Audio to MIDI conversion?

(464)

Submitted by: Jeff Jones on 15-Feb-1998

Does anyone know of a software program that can take audio
input (or WAV file) and create a MIDI file from it that can then be taken in by NWC to get a score? I guess what I am looking for is a sort of OCR for audio.

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 15-Feb-1998

Autoscore, www.wildcat.com does a very poor job for a single voice/instrument if that voice instrument is extremely accurate in pitch and duration. They now offer a 30 day money back (advertised as risk free but they get paid before shipping) trial of their product ($249 US). They used to have a demo but after people tried it - no sales.
Audio2Midi, www.audioworks.com, sounds about the same, haven't tried it, $118 US to download it.
Someday audio to code (MIDI) will exist if there is a real market for it, but ...

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-Feb-1998

Jeff - If are looking to producing a score from a CD or .wav file the technology isn't there yet.
The best I've seen at an experimental stage has been done by a reseacher at Durham Univ. - UK I think.
The problem involves indentification and separation of the frequency components in the wave into discrete note frequencies for all instruments in the score.
Harmonics (partial frequencies) muddy the end result.
If you are interested find a copy of Spectrogram - try shareware.com - a freeware program that produces a frequency plot of a .wav file.
I have used this to identify chords on shot notes that are difficult to transcribe - you may have trouble reading the output though which is displayed on a log scale.

Reply 3 offered by: Jeff Jones on 15-Feb-1998

Many thanks. I'll wait on the technology to catch up.

Reply 4 offered by: Paul Tooley on 17-Jan-2000

AudioToMidi is a pretty good product for converting a solo instrument to midi. I wish it could transcribe pitch bending though. You can get a free demo from thier web sight.

Reply 5 offered by: Tom Brown on 14-Jun-2000

Try Digital Ear:
http://digitalear.iwarp.com/

It is by far the best audio-to-MIDI conversion software.

Reply 6 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Jun-2000

Digital Ear are offering a commission on sales to anyone who will recommend their product on the web.

Readers should, perhaps, bear this in mind when considering recommendations for this software.

I would recommend downloading a demo first to see what it can do.

Reply 7 offered by: Stoker on 15-Jul-2000

Audio Logic Gold
You Will Love Live

Reply 8 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 9 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 10 offered by: Joe Music on 15-Oct-2000

The URL for the free "Spectrogram" program is:

http://www.monumental.com/rshorne/gram.html

If you know what a spectrogram is, then you know what this program does, and does it well. But it is NOT a wav-to-MIDI converter. If you want to manually create a music file (say, by using NWC) and cannot tell by listening what note is being played at a given point in your wav file, Spectrogram can analyze the file for frequency components. What you do with that information is up to you. I believe that this technique would only be useful to experienced musicians who can usually analyze a recording by ear, and write the notes from it, but who need a little help.


#466: Sharing the audio device
Sharing the audio device

(466)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 17-Feb-1998

I have a new problem, and I don't know whether it is due to
my new version of Windows (95 instead of 3.1) or to my new
version of NoteWorthy (1.50 instead of 1.31).

Before, the audio device was only reserved and used by
NoteWorthy when playing the song (key F5 or click on Play).
It was possible to compose a song with NoteWorthy (but not
to play it) while another program used the audio device.

Now, I have various problems when I try to launch NoteWorthy
and, say, Winamp at the same time.

1) If NoteWorthy is running (and not playing) and I try to
launch Winamp, then I have a message "Could not initialize
audio: Audio device already in use"

2) When Winamp is playing and I try to launch NoteWorthy,
I may have several different behaviours.
2.1) Message "Abnormal Program"
2.2) Message "GDI failure"
2.3) NoteWorthy runs, and then I can even click on "Play"
and hear both "Bohemian Rhapsody" by Winamp and "Warm
up" by NoteWorthy ! (I call this a "table de mixage"
in french, maybe "mixing table" in english ?)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Feb-1998

Goto Tools, Options, then the MIDI Tab. Set Port Usage to "While Playing" and NWC will never access your MIDI ports until you press the Play or Record buttons. However, in this case, you will lose step entry MIDI input (if you are using an external MIDI keyboard).

The varying type of failures that you currently experience may also indicate a problem in your MIDI drivers. Did you upgrade a current machine to Windows 95? If so, you may want to see if newer MIDI drivers are available for your sound card (if you have not done so already). Check with your computer/soundcard manufacturer for details.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 17-Feb-1998

Thank you for your answer. I will change this MIDI option.

About your last question, I forgot to say that I also
changed my computer (from a Pentium 90 to a Pentium 233)
and I suppose that the last MIDI driver came with this
new computer/soundcard. But I will also try and see with my
manufacturer.

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 17-Feb-1998

A last question on this subject.

Suppose that I have the last MIDI driver (*the* good driver),
that I don't set Port Usage to "While Playing", and that I
launch NoteWorthy while the audio port is busy. What should
be the correct behaviour for NoteWorthy ? An error message ?
If any, which message ?

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Feb-1998

If a MIDI port fails to open in NWC, the error message:

"One or more of your selected MIDI devices are failing to open.

Would you like to go to the MIDI options tab to investigate?"

Respond "Yes" if you want to find the problem, which in your case is the fact the another program is using the port, and the port's driver does not allow multiple programs to use it simultaneously.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 17-Feb-1998

And what if you respond "No"?

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Feb-1998

If you answer "No" then the error is ignored (you are not taken to the options area to find and correct it).


#468: Strange attractors (Ties running wild)
Strange attractors (Ties running wild)

(468)

Submitted by: Drake Donahue on 18-Feb-1998

Seen this before?
Receive 'Petite Valse' from fellow in France (scanned in color at 72 DPI sent as a .gif). Photoshop and IPhoto can neither one handle making a good 300 dpi lineart copy for midiscan to use. Print it out on the inkjet, scan the print copy, midiscan eats it up!! Does better than it does on music store mint copy scores. Go figure. Edit in midiscan, convert to midi, import to Noteworthy, nice job NWC. Good sounds till the long slow piano part that goes for 6 dotted quarter notes in 3/8 time at d=66. Sounds of silence revisited in spite of much hardwork with AWE contol panel.
However--this piece will do just fine if those ties are replaced with slurs--in fact probably the composer meant slurs and midiscan did ties.
So untie those notes and set them free!
Highlight-good-tie button is depressed-good-release the tie button-bad-the tie just flipped LEFT to the closest equal pitch note-??
Untie that and it flips left again or it does not have a depressed tie button and you can't untie it. Delete the note and the tie jumps left..
After the "strange" notes have no depressed tie buttons I play the tune just to see what happens sonically. The ties don't play. After I stop play, the "strange" tie symbols are gone. However the next time I play I get the Dreaded Stuck Notes. Stuck notes go away after a save and reopen.
Other files imported from .mids will sometimes do this, some don't.
Clueless in Carolina.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Feb-1998

I am having trouble following your question and how it relates to NWC. If you have a MIDI file that you think is being improperly imported by NWC, feel free to send it to us for review at support@ntworthy.com.

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 19-Feb-1998

The behavior was:
editing an imported .mid file, desiring to remove a tie
Highlight the lead note
click the depressed tie key
tie key pops up
tie symbol redraws connected to an equal pitch note to the left of the original, the right end of this new tie symbol would variously remain in place, move left to the original start tie note, move right to some other equal pitch note.
Or delete the tie note and the same sort of left jump would occur.
Tries at removing the bogus ties would cause them to do more left jumps until a tie spanning several equal pitch notes was drawn. Eventually, when highlighted, the lead tied note would have a raised tie button. Deleting a lead tie note with an inactive raised tie button would cause another left jump.
Playing the piece would clear the bogus ties.
Save/reload cycles cleared the stuck notes.
Not reported as a bug because I cleared the problem by play/save/reload and was unable to duplicate.
My question was "Have you seen" and the apparent answer is no. The other time I saw similar behavior was on imported files with the 32 bit beta a long time back. A review of one of the files from that era found one case of a tie/slur marking with neither tie nor slur button depressed, deleting the lead tie note cleared that right up.

The behavior will not repeat on a reconstructed version of the file I was editing at the time.
Conditions are not the same, I am now 1.50a and have neither ability nor will to duplicate the editing sequence or the start up / shutdown sequence of NWC and other programs I did that day. I think I remember WIN 95 being flaky shortly after the editing was over. Does untying ties involves windows system calls?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Feb-1998

If you get flaky lines or junk on your screen while using NWC, the first thing to try is a Refresh, on the F9 key. If the unusual display is corrected after pressing F9, then you can chalk it up to one of two things:

1 - NWC screwed up somewhere and corrupted the screen display (temporarily)

2 - Your display driver screwed up and did not paint the screen properly

Either way, if an F9 clears it up, you can be sure that you do not have a problem.

By the way, the 1.50a patch does fix some things in this area, but not specifically in the tie display.


#469: DS al Fine vs. Repeats
DS al Fine vs. Repeats

(469)

Submitted by: Rich Noble on 18-Feb-1998

I have a piece of dance music with the repeat pattern
AA BB CC DD EE FF DD EE FF. Each of the sections A - F is
bracketed by master repeats. I put a signo between the
master repeat close of section C and the master repeat
open of section D and a DS al Fine after the master repeat
close of section F. When I play it, however, it plays as
AA BB CC DD EE FF D E F. My more musically-educated friend
tells me that this is not the usual interpretation of the
DS notation. How do I get sections D - F to repeat on the
DS?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Feb-1998

NWC follows standard music convention when it comes to D.S. al Fine redirections. Convention dictates that repeats be ignored after a redirection to the Segno mark. This is also true on a da Capo redirection. In both cases, master repeats are ignored by NWC until and unless another redirection occurs by branching to a Coda.

In your scenario, however, you can get around this by using local repeats.

Reply 2 offered by: Eric Black on 22-Feb-1998

What's the difference between a master repeat and a local repeat with regards to this program? The local repeats allow you to loop more than twice through the same section, but what else?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Feb-1998

See the repeat*.nwc samples, and the File Info explanations included in them.

Reply 4 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 16-Mar-1998

Do you mean "|: A B C :| S. |: D E F D E F :| D.S."???
Try just a Dal Segno and not D.S. al Fine/Coda. That's what I use and it works fine for me. About the repeats, I think he's right about using local repeats. And then just use a different layout if oyu want to print...

Reply 5 offered by: Rich Noble on 16-Mar-1998

Using local repeats worked. Thanks. :)


#471: Please help (request)
Please help (request)

(471)

Submitted by: Joe Eidson on 19-Feb-1998

I'm sorry to post this here but I am desperate and this is
my last hope! =(
Does anyone out there have/know where I can get a MIDI or a
Noteworthy file of the song "Universal Judgment" by Camille
de Nardin???? I really would like to find this song, and I hope
someone can help.
Thanks,
-= Joe =-

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 20-Feb-1998

Try
http://www.und.nodak.edu/instruct/knorman/521/universaljudg.html
and
http://www.realism.com/Pierce/notes97.htm

That's all I could find using Altavista. Neither are Midis, but both give the publisher's name.
I imagine the piece is still in copyright.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: A on 20-Feb-1998

Not too sure about the copyright, if what they say is correct, "This symphonic poem won first prize at a national band competition in Naples in 1878 and was first published in 1934."
I think it's fifty years after date of publication if the composer has died before 1924 (75 years ago).

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Kent Dugan on 20-Feb-1998

I think I played it in High School Honor Band. It's for full concert band, and has lots of difficult altissimo clarinet?
Don't know where you'd find that.
Or is there another piece with that name?

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Eidson on 20-Feb-1998

>> Kent:
Not sure about the clarinet part, I play french horn myself.....
I know there is lots of 16th-note tounging.....
I think I will just borrow the score from my director and
sequence it myself.
Thanks for your help.

Reply 5 offered by: Linda Perrron on 09-Aug-1998

Does any one Know who wrote Amazing Grace, and more importantly in what year?

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 10-Aug-1998

Amazing Grace was written by John Newton in about 1750
in Olney, Buckinghamshire, England.

Olney was also the home of William Cowper, another well know poet/hymn writer. It has the longest high street in England and is the home of the Pancake Race.

The tune is originally a Scottish folk song imported into America and attached to Newton's hymn.


#472: Converting keyboard files to midi
Converting keyboard files to midi

(472)

Submitted by: Tom Gilland on 20-Feb-1998

My wife has a keyboard which creates files with a suffix of .sgn which she would like to import into Noteworthy without
connecting the keyboard to the pc. She can play files created in Noteworthy on the keyboard, but cannot get the files to go from the keyboard to Noteworthy. Someone had mentioned to her about changing a windows file (win.ini?), but as she is not technical she cannot remember exactly what they said. Does anyone have any ideas. Many thanks. Tom

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 20-Feb-1998

Right click a *.sgn file and rename it *.mid, double left click it and see if it plays on your media player. Some companies make standard formats look proprietary by assigning an extension only their stuff wii read. If it does, import it and have fun in NWC.
After that fails, check the manual for the keyboard it may well have a .mid output option.
After that fails, check the company by net, phone, letter for converter software.
After that fails, net search for a user group and or user web pages.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Feb-1998

If you can look at the binary contents of the file, you should see a "MThd" label at the top of the file IF the file is in standard MIDI format. Otherwise, as suggested, you should look for a converter program to convert the file to MIDI format.

Reply 3 offered by: Alton Atherton on 20-Dec-1999

Thank you all for your very helpful response.
I will do what I can with the info.
Thanks Alton!


#473: Starting tempo
Starting tempo

(473)

Submitted by: Alan Rolfe on 20-Feb-1998

I know how to change the tempo by inserting a tempo change,
but how can I set the tempo at which a song starts.
I find that I have to insert a tempo change after the first
note, or rest, or insert an extra bar to get it to start at
the speed I want.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Feb-1998

Do you have another tempo change elsewhere in the score that starts at the beginning of the song? If so, you must remove it if you want a tempo is some other location higher in the score to control the tempo. For example, on an imported MIDI score, any tempo changes contained in the file are placed in the conductor staff (the last staff in the imported score).


#474: Measure numbers
Measure numbers

(474)

Submitted by: Ed Aposhian on 20-Feb-1998

I just loaded NWC and I'm impressed. I loaded the sample files and noticed on the Beethovn song there are measure numbers. I've looked everywhere in the help screens but find no reference to this item. So... how do you add measure numbering?

EA

Reply 1 offered by: christian wolllin on 20-Feb-1998

Go to file/page setup/measure numbers

Reply 2 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 16-Mar-1998

Go to FIle, Page Setup, Option, and towards the bottom, change the drop list to plain, circled, or boxed (to your preference.)


#475: Placing rests between beamed notes
Placing rests between beamed notes

(475)

Submitted by: John on 20-Feb-1998

I'm afraid that I know little about music but a friend of mine uses Noteworthy (who doesn't have internet access) and wants to ask if there is a way of getting rest symbols between notes when they are beamed.
He realises that beaming is not essential but apparently this is desirable for the music he writes and the people playing it.
Any help? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Feb-1998

You can't put anything between beamed notes. Not even text,
which should make no difference.

Reply 2 offered by: Arie van Peer on 16-Mar-1998

You can put symbols between beamed notes if you can squeeze them in by inserting the text at the left of the beamed group and then using spaces to move the position of the text to the right

Reply 3 offered by: John on 16-Mar-1998

Thanks for your help. I will pass on your comments.


#476: Hairpins etc.
Hairpins etc.

(476)

Submitted by: Peter V on 20-Feb-1998

I've found a useful way to get hairpins, extra slurs,
and other graphical notations onto a score is to draw them
'off line' (I use Top Draw) and save them in a clip art
directory as Windows Metafiles. Cut and Paste the score
page into a suitable package then import and position the
symbols as required. Page Plus for example can stretch,
flip and rotate graphics, so almost any requirement can be
met. I WISH ... for dynamic hairpins and repositioning of
slurs - they often obscure lyrics.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Feb-1998

Peter - have you had any joy in importing a metafile or screen save from NWC into TopDraw.
I cant do it successfully - I guess the TD metafile format is a bit strange - I have a similar problem with Coreldraw imports.

Reply 2 offered by: Eric Black on 23-Feb-1998

I have heard that good old Microsoft Word works well enough when you paste a clipboard-copy of a NoteWorthy Composer page.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 23-Feb-1998

Barry - In answer to your query re importing to Top Draw, Although
the import is at first sight successful, I've found that invariably
the note 'dots' are incorrectly aligned almost half their width
below the correct position. The width to height proportions of the
score are sometimes distorted, although this can be corrected by
dragging.

Corel Draw! (version 4) takes a year and a day to convert the file,
and then doesn't always position all the symbols correctly although
the notes are OK. Serif Draw Plus 2 misses out the slurs and thins
the text fonts. So it's back to good old Serif Page Plus (version 3)
(I haven't got Word, Eric, so can't comment on that).

As a further refinement to the Page Plus solution, I've set up a blank
page with my extra symbols pre-loaded outside the printable area.
Once the music score has been pasted, it's then very easy repeatedly
to copy and paste extra symbols as required. So far I've set up a
hairpin, slur, ripple (for arpeggios etc.) and 'plet' (for quadruplets,
sextuplets etc.) You can at the same time of course add fancy titling
and extra text if required.

I'd be happy to post a copy of the blank Page Plus page to the forum if
I knew how! As a beginner on the 'Net I'm not up to that yet - any tips??

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 23-Feb-1998

Barry - In answer to your query re importing to Top Draw, Although
the import is at first sight successful, I've found that invariably
the note 'dots' are incorrectly aligned almost half their width
below the correct position. The width to height proportions of the
score are sometimes distorted, although this can be corrected by
dragging.

Corel Draw! (version 4) takes a year and a day to convert the file,
and then doesn't always position all the symbols correctly although
the notes are OK. Serif Draw Plus 2 misses out the slurs and thins
the text fonts. So it's back to good old Serif Page Plus (version 3)
(I haven't got Word, Eric, so can't comment on that).

As a further refinement to the Page Plus solution, I've set up a blank
page with my extra symbols pre-loaded outside the printable area.
Once the music score has been pasted, it's then very easy repeatedly
to copy and paste extra symbols as required. So far I've set up a
hairpin, slur, ripple (for arpeggios etc.) and 'plet' (for quadruplets,
sextuplets etc.) You can at the same time of course add fancy titling
and extra text if required.

I'd be happy to post a copy of the blank Page Plus page to the forum if
I knew how! As a beginner on the 'Net I'm not up to that yet - any tips??

Reply 5 offered by: John Taylor on 23-Feb-1998

Post it as an attachment to a post on the news group.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 23-Feb-1998

Thanks for replying, John, but as I said earlier I'm a total
novice on the 'Net (as witness my fumble fingered repeated
reply above) and I need to be led by the hand . . .

Reply 7 offered by: John E. Taylor on 24-Feb-1998

Post your Email address here and I or someone will get back to you and lead you through.

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Vasey on 24-Feb-1998

Thanks John, E-mail address now linked. I've been looking
at the news group system and note one of the icons is called
attachments - surprise surprise! Maybe I could find my own
way, but your kindly assistance will be most welcome.


#477: NWC file association not possible
NWC file association not possible

(477)

Submitted by: John Marchington on 21-Feb-1998

I am unable to click onto a file with extension NWC and have that file displayed in NoteWorthy Composer. The latter loads OK , but then I get a message saying "Cannot find the file 'C:\ ...." (or one of its components). Make sure that the path and filename are correct and that all required libraries are available."
I have had this problem with a number of versions of NWC (I'm afraid I can't remember how the problem started now) and am currently using NWC 1.50. I don't have this problem with any other application like Word (doc files), PaintShop Pro (numerous graphics formats)etc.
I can, of course, load NoteWorthy Composer then, once in it, load the NWC file I want to. It's just that I would like to be able to do it the other way to.
Once in NoteWorthy Composer, everything is fine.
Eric of NoteWorthy Artware spent some time with me and we went through the Win95 Registry etc without finding anything unusual. I've tried deleting the file association registration then re-registering it, but the fault continues to appear.
Any suggestions would be most welcome.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Feb-1998

We do not recommend trying to setup the NWC file association manually (the setup routine does this for you). However, if you must do it, here is how to do it:

- Open the REGEDIT program

- Goto the HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT/.nwc key (if it does not exist, then you must create it).

- Set the default value for this key to "nwcomposer"

- Now, goto the HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT/nwcomposer key (if it does not exist, then you must create it).

- Set the default value to "NoteWorthy Composer Song"

- Create the remaining keys as follows (if the key does not exist, then you must create it):

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT/nwcomposer/shell/open/command
Set the default to your NWC32.EXE program, specifying its full short filename patch (eg. "C:\PROGRA~1\NOTEWO~1\NWC32.EXE")

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT/nwcomposer/shell/open/ddeexec
Set the default to "[Open(%1)]"

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT/nwcomposer/shell/open/ddeexec/Application
Set the default to "NWC32"

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT/nwcomposer/shell/open/ddeexec/topic
Set the default to "System"

Once completed, you have setup a file association between .nwc files and the 32-bit NoteWorthy Composer program when the Open command is requested from the Windows Explorer. Windows will open the file by first starting NWC32, then telling NWC32 to open the file using a DDE conversation.

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 21-Feb-1998

I would recommend exporting the registry to a floppy before changing it. If you have an oops you can import from the floppy to get back to current status.
An alternate to straight manual entry might be:
uninstall NWC from start\settings\control panel\add/remove programs
start\run\regedit
registry\export registry (if you are chicken like me)
find, right click, and delete the .nwc and noteworthy composer entries mentioned above from the tree
exit regedit and reinstall NWC

Reply 3 offered by: John Marchington on 21-Feb-1998

Thanks for the replies from NWC Support and Drake Donahue. Sadly, neither offered a solution to the problem. I confess I have almost given up hope of finding what's wrong.
Incidentally, I tried backing up the Registry as suggested by Drake but could only find a floppy with 1.2MB free. Believe it or not, the Registry backup filled up the floppy and I got an error message. I decided to proceed without the backup and, fortunately, didn't run into any problems.

Reply 4 offered by: Drake Donahue on 21-Feb-1998

If you are chicken (like me) make a copy c:\windows\win.ini under another name or in another directory.
Start\run\sysedit
click on win.ini to bring it up front and expand it to fill configuration editor
search\find nwc
should bring you to a line under under programs like: NWC32.EXE="C:\NoteWorthy Composer\NWC32.EXE"
If you don't have it you need it and the path in quotes should be correct for the copy of NWC32 that works for you.
Continue to find nwc to the bottom of the file to eliminate any extra NWC= entries that point to wrong locations.
BTW you have a HUGE registry. :) You can export to your hard drive if you wish.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Feb-1998

John: We will send you a debug utility and procedure in an email. We are writing the test procedure now, and should be sending it to you by the end of today (Sunday, 22-Feb-1998). Perhaps an error in your system is causing the problem, and maybe we can determine this through diagnostics.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Feb-1998

OK, a diagnostic package has been sent to your email address. After running the test, you can send the result in an email reply (per the instructions in the package), or simply add the results to this thread.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Crossley on 22-Feb-1998

I have had this problem with Word Files using MS Office professional. I was strongly advised not to interfere with the registries and to re-install Ms Office. As soon as it was re-installed all was well.
Hope this helps.

Reply 8 offered by: Drake Donahue on 22-Feb-1998

My current conclusion is that the autostart hook in NWC is no longer present.
Perhaps it never was and I'm remembering Noteworthy Player when I remember Noteworthy autoplaying my .NWC files.
It further appears that if Player was installed and autostarting and then Composer was installed, Composer takes over the .nwc extension. It appears composer has the handles to load, to start, to load the designated song, but not to play it automatically.
The easy way out, download and install NoteWorthy player. If clicking a .nwc plays it in player then tutto bene.
If not, open any directory or My Computer.
View\Folder Options\File Types
Hunt down and double click NoteWorthy Composer.
In the large white window in the dialog box should be two entries: open
Play
One of the two will be in darker print.
If open is darker, a problem is found..
Click Set Default until Play is in dark type.
Close and ok out.
Try a double click on a .nwc, Player should jump up and play it.

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Feb-1998

NoteWorthy Player associates a "Play" command with *.nwc files, accessible by right clicking on any nwc file. MIDI files also get some associations to the player. Composer always associates as the Open command for *.nwc files, regardless of if or when the Player is installed.

Reply 10 offered by: Drake Donahue on 23-Feb-1998

Thanks for resetting my memory on that.
The user can reverse the action.
Change the default as discussed in my last post to play and a double click will start NWPlayer playing the tune, a right click and open will start NWComposer with the tune awaiting editing respectively.

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Feb-1998

Yes, this is a good tip. The user can decide which command should be the default action in Explorer. This is possible from the View Options command in the Explorer. This kind of change is relatively easy, and does not require that technical file association details be changed (so it is a much safer operation to perform).

Reply 12 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Feb-1998

New information from John has indicated that his *.nwc file association works correctly once he has started NWC32. However, Windows does not properly perform the association if NWC32 is not already running. Has anyone else experienced this? Some further details are this problem, and other association fact, are listed below:

- NoteWorthy Player is an SDI (Single Document Interface) program, so we did not implement the DDE version of File Associations. This is because users want a new Player window to appear when loading a new NWC file, rather than just having a single copy of Player running all the time that opens the last file that was clicked in the Exporer.

- NoteWorthy Composer does not currently accept command line arguments, so it will not load an *.nwc file that is dropped onto the NWC icon in the Explorer (this is becuase Windows just converts the dropped file into a command line argument when it opens the command that was targeted by the drop). You can, however, drag and drop files from Explorer into an already open NWC program.

- The DDE file associations are working on John's system, but only after he has started NWC32. If NWC32 is not already running, the DDE mechanism fails to perform the DDE association procedure as defined by Microsoft. It is supposed to work as follows:

DDE File Association Steps after an file action is requested in Explorer:

Step 1: Explorer opens a DDE conversation with the application. If this succeeds, then the application is told to open the requested file and skip the remaining steps. From the infomation in your latest email, this step appears to work correctly on John's system.

Step 2: If the DDE conversation attempt in Step 1 fails, then the Explorer should start the target application using the command line specified in the registry. This step also appears to be working almost correctly on John's system.

Step 3: Once the program is started from Step 2, the procedure from Step 1 should be performed again (the DDE conversation should be initiated, and a request to open the selected file should be sent to the program). This step, possibly combined with a problem in step 1 or 2 above, is NOT being performed correctly on John's system. The error message from Windows is not very descriptive. It is not necessarily trying to tell you that the selected file does not exist, but rather is trying to say that it encountered an error while trying to initiate the DDE conversation with NWC32.

For those experienciong the problem: Do you have something running on your system that might be interfering with this process? Perhaps something on your system is causing a delay (like an anti-virus utility, crash guard program, etc), thus triggering a synchronization problem between step 2 and 3 in the above procedure. Our advice would be to try the open procedure after closing everything else down on your system that is not needed. One way to do this is to press Ctrl+Alt+Delete, then select each running item shown in the Close Program Window, except for "Systray" and "Explorer" (if you close these items, your system will cease to function correctly).

Reply 13 offered by: John Marchington on 26-Feb-1998

I'd just like to take this opportunity of thanking all those who offered assistance in my hour of need and to inform you that, thanks to Eric and the team at Noteworthy Support, the problem has been solved to my satisfaction.

A great bunch of people supporting a great piece of software.

Reply 14 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Feb-1998

As a result of this thread, changes were incorporated into the latest maintenance release in an effort to help. Version 1.50b adds full support for opening a .nwc file from the command line, at the same time as NWC.EXE or NWC32.EXE is loaded. The DDE version continues to be fully supported as well, so the choice remains with the user as to which method to use.

Version 1.50b is available now. Goto http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/upgnwc.htm to get it.

Reply 15 offered by: Des McCloskey on 21-Aug-1998

Having read the thread regarding file association/registry problems - which, incidentally, are not by any means unique to NWC - I have discovered a relatively easy method to deal with the problem.

As a Windows 95 user, I have found it lacks some of the benefits of Windows 3.XX.
I have since re-loaded the Windows 3.1 "winfile.exe" to my Windows95 root \WINDOWS folder.( The old MSDOS Dosshell works in similar fashion. )
When problems occur such as discussed above, I open "Winfile" and make the necessary "File"---> "Association". This saves the bother of using Windows95 "Regedit.exe".
( The MSDOS Dosshell works in similar fashion. )

Regards,

Des


#478: NWC 1.5 difficulties
NWC 1.5 difficulties

(478)

Submitted by: TJ Clean on 22-Feb-1998

I use Noteworthy since versions 1.30 and do so under win3.11,
on a laptop with a small hard drive, and win3.11 and 95 on
my home system, out of preference.
When I used 1.5 recently under win3.11, I consistently
recieved general fault protection in the upper 4 megs of
memory, particularly when using the enhanced zoom from 1.31.
I have reisntalled 3.11, thinking I might have corrupted a
piece of its sytem, but the problem persists, and only when
run under 3.11, not 95.

has anyone else noted this?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Feb-1998

I am not clear what "the enhanced zoom from 1.31" refers to in your message. Could you explain this?

If you consistently get a GPF when zooming in or out in Win 3.1, it is possible that you have a display driver that is misbehaving. You might want to try switching to the stock VGA driver (assuming that you are not using this at the moment), and see if that helps.

If it persists, it would also help if you included the address of the GPF that is displayed by Windows. This might help to identify the problem as well.

Reply 2 offered by: TJ Clean on 23-Feb-1998

By enhanced zoom, I mean that the Zoom feature is capable
of zooming Outward in 1.5 further than in 1.31. The zoom
allows a lower pixel number than 4.

I tried using the generic SVGA windows driver and VGA and
continued to encouter the failure.

I've had a memory upgrade recently, and pulled it out,
fearing the RAM was bad, but studying the GPF address
numbers showed it to be in the upper 4 megs of whichever
memory configuration I used. I even cut the virtual memory.
(who knows, its windows. . )

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Feb-1998

The 2 pixel zoom was removed in 1,50a. Version 1.50a does NOT allow zooming out below a 4 pixel staff width. If the 2 pixel staff width was causing your problem, it will not cause it in 1.50a, as this zoom level is not possible (we took it out for problems, perhaps related to problems that you are having).

Reply 4 offered by: TJ Clean on 23-Feb-1998

On a version I just downloaded from the main page, the zoom -is-
capable of 2 pixel, and still yeilds memory failures.
Is the version on the main page 1.50? or 1.50a?

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Feb-1998

You can determine which version you have by selecting Help About in the program.


#479: Hanging Notes After Transposition
Hanging Notes After Transposition

(479)

Submitted by: Barry Graham on 22-Feb-1998

Notes tied across a bar line create the biggest problem - particularly if the first note of the tie has an implied accidental from a note earlier in the measure.
Forcing accidentals will reveal the accidental on the first note of the tie but doesn't show the true status of the note in the following bar.

When writing big band scores I write in concert and transpose the trumpets and saxes before printing out the parts.
I have found the following procedure a big help in eliminating false accidentals before transposing a staff.

Force accidentals - Examine each cross bar tie - Select/highlight the second note of the tie.

The TRUE status of the accidental is displayed on the TOOLBAR.

If the accidental on the second note differs from it's partner in the earlier bar change it to match using the appropriate accidental tool.

The staff should now transpose correctly without hung notes or extended ties.

Barry Graham
bargrah@hotmail.com
http://members.tripod.com/~melbmusic

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Feb-1998

If you have a soundcard, another technique can also be used, using your ear as the guide. Select the staff that you want to test, then change the instrument patch that plays for the staff. If you change it to something like an organ (anything with infinite sustain will work), then you will hear any mis-terminated tied notes as "stuck notes" in the playback. If you hear a stuck note, then you can use Barry's procedure to diagnose and correct the source of the problem.


#480: Putting a little swing into the thing
Putting a little swing into the thing

(480)

Submitted by: Eric Black on 22-Feb-1998

I'm not sure if this issue has been ever brought up, or if anyone has even thought of this. What would be the chances of activating some sort of "Swing feature" whereby two eighth notes could automatically be played as a quarter note and an eighth note in the times of two eighth notes.

I do not believe that this feature has been implimented in any other sequencers. If NoteWorthy Composer were to have this feature, it would be a great deal (what a price!) for the swing set.

Just thought I'd swing by.

Reply 1 offered by: Paul Heichelheim on 23-Feb-1998

Mozart is the only shareware program that I have tried that automates "swing". However, IMO, it falls way short in other areas in comparison to NoteWorthy.

NoteWorthy is a MUCH better product for the money.

Paul

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 23-Feb-1998

F'rinstance, Mozart (when I tested it - asked for my money back and ordered Noteworthy instead) couldn't do polyphony in a staff.

ABC (a VERY non-Wysiwyg program) allows you to allocate timing ratios to beats. Say, 13:11:12 for triplets, 3:2 for lazy duplets, 3:1 for more strident swing, 2:1 for tripletty swings. This sort of feature would be FANTASTIC, allowing us to make much more realistic sounding music, esp if we can modify it on the fly.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Alex Hough on 17-Mar-1999

There is another program which implements swing excellently to a variety of degrees!

However, hold onto your pockets and purseslads and lasses because it'll set ya back

£700
£700
£700
£700
£700
£700
£700
£700
£700

Yes, babyloves £700, it's called Sibelius, every musicians dream, apart from Noteworthy whihch is heaven on Earth, I hope the wish list is achieved!

PS I know loads about Sibelius so contact me if you want to know more!

Reply 4 offered by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 22-Mar-1999

I bumped intothe same problem when trying to play back a standard 4/4 score with a 12/8 section in one of the voices. My workaround was to write it all in as 12/8, then tripletting three and three of the eights to perform well under 4/4 playback. It sorta sounds like swing!

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Edwards on 22-Mar-1999

I think I requested this two years ago. If you have different time signatures on different staves, then compound times should mesh with simple times, and not with note values. i.e crotchet = dotted crotchet, rather than quarter note = quarter note. More grist to the wishlist mill please!

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 24-Mar-1999

I'd like to say that this is feasible since the earlier versions of NWC.
Save 700£ ! ;-) Go and see at #http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip6.htm#jazz and you'll know anything about this. With small effort, you can do rubato triplets with 11/36+13/36+12/36 proportions if you want. If you find the current solution not enough, I can write a small program (or XL shett but I'd prefer not) to let you know automatically the currect values to set.

Pleeeeaaaase do not hesitate to contact me for further details (since I got an internet access back).

Sure this helps

                                              MAD

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 24-Mar-1999

Oops, I meant http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip6.htm#jazz !

For this discussion, you may also refer to msg #373, msg #1067, msg #698, msg #438

NWCly yours

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Edwards on 24-Mar-1999

I think we are talking about two different things, or at least looking at different solutions to the same problem.

My request was for different time signatures on two staves simultaneously. One work round for this would be to have a 'false' time signature and then tripletise the whole staff but it would be nice then to make the triplet signs invisible.

That brings me onto a wider wish - that all elements should be visible/invisible at will.

Particularly:

Legato at the start of a piece so that the performance is correct, but most of the time the actual marking is inappropriate.

Dynamics etc on multiple staves when normally only one indication would be necessary.

Triplets and staccatto markings are normally replaced by 'simile' after a couple of bars.

Octavo Clef signs could get round the lack of a proper 8va implemetation, with a text only 8va marking.

Rests could be used for empty bars in Staff Layering.

Yours in hope
Peter

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 25-Mar-1999

Peter,
I admit that I was answering just the 4 first items of this thread (before it leaded to 12/8+4/4).
Though there is a solution to your problem too, but very tedious for now (until it is possible to set "invisible" property to items... add a wish ?) I used for a printed score libretto. Only for visual purpose, not sound. For sound the subject was already discussed (and solved I guess) in earlier threads. Get the offline forum and search thoroughly :-)

The solution (or rather turnaround) is to add items (rests or notes) on the "shortest measure" score to make bar lines (and beats) align properly. Add these items *off* the score (I mean under or over), so you will be able to hide them when you print the score.
To do this, you'll have to import the score from the previez window, as .wmf format or directly via clipboard, and either remove the excessing(?) items, either putting a white bitmap over them.
I told you this is tedious. I made this because I had to use a word-processing program anyway, for insierting pictures in my printed pages.

please Let me know if you find this useful, or if someone finds a better way (for now)... :-)

NWCly yours,
                    MAD


#484: Printing Problem - NWC 1.5
Printing Problem - NWC 1.5

(484)

Submitted by: Allen Card on 24-Feb-1998

I am having a terrible time with printing. The problem? Every time I start to print my music, the printer extends way beyond the paper on both right and left and as it makes passes back and forth, nothing lines up right. I at first thought it was a printer problem, but my printing in other programs is ok. I have tried everything to fix it, but haven't succeeded yet. It acts as if the paper is much wider than it is. I used the 1.3 version for some time with no problems, then all of a sudden started having this same problem in that version. I thought upgrading would fix it, but it didn't. Has anyone else had this same problem, or do you have any ideas for me?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Feb-1998

Without the file, it is difficult to guess what is wrong. It could be that you have not added any bar lines, have misaligned measures, or perhaps have a misbehaving printer. Make sure that you have bar lines in appropriate spots, are not using too large a font, and have the proper printer settings. You may want to go to Printer Setup to make sure things are set the way you want.

Lastly, if you send the file to us, perhaps we can figure it out from its contents.

Reply 2 offered by: Allen Card on 24-Feb-1998

I would like to send you the file; that way, you would be able to deteremine if it is my printer. Just last week I got some music to print just fine, so I don't know what is wrong. None of the other things you named seem to be the problem.

Reply 3 offered by: Eric Black on 25-Feb-1998

Try pressing F9 to refresh the score. Audit the bar lines. Select Letter-sized paper (8.5" in X 11" in) in Print Setup.

Make sure that you have set margins around the music. By default, NoteWorthy Composer seems to print with 0" margins on all sides of the printout (i.e. no margins); and the score will print incompletely and erroneously.

I have experienced the same sort of strange phenomenon ... the bar lines are stretched out of proportion and NWC prints out many pages of gibberish.

Perhaps one of the files within the software has become corrupted, infected, or damaged. I'd suggest removing NWC from your system, and then installing it again. In other words, have the Uninstall utility remove your directory. Don't just run the install program another time and replace the files in the already existant directory. This may not work, but, by chance, it seemed to solve a problem that I had been experiencing. It couldn't hurt.

Reply 4 offered by: John Taylor on 27-Feb-1998

If you are still having this printing problem, try sending Eric at NoteWorthy the information in the display window of Page Setup, ie: Device Mode Data and Printed Page Sizes.

Reply 5 offered by: Allen Card on 27-Feb-1998

Thanks for the helpful comments. I'm still having the printing problem, but I have sent the music file to NWC Support to see if they can figure out what the problem might be. I would say that it could be my printer, but other program files seem to be printing ok. I have checked and double checked the margins, bar lines, etc.,...everything I can think of. The score looks okay visually. Hopefully I'll find out something from them. Thanks again for the help.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Feb-1998

We received the file. We are sending a modified vbersion back to you in an email. The problem was caused by misaligned measures. When printing, the bar lines in the selected staves MUSU line up. They must have the same number of measures, the same number of bar lines, and the same rhythmic alignment. If any of these conditions are not present, you cannot expect NWC to reliably print a musical score, as it gets confused on what you want it to look like when formatted.


#485: Importing NIFF files
Importing NIFF files

(485)

Submitted by: Jakob F. Skipper on 25-Feb-1998

I have been looking at the Midiscan program (www.musitek.com), which can scan sheet music and export it to MIDI or NIFF. The advantage of NIFF over MIDI is that you don't loose notation information.

But how can I import NIFF files into NoteWorthy Composer?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 25-Feb-1998

Does this really work? This could save a tremendous amount
of time. I'd like to hear about people's experience with this.

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 25-Feb-1998

Pretty much, download the demo from www.musitek.com and make up your own mind.
A 300 dpi optical flatbed scanner recommended, feed through is of, hand held-forget it. Flatbeds are cheap. When you import set reolution to equal the smallest note / smallest rest in the scanned converted piece.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Feb-1998

Currently you would have to import the MIDI file produced from a scan.
The NIFF format has not been widely adopted by developers of notation software as yet.
I guess when they do NWC will follow.
The big advantage is that all you marks, dynamics, repeats etc. are included in the file transfer.
I posted a request for info on NIFF in the forum last year and followed up a few of the replies.
There is some info available at http://www.musitek.com/niff.html but if you want a full description of the proposed spec try http://www.jtauber.com I'm not sure of the extensions after that - could be /music/encoding/niff/spec (I'm sorry, the full URL is truncated on my printout).
Anyhow try the site to for more info.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 25-Feb-1998

niff is also supported by Lime, which still freezes and crashes on me (though the version you pay money for may be more stable). I heard (somewhere) that Niff will be supported soon by another manufacturer, but apart from that, no one else seems to be announcing any moves. So I wouldn't expect to see it in NWC for a while. A brief overview of niff revealed that NWC would be able to fully implement about 90% of the spec. 5% more could be kludged.
The last 5% (eg hairpins) may come when they get implemented in nwc.

A

Reply 5 offered by: Drake Donahue on 25-Feb-1998

Midiscan converts tiff>mnod>midi, NIFF is not an issue. I know of no other music scanning software.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 27-Feb-1998

Have a look at http://www.softpart.co.uk They market Midiscan,
also a German notation program, Capella, and its linked scan
program, Capella-scan, with which the scans can be edited then
either exported as MIDI files or imported directly into Capella.

I have to admit that Capella is more advanced (at the moment anyway!)
than NWC in its use of graphics and depth of musical notation, BUT
of the Windows notation editors I've looked at, namely Capella, Mozart
and NWC, only NWC came over for me as having a truly intuitive interface,
with far and away the quickest and easiest method of note entry -
surely the single most important factor in any notation program. And
it plays back much better than the other two!

Reply 7 offered by: Trevor Barnes on 23-Mar-1998

I have Midiscan and it's stability and accuracy is a bit
dodgy. It seems a rather clumst product.

I've looked at the demo version of Capella and the
methodology seems much sounder than Midiscan.
It's also a good bit cheaper.

Reply 8 offered by: Don Ruckman on 26-Mar-1998

I purchased MidiScan, some time ago and after using for about 1-2 hours, I packaged it up and took it back--actually got my money back.
After scanning music, looking at the scan was OK
After MidiScan finished with it, it looked nothing like the scan: missing time sigs, bar lines placed randomly,just general garbage. The amount of editing required would have been excessive. Would be easier to compose or play in music. Sorry for this report, but this was my experence.

Don Ruckman email ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew on 26-Mar-1998

I had heard similar, though I'd hoped things would improve as they refined it. I'm sure it depends on the complexity of the music and quality of the scan, but it is still not an easy task even with dot perfect scans.

A

Reply 10 offered by: David Miller on 28-Apr-1998

I've just recently started using Pianoscan to scan and convert
music to midi but find that when i import the midi into NWC the
music requires a lot of editing. I have had better luck when
converting to NIFF and importing into lime but find that lime
is very cumbersome to use, especially when adding finishing touches
such as lyrics. NWC is so much easier to use for editing; I
hope that NIFF capability will be added to NWC.
I have found that the quality of the original sheet music has
a big impact on the accuracy of the scan.

Reply 11 offered by: Chad Peplinski on 13-Jul-1998

I have just recently purchased Midiscan. The program is very easy to use and the implementation of the NIFF file format gives Midiscan an edge over so many apps. In fact, I was getting poor recognition until I actually broke down and called their tech support. WOW. Those guys are great, I actually talked to a person and he walked me through the whole process. Yes people, some tech guys do know their product. I love the fact that you get Lime with Midiscan for free, the current version 5.0, not some crappy shareware version.

Reply 12 offered by: Wim Van Wassenhove on 19-Mar-2000

2 years later...
Noteworthy composer still isn't importing NIFF and I still like Noteworthy more for editing than Lime.
I recently discovered Sharpeye, music OCR, I would love to use it in combinartion with Noteworthy.

It works to export to Midi files and import the midi in Noteworthy, but I feel NIFF import capability would add a lot of value.

Reply 13 offered by: Neil Clayton on 15-May-2000

I've used SharpEye and it was very accurate (i.e. after scanning and viewing it looked identical to the original) however after exporting it as MIDI and then importing it into NWC I had to put in quite a lot more work to get it back to the original... Support for NIFF in NWC would be very useful.

Reply 14 offered by: Roger Malton on 29-Nov-2000

I've been using Cakewalk Scorewriter for some time to produce finished work. I'm trying Smartscore (son of Midiscan, I think) but am getting a bit frustrated by the lack of a common format bewtween the two, other than midi which loses a lot of format including repeats. I wrote to Cakewalk a year ago suggesting incorporation of a scanner into the product. Some expression of interest, but I doubt whether it comes to much, and wrote again a few days ago suggesting incorporation of options to import from NIFF and ABC. No reply as yet.
I would have thought that it was in the interests of vendors to support as many formats as possible, in order to boost software sales, as has happened with graphics and audio formats. Any information on conversion from NIFF to SCW would be welcome.

Reply 15 offered by: Barry Graham on 30-Nov-2000

Cakewalk no longer develop Score Writer.
They "service" the product - which means they'll sell you a copy and may one day get around to answering your enquiry but don't expect any upgrades or enhancements.


#487: Printing Problems with 1.5
Printing Problems with 1.5

(487)

Submitted by: Dave Yanuk on 26-Feb-1998

I'm experiencing printing problems with NoteWorthy 1.5.
Printing in either landscape or portrait mode results in
only a portion of one page of the score being printed. The
bottom of the page in portrait (left side in landscape) comes
out with the dots of the notes only. No stems, bar lines, staff lines,
etc. The Windows print manager then complains that the printer
is out of paper. The printer performa properly woth every
other application on my machine.

thanks in advance for responses.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Feb-1998

NWC uses your default pinter settings, as defined in the Printers control panel applet. My first suggestion would be to try changing some of the options, either directly from the Control Panel applet, or from the Printer Setup in NWC. If this does not help, try copying the NWC notation using Edit, Copy Special, or the Copy command in Print Preview. Paste this into something like Microsoft Word, and try printing. Let us know the results of the test (it tests whether your printer is handling the NWC font and graphics commands properly).


#489: Printing and Transposing MIDI Files
Printing and Transposing MIDI Files

(489)

Submitted by: Tom Dressler on 27-Feb-1998

My friend has a keyboard that she can put MIDI fles
on a floppy disc. We want to transpose these to a lower
key and print them out so we can play them on another piano.
I have just down loaded nwp and nwc. Any suggestion on how
I should proceed. Thanks, Tom

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Feb-1998

You can import standard MIDI files within NWC or NWP, but only NWC will enable you to edit them and print them out.

Reply 2 offered by: graham howes on 21-Jul-1998

yes but how do i stop it mapping midi files to innumerable staves?
i want max 3 staves ie vocal line plus piano part and i keep getting
what seems like a huge orchestral score!

thanks

graham

Reply 3 offered by: Goode, Steve on 01-Apr-2000

I use a program called MusicTime. This program reads your midi and converts them into
scores. As the “orchestral”, You can copy and past the staffs you need onto a new score
sheet. There’s an option called “Split staff”- use this to take a staff that is condensed and
(It looks like a mess of bass and treble all put in one staff) split into two.

Reply 4 offered by: Sue Morton on 02-Apr-2000

Hi Graham,

There are a couple of reasons why you might be getting "all those staves" when you import a MIDI. The most common reason is there really are THAT MANY channels in the MIDI file you're using, they will come in on separate staffs as they represent separate instruments to be played. The other reason is the channel(s) are being split in an attempt to separate bass from treble.

You can easily see which of these is the case during NWC import. On "Step 3" of the import wizard, you can see what tracks are mapped to what MIDI channels. If any have been split and you don't want them split, you can edit it right here. Or, back up to "Step 2" and give a global number for the split (the default is 18, you can give a max of 127 which means "no split").

Once you've finished the import into NWC, you can delete any staffs for instruments you don't want. If you were only interested in the vocal line and piano, just delete the other staves and save your file.

HTH and Good Luck,

Sue


#490: More Wishes
More Wishes

(490)

Submitted by: Arthur Archer on 27-Feb-1998

Hello All,
I have to agree that NoteWorthy is a superb value for money package. (Don't put the cost up!) This forum where relatively small niggles and glitches can be sorted out by other users is a great idea.

What I wish for though, is when I place chord symbols on the stave ( eg C , G7, Am etc) I would like these to be transposed with the notation.

Why? If I transpose from say concert pitch up two semi-tones for a Bb instrument, It is useful for improvisers to see the chord symbols for their instrument.

Regards Arthur Archer.

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 27-Feb-1998

I agree. But since chord symbols are current only text field, it's meaningless at this point. Need the chords to have value as far as beats are concerned, and then we can (that's me and the mouse in my pocket, I'm guessing) can assign semitone counts for the letter names of chords and count up the number of semitones to actually perform a transposition.
On the other hand, mayber a macro can handle this. Any takers? Maybe break down the flats and sharps and assign values for those, add that to the chord letter name, then count up the number of semitones and re-assign the proper chord value?

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 28-Feb-1998

I don't think we can do anything other than manual adjustment until NWC actually implements chords (add your vote to the wish list, I prefer to think that the wish-list mechanism actually works). A macro can't do this unless it has a way of looking at the text, which it can't.
Musicmaker, an Australian product, has a good chord implementation, where each chord has a set of check boxes for b5, aug, 7, maj7, etc... and then a drop down list for A, A#, Bb, B, C, C#, Db, etc. (ie we should include enharmonics). Then when you transpose a staff, the program just looks for chords as well, and transposes them too. Very easy. ("Yeah, right" says Eric).

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 16-Mar-1998

That would be a great feature. But What I think would be
better is to implement graphical chord icon. For example:
Encore let's you add the chord symbol (a grid with dots for
finger placements and the chord name next to it). This
feature would help out a LOT and then possibly, It would
then let it transpose the chord name... Where would I find
the wish list anyway? Is it in this forum???

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Mar-1998

The wish list is hard to find. It should be linked on the forum page.

Go to the home page, select the Noteworthy Composer page, and the wish list will be on the list on the left.

Or just use http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm


#491: Copying Lyrics
Copying Lyrics

(491)

Submitted by: Lee McHugh on 27-Feb-1998

Is there any way to copy lyrics from one staff to another?
If I'm doing SATB with one voice per staff, it would great
to type in the lyrics just once and copy them to the other
parts and modify from there rather than typing them out for
each parts seperately.
Also; is there any way to clear individual entries in
the history function?
I've not been able to find any info in the help files for
either of these.
Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Bill Marshall on 27-Feb-1998

Copying lyrics from one staff to another is straightforward.
Just use copy (CTRL/C) and paste (CTRL/V) to copy through
the clipboard, as in any Windows app. You also can save time
and typing effort by copying segments of lyric that repeat.

As for deleting History entries, why bother? Don't the
older ones just fade away naturally while the recent, more
active ones dominate?

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 04-Apr-1998

If you have to edit the History list, this can be done using
Notepad. Load nwc.ini from your Windows Directory and you
will find the History list. Edit this, but make a backup
copy first just in case! Don't remove anything to the left
of the '=' sign, and if you take out an intermediate entry
you need to shuffle up the lower entries. Hardly seems
worth it really. You can of course clear the whole history
list using the 'Clear' Button on the History Form.


#492: Fermata placement
Fermata placement

(492)

Submitted by: Bill Marshall on 27-Feb-1998

I find that a fermata placed over an ordinary note is
correctly positioned (with Preserve Width off), but on a
note with an accidental it is placed over the accidental
(or sometimes midway between them.) On a chord with
multiple accidentals it really gets out of position.
Can this be cured?

All in all I love this program --- good work!

Reply 1 offered by: Rik Schuurmans on 02-Mar-1998

I hope this problem can be cured. I had the same problem many, many times.

Reply 2 offered by: Jim on 26-Apr-1998

I am looking for the translation (into English) of the following term: fermata sussidiaria.

A friend of mine has a sign that's labeled with these words,
and if you can translate, you'll settle a longtime debate about its meaning.
Thanks,
Jim

Reply 3 offered by: Paul on 27-Apr-1998

According to babelfish (Italian to English), the literal translation is

"stopped subsidiary"

I don't know if this helps, but you never know...

Paul


#493: Noteworthy Player
Noteworthy Player

(493)

Submitted by: Charles Martin on 28-Feb-1998

Is there a way to set the path for my music in Player so it opens the right folder when you choose the open file button?
I did this in Composer but have been unable to find a way in Player.

Charles

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Feb-1998

The player will open in whatever default directory is specified by Windows. In Windows 95, this is specified in the File Properties for the NoteWorthy Player shortcut. On Windows 3.1, it is specified on the NoteWorthy Player icon. Lastly, it is far easier to open the MIDI or NWC file directly from the Windows Explorer. Simply select "Play" for NWC files, or "NoteWorthy Player" for MIDI files.


#494: Problem with staccato?
Problem with staccato?

(494)

Submitted by: David on 28-Feb-1998

Further to earlier posts titled "Timing errors" I think the problem is that Noteworthy doesn't understand staccato. In the case where importing a file with resolution 8th length and 8th rests, Noteworthy makes it go to 32nds or 64ths or whatever.
The solution would be if Noteworthy could have a smoothing feature when it imports a MIDI file, OR if it would just add a dot to say that the note is staccato.
What do you suggest? <b> :-) </b>

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Feb-1998

NWC will not mark any notes as staccato during an import. YOu would need to do this manually. If you want to prevent a note from unnecessarily being imported as a short note, like a 64th note, then increase the rest resolution to something like a quarter note, or even a half note. This will prevent note events from being notated as a small note followed by a small rest. However, it will not prevent small notes where they are actually necessary.

Reply 2 offered by: David on 12-Mar-1998

Okay. Would it be possible to add an option to the screens where you import MIDI files, so that short notes could be written as the note resolution you have selected with a staccato dot?
This would stop the MIDI-to-note length converter writing notes as 64ths etc.

I am extremely happy with NoteWorthy. This tiny addition or some smoothing option would make it perfect.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 13-Mar-1998

Yes, but....

This might not meet the needs of some musical purists (who, me? pure? never!) as a staccato crotchet (half note?) generally ought to have a longer duration than say a non-staccato semiquaver (eigth note?).

Having said that, one might get a closer approximation to what is required using a configurable algorithm like

note shorter than X = staccato dotted X
where X = half/quarter/eiigth etc note

and save some editing.

Reply 4 offered by: David on 17-Mar-1998

For this one MIDI I am trying to import, I know the notes are already quantized to eights.

(import settings)
If I set the res to quarters I lose half the information.
If I set to the res to eights I get what you see at:
http://www.flexi.net.au/~acelogix/ntw.gif

If this problem can be solved it would more than halve my work around time.
Has anyone else had the problem or is it just me using another sequencer and importing the MIDI into Noteworthy?

Recording straight into Noteworthy is not an option either.

Appreciating your help.


#495: ABC to noteworthy, tune archives
ABC to noteworthy, tune archives

(495)

Submitted by: John Ashurst on 01-Mar-1998

I would like to own a basic collection of folk tunes in noteworthy format without typing them all in. Are there noteworthy files I could download? Alternatively I have found huge collections of folk tunes in abc format. Can these be converted to noteworthy and if so where do I look for the software? I had a brief look in the archive but ran out of patience. Is it possible to search the archive as I guess these questions are answered in there somewhere.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 01-Mar-1998

You could convert ABC to Noteworthy by using a program to first convert ABD to Midi, and then importing the midi. Most folk tunes are simple enough that this should work fairly well.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Offer on 01-Mar-1998

John, if you check at the <a href="http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/">ABC Home Page</a> (http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/), you will find a number of ABC players available for download. the one I like best is ABCMUS, which can convert to MIDI or play ABC tunes and the Songwright tunes from the <a href="http://www.mudcat.org">Digital Tradition Folk Song Database</a>.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Offer on 01-Mar-1998

John, if you check at the <a href="http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/">ABC Home Page</a> (http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/), you will find a number of ABC players available for download. the one I like best is ABCMUS, which can convert to MIDI or play ABC tunes and the Songwright tunes from the <a href="http://www.mudcat.org">Digital Tradition Folk Song Database</a>.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Offer on 01-Mar-1998

Well, I really goofed that up. I guess this forum doesn't take html links.
Anyhow, that link to the ABC Home Page is http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/
You can use a program like ABCMUS to convert ABC tunes to MIDI, and then import the MIDI into Noteworthy.

The Digital Tradition Folk Song Database is at http://www.mudcat.org
You can download the entire Digital Tradition database, which includes some 6,500 folk lyrics, plus over 3,500 tunes in SongWright format. The tunes are available online in MIDI format and you can download them one-by-one if you only want a few. One you import the MIDI into Noteworthy, you can paste the lyrics from the Digital Tradition into Noteworthy. You do have to hyphenate the lyrics by hand, I guess. the Digital Tradition has a lively forum, and you're welcome to join us there.
-Joe Offer-

Reply 5 offered by: George Ashton on 30-Oct-2001

I knocked up a small windows prog to convert Songwright to Noteworthy if that would help? Works fine on all DT files I have tried it on, lyrics and all.

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 30-Oct-2001

Actually, the forum does take HTML links, but not coded the way you do it with a text editor. See the "Hints" link, located just about the reply text entry box, when you make a forum reply.


#496: Wrong measure-numbers after repeat
Wrong measure-numbers after repeat

(496)

Submitted by: Peter van Iersel on 02-Mar-1998

There's a little problem I encountered concerning
measure-numbering. The conventions of music-publishing
dictate that an up-beat (a first measure that has a shorter
duration than a normal full-length measure) shouldn't get a
number assigned to it. In NoteWorthy Composer you can deal
with this situation by letting the measure-numbering start
at zero (page setup, options, measure start = 0).
This works fine as long as there are no repeats in the
movement. The section that comes after a repeat is again
bound to start with an incomplete measure that should not
get it's own number. NoteWorthy, however, does assign a
number to it, so after a repeat in a movement that starts
with an up-beat all the measure-numbers are one too high.
The only possible work-around I can think of is splitting
the movement in two files, which enables you to manually set
the measure-start for the second section.
Not a very elegant solution!
Has anybody got a useful suggestion on the subject?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Mar-1998

I'm not sure I understand completely.
Do you have another anacrusis bar midway through the piece?
Like does the music stop and restart?
Or does the flow continue to the next movement.
If you pad this with rests the bar would count.
When you say repeat do you mean using repeat symbols?
In which case the anacrusis!! would be in a first ending or have I got this wrong?

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 04-Mar-1998

I think I understand the problem because I experienced the
same. The problem is that a "decorated bar line" is considered
to separate two measures, even if it is inserted in the
middle of a single measure. Thus a measure with a "master
repeat open" or "master repeat close" in the middle of it
will be considered to be *two* measures instead of one.

I think it is rather difficult to fix: it would require
to count the number of beats before and after the repeat
bar. For instance, if we are at 3/4:
1) If there are 3 beats before and 3 beats after, then
count 2 measures.
2) If there are 1 beat before and 2 beats after, or the
inverse, then count one measure.
3) If there are 2 beats before and two beats after... ahem...
this is very bothering!

Maybe the better fix would be to add new styles of decorated
bar lines:
- ones that count as an actual measure separator;
- other that can be inserted in one measure without
incrementing the bar count.

What do you think of this, Eric ?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Mar-1998

We will give consideration to this issue as we plan future development. I cannot, however, guarantee anything at this time.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter van Iersel on 04-Mar-1998

Thanks to Olivier Miakinen for explaining my measure-
numbering problem. That's exactly what I meant! I posted an
example to the NoteWorthy newsgroup as an illustration.

I do agree with Olivier Makinen that it would be difficult
to fix the problem in a 100 % watertight way.
May I suggest a simple fix that should work fine for music
that sticks to the traditional rules of composition:

If measure-start is set to zero, don't increment
the measure-number on a master-repeat.

What's your opinion?


#497: addition to the nwc roles--also MIDI
addition to the nwc roles--also MIDI

(497)

Submitted by: Louis D. Diaz on 04-Mar-1998

Hello:
hey, are there no salsa comnposers using this software,
here's what I can do with it when I get real Latino.
I like anonymity on the web, so my name is mloud@HOTMAIL.com
My AKA is LOUD
P.S. I am looking for a way to attach my NWC file contribution, but you don't include that option. E-mail
me, and I will send it to you, thanks for great software.

Reply 1 offered by: John E. Taylor on 04-Mar-1998

Louis:
Use the newsgroup. When you make your post to the newsgroup, you can attach your file to that post. You can attach either your .nwc file or use the export feature and attach the resulting .mid file.

Reply 2 offered by: Louis D. Diaz on 05-Mar-1998

I can't beleive tha latin music is excluded from your idea
of what your program can be used for. I Include my effort to
the cause, many latin musicians may be included. So There.


#498: Transpose Viola Clef to Tebble Clef
Transpose Viola Clef to Tebble Clef

(498)

Submitted by: alice goleby on 04-Mar-1998

I need to transpose some music written in Viola Clef
to Trebble Clef. The music has been entered into NWC
as-is and now needs to be transposed to Trebble Clef.
Does anyone know how to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Mar-1998

This first step isn't always necessary but I always do it just in case.
CLick on the TOOLS menu and FORCE ACCIDENTALS.
Position cursor at the very start of the Alto clef.
Hold down SHIFT and press END to select the entire staff.
Hold down both CTRL and SHIFT and press the DOWN ARROW six (6) times.
The notes are now at their Treble position.
Select the Alto clef and click the RIGHT mouse button.
Click on SELECTION in the menu displayed.
Select TREBLE clef then OK.
Hold down CRTL and press F9 to audit the staff or you could press F9 or the REFRESH SCORE tool.
The above step fixes the accidentals to match the clef among other things.
From the TOOLS menu click on AUDIT ACIDENTALS then AUDIT NOTE STEMS.
Should be then be OK.

You could shift the notes up one and transpose down an octave but this could require adjusting the sound transposition.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 05-Mar-1998

Sounds like it'd be a good tool to have. "Change clef".

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-Mar-1998

Clef Change Procedure:

1. Select the clef, press Ctrl+E, and change it as necessary

2. Now, press Home, then Shift+End, which selects the whole staff (you can also try this procedure on smaller selections, where appropriate)

3. Press Shift+Ctrl+Up/Down arrow until the notes are at the
proper position for the new clef

4. Press F9 to update the key signatures

You now have completed the clef change.


#499: Decorated Bar Lines
Decorated Bar Lines

(499)

Submitted by: Keith Markham on 06-Mar-1998

As I am involved with writing music for another composer, he often requires 'Master Repeat' bar lines 'back to back' - that is, with dots both sides of the thick line. Is it possible to do this in Noteworthy? To put in 'repeat close' followed by 'repeat open' looks OK if they occur at the end/beginning of the stave line, but not if they are in the middle of the line.
Another minor 'wish' - can we also have a 'thick' bar line as well as a double one. I mean one which looks like the one at the end of the final bar?

Reply 1 offered by: Rik Schuurmans on 07-Mar-1998

In addiction of this I have another minor wish. Is it possible to have an option to replace the standard 'end-bar' (the one on the nd of the final bar) by another. Exspecially by one who had the 'repeat-dots' with it. It's now not possible but sometimes I need it.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 07-Mar-1998

I believe (hope) that Eric is working on these, as they have been reported for quite a while now. You may wish to send a direct e-mail to support@ntworthy.com just to make sure he knows of (both) your added support for such changes.

A


#500: Increase note spacing in combination with a rest
Increase note spacing in combination with a rest

(500)

Submitted by: Rik Schuurmans on 07-Mar-1998

When you don't want to increase the note spacing for larger durations and a bar-line starts with a rest, you have a problem. The time-signature (at the beginning of a song) will be placed on the same place as the rest. That means that the time-signature and the rest are both very difficult to read because of the fact the are on the same place. Does some-one has the solution? If you don't know what I mean, send me an e-mail and will send you a song with the problem.

Rik Schuurmans

ps. Sorry for my poor English.

Reply 1 offered by: andrew  on 07-Mar-1998

Rik,
If you can use the newsgroup, please send it there.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Marsu on 11-Jun-1998

Rik,
I think that your problem is solved with the last version of NWC.
However I think you could solve it by inserting a teXt item (preserving width) containing a space. Though this solution doesn't work any more (but you don't need it either).

Hope this helps.


#501: Newsgroup
Newsgroup

(501)

Submitted by: Just wondering on 07-Mar-1998

I know how to use newsgroups but this doesn't work for me:
news://news.internet-company.com/ntworthy.nwc

Shouldn't it be in the format:
news:rec.news.group

?

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 07-Mar-1998

This is a proprietary newsgroup hosted at internet-company only.
When you news://** you address your designated primary (maybe all designated) news server(s). Unless the server addressed carries the ** group it tells you no such group. You should be able to link the group from the forum page or you can add the internet-company as a news server and subscibe to ntworthy.nwc.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew P on 08-Mar-1998

What news-reader do you use?

Netscape's built-in newsreader works fine, as does Internet Explorer's.
Agent and Free Agent by Forte (recently taken over, I hear) need configuration (which is a little complicated), as it doesn't understand the above notation.
I don't know if AOL provide a newsreader.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Drake Donahue on 08-Mar-1998

Interesting.
Last night no such group from IE4 and NAV 3.0 and 4.0 -
Tonight news://news.internet-company.com/ntworthy.nwc brings the group right up!
A third way to get there! Thanks guys.

Reply 4 offered by: seb on 09-Mar-1998

Yeah, but have some pity on those of us behind firewalls.
We aren't allowed to access NNTP servers over the net, so
the Noteworthy newsgroup is inaccessible to us.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 09-Mar-1998

Yes, we've discussed pros and cons before. I guess this is why we have both the newsgroup AND the forum for those that can't access the newsgroup.
Public newsgroups can be very lossy and slow in propagation, which stifles and muddles conversation, not to mention spammers etc. Moderating the newsgroup normally introduces a 24 hour delay in posts. These are all fixed by going to a private server, with the down side that security mechanisms may prevent that access. Can you talk to your ISP about allowing this one NNTP server with its dedicated newsgroups?

A

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew on 09-Mar-1998

Yes, we've discussed pros and cons before. I guess this is why we have both the newsgroup AND the forum for those that can't access the newsgroup.
Public newsgroups can be very lossy and slow in propagation, which stifles and muddles conversation, not to mention spammers etc. Moderating the newsgroup normally introduces a 24 hour delay in posts. These are all fixed by going to a private server, with the down side that security mechanisms may prevent that access. Can you talk to your ISP about allowing this one NNTP server with its dedicated newsgroups?

A


#503: G Sharp or A Flat?
G Sharp or A Flat?

(503)

Submitted by: Chris Stent on 09-Mar-1998

OK, so G Sharp plays the same as A Flat, but on a printed
sheet the wrong "spelling" looks really odd and can be very
hard to sing, depending on the key. How do I change a note
/ group of notes / whole staff so the C Sharps become
D Flats, etc. or vice versa?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Mar-1998

Chris - I agree - I have added an Enharmonic Tool to my wish list.
Then you could select a note, group of notes or a measure and change the accidental spelling.
My biggest beef if a flat chord in a sharp key - Like Eb7 in the key of C.
The notes spell D#7 - very nasty!!
Add your request to the wish list please.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 10-Mar-1998

Hear Hear!

I wrote to Eric some time ago requesting that there should be default spellings for each key. So for instance in F major and D minor (one flat) you would get A and E flat, and C and F sharp by default when audit accidentals was performed or the notes were played in from a keyboard.

At the moment the dominant chord of D minor is notated A, Db, E which looks ridiculous. Sadly there has been no response.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 10-Mar-1998

Yes again. I must add my weight to this wish. The manifestation of this problem that I like least is during staff tranpositions.

For example: a G# in the key of Bbmaj (6th note of the scale sharpened by one semitone) should transpose to a G double sharp in Bmaj. However the transpose tool (up one semitoine) makes it an A natural (seventh note of the scale flattened by one semitone). Transposing back again the A natural becomes an A flat, which is very confusing.

The transposition process should be purely mechanical. There is no ambiguity about the correspondence between the notes in one key and the notes in another.

I think the idea of default spellings would be a mistake. Sometimes I need a G# when I'm writing in Bb major and sometimes I need an A flat.

Moreover, a G# and an A flat don't always sound the same. Fixed pitch instruments don't have much option but to play them at the same pitch. However, for most wind instruments and unfretted strings a G# and and A flat will generally be played at different pitches - both of which will depend on the context, style of music, type of ensemble etc.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 10-Mar-1998

No mechanical set of rules is perfect and of course sometimes you do need an enharmonic spelling in a particular key, especially if you have temporarily transposed to a different key without changing the key signature. But at least let us have the more probable spelling as the default, and edit the few occasions on which that is not required.
Playing in a sequence of mis-spelled chords, especially in a minor key is a right pain!

At the moment we do have a default spelling. If the key is flat then you get flats: similarly with sharp keys you get sharps. My point is that in the key of D minor it would be unusual to have a D flat, so when a note is played in from a midi keyboard the default should assume it is a C sharp, which would be correct 90% of the time.

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Randall on 10-Mar-1998

Yes, I see your point about the default during data entry.

It seems we need two types of default - during tranposition the default should be to get it right - there is only one way of doing it (however, sometimes its kinder on the players to use enharmonic changes to reduce the number of double accidentals).

During data entry the default has to use a bit more intelligence: in d minor a C# is more likely; in F maj, I would put my money on it being a D flat (during a temporary excursion to Ab maj.). Thus NWC has to know whether to expect notes in the major or relative minor key. At present I don't think it takes any notice - even though the key signatures of both are included in the insert key signature tool. (Note it is even possible to create your own key signature - e.g. a Bb and a C# for a piece in Dminor. It looks odd but works.)

Is there a good algorithm for deciding which spelling is most likely?

Reply 6 offered by: seb on 11-Mar-1998

Another problem that default mechanical translation of
accidentals during transposition would solve:

I seem to recall that there is a restriction about certain
combinations of notes a semitone apart during transposition.
Obviously it's because, say, if you had a B and a C and a
Db together in a piece and transposed it up a semitone,
you'd get C and C# and D, or C and Db and D, neither of
which can be represented on a single staff. However, it
should be possible with the suggestion made above, because
that could result in B# and C# and D, for example.

There are probably cases that can't be helped, though.

Which brings me to a new point: can you have, say, a
C and a C# together (same position, same staff)? I know
that you can have 2 C's now....

Reply 7 offered by: Arthur Archer on 17-Mar-1998

This is probably going to generate more heat than light!
I always thought that that when an accidental fell into a group of upward moving notes it became a sharp. But in a group od downward moving notes it was generally a flat.

But I am probanly wrong.

Arthur Archer
UK

Reply 8 offered by: Tom Farnsworth on 18-Mar-1998

Add my name. I've had some problems myself, and met with nothing but frustration in what is otherwise a wonderful piece of software.

Reply 9 offered by: Ken Tinkham on 21-Mar-1998

I would like to be able to select a note and use a key-press to change to the enharmonic alternate, to make it easier for instrumentalists to read chromatic sequences in their parts. In "pop" or "Jazz" the harmonies often follow the circle of fifths, which is like changing the key with each new chord.

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 12-Jun-1998

Refer to msg #665#reply1 or ask Andrew :-)


#504: Unequal temperaments
Unequal temperaments

(504)

Submitted by: Stephen Randall on 10-Mar-1998

I have been reading Arthur Benade's book "Fundamentals of Musicaf Accoustics" recently. This contains an excellent discussion of the origins of various temperamants for the scale (hence my recent post re: G sharp or A flat!).

I would like to do some experiments using NWC to see how the different temperaments sound. Is it possible to set up a Midi device so that it is anything other than equal tempered?

Reply 1 offered by: Kent Dugan on 10-Mar-1998

You need to talk to a piano tuner. They know this stuff. Seriously, I don't know. If you retune your computer (can you do that?) it'ss just sound like a bad recording of the Handel Water Music.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 10-Mar-1998

Yes, you can retune devices. Lime did this rather well.
There are two ways of doing it, depending upon the midi device:
WARNING - VERY DENSE INFORMATION - PLEASE READ SLOWLY.

1) Use a multipoint controller before every note to adjust the pitch of the note correctly. This works for every midi device, and is doable in NWC, though EXTREMELY tedious.
2) Create a normal NWC file, export to midi, use another midi editor to create a keyboard mapping that tells the midi device to play - for example - Ab 10 cents sharper, Bb 15 cents flatter etc. This requires (a) a midi editor that can create such instructions, (b) a midi device that will execute such instructions (Yamaha do one, many "midi-workstations" will have it, most general midi devices WON'T!), (c) determination on your part to read the midi spec and get the instructions right; or (d) Lime (which unfortunately is free and buggy, or expensive).

Some workstations will let you arbitrarily assign ANY pitch to ANY note. eg if you wanted, you could reverse all the notes on the keyboard, or have 127 notes spanning only one octave, or even one semitone. This is extremely good fun, and interesting, but often not acceptable musically. :-)

I was very interested in temperaments at one stage, and documented my findings at:
http://www.tip.net.au/~apurdam/tempers.html
Drop in and have a look. It discusses very briefly some of the problems discussed by Brenade.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-Mar-1998

Here is a tip that works for usual temperaments - I mean
when there are only 12 notes in an octave, and when any
octave is pure, whatever the other intervals are.

You compose your music normally using NoteWorthy. When it
is finished, you set the same midi channel for all staves
(if you have more than one) and you export it to a midi
file.

Then you read it with any MIDI sequencer (I use cakewalk
apprentice), and you copy/paste the result to other channels
using note filters. For instance, all the C go to channel 1,
all the C#/Db to channel 2, all the D to channel 3, etc.
Remember not to use drums channel! (usually channel 10).

Then you can change pitch bend for each channel. If you
don't know how to do it with the MIDI sequencer (or you
don't want to), you can reimport the result into NoteWorthy
and use multipoint controller.

The advantages of this method are:
- it is not very difficult to do it
- it will work with any general midi device
- it is better than a pitch bend for each note, because
it works even when you have chords

The drawbacks are:
- after transformation, the score is not very readable
- if you want to play several instruments, you need more
channels (12 per instrument if all 12 notes are used)

Olivier.

Reply 4 offered by: Jimmy Malone on 01-May-1998

This is an involved task. First, get the free program CSound from http://www.leeds.ac.uk/music/Man/c_front.html
This program creates sound files (i.e. wavs) from music files. Also get the program midi2cs, which converts midi files to csound files. Then edit the file midi2cs.cps, which contains the tuning for each note, in cycles per second. Edit this file for the appropriate tuning to your other temperament.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 01-Jul-1998

This is a limitation on Olivier's solution (which is good enough in many cases, and really simple to execute).
You sometimes have in the same score C# and Db. In midi this will alas refer to the same data (tell me if I'm wrong). So you'll lose the difference (ask a violonist ;^)).

What would be great is to ask NWC to search for each occurence of C#, jump to it, add an MPC event that increases slightly the pitch (forget the chords then) before and get it normal after, and so on. The same with Db with an MPC which would decrease the pitch, ...
This is not possible *now*. NWC doesn't allow you to find whatever, quel dommage ! Let's dream a bit... :)

P.S. Purely musically speaking, in which temperaments xC is the same as natural D ?

NWCly yours


#505: Transposing from one key to other!!??? :o)
Transposing from one key to other!!??? :o)

(505)

Submitted by: Madgewick on 11-Mar-1998

Hi,
I am about to sequence an entire musical for midi which will envolve a full orchestra, and when I get the orchestra part - there will be a Bb Clarinet part and I'd like to know how to get the Bb Clarinet part into the key that the rest of the instruments are in. Say the key was ## (2 sharps) that means the clarient part would be in #### (4 sharps) how do I transpose this?? Please help!!

Thanks

Madgewick :o)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11-Mar-1998

Try Help | Search for Help on... Transpose

But briefly,
Tools | Transpose Staff - this will "respell" every note, as well as change key on any key signatures. Bb clarinets' music is written 2 semis higher (so a Bb for a C instrument is written as a C for clarinet). When you use the Transpose Staff tool, you can ask for the staff to sound 2 semis lower, to compensate for this so that the clari will sound correct.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 12-Mar-1998

Note that music for a Bb bass clarinet is usually written a ninth higher than it sounds - 14 semitones.

Stephen

Reply 3 offered by: Desiree on 30-Apr-1998

please i need help
I'm an eight grader and my teacher wants us to wright an easy learing pice for three diffrent instruments and i don't now how we have to have it done tomarrow i play b flat clarinet i want to do it for trumpite and flute will some one help me!!!!!!!!

Reply 4 offered by: SS on 11-Aug-1998

I need to transpose a melody line from piano to trumpet. If
a C is being played on the piano, what is played on the
trumpet?

Reply 5 offered by: Peter on 11-Aug-1998

Almost certainly the wrong note!

Reply 6 offered by: Paul on 11-Aug-1998

I THINK this table is correct for a piano C

Instrument Note
---------- ----
Bb Trumpet D
C Trumpet C
D Trumpet Bb
Eb Trumpet A
G (Pic.) F
A (Pic.) Eb

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 17-Aug-1998

In fact the rule is rather simple. Just shift the melody in the other direction than the instrument does. The
If the instrument "sounds" 2 semitones lower (Bb trumpet for ex.) then transpose the score 2 semitones higher.
2nd example: a trombone in Eb. This means that a C played on it will sound as Bb. 3 semitones higher. So you transpose the score 3 semitones lower.

Note that many instrument are not written to the right octave, so you may need to transpose the score an octave higher/lower (Piccolo, Cor d'harmonie...). This can be quickly done selecting all the staff (home, shift+end) and moving it (Ctrl+UpOrDown Arrow) 7 times.

Hope I've been clear :-)

Reply 8 offered by: tom on 14-Apr-2001

Looking for "still got the blues"by gary moore transposed from key of "D" to key of "g" for guitar,help!!!!!


#506: Drums Scoring
Drums Scoring

(506)

Submitted by: Madgewick on 12-Mar-1998

I don't play the drums so my hands are a bit tied as I do not know what note is what drum on a drum kit. When adding in drum parts from a full score to a musical, will the notes in the score be right and still work and sound good when in Noteworthy Composer??

Madgewick :o)

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Mund on 14-Mar-1998

Check out the files "Writing and Hearing parts for Kit Drummers" and "Midi Drum List" in the USER TIPS in the Noteworthy home page.

Midi drum patches are not on the same lines as on a standard drum score but you can change them to match using IDEdit I think. The first Tip listed above explains this more and tells you were to get it.

Reply 2 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 16-Mar-1998

You may also change all notes to the correct original MIDI
note and use it. EX: Snare is E I believe on a trapset, but
in MIDI, it's a D. You can find all the correct note values
for each instrument in Help, Contents, Troubleshooting,
Common Questions, Question #6. It shows the name of the
auxillary or trap instrument and the correct note value. You
must knkow what each note on a real drum staff stands for
first! I've attempted to use the IDEdit program, but came
up with no success. Maybe I just didn't do it right. But with
this, you can't go wrong!

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Stranburg on 08-Apr-1998

Hi I am a rergistered user of noteworthy and I play the drums. How can I change the notation to drums I have tried everything Please help

Reply 4 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 10-Apr-1998

If you can write a drum score, you can use the section in the Help file: Contents, Troubleshooting,
Common Questions, Question #6 to change tthe insrument to the correctt note. (The first note is 34?, which is a bass drum i think... The best way to do this is with a bass clef Octave DOWN on the C in the second space from the bottom...)


#507: Downloading Crescendo Plug-In to NT
Downloading Crescendo Plug-In to NT

(507)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson on 12-Mar-1998

I have been contacted by a person who has accessed my web-site
http://www.bright.net/~mrbanjo/ and downloaded Crescendo to play
the NWC song files on my site.

He says the music files will not play on his NT Machine.

I have no clue on what his problem may be.

Can anyone out there help me out with an answer to his problem?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 12-Mar-1998

Your site will not let me in. I am not sure what you mean
by Crescendo - is it an application that plays NWC files?
I do know that the original release of Noteworthy Player 1.5
did not work on NT, but it was fixed within a few days.

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 12-Mar-1998

Crescendo is a player for .mid files.
If the files on your site are .nwc files Crescendo will not start.
NoteWorthy Player/composer can be configured as a helper app I do believe.
However exporting your tunes as .mid files will provide more general access.
The ads imply NT compatibility for Crescendo, it's pretty much the standard net midi player, so it probably really is compatible.


#508: recent activity
recent activity

(508)

Submitted by: Drake Donahue on 12-Mar-1998

After I send this a neat little list is going to pop asking if I want to see my message, home, forum contents, or recent activity.
Recent activity gives a neat list in reverse chronology of topics and RESPONSES and allows me to see new posts to old threads that I have ceased to follow.
This is a vote for a Recent Activity link right up there with Home|Contents etc when the FORUM page opens.
Those in favor ....

Reply 1 offered by: Yay! on 12-Mar-1998

Yep, give it a shot

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 12-Mar-1998

Blush.
Embarrassed giggle.
Just figured out what Recent-100 is about.
Sorry about that.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Mar-1998

We provide the label "Recent-100" to the main forum index. Although it is not the most obvious reference, it does accurately reflect its own title.

We provide the more detailed reference in response to new posts and replies. The theory is that 'active' members (those who add their own posts) would be more interested in viewing recent, chronological activity. Casual visitors, who do not stop by regularly, are more likely to be interested in the master index.


#509: exporting to MIDI?
exporting to MIDI?

(509)

Submitted by: Dan on 12-Mar-1998

Can someone tell me how to export an NWC file to MIDI?
The help function does not seem to be of much help with regard to this.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Mar-1998

Your question almost provides its own answer. Use the Export command in NWC to create a MIDI file. It is on the File menu.


#510: Sustain Pedal has no effect on playback
Sustain Pedal has no effect on playback

(510)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 13-Mar-1998

The Insert | Sustain Pedal looks nice on the output, but as
far as I can hear, it has no effect on the playback. Am I
right, and (if so) will it get fixed.

Why does it have no Preserve Width and Hide when Printing
options? Every insertable marking should have the same options.
Dynamic Variance also does not have Hide when Printing.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 18-Mar-1998

Pedal works just fine on all my midi cards/boxes.
What is your midi device?

I agree, Preserve Width and Hide When Printing should be on it, at least for consistency's sake. Don't forget Staff Position.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Mar-1998

I have a notebook computer with a built in sound card. I would guess it is Sound Blaster compatible, but I don't know. Maybe there is a problem with the midi driver.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 18-Mar-1998

It may be that that particular card doesn't do sustain pedals!? Some of the cheaper cards are pretty trashy.

A

Reply 4 offered by: Hedley Pinsent on 24-Jun-1998

I used a bunch of stuff to record MIDI (I haven't tried
NOTEWORTHY yet)
I have the same problem. I put a few files on a homepage
(http://www.infonet.st-johns.nf.ca/providers/green/songs.html)
but they sound terrible with my PINE (I had two, ISA and PCI)
sound cards, but much better (with pedal)through an external
MIDI device (Roland CM-300). What we need is a workaround
- a program to pre-process the pedal signals, replacing
them with delayed note off signals. Does anyone know of any
program that already does this? It seems that a little
utility in QBASIC would suffice (an educational project for
a student?)


#511: Copyrights
Copyrights

(511)

Submitted by: Garry Carter on 14-Mar-1998

If you import/write to NoteWorthy that is someone elses's
composition, how do you get permission to transcibe it to
electronic format?
And how ammenable are people to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew P on 18-Mar-1998

This is an important point. A few things as I see them.

1) Their is provision in most nation's copyright laws for fair usage for research or review, or for personal use. This is applicable for some NWC users.

2) Works by a composer dead 50 years (in Australia, 75 in the USA) are in the public domain. Transcribing a piece from printed music may still breach copyright, as you are "copying" the publisher's impression. If you are rearranging it, things get much greyer. Though technically it is still a copyright breach, it would be very hard for a case to be made in court, I would imagine. (I AM NOT A LAWYER).

3) Works by living composers, or those dead within 50/75 years need the permission of the copyright owner (either the composer or the publisher). Many web-based composers are happy for you to use their works, and may freely give permission. Most music companies will screw you for every penny they can get. Nothing personal, it's just their policy.

Case example: I did a beaut transcription of Colonel Bogey's March for a computer war game I've been conscripted into (small joke there...). I contacted Boosey and Hawkes. The result? Alsford (composer) died in 42 (or thereabouts), was 50 years gone (yay Australia), but not 75 years gone (boo US). So? I could only distribute in Australia and needed a licence for US and European distribution. I quote: "however we do require more information regarding the arrangement itself, a copy of the score would be required, and also synopsis of the game. Any use of this kind would require a payment of synchronisation fees together with mechanical fees based on the quantity of the games produced. Fee would also be based on the actual duration of the music used."
Final result: ditched it.

So much for creativity. :(

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Garry Carter on 18-Mar-1998

Thanx Andrew for the reply.
The reason i asked is that I once did a score from a rock
band called "Asia." Before I took it any further, I contacted
Warner Bros. Music Inc. All they gave me was a lecture on
breech of copyright and that in no circumstances could I
put the score down in any format.
I tried the musician's union here in the UK and they
basically said the same thing.
I never bothered taking things any further, as I did not
know who else to contact.
Thanx again, though.


#512: Printing
Printing

(512)

Submitted by: Micah Galizia on 14-Mar-1998

Howcome when i print the font's are huge, it comes out with 4 bars on a page, 2 on top, and 2 on the bottom? Someone help!

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 15-Mar-1998

On the File menu select Page Setup...
On the Options tab you will see an edit box for Staff Size.
Reducing that number will make the staff smaller. I usually
use a size around 20.

For more control, select the Fonts tab.
Staff Italic and Staff Bold are the sizes of the staff notation
(like mp or cresc.) Staff Lyric is the size of the lyrics.

Select the Preview tab and press the Preview... button to
see what your printout will look like.

If the edges are cut off, make sure you Margins are all at
least 0.4

Hope this helps.


#513: Broken chords & Blank Manuscript
Broken chords & Blank Manuscript

(513)

Submitted by: David Turvey on 15-Mar-1998

I am new but NoteWorthy Composer and cannot find the
Broken Chord symbol or how to achieve broken chords
also, is it possible to print a partially blank
manuscript showing ledger lines and bar lines.

Any assistance would be much appreciated.

Thank you

David Turvey

Reply 1 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 17-Mar-1998

I'm not exactly sure of what broken chords are that you are talking about. One thing I'd like added as well, is support for two eigth notes ro be chorded together but not two notes on one stem. I mean one going up and the bass one going down. Is this supported?

Reply 2 offered by: Huy on 17-Mar-1998

I especially like David's ideas. Especially the printing out of a blank score. Would Noteworthy consider adding this feature to their great program, so we can print blank scores with our choice of staves and staff heights (e.g. 50pt, etc)?

This would make NoteWorthy look like a standard for music education maybe. :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Tom Farnsworth on 18-Mar-1998

I'm in total agreement. I'm always trying to find some way to make the cresc/decresc look right. The text simply doesn't cut it.
And broken chords are a must for piano music. Do you guys at Noteworthy play piano or what?

Some graphical symbols, please? #:)

I've had to fake some broken chords, too, David. The best shortcut for the correct sound is to use 32nd or 64th notes barred together, tied to a chord with the same notes. It's a but choppy, but close.

A blank score would again be very nice. As it is, I was able to make some notation paper with WordPerfect: I just held down the underscore key until 5 lines were filled, hit enter twice, and continued until the page was done. Line height can be adjusted using the line spacing option in the Format menu.

Reply 4 offered by: David on 18-Mar-1998

Hey Guys,

I think I have an idea for the blank scores. I have NOT tried this yet, but here's how I'd do it:

Create as many staves as you want for your blank page. (e.g. 5)
Don't add any bar lines.
Go in the page setup thingy and select Extend last system.
Go to preview and see if it will work.
Print it.

I guess you could try placing in different clefs too.
Now I'll go and try it!

Reply 5 offered by: David on 18-Mar-1998

Yay! I solved that; now let's do the broken chords thing!

Reply 6 offered by: Another Eric on 15-Apr-1998

I couldn't get David's "extend last system" trickfor printing blank staves to work, although maybe I'm just being a gourd-head. Add a new staff, select "extend last system" from the options tab in print preview, right? What am I doing wrong? It'd be great to be able to print a blank staff paired with the basic chords of a song, so our violin player could write in her part below.


#514: Disappearing Staff Groups
Disappearing Staff Groups

(514)

Submitted by: Brad Powell on 16-Mar-1998

I have NWC 1.50b. When I create a new score with two staves, each having different group names, both staves appear in the main edit window simultaneously. In previous versions, NWC would show only one group at a time and allow you to change groups under the View menu.

Also, when I open a score created with a previous version, NWC will show only the staves within one group (i.e. "Strings") but I cannot switch to another group (i.e. "Brass") to edit it. It seems as if the other groups have been "lost."

Anyone have any insight?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Mar-1998

Select Page Setup on the File menu, then goto the Contents tab.

Reply 2 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 16-Mar-1998

The reason they do not appear is because of a setting
difference between the two versions. I found a way to get
around this. Go to Score Review in the Tools menu. Then
click the staff that has "disappered" Then click on "Goto
Staff Properties..." This will bring up the properties of
the staff, and the staff will have appeared in the Score
editor window.

_.-o•^ BassG ^•o-._

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Brown on 04-May-1998

I wrote a 200 measure piano sonata using NWC, saving it many times. When I opened the file today, however, only one staff appeared, with nothing on it.

If anyone has any insights on how I could retrive my piece, your assistence would be most appreciated.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-May-1998

Follow the instructions given inthis very thread: Select Page Setup on the File menu, then goto the Contents tab.


#517: keyboard entry
keyboard entry

(517)

Submitted by: Jos Briers on 17-Mar-1998

Hi, I'm using a Rolang JV-50 keyboard as input-device.
Somehow I don't seem to get the duration of the note into
Noteworthy. The pitch is ok, and even the instrument settings
get imported. Changing the patch also changes the default
note-duration setting.

I'm I missing something?
Jos

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 17-Mar-1998

Jos,
Are you using the 'Record' or the 'Midi input active'
buttons? The latter is only step entry. To get real-time
entry you have to use the 'Record' button, and play the
piece 'blind' into a buffer, before importing it as a MIDI
file into NWC. You need thoroughly to read the appropriate
Help file to get it right! Best of luck,
Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 18-Mar-1998

It needn't be blind. You can record direct to NWC whilst a rhythm track (for example) is playing. With appropriate tweaking of Midi import parameters (as NWC uses this to translate what you played into NWC notation) you can get basic notation working very well and looking good. Alternatively, with the right tweaking, you can get music that sounds good but looks messy!

A

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 18-Mar-1998

Perhaps I didn't make myself clear, Andrew. What I mean by
'blind' is that you don't see the notes appear on the stave
until you've finished recording. At least that's how I
understand it to work. If I'm wrong, I stand corrected! It can look very messy can't it! It's amazing how inaccurate one's timing is in practice. A very good idea to have a metronomic rhythm track playing while you record.

Peter


#518: NWC fonts
NWC fonts

(518)

Submitted by: Joseph Hansche on 17-Mar-1998

I'd like some musical fonts that I can use in NWC. Anyone with such fonts, please send them to me. I would like htings like the chord grid and the multi bar rest and cresendo/decresendo signs. THanks... You can E-Mail them to me if you'd like.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Mar-1998

This issue was discussed in the Forum article "Special characters in fonts (ie: shape notes, etc)" at msg #443

John Peterson said he was going to produce such a font, but I have not heard if this has been done yet. I think many of us would love such a font.


#519: Lost Sound
Lost Sound

(519)

Submitted by: Dave on 20-Mar-1998

I have been a user (and committed supporter) of NWC for over a year now. I had great luck using it under Win 3.1. When I changeed to Win95 I lost my playback ability. I'm using an Acer Magic S23 card with Wavetable daughter board attached. After upgrading to Win95 my system crashed, with the message "Windows protection error, you must restart your computer." Tyhe only way to get things running was to remove all the sound card drivers and use Win 95's built in drivers. That works fine for system sounds, but wavetable sounds are gone, and if I can get NWC to play at all, it's only in FM synth - 4 part. The tech support for Acer has no responce, and Win95 support is no help either. Has anyone run into this problem and found a solution?

Thanks,
Dave

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 20-Mar-1998

That's a shame. It does sound very much like a driver problem. I thought NWC took pains to only use standard midi that would work with standard midi drivers. If I were you, I would press Acer very hard for new drivers. Do they have a web-site with Win95 drivers available? When you say tech support for Acer has no response, do you mean they don't respond to you, or they don't know what to do?

A

Reply 2 offered by: Dave on 20-Mar-1998

Andrew,

Thanks for the responce. Acer never responded to my inquiry. I did download a new Win95 driver and had the same problem. It seems there must be a conflict somewhere, but I have been unable to track it down. I was hoping another NWC user hada run into (and solved) the same problem. I'll just have to keep playing with Win 95 settings until I find a set that work.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Mar-1998

This does, indeed, sound very much like a driver problem. Here are some tips that might help:

-> Sometimes the daughter WaveTable board can be controlled via the External MIDI Out driver (sometimes also called the MPU-401 Out driver). I have seen this on at least one sound card. You might try this.

-> If you have a conflict, you might learn more about the conflict by reviewing your System Properties. Right click on your My Computer icon (on your desktop), and review its contents.

-> In NWC, only select one driver for use by play back. DO not bother selecting the MIDI Mapper until you have successfully found which real device is the one you want. Once you find it, you can setup your system's MIDI Mapper to use that device as well (so the Windows Media Player will also sound good).

-> Try again to install the Win 95 drivers for your setup. Make sure that you remove all of the old drivers first. If your system does not support Plug-n-Play, you may have to get intimately involved with your system's IRQ and DMA settings. Your system manufacturer should provide documentation on this procedure.


#520: Crashing Net Browser
Crashing Net Browser

(520)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 20-Mar-1998

Not a musical query this, but nevertheless relevant to Noteworthy. I have a copy (from magazine disc) of Netscape Navigator 4.04 whichI prefer to Microsoft Internet Explorer, BUT whenever I attempt to download the Noteworthy product index page http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/index.htm (or the equivalent Player page) Navigator crashes out with the message: General Protection Fault in Netscape.exe at 001F:50CE. Explorer is ok, so I saved the page to disc, then tried loading it into Navigator off-line. Same result! I'm using Windows 3.11, and I get the same crash on two different computers. Anybody else had this problem??? Anybody know what's happening???

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Mar-1998

There is a bug in the Netscape browser. We have been working on this for the last 24 hours. See the next post for what we have found.

Reply 2 offered by: brian on 28-Apr-1998

mine doesnt crash


#521: Bug in Netscape Version 4.04
Bug in Netscape Version 4.04

(521)

Submitted by: NWC-Support on 20-Mar-1998

Are you using the Netscape 4.04 browser. If so, you may recently experienced browser crashes when surfing our site. A bug in the Netscape browser is the cause of this problem. The bug seems to be in all platform versions of Netscape 4.04 (Unix and Windows). We are in the process of modifying our site in such a way as it will be loadable by users of Netscape 4.04.

For thos of you who understand HTML, the following short HTML source demonstrates the Netscape 4.04 bug.

-----------------------------------
<html>
<head><title>Netscape 4.04 Bug</title></head>
<body>
<table>
<tr><td style="padding-left: 20px" valign="top">
<p>This simple page causes the Netscape 4.04 browser to crash.</p>
<blockquote>
<table><tr><td>Item</td></tr></table>
</blockquote>
</td></tr>
</table>
</body>
</html>
-----------------------------------

If you are developing web pages, you might want to be careful with the combination of:

- a table with left side padding, combined with
- a blockquote, combined with
- an interior table

These elements, used together, appear to be the cause of a Netscape 4.04 crash. Try this for yourself by going to:

http://www.ntworthy.com/netscape-bug.htm

Warning: If you are running Netscape 4.04, your browser will likely crash when loading this page.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 20-Mar-1998

Wow!! You don't waste any time, do you! Thanks for replying so quickly. I actually notified Netscape of the crashing last week, but had no reply. I dare say things will start moving now the bug has been identified. I'm (honestly and sincerely and I'm not just saying this to get brownie points) most impressed at your committment and skills. Fantastic!
Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Mar-1998

We have also reported the problem to Netscape. Our site has now been fully updated. Netscape 4.04 will not fall over when loading our pages, as of today.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 20-Mar-1998

That's what I call service! Many thanks.

Reply 4 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 20-Mar-1998

I have a version of Netscape version 4.02 and just to see what, if anything, happens, I went to your http://www.ntworthy.com/netscape-bug.htm page . Guess what - it crashed as well.

Were you aware of this ? I don't remember getting this problem before but then usually with software crashes I usually just assume a glitch and restart.

Probably no further action needed but any comment ?

Richard

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Mar-1998

We are aware of the fact that earlier editions of Netscape 4 (prior to 4.04) also have this bug. This does not, however, change the facts as described in this thread. We reported the bug to Netscape, we changed our site to compensate for the bug, and we isolated a very precise test case that illustrates the bug, should Netscape wish to fix it. Any further action is really up to Netscape...

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew on 20-Mar-1998

Richard,

NW's website was "prettied up" recently, and it may have only been then that the Netscape bug came to surface.

A

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Mar-1998

Yes, that is exactly right. We updated our site about 10 days ago. We started getting an unusual number of complaints, and finally determined that Netscape 4 was crashing on some of our pages. Until this happened, we only tested with an earlier Netscape version, which did not have this bug. We now test with version 4 as well (live and learn).

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew on 21-Mar-1998

Yeah. So much for standards. The pages I'm writing now need variations for non-scripting, NetScape and IE4.0. Phew!
To satisfy EVERYONE, you need text-only (well, okay, you CAN have pix), non-framed, no scripts, no applets/plug-ins/ActiveX. Doesn't leave much, does it?

A

Reply 9 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 22-Mar-1998

I seem to get the impression lately that there will soon
be two webs, one for Netscape and one for I.E. It also seems
each browser 'update' has more and more bugs. The whole web
is starting to remind me of a garbage dump, 'bugs' and all!
A nice little dumping ground for useless bits of misinformed
junk. (Except for the Noteworthy site, of course!:-)

Reply 10 offered by: Joonas Linkola on 27-Mar-1998

Nice going, people! I wasn't aware of that kind of bug before visiting this site. It crashed my NS 4.03, too :-/

The Internet will soon be split up to several parts, which won't be compatible.

I have noticed this with my website. I had a news-ticker Java-applet put up, everything worked fine, it was nice. Then someone mailed me about how his IE4.0 crashed everytime he goes to my site. The reason was the Java-applet.

This is strange, as Java *should* be platform-free, and work in every browser.

Now Microsoft has been forced to take the "Java compatible" logo away from its products by Sun Microsystems, as they claim they are not Java-compatible anymore. Microsoft also begins to use its own libraries in J++, so bye bye Java, it seems.

Reply 11 offered by: Justin Keller on 24-Apr-1998

Netscape 4.04 crashed all the time for me. It is a piece
of junk. About every 4 minutes it would crash. I downloaded
4.05 and it is a little better, but it still crashes a lot.

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 29-Apr-1998

With the version 3 it works fine... It's often dangerous to use the last version of a program. It converts you a beta-tester when you were a user...
(Note : there is NO Microsoft software users. All are beta-testers, but they're not aware of this)

By the way, each and every new version of a piece of software corrects some old bugs, adds new ones (especially (and logically in a certain way) for new functionalities)), and takes longer to load.

NWC excepted... :-) (Reason : they seem to do REAL testing (including beta-, remember 1.50beta) and they add functionalities asked by users...

Enjoy NWC !

Reply 13 offered by: Brett Green on 25-Feb-2000

Little late in this thread, but guess what? Using Netscape version 6.2 and this bug is STILL there... and believe me, this one was hard to figure out! After hours of practically throwing my hands up, I finally thought 'could it be the blockquotes?'...sure enough, I remove the blockquotes and the problem goes away.
People like to rant against Microsoft and IE, but this kind of bug is unacceptable and should've been addressed a long time ago.

</brett>

Reply 14 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Feb-2000

fwiw - the problem is gone in V4.7. (I snipped NoteWorthy's little sample and viewed it, no crash.)

Reply 15 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 28-Feb-2000

Maybe it's true for V4.7 on Windows. But I have V4.7 on AIX, and it still crashes.

Reply 16 offered by: ron green on 17-Apr-2000

I have Netscape 4.7 on NT workstation and it still crashes. No wonder Netscape is down to a 10% market share of the browser market!

Reply 17 offered by: Nicolas Helleringer on 05-May-2000

Same bug (crash with NULL pointer execption what a shame !) with :

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40/loose.dtd">
<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<title>Test2</title>
</head>
<body>
<div style="position:absolute; border:none">
<table border="0">
<tr>
<td>
<table border="0">
<tr>
<td>
Die Netscape !
</td>
</tr>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</table>
</div>
</body>
</html>

No comment ...

Reply 18 offered by: Tim Powell on 18-Aug-2000

Thanks Nicholas for the very helpful information. I've discovered that the real problem in your example is the border style in the DIV.

Both of the following work fine in 4.04:

<div style="position:absolute;">
<table border="0">
<tr>
<td><table border="0">
<tr>
<td>Netscape 4.04 dies because of tables inside a div with border</td>
</tr>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</table>
</div>

<div style="position:absolute; top: 80px; border: 1px solid #FF0000">
Plain text in a div with border seems okay in 4.04.
</div>

However, add border: 1px solid #0000 to the style of the div that wraps a table above (or use border: none or whatever) and Boom! Netscape 4.04 (and 4.05) will crash.

Additional testing revealed that Netscape 4.70 had memory leaks that would eventually cause a crash after hitting pages that have tables inside divs with border. 4.72 and above do not seem to have this instability.

The crash in the original example on this page is similar. The padding-left forces Netscape to create a positioned layer. This positioned layer (the equivalent of a div) contains a table and caused the crash. Removing the padding-left fixes the crash.

I've kept Netscape 4.04 around because I've always been amused to use a web browser with the number 404. :-)

Remove the anti-spam message from my email to reply.


#522: 1.5 playback problems after printing
1.5 playback problems after printing

(522)

Submitted by: Carl Peter on 20-Mar-1998

After printing several pages of a score I continued working in NWC. When I used the playback, however, many notes were either missing or distorted. The problem only got worse as I tried playbacks from several different files. Eventually the program froze and I had to do a warm boot to exit. Once Windows 95 and NWC were loaded again everything was fine. Is there a problem with using NWC 1.5 after printing that anyone else has experienced?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Mar-1998

We do not have specific knowledge of a Windows 95 problem in this area (other users have reported printing issues on Windows NT, when more than one print job is done in quick succession). Are you using the 32-bit edition? Does it happen every time you print (ie. can it be reproduced)? Do you have any other print drivers installed? If so, if you try printing to them (if you do not actually have another printer, you can set it up to print to a file), does the problem occur?

Any other details that might help to diagnose the problem would be helpful.


#523: Unexpected keychange after mpc
Unexpected keychange after mpc

(523)

Submitted by: Jon Featherstone on 23-Mar-1998

Lately I have been playing around with inserting multi-point controllers, especially linear sweep of pitch.
My problem is when I delete it afterwards, the playback key of that part is different!
Wot am I missing here?

Jon F.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Mar-1998

If you use a multi-point controller to alter the pitch (via the Pitch Bend MIDI capabilities), then the notes that foolow the pitch bend will have their pitch changed accordingly. If you then remove the MPC item, the items will no longer have their pitch shifted up or down.

Reply 2 offered by: Jon Featherstone on 23-Mar-1998

Yes, but even when I delete the mpc (which I had placed at measure 5), the pitch of the whole part changes (ie: from measure 1)!

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Mar-1998

If you altered the Pitch Bend settings in your sound card (used an MPC change), and did not reset the pitch bend back to zero, all future notes on that channel will play at the new, bended pitch. You need to reset the Pitch Bend setting. The easiest way to do this is to press the Stop button in NWC when nothing is playing. This will automatically reset the Pitch Bend settings on all channels (as well as shut off any stuck notes, etc.).


#524: Upcoming features?
Upcoming features?

(524)

Submitted by: David on 23-Mar-1998

Is there a page that says what kinds of things that users can expect in the next version of NoteWorthy?

e.g. I am hoping there will be a feature to split chords into several single note tracks. (NoteWorthy already has a range split thing on the MIDI import screens)

PS: I enjoyed reading the thread on the Netscape bug - you guys sure are clever!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Mar-1998

We only publish new NWC features when they are available, at least in alpha/beta test form. We do not publish information about features that do not yet exist in NWC.


#525: Drums and General MIDI
Drums and General MIDI

(525)

Submitted by: David on 23-Mar-1998

Is there any software that exists which allows me to take a general MIDI drum track and convert it to the proper note for going on a bass clef? As in the form that a drummer can read? (if he can :-)
e.g. with bass drum in bottom gap, snare in next gap above, etc...

(this post is different to the one asking how to make the drums sound in NoteWorthy)

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Mar-1998

David - I have written a short Qbasic program that will do just that.
It converts a written bas clef drum part to a Midi sound part or converts the other way - Midi drums to a written bass clef part.
There is a default for the transfer that can be changed to your needs.
You haven't added an Email address so I cant send it to you.

Reply 2 offered by: David on 01-Apr-1998

Hi there, I used Barry's program to convert from General MIDI to notation and it worked perfectly! Looks like it will save me many hours - It would be amazingly good for NoteWorthy if they added this feature.


#526: Lyrics for 1Chorus, Many verses
Lyrics for 1Chorus, Many verses

(526)

Submitted by: Trevor Hawes on 24-Mar-1998

If I have one chorus and many verses, does the lyric editor cope with this (one line of lyrics for part of the song, many lines for other parts)?

Reply 1 offered by: Tom Gurak on 24-Mar-1998

Trevor,

I usually handle this by prefixing each verse other than the first with a number of underscores where the number matches the number of syllables in the chorus. I enter it once, copy it to the clipboard and then paste it into the beginning of each subsequent verse. I don't know if this is the best (or even the only) way to do this, but it works for me!

Tom Gurak

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 24-Mar-1998

Tom just beat me to the draw - I've duplicated one of his suggestions!

My wish list includes the ability to change the number of staves
part way through the song, but at the moment there isn't a way
directly to do this or to start a lyric line part way through a song.
Nevertheless there are a number of ways to get round this:

If you want the chorus at the end, then extend one of the verse
lyrics to produce the chorus lyric in line with the chorus music.

If you want the chorus at the beginning, then you must pad out
the unused verse lines with one <SPACE UNDERSCORE> for each
note (or note group using one syllable) of the chorus. It isn't too much
work - once you have the correct amount of spaces in the first verse
just Copy and Paste them into the remaining verses.

The best positioning, avoiding a lot of blank lyric space in the chorus
section will be obtained with a bit more work:
Write the chorus as a separate song, and adjust the top margins
to position it where required. You may then need to split the
song into two files if your piece extends over more than one page.
Or export the printouts (using Copy from Page Preview) into your
favourite publishing suite and adjust the layout to suit yourself.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Mar-1998

Some of the samples demonstrate how to change the appearance of lyric line count; ROSE.NWC for one.

Reply 4 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 09-Jun-2000

Is there something new in 2000 ?
I think my problem is the same :
Is there a way to change the number of lyrics inside a song eg. after a bar with a "forced carriage return" ?
Often I have 2 parts in a song :
one named "couplets" in French (my dictionary said "verse" for it but the Webster's does not give an equivalent definition)has always the same notes but each time a different lyric eg. A1 A2 A3 etc.
the other "refrain" in French (my dictionary said "chorus" for it and the Webster's gives an equivalent definition)has always the same notes and the same lyric eg. B.
At play time you have A1 B A2 B A3 B etc. or B A1 B A2 B A3 B etc.
I have also found a song with a 3 parts structure B A1 C B A2 C B A3 C B etc. C being also 1 lyric part (in this case how to use repeats or special endings to play this way ?).
My problem is that the 1 lyric part with room to several lyrics does not look nice and take too much space...
If this is not yet implemented put this in the Wish list !
What are the correct english terms for the 2 parts of the song ?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 09-Jun-2000

> What are the correct english terms for the 2 parts of the
> song ?

"Verse" and "Chorus". The Chorus often uses the same lyrics. If there is a third section (generally only done once, perhaps with a key or time change, or other way of setting it apart) it is usually called a "Bridge."

Reply 6 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 20-Jun-2000

I plan to enter the following wish :
Variable geometry song
I wish to be able to define 2 or several parts with different numbers of Lyrics AND different vertical sizes ("in properties for vocal").
Rationale :
Often I have 2 parts in a song :
1)One "verse" has always the same notes but each time a different lyric eg. A1 A2 A3 etc.
2) The other "chorus" has always the same notes and the same lyric eg. B. In few cases there are several diferent lyrics but fewer than the number of verse.
At play time you have A1 B A2 B A3 B etc. or B A1 B A2 B A3 B etc.
My problem is that the 1 lyric part with room to several lyrics does not look nice and take too much space...
So it is interesting to be able to define parts with different vertical size and number of lyrics.
Each part should be separated by a break equivalent to a cariage return in text.
If this is not difficult you may add the capability to change other parameters as font size, etc. ...


#527: The other NoteWorthy?
The other NoteWorthy?

(527)

Submitted by: Batchman on 24-Mar-1998

Did you know that there is another music notation program
called NoteWorthy 2? I saw this posted recently.
Know anything about this?

- seb

---

Date: Sat, 21 Mar 1998 09:48:00 +0000
From: Bernard Hill <bernard@braeburn.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Sv: Notation program
Sender: owner-choraltalk@lists.colorado.edu
X-Sender: gate-owner@mail.llu.edu
To: choraltalk@lists.colorado.edu

In article <19980316221845.AAA42964@ezivuwqo>, Simon Drew
<sdrew@post10.tele.dk> writes
>I hear glowing reports about Sibelius 7; not a *standard* platform, but by
>all accounts a very powerful system...
>
For the PC you might want to look at NoteWorthy 2 (*nothing* to do with
Noteworthy Composer - they "stole" our name) which is DTP for music. It
does not understand what it is doing so it allows you to put exactly
what you want to see on the page without arguing.

Registration £45 or $75, 30 working day evaluation from
http://www.braeburn.demon.co.uk/nw.htm

Bernard Hill
Braeburn Software
Selkirk, Scotland
01750 721854
+44 1750 721854

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Mar-1998

You ask:

> Know anything about this?

Your post includes a web address. If you are interested, it seems like your best course of action would be to visit the site.

> For the PC you might want to look at NoteWorthy 2
> (*nothing* to do with Noteworthy Composer - they
> "stole" our name) which is DTP for music.

Here are the facts. NoteWorthy ArtWare originally released our NoteWorthy Composer as a program called "NoteWorthy 1.0", back in October of 1994 (see the history page for a list of improvements since then, all offered for free to our registered user base). In December 1994, Mr. Hill called it to our attention that he already had a DOS program called NoteWorthy. Although the Braeburn Software product package made no particular trademark claims, we elected to change the name of our product to NoteWorthy Composer, to avoid the name conflict. As you can tell, NoteWorthy ArtWare is now using "noteworthy" as an adjective in its product branding: NoteWorthy Composer, NoteWorthy Player, and NoteWorthy UpgMaker, all by NoteWorthy ArtWare.

Bottom line: products and services of NoteWorthy ArtWare are not affiliated with Braeburn Software in any way.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 24-Mar-1998

I had a quick look at their page. A few things I noticed:

1) It's DOS based (works on EGA!). That's great for the four or five of us with 386s! Unimportant for Pentium/Windows users.

2) Braeburn claim to have released Noteworthy in 1992, but they are a UK company, and so probably didn't have a trademark conflict with Noteworthy anyway (I'm not a lawyer). As to whether Noteworthy Artware "stole" the name, I created a whole software concept and checked the net later only to find (much to my sadness) that I wasn't the first. That is to say, it's quite likely that Eric and co created the name Noteworthy quite independently of Braeburn and DIDN'T steal it.

3) It doesn't seem to support MIDI playback or export

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Huy on 25-Mar-1998

OK I get the difference. If Noteworthy artware make a program called noteworthy, it would be called:
"Noteworthy Noteworthy"
OK

Reply 4 offered by: pete bowers on 25-Mar-1998

And don't forget Noteworthy records (a jazz recording label
founded in 1993) as well as Noteworthy pc disks made by
Port Inc.

Reply 5 offered by: Alan Rolfe  on 26-Mar-1998

I seem to be the first one the respond to this message who actually has the program!
As previous writers suggest, it is solely a scoring program,
with no facilities for converting to MIDI, or playing back.
No disrespect to Bernard, but I gave up using it as soon as I
discovered NWC.

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Mar-1998

I know another "DTP" program that "does not understand what it is doing so it allows you to put exactly
what you want to see on the page without arguing." It is much more flexible than
NWC and, best of all, you don't have to buy it. It is already on your computer.
It is called Paintbrush. Not quite as easy to use! :-)

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 26-Mar-1998

Paintbrush would be great for formless post-contemporary music. "That naughty modern music", as Henry Crun would put it. (Those of you who don't know the Goon Show will just have to scratch your heads...)

A

Reply 8 offered by: Alan Rolfe on 09-Apr-1998

Sorry. Forgot to mention. One thing the other Noteworthy does do that NWC doesn't is that you can put guitar chords above the staff, and when you transpose the piece, the chords are automatically transposed with it. (How about it, NWC?)


#528: Moving songs  into Word
Moving songs  into Word

(528)

Submitted by: Kevin McGrath on 24-Mar-1998

I put together song-books - is it possible to put a copy of a song with notes into a wordprocessor such as Word? The printout of the songs is great, but the only way I can at present put them together with the rest of the song, and etc is to cut it out and stick it in.

Kevin McGrath kevin.mcgrath@bigfoot.com

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 25-Mar-1998

Yes you can do it. You don't say whether you are using Windows 3.1 or 95 but here's how for 3.1
I believe that 95 is similar however you may not get as may choices at one of the stages.

1. In NoteWorthy go to Page Setup and select the staves that you want printed from the contents tab.
2. Go to the Preview tab and select preview
3. Select Copy from the Print Preview window.
4. Select one of the three options presented (this is where 3.1 and 95 differ I think). I believe the best option is one of the Metafile options. Option 1 will copy the page to the clipboard. Options 2 and 3 will ask for a filename to save as a BMP/WMF file. You only really need the file saving options if you have got many pages to do and you don't want to keep switching backwards and forwards. If you are following this through as an example then for now select option 1.

5. Go into Word.
6. Make sure that your page is set up for the way you want to print (Portrait or Landscape)
7. Select Past from the Edit menu - Et Voila !

Had you chosen options 2 or 3, you would need to select Picture from the insert menu and then select the appropriate file type (BMP or WMF) from the drop down menu. You will then be able to select the file that you saved in NoteWorthy and load it into Word.

Note 	You can only do one page at a time whichever format you use.
You may need to re-do certain pages since the 'copy mechanism' sometimes doesn't catch all of the writing on a page (the composers name for instance on the first page)
Once in Word, the metafile options are ideal for resizing to fit the page.

As Eric would say - Hope this helps.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Mar-1998

The 32-bit edition of NWC will copy a metafile graphic to the clipboard. It does not support the creation of a true *.WMF or *.BMP file. The 16-bit edition allows all three formats, as Richard describes above.


#529: Screen Set-up
Screen Set-up

(529)

Submitted by: Norman Butchko on 26-Mar-1998

Is there any way to change the spacing between the bar
lines? All I've seen is the ability to edit the number
of spaces above or below the main area, but nothing
between individual lines. A song I am doing has a chord
with "C" and "D#" together, but NWC writes them as two
separate, but close, notes instead of a chord.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 26-Mar-1998

That's how it's done in all notation editors I've seen
(and most printed music). If it really bothers you,
you could always write the D sharp as E flat, but this
might clash with your key signature and set the purists
teeth on edge. See thread 503 - G sharp or A flat - for
a lively discussion of complex issues!

Reply 2 offered by: Norm Butchko on 26-Mar-1998

I thought of that, and the double flat/double
sharp options too. it just seemed like an option
that might be available since there are many "page setup"
options - screen setup didn't seem less important.

Thanks

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 26-Mar-1998

I'm not sure I understand the problem. When I enter C nat and (control-enter) D sharp, I get a chord with the C on the left of the bar and the D# on the right, which is how it should be. What do you want them to do? One on top of the other? That's only for notes more than a second apart. Intervals of a second stack with the lower on the left of the bar and the higher on the right, afaik.
A

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 26-Mar-1998

I said <<Intervals of a second stack with the lower on the left of the bar and the higher on the right, afaik>>
Scrub that. It seems they can be either side, depending upon what's above/below them.

A


#530: MIDI file imports to NWC
MIDI file imports to NWC

(530)

Submitted by: Don Ruckman on 26-Mar-1998

I just transfered 35 files from my old music program to NWC with very good results. The only exception I found was in transfering Triplets. I played the .MID file(with Triplets) and it plays OK. When IMPORTED to NWC it transcribes as
1/16 1/8 1/16 all bared together. Any one else with this experence?
How come?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Mar-1998

MIDI import in NWC does not support (recognize) triplets. This is just how it works at the moment.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 26-Mar-1998

Don,
I created a macro file (using Win 3.1's Recorder.exe, which ain't available on NT or 95 - or 98) which "tripletises" groups of notes with the right behaviour.
Either grab it from http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/
(navigating down "music" and "composing") or go straight to http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html

OR

if it's not too big (and you don't trust the contents of the macro file), send me the midi file and I'll convert it for you.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Don Ruckman on 27-Mar-1998

NWC Support: Thanks for the heads up.
Andrew: Thanks for the offer, I am on Win 95. The edit of files with triplets will not be a big effort, thanks to the workings of NWC; and they are easy to spot.
Thanks again.
Don


#531: To trumpets, clarinets and saxophones
To trumpets, clarinets and saxophones

(531)

Submitted by: Huy on 26-Mar-1998

I'd just like to share this note with you:

The other day I imported an orchestral piece into NoteWorthy that had 17 parts. I then tried to transpose the non-C instruments by:
- selecting the staff in question
- using the Tools, Transpose option to transpose in the right direction (e.g. alto sax down 3 semitones, clarinet and trumpet up 2 s.ts [I thought] ) and on the transpose tool I deselected the checkbox
- I then inserted the correct key signature (A major and D major)
- then selected the staff again and selected transpose staff +0 with the tools

And then by soloing the instrument, the melody came out all wrong. Of course I had to print 60 pages before I realised my mistake.

Since then I've done it slightly different:
- using CTRL-SHIFT up and down
- for alto sax going up one tone and adding the key sig. (A major)
- for clarinet/trumpet going down one tone and adding key sig. (D major)

And I am still not entirely sure how to get it right every time.

And even more so, I don't know why a feature to do this hasn't been incorporated for idiots like me.

Any comments?

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ruckman on 26-Mar-1998

I just did this, transposing to Bb instrument (Trumpet)
- Select staff
- Select tools
- Select Transpose
- Put in 2 semitones UP
- Select OK
Notes in staff are all raised by 1 full step and the key signature is automatically changed.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Mar-1998

The transpose operation is as simple as the Transpose command on the Tools menu, as described by Don. One this to be careful about though: if the staff is currently in C, make sure that the key signature is present in the staff (NWC shows a key of C as an F natural while working in the editor). If a key signature is not present, then the staff will remain in the key of C after a transpose operation.

Reply 3 offered by: Drake Donahue on 26-Mar-1998

Eb Alto saxophone music is printed 9 semitones above the concert note that the alto saxophonist will sound when playing the written note.
to make a "printed" part for the alto from a 'concert' staff, proceed as explained by Don and Support except Tools\Transpose Staff\ +9 semitones\
Bb Tenor Sax is +2 like trumpet, Bb Clarinet is +2 also
Eb Baritone sax is -3
Bb Soprano Sax is +14
Bb Bass Sax is -10, as is Bb Bass Clarinet

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 29-Mar-1998

Small correction - Tenor sax is +14 from concert sound and Soprano is +2 - the same as clarinet.
And you have to be careful some of the other instruments eg. Baritone are written an octave above where they sound.
Forgetting to add a C major key signature is the usual source of error.

Reply 5 offered by: Huy on 29-Mar-1998

::Forgetting to add a C major key signature is the usual source of error.

Thankyou; this solve my problem.

Reply 6 offered by: Drake Donahue on 29-Mar-1998

NOOOOOO,
I told it true, soprano voice is higher than tenor. Tenor sax +2, soprano sax +14, alto sax +9, baritone sax-3 with concert pitch as base.
Lest we have some sort of up/down +/- confusion: Tenor sax middle C will play as concert pitch Bb5. Soprano Sax middle C will play as concert pitch Bb6.

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 30-Mar-1998

Perhaps it's my poor communication that was in error - it often is.
The original query was related to producing transposed parts from a concert score.
If you have written all the parts on the score in concert pitch and wish to tranpose and print the parts for transposing instruments you must transpose the individual instrumental staves as follows.

Bb Trumpet - transposition +2 semitones.
Eb Alto Saxophone - transposition +9 semitones.
Bb Tenor Saxophone - transposition +14 semitones.
Eb Baritone Saxophone - transposition +21 semitones - usually from concert score bass clef to written treble clef.
The Baritone is pitched one octave lower than the Alto Saxophone.
Bb Soprano Saxophone - transposition +2 semitones.
Bb Clarinet - transposition +2 semitones. Clarinet in Bb, Bb Soprano Saxophone and Bb Trumpet are pitched the same.

In terms of the concert pitch of written Middle C - that is C5 just below the treble staff on the written part for each of these instruments they will sound as follows:

Bb Trumpet written C5 - sounds as concert Bb4 - 2 semitones lower than written.
Eb Alto Saxophone written C5 - sounds as concert Eb4 - 9 semitones lower than written.
Bb Tenor Saxophone written C5 - sounds as concert Bb3 - 14 semitones lower than written.
Eb Baritone Saxophone written C5 - sounds as concert Eb3 - below bass clef - 21 semitones lower than written.
Bb Soprano Saxophone written C5 - sounds as concert Bb4 - 2 semitones lower than written.
Bb Clarinet written C5 - sounds as concert Bb4 - 2 semitones lower than written.

There are a few other interesting transpositions you may like to follow up - Horn in F, Cor Anglais, Alto Flute and for real fun try the brass band instruments.

Having been an alto/baritone/clarinet/flute player for over 40 years and a transposing professional copyist since 1972 I hope I've finally got it right!

Reply 8 offered by: Drake Donahue on 30-Mar-1998

OOPS!
Darn it, age and experience triumphs again.
My last tenor transpose went high out of range so I minus 12'd it and forgot why I was at +2.
Sorry.

Reply 9 offered by: Don Ruckman on 30-Mar-1998

I have enjoyed this discussion of 'transposing', and discovered the method of 'semitones' used in NWC. This was and is somewhat confusing except as described by Barry above for changes from 'concert' key. I am a trumpet player and do brass quintet stuff, and many times transpose things like the following:
Horn native key = F
BbTrumpet Transpose to = C
Trombone or C Tuba = Bb
or Horn native key = Ab (4 flats)
BbTrumpet Transpose to = Bb
Tromb or C tuba = Db (5 flats)
Any combination of the above is possible.

This becomes confusing in 'semitones' when one knows the "FROM" key and the "DESIRED" key UP or DOWN

Let me throw this out as an OPTIONAL Transpose method:
KEY TO KEY either UP or DOWN
ie F to Bb DOWN; this would include KEY to SAME KEY UP or DOWN and the result would be an OCTIVE( up or down)
This is the method used by a previously used composing program by me and it worked very well. It also had automatic note placement with change of clef; the notes would be proper but might be an octive off.

Don Ruckman

Reply 10 offered by: Huy on 30-Mar-1998

Thankyou; your help has been so useful.

I usually have my scores checked by players if I don't know the instrument very well. I also get string players to draw the bowings on the score. (I haven't checked if NoteWorthy has these symbols)

This discussion on transposing might be useful to go in NoteWorthy's help file if it's not already there.

Reply 11 offered by: Barb on 26-Apr-1998

Could someone help my son? He just started playning tenor sax. Is the instrument pitched at B-flat? If you play a C-major concert scale what is your starting note?

Reply 12 offered by: Drake Donahue on 26-Apr-1998

Tenor is a Bb saxophone.
When your son plays a tenor sax C he will be playing concert Bb.
If he were playing a C major concert scale he would start with a tenor D and play tenor sax D major scale.
Will Email a little NWC C Major scale and its transpose to tenor sax D Major.
You can copy this and use Tools\Transpose Staff to create the rest of the scales.
Playing concert scales when starting sax is most unusual, usual is to play tenor sax scales when starting and branch out later into transposing.
Advice: good tenor player who is good with kids (but strict) as private teacher for your beginner. Bad habits are hard to correct but easy to develop on the saxophone.
Good luck, the foam rubber ear plugs are best.

Reply 13 offered by: Bonghee on 28-Aug-1998

Sorry for sounding ignorant, but
I have written a piece of music on a program similar to Noteworthy Composer.
My problem is that I have written every instrument in 3 flats
does the above apply from 3 flats as it does from C concert?

So will it work if I just + or - like explained above?

so If I were to transpose an instrument in Bb like trumpet

Eb + 2 semitones F major? am I right

thankyou

Reply 14 offered by: Drake Donahue on 28-Aug-1998

Yes.
Tools\Transpose Staff +2 with udate playback checked will do the key change and the note movements automatically so your trumpeter can play from the written music and NWC will still play the correct pitches.

Reply 15 offered by: Richie Barshay on 31-Jan-2001

Someone please clarify for me: How do I transpose soprano sax from concert key? What is the interval? If i'm at concert C than soprano sax is playing: ????
I thought it was a minor second (1/2 step) but i'm not sure
Thanks

Reply 16 offered by: Grant on 31-Jan-2001

The soprano sax sounds a whole step (2 semitones) lower than written; or, conversely, is written 2 semitones higher than it sounds. (For a list of all the sax transpositions, see msg #1910 (reply 1) ).

A soprano sax part that is to sound in C major would be notated in D major. The NWC staff assigned to the instrument would be need a playback transposition ("Transposition" on the MIDI tab of Staff Properties) of -2 in order to sound at concert pitch.

The easiest way to do this in NWC is to write the sax part at concert pitch and then use the Transpose Staff tool. Transpose up 2 semitones and check the box labeled "Update staff play back transposition".

Reply 17 offered by: E. vonKleist on 26-Jul-2001

This is in relpy to Richie Barshay: The soprano sax would be playing a D, if the concert note was a C. I happen to be a soprano sax player, and I have to transpose from concert key to soprano key all the time. It's just a whole step, but boy it gets rough! Other instruments that share this key are the Bb clarinet, the Bb trumpet, and the Tenor saxophone. So just in case you're writing for those other instruments, maybe that will aid in your endevors. Thank you.

Reply 18 offered by: DON FRANK on 11-Oct-2001

All Bb horns except tenor sax written up 1 whole tone (MMajor 2nd.
Bb tenor written up a Major 9th .
Eb alto written up major 6 th
French horn written up a perfect th5

all C instuments flute, oboe, as written stays in cocert key.

trombone, tuba, as written stays in concert key.

eb baritone sax a 6th and a octive.

this one is the hard one: Bb Baritone is a Horn
that has two parts. one in bass cleff played as written
and treble cleff that is played like a Bb tenor sax
which is written like up a whole tone and a octive
which is called a major 9th in music.
I will tell you how all insturments get their KEY name ?
When the Horn plays its written C the note that it sounds
into concert pitch is the key of the horn.
Th e Bb Clarinet when it plays its C sounds a Bb concert
so it is called a Bb clarinet, When a Eb alto Sax sounds its written C it sounds a Eb so it is called a Eb Alto sax

So when a flute plays its written C it sounds C and we
say that the Flute, oboe, piano, trombone, and bells
are C insturments.
c to eb is is called minor 3rd but
if its Eb to c it is called a major 6th, as you can see 3 bebecomes 6,s and minors be come major.

how many sharps does G# major have, There are two answers.

send me the answer for fun.

don frank ret Army Bandsmen

P.S don,t mine my spelling

Reply 19 offered by: Grant on 12-Oct-2001

Don't forget the C instruments that transpose. These end up sounding in concert key, but in a different octave than written: piccolo and celesta, an octave higher; glockenspiel, 2 octaves higher; double bass and contrabassoon, an octave lower.

As far as I'm concerned, the answer to your question about how many sharps G# major has is: "too many".

Reply 20 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Oct-2001

> how many sharps does G# major have, There are two answers.
Answer 1: 8.
Answer 2: 7, plus a double sharp.
Answer 3: Grant's, which is the one I use.
Answer 4: (The enharmonic answer) - None. It's really Ab, which has four flats and no sharps whatsoever.

Reply 21 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 12-Oct-2001

So, you hear an enharmonic modulation coming a mile away...

Reply 22 offered by: marsu on 22-Oct-2001

About rep.19 : I'd add Bass guitar that plays actually one octave lower than written.
Fred, ain't it the same for guitar too, btw ?

About G#M sharps number: 6, plus a double sharp; or 7, with one being double. Grant's answer is yet the best! But I'd read it as AbM too (though one won't play it the same in that case)


#532: Converting .syx to .mid
Converting .syx to .mid

(532)

Submitted by: Chris Young on 27-Mar-1998

I am a registered user of Noteworthy (a brilliant package I
must say), and also own a yamaha PSR-330 keyboard.
What I want to do is record s song into the internal
memory of the keyboard (which I can do very easily), and then down load that to my PC so that I can produce the notation within Noteworthy. I have tried the following approaches so far:

1) I have tried recording directly into Noteworthy by
having a simple temp track running and then recording
the song in Notewrothy as I play it. The problem with
this is that the tempo track and the tempo track in the
keyboard get out of synch with each other and so the
resultant notation is messy to say the least.

2) I have also been able to download the stored song data
to a pc package which stores this as System Exclusive midi
files (.syx) files. These obviusly cannot be read into
Noteworthy as it only recognises standard midi files
(.mid). Do you know of any good .syx to .mid conversion
programs? I have found a couple on the internet but none
of them seem to work properly.

FYI my PC runs WIndows 95

ANY HELP WOULD BE GREATLY RECIEVED!!!

MANY THANKS A FRUSTRATED USER

CHRIS YOUNG

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 29-Mar-1998

I tried this briefly with my PSR-520.
The keyboard can send out midi, though it then is taken down on one track by NWC instead of split. Maybe single track outs (ie one part at a time) would get around this. I don't know if the 330 is smart enough to do that. I think the 520 can. I think you'd need a true midi program that can read SMPTE (or whatever they're called) time markings (so long as the 330 actually sends them).
Hunt around on the web and you may find a midi sequencer that reads syx files.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: James on 30-Apr-1998

Actually, the 330 doesn't allow you to send MIDI data in the
Song Mode, you can only send it in a bulk dump (or as you
record it). Using Cakewalk, or MIDIOX you can get the bulk
dumps as sysx files, but I'm not sure how to convert them to
midi format or vice versa. Although, I did discover that
the 330 has limited XG capabilities. :-)

Reply 3 offered by: James (again) on 25-Jun-1998

i don't have noteworthy, just a PSR-330, but for recording
directly into the software sequencer, try changing the midi
clock (can you in noteworthy?) if you set the clock to
match the keyboard's tempo, be sure to hit play on the PSR,
but if you set the keyboard to match the PC's clock, make
sure that noteworthy sends the codes to play the accomp.
i tried all this and it works in Cakewalk.
(sorry i guess i'm a traitor, talking about Cakewalk in a
noteworthy msg board, but sequencers are expensive and
i'm not buying another squencer, even if it is easier to use)


#533: Importing midis - why doesn't it work good?
Importing midis - why doesn't it work good?

(533)

Submitted by: Joonas Linkola on 27-Mar-1998

Hi,

I have wondered that why doesn't the importing midis -tool work good in NW Composer? In NWPlayer it works fine, and puts all notes in right places, but in Composer program all tempos, notes and so on are messed up. Why can't you use the same importing tool in Composer than you use in Player?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Mar-1998

Our Player and Composer products use the same import engines. The differences are:

1 - The player actually plays back the MIDI performance, rather than the notation created by the import (so it will usually sound better than the playback of an imported score in NWC).

2 - The player does NOT include options that let you control how a piece is imported.

Perhaps the added flexibility in NWC is causing some confusion for you. Try setting you note resolution to 32nd notes, your rest resolution to Quarter Notes. This matches the settings used by the player (behind the scenes).

Reply 2 offered by: Joonas Linkola on 27-Mar-1998

Thanks for the info.

It seems strange that the Player can notate the midi perfectly, where the Composer fails to do the job.

Well, I'll try the suggested values.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Mar-1998

It might help if you explained what you mean by "fails to do the job", since Player and Composer do exactly the same thing when it comes to notating a MIDI performance.

Reply 4 offered by: Joonas Linkola on 28-Mar-1998

Well, at first, I wasn't aware that the player plays the MIDI instead of the notation...

The thing I meant was that in Composer, when I import a MIDI file, the playback is "sticky", so all notes and rests are not the right length and it doesn't sound the same as when the MIDI is normally played.

I hope you understood this :) If not, I can send you an example file.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 29-Mar-1998

"Sticky" is a good description!
To create readable notation, NWC "quantizes" the note lengths (and rest lengths), which are configurable in the import wizard. "Stickiness" occurs when those lengths don't suit the music being played (NB: triplets [and any odd tuplets] don't import well into NWC at the moment).
Try fiddling with note lengths and see what you can trade off between readability and what sounds right.

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: Antonin on 05-Apr-1998

Is it possible to hope for a triplet-recognizing NWC?
That is one of the few doors standing behind it and
perfection

Reply 7 offered by: Wayne Petrychyn on 07-Apr-1998

I vote for the MIDI import to interpret triplets!!!


#534: Exporting midi file type 0
Exporting midi file type 0

(534)

Submitted by: John Hughes on 27-Mar-1998

I am experiencing problems with the midi files produced with version 1.5 not being recognized by my Yamaha Keyboard (PSR620). I had managed to get a previous version (?) to work, but cannot get this one to function. The midi files produced play fine on the PC players, and the actual files on disk are recognized - however the format appears to be rejected. Has anyone else had any experience of problems in this area or aware of any useful tools that may help to examine what is going on.

Regards
John

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Mar-1998

If you want Type 0 files, you need to set the MIDI File Type option accordingly in Tools, Options, File tab.

Reply 2 offered by: John Hughes on 29-Mar-1998

Sorry I ommitted to say that I have set the file type to type 0 (except in the message header). I have also attempted every possible option of the options but believe that SMF 0 and exclude header information are most appropriate - this has with version 1.5 not worked, however did appear to work with a previous version. Any clues ?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Mar-1998

I do not know what your problem might be. If you have a sample of a MIDI file that works, and one that does not work, then we might be able to help. Send the samples to support, and mention this forum thread (534.htm).


#535: Brass instruments/AWE64 sound fonts
Brass instruments/AWE64 sound fonts

(535)

Submitted by: Richard Berthelsdorf on 28-Mar-1998

I installed an AWE64, and found the sound quality to be
superior to the card I used before, but still the
instruments were unacceptable to me (I'm writing for brass
quintet - 2 trumpets, horn, trombone & tuba). So I bought
a 12M memory module from Creative, then downloaded the Chaos
12M sound font (as suggested by Drake Donahue) and installed
it. But I can't tell any difference in the sounds I get
from Noteworthy, before or after the memory/sound font
installation (I also tried the sound fonts which came with
the card & memory module). So I have the feeling I just
wasted $$. Am I missing something in my installation, or
will brass instruments sound hokey no matter what I do?

Here's what I've done:
In AWE Control:
synth tab
available synth = General Midi
set path to the Chaos sound font
apply (following this, there are only 380K out of the
12M memory left available)
quit
In Noteworthy:
Tools
Options
Midi tab
put AWE64 MIDI Synth (620) into the "devices used by
play back" window
OK
Staff
Playback Instrument
patch list = General MIDI
selected the appropriate instrument
I left the bank select and controller at their defaults.
OK

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 28-Mar-1998

I do have a tin ear but I found the 8meg Chaos head and shoulders better than the Emu 8 meg gmgs which was a head better than what came with my awe 32 card. The 12 meg chaos claims to use Roland samples so I have been feeling bad about only having 8 meg. Compared to live even a CD sounds cheesy to me and a CD is still better than the Chaos. I have not found a trumpet i like in any sound font but Chaos trombone, french horn, baritone and tubas, etc, as well as the woodwinds; I like real well. Not crazy about the 8 meg chaos guitars. If you are not at present, I might suggest using the line out to rca plugs cable that came with the card (in my case anyway) to connect to your stereo system (or use headphones). My computer speakers were limiting my attempt to hear good sound.

Staff
Staff properties
Does AWE 620 midi synth appear as playback device?
If perchance it does not-mine used midimapper at one time and midimapper wanted fm synth ...

Reply 2 offered by: Richard on 28-Mar-1998

Thanks for the reply. Yes, AWE 620 midi synth appears
as playback device. I've tried midi mapper also; sounds
exactly the same. The sound with headphones is only
marginally better, still very unrealistic. Maybe I expect
too much.

Reply 3 offered by: Drake Donahue on 28-Mar-1998

You might try recording .WAV files of your instruments and:
if you like the playback use Vienna to make your own font.
if you don't like the playback then ?punt? :)
Side by side of a .WAV vs a .MID vs the instrument doing the same note may tell you whether the big gap is in the playback hardware or the wavetable synth.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Mar-1998

Two things:

1. I am not an expert in SoundBlaster support, but, in your AWE Control, I think that your available synth should be set to "User Synth", not "General MIDI" (this is what works for me)

2. In NWC, you should have only one device listed in "Devices used by play back", which should be AWE64 MIDI Synth (or, in our case, we "AWE64G MIDI Synth", probably because it is the AWE64 Gold model)

Reply 5 offered by: Neil Dewhurst on 06-Apr-1998

It sounds to me like Richard's problem is that the samples in the GM set
aren't good enough to provide the standard of synthesis he's after.

He's got 12 Mbytes of RAM in his card, and he wants to use four different
instruments. So he has 2.5 Mbytes per instrument available.

However, what he's actually done is to upload a complete general MIDI set,
eight(!) full drumkits plus 128 assorted instruments. The sizes will vary, but
that means he's using 100 K or so per instrument.

So roughly speaking he's using instruments that are 1/25 the quality he could
have, because almost all the RAM in his board is taken up by other instruments
he's not actually using.

If he wants instruments that sound authentic, the way to do it is to get
some nice big samples for just the instruments he wants, and load them into his
soundcard in place of the general MIDI set.

The catch is that he'll either have to buy them, or make them himself.

One fairly cheap option would be the CD of brass instruments that E-mu sell.
I got it bundled with my AWE, and the instruments sound fairly good (certainly
better than their General Midi instruments). I don't work for E-mu, and
in fact this isn't even a recommendation - I'm just pointing out that it's
available.

Also, regarding "General MIDI" and "User Synth" - the first refers to
instrument bank 0, the second to banks 1, 2, 3 etc. As I understand it the only
difference is that bank 0 has a Creative Labs-supplied general MIDI soundfont
installed in it by default. If you want to use all the AWE RAM for your own
samples, you have to replace it. So what Richard was doing was correct.

Neil

Reply 6 offered by: Richard Berthelsdorf on 08-Apr-1998

I think Neil is spot on. I don't need 10 Mb of drums and
electric guitars.
Neil - I'm trying to figure which CD from E-mu you're referring to.
The closest I can find on their web page is called "Emulator
standards", part no. 6009. It has a lot of stuff other than
brass instruments, which are distinctly in the minority. Or
do you mean a different CD? Has it any identifying characteristics?
I'd be reluctant to spend another $95 without some assurance that
it wouldn't be wasted.
Thanks for your help.

Reply 7 offered by: Drake Donahue on 08-Apr-1998

I think the 6009 sounds like the source for the 8mb gmgs that you got with your card.
creaf.com has a free download of "clean horns" on their site from their latest efforts. It is a french horn that does sound more like a french horn than the gmgs or chaos, but it sounds ugly to me. In short, you are more likely to hear it and say, "french horn", but then to say, "fire that guy".
My $95 stays in my pocket.
Have you looked at the Vienna sound font editor yet?

Reply 8 offered by: Paul McBurney on 11-May-1998

I feel that some of you are missing the point. I too have been writing for Brass Quintet but I have found the sounds that came with my AWE32 more than adequate. I'm a Trumpet player myself, so believe me when I tell you thay are nothing like the true sounds of the original instruments.
I only use the available sounds to 'proof' my writing. I know that when I put my Score up in front of a group that it will sound heaps better (obviously) but for checking the general overall voicing and timbre of my arrangement, what comes with the sound card is fine.

I see no real point in spending the time and/or money researching better sounds. It's easier to make a recording of the final result (when it's played that is...) and play that when you want to hear the 'true' sound of your arrangement. Besides... a group of talented muso's make an arrangement sound like it should, not like how a computer would play it...

Reply 9 offered by: ben on 04-Dec-1999

were can I get a version of vienna at.....the only sound font editor i found was esbeekay and it does not support SB2 files...which I use on my Live!........I would like to have a good program for making and mapping out sound fonts.

Thanks

Reply 10 offered by: dev on 23-Dec-1999

Vienna 2.3 is available at www.sblive.com, in their download section.

Reply 11 offered by: Joel Cress on 23-Dec-1999

Before you spend the BIG bucks for soundfonts, first check out the HUGE database of free soundfonts at

http://www.pvv.org/~thammer/HammerSound/

You will find that this gentleman has compiled a world-wide collection of single instrument samples, ensembles, GM/GS sets . . .

This is my one-stop site for soundfonts -- check it out and you'll be busy for weeks!

Reply 12 offered by: Joel Cress on 23-Dec-1999

By the way, I'll have to agree with Richard in that my experience with the SoundBlaster AWE64 Gold card has been quite disappointing. Having used a Korg M1 for years now, I expected the superior specifications of the AWE 64 to eliminate my need for the Korg altogether. This has definitely not been my experience, regardless of the soundfont that I have tried. Not that the Korg is by any means perfect with its loopy, loopy strings; alas, 'tis the state of computer-generated music!

Reply 13 offered by: Stevie on 10-Feb-2000

I've just bought a Soundblaster Live card. One of the main reasons for this was to use sounfonts with it but the Vienna manual is so crap I can't work out how to make my own soundfonts or load patches/banks etc..
I hope I'm not just being thick!
Can anyone please help??

Reply 14 offered by: alex on 18-Jul-2000

I downloaded some soundfonts from the internet,but i dont know how to use it in the Qubase music program.can you help me out?

Reply 15 offered by: alex on 28-Aug-2000

I have downloaded some soundfont from hammer sound site,but I cant hear them with vienna software program .then I tryied to download The Awav software but i still cant hear the sounds.And there is something else .Idont know how to use the soundfonts in the cubase.cant you pls help me with this problems

Reply 16 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Aug-2000

Cubase is notorious for not working properly with midi devices that play via the wave device (including softsynths, etc.). For what it's worth, this is the forum for NoteWorthy Composer, a program that does not have such restrictions. You might see if you can get some support or a workaround from http://www.steinberg.net

Reply 17 offered by: DjIxam20 on 05-Oct-2000

Hi everyone!

I want to buy some RAM for my Soundblaster AWE64...

Now it´s have 512kB :-(

If you will give me your RAM-CARD cheaply, then write me to:
DJIXAM20@UBOOT.COM

Greetz, DjIxam20

Reply 18 offered by: Ricardo solis  on 11-Oct-2000

Hi, i have downloaded some sondfonts. And i have a lot of problems:

The first of all is that i wanted to download good soundfonts but i only have 553kb of RAM. What sould i do?
By another sound-card?, get more RAM memory?, or its not necessary the RAM memory?

Anyway i use Cakewalk programs, and i can't find the sound fonts i downloaded in Cakewalk or Cubace. What sould i do?

Could anyone help me, please?

Reply 19 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Oct-2000

If 512K RAM is all you have that is the largest font you can load.
You have three options -
1. Buy the Creative RAM extension (expensive) -
2. Buy an SB Live card (probably as expensive but you get an updated card) -
3. Swap the 64 for an SB32 with RAM slots and find some 30pin SIMMS to fit the card (you need pairs of SIMMS in 2Mb, 4MB or 16Mb size).
I have 2x4Mb Simms on my 32 allowing me to load an 8Mb soundfont (I use the 8mb CHAOS sf for the brass and saxes).
4Mb SIMMS cost about $5US each here in OZ.

You could also use a patch cache containing just the trumpet, trom and sax patches in another bank - with a bit of luck this may fit your RAM and use your ROM for the other voices.

Reply 20 offered by: Sébastien on 12-Oct-2000

Hello ,
I have a AWE64G
I would like buy Memory Module
I must use Creative Memory expensive ..or
I can Use "memory compatible or adaptateur for Sim standard" ?

You said with AWE32 you can Use old SImm 32pin standard !
Not with AWE64G !!! exactly

Thank for your help
Seb

Reply 21 offered by: silverwolf on 23-Jan-2001

i cant record any of the songs i create on midi can you help me!!!!

Reply 22 offered by: Grant on 23-Jan-2001

If you can't find the answer to this question here msg #1003, it probably doesn't exist.

Reply 23 offered by: Robert on 18-Aug-2001

I see this question is 3 years old, so by now I'm assuming you've upgraded your hardware, to either a later version of the SoundBlaster Live which is actually an incredible card for making music, and expanded your knowledge of Soundfonts, or gotten some sort of pro gear.

In general you'll find that the larger the sample you're able to use the better the sound will be. Your available memory on that old card was very limited. The Live cards allow you to use up to half your system memory, so if you've since upgraded your computer, hopefully to at least a Pentium II with some expanded memory, you'll have at least 128 megs or more. To get an optimum sound on any instrument, loading stand-alone instruments is the best way to go instead of taking up memory with a bank where most of the instruments you're not even going to use - Just how often are people inspired to use helicopters, bird tweets and ringing phones in their music? >;0)

It's my seat of the pants observation that for a string, woodwind or brass instrument to begin to sound decent it needs to be at least a couple of megs, and many are far larger than that. I have a piano that's 29 megs by itself! And it isn't close to the largest available.

Brass instruments in particular are a bit of a problem, especially trumpet. The problem is, even if you have a killer, unlooped sample of a real trumpet, because of the nature of the instrument, simply having the sound isn't enough. There are so many subtle variables, trying to make an artificial trumpet sound real is pretty tough. Having this perfect, pristine trumpet sound that's exactly the same every time doesn't give you a truly authentic sound. I've heard some that are better than others, but even the pro sounds I've heard aren't quite there. A composer I know said he has a brass file that uses a wide variety of types of attack samples - hard, soft, falls, rips, etc. to cover the range of what the instrument can do.

You can make your own, but you'd have to have some decent equipment to record a trumpet well, and it will be a heck of an involved process. I imagine there are professionally made brass soundfonts, you'd have to check out any demos to see if they're good enough for you.

Reply 24 offered by: Dave Goodwin on 06-Dec-2001

I came accross this site by sheer accident while searching in vain for realistic brass fonts. As a Cornet player and conductor I spend a considerable amount of time producing scores for brass band music and bought an AWE64 Gold sound card some years ago in the mistaken belief that sound cards could faithfully reproduce the brass sounds I was looking for i.e. Cornet, Flugel horn, Tenor Horn, Baritone, Euphonium, Trombone and Tuba. Like the rest of you I feel I've been conned and there is no such thing as a fair reproduction available even with the very latest cards and fonts. I would refer you to REPLY No.8 offered by Paul McBurney as the answer I twigged on to some time back. The sound card will quite happily play all the parts, even if a bit honky tonky, but it's not until the music is put in front of musicians that it comes to life and that's something that computers, however wonderfully they may be portrayed in the glossy magazines, cannot produce.
Sad thing to say but keep your hard earned cash in your pocket rather than spend it in the mistaken belief that your computer and sound card will produce real life brass sounds.

Reply 25 offered by: Jonathan Swift on 29-Dec-2001

What I do to make the sound more "authentic" is to push the mixer to the point of adding a little distortion while recording, and depending on whether or not "punch" is needed, use a very quick attack gating/compression that actually is "pumping" which is supposedly not a welcome artifact, but when blended in with a more "normal" signal often does the trick.


#536: Size of staffs and notes
Size of staffs and notes

(536)

Submitted by: Jeremy on 28-Mar-1998

I have probably a very simple problem but I cannot find any help in the help menus etc.
My staffs and notes seem to be very big when I print out the music but I cannot find a way to reducing either, can anyone help?
Thanks

Jeremy :o)

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ruckman on 29-Mar-1998

Jeremy, the following should help:
From FILE select PAGE SETUP, then OPTIONS TAB
then change 'Staff Size(in points)' 40,
to something less, say 20,15,25.
Go back to FILE and hit Page preview.
Also, the PREVIEW TAB in page setup will tell you
the Number of pages required to print your score.
Hope this helps you out
Don Ruckman ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 2 offered by: Huy on 29-Mar-1998

The options, size, preview, and copy features are things about NoteWorthy I love so much.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 29-Mar-1998

Is there anyway to make the default (in Normal) some size other than 40? Or should we just create another tetmplate and click on that instead?

A

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 30-Mar-1998

One of the main reasons for templates is to allow user control over option settings. The best thing to do is create your own "Normal" or "Blank" template, and use it instead of our internally default "<Blank Score>" template.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Mar-1998

This seems to be a common problem for new users. I think
they get used to the nice intuitive interface where notes get
automatically laid out for them, and expect printing to work
the same way. When they press the print button there is
no hint that you can configure how it will look.

I think the solution is to put Print Preview
and a Print Setup buttons on the print dialog, so users are
made aware that these options exist.


#537: Two Voices on a Staff
Two Voices on a Staff

(537)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 31-Mar-1998

NWC 1.5 goes a long way in supporting two voices on one staff.
The rule seems to be if you chord two notes of different length with stems in opposite directions, you can add notes with stems in the direction of the shorter note until they add up to the time of the longer note.
This is good, but it does not support the case when you have alternating overlapped notes.
Consider this example of one bar in 4/4 time:
Stems up: Two half notes.
Stems down: Quarter note chorded with first half note, then eighth, quarter, eighth, quarter.
The second quarter appears before the second half, but its duration overlaps part of the half.
This sequence should add up to four beats, but currently it does not.

Perhaps the rule should be after a mixed chord notes with different stem directions should be considered to be two voices with posisbly overlapping notes. This sequence would end either when both voices catch up, or at the end of the bar.
The danger here this could cause confusion to someone not expecting this rule, but I don't think so because it would only apply to notes that have a forced stem direction.

Is this reasonable?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 01-Apr-1998

Yes, I have had problems with this sort of thing as well. The only way to overcome it is to split your second quarter into two eighth notes and tie them, the second eighth note being part of the chord with the second half note. - Not elegant and definitely not what is usually written, but it works.

As to your suggestion, it sounds plausible but the problem might be if the end of the bar has been reached and the voices haven't caught up with each other ('cause someone has made a counting mistake for example). This would introduce Eric having to program 'forced corrections' into the bar to keep everything that follows in sync. and I don't think he would want to do that. - Not that he ever comments on possibilities of future developments.

Reply 2 offered by: Keith Markham on 01-Apr-1998

I have also had these problems, also in putting a rest in one voice and a note in the other. I have had to 'doctor' the notation with specially insterted rest characters (Or note characters) by using the text insertion facility and a 'user defined' font of musical characters. Doesn't play back of course, but looks OK.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 01-Apr-1998

I've had to do this on many occasions - it's just something
I live with. I'd be wary of having a true second voice on
the stave - Capella has this feature, (it only allows chords
with all the notes the same length), but if you just want
the occasional note, you still have to enter a complete line
of rests up to that point. Better I believe to have the
more flexible arrangement now available, and live with the
occasional tied note adjustment. If the music is to be
printed, then try using the Noteworthy font and inserting
preferred notes as text items.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 01-Apr-1998

I don't beleeeeve it! Keith must have sent his reply while
I was writing mine! At least we both agree on the use of
text items!

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 01-Apr-1998

Two workarounds. Split the notes so you can chord them - tedious, looks bad, but sounds right.
Or just draw in the notes with text - looks right, sounds not quite right.
A compromise is to shorten the notes so there is no overlap - looks not too bad, sounds a little choppy.

Richard: I see no problem with reaching the end of the bar with notes out of synch. Noteworthy lets you put bar lines where ever you want. The problem might be when you request automatic bar lines. It would have to stick the bar line in when the notes add up to the count, and leave the rest out of synch. This is no different than any other error of this type.

Reply 6 offered by: James Franklin on 02-Apr-1998

Just to throw my two cents worth in: the answer I believe is the layered staff concept that is in the experimental stage with NWC. What's really being discussed here is the placement of multiple, independent voices on a single staff and not chords. I tend to think of chords as stacks of notes with the _same duration_ and anything else as multiple voices.

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 03-Apr-1998

That certainly is a unique and powerful solution. Playback would be correct; the challenge would be to notate the combined score properly. How do you notate three or more voices properly with only two stem directions. Still, maybe this is the way to go.

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Vasey on 04-Apr-1998

I think two independent voices per stave would be quite
enough to handle, thank you! It's really only
piano/keyboard/synthesiser scores that require complex
chording - anything else and we can add extra staves. Even
choral settings rarely split individual voices into more
than two parts, and when this is done it is usually printed
as seperate lines - too many parts on one line become
cluttered and ultimately unreadable. But no doubt there are
some skilled keyboard artists out there who thrive on
'squiggly' chords - any comments from them??
P.S. Capella (dare I mention it again - I definitely prefer
NWC) allows no more than two voices per stave.

Reply 9 offered by: Blair Dowden on 06-Apr-1998

Right after I made my last comment here, I received some music to score that really required the experimental staff layering feature to do it properly.
This is the first time I really used that feature, rather than just played with it. I have the following observations:
It does a dumb merge. I thought I could fill one staff with rests, and only notate the bars I needed to. But it dumped the rests in every staff! So I have to make copy of the whole other staff.
It does not merge with rests, so when I need a chord with a rest, I have to do it the old way, and copy it into both staves. A smart merge would save a lot of notation time.
Tie and slur lines are wrong. Noteworthy points these in the opposite direction of the stems, which is fine for a single voice. For two voices I need the opposite. Either NWC should be smart enough to know this, or we should get control over the direction of slurs and ties.
Except for tie and slur lines, staff merging did the job. It is one of those thing that most people do not need (like me until now), but those who do need it need it bad.

Reply 10 offered by: Pete Bowers on 07-Apr-1998

I am finding the staff layering to be very useful.

For Rests, would it be possible to have an additional attribute such as "Hidden when Layered" for rests. This would allow you to notate the rests in a separate staff and match the bar lines until it is time to layer. It would also allow a bit more control over which rests are visible if you need more clarity for the singers. Positional placement of rests (or a +/- displacement value) would be an advantage also.

Reply 11 offered by: Andrew on 07-Apr-1998

Agreed. I think we'll need both attirbutes (hidden + vertical position)

A

Reply 12 offered by: Joseph Hansche on 10-Apr-1998

I think that the experimental files are very useful... I have the two files for staff layering. Are there any others? If so, where can I find them?

Reply 13 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Apr-1998

Joseph,

Do you need more files? I believe that you can add or delete as many staves as you like to one of the experimental files to construct a new piece.

Reply 14 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Apr-1998

You can copy the files (or use "Save As"), delete the contents to nothing, then paste in music from another file. This has to be the only program where the only way to create a new file is by cloning an old one. If they release another "experimental" feature, will be be able to mate the two files if we want to use both features at once?

Reply 15 offered by: David on 17-Apr-1998

I would rather a feature that could split two or three voices on a staff into two or three tracks.
:)


#538: Fine problems
Fine problems

(538)

Submitted by: Susan Tucker on 01-Apr-1998

I have a multi-stave piece that I'm trying to play back.
It's got a DS al Fine at the end the DS at measure 2, and
the Fine in about the middle. The problem? The piece stops
playing when the Fine is reached the first time.

I've looked at the examples, and they play fine. I made
sure all of my staves had all of the flow direction markings.
What else should I check?

thanks,

Susan

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 02-Apr-1998

Susan,

I suspect that what you have done is to put a D.S. Segno mark at bar two and not the Segno mark (There should not be the letters D.S. in front of the mark) . If this is what you have done, then replace this with just the segno mark (It is near the top of the drop down list from insert flow variance menu , not near the bottom of the list. All should then be OK.

If this is not what you have done, then post a message back here .
Richard

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Apr-1998

As Richard points out, the common source of error is using the wrong marker at the various places in the Dal Segno redirection. Here are a few tips:

1 - Open the REPEAT4.NWC file in the NWC Samples folder, and press Ctrl+I to get a description of how to construct a Dal Segno redirection.

2 - You can select individual redirections in the samples, then press Ctrl+E to see which setting is used.

3 - The Help button in the Flow Direction dialog also explains each possible setting.

Reply 3 offered by: Susan Tucker on 07-Apr-1998

Thanks to both Richard and NWC support, you hit the
segno on the head and my playback is fine now.

Regards,

Susan


#539: Does a French Version exist ?
Does a French Version exist ?

(539)

Submitted by: catherine guirao on 02-Apr-1998

Do you know if a french version exist for NoteWorthy composer ?

Thanks for your reply.

Best regards,

Catherine

Reply 1 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 02-Apr-1998

I don't think there are any other versions than the English one.
But it could be a nice feature to have a localization option. And more, if the menu items could be in a separate file, we could, as forum users, take the localisation work in charge for French, German, Italian, .....

Bruno

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 21-Apr-1998

There is a way to translate it, it is to use a ressource Editor such as Watcom's.
I did it once already --'twas on version 1.21 I guess--, and it worked fine. I also modified the order of #, b and becarre(natural) so they be in a more logical order (b, nat., #).
For the help alas, no easy way does exist (to my knowledge), in the .hlp way at least. with hlp2html, ok.

But for you francophone people who have access to the NNTP{News protocol}(I don't), why not creating fr.musique.nwc ?

Hope this helps.

P.S. When I got time I'll do it again for the current version (1.50). But Eric told me that he would not support bugs in that case. Which I obviously understand :-)

Marsu


#540: Midi channel note volume
Midi channel note volume

(540)

Submitted by: Jon Featherstone on 02-Apr-1998

My great delight of my new Midiator parallel port/MIDI interface
was killed stone dead when after recording a piece with my
Roland keyboard Noteworthy scored it correctly but played
it back with all notes having the same volume. All that
heartrending feeling and expression gone!
I imagine the answer I will get is that Noteworthy is a music notation
program, and not a sequencer, so the record feature is only
a way to enter music. Is this correct? If I had some other sequencer program,
would it also keep the note volume variations within each
MIDI channel?

Thanks,

Jon F.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Apr-1998

You are correct on all counts. When you record a performance with NWC, the notes are captured, quantized, and notated. Dynamics would need to be added separately.

A sequencer would capture the dynamics on the note events, just as you suspected.

Reply 2 offered by: David on 02-Apr-1998

But then it would be good if this information was stored with the note. For example, if the velocity of the note was indicated by notes in grayscale, where strong notes were black and soft notes were light gray, this would make Noteworthy the best program for indicating dynamics on a score.

Could this be a goer? (we know what goer means?)

Reply 3 offered by: David on 02-Apr-1998

Then NoteWorthy could even notate the dynamics exactly for us...

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 04-Apr-1998

I've always wondered why NWC didn't even "have a go" at doing this.
I know that it would be difficult/ridiculous to use dynamic markings to get every nuance, but it IS a pain not getting ANY nuance. Like quantising the time aspect, maybe we could ask NWC to "quantise" the dynamics so that if we play it soft, it marks p, medium, mp, loud, f, very loud ff etc.
And maybe if we hit some notes in between on the way, it could even mark a cresc or decresc.
Has anyone ever put this on the wish list?

Andrew


#541: C sharp to D flat?
C sharp to D flat?

(541)

Submitted by: Richard Lee on 02-Apr-1998

After a transposition, a piece we entered shows up in C#. I'd like to have it instead in D flat. Sure, it would sound the same, but it is a psychological thing about how it falls under the fingers. If it weren't for accidentals I could simply move the staff up and change the key signature, but there are accidentals, so I don't think it works out cleanly.
Is there a way to tell the transposer to write it in D flat instead of C sharp. (I've tried to fool it by transposing up and then down again etc., but it doesn't seem to work.)
Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Lee on 02-Apr-1998

This has already been asked and an answer has been posted (nice forum, eh?). See archived thread 194.htm where Tim Reichard gives an ingenious answer.

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ruckman on 03-Apr-1998

Richard,
I was interested in the reply to your topic, then I see you replied to yourself -- I guess it gets to us all sometimes. Anyway, If you look at the Forum article "To trumpets,clarinets,and saxophones", about 10 items below this one (with 10 replies at this time),you will see a reply I submitted, and submitted to NWC Wish List. With this optional method, you could(would) specify Db as your desired key sig( or ,of course C# if you so desired). This was the method used by another composer program I used for years.

Don Ruckman ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Apr-1998

Just for completeness, the procedure is:

- Force accidentals
- Select the key signature and change as needed
- Transpose 0

The transpose operation causes the notes to be respelled in the new key signature. If you just audit accidentals, the notes will not be respelled in the new key signature.

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen on 06-Apr-1998

But... (sorry to go on about this) NWC doesn't, in general, spell accidentals correctly after transposition -see the thread "G sharp or A flat?".


#543: Suggestions for all to consider
Suggestions for all to consider

(543)

Submitted by: P. Smårs on 05-Apr-1998

Suggestion #1:
How about adding a feature that enables us to drag and drop
high-lighted notes à la MS Word? Then you can have two open
child windows, one of which with the most used notes, or
sequences of notes, in it and drop them on the lower child
window as you notate your song. It will require that the
program senses on which staff, if several, the cursor is
located and high-light this staff automatically as it
passes over it.

No more cut'n'paste. Of course, this feature should be
optional. I know some people don't like it in Word so there
is a great possibility that someone might dislike it in
this very neat program too...although I can't see why. ;-)

You already have the drag and drop thingy available in the
program (open file) so I think it would be fairly easy to
implement it.

Suggestion #2:
Another thing I really, really would like to see, is if you
could go back to the print preview gadget that was earlier
available in NoteWorthy Composer. That preview was much
better than what it is now.

Suggestion #3:
Also, please keep the layering feature. Very nice! We are
two users on the same street over here and we both love this
new feature.

Regards from Sweden,
P. Smårs.
--
Post scriptum
Oh, I forgot to tell you...I'm a registered user. :-)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 06-Apr-1998

Re: Idea 1, P says "You already have the drag and drop thingy available in the program (open file) so I think it would be fairly easy to implement it."
Whilst it is true that drag and drop happens with files, it would be an understatement to say that this is entirely different! Drag and dropping files simply sends a message to NWC saying "Please open file so-and-so".

Suggestion #2: "go back to the print preview gadget that was earlier available"
I remember things being different, but can't remember what was. I actually like being able to preview things, even though I seem to have to shuffle around a bit to get there.

Suggestion #3: "Also, please keep the layering feature. "
Whole heartedly agree. I guess Eric needs to work out which way to jump with rests. Whether to be able to hide them or move them up and down, or both.

Reply 2 offered by: James Franklin on 06-Apr-1998

Re: suggestion #3
Yes to keeping the layering technique. As to the rests, if I had to choose, my vote would be for absolute placement of the rests. I have in mind a "note" value for the rest (where the bottom or top of the rest touches the staff] with a default value. Then we could move the rest up or down like a note.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Heindrich on 06-Apr-1998

The current preview system is the best, except that on my computer (in 800 x 600) when I maximise the preview window, the gap where you see the page is only a third the width of the available window. So to look at the page you have to scroll around in the window. It doesn't worry me; I just wasn't sure what P. Smårs meant in point #2.

ST3V3.

Reply 4 offered by: drake donahue on 07-Apr-1998

how 'bout smooth scrolling during playback with the red note fixed on the screen a little way right of the left screen edge.
some help for us play/sing along (badly)addicts.?

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 08-Jun-1998

Sorry drake, not every one has a PII 450MHz with a 3Dmonster video card !!!
On a 486 (yes, some still exist and they do work fine) it is perfect like this and wouldn't accept more refresh work.
And worse, you would be sea-sick in less than 2 minutes ! In particular because all notes played at the same time are not always equal in duration... ;-)

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 08-Jun-1998

Dear P. Smårs,
Thanx for your suggestions, they make sense. But I'd bet you should try to use more your kbd and less your mouse, you'd gain time. But you're probably not left-handed (using the mouse with the "right" hand though), so your kbd-skills won't be as quick as they could. Just because the layout of the keyboard has been designed to SLOW DOWN the typists !!! (Or do you have a Dvorak kbd ?) As you can verify yourself, much important keys are accessible with the LEFT hand...
This was referring to your point number 1. About point 3 (staff layout in experimentals NWC), I guess we all agree : it's GREAT ! Still there are troubles with rests. Hope that Eric will (soon :-)) find a solution ! (Using the same property (height) as the notes would may be do the work ??)

Good NWC-time to all!
MAD

Reply 7 offered by: drake donahue on 08-Jun-1998

I am pro choice. I picture an option like..
Scroll: Continuous
End of Bar
End of Line
Wishing and hoping


#544: grace notes or flams
grace notes or flams

(544)

Submitted by: Darlene Marquardt on 05-Apr-1998

Is there a way to notate grace notes or in the case
of the percussion.. flam notes? I haven't had any major
problems with my noteworthy of late except haven't figured
out this particular notation yet.. when I make something for
my students then I have to print and write in the grace
notes by hand.. what a nuisance.

Any help is appreciated.

Registered Noteworthy User
Darlene Marquardt
dmaring@orednet.org
http://www.orednet.org/~dmaring

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 06-Apr-1998

Yes. In version 1.5 and beyond, grace notes are implemented.
They do play back on midi, and there has been considerable discussion about how this should be done.
The Grace-Note button looks like to notes, one smaller one scrunched up next to the bigger one.
Or you can use the "=" key to select grace note mode, or to change the grace-note-ness of selected notes.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Darlene Marquardt on 06-Apr-1998

Thanks... I realized shortly after I posted
the question that it was a matter of
upgrading my software.. I did that
and now I have the grace notes such
as they are...
Thanks


#545: D.S. al Coda  gets lost
D.S. al Coda  gets lost

(545)

Submitted by: Wayne Petrychyn on 07-Apr-1998

I have a problem with the D.S. al Coda not flowing correctly.
When I hit the D.S. al Coda sign it goes back to the segna
(which is good), plays to the measure before the first
ending following it and then jumps to the next measure which
is proceeded by a double bar line (instead of to the Coda).
If I remove all double bar lines it simply stops playing
at that measure before the first ending.

I have scored a piece of music in which I have have several
key changes. I use the double bar lines to signify a key
change.

I can send the music file if it helps but in summary it is
constructed as follows:

- Measure 1: Master Repeat Open
- Measure 4: First Ending and Master Repeat Close
- Measure 5: Second Ending
- Measure 8: Master Repeat Open and "Segna" sign
- Measure 15: First Ending and Master Repeat Close
- Measure 16: Second Ending
- Measure 20: "To Coda"
- Measure 23: First Double Bar Line after the "segna" sign
- Measure 74: "D.S. al Coda"
- Measure 75: "Coda"
- Measure 85: The End

When it hits D.S. al Coda at Measure 74 it goes back to
Measure 8, plays to measure 14 then jumps to measure 23
and plays through to the end. If I remove all double bar
lines it stops at measure 14.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 08-Apr-1998

My first guess is that master repeats are ignored after a DS or DC flow control and the To Coda is within a 2nd ending of a master repeat.
Local repeats are performed in these circumstances and may offer another solution.
There is an option for a default DS/DC ending after playing through the section from the Segno sign but this is the only ending that will be performed.
Try adding the default DS/DC ending to the 2nd ending at bar 16.
This may perform the To Coda successfully but you still wont get a repeat of the section from bar 8 to 15 unless you reorganize your score to use a local repeat instead.
Hope this helps!
With a bit of luck someone who has had the same problem may reply.
Try also the help screen or Email NoteWorthy Support.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Apr-1998

I think that Barry's suggestion should solve your problem. For reference, this is discussed in the help section for the special endings, which is excerpted below:

>>>> Excerpt from NWC Help File >>>>
This command is used to designate that the current measure should be played during specific iterations of a master repeat loop. Up to seven standard iterations are possible. These are labeled 1st Ending through 7th Ending in the Repeat Loop Ending Specification dialog. The last ending, Default D.S./D.C. Ending, is used after a Da capo or Dal Segno instruction (flow redirection) has been performed. The last primary ending and the default ending are usually followed by a Section Close bar line to designate the end of the master repeat section.

The special ending containing the first ending must always appear before any other special ending, and must be concluded using a Master Repeat Close bar line. The special ending may be longer than one measure, but only the first measure will contain a printed marker line on top of it. In addition, the first special ending marker must only appear once before the Master Repeat Close is encountered. If more than one first special ending is defined in a single repeat loop, you may get unexpected results.


#546: NWC Offline Forum
NWC Offline Forum

(546)

Submitted by: NWC-Support on 08-Apr-1998

The NoteWorthy Composer forum is now available offline!

Click the "View Offline" link at the top of either the Recent-100 or Index page for details (or go directly to http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm).

Reply 1 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Apr-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 21-Apr-1998. New features have also been added, including an index by title, forum message numbers included in each message page and contents, and quick access to the find mechanism through a Find button. Goto http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm to get the latest edition.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-May-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 15-May-1998. A new color scheme for links has been added as well. Email links are in blue, links to other offline messages are in green, and web links are in red. Goto http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm to get the latest edition.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jun-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 15-Jun-1998. Goto http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm to get the latest edition.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jul-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 15-Jul-1998, which is available from http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm here.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Aug-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 15-Aug-1998, which is available from http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm here.

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Sep-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 23-Sep-1998. While online, click "Go Offline" for details.

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Oct-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 19-Oct-1998. Click "Go Offline" for details.

Reply 10 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Nov-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 15-Nov-1998. Click "Go Offline" for details.

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Dec-1998

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 23-Dec-1998. Click "Go Offline" for details.

Reply 12 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Feb-1999

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 03-Feb-1999. Click "Go Offline" for details.

Reply 13 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Mar-1999

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 02-Mar-1999. Click "Go Offline" for details.

Reply 14 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-May-1999

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 28-May-1999. As previously promised, this new version has switched to 8 character filenames, as well as including all of the latest forum content.

Reply 15 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Jun-2000

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 07-Jun-2000. Click "Go Offline" for details.

Reply 16 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Oct-2000

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 12-Oct-2000. Click "Go Offline" for details.

Reply 17 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Aug-2001

The offline forum has been updated to vintage 20-Aug-2001. Click "Go Offline" for details.


#547: opening 2-staff files
opening 2-staff files

(547)

Submitted by: Gail on 08-Apr-1998

When I open 2- and 3- staff files I created in the previous version of Noteworthy, I only can see the first staff, but the other staves are still there because they still play. What do I need to do to see them? If I add a staff, I get a blank staff. My default page has only one staff--this may be the problem. If so, how do I change the default?

Reply 1 offered by: x on 08-Apr-1998

See if your Page Setup is set to show all the staves.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 08-Apr-1998

Your default page has nothing to do with how many staffs you will see. It is simply the default starting point for an NWC song, that's all.
As x said above, check which staffs are visible using the Contents tab in File | Page Setup.

A


#548: stupid question
stupid question

(548)

Submitted by: Me on 10-Apr-1998

I'm totally new at midi. When I play something using clarinet, it should transpose the music. Does a midi clarinet automatically transpose, or is the music "written for clarinet" pre-transposed.
Second, is there any way to get the instruments to sound more like what they are supposed to sound like? The midi clarinet sounds like a computer playing music, and sounds the same as brass section and the same as piano.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Apr-1998

In general, your sound card will usually play every patch in Concert C (A440) tuning, unless you set it to comething else. In NWC, this is done in the Staff Properties (F2).

It is not always possible to get that "perfect sound" using computer soundcards. However, if you are currently using a soundcard that uses FM synthesis, then dramatic improvements can usually be achieved by moving up to a soundcard that supports better patch reproduction (such as one that uses WaveTable synthesis).

Reply 2 offered by: Russ on 14-May-1998

you can get a better and more realistic sound driver at
http://www.geocities.com/~scottkaul/music.html
it is a person's website...but you can download the driver from there.

Reply 3 offered by: Johan on 27-Aug-1998

I Realy nead help with a stuped thing
I re-wrote the words for a song called sweet dreams (M.Manson)
now I want to make a backtrack for it wich I need In approx.
19 hours in wich I have to study, sleep, work etc, etc.
So I am looking for a nwc file for it on the i-net
and I can't find it if anyone has a sugjestion please e-mail
me and tell me what to do..
P.S I do have Noteworthy

Reply 4 offered by: Johan on 27-Aug-1998

I Realy nead help with a stuped thing
I re-wrote the words for a song called sweet dreams (M.Manson)
now I want to make a backtrack for it wich I need In approx.
19 hours in wich I have to study, sleep, work etc, etc.
So I am looking for a nwc file for it on the i-net
and I can't find it if anyone has a sugjestion please e-mail
me and tell me what to do..
P.S I do have Noteworthy

Reply 5 offered by: Johan on 27-Aug-1998

Sorry my E-mail is j.vanderwalt@mailexcite.com

Reply 6 offered by: Drake Donahue on 27-Aug-1998

Webcrawler search for "Sweet Dreams" and "midi" found the thing in about 2 minutes, 2 minute save, 1 minute NWC import, 2 minutes to do outgoing Email with attachment. Song is in the Email. Technology is grand when it works.


#549: transposing from another clef
transposing from another clef

(549)

Submitted by: Beth on 10-Apr-1998

Has anyone found an easy way to transpose from clefs? This is my situation---playing for church--trying to tranpose bass cleff (string bass-C instrument?) to treble cleff Bb instrument (bass clarinet). Any tips, hints, help greatly appreciated. Thanks! Beth

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Apr-1998

This is done in two steps:

1 - Change the key

2 - Change the clef

These are defined in our web site common questions, at:

/composer/faq2.htm#newclef

/composer/faq2.htm#changkey

And, also in the following forum threads:

msg #3
msg #4

Reply 2 offered by: Taylo on 03-Apr-2001

I have figured out(and it works) that a decent part can be made by playing the bass part like it was a treble part, yet making the treble G(on the bass part) a C on the Bb clarinet. See Example below.
Bass Part>---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------@----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Would be played on the treble instrument as>----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-@-


#550: transposing...again
transposing...again

(550)

Submitted by: vincent on 10-Apr-1998

being mainly a self taught composer(30 years exper. as a drummer),
my question at this time deals with transposing of instruments...
just read some things about it in last topic,but am still unclear on some issues.
my source of composing is midi/sequencing. i do alot of orchestral compostions.
...a rose by any other name is still called a rose...right?
an E played in the treble cleff(midi keyboard,clarinet sound)
will still be placed (notational) in the traditonal place(first line in the staff
or top space of the staff..depending on the octive you desire)...yes or no
if the anwser is yes,then where does the transposing of the instru. come in
i've got 88 keys to compose with, if i hit the middle c
for one instru. change it to another instru. which normally needs to be transposed,
is that note ON MY NOTATION still going to be a C (octive preference considered)?

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 11-Apr-1998

Yes, you've got it, changing playback instrument will not affect the pitch the computer plays. Would be a nice option, though, wish list time.
A NoteWorthy c is a c is a concert c unless you intervene.
You could take a concert Eb and use Tools\Transpose Staff\+9,check mark in update staff transposition and change that Eb into an alto saxophone c. It looks like a c but plays concert Eb. You might do this if you wanted a live alto to play the alto c in harmony with the computer playing concert eb.
You could take a concert c and use staff\staff properties\midi\transposition -9 to change the pitch to Eb while leaving the printed note at c. You might do this if you were entering alto score from printed music.


#552: Assembling sets of tunes
Assembling sets of tunes

(552)

Submitted by: Janet M M Burns on 11-Apr-1998

I have several dance tunes in individual .NWC files.
I want to combine several of these onto one page into sets for dancing. I would like these to have the properties:

1 Each tune starting on a new line
2 New line starting every 4 or 8 bars

How can I do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Apr-1998

Firstly have a look at thread 526 (Lyrics for 1 Chorus, Many verses). I don't know of any easy way to accomplish your requirements, but I have had to do the same sort of thing recently for a medley. To force a set number of bars per line you have to use Page Setup and play with the font size (and note spacing - use 'Increase note spacing for longer durations'), and sometimes 'pad' the lines with text entries consisting only of spaces. For page positioning, don't attempt to combine the files (although you can do this using copy and paste), rather set your top margin for each song to give the correct position on the page. But really the best solution again comes back to using a suitable publishing suite - I've praised Page Plus before, and I believe Word also can do the job.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 13-Apr-1998

Another QUICK and EASY way is to print all out and glue them onto a blank sheet! :)

Really. I've done LOTS of publishing (32 page newsletters every 2 months, music primers etc) and sometimes 5 minutes of scissors and glue saves 100 minutes of frustration at the keyboard.

Andrew P


#553: Problems with Chording
Problems with Chording

(553)

Submitted by: Andrew Bovett on 12-Apr-1998

I'm evaluating NoteWorth Composer. It looks quite good and I might buy it, but I've run into a couple of things I can't figure out how to do. Can anyone tell me if the following are possible:

1. Chording a rest with a note. One case where this is needed is where a longer note (e.g. a minim), printed with it's stem going down, coincides with a phrase of shorter notes (e.g. quavers) which starts with a quaver rest.

2. Printing a dotted minim followed by a crotchet above two minims, where the dotted minim is chorded with the first of the two lower minims, such that the second of the lower minims is played on the 3rd beat of the bar, and the crotchet is played on the 4th beat. When I try to enter this combination, the crotchet gets played on the 5th beat!

I'm hoping there are solutions to, or at least ways around these problems, as there's no point in buying it unless it can accurately transcribe the music I am trying to enter.

Regards,

Anderw Bovett

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 13-Apr-1998

Andrew,
Your query 1 can be accommodated. Enter the quaver rest (and the remaining quavers) first with the 'stem up' option on. Then change the stem up to stem down and chord the minim with the rest. For your second query, this approach doesn't work, so you must split the dotted minim into a minim tied to a crotchet chorded with the second lower minim, stems set accordingly. Then enter your remaining crotchet. Thread 537 - Two Voices on a Staff - examines this problem exhaustively!

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Bovett on 13-Apr-1998

Thanks, Peter. I don't know why I didn't find the rest chording myself - it's easy when you know how, isn't it! As for the problem with the dotted minim, I can live with the workaround. Cheers.


#554: Bar Lines and Insertion Points
Bar Lines and Insertion Points

(554)

Submitted by: Judy Rutherford on 13-Apr-1998

Hi. I'm evaluating NoteWorthy Composer 1.50 shareware, and
I have some questions.

First, there's this about bar lines in the Help file:

"During note entry, the bar lines will, at times, not align
with one another in different staves. After completing a
section of a song, all bar lines should line up properly.
If they do not, then there are duration differences between
common measures of the different staves of the section."

Is it sometimes not possible to align bar lines, thus
messing up print outs? Would non-aligned bar lines mess up
MIDI playback?

It's easy to enter notes on a staff using only my right hand
on the keyboard. The Tab key for entering bar lines is on
the far left side of the keyboard. That means I have to use
my left hand to enter bar lines (when I'd rather use it to
keep my place in the music I'm entering) or reach across the
keyboard with my right hand. Is it possible to assign bar
line entry to a key on the right half of the keyboard?

A lot of note entering seems to take place up against the
far right edge of the screen. I can use the mouse and
scroll bars to give myself some extra space, but when I'm
using the keyboard for note entry, always grabbing for the
mouse isn't what I had in mind. Is there a way to move the
insertion point away from the edge without using the mouse?

Regards,

Judy

Reply 1 offered by: Wayne Petrychyn on 13-Apr-1998

As long as the durations of the corresponding measures are
the same the bar lines will line up. If they don't, it is
an indication that the out-of-line measure has a duration
problem. If the bar lines line up they will print lined-up
and play correctly.

You do NOT need to add bar lines yourself. After you enter
the music (or a part of it) click:
Tools Audit Bar Lines (or Alt-t-b).
to provide (or verify) the bar lines for you.

As you are entering, the insertion point is generally at
the far right of the screen. But it is never off the screen.
As you enter music the screen will scroll, always keeping
the insertion point in view.
One thing I have found that temporarily gets the insertion
point to the left side of the screen is pressing "Home" and
then "End".

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 14-Apr-1998

This does raise the interesting point that some musical pieces do their bar lines at different spacings
(say one part is in 6/8 and another is in 2/4 and they are playing "across" each other).
Whilst NWC allows different time sigs and arbitrary bar placement, the alignment - I'd have to say - looks pretty ugly.

A

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Apr-1998

NWC will not line up different time signatures, where one is compound time like 6/8 and another is 2/4. This is not possible in NWC. However, in the general case, the bar lines will line up provided that the time duration included in the vertically aligned bars all add up to the same duration.

As for bar lines, we added the ability to add them using the '*' key. This enables bar lines and notes to be added from the numeric keypad on the right of most keyboards, for those who prefer this technique.

Reply 4 offered by: x on 16-Apr-1998

I think there is some confusion here. Sometimes people are talking about barlines aligning in the editor, and sometimes they are referring to bar lines aligning in the print out. My experience is (having not used different time signatures) that if the bar lines are aligned in the editor, then they will be aligned in the printout.

*** Would non-aligned bar lines mess up MIDI playback?

Yes. Because non-aligned barlines usually means that a bar has not got enough notes in it.

Also could Noteworthy implement a "Smart" editor so that the place you have the cursor (insertion point) is aligned where you want it? Like in a wordprocessor where you set the indentation on a ruler.

Cool.

Reply 5 offered by: Judy Rutherford on 17-Apr-1998

Thanks, for the input, guys. My new registered software
came in the mail today. Nice program.

Judy

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 09-Jun-1998

I tried "audit bar lines". Serious mistake. What I hoped for
was some indications of which measures were defective, so that
I could correct them. What I got was the bar lines shifted to
the middle of notes, so that it looked like I needed to painfully
recorrect all the formerly correct measures, as well as deduce
the incorrect measure by the beginning of the corruption.

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Jun-1998

You can use the audit to find misaligned bars. Once you find them, simply Undo the changes made by the audit, then manually correct the problem bar.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

Stephen, you said "what I hoped for...". Do not forget to RTFM (Read The Fineprint Manual), this will save you from being deceived.
NWC is a NOT WinWord (what a chance for NWC btw!), so do not expect it to do such things that word does (for instance : "are you sure you want to replace the selection ??" or "Are you sure you want to inflate the airbag ?", Thanx µ$oft).
NWC is a performant tool that won't bother you with everlasting dialogs. It does its job quickly and fine. And as nwc-suppot says, you can use the audit to look at which measures are misaligned.

Though I use another way for this : simply use Ctrl-RightArrow (or left) and you'll go to the next bar. Very useful indeed. (I also use it in a macro that automatically remove systematic key/time signature that some midi have in them. But it'd be great that NWC does not import them when they do not change... :-))

HTH,
                MAD


#555: MIDI OCR software - Does it exist?
MIDI OCR software - Does it exist?

(555)

Submitted by: Wayne Petrychyn on 13-Apr-1998

This isn't a question directly about NoteWorthy Composer
but a favourable answer would sure make NoteWorthy more
productive.

I recently bought a scanner. What I imagine doing is
scanning in a page of music and running some software
to analyze the scanned image and create a MIDI file.
I could then use NWC to convert the MIDI file to NWC format.
Then I would use NWC to edit, clean up, play, print, etc.

OCR (Optical Character Recognition) software is readily
available to interpret text characters from a scanned image,
but does such a thing exist for music?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 14-Apr-1998

Yes. See msg #485
for vigourous discussion about Midiscan.
I must admit I start to get nervous about scanning in soeone else's impression of the music, as this must certainly breach copyright, unless the publishing company's been dead for 70 years!!!

Andrew P

Reply 2 offered by: Me on 14-Apr-1998

If you log onto www.sheetmusic1.com and poke around you will find such a package for about $60.00

Reply 3 offered by: romanoto on 25-May-1998

italian linguage,please
cerco DRV. ocr for scanner x midi file or immage midi

Reply 4 offered by: Chris on 17-Jun-1998

Midiscan claims to have this capability, as do some other programs. However, everyone I've ever talked to who has tried these types of software claim that they have such a high rate of error, that you might as well just enter the music manually. That is, it takes forever to edit all the mistakes by the OCR software.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1998

I own midiscan and it seems quite correct to me. Not fully satisfactory though (lyrics cause troubles, so you have to clear them before).
I also tried capella Scan (you can download a demo version at www.whc.de (diese URL ist in deutsch) or at www.softpart.co.uk (in english language). I was _really_ impressed by its quickness (and simplicity of checking : it draws what it recognizes onto the original image), but a bit disoriented with their interface to modify results. Output to midi should be enough though. But IT DOESN'T ! you have to use another tool... And the demo version do not let you do it. So bad...

Hope this helps.

P.S. Do not forget engraver/editor copyrights !!

Reply 6 offered by: Jef Minne on 25-Dec-2000

please send me sum documentation obout ocr midi
if its possebel freeware

jefminne@freegates.be

Thanks in advace


#556: Importing Midi File
Importing Midi File

(556)

Submitted by: ti on 14-Apr-1998

I saved a midi file and tried to import it to noteworthy. A box popped up with the message: SMF Warning/ Expected string [MThd] not found in proper place. I can't import it! How do I go about importing this file with string instruments?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew P on 14-Apr-1998

LOL! The Expected String is not an instrument! It is part of the midi stream which NWC expected and wasn't there.
If you have some other midi program, try reading and writing the file again and see if that fixes it. I've seen this error very rarely, but had to give up in most cases, as the file was not readable with any software (and often not playable, either). Is your midi file at least playable?

A

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Apr-1998

As Andrew points out, this error is an indication that what you think is a MIDI file, is actually something else entirely. It is either a corrupted file, a compressed file, or a file of a different type (perhaps a proprietary file format from another program that you are using).

If you have a program that actually loads the file as MIDI music, then you might try looking for an Export or Save As function in the program, which would enable you to convert it into a true MIDI file.

Reply 3 offered by: ti on 14-Apr-1998

Thank you both for replying. Unfortunately, I am very inexperienced with computers and so I don't know if I'm understanding everything correctly. This file is played by the media system on my computer but not by NWC. How do I change it to a midi file if it isn't one right now?

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Apr-1998

What dot extension does it have (.mid, .rmi, .wav, etc.)? In other words, what kind of file is it? If it is a *.WAV file, then it is a digital audio file, rather than a MIDI file, and cannot be played through MIDI only software. If it is an RMI file, you need to be using the latest version of NWC.

If it is not a MIDI file, but is a proprietary file format, then your best bet is to follow the instructions in our earlier post: look to the program that loads the file to see if it includes some kind of "export" or "save as" feature to create a MIDI file.

Lastly, it would help if you named the exact program that currently plays the file. If it is the Windows Media Player, then it would help to know what menu item is checked on the Device menu when you load the file.


#557: set percussion patterns
set percussion patterns

(557)

Submitted by: Noel on 14-Apr-1998

I have no percussion background. Although I've learned
how to creat a score for drums and the like using channel 10 etc,.
it would be great if Noteworthy provided set percussion
patterns (i.e. more rhythm samples) that I can just choose
and copy for my specific composition. Much like the percussion
patterns one can choose from in a midi keyboard player like
roland, technics and yamaha.

Would you have these available? Would you also have matching
drumroll patterns?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Apr-1998

The rhythm patterns included in the Template folder are the only ones included in the base NWC package. There may be others available around the net, but the templates are there to get you started.

Reply 2 offered by: noel on 14-Apr-1998

If there are such rhythm patterns available in the net,
can these be converted into nwc files? Would you know of
any sites that may have such patterns? Thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 16-Apr-1998

If I write some, I'll put them on the newsgroup.
Maybe some of the others (some of the other Aussies are into band music with drumkits) have some patterns they are happy to share.

A

Reply 4 offered by: Paul Heichelheim on 16-Apr-1998

There are plenty of percussion midi files out on the web. Find one you like and import it into NWC, then do a cut-and-paste to get it into your composition.

Another suggestion would be to find a midi version of a song with the rhythm pattern you want to use, import it, highlight the track 10 staff, and cut-and-paste the part you want.

I don't remember where I got it, but I have a collection of over 200 rhythm patterns in midi format. If anyone wants, I can zip them and put them on the newsgroup.

Paul

Reply 5 offered by: noel on 16-Apr-1998

Yes, Paul I would be very much interested in seeing your collection. Thanks, Noel

Reply 6 offered by: Paul on 17-Apr-1998

I just posted the collection on the newsgroup. Look for "Percussion rhythm patterns" in the subject line.

Paul

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 17-Apr-1998

It's great!
We've now got some very good "references".
The annotated drum list, a drum part converter, pitch ranges for a variety of "standard" instruments.

Any other NWC benefactors out there? :)

Andrew

PS: What we need now is an ftp site where all these can be made available (what about it Eric?, Adam?, Richard?, Barry?...)

Reply 8 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 9 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 10 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 11 offered by: Scott on 20-Apr-1998

If you have Band-in-a-Box, or know someone who does, you can also get good drum lines from it's output. Also bass lines, piano harmonies, strings, etc. I've found that BIAB MIDI files import very well into NWC.

Reply 12 offered by: Justin Keller on 23-Apr-1998

Does anyone know if there is a way to make Flams, six
tuplets, double rolls, buzzes, and figering on Ntworthy?
I have 1.5 and I am registered. I want to write snare parts,
but I can't write snare parts without these signs.
Does anyone know of A drum Composer that does all these
signs plus more? If you do PLEASE email me. Thanks.

Reply 13 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 14 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 15 offered by: Paul Heichelheim on 24-Apr-1998

Here's a link that gets you directly to their drum pattern page:

http://www.midifarm.com/files/midifiles/General_MIDI/DRUM_PATTERNS.htm

If this doesn't help, let me know and I will try e-mailing them to you directly.


#558: connecting to a midi keyboard
connecting to a midi keyboard

(558)

Submitted by: noel on 14-Apr-1998

I'd like to move on to connecting my computer to a keyboard.
What do I need to purchase other than a midi cable? What
specs should I look out for in buying the cable? I'read
some messages in the forum that they had to learn the hard
way that they bought the wrong cable. Thanks. Noel

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 14-Apr-1998

In short, nothing! Some sound cards (e.g. Soundblaster AWE32) actually come complete with a Midi cable, which was certainly compatible with my (quite old) Technics Keyboard and my sound card MIDI port. The connectors follow a standard, nevertheless if a cable didn't come with your Sound Card it would be sensible to check with the card maufacturers that (a) their card has a MIDI input (it most certainly should) and (b) the connection is standard.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Apr-1998

In general, there are two types of cards that you might have in your computer to support MIDI:

1 - A dedicated MIDI I/O card which contains one or more true MIDI inputs and outputs. The original card in this area was the Roland MPU-401. Many other cards have been marketed since the MPU-401, some including additional MIDI ports and varying degrees of support for time synch features. This is generally not the solution used by most MIDI hobbyists (which usually use option 2).

2 - Sound cards generally include some rudimentary MIDI I/O support through their joystick port. This is possible by using a special cable that converts the pinout of the joystick port into a MIDI input and output connection. In most cases, the sound card is "SoundBlaster compatible", which means that the required cable is pretty much standard. Hoever, I think that there used to be other cards that were not SoundBlaster compatible, and required a different adapter cable to get MIDI functions.

If you already have a sound card in your computer, then it is probably SoundBlaster compatible. If it is, your least expensive solution is probably the second approach. Find a SoundBlaster to MIDI adapter cable, and use it to connect your sound card to your MIDI keyboard.

If you do not have a sound card, then you probably want to buy one. If not, then option 1 above is a very high quality approach. You may also be able to find other MIDI solutions that utilize the parallel or serial ports on your computer. If you elect to go this route, then you should explore this with your retail outlet or wherever you plan to shop for this equipment.

Once you get MIDI setup, you then need to switch to the External MIDI driver to play back into your MIDI keyboard's synthesizer (if it has one). You can also select the External MIDI Input driver in the NWC record tab. If you keyboard does not have a synthesizer, then you can use the Echo feature in NWC to play from your keyboard directly through your sound card in real-time.

One last word of warning: Beware that some sound card implementations that are supposedly "SoundBlaster compatible" actually do not implement the external MIDI features properly. At least some of the new inexpensive computer systems include sound card feature support directly from the motherboard (these are typically Cyrix CPUs that have graphics card and sound card support directly on the motherboard). In my experience, these systems tend to misbehave when you try to use their external MIDI device drivers to access the joystick port. This seems to indicate that the systems do not implement the external MIDI capabilities on their sound card emulations. If you have one of these systems, you may have additional difficulties, but you will not know this until you give it a try.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 15-Apr-1998

Well that certainly fleshes out my reply doesn't it! Perhaps I was just lucky - I connected up and away I went! The only hiccup was that the instruments chosen in Staff Properties didn't match the playback on my keyboard, but trial and error soon found the correct channel settings. I haven't got round to setting up a patch list specific to my keyboard - it only has a handful of intruments anyway, but perhaps someone could give some tips on how to go about it?

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Apr-1998

noel: As Peter points out, a couple of the Create Labs soundcard products include the MIDI adapter cable, which makes the process very simple. However, if you already have a soundcard in your system, and do not have the adapter cable, then you will need to make sure that you acquire the correct cable for your equipment (assuming that the existing card actually can be operated as an external MIDI port).

Peter: The instrument list used by NWC is defined from the NTWPATCH.INI file. We include the standard patch lists used by most equipment. If your keyboard only includes a few instrument patches (which is rare in the current environment where even inexpensive keyboards include hundreds of sounds), then you should have an easy time adapting the NTWPATCH.INI file to suit your needs. Just follow the example of the ones in there now.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 16-Apr-1998

Beware: If you do adapt NTWPATCH.INI, make sure you back it up before any upgrades (esp if you need to delete an old version before installing a new one), as it may be overwritten.

Andrew P

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Apr-1998

The NWC setup program will not overwrite an existing copy of your NTWPATCH.INI file. However, if you uninstall NWC, the file will be removed if it did not exist when the NWC setup program was original run.

Bottom line: Andrew makes a good point. It is a great idea to back up your current NTWPATCH.INI and TOOLBARS.DAT if you customize your patch lists or toolbar setup.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 17-Apr-1998

Thank you both. I have now customised my patch list. My venerable keyboard (Technics SK350) which cost nearly £500 in 1986 - what would the equivalent buy now, I wonder - has four channels (Polyphonic, Solo, Accompaniment and Bass) so I can set up quite interesting playbacks, albeit limited to a choice of eight polyphonic or solo instruments. Fun!

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Vasey on 17-Apr-1998

Oops! K350, not SK350. (Just in case someone out there has one!)

Reply 9 offered by: regin rodriguez on 16-Apr-1999

hello, i would just like to ask if anyone of you knows the pin configuration of the midi cable for soundcards
thankyou

please reply to
<regin_rodriguez@hotmail.com>

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Apr-1999

http://freebyte.ml.org/hwb/

Specifically,

http://freebyte.ml.org/hwb/ca_Midi.html

and

http://freebyte.ml.org/hwb/co_MidiIn.html

or the main cables menu at:

http://freebyte.ml.org/hwb/menu_Cable.html

HTH

Reply 11 offered by: mardell Jimerson on 19-Aug-2001

Question: I have a midi compatible keyboard and have purchased two midi cables, but can not find any outlets in the computer to connect them to. I see only a rectangular outlet. Is there some kind of converting appliance I need? Anyone please help!

Reply 12 offered by: Keith Sheasley on 19-Aug-2001

Hi, Mardell -
That rectangular port is the game port. It's where you would connect a joystick. You do need to adapt it for midi connection. I had to stretch my memory, but I believe this is where I bought my setup.

http://www.cablesnmor.com/midi-cable.html

It provides a sort of Y-connector that comes off the game port with midi connections on one arm and the joystick connector on the other. Depending on how you're set up, I would also recommend the cable extensions. They're cheap and they allow you a lot more latitude in placing your keyboard.

Good luck,
Keith

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Aug-2001

Joystick-to-midi cables are generally also available both at music stores and computer stores. Generally they'll be a bit cheaper at computer stores, for whatever reason.

Once you've got it set up (usually the cable marked IN has to go to MIDI OUT on your keyboard, and the one marked OUT has to go to MIDI IN), you also have to select the suitable devices for midi in/out in Control Panel -> Multimedia -> Midi (for midi out) and in your client program (e.g. NoteWorthy) for midi in. (Or choose both directly in NoteWorthy Tools -> Options -> Midi and Record tabs). These will usually have names that make it obvious, e.g. "Foobar external midi in".

Reply 14 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Aug-2001

If you have one of the PCs that do not have a joystick port (some PC motherboards that have integrated sound do not offer any compatible joystick port), then you will have to either:

- buy and add a sound card to your system (and probably need to shut off motherboard version in the bios)
- buy a USB or Serial MIDI box

Reply 15 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Aug-2001

Commercial hardware is available that will connect MIDI cables to an ordinary parallel printer port. The hardware comes in several varieties and price ranges (not cheap). It can be found on-line by the usual search-engine techniques. I have one for my laptop, since I cannot change any internal hardware. I rarely use it, so I'm not a source of useful advice on this topic, other than to mention that the capability exists.


#559: Change keys mapping on computer keyboard
Change keys mapping on computer keyboard

(559)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 14-Apr-1998

In thread 554, Judy Rutherford asked for the possibility
to change the key for entering bar lines, because the
Tab key was on the far left side on the keyboard.

I personally would like to change the keys for accidentals
because the actual order (natural-flat-sharp) seems to me
a bad choice. I would prefer flat-natural-sharp.

But maybe the best thing would be to have a completely
customisable keyboard. Is this possible ? In brief, what
should I add to the wish list:
- change the order of accidentals ?
- or have a customisable keyboard ?

Reply 1 offered by: Greg on 14-Apr-1998

In the 10 Key area of your keyboard, there is a "Star Key" above the 9. It works on my keyboard, it should work on yours to enter bar lines. I should note that it enters only a single barline and if one different needs to be there, then after entering it, marking it and changing the selection.

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 removed by: SYSOP


#560: printing piano music
printing piano music

(560)

Submitted by: Rick  on 16-Apr-1998

I'm new to NoteWorthy, and I'd be glad to buy a registered version if I can get it to print out nice sheet music. My kids would like to use it to write piano songs, but I can't seem to find the right commands to have the print-out look right.

Specifically, how do you get it to print 4 complete measures to a line, and then start the next line. Is there a "carriage return" command? Creating a new staff for each line doesn't seem like the right answer. I've tried affecting the print-out using the point size, but that doesn't really work very well. What am I missing here? There must be a way to do this.

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 16-Apr-1998

I'm not sure what you are asking Noteworthy Composer to do BUT if you are asking it to print out blank sheet music so that your children can write notes on the printed out sheet, well Noteworthy was not designed to do this. You might be better off using a drawing or word processing package where a little bit of effort and then a save will provide a template for ever!

If you mean that you dont know how to format the number of measures to a line once you have entered the notes (and either Noteworthy or you have entered the bar lines), then you should know that the number of measures on a line is calculated automatically by Noteworthy dependant on the printer/font/point size being used.
There is a little lattitude in this where, for a given printer/font/point combination, you can force fewer measures to a line by inserting spaces into a measure. This though is not easy and takes patience to get it right.

Why not let your kids write piano songs directly into Noteworthy .Let them hear what they are writing as they write it ! The program is a gem and you will not regret paying for the registered version.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: x on 16-Apr-1998

Hello Rick and Richard,

*** if you are asking it to print out blank sheet music
*** so that your children can write notes on the printed
*** out sheet, well Noteworthy was not designed to do this.

To print blank music sheets, insert 12 or so new staffs with nothing in them (just add the clefs you want) and go to page setup and select 'Extend last system'. Go to the print preview screen and see if you have enough staves to fill the page. Otherwise add more staves or change the point size.

*** Specifically, how do you get it to print 4 complete
*** measures to a line, and then start the next line.

Do you mean blank staves or ones with music? If you want the bars to align I'm not sure if you can get Noteworthy to do this. (I'd like to know how)

x

PS: A good way to get music sheets is to download MIDI files off the internet and print them with Noteworthy.

Reply 3 offered by: Rick on 17-Apr-1998

No, I'm not looking to print out blank manuscript paper.

We'd like to use NoteWorthy to compose songs, by entering the notes on the staffs, and than have it print out the sheet music that can be used at the piano. Our problem is that the print-outs don't look right. For example, if you were to have 16 measures on a page, how do you get it to print 4 lines of 4 measure each. The automatic "word wrap" function doesn't make the line breaks where we want them, and leaves the bar line off the last measure on each line.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 17-Apr-1998

Rick,
See also the thread 'Assembling sets of tunes'. You cannot force new lines or for that matter new pages - as Richard stated, you have to juggle font sizes (the note font rather than the lyrics font, although both affect the layout). Both these as yet unavailable options are on my 'Wish List' - why not put it on yours, if enough people request it we may be lucky! But don't let this put you off - I agree with Richard, the program is very user friendly and incredible value for money.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 17-Apr-1998

Rick,
You could ask yourself how important it is to have a 4 (staves) x4 (bars) page. I agree that being able to "kick" a bar over to the next line would be great, but it wasn't the end of the world for me.

A

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew on 17-Apr-1998

Rick,
You could ask yourself how important it is to have a 4 (staves) x4 (bars) page. I agree that being able to "kick" a bar over to the next line would be great, but it wasn't the end of the world for me.

A

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Apr-1998

If bar lines are missing off the end of the lines, it is because
you need to adjust the margins, in the Margins tab of the Print Setup dialog.
The default values often do not work. Make sure you use at least
0.40 for each direction.

I find I can get pretty good control of the printout using
the staff font size. No, you can't force line and page breaks
where you want them - this is a much requested feature and may
show up in a later version. Each upgrade (free) is a significant
improvement.

If you have lyrics, you can play with the lyric font size to make
the song a little longer, or shorter so it fits on a page.
If you don't have lyrics, and REALLY want control of line
breaks, than you can insert empty lyrics (use an underscore
for each note). A whole bunch of consecutive underscores
should stretch the staff, as Noteworthy makes sure the lyric
fits under each note. This is a bit tedious, however.

Reply 8 offered by: Rick on 17-Apr-1998

Thank you all. The advice that did the trick for us was to adjust the inside and outside margins. We settled on 20 point notes with a 1.00 inch margin. We are now quite happy with the sheet music, although I think a little more staightforward control of the line breaks would be nice. I'm going to order a registered version this afternoon.

Reply 9 offered by: Nikki MacLeod on 22-Apr-1998

Just like to add my name yet again to the list of users who would like to be able to set the print-out to say 4 measures per line

Reply 10 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 29-Apr-1998

Rick and Nikki, you may add your votes to the wish list:
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm

Reply 11 offered by: Linda Troost on 29-Apr-1998

I, too, would like to be able to say where the line of music breaks. When writing out songs for singing, I want to preserve the verse structure on the page (many hymnals do this). It also improves sightreading for many people since one sees the entire musical/poetic phrase.

Reply 12 offered by: joe robbins on 15-Dec-1999

i want piano music but i will need it written like this example................below
cefg meaning use letters of keys please i am trying to learn to play the piano!!!!!!!!!!

i am only 15


#561: Percussion
Percussion

(561)

Submitted by: Chuck on 17-Apr-1998

I love Noteworthy! I think it is a fantastic value. I cannot,
however, figure out how to write my own percussion line. I can
use the ones provided with Noteworthy and then modify them as
I need, but I would also think that I could start from scratch
and create and notate a percussion staff.
Here is what I want to be able to do:
1) Create a new staff
2) select the intrument for this staff to be a percussion set
3) notate the percussion I want for my musical composition.

HOW DO I DO THIS?
Thanks in advance.
Chuck

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 17-Apr-1998

1) Create a new staff
Press Control-A (for "Add")

2) select the intrument for this staff to be a percussion set
F2 (staff properties, nothing mnemonic there, I'm afraid). Change the Channel to 10 (normally, 16 in some cases, suck it and see).

3) notate the percussion I want for my musical composition.
Somewhere, someone created a file called Drum.nwc (either in the online help, user tips or on the newsgroup), which gives every percussion sound generated by (most) general midi devices. That should do the trick.

Andrew P

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 17-Apr-1998

Also look at common questions no. 6 in NWC Help, and at the file 'drumref.nwc' in the 'samples' folder (which I suspect from your questions you've already found).


#562: MS Intellimouse wheel
MS Intellimouse wheel

(562)

Submitted by: Barry Starfield on 18-Apr-1998

The wheel on the Microsoft IntelliMouse could be great for placing the notes on the stave during music entry. Any chance of this being done?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Apr-1998

NWC does not currently include any special handling for IntelliMouse. As a feature, it can certainly be requested from our wish list form.


#563:  Suggestion:repeat prev bar symbol
Suggestion:repeat prev bar symbol

(563)

Submitted by: Gene Rutter on 18-Apr-1998

I would dearly love to see a "repeat the prev bar (or 2 or 4 bars, etc)
symbol added.( *//. ) or ( */2/. ) if you catch my drift.

Also, the ability to indicate an instrument is to "layout" for
8,16 24 bars, like in show musicals scores would be helpful.

a la: |-------------16-------------------|

Something to think about for the next upgrade.

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 20-Apr-1998

You have to put it on the wish list. Doesn't count if you just tell us. Maybe we need a button here to send it to the wish list. Anyone listening?
The above is called a multi-bar rest. Most of us have put in a vote for this feature.

Reply 2 offered by: Gene on 20-Apr-1998

Where does one make entries into the wish list?

I've only just discovered this website and I'm still fumbling around getting aclimated.

Gene

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Apr-1998

The wish list form can be found at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm.

Reply 4 offered by: Arthur Morgan on 21-Apr-1998

I put both of those things on the list 2 revs ago. Still waiting...

Reply 5 offered by: jon w on 10-Jul-1998

I had always asked for multi-measure rests! When would they
do it? I am making music for print outs to use. I dont want
to have a page of one measure rests! Also, I find that
when importing midi, i get a lot of tied notes, rather than
dotten halves, or quarters. Why is that? Is there a way to
get this done automaticcly rather than going through the
entire piece and changing all the notes? Thanks


#564: DLS
DLS

(564)

Submitted by: Nigel Horne on 18-Apr-1998

Does anyone know anything about DLS that if I understand will be added in Windows '98? Will NWC support export to DLS format files? For more info see http://www.eu.microsoft.com/music/MSSynth/Synth.htm

-Nigel

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Apr-1998

The DLS mechanism described on your reference link is used to convert MIDI instructions into audible sound. The mechanism employed by a computer in converting MIDI instructions to actual sound/music will not generally effect the ability of NWC to play your notated songs, although it may affect the synchronization between hightlighted notes and the actuall audio.

Bottom line: NWC will work with the DLS stuff in much the same way as it currently works with other playback mechanisms, via the provided MIDI driver(s). Architectures that already do this include: play back performed by synthesizer present on the sound card (either FM synthesizer, WaveTable sythesizer, a hybrid, or a downloadable synth using sound fonts), play back performed through external synthesizer connected via a MIDI port, or play back performed by the sound card using sample data generated by the computer's main processor and then directed as digial audio data down to the sound card (and finally to the speakers).

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Horne on 18-Apr-1998

I don't understand your reply. Maybe it's a little too technical in areas
I don't understand. Are you saying that this DLS stuff is just a fancy
new reader for MIDI files?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Apr-1998

From reading the page, it sounds like DLS is just a new acronym for a synthesis technology that is already pretty widely available. Specifically, I am saying that DLS is described as just another sound synthesis specification, used by the Microsoft Synthesizer. I think that DLS is just Microsoft's way of standardizing the format of the digital audio samples (the way I read it, anyway). The Micorosoft Synthesizer, again as I understand it, is one of numerous new software synthesis products that utilize the main computer CPU and downloadable soundfont technology to generate sound from MIDI events (generated by MIDI programs like NWC). This is along the lines of WaveSynth/WG in the SB AWE 64, the WinGroove shareware utilty discussed so much in this forum (see msg #447), and similar technologies from Roland and Yamaha (I do not remember the product names at the moment).

NWC supports the selection of multiple sound synthesizers through the Tools, Options interface (in the MIDI tab). If you decide to use the Micorosft Synthesizer, or one of the other products, you are fully able to select those devices from within NWC. As I said above, the one possible problem with some of these synthesizer technologies is that note highlights during play back may not line up with the audio rendering of the synthesizer.

I hope this helps. --Eric


#565: Trills
Trills

(565)

Submitted by: Garry Carter on 19-Apr-1998

Can trills be incorporated in to music on screen?
If so, how.
If not, are NoteWorthy going to put that facility in to
their programmes?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 19-Apr-1998

Garry,
This is covered in 'User Tips and Tricks', subheading 'Inserting Symbols', item 'Trill Sound and Trill Print'


#566: line of text under title
line of text under title

(566)

Submitted by: Rick on 19-Apr-1998

I suppose this is easy, but I haven't been able to figure it out yet. How do you add a line of text under the title when printing out a sheet of music? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Apr-1998

Find the (horizontal) position on the top staff where you
want to insert the text. Click near the top of the screen.

Use the Insert Text command. In the Staff Position field
in the dialog add about 5 to the value, type in your text
and select the font. You probably want Page Text (same as
that used for author information), but its up to you.
Make sure you turn off Preserve Width.

Now do Print Preview and see if it is in the right place. To
move the text select the little diamond (click near it and
try Shift left or right arrow until only the little diamond
is selected). Control-E will bring up the font dialog and
you can change its vertical position. To move it horizontally
(and padding with leading spaces won't work) select it, cut
it to the clipboard (Ctrl-X), and re-insert it (Ctrl-V) where
you want it.

Always do Print Priview before you print after that, because
any change to fonts or the staff will cause the text to move.

This is a pain, but it does work. I use it all the time.

See the user tips page for more info:
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#authleft

Reply 2 offered by: Rick on 20-Apr-1998

I tried it, and you are right on both counts. It does work, and it is a pain. I have to give you credit, I don't think I ever would have thought up that procedure. You said that padding with leading spaces wouldn't work, but it does seem to work to help center the text under the title. The cut and paste seems to move horizontally only in jumps according to the notes on the staff. Thanks again.


#569: Chinese Seventh's (Inverted Notes/flags)
Chinese Seventh's (Inverted Notes/flags)

(569)

Submitted by: David Cole on 21-Apr-1998

I'm experimenting with the program for barbershop quartet use. I'm have problems writting a "Chinese Seventh" chord -- two notes on the same cleft, inverted so that the higher voice part is singing the lower note, and visa versa.

The basic problem is that the note flags have to be inverted, and the program doesn't accomodate for that. One solution (manually) is to write a small "x" above the chord notating the inversion. This too is not available -- seemingly. Any solutions?

Thanks
Harmoniously,
David Cole
President Pioneer District - SPEBSQSA, Inc.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Apr-1998

It is true that NWC will not allow a chord to contain an upward stem note that is below a downward stem note. However, the staff layering feature (currently in an experimental development phase) will allow this by placing each of the voices in your quartett are notated on a separate staff. You can acquire some more info on the experimental feature at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertips.htm.


#571: Converting between ABC format and NoteWorthy
Converting between ABC format and NoteWorthy

(571)

Submitted by: Erik Svendsen on 22-Apr-1998

Hello,

Does anybody know of any programs that can convert music
files in the ABC format (http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/)
to the NoteWorthy Composer format?

Erik :-)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Apr-1998

Convert the ABC file to MIDI, then Import them using NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Erik Svendsen on 22-Apr-1998

Thanks for the reply, I am aware of this method, I had just
hoped I could do the conversion directly. Is it possible to
obtain the file format for NWC? Then it would be possible to
write a conversion program.

Erik :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Alex Cormack on 28-Apr-1998

Ha - funnily enough I'd just written to the wishlist, then
came browsing through the forum and read the above. I agree
with Erik that it would be good to be able to import into NWC
straight from an ABC file; ABC-MIDI-NWC can end up a little
garbled, particularly where gracenotes and triplets are
concerned.

I also suggested that NWC could offer reverse conversion,
i.e.NWC-ABC - there are many potential uses for such a facility
and no Win95 programs that make a decent job of it.

I live in hope...
Alex


#572: Two suggestions to wishlist
Two suggestions to wishlist

(572)

Submitted by: Joonas Linkola on 22-Apr-1998

Hi,

I tried to send things to wishlist, but my Netscape crashed (a bug still on?), so I'll post them here:

1) I would like to have many notes tied at once. You know, when you have many notes in one place (I don't know what that is called), you could just paint the note group and press "tie" button, and all those notes would get tied.

2) Please add 'tieing' between notes of different pitch (or have I just missed that option?)

Regards,
Joonas

Reply 1 offered by: Thomas Lefort on 22-Apr-1998

I quite agree with your wish to have several notes tied at once ; it would be particularily useful for arpeggios.
Moreover, such an extension is easy to implement - a loop treating sequentially each note of the selection, exactly as the user would do.

But... as regards your second wish, it seems that you actually have missed an option :) !
Indeed there's a distinction between the tie (2 notes of the same pitch, which form one note whose duration is the sum of the single notes' ones) and the slur (from one note to another, even of equal pitch, introducing a continuity into the melodic flow). To obtain a slur, select a group of notes and press ';' or the slur button (the one with a curly arrow). The slur will end upon the note (or silence) next to your selection.

Regards,
Thomas

Reply 2 offered by: Richard W on 23-Apr-1998

Does Joonas mean a Glissando between notes?

Reply 3 offered by: Joonas Linkola on 23-Apr-1998

No, I meant just what Thomas described. And now I know how to do it :-)

Erm... is there glissando option in NWC, btw?-)

Reply 4 offered by: Richard W on 23-Apr-1998

Unfortunately not . Yet another wish Huh !


#573: n-uplets
n-uplets

(573)

Submitted by: Thomas Lefort on 22-Apr-1998

Several messages have been previously posted about the problem of n-uplets (or multiplets) in NWC.
To sum up, it appears that NWC supports only triplets ; so that in order to obtain a duplet you have to use dotted notes (for instance, an 8th duplet in 6/8 is equivalent to a pair of dotted 8ths). This solution is acceptable, but doesn't look very natural. As concerns 5,7,11...-uplets, it gets worse : The only way to obtain the correct rythm is to work out an equivalent time signature with a sufficient resolution. Let's say 20/20 instead of 4/4 to allow a 16th quintuplet : really unpracticable !
Consedering that at least quintuplets and duplets are widely used, i think a n-uplet implementation is needed for the next versions. And, if it brings problems with the timer resolution, quintuplets may be limited to 32th figures for example...

Waiting forward to reading your replies,
Thomas

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 27-Apr-1998

I'd love n-tuplets! It was one of the first things I wanted (over a year ago), and I still wish for it. I must say that Eric has been good in getting some big things up (user-selected fonts, grace notes [in a fashion], and now the multi-voice experiment), but I still hanker for something that will say "n-tuplise the group I've selected".

A


#574: Still more suggestions and a few questions
Still more suggestions and a few questions

(574)

Submitted by: Joonas Linkola on 23-Apr-1998

Hi,

I would like to see real crescendo/diminuendo and accelerando options in NWC, that would not be just words there, but actually did something. For example accelerando: you would give it the start tempo, the end tempo and then put in on how long distance you would like the tempo to change.

Also, is it possible to change the panning of a staff in the middle of the song, or is the panning value "glued" to the staff? (I would like the sound to move from right to left and vice versa)

PS. Sorry for my bad English.

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 23-Apr-1998

Your first two wishes are already up and running!

Try

Insert...
Dynamic Variance

and

Insert...
Tempo Variance

They work pretty much as you say. You specify a start tempo (or dynamic) and a finish tempo (or dynamic) and insert a tempo (or dynamic) variance between these two. NWC then smoothly varies the tempo (or dynamic) starting at the postion of the variance marker and ending with the following tempo (or dynamic) marker.

For example: you insert a mezzo piano in bar 3, you insert a crescendo at the start of bar 5 and a forte in bar 10. NWC plays the staff at mp in bars 3 and 4. In bar 5 it starts to crank up the volume until it reaches forte in bar 10. Similar things happen with tempo variances.

Note that diminuendo is implemented as decrescendo.

The help screens accessed from the dialogue boxes give you the "official" guidance on their use.

I haven't felt the need to pan so - no comment.

I hope this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Apr-1998

regarding pan: Use the Multi-point Controller setting for "Stereo Pan" to change the left to right imaging anywhere in the staff. Your sound card must support this in order for it to be effective.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 23-Apr-1998

Steven says in his reply "Note that diminuendo is implemented as decrescendo"

Ah !

How fortunate for me that he has replied in this way.

It sounds like he can answer a question I've had for a long time.

What is the difference between diminuendo and decrescendo ?

The Oxford Dictionary of music gives :

Diminuendo : Gradually getting quieter
Decrescendo : Gradually getting softer
Crescendo : Gradual increase in loudness (opposite of diminuendo)

The Collins Encyclopaedia of music gives :

Diminuendo : Getting softer
Decrescendo : Getting softer (opposite of crescendo)
Crescendo : Getting louder (opposite of crescendo or diminuendo)

The Oxford companion to music says that hairpins were originally invented
by Francesco Geminiani and refered to crescendo and diminuendo but makes
no mention of decrescendo.

It's all very well for us all to ask NoteWorthy to include additional
functionality into NWC but it might be just as well to agree terminology.

Is there anyone out there who (at least for the purpose asking for
additional functionality) would not be content to allow decrescendo and diminuendo
to be synonymous ?

And just what is the difference anyway?

Richard

Reply 4 offered by: Dad on 23-Apr-1998

And between A# and Bb??

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Randall on 24-Apr-1998

Well, since you ask.. I don't know that there is any difference except that decrescendos tend to be much rarer than diminuendos. Perhaps its only composers using NWC who use decrescendos. :-)

As for A# and Bb...It all depends (he says mysteriously).

Stephen

Reply 6 offered by: Kend Dugan on 24-Apr-1998

And it's a lot easier to abbreviate dim. More understandable, yes? That's why you don't see desc. very often. Too labor-intensive.

Reply 7 offered by: Don Ruckman on 25-Apr-1998

You all are having just too much FUN!
How about the dynamics I see all the time in original Big Band charts by Billy May, Les Elgart, Les Brown, Glen Miller, etc.; such as " get soft here, bold, all out, loud, not too much, etc., etc. Do these mean anything to any one; certinally not for NWC except as text notation.

Don Ruckman ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 8 offered by: Donald W. Davis on 26-Apr-1998

Regarding the mysteries of A# and Bb, see

http://www.astro.virginia.edu/~eww6n/music/music.html,

items: Just Intonation, Tempered Scale and (if you are
really curious) Equal Temperament.

-DonD

Reply 9 offered by: Donald W. Davis on 26-Apr-1998

Opps. That link should not have a comma at the end:

http://www.astro.virginia.edu/~eww6n/music/music.html

Sorry.

-DonD

Reply 10 offered by: Batchman on 29-Apr-1998

I've never been able to get the tempo variance to work.
I presume you mean have a tempo setting, a ritard or a
rallentando, then another tempo setting. Doesn't work
for me. ANd do you treat rit. and rall. differently?

(I'd also like to see rit. followed by "a tempo" work, if we
want additional wish list items.)

I have found that the dynamic variance works for cresc.
and decresc. but not for dim.

- seb

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Apr-1998

Just tried ritard. and rall. with version 1.50b, and both worked exactly as described in the help file.


#575: IDFEdit and Drum Patches
IDFEdit and Drum Patches

(575)

Submitted by: Ian Wesley on 23-Apr-1998

I've been trying to repatch my sound card so that percussion
parts can be written for real players. I found all of the
previous threads on this and created a new patch using IDFEdit.
I selected this new patch as the default for windows but
when I use NW, the percussion reverts to is default patch.
What have I missed???

Ian

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Apr-1998

two things:

1 - You new patch assignments must work as you intended when you play back a MIDI file using the Windows Media Player

2 - You must select the Midi Mapper as the ONLY play back device in NWC (from Tools, Options, MIDI Tab).

Reply 2 offered by: Jerry Herndon on 12-Jul-1998

Ian, did you have any success mapping to standard drum notation. I have the same problem. In NT Composer I can select midi-mapper or Creative midi-mapper (sound blasters mapper) as output. However, in windows midi setup from the control panel, there is only Creative midi-mapper. No Midi-mapper. In any event, no matter what I do, it doesn't work. In IDFEDIT, I copied the General.IDF file to Drum.IDF and mapped only the percussion keys (didn't touch the instrument and key mapping). Is this correct? If you had success, please give a detailed explanation of what to do>
Thanks....Jerry

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-Jul-1998

I've struggled with IDFEdit too.
If someone has made this work around successfully please post the procedure on the forum.
I'm sure I'm not the only one who would be grateful.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Jul-1998

FYI: In Windows >=95, there is no explicit reference to a MIDI Mapper in the Windows system. However, it does actually exist, just without the recognition. You control which devices it uses for playback from the Multimedia applet in the Control Panel. The MIDI Mapper is always used by Windows for multimedia playback of MIDI files (such as the MIDI player component of the Media Player program that comes with Windows).

You can also run into trouble if you select the MIDI mapper and other devices for use by playback in NWC. The trouble is caused by having the MIDI Mapper trying to use the same device as is explicitly listed in NWC. The important point is that it is best to use the MIDI Mapper by itself in NWC for playback. Use the Multimedia applet to change the device that is used by playback. This way, your base Windows multimedia will sound better too (as well as the NoteWorthy Player playback).


#576: Printing
Printing

(576)

Submitted by: Peter Maynard on 25-Apr-1998

The printed page does not contain the copyright notices.
It is showing, however, in print preview.
How do I print the copyright notices?
I am using version 1.50b.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 25-Apr-1998

This is almost certainly due to a wrongly set bottom margin. For several comments on printing problems have a look at thread 560 - Printing Piano Music.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Maynard on 27-Apr-1998

Yes, thanks Peter Vasey, I set the bottom margin to 1".
It now prints ok!

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Apr-1998

0.2 or 0.3 should do. You may be wasting precious page space!

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 01-May-1998

Depends on your printer driver default settings - some drivers allow margin settings, others don't. I had to set bottom margin to 0.6 ins. recently to stop some below staff bass notes being cut off.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-May-1998

Most printers have an area around the edges that is an "unprintable area" which will not print. NWC attempts to show any clipping that will occur around the edges using information provided by the print driver. This does not always match the true area around the edges that will be clipped. If you are trying to push the envelope and print right up to the edge of the paper, it might be a good idea to determine where the edges are for your printer. A proecure to do this might be as follows:

- Open a score that prints at least one full page
- Goto Page Setup, set all margins to 0
- Print one page
- Measure the clipping area that does not show up

Now add one or two tenths to your measurements, and this can be you smallest margin settings when you want to print right to the edge of the printable area for your printer.


#577: lyrics and repeats
lyrics and repeats

(577)

Submitted by: Eric on 25-Apr-1998

I have a simple song with three lyric lines. I have it repeat 3 times with a different third ending. How do I make the last part of my 3rd lyric line carry over to the 3rd ending?

Thanks,

Eric

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Apr-1998

You need to pad the end of the third lyric with spaces.
To do this, place an underscore (_) on the third lyric line
under each syllable in the special ending used for the first two lines.
The lyric placement does not understand special endings,
so you have to do it yourself.


#578: Selective Silence on a Staff
Selective Silence on a Staff

(578)

Submitted by: Donald W. Davis on 26-Apr-1998

I'd like to be able to surpress the output of a staff
during a repeat. If "Midi Control -> Instrument Patch ->
Patch Name - <none>" resulted in silent output, I'd have
what I need. It doesn't, at least on my system.

Inserting a "Multipoint Controler" patch with Volume = zero
almost works, but the staff is still audible. Same for
using an explicit Dynamic and overriding the midi volume
setting.

NoteWorthy 1.5, Sound car - '93 vintage plain vanilla
Creative Labs Sound Blaster. Op. Sys - Win95.

Worthy Noters, any suggestions?

-DonD

Reply 1 offered by: DDon on 26-Apr-1998

this works for me-

(perhaps you missed the check marks or did not zero the velocity?)

repeat open
notes
insert\dynamic\, check override volume=0, check override velocity=0
repeat close
insert\dynamic\, uncheck override volume, incheck override velocity
notes

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 29-Apr-1998

Do you want to shut up a staff when playing ?

If I really understood your question, then you have a
very simple way to do that:
1) select the staff
2) click on the appropriate button (I don't remember
how it is called, but if I remember it represents a
speaker)

I hope this helps


#579: some questions
some questions

(579)

Submitted by: Nir Wallenstein on 26-Apr-1998

yello.

I have a question concerning noteworthy but since I am not
sure of the correct terminology I will just have to say it
as it is.
Let's I want to have a four quarter note and then have a
two quarter note start at the second beat of the four
quarter note. So, is it possible to do that and if so how.
By the way, what would be the correct term for that (broken
chord maybe).

Another thing. As was written in previous messages it really
is much easier to setup netscape to recieve the newsgroup
messages but how exactly do you setup agent?

thanks in advance,
Nir Wallenstein

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 27-Apr-1998

Answer 1:
Start with a quarter note rest (this is to precede your second, two-quarter [half note, or minim] note). Now enter your 4-quarter note (whole note, or semi-breve) as a chord (using Ctrl-Enter). You may need to change stem direction (I know this doesn't make much sense for either whole notes or rests, but trust me - I'm a musician :) You should now have a whole note stacked with a quarter rest.
Now enter your half note, and I think you have what you asked for.

Answer 2:
Create a new folder and copy your Agent.Ini file into it.
Now create a Shortcut that runs Agent, but uses this new folder as its working ("Start In") folder.
For more (or less) help, try Agent's On-line help, "How To" "How to Configure Agent for Multiple Users and Servers"

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Apr-1998

Comments on Answer 1: This can be a bit tricky. First set the "stem" direction of your quarter rest. You can either set the direction before you enter it, or select it and set its direction. The direction should be the same as you want your half note to be. Next, reverse the stem direction and Ctrl-Enter your whole note. Then reverse the stem direction again before entering your half note. The notes that share time with the whole note must have stems in the opposite direction (even if you can’t see the stem).


#580: ZOOMing
ZOOMing

(580)

Submitted by: Eamonn FitzPatrick on 27-Apr-1998

Hi All,
I hope nobody will object to me going back to thread msg #395
concerning the ZOOM function. I am still frustrated by the
way this is working, and in spite of all my efforts the best
I can achieve with the setting at "2" is to go from four
fairly big staves per screen to twelve microscopic ones!
There has to be something between these two settings, but
how do I achieve it? Any help greatly apprciated. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 27-Apr-1998

ALT = (i.e, Alt key and the + sign) will prompt you for a new resolution. Try something between 2 and 6 this time.

Reply 2 offered by: kent dugan on 27-Apr-1998

Sorry about that. Alt and =, like I said first.


#581: Notes un-joined by teXt
Notes un-joined by teXt

(581)

Submitted by: Jon Featherstone on 27-Apr-1998

I always notate all chords on my music, but notice that if the chord text falls between two notes that in normal music
are joined together, (eg two eigth notes) then noteworthy 'un-joins' them, and the bar symbol is grayed out if I select them afterwards.

What am I missing here?

Jon F

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 27-Apr-1998

Unfortunately, that is how it works. I consider it a bug.
Add your voice to the wish list.
To work around it, you have to insert all your notation
before the first beamed note, and separate the notation
with spaces. Check Print Preview because it is different
than how it looks on the screen. I find that even Print
Preview does not quite match what actually appears on the printout.

Reply 2 offered by: Jon Featherstone on 27-Apr-1998

Although I'm a work hardened Noteworthy fan, I'm astonished
that a 'music notation' program does not permit normal music
notation and chord notation at the same time!
Am I placing unrealistic expectations on a $40 shareware product?

Jon F.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Apr-1998

You could also try adding the chords as text above the staff.
If you can bear entering all the _'s at non-chorded notes.

I too have great expectations of an underpriced package - but strangely this software continues to deliver surprises.
I dont think it hurts to add requests to the wish list - who knows - it could happen!

Reply 4 offered by: x on 28-Apr-1998

For $US40 I have a program that allows me to publish my scores; and have conductors/orchestra members comment on how good the parts look.
(I copy individual pages and paste the metafile file into Publisher.)

Works great!


#582: my wishes
my wishes

(582)

Submitted by: Joseph Guix on 27-Apr-1998

Two wishes that I have already expressed in the wishlist for a long time,
But I am surprised that nobody refers to them :
1) Have you ever needed, users of NoteWorthy,
the possibility to have words or syllabes underlined
in text? For my part I use it a lot and I am obliged
to make it by hand, what is little professional, is it ?
I think that, given the number of liturgical choir
chiefs that frequent this forum, some of them should be
concerned and will add their voice in the wishlist.
2)Aren't you bothered by the impossibility to beam
the eighths oriented upwards AND those oriented downwards ?
In that question the staff layering is insufficient.
I hope feed-back. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Apr-1998

A workaround for problem #1 is to do Insert Text at the same location as the lyric line, in the same font, and insert underscores. Not fun, but better than doing it by hand every time.

Reply 2 offered by: trick on 02-Jul-1998

And if you do what Blair suggests at the end of your work, you can copy/paste to be much quicker :)


#584: Printing Help
Printing Help

(584)

Submitted by: Daniel Backlund on 27-Apr-1998

Is there any way to print just a single staff. Your help
would be greatly appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Apr-1998

Use the File / Page Setup to display the staff you want.
In the same dialogue check out all the tabs and enter the required attributes like measure numbers, staff name required - Preview the page - then Print it.

Reply 2 offered by: Daniel Backlund on 29-Apr-1998

Thanks


#585: .wav file import ?
.wav file import ?

(585)

Submitted by: mike hart on 28-Apr-1998

This may be a daft question but here goes: I can play
my clarinet into a microphone connected to my SoundBlaster
card and creat a .wav file. Is there any way of getting
the resulting music in to NWC ? Perhaps via a piece of
software that converts .wav files to MIDI ? Does anyone
know of any way of doing this ?

Mike

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 28-Apr-1998

http://www.wildcat.com for Autoscore
http://www.audioworks.com for Sound2Midi
when last tried not real good; now they don't have demos!

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Apr-1998

Hey - if you could play a wav file through a clarinet - now that would be something.
Come to think of it - if I could play anything well through a clarinet - that would be remarkable!

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 28-Apr-1998

Thanks, Drake for the pointers for Sound2Midi. I suspected that someone would be trying. I imagine that is must be nearly as hard as voice recognition.

As for adding waves to scores, Cubase does this, though I think it's nearly $1000. Maybe its cheaper siblings do it, too, I don't know, they're all way beyond my price range (I'd have to be a PROFESSIONAL muso to want it, and if I was, I couldn't afford it!)

The other way to do this (I presume you want a "live" solo over a midi backing), would be to
1) start your wave editing program
2) arrange levels so that when it records, it will record both midi and microphone (panned however you wish)
3) hit "Record" in your wave editor
4) hit "Play" in NWC
5) Wail on your clarinet
6) press "Stop"
7) On the seventh day you should have a rest, and see that is WAS good. (Apologies to all Biblical types out there :)

Not that I've tried it, but I think it'll work.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Drake Donahue on 28-Apr-1998

http://www.pgmusic.com for power tracks pro (an NWC priced product devoted more to producing sonic output than printed score) has the ability to record your clarinet output and midi output as a .wav. Don't try this at home unless you have a really big hard drive with a really big cache and a very fast processor with lots of ram and cache ram. (A strong masochistic streak helps also).
http://www.yamaha.com and hunt around for wind controllers, wx-11 comes to mind. This is a device that senses lip, finger, breath action and outputs midi signals. I would presume it could input to NWC just like a midi keyboard.

Reply 5 offered by: Jimmy Malone on 01-May-1998

This is not going to be a simple task. I would recommend using CSound from http://www.leeds.ac.uk/music/Man/c_front.html
It is a free program which generates audio files like wavs. You can also get Midi2cs from that page. This program converts midi files to csound files. Finally if you get SOX (available from the Midi2cs site) you can convert your recording of the clarinet to an AIFF file, which may be used as an instrument in csound and midi2cs. After having done all that, perhaps you could make world peace, cure all disease, or any other equally simple task. I know it seems like a lot of work, but it is well worth it.

Reply 6 offered by: Chris on 17-Jun-1998

There is a program called autoscore which converts sound into MIDI format. You can play into a microphone with any instrument, or your voice, so I assume that you could play a WAV file into it too. It will only recognize one pitch, so chords would be out of the question. The software is about $150 I believe. However, I'm not sure if it is compatible with NWC.

Reply 7 offered by: Evi|Homer on 02-Dec-1999

yur all wrong. wav to midi is impossible. it can never be the same. mid--->wav is like mixing the ingredients of a cake and baking it. wav--->mid is like trying to get those ingredients back again. no way r u gonna do that!

Evi|Homer

Reply 8 offered by: John on 02-Mar-2000

As a musician and a computer programmer, who enjoys combining the two, I know that .wav to midi IS possible. The reason I know this is because.... Musicians do it all the time! One of the things we're taught in theory class is to listen to someone play the piano and write down the notes played to match the music. Our ears can do it, a properly programmed computer could do it too.

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 02-Mar-2000

The annals of computer science are filled with examples of things our brains can do that it's very hard to get computers to do well, if at all. Good natural language comprehension comes to mind, as do translation, visual pattern recognition, and so forth. These are things that have been worked on for years and years at government, commercial and academic labs with only limited success. I suspect wav-to-midi is in the same category, at least for nontrivial sources. Yes, it's probably possible, but not now (or probably even soon) and not on the desktop.

Reply 10 offered by: Miguel Nishii on 03-Mar-2000

YESSS!!!!!!!!!! it could be done with a program named composer, i think its a russian program. Look for it id tried and its great for get the midi notes on music, works much bettter if like you want to play a monotone instrument, but i usually use to get a score form a cd music, of course it need some arrange in any midi program like cakewalk!

Reply 11 offered by: duh on 24-Apr-2000

why are you guys making this sound impossible?

think:

note pitches are simply frequencies. if not too much is
going on, these frequencies can be isolated.

once isolated, they can be interpreted and extracted...

besides, i used autoscore years ago in its early stages,
and it works. there were some errors, and my slow 286
didnt make things any better, but i suspect that my PIII 500
can handle the process much better and i'm going to give the
program a try.

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Apr-2000

To those who still believe that there are programs that will convert wav to midi - here's a challenge.
I will send you a few bars of a big band midi file converted to wav or (preferably) mp3.
All I ask as proof that your program works is to return to me the complete score in NWC format.
Couldn't be easier!


#588: Printing with dot matrix printers
Printing with dot matrix printers

(588)

Submitted by: Peter Gaunt on 29-Apr-1998

I am having problems printing using Epsom FX-1000 & FX-1050 printers. I am using Windows 3.1 and 3.11 on 2 seperate PCs.

When I try to increase the staff point size to get a better page fit to a document, the programme seems to make step changes rather than the smooth changes in point size with previous versions.

For example for as many as 5 different point sizes the notes stay the same size, fitting onto one page. Then, suddenly, as I increase the size by one point the notes radically change in size, overflowwing onto 3 or even 4 pages.

I have noticed I do not have this problem with laserjet printers.

Can anybody help?

Reply 1 offered by: Marsu on 29-Apr-1998

I already had that problem. This seems not te be related to the printer, but because the file you use has been created with an earlier version. You may try to save it again (in a temp file for archive sake), then close your file and open the saved one. It solved me the trouble for the cases I met. I do not guarantee this will work for yours...
Hope this helps anyway. (I use Epson ColorPro (and sometimes HPLJ3PS))

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Apr-1998

Peter: What were the point sizes? Do you still have the file? If so, and you send a copy to beta@ntworthy.com, then we will have a look...

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-May-1998

In your email, you wrote:

<< Using an Epsom FX-1050 (or FX-1000) & Windows 3.1 14pt to 17pt inclusive all leave the staves the same size (fitting onto 2 pages finishing on the 3rd line) 18pt and above put the staves onto 4  pages
>>

I installed an FX-1050 on one of our test systems. I noticed that this printer supports several print resolutions (240x144, 120x144, 120x72). This first thing to point out is that the higher the resolution, the better that NWC will perform (finer details can be printed). For testing, I set the resolution to 120x144, and then tested your file. I used Preview to test, as we do not actually have this printer.

In my test results, each staff size from 14 through 19 yielded successively different results, although some were fairly close. What resolution are you using? You can find this out on the Preview tab in Page Setup.


#589: Bends and Glissandos
Bends and Glissandos

(589)

Submitted by: Chris Coon on 29-Apr-1998

Is there any way to import bends and Glissandos from midi files?

Is there any way to create a long bend up or down? (like more than 2 note values)

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 29-Apr-1998

It is impossible w/ the current version for glissandos,
as for the importing of the pitch bend, I do not know.
I do know how to make the pitch bends wider...
in fact, I can have a pitch bend up to 2 octaves above original
pitch!! 'laughs' I do not know how to put these controllers in
w/ Noteworthy, but I will put the numbers on the next message
(have to find the sheet)

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 30-Apr-1998

Joe's right. Normally, pitch bending from -8192 to +8192 will only do 4 semitones, as this is the standard used by most midi implementations. However, there is a fairly standard setting one can send to change this (the Global Pitch Bend? something like that). Note that unless you can make the step size small, 16ve pitch bends can sound very chunky.

As for glissandi, I always thought they were a series of discreet notes (well, for keyboards and fretted instruments anyway). Is a gliss on a violin (or even a saxophone) one continuous glide? You may be able to twiddle with a series of notes and pitch bends to get a close rendition (as if the violinist is doing a quick tremolo whilst glissing).

Andrew


#590: triplet in 6/8
triplet in 6/8

(590)

Submitted by: vincent on 30-Apr-1998

in 6/8 time sig. how many eighth note triplets are there?
i know in 4/4 a quarter note gets one full triplet,therefore
in one measure max. number of eighth note triplet is 4...
does that work in 6/8?does each eighth note in 6/8 get a triplet ?

also what about sixteenth note triplet?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 30-Apr-1998

In 6/8 time there will be 6 eighth notes in each measure.
If you make the eighth notes into triplets you will need 3 groups of eighth triplets to fill the measure.
Making it a false 9/8 measure.
So in 6/8 time 6 eighth notes without triplets is correct.

Reply 2 offered by: kent dugan on 30-Apr-1998

For purposes of quantizing, 6/8 and 9/8 don't have ANY triplets in them. A triplet is properly a group of three notes played in the space of 2 notes of the same value (and braced as a triplet). So, three quarter notes (as a triplet) take the place of 2 regular quarter notes. If you're in 6/8 and actually using the triplet figure, you're doing it wrong. It's really just 6 eighth notes in straight time.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 12-Jun-1998

You're dealing with composed measures. In such, 6/8, 9/8, 12/8 (not 3/8) the count of "time" is respectively 2, 3, 4. Each time is divided into 3 equal parts, NOT notated as triplets. And you can (or could, since NWC doens't support it yet) divide by 2 instead of 3 : this is called a duolet (in french).
In that latter case, you can have the exact sound by writing them as two dotted-eighth notes. This can be understood by the performer, though rather unusual. I think that the subject has already been discussed, but can't remember when.
Hope this helps.
            Dominique


#591: printing
printing

(591)

Submitted by: Imre Gusztin on 30-Apr-1998

I am in the evaluating process of NoteWorthy Music Composer currently. I have a HP 5MP PostScript printer, but I cannot see how to print in mirror from NoteWorthy. Usually it is available from most of the softwers when i use it with PS printer. Could anyone help? Thanks.

Imre

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 30-Apr-1998

I thought mirror was usually a option in the printer driver.


#592: Text  Chord Symbols
Text  Chord Symbols

(592)

Submitted by: Herbert A. Brail on 30-Apr-1998

Adding chord names above a staff using the text insert comand works fine for chords like C, G or F. The # sign is available for sharps, but how do you enter symbols for flats? Are extended characters (Alt + 0XXX) available for this text font? Why doesn't it display in character map? Any suggestions or work-arounds greatly appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Kent Dugan on 30-Apr-1998

A flat is just a lower-case b, as in Bb7(-9). It works just dandy.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 03-May-1998

It can be done, if you are desperate to make it look perfect. You use Page Setup, select the Fonts tab, double click on the "User 1" font, and select NWCV15. This is the font NWC uses to paint the screen. Select a 36 point size. Now, using Insert Text, select the User 1 font. Lower case "d" is the sharp symbol, and "f" is the flat symbol.

Unfortunately, there is a big problem. There is no single font with both letters and music symbols that I know of. Worse, you can’t pad the music font with spaces - there is no character that produces an empty space. So you have to insert the letters (eg. If you want Bb7, the B and the 7 with a space or two between them) above the previous note, with leading spaces so they are in the right place. Then on the next note use the User 1 font and insert an "f". Preserve width must be turned off. Then switch back and forth between Print Preview and the letter text until it is right. Don’t believe what you see on the screen. If you want chords above every note, this will be a real nightmare.

Using a "b" is a lot easier!

This would be trivial if someone could merge the Noteworthy font with a standard font. This is a wish of mine.

Reply 3 offered by: Pete Bowers on 04-May-1998

There is a combined text and music symbol font called bach.ttf at http://www.music.qub.ac.uk/~tomita/bach-mf.html
You might have to cut and past from a word processor to get the extended symbol set.

Reply 4 offered by: Pete Bowers on 04-May-1998

Should have tried it first... but... You can add extended symbols (such as the music symbols in the Bach.ttf font) by cutting and pasting from a word processor (I use word for windows). Set up the alternate font as one of the user defined fonts in "Page Setup" and use that same font in your word processor. You can add the sharps and flats (and notes) using the insert symbol command in word. Cut/copy from word to the clipboard and use "ctrl-v" to insert into the text box you get when you use the NWC "insert text" command. Select the same user font you set up earlier and you will get all the text and symbols.

Reply 5 offered by: Pete Bowers on 04-May-1998

One more thing... you can use the space character in that font also

Reply 6 offered by: One solution... on 14-Aug-2000

Always call black keys on the piano by sharp names...If you don't play piano, sharps and flats are always called by sharp names. So instead of
F Gm Am Bflat C Dm E° F
write
F Gm Am A# C Dm E° F
and half-diminished 7ths are written ½°7 or -7-5
the chords of Aflat major:
G#maj7 A#m7 Cm C#maj7 D#7 Fm7 G½°7 G#maj7
or
G#maj7 A#m7 Cm C#maj7 D#7 Fm7 G-7-5 G#maj7


#593: Transposeing
Transposeing

(593)

Submitted by: John Young on 01-May-1998

How do I transpose a single bar of sheet music in stead of transposeing the whole staff. I write a line moving from one chord the next, such as 2-5-1- chord line in "C" and want to tansopse it up a forth which will be the key of " F " . and still have the line in " C" in the previous bar. and perhap transpose it to all 12 keys.
Please help if you can.
Thank You
John

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-May-1998

Normally, you would transpose smaller sections by cutting the section into a temp staff, transposing, then pasting it back into the original staff. However, if you just want to transpose one chord, you are probably better off either:

1 - Constructing the chord manually, or

2 - If the new chord stays "in key", you can simply select it, and move it up or down on the staff using Shift+Ctrl+Up/Down arrow keys.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 02-May-1998

When I'm chording vamps (normally for audio reproduction), I'll generate one chord, copy it, paste it, transpose it by Method 2 above and then adjust any notes to get the desired inversion (which note to use as the bottom note of the chord). I simply do that for all the chords and then madly copy and paste all over the place. It's fairly quick when I don't get muddled!

A


#594: Tremelos and Arpeggiated Chords
Tremelos and Arpeggiated Chords

(594)

Submitted by: Matthew Murray on 03-May-1998

Is there any way to put tremelos or arpeggiated chords in
compositions? A lot of times, I want to use these, but
putting them in by hand can be time-consuming and often
very frustrating...

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-May-1998

See the sample file "moonlite.nwc" for a demonstration on how to do this in NWC at the moment. You cannot directly add these items, but you can use text items to approximate it, and then a hidden staff to create the audio effect.


#595: "x" note heads
"x" note heads

(595)

Submitted by: Bob  on 04-May-1998

I need to be able to have a few spoken words in the middle of a vocal line, and want to represent them with a note that has an 'x' as the note head.

Is this possible?

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 04-May-1998

No. I wish it was, it would mean we could do drum parts as well. You'll have to substitute the spoken words with actual notes. Try to pick some from the chord, this usually sounds better than random notes.

Reply 2 offered by: matt on 20-Jul-1998

is there any guitar symbols


#596: glissandos
glissandos

(596)

Submitted by: Bob on 04-May-1998

Can a glissando be entered on a score? I can't seem to find anything on this symbol.

If it can, can it transcend from the treble to the bass staffs on a piano composition?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-May-1998

NWC does not currently support this. NWC does not support transcending items from one staff to another, even is it is a grand staff (which is treated as two separate parts, usually a bass and a treble part, in NWC).


#597: suppressed lines in printing
suppressed lines in printing

(597)

Submitted by: Bob on 04-May-1998

I have a composition that splits into two parts (separate staffs and lyrics) late in the song. Is it possible to do this in the middle of a work so that I don't have a staff that is blank until late in the song where the second line comes in?

The only success I have had is in creative printing where I print the first few pages without the second staff, and then print the rest of the piece with the second staff.

However, this is obviously cumbersome.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-May-1998

The explanation in msg #311 is still valid today. At the moment, NWC supports only a static number of active parts in any single print job.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 12-Jun-1998

You could also refer to msg #463 where the subject has been discussed too.


#598: controlling note placement in chords
controlling note placement in chords

(598)

Submitted by: clint mers on 04-May-1998

I'm currently evaluating NoteWorthy, and I have the following questions about note placement in chords:

1. I create a chord which contains three notes, two of which are a step away from each other. This means that there isn't space for all the heads on the same side of the stem. NWC picks one of the notes and places it on the other side of the stem. Is there any way to control WHICH head gets displaced?
2. In this same chord, one of the notes falls outside the staff, so NWC fills in a ledger line through the note. However, since NWC has placed heads on both sides of the stem, it makes the ledger line twice as wide as it should be. Any way to control this (shorten the ledger line)?
(If these questions aren't clear, I could send a *.NWC file with an example...)

And one more question...

3. Is there any support for ornament or mordent symbols? I'm thinking that I can probably do a user font using music symbols and insert these, but I wondered if there was a nicer way of doing this?

Thanks for any assistance...
-Clint

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-May-1998

NWC does not support user control over notehead placement in a chord or ledger line width. The user font facility is the only way to enter symbols/ornaments that are otherwise not natively supported in NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 05-May-1998

For the past two years I have been asking the same question about noteheads, and nothing has been done to remedy such a simple error. It really makes me despair of NWC when every other package I've seen gets it right.

There should be no need for user intervention, since any book on musical notation (and I've sent a selection to Eric :~() specifies that the lower of the two notes goes to the left of the stem, and the higher to the right ... whichever way the stem goes ... and the head note is always in its correct position , so there should never be any ambiguity.

What's more the chords on two staves should always be aligned on the head notes. NWC always aligns the chords on the left-hand notes, and puts accents and staccato dots on the left hand notes instead of the head notes.

I tear my hair out at each new release which fails to put right what is just plain sloppy.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-May-1998

Regarding note placements, the next release includes some non-trivial fixes in this area (note position from one staff to the next, however, remains unchanged in version 1.51):

Bug Summary: A bug exists in note placement for chord members separated by a semitone
Fixed in: Version 1.51
Availability: by 09 May 1998

Bug Summary: A bug exists in alignment of note attributes (accent, staccato, tenuto) for chords that include members separated by a semitone
Fixed in: Version 1.51
Availability: by 09 May 1998

Details: We are releasing a maintenance upgrade (version 1.51), which includes all of our recent bug fixes, including these. Look for a version 1.51 upgrade to be available on or before 09 May 1998.


#599: General Midi Instrument Numbers
General Midi Instrument Numbers

(599)

Submitted by: .br on 05-May-1998

Does NoteWorthy have a list of the general midi instrument numbers? I cannot find a list. (I may be stupid OK)
My synth does not use GM programs but I need to change it so other peoploe can play my pieces properly.
I would like to print out a list too.
Thankyou, I don't think NWC will go broke like the Encore. :)

Reply 1 offered by: .br on 05-May-1998

Sorry for my spelling mistake. :)

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-May-1998

If you'd like to Email your address I can send you a list of General Midi numbers.

Reply 3 offered by: Paul Heichelheim on 05-May-1998

Try doing a web search on "General Midi Instrument Patch Map".

This should give you a pretty good list of web sites with GM patch maps and percussion lists.

Paul

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-May-1998

The NTWPATCH.INI file includes all of the General MIDI note assignments, by name. The file is in the NWC program folder. The drum names are in the help file, in the Common Questions section, as well as in the DRUMREF.NWC sample file.

Reply 5 offered by: Corkey on 06-Mar-2001

need a list cc numbers o-127 and what they do ?
any help will be great
Thanks corkey

Reply 6 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Mar-2001

The effect of midi controllers varies depending on which soundcard you use.

A general list can be found at the NWC Users Scriptorium.
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

Click on the Useful Files link.


#600: Printing Problems (single pages)
Printing Problems (single pages)

(600)

Submitted by: Joy Byford on 05-May-1998

Has anyone else experienced problems printing individual pages with version 1.50? I used to do this frequently with the previous version. Now even if I select (eg) Page 1, it attempts to print the whole score.

Also I notice that several options in the print dialog window are 'greyed out'. (eg no of copies). Is there a bug in the print dialog?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-May-1998

NWC does not offer the Selection option when printing. This is not a bug, just not an option.

The "Number of copies" option is supported by NWC, but only if your printer supports this option. If it is greyed out, then your printer does not support the multiple copies option.

Lastly, NWC also supports the select pages (from and to) option. Are you selecting the the Pages option? You must do this in addition to specifgying the page range.


#601: guitar tablature notation
guitar tablature notation

(601)

Submitted by: pierre demeure on 05-May-1998

Is it possible to use Noteworthy for guitar tablature notation ?
It would be great, as I've found some other programs which do
that, but which are less (very less...)efficient !

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-May-1998

NWC does not currently support guitar tab.

Reply 2 offered by: Billy F. Staggs on 12-May-1998

Boomer
:-(

Reply 3 offered by: jbh on 28-May-1998

You can use a program called TabTranscriber to make your MIDI
file to a guitar tab. It is located here:
http://www.cam.org/~mibra/

P.S. Learn normal notes! Thats less difficult when you know
it

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 04-Jun-1998

jbh, thanx for http://www.cam.org/~mibra/ !
It seems ok to me (I just tried 'Go, tell it on the mountain..' and what it transcribed (8 measures since it is an unregistered version) seems to be playable.

About your P.S., yes "normal" notes is better (in particular for having an idea of the melody at the first glance), but the tablatures (origin of the classical notation, it was used for the luth at that time). But tab's give an idea of the placement of the fingers.
Though it is anyway much better when putting fingering on the score ! It is also possible to put the number of the cord played, in NWC use an item text with chars Alt-0128 to Alt-0134 in wingdings font (I set it to user4 font) and it will give you the # in a circle.
Another advantage of using classical notation is that you also sho when the note ENDs up. Which is rarely shown in tab's notation.

Hope this helps. Do not hesitate to contact me for further explanations if needed.

NWCly yours


#602: forced page break?
forced page break?

(602)

Submitted by: Roland Siemons on 05-May-1998

Is there a way to force a page break at a convenient bar (e.g. after some rests) so that the reader/musician has time to turn the page more or less conveniently?

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 05-May-1998

No, there isn't. Please add your wish in the wish list:
<a href="http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm">http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm</a>

This is the best way to get a feature added.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 05-May-1998

Hum... I thought I could add HTML, just as in post
574.htm#reply8 by Donald W. Davis !

Well... here is the URL without any HTML tag :
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm

Eric, could you add a link to this page at the top of any
forum message, along with [New Reply|Home|Contents|Help] ?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-May-1998

You can create a hot link to a web address simply by prefixing it with an exclamation point. See the help button for details. For example,

!http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm

enters in the forum as:

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 06-May-1998

Nice ! That is a great thing. Thank you for the response,
and please accept my apologises that I didn't RTFM...

Anyway, IMHO, it would also be a good idea if you add
a link to the wish list page, directly accessible from
the forum pages.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 04-Jun-1998

There is a way to force a page break.
But this would deserve NWC usage as it is now, i.e. its automatic page setup, which I find particulalry useful (One must spend a considerable amount of time on setting page layout in other Score composers as F****e, C****e or others).
The way to do this is to use "blank" text ('x' key, using 31 white spaces at most) inserted before and/or after the rests (or notes) you want to change page.
Hint : to enlarge it, use Staff Italic rather than bold, it takes more space. Add a 2nd item for more.

Though I do not recommand this, I once used it. The limitation is that this is highly dependant of the printer definition as well as printing layout (one staff, all staves, ...)

Hope this helps anyway :-)

Reply 6 offered by: Alan Rolfe on 09-Jun-1998

Presumably, since there is no means of forcing a page break, there is no way of forcing a line break either, i.e. making the printed version start the following measure on a new line of music ?

Reply 7 offered by: Warren Barnett on 10-Jun-1998

The only way that I have found to make the next bar start on the next line is to insert spaces as text in strategic locations in the previous bars. As long as you chose the preserve width box then everything will space over until th next bar will no longer fit on the line and starts the next line.


#603: Scanners
Scanners

(603)

Submitted by: John Young on 06-May-1998

I'm a flute player and in the band I play in don't have music
for flutes, so I have to transpose Bb charts to concert music. I have a scanner and I want to know if there's a way to scanned sheet music into NWC that's not from a midi format. If so please tell me how this can be done. It will
save me a lot of time trying to transpose large parts.

Thank you
John

Reply 1 offered by: drake donahue on 06-May-1998

!http:/www.musitek.com pianoscan (the cheap version) should do it. They have a demo - try it - it is not great but somewhere between good and better. much editing will remain.

Reply 2 offered by: drake on 06-May-1998

http://www.musitek.com

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 06-May-1998

Also see msg #555 and msg #485 for further information.

A general point. Recently I've noticed a lot of queries which duplicate earlier
discussions, sometimes only a few threads before. Perhaps newcomers haven't cottoned
on to the off-line forum - it's certainly worth downloading and studying at leisure.
Granted that it isn't available for Windows 3.x users - perhaps such a version could
be made available(?), but failing that, a quick look at the forum every couple of days
keeps one up to date.

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ruckman on 06-May-1998

John, As suggedted by Peter (above) msg#555 and msg #485,discuss some of the experiences with scan software. You mentioned you are needing to trasnpose Bb parts (clarinet,trumpet,tenor sax,Bb euphonium(probably not for flute)), all these band parts are single notes,single staff. It might,as I have found to play these into NWC directly with your MIDI keyboard. If this is not available, then direct input to NWC (again single note,single staff) is so fast and accurate that this might be your best bet. It is for certain that after scanning,some editing will be required, and after MIDI input to NWC, some additional editing will be required( ie. 1/8 notr triplets). I hane not yet tried 'pianoscan', but I discussed 'MIDISCAN' in msg #485.

Reply 5 offered by: Drake on 06-May-1998

Pianoscan is Midiscan for a 2 staff system without Lime for 99 vice 299 US$.

Reply 6 offered by: Don Ruckman on 06-May-1998

Drake, Yes, thank you.
I just (past 2 hours) downloaded the trial version of MIDISCAN, and scanned in the same music score that I used some time ago as discussed in msg#485. The results were not much different. I also printed (on Epson color 800 printer -- excellent for music print) one of the sample files provided and then scanned it back into MIDISCAN and guess what - the results again were not very exciting.
here are some of the obvious problems:
no slur lines; no staccato(.)above notes; no accent(>) above notes; no triplet __3__ indications; sone note values changed; it even recognized the Bass Clef as a Alto or Tenor Clef(not sure which); no dynamics(p,pp,ff) recognized, etc. In all cases, the scan as viewed in MIDISCAN looked perfect, but the recognition phase is where excessive editing would be necessary. I would encourage anyone interested in scanning to download the trial version (2.5) and give it a try; it is quite fast and the download is fast.

Have fun,
Don Ruckman ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 07-May-1998

Just thought I'd mention Capella-scan again. It can be downloaded from http://www.softpart.co.uk
(file size 285 K so the download takes only a few minutes). Although it originates in Germany, all
the files are in English, so no problem there. I believe the price is around UK £75.00, and the main
Capella program isn't essential since there is a free MIDI export add-on available. I've only tried
the demo version (which has the save disabled), and not in depth, but the recognition seems pretty
good - definitely worth a look.

Reply 8 offered by: Joe Befumo on 18-May-1998

Re: (http:/www.musitek.com)

I have their better version, and would agree that while it's a somewhat neat little program, I don't think it's worth the price, and frankly, by the time you finish cleaning up the scan it's almost as much trouble as transcribing the piece by hand (which I still do most of the time.) Also -- it doesn't work with Windows NT, if that's an issue (which it is for me -- I have to run it on my old 486 system which I set up with Win 95 just to run that one application.)


#604: Classical guitar specific notation
Classical guitar specific notation

(604)

Submitted by: Pierre Archambault on 06-May-1998

I am evaluating the program to write classical guitar music. I would need some special characters to display the string numbers, left hand finger numbers, right hand finger numbers, fret positions, finger sliding, tremolos etc. Is there another way than using the text function?

I need full control on multiple voices on the same staff because I sometimes have to write up to three different voices (melody, accompaniment and bass). Will it be possible?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Befumo on 18-May-1998

You may want to look at Coda Finale -- If it doesn't do what you want I'd be more than surprised, since a vast majority of all professional typesetters use it for musical notation. That said, it's not cheap (List is around $795), nor is it easy to use. I just bit the bullet and ordered a copy, but I suspect that I'll continue using Noteworthy when I want to get something done fast and easy.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

Pierre,
with the current version of NWC you could do it anyway.
The text item allows you to have more than one font.
. For cord specification : use wingdings font, Alt-0128 to Alt-0134 will give you '1' to '6' numbers in black on a white disk
. For "case" (fret?) specification : use wingdings font (Alt-0139 to Alt-0149) you'll be able to have '0' to '10' numbers in white on a black disk (not 11 nor 12, alas)
For more specific items, try to find a specific font (chopin.ttf or ?)

For the complete control on 3 parts in one score, try the experimental score that NWC proposes. It allows you staff layering, displaying 1 score but using more than one.

HTH, and good evaluation.
                    MAD (happy reg'd user)


#605: Classical guitar specific notation
Classical guitar specific notation

(605)

Submitted by: Pierre Archambault on 06-May-1998

I am evaluating the program to write classical guitar music. I would need some special characters to display the string numbers, left hand finger numbers, right hand finger numbers, fret positions, finger sliding, tremolos etc. Is there another way than using the text function?

I need full control on multiple voices on the same staff because I sometimes have to write up to three different voices (melody, accompaniment and bass). Will it be possible?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 06-May-1998

A nuts-and-bolts answer is...
Special characters can be "imported" by using the Text feature and specifying a font which contains the characters you need. Unfortunately, the text function is the only means at the moment.

The current experimental feature of multiple voices, as far as I see it, will only pair staffs. What do you do with three, anyway? Certainly you can have multiple notes on one staff, so maybe needing three is not necessary.

Unfortunately, I can't think of any guitar notation programs out there short of going to Cubasis or something expensive like that, but I'd be interested to know if there is a shareware one around. ie maybe you should have a bit more of a look to see if there is some software that more easily matches your needs.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 07-May-1998

The staff layering feature will allow you to layer three (or more) staves, but the result would be difficult for any player/performer to interpret.

Reply 3 offered by: Jerzy on 22-Aug-1998

I think that the problem with NoteWorthy is that it adjusts
the positions of the old notes when new one is entered
which when combined with constraint that only two notes
of different durations can be combined in chords effectively
precludes having multiple voicing that is common in guitar
music.
One solution would be to add a "ruler" option and allow
notes to be positioned with respect to that ruler and not
each other. That would allow complete independence of
voices.
Somebody offered recently a solution to enter guitar score
on 6 different staffs (one string per staf) but that is
a rather cumbersome task.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1998

By far the easiest way I've found is to use a piano-roll-type editor. Note lengths can easily be dragged to whatever is desired. This also makes it easy to drag the entire note for arpeggiated chords, another typically guitaristic device.

Such an editor is pretty high on my wish-list for NWC.


#606: Merging staffs for vocal scores
Merging staffs for vocal scores

(606)

Submitted by: Tim Mitchell on 08-May-1998

Hello, I'm currently evaluating Noteworthy, mostly it's very good and I am almost certainly going to register it, but there's a couple of things... maybe some of you experienced Noteworthy users can help me out.

I'm trying to notate a 4-part vocal score that uses 2 staffs, i.e. the soprano and alto is together on the top staff (stems up / stems down) and same for the tenor and bass on the bottom staff.
I imported them from a sequencer as 4 separate midi tracks but couldn't find a way to merge them together. I seemed to be stuck with 4 staffs. Is there any way to do this? I see mention of an experimental staff layering system - tell me more!

So then I imported them as 2 tracks, all the alto stems were in the wrong direction, as you would expect. But I had to delete and re-enter all the alto notes to get stems down. Is there any way of changing the stem direction of one note in a chord?

And... I had some quavers (eighths) beamed together for the sopranos, is there a way of beaming the equivalent quavers for the altos? Because I seemed to be stuck with individual "stems down" notes, even though I could beam or not beam the upper notes.

Maybe it's obvious and I'm missing it...

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 08-May-1998

Firstly download the file Xprmntl.zip from

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#layer

Unzip it and load xprmntl1 into NWC. Select and Delete the Bass
staff (You will need to delete twice). Delete all the contents
of the remaining staff. Without closing this file, load your MIDI
file. Select as much of the Soprano line as you wish to work with
and Copy (CTRL+C) it to the clipboard (complete with clef, key and
time signatures). Then bring up the experimental file and Paste
(CTRL+V) the copied Soprano line. Select all the notes and click
the stems up button.

Now set up a new staff (Staff - New Staff). Copy a matching section
of the Alto line from your MIDI piece, then set all the stems to down.
Now go back to the Soprano staff and set Staff Properties - Visual -
Layer with next staff. Voila!! (Hopefully!). Then set up two new
(Bass Clef) staves for the Tenor and Bass lines, Copy, Set stems and
Layer.

You will probably find some hiccups - slurs out of place etc., but
further editing has a good chance of success. The system is still
experimental so don't expect the Sun, Moon and Stars. There have
been a number of discussions which include the experimental files,
msg #537 is a thread worth reading. Have fun!

The above will take care of your beaming query, regarding changing
the stem direction of a note within a chord, you have to delete
(CTRL+Backspace) the offending note and re-enter it (CTRL+Enter).
Not always possible, depending on the remaining contents of the chord.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

Tim,
to make all the stem down on all the notes of a staff, it's really simple :
1. go to the beginning of the staff (kbd: Home)
2. select all the items of the staff (kbd: shift+End)
3. put all stems down (kbd: shift+Down)

That's all ! :-) quick and easy.

Hope this helps !
                    MAD
P.S. read the inline help, you'll learn much. reading it first is annoying as usual, but since you fingered a little with NWC you'll get much interest in it. I still discover some hints in it from time to time. And in the forum too :-). Hope I'll be able to get the news forum some day :-(


#607: Importing rests with a quarter note resolution
Importing rests with a quarter note resolution

(607)

Submitted by: Hernando Silva-Varela on 08-May-1998

Dear friends:

I can understand the meaning of importing a MIDI file
with a resolution of 32nd notes, which is a very high
resolution for me to play my saxophone {;-) . However,
what is the meaning of importing rests with a quarter note
resolution ?. Does it means that no rests with a duration
lower than a quarter note will be shown in the score ?. If
so, what are the adventages and disadventages of this
setting ?.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 08-May-1998

My understanding is that changing the rest duration will alter the LENGTH of notes.
eg. A note of 3/4 normal duration will get "rounded" up or down, (or left the same) depending on the rest duration.
Compare this with note duration which if made too large will scrunch runs of notes into chords.
For MORE help, use the right mouse button on the note and rest duration fields of the Options | Import dialog.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-May-1998

The rest resolution determines how small a rest will be employed by NWC to maintain a staccato effect on a note. In other words, how small of a rest are you willing to accept in a performance. If a part contains small 16th notes of silence between notes, do you really want to see these? If not, set the rest resolution to something larger.

See also:
msg #451
msg #494


#608: Guitar Harmonics...
Guitar Harmonics...

(608)

Submitted by: David Grace on 10-May-1998

Is there any way to get Noteworthy to write harmonics for guitar. I have a midi file which has harmonics in it, but they are written as they sound rather than as they would normally be notated. Is it also possible to get the harmonic notes to have a diamond face rather than a normal round one?

Classical guitar music will often have a number of voices on the same staff, which sometimes means that two voices will share the same note. This is usually represented by a note with two tails (up and down) is there any way to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-May-1998

1) Not easily. You would have to find a font that contains notes that look the way you want, and insert them with Insert Text. Then to get the sound you have to have a hidden track.

2) Yes. Select the Stem Up tool (or from the Notes menu), enter your note. Then select Stem Down, add the same note with Ctrl-Enter. Now push the Stem Down tool again to clear it, so it does not mess up the rest of your note entry.


#609: Glossary
Glossary

(609)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-May-1998

As a french speaking man, I find sometimes difficult
to read some messages, or to write ones, because I don't
know the musical vocabulary. Ok, I already read all the
terms, but many often I mix them up, for instance beam/slur,
sharp/flat or quaver/semiquaver/eighth.

Do you know of a glossary of these rather simple terms
(for english people) ? Or maybe would it be possible to
add it on ntworthy site ?

Thank you very much...

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-May-1998

Here is the URL for an on-line music theory course.
I haven't tried it - only looked at it - not actually a glossary but it may be worthwhile.
http://orathost.cfa.ilstu.edu/~kwfansle/onlinemusicpage.htm

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-May-1998

There is already a substantial source of information on the Noteworthy site - the FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) page is the place to go. See http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/faq.htm for the main page. For musical terms see http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/music.htm and for note lengths see http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/faq3.htm#notechrt

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-May-1998

Oops! I missed out the '!'. For note lengths seehttp://www.ntworthy.com/composer/faq3.htm#notechrt

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 12-May-1998

Thank you, Barry, it was not exactly what I was looking
for, but it was very interesting anyway (even if I don't
agree when musical courses state as a golden rule:
"1 quarter note = 1 beat")

And thank you very much, Peter, that was precisely what
I expected to find. Once again, I didn't started with
Reading The Fine Manual...

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 13-May-1998

Hi, it's me again.

Finally, I didn't found what I was looking for.
Ok, I found the words that can be difficult to understand,
even for english or american people (such as coda, fermata
or hemidemisemiquaver), but I don't find the basic vocabulary.

For instance, I can't find the name of the symbol that is
between flat and sharp (french: bemol, becarre, diese),
and I can't find the name of the note duration that is
twice the whole (french: 1 carree = 2 rondes).

Such a glossary should include terms such as: beam, slur,
treble clef, key signature, ledger line, rest, beat, bar
line, triplet, staff and so on. Does this exist somewhere ?

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 14-May-1998

Hello again, Olivier,

I think you're going to have to consult a French - English dictionary for these translations. I have a pocket size one which has 'becarre' = 'natural' (as expected). It also correctly lists bemol (flat) and diese (sharp). 'ronde' translates correctly as 'semibreve', so 'carree' = 'breve'. If a pocket dictionary has these terms, I expect a large dictionary would contain all the terms you require. Perhaps a visit to your local library would help??

Best of luck, Peter.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1998

Peter, Olivier,
in a french/english dictionary you'll get silly things (as silly as what you'd get with http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com/cgi-bin/translate? !).
So here are the translations Olivier asked for, since I didn't find any place on the www for this :
(note that I once translated NWC (1.21) in French, but gave up since I had to "redo from start" (hey, sounds basic!) each and every new version...)
----8<----8<----8<----8<----8<----8<----
beam: ?barre? NPC avec "barre de mesure"
slur: liaison
treble clef: clé de sol
alto clef: clé d'ut 3
tenor clef: clef d'ut 4
key signature: armure
ledger line: ??? un exemple stp, Olivier ??
rest: silence (parfois soupir)
beat: temps (composé ou non)
bar: barre de mesure
line: ligne
triplet: triolet
staff:portée
and so on:etc.
Does this exist somewhere ?: Alas, not to my humble knowledge. I just search for 1/2 hour though...

I'll set up a page on one of my sites in the (end of the) current month (June1998). You should know it via the http://www.ntworthy.com/newstuff.htm page at that time.

Hope this helps.
BTW, how many french or french-speaking users is there ??

Viel Spaß, (in german, my "geo-native" tongue)
MAD


#610: Writing versus recording melodies
Writing versus recording melodies

(610)

Submitted by: Hernando Silva-Varela on 11-May-1998

By importing a lot of MIDI files to several music software
packages, I have the seen that the score of almost all of
the tracks (v.g., staffs) shows such a mixture of short
notes, small rests and very weird legatos that makes very
difficult the reading and performance with a real
instrument. Of course, it depends on the resolution settings
when importing.

My guess is that some "composers" of MIDI files prefer to
play with an instrument of their preference the especific
part, which is recorded and MIDI converted through the
computer, instead of writing the correct notes and durations
with a music scoring program. I guess the recording process
introduces mistakes such like small delays and overtakings
that occur normally during performance, among others, that
makes the final score unreadable and difficult to play,
unless some corrections are made.

My questions are, am I right in my statements ?, how does
Note Worthy Composer deals with this trouble beyond the
setting of the rest and note resolution ? (v.g., I have seen
that some music software packages take into account distance
and position between notes and rests). Is it impossible to
obtain the right transcription when importing a MIDI file ?

Thanks once again.

Reply 1 offered by: Neil Glynn on 16-May-1998

Not yet having used the midi interface with this particular program I cannot be certain, but there wil probably be a quantize function as with most other music programs. Try using this to sort out the problem!

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-May-1998

Composer performs a complex analysis of a MIDI performance in order to convert it to notation. It allows some user customization, as described by the Import Wizard options, and the associated help. There are some things that it does not do, such as notated dynamics and staccato (although the audio effect can be imported by allowing small rests to be used to create the staccato effect, but it usually makes for ugly notation).

See Also: msg #170, msg #533, msg #607


#611: Notes dropping out
Notes dropping out

(611)

Submitted by: Steve B Hall on 11-May-1998

I have a song section with 2 acoustic guitars (steel and nylon panned left and right) and a bass. The steel guitar keeps dropping out occasional notes. If I mute the bass or the other guitar, it sounds fine. This is happening on my system (SB32 + Yamaha XG) as well as a mates (AWE64). Any ideas???

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-May-1998

I have the same problem on an SB16 card which I suspect is due to the limitation on the number of voices that can sound at one time.
On an SB16 I think you have only 20 2-operator voices and 5 of those are taken up by the drum channel leaving 15 voices to share around among the other channels.
I wouldn't have thought that this would be a problem on AWE32/64 though.
If all your voices sound at the same instant the sound card chokes.
I write for big band and find that multi-voice ensembles written with NWC are quantized exactly to the same instant causing the choke off of some notes.
If you have access to a sequencer that allows you to shift staves in time -like Cakewalk, export your midi and try spreading the notes that sound together slightly apart.
For guitar this will mean appegiating the chord a couple of ticks after each other.
This works well on my sound card - try it on yours.
Unfortunately NWC doesn't provide this facility.

Reply 2 offered by: DjScottO on 15-May-1998

Hmm Have you tried turning the amount of voices allowed on the XG driver setting?
also try and turn the chorus off in the same settings area
I ten to have problems with that but they are fine after i switch them around.

Reply 3 offered by: Lyndon Griffin on 31-May-1998

Check the documentation on your sound card... Some patches will play back better on a few certain channels. Also, make sure that you don't have all the same instruments on the same channel, if possible.

<:) Lyndon


#614: writing chord
writing chord

(614)

Submitted by: Martin on 12-May-1998

I´m a new user of NWC. I can´t figure out how to write a chord (ex. C, F, etc.) above a note or a rest. When I use the text-insert command, the chord is placed whether to the left of the note or to the right.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 12-May-1998

In the "Text Expression" window, just un-check the "Preserve Width" checkbox.
And for better placement, set 8 for the "staff position".
Hope this helps.

P.S. Take a look at the examples, you'll learn much. :-)

Reply 2 offered by: Stussy on 22-Jun-1998

I was wondering how you actually put in a chord on the
actual music... Not actually above it.. For example
the keyboard chords or C E G etc...
Thanx

Reply 3 offered by: Ted on 22-Jun-1998

Wanting to find a program that will let me take existing (printed_ music and edit it such that we can change the key and then to add some harmony (2nd and or third) - does the program write harmony?

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 23-Jun-1998

Stussy,
do you mean that you want to put simultaneaous notes ? In tht case, enter the first one, then move (up/down) to the 2nd note, and press Ctrl+Enter. And so on.
Look at the "Chord Member Command" in the online help, it also tells about 2 stems chords and different-lengthed notes.

Ted,
midiscan (though slow) will let you convert scanned sheets into Midi, that you can import into NWC where you can change the key (transpose), but it doesn't write harmony itself. But it's really easy to do (copy, paste into another staff, move up/down and change some notes).

Hope this helps.


#615: 'Live' Performance
'Live' Performance

(615)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 12-May-1998

I'm putting this on the forum rather than as a Hint and Tip because I can't guarantee the continued availability of the download I'm going to refer to later. In the earlier thread 'Writing Versus Recording Melodies' (msg #610) the irregularity of tempo produced by a live performance is discussed. Entering a song note by note gives a more accurate score, but lacks the 'feel' of a live performance. But there is a way to fake this, and a superb example is on John Roache's Ragtime page, http://members.aol.com/ragtimers Go to this page and click on Classic Ragtime in the left hand column, then download the Wall Street Rag file. (The Maple Leaf Rag is also worth downloading - it's a cracking rendition!) Unzip Wall Street and import the midi file into NWC. (Suggested Wizard settings are 1/16th note, 1/8th rest, chord size 34). You will see that a third tempo staff appears with varying tempi throughout the piece. Most effective and a technique which I hope you find useful.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-May-1998

Addendum to the above - If you want to save time, skip the main ragtime page and go direct to the download page at http://members.aol.com/johnroache/private/classic.html

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 13-May-1998

One of my great joys in using NWC is in fact scoring the accels, decels, pauses, tempi changes, dynamics - having entered the notes. Turns it from a score into a performance. See http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/music/carmen.mid for an example of a piece that was copiously scored for dynamics (esp. LOUD!) and speed.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 13-May-1998

See also
http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/music/albzargn.mid
and
http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/music/albzcast.mid

I agree, it takes a lot of time to score such things, but I take great pleasure in hearing a piece rendered "musically".

A

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 14-May-1998

Thanks, Andrew. The Carmen piece is indeed very impressive. My browser (Netscape Navigator) played the files fine, but it would appear that they aren't downloadable in their present form. Any chance you could make them so, or perhaps e-mail an attachment to me?

Thanks again, Peter.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter V. on 14-May-1998

Wot! You again? I hear you say!

Belay the above, Andrew. I've found your superb Web page and downloaded the zip files. Terrific!

Peter.

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-May-1998

I can't find a NWC version of the Carmen piece. Is it at your website?

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 18-May-1998

Hi, Blair,

Andrew's web page is http://www.tip.net.au/~apurdam

The Carmen piece doesn't seem to be available in NWC format,
but if you download the zip files from

http://www.tip.net.au/~apurdam/nwcfiles.zip

you'll find the MIDI file among the selection.

Peter


#616: Pauses
Pauses

(616)

Submitted by: David Vallance on 12-May-1998

How do I add a pause to a note? I know it is possible because
the Chopin Prelude in the samples has one on the last chord.
TIA
Dave

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-May-1998

OK. David, the semicircle with dot symbol used to denote a pause is called a 'fermata' (I didn't know this until I started using NWC!) and is added using Insert - Tempo Variance - Fermata. Put the entry point just before the note at an appropriate staff position (7 or 8 usually suffices, and the latest upgrade to 1.51a makes sure it is positioned above the note). Set the delay time to suit yourself. Thanks for the thanks! Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 18-May-1998

As a slight clarification to Peter Vasey's comment, a "fermata" extends the duration of a note for the indicated time. On the same menu, there is also a "breath" mark which acutally pauses the music for the indicated amount of time (so short-winded singers like me can catch their breath).


#617: Printing From Explorer
Printing From Explorer

(617)

Submitted by: Steve Pearson on 13-May-1998

Most files (including multiple files) I can simply print from Windows Explorer with the "Send To" or "Print" features by right clicking the mouse. However, I have not yet been successful in getting this to happen with NWC. I have associated the file and extension, and have tried various DDE configurations without success.

Handy sometimes to be able to print a whole selection of songs without having to open each one in NWC.

Any suggestions? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-May-1998

NWC does not current support a DDE directive that will enable you to print from Explorer. Your best alternative is to select the files, open them all at once, then print individually.

Reply 2 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 18-May-1998

I once faxed a Noteworthy file using a right click on the file and choosing print (to fax). I havn't tried this for a while, but it worked back then. What is different, or was it just me having daydreams again?
Adam

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 18-May-1998

I just tried it then, and it didn't work. Maybe I got it mixed up with something else. (Don't worry, just a bass players brain playing tricks again:-)
Adam


#618: MIDI controllers
MIDI controllers

(618)

Submitted by: Shane T on 14-May-1998

I started using the demo version and soon became addicted! But often in my midis i use the MIDI controllers. Right now NWC allows you to access volume, pitch bend, stereo pan etc which is great!....

...but it would be really nice if I could enter my own controller values so that I could have access to other controllers such as especially reverb and chorus.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 14-May-1998

Oh yes! That would be good, and shouldn't be too hard to implement. I even suggested (long ago) some form of entering straight Hexadecimal for those of us who wanted to get right to the nuts and bolts. The best thing to do is add it to the wish list, http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm
as that is NWA's official channel for considering user's wishes.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Shane T on 14-May-1998

O.K. thanks, I'll sure do that right away!!


#619: Making records
Making records

(619)

Submitted by: Chuck on 14-May-1998

I am facinated by the possibility that the music created
using NWC might be enjoyed by others via a CD or tape.
How does one get started in the "electronic recording" business?
Has anyone out there had their midi files recorded
professionally? What kind of costs are associated with
this kind of endeavor? Am I just dreaming? Should I just
record this music on a cassette tape myself? Does anyone
actually buy midi-music?

Chuck

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 14-May-1998

Mitsumi CD recorders are around the net at $259 and dropping if you are interested in one disc at a time recording.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 14-May-1998

We used midi for our book of dulcimer music (A Bag of Sticks) so that people could practice with the solo part on one side and music-minus-one on the other (or turn the balance into the centre for the whole thing). This was a very cheap arrangement for us (we "played" to DAT tape and then used it as the master for multiple tape recordings).
The upshot? Most people said they'd prefer "live" music.
And this was for a _practice_ tape!

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 15-May-1998

I am myself toying with the idea of using Noteworthy as accompaniment for an album my father will be doing soon. (He is a Pedal Steel Guitar player) As newer and more fascinating midi tools are being added, the idea is getting closer to our grasp. I think if you used a good midi synthesizer, and a good recording setup, I believe the basic band could (mind you I say 'could') be quite close to the real thing. I think as long as the guitar and other such instruments are 'real', it NWC could lend itself to being quite a good, trusting, 'Noteworthy' band. And at least they won't play wrong notes! :-)
Adam

Reply 4 offered by: Chuck on 18-May-1998

Thanks to everyone who responded to my query. The problem
I see is that many people do not think midi music is worth
a listen. Real instruments are certainly better. But is
there a market for Midi-created music? From the responses
I have received, I would think not. Perhaps with the right
composer and recording company a market could be carved out.
There seems to be a niche for every other kind of music
imaginable... so why not Midi music?

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 18-May-1998

There a are several commercial Midi marketeers.
Mainly in the vocal accomp. area with backing tracks for vocalists.
So there must be a commercial market, particularly if the backing track comes with player software that will allow transposition of all voices to the key of the performer.
Another market may be in improvisation to a rhythm backing although I guess Band-in-a-Box fills this niche.
In education there is scope for including multi track Midis with band and orchestral scores to allow students to mute their part and rehearse in play along mode but this is probably only an option for publishers.
Conversion of Midi to digital audio for recording seems limited there is no great gain in fidelity and file size limits transportability.
Mechanical music remains mechanical regardless of it's source.
There is not enough inflection, feeling or subtlty in the performance despite arranger efforts to build that in.
Anyhow!...as a musician I prefer live performance - mistakes and all. At least you know it's live.

Best of Luck if you try.

Regards

Barry

Reply 6 offered by: x on 18-May-1998

From my experience, most pop music is done with midi.
The advantage of NoteWorthy for real musicians is that it displays the chords for you while it plays.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 19-May-1998

Chuck,

You say that real instruments are certainly better. Although some traditional instruments are difficult to synthesise accurately, even with extensive sound sampling, nevertheless many are well served. Does an electronic Piano perform worse than an acoustic instrument costing the same or even more? I reckon in many cases it is better and certainly more versatile, not only can it put on different 'hats', but it's a lot easier to carry around than a baby Grand! As x says, much pop music relies almost entirely on synthesisers, all of which use MIDI, and as Andrew Purdam (above) and John Roache (see msg #615) have proved, MIDI certainly has a place in transcription as well as reproduction. In 1995 an upmarket English notation program (Sibelius 7 see http://www.sibelius-software.com only on Acorn computers) gave an acclaimed public performance of fiendishly difficult piano pieces by Gyorgy Ligeti at London's Royal Academy of Music - this was broadcast world wide.

If they can do it, so can you, so go for it, Chuck, and good luck!

Reply 8 offered by: Louis Banks,India on 20-Jul-1998

Dear Chuck,

Good music is music that is played well ,be it electronic or acoustic . Today,s advancement of technology is helping Midi music to be more acceptable . The source may be electronic but remember there is a musician behind the music.midi music is one more dimension and universe of music making that is the future .

Best of luck in your music making. I am a jazz pianist and an electronic keyboard player.

Regards ,

Louis


#620: Change midi instrument sounds
Change midi instrument sounds

(620)

Submitted by: Sergio Marshall on 14-May-1998

Is it possible to change the way an instrument sounds. For example I don't like the way the french horn sounds when I select it as a playback instrument. Can I replace tgis with a better sounding french horn?? If so, how do I do it??

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 15-May-1998

If you have a sample based synthesizer, you find and load a better sample. If you do find a good sounding french horn be sure to tell us!
msg #535 thread beat this topic up pretty well.

Reply 2 offered by: x on 18-May-1998

In my opinion, the best module ever made was the Roland U-220. If you get the Orchestra Winds pcm card, there are several french horns to choose from, and they are all wonderful sounds. The SN-U110 pcm cards work on the D70, rhodes model 760, super LA, u220 synth, etc.
NoteWorthy and one of those modules/synths is the best!

Reply 3 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 19-May-1998

My original post was brief and perhaps didn't outline quite what I was asking. I was wondering if it were possible to change the selection of instrument sounds when I play music from NWC through the sound card. I do not have a keyboard yet just writing and playing back. My sound card is a 16 bit Yamaha OPLA3 and the instrument sounds are OK but can I make them better. There is a function in the multimedia part of Win95 that allows me to select an instrument definition file (*.idf) for General midi playback. Does this have anything to do woth different sounds?

Any help with this would be appreciated...humour me :-)

Reply 4 offered by: Chris on 17-Jun-1998

I believe the only way to change/improve your instrument sounds for computer playback would be to get a different soundcard. I've been told that soundblaster64 has excellent instrument sounds. I installed a newer soundcard (not SB64) on my home computer a few weeks ago, and many instruments (particularly brass and woodwinds) seem to be improved. However, the percussion sounds are not as good. :-(


#621: Soundfonts
Soundfonts

(621)

Submitted by: Steve Pearson on 15-May-1998

I have historically used an Ensoniq soundcard since I preferred its wavetables to those of the soundblaster. Unfortunately, Creative has now acquired Ensoniq, and the latest Ensoniq PCI sounds suspiciously like a soundblaster.

Verdict: I may have to change to a soundblaster AWE and rely on soundfonts.

Query whether we should begin a list of good freeware soundfont sites (and recommendations as to particular instrument effects within a particular grouping)? Does anyone have any favorites? Has anyone used and found the wave sampling technology of the latest Creative cards to be useful?

I guess I am basically looking for some feedback before I spend the bucks on an AWE 64 Value or Gold cards. (P.S. it would be helpful to know if there are any significant recommendations between the two).

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 16-May-1998

Definitely visit

http://home.worldonline.nl/~sanderb/ The Unofficial AWE64 page

and
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Campus/8645/sf2.html
has some good retro 80s synth stuff

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 16-May-1998

Andrew: many thanks. Good leads. Steve.

Reply 3 offered by: Chen on 27-May-1998

What are soundfonts?

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Pearson on 27-May-1998

Chen: I am still a bit of a novice in the new field. However, the newer sounds now allow wavetable samples to be stored and accessed on the harddrive, rather than static ROM chips on the card. As a result, a whole new arena a wavetable samples are available for downloading and manipulation for playback and recording purposes.

Additionally, if a person wants to record in a favorite instrument, they can create (and polish) a sample that can thereafter be used in selecting instruments and instrument sounds (assuming appropriate software programs that add that flexibility such as Midisoft's Recording Studio program (p.s. apparently, some special ini are needed to allow selection of discrete instuments in Recording Studio. Technical Support at Midisoft can help with those).

I know there are some folks out there far more versed in the area. Perhaps they will have some added information (or corrections) relating to the foregoing.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-May-1998

Chen: I sent the prior response without proofreading. Should know better. Here is a better copy.

Chen: I am still a bit of a novice in the new field. However, the newer soundcards now allow wavetable samples to be stored and accessed on the harddrive, rather than on static ROM chips on the card. As a result, a whole new arena of wavetable samples are available for downloading and manipulation for playback and recording purposes. One of the leading firms in the area has coined (and trademarked?) the term "soundfonts" for the new form of samples that are available through its resources.

In addition to harddrive and downloadable soundfont packages, if a person wants to record in a favorite instrument in a wave or comparable format, they can create (and polish) a sample that can thereafter be used in selecting instruments and instrument sounds for their music(assuming appropriate software programs that add that flexibility such as Midisoft's Recording Studio program) (P.S. apparently, some special "ini" files/modifications are needed to allow selection of discrete instuments in Recording Studio. Technical Support at Midisoft can help with those).

I know there are some folks out there far more versed in the area. Perhaps they will have some added information (or corrections) relating to the foregoing.


#622: Now to Add a note?
Now to Add a note?

(622)

Submitted by: laichung on 16-May-1998

Hi all~
I have a problem whwn I was entering a song.
In one bar of my song , there are two voice .
but when I want to add a 1/2 note under a 1/2 rest,
the error come out .
I can't add it .
Can anyone help me about this ?
thank you

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 16-May-1998

Select the rest and give it a "tail direction" (up or down). Now select the opposite direction and enter the note as a chord member (using the control-enter combination).

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-May-1998

However, if the note and rest are of the same duration, this will be disallowed by NWC. See the help file section for Insert Chord Member for details on all of the rules.

See Also: msg #59, msg #461, msg #537, msg #606

Reply 3 offered by: Ken Stanton on 18-May-1998

I've looked in a couple of books for reference but cannot find the 'rule' that I'm looking for. If the rest is the same time value as the notes in the chord, why can it not be included in it ? is this a music theory 'rule' or is it determined by the way NWC works ?

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-May-1998

This is not music theory, but how the program works.

Reply 5 offered by: Tanya on 27-Jun-1998

Thanks! This works great with my problem too!


#623: Lyric Placement
Lyric Placement

(623)

Submitted by: Curtis on 17-May-1998

Hey,

Does anyone know how to insert lyrics starting at say,
the 10th or 20th bar, as opposed to the first?? This
is driving me crazy!

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson on 17-May-1998

You have to pad the lyrics page with the underline character separated by a space.

See LYRICS COMMAND under HELP which will explain the concept and also show
other things of interest on entering lyrics.

Reply 2 offered by: Curtis on 18-May-1998

Thanks, that's exactly what I needed to know. The technique
works perfectly. I had looked in the help before, but the
information was not the practical.


#624: Beaming
Beaming

(624)

Submitted by: Lee McHugh on 17-May-1998

I know this subject has probably already been addressed and
it is probably discussed in NWC online help but I can't seem
to find it. Here's my question/problem: A single line of music; sixteenth notes on top, stems up; eighths below, stems down. I am unable to get note configurations such as this to beam together properly. Need suggestions. Thanks....

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-May-1998

You can't. Beamed notes must all be in the same direction. Add this request to the wish list.

Reply 2 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 18-May-1998

You can achieve the desired effect by using the secret layering.

Copy the line of music to a second stave in an experimental layer file.

In the first stave include only the sixteenth notes stems up and beam them.

In the lower stave include only the eighths stems down and beam them.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 18-May-1998

Re last item, NB you should make sure that you only have one set of beamed notes in each layered staff or else when you beam them together, you will have tails appearing from the note stems.

Richard

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-May-1998

I thing I misunderstood your question - I thought you wanted one beam with notes going in two directions. Richard is right - use the staff layering feature. See the discussions in msg #606 msg #537 and msg #461


#625: Page setup window
Page setup window

(625)

Submitted by: x on 17-May-1998

Hi,

Can you make the page setup window wider so I don't have to click that little button to see the contents tab after I've click the preview tab?

Another thing (not a NoteWorthy problem but I ask because NoteWorthy users are so clever) I can't set up my soundblaster16 to have the creative midi port, the audio and fm synth working under NT. I re-installed the soundblaster16 driver with NT but I can't use the midi port. Please help me by emailing: business_net@bitsmart.com

I would also like the feature to force NoteWorthy to keep notes to 8ths even if the notes are slightly less than 8ths.

Thankyou for a GREAT program.

Reply 1 offered by: x on 18-May-1998

I solved the my midi problem thankyou.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 18-May-1998

If I understand your first question correctly, you want to speed up access to the preview after adjusting the contents.
I agree. Maybe putting the preview button on the right hand side (under Close & Cancel & Help) would be more helpful.
Version 1.51 does have a toolbar button going straight to Preview, but it doesn't work when the Page Setup dialog is open. Hmm. I'd vote for the Preview button in the dialog to be "common" to all pages.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: MAD on 11-Jun-1998

X, you can use Alt-v when the preview tab is open.
Andrew, I agree to the idea of moving the Preview button to the comman part on the right (thus making the Alt-v work anywhere :-)).
Eric, some comments ?


#626: Noteworthy 1.51a
Noteworthy 1.51a

(626)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 17-May-1998

I see a 1.51a version has arrived, but with no description of what it is supposeed to fix. I tried to download the patch, but it failed (file size CRC error). I am upgrading from 1.51. Is this upgrade worth picking up? And do I have to download the entire program again to get it?

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 18-May-1998

I had the same problem with the error on the 16bit version, however the 32bit upgrade fixes the short note stem problem outside of the stave (the higher the note, the shorter the stem). I didn't have the same problem with the 16bit version on Win 3.1, but if you are using Windows 95, 32bit NWC, yes, it's worth it.
Adam

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-May-1998

I just successfully retrieved and applied the 1.51 upgrade patch from two different service providers. It appears to be fine.

Version 1.51a fixes a bug in the stem length when beaming notes with downward stems that appear well above the staff.

Reply 3 offered by: Geoff Grayton on 07-Jul-1998

As a registered user of noteworthy Composer I though I was supposed to be notiified of upgrades. I have never recieved any upgrade notice nor have several of my friends who are registered users.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 07-Jul-1998

First I do not think such a behaviour is described in the install file (maybe, it's long time u know)
Second I do think that really few companies act like you think. One of the bad side-effects of WEb-based information is that you need to get your new drivers yourself, find out if ther is a new version of your softwares, on so on.
On the other hand, each time you connect to a web site, you'll be sure to get the latest version.
Hope you'll enjoy this 1.51a !
P.S. Maybe you'll be warned for version 2.0 ? ;-)
P.P.S. I connect at last once a month on all the sites I need to (gnu, epson, ...) but NWC, 5 a week : the forum is helpful :-)

a Happy Reg'd User


#627: Chord names/symbols!
Chord names/symbols!

(627)

Submitted by: Joe Befumo on 18-May-1998

I consider Noteworthy composer just about the best value in any software product I own (and I own a LOT!) It's stable, well designed, and generally an absolute pleasure to use. Considering all this, the absence of support for chord information is particularly difficult to understand. For me, this makes the product all but unusable for anything requiring printed output. Yes, I know you can use the Insert|Text feature, and that would be fine if not for the fact that the inserted text can not occupy the same space as a note -- in many cases it's important to indicate that the chort is played AT a note, not before or after it.

I certainly would not mind if these did not transpose with the rest of the music -- Cakewalk's chord symbols are simply 'decorations' but are quite useful (unfortunately, Cakewalk doesn't do most anything else as well as Noteworthy!)

Reply 1 offered by: Wayne Petrychyn on 18-May-1998

I use the "insert|text" option for chords and I find it works
quite well. Two options to keep in mind:
1. Staff Postition:
try about 8 to 15 for chords above the staff
try about -8 to -15 for chords below the staff
2. Preserve width: (most important)
make sure it is NOT checked. This allows the chord to be
positioned directly above/below a note instead of before
or after it.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Heichelheim on 18-May-1998

Have you tried deselecting the "Preserve Width" attribute of the inserted text? This will cause the text to align itself with the note that it preceeds.

See "jingle.nwc" in the samples folder to see what I mean.

Reply 3 offered by: Ben Robertson on 08-Jul-1998

I have to agree with Joe. I tried Noteworthy 1.3 last year
and found even that version very easy to use for my purposes
(creating fakesheets). HOWEVER, the lack of proper chord
symbol handling caused me to switch to music@passport.
My biggest problem was that when you transpose a staff
(something I do quite often, since I am a vocalist), the
chord names, being text, don't transpose. I'm certainly not
going to go back in and manually change all the chords.
I put in a request over a year ago for support for chord
symbols, and I really wonder why it has never appeard in
any subsequent release. This function is supported by
MANY other notation packages.

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-Jul-1998

This would be a big feature, meaning take a long time to do. I guess if you do chords you want this a lot, but those who do not need chords have other things they want a lot. Picking the features to do for each release is a tough balancing act. I guess the forum and wish list are the only way to guess what the (most vocal) customers really want.

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Befumo on 09-Jul-1998

Thanks for the tip regarding 'preserve width' -- that really helps a lot. As I said in my root post, it's hard to fault Noteworthy for any omission, considering the overall quality, features, price, ease of use, etc., and I can certainly understand the juggling that software developers must do in trying to please everyone at once. I'm not sure I see how this particular feature would benefit vocal-oriented users as much as other musicians, who rely more on the chord symbols, though.


#628: Importing/Splitting
Importing/Splitting

(628)

Submitted by: x on 18-May-1998

Heya...

I was wonder'n 'bout when I imports a midi file, and I wants to split one track but not the others. Like, for example, I want 'de piano to be split at 18, but not any other instrument.
Get what I'm saying?

How do I makes it so one geets split, but the others don't?

Thanksyou man.

X

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-May-1998

The last step in the import wizard allows you to edit the import instructions. This is how you override your earlier settings.

Reply 2 offered by: X on 09-Jun-1998

Can I have a split track feature for NoteWorthy please?
It'd be sure as turkey a good thing to have.
Like spleeting 'de violins into three tracks mebbe.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1998

X, do you mean that you want 3-note chords to be automatically splitted into 3 different scores, or what ??
(Eric, that would be a great thing by the way... :-))

MAD (also marsu@ThePentagon.com, too)

Reply 4 offered by: X on 09-Jun-1998

YES!

All I want to do is split violins (3 note chords) into
3 staves with 1st, 2nd and 3rd violin.

NO PC software can do it!

Anyone who does it for PC will make a mint.

They can do it on a 10year old Atari with Notator,
but I've been searching for months and haven't found
any PC software that does it. If NoteWorthy or
one of you guys can program it, I need this feature
desperately.

I'll register ten copies and give them to my friends
if NoteWorthy does it! *grin*

The instant that you realise there is some software
that can do it fly down and give it to me... I mean
email: business_net@bitsmart.com
right away!

Thankyou!

X

Reply 5 offered by: Chris on 16-Jun-1998

There is a commercial program which will split tracks into however many parts are needed. If is Finale by Coda software. The academic price for Finale is $250 and regular retail is quite a bit more than that. The function that splits lines in Finale is "explode music," and there is also a function called "implode music" which will do the reverse. When exploding, if the track has 3 part chords, then it will make 3 seperate parts from that line. If some of the chords are 4 part, it will make a 4th line which has rests during the 3 part chords. However, cut and paste can fix that easily. The problem with Finale is that it is expensive and very complex. If Noteworthy Composer ever adds the splitting function, I'll be as happy as you are.


#629: Great things about NoteWorthy
Great things about NoteWorthy

(629)

Submitted by: x on 18-May-1998

I'd just like to start a thread where people can say what features they like about NTW. I want to do this because I showed a few musician friends Noteworthy and they found delight in how easy it was to insert notes, chords, staffs, and be able to write large pieces without spending more than 5 minutes learning how to do everything.
Another thing I think is great how I can copy out a page and stick it in my desktop publishing software and make my own sheet music. (the look of a Noteworthy score is so good.)

Reply 1 offered by: Hillary Morgan on 19-May-1998

Yes. One thing I look for in a piece of software is its intuitve feel.
If I'm able to sit down with it, bash a few keys and click the mouse a bit,
and produce something reasonable after only a few minutes, then
I think it's great.

NWC is just that!

More power to your elbow!

Reply 2 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 19-May-1998

I agree. After a long time searching for decent composing software, I finally found NWC, and registered within a week. Another 3 guys from my work, and a couple from outside my work registered after I gave them shareware copies of the program. Everyone I know seems to have more compliments than complaints about a program that is easy to use, has great support, and an online users group (oncu) that are the most helpful and nicest bunch of mates a guy could have! 'Hey, buy you boys a drink?' :-)
Adam

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-May-1998

See also the discussion in msg #437

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 22-May-1998

When I moved across to the PC platform from my trusty but non mainstream Acorn Archimedes, I needed a notation program to replace the bundled Acorn offering (Maestro, very good for its time in 1989) which I had used extensively to help me learn solo songs and chorus parts for my main musical interest, singing. I looked at a number of notation programs before finding NWC on a PC World Magazine Disc. Joy! - at last a program which was intuitive, easy and quick to use with a slick screen display, tidy printout, compact files and a main program which didn't take up megabytes of disc space and scatter armfuls of DLL's all over my hard disc. Since then as well as the originally intended uses, I've set professionally arranged choral and piano pieces for a number of public performances, and my 18 year old daughter has used NWC to good effect in preparing her coursework and composition pieces for her Music 'A' Level exams here in England. She'll almost certainly register her own copy when she (hopefully) goes to University in October to study Music. Two of my friends have registered copies, and they agree with me that NWC is one of the nicest notation programs available for the PC, and at its present price is unbelievable value for money. A PC version of the excellent Sibelius program (see http://www.sibelius-software.com ) is on the way, and although more advanced is likely to cost at least fifteen (yes 15) times as much as NWC. How does Eric do it?? And long may he reign!

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 22-May-1998

Oops! Not PC World, PC Plus.

Reply 6 offered by: Ken Mund on 23-May-1998

I have used many notation programs including the popular ones like "Finale", "Encore" etc. They are much more expensive and you can modify more features with some other programs but I like the ease of use in NWC and the price is fantastic also. The cut-down versions of the above mentioned programs don't compare to NWC in my opinion either. My thanks to the NWC staff for a great product.

Reply 7 offered by: x on 27-May-1998

NoteWorthy is so much easier and uses a more intelligient interface than Encore.

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 11-Jun-1998

The evaluation demo:
Other demos don't let you save at all, or nothing more than
a couple of measures. NWC saves up to 10 times-plenty for
simple transcriptions.
Other demos don't allow print. How do you know whether the
print is going to be jagged? NWC does well to show off its
very slick print engine...

Reply 9 offered by: Dem on 16-Jun-1998

Because I could work on files and print them out to see the results with a shareware version, I registered NoteWorthy!

It's cool.

Dem.

Reply 10 offered by: chris on 16-Jun-1998

I too was very impressed when I found NWC. I was browsing around the keyword: MIDI area of America Online and read the description of NWC. I was very skeptical that it would do all the things it claimed, but once I tried it, I immediately registered it at home and at the high school where I teach instrumental music. I have used other music notation programs and feel that NWC has the easiest to use interface. Software such as Finale is great, but you have to have a lot of time to learn how to use it. My final thought is "How can this great little piece of software cost so little?" Keep it up, and I hope the future releases are even more impressive.


#630: Running the Offline forum from Windows 3.1 / 3.11
Running the Offline forum from Windows 3.1 / 3.11

(630)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 19-May-1998

The Offline forum is designed to work only on Windows 95/NT.
I wasn't too happy about this since I am unable to upgrade at the moment. BUT I have found that there is a way that it can be run on Windows 3.1 or Windows for Workgroups (3.11).

If any one is interested in knowing how to do this, please add a message below. (I don't want to write out the procedure
if there are no takers ! - Although not too dificult, it will take a few words to describe !!)

Richard

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 20-May-1998

Yes please, Richard. I use 3.11, and although I have a Windows 95 partition (for evaluation), at the moment I'm staying with 3.11, at least until Windows 98 is sorted.

Reply 2 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 22-May-1998

No too much interest in this then.
Perhaps there's just a few of the dying breed around!

Peter, I'll E-mail instructions later.

R.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 05-Jun-1998

Richard,
I'd be interesting in knowing your solution. I use W95 now at the office since I changed of client, but I still use my old 486 with that good old W3.11 at home. I find it much more quickly and much more less bugged than W95 (or W98ß), and will keep on using it as much as I can. Quickness is my first criterium when working on a computer. Reliablility the second. (some people should say : "why don't you use OS/2 instead ?" they would be right... But can't afford it. Yet.)

I even sometimes use the 32-bit version of NWC on Win3.11 (+Win32s extension), it works fine except for MIDI engine (which seems not to be a 32-bit part, but a 95/NT part. Yes, there IS a difference...) Alas I was uncapable to use the offline forum on it, so if you know the solution... :-)

TIA, MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Richard on 05-Jun-1998

Marsu,

Info on the way by E-Mail

R.


#631: Layering
Layering

(631)

Submitted by: Lee McHugh on 20-May-1998

Does the experimental option of staff layering exist in the 16-bit version of NWC 1.51a? It's discussed in the online help section under Experimental Features but does not appear in any of the pull-down menus or windows that I can find. Need direction.......

Reply 1 offered by: Singstimmer on 20-May-1998

Yes it does.
You need to get a sample file from the newsgroup and then base any future files on these samples
S.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-May-1998

See the User Tip at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#layer

Reply 3 offered by: Singstimmer on 21-May-1998

Gee Thanks Blair,

I forgot the files were there. Much easier to get at than
the newsgroup.

S.


#632: Moonlite - NWC Samples
Moonlite - NWC Samples

(632)

Submitted by: David Moderate on 23-May-1998

In the 'Samples' folder of Noteworthy Composer, I found 'Moonlite', the first movement (I think) of Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata. The thing is, it doesn't seem to behave as other NWC do. The mute button seems to have no effect and other devices like trills and arpeggiated chords work but the symbols that perform these wonders are only text expressions. I'm probably missing something really obvious :)

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Mund on 23-May-1998

Look in "Page Setup" and you will find 2 hidden files which are the lines playing by default. This is where the ornamentation is located. You can often find additional information by clicking the italicized (i) on the tool bar. This area mentions the hidden files.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-May-1998

It is the third movement. It really shows what NWC can do!


#633: Accents
Accents

(633)

Submitted by: Ken Mund on 23-May-1998

I use NWC often for work and in hobby and I am frustrated that a housetop accent (^) is not included. (Sorry I can't think of the correct name for it at this time.) This is a very common accent in jazz and band music and being a H.S. band director, I am tired of adding this accent by hand. I have used the text editor to add them but found difficulties when corrections to the score were made, etc. I have sent this to the wish list many times, but I know the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Anyone else want this?

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 23-May-1998

Whilst the "^" is a very commen accent in music, it is rare that I actually hear musicians play it right, and I have found that the ">" is played virtually the same by professional musicians. To be honest, to get the musicains to play the ^ accent properly, I give them a > with a staccato underneath. It works, the musicians can read it fine, and at least they play it the way I want it.

Reply 2 offered by: Adam B on 23-May-1998

By the way, a squeaky wheel gets the grease when the grease is available. For the time being though, it is so annoying! :-))

Reply 3 offered by: Kent Dugan on 27-May-1998

I agree. We need the circumflex accent. The > with a dot (which I'm forced to use) is not played the same in dance band music. The housetop traditionally gets played as a harder accent. Also, I spend a lot of my life adding two marks when one would do.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 08-Jun-1998

I discovered the ^ accent (musically speaking of course, in french language it is often used) recently, and none around me could explain its musical value. Now I know, thanks to you all !!
So I may give you some hint to reduce your pain when coding it in NWC : instead of using ',' and '>' kbd keys which give +/- the same sound, you can define a unique quick-key that will :
1. type in the two previous keys for, selecting the note to the right of the cursor ;
2. go up an octave
3. insert text with '^' character in ScoreBold, not preserving space ;
4. go down an octave and go right.
Of course you can do 1. separately, or 2-4 as a whole (not played then, but printed).
To define this macro(s), you need recorder.Exe (Win3.x macro recorder of µSoft, basic but works anywhere).

I'd be glad to send this macro, but I'm 99% sure that it would not work. Since I am using a french kdb, and its layout is NOT the US std... (Very annoying in most bad-written games, by the way :-()
You can refer to http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html (Andrew's NWC page), he describes how to use the macro recorder of Windows (3.x!!! µSoft stupidly removed it from W95, but it still work though.)
You can look at his macros, they are re-played at the normal pace so you will get how it works. Read the description (about placement in particular) before.
And then do your owns...
PDNHTCM if you need more explanations.
HTH,
MAD

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 08-Jun-1998

PDNHTCM Please Do Not Hit The Computer Monitor????
HTH Hope This Helps!!! (Eric's catchcry!)
MAD ?????

A

Reply 6 offered by: Ken Mund on 09-Jun-1998

MAD would be short for "MADMARSU" I presume?

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1998

LOL :-)
PDNHTCM = "Please Do Not Hesitate To Contact Me"
MAD=Marsupilami A... & D... (in French... in English it'd be MND. Less fun)

Sorry for this <:-|

Andrew, is there lyrics on your courante (Praetorius' one) or is it only a wind quartet ?

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew Ballard on 05-Jul-1998

Squeaky or not, I rather agree with the original post. I added this request to the wishlist a while ago, and have yet to see it implemented.


#634: SB AWE32 Full duplex?
SB AWE32 Full duplex?

(634)

Submitted by: Jonas Vreintaal on 24-May-1998

Does Sound Blaster AWE32 have full duplex?

Well, I cant etc play a wavefile and record one at the same time.. and I don´t if it is me, or the card.. It comes a message that the device is busy..( I have marked the Full duplex option in Windows 95/System)

Hope someone know these things..

/Jonas

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 24-May-1998

I thought that the SB Cards did support full duplex, as they can do full duplex Inet phone etc.
However, Noteworthy Composer doesn't use Wave in/out at all. It uses midi for playing back and recording compositions.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 24-May-1998

Full duplex was a free software add on/update.
http://www.creaf.com and get the current drivers.

Reply 3 offered by: Chris Coon on 24-May-1998

You might be using WaveSynth. That does not allow wave files to play while midi files are if full duplex is enabled. (I know WaveSynth comes with AWE 64 but I don't know if it comes with AWE 32.)


#635: Beamed Notes
Beamed Notes

(635)

Submitted by: Rock Alberts on 24-May-1998

I have found that if I have a group of beamed notes
and then I insert text such as a dynamic marking
starting on a note other than the first one, that the
notes are unbeamed.

Any suggestions on working around this problem?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 24-May-1998

Two quick ideas come to mind:
1) Start at the left of the group of notes and pad the text with spaces (with Preserve Width OFF, obviously :)
2) Climb up from a stave below, or down from a stave above.

A


#636: Problem with drum staff
Problem with drum staff

(636)

Submitted by: normand on 24-May-1998

I have many files with different tunes. When I try to play each files
(one after the other), it's make a big mix sound... If I have a tune
with a drum track (in the staff 10), often these track sound like and
other with an other sound (like piano for example).

I really don't know what's happen but I think that when I change a tune
for another, the software not "understand" that it's a new tune and all
the parameters must be at "zero".

Please help me, I must make a show in one week ...

Thank's !

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-May-1998

Is NWC your playback device?
If so click Stop after playback is complete to reset the sound output.
If your using a juke box type player I guess it might not reset.
Try putting a program change - playback instrument at the start of each staff.
I hope your drums are on Channel 10 not staff 10.

Otherwise - cant help.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-May-1998

You can also press the R key to go to Score Review. Make sure that you have a sound patch assigned to every staff with a unique MIDI channel (staves that are not assigned a MIDI instrument patch show a --- in the Patch column).

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 26-May-1998

I have found that it is helpful to have the midi channel 10 (drums) set with the sound as acoustic piano. This sets the drums to a basic rock kit, and stops any other drum patches (if they are available like in Wingroove) from sounding when they shouldn't be.

Reply 4 offered by: Chen on 27-May-1998

Talking of drum tracks, can I display a drum track using crosses instead of normal note?

Chen

Reply 5 offered by: Chen on 02-Jul-1998

huh?

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 03-Jul-1998

Chen,
no you can't *yet*.
Unless you modify the NWCV15.TTF font to display a X instead of O filled with Fontographer or such tool ;^)

HTH
    MAD


#637: Extra midi controllers
Extra midi controllers

(637)

Submitted by: Chris Coon on 24-May-1998

Is there any possible way to insert a midi controller into a Noteworthy composer song (Pitch Bend, Modulation, etc.) even unnofficially?

Also, is there any way to use an instrument not in the General MIDI library (like a patch #128 or >) I have a midi renderer that allows extra instruments and whenever I want to use a different library, I have to switch them. If I could add instruments, it would be a whole lot easier. (by using the same library)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-May-1998

The MIDI spec only supports 128 MIDI patches. It is physically impossible to directly select more than 128. However, when combined with the Bank Select feature, many more possible patch changes are addressable, assuming your sound card supports them. See your sound card docs to see if you have the option of using more than just General MIDI patch changes.

Some MIDI controller values can be set via the Multi-point Controller (such as Pitch bend).


#641: Feedback
Feedback

(641)

Submitted by: Corey on 25-May-1998

can you make guitar feedback?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 25-May-1998

There is a General Midi instrument called harmonic guitar.
I've tried using Multipoint controllers to crossfade from distortion or overdrive guitar to harmonic guitar, but the effect is pretty dismal. I'd suggest you have a go, I may have been doing something wrong.

Andrew


#642: Noteworthy on a Notebook.
Noteworthy on a Notebook.

(642)

Submitted by: Adam Bodkin on 26-May-1998

Well, I finally bought myself a notebook, and NWC runs perfectly on it. In fact the general viewing and clarity is better than on my PC. I use Wingroove as a driver, and the Notebook has Windows 98. If any of you are comsidering using NWC on a Notebook, make sure it has a TFT screen, and you can't go wrong! Thanks for the help in deciding on a Notebook, Eric.
Adam

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-May-1998

Yes, it is very useful to be able to take the music where I want to play it. But my "SoundBlaster Pro Compatible" sound card is not that great, and there is no way to upgrade it. I play piano pieces with a vocal line (using a flute). There is a choice of two drivers: FM synthesis produces an OK piano and a bad flute, or the other does a decent flute but a very dull sounding piano. Still, for me it is the only way to go.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 26-May-1998

In msg #558 'noel' was trying to connect up external MIDI and enquired about cabling etc. I now know he has a Compaq LTE notebook. Have either of you (Adam or Blair, or anyone else for that matter) interfaced your notebooks with MIDI instruments? Did you have any problems with connections? I'm sure noel would like to know, and as I'm getting a notebook this summer, I'd like to be forewarned of any problems before I buy.

Thanks, Peter.

PS Nice to know NWC runs perfectly - not that I would have expected otherwise from such a sound program! Thanks for the advice re TFT screen.

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 26-May-1998

I havn't tried hooking up to midi with the notebook, but it does have a joystick port, so I suppose it should work. I was only using Wingroove on it, as that's the only sounds I needed, but I'll give it a try and let you know what happened.
Adam

Reply 4 offered by: Howard Chambers on 06-Jun-1998

I also have a note book computer that I use with the program.
It is a Compaq Presario 1210 notebook and I like being able to
move my computer around with me easily. It did not have a
joystick/midi port but I was able to locate a product by
Opcode which is a midi trasnlator to PC. It plugs into the
printer port instead and works great.

Reply 5 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 06-Jun-1998

Howard,

I would be grateful for more details of the midi translator
by opcode. Do you know anything else about it.

How much ? Where ? net address ?

Thanks

Richard

Reply 6 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 12-Jun-1998

The Notebook I bought has a joystick port on the back, so I plugged in a midi adapter cable, and it worked fine. The Notebook I bought was a cheapy second hand, but it seems to have evrything (and more) than my main desktop. I guess I was just lucky.
Adam

Reply 7 offered by: Howard Chambers on 24-Jun-1998

The Notebook I had bought did not have the joystick port. They offered me one that would plug into the PC Card slot but it was only for joysticks and not midi, that was why I went this way and had no problems.

Reply 8 offered by: Bart Sills on 27-Jun-1998

I'm using Noteworthy on my Toshiba laptop and use Portman PC/P interface to connect via the printer port to my midi keyboard. Works great.

Reply 9 offered by: Bart Sills on 27-Jun-1998

I'm using Noteworthy on my Toshiba laptop and use Portman PC/P interface to connect via the printer port to my midi keyboard. Works great.


#643: Stem direction
Stem direction

(643)

Submitted by: Chen on 27-May-1998

Hullo,

I import a midi file and notes above the middle line of a staff with a treble clef have notes with stems going up. In some staves it does this and sometimes it doesn't. I consider this a major fault.
The standard is that notes on C (the notes above the middle line) have their stems going down. If I can configure this somewhere that would be good.

Also, is there a reference somewhere for the order that orchestral parts should be placed in? I know there is a standard but I forget.

Chen

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 27-May-1998

I'm sure Eric will have something to say about note stems, but if note stems are irking you after import (I can't imagine why they would be stem up, but anyway...) use Tools | Audit Note Stems to fix them.

If you have access to the newsgroup, there has been a lot of talk about orchestral parts, about six months ago, including files of standard written ranges for parts.

Regards,
Andrew

PS: I'll get the files up on my web site within a week, and let the forum know.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-May-1998

All notes that are not beamed use the default stem direction after MIDI import. The default stem direction for notes above center on a staff is downward. The only exception to this is when a note is beamed to other lower notes. In this case, the stem may go upward based on the overall wieght of all of the notes in the beam. If you know of an exception to this in the behaviour of NWC, send the example to our support for review.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1998

Chen,
In order to save space as well for better design, it is NOT a fault to write 3rd-line notes with stem up or down. I think you agree with this. For notes above, IMHO it may be good practice to keep the stem down when beamed to other notes lower. Even when (in treble clef) you have B-D-C-B sequence, it may be better for the reader to write them stem down, namely when surrounded by lower sequences. This allows the "graphic" part to be smoother. And often to enhance readability.

Just on the reader point of view.

Reply 4 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 09-Jun-1998

And whilst we're on the subject of stems, do not have a chord with stems going in different directions if you also want the chord to be staccato.

The staccato bit doesn't work with mixed stems, they must all point in the same direction in order to get a staccato chord.

Richard


#645: Compiling?
Compiling?

(645)

Submitted by: Steve Fissel on 30-May-1998

I am making a piece of music and whenever I hit the play
button, the program stops responding, I get the hourglass
and my screen freezes with:
"Compiling . . ." at the bottom
I am getting very, very frustrated.
If you want to check the file, I've uploaded it to:
http://www.islandnet.com/~sfissel/Heroic.nwc
(case sensitive)

thanks in advance

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 30-May-1998

This is a bug, but you can easily avoid it. Goto bar 26 (Ctrl+G, then type 26 and press enter). Insert a "Local Repeat Open" bar line somewhere after the previous "Local Repeat Close (3)" bar. This tells the repeat at the end of bar 30 where to repeat back to in the staff.

We will add preventative measures into the next release of NWC such that the computer lockup for such a long time is avoided.

I hope this helps in your evaluation.


#646: Instrument patches
Instrument patches

(646)

Submitted by: Lyndon Griffin on 31-May-1998

Is there a better way - or maybe just an optimization:
In the midst of a score it is necessary to change from bowed instruments (violin, viola, cello, etc.) to pizzicatto strings for a few measures, and then back. I used the Insert>Instrument Patch option, which was great, until I tried to revert to the original instrument through use of another instrument patch. The resulting instruments sound dull and "cloudy." This is not the desired effect - I need them to be bright and clear.
Technical specs - I'm using v1.51a (licensed). My score contains 22 instruments, and at at least one point, they all play simultaneously. I have all the strings (5 staves) playing back on channel 16, which seems the appropriate channel for my AWE64 Gold. Nothing else is on that channel.
Thanks in advance!

<:) Lyndon

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Jun-1998

It does not matter how you assign your instrument patch. If you set it in the Staff Properties (F2), and change it with Insert Instrument Patch, and then change it back to the original set in Staff Properties, it should now sound exactly as it did the first time (the MIDI messages sent to your sound card are the same no matter which way you do it).

It is possible to have differing results on different MIDI channels if you are using the MIDI Mapper. In some system configurations, the MIDI Mapper will assign different device drivers to different channels (for example, channels 1 through 10 to the WaveTable device, and 11 through 16 to the FM Synthesizer). In this case, you have two options:

1) Change your play back device to directly use the synth that you want to use for play back

2) change your MIDI mapper configuration


#647: Can you change the stem size?
Can you change the stem size?

(647)

Submitted by: Zach on 01-Jun-1998

Can you change the size of note stems in Noteworthy Composer?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 01-Jun-1998

No this is totally automatic and accords with the principles of writing music

Richard


#648: Measures
Measures

(648)

Submitted by: Zach on 01-Jun-1998

Is their a way to stop noteworthy from only ending a line with a complete measure?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 01-Jun-1998

I do not believe so.

I remember singing from some music recently (a copy of Mozart's requiem -Barenriter version)
where the publisher decided that in order to save space, they would end a line of music mid way through a bar.

This was very uncomfortable to sing from and I would not recommend or wish Noteworthy to act in this way .
It did force you count all the way through but you tend to expect the beginning of a line of music to be the first beat, not the third or fourth.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 02-Jun-1998

Starting and ending pieces (and sections of pieces) with parts of bars is very common. I might even guess that it is more common than starting and ending with whole bars. However, individual lines other than the first and last lines of sections are generally complete bars.

The convention is that if, for example, the piece is in 3/4 and starts halfway through beat 2 (i.e. 3 quavers up-beat) it ends in the same place. (i.e. the final bar will have 1 and 1/2 beats in it)

NWC can handle this as you are free to put bar lines wherever you like. However, if you use "Audit Bar Lines"
NWC assumes that the first bar starts on beat one and moves the bar lines accordingly. To get round this, add sufficient rests to make bar one start on beat one before doing an Audit Bar Lines. Then delete the superfluous rests at the start and make sure the last bar is the right length.

Stephen


#649: exporting
exporting

(649)

Submitted by: charlotte on 02-Jun-1998

is it possible to export a noteworthy file to a lotus wordpro file, and if so how do you do it?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Jun-1998

You can use the Print Preview, Copy feature, and the Edit, Copy Special feature to do this kind of thing. You will need the NWC font to be available on any system that views the document that you create.

See also msg #140, msg #431, and msg #528


#652: Muting a range of notes
Muting a range of notes

(652)

Submitted by: Ramon Pajares Box on 02-Jun-1998

Is it possible to mute a range of notes in a staff? I know I can mute the whole staff but it is sometimes useful to be able to stop the sound of some notes while still maintaining them in the score.

I've tried to change to sound patch 0 in General MIDI but this has no effect: the last patch specified in the staff continues to sound. It would be very useful if we could do as in programming code: a line can be commented out instead of being erased and it produces no effect when the program runs or compiles but remains written for future reference.

When working with large orchestral scores in NWC it is easy to reach the maximum polyphony of the sound card. My AWE64 is 64 voices polyphonic, although its true limits are more akin to 32 than to 64. Since a patch can use more than one voice, when playing back orchestral tutti, some instruments do not sound. Which? Only the sound card knows. But I prefer to control that myself and then it would be great if I could void or comment out a range of notes in some staves without erasing the notes themselves which I need there when printing (or when trying other arrangements).

TIA for any hint about this.

(Please visit http://www.nil.es/rpajares/

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Jun-1998

Try setting the volume/velocity to zero for the range of the muted part.
Perhaps use ppp and override the default - setting it to zero.
Bring the volume up again with another dynamic when you want it to be heard.

Incidentally - I use an SB16 and I find that the polyphony improves if you shift the attack times of the unison notes a few ticks apart.
Unfortunately you cant do this with NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Jun-1998

And...

You might thicken the tutti a little if you enter a Multi Point Controller for Pitch with values of -10 to +10 on the voices around the lead.
This could avoid the in tune flanging effect.

Reply 3 offered by: Ramon Pajares Box on 03-Jun-1998

Thank you for your hints, Barry.

I'll try setting volume and velocity to zero and the Pitch Wheel effect for tutti, although usually I need not to thicken but to clean (to make more crystal-like) my tutti, at least with my card.

Can you elaborate a little more on the tune flanging effect? I'm not sure I understand what it is.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Jun-1998

See also msg #57, msg #578, msg #611


#653: Q: repear bar inside a measure?
Q: repear bar inside a measure?

(653)

Submitted by: Herbert Tsang on 05-Jun-1998

Is it possible to put a repeat bar inside a measure and not messes up the measure counting.

For example
in 4/4 AAAAA | AAAA | BBBB | A |: BB :| C |
where A B and C are quarter note, | is bar line and |: is repeat section. In this example there should be a total of 4 measures not 5......

Is this a bug?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-Jun-1998

Any bar line with notes to the left is considered a valid measure, and as such, will increment the measure count.

Reply 2 offered by: Herbert Tsang on 05-Jun-1998

So this is a bug then.
The problem is that in some cases you don't want the repeat sign become a bar line. For example in the case when you have to repeat and it is not at the end of a full measure. Noteworthy will count that as seperate measure, not correct.

Reply 3 offered by: kent dugan on 05-Jun-1998

This goes against the conventions for copying music. Any partial bars are difficult to read, and just asking for trouble. Besides, it's quicker to finish the bar properly and then use the expected repeat then to learn how to use the fudge factor.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 06-Jun-1998

The example above (I'll repeat it here to save you scrolling around)
4/4 AAAAA | AAAA | BBBB | A |: BB :| C |
would be very difficult to read and I wonder why you would bother setting it to 4/4! Is this some new way of scripting music?
I can't see why it's not 6 uneven measures.
If you want to bar it up that way, why not make it plain with time sigs of 5/4 4/4 4/4 1/4 2/4 and 1/4?

Andrew

Reply 5 offered by: Herbert Tsang on 08-Jun-1998

Maybe I didn't make myself clear, the example that I have used is just an example to demonstrate the problem/limitation of the software which is counting measure incorrectly.
If you are interested in a "real" example, take "Bourree" from the Water Music as an example:
A | A A A A | etc etc | A (dotted half) :||: A | A A A A |
A A A A | etc etc | B (dotted half note) :|
The software count the measure | A (dotted half :||: A| as 2 seperate measures, which is incorrect. There is noting wrong to do this "partial measure", and it is very common.

Reply 6 offered by: John Gillings on 09-Jun-1998

I think I see what Herbert is talking about. When starting
with an anacrucious (sp?) with a repeat back to the
beginning he ends up with partial bars.

I think this issue is usually dealt with as follows:

A |: AAAA | etc etc | AAA A :|

in other words, the first note is repeated as the last note
in the last bar of the repeat section. You may need to use
first and second time bars to connect to the next section.
The result is that only the very first and very last bars
are incomplete. Noteworthy will certainly allow this and I
think it's more likely to be acceptable to readers.
Personally, I think I'd have a lot of trouble with a repeat
in the middle of a bar!

Reply 7 offered by: Herbert Tsang on 09-Jun-1998

Well John, your suggestion would work if the "pickup" note is the same for the 2nd section. It is not a good way to deal with the problem though and I have seen a lot of music that has a repear bar in the middle of the measure. So it is not at all uncommon.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1998

What is common is not necessarily normal.
Putting a repeat in the middle of a measure is never a good thing (even if engravers do so to save pages), for when you're reading music you prefer to concentrate on the music itself, not the syntax... I once saw a book that used so much ||: :||and |: :| imbricated that you had to think much before starting to read... Music should never be a labyrinth (maze) [unless in the "harmonic labyrinth" of J.S.Bach].
Just a musician thought.

NWCly yours,
MAD

Reply 9 offered by: Barry Graham on 10-Jun-1998

I appreciate the difficulty of trying to reproduce a score exactly but...
The first law of music copying is to keep it simple.
If you can avoid multiple repeats, segnos etc. particularly nested - it makes it easier for the performer.
When copying I use coloured highlighters to mark repeats, signs and codas each a different colour.
You dont want to waste studio time because someone misreads the part on every second take.
Bill Russo wrote the perfect axiom in his book - Composing for the Jazz Orchestra.

If want something played well, keep it simple - anything slightly difficult may not be played at all!

Reply 10 offered by: John Gillings on 11-Jun-1998

Herbert,

>your suggestion would work if the "pickup" note is the same
>for the 2nd section

That's what I meant about maybe needing a first and
second time bar. The last beat of the first time bar
contains the duplicated anacrucious note, the last beat
of the second time bar is the first note of the second
phrase. Over the 30 years or so that I've been reading
music I cannot recall ever having seen a repeat in the
middle of a bar, so it can't be *that* common! I've often
seen the structure I described in my previous post.

Just a question - where is your opening repeat? Is it
assumed to be the beginning?

Reply 11 offered by: Herbert Tsang on 11-Jun-1998

Haha, I can't say that I have 30 years of experience in reading music, however, in my years of playing in chamber music, orhestral music, it is very common.

For example, when I open up a score of Handel's "Royal Fireworks" I can find quite a few examples (Movements: Bouree, La Rejouissance, etc etc). The same with "Water Music" (Movements: Bouree, Aria, Menuet etc etc) Plus many many more examples. If you have a few minuets, go to the local library and check out the above score, and you will see what I am talking about.

To answer your question,opening repeat is assumed in the beginning.

Enjoyed!

Reply 12 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 12-Jun-1998

I just tried entering the notes as written above, and NWC played it back exactly the way I would have played it if I saw it written. Maybe my copy of NWC is broken :-)
Adam

Reply 13 offered by: Herbert Tsang on 12-Jun-1998

Well, the problem that is in dicsussion is not the correctness of playing the music back but rather the measure number being count incorrectly.

Reply 14 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 12-Jun-1998

I see what you mean. What do you do if you compress rests, or don't you have more than 1 bars rest in your music? I use rehearsal letters, rather than bar numbers. It makes rehearsal of NWC scores so much easier.
Adam

Reply 15 offered by: Herbert Tsang on 13-Jun-1998

Well, using rehearsal letters is good idea, but having correct measure number is also necessary.

I am not sure if I understand what do you mean by "compress rests".....

Reply 16 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 14-Jun-1998

It's just a method that I (and I'm sure many others) use when there is more than 1 bars rest. I seperate the part to a seperate score, and if there is more than 1 bars rest, I just leave it as a 1 bar rest, and use the text tool to write how many bars rest it should be. Makes things easier to read for musicians.
Adam

Reply 17 offered by: Herbert Tsang on 16-Jun-1998

Yeah, this compressed rest idea is good, wonder how come it is not a feature in noteworthy, maybe somone can submit it to the wish list. :)

Reply 18 offered by: Chris on 17-Jun-1998

I am crossing my fingers hoping that NWC have compressed rests in the next, or at least, some future release. I have used other notation software that groups multi-measure rests when pulling out individual parts. If NWC adds this, I think many users will find it to be a great feature!!

Reply 19 offered by: X on 17-Jun-1998

Heh! I'll quartet that motion for that feature.

Reply 20 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1998

Why do you want to limit this to rests only ? Never play bass guitar ? Sometimes you have 32 times the same measure (rap), and it's rather useful in that case too... I agree that a correct numbering would be great !
But Chris, uncross your fingers, it ain't easy to use the kbd ;^)

MAD


#654: Converting midis to wav files
Converting midis to wav files

(654)

Submitted by: Kubilay on 08-Jun-1998

Anybody using midi to wav converters? I need some reccomendations for the best software
Thanks a lot

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 08-Jun-1998

I simply use the softs that came along with Windows. That's enough for my needs. Not enough though if you want to convert a serie of .mid, of course, but simply enough to make BIG .wav with (much) smaller .["mid"|"nwc"] :-)
The only parameter is to adjust the record volume, and the midi playback volume(s).

HTH, Mad

P.S. When I need to modify .wav, I generally use GoldWave. An "old" version (1995 I think) (much disk space saved).

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 08-Jun-1998

Marsu's right, Kubilay. In my case I use CoolEdit, but you could just as easily use Windows' SoundOLE or WaveStudio (if you have a Creative Labs card). You simply turn off all sound inputs (for recording) except Midi. Start recording, start playing the midi, and wait 'til all is done.
NB: 16bit sound is twice as big as 8bit.
22kHz sample rate is twice as big as 11kHz
Stereo is twice as big as mono.
So good quality is 8 times as big as bad, but there are trade offs that you can make to save some space.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1998

For smaller size, independantly of your technical choices (mono/st., freq., ...) you can choose to compress your .WAV files. I think that CCITT µLaw is a good choice.
HTH.
. MAD

Reply 4 offered by: kubilay on 15-Jun-1998

Here is the detailed version of my question. I wrote a song
with noteworthy 1.51a and import it to midi. It contains
only drum and bass. I used wingroove to convert this midi
to wav file and mixed it with a nother wave file with
cooledit96. I also used yamahaxg50 wavetable. Then the
toroubles appeared. Some of the notes were converted incorrectly.
Such as snare roll became something else. I guess that wingooove
won't make any problem if I use general midi drum format not
the yamaha but if you know any other good converter I will be pleased.
thanks a lot to you guys for your kind help.
Kubilay / TURKEY

Reply 5 offered by: A. DeDomenico on 03-Jan-100

I hear that WavMaker is a program that converts MIDI to Wav
It's $49 US. They have a demo version, but it doesn't provide all the files. You can convert the MIDI files they proivide, but not your own.

Reply 6 offered by: yotang on 29-Feb-2000

Hi! It's from japan.I visited the site of "WaveMaker",
but it seems to be closed.(I couldn't find it.)
Could you show me where I have to visit to get "WaveMaker"?

Reply 7 offered by: yotang on 02-Mar-2000

Sorry! I found it! I just made a mistake "WaveMaker" for
"WavMaker".Thanks everybody!

Reply 8 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 9 offered by: Riceboy Sway on 05-Jun-2001

I have wavemaker and it doesn't help you at all unless you have a intrument hooked up into your computer.I'm thinking this though if you wanted to turn a midi file into a regular music file why would you need a converter if you have to use your keyboard anyway.


#655: soundfont
soundfont

(655)

Submitted by: Thomas on 08-Jun-1998

HI !
I am Tom
and I'm looking for any one to exchange soundfont files or
maybe some info on home made musik.
Well...just send your e-mail at:
gothness@usa.net

Reply 1 offered by: Sterghios on 08-Aug-1998

Hi Tom, I have a soundfont CD, the one that Creative Labs
sell. Should you be interested, please reply. Also, it
would be very interesting to talk with another NWC user!
Hey, I also need to get some info on how to use these babies
to get more (and better) sounds. Could you help?

Reply 2 offered by: stephen brown on 25-Apr-1999

I have close to 300 sf2 soundfonts collected from the far reaches of the internet. I would be willing to trade. If you have even a few that I like you can have 10 for every one of yours. I just don't want to try and e-mail everything I have cause it would take too long. I particularly like big sf files with very natural acoustic instruments, world or orchestral, stereo and sampled at several velocities. Also exotic sound efx, bells chimes, etc. My holiest quest involves the elusive glass harp an instrument built by Benjamin Franklin. It's tonality is approximated by running a wet finger around a wine glass.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 26-Apr-1999

About glass harp: it seems to me that it is an old austrian/bohemian (referring to boheme, south germany) instrument, much time before B.Franklin came to it. I'll try toverify its history tonite. But I'm sure Richard or Andrew may help us about this :-)

MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Apr-1999

You were both right. Here's some info on the "Glass Armonica" (later "Harmonica"), which is the instrument Franklin invented (or rather, perfected), and for which Mozart wrote his famous quintet:

http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/7597/history.htm

The glass harp is a two-dimensional variation on the same idea... making it easier to play chords. The same site has an html page on this instrument at:

http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/7597/glasshrp.htm

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Apr-1999

Oops... forgot the exclamation point to make the links work. Here the are again, with feelin':

Glass Armonica:
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/7597/history.htm

Glass Harp:
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/7597/glasshrp.htm

For RealAudio sound clips:
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/7597/samples.htm


#656: Finding the wish list
Finding the wish list

(656)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 09-Jun-1998

Where do I add something to the official wish list?

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 09-Jun-1998

From NoteWorthy home page, click on NoteWorthy Composer, and on the next screen, the wish list is along the left side in the blue area. Saw the other entries first, so also posted this elsewhere.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

you can also use this : http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm :-)


#657: space-wasting measure bars
space-wasting measure bars

(657)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 09-Jun-1998

I am evaluating your program for lyrics-heavy use. It
compares very favorably to other budget-sized programs in
both ease of use and quality of output. Compared to
commercially published songs, though, it wastes a lot of
horizontal space. The single biggest offender is the
vertical bar, which is normally 1 pixel wide: that is, two
quarter notes separated by a vertical bar are no further
apart than two notes not so separated. This would seem to
be a very easy change, would often save 5-15% of the space.
Is there any reason not to allow skinny bars? or to have
that as the default?


#658: Space-consuming dashes in lyrics
Space-consuming dashes in lyrics

(658)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 09-Jun-1998

Another space-consuming issue is the dash in multiple-
syllable words in lyrics. If a non-ultimate-syllable is the
longest syllable for a note of all the lines of lyrics, it
would be nice to see the dash, and spaces around it, squeezed
out. I tried to work around this by combining syllables in
the other lines of lyrics, but that required visible slurs
in the music--not acceptable. This also would seem an easy
change?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

Stephen,
I ain't sure of what U want.
Do you want that the hyphen that separates syllables disappear ?
In that case the solution is obvious : Do not use an hyphen, use a space instead (though I'm afraid this risks to confuse the reader, especially when lyrics are in a foreign language).

HTH,
          MAD

Reply 2 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 12-Jun-1998

In every piece of vocal music I have ever seen, if more than one note has only one syllable, it is always slurred.
Adam

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 12-Jun-1998

I can tell you that in Bach chorals, it ain't the case. Guess it's a lazyness of JSBach or of the engraver, but it is all the book long.
That had lead me to write A-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-le(...)-lu(...)-ia in the BWV 225 (?) : "Singet des Herrn ein neues Lied" that I sung last year. But that was the only way because of the very long (more than 48 measures sometimes) the avoid a slur that would not mean very much. Because I guess no one can do all this in one breath !!

However when it's just for 2 or three notes, it's better to slur them.
Dominique


#659: Floating lyrics
Floating lyrics

(659)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 09-Jun-1998

In commercial music, a syllable of the lyrics is ideally
centered under the note. The advantage of this is that even
a very long syllable need not expand the whole line if it
is preceded and followed by shorter syllables. (And the
shorter syllables would be offset to left or right to make
a little more room.)

Cakewalk appears to center lyrics, although I don't know if
it compresses where needed, or if it shifts to improve
compression (I doubt the latter.) But overall, your
interface and presentation both look better; and I
__really__ like your evaluation demo approach....

I think I can tell what you are doing: left-aligning all the
sync-ed entities, and I know this approach would be harder.
But is it possible for consideration?

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 09-Jun-1998

At the home page, click on Noteworthy, then at the left side of the page where you'll see "wish list.' That's where you have to enter the requests.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

Stephen,
One thing you can do to gain space is to use a more compressed font. This will save space for sure.
About centering, I think this could be an option --I'll make a wish unless you did yourself (please let me know)-- but I have to say that lyrics are now correctly left-aligned. This was not the case in 1.3x versions and earlier when one note has (or hasn't) an alteration (#, b or natural).
But if you want to make high-quality scores, doing whatever you want with lyrics placement, every musical symbol and so on, NWC is not for you. YET. Just a matter of time... I know it since the 1.10 and it drastically changed since then ! Thanx to the shareware concept and the efficiency of Eric.

Good evaluation,
MAD (happy reg'd user)


#660: Accidental alignment
Accidental alignment

(660)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 09-Jun-1998

In commercially printed music, sharp/flat/natural symbols
are placed ahead of a note, in the "open space" after the
last note: and the notes themselves are placed the same
way regardless of whether there are intervening accidental
symbols. This makes the file slightly more compact, and,
I think, "looks better." Is this a possible enhancement?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

As some other people already said, you could add this kinda topic in the wish list (http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm).
And if you REALLY want to gain space, use the Copy option in the Previez window and use Xpress or so.
If you really want to have to place yourself each item, use SCORE (a dos program that allows you whatever you want but you have to manage it, but it also has a powerful macro engine in it). Two years ago, some people were talking about a W95 version soon...;-)

More seriously, in commercially printed music, the engravers have the BAD habit to compress some sequences not regarding their duration (respecting the vertical alignment though, of course) and this can result into hard-to-read sheets. I usually prefer small efficient programs (such as NWC ;-)), but sometimes smallness is against comfort... Never forget the final user, the customer :
- As a reader, I don't care if my booklet has 64 or 68 pages.
- That's not my problem.
- But i higly prefer that the score be readable, thanks to 4 more pages out of 68...

NWCly,
                  MAD


#661: Noteworthy Player-Printer? Portable Scores
Noteworthy Player-Printer? Portable Scores

(661)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 09-Jun-1998

I am generating scores for people, but do not want them to
have to incur any additional expense to use them.
NoteWorthy Player is great for listeners--and the
price is perfect--but doesn't have "print" capability. NWC
is very reasonably priced for developers, but is more than
I want users to pay... Copying and pasting into
$hundreds-of-dollars MS-Word, or even Word Perfect,
are right out. Bitmaps chew up disk space, and don't
print beautifully like NWC does...

What is the recommended way to generate good-quality,
portable scores generated by NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Jun-1998

One way is to include an evaluation copy of NoteWorthy Composer with each score - that's the shareware way.
If the people agree with you - that it is the best notator for the least cost available anywhere - how could they resist registering.
Particularly when they get an added bonus of being able to create their own scores.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 10-Jun-1998

But, alas! I think the evaluation version has "Unregistered Copy of Noteworthy Composer" or something like that, doesn't it? (It HAS been a long time since I registered).

As suggested elsewhere, you could save page by page (using copy off the print preview dialog) and paste the copied results into a drawing program, then saving the file as a windows metafile. I believe Win 95 will print these directly from Explorer, though I may be wrong.

Not much solid advice there, but holefully it'll get you on the way to where you want to go.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

Andrew, Barry, Stephen,
The way Barry indicated is good. In my memory, the unregisted scores were printed with text "Unregistered NoteWorthy Composer Score Print" added to each staff (somewhat above), and (c) info replaced by its'. This was true in 1.10 version, now I just checked (to try, rename %Windows%\NWRgstry.ini to _*.*) with an unregistered version.
In case of a registered-user score, it prints normally.
In case of a self-created (so unreg'd) score, it adds the stuff I mentioned plus an order form first.

So if Stephen wants to distribute scores (as a reg'd user himself), he can just send along NWCSetup along. Users will be able to print any reg'd-user score as a reg'd user, but not for theirs.

Stephen, just have a try with http://www.mygale.org/05/madmarsu/absalon.zip (copyright Dominique Portier (me) (I did it by ear, so do not claim if you find errors in it. I still work on it btw).

HTH,
    NWCly,
                MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 12-Jun-1998

I would suggest that is a good way as well, however it would be good to add a little encouragement for the user to register the program. Surely the 40 odd dollars for the program isn't too much to ask, (unless you are charging an unbelieveable amount for the scores:-)
Adam

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 12-Jun-1998

I'm not planning to charge anything for the scores. If my
target user was someone who wanted to hear the music, I would
give them NWP [and, of course, a well-deserved plug for NWC]
with the files. They could listen to anything free...This
may be the most common user for most developers.

But my target is someone who would occasionally print a few
copies and have a group sing from them. This they cannot do
free: NWC allows 30 days free use, which might be a couple
of uses. After that, ethically speaking, they must pay.

And I do not want to require anyone to spend money to use
my work.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 12-Jun-1998

Oops. Completely forgot the 30days limit. But its soooo long I reg'd... I ain't even sure that the limit existed at that time. Guess so though.
However, is it 30 calendar days or 30 *different* days using it ? In the latter case that would mean at least 30 printouts :-) surely enough, ain't it ?

But what you could do is to add this to the wish list : a NWPrinter as there is a NWPlayer :-)

NWCly yours

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 14-Jun-1998

Seems to me there's an important point being overlooked here! Most unregistered programs (not just music notators)don't allow print or save at all. Noteworthy Artware are extremely enlightened in allowing this, even more so in not defacing printouts - other notators scatter unregistered messages all over the place. 30 days free trial is enough time for someone to print out thousands of copies if they so wished. Software of the standard of NWC takes countless hours of work to design and program - I don't think we should take it for granted!

Reply 8 offered by: Steve on 18-Jun-1998

I think NoteWorthy should consider an additional version that prints. Consider Adobe Acrobat - the creators buy the writer, and everyone else can get a free version that prints.

Heh. And NoteWorthy would have a trio then:
composer
player
printer / writer


#662: Beamed Notes & Chord Symbols
Beamed Notes & Chord Symbols

(662)

Submitted by: Jon Featherstone on 10-Jun-1998

The problem of Chord symbols inserted as teXt between two beamed notes unfortunately (and incorrectly) removes the beam.
I have found the work-around of entering the chord symbols as Lyrics, and selecting "Top" positioning. For chords with no symbol, I insert an underscore. This method eliminates all the alignment nightmares of other methods.

Jon F

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

I found a limitation to this (excellent) method : when you need to have GuitarChords AND lyrics.
Typically you'd like to have chords above and lyrics below. So even with 2 lyrics lines it won't work.
If the experimental feature (staff layering namely) is kept, no problem : you just have to duplicate the score, superpose them and put chords above on one, and lyrics on bottom on the other.

Hope this helps.
                                MAD


#663: Breath mark
Breath mark

(663)

Submitted by: marsu on 10-Jun-1998

Eric and any NWC user,
I'd like to have your opinion about breath marks.
In classical music a breath mark doesn't alter the tempo (i.e. it does not induces extra time to breathe indeed), rather you have to cut off the previous note (making a quarter become somewhat a dotted eight).
In NWC if you specify a duration (Delay), the effect is to act is if you add a Fermata just AFTER the note.

Is it normal ? I mean is this understood like that by any musician ??? Eric, Andrew, your opinion would be greatly appreciated :-)

NWCly yours,
                      MAD (HRU (HappyReg'dUser :-)))

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Jun-1998

In NWC, you can specify a delay for the breath mark, but this is, in fact, completely optional (in some performances, it is accurate to have a delay over and above the tempo). You cannot get the breath mark to steal time from the note that preceeds it, so the delay is your only choice in this case.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 11-Jun-1998

OK, so fundamentally the comma type breath mark is there either to prevent total lung collapse of the performers, be they singers or wind players, or to indicate a slight pause in the flow of music. The more formal fermata extends the note to which it is attached. But unless the delay time is specified, it is very much up to the individual conductor or solo performer how they interpret the instruction. Sometimes as marsu points out strict tempo is maintained, but conversely the music may come to a complete halt. It very much depends on the mood of the music and the requirements of the performers.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 11-Jun-1998

I have seen fermata over both notes and bar lines (don't know how they'd go over barlines in NWC, never tried it). In NWC, I use breath marks if I want a pause at the end of the bar, or I tweak the tempo. I think that interpretation of tempo is normally left up to performer, and this would include pauses after breath marks. I hear that in shakuhachi playing, whilst every note must be played, the length of each note and the timing between them is totally up to the player, though I expect there are guidelines.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 12-Jun-1998

Just tried it. They're not at the place they should, I think : over the bar line (not preserving width of course). Should I add this to the wish list, or is there another list for bugs ?

Dominique

P.S. What is shakuhachi ?? I think it is a bamboo japanese flute, but ain't sure. As a flutist, I'd be interested in that subject :-)

Reply 5 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 12-Jun-1998

In every single music theory lesson I ever had, a pause (fermata) can only happen over either a rest or a note. A bar line in realistic terms is just a seperater to make music easier to read. If you have seen a pause over a bar line, it was probably meant to be over a rest of some sort. Sometimes I get a semi breve (whole note) rest with a pause over a bar line, when it is actually meant to be over a cotchet or quaver rest. I guess the transcriber was just lazy. (I must point out that I do this occasionally myself:-)
Adam

Reply 6 offered by: Batchman on 13-Jun-1998

Another thing about breath marks vs. fermatas: with a
multi-staff score, you have to assign the same duration
value to each fermata in the given point in the staff,
otherwise the parts won't all be delayed in sync. And if
you have the fermatas at different points (e.g. one staff
has a whole note and another has two half notes, and you
want to place the fermata over the first note in the
measure), it doesn't work. I've had to change whole notes
to tied half notes, for example, to get this to work.

Breath marks, on the other hand, work cumulatively. If you
want a delay of 1, you have to put it on exactly one of the
breath marks and leave the others as zero.

So why do fermata delays and breath mark delays work
differently from one another?

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 15-Jun-1998

I think that fermatas work cumulatively too. Just checked it, and they act as breath marks do.

MAD

P.S. I always affect a duration to only ONE fermat/b.mark. This avoids strange things to happen, and is simpler to manage. Even when you play only one staff, the f/b.m. on other staves have an effect with their own values.

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jun-1998

Breath marks and farmata delays work identically. Neither delay should be specified more than once for the same point in a song, since the effect is cumulative. Use a zero values where appropriate. If you have two half notes in one staff, and a whole note in another, each with a fermata, asssign the actual fermata delay to the part that accurately represents where the delay should occur (one the second half note, for example).

In extreme cases, you can always move your tempo control to another hidden staff and control tempo changes without altering the appearance of your actual scores.

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen Randall on 16-Jun-1998

Fermata over bar lines:

I've seen these over DOUBLE bar lines. My understanding is that this notation is used in two (similar) ways.

a) as an alternative to a Fine marking

b) to indicate an optional pause between movements.

Use a) is often used in marches where space is at a premium on march cards. The double bar with a fermata is where you stop after the Da Capo.

Use b) is often seen between movements of old waltzes. I suppose the idea is to let the old waltzers get their breath back beteween movements :)


#664: last bar line
last bar line

(664)

Submitted by: MAD on 11-Jun-1998

Is there a way to modify the last bar line ?
I sometimes use a :|| ending bar line, and NWC adds a || afterwards when this is the last measure. Is there a way to eliminate the latter ? Or is this conform to standard music notation ?
I noticed that if I add some white text to enlarge the last score (refer to msg #602#reply5 for details) I can superimpose the two last bar line (the :||onto the ||), but this seems a NWC bug --or rather undocumented feature for me in that case--.

Some clue someone ?

Marsu

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 11-Jun-1998

You are quite right, it isn't correct to have both types of barline at the end, and I am sure this has been mentioned before.

A similar problem occurs when you get a close repeat followed by an open repeat, when a spurious empty bar appears.

Reply 2 offered by: Marsu on 11-Jun-1998

I found what you mentionned in msg #119 (#reply2, "5)" item) and understood why you were sure :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 11-Jun-1998

As far as I know, these are bugs that are still waiting to be fixed by Eric (any comments, Eric?)
'Twould be nice to have them fixed, to be sure.

A

PS: With back to back repeats, I often make them look intentional by putting a section (rehearsal) mark in, or a performance comment, or something like that. Sometimes, however, this backfires and ends up dangling over the edge of the line!

Reply 4 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 12-Jun-1998

I believe a piece cannot end with a repeat sign. Usually a D.C Al Fine is used instead, or I use a 1st and 2nd time ending, even if the bar(s) are the same both times. Don't quote me on this, I've just never seen a repeat sign at the end of a piece before.
Adam


#665: Moving an item up
Moving an item up

(665)

Submitted by: Marsu on 11-Jun-1998

To make a note higher/lower, we all know that one just needs to select it (Shift+right), use Ctrl+Shift+Up(or down), and it's done.
Badly this won't work with items such as text, comma or fermata, ...
but there is a solution --again with the macro recorder.
I now use Alt+Up to move an item one position higher.
If people are interested in, I'll put it on my mygale page.

Anyway here is the kbd sequence to use when recording the macro :
(format is : Key #comment (ignore this))
Shift-Right      #select the item to your right. So you must be B4 it.
Ctrl-E           #open the Item Editor
Alt-S            #jump to the Staff position value
Up               # or down for the other macro (Alt+Down in that latter case)
Enter            # to valid and close window
Shift-Left       # to go back to the place before and unselect the item.

If you use only Left on the last step, this only deselects the item, leaving you to the right of it.
I prefer to go back (pour une fois !), for I can repeatly use the macro for successive moves of the same item.

Hope this helps you for quicker writing. I hope though that Eric will allow items to be moved the same way than notes do!

A last thing : be sure that you choose "quick"(?) speed, not "recorded"(?), in the macro properties box. This goes much more quicker !!! (sorry for the (?), but my macro recorder is in French, not in english, and ain't sure of the exact translation µ$oft used).

P.S. Contest Proposal (nothing to win but others NWC users consideration) : Submit your best macros :-) Limitation : the macro recorder is not clever :-( so you can't do things such as a generic enharmonicist (replacing B# by Cnatural as well as the reverse)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11-Jun-1998

Actually, I do have an enharmoniser or three... sort of.
One just turns a (f'rinstance) A# into a Bb by changing the # to a b and moving the (single or octave pair) note up one. Another does the opposite. A third I had did chord members, which I found VERY HANDY (once).
I created a ^7, ^8 and ^9 to naturalise, flatten and sharpen chord members. Very handy when transposing chords within a chord progression.
The transpose entity (as Marsu outlined above) was one of the very first things I ever put in my macros, and one I'd love Eric to make optional (I normally don't want to transpose text, decresc/cresc or some tempo and dynamic markings... but sometimes I do).

A

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Crossley on 17-Jun-1998

For those of us who have not yet graduated to macros, how do you invoke the macro recording facility when you are in NWC because I do not see a "REC" in any of the menus or toolbars.
Many thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 17-Jun-1998

The macro utility being talked about is the windows 3.1 keyboard recorder system.
The executable is recorder.exe and you have to run this program to record key depresses or
mouse actions. You can then play the sequence back at a much greater speed simply by pressing some pre defined keys.

Unfortunately, Microsoft have not release this product with windows 95 or NT but you can use the 3.1 version on these platforms.

Find a 3.1 system and copy the recorder.exe file.

Richard

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Crossley on 18-Jun-1998

Thanks Richard this puts me out of my misery.


#666: Frustrated  ~:(
Frustrated  ~:(

(666)

Submitted by: Bill Price on 11-Jun-1998

Here's what I want to do. I need to orchestrate for a
church orchestra. I created my own rhythm track to use as
a metronome and made a recording, but I can't figure out
the whole key signature/accidentals thing. When I entered
a key signature or attempted to transpose the newly
recorded staff, notes got re-written, sounded wrong, and
generally nothing worked. Has anyone written a step-by-
step approach to recording from a MIDI keyboard?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11-Jun-1998

I think this'll work every time.
1) Record your midi track
2) Tools | Force accidentals
3) Put the key sig at the front
4) Tools | Audit accidentals

Any comments anyone?

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Jun-1998

Bill - Is it possible that you transposed without first placing a C major key signature at the head of the staff.
If no key signature exists before transposition the result can become confused.


#667: arpagio
arpagio

(667)

Submitted by: Andy on 11-Jun-1998

Is there something like "arpagio" available in NoteWorthy Composer

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11-Jun-1998

Yes and no. :) :(
You can create a hidden (playing) staff with an explicitly notated arpeggio whilst on your (muted) display staff, you simply display the chord with an appropriate text glyph that indicates the arpeggio.

Or you can use tied grace notes in an upward sweeping chord. I've done this a few times and it doesn't look too bad. If you need to, you may be able to alter the tempo before and after with hidden tempo markers (I've not tried this).

A

PS: We're all waiting with bated breath for such handy items.

Reply 2 offered by: Andy on 12-Jun-1998

Thanks for the advice

Reply 3 offered by: Ron Scoville on 11-Apr-2001

See SCOVILLE #5 The Music will leave you.


#668: Polish version of NoteWorthy Composer
Polish version of NoteWorthy Composer

(668)

Submitted by: Andrzej Tomasiewicz on 11-Jun-1998

When can I expect Polish version of NoteWorthy Composer

Reply 1 offered by: Marsu on 12-Jun-1998

As soon as Eric will decide to create string-resource DLLs or Files in different languages. I already proposed him a french version.
Otherwise you can do the translation yourself on the .exe with a resource editor. Quite long and tiring though, since you'll have to do it each and new version.

Add it to the wish list : http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm !

Reply 2 offered by: Andy on 13-Jun-1998

If it is not too difficult maybe I could try to prepare Polish version.
Translating into Polish is not rather a big problem. Trouble could appear during programmnig.
Eric, what do you think about it?


#669: Enormous fonts
Enormous fonts

(669)

Submitted by: Andy on 12-Jun-1998

Letters on the buttons and forms are so large that they can't fit and it's difficult to read the text. How to decrease size of fonts. Problem appeared after loading new version of NoteWorthy Composer.

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 12-Jun-1998

Buttons and forms of what? If it's the font's in the actual program menus, that is a Window's issue, and not Noteworthy. Have you noticed the problem with other programs? Themes tends to cause Windows 95b to do this, if someone has put large font size in the theme. Also the accesability option in Control panel can cause this to happen. If the font problems are in the file (score) then just go to file, page setup, fonts then modify, and change all the file size fonts to your hearts content.
Adam

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Jun-1998

If you are not using version 1.51a, then you are not currently using the latest (it is currently 12-Jun-1998).

In version 1.50, new scores created from the internal <Blank Score> template default to a very large notation size. You can adjust this in the Page Setup options on the File menu. In version 1.51a, the default notation size is considerably smaller.

Reply 3 offered by: Andy on 12-Jun-1998

I have only problems with large fonts in NoteWorthy Composer. Not in scoring but in forms and menus in NWC.
All other programmes look to work OK. It is not a big problem but a little bit boring.
My version is 1.51a (latest one). I used 1.3x and had no such problems

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Jun-1998

NWC uses standard menus. They use the same font as any other conforming Windows program. The dialogs (forms) use two different techniques. You can switch between the two techniques from the Tools, Options, Editor, "Use light font in dialogs" option.

Reply 5 offered by: Andy on 15-Jun-1998

That was what I needed.
Thanks


#670: Notes
Notes

(670)

Submitted by: Jeff on 13-Jun-1998

How do I make a note on top of another?

E.G. - |O <-- First note
|
|O <-- Second note
|

Reply 1 offered by: christian wollin on 14-Jun-1998

To put a note on top or below another note, use shift + enter

Reply 2 offered by: christian wollin on 14-Jun-1998

Sorry about the first message. It should be Ctrl + Enter

Reply 3 offered by: Marsu on 15-Jun-1998

Also refer to the frequently asked questions @ http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/faq.htm :-) before submit such questions. You'll get an answer quickly. You could also use the Search item in the online help (F1).

Hope this helps for further usage.

MAD


#671: Saving as a MIDI
Saving as a MIDI

(671)

Submitted by: Jeff on 13-Jun-1998

How do I save my song as a MIDI?

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 13-Jun-1998

Choose File, export, and save as the file name you wish. Easy as that!
Adam


#672: Help me, please!
Help me, please!

(672)

Submitted by: Charlie on 14-Jun-1998

I have got a Hi-End 4-Bit Soundcard, and i do not know
how to use Ntworthy with it. I tried to configure it in the
registercard MIDI, but it did not functioned.

Help me please and sorry for my bed english.

Your Charlie

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 14-Jun-1998

I would suggest you try and get the card working as a straight midi device first. eg make sure that it plays something like canyon.mid with mplayer.exe which are normally found floating around in the windows directory.
Once you've got your midi system working, NWC should work fine.

Andrew


#673: Irritation
Irritation

(673)

Submitted by: Josh Brown on 14-Jun-1998

Is there anybody that is annoyed about some of the changes in Noteworthy Composer 1.51a?
I found the square that encircles the selected track to be very intrusive since it gets in the way of the notes you want to put in.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 14-Jun-1998

Then why don't you switch it off ?
Go to Tools Options Editor and then uncheck the Active Staff frame box.

No more frame - No more annoyance !

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 14-Jun-1998

Yes. Turning off the frame was the first thing I did in 1.51a!

A

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 14-Jun-1998

Geez. I use the program every day, and I didn't know that! I might play around with the options a bit more and see what other great things it can do :-)
Adam

Reply 4 offered by: John Gillings on 15-Jun-1998

I found the frame useful to show if your notes are outside
the "reserved" space for the staff. If you find it clashes
with notes, you should probably increase the vertical size
of the staff. The box also lets you know if you can reduce
the vertical size without crashing into other staves, but
without the need for trial and error.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 15-Jun-1998

Yes, the bax can help much to know whether you have to increase the up/down height. Use Ctrl-Right and you'll scroll quickly through all the length of the score, and now the box helps you to see if notes are too far easier.
But there are cases in which it is annoying.
Sometimes I dream that I can just change the height of the staff by draggin the box line...

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jun-1998

> Sometimes I dream that I can just change the height
> of the staff by draggin the box line...

Maybe the box was created in anticipation of something like this in the future... :)

Reply 7 offered by: Richard woodroffe on 15-Jun-1998

Wow !

Is this where we begin eagerly anticipating the next release ?

Richard


#674: One Quick Question
One Quick Question

(674)

Submitted by: ST on 15-Jun-1998

Right now NoteWorthy allows you to change several
MIDI controllers (pitch bend, stereo pan, etc...)

Is there any way to access other MIDI controllers
(eg Chorus, Reverb, Harmonic Content, etc...) in NoteWorthy?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jun-1998

As of version 1.51a, NWC only supports direct access to the controllers specified in the Multi-point Controller.


#675: Rolls
Rolls

(675)

Submitted by: Jeff on 15-Jun-1998

I'm trying to put in my marching band music for this year, but I don't know how to make a roll. Can anyone help/

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 15-Jun-1998

Some midi boxes actually have a roll somewhere in their percussion patches, but it's not standard General Midi.
If you are writing the percussion part, you'll have a little trouble making it legible for the percussionists, as NWC doesn't support standard percussion clefs (yet?).
You could probably right a muted staff, and then implement what you wrote on another staff.

If you just want rolls to sound right, try 32nd notes or even 64ths (depending on your tempo). Sometimes having a second track playing slightly out of time helps.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: X on 17-Jun-1998

Do I see the same features people wanting popping up all the time?

Reply 3 offered by: Charles Raiff on 06-Jul-1998

Okay, after months of trying to figure it out, I think I have a
solution to your problem!!!! What I do, is write it out regularly
and just where the roll goes, use a regular note. Then make
a hidden staff where you notate out a roll in 32nd notes, if you
want a nice open roll, or 64+notes if you want a buzz roll. Then
Hide that staff. As for looks on notation, just find what
ever note starts the roll on the normal staff, and put an =
with a non-preserved width text. It looks good enough for us
dumb drummers to figure out what it is. It takes a little
tinkering but it works.
Hope it helps.


#676: 1.51a/HP500C Print Problem
1.51a/HP500C Print Problem

(676)

Submitted by: Jim Lendvay on 15-Jun-1998

When I downloaded 1.51a, my print-outs went lousy. I can run an old version (1.31d), and the print works fine.

Specifically, wherever there is a note, all staff lines disappear for the width of the note. The same is true for any character that prints on the staff, Clefs included. I am missing about half of any chord notes, and the upper "4" of a 4/4 time signature is simply blank (no staff lines, no nothing!).

I'd rather not revert to the old version. There must be a reason this is happening.

Please help.

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 16-Jun-1998

I don't know if this will help, but I have found that if you keep the printer at it's default setup, it will print fine. Any other settings tends to cause memory errors, and you end up with the results you mentioned. I printed a 72 page score today, got to the 3rd page and ran out of memory. After restoring the default setting for the printer, it printed all 72 pages beautifully. Hope this helps... oh, that's someone elses line :-)
Adam

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-Jun-1998

The behavioour that you describe is symptomatic of a buggy print driver. The printer should NOT be clearing out the background area of the true-type fonts used by NWC. If it is, then you probably need an updated print driver ( I assume HP would have fixed this situation in a new driver version). It is very unlikely that an earlier version of NWC will fix the problem (unless you go way back to version 1.1, where we used bitmap graphics for all notation). All versions since 1.2 use true-type fonts for rendering the notation, so the behaviour is likely to show up in every instance where this technology is used.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Jun-1998

This is a follow up to additional information posted into a new thread at msg #681.

As Olivier points out, it is important to run your tests on the same machine, booting from the same operating system (some users have a dual boot setup). It is also important to use the same binary edition of NWC. If the 16-bit edition of an older NWC version worked, but the 32-bit edition of the latest version does not, then try using the 16-bit edition of the latest version of NWC.

You have not indicated what version of Windows is on your new system, but I am guessing that it is Windows 95. I went and looked on the HP site for the latest driver for your HP500C. HP does not seem to offer a Win 95 version, but the latest Win 3.1 version is 6.2, dated May-08-1995. You can find it by starting at:

http://www.hp.com/cposupport/prodhome/dj500c.html

As a matter of background, users have reported this kind of problem with printing on numerous occasions over the years (with several printers, usually from HP). In all cases that I know about, an updated print driver fixed the problem. There is nothing we can change in NWC to make your printer and its driver behave properly when it comes to rendering true-type symbols on a printed page. Per spec, the printer should render the true-type symbol transparently onto the page, because NWC tells it to do so.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Jun-1998

One more thing: I left out an important detail about the driver issue. I do not completely understand this, but a substantial number of users were able to fix this problem by changing their display driver, rather than their print driver. It would seem that there is an interaction between the system's display driver and the print driver which can trigger this problem. You can give this a try, using the follwing display driver procedure:

Display Driver Problems:
If your problem is caused by a bug in the display device driver of your system, this can usually be corrected by acquiring an updated device driver from the manufacturer. You could also switch to a stock Windows display driver. These are generally well behaved drivers that do not have this bug.

You can test this by selecting a generic display driver in Windows and verifying NWC works okay there.

- Click on your desktop
- Select Properties, then
Settings
Change Display Type
Change Adapter Type to Standard Display Type - Super VGA

If this solves the problem, you should make sure you had the correct device driver selected for your system. If it is correct, then the device is causing the problem, see the manufacturer for an updated driver.

Reply 5 offered by: Phil Allwood on 19-Jun-1998

I had this problem quite some time ago and it was caused by a bug in the Matrox Mystique Display driver. It was necessary to turn off the "Use PowerGDU acceleration" in the "Settings/Powerdesk" of Display Properties.


#677: Save me hours please :)
Save me hours please :)

(677)

Submitted by: Dem on 16-Jun-1998

NoteWorthy has great music fonts, and the scores are wonderful - and the interface is the best; the midi import is super... etc.

BUT.

It would save me hours (and I mean about 5 hours per orchestral or big band piece) if NoteWorthy could incorporate split tracks and automatic bar numbering. The splitting tracks thing was discussed on a couple of other threads I see, but by bar numbering I mean if only I could click an option to get Noteworthy to go through a staff, and if it finds more than 4 empty bars in a sequence then do the numbering thing automatically. (perhaps only on the printout - not the editor because it would stuff the editor)

e.g.
|....|....|....|....|
changed to:
|--4--|

Can you see what I mean? I'm looking for software that can particularly do these things. Any software that can do that would be worth ten grand a year to me.
Noteworthy uses a good system that I think could incorporate these features easily.

Help me if you can. :)

Thanks.
Dem

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 16-Jun-1998

They are called compressed rests, and it has been discussed. I just make all the rests into one, and use a modified text to add the number of bars rest at the top of the stave. A little time consuming, but better than seperate parts having 22 seperate bars rest. If you want a program that compresses rests, try Encore. It's only about $450 Aus (and hard to use), but what's $450 if you can save $10000 :-) (I'll stick with Noteworthy)
Adam

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 16-Jun-1998

Dem has a point tho' - if you contrive a compressed rest in the manner Adam suggests, the automatic bar numbering goes out of sequence and can no longer be used. Next version perhaps? (It's already on my wish list!)

Reply 3 offered by: Chris on 16-Jun-1998

Dem-

I agree wholeheartedly with your point. I have also put multi-measure rest groupings on my wish list with Noteworthy Artware. As a high school band director, I have used a couple of different notation programs, and frankly, Noteworthy Composer is the easiest to use. However, the trade off to ease of use is the loss of some features. If you are making that amount of money from your arrangements and compositions, then you should consider getting a higher powered program, as Adam Bodkin suggested. Another good program is Finale by Coda software. Academic price is $250 and retail is quite a bit higher. I have started to use this program, and it is rather complex, however, it offers the functions you are looking for.

Reply 4 offered by: Dem on 16-Jun-1998

You know how Noteworthy uses fonts to draw the notes, why can't they add a feature to change all crochets to stems with Xs for drum tracks. Surely you guys could use that feature too...

It's just that because I like Noteworthy so much, I think they are doing themselves a disservice by not adding some of these features. But in time they probably might...

Reply 5 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 17-Jun-1998

I guess it is because of the fact that if 'ONCU' wants a feature in Noteworthy, it is usually only a matter of time before they get it. We really are a bunch of spoilt brats, aren't we. :-)
Adam

Reply 6 offered by: Dem on 17-Jun-1998

Does ONCU mean:
(something) Noteworthy Composer Users
?

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 17-Jun-1998

Online Noteworthy Composer Users, I think

Reply 8 offered by: steven yu on 17-Jun-1998

you mean
if the features don't come out in next version we be very angry because the squeky wheel get the oil

Reply 9 offered by: mad on 18-Jun-1998

what's that oil & wheel story ? A good old pionnier time reminiscence ??


#678: accidentals/key signatures
accidentals/key signatures

(678)

Submitted by: Chris on 16-Jun-1998

I'm a fairly new user of Noteworthy Composer and am using version 1.51a. A problem I've run across that I have yet to figure out involves importing MIDI files. When I open a file from MIDI to NWC, it always seems to use the sharp enharmonics (i.e. A# instead of Bflat). I have this same problem when transposing parts up or down. Since my primary use is to do band arrangements, I would much rather have the notes show up in flat keys. Is there a way I can force the program to use flat keys instead of sharps? It gets very tiresome to go through each line and manually change the notes to flat enharmonics.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 16-Jun-1998

There is a feature that is documented.
You should set a flat key signature (F, Bb etc.) at the start of the staff and do a Tools/Transpose Staff with a value of 0 (zero) semitones.

BUT.. this is not entirely satisfactory since it means all accidentals in C major, G major etc. are sharps, all in F are flats and in keys like D minor the tonic leading note will be Db.
It looks worse on keyboard parts - Eb7 in a sharp key spells as D#7 - not good!!

I have added a wish list item - Enharmonic Flip - which would allow the user to select a note, group of notes, measure or chord and flip the accidentals.
At the moment it's only a wish - but Eric has granted wishes before!!

Let's hope.

Reply 2 offered by: Chris on 17-Jun-1998

I'm just pasting the same follow up response to my question about copying between clefs.

Thanks for the replies, I feel like such a NWC rookie!! I actually took the time to go back through some of the earlier forum threads and found out how to solve this problem. If any new users read this thread, take the time to review earlier questions in the forum to answer your questions.


#679: copying between clefs
copying between clefs

(679)

Submitted by: Chris on 16-Jun-1998

I've mentioned in another entry that I've had problems with notes being imported as a sharp harmonic instead of a flat, and that when transposing, the same problem occurs. Another problem I've had is when I copy and paste between clefs (i.e. from treble to bass), the notes remain on their respective lines and must be transposed. I've used other software that automatically did the transposition when changing clefs and wondered if this function is available with NWC? It could be there and because I'm a fairly new user, haven't found it yet.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Jun-1998

Your are right - you do have to do it manually.
Eric explained the method in an earlier thread.
Basically - you select the pasted staff with Home then Shift/End to select the whole staff.
Use Ctrl/Shift with the Up or Down cursor to move the notes to the correct pitch in the new clef.
Change the clef if it's not correct.
If notes and ties are the wrong way round - Tools/Audit Note Stems and Ctrl/F9 staff audit might be required.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 17-Jun-1998

By the way, cut/Paste acting like that are perfect for me. First because using the technique Barry describes above is rather easy, and 2nd because when you're writng fugues or music îeces like that you may not want the transposition to be ssystematic -- in fact it's better for me that the music line stays as is. Even in JSBach fugues, (with more than 2 voices) the melody is partly changed, due to harmonic rules.
Mad

Reply 3 offered by: Chris on 17-Jun-1998

Thanks for the replies, I feel like such a NWC rookie!! I actually took the time to go back through some of the earlier forum threads and found out how to solve this problem. If any new users read this thread, take the time to review earlier questions in the forum to answer your questions.


#680: overlapping syllables
overlapping syllables

(680)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 16-Jun-1998

I am transcribing 4-part vocal music on two clefs. Occasionally
(e.g.) soprano will have "dotted-quarter , eighth" notes
for two syllables where the alto has two quarter notes.
NWC nicely chords the dotted-quarter note with the first
quarter note, but when I put in the other notes (which
should not show as a chord even though they fit the same
syllable in the lyrics) NWC wants to treat them as successive
rather than partly overlapping. Can NWC do this? and How do
I show it?

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Oakes on 17-Jun-1998

One (less than ideal) way is to have your second quarter note as
two (tied) eighth notes. Then the second of these eighth notes
appears in a chord with the soprano's eighth note.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 17-Jun-1998

I ain't sure that I understood your problem, but if it is what I think there is a solution.
It depends on whether you use 2 lyrics or one.
Let's say that the text is "one two three" ("three" being just after the musical scheme you describe).
If two lyrics (one for sop., one alto) : on the sop. lyrics, put : "one two _ three" and in the alto's (lower) : "one _ two three".
If only one lyric line, put "one __two _ three". The eighth' syllable will be written a bit one the right of the 2nd quarter, and a bit before the eighth.

HTH. If you want an example, I could send you a .nwc file, but it is not possible here. I'd rather add a trick then.

                  Dominique

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 17-Jun-1998

I found a limitation on the above technique. NWC considers the musical scheme as 2 quarters plus one eighth, which is obviously wrong. If you try Audit/Bar line, you'll see what I mean. But for printing purpose, it remains valid. Be careful with the other staves though !

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 17-Jun-1998

My application has one line of lyrics, which, as you point
out, can be made to work with anything by judicious use of
underscore. The real problem is the musical count.
And I have a separate staff (tenor and bass voices).
View, play, or print, the staves just won't line up.
I don't mind it not playing, but I want useable printouts.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1998

Ok, I got a solution.
What I did is to keep the 2 quarters (alto), and the dotted quarter (sop.). With this items only, the other staff matches perfectly.
Now you have to add the missing soprano eighth. I did this by inserting a text item, with 'G' as the text, position 6 (for a B note), and set the font to User1, User1 being NWCV15 regular 42. You may want to change the font size depending on your staff size (I used 19).
Do not forget to NOT preserve width for the text item. It will save space, and more : it will display the diamond that reminds you this is not a true note... :-)

I used such a trick in http://www.mygale.org/05/madmarsu/doeba.zip for the : at the end.

I'll put this method to the NRU tricks (if not present yet).

Bet this helps !

Dominique

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1998

Just forgot to mention this work for upper stems only.
Eric, do you have a solution for down stems ? There is no such item in the font !? Guess you use 'N', 'k', 't', but for the stem ??

Note for doeba.nwc : I also used white text items to have only two measure per staff. And could someone tell me if the {mpc} volume does work ? It doesn't on my SB card :-(

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 18-Jun-1998

I believe you need a wave table card to implement a crescendo on a held note.
Eric has replied so in an earlier thread.
It seems that the SB16 card is limited to sounding only the original note velocity as it is received and cannot modify this once the note is sounding.
A series of notes increasing in volume will be handled okay as each individual note velocity is played as received.
I too have an SB16 - I wish it could do cresc. and dim. on a held note.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1998

Thanx Barry for the explanation.
I already tried to transform a whole note into 64 64th to try to avoid this behaviour (about velocity as well as volume, which is not the same (in particular organ : ppp or fff will sound the same, as it changes velocity; but volume changes will sound ok)
But it lead me to another problem : the note seemed to be re-attacked on each 64th... Even if they were tied, and even with legato style (which has an effect only on duration greater than 8th, it seems).
Is it a midi card problem, or a NWC problem ? I dunno (yet).

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1998

this is an other addendum to reply5 (the one that links to doeba.zip).
If the note added via the text item is not properly placed (such as on the bar line), just add after it another text item (with lyric italic font) that contains one or more space(s), preserving width. This will push the bar line (or whatever) further on the right.
(I also use such "hidden space" in doeba.zip, making a single note measure (# 11) wider.)

Hope this helps.

Reply 10 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Jun-1998

> My application has one line of lyrics, which, as you point out,
> can be made to work with anything by judicious use of underscore.
> The real problem is the musical count.

NWC does not truly support dual voices in one staff (unless you are using the experiemtal staff layering feature). This is why you sometimes have to split a note into two notes that are tied together. This issue is spelled out in the chord member help:

"Lastly, it is important to understand that only the smaller duration item is actually used in aligning notes on a score. When creating split-stem chords, the notes in the larger duration are ignored when formatting and alignment is performed with respect to other notes above and around this item. It is also only possible to beam, triplet, or slur the notes of the shorter duration in a split stem chord."

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Jun-1998

Regarding tied notes: if a note is tied to an earlier note, it will not "re-attack" with another note on. This is covered more at msg #442.

Reply 12 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 01-Jul-1998

I am running into a related but "simpler" problem: Chording
of unlike notes. (I know this is a new feature.) Some
combinations I haven't been able to do at all. Others
work (or don't work) depending on which note is
entered first. And still others can be made to work by
entering one note and changing its stem direction before
entering the other note. I haven't seen a pattern yet.
Should I give examples of failing cases, or send a
file in?

Reply 13 offered by: marsu on 02-Jul-1998

The rules I found are :
- a note with stem up can not be lower than a note with stem down, and recipr. ;
- one or two different durations can be used, not more (which I've never seen anyway) ; if two diff. durations, they must be different stems direction ;
- a rest, if present, must be smaller and entered first ; you can then have only one stem direction (the rest takes the 2nd) ;
- the rest will move (if necessary) up or down depending on its stem direction ;

For more details, refer to the online help.

Hope this helps.
      Dominique P.

P.S. For "standard" chords, I use macro recorders (as well as for arpeggios) for Maj, 5th, ... 1-3-5-7, ... Very useful for guitar or piano scores.

Reply 14 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 02-Jul-1998

There are more rules. Sometimes you cannot enter a new note
above a stem-down note, but you can delete the stem-down
note, enter the upper note, upsize its stem, and re-enter
the stem-down note. Sometimes even this fails. Unison and
second chords are obviously a special case, and I would
expect more difficulty, but occasionally they work...


#681: 1.51a/hp500c still a problem!
1.51a/hp500c still a problem!

(681)

Submitted by: Jim Lendvay on 16-Jun-1998

Thank you for your responses. Unfortunately, restoring the defaults did not help. Same symptoms. Also, 1.31a DOES work just fine. I had that on my old computer, which I replaced last December. I hooked it up again, and the printer works just fine with 1.31a. The printer has no problem with printing its own diagnostics, or any other type of document. Just NoteWorthy 1.51a.

Any other ideas? I'm at a loss. 15 years of computer programming has not helped me here!

Thanks,
Jim

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 17-Jun-1998

I'm not fluent in english, so I don't know, when you say
"I hooked it up again" if you tried with your old computer
(and old version of NWc) or if you installed the old
version of NWC on your new computer.

Of course, it is not the same, because the drivers can
be different. If you did the first thing, then you can try
the second one...

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Jun-1998

In order to keep this all together in the same thread (to avoid confusion and rehashing the same information twice), our replies will be kept in your original post, at msg #676.


#682: Message Numbers
Message Numbers

(682)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 17-Jun-1998

I have noticed references to message numbers in the forum. How can one retrieve items by message number?

Reply 1 offered by: Dem on 17-Jun-1998

Click in the location bar of your browser, move the cursor to the end and change the document name at the end to the name of the document referenced.
e.g. this page is:
msg #682

for 400.htm, changed the URL in your browser from 682.htm to 400.htm

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1998

when referencing a msg, use '!' before its number. (Refer to help on the top of the page). for example, this very msg can be referenced by 4 chars : ! 6 8 2 which gives msg #682.
'!' can also be used for absolute URL (beginning with http only ?).
Eric, could you modify the '!' tool to allow !number#reply_number ? :-)

HTH.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Jun-1998

For those who have not done so recently, click the Help link to read about the new link features in the forum. Also, you can get the offline forum to be able to browse and search the forum contents at your leisure. We will consider the reply part suggestion.

Reply 4 offered by: Dem on 18-Jun-1998

Test:

msg #682.htm

Reply 5 offered by: Dem on 02-Jul-1998

My midi/NWC file site coming soon:
http://www.davidmulliss.com.au


#683: Newbie help
Newbie help

(683)

Submitted by: Michael LeMay on 17-Jun-1998

I am evaluating Noteworthy Composer and having a bit of difficulty. Is there any way to enter secondary notes within a local repeat. By this I mean that on the second time through, there is a slight variation in the notes at one point. I would hate to have to re-enter the entire repeat and change that one area. (I know copy and paste will work fine, but printing will be a bear). Also, I am having some difficulty with a measure. It is piano treble staff. There is a series of eighth notes, barred. Additionally, there are a series of quarter notes barred. NWC doesn't seem to want to let me bar them individually (ie. quarters barred to quarters, eights barred to eights). One last one, and then I'll stop complaining. How do you enter a broken chord (wavy line) in NWC? Any help would be greatly appreciated, it's a great program.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 18-Jun-1998

Hi, Michael, and welcome to NWC!

Repeats can be quite tricky! If you want to alter some notes in the middle of a section, then it's not strictly a repeat. The only way I know is to use the first and second time bar control (look in the menu <insert - special ending>) and duplicate the remainder of the section. Examples of this sort of thing can be found in the samples folder, entitled repeat1..4.
I'm not quite sure what your barring problem is - if the notes are occasionally chorded then the barring is preset. If the sequences follow on, i.e. the end of the sequence of eighth notes is barred to the beginning of the sequence of quarter notes presumably you used automatic beam. Just select the group of notes you want to split. Click the beam notes button on the toolbar to unbar the group. Then reselect the notes you want to bar and click the beam button again.
Broken chords are not supported (as yet!), but have been discussed on a number of occasions. Have a look at msg #596 and also hints and tips http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip3.htm#arpeggio and http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip4.htm#sprdgrc The wavy line symbol itself either has to be written in by hand, placed as a text insert using a special font (if you can find one) or drawn onto an exported page (see msg #476) in a suitable program.

Enjoy!, Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 18-Jun-1998

Missed this one out - also look at msg #594


#684: Can a voice change staffs?
Can a voice change staffs?

(684)

Submitted by: Mike Groves on 18-Jun-1998

Hi all,

During eval of 1.51 I ran across a problem that I can't seem to resolve.
Say I have a simple piano score with a Treble and Bass clef. The 2 parts
are in octaves and are descending down the scale. In typical piano notation,
once the note on the Treble clef reaches around middle-C, it jumps to the
Bass clef (usually a diagonal line indicates to follow this voice to the
next staff down) and continues on down the scale. The top staff is left blank
without rests indicating the notes are not to be played just by the left
hand, but rather by both hands. At some point, the notes played by the right
hand once again ascend above middle-C and a diagonal line leads the musician's
eyes back up to the top staff.

Is this type of notation supported?

Thanks,
Mike

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 18-Jun-1998

Mike, seemsg #596

Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 20-Jun-1998

That's right. The short answer is no (at the moment).
That's why I think having the option of not displaying rests when printing would be damned useful.
Then all we'd need would be some way of drawing lines from one note in a staff to another note in another staff (and I bet that THAT'S non-trivial!)

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Jun-1998

You can fake the line with Insert Text using a backslash in a large font.


#685: Instrument/Voice identifiers
Instrument/Voice identifiers

(685)

Submitted by: Hugh Wallis on 18-Jun-1998

I can't find a way to put the Instrument or voice identifiers to the left of the staff - is there a way?

Thanks

Hugh

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Jun-1998

See msg #233

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 19-Jun-1998

see also msg #688


#687: Measures and Lines
Measures and Lines

(687)

Submitted by: Zach on 18-Jun-1998

The particular music I am working with (religious music) is usually written so that each line is not, usually, a complete measure. This is possible because the music doesn't have a time signature. When the line does not end with a complete measure, a dotted bar line usually appears at the end of the line. I know for a fact that other notation softwares can handle this, and I was wondering whether Noteworthy was capable of using dotted bar lines. If not, that would be a good option to write into the next upgrade.

Reply 1 offered by: kent dugan on 18-Jun-1998

Noteworthy doesn't handle partial bars. There isn't much point in trying to force this condition, as partial bars are not a real viable convention in music notation. The solution to avoiding those is to write bigger or smaller so that you can end a line with a bar line. Windows programs handle fonts well enough that there is no reason to wish for this facility.

Maybe I'm old-world, but where's the lure in this? Why would this ever be wished for? It's the result of a lack of ability to make it fit in the space provided.

Reply 2 offered by: Zach on 18-Jun-1998

This ability is wished for because I want to space the music out with words instead of notes. In this particular situation most of the choir members know the notes, so they have to read the words. It's easier to read words that are evenly spaced.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 19-Jun-1998

Kent, you're not *old-world* enough :-)
In case of psalmody, what Zach requires is needed indeed. And adding a decorated bar line which would be partial would save him/us from the trouble he's in.
And |O| notes (double whole or "ronde carrée") would help much too ! This kinda note have no specific duration, it's used to sing all the text that needs to be sung. Usually the note change is indicated by an underlined letter... which is not easy to do (yet).

Zach, by the way, there is something that you can use though : put a normal bar line where you want the staff to break, and adjust the margins until it is just off of the printing area... It's tricky but does work ! But do it when you finished everything else on that score, since you'd probably have to do it again if you change something elsewhere.

Hope this helps

Reply 4 offered by: James Franklin on 19-Jun-1998

The partial bar line problem is related to forcing line breaks at specific places. Most people using Noteworthy have wished the ability to force a line break at a specific measure. But if I understand what Zach wants to do, he wants to force line breaks within a staff of unmeasured music and then decorate the end of the lines with the dotted bar. I don't think that would be a trivial fix.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 20-Jun-1998

So long as you don't accidentally press Audit Bar Lines, I think NWC handles unmeasured music fine with normal bar lines. Why not just use those (and explain their use to you choir readers for now), and put on the wish list the ability to decorate the bar line as a "dotted" bar?

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: Marsu on 23-Jun-1998

Zach,
in the cases you need a partial bar line but not at the end of a score line, you can "draw" it :
insert a teXt item using the "|" character, font "Page Small Text". Either use one, Staff pos. 0, or use two (staff pos. 2 and staff pos. -2), the first preserving width in order to be over the 2nd item.

Hope this helps,
                  Dominique


#688: Useful fonts
Useful fonts

(688)

Submitted by: Marsu on 19-Jun-1998

Hi all,
I've found a place where you can find many fonts of interests. In particular there are two fonts to download that you can use :
"music for a while" that displays instrument shapes and is freeware ;
"frets" that display guitar chords (not "Cm7" but the _real_ chord, with strings and all). The latter seems to be very expected from many of us :-)

"music for a while" can also be used to replace "staff bold" in one case : when you want to display the instrument symbol rather than its name in front of the staff. But in order not to make strange things appear, you mustn't have other items using this "staff bold" font (such as measure number, tempo, ...). So its usage is rather restricted :( but you always can add it in another editing software (Works, µ$Word, ...)

So Where to find these fonts ? at http://web23.interspeed.net/dingbats/arts/arts.htm Re-active "auto load images" for that page, it's worth the try. And re-deactivate later to suft WWW at warp speed ;)

Well, hope this helps (at least guitar transcribers!). I use frets with user font 4. Do not forget to join it to your scores though...

Hasta luego

Reply 1 offered by: Sterghios on 30-Sep-1998

Um, no DNS entry comes up when I click on your link mate.
Would you mind relocating the site or ammending the addy?
Thanx

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 02-Oct-1998

It seems the site disappeared. I'll try to find it out again (I found it by seraching for specific, free/shareware fonts with Lycos)

Reply 3 offered by: ed on 11-May-2000

try this site for some chord dingbats-http://www.fontaddict.com/dingbats2.html

Reply 4 offered by: Press the Send button below to add your reply on 13-May-2000

Thanks a bunch Ed!


#689: What do you think of these ideas?
What do you think of these ideas?

(689)

Submitted by: Dem on 19-Jun-1998

I'd just quickly like to make some suggestions:

* no dotted crochet rests when midi files are imported.
(because there's half a chance that the beat falls halfway into the crochet. Others might be able to explain that better)
(I've also never seen dotted crochets in music, because it makes it harder for the performer to read [to count the beats])

* in status bar show program number and channel for active staff.

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Blop on 20-Jun-1998

The idea with the status bar is good.

Reply 2 offered by: Dem on 20-Jun-1998

Another thing (these are suggestions; I still love NoteWorthy) is when making drum tracks the notes below the middle line of the staff should have their stems pointing down, while the notes above the middle line of the staff should have their stems pointing up. (when they add the feature to add Xs for drums notes, they'll no doubt include that guideline too :)


#690: Noteworthy-Source-Code !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Noteworthy-Source-Code !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(690)

Submitted by: Anne-Sophie on 20-Jun-1998

Good day, Noteworth'ler!

My name is Anne-Sophie, and I'am a german professional programmer.
I'd be very interested in Noteworthy's source code. I suggest
that it's written in C++. I have got so many ideas of extending
your Noteworthy Composer. Maybe it would be possible to create
a kind of an easy "Upper (NTW) Language" in which all users are able
to bring their own implementations into Noteworthy Composer, so
that all can participate in constructing a better Noteworthy
without knowing how to program in C++ (eg. like in AutoCAD, Excel, Word Basic).

Best regards, Anne-Sophie

Reply 1 offered by: ST on 20-Jun-1998

That would be awesome! Then we could tailor-make NWC to work
with our equipment optimally.
For example: I have Yamaha XG and I sure wish I could access
more of the capabilities of the synth from within
NoteWorthy itself, although that in itself might take quite
a bit of work for the programmers to implement (especially
just for me) with a 5th generation language in
NWC anyone could easily personally add the needed features
to NWC and then distribute their modules to others...

Reply 2 offered by: Singstimmer on 20-Jun-1998

Leave Noteworthy alone! Eric's doing just fine without any help thank you !

S.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe on 20-Jun-1998

I agree with both points presented here
1) Noteworthy is a GREAT program without any other implementations
2) There are just a few things I would like to see in the program, and
with the source code, it would be possible much faster than waiting for
the next upgrade.

I doubt that Noteworthy will release the code, but it would be a neat addition.

Reply 4 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 21-Jun-1998

I think that if I wrote a program such as NWC, I would be a bit offended by some of the users saying, basically, that the program wasn't good enough, and 'I could make it better'. This may sound a bit of track, but a few years ago, I had a CD player that I decided to pull apart, and 'make better'. (It didn't have a scan function on it.) In the process, I damaged the lens and ended up with a piece of junk. I guess what I am trying to say is, if something is meant to be in NWC, Eric will put it there, it's not up to us to do so. In the mean time there are plenty of work arounds from all sorts of users that we can use.
Adam

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 21-Jun-1998

I guess the programmer part of me comes out with ideas like this. I've sent lots of big and intricate ideas into Eric (and even seen a few implemented, thanx!) and often tried to second guess what he was up to.
The bottom line is, tho', if it's not written with user-extensions in mind, it'll be fiendishly hard to retrofit, and so will probably never happen, which is a shame, but one I'm prepared to live with.
Just one example: I'd love to fiddle with where NWC kicks a "new line" (staff "justification" or something like that, an issue discussed several times before. Now to actually code something to do that would be non-trivial, even if all the hooks were in place to do it. Best if Eric does it (and SOON! ;)
That sort of stuff normally involves a major rewrite, though I'm sure that modular object-oriented programming makes the task easier.
In short, it'd be real neat for all us retired programmers, but probably a headache for Eric trying to stop us damaging the lens!

A

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Crossley on 21-Jun-1998

It depends which you prefer: a smorgasbord or the contents of a dustbin. One person controlling the specification and programming quality equals smorgasbord; end users fiddling about with code equals contents of dustbin. The job of end users is to keep the suggestions and money flowing. Perhaps if NWC were to charge for upgrades then it might be possible to invest more in programming.

Reply 7 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 21-Jun-1998

Here is another computer programmer writing and I have enough difficulty adding code to my old code when the 'users' decide that they want something different.

When I have to add code to other people's work the problems just get compounded.

I can see instances where hooks might be useful but once implemented, would be a nightmare to support and also to introduce new ideas- you could never re-write that part of the code in a different way if you have to ensure that everything your users had written would still work.
All things being equal then - although I would also love to get my hands on the source code, I would fully support Eric in not releasing it.

In fact, I would be quite happy to support Peter Crossley's 'charge for upgrades' idea if it would enable Eric to incorporate more wish list items into the program at a faster rate. I have got far more value from Noteworthy than I have from programs which cost far more and so would be happy to pay for major upgrades.

Keep up the good work Eric. Thanks

Richard

Reply 8 offered by: John Gillings on 22-Jun-1998

regarding general release of source code - Don't be silly! Your registration
is a license to use the product. There are such things as source
licenses, but they are usually an order of magnitude or two over
the right to use license.

Regarding "pay for upgrade", I'd happily pay another registration
fee for a version of Noteworthy that contained rest compression
(with user defineable grouping), per stave user defined page turns
and global substitution of enharmonic spellings.

Leave the source code in Eric's capable hands.

Reply 9 offered by: Peter Vasey on 22-Jun-1998

John and Richard, Hear Hear!!

I couldn't agree more - I too have to think hard when returning to programs I haven't altered for a while, and they are relatively simple - nowhere near the complexity of NWC. Even the best annotated and 'modularised' code for a program as comprehensive as NWC is going to require a huge amount of preparatory work before attempting any modifications. I said in an earlier thread that we sholdn't take NWC for granted just because it's inexpensive - if it was $390 instead of $39 would one be so keen to fiddle?? Not I - I'll leave it in Eric's capable hands, and thank my lucky stars that he looks after us as well as he does!

Reply 10 offered by: Marsu on 22-Jun-1998

Briefly, Anne-Sophie :
deine Idee ist ein gut Versuch, aber unwirklich. (Let's go on in English for other ppl)
First, if Eric does publish the NWC source code (even to only some external programmers) you can bet that within 2 months a musical notator software will appear on the market. "indpired of"...
2nd, many of us have already proposed their knowledge and skills to Eric. He declined (very politely) all these proposals, and IMHO he's right. Even if I still wish to make the french version of NWC/NWP, as others want to in Polish, Russian, and so on.
3rd, Eric does his work fine. He realized many users' (even unreg'd users') wishes, and I bet that next version (1.6 or 1.52 ?) will realize other wishes plus some enhancements which he keeps secret and amze us each time.
4th, Peter, John, Richard, Andrew are right. It would be great to fiddle with the source code --be they in C, C++, ADA, lisp or whatever-- to implement our own features. But that would give many different versions that would be not compatible. Just think of µ$oft Word and its enormous bugs/GPF and you'll see what I mean!
5th, we all want to give Eric some ideas already implemented. Never had a headache integrating others' pieces of code ? Cross your fingers then, and I wish you to go on like that.

Yes, that would be great to be able to customise NWC at our will. A game named Abuse (look at it at http://www.abuse.com) proposed the same. Many few people did it though. Is it because it's in Lisp ? I doubt.
Take the time to read quietly the whole forum. Download the offline version, it's worth the try.

Hab Mut und viel Spaß !

P.S. Hope you didn't found my reply too aggressive. What I'm trying to say is that Eric does a GREAT work. I think we should leave him alone to drive NWC where HE wants. But you can send wish as often as you want. And even tell here which you'd like, in order that other users wish them too :-)

Dominique

Reply 11 offered by: Christian on 22-Jun-1998

1) First of all:
If I read all the noteworhty user's wishes,
I can see, that there is an urgent need to make noteworthy
even betten than it is.
It is paradox, how some of the users react:
On the one hand they pray to their noteworthy and its
inventors (Eric a.s.o.) like in church,
on the other hand you can read hundreds of suggestions and critics
showing, that everyone who complains, wish to have to better
noteworthy composer.

In comparison to professional notation programs
(finale, encore and sibelius 7 a.s.o.) noteworthy composer
is easy to use, but a little small and <static> in very important
functions. Even if you look at nwc-file-format, you can see and
understand, why realization of very good users ideas it
complicate to manage (n-tupels e.g.), because the format itself
could not store the data of it. (Reserve some bits for the
information of a triplet, so you are not able to generalize
to n-tuplets without changing the file-compatibility.)

2) The idea to let people participate in updating a product,
and even bringing more good ideas into it is not new and not
a silly one.
Think of what Linus Torvald iniated with his wourldwide well-
known LINUX. Linux (very cheap UNIX)'s main concept is to be
distributed entirely with the source-code! Thousands of people
helped to make LINUX better and better. This is the power and
the speed of an adequate developement of software.
Their are also shareware-distributions of LINUS to be payed
for it as well.
(Also <netscape> indicated to publish its navigator's
source-code for all users!)

But even if the source-code of noteworthy would stay with
noteworthy, the idea to create an "upper language", in
which one can program new applications, plug ins,
for a product is very good and has already been practiced.

Your
Christian

Reply 12 offered by: Peter Crossley on 22-Jun-1998

I agree that there are two types of software, but I would say that many end users are interested in dealing with a company which has a good product at a good price, can speak with some authority on its content and capabilities, be open to suggestions, deliver on its up-grade promises and fix bugs expeditiously. There is obviously a market among those who want to buy lego kits but I am not part of it.

Reply 13 offered by: Dem on 22-Jun-1998

Hi there, I agree with Adam (I'm too busy to read the rest right now).
Firstly, NoteWorthy is great.
There are a few things that can easily be added.
However, there need to be some balance in how the future
of NoteWorthy Composer is managed. I would like to see NoteWorthy
have a few more features that would make it the best in the marketplace.
Can NoteWorthy remain shareware and at the same time become the perfect
tool for beginners and professionals alike? Yes, I believe it can.
What is the limitation to whether more features are added to
NoteWorthy? Time/money/expertise?

Forget handing out the source code.

I say invest a few thousand into getting the features into
(and tested in) Noteworthy, and do so in a business-like manner,
ie: okay, we will pay 1000 to get it up to level X and
increase the registration fee by 10%. We will cover this cost
if we sell the same number of licences we have been selling over
the next three months.
Personally, I think NoteWorthy is the best piece of software
ever written. I'm sure thousands of people have learnt more
with Noteworthy Composer about music (and notation) than any
other piece of software around.
(if NoteWorthy needs help in promoting NoteWorthy Composer to
get more sales, just ask :)

Reply 14 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Jun-1998

There are three options:
1) Release the source code. This benefits a very few people with a lot of time on their hands, some of whom will use it to compete with Noteworthy. Not a good idea.
2) Re-write the code so it presents a set of interfaces people can use. Fine idea, but the (large amount of) time spend doing this is time taken away from providing the features we all want.
3) Provide some sort of macro language. Similar to 2, much more useful, but is it our first priority? Not mine. I would love to have it, but there are basic things I want much more.

Reply 15 offered by: Quivis on 22-Jun-1998

"Dem" in his wisdom says above:

"I'm sure thousands of people have learnt more
with Noteworthy Composer about music (and notation) than any
other piece of software around."

Personally I could not agree more. I was a total novice when it came to read and write music when I first got my hands on a copy of NWC back in 90-something, believe it was version 1.1. Then I hooked my SB sound card into my computer and was amazed by how those little red dots moved over the screen and actual music came out of the speakers. Gee, I learnt what I know about music with NWC as my teacher!

So "Dem", there are now 1001 of us. ;-)

I have also tried a few other music notation programs, Finale being one, but I always return to NWC. Why? Because it has everything I need and it's extremely easy to use. Even my neighbor who has very little computer knowledge, although being a professional musician, can use the program with ease, and she says the same: NWC is great to use because it's so easy to write music in it.

I guess this tells a little about how two "differently educated novices" can use the same program, and get something out from it.

This NWC software is probably developed in some C version of some kind which I know nothing about, I speak Borland Delphi Pascal, but as a programmer ( sortta ;) I can only say:
Leave the code in Eric's hands. It assures for the best handling of the code - this he has already proven!

Best wishes,
Quivis.

Reply 16 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 23-Jun-1998

As to people 'kneeling and praying to Eric' and then praising NWC for what it is already.... I havn't done that. I like NWC. It's great, it's brilliant, excuse my language but for usability it s**ts on Finale and Encore. Please people, I am not a rich man. Leave well enough alone, I can't afford 'another' expensive program.
Adam
"Close enough for Jazz...": every musician when tuning up. :-)

Reply 17 offered by: X on 23-Jun-1998

Brilliance can be improved...WITHOUT handing out the source code!

There's nothing wrong with saying: "Eric, your program is the BEST...and, it can be made even better!"

Reply 18 offered by: X on 23-Jun-1998

What does Eric and current users think of this:
"Perhaps if NWC were to charge for upgrades then it might be possible to invest more in programming."

Reply 19 offered by: marsu on 24-Jun-1998

I think that $ is not sufficient. It may help of course :) : "L'argent ne fait pas le bonheur mais il y contribue" (old proverb) I dunno when the version 2 of NWC will appear. I only hope that the improvements will be amazing. And that it will be for 16bit systems too!!
Trying to reduce worktime duration per week in France does not provide further employments in many many cases.
Having more dough would not necessarily mean having some more programmers and do quicker jobs.
'Chi va piano va sano', say Italian ppl. Eric's programming is an almost bug-free result. That's good enough, it becomes so rare !

But I'm sure we all would like to have Eric's opinion about all this. At least to close the discussion which could last forever...

May the wisdom be with you
                                  MAD

Reply 20 offered by: Dem on 29-Jun-1998

One thing that strikes me, now that Marsu mentions it --- I've used Noteworthy for hundreds of hours and it's never crashed!

Eric, you are a legend!

Reply 21 removed by: SYSOP


#692: Multiple Voices
Multiple Voices

(692)

Submitted by: Jonathan on 21-Jun-1998

Hi everyone!!

I'm writing a marching band piece, and I was wondering, how do you do different voices?? At least I think that's what it is called. Here's an example:
I have to put the symbol crashes and snare drum on different staffs, which is a big hassle. Is there any way to put them on one? Even if they are on different beats?? Thanks for ANY help!!

Jonathan

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 21-Jun-1998

Jonathan,

With all percussion (including snare and cymbals) you can use the percussion channel (either 10 or 16) and then, depending on the note you select, you can choose your percussion instrument.

A list of these can be found in the help file. Go to Common Questions number 6 for further information and help with percussion instruments.

For all instruments apart from percussion, you can change the instrument on the staff by selecting the insert menu and then selecting instrument patch. (Pressing key I is a short cut to this)

HTH

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Ken Mund on 22-Jun-1998

You may also check the "User Tips" or more specifically: http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip3.htm#drumkit

Listed is a way to assign specific notes on the staff to specific percussion instruments. The explanation is for windows 3.x but at the end is a way for Win95.


#693: Keyboards
Keyboards

(693)

Submitted by: Jonathan on 21-Jun-1998

Dear all,
Hi. I am in the process of buying a new keyboard. I was looking at the Yamaha PSR630, which has XG. Do you know if Noteworthy supports XG voices?? Also what keyboard would you suggest to use with Noteworthy, in the same price range???
Thank you for any help

Jonathan

Reply 1 offered by: Shane Turner on 21-Jun-1998

Hi,

I have a Yamaha XG PSR-530 which has the same voices as you
do, and you can use all of the Yamaha XG voices.

To do this, first choose the "Instrument patch" option.
Then, click on the "Select a Different Patch Bank" option.

Now get out the Yamaha manual, and turn to the back of the
book where the "Voice List" table is.

To make things easier I change the Patch List Type to
0-based so that it coincides with the table which is 0-based
as well.

Find the instrument you want from the table.

Enter the values for MSB (controller 0) and
LSB (controller 32) and select the
MIDI Program number (Patch Name).

Away it goes!! Using this option its even possible to
access all the drum kits as well!

Hope this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: JUBAL BACA on 22-Jun-1998

Hi. I have a KORG X5D keyboard. It have a good sound and
it is working well with NWC 1.51a. I'm working every days
over clasical music. If compare it price with sound, result
a not spenciff keyboard. It cost is $1,500 (in Argentina). In EE.UU may be it is chiper.(I'm sorry my English).But exist the ALESIS keyboard with a sampler card. It sound are
fantastic, and it price round about a $1200 to $2000 ( in
this country)

Regards...


#694: channels
channels

(694)

Submitted by: Jonathan on 21-Jun-1998

Hi, it's me again.
I was wondering, with all this talk of channels, what exactly is a channel???? And how do you use it?? Is it different on each sound card?? In that case I have a Ensoniq PCI sound card. What's the difference between an instrument patch and a channel. Because the channel 10 is drums on my system, but how about the other channels?? And why isn't there a drum patch in the list of instruments??
Thanks, I'm really confused.

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Mund on 22-Jun-1998

You will find probably 16 channels listed when you check the channels box in your music programs. They are separate divisions (lack of better word) for different sounds and settings in your program. You can put two sounds on one channel and two different musical lines or staves, but I don't think you can change the volume between the staves etc. if they are both on one channel. I have'nt played with the channels for some time because I generally put each separate line of music on a separate channel. As for drum sounds, open the file "drumref"in the "Samples" folder included with your NWC program and it will list the appropriate notes to match the drum sounds desired (in General MIDI I believe). Someone else may be able to explain all this better, after I learn how to use something I am afraid that I forget much of the technical aspects.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 23-Jun-1998

Briefly, you can consider the channels as independant parts of the MIDI software.
this means that you can vary the volume, alter the pitch on one channel without alter the others.
On each channel you can assign one or more instruments, each of them can play 0 to n notes at the same time. The limits depend on your MIDI hardware (for example a channel may be limited to 16 simultaneous notes, with instruments limited to 4 for each, and a global limitation (all channels altogether) of 20 notes. Thus if you got a big piano chord (10 notes), the flute or bassoon may not sound at that moment because the violins+contrabass are playing 10 notes too...)

Typically, you may want to assign the same channel to instruments/staves that you want to "link".
But you always can assign the same instrument (but not staff) to different channels, i.e. each channel ignores what the others do.

Hope it helps ?


#695: notes above the staff
notes above the staff

(695)

Submitted by: John Young on 21-Jun-1998

I new to NWC, and love 1.50b but I have a problem, when
inserting notes like F,G,A B, etc, above the staff the toolbar
is in the way and I cannot see the notes that I'm trying to insert.how can I get around this?
thank you in advance.
John

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Mund on 22-Jun-1998

Type F2 and increase the vertical size of the staff (upper). This should take care of the problem, I just tried it and it worked for me.

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 02-Jul-1998

The response Ken Mund gave is the way to do it. I've had the same problem and it works well for me. I also use it when doing parts for instruments which play below the staff in the same fashion. Remember when printing your score or individual parts out, though, that the vertical sizing you gave it will come into play. I've had some cases in which I went back and closed the spacing after I was done working with each stave.


#697: Greetings, Anne-Sophie again !!
Greetings, Anne-Sophie again !!

(697)

Submitted by: A.S. on 22-Jun-1998

Hello people, it's me again!

I've read all your notes to my forum's message 'Noteworthy Source-Code !!',
and first of all I want to establish, that I'am not interested in
Noteworthy Composer's source code (Copyright!). My statement,
mentioned above, was only a stimulation for you, but the
'Upper Language Extension' was actually meant.

I don't believe, that all users are completely satisfied with NWC as they state.
Many unrealized wishes and critics, which you can read in the Forum, prove that.
The main critics are, that NWC does'nt implement basic features eg. n-tuplets,
multiple voices in one system, a.s.o. Why does'nt Noteworthy
behaves a little bit like a word processor, when you think
about the edit functions, for example why is it not possible
to copy/paste/insert in more than one staff at once?
Inserting empty bars in all staffs individually is like a punishment, isn't it?

Maybe your ideas will come true, but in how many years, if at all?

Best regards, Anne-Sophie

P.S.
In spite of all, I don't doubt Noteworthy is a good program
(especially because of it's price), but I think it's a little bit
exaggerated to make an ideology out of it. Finally I didn't intend
to offend anybody of the users and of Noteworthy.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Jun-1998

No offense taken. We are all frustrated by some obviously missing features. Unfortunately each person's obvious missing features are different. We may have to wait months or years for what we want, but releasing source code or diverting effort to release an interface or macro language will mean we wait even longer. Meanwhile what he have now is quite usable.

Reply 2 offered by: X on 22-Jun-1998

(judging by the apostrophes, I think I know who this 'guy' is.)

"does'nt"

...

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Crossley on 23-Jun-1998

May I suggest you send your wish list in the usual way to NWC. If users then feel implementation is too slow I suggest we offer to contribute to the cost of development by paying for the up-grades.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 23-Jun-1998

Liebe Anne-So,
Warum läßt du nicht deine e-mail Adresse wenn du eine neue Message einfangst ?
Dann würdest du wissen wenn jemand antwort... Sehr angenehm.

Well, that's said, I think you see us NWC users as people adorating their God and praying He realizes their dream.
As you do a parallel between word-processor and NWC, I'd like to say that if NWC becomes as complex as µ$oftWord or others, I'm sure that many users will let NW go its own way alone --without them. If we want a complete software, we already can find many --with at bad hotline, no discussion a.s.o. (and so on).
You want to do the same insert into multi-staves simultaneously ? I do this since more than 2 years (to create fugues à la J.S.Bach) with one keystroke. Use your brains and MacroRecorder (one of the 2 good programs µ$ ever sold : that one and FlightSimulator III) and you'll do much things that you still cannot imagine.

What misses in NWC is, as you state it, n-uplets, but also some "word-processing" facilities such as Search, Replace. If you need it, add it to the wishlist. As I did. And if enough people ask for it, Eric will do it asap. But he's the sole captain aboard.
If you really think that NWC should be done like a "stone-soup-group-software" (take a look at FractInt rather than Linux), then a better way would be that Eric give us programmers the way to implement plug-ins. That way each plug-in has its own author which is responsible of bugs... And the nightmare may start.

I do not say that NWC is the best ever-written program. But it is a _good_ one. I did a notator (under DOS at that time) myself and this one is really clever, easy-to-use, consistant (except 789 instead of 879 for alterations maybe) and... evolutive. No matter the price. Many of NWC users have also used other notators. Don't you wonder why ?
Well, anyway, if you have good ideas that you know how to implement (in C++ or whatever), you could submit it to Eric :-)

P.S. to 'X' : I only read "does'nt" once, and it came from someone from .nz... I guess it ain't the same person.

Viel Spaß

                Dominique

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Jun-1998

I think Noteworthy can be thought of as a word processor for music, while programs like Finale and Encore are more like desktop publishers - unintuitive, difficult to use, but powerful. There was a time when serious work was only done with desktop publishers, and word processors were cute toys for beginners. Well, the word processors grew up, and have pushed DTP aside. I think the same thing will happen with music notators. Whether Noteworthy grows up and takes over, or stagnates and withers away remains to be seen. I am not sure how much further one guy can take it, as good as it has been so far.


#698: Swing 8ths
Swing 8ths

(698)

Submitted by: Jonathan on 22-Jun-1998

Hi everyone, it's me again!!!
I'm writing a jazz tune, and it sounds really stupid with straight 8ths. Is there any way to set it to play swing 8ths without literally changing it to 2 tied triplet 8ths and another triplet 8th.
Thanks for any help!!!

Jonathan

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Jun-1998

I know what you mean - it's like trying to run in lead boots!
The only solution to your problem is to export as a Midi to a sequencer that can quantize at different strengths.
Most sequencers will do this - Cakewalk et al.
A strength of 62% seems about right - it adds the swing without creating a 12/8 feel.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 23-Jun-1998

Also refer to msg #373#reply5 where Andrew give a good turn-around. The macro recorder is really useful :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Andre on 26-Jun-1998

What I do (it can be a little annoying at times) is
make 2 successive 8th notes into a quarter-eighth triplet.
That's how almost how swinging is done in real life

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew P on 26-Jun-1998

I agree with Barry that making it into full triplets (which I wrote a RECORDER macro - Marsu has said several times recently how useful macros are - to do very easily) swings it a little too far. It'd be nice to have something in there which let us specify time weigtings for groups.
I know we've discussed this before, becuase I remember talking about options not only for swinging duplets, but also for swinging triplets to give jigs the right feel.

Andrew


#700: Score Print Preview
Score Print Preview

(700)

Submitted by: John Young on 22-Jun-1998

Everytime I try to look at my score print preview, its so small
that I connot see if I made any mistakes, is there a way to in large the score and the fonts to see it more clearly,
Please teach me how.
Thank you
John

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 23-Jun-1998

Plave your cursor over the preview screen - a zoom indicator will appear. Use the mouse to zoom out/in.

Reply 2 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 23-Jun-1998

I also find expanding the print preview window to full screen much better to view, but its a shame it doesnt stay that way after you close it.
Adam


#701: 1.51a/HP500C Problem Solved
1.51a/HP500C Problem Solved

(701)

Submitted by: Jim Lendvay on 23-Jun-1998

IT WORKS!!!

Thanks go to Phil, who had the solution, and apparently the same Matrox video setup that I have.

I owe you a beer!

Sincerely,

Jim

Reply 1 offered by: Phil Allwood on 27-Jun-1998

I'm glad I was able to help. I'll have the drink this evening when I'm out, thanks.


#702: Insert/Text expression/Staff Position
Insert/Text expression/Staff Position

(702)

Submitted by: raul robledo on 24-Jun-1998

Is there any way to set up only once the staff position
when inserting multiples text that are to be placed all
at the same line ? Is a lost of time having to point with
the mouse to the line desired or changing the staff position
box each time.
The Expression, Preserve Width an Display Font boxes remain unchanged once they are setted, but does not happens the same width the staff position.

Reply 1 offered by: Paul on 24-Jun-1998

1) Insert the first instance of the text.
2) Put the cursor to the LEFT of the text (or anchor), hold down the shift key, and press the right arrow key to select the text.
3) Hold down the Ctrl key and press C to copy the text into the copy buffer.
4) Move the cursor to the horizontal position you wish to place the next instance of the text. Vertical position does not matter.
5) Hold down the Ctrl key and press V to insert the text at the cursor position.
6) Repeat steps 4 and 5 until all instances of the text have been inserted. You can also move to a different staff (Page Up/Page Dn) and insert the text.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 25-Jun-1998

Raul,
to make things go quicker use the keyboard rather than the mouse.
To move Text items up/down once they're placed, refer to msg #665
Otherwise the solution Paul gives overhere is good too. But you have to make all your text items in the same time.
Note that he uses the kbd keystrokes instead of mouse-clicking menus... :-)

Note : Ctrl-Insert is the same as Ctrl-C (copy from window to clipboard)
Shift-Insert              Ctrl-V (copy from clipboard to window)
Shift-Del                  Ctrl-X (move from window to clipboard)
This may save time for right-handed people. Unless you use Ctrl with the right hand, which I doubt. Few users did learn type-writing... :-)

Hope this helps.

Reply 3 offered by: Batchman on 26-Jun-1998

Fine for inserting repeated text, but what I really want
to have is the ability to set a default position for
dynamics (pp/p/f/ff/etc.). Nearly all the time, I want the
dynamic markings to go in the same place on the staff (-12).
Why can't I set it up so that that's always the value in
the staff position box, instead of the current vertical
position of the cursor? Usually the current vertical position of the
cursor is wherever my note values happen to be, and nobody puts
dynamic markings there in the middle of the staff...

- seb

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 26-Jun-1998

I usually make it two octaves below middle line, and then it's just two keystrokes (Ctrl-Down) to get there.
Also, if you do all the dynamics at the same time, just use the left and right arrow (or control arrow) keys to keep on the same line.
Lastly, in my macros, I have one which adjusts the vertical position of such entities so that having got it wrong, it's not to hard to change. I WISH M$ had a new macro recorder for Windows 95, but they don't so we're stuck with 3.1's.
Andrew


#703: Broken Triplets
Broken Triplets

(703)

Submitted by: Dale Lewis on 24-Jun-1998

My father is a retiree who in his early years was an outstanding sax player (invited to audition by Benny
Goodman). He was given Cakewalk, but found that it did
not offer all the features that he desired, to do some
transcribing of many of his old scores. This is a copy
of his comment regarding his need--------

"The key for me, with any of these programs is whether a program can notate broken triplets and triplets which tie notes to other notes. Cakewalk couldn't, and that was a
fatal deficiency for me. The lag behind the beat and the susequent catching up is what gives jazz music that
laid-back feeling which the best jazz has."

Does Noteworthy Composer offer this kind of function, and
if not, can any of you recommend an alternate program, that
I could suggest to Dad? Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated.....I will check into the newsgroup, and post this question through that resource as well.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 25-Jun-1998

Dale, I'm not sure to understand what you call "broken triplets".
If you mean : a note, a rest, a note, all this being a triplet, NWC can do it. It can even do triplets of rests ;-) or 2 rests and a note.
About triplets tied to other notes, if it is what I think of course NWC can do it. But I wonder why cakewalk can't?
Do not hesitate to try NWC yourself as it is a shareware --not the perfect professional engraver tool, but can do many many types of scores though.

Hope this helps, and congrats to your father for such a musical level :)

Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: Kurtis Henderson on 29-Jul-1998

Dale,
I can't find a way to get a tripled note by itself, but I did manage to get two notes tripled as apposed to three. First, you place the two wanted notes in a triple. The third note is erased later. You can't erase the unwanted note while it is connected to the other two notes, but you can highlight the two wanted notes, copy them by either going to Edit/Copy or go to the copy button next to the little pair of scissors. Then, you paste the two notes where ever you want them. Also, if you need a single triple and it is immediatly preceded by a quarter note, you can place four trippled notes by placing two sets of two trippled notes and tie in the first three together and leave the last one untied. Remember, you have to tie the notes one note at a time, or else it won't work. You'll have to pracice that to see what you can do with ie i.e.;
try smaller notes.
Finally, if it is just on the computer and not going to be used as reading material, you can try tempo changes. It probably won't work well, but it might.
Hope this helps!
Kurtis Henderson
Sorry if it is confusing!:)

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 30-Jul-1998

Does this make any musical sense? I think it will be treated as a bug report. One time I reported that chording grace notes with regular notes didn't work quite right, and they responded by removing the ability to do it at all.

Reply 4 offered by: Chris Schiel on 13-Aug-1998

Dale,
The answer is yes. There are a bunch of way you can do this.
You can make a broken triplet (I.E. Note - Rest - Note) by
by simply highlighting the notes and using the triplet
option. Same goes for quarter note, eighth note. And any
other possible combination as well. Just make sure you have
all the notes in before you try to triplet them.

Also to tie a triplet to the next non-triplet note, write
the phrase as though it were not a triplet, except tie the
last note of the would-be triplet to the next note. Then
triplet the notes you would like to triplet. So the answer
is yes, there should be no problem.

chris


#704: evaluating - questions and comments
evaluating - questions and comments

(704)

Submitted by: Carolyn on 25-Jun-1998

Just began evaluating shareware. Printout is outstanding!! using HP 672C. However, when I added several staves of music to my song, the printout went berserk, size-wise. Threw the last bars onto a second page, changed font size. I have no idea what I did to make that happen. Ideas?

Also, this piece started out as score with one vocal line plus piano. But when I added the second line of vocal score, it appears to be joined to the first set of three staves, and likewise the second line of the "piano" part. And the brace has disappeared. Is it necessary to re-invent the wheel every time one adds another line of each part?

I read a review that talked about Noteworthy being an "intuitive" program, and tend to agree. Comments?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Jun-1998

It is very difficult to ascertain what you are doing wrong without actually looking at the file. Something to note, however: you only add staves to the extent that you have individual parts to be played. The actual grouping of the staves into systems that fit onto the printed page is done by NWC. See the samples for a good indication of how to do this. You can also send your file to support, where we can look at it and indicate where the problem is taking place.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 26-Jun-1998

Moreover, you have to know that when you add a staff, it is always placed at the bottom. (let's go to the wish list to ask to add it under the current :-)
If it is not there that you want it, simply go to Staff/Move (Alt-s, v) and move it where you want to (on Upper piano part I guess).

Good evaluation, and do not hesitate to ask for files if you want more examples (those that NWC gives are enough though, including models)

Dominique

Reply 3 offered by: Carolyn Conyers on 26-Jun-1998

Thanks for the replies. I cut and pasted the passages I had entered wrongly, so that everything displayed out to the right. Printout then worked beautifully, as did the cut and paste. Score printed very well. The ease of beaming notes is worth the price of the license. I will send in the order form today! Really appreciate the programming skills that have obviously gone into this program!!!

Another quick beginner's question. My score, which is a pretty simple piece, 16 bars, four bars to a system. The last system does not justify the margins like the other systems. That's a disappointment. Any solutions?

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 26-Jun-1998

Carolyn, Welcome to the ranks of the converted!

Re your last system margin query, try Page Setup - Options - Extend Last System.

Best Wishes, Peter.


#706: HELP please new MIDI driver doesn't play right
HELP please new MIDI driver doesn't play right

(706)

Submitted by: Aaron Ramsey on 26-Jun-1998

HELP me please...

I recently got a new MIDI player/driver, the "Yamaha SYXG70". It sounds a whole lot better than my old AWE32 driver, but when I run NWC, i have 2 main problems.

1. The notes are not synchronized with what sound is playing, the sound usually starts a second or two after the visual "note highlights" start.

2. Not all the staves play! I tested out a few songs I made that have just 2 staves (staffs), but only 1 of them plays! And in some, NO staves play!

PLEASE HELP ME!!!!!!!!

And yes, I DID select "Yamaha SYXG70" in the MIDI Options box as my playback instrument.

If anybody replies please send me an E-mail copy of your reply.

Thanks a lot!!!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: drake donahue on 26-Jun-1998

You need to get a 450 mhz dual pentium-II (or faster with even more microprocessers) computer with the not yet available agp bus sound card. :)
Seriously, a software synth places extreme demands on the CPU and therein lies your rub.

Reply 2 offered by: Aaron Ramsey on 26-Jun-1998

In response to your reply, I have decided to switch back to my old AWE32.

Reply 3 offered by: Shane Turner on 27-Jun-1998

I got the Yamaha synth back in december, and have found
that sounds much better than AWE and I use it with NWC.
I had the same problems you had.
For the record: I have a K6-200 so its not exactly the
fastest machine avaliable either (still good enough tho).

First of all that delay unfortunately happens no matter
what, but if you can put up with the delay then you'll
find that it is entirely worh it.

As far as some of the notes not playing... well I had
that problem. There are two possible reasons I know of:

1. You should check the Yamaha setup:
The synth allows you to select sound quality
(up to 44khz cd quality) and also polyphony (the maximum
notes that can be played at one time).

I'm just guessing that the main problem is that polyphony is
set too low for your MIDIs. You can set it up to 128! but
that really taxes your processor so you should be able to
set it around 48-64 reasonably.

2. You mentioned that you selected Yamaha XG as your
playback device under "Midi Options." But each individual
staff can be set to a different synth. Move through each
staff, and press F2 to access the staff properties and check
to see that each staff is set to Yamaha XG. Sometimes
when nothing was playing it was only because that an
individual staff or two had no playback device selected...

It can be a bit of a pain at first, but it just takes
getting used to the setup. NWC allows you to access
the patch banks so that you can use all of the Yamaha's
drum kits (which put AWE's drums to shame), and all of the
600 or whatever instruments are available. :)

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 17-Oct-2001

First of all, even with a K6-266 (somewhat "old" compared to new machines), there is a way to configure the "Yamaha Soft Synthesizer S-YZXG50 MIDI system" to make it play in "real-time". You can adjust it to start asap, or to use not more than 30% of CPU for example.
I've played a bit with fine tunings on that driver and finally found a sound that starts at the moment wanted (ie when it's highlighted in NWC or when I hit the key using Piano1.1), and with a sufficient quality --better than my SB16 anyway!

HTH, then.

I had showed this to a friend of mine who plays viola and theorb, and he asked me if it was possible to use that software for organ sounds , like using soundfonts.
Whichi I don't know.
Is there a software that allows this (using soudfonts or something like that) , without needing the latest microwave-processor (i.e. more than 1.2 GHz) ???
What would be an other possibility, preferently not too expensive (because, for a reason I can't explain, musicians who play *old* instruments are never much to spend...)

TIA,
Dominique


#708: Sibelius Cometh (or not?)
Sibelius Cometh (or not?)

(708)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 27-Jun-1998

There's been a lot said recently about the supposed shortcomings of NWC in comparison with 'professional' notators such as Encore or Sibelius (see msg #629 and msg #690). The price for Windows Sibelius has now been announced. It's 'only' £695 (around $1000). Anybody feeling really rich?? Unless you're a professional composer/arranger, or a well heeled amateur these mainstream programs are well and truly out of reach. Thank heavens for the fantastic value NWC - maybe it doesn't do everything we would like, but many work arounds have been documented both here, in tips and on the newsgroup. And upgrades keep on coming!

Peter.

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 27-Jun-1998

Speaking only to Encore, many of the "advanced" features are right for some schools of notation but wrong for others. The threads we've generated about implementing ornaments and multi voices make clear that a single notation can have various meanings.

Reply 2 offered by: James Bullock on 16-Jul-1998

With regard to the Sibelius price tag of 695UKP, what happened with the Acorn version is that there are four flavours :
Sibelius 7 £695
Sibelius 7 Student £400
Sibelius 6 £120
Sibelius Junior £50

So i'm sure that this will be mirrored with the Pc version


#710: Grace Notes
Grace Notes

(710)

Submitted by: MaryAnn on 28-Jun-1998

I just upgraded to 1.51 and found the new grace note feature. Hallelujah! However, why are they not flagged? How do I get them to beam when I have several? Also, can I get them to not break a beam if they come in the middle of several already beamed notes, such as 16th? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Curt Watts on 28-Jun-1998

I was just wondering the same thing.. It doesn't seem like you can beam the notes again after you've put in the grace note.. Is this something for the next version?? =)

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 29-Jun-1998

To beam several grace notes together, simply select them and then type ^B.
Right now you can't avoid breaking beams when you insert ANYTHING!

Far be it from me to 2nd guess Eric, but that's never stopped me before...

Let's hope Eric will do something about breaking beams, as many people have complained about not being able to insert text, dynamics, or - now - grace notes.

I'd also like next version to include some options on grace notes as to whether I play them before or after the start of the note, and how quickly they should be played.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: MaryAnn on 30-Jun-1998

Sorry, I just found out that you can select the value of grace notes (who would have thought that you could choose to make grace notes whole notes?!) so I apologize for asking a stupid question about beaming grace notes but yes, this issue of grace notes breaking beams is a consideration for upgrades. I am sure I am not the first one to put it on the wish list.

MaryAnn


#711: zooming in Preview
zooming in Preview

(711)

Submitted by: Marsu on 29-Jun-1998

Hi all happy NWC users,

I'd just want to know your opinion about the zoom in Print/Preview.
On a slow computer (slow means a 486-dx2-66 now), when you're displaying only a part of the page, you can notice a freeze-time that must correspond to the off-window display.
This is not very troublesome, but when I use the scrollbars, it doesn't scroll as I expect to (I supposed that clicking on the arrow would scroll a tenth of the display, and clicking on the scrollbar would move half the display (or 9/10th)). This becomes somewhat lengthy to display the particular zone I want to, especially as the place where you click onto doesn't matter for the new position. In fact the new zoomed position corresponds exactly to the scrollbar indexes current settings.
Is that kind of behaviour annoying someone else ?

By the way, using keystrokes would be great in that part too :-)

NWCly yours,
                Dominique

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 29-Jun-1998

Yes, it should zoom around the place you click rather than the top left corner. I click on the spot because I want a closer look at it, then it disappears from view. Also, the window should be sizable so I can use as much as the screen as possible, and it should remember the window position for the next time I enter Print Preview. Maybe it should remember the position in the music it was looking at too. Then I could toggle between making a change and seeing the effect.

Those are (reasonable) wishes. I can dream of a modeless preview window that is visible and shows updates while I make changes in the score.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 29-Jun-1998

Yes, zooming on where I click would be much more useful.
Remembering position would be neat, too.

A


#712: Measure numbers every 5 measures
Measure numbers every 5 measures

(712)

Submitted by: Marsu on 29-Jun-1998

On many scores, the measure number is written each and every 5 measures rather than at each new staff line. This is great when working with landscape mode scores.
Does anyone else would like to have that kind of feature available in NWC ?

NWCly yours,
             Dominique

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 29-Jun-1998

Yes, Dominique.

I agree it should be added to the wish list.

Reply 2 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 29-Jun-1998

I prefer the Boxed letters font as posted on the newsgroup to numbers. To many opportunities for mistakes, especially on large scores.Not only that, but the graphics for compressed rests in the boxes font are a godsend!
Adam

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 30-Jun-1998

I don't prefer one option over the other: I would like
to have both !

Reply 4 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 30-Jun-1998

Hi Adam

I would like to have a copy of the Boxed letters font that you mention in your post. Please could you mail me a copy? Much appreciated.

Sergio.


#713: Publishing Scores
Publishing Scores

(713)

Submitted by: Anonymous on 29-Jun-1998

I'd like to share this with you...

Firstly, this is how I use NoteWorthy:
1. import a midi file from my sequencing software.
2. fix up any mistakes with the rests, and add dynamics.
3. copy to clipboard as metafile a conductor's score and inidividual parts.
4. paste into Publisher 97 into my template (with my own titles, copyright info, address, etc.)
5. print out all the pages.

And from there I either print out the parts, or use the publish to web feature (and get a gif file from publisher 97). I may also scan in the printouts to get better gif files than the publisher ones. (I sometimes have to scan in a printout to add some markings not provided in NWC)

Q: Why do I want gifs?
A: It's easier to manage the pieces. I can batch print gifs so if I need another copy of a piece I can get the complete chart with a couple of clicks. I can also email a whole piece to any orchestra in the world. And the person receiving the work usually has a program to print out gifs. (and they can print in landscape or portrait, according to the part)

Q: Why do I do it this way?
A: Because I can use the wonderful resultant NWC staves in my own published music. Also because this way (in my opinion) is infinitely better and faster than using Finale, or Encore, etc. (I'm sure of this because I know the average time it takes to publish a piece)

Q: Do I find a problem with this method?
A: No, only that Noteworthy can't do drum tracks (and that is a pity). :(

I'd love to read how other users use Noteworthy to publish scores...

I'd also like to know what others think of my method, (please email!).

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 30-Jun-1998

I published a book of six scores centred around hammered dulcimer last year (a second volume perhaps later this year...).
We used M$ Word for the text and simply printed the score (full score in the book and separate parts as separate sheets) straight from NWC. My main beefs with doing it this way were
1) No running headers or footers
2) Couldn't configure the page numbers how we wanted, but just did them anyway
3) Couldn't configure the title text font, but that's changed with the later version
4) We really needed more lines for composer/arranger info.
5) Would've been nice to add a graphic or two to NWC (rather than the reverse, which is what we all have to do at the moment).
6) Not being able to manually kick around the staffs (ie when a new line should be started, etc) was a real pain, as we often would end up with a single staff on a new page.

My main problem with importing huge WMF files was that they often wouldn't resize correctly. I must visit the problem again and see if I can work out why (it may have vanished in the most recent version).

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Dem on 30-Jun-1998

On my page setup options page (as you can guess) is set to not include title page info or page numbers, etc. It's great that NWC has given us these options...but not forced us to use them!

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 01-Jul-1998

I haven't found a satisfactory way to publish yet, but I'm
working on it. I won't be using Publisher, though, but I am
curious: what do you mean that it creates poorer gif files
than a scanned image? You'd think the ideal way would be
to convert directly from WMF to GIF....

Reply 4 offered by: Anonymous on 01-Jul-1998

>> what do you mean that it creates poorer gif files
>> than a scanned image?

Well, I think the scanned image has much softer edges, that's all. (and I can set the res. of the scan to get the size image I need.)

>> You'd think the ideal way would be
>> to convert directly from WMF to GIF....

You're right, but I like to drag and drop images/text on some of the pages of my scores, so I do it in Publisher. It would be even good to get gifs out of NWC but I think it wouldn't be used much at all. (even I wouldn't use it.)

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 02-Jul-1998

An interesting thread, this and it prompted me to do a bit of experimenting. I favour Page Plus for my publishing, I've found it accepts the NWC metafile (copy from page preview) accurately and quickly, then I can play around with fancy titles, extra symbols etc. at my leisure. But the finished files tend to be quite large, particularly if one wants to send them to someone else either on a floppy or e-mail, so I had a look at file sizes with the following results:

These figures are for a single page not too complex score, and the compression system used was Winzip

Original Compressed (file size in bytes)

wmf 157,290 36,579
gif (300 dpi) 86,028 86,043
PagePlus (wmf) 245,114 44,758
PagePlus (gif) 173,848 94,755

A self extracting Winzip .exe of the wmf Page Plus file was approx. 64,600 bytes.

The .gif file, being already compressed, didn't benefit from Winzip, but it's interesting to note that the metafile ended up less than half the size of the gif, even when embedded in Page Plus. I favour metafiles because they are fully scaleable without loss of definition - the 32 bit NWC doesn't save metafiles directly to disc, but I'm using 16-bit at the moment.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 02-Jul-1998

Oops! Lost the spacing in transmission. Here is the table again, spaced with underscores - I hope this works:

_______________Original Compressed (file size in bytes)

wmf___________ 157,290___ 36,579
gif (300 dpi)__ 86,028___ 86,043
PagePlus (wmf) 245,114___ 44,758
PagePlus (gif) 173,848___ 94,755

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 02-Jul-1998

Well, that'll have to do!. Just a quick further point of interest - Page Plus supports booklet printing - set the pages in A5 size, then the program can print A4 paper with the pages correctly collated to form a booklet. Page Plus is available from Serif (http://www.serif.com ) I hasten to add I've no connection with Serif other than as a satisfied customer!

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew on 02-Jul-1998

Well. I may need something like that! I think my COrelDraw 4.0 is a bit too old for Eric's metafil format. I find some of it really hard to scale. I'll experiment and get back to you (maybe try Word 98, too!)

btw: wouldn't it be nice if NWC 32 saved metafiles direct to disk! (cc: wishlist!)

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 02-Jul-1998

Furthermore, Andrew : why couldn't NWC export _automatically_ each page to a new page_###.wmf file ? :) Though once again macro recorder may help, it is not "clever" enough!
MAD

Reply 10 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 11 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 12 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 03-Jul-1998

Let me point out a lovely program called IrfanView, which free to one and all.
It will let you view almost any graphic file, including WMF, and convert them to an number of formats (I'm not sure if WMF is among them).
It will also resample the image and perform limited manipulation, including cropping and brightness/contrast/gamma adjustments.
It is avalible at: http://stud1.tuwien.ac.at/~e9227474/
I am just a happy user.

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 13 offered by: warez on 13-Jul-1998

?ten eht no elaniF laodnwod ot ecalp a ereht sI

!xnaht

Reply 14 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 13-Jul-1998

There are two good reasons for not generating .WMF files:
1) Microsoft changes file formats more often than they get
sued.
2) It's not portable: to Apple, Sun, or the MS-Windows
successor. You're unneccessarily limiting your users' target
audience.

So far as I know, as PDF is the only thing resembling a
DTP standard; it's probably the best way to publish digital
score images.

Is Adobe Acrobat the cheapest way to publish .PDF files?
Note that I am trying not to ask for PDF output from NWC.


#714: musical terms
musical terms

(714)

Submitted by: Marsu on 30-Jun-1998

Hi all,
I found an URL that can be of interests for many of us : the "Online Music Dictionary". It can be seen at http://thanatos.uoregon.edu/~lincicum/terms.html (or you can save it onto your system for later instant reference).
Not perfect ("Eighth" should have two definitions) but answers to many basic questions.

And for classical choirs lover, the Silvis Woodshed would be appreciated : http://www.channel1.com/users/gsilvis/

NWCly yours,
            Dominique


#715: WAV to MIDI conversion
WAV to MIDI conversion

(715)

Submitted by: Phil on 30-Jun-1998

Does anyone know of a utility to convert WAV files to MIDI?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 30-Jun-1998

This has already been discussed (use Search in nwc site) such as in msg #464 ; this is heavy mathematics stuff you know :) and often your own ear can do better. But requires some time !

hope this helps!?
                  Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 30-Jun-1998

Also, msg #430 briefly covers this subject, as well as the reverse.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 30-Jun-1998

A rough and ready approach is to use Spectrogram by R.S.Horne - a freeware program available for download through most shareware servers.
Make sure you get the latest version which allows the spectrum display to be plotted on a log scale.
It doesn't do the conversion but you can read off the frequencies in the sample.
It helps if you have a chart or spreadsheet of the frequencies of notes on the tempered scale.
If you use a spreadsheet you can change the base frequency if the sample is off pitch.
Useful for determining the harmonic content of shot chords but it is clouded by harmonics and overtones.
Transcribe be ear first then fill the gaps using Spectrogram. Try it!

Reply 4 offered by: James Foster on 27-Oct-1999

Have a look Digital Ear.

They have a free demo on their WEB site. I think

http://digitalear.iwarp.com/

This program is BY FAR better than autoscore or sound2midi

If I remember well the full version costs about $65

Cheers,

--James

Reply 5 offered by: Joe on 14-Nov-1999

AutoScore, Sound2Midi, and Digital Ear only work with wav files containing one note at a time (monophonic). If your wav files contain more than one note at a time, such as chords (polyphonic), I suggest you give intelliScore a try. You can download a free trial copy at http://www.intelliscore.net

Reply 6 offered by: Herman on 03-Dec-1999

I just found out that I have I problem.
I need to now how to make a MP3 or a wav to Midi.
please help me...

/Herman

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Dec-1999

See the thread below. Especially the last reply (#7) which offers an excellent analogy to what you're trying to accomplish here.

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/0/585.htm

Reply 8 offered by: payonidhi on 04-Feb-2000

How to convert WAV files into MIDI files any software is in the market,If you know the software mail me

Reply 9 offered by: Bengt Werstén on 15-Mar-2000

Check out Akoff Music Composer.
It works very good.
http://www.akoff.com

Reply 10 offered by: Martin Lopez on 02-Jun-2000

Try Digital Ear. http://digitalear.iwarp.com/

Reply 11 offered by: jkhkjhkj on 19-Jun-2000

jhkjhkjhkjhkj


#716: Octave change indicator
Octave change indicator

(716)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 30-Jun-1998

Hi All,

So glad to see the NWC forum alive and well! Lots of new users joining all the time, I really enjoy reading the posts.

Does anyone know if NWC can print the "8va" marking or the Treble clef with the little "8" attached to the bottom (a different sort of tenor clef)? I have searched in the NWC help for the word "octave" but have come up empty. Alas, I do not know the proper term for the "8va" designation, or for the treble-tenor clef. If anyone can educate me as to the proper terminology, that too would be helpful! Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 30-Jun-1998

Sue

When you set up your clef (C key or Insert Clef) you will see an Octave shift box.
Inside that you will find 3 entries - None, Octave Up or Octave Down.

For the Tenor Clef, select octave down. This will give you the clef with an 8 underneath it and the stave will play an octave lower.

NoteWorthy does not support 8va, 15ma ,8va bassa etc as such and so you have to insert a clef with an 8 above or below it (as described above) to get the effect in the middle of a stave.
To return to normal just enter a clef on its own without the 8 above or below it. This is sometime written as Loco in the music.

According to my dictionary, the term for these is :

8va all'ottava
8va bassa ottava bassa
15ma quindicesima (Play 2 octaves higher)

HTH

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 30-Jun-1998

Hi Richard, thanks for the quick reply! I just upgraded my work machine from 1.50 to 1.51a, and I see the "octave up/down" box you mention. I will have to look on my other (home) machine, which still has 1.50 on it, but I do not think that octave box was there (either that or I was very asleep last night when writing this music!) :>

What a great product NWC is, and what great folk are using it! Thanks again for the help and the education.

Sue

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 01-Jul-1998

Sue, you must have been sleepy :)
I think that this feature exists since version 1.21 (maybe 1.10 but ain't sure).
Anyway you could ask Eric (NWC author) to add a link in the online help about octavas and the li'l 8 above or under the clef. :)

NWCly yours


#717: share arrangements?
share arrangements?

(717)

Submitted by: johnti on 30-Jun-1998

Hullo,

I am always after midi files and arrangements of unusual duets, trios and quartets (without the piano and drums) in classical and jazz style. Also I like to see other people's noteworthy files. Can we use this thread for other people to list their website where they have pieces of music they implement with noteworthy composer?
and, if you have duets to quartets in midi or nwc format, please send them to me.

i thank you.
johnti.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 01-Jul-1998

Johnti,
I think you can already find _many_ on http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/userlinks.htm !
Maybe this would need some more precision though ?

HTH

Reply 2 offered by: Phil on 01-Jul-1998

I think that's a great idea, johnti. I also am interested in receiving NWC files, particularly quartets which could be used for a woodwind quartet (Flute, Oboe, Clarinet, Bass Clarinet). I would be quite happy to exchange files with you.

Phil.


#719: 2 fonts for lyrics
2 fonts for lyrics

(719)

Submitted by: marsu on 02-Jul-1998

Hi all,
I'm looking for a solution to the following problem :
When I have scores with many lyrics (let's say 8), I'd like that the 1, 3, 5, 7 be in straigt font, and the 2, 4, 6, 8 be in italic font. Has someone found a workaround ?

TIA,
    Dominique P.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 02-Jul-1998

Hi Dominique,

I don't know a direct workaround. I'm afraid it's back to what I used to do before we had user definable fonts, namely leave enough space between the staves (using Staff Properties - Vertical Size) and copy the page from Print Preview into a suitable Publishing program. Then add the lyrics 'manually' as required. It does have the advantage that you can emphasise particular sections, and it's not too bad once you get into it. Now that we've got user definable fonts, it's always worth putting the first line of lyrics in with NWC - it helps to get the slurs and ties correct.

Hope this helps, Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: KenJ on 02-Jul-1998

I would think that since fonts are connected to the staves, that you would have to add another staff and put the alternating verses underneath. It would look a little strange, or even confusing, with 1, 3, 5, and 7 under one staff and 2, 4, 6, and 8 under another.

I would stick with numbering the verses. You could indent alternating verses with underline characters, if you think that would help.

Otherwise, put it on the 'Wishlist' using the link on the title page of this website.

KenJ

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 02-Jul-1998

Nope.
I was hoping to extend Ken's suggestion to use lyrics at the bottom of one staff and the top of the other, but realised that they'd still sue the same font anyway.
How about doing Lyrics 1,3,5,7 as per normal, and then using
good ol' ttext inserts for the rest? (Blechhh!)

A

Reply 4 offered by: Marsu on 02-Jul-1998

Peter, KenJ, Andrew, thanks for the replies ! So there is just one solution left : add a wish :)
But still hesitate between a font per lyric line, or simply a checkbox named 'italic' ??

P.S. Andrew, thanx for the news Cc:maillist !!! IT WORKS !!!! :) :) :) :)

Dominique

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Bowers on 02-Jul-1998

I would vote for a button for italic or bold a la your typical word processor.

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew on 02-Jul-1998

That's a very good idea.

A

Reply 7 offered by: X on 02-Jul-1998

What if...

Set your page margins to about 5 inches from the bottom in page setup. Preview and copy to clipboard. Paste into DTP. (desktop publisher/word processor)

Make your page look like this:

---- ---- (staves)
---- ----
---- ----
---- ----

.... .... (text)
.... ....
.... ....
.... ....

Type out the text in your word processor under the staves. (marking chorus, and verse in your music). I got this idea from other thread.
I don't want noteworthy to turn into a mini desktop publisher with all these text options you ask for; let them concentrate on getting drum trax, split trax, and the other musical stuff.

X

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Bowers on 06-Jul-1998

I'm not sure the two are mutually exclusive. Text options could conceivably be implemented in such a way as to be available from any point you add text. Most italicized or bold text is done by adding a font with those characteristics (italic or bold) which are then used instead of the normal font (in fact most of the time involved is probably in font creation). If this font were in turn selectable it would be possible to add things like fingering or chord notation by adding a font that would be invoked by the italic or bold button and doing standard text inserts. Obviously, if these NWC files are shared then the fonts would have to be "freely" distributed :-)

Reply 9 offered by: Jo Hindriks on 09-Jul-1998

But what if I want to put in cyrillic (=russian) text?
for instance for a russian folk song or something like that
I can select my cyrillic font for the lyrics, but don't see
the appropriate characters in the lyrics menu, virtually
forcing me to type "blind" and going back and forth to the
actual score to see if I made any mistakes.

Tying in to the above discussion: I don't understand what is
so hard in just invoking the fonts everyone already has on
his computer in windows, like all other windows programs do.

Just my 0.02

Reply 10 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Jul-1998

> I can select my cyrillic font for the lyrics, but don't
> see the appropriate characters in the lyrics menu

Goto Tools, Options, Editor, and uncheck: Use light font in dialogs

You will now see the same font in the lyric editor as in the staff.


#720: Great !
Great !

(720)

Submitted by: Mad on 02-Jul-1998

Hi you all!
I just found that in the template directory, you can enter as many directories as you want, it will be ok in the "Song Template" window! :)
I thought it was limited to 5 (+ general=6), but I just saw that 2 arrows appear on the right !! Combined with & for Alt-access (see http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip4.htm#shorttab), this is GREAT !
Now I have to move my templates to their new proper place !

Houba!


#721: help no notes
help no notes

(721)

Submitted by: leslie johnson on 02-Jul-1998

I composed a page of sheet music but no notes printed, and i have a really messed up staff.
I don't know what to do. Can you help?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 02-Jul-1998

Can you normally print from any other software? NWC uses the normal print driver, no magic, unless it didn't instal correctly, and the font NWC15a is not available to the printer driver (in which case your screen would not look it had music on it).

With the messy staff, what do you mean by messy?
With note entry, NWC works as an infinite left to right scroll. DON'T create new staffs unless it is for the other hand of the piano, or another instrument. NWC takes care of where to "wrap around at the end of the line".
If this is what you have done, simply select and cut each subsequent line's notes, pasting them back onto the first staff.
If this is not what you have done, you'll need to give more details to get more help.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Phil Allwood on 04-Jul-1998

Are you using a Matrox video card? It sounds like it could be related to the bug in the drivers for this card (which Matrox still haven't fixed after 6 months or more since Microsoft discovered it).
It is necessary to turn off the "Use PowerGDU acceleration" in the "Settings/Powerdesk" of Display Properties.

Reply 3 offered by: leslie johnson on 04-Jul-1998

I can see the staves on the computer, but when i go to add notes the first one goes on fine but the others disappear. What am i doing wrong.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Jul-1998

Bar lines are important. If you have not added any, then you will only see as much of the first measure (which would be the whole score if no bar lines are present) as will fit in the first system. If you have bar lines added, then there must be something else that is wrong, perhaps with your print or display driver.


#723: NWC NewsGroup in your mailbox :-)
NWC NewsGroup in your mailbox :-)

(723)

Submitted by: Marsu on 03-Jul-1998

Hi all,

I finally found a solution for all of us poor people which do not have access to the newsgroup (because of firewalls, or whatever).

Now if any subscribed (cf. hereunder) user of the newsgroup adds
NwcNewsByEmail@listbot.com as a recipient, the post will also be sent to the people which have subscribed to the mail-list!!

NewsGroup readers may have seen such a (no, 2) message, that Andrew P. kindly tested for me --succesfully-- !!

For full details, refer to http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/nwcmail.html where I explain everything. If not clear enough, I'll be back on Monday :-) !

PDNHTCM for further details ;^)

Dominique Portier aka MAD

P.S. HopeThisHelps!
P.P.S. Thanx Andrew for the beta-test !

Reply 1 offered by: idem on 07-Jul-1998

5 persons yet (so 3 more, thanx you three!). Maybe more when I getback from holidays ?

NWCly yours
MAD
P.S. please let me know if you find this feature useful!! It will _really_ be if more people use it...


#724: De-install?
De-install?

(724)

Submitted by: Alexander Timothy on 03-Jul-1998

I would be glad if you could help me!

I want to de-install Noteworthy, and i do not know how?

Thanks, for your help.....

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 04-Jul-1998

In Win 95, from the Windows Start Menu, select Settings | Control Panel and choose the Add/Remove Programs applet.
If Noteworthy Composer was properly installed, it'll be in the list, so just select it and off you go!

In Win 3.1, have a look in the Noteworthy program directory for an Uninstall program.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Jul-1998

The uninstall option is placed in the NoteWorthy Composer Program Group (in the Program Manager) when NWC is installed on Win 3.1. Simply run it to uninstall.


#725: Non printing rests
Non printing rests

(725)

Submitted by: Keith Markham on 03-Jul-1998

An added refinement to Noteworthy would be the ability to place a rest in a bar without it showing in the print. Useful for opening bar where the first note is not on the first beat. Also for producing a sort of score with blank bars, allowing the use of an old fashioned pencil on the printout. (? Or have I missed somewhere how to do this?)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 04-Jul-1998

NWC handles anacrusis (oftimes mispronounced by me as aneurism or enuresis !) just fine.
Just enter your note, and then enter the bar line.

To create score paper,
1) create a whole lot of staves with the spacing that you desire
2) go to Page Setup | Options and Extend Last System
3) Print.

_I_ would like to hide rests so that I can do complicated stuff like crossovers from staff to staff on piano scores, or multi part pieces without rests getting in the way (though this second can be fixed by other means viz rests being able to move up or down the staff).

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Keith  on 04-Jul-1998

Thanks for your comments. Your last paragraph really reflects my own feeling - hidden rests would be really useful


#726: Grace notes?
Grace notes?

(726)

Submitted by: Peter Bentley on 04-Jul-1998

Hello folks!

I have a little question.
Why don't you hear the grace notes you had set?

Thanks, for help!

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 04-Jul-1998

We do hear them !

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 05-Jul-1998

There was (for a very brief time) a version of NWC that had silent grace notes (which I liked, actually, 'cos then I could implement them - using a hidden staff) exactly as I wanted to (which I can still do by the way - it's just that we're now nearer, but yet so far...).
Which version of NWC are you using?
What instrument patch? MIDI card?

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 05-Jul-1998

There was (for a very brief time) a version of NWC that had silent grace notes (which I liked, actually, 'cos then I could implement them - using a hidden staff) exactly as I wanted to (which I can still do by the way - it's just that we're now nearer, but yet so far...).
Which version of NWC are you using?
What instrument patch? MIDI card?

Andrew


#727: Pedal and Dynamics for multi staves
Pedal and Dynamics for multi staves

(727)

Submitted by: Robert Shiffman on 04-Jul-1998

Wish list item: Particularly for piano scores, can there be a single Ped...* that would cover both staves? Ditto dynamics, though frequently they vary between staves.

Great program; keep it up!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 05-Jul-1998

Pedal can be on both staves by mapping both staves to the one channel (I think Richard put me onto this, over a year ago...).
I actually like having pedal split though. Can make for some intersting effects.
As for dynamics, I'd LOVE to have an overriding dynamics (like on a conductor score), though as you say, things can (and SHOULD) vary frequently.

Andrew


#728: NoteWorthy Composer 1.51a (windows 95)
NoteWorthy Composer 1.51a (windows 95)

(728)

Submitted by: tom janssen on 05-Jul-1998

I want to buy NoteWorthy Composer 1.51a for windows 95.
I don't have any creditcards.
Is it possible to buy this software in another way.
For example by transcription.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 05-Jul-1998

e-mail Eric directly, and see what he says, but I'd imagine that you could post an International Money Order directly to

NoteWorthy ArtWare, Inc.
PO Box 995
Fuquay-Varina, NC 27526-0995
USA

Reply 2 offered by: Ken Stanton on 06-Jul-1998

I purchased my original Registered Copy from the "Public Domain Software Library" in the UK. There may be a similar Library locally that you could contact. The PDSL is a mail-order company. If you need it I can post the address for you tomorrow.

Reply 3 offered by: Jubal on 07-Jul-1998

Hi Tom: I buy it a NWC througth a Check Order (from Argentina). The check I put it on a letter. I had not any problems. Bye... Bye... Jubal

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 07-Jul-1998

You can also ask a friend to buy it for you. If he/she doesn't want to write it via internet --which I understand-- you also can fax the order.

Read you soon on the forum ! :-)

Reply 5 offered by: song in chul on 25-Jul-1998

I Want upgrade

Reply 6 offered by: a on 25-Jul-1998

Upgrades are freely available to registered users from the NWC web site. I don't know how the shareware thing works, but the shareware version is also the most up to date. Most recent version is 1.52, Built on 23 June 1998.


#729: page layout, clef changes, chords
page layout, clef changes, chords

(729)

Submitted by: carolyn conyers on 07-Jul-1998

A couple of beginner questions. The program is great and easy to use. BUT…

Is there any way to control how many bars are printed per system or to break the lines where you want them to break, other than lowering or raising the font size?

A strong factor in the page layout seems to occur when changing clef signs. There is a lot of wasted space on either side of the changed clef. Any way to scrunch that?

I sometimes need to notate a chord in which an inner voice moves and is a different value. I can't do that. I've tried to make sure the stems are different for the moving note, but it doesn't work. The only thing that appears to work is if the moving note is on the top or the bottom of the chord. Correct? Or is there a workaround?

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 07-Jul-1998

Carolyn,
For answers to your 2 questions, you can refer to the msg #680 : there are answers related to chords as well as spacing (find some of the hints in http://www.mygale.org/05/madmarsu/doeba.zip)
What _I_ particularly like in NWC is that I do NOT need to care for the layout. I don't care for where the break lines occurs for a simple reason : I use my scores in MANY differents printed formats. So starting to design my scores for such paper dimension, such setof staves,... would mean much more work.

To break the lines where you want though, refer to the 2 links I gave (plsu some others in the forum, which I do not remember).

If you use your score just for printing, you can insert a clef as a text item ('a' as text for TrebleClef, select NWCV15 in user1 font and set it to your item text) but you'll need to find out a convenient font size. (When I do this i usually take a smaller size than the real one). But I've never found that there was too much sapce before/after the clef... IMHO.

Hope this helps

Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 08-Jul-1998

One improvement that could be introduced (wish list here I come) is that in printed music a clef change is usually indicated by a somewhat smaller clef sign than the one at the start of each line. This would help your problem.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-Jul-1998

Forcing line and page breaks is a common request, which cannot really be done now. You can fiddle with the staff font size, move the left and right margins, or if you have lyrics you can pad the last word in the line with trailing underscores to force the line to break sooner.

I also had the "inner voice" problem. You can consider using the experimental "Staff Layering" feature, described in the user tips and in some threads in the forum (you can search by keyword).


#731: Importing syncopated 4-4
Importing syncopated 4-4

(731)

Submitted by: Sheldon on 08-Jul-1998

I tried to import a midi tune (Clapton's "Wonderful Tonight"),
but it came out rather scrambled. I tried a few things
(like import compound time),but nothing cured it.
Could this be because of a 12-8 tune scored in 4-4?
Does midi even give a time signature? We are new to computer music(and computers in general),
and are checking out what is
around in the way of useful programs for teaching.
Thanks,
Sheldon and Robyn.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Jul-1998

The MIDI file standard does include a time signature. NWC will use the time signature if it is included in the MIDI file. If no time signature is found, then 4/4 is assumed. You can manually change the signature to 12/8, export, then re-import in order to get imported results in 12/8 form.

Reply 2 offered by: Chris on 15-Jul-1998

Many MIDI files, especially popular music, will show up as rather bizzare when notated by a program such as NWC (even far more expensive notation software will give you this problem). A lot of the MIDI files you come across were created by playing a MIDI instrument and not with a notation program. Because of subtle nuisances in playing, the file doesn't always fit real well into notation, even if it sounds pretty good when played through a MIDI player. You can help yourself by setting time signatures and playing around with the note duration settings when importing. I have often found, however, that I have to do some serious editing of rhythms and there is no other way around it.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 16-Jul-1998

Absolutely. To help with rhythm editing, you can set up a macro to automatically actually change groups of notes (say a triplet or more complex pattern) into a set rhythmic pattern. I know I'm flogging a dead horse here (euthanased by ms themselves) but recorder macros are really really useful.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Sheldon on 19-Jul-1998

ok, I tried editing the scores to l2/8, then exporting,
then reimporting, but I got the same thing back.
(I guess that's not too surprising...)
Thanks for the tips,I can see it's a common problem. I'll
keep hacking away at it.
P.S.- Oops! That tune was Louis Armstrong's What A Wonderful World,
obtained at the Art Bell web site (www.artbell.com ,look for
bumper music)


#732: Drum Flams
Drum Flams

(732)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 08-Jul-1998

The instrument I am competent of playing is Drums,
and one of the neat tricks you can do on them is to
play a crack sound on each note. For instance one
may play succesive eighths in 2/4 as " tak-tak tak-tak"
and the first eighth can be a flam: " crack-tak tak-tak",
the introduction of the second beating on the first eighth
having no effect on the timing of the rest. I tried to
overcome this by introducing a last 64th hit after the 4th
eighth of the previous measure and the second 64th of the
first eight to which the flam effect is to be introduced.
This however becomes noticable in low
metronome speeds. The actual notation of this in Drum
music sheets is the NWC equivelant of an accent note,
however this does not work.

Reply 1 offered by: Lance on 09-Jul-1998

Are you asking about flams, which really look like grace notes, or those that you said "look like nwc accents"which are really rolls? If you mean the first ones, then you can use real grace notes. If not, see my response on trills.

Reply 2 offered by: Warren Barnett on 23-Jul-1998

You can't use the grace notes feature because NWC steals time for the grace notes from the following note (often the way it is played on piano) but drum flams always steal from the preceeding note. If you use the grace note feature it will sound wrong but print correctly unless you put the grace note in the middle of a beam and then the beam gets broken up.

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP


#733: crescendos
crescendos

(733)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 08-Jul-1998

I try to create a crescendo effect by using the linear volume sweep on attached notes.
This is done on many instruments together (4 or 5). The problem is that some of the
instruments are not heard afte a few beats. If the rest instruments are muted then the one
that is left to play crescends neatly. If more han two instruments are to be played together,
the crescending instruments silence up. Bug?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Jul-1998

This could be a bug in your sound card, or could be a consequence of how you have assigned your MIDI channels and constructed your multi-point controller sequences. You should probably experiment with the mechanism until you figure out which is the problem in your case.


#734: Soundfont use
Soundfont use

(734)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 08-Jul-1998

If anyone out there can tell me how to use the Soundblaster 64 AWE Gold soundfonts
for introducing new instruments in the available list, I will be very gratefull.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Jul-1998

I think that this is a job best left to your SoundBlaster manual and help documentation. Once you get it, you can add your own custom patch lists into the NTWPATCH.INI file in the NWC program folder that match your custom instrument assignments.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 09-Jul-1998

Have a scrounge through the archive of this forum
(http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/archive/) and you'll find more postings of good sites for awe64 soundfonts. I use a 4Meg soundfont just for general midi, and am very happy with the sound. I don't bother with extra sounds, though I'd love to find some good Indian or Middle Eastern percussion.
Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: CASTRY Alen on 19-Jul-1998

Can there are a personn who can explic me how can I use to better about my sound card, Where can I find udpates of General Midi, MT-32, Numeric 1 and O, I an user of an AWE64 Pnp Card.

Thank you to help me.


#735: importing MIDI & controlling choice of staff
importing MIDI & controlling choice of staff

(735)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 08-Jul-1998

I picked up several MIDI files (from the same source) and
have been importing them to get the music notation. The
original is two-staff, generally 4-part harmony (for the
traditional SATB voices, or for piano or organ. Usually that
is the way the import works. But I have one file where NWC insists
on making the second staff a treble rather than a bass staff.
I can't figure out why: the first few measures are all below
middle C, and the total range is from D above middle C, to
G below middle C. (For the notes that are "too far" from the
treble clef, NWC introduces a third staff, this one properly
bass'ed.) I have tried dinking with the parameters on the
import wizard (with no effect), and deleting the second
staff (which just deletes all the notes on it). Why is the
wizard doing this to me now? (I suspect black magic....) and
how can I exorcise it?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Jul-1998

The choice of clef is automatic during import and cannot be adjusted until AFTER the import has completed. Once you have imported the file, you can easily change the clef by using the procedure at msg #4.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 08-Jul-1998

Thanks for the quick response. I can do this.

But... is there any quick way of merging the two staves?
I wasn't able to force all the notes onto the treble clef--
whatever I did, about 20% of the notes got siphoned off into
the third staff. Is there any way of avoiding this? Or
recovering quickly?

Also...can you give any hints on how the wizard chooses
the clef? (So I could perhaps tweak the .MID file and fake
it out?)

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Jul-1998

You cannot directly combine two staves. However, you can export both into a type 0 MIDI file, then re-import them as one staff. The type 0 option is in Tools, Options.

If you get a third staff, this must be from some other track in the MIDI file. The Wizard will only split a track into, at most, two parts (staves) automatically. You can make it split into three parts, but this would require manually editing the import instructions.

Lastly, the wizard is fairly primitive at the moment about picking the clef. It simply looks at the highest note found on the staff. If it is above a certain note, a treble clef is chosen. If below, then bass clef is used. It is, however, pretty easy to change after the fact (relative to the work required to actually enter the notes manually, or alter the MIDI file in some way). Note that the MID file includes performance info, rather than visual data, so no clef indication is actually included in the MIDI spec.

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 09-Jul-1998

Thanks. I'll try twice around the mulberry bush... I think
this will do what I need.

BTW:
Yes, the first (of three) staves is track 0; staves 2 and 3
are from track 1.

I would think that picking the average of the highest and
lowest notes would be a fairly easy way of improving on the
current scheme. Perhaps a future enhancement?

B


#736: Non listed instruments in the patch list
Non listed instruments in the patch list

(736)

Submitted by: Robert Dane on 08-Jul-1998

My keyboard has more instruments than that listed in the patch list on the staff properties.

At the moment if I want to use on of these I have to select it on my keyboard and load NWC. I can then use it though chanel one on the midi out.

Is there an easier way to use my different keyboard sounds than this?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Bowers on 08-Jul-1998

This may have been covered in another message but here is what you can do:

In the NWC directory there is a file named ntwpatch.ini, save a copy of this before you begin. Edit this file and add your keyboard type under [Patch Lists] (be sure and add an equal sign after the definition. For example your keyboard might be named "My Keyboard 1600", add an entry called My Keyboard 1600=

Add a new section called [My Keyboard 1600], list the instruments supported by your keyboard sequentially (starting with 00). The section should look like:

[My Keyboard 1600]
Silly String Percussion=
Grand Piano=
etc...

You can select the My Keyboard 1600 patch list from the staff properties dialog and select your own instrument list.
Hope this helps.

Remember, if you re-install NWC this file may revert to the original, you probably want to save your work in another file when you are done.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Dane on 09-Jul-1998

This did indeed change the patch list but it doesn't change the voices. It still corasponds with the general midi values.
Is there anyway to change this?

Robert Dane

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Bowers on 10-Jul-1998

Welllll.....hmmmm.....What kind of keyboard are you using?

Perhaps someone has some experience with the same equipment.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Dane on 10-Jul-1998

I'm using a Yahama PSR-620.

I've tried experimenting with lots of things to try and get this to work properly.
By using the bank select menu I've managed to use my different drum kits through midi channel 10 by following the (very unclear) advice in my keyboard manual.
However I still can't get all voices to work how i want them to.

ie. I select violin (patch number 63 on my keyboard) from the list I created in nwcpatch.ini The sounds then comes out as Synth Brass. patch number 63 on the general midi list.

any more ideas. I'm still trying lots of differnt things out.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Jul-1998

I suspect that the PSR-620 works very similar to the PSR-520. We have a PSR-520 in our lab. Its MIDI implementation is a little bizarre, but actually is explained fairly completely in the manual. The PSR-520 will, by default, behave as a General MIDI (GM) synth on all MIDI channels. This means that only GM patches can be used. However, you can assign one MIDI channel as the incoming "Panel Mode Channel" which will then allow incoming MIDI to select the same instrument set as you can do yourself from the front panel. On the PSR-520, you do this as follows:

1) Goto the Function area, and select "OVERALL"
2) Goto the function titled "RemoteCh"
3) Set the channel to 01

Now, any staff that you use in NWC that is set to MIDI channel 1 can select instruments using the same numbers as are shown on your front panel display.

Be careful about the echo feature! By default, the PSR-520 seems to echo all MIDI commands sent fromthe "Panel Channel" back to its MIDI out port. If you also set NWC to echo its MIDI input to the output, you will set up an infinite loop scenario. On many of our test computers, this caused a system crash. You have been warned.

Reply 6 offered by: Benjimen on 20-Aug-2001

Yes, I myself have a PSR-620 and have experienced the same stupid scenario!!!! Panel voices rule, and the GM sucks comparatively speaking. I can only use one panel voice in conjunction with the GM by Remote Channel in the Overall view. Guess this was the drawback of this early stages of the PSR Series. I now have the new PSR-550 with XG and can access all the panel voices just fine. If you have any further explination or insight on how to get my 620's panel voices activate when playing GM files, please e-mail me and let me know. Thanks, currently I am searching for the 620's Instrument Definition file (.ins). If you have it, please e-mail it to me, I am using Cakewalk Sonar in conjunction with my PSR keyboards.
Benji


#737: pitch bends w/out joystick
pitch bends w/out joystick

(737)

Submitted by: Alan Land on 08-Jul-1998

My MIDI keyboard has no pitch bend. Before I go buy one, is it not possible to enter the data by hand? I just got a program that lets you edit events, one by one. Just hoping someone can jump-start my project. Hear my MIDIs at:
http://members.aol.com/basicfile
WARNINGRock and Roll/Beethoven.
Tnx!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 09-Jul-1998

Yes. Look up Multipoint controllers, using Pitch, and that is exactly what you're after. Of course, set it to do a linear sweep, rather than step!

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Alan Land on 09-Jul-1998

Thank you, Andrew. NotewWorthy Composer is one fine program! Check back in a month, or so, at the basicfile site and I'll post a song using your suggestion.

Alan


#738: Beaming triplets with grace notes
Beaming triplets with grace notes

(738)

Submitted by: ANTONICELLI Vincenzo on 09-Jul-1998

Does anybody know why if I beam a triplet (of flagged notes, of course) and
then add a grace note, beaming disappears ?
It's played, but not printed or showed.
There's a way to add grace notes in a beamed triplet without losing beaming ?
Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Jul-1998

No. You cannot insert anything, even text, between beamed notes without breaking the beams. Add this to the wish list (or the bug list - it really should not behave like this).


#739: printing problems
printing problems

(739)

Submitted by: Dale Entrekin on 09-Jul-1998

I have been trying to print a 2 page song onto one sheet - landscape, as in a church songbook. According to another forum tip, I go to print preview, copy the page, and paste to a Publisher booklet. This has worked fine with page 1, but when I copy page 2, onto the right side of the landscape page, the last 1/2 measure of every line gets cut off. I have tried adjusting margins, etc but nothing works. The page looks fine on the print preview but does not fully seem to copy. What is wrong?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Jul-1998

Try copying the second page onto its own page in your application. If it looks right, then the problem is not with Noteworthy.

Reply 2 offered by: Keith on 11-Jul-1998

When you paste from the clipboard, try using the 'Paste Special' from the Edit menu, then paste as 'Windows Metafile'. I found that pasting as EMF didn't work. A windows metafile is very adaptable.


#740: Trills
Trills

(740)

Submitted by: Scott Moore on 09-Jul-1998

How do you create a trill? It's in one of the samples, so it must be possible...

Reply 1 offered by: Lance on 09-Jul-1998

You need to make another staff where the trill is written out (in 32nds, etc.). If you want to print the score, make this staff hidden and add a Text "tr." over the real staff. But when it's played, it will sound like a trill.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Jul-1998

See also msg #632

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 10-Jul-1998

Also see:

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#trill

and

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip3.htm#trillmpc

Reply 4 offered by: Phil Taylor on 10-Jul-1998

It still doesn't sound entirely correct because the written (continuous) note sounds in addition to the trill sound. Is there a way of muting an individual note, but retaining its presence on the staff and print?

Reply 5 offered by: Arova on 13-Jul-1998

How do I enter a trill symbol?

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Jul-1998

You can mute a note using a hidden ppp (pianissimo) dynamic, then restoring the original dynamic with another hidden dynamic. A bit messy. It would be really nice if every insertable symbol could be hidden!

Reply 7 offered by: Arova on 15-Jul-1998

I thought you would play in a trill through the midi if you were recording midi for the purpose of performance.
Otherwise I'd think there would/should be *the* trill symbol that one could automatically place in a score for live perfomance.

Reply 8 offered by: Kassandra Thomas on 03-Nov-1998

I have had to use 32nd and 56th notes to attain the "trill" effect...

Kassandra

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Nov-1998

56th notes? Where did you find those? ;-)


#741: Single-line staves
Single-line staves

(741)

Submitted by: James Malone on 09-Jul-1998

It would be nice if it were possible to have single-line staves (percussion staves) as well as the traditional five-line staves. If one could then spcecify what pitch the line represented, it would be possible to score percussion parts in the traditional manner. For instance, a single-line staff set to represent pitch #38 would represent a snare drum. It would only be necessary to have a normal staff which displays only the middle line instead of all five.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 09-Jul-1998

James, please please add this to the wishlist
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm .
I made a similar suggestion to Eric before (though a little more complicated, allowing for each line on any staff to be remapped - allowing kit drums, and other types of scoring, eg perc parts above and below a single line). I'd love to see it implemented.

Andrew


#742: Blank score paper
Blank score paper

(742)

Submitted by: James Malone on 09-Jul-1998

It would be nice if NWC could print out blank score paper with only blank staves. This would be a quick, cheap way to make score paper. It could print 12 blank systems or sets of Grand Staves or full orchestral score paper. This would make composing away from the computer much easier.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 09-Jul-1998

Try this (I _think_ it works)
1. Use ^A to add as many staffs to your page as you want.
2. Adjust their spacing and braces etc in the Visual tab of Staff Properties (F2)
3. In Page Setup, select Extend Last System
4. Preview it and adjust to taste
5. Print It!

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: X on 09-Jul-1998

hey, that's my line :)

Reply 3 offered by: Eric Black on 17-Jul-1998

The staves would be connected by a vertical line over to the left. Well, hey, you could always use white-out to get rid of the line, and take it to a photo-copy place and make as many copies you need for much cheaper than you'd pay for real sheet music paper from a store.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Bowers on 17-Jul-1998

You can get blank staff paper and grand staff paper in a PDF format from

http://www.sheetmusic1.com

The PDF format can be printed with the Free Adobe Acrobat reader.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Bowers on 17-Jul-1998

... Look under the free and public domain section ....

Reply 6 offered by: Smiley Guy :-) on 19-Jul-1998

looks like it was a print out from noteworthy...


#743: hiding items when printing
hiding items when printing

(743)

Submitted by: James Malone on 09-Jul-1998

It should be possible to hide almost any item on a score when printing if it affects the MIDI performance. For intance, it should be possible to hide clef changes, repeat symbols, and eve notes. This way, it would be possible to put a hidden octave change in with an octave-shifted clef and print the more natural 8va-------------- for the performer.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Jul-1998

Yes. Hiding items is a simple solution to many problems. Hiding rests would be very useful. See the discussion in http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/0/725.htm

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 09-Jul-1998

Agreed agreed.
Again, please add it to http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm
as this is Eric's preferred method.

Andrew


#744: duplets
duplets

(744)

Submitted by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 10-Jul-1998

Given that NoteWorthy handles triplets reasonably well, how
come it won't do duplets? Or am I missing something.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11-Jul-1998

You're not missing anything. It just won't at the moment. Several of us have suggested generic n-tuplets, to cope with every situation.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Geoff Allan on 14-Jul-1998

I agree n-tuplets would be marvellous. I started to transcribe
some Ben. Britten the other day until I realised I needed
pentuplets .. hmmmm!

I'd still like < crescendo and > dim. signs too.

Reply 3 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 16-Jul-1998

n-tuplets would be great. I have wished for them on more than one occasion, as well as < cresc and > dim. Still really happy with my NWC purchase though. How many other software companies provide such excellent support.

Reply 4 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 27-Jul-1998

Hairpin dynamic marks, n-tuplets, collapsible rests ...
always cropping up in wishlist entries and forum postings,
these :-} though I agree that these lasting niggles aside,
NoteWorthy is a good example that does a specific job well.

Specific reply to Sergio's question - UltraEdit is an
excellent (commercial) editor that I use both at work and
at home, and Ian Mead gives first-class support. I seize
this chance of proclaiming my good opinion!


#745: Center Fermata above Note
Center Fermata above Note

(745)

Submitted by: jonathan weinraub on 10-Jul-1998

When I do a fermata, it is never right about the note. How
can this be achieved, if it can?

Reply 1 offered by: James Malone on 10-Jul-1998

I put the fermata right before the note, and un-check "preserve width." This seems to work reasonably well when printing.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul on 10-Jul-1998

I haven't had problems centering fermatas over notes, but I have had problems getting them to center over a whole rest. It looks OK on the staff editor, but it is off on the printout.


#746: Sound cards
Sound cards

(746)

Submitted by: Dave Puttock on 10-Jul-1998

I bought Noteworthy so that my children, who all play in the school swing band, could arrange new pieces etc.

Their music teacher has become quite excited about the work that they have done and is proposing buying two or three copies for his senior students to use The problem is that he has asked me to set him up with three computers for the purpose and I am really not experienced enough to choose the sound cards. At least one of the machines needs to be of "Performance quality" so that six or eight part composition can be played through a sound system for groups to listen to. As well as replaying MIDI files uplifted from the keyboard, edited and replayed.

I have always used Sound Blaster which was good enough for my ear, but probably not on a good sound system. The teacher has a catalogue of some Turtle Beach cards. Can anyone make recomendations on make and model at under say GBP 150 ($200) on the basis that I know of nowhere where I can listen to one, so it will be a case of buy it and stick with it.

Any assistance greatfully recieved

Regards Dave Puttock Derby, England.

Reply 1 offered by: Kent Dugan on 10-Jul-1998

I've heard the Turtle Beach is just great. Ensoniq has always had the most natural sounding sounds, though. Best bet might be to play them back through midi out to a keyboard. Most keyboards sound better than sound cards. Can you find a user's group where they're using different cards and get to listen to some? Or your local computer dealer?

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 10-Jul-1998

With really fast PII CPU and lots of memory in the computer a pci sound card is probably a winner.
Failing the super computer an awe 64 is pretty good value for dollars..(pounds)
Ensoniq is now another way to say Soundblaster (Tongue in cheek, corporate takeover by Creative Labs).

Reply 3 offered by: christophe on 13-Jul-1998

j'habite en france et je parle trés peu en anglais. Je voudrais avoir une réponse en francais concernant le type de carte son que je peux employer sur mon micro. Merci de me repondre en francais si possible

Reply 4 offered by: James C. Franklin on 13-Jul-1998

I have the TBS-2000, the basic card by Turtle Beach. I am quite happy with it. It's wavetable synthesis is very good to my ears. The SB products are priced low, relative to other cards, but based on what I've read, and heard, they are not the best quality cards. For example, the AWE-32 and 64 are both only half-duplex in hardward. I think you can do as well or better looking at the TBS-2000 or the Tropez sound cards for quality.

To give you some perspective on my opinion, I started my college career back in the late 70s as a music composition student. Although I switched to a somewhat more stable career field (economics) I've remained involved in music at the amateur, and occaisionally semi-pro level. I'm planning on purchasing Turtle Beaches' Pinnacle Project Studio for an all-in-one digital audio/midi work station.

The following URL has an execellent discussion about sound cards in general and which ones are suited to purposes.

http://www.borg.com/%7Ejglatt/tutr/midicard.htm

Reply 5 offered by: Chris Coon on 03-Aug-1998

If you need REALLY good sound quality that won't cost $$$$$$$$, get MIDInight Express and demo files at http://www.polyhedric.com

All you have to buy is the CD sampler library--MIDInight Express is free. The quality of this is astounding--especially for <$30!!! and you don't even need a fancy sound card. Get a SB 16 WAVeffects for $50 this will provide adequate sound for pieces under developement (in NoteWorthy) The only thing you can't do is follow the watch the score play. You must export to midi first in order to use MIDInight Express.

Reply 6 offered by: Pentium on 04-Aug-1998

I'm much better for my li'l brother 486 for that job.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Aug-1998

I've been very happy with my recently acquired "Audiotrix 3D-XG". It goes for about $390 CDN (or about $250 US - don't know what that would be in pounds).

You can check out the specs by visiting their web site at http://www.mediatrix.com.

Regards,
Fred Nachbaur


#747: Problems !
Problems !

(747)

Submitted by: Christopher Cambley on 11-Jul-1998

Hello people.

How do I set notes in NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 12-Jul-1998

Press the return/enter key. Up and down arrows get you to the right spot, and the keys 1-6 (or +/-) change the note length. Er... have you looked at any of the online help?

Andrew


#748: Odd (?) use of Fermata
Odd (?) use of Fermata

(748)

Submitted by: Cyril N. Alberga on 11-Jul-1998

In the vocal score for G&S The Gondoliers I stumbled on the following configuration:
In 3/4 time, in the upper piano staff, a dotted quarter note marked with a trill, over a dotted half note, and followed by two eighth notes and a sixteenth; in the lover staff a half note with a fermata, followed by a quarter rest.
I interpret this to mean that the trill should be prolonged (I have no idea whether the first eighth should be, as well).
I see no way to have both correct notation and play-back. A hidden staff would not seem to help, as the fermata would (I assume) propagate through all staffs, presumably effecting the first note of the (hidden) trill.
So? Is it possible?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 12-Jul-1998

Oh, Cyril, you old programmer you!
(takes on to know one ... :)
I really would imagine that this is interpreted variously, in fact, I would say
1) There is not enough information for an unambiguous interpretation because
2a) the music typographer made a mistake or
2b) Sir Sullivan made a mistake
I have many (many!) bits of music with what I imagine to be mistakes in them (they were written (and typeset) by humans, after all) and I would say that this may be one more.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 12-Jul-1998

Well, I have at least one other example of this sort of thing, this one by Virgil Thompson.
He has a snare drum line with a dotted half note with two slashes on the stem (i.e., a dotted half's worth of sixteenth notes), with a fermata over it -- meaning, I assume, MORE than a dotted half's worth.

Also, elsewhere in "The Gondoliers" there is a whole note chord with triple slashes over it, commented as "trem.", with a fermata.

So, it appears that at least two composers, one late 19th cent., one mid 20th, use the fermata to extend sequences of notes, not just to hold a single note.

The Thompson score (the vocal score for "Four Saints in Three Acts" has so many things that I can't "do" in NWC that I am thinking of scanning a sample (about 55 items!) of oddities and posting them to the news group.
I don't even know what to call some of them. Then you gurus can tell me, a) what they are called, and b) if they are worth throwing into the wish-list.
Some are old favorates, like duples, 4-ples, 5-ples, etc., while some seem off the wall, but do serve a real purpose in this case. Others I just have no clue.

If you think posting images is a bad idea throw a brick-bat in my direction and I will exercise my minimal powers of verbal description instead.

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 3 offered by: Ian Wesley on 12-Jul-1998

Hi

Which part of Gondoliers are you refering to?
Also, remember that what you get in the vocal score is really
a piano reduction (usually not by Sullivan), not a piano arrangement.
I had this explained to me many years ago by a very good
rehearsal pianist who pointed out that some of the notation
was impossible to play on the piano!

Ian

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 12-Jul-1998

Yes, it is the piano reduction, and yes, there are notes which "overlap", i.e. half-note on F, say, with a quarter rest, followed (the rest that is) by a quarter note on F. That sort of thing.
The tremulo under a fermata is the final chord of the overture. The trill on the same beat as the fermata is near the end of the Allegretto grazioso section of the overture, measure 47 (or counting backwards from the following double bar, measure -9).

The drum roll with the fermata is in the first measure of the piano reduction of "Four Saint in Three Acts".

Cyril

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Jul-1998

FYI:

> A hidden staff would not seem to help, as the fermata
> would (I assume) propagate through all staffs,
> presumably effecting the first note of the (hidden) trill.

A fermata that is assigned a 0 delay is essentially non-existent as far as NWC playback is concerned. You can add your fermatas with 0 delay, then create your actual pause effect in a different manner, such as with an MPC change, hidden tempo changes, or whatever.


#749: gliss
gliss

(749)

Submitted by: Abner on 12-Jul-1998

Can notes be glissed on noteworthy and how can this be done?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 13-Jul-1998

Not across staves. See msg #596 for the definitive reply.
BUT also see http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip3.htm#arpeggio
and http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip4.htm#sprdgrc

Cheers, Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Jul-1998

If I understand a Glissando correctly, it means you slide from one note to another. On a discrete note instrument like a piano, this can easily be faked with grace notes. Just place a grace note for every note you want played, ending with a regular note. If you force all the grace note stems in the same direction it does not even look too bad. This will not work so well for a continuous instrument.

By the way, it seems that no matter what duration I pick for grace notes, they always sound the same. Are the stems just for looks?

Reply 3 offered by: Eric Black on 17-Jul-1998

A true glissando cannot be notated in NWC as of yet. The only way to make a glissando sound in NWC is to enter a stream of small-value notes, or grace notes. If you want a true glissando (such as that which can be done with a trombone or a violin) use NWC's ability to insert Multi-Point controller commands. You should use the Pitch Bend controller with a linear sweep. You can slide in to the note by starting with a negative value and approaching zero. Or you can gliss up or down by starting on zero and going up or down. However, I don't think the actual values are standard. Glissandos produced via this method will sound unpredictable on different soundcards. If you want to listen to an example of such being employed, visit my site:

http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/Strasse/6494

go to the My Compositions, and listen to my Fantasy for Trombone, or, for the second movement of my Three Movements for Brass Quintet. (And if you really want to see the notation, e-mail me and I'll send the NWC file to you!).


#750: NW version 1.51a
NW version 1.51a

(750)

Submitted by: H. VIAL on 13-Jul-1998

There are good enhancements in this version, but the lack of
separator line beetween the buttons in the toolbars is
slightly surprising!

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 13-Jul-1998

Not so!
From the main menu go to <View - Toolbars - Customise>
and add as many separators as you wish.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 13-Jul-1998

Addendum to the above - I personally think the new button style where they pop out when
covered by the cursor is excellent - it makes for more accurate navigation.


#751: drums
drums

(751)

Submitted by: simon adcock on 13-Jul-1998

can any one tell me. can you print off proper drum music on noteworthy? if so how? if not, are there any you can do such a thing?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 13-Jul-1998

Printing percussion staff is not currently possible in NWC, though it has been often asked for (and, judging from Noteworthy's response in the past, quite likely to make it in some time). Windows 3.1 had IDF files which allowed remapping of notes (I believe) however I think this has become impossible in Win 95. Also, I think in earlier posts (in the forum or the newsgroup, I can't remember) on of the contributors had a BASIC program that rempped the MIDI track so you'd write it how it should look, export it, remap it and then it would play correctly.
Programs that DO do drum staff are Cubasis, Finale, MusicMaster, all of them much MUCH more than $39 US! There may be other cheaper ones out there, I con't know.

Andrew


#752: Printing Music
Printing Music

(752)

Submitted by: James Lin on 13-Jul-1998

On the shareware version of Noteworthy Composer, everytime I print music on my printer there is an error. The printer says that there is a ram overflow. I want to get the full version, but I also want to be able to print music.

Reply 1 offered by: Jubal Baca on 14-Jul-1998

Hola: Soy usuario registrado de NWC y trabajo todos los días
con el programa. No he tenido problemas de ninguna clase para imprimi.

Reply 2 offered by: John Ford on 14-Jul-1998

I don't know what kind of printer you have, but I have
found on some HP Printers (Laserjet 4 in particular)
that you need to turn on Page Protect to prevent RAM
overflow. We had the same problem when we printed
graphics intensive files in the office. Once we turned
on Page Protect and set the amount of RAM in the
printer, everything printed fine. Just a thought...

Reply 3 offered by: Thea McEntire on 26-Aug-1998

I don't know if you understood what Jubal Baca said, but for the record, the message said that s/he is a registered user of NWC abd s/he uses it everyday. S/he hasn't had any problems with it. Just thought that you might want to know.


#753: Panasonic KX-P4410 problems
Panasonic KX-P4410 problems

(753)

Submitted by: James Lin on 13-Jul-1998

I have the shareware version of NoteWorth Composer and I cant print because the printer always has a ram overflow error. I want to get the full version but I wont if I cant print my music. I dont know if this will help, but I use Windows 98.

Reply 1 offered by: Phil Taylor on 14-Jul-1998

I would initially check that you have the correct version of the demo, ie the 32 bit version, and that it is intended to work with Win98. Secondly I would check you have the correct printer driver installed. You could try using a different printer. If you have no problem then, it indicates the problem is printer related. In any case, I would run SCANDISK, DEFRAG etc on your PC to eliminate any problems of that nature. Other software installed on your PC could be contributing to it by conflicting with memory requirements. Try running Noteworthy on its own, without anything in the background. Have you also virus checked your demo disk?

Regards,

Phil

Reply 2 offered by: John Ford on 14-Jul-1998

James - Please see my reply to your previous message.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Gill-Purdon on 16-Jul-1998

Upgrading your printer memory may help also.

Reply 4 offered by: Christopher Nolden on 17-Jul-1998

Sorry to tell you, but printing even the simplest music will cause that printer to have a ram overflow.
I have the same printer, and it's not a problem with the driver. I talked to Panasonic,
and the only thing to do is spend $200 to upgrade for an extra 1MB of RAM, $150 for ever MB after that.
Sorry to sound grim!!

Reply 5 offered by: Doug Hutter on 20-Jul-1998

I have the same printer, and have no problems printing using the driver from Panasonic. If you do want to upgrade the printer memory, you can look in the ads in the back of computer magazines (ie;PC Magazine) and find the upgrades for approximately $59 for 1mb, $99 for 2mb. I have been watching the prices so I can upgrade mine.

Reply 6 offered by: jose pany on 18-Dec-1999

Ihave the same printer my problem is when I using a specific program and I want to print landscape its print on portrait
please hve can solve this matter.

Thank you

Reply 7 offered by: Danny H. on 10-Feb-2000

Make sure your printer setting is for 150 dots per inch (Printer/properties/graphics). Also see FAQ's from Panasonic at http://www.panasonic.com/office/faq.html.

Hope this helps.

Reply 8 offered by: Roberto Diaz on 12-Feb-2000

Tengo el problema que me esta marcando "ERROR E31" en la pantalla. a que se debera dicho error.

Reply 9 offered by: Thurein on 16-Feb-2000

Hi!
Just recently I've changed both drum and toner for the laser printer "Panasonic KX-P4410".
But I still have one problem that is when a paper starts to feed in, the roller stops turning or sometimes it roll but does not feed the paper in. I've tried to over come the problem by cleaning the roller and also the bottom block which sits beneath the roller. This problem is happening for about four months.
Do you think the relay which trigger the roller?

Reply 10 offered by: Randy on 23-Nov-2000

I got a KX-P4410, and I used to be able to print a ten page text document, but now I can't after I changed some settings. Which settings will allow me to print multi-page documents? Now, I can't print one page.

Reply 11 offered by: Matthew Breslin on 06-Feb-2001

I have acquired a KX-94410, I need a manual also if I can run it on Win98

Reply 12 offered by: Jorge Castillo on 31-Mar-2001

I have a printer KX-P4410. This printer present an error E31 in the Display. Thanks for your help.

Reply 13 offered by: az on 29-Apr-2001

I have the KK-P4410 and need to replace my paper cartridge. If anyone has one for sell or know of where to get any accessories for that model, please email.

Reply 14 offered by: D Ruth on 15-Jun-2001

the KX-PKC2 tray is $52.20. This is a special order item
and no returns are allowed. If you would like to order online, go to
this link and type in KXPKC2 at the search command.

http://www.laserlux.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv

Reply 15 offered by: Joe Music on 15-Jun-2001

Fasinating how this thread quickly evolved into a support line for a particular model of printer! That's the magic of Internet search engines: Type in the printer model, and the NWC forum pops up. I wonder what George W. Bush and Vladimir Putin would say about that, if music publishing had arisen in the context of NAFTA, free trade, global warming, the strategic defense initiative, the California energy crisis, or Kyoto?

Reply 16 offered by: Greg Hall on 29-Jun-2001

To Anyone, I own a Panasonic KX-P4410 printer that is displaying "Call Service" Has anyone had this error only to find out that something simple has to be done that I may do myself? All replies greatly appreciated. Greg

Reply 17 offered by: w. tripp on 11-Jul-2001

I have Panasonic kx-p4410 with "chg drum" message flashing. have purchased/installed new drum & have same error. I don't have an owners manual for this machine and am wondering if I missed a vital step in the installation or if I should consider the beast ready for the bone yard. Thanks.

Reply 18 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Jul-2001

The manufacturer site is the best place for general printer support: Panasonic Web Site

Reply 19 offered by: Fort563@earthlink.net on 29-Jul-2001

For sale: KX - P4410. Bought a 4430. The drum indicates "needs replaced", but can be cleaned for a few extra miles. The quality of these older printers is fantastic. Make me an offer. I can also part it out, but rather sell the whole unit. I bought it new in 95' and used it for a small business, printing short inventory lists and sketches so it hasn't had a gazillion pages run through it.

Reply 20 offered by: Martin on 30-Jul-2001

I also have a printer with the ''Call Service E31'' error. In searching on the net I found the following from Panasonic's website: Question: Printer Error E31
Answer: Heat lamp problem. Please send in for repair

The following website has the parts available for repair:
http://www.all-laser.com/lamps.html
As with toner cartridges, I am sure there are many Parts places where the parts can be purchased.

Reply 21 offered by: Diego Urbina on 02-Aug-2001

heres the website of all the error codes. good luck.

http://www.partsnowinc.com/ST/PANA/CALLSERVICE/clearcode.htm

Aqui tienen la lista de los errores del impresor. suerte.

Reply 22 offered by: Craig  on 07-Aug-2001

HEY!!! I also have a Panasonic KX-P4410... I got a newer HP Laser printer for speed...I'd like to get the book/manual for this so I can sell them as a set.

Reply 23 offered by: Penny on 08-Aug-2001

I also have a KX-P4410 and had the "change drum" message this week after I changed the toner. All I did was turn the printer on and off and the message went away.


#754: Got Grace notes, now to turn BMW files into NWC
Got Grace notes, now to turn BMW files into NWC

(754)

Submitted by: Edward J. Bradshaw on 15-Jul-1998

Grace Notes! I have been waiting over a year for them. Now to find a way to convert all the Bagpipe Music Writer (BMW) files to Noteworthy composer files. Anyone know if this is possible or better yet, has been done already?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 15-Jul-1998

Really? Is there a Bagpipe Music Writer? I'd love to see it. I'd imagine that the current route would be
BMW -> MIDI -> NWC
however, this'll wreck most of the grace notes.
They'll be there, but the note lengths may be a bit strange.
Could be worth a try, though.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 16-Jul-1998

I had to check the date to see if it was April 1st., but a quick web search found http://home.istar.ca/~rmm/index.shtml
Verry Interesting!

Reply 3 offered by: Edward J. Bradshaw on 16-Jul-1998

Yes, there is a program called Bagpipe Music Writer.
It has been out for some time now but it is only a 16bit
version. They were supposed to be releasing a 32bin windows
version last year, then they moved it to last fall, then to
this spring now it's moved to this fall. I have also used
NWC for some time now but found it limited because it didn't
have the ability to do grace notes. Now that it does, it
has all the function of BMW exept the ability to profesionaly
format your sheet music and save as PS for printing.

There are thousands of bagpipe tunes available in BMW format
which is text based. I just need a way to conver the text,
which has all the formating, into the binary based NWC file.

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 16-Jul-1998

If you have just discovered grace notes, you may not have discovered that NWC printing has vastly improved. I don't think you can put it into a postscript file, as far as I know.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 16-Jul-1998

To create a PS file, can't you just use the Windows generic PS printer and "Print To File"?

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 14-Aug-1998

To create a PS file, can't you just copy from NWC and paste
into Adobe Pagemaker?

Reply 7 offered by: Edward J. Bradshaw on 14-Aug-1998

Thanks for all the PS help, but my original post was about a conversion utility to go from Bagpipe music Writer(BMW) format to NoteWorthy.

Bagpipe Music Writer is a great program for creating bagpipe sheet music and there are thousands of tunes available. The problem is they do not have a 32Bit version.
They are working on one but keep pushing the release date ahead, and have done so for the last year and a half. I thought it would be great to be able to use NoteWorthy instead but be able to read the BMW files.

There is a program that converts BMW to ABC format (both text based) and then one that converts ABC to PS. I have been using this to read the BMW files so far.

The other problem is the fact that you cannot place a gracenote in between two barred notes without breaking the barre. Hopfuly that will be "fixed" in future releases.

Reply 8 offered by: 16-bit on 17-Aug-1998

Doesn't exist any 16-bit version ? This should work on any 16- or 32-bits software...

Reply 9 offered by: John MacDonald on 22-Aug-2000

Initially i bought BMW GOLD but i discovered the following programme purely by chance which appears to be exactly the same thing under a different name.

it is a free download with a file converter and appears to be for all intents and purposes the BMW GOLD

here is the link http://home.istar.ca/~dougwick/


#755: Transposing from C major/A minor
Transposing from C major/A minor

(755)

Submitted by: Phil on 16-Jul-1998

Has anyone else noticed that when transposing from C major/A minor, the key signature is not changed, although the notes move, requiring the user to put the new key signature in manually?

I assume this is a bug (and I've submitted a request to the wish list), or does anyone know differently.

It's no great hassle to put it in manually, but it's an annoying idiosyncrasy.

Phil.

Reply 1 offered by: James C. Franklin on 16-Jul-1998

The key signature for C major/A minor is the same. The A minor scale is the Aeolian mode of C major. The tonic emphasis is different, but the signature is the same. I suspect you are thinking of either the harmonic are melodic minor of A, which I consider alterations of the Aeolian A minor. I prefer the current behaivor of NWC in this respect.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 16-Jul-1998

I think Phil meant that when you transpose FROM Cmaj OR Amin ie NO KEY SIG, you don't get a new key sig.
I agree that it's a pain, and that NWC could be made smart enough to add a sig where none exists before transposing.
The easiest work around is, as Phil says, adding the key signature manually, though adding a C maj signature (single F natural) before transposing is probably the best way.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Jul-1998

Adding a Cmajor key signature when the staff is in that key is mandatory if you intend to transpose otherwise NWC does not know what key you are in and therefore cant add a new key signature for the transposition.
Adding a Cmajor key signature is not a work around it's essential.

Reply 4 offered by: James C. Franklin on 17-Jul-1998

I misread Phil's message originally. But I still think there is a certain advantage to the way NWC handles the key signature transposition: that is transposing a key signature only when there is an explicit key signature (the single F natural for C major/A minor). I'm thinking specifically of nontonal music where a key signature could be considered superfluous aside from ease of reading issues. Perhaps whats needed is a global preference to defualt to either no key, or a particular key such as C major. But having written that, it occurs to me that setting up templates with the desired could accomplish the same thing.

Reply 5 offered by: Jame C. Franklin on 17-Jul-1998

.... setting up templates with the desired default key could accomplish the same thing.

Reply 6 offered by: Eric Black on 17-Jul-1998

Adding a key signature when writing in C major is essential, and it's no problem, because nothing shows when you print out. It displays as a natural sign when you're working in NWC just so that you know that it's there.

Reply 7 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 04-Aug-1998

Here's one for you all

I have got a solo for Bb trumpet with piano accompaniment.
Trumpet in 2 flats and piano in 4 flats.

I typed in the solo and the piano part as they appeared on the original. Playback was fine.

Next, because I play Eb altohorn, I transposed the piano part down 5 semitones. Looking for the key signature to be 5 flats as the Eb parts in the same sounding pitch have one more sharp than the Bb. To my surprise I was presented with the key signature of 7 sharps. This proved to be enharmonically the same as 5 flats but probably harder for a pianist to read.

Any suggestions for changing the key to 5 flats without having to fiddle with the part too much??

Cheers

Sergio

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Aug-1998

Sergio: Please see the reply to your duplicate post at msg #802.


#756: upgrade to 1.52
upgrade to 1.52

(756)

Submitted by: John Young on 16-Jul-1998

Has anyone tried the new version of note worthy 1.52.
If so please tell how good it is compared to 1.50 . Thank you John

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 17-Jul-1998

Well, since the upgrades are FREE, I would say it is DEFINITELY worth your while to upgrade, esp if you
o use triplets (these are displayed more clearly)
o use whole note (breve) pairs in vocal work
o combine half notes in chords
o use the toolbars (they are now configurable)
o use dense chords (changed note placement logic)
o have a first bar with a rest in it (better placement of rests)

A


#757: Multi-Point Controllers
Multi-Point Controllers

(757)

Submitted by: Eric Black on 17-Jul-1998

I notice that insert MPC commands into NoteWorthy Composer scores results in a lot of unpredictability. Specifically, I notice that when I do a linear volume sweep coming up from a pianissimo, to say, a fortissimo, the fortissimo that results is not as loud as one that came before the MPC command. I checked the exact MIDI volumes.

For example, a fortissisimo (a full 127) played at the beginning of a piece does not sound like a fortissimo played at any point in a piece after the MPC, though NWC should play that one at 127 too. Any suggestions? Am I not using an appropriate controller?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 17-Jul-1998

Yes! You are not using the appropriate controller?
MPCs don't control note VELOCITY (ppp - fff) (ff by default). You are probably fiddling with channel VOLUME (127 by default).
For a "volume sweep", I would suggest
1) on long notes, use the channel volume MPC
2) on a series of notes, use cresc./descresc. between appropriate dynamic markings.

Andrew


#758: shifting position of notes
shifting position of notes

(758)

Submitted by: sagittarius on 17-Jul-1998

how do i specify where i want a note to be positioned on the stave? that is, if i have two staves, and i want a note on the bottom stave to be positioned below a certain note on the top stave, how do i do it?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 18-Jul-1998

Noteworthy works kinda left to right.
Things will line up one above the other if the timing dictates that that is when they should occur.
If there are no notes being played before your bottom staff note, then pad before it with rests.

Andrew


#759: importing midi file
importing midi file

(759)

Submitted by: nigel pendrey on 19-Jul-1998

I have a trio a midi files which, when imported to NWC 1.52 consistently produce a GPF. They play on the windows media player perfectly well. Can any one give a plausibel reason for this?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jul-1998

Give us the URL where you got the midi files, and we can try it ourselves. All three crash?

Reply 2 offered by: nigel pendrey on 19-Jul-1998

Thanks for your interest. The URL's are http://midiworld.com/mid/byrd/wbfan1.mid and wbfan2, wbfan3 respectively

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Jul-1998

I just went three-for-three on these files. I downloaded them, and then one by one imported them into the 32-bit edition of NWC version 1.52 without incident. Perhaps you can be more specific about

- what options are set,
- where the GPF occurs,
- your system configuration (perhaps you do not have enough memory, for example),
- where in the import process the GPF takes place (do you go through the wizard interface, for example).

Reply 4 offered by: nigel pendrey on 19-Jul-1998

I am using the 16 bit version running under windows 3.11. I use the import wizard. In each file the import bar "stalls" at the first staff reporting a GPF in module NWC.EXE at 0024:5CBA on each of the three files each time I attempt to import. I have not seen anything similar on any other imported midi file (yet)!

Reply 5 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 19-Jul-1998

Just to confirm,
I tried loading this midi file on 16 bit NWC and also got the same GPF

Richard

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Jul-1998

We confirm that the GPF occurs when running in the 16-bit version. We will diagnose the issue and correct it in the next release.

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Jul-1998

We do not yet know the reason why, but you can work around this problem by disabling the "Detect Compound Time" option during the import operation. Once unchecked, the files should import normally.

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Jul-1998

OK. We have diagnosed the problem (it does have to do with the compound time techniques in the 16-bit edition of NWC). It is fixed for the next maintenance release (we are currently on version 1.52).

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Aug-1998

This is fixed in version 1.52a, available now.


#760: NWC files on GeoCities web sites
NWC files on GeoCities web sites

(760)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jul-1998

Is there any way to post an NWC file on a GeoCities web site so that it can be downloaded? All I can think of is to change the extension to .MID, but this is not convenient for the person trying to download. I have asked them to allow NWC files. Maybe if we pester them enough?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Jul-1998

You should be able to simply upload it with the existing extension. Since there
will (probably) not be an association set up for the *.nwc files on the client's
computer, he'll get a dialog box prompting him to save the file. If he does have
an association to Noteworthy Composer, the association might try to bring up NWC
to read the file (perhaps unwantedly). In this case, instruct your potential
downloaders to hold shift while clicking on the link (Netscape) or whatever the
equivalent action would be in IE.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Jul-1998

The problem is they won't let me load the file onto their site with the NWC extension.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 26-Jul-1998

Not even if you use CuteFTP?

Reply 4 offered by: BlairDowden on 26-Jul-1998

Not even when I use FTP Explorer. I now make ZIP files and post those.

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 28-Jul-1998

I can download from some sites with no trouble, but others
simply won't go. "Cyberhymnal" @ tch.simplenet.com is one of
the "no way" sites. I played around with several options,
including the "shift-click" mentioned above (which was new
to me, but had no better results than some of the more
arduous menu options. I get a file, but when I try to open
it, I get a "file corrupted" message and see nothing after
the clef/key/time sigs for the first staff.

This happens in both Netscape 4.0x and 4.5x, and with both
registered and unregistered Noteworthy. Can other download
from CyberHymnal, or is it all in their server?

Reply 6 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 28-Jul-1998

Stephen

I have managed to download the zip file of hymns midis from the Cyberhymnal OK and I have sent them to you.

They seem to import into NWC OK also

Cheers ... Sergio

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Jul-1998

Stephen: We tried the CyberHymnal site using Navigator 4, with no luck. It clearly does not download the NWC files as binary. Perhaps the MIME type is not set to trigger a binary download in Navigator. On the other hand, IE4 had no trouble with this. IE downloaded the NWC samples from this site without incident.

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Jul-1998

Update on CyberHymnal site using Navigator: I successfully downloaded the MIDI files on this site using Navigator, so there is probably a MIME type issue at play here with regard to *.nwc files. NWC files should be treated as application binary data, rather than text/ascii. Bottom line: you should be able to work around the issue by using IE for this task.

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew on 28-Jul-1998

Large (and small!) NWC files compress really well, so why not use ZIP if that's the only way to deliver binary data?
It had been suggested before (and normally ignored by me...) to use zipped files for newsgroup uploads.
This is only a workaround, though, as the problem is actually with the webserver not recognising NWC files as binary data. Find your webmaster and suggest that they create a mime association for nwc files as
application/x-nwc
or something like that.

Andrew

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Jul-1998

You are right. I am now using zip files, and the web site accepts them. What I want is for the user to click on the NWC file name and have NWC (or player) automatically start, just like it works for .mid files. It might encourage more use of Noteworthy by new people.

Reply 11 offered by: Andrew on 29-Jul-1998

I agree entirely. See if you can do so at my site
http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html
If so, then you'll have to work out who to talk to (the "webmaster") to make it possible on your site.

A

Reply 12 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 29-Jul-1998

Thanks for all the help!
-- I have been sent the CyberHymnal files in zip form.
-- I can download Andrew's .nwc files with no difficulty
using the standard browser.
-- "zip" files are preferred way for downloads, no doubt.
But the site owner controls that....
-- I don't have IE. Version 3 didn't work (Javascript 1.1
missing functionality); version 4 doesn't fit on my hard
drive. (My opinion of Microsoft would be irrelevant even
if it were suitable for a public forum.)
-- It's not the browser configuration alone because it
recognizes the mime type (as "unknown" and offers me a
chance to save it, which it does successfully from some
sites. But, what does your browser know, or not know,
about .nwc files (if it can access Cyberhymnal).
-- So, when will we have a Netscape-noteworthy plugin?

Reply 13 offered by: Drake Donahue on 29-Jul-1998

Why wait?
in netscape 3.0 (the peak of browser technology so far):
"Options"
"General Preferences"
"Helpers"
"Create new type"
Fill in the blanks "mime type" and "subtype" with something-I used music/NWC
Fill in "File extension" with nwc
Dot "Launch the application"
Browse to your choice of NWPlayer or NWComposer and select it
"ok"
restart Navigator and the next time you find an NWC file a right click should start NWC/NWP as selected above and load the file.

Reply 14 offered by: marsu on 31-Jul-1998

Thanx Drake for such a clear explanation.

Blair, about GeoCities, they _rarely_ allow a new type to be uploaded. I asked them 2 years ago for .NTW files (older format of NWC) and they did nothing.
So load them as .zip ...
Maybe one trick that could work :
1. First rename (on YOUR disk) YourFile.NWC as YourFile.zip
2. Using ftp or their file upload tool (great indeed) upload your pseudo-zip file.
3. Using their file upload tool, rename the DISTANT -on geocities I mean- YOURFILE.ZIP into YourFile.NWC
4. If the step 3. can be done, that's it!! :-)

I think I'm gonna try just to check my theory is correct. I got a page at http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357 and will try to put there solveig.nwc !

MAD

Reply 15 offered by: mad on 31-Jul-1998

Alas!
I got the msg :
Could not rename file "solveig.zip" to "solveig.nwc":
---Invalid extension
I let solveig.zip though... This means that if you download it, you have to rename it as solveig.nwc. Not satisfatcory, is it ? a Real zip is better, as it can even contains directories (to get rid of having to find each and evrey file a different new name)

Un rêve s'évanouit... Well, let's try to write periodically to geocities to allow the ".NWC" extension !!
Or try www.mygale.org, or www.angelfire.com, or many others.

HTH

Reply 16 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Jul-1998

Thanks for the help. Maybe if we all bug GeoCities enough they will let us do it.

Reply 17 offered by: Chris Coon on 28-Aug-1998

If you are having problems with geocities, why don't you transfer to another free webspace provider like tripod?

Reply 18 offered by: Chris Coon on 28-Aug-1998

or upload files to tripod, etc. and link to them from your geocities page if you don't want to break other links?

Reply 19 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Feb-1999

See also: msg #18 (reply 9)

Reply 20 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Feb-1999

GeoCities has not responded to my request. I tried Tripod, and found that it was no different. It seems that it is not enough to permit uploading the file type, it must also be registered as a custom MIME type. If there is a free web page provider that does this, I would like to know about it.

Reply 21 offered by: CyberDeus on 09-Aug-2000

If anyone has a good Composition plese send it.
Thanks.
Cad

Reply 22 offered by: Janice on 10-Aug-2000

Maybe one of you could setup a public web directory where we can upload NWC files, then just link to them from your web site on geocities???


#761: old DOS music notation software
old DOS music notation software

(761)

Submitted by: Joan Wikler on 19-Jul-1998

Hello. I'm a newbie to this group and I'm writing for a
friend who is a composer. She is considering buying a
computer and music notation software for the first time.
Since she has very little money, she would like to buy an
old second hand computer for as little as possible.

Does anyone know where she could get music notation software
that would run on an old system, say a 286 or 386? Perhaps
some old DOS, pre-Windows software?

I know that, in theory, Noteworthy will run on a 386, but
I would think running Windows on a 386 would be kind of
tight.

Any suggestions would be appreciated. Please reply by email,
since I don't read this forum regularly.

Thanks a lot.

Joan Wikler
jwikler@orednet.org

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Mund on 19-Jul-1998

MusicPrinter Plus is an excellent DOS notation program. Last I knew it was still rather spendy thought, like $400 or more. It is made by the same company as the Macintosh program Nightingale.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Jul-1998

The 16-bit edition of NWC 1.52 will run on a 386 with Windows 3.1. With memory costs so low, you could run it with 16M of RAM and get reasonable results. However, you have indicated your friend is about to buy a computer. My advice would be to very carefully consider the logic of investing in a new computer that includes an 80286, 80386, or 80486. These Intel CPUs are extremely outdated technology, and newer PCs equipped with Pentium chips just do not cost that much more...

Reply 3 offered by: johnti on 19-Jul-1998

Noteworthy runs perfectly happy on a 386-dx40 with 8 megs of ram.
Why don't you go halves on a high-end 486 with 16meg ram?

(I personally use a p200mmx with 128meg ram and it runs okay as well :)

Reply 4 offered by: John Ford on 20-Jul-1998

I run Noteworthy (currently 1.51a) on a 386 with 8 MB
of RAM (as well as on a Pentium 166). The 386 works fine,
except that it is noticeably slower. Of course, that is
a matter of perspective (if that's all you know, then
speed is relative).

I would also recommend not buying a 386 today. Low end
pentiums are pretty inexpensive and you may have Y2K issues
on a 386 (you might not care, but if you end up using the
computer for other things, then you probably will).

-- John

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Jul-1998

Noteworthy 1.50 runs fine on my 486-66DX with only 4 MB RAM.

Reply 6 offered by: Al Lilly on 31-Aug-1998

An older version SCORE would definitely run on a 386. I'd check around with some SCORE users via the SCORE mail list. They might have an older version for sale cheap.


#762: Key signature in midi imports
Key signature in midi imports

(762)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jul-1998

I have a considerable number of midi files previously
created using Cubasis Audio, which I have imported to
Noteworthy 1.52 to make use of its superior scoring
capabilities. The problem is in properly displaying files
in keys other than C. E.g., I have one in F#m (A major, three
sharps); when I import it and insert the appropriate key
signature, all F#, C# and G#'s still have the accidentals
associated with each note. Does anyone know how to globally
assign the key signature?

Reply 1 offered by: James C. Franklin on 20-Jul-1998

After you add the key signature try: Tools --> Audit accidentals. As an aside, I think the key signatures are "linearly global", that is in effect until a new key signature is encountered.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Jul-1998

You cannot globally assign the key, but is not very hard to do per staff. Insert or assign the key, then audit accidentals to clear up the unnecessary accidentals that are in key.

See also msg #3

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jul-1998

Thanks for the hints, also an essential part of the puzzle was
supplied directly by e-mail. Using the Audit Accidentals
option alone doesn't quite do it, it leaves wrong notes (both
visually and as played), especially on pieces with tonicizations
(brief excursions into other keys). With your help, I've found
a method that seems to work perfectly:

For each staff:
1) Insert a null key signature (C/Am).
2) Using TOOLS menu, select Force Accidentals. Your staff will
look rather messy at this point.
3) Select the key signature, and use CNTL E to edit it to
the desired key.
4) Using TOOLS menu, select Audit Accidentals.
Next staff.

It may also work to transpose steps 2 and 3 above; if so, it
may be possible (??) to incorporate this into a future version
of Noteworthy, i.e. by preceding the call to "Audit..." with
a call to "Force..."

Thanks again all, thanks to Noteworthy for a great program
and excellent support.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Jul-1998

That answers part of the question.
If the key signature does not import with the midi file you still have to determine the correct key signature with your own music craft.
The technique above doesn't work if you require flats in a sharp key or vice versa.
For example you want to notate a piano chord as Eb7 in the key of C - you get sharps D#7 by default.
If you insert a temporary flat - eg F - key signature and do the tramspose zero /accidental audit you then have to correct the note accidentals that have been neutralized by the temporary key signature.
I think the best answer to this problem and the leading note accidental in minor keys is an Enharmonic Flip Tool.
Select a note, chord, group or measure then use the tool to enharmonically flip the accidentals!
I made it a wish list item.


#763: Transpose Bass -> treble clef???
Transpose Bass -> treble clef???

(763)

Submitted by: Sergio Marshall on 20-Jul-1998

I primarily use NWC to transpose music for my brass quintet. It is a brass band quintet with Eb altohorn, Bb treble clef Euphonium and EEb Tuba. Instead of F Horn C trom in Bass clef and C tuba in Bass clef.

I can perform the transposition for the horn parts, but the shift from bass to treble clefs seems to be a case of selecting the whole stave and ctrl>shft>down arrow to move the notes into the right place. sharpen the key signature twice and change the clef. Then playing both parts together ( Bass clef and treble clef with the appropriate midi transposition) auditing the part audially to pick up the accidentals that havent changed.

Is there an easier way?

Cheers

Sergio Marshall

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jul-1998

No, I haven't found an easier way. I ran into a similar dilemma when converting imported midi files for use with viola (alto) clef.

Regarding wrong notes, here's a hint: select TOOLS, Force Accidentals before doing any transposition or key signature changes. Worked for me.

Reply 2 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 20-Jul-1998

Yes, that is OK for changing clefs for a C instrument to a C instrument. But I have the added hassle of moving to Bb or Eb instruments. I force accidentals but the manual change in key signature mucks up the usefulness of this feature a little.

Looks like I have to do it the way that I already do.

Thanks

Sergio

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 21-Jul-1998

(Andrew blowing the "macro" trumpet again!)
Using RECORDER.EXE (a Windows 3.11 legacy program, normally found in the old Windows directory) as a macro tool, you could record a sequence of keystrokes (I can't make it work with the mouse) so that you reduce this repetetive sequence to a single keystroke.

Andrew

PS: It'd be nice if NWC did some of these things, but if I can find an easy way with a macro program, then Noteworthy can concentrate on other things.

Reply 4 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 21-Jul-1998

OK It would be good if I were running Win 3.11 but I am running Win95 and also don't know anything about macro's. Andrew, if you have any suggestions as to how I could make this procedure less tedious I would be most pleased.

My main concern is fixing the accidentals once all the note shifting has taken place.

Cheers

Sergio

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Jul-1998

Sergio - you shouldn't have to worry about accidentals.
Follow this example.
C Trom Bass Clef to Bb Euphonium in Treble.

1. Make sure that you have the correct key signature for the C Trom in Bass clef before you start.
You must have a key signature present for transposition operations.

2. Select the entire staff - Home then Shift/End.

3. Use Shift/UpArrow twice to lift the note positions to the correct place in the Treble Clef.

4. Select the Bass Clef symbol - Press Ctrl/E and change the clef to Treble.

5. Use the Refresh Score icon or press F9 to update the accidentals in the key signature to Treble clef.
You now have a Treble Clef part in concert pitch with the correct key signature and accidentals unchanged but pitched 2 octaves higher than the original Trom in Bass Clef.

6. Transpose Staff to Bb - Up 2 semitones then whatever octave transposition you require to place the Euphonium in the correct octave.
You may have to adjust the sound transposition in the Midi section of the Staff Properties dialogue by an octave.

I don't think you will need to mess around with the individual accidentals in the part.

Somewhere else in the forum Eric has described this procedure.
Try searching the forum for transpose clef - you may find it.

Reply 6 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 22-Jul-1998

Barry

your instructions worked a treat thank you. I was moving the notes to the position that they would appear on the treble Bb part and then changing the clef and key signature as well. This did not update some of the accidentals as the play back illustrated.

Thanks again

Sergio

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 23-Jul-1998

What's the transposition for Horn in F to Eb alto Horn.
Is it up 2 or down 10 or are you starting from alto clef?
Just curious!

Reply 8 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 23-Jul-1998

Up 2. Both Horns in treble clef. Eb "sounds" 2 semitones below F so you have to move up 2 to sound in the same pitch. Same as Bb trumpet playing C trumpet parts, read a tone higher.

Sergio

Reply 9 offered by: phil on 23-Jul-1998

I've found one method of transposing loses some of the accidentals, but the other method, doesn't have that problem.
Which method is the wrong way, and which is the right way, and can noteworthy or others suggest a solution for the wrong way?

Reply 10 offered by: sveden on 23-Jul-1998

Re Transposing non C instruments.

Does anyone have a good list of all the transposing for all the instruments?

thahnkyu

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Jul-1998

> I've found one method of transposing loses some of
> the accidentals, but the other method, doesn't have
> that problem.

There is only one method, which is the Transpose command on the Tools menu. You cannot simply shift notes up or down to transpose them, as this would not properly change the note spelling to keep them in key. If you are just changing clef, however, then you do simply move the notes up or down as necessary, since the same spelling should exist in both clefs.

See also: msg #3 and msg #4

Reply 12 offered by: Lucas on 25-Jul-1998

IMHO Noteworthy should add this functionality to the UI. It drives me nuts that I hsve to do it by hand... Transposing in place (just the selection), transposing clef, key transpositions, instrumental transpositions should all be menu items!

Reply 13 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 25-Jul-1998

This sounds like a candidate for a "wizard" with knowledge
of specifications (typical clefs & transpositions) for
target instruments.

If there were an eager user ready to prepare the instrument
database, might a wish be more likely to be granted??

Reply 14 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 26-Jul-1998

Transposing for non C instruments is quite easy if you know the pitch of the instrument.

For example Bb trumpet

Bb sounds 2 semitones lower than C so the transposition must "pull" the notes up to allow the Bb trumpet to sound in the C or concert pitch.
Similarly the F horn to C transposition is 7 semitones up or 5 down.

You will soon get the feel for it.

With regards to clefs I find that some composers will write everything for C instruments if the music is only intended for MIDI playback. If you are writing for "live" players then a bit of research will provide you with more information about clef and pitch. Also while researching this find out the range for the instruments you are writing for.

Just my 10 cents worth.

Sergio

Reply 15 offered by: marsu on 31-Jul-1998

Well, IMHO the current behaviour of NWC when changing clefs is correct. If it transposed automatically when changing clefs, (high or up??) this would disallow me to write fugues as I do... :-)
I use the macro recorder too (Sergio, it is really easy to use you know, no "macro language" at all à la µ$-Word (in which case "macro" is bad naming, it should be "script programming"), I'm sending it to you in a separate mail) and this is really simple. And as Andrew points out, if Eric does not work on macros, he can concentrate on other features ;-)

Nevertheless a table that lists all the transposition would be great. I know it exists on the web --I once found it with the scales of many instruments. No time to look for it now.

MAD, HRU (happy reg'd user)

Reply 16 offered by: Melissa on 05-Jun-2001

hello i am a Bass Clef baritone student @ WMHS adn was wondering if Any one could tell me how to tranpose Trble Clef To Bass Clef By Hand If You Could It would be helpful

Reply 17 offered by: Joy Byford on 05-Jun-2001

If you are talking about music written in treble clef for brass instruments that sounds an octave lower than written (which is what I assume you mean) yes its easy.....
Highlight the entire staff then hold down Cntl and Shift, while hitting the up-arrow five times. This repositions the notes ready for bass clef. Then replace the treble clef with bass clef (eg highlight it, then Cntl-E) - the key signature should automatically adjust.

Reply 18 offered by: Stephen Randall on 06-Jun-2001

Wouldn't a treble clef Baritone part be written as a transposing part in Bb according to brass brand practice? In this case the corresponding bass clef part needs to be written a ninth lower rather than an octave. Therefore you would need to go to Tools/Transpose Staff and transpose down two semitones before following Melissa's instructions.

To do it by hand - rather than by NWC - write out your bass clef part by first identifying the correct key signature, two flats more than the treble clef part (or two sharps less). Then write in the notes on the bass clef one letter name below those on the treble clef. Where there is an accidental in the treble clef, there will need to be an equivalent accidental in the bass clef. If the notes in both the treble and bass clef are not affected by the key signature, the accidental will be the same in both cases but if in the treble clef you have a natural on a note that is sharpened by the key signature, this will transcribe to a flat in the bass clef part if the note is not otherwise affected by the key signature. For example, if the treble clef part is in G maj. The bass clef part will be in F Maj. An Fnat in the treble clef will correspond to a Eb in the bass clef. Similarly if you have a sharp on a note that is not affected by the key signature in the in treble clef it will correspond to natural on a note that is flattened by the key signature in the bass clef. For example, using the key of G again in the treble clef part, a C# in the treble clef part would correspond to a Bnat in the bass clef part.

It's a lot easier using NWC!

Personally, I would recommend learning to read treble clef parts directly. It isn't too difficult and once you've learnt it for the baritone you can use the same fingerings on all the brass instruments (except trombone).

HTH

Stephen (part time treble clef AND bass clef tuba player)

Reply 19 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Jun-2001

If the question hadn't been posed by "Melissa," I would have thought it was an adult male (baritone) voice who wanted to sing from the Bass Clef, rather than from the Treble Clef with octave down. I do that all the time. In this case, the advice about shift-five and change the clef is correct.


#764: Upgrade to Version 1.52
Upgrade to Version 1.52

(764)

Submitted by: Ken Stanton on 21-Jul-1998

I've just downloaded the upgrade file for version 1.5x to version 1.52. Having applied the upgrade, the Help / About screen still shows that it is Version 1.51a. Does this mean that the upgrade failed or that the About screen is out of step ?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Jul-1998

Mine says 1.52, so I guess yours did not work. Do you have more than one version of NWC on your machine?

Reply 2 offered by: Ken Stanton on 21-Jul-1998

Blair, thanks for the advice. I have only the one version on my machine, I repeated the download and the upgrade process and it still shows 1.51a. I'll try again after a cold boot and see if it is more successful.

Reply 3 offered by: Ken Stanton on 21-Jul-1998

Tried after a cold boot. Same result; still shows v1.51a. Could it be that 1.51a didn't load correctly in the first instance ? Should I uninstall and reinstall NWC at 1.51a level ?

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Jul-1998

There are two possibilities:

1 - You have more than one copy of NWC on your machine, and you updated the wrong copy

2 - An error prevented the upgrade, in which case you would have received a message

If you did not get an error, then you should carefully check to make sure that you do not have more than one copy of NWC on your machine.

Reply 5 offered by: Ken Stanton on 22-Jul-1998

Blair, NWC Support, I should have taken the hint. I still keep (kept!) an archive file with a copy of my original purchased copy of NWC. I deleted this archive directory and the update went ahead fine. I should have listened first time, because is wasn't an ACTIVE copy I didn't consider that the update routines would find it. Thanks for the help.


#765: Fingering does not print correctly
Fingering does not print correctly

(765)

Submitted by: Joe Niemeyer on 21-Jul-1998

After reading a post in this forum about adding fingering to scores using the insert text feature I find the printed result does not align with what I see on screen. I am trying to indicate fingering for classical guitar for notation that includes beamed notes. I insert text before the beamed notes, but when I pad my fingering text with spaces it does not print over the notes as shown on screen. Has anyone figured out how to correctly show fingering for specific beamed notes so that it prints correctly?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Jul-1998

You must use Print Preview, not the screen display, to see where the text will be placed.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Niemeyer on 22-Jul-1998

When using Print Preview the fingering text still does not line up with what comes out of my laser printer. I have a feeling NWC is not handling the width of spaces in proportional fonts correctly in either the screen or preview depictions. Fingerings are very important to classical guitar notation and NWC has problems in this area. My biggest gripe is that I can't enter text within a set of beamed notes. Doing so breaks the beamed set. I know this has been on the wish list for a long time. It would be nice to see this addressed.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Jul-1998

If your not using lyrics you could enter the fingering as a lyric above or below the staff.
You will need to enter an underscore at notes without fingering marks though - they wont print - but it could be a messy process!

Reply 4 offered by: Warren Barnett on 23-Jul-1998

The trick to seeing on the screen what you want to see on paper is to make sure that the print preview mode is maximized and that you are zoomed all the way in. It's difficult to see more than a small section at a time, but it gives you a very good representation of what will print.


#766: Importing midi in NWC to piano part + vocal only!
Importing midi in NWC to piano part + vocal only!

(766)

Submitted by: graham howes on 21-Jul-1998

how do i stop NWC mapping midi files to innumerable staves?
i want max 3 staves ie vocal line plus piano part as in sample files in NWC format
and i keep getting
what seems like a huge orchestral score! Who knows if it works I might buy the full version ;)

thanks

graham

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Jul-1998

Note: you only need to ask your questions in one place (See msg #489).

You control exactly how many staves are created during MIDI import. Each "Import Instruction" in the import wizard will result in a unique staff. You can add, edit, and delete instructions as appropriate for the material that you are trying to import. In general, though, the instructions created automatically by NWC are usually the most appropriate (you could disable the "Map each MIDI channel to a new staff" option if your MIDI material already has the track arrangement that matches the resulting staves that you are hoping for).

One caveat: if you try to import an orchestral score, you are naturally going to get an import result that looks like an orchestral score (since it is one). If you want an abridged version for piano, you would have to do this yourself.

Reply 2 offered by: Graham Howes on 21-Jul-1998

thanks - I played with various options
but still got multi instrumentation violin / bass / drums etc is it not possible to find mids
that just have piano and voice line? I would be greatful if you could explain further as the
help file is less than helpful - also if you transpose the software still seems to play back in the original key???

yours puzzled

Graham

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 21-Jul-1998

I'll make some point by point suggestions:
"is it not possible to find mids that just have piano and voice line?"
Yes, but you'll need to search them out. If you want to see how some voice lines work, look at the examples provided in the Samples folder with NWC, or some of the many NWC files on the user links page http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/userlinks.htm

"I would be greatful if you could explain further as the
help file is less than helpful"
One of the first things I did with the NWC online help was create a "Find" database (WinHelp 95/98 only), which greatly helped in finding things.

"also if you transpose the software still seems to play back in the original key???"
This is often what's required when mixing transposing with non-transposing instruments, (or instruments that transposse differently) and possibly what you actually will want in this case. When you use the transpose tool, it does two things:
1) rewrite the staff in the new key
2) OPTIONALLY transpose the staff back (using a small midi instruction) so that it sounds the same. This is equivalent to - say - a Bb trumpet player reading and playing a "C" (to them) and hearing a Bb.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Ken Mund on 22-Jul-1998

If you wan't the transposed part to sound like it should transposed you need to cancel the "Update staff transposition" box which appears when you go to "Transpose Staff" under "Tools". Otherwise it will match the original pitches which is quite useful when making band scores in concert pitch, then transposing the instrumental parts to their respective keys.

Reply 5 offered by: graham howes on 23-Jul-1998

Thanks Andrew - the key point for me is I'm a UK based Actor/singer with a Bass/Baritone voice
so constantly searching (often in vain) for decent audition pieces and to wrok on in class. My route often has to be find a piece I like and get it transposed by
Musos who, over in the Uk at least, are often bored with doing this kind of work so charge thru the nose! I need ideally a piece of software that combines the attributes of NWC
that will also play back the transposition in the transposed key and which would also OCR sheet music to MID like Pianoscan
to give raw material - better in NWC it would map it to the correct format - I only need get a bored muso to check for errors instead of doing what they seem to consier a chore!

As for mids - when you download most they seem to generally come in a format where there are a number of parts - violin piano drums bass - no good to me - I'd be grateful for any info on sites with piano + vocal lines
mids which are Broadway Musical or Intelligent pop like Randy Newman/Tom Waits etc who happen to write good intelligent lyrics and tunes that are suitable for auditions for Musicals - my particular gravy train- but as I am distressingly
basic musically - used to following a score with help of an MD!! It would be good to see a varitety of
AI or something to help us poor suckers - it would sell well to Equity members!! I was introduced by a Tom Lehrer like froiend who wites pastiches and comic songs for Radio here in UK. Any responses welcomed

thanks
Graham

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 24-Jul-1998

Graham, have you looked at the NWC Links page (http://www.ntworthy.com/links/index.htm ) - there are a large number of potential sources there.

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 24-Jul-1998

There are some piano/vocal mids out there. None with lyrics as far as I know, though, as that's cutting too close the the copyright bone.

A

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 12-Aug-1998

Huh? The same copyright law applies to music and
arrangements thereof, as to text. So far as I can tell,
though, a particular combination of music and text is not
copyrighteable. (If you have permission to copy the text,
and you have permission to copy the music, there's nothing
to prevent you copying them into the same file.) I think
this applies to US and ICU (International Copyright Union)
both.

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. Your judge has a right to
his own opinion, and probably won't pay any attention to me.


#767: Jpg files of musical notation
Jpg files of musical notation

(767)

Submitted by: Dan  on 21-Jul-1998

Is there a way to create a jpeg file of the music notation fron NWC?
I have heard someone mention that it is possible to set it up so that it think that my hard drive is a printer
and that I could then manipulate the graphic file ....
Anyone got any clue about this?
Dan

Reply 1 offered by: fred on 21-Jul-1998

print it out and scan it in
OR
paste a copy (from the page preview window) into publisher & save as webpage
OR
maybe something else

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 21-Jul-1998

You could try this.
Use the Copy button in the Print Preview this creates a WMF image on the clipboard.
Open a graphic program - Paint Shop Pro - excellent shareware or CorelDraw and paste the image.
If using PSP you will probably have to double the image size on import to get a reasonable resolution.
Then Save the image using a JPEG file format option.
But a Metafile converted to a raster image wont look as good as the original.
It depends on the destination of the file but a zipped Metafile is fairly compact if you intend to transmit over the net and retains the sharpness.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 21-Jul-1998

I would counsel strongly against using JPG as your graphics file format.
JPG works best with gradual changes in color or grey, not sharp boundaries. NWC music is black and white with sharp boundaries.
GIF or TIFF (each reduced to b/w) will give much better reproduction when "unpacked". Try each and see which gives the compression and picture quality when closed and reopened. If you need a graphics file format that is web readable, use GIF.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 21-Jul-1998

I strongly recommend IrfanView, which is FREE. It seems to understand most graphic formats, and will convert between most pairs. It also support re-sizing, and has limited color and gamma tweaking (not relevant with black and white.
It has been written up in a number of magazines, and is avalible at:

http://stud1.tuwien.ac.at/~e9227474/

Cyril N. Alberga

Reply 5 offered by: fred on 22-Jul-1998

Andrew is super right. the gif format is compresses far more efficiently than jpegs. also, gifs print much more clearly. see for yourself.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 22-Jul-1998

You might also find msg #713 of interest.

Reply 7 offered by: Dan on 22-Jul-1998

Ummm....ok . How can I save ANY kind of graphic file of music notation generated by NWC?
I tried copying and pasting into Lview pro. That doesn't work. I was able to paste into a frame
in WORD but I couldn't figure out any way to save it.

Reply 8 offered by: Scandalous on 22-Jul-1998

Paste it into PSP, then save it as *Any* format you like! :-)

Reply 9 offered by: Even more scandalous on 22-Jul-1998

PSP= Paint Shop Pro

Reply 10 offered by: Lucas on 25-Jul-1998

In my expierience the images created by the 'copy' function in page preview produces images that are unusable. They're so full of jagged edges and distortions that a musician couldn't begin to read from them. Is there a way to improve this situation?

Reply 11 offered by: Peter Vasey on 25-Jul-1998

Lucas, I wonder what software you're pasting your image into?? I'll give yet another plug for Serif's Page Plus which gives excellent results. There are cut down trial versions around which will do the job for peanuts. Look at http://www.serif.com

Peter

Reply 12 offered by: Kevin O'Brien on 28-Jul-1998

See how I manipulate Noteworthy output in graphics form:

http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/Stage/6416/

Reply 13 offered by: Andrew on 29-Jul-1998

Peter's right. Some programs (including Photoshop v3) will do a very poor render of the metafile (which is what NWC provides) into a bitmap because they render at the screen dot-density (normally 72 dpi).
Others are a little more careful, and will consider the stated dot-density of the bitmap (or "image") they are rendering to.

Andrew

Reply 14 offered by: Kevin Pammett on 29-Jul-1998

This is all very much in the "rough" stages... but since
this topic has come up, let me "come out" and admit that
I've been looking into taking all this one step further - to
try and get the dynamic affect of "playing a song" on the
web. If you're curious, go to my home page
http://www.net1plus.com/users/pammett/
and
click on "music" right there near the very top of the page.

More than anything, what I think my "experiment" shows is
that doing it "by hand" (as I did) is much too rough. What
we really need is for Nwc itself to output the animated .gif
so that it's smoother and more professional. How big the
.gif gets is simply a function of how big a "screen" size
you want and how often you want to take the snapshots.

Maybe there's another way to get the shapshots taken
automagically. I did it with Alt-PrintScreen (on Win 95)
and then I pasted each image into a .gif with LView Pro
and then I used GifAnimator to put together the sequence.

Anyone got a better idea of how to automate this ?
-Kevin
================================================
| work : KPammett@PlanetDirect.com (978) 684-3571
| home phone/Groton: (978) 448-9088
| email "for life" : Kevin_Gene_Pammett@Bigfoot.com

Reply 15 offered by: Andrew on 30-Jul-1998

I wonder if RealVideo or one of those things can "read" the screen whilst the music is playing?

Reply 16 offered by: marsu on 30-Jul-1998

I guess that Lotus ScreenCam Recorder can record both screen and sound. And your comments if any :-)
But all this takes space, and I dunno if ScreenCam redaer is free. Nor for any platforms.

MAD

Reply 17 offered by: johnti on 05-Aug-1998

If you paste the metafile into publisher 97 and output as a website, you get a gif file. If you customise the size of the page, you can get any size gif you want, e.g 2000 wide, etc. If you use Publisher 97, I assume you have a fast computer.

Reply 18 offered by: abc nonsence on 25-Jul-2000

send icons

Reply 19 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 25-Jul-2000

There is a separate thread of messages regarding how to make GIF, JPG, and so forth, from NWC files. The recent activity has been within the last month or so. Look in the archives.

As the above users pointed out, you can (1) In NWC, using Print Preview, make a placeable Windows metafile, then open the metafile in a program that can do it. If you happen to own a hot-shot drawing program (Illustrator, Corel Draw, etc.) try it. If not, try Irfan View (free and opens nearly anything). The drawing programs retain maximum resolution of the metafile (because a metafile is a drawn object, not a bitmap). In any case, the metafile is too big in pixel dimensions, and will need to be scaled down before saving as GIF or JPG or whatever.

(2) Get Ghostscript and Ghostview. These free programs can open a Postscript file and "print" it to a PDF file, or a bitmap, or JPG. From bitmap or JPG you can re-convert to GIF using (for example) Irfan view. To use Ghostcript and Ghostview, you will need to create a virtual "printer" that creates a file on disk in Postscript format. One way to do this is to install one from your Windows CD-ROM (nearly any "PS" printer will do). There may be tricks involved, and perhpas one of the regular Ghostscript/Ghostview users can advise you better (I use commercial software from Adobe).

(3) From reading other replies, it seems that printing your NWC document then scanning it at 72 DPI is the easiest, if you have a scanner. If the software accompanying your scanner won't directly make a GIF or JPG for you, get Irfan View.

Once again, I point out that NWC owrks something like a drawing (vector) program, whereas GIF and JPG are bitmap images.


#769: soundfonts & SF2
soundfonts & SF2

(769)

Submitted by: David Moderate on 23-Jul-1998

Can anyone help me? I want to use some of the soundfonts that different web sites like "Creative" are offering for download. Their format is 'sf2'. What do you do with them? I downloaded 'IDFEdit' but I don't know what an IDF file is. Whatever I do I fear wiping out what I have.

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 23-Jul-1998

The ability to use soundfonts is a function of the soundcard or the software synthesizer you are using and should be explained in the manual or help for the card/software. If a SoundBlaster AWE card with random access memory installed; there is included software (called 'Control Panel') which gives the tools for loading soundfonts. If you identify your card there may be someone here who also has it and can help.

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 3 offered by: TC on 12-Nov-2000

You need a soundblaster live card or some sound card that uses SF2's. There is software you can use as a substitute to the card but they are crap.

So wake up, get a soundblaster live

Reply 4 offered by: tauseef murtaza on 05-May-2001

well if you have already purchased a sound blaster even then you won't be able to play soundfonts unless you install an appropriate software like "cakewalk" and after that you will still need some software which could help "cakewalk" to play soundfonts....! that software actually works in the background and helps cakewalk to play soundfonts on it.... you can use veanna (pardon me if my spellings are not correct)...

wish you all the best

PS: if you need any help... you can always e-mail me and i will try to reply you as soon as i could.... actually i am thinking over making a cyber band.... so you can be a part of it!!!

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 06-May-2001

You don't need Cakewalk -essentially- to use soundfonts. Once loaded into memory, you can use them within NWC (ref. msg #1517)

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-May-2001

Reply 4 is a but misleading. Generally, when using soundfonts, you need the following:

1 - a sound card that supports them
2 - a program or utility that manages them (as far as I know, this always comes with the card)
3 - any Windows MIDI programs, such as NWC


#770: Midi beginner questions
Midi beginner questions

(770)

Submitted by: Carolyn C on 23-Jul-1998

Recently upgraded computer, etc. I now have Windows 95 and a 16-bit Sound Blaster. Also have upgraded powerful (new) speakers that work great through Windows. Reinstalled Noteworthy 1.52. However, something is not right about using Noteworthy - I suspect I've missed something in the MIDI setup since I'm a rank beginner at MIDI. My keyboard is a Yamaha PSR 320. I've learned how to enter notes in step-time and real time. BUT - the sound quality is not good. There's much less volume than the Windows music and there's static on playback. I have fiddled around with various settings, but no improvement. Any ideas on what's going on? Is it the cable? I'm using just a standard MIDI cable, no extenders. All help is appreciated. The Forum is terrific!

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 23-Jul-1998

You don't say whether the poor sound quality is on replay through your keyboard or computer, but I suspect the latter. As I understand it, the only information that is stored when you enter notes from a keyboard is the channel (effectively the instrument), pitch and duration (for real time entry). You have to set up key signatures, dynamics etc. yourself. Try altering the staff volume setting (from the main Menu follow : Staff - Staff Properties - MIDI), and put some dynamic notation on your score - ff would be a good place to start! The static is almost certainly due to the low volume of the playback signal - what you are hearing is general background noise, rather like a radio tuned away from a station.

Good Luck, Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 23-Jul-1998

I do not think that the static is caused by low volume. I
play noteworthy files and CD's at the same speaker volume,
and the loudness level is similar. But the CD is crystal-clear
and Noteworthy sounds like a Tesla coil. It hasn't hampered
me, because I am listening only to proofread the notation.

I suspect sound card or driver configuration has something to
do with it, but I'm immune to the pleasures of trying to
configure hardware and Microsoft programs, so I haven't
persued it.

I doubt that it is Noteworthy, though. One way to prove that
would be to download another freeware MIDI player and try it.
It's not likely that it and Noteworthy would indepentantly
have the same problem...

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 23-Jul-1998

In reply to Stephen, isn't CD sound handled differently? I thought the sound information on a digital CD directly related to the waveform being reproduced, whereas a Noteworthy or MIDI file played through a computer's sound card relies upon the sound card's inbuilt instrument synthesis and/or samples. Carolyn, I don't have your symptoms with two different sound cards in two different computers. Is it only the tunes you have entered via your keyboard that give problems, or are all your NWC tunes, including the sample files showing the same symptoms?

Peter.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 23-Jul-1998

Just had another thought Carolyn - after you upgraded, did you check your sound card settings? Bear in mind that the Windows opening sequence and other sounds are wave files, and you are having problems with MIDI. In your sound setup (I think it's somewhere in Control Panel under Windows 95, or Creative Mixer in Soundblaster 16) there are different volume settings for the various inputs, i.e. wave, MIDI, CD, Microphone and Line In. A low MIDI volume would explain your basic problem, and high settings on unused Line In or Microphone inputs would add to the background noise. Let us know how you get on.

Cheers, Peter.

Reply 5 offered by: Carolyn C on 23-Jul-1998

Peter - I will have to try out the "samples" versus my own entries to see if there's a difference. Intuitively, it just feels like it's a mixed up connection somehow to the MIDI cable or something mixed up in the transmission to the computer from the keyboard. I suppose that if the samples are different - better - than my own stuff, that would serve to further indicate what I'm trying to say. I will keep you posted.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Jul-1998

Here are a few other thoughts:

- Does the PSR-320 have speakers of its own? If so, is the PSR-320 sounding wrong, or is it your MIDI playback via your sound card? Either way, your MIDI cable is not the problem, as it only carries digital MIDI event data, and cannot contribute to a noise issue the way an audio cable might.

- Is your CD player internal to your computer? Is it internally connected to your sound card, or does it connect to your speakers through a different system? If your CD player does not route through your sound card, then you may simply be using the wrong output on your sound card to your speakers. Make sure that you use the line out if your speakers have their own amplifier. If you use the amplified output from your sound card, you might hear the amp clipping, thus causing noise.

- Have your tried the Media Player that comes with Windows on any of the MIDI samples that also come with Windows? The samples are in the Windows\Media folder if you have installed them (they are optional in the Windows setup). If the samples sound OK, then make sure that you use ONLY the MIDI Mapper for playback in NWC. This will make it sound just as good as the generic Windows Media Player.

Reply 7 offered by: Carolyn C on 23-Jul-1998

Gee, thanks for all the replies! Appreciated. Replying to NWC-Support response: The PSR-320 is sounding fine, no problems. CD player is connected to the Audio part of the sound card, but it is sounding great. Also, Media Player files sound great. Very clear sound and quite powerful. But I need to try setting up the NWC MIDI Mapper as my playback. I will do that tonight and report back. Many thanks.

Reply 8 offered by: Johnti on 26-Jul-1998

I have found that some amplified speaker system are cheap and poorly designed. Inside the speakers there is hardly any insulation, so in actual fact, the speakers are just amplifying the noise that leaks in.
So I suggest that anyone with this problem should try out different amplifying speakers.

Reply 9 offered by: carolyn c on 27-Jul-1998

I said I would reply: thanks again for all the replies. The key answer was to make the playback choice "MIDI mapper." Now the sound is as good as the Windows players, and volume is the same also. Thanks again!

Reply 10 offered by: Peter Vasey on 27-Jul-1998

Thanks for keeping us informed, Carolyn. I wonder if your solution would work for Stephen Hutcheson - he would appear to have a similar problem. Come back, Stephen!

Reply 11 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 03-Aug-1998

Thanks for asking. School is starting here, and I'm losing my only sound-equipped machine to homework assignments. I'll review and double-check all of this, but it may take awhile...

Reply 12 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 12-Aug-1998

I have an internal CD-ROM, with output to powered speakers
through the sound card, although I'm still not sure of the
actual data path. But the Microsoft sound player had the
same problem with static.

And __Reducing__ the output volume on the
sound card eliminated one source of static: the amplifiers
were indeed being overloaded. Now, the "acoustic grand
piano" and "church organ" instruments are essentially
static-free. The static on the "choir" instrument is mostly
masked by the buzz.... (It's a cheap sound card.)

Thanks, all. This does make proofing scores more pleasant.


#771: print a medly on a page
print a medly on a page

(771)

Submitted by: Ellen Klomps on 24-Jul-1998

I often want to place three separate tunes on one page for a medly. How can I print them out, with a break and title between each tune on one page?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 24-Jul-1998

This would be easiest solved by either
1) printing each song separately and manually cutting and ppasting them onto a single sheet
2) Again creating three separate songs. Use Print Preview, copying each song and pasting the metafile picture into something like Word.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 31-Jul-1998

You can also try to use ClickBook, which would allow you o make much more. NWC-Support already described it in older messages. It can be found at !ftp://store.bluesquirrel.com/cbtrial.exe (1.3Mb) for a free trial.
But the solution Andrew gives above is the fastest right now. If you have ClickBook it's better though --but it costs $50. How much is µ$-Word?? ;-)

MAD

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 31-Jul-1998

Have a read through msg #713. Also check out the Serif page at http://www.serif.com Their Page Plus Intro is free and will do the job admirably. Only snag is the filesize is several megabytes, so I hope you have a fast modem and telephone line, otherwise the download will cost you more than sending for the CD-ROM!

Peter.


#772: Turtle Beach ??
Turtle Beach ??

(772)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jul-1998

Does anyone have experience with the Turtle Beach 'Pinnacle' card? Considering this as a possible upgrade, getting rather tired of the cheesy SB16 sounds. Another possibility is a dedicated synth module; any recommendations?

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 25-Jul-1998

Hi Fred, I can't offer you any help, but I too am thinking about upgrading to TB Fiji or Pinnacle. Reviews all seem good about TB products, reviews about Creative's AWE 32 or 64 Gold all say it is way overrated, but a good value for the money...

Any recommendations, experiences? I too am interested in the opinions on this Forum. Thanks!

Reply 2 offered by: Chris Coon on 03-Aug-1998

WAVmaker is the most AWESOME program on the web for rendering MIDI to CD-quality WAV files. I have had very good experience with it. (Do a search on WAVmaker at http://www.yahoo.com) However, it takes a long time to render MIDI's, and WAVs are huge files. Also condsider the MIDInight Express for faster rendering. (As soon as you export a mid file, you can listen to it. Go to http://www.polyhedric.com) It is cheaper but slightly less quality. These programs are enough to satisfy my wants for high quality sound and they are much cheaper than another sound card. I have an AWE64 Value and the quality of these programs surpasses the best that the card can do.

However, they do not play back MIDs like a Wavetable sound card does. You would need to export your files to MID before you could listen to them. Consequently you can not listen and watch the music at the same time.

Reply 3 offered by: Dave Putrtock on 14-Aug-1998

I've just done a comparison for our local school music department who scraped up enough cash to fund three new computers and midi keyboards. After trying out a few including my sons' AWE32 we went for the Turtle Beach Malibu Surround 64. The results have been really impressive particularly when played through a mixer into a decent amplifier, almost broadcast quality.
The school are using them with Windows 95 but they also come with drivers for 3.11 and NT4.


#773: Midi won't play all tracks
Midi won't play all tracks

(773)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jul-1998

Ran into an odd problem playing some multi-track midi files. NW Player, NW Composer (registered) and other midi players (i.e. MS Media Player in Win 3.11, Creative Midi player, and several freeware players) all play just the first 8 tracks.

This occurs both on the SB16, and also on an external Casio CTK611 synth.

What really strange is that if I import it into Cubasis Audio V1.0, all tracks play properly, both on SB16 and on the Casio.

If anyone is interested in pursuing this, a good sample file to play with is at:

http://midiworld.com/cmc/midi/a1/mfovert.mid

(This is the overture to Mozart's "The Magic Flute", and consists of 14 tracks. The missing tracks will be immediately obvious if you're at all familiar with this piece.)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Jul-1998

Tried to look at your MIDI file to diagnose the problem, but I get this:

"You don't have permission to access /cmc/midi/a1/mfovert.mid on this server."

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jul-1998

Hm... weird. I didn't have any trouble getting on, try going to the main page at "http://midiworld.com/cmc/index.htm". Then scroll down a few pages to the "M's" on the links at the left, then click MOZART and you should be able to pull up the file from there.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Jul-1998

OK. I reviewed the file. There are two possible causes for your problem:

1. The string ensembles are on MIDI channels 11 through 15. It is possible that your MIDI Mapper configuration does not map these channels to a playback device (thus they will not sound). You can either fix up your mapping settings, or directly select a MIDI device as your playback device in NWC (although this will not help the Media Player or NoteWorthy Player programs).

2. Less likely: The String Ensemble patches probably require more synth voices in your sound card, thus causing drop-outs in instruments in playback. This would happen on all channels though.

I suspect that #1 is the true problem with your system (it usually is the problem in these cases).

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jul-1998

You were absolutely right - the mapping was only set for the first 10 channels (by Windows default). Boy do I feel dumb... Doh!

Reply 5 offered by: Johnti on 26-Jul-1998

BTW, (Re the Magic Flute) Mozart was a freemason and was involved in some occultic activity.

That's why he composed in the pentagrammic scale!

(joke)


#774: Preserving Dynamics during Import
Preserving Dynamics during Import

(774)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jul-1998

Does anyone know of a way to force NW Composer to preserve dynamics and other controllers (pitch bend, etc.) during Midi import?

It's interesting to note that NW Player preserves these controllers, but Composer does not.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 25-Jul-1998

NW Player cheats - it actually plays the Midi file!

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 26-Jul-1998

I think Noteworthy has probably thought about this, and we have talked about it. It would be a great feature. As far as I am concerned though, Noteworthy basically does what I want and anything else is a bonus.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 26-Jul-1998

You can also consider it a special feature we haven't got yet. :-)

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 31-Jul-1998

I think Fred's last word is right :-)
But I long for this feature I must say !


#775: NW Composer and Player
NW Composer and Player

(775)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 25-Jul-1998

I upgraded to NWC 1.52, and now my NW Player (still 1.51a) does not work anymore (on NT). I installed them both into the same directory, because they seem to share the same DLL's. Is this not a good idea?

So I had to use NW Composer to play Midi files, which is more bother and does not work as well. I think both these products would benefit from using standard VCR controls for playback.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jul-1998

This probably isn't the best thing to do, if for no other reason than that Composer's uninstal.exe and install.log files will be overwritten by Player's files (same name but different contents). If you try to uninstall Composer, it will uninstall Player instead... with possibly unpredictable results.

If you're running Win 3.x it's not too serious, you can delete the desktop links, delete the appropriate files, and edit the associations out of your win.ini file. However, if you've got Win95 it'll be trickier, since setup probably wrote to your Windows registry. Good luck trying to edit that sucker! (Anybody out there who thinks Win95 is an improvement, raise your hands!) Sorry, my agenda is showing...


#776: Information
Information

(776)

Submitted by: herve on 26-Jul-1998

I want to put int the same staff stem up notes and stem down notes. There is an example in the product with the file song "Nowell". How can I do ? thanks

Reply 1 offered by: na on 26-Jul-1998

On the tool bar there are buttons indicating notes with up stems and notes with down stems. Click on them with the mouse and see what happens.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jul-1998

You can selectively make stems go up or down by selecting the desired note group (hold shift and use the cursor keys to select), then click the appropriate toolbar buttons.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 26-Jul-1998

If you refer to on-line Help, following the trail :
<Contents><Command Reference><Tool Bar Reference>
you will find a description with icons of all the Tool
Bar Button functions.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 26-Jul-1998

Or by opening the Notes menu, moving down to Stem Up or Stem Down and Pressing F1.
Note that this method will provide help about ANY menu command you highlight.

A

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 31-Jul-1998

You can also try the "Tools/Audit stems" menu. This will put the notes above the 2 inter-line up, and underneath down.

Bonne continuation et bienvenue au club.
P.S. If you want to put some notes as chords (accords), be careful to the placement. Refer to the help for further details.

MAD

Reply 6 offered by: |\|eur0N on 02-Aug-1998

I´m a vilinist, I want to know how can I make a Down Bow or make up bows on the music score???

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 02-Aug-1998

The answer to the general problem must be in the help file somewhere, but to be quick and specific:

Find a graphic music font which contains the glyphs you need, and install it. There are many kicking around, but I'm not sure which contain the bow marks.

In Noteworthy Composer in Options | Fonts, specify this font as one of the user defined fonts.

When inserting text (with the X command), select your "User Defined Font", and insert the appropriate character.

And that's sort of about it. The rest is left as an exercise for the reader! :)

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 04-Aug-1998

Dear Neuron,
As you appear to make ascii-art,
try to use ^ for one end of the archet" (bow?) and | Alt-0175 |
(which gives |¯|) for the other end. Select the "System" font for those item text. (set User 4 font to system and use User4 in font listbox)

Hope this helps.


#777: Playback speed
Playback speed

(777)

Submitted by: Gene on 26-Jul-1998

How do I adjust the playback speed of NWC files?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 26-Jul-1998

Change the tempo in the conductor track.
Select the tempo mark - Press Ctrl/E and edit the value.

Reply 2 offered by: Gene on 27-Jul-1998

Thanks Barry. That did the trick.

Gene


#778: Chaning the Clefs + Notes
Chaning the Clefs + Notes

(778)

Submitted by: George on 26-Jul-1998

I've downloaded midi files that were composed using a
bass clef, but I can't play those notes on my
instrument, is there a way to convert the file from
bass clef notes to treble clef notes.

Please help.
It would be greatly apprieciated. Thanks in Advance!

shadow16@juno.com

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 26-Jul-1998

I don't think midi stores clef information. What do you mean you can't play bass clef notes on your keyboard? The middle note on the bass clef is D. Find that on your keyboard and go from there.
If you have trouble reading bass clef, and want to change to treble clef, then refer to http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/0/763.htm
which is just 15 articles below.


#779: blank staff with notated staff
blank staff with notated staff

(779)

Submitted by: Ellen on 27-Jul-1998

I'm looking for a way to print out a treble staff with notes and a blank bass staff that I can pencil in notes while arranging. I'm currently doing the bass clef with rests, but they get in the way. I tried setting up the staff and using extend last sysytem, but that doensn't work.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Jul-1998

Try this. It's clunky, but it works. Create a NEW staff from the FILE menu. INSERT the desired CLEF, KEY and TIME signatures.

Now click the whole note (assuming 4/4 time; dotted half for 3/4, etc.) Now press the space bar n times, where n is the number of desired bars. This fills in a bunch of rests (if I read your message correctly, you've already gotten this far).

Next use the TOOLS menu to AUDIT BAR LINES. This will insert the bar lines.

Then go through and delete the rests. The result will be a series of very short "bars", without anything in them.

Next, click on the first bar and INSERT TEXT. But don't enter any actual text; use a string of spaces instead. Click the "Preserve Width" button ON. Experiment with the number of spaces until you get the size of bar you want.

Finally, select the invisible "text" and copy to clipboard with CNTL C. Then go through the blank "score" to paste that same invisible text line into each bar using CNTL V.

You can use PRINT PREVIEW to verify that you've got it the way you want it.

Voila. (Or "Viola" as the case may be.)

Reply 2 offered by: Chris Lee on 09-Apr-1999

Please can a non-clunky way of doing this be added to the wish list?

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 12-Apr-1999

Fred, I tried but couldn't make it as ou explain it ("space" measures won't have the right width).
So here is another "solution": insert, as Fred explains, "whole rests" (you can *always* use a whole rest, whatever the time sgnature may be) and assign it a "+8" vertical placement. This will move them over the "empty" staff.
Then print it as is, or import it (via Print Preview/Copy/wmf) in any design program (paint shop pro, word...) where you remove (easily, since alone and aligned) the now unwanted whole rests, floating around.

Other solution, muc more easy: compose directly with NWC :-)
but in that case, if one could hear notes one enters them would be wonderful ;)

hth,
      MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 12-Apr-1999

It's probably my natural incompetence, but I produced a "WMF" file and none of my programs want anything to do with it. Help!

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 12-Apr-1999

Peter,
which program did you try to open the .wmf file ? If you got word, try Insert/Image... to get the .wmf, then double-click on the image to get access to the picture elements. /!\ you'll need MUCH memory!
Or open it with PaintShopPro (shareware), if you ain't got it I'm sure many other programs will be able to treat .wmf files. Alas, PhotoShop (even 5) DOESN'T! Maybe (probably?) CorelDraw! does.
hth, MAD

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Apr-1999

What programs are you trying? Lots of programs will not work, since they are not graphics or page layout programs. Many word processors accept metafiles. Some paint programs work, some do not. Technically, they must accept the Placeable Metafile format. We have sucessfully used MS-Word as well as some versions of WordPefect.


#780: Joining staves
Joining staves

(780)

Submitted by: Dan on 27-Jul-1998

I am writing a magnificat with 7 staves. How do I join the top four staves together and the bottom three together, but not staves four and five, (separating choir and organ).

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Jul-1998

You need to organize your score into "groups". Follow the online help by searching for "Staff Properties."

There may also be a way of editing the "canned" templates provided in the FILE NEW option, but I haven't figured that one out yet.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Jul-1998

I'm not sure that grouping will achieve what you want.
The only work around I could suggest is to make the top and bottom staves in each group Upper Grand Staff and Lower Grand Staff.
This wont separate the two groups at the start of the page but will bracket each group. The bar lines will look odd at intermediate measures though.
This is an item to add to the wish list - Staff Style by Groups.
I would like to group Saxes, Trumpets, Troms and Rhythm into separate grouping in the score with the Orchestral Style corners at the top and bottom of each group.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Jul-1998

You can get very close to what you want. Here are the steps:

1. Create a song with 7 staves
2. Mark the top and bottom staff with the "Orchestral" style (activate the staff, press F2, goto Visual tab, then field Style)
3. Lastly, mark any other staves as "Orchestral" that should be connected to the staff above it.

You will not get individual braces, but you will get bar lines connected for the staves that are marked as Orchestral.


#781: Suggested Enhancement
Suggested Enhancement

(781)

Submitted by: Harry Kellogg on 27-Jul-1998

I am a new user of NWC, which I find superb! I use it to enter music which I am learning to sing. While entering a long piece I frequently find that I can't recall, e.g., what tempo is currently in effect (need to know this e.g. to enter a new tempo when I encounter a ritard). Awkward to page back looking for the last tempo entered (and error-prone). Therefore I have the following suggestion for an enhancement.

In the status bar at the bottom, reserve an area in which are displayed the current values in effect (for the cursor location) for
o key signature
o time signature
o tempo
o dynamic

This would be a big help to me. What do others think of this?

Harry Kellogg

[My apologies if you've seen this before. I thought I had entered it some time ago. But when I looked for replies last week, I couldn;t find it.]

Reply 1 offered by: Harry Kellogg on 27-Jul-1998

I have added this to the wish list. But I'm also interested to see what others think of this idea.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 28-Jul-1998

Let me say, Harry, that you are not the first to have made such a suggestion (though mine included bar number and "position" within the bar). Seems like a small thing to implement, but maybe the suggestion was not that popular.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 31-Jul-1998

Gosh yes, what a good idea.

This demonstrates the problem with the invisible wish list. How can one [Eric that is - he must be Number One Programmer :) ] judge popularity when no-one knows what other bright ideas others have thought up.

I'm off to the wish list to say "Yes please, me too".

Stephen

Reply 4 offered by: Johnti on 02-Aug-1998

I need a downward squiggle to notate that effect with trombones and saxophones, etc. Can someone please add that as well?

Thankyou!

PS: any other big banders out there?

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 02-Aug-1998

You can get the "notation" (but not the sound - unless you use a hidden staff and a pitch MultiPoint Controller, discussed elsewhere, I think at ntworthy.nwc) of by inserting text with a User Defined font, and using some other music font which contains the desired squiggle.

I'm really hoping that Noteworthy will augment their NWC font to include the more common desired goodies.

A


#782: no space between repeat and author
no space between repeat and author

(782)

Submitted by: Paul on 29-Jul-1998

How does one creat more space between the horizontal line
of the repeat and the author line.
It looks like this:

_____NoteWorthy Art
|2

if I increase the upper space area, in the staff properties
the horizontal stays the same the vertical line just "grows"

like this.

____Noteworthy
|2
|
|

Sure is a nice program though.

Reply 1 offered by: Sergio on 29-Jul-1998

I also tried to fiddle with the top margin to see if it moved the text away from the score. Didn't work.

A way round the problem is to produce the music with no information for title and composer. Then in print preview copy the final product and paste it into Word etc as a picture then type the title etc at the top. Allows you to have more flexibility for heading designs. Make sure that the music is exactly as you want it before copying and pasting.

The end result looks really good.

Cheers ... Sergio


#783: Little question to the Forum:
Little question to the Forum:

(783)

Submitted by: Gregor Rjidlicka on 29-Jul-1998

Hello Forum.

I only want to know if it's possible to run Noteworthy
under a 368 DX 40.

Thanks for answering.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Jul-1998

I'm running it on a 486SLC66 (essentially the same as 486SX66) and it runs just fine. Haven't run into any undue speed problems.

Your 386DX40 is only marginally slower, so you should have no trouble. You can't hurt anything by trying it, NWC is an exceptionally stable and forgiving program. (After all, that's what "try before you buy" is all about!)

regards, Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 30-Jul-1998

Fred's right. It may run a little slower, but if your 386 can handle normal midi files, it should be able to handle NWC no problemo.
All the better if you are running Win 3.1 !

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: James C. Franklin on 30-Jul-1998

I run NWC on a 386sx25 under Win 3.1 and it works fine.

Yeah, I know it's an obsolete machine but it still works.
And I have an upgrade planned..... real soon now.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 31-Jul-1998

By "upgrade", I bet your 386 will be _replaced_, ain't it ?
About the initial question, it should work fine. Hope you got Win3.1 and 4Mb. (It could run with 2 though, I think)
If you got the non-color screen (probably), you can customize the color used in NWC to change them into different grey shades if necessary (though the gr.card should do it itself)

HTH

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 31-Jul-1998

FYI: It is doubtful that NWC will run in 2 MB of space, even on Windows 3.1. It never hurts to try, but I suspect that you would get less than adequate results, even if you are not running any other background tasks.

Reply 6 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 03-Aug-1998

I occaisionally use NWC on a 386 with 4 meg, but even that is a right pain in the ummm..well you know. I suppose it just comes down to the obvious...the more powerful, the better.
Adam


#785: Hallo Forum!
Hallo Forum!

(785)

Submitted by: Michael Schneider on 30-Jul-1998

Ich habe eine Frage:

Gibt es eigentlich in diesem Forum auch deutsche User?
Ich würde mich sehr freuen, weil ich des Englischen nicht mächtig bin.

Danke, und schöne Grüße an das Forum!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Jul-1998

Ich bin eigentlich nicht ein deutscher User, aber kann geschriebenes Deutsch verstehen. (Mann koennte sagen, dass ich des Deutschen nicht maechtig bin!)

Es wuerde mich freuen zu helfen wo moeglich.

Fred Nachbaur

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 31-Jul-1998

Ich weiß nicht ob es hier anderen Deutschen gibt, wie Fred bin ich kein Deutsch (aber in Deutschland geboren).
Wenn du kein English spricht, du kannst der Altavista/Systran Automat "Übersetzer" versuchen. Dan gibt es die URLen du willst zu übersetzen. Es ist nicht echt richtig, sondern bisweilen hilft es mir.

Par la même occasion, combien y a-t-il de francophones ??

Sorry for english-only users for this extra-language parenthesis !!

MAD

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 31-Jul-1998

There are times that I really wish I listened to my french and german teachers at school:-)

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 04-Aug-1998

Ich spreche Französich, ein bißchen English und ein kleines
bißchen Deutsch...

For people who understand english but not french or german,
the initial question was "are there german users in this
forum", and marsu also asked "how many french speaking
people are there".

We could extend the question: how many people here speak
italian, spanish, esperanto, czech, (...) ?

Reply 5 offered by: George Jenner on 10-Aug-1998

Frenchophone and Spanishophone chez nous.

Hides behind an American low ascii keyboard to avoid grammatical errors
(yes I know how to find the chars, but I'm lazy).

Geo.


#786: Accidentals during Midi Input
Accidentals during Midi Input

(786)

Submitted by: Rob on 30-Jul-1998

When playing in to Noteworthy composer via my keyboard, all the accidentals come out as sharps. This is OK for a bit, but is a bit tough when a piece played in A flat major comes out in G sharp major-ish. Has anyone got a way to specify whether you want sharps of flats before you start recording? Or maybe recording in a specific key?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 31-Jul-1998

Did you try to set the key signature before ??
if yes, then try this:
1. Set the key sig. to C Maj (nothing)
2. Record your work
3. Use Tools/Force Accidentals
4. Edit the KeySig to what you want.
5. Use Tools/Audit Accidentals.

Then A# should be replaceb by Bb when you got flats in the key sig.

HTH (you can also refer to older messages about transposition, and enterring via keyboard. Already discussed many times),

         MAD

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 04-Aug-1998

marsu wrote:
> 5. Use Tools/Audit Accidentals.

I think it should rather be:
5. Transpose 0 semitones.


#787: converting midi files in proper staff notations
converting midi files in proper staff notations

(787)

Submitted by: Purvi R. Sheth on 31-Jul-1998

I use noteworthy composer to import midi files but the staff notations look so dangerous to me - with 10 staffs being played together.I wonder how many fingers do I need to do this. Actually, I'm quite new to music itself. I've started learning keyboard recently. So,I don't know the proper method.
Can anyone help me?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 31-Jul-1998

Purvi, I suspect that your 10 stave file is an orchestral arrangement with several different instruments represented. (Hint: Look at <File><Page Setup><Contents> for a listing of all the stave names). If it is just a piano accompaniment, try increasing the 'maximum single track chord size' in the Import Wizard.

Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: Purvi R. Sheth on 01-Aug-1998

Thanks, Peter. You were right. There are several instruments.
Can you tell me some sites where I can get some free sheet music for beginners.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Aug-1998

There's more places to get midi files than you can shake a stick at. Depends what you're looking for. Try http://midiworld.com/cmc/index.htm for starters, there are tons of classical midi files there.

Also look up the Crescendo Player homesite at http://liveupdate.com/crescendo.htm, you can pick up a free streaming midi player that's pretty cool when web-surfing. They also have links to sites using their streaming midi protocol. You'll be amazed at the diversity of midi music out there, especially if you have something a little better than the typical soundblaster card.

Once you've found some midi files you like, import them into Noteworthy Composer, edit and layout as desired (good practise!) and print them out. Viola! Free scores (except for the cost of paper and ribbon/cartidge).

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 04-Aug-1998

you could try http://www.prs.net/midi_src.html too, Pierre Schwod has got categories such as Piano --All Scarlatti's work-- or Choir pieces.
Also refer to http://www.channel1.com/users/gsilvis/ !

Hope this helps,
                    MAD

Reply 5 offered by: Spamware Inc. on 05-Aug-1998

Go to altavista and search for this:
+"any title of a song" +midi +download

Reply 6 offered by: gaurav on 24-Jun-2000

dear sir
if such software exists, please contact me at gau013@rediffmail.com

Reply 7 offered by: cas on 22-Jul-2001

hi guys! i've been searching EVERYWHERE ON THE WHOLE NET FOR SOME STAFF-NOTATIONS!! It took me to these forums... Now I know that i can use noteworthy composer to convert midi-songs to staff-notations (right?)!!
but i still don't know where I can easily download (or copy and paste) staff-notations from!!

HELP! HELP! HELP!!

THNX!
CAS

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Jul-2001

I presume that you are looking for scores? If so, start here:

Free Sheet Music Downloads

If you're looking for files in NWC format, go here:

NWC Scriptorium

Finally, if you need the finest scoring program in the known universe, at the lowest price in the history of humanity, go here: ;-)

NoteWorthy Software

Have fun!


#789: Noteworthy simply rules
Noteworthy simply rules

(789)

Submitted by: Robert Dowden on 01-Aug-1998

I'm evaluating the shareware version and I must say that this is one excellent program indeed....refreshing to say the least in a world of lame programs all asking for my money. Well done! Keep up the good work!

And the community here for support and inspiration is incredible!

Reply 1 offered by: hru on 04-Aug-1998

(happy registered user)
So join the club :-) and fell free to contribute too
we all learn from each other

            Houba!


#791: Music Font
Music Font

(791)

Submitted by: Barry Graham on 02-Aug-1998

There has been continual discussion of music fonts and marks which prompts me to re-attempt another try at adding these to the 'Boxes' font previously posted in the newsgroup.
I have delayed this hoping Eric would say 'don't do it - help is on the way'!
Anyhow! - While I'm less than satisfied with the results so far and I find the text entry tedious perhaps it's time to re-think.
So - here's a list of marks I would use - perhaps you could suggest some more - there is a limit of 128 marks and I've used some already.
Short and Long Fall Offs.
Short and Long Lip Up.
Short and Long Gliss.
Short and Long Slide.
Attack accent ^.
Trill.
Shake.
Turn.
plus the Multi-bar Rest markers, numbers and Section Flag Boxes already in the font.
That's basically it for the jazz and big-band stuff I do.

I find that spending time in entering text to enhance the parts is a great time absorber so I only do this to the lead parts.
Then I print a rough and ready score - NWC does produce an exquisite big band score in landscape mode on A4 paper - and manually copy the parts adding the marks to the other parts as I go.
I have to do this for the rhythm parts anyway - since there are no rhythm time indicators or drum note heads - and dont ask I'm not going to add them - the problem with empty bars full of text marks falling out of the right side of the screen still exists!!

So if you want your favourite mark added - post a reply - no promises and it's all subject to available time.

Barry

Reply 1 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 03-Aug-1998

Hi Barry

I am interested in the Boxes font the you speak of. Where can I get a copy?? I particularly like the idea of inserting gliss. and also boxed letters or numbers for "bar flags"

Cheers

Sergio

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 03-Aug-1998

By gliss, I hope you mean arpeggio several heights), though gliss markers would be cool, too.

I'd also like cross markers to put through notes to indicate tremolo. (Like singe slash and double slash).

Oh and a mordent, inverted mordent, a turn, vibrato/trill (several lengths) and cresc./decresc (several lengths)

Better stop there... !

A

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 04-Aug-1998

I have been hoping for crescendo / decrescendo for a long time. If you do come up with a font, how can those of use who cannot access the newsgroup get it?

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Bowers on 04-Aug-1998

There are two music fonts available for free download at

http://www.efn.org/~bch/aboutfonts.html

These have a lot of useful symbols, including several glissando symbols.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 05-Aug-1998

For < and > signs, in case you have a postscript printer, refer to msg #166, msg #157, msg #188.
Do not hesitate to contact me if you want other details (NwcConvL.exe should help).

MAD

Reply 6 offered by: Praveen on 21-Jun-2000

Get <A Href="http://loserband.homepage.com/">Petrucci (http://loserband.homepage.com/)</A> along with <A href="http://www.efn.org/~bch/aboutfonts.html">efn-bch</A>. I use Petrucci with my piano pieces.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Jun-2000

Thanks Praveen. btw - to make a link on this forum you don't have to use html tags. Just preface the URL with a bang (!).


#792: joint projects
joint projects

(792)

Submitted by: Russell K. on 02-Aug-1998

I would like to know if there is anyone on the net that would like to do a joint project using NWC. I am in the process of one. They are good learning expreiences. I am a young composer(about 16). I have several accomplishments to my name, such as the current joint project i am working isn't even halfway finished and it is already nearly 12 minutes long. I have started several overtures and symphonies. I have composed over 100 pieces. Email me back if you're interested.

Russell


#793: Adding expression to a note doesn't make differenc
Adding expression to a note doesn't make differenc

(793)

Submitted by: Francois Faucher on 02-Aug-1998

When I add an expression (fff, piano) or crescendo before a note, I don't hear any difference in the volume when I play back. Why?

Reply 1 offered by: Russell on 03-Aug-1998

When you start a new document in NWC, the dynamic expression is already at the maximum volume(fff). In order to make it get louder, you must insert a softer volume text expression such as mp. Crescendos don't work at all, they are just there for the final printout.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-Aug-1998

Crescendos do work but only if there are several attacks between the start note dynamic and the end note dynamic.
And both dynamics are required.
They just wont work on a single note unless you are operating a wave table card or software synth.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Aug-1998

See also: msg #57

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Aug-1998

I'd just like to re-iterate an important point that has messed me up in the past. Not all synths treat velocity the same. For instance, "bottom end" FM synths like SB16, SB Pro, etc. seem to exhibit a linear voltage relationship with velocity, whereas the better synthesizers use a logarithmic approach (more suited to the characteristics of the human ear).

The result is that I've got a bunch of files I taylored for the SB16, only to find that the dynamics are too extreme on my new Audiotrix (Yamaha XG compatible) card.

Contemplating doing two sets of midi files... *sigh* ... one for the generic SB-compatibles, and one for the more upscale units.


#794: Seeking MIDI help
Seeking MIDI help

(794)

Submitted by: Grant Hicks on 03-Aug-1998

I have a MIDI problem that may or may not be an NWC problem (except that NWC is my only MIDI app). Tonight, after weeks of successfully playing NWC files, my computer refuses to make a sound when I click on the NWC "Play" icon. The first time it did this it popped up a "Midi Device Warning" and, after it sent me to the NWC MIDI options tab, informed me that the "MIDI Mapper" device failed to open properly. I've since tried various combinations of the 3 "available play devices" (Sound Blaster FM Synthesis, Creative Labs Sound Blaster, and MIDI Mapper) and get either silence or a device-open failure.

Now, as far as I know the only thing I've done since the last time everything worked correctly was to play a .WAV file using the Media Player applet. I don't know if this is relevant or coincidental. I'm running NWC 1.52 on NT 4.0, service pack 3.

Any thoughts from the many people out there who know more about MIDI than I do? If so, thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Russell on 03-Aug-1998

The only thing I can think of is that the MIDI driver can only work on one application at a time. You can only have one program that uses MIDI at a time. Otherwise, there will be a conflict and it won't play. If that's not the problem, you might want to try reloading your device driver(as an extreme action).

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Aug-1998

If your MIDI Mapper fails to open, you either:

1 - Are selecting more than one device for use by play back, including the device that will also be used by the MIDI Mapper

2 - You have some other MIDI program that is running and already has the MIDI device open

3 - Something changed in your system and corrupted your MIDI drivers

In all probability, your problem is caused by selecting more than one device in NWC. Unless you specifically know what you are doing, you should only select one device for use by playback.

You should also review our faq at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/faq.htm specifically http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/faq3.htm#playback

See also: msg #334, msg #519

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 06-Aug-1998

Well, it's back, but why is a mystery. (1) is out because it started failing without my having done *anything* to device selections, or anything else. (2) is out because I rebooted several times during the troubleshooting process, all without effect. (3) is probably out because it finally started working again the first time I rebooted the PC after posting the original question.

In any event, I'm back in business - at least for the moment. Thanks for your help.

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 07-Aug-1998

For sound problems it is a good idea to try running the standard Windows MIDI player. If it also fails, then Noteworthy is definitely not at fault. It can by run by double clicking on a midi file, or (if this is not set up) you can find Media Player under Start | Programs | Accessories. In NT you can make sure no other programs are running (maybe from the StartUp group?) using the Task Manager (right click on the task bar).

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 11-Aug-1998

Yeah, I tried playing canyon.mid in the Media Player as per the NWC faq page (to which NWC-Support graciously pointed me, above), and that was failing too. And believe me, although I'm a MIDI neophyte I know a fair amount about NT, and there *was* no other relevant program running (my Startup groups are empty).

I think somehow this all got started when a program crashed (or otherwise failed to terminate normally) and left the MIDI device open. The problem is that I haven't been able to constructed an explanation that covers everything that happened subsequently, though believe me I've tried. Once weirdness started occurring, I should probably have been writing down in gory detail everything I did and everything that resulted. Having been on the other side of the technical support fence (as a software developer myself), I kick myself for not having been better about this.

If I ever do come up with an explanation I believe in, I'll post it here. Maybe it'll help others who are as MIDIcally inept as I seem to have been.


#795: Printing Music from Clickbooks
Printing Music from Clickbooks

(795)

Submitted by: Connie on 03-Aug-1998

Has anyone out there in Composer Land ran across the problem of the music lines mismatching when printing out of "Clickbooks" (A booklet printing program). I used an earlier version of Noteworthy Composer & had no problem ... Now I have 1.51 and my notes are misaligned. They are not totally obnoxious ... but it did a much better job of printing from Clickbooks in the earlier version. Any help on the subject would be greatly appreciated. I like to print music booklets using Clickbooks and they just aren't turning out as good as before !!!

P.S. I love everything else about this awesome program !!

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 03-Aug-1998

I've not had any problems with HP printers. Have you got version 2 of ClickBook? If not you can download it from:

http://www.bluesquirrel.com/clickbook/

Reply 2 offered by: Connie on 03-Aug-1998

Peter,

I do have version 2.01 of Clickbook & I'm printing the music booklets with a HP Deskjet 820Cse. I'm not sure why it is misaligning the musical notes ... but I'm quite certain it is not printing as well under the new version of Noteworthy composer ... Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks !!

Connie

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 04-Aug-1998

Connie,
I got here clickbook 2.08 and NWC 1.51a and they work fine (for an A4 folded at least).
Maybe you could send me your faulty file? I'll upgrade to 1.52.
My printer here is HP4+.

I'll try at home too, maybe I'll have troubles. Hope not though.

MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Peter on 04-Aug-1998

Connie

My version is 2.2.1.0. If you'd like to email the file I can try it on a variety of printers. Could you also explain in more detail what the precise problem is?

The only major problems I've ever had from ClickBook are

1 Certain Right Justified text gets out of alignment (a known bug in Ver 1)

2 Using Adobe Acrobat with embedded fonts it changes the Symbol Set to Greek characters! I'd really like to get to the bottom of that one.

Peter

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 14-Aug-1998

ClickBook claims they're working with Adobe to resolve the
postscript issues, but that it will require changes on both
sides.

My attempts to use Clickbook were a failure; I tried to turn
scaling off (hoping for 100% scaling) and could thereafter
only get postage-stamp sized pages. I plan to try PageMaker
next time I build a booklet.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 21-Jan-2000

It seems that ClickBook finally issued the PDF trouble.
Go and see http://www.bluesquirrel.com/support/clickbook/FAQ_CB22_Win95.html#26 for more details (briefly: you need AcrobatReader 4)

HTH


#796: Roland GS Patches
Roland GS Patches

(796)

Submitted by: Chris Coon on 03-Aug-1998

I'm confused. Doesn't the GS patch bank have about 256 patches (at least more than GM)? Why doesn't NoteWorthy include all of them? If GS has 128--like GM, what is different?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Aug-1998

As I understand it, Roland's GS and Yamaha's XG are extensions to the GM protocol, allowing things like additional patches, DSP (digital signal processing), and additional controllers. However, since these are supersets of GM, files that make extensive use of GS or XG may not play back properly on a "bare bones" GM synthesizer.

The idea behind GM in the first place was to improve compatibility between synths by different manufacturers. You could, in principle, compose a GM file on any synth, and have it play back more-or-less faithfully on any other GM synth.

In the "more or less" lies the rub: even within General Midi there are wide variations in the timbre and other characteristics of allegedly identical instrument patches. Also, some are harder to do justice to than others... most synths do pianos and string sections alright, but do a miserable job on other solo instruments like violins and oboes. GS and XG can greatly improve the expression in such instruments, but at the expense of no longer being exactly GM-compatible.

Incidentally, even GM allows "system exclusive" (SysEx) controllers ... however, these should be avoided if you want your files to be playable on other peoples' synthesizers.

Reply 2 offered by: Chris Coon on 04-Aug-1998

How would I add GS patches in Noteworthy? The patch listing is just a different wording than the GM patch listing. There aren't any more patches than the GM in the GS listing, but there should be. Anyone know more than me?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Aug-1998

You should be able to select a different bank (see the "instrument patch" dialog), then use the numeric instrument patch entry option to specify any bank/patch combination your synth supports.

If you're lucky, your instrument's instruction manual will have a set of tables listing the various sound available in each bank.

As I understand it, most instruments allow you to re-map sounds, so that you could (for instance) replace the GM "harpsichord" sound with, say, "chorus dulcimer", or even an edited or newly created sound.

Reply 4 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 06-Aug-1998

I was playing around with the help file of my Yamaha yxg software synth last night, and happened to find instructions on getting all 256 sounds accessed. Fred is right, as long as you know the bank number, you can access all the sounds. You just have to have a list of what all the sounds are and where they are located. i.e: standard violin is patch 41, no bank number, slow violin is patch 41, bank number 8. Experiment with it and see how you go.
Adam


#797: MIDI wind
MIDI wind

(797)

Submitted by: Rick on 03-Aug-1998

I am a clarinet player and I'm wondering if there is a MIDI wind input device with clarinet fingerings? I know Yamaha makes one with sax and flute fingerings but it doesnt have the keys for clarinet throat tones and breaks in octives instead of 12ths.

Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 04-Aug-1998

I know that MIDI guitar are in fact equipped with a micro that produces MIDI events from the sound it receives. Maybe using such a microphone on your clarinet would help. I'll try on my flute as soon as I get my friend's guitar :-)

Reply 2 offered by: Ken on 05-Aug-1998

Do you want to use this as a performing instrument or for entering MIDI data to a file? A box called "Amadeus" is a pitch to MIDI translator that will convert your clarinet playing instantly into MIDI data. I think it is made by Roland. I have read several articles about it, but have not tried it. There are also software programs that will enter your instrument pitches as midi files, but I don't think they will produce other sounds instantly like "Amadeus" supposedly does.

Reply 3 offered by: Rick on 05-Aug-1998

I was actually hoping to use it in part for practicing after the kids are asleep, you know, put on headphones.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 05-Aug-1998

In that case that's a "fake" clarinet that you want, as an electric-guitar-ist would do without electricity.
Dunno if this exists, but if it exists for flute, it should exist for a clarinet. Probably as expensive as a real clarinet I fear. Maybe Roland, if Yamaha doesn't do that ?


#799: Archive Navigation
Archive Navigation

(799)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 04-Aug-1998

If I read an item in the archive the contents option exects me out of the archive section to the top of the most recent list. Does anyone else share my wish to be able to return to the top of the current archive section?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 05-Aug-1998

I always use Alt+LeftArrow for this action. This frees memory in the process when accessing a new url.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Crossley on 05-Aug-1998

Thanks marsu I will try and remember this but I would still benefit from having an explicit option on the menu at the top.


#800: Soundfonts
Soundfonts

(800)

Submitted by: Dennis on 04-Aug-1998

With my Soundblaster's Vienna Software, I have discovered a
virtual universe of sounds. Problem is, how do I get those
sounds into Noteworthy? I have done some pretty creative
fudging, to little avail.

I have editing my nwcpatch.ini, but in the end, though I
have the names of the new patches, the sounds have not
changed. All help appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 04-Aug-1998

Do you mean that you have some sound fonts that you want to use for playback from Noteworthy instead of the usual sounds from the soundcard?

Or do you mean something else ?

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Dennis James on 05-Aug-1998

I think that is what I mean. Let me give you an example: I
downloaded a soundfont called "Men'sChorus". I have opened
that sound font in Vienna and successfully "played back"
a melody using the Vienna playback system. I then edited my
mwcpatch.ini to include the soundfont and its patch names.
After that, I put the font's file in the system directory
contains all the other sound fonts. But... though Noteworthy
shows the names of each individual sound, the sounds remain
those from General Midi.

I think that's everything.

Dennis

Reply 3 offered by: Drake Donahue on 05-Aug-1998

Assuming you found a complete new GM sound font, wonderful.sf2, on the net you would open the awe control panel and go to the synth tab and install it. Any .mid or .nwc would then play back using the sounds of wonderful.sf2.
Assuming you found a great recording of a barking seal and a rattling snake and used Vienna to make a new sound font, morewonderful.sf2 (seal as instrument 001, snake as instrument002), you would use control panel and user tab to install more wonderful as a user synth at a number (xxx) not used by Wonderful.sf2. If the card has sufficient memory both wonderful and more wonderful will be ready to go.
To bark or rattle in NWC, highlight a staff, then Staff\Playback Instrument\, check 'select a different patch bank', in controller 0 select "xxx", select instrument 001 for seal or 002 for snake. Notes on this staff should bark or rattle appropriately.
Absolutely reserving the right to answer the wrong question and to get the answer totally wrong but I hope this helps.

Reply 4 offered by: Drake Donahue on 05-Aug-1998

BTW, you might want to verify that NWC\Tools\Options\Midi\'Devices used by playback:' = SB AWE 32(64) Midi synth(620){best choice} or Midi Mapper. If Midi Mapper further check WIN95(98)\Start\Settings\Control Panel\Multimedia\Midi has SB AWE 32(64) MIDI SYNTH(620) selected.

Reply 5 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 05-Aug-1998

Thanks Drake,

Saved me trying to explain it and you were clearer than I would have been

Richard

Reply 6 offered by: Dennis on 06-Aug-1998

Thanks everyone for your help. I'll try it all.

Dennis


#801: Postscript Files
Postscript Files

(801)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Aug-1998

Not directly related to NWC, but... Does anyone know of a utility to allow printing Postscript files to a "regular" printer (24-pin DMP or HP-PCL)?

Reason I ask is that I found a wealth of classical scores in Postscript format.

Reply 1 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 04-Aug-1998

Hi Fred

I print *.ps files from DOS by copying them to the printer.

Heres how assuming you are using a PC with Win95.

Open a DOS window and go to the directory where the PS files are kept.

Type at the prompt

copy<space><filename>.<extension><space><printer path>

Example (Note I am on a LAN and my printer is networked)

C:\music\>
C:\music\>copy jingle.ps \\regent\rp_prot

You should be able to find out the path for the printer by

Start>Settings>Printers then select the printer from the list and File>Properties>Details the path is the entry in "Print to the following port" box.

Get back to me if you have any trouble.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Aug-1998

Thanks Sergio. No, I'm not presently running Win95 (tried it, didn't like it) but I have no trouble finding my way around DOS.

My difficulty is that neither of my printers support the PS format. If I try to dump a PS graphics file directly to print all I get is a bunch of gibberish. What I'm looking for is something that translates the PS protocol (metalanguage?) into the graphics bitmaps expected by Epson DMP or HP-PCL laserjets.

Regards,
fred

Reply 3 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 04-Aug-1998

Ok. Well that's about the limit of my experience on this matter. I had some music sent from a quintet in the States and that is how I handled the files via a postscript printer.

Happy hunting

Sergio

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 05-Aug-1998

There is GhostScript that could help you.
Maybe some good picture program can convert them but I dunno any.

About GhostScript, refer to http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~ghost/gsview/new25.html to download gsv25w16.zip (Win16, 508k), and http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~ghost/ for more information.
You'll need Aladdin Ghostscript, look at http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~ghost/aladdin/get403.html for this latter.

Hope this helps!

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Aug-1998

Cool!! That's *precisely* what I was looking for. Nice to see that it's distributed under GPL. (*Bonus*)

Thanks for the help.


#802: Piano Part.  How low is too low???
Piano Part.  How low is too low???

(802)

Submitted by: Sergio Marshall on 04-Aug-1998

I have transposed a piano accompaniment for a Bb trumpet solo (Air on a G string) down 5 steps so that the piano accompaniment is in the right pitch for an Eb altohorn. However there appears to be 2 problems.

1. The key change from Bb accompaniment(4 flats) should be to 5 flats for the Eb accompaniment. It is in fact 7 sharps!! Enharmonically it is the same. This may prove to be a difficult key for a pianist to play in.

2. The notes in the treble stave drop way down with ledger lines for Africa. Should this be transferred to the bass stave? Any help would be appreciated.

Lastly would it be legitimate to transpose the piano part UP 7 steps to accompany an Eb instrument or for this instance would it put the solo and accompaniment too close together as far as pitch is concerned??

Any comments or suggestions greatly appreciated.

Cheers ... Sergio.

P.S. Eb altohorn player ... not a pianist or much of a music theorist come to think of it, but learning as I go.

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 04-Aug-1998

Maybe it would be easier to transpose the Eb Altohorn? In most situations this would be the easiest thing to do. As for the tranposing into the wrong enharmonic spelling, I can't help you. I tried transposing a flute part and ended up with the seven sharps. After a lot of playing around I finally got the part in the right key, but the million dollar question, was it really worth it?:-)
Adam

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Aug-1998

Sergio:

Please post your question only once, as duplication only complicates things (see msg #755 (reply 7)).

If you are unhappy with the choice of key, simply change it. This is described in msg #3. If you decide to change the clef, the procedure is described in msg #4.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry graham on 04-Aug-1998

Sergio,

I wouldn't worry about the piano being to high - this is always a problem with low-voiced instrumental solos.
Transpose the piano up an octave where it's comfortable - the listener will be able to distinguish between instruments and provided there are no harmonic clashes like semitones close together it should sound OK.
As for the seven sharps - force accidentals - change the key signature to 5 flats - then transpose the staff zero '0' semitones.

Reply 4 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 04-Aug-1998

NWC-Support - sorry for the duplication. I have tried the key change procedure and I think it has worked. I have looked at that procedure before without really understanding it. Amazing what a little bit more knowledge can do to help. Thanks NWC

Adam - Yes I have thought of changing the Eb part maybe a little tweaking of both parts up or down will simplify the key signature. One snag is that I kind of like the key the solo part is in. However thanks for your suggestions.

Getting there slowly (where ever that is)

Sergio

Reply 5 offered by: Sergio Marshall on 04-Aug-1998

Thanks Barry for the piano advice. I thought that might be the case with transposing up. I will find a friendly piano player and have a few runs with some ideas.

I have learnt about changing the enharmonic spelling But thanks for the prompt reply.

Cheers ... Sergio

Reply 6 offered by: NWC'er on 05-Aug-1998

I would like to chat to people about using NWC.
!telnet://ncohafmuta.com:4444


#803: Rests.
Rests.

(803)

Submitted by: Philip on 05-Aug-1998

Please advise me how to align a rest note together
with a normal note.

For example, a quater rest on the upper staff, and a E note
on the lower staff; but both are aligned at the some
position, instead putting a rest note at the center of the
staff.

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: me on 05-Aug-1998

What do you mean ??? Quarter rests are on the proper place I think!?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Aug-1998

I'm not sure, but I think what you're running into is that NWC will let you enter just about anything into a given bar, regardless of whether the timing is correct.

This is actually a *good* thing, as it gives you a lot more control over your printed score.

That being said, to be musically proper (not to mention making your scores playable), you must have the same total time value in each staff for any given bar. I.e. if you're in 4/4 time, you need the equivalent of a whole note in each staff, in every bar.

NWC has a wonderful tool called "Audit Bar Lines" which will adjust your bar lines to put the proper time value into each bar for the selected staff. If you do this (or are careful about time during the original entry), notes and rests should line up. The exception is rests taking up the entire bar (i.e. whole rests in 4/4, half rests in 2/4, etc.) in which case they're printed in the centre of the bar per the usual musical convention (and for a much better appearance and readability).

Hope I didn't answer the wrong question incorrectly... :-)

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 07-Aug-1998

Also note that the "whole rest" is well-named : one is enough for any measure length. I use it for 4/2 and it acts as expected (takes 8 quarter) musically speaking.

Reply 4 offered by: ahmui on 24-Aug-1998

dear sir/madam,
i want to know where is the whole rest & the halp rest, also the 6-together note, i mean a quater note is divided into 6 notes.sorry for my poor English coz i'm Chinese, thx~~

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 24-Aug-1998

Select the correct note length (whole note or half note) and then use the Spacebar to enter the rest.

To do 6 eighth or sixteenth notes, simply highlight the group of six notes with the mouse and press Control-T (for "triplet"). It may mark them with a 3 instead of a six, but is has the desired effect.

A


#805: Copying Lyrics
Copying Lyrics

(805)

Submitted by: Carolyn on 06-Aug-1998

1. Is it possible to copy lyrics from a word processing program into NWC?
2. Is it possible to print the lyrics from NWC?
3. Also, say you're writing an open score choral piece in which you want lyrics below each staff. Any way to do that without re-typing one set of lyrics four times? Copying copies only the notes, not the lyrics.

Help is appreciated. NWC is great! I can't adequately tell you how much time you've saved for me. Really appreciate you programmer-type people!

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 06-Aug-1998

This works on WIN 98 (and did on my last version of 95-I think..)-
1. Start the Word Processor
Select (Highlight) a lyric line
Edit\Copy (or Cut)
Start NWC
Open the score
Select (Highlight) the staff to which the lyrics belong
CTRL-L -- select the ultimate number of lyric lines to be attached to the staff
Select the tab for the number of this line (1 for example)
In the text entry window left click to get a cursor, right click and Paste
Repeat as needed for more lines and other staffs.
Complain to NWC Support if this doesn't work. :)

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Bowers on 06-Aug-1998

You can cut and paste in the lyric window by highlighting
the text and then using the keyboard shortcut keys:

ctrl-x cuts
ctrl-c copies
ctrl-v pastes

These commands work to and from the clipboard so you can
copy and then switch to a new window and paste.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Aug-1998

by the way...

You can keep both windows (NWC and your WP) active, for multiple cut and paste operations. Either use the Window Tile command to put them side-by-side, or else maximize them both and use Alt-Tab to switch between them. (Works in Win3.x, anway, as far as I remember it also works on Win95).

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 07-Aug-1998

And, once more, the macro recorder can be of great value here. Just record the keystroke for the first staff, and then replay for the others. It's so simple as this.
For more information, search the forum about macro recoreder :-)


#807: Slurring the Notes During play Back
Slurring the Notes During play Back

(807)

Submitted by: Soon H. Leong on 07-Aug-1998

Does Noteworthy have the capability to slur the notes while playing a piece of music with slurring notations. If so, how do I make it happen?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 07-Aug-1998

As I understand the slur notation as used in NWC, it is primarily an indication to the performer to link the slurred notes together smoothly. Where lyrics are used it ensures that the associated syllable is correctly spread over the slurred notes. If you want it to slide atonally from one note to the next I don't believe this is possible. In any event it can only be achieved by instruments such as strings or trombone (and voice of course).

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 07-Aug-1998

I pressed the send button too soon, didn't I! There is of course the Multi point controller which can be used to alter the pitch of a note smoothly. Try <Insert><Multi Point Controller> and change the controller type to Pitch Bend. Then play with the settings to achieve the effect required. I've only experimented briefly with this, but it does the job.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 09-Aug-1998

AFAIK, slurring of notes in - say - the way piano player does it IS implemented automatically in NWC.
Notes played normally in NWC are actually only held down for 80% of the length. Slurring holds the note down for 100%.

Hope this is the info you were after.

A

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 10-Aug-1998

About last reply : if you want notes to be always played 100% (as a singer would), you can just add the "Legato" style at the beginning of the staff. Of course, it would be great to hide this when printing... :-)

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 10-Aug-1998

I'm still learning tips about NWC ! I didn't know this
"Legato" style.

Merci beaucoup, Marsu.


#808: Repeat at End of Staff
Repeat at End of Staff

(808)

Submitted by: Don Whitener on 07-Aug-1998

Is there any way to get the very last symbol on a staff to be a master close repeat as opposed to the normal end of section bar?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Aug-1998

Only way I've found involves the use of wite-out... (on the printed score, not the screen ;-)

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 10-Aug-1998

…Or you can add teXt items with a dot in it, two items not preserving space and well placed. For another solution look at http://www.mygale.org/05/madmarsu/doeba.zip in which I use many tricks.


#809: Trills/Glisando
Trills/Glisando

(809)

Submitted by: Stefan on 07-Aug-1998

How do you put in trills or glissandos?
I've seen trills in the sample files and I was wondering if I can make them!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Aug-1998

See msg #740, msg #632, msg #594, msg #58

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 10-Aug-1998

If you have seen it in any fie, just copy and paste it :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Joel Hall on 13-Aug-1998

Warning, several of the sample files have hidden staffs that implement the actual trill, etc manually. Unhide all staffs to view the actual notation used to create the effect.

Reply 4 offered by: Mark on 05-Nov-1998

I put in the trills the old fashioned way - with grace notes<g>. It really doesn't take that long, with cutting and pasting.


#810: Free MIDI to Text Converter
Free MIDI to Text Converter

(810)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Aug-1998

Hi all,

There's a nice little DOS program available for free, which lets you convert midi files to text, for analysis, learning, and modification.

It's called MF2T (midi file to text) and comes with the inverse operation T2MF (text to midi file).

I've found it very useful for learning more about the ins and outs (pun intended) of midi, as well as making subtle corrections by hand. E.g. use "Write" search to find all occurrences of instrument patches, to delete redundant or unwanted instrument changes, etc.

It's available from ftp://ftp.cs.ruu.nl/pub/MIDI/PROGRAMS/MSDOS as mf2t.zip and mf2t.doc. If you want to dive right in without reading the docs, try the syntax "mf2t -mntv [input.mid] [output.txt]".

This Univ. of Utrecht ftp site has lots of other cool midi (and not-so-midi)-related stuff.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 10-Aug-1998

Thanks for the addy. It may be very useful for what I do : transforming MIDI events to part of a C program (music & sound fx on a game)
...And of course to replace all C# to F for instance.

Reply 2 offered by: Dave Washburn on 23-Aug-1998

marsu wrote:
>...And of course to replace all C# to F for instance.

!!! I was just going to post a question, asking if anybody had
come up with a way to do this sort of thing. I have many
occasions when I need to find all occurrences of a note and
change them to another note. In a long composition, this
really gets tedious. You've shown me one possible way to
accomplish it; anybody got any other ways? Is there a way
to do such a thing right in NWC?
Thanks!

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Aug-1998

I'm surprised at how much use I get out of this little program. E.g. search for ProgCh to find patch changes, con=10 to find (or replace or insert) pan settings, insertering metatext comments, and on an on. Glad others are finding it useful too.

IMHO it's too much to expect *any* program to do it all. That's why I try to maintain (and learn) several progs to allow me to take advantage of the strengths of each.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 23-Aug-1998

"That's why I try to maintain (and learn) several progs to allow me to take advantage of the strengths of each."
Agreed, so long as there is no loss of information. Unfortunately there is, though. So if I create something in NWC, import to Orchestrator, fiddle there and then publish the midi on the web, it's a right pain to have to go and do the whole process again when I change one or two notes in NWC.

"IMHO it's too much to expect *any* program to do it all"
Agreed. Then we'll all need Pentium 500s just to read "Mary Had a Little Lamb"!

To overcome this needs a better operating system than Windows, IMHO. Linux comes to mind!

Andrew

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Aug-1998

The ability to carry out global alterations described is one reason the I use Cakewalk.
An Edit Filter that allows global changes to selections controlled by a filter would be a useful tool in NoteWorthy.
One application that comes to mind is changing the Db leading note in D minor to a C# throughout a score.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Aug-1998

Andrew wrote:
"To overcome this needs a better operating system than Windows, IMHO. Linux comes to mind!"

Yes. I've recently had my son install Linux in a separate partition on my computer, and I'm bit by bit learning it. All I can say is... Wow.

Barry Graham wrote:

"An Edit Filter that allows global changes to selections controlled by a filter would be a useful tool in
NoteWorthy.
One application that comes to mind is changing the Db leading note in D minor to a C# throughout a
score."

Yes, I agree. I had a similar problem with the Schubert Sonata, Noteworthy insisted on calling B-flats "A#" (in key of C, during tonicizations to F).

Maybe at least Eric can work a way to have such notes labelled more logically, by assigning the value that is closest to the home key (i.e. going around the circle of fifths, B-flat is a lot closer to C than A#).

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Edwards on 01-Sep-1998

Yes please. And make sure that the note that could still be sharp or flat (Ab,G# in the key of C) is in fact G# since this is the leading note of the relative minor.


#811: Boxmarks - Music Font
Boxmarks - Music Font

(811)

Submitted by: Barry graham on 09-Aug-1998

A new music symbol font for NWC users is now available for download in the newsgroup.
Boxmarks.ttf is an updated version of Boxes.ttf previously posted.

Boxmarks.ttf provides Boxed Letters for section flags, Multi-bar Rest Markers and Numbers and now includes:-
Lip Up, Fall Off, Arpeggio, Gliss, Bowing Marks, Crescendo, Roll, Turns etc.

If you can't access the newsgroup I can Email a copy but I can't guarantee prompt reply.
PLEASE try the newsgroup first.

Barry Graham
Melbourne, Australia
bargrah@hotmail.com

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 11-Aug-1998

Sensational! I can't remember how I faked out multi bar
rests last time I had to do it, but it wasn't a patch on
boxmarks. Same score had lots of glisses and lip ups too.
Multiple tildas looked pretty feeble. Thanks!

Reply 2 offered by: Masiello on 21-Feb-2000

§1234567890'^¨üpoiuztrewqasdfghjklöä$-.,mnbvcxy<°+"*ç%&/()=?`!èPOIUZTREWQASDFGHJKLéà£_;:;MNBVCXY>

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 21-Feb-2000

Yes - That looks like the Boxmarks font I know and love!


#812: NWC1.52 bugs
NWC1.52 bugs

(812)

Submitted by: Steve Bacher on 10-Aug-1998

Just installed the NWC 1.52 upgrade. Some bugs:

(1) When I have two notes in a staff (one up stem and one
down stem), and one is longer in duration than the other,
the way NWC has always behaved in the past is to assume
the longer note's duration for the measure. 1.52 seems
to have changed this and is using the shorter duration.
This means that if I have, say, a half note with the up
stem and a quarter note with a down stem, and both are
followed by a single note or rest, the playback is wrong
(in that what I intended, based on previous NWC experience,
doesn't work). This may mean that all my existing NWC files
will play back wrong.

(2) Accent marks over chords often don't display.

(3) Beaming and up/down stems interact oddly. This is
mainly a nuisance, but means that I have to up/down stem
beamed groups of notes in a separate interaction, rather
than being able to rely on the current up/down stem setting
when entering 8th (etc.) notes and then beaming them.

- seb

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Aug-1998

NWC split-stem chords have always assumed the duration of the smaller note. This has been true since the original version 1.0.

The usability of the beaming feature has been enhanced inversion 1.52a, which shipped today.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Bacher on 17-Aug-1998

OK, so the split stem thing also happened in previous
versions. I could have sworn...

Anyway, there is a real bug: when I bring up a file that
was created in 1.50 under 1.52, and I select Print Preview,
either from the File menu or from the Page Setup menu,
I get a program error. Some kind of exception. I had to
go back to using 1.50.

- seb

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Aug-1998

Can you add some details to that? Are you using 16-bit or 32-bit? Running Win 3.1, Win 95, Win 98, or NT? Can you send the file that causes this? Can you describe the exact exception message that occurs? This info is necessary in order to resolve problem reports.

Reply 4 offered by: Yazan on 26-Aug-1998

I got the same error as seb. IT crashes whenever I try to preview it, and then I can't access the page setup ever again, otherwise it crashes with the same error. I had to uninstall it and reinstall it. It continued to happen after I rebooted and everything. Running Win95, 32 bit. Three error messages pop up, one after another.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 26-Aug-1998

Steve & Yazan, send the files to Eric (support@ntworthy.com). He's very good at fixing them when they fail so unfailingly ;)

A


#813: Still a "Time signature bug" - second time
Still a "Time signature bug" - second time

(813)

Submitted by: Ernst Christian Peter on 10-Aug-1998

NoteWorthy Composer still has the following bug:
Try Time Signature (g)
Value of Beat : 32 will not be handled correctly !!!!
Try to edit (strg e) the time signature a second time and
you will see that NWC does not display the value 32,
it shows the default 4. >>>>>not fixed (the requester ist meant!)

You can also notice this bug by saving the score with a
time signature displayed as 4/32, that is displayed as 4/4,
when you load the file again. >>>>> fixed

See message:
http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/0/790.htm

Chris

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Aug-1998

Which version are you using (16 or 32-bit)? Not sure I understand the problem correctly, but I had no trouble using /32 time signatures with new 1.52a 16-bit version.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Aug-1998

Thanks for the report. You can now add a time signature over 32, but you cannot edit it (using Ctrl+E). For now, you can get it to work, at least, so long as you do not use Ctrl+E.


#814: Counting your Items!
Counting your Items!

(814)

Submitted by: Matje Örle on 10-Aug-1998

I have something new for the wish list:
It would be good, if there would be an info (statistic), in which
you can see, how many clefs, notes, bars, in general items
you have in your score. I would be interested what NWC-Support
thinks abou that.

Best regards, Bill

P.S. Sorry for my bad English.

Reply 1 offered by: Manfred Neubauer on 11-Aug-1998

I think this would be a good idea. Why didn't NWC-Support
answered to that.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 11-Aug-1998

Hmm. Not sure how useful it would be apart from academic interest, except for number of bars, which can be determined by turning on bar labelling and then scrolling to the end of the staff.
Would we end up with the comment made to Mozart of "too many notes"?!

Andrew


#815: measures per line?
measures per line?

(815)

Submitted by: Dan on 10-Aug-1998

Is there a way to specify how many measures per line in the print parameters?
some lines have 3 some have five, etc.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11-Aug-1998

No, Dan, there isn't. This is probably the biggest problem for me when I'm trying to fit things best onto a page, and one that I hope Eric will address soon. It takes some fiddling at the moment. (Hey Eric, how about a "fit to page" option?! ... only kidding!)

I guess one question to ask is "how important is it?", though I know many players who prefer, say, four bars to a line etc.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-Aug-1998

This is my biggest wish, already in the wish list.

Add your vote to:
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm

Reply 3 offered by: Marsu on 12-Aug-1998

This is a wish that may be really hard to realize.
What if you "suddenly" change the size of your paper ??? Especially when reducing it ?? This may be really tricky, or should at least produce a message such as "The number of measures set is too large for such a format", but this would require to check all the staves... Time lost when you just want to print a special edition for one instrument.

IMHO, this automatic decision is more efficient in 95% of configurations. Especially when ou do not know what kind of printing you will produce yet.
Otherwise, the "blank" teXt items are useful but, I agree, somewhat painful.

HTH

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 12-Aug-1998

Actually, my wish in the wishlist is not to have a constant
number of measures per lines, but to have the possibility
to specify a "line break", very similar to the "page break"
in word processors.

Of course, between two forced "line breaks", the measures
should be arranged automatically by NWC, on several lines
if necessary.

Reply 5 offered by: Warren Barnett on 12-Aug-1998

If you look at all the professionally produced pieces of music, they all fit as many bars of music on a line as is practical (just like noteworthy composer) If you want different bar spacing try inserting spaces as text to move things over. You may find that adding two or three spaces in just on bar will remove en entire bar from that line.

Reply 6 offered by: carolyn conyers on 12-Aug-1998

While I'm not a programmer, I don't buy the idea that this issue is too hard to realize. I used another notation program for a long while that, although it was very tedious to manipulate, had the option of breaking the lines where one wanted them to break, and the notes were then proportioned nicely across the line. I still like NWC better, all things considered, but find this issue to be one of the most important features for the next version. I am trying to prepare manuscripts quickly for performance and/or publication, so that I can go on with the next "opus." If I have to take an NWC file and re-do it into a "pagemaker" program (which I don't want to consider right now), have I gained something by NWC's ease of use? End of soapbox. NWC still gets three hearty cheers!

Reply 7 offered by: Dan on 12-Aug-1998

ummm...I couldn't find ANY professionally published music that did not
have a set number of bars per line in each tune. (the most common is four.)
I looked through VOLUMES of music.<br><br>As for the "too hard to realize" issue,
my brother has notation software that does it, but he has a Mac, ....of course.

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-Aug-1998

Perhaps that's true of piano copies and lead sheets.
Orchestrations have varied and varying measures per line - which personally I prefer.
I find the structure of fixed measures per line too rigid and illogical.
Some parts - especially strings - can be quite florid for some measures and then have bar after bar of whole note fills.
If your not careful fixing the number of measures per line may leave you with a couple of busy bars then pages of two bar to the line whole note measures.
It's better if the measures per line adjust to fit the density of the bar - as NoteWorthy Composer does.
For what it's worth- the Music Arrangers Guild set 4 bars per line and 10 lines per page as standard.
As for other software - I'm sure Finale would do everything you want - but you have chosen NWC for other reasons - let me guess....?

Reply 9 offered by: Gene McGough on 13-Aug-1998

Oliver hit it exactly right with a suggestion for a "line break" command. My immediate task at hand is a refrain of few measures followed by many optional verses. It would be most readable with a line break at the end of the refrain.

A fixed number of measures per line for an entire selection would be useful in some situations and ridiculous in others.

Reply 10 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 14-Aug-1998

I've looked at a lot of hymnals, representing a fair
selection of American hymnals over the last century.

I have not seen any that tried to maintain a fixed number
of measures per line even within a song. Some songs happen
to have a fixed number of measures per line; A few
songs with regular phrase lengths corresponding to page
size, also happen to end each phrase at the end of a line.
(Most songs do not, and do not.)

Most songs end a line at the end of a measure. A few end
it in a random place in the middle of a measure. Many songs
have phrases that begin on the upbeat; where the phrases
of such songs fit nicely on one line, they _invariably_
break the line at the phrase break, which is _not_ a measure
boundary.

I know that English hymnals may not play by all of these
rules; nor do nineteenth-century American hymnals or even
modern American "Service Books." But that still leaves a
mass body of musical notation.

fit nice

Reply 11 offered by: Peter Vasey on 15-Aug-1998

Just for the record, line break and page break have been on
my wish list since March.

Reply 12 offered by: chris on 17-Aug-1998

A couple of people in this string have mentioned other software which will do this. "Finale," and an earlier version called "MusicProse" will allow for breaks either by a specific number of measures per line, or by manually breaking up the lines. While it can be time-consuming to break lines up manually, it does allow great flexibility in creating parts (particularly band and orchestra parts from a full score). However, "Finale" costs several hundred dollars, and does not print music of that much greater quality than NWC. I'll keep wishing too, but I can't complain about the quality of NWC for the price.

Reply 13 offered by: marsu again on 17-Aug-1998

Wow! I would'nt have imagine this thread would grow so much.

When I was sayng "too hard to realize", I was talking about _my_ experience when I build myself a musical notation program -under DOS 6.22, from scratch, in T. Pascal 4- although I used a fixed spacing at that time.
I've seen how further (!) Eric went since, But I still consider it at hard. Hard for the user too, for it can really be "time-consuming" (sic) to manually place (and remove) line breaks. For what I consider the most important is the ability to care for the printing format at the very last moment. And I do want to be able to change my mind about the paper size, orientation (but keeping the staff size) until last moment --and after.

Olivier is right, the ability to add manually a line-break would be great. If it can be easily to find where you put it without to have to "preview-print" again to find out where.
But this leads to a problem : the line-break may perfectly fit when printing a lead score alone, but NOT when printing the conductor's... So what?? An option indicating for what type of printing you must use it ?? That would be a nightmare for the users.

When you wanna buy a painting, if there is something you don't like in it you don't buy it neither do you ask the painter to change it.
For shareware it's different, I know, but why don't you try to use the existing features to their maximum extent ? Try to more use your imagination...

La suite au prochain épisode.

NWCly yours,
                a HRU.

Reply 14 offered by: Olivier again on 17-Aug-1998

Yes, you're right, it could be difficult to choose where
to place a line break before the very last moment.
Then, it could be just a feature within the "preview-print":
line breaks wouldn't be set within the score, but only when
printing.

And yes, I know that NWC is a shareware, I am *very* happy
with it for its high quality and its low price. But since
a wish list exists and wish list items are often included
in next versions, then I would be silly if I didn't ask for
what I would like to get.

Reply 15 offered by: Peter Vasey on 17-Aug-1998

The actual wording of my wish list item was:

The ability to force an end of line (with appropriate bar stretching to fill the line)
would be useful, particularly when setting songs with multiple verses (and even more
particularly with unequal length lines) - it is much easier to match the words with the
music if each line of music can be associated with a line of verse, particularly if the
verses have to be printed separately rather than as lyric lines within the stave. A
natural corollary from this is to be able to force a new page (independently adjustable
top and bottom margins for each page would accomplish the same end and be even
more flexible).

So I'm not suggesting that we always would specify the line/page breaks - as has been noted, this would be a retrograde step. Independent margins would be very useful for medleys. Nevertheless I agree that the NWC way is very convenient (and very clever!) most of the time. It's just those odd occasions when ......

Reply 16 offered by: marsu on 11-Feb-2000

Now you can. With the 1.70 version, you may add the option to "break" at any bar you want.
You can even break lines inside a measure: add a bar line with force system break option, and in the "visibility" tab, choose "never".

HTH,
          Dominique


#816: problem
problem

(816)

Submitted by: Theodore Pfeiffer on 10-Aug-1998

When I attempt to load a file (one that comes with the program, for example)
The program hangs up ... mouse is not getting a response and
Control-alt-delete gets me out of the program. Any Ideas?
I do have the program running on one computer but I would prefer
to work on my other one in the shop!

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 10-Aug-1998

Sounds like either a problem with the installation, or your soundcard setup. Try opening the program, then go to Tools, Options, Midi and make sure the driver you have listed is installed and valid, and try not to have more than 1 driver. If the midi setup is correct, you may have to uninstall NoteWorthy and reinstall it, as it may have had an incorrect installation routine. Make sure you have the latest version! (1.52a)
Adam

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Aug-1998

Obviously your circumstance is unusual, or there would be many complaints. Some more information is really necessary before trying any sort of diagnosis, such as:

- What version of Windows are you using?
- What version of NWC are you using?
- Is it 16-bit or 32-bit edition of NWC?
- How much memory (RAM) is on your computer?
- What kind of processor is in your computer (386, 486, Pentium, AMD, Cyrix, etc.)?
- Can you open any files at all?
- What status bar message is shown when it locks up?
- Can you import MIDI files?
- Can you start a new file using File New?
- Can you save a file that you create?

Short of this extra info, a good first step would be to acquire the latest version, just as Adam indicates.

Reply 3 offered by: Theodore Pfeiffer on 11-Aug-1998

I have a feeling that there is some conflice in the irq and port
assignments. I am using win 3.1 8 megs ram. I have no sound
card but I do have a midi port that is responding. The options
midi steps suggested by Adam show me that without the proper
driver there I get the message driver problem go fix it...
(those are not the exact wording!)
Ted.

Reply 4 offered by: Theodore Pfeiffer on 11-Aug-1998

Hey! Tell me why this makes a difference...
I changed the monitor color to 16 colors.
Now it is working!
Thanks for your assistance!
Ted.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Aug-1998

This probably means that your original problem was caused by your display driver. You should probably check for an updated display driver for your system.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Aug-1998

I had similar headaches with Win3.1, in fact this didn't even have the 800x600x256 and 1024x768x256 drivers. I upgraded to Win3.11 ("Windows for Workgroups") and all my display-related problems went away.

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 11-Aug-1998

I'd agree. Win 3.11 is much more stable than Win 3.1 and I'd urge anyone with 3.1 to upgrade if they are having problems.
I really like Win 95, tho, even if it uses far more memory to function.

A


#817: Automatic unbeam ?
Automatic unbeam ?

(817)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-Aug-1998

I don't have the latest version (1.52a) but a rather recent
one (1.50 or 1.51, I don't remember).

I have a score where the notes were automatically beamed
in a 4/4 time signature (i.e. 8th notes are beamed 2 by 2).
I would like to beam them 4 by 4, then I changed time
signature to 2/2 and clicked on "Automatic beam". Too bad,
since the notes are beamed already, this doesn't work.

I tried to select all the staff in order to unbeam all,
but it doesn't work because (I presume) there are also
quarter notes and half notes.

The only solution is to export the file to MIDI, and
reimport it. But then I loose all my triplets !

Please help me if you can...

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Aug-1998

A macro is one way to ease the burden of re-beaming the groups.
Do have the old Win3.x Recorder.exe buried away in your hard disk?
I have a macro to do just that - but you need the Recorder.exe file on your system.
Let me know.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Aug-1998

This is actually a bug, indirectly anyway. We will give this item priority in the next release.


#818: Sound Quality
Sound Quality

(818)

Submitted by: Josh Brown on 11-Aug-1998

Can anyone recommend a good sound card for MIDI playback? I have an FM synthesis card, and the result is not pretty.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 11-Aug-1998

There are many cards around these days. Go for a wavetable card, as these use actual samples of the instruments to generate the sounds, giving much more realistic playback.
Roland do a SoundCanvas card, there are great cards by Ensoniq, SoundBlaster to the AWE-32 and AWE-64 (64 voices, but half are done in software), and some people will recommend the "software" sound "cards" (midi-drivers done in software, which will work fine on any Pentium) by Yamaha or ... er... wotsisname.
FOr a while, I used an external midi box, and then a keyboard, both of which sounded great, but don't have the ability to download new sounds if you're not happy with the ones you have.

A

Reply 2 offered by: E.C.Peter on 12-Aug-1998

>FOr a while, I used an external midi box, and then a
>keyboard, both of which sounded great, but don't have
>the ability to download >new sounds if you're not happy
>with the ones you have.

Another possibility to have an external midi box with the ability to download new sounds is to use a professional sampler (like EMU ESI-4000, up to 128M Byte sample capacity).

Millions of samples in many libraries (mostly AKAI-format) are waiting to be used. This is expensive, but the only (!) way (besides using the so called GIGA-Sampler, software based memory unlimited sampler-technology) to get the real sound of many instruments, sounding like the real ones, or what ever you are looking for. (Even you own voice, your own samples can be used)
If you are tired of searching a special instrument sound (a dulcimer!) in any "midi box", you can record (sample) it yourself at all events. This sounds are in CD-quality, and you can not distinguish them from their originals.
If you don't want to sample yourself, you just have to look for new editions of sample-CDs.

For samplers and sample-libraries look at:
http://www.emu.com or http://www.akai.com or
http://www.bestservice.de

Orchestra:
There is a 5-volume orchestra - sample - library
Peter Siedlaczek's Advanced Orchestra, Vol 1-5,
containing thousands of samples of a classical symphony orchestra.
A must for everyone, looking for brilliant, pure classical sounds.

Pianos:
The Ultimate Piano Collection Vol 1, East*West, containing four of the best Pianos ever built:
1) Steinway D
2) Steinway C,
3) Fazioli F228
and finally
4) Bösendorfer 225
in different memory size versions.
(This piano collection is even available for the GIGASAMPLER, look at
http://www.soundsonline.com/ew*TEMPLATE=/ew/htp/giga.htp)

Chris

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Aug-1998

I can highly recommend the "Audiotrix 3D-XG" by Mediatrix (their webpage is ...believe it or not... http://www.mediatrix.com ...) which sports full Yamaha XG compatibility, plus wave-table "soft synth", plus a SB-compatible FM synth. Lots of built-in effect... reverb, chorus, flange, distortion, you name it.

It comes bundled with an excellent wave editor/manipulator, XG mixer, media player, Hotztrax and other toys, and reasonable documentation on CD. Oh, yes, it also includes a "lite" version of Cakewalk.

The price is right, too. About $400 Cdn (about $250 US at the present rate).

I'm happy with mine, but should be clear that *in my opinion* this give the best bang for the buck.

Reply 4 offered by: Chris Coon on 24-Aug-1998

If you're just looking for a cheap way to perform your songs at high quality (you have to export to midi first) consider MIDInight Express at

http://www.polyhedric.com

You can buy the sampler CD for $30!!! and the program itself is free. Check it out, there is a comparison between MIDInight Express and AWE64 somewhere on the site.


#820: NWC 1.52a
NWC 1.52a

(820)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 11-Aug-1998

Hi NWC-er's,

I downloaded 1.52a 32-bit version last night, and installed it today on both my machine at home and my machine at work.

On both machines, in different pieces of music, I noticed the score editor doesn't always redraw "cleanly". E.g. sometimes a few of the notes are shadowed, as if the picture is ghosted (like on the old TV's).

Moving the score out of the window and then back again cleans up the display.

My home machine is Win95 SP1, Trident SVGA 800x600. My work machine is NT 4.0 SP3 (128-bit), S3 SVGA 1024x768.

I've not seen this before in prior NWC versions I've had. Anyone else seeing this? Also, one time after I stopped play of a score with F6, the window didn't scroll back to the start of the score when I pressed the Home key (the cursor was already at the start of the score). I had to "click" into a measure in the staff, THEN press the Home key to scroll back to the start of the song.

Sorry, I haven't found a way to duplicate these minor nuisances yet.

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Aug-1998

No such problems observed on my system using 486SLC66, Win3.11.

Reply 2 offered by: Michele Hirt on 06-Sep-1998

Sometimes the score looks funky if you scroll back quickly. It may be a function of your video card, but I'm not sure. At any rate, the refresh button fixed it for me.


#821: NIFF (Music Notation proposed standard)
NIFF (Music Notation proposed standard)

(821)

Submitted by: Stephen Hutcheson on 12-Aug-1998

See: http://www.jtauber.com/music/encoding/niff/

Does anyone have any experience with this?

Is it becoming a viable standard?

Should NWC support it?

Reply 1 offered by: Micah Eberman on 13-Aug-1998

Yes it is. It's great for taking files from app to app. Musitek makes scanning software, Midiscan and Pianoscan, I have Midiscan. I would love to take scanned sheet music into any program I want using NIFF. So far only one other program supports NIFF, that's Lime. OK program, but not the best. I heard Encore was going to support NIFF prior to the close of Passport. I also heard of a few other programs that might pick up NIFF, Overture, Cakewalk, and some others. My plea to publishers of music software, "The technology exists so please use it."

Reply 2 offered by: Ken Mund on 14-Aug-1998

I tried the address as listed but only received an error message.
http://www.jtauber.com/music/encoding/niff/

is it correct?

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 14-Aug-1998

I pasted the address out of the message above and copied it
into the URL field on my browser... worked fine. I believe
it's correct. I'm using Netscape 4.5, but the URL looks
pretty vanilla-flavored to me, except for the closing slash,
which is optional for Netscape 3.1 and later. Try without
the slash (that also works for me)

Reply 4 offered by: Fred N on 18-Aug-1998

I agree that standardization would be a wonderful thing, and would encourage NoteWorthy ArtWare to take a look at the NIFF standard.

There are three sequencers/scoring programs that I use, and each has its own format. The only way to convert between them to take advantage of relative strengths is import/export via midi -- definitely not the best solution.

There's a good description and demo of what NIFF is all about at http://www.musitek.com/niff.html

Reply 5 offered by: Gerd Castan on 19-Nov-1998

Hi,

I collected some links and hints on this topic on
http://www.s-line.de/homepages/gerd_castan/compmus/index_e.html
Hope that helps.

Cheers,
Gerd


#822: NWC to PDF conversion
NWC to PDF conversion

(822)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Aug-1998

There's been some discussion on various aspects of printing, both here and on the newsgroup, so I thought I'd detail a method for exporting NWC score files to the popular PDF (Adobe) format.

Thanks to Marsu, who got me going on this, albeit for another purpose entirely (see Msg. #801)

The idea is to use NWC to create a PostScript file (with the help of the suitable Windows driver), then use GhostView to convert the resulting *.ps file into *.pdf. I'll try to post an example file on the newsgroup, as evidence that the method works.

Here are the gory details (you might want to print out this message). Looks scary, but once you've got it set up, it's a piece of cake.

If you haven't got a PostScript printer driver installed in Windows, do so first. In the Control Panel applet select Printers, and if you don't have the PostScript driver installed click on Add Printer. Follow the dialog as required to copy the drivers from the original Win diskette or CD. Optionally, you can at this time specify "Print to File" and give a generic filename (since these will only be intermediate products.

Win 3.11 users: if you haven't installed Win32s yet, get it now. (It's available for free from Microsoft.) This will let you run the 32-bit version of GhostView (at least twice as fast as the 16-bit version, and not as buggy.)

Then get GhostScript and GhostView. Go to http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~ghost/aladdin/get510.html and download the following files:

gs510ini.zip
gs510w32.zip
gs510fn1.zip

Go to http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~ghost/gsview/new25.html and download:

gsv25w32.zip

Download all into the same temp directory. Unzip gsv25w32.zip (only) into the same directory, and run the setup.exe program that now appears. This will automatically set up both GhostScript (a command-line PS file manipulator) and GhostView (a GUI Windows shell for GhostScript).

Familiarize yourself a bit with GSview, then go into NWC and find a file you want to convert to PDF. Select your PostScript printer driver, select "print to file" if you haven't done so already (use the .ps extension), and let 'er rip.

Exit NWC, bring up GhostView, open the *.ps file you just saved. Then go to File.. Print.. and select the "pdfwrite" print device, select resolution (300 dpi recommended), and again "print to file" (this time with .pdf extension). Print the file, exit Ghostview, and bring up Adobe Acrobat viewer to verify that the magic worked.

Viola.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred N on 13-Aug-1998

PS - You might consider making Ghostscript your default viewer for PDF. It seems quite a bit quicker than Adobe viewer 3.0, on my ancient machine at least.... :-)

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-May-2000

Since Ghostscript and GSview are continually updated, the above information is a bit out of date. For folks following this thread and wanting to get the latest info in this great program, I have a small web-page which I update as new versions are developed. It's at:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/gsinfo.htm

Reply 3 offered by: songlette on 04-May-2000

Won't pdf writer with adobe acrobat 4 work?
Or, does this method work better?
Just wondering.
You do too much helping around the net Fred. :-)

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-May-2000

Well, PDF writer with Adobe 4 would probably work better in some applications - example, if you want imbedded links, encapsulated midis, things like that. /But/ you have to buy Acrobat... at around $250 US the last time I looked.

Ghostscript/GSview, OTOH, is completely free. No strings attached, you can even get the source code if you want it. Adobe must hate it.

Another publishing note: it's commonly believed that PDF is a better format than PostScript for publishing because it's smaller. True as far as it goes, but if you compress the files (using WinZip, gzip, whatever), a compressed PostScript file is /significantly/ smaller than the corresponding compressed PDF file.

FWIW...

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 09-May-2000

Both Ghostscript/Ghostview and Adobe Acrobat 4 (the full product, not just the free reader) are useful for making PDF files from Noteworthy Composer. I have both of them.

Those of you who are "educational" users can buy Adobe Acrobat 4 at a deep discount. It is still not cheap. It can be found at places such as college bookstores (if you are student/faculty there).

The advantage to using Acrobat is that the text (lyrics and comments) in the resulting PDF file is editable. The editing is primitive, but if you discover something such as a lyric error (or want to change some words) it can be done without having to go back to Noteworthy. But this is not the best technique for major changes.

The BIG advantage to Ghostscript/Ghostview in the latest and greatest version of Ghostview (2.93 BETA) is that a Poscript file can be converted to an IMAGE is formats such as BMP, GIF, JPG, PNG, TIF. Wow!!! So, Your Noteworthy document can be printed to Postscript (see above replies), brought into Ghostview/Ghostscript Beta 2.93, and re-issued as a picture that can be displayed wherever pictures go.

Versions of Ghostview prior to 2.93 beta do not have this feature. It is hot off the press. Find it with an Internet search (I don't have the URL handy).


#823: Notes hanging...
Notes hanging...

(823)

Submitted by: Maxi Rose on 13-Aug-1998

Since Andrew helped me understand Multipoint Controllers,
I've been going nuts with them. But now I have a problem.
They sometimes cause notes to "hang". I mean that the
notation shows them as being finished, but the sound
continues. Such as a half note that plays the full two
beats and then the sound won't cut off. It just keeps
playing.

I don't really know an adequate way to show how I'm
achieving this except to email anyone a copy of the song
that this is happening in, but any ideas/help would be
gratefully and desperately accepted! I simply can't make
the notes stop playing without having to stop the entire
song!

@}>-`--,-- Maxi Rose Ghost of a Texas Lady

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Aug-1998

See the Troubleshooting, Common Questions sections of the NWC help file, specifically question 3 and its answer.


#824: two questions about beaming
two questions about beaming

(824)

Submitted by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 14-Aug-1998

Someone asked me if I could make him a copy of the first
movement of one of the Brandenburgs ready for a music
weekend. I set to quite happily, but came across two
problems with beaming:

* Two quavers (eighth notes) beamed together; I use the
Text command to add tr above the first and voilà! two
quavers unbeamed

* Sometimes there is a divisi section, where I need two
sets of quavers (for the two parts) in the same bar. No
matter how I play with stems up/stems down, beaming one
set unbeams the other

Are there workarounds for these? Thanks in advance for
any hints and tips.

Reply 1 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 14-Aug-1998

1: You are putting the text in after the first quaver rather than before. Make sure any text you put in is before any beamed notes, or it will break the beams.

2: The only way you can have 2 lots of beamed quavers on the same stave is to have 2 staves, and use the layer file to layer the first staff over the second. If you have version 1.52a you can get a program to activate the layer command, or if you have an earlier version, you can get the layer file from http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#layer and this will give you a layer file to work with.
Adam

Reply 2 offered by: Adam on 14-Aug-1998

Sorry, the program you can get is in the newsgroup, and you must have version 1.5 or later to use the layer file mentioned above.
Adam

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 17-Aug-1998

I think that you can beam 2 sets of quavers at the same time.
You should normally do this entering all the notes (as chords), then beaming all together.

HTH.

Reply 4 offered by: Joy Byford on 18-Aug-1998

I don't think marsu's suggestion will work when you have stem up and stem down notes present. I've never managed to get both sets beamed anyway.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 18-Aug-1998

Joy, you're right.
In fact the beam is on the side the icon tells (stem down => beam down, and vice-versa)
Maybe this may be considered as a bug ? But then how to tell NWC to beam _only_ the stem-down notes for instance ?
One way of doing this could be that the Stem Up/Down could be de-activated, then beaming would appear on both side (or none of course) ?

Otherwise, a good solution is to use the Underlying staff feature.
But --there we need NWC support answer-- will this experimental feature be kept in next release ?? I know many of advanced users use it, what a loss if not kept !!

NWCly yours,

                              MAD


#825: Midi recording
Midi recording

(825)

Submitted by: Dave Puttock on 14-Aug-1998

I note that when I input via a midi keyboard onto a new stave the note durations are all the same as the selected note length, but if I input onto a stave which already has a track existing then the note durations are correct relative to the existing track.
Is it not possible to set a time signature and tempo for a new stave and then record at a duration relative to the midi click.
Also I find of course that my input tends to be full of demi semi quavers (I'm not much of a player) but I've seen midi programs that will (quantise?) adjust to a more playable structure. Is this possible in Noteworthy?

Reply 1 offered by: carolyn c on 14-Aug-1998

I've had the same thing happen with the 32nd notes, so it appears that either I have to play much more precisely, or enter the notes in step time, and that has become much better for me, even though I have to go back and adjust rhythms. I find it's much easier to adjust step-time than to deal with all those hemi-semi-demis or whatever they end up being. I think I remember that in real time it's possible to set the tempo on the template for a slower tempo and that can be helpful. Actually, one can get a pretty good speed going in step time, even including hitting the tab key for bar lines, so it still goes pretty fast. Good luck!

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Aug-1998

See also: msg #292, msg #392, msg #517


#826: Copyright
Copyright

(826)

Submitted by: B Wilkins on 15-Aug-1998

I am working on a medley of Buddy Holly songs. The copyright holders instructed me to put the copyright info on the first page of each copy. There is not near enough space to put all three paragraphs(for the three songs in the medley)into the "song author info" slot. The only idea I can come up with is to make a cover sheet with the medley title and the three copyright info paragraphs. Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: Kassandra Thomas on 03-Nov-1998

How about putting it under the "Comments" section in the end of the Information part, and placing the most recent copyright as the main copyright?

Kassandra

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 03-Nov-1998

There is space for two lines of "copyright info" in NWC.
These go at the bottom of the first page.
If they are not enough, your best bet would be to do a cover sheet.

A


#827: Copyright
Copyright

(827)

Submitted by: B Wilkins on 15-Aug-1998

I am working on a medley of Buddy Holly songs. The copyright holders instructed me to put the copyright info on the first page of each copy. There is not near enough space to put all three paragraphs(for the three songs in the medley)into the "song author info" slot. The only idea I can come up with is to make a cover sheet with the medley title and the three copyright info paragraphs. Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 16-Aug-1998

Why not put it in the "Copyright" slot (at thebottom of the page).
Alternately, create a title with a blank, and change the Title font to something huge.
Import the first page to Word or something (using the Copy button when previewing), and add the info you need in Word.

A


#828: Grace notes
Grace notes

(828)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Aug-1998

When using grace notes, it doesn't seem to matter what time duration is chosen as far as playback is concerned.

Is there a way of changing the duration of the grace note during staff play?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 16-Aug-1998

At the moment no. I hope that Eric will fix this in a future release, tho'.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 16-Aug-1998

Actually, I just thought of something. You could alter the tempo tempo-rarily.

A

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Aug-1998

Right! Good idea. Now I'll have to brush up on my college algebra to figure out how much to modify the tempo for the next beat to compensate...

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: LOL on 18-Aug-1998

:-)
Hope you do not have other small notes on other staves there, or it will turn to nightmare!

Reply 5 offered by: Fred n on 18-Aug-1998

Hoo. That's getting too scary. I think I'll go back to my old method of having two sets of scores - one set that looks good and is muted, and the other that sounds good (but looks ugly) and is hidden.


#829: Nylon string guitar sounds like an organ.
Nylon string guitar sounds like an organ.

(829)

Submitted by: Joe Camerlin on 18-Aug-1998

Does anyone have a clue on how to get the nylon string
guitar to sound more like a guitar, than an organ when
a score is played back?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Aug-1998

Without further information I can only suggest the following:

Are you using the correct instrument patch? The guitar sounds are patches 25-32 (nylon string is 25), whereas the organs are 17-24.

Some synths start the patch numbering at 0, others at 1. This might be your problem, since 24 is Tango Accordian (a sort of organ sound).

If no luck, try explicitly specifying a bank - i.e. bank 0. Your synth might be off in some other patch bank.

Good luck.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 18-Aug-1998

Also, some synths (FM onces particularly) sounds REALLY BAD!

A

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 19-Aug-1998

You bet! You should hear the bass guitar on my ESS1880 fm synth. Sounds like a sick clavinova! Software synths can do a world of wonder to an FM soundcard.
Adam

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Camerlin on 20-Aug-1998

My apologies for the lack of information. I have a Creative
Labs AWE64 sound card. I am using the correct instrument
patch (025) for nylon stringed guitar. However, I will try
your advise to explicitly specify a bank.

Thanks,
JC

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 20-Aug-1998

Two tracks to follow here:
1) How much memory is on yur sound card, and what soundfont bank are you using for general midi? I have a 4M AWE64 and nylong string guitars sound very nice on mine.

2) Are you sure that in this particular file that you haven't got the guitar sharing a channel with an organ? I just did that the other day (timpani and french horns, actually).

A

Reply 6 offered by: Fred on 22-Aug-1998

See message msg #832

Reply 7 offered by: Byron Dickens on 19-Sep-1998

I don't even bother with the synth on my AWE 64. I always use the MIDI out driver and play back through my Korg X3, which sounds so much better. Not perfect, but at least I can tell the difference between, say, my brass and woodwind parts.

Even though I use NWC just for notating because I have a dedicated sequencer, it still helps to have some reasonable sounds for quick proofreading (proofhearing?).


#830: NWC 1.52a and Screen Savers
NWC 1.52a and Screen Savers

(830)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 19-Aug-1998

Hi NWC'ers,

This morning NWC 1.52a stopped playback completely when my screensaver took over...

I don't remember this happening in previous releases, come to think of it, I don't think the screensaver ever took over during playback before...

Anyone else having this problem? I'd rather not increase the delay/disable the screensaver just for NWC. Suggestions welcome!

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Aug-1998

Hi Sue. I haven't run into this with NWC, but have with other midi players/sequencers (Yamaha Player, MS Media player). I "solved" the problem by increasing the screen-save delay time to about 15 minutes.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 19-Aug-1998

I think that what is happening is that you have NWC set to play only when it is the "Front Application" (ie your Options | Midi tab has Port Usage set to "While Active").
If you set it to always (or while playing), that'll fix it, though it may disturb other midi players if you have them around whilst NWC is up.

Or you can do as Fred did, and increase your screensaver time.

A

Reply 3 offered by: Sue Morton on 19-Aug-1998

Thanx Andrew! Yes, I did change my MIDI options because temporarily I had two midi programs that I was playing alternately. I will change my options back to "while active" immediately. One of these days I will no longer be brain-dead and will remember this stuff... :>


#831: sounds
sounds

(831)

Submitted by: joe  on 21-Aug-1998

Ive tried to understand how to bring new sounds into the nwc but I want to ask someone to please spell it out for me in easy-to-follow steps. Is there somewhere to download new sounds?
joe dont know

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 21-Aug-1998

I'm afraid you'll have to clarify what you mean here.
Do you mean, for instance, how to use a different set of sounds in your Wavetable sound card?
Or do you simply mean "how do I add a note to NWC"?

A

Reply 2 offered by: Joe on 22-Aug-1998

Hmm didnt think i was that obtuse.
I mean soundfonts. Is it possible to download say, new classical guitar sounds that dont sound like tin if you know what I mean. There must be away to expand the available instruments for playback. I dont have a keyboard. I am just using the program to write with.
Joe dont know

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1998

See message #832


#832: Guitar Lesson (re: 829, 831)
Guitar Lesson (re: 829, 831)

(832)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1998

I think I figured out the difficulty Joe is having. He sent me a midi file of a lovely little piece he sequenced, and some of the problems became immediately obvious.

Guitar is a challenging instrument to sequence. So I'll write a little mini-tutorial, hopefully without getting too verbose. First off, to sequence for guitar, you have to think like a guitarist... or get a lobotomy ;-) [I can say things like that, I'm one myself...] Joking aside, you have to treat the guitar as six separate instruments - one for each string.

One of the first lessons in classical guitar is "Don't move a finger of the fretting hand unless you have to." A corollary is "Don't right-hand-mute the strings unless you have to."

The way guitar pieces are written are *not* how they're played, in terms of note duration. I'm attaching a little file that illustrates this. It's an attachment on this identical message on the newsgroup. (If you can't get onto the newsgroup, e-mail me and I'll send it to you.)

The first staff is how you would more-or-less enter it in from a piece of sheet music (within the limitations of NWC). Go ahead and play the file. The other six staves are muted as supplied. Sound pretty awful and chunky, doesn't it?

The other thing people forget is that guitar music is sounded *an octave lower* than written. Guitarists, being simple-minded creatures, would find it tough to cope with a grand staff. So, to allow squeezing everything on one staff, the music is written an octave higher. Some sequencers have an option of putting little 8's (or even 15's) above or below the clef to indicate such octavizations. NWC doesn't, but there's a way around it.

First select all notes of a staff, and use shift-ctl-down seven times to move the notes down an octave. Then use Tools - Transpose staff to transpose +12 semitones. The score is back to looking as it should, but the sound will be an octave lower, again as it should.

Back to the other point. Thinking like a guitarist means actually figuring out which string each note is played on, and writing a staff for each string to allow the notes to ring for their full length until a "virtual finger" changes position. See staves 2-7 of the sample NWC file, which represent strings 1-6 of the guitar.

Finally, adding dynamics can make a world of difference.

So let's hear what this is all about. Select the first staff, and click Staff - Mute staff. Now go down the line and unmute each of the other six staves. Press home, then F5 to replay the file. Sounds like a guitar now, eh Joe?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 22-Aug-1998

<putting little 8's (or even 15's) above or below the clef. . . NWC doesn't>

Actually it does - when inserting or editing a clef symbol there is an option
to shift up or down by an octave. Just thought I'd mention it ...

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 22-Aug-1998

Oops... you're absolutely right. Thanks for pointing that out, it will make things a lot easier for future guitar (and double bass) projects.


#833: Auto save
Auto save

(833)

Submitted by: Robert Shiffman on 22-Aug-1998

Yikes! It happened again! I forgot to save during the heat of creative expression, the computer froze and, well, 1/2 hour of inspiration lost. I can't find an auto save setting, so assume there is none at present. Please implement one real soon and save a masterpiece.

Humbly,
Robert Shiffman

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Aug-1998

Look closer at the Tools, Options, File tab. Specifically, the Auto save/recovery option and companion Frequency option. Added in version 1.50.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 23-Aug-1998

This raises an interesting question.
Are people still running older ("legacy") versions of NWC?
If so, where are they obtaining them from? Must be a bummer being asked to support stuff you fixed 6 months ago.
Eric, maybe you should put expiry dates on NWC (thus guaranteeing upgrades!)

A

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Shiffman on 23-Aug-1998

Sonofagun! You're right. Darned if I could find it in Help, but after compiling "Search," why, there it was. Thanks!

Contritely,
Robert Shiffman

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier on 24-Aug-1998

Andrew,

I don't agree with your proposal. I can imagine the following
situation, where my NWC version expires, I urgently need to
write and print a piece of music, and I have no Internet
access for the next three months... In that situation, I
would be furious to have an expiry date !

Olivier.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 24-Aug-1998

Okay, you are both right :
So the solution could be :if you start NWC and it finds itself to be reather old, it just displays a message telling you that an upgrade (should) exist(s) at that time, and that _many_ new *exciting* features are included in it ;-)

Another proposal ?

P.S. And in Option/Tools, the ability not to display such messagebox !
PPS: And why not in the (opening) Tips ? (oh, btw, you know that you can customize them, don't you ?)

HTH
                          MAD

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew on 24-Aug-1998

I think Marsu's is the best suggestion so far. But let it log on for you and download it as well (after asking permission, of course!)

I indeed would be as furious as Olivier if my paid for software were to expire and no upgrade within reach (though furious at myself since it was my suggestion!) ;)

Whimsically,
A

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Shiffman on 25-Aug-1998

Flattered as I am to see that my question has sparked a dialog about legacy versions of nwc, I have to say that my present version is 1.52. I would prefer NOT to have my software chastize me for not retiring it. There's too much software with attitude already. But do please consider expanding the index in the help file. After making the suggested change the program is saving its little heart out.

I remain
Happily
Robert Shiffman


#834: Composing & Orchestration Tutorials?
Composing & Orchestration Tutorials?

(834)

Submitted by: Phil Allwood on 23-Aug-1998

Does anyone know of any web sites which have tutorials for composing music and/or orchestration. Alternatively, would anyone recommend any books on these subjects. Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: KenJ on 24-Aug-1998

There's a wealth of information here:

http://www.phoaks.com/phoaks2/newsgroups/rec/music/compose/

Reply 2 offered by: KenJ on 24-Aug-1998

Here is one more link to several links:

http://www.hcca.ohio.gov/kelleysworld/7179.htm

This ought to keep you busy.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 24-Aug-1998

And for other languages (dutch, deutsch, français, español...), any clue ?

Reply 4 offered by: Ken Grace on 25-Aug-1998

Maybe we could discuss a few specific examples here,
that might be generally useful.

For example, I recently posted a concert band arrangement
of a Brahms piece to the newsgroup. While I am NOT the
arranger, I have a very strong interest in the piece.

Perhaps as a way of starting the conversation, consider
the two-bar Oboe solo just prior to letter "A". The
arranger (Guy Hutchins) suggested that the solo would sound
very nice on the Soprano Sax. As an alternative, he
suggested doubling the oboe with the Bassoon, in octave.

Am I totally off-base in suggesting this discussion?

Kenny G.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Aug-1998

"Am I totally off-base in suggesting this discussion?"

No, I don't think so. As to your question... chee, I don't know. I'd suggest trying it out. Sometimes it helps to selectively mute certain instruments to see how the doubled instruments interact with each other, then strike up the whole band to see (or rather hear) if anything "sticks out."

As an example, I composed a little piece to augment one of Fernando Sor's guitar studies. The first thought was to have flute carry the lead, and clarinet do the harmony. It just didn't work - even with volume settings adjusted accordingly, the clarinet still overpowered the flute by its reedy timbre.

I settled on two flutes, cello and bass doubled (this one worked well), and of course the guitar part.

For fun I did a string arrangement also (two violins, cello and guitar). The two different arrangements are attached. Same notes, but a very different overall sound. If anyone's interested, let me know and I'll e-mail them to you.

Isn't midi a hoot?

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Aug-1998

Of course, the files mentioned in my last message aren't attached. Must be bedtime.

E-mail me if you want to hear these.


#835: Importing MIDI files with Triplets. . . .
Importing MIDI files with Triplets. . . .

(835)

Submitted by: Steven Walvick on 23-Aug-1998

Doesn't seem to work well at all. Is there a fix for this?
Otherwise, I end up with a whole bunch o' quavers.

Noteworthy also can't seem to determine a time signature if
none is provided, and compound rhythm is a problem. How do
I take a midifile, and specify a Key Signature if none is
already there, without resorting to using something like
mf2t to switch the .mid to .txt and change it manually. . .

Also, this still doesn't fix the triplet problem.

Since you can't just 'insert' a single triplet into a score
(in NWC it seems you have to highlight 3 'beats' and make
it a triplet group....) perhaps it won't try to read in
triplets, in case it only finds one instead of 3. . .

Any thoughts?

-Steve.

p.s. I scanned through all 700+ threads, and haven't found
anything, but then again, it IS 4:30 in the morning, so who
knows???

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 23-Aug-1998

See msg #296, msg #373, msg #731.
Bottom line is NWC currently doesn't convert notes back to triplets (as MIDI doesn't store them as triplets, but just as notes that go on now and go off then). However, NWC can import triplets in a predictable way such that a recorder macro (recorder.exe came and went with Windows 3.1) can fix them very easily. See my homepage http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/harmonograph/harmonograph.html for more info.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 23-Aug-1998

Oops! Forgot the ! at the start!
http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/harmonograph/harmonograph.html
Also, w.r.t. your search failing. GET THE OFFLINE VERSION!
It allows for you to use the Windows help search utility.

A

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 23-Aug-1998

Aw shoot me!
Wrong page reference.
Try this one...
http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html

Sorry about the confusion.

A


#836: Getting more soundfonts/playback devices-how to?
Getting more soundfonts/playback devices-how to?

(836)

Submitted by: joe on 23-Aug-1998

Thanx to Fred Nachbaur for that great reply about getting the guitar to sound like one. But his response to me was really in re of a question someone else posed so my original question still goes.

How do you expand the range of sound available to use as instruments if you dont have an external input such as a keyboard?

Is it possible to download new soundfonts?

Please tell me how to do it keeping in mind I am not the most profficient with computerese.

Thanx a bundle
Joe

Reply 1 offered by: joe  on 23-Aug-1998

By the way fred I just checked. That was ANOTHER joe who asked the question about guitar/organ sounds. I just used the guit as an example.
Joe

Reply 2 offered by: Sly on 04-Apr-2000

I use notewworthy composer and I have an awe64 live soundcard......I do all my writing with noteworthy without the use of any instruments. You can load soundfonts into the soundcard and have noteworthy play the sequences. But your card has to have the memory available to load the soundfonts........my old awe card only had 512k of memory so I couldn't load the sounds into it. The awe live will load them and play them with noteworthy. I hope I was able to help you.
Sly


#837: balance
balance

(837)

Submitted by: R.J. on 23-Aug-1998

I was just wondering if there was any way I could adjust the balance using Noteworthy with out the use of a mixer.

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Mund on 23-Aug-1998

Press F2 (Properties for Staff), click the "MIDI" tab and look at "Stereo Pan". You can change this for left/right balance - "0" is full left and "127" is full right I believe. Also look at "Part Volume", right above "Stereo Pan". You can adjust each individual staff's volume with this control, "127" is the loudest and "0" is the softest. Hope this is what you were looking for.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier on 24-Aug-1998

Yes, I also think that you can change stereo pan in the middle
of a score, thanks to a "multi point controller".

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 25-Aug-1998

Also note that some cards do not sounds the panoramic correctly.
My SB card just "sounds" 3 positions: left, middle, right. 30 is like 0, 32 like 63. But I guess the score I wrote sound better on better cards (I use 0, 42, 86 and 127 for 4 parts).
Though you can duplicate a staff and adjust the volume to hear it at the proper place... but you need to change the channel, so it limits the number of parts.

HTH,
            MAD


#838: Breves (double whole note duration)
Breves (double whole note duration)

(838)

Submitted by: John Shepherd on 24-Aug-1998

I am composing a piece in 4/2 time, and I want to use breves for notes that last for the whole bar (measure). So far I haven't found a way to enter a breve. For the moment I am using two semi-breves (whole notes) tied together. Does NWC have breves ?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 24-Aug-1998

I don't believe it does. I've never understood the importance of breves. Surely it can be done in 4/4 at half the tempo? I'd love someone to explain the different "feel".

A

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 24-Aug-1998

No, NWC does not contain any breves (at least not yet, but I added this item to the official wish list a few months ago). I use them for recitativos.

If you've got other music fonts (e.g. Mozart), you can "copy" breves and insert them as "text" into the NWC staff. But then they, of course, do not sound, nor are they "counted" (which means that the bar must contain other NWC notes to fill the measure).

Paul

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier on 24-Aug-1998

Oh, then the note duration that is twice a whole is called
a `breve' ? This is funny, because in french the words
'bref' and 'breve' mean 'brief' or 'short' ! In french,
I call it a 'carrée', i.e. 'squared' in english.

These breves are wery frequent in early music. Yes, we
could replace 4/2 by 4/4 and breves by whole notes, but
it is painful, and hard to read for people who are used
to playing or singing early music.

By the way, do you know the name of the notes that are
still longer than the breves ? And the corresponding rests ?

Reply 4 offered by: John Shepherd on 25-Aug-1998

Thanks for your replies.

Like Olivier, I think that it is not so much the "feel" of breves but rather the "look" that makes them attractive. A page of 4/2 looks so much less cluttered than a page of 4/4.

How does the wishlist work ? Do I need to register my vote for breves as well (so that the relative popularity of different wishes can be compared), or are duplicate requests ignored ?

I will have to do some homework to find out more about breves - I have quite happily used them without knowing much about them!

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 25-Aug-1998

About "breve" :
I wonder (I think I heard this long ago, when singing gregorian) if the name doesn't come from the same root that gave "breathe" in early english.
The old latin name for "whole note" ('ronde' in French) is semi-brevis, the 'ronde carrée' ("breve") being brevis --a full breathe.
There is no duration longer than the breve then :-), and in fact a "breve" take all the beats needed for the lyrics and/or measure. Exactly as the "whole rest" does... even in NWC :-D

HTH
          MAD

Reply 6 offered by: mad again on 25-Aug-1998

Oh, and to reply to first posts :
At this time there is no other way but inserting 2 whole notes. I use it in "Tristis est" of J.Kuhnau, since I want to use 4/2 notation.
I do NOT use 4/4 because I know by experience that the singers do NOT sing it the same.
As well as some Bach's scores where you find 32ths notes (in a slooow tempo though) make the interpret panic... The feel is not the same.

Reply 7 offered by: Olivier on 25-Aug-1998

marsu wrote:
> There is no duration longer than the breve then :-), and
> in fact a "breve" take all the beats needed for the lyrics
> and/or measure.

Yet, I already sung a score (with no bar lines), where
the breve took exactly two beats (i.e. two whole notes),
and there was another notation that meant "continue up
to the end of the score". This note was like a brevis,
but with a stem such as an half note.

Reply 8 offered by: Curtis Clark on 25-Aug-1998

The note longer than a breve is a "longa".

Reply 9 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 25-Aug-1998

The current system of notation was developed from the medieval neumes notation.

The notation was originally One Large (or Duplex Long) = two longs
One long = either two or three breves (or shorts).

With the passage of time, shorter notes than the breve were required and at first the semi breve (half short) came into being and then the minim, the name coming again from the Latin 'Semibreves minimae').

In due course the notes that were longer than the breve dropped out of common usage and so we are now left with the paradox of today's longest written note being called a breve (or short)

HTH

Richard


#841: New instrument patch won't play
New instrument patch won't play

(841)

Submitted by: Barry Beach on 26-Aug-1998

I am trying to change the instrument patch in a song. It shows up on the score, but when I play it, it sounds the same as before. Am I doing something wrong?

Reply 1 offered by: Sterghios on 30-Sep-1998

Assuming that you enter in the score an instrument patch, then I presume that you do d/c the instrument from the patch list you want.
If this concerns changing the "root" instrument, or in other words the instrument assigned in the first place in the score, then press F2, select the third tab, select the instrument assign a midi channel and then press ok. If this doesn't work then the problem has to come down to your soundcard


#842: Suggested improvement
Suggested improvement

(842)

Submitted by: Chris Coon on 26-Aug-1998

I am starting this message thread to try to get response and possibly a few peaople to add this to the wish list.
Ok
How many of you would like NoteWorthy to directly accept MIDI controllers? (not just MPC, all of the different controllers)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 26-Aug-1998

Yes. There are several I'd like to work with, reverb, chorus, etc. I think the problem lies in the varying interpretations of these controllers by different GM cards. Still, pitch bend is already interpreted variously so why not go the whole hog? :)

A

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Aug-1998

Yes. It would make things much easier. As it is I do a lot of shuffling between different programs to accomplish this and some other chores.

Reply 3 offered by: Ramon Pajares Box on 28-Aug-1998

Agreed. It would be great if NWC could manage Expression (no. 11) controllers. Sometimes access to Volume (7) controllers is not enough.

Reply 4 offered by: Shane T on 08-Sep-1998

Same here. Having an XG keyboard it would be nice to be able
to access more of the controllers through NoteWorthy, instead
of always having to export as a midi file and add the effects
using other programs.

Reply 5 offered by: ST on 08-Sep-1998

Same here. Having an XG keyboard it would be nice to be able
to access more of the controllers through NoteWorthy, instead
of always having to export as a midi file and add the effects
using other programs.

Reply 6 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 30-Sep-1998

I sign on this onw too.
NWC is powerfull enough now, but getting directly to play with all these cute
little tricks will make its musical output and applicabillity to actual recording of
songs much higher and professional.
Hell, I 'll put it into the 8-track directly instead of running around to find people to
play my stuff or busting my brains with ways of playing these tricks through other
programs or the soundcards control panel.

May I also suggest a way out of the problem A suggested?
Instead of issuing a new version with all the different configurations for all the different
soundcards included, why not make patch files that will provide these functions for specific
cards. That way each one will have a program trimmed to his own needs, and less space occupied
by unwanted data.
It will also allow to share the workload to different teams in your programming centre and hence have a faster result. If one patch (or new version) comes out, then more time will be needed to find ways to intergrate the various setup needs.

Go for it!


#843: Combining Staffs
Combining Staffs

(843)

Submitted by: Arthur W. Schulze on 26-Aug-1998

Is there any way to combine two (or more) staffs already
written into one staff so as to make a condensed score
of an already existing score?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Aug-1998

Well, yes and no. No you can't just cut-and-paste like on some other programs, or shift-dragging or the like.

Yes, you can layer two staves using an "experimental" feature built into the current release V1.52a. Previously you had to use a file that had the feature enabled, but with 1.52a you can download a little patch that makes the feature "permanently" available.

Go to the *newgroup* linked at the top of the main forums page, and look for the posting by NWC Support dated 08/10/98 20:43, entitled "Experimental Layering in NWC 1.52a" (or something like that). Download the little patch contained therein. It might also be available on their home page (I took a quick look but didn't find it).

It's called "experimental" because apparently there are difficulties under some conditions. See the online help, search for "experimental", for further info and instructions on use.

Note that this will, at present, only work to overlay a staff with the next one. There doesn't seem to be a way of layering more than two adjacent staves.

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 27-Aug-1998

You could try layering them. Might look a bit odd with
note stems going in different directions. Get hold of one
of the experimental samples and use it as a template. Paste
your staves into the new file and then layer them as
appropriate.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 27-Aug-1998

You should refer to msg #735 reply 3.
and, as Andrew would say : GET THE OFFLINE FORUM! (that's how I got the reference from)

HTH
              Marsu

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Aug-1998

Here's a rough and ready alternative.
Mute all staves except the ones you want to combine.
For example mute all except the violins.
Export the required staves in Type 0 format - this combines them on one staff.
Do the same with other combined staves - trumpets whatever.
Import each staff grouping as a Midi file but DONT select the Convert Each Channel to a Staff option.

The result wont be pretty and you'll lose all the marks.
But you can condense the score.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 28-Aug-1998

Fred,

Thanks for the tip on the layering patch - I had a scout around and found it
in the New page (go to home page then click on the New in the left hand margin)

Cheers, Peter.

Reply 6 offered by: Clayton Spicer on 06-Sep-1998

if you want to layer 2 or more staffs just layer the bottom one then the top one


#844: Localization of NoteWorthy Composer
Localization of NoteWorthy Composer

(844)

Submitted by: Timothy Ha on 27-Aug-1998

Dear Eric and others, big thanks for the program. I'm interested if there is any plan to make NWC localized versions. I think, my friends and I could help translating NWC into Russian language.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 27-Aug-1998

Timothy, I fear that it's not planned yet --unless Eric wants to do all versions himself :-)
I'm still volunteer for French (and maybe german) versions.
Already done it, but in a non-reiterable way, on an earlier version.

MAD

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 28-Aug-1998

I would, of course, love to have a Swedish version of NWC. But the English version works fine - I hope you're aware that you can e.g. add lyrics to your music in any language you want: I use Swedish and RUSSIAN, and it works just fine.

Living in a small country in Sweden, you cannot expect all software to be in your own langauge, you simple have to learn basic commands etc. in English. Isn't that true also for PC users in bigger coutries like Germany, France or Russia?

Paul

Reply 3 offered by: Timothy Ha on 28-Aug-1998

Thanks to all of you for your response. Of course the situation is much alike that all of us should use English software. But my friends would use NWC better if it's in our native language. By the way, since NWC 1.50 we could use RUSSIAN lyrics very well in our music sheets. We're very glad we bought NWC. Big thanks go to Eric.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 28-Aug-1998

Timothy's right, I translated NWC for my wife who doesn't speak english at all. It'd be great to have it in many languages, but who'd do the support ?

MAD

Reply 5 offered by: yonatan lehman on 03-Nov-1998

I was astounded to see that I could do hebrew lyrics !
Hebrew (and arabic) is written right to left so there
is a problem putting it in scores. The solutin is to break up the words into sylables, each sylable is written left to right and the sylables are placed under the notes just as in english.

Once I out the PC into "left to right mode" (left alt shift) I got a hebrew font, I wrote left to right - and in the lyrics it came out ok. I had to manually set a hebrew font to see it on the screen (as opposed to the lyrics page).


#845: Sound Patches?
Sound Patches?

(845)

Submitted by: Charles Blachly on 27-Aug-1998

Is there any way to get noteworthy composer to play using
my collection of .pat files which are the GUS samples?
I have an SB16, and was just wondering if I could use
the samples.

Reply 1 offered by: Timothy Ha on 28-Aug-1998

It seems like you must have a software MIDI driver, which can use those .pat files for GUS. Then in NWC you can specify for all outgoing MIDI to go through this driver. Select Options/MIDI tab. Hope that this helps. I don't have a GUS. :)


#846: Extending last line to right margin
Extending last line to right margin

(846)

Submitted by: Michael Bean on 27-Aug-1998

When a tune's notation ends in the middle of the stave,
I would like to extend the blank stave to the right hand
margin just so it looks a little better.

Here's the embarrassing part. I've done it before. . .
I just can't remember how I did it? Duhhhhh!

Thanks, gang. . .

Michael

Reply 1 offered by: Greg on 28-Aug-1998

Try clicking on File, Page Setup, Options, then check the box Extend Last System.


#847: Experimental Layering Patch
Experimental Layering Patch

(847)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 28-Aug-1998

Following msg #843 I downloaded the patch nwcxftr.exe. I have activated the patch and the
appropriate check box now appears in the Staff Visual window, BUT it doesn't do anything
when checked! The original experimental files still work ok.

I have version 1.52a, and have tried both the 32 bit and 16 bit versions of NWC. Any ideas?
(This might be one for NWC Support)

Peter.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Aug-1998

You have global control over staff layering in the Page Setup Contents area. It defauls to off initially.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 28-Aug-1998

That's the ticket. I didn't read the 'Tip' thoroughly did I!!

Many thanks, Peter

Reply 3 offered by: Sue Morton on 29-Aug-1998

Hi, for those of you that, like me, want the patch .exe for version 1.52a and don't have the newsgroup, go to this page:

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#layer

The .exe is there, along with a zip file of music using the experimental layering feature.

What fun NWC is!

Sue

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Aug-1998

Even more fun than NWC are the NWC users... and this forum and the newsgroup. Lots to learn, good fun, and helpful people. It doesn't get much better... :-)


#848: NWC and Cakewalk MIDI files
NWC and Cakewalk MIDI files

(848)

Submitted by: Ramon Pajares Box on 28-Aug-1998

When I export to MIDI from NWC the resulting MIDI file has some size.
If I load this MIDI file in Cakewalk (3.0 Pro) and save it inmediately, the file size shrinks by about one-third. It gets shorter without any perceptible loss in sound quality.
How is it possible? Does NWC put in MIDI files some stuff which is not really needed there? Are MIDI files from NWC and Cakewalk really the same format?

Puzzled,

Ramon
http://www.nil.es/rpajares/

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Aug-1998

You are probably changing the time base of the file to a lower resolution. This could reduce the size requirements for the timing data in the file.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Aug-1998

It is also possible that you are changing the channel assignments, thus changing the way the MIDI running data can be utilized. The only way to know for sure is to compare the tracks, events, and timing in the two files.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Aug-1998

A great way to do that is using MF2T (see "Free Midi to Text Converter" thread in this forum).

Reply 4 offered by: Ramon Pajares Box on 29-Aug-1998

I change nothing in file. I just save in Cakewalk after having loaded the NWC MIDI file. Obviously something changes but it happens automatically.
Well, I was thinking that this was a rather known fact by the NWC community. But now I wonder if somebody has made the same experiment I've made and if he/she has found the same results.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Aug-1998

Eric was right. I took my own advice and used mf2t to compare two files, the first as exported by NWC and the second as imported and re-exported through Cakewalk (the version I have is Express 3.01).

The difference is immediately obvious. NWC exports at a resolution of 192 ticks per beat, whereas Cakewalk exports at 120 ticks per beat.

This won't make a perceptible difference in most music files, but it *can* make a difference in files that contain fast notes (e.g. sixty-fourths). Such notes will sound choppy at the lower resolution because 120 isn't evenly divisible by 64.

The only other discrepancy I found is that if you have more than one tempo assignment at any given point, NWC faithfully exports both. However, Cakewalk only exports the second of such simultaneous events in the master track.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 30-Aug-1998

So yet again, NWC does the job more thoroughly than the competition. More power to their elbow!
Incidentally, Sibelius for Windows is now available (at 30 times the price of NWC!). It looks
excellent on the demo CD (so it should be at that price), but at the moment there are no cut down
versions advertised, so it's definitely for the dedicated/professionals . . . . I think I'll stick
with NWC!

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 30-Aug-1998

I use Cakewalk for MIDI production after entering data in NWC.
I have found that you can import MIDI's in the 192 division format.
In fact that is the default import in my setup although I normally use 120 if using Cakewalk alone.
You dont need to convert your MIDI file to text in Cakewalk thats all provided in the Event List.
The flexibility, global and filtered editing in Cakewalk make it an ideal tool for MIDI production.
I'll stick to NoteWorthy Composer for note entry and printed output though since I find it both faster and superior in quality.

Reply 8 offered by: Ramon Pajares Box on 30-Aug-1998

Fred, great reply! The difference of resolution in the saved MIDI files is somewhat important.
I don't know if the latest release of Cakewalk bears this limitation.

Thank you very much the time spent in doing the comparison.

Ramon

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Aug-1998

Barry wrote:
"You dont need to convert your MIDI file to text in Cakewalk thats all provided in the Event List."

Yes. I only converted the input and output midi files to text for easy comparison. (A lot easier than trying to make heads or tails of it in a hex editor).

Reply 10 offered by: Johnti on 01-Sep-1998

This is very interesting for me! But what does the 120 and 192 ticks mean?

Reply 11 offered by: Fred on 01-Sep-1998

It's the smallest time division that a midi event (usually a note) can have. An analogy is screen resolution; you can see finer details at 1024x768 than, say, 320x200.

Reply 12 offered by: Gregour Beatty on 07-Nov-1999

Cakewalk's Event Lists will also show all the parameters, in the form of a table of MIDI event messages. Most of its "View"s would let you pop up windows &c where one could also glean the info ... however, there are advantages to using a dis-assembler utility to see a text output of the messages ... when Cakewalk's "user friendly" interfaces fail you, you really need to see more like what the MIDI message stream "REALLY" contains, period. After spotting what's going on, it becomes more obvious which "View" in Cakewalk lets you get at control of the element/s in question.
Midi files can be very small anyway, just as a piano roll doesn't need to weigh as much as a piano -- it gets its sounds from the next player piano you put it into (and hope it's in tune), and MIDI files get their sounds from a sound card or keyboard or &c (and hope it ain't dorky). However, still doesn't explain, by itself, how one program vs another can come up with such a difference in file sizes -- neither of them would contain anything but (theoretically) the same plain MIDI messages ...
There are also MIDI type zero & type 1 &c formats ... in some cases it makes a difference, not every target application considers the same basic format to be universal. Perhaps the most universal version is the one where all the events' messages are mixed into one big stream; since one's "tracks" are usually assigned to channels, and all that is fairly visible in Cakewalk's Track View, Cakewalk will include the channel parameter when it saves the file, and the messages will still play normally. (I believe I'm talking about type zero there? Cakewalk's Help screens ought to delineate which are which.) Perhaps there are different format types afoot here, I haven't ever looked at identical tunes saved to different formats & looked at the file sizes comparison.
Cakewalk does let you choose and set your time division, it's just that it defaults to 120. Like many a software quirk, it will assume the default, and then may adjust tempo to fit that value, so a slow passage might take up a standard amount of screen space as you watch the playback, but the "now" cursor will slow down during a slow section, and then snap back to "normal" speed if the tempo goes back to "a tempo" ...
If you don't make some settings to take control of such things, you may wonder for a while where the program gets the ideas you THOUGHT YOU were supposed to have been putting in there. The tune would most likely sound exactly just as good because none of the sound's wave profiles or info are ever actually in the MIDI file, all that is produced by the soundcard or &c. Unless the time resolution is just plain not apropos of the piece to the point where it simply trips over itself somehow, there would never be a difference in sound quality per se.


#849: .BAK files
.BAK files

(849)

Submitted by: joe on 28-Aug-1998

Whats the difference between the regular NWC songfiles
that I see when Ive saved a song, as opposed to the
BAK files which look like computer code?
Ive deleted BAK files and havent seen any change.
Why should I save each song twice, in effect?Takes up
limited storage space, yes indeed.
Thx
Joe

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Aug-1998

The answers to this question, as posted in the newsgroup, are as follows:

>
> Can anyone tell me what the difference is between
> a BAK file and an NWC file. Ive noticed I have two
> of every file.thx
> Joe

A .BAK file is a "backup" file, which NWC makes for you. If your .NWC somehow gets corrupted or deleted, you can rename your .BAK file to have a .NWC extension then open it. It should be a fairly recent version of your .NWC file.
-------------------------
The Tools, Options, File tab includes an option that you can use to disable this (not recommended however).


#850: Measure Numbers
Measure Numbers

(850)

Submitted by: Becky Wilkins on 30-Aug-1998

I would like measure numbers above EVERY measure on a songs I am arranging. Can NoteWorthy do that?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Aug-1998

When turning on the measure numbers function, it does show on every measure during editing mode.

However, when printing, it only prints the number of the first measure of each "system" (line) -- which is the usual way music is presented.

You could use the Insert Text function to print the other measure numbers (though not easily with boxes or circles), but you'd have to turn off the measure numbers during printing to avoid duplicates on the first measure of each system.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 30-Aug-1998

If what you are after if rehearsal marks (say, at the start of a section or some difficulat part or something like that)use text inserts with
1) plain vanilla text saying something like "Sec A" or
2) use Barry Graham's boxmarks font which has alphabetics in boxes, just like on "real" music! :) You'll find the font and directions on how to use it on the newsgroup.

A


#851: Importing Cakewalk Files to NWC
Importing Cakewalk Files to NWC

(851)

Submitted by: John on 30-Aug-1998

I have never used Cakewalk, but have been offered some files
containing MIDI and lyric information.

The MIDI's I can now extract courtesy of a little ytility
called CAKE2MID, but I still have no way of viewing the
lyrics embedded in the Cakewalk file.

The impression I get is that Cakewalk is a Win95 application,
whereas I only have Win3.1. I am very happy with NWC and
would prefer not to have to buy another suite of programs.

Regards
John

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 31-Aug-1998

If you're, really after the lyrics, perhaps you could open the file with Notepad or Write and get the text out that way.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Aug-1998

Hooray! Another Win3.1x enthusiast!

fyi - Cakewalk is available for Win 3.11 also. The files are portable between the Win3.1 and Win95 versions.

The version I have is "Cakewalk Express V3.01." It came bundled (i.e. free) with my Audiotrix 3DXG sound card (by Mediatrix).

Reply 3 offered by: John on 31-Aug-1998

Thanks for the replies to date, but as yet I don't have a
viable solution. I have tried viewing the Cakewalk .wrk
file in a variety of text editors, but there is so much
gobbledy-gook that it is extremely difficult to separate the
real lyrics without ambiguity. I guess that I wouldn't make
a very good code cracker 'cos I can't see the any obvious
pattern to differentiate between chords, control characters
and the real text. Thank you Andrew.

Yes Fred, I am a Win 3.1 enthusiast, but probably more
because I'm not an early adopter - or don't have the
wherewithal to be one. This may be one occasion however
where the odds of picking up a 16 bit version seem to be
lengthening somewhat. My local distributor tells me that
Cakewalk now only sells the 32 bit versions. In the absence
of any other ideas, my only thought is to find a shareware
site which, like me, has not quite kept up with the times.
No luck to date though.

Your ideas would be appreciated.

Regards
John

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 31-Aug-1998

John - How many Cakewalk.wrk files do you have?
If there's not too many - zip them up - send them over and I'll extract your lyrics for you - I assume you can handle the MIDI conversion OK - so you can get the notes but not the lyrics.

Barry

Reply 5 offered by: Johnti on 01-Sep-1998

Barry is a great guy don't you think!

Did Noteworthy ever ask him for his brilliant program that changes general midi drum tracks to notation?

Most Coolest Regards,
Johnti.

Reply 6 offered by: KenJ on 07-Sep-1998

I did a websearch and found Windows 3.1 versions all over the internet. 16-bit and 32-bit versions are on the same CD-ROM. Why not just download the demo version. The only function disabled is save. Maybe you could still copy lyrics though.

KenJ


#852: repeat signs/playback/breathmarks
repeat signs/playback/breathmarks

(852)

Submitted by: Carolyn Conyers on 31-Aug-1998

Two questions and an observation:
1. I encountered an interesting problem over the weekend. Have a choral piece that starts with a pickup note, and needs to repeat the first section before going on to the "refrain." So, I put in a repeat sign to indicate the repeat. Apparently, since repeat signs are considered to be "decorated bar lines" in NWC, the program counted the pickup note like a full measure, thereby throwing off the measure count by one bar. This piece is "hymn-like" in construction, so it's measured in sections of 8 bars each. The pickup needs not to be considered a full bar. Any way to work around this?

2. In this same choral piece, my piano part is not included with the choral parts, because it's for rehearsal only. The piano part plays back nicely. The SATB is notated with the tenor in treble clef, an octave higher than the voices will sound. Playback is, therefore, skewed, since the tenor is written in that higher octave. So, the question is, when I write pieces for chorus or transposing instruments, will I have to have two versions - one at concert pitch, the other at written pitch? Yes, I have a Yamaha keyboard, also a "regular" piano, but I really enjoy hearing the computer playback, so I can listen without also working. Sometimes I can catch things that way that I might miss otherwise.

Observation for anyone who can use it: Here and there in the same piece, I put in some breath marks. In order for the playback to sound right (by the way, SATB is notated in open score), the Soprano breath mark can have a notation (i.e., 16th note) but breath marks on the other staffs need to be marked "0". Otherwise, you get a playback in which each staff gets its own 16th note breath in succession! Just a little bit skewed! (Printout is fine.)

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Aug-1998

1: Put the Repeat Open barline after the pickup note. Then repeat the pickup note at the end of the last bar to be repeated. Often, the last time through you *don't* want the pickup, since it goes on to the next section. In this case, you'll have to use the "Master Repeat" open and close, which allow first, second... etc. endings. The drawback to the master repeat is that you can have only one per piece. The *big* advantage is that you can use it in conjuntion with DS, DS al coda, DC al fine, etc.

2: I had the same problem with guitar voicings, which too are written an octave higher than played. Solution is easy -- when you select your clef, click on the Octave Lower option button.

3: You can use Insert Text to insert an apostrophe (in whatever font you desire) which will indicate the breath in the score without introducing a delay. Any of these subtle timing variations (breath mark, fermata, grace note) are difficult to use, since there's no way of setting the duration of these events... yet.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 31-Aug-1998

Carolyn - You can change where the bar numbers start counting in the Page Setup - but I guess that is not the problem you describe.
As for the second problem - you can notate a voice an octave higher but set the MIDI pitch an octave (or 2) lower in the Staff-Staff Properties-Midi-Transposition dialogue box.
It's possible to write in transposed score and still here sound at concert pitch using this method.
For example I write Baritone Sax at it's written pitch in treble clef - but set the MIDI sound to -21 semitones so it sounds at correct concert pitch.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 01-Sep-1998

Carolyn,

It's common practice not to include the anacrusis (pickup note) in choral music repeats, so follow Fred's advice here. Also for the Clef transposition use the option button - this too is standard practice in modern scores. (Unlike some medieval music where the tenor line is often written in natural treble clef with umpteen ledger lines below the stave - very difficult to follow without lots of practice!) Regarding the music sounding right, you may find msg #615 of interest, the use of a seperate tempo stave can be very effective. You can still have your breath marks in the score, but set with zero duration, and when you print out your score leave out the tempo stave in Page Setup.
Regards, Peter.

Reply 4 offered by: Carolyn Conyers on 02-Sep-1998

Okay, we're making some progress. For Text reasons, the best solution was to have a First and Second ending, using the Master Close. (By the way, since the repeat section starts at the beginning, it's not necessary to have a Repeat Open symbol at the beginning of the piece, thereby eliminating a rather disconcerting visual symbol.) The First & Second endingts worked fine and the bars numbered better. But I was using full measures-there was no partial measure to count as a whole measure. Recall that this is an open vocal score - SATB - four staves. I am somewhat dismayed that the first and second ending numbers and brackets will only print on the top (Soprano) staff. I can cut and paste before making performance copies, so each staff has its own symbols, but I'd rather not. Any way around that? Is this a Wish List item? Could it be an available printing option?

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 02-Sep-1998

Carolyn,
what is the trouble with your 4-staves numbering ?
AFAIK, all scores are always numbered only on the higher staff.
  ° If you want each staff to be numbered, AND printed all at the same time, then YES, add this to wish list (more present an item is, more chances it got to be realized ;-)
  ° If you want each staff to be numbered, AND print one booklet per voice (typically used in orchestras), then no change needed. NWC handles this fine.

Do not forget to add this (having such items to each staff) on the wish list.
Though I do not see why it is so much needed : one can use one eye to read lyrics, the 2nd to read notes (one measure ahead), the 3rd to read Soprano items, and the last to look at the conductor ;-)

NWCly yours
            Dominique

Reply 6 offered by: Carolyn Conyers on 02-Sep-1998

This all began when I tried to insert a repeat sign into a vocal score, SATB open score. I inserted the repeat sign after the second beat (3/4 time) of bar #8, expecting the verse to repeat from the upbeat at the beginning of the piece. It did that, but the BAR NUMBERS GOT MESSED UP because NWC considered the first two beats of bar #8 to be bar #8, and the last beat of the bar (which is the upbeat to the next section) to be measure #9. That struck me as kind of dumb, so I wanted a solution. The solution was to do the first & second ending (thanks to Fred). Everything is okay now, I think. All bars are numbered fine. I just think it could be confusing to the performers when their own staff is not marked well, and no doubt they will mark up their scores! At any rate, thanks to everyone for the responses. The printout looks fantastic!


#853: midi keyboard trouble
midi keyboard trouble

(853)

Submitted by: Sasha von Dassow on 31-Aug-1998

This is probably MIDI problems for Dummies #1, but how do I get NWC to actually notice and let me use my keyboard? I'm running WIN98 on a p166 with AWE64 through my gameport. I've tried going through control panel/multimedia/add new instrument on various things- midi mapper, AWE64 330 MIDI out, and NWC doesn't let anything happen- it gives me messages like "program won't open properly" when I try to open anything but AWE64 330 out, but I still can't get it to hear my keyboard. Neither the keyboard instructions, WIN98, nor NWC info or FAQs/newsgroups/forum seems to hold the key to unlock the magic door for me. The keyboard used to work but I always had trouble figuring out how to jigger things the right way anyway, so can somebody help? thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Sep-1998

Playing your MIDI keyboard into your computer is a "MIDI In" function, rather than a "MIDI Out" function. You need to make sure that your cables are properly connected, your soundcard drivers are properly installed, and that NWC is properly setup for recording. You setup NWC using Tools, Options, in the Record tab. Help is available from that page.

See also: msg #184, msg #292, msg #329, msg #392, msg #436, msg #462, msg #517

Reply 2 offered by: Sasha von Dassow on 01-Sep-1998

Thanks for the info- after gnashing my teeth some more I checked the cable connections (again) and discovered that the Y-cable to the gameport had gone bad- to many games played by my son, I guess. The lesson is: check the cable connections just like everybody says to do! Thanks for the time- Sasha

Reply 3 offered by: carolyn conyers on 01-Sep-1998

Sounds like the same maddening problems I had when setting up NWC. Someplace in NWC (I think) there's a little sentence that says something like "MIDI IN should connect to MIDI IN, but sometimes it's MIDI IN to MIDI OUT. At any rate, when I switched the cables to be MIDI IN to MIDI OUT, my keyboard was recognized! Good Luck!


#854: Trouble with  hearing the playing of a score
Trouble with  hearing the playing of a score

(854)

Submitted by: John Young on 02-Sep-1998

When notating a song and wanting to hear the play back. I'm having trouble with the wholle note, it is sounding more than 4 beats, it is still sounding while the next bars of music is being played. And if I have another whole note they both will play at the same time untill I hit the stop tab. Is there a way to adjust this so it will stop. I'm useing the new NWC 1.52.
Thank you all in advance
John

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 02-Sep-1998

It is possible that you did tie your whole note to another. The 2nd note disappeared since then, and the remaining note only starts and doesn't stop.
Try to remove the faulty note and re-insert it ; if this corrects the situation, it was that.
I guess that normally Ctrl-F9 should correct this --maybe am I wrong.

hope this helps

              Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Sep-1998

See the Common Question #3 in the NWC help file. It covers stuck notes, and the causes.

See also: msg #39, msg #128, msg #442, msg #479


#855: Clusters
Clusters

(855)

Submitted by: Shannon W. Mack on 02-Sep-1998

How does one write a cluster on the program?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Sep-1998

I do not understand your question in the context of music notation and NWC. What do you mean by this question? Could you elaborate on a cluster?

Reply 2 offered by: Shannon W. Mack on 02-Sep-1998

A cluster is a group of notes all 1 half-step apart. Attempting to write a d and a d-flat in the same chord, I found the program unwilling. Please tell me how I may do this. Thank you.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Sep-1998

Select stem up, insert your D. Then select stem down, select the "flat" button, and use CNTL ENTER to insert the Db.

Then it gets trickier. You can't add a D#, you'll have to settle for Eb. (Enharmonically the same note, sounds just as bad.. ;-) )

Regards,
Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 03-Sep-1998

Fred, I can't try it right now, but is it possible then
to have e.g. Bb, B, C, Db, D, Eb and E on the same chord ?
Or simply Db, D, Eb and E ?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 03-Sep-1998

I don't see why not, I'm not at a computer with NWC installed at the moment. Experiment! :)

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Sep-1998

It is not a good idea to try combining a natural note and corresponding flat at the same position on the staff. You should use the enharmonic equivalent for one of the notes. For example, D and C#m rather than D and Db.

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 04-Sep-1998

Hmm. So contiguous clusters can only be at most 3 semitones large (eg B,C,Db or G#,A,Bb), no?. However, if a semitone were dropped out here and there, you can make some very fat chords. Also, the overlaying thingy could work well, or using a hidden staff to add extra notes (though how one notates them is another matter).

A

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Sep-1998

You can also use a double-flat on top and double-sharp on the bottom, if you are so inclined. I would not want to be the performer for the piece, however (maybe not the listener either). - Eric

Reply 9 offered by: Fred on 04-Sep-1998

My daughter's cat Schubert composed a piece like that once, by sitting on her D50 with the Theatre Organ patch on. It was a modern impressionistic piece, evoking visions of his feline compadres on a back fence ;-)

Reply 10 offered by: Napoleon on 04-Sep-1998

But in lots of kinds of music like jazz and classical piano this is used.

Reply 11 offered by: Sheldon on 06-Sep-1998

So...let's see. The biggest cluster I can come up with is
Gx,A#,B,C,Db,Ebb. I asked my g.f. (she's a classical piano
teacher) what would be a good way, she said that often
just the top and bottom notes are scored, with a "block"
between them, and often a table at the bottom of the sheet
for ref. Would a "lyric" under the chord be acceptable?
(I.E.- cluster, black and white keys.)

P.S.-
Fred, I love your daughters cats name! Can anyone guess
where my g.f. got her 4 pet chickens names from? They are
Anna, Clara, Hildegarde and Fanny ;^)

P.P.S.-
They are NOT allowed to play the piano.

Reply 12 offered by: Michele Hirt on 06-Sep-1998

Anna Magdalena Bach
Clara Schumann
Hildegarde of Bingen
Fanny Mendellsohn

Am I right?

Reply 13 offered by: Michele Hirt on 06-Sep-1998

BTW, clusters are used extensively in modern concert music as well as in some jazz styles. In modern concert music, they are usually notated as suggested above (top & bottom note written with "bar" thingy connecting them). This would be a nice feature for NWC to include in 2.x. Maybe also other modern musical notations as well....

I'm not sure how jazz notates the clusters, since it's mostly improv. They may not notate them at all, but let the performer "do his thing."

Reply 14 offered by: wow on 08-Sep-1998

2.x ? why not 1.6 ?
by te way this could be added to bowmarks font... ;-)

Reply 15 offered by: Sheldon on 08-Sep-1998

Michele, Right-O! :^>

Reply 16 offered by: Shannon W. Mack on 08-Sep-1998

I didn't mean for a simple question to degenerate into a discussion about the aesthetic value of tone clusters.

Reply 17 offered by: Michele Hirt on 09-Sep-1998

To Sheldon: Yay! At least my musical training wasn't for naught! The head of the Music History Department at the Conservatory I attended was a hard-core feminist & made sure we knew ALL about important women in music. Hildegard is probably my favorite - I love plainchant & to hear it in women's voices is wonderful. There is a music group that plays Hildegard's music - they're url is http://www.mattress.org/urban/sky.html
They played (or will play - not sure of the date) at Hildegard's 900th birthday celebration this year.

To Shannon: It shouldn't have degenerated at all. Clusters are a common device used in modern concert music & you had good reason to ask if they were support in NWC.

To wow: I wrote that before I knew the boxmarks font existed, but yes, they could be added to that. It'd make more sense for ALL of that stuff to be added to future versions of NWC. I said "2.x" because this would constitute a major revision (especially since the playback would have to support all of that stuff) & not just a "feature creeper." You only increment the ".x" when it's a minor modification - no major changes to the underlying functions or look of the software.

Reply 18 offered by: Michele Hirt on 09-Sep-1998

Excuse me - "*their* url" not "they're url"....

Reply 19 offered by: marsu (wow earlier) on 10-Sep-1998

Thanx for the URL. But I think the name is 'Hildegard _von_ Bingen'. Even in french :^P

I still insist for 1.x : I know NWC since the 1.1(0) version and a GREAT enhancement was lyrics. it was NOT 2.x but 1.2x version...
Normally small changes (bug fixes, ...) refer to a last char. : NWC 1.52a, Word 6.0c...

Personally I often use three numbers : release.version.revision, which is the same as release.version.bugfix[letter]

I'd agree with NWC 2.x version if it had a macro editor in it, for example... ;-)

NWCly yours,
                      Dominique

Reply 20 offered by: Michele Hirt on 18-Sep-1998

"von", "of" - It may be the same in French, but I'm American, so I can say "of" if I want to. ::teasing::

Anyway, I guess we just have a difference of opinion as to how big of an addition these changes would be. No big deal either way whether it's called 2.x or 1.6, just as long as the changes are considered & possibly implemented!

Michele

Reply 21 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Sep-1998

An interesting historical side-note: As Michelle pointed out, the "von" originally just meant "of" or "from," as in "Francis of Assisi" etc. But later, the "von" label was used to indicate members of the aristocracy.

In Dutch, "von" translates into "van" - and the Dutch never carried this into an aristocratic title. So Ludwig van Beethoven (literally, "from the root garden") used this to advantage... it was generally assumed that he was of "aristocratic blood" when he really wasn't. This little misunderstanding suited LvB's personality to a tee.... ;-)


#856: Translation from MusicTime De Luxe
Translation from MusicTime De Luxe

(856)

Submitted by: Pete Shaw on 02-Sep-1998

Anyone know if there's a translation program for my Music Time De Luxe .mus files?

Reply 1 offered by: Ken  on 02-Sep-1998

I have not found one (I have looked) so I have only been able to convert to MIDI and import them as such.

Reply 2 offered by: Jean-Christophe on 07-Apr-2000

I've read in a response you gave 2 years ago that you know how to convert a *.mus to a *.mid.

How did you do this conversion ?

Thanks a lot.

Reply 1 offered by: Ken on 02-Sep-1998

I have not found one (I have looked) so I have only been able to convert to MIDI and import them as such.


#857: Ending with Repeat Close
Ending with Repeat Close

(857)

Submitted by: Jim Lendvay on 02-Sep-1998

I'd like to end a piece with a Master Repeat Close.

How can I do this so that the final Section Close is not
there?

I end up with the repeat, then an empty measure prior to the
closing bar.

There HAS to be a better way. HHHEEEELLLLPPPPP!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 02-Sep-1998

This is one that I hope Eric will fix soon. Currently, the most elegant way I have used (and I needed to do SOMETHING, since I was publishing in a book) is to have a special ending, and do something slightly different on the second one (so that it looks like that's what you wanted all along ;) It has made my pieces more musical, though not as concise as I wanted.

Eric, please don't forget this little problem.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Sep-1998

Another thing you can try is to pad out that last quasi-bar with a whole bunch of text (a long string of underscores works well). Then fiddly with your staff sizes and spacings to make that last bar "orphan" itself out onto the last page. When you print, just don't print that last page!

If you have access to the newsgroup, check out the first message of the thread "Converting NWC files to PDF". There's an attachment which you can view on your Adobe Acrobat reader which demonstrates this technique.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Sep-1998

To briefly summarize previous traffic on this subject... See http://www.lyrics.com and/or http://www.lyrics.ch

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 03-Sep-1998

Doh! Linked to the wrong thread... Sorry.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 03-Sep-1998

This is an occasion (Fred's solution) where the oft requested optional page break would do the trick. Put it on your wish list!

Reply 6 offered by: Keith Markham on 03-Sep-1998

I needed this for a book, too. I got over the problem by exporting the finished music as a graphic from the page view (I used an WMF file in pagemaker 6.5) and then editing the graphic so that the last repeat was engineered to be the end of the final bar.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 04-Sep-1998

I needed this once, and did +/- as Fred N. (but don't have a last orphan page : it's just out of the printable zone).
Look at http://www.mygale.org/05/madmarsu/doeba.zip (once more)

HTH
      Dominique
P.S. Add this to the wish list :-)


#858: Note Groupings
Note Groupings

(858)

Submitted by: Shannon W. Mack on 03-Sep-1998

I sit possible to do note groupings larger than triplets such as quintuplets, etc.? If so, how?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 04-Sep-1998

Not at the moment, though it has been asked for.
One work around is to use appropriate amounts of duplets (or fours) and triplets. This won't give you an even five (or anything for that matter).

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Sep-1998

The following messages on this subject are still valid:

msg #52, msg #145, msg #419, msg #573, msg #744

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 04-Sep-1998

I've always had a wish that when there is 2 16th notes followed by a 16th note triplet, that they are all beamed together. At the moment the triplet beams seperately from the even 16th notes. Opinions differ on whether it is correct to do it this way or not, I've seen it printed both ways, but gee it would be nice to have the option. It would make some of my files a lot easier to read. (See my recent posting to the newsgroup).
Adam

Reply 4 offered by: Ken on 04-Sep-1998

I would like to see the sixteenth triplets beamed to an eighth or 2 sixteenth notes also. I have always found sight-reading easier when the music is divided by beats rather than by random rhythm combinations.


#859: exporting MIDI files
exporting MIDI files

(859)

Submitted by: Ellen Reed on 04-Sep-1998

Entering a melody into NWC is quite easy, as you know, and exporting it as a MIDI file couldn't be easier.
However, when I import that file into another program that handles MIDI files, I'm in for a shock. The melody would sound the same if played, but there have been some changes made.
For example, a quarter note has been turned into a dotted eighth with a 16th rest. A half note is now a dotted quarter with an eighth rest following it. This is not what I put in (note by note, not playing it in) and it's not what shows up in the .nwc files.

I am currently evaluating Noteworthy, and at this point, am not inclined to purchase it.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Sep-1998

The way other programs notate a MIDI performance is beyond the control of NWC. However, that said, if a program does not do a good job of minimizing rests, you might be able to help the situation. Try by changing to a legato style in NWC, thus minimizing the amount of time between notes that are played in a staff.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 04-Sep-1998

What you are seeing is Noteworthy "playing" the note as a non-legato note. If you want full length notes, use either the legato performance marking, or use the ";" key to place a phrase mark over selected notes.
Roughly (and I think I evaluated this more accuately months ago, but my memory ain't what it used to be)
Legato will hold down the note for 100%
Unmarked = 75%
Staccato = 50%
There should be a staccatissimo at 25% but there isn't
Tenuto = 100% as well, I think.

Looking at what you've said above, I think the only problem was your (perhaps reasonable) expectation that unmarked notes would be played legato.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Ellen Reed on 04-Sep-1998

Perhaps you're right. I rather expected the notes to come out as I put them in! I put in a quarter note, wanted a quarter note. Unreasonable?

BTW, this happened with at least two other programs, not just one.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 04-Sep-1998

Welcome to the world of midi sequencing. Wait till you see what sequencers (any of them) do to real-time performances...

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 04-Sep-1998

After that admittedly flippant little remark, I felt compelled to write something that might actually be useful in your situation.

All sequencers I'm familiar with allow you to set the note and rest resolution either before/during midi import (as NoteWorthy Composer), or subsequently. Careful choice of these parameters on a track-by-track basis can help immensely.

There are also often functions called "quantize" and "snap". Quantize lets you "smooth out" irregularities (as when playing in a piece in real time), and Snap causes the note-on time to "snap" to the nearest 1/4, 1/8, etc.

There is even a sequencer (Performer, only available for Mac the last I heard) that lets you quantize the notes as they appear on the score, without changing the quantization of the way the notes are sounded (allowing for a "human" quality while still giving readable score and/or piano roll views).

The solution I've personally arrived at is to have several programs, each of which has its own strengths and limitations, and is used as appropriate. It may very well be that somewhere, sometime there might be a single program that does it all, but I shudder to contemplate the complexity of such an animal. Even [one of the most popular programs] is too involved for my liking, I prefer to use [another fairly popular program] for sequencing, and NWC for scoring and quick demos.

Reply 6 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 04-Sep-1998

As a performer first, midi composer second, the actual performance of an un-ornamented note is played back correct in NWC. If any note doesn't have an ornament over it, it should be slightly detached from the first when played. The problem you are experiencing however are not the problem of Noteworthy, but more the program you are importing the midi file into. If you export a group of quarter notes from NWC, even NWC itself will not import the notes as they were exported. Very much a question of compromise between the midi playback and the visual accuracy of imported files.
Adam

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 08-Sep-1998

Ellen,
for simplicity sake use "Legato" style (menu Insert/Performance style : expression Legato (uncheck preserve space)).
I use it for EACH and EVERY piece of music, on each staff.
You can notice the difference by applying it on an existing score and play it afterwards --listen carefully for the quarter, halves,.. and you'll notice they are off earlier than written without that perf. style.
Or try Export+Import with NWC (both directions), it's obvious.

If only this could be hidden at printing time... Pleeeaaase, Eric ! :-)

P.S. Currently, only staccato and legato styles have a sound effect. Others are for the reader only --yet

Hope this helps

Dominique


#860: How to enlarge the printed score
How to enlarge the printed score

(860)

Submitted by: John Young on 04-Sep-1998

I'm having trouble with trying to print the music it is very small in size. How can I change it so i don't need two sets of eyes to see it. even in the print preview it's very small.
is there away I can enlarge the printed music and the print preview.
Thank You in advance
John Young

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 04-Sep-1998

Sure. Go to File -> Page Setup -> Options -> Staff Size. You can set it low (around 8) for truly microscopic scores, or up to, say, 30 if you want to publish using the "Mel Bay Big Note Method".

This usage of True Type Fonts is IMHO one of NWC's strongest points.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 04-Sep-1998

PS - In the Print Preview you can use the mouse buttons to zoon in/out. Left zooms in, right zooms out.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Sep-1998

See also: msg #536


#861: Midiscan. Any happy user?
Midiscan. Any happy user?

(861)

Submitted by: Bruno on 04-Sep-1998

Midiscan is a score -->scan --> midi program.
I bought the 2.5 version of Midiscan one year ago, having to prepare rehearshal tapes for many Bach chorals (that i did found on the web later on).
This program has such very strange behaviours, either in the first recognition phase when apparently identical graphical figures (like two identical notes on successive measures) are sometimes recognized, some times not.
It becomes very surprising when, as i convert the work to midi (second phase), parts of the job which are apparently correct on the screen, becomes unrecognizable when played.
You may encounter missing notes, missing measures, measures filled with rests and so on.
A part that bad job, this program appears as implementing the worth human interface i've ever been using.
It costs 250$ in france.
After a while, I decided to give up and to improve my speed entering music with Noteworthy.

I would be interested to share my impressions with others.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 04-Sep-1998

See msg #603, msg #555 and msg #485

Reply 2 offered by: Peter on 07-Sep-1998

I tried Midi Scan some weeks ago. Youre right, the user interface is a bit clumsy, but when you figured it out, it works. The strategy is to try every key combination in every situation :)
( for instance I figured out after a long time, that you can simply drag notes with the shift key, and there exist combinations for notes, rests, dots and so on, which I couldnt find in the help file)But anyway, note recognition is a very difficult task for a program to do, so you should not have to high expectations of a fully automatical recognition program. I think, the only way to work faster is to record the piece on a midi keyboard ( and quantize afterwards :) )
I never heard about another music recognition program. I think if you already spent the money, you should spent some more time with the program as well. Good Luck!

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 08-Sep-1998

Voir le msg #555, dernière réponse, pour voir capella-scan --très rapide!.
I also used MidiScan and find it rather slow.
a hint though : when exporting to midi, CHECK that the measure indication (3/4, C, ...) is correct.
Otherwise MidiScan will add many rests in the midi output.
HTH,
        MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Diane Bailey on 29-Aug-2000

I do not read music and find Midiscan (demo) to be of enormous help to me as a barbershop singer we have music which is in four part harmony.

Before using Midiscan I would write every note on the music sheet for all four parts and then record and play them separately with my one finger.

I recommend Midiscan to all those who cannot play an instrument, but have the basic knowledge of musical notes.

Could you let me know where in England I can purchase the full version? and if this allows you to play each individual part.

Thanks for coming to my rescue, I will be recommending Midiscan to my barbershop friends.

Regards

Diane

Reply 5 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 29-Aug-2000

I may be misunderstanding what you are saying but it would appear to me that NoteWorthy would suit your needs far better than MidiScan.

I find that midiscan needs much correction, particularly for the more complex music.

There is a cheaper shareware version called SharpEye but this also suffers from the need to rework all of the music once scanned.

I re-visit both addresses and download the demo versions regularly to see if the versions have improved to any extent.

You can find both of these products via a search engine.

Richard


#862: midi keyboard and awe64
midi keyboard and awe64

(862)

Submitted by: adriano dos santos on 04-Sep-1998

can I connect an external midi keyboard to awe64 without
a midi adapter?

if so, how do I do it?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 04-Sep-1998

msg #558 covered this thoroughly, although for a notebook as it turned out. It is likely that your AWE64 card came complete with a compatible connecting cable, my AWE 32 certainly did. If so, simply connect your keyboard MIDI socket to your joystick/MIDI port on the computer, set up NWC to recognise the MIDI interface (<Tools><Options><Midi/Record>)and that should do it. Otherwise (as they say) contact your supplier! (Or NWC Support)
Here's hoping, Peter

Reply 2 offered by: ken on 04-Sep-1998

I think you need a soundcard cable. My Awe64 didn't come with one. They are about $25.00 US most everywhere and you can occasionally find them for around $15.00.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 04-Sep-1998

I just climbed over my computer and fund that my AWE 64 uses a joystick adapter. I think my AWE 64 Gold came with the adapter, though.

A

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 04-Sep-1998

Same thing. The joystick connector is also used for midi I/O. As mentioned earlier, you just need the midi cable; most of them are actually a three-way "Y", with an extension for the joystick, plus midi in and midi out on 5-pin DIN connectors

Reply 5 offered by: Joseph Behrens on 22-Aug-2000

does anybody know where i can get pinout diagrams for the midi/gamejoystick port and midi io plugs? Furthermore, how to connect them? Id rather go to radioshack and get the parts to make my own cable.

Reply 6 offered by: Joseph Behrens on 22-Aug-2000

i found good stuff,
http://www.harmony-central.com/MIDI/sbmidi2.zip
if link goes down, <a href="http://listen.to/FrogSlayer">ME PAGE</a>

Reply 7 offered by: Joseph Behrens,, on 09-Feb-2001

Alright, i removed it from my site, its cleaner and easier to buy the cable.

if i find a better way of doing this stucff, ill post it


#863: guitar tabs + drum tracks
guitar tabs + drum tracks

(863)

Submitted by: Brad Gardiner on 05-Sep-1998

I am in year 11 and currently writing a composition in Noteworthy. I have a problem. I have a guitar which is just comping and I can't write tabs (those little slashes on the staff). Can anyone help me?

Also I need to include a drum part, but I can't do that either.

Also is there any way of inserting a swing rhythm thing at the top of the staff (two quavers = triplet crotchet + quaver)? Help would be greatly appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Michele Hirt on 06-Sep-1998

For the tabs - have you tried inserting the / symbol as straight text with "Preserve Width" unchecked?

(I haven't, but it just might work....)

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Sep-1998

Multiple text inserts in bars that contain no note or rest data will ultimately spill out of the right screen margin.
(I keep a bucket there to catch the droppings)!
What we need are rhythm markers that occupy time.

Brad - Reply and explain your drum problem - I have a program that may help (a bit).

Barry

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP


#865: "Bug" report
"Bug" report

(865)

Submitted by: Sheldon on 06-Sep-1998

It's not an NWC bug really, but it may be useful for some. Here is the long storey shortened. One day I decided to fire up my recently downloaded NWC program, and all of the note buttons had gone BLACK! They were barely readable! NWC was rendered virtually useless! So I (blah blah blah) deleted, reloaded,(blahhhh) re-downloaded (censored) (blah blah). Finally, about 3 months after this horror story started, a light came on! Could it be MS-Plus? I re-imported a new desktop theme, and ... , VOILA! NWC could be used again! In my travels since, I have noticed others running across problems after changing various desktop colours,fonts,etc. So if it happens to you, reset your colours to the defaults, or re-import a theme and it should be O.K. NWC is NOT a (censored) program after all!

Reply 1 offered by: Bill Gates on 08-Sep-1998

but MS-plus is maybe ?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Sep-1998

No, MS-plus is "definitely."


#866: Bar lines
Bar lines

(866)

Submitted by: John Young on 07-Sep-1998

I've notice in printing a sheet of music that the bar line before the clef sign is not closed. Is there's an adjustment that i don"t know about? It not a big deal but in NWC 1.50 it did close both ends of the staff. Now I'm useing NWC 1.52.
Thanks in advance
John

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Sep-1998

I'd prefer that too. I've tried putting a section open decorated barline at the beginning, but that still leaves a short "open" bit of staff.


#867: Automatic beaming tool doesn't work.
Automatic beaming tool doesn't work.

(867)

Submitted by: Hacer Eriskin on 08-Sep-1998

if i remember correctly, the version of my noteworthy
composer program is 1.51a. i always set the automatic beam
option but when i write the 8th notes (or another types of
notes which can be beamed) they are never beamed, look and laugh to me
and make me sick because i have to beam them manually every time.
do you any idea about my situation?

Reply 1 offered by: Brad Gardiner on 08-Sep-1998

try beaming after you have written everything - at the end.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 08-Sep-1998

As the menu says, it is not an option but a tool. Tools apply on stuff already present, not on what you've not entered yet.
The helptext (in the bottom line (status line) says "Automatically beams the [already existing] notes in the current staff". Do not forget to look at the inline help (F1) to have more details on any item.

HTH,
    MAD

P.S. Look also for "macro recorder" in the forum. You'll find useful information to gain time. (ex.: msg #665, msg #327, msg #145)


#868: Can I Get Beautiful Image of Score
Can I Get Beautiful Image of Score

(868)

Submitted by: Kaneko on 08-Sep-1998

Sorry, I cann't English very well.
I tried Copy on Preview.
But It is not beautiful on Drow Apllications.
Lines are not same thickness.
And picture Size is too small.
I want to send scores to my band member by bitmap
or other data.
How can I get beautiful scores as printing.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 08-Sep-1998

try to refer to msg #649, msg #167, msg #739 where this subject has been discussed.
Direct export to .bmp generates 3Mb files (highly compressible though), but better solution exist (try wmf)

This should solve your trouble.

Hope this helps,
  Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 08-Sep-1998

oops! msg #117, not msg #167. Sorry

Reply 3 offered by: johnti on 09-Sep-1998

But surely the export feature to bitmaps makes 1 bit images?

1 bit bitmaps are tiny.

What kind of bitmaps does it make?

Reply 4 offered by: Kaneko on 09-Sep-1998

Thank you for your Infomation, marsu.
I see that clipboard date is Note Worthy True Font data.
I'll try paste on MS-Word.(I cann't now.)

To johnti
They are 1bit bitmap files, I want to create.
One bit bitmap files are smaller than any other image files,
if it was compressed (.zip for examble).
But I Don't know how create bitmap files from Word Documents.
Anyone Knows ?

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 09-Sep-1998

If you select "bitmap" format from the NWC preview, you optain 1bit bitmap. I just tried, and got this result : Image is 4384x6414 , 1Bps incl. Colortable

Otherwise, from anywhere in windows (3.x, 95, NT), Alt+PrintScreen [PrintScreen respectively] puts a snapshot of the current window [whole screen resp.] in the clipboard. You can then paste it into PaintBrush or any other painting program, and save it as a b&w image.

Last thing about the .wmf export : you need to distribute the nwc15.ttf font along with your document (or am I wrong ?) to make your .doc viewable.

Hope this helps :^P

Reply 6 offered by: Kaneko on 09-Sep-1998

Thanks.

for 1st.
How did you got bitmap from the NWC preview ?

for 2nd.
I had tried Alt+PrintScreen, allready.
But, It requires me several times to get 1 page of score,
and I must synthesize these pictures.
There are other simple methods ?

for 3rd.
I don't know to export to .wmf files.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 10-Sep-1998

Have a look at msg #767 and msg #713 for earlier discussions in some depth. To get bitmaps and wmf files from preview, use the Copy button and follow on from there. (The 32-bit Version 1.52 now exports wmf files to disc.)


#869: Maximum Number of Staves
Maximum Number of Staves

(869)

Submitted by: Kaneko on 08-Sep-1998

I want to display or print over 32 staves.
How can I use over 32 staves ?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 08-Sep-1998

The limit is 255 (256?) staves.
But I doubt any printed score can have so many !
Try to separate your different instruments (more than 32 ???) into different groups, that you can hide/print separately or altogether.

Do not forget that with NWC, you don't have to take care for the layout. You create staves that have an unlimited length, and NWC takes care to display them correctly.

Except for the "50 Vocci Canon", I really wonder what for you'd need more than 32 though ? I'd like to know.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 08-Sep-1998

You can use over 32 staves, but can only print up to 32. (This used to cause a program crash, but I think Eric fixed it). When you think about it, 32 is probably more that can fit on a page, anyway.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Kaneko on 09-Sep-1998

Thanks, marsu and Andrew.
I'm Jazz Saxophone Player, not Professional.(in hobby)
But, I'll write Brass Band Scores.(Arrengment)
There are many instruments, 1 Picolo, 2 Flute, 2 Oboes,
3 Clarinets, 1 Eb Clarinet, 1 Alto Clarinet,
2 Bass Clarinets, 2 Fagots, 2 Alto Saxophones,
2 Tener Saxophones, 1 Britone Saxophones, 4 Horns,
3 Trumpets, 3 Trumbones, 1 Tuba, 1 Contra Bass,
and some Percussions.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 09-Sep-1998

Wow! that's what I call a BIG band ! Wish you all the best, guess it ain't easy to manage all this!

Reply 5 offered by: Byron Dickens on 19-Sep-1998

You will probably run out of paper at the bottom of the page. Either that, or you'll end up with some really tiny print that you can't read.

I just might try it myself, just to see what happens.

Reply 6 offered by: Ken Grace on 20-Sep-1998

Try printing on Legal size paper, 8.5 x 14 inches, which most printers can accommodate. You can get pretty close to the 32-stave limit with a readable font size.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 23-Sep-1998

I dunno where to find Legal size paper. Guess A3 would be even much better.


#870: how can i change the lead instrument?
how can i change the lead instrument?

(870)

Submitted by: hacer eriskin on 08-Sep-1998

hi everyone,
i know i'm asking a lot of questions, but I'm a pretty new noteworthy
user.
BTW, I use to write my own music on at least 4 scores and i want to change
the lead instrument (it set to piano as default) as well. is it
possible to do that?

Reply 1 offered by: Chris Coon on 08-Sep-1998

press F2 (or to staff, properties) and go to the midi tab. go to change instrument. Change it to whatever you like! Its also a good idea to label it on the general tab so that you don't forget what it was.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 08-Sep-1998

It is also possible to change it during the staff. Try Insert/Instrument Patch ("i" hot key).

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 08-Sep-1998

Or from the Staff menu, select Playback Instrument


#871: Print Preview Staff Lines are uneven...
Print Preview Staff Lines are uneven...

(871)

Submitted by: Paul on 08-Sep-1998

In Print Preview the staff lines reproduce unevenly. Some bleed together as one thick one. Changing resolution doesn't help. My computer is a 386 DX with a svga trident monitor card using vga monitor.
Also, when I sent a midi file to another computer using finale, the Key changed drastically on reconstruct.
If anyone knows about these events please reply.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 08-Sep-1998

This happens in many programs (MS Word, for example). Which resolutions did you use? Did zooming in resolve it?
Does it print okay regardless?

A


#872: New Web Site Layout
New Web Site Layout

(872)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 08-Sep-1998

I liked the new Web Page lay out , especially the site map which make it so much easier to get to different area. (The wish list springs to mind as an area that many people can't find !)

Well done

Richard

Reply 1 offered by: johnti on 09-Sep-1998

I don't like the frames to appear straight away. You could have a single opening page and people should be able to go to frames if they want to.

Of course... your website isn't as good as your software! (compliment)

Best Wishes,
Johnti

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 09-Sep-1998

Which frames are you talking about ? There is none, HTML speaking. There are only images on the left and top, afaik, and you can _not_load images by setting up your browser options properly (much more quicker browsing then, btw)

One good thing about this site, is that is still works with old browser. Thanks again for _real_ support ! :^P

MAD
P.S. I find that it's much more quicker, is it only the lack of lag or what ?

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 09-Sep-1998

Marsu's right. It's all done with tables.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Sep-1998

Thanks for noticing our changes. We work hard to maintain support for older generation web browsers, while improving your browsing experience at our site. As noted above, we do not use frames anywhere on our site. The boundary tables are used for navigation and context, hopefully making it easier to find your way around, and also recognize your current location in the site.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Crossley on 09-Sep-1998

Agree with everyone. The structure is even better. Only problem is that legibility suffers from using the quite dark grey background. The pages look a bit funereal. They were nice and bright before.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Sep-1998

Peter: The body of all pages uses your default browser settings. We do not set the colours in the main body (the boundaries do use black background with light text). Try changing your options if you prefer lighter backgrounds.

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Sep-1998

Eric and Beth - Hey! I don't know whether I like being referred to as an old web browser! ;-)
The site does look good - I like the Go To list on the home page.

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Sep-1998

Another note of appreciation for maintaining compatibility with older browsers. At the moment I'm using N4.05, but I also have N2.02 installed on this and another machine for its quicker response. Thank you many times!

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Sep-1998

The conversion of the forum over to the new format is now complete. For tips on how to best use the forum, take a few moments to review the help section contained in the forum index (the help link in the navigation bar will take you there).


#873: Note spacing
Note spacing

(873)

Submitted by: MaryAnn on 09-Sep-1998

I want to change the spacing of the notes so that I can affect the length of measures. How can I do this without changing the staff size? Anyone deal with this issue before? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 09-Sep-1998

MaryAnn,
You can refer to msg #729 and the link to doeba.zip I give there.
NWC currently has only two ways to calculate the length of measures ; check or uncheck "increase note length..." in File/PageSetip/Options tab to choose which seems the best for you.
Otherwise use item text containing spaces (refer to the link above, or msg #602).

Hope this helps.
P.S. you can also search on this site for "bar measures and space" :-)

    Dominique


#874: preview- staff lines mess up
preview- staff lines mess up

(874)

Submitted by: Paul  on 09-Sep-1998

Several staff lines are bleeding together... in the print preview.
Andrew,
The problem has nothing to do with Microsoft Word, but the preview itself. a few of the staff lines bleed together. They print the same way. I use 640x480. I tried windows standard vga driver. and then the trident for 800x600 with the same.
So... it remains a problem. Also I sent a midi file in the key of D to finale and it ended up with 5 sharps.!.!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 09-Sep-1998

Hmmm. Possibly a video driver problem (this is normally where these problems occur, even when it comes to printing, though it sounds pretty way-left-field to me...). I didn't mean to implicate MS Word except that if things are of too low "granularity", you just can't tell. I'm not sure I understand what you mean, then, when you say the lines bleed together. Can you do a screen capture, (PrintScreen button, in Win 95), strip it down to 16 colors and send me the gif file, so I can see what you mean?
wrt: the midi file, maybe you could zip up the NWC and send it. You really shouldn't have 5 sharps, and maybe it's Finale getting a little creative!

A

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Sep-1998

Could also be the printer driver - I've noticed I get different results with staff line spacings with different HP printer drivers - I am exporting .wmf files to Coreldraw - but I dont see why - it doesn't even seem logical.
With Finale - I'd say that was Finale's problem - I'm sure NWC exports the key signature in the conductor track in the correct MIDI format - you could try checking the Tools/Options/File Export as Track Signature option and see if that improves things.
Also is it possible that the staff sound transposition is active - the MIDI file generated is based on concert sound not the notes that appear on the staff and if the staff is transposed with the update sound option the staff key and MIDI output are unrelated.


#875: The forum is back online
The forum is back online

(875)

Submitted by: NWC-Support on 17-Sep-1998

The conversion of the forum over to the new format is now complete. For tips on how to best use the forum, take a few moments to review the help section contained in the forum index (the help link in the navigation bar will take you there). From there, you will learn how to:

- setup a cookie file so that the forum will remember your name and e-mail address

- embed hot links to other forum messages and replies

- embed hot links to other web site pages

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 18-Sep-1998

Wow! Windows all over the place! I guess it'll behave more consistently across more platforms, though.
I like the cookie feature that remembers name and e-mail address for replies (as you can see, I now _can_ be bothered to type my whole name!)
We now just need the cookies to remember which messages we've read, and a way of uploading attachment, and we'll have a complete news system. Having said that, I still like the "offlineness" of the newsgroup.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Sep-1998

Congrats on a job well done. You'll be please to know that NoteWorthy is now one of only three entries in my jealously guarded cookies.txt. (I set my browser to accept all cookies, but set the file attributes to r/o under normal conditions.)

The only improvement I could suggest is auto-wrap when entering replies into the text box. Or is that a function of my browser?

Andrew - good for you for being the first to discover the online status. I admire your loyalty and perserverance.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Sep-1998

In my experience, Internet Explorer word wraps, Netscape does not.

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 21-Sep-1998

You are right for Netscape: lines don't wrap, and we have
a scrollbar instead. Would it be possible to parameter the
number of columns (default 60), for instance the same way
we parameter our Name and E-mail in a cookie file ?
Of course, I ask this question to Eric...

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Sep-1998

Thanks for the feedback. As of now, message text will wrap for users of both Netscape Navigator and Microsoft Internet Explorer (to the extent that it is possible, they now should work the same).

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Sep-1998

Due to the repeated presence of multiple, duplicate forum submissions, we have now also added a detection mechanism designed to prevent this in the future. From now on, make sure you open a new submission form before posting a new message or reply to the forum. If you try to re-use the same form for multiple submissions, the subsequent attempts (after the first) will be disallowed.

Reply 7 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 22-Sep-1998

This is a very nice feature. Thank you very much !

Reply 8 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 22-Sep-1998

(test of the new feature)

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Sep-1998

Olivier: I hope your test was successful...

Reply 10 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 23-Sep-1998

Actually it was not successful, but it was not a good test. The window disappeared so quickly that I couldn't click twice. Then I clicked on "back", I got my message again, suppressed the old text and replaced it by a new one.
Maybe then your mechanism is smart enough for knowing that the messages are different.

Besides, about the suppression of the horizontal scrollbar in the edition window, it is ok. Thank you again.

Reply 11 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 23-Sep-1998

Actually it was not successful, but it was not a good test. The window disappeared so quickly that I couldn't click twice. Then I clicked on "back", I got my message again, suppressed the old text and replaced it by a new one.
Maybe then your mechanism is smart enough for knowing that the messages are different.

Besides, about the suppression of the horizontal scrollbar in the edition window, it is ok. Thank you again.

Reply 12 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 23-Sep-1998

The last test WAS a correct test: I clicked twice, and my message appeared twice...

Reply 13 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Sep-1998

We tell browsers and other caching servers not to cache the form responses, which is why often times going "Back" will give a new form. We do not stop you from typing or pasting the same message in more than once, we simply disallow two forms with the same uniqueness ID.

Reply 14 offered by: Batchman on 25-Sep-1998

The fact that you don't cache forum responses - or the forum index -
creates a slight inconvenience. When my list of items is longer than
the page, I have to scroll down to read the earliest ones. When I bit
BACK to return to the index, I expect to be where I was, But I'm not
where I was, because the forum index is regenerated and I have to
scroll down from the top again.

WIth the old forum I used to leave my mouse cursor where it was on
the forum index, use the hot key to go back, and then just click on
the mouse again to read the next post (the lines would scroll up one
at a time). Maybe they all fit on one page then.

If you're using cookies, maybe you can come up with a better mechanism
for remembering which replies I read than just relying on the history file.
The 'recent activity' option is great, but when I select a reply I like to
read the whole thread at once. So I'd like all the other "recent reply"
entries for that thread to be marked as "visited" when I go back. Instead, I have to select each reply for a given thread and go back, just to get my
browser to mark it visited. This is a pain.

- seb

Reply 15 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Sep-1998

The FORMS are the only pages that cannot be cached. The behaviour regarding when links are marked as "read" is browser dependent. Forum messages and the forum contents can, and are, cached by both major browsers. The actual instances where pages need to be reloaded are dependent on:

1 - When the file was last changed (the contents change often)

2 - The cache settings in your browser

3 - Whether your ISP has cached the page (although forum messages and contents files have a header that attempts to avoid this)

We have no plans to implement cookie tracking of read messages.

Reply 16 offered by: J on 28-Sep-1998

Browsing the forum:

The best way I have found is to open up your browser, and open the message you want to read into a NEW window. Then drag messages from your forum window into the other browser window to open and read. Then the location of where you are in the forum window remains constant. (providing that all other conditions remain in equilibrium)

Actually, I just want version 2.0 of Noteworthy Composer.

*smile*

Reply 17 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 29-Sep-1998

Hey !

I just tried that ! It's a good method.

Thanks 'J'

Yeah I want version 2.0 as well . Do you know something I don't ?

Reply 18 offered by: marsu on 02-Oct-1998

About getting back to where you were when changed of page :
In Netscape, Use Alt+Left Arrow (Explorer does it too now) and then space to scroll down screen by screen. It ain't hard to remember if you have 3 or 4 times to hit space.
MoreOver the last links you have folower are not the same color (if properly set up)...

Abount NWC next version : what about 1.60 ?
(If I told you what I expect to be in 2.0, you wouldn't beleive it... So step by step, please :-)

MAD

Reply 19 offered by: marsu on 02-Oct-1998

Sorry. Forgot one proposal (to Support) :
When clicking on a link could it be possible to create a new page as it's done when adding a new reply ?
But we need to know of this takes mmory/time on 486 CPUs ... Don't smile, they are stimm numerous. (I'm in ;-))


#876: Maximizing Active Screen
Maximizing Active Screen

(876)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 18-Sep-1998

Well, I looked in the help files, the FAQ, and the User Tips, and if I've missed it, I'm sorry.
When I open a song file the screen is about 1/2 page, so I double click on the title bar to maximize it.
Is there a setting in NWC that will open the song file window in a maximized position? It's not too hard to double click, but would be handy if it opened maximized.
(Andrew, I listen to your version of Toreador regularly, and love it.)
Thanks,
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Sep-1998

You cannot set a default for maximizing an editor window. However, if the current editor window is maximized, subsequent files that you open will also be initially maximized.

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 18-Sep-1998

OK, here's what I do. I open NWC. Open a song, maximize it and work on it. Then I close it and open another song. The editor screen is back to 1/2 size. It does not stay maximized.
The only way it will stay maximized for an entire session is if I never closed a file...if I simply left them all open until the end of the session and then closed them one by one at that time.
Is this what you mean?
Regards,
Gordon

Reply 3 offered by: Ken Mund on 18-Sep-1998

I find that I rarely maximize the screen unless I am working on a large score, but even then I often only have 3 or 4 staves showing at once from page set-up. This helps with measure numbers, etc.

Reply 4 offered by: Sue Morton on 20-Sep-1998

Hi NWC'ers,

I just added "save the current window sizing upon program exit" to the wish list -- I would like not only the "maximized" sizing to be remembered, but I would also like any size I make a window to be remembered the next time I want to open a song.

If you want maximized or other sizing options to be saved, please add your vote to the wishlist (which is easy to find, now! Thanx NWC Support). The more votes to the wishlist, the more likely we will get our wish granted...

Sue

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 23-Sep-1998

Gordon, you don't have to switch from one excess to the other.
Simply keep 1 window open (I often keep one with standard schemes opened, to quickly copy+paste), and you can also quit with Alt+F4 : you'll be prompted for each file not saved.

HTH
To support : cool feature, your cookie... I raely accept them, but this time I did.


#877: AWE 64 users only
AWE 64 users only

(877)

Submitted by: Drake Donahue on 19-Sep-1998

http://www.synthzone.com/sndcard.htm
A way around Creative Labs proprietary memory expansion for unreasonable prices for those interested in bigger/better soundfont.


#879: Articulations?
Articulations?

(879)

Submitted by: Byron Dickens on 19-Sep-1998

Is there a way I can notate articulations such as bowed tremelos and flutter tonguing?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Sep-1998

Barry Graham's "Boxmarks" font has some of these. I've found it invaluable in sprucing up my scores.

See msg #811. You can download the font from the NoteWorthy Newsgroup.

Reply 2 offered by: Byron Dickens on 21-Sep-1998

I can't seem to find the "boxmarks" font file. do I just not know where to look?

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 22-Sep-1998

Must be back a fair way by now.
Barry/Eric, could you add it to the user tips page?
That'd be a good place for it.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 22-Sep-1998

Aw spit! The other thing I wanted to say was that Byron, I've posted it to you.

A

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Sep-1998

Yes, please post the font in the user tips so those of us without newsgroup access can get it. Even better, add the useful font symbols onto the end of the Noteworthy font (including a space character!) so everyone can do this in a standard and portable way.

Reply 6 offered by: Byron Dickens on 23-Sep-1998

Well Andrew, now I need to figure out how to use the dang font file. I figured I'd post here rather than e- mailing you direct because there might be someone else out there like me who is only computer semi- literate.

Thanks again!

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 24-Sep-1998

Once you have acquired the boxfonts.ttf file,
1) in each file (and you may be able to set up a template to do this automatically, I haven't tried), in Page Setup | Fonts, assign boxfonts.ttf to one of the User fonts.
2) enter some text (X command) and specify the font to use as the user font you defined above
2a) to help enter the correct font, I often use the trusty old windows Character Map program, which shows an array of all of the characters
3) There is no number 3.
4) You may need to slightly adjust the sizes at step (1)
4a) If you change the note size, you will need to readjust the user font size, as they don't rescale automatically.

A


#880: Copied staff is off-pitch from original
Copied staff is off-pitch from original

(880)

Submitted by: Taylor Anderson (andersot@ugsolutions.com) on 19-Sep-1998

Newbie here --

When I add a blank staff to a piece and copy the clef, key
signature, midi assignment, time signature, and the first
few measures from another staff, the playback plays the new
staff horribly out of tune with the others, even though the
key signature, notes and midi assignment are identical to
the line above it. (I would expect to hear no difference
in the sound at that point.)

Any thoughts? What's the best way to copy a line down and
then start editing it?

Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 20-Sep-1998

Can't imagine how that is happening. Why not send me the NWC file and I'll investigate?

A

Reply 2 offered by: Note Master on 20-Sep-1998

You obviously need to learn what the crap you're
doing because it works fine when everyone else
does it.

Reply 3 offered by: Taylor Anderson (andersot@ugsolutions.com) on 21-Sep-1998

Thanks, "Note Master". That was really productive.

Reply 4 offered by: John Ford on 21-Sep-1998

Over time, I've read pretty much all the postings on this
forum, but may have missed a few. I have say, up until now,
this has been a very civilized forum. Experts and novices
alike have been free to post questions and receive answers
and help very quickly. We're all learning here and we're
all continually learning. None of us knows it all, and
we are all at different levels of abilities. Everyone can
learn from everyone else.

"Note Master" obviously has no time for people who don't
know the things HE (or SHE) already knows. I suspect he
only wants answers to his questions and when someone asks
something that seems intuitively obvious to him, then
he has a problem with that. But we are all learning this
software called NWC that we've come to love. There is no
reason to use language like "Note Master" used, just
because most of the other forums and newsgroups do it.
I think this forum is different and offers a lot of advice
for both novices and experts alike. No one should be
afraid of getting flamed or the "crap" beaten out of them
just because they ask a question. Even when the question
has been asked before, regular submitters are quick to
point the user to the posting number to answer the question;
however, it is usually in the form of "PLEASE see message
#xxx".

To Note Master - we're all in this together, this forum
was not set up exclusively to serve your needs. Please
check the language and attitude at the door and enjoy
the discourse and exchange of great information presented
in this forum.

I apologize for my long-windedness, but this posting really
got to me. A little civility and good humor make for a
much more enjoyable experience.

Thanks,

John Ford

Reply 5 offered by: John Ford on 21-Sep-1998

Over time, I've read pretty much all the postings on this
forum, but may have missed a few. I have say, up until now,
this has been a very civilized forum. Experts and novices
alike have been free to post questions and receive answers
and help very quickly. We're all learning here and we're
all continually learning. None of us knows it all, and
we are all at different levels of abilities. Everyone can
learn from everyone else.

"Note Master" obviously has no time for people who don't
know the things HE (or SHE) already knows. I suspect he
only wants answers to his questions and when someone asks
something that seems intuitively obvious to him, then
he has a problem with that. But we are all learning this
software called NWC that we've come to love. There is no
reason to use language like "Note Master" used, just
because most of the other forums and newsgroups do it.
I think this forum is different and offers a lot of advice
for both novices and experts alike. No one should be
afraid of getting flamed or the "crap" beaten out of them
just because they ask a question. Even when the question
has been asked before, regular submitters are quick to
point the user to the posting number to answer the question;
however, it is usually in the form of "PLEASE see message
#xxx".

To Note Master - we're all in this together, this forum
was not set up exclusively to serve your needs. Please
check the language and attitude at the door and enjoy
the discourse and exchange of great information presented
in this forum.

I apologize for my long-windedness, but this posting really
got to me. A little civility and good humor make for a
much more enjoyable experience.

Thanks,

John Ford

Reply 6 offered by: John Ford on 21-Sep-1998

Sorry about the double posting. I'll keep my fingers of the mouse next time.

Thanks,

John

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Sep-1998

Taylor sent me the offending file, and the offending staff was quickly identified as one that was inadvertently transposed (or actually not transposed when the others were). No big trouble.

A

Reply 8 offered by: Taylor Anderson (andersot@ugsolutions.com) on 21-Sep-1998

Thanks, Andrew.

Yeah, now that I think about it, I WAS playing with trasposition before on that song. I'll keep a loser eye on that in the future.

Presuming that this situation may very well arise again, is there a way that the transposition could be copied also?

Reply 9 offered by: Taylor Anderson (andersot@ugsolutions.com) on 21-Sep-1998

Thanks, Andrew.

Yeah, now that I think about it, I WAS playing with trasposition before on that song. I'll keep a loser eye on that in the future.

Presuming that this situation may very well arise again, is there a way that the transposition could be copied also?

Reply 10 offered by: Taylor Anderson (andersot@ugsolutions.com) on 21-Sep-1998

Oops. Looks like I did a "John Ford". :-) Sorry.

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Sep-1998

Keep in mind that copying staff notation does NOT copy the staff properties. Each staff can have its own MIDI channel, sound patch, volume, and transposition settings, which must be accounted for when copying. This is not unlike a pianist giving some music to a trumpet player. If neither individual accounts for the Bb trumpet variation, a duet between the two will sound incorrect. One would have to visually transpose their playing (or enter it into NWC and let it do the work of transposing the piece).

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 30-Sep-1998

One thing you can do is checking all at once, using "score review" window.
This can be done with the "R" key, or with menu Tools/Score review. It displays a summary of some important characteristics of the staves.

Hope this helps

P.S. To learn more quickly, use inline help, user tips, and offline forum (_really_ GREAT!). In the process of looking for what you need, you'll find many other useful information :-)

                            MAD aka Dominique


#881: Chord with note and rest of same duration?
Chord with note and rest of same duration?

(881)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 20-Sep-1998

Why can't I construct a chord with a note and a rest of the same duration? The help file just says that the rest MUST be a smaller duration than the note.
Is there a workaround for this?
I have a song in a music book with several chords composed of a quarter note and a quarter rest.
Thanks,
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Sep-1998

Yes, it's a bit of a nuisance, and yes, there's a workaround for it.

Click File --> Page Setup --> Fonts. Select "User 1" and click Modify. Select NWCV15 (NWC installed this when you set it up) and click OK.

You can now insert anything in the NWC master font into your score as text. Press X (or Insert --> Text), and select the User 1 font. If I remember correctly, the rests are all in the range of n, o, p, q (lower case).

You'll probably want to turn "preserve width" off so that the rest falls directly under (or over, depending on your selected staff setting) the note it's associated with.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Sep-1998

FWIW: I can't say how much I am beginning to hate using NWCV15.TTF as a text font! The font size is so small, and spaces are hard to come by...

Eric, if you add things to the font (and thus create an NWCV16) please scale the font up in size so it's a bit easier to place.

A

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Sep-1998

We have no plans to change the scaling of the font. The fact is that the scaling is necessary, as the larget font characters (clefs) necessitate the disparity in size between the largest and smallest character. We have chosen other settings over time to work around buggy display drivers that take issue with this kind of font, and do not plan on messing with it (for fear of breaking some earlier work arounds).

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Sep-1998

Okay, then I'd like to suggest a souped-up boxmarks.ttf (with everything we need, including full notes with tails in both directions) be shipped with NWC.

A


#882: Multiplr bar rests
Multiplr bar rests

(882)

Submitted by: David Sheppard on 21-Sep-1998

I would like to know if Noteworthy currently supports the use of multiple bars rests. If not does anybody know when this option will be available. I am a heavy user of NWC but would dearly like to see this option included in a future update.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Sep-1998

In short, nom multi bar rests are not supported by NWC, but see earlier discussions about how to your boxmarks.ttf to fool the reader into thinking they are seeing the real thing!

Eric normally says "we don't announce stuff until we are sure it'll be in the next release..." so we don't know when it'll be in, but I hope to hell that Eric's considering it...

A


#884: MIDI Controllers
MIDI Controllers

(884)

Submitted by: Chris Coon on 21-Sep-1998

Is there any way, using NWC or any (freeware) program to add Specific MIDI controllers (specifically chorus and reverbe) to a midi or nwc file. (Need to add it to midi file to make it sound good when rendered from a midi file to a wav file) I'm really talking any possible way in the whole world (even would accept hexadecimal editing if someone knew what to change)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Sep-1998

Most midi card producers send some sort of midi processor along with the card. Most will do what you require. See what you've got.

Also, check the "back issues" (off-line version) of this forum and the newsgroup, as someone posted a midi-text-midi converter somewhile back.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Sep-1998

Yes, go to ftp://ftp.cs.ruu.nl/pub/MIDI/PROGRAMS/MSDOS/ and download mf2t.zip

This zipfile contains both mf2t.exe (midi-file to text) and t2mf (text to midi-file) along with instructions. A good default usage is:

mf2t -mntv [source.mid] [dest.txt]

I use it lots, for exactly that kind of "fine tuning".

Reply 3 offered by: Gene McGough on 22-Sep-1998

There are several utilities at a site called Günter Nagler's midi utilities http://www2.iicm.edu/Cpub
The files for this task are midi2txt.zip and txt2midi.zip. Wouldn't be surprised if these are the same ones Fred mentioned.
Chris probably knows, but others may not, that after conversion of midi to text, you can use a text editor to make changes where you know what you are doing. Finish up by converting the edited text file back to midi.

Gene

Reply 4 offered by: Chris Coon on 22-Sep-1998

Thanks a lot : )

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Sep-1998

No, these aren't the same program. Guenter's programs seem to have a couple additional options.

What a cool site! There's a whole whack of midi utilities, ideal for consummate midi hackers.

Thanks for the lead!

Reply 6 offered by: Gene McGough on 22-Sep-1998

Fred or anyone,

Has anybody come up with a utility that will let you directly edit the embedded title text in a midi file.
The midi2txt | edit | txt2midi sequence in DOS is a bit much.

Most of Günter's utilities require command line parameters, which is messy because DOS can't handle long filenames. What I'm trying to say is that my typing skills are not all that good.

Gene

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Sep-1998

Umm.. not that I can think of. You're looking for a point-and-click GUI to do this. You could possibly automate the procedure somewhat by using macros, but the added complexity might not be worth it.

NWC support - maybe there's a market for such a beastie for Windows???


#885: Strange mark in score
Strange mark in score

(885)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 22-Sep-1998

I'm copying a song from a music book into NWC, and I've run across a strange mark in the score. There's a mark that looks like a fat X beside one of the notes, in the same position where one would find naturals, sharps, and flats. The Time is 4/4 and the Key is 4 sharps.
Could someone tell me what this mark means?
Thanks,
Gordon Isbell

Reply 1 offered by: Paul on 22-Sep-1998

That's probably a double sharp accidental. The button for it is next to the sharp accidental button in the tool bar.

Reply 2 offered by: Byron Dickens on 22-Sep-1998

Definitely a double sharp.
One occasionally runs accross double flats, as well; they look like two flats one right after another.

Reply 3 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 23-Sep-1998

Thanks, folks. I should have been able to figure that out, since the button is right next to the sharp button. But, it looked so strange and I had never seen it in a score before.
Thanks again.
Gordon

Reply 4 offered by: Warren Barnett on 16-Oct-1998

It's not the thing that you usually see. It's usually only used when the key you are in contains flats, and you want to flatten a note which is already flat because of the key signature.


#886: Audit Accidentals Tool
Audit Accidentals Tool

(886)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 23-Sep-1998

Hi NWC'ers,

I make good use of the Audit tools available, particularly the "audit accidentals" tool.

However, the tool removes all but one accidental from equivalent notes in the measure -- e.g. if you have two notes played sequentially, one octave apart (like Eb), the flat symbol is removed from the 2nd note, even though most music (that I've seen) places the accidental on all notes in the measure (am I making sense?). I believe the NWC help file explains that the tool will do this (along with removing hint accidentals in the next measure), but I'd like to know why...? It seems like we would want NWC to leave all those marks there in the printed score.

The tool is great, takes care of some of my keying problems, but then I have to go back and fix the octaves, as well as add back in the hint accidentals.

Reply 1 offered by: Jubal Baca on 23-Sep-1998

Hi Sue: For security, always put it into a mearures
all the accidental notes with your simbol. By.. by

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Sep-1998

The way I was taught way back a long time ago, only the first occurrence of an accidental was written. It was assumed that the change remained throughout the entire bar.

On occasion, to emphasize that an accidental is in effect, the accidental might be repeated in parentheses as a "courtesy" to the player. As a rule, though, only the first occurrence is traditionally indicated.

However, I've recently seen several scores where every occurrence is notated. Which is correct? I suppose it's up to personal taste.

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 23-Sep-1998

Fred,
Certainly, an accidental propagates to all subsequent instances of the same note within the bar. However, I'm not sure what the strict technical answer is for notes with the same name in different octaves. Personally, I prefer each octave to be treated independently. I've got a few examples of music where the octave has an implied accidental (courtesy of this "feature" of Noteworthy) and I get it wrong every time I play them! (until I hand lettered the accidental).

It's definitely not "incorrect" to write redundant accidentals, so I'd say to do whatever makes the music easiest to read. Maybe the audit accidental tool needs an option to leave octaves alone? (just like it needs a way to select the preferred enharmonic spelling!).

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Sep-1998

As John points out, there is a problem with accidentals in NWC, as they work with notes that appear in different octaves in a measure. When two notes of the same pitch appear in different octaves, NWC assumes the same accidental for both notes, unless each specifically contains the accidental that should be used. This is not technically accurate for sheet music, and we are working on an improvement in NWC to help this (stay tuned).

Reply 5 offered by: Sue Morton on 24-Sep-1998

Hi All,

Thanks everyone (and NWC-support!), for info and encourgement on this issue. I must agree with John, I think the octave accidentals are very readable, and I too have often played the octave notes wrong without the added mark!

The "hint" accidentals written at the next measure are also very helpful and readable and the audit tool removes these as well. Yes, the "rules" say the accidental is not in effect in the next measure unless written in again, but the "hint" marks are so very helpful and readable. I hope NWC-support will consider leaving these alone when the audit tool is used.

Thanks for a great forum, and a great product. NWC gets better and better all the time!

Sue

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Sep-1998

Meanwhile, you can do "hint" accidentals by inserting them as text. Set up your User 1 font for NWCV15, and you can then insert anything in the NWC font wherever you like, without having the audit routines mess with them.

Reply 7 offered by: Sue Morton on 24-Sep-1998

What a good idea, Fred, that is a nice workaround for the time being. BTW, I found your guitar arrangement of Adagio Cantabile at the Sheet Music Archive, great job!

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Sep-1998

Thanks, Sue. It's nice to know that other people hang out at some of my favourite sites.

The sysop of GMD posted this right away, no questions asked. For this I have to give credit to NWC (and its illustrious programmer). The resulting .ps files look anywhere as good as the files created using the (*much* more cumbersome, I've heard) MusiTex for Unix.

Reply 9 offered by: yonatan lehman on 03-Nov-1998

Talking of accidentals - I think I see a bug here.
When I tie a note with an accidental into the next bar
I get a "stuck" note.

When I explicitly mark the next note (in my case qith
a "natural") the natural does NOT show up in the text
but i get a "stuck" note from that point onwards.

1) the stuck note is a definate bug
2) should a tie extend the natural ? I think someone
above implied not - I think NWC does - but it doesn't show
up on the screen

Reply 10 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Nov-1998

See the help file Common Questions section, as well as msg #39, msg #128, msg #442, msg #479, and msg #854.

Reply 11 offered by: Brian T. Hill on 09-Nov-1998

I've seen that as well. When you have an accidental tied across a measure, NWC does not change pitch at the bar line. That seems correct. However, internally, NWC seems to know that the note in the second measure does not have the accidental applied (the sharp or flat is not indicated on the toolbar when you select the note). During playback, NWC does not stop the note. It just keeps playing. I think this is a bug, but you can work around it by explicitly marking the sharp or flat on the second note (it won't print, but you can see it on the toolbar).


#887: Noteworthy
Noteworthy

(887)

Submitted by: johnti on 25-Sep-1998

HI there, I've been so busy over the last few months that I haven't been keeping up with Noteworthy. Have they been adding new features like drum scores and chord separation, etc yet?

gotta smile 'n swing,
johnti.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Sep-1998

See our web site.


#889: Groupings
Groupings

(889)

Submitted by: Shannon W. Mack on 26-Sep-1998

How do I make a group of notes larger than a triplet (eg. quintuplet, sextuplet, etc.)?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 26-Sep-1998

What you have to do is wait for a future version of Notewothy and maybe Eric will have included these .

Seriously though, only triplets are available at the moment.

If you look through the Forum (or was it the newsgroup) you will find that users have attempted to get quintuplets etc by all sorts of clever mathematical means.

But I reckon that you have just got to wait !!

Richars

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Sep-1998

See also: msg #52, msg #185, msg #419, msg #573, msg #744, msg #858


#893: slurs
slurs

(893)

Submitted by: carolyn conyers on 28-Sep-1998

It's great to have a simple way to add slurs. BUT - sometimes NWC puts the slur under the notes, rather than on top, thereby conflicting with lyrics or score directions. Is there any way to direct the slur to be on top (or on bottom, as the case may be)? Or is this another Wish List?

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 28-Sep-1998

Change the stem direction of the first note, even if it
has no stem (whole note). This should work.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 29-Sep-1998

It's probably quite difficult to do, but it would be nice if slurs could slope diagonally as well. They can be a bit ugly if drawn horizontally over say a glissando.

Reply 3 offered by: carolyn conyers on 29-Sep-1998

To Olivier: Yes, the slur does change direction if one changes stems on the first note. However, this is not an acceptable workaround, if one is preparing a professional looking score and the stems are obviously wrong. I even tried changing the stems, placing the slur, then changing the stems back to correct alignment - hoping to fool NWC. Didn't work. The slur goes with the stem. So, I will add something to the Wish List about slur flexibility. Thanks for the reply. Perhaps it will work on some occasions.


#894: Printing problems
Printing problems

(894)

Submitted by: Lisa Michnick on 28-Sep-1998

My score prints correctly except that notes are expressed with alphabetic characters. Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Sep-1998

Check to see that Windows recognizes the NWC font as an available font. Go to Control Panel --> Fonts, you should see NWCV15 listed. If not, use Add Fonts to make NWCV15 available to Windows. The install program should have done this already, if this doesn't work try un-installing / re-installing NoteWorthy Composer.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Sep-1998

If your editor display is correct, then you may have a printer bug, possibly in the printer driver. The first step would be to contact the manufacturer and try to get an updated print driver (try their web site, if they have one). You may also want to update your display driver, as this also routinely causes problems when printing.

See also: msg #97, msg #123, msg #676, msg #681, msg #721, msg #753

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Sep-1998

NWC Support, you're amazing. How do you keep track of all those message numbers? (Rhetorical question.. no need to reply :-)

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 29-Sep-1998

I had this problem when I loaded several songs into memory then tried to print them in quick succession. I solved it by loading and printing one song at a time.

Reply 5 offered by: Lisa Michnick on 29-Sep-1998

I reinstalled my printer driver from my Windows 95 CD and all is well!!!! Thanks for the help everyone.


#895: Pitch bend
Pitch bend

(895)

Submitted by: Sterghios on 30-Sep-1998

Me daft
Me no understand computers
me see numbers when want pitch bend
Could somebody please explain to me in plain MUSICAL terms what the heck those numbers represent?
Can't I just ask the poor thing to pitch bend from A to A flat or to B?
Not in darned numbers?
And if not, what is the numeric value that represents bending of a semitone (in either direction)?

Thanx

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Sep-1998

You no daft. Computers daft.

Midi controllers like pitch bend are expressed as numbers between 0 and 16383, or put another way (as NWC does) between -8191 and +8192.

The default pitch-bend definition for midi is +/- one whole tone (two semitones). So a semitone is a change of 4096 in the pitch bend parameter. Or, one cent (hundredth of a semitone) is a change of about 41.

This does permit very fine tuning (perhaps much finer than anyone can hear).

Note also however that most synths allow you to change the pitch-bend range. I have avoided doing this myself, just to be sure that my pitch-bends sound the same on any midi-compatible synthesizer.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Sep-1998

Correction. *Me* daft.

The pitch bend range is +/- one *whole* tone, or a total swing of four semitones. So a semitone is a change of 2048, not 4096 as stated in my last message.

So to use your example, to pitch-bend from A to Ab, use -2048; from A to B use +4096.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 30-Sep-1998

See also: msg #155, msg #190, msg #460


#896: Inputting Notes From Piano Keyboard
Inputting Notes From Piano Keyboard

(896)

Submitted by: Kelly Walter on 30-Sep-1998

I have installed NoteWorthy on a computer with a Sound Blaster 16 sound card. I connected this system to my Yamaha CLP-20. I can play sample files on the Yamaha. I can also create songs from the computer keyboard and play them on the Yamaha. But when I try to input notes from the Yamaha in either step time or record I get nothing.

What am I missing? I've read the manual a dozen times and read all the old forum messages but nothing seems to fix it.

Do I need to do something with the sound driver or MIDI Mapper in Windows?

Any suggestions would be most helpful.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 30-Sep-1998

Kelly,

Check the Tools / Options dialogue.

Under the Record Tab your settings should be:-

Input Device - SB16 Midi In (220) or some other address recognized by your card (yours might be 330).

Since you have tried to record in step-time without success either the input device is set incorrectly or address is incorrect.
If you can produce a sound from the keyboard through the soundcard the connections are OK and recording should then work.
If you turn off the sound of your keyboard can you hear the notes through the sound card speakers if you play without recording?
I assume that your MIDI cable is connected correctly to the MIDI IN / MIDI OUT ports.

Apart from that I cant help.
Perhaps someone else has had difficulty with this model keyboard.

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 01-Oct-1998

Your MIDI cables are marked In and Out. Remember, the cable marked IN goes into the Keyboard port marked OUT. I found this confusing when I first started with MIDI.
Gordon

Reply 3 offered by: yonatan lehman on 03-Nov-1998

On my Yamaha (clavonova p100) I need to press the
"midi" button to get it send the midi.
BTW - i didn't find the option useful - in input mode
getting different length notes is difficult,
in record modes - i don't play accurate enough to
get it right. I find using the keyboard (numeric pad)
best.

Reply 4 offered by: David Lake on 08-Nov-1998

I have similar problems with my Yamaha PSR 420.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Nov-1998

I am not sure what you mean by "similar problems", but if you are having trouble getting the record feature or step time entry feature to work, it is usually caused by one of the following:

- an improperly connected MIDI cable (input connected to input, rather than output for example)

- a faulty MIDI cable (try it on other equipment to test it out)

- a misconfigured sound card on the computer (sometimes the wrong drivers are installed, or a device conflict prevents the MIDI input to work correctly)

- a faulty MIDI out port on the keyboard (try it with other equipment to see if that is the problem)

See also: msg #128, msg #138, msg #141, msg #150, msg #174, msg #184, msg #292, msg #329, msg #392, msg #517, msg #558, msg #853

Reply 6 offered by: drake donahue on 08-Nov-1998

Asking from a position of total ignorance-
If one is playing in from a touch sensitive keyboard on a standalone synthesizer, would it not be likely that the attack-decay-sustain characteristics of the player and the synthesizer would interact to produce note on/off commands that NWC import is reproducing literally and pretty accurately?
If the synth supports perhaps selecting a wind vice piano or string would give better results. The instrument can be changed again in nwc after the notes are delivered.


#897: Musical truncation at end of MIDI files
Musical truncation at end of MIDI files

(897)

Submitted by: John Marchington on 01-Oct-1998

I've looked through previous forum correspondence and could not find any reference to either problem mentioned below, so wonder whether others have noticed them.

Firstly, I find that the final note of an exported NWC file is clipped short when the resultant MIDI file is played back. This occurs whether NoteWorthy Player, the Windows Media Player or the default MIDI player is employed for the playback. This effect is especially noticeable when the final note is tied over other bars and is annoying. The problem does not occur in NoteWorthy Composer, only in coverted MIDI files. I though that adding a number of bars of rests to the ends of the pieces might have solved the problem but that didn't make any difference at all. I also tried adding extra bars of semibreves in an additonal stave, then muting the stave, but that didn't help either.

I have also noticed that files exported to MIDI and then imported back to NWC seem to lose their dynamic references, both notation-wise and, more importantly, as sound. An end of one of my pieces has decreasing dynamics (mf, followed by mp, and finally p) but when played back as a re-converted NWC file, it all sounds at one dynamic level throughout.

I'm using Win95, NWC 1.52a and NWP 1.52 and have an AWE64 sound card. I don't have any problems with NWC in this direction.

Any suggestions for cures to the above problems would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Oct-1998

I cannot reproduce the problem you describe with play back of exported songs. I suspect that you are either using a sound patch that sustains notes after they shut off, or you have a sustain pedal effect on when the song stops playing. In both of these cases, results could be different in MIDI players, including NWP, since they release the MIDI Mapper device as soon as play is concluded (thus turning off all notes). If you set the MIDI Device to be used "While Playing" in Tools, Options, MIDI, you should get a similar effect in NWC.

NWC import does not take notice of dynamic changes. These have to be added in by hand. See also: msg #170, msg #533, msg #610, msg #774

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Oct-1998

I haven't noticed the truncated notes, but I'll see if I can duplicate the problem.

Regarding dynamics, this was an issue for me also when I started using NWC. The fact is that all dynamics (note velocity values, as well as other controllers) are stripped on midi import.

This doesn't happen with NW Player, since it actually plays the original midi file. NWC, however, uses the novel approach of controlling dynamics directly by the insertion of dynamics instructions (pp, p, mf, etc.) as well as dynamic variances (cresc., decresc. etc.). This is wonderful for compostion/scoring, but would be *very* difficult, I'm sure, to implement on an import of an arbitrary file. It would have to evaluate the dynamics of the imput file, which could even have large variances from note to note (as usually occurs when played in from a keyboard.) How it would decide how many dynamics and dynamics marking to insert... I have no idea how one would program for that.

That being said, I also wish for maintainance of imported dynamics and controllers, even if they are not displayed in the resulting score.

F

Reply 3 offered by: John Marchington on 02-Oct-1998

Thanks for the replies so far received. I am using a patch at the end of the piece causing the most trouble, but it's being used merely to provide a specific sound, not to extend note values. I'm not using any pedal effects either. Essentially, the first bar contains a minim (and other notes/rests to bring the bar up to 4/4 time) and that is tied to a semibreve in the following bar which is being terminated too early.

There are times when the problem doesn't exist at all.

I thank you also for confirming the absence of dynamic shadings after re-importation to NWC.

Reply 4 offered by: John Marchington on 02-Oct-1998

Thanks for the replies so far. I've just tried changing the port setting to 'While Playing' as suggested by NoteWorthy Support and it does, indeed, produce the same result in NWC. (My usual port setting is 'Always'). Does that mean that I will have to put up with the problem and that there is no cure?

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Oct-1998

Try adding some rests to the end of your song, followed by a single note with the volume set down to 1. This will force playback to extend longer, thus completing whatever sound effect you are using.

Reply 6 offered by: John Marchington on 03-Oct-1998

The last reply from NWC Support put me in an experimental mood and I think I now have the perfect solution to the problem. The following describes the steps I adopted after some experimentation.

(a) I added another bar to each of the staves (only two in the test piece I modified) and inserted a semibreve in each so that the note was the same as the final one(s) already in the piece. These new notes were not tied to the previous one(s) in their respective staves.
(b) I pressed D to bring up the Dynamics window and set the following parameters:-
Expression: Pianissimo(ppp)
Note Velocity: 0
MIDI Volume: 0
Both Override Default boxes were then checked after setting the above parameters.

ppp(0,0) then appeared next to the new notes.

Even through headphones I am unable to hear any 'new' note, yet the previous notes I want to hear sound right to the end. If the Override Default boxes are not checked, the Note Velocity and MIDI Volume settings revert to the default ones and the added notes can be heard, albeit at a very low level.

If it is possible for problems to be experienced with the above method, please let me know. I have so far only experimented with the one piece, and I'm obviously delighted with the result.

Thanks to those who assisted.

Reply 7 offered by: John Marchington on 03-Oct-1998

It's easier than I thought. Further experimentation appears to indicate that it's only necessary to 'doctor' one stave, leaving all others as they are.

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-May-1999

You can also experience this phenomenon if you use a fermata delay on the last note of your song. Fermata delays are not supported by in MIDI files, so no such delay will exist in an exported MIDI file. If you still want such a delay, you will have to approximate it using either an MPC or insert hidden tempo changes around the note. Make sure that you zero out the fermata delay if you employ this technique.

See also: msg #1047

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 12-May-1999

Further to John's fix, maybe the right place to put this would be either in the "conductor" track (if you have one) or an "author" track.
An "author" track is a track (staff) that has no notes, but has a meaningful staff name giving things like the piece's name, transcriber's name and e-mail address.
(You'll normally need three tracks for that).
It is a standard used by the Classical Midi Archives and a few other repositories to help keep track of authorship.
Of course we don't need such signatures in NWC files, as Eric has created special fields for that.
(As an aside: Eric, is there a way of exporting and importig that info to/fro MIDI files?)

A

Reply 10 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-May-1999

Looks like we resurrected this thread...I added content to the thread because we are directing some support questions to this thread.

Andrew, I am not clear on what you mean by "that info" in your question. NWC automatically creates a "conductor track" when exporting to a "Type 1" MIDI file (it is required by the spec). The basic author text is exported to the MIDI file, and NWC does attempt to recreate it on import.


#898: Help: Splitting Piano Parts at mC
Help: Splitting Piano Parts at mC

(898)

Submitted by: J on 01-Oct-1998

I've tried all I can, read the help (I'm sorry it didn't help), tried all different options/settings with the import tab but I can't do it.

I want to split a piano track at middle C, where notes above mC go in the treble clef, and the notes mC and below go in a bass clef.

I've tried editing the track import settings, C0 to C3 in the top track, and C3# to C10 in the top track, and it doesn't work. It either doesn't split it in the right place or it sticks it all on the top staff with a bass clef.

I need help; I admit I'm a bit stupid but I don't ask for much.

Help me please! (I need to split it there because I am trying to learn to read my music via staves)

I'm using NT4 and 32bit ver 1.50.

J.

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 02-Oct-1998

J,
You're nearly there, you've just got the coding wrong. C0 is the lowest note and G10 the highest (don't ask me why the menus are upside down! ;-). Middle C is C5. So, your top staff should be C5 through G10 and your bottom staff should be C0 through B4. At step 3 in the import wizard edit the starting entry with the upper range, then add a new entry and fill in the lower range.
This will put middle C and above into the top staff and notes below middle C into the bottom staff. Note that you can overlap the ranges so some notes are placed in both staves.

Hope this helps...

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Oct-1998

It sounds like the MIDI material that you are importing may all be between C0 and C3, thus causing the behaviour that you describe. There are two things to try:

1 - Decrease the "Maximum single track chord size" to a lower number

2 - Try a different split point

If you can get NWC to split your track using step number 1, then you can look at the resulting import instruction to determine the precise picth range that appears in the MIDI track. Once you know this, you can create different import instructions for the two staves that you want to create from the single track. If they both appear in bass clef, then you can change one of them to treble using the procedure in msg #4.

See also: msg #328, msg #735, msg #763, msg #766

Reply 3 offered by: J on 06-Oct-1998

Thankyou! It worked PERFECTLY!


#899: how do I (text)
how do I (text)

(899)

Submitted by: Paul on 02-Oct-1998

Two things are unclear.

How do I mark chord fingerings for violin double stops with the text feature.(one number over another) Alot of times the upper number doesn't align with the bottom one.
i.e. 2 (over) 1

Also with perserve width off, the screen shows alignment of fingerings with notes but print preview is different. Particularly if I use spaces between numbers in a string, as opposed to separate operations for each number...
Thanks PB
1(sp)(sp)2(sp)(sp)(sp)2

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Oct-1998

Even with "Preserve Width" off, the numbers won't line up on the screen. If they did, it would be impossible to select one or the other to edit/delete it later by selecting the little diamond "handle".

However, when you print (or use Print Preview), such numbers will indeed line up.

At first you'll be doing a lot of preview checking, until you get the hang of what does what. Even then, it's best to thoroughly preview your finished material before committing it to print.

Changing font sizes will also cause changes in your inserted text locations, so settle on an acceptable font size setting early on in your project.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Oct-1998

Forgot to address the space issue. You'll find that you have to put a lot more spaces in than it seems you need. This is presumably because in proportional fonts (e.g. arial, TNR, etc. - almost everything except Courier) the spaces are very narrow compared to the widths of most printable characters.

Again, liberal use of Print Preview will help you get the results you need. And again, it gets easier after you've done it for awhile.


#900: NWC Command Reference
NWC Command Reference

(900)

Submitted by: Barry Graham on 05-Oct-1998

Over the next few weeks I will be posting sections of a command reference for NoteWorthy Composer on my web site.
The reference is in MS publish format on double-sided A4 size pages.

The first two sections of the command reference may be downloaded now at:- http://members.tripod.com/~melbmusic/bits.htm

The sections are:
Part 1 - Introduction (nwc1.zip 76kb)
Part 2 - Command and File Menu (nwc2.zip 97kb)

Also available for download:
Boxmarks.zip and Drumkit.zip

Thanks to the support team at NoteWorthy Artware for granting permission to post the reference.

Barry Graham
Melbourne, Australia
bargrah@hotmail.com
http://members.tripod.com/~melbmusic/bits.htm

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Oct-1998

Command Reference - MS Publish Format

Part 3 - Edit and View Menus - NWC3.zip 8 pages 38k.
Now posted at http://members.tripod.com/~melbmusic/bits.htm

Previously posted:
Part 1 - Introduction NWC1.zip 12 pages 78k.
Part 2 - Control and File Menus - NWC2.zip 16 pages 98k.

Next postings (soon):
Part 4 - Staff and Insert Menus - around 20 pages.
Part 5 - Notes and Tools Menus - around 18 pages


#901: inporting MIDI
inporting MIDI

(901)

Submitted by: Monica Busso on 06-Oct-1998

I've problems inporting MIDI files. If I save as MIDI the sample file "Nowel.nwc" and I inport it I can't get the same staffs. Chords aren't the same.
How can I solve this?

Thanks

Monica

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Oct-1998

Start at msg #897 and follow the "see also" links for details in import.

Reply 2 offered by: Monica Busso on 06-Oct-1998

Thank you for your reply! I read the messages but I still have a question: is there a way to import correctly chords having notes with different duration?

Thanks

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Oct-1998

See msg #318


#902: I cant export to a midi
I cant export to a midi

(902)

Submitted by: Daniel Garmendia on 07-Oct-1998

Im reletavely new with this. ok Im really new to this. I export my music to a new midi file, but when i open the midi file, it doesn't play the music. Any idea why?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 07-Oct-1998

What are you using to open the MIDI file? You should:

1 - Close NWC, or at least make sure that your MIDI plyback device is available to the system

2 - Open the MIDI file with the Windows Media Player

All should be well. You can also use NoteWorthy Player to play back the MIDI file. If htis does not work, then either your song is using MIDI channels not supported by your MIDI Mapper setup, or your system is not correctly configured for generic MIDI playback through the MIDI mapper.


#903: choral parts in one stave
choral parts in one stave

(903)

Submitted by: Alan Gale on 11-Oct-1998

I don't want to create chords, but I do want to split parts for one group of voices on the one staff (ie first and second sops, or tenors, etc.

This means I would like to end up with two sets of notes on the one staff: one with stems up and the other with stems down. It seems the only way to link more than one note vertically is by a chord member command. But this is not wot i want. Help.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Oct-1998

If I understand correctly, you don't want to use two-note chords (one stem up, one stem down) on a single staff because the two voices have to be on separate midi channels. If so, a workaround would be the staff layering feature. If you don't have this enabled already (it's still in the experimental stages) you can download the patch to enable this from the NoteWorthy web site.

If you don't care that both notes are voiced by the same midi channel, the usual two-note chord approach should work fine.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Oct-1998

Just to add to Fred's reply, Alan, I get the feeling that you are more interested in the appearance of the score than the MIDI split. You CAN use the chording feature for one note tail up and one down, with certain limitations. The notes can be the same, but cannot overhang i.e. the note with the upward pointing stem must be above the downward one. Sometimes you will have to split a note into two tied notes to obtain the correct timing. Nevertheless, most of the time it works. The trick is to ensure that the tail up/down button is active for the appropriate note - if you leave it all to NWC it will set a common tail for the chord depending on its position on the stave. I generally do the top line first with all tails set up, then click the 'down' button and add the second line. Hope this works for you.

Peter.

Reply 3 offered by: Alan Gale on 12-Oct-1998

Fred and Peter:

You confuse me with midi channels - my use is more to transcribe hand written choral parts....

SATB (Soprano, Tenor, Alto, Bass) scores often split into first and second tenors, for example. They are shown as stems up and stems down, but on the same stave.

Does your solution cover me when they share a note and cross over? (ie the top like (stems up) goes below the bottom line (stems down) keeping the stems constant so part 1 knows where to go?

I will give it a go, and report back....

My task also includes sections where the two parts have different rhythms (lower may have a crotchet and upper a dotted quaver beamemed to a semiquaver.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Oct-1998

Alan, you said <Does your solution cover me when they share a note and cross over?> I'm afraid not (this is what I meant by overhang). Sharing a note is OK, but not crossing over. As I also mentioned, occasionally you may have timing problems. Your best solution is to go the layered staves route as Fred suggests. You'll find this feature in the Tips page. Best of luck, Peter.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Oct-1998

I've just tried the Crotchet with dotted quaver beamed to semiquaver query. Works OK using normal chording. But you've still got the problem of crossover. Cheers, Peter.

Reply 6 offered by: Alan Gale on 12-Oct-1998

cooking with gas* - thanks muchly to fred and peter....fortunately no crossovers, but there have been some rhythm tensions thant have been a nuisance....but then who needs it all?

BIG THANKS TO NOTEWORTHY DESIGNERS, AND ALL THE FREE HELP FROM THE FORUM

*Melbourne now has gas again - how taken for granted it was until taken away


#905: Pitch bend
Pitch bend

(905)

Submitted by: Maxi Rose on 12-Oct-1998

Is there a way to get a greater range of pitch bend within one notation? Such as two quarter notes tied across a bar, attempting to bend a step-and-a-half up, or even just one quarter note trying to do that. I'm hoping to get a much fuller range of pitch bend for individual notes.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Oct-1998

I've addressed this question on the forum previously, but I'm afraid I didn't do a very good job of it. So I'll paste in a better treatment of the subject from an answer on the Newsgroup. (The person in this case wanted to know how to do trombone slides, but the principles are the same).

-----------------------------------------------------------

... It's not hard to do a slide (whatever it might be termed
technically) as long as it's no more than a major third (for example,
from C to E).

So let's say you want to do a slide on a whole note on C, starting at
the beginning of the note continuing to the third beat, then holding for
the rest of the duration of the note.

Write your note on D (not C... you'll see why in a minute). Select
Insert --> Multipoint Controller. This brings up a dialog box. For
Contoller, select Pitch Bend. For Style, select Linear Sweep (that's
what gives the slide). For Linear Sweep Contour, leave it at 32 (the
default for now) This controls the rate and resolution of the sweep.
Also leave Time Offset Multiplier at the default fo Quarter. Below,
you'll see four "slidepots" Crank the first one all the way to the left
(-8192) and then inch forward by one to 8191 (some sound cards don't
like -8192). Leave its time offset at 0. This bends our D down to C,
where we want it to start. Check the clickbox on Setting 2, leave its
time offset at 1, and slide its pot all the way to the right (+8191).
This bends our D up to E, where we want it to end up.

After the note, add another pitch bend MPC, to restore that channel to
normal intonation. This time, use Absolute for Style, since we just want
one quick change and not a linear sweep of a whole bunch of them.
Restore all the slide pots to the center.

btw - you can do +/- 10 changes to these pots by clicking the mouse on
either side of the pointer, and changes of +/- 1 by using left/right
arros.

By now you may have gathered that a pitch bend of +/- 8192 corresponds
to a whole tone, or put another way, 4096 pitch-bend units per semitone.
This is the default pitch-bend range as defined in midi. So that limits
our possible slide range to a major third. There *is* a pitch-bend range
parameter, but you would have to insert that with some external utility
as it doesn't seem to be supported in the current version of NoteWorthy
Composer. That being said, I'd hesitate to use it anyway, since I've
heard from others that not all synths treat this parameter the same way.

By using subsequent pitch bend MPC's, you can with care get pretty good
approximations of slides over larger intervals by appropriately choosing
your notes and slide ranges, and setting the performance style to legato
or use a slur to minimize the length of the "dropout" in the middle of
the slide.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 12-Oct-1998

In order to simplify, how great it would be to have 5 lines instead of 4 in MPCs...

Excellent description, Fred, as usual :-)

Hint : once you made one, copy your 2 MPCs into an empty staff or your "tools" score. It's always handy to have such a "tools" staff with such items already made...

HTH,
      MAD

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Oct-1998

See also: msg #155, msg #190, msg #460, msg #589, msg #737


#906: Solo staffs leading into choral staffs
Solo staffs leading into choral staffs

(906)

Submitted by: Alan Gale on 12-Oct-1998

I have a piece of music where one voice begins, then another soloist joins in, and then a four part choir kicks in, then it reduces to the duet, then the solo, then back to the full four part choir.

How do I avoid having to maintain six staffs?

Is there a way of having one line a music layout that has say 20 bars of one line at the beginning, and only developing second, third and fourth staffs as they are needed?

Or should I go and spend hundreds on a music publishing program? (Not the right answer, but I am prepared to accept your version of reality :) )

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Oct-1998

Hello again, Alan. I've had the same problem on a number of occasions, and put it on my wish list - it can't be done directly at the moment. You will need to write the sections as seperate files, then export them into a suitable publishing program, (copy from page preview) and lay out to suit. Publishing has been discussed in some depth - msg #713 is worth a look. I daresay NWC support can list several useful pages going a long way back.

Query to NWC Support - is it my browser (Netscape 4.04) or because of the change in the Reply form - I can't abort the reply form back to the forum without reloading from my bookmark - my 'Back' button is greyed out.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Oct-1998

I think it's Netscape. Suggest downloading 4.06 from Netscape.

But be warned: even that one still has some... shall we say "oddities." I got tired of it and went back to 3.04... everything works as it should again.

Regards,
Fred

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Oct-1998

The "Add Your Own Reply" button open a new browser window. This is so you can Alt-Tab back to the original post, if necessary, while authoring a new reply. Whether you complete the reply or not, you simply close this window when you are done. We will consider adding a JavaScript button on the reply form and response in order to make this easier for you.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter V on 14-Oct-1998

Thanks NWC Support (and Fred!) - there are a lot of so-called support organisations in the computing world that could learn a lot from you - with NWC, support really means it!! Congratulations and keep up the good work. Peter.

Reply 5 offered by: Byron Dickens on 17-Oct-1998

I came up with a workaround that might help. I have a song that starts out with guitar, bass, and full orchestra and then the orchestra drops out, leaving guitar, bass, and piano. What I did was split the piece into two songs and played around with the font sizes until I could make it look like the change happened at a page break.

Hope this might help some.


#907: Rhythm tensions with choral parts
Rhythm tensions with choral parts

(907)

Submitted by: Alan Gale on 12-Oct-1998

Guys I am sorry to bore you with this....

Here's the score (so to speak)

Tenor 1 = dotted crotchet, quaver, crotchet crotchet
tenor 2 = quaver, quaver, quaver, quaver, quaver, quaver

I have written the top line in first, sticks up, and come back for t2s, sticks down. chord member does not allow all the quavers to align....am i doing it wrong?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Oct-1998

Yes... you have to put the shortest note in first. (I don't know from quavers and crotchets, but if you do the shortest note first, the longer ones can be added.)

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 13-Oct-1998

Alan, your notes don't add up - T1 is effectively 8 quavers against T2 6. Where is T2 resting?

Peter

Reply 3 offered by: Sue Morton on 13-Oct-1998

Hi Alan, Fred, and Peter,

I've been away from music a very long time, and only just returned, so forgive me a question: What is a crochet, and what is a quaver? These are terms I'm not familiar with... is a "crochet" a half-note? A quaver a quarter-note? or what????

I've learned a bunch from reading the posts on the forum, memories come flooding back, but not this time! Please explain, thanks!

Sue

Reply 4 offered by: KM on 13-Oct-1998

Sure, I remember, Jimminy Crotchet!

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Oct-1998

I'm starting to feeling crotchety, quavering with confusion...

Good question, Sue. You inspired me to look it up in my handy dandy musical dictionary. So, for the rest of us who learned notes in powers of two, here's the scoop:

Breve = double whole note (looks like a glorified = sign)

Semi-breve = whole note

Minim = half note

Crotchet = quarter note

Quaver = 1/8 note

Semiquaver = 1/16 note

Demisemiquaver = 1/32 note (not Ms. Moore's maiden name as commonly believed ;-)

Hemidemisemiquaver = 1/64 note

Got it? Got it!

F

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 14-Oct-1998

Oh boy, it seems really complicated in English!

Alan, Fred gave the rite answer. Enter the shortest notes which SHARE longer notes first (mixing T1 & T2 parts if needed), then complete the work with others.
So if T2 start at same time as T1 (though 2 quavers are missing), then enter first the 3 quavers of T2 then dotted crotchet of T1, and so on.

And now, after American|Australian To English, the French version :
Breve = ronde carrée (looks like this : |O| (withut space in it)

Semi-breve = ronde = 1 (in NWC) = 1 (in high part of time signature)
Minim = blanche = 2 = 2 (means "white")
Crotchet = noire = 3 = 4 (means "black")
Quaver = croche = 4 = 8
Semiquaver = double croche = 5 = 16
Demisemiquaver = triple croche = 6 = 32
Hemidemisemiquaver = quadruple croche = ? = 64
half of h.d.s.quaver = quintuple croche = ? = 128

Next time, rests ;-)

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 14-Oct-1998

So the word for an English crotchet sounds like a French quaver. What a minefield. Who said music was an international language?? Perhaps we should all stick to fractions! But this thread certainly emphasises the worldwide scope of the NWC Forum - if I ever go to Australia/France/California etc. etc., I know I've got contacts there.

Best wishes to all, Peter.

Reply 8 offered by: Paul on 14-Oct-1998

So what happens when you start adding dots to the notes?

Is a dotted 16th == Sesquisemiquaver?
What if it is double-dotted?

Just curious.

Reply 9 offered by: Sue Morton on 14-Oct-1998

Wow, what a flurry of conversation I inspired... BTW Peter, I *am* in California, and here we stick to "whole- note", "half-note", "quarter-note", "eighth-note", "sixteenth-note", "thirtysecond-note", "sixtyfourth-note"... that's about as complicated as we get! : >

Thanks to all for the confusion, er, clarification, er...

Reply 10 offered by: Sue on 14-Oct-1998

P.S. I find it funny that "breve" is a whole note.

Reply 11 offered by: Alan Gale on 15-Oct-1998

OK now listen up....

a crotchet is one beat in a 4/4 bar or even a 3/4 or a 2/4...

let's not talk about 6/8 where the quaver is the beat!

when it's dotted, it's called a .... wait for it ... dotted crotchet! it adds half the note's value.

There are two crotchet beats in a minim, two minims in a semi-breve, and two quavers in a crotchet.

All this from the country that put 12 inches in a foot, three feet in a yard and 1,760 yards in a mile - to say nothing of furlongs, rods, poles and perches - and further confused us by having 12 pence in a shilling, 20 shillings in a pound, and expected you to be able to keep accurate account books.

Thanks to everyone for the help - I am now well on my way getting music sorted out for the male choir i am involved with.........

Thanks to the international help from Melbourne Australia

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 15-Oct-1998

Wow !
Sorry, but in 3/8, quaver is beat, okay.
But NOT in 6/8, where dotted crotchet is 1 beat --thus quaver being a third of beat.
  That's what's called "compound time" in English ("ternaire" in French), thus 6/8 is a 2 beats measure, 6/8 is 3 b.measure, 12/8 a 4b.m. ... but I guess 7/8 is a seven beats measure, (3/8 + 4/8 in fact, or 4/8+3/8)...
Maybe that's why we got to learn music theory for 12 years before having rights to teach it ?..

Hope this helps,
                          MAD

Reply 13 offered by: marsu on 15-Oct-1998

Related to measure units (thx Alan) : the best thing in the 1789 revolution is definitely the metric system. Though arbitrary, it's sooo simple now... a Kg is 1000 grams, but a pound could vary from 250 to 640 with many variances... depending on the place you were. As U.S. gallons and U.K. gallons... Now I know why french students are so bad in mental calculations ;-)

So when will a day be divided into 10ths, which'd be divided in 100ths, ... ?? *<8-)

Reply 14 offered by: alan gale on 15-Oct-1998

I bare buttocks for caning in punishment for poor music theory - yep crochetty dot is the 6/8 beat.

measurements:

when metric was introduced in Oz in 1976, local paper ran april fools day article on metric time....10 days a week, 10 months a year, etc etc...caught a lot out, it did.

especially kiloseconds, that was a ripper

Reply 15 offered by: Peter V. on 16-Oct-1998

Watch out, Alan - in Europe caning is verboten - the human rights mob will be after us! And in this case would we use a cane or a baton?? And what does baton mean in French? Here we go again . . . .

Peter.

Reply 16 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 16-Oct-1998

Marsu (reply 12),

I guess 7/8 is rarely a seven beats measure. Most probably it is a two or three beats measure, with beats of unequal lengths, e.g. 3/8 + 4/8 or 2/8 + 2/8 + 3/8.

I already sung a piece of music at 13/16, which was a five beats measure (3 + 3 + 3 + 2 + 2).

And Dave Brubeck's "blue rondo a la turk" is, in my humble opinion, a four beats measure (2 + 2 + 2 + 3), thus 9/8 is not always 3 b. measure.

Reply 17 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Oct-1998

"Beats of unequal length" is a self-contradiction, to my understanding a beat is a constant unit of time.

How the notes are grouped within a beat can, of course, vary i.e. duplets, triplets, ets. So you could have, say, three groupings in 7/8 (2 + 2 + 3) but each beat has the same time duration.

Reply 18 offered by: Joe Eidson on 16-Oct-1998

Just to add something on time signatures:
marsu was talking about 'compound' and 'simple' meters a few messages back and mentioned 7/8. The meters in 5 and 7 are called 'asymmetrical' meters, referring to the unequal note groupings as mentioned before. (2+2+3=7, etc...)
Isn't theory great??? ;)
-JE

Reply 19 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 17-Oct-1998

Bruce Sagan, a maths prof from the States and brilliant gedulka (Bulgarian upright fiddle played on the cuticle) player and Hardangviolist played us a Sweish piece that was in "3". It counted like about 1.5 : 1 : 0.75 in "beats", giving it a fantastically lazy feel.

A

Reply 20 offered by: marsu on 19-Oct-1998

Hey, what about a new wish list for that kinda special tempi...
Though it's already achievable (?) I guess :
in the tempo track, create a measure containing an MPC (tempo item) before each beat, which changes the tempo. For example, for a 80 "regular" tempo, 1st MPC contains (in absolute value) 64, the 2nd MPC (2nd beat) contains 80, and last MPC contains 107. Now repeat that measure (using repeat bars), and this should give 1.25 / 1 / 0.75 feeling... Is that okay, Andrew ? (Am I lazy enough ??)

HTH,
        MAD

Reply 21 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 20-Oct-1998

Fred, I won't try to convince you that a beat is not necessarily a constant unit of time, because soooo much
music uses regular beats.

Sometimes I tried to convince people that a beat is not necessarily a quarter note (e.g. a whole note), and that there exist other modes than major and minor (e.g. D or E modes), but I usually failed to convince them, even in french !

Er... maybe if I speak about heart beats, which are all but regular ?

Reply 22 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Oct-1998

Certainly there are tempo variances... fermata, accel., ritard. etc. as well as forms (the Swedish waltz was mentioned, but it's also true of the Austrian waltz and other forms) where beats are stretched or compressed in a regular manner.

But IMHO calling 7/8 the same as 3/4 is... well, stretching it a bit. ;---D

It's like saying the modes are all just variations of the same major scale, so why have modes at all.

Reply 23 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 21-Oct-1998

You needn't worry, I will never call 7/8 the same as 3/4 ! Sometimes I can write it 2/8+2/8+3/8, I can also say there are three unequal beats, but I will never mix up this with 3/4 or any other "three equal beats" measure.

Anyway, when I say "three beats", if I don't specify "unequal", I usually mean 3/4 or 3/1 or 3/something, the same as you do.

But it would be incorrect, in my opinion, to say that 7/8 is seven beats.


#908: Quick Tip - Rest Characters
Quick Tip - Rest Characters

(908)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 13-Oct-1998

Some current threads are dealing with publishing, particularly with refence to doubling up of parts. It is not possible to have a note with rest 'chord' where the rest is the same length as the chorded note so it might be useful to know that the NWC15 font family of rests are given by lower case characters 'l' through 'r'. Set a user font to NWC 15 and insert the text at the required staff position with 'preserve width' unchecked.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter V on 13-Oct-1998

Yeah yeah, I noticed too, but too late - 'reference'

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 14-Oct-1998

Oh, I thought I had to learn another word. Never mind...

For Capella font, rests are from "I" (capital i) to "O" (not zero).
for Chopin font, they're "a" to "i" ("b" excepted, it's a "breve" (double whole note))

HTH,
        MAD


#909: Duplet (?) timing???
Duplet (?) timing???

(909)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 14-Oct-1998

Hi NWC Forum,

I have followed all the posts on duplets, n-tuplets etc., but could still use some help with the following situation.

I have a choral piece that switches to 9/8 time signature, then has what I am assuming to be duplets in some of the measures, they look like eighth notes with the numeral 2 above them.

I have been away from music 20 years, memory fades... I have no idea how this should be counted. I need to learn to sing the piece for a concert, and I would like to enter some of these passages into NWC to help me with the timing. But since NWC doesn't support anything but triplets, how????

I am only interested in hearing the music played with the correct timing, I don't care what the score looks like. Can anyone help? At the minimum, how should this be counted? I can always go the "low-tech" (metronome) route to learn it, if I have to! : >

Thanks as always for any help. Great forum, I've remembered (and learned) so much here!

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: richard Woodroffe on 14-Oct-1998

Sue,
I am e-mailing a NWC file which may help.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 15-Oct-1998

Sue,
Yes, you're looking at duplets - 2 notes in the time of 3.
I can't "tell you" how to count them, except by subdividing
into semiquavers (16th notes). Each note in the duplet will be the same duration as 3 semiquavers (16ths).

Since the time signature is 9/8 you don't really have "triplets" in the normal sense, the natural grouping
is 3. A triplet only makes sense when you want 3 notes in
the time usually taken by 2.

So, there are 2 ways I can think of to write this. First will look really ugly - notate in 9/8 and replace each duplet with a quaver tied to a semiquaver (8th to 16th).

The other possibility is to change the time signature to
3/4 and write each group of 3 quavers (8th) as a "real" triplet. Your duplet notes are then written as quavers (8th). This will look closer to the "correct" score, the
only difference is the duplets won't have "2" above them end
each group of 3 will have "3" above it. The down side, is you may have to think harder about exactly how to notate
more complex rhythms than just straight quavers.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Oct-1998

Sue, the way I would count it is to think of it as 3/4 like John suggests, then the 9/8 would be counted as

one-and-ah two-and-ah three-and-ah...

When counting the dupletted notes (let's say the duplet is on the 3rd beat, in 3/4 time) it would sound a bit like

one-and-ah two-and-ah THREE-AND

Do follow your own suggestion and try this with a metronome or click track, set slow to start (around 60).

This may not be technically correct, but it might help.

F

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 15-Oct-1998

John suggests "First will look really ugly - notate in 9/8 and replace each duplet with a quaver tied to a semiquaver (8th to 16th)."

Or you can just use two dotted quavers (eighth notes) for the duplet. In fact, if you then bar them together, put a text "2" above them (insert text before the first one and pad with spaces - otherwise you'll break the bar), then all you'd need to do would be to white-out the dots, and you'd have a perfect looking (and sounding) duplet!

A

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Edwards on 15-Oct-1998

I count it "diddledee diddledee diddledee DahDah diddledee" etc, with each word taking the same length of time. It helps sometimes to think of it the other way round; that the time signature is really 2/4 and the diddledees are triplets. Then duplets are just ordinary quavers.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Oct-1998

The easiest way to do a duplet in a compound time signature (triplet feel) is just to select them and dot the notes (gives them time and a half).

Reply 7 offered by: Sue Morton on 15-Oct-1998

Thanks to all of you for responding! Richard was the first to respond with the missing info... 2 notes in the time of 3 was the part I could not remember!

Actually, after I had made this post, I remembered that 9/8 time is the same as counting "3" beats in a measure (and counting the original 8th notes as triplets)... that turns my duplets into normally-timed 8th notes, 2 per beat -- quite easy to sing as long as I ignore the triplets in the accompaniment!

Thanks to all for the additional lessons on how to switch between triplets and duplets -- fortunately, I already have that part down, I just couldn't remember what timing duplets occupy...! But I am printing off all the answers as there are folk in my choir that do not know how this works and have trouble switching. You all have provided a great tutorial for these people!

Thanks for the good wishes on my concert, "MAD Marsu", it is a lovely piece written by Aaron Copeland for Thanksgiving. We have a "round-table" of all of our churches in the area on "Thanksgiving Eve", and this will be my contribution.

Happy NWC-ing, thanks for all the help,

Sue


#910: Hanging File
Hanging File

(910)

Submitted by: Stuck on 19-Oct-1998

Why is that sometimes if I press F5 to play a song, the program hangs and just says "compiling" at the bottom.

Thanks, Stuck

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 19-Oct-1998

Look at msg #645, but I think the last (1.52a) NWC corrects this bug (since there has been a release since May).

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Oct-1998

You may have a problem in your notation, such as a series of repeat marks that create a song passage that repeats forever. You can correct the notation, but you may be able to prevent the problem by getting the latest release of NWC (1.52a). If you still have trouble (when using 1.52a), you can send us a copy of your file, and we will identify the cause, and add preventative measures to NWC.

See also: msg #645


#911: Any way to control the placement of slurs/ties?
Any way to control the placement of slurs/ties?

(911)

Submitted by: Alex Lebed on 19-Oct-1998

Hello,

Most of the music I need to handle with NoteWorthy is Choral Score music--which has Soprano and Alto parts on the top staff ; and Tenor and Bass on the bottom staff.

The two voices on each of the two staff are differentiated by stems up or stems down.

My requirement is that slurs/ties appear both over the Soprano part and under the Alto part at the same time--and the same for the Tenor and Bass, i.e. I need to show four sets of ties--two on each staff--one above, and one below the notes.

The layering feature works almost perfectly in this regard, except that I have no control as to where NoteWorthy places the slurs/ties--whether above the notes or below. Sometimes it chooses in accordance with what I need--sometimes it doesn't.

I guess the simplest way to express my requirement is that I need to be able to control on each staff (which I can then layer) whether the slurs/ties appear above or below the notes, just as I can control whether the stems go up or down.

Is there a way to do this?

Basically, I wish there were an option to say: I want the slurs/ties on the same side as the stems of the notes.

This is really important for me, as I have a lot of music that needs to be transcribed, and all of it has the same requirement.

Thank you

Alex

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 21-Oct-1998

Alex,

at the time being, slurs are on the opposite side of the stem.
So if you want to place your slurs above or under the note, change the stem in accordance --tothe opposite.

But this may lead to unreadable staves.

but IMHO, choral atuff should not be written on 2 staves but on 4, one per voice. This allow much more readability for the reader, and it's 20+ years that I read choral music... Many music friends of mine agree on this (in fact, none denies this opinion).

Unless it's a real trouble on the cost when you print it, it's better for the final user to have a voice per staff, since he/she can write easily the remarks, annothations or whatever on the part he/she reads. Which is realy convenient...

Otherwise, for such an already discussed subject, you can use (it is really useful) the "offline forum" to calmly search for what you need. Use the "Go offline" item on the top of this page :-) or use the inline "search" tool.
(If you're on a 16 bits system, there is a way to use it)

Hope this helps
                      MAD

Reply 2 offered by: drake donahue on 21-Oct-1998

Amen.
Thanks to Eric et al. we are no longer nearsighted monks scratching with (hard to find) quills on (incedibly expensive) parchment. The shortcuts and compromises that were so critical in the resource poor world in which notation developed are not needed in the world of cut/copy/paste. In fact, they impede getting music on paper. As the Nike ads say, "Just do it!"

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 21-Oct-1998

Drake:

Speaking as one of the 'monks'.
I STILL prefer to copy my parts by hand using an Asian music pen.

They're more readable - I can easily control bars per line, note spacing, notehead size and so much more when manually copying.

It's faster - the time spent in tarting up the parts is longer than manually copying ( I have spent a long apprenticeship ).

I can add whatever marks I wish - not just those included with the software or offered in the Boxmarks font (I created it but don't use it).

I can quickly produce - piano, guitar, bass (with chord symbols and rhythm markers) and drum parts using correct notation.

Most studio musicians I know prefer manual copying and they see so much of it because arrangers still score by hand for speed.

I use NoteWorthy as a tool - to transpose the saxes, trumpets and print out an exquisite little score to copy from.
NoteWorthy offers an easy method of note entry to create the score but I export a midi file to Cakewalk to create a better sound.

I don't need to get involved in discussions about slur placement, stem positions, lack of marks - their all there at my finger tips.
If I ever get to the stage where I depend entirely on a computer to produce my parts I'll give music away!

Copying is an art combining the look, feel and accuracy of writing with the incredible flexibility of the human brain.
(Although mine is slowly reaching a stage of atrophy)!

I love NoteWorthy for what it offers and it ranks highly among my favourite software.
I'm sorry but to me the printed part looks stiff and mechanical.

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Oct-1998

While there may be alternatives, I think the request of the originator of this thread is reasonable and not hard to implement. I would like it too.

Reply 5 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 23-Oct-1998

I would like to reply to Marsu about choral music.

I sing in 2 choirs at the moment, and most of the work I do on NWC is to re-notate scores I get from the choir librarian that have the voices split over 4 staves, to bring it back to 2 staves. I find that music over 4 staves with the piano parts added only give me a few bars per page, and you end up paging like crazy to follow the music.

It just goes to show that we all have differnet needs and tastes and it is great to have a program that will allow us to express that freedom.

Barry, I agree with you that a handwritten score is a work of art, but it is not practical. I used to a draughtsman and enjoyed drawing "on the board" but the benefits of CAD far outweighed the "niceness" of a hand-drawn drawing.

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 02-Nov-1998

Different needs, indeed. _My_ 20 years experience has all
been with the two-staff, four-part format. And I (and 98%
of the people I sing with) couldn't sing a Bach chorale if
you engraved it in notes of gold in a scroll of silver. What
_we_ really need (to make the music easier to read) is
shaped notes. (The Aiken scheme, that is. Any chance?)

But, using two staves, a hymn score fits within one page
of a handbook-sized book. You can sing multiple verses
without any page flipping. This is a real advantage for
people who can read music barely, if at all; and perhaps
can just barely read words fast enough to keep up.

For many of us, if the music is too complex to fit clearly
on two staves, it's much to complex to sing.

A lot of music gets printed this way: probably 5-15 pages
per capita per annum in the U.S. That has to account for
a significant part of the ink spilled on lined paper.

Reply 7 offered by: Cathy O'Connor on 13-Dec-1998

I would like to add my vote for the request to control the position of slurs. I also score music for voice and instruments as a church musician. Although I have gone the four-stave route, it really takes too much paper. Often, to be readable you end up with one set of four-staves per page.

Reply 8 offered by: Jean-Louis on 17-Dec-1998

To Cathy, Stephen, Roelie and the others...
Don't forget to fill the NWC Wish list !


#912: Placement of slurs and ties
Placement of slurs and ties

(912)

Submitted by: Roelie Oelofse on 20-Oct-1998

I tried to reply to msg #911 but my browser refuses to do anything when I click on "Add you own reply". (Help Eric, what am I doing wrong. I also tried to setup defaults from the help page with the same result)

I have the same problem with slurs, ties and rests. As most of the scores I enter in NWC is for choral pieces, I had to find a solution. What I do is to first enter all the notes on separate hidden staves for each voice for correct playback. I then make copies of the staves to set it up for display. I use layering to combine the voices, and wherever slurs or ties falls on the wrong side I chord the notes to force the direction of the slurs, rests etc. Remember that when you have problems with fitting rests (a rest cannot be chorded with a note of the same duration) if you layer a half note with a quater note it will print as a quater note.
With the help of Boxmarks and NWCV15 fonts and layering I found that I could notate almost any type of score and make it look and sound correct.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 20-Oct-1998

msg #893 also looked at this problem, but Alex's case where he presumably wants the slurs on the same side of the note as the tails (and the lyrics?) there isn't a direct solution. I've got slur control on my wish list - put it on yours. In the meantime, perhaps the export of NWC previews into a publishing suite is the most effective work around. You need to devise a slur 'picture' using a drawing package then add the slurs where required. It may even be necessary to add the lyrics at this stage to ensure correct positioning. A nuisance I know, but very effective when you've got the knack, and of course once the composition is in a publishing program you can add any extra embellishments you wish.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Oct-1998

> but my browser refuses to do anything when I click on "Add you own reply".

The browser is supposed to open a new browsing window with a reply form. Which browser are you using?

Reply 3 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 20-Oct-1998

I normally use IE4.0, but it looks like I've got some kind of problem there. This reply works from Netscape 4.04.

Peter, this is a bit difficult to explain without showing an example, but I'll try. Let say you have a b with the stem showing upwards, slurred with the next note, NWC will place the slur at the bottom. If you chord another note eg. a g with the stem showing down, the slur jumps to the top. This means that you can control which side the slur must go, and using layering one can print notes on top of each other. I hope this makes sense.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Oct-1998

This reply is authored from IE4. I looked through the IE options, but could not find anything that would break our reply process. Perhaps someone else knows what might be wrong with your IE4.

Reply 5 offered by: Alex Lebed on 20-Oct-1998

Well, thanks to Roelie Oelofse and the rest of you, I was able to figure out how to control the placement of slurs and ties. It's a bit klugey, but it works.

Less than stellar marks, however, to NWC Tech Support, to whom I had sent the very same message I had posted to the forum.

I got the following reply:

==================================

Hi Alex:

You cannot control the direction of the ties or slurs in NoteWorthy
Composer.

Regards,
Beth
NoteWorthy ArtWare, Inc.

==============================

But you can. . .

Here's how it works:

All you need to do is to have a separate staff for each of the two voices you want to combine through layering.

You enter the notes for each staff, stem up on one, stem down on the other.

You then put in the necessary slurs/ties, which will most likely end up on the wrong side.

Then you take the first note of each slur and add a chord member with the note the *other* voice has at the same position, but with the stem in the opposite direction. The slur/tie will jump to the opposite side.

You do this for every voice, then layer the results (the overlayed notes will print correctly, and voila!-- you get four sets of slurs/ties--above and below each staff.

Neat stuff.

And thanks again.

(Although I would like to rally for a wish list item that would let you, in addition to the automated slur/tie capability, to manually enter any slur or tie you want, simply by moving your cursor to the begin point and clicking, then moving to the end point and clicking--which would cause a tie to be drawn between the two points.)

Alex

Reply 6 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 7 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 21-Oct-1998

At last! This reply was sent from IE4.01. I eventually reinstalled IE to fix the problem. I hate Microsoft!

Reply 8 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 21-Oct-1998

Alex,

I am glad that I could be of assistance, but I think I have to defend NWC Support. Their response to you was the correct one - you cannot control the placement of a slur directly, it would be wrong for them to state that the s/w can do something if it means you have to fiddle to get it going. No software package could be expected to work 100% for every user, it is sometimes up to us as the users to "invent" ways to circumvent shortcomings. That is why this forum and the newsgroup exists, and as we all know it give Eric a good idea which feature to put in the next release.

I do not know of any other package with such a healthy support base as this - both from the developer and users.

My own experience with Microsoft today just made me appreciate what we have here that much more.

Reply 9 offered by: Peter Vasey on 21-Oct-1998

Back to slurs. Maybe I haven't thought this through properly, BUT:

Roelie said : <If you chord another note eg. a g with the stem showing down, the slur jumps to the top.>

Alex said : <Then you take the first note of each slur and add a chord member with the note the *other* voice has at the same position, but with the stem in the opposite direction. The slur/tie will jump to the opposite side.>

So what do you do if there isn't a note in the second voice at that particular point? You can't construct a chord, so the slur will be on the opposite side to the tail.

Peter.

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 21-Oct-1998

Just to know...
I learned how to write music many years ago, but I think that it ain't very good practice to superimpose elements. What you do if you make slurs on the same side as stems. And I'm sure that's the reason why NWC puts ties (which are on the stem side) between notes, and not "through".

So for legibility, I'd recommand to use separate staves.

just a last thing I'd like to know : I avoid to use alyering, as it's called "experimental" feature. Not perfect (yet), but really good thing though -- but will it be present in next versions ?

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Oct-1998

Here is an update on staff layering:
The staff layering feature will be supported in the next version of NWC. This is why we released the tool that enables the feature for all existing NWC files. The feature is not perfect at the moment, so we currently offer it with its known (experimental) limitations. However, please feel free to take advantage of it now, as support for it will be included in future NWC releases.

Reply 12 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Oct-1998

Regarding slur directions, we stand by the offical language that user specification of slur direction is not supported. The language in the help file says it best:

> The direction of slurs are now determined by the first
> note of the slur: if the stem of the first note is
> upward, then the slur will be underneath the notes.
> If the stem of the first note is downward, then the slur
> is extended above the notes. If the first note is a split
> direction chord, then these rules are reversed.

It is difficult for us to cover every possible work around with each support incident that we receive, which is why we offer the many user facilities on this web site (so others can share their experiences, work arounds, etc.).

See also: msg #177, msg #893

Reply 13 offered by: Alex Lebed on 21-Oct-1998

First of all, I would like to apologize for my comments regarding the terse reply I first received from NWC Tech Support.

It would have been nice, however, if they had suggested to place my question on the forum to see if users could come up with some sort of workaround (which they did).

Their last response is, however, much more informative--and it does indicate that the user has some control over the placement of slurs by the control he has over the direction of the stem on the first note of the slur.

Although full user control over the placement of slurs would be a very useful enhancement, another way of handling this would be to allow users to *hide* a note--meaning, that you could select a note (or a rest), and toggle it to be hidden--i.e. not print (perhaps it could appear "grayed out" on the screen).

These hidden notes could be used to solve the slur placement problem, and, I think, could be useful in other situations, for examle, to resolve some rhythmic notation problems.

Alex

Reply 14 offered by: marsu on 21-Oct-1998

Good last proposal.
Otherwise, as you state it yourself, search for help in the manual/online help in which was the information you needed :-)
But this would not have allowed to have so many anwsers ;-)

To support: many thx for the "Layer" feature info. I'll use it much more from now (will allow me to better place lyrics, with 1 pixel adjustement in height).

Reply 15 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Oct-1998

I also want to add my voice (again) in praise of NoteWorthy Artware's support network, and to the many fellow users who make it possible.

I recently purchased an upgrade of Cubasis, mainly to get rid of the stupid dongle. (Don't ask me why I use it... suffice it to say it's the first sequencer I used, and the one I'm most familiar with). The damn thing crashed my computer every time I tried to run it. It took a full week to get an answer from their tech support, and that only to try to book a time when I could call them by voice phone so they could try to figure it out.

I had to battle the problem by myself. No forum, no newsgroup, no answer from tech support. Turns out that an obscure .ini was set for MMX on by default, with no way of changing it except for manual editing.

A long story, but one to remind us all of just how good we've got it here.

Reply 16 offered by: Sue Morton	 on 22-Oct-1998

I think I'd better check out the layering function. I have stayed away from it because it is *experimental* and may not work in future releases.

However, I too would like (and have put on the official wish list) user placement of slurs. I work mostly with Choral music, and being able to place a slur where I want it (instead of by stem direction) would be a big plus. Same with ties.

And, some church music from around the turn of the century uses what appears as a slur as a performance mark (e.g. make the singer think 'legato'), even though the word syllable is not spread across two or more notes as in a 'true' slur. I think I might be able to simulate this as well using the experimental layering... I can try, anyhow.

Reply 17 offered by: Grant on 23-Oct-1998

I have to take exception to marsu's comments about legibility and superimposition of ties and stems. It's been common practice for at least a century or two to combine paired orchestral instruments onto the same staff, with both stems and slurs/ties facing in opposite directions. A glance at any moderately complicated orchestral score will show examples of this. There's never any problem with superimposing stems and slurs because of the simple rule, always followed, that says that slurs must be extended far enough away from the staff that they don't intersect any stems. (In fact, slurs, as opposed to ties, generally run from stem-end to stem-end rather than from note to note in such circumstances.)

As to legibility, there are inevitably compromises, but I assure you that the common solution is usually a whole lot better than (a) twice as many staves in the score or (b) slurs and ties that cross each other in the middle of the staff.

There is a further issue here, which is the placement of articulation marks such as staccato dots and accent wedges. Convention says that on a shared staff, these should be on the outside of the staff, on the stem side of the notes to which they apply. In practice, this means that they, like slurs, are often placed at the ends of the stems rather than near the note heads. This is definitely an area where NWC needs to become more savvy if the layering feature is to be fully useful. Right now such marks can disappear if they happen to coincide with a note head in the other part - and may be hard to read even if they're visible, since they end up in a non-standard location.


#913: Umlauts in lyrics
Umlauts in lyrics

(913)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Oct-1998

Does anyone know of a workaround to include bit-8-high ASCII characters in the lyric editor? I'd like to put umlauted characters (working on a German opera...) in the text editor. Normally I would clip the character to the clipboard using the Character Map applet in Accessories, then paste it in. But there doesn't seem to be an Edit->Paste menu in the lyric editor. Any ideas? (Short of converting Windows to German...)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Oct-1998

Ctrl-V worked for me!

A

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Oct-1998

Oh. I mean, duh...!

Thanks, Andrew.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 21-Oct-1998

Or use the appropriate Alt + xxxx

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Oct-1998

See also: msg #102

Reply 5 offered by: Gene McGough on 21-Oct-1998

Peter's reply is the best way I've found. Remember to hold down the ALT key while keying the numeric code on the *keypad* keys, then release the ALT. I don't want to do the whole table here but: 129 ü, 130 é, 131 â, 132 ä, 133 à, 134 å, 135 ç, 136 ê, 137 ë, 138 è, 139 ï, 140 î, 141 ì, 142 Ä, 143 Å, 144 É, 145 æ, 146 Æ, 147 ô, 148 ö, 149 ò, 150 û, 151 ù, 152 ÿ, 153 Ö, 154 Ü, 155 ¢ . . . up to 255 which is supposed to be a blank character.

Gene

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 21-Oct-1998

Caution, in charmap (character map appication) the numeric code is given on 4 digits, and the leading zero DOES matter!!

Alt 0233 is "é", but Alt 233 is "Ú". (resp. &eacute; and &Uacute; in HTML code)

As this may vary on fonts (and/or windows' localization), you should check them by yourself to find out which are real values (always the one given by charmap).

And Ctrl-V (or good old Shift-Insert) works in Lyric window, as well as Ctrl-insert, Shift-Del (^C, ^X).

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Oct-1998

Thanks, all. I'm ashamed to admit that I didn't even know about the ALT xxxx trick... I guess I'm still learning something new every day.

btw - the Cntrl V approach works fine, but is a little clunky if you have several different special character requirements.

Reply 8 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 22-Oct-1998

marsu wrote:
> Alt 0233 is "é", but Alt 233 is "Ú"

"é" is at position 233 in ISO Latin 1 (ISO 8859-1), but do you know in which character set the character #233 is "Ú" ? Maybe in MS-DOS 8bits table ?

By the way, on my unix station, only Alt 233 works ! Ok, I don't have NWC on this machine :-)

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 02-Nov-1998

I had to deal with this problem yesterday. Yeah, ctrl-v
works. Yeah, I eventually thought of it, and, yeah, I was
pleased to see that it worked when I thought of it.

But: my fingers know the emacs commands much better than
the windows commands. Rather than try to remember the
windows not-so-long cuts I generally look at the menu. Then,
if I'm doing several of the same functions, I might notice
the alternate,control,shift,key,stand-on-head-and-
insert-elbow-in-ear sequences.

Now, this works fine in the music window. But, in the lyrics
window, all I get is "beep" when I go to the menu. It was
somewhat frustrating, since I knew that the menu would also
tell me the keystroke that I could use in the absence of the
menu.... I would probably have given up if I had not dimly
remembered that I had managed to do this several months
earlier.

So: please, at least put a "help" button in the lyrics dialog, if you can't get the "Edit" menu to work.

Reply 10 offered by: Peter Edwards on 03-Nov-1998

The "alt" sequences do work in the Lyric Box.

Try checking

1. You are using the numeric keypad

2. You type a leading zero. So alt 0235 gives "ë" (see it works here as well!) whereas alt 235 gives "_" ???!!!

HTH
Peter

Reply 11 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 04-Nov-1998

In Windows 95 (I can't speak for any other OS) there is an option someplace which allows the entry for most accented characters using simulated overstrikes.

I am not sure how I set this, but my "keyboard" setting under language is "US - International", so perhaps this is it. I also have defined my code page as 850, which contains many more accented characters than the default (437?), but lacks a lot of the box characters, which I don't us.

The way it works: one types one of the following, ' ` ~ " ^ followed by an alphabetic character. If the pair "makes sense" then an accented characher results, other wise the accent character is entered followed by the next character typed. Thus:

'a => á
'c => ç
~n => ñ
`e => è
"o => ö
^a => â

If you want one of the leading combinations above, e.g. 'e, you must type a space after the ', which will NOT appear in the text. Some of the above examples may not display correctly if you are not using code page 850 (for example I'm think that õ, an o with a tilda over it, will not).

Cyril


#914: Gliss.
Gliss.

(914)

Submitted by: Stephen Lamb on 21-Oct-1998

How can you make a Gliss. for the piano look right when you print it out?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Oct-1998

Gliss is not truly supported in NWC, but here are some threads that might help in a work around: msg #262, msg #298, msg #589, msg #596, msg #749, msg #791, msg #809, msg #811


#916: Crescendo/diminuendo signs
Crescendo/diminuendo signs

(916)

Submitted by: Peter Verbist on 22-Oct-1998

Is there a possibility to insert a crescendo/diminuendo sign.
i.e. no text s.a. cresc. / dim. but the sign itself :

< for crescendo
> for diminuendo

If the answer is yes, how do I do that.
I want this question to be solved before I buy the program.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 22-Oct-1998

Simply aid, the answer is No. But don't be desperated, CbB ("See BeLow")

But I'd add : for now. At the time I discovered NWC, I deeply needed the lyrics feature (which did not exist at that time). The time to think of a solution, and the new NWC version (1.20) get out, with the lyrics feature :-)

I don't say that next version of NWC will have full support for cresc/decresc. signs. Only God (and Eric) know. And maybe He wonders ;-)

But I wrote a solution 2 years ago which should be satisfactory --if you have a poscscript driver. Look at msg #157, msg #166, msg #188 or directly at http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/cresdecr.html which I just updated.

Lemme know what you think of it --if you use it !
But the principles is good I think, and maybe this could help for implementation... ;-)

NWCly yours,
                    MAD

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Oct-1998

Another way is Barry Graham's "Boxmarks" font. This contains cresc/decresc. hairpins as well as other performance marks, e.g. turns, arpeggiations, etc.

Download it from his website at:

http://members.tripod.com/~melbmusic/bits.htm

F

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 22-Oct-1998

I'd imagine that support of cresc/dim signs may be a little more difficult than we imagine. What happens if the marks "wrap around" (ie span more than one "line" of the staff)?
Marsu, what does your ps version do?

wrt: Barry's fonts, they are a text workaround and because of their limited size, are of limited use (but still better than greater-than and less-than signs!)

A

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 23-Oct-1998

When a cres/decresc. sign is splitted on 2 lines, I'm afraid the result ain't what you expect.
In fact my program draws lines from the starting point to the ending point. And if they're on different lines... then you'll get a cres. sign that crosses over the staff. Hard to explain, without a drawing. Anyway, in that case, I usually insert two cres/decresc. signs (one before the line jump, one after).

Guess it's time to make a more clever solution :-)

MAD

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 23-Oct-1998

This raises another issue.
Because we compose on an "infinite" (left to right, no line-break) script, we don't know where "line-breaks" are to facilitate things like Marsu's dec/cresc work.
Maybe NWC should mark "breaking" barlines in another colour as a cue (since NWC MUST know where these boundaries are).
Alternatively, if NWC took on hairpins, the problem would be solved, as it already copes with ties and slurs around linebreaks, doesn't it?

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Bowers on 26-Oct-1998

I think that NWC would only know where they are when formatting for printing. I can't imagine trying to keep track of that information on the fly when there are so many variables for a line break (font size, margins are two big ones that come to mind). It might be possible to mark the line breaks after doing a print preview or perhaps a line break audit tool.

Reply 7 offered by: John on 27-Oct-1998

My vote is for the Barry Graham "Boxmark" font that Nachbaur mentions (see below.) I had it operational in minutes.
You add the symbols as text. Use extra spaces to reposition the symbol if necessary. For something like multi-bar rest marker or single bar repeat symbol, be sure to check "Preserve Width" and insert a few spaces on either side.

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 27-Oct-1998

To Peter:
I guess that's what I meant. NWC would deal with line-breaks at print time.

A

Reply 9 offered by: Brian T. Hill on 09-Nov-1998

My lines don't break in the same place all the time. If I print a conductor's score, there will be more line breaks than if I just print a flute part or a horn part. And when each part is printed individually, their line breaks will occur in different places.


#917: ties, slurs etc. with layering feature
ties, slurs etc. with layering feature

(917)

Submitted by: Grant on 22-Oct-1998

I've looked through the offline and online forums (fora?) and haven't seen any mention of a problem I've run into with the experimental layering feature. When you layer independent parts, to keep the result readable you must make sure that the stems are up for the upper part and down for the lower part. There's no problem here because NWC gives you control over such things.

However, printed scores also generally force expression and articulation marks (staccato dots, slurs, ties, accents, etc.) to the outside of a shared staff, so that, for example, the ties in the lower part curve downwards and those in the upper part curve upwards. I have some layered staves where the lower part's ties curve upwards in the direction of the upper part, staccato dots on the upper part are covered by notes in the lower part, and so on.

Is there any way that the user can explicitly control the placement of articulation marks to make staff layering work better?

(Even if there is, can we add an item to the wish list for the next release? NWC needs a better built-in understanding of how multiple parts must be laid out so that they can gracefully share a staff. Correct placement of articulation marks is just one aspect of this, but it's one I haven't seen discussed before.)

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 23-Oct-1998

Okay, so I looked carefully at the offline forum and failed to notice the thread from _yesterday_ on the online forum addressing this very issue. Oops.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 23-Oct-1998

Never mind, Grant, the earlier thread ( msg #912 )was getting a bit long anyway! In February I posted a message (my first 'wet-behind-the-ears' one) - msg #476 - suggesting the publishing suite solution I mentioned in thread 912. Since then I've given a couple of plugs for Page Plus, msg #713 for example. The underlying need still remains for more control over symbols. Capella for example has a graphical solution (but otherwise doesn't match up to NWC in my opinion) as of course do the (much!) more expensive 'mainstream' programs. NWC Version 2 perhaps??

Peter.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 23-Oct-1998

Okay, here's one for the wish list.
To make the layering feature more fluid and effective, we need:
1) rests to be movable (up and down)
2) notes to be able to be tweaked left or right for when they are adjacent (same line/space or one apart)
3) expression marks switchable "to the outside" (this is a very straightforward definition which I like a lot!)

Anything else?

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Oct-1998

4) ability to beam over a rest, eg in 6/8 if you have:

note-rest-note note-rest-note

the present version doesn't allow the two groups to be beamed together... unless I'm missing something.

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP


#918: Placing a rest over existing notes
Placing a rest over existing notes

(918)

Submitted by: PaulM on 27-Oct-1998

On a stave with two parts, is it possible
to have a rest for part 1 while part 2 plays
e.g.
| | |
| # # | # | part 1
| # |
| _ _
| # # | part 2 with 2 beats rest
| |

Thanks in advance Paul M.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Oct-1998

You can treat a rest as a "chord member." Insert the rest first, then you can add notes of longer duration on top of it.

Sometimes, this isn't good enough, for instance if the note and rest are the same length. The workaround is to insert rests as "text" where required, by assigning one of your User fonts as NWCV15.TTF. You can then add rests (lower case r for example) exactly where needed.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 28-Oct-1998

Also see msg #908


#919: Cue notation
Cue notation

(919)

Submitted by: John on 27-Oct-1998

Is there any way to put in cued parts (played by other instrument but included FYI.) They are usually indicated with smaller notes. I tried grace notes but they weren't spaced correctly.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Oct-1998

Not directly in the current version (or any other program that I've used so far). Another difficulty with grace notes is that they will be sounded when you play the file, with perhaps unpredictable and unwanted results.

It's conceivable that you could do this be adding notes as text (see the previous message), but it might involve a bit of experimentation; i.e. using text strings consisting only of spaces (in a standard font) before/after the notes (in NWCV15 font) to space them as desired.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 27-Oct-1998

How was the spacing incorrect?
My main problem with using grace notes for cue notes is that NWC won't allow half or whole notes, and that they sounded.
Sounding can be fixed by adding a hidden dynamic marking which turns note velocity to 0 (or perhaps 1, maybe zero is a special case), or channel volume to zero.
Whole and half notes can be worked around by adding text, but "support" for cue notes would be nice. I mean, it's nearly there already.

A

Reply 3 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 28-Oct-1998

Another way that I once solved that problem was to create a duplicate staff, add the grace notes, mute it and layer it with the first staff. I don't know how to deal with notes longer than quarter notes.


#920: scroll lock
scroll lock

(920)

Submitted by: marsu on 28-Oct-1998

As maybe a few users know, the "scroll lock" key (near PrintScreen key, upper right) has a special function: it allows the user to scroll a document (try in an XL sheet, word doc, many standard scrollable windows) without moving the cursor.
I found that NWC doesn't support this (can't remembe if it did on earlier versions). Maybe this support could be added (it allows the user to do with keyboard what he/she could do with the mouse on scrollbars).

Just to know what other users think of this...

Note: I do _NOT_ like using the mouse ;) in case you didn't notice (why limiting oneself to 1 (MacOS), 2 or 3 buttons when you have 102 (or 105) keys???)

NWCly yours,
                MAD

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Oct-1998

Would you elaborate on this? I am not able to notice any special behaviour in MS-Word when Scroll Lock is on.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 28-Oct-1998

Sorry, you're right about Word. I didn't checked back.
But it is true for eXceL: when scroll lock is on, you can use the cursor keys (or PgDn, Pgup) to move the sheet without moving the selected cell(s), just as clicking with the mouse on scrollbars.

In NWC this could, for instance, allow to quickly go back to the beginning of a score (to check Key signature or whatever) without losing the current selection or place.

I remember to have read more on the "scroll lock" key function in the Windows SDK (inthe book about standard Windows GUI, which documents Ctrl-F6, Alt-PgDown, Ctrl-Tab, and so on. Can't remind the name of it).

HTH
    Marsu

Reply 3 offered by: Timitae on 28-Nov-1999

I'm sorry.. but Page Up and Page Down work anyway in things like Excel, even without the scroll lock button on. I'm going to go with this theory: Maybe it does nothing at all, and is just to put there so people spend every waking moment of their life trying to figure out what the heck it does.

Reply 4 offered by: Phil Symonds on 22-Sep-2000

Everyone knows that the scroll lock was designed for one purpose alone. At least everyone who played Rise of the Triad (A poor FPS before true 3d). This game had the great feature that however badly the game crashed (and it did - often) you could get back to the DOS prompt using the scroll lock key, to be greeted with the phrase "Scroll Lock Pressed!". This is the only ever documented use of the scroll lock key.

The scroll lock light is another matter entirely that was originally included just to enable people to simulate the KIT lights (from knightrider) through rapid key pressing.

Hope this has been enlightening
Phil

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Sep-2000

Here's a graphic demonstration of what the scroll lock does:

http://members.aol.com/elmothecow/scrollock/scroloff.htm

Reply 6 offered by: Matt Newey on 24-Oct-2000

You may be intersested to know that PC Format Magazine run a cartoon on the "Scroll Lock" key in November 2000 issue

Reply 7 offered by: Art thompson on 24-Oct-2000

This forum contains some great information from experienced users like Fred. It also contains some pleasant and refreshing vignettes, even on 2 year old threads! Keep up the good work.

Reply 8 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 24-Oct-2000

If I recall correctly... I think SimCity used it! If it was on, you wouldn't automatically scroll if you put the cursor at the edge of the screen. Other than that... No, I don't think it has a use.

Reply 9 offered by: El Dosso on 25-Oct-2000

Didn't "scroll lock" originally have some sort of use in DOS?

Reply 10 offered by: CN on 26-Oct-2000

Ok, scroll lock works in eXcel. If you push the up and down arrows with scroll lock off then it moves to the next vertical cell. If you press up and down when the scroll lock is on then it scrolls the screen without changing the current cell your in. It's equivalent to scrolling using the mouse and the scroll bar.

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Oct-2000

Hey, you're right! Learn something new every day... :)

Reply 12 offered by: Slinky on 27-Oct-2000

My theory on the scroll lock key is that it has no pre-defined use,

But when in the codeing a program you could probable add a conditional statement that made the keys do other actions.

for example:

if (down arrow pressed & scroll lock on) then
//do cool thing

Else {
//do normal
}

Thats why in most programms it dont do squat, but in others like ms Excel it has a purpose....

...Slinky...

Reply 13 offered by: Chris on 05-Nov-2000

On Via voice, the speech programe, you use to switch the mic on, although F12 is more useful

Reply 14 offered by: DannyBoy on 09-Dec-2000

From:
http://www.disability-network.org.uk/Computalk.htm

The Scroll Lock key is no longer used for its original purpose of stopping words disappearing off the top of the screen when it becomes full. The only function Microsoft assigns to the key now is when you use the Windows 98 Magnifier. If you have a Magnifier installed, press Scroll Lock while holding down the Windows key to copy the magnified screen. Step 3. The Pause key does nothing inWindows, but is useful in MS-DOS where it freezes the screen and stops words disappearing before you have a chance to read them. Try it out by restarting your PC and waiting for some of those mysterious lines of text that flash briefly into view when Windows loads. If you hit the Pause key at the right time, they'll stay on screen and remain there until you press any other key to release them. The Break function on the Pause key (hold down Control while pressing Pause) was designed to stop MS-DOS programs that had run out of control or to sever a link with a modem. Windows programs don't respond to the Break key. Step 4.

Reply 15 offered by: jan on 10-Dec-2000

it makes that little light go on :-P

Reply 16 offered by: ^RaGe^ on 10-Dec-2000

whats the average life expectancy of the light anyway? :P

Reply 17 offered by: Blom on 10-Dec-2000

It does that ? WOW !! , and guess what ? , u press it agen , it goes off...

Reply 18 offered by: Frosty on 10-Dec-2000

oh my just yesterday i found out that the key-board look incomlet if i wasn't there and three is beeter than 2

Reply 19 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 20 offered by: Blom on 10-Dec-2000

Well , i think , it would be like the keyboard without a scroll lock totally %&#$@# up....

Reply 21 offered by: ToxicBunny on 11-Dec-2000

woooooohoooooo and it has a coolllll light wowwww im amazed
does it change color aswell?

Reply 22 offered by: ^RaGe^ on 11-Dec-2000

I think if you hold the scroll lock down long enough a pizza deliver screen pops up... no fancy colors tho:(

Reply 23 offered by: Zentex on 11-Dec-2000

I just try that and it works!! But the pizza man took 5 min longer than useal. That maybe cause be some network problems experienced by his protocalls listed under network... actualy if you hold it a little bit longer down , the pizza man take less time. But i still think that little light look funny.

Reply 24 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 25 offered by: ToxicBunny on 11-Dec-2000

Dont make me talk to your manager boy!

Reply 26 offered by: ToxicBunny on 11-Dec-2000

ok thats it
theres a fly in my soup
im calling the manager!

Reply 27 offered by: Fr0sT_xTrEmE on 13-Dec-2000

About that Pizza thing, I ordered a Hawaiin Pizza and thay came with a sweet-and-sour chicken, maby becuase I had Caps lock on aswell, well, dunno but it took 2 min to receive the pizza

Reply 28 offered by: ^RaGe^ on 13-Dec-2000

how my key presses for a pizza? and whats the key combination for online hooker order?

is there a extra charge for using the scroll lock service?

*ponders*

Reply 29 offered by: James on 17-Dec-2000

WTF is wrong with you people?
The scroll lock is only for one thing:
excercising your power over the keyboard. You press it,
you OWN the keyboard. It shows the computer who's REALLY in control. Try it next time the computer is screwing up...
"Hey, you don't listen to me? Well.. {SCROLL LOCK} so naaah!" Unfortunatley, this doesn't work after a certain point when the computer completeley stops responding... it won't come on anymore.. then the computer is controlling something you own... lates.

Reply 30 offered by: Denis Galkin on 31-Jan-2001

I find jus exeles use to scroll lock but nothink more

Reply 31 offered by: doo_much on 02-Feb-2001

AMAAAAZING....
The true purpose of the "scroll lock key" seems to that of a chinese puzzle. One little button that toggles a light - and we've all spent 2 years contemplating the use thereof.
Productivity - Ya've gotta be kidding!

Reply 32 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Feb-2001

Zen philosophy question: If a scroll-lock key is pressed and the light is burned out, is it actually on?

Reply 33 offered by: John Anders on 23-Mar-2001

The "scroll lock" key obviously as clearly implied by the very name functions to lock the scroll.

Reply 34 offered by: Robin Withey on 23-Mar-2001

...or is it to scroll the lock? ;-)

Reply 35 offered by: Joe Music on 23-Mar-2001

I believe the term "scroll lock" is a carryover from medieval monasteries. It is related to the modern term, "writer's block."

Reply 36 offered by: Sev on 14-Apr-2001

lol the true use for scroll lock is to fill in the gap between print screena dn pause......i think microsoft was better off putting in some other kind of key...like a "hit computer upside the head when it stops responding" key. bt i think they will have to abbreviate it cause all those words cant fit on that singel key.....if you dont like it, you can always get a screwdriver and tear it out and then put duct tape on the light. i wont do that, me and my scroll lock key have become good friends. i turn him on and he just lays htere.....wait... i HATE THAT THING!!!!
:::gets screwdriver and a roll of duct tape::: there....no more scrolly =P

Reply 37 offered by: Moses Junior on 08-Jun-2001

well in my case I just hooked up a resistor a watch battery and a bigger led to my scroll lock, now its so easy to find the bathroom at night !

Reply 38 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 09-Jun-2001

Well, unless I'm wrong (which is more often than I'd like to admit), Scroll Lock was around before M$ cursed.... I mean joined... the PC world...

Reply 39 offered by: FranMan on 10-Jun-2001

I don't know about the pizza guy, but I do know that if you turn on the accesibility features in windows the scroll lock key also controls a little beep and can be used with the Num Lock key, which is only a bit more useful, to simulate warm-ups for brass instruments.

Reply 40 offered by: Inimicum on 02-Jul-2001

I use it for morus code with my friend across the office, it works rather well.

Reply 41 offered by: uutop on 31-Jul-2001

the coolest thing about my scroll lock key, is that it's
the only real CLEAN key i have, actually it's the only one that is readable...

Reply 42 offered by: user24 on 07-Aug-2001

DUH!!

The Scroll Lock key has 4 uses: 1 already mentioned (hidden features of a program unLOCKed with the key

2) the pizza one (try southern chicken deep pan, v. nice)

3) the excel one

and 4)

So geeky computer guys can open up the keyboard and attach laser guns, panic alarms etc where the scroll lock light is.

Reply 43 offered by: dado on 09-Aug-2001

Hey, guys, guys. Think a little of the inventor of the Einsteinlly key! He must feel a bit embarrassed. I think we should ask the man, even though I don't know who he is, but my best guess at the moment is that that key is a mistake (as well as he might be).


#921: Playback devices
Playback devices

(921)

Submitted by: Richard Nye on 28-Oct-1998

PLease help,
Some of my musical works lose the ability to play from time to time, when this occurs & I look in Staff,Staff properties,Play back device - I see that it defaults to <unavailable>,
This can be easily rectified by selecting my sound-card but I would prefer not to have to do this, and am curious to find out a possible reason. ?

Thank you ,

Rich Nye

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 28-Oct-1998

One guesses that knowingly or unknowingly you or your computer are running some other audio or multimedia application that has siezed your output device.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Oct-1998

Your selected play back device (in staff properties) is stored as a numeric index, based on the number of devices added to the play back availiability list in Tools, Options, MIDI. If you setup your staff MIDI properties, and then later change the number of devices used for play back, you can end up with staff play back set to an unavailable device (if you decrease the number of devices used for play back). In general, it is best to select one, and only one, device for play back in Tools, Options, MIDI unless you know exactly what you are doing. We generally recommend that you select the MIDI Mapper as your lone play back device.

See also: msg #334, msg #519, msg #773, msg #794


#922: Harp (celtic) & dulcimer (lap/mountain)
Harp (celtic) & dulcimer (lap/mountain)

(922)

Submitted by: Georgeanne on 29-Oct-1998

I am an untalented left brained retiree who has just ordered NoteWorthy product. Any help on finding simple Christmas music suitable for celtic harp and/or mountain dulcimer? I have plenty of sheet music from books but just getting into online, computer stuff for my music. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Oct-1998

Hi, there!

Welcome to the wonderful world of computer-assisted music.

Suggest you do a search using the search engine of your choice. Maybe something like,

+Christmas +music +midi

might be a good starting point. There's _lot's_ of stuff out there, just waiting to be discovered. The nice thing about NWC is that you can take a pre-existing midi file and import it, dress it up or modify as you see fit, and print out the result for actual live performance.

If you have sheet music, experiment with entering it into NWC. It's a great way to learn the program.

Regards,
Fred


#923: multiple tracks
multiple tracks

(923)

Submitted by: Jason Phillips on 01-Nov-1998

Can this software play multiple tracks of different instruments and does the software have a percussion feature?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Nov-1998

Yes to both. The limitation on number of tracks available will normally be determined by your hardware's track and polyphony capabilities.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 02-Nov-1998

I add a precision for the second question. The software doesn't actually have a "percussion feature", but it supports General Midi, and General Midi supports percussions, usually on the channel #10.


#924: Reassigning channel 10
Reassigning channel 10

(924)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Nov-1998

Is there a way of reassigning General Midi channel 10 to use the standard instrument patches (instead of the percussion patches)?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Nov-1998

The Midi Mapper allows you to reassign channels - certainly Win 3.1 MM did - You can edit the direction of channels to whatever device you like.
Cakewalk lets you redefine tracks, channels and instruments.

I guess you're using a later version of Windows but check out the User Tips - I have one in there about re-assigning the drum map so you can write your drums as notation and play it back as drum sounds. I used channel 16 for the drums.

I've tried IDEF Edit but haven't had success with it - if you get lucky tell me how.
The Drumkit package on my web site contains some stuff that may be of interest http://members.tripod.com/~melbmusic/bits.htm check it out.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Nov-1998

Hm... I'm actually trying to go the other way. I'm working on a piece that doesn't have drums, and it would be nice to have one more channel for "other stuff" (actually, timpani, which even though it's technically a drum, it's mapped in the standard GM map). My soundcard allows enough tracks, but I'd like to keep the file compatible with synths/soundcards that only allow sixteen tracks.

You've given me some tips to play with, though. And no, I'm not using a later version of Windows, I'm quite happy with 3.11...

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Nov-1998

Some higher end synthesizers allow some control like this, but it would depend on your equipment. On most sound cards, channel 10 will play drum sounds, and cannot be altered. You also run into max simultaneuous notes as an issue when looking for more channels...

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Nov-1998

Fred - I don't know which sound card you use but you could use the GS orchestral drum set (program 48 from memory) - in another bank but on channel 10.
That has a wide range of pitched tymps.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Nov-1998

Actually I have a Yamaha XG daughterboard on a "SB compatible" main board. So there's no problem getting lots of sounds, polyphony, etc. as long as I use _my_ card.

NWC Support's answer confirmed what I had feared. I can't use channel 10 for anything except drums if I want the resulting files to remain compatible on other GM devices...
(part of the GM definition....) Oh, well. Did a workaround by doubling two similar instruments on one track.

Thanks all.


#925: NWC Scriptorium open for business!
NWC Scriptorium open for business!

(925)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 01-Nov-1998

Folks!

The NWC Scriptorium, at http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ is now operational. It currently houses:
Barry Graham's NWC documentation (in numerous formats converted by Fred Nachbaur),
Adam's famous Passion Play,
about 20 of "my favourite things",
Barry and Drake's drumkit.zip,
Barry's boxmarks, and
the newsgroup archive (up to October) courtesy of Richard Woodroffe.

I now hesitantly invite you - one at a time - to offer your
pieces-de-resistance for inclusion in the database.

Unfortunately, item addition is still manual, so I ask the following:
1) ZIP it (if poss.) and post it to apurdam@pcug.org.au with the following
info.
For example:
Title: Castilla (Seguidillas) Op 47. Part 7
Composer: Albeniz, Isaac (1860-1909), Spanish
Categories: Romantic
Instruments: Piano
Creator: Andrew Purdam
Email: apurdam@pcug.org.au
Comments: From Suite Espanola

If you don't have bio on the composer, don't worry, I've got several books to help with that! (Michael Nachbaur has suggested that we augment the biogs with links to composer sites, etc which I think may be a neat idea once we're up and running with the database proper).

Have fun! And remember: Walk, don't run!

Andrew


#926: Bar lines move when converted to midi
Bar lines move when converted to midi

(926)

Submitted by: Robyn Adair on 02-Nov-1998

When I finished the manuscript for a piece in *.nwc form and
then exported to save as a *.mid file, it shifted the barlines 1 beat to the left removing the 1 beat pickup at the beginning (and of course the final 3 beats at the end of the piece)...the music to anyone else probably sounds the same but when viewed as a midi file manuscript, it is
simply not written correctly. How can I keep this from happening (and why did it?). Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Nov-1998

What software are you using to look at the exported MIDI file? If you are just re-importing it into NWC, then naturally your bar lines placements will not be preserved, as a MIDI file only includes note events, not bar lines and other decorations that appear in notation. NWC exports to a MIDI file exactly as the song is played back, except that fermata and breath mark delays are not exported (since these do not exist in MIDI files). It does not add or remove any beats to the exported song.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Nov-1998

You can keep this from happening (probably) by inserting rests before the anacrucis (pick-up note) to fill it out to a full bar. E.g. in 4/4, if your anacrucis is 1/4, put a 1/2 rest and a 1/4 rest on each staff before the note.

Reply 3 offered by: Robyn Adair on 02-Nov-1998

Thanks for the quick reply....I opened it up using Cakewalk
which is another program similar to Noteworthy. It displays the entire music manuscript of any *.mid file...but in this case, displayed it with the barline shift to the left (also causing many half notes to become tied quarters over the bar) Not really a problem from the listening angle, but anyone else who opened/printed that midi file (which will be displayed on a webpage)using a music program capable as such, would see the manuscript incorrectly written. I was just curious how I could compose using the Noteworthy program, and then convert it to a *.mid without that shift.
(I am only using the shareware versions of both programs to compare before I buy, as the cost difference is quite a bit.) I had written the 4 part arrangement out in pencil and then simply used the computer keyboard to transfer it into Noteworthy to see how it printed out. The Noteworthy (*.nwc) version printed exactly as written...the *.mid version, which I didn't print but just looked at, was altered. Robyn

Reply 4 offered by: Robyn Adair on 02-Nov-1998

I'm sort replying to my own reply here (???)...in other words, wouldn't the music to the First Noel, which starts with a 2 note/single beat pickup look rather ridiculous to anyone who has spent a lifetime of Christmases playing it, if it weren't in correct notation...I guess I would gag and say who wrote this mess and how did they ever get through Theory 101!! ;-DD Ha! Robyn

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 02-Nov-1998

So, does Cakewalk do a better midi import than Noteworthy?

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 03-Nov-1998

Fred is right - put the appropriate rests in the first bar to pad it out to a full bar, and the exported MIDI file will re-import correctly. At least it does in NWC - I've just tried it!

Reply 7 offered by: Robyn Adair on 03-Nov-1998

Thanks for all the tips etc. Whenever I'm comparing similar software (whether Netscape vs IExplore or Cakewalk/Encore/Noteworthy etc) I usually try to view/do something from a third party to see exactly how each program treats the same file. In this case, I was looking at my own Noteworthy creation...I probably should use a *.mid file that I did not create, then export/convert, then import back to view.
Cakewalk has limits on its freeware trial version also...you cannot print or save-to-disk anything you do. (You can create or import and then fool with it all you want...but the creation and all changes to someone else's are lost when you close the program). This doesn't allow me see what actually gets printed or saved in the end...nor does it allow saving-to-disk and reopening in another program to see if any changes occur at the "save or import" point.
I did find one other glitch. I opened that *mid file back in Noteworthy this morning and it of course had to convert it back into *.nwc format to see it...the barlines were still in the "moved" position...but in addition to that, the original grand staff (piano score) was then split into 3: a single treble with the sop/alto lines but the bass clef became two - another treble and a bass. The tenor line was placed by itself on the second treble and the bass on the bass. Instead of looking like a standard hymn right out of hymnal (4 pt Chorale or keyboard use),...it looked liked I had scored it for individual voices on 3 staves (S/A - T - B). The tenor line did have a couple of higher notes above the staff (c and d) but certainly not enough to warrant assigning it to the treble clef....very weird.
Cakewalk has its own filetype *.wrk and a "bundling" of complete info *.bun, plus *.mid and two others: *.rmi and *.mff And I would assume like Noteworthy, stores the most complete and true information about a creation on its own filetype, using *.mid as a common exchange format - losing some things in the process. If you're not using these programs to make a living (and need more sophistication) but are just having fun...Noteworthy costs 1/3 as much...fun for a great price!

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 03-Nov-1998

Rats! I can't find where we covered this, but you can fix the anacrusis problem on reimported midi files by placing a double bar after the anacrusis note and then hitting "Audit Bar Lines".

A

Reply 9 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-Nov-1998

You could insert a Section Open barline and run the Audit barlines but it will still leave strange tied notation.
It is safer to pad out the anacrusis bar with rests if you are exporting to a midi file.
Try padding the first bar -run a bar audit then export as a midi file and re-import into NoteWorthy which will now think the first measure starts on the first beat and organizes the rest of the score to match.
Padding the first bar also leaves some space at the front of the piece to add any sysyex or controllers in Cakewalk.

The problem you had with the keyboard can be fixed in import - check the list of imported tracks you will find that the lower staff is split because the range of notes in the staff exceeds the 18 semitone default setting.
Either increase this value to something larger (or the maximum 127) or edit the imported tracks changing the split point or reducing the split track to one.

Incidentally - You must check out the print capabilties of Cakewalk before deciding on the software to purchase.
For my money NoteWorthy produces printed scores of higher quality but if you intend to make midi files the sound control in Cakewalk is superior. (sorry Eric!)

Reply 10 offered by: Robyn Adair on 03-Nov-1998

Hey...to everybody...thanks a bunch!! This is one of the best (and fastest) forums out there. I've asked questions on forums before and grown *old* waiting for someone to respond...you guys are too much! I'm going to try all these suggestions. Also I just came offline registering my copy so I can do all the neat stuff all the time!!! ;-DD Robyn

Reply 11 offered by: John Hart on 01-Jul-2000

This is not a reply but a question:

How do I convert Encore music files to Midi files?? Thanks

John Hart


#927: values of tempo terms
values of tempo terms

(927)

Submitted by: Francois Faucher on 02-Nov-1998

Would it be possible to have a table containing the tempo terms and their beats/minute instead of their definition or rate of speed?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Nov-1998

I do not understand your question. In NWC, you specify a tempo in beats per minute. You can also optionally display a standard text expression describing the tempo, but the numeric tempo still controls the playback speed.

Reply 2 offered by: Francois Faucher on 02-Nov-1998

In other words, my question was: what theoric value of beat/min must one associate to, for example, andante, largo, presto, etc.?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Nov-1998

There are no hard and fast rules on how to equate tempo marks into numeric tempo, so when not specified, the performer should satisfy the spirit of the mark. When entering into NWC, NWC is the performer, but you are its guide, and the numeric tempo allows you to specify it to what sounds best.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Nov-1998

If you are just looking for a definition of some of the tempo terms, a look at http://www.dreamscape.com/esmith/dansm/notate/terms.htm might get you started.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 03-Nov-1998

The quickest answer is ot look at a "métronome" (don't know the word in English : you know, that mechanical thing any musician hates).

But one thing to keep in mind is that some Largo can seem quicker than some Andante... Due to the number of notes per beat, for example a Largo with sixteenth (double-croches) and a Presto with only half notes...

Another thing : the real tempo is rarely indicated, giving the performer(s) many differences in interpretation. As it appears, in concert it is always quicker... ;-)

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Nov-1998

... and very often gets faster as it goes along, especially if it also gets louder... :-)

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 03-Nov-1998

A note for marsu regarding "métronome": This is one of those fortunate times when the English word is just the French word pronounced differently and written without diacritics. Would that life (and translation) were always that easy.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 04-Nov-1998

So Grant, should I invite you to drink a "café" in a coffee shop, or a coffee in a café ? :-)

Well, I guess translators will still be needed for a long time!

To help for "francophone" ppl, I'll write a page giving translation between US English, UK ENglish, (what about Australia ? Same as US it seems ?), French, maybe german... Soon on your PC screens :-)

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 05-Nov-1998

Marsu!

Whilst most people know otherwise, many Australians would vehemently deny that the US is their main cultural influence. (Mine personally is probably India, the Middle East or Africa, but that's another story). I guess many Aussies would look to Mother England, or her estranged sister, Ireland. In this Century, most Australian immigration has been from Europe (Italy, Greece - Melbourne has the highest Greek population in a city outside of Greece) and latterly from Vietnam, Lebanon, Indonesia, though the single most significant source country remains the Olde Countrye. I guess most US culture is imported through that old cathode ray tube that i never watch (preferring to spend most of my spare time watching the computer's!)

A

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 05-Nov-1998

Andrew, really sorry if I hurted your sensivity !!

I do _not_ suppose that US is he source of Australian culture, (they have enough influence on the rest of the world, on lil' cathodic or movie screens, plus radio) but only that for musical terms used in NWC forum, it seems that Australian people use the same term as the North-american people. Unless you use hemi-semi-demi-quaver... I think that your language took a different way than the UK, just as Quebec did about the french language.
And the boats that arrived in 1788 certainy did not came from America :-)

Should I be forgiven if I give this link http://aboriginalart.com.au/didgeridoo/dig_background.html ?

NWCly yours,
                      Marsu

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Nov-1998

Thanks for that, Marsu! _Very_ cool link! Now I'll just have to figure out how to download the audio clips, since my machine isn't quite fast enough for RealAudio :-(

Or get a newer computer :-)


#928: MIDI to CD audio format
MIDI to CD audio format

(928)

Submitted by: Priscilla Coe on 03-Nov-1998

I would like to transfer a MIDI file to CD (as music, not as data backup). Can this be done without a lot of expense? I have access to a CD writer. Will the nice piano quality I heard on my Yamaha Clavinova 560 and then recorded to a MIDI file on disk be translated to the CD audio format (WAV or ??). Are there MIDI to audio converters available to download? Thanks in advance for any help.

Reply 1 offered by: Kassandra Thomas on 03-Nov-1998

In order for you to be able to have the song saved on a CD, you must have a writeable AUDIO CD, similar to the ones used for today's music CD's. Then you use either Windows Explorer or File Manager to access the file, save it to the CD (if it is in NWC format, it is recommended that you convert it to MIDI or WAV first), and when you wish to play it, open an audio or midi player from your windows directory and open the file through the CD.

Kassandra

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Nov-1998

More info: Yes, you'll have to convert your .nwc file first to .mid, then to .wav. The .wav has to be "raw pcm" (not Microsoft ADPCM), recorded in stereo at 44,100 samples per second.

Most modern soundcards will let you do this - i.e. record the .wav while playing the .mid (using the native Media Player / Sound Recorder, or via a third-party wav recording/editing package. I'm really happy with CoolEdit, which was actually included bundled with my soundcard).

You then basically just have to transfer the raw pcm .wav to the CD burner via the appropriate software.

Reply 3 offered by: Priscilla Coe on 04-Nov-1998

Thank you! I'll try it.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 04-Nov-1998

Priscilla, you asked <Will the nice piano quality I heard on my Yamaha Clavinova 560 . . be translated to the CD audio format?>

OK, I've never done this, but I suspect that the recorded .wav file quality will be dependent entirely on your sound card - the nice sound from the Clavinova is produced by the high quality guts of said machine, not the computer. So unless you play your MIDI file through the Clavinova and record from its output, or you have an extremely good sound card with excellent samples, you may be disappointed by the result. Let us know how you get on.

Peter.

Reply 5 offered by: Priscilla Coe on 04-Nov-1998

What Peter said was exactly right. I downloaded a MIDI to WAV converter and the resulting WAV file was not high quality, not even sounding like a piano. So to be able to translate the high quality sound from my Clavinova to CD I may have to have a better sound card? Or might it be the MIDI to WAV converter's abilities?

Reply 6 offered by: drake donahue on 04-Nov-1998

Perhaps the clavinova has speaker out or line out connection?
Perhaps your sound card has line in or mic in?
Perhaps you could hook up one of the above outs to one of the above ins and use wave recorder software to sample at 44.1 or 48 khz, 16 bits, stereo or mono and save a .wav of your music as produced by your very fine synthesizer?

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 05-Nov-1998

I wonder, Priscilla what sound card you have. I used to use an ordinary Sound Blaster 16, which had a tinny piano sound. I now have an Awe 32 which is much better. So the first thing to decide is whether the sound from your computer is acceptable, particularly when played through a Hi-Fi setup - after all, your Clavinova has a quality amplifier/speaker system. If not, then you must record from the Clavinova output - I'm sure it will have a line out socket. Or you may be able to load a better sound sample depending on your sound card. Anyway, if your sound card output is acceptable, but you're not happy with your MIDI to Wave converter, have a look at the software that came with your sound card. I can only comment on my own system - I've just had a go making a .wav (it's amazing what this forum prompts you to try). My SB AWE 32 comes with a software suite including 'Wave Studio'. I set up a file ready to play (it can be a composition direct from NWC, or a MIDI file played through Windows Media Player or Noteworthy Player), then set up Wave Studio to record at the maximum available fidelity (stereo, 44100 KHz, 16 bits). Started recording, then started the tune playing. And there it was - a faithfully reproduced wave file, just as Fred suggested earlier in this thread. Beware - at 10 Mb per minute you need lots of Hard Disc space. This may solve your problem, but if I were you I would try and record from the Clavinova output as Drake suggests - there is line input on my sound card and associated software to pick it up, hopefully this will apply to you also.

Best of luck, Peter.

Reply 8 offered by: bill gates on 05-Nov-1998

Peter's answer is perfect, as usual.
with this only exception: set to 44100 Hz, not KHz or you'll explode your disks in a few seconds ;-)

And do not forget that your card (if not good enough) may not interpret stereo as your Clavinova. The best is to listen with headphones to get in idea of what you can obtain.

Reply 9 offered by: Priscilla Coe  on 05-Nov-1998

I'll try what Drake and Peter suggest with the speaker output. I'm not sure if my sound card has the stereo connectors but I bet it does (I'm at work and can't check now). Not sure what my sound card is, but I think it's fairly good - one year old, came with my Compaq Presario. The driver is ESS something if that tells you anything. Do I just need to buy a cable with stereo connectors at either end and then configure the sound card to use the stereo input instead of the microphone? I never realized you could bypass the MIDI file - that'll be great if it works. Thanks for all the suggestions - I'll let you know what happens tonight!

Reply 10 offered by: Priscilla Coe on 05-Nov-1998

Wow, I'm getting some high-powered advice here. Thanks, Bill... (aren't you a little busy for this)?

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Nov-1998

No, you won't even need to mess with cables to route the soundcard's synth output to the wav (i.e. mic or line) input. Your software mixer should take care of that for you... at least it does on my system.

I'll have to admit, though, I had to resort to reading my soundcard's instruction manual to find this out... ;-)

Fred

Reply 12 offered by: Peter Vasey on 06-Nov-1998

Hi, Bill, I wondered why my office suddenly filled up with bits of shredded Hard Disc! Well spotted!

Peter.

Reply 13 offered by: Priscilla Coe on 07-Nov-1998

Well, it works great. Going directly from the Yamaha to the sound card via the speaker jacks. Recording via Compaq's Wave Maker. Didn't have to mess with the sound card except to turn the volume down so I could turn the Yamaha up to the volume I wanted. The quality came through just fine for me.

Thank you all for the advice. Couldn't have done it without you!

Reply 14 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 07-Nov-1998

You probably also also a "line out" plug somewhere on the rear panel of your Clavinova.
Connecting that plug to the "line in" of your sound card should provide a better, undistorded, record as both signals levels and adaptation do match perfectly.

Best of luck as said peter.

Reply 15 offered by: Bill Gates on 16-Nov-1998

Peter,

Don't worry, this "scale error" appears often. Don't you remember when I said "640 Kb should be enough for anyone" some years ago ? I obviously meant "640 Mb..." but twas too late.

Reply 16 offered by: Priscilla Coe on 16-Nov-1998

One problem I've been having since I've been using the stereo output. Update: I bought the cable that goes from the Yamaha AUX to the sound card and then use my sound card's wave maker to record. At first it was good but then the next night the cable was somehow picking up a radio or TV station. And it gets recorded, too! It keeps happening. Not good.

I'm back to wanting to convert the MIDI file to a Wave file. The MIDI file is just so much cleaner and nice. I'll try what Peter suggested, using my sound card's software to record a wav file while the midi is playing.

Reply 17 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Nov-1998

That sure sounds like a bad cable, i.e. one of the "grounds" (the outside part of the cable) isn't making contact... or it's not a shielded cable.

Isn't technology wonderful (when it works)?

Reply 18 offered by: Don Ferguson on 05-Dec-1998

I certainly am not against technology, but isn't the conversion of NWC Midi files to .Wav files a little too much technology as described in previous posts to get the job done?

What has anyone against merely recording the midi onto a high quality tape recorder? Certainly less hassle. Or is the supposed quality of a CD that important to get the job done?

A tape recorder is so much more versatile and easier to edit or change as recordings are made.

Reply 19 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Dec-1998

Well, I think the point is that, having a CD burner available, and given the low cost of blank CD's, longevity and stability, sound quality, as well as the other benefits, why not?

Some of the problems that were discussed in this thread - e.g. interfacing to external synths, bad cables, etc. could happen with a tape recording also. Conversion to .wav is actually the easy part - once the hardware is in order.

Interestingly, I'm in the process of going in the other direction - making wav files of some of my old archive tapes so I can clean up the tape hiss, try to recover lost highs, and fix dropouts and other anomalies using wav editing.

Reply 20 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 07-Dec-1998

In reply to Fred's reply, you may find pretty efficient softwares able to simplify the process like CD Spin Doctor.
CD Spin doctor, from Adaptec, is part of the EASY CD CREATOR suite delivered with some CD burners.
His main purpose is to transfer old vinyl recordings to CD performing hiss and scratches removal as well as automatic track switching.

Reply 21 offered by: Chris Coon on 10-Jan-1999

If you still want to convert your mids to Wav, try Wavmaker with which I've been very happy. That is what the program is meant for. A demo can be found at www.polyhedric.com

Reply 22 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Jun-1999

>Does anyone know of any software out there that lets you save a .wav file
>(or other recorded audio file) onto a cd so that a regular audio cd player
>(not a cd-rom) can play it?

Most CD-R drives come with bundled software for buring a variety of CD formats. In this case, you want to burn "CD Audio" using source wave files. If you already have a CD-R drive, you should look through the bundled software to see if you already have software for burning a CD Audio disk.

Other things of note:

-> Some CD-R software allows you to burn an audio CD directly from source music, with no intermediate step of creating a collection of WAV files. If you do not have 700MB of free disk space, you might want this (the tradeoff is that you are, in effect, writing the CD at 1X speed, since you can write the CD no faster than the audio can actually be played.

-> If you plan to make a CD of NWC compositions, you probably want to record the play back of your songs while they play in NWC. To do this, you need a program that can record digital audio at 44.1 KHz stereo (the format used in CD Audio). Your sound card must also be "Full Duplex" capable, which means that it can record and play back at the same time.

-> If you have not purchased a CD-R drive yet, make sure you look at the bundled software list so you ghet what you want to make audio CDs. Also, if you want to avoid gaps between your audio tracks, you will want a drive that support "Disc-At-Once" writing.

-> You need to use CD-R disks, rather than CD-RW disks, to create audio CDs. The reflectivity of a CD-RW disk is different, and normal audio CD drives (and many computer CD drives) do not contain the necessary laser for reading CD-RW disks.

-> In my experience, CD-R disks are a little heavier than manufactured CDs (from a glass master), and may not be playable in all audio CD drives. One of my old CD players cannot get unlabelled CD-R gold disks spinning fast enough to play them. If they are labelled, it just makes this situation worse.

Reply 23 offered by: Inez on 24-Sep-1999

But how do I get my NWC files changed to .WAV files?
Thanks, Inez

Reply 24 offered by: Sue Morton on 25-Sep-1999

Hi Inez,

You need a WAV recorder (a small one comes with Windows, but you will probably need something that can record longer).

You play the MIDI file and record the result with the WAV recorder. I use Cool Edit, there is a shareware version available at:

http://www.syntrillium.com

(My SoundBlaster Live! came with Creative Wave Studio, that can make the WAV file too. And there are many other WAV recorder programs out there on the 'net.)

HTH,

Sue

Reply 25 offered by: Cool Baby on 13-Nov-1999

A good program for converting sound from any source is, total recorder which can be found at http://WWW.Download.COM

There are many other FREE!! programs there that can do this stuff, Just type Keyword: CD Audio

Reply 26 offered by: KoolKat on 19-Dec-1999

I've been writing my own MIDIs for a long time now, and I've always played around with MIDI to WAV conversion. Let me tell you, when you just want to hear a familiar tune, quality isn't that important, but when you want to show off music that you've created to your friends, quality is probably the most important thing. I write my music for the Yamaha XG Soft MIDI driver, but most MIDI to WAV converters will not let you use your computer's midi driver, they come with an instrument set of their own...IF ANYONE KNOWS ANY MIDI to WAV CONVERTER THAT WILL LET YOU USE YOUR OWN MIDI DRIVER, PLEASE LAT ME KNOW THROUGH THIS FORUM OR THROUGH E-MAIL...THANX IN ADVANCE :)
P.S If anyone is interested in hearing my music, feel free to e-mail me.
KoolKat

Reply 27 offered by: Barry Graham on 19-Dec-1999

You can use a great software tool - Audio Compositor.
Search the name and download an evaluation copy from their web site.
The process is done "offline" - the WAV file is created in memory using your soundfonts - I suppose it will find your softsynth data.
Check it out.

Reply 28 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Dec-1999

No, sorry. AC won't work with Yamaha XG (either the softsynth or the firmware versions). Yamaha apparently uses a proprietary wave file format that AC can't read.

I've tried quite a few sf2 soundfonts with the trial version of Audio Compositor, and though I'm still seriously considering registering it, it would only be for "special effects." For general use I haven't found any sound fonts I prefer to the Yamaha sounds. Your best bet is to use the "old" way of recording your midis/nwc files, i.e. record to .wav directly from your sound card or external synth using an analog connection.

Reply 29 offered by: satansdog on 09-Mar-2000

Please forgive and ignore me if this request should not be here.

I've been using Audio Compositor for a while now... and for the simple stuff i'm doing with my SBLIVE and soundfonts... i find it gets the job done well enough, (converting midi to wav that is). I was just wondering however... i am using Cakewalk Express Gold, (came with the card), and occasionally i like to record a midi track to a wav track while it's playing... (i.e. all recording is done in cake walk)... however for some reason and on a regular basis... cakewalk seems to be able to only record for a few seconds, (say 15), before it just conks out. The program doesn't crash... it just stops recording... no error message at all, (and yes i have plenty of HD space). Has anyone experienced something like this before? (There is a reason why i want to do it all in cake walk and not just record it to an external wave program like soundforge... but this message is long enough... i won't blab on.)

Thankyou for any help...

SD.

Reply 30 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 31 offered by: Chris carter on 20-Mar-2000

I've got my album recorded nicely in wav. does any one know where i cant get a resonablely priced cd burner with easy cd creator 4

Reply 32 offered by: Ben on 24-Mar-2000

Hey people,

I want to make my midi files into wav and i dont really understand much about it and its real confusing if anyone could help i would be vaery thankful.

Reply 33 offered by: Grant on 28-Mar-2000

Have you taken a look at msg #1003?

Reply 34 offered by: Almassud on 08-May-2000

hi
I was trying to record some songs from my casset player to my pc and I wanna record them to the CD rom coz I have a CD writer but before I do that I want the quality of the songs to be in a CD quality, so how can I do that.
thank you

Reply 35 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-May-2000

The GIGO principle applies here ("garbage in, garbage out"). If you have a muddy old cassette recording and transfer to CD, you'll have a muddy old CD recording. There are utilities (such as CoolEdit) which allow you to do various manipulations such as noise reduction, filtering, and equalisation, but they all carry a price; for example, too much noise reduction will introduce other distortions, etc.

Reply 36 offered by: The Rock on 29-May-2000

I would like to convert Real Audio File's To a cd as a music backup how do I do that

Reply 37 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-May-2000

The RealAudio format, like mp3, uses the playback wav driver of your sound card. So your sound card needs to be full-duplex, i.e. capable of recording and playing at the same time. The procedure would be, basically, open your wav recorder and start it recording. Open up RealPlayer and start playing. Adjust playback and record volumes as required to get a good recorded level (not too high so it clips, not too low so it's down in the mud). Repeat until satisfied. :)

Reply 38 offered by: LL on 06-Jun-2000

Hello! I have a big problem: I have a AWE64 Value soundcard and would like to convert midi into wav. The card should be able to do this by playing the midi with one player and recording it with CoolEdit. But it says "device already in use"...and I don't know any progs, that can convert it directly. WaveMaker III would be great but I don't have the money to buy it, secondly, I would have to order it and I live in Europe, so it would be expense. So I'd need a small freeware prog. that can convert it...any ideas? What should I do? Please mail me, if you have any suggestions!
(also if you have an AWE64 Value and it works)

Reply 39 offered by: Jeff c on 29-Jun-2000

Unfortunetly for all I have no reply's to previous questions and comments. My interest is to read from my school text book through a microphone (via mic input on my sound card) and to change the wave format so I'm able to burn a CD and listen to "my voice" in my car on my way to work. If anyone has a suggestion or comments I would be greately appreciative.

Thank's alot.

Jeff c

Reply 40 offered by: Grant on 04-Jul-2000

Jeff, there should be no need to "change the wave format". If you have a CD/RW drive, the odds are that it came with CD-burning software. All such software that I've heard of can write .wav files (such as Windows Sound Recorder produces) to CD, performing the necessary format translation automatically. You might want to check your software's documentation or Help file.

Reply 41 offered by: Jeff c on 08-Jul-2000

Thanks for the advise Grant!! Let me look into this (I need to purchase some blank cd's) and I will reply with my progress.

Thanks again, Jeff

Reply 42 offered by: Pebbles on 12-Jul-2000

I am trying to use micorphone wwith yahoo messenger voice chat but when i try it says error and that it cant find audio mixer,can someone please help me and tell me what i need to do as soon as possible. Thank You

Pebbles

Reply 43 offered by: Cid Highwind on 22-Jul-2000

I have been reading each of these messages... and I thought i saw a free Mid-to-wav.. All those SHAREWARE progs have limits.. and I have tried all of them.. Im not seeing anything i like. Is there a FREEWARE prog to do this? (Yes I have tried the cord, Plugged into the MIC and Line out and it doesnt come out good quality I want.. I used a Shareware prog, and it did 30 seconds, and it sounded better that way..)

If ya can help Email me TIA. Cid Highwind

Reply 44 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 45 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 46 offered by: tommy on 06-Aug-2000

ther is a program on www.musicmatch.com
when you download it you go to file and create cd and that's

Reply 47 offered by: Cid Highwind on 08-Aug-2000

I tried that Music Match thing
It will Convert wavs and a few other types to MP3 but not Midis

Ok Lets change the Question

How Bout Midi To MP3?

Reply 48 offered by: Grant on 09-Aug-2000

From what I've heard, the way to do this is to convert the MIDI to WAV and then convert the WAV to MP3. For MIDI-to-WAV conversion, check out the extensive discussion in msg #1003.

Reply 49 offered by: Jeff c on 31-Aug-2000

Well Grant, I have finally found the time and scratch to purhcase CD-R's. To my delight you were right. I did not have to alter the wave format! My plextor writer copied the wave files nicely. Now I can safely, on my 40 minute drive to work, "study" with my own lechure. Thanks again and keep up the good work. You have been supportive to all involved on this site.

Jeff c

Reply 50 offered by: BiGGieSmG on 02-Jan-2001

Ah, the famous converting mid to wav file paradox. I think the only reasonable way to do this is to GET A CREATIVE SOUNDBLASTER!! Fine if you don't like their quality, but their included software always has an easy-to-use recording program (such as the Creative Recorder that comes with Live!Value), which, if used with any soundblaster with fullduplex (haven't tried it with any other brands) will amazingly convert midis to waves!! I just dropped by to tell you that there are people out there who've been using this kind of software for years. And no, it doesn't require fancy external cables and line-ins/outs, just the program. If you are really needing for a solution to ur converting dilemma, don't take my word for it, give it a try. I'm sure you can find out where to download it (mine came with my compaq's quickrestore disk, which has free drivers for the live!value even tho mine is only pci128). Sorry to write so much, just thought it would help someone. Later!

Reply 51 offered by: Brad Blumer on 16-Jan-2001

Hey out there to all of you with trouble converting MIDI files to .wav or .mp3. I have tried just about every progam mentioned in all of the internet forums, and only 1 has ever worked for me! MODPLUG TRACKER:

http://www.modplug.com/index.shtml

All you do it open a midi, then go to File/Save as Wave or Save as MP3, how much easier can it get? I tried plugins for Real, WinAmp, have tried Cool Edit, WavMaker, Total Recorder, Wav2Mid, Wingroove and all of them either didnt work or had registration limits. This is free and worked for me!!!

Reply 52 offered by: Dave  on 19-Mar-2001

I'm trying to record a casset tape onto my cpu and record onto cd. What device or equipment do i need, and what type of software shuold i use.

Thank You

Reply 53 offered by: michel on 19-Jun-2001

I'mcomputer dumb and trying to convert a midi file from pgmusics band in a box to something that is playable on a cd player.i have a macintosh a yamaha burner and adaptec toaster software.can this be done?i've sorta seen the answer in other peoples questions but if anyone could help me more specifically i would be gratefull,considering that finding software if needed for macintosh seems difficult. thank you

Reply 54 offered by: Missteecat on 26-Jul-2001

I have permission to make a midi from a CD from a Gospel Artist in Nigeria. I need to know how to make a midi. How do I make a midi from a CD???? Thanks for your help!!!

Reply 55 offered by: Grant on 27-Jul-2001

This may sound like a flip answer, but the easiest way may be to play the CD and use NoteWorthy Composer to write down what you hear.

The problem boils down to how to convert data representing the sounds of a real musical performance into a file containing MIDI instructions for mimicking that performance. This is by no means trivial.

For a number of lengthy discussions of this issue, see (among others!!) msg #1003, msg #1207, msg #1514, msg #2025.

Reply 56 offered by: Grant on 27-Jul-2001

My apologies. The first 2 links I gave are useless - they refer to conversion *from* MIDI.

Reply 57 offered by: Earl Kenvin on 15-Nov-2001

I have converted MIDI to WAV using Cakewalk Pyro. The results are good, but not musically acceptable. And the quality diminishes when recorded to CD. As a former programmer (retired), my intuition tells me that it is possible to convert a MIDI file to standard (Redbook?) CD audio format WITHOUT MAKING WAV(ES), i.e by direct conversion of the MIDI binary data to CD data. However, I also realize that if it is feasible, some CD recording software would already do it, i.e. allow midi files in a playlist. I would like to know if such software exists.
If you have a suggestion, please e-mail.


#929: Cyber Hymnal
Cyber Hymnal

(929)

Submitted by: Peter Edwards on 06-Nov-1998

I've just followed a link to this wonderful repository of hymn tunes, but the link to the NWC scores from the individual hymns fails, although you can download them in Zip files from another page.

OK, but if you try to tell the owner this you get a message saying they've shut up shop for any more input, which is a great pity. Can we encourage them to open up again.

It shows how good the NWC format is for such sites.

Reply 1 offered by: Paul on 06-Nov-1998

What is the URL for this site?

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 09-Nov-1998

http://tch.simplenet.com

Reply 3 offered by: Cyber Hymnal on 12-Dec-2000

We're open for business at http://www.wordnic.com/~tch !

Reply 4 offered by: JTK on 07-Jan-2001

As of 7:36 PM, January 7, this is the address for Cyber Hymnal I used. http://tch.wordnic.com/

Reply 5 offered by: The Cyber Hymnal on 18-Jan-2001

We've had to move once more (hopefully, for the last time!). Our URL is now:

http://www.cyberhymnal.org


#930: Sound without a soundcard
Sound without a soundcard

(930)

Submitted by: Stephen Randall on 06-Nov-1998

This seems a bit of dumb question but is it possible to get NWC to play without a sound card?

I use NWC mostly at home (with a Creative Labs 16 bit FM card which is just about tolerable if you limit yourself to accoustic piano). However, I have no web access at home but, thanks to a generous employer, I can keep in touch at work. But at my work PC has no sound card so to hear the NWC offerings and examples attached to newsgroup items I have to download onto a floppy and take them home. Generally I can't be bothered (except for Fred's Wonderful Extracts of Magic Flute). It would be really nice to have a quick preview, no matter how lousy the quality is, before I decide what to put on my floppy to take home.

So:

Can I get my work PC's beeper to beep under instruction from NWC?

How is it that I get audio out of my CD ROM drive via the headphone socket without a sound card? Can I feed it with something from NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 06-Nov-1998

To my knowledge, there is no way t do this. The some "samplers" programs that know need the MIDI device to be operative to generate (through CPU computes and not special sound device) a .wav or somewhat equivalent (direct output to hp through the speaker.drv (I can send you the one I got if needed, though rather disappointing).

I'm currently in the same situation as you are, and didn't find any solution. But maybe there is hope anyway ???

About your CD output : this is completely independant of the motherboard or OS. The proof of this is that I often (at home, here I ain't even got a CD) boot with the CD device driver, start (under DOS or Windows) to listen to a music CD, then reboot with another conf. without the CD driver --- the CD keeps on playing ! And even through sound card if one is present, device loaded or not.

The output located near the CD drawer (tray?) is directly connected to the CD output --no sound card needed in that case. And no adjustment is possible either through the sound card on that output.

HTH (though I doubt)
Maybe if someone does know about a "virtual" midi driver??

Reply 2 offered by: drake donahue on 06-Nov-1998

Speaker.exe used to be downloadable from microsoft and other windows 3.x support sites and would play .wav files badly on the pc speaker. Last i heard none of the software synths would support it though.
Why not a midnight upgrade to the work computer? Lot of cheap sound cards these days.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 06-Nov-1998

Just reminding : I once used (2 years ago or more) a small DOS program that were able to play S3M files, ported from Amiga.
It was also capable to load MIDI files and play them... _without_ any windows ugly driver. Can't remind the name of it, but it could be the alternative to the 0h00 am solution ;-)

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Nov-1998

It seems theoretically possible to make a Windows MIDI driver that works like a MIDI dveice, but plays through the PC speaker. However, we have never heard of such a beast, and I doubt there is much demand anymore, since sound card prices have dropped through the floor in the last 18 months.

Reply 5 offered by: Anon on 08-Nov-1998

There is a DOS midi player that plays through the pc speaker. It is designed for the HP200LX but might work (very poorly) on some pcs. Try a search for the software called lxmidi.com

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 09-Nov-1998

For people using NWC at the office, it is often impossible to modify the hardware of the machine. Hence the need hereover.
I found a japanese(?) version of lxmidi at http://www.vector.co.jp/common/dos/util/machine/hp/lxmid171.lzh, referred by the http://www.vector.co.jp/common/dos/util/machine/hp/00_index.html page. It needs to be run under plain dos (not a Dos session in Win95), and that the export be done in SMT0 format (modify NWC settings in Tools/Options, File Tab, Midi File Type : set to SMF type 0)

Hope this helps

Reply 7 offered by: John in Brisbane on 01-Dec-1998

I have a midi driver which allows you to play one channel only (channel 1) for any Midi file. Please contact me if the other solutions above are not tenable. I have a virtually identical situation to the original author of this thread.

Regards
John

PS The driver will not play polyphony, but resorts to the highest pitched simultaneous note.

Reply 8 offered by: john on 16-Jun-2000

I have speaker.exe, works in most DOS and WIN31 apps. great for games on lower-end computers. will reply by e-mail and include the program as an attachment. don't recall file size, but its not too large. This is in appreciation of all the help I've received from others of you out there. TNX - john

Reply 9 offered by: Daniel A. Bunting on 08-Sep-2001

I have CD ROM drive, and I can bypass the soundcard, but it
will not pickup through WinAmp v2.5 because it has to
go through the soundcard. I was wondering if I can setup
CD ROM drive to respond through WinAmp v2.5, and still can
hear the audio through the CD ROM drive directly.

If you know, please give me information on this audio
problem.

Reply 10 offered by: Fred on 08-Sep-2001

Daniel -

WinAmp or other CD player simply tells the CD ROM drive where to go and what to do when it gets there. You can route the audio output cable from the CD ROM wherever you want, though this might take a bit of soldering to get it into RCA jacks or whatever.

An easier approach is to get a cable (e.g. from Radio Shack) with a 1/8" (3.5 mm) stereo jack on one end and a pair of RCA's on the other. Plug it into the CD ROM's front-panel earphone jack, and the RCA's into your stereo, and away you go.

HTH
Fred


#931: new software for WP
new software for WP

(931)

Submitted by: Jensen on 06-Nov-1998

I have installed Corel WP8 on my system (removing Windows 95) and now I can not access some of my music files. It says I have a newer 1.5 version and can't be accessed the way it is. Any Ideas from anyone on who to access those files and get my new system arrangement to accept them all? I have tried reloading, but it doesn't help. I need advice and have notified support but have received no answer yet.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Nov-1998

Your message is a little confusing:

1. What do you mean by "removingWindows 95"?
2. By music files, do you mean NWC files?
3. NWC files are opened with NoteWorthy Composer, not Corel WordPerfect. What are you trying to do?

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Nov-1998

We also gave youa reply from our support account, as follows:

> I have recently installed corel word perfect suite 8 on
> my computer (it used to be windows 95) and now I can
> not access some of my music files. I have version 3.1
> noteworthy. Does 95 have anything to do with this?
> And how can I access my files that tell me I have a new
> version, when I know I have only one and it is 3.1.
> HelP! Time is critical as I have stuff due on Monday and
> it is Thursday already. Have been fussing with this now
> for over a week, and can't figure anything out.
>

NoteWorthy Composer Version 1.52a is the latest version available at this time.

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/upgrade.htm

We do not have a version 3.1.

I am not sure why installing corel word perfect suite 8 would cause you not to be able to access music files. You may want to contact corel.

If you have only ever had one version of NoteWorthy Composer something is telling you that you have a newer version.

If you can be more specific with your problem, I may be better able to help you.

You say you cannot access music files-

- Are these *.nwc files?
- Can you not find them or can you not open them?
- Can you open the NoteWorthy Composer sample song files like jingle.nwc?
- What version of NoteWorthy Composer do you have? see Help: About.

Your registration name and code will register all version 1.* releases that you download. You may have downloaded a newer version than the one you were shipped.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 06-Nov-1998

I would agree with Noteworthy support that your messages are very VERY confusing and seem to have bits and pieces of completely unrelated systems.

But just a thought - you are not trying to run the 32 bit Noteworthy composer under Windows 3.1 are you ?

There are many people who use this forum and the newsgroup who would be only too willing to help you, as well as Noteworthy support. But you will HAVE to give better information about what you are doing / have done and what the result is.

Richard

Reply 4 offered by: dejensen on 08-Nov-1998

I'm sorry to be so stupid, but I don't quite understand all the ins and outs of word processing. I just do what I know how to do. When I installed my 32 bit noteworthy, I seem to recall there was something connected to Windows 95 which I thought meant then that I had a 95 version of Noteworthy (upgraded?). Since I do not understand exactly how it works, I can only tell you that originally I installed noteworthy 1.3 (is it?) and used the system accordingly. I was working on a microsoft windows 95 system (I think that's how one would say it.) Then when I had a different software program put on (Corel 8) my windows 95 sent everything into a dither, and we had to reload Windows 95. then noteworthy started sending me messages that I had 1.5 files - "a newer version of this application", and it won't allow me to access it. I guess what I need to know is if I get the updated version of Noteworthy, will that take care of my problem?

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Nov-1998

> if I get the updated version of Noteworthy, will that take care
> of my problem?

Yes, it sure sounds like it will. If you had been using version 1.5 in the past, and then you went back to version 1.3, you will not be able to load your version 1.5 files into version 1.3. In fact, anyone still using version 1.3 would do well to upgrade to our latest release.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Nov-1998

One more thing: After you download the latest release, it might be a good idea to copy it onto your NWC setup diskette (replacing the 1.3 setup files). By doing so, this problem will not occur again.

Reply 7 offered by: j on 12-Nov-1998

Dejensen, You could also try going to the Adobe suite of office applications, and upgrading your computer to Windows NT 4 with 128M RAM


#932: How to configure the midi
How to configure the midi

(932)

Submitted by: Alain Beaudoin on 06-Nov-1998

Hello! Im sure it should be only a configuration problem.
The problem is that NoteWorthy does not render correctly
what I play on the keyboard. At earing it the same, I ear exactly what i play (I think). The problem is that it transpose a single into two double or few triplet. I Gived to a music teacher of an university and he told me that the time and mesure was correct, respecting 4/4 but the way it was writen was tremendouly complicated. Enought complicated that no human can play it. I changed 3 time my Pc, My sound card and still have the same problem. I tryed other sequencer and they rendered corectly what i did. But for editing or corecting Noteworthy is more easy, friendly.

So what could cause noteworthy to decompose the song into triplet, quadruplet, when they are only single ?

Any help will be apreciated

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Nov-1998

I suspect you might be using too fine a resolution for "note resolution." If your piece has nothing shorter than 1/8 notes, set note resolution to 1/8. Otherwise you will have to be _very_ precise in your playing to make the notes come out as you intended.

See also the built-in Help system regarding note and rest resolution.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Nov-1998

Use Tools, Options, Import tab to globally change the import options used for MIDI recording in NWC. Use Staff, Import Recording to manually change them for your most recent recording session.

Reply 3 offered by: Alain Beaudoin on 08-Nov-1998

Hello!
I tryed both option and it is worst, if i change the note resolution to 1/8 it still replace single by few double or triplet. but now it change what ive played. I gues it is the
synthetizer that he dont like i have an Yamaha Psr-630 conected to a AW64 sound card into a pentium P55-200 mmx computer. Thanks anyway will continue to use Midisoft studio
as input for my piano and then enter manualy each note in noteworthy.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Nov-1998

If you play a series of notes in rapid succession while recording, each note starting after the previous note has completed, then NWC import will convert these into a series of short note runs. In these cases, using a smaller note resolution (like 32nd notes) can actually produce better results. Beyond this, it is difficult to guess what is causing your problem. If you have a source MIDI performance and a resulting NWC import that demonstrates your problem, we would be glad to review it to try and understand what is happening.

That said, if you do have access to a sequencer, you are probably better off playing your performance into it until you are happy with it, then importing it into NWC. Sometimes, pure step time entry into NWC is even faster, depending on your objectives.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 09-Nov-1998

Vous pouvez peut-être poser la question en français aussi ;-)

I'm perplex about "Thanks anyway will continue to use Midisoft studio as input for my piano and then enter manually each note in noteworthy." :
you can use MidiSoftStudio to create your midi file, but I wonder why you need to re-enter it into NWC. You could import it with the .mid you create with MSS.

If ever the piece you're working on has many tempo changes, if MSS doesn't note them then the import will be ugly --in any notator software. If the tempo-changes are present in the .mid, then it should be okay in the .nwc file.

About how to modifiy "hard-to-read" notations, maybe you could go to Andrew's http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html NWC page, or other old messages in the forum (download the offline version, see at the top of this page)
Or even better, tell us where to find one of your .mid file, so that anyone can clearly figure out what your problem is.

Hope this helps

Reply 6 offered by: Alain Beaudoin on 09-Nov-1998

Sorry abouth my english, :( The reason why I like NoteWorthy is for the ability to easy change a note (when i make mistake and play 2 note in the same time) and the ability to put loops in the song. So i made a test file
where i recorded a small part in sistyfourth note and quarter rest, i changed the inport setting to sisteen note and quarter rest, and record a second staff, then changed to eight note and recorded to an other track. then i put everything back to sistyfourth note and quarter rest and inport the same part that i played on other sequencer and puted into the last track.

The test file can be found at http://www.total.net/~koalas/test.zip

Hope that will help.

And again i use noteworthy for its ability in reediting song when you want to correct note or mesure.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 10-Nov-1998

I looked at the score and en effet it looks really hard to read. the cause is clearly an imprecision of the input --normal, but quite hard to manage (especially when improvising or "en déchiffrage" (first reading?) )

I then created a test.mid file with the first staff only (having added "legato" style to preserve correct length of longest notes) that I imported back in NWC.
The best results I obtained were with 16th/16th and 16th/8th settings.

But I think that things could be drastically improved if the direct input in NWC had the following feature : that either a pedal or a special note (let's say A0) be used to give exact place of beats (thus giving you the time to look for the next chord). Comments anyone ?

To get back to your problem, Alain, I think that if you find the settings I gave acceptable to work with the score, some advices can be helpful.
Repetitives tasks may be automated thanks to the macro recorder of Win3.* (still works on Win32*) ;
In case you didn't use the feature often, the lenght of a note can be changed without re-entering the note (or chord) simply by selecting it and typing the number (or clicking the icon if you're a mouse addict). '+' and '-' can also be used (but all the selected notes will take the same duration)

hope this helps,

MAD


#933: Complete Command Reference Now Available.
Complete Command Reference Now Available.

(933)

Submitted by: Barry Graham on 08-Nov-1998

A command reference covering all NWC menu items and including some easy to follow exercises is now updated with version 1.5 fonts and available for download at a new address http://members.tripod.com/~melbmusic/nwc.htm

The reference is only available at this site in MS Publish A4 size double-page format.

If you prefer PDF or PS format - hang on Fred is on his way!!

Reply 1 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 09-Nov-1998

Thanks for your reply about repeats. I shall try it when I get offline.
Also, I went to the site you noted above and DL'ed a couple of the files before I noticed they're in an extension I can't use (as you said in your post, if I had read it carefully.)
I'll be anxious to see your post in .pdf or .doc form.
Thanks!
Gordon

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 09-Nov-1998

Gordon,

The first 3 parts (and the intro) are already available at
http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ (our new user-supported archive) in PostScript and PDF format.
The new parts will make their way there once Fred has converted them.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 09-Nov-1998

Barry,

Problem - I can't unzip nwc5.zip and nwc7.zip - I get an invalid archive message from Winzip (version 6.3). I've tried downloading 3 times, same result every time. No problem with the rest of the files. Any ideas??

Peter

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Nov-1998

I had no trouble, but if you want to try an alternate site check out the Scriptorium, the completed work is there in the original .pub as well as .pdf and .ps formats.

At this instant (9 Nov 98, 1630 PST) it's only in the ftp, but will very soon be accessible via html (the Command Summary link on the main page).

Fred

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 10-Nov-1998

Great job! I had no trouble in donwloading/unzipping.
The only trouble I had is Bookman-LightItalic which is not available on my machine, replaced by Courier.

Otherwise the contents itself is _great_ !
What about a french version ? I can do it if you allow me the rights for this.

thanx for all !

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 10-Nov-1998

Barry has very kindly e-mailed me the problem files - all is now in order. Many thanks, Barry - you're a gentleman!

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Nov-1998

marsu, I think a French version would be wonderful. We'd be happy to host it on the Scriptorium... Same goes, by the way, for other languages.

I do suggest that you clear it with Barry first, if you plan on using his imbedded objects, etc.

Also by the way, it was thanks to your (marsu's) suggestion a long time ago that I get GSview and Ghostscript, that we have the command reference in other formats. So you've already been a major contributor to the project! Thanks again.

Fred

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 10-Nov-1998

I have no problem with anyone translating the text into any language - as long as I don't have to do it!!!
The reference is Public Domain as far as I'm concerned.

Didn't think about the missing font difficulty (although I should have known after the first version in nwc13 font produced strange noteheads).
I think Times would be a better substitute than Courier (yuk!).

Barry

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Nov-1998

I think most people will have Bookman, since it comes with MS/Word. It's also available freely on the web.

btw - marsu, you might try the PDF version, since all fonts required are (theoretically) already encapsulated in the file.

Fred


#934: How do I use repeats?
How do I use repeats?

(934)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 08-Nov-1998

I've looked at them all, and I can't figure out how to do what I want.
I have a fairly typical hymn, with 3 or 4 verses, and a chorus. I want to enter the 1st verse, then the chorus. Then the second verse, and then repeat the chorus.
Then the third verse, and then repeat the chorus. (You get the point.)
I need to enter each verse because each one has a different number of notes, but I don't see any reason to repeat the chorus 3 or 4 times.
What I will do is copy and paste the 1st verse notes, to create the 2nd verse, then make the necessary note changes. This will all work, if only I could figure how out to come back to the chorus each time. You see, each time I'll be farther along, and would expect NWC to only pick up the chorus, then skip the 2nd verse, for instance, and go directly to the 3rd verse, then eventually to the 4th verse.
Am I over explaining this?
All help appreciated.
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Nov-1998

You could place each verse in a special ending - that is as 1st, 2nd, 3rd etc. ending to a master repeat that only contained your chorus.
This would work for playback.
Or is your concern publishing?

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 09-Nov-1998

Barry's answer is good. Did you look at the 4 examples that come along with the NWC setup ? You should find them in the Samples directory. They show how the repeat bars work.

I'll post a link to a file that do what you want in some hours (unless someone else has one already made ?) (I have to wait for the lunch pause)

If your problem is just for printing scores, then you don't need to use special bars. Simply add a text item that displays where chorus/verses start (if not already clear).

HTH


#935: drum partitions
drum partitions

(935)

Submitted by: hacer  on 09-Nov-1998

hi,

I just want to know how can I use the percussion instruments
by writing the notes. In program there is a drum sample, but
I couldn't understand which way have been used to write these
drum partitions. I have selected some drum alternatives from
the 'instrument patch' menu, but these are not the sounds
I want to hear. Can anyone help me?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 09-Nov-1998

For a complete drum explanation/tools, look at http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/helpful.html and download the drumkit.zip file. It contains patches, explanations for "standard" drum notation.

Hope this helps

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 09-Nov-1998

Ho, forgot : maybe this is what you need: usually drums are played on channel 10 or 16. If you already have percussion sounds, this is already done. Otherwise check that the channel is properly set (use [F2], select Midi tab, and check Channel listbox value).

HTH

Reply 3 offered by: hacer on 09-Nov-1998

thanks, I'll check them out.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Nov-1998

There is also a sample file called "drumref.nwc" in the NWC distribution. This file shows the General MIDI drum note mappings which usually are supported on MIDI Channel 10.


#936: WYSIWYG
WYSIWYG

(936)

Submitted by: Volker Lingnau on 09-Nov-1998

Another programme I am evaluating right now offers a manual cast off feature. As far as I understand, there is no such thing in NWC. You can only select the print preview option, but closing it you return to the "single line mode". Or is there any other possibility?
Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 09-Nov-1998

Volker,

Believe me you *don't* want a WYSIWYG score editor. They
work fine for (say) 3 or 4 parts and maybe 50 to 100 bars,
but much more than that and they get s l o w e r a n d
s l o w e r until each key or mouse click takes
results in several seconds pause to repaint.

If you're evaluating other programs make sure you load
them up with a large score to see how they perform.

Reply 2 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 13-Nov-1998

John is right. A good test, try importing the midi file that I did, "Thick as a Brick" into your evaluation program, and see how it all copes. If you really want to try this, get the midi file from http://homepages.tig.com.au/~boddo/midis/taab.mid and have fun:-)
Adam


#937: Jazz NWC Files?
Jazz NWC Files?

(937)

Submitted by: Tom Jackson on 09-Nov-1998

I have been searching for a while but without any luck. Does anyone know where to find Jazz NWC Files? I would particularly appreciateany files for a jazz band of 5 pieces.
Thanks ever so much.
Bye

Reply 1 offered by: j on 12-Nov-1998

That is okay if nobody owns the copyright or the works are original. I love big bands and jazz, and if you are not getting proper arrangements, you are not getting the real story.

Reply 2 offered by: John Kavanagh on 23-Dec-1998

I have an easy arrangement of All Of Me for trumpet, alto, two tenors, and bari or
trombone with rhythm and an optional vocal. It can be done with three horns; I also
have my original arrangement, for three voices and rhythm, plus Paper Moon and
Out Of Nowhere for that combo which you could easily transpose/arrange.

Email me if you'd like them.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Dec-1998

How about posting them on the Scriptorium so we all can enjoy them?

We'll even start a "Jazz" category just for you! :-)

Fred


#938: lyrics
lyrics

(938)

Submitted by: jack on 10-Nov-1998

Can I print out the lyrics of a song without printing out the music. It seems like that should be possible, but I haven't found a way to do it yet.
Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 10-Nov-1998

You may simply copy the lyrics from inside the lyric window and then paste into your favorite word processor.
It's a little bit lengthy as you have to do it for each staff and for each lyric line.
If you've entered the NWC piece yourself, you should better work the other way: first type your text inside winword or wordperfect ( or ...), copy it and then paste it into the lyric window.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 12-Nov-1998

Or use the wishlist page at
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm
to ask for it. It would be neat, though I have had no use for such a facility.

A

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 12-Nov-1998

When copy/paste-ing your lyrics text into a word processor, you may want to replace the '-' between syllables by a "conditional hyphen" which will print only if needed. This will give "normal" text.
With µ$word, do a global replacement from
-
with
^-
and it's done.
Example : the lyrics (in NWC) "Safe from all troub-le and dang-er and harm." would become "Safe from all trouble and danger and harm." in a second.

Note that I'm working on a utility that would do the hyphenation automatically (in French ; for English, I'd need to know what criteria define a syllable (seems much harder to me than french). Unless Eric tells us he will add one :-)

Hope this helps


#939: Transposing from Eb to Db
Transposing from Eb to Db

(939)

Submitted by: Mary Ann Hunt on 10-Nov-1998

I wish to transpose a song fom E flat to D flat. Evertime
I tell NWC to transpose down 2 semitones, it gives me
7 sharps instead of 5 flats. I thought tranposing 0 tones
would change the enharmonic spelling, but it didn't. Please
help.

Reply 1 offered by: drake donahue on 10-Nov-1998

take Eb piece:
tools/force accidentals
tools/transpose staff -2
tools/force accidentals
Highlight the 7 sharp key sig ctrl-e, select Db major,
Tools/Audit accidentals --see if it worked

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Nov-1998

See msg #541

See also: msg #3, msg #74, msg #375, msg #503, msg #531, msg #755, msg #762, msg #763, msg #802, msg #880

Reply 3 offered by: j on 12-Nov-1998

Wow! Look at that support!

---

Dear Noteworthy,

You rule.

J


#940: NoteWorthy Player playback quality
NoteWorthy Player playback quality

(940)

Submitted by: Joe Ellerbrock on 11-Nov-1998

Why is the playback quality of NWC files read by NWP not as good as or sound the same as the same NWC files read by NWP? This is annoying to me because the listener with NWP to whom I send my files does not hear the same piano or other instrument sounds I select with NWC. What they hear played back by NWP sounds a lot crummier, such as the piano: the MIDI grand I slected foor playback in NWC changes to what sounds like an out-of-tune honkey tonk! Yuk! This is not a function of the hardware on my computer because this difference in sounds occurs when I use my own PC to play NWC files with NWP. Is there a default setting in either program that ensures that the playback instruments are identical between them? Or does the listener have to download NWC free for 30 days to hear what I hear in NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Nov-1998

See msg #941.


#941: NWP playback quality - rev. for correct spelling
NWP playback quality - rev. for correct spelling

(941)

Submitted by: Joe Ellerbrock on 11-Nov-1998

Why is the playback quality of NWC files read by NWP not as good as or sound the same as the same NWC files read by NWP? This is annoying to me because the listener with NWP to whom I send my files does not hear the same piano or other instrument sounds I select with NWC. What they hear played back by NWP sounds a lot crummier, such as the piano: the MIDI grand I SELECTED FOR playback in NWC changes to what sounds like an out-of-tune honkey tonk! Yuk! This is not a function of the hardware on my computer because this difference in sounds occurs when I use my own PC to play NWC files with NWP. Is there a default setting in either program that ensures that the playback instruments are identical between them? Or does the listener have to download NWC free for 30 days to hear what I hear in NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Nov-1998

Please do not unnecessarily duplicate your posts in the forum (see msg #940).

Regarding NoteWorthy Player, please read the following NoteWorthy Player help sections:

- Technical Help: Song playback using a sound card

- Authoring Tips: Use the MIDI Mapper, mapped to a single device, for testing playback

These will answer your questions.


#942: tied notes on 3rd staff line
tied notes on 3rd staff line

(942)

Submitted by: Eric James on 13-Nov-1998

This may have been discussed before, although I can't recall seeing it. A tie on a note on the middle line of the staff (B in treble clef) will invariably be an under-tie rather than over, even if the stem is pointing down. This simply doesn't look right and I can see no way to fix it. Or is there? For now, I use a slur where playback isn't affected, i.e., when there is no accidental on the note.

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 13-Nov-1998

I already sent a bug report, and I was assured that it was fixed for the version 1.60 release.

Anyway, there is a workaround: simply force the stem down instead of letting it down by default.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Nov-1998

Yes, this is fixed in the next release. Stay tuned.


#943: Cakewalk to NoteWorthy?
Cakewalk to NoteWorthy?

(943)

Submitted by: Martin Goldman, martin@goldman.net on 14-Nov-1998

I am planning to purchase the Noteworthy Composer soon. I have been using Cakewalk Home Studio 6.0 until now (it's too buggy, and doesn't have enough notation features.) Anyway, I was wondering if anyone was aware of a way to convert Cakewalk files directly to the Noteworthy format. I know that I could save the file as a MIDI in Cakewalk and Import it in NoteWorthy, but then I would lose my dynamic markings and such.

Thanks in advance,

Martin Goldman

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Nov-1998

No, unfortunately there isn't such a utility available. I have the same problem with files I had done using Cubasis (same problem, inadequate scoring capability). For awhile I was doing everything twice... Cubasis for the sound, and NWC for the scoring. But once I learned the finer points of NWC, I found I can get just as good (if not better) control over sound, and a lot faster too.

It would be wonderful if some enterprising programmer-type were to write conversions for Cakewalk *.wrk and Cubase *.arr files to NWC.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 16-Nov-1998

Typically, to write such a converter, two things are needed: documentation about the file format of the input (Cubasis, Finale, Encore, Cakewalk...) when it is not MIDI, and the file format of the output (NWC/NTW). Since there is a part of the protection scheme in the NWC files, I guess we couldn't be allowed to know all of the NWC file format; but in that case a format of the "private clipboard" could be enough (i.e. the output would not come into a file, but in the clipboard and you would just "paste" the results. But what if more than one staff ???)

About it, what is a ".kar" file ? (as Karaoke I guess???)

How good it'd be to know how to add plug-ins... I'm sure many programmers are ready out there. ;-)

NWC rules!

Reply 3 offered by: doug on 18-Nov-1998

Yes, *.kar files are for karaoke.

They are basically a midi file with lyrics saved with one of the tracks. I have been checking out a lot of Karaoke creators/editors, but have found most of them to be not near as easy to use as Noteworthy. It would be nice if Noteworthy supported *.kar files.

Maybe we could put that on the wishlist?

doug

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 19-Nov-1998

Thanks for the info. I just searched for .kar files and found some (look at http://perso.wanadoo.fr/surfin-charly/sframes/karaoke/karaoke.htm and follow the links at the bottom).
NWC support them (with FileImport) perfectly --for the music part. For the lyrics part, it's not (yet?) included, but I wonder how NWC'd know on which staff to place them.
For now, you can use a tool à la Unix such as "strings" to get the lyrics.
{get a "strings" tool (just to try, it's copyrighted) at http://homepages.infoseek.com/~marsu/strings.exe ; you can read the doc at http://homepages.infoseek.com/~marsu/strings.txt, but I recommend the following syntax :
strings -aN -n 2 YourFile.KAR > YourFile.txt
}
then cut and paste the lyrics into NWC.

If NWC could export to .kar too, it would be a good thing too (and that would allow NWC to be more known maybe :-) since many karaoke users can't read music, and are afraitd but this small dots and lines!

Hope this helps,
                              NWCly yours

Reply 5 offered by: Ross on 22-Nov-1998

In my experience Cakewalk is incapable of playing midi files correctly when the midi tempo exceeds about 240. This can result in fast music being played very slowly - I think the reason is because it uses an old format whereby the tempo is stored in a single byte rather than two bytes.

Reply 6 offered by: Dave on 10-Dec-1998

I'm assuming that cake walk can extract midi files. So why no expot a standard midi file then import the standard midi file in NWC

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP


#944: Pause for a rest
Pause for a rest

(944)

Submitted by: Peter Edwards on 16-Nov-1998

When I insert a whole note rest (Semibreve) to indicate a whole bar's silence then everything works fine, independently of the time signature - which is as it should be - nicely centered in the bar.

Then when I put a pause mark (or fermata) on it, something goes wrong, and the fermata appears at the start of the bar instead of over the rest.

This doesn't happen in say 2/4 time with a minim rest, so I suspect a bug, but am I missing something?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 16-Nov-1998

Tried with a 5/4 (2/4 and 3/4 too) measure as well, and it seems that the fermata signs is placed just after the item before (in my case the time sig). I tried with 1 and 2 staves (the 2nd having only quarter rests). Seems to be a bug. Either w/ or w/o "Preserve width" checked. This appears only with a whole note rest.
Btw, how is it you need such a thing? because of a repeat I guess?

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 16-Nov-1998

In this instance it was to warn the pianist that the chorus parts had a pause during an unaccopanied bit of the piece.

In another case, in orchestral parts, you should always mark pauses and tempo changes even though the instruments are tacit at that stage, on the off chance that they could be following the conductor and actually counting bars!


#945: Meaning of numbers
Meaning of numbers

(945)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Nov-1998

A couple quick questions about the significance of numbers used in NWC:

1) When selecting a track, the lower right corner contains a description of the track and a number expressed as a percentage. Is this a relative indication (i.e. percentage of available RAM) or an absolute (i.e. a percentage of the maximum size imposed by the program)?

2) In the MPC dialog box, what is the exact relationship between the number set for Linear Sweep Contour and Time Offset Multiplier? Is there a direct way of calculating how many events are inserted in a given time?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 17-Nov-1998

Fred,

I think Eric explained the first one once. Each stave has a maximum amount of items that it can hold. So for example, a chord of three notes would be three items.

The percentage is an absolute percentage against the maximum number of items that the highlighted stave can hold.

(You will have to be 'going some' to reach 100%, at which stage you will get an error message - I can't remember what it says but I remember once doing a multiple paste just to see what happened)

The linear sweep contour is a strange item. I hope that someone wil post and make it crystal clear. I find this difficult as well.

If you get this wrong, you end up flooding your sound card with so many midi instructions that it can't cope. So I think that it is dependant on the sound card you have got as to what noise you get out and how smooth the change is.

Of course I may be talking a load of rubbish but I'm sure someone will correct me if I am.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Nov-1998

Re: the linear sweep contour. Yes, I've done that (jammed up the midi stream) with the contour set at 1. I set it to 3 and that cleared it up. It would be nice to know, though how the number relates to how many events are actually generated.

I almost did some experiments, i.e. doing a bunch of different mpc's at various settings, exporting to mid, converting to text, ... sounds a lot like work...

::sigh::

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 18-Nov-1998

Just a precision about items: a chord is one item, how many notes it has. Try this yourself : create a new staff, keep the Enter key down until you reach 2%. Delete back to get 1% again, just before 2%. Now add how many notes you want but as a chord to existing (last or not) note. You'll stay at 1%.
I approx. count 1% being 110 items (a bar, a clef or a rest are items too)

Eric gave more details somewhere, but can't find out where. Just sought into the last offline help without success.

Ha! Found it in the newsgroup archive (Thanx to Richard!!), I quote the reply here below:
----8<--------8<--------8<--------8<----
From: "NoteWorthy Support" <support@ntworthy.com>
Subject: Re: Status bar question
Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:23:10 -0400

>>What does the percentage on the status bar refers to?
>% of available memory for that staff.

A staff can hold approximately 12000 items. A chord consititutes one item.
If you added 1000 notes and 200 bar lines, you would see that the staff shows roughly 10% of capacity (in our tests, it says 11%).
----8<--------8<--------8<--------8<----

Otherwise, I supposed that online help was enough for MPC. I once jammed my sound card (is this related to Midi Timer settings, btw??) by giving a very small value to the linear settings contour. But I find it's linked with the time offset multiplier (or am I wrong?).
What I usually do is to set a value about 5 or 10, then I decrease (for pitch bend especially) the value till I get a proper result (i.e. seems ok to my ear).

HTH!

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Nov-1998

The Linear Sweep Contour defines how large a change to the controller value will be considered significant. In the case of pitch bend, where the value can be swept over thousands of values, each and every change of only 3 or 4 is not very important. In this case, you might use a value of 100, or even more, depending on how smooth you wish the pitch bend to be. This allows NWC to lean out the number of control changes sent to the MIDI device, which can significantly improve performance.

Think of it like this. If you started at 0 and wanted to count out loud to 10000 in 2 minutes, then:

- using a contour setting of 1, you would count like this: "1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9..." all the way to 10000, and you would have to speak very fast to finish in 2 minutes

- using a contour setting of 100, you would count: "100, 200, 300, 400, 500..." all the way to 10000, and you would probably have no trouble finishing in 2 minutes

The same is true in an MPC. A higher contour value makes it easier for NWC to change the value from the value of 1 up to the value of 10000.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Nov-1998

Thanks, NW Support. That clears it up totally!

Fred

Reply 6 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 19-Nov-1998

Now I understand. At last!

Please NWC-Support, can you include such an example in the Help file for the Multi-Point Controller? It will clarify things a lot.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Crossley on 19-Nov-1998

Maybe if you called it "the controller sampling interval" it would convey the idea more easily.

Reply 8 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 19-Nov-1998

Another mystery cleared up.
Wonderful - Linear swwep contour no longer a puzzle.

Thanks

Richard


#946: Play-Only Mode for Copyright Protection
Play-Only Mode for Copyright Protection

(946)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 19-Nov-1998

There is a reluctance to post NWC files on the internet for fear of breaching copyright protection. Whereas a MIDI file may be considered to be a performance, an NWC file provides the opportunity to make printed copies.

A possible solution is to have Noteworthy export an "NWP" file type, that can only be played in Noteworthy Player or in Noteworthy Composer with editing, copying and printing disabled.

This should be an easy feature to implement and help increase distribution of NWC music and promotion of Noteworthy in general.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 19-Nov-1998

I was trying to think of something similar to suggest and was thinking along the lines of a password lock on the file - could only be unlocked for editing by entering the correct password.

But I like this idea better - just an export function to an NWP file that can be played by either composer or player but that can't be edited or re-saved in any way.

It would be neat -

Wish list here I come

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Nov-1998

The goal is to prevent people printing from a "NWP" file. I think it would be sufficient to disable Cut and Copy to the clipboard, and Print. I see nothing wrong with letting someone modify and save the file, but that does not really matter.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 20-Nov-1998

Sure, but if the person just adds a rest, save, then remove the rest in the new file, the print facility would be restored... A password would be a good solution. Though I dislike that kind of practice.

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 20-Nov-1998

I don't understand the purpose of this. Copyright applies
to copies--whether printed on paper or magnetized on disk--
as well as to performances. Although it is legally possible,
I have a hard time imagining anyone completely relinquishing
performance rights but restricting paper copies.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Nov-1998

Once the file is an NWP, it stays that way forever. Maybe allowing editing does not make sense, especially with copy & paste disabled. There is no need for passwords.

I think there is a difference between performing a piece (which is effectively what a MIDI file is) and making printed copies, which is what many of these authors try to make a living selling. This proposal is intended to let us use Noteworthy to give people a way of viewing the music as well as hearing it, without effectivly giving away copies of the printed score.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Nov-1998

Someone who _really_ wanted to rip off a printed copy could still use any of a number of screen-capture programs to capture chunks, then splice them all together.

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Nov-1998

They would have to ___R E A L L Y____ want to rip it off! You would have to patch the beginning and ending of every staff line, and get blocky output at screen resolution on the printout. It would be easier to hack the NWC file to turn off the play-only bit.

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Nov-1998

Or capture the midi playing to another midi program that did notation. But I think that folks doing that are probably already photocopying printed sheet music anyway, so I don't see play-only NWC as any worse than midi. And in fact, if it becomes so difficult to import to other programs, would effectively be a "performance only".

My understanding is that performances of pieces are treated very differently to copies of pieces. Anyone with any copyright knowledge out there?

A

Reply 9 offered by: John Gillings on 22-Nov-1998

Entering your copyright notice in the file is all the
protection you need. Honest folk will honor it and not
make illegal copies. Dishonest folk who want to make
illegal copies will do so no matter how many tricks and
hacks you play. Indeed, I'd argue that adding artificial
limits, passwords etc both limits your scope (what if I
want to hear your work on different instruments or in
a different key?) and tends to encourage cracking.

As has been pointed out, whatever you do can be trivially
bypassed by capturing the MIDI output and reconstructing
the NWC file.

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Nov-1998

What do you mean by "your copyright notice". You mean all I have to do is say "Please don't copy this" and I can post anything I want without worrying about copyright infringement?

I disagree that capturing Midi output bypasses protecting the NWC file. The result is far from usable as a printed score, and often does not even play back correctly (eg. triplets).

Reply 11 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 23-Nov-1998

Copyright law is complex, and I am not an expert. But I am
confident that this is correct:
1) Performance rights and copying rights are different.
That is, you may be given the right to perform, but not
the right to make copies, or vice versa. But both rights
exclusively belong to the "copyright owner" until he gives
them away. This means that you may have a copy and not
have the right to perform it. It does not mean that anyone
can get the right to perform your music without your
permission, whether or not their copy of the score was legally made.

2) A MIDI file is a copy, not a performance, as any lawyer
will tell you, arguing from either case law or analogy.
Just because it's not on paper doesn't mean it's not a copy:
.fax, .bmp, .txt, .doc, .wmf, or .mid files are all various
ways of encoding electronic copies of ink-splattered pieces
of paper. If you encrypted or compressed the file, it would
still be a copy. Just because it takes a computer to view
the information doesn't make it a copy--see above. Just
because you change the form of the information doesn't make
it any less a copy--you take my book, translate it into
French and print it in green ink on a parchment scroll: it's
still a copy (or, at most, a derivative work, which is
covered by the same law and principles.)

3) Now: MIDI files can be performed by a computer, unlike some other file formats. So if you don't play a file itself,
you may only be breaching one clause of the law. If someone
downloads (copies!) your MIDI file and then PLAYS it, they
can breach two clauses: unauthorized copying AND
unauthorized performance. This is the real point of the
distinction between copying and performance rights.

Reply 12 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Nov-1998

So there is no legal difference between a midi file and a NWC file. The midi file is just a bad copy (a lot of information is lost), while the NWC file is only a much better copy. If this is true, then my proposal serves no useful purpose as far as protecting ourselves is concerned, and we can post our NWC files anywhere MIDI files get posted (and take our chances!)

Reply 13 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 24-Nov-1998

Please help me to see better the difference between a
copy and a performance, with these two scenarios :

1) I have purchased a score of, say, the Beatles. I create
a NWC file by copying all notes of the score, then I export
the result as a MIDI file.

2) With the same score, I play it on my electric piano,
and record the performance into a MIDI file directly.

May I consider that first scenario is a copy, and second
one is a performance ? Or is it a copy in both cases ?

Is it different if the composer is in the public domain
(e.g. Bach instead of the Beatles) ? And if I didn't
look at any score, but heard the music on the radio ?

Reply 14 offered by: Peter Vasey on 24-Nov-1998

This is a fascinating thread! Oliver, when you purchased the printed score of your Beatles music you also inherently purchased the right to play it for your personal enjoyment. But if you wish to perform it in public, particularly for financial reward, you should first obtain performance rights from the copyright holders. This will cost you from peanuts to megabucks, depending on the scale and number of performances, and the music in question. As I see it, a private personal performance is a one-off - the sound waves dissipate and are lost for ever. But if you record that performance, you are then entering the next realm, not yet mentioned in this thread, of recording rights, whether the recording is stored on vinyl, CD, tape etc. or as a MIDI file. And the recording rights don't necessarily belong to the music publisher - they may have been purchased by a recording company.

It doesn't matter where the music originates - heard on the radio, someone whistling a tune or whatever. If copyright has been claimed for that music, you should not copy it without permission. Taken to the limit, the above mentioned whistler is probably breaking performance copyright, but in general it would seem that the publishers/copyright holders aren't concerned *unless they stand to lose financially*. This is the crux of all copyright matters. So if I notate or store as MIDI or record a copyrighted song for my own use, no problem, particularly if I have already purchased the song in some form. But as soon as I distribute it, watch out!

I'm a bit fuzzy regarding public domain music, but it is inadvisable to photocopy a printed score - the musical content is P.D., but the score itself has its own copyright which belongs to the publishers. Again, apply the criterion - does anyone stand to lose money in any way if you copy (in any form) and distribute some music. If the answer is yes, tread carefully!

Having said the above, as we all know many people sing/play music in pubs, clubs etc. without any thought to copyright matters. But distribution on the Internet where access can be gained by millions, and in all likelihood your name and e-mail address is available is another matter. There is a huge amount of music already available on some Web sites, Classical MIDI Connection being a case in point. If anyone there reads this, perhaps they would care to comment on their position re copyright.

Well, I've rambled on quite long enough. 'Bye for now, Peter.

Reply 15 offered by: Blair Dowden on 24-Nov-1998

Playing the MIDI file is like whistling the tune - it may violate copyright but no one cares because no one stands to lose financially. The NWC file lets someone get a good quality printed score, which may replace buying a legitimate version, which does hurt financially. So a Play-Only mode would provide some protection.

Reply 16 offered by: J on 25-Nov-1998

I think password protection would be the most very best idea ever! Please think about it NWC!

Reply 17 offered by: Alain Beaudoin on 30-Dec-1998

Hello!
I totaly disagree the use of "blocking techniques" it will just complicate things. Copyright is complex, and has others saids it not matters where you ear it as long it has copyright you "can not use it" except for your personal listen.

I know various musician that you give them a cassette and they will reproduce it the same way you read paper but all of them recognize copyright matters.

As for the performance, musician are human and depending of the humor of that day a same musician will play a song in diferent way, so the copyright "can not be specific" to a certain interpretation.

Copyright are for the interpretation, the music sheet the word.

For better understanding let say you take the song of your favorit artist who is in rock and make a version in pop you are breaking the rule of the copyright and the owner can pursuit you.

As long that someone can recognize that the song was writen by an other person, no matter how you play, the copyright will still be active.

So as you can see the copyright is very large, and does not stand for the music partition it self but for the ensemble of the song.

Other thing, you can "jam" a day with your musician and record all your "jaming" if you put copyright on it, even if you dont have partition for it, the day you will make the partition they will be automaticly protected by the copyright you have on the song.

Hoping that it will help to understand copyright.
Alain


#947: New to Noteworthy
New to Noteworthy

(947)

Submitted by: Randall Budden on 20-Nov-1998

I feel like a kid in a candy store. The noteworthy system "rules". I've spent a couple of days reading threads(?) and found a lot of helpful advice. When a message is referred to by number, how do you locate that? Is there a search mechanism to help prevent reiterating questions?

Thanks in advance for your help and for making such a wonderful program available to the "ordinary" people.

Reply 1 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 20-Nov-1998

If you click on the message number, it should take you to that message. Then click Back to return to the current messages.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 20-Nov-1998

There is many ways to get help on this wonderful product.

Online:
1. Use the http://www.ntworthy.com/search.htm link (at the top of the page) for finding quickly what you search for;
2. do not neglect the usertips (go there by using the "New" link, at http://www.ntworthy.com/sitemap.htm : many reg'd users put some hints there;
3. ask for questions (here or at the newsgroup) if you didn't find the answer to your problem.

Offline:
1. the ..."online" help (F1 in NWC) of course, is precious. As well as the samples that come along NWC.
2. But also the "offline forum", get it at http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm (if you use Win3.* then you'll need win32s add-on to make it work) which is the complete forum archives in a one-file help system. The latest version is from 15Nov (with one update per month, mor or less).
3. The offline version of the newsgroup (text only) exists too, thanks to Richard.
4. The NWC Scriptorium, entirely by NWC users, at http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ : in particular the CommandSummary (PDF or PostScipt formats).

Hope this helps (I'm sure I forgot other help tools!)

Dominique (happy reg'd user)

P.S. Welcome to this wonderful world


#948: Vers. 1.55  Experimental
Vers. 1.55  Experimental

(948)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson on 22-Nov-1998

I thought I understood that the experimental features would apply to new song.

However I have tried everyway (?) to get the feature to work in a new song. The page setup shows that the staff layering fuction is activated but when I go back to the song there has been no layering.

The experimental file staff layering function examples by NWC works OK but when I start a new song the staff layering function does not work. Anyone else having this problem with 1.55?

Am I missing something?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson on 22-Nov-1998

Addendum to previous message.

Yes, the Restrict Experimental Features in the Options File menu is unchecked.

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson on 22-Nov-1998

Figured it out. I did'nt check staff layering in staff properties. I should have read the help files a little more thoroughly.


#949: Is midi banks turned off in the demo?
Is midi banks turned off in the demo?

(949)

Submitted by: Rick Smith on 22-Nov-1998

I just got a SBLive sound card and loaded the proteus 1-3 soundfonts into banks 01-03. They play ok from Power Tracks Pro but all I can get from NoteWorthy is the default bank 0 sound. I used midi controler 0 as per the SBLive instructions. Is this turned off in the NoteWorthy demo?

NW seems to be a good program, reminds me of Deluxe Music on the Amiga but with many more features and many less bugs!
I sent my mola yesterday for the full version.

Rick,

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Nov-1998

Make sure that you enable the "Select a different patch bank" option as well as entering the bank number in the appropriate controller box.


#950: importing .mid files - what's wrong with this one?
importing .mid files - what's wrong with this one?

(950)

Submitted by: Kevin G. Pammett on 22-Nov-1998

If someone would kindly help me with this one, I'd very much
appreciate it. I can't figure out what's "wrong" with this
song:
http://www.net1plus.com/users/pammett/music/God Bless the USA/USA.mid

It sounds beautiful when I play the .mid file, but after
many many attempts to import it, I cannot get the score
editor to come up with anything that sounds even close
to the quality of the .mid when played back. If I pick
a fine resolution (32 or 64th), it sounds smooth enough
(as opposed to the extremely choppy effect you get if you
pick 16th resolution), but even with smooth, it still
breaks off notes VERY suddenly.

My guess is that the 'problem' lies in the peddle being
on or off at the right/wrong time. But I don't see any
option other than just ON or OFF and neither of those
sounds right. I can hardly believe that I have to go
thru this whole score and change the peddle though I have
done that for a few bars and I can get it to sound a lot
better.

But my question is: what settings can I specify in the
import that get me a score that sounds pretty much
equivalent to the .mid? Or, is it in fact true that
there's just something 'wrong' with the .mid file itself ?
Thanks !
-Kevin
|+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
| email "for life" : Kevin_Gene_Pammett@Bigfoot.com
| phone: (978) 448-9088
| home: http://www.net1plus.com/users/pammett/

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Nov-1998

There is nothing wrong with the MIDI file, it is just that the performance does not lend itself to conversion to notation. It uses arpeggiated chords, and a lot of overlapping notes, which is not translated well into notation. This is one of those cases where hand entering may be easier than trying to "fix" the problems with the imported notation.

Reply 2 offered by: Quentin on 16-Jul-2000

(This is probably way-late, but never mind)....Suggestion: if your software includes Note-duration, you could Select
chunks (as required) of music and set the durations to about 99%. Trial and error will help.

QG.

Reply 3 offered by: ded jorge on 16-Jul-2000

Keep in mind that there are a bunch of midi files that won't import properly into any notation software. As Quentin suggests, try trial and error, select different quanitization on note length and rests. The next best thing is to buy a music book with that score in it. I came across a book with that title and a bunch of similiar things like America The Beautiful but since I'm a punk rocker I never bought it.


#951: Player Crashes in NT 4
Player Crashes in NT 4

(951)

Submitted by: Andre Morris on 23-Nov-1998

Hello.

Previously installed on a Windows NT 4 SP2 system was NoteWorthy Player 1.5. This version would load a mid file and play (showing notes), but no volume for the MID would play through the speakers. Even though MID files would play in Windows NT Media Player. It was as if MID volume for NoteWorthy Player alone had been turned off.

Removed that software, and installed version 1.55 of Noteworthy player. Now, noteworthy player will play a midi file, and I can see the notes come through. However, with auto-repeat enabled it will stop playing at the end of a file. It will not repeat. What's more, if I try to open another MIDI after the first one. No matter where in the first song it is, Player will crash out of NT. I cannot play more than 1 midi file without closing player first.

In addition, now MIDI files no longer play in Media Player. I can hear them in NoteWorthy, but no longer in NT. It is as if the problem that was part of 1.5 has been reversed in 1.55! Please if you have information email me at Intratech@msn.com. I can no longer play MIDI files on my Windows NT machine after this install! Only through NW Player and then only 1 song without crashing or closing NWP!

Thanks in Advance.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Nov-1998

You can restore MIDI play back capability for your media player by rebooting your machine (ie. do a full powered down reset of your machine).

For those who have experienced problems with the Player version 1.55, we have uploaded a new release of both the 16-bit and 32-bit player, version 1.55a. This version corrects the reliabliity problems in version 1.55, and reinstates a file history facility for your file opening pleasure.

You can get the latest player release from http://www.ntworthy.com/player/

Reply 2 offered by: Andre on 23-Nov-1998

Thanks a million! I can tell you that 1.5a has been tested here on my machine, and the problem of it crashing on a new midi file has been fixed. The auto-repeat feature of the program still does not work, however. As it reaches the end of the song, it says "playing" at the bottom of the program, but never rewinds. This does not appear to represent a problem to the system or the program, however. In any case, I appreciate how quickly you responded to this situation. Very impressive!

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Nov-1998

The auto repeat feature works for me. Maybe you could give an exact example of the problem (the exact sequence you do), so that we can test it here.


#952: Why does IE4 mark unread replies as read?
Why does IE4 mark unread replies as read?

(952)

Submitted by: Stephen Randall on 24-Nov-1998

When I visit the forum's recent activity page I only see new topics as unread. All replies in topics where I have read at least one message are marked as read. I'm sure this was not always the case but I can't decide if the change occured when the NWC site changed or when my browser was "up"graded or when our firewall was installed.

It would be nice to be able to see all the new stuff in blue again. What do I need to do? Or is this a TYJHTLW(thing you just have to live with)?

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 24-Nov-1998

IMHO (In My Humble Opinion), it is a browser issue only. It certainly occured when your browser was "something"graded.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 24-Nov-1998

IE 4 marks the whole page as read if you visited it, regardless of whether the page has been updated or not.
This forum updates pages containing the "thread" of the conversation.

I find the easiest way to keep track is to visit the "Recent Activity" page (link is at the top of the forum page). This has everythin in reverse chronological order. So if you remember when you last visited (ie what you last read), everything unread is above it.

HTH,

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 25-Nov-1998

Another solution is to use Netscape (2 or later). Though I've been told it consumes memory, I'm sure NS2 (or 3) is much smaller and quicker than IE4 !

on the other hand, if there was the date(+time) of the replies, maybe it could help too :-)

MAD

Reply 4 offered by: marsu (tired) on 25-Nov-1998

Oops, as I usually look at the link's color only, I completely forgot that the date is _already_ there :-x
maybe I should have slept instead of nwcomposing!


#953: Scriptorium update
Scriptorium update

(953)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 24-Nov-1998

The NWC Scriptorium is an archive/collection of NWC files, macros, documentation, MIDI utilities, newsgroup postings and many other things. It is run by NWC users, and Noteworthy Artware have (perhaps wisely!) had nothing to do with it.

It's URL is http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/
Please feel free to visit it. Newstuff is noted on the "What's the latest?" page, and includes a new interface for piece details that I'm experimenting with at
http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/dbfull-test.html

Regards,
Andrew

Reply 1 offered by: Teresa on 03-Jan-100

Hi,

I have two problems, when I use "slur" or "tie" and when I hear the work some sounds don't stop (the sound continues and continues) What can I do? Is necesary a file with one exemple?

An other problem: I don't undertand how make "glissando" (in wins and string)

Thanks for all

I am sorry for my english

Teresa

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Jan-2000

Teresa,

The note continues because the note before the barline has an accidental (sharp, flat, natural) that is different to the note after the barline.
Select/highlight the note after the barline.
The accidental (or lack of accidental) will be indicated on the toolbar.
Click on the accidental (sharp, flat, natural) that matches the note before the barline.
Remember that the note before the barline may have an implied accidental from a previous note in the measure or in a different octave.


#954: Lyric font in NWC
Lyric font in NWC

(954)

Submitted by: Denis LIEVRE on 25-Nov-1998

Would it be possible to choose a different font for each lyric line ?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 25-Nov-1998

Not yet, so add this to the wish list at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm :-)
See also msg #719 for such a discussion

Hope this helps,
                        Dominique


#955: Harmonic notation revisited
Harmonic notation revisited

(955)

Submitted by: Joe Niemeyer on 25-Nov-1998

Many composers for guitar use diamond shaped notes to indicate harmonics. Has anyone figured out a way to do this with Noteworthy? I noticed Scot Boyd offered the idea placing a small "o" just above the note, but this doesn't seem satisfactory or "standard" if I dare to use that word regarding harmonic notation. Any ideas?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 25-Nov-1998

One thing you can try is to insert a teXt item (with Wingdings font selected), just before the note you want. the characters you can use are t, u and w (three different diamond shapes/sizes). In order to fully overwrite the note with the diamond, you may try different sizes of the font (and play with bold or not).
This is not perfect, but seems acceptable to me.

For playback purpose, do not forget to create a hidden stave with the real note (the usage I know is that you write the note where it is played as harmonic, which is not what it sounds. Am I wrong?) and mute the "printable" one.

Hope this helps,
                    MAD

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Nov-1998

There is a "Guitar Harmonics" patch in General Midi (patch number 32). You can insert an instrument patch change before the harmonic note(s), then another one to change back to the original guitar sound afterwards. These patches changes (like other insertions such as MPC's) don't show up in the final printed document, Print Preview, or NoteWorthy Player display. (Saves having to have a separate staff for harmonics or other effects.)

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 25-Nov-1998

The small "o" above the note is standard notation for
harmonics on strings (viol family). The sounded note is
the same as written, it's just produced differently and
sounds different (touching the string, rather than
stopping). It may be that you touch the string in a
different place from where you'd stop it to get the
same note.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Nov-1998

Harmonic symbol and brass mute open/close are on my list for the next update of 'Boxmarks'.

In the meantime hold down Alt and type 0176 (that's zero-one-seven-six) to get a small degree symbol that may be suitable for your purpose.

I agree with John - the small circle is generally recognized by string players.
I usually use a small triangle for guitar though (comment Fred?) but it has to be small or it's read as a whole chord symbol marker.

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Niemeyer on 25-Nov-1998

Thanks for all the good suggestions. I'll give them a try. I'm a student of classic guitar, so the reference to using the small "o" for harmonics on bowed instruments went right by me. Also, I'm a user/fan of the boxmarks font. We all appreciate your contribution, Barry.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Nov-1998

I've seen them all different ways; little circles, triangles, even "harmonic" or "armonico" spelled out. I think my favourite, though, is a little "x" just as is used for percussion.

There have also been different ways of displaying "artificial harmonics". These are where you play a harmonic while fretting with the left hand while touching the string an octave higher with one finger while plucking with the thumb (and fretting over how you're going to accomplish this!) as opposed to simply touching a point on an open string and plucking. My preference here is, again, the little "x" notehead, with "A.H." in text above or before the note.


#956: forcing midi tracks to one staff?
forcing midi tracks to one staff?

(956)

Submitted by: Mark on 25-Nov-1998

I am trying to arrange some piano pieces for guitar, and would like to force both hands onto one staff. The midi import interface does not seem to let me combine tracks onto one staff (although it does allow channels to be multiple.

Does anyone know of a way to force multiple tracks to one staff?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Nov-1998

The import wizard gives you complete control over which MIDI channels, and pitch ranges within the channels, get mapped to new staves. The import instructions allow you to specify whatever assignments that you need.

You can also overlap your parts, if you prefer. Disable the experimental file restrictions from Tools, Options, File, then you can layer staves (from Page Setup and Staff Properties) as another way of achieving one visible staff.

Reply 2 offered by: Mark on 25-Nov-1998

>>The import wizard gives you complete control over which MIDI channels, and pitch ranges within the channels, get mapped to new staves<<

I see that, but it appears that the different parts are coming in in separate tracks - and the import wizard only lets me specify one track per staff. When I try to load all channels and ranges into a single staff, it loads the first track information, and loses everything else.

I'll try doing the visual overlap - but I suspect that will make it harder to edit the file.

Thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Nov-1998

>> I'll try doing the visual overlap - but I suspect that
>> will make it harder to edit the file.

A little bit... but it's not too bad if you use page up/page down to move between overlaid staves rather than the mouse (which will only select the "top" layer). The selected staff is in a different colour (which you can change).

Also, for the purposes of editing, you can always "unlayer" the staves, then enable the layering only as a final action before printing.

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Nov-1998

Here's a rough and ready solution.

MUTE all staves except the ones you want to combine.
(eg. all the guitar strings on six separate staves).

In Tools - Options - Files select type 0 midi file format for export.
This creates a single track file.

Export your single track midi file.

Re-import the file and assign all channels (if you have separate channels) to one staff.

You can then cut and paste the staff into the score.

But it might not be quite what you expect every note entrance cuts off or truncates the durations of previous notes.
Also I'm not sure (because I haven't tried) how many voices the single track midi can handle - I'm sure it will cope with 6 guitar strings.
(Most of the brass players in my band agree that coping with 6 guitar strings requires access to a good set of wire cutters).

Don't forget to reset your midi output back to type 1 after the experiment.

Reply 5 offered by: J on 25-Nov-1998

I'll tell you about a shareware program that can merge tracks if you tell me about one that can split parts. ---> email.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Nov-1998

> and the import wizard only lets me specify one track per staff.

If your source material has multiple tracks, it would seem like you would want each in its own staff. However, you can combine them, but with some loss. After importing the file, do the following:

- export the file back to MIDI as a type 0 file (in 1.55, you actually have to specify type 1 at the moment, due to a big). All of your song data will now be on one channel.

- reimport the type 0 file and specify import as needed

This will enable the merging of the track data.

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Nov-1998

If you registered recently, this procedure is also described on page 29 of the current NWC User's Guide.

Reply 8 offered by: Mark on 26-Nov-1998

Thanks, everyone - this gives me several things to try

Mark

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 26-Nov-1998

J(ohnti), I know a shareware that does splitting. It is called NoteWorthyComposer...
but if you're talking about splitting as discussed in msg #628 in June, there is none. But writing a small awk/perl script would do the trick with midi2text (mf2t/t2mf, already discussed). Time to do it, anyone?

HTH,
      MAD


#957: Highlighted notes during playback
Highlighted notes during playback

(957)

Submitted by: David Heidelberger on 25-Nov-1998

I've used NoteWorthy for Windows '95 and '98. I recently got a 400mHz Pentium II (etc.) for Windows '98. The computer includes the Yamaha Soft Synthesizer S-YZXG50 MIDI system, which is much better than general MIDI. The problem is that the notes that get highlighted to indicate the current position in the song are highlighted a little bit faster than the song is going. I think it has something to do with a faster computer and a slower MIDI system but I'm not sure. If anyone has had a similar problem and fixed it, I would be grateful to hear from you. Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Nov-1998

NoteWorthy Composer and Player highlight the notes when the "note on" event is first sent to the MIDI driver. Most synthesizers end up playing the notes in near real-time. This is important, for example, when playing a piano keyboard that is triggering the synthesizer sounds. It would be very hard to perform a piece on a keyboard where the sound is not produced until a half second after the key is pressed.

Unfortunately, many of the new breed of software synthesizers do not seem to behave in this traditional fashion. They introduce a delay between receiving a "note on" event and actually playing the note. This means the following:

1 - Your play back highlights in NWC and NWP will not synchronize with the sound

2 - You will not be able to play your soft synth concurrently with other MIDI devices (since they will be playing the same thing, but at different times)

3 - You will not be able to play through the soft synth using an external MIDI keyboard (this is normally done using the MIDI echo feature in NWC) without getting very confused

There is no way to work around this in NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Nov-1998

See also: msg #321, msg #706

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 25-Nov-1998

> It would be very hard to perform a piece on a keyboard
> where the sound is not produced until a half second after
> the key is pressed.

"Tracker" organs behave exactly like this. I can't imagine
how, but there are plenty of people who have learnt to
deal with the delay.

Reply 4 offered by: Christopher R. lee on 14-Feb-1999

This is not exacly on the subject, but I'd like the playback to jump to the next horizontal page a bar or so before the highlight reaches the end of the screen. Ideally, the screen should scroll smoothly, so that the highlighted bar is always in the middle, but I accept that this is probably asking too much.

Regards

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 15-Feb-1999

Christopher, I support your request, and added it to the
wish list. Did you too ?


#958: US Copyright laws RE/printed music & Performance
US Copyright laws RE/printed music & Performance

(958)

Submitted by: Don Ferguson on 26-Nov-1998

General Copyright Information

The information shown below are excerpts from various web site regarding copyrights and their application to reproduction of printed music and performance of copyrighted music. The information is not intended to be all inclusive but rather a starting point for those NWC users wanting to know more about copyrights.

See the REF: web sites for other pertinent information. Look at 1 and 4 for reproducing copies and performing music.
============================================================
In the United States, these seven rights are recognized:

1) the reproductive right: the right to reproduce the work in copies;
2) the adaptative right: the right to produce derivative works based on the copyrighted work;
3) the distribution right: the right to distribute copies of the work;
4) the performance right: the right to perform the copyrighted work publicly;
5) the display right: the right to display the copyrighted work publicly;
6) the attribution right (sometimes called the paternity
right): the right of the author to claim authorship of the work and to prevent the use of his or her name as the or of a work he or she did not create;
7) the integrity right: the right of an author to prevent the use of his or her name as the author of a distorted version of the work, to prevent intentional distortion of the work,and to prevent destruction of the work.

FACT: (not part of web site) copyright covers printed music and performance of music.

For works published in the years 1904 through 1963, the copyright lasted for 28 years from date of publication; if the copyright was not renewed, it lapsed, and the work went into the public domain. Another 28 years of
protection could be obtained by filing a renewal, for a total term of 56 years (1906 comes from the fact that the U.S. effectively switched to a 47-year second term in 1962, and 1962 minus 56 (the old maximum duration
of two 28-year terms) equals 1906). If the copyright was not renewed after its initial 28-year term, the work lapsed into public domain.
Generally, all copyrights secured in 1918 or earlier lapsed at the latest in 1993 and are now in public domain (1993 (last year) minus 75 equals 1918). Copyrights secured in the period 1919 through 1949 continue to
exist only if they were renewed, and expire in the period 1994 through 2024.

REF: ftp://ftp.aimnet.com/pub/users/carroll/law/copyright/faq/part2

§ 302. Duration of copyright: Works created on or after January 1,
1978

(a) In General. Copyright in a work created on or after January 1, 1978, subsists from its creation and, except as provided by the following subsections, endures for a term consisting of the life of the author and fifty years after the author's death.

(b) Joint Works. In the case of a joint work prepared by two or more authors who did not work for hire, the copyright endures for a term consisting of the life of the last surviving author and fifty years after such last surviving author's death.

REF: http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/title17/3-302.html

HOW LONG COPYRIGHT PROTECTION ENDURES

Works Originally Created On or After January 1, 1978

A work that is created (fixed in tangible form for the first time) on or after January 1, 1978, is automatically protected from the moment of its creation and is ordinarily given a term enduring for the author’s life plus an additional 50 years after the author’s death. In the case of “a joint work prepared by two or more authors who did not work for hire,” the term lasts for 50 years after the last surviving author’s death. For works made for hire, and for anonymous and pseudonymous works (unless the author’s identity is revealed in Copyright Office records), the duration of copyright
will be 75 years from publication or 100 years from creation, whichever is shorter.

Works Originally Created Before January 1, 1978, But Not Published or Registered by That Date

These works have been automatically brought under the statute and are now given Federal copyright protection. The duration of copyright in these works will generally be computed in the same way as for works created on or after January 1, 1978: the life-plus-50 or 75/100-year terms will apply to them as well. The law provides that in no case will the term of copyright for works in this category expire before December 31, 2002, and for works published on or before December 31, 2002, the term of copyright will not expire before December 31, 2027.

Works Originally Created and Published or Registered Before January 1, 1978

Under the law in effect before 1978, copyright was secured either on the date a work was published or on the date of registration if the work was registered in unpublished form. In either case, the copyright endured for a first term of 28 years from the date it was secured. During the last (28th) year of the first term, the copyright was eligible for renewal. The current copyright law has extended the renewal term from 28 to 47 years for copyrights that were subsisting on January 1, 1978, making these works eligible for a total term of protection of 75 years.

Public Law 102-307, enacted on June 26, 1992, amended the 1976 Copyright Act to extend automatically the term of copyrights secured between January 1, 1964, and December 31, 1977, to the further term of 47 years. Although the renewal term is automatically provided, the Copyright Office does not issue a renewal certificate for these works unless a renewal application and fee are received and registered in the Copyright Office.

P.L.102-307 makes renewal registration optional. There is no need to make the renewal filing in order to extend the original 28-year copyright term to the full 75 years. However, some benefits accrue from making a renewal registration during the 28th year of the original term.

For more detailed information on renewal of copyright and the copyright term, request Circular 15, “Renewal of Copyright”; Circular 15a, “Duration of Copyright”; and Circular 15t, “Extension of Copyright Terms.”

REF: http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/circs/circ1.html#hlc

Looks like 75 year copyright protection is the magic number. Therefore 1998 - 75 = 1923. Any music prior to 1923
should be in public domain.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 29-Nov-1998

Don,

There is also a restriction on transcription that restricts this to the copyright holder or his/her agent. Is this so?

What category does this fall under - reproductive or adaptive?

Barry

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ferguson on 29-Nov-1998

Hi Barry

Suggest you review the references I made. There is a lot of other material there. I did not try to cover all the bases.

Also suggest you search on US Copyright Laws (I did) and you might find the answer to your question.

Don F


#959: Musictime?
Musictime?

(959)

Submitted by: Sharon on 27-Nov-1998

Is Noteworthy compatable with Musictime? Musictime used midi files......I enter them with a midi keyboard.... Just wondering if the two are similar enough that you comments might apply to my situation and vice-versa. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Nov-1998

I do not understand your question. What do you mean by compatible? NWC will import MIDI files, as well as export them. You can also capture a performance in real time, or step time, from a remote MIDI keyboard. We suggest that you just try out the evaluation and decide the rest for yourself.

Reply 2 offered by: ADAM on 21-Apr-2000

Music Time 2.0

Reply 3 offered by: Dennis on 28-Jul-2000

Whenever sharing files between different music programs; remember to save files as MIDI files.(.mid) Most programs create thier own file extensions, but can also save as a MIDI file.


#961: help me!!
help me!!

(961)

Submitted by: lewis on 29-Nov-1998

i just got a midi interface and don't know how to configure the program so i can record from my keyboard to nwc. can someone please help? you can email me at home and i'd be very grateful.

thanx in advance
lewis

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Nov-1998

You'll have to make your midi device active in the "Midi Mapper" applet in your Windows Control Panel. That should be all there is to it! NoteWorthy Composer takes as midi input/output whatever is active in the midi mapper.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Nov-1998

This is covered in the User's Guide under "Remotely input notes from a MIDI keyboard" and "Record play from a MIDI keyboard" which is shipped with all orders.


#962: Printing
Printing

(962)

Submitted by: D. Baker on 29-Nov-1998

I downloaded the evaluation copy of Noteworthy Composer.
The print option is turned off in the evaluation copy.
I need to know from someone who has used the full blown
Noteworthy Composer-- How does the print option work?
I feel this is extremely important to know before
purchasing the real product.
Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Nov-1998

You are able to evaluate the print option. It is NOT turned off in the evaluation. It will, however, print an order form in addition to your song, unless you are working with one of the samples.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 01-Dec-1998

An evaluation copy print sprinkles "Noteworthy
copyright" notices all 'round the page. Otherwise, what
you see on the paper is what you see from a registered
copy. And if you have a halfway decent printer, what you'll
see is _very_ nice... not just a screen image dump, but
truetype fonts drawn to the printer's limits of resolution.

BTW, this is an unusually generous feature in a demo
version. Most programs don't let you print at all....
You really don't know exactly what you're going to get.


#963: Continous Horizontal Staff - must pan to see?
Continous Horizontal Staff - must pan to see?

(963)

Submitted by: D. Baker on 29-Nov-1998

The Noteworthy Composer seems to default to many measures on
a very large "one line horizontal staff". It would be
nice to view a staff continuation on multiple lines.
For example each line might contain 5 or 6 measures before
continuing to the next line. Is there a way to do this
in Noteworthy Composer?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 29-Nov-1998

No. Should it, at least as an option? There are a lot of other things I want first.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 30-Nov-1998

You can of course view the score page by page as it appears when printed, using the Print Preview option - perhaps this meets your requirements?

Reply 3 offered by: D.Baker on 01-Dec-1998

Let me equate the hard coded one line edit feature
with any word processor. Can you imagine the frustration a user might have if he/she were required to enter an entire document on one line? And then have to go to print
preview to see what it looks like? For $40 I think
Notworthy Composer should allow editing multiple lines.
There are less expensive Composers that have this feature.

Reply 4 offered by: John Gillings on 01-Dec-1998

Perhaps if you were only editing a small number of staves
wrapping would make sense. If you're editing an orchestral score, you won't fit all staves on the screen simultaneously, let alone wrap them.

The analogy with word processors is only really apt for a single stave, which is the degenerate case.

The separation of editing from final display is one of the KEY advantages of Noteworthy over other products.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Dec-1998

I too thought that the single-line edit window was inadequate at first, having used two other (much more expensive) sequencers that did that. But having gotten used to it, I find the line-wrapping to be a real nuisance the rare time when I go back to the old expensive software (to export an old file, etc.) Much slower to refresh the screen, harder to see where the cursor position is during playing, and generally much more confusing.

I should add that I rarely work with less than four staves. Perhaps, as mentioned, if one or two staves were all one ever needed, the line-wrapping might be tolerable.

If such a feature were to be included in a future release, I would only ask that the option be included to turn it off.

Reply 6 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 02-Dec-1998

My question is, which are the less expensive composers?
Adam

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 02-Dec-1998

My "question" is, which is the most usable on any computer? And the most reliable?

Dominique

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 02-Dec-1998

I was thinking about D.Baker's thing about hard coded one-line edit in a word processor, and could see where his frustration was coming from. But as other folks here pointed out, wrapping staves becomes a nuisance when you work with more than one or two.

Also, why do you need to read "down the page"? I preview my stuff normally by listening to it. What I WOULD like is the ability to say "break this line here on output", so that I can make a piece fit a page EXACTLY.

Andrew

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen Randall on 02-Dec-1998

Another advantage of folding scores at the screen boundary would be to speed up getting to the bit one wants to edit. It can be a bit fiddly to find your place using the horizontal scroll bar in long pieces. An alternative (better?) means to do this would be to have a goto "mark" facility in addition to the goto measure number. If marks could be set during playback (when you hear the bum note you've entered) that could be even more useful.

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 02-Dec-1998

When playing music and you hear something wrong, hit Escape, click on the score, and there you are! Fix it, then press F5 to continue.

I would like to see more score at a time, especially when copying music from one part to another. I think this is best accomplished by allowing two windows to view the same song file.

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Dec-1998

You could Save As... your file under another name, then spawn a second window. Voila! You can now cut/paste between them at will.

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 03-Dec-1998

About two windows of a same file, a great thing would be the ability to import twice (or more) the same midi file. At the time being, when you make an import, keep it open and want to try a 2nd one with other parameters (rest max value, ...), you are directly sent back to the already imported version. Making very difficult (and history-list destructive, since you got to "save as..." into temp names) to get the best version : I often import 3 times with diferent settings the same file, then cut/paste from the three to my final version (some staves are good in one version, some in another, ...)
wish wish...

Reply 13 offered by: Sue Morton on 05-Dec-1998

Back to the original question, if you have good eyes you can at least "fit" more horizontal music onto your NWC editing screen by: 1. Making your PC's video resolution as small as you dare, and/or 2. Setting the "Staff Size in Points" (Page Setup, Options) down to the smallest number you can tolerate. One or both of these will get more measures visible on a single screen display.

Reply 14 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 06-Dec-1998

I do all my NWC scoring on my notebook, with a 12.1" TFT screen set at 800-600 res, and I always set the Zoom level at 4. I can read it fine like that, and it makes comparing staves very easy even in large scores. Just a brag.
Adam

Reply 15 offered by: Paul Gitlitz on 14-Dec-1998

The cheaper ($20 )program out there is called abc. It's not nearly as musically intuitive and you need a separate program for another $10 to support midi. It's not as comprehensive in symbols and you have to toggle from a page of letters and other non musical markings to the staves,but you can control the # of bars on each line of music,and you can put a couple or more tunes on one page. It is the defalt program for anyone who plays fiddle tunes.


#964: Experimental Rest Positions (1.55a)
Experimental Rest Positions (1.55a)

(964)

Submitted by: Peter Bowers on 30-Nov-1998

Hooray!!!! This solves many of my problems. At the risk of seeming greedy: Is visible/not visible next?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard on 30-Nov-1998

Would be useful

R.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 01-Dec-1998

Yes, this is useful, even though it departs from the Noteworthy principle of doing the layout for you if it can be predicted (which rest placement is).

Obviously the goal of this release was to improve staff layering. What is missing is the ability to set the position (up or down) of ties and slurs. This CANNOT always be predicted by the computer, and would be useful for both layered (the ties sometimes overlap) and non-layered scores.

I also agree that EVERY item should have a Visible setting.


#965: thanx
thanx

(965)

Submitted by: lewis on 01-Dec-1998

thanks to those who helped me with my midi interface problem. now that i've got that going, i have another query.

is there any way to save nwc files as .mid files? when i tried it before it failed to work properly.

thanks again!

lewis

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 01-Dec-1998

Yes, it is possible:
use [File]/[Export] menu item to do this.
You also may want to change the MIDI export settings in [Tools]/[Options...], File tab, MIDI section. Refer to online help there to know which settings you'd prefer.

HTH.
      MAD


#966: Beamed notes with a rest between them?
Beamed notes with a rest between them?

(966)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 02-Dec-1998

I'm sure I've seen a message telling how to create a couple of beamed notes with a rest between them. Is there a search method to find this in the archives? How does one find a specific subject among 900 messages?
Thanks
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 02-Dec-1998

You go to http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm
and download the offline version of the Forum. Then you can do an index or word search of the whole 900 messages!

A

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 02-Dec-1998

Thanks, Andrew. I DL'ed the Forum and created a Folder on my harddrive. Now when I have a question, I look there first. It's a great idea.
Gordon

Reply 3 offered by: Don Ferguson on 04-Dec-1998

I believe that question was answered once before by NWC support. It can't be done unless you use the experimental feature and overlay staffs.


#967: Chord notation
Chord notation

(967)

Submitted by: Hugo on 02-Dec-1998

This question is not directly related to the NWC sofware, but as long as I use it for all my musical activities, I ask my question in this forum :
What is the exact meaning of a chord written like this in a score :
G7/C or Dm/C or Am7/C or F/C...
Thanks,
Pierre Hugo, Paris, France.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Dec-1998

The letter after the / is the bass note. Example:

Dm7/C would be a D-minor 7 (D, F, A, C) with C bass

Fsus4/C would be Fsus4 (F, C, D) with C bass,

etc.

HTH

Reply 2 offered by: Warren Barnett on 02-Dec-1998

Chords notated like that are usually meant to represent a chord with a specific note on the bottom of the chord even though that note is not necessarily in the chord. For example Dm/C refers to a D minor chord with a C on the bottom. G7/C means a G seventh chord with a C on the bottom even though the C is not in the G7 chord.

Warren Barnett

Reply 3 offered by: Pierre Hugo on 02-Dec-1998

Fred, Warren,

Thanks a lot for your quick answers.
I have understood your replies for an organ for instance : I play the </part> on the ped keyboard. So how do I do the same on a guitar ?

Pierre Hugo, Paris, France

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Dec-1998

Well, on a guitar you have a lot less options - being restricted to six strings and finite-sized hands. However, there are a few common chords to which this would apply:

Examples:

The "C" chord that everyone knows and learns first off is actually C/E if you play all six strings.

The "A minor" chord is similarly actually Am/E if you strum without damping the big E string.

If you play the "basic" (three fingers in a V shape) "D" chord and strum all strings, you're actually playing D/E... and having the 2 in the bass is usually considered pretty ugly, so we soon learn to damp that string... :-P

If you play the usual "G" chord and drop the bottom string, you have a G/E, aka Em7.

And so on.

In some notation, the "guitar" chords like this are combined with what the bass is doing, so that you can fake it (or try to) if you happen to be stuck playing solo.

Fred

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 03-Dec-1998

But you may have a bottom note that is not in the chord and have it sound quite good if it is part of a descending scale, or something else that works musically in the bass.

A

Reply 6 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 06-Dec-1998

I was always impressed by the often used by jazz pianists 5 of 5 over 1, or in the key of C, D triad over a C bass. Sounds wonderfully corny when you play an arpeggio over that chord :-)
Adam

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Dec-1998

That one's a lot older than jazz. Beethoven was chastised for using this one (essentially a dominant 7 with the 7 in the bass), as for opening his first symphony with a dominant 7 chord... what a renegade ;-)

F

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Dec-1998

The method is often used in jazz as short hand to simplify a chord structure when written.

For example: Gm7/C is written for C9sus4.

And polyphonic chord examples include D/C7 for C13#11 etc.

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen Randall on 07-Dec-1998

Why are 4ths always sus?

As I understand it the abreviation is for a suspended fourth and this means that the fourth which is supspended should be sounding in the same part in the previous chord. e.g A -> Esus4 with the A of the A major being retained in the Esus4. However, I also see things like E7 -> E7sus4. But there is no fourth (A) in E7 to be suspended.

Have I misunderstood the meaning of sus or is the terminology used by arrangers by arrangers more loosely than I was taught in music theory?

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 07-Dec-1998

To follow S.R.'s question:
as a french-native musician, I always supposed that 'sus' meant 'augmentée' or 'diminuée' (more than a "true" 4th, or less resp.). C-F is what I call here a "true" 4th, C-F# being 4sus for me. Am i completely wrong??? (This sends me years ago, now I only read choir or classical music and no R'n'[B|R] no more,so didn't investigate further...)
F-B (in C major) being _the_ 4th exception ("triton" in french, what's its name in english?)

TIA,
      MAD

Reply 11 offered by: James Franklin on 07-Dec-1998

marsu: the "triton" (F-B in C) is a "tritone" in English... at least in the American dialect. The tritone substitution is a standard jazz chord substitution in a V-I sequence. In C: Db7 for G7 in G7|C ->Db7|C.

Stephan: It's been a while since I've been in a theory class, so I'm a little fuzzy on some of the "rules" but arrangers/composers almost always loosely abide by them. In practice, I've seen and used the sus chord in three ways. 1) The traditional suspension: A -> Esus. 2) As an anticipation: Esus -> A. 3) And as a "color" substitution: E -> Esus -> E.

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 07-Dec-1998

In jazz chord notation the 'sus4' invariably means that the third is omitted and replaced by the perfect fourth.
C,F,G,Bb (C7sus4)

If a fourth formed part of a 7th chord which also included a third (usually minor) I would call the chord an 11th chord.
G,Bb,D,F,(A),C (Gm11)

I have seen some arrangers call the first chord a C11 but to me an extension above the 7th (eg.9,11,13) implies a dominant 7th chord (V7) which includes both the maj 3rd and min 7th.
So I prefer this type of notation as it's less ambiguous.

I think the Berklee system of I II III with other marks #,b M,m,x (etc) signifying changes to the normal diatonic chords is a better system because it has a floating tonality that is independent of the key.
Unfortunately is seldom used in this country.

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Dec-1998

Interesting thread. As a sidenote, (is that a pun?) sus doesn't have to be 4, though it's usually understood as such if no specification, e.g. Gsus would consist of G, C, D.

You can also have sus2, which to continue the example would be G, A, D.

I was taught that "suspended" meant a chord lacking a third, to which it "wants to go" to be resolved - hence "suspended."

Fred

Reply 14 offered by: James C. Frankln on 08-Dec-1998

Barry, Fred... That's right -- there's no third in the sus chord. I forgot to mention that. Otherwise, as Barry pointed out, the chord is an extended IIm7 or V7.

Reply 15 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Dec-1998

Fred,

I taken the sus2 notation to mean 'add9' like CEGD.
Am I wrong?

Reply 16 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Dec-1998

To my understanding, add9, 9 and sus2 are all different. To summarize what I understand them to mean:

G 9 - G,B,D,F,A (the dominant 7 is understood to be present)

G add9 - G,B,D,A (no 7)

G sus2 - G,A,D (no 3, no 7, 2 in the same octave)

Fred

Reply 17 offered by: James C. Franklin on 10-Dec-1998

I've also seen Gsus2 notated as "G2(no 3)" which kind of put me off the first time I saw it. The notation may be explicit but I don't like the use of the parenthesis.

Reply 18 offered by: John Kavanagh on 12-Dec-1998

Actually, to be a complete pedant about it, the word "suspended" is used because the note (usually a 4th or 2nd)
is held over form the previous chord, at least in classical
voice leading. So in the basic 4-3 suspension, in C for instance, you might have IV (F: F a c' f') going to V7 with a supended 4th (G7sus4: G d c' f'), and then the held over, or suspended, fourth resolves to the third (G d b f'), and then you could do G7 - Csus4 - C for a real churchy ending
(G d b f' - C g c f' - C g c e')- excuse the bad voice leading, I'm doing this in a hurry. As the last writer
pointed out, it's useful to use the sus4 even when the note isn't actually suspended FROM anywhere, because it distinguishes it from an added fourth, which is a chord with an extra note, to a fourth that REPLACES the third and, in a pop or jazz context, may or may not resolve to it.


#968: Pedal for each clef?
Pedal for each clef?

(968)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 02-Dec-1998

After some experimenting, it seems that I need a Pedal mark for each clef if I want the effect in each clef (and I should want it to be universal, shouldn't I?)
When I see written music, I don't see Pedal marks more than once on a vertical plane; why is this?
I want the Pedal to sustain on playback (I'm not interested in printing.)
Is there a location on the staff where I can place the Pedal command so it works for the entire staff?
BTW, if one of the Pedals on a piano is sustain, what is the purpose of the other (I know, that's a really basic question, and I'm showing my ignorance, but I have to ask.)
For playback purposes, shouldn't there be a Release for every Pedal command? I have a piece of music here that has 9 Pedal commands in a row before there's a release. I suspect 8 of these is for the 2nd Pedal, right?
All help appreciated,
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Dec-1998

Usually, (and by default) each staff is assigned to its own unique midi channel. This means that a pedal (or any other) command will only affect the staff (i.e. channel) to which it's assigned.

You can circumvent this by setting both piano staves to the same midi channel in Staff Properties --> Midi. Then anything you do on one staff will also affect the other. That is, except dynamics and dynamic variances, since these are applied on a per-note basis.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 03-Dec-1998

About multi pedal for one release mark, it is sometimes laziness that leads to that. Many pianist I know interpret it the exceeding pedal marks as a release+immediate pedal.

comments anyone ? (I'm not a pianist you know)

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 03-Dec-1998

I'd agree with marsu.
If you see
Ped......Ped......Ped.......
that probably means
Ped.....*Ped.....*Ped.......

The three pedals are normally (l to r)
Una corda (the "soft" pedal) which on grands moves the hammers such that only one string is played. On other pianos, the hammers are moved closer to the string (thus reducing their "run up" and striking velocity).
Middle is either a sustain on notes already played (but not on notes subsequently played, I don't know how they do this), OR the practice pedal, which drops a cloth between the hammers and strings to mute the sound
Right is normally sustain - preventing the dampers returning so that notes still with the keys down and subsequent notes will ring on until the pedal is released.

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Dec-1998

On the upright I had access to as a child, the middle pedal was a sustain for the bass region (below middle C, or maybe just below) while allowing the treble region to act normally (damp-on-release).

Fred

Reply 5 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 04-Dec-1998

Thanks, everyone. This is just the kind of information I was looking for.
Gordon

Reply 6 offered by: Grant Hicks on 04-Dec-1998

To follow up on Andrew's note:

On grands, the middle pedal sustains notes already struck by keeping the dampers raised only on those notes. (Normally the dampers would fall and damp out the sound as soon as the keys were released.) This is in contrast to the right pedal, which raises *all* the dampers.

On uprights the use of the middle pedal varies. On some, it's a dummy (and on some "honest" uprights it's missing entirely). On others it does what Fred describes.

I've never run into the "practice pedal" behavior Andrew mentions, but I wouldn't doubt it. (This would have to be an uprights-only behavior, wouldn't it?)

Reply 7 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 06-Dec-1998

To follow up on Grants first note,
Billy Joel uses this pedal to great effect on the intro to 'Angry Young Man'. He sets the bass C octaves to sustain, whilst the rest of the notes can be played normally. He then does the huge demi-semi quaver intro and then hammers the sustain notes to ring over the second time he plays the D-S quavers. Great sound. Apparently he used to break piano bass strings doing this. What strength!
Adam


#969: Exporting to midi
Exporting to midi

(969)

Submitted by: Sterghios "Estaroth" Moschos on 02-Dec-1998

I tried SAVE AS... -> TYPE 1 MIDI FILE on a NWC file written in v1.52, finished in v1.55 and then tried playing it in WINAMP and in CAKEWALK 6.3. Unfortunately I was "unable to play file" as the most kind sun-of-a-you-know-what computer of mine informed me. I suspect this to be a glitch in NWC, though I cannot be 100% positive. If it is of any help I am using an 8mb soundfont on a AWE64Gold card to play mids - the rest of my mids play fine however...

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Dec-1998

Yes. There's a ... shall we say "anomaly" in the NWC1.55 build; the "Type 0" and "Type 1" legends are switched. So to export the usual Type 1 file, you actually have to either:

1) Specify "Type 0" in the export dialog, :-) or,

2) Use the "Save As..." dialog to save as Type 1 midi (but don't forget to change the file extension to .mid, or else your precious .nwc file -of-the-same-name- will be overwritten.) :-(

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Dec-1998

or,

3) Acquire version 1.55a, which corrects this "anomaly"


#970: Performer controlled midi sequencer available
Performer controlled midi sequencer available

(970)

Submitted by: Alex Chunghen Chow on 02-Dec-1998

I have wrote a midi sequencer whose tempo / beat count is controlled completely by a user. Currently, it works well only with the midi file exported by NoteWorthy Composer. (Several assumptions were made based on Noteworthy's midi file style.)

Its function is similar to the "Magicton" or "In concert" program of Cakewalk except that its user has even more precise control over the timing of a note and, as if it matters, it is FREE. The program has been tried out in a couple of performances with a 25-people orchestra and the results sound great.

Even it seems not to have obvious bugs, please don't expect super quality. If you like to try it out, please send me email and I'll send you the program and a very simplified user's manual. Of course, the thing that I ask for is your suggestions.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-Dec-1998

Alex,

This sounds like it would be of interest to a lot of users.
Would you like to post a zip file of the program and manual on the Scriptorium at http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com

I'm sure the guys who maintain the site would be interested.

Reply 2 offered by: Alex Chunghen Chow on 03-Dec-1998

Barry, good idea. I'll write a man page and post the program there.


#972: Key Changes
Key Changes

(972)

Submitted by: Peter Edwards on 03-Dec-1998

Is there a bug in the print out of key signatures?

My score starts in E flat and moves to A flat and then comes to a First Time Bar which includes a modulation back to E flat and a return to near the beginning of the piece.

The second time through it again, obviously, modulates to A flat but the second time bar does not repeat the change back to E flat, and the piece continues in A flat to the end.

All this plays fine and as expected, but the print out prints the final section with an E flat key signature instead of an A flat one.

Help!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Dec-1998

Short answer: A sample would be very useful. Without it, I would guess that you may need to add another copy of the correct key signature when you make key sig changes in repeated sections.

Long answer: NWC used to determine the key signature during printing by doing a simulated play back up to the start of each system. This meant that the printout reflected the way the score was played (key signatrues on each printed system would reflect how the piece actually sounded when played by NWC). However, this caused troubles for some users who did not listen to their pieces, but created unusual repeat traps, where some notation would be skipped all together by play back. If a key signature was located in one of these "notation holes" (not heard on play back), it would never get identified in printing of later systems. We changed NWC to use a more linear view (left to right) for printing of key signatures. This significantly reduced our support incidents in this area. This may be the cause of the behaviour you see. The solution is simple: add an extra key signature after repeated sections that change the key. This clarifies things for NWC, and makes it clear for a live player as well.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 03-Dec-1998

Thank you for the prompt reply. Yes that clears up the mystery.


#973: New with keyboards
New with keyboards

(973)

Submitted by: Martti Pesso on 04-Dec-1998

How to compose with keyboard?
I have SB64AWE-value card/Midi-cable/ESQ1-synth/WIN98.
Does anyone know forum or site with step-by-step instructions to play with this keyboard and/or write
the music to NWC?
Thanks
Martti Pesso/Finland

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 07-Dec-1998

Marti,

There are several places to read responses to similar questions.

1) The offline (Windows Help) version of this is at
http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm

2) NWC's own help covers a bit of this

3) The archives of the newsgroup at
http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/newsgroup.html

I think each of these will answer your question (and many more that you may think up!)

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Martti Pesso on 08-Dec-1998

Thanx.
I will dig into the info and see what I can do
myself.
Martti


#974: How do I match a key sig to my voice?
How do I match a key sig to my voice?

(974)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 04-Dec-1998

I enter songs into NWC so I can sing along. How do I get these songs transposed into a key that matches my voice?
If, for instance, I find that I sing in the key of C (and it is true that one always sings in the same key, isn't it?), and the song is written in b flat, how do I change the song to C?
The help file discusses forcing all accidentals, then changing by a given number of semitones, but this seems to be related to making a certain instrument *fit*, rather than making a change so the human voice would *fit*. And I don't know the relationship between changing semitones and changing keys. If someone has an old message number I can refer to, I would appreciate it.
Thanks,
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Don Ferguson on 04-Dec-1998

Look up TRANSPOSE STAFF COMMAND in Help file.

Go to Tools/Transpose staff and follow directions.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Dec-1998

Gordon

We dont sing in a 'key'.
Our voice has a 'range' - that is an upper and lower limit in which we can sing without strain.

What you need to do is find your range.(Find your lowest comfortable note on the piano keyboard and sing the chromatic scale with the piano up to your highest comfortable note).Make a note of this somewhere.

Examine the upper and lower range of the song you want to sing.
Raise or lower the pitch of your song until it fits within your singing range using the transpose staff feature of NWC.
Count up or down the semitones from the limit of your range to the limit of your song and transpose by this amount.

If you dont have a keyboard - just transpose your song a semitone at a time until the range of the song fits comfortably with your voice.

HTH!


#975: printing many staves
printing many staves

(975)

Submitted by: Peter W on 04-Dec-1998

I'm trying to print several staves, and the problem is that each one has a different time signature (such as 2/2, 2/8, 2/4, etc). When I try to print it, the 2/2 bar is huge, and the print-out is generally messed up. I've turned off "increase note spacing for larger durations," but that doesn't help. Any suggestions?
Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Byron Dickens on 04-Dec-1998

Unfortunately, NWC doesn't support polyrhythms like that. (I assume that's what you're trying to do.)

Maybe in the future???!!

Reply 2 offered by: Peter W on 04-Dec-1998

Actually, I don't need it to play back...I just need it to print out so that each 4 bar section is the same length on the page. It's for a text-book like assignment, and I want to print out a bunch of examples, each in a different metre.
As I said, all I care about is the printout.
Thanks again

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Dec-1998

A couple things you might try:

Use the Print Preview --> Copy function, or the Edit --> Copy Special option to copy the desired staff fragments to your clipboard, from whence you can import the graphic (as a metafile) into a program such as Word or Publisher. The online help file describes these functions quite well.

My daughter (who doesn't care for such tomfoolery but is quite resourceful) figured out that she can print several short pieces on a single page by suitably adjusting the top and bottom margins (in Page Setup), then running the same sheet of paper through the printer several times.

Fred


#976: Midi export hint
Midi export hint

(976)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur fred_nachbaur@bc.sympatico.ca on 05-Dec-1998

When exporting NWC files to midi, it's a good idea to delete any muted staves before doing the export.

The reason is that muted staves will still export their entire contents, albeit with velocity for each note set to zero.

Deleting the muted staves before export will have three significant advantages:

1) The resulting midi file will be considerably smaller.

2) There will be less chance of running out of polyphony.

3) With large numbers of staves, dense MPC's, etc. there will be less chance of overloading the resulting midi stream.

Fred Nachbaur


#977: Duplets
Duplets

(977)

Submitted by: Anakin Skywalker on 05-Dec-1998

Is there any way to put in duplets?? I have a piece in 6/8 that has some duplets in it, so does anyone have suggestions on what to do?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Dec-1998

There's been considerable discussion on this topic, if you are running Win95 I'd suggest getting the "off-line Forum" and doing a search on "duplets" and "n-tuplets." Various workarounds have been discussed.

The simple answer is.. no, this isn't currently supported. One possibility is if you have a lot of duplets and triplets mixed, write in 2/4 instead of 6/8. "Regular" 1/8 notes would then be duplets, and tripletted 1/8 notes would be the "usual" 6/8 eighth notes.

Reply 2 offered by: Damien Hall on 06-Dec-1998

Or just use a dotted eighth not instead...

Reply 3 offered by: Adam on 06-Dec-1998

Use the force:-)

Reply 4 offered by: Grant Hicks on 06-Dec-1998

Dotted eighths are best (and more accessible to most of us than the "Force"). In fact, there is actual published music by actual famous composers (Benjamin Britten comes to mind) where dotted eighths are used in this way, so it is a legitimate solution to the problem.

Of course, this isn't to say that Eric shouldn't put duplets into some future version of NWC. I just wouldn't like it to distract him from the _real_ issue, which is quintuplets. For the lack of these there's no reasonable work-around whatever.

Reply 5 offered by: snuffbear on 10-Jan-1999

Re ?tuplets the best way in my view is type in the number of note you want and print out without auditing the bar lines then bracket the notes in the ? uplets and mark with ink the number required. I know it will not sound correct but if you use Noteworthy as a composer's template thats the best it can do on this sticky subject. Best of luck


#978: Flow directon marks
Flow directon marks

(978)

Submitted by: Lars Eriksen on 07-Dec-1998

I am currently typing choir arrangements on the NWC. To make the playback right, I have to put marks like "da capo" on _every single staff_, or some staffs won't be repeated.

On the print out this looks rather silly - especially since the mark has to be notated even on both the lines for the piano.... Is there a way to get around this?

Aside from that, the program is excellent for work with choirs. Not least the fact that one may play back each of the voices individually is a real time saver!

Lars

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 07-Dec-1998

Without wishing to doubt you, have you actually tried printing this out or looking at a print preview ?

I have used 'da capo' and the other repeat instructions frequently in my music and although you have to enter the marks on every stave, NoteWorthy is clever enough to only print the marks on the top most stave.

It is also useful that you DON'T ONLY have to put the marks once since there are occasions where you can have hidden staves where you don't want the music to obey a global stave instruction.

I reckon that the methodology here is probably just about right.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Lars Eriksen on 07-Dec-1998

Thanks a lot. :-)

Somehow I assumed that the score would look like what I see on my screen.

Lars


#979: Pedal Sustain/Release
Pedal Sustain/Release

(979)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 07-Dec-1998

Hi NWC'ers,

I have a simple score, one staff for mezzo soloist, then two staves for piano. I have added Pedal down and up commands in appropriate places in the music; these I have only added to the bottom (bass clef) staff for the piano. Also, the soloist staff is muted.

Upon playback, a sustained sound continues beyond the pedal release marks... I have read in the offline forum that some folk have needed to add the pedal marks to all staves in order to get play back to sound correct -- will that cure my problem? I thought the pedal marks only apply to the staff they're on, that should be all I'm affecting, right?

I really only need the printed music, but as long as I am doing some practicing with NWC playback, I find the continuance of sound annoying! Please tell me what dumb thing I am/am not doing so I can fix this... thanx as always for your help!

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Dec-1998

Check to be sure that you don't have ties across bars between two "different" notes; e.g. if you have an F# in one bar, and tie it to an F natural in the next, you will get a stuck note.

You can examine each note without un-tying it by selecting it and seeing which (if any) accidentals buttons are "lit up."

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Sue on 08-Dec-1998

Hi Fred,

I had no "stuck notes" in the score prior to adding the pedal marks...

It is not a terribly large file, are you interested in playing it to see if it behaves the same on your system? I can e-mail it to you if you like. Let me know.

Sue

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Dec-1998

Sue,

I'd be happy to have a listen/look at your file. Go ahead and send it, I'll let you know what it does on my machine.

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Sue on 11-Dec-1998

Hi Fred,

Thanks for looking at my score, and confirming that it is my SB16 card that is not performing the pedal release. Just something I'll have to live with until I decide to upgrade...

Sue

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Dec-1998

For the record - we discovered that it's the Creative Labs SB16 FM synth midi itself that has this bug. It doesn't occur on other cards, even in FM (OPL3) mode... only on the SB16.

I verified this using a completely different sequencer - so it's not a problem unique to NoteWorthy Composer.

Fred


#980: MIDI keyboard controlling note duration?
MIDI keyboard controlling note duration?

(980)

Submitted by: Alex Fefer on 07-Dec-1998

Hi,

I was wondering if it's possible to have your MIDI keyboard control pitch and duration, so it will be able to record exactly what you play?

Thanks.

Alex

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Dec-1998

Well, I'm not sure if I'm answering the question you asked, but yes - you control pitch with which key you press, and duration by how long you hold it down. Most keyboards also record how hard you press (velocity), which at present isn't imported into NoteWorthy Composer. Similarly, pitch and mod wheel, and volume controllers aren't imported either; you have to add these afterwards.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 08-Dec-1998

Alex, there are two methods of note entry from a MIDI keyboard. Step time entry goes note by note, and you have to set the key and time signatures, note duration and bar lines yourself - the keyboard only determines the pitch.

To record an actual performance you need to run a 'dummy' tune and play in time with it. Best done by setting up a repeating 'metronome' bar, (Channels 10 or 16 are the usual percussion channels) preferably longer than the intended recording - you can then replay a mistake and edit out the offending bar later. The method is fully documented in the Help system (Search <Record Command>). Have fun!

Peter

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 08-Dec-1998

If your are step entering from a midi controller the pitch wheel and mod wheel can be used to change the duration of the entered note.
You will find the documentation in the help files.


#983: Loss of font
Loss of font

(983)

Submitted by: Bryan Wylie on 10-Dec-1998

I have just downloaded v 1.55a and up graded my previuos installation.
Unfortunately it will not run - I get a message saying the program cannot find nwcv15.ttf. It's true I don't have this anywhere 'tho I don't know how I can have lost it.
Also, I cannot re-load it from my original disk as I only have v 1.3 which does not have this file.
Where do I go from here, please

Bryan Wylie bwylie@cix.co.uk

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Dec-1998

You cannot use the upgrades on a prior copy of NWC that is older than 1.50. If you were running version 1.31, for example, then you need to download and install the entire version 1.55a program using the NWCSETUP.EXE file. The upgrade page gives you all of the necessary links.

Reply 2 offered by: Bryan Wylie on 11-Dec-1998

OK thanks, I'll give that a go

Bryan Wylie

bwylie@cix.co.uk


#984: Glissandos
Glissandos

(984)

Submitted by: foth on 12-Dec-1998

Hi does anyone know how to make glissando markings in noteworthy? (The symbol is a squiggly line going diagonally up or down depending on the direction of the gliss) I don't care as much about the sound, more about the marking on the score.

PS: I'm a pianist and trombonist, both instruments are famous for their use of glisses, so i'd appreciate some help

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 12-Dec-1998

Glisses aren't supported in NWC yet.
However, the glyphs can be added to your score using teXt inserted that is from the Boxmarks font (characters d,e & f)
To do this, in Page Setup (Fonts tab) define User Font 1 as Boxmarks.
Then use the X command (Insert Text), make the character d,e or f, and set the font to User Font 1, and bob's your uncle!

Andrew


#985: Chords containing rests
Chords containing rests

(985)

Submitted by: Bryan Wylie on 12-Dec-1998

I am having problems with rests, chords and layers. To illustrate this I will take the opening bar of Lionel Bart's "Where is Love" treble clef, piano accompaniment. This is written basically as a Soprano line (all sticks up) with an Alto line (all sticks down) below.

The Soprano line goes: Four half notes, one dotted whole note, one half note (ie 4 beats/bar)

The Alto line goes: One whole note rest, two half notes, two whole notes (ie 4 beats/bar)

Trying to write this in NWC gets me in immediate trouble. The program will not let me chord the Alto whole note rest with the first Soprano half note, nor will it even let me chord the first two Soprano half notes with two half note rests, and if I simply leave out the rest the program thinks I have four and a half beats in the bar. The basic trouble here seems to be the inability of the program to accept a chord containing a rest and an equal or shorter note, coupled with an inability to recognise whether a rest is in the Alto or the Soprano part.

No doubt I am missing something quite simple here..... Anyone got a solution, please.

Bryan Wylie

bwylie@cix.co.uk

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Dec-1998

I've had to resort to inserting rests as "text" in similar situations. This might be something for you to experiment with.

In File--> Page Setup --> Fonts, assign one of the User Fonts (I use User1) as the native NoteWorthy note font NWCV15.TTF. You can then put rests or other objects just about anywhere you want using the x (insert text) command.

There's a little "FONTMAP" file on the Scriptorium that you can use as a "toolbox" to copy/paste such objects into your file.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 14-Dec-1998

Also see msg #908

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 14-Dec-1998

The Staff Layering feature should solve this problem. You write each voice on its own staff, and layer them together.
The new 1.55 version allows you to place rests properly, fixing the biggest limitation of this feature.

Reply 4 offered by: Bryan Wylie on 14-Dec-1998

OK, I take the point about using text rather than a "proper" rest, but what does this do to the playack feature?

I've thought about the layering solution but not yet used it for real - thing is, this really just amounts to putting your two voices on two staves which is a bit of a PITA...

Thanks for your comments chaps

Bryan bwylie@cix.co.uk

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Dec-1998

Adding a rest as "text" has the same effect as any other text - none. It's simply ignored during playback.

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 15-Dec-1998

If the whole song is two voices, it is easier to enter it into two separate staves then trying to chord every note. The PITA is when two notes occupy the same value or one value apart. Then you must either chord the note in both staves, or select the bottom note, edit it (Ctrl-E)and move it one point to the right (Extra Note Spacing).

Reply 7 offered by: wondering on 16-Dec-1998

What is a PITA ???

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Bowers on 16-Dec-1998

PITA - Pain In The A...


#986: Midi convertion in triplets
Midi convertion in triplets

(986)

Submitted by: snuff bear on 12-Dec-1998

I have an extensive quantity of midi files to convert and need help to get Noteworthy Composer to convert the midi triplets into Noteworthy triplets in the musical score. Anyone had this problem and has a quick way of solving it please?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Dec-1998

Andrew Purdam has worked up a nice collection of macros for recorder.exe to do just this sort of thing. You can pick up the macros at the Scriptorium. There's also a link to get recorder.exe and related files, just in case you no longer have this on your system (it was a Windows 3.x program that was dropped in Win95, but will run just fine if you reinstall it).

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 14-Dec-1998

You can also have a visual example of what the "tripletize" macro does at Andrew's page, at http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html#macros
Do not hesitate to ask further if needed.


#987: Arpeggio.
Arpeggio.

(987)

Submitted by: Lars E. on 14-Dec-1998

Despiting the danger of ridiculing myself once again...

Does anyone know how to notate arpeggios in piano scores written with NoteWorthy? Is it possible to make the program play these chords as arpeggios?

(I still trying to get the hang of this program!)

Lars Eriksen.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 14-Dec-1998

You cannot just 'do' this. It takes a bit of effort.

First of all, if you need to show the vertical wavy line, then you should get Barry's Boxmarks font from the Scriptorium or from the newsgroup.

You then need to have a hidden stave in which you actually notate the arpeggio as it sounds.

If you refer to !usertip4.htm#sprdgrd , I have documented an easier way to achieve this using grace notes.

If you just want the sound and you are not worried about the look of the music, then you can use this method and not worry about hidden staves.

HTH

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 14-Dec-1998

Sorry I think this should be the link.

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip4.htm#sprdgrd

R.


#988: Staves displaced
Staves displaced

(988)

Submitted by: Bryan Wylie on 14-Dec-1998

I have a composition which contains two "standard" repeats and then a third repeat in which the last two bars are slightly different.

All this looks fine one the screen and prints OK. However the playback feature goes haywire at the end of the third repeat - the first treble bar plays OK but only the first note of the first bass bar is in synch, then the bass line is halted until the treble bars complete, after which the bass line completes.

I hope that's understandable - it sure is odd! Anyone any ideas?

Bryan

bwylie@cix.co.uk

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Dec-1998

You must have the repeats on all staves.
Have you done this?

Reply 2 offered by: Bryan Wylie on 20-Dec-1998

<<You must have the repeats on all staves.
Have you done this>>

Yes, I had, Barry, but I discovered yesterday in the course of increasing the number of repeats, that I had left behind an old repeat sign that I thought I had deleted. That's what comes of changing too many things at once <grrr>

Thanks for your help, anyway,

Bryan


#990: Mozart Piano Sonata K.310
Mozart Piano Sonata K.310

(990)

Submitted by: Christine E. Pierce on 16-Dec-1998

Does anyone know of an online source of harmonic analysis? I am looking for a harmonic analysis of the first two movements of mozart's piano sonata in A minor - k.310. Help, please. This piece is driving me insane.
Thanks,C. Pierce

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Dec-1998

Hi Christine,

One of Guenter Nagler's Midi utilities does a chordal analysis of a midi file. If you have a midi of the piece, you could try this. There's a link to his page (and a zippped compendium of all the utilities) on the Scriptorium.

If not, or if you're not comfortable with command-line interpreters (DOS), try a web search using keywords like +"harmonic analysis" +Mozart.

Fred


#991: OCR
OCR

(991)

Submitted by: Rod Lloyd on 17-Dec-1998

I am looking for a way to scan my music into noteworthy. can noteworthy do this or is there some other way to achieve this?

prefer reply direct to lloyd@clear-lake.com

Rod

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 18-Dec-1998

You can't do this directly from NoteWorthy but there are at least two products on the market which will allow you to scan in sheet music and convert it to MIDI format.

From there you can import the MIDI file into NoteWorthy.

The products are :

Midiscan from
http://www.musitek.com/

and

Cappella scan or Capscan from

http://www.softpart.co.uk/capella.html

You can download a demo version for bothe products at these addresses.

From personal experience of trying these products, I would still say that it is quicker to notate manually directly into NoteWorthy.

Much time is spent correcting the errors and assumptions of the scanning conversion program and then further time is spent after the import into NoteWorthy. However IMHO,I do think that Capscan is slightly better than Midiscan.

But the demo programs are there for you to form your own opinion so good luck with them.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ruckman on 18-Dec-1998

As Richard has said, it would be quicker to manually input to NoteWorthy. I agree, take a look at msg #485, and read about my experience with MidiScan.

Reply 3 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 19-Dec-1998

I DL'ed Capella from the site shown, and I can't see that it has any OCR capabilities. Have I overlooked something? I also looked for something other than Capella (you mentioned CapScan) but could find nothing.
All help appreciated,
Gordon

Reply 4 offered by: Rod Lloyd on 19-Dec-1998

I also checked out Capella and contacted them direct. as follows. Not sure it is worth it based on reports of time ti fix errors
====

Hello Rod

Thank you for your email.

Yes, we have capella-scan which will scan in music and save as a capella
file. Once it is a capella file you can transpose, extract parts, etc.
or save as a MIDI file.

The scanning program works by recognising the musical elements of a bit
map created by the software already in the scanner. The recognised music
is overlaid in green on the bit map image and this makes it very easy to
see errors. Corrections are made with the aid of a floating palette. We
recognised a page of a Chopin Etude in 8 seconds.

capella and capella-scan cost 184 pounds (including VAT and UK postage).

Regards

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 19-Dec-1998

OCR also received a good airing (and the various programs a good hammering) in threads: msg #603 , msg #555 , and msg #485

Reply 6 offered by: Bodo Meissner on 25-Jan-1999

I just bought "capella scan" and "capella" in a "special editition" which costs only 30DM each instead of nearly 200DM for the "professional" version. (You need capella because capella scan saves files in capella format only.) I scanned and recognized a small song containing 3 voices in 2 staves. The program did not recognize some of the rests, dotted notes, ties and repeat bars. It was easy to correct this because capella scan draws recognized objects directly onto the scanned image and I can select notation objects from a toolbar and drag them onto their scanned counterpart. (But I didn't find a way to insert the ties in capella scan.) I used capella to insert the missing ties and exported the the file in MIDI format. The MIDI file could easily be imported into NWC. I had to insert repeats manually in NWC because they were lost due to the MIDI export/import. Capella scan does not recognize lyrics at all so I had to enter them manually. The "special edition" of capella scan saves staffs containing two voices as two separate staves so I used staff layering in NWC to get them together.
In my opinion it was easier to correct the recognition errors than entering the notes manually.

Bodo


#992: Sound Card
Sound Card

(992)

Submitted by: Al simpson on 18-Dec-1998

when using noteworhty or music writer all of the instruments sound very similar. Does anyone have any recommendation for a sound card that will produce a guitiar sound that actually sounds like one.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Dec-1998

If you're using an SB16 or similar card, just about anything would be an improvement. I'm happy with my Yamaha-based MPU401 card, but there's lots of good cards available.

Another option if you have Pentium and Win95 (_not_ Win98) then you can use Yamaha's SoftSynth to get true wave-table sound on a stock SB16. You can download a trial version from their website; if you like it, registration is under $25 US.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 18-Dec-1998

You'll need to check your hardware, but there are several daughterboards available, too, which can be added to many soundcards (well, SB16s, anyway), which give wavetable sounds, but are cheaper than a full-blown wavetable board.

Andrew


#994: Crescendo within one note
Crescendo within one note

(994)

Submitted by: Joonas Linkola on 20-Dec-1998

Hi,

I'm trying to notate a beautiful violin piece which uses a lot of crescendo and diminuendo. The notes in the tune are quite long (many whole notes and such), so I haven't been able to use NoteWorthy's crescendo option to increase the volume if I have one, long note. Is it possible?

For instance: "pianissimo crescendo whole-note forte quarter note" gives me a pianissimo whole note and a forte quarter note, not a crescendo whole note as desired.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 20-Dec-1998

Joonas,
Crescendo will only work as it is for a sequence of notes.
To get a swell on a single note, use a volume Multi-Point Controller.
Set the channel volume of the staves to about 100.
Then with the multipoint controller, do a linear increase in volume to 128, over about 3 quarter notes. With suitable tweakikng of numbers and dynamics, you should get something that sounds okay.

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Dec-1998

Also, remember that not all sound cards support changing the volume for a note that is already playing. Some cards will only enforce a new volume settings for nptes that start AFTER the volume change.

Reply 3 offered by: Joonas Linkola on 20-Dec-1998

Thanks for the advice, I'll try that!


#995: WAV file conversion
WAV file conversion

(995)

Submitted by: Peter Boyd on 21-Dec-1998

I guess this is a non starter, but I'll ask the question anyway - does anyone know a way to to convert .WAV files to .MID files?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 21-Dec-1998

As far as I know, there are no programs currently that can do that type of conversion reliably, due to the many factors involved. I have vaguely heard that efforts to do so work even more dismally than OCR conversions.

For the foreseeable future, I think the best bet is to program in the song or item in through use of a midi-instrument. You may also be able to find a midi rendition of the music on the Web.

Reply 2 offered by: Don Ruckman on 22-Dec-1998

Peter,
Check out the site: www.audioworks.com. There are two programs that might be of interest to you: Sound2Midi, and Wav2Mid. I downloaded the trial version of Sound2Midi and exercised it quite a bit. I played trumpet into the sound card card (computer microphone) and viewed the notated results. Not bad, but not perfect. This program is for monophonic sound, but am not sure about wav2mid. Give it a look.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 28-Dec-1998

You could also try (shareware, 20 USD) AKoff Composer
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Hills/4313/
The 1.03 version is just out, didn't try it (I downloaded 1.0b 98.9 and never had time to try) but if it work as promised, it's worth the price.

Due to huge mathematic calculation or signal analysis, wav to midi conversion is rare. This is much more complicated than OCR, since any instrument's sound is made by additional waves at different frequencies, that can be common when more than one sound (or instrument) appear. In fact, it is amazing that the human brains can recognize a pianissimo piccolo in a full orchestra...

HTH,
Marsu

Reply 4 offered by: Terry Brooks on 26-Sep-1999

It's no good trying to convert WAV to MIDI, as there isn't a program capable of recognising the different instruments within the piece being converted.
I have tried all of the above without success, your best bet is to find an existing midi file on the net.
However if your wav files contain notes from only one instrument then you may have more luck.
If you do solve this problem there are hundreds of people on the net who would like to hear from you.
Good luck !
Terry

Reply 5 offered by: Brian on 02-Oct-1999

Just a note about Wav2Mid. I tried it and it has nothing to do with converting what is actually in the .wav file to midi format. It just uses it somehow to generate a totally different (and very strange sounding) midi file.

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Flood on 02-Nov-1999

I downloaded yesterday the Digital Ear demo.
I was amazed with its capabilities.
No other program (wav2midi, autoscore)could really
recognize any instrument like this one.
I will definetly register.

Here is the site:

http://digitalear.iwarp.com/

Cheers,

S. Flood

Reply 7 offered by: Janice on 19-Nov-1999

Sound2Midi, Wav2Mid, Autoscore, and Digital Ear are all intended for use with monophonic music - one note at a time. If your wav files contain many notes at once such as chords (most do), then these programs would be of no use.

There is a program called Intelliscore that creates midi files from polyphonic wav files. The results aren't perfect, but it's still quicker than transcribing by hand.

You can download a demo from http://www.intelliscore.net.

Reply 8 offered by: TallStick on 21-Dec-1999

Try TS-AudioToMidi Realtime Converter (freeware): http://www.midi.ru/AudioToMidi/

Reply 9 offered by: Nick Wilde on 04-Feb-2000

I believe that Digital Ear is by far the best of all
similar programs.

The reason for that is that actually WORKS!

See by your self, get a their free demo from:

http://digitalear.iwarp.com/demo.htm

Reply 10 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Feb-2000

'....that actually works'

Do you need to qualify that.
Will Digital Ear transcribe a midi file of Glenn Miller's big band playing 'In the Mood' with all the saxes, brass and rhythm on separate tracks or will it only transcribe a single voice or perhaps 4 voices from guitar/piano chords.

I've spent a lot of time pursuing the claims of wav to mid software vendors and have found them to be exaggerated to say the least.
Digital Ear, Amazing Midi and Intelliscore come to mind.
Even as single voice transcribers it's faster and more accurate to rely on your ear and your note entry skills than fiddling with parameters and editing until you get a less than satisfactory result with any of these.

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Feb-2000

I've found that the Russian one (URL a couple messages earlier) works as well as any of the others... and it's completely free.

Digital Ear is probably the worst, since it relies on your synth being capable of a one-octave pitch-bend range -- completely at odds with the General Midi spec, and therefore not even usable with the majority of GM-compatible sound cards.

Reply 12 offered by: toru kurabayashi on 06-Feb-2000

Hellow, I am Japanese.
I found the following software.
I will use these as "vocal to midi".

PolyAxe Driver v1.1
http://welcom.to/manitu

melos release1.0 (melos10e.zip)
schulz@biopsy.uni-jena.de

NoteWhistler v1.1
ak@amllc.com

Prismer V1.2 (prismer.exe)
$B!!(J Creative Tech Korea,Ltd

WIDI v2.31
www.midi.ru/w2m/english/widi.htm

WAV2MID v1.0 D (wavmid.zip)
Tanager productions 74055.1622@compuserve.com

wav2midi v1.1
http://www.iicm.edu/Cpub

Singing Tutor VIMAS Technologies
http://www.vimas.com/ve_singt_order.htm

Japan sites

Sing-a-Tune 005 (sing005.exe)
sharai@ibm.net

XGworks v4.0
YAMAHA

SINGER SONG WRITER v5.0 (ssw5demo.exe)
http://www.ssw.co.jp/products/index.htm

song-raita v4.20 (srt420.exe)
http://www.dynasys.co.jp/

gama v2.02 (gama202.zip)
http://www18.cds.ne.jp/~ru-chan/htdocs/soft/e_gama.html

wav2midi 0.93a (wv2md093.lzh)
http://www.geocities.co.jp/SiliconValley/4996/

Hanauta-musician
http://www.medianavi.co.jp

and others

autoscore v2.0

cakewalk v9

AmazingMIDI v1.50
http://www.pluto.dti.ne.jp/~araki/amazingmidi/

audio to midi v1.06
www.midi.ru/

sound2midi v1.5c
wav2mid v1.5
http://www.audioworks.com

Digital Ear v1.5
http://digitalear.iwarp.com/

Intelliscore v2.0
http://www.intelliscore.net/

AKoff Music Composer V1.45
http://www.akoff.com

If anyone know the other software except the above,
please tell me it.

Reply 13 offered by: Sakae Kawamura on 25-Feb-2000

Hellow.
I found this site.

inst2midi
http://www.nerds.de/nerds/english/inst2midi.html

Reply 14 offered by: Tom Horowitz on 24-Mar-2000

Digital Ear v. 2.0 http://digitalear.iwarp.com/
is the only serious solution.

It is completely wrong that it relies on the octave pitch
bend range. It is user adjustable, just see the settings.

Reply 15 offered by: Toru Kurabayashi on 09-Apr-2000

Wav-2-Midi
Naked Note Software
9638792@student.ul.ie
www.esatclear.ie/~padraigmyers/index.html

Reply 16 offered by: Chris on 19-Aug-2000

I have used many of the above packages so I can convert cd samples recorded into wav files into ringtones for nokia phones. Widi recognition system 2.5 is ok but as with all of them they don't like high pitch sounds and multiple instruments.

If any one knows how to convert the pitch of a wav file or midi file please e-mail me.

Reply 17 offered by: brknhrts on 18-Sep-2000

does anyone know how to convert .wav to .ra??? wav to real audio files? does anyone know any free programs that allows users to convert wav to real audio files?

Reply 18 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Sep-2000

You can get a Real-Audio encoder called Real Producer from their website at http://www.real.com/ -- there used to be a free version available (probably still is, you might have to dig through their site), without the bells and whistles, and seemed to do the job just fine... if /any/ "real" audio can be called "fine"...

Reply 19 offered by: Fede on 18-Nov-2000

So, you say there is no program to transcribe (automatically) a rock band (guitar,bass,drums and voice) to midi file?

Reply 20 offered by: Barry Graham on 18-Nov-2000

Exactly!

Reply 21 offered by: Rachel on 15-May-2001

Here is my problem rookie to the program Cakewalk 6.0 is what I am using. I am triing to put a Dance recital on a CD all I need to do is make some tracks louder and combine a few tracks not on top of each other just on after the other almost like pushing pause on the tape recorder. The wav 2 midi issue ...well... I wonder if it will ever happen. Also, Can you use all of calewalks editing capabilities on wav files as well as midi files? Thank you to who ever took the time to read and reply.

Reply 22 offered by: John on 16-May-2001

Hello everyone,
I am simply looking for a way to convert
a wav file to a midi file.
Wav files always wind up too big!

Somebody figured out how to make the files.

I am sure it can be done, we have remote
satellites that can do all kinds of wild stuff.

Does anyone know of a help forum where I
might find a tip, rather than everyone just saying
" It can't be done "

Reply 23 offered by: John on 16-May-2001

It CAN'T BE DONE.

Reply 24 offered by: Joe Music on 16-May-2001

"As the sun slowly sets over the Pacific Ocean, a distant seagull dives for fish. Surfers paddle ashore, mournful that the sea has been so calm."

When someone figures out how to automatically convert the above language into a JPEG image, then I'll tell you the secret of converting WAV to MIDI.

Reply 25 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 16-May-2001

Great! A couple of sentences worth a whole article.

Thx.

Reply 26 offered by: John Gann on 16-May-2001

Ok, sorry I asked.

I was just looking for some help, and maybe a little civility.

I can be made fun of anywhere, I don't have to come here for it.

Reply 27 offered by: John on 16-May-2001

I do not think you are being made fun of here. However, your statement "I am sure it can be done" is being challenged. Why are you sure?

Reply 28 offered by: John Gann on 16-May-2001

yeah, right.

This is your statement born of infinite wisdom:
It CAN'T BE DONE.

Now I ask you,
Why are you sure?

jerk

Reply 29 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-May-2001

Perhaps a more precise way of phrasing it would be to say "it /hasn't/ yet been done, and it is unlikely to be done in the foreseeable future."

I don't think anyone was trying to make fun of anyone by using the text-to-jpeg analogy. It's actually a very good analogy for the situation of converting a complex sound recording (wav, mp3, etc.) into a representative series of commands (midi).

That being said, there are programs that purport to do this, with varying degrees of success. Check out Audio2Midi by Alexey Egorov, it's a free download and in my opinion anywhere as competent as some very much pricier products. Even so, I consider it little more than an interesting toy.

Reply 30 offered by: Grant on 17-May-2001

Isn't the text-to-JPEG analogy backwards? The text, being a high-level description of the scene, seems to me analogous to a MIDI file, while a JPEG, being a complex realization of the scene, is more like a WAV file.

In fact I imagine it would be relatively easy to construct a program that could produce a JPEG file from a (highly formulaic) text description plus an appropriate library of clip art (MIDI->WAV). What would be difficult would be a program that could take an arbitrary JPEG file and produce a concise description of its contents in words (WAV->MIDI).

Reply 31 offered by: Joe Music on 17-May-2001

You are right, Grant. My word-to-JPEG analogy IS backwards.

In fact, I believe it would be reasonably possible for sentence-parsing software to analyze my sentence about the sunset, go to an image library for seashore, sunset, seagull, and surfers, and put something together!

We are not trying to make fun of the person who asked the original question. Indeed, there are existing programs that accept WAV as input, think about it, and give MIDI as output. But in no sense is the WAV being "converted" to MIDI. The inadequate quality of output, when re-output as sound, is the problem.

More to the point, I gather that the main reason why consumers would want to convert WAV to MIDI, which could then be formatted as sheet music, is to learn how to play someone else's (copyrighted) recording. I believe that faster information transfer rates are technologically close enough that conversion of WAV to MIDI, merely to save space or bandwidth, is a waste of programming effort.

Reply 32 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-May-2001

Folks,

Maybe this wav-to-midi subject; differences between a wav and midi and why a wav couldn't yet have been successfully converted to midi etc. can be done as a web article or a faq.

I have some concrete data on the subject:

* A simple nwc/midi file (only a C chord w. piano patch),
* WAV file recorded from it,
* MIDI file said_to_have_been converted from the WAV,

if would be of help.

I think the Scripto will be a proper host for such an article.

Regards.

PS: Apologies to John; I didn't intend to offend him anyway.

Reply 33 offered by: Z-Man on 30-Aug-2001

yo,yo,yo,yo! If anyone still reads these things.... I tell you that wav-midi conversion can be done. Most programs suck and only do the mono files, but AKoff's composer really does work properly. I converted a wav file that completly screwed up on every other program on AKoff, and I was quite pleased with the results. I recommend that you people try it out. It's the only good one there is. You can't save on the demo, but if you can chuck up $29, you can save all you want. and this one doesn't place those stupid 15 second limits on your conversions, either.

Try it!!! :-)

Reply 34 offered by: Roman on 31-Aug-2001

I am developing new wav to mid tool,
http://www.roman.binom.com/score_extractor/

Decription:
===========
ScoreExtractor is a program that can help you manually convert your wav file to midi.
The idea is to draw notes on a time-frequency picture,
then you can test yourself, and save a results

License: Freeware
Minimum requirements: 486, Windows 95/98/Me/2000
File size: 1.15 Mb
Uninstaller: Don't included
Date added: August 28, 2001
Help support: Only quick help text file

Reply 35 offered by: Midiman on 08-Sep-2001

Actually, it is VERY easy to create text-to jpeg. why dont you get psp, scroll up, push the little button on the toolbar, and there ya go. NOW TELL ME HOW TO MAKE EM!!!! just joking. Actually wav files do retain some computer guided definitions that these programs use. Not much, but only on CD quality sound. If you get RCMP3 and get the wav files off the cd, they should be 'digitally mutilated' cause they arent recordings, they are d

Reply 36 offered by: Blight on 09-Sep-2001

AKOff is another cheap one that doesn't make them sound right.

Reply 37 offered by: Dwain on 16-Oct-2001

I was just looking for a Realaudio-to-wav converter for a friend; the wav-to-midi converter is found on the same page! Try http://www.hitsquad.com/smm/win95/FORMAT_CONVERTERS/

Reply 38 offered by: screwhead138 on 04-Nov-2001

Hey I'm new to this, and I was wondering if anyone knows a way to convert .wav files to .mp3?? I would be very greatful if anyone knows how to do this!!!

Reply 39 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Nov-2001

Music Match Jukebox can convert wav to mp3 and the reverse.
Download the free version at www.musicmatch.com

Reply 40 offered by: tuanthan on 26-Nov-2001

I think it can be done but not perfect. Why don't we discuss about this topic.
Is there any forum discuss about this ? Please tell me know.

tuanthan

Reply 41 offered by: Camilla on 01-Dec-2001

Does anyone know how to tell a complete computer novice how to convert midi to wav? Email replies welcome

Reply 42 offered by: Michael on 07-Jan-2002

Hello,
Can anyone tell me, if exists a software, that can make a midi-file from a wav-file in which exists only drumsounds? I have recorded some drum tracks from an acoustic drumkit. But it sounds not so good. I would use these drumtracks now to trigger a software drum machine.

Reply 43 offered by: Michael on 07-Jan-2002

And...
I have not the money to buy a ddrum e-drum or similar.

Regards
Michael


#996: stuck keys
stuck keys

(996)

Submitted by: hornman on 23-Dec-1998

in almost every piece i work on, noteworthy has a problem with stuck keys. it will sustain a note even after i click stop. clicking stop 2 or 3 times usually shuts it off, but this problem makes it hard to hear a score. any ideas?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Dec-1998

See the help file Common Questions section, as well as msg #39, msg #128, msg #442, msg #479, msg #854, msg #886

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 23-Dec-1998

I had this same problem when I first started using NWC. In my case, tied notes were the culprit. If the first of a pair of tied notes uses an accidental, you must enter the second with the same accidental marked. This won't show up on the screen or in a printout, but you have to tell NWC that you want that note to remain the same. For example, if you want two B flats tied together within the key of C, you must enter the second B as a flat. Otherwise, NWC thinks you want the second note to change to B natural. The first note is tied to nothing and the program continues to play it (until another B flat comes along). I had to edit several scores early on by highlighting the incorrect notes and clicking the proper accidental. Hope this helps.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant Hicks on 27-Dec-1998

I would add to chris's response that this only happens when the tie crosses a bar line. Within a measure, once an accidental has been applied to a note it remains in effect. The bar line wipes the slate clean, so it's really only after a bar line that you need to re-enter the accidental.


#997: Strange Timing
Strange Timing

(997)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 23-Dec-1998

I'm entering a song that's in 6/8 time. A lot of the measures have in the treble clef 2 pair of 8th notes, and each pair has a "2" beside them. The corresponding bass clef will have 2 dotted quarter notes. This time does not match at all. What does the "2" mean? The triplet icon is not enabled. I find I can make the measures identical if I simply dot the four eighth notes. Is this OK? Why was the song written the way it is. Thanks for all help.
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Dec-1998

You are seeing duplets, which, unlike triplets, are not supported in NWC. Dotting the eight notes is equivalent.

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 23-Dec-1998

Thank you, Blair, for clearing this up for me. I appreciate it.
Gordon


#999: How about answering some dumb questions?
How about answering some dumb questions?

(999)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 23-Dec-1998

Hi NWCer's,

This is not about NWC software, but music in general. Can you help me out with answers to the following questions?

1. I have a song that starts out in key of F Minor, then switches to F Major. The reason I know the starting key signature is F Minor is because I am familiar with the song! So my question is: In looking at unknown music, how would I know the song starts in F minor, as opposed to A Flat Major, which has the same key signature? My ancient brain has a vague inkling that there is something I'm forgetting... can you help to restore my memory?

2. Question: Does anyone KNOW where the term "accidental" came from? Some music friends and I were having a discussion and we were unsuccessful at coming up with the original reason for the term. Speculation welcome, but does anyone know the REAL story?

3. Lastly, I need to replace my guitar capo, I have nylon strings and always have used the little elastic-strap kind. I have seen a "clamp-on" kind of capo, they look cumbersome to me if you need to move the capo during play. Can anyone tell me if there is a good reason to buy this style of capo over the "old" style?

Thanks for any and all help you can give. And have a very Merry Christmas, and joyous holiday season!

Sue Morton

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Dec-1998

1) a) There's no way to tell _just_ by the key signature whether a piece is major or minor. You have to look at the actual notes, preferably chords. To continue your example, if your piece starts on an F, with an A-flat and a C in the harmony, it's F minor. If it starts on A-flat, with a C and an E in the harmony, it's A-flat major. Another clue is often the ending note, which will very often be the tonic (root). If your song ends on F, it's probably minor; if it's A-flat, it's probably major. If C, it's more like to be major, since it's more common to end on a "3" than on a "5".

b) you can also get a clue by looking at the other accidentals. Minor keys will often have the "leading tone" somewhere; in F minor that would be E natural. (That would be in the case of the very common "harmonic" minor. There are other minor modes that don't have this leading tone.)

2) Pass.

3) I prefer the clamp-on kind just because there's less fussing with the little strap. But there's no end-all reason to use one over the other. If it works for you, that's the one to use!

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Dec-1998

Oops... point 1a), fourth sentence, should be A-flat, C and *E-flat* (of course)

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 24-Dec-1998

Accidental comes from the Italian accidentale which means secondary.

Accidentale also means unessential, casual, or fortuitous, which is just how they come out when I play the piano!

Reply 4 offered by: Sidney Rosenberg on 04-Apr-1999

F minor or A flat? Minor keys have a sad "minor" sound to them. Play some minor keys and note (forgive the pun) the difference between them and major chords. The seventh note (leading note ) from F is E which should be E flat but is often a natural in the case of a minor key. So E natural will probably be prominent. Minor chords on the first and fourth of the scale will also be prominent (F minor and B flat minor). And the dominant chord (in the case of F minor) will be C7 which will comfortably take you back to F minor at the close of the song. If these chords do not work with the piece then try the associated major - A flat on the first of the scale. D flat will be prominent of the forth and E flat 7 will dictate your journey at song's end to A flat major. All this is right but could also be wrong depending on the complexity of the song which can often be in several keys all at the same time. The end note most often dictates the key and only you can judge if it should carry a minor or a major chord.


#1001: What kind of *Sound* to buy?
What kind of *Sound* to buy?

(1001)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 25-Dec-1998

My internal sound is SoundBlaster which I don't like at all, so I use my Yamaha PSR 500 keyboard for sound. I like the sound very much, but this model Yamaha has only MIDI, not General MIDI. In other words, it has 100 voices of Yamaha's creation rather than the 128 General MIDI voices.
The question is: I want to buy a General MIDI *EXTERNAL* sound generator. Can someone please give me advice on what's available in the market.
All help appreciated.
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Dec-1998

There are so many on the market, by best suggestion is to go to as many music stores as you can and listen to them. There are synths with keyboards, and also "modules" which don't have a keyboard, from Yamaha, Roland, Korg, and others in the "consumer" range, and from Alesis, Kurzweil etc. in the "semi-pro" and "pro" ranges. Also browse the various manufacturers' websites for further info.

Consider getting units that have also one of the two available midi extensions (Yamaha XG or Roland GS), as this can considerably extend the capabilities of General Midi.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 25-Dec-1998

Usually, the Yamaha PSR series keyboards respond to external MIDI events using General MIDI by default. I am not sure about the 500, but you might want to check the manual...


#1003: Convert MIDI into WAV?
Convert MIDI into WAV?

(1003)

Submitted by: Alex Fefer on 26-Dec-1998

Hi,

Does anyone here happen to know how to convert a MIDI file into a WAV file?

Thanks.

-Alex

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Dec-1998

You'll need to record the midi while it is playing using either the Sound Recorder that comes with Windows, or an external utility such as CoolEdit. The exact procedure depends on your system, but typically it goes something like this:

Open NWC (if recording an NWC file) or Media Player (if recording a straight .mid file), and load your file. Size the window so you can also open Sound Recorder or CoolEdit, etc. Go to the midi window (NWC or Media Player) and start the midi. Go to the recorder window and click record so you can set the recording level (using the mixer utility that came with your sound card). Stop playing once set, hit Record again (discarding the old recording) and start the midi playing.

You'll usually be given choices for sound quality; higher quality means larger files. The best quality is with 44,100 Hertz sampling rate, stereo.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Frank Lane on 08-Jan-1999

With my soundcard I received Turtle Beach Audio Station 2.
With that it is possible to play the midi and record on the wav sections simultaneously.
I have found, however, that I lose volume which is annoying when I want to record onto CD.

Frank

Reply 3 offered by: Paul on 26-Mar-1999

To record midi into audio, certainly the suggestion given earlier is the way to do it... However, get yourself a copy of Powertracs by PG Music... It costs $29 dollars, easy to use, and you can record multiple tracks which you can mix in Powertracs and export as a stereo wav file... In addition to which, Powertracs has DSP (Digital Signal Processing) with which you can enhance the sound of your recordings... Nothing is going to do a better job for $29 than Powertracs..

Reply 4 offered by: Ryan on 29-Mar-1999

I remember when I had my IBM PS/1 486 computer, the 8bit sound blaster card came with a DOS program called mid2wav.exe and wav2mid.exe and I was able to pass it a command line and it would convert the midi to a wav. I didn't have to play it and record at the same time or anything like that. The wav2mid.exe makes me wonder now though, I can't see how that can be done? I've lost the mid2wav.exe program so I can't really help anymore, but such software does exist.

Reply 5 offered by: Kenneth on 02-May-1999

I have heard that you can use a program called Yamaha Ystation to convert them into wavs. I dont know if this is true, where you can download it and I dont have it.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-May-1999

Ystation is the package Yamaha provides with its soundcards (e.g. the DB50XG that I have), which includes midi, CD and wave players, mixer, and recorder. It's dubious whether this would work with other soundcards.

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 04-May-1999

To change the topic slightly, I wonder if there is any way to convert Midi into MP3. I think this would be more useful, and certainly more portable than a WAV file.

Reply 8 offered by: Drake Donahue on 04-May-1999

Convert mid to wav then wav to mp3 is the current state of the art according to the gurus of alt.music.midi

Reply 9 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-May-1999

I recently downloaded a program called AUDIO COMPOSITOR which I believe can create a wav file from a midi offline.
Presumably this means without requiring playback.
Unfortunately the download was corrupted and I haven't got back to try again.

Reply 10 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-May-1999

Now I've got back.

The site is:-

http://www.eden.com/~mitchell

You can download an evaluation copy and register for $40US.

Barry

Reply 11 offered by: marsu on 05-May-1999

(to reply 7 & 8):
Then tell the gurus of alt.music.midi that VQF is much better than MP3 (better quality, smaller files). Go and visit http://www.vqf.net/software/soft.cgi to get an encoder and a player (or ask me via e-mail, but versions I have are 1.6 / 1.7 Mb).
For more details, check http://www.vqf.net/ or serach for 'vqf yamaha' on a search tool as http://www.savvysearch.com (my preferred one).

HTH, Marsu

Reply 12 offered by: gilberto cesaroni on 26-Oct-1999

i need to know where i can found some 'sound font' (*.sf2)
to work with audio compositor,
ta
gilberto

Reply 13 offered by: Oskilian on 09-Nov-1999

All right: I have not read all those replies back there; but I'll tell you the Way I do it(it's very effective because I have a 486/66 and it worked perfectly when I had my old 386/18) first, you have to disconnect your microphone from the PC(so that you won't record any kind of noise), after that, you need to open two different applications:
1)Windows media Player(any version that supports MIDI should do it)
2)Windows Sound Recorder(ANY version should work)

After that, You have to open your MIDI in the media player(duh)

Then, you just record in the Sound recorder and, as fast as you can, you play the MIDI.

The next step is to enjoy your sound.

Easy, Is'nt it?

PD: In case you find any errors in the grammar or spelling of my sentences, please forgive me(I live in a no-english-talking-country!!!

Have Fun...

Reply 14 offered by: whitney on 11-Nov-1999

Back in 94 or 95 on the net there once was a program called mid2wav, I had it archived for a while, I NO LONGER HAVE IT NOR DO I KNOW WHO MADE IT.

But all you did was open a mid and it exported to a wav.
You might want to look for it, but from the reply's listed
here looks like the program is no longer available.

Reply 15 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Nov-1999

Some poking around found several such programs. There's what appears to be a very nice shareware package called Audio Compositor, which will convert midi to sampled wav files (using any of several different sound font formats), or play them in real-time.

http://home.att.net/~audiocompositor/index.html

There's also a free one, available from (among other places) the Slovak Anti-Virus Centre (?!), filename timi95v3.exe... except I haven't figured out how to work it yet. (Something about a missing timidity.cfg file...) For the adventurous, the URL is:

http://esca.atomki.hu/paradise/sac/sound.html

Reply 16 offered by: nick on 04-Dec-1999

I tried the method of using Sound Recorder and Media Player, and unfortunately it resulted in a big fat nothing. No sound was recorded into wave. I've seen a couple programs like Audio Compositor, too, and those all have the same problem: only a few "sound fonts." What we really need is a plug-in for WinAmp that converts midi to mp3 directly. This would be a major download popularity blitz for NullSoft.
-Nick

Reply 17 offered by: Daryll on 06-Dec-1999

I also tried the media player/sound recorder option, but found the loss of volume and quality unacceptible. Found a solution at midifarm.com that might work. They suggest using a jumper cable to connect your output jack (speakers) to your line in, making sure the line in as selected as the recording source.

Reply 18 offered by: rick on 07-Dec-1999

Try looking at http://www.polyhedric.com/software/. They offer a program called WavMaker that is designed to convert midi files to wav files offline. I have not had the time to test it completely but I am looking for this capability.

Reply 19 offered by: Ron on 09-Dec-1999

Hey. I've been reading up on this topic as I have made some REALLY great fractal-generated midis and I want to put them on a CD to listen to them at work...only, that would have to obviously involve recording the midi sound into wav's, which I have undoubtedly been dubbed a curse to never be able to to that. The problem is simple...I cannot use anything that requires PRG files (all the shareware stuff), because I want to just record exactly what's on the midi, and not in slightly different instruments, ect. But anyways, I have tried and tried and tried for 3 days straight to get the media player/sound recorder deal to work, but to no avail. I am at my wits end...have had little sleep and just might uzi my workplace tomorrow. ;)
Ok, here's exactly what happens...With my voyetra audio station 2 midi player and sound recorder, the sound recorder records a loud annoying MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP sound whenever I record, whether or not the midi from the player is playing. Now, with the media player, it's different. No midi playing, no sound is recorded...but when the midi is playing on the media player, the sound recorder records a high-pitched ear-shattering MEEEEEEEEEEEEEP once again instead of the midi. I think this has something to do with midi channels or sound channels to and from my speakers or something to do with something along that line...but I have no clue as to what it might be. I have speakers that connect into the back of my 'puter (normal speakers). Is there something I have to change in control panels? If anyone knows how to help me and doesn't want to hear about a man's head exploding in the local newspaper, then please help!! :)
I have this page bookmarked or you can EMail me anytime at RLore18@hotmail.com. Any insight is greatly appreciated!

-Ron

PS - I have soundblaster v64 or something like that for my audio card, if that's any help.

Reply 20 offered by: Marc on 09-Dec-1999

I had a v64 and never could use it for recording. Maybe the cards have problems?

Reply 21 offered by: Ron on 10-Dec-1999

Hey, good news! I called tech help and figured the problem...I have so many different programs for sound and music that I ended up having a whole bunch of drivers replace the original driver that came with my sound card...I downloaded the driver and my sound recorder now records through the microphone fine. At least I solved that problem.

Now...recording a midi through a microphone yields very crappy music if you know what I mean. I have read other parts of this forum as well, and have learned of 2 other ways to record "the perfect wav". The first involves recording through the stereo itself, which I have no clue how to do. The second I read about is buying a two-head jack (from radio-shack or so), and hooking up the output music port directly to the input from the microphone port. I have read that it produces great wav's...if anyone can confirm that, please do so. :)

-Ron (Is doing much better now)

Reply 22 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Dec-1999

On my sound card I don't even have to bother with cables and such. I simply play the midi, and adjust the recording level in the mixer applet while recording the wav file (Master and Line sliders).

Reply 23 offered by: Rich on 11-Dec-1999

Umm, after the entire point of the question I need to do the exact opposite: Convert a wav file into either a midi file or an mp3 file. Nothing has been done to this file before so don't start suggesting reversing the process for me. I need to do this cause I used a cd ripper which only rips things to wav format and now for a screensaver creater program I need them in midi format. Annoying eh?? please help me cause this is quite urgent.

Reply 24 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Dec-1999

wav to mp3 - no problem. Get an MP3 encoder (mp3.com is one place to start). wav to midi - not practical, or even possible (imo). See the several other threads on this subject.

Reply 25 offered by: Rich on 12-Dec-1999

thanks for the advice. I'm new to mp3 and i know little on the subject. I got an encoder called SCMPX from http://www.70.nu/ch3/index_e.html
There is actually little choice on mp3 for anything to do with mp3!!! You're better using a search engine like www.aj.com There is little choice there for the kind of music I listen to: Heavy stuff and grunge but not Nirvana. Proper grung like alice in chains and soundgarden. enough of that. I would still be interested to see if anyones found a way to convert wav to midi. Perhaps a little competition eh?
You may have to covert wav to some other format before then converting that format to midi.
anyway did you know this discussion has been going on for over a year now!!!!!

Reply 26 offered by: John on 12-Dec-1999

To Rich dude, WHY?!? Wav to midi, you gotta be kiddin, midi to wav ova hea everyone,
www.users.bigpond.com/andypiper/wingroove.htm

Reply 27 offered by: Ron on 12-Dec-1999

Ok...I got two cords, mono and stereo (one ring and two ring cords)...Recording midi to wav works, but only one side of the stereo info is recorded, using both cords. This is majorly annoying since half the insturments are tagged to only one side to create a nice surround-sound effect on stereo speakers. Therefore, I only record some of the insturmentals onto the wav. If anyone knows how to fix this, or any temporary or permanent solution, please post it here or EMail me at RLore18@hotmail.com!

-Ron

Reply 28 offered by: Rich on 13-Dec-1999

I dont exactly get what you mean but I'll try and tell you an idea, It hasn't been tried so it may not work. Try first coverting your dodgy wav file to another commonly used format and see if that works in that format. It is also known but not that well that some recordings when put onto computer do not convert very well. Try it out but it may be that something is screwed on your computer!

Reply 29 offered by: Ron on 13-Dec-1999

No, I mean that when the midi is recording to the wav, only the left speaker's output is recorded. Any sound that is supposed to come out of the right speaker only is not recorded. I've tried using both a mono cable and a stereo cable to record the midi properly, but the wav recorder is still recording only one "side" of the midi. It's like when you hook up a speaker from a stereo system (one of two, say the left speaker) to your portable CD-player, only one side of the stereo output is played. For example, let's say piano is playing on the left speaker and flute is playing on both sides, and a banjo is playing on the right...the recorder will only record the piano and the flute (the flute at half-volume, since it is shared with the other speaker), and it won't record the banjo part. Any way around this?

-Ron

Reply 30 offered by: Gavrilo P. on 25-Dec-1999

To Fred: What are you complaining at? Wav2mid is no problem. Use a program which is called exactly by this name, distributed by
http://www.audioworks.com/demo/demo.htm
It works fine, at least for monophonic audio sound files. Only problem is that it is no shareware and it will expire after ten (10!) days. And no cracks to be found on the "standard cracking pages". (LOL, is there any help for this big problem???)
Another one I downloaded but which I haven't tested extensively yet is a program WIDI23IN.EXE

http://www.midi.ru/w2m/ruskoi8/down.htm
http://www.midi.ru/w2m/english/widi.htm
Regards
Gavrilo P.

Reply 31 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Dec-1999

Complaining? Who me? No complaints here, and the so-called "wave to midi" programs may even be of limited use as another tool in our musical toolkits. But there is no program at this time which will "convert" an arbitrary wave-file to an exact copy midi, any more than there's a program that will transcribe a recording of a symphony onto a piano roll.

Reply 32 offered by: Gavrilo P. on 26-Dec-1999

Fred: Please try out the links I suggested. Of course these programs don't produce "an exact copy", but they are useful in transcribing, as I said, monophonic files. The latter one from Russia (I tested it last night) even manages to handle more complex waveforms, but I am unable to state explicitly how "exact" the resulting midi-file is.
Regards
Gavrilo

Reply 33 offered by: The Electric Gypsie on 26-Dec-1999

Problem "Solvered" .... Send me the Midi file, with a list of the "preffered" instruments to be used and the output format.

make it so............

Reply 34 offered by: little davy on 07-Jan-2000

Greetings earthling.......

You must use WINGROOVE bye bye cu l8r little davy

Reply 35 offered by: bicky on 23-Jan-2000

I too am looking for the quick mid to wav conversion (so I can enjoy my creations with Geiss / WinAmp. If someone knows an elegant solution (no patch cords please) how to force the audio through to the winamp player (at least the part which 2ndary audio is processed) it would be very much appreciated.

Wav to midi can only work to transcribe DISTINCT pitches to musical leger but no more (unless voodoo magic is involved).

Another note, it would also be more helpful if people would mention exactly what soundcard they have since some solutions seem to work for some but not others (ie. SoundRecorder and MediaPlayer = Mid to wav conversion -- but not for me).

Reply 36 offered by: JAADrive on 07-Feb-2000

You can do this in a few steps:

Download 2 files:
1. ftp://ftp.cdrom.com/.1/demos/music/programs/convert/mid2xm14.zip

2. ftp://ftp.cdrom.com/.1/demos/music/programs/convert/convrt14.zip

Then use winzip or pkzip to unpack the files.
(Dont have winzip? goto www.winzip.com and downloadthe shareware version.)

use the first file to convert your midi file to XM
use the second file to convert your XM file to wav

You now have a wav file

Reply 37 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 38 offered by: Phoenix on 15-Feb-2000

To answer Ron's question, it may be as simple as checking the wav recorder's settings to see if it is in mono or stereo. Typically mono recording mode defaults to the left channel. You SHOULD be able to record in stereo as long as your recorder is set to stereo. If not, try licking the contacts on your plug. Sounds gross, but it helps to make a better connection.

I have experienced my own difficulties in recording midi files into wavs. My old SB AWE32 did it without any problems. You can do it with an SB Live! card, but you have to manually set the record option to Midi. My current card is a Guillemot Maxi Sound Fortissimo, and all I can say is the Yamaha XG waveset blows EVERYTHING away! It is THE perfect wavetable, imho. However, there is no option to use midi as a recording source. That is my only gripe about the card. I don't know if it's a hardware issue, or a driver issue. I think that is the main problem trying to record midi to wav in most cases. It's also annoying that I have been unable to find any kind of software that can capture wav output from a sound card. THAT would solve the problem... Then again, may not be possible. Maybe a software playback emulator, set as the default wav out???

The solution I used was to connect the output on one computer's sound card into the input on another. Great IF you have two comps... It worked, and sounds great, but I could only record about 30 seconds because I need a better program than Sound Recorder <cackle>.

However, the output to input method MIGHT work on the same sound card, but BE CAREFUL that you don't feed back in any way, because you won't be able to hear it if it does unless you split the output into some headphones or something. Overloading a sound card is not my idea of fun. I recommend getting a 1/8" stereo Y adapter from radio shack for $3. That way you don't have to be constantly popping cables to see how the recording turns out.

Reply 39 offered by: Phoenix on 15-Feb-2000

Well here's a big <SQUAWK!!> of happiness! I just hooked up the way I said to - with the output split into my speakers, and to the line in. With system volume up all the way, midi volume up all the way, line in as the recording source, and line recording volume up all the way, it sounded IDENTICAL to the midi playback, INCLUDING the 3DWide effect! I am now totally content with my sound hardware! 8)

If you're like me, and like the midis from DOOM, or HERETIC, you need this sound card!!! It really does put the SB Live! X-Gamer to shame as far as midi is concerned. (I relegated mine to the backup computer...) Creative's GS set has the WORST percussion... Besides, the Fortissimo has four channels support, digital out/in optical port, A3D support, EAX support, DLS Direct music, and costs $50 as opposed to $100. Can't use soundfonts, but with the midi set, who needs to?

Go to
http://www.yamaha.co.uk/xg/download/syxg50/xg50us.zip to get a trial based software synth of the XG waveset. You really need to hear it if you like midi. Be sure you have a P233 or faster though! 4.5 mb download, so be patient.

Oh, as for my recording, I experienced NO feedback whatsoever. On note: BE SURE if you have a high end sound card that supports 4 speakers to set it to 2 speaker mode, and run your splitter out of the front channel, not the rear. Leave it hooked up that way. You can switch back to 4 speaker after you're done recording. Happy waving!

Reply 40 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-Feb-2000

One man's meat is another man's poison - so the saying goes.

Fred Nachbaur and I have had this discussion over the relative merits of soundcards.
We agreed in the end that it depends on your use.
I have the SyXG50 soft synth as an alternative on my system and it cannot produce good brass and sax sounds, or at least anywhere near as good as the Chaos soundfont on my AWE32 and since my interest is big-band that's what I need.

I agree that the guitar, bass, drum and effects are superior on the XG - but these are less important to me.

Reply 41 offered by: Blair Dowden on 15-Feb-2000

Thanks for the http://www.yamaha.co.uk/xg/download/syxg50/xg50us.zip link. It plays piano WAY better on my system, which does not have a good sound card. The playback is a beat behind the highlighted notes, which I suppose is the price of software synth.

Reply 42 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Feb-2000

Blair - have you installed DirectX? This will greatly improve the latency problem in Yamaha SoftSynths. I'd recommend getting the latest version, DX7a, since it also includes DirectMusic. (And I too just love those Yami sounds. Mine are in firmware, but my wife runs SoftSynth also.)

Reply 43 offered by: Blair Dowden on 16-Feb-2000

My system has Direct X (Win 98, 333MHz, 64MB RAM), but I am not sure what version.

I wonder if there could be a staff property to set a delay so either playback time or note display could be adjusted?

Reply 44 offered by: Chrono on 03-Mar-2000

I had a mid2wav only
who got a wav2mid that can be used in command lines?

Reply 45 offered by: Techno Guy on 04-Mar-2000

None that other stuff works well at all, the programs mess up the sound of the music and the recording as it plays works a little but the best thing to do, and you can do it with any audio, is to get this program:
http://www.highcriteria.com/download/totrec22.exe
It will record the sound out of most any playback program without messing it up, because it reads the input to the soundcard ( or something like that ). Anyway check it out

Reply 46 offered by: Zenith on 04-Mar-2000

I know the easiest way to do this, download Modplug Tracker which is freeware, it has an option to load midis and then when you load it you can save it as a wav or mp3, which is a good thing to me ;D
-> www.modplug.com

Reply 47 offered by: Grant on 04-Mar-2000

Do any of these magic midi-to-wav freeware solutions handle multiple midi devices (> 16 channels)? How do they generate their wav sounds? Are they programmable (i.e., do they support the equivalent of soundfonts) or do they have a fixed repertoire of sounds?

Reply 48 offered by: Ewald on 04-Mar-2000

Well Thanks for all the good ideas. Why the hell wasnt some programming dude made millions off this. Give us an easy way!

Reply 49 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Mar-2000

Haven't had much luck with the magic freeware solutions, but there are at least two shareware programs that do work: Audio Compositor http://home.att.net/~audiocompositor/
and Awave http://www.fmjsoft.com/ . I personally think Audio Compositor is better for rendering midi to wave, since it supports several different soundfont formats (including the popular SF2). Awave on the other hand also includes wav editing facilities (but much more limited than CoolEdit. And s..l..o..w... at least the version I tried. I see there's a new version now.) Audio Compositor also allows real-time playing, using soundfonts and your wave device, but you'd better have a seriously fast computer for this to work properly.

Reply 50 offered by: crap on 05-Mar-2000

crap

you can recommend other programs for waves but none that notate music?

crap

Reply 51 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Mar-2000

For notating music I'd recommend NoteWorthy Composer and an ear-training course.

Reply 52 offered by: James Malone on 05-Mar-2000

For MIDI to WAV, try Timidity++ at
http://www.goice.co.jp/member/mo/timidity/
It is freeware and supports .pat and .sf2 soundfonts.

Reply 53 offered by: chrnosphere on 10-Mar-2000

You may use MIDI Renderer,but I don't know where to download it
Please post here

Reply 54 offered by: Michael Darkman on 17-Mar-2000

Ok,,,all this fussin is unnecessary,,,go get this program called "Total Record" here's the link http://www.highcriteria.com/...it does fine if you set it up to record thru the midi softsynth on your computer,,I tried it ,,it works perfect,no difference from the actual midi file.No noise,,no difference..then get Audio catalyst 2.01 and turn that mug into an mp3...and start livin again...I'm is...he he he !!!

Reply 55 offered by: Nemo Wilde on 25-Mar-2000

I want to convert a midi file to a wave file so that i could put it on a CD. I am not sure how...My sound card or maby my computer won't record and play simultaneously.

Reply 56 offered by: Grant on 25-Mar-2000

There are programs that will produce a .wav file from a MIDI file without involving the soundcard at all. I've tried Audio Compositor and am reasonably happy with it. See Fred Nachbaur's earlier message in this thread (about 5 messages up from yours) for more info.

Reply 57 offered by: Michael Powell on 25-Mar-2000

I'd have to add my two cents worth to the discussion by echoing those others who have recommended and are using Audio Compositor. For my money, there is nothing else on the market that will do the job with the ease that Audio Compositor does, especially if your into creating and editing soundfonts.

I did a project about a year ago of original songs for a CD where the instrumentation was all composed on NoteWorthy Composer. I used NoteWorthy to export each song as a MIDI file and then converted the tracks in each MIDI separately to individual WAVs using Audio Compositor and a soundfont of the instrumentation that I needed that I put together. Audio Compositor allowed me to create and edit the soundfont I used and the whole project really was very easy and done rather quickly. I then used Cool Edit Pro to lay down the vocal tracks and to enhance and blend all of the WAVs into a single file for each song, suitable for burining to a CD.

I'd have to say my work would have been much harder had it not been for Audio Compositor and the great capabilities of NoteWorthy Composer.

Reply 58 offered by: tony on 29-Mar-2000

came across this page searching for "mid2wav" Many thanks to Phoenix as I`ve just been wrestling with recording midi with the fortissimo.I even tried that virtual audio cable (like a wav version of Hubi`s loop) to no avail. You seem to have covered all the bases saving me a load of grief trying to do the imposible with it.Weird ,never had a card that couldn`t do it internally before .The splitter solution is a bit of a pain though when you want to use the line in for other stuff, ie tape decks or mixers.
Sure XG is a little weak on the brasses and some other stuff but its so flexible it more than makes up for it. If you don`t like a sound change it. For an easy solution grab a copy of XG Edit from yamaha.co.uk Its a save disabled demo but it does some really cool stuff (essential really) and its not even expensive if you want the unrestricted version
PS Phoenix new Fortissimo drivers out 22/02/2000 at the Guillemot site just in case you missed them

Reply 59 offered by: Olen Ronning on 13-Apr-2000

Well, I've been reading the forum, now to put my own 2 cents in. I recently did an accompaniament CD using midi with piano tracks. I converted the midi into wav by just playing the midi (using an old program called orchestrator - a voyetra thing) and creative's WaveStudio (as the wav recorder). The thing that is important to do is to go into the sound recording properties of Windows (right-click that little yellow speaker and look around there) and pick as your recording source "Midi." If that's not possible, try "What-u-hear" or "monitor" if those are available. If you happen to have a fancy sound card (like my Sound Blaster LIVE!) then it's very easily done using Creative's "Audio HQ". Anyway, I'm very much looking forward to trying this Audio Compositor, being as doing it the play/record way is VERY time consumng. If anyone has any comments/suggestions, you can email me at ronning@whidbey.net

Reply 60 offered by: LauraLee Hohner on 13-Apr-2000

This is for "crap" who wanted a notetation program. The very best program for the serious composer is Personal Composer. It has the ability to do an entire orchestra score, or just a plain one line piece of music. Ir is very easy to use. I am a composer and a teacher and I have written my own piano course using this program. The web
site is www.pcomposer.com. You can download a demo to check it out. Believe me, you won't be sorry.

Reply 61 offered by: Fred on 13-Apr-2000

Er.. actually, I did download it, and I /was/ sorry...

Reply 62 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 63 offered by: Midiman on 21-Apr-2000

I have just made a CD that plays a recording from MIDI. Yes Midi to CD. Via Wav.......thats midi to wave to mp3 to cd. Need lots of tweaking but its great. Just imagine turning all those midi files into a format that you can play on your home cd player or car cd player. Convert the midi to a good notation software and you have the sheet music to.

Reply 64 offered by: Grant on 21-Apr-2000

I don't think anyone disputes this. I've written CD's from MIDI myself.

I wonder, though, that you found it necessary to convert to mp3 before writing your CD. Most CD writing software I've heard of will write directly from wav files. I'm under the impression, too, that converting from wav to mp3 format causes some loss of sound fidelity, which doesn't seem desirable.

Reply 65 offered by: Barry Graham on 23-Apr-2000

If you need a simple WAV to MP3 converter try:-
Right Click MP3
Download at:-
http://www.execpc.com/MrShannon/rc-mp3/
Adjustable Bit Rate from Midi quality right up.

To convert a wav file all you have to do is right click it and a minute or so later you have an mp3.

Reply 66 offered by: Sidney Neeb on 23-Apr-2000

I have read many of the above replys, and actually Sound Blaster Live! now has the capability of using wave files through its midi port.

Reply 67 offered by: Captain Timeout on 25-Apr-2000

Hi All! Getting back to this thread just a little, may I add my support to AUDIO COMPOSITOR by Scott Mitchell. Version 4 has just been released and it's fantastic.

For soundfonts, go to www.personalcopy.com and download UNISON.ZIP - it's huge and it'll take hours, but you won't be disappointed!

AUDIO COMPOSITOR available from

http://home.att.net/~audiocompositor

Reply 68 offered by: Vivian on 01-May-2000

Well, all of this info is really great for you PC folks. Can anyone tell me how to do this midi to wav conversion on a Mac? Thanks.

Reply 69 offered by: *ggg* on 04-May-2000

you can download a freeware midi to wav converter at
www.goice.co.jp/members/mo

Reply 70 offered by: Steve Johnson on 05-May-2000

To Sidney Neeb(and anyone else with an idea)...I have the Sound Blaster Live! Platinum edition, a digital piano(with midi capabilities, of course), and an old Roland Sound Canvas...now, the quality of the Sound Canvas' piano is magnificent, and I've made one CD using the RCA's from the SC to the line-in on my computer...terrible quality being analog and all...Sidney earlier said you can go straight to WAV through the midi cables on SB Live...can anyone confirm and if so how? That is the only way to get digital quality through lines that I know of...I have recorded Midi in, but I can't figure out how to loop it back through the Sound Canvas all MIDI so I can keep the digital quality...can anyone help? I'm not interested in full orchestral effects or anything, I just want my piano synthesis to sound like a real grand piano...thank you...

Stephen

Reply 71 offered by: paddle on 08-May-2000

Wingroove will convert midi to wav. The output is great but you're restricted to wingroove's sound set (which are pretty good anyway)
But...I've got a cracked version of wingroove and it will only convert files that are shorter than 30 seconds...will actually registering help?

Reply 72 offered by: Isamu on 09-May-2000

I'm too cheap to pay for the registered version of any of these programs, and nothing free has worked. Does midi2wav.exe yield good waves? And if so, on what ftp search engine could I find it? I've looked on all the ftpsearches I could find and I couldn't find it.

Reply 73 offered by: Stuart Urquhart on 13-May-2000

To make timidy work, you have to download some files from

http://www.stardate.bc.ca/timidity.htm

Reply 74 offered by: Thanks for helping me on 13-May-2000

I also needed to convert midis to wavs for a project I needed to do. This page really helped me alot. I downloaded the Mod Plug Tracker at http://www.modplug.com/index.shtml
It seems to work pretty good for me.

Reply 75 offered by: Jakob on 25-May-2000

Hi

I have tried to put a jack cable from my output channel to input. When i am recording from the windows media player, and makes the quality to 127 i cant hear it. It can not record in this quality. when I tried to record in goldwave. whith 44.100 htz. it was still at very sad quality

( I have a ISIS 4 input 8 output)

Reply 76 offered by: Eric Neely on 29-May-2000

I recently got a CD Writer and I can only use WAV files to put on CD. And I have so many MIDI files. And I have to convert them to WAV, but I have no idea how to do it. Audio Compositor does not work. Nothing I've tried works. Is there anyone out there that can help me with this problem? How can I convert my MIDI files to WAV files?

Reply 77 offered by: Grant on 29-May-2000

Audio Compositor is certainly capable of converting MIDI to WAV. Here's how:

- Start Audio Compositor.

- From the File Menu, select "Open MIDI file" and open the file you're trying to convert.

- In the window representing your open MIDI file, go to the "Instrument/MIDI input" tab and specify an Instrument file. (SoundBlaster .sf2 files work here. If you don't have any available, you can find any number of free ones on the Web. A good place to start is http://thesoundsite.ismi.net/ )

- Then go to the "Audio output" tab, check "To file" and specify an output file name. For CD quality sound select a "Sample Rate" of 44100 and a "Word size" of 16 bits.
At this point you can create a WAV file simply by checking on the "start rendering" button (upper left in the MIDI file window).

Reply 78 offered by: agereion henry on 01-Jun-2000

24 fred nachbaur

Reply 79 offered by: kyle on 02-Jun-2000

i found the best program to convert midi into wav and ITS 100% FREE!!!! it is amazing..perfect quality..If you want it feel free to email me...when you install it make sure that the targer destination is different than the source directory.

Reply 80 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 04-Jun-2000

I tried converting my Prelude (available from the Scr. or my site: http://ertugrulinanc@8m.com) via Audio Compositor and used SB Live's standard instrument set but it changed my tubular bells so that I couldn't identify them. Trying different instrument files did not work. Does anybody have a solution?

Reply 81 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 04-Jun-2000

Execuse me please! My site address should be as follows:
http://ertugrulinanc.8m.com

Reply 82 offered by: LL on 07-Jun-2000

Well, I got a AWE64 Value and playing midi with MediaPlayer and recorded with CoolEdit or something doesn't work, as there are some small pauses in between and it hisses...which is not good as I program the drums for by solo-projekt...then Midi is created and now I need some prog. that can convert midi to wav.

I tried some progs but all of them are shareware...Wingroov did the job...here the problem is:
when playing the file, you can select the instruments...but when saving as wav, the defaults are used and the drums sound crappy..any ideas?

Where can I get a free converter that uses my actual midi device? (W-synth/midi on my Awe64) ?

Reply 83 offered by: LL on 07-Jun-2000

Yeah!!! Now I got a cool prog, Audiocompositor and it works :)))

Reply 84 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Jun-2000

Hint when using CoolEdit:

In Options --> Settings, System tab: reduce total buffer size from default. I set it at 1 second using 8 buffers, Wave cache 2048K, peaks cache 256. This eliminated the occasional stutter I was getting, even using a fast computer (K6-II/500).

Reply 85 offered by: LL on 08-Jun-2000

Does anyone know HOW to use SF2-files? (sound-fonts)

I can select the SF2 with which the prog converts midi to wav, therefore I'd need good drums and bass...any suggestions?

(on the Audio Compositor HP, there are links but the sound wasn't too good...and e.g. Korg55 had only 6 drum sounds and not the whole range I would need)...

Any hints?

Reply 86 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 08-Jun-2000

I have two questions about this thread.

1) Is there an extra bonus for a thread that reaches more than 100 replies ? (this one will probably do)

2) Did Alex Fefer who initiated the thread receive a warning message in his/her mailbox for each of the 85 replies (+ 1 for mine) ?

Reply 87 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Jun-2000

Answer to #2: No, becuase this thread is no longer in the active listing (but he might have received the first 20 or so).

Reply 88 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 09-Jun-2000

Reply 85,

See msg #1517

Reply 89 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 09-Jun-2000

Message !#1517

Reply 90 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Jun-2000

I think you are trying to link to msg #1517

Reply 91 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 13-Jun-2000

Exactly.

Reply 92 offered by: blue on 16-Jun-2000

how do you convert an MP3 file to an audio file for play on car stereos

Reply 93 offered by: PhoeniX on 20-Jun-2000

Sitting here reading all the replies, I notice only one person tried Goldwave. I've used Goldwave for everything including this problem. With the latest incarnation of this program, you have the option to specify recording from Midi. Essentially, it's recording from Media Player without cables. No microphones necessary either.

Just be sure to up the midi recording volume to max and Windows Midi playback to max with everything else leveled. If that's still not loud enough, you may have to double the volume, but at this record rate, that's not a problem. For myself, the quality came out just fine with settings at 96000 and stereo using a Sound Blaster Live Value.

Reply 94 offered by: skywalker on 20-Jun-2000

Well, I didn't know if this was saying before but I can say how I did it.

First you set up the sound recorder of windows or (in my case) the wave recorder of Sounblaster. (I've setted on cd cuality.) Be sure you are recoring from the sound card, not line in. (as I remenber) press record and then press play on the noteworthy.

It works for me, even I've record it on CD. =)

Reply 95 offered by: Surprised on 01-Jul-2000

God, all this for one question!

Reply 96 offered by: dan on 07-Jul-2000

I too was interested in this but a new question is how to convert mp3 to wav. to burn some cd's. :()help

Reply 97 offered by: dan on 07-Jul-2000

i think i have sound blaster 1080 ??

Reply 98 offered by: Frank Smith on 09-Jul-2000

OK, for what it is worth. I use a program called AC to convert midi to wav......then i use Shuttle to convert MP3 or wav or wma back and forth...... easy way to convert mp3 to wav is program called Decode. Now with these 3 programs i can convert mp3,mwa,wav,midi back and forth.
Then i use Sound Forge/CD arch to do any other changing, like fade in/out and such.

Reply 99 offered by: Sung-Min on 12-Jul-2000

I have SoundBlaster MP3+, but I don't have a good application to convert long MIDIs (4 minutes +, 14 channels) to WAV format. I need to put the MIDIs in a CD that I'm trying to burn. Would anybody be so kind to either tell me where to get software to do it or just send the software to me over e-mail at dkwon@uiuc.edu.

Reply 100 offered by: Josh B on 14-Jul-2000

My twin brother does some song writing in Midi file, and since he hasn't yet been able to gather enough friends together to record them, he wants to record the midi files into *.wav files. I have this to say on the subject:

he tried the speaker-out to mic-in with loss of quality.

I tried the the midi-player to sound-recorder on my computer and it worked. On all the other computers, it didn't work. I tried running the program from mine over the network, it didn't work. Since my mom's work computer has a *great* sound card with some a good midi sequencer (is that what its called?) we wanted to do it on that computer, but to nno avail. I came to this conclusion: it depends on the sound card, since I know the sound card is closely linked to what type of things you can do with midi files (one midi file will even sound different with different sound cards).

p.s. for any writers out there, i have a great website (for you readers, too):
http://members.home.net/pocketfuz/newpage

for all those who like riddles, stories, jokes, and games, i have a page for you, too:
http://members.home.net/pocketfuz

Reply 101 offered by: ME on 16-Jul-2000

DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW TO CONVERT A .ZIP FILE TO A .WAV FILE??
please e-mail me.....

Reply 102 offered by: ded jorge on 16-Jul-2000

go to http://www.winzip.com, get winzip and open the zip file with that

Reply 103 offered by: codemaster on 17-Jul-2000

Yes you can get there from here! I wanted to use a MIDI file for background sound for my Flash page but Flash wanted a WAV file.

My solution:

I launched Creative Play Center that came with my Sound Blaster Live (it plays 20 or so file types including MIDI) and loaded the MIDI file.

I then launched Creative Wave Studio It also came with the sound card. It records anything that goes through the sound card and writes a temporary file for you to edit.

I then selected "Record" on the Wave Studio and "Play" on the Play Center.

When the song was complete I selected "Stop" on the Wave Studio. I then selected SaveAs a WAV file with PCM compression (which were the defaults).

Piece of cake right? Well the original MIDI file was 25K in size. The WAV file with PCM compression was over 20 MEG! Rather large for a WEB page.

I tried other compressions and got the following smaller file sizes but they would not load into Flash:

WAV MPEG Layer3 was 837K
WAV MS ADPCM was 5.3 MEG
WAV IMA ADPCM was 5.3 MEG
WAV CCIT u-Law was 10.6 MEG
WAV CCIT A-Law was 10.6 MEG

The two last compression techniques failed:
Windows Media Audio V1 & V2

Reply 104 offered by: Ken on 17-Jul-2000

I wanted to make my own CD mix of a bunch of midis I've collected, and therefore needed to convert them to WAVs while keeping the same stereo sound, quality, and instruments that I was getting already. After trying all the methods everyone suggested, I found that, by far the easiest and most effective method was using Goldwave in combination with Windows Media player. Since Goldwave recorded directly from the MIDI port, sound quality was absolutely perfect, and the stereo was kept intact. I wouldn't waste time with all the other methods.

Reply 105 offered by: Darrell on 17-Jul-2000

A question...

why does everyone use cds? i mean to make cds from wavs and midi`s, mp3s?

I use an MD (minidisc) deck and a two portable players/recorders..the quality is superb, and correcting a mistake takes a second..not 10 mins..especially if you use once only cds... and the mds are cheap too..

and you can hook up your soundcard to a digital output anyway...so i threw my cd player away! (well i kept it for playing the odd cd)

im having the same problem as most, trying to find a good midi to wave/mp3 converter..any ideas?

I used wavemaker and i wasnt impressed with it at all..

Darrell

Reply 106 offered by: Chris L. on 21-Jul-2000

I have many MIDIs that I too wish to convert to WAVS, problem is that the processes already mentioned require this do be done one file at a time and this would take forever for me to do. Is there a program that allows u to convert many midis to wavs at once, instead of individually?

Reply 107 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Jul-2000

I believe that WinAmp can do this by setting up a playlist, and using the CDwriter plugin. Haven't tried it myself, but should work in principle...

Reply 108 offered by: dude on 23-Jul-2000

It does not work!

Reply 109 offered by: Bryan on 25-Jul-2000

Ok I wanna put a song on my webpage to play while you browse and I know you need to put in .midi format so it will be compact. My first question, I've never heard a .midi file with words. Can they have lyrics? 2nd I know how to convert MP3 to .wav but how do you go from .wav to .midi? See my problem is I have this mp3 I want to play on the page but it would take to long to download and if i make it .wav it'd take even longer. Plus mp3z won't even play on webpages I don't think. But, what about these flash players that play music, will it work then? I dunno, but preferably someone with some HTML and music file knowledge hit me back

Peace

Reply 110 offered by: Rodrigo Rocha on 25-Jul-2000

Ok, I've read many messages from this forum, but I think there isn't any real solution for mid -> wav conversion. The line out to mic (or line out to line in) connection works, but, at least here, there is a little but decisive loss of quality (mostly in the treble). I'm wondering if there's a program that converts from mid to wav using the Yamaha SYXG100 synthetizer or, at least, a way to record the MIDI without losing quality.
P.S.: Hey, my music will be presented in an auditorium, please help me =)

Reply 111 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Jul-2000

Several points:

- When using a full duplex sound card, there is no reason to configure an external connection from output to input. Full duplex cards can record what they play internally.

- It is generally a bad idea to connect any line output (line level) to the MIC input on a sound card. The MIC input is specifically designed for MIC levels.

See msg #1424, msg #1330, msg #1468, and msg #1484 for other discussions on this topic.

Reply 112 offered by: Rodrigo Rocha on 26-Jul-2000

Well, I finally "converted" my MIDI file to WAV, without loss of quality. These are the steps:
1. Double-click on the speaker (on the task bar)
2. Click on Option -> Properties, select Recording (OK)
3. Then select "Digital Mixer" (and set the volume)
(Without this 3rd step, the thing doesn't work here)
Then I record the WAV file with any program (like windows sound recorder), while playing the MIDI file. No connections, no mic, no line in.
Remarks: don't connect the mic nor the line in. Don't forget to choose the 44.100 KHz recording quality.
That's the way it worked here, I hope it can work with other people.
Thanks to everybody who posted messages here, specially NoteWorthy Online.

Reply 113 offered by: MajorCooke on 26-Jul-2000

I know how to make mp3s into wav 2. If you want to know how plz ask the people at winamp.com. It's 2 long for me 2 go through it (lazy). But if anyone knows a program that will trun my wavs into midi that is freeware....maybe i dont have to be so lazy.....

Reply 114 offered by: MajorCooke on 26-Jul-2000

check this program out. I did not try it yet but it looks good.

http://quinqsoft.tripod.com/products/cooldecode.htm

Reply 115 offered by: Help!! on 31-Jul-2000

I need a free way to convert .MP3 to .WAV!!

Thanks!!

Reply 116 offered by: MajorCooke on 01-Aug-2000

PLZ! ask the people at winamp.com. they WILL tell you. If not I will, only if someone can tell me how to get wav to minds. Thats what I will give in return.

Reply 117 offered by: Grant on 02-Aug-2000

I assume you mean wav to midi. Check out msg #1514 for some links to other discussions on this forum (and this one).

Reply 118 offered by: SoooLazy on 03-Aug-2000

Rodrigo Rocha (reply 112) has the right idea. I'm not interested in high-fidelity sound, just an easy way to convert Midi to Wav. I used his suggestion and it worked (I converted the Looneyto.mid file to a wav for my windows start-up sound) One suggestion to help the transition:

After launching the sounder recorder and media player,

activate the media player window by clicking on the 'stop' button,

hover your pointer above the 'record' button on the recorder (don't push the button yet)

press 'alt' 'p' 'p' to start the player

quickly click the mouse button to start recording

This method prevents the delay you will have when trying to click from the play button to the record button. My PC delayed for a split second after pressing play, and that really makes it hard to hit the record button quickly. GOOD LUCK!

Reply 119 offered by: Rodrigo Rocha on 06-Aug-2000

The "classic" way to convert MP3 to WAV is using Winamp. Start Winamp, press Ctrl+P (Preferences), then choose Plug-ins -> Output. Click on Nullsoft Disk Writer plug-in then click in Configure to choose the folder where the WAV file will be created. The name of the WAV file will be the same of the name of the MP3 file. Then just play the song you want to convert and Winamp will convert it to WAV. It works with other file formats supported by Winamp, like IT, XM, MOD, etc.
After converting, don't forget to choose the Nullsoft waveOut plug-in (or the Nullsoft DirectSound plug-in) again in the Preferences window, so your Winamp will play the songs in place of converting them.
Sure, there are programs that do this conversion in an easier way, but for those who don't have this kind of program, this should work.

Reply 120 offered by: Fonzie A. Lafonze on 06-Aug-2000

I really have figured out how to convert midis to wavs!!! THIS IS NO JOKE!!! IF YOU WANT IT REALLY BAD, THEN GO TO THIS WEBSITE:

ftp://sac-ftp.gratex.sk/sac/sound/ac33.zip

Reply 121 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Aug-2000

Actually, that's an ftp address for an obsolete version of Audio Compositor, not a website. Here's the actual website, where you can get the current version:

http://home.att.net/~audiocompositor/

Reply 122 offered by: Andy Coates on 07-Aug-2000

http://www.winsite.com/info/pc/win95/sounds/wavmid.zip/

This is the location of the file wav2mid.exe

seeya.

Reply 123 offered by: Grant on 07-Aug-2000

Hmm. In addition to a horrific memory leak, this program seems to have trouble dealing with relatively simple WAV files. All I get from it is a mismash of seemingly random pitches.

Reply 124 offered by: Sean on 11-Aug-2000

Try downloading Modplug Tracker from Modplug.com. You can open up your midi file and then click file and save as wave. It's great and it works properly!!

Reply 125 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 126 offered by: seph on 13-Aug-2000

go to windows media player and open the midi. then go to save as. save in all files type and enter the name with .mp3 or wav to convert it you dont even need a converter program

Reply 127 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Aug-2000

<quote>
go to windows media player and open the midi. then go to save as. save in all files type and enter the name with .mp3 or wav to convert it you dont even need a converter program
</quote>

Lest anyone falsely gets their hopes up -- all this accomplishes is saving a midi file with the wrong extension (mp3, wav etc.) It does /not/ convert the file. Media Player will re-open and play the renamed file, but only because it recognises it as a midi file with a wrong extension.

Reply 128 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 129 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 130 offered by: abie on 22-Aug-2000

midi to wav is ussual, but anyone know how to convert
WAV to MIDI?

Reply 131 offered by: Criss on 26-Aug-2000

Or Even MP3 to midi for background sounds on a webpage?

Reply 132 offered by: Binh on 27-Aug-2000

all you music lover.
Check out the cdc-mp3 car player from Aiwa ($260-300 US).
Now you can have all your favourite music in mp3 format and play them in your car. No need to convert them to wav anymore.

--binh--

Reply 133 offered by: May on 01-Sep-2000

well i read some of this stuff but not all of it.... my question has nothing to do with the midi to wav file but instead i was wondering how to convert a mp3 to a wav....anyone can tell me?

Reply 134 offered by: Grant on 01-Sep-2000

>>i was wondering how to convert a mp3 to a wav....anyone can tell me?

Check out reply 119 above.

Reply 135 offered by: Rob Koerts on 05-Sep-2000

To answer your question Grant, you can use Winamp for a conversion from mp3 to WAV.

Simply start up winamp, press ctrl+P (preferences), then you'll see a list of options.
select OUTPUT, select the "diskwriter plugin", choose a directory to save your files and you're done, every mp3 you will select will be converted to WAV.

Don't forget to switch off the repeat button or your harddisk will be full in a very short time. :)

If you want to play mp3's again, then select the "waveout" plugin on the top and everything will be back to normal.

Have fun :)

And about the other topic, if you try to record midi to wav with your basic windows players (midi player and sound recorder) then your soundcard will have to support it, it won't work with every soundcard.

I'm still searching for an easy way to do it for the 2nd one of 2 soundcards, my SBlive is no problem, mut the vortex II I have has a complete different wavetable and a bigger SF support too, but every attempt to convert midi to wav with that card was a failure.

If someone could help me with that, that would be great.

Reply 136 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 137 offered by: aphid on 06-Sep-2000

okay...
i read it all...
here's the DL
If you want to convert a midi to wav... i say, like many others here, go with Audio Compositor.
It's simple, it's fast... and there are MANY advantages...

1.It fully supports soundfonts (SF2), and unlike many other programs that claim to use SF2, it is as easy as clicking on the soundfont you want to use... (provided you know where you have stored them... hey, don't laugh... i lost a few...)

2.It converts the MIDI files as they are, with no gaps at the beginning, which is useful for sychronizing an external device (i.e. a drum machine) if you happen to have any multitrack recording software... for this, I like N-Track studio...
this is also very easy to do... all you do is set the MIDI sync clock in the -VIEW- menu, and in the -PREFERENCES- menu, set it to sync with THE ORIGINAL MIDI FILE... not the converted wave file... You will also have to plug the audio of the device into the computer (duh). Then configure the device for midi sync instead of internal sync. Hit record on N-Track Studio, and go...

There are simpler ways to do all of this, but I have not found another way to do it with Sound Fonts... and that is a major point with me, and anyone who hates the boring sound of General Midi instruments, or anyone who can't afford an expensive and complicated sampler.

For converting MIDI to MP3, this can be done with N-Track as well, you'll need to make a wav file (this can also be done with N-Track if you don't want Sound Fonts), then choose to mix down the file and it will ask you if you want to make an MP3...

Also Sound Forge by Sonic Foundries can make an MP3 from a wav file...

I hope some of this will help someone.

Reply 138 offered by: Kristy on 11-Sep-2000

For converting MIDI to WAV or mp3, I have found the easiest way to do so. All you have to do is download the modplug tracker. It does it all for you. Just go to www.modplug.com and download it right from the website. I found that when I tried downloading it from the locations list, choose the one from modplug themselves, it starts right away.
Once you download it, just go to the files and choose the MIDI file you want to convert by opening it and choose either to convert it to wav or mp3. It does it all for you, with both options. IT'S GREAT!!!!!!!

Reply 139 offered by: jesus de santiago on 16-Sep-2000

thanks for midi into a wav

Reply 140 offered by: Harvey Swick on 23-Sep-2000

Responding to the below:
Thanks for whoever figured this out in the first place this program rocks!! You don't even have to install it and the MP3s sound great! Plus, a 3 minute MIDI converted to MP3 was still only about 1.3 MB!!

<i>Reply 138 offered by: Kristy on 11-Sep-2000

For converting MIDI to WAV or mp3, I have found the easiest way to do so. All you have to do is download the modplug tracker. It does it all for you. Just go to www.modplug.com and download it right from the website. I found that when I tried downloading it from the locations list, choose the one from modplug themselves, it starts right away.
Once you download it, just go to the files and choose the MIDI file you want to convert by opening it and choose either to convert it to wav or mp3. It does it all for you, with both options. IT'S GREAT!!!!!!!</i>

Reply 141 offered by: Sheri on 26-Sep-2000

If you want to burn a song on a cd for your use what type of file does it need to be. Do you need to convert MP3 in WAV or is is the other way around. Basically which type of flie should be burned on a CD for your listening pleasure.

Reply 142 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Sep-2000

wav. 44.1 kHz. Stereo. 16-bit.

Reply 143 offered by: Sheri on 26-Sep-2000

So, do mp3's play on cd's in a regular cd player or does it have to be wav files in order to download songs and put then on a cd. Basically I'm asking, say you go to napster what do you have to do in order to burn songs on your cd so you can listen to it besides from you computer. Please help!!

Reply 144 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Sep-2000

If you save the mp3 directly to a CD-R or CD-RW as an mp3 file, you'll be able to play them... but only from your computer. Just like any other computer data; save a .doc file, you can open it with Word, save a midi file you can open it with mplayer, etc. If you want to play them on a home or car (i.e. audio) CD player, you have to convert them to wav, then use the /audio/ function of your burner to create the audio CD.

Some burners may by now support direct audio recording from mp3, but all the ones I've seen and used require the raw data in the form of a wav file.

Reply 145 offered by: Troatunit on 05-Oct-2000

Go here to get an easy to use program to turn midi to wav

http://www.polyhedric.com/software/mn/download.html

Reply 146 offered by: Philip on 08-Oct-2000

has any one go the software to convert midi's to wave's
Thanks

Reply 147 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Oct-2000

See msg #1003 (reply 1)

... and the circle is complete. :)

Reply 148 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 09-Oct-2000

Good observation, Fred! In general, I notice that some topics keep reappearing from time to time, presumably because new users (or those evaluating the software) need to know it, and would be reluctant to hunt though archival information to find it. I am not referring to very specific items (such as, which keyboard commands do such-and-such) but generalities.

I suggest that at the entrance page to the forum, Noteworthy should put a number of big-print buttons with answers to common questions. Or, the reader could be directed to where the answer is to be found. Some of the questions might refer to questions arising outside the scope of NWC itself, such as how to create a PDF file, or how to convert MIDI to WAV, or how to place a NWC file into MS Word.

This would be to the advantage of NWC. When I evaluate software, I rarely take the time to learn in detail how it is used. I need quick answers regarding whether or not it will do some specific things, and often that involves interacting with other applications.

Reply 149 offered by: Panda Lai on 09-Oct-2000

to Kristy (Reply 138)
I've d/l mudplog tracker but I can't seem to find a way to use it to play my midi file! I went to 'File' and opened my midi, but it doesn't work!

Reply 150 offered by: K Williams on 16-Oct-2000

I just open midi file in win media player and click save as and change the name to "name.wav" Can someone tell me if this is wrong for some reason. It seems to work for me, with a lot less effort from some of the responces I've read here.

Reply 151 offered by: Grant on 16-Oct-2000

When you do this all you've done is change the file extension. You haven't changed the nature or contents of the file itself. Media player is perfectly happy to open and play the renamed file because it recognizes that its contents are in MIDI format regardless of the file name. Other applications that want files containing WAV data will not be so accommodating. For example, try feeding your renamed "name.wav" file to a program that burns music CD's. I doubt you'll get very far.

What you need is a program that will convert MIDI instructions into a WAV data stream. This involves a lot more than just changing the filename, and that's what this thread has been about.

Reply 152 offered by: Curt Vatthauer on 17-Oct-2000

I downloaded the current version of Audio Compositor, and it does not work correctly with the soundcard/soundfont that I am using. I am using a SB Live! value with it's generic 8mb .sf2 soundfont. The problem, according to AC's own help file, is this: AC will not use some of the sound channels that the midi file is asking for from the soundfont. Where there should be violins, I hear nothing. The help file also goes on to say that it has no way of accessing ROM sound samples that are stored directly on the soundcard, itself. It does warn you if any ROM samples are present in the soundfont you try to select, however. This is not the problem I am faced with in using that 8mb soundfont. By the sheer number of posts on this message string saying how great AC is working for them, my case must be unique. I did get what I needed from this whole msg string, though. Somewhere in the middle of it all, someone mentioned using the AudioHQ software that came with the soundcard installation. I'll just go ahead and give that a shot. =)

Reply 153 offered by: Max on 18-Oct-2000

I want that you guys know, that the Windows Audio Format (.wma) files are much better and much smaller than MP3 and even VQF.
You can download the Windows Media Converter at http://www.microsoft.com

Reply 154 offered by: Jessica on 19-Oct-2000

Could someone please tell me how to convert mp3's into waves so that I can burn music onto a cd; is there a particular type of software needed to do this besides Adaptec?

Reply 155 offered by: Joe Music on 19-Oct-2000

If you have Windows 98 or later (NOT 95) it seems that Version 7 of the Windows Media player (free download from Microsoft) will do something like that. I say "it seems like" because I haven't tried it. Version 7 has features that automatically connect you to the Internet (which is why it needs 98 or later) and may not be the best solution.

Reply 156 offered by: Miikka on 21-Oct-2000

u can convert mp3's to wav with winamp
select output to: disk writer
or with nero burning rom u can burn directly mp3's
to audio cd without converting
www.winamp.com
www.ahead.de

Reply 157 offered by: Hansen on 21-Oct-2000

I just found a program called "WAVmaker". It says it renderes MIDI-files to WAV-files - in CD-quality.
I downloaded it here

http://www.polyhedric.com/software/wavmaker/index.html

good luck!

Reply 158 offered by: Webelecs on 21-Oct-2000

modplug tracker does work for neerly all conversions you need; mp3,wav,mid etc.

Reply 159 offered by: Steve Oldham on 22-Oct-2000

Midi to Wav - Modplug Tracker - its free, it worked, sorted. Thanks to Zenith (Reply 46 above) for the lead. This is the only board that I found dealing with what I mistakenly assumed would be a pretty standard conversion. Modplug was a fast download at about 640k - and as a relative novice at these things I had no trouble working out what to do - wish I knew what the rest of it did 8-)

http://www.modplug.com

Steve

Reply 160 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 161 offered by: Barry Graham on 29-Oct-2000

Download "Right-Click MP3" at this address:-
http://execpc.com/MrShannon
(and you'll never need to come back here again)!

Reply 162 offered by: low pro on 29-Oct-2000

Im glad every one is helping each other out.i read all of th questions and answers and now i have different ways of trying to get this to work.I dont think any one wants to plug jacks to there computer going out and back in.all though i wish WINAP had a WORKING midi to wave plug in.

Reply 163 offered by: HermsTruly on 03-Nov-2000

Hi everyone. I just want to say thank you to each and every person who has posted a reply on the nasty little midi to wav issue! :) THANK YOU ALL!!! I was doing it the old way with the Media Player and Sound Recorder, as some suggested, but with my longer compositions, this got VERY tedious. I'm now in the process of downloading several of the things suggested here, and I will let you know how it goes!

Herm

Reply 164 offered by: Fido X on 10-Nov-2000

Hi to all !

I have already recorded a lot of my own tracks with method;
when the midi file was playing I was start to record with sound editor (like Sound Forge or you can try whatever you want, sound recorder or similar), that i was doing a long time, then one guy said to me ,that i should try to record with other method.So i have tried and I see a lot of differences.It's more clean sound and really cd-quality.
But this kind of method which I know is more for Cubase users.
First go to Control Panel, then Multimedia Settings.
Click Midi options and set your own settings for each channel.I have 2 midi outports(example - channel 1 - Roland out, channel 2, soundblaster out, channel 3 - roland out and so on....).When you have all 16 channel selected for midi outputs, you can save settings.
Then go to Cubase and you must specify for all channels , also right outputs, like you did in Multimedia settings, then go to File directory and "Audio export", you'll get Mixdown channel and with this channel you can record in realtime directly to wav file, results are extremly good :)

I hope that you'll understand, sorry for mine , not so good English :))

bye, any questions e-mail me: matej.peternel@g-kabel.si

Reply 165 offered by: RockHound on 13-Nov-2000

Anyone know of a way to convert wma's to mp3's. I have a cd copied using Windows Media Player 7 in wma format but i can't get it to burn to a cd. Anyone suggestions?

Reply 166 offered by: Tripp Storm on 14-Nov-2000

Just a little helpful hint for those of you who inquire about WAV to MP3, and vice versa: download MusicMatch. It's free at musicmatch.com, and it can switch between WAV, MP3, and WMA. It is fast, effective, and if you love Napster as much as I do, it takes all of those MP3's, and gets them ready for your CD burner.

Hope this was useful.

Reply 167 offered by: Spamiam on 16-Nov-2000

Wingroove! Awesome. Registration $20.00. Free demo which is limited to 30 seconds of wav output. Extremely easy to use...load up the midi, click "file", click "create wavefile", give it a name and you're done.

http://www.cc.rim.or.jp/~hiroki/english/index.html?

Interesting. The question mark is a part of the url. Hope that works for you. If not, do a search-engine search for wingroove.

Reply 168 offered by: Scott on 26-Nov-2000

SIMPLE...

Click on the little "speaker" icon in the taskbar.
Go to "options", "properties" and click the "Recording" radio button. Click "OK" and play the MIDI file and record with the vanilla Windows Sound Recorder (making certain to maximize the sound quality). I have done it...it works great.

Reply 169 offered by: Artur on 27-Nov-2000

Great inexpensive easy tip!! I just have one question: when I try to record something, it only records up to almost 6 seconds. What should I do to have it record the whole song?

Reply 170 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Nov-2000

How long it records depends on your available RAM. This is why for most work it is necessary to use a recorder program that writes directly to disk.

Reply 171 offered by: Teresa on 02-Dec-2000

How do you go from mp3 to midi? I am trying to get notation for a song that I have from an mp3 file over the email. I have downloaded midtab, midnotate, and digital-something. None seem to have an easy way to get my file to be midi-fied into sheet music.

thanks,
Teresa

Reply 172 offered by: Grant on 04-Dec-2000

You'll find that opinions differ, but apparently it's not really possible to find a program that will do this except perhaps for the very simplest files (e.g., those with a single-line melody and no harmony or other distractions). For a discussion of this you might visit msg #1514 on this forum. (It also comes up several times earlier on this very page.)

On the other hand, here's a perfect chance to practice your ear training. Get NWC and use it to transcribe what you hear in your mp3 file.

Reply 173 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 174 offered by: costa on 05-Dec-2000

does anyone know of a mac prgm that converts midi to wave!!?

Reply 175 offered by: Jimmy on 07-Dec-2000

Hi everyone,
just making this message to continue this almost 2 year
conversation...
c ya

Reply 176 offered by: Sidney Neeb on 09-Dec-2000

To Steve Johnson in reply to reply #70...The SBLive card uses creative audioHQ. Open audioHQ and open the mixer. Select the recording source as "midi". Open the keyboard program, then open any sound recording program. Start recording, go back to the keyboard, and play.

Reply 177 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 178 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 16-Dec-2000

I think, as NWC grows up, midi -as a file format- becomes useless.

Thougts?

Reply 179 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 16-Dec-2000

I'm not sure what Ertrugal means by MIDI "as a file format." Compared to .... what? I make use of MIDI output so that I can play my NWC compositions through software that over-rides the crappy sound card on my laptop (I can't change it or install sound fonts). Also, I use MIDI to import files in foreign format into NWC. Since I work with simple music (hymns, etc.) I usually have no problem with the composition.

Of course, a universal music publishing format (something like the way PDF works for word processing) might be nice, but this is not within the realm of a single supplier. Those of you who work with PDF also know that even with the complete Acrobat and/or Ghostscript products, PDF files are in general not editable.

Reply 180 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Dec-2000

NIFF!

Reply 181 offered by: Lorrie Adams on 18-Dec-2000

I, too, have been looking for an easy way to convert a few MIDI's to WAV to burn to disk. I took the advice of several replies and tried the ModPlug Tracker. The sound was great but in one of the songs a bell that you hear in the MIDI was missing. Has anyone tried or had any luck with Polyhedrics MIDInight Express G22Sound Library or the Mellosoftron, also from Polyhedric?

Reply 182 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 19-Dec-2000

[addt. to reply#178]

Firstly, I beg pardons for being unclear. What I've tried to express is the outstanding developments in NWC especially from 1.55's to 1.70 and now those plug-ins.

As a file format and document, a nwc file is much more advantageous than a mid. First of all, it's smaller. (NWC is about %50 of its consequent MID) Second, it includes the music and the score together and now, after the WinAmp plug-in especially, it's as transportable as midi.

I'm completely in agreement with Robert regarding midi as a port, a sound device. Of course we need midi output to play nwc and nwc probably wouldn't exist without midi indeed. But what I mention is; nwc files are becoming much more useful in employing midi capabilities than midi files themselves.

Today, many platforms such as CSound get midi input. I think, midi will soon be just a "bridge" to pass nwc to those platforms -at least for me. Because I noticed that I have if not completely left, reasonably decreased using post-processing programs as NWC has achieved the recent developments.

Although there are still serious gaps to be filled I thank NW staff for the great effort and good quality work.

Reply 183 offered by: Rebz on 23-Dec-2000

To convert midi into wav - use audio compositor 4.1 -- it converts the file within seconds.

Does anybody know where I can download the beneath file from..

8RealGs20.SF2m (instrument file used with this siftware to carry out the conversion)

Pls e-mail me and if u help me locate this file - I will give u the serial details for Audio compositor!

Thanks

Rebz

Reply 184 offered by: Karsten Schuetze on 23-Dec-2000

Hello Everybody!

As far as I saw you all already presented some usefull ways to convert MIDI to Wave.
I have got one more question:
Winamp is able to covert MP3 to Wave with the Diwk Writer. i think it would be the best and easiest if there was a plugin to convert MIDI to Wave. Is there such a one?
And one more question:
I read most of these replies and now I am a litttle confused, can anyone tell whch is the best tool/way to conert MIDI to Wave???
Thanke a lot!
Merry Christmas!!!!!
Karsten

Reply 185 offered by: Ken Hines on 26-Dec-2000

Thanks for all the help on converting MIDI files to WAV or MP3. I tried several applications and techniques mentioned in the thread but didn't find anything that didn't cost a bundle or work very well. Finally, I came up with a fix that will probably work for most everyone else. Bring the MIDI file up in Windows Media Player and make sure the volume settings aren't too lound. After doing this, unhook the speaker cable going into the speakers and plug it into the mic jack on the computer. Hit the play button on Windows Media at the same time you start recording from the Windows sound recorder application. Works great!!!! Don't forget to save the file.
Good luck.
Ken

Reply 186 offered by: ffxshadow on 26-Dec-2000

Now when you convert these midis to wavs using these programs, does it use the driver you currently are using on your computer? For example if you have the yamaha syxg softsynth drivers and player loaded on your computer, do these programs turn it into wav with the sound quality of the yamaha driver? because the yamaha driver is really realy really really good, and converting midi to wav is really pointless if it doesn't convert with the yamaha driver in my opinion. The yamaha driver really really improves the sound quality of midi. I tried modplug and it doesn't convert the midi to wav with the yamaha driver. the yamaha program/driver cannot convert midi to wav. it just plays midis really high quality.

Reply 187 offered by: lidewoad on 28-Dec-2000

i just noticed that this topic is 2 years old!! YAY!! and peeps are still asking the same questions that they were all the way back in '98! Psh! I just wanna know a site where I can download midis, particularily tubular bells 4 me mum........ Anyways, cya all!

LiD£w0@D

Reply 188 offered by: ffxshadow on 29-Dec-2000

ok...jus use the yamaha sxg player...and have total recorder...and set it to record from the wav out mix...and u will get it to work...it works...very well...no mess up...jus remember to save the file in the right format...

Reply 189 offered by: Huw on 29-Dec-2000

Hi!

Do do this on a Macintosh all you need is;
SoundApp(any version will do), Quicktime 3 or over and Quick time movie player.
If you have Mac OS 8 or above you already have quick time.

1) open movie player and goto file menu to export your midi to AIFF (AIFFs are bulky and need alot of disk space)

2) quit movie player and open soundapp, select convert from file menu and convert it into a sun audio(.au).

3) select convert again this time converting it to wave

This method of conversion takes a long time to do if your runing a 68K. the end result is always 3 to 10Mg depenting on how long the sound is. there is another way of doing this i haven't found it yet

Rowlah3@excite.com


#1004: Downloading music files
Downloading music files

(1004)

Submitted by: Rosalie Valvo on 26-Dec-1998

Well, here I am among all these grand musicians and technophiles. I know little about music, but my question is more in my own realm, the technology.

I have a copy of Noteworthy Composer 1.31d on my computer. I have ordered the program (even though I know so little about music) and so have registered what is on my machine.

Yesterday I got on line and explored the web site. I found the music modules and downloaded several of them. When I got offline, I went to some of the files in the folder where I'd downloaded them and double-clicked them. The program was loaded, but then an error message saying that the music file that I'd double-clicked either didn't exist or was corrupted. That happened in each case. (I couldn't figure out how to un-zip the compressed files, but that's another question.) I looked at the files in Notepad, and they looked just like files to me, starting out with [NWZ] on the first line.

Surely this is not because of an older version of the program. What have I done wrong??

I bought the program because I love to play with music even though I know so little about it. I learned in school how to read it more or less, but there is a lot of terminology I do not understand; and the help files assume the user does understand. Perhaps I will be back with terminology and concept questions.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Dec-1998

Well... I think you'll find that most of us are "hobby musicians" like yourself, and just as baffled by technology...

Anyway, I suspect that your problems are indeed from having an older version of the program. A lot of new features have been included since the version you have, which the poor "older" program just can't make heads or tails of.

While you're waiting for your new version to come in the mail, you can download the new version from NoteWorthy's website. Just follow the links to download the version for your machine (16-bit for Windows 3.x, 32-bit for Win95 or Win98). Uninstall the old one, install the new one. NoteWorthy will send you your registration code by e-mail, so you don't have to wait for the post to be listening to other users' music files.

Regarding zip files - the "friendliest" zip utility is probably WinZip, you can get a shareware evaluation version from http://winzip.com.

Hope this helps.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Dec-1998

The WinZip address should be, of course,

http://www.winzip.com

(forgot the www part...)

Reply 3 offered by: Rosalie Valvo on 26-Dec-1998

Thanks -- I'll try your suggestions.

Reply 4 offered by: Arthur Morgan on 29-Dec-1998

I wouldn't even go so far as uninstalling the prior version. In my experience (going back to 1.2) you can just run the setup for the new version, and it'll autoinstall right over the top of whatever you have on your machine. If the existing copy was already registered, the new version will pick up on that and not ask for your registration again.

And NTWorthy did go to a new schema somewhere around 1.3, so your version won't be able to read files generated with a newer version. You definitely need to upgrade.

If you uninstall and do a fresh install with the new version, then you'll probably have to have your registration codes handy. (And if you're anything like me, after 2 years who knows where that code disappeared to... :-)

Reply 5 offered by: Rosalie Valvo on 29-Dec-1998

I downloaded from the web site, uninstalled my old version (a piece of cake, no reason not to), and installed the new version. The system still had my registration info -- probably in the Windows 98 registry -- somewhere where uninstall didn't affect it. When I received the floppy in the mail yesterday, I repeated the procedure, although the documentation (which I read later) said I could install over the top of 1.5x; and although I probably was installing the same version.

Having read the information more closely (it sometimes takes several tries), I realize that it was already stated that I couldn't run new modules with the old program.

Reply 6 offered by: Jason on 10-Jan-1999

has any one got a reg. key that they can give me

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Jan-1999

Boy, some people have a lot of gall. If you use it, pay for it. The price is more than reasonable for what you get.

Reply 8 offered by: Robert C. Nichols on 15-Jan-1999

Registration Key

Comment: Can someone give me a key?

After spending over 1,000.00 for a PC someone says can I have a key so I don't have to pay for it. How cheap can you get. PAY FOR THE PROGRAM.


#1006: Help Me!  Br3 - File Problem
Help Me!  Br3 - File Problem

(1006)

Submitted by: Cyberbob on 27-Dec-1998

Hello Noteworthy Forum.
I am using a Yamaha X-75 R and i want
to know if it is possible to import br3 files into
Noteworthy.

I would be very happy if you would help me.

Sorry for my bad english.

Thank you very much

Noteworthy is the best programm i've ever seen.
I love Erics programms. More of that. Thank you
for this supermegaprogramm. I love Noteworthy.

Please help me Super Eric!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Dec-1998

I assume that br3 is a file format used specifically by your keyboard? You might try this:

Enable "midi through" (this might be on the keyboard as "local"). Connect "midi out" on the keyboard to the "midi in" of the interface cable to your soundcard. Configure your midi mapper (if necessary) to accept data from the "midi in" port. Use NWC to import the performance in real-time, using its real-time recording option.

I used a similar technique to import a drum track from an ancient Korg drum machine. (It's digital data was stored on cassette tape, it's _that_ old!) The only trouble I had was getting exact synchronisation, since NWC presently does not support external midi sync. But I was able to get it close enough that, with careful selection of note/rest resolution, I got a workable file with not too much changing by hand.

Hope this helps.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Dec-1998

I am not familiar with a Yamaha X-75. In general, you need to work with standard MIDI files (*.mid) in order to get them into NWC from other programs.


#1007: How do I access voices above 128?
How do I access voices above 128?

(1007)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 28-Dec-1998

I just downloaded Yamaha's S-YXG50, and love it so far.
The help files indicate that it has 676 Normal Voices and 21 Drum Voices. It then says that if a voice number above 128 is wanted, one must use a bank number and a program number in combination. What does this mean? I've looked around NWC and don't see where this is possible. I'm also familiar with MIDI and have never seen voices above 128.
All help appreciated,
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Dec-1998

In Staff --> Properties --> Midi --> Patch/Bank Change you'll see a clickbox for "change bank". This allows you to switch to a different bank, using controllers 0 or 32 or both (depending on the requirements of the synth).

You should know, though, that not all synths will respond in the same way as yours. I, too, have a Yamaha XG (except mine's in firmware on my soundcard) and haven't even heard those 500-odd additional sounds... simply because all of my work so far has been with transportability in mind.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 13-Jan-1999

Like Fred, I pretty much stick with the standard set of voices to assure some compatibility. However, the question perked my interest. I personally need a "cookbook", so I'll try to lay out a step by step.

1. Although I have a Yamaha card as well as well as the Ensoniq PCI (my normal card), the downloadable SYXG50 driver can be used in connection with my ensoniq if selected as the driver.

2. To get a list of the SYXG50 banks and instruments, go to Start, the Yamaha Softsynth category and go to the help file. Go to "Functions", selecting voices, and (for instance) click on "XG Normal Voice List". I suggest that the topic be printed out.

3. In reviewing the voices, you will find that many are "subsets" of the existing voices. Thus, it is somewhat easier just to keep the "General Midi" Patch List in the Noteworthy "Staff Properties" list.

4. On the Staff Properties, Midi screen, make sure the Yamaha SXG driver is selected. (If it is not an option, you may need to reinstall or make sure it is available in the Multimedia properties component of the Windows System category.)

5. Now the fun part. On the initial NWC staff properties, midi screen, click "change" on the playback instrument. Select the instrument (or program number you want) as you would normally do. If you want to cross check the "program number", you can temporarily change the patch list type to numerical. With most sound cards, you will find that the steel guitar is Program Number 26.

6. If you want some variations, look at the voice list you printed out. In Bank Select on the NWC staff properties sheet, click on the "Select a different patch bank". Typically, the controller O should be kept to "zero" for beginning practice, looking over the list. (If you look at the Yamaha XG voice list, that is equivalent to selecting the GM,general midi bank without a lot of special effects). Controller 32 selects the particular Bank number noted in the early pages of the Yamaha help, voice selection lists.

7. As an example, on the NWC staff properties, midi screens, if I have selected the SYG50 driver, steel guitar (program 26), with controller0=0, and controller32(ie the "bank #)=35, I will get a 12 string guitar sound.

8. Your particular question is why you cannot get voices above 128. Actually, in the Yamaha SYG50 setup, the extra voices tend to be "subsets" of existing voices in a lot of settings.

9. The only "trick" at this point is: is there an easy way to sample all of the voices without going through all of the "multiple clicks" in the Noteworthy program. I don't know at this point, but perhaps someone else out there has an answer.

Hope that helps. Sorry about the length of the response. However, it might save someother midi-challenged person several hours of hit and miss testing.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 14-Jan-1999

Quick addendum to last message.

It is very easy to quickly "sample" all of the 600 some odd voices with Midisoft Studio 6.0. Simply go to the Device Wizard, choose the Yamaha SYG50, choose device properties, and then choose the XG extended series for the sounds and percussion. The entirety of the sounds (with names and grouped by either banks or types) will then be available under the Instrument Inspector. Under midisoft, one can change the instrument as a piece is playing to hear the different sounds.

I suspect other sequencing programs may have similar capabilities.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Jan-1999

My XG soundcard (from Mediatrix) came with a program on CD called "XGEdit" which does much the same thing using a bank of "radio buttons". You can also use it to fine-tune your XG effects settings, and so on. It even has a built-in virtual keyboard, and looks and operates much like a mix-down studio. It's supposed to work with the softsynth also (which I have but can't use because of hardware limitations).

It's written by G. Gregson, and appears to be available as a shareware program also. Might be worth a look into, either by searching the web or perhaps contacting http://www.mediatrix.com

Fred

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Pearson on 18-Mar-1999

Gordon: a belated further note.

The file NTWpatch.ini in your Noteworthy folder contains the information for patch lists. Lo and behold, I discovered that I could copy and patch the Yamaha XG Extended voice set from another program's ini file into the NTWpatch.ini file, and after some fiddling with format to make it consistent with Noteworthy's format, made it work so that the Yamaha 50XG instruments could be selected by name rather than all the controller gobblygook.

If you are interested, I could send you more information. Quick word of warning: save a copy of the orginal NTWpatch.ini file under some other name in case all blows up! Steve

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Pearson on 19-Mar-1999

Seems I spoke too quickly. The "import" of the information into the ntwpatch.ini (with some editing) displayed the additional sounds with the additional controller information (i.e. "12 string guitar" would be followed by the necessary controller32 number 35). However, the additional controller would still need to be noted on the instrument patch screen under the staff properties, program change screen. Sorry about that. Have sent a wish list item to NWC to make matters easier.

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 8 offered by: Calk Walk User on 08-Oct-2000

I find that Cake Walk Pro has far better midi cabilities then NWC. I know this because I've used NWC for a great deal of time, but I personally found the extra tracks on SYXG-70 better used in Cake Walk Pro. I suggest for improvement of quality that you give Cake Walk Pro a try :)

Reply 9 offered by: ah choo on 08-Oct-2000

I personally found Cakewalk to be absolute rubbish.
Every time I ran Cakewalk, cakewalk sent a whole bunch of resets to my synth which totally stuffed up all my settings. After a few goes of this I got the hint to turn it off while trying Cakewalk, but this didn't work all the time as I usually rehearse what I want to play while running the software. So I spend the next ten minutes resetting my synth and by that time forget what I want to play. So that was the first area of crap. The next areas of crap were useless interface, all-hype/no use features, slow to record/play, notation was shocking, everything was a joke. Be warned! If you want to be a synth programmer instead of a musician try it out!
Noteworthy doesn't pretend to be a complete sequence/notation package, but it does record and you can sequence quickly if you can read music and copy and paste sections. (so it does what you want without the hype)

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Oct-2000

I've used Cakewalk also, but prefer Cubasis Audio (the simplest in the Cubase line) simply because it's the first sequencer I used, and I prefer its more austere "European" look and feel to the more glitzy GUI in Cakewalk. I still use Cubasis occasionally for tweaking midi files, etc.

Ahchoo is right; you can't directly compare NWC (or Encore or Finale or Sibelius for that matter) with Cakewalk/ Cubase or other sequencers. I won't say "NWC is better than Cakewalk (or Cubase)" -- better for what? I /will/ say that for 95%+ of my work with music, NWC is the appropriate tool to use. For 95%+ of my midi tweaking I use a text editor (together with midi-text converters). For the other 5% or less I use Cubasis.


#1008: Korg N364 General MIDI bank selection
Korg N364 General MIDI bank selection

(1008)

Submitted by: Alex Reyes on 29-Dec-1998

I browsed the Forum as well as the offline, archived messages of the Forum, and didn't find the answers I was looking for.

I have a Korg N364. I have managed to figure out that to select Banks A, B, C and D, I use controller 32 and set them to 0, 1, 2 and 3, respectively, and then set the instrument using Numeric, 0-based selection. That's fine.

But I do not know how to access the General MIDI bank from Noteworthy Composer.

Can anyone help me with this specific problem?

(I prefer a response by e-mail: alex_reyes@usa.net)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 01-Jan-1999

Won't Bank A be the General Midi bank?

A

Reply 2 offered by: Alex Reyes on 05-Jan-1999

No, Bank A is Bank A; it is a bank unto itself, with 100 particular instruments/sounds.

The Korg N364 has banks A through D, and additionally a GM bank (separate and distinct from banks A to D).

Thanks for the reply, though.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Jan-1999

My daughter has an older Korg, X5DR I think it's called. We couldn't find a way to put it into GM mode from any outside software, so she has to put it into that mode manually from the little front-panel buttons before using GM sounds.

Reply 4 offered by: Alex Reyes on 06-Jan-1999

Yes, that seems to be the only way I know how to do it now. But it would be nice if I could avoid having to manually set up the track programs; after all, that's the point of MIDI.

Thanks for the reply.

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 offered by: patrick st-hilaire on 02-Feb-2000

I'm not shure but I think that you have to change your program filter in global mode (page 3C) from "PROG:ENA" to "PROG:NUM."

Reply 7 offered by: Bluey on 13-May-2000

Have you tried setting 4 as GM? or use the PC synth...


#1009: Differing Time Signatures
Differing Time Signatures

(1009)

Submitted by: ChrisW on 30-Dec-1998

Maybe I'm just missing something silly but....

I've got a stave running on 6/8 and a counter melody running on 2/4. How do I get them to match? ANy suggestions?

Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 30-Dec-1998

NWC uses absolute times for note alignment, so the time signature is ignored for all but whole measure/bar rests. For this reason, you cannot get a 2/4 line and a 6/8 line to match up.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 31-Dec-1998

I tried to make notes match, and found 3 imperfect solutions:

1. either you decide to rewrite the 6/8 measures into 2/4, using triplets almost anywhere (even with unequal values such as in a "sicilienne"); this can lead to a hard-to-read score, but no other change is to be made;
2. either what you could do is to write your 2/4 with dotted notes to make them as long as needed. This works for 2 4th, or 2 8ths, but I couldn't found a solution for the pair "dotted 8th+16th".
3. or you write your 6/8 measures as normal, but add the "triplet" character to every compound time (3 8ths, 4th+8th, ...). The limit is that a dotted 4ths must rewritten as 4th+8th, and same for dotted 2ths... Moreover, small italic "3"s appear anywhere. You could make them disappear by changing the "Staff italic" font (either change the font size to 0 (2 will display in the size box later), or change the font to a font that displays nothing for the "3" char). You'll then have to remove (in .wmf format or whatever) the small [____ ____] that appear...

Oh, a 4th option comes to mind : make a wish (go to http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm ) to ask this.

Btw, I found that a triplet is unevenly printed (the 2nd note comes too soon) when the same beat is used by more than one note in another staff; should this be considered as a bug? (ask me to email an example if you want)

hope this helps, and happy nwc year to y'all

Marsu

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Jan-1999

Thanks for the "kill the 3's in the triplet" hint, Marsu! This will come in very handy for a classical score I'm working on where _everything_ is triplets. Usual practise is to only show the '3's for the first couple bars, then put a "simile" thereafter to keep the score less busy looking. For those first couple bars, the 3's could be printed as text in another font, with enough leading spaces so you don't kill the beams.

Fred


#1010: Note Duration From PSR 225 to NWC
Note Duration From PSR 225 to NWC

(1010)

Submitted by: Susan Hansen on 30-Dec-1998

I've seen this mentioned briefly before, but I am a MIDI ignoramus. I have my Yamaha psr225 connected to my Noteworthy and can get the notes to write on the staff, but I still can't figure out how to have the keyboard send duration information--I don't want to manually have to change each note. I love using NWC to enter a song and with a few clicks have it transpose for my trumpet and I can add some descants. I just wish I could easily play a melody on the keyboard and it would "magically" appear on the staff the right way.

If anyone cares to try to explain a possibility to me, I'm listening (my keyboard doesn't have any sliders or wheels modulators).
Someone had suggested making a repeating metronome bar and playing along with that - but I can't figure that out either.

Appreciate any advice.

Thanks!!
Susan Hansen

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 31-Dec-1998

Susan, take a look at the online help (record command topic). The fastest way to get it is, in NWC, press the following keys separately : Alt, T, F1

I quote a part of it:
(...) Recording is only possible when a score is open and is playing. If the current song is only three bars in length, then starting a recording will only allow up to three bars to be recorded. This is because recording and play back will both stop when the current song play back is finished.
          this explains why you need to already have "a repeating metronome bar and playing along" : create an empty staff, put only rests in it, and add a repeat bar at the end to make it loop "forever" (250 times with a "local repeat close" bar).
          Instead of rests, you can also put a "metronome": set the midi port of this staff to 10 to make it play "drums", and insert quarters (with C note for ex.). Each note is a different percussion in that mode. Then you will hear it when you play with your midi keyboard.

Let's go on with NWC help:
This command can be quickly activated using the F4 key, or the record icon on the file tool bar.
(...)
When the play back of the song is finished, or play is stopped, the recorded performance is saved into a dedicated record buffer. The performance may optionally be imported into a new staff or new song window. This is controlled by options that you set in the Record Tab of the Options dialog. Regardless of the setting for the recording import, the saved performance can be manually imported into a new staff at any time by using the Import Recording command on the Staff menu.
          briefly: when you're redy to play, press F4 on your PC keyboard, wait a measure or two to get the beat, and start to play. When you're done, press Escape (or F5) and the music you played is ready-to-use. Depending on the record options (menu Tools/Options, "record" tab, "import options" part), you will have a new staff or a new window. use the Staff/ImportRecording... menu and you can start to modify your record.
          /!\ the "precision" of the record depends on the "import" options you choose. If you're not precise enough when playing, rather choose 8ths value than 32ths... But only you can make the better choice. that's what I call freedom :)

The help quoted above is Copyright ® 1998 by NoteWorthy ArtWare, Inc.

          Hope this helps,

MAD


#1011: New Year
New Year

(1011)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 31-Dec-1998

A happy final year of the millenium to all Noteworthy friends - May the music be with you !

Richard

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Jan-1999

Happy New Year to you too, Richard, and to everyone else.

Had an interesting thought (totally off-topic) that with all the interest in the numeric significance of the year 2000, if you look at it numerologically, 2000 is a "2" year, which is no big deal. The year 1999, however, is a "1" year, which to numerologists signifies new beginnings, letting the past be the past, and looking to the future.

Nice thought, even if (like me) you don't put much stock in numerology per se.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Chris on 02-Jan-1999

Happy new year to every nwc user.
There is a common error that is often made:
Every decade, century and millenium begins with 1!
1-10 is the first decade,...(it would not be a decade {10 years} otherwise!)
1-100 is the first century, ...(it would not be a century {100 years} otherwise!)
1-1000 is the first millenium,...(it would not be a millenium {1000 years} otherwise)
So the first year of the next millenium is the year 2001,
what means:
2000 belongs to the old millenium: This is the final year
of the millenium.
(The often mentioned 00-millenium problem is not a millenium - changing problem but a "carry over" problem of a definition of year numbers of some programmers.)

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 03-Jan-1999

Thx Chris for that explanation I had no time to make earlier :-)
All this just because after the "-1" year, was the year number 1... There is no year number zero, and that's the reason why.
Anyway, what is funny is that Jesus-Christ (our reference in counting years), should have his birth in 6 before JC, according to the most recent research... :-)

Anyway, happy new year to you all,
Bonne année et bonnsanté à tous !

NWCly yours,
MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Chris on 04-Jan-1999

That's true, Marsu,
it mainly depends on our christian roots (gregorian calend.)
Think of the moslems: The islamic calender is totally different from our (anno - domine) one, because their mounths are defined to be shorter (abt. 29 days, according to the earth moons phase), and the time of year "zero" is different from the christian version.
In other words: Our millenium - changing means nothing to their calender and to all possible other existing calenders in the world.

Happy New Year to all readers.

Chris

Reply 5 offered by: Chris on 04-Jan-1999

I forgot:
The correct spelling is:
millennium (not millenium, lat.: mille + annus)
and calendar (not calender)

Bye,
Chris

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson[nospam]@clr.com on 04-Jan-1999

The chronology of the life of Jesus is, so far as I can
tell, still open to question. Jack Finegan's "Handbook of
Biblical Chronology", published last year, argued for a
2/1 B.C. birthdate. The main sticking point with this is
the death of Herod the Great, which is usually fixed in
4 B.C. by a complex catenation of astronomical and other
synchronisms. (Finegan argues that Herod actually died in
1 B.C., which is a new and so-far very-much-a-minority
viewpoint.)

(The crucifixion is just as obscure. Only the years 27, 29,
30, and 33 can possibly fit the astronomic data.
(Astronomers disagree about some of those years.)

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 06-Jan-1999

Yes indeed, only the Christian calendar is involved with the Western 'New Year'. Nevertheless, I won't be seen near an airport (or in an aeroplane) approaching and for some time after midnight on December 31st. 1999. And I'm going to lay in a stock of canned food, bottled water and camping gas!

Compliments of the Season to all - Peter.

Reply 8 offered by: bah on 25-May-2001

how do i get the moon phase

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-May-2001

Sorry, this feature is not currently supported. ;-)

Reply 10 offered by: Joe Music on 27-May-2001

Moon phase? See the thread regarding "Moonlight Sonata."


#1012: NWC from Linux ????
NWC from Linux ????

(1012)

Submitted by: Aurelio on 04-Jan-1999

Does anyone have experience on running NWC from Linux,
using some window emulator? I tried WINE, but did not
work...

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Jan-1999

I would love to see an NWC port directly to Linux, so we can kick Microsoft out of the picture entirely.

Any chance of that in the future?

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Jan-1999

Are you an optimist?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Jan-1999

Yes!! I have Linux on my machine, and am gradually learning it (and what's more... learning to really like it). There's a great big vacuum where it comes to music software, though. The best that exists is that abysmal MusicTeX. If you came up with an OSS or GPL Linux version of NoteWorthy Composer, you would have the de facto cross-platform standard for music composition/scoring software. Think of it! You could be to music software what Linus Torvaald (sp?) is to Linux ;-)

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 05-Jan-1999

Eric,

You need more programmers! Why not go the Linux/NetScape way, and release the source? 8-O (I know, scary thought, isn't it? How about releasing it to some "trusted and enthusiastic NWC users who can also program"? ;-)
That way, we get all those enhancements we clamour for, you'd get cross-platform coverage, and the world would get NWC. we'd all be in nirvana, wouldn't we?

Facetiously,
Andrew

Reply 5 offered by: David Carson on 10-Jan-1999

I suggested a Linux port to Eric a while back (when I first came on board with NoteWorthy). At that time, I didn't know what kind of support for Linux was out there in the NWC community. But, hey, now that I know I'm not alone...

Andrew, your suggestion, even if it was tongue-in-cheek, was a great one. The down side, of course, is that if Eric gave the source to the Open Source community, he would lose the shareware revenue he gets now, I think. (Do folks in the Open Source community get 'contributions' that might equal what NWC is generating in shareware revenue?)

The up side of Andrew's suggestion is that this piece of software, in the hands of a whole crew of programmers, would get even better than it is now--and that's pretty good.

Let's go one step better and get a crew to work on a GPL or OpenSource music scanning program, Linux, Windows, or otherwise.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Jan-1999

I don't think OSS/GPL and making a living are mutually exclusive. There will be many people (myself included) who would be happy to buy the compiled binaries in a nice, easy-to-use, point-and-click install package.

The true DIYers, of course, never buy anything anyway. They just download the shareware version and hack into the protection "just to prove it can be done." Take away the game of cracking the code, and even they (some of them anyway) will grudgingly fork out the pittance that Eric's asking for this lovely program.

A good example of this is RedHat, who seem to be doing just fine even though they give away their version of the Linux operating system.

The biggest problem with OSS and multiple contributors appears to be forking of the product. That's where strong leadership and a central "clearinghouse" is vital. NoteWorthy Artware has the infrastructure and the highly respected "director of development" who would have the last word on any new developments. Plus of course he retains the right to sell it. GPL does _not_ mean that you can't sell it; it only says that _if_ you give it away, you have to let the recipient pass it on.

Fred

Reply 7 offered by: Nigel Horne on 11-Feb-1999

When you say it didn't work under Wine, what was the problem? Maybe it's font related.

Yes to Linux support from me.

-Nigel

Reply 8 offered by: Nigel Horne on 17-Mar-1999

I have just installed the latest version of Wine - 990314. And it's great. If only I could work out how to access noteworthy's true type fonts from Linux I have this feeling I'd be up and running with NWC 1.55 on Linux.

Reply 9 offered by: Albert ARIBAUD on 28-Apr-1999

>I have just installed the latest version of Wine - 990314.
>And it's great. If only I could work out how to
>access noteworthy's true type fonts from Linux
>I have this feeling I'd be up and running with
>NWC 1.55 on Linux.

I have tried NWC 1.55a with wine-990328 and so far it will not work, nor will it with the latest wine-990426. Problem is, no TrueType support in Wine.

Precisely, XFree86 can display True Type fonts (via a TT font server), but Wine does not query glyph dimensions -- or maybe it simply can't. Anyway, it does not implement Windows' GetcharABCWidths call.

I have inquired on the Wine HQ to see if someone is working on TT support in Wine, and have got no reply so far but, hey, it was only 3 hours ago. :)

Could be interesting to add TT support to Wine for "our" NWC to work in it!

All the best,
Albert.

Reply 10 offered by: Jesse Alter on 08-May-1999

You got the support of me behind ya..
When I got Linux going again, if a tech support guy here could send me a list of all the DLLs and other libraries that NoteWorthy uses, (and the fonts), I'll see what I can do....Wine IS sort of finicky.

And also, if you guys went open-source, this site would get a LOT more hits, and as soon as xlib is ported, the unofficial OS/2 version would appear shortly.

Reply 11 offered by: Dave on 10-Jan-2000

i vote for open source too :) or if not open source, at least a linux version! ;)

Reply 12 offered by: Kirrily Robert on 02-Sep-2000

Hear hear. I'd love to see an open source version, or at
least some degree of availability for Linux. I'd be happy
to help out with the process of taking NWC open source,
even if I probably don't have the coding skills for it.

Reply 13 offered by: Dave Seidel on 11-Sep-2000

Here's another idead for a form of Linux (really, cross-platform) support.

Linux now has an excellent system under development called Lilypond (see http://www.lilypond.org) that provides a very powerful text-based language for typesetting music, using TeX on the backend to generate Postscript, DVI, etc. Lilypond is already very advanced, with notational capabilities beyond what NWC currently offers, and it can be arbitrarily extended by the user.

However, it does not come with a graphical editor. There is at least one third-party tool (called Denemo) under development, but it's pretty primitive thus far.

That fact is, NWC is a very well designed and implemented editor, and it's likely to be a long time (if ever) before someone comes up with anything of comparable quality.

So, why not have the best of both worlds? Why go through all the pain of porting NWC to Linux (and it *would* be a royal pain)? How about a conversion utility that could convert a .nwc file into an .ly (Lilypond) source file, and vice-versa? I dual-boot between Windows and Linux already, as many people do (I do it *specifically* to use NWC, since I don't need Windows for anthing else). This allows us to continue using (and supporting) a great editor, but also allows us to go beyond its limitations and gain the advantage of some other very powerful tools.

If Eric thinks this is a good idea, he doesn't have to open up any of his source code at all -- just the .nwc file format specification.

Opinions?

-- Dave

Reply 14 offered by: Evan Cortens on 26-Jan-2001

I realize this reply is very late, but I only just recently came across this forum. I agree that lilypond is an excellent program for Linux, and I think that opening the .nwc format would be a great idea, as I could really use a converter.

Reply 15 offered by: Fred on 26-Jan-2001

see also:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Wine

Reply 16 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 30-Jul-2001

I am all for porting NWC to Linux. :) But I have one other problem... I haven't gotten midi to work under Linux yet. I have an Ensoniq AudioPCI... it uses wavesets for MIDI. How do I tell Linux where to find them? If anyone can help, email me, please.

I personally don't care if NWC goes open-source; it's so wonderful already. But a Linux port... *drool*


#1013: Poor quality instrument patches...
Poor quality instrument patches...

(1013)

Submitted by: Al Rojas on 04-Jan-1999

Hello,
I had been a very happy user of the shareware noteworthy composer for sometime now. The other week my computer crashed and i lost everything, including the noteworthy composer. When i got my copmter working again, one of the first things i did was get another shareware version. But unfortunatly to my dismay, i found that the sound of the different Midi patches were horrible!! With my first N.C.
I had very nice and authentic sounding patches, but these new ones sound just awful!! Does anyone know of how to get the good sounding patches?

Thanks
Al Rojas

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Jan-1999

Well, that would have nothing to do with NoteWorthy Composer. The program simply sends out the midi commands to your sound card... at that point it's up to the sound card (or external synth) to play the sound.

Did you replace the sound card? Perhaps your sound card (like mine) has different modes... e.g. OPL-3 FM (for SB16 compatibility) vs. MPU-401. If you're in OPL-3 mode, that would explain some pretty awful noises coming out of your computer ;-)

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Sarah on 15-Jan-2000

Does anyone have recommendations as far as settings for instrument patches? Also, can other patches be downloaded or added to Noteworthy?


#1014: Bug?  No Opening Bar Line for Single Staff Song
Bug?  No Opening Bar Line for Single Staff Song

(1014)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 05-Jan-1999

When I print a single staff song in 1.55a, the bar line at
the left side of each staff line does not appear. This does not happen for multiple staff songs. It is not a margin problem - I gave it plenty of margin, and the boxed measure numbers extend to the left of the beginning of each staff line.

Is this a new bug?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-Jan-1999

The following is an excerpt from the NWC newsgroup:

>Just a thought. Technically, on a single stave you don't
>cap the left hand side, this is usually only done with
>scores, *however*, I agree that it is an option that would
>be nice to have control over for those of us who find
>it more visually appealing to have left margin capping.
>Adam

This is why it was changed in NWC. We had a substantial number of requests to support the open ended single staff, as prescribed by standards. We changed NWC to comply with these requests. However, we agree that it could, and perhaps should, be optional, and will consider this.

Reply 2 offered by: Keith Markham on 06-Jan-1999

The left hand end of the stave is managed very well if the "Staff properties - visual" is ticked as "Orchestral" I always do this for a single line of stave.


#1015: lyrics in repeats
lyrics in repeats

(1015)

Submitted by: Mike on 05-Jan-1999

What would be the best way to add 2 lyric lines to a repeat in the middle of a song? Tried adding a second lyric line to the staff, but then I have to hyphen all notes before the repeat. Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-Jan-1999

Use an underscore ( _ )separated by spaces for each syllable that you wish to skip in a lyric line.

See also:
- Page 17 of the latest NWC User's Guide
- msg #42, msg #47, msg #223, msg #319, msg #526, msg #577, msg #623


#1016: voyetra and harmony software
voyetra and harmony software

(1016)

Submitted by: Joao Pinto on 06-Jan-1999

When using note worthy composer is so good the is superior to harmony in the simple way to handled with keybord
only the limited resorces comparing with harmony that makes some diference that could be improved.
That was a problem writing music in voyetra because isnt easy but with NWC it realy advaced the work of writing music
thnks to the makers of NWC and another thing i make a download of NWP that doesn play.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Jan-1999

I agree. NoteWorthy Composer by far outperforms software I've seen costing ten times as much.

Regarding your NoteWorthy Player problem, did you install it into a different directory ("folder") than the one you have Composer in? Another user reported a similar problem when he tried to put both into the same directory.

If this is not the problem, are you getting an error message? What happens when you try to play a file?

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Joao Pinto on 08-Jan-1999

I need to cheek out it, another thing somebody said that working with capella scan, can scan a paper of music like OCR does to any text document. Im in the way for tryng it i will give some feed back on it.
Joao Pinto


#1017: Synchronization problem
Synchronization problem

(1017)

Submitted by: Pierre Hugo on 06-Jan-1999

I am a new happy lucky owner of 400 Mh computer and I encounter some synchronizing problems beetween the score display on the screen and the sound part.
The screen display is in advance from 1 beat to a measure versus the sound player.
Is there any solution to this problem.

PS : Let me know if my English is unreadable !!!

P. Hugo France

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Jan-1999

If you're using a software synthesizer ("wavetable" synth) this is normal behavior, since it takes the soft-synth awhile to process the midi data before playing it.

This shouldn't occur with a hardware synth (or soundcard with daughterboard), etc.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 07-Jan-1999

See also: msg #957

Reply 3 offered by: Pierre Hugo on 07-Jan-1999

Yes,yes, you are right, my new computer uses a sofware synthesizer. So, I imagine that I have to live with this (or to buy a real card...)
BTW, any opinions about sofware synth vs hardware synth ?

Pierre.

Reply 4 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 08-Jan-1999

If your wonderful 400Mhz computer is equipped with a sound card, ever a standard 16bit one, it should provide an hardware synthetiser.
You may choose the MIDI port from the Tools/Options/Midi menu. You will find there a list of available play devices that you may test individually. You will see, at least, a sound card internal synthetiser + a soundblaster compatible opl3 (horrible quality) + something called "MPU 401 compatible" which correspond to the MIDI output plug that you may connect to an external synth (keyboard or standalone synth).

Bruno


#1018: Chord Alignment
Chord Alignment

(1018)

Submitted by: Peter Edwards on 07-Jan-1999

It was wonderful when you corrected the notehead positioning in chords (ie the treatment of seconds) but at the time you indicated that aligning chords on staves was still problematical. At present they line up on the left hand notes, rather than the head notes of the chords.

There does now seem to be a work-round in the experimental features where you can put extra space before a note, but this is a bit tiresome for a heavily chorded piece, especially if you then change a chord.

Have you any plans to automate this feature (please)?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 07-Jan-1999

I am not clear on what you mean.

NWC automatically aligns the members of a chord, handling the case of intervals of a 2nd.

When using staff layering, intervals of a 2nd must be handled manually, by selecting a note in one of the layered staves and pressing Ctrl+E to move its position.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 08-Jan-1999

Sorry if I'm not being clear. I've posted an example on the Newsgroup.


#1019: Export to .mid in XG mode
Export to .mid in XG mode

(1019)

Submitted by: Ludwig Grissom on 08-Jan-1999

I have synth software S-YXG50 as tune generator. When I play back inside NWC program the banks I selected go on fine. But when I exporting to .mid format (mode 0 or 1) and run in S-YXG50 player not hearing the voice selected. Can I to solve this problem?.
Please helpme. Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 14-Jan-1999

Not sure if I fully understand the question. However, if your normal midi player (Microsoft MPlayer, or whatever) is not playing, you may want to check the settings under Control Panel, Multimedia, Midi and verify that the correct driver or resource is chosen.

Hope that helps. If I am not understanding the question, feel free to set me straight.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 14-Jan-1999

One other quick thought. On the SYG50 player, look for the "set" button immediately to the right of the "soft synthesizer" label and click on it. If an output port has not been selected, that may be the problem.

Let me know if it does not, and maybe we can trouble shoot the multimedia setup.

Reply 3 offered by: Ludovico on 21-Jan-1999

Thanks, Steve. Your second reply is OK.

Excuse my very poor English please. Bye.

Ludwig


#1020: Special endings in layered staves
Special endings in layered staves

(1020)

Submitted by: Alan Rolfe on 08-Jan-1999

I have recently been using the 'layered staves' feature, which is a real blessing. But one problem I have found is that if special endings are used (1, 2, etc.) they are doubled up on the print-out. Has anybody else come across this? Is there a work-around? The endings have to be on each staff, otherwise the playback goes wrong. Sorry if this has been covered before, but I couldn't find it on the message threads.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 08-Jan-1999

Yes, I've come across this.
What you have to do is check the vertical size on both of the layered staffs.

You will find that one layered staff has a different upper size to the other. If you make them both the same, then all will be OK.

This happens because NoteWorthy automatically assigns 12 as the upper size to the first stave and then 10 from then on.

HTH

Richard


#1021: Media Playlist entries?
Media Playlist entries?

(1021)

Submitted by: Thomas F. Penrose on 08-Jan-1999

How do you enter NWC files into the Media Playlist with Windows 98? (My sound card is an Aureal PCI 338-A3D.)

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Jan-1999

Use the File --> Export option to create a Type 1 midi file, then load into playlist like any other midi.


#1022: Changing the default copyright notices?
Changing the default copyright notices?

(1022)

Submitted by: Dave Washburn on 08-Jan-1999

When I start a blank score, it by default enters my name in the Copyright notice 1 line, and "All rights reserved" in the Copyright notice 2 line. I'd like to change this so that the first line doesn't have a name at all, and so that the second line lists my CCLI number. How can I change this default info in the <blank score> template? (I suppose I could just use the "basic" template, but that would be too easy...besides, curiosity compels me now.)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Jan-1999

Your question includes the answer. Start a new score using <blank score>, make the changes that you desire, then save it into a new template. Now, use this new template instead of the predefined <blank score> when starting new work.


#1023: Connecting To Keyboard.
Connecting To Keyboard.

(1023)

Submitted by: Geoff Berry on 10-Jan-1999

I wish to connect a Roland ep.7 11 keyboard to my PC to run with Noteworthy Composer.
I have purchased a Midi cable from our local shop, but so far the PC does not appear to notice the keyboard.
I have read through the hints on this newsgroup but still no success.

Can anyone help please.

Thank you
Geoff Berry
South Australia

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Jan-1999

Hi, Geoff,

Welcome. The most common problem is connecting the cables improperly. The OUT cable should go to the MIDI IN of the keyboard, and the IN cable to the MIDI OUT. The other end, of course, has to be connected to the sound card's midi/joystick port.

Another thing to check is that your MPU-401 driver is enabled in Control Panel --> Multimedia. (Assuming you're running Win9x).

Finally, some keyboards seem to be balky if "Local" is on. No logical reason for this, but I've had problems with my daughter's Roland D-50 if local was on.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Jan-1999

See also: msg #558


#1024: Measures with Chords of mixed duration
Measures with Chords of mixed duration

(1024)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 11-Jan-1999

Hi All!

I was going along nicely, entering a delightful S.A. version of Bach's "We Hasten to Thee" into NWC, when I ran into snag. No big deal, as I am only keying in the score so I can use the playback to practice with.

I improvised, but it seems that there should be a way to enter this one measure without using layering (I'd hate to have to use a layered staff just for one measure!).

I have entered many mixed duration chords before without trouble, but could not enter the last beat of this measure so that it is counted correctly by NWC. Here it is:

(Treble clef)(4/4 time)

Beats 1 and 2 are just plain quarter-note chords

Beat three: (Stem-up) Quarter-note high 'E' flat (e.g. two E's above middle-C). (Stem-down) Dotted-quarter-note 'A', dotted-quarter-note 'F#'.

Beat four: (Stem-up) Quarter-note high 'D'.
Beat four 1/2: (stem-down) Eighth-note 'A', eighth-note 'F#'.

So in other words, beat three consists of a quarter note combined with a 2-note-chord of dotted quarters. Beat four has the "other" quarter note that goes with beat three's quarter note. Beat four 1/2 chord finishes the measure as far as the dotted-quarter-note chord is concerned.

You have to enter this in to NWC in order to see it, I think. I can post an example on the newsgroup if need be.

Does anyone know how to get beats four, and four 1/2, into the measure on one staff and counted correctly? NWC lets me enter it all in, of course, but then the measure count is off.

As I said, no big deal, I'm only using the playback for practice, but I thought there ought to be a way to do this without having to use the layering feature.

Any thoughts? Thanks.

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Jan-1999

This is best answered in msg #680 (reply 10).

See also: msg #61, msg #206

Reply 2 offered by: Sue on 11-Jan-1999

Hmm, I guess I was not clear, as I do not see anything resembling my intended question in Msg 680 or 206. Msg 61 does mention that NWC will take only *one* of the note duration paths and attempt to resolve the measure. I guess that would cause me to infer that NWC would be unhappy with the "other" note duration path?

Just for clarity, I am going to go over to the Newsgroup in a moment and post a song fragment there. Perhaps that would be clearer than my attempt to describle the problem.

Thanks again for any and all help.

Sue

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Jan-1999

I've replied to this on the newsgroup, but thought it important enough to repeat here.

When looking at a chord consisting of different durations, NWC takes the shortest duration as the time value for that chord. Makes sense, since that way the longer values can continue to sound after the "alotted" time has elapsed.

Solution in your case: follow the chorded quarter and dotted quarters with a eighth rest, with the quarter "chorded" on top of it. Now the time adds up right.

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Jan-1999

Sue, the answer to your question is absolutely covered by msg #680 (reply 10), which is also summarized by Fred in the above followup.

Reply 5 offered by: Sue on 12-Jan-1999

Hi All,

I found out why MSG 680 wasn't of any use to me -- my browser takes me to Reply #7 (marsu) instead of NWC support's reply #10. Not sure why that is. I counted down to reply 10 manually and found it that way.

Many thanks to all, here and on the newsgroup. Fred, your GIF file solution (on the newsgroup) is interesting. Yes, I see that it would play back correctly, which was all I was after in this instance, but if that was a printed score wouldn't it actually confuse the accompanist? I'd hate to notate this as such and then forget about it, and print it out for someone!

Lastly, after 12 pages of score I was reluctant to introduce layering just for this one measure. NWC Support: Is there a way to quickly create a blank staff full of rests and measure bars, and other flow direction, etc. symbols as contained in another staff? I know, copy/paste, but perhaps this is one for the wish list -- a "copy staff" function that quickly copies an entire staff except notes, and instead puts rests in the measures. Would that be of any use to anyone?

Thanks again for all the help. What a great forum this is!

Sue

Reply 6 offered by: Richard woodroffe on 12-Jan-1999

Hi Sue,

Glad you're sorted out now.

I understand your wish BUT I think you'll find that for layering generally you do not want to convert the notes to rests. For the majority of the measures, you need the two layered staffs to be exactly the same so that you can layer one over the other without being able to spot the difference and only in one or two measures does there need to be a change.

Richard

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Jan-1999

Sue,

Pianists are used to seeing parts split into separate voices, so probably wouldn't have any trouble with the "extra" rest. That being said, it's true that the times on the two voices don't add up correctly, so for authenticity the tied approach suggested by Grant on the newsgroup would perhaps be preferred, though it's not as visually appealing.

Fred

Reply 8 offered by: Sue on 13-Jan-1999

Thanks Richard for the clarification on layering... I guess I was in "wonderland" when I wrote that! I was of course thinking that rests would overlay the other staff correctly (which of course they won't, as you've pointed out), and therefore only the needed notes should be notated.

Thanks Fred, yes I think Grant's idea would be "more correct" even though visually not as nice.

This layering discussion brings up a different question to me, though: If you *do* have two identical staves, save for a measure or two, should you assign them both to the same midi channel? Is there a way (besides inserting a variety of midi commands into the score) to keep the two from sounding twice as loud while they are in unison, but still sound correctly when the "time comes" for the needed measures to be blended? How does an exported MIDI file look when you do this sort of layering, where the staves are identical save a few measures?

This is all "just wondering" on my part, I really have no specific need for any of this, but I'm curious. Anyone's thoughts?

Sue

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Jan-1999

Your best bet is as follows:

Create a second, layered staff that mirrors the first in all but the one or two measures. Mute this staff, and assign it an unused MIDI channel (16 could be a plausible choice). Make this staff visible in Page Setup.

Create a third staff that uses whole rests until the key measure in question. Assign it the same MIDI channel as the original staff, but hide in in Page Setup.

This is not the easiest solution, but it may work for you.

Reply 10 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 13-Jan-1999

Unfortunately, from experience, the NoteWorthy solution outlined above, is the only solution that works well.

There are occasions where you have doubled up the instrument on a layered staff and because that instrument is not very loud in comparison to other General MIDI instruments, you leave it sounding and don't bother to go through this routine.

The only problem with this is that when you come to play the piece on another PC with a different sound card, the volume is then all wrong.

I've found that my greatest problem with PC music (I nearly said NoteWorthy but it's not a NoteWorthy problem) is the different standards of volume for any specified General MIDI
instrument (as others will testify from downloading some of my pieces from the Scripto). My machine seems to have a completely different idea of dynamics to the machines belonging to other ONCUers.

Richard

Reply 11 offered by: marsu on 17-Mar-1999

(I know this is a bit old, but I'm just getting back to the net :-/
There is a solution not mentioned here (it maybe the Grant's one on the news, but still no access to them; or is it feasible with a http page somewhere???) for your quarter+dottedquarter followed by quarter+eighth.
Simply replace the dot by its value, i.e. do a full chord with 3 quarters, the two that should be dotted being tied; then enter the 2nd beat as a chord with quarter+2ieghths, beamed (or not) to the the last eights.
Note that this kind of notation is often used in multi-voice scores where different rythmic schemes appears simultaneously, making a "vertical" reading easier.

HTH,
        MAD


#1025: How to format lyrics in repeat sections?
How to format lyrics in repeat sections?

(1025)

Submitted by: Henk Dijkstra on 11-Jan-1999

Hi,

I've a song with a repeat section, like the second example on page 23 of the users guide:
   A  B C  (where section B is repeated 3 times)
The lyrics are all 3 times different, and the whole song is repeated two times.
So I want to end up with the above score notation, and lyrics something like this:

    A  B1 C
       B2
       B3
    D  E1 F
       E2
       E3

How should i divide up the lyrics in lines to get this result? If I try using more than
1 lyric line, I end up with text under A and/or C.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Jan-1999

Refer to the answer in msg #1015, which appears to also apply to your question.


#1026: Notation from Midi input
Notation from Midi input

(1026)

Submitted by: Susan Hansen on 13-Jan-1999

Sorry if this has been discussed, but I don't know what to call it or how to find out how to fix it. When I am recording from the keyboard into NWC, it always puts the notes with sharps (for example D# instead of Eb). I've tried setting the key signature in my dummy metronome file but it still stays sharps. Is there a way to set this?
Also, is there a way to just have a note move up a step without erasing it and placing a new one?

Thanks for any assistance!

I got great help with recording from my keyboard on previous message.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Jan-1999

You will need to add a key signature after the import.

In current User's Guide (version 1.55):
- Page 21 for key change procedure
- Page 36, middle of page, for tip on moving notes

In the forum, see:
- msg #3, msg #4, msg #541, msg #665
- msg #678, msg #762, msg #786

Reply 2 offered by: Matt Mattero on 05-Feb-2000

Susan,

I haven't tried NW Composer, But I can recommend MIDINOTATE available from this web site: http://www.notation.com/

God Bless,

Matt Mattero Ministries †

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Feb-2000

Matt: -

It's seems your reply is more than slightly off topic.
Susan was seeking assistance for a midi-in problem not a conversion from a midi file to notation.

I wondered why someone who hadn't used NWC was recommending a competitor's software....until I went to the site.
It seems that the developers of Midinotate offer rewards to anyone who will sell or promote their software on the net.
Might you be one of those promoters?
Your lack off knowledge with Susan's question suggests you might be.
I'm sure your motives in accepting a reward for service are correct - but get your facts right.

This isn't a public newsgroup - it's provided and maintained by NoteWorthy Artware as a discussion forum for users - not as a billboard for competing products.
The users here frequently recommend NoteWorthy Composer in public newsgroups, not for reward, but simply because we believe that NWC is an excellent tool.

If anyone is interested - Midinotate does a reasonable job in coverting a midi file to notation but you can't edit the notes (only transpose and change clef).
You have to wait until the developer produces ...Midinotate Composer... before you can do that.
And that's vapourware!

I have tried ... and uninstalled Midinotate.


#1027: Author Field
Author Field

(1027)

Submitted by: yonatan lehman on 13-Jan-1999

At the moment the "author" filed is very limited
if I want to credit words, music and arrangement to
three people I cant get it all in.
Is there a way around this or do I need to goto
the wish list ?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Jan-1999

Yes, we can wish for better support for author information. But meanwhile you can use the Insert Text facility to put text wherever you want, including the top of the page. See the user tip at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#authleft for how to insert author info at the left side, but the idea can be extended to put it anywhere.


#1028: Suggestion for NWC Forum.
Suggestion for NWC Forum.

(1028)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 14-Jan-1999

About Sue's confusion in msg #1024 (reply 5) : it would be nice to have the reply number displayed with each reply. For instance, instead of "Reply offered by: <Name> on <date>", we'd have "Reply #n offered by: <Name> on <date>".

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 14-Jan-1999

As you get if you view the messages from 'Recent Activity' rather than 'Active Contents' ?

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 14-Jan-1999

Yes indeed. I mean it would be nice to have these reply numbers in the body of the message itself. For instance, your reply would read "Reply #1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 14-Jan-1999", and mine "Reply #2 offered by Olivier Miakinen on 14-Jan-1999".

Reply 3 offered by: Richard on 14-Jan-1999

Eric ?


#1029: Multiple Measure Rests
Multiple Measure Rests

(1029)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 14-Jan-1999

Hey All,

I searched through the offline forum, and found my question asked: Does NWC support multiple-measure rests, where a whole note measure includes a bold bar across the top, with a number embedded in the center, to indicate how many whole measures to rest? The answer in the offline forum (by Andrew Purdam) was "Nope."

This question was asked on 5/3/97, a few releases of NWC have come by since then. Does NWC have a way to support this feature when printing out a single staff? I have saved many a staff to a separate file and accomplished this by using text for the bolded "# of measures" bar. But then of course NWC does not understand the "collapse" of the staff, and automatic measure numbering must be turned off, and the measure numbers also input as text (assuming you want measure numbering, as I do).

Is this a good item for the wish list? Ideas on how to do this more easily than what I am doing? Thanks in advance for everyone's thoughts and contributions.

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: Grant Hicks on 14-Jan-1999

I'm sure this is already on the wish list. But it never hurts to ask again. And again. And again.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Jan-1999

Sue,

If your only interest is in printing the part, the answer is "yes." Barry's Boxmarks font has the facility to insert those "multi-bar rests".

Just delete all but one of those multiple bars, insert the appropriate "multi-bar indicator" from Boxmarks, and save the modified file as a separate file (in case you have to do it again after finding an error) <== Speaking from experience! ;-)

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Jan-1999

As far as native NWC features are concerned, the following page will always be the one, authoritative source:

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/history.htm

Reply 4 offered by: Sue on 15-Jan-1999

I forgot that Boxmarks has got the multi-bar marking in it (I've been using plain old text, e.g.

|----- 53 -----|

I use Boxmarks fairly regularly, too, and still forgot!

I will also add this to the wishlist (again) as it would be much nice if NWC handled it for print, and could still keep track of the measure numbers for you.

Thanks again everyone,

Sue

Reply 5 offered by: Danny Thompson on 20-Jan-1999

Multiple Measure rests... what is Boxmarks?
Please put multiple measure rests as a feature of NWC!
thanks!

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jan-1999

Boxmarks is a "User Font" designed by Barry Graham that you can install in one of the four supplied "User Fonts" slots provided for that purpose in NWC.

You can download it from

http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com

among other places

Fred

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Jan-1999

Get the file from http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ftp/helpful/boxmarks.zip

I wish it had longer crescendo signs!


#1032: Score outlay
Score outlay

(1032)

Submitted by: Mick on 20-Jan-1999

Is there a way to seperate a family of instruments from each other to give it a professional look. Like if you have trumpets and horns, and you want to bracket them together and not have the bracket continuing all the way through the rest of the instruments. Tried about everything, is there a way? Please help, thanks, Mick

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Jan-1999

You cannot control the bracket at this time. You can, however, combine a Standard style staff into an orchestral arrangement to separate out a section using bar line extension. This is as far as you can go at present.

Reply 2 offered by: Byron Dickens on 21-Jan-1999

This is a good thing to add to the wish list!

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Jan-1999

Also, you can insert an upper/lower Grand Staff pair into the middle of an orchestral score to tie together Violin I/ Violin II, or Tenor-Alto and Bass Trombones, etc. It's especially useful if the staves before and after the pair are set to "standard." This ties the barlines together for those two staves and adds a bracket at the beginning. Might be suitable for your purposes...??


#1033: Printing on One Page
Printing on One Page

(1033)

Submitted by: Neil Kinman on 21-Jan-1999

I downloaded and installed the shareware version to evaluate. It is wonderful to be able to transcribe music on the computer!

One major concern I have is being able to print one short song on one 8½ x 11 inch page, portrait, without the staff printing over to subsequent pages. If this is not possible, the software will not be of any use to me.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Jan-1999

Yes, it is possible. What you want is exactly how it works.

Reply 2 offered by: Neil Kinman on 21-Jan-1999

You are correct; I should have phrased my question more clearly.
How, exactly, do I print a short song on one 8½ x 11 page, portrait, without the staff spilling over onto subsequent pages????

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Jan-1999

Obviously, the more measures, notes, and other items that are in a staff, the less likely that it will fit on one page. However, if it is short enough, you can fit a staff on a single page by reducing the staff size, which is set in Page Setup. The smaller the staff, the more notation that will fit on a page...

Reply 4 offered by: Neil Kinman on 21-Jan-1999

This is the third time I have received this exact same message, which does not tell me how to print on one page.

Will someone PLEASE tell me HOW to print a short song entirely on one page, portrait.

This "how-to" is what's required before I feel comfortable in registering my shareware version and/or buying the program.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Jan-1999

I am not sure what else you need to know. You print using the Print command on the File menu. You can preview the printout using Print Preview, again on the File menu. Obviously if your staff contains too much material for the selected staff size (in Page Properties), then it might not fit on one page (this is easily checked with Print Preview).

If you still do not get it, maybe you can explain why you are having such difficulty printing a single staff to one page. The JINGLE.NWC sample prints to one page, and it even uses two staves, not just one. Does JINGLE.NWC print on one page for you? How many measures does your staff contain that it will not fit on one page? What is your point size setting in Page Setup? What do you see on the printed page?

Reply 6 offered by: Don Ruckman on 21-Jan-1999

Neil,
Let me take a stab at your problem.
With your composition displayed in NWC, do the following:
1. Select FILE (upper left corner)
2. Select PAGE SETUP (about 2/3 down the FILE menu)
3. select the OPTIONS TAB (2nd from left)
4. change the STAFF SIZE(in points): nn
make this smaller to condense the number of pages
5. select OK
6. Select FILE (upper left corner)
7. Select PRINT PREVIEW (about 2/3 down the FILE menu)
now if the NEXT button on the right is black
(not gray), then more than one page is required
to print. You can count the number of pages by
selecting NEXT n times until it turns gray.
8. Repeat the above steps until you are satisfied with
the PRINT PREVIEW (number of pages desired). Then Print

Might I also suggest that NWC is very powerful and has great capability, and the use of HELP is essential and very useful. Also, some time spent experimenting with the numerous capabilities is necessary.

Reply 7 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 23-Jan-1999

What nobody has said is the NWC is not really WYSIWYG, dispite it's pretty interface. The editing display is streatched out from here to eternity (or at least as long as you are likely to we willing to enter notes). The print format is neatly folded, one staff system above another, just as you would hope.

The problem is it's obvious to most of us, but not so to a newcomer.

Cyril

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Jan-1999

Good point, Cyril.

Neil, if you are creating more than one staff in the editor, then this will not give you the results that you are looking for from the program. Make sure that you are working with only a single staff in the editor, then let NWC do the formatting onto the printed page.

You stated above that you are only working with one staff, but I figured it was worth some elaboration, in case this is the problem.

Reply 9 offered by: Jeff Kalmar on 27-Jan-1999

Neil:
I think that your question has been thoroughly answered;however, as a composer and musician I want to recommend that you go ahead and register NWC. There's nothing else that comes close for the price. By the way, I have printed several songs of varying lengths, each to a single page. The answers you've received tell you exactly how to do it. Good Luck!

Reply 10 offered by: Neil Kinman on 28-Jan-1999

Thanks to all who responded to my questions. As soon as I read that the program is not WYSIWYG I understood what I needed to to achieve the end result I desired. I hope to get much use from this program in the future as I become more proficient on my keyboard.


#1034: Recovering FIle
Recovering FIle

(1034)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 22-Jan-1999

I was chopping up a multiple-staff score into separate files per instrument when I accidentally pressed the save button before renaming the file. Is there ANY way of recovering the file in its full format (i.e. with all the staffs) withouth having to re-write it?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 22-Jan-1999

If you have "Create Backup Files" enabled in the Tools, Options, File tab, then the answer is Yes. When enabled, each existing file is renamed from "*.nwc" to "*.bak" when a new save is performed. You can simply rename the "*.bak" file to a "*.nwc" file, then load it into the program.

If you disabled this feature somewhere along the line (it is on by default), then you will only be able to recover the file using a backup copy of your own.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 22-Jan-1999

If you "overwrote" a prior file, have Norton's Utilities or some other similar utility to find "deleted" files, and have not done much with your computer since "overwriting" the file, the utility may be able to pick up the old file. See the manuals. The potential saving grace is that "overwriting" a file frequently does not put the new file at the same address on the hard drive, and the old file may still be there to be ferreted out by the utility. As you use the computer, however, it becomes more and more likely that the computer will use the space occupied by the old file. Hope that helps if the backup tip didn't save the day.

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 22-Jan-1999

Thanks. You just saved my day...

Suggestion: Why don't you add this detail to the help file?

Reply 4 offered by: Grant Hicks on 22-Jan-1999

I don't know of a single application that documents the DOS or NT file systems or how to recover deleted files. Imagine the duplication of effort (not to mention waste of disk space) if every program that ran under Windows had to provide this information! The help file should document how the program itself works and any *peculiarities* in its interface to the operating system. The operating system, or utility package such as Norton, should document the generic stuff.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Jan-1999

I understood the suggestion to refer to the renaming of *.bak files in case of trouble... a nice feature of NWC which not every DOS/Win app includes... and which I too didn't know about until I stumbled on the .bak files while doing routine housekeeping shortly after installing NWC the first time. I just checked, and couldn't find a reference to backup files in the help system.

Reply 6 offered by: Jonathan Lee on 07-Feb-1999

The same thing happened to me, and I managed to save the file. However, the backup info IS in the help file. Go to find, and search for backup. Then look at "Save File" or something similar to that. It's there.


#1036: Numbing Measures, Need Help
Numbing Measures, Need Help

(1036)

Submitted by: FreakToy on 22-Jan-1999

Where is the command so I can make it automaticlly number my measures? Please Help

Reply 1 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 22-Jan-1999

Go under File>Page Setup>Options and change the variables in boxes "Measure Numbers" & "Measure Start"


#1037: Maximum Volume & Note Accents
Maximum Volume & Note Accents

(1037)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 23-Jan-1999

It just occured to me; If I put in the staff properties a staff volume of 127 (maximum) and then write on that staff accented notes, will they SOUND accented? If not, then in numerical (0 to 127) terms or in percentile terms, if appropriate, how much does accenting increase the volume?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Jan-1999

Accents affect velocity (as controlled by dynamics) rather than channel volume. You can use the following table as a guide, the dynamics shown are the default values. The first entry of each pair is accented, the second is unaccented. You can copy the table with Cntl C, then paste it into your file editor of choice for later reference.

On ch=1 note=c6 vel=10 ppp
On ch=1 note=c6 vel=14

On ch=1 note=b5 vel=30	pp
On ch=1 note=b5 vel=42

On ch=1 note=b5 vel=45	p
On ch=1 note=b5 vel=63

On ch=1 note=b5 vel=60	mp
On ch=1 note=b5 vel=84

On ch=1 note=b5 vel=75	mf
On ch=1 note=b5 vel=105

On ch=1 note=b5 vel=92 f
On ch=1 note=b5 vel=127

On ch=1 note=b5 vel=108 ff
On ch=1 note=b5 vel=127

On ch=1 note=b5 vel=127 fff
On ch=1 note=b5 vel=127

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Jan-1999

Oops.. I mean, the first value of each pair is _un_accented, the second value is accented.

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Jan-1999

See also: msg #57, msg #793 for earlier discussion of velocity versus volume.

Reply 4 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 26-Jan-1999

Thanks Fred for compiling this useful table.

This confirm a suspiction of mine: that in general NWC accents are too loud. A boost of 10 points or so in velocity value would be preferable, but to pass from a mf 75 to an accented mf 105 (30 points) is really too much and I find myself always applying workarounds because NWC defaults are a bit extreme, at least for classical music.

Would it be possible to have the percentage of accent boost to be configurable as a staff or song property? What does the NWC community think about this?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jan-1999

I agree. I've already added this to the wish list ;) but I'm glad someone would find this a desirable addition. I too have had to use workarounds to make the accents more reasonable (to my ear).

I'd also really like to be able to change the default dynamics settings, without having to specify them at every occurrence (e.g. p(60,0) etc.) Perhaps this could even be stored in an .ini or .cfg file so that different default setups could be installed using file copy/rename.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jan-1999

By the way, Ramón, thanks for your wonderful submissions recently to the Scriptorium. I've also enjoyed the sequences on your home page, and was hoping you'd send some along to the "group repository." Wonderful work.

Fred

Reply 7 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 26-Jan-1999

Thanks for the kind words. They're much needed.

As soon as I revise some old files I'll send them to the Scriptorium too.


#1038: Vibrato and other effects
Vibrato and other effects

(1038)

Submitted by: Seifer on 26-Jan-1999

Is there any way to add crescendo, decrescendo, vibrato, and other effects to notes that will export to MIDI. I can put in a crescendo, but it's just in the notation...it's not in the actual MIDI itself. Is there anyway to do this or am I just stupid?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jan-1999

One of the beauties of NWC is that, unlike other programs, it _does_ actually do dynamic variations in its midi output. You just have to specify a starting and ending dynamic, and NWC takes if from there. Example:

| | | | | | | |
p cresc. ff

(starts here...............to here)

Obviously, if you're starting at fff (the default), you won't get any crescendo. Similarly, if you specify decresc. but don't put an "ending dynamic" somewhere, you won't hear a change.

Vibrato is a lot trickier... involving the use of many pitch-change MPC's. Similarly, tremolo would need many fast volume MPC's.

Hope this helps.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Seifer on 26-Jan-1999

Hmm...I tried that...I put piano crescendoes to fortissimo, but I still didn't hear a change. Is there something I'm missing, or some detail that I didn't get? Do they all have to be in a particular place in relation to another (except obviously that it needs to be in order)?

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 27-Jan-1999

Silly question perhaps, and apologies in advance, but are you using the correct <Insert> <Dynamic Variance> <Crescendo> command? If you're just inserting a text item, NWC won't pick it up.

Reply 4 offered by: Sue Morton on 27-Jan-1999

As Fred already mentioned, NWC sets the staff default to full volume. Did you set each staff's properties for Part Volume (on the Midi tab of Staff Properties) to something less than the maximum? NWC always defaults the staff volume to 127, which is maximum loudness possible. In order to have variation, the staff property must be set lower, usually very much lower if you want to go from something like ppp up to fff on the staff.

Hope this helps.

Sue

Reply 5 offered by: Seifer on 27-Jan-1999

Ooooooh, okay! Man, I knew it was something obvious. Okay, so let me get this straight. I have to set the volume to something significantly lower than 127, then insert piano, then insert crescendo, then insert forte? And yes, I was inserting dynamic variance, not just adding text. Something tells me once you learn how to use the intricacies of NWC, you can figure out more things by yourself :P

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 27-Jan-1999

Yes. You insert
Dynamic - piano
Dynamic Variance - cresc.
and some notes later
Dynamic - forte

On play back, that should give a cresc. sound, as well as the correct note down velocities in an exported midi file.

You DON'T need to adjust the volume of the channel.
I expect that the lack of results before may have been due to not having a quiet dynamic to cresc. from.

Andrew

Reply 7 offered by: Seifer on 27-Jan-1999

Nope nope, that's what I did. Nothing happened. I'll figure it out one of these days. Life's so complicated sometimes... heh

Reply 8 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 28-Jan-1999

As Andrew pointed out, you DON'T need to adjust the volume. The dynamics only affect the velocity.

But if I remember, in early versions of NWc it was necessary to "recompute" staff after adding cresc (with F9 or so).
Besides, how many notes do you have between piano and forte? If you have only one note, it may be normal that it doesn't changes "volume" during the note (since velocity normally affects the beginning of the note).

Anyway, what happens exactly? The velocity changes at once when encountering forte, or it doesn't change at all ?

Reply 9 offered by: Seifer on 28-Jan-1999

Okay I got it to work, but only because i used multiple notes. I was tying two whole notes together and doing the same thing, and it didn't crescendo. I used 5 or 6 quarter notes and it did crescendo. So...how do you get dynamic variances to work on a drawn out note?

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jan-1999

Aha. The thot plickens. Changing dynamics once a note is struck is an entirely different operation. You have to use, in this case, Volume MPC (multi-point controller). Here's the reason:

VELOCITY affects how hard the sound is struck. Each note in a midi file has a velocity value assigned to it. This means that you can't "go back in time" and change the velocity once the note has sounded.

VOLUME affects the overall volume of that channel. Once a volume setting or change is invoked, all subsequent events (notes) will be affected by the new volume setting.

I know it's confusing. Re-read the difference a couple times, and experiment.

Reply 11 offered by: NWC-Support on 31-Jan-1999

Many sound cards do not support volume swells on notes that are already playing. Some good ones do support this, but yours probably does not support it. If this is the case, then there is nothing you can do to change the volume (loudness) of a note that is already playing (since your sound card simply will not support such a change).

Reply 12 offered by: NWC-Support on 31-Jan-1999

See also: msg #994

Reply 13 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 31-Jan-1999

Further to your question about vibrato, etc. apart from the desc/cresc based on multiple notes, the others require a midi system that does more than el cheapo basic Soundblaster 16. As Eric explained, if you have a card that supports volume change on a channel which will change the volume on notes already down, then use a multi-point controller to vary the volume. You may want to set the initial volume (on the Staff property) to 100 or so, to give you some headspace for crescendo's. I just experimented with using velocity overrides with the dynamics, and this seems to work as well.

w.r.t. vibrato, some synths will support this and tremolo, with specific commands not supported in Noteworthy. In this case, you'll need a midi program to insert the correct midi commands. These commands can be instrument specific, and you'd best refer to your instrument's implementation manual to see what the commands would be.

HTH
Andrew

Reply 14 offered by: Seifer on 31-Jan-1999

Yeah! I experimented a lot with multi point controllers yesterday, and now i can get tempo, volume, and pan changes to work perfectly! Still having problems with pitch bend...*sigh* glissando had better hurry up and get here :P

Reply 15 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 12-Feb-1999

As funny as it may sound I am (planning on) using the music written on NWC for recording purposes. If I use however volumes (MPC wise) that are not as loud as possible, then the .wav file that results by recording the midi playback at full midi-playback-volume/recording-sensitivity is very low volumewise. Amplifiying it introduces distortion and clicks. So everytime a write a song, I start every staff at volume 64, adjust levels between the instruments, then knock up the values of all the mpc's used so that the one with the highest value gets a full 127. A LOT of work...


#1039: How do I make a note stem up & down ?
How do I make a note stem up & down ?

(1039)

Submitted by: Samuel C. Devaraj on 27-Jan-1999

Is is possible in NWC to make a note stem up & down ?
(I am using evaluation version of NWC 1.31d)

Note :
If Melody & Alto (OR Tenor & Bass) have the same note, it is represented by making that note stem up & down (as given below).
----|--
----|--
---O---
--|----
--|----
It does not matter to NWC when playing back.
But the choristers get confused when printout is given.
- Sam

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 27-Jan-1999

Hi Sam,

To enter two notes in a chord (even if they are the same note) with one stem up and one stem down, first select a stem direction (from the toolbar, Notes menu, or use shift+up arrow and shift+down arrow), and enter a note onto the staff.

Now choose the opposite stem direction and enter the second note using the chord command (CTRL-ENTER if entering notes from the keyboard). You should now have one note stem going up and one going down in the same position on the staff.

I hope this answers your question.

Sue

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 27-Jan-1999

You have NWC 1.31d? It's been a long time, but I'm not sure that what you want to do can be done in that version.
Download 1.55a.
If I'm wrong, sorry! :-)

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Jan-1999

A quick reveiew of http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/history.htm will show that you need version 1.5 or better to evaluate this feature.

Reply 4 offered by: Samuel C. Devaraj on 27-Jan-1999

Hi Sue Morton, Gordon Isbell & NWC-Support,

(1)
Thank you all for your prompt and useful reply.

I have downloaded NWC Ver 1.55a, and tried to make a note stem up & down (thanks Sue...).

It works !!!

I have few other questions, but let me try those with the ver 1.55 before I post it to the forum.

(2)
By the way... has anyone purchased NWC from INDIA. I wish to know how to pay the registration fee (to NWC) from INDIA.

Thanks
- Sam

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 28-Jan-1999

About (2) : I have purchased NWC from France. I think it is the same thing for India or any other country: I have sent the registration form along with my credit card number. If you don't want to send it by email or by fax (I understand that), I think it should be possible to send it by snail mail.

Reply 6 offered by: Samuel C. Devaraj on 28-Jan-1999

Hi Olivier Miakinen,

Thanks for your reply.

I think, it's not so simple in INDIA.
My Credit card says, it is valid only in INDIA & NEPAL.
I dought NWA Inc will be able to debit money from my Card.

I may need to get somehting like Overseas Cheque/Draft.
Ofcourse, I can enquire about this from the Banks here.
I just felt lazy and thought I could benefit from those
who have done it already.

thank you
- Sam


#1040: How do I represent Breve (an 8 beat note) ?
How do I represent Breve (an 8 beat note) ?

(1040)

Submitted by: Samuel C. Devaraj on 27-Jan-1999

How do I represent Breve ?

The longest not available in NWC is SemiBreve (4 beat).
At present to emulate a Breve, I use two tied Semibreves.

But.. is there any direct way ???

thanks
- Sam

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Jan-1999

This is not currently supported (version 1.55a is current release)

Reply 2 offered by: Samuel C. Devaraj on 27-Jan-1999

Hi,

Thanks for your prompt reply.
Hope you would include this feature in future releases.

thanks
- Sam

Reply 3 offered by: Grant Hicks on 31-Jan-1999

This is why I've always objected to the English system of naming durations (minim, crotchet, etc.). Not only does it use three different prefixes meaning "half" (hemi, demi, semi), it calls a double whole note "breve", which means "short" by etymology. ("Minim" is worse: it means "least".) Is this any way to run a language?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-1999

Who ever said the English language was logical? Let's switch to Esperanto... oh... it's been tried? didn't work? Darn!

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 01-Feb-1999

But Grant! In the days that breve and minim inherited their names, they _were_ short and least! It wasn't until our culture sped up that we wrote faster music. ;-)
By next millenium, we'll be using nano-quavers.

A

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 01-Feb-1999

That will mean a complete rewrite of NWC to allow a time base of 10. Otherwise the nearest I can get is a quaver divided by two thirty times, which is an awful lot of tails.

P

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-1999

Hee, hee :-)

Reply 8 offered by: Chris R. Lee on 14-Feb-1999

Breves would be useful. They are sorely lacking for things like madrigals, for which NWC is a great learning aid.

By the way, if anyone wants to post Banchieri's FESTINA (20 numbers), including the deservedly famous Madrigal to a Nightingale, I'll send the files (if I can work out how).

Regards


#1041: File Associations on the web?
File Associations on the web?

(1041)

Submitted by: Seifer on 27-Jan-1999

Okay, here's the deal. I'm using IE5, and whenever I click on a link that's a MIDI file, it'll run that file with Media Player. That's all good and dandy, but I want the MIDI to run in NWC instead. So where do I go to change that? Or for that matter, how do I change it to play in any other program, and not just Media Player? This would make my life easier if I could get those MIDIs to open in NWC from the web instead of Windows Media Player.

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 27-Jan-1999

I think IE uses the normal file associations.
If this is the case, the thing to change is in Windows Explorer (or probably IE if you are using Win 98).
In Windows Explorer, you would go to View, Options, File Types, and edit the MIDI Sequence definitions to default to Noteworthy Player.

Reply 2 offered by: Seifer on 27-Jan-1999

Unfortunately, I did that already. I associated WinGroove with my MIDI files that way. I use Win95, and even though in my file types, MIDI files open and play with WinGroove (Or NWC), it still open up MIDI files from the web with Media Player. That's what makes this problem so frustrating...it should have been fixed already. But since I can't edit what program opens up those MIDI files, I can't make NWC or anything else open them. And that makes me mad :P

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Jan-1999

Sorry, as neither an IE nor Win98 user I can't help with your association problem directly, but do suggest that once you do figure it out, associate NoteWorthy _Player_ with midi files, not Composer. The reason is that Player will retain all of the dynamics and other controllers in the midi file, whereas Composer will remove them and you'll just get very flat (and usually very loud) midi renditions with mucked-up triplets.

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: John Gillings on 27-Jan-1999

Works for me!, just to make sure we're talking about the
same thing, here's what I did to test this.

Open Windows Explorer, choose "Options" from "View" menu.
Click on the "File Types" tab and select the file type "Midi Sequence"
Now click "Edit" to go to the "Edit File Type" dialog. it
should contain a list of actions, one of which is bolded.
The bold action is the default.

Since I installed Noteworthy Player, it is listed as one of
the actions, but is not the default. Select Noteworthy
Player and click on "Set Default".

From now on, double clicking a .MID or .RMI file will
activate Noteworthy Player, as will opening a MID file from
inside Internet Explorer.

You said you wanted Noteworthy Composer to be activated (are
you sure? do you really want to go through the MIDI import
wizard for every file?). If you do, get to the Edit File
Types dialog as above and click on New. Make up a name for
the action (say "Noteworthy Composer") then browse for NWC32
as the application. Finally set that action as the default.

I did this on Win95 with Explorer V4.0. Since I don't
usually use Explorer (since it won't run under OpenVMS)
I may have missed an option to specify an action for
MIDI files from within Explorer itself.

Reply 5 offered by: Seifer on 27-Jan-1999

I said Internet Explorer, not Explorer. I have Media Player 6.0...maybe that has something to do with it. I'm also running IE 5. I have associated all of the actions as default actions in the *.mid file type, but Media Player opens it up no matter what I have as the default player.

Reply 6 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 28-Jan-1999

In that case I'd try to find help from Microsoft.
Surely they haven't created such a badly engineered piece of software that you can't easily do this?!?!!? :)

Try the Help menu on IE5, or the knowledge base (well at least they don't call it intelligence!) at !www.microsoft.com

A


#1042: Search William Tell Overture full in NWC
Search William Tell Overture full in NWC

(1042)

Submitted by: Maxime Hoile on 27-Jan-1999

Hello... i'm search William Tell Overture, the full version in NWC format... Send me this file per e-mail, please

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 27-Jan-1999

I tried an AltaVista (!www.altavista.com) query:
"+William +Tell +Overture +Midi" which came up with
!www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Hills/6764/willtell.mid
which looks reasonably complete. To convert it from MIDI
just Import it into NWC. If it's not good enough, there are
probably lots of other versions in the other 3947 pages
that AltaVista found.

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 27-Jan-1999

Those links should be:

AltaVista: http://www.altavista.com

and the file at: http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Hills/6764/willtell.mid

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 28-Jan-1999

You will also find a number of MIDI versions at the Classical Music Connection (along with hundreds of other files), web address http://midiworld.com/cmc/index.htm#M

Happy downloading!

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Vasey on 28-Jan-1999

Just to add to the above, I've had a look at all the MIDIs referred to, and only the Brian Ames (243K) version on Classical Music Connection is the complete overture - the rest are all only the last 'Lone Ranger' section! The Brian Ames version is a very good rendering and worth adding to your collection.

Reply 5 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 28-Jan-1999

Peter: Thanks for the link to the Midiworld site. Looks like a candy store full of goodies.
Question: When I click on a piece, Windows Media Player comes up and plays the piece for me. What I would like, is to download the piece to my hard drive. How do I make this happen? I'm using MS Internet Explorer 4.0 on Win98.
All help appreciated,
Gordon

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 28-Jan-1999

Right click on the link and select "Save Target As..."

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 31-Jan-1999

That's a good tip, Support. Thanks. I had the opposite problem - it played in Netscape and downloaded in Explorer so I could still get the file, but your suggestion is much more useful.

Reply 8 offered by: Janet on 10-Jul-2000

I'm trying to find the sheet music for the William Tell Overture, in an intermediate format (for my accordion). There will be 10,000 runners going by my house next month in a race, and my friends and I would like to play this tune for them.

Reply 9 offered by: Artur on 10-Jul-2000

As for the midi, try also:
http://www.prs.net (Classical Music Archives)
This site has somewhat like 9.500 midi files...

Reply 10 offered by: Mike Lockey on 16-Oct-2000

Just read your query - probably too late but why don't you downlaod a MIDI file and print out the parts using suitable software - eg XG works, Cubase, Sibelius, Magix Music, Encore or shareware (try ZD net)
Cheers
Mike Lockey

Reply 11 offered by: Stephen Randall on 17-Oct-2000

"...print out the parts using suitable software - eg XG works, Cubase, Sibelius, Magix Music, Encore..."

or even Noteworthy Composer!

Reply 12 offered by: Joe Music on 17-Oct-2000

Good point, Steve....

For those of you who didn't realize it, NWC can import a MIDI file and convert it into sheet music, just like the big boys. However, no matter what program you are using, MIDI is a reduction of the sheet music into a linear sequence of commands, and therefore contains less information than does the original score. In other words, importing MIDI into any music publishing program necessarily is imprecise.

I also recommend that you carefully choose the resolution (minimum size of rests and notes) before you import, lest small variations timing be interpreted as hemidemisemiquavers or whatever they are called. I don't work with anything as complicated as the William Tell Overture, but for *choral music*, it is rarely necessary to resolve timing to faster than a sixteenth note or eighth rest.

Say, do they make MIDI-compatible accordions? If so, then the MIDI could be directly input to the instrument, and playing it could be faked!

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Oct-2000

> Say, do they make MIDI-compatible accordions? If so, then
> the MIDI could be directly input to the instrument, and
> playing it could
> be faked!

My gawd, why would anyone want to do that? (Just kidding, Andrew!) :)

On the topic of midi importation, there is no reason why midi meta-text "events" couldn't be used to store scoring data. Cubasis does this for its dynamics markings, lyrics, and such; so a midi file exported from Cubase will import back into it with reasoable fidelity. (Its actual scoring facilities are another matter entirely...) I seem to recall some discussion of this as a possibility for a future release of NWC, but IIRC the upshot was that such an idea is wishful thinking, for the nonce anyway.


#1043: How to "Beam" both Melody and Alto notes ?
How to "Beam" both Melody and Alto notes ?

(1043)

Submitted by: Samuel C. Devaraj on 28-Jan-1999

How to "Beam" both Melody and Alto (OR Tenor & Bass) notes ?
( I'm using NWC evaluation ver 1.55a on Win 95 )

In Detail :
===========

( You may need to view the diagrams below with a constant width font. One simple way is to copy & paste the text into Notepad )

Consider the following score..

--------|\--
|\ |
---|---O----
O
------------
O
-|-----O----
|/ |
------|/----

When I select these notes and try to "Beam" (using the button OR pressing Ctrl+B), NWC beams either the higher notes OR the lower notes, depending on Stem UP/DOWN whichever is set.
(as given below : only higher notes are beamed)
/|
----/-|-----
| |
---|-O------
O
------------
O
-|---O------
|/ |
----|/-------

Is it possible to make both the sets Beam (as given below) ?

/|
----/-|-----
| |
---|-O------
O
------------
O
-|---O------
| |
--\-|-------
\|

thanks
- sam

Reply 1 offered by: Samuel C. Devaraj on 28-Jan-1999

I am sorry the diagrams were very bad even in NotePad.
Try the following Text in NotePad

Consider the following score..

--------|\--
---|\---|---
---|---O----
---O--------
------------
----O-------
---|---O----
---|/-|-----
------|/----

When I select these notes and try to "Beam" (using the button OR pressing Ctrl+B), NWC beams either the higher notes OR the lower notes, depending on Stem UP/DOWN whichever is set.
(as given below : only higher notes are beamed)
-----/|-----
----/-|-----
---|--|-----
---|-O------
--O---------
------------
--O---------
-|---O------
-|/-|-------
----|/------

Is it possible to make both the sets Beam (as given below) ?

-----/|-----
----/-|-----
---|--|-----
---|-O------
--O---------
------------
--O---------
-|---O------
-|--|-------
--\-|-------
---\|-------

thanks
- sam

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Jan-1999

Yes. Use staff layering. You have to enable staff layering in the Page Setup dialog, Contents tab, and in the Staff Properties (F2) of the top staff.


#1044: The Scriptorium is now a hundred!
The Scriptorium is now a hundred!

(1044)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 29-Jan-1999

That's right, we've cracked the ton!
We now have a hundred pieces on the Scriptorium archive.
(Some are collections, so the number is closer to 110).
Visit http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/
to see.

Andrew


#1045: I want a player like NWPlayer, except...
I want a player like NWPlayer, except...

(1045)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 29-Jan-1999

...I want to be able to change the synth. My Midi Mapper sounds terrible. I want to be able to use the Soft Synth from Yamaha on a player that will play MIDI files, AND show the score as the piece plays.
Does such a creature exist?
All help appreciated.
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Seifer on 29-Jan-1999

Um, NoteWorthy Player should play MIDIs through whatever MIDI playback device you have selected in the Multimedia part of Control Panel in Win95...if Yamaha SoftSynth is your MIDI Playback device, that's what it will play back with.

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 30-Jan-1999

Thanks for the reply. I'm sure I read that NWPlayer played in MidiMapper (and I know that it can't be changed from within NWPlayer), so it never occurred to me to change the default synth in the Multimedia section.
I shall try this as soon as I go offline.
Gordon

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 30-Jan-1999

In Windows 95/98:

- Start menu, select Settings, COntrol Panel
- Open the Multimedia applet
- Select the MIDI Tab
- Select Single Instrument
- Select the device you want the Player to use

This will also change the device used by the Media Player, and other similar play programs.

Reply 4 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 30-Jan-1999

Thanks Seifer and NWC-Support. I now have the answer and have made the changes. I'm glad it was this easy--I didn't want to have to add another player.
Gordon

Reply 5 offered by: snuff bear on 01-Feb-1999

Thank you so much I thought I was going bonkers but no! What a relief. Now Wagner can rest in Peace???


#1046: Pitch Bend
Pitch Bend

(1046)

Submitted by: Seifer on 30-Jan-1999

Whenever I try pitch bend, it sound completely off. Is there any way to bitch bend to a certain note, or would that be glissando, which isn't supported yet?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jan-1999

The normal pitch-bend range is plus-or-minus two semitones (total range of four semitones, or a major 3rd). This corresponds to the actual pitch-bend numbers as follows:

+8191 = +2 semitones
+4096 = +1 semitone
0 = no pitch bend
-4096 = -1 semitone
-8191 = -2 semitones

Avoid 8192, since it's ambiguous; some sound cards interpret it as +2, some as -2.

Reply 2 offered by: Dickson Livingstone on 19-Jan-2000

I recently bought a mixer and it has got a booth connectors at the back, what do they do...!!!???

R they the same as master output to the amplifier..

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 19-Jan-2000

Probably monitor outputs, roughly equivalent to the master outs but controlled by the monitor pots.


#1047: Fermata Delay
Fermata Delay

(1047)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 30-Jan-1999

Hi NWC'ers,

I have searched the Offline Forum, as well as the NWC 1.55a help, and need clarification on the correct specification of the delay with a fermata.

The NWC help indicates that a Breath Mark inserted into the score should have a delay specified for only ONE vertical instance of the breath mark. The help does NOT give this same warning for the fermata...

Sooooooo, I have a score with 6 staves, and somewhere in the middle is the place for the fermata. I inserted the fermata at the same location across all 6 staves, and gave all fermatas a delay of 8 (16ths). (The piece is in 4/4 time, the fermata is above either a quarter note or a quarter note rest in every staff.)

I fully expected NWC to count 1 beat for the quarter note/quarter note rest, and two additional counts for the fermata delay. What I got was something around 6-7 beats before the song resumed.

I removed the delay from ALL but ONE of the fermatas, and then the delay was counted as I wished it to be.

So, did I stumble upon the correct implementation of the fermata delay (and should the NWC help be clarified accordingly), or is there something else I should have been doing to get it to work out? Any help or comment is appreciated! Thanks.

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jan-1999

Yes. I've discovered this too -- tempo variations like fermata and breath-marks are additive.

Another point: it isn't necessary to have a separate "conductor" track. Tempo changes or variations can be placed on any staff, and will (of course) affect all staves. Apparently NWC, on exporting to midi, combs through all staves looking for tempo changes before writing the midi Master Track.

Finally, I should point out that fermatas and breath-marks do _not_ export to midi, and only work if you're playing the NWC file itself (this is in the help system, but I overlooked that and wondered why my fermatas stopped working). So if you want your file midi transportable, you have to "fake" the fermatas etc. using brief tempo changes.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 31-Jan-1999

Well stated, Fred.

See also: msg #259, msg #663


#1048: Printing/Time signature on each page.
Printing/Time signature on each page.

(1048)

Submitted by: Joe Allison on 30-Jan-1999

I have a rather long song, (4 pages) and would like the time signature to print out on each page. It now prints out only on the first page. Pages 2,3 & 4 do not print out the time signature. Is there a way I can print the time signature on each page? Thanks,

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jan-1999

Since the standard way of displaying time signatures is only at the beginning of the piece, or if it changes, I've never tried this; but the following procedure should work.

Note which bar numbers are at the beginning of each new page, and simply insert a time signature there. You might have to play with it a bit, because it's possible that the addition of another T/S might cause the first line to no longer fit, spilling the last bar onto the next line.


#1049: Wird Sounds on large number of staves
Wird Sounds on large number of staves

(1049)

Submitted by: Snuff on 31-Jan-1999

I have been writing the score of Wagner Operas just the music and as soon as I introduce a new staff say 15 up then when I playback I get the mmost wierd sounds froim percussion instruments not scored or entered by me even though I place the instrument correctly.

Any ideas please.

Also the patch for triplets doesnot work for me any suggestions please.

Reply 1 offered by: Ian Wesley on 31-Jan-1999

I suspect that you have set the midi channel to either 10 or 16 for this track. General midi uses channel 10 by default for the general midi percussion sounds. However, some playback devices use 16. Either way you can check using the windows midi mapper (if you are using wim 3.x) or the idfedit program (if you are using win 9*). The link is somewhere in the archive.

My Technics keyboard uses 16 for internal midi percussion, so I know the effect you are descibing - I occasionally forget to switch it over to general midi when I turn it on. However, somethimes the results are not half bad - the Hallelujah Chorus came out with quite a reasonable "disco" feel (but I still prefer Handel's original!)

Ian

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 31-Jan-1999

I just experienced this very same phenomenon last night while entering an arrangement of Bach's "We Hasten to Thee" into my laptop. It just so happened that channel 11 (yes, I do mean *11*) got assigned to the flute staff, and for some reason this came out as all sorts of tambourine, bell, whistle, finger symbol, squeaks, etc. Quite a hoot, it was, but I too prefer the original intent of flute!

Don't know why my laptop soundcard uses channel 11 for this stuff, drum track is on 10 where it should be. Don't know about channel 16, just got the laptop and this is the first time I've used it with NWC...

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 01-Feb-1999

Sue, just a question prompted by your laptop presence! Do you use an external MIDI instrument with your laptop, if so can you both record and play back with it? I've been advised by one particular laptop manufacturer - Pico - that their machine only allows inputs, but if you or any other laptop users have fully compatible machines, I'd be very grateful for info.

Thanks, Peter.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Feb-1999

Sue: If you look at your MIDI Mapper configuration (on the lap top), you will probably see channel 11 mapped to channel 10 of your synthesizer. This would cause it to also sound as percussion.

Snuff: As for triplets, you must select the notes first, then press the Triplet button.

Reply 5 offered by: Sue Morton on 01-Feb-1999

Peter: My laptop, a Toshiba, only allows MIDI input, mic input, and has a speaker/headphone output. I do not use an external keyboard but rather use the laptop keyboard for entry into NWC.

NWC-Support: I looked at both my laptop (Windows 95) and my desktop (Windows NT 4.0), and I confess I cannot find where I check the MIDI mapper configuration and settings.

I know it is there -- I have NWC configured to play through it -- but I guess I have never looked any closer at it than that! Can you tell me how to find it on each of these platforms? Then I will be able to answer your question! Thanks.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Feb-1999

See msg #1045 (reply 3)

Reply 7 offered by: Sue Morton on 02-Feb-1999

Per Msg 1045, Reply 3 (BTW, thanks for adding the "reply #" to each entry! Great, Great help!), I looked at the control panel applet again...

MIDI mapper is listed in NWC as playback device on both my laptop and my desktop, but MIDI mapper is NOT listed as a "single instrument" choice on either one in the control panel settings. That is why I thought I didn't know how to go find it, as I had already looked there before making the above post. I guess I still don't know how to find MIDI mapper, since it is not where you suggest it should be...

Just for grins, I tried double-clicking on each of the entries that ARE there, but I don't get anything. And there are no other buttons on the applet tab. So I still don't know how to check the status of reassignment of channel 11 to channel 10, the real question I'm trying to answer. How do I check the configuration of one of these "single instruments"? And my new question, how do I find the MIDI mapper?

Any and all help is appreciated. Thanks!

Sue

P.S. I'm going over to the newsgroup right now and post two screen prints, one of NWC playback config, and one from my control panel settings. Hopefully, my two questions can be answered easily!

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Feb-1999

*** The secrets of the MIDI Mapper revealed ***

The MIDI tab of the Multimedia applet *IS* the MIDI Mapper. If you select single instrument, you then can select the real device that is played back by the MIDI Mapper. If you chose "Custom configuration" then you can select the individual channels of the MIDI Mapper and assign different device drivers to each of the 16 channels of the MIDI Mapper.

Reply 9 offered by: Sue Morton on 06-Feb-1999

Sorry about the delay, I finally got a chance to look at my laptop and check out the channel config. I can put a screen print (OK Andrew, not a .bmp!) on the newsgroup if anyone wants to see it.... There is only one config, "default", and all 16 channels show the same instrument: "MIDI for Internal OPL2/OPL3 FM Synthesis".

I still don't know how to answer NWC-support's guess, that channel 11 is mapped to percussion on my laptop.

Can anyone help further? I'd like to know how to find these things out. Thanks!

Sue


#1050: MPC Cancel
MPC Cancel

(1050)

Submitted by: Seifer on 31-Jan-1999

Is there anything I can put at all to cancel all active multi point controllers on a staff? I seem to be having a hanging pitch bend or something, and if I could just 'reset' everything at a certain point, I think it will clear it up. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks :)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 31-Jan-1999

Hmm. It's a bummer when you've lost track of those things, as there is no search facility in NWC. If you don't have toooo many tracks, you can mute staves one by one until the hanging pitch bend disappears. Then you'll know which stave to look on. Should be easy after that.
A pitch bend mpc setting to absolute middle (0) should fix it.

Sorry this is a magic wand... ;)

A

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Feb-1999

If you want to interactively reset everything, you simply press F6 twice (or once if nothing is playing). This resets sustain pedal, volume, stereo pan, and pitch bend information on every channel.

If you want to do it in the middle of a staff, you must embed each of these: sustain pedal up, MPC volume to whatever volume you want, MPC pitch bend to 0.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-1999

How hard would it be to include an optional full reset (controller 121) at the beginning or end or both of an exported midi file?

Some midi sites (e.g. Classical Midi Connection) strongly encourage this for the files on their sites, I've been inserting them by hand using mid-text conversion and back but it's a bit of a nuisance.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Feb-1999

We are considering a mechanism to support a raw MIDI insert function directly into the staff. This would obviously allow you to do this kind of thing.

FYI: NWC used to automatically send a device reset. This was removed after complaints from some folks who used synthesizers that were dynamically loaded with sound fonts. The reset sent by NWC would force them to reload their sound font banks. Once we removed this feature, we stopped receiving such complaints.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-1999

Hmm.. yeah, I can see where that would be a problem. I guess if were re-implemented it would have to be a "user-choice" kind of thing...


#1051: Numbering verses
Numbering verses

(1051)

Submitted by: Joe Allison on 31-Jan-1999

I have not been succesful at numbering verses in a 4-verse song. I have tried the insert text function, both with the "preserve width function enabled and disabled. I have not been able, in either case, to line up my verse numbers in a vertical line. What could I be overlooking? Thanks,
Joe Allison

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-1999

How about including the numbers in the verses as typed into the lyric text editor? E.g.

1:_'Twas bril-lig and the sli-thy toves did gyre and gimbel in the wabe....

2:_Twee-dle-dum and Twee-dle-dee re-solved to have a bat-tle

etc.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 01-Feb-1999

Fred's method works, but does make the first syllable longer than it should be, and this effects the note spacing.

I played around with insert text and found the following:

Place the cursor on the same level as the first lyric line, and in front of the time signature or a bar line (in other words in front of something just before the first lyric note).

Insert text "1." with preserve width off and using lyric font.
Move the cursor down four lines to the next lyric line and repeat the process. etc, etc.

The numbers won't line up in the edit screen, but they do when you print it.

HTH
Peter


#1052: New Users - Melbourne, Australia
New Users - Melbourne, Australia

(1052)

Submitted by: Barry Graham on 01-Feb-1999

If you are new to NoteWorthy Composer and live in Melbourne, Australia you may be interested in a Computer Music course to be conducted at Chisholm Institute (Moorabbin) over 5 x 3 hour sessions commencing on Wednesday the 3rd of March.
Cost $180.

The course will cover:

Midi standards, hardware and software.
Introduction to NoteWorthy Composer.
Setting up a score.
Adding notation, lyrics, marks, dynamics etc.
Keyboard, mouse, step entry and recording.
Printing the score and parts.
Creating and editing midi files.

All participants receive an evaluation copy of NoteWorthy Composer and a 100+ page workbook containing notes, instruction manual and exercises.

Contact the Short Course Department at the Institute.
Telephone: 9209 5760

Barry Graham
bargrah@hotmail.com


#1054: An old and, sadly, forgotten way to enter music
An old and, sadly, forgotten way to enter music

(1054)

Submitted by: David Wallace on 01-Feb-1999

I have an idea for NoteWorthy Composer that I discovered
while using Electronic Arts(TM) Deluxe Music Construction
Set [DMCS],(C) 1988. It allowed me to enter notes in a way
which I have not seen before or since:

1. Upon pressing down the mouse button, the mouse pointer
became a small bar representing the note to be entered,
and the speaker played it immediately.

2. The note could be dragged up and down the scale while the
mouse button stayed pressed, and the speaker would reflect
the note's pitch at each position.

3. Once the mouse button was released, the note would be
officially entered and displayed as such.

I took this feature for granted while I could use the Mac
the program was written for (newer Macs crash when they load
DMCS), but when I tried to use any other composing software,
including NoteWorthy, I found that I was unable to generate
the kind of quality music I could with the old DMCS. I
found it much easier to follow the flow of notes when I
could hear what I was doing at each note entry as opposed to
just listening to playback over and over again. While I can
link a written note to a location on the keyboard, albeit
with some difficulty, I am unable to make the connection
between either and the resulting sound. DMCS's unique note
entry scheme does that for me, and its inclusion into NoteWorthy would substantially increase the value of
NoteWorthy, at least for me.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-1999

Quite a few sequencers allow this, e.g. Cubasis and Cakewalk. For myself, personally, I found the mouse entry method niggly and frustrating, greatly preferring the NWC spproach of direct keyboard entry. However I do like the idea of the note being sounded. I think my preference would be to have the option of having the note sounded upon entry, or when moving it with CNTL/SHIFT up/down.

The other difficulty is with long notes, e.g. halves and wholes. One nuisance about Cubasis is that it plays the whole length of the note every time you mouse-move it or sweep it with the brush tool. Maybe just a little "bip" would be better so you can hear the pitch without having to wait out the full duration.

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 01-Feb-1999

I like this idea of holding down the mouse button and positioning the note on the screen, then releasing the button. I agree the sound would be nice but should be optional, and a "bip" would be better than sounding the duration, which I also imagine would be frustrating!

I think I would only want NWC to offer this function as long as you could hold down the CTRL key and enter chords this way, too, to minimize jumping back and forth from PC keyboard to mouse.

However, having said this, one of the things I really appreciate about NWC is that virtually everything can be done straight from the PC keyboard. I rarely have to jump back and forth between mouse and keyboard, and this is a real timesaver.

What say all you NWC'ers? Is there something in these ideas that we should add to the wish list?

Sue

Reply 3 offered by: Samuel C. Devaraj on 02-Feb-1999

My experience is...Keyboard is a HUNDRED times faster...
This suggestion can be an optional feature.
- Sam

Reply 4 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 02-Feb-1999

When I used Cakewalk, I liked the drag and position for notes, but now I really like the arrow method. I would vote for the mouse drag if it was an option I could enable. I would not want it to become the only way to enter notes (to the exclusion of a synth, of course.)
Gordon

Reply 5 offered by: David Wallace on 04-Feb-1999

Of course the audio feedback should be option: I just need
the option. The mouse/keyboard debate is interesting, but
the audio feedback (preferably in MIDI, and long enough to
interpret) is the most critical element.

BTW, the Deluxe Music Construction set has yet another note
entry scheme: a virtual piano. Click on a key, and DMCS
sounds the note, with an option to enter the note in the
score, accidentals and all. A neat option for those without
a separate MIDI keyboard or the know-how to link it to the
sequencer software.

David Wallace

Reply 6 offered by: Jeff Kalmar on 06-Feb-1999

I used to use MCS, and as I recall, you could choose between the mouse and the keyboard when placing notes - or at least when moving them. I agree that hearing the note when entering it would be a good option - how about it?

Reply 7 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 12-Feb-1999

I am inclined on preffering things as they are. Less experienced musicians like me benefit form listening to the playback of the whole bar, as this indicates acoustically too the flow of the melody and the chords, whereas it provides an acoustical verification of the harmony between the note inputed and the notes playing at that beat.
However if people like this, taking both sides into account, such a function could be activated by the tools/options... command. This would have both sides satisfied

Reply 8 offered by: Sue Morton on 23-Feb-1999

Ooooh Ooooh Ooooh! I *like* the idea of a virtual keyboard! Just click on the notes and have them entered into the staff. Especially if there was a toggle for chord entry -- so you could "hold down" multiple keys, then release them all at once. And sound as an option.

Great idea! Is it worth it to everybody?

Reply 9 offered by: Martha Aramoana on 17-May-1999

DMCS was one of the easiest composers around in my own opinion, even for the amateur. Its a pity though, I haven't seen one for the PC. I could do with it right now.

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 17-May-1999

Sue, there is a small program called piano.exe (and piano.drv) that turns any PC-keyboard into a pseudo-organ keyboard. (I think it was written for Win3.0 in 1991, but is still usable)
Theoritically, you can even use it as a midi keyboard as external keyboard, but I've never found out how to configure it along with NWC to make this pair of programs work correctly.

P.S. The program I'm speaking of is NOT piano.zip, 31kb, that you can find on the net, containing only piano.exe + piano.dll)

Ask me for the program (it is a "cardware") if you want to try it (I don't have it here, only at home)

HTH, Dominique

Reply 11 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 12 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Jun-1999

I had marsu send me the piano.exe program as offered, and find it quite a viable option for people who don't have a piano keyboard... except that it doesn't seem to work with NWC. Further info: "Midi Monitor" works with it, showing it as a valid midi input. Cakewalk does NOT work with it, giving a similar error (can't load driver) as NWC. However, the Steinberg "Cubase" programs are perfectly content with it.

For those with access to the newsgroup, I've posted it there in a thread called "virtual piano" in case anyone out there has the technical expertise to figure this out.

Reply 13 offered by: marsu on 25-Jun-1999

I finally found out some information on Piano.exe + pianodrv.drv.
By using this link : http://www.savvysearch.com/search?q=bojan+rijavec+piano&op=a&cat=11 you'll get 5 answers, and in 1st one you'll learn that piano2.0 doesn't work with CakeWalk, but 2.1 does :-)
You can find it at http://wuarchive.wustl.edu/packages/ultrasound/util/windows/00Index or http://wuarchive.wustl.edu/packages/ultrasound/util/windows/piano21.zip :-)

HTH, Mad

Reply 14 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jun-1999

Ah, marsu, I could kiss you (on _both_ cheeks!) :-) Not only does piano.exe V2.1 work with Cakewalk, it also works with NWC! Hurrah! Note to Win3.x users: use the direct Piano Midi In port, it doesn't like it if you go through a multiple midi driver like multimid.

Have any Win9x users tried this out?

Reply 15 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Jun-1999

> Have any Win9x users tried this out?

We installed and used the 2.1 version on Windows 95 and Windows 98. It interworked with the 32-bit edition of NWC without any apparent problems. We were able to use it do do real-time recording of a simple piece using the computer keyboard.

Reply 16 offered by: Rebeccah Prastein on 19-Aug-1999

How do you install piano21.exe on Win98? The readme file gives instructions for win3.1 installation.

TIA

Reply 17 offered by: marsu on 20-Aug-1999

From read.me file:
PIANO v2.1 - Special Notes
--------------------------
           3-Nov-1993
Installation:
   - unzip/copy Piano files somewhere on your disk
   - add PIANO.EXE to your favorite program group using Program Manager's File/Add command
=> on win9*, select the piano.exe file, use Shift+F10 (or right click), select "create a shortcut", and move this latter into the "program" folder of the "start menu" in Windows.
- install 'Piano MIDI Driver' using Control Panel: Drivers/Add/Unlisted or updated/Browse/select Piano's directory...
=> the same, or via the "add a new program" item in the menu Start/Applications.

Sorry but I'm not sure of how names are in US english of Windows, hope this helps anyway.

Marsu

Reply 18 offered by: Sue Morton on 04-Sep-1999

I just got around to trying the Virtual Piano again. I still can't get it to work. Here's what I've got:

1. Shortcut created to PIANO.EXE
2. Couldn't do anything with PIANODRV.DRV. Tried going through "add new programs" applet in control panel. Did not add any new drivers to my system.
3. Start up PIANO, supposed to hear something (according to message at bottom), can't hear anything.
4. Start up NWC, new blank score, set MIDI input active.
5. NWC Tools, options, Record Tab. Only "input device" listed is SB Live MIDI In, so I select that. Only device listed for "echo input to play device" is A: SB Live MIDI Synth, so I select that. I've tried checking/unchecking the "echo MIDI input" box, and have tried "echo to MIDI channel" set to original, and various channels.
6. When in NWC, and I press zsdcfv etc. keys on keyboard, all it does is activate various NWC commands associated with those keys. No MIDI input to the blank staff at all.

OK, what am I doing wrong. Some of you have this working on Win98? Please let me know specific steps, if you would. Thanks as always!

Sue

Reply 19 offered by: Sue Morton on 04-Sep-1999

I went through the newsgroup's messages and found the thread on Virtual Piano. Duh! Fred already covered the problem I posted above:

"The disadvantage to both [virtual piano programs] is that you can't do step recording in NWC. Reason is that both progs (NWC and the virtual pianos) require that the focus be on the program in order to work."

OK, "live" instead of memorex it will have to be. If anyone knows of a Virtual Piano that can be used in step mode, please let me know. Thanks!

Sue

Reply 20 offered by: Marsu on 08-Sep-1999

Sue,

I strongly disagree with Fred: I finally made Piano 2.1 work on my Win95/Win3.11 systems, so I don't think this would be impossible on Win98. But we never can be sure with µ$... *sigh*

Anyway, if you want to install the pianodrv.drv , you also need to have oemsetup.inf in the same directory you specify to your installation procedure. This worked for me in both 3.11 and 95 systems, and is more detailed in the same thread you refer to (look at the post signed marsu)

If you do not have sound starting Piano, may be a problem. Check that the "local echo" is on in Piano (I think it's off though, when I use it to record in NWC).

When pressing F4 in NWC, Piano.exe (which is already started) comes in front, and you just have to play along the existing score; I use at least a "metronome", at a slow tempo, to avoid too high precision to be required, especially when starting to use Piano.exe. I even play without the key signature, i.e. just accidentals, since with a cut and paste it's corrected automatically. Sounds strange though!!! But more easy to play.

I won't have much time at home to check my conf. since I'm looking for a job, but I'll try to give more details on the midi devices I used; I think I do not use Midi mapper at all, but Voyetra (on an SB16) on both.

Hope this helps (do not forget the news),

Dominique

Reply 21 offered by: Fourati wissem on 10-Feb-2000

I like the piano.exe

Reply 22 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Feb-2000

Here is how we installed the piano21.zip utility program in Windows 98.

1. Install PIANO21.ZIP into a program folder. We
installed it into the folder c:\apps\piano21\.

2. Open an Explorer window and navigate to c:\windows

3. Open the SYSTEM.INI in NOTEPAD

4. Go down to the [drivers] section and look for existing entries of the form "midi#=nnnnnnnn.drv", where # is a number and nnnnnnn represents a driver file name. Take note of the highest number for #.

5. Add the following entry to the [drivers] section:
>
> midi#=c:\apps\piano21\pianodrv.drv
>
for example, our entry is:
>
> midi3=c:\app\piano21\pianodrv.drv
>

6. Save the SYSTEM.INI file

7. Reboot

8. Run the PIANO.EXE and all should be well

Note that you use these instructions at your own risk. Note also that the PIANO.EXE program will open the MIDI Mapper, probably making it unavailable for use in NWC.

Reply 23 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Feb-2000

Turn off Options | Local Echo to allow the MIDI Mapper to be used in NWC.

Reply 24 offered by: m jordan on 27-Mar-2000

In response to certain features found on different versions
of composing software, one must understand you get what you pay for. All the main brands of sequencing and composing programs usually have common midi and digital functions, as do most mid-level soundcards and pro i/o cards. Entry level soundcards and most shareware programs do not have the programming for enhanced interfacing. If you are serious about composing, invest a few bucks and get a decent soundcard, keyboard and composing software that takes full advantage of the computers capability.


#1055: Features
Features

(1055)

Submitted by: Derek Zahn on 02-Feb-1999

I am a pretty much satisfied registered user
of NWC; like everybody else, though, I have
wishes (perhaps some of them are possible already
but I just don't know how to achieve them).
As feedback to the authors, here are the things
I would like:

1. A way to transpose selected notes only (not
a whole staff). This is so obvious that it
must be possible already, but I can't figure
it out.

2. More flexibility in inserting MIDI data
such as sysex and odd controllers.

3. Configurable default values for the velocities
of dynamics (this should be a *staff* property).

4. Some kind of configurable native support
for trills and string tremolo.

5. The ability to configure default percentages
for regular, dotted, and slurred notes (again,
per staff). For example, to get a synth to
truly play legato, the notes should overlap;
maybe there is some way to get NWC to overlap
the notes, but it doesn't seem to.

Haha, now here's what I REALLY want for version 2:

Note properties (when you right click on a selected
note, "selection" should not be grayed out).
Selecting properties brings up a window that
allows you to adjust everything about that note.
Including:

* Actual start time and duration (to "humanize"
the time values)

* Velocity

* One-shot midi information (like controller values)

* Finally, the ability to add sequences of controller
values for pitch bend, arbitrary controllers, channel
pressure, etc. Ideally, this would be a little graph
for the duration of the note that allows the user to
add points and view the resulting graph.

Obviously, copying notes would copy the associated
midi note properties. Also, some thought would
have to be given to how to configure the default
settings for new notes.

Although this "note properties" feature would take
some effort to code, it seems fairly self-contained
and would make a good program truly great.

derek

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Feb-1999

Wow, what a well thought-out wish list. Any of those feaures would be welcome additions, all of them would be heaven! :-)

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Rebecca Voris on 02-Feb-1999

Ha! A nice list indeed, but not even vaguely overlapping with my own. I could care less about the playback; I mostly use it for debugging. What I use NWC for is typesetting arrangements for my group. I want better control over printing features

For example:

I want to be able to specify line breaks. I have a whole lot of pieces which are an A section and a B section, and the A section is 4 measures, the B section is 8. I want the A section on one line, and the B section on two lines below. Right now, I can sometimes get that if I get the margins and point sizes exactly right, but I can't always adjust that.

I want to be able to eliminate the space between master section open and close bar lines.

I want to be able to eliminate the space between master section close bar lines and the end of the piece. (I just this minute downloaded v 1.55a, which if I am correctly understanding the upgrade notes does this. That would make me happy.)

Etc.

If anyone has suggestions on formatting pieces for printing, I'd love to hear them.

Reply 3 offered by: Derek Zahn on 02-Feb-1999

Heh, I have some printing wishes as
well, but since I use NWC as a composition
tool rather than as a pretty-printer they
are secondary in importance to me. But
there are a few things I'd like (again,
maybe these are possible but I haven't
figured them out):

1. It would be nice if the label for
a grand staff would be centered between
the two staves rather than each staff
having its own label (as an option, so
I can label it "piano").

2. Even with the options set as suggested
elsewhere on this site, the music takes
up too much horizontal space.

3. I'd like an alternate label for the staffs
on page two and so on, like the scores I
buy at the bookstore.

4. (suggested elsewhere I think): the option to
not show a staff at all if the whole line is
just rests (again, like the scores I buy).

derek
(but gimme "note properties" first, haha)

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Feb-1999

These are all great wishes but like all wishes must be tempered with patience.
The right place for wishes is in the Wish List.
Please duplicate your wishes there where NoteWorthy Support will find them.

Reply 5 offered by: Sue Morton on 03-Feb-1999

Hi Derek,

Great Wishes! Please put them in the Wish List area of the NWC site, as suggested. Wishes do come true!

Regarding your original message item #1, transposing selected notes only instead of whole staff, if you truly mean transpose key in the purest sense, you can copy and paste your selected notes to a new (temporary) blank staff (be sure you have the right key sig inserted), transpose the staff, then copy and paste the results back to your original staff. Takes a bit of work, but works.

If you don't really want to transpose in the technical sense, but just want to move the notes (and add the accidentals yourself afterward to complete the key change) -- works OK for small sections -- you can select the notes you want to move up or down on the staff, then hold down SHIFT and CTRL keys and use the up or down arrows to move the block of notes up or down on the staff. Then add the key sig, accidentals etc.

There may be other ways; these work OK for me.

Sue

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 05-Feb-1999

My comments...

Derek - 3. Lets get all the standard music notation supported, like trills, glissandos, 8va, hairpin crescendo, etc.

Not just notes, but every music element should have properties - at least a Visible property.

Rebecca - 1.55 eliminates the space between master section close bar lines and the end of the piece. You do this in the Staff Properties (F2), not exactly where I expected it.

Reply 7 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 12-Feb-1999

This sounds like version 3 to me, not even 2 (LOL)
But its good stuff, particularly about tremolo.
I also want to point out one more thing; Ability to control accenting. On a previous string concerning this a friend provided a table of the standard accenting values for NWC. What would be particularly useful would be control of each single accent, in both a positive and a negative way; so one could put a -30 value or a +30 (the standard, I think), with the sign over the note having the respective shape; ">" for positive values and "<" for negative values. This would overcome accenting problems particularly faced in drum scores where use of mpc's affects all the drumming instruments and not one only (e.g. Base drum AND cymbal instead of Cymbal only).

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Feb-1999

For now, a partial workaround would be to give each instrument in the drum kit its own staff, which could optionally be layered to give a single visual staff. This way each instrument (bass, snare, HH, etc.) could have its own dynamics and accents (though not volume MPC's, since they affect the entire channel). Just be sure that all of the drum channels are assigned to the same midi channel (usually 10).


#1056: MIDI in/out with Notebooks
MIDI in/out with Notebooks

(1056)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 03-Feb-1999

I mentioned this in msg #1049, but I think it deserves its own thread. Does anyone know of a laptop/notebook which has both MIDI in *and* out? Sue Morton's has only MIDI in, and Pico (England) don't have MIDI out (they say). Perhaps using a port replicator does the trick. Or is it simply an unfortunate limitation of the sound system incorporated in notebooks? A pity if this is the case - a fully configureable notebook and keyboard would be a formidable combination!

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 03-Feb-1999

Hi Peter,

I ran into this site while searching the net for something else:

http://wholesalemusic.com/keyboard/midiman/index.html

They sell a serial in/out MIDI card for laptops, perhaps this will help.

I also found:

http://www.byteit.com/rgrace/sound.htm

This fellow worked with a wavetable synth made for laptops by Roland... I haven't tracked down the specs on the actual card he mentions but perhaps if you checked it out it might have midi in/out built in.

Good Luck!

Sue

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 05-Feb-1999

Thanks, Sue, I've had a look at your links - Verrry interesting! I'll certainly follow them up and post info on the Forum as and when.

Peter.

Reply 3 offered by: Adam Bodkin on 05-Feb-1999

Soory for the late reply. I use a Twinhead Notebook for all of my music, and it supports the Midi in and out via the game port. I've never had a problem with it, and you are right, very formidable:-)
Adam


#1057: Inserting scores into other files
Inserting scores into other files

(1057)

Submitted by: Alec Brady on 03-Feb-1999

I'm looking for a way to insert a score into a word-processor file (I use MS Word 97) so I can print out a song book. To date what I do is print out the score, scan it, save it as a .gif and insert it as a picture. Does anyone have any better ideas?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 03-Feb-1999

Do a print preview in Noteworthy.
If all is as you expect for the page then click on copy.

This can copy the page as it would be printed into the clipboard (16 bit and 32 bit versions differ slightly I think).

Swap to Word and then select edit paste. This will paste that page into word. Check to see that the words at the end of lines (if any) are all completely printed. Sometimes the words get chopped off. If this happens, you need to play around with the margins and the font sizes or even put some spaces at the end of the bar causing problems.

Use the same procedure for all pages.

H.T.H.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 04-Feb-1999

Also have a look at msg #767 and msg #713 for earlier in depth discussions.


#1058: Inserting Pauses!
Inserting Pauses!

(1058)

Submitted by: Andrew on 04-Feb-1999

I've noticed in the samples there are some pauses but when I want to put one in I haven't been able to find a command that inserts a pause and I looked in the help section and that didn't help me. So could some one tell me how to do that. It would be very much appreiciated!

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 04-Feb-1999

I suppose that, like in french, a pause is a rest that has the duration of a whole note. Then, you shall first select the whole note duration (for instance strike the "1" key on the numeric keypad), then strike the space bar.

That's all !

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 04-Feb-1999

Divided by a common language again!

Americans call a pause a 'Fermata'

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 04-Feb-1999

Oh! In french it is a "point d'orgue" (or "point d'arrêt" in case it is over a french "pause" !). Then, Andrew, try to insert a fermata...

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Feb-1999

See msg #13, msg #616


#1059: In praise of Noteworthy
In praise of Noteworthy

(1059)

Submitted by: Eric James on 04-Feb-1999

For a long time now I've wanted to express how delighted I am with Noteworthy Composer. I've become pretty cynical over the years with all things computer. To me, the term "user friendly" is pretty much a cruel joke. But not with Noteworthy. I've never had a problem with the program since I first installed it, nor with the many upgrades. The program works. Despite all sorts of disasters which have befallen my computer, Noteworthy has always run as reliably as ever.

I'm quite aware of the program's limitations but the support and workarounds offered by the programers and fellow users is fantastic. One day I will splurge for a new computer, printer, scanner and Sibelius but until then I won't even entertain the idea of anything in between. I consider Noteworthy one of the best investments I've made ever.

Reply 1 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 05-Feb-1999

I second your thoughts wholeheartedly.

By today standards about user fiendliness, support, generosity about updates, bug fixes, product hype and corporate boasting... NWC is a rare beast.

I only wonder how much time this can last. In any case, thanks Eric for such a nice product.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 05-Feb-1999

Yes, this is a great product.

This kind of thread has been started a few times. For example, http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/0/437.htm (or can I just say msg #437 ?)

It would be nice if this reply box would tell you how to put in links! I forget how to link other threads.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair again on 05-Feb-1999

OK. Link to threads using ! and the thread number. Look at the URL to see what number it is. For example, this page is 1059 because the URL is http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1059.htm#reply2

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Feb-1999

Just click the Help link to review the special mechanisms in the forum...

Reply 5 offered by: danb on 14-Jun-1999

as a result of your recommendations i'm going to get a copy of this product


#1060: SoundBlaster Live and MIDI Effects
SoundBlaster Live and MIDI Effects

(1060)

Submitted by: Brad Powell on 04-Feb-1999

I have a SoundBlaster Live and would like to apply its real-time effects to NoteWorthy's output. It looks like I have to use NoteWorthy to write a value (0..127) to MIDI controllers 91 and/or 93. Any suggestions?? Here are two relevant questions from the SB Live FAQ:

Q: It seems as if the Environmental Audio control with the Sound Blaster Live! affects every sound source except MIDI. How do I apply Environmental Audio to my MIDI files?

A: Go to the MIDI tab in the Environmental Audio Control where you can assign effects to your MIDI tracks via Controller messages.

Q: How do I use Environmental Audio or reverbs in my MIDI sequence? I could not add the effects by mapping to a MIDI controller in my MIDI sequencer.

A: You can use a maximum of two simultaneous effects in your MIDI sequence. This is done in the MIDI tab of the Environmental Audio applet. By default, Reverb and Chorus effects are accessible via MIDI controller 91 and 93 respectively. To use another effect such as Distortion, you first need to unmap one of these and then assign that effect to any of the available MIDI controllers. Set the effect amount and parameters to your preference in the Environmental Audio applet. You can control the level of effects in the event list of your MIDI sequencer. A value of 127 indicates that you want the full amount as set in the Environmental Audio panel to be applied to the MIDI track.

Reply 1 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 05-Feb-1999

Unfortunately it seems as you can't specify values for MIDI controllers 91 and 93 inside NWC. It would be a very welcome feature and I think not so difficult to implement, at least as staff properties.

Usually I export to MIDI all my NWC scores and load them in Cakewalk just to insert at the beginning of each track a suitable value for Reverb and Chorus. Well, and also to add some delay to tracks, a feature which would also be welcome but no so easy to implement, I think.

Reply 2 offered by: Shane Turner on 05-Feb-1999

Yes, this would be a very welcome feature in Noteworthy. I have to do the exact same thing you do.. export as a midi.. then add in the chorus/reverb/harmony effects externally. Everytime I update the original song I have to do it all over again, a real pain.
Maybe its something we should all submit to the wishlist.

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 12-Feb-1999

So, let me get something strait, can or can't one enter novel midi controllers in NWC?

Reply 4 offered by: Shane Turner on 13-Feb-1999

So far you can only choose from a list of five controllers..
stereo pan, pitch bend, volume, tempo, and breath control.

Reply 5 offered by: reggie mcbride on 02-Feb-2002

what if the reverb in the midi window of the enviromental audio says not mappable


#1061: Printing the signature just in the first line
Printing the signature just in the first line

(1061)

Submitted by: Hernando Silva Varela on 05-Feb-1999

When printing, is it possible to print the signature just
in the first line of the sheet rather than in all of them ?
It is only a matter of taking the most of the space in the
sheets.

Thanks.


#1062: Messiah Project or ?????
Messiah Project or ?????

(1062)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 06-Feb-1999

Our local community auditorium has been refurbished, and for it's grand opening celebration, we are performing -- the Messiah! (March is a strange time of year for it, but the Community Director is retiring. This will be his last Messiah performance, he has been doing it every couple of years since 1962!)

Through the NWC Scriptorium, I had found the Messiah Project just before Christmas, and I downloaded the files posted there. But the site seems to have disappeared from the web... was it not an ongoing project?

Anyhow, I could really use NWC or MIDI files to practice with. I have a commercial recording, which is helpful, but MIDI is so much better for me since I can isolate my part, slow it down, etc.

Does anyone know where I can get NWC or MIDI files for some or all of the Messiah? We start practicing March 1 and I'd like to be as prepared as possible! Thanks as always,

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: Sue again... on 06-Feb-1999

I see I misspoke... What I meant to say is, I'd prefer NWC files above MIDI, and MIDI files above my commercial CD recording for my practice...

I just found the complete score in MIDI at Classical MIDI Archives, I had forgotten about them. So I modify my original query: Does anyone know where I can get NWC file versions? Thanks!

Sue

Reply 2 offered by: fred on 06-Feb-1999

Hi Sue,

Just checked the link from the Scriptorium, it's working now so maybe there was just a temporary glitch. The "work in progress" TMP URL is:

http://www.guysfield.demon.co.uk/messiah/

Regards,
Fred

Reply 3 offered by: Joseph O. Morrow on 23-Feb-1999

Yes,
I have some parts of the Messiah as .nwc files:

including: Halleluia, Worthy is the Lamb (w/Amen), All We Like Sheep, etc.

Sorry, the lyrics are not included, even though the voice parts are unchanged. The accompaniments are somewhat my own, however; but you may enjoy them.

How can I get them to you?

j o s e p h

Reply 4 offered by: Sue Morton on 23-Feb-1999

Hi Joseph!

Thank you for offering to share your Messiah files with me. Do you have access to the NWC newsgroup? If so, you could compress/zip them up and post them there. Perhaps others would enjoy them, too.

If not, use my e-mail addy and send me a zip file (or send individual NWC compressed files), as my e-mail system accepts attachments. (I assume yours can send them?)

Thanx!

Sue

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Feb-1999

Hi Joseph,

I highly recommend that you get in touch with the fine people at The Messiah Project, I'm sure that they would welcome your participation. To make the final result more-or-less consistent, there are some guidelines (volume settings, patches, etc.) for contributors. Just click on the URL in the previous message, this will take you to the "in progress" TMP site.

Fred

Reply 6 offered by: Sue Morton on 28-Feb-1999

Fred Writes: "I highly recommend that you get in touch with the fine people at The Messiah Project, I'm sure that they would welcome your participation."

Matt and Company, are you reading this? I have e-mailed you twice (once just before Christmas, once right after I saw your site was updated 2/6), and have never received a reply. Did you not receive my e-mails? I sent them to this address: matt@guysfield.demon.co.uk

I have not otherwise had trouble with AOL, so I have wondered why I've not heard from you. Please respond. Thanks.

Sue


#1063: NoteWorthy Composer vs. Alternatives
NoteWorthy Composer vs. Alternatives

(1063)

Submitted by: Danilo Almeida on 09-Feb-1999

A friend of mine gave me a copy of NoteWorthy Composer that he had downloaded but had never had the time to try out. I gave it a try and loved it. Before buying it, however, I would like to know what experience people have had with other products.

My friend had tried some version of Cakewalk and was very unimpressed with ease of use. When I showed him the copy of NoteWorthy he had given me, he was impressed that it seemed to be able to do the things he wanted.

Does anyone have any experieces with other products that they would like to share?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Feb-1999

Tall order. But I'll give it a try. I've extensively used Cubasis Audio and Cubasis AV, and while there are some things I still use them for, NWC is by far my preferred program. I've also used Cakewalk, Performer (on Macintosh), Mozart, and probably a half-dozen other programs in my quest for the most flexible music composition program. I've even dabbled briefly with the awful MusixTex (and the adjective I just used should give an idea of what I think of it). It's important to me to have a program that is fast and easy to use, flexible in formatting, gives good printed output, allows easy PostScript exporting, import/exports midi, and is capable of giving a good midi "performance." While all of the programs I've tried did some of these things well, NWC is the only one I've found that does all of them.

Add the incredible support network that has grown around this amazing program (of which this Forum is only one small part) and you have a bargain the likes of which I've never seen in my 20-or-so years of computer dabbling.

Buy it! You won't regret it.

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 10-Feb-1999

"Buy it! You won't regret it."

I echo Fred's sentiments to the letter. Sure, there's things NWC doesn't do (but we're working on it via the Wish List!), but there is SO MUCH IT DOES DO.

As Fred already pointed out, the support network is nothing short of TERRIFIC! I challenge you to find the same level of support, as provided here by Noteworthy Artware and users of NWC, on any other product. The support has been worth a great deal to me, as there is nothing more frustrating than to have a question about a feature, how it works, how to do it, etc., and have to wait days or weeks for an answer from a vendor (or pay $25 per phone call just to ask the question.) There is so much of NWC I haven't even tapped yet, but when I do and need help, here is where I'll come. I'll get all the help I need, including clever workarounds to wishes not yet granted!

Buy it.

Reply 3 offered by: Chris on 10-Feb-1999

I have used both MusicProse and Finale from Coda Software. MusicProse is no longer available, however I would compare it favorably with NWC. There are a few features it has that NWC does not (I've put them on my wish list), however that program was over 4 times as much to purchase as NWC. Finale is an extremely powerful program with an amazing array of features. Yet, learning the program takes an equally amazing amount of time. Also, Finale is almost 10 times the cost of NWC (and that is at the academic/institution discount). Many of the limitations of NWC are not as bad as they seem if you are creative and use the tips and tricks offered by experienced users. For the price and ease of use, I'd say NWC is the best value available.

Reply 4 offered by: Shane Turner on 11-Feb-1999

Living in the middle of nowhere, as I do, I really lucked out when a few years ago I found a copy of Noteworthy sitting on a shelf. Since I got the internet I downloaded just about any midi/notation program I could find. Noteworthy is still my first choice, I do not regret my purchase.

Reply 5 offered by: Sterghios Moschos  on 12-Feb-1999

My main instrument is drums and my secondary piano. Unfortunately neither are things one can easy transport between countries or by in pairs due to costs on both occasions. So this poor fella that is a student in the UK, away from his homeland, Greece, nearly lost his mind with the lack of music playing and writting. Until a friend gave him a copy of Cubase VST (don't tell Steinberg!). And after spending hours trying to learn about midi and Cubase, he thought he should give up music because that program was God's curse to musicians. Then my dear friend Nikos Hantzinikolaou pointed to me this program. Presently I use exclusively NWC to compose music for a band across Europe, and spend hours on end enjoying both its creational simplicity and its educational value. If one is into music (amateurely or professionally) and owns a computer, NWC is a MUST.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Feb-1999

Not to mention that if you need support from Steinberg... Rotsa Ruck!

Reply 7 offered by: Adam on 15-May-1999

I was lucky enough to discover NWC via the web, and having tried lots of alternatives, like Cubase (Unbelievably confusing at times), Cakewalk (Nice, but you have very little control over things like how many lyric lines you can have, and how big lyrics font is) NWC, although I've only had it a week, is the best. I wish it had some more features, like glissando marks, but I'm sure that will come. And what an amazing price!


#1064: Scanning in Music
Scanning in Music

(1064)

Submitted by: Marty J on 09-Feb-1999

Is one able to scan sheet music into the program.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Feb-1999

See msg #555, msg #603, msg #861


#1066: select a stave in one shot ?
select a stave in one shot ?

(1066)

Submitted by: Alain Falcoz on 11-Feb-1999

Is there a fast way to select a whole stave without dragging the mouse ?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 11-Feb-1999

On the computer keyboard, press Home, then Shift+End.

See also: msg #6

Reply 2 offered by: Alain Falcoz on 12-Feb-1999

Fast and efficient as always, thanks !

Alain


#1067: Swing?
Swing?

(1067)

Submitted by: James Smith on 11-Feb-1999

Is there any way to make quavers sound swung on playback.

Currently I have to create two staves, one for playback and the other for printing, mute the printing one and use dotted quavers and semi-quavers, this is very tiresome and a way around would be fully appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 11-Feb-1999

Check out Marsu's "NWC does Jazz" (I think that's what it's called) in the User Tips area.

Reply 2 offered by: James Smith on 12-Feb-1999

Thanks Fred


#1068: Midi Files
Midi Files

(1068)

Submitted by: Bull on 12-Feb-1999

When I import a midi file that has, say, three flats(E flat major) the score prints with sharps. It is easy to change all the affected notes or do you have do do each one manually?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Feb-1999

See msg #1026.


#1069: Three questions...
Three questions...

(1069)

Submitted by: Paul H. Borisoff on 12-Feb-1999

three questions.
1. When I have three whole notes tied across three bars. The tie runs from the first to the last, as opposed to one to another or three shorter, separate ones. Also when played on the system speaker, all notes are played and the tied ones sound too.

2. How do I transpose a small section of notes, like three or four bars that need to be raised an octave. (In the wrong octive)

3. I tried to make the staff fatter in the vertical direction on an existing piece, increasing
the upper staff number from 12 to 18 only increased the space between staffs. I am writing for solo violin. (one staff). I will try blocking the whole shebang and see what
happens.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 12-Feb-1999

Paul,

1.
I think that you have used a slur (keyboard semicolon ;) rather than a tie (keyboard slash /). If you highlight the first two notes (hold down the shift key and use the relevant arrow key) and then press the semicolon, you should remove the slur. While the notes are still highlighted, hit the forward slash (/) and the notes should then tie. This will then only sound once instead of three times.

2.
There are two different methods to easily raise or lower a group of notes by an octave. The first is to highlight all of the notes that you want to raise. Then hold down both the control and shift keys and while you are doing this, press the up arrow 7 times.

The second method is to insert a new clef with an octave up instruction. Remember to place another clef without an octave change at the end of the section.

3. Not sure what you mean here but try the magnifying glass to make the staff bigger. For printing purposes you may wish to try a larger points size. (Page setup then the options tab)

Hope this helps

Richard


#1070: Using soundcard extra midi controllers
Using soundcard extra midi controllers

(1070)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 12-Feb-1999

I was wondering always why NWC does not provide under the mpc all of the soundcards' midi control devices such as modulation, reverb, chorus and sustain. Then it occured to me that probably the soundcards available in the market do not have the same controller addresses (?) for the same functions (apart from the main ones such as volume and pan positioning) or that they do not all provide these effects.
Maybe in one of the forthcoming versions NWC will provide such support for the most widely used soundcards, information easily obtained by a survey performed on this website. However it would be interesting to know how one can enter such midi controler commands in the scores so that they can be activated and performed during playback.

Reply 1 offered by: Shane Turner on 13-Feb-1999

Many midi programs let you choose from a list of 0-127 controllers... it would be nice if Noteworthy could be customized to add the controllers you wanted to use, especially since Noteworthy has such a nice menu for setting controllers. Easy to do pans, volume fadeouts.. would be nice with things like chorus.. etc.


#1071: Looking for Tchaikovsky's "Dance of the Swans"
Looking for Tchaikovsky's "Dance of the Swans"

(1071)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 12-Feb-1999

I have spent a few hours on the net trying to locate the scores for the "Dance of the Swans" part of Tchaikovsky's Swan Lake (or whatever it's called in English... :) ), but with no luck. I would appreciate it if anyone has it available, prefferably on midi format, for orchestra.

My band wish to cover it and I am supposed to figure out what each instrument should play, replacing parts of the classical orchestra. I promise not to make the master's bones rattle in his grave...

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 16-Feb-1999

Try AltaVista http://www.altavista.com/ enter a query like:

+Tchaikovsky +swan +lake +midi

I got 268 hits, I'm sure at least one of them has what
you're looking for

Reply 2 offered by: Behzad on 02-Aug-2001

hello
I want the note of Swan Lake from Tchaikovsky, also I have NoteWorthy Composer in my computer.thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 03-Aug-2001

As John Gillings suggested, try importing a midi file into NWC. Stuff like this should work fine (with the right import settings) except for triplets, which will invariably end up looking messy. My first port of call would be the Classical midi archives at
http://www.classicalarchives.com/tchai.html

HTH


#1072: Transposing
Transposing

(1072)

Submitted by: Kenneth Scott on 13-Feb-1999

I am arranging a peice for a braas band, and Iam using Noteweothy to do so.

The whole band play b flat instruments except:

Soprano Cornet
Tenor Horn
E flat Bass

The three instruments above are all in e flat.

I have tried to compose so they are in the same key as the b flats by taking it down a fifth. It doesn't seem to be working , Am i doing something wrong. I also tried taking it upa fourth but this did help either.

The peice is in a really annoying key of D flat major.

Please help.!!

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 13-Feb-1999

If you search using keyword "transpose" or "transposition" you'll find this topic is recurrent. Handling this problem is one of NWC's more elegant features.
Assuming you have a piece of sheet music in hand which was written for a Bb instrument-
Enter the piece exactly as written key signatures et al.
If you print and have a Bb musician play the printed score or have the musician play along from the screen you will find that the musician and the computer will be playing two semitones apart plus or minus 0, 12, 24, etc, semitones as octave differences.
Staff\Staff Properties\Midi\Transposition -2 will change the pitch the computer plays without changing the visible notes. +10, -14, +22, are also available for octave changes.
You should now have one Bb staff that the musician and the computer can play in unison.
Staff\New Staff
Select the staff with the Bb part. (click on it)
Home
Shift-end
Edit\Copy
Select the new staff.
Edit\Paste
You should now have two copies of the Bb Part.
Tools\Transpose Staff\+7 semitones{leave the checkmark}
A part which the Eb instrument can play in unison with the Bb and the computer will result unless an octave difference exists. The key will have changed automatically. Tools\Transpose Staff\+12 or -12{box checked} can be used to move the Eb instrument up or down an octave in its range.
Search "enharmonic" spelling when you find you don't like the key the program selcted.
Good luck, benevenuto.


#1073: Shaped Notes
Shaped Notes

(1073)

Submitted by: John on 13-Feb-1999

Is there an option in Noteworthy to change the round note text to the traditional shapped notes, do, re, me, amd so forth? If not does anyone know where I can find a program that will write in shapped notes? Thank you for your time. John.

Reply 1 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 14-Feb-1999

I have never seen an option in NWC to use shaped notes. I also have never heard of a sequencer or notation program that would accomplish this. I shall watch this message thread though, and see if someone names one that would do this. I think it would be sorta cool!
Gordon

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 14-Feb-1999

I have a need to have configurable note heads, as well. Sometime back (way back) I put in the NWC Wish List to give an option to make the notehead an "x", for spoken places in the staff that need some rhythym (and so you'd still use quarter notes, eighth notes, etc.) Especially good with the kids' songs.

Why don't you add shaped notes to the wish list as another idea for "configurable notes"? My wish hasn't been granted yet, but you never know... : >

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 16-Feb-1999

I also think that user-definable note-heads would be handy.
Please forward the request to the wish-list.
There are other programs which implement this (no names come to mind at the moment, but I would expect all the multi-hundred dollar ones to do it).

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Tony Huddleston on 09-Mar-1999

If necessary, I would pay for an upgrade to allow the creation of shaped notes. I hope this option will be considered. Thank you.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Bowers on 09-Mar-1999

While user configurable note heads are definitely on my list of things I would like to see. Lets remember that shaped notes are a bit more complicated. It is not just a matter of changing the note heads to different shapes, the notes would have to change depending on the key signature that you were using in order for "do" to correspond to the key note. Transposition becomes quite a bit more challenging.

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 10-Mar-1999

>> Note shape depends on key.

This is true, and is truly complicated.

>> Transposition becomes more difficult.

I don't think so. The beauty of shape notes is that
transposition doesn't change the shapes--just shifts them
on the staff. You'd probably need an "audit shape notes"
tool, which wouldn't be any more complicated than handling
shape on note entry.

Reply 7 offered by: John on 11-Mar-1999

Shaped Notes are most often used by singers and vocalist. It is true that the (DO) is placed on whatever line or space of the initial key signature, and a change of one key would either be a (TE) or a (RE), depending on whether you go up or down. Also the standard seven notes take on a different name when you sharp or flat them. I was taught that all songs begin and end with a tonic chord, (DO, ME, SO, DO). All this is really irevelent, because it should be a simple feat for a programer to add a function that after you write a song in round notes, the computer could just transpose the score for you. Now having said all that let me say this, A song wrote in shaped notes is NOT played any different than a song wrote in round notes. Any trained quartet singer can read his notes and automatically switch from a (DO) to a (SO), or any other example you can think of. This is most difficult with round notes, because if you sing you could'nt really care less what line or space the note is on, only what shape is it? Piano (or whatever your instrument) players could'nt care less what shape a note is, only what line or space is it on? Players would'nt care if all notes were shaped like chicken heads. This is why it is important to have notes that the singers can read.
Thank you for your time, and for bearing with me.
John

Reply 8 offered by: Tony Huddleston on 11-Mar-1999

I just have one more comment. I wouldn't expect anything elaborate. Shaped notes are primarily for singing melodies that are relatively simple, such as hymns. A way to do it, even if it wasn't very sophisticated, would be nice.

Tony

Reply 9 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Mar-1999

(Please note new e-mail address for those interested).
I've been singing as long as I can remember and since I started reading music have *always* used standard notation. I take my hat off to those who can read tonic sol-fa - it seems to me to be extraordinarily cluttered at times, and surely slower to convert into pitch than standard notation - a series of runs in a Bach motet would be horrendous! Having said that, I dare say a trained sol-fa singer would prove me wrong, but I tend to agree with Tony's comment in reply 8 - <Shaped notes are primarily for singing melodies that are relatively simple, such as hymns>.
But most certainly crossed head notes would be extremely useful, for spoken passages and percussion. One for the wish list!

Peter.

Reply 10 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 12-Mar-1999

The normal arrangement of shaped notes is just like round notes: placed on a staff, with tails, flags, open and
filled-in shapes, dots, etc.: and a trained musician would have no trouble.

The shapes are for 1) untrained 2) singers 3) trying to harmonize 4) unfamiliar 5) a-cappella music.

1) Trained musicians don't need them, and can ignore them.
2) As normally used, shapes are keyed to the key--this is not a useful concept for a musical instrument that plays absolute notes: and for instruments like guitars, chord notation is more useful.
3) A simple melody doesn't gain much from note shapes. But for an untrained (or informally trained) singer trying to read unfamiliar words quickly, pick out a specific part from multipart harmony on two staves, blend with other voices, the shapes give a quick indication of what chord is intended as well as what part a particular voice plays in it.
4) It doesn't take much practice with any particular song to get past the point where shape notes are useful. Once you've heard the harmonies sung correctly and you know where your part fits in, the shapes can be ignored.
5) If you have instrumental accompaniment, you can use it to fill in the harmonies. Only if that is not available are you compelled to get whatever harmonies will be gotten, from the untrained voices.

In a culture where entertainment music is provided by electronic technologies, there is very limited demand for "high folk" music from "low-trained" folk: thus, the only place you'll be likely to see shape notes is in churches where a-cappella congregational singing is considered an essential part of worship.

Reply 11 offered by: John on 24-Mar-1999

Well I hope this is the last time I am compelled to pen a reply on this matter. However, after reading reply # 10, offered by Stephen Hutcheson, I must say I am offended and insulted.
He attemptes to make the point that shaped notes are for the untrained. <1) Trained musicians don't need them, and can ignore them.> This is hardly a point, musicians don't need them because they were never intended for musicians in the first place. (THEY ARE FOR SINGERS.)
I am not totally in disagreement with his statement #2.
However his statement #3 is simply wrong. <3) A simple melody doesn't gain much from note shapes. But for an untrained (or informally trained) singer trying to read unfamiliar words quickly, pick out a specific part from multipart harmony on two staves, blend with other voices, the shapes give a quick indication of what chord is intended as well as what part a particular voice plays in it.> I can not begin to tell you how many things are wrong with this quote. First off, a melody is not supposed to gain from shaped notes, the melody is the same wether the melody is shaped or round notes. Secondly, untrained (or informally trained)people do not read shaped notes. Third, the shapes give NO indication of the chord being intended, this is determined by there position.
Now lets move on to statement #4 <4) It doesn't take much practice with any particular song to get past the point where shape notes are useful. Once you've heard the harmonies sung correctly and you know where your part fits in, the shapes can be ignored.> RIDICULOUS, Absolute Fantasy, I suppose this fellow only sings things that he can first hear someone else sing, that way he can memorize his part and not bother with reading any notes, (Which is a good thing considering his knowledge of them.) What do you suppose would happen if this guy had to sing a song he had never heard, (be a real good thing if you could read notes at this point,) it might not go over too well.
Forgive me for saying this but it is rather infuriating for someone who knows so little about what there saying to be here speaking as an expert, it almost makes me wish I would never have started this thread. Only one word of advice, in the future, when you don't know what your talking about, keep your mouth shut.
Thanks,
John

Reply 12 offered by: John on 24-Mar-1999

CONTINUATION OF REPLY #11

Here's an exert from response #10, <5) If you have instrumental accompaniment, you can use it to fill in the harmonies. Only if that is not available are you compelled to get whatever harmonies will be gotten, from the untrained voices.> THIS IS JUST INSULTING. So insulting I am having trouble composing a response that lets me keep my statis as a gentleman.
Moving on, His final statements,<there is very limited demand for "high folk" music from "low-trained" folk:>
These sir are fighting words. I will not sit by and be blindly run down by someone of your limited foresight. Most of what you say has a funny smell about it. Keep that in mind please.
John...................

Reply 13 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 24-Mar-1999

I'm not sure exactly what offended John. Set the pistol down, carefully, ... we're all on the same side ... I think. At any rate, I have also asked for shape notes, and if I had them, I would use them exclusively.

1) Singers are not musicians? Not my meaning: I'll call anyone who makes music a "musician." I differentiate between vocal and instrumental music, and agree that shape notes are useful only for the former.

2) I was thinking of "training" primarily as in "reading music" and not "voice control." I suppose there are groups who concentrate on "voice training" and skip the musical theory; I haven't had contact with any, though.

3) Part of standard musical training is to sight-read the standard round notation, from the lines. [My training, though, was cut very short and mostly forgotten, and I still find the shapes helpful. Without shape notes, I do not believe I could sing, say, tenor, on a song I had never before heard or studied.]

4) I can see that I expressed myself poorly. It is, of course, the singer, not the song, that gains from shape notes. What I should have said is that, in my experience 1) Nobody seems to publish unharmonized melodies in shape notes, 2) People who sing the melody don't seem to be aware of them, and 3) I find them much more helpful reading other parts than I do reading the melody. 4) The first observation seems to indicate that the last two can be generalized.

4) may seem like fantasy, but I assure you that I have worked with untrained singers, and many people learn songs in just this way. In congregational singing (where you can't expect members to have any musical training), there are many people who learn songs only this way, and if you want to introduce new songs (which I do), you have to take them into account. And there are many more (like me) who can only sight-read "a little:" these are the ones for whom shape notes are particularly important. I have introduced many songs I had never heard before into such an environment,
and exerted considerable effort trying to get as "high-folk" music as possible without excluding "low-folk" voices.

It is a lot of effort, and most religious groups faced with this problem avoid it: either replacing congregational singing (with choirs or performing bands) or recommending that the congregation sing only the melody (while filling in the harmony with a choir or organ.) Neither of these is an option for us.

I didn't mean to confuse, much less insult, anyone who will support my plea for shape notes. Those of us who want to introduce acappella music to untrained singers find them indispensable.

Reply 14 offered by: Blair Dowden on 25-Mar-1999

All right, so there is a need for shaped notes, even if we don't all agree on how they should be used. Lets have a proposal. Let the user define a note shape with a character in a font, and a point size adjustment for staff scaling. What about half and whole notes - do we need a separate character for these? Now, how do we place the note on the staff? I guess it is a note property (which does not exist yet, but should, if only to give it an invisible setting).

All I need is the note with the x as a head, but this is more general.

Reply 15 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 25-Mar-1999

Blair,

I'm not sure that this is more general. I tend to think that shape notes are more specific. I have not come across them, but then I've been a musician for much longer than I've been a vocalist! ;-)

I don't expect that I would need them, but if there are many users who ask, and it does get implemented, I'm sure that definable/configurable noteheads would be a spin-off that would benefit others of us, too.

From what I have just read, shape notes provide a set of cues based on the shape of the note head (I'd love to see and example - anyone got any?). I imagine they might prove useful to jazz improvisation as well, but I doubt they get used in that genre. Anyhow, NWC would need to include an "Audit Shape Notes" tool that went through and adjusted each note head to be different. Hence EVERY note would need to be editable to have its notehead defined, and hence the spin-off for us "drumheads" who just want Xs and diamonds.

A

Reply 16 offered by: Blair Dowden on 25-Mar-1999

From the heated discussion above, I would not want to make any assumptions about what shapes these notes should be! Like you, I just want the little x's.

Reply 17 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 26-Mar-1999

1) Yes, there are different "shape note" schemes. There are two or three that are used by "preservationist" organizations: see samples and historical detail from the sites listed by the Open Directory Project: "http://dmoz.org/Society/Religion/Faiths_and_Beliefs/Christianity/Music/Hymns/Shape_Notes/." Some of these groups suppor t new compositions in the historical style of music, and set with the historically appropriate shape notes (and so would be in the market for composing software)

For these shapes, the stem attachment would be an issue: they go to the middle top or (middle bottom) of a note rather than the side. (Chords are not done on one stem, or generally even on one staff.)

The most common shapes in "common" use are the 7-shape "Aiken" scheme, which at least use the standard sideband stem, although the stem might need to be continued to the top or bottom of a note, and some shapes are flipped depending on which way the stem goes.

In all these schemes, half and whole notes are the same shape as the respective quarter notes, just outline instead of solid.

I won't mention neumes if you won't.

Reply 18 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 26-Mar-1999

>>I won't mention neumes if you won't.<<

No, we're very polite here and don't call people rude neumes.

A

Reply 19 offered by: Tony Huddleston on 27-Mar-1999

The type of shaped notes with which I am familiar are defined as follows: do-equilateral triangle, re-upside down semicircle (like a cup with a line across the top), mi-diamond, fa-right triangle with one side of the right angle on the staff (like a flag), sol-round (same as ordinary note), la-rectangle (longest side on the bottom), and ti-similar to a triangle with point down and curved on top. (like an ice-cream cone).

There are only SIX shapes here that are new. That's all that I would need. However, I don't know the name of this system and was not aware there were others. By the way, accidentals do not change the shape of a note, even though the pitch would be altered.

Reply 20 offered by: John on 27-Mar-1999

Directed to all, but espicially Stephen Hutcheson.
Please forgive me for my earlier outburst, it was uncalled for. I only ask that you realize that I have so much respect and admiration for people that sight read unfimiliar notes that I have a hard time with anyone calling them "Simple Folk". It is unquestionable that I am very passionate about the matter, and I ask everyone to overlook my venting.
Sorry,
John

Reply 21 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Mar-1999

Its getting complicated (if more polite). So we need not only a font, character and point size, but also stem placement information (side or middle; to top or bottom of note), possibly a second character depending on stem direction. Then someone needs to produce the fonts.

Forget having them built into the product - its clear that there is an unending variety of these things.

Still, all I want is the little "x"!

Reply 22 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Mar-1999

Forgive if I seem dense, but never having seen notes like this I don't quite get it... does this mean that all notes are on a single staff line? Is the purpose compactness? How are octaves handled?

For my purposes also, I would like to have little x-shaped noteheads, maybe diamonds also.

Reply 23 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 29-Mar-1999

Tony: What you described is the "Aiken" system. It is the only one I have ever used, or even seen in a modern book.

Fred: The shaped notes are placed on the staff just like round notes: and take the same space. In the modern "Aiken" system, four voices are printed on two staves, as usual. The shape is, strictly speaking, "redundant:" Anyone could look at a round note on a staff and figure out which shape it ought to be, given the key signature. It's "just" an extra visual clue to facilitate sight reading.

On the "historical" schemes (including Aiken when it was first introduced), each voice was on a different staff (but still positioned just like a round note. I think this was to facilitate creating music fonts (in lead type) -- it would be hard to have all the possible two-note chord characters created.

Any of these schemes will seem wierd if you haven't used them. They were "Yankee experiments" of the early nineteenth century: just some of many attempts to make musical notation less mysterious to the uninitiated (and musical books more usable on the frontier.)

Reply 24 offered by: John on 01-Apr-1999

Blair.....Concerning stem placement.
If you only change the note shape itself, this would not affect the stem placement. The only difference would be the very end of the note. Instead of all notes being round, most would vary in shape, a triangle, rectangle, dimond and some that are not easily explained. However, Tony in reply 19 does a good job explaining them. There is even a round note. The staff, staff position, and flags would remain unchainged. Also, all notes would still be roughly the same size, looking at them from several feet away, you probably could'nt even tell that they were'nt all round.

Fred.......Stephen is correct in reply 23....
Four voices are printed on two staves. Corresponding to the four natural divisions of the human voice. These are, naming them in regular order from the lowest to the highest, Bass, Tenor, Alto, Soprano. Between the bass and tenor there is another voice called Baritone. Between the alto and soprano there is another voice called Mezzo-Soprano. An extra low and heavy alto voice is often called Contralto. However traditional shaped notes are written for the first four voices that I named. The names of these voices change depending on if it is a man or woman singing the part.
An example would be, a man sings First-Tenor, (This is a different Tenor from the one I listed earlier, in this situation that would become Second-Tenor.) a woman singing the same part would be singing Alto. A man sings Lead, a woman singing the same part would be singing Soprano.

An answer to an earlier question.......
Someone ask if the shaped notes would affect rests. The answer is no, a rest would look like it always has, and would be used in the same manner.

Also the use of sharps and flats or dotted notes, or any thing else you can think of will not be affected. you would have the same use of them you have always had.

Stephen.........
The shaped note system goes back to Italian syllables (Sol-fa). I do not know how old this system is, but we can all agree that it is very old. Also, could you give me an example of a situation you project in your last reply? <"it would be hard to have all the possible two-note chord characters created.">..I'm not certain I understand what could not be created....
Thanks
Hoped I helped clear some of this up.
John.

Reply 25 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 01-Apr-1999

Shape notes and fonts: a clarification.

In the early eighteenth century, music publishers began to experiment with fonts for musical notation. Each "letter" would have the five lines of the staff all the way across;
in addition, there would be a "letter" for each weight of rest, for accidentals in each position on the staff, and for notes of each duration and position on the staff. Counting, say, 15 staff positions (including risers and descenders),
5 or 6 note types + dots and accidentals, you'd need more than 150 separate "characters" (besides clefs, measure bars, etc.)

It would be very simple for any experienced typesetter to set music for a single melodic line on a staff with such a scheme. If you used four shape notes, you'd need four such fonts, but you'd only use one at a time on each staff.

But suppose you tried to typeset chords this way: instead of 15 note positions with one note each, there would be 15*15 possible combinations of two notes: times six note durations, and let's hope you never had two accidentals for the same chord ... anyway, your font tray would be too large. If you had to have chords on a staff, it would be time to send for the music engraver--a much less cost-efficient solution.

Or you could simply set each voice on a different staff: and this is what was often done.

Reply 26 offered by: Jerry Evans on 23-Nov-1999

Singers etal.

When at one of the many Gospel Singing Conventions, a leader often gets up and announces the number of a song that is totally unknown to all present including the leader. Near perfect harmony ensues from the congregation.

At the National Gospel Singing Convention I personally have experienced being called to the front to sing in a quartet. On the way up to the front I was given the music to a song that I had never seen nor heard.

Thank Goodness for shaped notes!

Usually six different song books are used at these conventions. For anyone interested in these books containing shaped notes contact me at jevans@vvm.com.

Jerry Evans
Bass singer from Texas

Reply 27 offered by: James on 21-Dec-1999

I happened upon this conversation just be accident. I find it very interesting. Shape notes have been a way of life for me and learned to use them at 8 years of age. I am a member of the Church of Christ and we sing a cappella, which encourages individual sight reading at times. Most of our song books are still printed in shape notes.

I have been teaching music at summer schools for many years and we teach shape notes because that is the only way to teach sight reading in a one week period, and we do it. The school is the Singing School at Abilene Christian University.

I also direct an a cappella gospel mixed chorus and most of the singers can read shape notes, which makes new pieces of music come to life within a short period of time. I print all our music with Coda's Finale which has shape note capability built in. For information about it, go to my web site at -

ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/James_Tackett

Most of us who sing have not had the opportunity to spend four years at a good college or university majoring in music so we can be "trained". I find very few "trained" musicians who can sing a new piece of music without the aid of an instrument. To me, that kind of training is worthless, if your purpose was to learn to sight read music. Shape notes are far better. Any time I hear someone laughing at shape notes and making fun of us who do, I just consider the source and feel sorry for them, knowing I can read music better than they can.

James

Reply 28 offered by: Sandra on 02-Feb-2000

I am interested in meeting with shaped note singers in the Dallas/Ft. Worth metroplex. I've figured out pretty much what to do and when, but would really appreciate learning and fine tuning the basics in a small group, or class setting so that I can then pass the techniques on to others. Thanks for any help any of you can supply.

Reply 29 offered by: Brenda Weaver on 07-May-2000

This discussion is so interesting. I have taught the Shaped Notes/Singing Schools for many years. For those who are Instrumentalists and (not) singers, they simply need to understand that Shaped Notes are read from the regular staff (just the same as round notes) - Accidentals are handled exactly the same way with no moving of the note, Also, anyone proficient in their note reading (and)or playing ability, can simply have a glorious and fun time singing (or) playing, but I must admit for my own part, having taught it, I personally would have to choose the "Pick up the Song Book and Just Sing It" A capello music can be the most beautiful singing there is (if) everyone involved sings his/her part properly and has excellent ability for counting time. I have so enjoyed everyone's comments on this page. It brings back so many wonderful memories. A man in a large church many years ago (who) is very negative toward The Shaped Note Music, spoke with me, saying this, "Shaped Notes" are (Inferior) to round notes. (Of course that was because he didn't have a Clue about Shaped Notes - I know many people who (think) they are actually sight reading, when in reality, they are only "guessing" a great deal of the time. Shaped Notes give the Singer a method to absolutely "perfect" (without error), his/her ability to sing any new piece of music without having ever seen it before and with no accompaniment. My greatest sadness about this style of music is that is has died out completely in many areas. We need to keep it alive and "kicking" so to speak in our various parts of the country There are so many folks who simply will (not) work at learning their music, of course that is their loss. Many of the Professional Gospel Singers have used this method in past years to improve their music reading skills. It works. (If) the Singer properly applies himself, (and) can carry a tune in a bucket, he cannot fail with this method. Does anyone out there share any of my thoughts on the subject?

Reply 30 offered by: Brenda Weaver on 07-May-2000

A P.S. Note - I apologize if I seem to be intruding in this wonderful discussion - Please forgive me for interjecting my thoughts. This is such a wonderful site, especially for those of us who love the subject matter being discussed. I personally thank each one for your thoughts and comments on the subject. Has anyone gotten much into the "Sacred Heart" Shaped Note thing?

Reply 31 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 20-May-2000

For information on "Sacred Harp" and other shape note communities on the web, check out the topic on the Open Directory:

http://dmoz.org/Society/Religion_and_Spirituality/Christianity/Music/Hymns/Shape_Notes/

Reply 32 offered by: Sue Morton on 26-May-2000

And I still want the little 'x'. No joy yet on that one. Maybe in version 1.8?

Reply 33 offered by: David Whitten on 07-Sep-2000

I happened to stumble into this thread after doing a word search for "shaped notes" on a search engine. I had never totally understood the "true" purposes for the shaped notes,(I do understand they are used for singers, not instruments) but let me explain: I learned how to play the piano on my own, playing the fairly simple, yet wonderful old gospel hymns, as found in many of the standard "church hymnals". For some reason, I developed my own little system of using the shape notes to help me play. As I progressed, I found that I could pay more attention to their shapes, and their arrangement relative to each other on the staff, and I could play better, and make less mistakes using the shaped notes-version of songbooks. Another thing is that once you have "ingrained into your mind" the shape-note arrangements, I now can merely pay attention to the shapes, ignore the lines and spaces, and transpose a hymn into another key with little effort. For instance many hymns written "officially" in A flat, I prefer to play in F, and I just look at the shape notes, and somehow can play in the different key much easier than if they were all round notes. This may be hard to explain, or to be understood by anyone else, but I have found it works great for me! (And yes, to be honest, this has probably "hindered" my ability to read ordinary, more traditional songs/music, but for my own purposes, it is fine, as I have little interest in playing any other types of music. Anyone else out there that has found this to be helpful, let me know!

Reply 34 offered by: Fiona Wilkinson on 14-Nov-2000

The little x's would be SO useful for spoken words and ESPECIALLY for percussion - it would solve my drum notation problem.

Also what would be useful is the long slashes for guitar strumming patterns.

Ta

Fiona

Reply 35 offered by: Pamela Whiteley on 21-Nov-2000

David Whitten, I too learned to play the piano with books that had shape notes and I just prefer them over round notes. It seems like my mind registers them quicker than round notes. I also learned to play by using my left hand to play chords and octaves to keep the timing instead of the actual bass and tenor notes. I've heard that's old fashioned, but I took lessons from a teacher who taught me to play church music in 12 lessons (lots of practice of course) I play strictly gospel hymn music, those old-fashioned Stamps-Baxter Heavenly Highway Hymns songs, etc. Now I am at a church where I am the only one who can play piano, and I really do love playing.

Reply 36 offered by: Wilmer Gingerich on 11-Feb-2001

Hey Folks;
I Just happened on your conversation about shaped note programs by accident, so thought I'd offer my 2 cents.
Try this--www.myriad-online.com/main.htm
Good Luck!!
Wilmer G.

Reply 37 offered by: Joe Music on 12-Feb-2001

Myrida-Online offers the shareware "Melody Assistant" and other products. I own it and NWC, as well as some famous names. The programs are very different in functionality and ease of use. For ease of use, you can't beat NWC but Melody does some extra things.

Reply 38 offered by: Timothy Ha on 31-May-2001

I am also a fan of NWC, and in my church we have may be 500-600 songs notated in NWC for our church services.

Recently I found that MusicEase has capability to type shaped notes. I am not a user of shaped notes :-) but this might help those who need it. http://www.musicease.com/

Great thanks to NWC creators!

Reply 39 offered by: Joe Music on 31-May-2001

It seems that shaped notes are fashionable these days. I don't know why. It's not as if the music is easier to read or to notate than standard notes.

Before the rest of you start requesting shaped notes within NWC, be aware that NWC uses the same style regardless of position on the staff. Thus, merely providing something like a font modification would not, of itself, enable NWC to do shaped notes.

I have the feeling that shaped notes are a fad, that will die out in a couple of years. Anyone else think so?

Reply 40 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 31-May-2001

>>I have the feeling that shaped notes are a fad, that will die out in a couple of years. Anyone else think so?

It's hard to predict the future of a fad, but 150+ years of tradition sorta removes something from the "fad" category.

I'd suspect they'll last as long as any other vestige of harmonic folksong. Of course, commercial contempop has drastically cut into the audience and performers of folk music, and the ubiquitous non-tonal dance music has cut into the audience for singing -- or at least, opportunities to develop an appreciation for it.

But despite commercial pressure: harmony has an innate appeal to some people, even if it can't be taught in public schools or experienced in normal social settings. And the do-it-yourself attitude has always been strong in some parts of the world where harmonic music has been a part of cultural history. Where these attitudes intersect, there will be a niche for shape notes -- and so far, there has been nothing else to fill that niche.

Reply 41 offered by: Joe Music on 31-May-2001

Good point. Actually, I was referring to the usage of shaped notes not in terms of historical/cultural values, but rather as a possible substitute for ordinary staff music in things like hymns for congregations.

Reply 42 offered by: Alwin J. on 30-Jun-2001

Back to the original question that started this string . . .
I would recomend a music program that does everything you want when it comes to shaped notes.
Although the ease of use may not be quite like NoteWorthy in some ways, I have found the program very workable . . . I found him very willing to work with me in getting this into his program.
Check out www.musicease.com, it may be worth your time.
The professional version has the shaped notes.

Reply 43 offered by: Yves Grasset on 02-Jul-2001

> The professional version has the shaped notes.

And costs 5 times as much as NWC, just for info.

Yves

Reply 44 offered by: John on 12-Dec-2001

Programs that convert round notes to shapped notes are availabe. I have seen them. I do not know the program names, but they are available. There is also a program that will put the "X" for unspoken parts, try "Music Time" or "Songworks". And to reply to the person who said that shapped notes are a fad that will pass in a few years, I'm afraid that you will pass away long before shapped notes do.
My grandmother could pick up any song regardless of wheather she had heard it or not and just sight read it perfectly. She told me she learned to sight sing at the old "church campmeetings". I can't sight read anything, maybe if someone had taught me shapped notes it would be different.

Reply 45 offered by: marsu on 13-Dec-2001

So did my grandma either, without shaped notes. She would have been horrified to know that such a thing exist. As I learned from her at the age of 6, a note is a note. Its place on the staff gives anything, with the key signature.
I still can't see the usage of these shaped notes, and the loooooooong discussions we already had on it didn't change anything :(
Maybe in my mother tongue would it be different?
Real question: What if you transpose a third above? You just have to remove the highest line, and place it under the staff?

Reply 46 offered by: Grant on 13-Dec-2001

I don't know whether shaped notes make it easier to learn sight-singing, but it is certainly possible (and not uncommon) to learn sight-singing without them.

As I understand it, in the shaped-note system the shapes of the notes are correlated with their function in the current key. How does this work when the music is highly chromatic or modulates frequently?

Reply 47 offered by: Joe Music on 13-Dec-2001

I understand that the shaped-note method (of which there are several) was developed for 19th century rural American hymns. I can't imagine that they were very chromatic or modulated. But I could be wrong.

Incidentally, the shaped note systems that I have come across (fasola and fasolami), do not use a distinct note for each pitch of the scale.

Reply 48 offered by: hutcheson on 18-Dec-2001

>>As I understand it, in the shaped-note system the shapes of the notes are correlated with their function in the current key.

>>How does this work when the music is highly chromatic or modulates frequently?

Not well. This isn't much of a problem because....

>>I understand that the shaped-note method (of which there are several) was developed for 19th century rural American hymns. I can't imagine that they were very chromatic or modulated.

Yes, except not just hymns. Back then, there was an interest in general participation in other kinds of folk music. On the frontier, before the days of RCA and MP3, you made your own music -- with instruments you could carry with you -- or you did without.

And yes, in order to sing highly chromatic or modulated music, you have to be able to read music well enough not to need shape notes anyway. Pentatonic and diatonic scales are typical. Isolated chords in very remote keys (or even outright dissonances) are surprisingly common; modulation to anything but relative major or minor -- very rare.

Reply 49 offered by: hutcheson on 18-Dec-2001

>>Incidentally, the shaped note systems that I have come across (fasola and fasolami), do not use a distinct note for each pitch of the scale.

The Aiken (7-shape) system, introduced about 1860, does. It is still widely used in new hymnals, especially for churches in the south and midwest. For instance, the Southern Baptists' official hymnal is printed (optionally) with Aiken notes; and I believe most churches of Christ use hymnals with Aiken notes.

The four-note systems are not widely used today, or in much new music, except within a (fairly active) "Sacred Harp" community, which sings (mostly) hymns but in (mostly) a "social-traditional" rather than religious context. You may be able to find a few Primitive Baptist churches that do use four-note tune books in worship.

Today, churches that emphasize a-cappella congregational singing are the major consumers of shape-note sheet-music.


#1074: Drum music
Drum music

(1074)

Submitted by: Mark Atkins on 14-Feb-1999

When writing drum rolls in drum music a roll played with demi-semiquavers for the count of a smeibrave (say) would be written by placing a smibreve in the bar with 3 backward tails over the note. This save the mess of writting 32 demi-semiquavers in one bar. Is there any way of getting noteworthy to do this.
Bongo (Derby Midshipmen Marching Band) www.middies.demon.co.uk

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Feb-1999

These "tremolo bars" are available in Barry Graham's "Boxmarks" font. For the staff that does the sounding you'll still need to write out the actual notes, but you can have a second muted "visual" staff for printing or viewing.

If you don't have Boxmarks yet, I strongly suggest getting it because it has become the de facto standard "accessory" font for NWC. You can pick it up from the Scriptorium at:

http://noteworty.beyondtheweb.com/helpful.html

Regards,
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Feb-1999

Oops... that should be

http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/helpful.html

Reply 3 offered by: mew on 12-Jan-2000

When plaing a drum the sticks should be 60 degries and when
you strik the drum you let the stick bounce of the drum head

Reply 4 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 12-Jan-2000

The Scriptorium moved to www.vadu.com/nwc, so the file is now located at:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html

KenJ

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 offered by: Cameron Brown on 19-Apr-2000

drum music for jimi hedrix and rolling stones

Reply 7 offered by: Cameron Brown on 19-Apr-2000

rolling stones drum music an jimi hendrix


#1075: Arpeggio (sp) and Trills
Arpeggio (sp) and Trills

(1075)

Submitted by: Jimmy on 15-Feb-1999

I noticed that in the Sample Moonlight Sonata that comes with Noteworthy there are Arpeggios and Trills ( "{" and "tr~~~~") These seem to just be text, but the notes still play like arpeggios and trills are being used. How do I do this on my own? Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 15-Feb-1999

Welcome to the Forum, Jimmy

NWC doesn't as yet support trills and arpeggios. In the case of Moonlight Sonata, the music you see is not actually playing - the staves are muted. What you hear is a duplicate (almost) in hidden staves where the trills etc. are constructed from individual notes. If you click <File><Page Setup><Contents>, you will see that there are two extra staves in a 'Hidden' category. Check the box, and then they will become visible. This method is documented in the User tips page under http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#trill
Another way of constructing trills (a bit tricky this one) is to use the multi point controller. See user tip http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip3.htm#trillmpc
There is an easy way to construct an effective arpeggio using grace notes - you will find this in the user tips under http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip4.htm#sprdgrc

Hope this helps, Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Feb-1999

See also: msg #594, msg #632, msg #740, msg #809


#1076: Wish about the wish list
Wish about the wish list

(1076)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 15-Feb-1999

This is not a wish *for* the wish list, but "about" the
wish list form. I have setup the default name and e-mail
for the submission forms of the forum. Would it be possible
that these default values be also used in the wish list
submission form ?


#1077: Beaming On The Top and Bottom
Beaming On The Top and Bottom

(1077)

Submitted by: Larry on 15-Feb-1999

On the same staff, can I not beam 8th notes of the top AND bottom voice? Every time I try to group them, the beams of one voice are replaced with individual 8th notes.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 15-Feb-1999

You have to use Staff Layering to do this. Look for this feature in the Help, or search this forum.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Feb-1999

See msg #191, msg #1024


#1079: Recording onto Mini Discs
Recording onto Mini Discs

(1079)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 16-Feb-1999

Last November, msg #928 looked at recording .wav files onto a CD. Mini Discs, 'tho they haven't quite caught on yet, are a far more versatile medium for home digital recording. Indeed I'm surprised they haven't found their way into PC's, - their small size would make them particularly effective with notebooks. But it seems that DVD is all the rage now. Nevertheless, has anyone out there tried recording from their PC onto a Mini Disc? Or has anyone any views on the subject?

Peter.

Reply 1 offered by: Shane Turner on 16-Feb-1999

Hmm.. Well for the price of a minidisc recorder I got a good CD-RW. It holds data, not just music, so I can back up my hard drive. Also I recorded my songs I made in NoteWorthy and put them on a CD which I can play in the car or lend to a friend. (I don't even know anyone who has a minidisc player.)

That isn't to say they won't catch on (CD's took about 10 years before they became common, and LPs went underground). Its just that CDs are so popular right now and are versatile, holding audio or data..

Reply 2 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 16-Feb-1999

Although Shane is positively correct on all counts, I can see that the minidisc is very efficient particularly from a size point of view.
However if one wants to record professionally and not carry his PC to the studio every time, CDs are a better option. Thats because provided your soundcard and minidisc do not have optic line out/in respectively, one will perform an analogue recording using (ideally) golden cables to reduce noise and distortion. But it will still find its way into the recording. A CDR? Direct digital recording, no hisses no noise AND you can Digitally record with it in the Recording Studio (provided they have the equipment and you are willing to pay for the quality).
If however the soundcard has optical line out (e.g. AWE 64, Soundblaster Live) and your minidisc an optical line in, then the minidisc track is going to sustain minimal hiss and distortion, vs analogue cables that introduce more.

So to answer your question, use a (golden prefferably) cable to connect your soundcard with your minidsc and record as if you were recording from a CD.

Reply 3 offered by: Kim  on 13-Dec-1999

Hi.

Saw your comments regarding the recording onto mini discs.

I want to buy a portable mini disc recorder for my boyfriend for christmas.

He DJ's professionly and does do work in the studio.

Could you please advise the best type of mini disc recorder

Cheers

Reply 4 offered by: Jill Hayes on 07-Jan-2000

Hi
I've done a lot of recording from PC to MD, and they sound great. All you have to do is connect your MD to your speaker output, and away you go. This is convenient when you want to record an entire cd, because all you have to do is set up a playlist, and the MD will automatically place track marks inbetween the songs.
Jill

Reply 5 offered by: stephanie on 08-Jan-2000

how about recording from cassette or minicd to the harddrive? Anyone know how this is done? thanks
Steph

Reply 6 offered by: sertac ilhan on 29-Jan-2000

i can record music to my portable md recorder from cassettes cds mp3s and other sources....it is great to own and use the digital format of the cassette!

Reply 7 offered by: Paul T on 08-Mar-2000

Is there such a thing as a mini disc recorder Designed for Data (software) formats as well as music? Does such a beast exist?

Reply 8 offered by: Rex on 20-Mar-2000

Paul,

W/ regards to (WRT) your data/music mini-disc question:
the data versions are 650MB electro-optical/magnetic versions. They look the same, but they aren't. Sony (the inventor of mini-disc) made the decision to differentiate between the music and data versions of its product. So, in short, no they don't exist.

Cheers,
Rex

Reply 9 offered by: Michael Lau on 26-Mar-2000

Hi I want to get a mini disc player but I don't know what the price is, can you tell me how much the mini disc player and the mini discs cost?

Reply 10 offered by: aj on 18-Apr-2000

hey,
i just got an aiwa minidisc player/recorder and i can't figure how to record anything onto it. can someone help me?

Reply 11 offered by: jenn on 18-Apr-2000

Hey everyone,

I have recently received a md and was wondering if someone could tell me how to record songs onto a blank minidisc?

Reply 12 offered by: Selkie on 29-Jun-2000

Ya' might do!

Reply 13 offered by: sean on 30-Jul-2000

i just got MD player and i understand that to record music from your pc, you need to connect to tour speaker outlet.Could somebody tell me where that is on the computer.

Reply 14 offered by: Brent on 03-Aug-2000

ok to record on to a md from ur pc all u have to have is an anilog corde and a blank md. u plug one end of the cord into the head phone jack on ur pc and the other in to the line in port on ur md. u ajust ur recording level and get a play list on ur pc and push record on ur md and push play on ur pc. and walla. instant free music. I have had my md for about three months and i have hours and hours of great music. It has been one of the best purcheses i have ever gotten. the only down side is that u can't put data on it. I hear the japanes have that but since we live over here we wont have that stuff for a while. so if u have3 any more ? just e-mail me and ill be happy to try to answer them. =)

Happy recording

md's all the way!!!!!!

Reply 15 offered by: Pete on 04-Aug-2000

I just got a minidisc and I want to be able to use it for putting data on. Does anyone know of any software that'll do this or do I have to make my own? I'm thinking of writing one that makes the files to zips then plays them like audio files a lá the old cassettes you used to get for spectrums/amstrads. If there's one about I'll save myself the effort

Any thoughts anyone?

Reply 16 offered by: Andrew on 20-Aug-2000

I have an optical out on my sound card.
Does any one know if there is any mini dics editing software for the PC that will let me title my minn disc tracks via my computer????

Reply 17 offered by: Steve on 10-Sep-2000

Hi, I just bought a Sony MD player/recorder and I can record analog and it sounds good, but I want to record digital. It came with an optical/digital cable but both ends are different. The end that's supposed to plug into the computer is a weird shape and won't fit, the computer has a digital line out but it's the same size as a mini plug, and the cord is a differen't shape. could anyone tell me if I can get an adaptor for it or what soundcards are compatable with Sony optical cables?

Reply 18 offered by: isa mahmoud on 01-Oct-2000

hie,
anybody out there to advise/assist me with sources for this
thing called MD and the player/recorder,and how i can order. a price guide will do. by the way i live in zimbabwe.
thanx.

Reply 19 offered by: Nautica on 11-Dec-2000

Does anyone know how to get the output volume up any when recording MP3s to Mini Discs? I've seen people get better and higher output volume then me and I want to know how as well.

Reply 20 offered by: karl on 27-Dec-2000

Does anyone know how to record onto an md? If so, could you PLEASE send me a list from one to ten on what to do? PLEASE HELP ME!!

Reply 21 offered by: Holly on 06-Jan-2001

Can somebody please tell me if u need to convert MP3s to WAV. format b4 u copy them on to minidisc, and if so, how do u do this?
I WILL BE ETERNALLY GRATEFUL TO ANYBODY WHO CAN HELP ME!!!!!

Reply 22 offered by: William on 08-Jan-2001

Ok,

In response to all the questions about the means to go about recording song data onto a MD; Get yourself some source data (I'm sure you ahve something in mind, you fav somg, cd, tape, LP, EP, etc...) determine the output that your player gives. This is done be looking at the player if you have a 'phones' or 'optical digital out' plug these is probably ideal.

Hope this helps...
William ~ hpux@turbosport.com
Find a cable that interfaces between the ourput of your player to the 'mic,' 'line,' or 'optical' input or your Mini Disc recorder.

If you are using an analogue source (anything but optical/digital) then hold down the || (pause) button of your recorder then press/slide the rec button.

Get your source ready (in pause) and press pause on the reorder then the player (or simultaniously, if you prefer) and away you go! Some of the Mini Disc recorders have a auto mark feature that automatically places track marks when there is a 3 or more second pause.

If you are lucky enough to enjoy the crystal clear benefits of the optical/digital transfer then ready your Mini Disc recorder by enabeling 'syncro recording' then pressing record while holding down the pause button (as described above) once your recorder is all ready just press play on your source and enjoy.

(answers/corrections to other posts)
No, you dont have to decompress Mp3's to WAV's before transfer (is it really all that much more work typing actual words? all the 'u' '4' stuff is really annoying.)

Yes there is a Mini Disc Data drive, done by sony, yes it does use special discs, but it is only 140 Meg, and *very* hard to find.... (I am in the process of finding one right now)

Even tho you have a optical sound card it dosent mean that you can interface with the Mini Disc recorder in any special way. This is a purely audio-stream only connection

for optical cables, www.minidisco.com is a good source...
note: the included cable is a TOSlink - miniplug

Reply 23 offered by: Paul on 07-Feb-2001

I want to store data on a miniCD. I have seen some neat Credit Card shaped ones for sale, my question is: What internal CD writer supports writing to this media type? Help.

Reply 24 offered by: Cintra on 16-Feb-2001

Does anybody know how can I record from Mini Discs to CDrs?
Please...email me with the awnser...Thanks!

Reply 25 offered by: john on 19-Feb-2001

Anybody know how to solve any problems with recording from Napster on Laptop to minidisc:

Problems:

1.Napster starts to play the song then freezes up after 1 second.
2.Laptop occasionally does not recognize the USB input. This appears to be random as to wether it recognizes it or not.

Please e-mail me at jomo69@lycos.com

thank you

Reply 26 offered by: Alan on 25-Feb-2001

can somebody plz help me,

My problem is i don't know how to record fomr my PC t my minidisc recorder, i got an optical cable, which conencts the line out of my minidisc player to the digital out of my sound card, but on my Mini Disc recoder it says "no signal"

can somebody plz help or know another way to record form PC to MD, also if i'll need any cables thxs

Reply 27 offered by: skinnyglinny on 26-Jun-2001

Q1-this may be a stupid question, but can mini discs be recorded over multiple times or just once.
Q2-does it record at the same sound level as your playing it on or do they record on the same level everytime?
Q3-do u just set up a playlist and it will seperate each song? or do u have to do each song separate?

please help, im an idiot

Reply 28 offered by: Terrence on 19-Nov-2001

HOW DO YOU RECORD ON MINI DISCS FROM REGULAR CD'S?

DO I NEED SOME KIND OF SPECIAL CD TO MD CONVERTER OR WHAT??

I AM SO CONFUSED!! PLEASE HELP!!

Reply 29 offered by: marsu on 20-Nov-2001

to my knowledge, the optical cable is usable only with optical line out (which is not so often).
Otherwise a "normal" cable can be used : line out preferently, and line in (mic?) on the MD.
BUT this means that there is a DAD process (Digital[CD]-Analog[Cable]-Digital[MD]).
BTW, I never heard a difference... This won't be worse than listening to an MP3 in any case.

HTH.
And please DON'T SHOUT here :)


#1080: To bar or not to bar
To bar or not to bar

(1080)

Submitted by: Ian Wesley on 16-Feb-1999

I have a question concerning the presentation of the vocal line in a piece of music. I have some pieces where notes of quaver length and shorter are barred in the most sensible way and other pieces where the notes are split according to the syllables of the text, unless there is a slurred note (ie a syllable sung over more than one note). I was just wondering if there is a correct way to present the vocal line in a piece of music.

Also, is it possible to automatically undo the barring across the whole stave (the opposite of automatic bar)?

Ian

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 17-Feb-1999

You wrote:
> I was just wondering if there is a correct way to present
> the vocal line in a piece of music.

Both are correct. Nevertheless, some singers find it more
readable when the notes are split according to the syllabes.

> Also, is it possible to automatically undo the barring
> across the whole stave (the opposite of automatic bar)?

I am not sure that is possible. We should be able to select
the whole stave and then unbar all, but I think it doesn't
work because the selection contains quarter, half and whole
notes, and also bar lines (I can't try it right now).
Maybe it would be a good candidate for the Wish List.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-Feb-1999

Actually, this is a bug in version 1.55a. You should, ion fact, be able to select everything in a staff and then clear all beams using the Beam tool. However, this does not work at the moment. There will be a fix coming in the next release.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Feb-1999

The rule that I have seen is not to beam across the end of a sentance.


#1081: Reverb
Reverb

(1081)

Submitted by: Seifer on 17-Feb-1999

Is there anyway to give a staff a specified amount of reverb without using the sustain pedal? The sustain pedal sustains too much in my case, and it's kind of buggy...it hangs a lot. Any help would be appreciated

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Feb-1999

This seems heavily soundcard dependent. On SB16's, the "pedal off" doesn't work at all. On my Audiotrix, the pedal off doesn't work if immediately followed by another "pedal on." Yet it works fine if there is an intervening note. (And it's no fault of NWC, I checked the midi-file output to be sure.)

Regarding reverb, that's another matter entirely. You need a sound card or synth capable of one of the extended midi formats (e.g. Roland GS or Yamaha XG), and the appropriate editor to insert them into the midifiles exported from NWC. At present, there isn't a way to directly insert such custom controllers into NWC itself.

Reply 2 offered by: Seifer on 18-Feb-1999

Bleh, I think the next version should enable that. I've seen many midis where reverb was manipulated on each staff and stuff. Besides, I need it :P

Reply 3 offered by: Shane Turner on 20-Feb-1999

Close, but not entirely true.
Reverb is entirely different than sustain pedal. The pedal is just like a pedal on a piano.. it keeps the note held on for an extended period of time. Reverb on the other hand is basically ambient "echoes" after the note switches off.. Like shouting in a pool and hearing your voice echo around and die away (simple explanation).
You don't need a fancy card to support reverb. Most modern soundcards support reverb. Soundblaster 16, AWE32/64 do and these are all standard cards.

Reply 4 offered by: Seifer on 21-Feb-1999

yeah, but how do I configure it on NWC if at all?

Reply 5 offered by: Shane Turner on 21-Feb-1999

Currently there is no way to set reverb in Noteworthy composer. Although I've submitted it to the wish list (along with chorus, etc).


#1082: Adding drums to a song.
Adding drums to a song.

(1082)

Submitted by: Al Rojas on 17-Feb-1999

Hi there!

I have been using NWC for awhile now but have never seemed
to be able to get drums to be played under a song.
Is it possible to do this? Have some chords, a melody and
drums as well?
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks!

Al Rojas

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 18-Feb-1999

Look at and play 'Drumref' in the samples folder. If you examine the Staff Properties (MIDI) you will see that Channel 10 is used for the drum sounds. And there you have the basics. Have fun, Peter


#1083: Drum Kits
Drum Kits

(1083)

Submitted by: Seifer on 18-Feb-1999

Is there a way to specify a different drum kit? Or is there only one drum kit in standard midi. I know there's a power drum kit...electric...jazz...and more, but I have no clue where to edit it. The list of instrument patches on my soundcard doesn't have any drum kits on it, it's just labeled <none>. Or is this another stupid thing I can't do because of my crap soundcard.

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 18-Feb-1999

What is your highly regarded sound card?
Some one else may have it and be able to get specific.
It is probably reasonable to say that neither the GM nor the GS midi spec support "drum kits". However you can roll your own.
If you open Drumref.nwc you will see what GM percussion instruments are available on channel 10(16)and which note choice produces which sound.
Staff \ Playback Instruments and scan the list toward the bottom for other thumps and rattles available.

Reply 2 offered by: Seifer on 21-Feb-1999

I'm well aware of this. However, the only drum kit I can get to play back is Standard Drum Kit 1. I'm just asking whether there are mulitple drum kits in General MIDI, or if it's a soundcard specific thing...or somethng else.

Reply 3 offered by: Shane Turner on 21-Feb-1999

The answer to your questions:

First, I'd say that drumkits are soundcard dependant. For example, I have both an Awe64 and a Yamaha XG PSR-530. The Yamaha comes with 12 drum kits. As for the AWE64.. It certainly does support multiple drum kits, I have used it many times. It depends on the soundfont bank currently loaded into it.

Second, Noteworthy does support multiple drum kits via a nice little option when selecting your instruments. The check box that says "select a different patch bank" allows you to use multiple drum kits and instruments that come with your equipment. Underneath the check box is two little boxes marked MSB and LSB.
Now I have a chart that came with my Yamaha XG manual that shows the MSB and LSB values for the different drum kits.. just type them in, and away you go!!
This lets me select techno kits, electric, jazz, all kinds of neat stuff.

Out of curisity, what kind of soundcard do you have?

Reply 4 offered by: Seifer on 23-Feb-1999

An ESS1887 (crap sound card)

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Feb-1999

You could try Wingroove - it uses your existing sound card to reproduce it's wavetable sound in software.
It has a number of drum sets.
It's shareware and costs about $20 to register - from memory.

Reply 6 offered by: Shane Turner on 25-Feb-1999

Either that or try the Yamaha SXG50 softsynth... it runs 90 days no crippleware nagware or anything before requiring you to purchase it, so you have a good chance to try before you buy.

Reply 7 offered by: Seifer on 26-Feb-1999

I have WinGroove, and that's what I use. But I still can't define a song I'm making to use different drum kits.

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Feb-1999

Try this - it just worked for me using Wingroove with an ESS card - (yuk!)

Make sure that Wingroove driver is your output device in the Tools/Options/Midi dialogue.

Select the drum staff - go to Staff Properties.
Open the MIDI tab.
Check that you are using Channel 10 - OK.
And that the output device is Wingroove (using the Wingroove as a driver option).

Select Instrument for Playback.
Change the Patch Type to numeric (so you can count through the Wingroove kits to find the position of the one you want).
I think 1 based is what I used - this put the Power Kit at program 16. ( I have tried this one and the brush kit at 41)
Now select the Playback Instrument as a number that corresponds with the Kit you want.

Having said all this it seems you can change them but changing them back is another matter.

Try it!


#1084: phrasing
phrasing

(1084)

Submitted by: Tracey Whitehead on 19-Feb-1999

when I get to the end of a phrase - I need to start the next phrase on a new line - how can I do that?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 19-Feb-1999

At this time (although it is on several wish lists) you can't force an end of line. So you have to juggle the line lengths by padding the text and altering the font sizes and margins. You should have a look at msg #1033 , msg #868 and earlier links from those threads.

Hope this helps, Peter.


#1085: Adding more sounds to playback list
Adding more sounds to playback list

(1085)

Submitted by: Frank Kolwicz on 19-Feb-1999

I am trying out NoteWorthy Composer and I wonder if or how to get more percussion sounds from the playback. Specifically I want conga, djembe and related instruments.

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Feb-1999

You can only get the drum sounds supported by your sound card. At a minimum, your sound card should support General MIDI percussion, which is demonstrated by the DRUMREF.NWC file in the sample songs folder.

See also: msg #561, msg #694, msg #924, msg #935, msg #1082

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Feb-1999

I haven't read Eric's references, but basically to get those sounds, you'll need a sound card that produces them.
They aren't part of the General Midi specification, as such.
Some cards may have them as a "second bank" or something like that.
Any card with "soundfonts" (uploadable sounds), will need a soundfont with those sounds on them. As far as I know, there aren't any free soundfonts which contain these - but if you find one, let me know!

A

Reply 3 offered by: Frank Kolwicz on 21-Feb-1999

Thanks for the replies.

I checked my system and I have a Yamaha S-YXG50 sound card that has lots of extra sounds including all the percussion I want. Unfortuantely the docs with the CD are rather sketchy about how things are done and the HELP file is about useless, as usual. One of the blanks is how to access and specify a bank of sounds and then how to use it.

I've e-mailed Yamaha, but there has been no reply to date. It is possible that one of the downloadable manuals covers this, but I have't got that far.

Thanks again for your help.

Frank

Reply 4 offered by: Drake Donahue on 22-Feb-1999

s-yxg50 is a software synthesizer as opposed to a sound card however Shane Turner's information in the !msg#1083 parallel discussion should be helpful.

Reply 5 offered by: Shane Turner on 22-Feb-1999

Frank, if you want I can scan in the drum kit chart from my manual and email it to you. Its mainly meant for my Yamaha XG but it might work with the softsynth too, I think the softsynth has several drum kits.


#1086: chants
chants

(1086)

Submitted by: Judy Blair on 19-Feb-1999

How can I insert lyrics for a chant? Similar to Gregorian chant, where there can be 2, 3, 6 or a dozen words to one note?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Feb-1999

Press the Help button in the Lyric dialog box. In the help, it describes how you can use the underscore character in flexible ways. By separating several syllables with an underscore, the total will be treated as a single syllable when NWC aligns it up with a note.

See also: msg #121, msg #680, msg #1015


#1087: Cresendos/Decresendos
Cresendos/Decresendos

(1087)

Submitted by: Cyntalan Maelstrom  on 19-Feb-1999

I've been working with MIDIs for years with various programs, and I'm still trying to figure out how cresendos, decresendos, ritandos, rallitandos, diminuentos, etc., work on NWC. I know it has something to do with the Multi-Point Controller, but all I see on that that relates to this as far as bending is pitch bend. How are these done?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Feb-1999

Multipoint Controllers _can_ be used for dynamic variances, but are not essential. The beauty of NWC is that not only are dynamics (pp, p, ... mf ... f, ff etc.) obeyed in playback, so are the dynamic variances "cresc." and "decresc." Either of these will give a smooth variance in note velocity (loudness). For example, if your staff is a given dynamic level (e.g. mf), and you put a "crescendo" or "decrescendo" at a certain point, the effective loudness will gradually increase (or decrease) to the value indicated by the next dynamic marking.

Suggest studying the online help file for more information on this.

Reply 2 offered by: Lester Hough on 21-Feb-1999

Crescendo and diminuendo are handled to best effect by using a) the Override Default Note Velocity option and b)the Override Default Midi Volume options in the dialogue box that comes up when you're selecting an initial dynamic and a terminal dynamic.

By playing with these settings (try overriding the default midi volume first - put in a mumber between 1 and 127) you can vary the volume and the attack at the beginning of your crescendo and at the end.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Feb-1999

Sorry, I don't agree with Lester on that one.
To my mind, cresc. and dim. work best as follows.

Put your starting dynamic wherever.

Follow it with a cresc. or dim.

Finish off with the final dynamic.

NB: cresc., dec. and dim. will ONLY work if there is a dynamic somewhere before it in the staff, and another somewhere after it on the staff. (So that it knows its start and stop levels).

Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Cyntalan Maelstrom on 22-Feb-1999

That's what I read in the help doc, however, no significant change can be heard, even if the beginning dynamic is fff and the ending dynamic is ppp

Reply 5 offered by: Drake Donahue on 22-Feb-1999

Some sound cards/software synths do not support velocity volume changes during a SINGLE note.
If you can not hear a change over several notes your sound production equipment may not respond to velocity/volume changes at all.

Reply 6 offered by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 30-Mar-1999

One for the wish list as well:
After we got the magnificent font called Boxmarks, I'd like the ability to turn off printing of dynamic variances. If you double the input with dynamic variance 'Cresc' for playback, and Boxmark < for printing it looks a bit awkward on the paper!

Reply 7 offered by: Henry Ho on 04-Apr-1999

I am using Creative AWE64, it should support "velocity volume changes during a SINGLE note", right?

I tested NWC. I insert "AltoSax {#66}" then "fff" then "cresc." then a "whole note" and then a "ppp". Can't get the smooth decresendo out of that.

Then I change the whole note into 4 quarter notes, the volumn reduction works, but not smooth. So I put "Tie" on all of them, the result is the same, I can't get the smooth decresendo out of that.

Any suggestion on how can I do that?

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Apr-1999

By default, dynamic variances affect only the VELOCITY (which is assigned when the note is struck). In order to get dynamic variances while a note is playing, you have to vary the channel VOLUME. This is done by over-riding the default volumes in the dynamics (fff, p, etc.). If you do this, then cresc. and decresc. should operate as expected on a single whole note (or tied quarters, which is essentially the same thing from a midi standpoint).

nb: SB16's are, in my experience, not very good at following volume instructions. Among other things, like 'pedal release'...


#1088: Can't get scores to come up in NWC
Can't get scores to come up in NWC

(1088)

Submitted by: Rosalyn Saarinen on 20-Feb-1999

I'm using the unregistered trial vers.of NWC and Netscape Vers. 4.04 and when I go into Cyber Hymnal, right click score, then save it then go into NWC and try to bring the score up for viewing I get a message that the file is corrupted. I am able to get all of the sample scores to come up fine. Any help out there?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 20-Feb-1999

This means that the MIME type is not set correctly on the web site. Netscape incorrectly retrieves the file as ASCII instead of BINARY. You can switch to Internet Explorer, use an FTP program, contact the publisher of the web site, or follow the links below for additional ideas.

See also: msg #18, msg #93, msg #301, msg #760

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Feb-1999

I get this all the time. I am using Internet Explorer 5.0, and I am trying to open files from the NWC Scriptorium (for example, http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1088.htm). It seems to append a [1] to the file name. If I download it, then open it from the file, it works fine.

Netscape 4.08 works fine. Is this an IE bug?


#1089: importing midi files into nwc
importing midi files into nwc

(1089)

Submitted by: Paul on 21-Feb-1999

Apologies if this has been covered before - is there a way to avoid/remove key signatures and time signatures from the beginning of every bar on imported midi files - other than going througbn and deleting them individually?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Feb-1999

Using NWC, select File | Export and export the file as a type 1 MIDI file. NWC is smart enough to remove the extraneous signature data when exporting to a MIDI file. Now, select File | Import to import the file again. This new imported file should only have the necessary signatures.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Oct-2000

Note: As of version 1.70, MIDI imports and exports are done via the Open and Save As commands, respectively.


#1090: Better Printer Control (WYSYWIG)
Better Printer Control (WYSYWIG)

(1090)

Submitted by: Doug Richards on 22-Feb-1999

I submitted the following to the Wish List, but wondered if anyone has any comments or interim suggestions. I sometimes wish to end a line at the end of a specific musical phrase, or for some other reason to control where one system ends and the next starts. NWC has a mind of its own sometimes when it comes to "pretty printing":

I have been using both NWC and a trial copy of MusicEase. The main advantage of MusicEase is that it allows me to break a staff line wherever I wish, and what you see on the screen is what you get on the printer. With NWC the only control I have over the number of measures per line on printout is to mess with the Margins and Staff Size (points) in Page Setup.

Editing is so much easier in other Composing Programs when you can go to a specific page and a specific system and know that whatever changes you make are exactly as they will appear on the final printout.

For instance in NWC, if I want to make a change on the 3rd measure of the 4th system on page 6, I might have to figure out from the print preview and the measure numbers, that this is measure number 175. In other programs I just go to page 6, system 4 and it is obvious what measure it is.

I don't want to switch to another program just because of this one feature (besides it is more expensive)!

Reply 1 offered by: Doug Richards on 22-Feb-1999

I just read some of the replies to msg #936 which make the point that WYSIWYG score editors "work fine for (say) 3 or 4 parts and maybe 50 to 100 bars, but much more than that and they get slower and slower until each key or mouse click takes results in several seconds pause to repaint."

This may be true, but if NWC gave us an OPTIONAL feature where we could choose to insert our own line breaks OR NOT, this might give us the best of both worlds.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Feb-1999

Yes, line and page breaks are a long-standing wish. This feature will not affect the program's speed. WYSIWYG is a completely separate issue - it would definitely be slower, and is not worth it at this time because there are more important things what users need first.

Finding your place in a score is easy enough with measure numbers, especially if you set them to appear on the printout. Ctrl-G takes you right there.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Feb-1999

And it's always possible, when combining the attributes of two software packages, to get the worst of both worlds!

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Feb-1999

Well, line and page breaks could be added in the current Noteworthy style (ie. inserted like any other symbol), without trying to be another product. The difficulty would be extending the broken staff to the right margin, especially if it is only one bar long. Trying to stretch previous staff lines to fill the space would not be easy, and never work quite how the user expects it to, so it would be best simply to extend the line the break is on and live with the ugly but predictable results.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Feb-1999

NWC obviously has a right-justify algorithm, evenly padding bars as required to fit into a system, and can extend a single bar to fill an entire system (e.g. "Extend Last System" option), so adding line breaks shouldn't be too bad... unlike some of the other items on the wish-list, like preserving dynamics etc. during midi import, etc.

Reply 6 offered by: Doug Richards on 24-Feb-1999

The competing product I was trying has OPTIONAL justification (or unjustification) for the entire score, just the systems specified in a block or just the current system.

You can also set "Equal" spacing where the extra space caused by justification is distributed "evenly" among all notes on a staff, or "Linear", where extra space is distributed more in proportion to notes' durations.

I am sure NWC would be able to adapt to provide similar features. As Blair Dowden and Fred Nachbaur both imply in their replies, this would not be an extreme departure from methods already incorporated in NWC.

Reply 7 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 24-Feb-1999

I normally pad a measure with text to push the next bar line to wrap to the next line. This means that I have to toggle between the editor and the print preview to see the result. What could be handy would be somthing like in Excel wher it shows the print area with a dashed line in the spreadsheet. This way I won't have to use the print preview to see the effect of the text padding.

The drawback of text padding is that if anything changes on the score you have to go back to all those text items and move or remove them, which could be painfull if you have a number of staves.

Reply 8 offered by: Wilson Fowlie on 24-Feb-1999

I've found that I've had to combine Doug and Roelie's techniques:

1. play with the margins, staff sizes and fonts to get close to the number of pages I want, then;

2. add text (spaces) between notes to increase the size of individual bars (especially on the last page), so that extending the last bar to the end of the line looks fairly normal. The problem with this, in addition to the high maintenance cited by Roelie, is trying to remember precisely where I put the extra spacing (since it is, after all, invisible).

I love the algorithm NWC uses to determine note/bar spacing: the music almost invariably looks just as good as professional stuff, and I don't expect that that's an easy thing to accomplish.

However, I have to admit, the lack of 'hard line breaks' to go with that technology is my biggest complaint about NWC.
Which is really quite good, if you think about it.


#1091: Getting drums on different staffs
Getting drums on different staffs

(1091)

Submitted by: Al Rojas on 23-Feb-1999

Hi there,

First of all thank you for answering my earlier question regarding drums.
Now I was wondering is there any way to get drums on say the 3rd or 4th staff instead of just the 10th? Its very annoying having so many blank staffs just to have drums.

Thanks

Al Rojas

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Feb-1999

The number of staves is not important. You need to set the MIDI channel to 10 for any staff that should play drums. This is done via Staff Properties (F2). Start a new song using one of the Rhythm templates, then open Tools | Score Review and you will see that the channel is the important technique for triggering drums.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Feb-1999

Al,

You seem to be confusing staves with channels.

Each staff in the score would represent one instrument or a section of the same instruments (1 trumpet, 3 flutes or all the fingers in the left hand of a piano part for example).

The output from a staff in NWC is directed to one of a possible 16 channels which you select in the Midi Tab of the Staff Properties dialogue.
The Playback Instrument that produces the instrumental sound on the selected channel is selected in the same dialogue.

Except in the case of the Percussion Channel (usually Channel 10).
By selecting this channel your notes are no longer pitched but represent individual percussion sounds of a range of percussion instruments.
Unless you use a sound card that selects drum sets by playback instrument you should select <none> as the playback instrument.
Any staff can be directed to any channel and the sound produced by that channel is selected by the playback instrument assigned to that channel
You can direct several staves to share the same channel but note that they will also share the same sound unless you direct the output from each staff to a different output device.

Hope this helps.

Barry Graham


#1092: Print Preview Screen Size
Print Preview Screen Size

(1092)

Submitted by: Doug Richards on 24-Feb-1999

The Print Preview box only fills about 1/2 the width of my screen (600 x 800 pixels). This is fine when you first get into it. However if you Left-click your mouse to zoom in 1 level, the printing is now too wide for the preview box and you have to use scroll bars to see the right side of the score.

Is there any way to make the preview box wider to at least the first level of scrolling? Even if there were "handles" on it so that you could drag to a larger size (as with any normal window).

If this is not possible. maybe I should make it a "wish".

Does anyone else share this (minor) beef with me?

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 24-Feb-1999

A minor wish for me would be an interface similar to Word's print preview -- zoom percent, page-up and page-down, etc. keys navigate.

Another printing wish for me would be for "non-printing staff" -- mark one or more not to be printed. If that were available, I could print out a single staff (or just the vocal staves, or whatever) without having to copy and paste to another window temporarily to do it.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Feb-1999

Sue,

To print a single staff or only a few staves all you have to do turn off all others in the display using File - Page Setup - Contents then print normally.

Reply 3 offered by: Doug Richards on 25-Feb-1999

I like Sue's idea of a percentage zoom. NWC must be capable of this because this is in essence what they already have on the working screen. It permits you to ZOOM IN or ZOOM OUT in 2 pixel increments. I usually work at at a zoom level of 8 pixels.

On my screen (a 15" monitor) the Print Preview box measures about 6" wide x 8" high. I find that it gives an image which is essentially unreadable. It is smaller than a Zoom Level of 4 on the working screen (which I find to be marginally readable).

My entire screen is 11" wide of which the upper right 1" is used for 5 command buttons ("Done","Start", "Next", "Back" and "Copy"). This leaves potentially 10" for the width of a zoom window. The paper we print on is usually 8-1/2" wide, so presumably if we could zoom to FULL SIZE (in width) it would (1) be easily readable, and (2) would still fit the horizontal dimensions of the screen. Admittedly the vertical dimension of the screen would require scroll bars, but that is not a serious problem as we would at least be able to see the full width of the staff.

So to sum up I would like to see:

1. As a minimum the option of a "Full Size" zoom without horizontal scroll bars.
2. Preferably the option of variable zoom in say 10% increments (or smaller)
3. A zoom window which uses nearly the full available width of the monitor screen.

Should I submit this to the "Wish List"?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Feb-1999

I've already added to the wish list a "Fit to screen" option, with the further suggestion that the control buttons be moved to a toolbar to allow the use of the full width of the screen (less the vertical scrollbar). The percentage zoom option would be nice, please do add it to the wishlist if you're so inclined.
F

Reply 5 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 25-Feb-1999

Remember that Eric has stated (I can't point to the exact place) that zoom can only work in increments of 2 pixels. I'm not sure how this translates into percentages, but it could be related to the limitations on sizes under discussion here.

Cyril

Reply 6 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 26-Feb-1999

Are there any reason to stay with fixed width previews even at the different zooming levels?
Have a try: setup your printout in landscape (printer setup)and you'll see a nice unzoomed landscape view.
Would it be possible, in portrait mode, to have the preview increase its width till reaching the display width?

Reply 7 offered by: Sue Morton on 28-Feb-1999

Thanks Barry, I had forgotten about the choices regarding printing of which staves on the Page Setup... and I have really missed using this feature! Duh...


#1093: Honourable Mention in BBC Music Mag
Honourable Mention in BBC Music Mag

(1093)

Submitted by: Ian Wesley on 24-Feb-1999

Just thought readers might like to know that Noteworthy gets a mention in the March edition of BBC Music Magazine. The article is in fact a review of the latest version of Sibelius Composer, but notes that this program is very expensive and that there are inexpensive programs that do just as well - gives Noteworthy as the example.

Ian


#1094: How to get trill effects
How to get trill effects

(1094)

Submitted by: T.O. on 26-Feb-1999

on the staffs how do we get the effect of trills?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 26-Feb-1999

see msg #1075

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Feb-1999

Simple trills can be done using grace notes. This sounds good and looks not too bad on the score.

Reply 3 offered by: Brian on 12-Apr-1999

I have found that the only way to notate a good sounding trill is to use 32nd or 64th notes in a hidden staff, depending on the tempo. The muli-point controller will make a trill, but even with the value set at absolute(as opposed to linear sweep) there is still some glissando between notes and they are not attacked as they should be. Of course this effect could be good if you want a sound in your score similar to the sound of Tarzan swinging through the trees.


#1095: Semiquver rests
Semiquver rests

(1095)

Submitted by: Peter Edwards on 26-Feb-1999

When I insert a semiquaver rest (that's the one with two tails - a sixteenth) the tails end up in C and E (in the treble clef) instead of A and C. I have never noticed this before, although I'm sure I would have, so has something changed in the current release of NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Feb-1999

I do not think anything changed, but I agree that the 16th rest would be better in the A and C lines of a treble clef. For now, you can turn on experimenting, then use Edit Selection to drop the rest down. Beware, if you use this work around, you will need to undo it later when we fix this.


#1096: Pitch for Playback
Pitch for Playback

(1096)

Submitted by: Doug Richards on 26-Feb-1999

Just a simple question, perhaps asked before but I can't find the answer:

When NWC plays back a tune, are the notes tuned to Concert Pitch (A = 440 Cycles per second) or what. How exact is it?

Doug

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 26-Feb-1999

NWC playback is General Midi, either through the MIDI device that you have configured in NWC, or through the Midi Mapper for NW Player (I think).

Normally, everyday General Midi devices would be "tuned" to A=440 BUT
1) the instrument patches CAN vary
2) you may have a MIDI device that is set up differently (normally through some global "Master Tuning" thingy)

If you can get onto the newsgroup, there has been a huge discussion about woodwinds and the different versions of "Concert" pitch (A=440, 445 etc...)

Andrew


#1097: Multiple scores on one page
Multiple scores on one page

(1097)

Submitted by: Ed Panfili on 26-Feb-1999

Is there any way to put more than one score on a page with NoteWorthy (short of cut and paste)? .... ie. barbershop tags where the score for each piece may be only 3 to 5 measures long... I am currently just threading them together one after another but it makes inserting lyrics a bit of a chore...

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 26-Feb-1999

I'd suggest making little "songs" for each one, with or without titles, etc... and then either

1) just using "Copy Special" (from the Edit menu) or Copy from the Page Preview dialog.
Then simply paste the snatches of score into a word processor and set them out as you wish, or

2) Print each one out, and use scissors and glue! ;-)

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Ed Panfili on 26-Feb-1999

Thanks Andrew...I knew about the cut and paste option (both with and without glue ;-) ... ) but was hoping I could do it in the program as corrections and additions would be easier.

Have a great day!

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Starfield on 27-Feb-1999

You could try this Ed:
Print out the first song. Then feed the page back into the printer, use page setup to agust the top margin to clear your first song and print the second song. Keep going like this until the page is full or too scrunched to put in the printer again.


#1098: NWC Offline Forum
NWC Offline Forum

(1098)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 01-Mar-1999

Help! Has this question been asked before: How do I tell what "vintage" of offline forum I currently have, so I know which upgrade to apply?

The date/timestamp on my downloaded forum.exe is the date and time I pulled it down, not the "vintage" date. So I usually end up downloading the whole offline forum again because I don't remember what the vintage was that I last used...

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 02-Mar-1999

What I do is start up the offline help, and the contents page normally says "Threads in chronological order thru 3 Feb 99" or something like that. That final date (or a date very close to it) is your vintage.
A

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Mar-1999

The vintage appears in all of the following places in the offline forum help file:

- The title banner of the offline forum window:
NoteWorthy Composer Offline Forum (<vintage>)

- The title banner of the contents dialog:
Help Topics: NoteWorthy Composer Offline Forum Contents <vintage>

- The section title in the content tab:
Threads (in chronological order through <vintage>)

- The Contents page (the first page in the offline forum)

- Under the Help | Version command:
Vintage <vintage>

Reply 3 offered by: Sue on 08-Mar-1999

Help.

I deleted everything I had for the Offline forum and downloaded the full version right after getting this info. So far so good.

Today I see there is a new version of the offline forum available. I got into the offline version that I had downloaded, and saw the vintage was 03-feb-1999. I downloaded nwcforum-990203.exe and ran the setup.

I get CRC error on the file NWC Offline Forum.hlp.

I also get CRC error on the .CNT file, but of course I can rebuild the "find and search" criteria so I am not worried about that one.

Why do I get the CRC error when applying the update? As far as I can tell, I have followed the correct procedures. Any ideas are welcome. Thanks.

Sue

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Mar-1999

> Why do I get the CRC error when applying the update?

I just downloaded and ran this upgrade, and it worked perfectly. Something must be wrong with your installation. Here are the possible causes:

1) We do not offer a file called "nwcforum-990203.exe". We do offer an upgrade called "upgnwcforum-990203.exe" which upgrades from the 03-Feb-1999 edition to the latest. I will assume that you have the "upgnwcforum-990203.exe" upgrade for the rest of this.

2) You either don't have the 03-Feb-1999 edition installed on your computer, or it has been corrupted. When you run upgnwcforum-990203.exe, it should automatically find your existing 03-Feb-1999 copy of the forum. If it doesn't find it, then it does not exist on your hard drive.

3) The "upgnwcforum-990203.exe" program that you downloaded could be corrupted (thus requiring you to download again).

Since you are having so much trouble, you might be better off just downloading the nwcforum.exe distribution, which does not require you to keep track of your current older edition.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Mar-1999

Last, you can do a basic sanity check of your current copy of the offline forum, as follows (note that this does not prove whther your current copy is internally corrupted, only that it is the correct edition).

If you have the 03-Feb-1999 edition, then file:

NWC Offline Forum.hlp:
-- Should be dated February 03, 1999 8:37:31 PM
-- Should be size 3,428,352 bytes used

Reply 6 offered by: Sue on 09-Mar-1999

You are indeed correct, the newer filename I downloaded is "upgnwcforum-990203", I inadvertently left off the "upg".

I still have the nwcforum.exe file I previously downloaded, as well as the upg file. I deleted the Offline forum, and re-ran nwcforum.exe to create it. It says the vintage is 03-feb-99.

The resulting HLP file is 3,427,952 bytes. I received no errors downloading that file originally, nor did I receive any errors re-executing it just now.

I am on NT 4.0 using NTFS and compression, could this make any difference?

I will download the CURRENT nwcforum.exe now, and when the next upg file comes out, I will see what happens then.

In the meantime, any further ideas about this are appreciated. Thanks.

Sue

Reply 7 offered by: Sue on 10-Mar-1999

I downloaded the latest nwcforum.exe yesterday, received no download errors.

Just now I ran the unzip, received no errors.

The File Size (according to Windows NT Explorer, properties) of the .HLP file is: 3,363,010. The date is 3/2/99 at 08:09:32PM. Is this correct? Do I have a good file?

Reply 8 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Mar-1999

Yes. you have the latest, and the date and size are correct.

You may be correct about NTFS compression causing your earlier upgrade problem. We will look into it.


#1099: NWC format? Some API for it?
NWC format? Some API for it?

(1099)

Submitted by: Timothy Ha on 02-Mar-1999

Is it possible to have the layout for NWC file format? Or if that is a secret (commercial) information, can you provide with some API functions (in a DLL) like changing fonts for page elements, song and copyright titles and so on. I own a webpage and have a lot of *.NWC files. I would like to have this function in order to run a batch on all files instead of doing this tedious kind of work manually. Thanks a lot in advance for any kind of help.

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 02-Mar-1999

This would be a very useful feature. I would like to
be able to dynamically replace:

1) Lyrics
2) MIDI voice assignments (per staff)
3) Tempo
4) All "Info" fields.

I also have a collection of "Hundreds" of MIDI files, with all the info in different databases.

Reply 2 offered by: Bruce Vander Werf on 05-Mar-1999

Yes - this would be very useful! I would use it to transpose (guitar) chord designations entered as text!

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 06-Mar-1999

I don't think that the file format is a secret, but it is a lot of work to document it properly. The fact that it seems to change with every minor release means an even bigger documentation headache, plus suggests that your tools won't work for long. I think that the effort is better put into needed features that all users can use.

Reply 4 offered by: Timothy Ha on 08-Mar-1999

Yes, I understand the problem with documentation of the NWC format, since it changes with new releases. But there's a simpler way to help programmers -- it's to export some functions in a DLL. I think the functions in NWC itself CAN change every little parameter of the song :) So one only needs to export them.
Maybe this will be another commercial thing in addition to NWC, for example "NWC Toolkit" API DLL. :)

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP


#1100: Instruments for NWC
Instruments for NWC

(1100)

Submitted by: Nick Watkins on 04-Mar-1999

Hello,

i am having great fun evaluating the NWC and wish to know if one can get more realistic instrument sounds through MIDI. When I put an instrument patch from right hand click, midi control and there are afew different banks, but how do i get more of these and how do I get one's that sound like real instruments and have some depth to them.

i would be v. grateful if someone could get back to me with some advice. i imagine that you must be able to download something somewhere !

Thanks in advance,

Nicholas

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Mar-1999

Here are some past threads that might help:

msg #350, msg #746, msg #818, msg #992, msg #1013, msg #1085

Reply 2 offered by: Byron Dickens on 04-Mar-1999

It all depends on the synth you use. Most sound cards leave a lot to be desired. However, if you use the MIDI out to hook up to a good outboard keyboard or synth module you can get far better results. Another alternative is to use a good software synthesizer such as the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas.

Good Luck.

Reply 3 offered by: Russ on 04-Mar-1999

To be more direct, you can download yamaha's great sound driver from here:

http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/Strasse/5165/first.html

Reply 4 offered by: Sterhgios Moschos on 20-Apr-1999

Um, the link is dead, teh downlaod is not available anymore, any other sources maybe?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Apr-1999

Go straight to the source:

http://www.yamaha-xg.com/english/xg/s-synth/s-synth.html

Reply 6 offered by: Nicholas Watkins on 21-Apr-1999

Thanks v. much chaps ! Will try your suggestions to be honest I think I will go back to my Organ ( Pipe Organ of course ) and more traditional techniques. Interesting to know that the technology is not up to it yet. Thanks for your suggestions !

Best wishes,

Nicholas Watkins

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 22-Apr-1999

Sure Nicholas, synthesis technology has yet a long way to go. And as you mention Pipe Organ, this makes me think of this: in many organs, the stereo effect is produced by the physical place (left to right but also front-rear) of the pipes.
Would someone be kind enough to give some explanation on how ti _should_ sound to sound more like a real stereo organ?
I know that some "jeux" (same pipes with same kind of sound, don't know the name in English) are starting from edges and coming to center, each half-tone being alternatively left and right (I discovered this in helping an organist to tune his organ in). To which "jeux" does this apply? is it always true?
On the midi side, it's another story, I feel that a program will be written... Unless NWC can search for each C4 and set it to right, then C#3 to left, and so on... ;-) (wish, of course)

NWCly yours,
MAD

Reply 8 offered by: nicholas watkins on 22-Apr-1999

Dear MAD,

Thanks for the interesting reply, I will try to answer your question. The 'jeux' are the stops, that is the actual ranks of pipes ( in French I beleive they are called RANGS. ) One stop ( jeux ) can contain more than one rank of pipes although most stops have only one rank but the stops that give the organ it's very bright pitch ( called mixtures or fournitures in French ) are actually a combination of ranks of pipes on one jeux/stop tuned at differing pitches. If you look at the name of the stop it will have something like 'Fourniture III' 'Mixture II' which indicates the number of ranks. Most pipes have just the lenght of the bottom pipe ie "Montre 8'" "Prestant 4'" "Bourdon 16'" the number indicating the lenght in FEET ( not metres even on French/German organs, hah, hah.) 8' is in unison with a piano 16' an octave below and so on. When I play one note on the keyboard there are several pipes ( tauyaux ) sounding at the same time.

Now to the rest of your question, the pipes are NOT always arranged in a 'stereophonic' fashion. It does happen quite a bit BUT the more general rule is for them to descend from right to left or vica versa. IE: C C# D D# etc so that what you see is a sweep from the left or right. But is has to be said that in France partuicularly with the 'Buffet d'orgues' concept does require some amount of symetry and this was a very fashionable concept in late 19th Century french organ building. Of course if you look at the design of a modern organ ( recommend Notre Dame des Nieges in Alpe D'Huez which is shaped like a hand ) one can design a perfectly good organ without this stereo idea.

Interestingly enough in ELECTRONIC ORGAN BUILDING they have exactly the same problems ( and sounds ) as you have with NWC and digital sounds for real instruments. So far they are very into sampling technology at the moment, going to
La Trinite in Paris or Westminster Abbey and sampling the sounds of the pipes and then importing them into the electronic organ - it still doesn't sound like the real thing though - THANK GOD !!!!!

Any way hope that this interests you and answers your question - just remember it is more important phsically where the pipes are than how they are arranged - we don't just sit there playing arpeggios !

Best wishes,

Nicholas Watkins

Reply 9 offered by: lilith anthony on 06-May-1999

Unfortunately, a pipe organ is very difficult to transport anywhere. Besides, midi programs have so much more possibility!

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 07-May-1999

Lilith, that's true, MIDI have more possibilites... but they have less power.
Playing on a true organ will never be the same as midi-programming it, even with the best sounds/card.
You might answer that with midi, you can have a full orchestra. But then, why directors keep on directing an orchestra? Not only because they are more paid I suppose ;-)

Well, this subject is a big matter of discussion, and each part will have good reasons not to change their mind...

Provided this leads to MUSIC, ART and BEAUTY, that's all fine!

MAD (Midi (or Music?) Addicted Dominique)

Reply 11 offered by: nicholas watkins on 07-May-1999

Dear All,

You are of course quite right, there is really a huge difference between instruments proper and MIDI. In terms of producing music (scoring etc) technologiy is way ahead ( and in portability !!!) but warmth of sound has a long way to go.

I wish you all the best of luck, I though being able to import MIDI *.MID files was great by the way.

Best wishes,

Nicholas


#1101: How do I get the lyrics out of a MIDI file?
How do I get the lyrics out of a MIDI file?

(1101)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 04-Mar-1999

Hi NWC'ers!

This question has been asked awhile back (I looked at the Offline Forum), but I am hopeful there is new information available.

A friend just gave me a .MID file with the lyrics inside. Using Guenther Nagler's utilities, I can see that the text is in there, but I really can't make use of it. Does anyone know of a good way to get the lyrics out of the .MID file so I can copy them into NWC? The MIDI itself imports to NWC just fine.

Any and all help is appreciated, as usual. Thanx!

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 06-Mar-1999

Not sure which program you are using, so not sure if this will work, but . . . If you have quick view or quick view plus installed, right click the file in Windows Explorer. If the words show up in the view, you can highlight and copy them (i.e. control "c") and then paste (i.e. control "v")into either a Noteworthy lyrics screen or a wordprocessing file.

If you know the which program produced the midi file (Midisoft?), maybe mention it. Noteworthy seems to have a lot of good guru's out there who may already be using the program and who could help.

Reply 2 offered by: Sue on 06-Mar-1999

I don't know what program produced the MIDI. The friend that gave it to me downloaded from an internet site of MIDI files.

He uses a MAC, and he has software similar to NWPlayer, that scrolls the words across the screen while the MIDI is playing. I have no such software, only the standard MIDI stuff that comes with Windows, and of course NWC.

I used Quikview and Notepad to examine the file and can see the words (same with the MIDI to TXT utilities), but the song is long and it is going to take a few hours to get the text out and clean it up using those methods (with the viewers the text has a lot of embedded symbols; with Nagler's utilties the text is all run together like one long word).

I'm hopeful there's a better way... ????

Reply 3 offered by: derek on 16-Aug-2001

Look for a program called Easy Kar - I think from cnet.com
it allows you to save the text as a txt file


#1102: Computer doesn't recognize my keyboard
Computer doesn't recognize my keyboard

(1102)

Submitted by: Russ K. on 04-Mar-1999

Well I got the keyboard and I got the MIDI cable to hook up to my computer. I hooked it all up but the computer doesn't recongize anything I am sending. Isn't it true that with NWC I record the keyboard?
Maybe it's in the MIDI cable I got. the MIDI cable is really hooked up to the keyboard port and converts it to a MIDI input port. Is there some type of software to download to tell the computer there's a keyboard here?
What can I do?

Russ K.

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 04-Mar-1999

This may seem a silly thing to say but have you tried swapping the in and out midi plugs around. Sometimes logic would tell you to connect them one way when the illogical way is the one that works.

Try it anyway.

BTW Yes you can record from a keyboard into Noteworthy.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-Mar-1999

See msg #184, msg #558, msg #896, msg #961

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 08-Mar-1999

From your description your midi keyboard is connected to the qwerty keyboard input plug on your computer.Is this so?

Usually the midi keyboard connects to a 15 pin D connector (like a joystick port) on your sound card.
The two Din plugs connected to the D connector on the cable carry Midi In (to the computer) and Midi Out (from the computer).

Reply 4 offered by: Russ on 12-Mar-1999

well i still dont know whats wrong with it. It is hooked up t the joystick out port and directly into the back of my MIDI keyboard. Nothing's happens. I've tried the option on my MIDI keyboard called "bulk send" which supposedly send its stored music files into the computer via the cable cord, but NWC shows no response. I've tried hitting the record but etc. but it's just now being recognized! It's frustrating.
Any other solutions?

Russ K.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Mar-1999

I've just picked up on this thread, and one possibility comes to mind - many computers now come with 'built-in' sound - they don't have a seperate sound card. This may be affecting your MIDI capability. The fact that you have a joystick port may give the lie to this, but do you have a seperate card - if so, what is the make and model? If not, perhaps this is your problem.

HTH, Peter.

Reply 6 offered by: Russ on 13-Mar-1999

alright. I got the keyboard to work! the problem was simply that I had the IN to the IN and the OUT to the OUT where it shouldv'e been the other way around, which doesn't really make sense, but it works.
I also have a new question though: my keyboard only plays quarter notes and if I hold the "left hand" say for a whole note it only plays a quarter note and the "right hand" only adds memebers of a chord to the quarter note that the "left hand" should be holding for a whole notw count. In short, it only plays quarter notes no matter how fast I play or how slow i play.
Is this normal?! Any suggestins or help?

Russ Karloff

Reply 7 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Mar-1999

See Page 27 of the latest User's Guide. This covers how to use your MIDI keyboard with NWC, and answers your question.

See also: msg #128, msg #517, msg #825

Reply 8 offered by: Russ on 13-Mar-1999

you mean the user guide that came with the software, the instruction manual?
And those links to the different messages don't help me. My problem is that anything i play is a quarter note, even if i play a 64th note! Therefore any melody I play is worthless because it has no rhythm. And by the time i get back to manually changing it, I've forgotten how it was supposed to be.

Russ

Reply 9 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-Mar-1999

Yes, the User's Guide. Alternately, if you read the "see also" links you will find the answer to your problem.

Reply 10 offered by: Peter Vasey on 14-Mar-1999

Russ, I believe you're getting confused between Step time and Real time entry. Have a look at msg #980, and also read the sections in the Help File concerning the <MIDI Input Active> button (Step time entry) and <Record> button (Real time entry). Just to check, while you're getting only crotchets (quarter notes), try changing the note duration on the task bar to half notes and see what happens.

HTH, Peter

Reply 11 offered by: Russ on 16-Mar-1999

thanks for everyones help!
I figured out that I can't play real time and that I have to be recording another track while playing a latent tune.
Thanks, everything is working now.

Russ


#1103: Per-note performance dynamics - please!
Per-note performance dynamics - please!

(1103)

Submitted by: Ben Bacon on 10-Mar-1999

Hi everybody! For my first-ever posting to this forum, I'd
like to talk about a wish I've had since NWC 1.3f, when I
became a registered user...

...that is to have per-note performance dynamics - note
properties, if you will - available from within NWC. In a
prior life, I created hours of sequences using Personal
Composer for DOS (ran in Hercules graphics mode; anyone
remember that? ;-) One of the great features of PCD was the
ability to specify MIDI note velocity, volume, etc. note-by-note, if desired. This had nothing to do with ornamentation - you could indicate an accent, and have *this* note accented just a bit more than *that* one - made an incredible difference in the final quality of hand-sequenced scores (my specialty). NWC's multi-point controller and fixed-value dynamics are very
cumbersome, by comparison.

I appreciate the design ideal of having *every* score or
performance element have a visual counterpart - but that
gets limiting if you want to implement performance dynamics
on a note-by-note basis.

How about it? Anyone else want this feature?

And what's going on with NWA, anyway? Been quite a while since the last NWC update. Not a complaint, just wondering... ;-)

Peace!
Ben

Reply 1 offered by: Benjamin Bacon on 10-Mar-1999

On Wed, 10 Mar 1999, Drake Donahue wrote:

> dynamics are not fixed-you can assign any 0-127 value to volume and/or
> velocity-fff at 0,0 if you wish-
> MPC's give similar flexibility during a note if your card/synth supports
> Perhaps macros would reduce the cumber? - or cut and paste from a
> "utility staff"?
>

Thanks for your reply. Yes, you can assign any 0-127 value to volume
and/or velocity - in fact, you MUST assign a specific, absolute value!
That's what I mean by 'fixed'. A relative dynamic would allow you to
indicate that a specific note property be adjusted by an amount relative
to its current value - accenting (or diminishing) a note (or series of
notes) within a NWC crescendo, for example. The way it is now, you have to
update EVERY SINGLE DYNAMIC and EVERY SINGLE MPC to raise or lower the
overall volume of a passage - very labor-intensive.

I transcribe things like the Brandenburg Concertos using NWC, so I really,
really need a system that allows very fine control of performance
dynamics.

Ben

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 10-Mar-1999

I not sure of your final product - I assume that you are notating some previous work by transcribing and entering note data in NWC - I guess for the purpose of performing this with an orchestra. For this NWC is a great tool.

If you are transcribing to produce a midi file or the sound of the transcribed work perhaps you should be using some other product that allows the use of expression controller 11, graphic insertion of velocities or variation of individual note velocites in an event list.

Reply 3 offered by: Ben Bacon on 10-Mar-1999

I am indeed creating MIDI files from my notated scores.
And I do use other products - specifically, Cakewalk Pro -
to add the kind of detailed performance dynamics I want.
The problem is that I can only get my data into CakeWalk
by exporting from NWC as MIDI. Once I edit the file in
CakeWalk, I can't go back to NWC except by re-importing
from the MIDI file, which causes me to lose all my
formatting, bars, slurs, etc.

Check it out, people - there *are* notation-based products
that allow per-note performance dynamics to be entered -
they tend to be much more expensive and resource-intensive
than NWC, which is my favorite editor. I want my favorite
tool to better support the work I'm doing. Saying 'use
another product' is not particularly helpful.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 10-Mar-1999

OK
Use NWC if you want to print a score.
Use Cakewalk to produce the midi file.
What else do you want do do?
Or do you want the functionality of Cakewalk built into NWC at the same low registration price?

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Mar-1999

I don't think giving every note its own set of properties should be all that difficult. I would like every note, and every other insertable object, to have at least two properties: "Display (print) this note but don't play it" and "Hide (do not print) this note but do play it".

Reply 6 offered by: Ben Bacon on 11-Mar-1999

Barry Graham:

>Use NWC if you want to print a score.

NWC is more than just a score printing tool. You may not
use it for more than this, but I do.

>Use Cakewalk to produce the midi file.

As previously noted (hah!) once the score has left NWC as
a MIDI file and been edited, it can't be brought back while preserving all the work that's been put into it.

Suppose you had a word processor that would only allow you to edit, or print - and once you had printed a document,
you couldn't edit the text again, just change formatting,
unless you wanted to retype it.

>What else do you want do do?

I want to use one tool to do my compositions, not two
semi-compatible ones.

>Or do you want the functionality of Cakewalk built
>into NWC at the same low registration price?

No. I don't use a fraction of Cakewalk's functionality; the bulk of my work is done in NWC. All I use Cakewalk for is performance dynamics. This is functionality that would enhance NWC, give NWC capabilities found in other products of its type (notation-oriented sequencers), and not be terribly difficult to implement - we're talking about a different interface for entering MIDI controller messages that NWC already supports.

It's obvious you think NWC shouldn't do anything more than what it already does. I'm happy it meets your needs so handily.

Peace,
Ben

Reply 7 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 11-Mar-1999

Ben,

You have all my sympathy for your wish for a note properties box in which you can specify single note velocity either absolutely or relatively to the preceding notes.

I only fear this could be a burden to the programmer since this could entail a major rewriting of NWC.

But your message and Barry's reply raises an important issue: what is NWC, a printing tool or a playback tool?

It is obvious for me that NWC was born as a printing tool, but all the efforts put in it to have a decent playback, and the release of NoteWorthy Player plus the built-in compressed format have changed the status of NWC in that it is now an efficient way of transmitting music by the Internet. Music intended to be played and not only to be printed.

If this is so, it would be great that NWC would adquire some features traditionally in the realm of sequencers like Cakewalk which are, I think, not so difficult to implement. Access to more MIDI controllers (expression, reverb and chorus), a multi-point controller tool with more points, and support for track delaying (like the Time+ column in Cakewalk). These additions would enhace the playback abilities of NWC so that *.nwc files would be better fitted as a medium of music sharing.

It's not that NWC should become a sequencer. I think you shouldn't think in events and ticks to make good MIDI transcriptions and performances. NWC is ideal in that it allows a much more musical thinking. But some additions from the sequencer world would be really welcome.

And just because NWC is no longer just a music printing tool. So I think, at least.

Reply 8 offered by: Ben Bacon on 11-Mar-1999

Ramón,

Thanks for a cogent reply. :-)

>I only fear this could be a burden to the programmer
>since this could entail a major rewriting of NWC.

As a professional software developer, I don't think so - most music file formats store data as a stream of symbols, MIDI events, etc. Things like volume and velocity control messages are already present in the stream. To implement "note properties," NWC would simply insert a "set" message before the note, and a "reset" message after. The kind of data being saved is no different from what NWC already does.

>It's not that NWC should become a sequencer. I think you
>shouldn't think in events and ticks to make good MIDI
>transcriptions and performances. NWC is ideal in that it
>allows a much more musical thinking. But some additions
>from the sequencer world would be really welcome.

I submit that NWC already *is* a sequencer - one whose origins are in notation entry, rather than MIDI stream capture. I wholeheartedly agree that events and ticks are less expressive than notation - that's why I'd rather use NWC than Cakewalk for my creative work.

>And just because NWC is no longer just a music printing
>tool. So I think, at least.

I agree. For me, NWC crossed that line when it acquired MIDI recording capability - a feature, incidentally, that I've never used. Never needed it. ;-)

Peace,
Ben

Reply 9 offered by: Steve Bacher on 12-Mar-1999

I agree that it would be excellent to have per-note
dynamics settings. One reason I don't think has been
stressed (n.p.i.) here that it would be nice to be able
to have differing volumes, attacks, etc. on notes in the
same chord, to bring out one of two voices on a single
staff. Right now that is impossible.

- seb

Reply 10 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 14-Mar-1999

Steve,

I have used the "experimental" (Eric, you'll never walk alone ... :) overlay feature to do this precise thing, having one voice doing something different (and at a different velocity) to another voice on the same clef. Apart from the other (well!) documented gripes about this feature, it does do this particularly well. One could argu, I guess, that ANY note should have any arbitrary velocity assignable to it, but in reality, it is normally only one note in a chord that wants to ring out there. Using Fred Nachbaur's guitar technique, (hidden staves implementing what's written), you can actually do exactly what you want. It gets back to what overheads are you wanting to make what is written sound exactly as you want it (which is of course our Paradise!)

Andrew

Reply 11 offered by: Sue Morton on 16-Mar-1999

I too would like per-note settings. But right now, because I have the need, I would settle for "don't print this rest" property...

I have a score in which I need the layered staff feature in order to notate a odd combination of short and long notes. (I can notate this on one staff, but due to the way NWC counts the notes, the measure length is not correct even though it looks correct when printed.)

I have rests in all the measures except where the layered notes need to be in the 2nd staff. (That is the cheater's way out, I know, I could fool with hidden/muted staves instead.) If I could just say "hide print" on each rest in the 2nd staff, then they would layer together nicely for printing purposes, AND they would play back correctly as I wouldn't be doubling notes up (and having to fool with dynamics and MPC's to adjust the volumes.)

Seems like a simple solution that will allow good playback AND good printing... what say all of you? Am I on the right track, or am I missing something important? Let me know.

Sue

Reply 12 offered by: Peter Bowers on 18-Mar-1999

Hiding individual items for printing has been requested before. If you haven't put this in the wish list, please do so. The more people that officially request a feature, the more likely we are to get it quickly.

Reply 13 offered by: Ben Bacon on 18-Mar-1999

The visual appearance of a score is much less important to me than how it sounds when played back. Control of graphical output (on-screen or printed) is an entirely different function from control of MIDI output. I hope the distinction is clear to anyone adding "note properties" to the wish list... ;-)

Be careful what you ask for - you might not get it!

Reply 14 offered by: Stephen Randall on 19-Mar-1999

A few randomish thoughts:

1) I'm not sure that this was what Ben was asking for, but since it has been mentioned (by Steve Bacher): does Midi allow one to vary the dynamic of one note in a chord using a single voice? Or would an extra voice be required? i.e. if we are asking for NWC to allow one or more notes within a chord to be emphasised, would this be implementation of an existing Midi feature or would it be facilitation of a workaround to overcome one of the shortcomings of Midi?

2) How useful is Midi as a distribution medium? The capabilities of devices varies greatly. If Ben gets his wish and can add the subtle variations in note dynamics would I notice the difference if I played one of his efforts on my SB16? If I did notice the differences, would the diffences I notice be the ones that Ben intended? Would the subtle effects be subtly different even on high quality midi boxes from different manufacturers?

3) I come to NWC from the notation angle. I use NWC to play my compositions and arrangements - but only as a low quality preview of what they might sound like when I get some musicians to play them. I leave the subtleties of performance to the musicians.

If I was asked to vote on whether to give priority to improving NWC's notation capabilities or to improving its sound reproduction capabilities, my vote would go to getting the notation right every time. Let's hope there doesn't have to be a trade off between the two objectives.

Reply 15 offered by: Peter Vasey on 19-Mar-1999

Yes, Stephen, you have my vote. I too use Noteworthy primarily as a notator, and to help me learn vocal parts. The more complications built into the package, the longer it is likely to take to set a piece. Admittedly the 'extras' could be set up as options, but there is always the temptation to fiddle ..... If I was looking to produce an orchestral performance, I would be inclined to set the basics in NWC then export the MIDI to a good sequencer for fine tuning (as per Barry in reply 4).

Peter

Reply 16 offered by: Ben Bacon on 20-Mar-1999

Stephen Randall,

Thanks for your reply.

>does Midi allow one to vary the dynamic of one note in a
>chord using a single voice? Or would an extra voice be
>required?

As far as I know, MIDI control messages (velocity, volume, etc.) affect all notes assigned to a channel - in NWC, the relationship of channel to staff is one to one. By assigning the notes in a chord to different staves, it would be possible to use different channels for each note, and thus to send different control messages. Unfortunately, in NWC, this is a lot of work. I've done this with one transcription (the March from Beethoven's 9th, adapted from the Carlos version); I wouldn't be in a hurry to do it again. Very labor-intensive.

A better solution to achieving a similar effect is to have an additional staff which contains only the accents. While this is workable in some situations, it doesn't address diminuendos, and gets cumbersome if you want to achieve the effect for a lot of channels.

Note (hah!) that I'm not suggesting that NWC support multiple channels per staff; this really would be a significant change to the way note data is compiled into MIDI data. The addition of per-note (really, per-channel) performance dynamics is much simpler.

>i.e. if we are asking for NWC to allow one or more notes
>within a chord to be emphasised, would this >be implementation of an existing Midi feature or would it
>be facilitation of a workaround to overcome one of the
>shortcomings of Midi?

A good question, but no - the issue is the granularity of data entry interfaces for features that NWC *already provides*. The existing dynamic and MPC interfaces are suitable for passages, perhaps measures at most - not phrases.

A change to NWC performance dynamics that would extend MIDI nicely would be the specification of relative, rather than absolute, controller values.

>2) How useful is Midi as a distribution medium? The
>capabilities of devices varies greatly. If Ben
>gets his wish and can add the subtle variations in note
>dynamics would I notice the difference if I played one of
>his efforts on my SB16?
> . . . [snip] . . .

Hundreds of thousands of MIDI files are available for download off the Net. Major software works from major publishers ship with MIDI soundtracks. It might not be CD quality, but for computer-based multimedia, MIDI is a very viable distribution medium.

The ultimate effect of my note-level performance tuning would seem to depend on my skill as a transcriber, wouldn't it? ;-) Your SB16 is certainly capable of reproducing my efforts - I refer you to the soundtracks of LucasArt's 'Dark Forces', Raven's 'Hexen II', or Maxis' 'SimCity 3000' for some recent examples of commercial MIDI work that range from decent to amazing.

As for the benefits of having such control within NWC - you can hear it for yourself, if you play an instrument that can output MIDI velocity and volume along with note data: write out the notation for a simple piece (try a Scarlatti sonata, if you're into Baroque) in NWC. Add all the dynamics and MPCs you like. Now, record your own performance of the same piece, using your instrument. Quantize to the same resolution, and compare the recording with the transcription.

>3) I come to NWC from the notation angle. I use NWC to
>play my compositions and arrangements - but only as a low
>quality preview of what they might sound like when I get
>some musicians to play them. I leave the subtleties of
>performance to the musicians.

That's cool - but that's you. I don't have access to musicians to play my transcriptions, or the technical skill (not to mention equipment) necessary to perform and record them myself. I'm not asking for NWC to overcome the limits of MIDI transcription - just to support a more precise way of expressing my intentions, within the limitations of the medium.

Thanks for your reply; sorry to run on and on. You raise some good points. ;-)

Peace,
Ben

Reply 17 offered by: Ben Bacon on 20-Mar-1999

Peter,

>If I was looking to produce an orchestral performance, I
>would be inclined to set the basics in NWC then export the
>MIDI to a good sequencer for fine tuning (as per Barry in
>reply 4).

And as per my reply - that's fine, except where do you draw the line between dynamic and score-based "tuning"? The problem is exacerbated when you can't readily transfer your work back and forth between NWC and the "good sequencer." Note, BTW, that you're not using the latter for anything resembling "sequencing"...

I'd love to hear from somebody else who's attempted a serious transcription of an orchestral score using NWC - am I the only one? If anybody would like to hear some early attempts, from about a year ago, see the Music page at http://www.bebweb.com.

Reply 18 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Mar-1999

Well I don't know how "serious" it is, but you might want to look at my work with The Magic Flute (particularly the overture), also there's Adam Bodkin's treatment of a movement from a Mahler symphony, and a few other such entries available at the Scriptorium http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com

Reply 19 offered by: Barry Graham on 21-Mar-1999

It is possible to have different velocities on different notes of the same chord on a common channel.
Velocity - unlike volume - is attached to the Note On message at the attack.

Volume is assigned to the channel.
All notes respond to a velocity increase on the channel - although if you want to hear this on a sustained note you will need a wavetable sound card.

I would prefer NWC to become THE first class notation processor that it promises to be.
For the arrangements I write (big band, jazz octets, etc.)
NWC does a pretty reasonable job of score and part production but it does not allow swing quantizing, track slips or the subtle velocity pushes I require if I need to make a midi file of my arrangements.So I use software that specializes in midi file creation and editing.

But I dont expect Eric to build this sort of functionality into NWC - I can happily get by using other software.
Once the arrangement is written, the parts printed or hand-copied and the midi file created I dont have a need to re-import the midi file back into NWC.

High-end notation software is extremely expensive compared to NWC but NWC only requires a few additional tweeks to reach the standard of print-out I require.
In the meantime it's the best value shareware notation package around.


#1104: Your Wish Is Too Large ...?
Your Wish Is Too Large ...?

(1104)

Submitted by: C. R. Bryan on 10-Mar-1999

Here it is anyway, then, posted to forum.
---
Two versions of the same enhancement.
1. A STRUM button puts a graphic ripple to the left of the affected chord.
In MIDI, the playout of the chord is sequenced stairstep-style, the exact MIDIclocks per terrace depending on the current tempo, so that the chord does sound strummed.
2. A performance style marked "strum" which begins applying the above strum method to every chord, until closed with a "hammer" marking (which switches to the current default playing style).
You might as well make the strum terrace length a combo-box-selectable parameter right up front, that way you don't have to take time to develop the tempo-to-strum algorithm on the first iteration.
Those who need this to get natural-sounding guitar playout will be able to tune the stepping by ear to get what
they're after, without having to know anything about the underlying MIDI datastream. If they need tighter control
than the performance style setting gives them, they'll cut and paste strum-tweaked chords.
My work is currently expanding 30 years of solo singer/songwriter/guitarist compositions into full orchestrations, using MIDI and/or NWC for Net-based collaborations. I know what the guitar needs to sound like on strummed compositions; it takes this enhancement or a raw MIDI editor to get it.
---
btw another vote for a GNU/Linux port. Go look at www.linuxberg.com: there's room for shareware in the Linux world.

Reply 1 offered by: Sue on 11-Mar-1999

Be sure you put wishes in the "wish list" on this site or they won't be "counted"... In the forum or NG is not enough, I've been told!


#1105: Glissandos
Glissandos

(1105)

Submitted by: Jon Boehmer on 12-Mar-1999

How do you generate a glissando with Noteworthy Composer?

I'm composing a piece of music and need that part to complete the song. Its nothing with out the glissandos

Can you help?

Thanks in advance

Jon Boehmer

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 14-Mar-1999

Jon,

At this stage, gliss's (esp. on keyboard) are best implemented as follows:

1) Obtain and install the boxmarks font (say, from the Noteworthy Scriptorium, http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ )

2) Use the boxmarks font as a User Defined font to put a graphic (text) gliss in your staff.

3) Use a hidden staff to implement the actual notes to be played.

Hope this helps,

Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 15-Mar-1999

Also see msg #1075 and associated threads


#1106: ties and slurs
ties and slurs

(1106)

Submitted by: Wes Matchett on 12-Mar-1999

I've been using NW for over two years, but I've started down a new path.... I am trying to use NW to create quartet sheet music, but there are two things causing difficulty:

When I slur a two-note chord I would like the slur mark to apear both above and below the chord. For instance - treble cleff a/c slur to f/e: I'd like slurs showing both the upward and downward movement. Is this possible? Ties seem to handle this just fine.

My second question is about lyrics. NW does not seem to handle multiple endings to a repeated section. When I define two lyric lines, the second keeps right on displaying into the first ending. I have to '_' space through it until I arrive at the second ending. And when I want to contue with the bride lyrics after the multiple endings, I have to add to the end of one of the lyric lines and space through until I get to the proper measures. If I alter those spaced measures then my lyrics get scrambled.

Am I doing something wrong? This seems more difficult than is needed - something I have come NOT to expect from NW. If anyone is listeneing at NWA Inc... lyrics should be defined for a section of music at a time. things before and after that section in the score should not affect the relationship between the lyrics and the score.

Any help is greatly appreciated.
-Wes

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Mar-1999

You can get two slurs by using of staff layering. Unfortunately, the slurs are always placed relative to the note head, so you may not get the effect that you want. You can change the stem direction of the (I believe) first note to change where the slur goes.

A simple thing to wish (http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm) for is the ability to edit the placement of the slur (above/below). This would give you what you need.

Reply 2 offered by: michael e. lindenmeyer on 26-Apr-1999

Yup, I have discovered the same problem, and tried reversing the orientation of the first notes so that the slurs/ties would look right. Now the notes are oriented wrong. It is an unfortunate consequence of how the software is written, so I have added what I believe is a really important feature to the wish list.
mel 990416.1135


#1107: NWC Offline Forum Using WindoZe 3.11
NWC Offline Forum Using WindoZe 3.11

(1107)

Submitted by: Rich Nagel on 14-Mar-1999

Just a note to let any users still using Windows 3.1x that you can manually extract the EXE file using Pkunzip for DOS. If you have Win32's installed in Windows 3.1x, the 32-bit Winhelp will load in the extracted .HLP just fine (you'll have to rename the files to remove the whitespace 'tho, a glitch from unzipping long filenames in DOS).

Rich

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Mar-1999

Awesome! Thanks for that. It's nice to know that there are still others out there who prefer Jurassic Windoze to the "new improved" versions.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Mar-1999

Didn't work at first... then I reread the post and the reference to the "32-bit winhelp". It seems that when installing win32s using the supplied installer, the 32-bit help files are not automatically extracted! You can get around this by opening the win32s archive file (the version I have is w32s130c.zip) in winzip, and manually extracting winhlp32.exe, winhlp32.cnt and winhlp32.hlp into your Windows directory. Optionally drag winhlp32.exe into your program group of choice to create the 32-bit help icon. And away you go!

Incidentally, the self-extractor works fine, but you do have to rename the files to eliminate the whitespace, as Rich indicates. Easiest way is from DOS, or using a DOS shell such as DCOM.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-Mar-1999

Coincidentally, the next release of the offline forum will use short filenames, NWCFORUM.HLP and NWCFORUM.CNT.

Reply 4 offered by: Rich Nagel on 15-Mar-1999

(Fred Nachbaur wrote on 15-Mar-1999)

>>>>>
Awesome! Thanks for that. It's nice to know that there are still others out there who prefer Jurassic Windoze to the
"new improved" versions.
<<<<<

Not to mention all of the new bugs, aahhheemmm <clearing throat>... I mean "features" <BG>.

Rich

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Mar-1999

>Coincidentally, the next release of the offline forum will >use short filenames, NWCFORUM.HLP and NWCFORUM.CNT.

Hooray, yippee and thanks a lot, NWC Support!

btw - this thing is awesome! Had no idea what I was missing. Great resource! :-)

Reply 6 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 16-Mar-1999

That's great news about the shorter file names - particularly names without gaps in. This was one of the very tricky areas that was in my instructions on how to run the off line forum that I notified here last year sometime.

It will be far easier for us trogs to run this now.

Richard

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 16-Mar-1999

I have a vision of the worlds last remaining BBS called YeOldeWorldeWindozeBBS and Richard and Fred as the last remaining correspondents.

Now own up - who was it the upgraded to Win 3.11 from 3.1?

While cleaning out a cupboard I found a copy of DOS 2.1 complete with manuals that you guys may be able use.
Who'd like to open the bidding? <smile-grin-TIC>

Reply 8 offered by: Rich Nagel on 16-Mar-1999

>>>>>I have a vision of the worlds last remaining BBS called YeOldeWorldeWindozeBBS and Richard and Fred as the last remaining correspondents.<<<<<

<LOL>! Boy, do I remember the good 'ole "BBS days", with my 2400 baud modem using Bitcom for DOS (and the people who saw me running Bitcom and saying "WOW!! What program is that???!" <BG>.

Rich

Reply 9 offered by: Rich Nagel on 16-Mar-1999

Hi Richard,

>>>>>That's great news about the shorter file names - particularly names without gaps in. This was one of the very tricky areas that was in my instructions on how to run the off line forum that I notified here last year sometime. It will be far easier for us trogs to run this now.<<<<<

BTW, y'all HAVE to check out ZIPBLANK and ZIPSHORT, two of Günter Nagler's utilities at http://www.iicm.edu/Cpub. These utils are GREAT :))!!

Rich

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Mar-1999

Sorry Barry, no bid on DOS 2.x. Now 3.30... THERE was an operating system. Simple yet effective, still run it on my '286.

If you think Windoze 3.1x is jurassic, check THIS out!

http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~stevemcd/fredn.htm

Fred

Reply 11 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Mar-1999

I have a whole lot of basic and assembler code programs for a C64 or 6502 chip if you would like them also.
And a bit of Fortran IV if your interested in drainage design circa 1970!
(Never got around to the ZX81 - a bit to advanced for me!)

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 17-Mar-1999

About extracting files with long names under Win3.x, I'd like to add that you can use WindowsCommander too. It's a good replacement for Explorer/Winfile, winzip, pk(un)zip, rar, tar, and many others. I use it since 3 years now, under *any* windows version.
Referring to .hlp file for Win32s help, one hint is to rename nwcforum.hlp to nwcforum.h32 and to associate the .h32 extension to WinHlp32.exe :-)

Wow, it's good to get back the InterNet! Even with a 2400 modem (yup, it does still work...).

HTH,
          MAD

Reply 13 offered by: Rich Nagel on 17-Mar-1999

>>>>>Simple yet effective, still run it on my '286.<<<<<

Hehe, I used DRDOS 6.0 for years on my '286, remember that one? Man, that OS was nice, even came with disk compression and a defragger :) And, even allowed expanded memory (using a 3rd party memory manager) so that I could play Falcon 3.0 with all of the digital sounds enabled <G>.

Rich

Reply 14 offered by: Rich Nagel on 17-Mar-1999

Hiya Mad,

>>>>>About extracting files with long names under Win3.x, I'd like to add that you can use WindowsCommander too<<<<<

Thanx for the tip about Windows Commander :)) I have had WC for some time now and use it extensively, but never realized that it would remove the whitespaces in a ZIP file :)

Rich

Reply 15 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 17-Mar-1999

<<<<<<<I have a vision of the worlds last remaining BBS called YeOldeWorldeWindozeBBS and Richard and Fred as the last remaining correspondents.>>>>>>>>>

Don't forget about CP/M and DRS . I might just relinquish these one day !

BTW - anyone know where the SoundBlaster BBS went to?

Rich.

Reply 16 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Mar-1999

My God Richard!
I have previously conferred King of Trog on Fred.
I guess I'll have to make you Prince of Lodyte!

Reply 17 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-May-1999

Found the easiest way to deal with the associations situation is to re-associate ALL *.hlp files with winhelp32.exe. Works great. From File Mangler, click on any *.hlp file, then use File --> Associate to reassociate all help files with the 32-bit version. Works fine with every hlp file I've yet fun across.


#1108: Transposing only part of a staff
Transposing only part of a staff

(1108)

Submitted by: Marti on 17-Mar-1999

I am new to using NoteWorthy composer. I find it to be a great composition tool, very flexible and with really great printing quality. What I would like to do is transpose only part of a staff. For example, I have a song going along in the key of G, then there's a transition, and it continues in the key of A. Since the chorus in A is the same as the chorus in G, I'd like to just copy and paste it, then transpose the latter part of the staff up 2 semi-tones. However the transpose function seems to only affect the whole staff or none at all. Does anyone have a solution so that I don't have to completely re-enter that whole section manually in a new key?

Also, does any version of NWC have the ability to add
8va--------| symbols above or below a staff, so I don't have to add notes with 4 or 5 leger lines, which my students find hard to read? Thanks.

Marti

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Mar-1999

Firstly - you can enter the 8va above or below as an option when you enter a clef.

To transpose only part of a staff.
Copy the section to be transposed onto another empty staff or a staff in another window.
Transpose this staff.
Cut or Copy and Paste back into the original staff.

Make sure your staves have a key signature - even when in C major or A minor otherwise transposition wont occur as expected.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 18-Mar-1999

I very infrequently see 8va attached to a cleff. Sometimes I see 8vbasso on string bass parts but frequently its just assumed for these. Its much more frequent to see 8va------------------ over a section of a staff. As Marti says - it cuts down on the eye strain trying to count the ledger lines.

In NWC you can add 8va------- as text over a section of a staff, but you can't get NWC to do the transposition just for that section. Now there's an idea! I'm off to the wish list.

- now there's a good idea. I'm off to the wish list!

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Mar-1999

'Til it's implemented, a workaround is... once again... to have visible muted staves with the 8va----- over them as needed, and a "sounded" hidden staff where you insert clefs with the appropriate octave up/down option clicked to make the sound follow accordingly. Or, since these staves will be hidden anyway during printing or display with NWP, simply live with the high (or low) notes on leger lines.

Reply 4 offered by: Sue Morton on 18-Mar-1999

Hi Marti,

Regarding copying the chorus and transposing, there are a couple of ways you can do this...

If the part you're copying is very short, sometimes it is easiest to simply cut and paste the section. With the pasted section highlighted, use CTRL-SHIFT with up-arrow/down-arrow to move the block up and down the staff to the correct position. This of course does not put accidentals on, as it is only moving the notes up and down the staff, so you have to go back and put them by hand. Again, if the section being copied and transposed is very short, this can be a quick solution.

The other way is to temporarily add a new staff. Set it up in the old key and copy your chorus to that staff. Then transpose the staff to the new key. Copy and paste the new chorus to where you want it, then delete the temporary staff from your score. This doesn't take very much time and will do the job nicely. You may have to force accidentals and audit accidentals to get the new section to look correct for the key it is now in.

Regarding the "8va---------" markings, if you don't care about playback but only care about the printed score, then the advice already given to use the text insert tool works beautifully. (You may have to play with it a little to get it to look the way you want on paper.)

The other advice to use the octave shift up/down on the clef will certainly take care of playback, but may/may not be interpreted as elegantly by the musician reading the printed score. So the advice to use two staffs - a mute but visible staff with the "8va" text on it, and a non-muted but hidden staff that uses the octave shift, will take care of both the playback and the printed score.

Good Luck!

Sue

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Bacher on 19-Mar-1999

The simplest solution to the 8va problem is to combine
the two techniques: use Insert Text for the 8va------
and insert "octave up" and "octave down" clefs before
and after the 8va section. A couple of extranous clefs
on the score shouldn't be that distracting, and you don't
have to play with hidden staves.

- seb


#1109: Crescendos and ritardandoes
Crescendos and ritardandoes

(1109)

Submitted by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 18-Mar-1999

Does anyone have any clues on how to apply smooth crescendoes and ritardandoes to Noteworthy projects? Preferrably in a way that affects several staffs simultaneously. A long time ago I submitted to the wish list a few thaughts about a master track that could handle such issues, I don't know if Noteworthy is working on it

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 18-Mar-1999

Yes please!

Reply 2 offered by: Russ on 18-Mar-1999

they way i do crescendos is to input a dynamic such as mp and then enter the crescendo mark and then input my final dynamic marking, say fff. And it should gradually increase note volume for you.

Russ

Reply 3 offered by: Grant Hicks on 19-Mar-1999

I don't think crescendo and decrescendo have any effect on held notes. For this you need the multi-point controller, which is (imho) awkward at best.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 19-Mar-1999

If you are changing MIDI volume, and your sound card is of higher quality, then the volume changes will have an effect on held notes.


#1110: Problems with Notating Piano Fingering
Problems with Notating Piano Fingering

(1110)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 21-Mar-1999

I have run into multiple problems trying to put fingering numbers onto a piano score. The root problem is that I cannot insert text between beamed notes. I am then forced to start at the beginning of the beamed notes and insert the right number of spaces. Problem two is that the position on the screen does not reflect the position on the printed score. So I have to flip back and forth between Print Preview and the note entry view. Unfortunately Print Preview does not remember what page I was on, so I have to page through it every time. Problem three is when the beamed note section is long (ie. 6 beamed notes) the Insert Text field is not long enough to reach to the end, making it almost impossible to achieve what I want. After all this, the result is unstable - a change elsewhere in the score can throw all the positions off. They even change when switching to another printer.

So here is a wish (or wishes) that should not be too difficult: Please allow insert text (or anything else, like dynamics) between beamed notes. Also, when inserting text it would be nice if it would start right above the next note, skipping over leading accidentals.

While I am complaining, I should be able to select a group of notes and ask them all to become (for example) eighth notes. This does not work. I makes it harder to fix the mess from importing triplets.

This is such a good program; I don't usually run into compounding problems like this. I hope some fixes will come soon. I'm off to the wish list (http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm).

By the way, using the lyric line for fingering won't work because you can't place the numbers, it can't handle chords, and it won't work with long sequences of beamed notes.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Bacher on 25-Mar-1999

I wouldn't ask for Insert Text to be changed so that it starts over the note instead of over the accidental. I can't think of any situation offhand where it might matter,
but I'm sure that it works best as is.

Mainly, as long as you're wishing, why not wish for what you really want instead of wishing for a tweak to a different
feature so you can continue to use it as a workaround for the real thing? In this case, I'd wish for the ability to
assign "finger number" attributes to notes, similar to the way that accents, staccato marks, etc., are associated with them. (You could even define your own note markings and have them associated with notes.) The only hangup is with notating fingerings of chords - you would have to be able to specify a "stack" of numbers - unless we also wished for, and got, the ability to select individual notes of a chord,
which I believe has already been asked for.

- seb

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 25-Mar-1999

The "finger number" property of a note (or chord) would be great, but this is a tough feature to implement. You would have to be able to specify where the number (or number list) would go relative the the note (above, below, and how far).

Much easier (and hopefully sooner) is to fix the insert text between beamed notes bug (mis-feature). The insert text over notehead feature change should not hurt anybody, so, without a full support of fingering, why not?

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 07-Apr-1999

Blair, you wrote: "While I am complaining, I should be able to select a group of notes and ask them all to become (for example) eighth notes. This does not work"
Oh yes it does. Select a half, a quarter, a 32nd, and press 4: you'll got 3 eighths. If one of them is dotted, it will remain, so press '.' twice (or 3 times, depending on your double dot settings) and it will be removed.
By the way, I see this as a bug, when using '+' and '-' : I expect tht when selecting half+quarter and pressing '+', they become quarter+eighth. But they change to 2 quarters.

"It makes it harder to fix the mess from importing triplets", you said. Time to go to http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html#macros !

Hints about finger placement: use a NON proportional font, and that is common enough to be on any printer. This will less move on the printed result. You may also use Alt+0160 instead of space, with certain fonts it is larger.

hth, MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 07-Apr-1999

Thanks for the tips. The monospace font is a good idea as it is probably more predictable for the layout software. I really should look at Andrew's macros.

About selecting groups of notes with different time values I find that the Note Value commands (eg. 1, 2, 3) are disabled, and do not work, which I think is a bug. I am using 1.55a. But I did not know about the plus and minus keys, and they do what I wanted to do: setting all the selected notes to the same value (which YOU think is a bug!)

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Apr-1999

Wow, cool! Learn something new every day... never knew about the +/- thing! I also found that the direct assignment (1, 2, 3, etc.) doesn't work with a selection of notes of different lengths... but +/- does. So simply follow the + or - with the desired "hot key" and away you go. I'd hesitate to call either of these properties "bugs," rather it's "just the way it works." Once you figure it out, it's quite predictable and useful.

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-Apr-1999

Well, for the next release it would be nice if direct assignment of multiple length notes worked, and the + and - behaved as Marsu expected. Along the same lines, I have a piece of music which I want to convert from 4/4 time to 2/4 time. It would be nice to have a command (eg. * and /) that would double or half the value of all selected notes.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 09-Apr-1999

I have to mention that I found a turnaround for the '+'/'-' behaviour. I use a macro that select the item to the right, press '+', go once to the right (so deselect). I affect this to Alt+Shift+NumpadPlus, and then I use it repeatedly (even through bars and other items, since it just "beeps" but go through anyway.
Use Alt+Shift+NumpadMinus for the '-' procedure.
hth,
        Marsu


#1111: Irreversible merging
Irreversible merging

(1111)

Submitted by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 22-Mar-1999

After som lazy time with my composer I'm now back to God-speed, and I'm ready to throw out a few more wishes. Only last week I got the hang of layering staffs with the experimental feature, but still I experience that after exporting / importing as type 1 midi, the staffs are still separated. My humble wish #1: Could you incorporate a button/command that becomes active only on layered staffs, that will completely merge the staffs in question? I've made my own little argumentlist:
1: I want this feature for midi files that I publicate so that people who want to work on my files is encouraged to contact me first to get the original file.
2: MIDI-file size will be smaller (that's not much of a problem anyway!)
3: When PgUp-ing PgDwn-ing between staffs, I'm always sure which staff I'm on, without lifting my eyes ( too much, that is)
4: I can make one staff for all voices in a group (1. 2. and 3. trumpet i.e.)

Wish #2: It's about time that Noteworthy starts to reveal some of the new features we will see in the next patch / edition! When will we see OCR-importing for example? I've tried one quirky old score OCR-program some time ago, but I didn't like it at all.

Statement #1: Love you still! Keep up all the good work. In me you have one dedicated customer who will continue to buy (there was that ugly word again!) all your major releases. It's now about four years since I first laid hands on Noteworthy Composer (I don't remember which version was my first), and I haven't regretted one day that I registered it. Well spent money!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Mar-1999

You can merge any two staves (layered or not) by assigning them to the same channel and instrument patch, export as Type 0 midi, then re-import.

Note that this will lose any special formatting, dynamics, text, etc.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 26-Mar-1999

OCR is a BIG subject. I once studied it, and even if music OCR is much easier than (even printed) text OCR, this is far out of NWC scope...
For music OCR, you may try :
* MidiScan: more expensive than NWC, bad GUI, not good recognition results. But may be satisfactory in many cases.
* Capella Scan: MUCH (!) more expensive than NWC, good GUI, great speed, and excellent recognition (97-99% in notes AND text). BUT you'll need another Capella product (cap_midi.exe) to export to midi format.
Other products are out, of course. But rare are cheap products, due to the enormous work it needs.

Any programmer free to achieve such development ? ;-)

HRU (happy reg'd user), MAD


#1112: Master staff
Master staff

(1112)

Submitted by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 22-Mar-1999

One little issue I forgot: I never heard anything about the master staff I wished for, for the first time several years ago. Or maybe templates, or maybe (overrunnable) dynamic presets, or maybe the ability to write dynamics on all staffs simultaneously (then you would have to select more than one staff, which could be useful in other contexts as well)

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Mar-1999

Multiple-select is a long-standing wish, but it is a lot of work to implement properly and I would like to see other simpler things first (like in my previous message).

The Master Staff idea is interesting. The idea is you place a (for example) dynamic on the master staff, and it appears on all the other staves. I'm not sure how you would place things in it. Say you want a dynamic after the third beat in bar 28 - how do you do this without notes on the staff? I suppose you could place non-printing rests.

Reply 2 offered by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 22-Mar-1999

Non printing rests is one solution... How about an algoritm that calculates the resolution of the rests, based on the note lenght on the staffs above, beat by beat?!?


#1113: Two-line titles
Two-line titles

(1113)

Submitted by: Dave Washburn on 23-Mar-1999

I know I've seen the answer to this somewhere on this website before, but I can't seem to find it. I want to make a two-line title for some printed NWC scores, e.g.
My Dog Has Fleas
(and so do I)
I know there's a way to enter some control characters to make the title come out this way and I can't seem to find what they are. Can somebody give me a quick reminder?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 23-Mar-1999

No control characters can be made to do this. You can, however, add text early on in the top staff which appear to blend with the title. See msg #448 and msg #1027.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 24-Mar-1999

See the user tip at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#authleft

I suggest adding the text last, not early, because any new notation at the beginning of the song, point size change, margin change, etc. can cause your title to move.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Starfield on 25-Mar-1999

Hi Dave - for total freedom in printing headings you can print then using your word processor. Then feed the printed page back into your printer, select page setup in NoteWorthy, on the options tab untick the "Title page info" box and in the Margins tab set the top margin to 2 inches or whatever you need to miss your headings.Then print the score.

Reply 4 offered by: PhilM on 26-Mar-1999

If you have MS Word, you can edit the image, and add the second line then, but be careful, as the leading half of slurs/ties seems to disappear. (I don't have any other word processing s/ware to try it out on...)


#1114: GMI?
GMI?

(1114)

Submitted by: Eddie on 24-Mar-1999

How do I listen to midi files with *.gmi format?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 24-Mar-1999

Although I am not familar with a *.gmi file type, I will hazzard a guess. It sounds like this is an abbreviation for *.gmidi, which would tend to indicate that the file is:

1) a Standard MIDI file
2) conforms to the General MIDI specification

If this is the case, you should be able to rename the file as *.mid, and use it as any normal *.mid file.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Mar-1999

Sure this isn't RMI?

Reply 3 offered by: Eddie on 24-Mar-1999

Thanks, I can read it using NW after change it to RMI format...
It's midi from "Tie fighter" so it's very old format.


#1115: Print Preview tip
Print Preview tip

(1115)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Mar-1999

There have been a few complaints about various aspects of the Print Preview function, all of which can be worked around using Ghostscript/GSview. Set up a "virtual PostScript printer" (e.g. Applewriter), connected to FILE. Make this your default printer before entering NWC. When you want to check your printed output, use PRINT to create a PostScript file e.g. C:\TEST.PS. Bring up GSview and open the file, you can now Goto any page, change resolution and page width, etc. Use ALT-TAB to switch between GSview and NWC at will, make changes and re-"print", toggle back to GSview and hit R (redisplay) to view the modified file. (GSview is smart enough to know if another app -- i.e. NWC -- has made changes to the file.) Sounds time-consuming, but it's really not... especially on large scores, where you want to see the preview of pages towards the end.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 26-Mar-1999

this kind of always-the-same keys sequence seems to be a good candidate for macro recorder :-)
Surely works with Lose3.*, wonder about Lose98%...
Thx for the tip, Fred!

Note: it is possible, with Win3.*, to create a specific configuration to always write to the same file (i.e. the "File:" port is always redirected to a predefined file). couldn't find out how to make this under Win9*?!

MAD

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Mar-1999

The simple step of having Print Preview jump to the page that was being viewed in the score would be a big help.

So where does one obtain Ghostscript?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Mar-1999

I did up a page describing the process on my website at:

http://dogstar.beyondtheweb.com

or

http://www3.bc.sympatico.ca/dogstar

Click on the "About Ghostview" link to get into the page, there are links and instructions for installing.

Reply 4 offered by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 29-Mar-1999

Haven't anyone noticed another little design flaw in the print preview? When you zoom the preview it always takes you to the upper left corner! Please let it center to the magnifier!


#1116: Importing Triplets - a proposal
Importing Triplets - a proposal

(1116)

Submitted by: Steven Walvick on 25-Mar-1999

OK.
Noteworthy Composer doesn't import triplets, but I don't buy the reason "because midi-files don't indicate a triplet, but rather just a start and stop time of notes"

***WARNING!!! The following post may be long-winded, and completely useless. Do not operate heavy machinery while reading this post.***

Granted, it is a more difficult algorithm to look at a midi file and determine that a triplet is intended, but that DOESN'T mean it's impossible, and I think it MAY not be too hard to implement. (Then again, I don't know how exactly NWC performs the importing, so this could just be a waste of bandwidth....)

To convert .MID to .NWC the current system has to calculate how long a "beat" is. Since we know that midi doesn't indicate quarter notes etc., the NoteWorthy import procedure must do some calculation to determine that 1200 milleseconds is "1 quarter note" or whatnot.

Once you determine how many milleseconds a "Beat" (let's call it X) is, then any 'triplet' note would have to be some factor of X/3. So the importing procedure can determine if a single triplet note was intended.

However, this doesn't completely help us, because NWC does not deal with single triplets, but rather as a GROUP of notes that are 'triplicized' (yes, I just made up that word--so sue me)

So, in order to import a triplet from a midi file, we need to look at a GROUP of notes. One possible way to do this, would be to create a list of note durations, that begins with the first note that may be a triplet, and whose running total is some factor of the beat. Once the total is finished, we convert all the notes in the list to a triplet figure.

{E.g. 1 Quarter = 1200 ms.
First we encounter a note of duration 800 ms, so we start our list. Then we see a note of duration 800 again. (our running total of 1600 is not a factor of 1200, so we continue adding to the list) The third note has a duration of 400, and the fourth note also has a duration of 400. At this point we have 4 notes that we know add up to 2400 ms and thus fit into 2 quarter notes.

To convert this list to triplets, we could multiply the note lengths in the list by 3/2 and then put some kind of triplet tag around the notes in the list.

And so, the algorithm above would import the notes as a triplet figure containing 2 quarters followed by 2 eighths.
}

If in the middle of the list you encounter a note length that is NOT some factor of X/3 (that is a note which is not a triplet), the algorithm can abort the search, and just import the notes regularly.

Things I KNOW I haven't considered:
* Chords with varying length notes
* Triplet figures which might extend over barlines

So what's wrong with my idea (I'm sure there IS A problem, otherwise somebody else must have thought of this already!)

-Steven
p.s. If this DOESN'T prove feasible, how about adding a feature "audit triplets" which essentially searchs the staff for eighth-quarter-eighth patterns (such as NWC currently imports triplets) and runs the Recorder macro, so ingeniously written by Andrew Purdam?

p.p.s. If this IS a good idea, should I submit it to the WISH LIST?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 25-Mar-1999

>>To convert .MID to .NWC the current system has to calculate how long a "beat" is. Since we know that midi doesn't indicate quarter notes etc., the NoteWorthy import procedure must do some calculation to determine that 1200 milleseconds is "1 quarter note" or whatnot.<<

One hiccup straight away is in deciding whether a staccato quarter note is a staccato quarter note or an eighth note followed by an eighth rest. This is adjusted somewhat by the "rest granularity".

>>Once you determine how many milleseconds a "Beat" (let's call it X) is, then any 'triplet' note would have to be some factor of X/3. So the importing procedure can determine if a single triplet note was intended.<<

Maybe it would be easier to look for notes that START every X/3 (and who stop before the next one starts).

>>'triplicized' (yes, I just made up that word--so sue me)<<
I made up "tripletize" years ago. Expect a letter from my solicitor! :)

>>So, in order to import a triplet from a midi file, we need to look at a GROUP of notes. One possible way to do this, would be to create a list of note durations, that begins with the first note that may be a triplet, and whose running total is some factor of the beat. Once the total is finished, we convert all the notes in the list to a triplet figure. <<

I think that note durations would be a little difficult to use (though could provide good hints), and maybe note down times are better for determining groups. I can see that a generic approach could be use for ALL tuplets, though. And controlled by some import parameter so that rubato doesn't get misinterpreted.

>>Things I KNOW I haven't considered:
* Chords with varying length notes
* Triplet figures which might extend over barlines<<

I didn't think that triplets could extend over barlines.

>>So what's wrong with my idea (I'm sure there IS A problem, otherwise somebody else must have thought of this already!)<<

My guess is that Eric may have thought of this, but it may be further down his list of things to do.

>>p.s. If this DOESN'T prove feasible, how about adding a feature "audit triplets" which essentially searchs the staff for eighth-quarter-eighth patterns (such as NWC currently imports triplets) and runs the Recorder macro, so ingeniously written by Andrew Purdam?<<

The eighth-quarter-eighth pattern is only one of many possible interpretations. However, "Audit Triplets" is a very good idea, and possibly how Eric would do it anyway. They are just stages of the importation process, after all.

>>p.p.s. If this IS a good idea, should I submit it to the WISH LIST?<<

YES! Even if it's NOT a good idea! ;-)
I'm sure that Eric appreciates these sorts of suggestions that include possible algorithms. Whilst he may not use them, they must provide food for thought. (I HOPE he appreciates them, I used to send him dozens of these sorts of academic ideas :) 'Sfunny tho. Suggestions from programmers always make me wish we could "get at" the format or code to implement all these ideas. However, it would take a huge leap of faith for Noteworthy Artware to proceed down that path, as control becomes much more difficult. And my hat goes off to Eric and Beth for providing this forum and the newsgroup where they really assert very little control, and let the users say whatever they like. Hopping of my soap box now. - A

Reply 2 offered by: Steven Walvick on 25-Mar-1999

>>'triplicized' (yes, I just made up that word--so sue me)<<
>> I made up "tripletize" years ago. Expect a letter from my solicitor! :)<<

Ah, you created the word "tripletize" which I believe is intended as a verb meaning "to make into a triplet"

"triplicized" is an adjective meaning 'having been marked as a tuble of the third order'

In fact, the distinction goes even further beyond that!
I believe your word "tripletize" is derived from the Greek 'Tripleticus' who was a deity known for his enormus endowment, and from whom we have the phrase "third leg"

Meanwhile "triplicized" actually comes from the verb "riplicate" which as we all know means 'to replicate poorly' (thus the "i" instead of the "e") And many cunning linguists (or SOMETHING like that anyhow...) now believe that "triplicized" became used in musical terminology (quite recently in fact!) to mean groupings of notes indicated as triplets, since triplets can easily be described as notes that have been replicated so poorly that they have to be shorted just to squeeze them into the measure!

I hope that clarified the difference!

-Steve
PhD of blathering and double-talk

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Mar-1999

Interesting topic. I agree with Andrew that the criterion should be the "note on" time, rather than the absolute duration. Longer durations (even overlapping other notes) can be handled with ties, shorter ones with staccato or rests.

Perhaps it would help to have a look at how sequencers (e.g. the Cubase or Cakewalk families) handle this. In such programs, midi imports (or for that matter live performances) are stored in "raw" form, and the scoring aspect can be viewed as a sort of "post processing" that determines only how the notes are displayed. Other useful concepts are "quantise" and "snap"; quantise rounds the notes to the nearest available length (e.g. quarter, dotted 1/8, 1/8, tripletised 1/8, etc.) and "snap" rounds to the nearest available position. Again, such quantisation or snap can usually be "undone", reverting to the raw performance or midi import.

NWC seems to do this, to a degree, already -- using the note and rest resolution parameters, though I'll be the first to admit that I haven't really figured out how this works to a point where it's as intuitive and straightforward as the quantise and snap approach. I can't see that extending this to other durations (i.e. n-tuplets) would be impossible or even all that difficult... but then such things always looks easy until you actually try to do it!

Reply 4 offered by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 29-Mar-1999

Giving some thaught to the subject, it seems that importing triplets would be a fairly simple thing to implement. When importing a midi file, we already know how long is one quarter. When knowing that, it's simple arithmetic to determine the length oh a dotted eight or sixteenth, as a triplet would be made up of. When the import filter then finds one such note, it is a simple IF next note is of the same duration (+/- 3% for safety)AND the next note after that AND all three notes exists in the same bar,THEN we have a triplet.

By the way, what language is Noteworthy written in?

Reply 5 offered by: Steven Walvick on 29-Mar-1999

>>> When the import filter then finds one such note, it is a simple IF next note is of the same duration (+/- 3% for safety)AND the next note after that
AND all three notes exists in the same bar,THEN we have a triplet. <<<

It's not quite THAT simple. That would show us a pattern of 3 triplets of equal length, but that wouldn't handle all cases.

As far as Noteworthy is concerned, ANY grouping of notes that fit into 3-beats (or multiple thereof) can be made into triplets (and thus shortened to fit into 2-beats (or multiple thereof) oh I should close the other parenthesis!)

So, any algorithm to find triplets can't assume that there will only be 3-notes in a triplet group, OR that the notes will all be the same length!

The pattern: "Quarter, Quarter, Eighth, Eighth" can be tripletized; or even the 2-note pattern "dotted-quarter, dotted-quarter"

So, the difficulty is that, while the current MIDI import procedure needs only go straight through the file, any NEW program to find triplets, will have to temporarily store information about the score somewhere concerning triplets! And perhaps THAT'S the reason, it hasn't been implemented yet.


#1117: Running this past everyone prior to wish listing
Running this past everyone prior to wish listing

(1117)

Submitted by: PhilM on 26-Mar-1999

As you all know, you can set the location that playback starts, in the Tools/Options~midi dialog.
Would people find it easier to alter this at any time if it were part of the menubar... say as a separate dropdown list that could be altered, or as a selection that appears when the play button is pressed?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 26-Mar-1999

Maybe if you right-mouse click the Play button?
Personally, I use F5 and rapid use of the Ctrl-<- and
Ctrl--> keys.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Mar-1999

My ideal in this regard would be a slider bar (like a scroll bar) much like the ones provided on most midi players (including microsoft Media Player) to quickly drag the current play position anywhere in the piece. It would be nice if clicking on the stops at the end would advance or regress one bar at a time.

I presently make considerable use of CNTL-G to goto a particular bar number, but it's a bit of a hassle remembering all those numbers.

Reply 3 offered by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 29-Mar-1999

I gave this subject som thaught only last night, and the solution I came up with was (simply enough) BOOKMARKS! Say, let's combine bookmarks with the previous reply, and let a right click on the play button bring up a list of defined bookmarks to start playback from? How about that?

Reply 4 offered by: David Wallace on 05-Apr-1999

While we're on the subject of bookmarks, it would be good
to have them at the beginning and end of a selection that
needs to be consistently replayed to get right.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 06-Apr-1999

David, you mean a piece of the score you're working on, and you want to enhance ?
I sometimes had to do such work (when composing directly with NWC) and the best solution I found was to create a "working file" in which I put only the few measures I was working on (and then set the play parameter from Start).
Really handy when you need to work on a full phrase.
If you have many staves (I once had 6 for such a work session), the simplest is to duplicate your current score, remove all the music before the part you're working on.

Other solution: you may program a macro that goes to a particular measure and then starts play from there... :-)

hth,
      MAD

Reply 6 offered by: Tim Gilmour on 07-Apr-1999

Good idea, David and "MAD",
What if one could "select" across staves, with a special function key held down while selecting? That way I could select a complete (4 or 5 part) section of a song, and paste it into something else. Selecting without the key would perform only the default one staff select.
Tim

Reply 7 offered by: Martin Cassell on 14-Apr-1999

I would support Tim Gilmour's suggestion. 2-dimensional selection would be extremely useful for lots of operations, such as cutting and pasting, but also for applying other modifications to all parts together. I work a lot on 4-part choral music, and find it quite frustrating to have to repeat detailed changes four (or more) times over.

How about a related idea, a "power insert", which would insert an element across all staves? Just the thing to save a few dozen keystrokes when you need a fermata, a dynamic mark or a key change in all eight parts!

For comparison, 2-d selection is one of the strengths of another notation program I have used, called Mozart (see http://www.mozart.co.uk/).

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 15-Apr-1999

Sure, "vertical" selection/action would give much power to us.
About "Just the thing to save a few dozen keystrokes when you need a fermata, a dynamic mark or a key change in all eight parts!", the Cut+Paste technique is very useful too.

Eric, if Ctrl-Y could be usable as . in vi or F4 (or Ctrl-Y) in Word, i.e. repeat last action, it would be _very_ useful too. Just a suggestion :-)

And once more, recording as a (temp.) macro a sequence of actions is a great improvement. Very useful in choir work when "vertical" writing is used (JSBach Chorals, for example).

hth, MAD


#1118: Split chords
Split chords

(1118)

Submitted by: Katie on 28-Mar-1999

Help! I need to put a split chord in a composition. There seems to be the ability to do this as in 'Moonlite' (one of the samples) they do this frequently. Does anybody know?
katie

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 28-Mar-1999

The clever effects heard in the 'Moonlite' sample are achieved by using hidden staves. See msg #1175 , msg #1105 and associated threads.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 28-Mar-1999

Oops, sorry. Not msg1175, but msg #1075


#1119: Beamed Notes Spanning Bar Lines
Beamed Notes Spanning Bar Lines

(1119)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 29-Mar-1999

The score I am working on (Für Elise) has beamed notes that cross bar lines. It would look a lot nicer with them. For example bar 13 and 14 in http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/Choir/1724/#piano . Is this a reasonable thing to wish for?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Mar-1999

In the example you provide, it would probably be appropriate... but that being said, I'd be hard pressed to think of other examples where this would be desirable.

I suspect the problem is that beamed notes can't have anything between them (except I think mpc's), so if it were allowed to insert text, dynamics etc. between beamed notes, it shouldn't be much more difficult to allow insertion of a bar line.


#1120: Per-note performance dynamics - please! (2)
Per-note performance dynamics - please! (2)

(1120)

Submitted by: marsu on 31-Mar-1999

(This refers to msg #1103 which has become too big: 25186 bytes!)

Some people consider NWC as a print-only program.
Some other think of it as a sequencer only.
Some as both.
None is happy with the features he/she uses.
Okay, let's face it. Is it because you *want* some work to be done more easily (that's computer purpose, indeed)? Is it because you think hat the "other part" (print or hear) is unnecessary and "yours" should be privileged? Is it because you do not want to find out a solution, though I know there is not *always* a(n) (acceptable) solution)?
In any case you're frustrated. BUT if you decide to find an innovative way, using more widely NWC, or making new use of features you think you know, sometimes you'll find a clever and easy answer.

For instance:
   One not per chord must be accented. Problem: NWC do not let you "edit" a chord to manage each note separately. But NWC allows you a create a "hidden" staff where you'll put only rests plus the some notes you want to make more brilliant. This is *not* so tedious to do. And will allow you much more effects indeed... Just use your imagination. There are only 12 (21 if differencing # and b) notes in occidental music, but how numerous are melodies! There are maybe not plenty "items" in NWC, but many combinations are available.

Other example:
   One note per chord must be printed bigger than others. No solution at the time being. Maybe, if you consider the problem in another way: all notes as smaller (grace notes), and biggers as normal...No, not satisfactory. Well, wish list then.

Third example:
MPCs with "relative" values (a wish I made long ago). Not possible yet. But you still can note somewhere (text items, or Comments in File Info) why some values or such. Just a reminder, it will not correct the tempo when you decide to change the starting tempo... but you'll know why, and what values it had (especially when you get back to it 2 years later)

4th example:
You want to make your score swing. NWC has no option for it. But you can add MPCs that will manage 2 beats in 4 unequal parts, using Tempo MPC (much simpler than one MPC per half-beat as I proposed earlier). Moreover, you can adjust swing for each half-beat... As no sequencer does (to my knowledge).

  NWC may not print as some would like. But it does it nicely, quickly, and for much less effort than many other software.
  NWC may not sound as some would like. But for music-readers, it's much simpler than using ticks/events. At least, you still think as MIDI as music. Even if what you hear will highly depend on the hardware used (unless you aim low-level hardware, as you should for larger scope).
  NWC is not perfect. No program is, especially when they become larger... But what NWC does, it does it well. Chi va piano va sano, so let's go and propose many new features, provided they're usable by anyone, and don't turn NWC into a softnightmareware.

NWCly yours

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Mar-1999

The separation of printing from playing using hidden playback staff is very powerful. Staff layering solves many notation problems. But as the product works now, you get a lot of duplication, which makes updating the music tedious (you need to change it in two or three places.)

One simple feature would really help. It has been requested in bits and pieces by many people. Every notation unit (note, dynamic, text, everything) should have (at least) a Hide property. There are many reasons for turning off display - hiding dynamics, octave shift, etc. Even hiding text makes sense if you want to write a comment to yourself, as suggested above. In many cases a separate playback staff would be unnecessary if everything could be hidden. Hiding rests would make staff layering much easier.

Suppressing playback would also useful. For example, you could show a note, but really play some hidden notes. So maybe every notation unit should also have a Suppress Playback flag as well.

This simple request would greatly increase the ease of use of the product, make the user interface more consistent, should not be hard to do, and would not cause software bloat in this fine product.

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 31-Mar-1999

Blair: Amen!

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Mar-1999

Well stated, Blair. The avoidance of the "bloatware syndrome" is one very important to me also. I've tried sequencers and other software that purports to do "everything"... but it's so complicated and bloated that I can't do _anything_, and give up in frustration trying to do even the simple things. My very favourite quality of NWC is its simplicity -- and I'd much rather put up with sensible workarounds than have a program so full of buttons and menus and options that I don't know where to start.


#1121: notes without stems
notes without stems

(1121)

Submitted by: Chip Chillington on 31-Mar-1999

We are evaluating NW for use in preparing the parish Sunday bulletin. Often we need to include an antiphon or refrain for psalms. The usual notation for these does not include stems on any of the notes. How can we show black notes (quarter notes without stems) in NW?

Chip

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Mar-1999

I can't think of any way to do that. There has just been a long discussion (msg #1073) about different shaped notes, but of course it is just speculation. If you can live with regular notes, I have had good success with this product.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 31-Mar-1999

NWC does not provide any method for hiding or removing the stem from a note.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 01-Apr-1999

If you plan to use NWC scores into another software (word processing, ...), in that case there is a solution:
from the Print Preview, use the _C_opy button and export either as clipboard (then paste into your other document) either as .wmf file.
In your other document, "edit" the .wmf file or its result (double click on the picture in Word, for example) to remove the stems you do not want.
Do this when you're sure you're done with the NWC work, since you'll have to do it each time you import the .wmf !

Do not hesitate to ask me for more details if necessary.

    NWCly yours

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 01-Apr-1999

Ahem...
I just read the mshg 1073, and cannot figure out what ARE shaped notes. Does someone have a .gif/.jpg to refer to?
AfaIk, DO, RE, MI, FA, SOL, LA, SI are the NORMAL names of notes, at least for french, italian, spanish people. (It is translated as C, D, E, F, G, A, B in many other countries. But I remind that for vocalises, you use DO, RE, ME, FA, SO, LA, TI as note names... for simplicity sake? ;-)

So i can't figure out what IS the interest of writing DO instead of the note symbol at the proper place, especially if the "shape" depends on tonality...

For your knowledge, the note names are the first syllable of each 7 verses in the St John the Baptist' hymn , in latin. Except that DO is UT in that case (as we still use for the clef name, or other cases). Here it is:
UT queant laxis
REsonare fibris
MIra gestorum
FAmule tuorum
SOLve polluti
LAbii reatum
Sancte Iohannes.
Gui d'Arezzo, a benedict italian monk, chose that hymn, at the XIth century. UT became DO at XVIth century (probably 'cause it sounds better).

NWCly yours

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 01-Apr-1999

Marsu,

I also didn't know anything about shaped notes, but I found several pages by searching with altavista (I don't remember which ones were interesting).

What I think I understood, is that you don't have the french correspondance DO=C, RE=D, MI=E, and so on. This is true only in C major. In any case, you have DO = 1st degree, RE = 2nd degree, and so on.

For instance, in F major, DO = F, RE = G, MI = A, FA = Bb, and so on. For a french musician, it means this strange thing:
DO = fa
RE = sol
MI = la
FA = si bemol
SO = do
LA = re
TI = mi

I don't know what is the correspondance (if any) for minor keys.

I believe this also has a certain relationship with the so called "musica ficta", but I'm not sure.

About the DO instead of UT, I think it's because DO is the beginning of DOMINUS. Again, I'm not certain of that.

Reply 6 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 01-Apr-1999

I have e-mailed a GIF file, with a short extract from the Harvard Dictionary of Music. (Is there any way to attach GIF files to a forum posting?)

Shape notes were used as a way for musically untrained persons to sing hymns, by associating (sp?) different shaped note-heads with different notes of the scale.

Cyril

Reply 7 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 01-Apr-1999

For minor keys, the notes are positioned as for the related major key: that is, for a-minor, the "do" shape is on C.


#1124: Is there a way to make a Jazz Tempo
Is there a way to make a Jazz Tempo

(1124)

Submitted by: Kevin on 02-Apr-1999

Is there a way to make a Jazz Tempo

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-Apr-1999

Please refer to the User Tips section of our web site. It is linked via the "New Post" page of this forum, as well as "What do you want to do?" box of our home page.

See also: msg #1067


#1125: using yamaha sw60xg voices
using yamaha sw60xg voices

(1125)

Submitted by: yonatan lehman on 04-Apr-1999

I have just purchased a Yamaha SW60XG sound card,
It gives me great sounds but I am not sure how to get the
NC to use the extra (non general midi) voices.

I'm new to midi, from what I can gather I have to send
some bank switch codes to the card -

1) How do I insert the hex codes I need to send ?
2) Even Better - can I get the NC to give me a menu
that includes all the 600 odd voices available ?
3) Any background info, reasources and help would be great.

Thanks for your help
Yonatan

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-Apr-1999

See msg #1007


#1126: I can't get "Decresendo" to work...
I can't get "Decresendo" to work...

(1126)

Submitted by: Henry Ho on 04-Apr-1999

My sound card: Creative AWE64

How to get Decresendo to work?
I put FFF followed by Decresendo, then P after Decresendo... I can't hear any volumn reduction.

p.s. instrument used (#55) Synth Voice

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 04-Apr-1999

Hello,
If the notation you want to decrescendo is a single note, then your sound card may not support it. If it is a series of notes {4 quarters for example} then the decresc. should work fine.
- Joe

Reply 2 offered by: Henry Ho on 05-Apr-1999

Does Creative AWE64 support that thing?

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 05-Apr-1999

The AWE64 MIDI Synth does support volume changes on notes that are already playing (at least our AWE64 Gold does). Make sure that you are changing MIDI Volume, not Velocity, in your dynamics. You will need to override the volume in each dynamic, as NWC does not, by default, change MIDI Volume in a dynamic.

For a test, try the following:

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/files/voltest.nwc

Reply 4 offered by: Henry Ho on 05-Apr-1999

Yes, it does work in my creative sound blaster AWE64. Thanks for the sample file, I think it would help. Is there a section of your website that let us post up NWC files? Then we can share and learn from each other...

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 06-Apr-1999

Henry,
there is a place where you can send files (and get files too), thanks to kindness of NWC users (+ family).
It is http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ , the "NoteWorthy Composer Scriptorium".
Also exist the NWC newsgroup, if you have an access to nntp protocol.
(By the way, does someone know if a www site give access to the newsgroup, as www.remarq.com did for the previous one?)
Plus a maillist (see user tips) with the limit of 10Kb/msg.

HTH,
      Marsu

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Vasey on 06-Apr-1999

The sample also fades as expected on a Soundblaster AWE32 PnP. Just for the record!

Peter.


#1127: Drum Scores
Drum Scores

(1127)

Submitted by: Derek Parsons on 06-Apr-1999

Can anyone produce an orchestral drum score that ordinary musicians can read, instead of the midi notation?

I'm writing a musical & I need to get it played by a real orchestra - trouble is the drum notation, whilst fine on my GM module is incomprehensible to normal orchestral drummers.

Reply 1 offered by: Drake Donahue on 07-Apr-1999

If you need shaped notes, no, see the discussions in this forum.
If you know what you want the printed score to look like enter it on muted staffs. 'Hide' the GM percussion staff or staves and print away.
The drum kit utilities on the Scriptorium may be of help in shifting a note on the GM staff to a different note while preserving timing.

Reply 2 offered by: Derek Parsons on 07-Apr-1999

Thanks, Drake. I think that Drumkit.zip is more what I want - can't get it to work just yet, though. Shame that we can't yet get the x style of font. Anyone working on this?

Reply 3 offered by: Pedro Valentino on 08-Jan-2001

so this isnt an answer but can anyone tell me where to find actual drum scores and how to read them cos i want to learn but i cant cos i cant read them or find them anywhere.

thanks in advance
pedro :)

Reply 4 offered by: ric burnett on 04-Feb-2001

this isnt a reply but can anyone tell me where to get drum scores for popular rock music off the internet? i hope you can! thanx
ric

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 04-Feb-2001

Derek: regarding the x-style font.

NWC does not (currently) support alternative note styles, such as X-heads. If you happen to have an outside font with X-head notation, it can be used as "text" within NWC, but that would probably not be what you want.

My own font, "MusiSync," has a number of X-head style notes within it. It is free, at:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/

You can use it to create a text-line of X-head notes within a word processor, but you won't see staves.

Although I am not a drummer, I have noticed that X-head notation is a popular request for a future NWC enhancement. Singers could also use them for spoken words.

Reply 6 offered by: David Potvin on 06-Feb-2001

X heads, triangle heads, square heads, round hollow heads with an x or a / in it, all of the above!

There is SO MANY THINGS that we need to write when it comes to writing a drum part that the list would take version 2 AND 3 to complete! ;-)

A bit of advice to the NWC programmers: you hear people saying "too much is like not enough"? DON'T LISTEN TO THEM!
As like this one: "Never assume, because it makes an "a**" of "u" and "me"!!!" Put as much as out money's worth!!!

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Feb-2001

See my new thread regarding drum font!!!

Reply 8 offered by: rahmat on 11-Apr-2001

learn to read scores at http://catalog.com/drummers/read01.html

Reply 9 offered by: kostas dimitriou on 21-Aug-2001

hi!i am from greece and i want to ask if i can found on the net some drums scores about all the music styles(rock,funk,latin,jazz e.t.c)


#1128: Lyric Placement for Choral Scores
Lyric Placement for Choral Scores

(1128)

Submitted by: Tony Johnson on 06-Apr-1999

If the men and ladies are singing parts together, the lyrics drop in just fine, but if the ladies rest for a few beats and only the men sing, how do I get the lyrics to keep going if one of the staves drops out for a few beats? (soprano and alto on one staff, tenor and bass on another staff)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Apr-1999

You should either:

1 - Read the "How do I skip notes that I do not want to have lyrics?" section in the FAQ (on this web site)

2 - Press the Help button in the Lyric editor and read about how the underscore character works

3 - Read msg #1015 and its associated links


#1129: how do I get banks from alesis nanosynth
how do I get banks from alesis nanosynth

(1129)

Submitted by: GLENN L;EPINE on 07-Apr-1999

Have the new Alesis Nanosynth and I have been trying to
get NT to call up the other banks. I can access the regular
GM part of it, but short of modifying the .ini file (which I'm not all that sure would work, and would be very time consuming to type in over 1000 different patches) or assigning some of the 250 accessible patches from the panel of the synth, I can't seem to find a way to access the other 800. It won't take controller 32 as it is 0 based. The only other thing that works is to save the program as type 1 midi file and export to another program like Cakewalk and manipulate the separate channels from there. If anyone has any ideas, I would like to hear them. tks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Apr-1999

In Staff Properties (F2) select the midi tab, click the Change button in the Playback Instruments box, then change the patch bank in the Controller 0 window. HTH... Fred


#1130: Making an Audio CD of NWC Music Files
Making an Audio CD of NWC Music Files

(1130)

Submitted by: Joe Ellerbrock on 10-Apr-1999

I am not new to composing, but I am new to creating music using NWC and working with MIDI files. So for all you techno expert/composers, what hardware/software would I need to record/convert my NWC or MIDI files directly to a compact disk so that my music can be heard through a home stereo system with CD player? I have a MIDI keyboard/controller. But would this require some kind of digital to analog process, like putting a mike up to my PC speakers as my PC plays the music back, or is there a purely digital way to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 10-Apr-1999

Not sure why you would want to put your files onto CD if all you want to do is to play back through your home stereo system.

What about a lead from the sound card to the aux socket ?
Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Apr-1999

This topic has been covered quite extensively on this forum in the past, I'd suggest downloading the "offline" version of the Forum, then use the Search facility to find the applicable threads (there have been several). Briefly, yes it's quite possible to do; involves recording the .nwc or .mid as a wave file, then burning to CD.

Reply 3 offered by: Shane Turner on 10-Apr-1999

Since I have actually done this, and made an audio CD from my NWC files, a few pointers...
Any decent soundcard will let you record MIDI through the soundcard.. (no dumb mic needed) First I'll assume that you are recording MIDI directly off your MIDI soundcard. You can set the recording volume via the microsoft mixer (play control--the little speaker icon in the taskbar, double click it). In there, you can select "options", then under "properties", select "recording options". This will let you select MIDI to be recorded and also the volume.

Then you need a decent recording program. I suggest Cool Edit, its cheap, easy to use, and lets you record up to 1gb .wav files (more than you'd ever need). After you record the sucker, the software that comes with your CD-R or CD-RW should take care of the Audio CD process.

Reply 4 offered by: Shane Turner on 10-Apr-1999

Just an addendum, since you're using a MIDI keyboard (not midi card as I first thought).. all you need is some decent audio cables. Plug the cables from the Line out jack on your keyboard into the line in jack on your sound card. You might need to mess around to get the proper size cables, any radio shack should have the right cables available though.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 11-Apr-1999

msg #928 is an extensive thread covering this subject in depth.

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Ellerbrock on 11-Apr-1999

Thanks to Richard, Fred, Shane, and Peter for your responses. I want to "burn" CDs with my music for the same reason Shane has - to give to friends who don't have any other means than a standard audio CD player for hearing my NWC files. I understand the following basic steps are necessary to do this from my PC (please correct me if I'm wrong):

1. Convert .NWC file to .MID file using NWC
2. Convert .MID to .WAV file using a program like "Wavmaker" per Msg #928, Reply #21
3. Burn the .WAV file onto an audio CD-RW using a CD recorder (hardware) and a program like "CD Spin Doctor" per Msg #928, Reply #20
4. Put the "burned" CD in a CD player and voilà!

Assuming the software referred to in steps 3 and 4 is necessary, does anyone have any other recommendations based on what you have actually used?

Thanks Again!

Reply 7 offered by: Shane Turner on 11-Apr-1999

OK, the software I used was:
-Cool Edit for the .wav recording, noise filters, etc..
-Easy CD creator to make the actual audio CD.. it came with my cd-rw drive and it let me make audio cd's, data cds, or enhanced cds (mix of audio/data. It looks a lot like windows explorer, just drag and drop the .wav files you want on your audio CD.
-Of course you might already know this, but just in case you don't, only cd-r discs can play in an audio cd player, but this doesn't matter since cd-rw drives can write cd-r discs anyway.

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Apr-1999

Just another vote for CoolEdit... it's what I use, and is an excellent proggie for the price. That being said, you can even use the Sound Recorder that comes packaged with Windows for creating the .wav file, albeit with no post-processing filters. (Although come to think of it, I'm not sure if this is available in Win9x, maybe it's another 3.11 program they dropped?)

As Shane pointed out, your CD-R/RW hardware should have come with suitable software for transferring the .wav file to CD.

Reply 9 offered by: Drake Donahue on 11-Apr-1999

You can play the NWC version while recording with the Creative wave recorder with AWE32/64/SBLive. The windows wave recorder does come with 95/98 but did not please me as much.

Reply 10 offered by: Joe Ellerbrock on 12-Apr-1999

Shane, I am indeed unclear about your last point. Are you saying that all CD-RW recorders will also make CD-R recordings, and that my friends and I don’t have to upgrade to a CD player that is designed to the “Multiread” specification? (The Philips web site seems to suggest that I need a to get a CD-R recorder to play CDs I record on older CD players, such as my 10 year old Pioneer.) Also, will I be able to play back my CD-R or CD-RW recordings on my type 14/32X EIDE CD-ROM? Gee, am I getting there you think? And it sounds like CoolEdit is the one to get for .MID to .WAV conversion, editing, etc., huh? Got a web site I can find it on?

Thanks again everbody,
Joe

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Apr-1999

The problem seems to be due to the reflectivity of CD-R and CD-RW discs compared to "factory" CD's. My newer Kenwood player has no trouble with CD-R (haven't tried CD-RW) but my 15-year-old Toshiba balks at them. Even older CD ROMs (such as an old 2X Creative unit I have) don't properly read CD-R's.

Re: CoolEdit -- go to

http://www.syntrillium.com

Unless you're looking for the "be-all-end-all" wave editor, don't bother with "CoolEdit Pro", the standard edition does everything I've ever needed... and then some.

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 18-Apr-1999

If you only want your friends to be able to hear your NWC files you could send them their own copy of NoteWorthy Player.
Since it's freeware you can send this to anyone - and it's cheaper than burning CDs.

Reply 13 offered by: marsu on 19-Apr-1999

Moreover, as we recently learned, NWC files will sound better than midi since Tempo Variance (Fermata/Breath mark) are not exported.

And you can even be more famous since Info data is easily accessible ;-)

Reply 14 offered by: Shane Turner on 19-Apr-1999

Not everyone I know has a Yamaha PSR-530 XG or an EMU 10K1 or SB AWE soundcard (or the soundfonts). At least, no one I know does.
Hence, the value of recording the works into a much more universal format (aka audio CD) which plays exactly the same on every soundcard (and CD player).
Also, I was able to make a portfolio out of my songs and place them on an audio CD which I submitted to college.
So there are many reasons why one might make an audio CD, it depends entirely on the needs (or wants) of the individual.
--About MIDI--There is no need to export to MIDI to record. I usually just recorded my songs directly while they played in Noteworthy. Unless it was necessary to export to add in chorus, reverb controllers that Noteworthy does not yet support.

Reply 15 offered by: Jill Bengloff on 31-Jan-2000

I have no solution for you but i am working on project and was woundering if you know anything about/wouldn't mind sending me some info about how much it would cost to produce and sell a cd? If you could i would really appreciate it!! Thanks!!
P.s. i am also very interested in music and am helping a friend compose a song for our school chourus, and am very interested in what you are doing

Reply 16 offered by: David Schwartz on 12-Dec-2001

I've been making audio CDs from nwc files by playing [F5] while recording using FastEdit from Minnetonka Audio Software and my Soundblaster Live! audio card. The software is stable and I am happy with the quality and the sound of the instruments.

Of course, there is always room for improvement. Does anyone have suggestions for getting better sound fonts? What are the best choices in buying a new sound card?


#1131: NWC on a Mac?
NWC on a Mac?

(1131)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 11-Apr-1999

I know that there isn't a version of NWC for the Apple Macintosh, but a musician friend of mine wonders whether there is an emulation program available which will allow Macs to run PC software (albeit probably rather slowly) - he'd like to try NWC on his machine. Any ideas??

Reply 1 offered by: Shane Turner on 11-Apr-1999

There's a program called Virtual PC for Mac. (I unfortunately don't know what the website is, will have to run a search engine to find out). It might work, with minor slowdown (NWC isn't CPU intensive anyway).
Since I don't have a Mac I can't vouch for it or against it. Although I hope it works, this September my college only has Macs and I want to run Noteworthy on them!

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 12-Apr-1999

There is also RealPC, but I don't remember which one ("Virtual" or "Real") is better. One of the two creates a "virtual" pc alone (complete "MPC" i.e. SVGA+SB16+Pentium), so you can even "boot" it under plain dos (or linux... :-)), where the other emulates LoseDows (95 or 3.x I hope) making you unable to use dos-only programs (games for instance, or the "old" SCORE program).
You may go to http://www.insignia.com/products/realPC_mac.htm or http://www.insignia.com/products/sw95_mac.htm for these products. (I think that Virtual PC (of Connectix) is better than Softwindows, but believe that RealPC is better than Virtual).
Go and check http://home.earthlink.net/~lukes/vpc.html for comparisons and other solutions, freeware sometimes :-)

hth, MAD

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 12-Apr-1999

Thanks, folks. I found the Virtual PC suppilers web site at http://www.connectix.com Information will be passed on, and I'll post any further progress report if my friend gives one of the products a try. Peter.


#1132: fermatas and grace notes
fermatas and grace notes

(1132)

Submitted by: Russ on 11-Apr-1999

No matter which way I approach this I can't solve it. The problem is that it seems a fermata does not work on a note with a grace note before it. No matter if I put the fermata inbetween, after, or before the gracenote and regular note. The result is always the same, that it is the grace note that gets held for the longer period, not the note I want to be held. If anyone has any comments or solutions, please reply. Otherwise, I'll go ahead and post on the wishlist.

Russ

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Apr-1999

I've found the fermata and breath mark "delay" factors of only limited use, for doing quick previews of what the fermata will sound like. The main difficulties are:

1) Such fermata delays do NOT export to midi, the resulting midifiles are as if a delay of 0 had been selected.

2) Since delays are only in increments of 1/16 notes, the resolution is often less than what is needed.

Solution: use tempo changes instead of fermata delay. This works fine even if grace notes are present, and has the bonuses (boni?) of being exportable, and having near infinite resolution.

If you don't want the tempo changes to show up in your printed score, simply click off the "Display tempo expression when printing" click-box.

I'll send you a small file that demonstrates this via email.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 12-Apr-1999

Or use an MPC with tempo controls, instead of inserting 2 times a tempo specification. Of course you may keep the fermata sign (but without any value) for print purpose :-)

/!\ About Tempo Variance NOT exported: for me this is a bug!!! I'll check it asap with an old (1.2 or more) version.

MAD

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Apr-1999

Or, place the fermata delay before the note that you want to hold, but assign it a delay of 0. If you have other parts in the song, only assign the fermata delay to one of the parts that is not using grace notes. If you only have one staff in the song, make a second hidden staff, fill it with rests to the point of delay, then add the fermata with the necessary delay.

Using Multi-point Controller or other Tempo changes has the advantage of working in a MIDI file. If you want to use just fermatas, then use the technique above.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Apr-1999

Regarding "Tempo Variance NOT exported" from above. What is this statement about? Tempo variances export just fine to MIDI. Fermatas do not appear in an exported MIDI file, but the MIDI spec do not include any such thing as a fermata delay. MIDI files only support tempo changes, no absolute delays.

Reply 5 offered by: peanutjake on 05-May-1999

So why can't Noteworthy be programmed to convert a fermata to a tempo variance when the music is exported to a midi format?

When you look at a NWC file its a fermata
When you look at a midi file the program should turn it into a tempo change.
Either way it should sound the same.

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-May-1999

You are exactly right. You can use tempo changes, either directly, or from a MPC or Tempo Variance item in order to achieve a fermata effect on an exported MIDI file. You can use a fermata delay of 0 and then let your hidden tempo changes do the work.


#1133: Queen Of Sheba
Queen Of Sheba

(1133)

Submitted by: Nigel Horne on 12-Apr-1999

This is a long shot: Anyone have a copy of the Queen of Sheba in NWC format I can have?

-Nigel

Reply 1 offered by: Brian on 12-Apr-1999

I'm not sure exactly what piece you write about, but I assume Arrival of the Queen of Sheba by Handel.
I don't know where to get an NWC file of that (although if you find one, I would like it as well) but there is probably a midi file somewhere floating around on the internet that could be converted to an NWC file.
Good luck.

Reply 2 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 12-Apr-1999

There was a copy of the Arrival of the Queen of Sheba (Handel) posted on the Noteworthy newsgroup last November.

I think the piece was notated for flute and piano

If you don't have access to the newsgroup attachments you could try e-mailing Paul Beard at PBeard4929@aol.com. It was he who posted it.

HTH

Richard

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Apr-1999

Someone did a nice nwc version of this and posted it on the Newsgroup. I have it in my files, but whoever did it didn't fill in the "info" section... and I forget now who did it! I don't normally like forwarding peoples' work without their permission, but since it WAS posted on the newsgroup... I'll send it on.

Reply 4 offered by: Nigel Horne on 13-Apr-1999

Many thanks to Fred, and Paul I assume. Got a copy this morning from Fred in the e-post.

-Nigel

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 offered by: Genti on 22-Nov-1999

Hello!
can sombody tell me for sure if the qeen of Sheba was arabian or african.
Thanks a lot


#1134: Grace Notes
Grace Notes

(1134)

Submitted by: Drake Kay on 13-Apr-1999

I have look at all the messages and help topics and I can't find anything to tell me where to find the grace note command. And I'm not even sure if that is what I'm looking for. The effect I'm trying to get is the same as a hammer on or play the 7th fret and moveing quickly to the 9th so as not to change the music. Kind of like playing that by accident. Please tell me something to help me along. Thanks, email me or post a responce

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Apr-1999

I've done that sort of thing using pitch mpc's. To use your example of fretting at C-VII = B (assuming the E string) then hammering on C-IX (C#) you would start with two B notes tied together. Between the tied notes insert an MPC, pitch bend absolute +8191. After the second note insert an MPC, pitch bend absolute 0. (This restores the pitch back to normal).

This has the effect of changing the pitch while the note is sounding. For a true hammer-on effect, you also need to insert an absolute volume MPC between the two notes (e.g. 127, or full volume) then another one after the second note to restore the channel volume to your "default" staff volume (I suggest around 90-100). Note that the default volume is 127 unless you change it in Staff Properties (you have to leave yourself some headroom if you want to do hammer-on or pull-off effects as described above).

For a "quick and dirty" way of doing this, use the grace note button in the tool bar. Won't sound very realistic, but looks great when printed. Put this in a muted "printing" staff, and the mpc trickery in a hidden "sounded" staff.

Reply 2 offered by: DrakeKay on 13-Apr-1999

Fred:

You about blew me out of the water. I have only been useing nwc for 2 weeks and my theory is limited. I havent a clue what an mpc is but I do know what a pitch bend is, though I have no idea how to use them on nwc. I will look into this and hopefully I can figure that one out. As far as grace notes I can't find the grace note button in the toolbar which one is it and is it on the nwc version that is currently posted, which is the one I have! Also if I wanted to use a grace note as a grace note then do I have to do the math and (for example) place a 16th note infront of an arpegiated set of quarter notes to get the disired efect?

Reply 3 offered by: Drake Kay on 13-Apr-1999

Fred:

Its me again. I tried that midi point controller and the pitch bend. I was wondering, if I were to put two g notes tied with a mpc in the middle and one at the end. for the one in the middle if I wanted the effect of haveing the g sound like a F how much controller value would I need to use. I think this might solve the problem of not being able to slur notes in an arpegio without sounding the note like its stucato. MAYBE! its worth a try!

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Apr-1999

Sorry about the overwhelm... to backtrack a bit, the grace-note button shows a 1/2 note and a little bitty 1/8 note next to it. Select the desired note, then click the button, or press the = key on the keyboard. It "automagically" steals time from the following note -- usually quite realistically. However, the two events are treated as discrete notes... not as pitch-changes on a single note. (Think piano!)

Insert mpc's ("Multi-Point Controller") using the L key (or from the Insert menu). Regarding pitch-bend -- 0 is of course no bending. +4096 is +1 semitone, +8191 is +2 semitones (one whole tone). Similarly for negative values. So the maximum you could get from an mpc pitch bend is 2 whole tones (example: slide or hammer-on from F to A, play a G at -8191, which gives the F; then move it to +8191, which gives an A.

Hope this helps. If you want to look at some examples, I've posted some guitar work using this kind of thing on the Scriptorium. (lvb_adag.nwc, vivandte.nwc, sorst_g1.nwc).

Keep pluggin! Make liberal use of the help files, NWC is one of the precious few programs where the help files are actually helpful. MPC's especially are well worth the effort it takes to figure them out.

Reply 5 offered by: DrakeKay on 13-Apr-1999

Fred:

Wow you have got me into some great stuff. I worked with the mpc and my result was that 8192 + or - will give you a whole step. But the problem Im haveing is that if I have two notes and the first one's mpc pitch bent down 8192 then, right at the begining of the note almost to fast to hear, it sounds like it is actualy being bent down. That is not what Im looking for though it sounds really cool and I might use it later. Now I have figured out what you were talking about But I need to get past the slur problem. I dont want the two notes f and +8192 f -8192 to sound stcato I need them to slur. I hope you know what I mean. Ill keep working . Thank you!

Reply 6 offered by: DrakeKay on 13-Apr-1999

Fred:

I had gotten your message after writeing a new one sorry.
But I think my unregistered version does not have a grace note button and if it does it is not showing me. Im really in a bind and I need this piece of work done soon! How can I find a version that has the grace note button? Please help me! Thank you! Its really been a great lesson!

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Apr-1999

Hmmm... there's no difference between the "unregistered" version and the full-fledged one, except for some printing and saving limitations. I've long since customized my tool bars, so I don't remember which bar the grace note was in originally. If you downloaded NWC from NoteWorthy's site, you do indeed have the current version.

First off, slowly drag your mouse over the toolbar buttons. This will give you "mouse-overs" that identify the various buttons. If no joy, go on to the next step.

Here's how you can chase it down. In View ==> Toolbars click the Customize button. At the top there will be a pull-down menu marked "Toolbar"; click this, I believe by default there are three, FILE, NOTES and ?? (EDIT?) [as you may have gathered, I boiled mine down to just two]. By selecting the bars one at a time you can see which tools are active (on the right) and which are still available (on the left). You can add/delete/modify to your heart's content. The one you're looking for is called "Note Grace".

Regarding the slur issue: note that there are two tool buttons that look very similar; one is the slur (or ; key) that simply reduces the time between successive notes. The other is the tie ( or the / key ) which actually ties two notes together, making them essentially a single note. THIS is the tool you want to invoke to tie the two notes together, then put your pitch-bend mpc between.

Make any sense at all?

Reply 8 offered by: DrakeKay on 13-Apr-1999

Fred:

Thanks for all your help! It turns out that the version I downloaded today wasn't the version I was useing. I forgot to change my desktop shortcut! OOPS silly me. I found the note grace command. It sounds like **** but oh well Ill figure something out, its only the base line and I can always change the volume on the grace note so I don't hear it as much! Thanks again!


#1135: Looking for certain sound help?
Looking for certain sound help?

(1135)

Submitted by: Drake Kay on 15-Apr-1999

Hi all, I have the 1.55a version and I need to fill a guitar part with something that sounds like completely muted strings. The desired effect is a g chord play as in TAB 3 muted open open. Thats 3rd fret 6th sting, muted 5th string, open 4th string, and open 3rd string. I hope that is enough imformation. Can you give me any idea's as to how to produce the muted sound!

Drake Kay

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Apr-1999

Try using the nylon-string guitar sound, and make the notes very short (1/32 or even 1/64). You'll probably need to use multiple staves to combine the muted strings with the fretted ones.

There _is_ a "muted guitar" sound defined in General Midi, but on my DB50XG card, at least, it's pretty much useless...


#1136: http access to newsgroup ?
http access to newsgroup ?

(1136)

Submitted by: marsu on 16-Apr-1999

Hi,
as www.Remarq.com did with the previous newsgroup, does someone know how to access the new one, news://news.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc, via http ? This is useful for people blocked by a firewall which does not allow nntp.

TIA,
      Mad

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 16-Apr-1999

Someone, Fred I think, asked remarq to link to ezusa, but nothing seems to have happened.
I don't know if ezusa could do an e-mail interface.
So we'd need to create some sort of nntp interface to ezusa, which I'm able to spend time on.
Failing that, the archives are updated every month.

Regards,
Andrew

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 16-Apr-1999

Andrew,
thx for the quick reply. It seems that ezusa has not done anything and I couldn't find any way to ask them.

I plan to leave France for some years, I think I'm gonna go to Australia since it seems that time is much "wider" there!!! ;-)

MAD

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 19-Apr-1999

"I think I'm gonna go to Australia since it seems that time is much "wider" there!!! ;-)"

Well, we're always about nine hours ahead of France!

A

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 19-Apr-1999

Then you'll know much more about 00-year bug b4 us...
What makes me sad is that most of the buggy software comes from the USA (µ$ for instance) and they will be the last to have them crashing...

One thing that is sure: have cash at home, and take no plane nor lift!

MAD

Reply 5 offered by: PV on 19-Apr-1999

See msg #1011 reply 7


#1138: drum questions (multiple channels/stereo)
drum questions (multiple channels/stereo)

(1138)

Submitted by: Raul on 17-Apr-1999

Is there any way to use percussion in any channel other than 10? I have a MIDI file that has two different drum kits running on channels 10 and 11, but when I import it, the latter gets changed to a normal instrument. I also want to do this so that I can have percussion coming from more than one stereo position. If I make two staffs with channel 10 and assign a different stereo pan to each, both staffs only play in the position the first one was assigned to. Thanks for any help!

Reply 1 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 20-Apr-1999

Midi channels are like the, um, output options on your stereo. You can have cd or aux or tape1 or tape2 or tuner (etc.) playing at any one time (unless you have a mixer). The balance, treble and bass controls affect the output of the amplifier, but lets say for now that they affect directly the sound of the source playing (eg the cd player). If you manage to jack unto your amps' CD input two cd players (eg through a mixer) then both will be heard, and both will be affected by any changes in the balance, treble and bass controls.

NWC works pretty much the same way. Your "amplifier" is the channel on which a number of staves you have chosen are played from. If no instrument is selected, then piano is played. This applies to all channels with exception to channel 10 that by default plays drums in general midi. If now you have N staves that play through channel 10, and you use an mpc or a global setting (staff properties) that affects a midi controller then the channel and NOT the staff is affected. Thus all staves "suffer" setting. By default NWC adheres to the topmost staff OR the closest mpc. In essence, an mpc selection on a staff or a midi selection on a staff through staff properties affects the channel through which the staff plays, not the staff per se.
Its like overlaying two text transparencies (=staves) and asking someone to read(=channel playing) what he sees loud(=mpc). He is going to read both of them loud.

So what do we do to get away with this? I have an AWE wavetable soundcard (soundblaster) that uses soundfont files to tell to the soundcard what each instrument sounds like by giving digital sound samples to each of the instrument numbers (an instrument patch inserts a number, corresponding to an instrument on your soundcard). What I do is to get rid of sound I do not use e.g. gunshots, applause, cymbal etc. and in those positions (e.g. 118, 119 and 120) I put a sample collection that is nothing else than the prexisting drums instrument sample collection. I now can use three extra channels instead of channel 10 only on which I can place midi controller selections that do not "interact" with each other, for the same instrument. And of course I use a corresponding number of staves, each assigned to one of the four channels available; no overlapping whatsoever. Beware of the limitations of this trick my friend; 1) Soundfonts FEAST upon your soundcards memory (expandable in some cases) and 2) most soundcards have ONLY 16 CHANNELS to play with (expandable, but that is another LONG story). So don't go off trying to write the most delicately mastered song in this fashion. There just aren't enough channels.

Mail me for more info if you wish and an example of this... mess.


#1139: Grace Notes & Printout
Grace Notes & Printout

(1139)

Submitted by: Carolyn Conyers on 17-Apr-1999

Notes G F E D descending are grace notes going with the last note C (quarter note). I entered the grace notes properly, I think. The print as little "grace-looking" notes. BUT - in printing, the upper score of the piano part seems to think those are actual 16th notes followed by a quarter note and it skews the upper part so that nothing prints above the bass note C. It just leaves a blank space. In other words, the printing of that bar is a mess. Can someone help me? And shouldn't there be parentheses around the grace notes somehow?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 18-Apr-1999

Carolyn, are you allowing time for the grace notes? If so, don't! NWC automatically 'steals' time from the next full note, so if you are allowing time, then the measures will be unequal and cause horrendous print errors. You can tidy up the appearance of the grace notes by assigning them a short note length e.g. 1/8 or 1/16 then beaming them together (it sounds as though you already have them set as 1/16). It doesn't affect the actual playing length of the grace notes.
HTH, Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: Carolyn Conyers on 18-Apr-1999

Thanks for a quick reply, Peter. Yes, I have the notes set as 16th notes and beamed, so they look right. I am not allowing time for them, as far as I know, but how do I know??? And yes, the printing is horrendous and totally skewed. That's the problem. This, by the way, is intended only for a "hard copy" for performance. Playback via the computer is not significant here. So, the next question is how I can tell if NWC is reading the grace notes as "time" rather than grace notes? Thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: Sue Morton on 18-Apr-1999

Hi Carolyn,

I input the grace notes and quarter note into blank score and checked out the printing using both an ancient dot matrix printer and a brand-new HP Lasetjet 5N...

The print output from both of these printers looks fine to me. Could it be your printer driver? Can you try another printer driver? (You can use print preview to gauge results without having to actually print.)

Perhaps I didn't interpret your description of the notes correctly. I input the following:

Staff-1: Treble clef, quarter-note-C, the four grace notes (16th and beamed) then three more quarter-note-C's.
Staff-2: Bass clef, four quarter-note-C's.

All of the quarter notes line up. Space is left inbetween the first and second quarter notes in the bass clef to allow room for the grace notes to print in the treble clef.

Please let me know what the score should've looked like, if this does not illustrate your problem correctly, and you do not think it is a printer driver issue.

Good luck,
Sue

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 19-Apr-1999

Carolyn, you wrote "I am not allowing time for them, as far as I know, but how do I know???"
If you set notes as grace notes, then you do not have to count their duration on any other staff.
One thing to check, even if your score is not for playback purpose: play it. If the notes (your C after grace notes) is not (dis-)played at the same time as the note of the other staff, then there is a problem in your notation.
"So, the next question is how I can tell if NWC is reading the grace notes as "time" rather than grace notes?"
What I can tell you is that NWC does not count the duration of grace notes.
So if you have --not counting the grace notes-- the same umber of beats in your measures vertically, then everything should be alright. To check this, you may remove the grace notes just to verify bars align properly. Use Ctrl-Z to get them back, and correct the problem if any.

You may also send your NWC score to us :-) (even through mail-list, since it now accepts messages greater than 10k (up to 100).

HTH, MAD

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 19-Apr-1999

Hello, again, Carolyn. By 'allowing time' I mean adding up the apparent length of the grace notes and putting a rest or note in the other staves to balance them. But this is incorrect, since the grace notes as I mentioned above actually steal time from their associated full note. If you're not doing this, then I wonder if there is an unbalanced measure somewhere else in your score - like Sue I did a test using your note selection without any problems, nor have I had any problems with grace notes on other occasions. If you still can't find a fault, perhaps you would like to e-mail me the NWC file as an attachment, and I'll be happy to have a look at it.

Peter.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 19-Apr-1999

Peter, I guess we were writing an answer just at the same time ;-)

Reply 7 offered by: Peter V on 19-Apr-1999

Dominique, Oui!

Reply 8 offered by: Carolyn Conyers on 19-Apr-1999

Is there a "NWC for Dummies" book out there? If so, I am in need of it. Thanks to everyone who responded. It was operator error. I apologize!!! The grace note passage was the final bar of the piece, in 2/4, on the first beat of the bar, with a quarter rest as the final beat. So guess what! I had inadvertently forgotten to put in the quarter rest in the grace note bar, so apparently NWC read the bar in "real" time rather than reading the grace notes as grace notes. Still not sure why the totally garbled printout, but the important point is that everything is now fine (of course!) and NWC is as wonderful as ever. Thanks to all for responding. I have given myself 20 lashes with a quaver!
I will return soon with another minor problem that may be a Wish List item. By the way, I was copying the piece in question for someone else -- she was absolutely delighted to see her music "in print." NWC is good!

Reply 9 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 19-Apr-1999

Have you tried Barry Graham's excellent Noteworthy Manual.

You can download a copy from the Scriptorium.

Richard


#1140: NoteWorthy Player
NoteWorthy Player

(1140)

Submitted by: Bob on 18-Apr-1999

My NoteWorthy Player seems to work fine, but no sound comes out when I play the MIDI files! I've tried different files, different types, and tinkered with other things, but nothing seems to work! please help!
I have a Compaq Presario 9564

Thanks :o)

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-Apr-1999

Goto the help file:

section: [Technical Help]
item: "Song playback using a sound card"


#1141: Users of Internet Explorer 5.0
Users of Internet Explorer 5.0

(1141)

Submitted by: NWC-Support on 18-Apr-1999

If you are currently using Internet Explorer 5.0 (IE5), you will notice a problem when trying to directly open *.nwc song files from the web. As of NoteWorthy Composer Version 1.55a, the song will fail to open using this method. This is caused by a sharing violation between NoteWorthy Composer and Internet Explorer.

We are working on a fix, but for now, use the following work around.

Work around: use the Save option in IE5, then open the file manually from NoteWorthy Composer.

Reply 1 offered by: JL on 20-Apr-1999

Take note that NWP and IE5 are compatible.

Reply 2 offered by: Maarten Horst on 06-Dec-1999

Since I installed IE 5.0, al applications on my computer regularly error, and nothing reacts, I even have to reset sometimes!
Is there a downloadable solution?

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 06-Dec-1999

>>Is there a downloadable solution?

Yes. It's called Netscape.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Dec-1999

IE 5 support should be attempted from Microsoft at http://www.microsoft.com (good luck).


#1142: copy/paste functions
copy/paste functions

(1142)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 19-Apr-1999

What I have been particularly noticing lately in NWC is that it lacks some flexibility in its copy/paste functions. Now what do I mean with that. When for instance one deceides to paste a part of a song into another one, were he believes it fits better, one has to go through the process of copying each stave separately, lets say between bars 134 and 158. Now when a few staves are to be copied this is fairly easy. However it becomes tedious and troublesome when alot of instruments are involved. Moreover, a certain degree of error is possible which, as most of us know, can break all Hell loose.

Since NWC is based on the word processor format (I think?), in which one can drag the mouse pointer from point A to point B, thus selecting a number of lines for an action, why not make that possible in NWC too? Why not drag from a certain point not only across, but down as well?

I will place this on the wish list. I just wanted also to hear the opinion of others on this issue too.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 19-Apr-1999

What is curious in the recent and current versions of NWC is that this function is available when you do a Copy Special for insertion into another application.

You have the option to include the selected portion of the current staff or the selected portion of the entire score.

Yes - I'd support this as a wish list item.
But PLEASE do add it to your wish list Sterghios - not just here.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 20-Apr-1999

Sterghios,
you're right, it could be useful and less subject to (human) errors.
There is a good turnaround that I use when having this kind of work to do. I use (once more) the macro recorder to record the actions I make (without the mouse, which I dislike anyway) on the first (pair of) staff, and then I replay it after having moved to next staff.
For instance: you want to copy measures 9-12 (chorus in a song for example) from 4 staves to 4 others.
Go to the first staff. Start macro recorder. Then use Ctrl-G to go directly to measure 9. Shift-right four times. Ctrl-Insert (or Ctrl-C). Go to the "destination" staff using page down (or page up, if over). Use Ctrl-G, enter the measure number you want to go to, use Shift-Insert (or Ctrl-V) to paste. Then go back to the "from" staff. Stop macro recorder (Ctrl-Break or with the mouse).
Now go to the next staff where you want to do the same, and run the macro you just recorded. (This supposes that the same number of staves separate each "from -- to" pair.)

HTH (this kind of thing saves me *hours* in many programs),

        MAD

P.S. Though it may be a BIG part of programming, if "vertical" usability in NWC could grow it could even be version 2... since it would change drastically from the current ones.

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 20-Apr-1999

Indeed... Yet judging from the time that has passed since the last version update, I feel that we all should start saving up... (Hopefully not for much more...). By the way (THIS GOES TO THE NWC SUPPORT GROUP), I hope that version 1.* owners will be charged MUCH LESS for upgrading to 2.* when this arrives. Oh, and if a version 2.0 does come to life, it better differ substantially from 1.55, unlike windows 95 and 98 (i.e. please adhere to the value for money rule, please?).

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Apr-1999

Sterghios - Let us not forget that NWC has been providing really big value for little money for a long time now.
Unlike Windows it doesn't suffer from bloat, is continually upgraded and you have direct access to the vendor.
(When was the last time Bill Gates personally replied to a user request?)
If the next version of NWC provides multi-measure rests I'd be happy to pay the full registration fee whether it's V1.6 or V2.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Apr-1999

Hear Hear! Both for multiple-staff select, and the good value that Noteworthy Composer is. I would also be willing to pay for a significant upgrade.


#1143: Bug or feature?
Bug or feature?

(1143)

Submitted by: Sue Morton on 21-Apr-1999

I'm using NWC 1.55a. I have a score with 5 staves, the last staff is not selected for print under page setup ("hidden staff").

When I bring up the Score Review dialog box, I can use "goto staff properties" on the hidden staff, as it is listed in the score review dialog box. (This is great! You can't select the staff properties otherwise, without un-hiding it first.)

However, as soon as I access the properties for the hidden staff from the Score Review dialog box, the selection for printing reverses itself -- that is, the formerly hidden staff is now marked as the visible staff, and all the others that were once visible are now marked as hidden...

While easily righted, I find the behavior a bit disconcerting. At first I couldn't figure out how I had deleted all those staves so quickly... :>

Can anyone else replicate this? If so, Bug or Feature? NWC-Support?

Sue

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 21-Apr-1999

This behaviour is intentional. The Staff Properties mechanism requires that the staff be visible.

Reply 2 offered by: Sue on 21-Apr-1999

OK, I'll buy that... buy why does it reverse my settings and make my visible staves hidden? Shouldn't it just change my hidden staff to visible and leave the others alone?

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 22-Apr-1999

Sue, I do not understand: the _last_ behavior ("Shouldn't it...") is what it does!!
Do you click (or use Space) only on THE staff you want to un-hide?? By the way, does that staff belong to the same group as the other staves??
Theorem:
    If no staff of a group is selected, then the group is automatically deselected.
Corollary:
    If you (de)select a group, then all staves of the group are (de)selected.

If you have another behaviour, send this buggy file to someone (I'd like to see this personally)

HTH,
MAD

Reply 4 offered by: Sue on 22-Apr-1999

Hi Marsu,

Do this test: Open a new, blank score in NWC. Add three staves, leave them the default names (staff, staff-1, staff-2) and default group (standard).

Access page setup and hide Staff-2. Now only Staff and Staff-1 are visible on screen, as they should be.

Access Score Review. You will see all three staves listed. Select Staff-2 (the hidden staff) and click "goto staff properties". As soon as the Staff Properties dialog box comes up, your screen display will change. You will only see one staff on display, it is Staff-2.

Close the Staff Properties dialog box and access page setup again. You will see that Staff-2 is now marked VISIBLE and Staff, Staff-1 are now marked HIDDEN. This is the reverse of what you originally selected in page setup!

Personally, I think NWC should "un-hide" a hidden staff only while the Staff properties dialog box is open, then re-hide it when you close the dialog box. And not change the settings of the other staves. This would leave the score in the same condition it was in, when the Score Review/Goto Staff properties was first chosen.

But I will accept un-hiding the hidden staff, and leaving it at that. But I don't want my other staves' settings changed.

Let me know if this illustrates the problem for you, Marsu. Thanks for your help!

Sue

Reply 5 offered by: Sue on 22-Apr-1999

Sorry, I should've said in paragraph 4: Close Staff Properties dialog box AND Score Review, and access page setup....

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 23-Apr-1999

Okay Sue, now I got it. I had noticed that a long ago, but didn't bother at the time (I rarely use score review during wirting a score, unless for muting/channel verification. I created a lot of templates (making a big use of that window at that time) that I know use each time I create a new file.)

What had made me wondering most, was your "reverse" term. In fact it's a special case: in reality, only the last staff you modified properties, if it was hidden, is now un-hidden. All others are hidden.

This seems to be a strange behavior too, I must admit, but the ability to see the staff you're modifying properties, as it does and is intended for I suppose, is very useful. If no other side effect exist --I mean after closing the review window-- I agree it seems better to me. Add a wish :-)

Marsu A. D.

Reply 7 offered by: Sue on 26-Apr-1999

Hi Marsu,

Thanks for looking at this. Perhaps I should've said "all staves are OPPOSITE to what they started out as"...

In my example, the first two staves are visible, and the last staff is hidden. After accessing that last staff with Staff Properties, the settings have been switched to the OPPOSITE for ALL STAVES -- the first two have become hidden, the last one is now visible.

Sorry for the confusion in use of term. A minor inconvenience, but I will add it to the wish list anyway. Such a pretty piece of software, why not mention cosmetic things for the wish list once in a while too? :>

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 27-Apr-1999

To close this issue:
reverse or opposite, the term is inadequate.
In fact, if you click on a hidden staff, _only_ that one will appear later, whatever the others are, hidden or not.

And about "cosmetics": sure, this is good to mention it. And to add wishes for it. The GUI is a big part of any software. What if you got an excellent algorithm if you have to study hours on how to simply start the program???

That's where NWC is good too: easy to use, fast enough (even with a 386/Win3.11), fine printing, easy customable part-printing, ... It doesn't make coffee (yet), but let you write a coffee song at ease ;-)

NWCly yours


#1144: Downloading & Printing MIDI files.
Downloading & Printing MIDI files.

(1144)

Submitted by: Nicholas Gravino Jr. on 24-Apr-1999

I am new to this phase of music, is it possible to downloand and print other MIDI files from other sources, transpose and edit music with Net Worthy Composer?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 24-Apr-1999

It is very easy. Just click on File/Import and then follow the prompts. After importing, transposition can be done by menu ("Tools, transpose") or just by highlighting and moving the highlighted notes up and down (shift/control + arrow key). Some tinkering may be needed after transposing to reflect key shifts.

Text and lyrical items contained in preexisting music will not import into NWC format and typically need to be added manually. Hope that helps.

Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 26-Apr-1999

About importing files, see also msg #943 particularly reply 4 about lyrics import.

HTH, Marsu

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 26-Apr-1999

Note: correct URL for strings.txt is http://homepages.infoseek.com/~marsu/strings.txt (without the ',' at the end).

About transposing, see also online help (very complete), plus msg #194 , msg #251 , msg #3 , msg #505

Do not neglect to download the offline forum ( http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline/nwcforum.exe , see on the top "Go offline" link), it's a pretty precious tool ;-)

MAD


#1145: Chords,Separate Ties,Beams, Timing!!!
Chords,Separate Ties,Beams, Timing!!!

(1145)

Submitted by: Betty Ann Bryanton on 26-Apr-1999

I've just keyed in a song &, for the most part, it went well, but there are some snags that I could not figure out, find in the help, or find in the forum. And I want to print this out in piano-ready format so I'd like it to be as exact as possible. Please Help!!

1. How do I beam notes on both the top & the bottom? It seems you can only do it on the stems down OR the stems up.

2. The $64,000 Question: HOW do I enter chords of different durations and different stem directions?! The rules in the Chord Member help say they have to have the same duration or opposing stems AND a note w/ its stem going down can't go with a lower note w/ its stem up.

E.g., on the score, I'm seeing in the right hand a dotted half note low E (first line of the stave) and below that a dotted half note low G - both with stems up. Then there's a D quarter note, stem down. (I see this situation often!)

3. How do I get 2 separate ties (not slurs for the whole measure) for notes that are different?

E.g., a chord of quarter notes: an E & G; going to a chord of quarter notes: an F & A. Both notes in the 1st chord show a tie to the respective note in the 2nd chord.

4. How do I make the notes look more like a score? Some of them (particularly beamed groups of 4 eighths) look very distorted, the 1st 2 close together, the last 2 stretched far away.

5.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Apr-1999

Most if not all of your difficulties could be solved with the "Staff Layer" feature. Given that it's still "experimental" and won't necessarily be supported in the same way in future versions, it's a splendid workaround for a lot of the kinds of problems that you've mentioned.

Regarding timing, it's always the shorter note of a chord that defines the overall timing of that element. Again, layering can be very helpful in sorting this out. Another experimental feature that I've found _very_ useful is the vertical rest placement option (with experimental features enabled, select a rest and CNTL E to "edit" it).

I'm not sure what you mean by your fourth point, the only time I've seen this kind of thing happen is when the timing was off. The "Audit Bar Lines" feature can be very helpful to figure out what's going on. If this makes a mess by trying to correct your errors, use CNTL Z to undo it, and fix it up before re-invoking "Audit Bar Lines".

Hope this helps.
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 27-Apr-1999

Fred is right, points 1, 2 & 3 may be solved using the staff layering feature.
About 3, ties and slurs are not the same. Ties concern only notes of the same pitch. Hence it is not possible to tie a F with a E (even #E).
About point 4: usually notes are equally spaced. It is not the case when:
- lyrics take more room than note would normally allow
- others rhythmic schemes on other staves use smaller durations
- accidental is added to a note
Note that you can add extra space to the notes you'd find too close.

A last thing about "experimental": this feature will NOT disappear, it will be supported but may change of behavior. Or did I misunderstand Eric ?

HTH, MAD

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Apr-1999

You are quite correct. Although the product still has our standard experimental disclaimer, we are committed to support of the staff layering capabilities currently present.


#1146: Timing
Timing

(1146)

Submitted by: Betty Ann Bryanton on 26-Apr-1999

(Whoops! Cut myself off of that last one!)

Last question (for now):
5. How do I get the timing in a measure accurate?! In the stems up, I showing a chord of 2 dotted quarters, then an eighth note, and then 2 quarters. On the same stave, with the stems down, I'm showing a chord of 2 quarter notes and then a chord of dotted half notes. NWC is skewing the timing, making the measure appear 2 beats longer than it is, and of course, it doesn't play rhythmically correct with the rest of the song!

Thanks a bunch!!

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 27-Apr-1999

Using staff layering, you'll get exactly this as you want.
Otherwise, there is a solution that is not appreciated by some people: it is to decompose your dotted quarter (chord or not) into quarter+eighth, both of them being tied (not slurred). Use / before inserting each quarter to ensure that the tie is displayed for each quarter.

Let me know if this is not sufficient for you.

MAD


#1147: number...number...
number...number...

(1147)

Submitted by: Jubal Baca on 27-Apr-1999

Hello NWC users:

I have NWC 1.55a. I have a Orchestral score with 10 diferent instrument. (10 staff). I want to put meassures number por example, on 4th staff, and I don´t know how to do that. Please help me...

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Apr-1999

The measure numbers only appear on the top staff of a system. For example, if you're printing out the full score, they will appear only on the flutes (top) staff.

However, if you select only one staff for printing "parts" (e.g. bassoons), then the measure numbers will appear on that staff.


#1148: V 1.55b
V 1.55b

(1148)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Apr-1999

Thanks NoteWorthy Artware for fixing the "unbeam selected notes" thingy. There were a few times when I really missed it, and it's nice to have it back.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 29-Apr-1999

You're welcome. We missed it too!

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-May-1999

By the way, we'll let this thread be the official announcement. YOu can upgrade your copy of NoteWorthy Composer from:

http://noteworthycomposer.com/upgrade.htm

It includes the following maintenance changes:

- Easy removal of all note beams in a selected range
- Support for opening NWC files directly from Internet Explorer 5
- New help topics
- Fix for undo after changing fonts in File | Page Setup
- Fix for measure numbers on layered staves
- Fix for infinite loop condition when loading a corrupted NWC file
- Fix for song templates that require a score audit

The file format is unchanged.


#1149: Length of piece no longer displayed
Length of piece no longer displayed

(1149)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 02-May-1999

Once upon a time I could watch the playing time of a piece by observing a small window at the bottom right of the screen. Has this gone away (and why), or do I now have to enable it (and how). :-)
Thanks for the help.
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-May-1999

It's still there, on the lower right of the main window.

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 02-May-1999

It's not there on my screen, either with the main window in regular or maximized position. I'm using Win98. I moved the Win98 taskbar to the right edge (to see if it was in the way) and still see nothing.
I'll try playing with the main window later and see if I can make something happen.
BTW, May marks the second anniversary that I've had NoteWorthy, and I could not be happier with it.
Gordon

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-May-1999

You need to have thet Status Bar enabled on the View menu (View | Status Bar).

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-May-1999

You need to have the status bar enabled (View | Status Bar)


#1150: upgrade
upgrade

(1150)

Submitted by: Christian Wollin on 02-May-1999

I would just like to say thank you for the upgrade. I have been using NWC for almost three years in my work as a music teacher and musician and I think you really do a terrific job. Specially thank´s to Eric and Betty who always have answered my (sometimes) silly questions
Chris

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 03-May-1999

Just a quick joinder in expressing appreciation for a great product (and all the very helpful persons in the forum and newgroup!). Been using Noteworthy for approximately five years now. It is by far the most trouble free/user friendly music program I have found.


#1151: Font error when launching NWC32
Font error when launching NWC32

(1151)

Submitted by: Pete on 02-May-1999

Help!
When I launch NWC32 there is a Font Error message and the program exits.
I have tried installing the latest upgrade and also deleted some windows fonts but with the same result.
I am using issue 1.55b 32 bit version

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-May-1999

The error message should tell you the exact problem: you do not have the NWC font installed. This can happen under several conditions:

- You try to use the upgrade package ( at http://noteworthycomposer.com/upgrade.htm ) on a copy of NWC older than version 1.50

- You try to manually copy the NWC files from one machine to another without using the installer

- Your machine has too many fonts installed

The proper way to fix this is to run the NWC installation program. If your machine has too many fonts installed, you will first have to remove some fonts. You can also get the fonts from our FTP site:

ftp.noteworthysoftware.com/nwcfonts.zip

Version 1.55b requires the NWCV15.TTF font, which you can manually install.

Reply 2 offered by: Pete on 03-May-1999

I have downloaded the file nwfonts.zip but cannot
unzip as there are internal zip errors reported.
Bad zip file offset(Error local header signature not found).

Is there a particular version of winzip that I should be
using?

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 03-May-1999

I had no problem unzipping it with FreeZip, which I downloaded (for free, as the name implies) from http://tucows.nantucket.net.

Reply 4 offered by: Drake Donahue on 04-May-1999

Winzip worked fine.
File must have corrupted during download.
BTW, smart download added to a Netscape browser eases the pain of downloads. Fewer corrupted file problems. AND ... If you lose connection, it can resume download from the point of loss instead of restarting from the beginning.

Reply 5 offered by: NWC-Support on 04-May-1999

Pete: I checked the ifle, and it is fine. Did you mistakenly download the file in ASCII mode? If not, then you just have a corrupted download.

Reply 6 offered by: Pete on 09-May-1999

Hi,
Thanks for all your help.
It turned out that the zip file download failed
when I used IE5 but succeeded using Netscape 4.5.
Everything now working fine.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 10-May-1999

one more reason to let IE alone... until they debug it completely.
Thx BG!

Reply 8 offered by: DorkPixie on 12-Aug-1999

Now, now. MSIE has its uses, but you really should use Getright to download zip's and exe's


#1152: Mixing Symbols and Letters for Chords
Mixing Symbols and Letters for Chords

(1152)

Submitted by: David F. on 03-May-1999

Hi,

I read the User Tip entitled "Entering Sharps and Flats for Chord Symbols with the NWC Font" and now I can enter
music symbols in a text field, (my thanks to the author of that tip). However, I can't figure out how to mix the music symbols (sharps and flats) with letters for the chord names. I can only seem to apply a single font to one text field, (rather than a font to each character).

I can get the effect I want by putting the various
characters in separate text items and using "preserve width" feature, however, then the chord names don't align with the music.

Have I missed something obvious here? Does anyone
have a simple method for mixing the music symbols and
letters for chord notation above a staff of music?

Thanks and Regards,

- Dave

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-May-1999

I just use the hash (shift 3) and lower case b for sharps and flats.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 05-May-1999

There isn't a simple way for entering Rich Text Format text. It just isn't supported by NWC at the moment.

You can try using "concurrent" non-width-preserved text, with subsequent characters padded to the right be blank spaces.

Andrew

Reply 3 offered by: Dave Fowler on 27-May-1999

If any of you have made and progress on this one, I'd love to hear it. I'm struggling with the text aligment and getting them entered in (in less than 12 hours a page) using the text tool.

Reply 4 offered by: Terry Kosowick on 28-May-1999

Hi,
Re entering chord symbols. Has anyone tried using the lyrics feature to do it? Using the insert text command I also ran into major trouble trying to add chord symbols. The lyrics feature looked like it might be a way to do it but I haven't had a chance to work with it yet.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-May-1999

Using the lyrics for chords will work if you want the chords all at the same height, and you want chords for most notes (otherwise you need a lot of underscores). It does not help the mixed font problem Dave is having. What is needed is a font containing both musical symbols and standard characters. Anyone know where to find one?

If you must do insert text with multiple fonts, (aligned with leading spaces - what you see on the screen is different than Print Preview, which is different again from what actually is printed) you might have better luck with monospace fonts than proportional fonts.

Reply 6 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 30-May-1999

I don't see how the lyrics feature could be used. You wouldn't be able to insert chord changes during instrumental parts... at least not with a lot of 'padding'. I'm not sure how an introduction could be 'chorded' using the lyrics feature. There would be no first note to attach it to.

The workaround I came up with is to make a staff of rests as the top staff, use rests of similar duration as notes, and insert text where appropriate, using a negative 'staff position' to lower the chord names to the top of the next staff (which was 'vocals' in the original file in question).

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 31-May-1999

Using Text symbols, I obtain rather stable results when mixing these two fonts: TimesNewRoman|Bold|10 and MusicalSymbol|Normal|20 when using a staff size of 19 (then changing it don't alter placements)

You may find an example at http://www.geocities.com:80/Paris/LeftBank/1357/nwc/flotsjvr.zip (1260 bytes) (go to measure 15)

Please let me/us know if this helps you, and if not, why.
You may also send me your file, and I'll try on my side (at madmarsu@musician.org )

Dominique

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 31-May-1999

Oops, forgot to include the font. I don't remember of its copyright, so you may not have the right to keep it. Just test it from http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/nwc/zicsym.zip (28579 bytes)


#1153: Web Publishing on Compuserve
Web Publishing on Compuserve

(1153)

Submitted by: Rob Tyler on 05-May-1999

Somewhat new to trying to create a Web page I've been attempting to find a way to put music on board -
Problem : How can a composer file be posted onto a web page - I've read the other explanations on this forum and either dont understand them or cant do them - I'm not sure if this is mea culpa or the limitations of Compuserve - can anyone tell me ( slowly please ) how to do it
Thanks
The Vegan Fiddler

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 07-May-1999

I'm not sure about CompuServe, but there are limitations imposed (sometimes without reasons) by some providers.
The most frequent limit is not to accept some types of file, such as .bmp, .vqf, .mp3, .wav, .nwc, and so on. In fact they often only accept .txt, .mid, .htm, .html, .shtml, .zip, .jpg, .gif (though no .gif can be generated illegaly or almost, since the gif compression is under copyright).
And if you want to upload a file that has another extension, 2 solutions: either zip it, making it unusable directly by a browser (yet), either put another extension with instructions ot the user of how to rename it (not a good solution).

Last possibility : ask your provider to allow you the upload of .nwc files. On GeoCities for example, it would be helpful...

HTH, Marsu

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-May-1999

I have to use zip files to put NWC files on my GeoCities web site. You might try that. Of course, that makes it much harder for users to access them.

Reply 3 offered by: Wm Mierisch on 18-May-1999

Actually, this is really not hard at all if I understand the question. Are you trying to simply place the "printed" music on your webpage? If so, after you have created the file in NWC, go to "file" then "print preview". Select "copy" and SAVE the file as a bitmap (BMP) file. Then one of 2 things will need to happen. If you are using an HTML editor like Front Page (Express) or Netscape Composer, simply "insert image" and the file will be converted from BMP to JPEG (or the like). If you aren't using an editor capable of such a conversion, you will need to convert the file to JPG or some such graphic file traditionally supported by HTML viewers. Please feel free to email me if you would like further help on this one...

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 18-May-1999

Instead of using BMP format, you can use the wmf format (much lighter) along with paint shop pro. This is the quickest way I know (I used it for 126 files (thanks macro recorder once more) to make slides on a 10 meter screen... via tga files sent to a McIntosh). You can save your "prints" into any format you want, namely jpg/gif.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-May-1999

I recently mirrored my website on Sympatico, to have a (faster) option for my Canadian compatriots. Ran into the same problem of undefined mime-type causing problems on nwc downloads. I wrote an email to their support address, to the following effect:

"Please associate the .nwc file type as application/octet-stream on your servers. This binary format is becoming increasingly popular as a medium for music composition files. Thank you in advance for your consideration."

Two days later the problem was fixed, as you can see by downloading an nwc file from

http://www3.bc.sympatico.ca/dogstar

How's that for a subtle ad? ;-)

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 19-May-1999

Hey Fred, good idea, now let's pray (and act) to make GeoCities do the same !!! (cf Luc 18:1-5)

Reply 7 offered by: Rob Tyler on 22-May-1999

I have sorted out the printed music problem now - more or less as Bill said - by copying the print preview and pasting into MS Word and saving as a HTML file - only possible from Word97 I believe
- my next problem is how to put midi files on the web page - all the publishers I've had a go at have not been clear on this at all - I've managed to get a backgound midi playing by a <BGSOUND SRC="SongName.mid"> command - but to turn it off and on I've created a page with that command and another without it - so you can turn it off and on like that - cant it be done by creating a button of some sort ?
See my feeble efforts on :http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/cream/
in The Songbook section

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 24-May-1999

Marsu: if you are going to give biblical references, make them live! Try http://www.khouse.org/cgi-bin.blb/get_verses.pl?hr=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.judah.com%2Fbible%2F&icon=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.judah.com%2Fbanner_tmp_16_139296.gif&bgcolor=000000&textcolor=teal&linkcolor=0000FF&vlinkcolor=A000FF&Book=Luk&Chapter=18&show_all=on&Start=1&End=17
(found from http://www.judah.com/bible.html)

Reply 9 offered by: Blair on 24-May-1999

Sorry, that last link should be http://www.judah.com/bible.html

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 25-May-1999

Thx Blair for this link :-)
I personnally use (in French) the "Bible de Jérusalem", and ain't used to the KJV (nor any english version in fact). But if this site allows to search for verses specifying words in, not in (ex: verses containing "god" and ("music" or "harp") and not "flute" : nohemie 12:36 and daniel 3:15, but not I Samuel 10:5 (in BJ)) a my program does, I'll use it often :-)

About upload/download NWC files: there is two advantages in using .zip files:
1. file date is preserved _in_ the .zip file (file datation is very important for me)
2. you can easily include a .diz, .nfo or .txt file in addition of the info part of NWC files. Moreover, you may add a specific file needed to properly display/print the file (though it is better to separate these files, since they may be common to many NWC files).

The size subject is now quite completely out of discussion, thanks to NWC compressed file. However, when making a BIG zip file with many (hundreds :) NWC files, it is better not to use the compressed NWC format; but the room gained is not so much... not the effort worthy in reality.

To Rob: I do not know a solution with a button, but it's sooooo long I didn't play with HTML... nevertheless, you may want to add "LOOP=-1" in your BGSOUND item, to make it repeat (endlessly), or LOOP=2 to make it play 2 times.
Maybe a solution with frames could be better (though not supported by *old* browsers)
For a hint, go and see Andrew Purdam's page (http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html ) where you can choose what to play. I suppose that using an "empty" .mid file, you can stop the music at will.

HTH,
          Marsu


#1154: string notation
string notation

(1154)

Submitted by: Michael E Marks on 08-May-1999

Hi all,
Has anybody found a way to express classical guitar string notation - an encircled number above the individual note(s) concerned?

If it can't be done as a feature of NWC, does anybody know of a font where characters are encircled?

Michael

Reply 1 offered by: Jesse Alter on 08-May-1999

It wouldn't be too hard to create such a font yourself. Do a search at some freeware sites (i.e. tucows, download.com) and see if you can find a font editor. Load up Times New Roman, and draw a little circle around the numbers.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 08-May-1999

Only problem with "roll-your-own" fonts is portability... unless you exported the font with your published nwc files, then the user would have to install them... and so on.

Perhaps this could be put on the wish-list for the next version of "Boxmarks," which has become the de facto standard for auxiliary nwc symbols. Barry Graham, are you reading this?

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-May-1999

Trying not to!

(There are other fonts available that have circled numbers but I don't know them)

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 10-May-1999

In the WingDings font (I think it comes with Windows) there are some circled numbers.
Try Alt 0128 to Alt 0138 (do NOT forget the zero, I did not tell Alt 128 ...) for black number in white circle, and Alt 0139 to Alt 0149 for white on black.
Sorry, there is no 11, 12...22 numbers as you may need for complete guitar frets numbering !!

But this has already been discussed earlier. Add it to the wish ist (since there is no such numbers in my 10 musical fonts). I'm planning (in summer maybe) to make a "madmarks" font, but shouldn't we keep on one and only font, Barry's one ?

HTH, and though it's a bad habit to quote oneself, also refer to msg #601 reply 4 and msg #604 reply 2.

Marsu

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-May-1999

The circled numbers in guitar music refer only to "which string" - i.e. 1 through 6, so Marsu's solution is a good one indeed. (Fret positions are usually shown with C- [Roman numeral], like C-VIII would be barred at the 8th fret).

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-May-1999

PS - Regarding "Madmarks," how about expanding on "Boxmarks?" Maybe we could rename it "madboxmarks" or just "madbox.ttf" ;-)

Although most of the "easy" keystrokes have been used up, there's lots of room in the ALT 0xxx area for creative symbols. I believe that Barry has an informal wish-list for new symbols, and he doesn't seem too keen on doing yet another version :-)

Reply 7 offered by: Michael E Marks on 10-May-1999

Marsu and all,
You are quite right. I'm new to the forum and although I made it a point to check the archives and FAQ, I missed the very relevant comments about classical guitar notation. That, and other questions have been answered. (Add mine to the voices clamouring for the retention of the experimental layering feature). The Wingdings alt0xxx numbers did it. Another answer even spurred me on to create my first font. I now sympathize with Barry and his groans - it's not difficult, but tedious!

I think it's time to pay my registration, since the only remaing problem I had with NWC is now solved. I'll pay the man for Softy (a font editor) too since I foound it very workable and unpretentious.

Thanks all.

Reply 8 offered by: Dan on 12-May-1999

I use a simple system with a choice of user font and dont bother with the circle, but just use italicised, small size such as: 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th or 6th as req'd. I prefer this to the circled convention now.


#1155: Melody Switching From Right Hand to Left
Melody Switching From Right Hand to Left

(1155)

Submitted by: Jesse Alter on 08-May-1999

I'm inputting "Piano Man" by Billy Joel to NoteWorthy. I'm still learning about piano (and I'm using NoteWorthy to help me learn), but there's a little backslash from the right hand to the left hand at a certain point in the song, because the melody is being played at the left hand for a brief moment. If you are familiar with the song, it happens at this point.

There's an old man sitting next to me

---makin' love--- to his tonic and gin

"makin' love" is played by the left hand, and the rest is layed by the right. However, the problem is with the lyrics I've put into NoteWorthy. The program continues "makin' love" on the right hand, (God that sounded bad), and the notes which should be "makin' love" (oh god) have no lyrics above them. Is there a feature I could use to fix this?

If you are totally confused, I'll send you my work in progress....please respond by email.

--Jesse Alter

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-May-1999

I assume you assigned the lyrics to the right-hand staff, and you are using rests where the left hand is played. You have two options. The simplest is to assign the lyrics to each hand. For the left hand, in the Staff Lyrics Configuration tab, select Alignment to Top, and adjust the Offset (negative) so that the lyrics are on the same line as the right hand lyrics. If the lyrics collide, you can add spaces by appending an underscore to them (eg. __lyric). The underscores are displayed a spaces.

Alternatively, you can fit multiple words into a single beat by connecting them with underscores. So you could append "(last word)_makin'_love" to your last word.

Reply 2 offered by: Jesse Alter on 08-May-1999

No, that's not it. The left hand is playing harmony, and the right is playing melody, but at a certain point they switch, but the lyrics continue following the right hand.

It's VERY frusterating.

Reply 3 offered by: Jesse Alter on 08-May-1999

Ack! There's also a short musical interlude without any lyrics, and the program is placing lyrics on the interlude.

Is there anyway I can manually control the placement of lyrics?

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-May-1999

See the following:

- The help file section for the Lyric editor (press the Help button in the lyric editor to get there fast)

- The help file common question section, question #15 (in the Editing Section)

- The FAQ on our web site (a link is on the New Post form)

Reply 5 offered by: Jesse Alter on 09-May-1999

If you think you have a solution to this next problem with lyrics, you'll probably need the NWC file I'm working on. I'll send it on request...

The timing got all screwed up when I went on the second verse. I tried different combinations of underscores between words, and skipping certain parts, but it's still no good. 99% of the music in the song is done, and the remainder of the lyrics can be retrieved from http://www.lyrics.ch. If you finish this up for me, you'll get a mention in the "Comments" section when I start distributing the song. I'll also be very greatful. Or even just do the "Now John at the bar..." verse to get me started. Thanks!

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 10-May-1999

Jesse, to make lyrics appear farther, use sequences of '_ _ _ _ _ ' ... until you got them at the proper place (so create a lyrics line available on both staves). When there is a "bridge", insert same sequence in the lyrics.

You may send me your file if you don't understand what I mean, or ask me to send you one :-)

BTW, www.lyrics.ch is back ??? Great news !!! I was afraid it'd stay closed as www.altern.org !

HTH, Marsu

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-May-1999

One more suggestion: If the piano music is really a "mess" (from the lyrics point of view), then maybe you should consider a hidden track for lyrics only. Write the one-note melody on this track, assign lyrics, and use the Lyrics Configuration tab to offset the lyrics to where you want them to appear (I assume between the two piano staves).

You don't even need the melody - assign all the notes to the same key but make sure the timing is correct. Mute this track, and hide it in the Setup Dialog (first tab).

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-May-1999

Just one problem... when you hide the "dummy track", the lyrics disappear also... Darn! Would have been nice.

Reply 9 offered by: Steve Bacher on 14-May-1999

Why not just include a (visible) vocal line, with the lyrics? That's the way it would appear in actual printed sheet music, anyway.

It's very hard to produce audible words with fingers on piano keys.

- seb

Reply 10 offered by: Peter Vasey on 14-May-1999

Surely this problem would be best solved by exporting the metafile (from print preview - copy) to a suitable DTP program and entering the offending text manually. I've plugged Serif Page Plus in the past, and I believe Word also does a satisfactory job. HTH, Peter.

Reply 11 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 14-May-1999

I've solved the problem using what is currently available in NoteWorthy Composer 1.55b. Wait till Jesse posts the file, to see how I did it.

Reply 12 offered by: Jesse Alter on 15-May-1999

I tried posting it to my web page at http://webcrunchers.com/endvoid/piano%20man.nwc but it doesn't seem to work. I will send it on request, however. Thanks a lot for the help, though!

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-May-1999

It's the old mime-type problem. There is a way of fixing it; SAVE AS... then load it into a hex editor such as HexWorks and replace all occurrences of 0d0a with 0a. (There are two such occurrences). Then it runs in NWC normally. (Note: this is not a guaranteed fix for all such files, but it works with this one.)

Reply 14 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-May-1999

Or, on second thought, zip it up and post it on the website as a .zip file.

Reply 15 offered by: NWC-Support on 15-May-1999

The embedded space between "piano" and "man" may also cause problems.

Reply 16 offered by: NWC-Support on 17-May-1999

Message for Ken Jentsch: Here is reply 16, which did not cause any problems. Maybe something else is causing your problem. Could you be specific as to what happens...

Reply 17 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 17-May-1999

Due to the apparent problem of posting the file, I will try to explain 'my' solution.

The lyrics for the bottom staff are aligned to 'top', with an offset of -16 to push them up to be level with the lyrics attached to the top staff. Then I inserted a 'text expression' of blank spaces after the lower lyrics to keep them from overlapping the lyrics from the top staff.

KenJ

Reply 18 offered by: Jesse Alter on 17-May-1999

Thank you all for your help! When I completely finish the song, I will post the file in a ZIP file, as was recommended by Fred, to illustrate Ken's solution.

NWC-Support: I am aware of the problem with spaces, but by replacing spaces with "%20" that problem is solved. Thanks, however, for the suggestion.

Reply 19 offered by: NWC-Support on 18-May-1999

While the %20 does encode the space per internet specs, it does not necessarily avoid the problems that embedded spaces can trigger upstream and downstream.......

Reply 20 offered by: marsu on 18-May-1999

...and that one can experiment on 16bits systems. The part after the %20 (which turns into a space) is often lost, and when not, then many programs can not read the file (they don't find it, and you have to rename it with such a command as: (for "foo bar.nwc") ren foo?bar.nwc foo_bar.nwc [Enter]


#1156: sforzando alignment
sforzando alignment

(1156)

Submitted by: Cliff Drake on 09-May-1999

How do I enter a sforzando (or a similar character) so it appears directly under the note or notes? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-May-1999

If you mean what I think you mean then UNCHECK Preserve Width when entering the mark.

Reply 2 offered by: Brian on 16-May-1999

How does one put in flow directions such as D.C. al Fine directly under notes. Why do some things have preserve width boxes and others don't?

Reply 3 offered by: Cliff Drake on 16-May-1999

If you don't care about playback but about how the printed page looks you can add text above or below the staff for everything but the coda and segno symbols. Staff Italic I think is the font used for flow direction.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 16-May-1999

You can insert any native nwc symbols (incl. segno and coda symbols) as text by assigning one of the user fonts to nwcv15.ttf.


#1157: In Appreciation
In Appreciation

(1157)

Submitted by: Barry Graham on 11-May-1999

As a frequent user of the forum and the newsgroup I can't help noticing that the variety and extent of questions and discussions posted really push computer notation to the limits.
It really makes me appreciate the job the NWC support team has done in producing a great product at a modest price and helps me understand why 'professional quality' notation packages are such an astronomical price!
When I was working in the music profession my main source of income was copying.
It was quite easy to place marks where the arranger wanted them, add pedal marks to harp parts, tremolos to strings or trills and shakes to horn parts. But it's another thing altogether to write a program to do this at the whim of the user.
I take my hat off to the notation programmers of the world - you're doing a great job!
(Now if only MY wish list items were implemented)!

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 11-May-1999

  As a frequent user of the forum (and scarcely of the newsgroup, alas), I must admit that I fully share the opinion of Barry.
  As a musician and a programmer, I must push the congratulations further, for having written a small score editor myself in Pascal/Asm under Dos a long ago (for 8086 processor). Such a good GUI and bug-free (at 99.8%) program is really diffcult to achieve, especially when making new versions that include various (and sometimes opposed) users wishes.
  As a user, I have to say that the program is really easy to use, easy enough to let me do almost what I want or find turnarounds ; and when sometimes I have questions, they always have been answered (and sometimes in next version).
  As a registered user, I'm glad that the registration fee was affordable, even for a student !
  As a font-creator, I must ask Barry if he plans to release a version 3 of BoxMarks, and if not, if I could propose him a new version (instead of creating one entirely)...
  As a "dreamer", I dtram of certain usage of space-bar...

  Oh, and did I tell you I once tried to write scores with NWC via voice ?? it works perfectly (with an old Win3.1 program), but has the same inconvenience as mouse: it's much slower than (PC)keyboard!!

Enough said, NWCly yours,
                                   Marsu

Reply 2 offered by: Stergios on 13-May-1999

Not a surprise Marsu! This baby can do lotta things. And, by the way, for me the non-practising musician (due to practical complications) this programme is a blessing, and what keeps me into music.

Thank you NWC team. All of you.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher on 14-May-1999

Marsu, what usage of the space bar were you dreaming of?

- seb

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 17-May-1999

Steve,
I was dreaming of the space bar as a tool to "pause" the music. In many music programs (I have ProTools in mind, a _big_ professional music/tracks manager), the space bar is used to pause/unpause the playback. But this "cuts" the music, since the flow of data is interrupted.
In MIDI (thought I) the music should continue, since if data flow is stopped, no "shutdown" (or other) event is sent to the synthesis card. Thus making a "fermata" (point d'orgue) at will during playback. It seems that this is more complicated, since midi data are "compiled" at the beginning of midi playback, and that no real "delay" midi event exist.

For rehearsal purpose, as well as composing, this could be very helpful to study a score note by note...

Did I answer your question?

NWCly yours,
Marsu

Reply 5 offered by: Wm Mierisch on 18-May-1999

Just thought I'd chime in with a wee bit of praise as well. As a grad student in musicology, I frequently need to include examples in papers - and we all know how much those "big-guys'" software packages cost, even for students. I am thrilled with this program, suggest it strongly to others and do so often. Sure, I'd love to see stuff added - who wouldn't - but I wouldn't trade noteworthy in now for anything!

--- A frequent user and almost never a contributor to the discussion...

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 18-May-1999

Yup, and I only recently discovered (thx to Andrew with his NG faq) the "copy special" function for such a purpose... Really useful!!! No need any more to generate gifs/tga files. Neither .wmf (which make Word explode on low-memory systems).


#1158: Midi file importing
Midi file importing

(1158)

Submitted by: Sterhgios Moschos on 13-May-1999

Now I know that NWC is not the conventional music score midi whatever-computational-mumbo-jumbo-you-wanna-call-it piece of programming used to write and play midi music scores but I really would like to see more accurate midi inputs from this baby. What I mean is that I think that NWC does not import dynmaic variances and midi controllers or it doesn't do it in a really successful way because if I play a downloaded midi with Windows media player and import and play the same thing with NWC, boy does it sound different. And if you like doing covers of stuff this can get you into real trouble and can gurge on your time trying to fine-tune the scores. Just a thought.

Reply 1 offered by: Shane Turner on 13-May-1999

Yes, I would sure like that as well, but since NoteWorthy does not yet support most midi controllers, that would require implementation as well.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-May-1999

Further to that, if it even only imported midi controllers 10 and 7 (volume and pan) I'd be a happy camper (camposer?)

Reply 3 offered by: Matthew Allan on 19-May-1999

I'd have to say that the importing of midi file rhythms into NWC is absolutely appauling. The moment you touch something that even suggests triplets, the entire piece is thrown out by double dotted demi-semi quavers. Anything with an syncopation is completely distorted and jerky, not just the playback but the notation. There must be a way to read triplets correctly.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 20-May-1999

[I suppose that "appauling" should be read "appaling"]
Matthew, I guess you exaggerate a bit when you say <<The moment you touch something that even suggests triplets, the entire piece is thrown out by double dotted demi-semi-quavers>>...
Anyway, there is a solution to read triplets, look at http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html#macros (Thx Andrew).
What is a bit tiring, is that one can't open more than one window on an imported file (which could allow to compare differences when fiddling with note/rest resolution). Go to wish list?

NWC is mainly used (afaik) to write scores, and the import part is sometimes tiring to "clean" the score. But the macro recorder (see same link, or scriptorium) IS a great help, since it is always the same mis-writing that occur in a given file.
As soon as you have a repetitive thing to do, think of the macro recorder... :-) You'll save hours of work (and not only with NWC)

HTH, MAD


#1159: NWC info and comments exported?
NWC info and comments exported?

(1159)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 13-May-1999

Eric,

I'll start a new thread for this question. In "Musical Truncation" I started msuing about what extra "text" information gets exported to and imported from MIDI files.
eg Author, Copyright clauses, comments. Could you please clarify what goes where? Is there a generic text block for midi files?

On a slightly related note. There are one or two midi formats that contain words for "follow the bouncing ball" midi players (Macs have one, I just can't remember the name right now). I think I know the answer to this, but are there any plans to be able to import them at some time? (At least into Player?) :)

Andrew

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-May-1999

Song title, author, and copyright are all exported per the MIDI File Options block in Tools | Options | File. The help on these options explains what they do. The fields are exported as follows:

Title: If the header is placed in the Conductor track, then this field is export as a Sequence Name, otherwise is is exported as a generic text item.

Author: Always exported as a generic text item, but the word "By " is inserted in front of the author text.

Copyright: These are exported using the Copyright tag. Each copyright line is exported as a separate Copyright meta event.

During import, the same fields are recreated if they appear to conform to NWC conventions, as described above.

No other text, such as lyrics or text expressions, are currently exported or imported in NWC or the Player.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 13-May-1999

One other text item: Staff names are exported as Sequence Name events in a type 1 file.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 14-May-1999

Ta!

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-May-1999

Here's an example:

MFile 1 4 192
MTrk
0:0:0 Meta SeqName "Chawin' my Tobackey"
0:0:0 Meta Text "By Jethro Podunk"
0:0:0 Meta Copyright "Copyright \xa9 1969 by Jethro Podunk"
0:0:0 Meta Copyright "All Rights Reserved, y'all don't steal this!"
0:0:0 Meta Text "Generated by NoteWorthy Composer"
0:0:0 TimeSig 4/4 24 8
0:0:0 Meta TrkEnd
TrkEnd
MTrk
0:0:0 Meta 0x21 00
0:0:0 Meta TrkName "Jaw Harp"
0:0:0 ProgCh ch=1 prog=104
0:0:0 Param ch=1 con=7 val=127
0:0:0 Param ch=1 con=10 val=64
0:0:0 On ch=1 note=c6 vol=75
0:0:160 On ch=1 note=c6 vol=0
[...]
0:3:160 Meta TrkEnd
TrkEnd
MTrk
0:0:0 Meta 0x21 00
0:0:0 Meta TrkName "Banjo"
0:0:0 ProgCh ch=2 prog=105
0:0:0 Param ch=2 con=7 val=127
0:0:0 Param ch=2 con=10 val=64
0:0:0 On ch=2 note=c5 vol=75
0:0:160 On ch=2 note=c5 vol=0
[...]0:3:160 Meta TrkEnd
TrkEnd
MTrk
0:0:0 Meta 0x21 00
0:0:0 Meta TrkName "Washtub Bass"
0:0:0 ProgCh ch=3 prog=32
0:0:0 Param ch=3 con=7 val=127
0:0:0 Param ch=3 con=10 val=64
0:0:0 On ch=3 note=c4 vol=75
0:1:144 On ch=3 note=c4 vol=0
0:2:0 On ch=3 note=g3 vol=75
0:3:144 On ch=3 note=g3 vol=0
0:3:144 Meta TrkEnd
TrkEnd

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 17-May-1999

And what about lyrics from .kar files ? Could they be imported/exported in a future version ? (to import them, one can currently use an old dos editor...)

Thx for this clarification about info fields :-)

Marsu


#1160: Reading music from a CD
Reading music from a CD

(1160)

Submitted by: Derek Kelley on 14-May-1999

I have a piano, song that I love on one of my CD's. I can't find the sheet music for it and I was wondering if I could use Noteworthy Composer to make out the sheet music for it.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-May-1999

In a word, no. A couple people on the newsgroup have experimented with "wav-to-midi" converters, with no luck to speak of.

Here's an opportunity to practise your ear-training!

Reply 2 offered by: Derek Kelley on 14-May-1999

Well, If I figure a way of doing it. I'll let you know

Reply 3 offered by: Shane Turner on 15-May-1999

If you mean taking the actual recording and converting it directly into a midi or nwc file...
the problem is the difference in format and principle. A NWC file (and a MIDI file) is a list of notes and events. A wave file (like CD audio) is digital audio. VERY VERY different.
There are simple programs that can take a single pitch of music and turn it into a melody line but even those are experimental. Taking a whole song and turning it into a midi or nwc file.. well, maybe a cray supercomputer could do that, if such a program to do such a thing exists...
The only kind of "computer" that can turn a digital audio file into a NWC file that I know of is the human brain.

Reply 4 offered by: Don Ruckman on 26-May-1999

You might take a look at the program Wav2Midi, found at the following site:
http://www.audioworks.com/index.html
I tried this some time ago, using the computer microphone and played in, (created a WAV file), then converted to MIDI.
Don't know about a CD WAV (multi-voice), but it might be worth looking at, they have a free trial usage.

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 26-May-1999

I don't believe that a multi-voice audio track on a CD can be converted to a midi - yet.

I found a research fellow at Durham Univ. (UK) who had succeeded in converting a .wav file of a relatively simple multi-voice classical piece to a multi-channel midi but it took many, many passes to achieve this.

This was a few years ago so he may have refined this since.
The big problem in this conversion is establishing the db level of the desired signal and managing to sort out the notes from the harmonics which is not so difficult on a solo part.

You might like to try Spectrogram a freeware program by R.S.Horne that will display a log scale plot of the note frequencies in the file. (Search on Shareware.com).
You may be able to sort out the harmonies from this or at least you will appreciate the conversion problem.

Otherwise Fred is right - practice your ear training and transcribe the piece from the CD.

Good Luck!

Barry Graham

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 27-May-1999

About ear-transcribing:

I once did such a work for a complete piece (Absalon Fili Mi, Josquin des Prés (Desprez)), and I used the simultaneous playback of NWC along with the CD track.
For work purpose, I put NWC part on the left, and CD track on the right (or reverse), and use a headphone to listen more closely. This is of great help, as you hear instantly any difference that can appear due to a transcription error.
Just start NWC first (as it may delay the beginning due to "compiling"), one measure before, and then start the CD at the proper place. Even the simple MPlayer of µ$ is good to this, since you may "mark" where you want to start.
Using a midi keyboard will help you too to record lively.

I do not have the CD no more, but you'll be able to check for the file soon on Scriptorium...

Note that when parts are well "pan"ed, i.e. Tenor on the left side, Bass on right and so on, it is much easier to transcribe without error --provided ou have a good "musical ear"-- since you're not wondering which part is THAT note... :-)

Brains are the most powerful computer I know, use it; moreover, "aucun effort humain ne sert à rien" (No human effort is not worthy) sais A. de Saint Exupéry.

May the notes be with you,

HTH, Marsu

Reply 7 offered by: Shane Turner on 02-Jun-1999

>(No human effort is not worthy) sais A. de Saint Exupéry.

Except atomic bombs.

:-)

OK, OK I was taking it out of context.

Reply 8 offered by: DorkPixie on 10-Aug-1999

Yes, transcribe by ear. Its a lot of fun!

Reply 9 offered by: John on 14-Nov-1999

Software such as Sound2Midi only works for wav files containing one note at a time. For music containing more than one note at a time, such as chords, I suggest you download a trial version of Intelliscore from http://www.intelliscore.net

Reply 10 offered by: Rodolfo Sayeg on 21-Nov-2000

!Yes! there is a brilliant program called BRAIN&EARS. !USE IT,AND HAVE SOME FUN !

Reply 11 offered by: Robin Withey on 21-Nov-2000

Yours may be up to it, but we mere mortals need a little help!

Reply 12 offered by: Art Thompson on 21-Nov-2000

If you can hear it in your head, it sure is easier to write it.Start small, work your way up. Make sure you can identify intervals (seconds, thirds, etc.), both melodically and harmonically. Each has it's own distinct 'color' from the overtones it creates. A piano is the best instrument for this training, as you can listen to the notes decay. Then have someone play simple melodies and you figure out the notes. Later, try chords - major, minor, and just let the 'flavor' of those sounds enter your head. It's well worth the effort.

Reply 13 offered by: Robin Withey on 22-Nov-2000

I downloaded a shareware program recently which is supposed to help by giving a frequency analysis (with note frequencies shown) of .wav files. It looks quite interesting, but I haven't tried it out much as yet.

Unfortunately, I'm away from home at the moment, so I can't give you the URL, but I'll try and remember when I get back at the weekend.

Reply 14 offered by: Xuan Yuan on 14-Mar-2001

I had been searching for freeware online that can convert midi to wav, and I found quite a lot of other stuff.

I believe the best way for the first question is to rip the song from the CD to a wav file, convert the polyphonic wav file to a midi file, then use some software to produce the score from it.

I've forgotten the software names, but you can search for them using keywords like "wav midi converter" at sites like ask.com. If you mix around with the keywords, you'll be able to find freeware for the steps above.

Happy searching!

Reply 15 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Mar-2001

A great transcription tool is "Musicians CD Player" from
http://www.ronimusic.com
You can isolate and continously repeat sections of CD track.
There is also a feature to record sections and playback at half/double speed and/or alter pitch in cents up to +- octave.


#1161: Flow Control and Two Lyric Lines
Flow Control and Two Lyric Lines

(1161)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 15-May-1999

I am trying to use the flow control symbols (coda, segno) for the first time. My song is just like the REPEAT4 sample, except that I have two lines of lyrics between the SEGNO and the TO CODA. The music plays in the order I expect, except that during playback the second line of lyrics never gets highlighted (the first line gets highlighted again.) Is there a trick I am missing, or is this just how it works?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 16-May-1999

Blair: You cannot always get the playback note/lyric highlight to work the way you want. However, as long as you follow the rules, the playback will be correct. I trust that the play back is correct. If you want to send is a sample, we can identify precisely what is preventing your 2nd lyric from highlighting.


#1162: missing dynamics
missing dynamics

(1162)

Submitted by: peanutjake on 16-May-1999

I wrote a tune with NWC and saved it as a MIDI file. Using Crescendo everything sounded great. But when imported the file back into NWC all the dynamic changes were gone. No forte. No piano. No pianissimo. All gone. All the tracks played as if everything was forte or louder. I am using the upgrade 155-b. I then tried loading other midi files with the same result. Have I done something wrong or is there a problem with the program?

Reply 1 offered by: Brian on 16-May-1999

The same thing happened to me when I tried re-importing a file. As far as I know, dynamics are not something supported on midi file import.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 17-May-1999

No, it simply doesn't import (yet) such events. Why didn't you save your score as a standard NWC program ???
Note that if you make a specific layout with M$Word for instance and you save it as text, all your layout will be lost...
Though here the midi events are exported. What I'd tell you is to work with NWC format, and export to midi at the last stage. (Note: caution with fermata, refer to previous messages).

HTH, Marsu

Reply 3 offered by: peanutjake on 17-May-1999

As you suggested, I do indeed save a copy of a tune in nwc format so that I can easily make changes.
But I first noticed the problem when I imported a midi file that I had downloaded from the internet. All I wanted to do was make a change in the tempo. That should have taken me only a few seconds to do. But with all the dynamics missing I spent hours trying to recreate the origional volume changes on 8 tracks of music. I never got it just right.
If Crescendo and other midi players can detect the dynamic changes then I can only assume that midi files contain the information needed to play a tune correctly. I hope that you are able to fix this in the next revision of your truly great program.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 18-May-1999

(do not forget to tell this on http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm !)
If you just wanted to change a tempo, then maybe NWC ain't the simpliest solution. Try a midi event editor, maybe simply the midi2txt.exe / txt2midi.exe that you can find on http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com or referenced somewhere in the forum (I think of msg #884 reply 3)
Aside of this dynamics problem, you would probably also notice some "duration" problem, especially if you don't want an illegible score and set the note/rest resolution "low". But that is an other discussion...

HTH, Dominique


#1164: Lyric Lines
Lyric Lines

(1164)

Submitted by: Douglas Carter on 29-May-1999

Is there a way of increasing the space between the lyric lines of various verses. As it stands now, the top of the font on one verse is almost touching the bottom the verse line above.
Also, the author creit (found in the Information tap) I hve notice, encrouches, or even at times blends with any guitar chords text that appears above the notes. Is there a way of moving this higher.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 29-May-1999

If I understand your question correctly Douglas, there is a way. Actually two ways (or a mixture of both). Experiment with <Staff><Staff Properties><Visual><Vertical Size> and <Edit><Lyrics><Configuration><Offset>. A mixture of these settings will give you almost limitless options. You might also try varying the lyrics font size. Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 31-May-1999

Peter, sorry but this doesn't work as Douglas expects, since it dos not change the space BETWEEN lyrics lines.
I fear this is linked to the font, i.e. some fonts let more space above/under chars than others.
One solution, if you do not have too many (less than 12 lines) lyrics, is to add as much staves as you have lyrics lines, and use staff layering. Thus bypassing the 8-lines limit :-)
For printing, this is correct.
For playback, the problem is that the lyrics will be enlightened simultaneously.

You'll find on http://www.geocities.com:80/Paris/LeftBank/1357/nwc/vertical.zip a file that shows different techniques about vertical lyrics spacing.

Hope this helps,
Marsu


#1165: What software should I buy?
What software should I buy?

(1165)

Submitted by: Nigel Ewen on 29-May-1999

You don't get more of a novice than me. I would really appreciate some help on which software to buy/download, Cake Walk/Noteworthy/ etc. I have none at the moment. I am not a keyboard player but a classical guitar player who wants more music to play. I would also like to try my hand at composing! I would pay maybe $50 - $100 for software but nothing for hardware as I use a laptop from my work.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Starfield on 29-May-1999

Hi Nigel, I have been using Noteworthy for over 2 years now and considering the price, ease of entering notes, free upgrades and all the good advice you get on this forum I would highly recommend you to go that route! Good luck - Barry

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Shiffman on 30-May-1999

Nigel, I most enthusiastically recommend NoteWorthy! Give it a try. Why not? it's free (to start)! But -- If you would be advised -- download a copy of Keyboard Express by Insight Software, too. You'll find many uses for keyboard macros in NoteWorthy as you get into typing in music. To you and all other readers of this forum, I will be glad to send along a copy of the macros I have come up with; just e-mail a request.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 31-May-1999

Nigel, I'd personnally recommend NWc for same reasons, adding quick support and friendly users community.
Anyway, as a guitartist, you may be interested in http://guitar-pro.com/ which is more designed for guitar writing. But I did not use it (just 5 minutes to test it, seemed to be almost as good as NWC), so you'll have to try it yourself (btw, you are the one person that has to decide for you :-)
You may also refer to msg #601 for guitar discussion.

Robert, why wouldn't you submit your macros to the NWC scriptorium? (though I think that KeyBoard Express ain't as cheap as NWC, am I wrong?)

HTH, Marsu

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-May-1999

Re macros: The Scriptorium already has some macro files, intended for the (free) macro recorder that comes with Windows 3.1x. Dubious whether Keyboard Express macros would work with this, however.

Also available is a macro editor (wonderful program, btw) which can be used to (quite easily) convert macros written for Win95 to Win3.11, or vice versa.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Shiffman on 31-May-1999

Good suggestion, Marsu. But before uploading the macros I thought I'd better get up to date on the version of KeyBoard Express that I'm using. I webbed over to Insight Software at http://www.macros.com and found that KBE is no longer; it's now Macro Express. If you use ME you can import KBE macros. All appear to work fine. Thus the macros to be posted will be ME. Price for ME: 30-day trial, then $34.95.

Nigel, (remember Nigel?) Don't sweat the macro issue. Download Noteworthy. Right now. You'll thank me.

Bob Shiffman

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 01-Jun-1999

...And most of all you'll thank Eric, the author!

About Macros: I'm used to recorder.exe, the one Fred's speaking about, which I introduced a looooong time ago (Dec 1996, I think); and rather than investing 35 USD in a macro software, I'd rather put them into a decent modem... (well, I fear it won't be enough)

And, Fred: if it is you who brought RecEdit to the scripto, be thanked so much; if it ain't you, be thanked anyway for reminding us that it can be used to convert 32->16 macros and vice versa... I'm still using both environments, since my modem is under Win3.* only :-|

Marsu

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Jun-1999

No, I think RecEdit was Andrew's discovery, but thanks anyway marsu :-)

I too use both environments - Win95 (at work) because I have to, and Win3.11 (at home) because I prefer it!


#1167: Deleting Chord Text above notes
Deleting Chord Text above notes

(1167)

Submitted by: Douglas Carter on 02-Jun-1999

I have recently attempted to delete old guitar chord names from a musical setting that I have done, because of a key change.However I have had noting but grief in trying to earase them. They were placed with the "Preserve Width" box unchecked, thus leaving the little diamond shape . Does anyone know of a way to delete them?

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 02-Jun-1999

Highlight the 'little diamond shape' and delete it.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Jun-1999

As Ken says.
But if you have difficulty in selecting the diamond try using the arrow keys to navigate.
When you are located next to the diamond use Shift and Left or Right Arrow to highlight the little sucker and press Delete to blow it away.

Reply 3 offered by: one hand on 03-Jun-1999

I couldn't imagine one could try to select this with a mouse.
Keyboard is sooooo comfortable... one key, one place.

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Jun-1999

And if you miss on the first try, Edit | Undo is a quick and easy way to reverse the delete, and try again.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Jun-1999

If you _must_ use the mouse for this, it's a lot easier if you zoom in to give yourself more room (click the button with the magnifying glass thingy and the plus sign as many times as you're comfortable with).

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Bacher on 04-Jun-1999

Not only don't you need your mouse, but you don't even
need to do a select. Just use the arrow keys until the
cursor is immediately to the right of the object you want
to delete, and then press the Backspace key.

If you find you deleted the wrong thing, press Ctl-Z (undo)
and try again.

I think the DEL key will remove the object to the right of
the cursor, if I'm not mistaken.

- seb

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 04-Jun-1999

About BackSpace: if you use BackSpace to delete items (on the left of the cursor), then you're ready to use Alt+BackSpace instead of Ctrl-Z to undo an erroneous deletion. This is muck quicker :-)

HTH, Marsu

Reply 8 offered by: RC on 27-Jan-2002

Alright!! So simple & yet I couldn't find the solution. Have tried both working from directly to the right of the diamond (with backspace) and to left of diamond (with delete) and they both work slick. Thanks to all.


#1168: Fur Elise would like transcribes for nwc!
Fur Elise would like transcribes for nwc!

(1168)

Submitted by: DrakeKay on 03-Jun-1999

If you can help me locate transcibes or the sheet music online please leave me some information! I have always wanted to learn this music and I am haveing too much trouble doing it by ear!

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 03-Jun-1999

It's easy,
just go to http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/query.html and enter
lise
as search string.
You'll obtain a reference to http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ftp/classical/beetfur.nwc , submitted 16 days ago by blair.dowden@cognos.com ...

The Scriptorium ( http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ ) is the first place to search such items, then other places :-)

STH, have a good work ! :-)
(And thx to Blair Dowden)

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 03-Jun-1999

You can of course download a MIDI file and import it into NWC to obtain a transcription. Have a look at the Classical MIDI Collection at http://midiworld.com/cmc/index.htm#M it's a treasure trove! I'm also e-mailing you a version I've already obtained. HTH, Peter.

Reply 3 offered by: Dear Peter on 04-Jun-1999

Ive just opened the transcribe you sent me. Oh man you are great, this sounds so real and the upward movement in the last half sound beautiful. I will also try to find that midi file and download it too. I'm hopeing there are more peices in the url that you gave me. I would like to listen more to classical these days!

Thanks Again
Drake

Reply 4 offered by: DrakeKay on 04-Jun-1999

My thanks go out to Marsu and Peter Vasey, you two have helped me to enjoy the sounds of this great Begatelle. I have been looking over the arrangement and I've come to realize the dificulty of transcribing this piece to play on guitar. The base half of the song will not coincide with Treble if I do this. So I am searching the internet now for a prearranged duet for this piece, to be played on piano and guitar. Ive gotten a few idea's for the two of you and I have a few others that have helped. I will post my findings.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Jun-1999

There's actually a wonderful guitar arrangement of this, surprisingly accurate but a little difficult (especially the second part). I have it in a collection called "All Time Classical Guitar", Creative Concepts Publishing Corp. 154 E. Roblar Dr., Box 848, Ojai CA 93023 USA. Copyright 1989. Sadly, the arranger isn't credited.


#1170: installation
installation

(1170)

Submitted by: Judy Davis on 05-Jun-1999

After downloading & trying out version 1.51b, I ordered and received version 1.55b. Will I lose the compositions created in 1.51b by installing 1.55b over it? If so, is there a way to preserve them during the installation by moving them somewhere else?

Reply 1 offered by: Brian on 05-Jun-1999

I have installed newer versions of Noteworthy over previous versions and didn't lose a thing. If you're still worried about it though, it can't hurt to make a backup copy of all of your files (at least the ones you want to keep).

Good Luck,

Brian

Reply 2 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 05-Jun-1999

You should be able to find help elsewhere at this site. Try going to the Upgrade section and look for a Help link.

KenJ

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Jun-1999

You can safely install 1.55 over the top of 1.51, although uninstalling it later may not work out as planned. It is better to uninstall the original before installing the new copy, or install the new copy into a new folder.

In any event, you should never store files that you create in the same folder as your applications/programs. Keep them in another folder, such as the "My Documents" folder created automatically by Windows 95/98. If you don't do this, you should start now. Once you do this, your backups will be easier (since all of your files are in one locations), and upgrading your programs will be worry free.

Reply 4 offered by: Judy Davis on 06-Jun-1999

Great! Thanks for the support.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 07-Jun-1999

Judy,
I fear that you have all symptoms of a µ$ syndrom.
Installing a new version of NWC is safe, and you'll be able to read the files written with an older version correctly with the last version.
Even files written with the 1.10 version (in 1995!) are still usable.
And Eric is right : never place your own files into a sub-directory of an application. This may be very dangerous when installing *other* products of µ$ office, for instance Imagine this: you're installing a database software of a new office package, and you lose your older word-processing and slide-making software... Along with their sub-directories. Though this will NOT happen with NWC (installing NWPlayer will not uninstall your MIDI software for instance), some companies do such things.

Do not forget to have a safe copy of your own work files :-)

And enjoy the new NWC version!


#1171: joined staves...how to unjoin
joined staves...how to unjoin

(1171)

Submitted by: Fran Jelley on 06-Jun-1999

I have written a refrain and a verse and when I press play they are playing at the same time. I can't remove the line that joins them together...any ideas?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 06-Jun-1999

Fran, it sounds as though you have attempted to use NWC as a wsiwyg program - it isn't - the screen display is a continuous line. What you have probably got at the moment is a second stave linked to the first, which then plays at the same time. To get your refrain to play after the verse, it must be written following the verse in the linear stave as shown on the screen. If you look at the Print Preview (in the File drop down menu), it will be clear as to how your final music is laid out, and you can then determine the true position of your lyric and verse lines. HTH, Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter V. on 06-Jun-1999

Oops!, 'the true position of your *refrain* and verse lines' Peter

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 06-Jun-1999

See also:
- The NWC User's Guide
- msg #1033


#1173: 'Pea soup' drum sound
'Pea soup' drum sound

(1173)

Submitted by: Alan Rolfe on 07-Jun-1999

Does anyone know how to obtain that characteristic 'pea soup' hi-hat sound using a standard MIDI drum kit via NWC? i.e. on a real kit, the effect obtained by hitting an open hi-hat and then closing it. Perhaps this is more a MIDI question than a NWC one, but can NWC be used to create this sound?

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 07-Jun-1999

Yes, this is provided by the General MIDI spec. If you look at the file DRUMREF.NWC (provided as an NWC song sample in the package), you will notice two drum sounds:

- Open High Hat (Bb in 2nd octave)
- Closed High Hat (F# in 2nd octave)

Trigger the open high hat sound, then follow it with the closed high hat sound to achieve the effect that you are seeking. Most sound cards properly produce the effect of closing the high hat with the pedal.

Reply 2 offered by: Alan Rolfe on 07-Jun-1999

Thanks. I tried this before I sent the first message. I must have a crummy sound card, because the effect I got was not what I wanted. The 'open' sound persisted after the 'closed' sound. I even tried giving it a 'staccato' effect but it made no difference. (Sound card ESS ES 1868).

Reply 3 offered by: W.E. Gardner II on 31-Jul-1999

you were right about your sound card. Aaah the ESS 1868. A very much used cheap sound card. If you want a better sound card, but don't feel like spending big bucks, Yamaha makes some good cheap sound cards. They have an ISA one (Yamaha OPL3-SAx) for about $20 and a PCI one (I forget it's model) for $30. Both work great, and come with the Yamaha SYXG-50 Soft Synthesizer, which isn't that terribly bad a software wavetable synth. You can find them at almost any local computer store.


#1174: MIDI playback
MIDI playback

(1174)

Submitted by: Stewart Johnston on 08-Jun-1999

Hi,
After several years of working perfectly on my old 486, Noteworthy has developed a playback problem on my new PC (top end, tons of RAM). Basically, on playback, the sound is interrupted by 1 second gaps. Also the note highlights are about a beat ahead of the note actually being sounded. Has anyone any idea as to what the problem is please?
Stewart

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 08-Jun-1999

Can you say what type of sound card you are using and also what, if any, pseudo drivers such as wingroove ?

Rich.

Reply 2 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 08-Jun-1999

If you have a lot of other programs running at the same time, they could be competing with the 'player' for the CPU, and the delays might be the computer trying to catch up with all the tasks it is doing.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 08-Jun-1999

As Richard wrote above - if your new system includes a software synthesizer - like Wingroove - the synth has to compile the sound output from wavetable data stored in memory and this takes some time.
NWC displays the highlight when the note is triggered - the compile time produces a lag in the sound production.

If this is not the case then perhaps Ken is right - but I dont see a top end system dragging it's feet with midi output - unless you are multi-tasking a satellite launch in background!

Reply 4 offered by: Russ K. on 08-Jun-1999

I found a similar situation when I changed to a new sound driver. I don't think there's anything you can do about it as long as you stay with that same sound diver(at least in my case). I think the error is in the sound driver itself, being a programming error or such.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1999

The trouble come, as Richard, Barry & Russ said, from your software to produce sound.
If you're using a sound card directly (which does not affect CPU), no trouble; if you're using "advanced" software which computes the wave signal instead of letting the sound card doing it (with convenient electronic chips) you'll get a delay, whatever CPU power you got.
If you're using a sound card that has tis own chipset and almost no software, no trouble.
I've tried this with my old SB16 card, and the delay disappeared.

So change your driver, or --as you may xant to keep it for other usages-- install the most direct MIDI driver you've got (maybe simply µ$'s one) and set NWC to use this midi playback device (in Tools/Options.../Midi)

HTH, Marsu

Reply 6 offered by: Stewart Johnston on 09-Jun-1999

Thanks to everyone who gave me advice. I'll go and fiddle with my machine and let everyone know what happens.
Stewart


#1175: Notes On Note Worthy Composer
Notes On Note Worthy Composer

(1175)

Submitted by: Billy on 08-Jun-1999

How Do You Trill , Do A Roof Top And A Glis On NWC
Id Aprisheate it if you would e-mail me back if you know

thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Blair on 08-Jun-1999

You can't do these things directly, but you can simulate them using the Insert Text command with a musical font. The de-facto standard is the Boxmarks font on the NoteWorthy Composer Scriptorium at http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/helpful.html

If you are just doing publishing this is enough. Otherwise you then put the real music on a hidden track. There are many examples of this on the scriptorium. For example you can see my simulation of the turn symbol in bar 31 in Fur Elise at http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ftp/classical/beetfur.nwc

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Jun-1999

There is also a good example of trills in the MOONLITE.NWC sample that ships with the product.

Reply 3 offered by: Eduardo Cornejo on 30-Oct-1999

Hola

Reply 4 offered by: David González on 19-Dec-1999

Do you know where I can find classical music in NWC format?

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Dec-1999

Try http://www.vadu.com/nwc/dbfull.html

Reply 6 offered by: Ga goo, ga goo, ga goo on 20-Dec-1999

Great Idea! add that font with the extra symbols into nwc Noteworthy. we've been waiting your new release for years. When are ya gonna purdy us up with it?
yes, definitely add the glissando note, you can implement it like a grace note. easy. I know you guys can do it.
please, drop us a tease for when we can expect mroe goodies.
I'd love to have NWC 2 under my tree of idolatry this christmas!!!

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP


#1176: Help!
Help!

(1176)

Submitted by: June on 09-Jun-1999

I've written a piece with a tempo of 60.
Most of the notes have ended up as sixteenth notes.
This makes it much more difficult to play.

How can I double ALL the note (and rest) values?
(in other words, how do I turn the sixteenths into eighth notes, and half-notes into full ones, etc?)

I'll then be able to change the tempo to 120 (which it should be) so that the piece will be right...

The piece is rather large so I need an easy solution.

Thankyou for ANY help.

Yours,
June.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1999

June,
one comment before a solution:
it's not because notes are sixteenth at tempo 60 that they are harder to play than eighths at tempo 120. It's _exactly_ the same, though a psychologic effect *could* make it harder to appreciate.

Solution: first get the macro recorder (english version at http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ftp/helpful/recorder.zip ), unzip it in your Windows directory (in 3 seconds).
Start NWC, open your NWC file, and put the cursor just before the first note you want to make "larger".
Start macro recorder, and click on Macro/Record... to create a macro. Call it "larger", record only keyboard, set the shortcut key to Alt+Right, and set to fast speed. Click on Start.
Switch back to NWC with the mouse, and do what you have to do in NWC to "increase" notes duration:
Shift+Right	    (this will select the note)
Minus	    (this will change the note length)
Right	    (this will unselect the note and be ready for further action)
Stop the recording by pressing Ctrl+Pause (or using the mouse to switch back to Macro recorder). Save the macro.
Now you got a macro to repeat your NWC action.
Go back to NWC, and press Alt+Right (or the shortcut key you gave to your macro). Keep Alt+Right pressed to see all your notes be correctly changed at lightning speed.

Et voilà! Now you just have to change your tempo.
/!\ Take care also to chords which have different lenghts in them: they won't be correctly changed (they will take the shorter duration of the chord, shifted larger once).

If you find this procedure too tedious, I can send you the macro file along with the recorder (english or french, let me know). But I wanted to put the explanation (that I hope clear enough) for anyone on the forum.

HTH, please do not hesitate to contact me (madmarsu@musician.org), or to send me the file, I'll send it back to you in a 1-workday delay.

If you want more macros or details on it, go and visit http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/helpful.html#Macros :-)

    Marsu

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1999

Just one thing I've just been thinking about:
instead of working directly on your original staves, duplicate them and work on the duplicated ones. So you can easily see if the results are good or not, by visual comparison.
Alas, you won't be able to check by ear, since NWC doesn't allow (to my knowledge) 2 different tempi (one for original staves, one for enlarged ones).
And do not forget to change your time signature (or to use the AuditBarLines tool) too :-)
And while using the macro, do not care about text items, bars,... since they won't be affected. So keep the keys pressed until end or special case (chords of diff. notes durations)

Reply 3 offered by: June on 09-Jun-1999

oh dear. It sort of worked. I recorded a macro just like you said but I got some weird results. For example, I got several 64th rests appear out of nowhere, and some bar lines went missing (and I think some of the rest values got doubled as well or something?) Thank you for your offer to work on the piece for me but I think I will leave it for a while. I don't think Noteworthy was designed for the recorder thing as when the macro got to the end of the staff the buttons went crazy. I also found that doing "audit bar lines" makes the staff go crazy after the macro. Maybe if there was a tool to remove the bar lines first it would work? I think I will just stick to the piano music. Unless there is some other trick?

Yours,
June.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 09-Jun-1999

June:
the 64th rests come from "whole" rests "enlarged". As no larger value than the whole exist, it cycles to 64th. (hence the "button went crazy" phenomenon at the end, if you keep the shorcut key pressed.)

If you got whole notes/rests, you must duplicate them instead of using the macro.

If you're not too anxious about it, the macro recorder (yes, again) can help you to remove bar lines.
One thing to keep in mind in that the macro recorder just do what you'd do, but (much) quicker. It's absolutely not "intelligent".
The normal process to remove bar lines is:
1. go to end of staff
2. press Ctrl-Left
3. press BackSpace (not Delete!)

repeat 2. and 3. (you may repeat 1. too at will) until you got no more bar line.
So it is a perfect candidate for macro recorder: just record the 2. and 3. steps, and play it again.

I do NOT recommend to enable the auto-repeat feature of recorder. it may be very dangerous, especially when doing destructive work. Anyway, first NWC has a 100th level undo capability, and 2nd as long as you have not saved, you can revert to your work.

The "audit bar lines" should work perfectly, if no whole is badly transformed into 64th.

If anything does not go well in your work process (NWC+macroRecorder), NWC is NOT the cause. First check what your macro does (on the scripto, look for RecEdit, it allows you to "edit" the macros, a thing that recorder can't do).
In most of cases, writing down the keys you type explains the strange processes.

Hope this helps 2,

MAD (MacroRecorder Addicted Dominique?) aka Marsu

Reply 5 offered by: June on 18-Jun-1999

I successfully fixed my piece.

Could noteworthy add another feature
or
make it so that breve notes are changed
to two breves notes when the note value
is doubled using "-" (same for rests)

Just a thought...

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1999

Happy you fixed it :-)
btw, you can add your wish to the wishlist (http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm).
Personally, I'll wish that whole became "ronde carree", which value is two whole notes, something that looks like |o| or |=| , often used in old music (I'm willing to write Allegri's Miserere and some other plain-chant music).

Reply 7 offered by: oops on 18-Jun-1999

correct reference is http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm without ). at the end.

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Edwards on 21-Jun-1999

Just a small BTW.

A whole note is a semibreve in English English, and your ronde carrée would then be the same as the English breve, but what is the US equivalent?

Or am I the one who's mixed up?

Peter

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 22-Jun-1999

You're right Peter, the ronde carrée is the breve.
For other values, you may look at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/faq3.htm#notechrt ... I found it by searching od threads (vive le form offline), and you can refer to msg #609 and msg #838 for such a discussion.

NWCly yours

Reply 10 offered by: PeterEdwards on 22-Jun-1999

But no mention of the US English term for a breve. perhaps that's why NWC doesn't have it - because it doesn't have a name!

Reply 11 offered by: Peter Edwards on 23-Jun-1999

Come on, Eric, I was only teasing, so there's no need to retreat into your shell!
But what is the breve called in your neck of tyhe woods?

Actually that does lead me on to an apalling suggestion. In Victorian England there was a novel entitled 'Eric'. I am quite sure it is no longer read, and have no idea what it might be about, but in England the subtitle is still universally quoted: 'or Little by Little'!

May Jove hurl his thunderbolts, I don't mean it! Honest!!

Thanks for a great product, but please incorporate all our wishes in the next release!

Peter

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 24-Jun-1999

All our wishes, that's a bunch of work!!
Since one must filter out what would change the main aim of NWC, what is against other more-wished wishes, what is too much work for too simple feature, and so on.
Though I'm not too bad in programming, I wouldn't be in Eric's place to have to choose between all these wishes :-) !
But I'd like to be in his place to receive the congrats for such a wonderful program ;-)

Brgds,
    NWCly yours,
                            Dominique

Reply 13 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 13-Jul-1999

Late, sorry, but in U.S. English a breve is called a double whole note. Not very imaganative a translation for a word that mean "short", but there it is.

Cyril


#1177: Decresendo over multiple bars and tied chords
Decresendo over multiple bars and tied chords

(1177)

Submitted by: John Marchington on 11-Jun-1999

In my latest composition, I have a section involving identical semibreve triad chords which extend over a number of bars. The chords are tied across the barlines. I have a forte dynamic marking at the beginning of the sequence and a piano marking at the end. At the beginning of the bar following the f marking, I have place a decresendo. For some obscure reason, the latter is being ignored and there is no dynamic variance. If I untie the chords, however, the dynamic shading can be clearly heard. What is the reason for the problem and its solution, please?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Jun-1999

See:

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1126.htm and

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/0/994.htm

Reply 2 offered by: John Marchington on 11-Jun-1999

Thanks to everyone for the response to my request. The problem is solved, and very effectively too. The only other time I've tinkered with the MIDI Volume settings was when I was having 'too-abrupt' endings to my compositions when playing them back as MIDI files and I had to work out a method of adding a delay (time-wise) at the end. If anyone has had a problem there, I am happy to describe what I've done to overcome it.

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 12-Jun-1999

For those that look at this later in the offline forum, the prior message links are: msg #1126 and msg #994


#1178: Hairpins!
Hairpins!

(1178)

Submitted by: Joshua on 12-Jun-1999

I'm a chorister with my school's choir & I had been using noteworthy composer to type several scores, however, I would like to ask is there a option for me to put hairpins instead of crescendo or decrescendo? I currently have cakewalk express, but I find noteworthy much easier to use & much capable of more inputting more musical terms than cakewalk, however, cakewalk does has hairpins. Any suggestions on how to add hairpins on noteworthy?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 12-Jun-1999

Go to the NoteWorthy Scriptorium at

http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com

and download the Boxmarks font. This has become the "de facto" standard for additional musical symbols, including but not limited to hairpins. Install it as per usual, and assign it as a user font (most people seem to use User2 for this.) If you open the file Boxmarks.nwc in a separate window, you can copy items from this window and paste into your work.

Reply 2 offered by: Joshua on 13-Jun-1999

I downloaded the boxmark file, however, I find that the notations(namely the hairpins) do not really have any effect on the dynamics stated on the notes. Is it supposed to work this way?

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 13-Jun-1999

In short - yes. The hairpin symbol in the boxmarks font is an inactive text object - it is not linked in any way to the MIDI properties of the score. 'Active hairpins' has been requested by many users (myself included). Put it on a wish list - if enough requests are received we may get it! The wishlist reference is:
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Jun-1999

Next best would be the ability to "hide when printing" dynamic variances like cresc. and decresc.

The only known workaround at present is to use volume mpc's to do the actual dynamic variance (these don't show when printing) in conjuction with the text objects (i.e. hairpins) for the visual score.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 14-Jun-1999

If you print on a PostScript enhanced printer, you may also refer to http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1357/cresdecr.html (and not .htm as written long ago in msg #166, but correctly in msg #188 )

This is more flexible than hairpins chars, but as them, for print only.

Reply 6 offered by: Joshua on 14-Jun-1999

How do I use a volume mpc? How does it work anyway?

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 14-Jun-1999

Go where you want to enter the MPC.
Use L to open the MPC window (or Ctrl-E later to edit it, when selected)
Type V for volume, Tab, L for linear sweep, and jump to controller values.
Enter the correct value for volume (refer to your last dynamic entered, or set it at will) at the beginning (i.e. just at the MPC place, if you let 1st "Time Offset" to 0)
Enter the number of beats (in quarters, according to "time offset multiplier) for 2nd value of the volume. Set the last value for volume.

You just entered a (de)crescendo volume variation, from [1st volume value] to [2nd volume value] with a duration of [Time Offset Multiplier x [2nd setting value].

3rd and 4th values can be used subsequently to previous ones (offsets are from previous point, not absolute)

you may also read help ("Multi-point command controller") in online help.

Hope I've been clear & this helps,

Marsu

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 14-Jun-1999

Proper hairpin crescendo support is my biggest and longest standing wish for this product.

The Boxmarks crescendo symbols are too small. Longer ones would be a lot more useful as a work-around.

As for hiding the "cresc." symbols, yes there should be a hide setting. But if you are doing a piano score where you need to place these symbols on both staves, you can effectively hide one of them by placing it right on top of the other. They usually line up perfectly.

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 14-Jun-1999

Blair said: "The Boxmarks crescendo symbols are too small. Longer ones would be a lot more useful as a work-around."

I spoke to Barry about this a while ago, and the problem is that it affects the width of the character set in general, I guess causing alignment problems elsewhere.

Gives rise to the request for a horizontal adjustment of text, I guess.

"As for hiding the "cresc." symbols, yes there should be a hide setting."
Agreed.

"But if you are doing a piano score where you need to place these symbols on both staves, you can effectively hide one of them by placing it right on top of the other. They usually line up perfectly."
...Until you change the stave's vertical height, say to allow for extra note space.

A

Reply 10 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Jun-1999

Graphical dynamics (hairpins) are a major omission in the NWC notation marks (along with rhythm markers and multi-bar rests).
The problem with including variations in length etc. in a font like Boxmarks is that there is a width restriction on each character in the font.
Hairpins really need to be stretchable like Metafile objects to be of any real use.
In the meantime I'll be Wishin' and Hairpin' like everybody else!

Reply 11 offered by: Joshua on 15-Jun-1999

Thank You All for your help, I greatly appreciate that however, I have another problem. Certain times on a score for the piano, the notes on one staff can run on to the other staff to omit unneccesay ledger lines, however, I had not been able to do that, so I have to type with all the ledger lines which can be a hassle to the typist & the person playing the score. Take for example John Rutter's All things bright & beautiful. Secondly, the arpeggio effects written cannot be replicated in a midi, which make the whole piece sounds quite subtle.

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 15-Jun-1999

About Arpeggio effect: this can be done through a hidden staff. Look at moonlite.nwc in the samples folder, esp. measure 154 or 156.
To see how it is really made, open the "Page Setup" window, and check the box "hidden" in the Contents tab. Then go to measure 154.

About too many ledger lines, and notes going through staves:
NWC can't currently manage notes that change of staves, especially if you want to beam them (otherwise you can write them directly on the other staff). But for ledger lines, you can either use 1. "shifted clefs", i.e. clefs with a small 8 above or under it, which indicates that what you read must be shifted one octave up/down; 2. use the Boxmarks font, and insert the chars 8, v and w at the beginning/end of the sequence that is octaved-shifted. Look at http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ftp/classical/beetfur.nwc (Thank Blair Dowden), measure 81: before the first note, there are two text items for such a usage. You may want to increase the "upper" space of the staff to see it easily.

Hope this helps,
                                        Marsu

Reply 13 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 15-Jun-1999

The only solution I know to your problem with ledger lines, is to put it on the wishlist. Ask the author to allow "vertical size" settings (under staff properties) down to 6, instead of the current 8. That ought to line up the staves the way you want (with only one ledger line between the treble and the bass staves).


#1180: staff playback synchronization
staff playback synchronization

(1180)

Submitted by: Webb Comfort on 13-Jun-1999

I'm a new user of NWC. I'm doing 4-part vocal music on 2 staves, and mostly it's been going OK. Just ran into a problem that I can't find discussed. I just added a new section to a song; but when I try to play it back, the treble staff plays one measure ahead of the bass staff! If you start the play from the beginning, it plays OK until it hits the second ending, when it somehow skips playing the first measure of the treble staff, and they are out of synch from then on. Did I do something wrong? I have no idea where to look in the HELP file (except the PLAY description, which doesn't talk about such a problem). I'd appreciate any suggestions.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Jun-1999

Check to be sure that all flow direction commands and repeats are duplicated on all staves. Also, it's quite normal for repeats to act strangely when playing from an arbitrary point; this is apparently because the requisite repeat flag(s) haven't been set, as would be the case when playing the piece from the beginning.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 14-Jun-1999

You'll learn more on repeat usage looking at the repeat?.nwc Sample files, as specified in "Did you know" tip #6:

!newtip help=JumpID("nwc.hlp","MNU_ADDFLOWDIRECTION")
There are several samples included in the package that demonstrate how to create repeated sections in your songs using Flow Directions, Special Endings, and repeat bar lines.

Look for the songs REPEAT*.NWC in the Samples folder for details. The File Info in these songs explains them in more detail.
(end of quote)
So probably one repeat sign is not placed correctly on some staff (it must be on all staves, refer to msg #978 )
Hope this helps, NWCly yours,
Marsu

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Jun-1999

> it's quite normal for repeats to act strangely when
> playing from an arbitrary point

This should not be the case. If you have an example, it would be helpful if you sent it to us.

Reply 4 offered by: Webb Comfort on 14-Jun-1999

Thanks for the suggestions. It looks like what happened was that I put the second ending indicator on just the treble staff (since in a printed score it only shows there), and somehow the playback decided to skip that measure -- or something. Anyway, when I put the second ending indicator on the bass staff also, the synch problem went away. That just means that when I print it out I'll have to make a separate version of the file.

Thanks again for your help.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 14-Jun-1999

Webb Comfort, apparently you didn't look at the bottom of msg #978 :-) ...where it's said that "although you have to enter the marks on every stave, NoteWorthy is clever enough to only print the marks on the top most stave." (Richard W) and "Somehow I assumed that the score would look like what I see on my screen" (Lars E)
So you won't need to separate version of file.

To support: I bet that if one starts playback from a measure between repeat signs, but NOT on the "good" staff, some strange behaviour occurs. Anyway, this seems normal to me, as the score is not consistent.

Mad

Reply 6 offered by: Webb Comfort on 14-Jun-1999

You're right -- I did not look at note 978. I don't know how to find note 978 in the archive; and I don't know how I should know that note 978 has something to do with my problem! But thanks for your help.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Vasey on 15-Jun-1999

Hi Webb, to get to message 978, just click on this link : msg #978

You can set up links to previous messages by putting an exclamation mark in front of the message number. So (and obviously I can't use the exclamation mark in this example but will substitute a capital i for it) when posting this reply I used I378 to set up the link. Peter.

Reply 8 offered by: Peter (again) on 15-Jun-1999

Darn it. I978 Peter

Reply 9 offered by: Jim on 16-Jun-1999

>and I don't know how I should know (reply 6)
'Cuz someone told you on reply 5. so go and c msg #978!


#1181: Link with music scanning software
Link with music scanning software

(1181)

Submitted by: Alan Rolfe on 15-Jun-1999

I will be putting this on the wishlist, but I thought I'd stick it here as well, to try and get a bit of support.
I would like a nice seamless way of integrating NWC with a music scanning program such as MIDISCAN. At present I can scan in a manuscript with PIANOSCAN (a mini version of MIDISCAN), correct it, create a MIDI file, import that into NWC, correct it again, and then print it or play it. Quite a long job, and only marginally quicker than transcribing it by hand. If there was a better link between the two programs, or if NWC came up with a plug-in which scanned in music, it would be excellent!

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 15-Jun-1999

Alan,

I used to achieve same scan-midiscan-midiexport-importNWC process. What I found is that the quickest way is to correct just time signature in MidiScan, and then export to midi, and to make all other corrections in NWC.
Because MidiScan is all but user-friendly, and NWC GUI is soooo easy to use. Keyboard is hundreds more precise than a mouse. And NWC has some powerful tools.

If midiscan could directly export to clipboard in NWC format, it would be a bit better :) since complex chords (chords with different note lengths) should be correctly imported. Las, MidiScan has no NWC export :(
On the other hand, if NWC could read .mnd files...

IMHO, let's NWC programmers concentrate on printing/midiing stuff, instead of scattering energy onto music recognition (look at msg #1111 , msg #861, msg #485 or msg #555 for old discussions).

Did someone recently upgrade MidiScan? Did they make some progress?

Marsu


#1182: Publishing on the Net
Publishing on the Net

(1182)

Submitted by: Douglas Carter on 16-Jun-1999

I was wondering if there is anyone out there taht has placed their compositions on the net. I'm not quite sure as to how to go about it. I have a home page which I am ready to publish and have links to various folers on MY computer . Do I have to place these pages in my home home page and if so how.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Jun-1999

You have to upload your files to your remote server, after suitably creating directories to contain them. I'd suggest checking out the help facility of whatever web server you're using. They undoubtedly have an "Upload Wizard" or something to that effect. The idea is to duplicate your directory structure.. aka "folders" .. on the remote server computer.

You'll probably find the "easy" uploading facility slow and ponderous. Once you get the idea of how it all works, you'd be well off to get yourself an "ftp client" program that will let you upload directly, much like copying files between directories (by dragging and dropping) on your own home computer.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Jun-1999

First you can look at some examples. Start with http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com then look for the web ring on that page. This will take you to a few dozen web sites for NWC users.

The big problem is that many sites do not permit the direct uploading of NWC files. It is necessary to ZIP them first. This is unfortunate, because it make it harder for visitors to access the files.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1999

Well, uploading .nwc files directly is highly dependant of your provider.
Nevertheless, some "free web space" providers authorize it. We already know that GeoCities doesn't, but FortuneCity DOES ! I just tested it (I have a site there since some months (created for NWC ring)) and it works well. No trouble uploading the file. But I had troubles downloading it (with NS3), since it's interpreted as text... I think I must change something in my preferences, but do not know what.
URL of FortuneCity is : http://www2.fortunecity.com/downtown/index.cgi
where you can create your own site freely. I have to say that they ask you to give full rights on what you publish there, though. That's why I won't place own copyrighted stuff on *that* place.
For francophone people, look rather at http://fr.fortunecity.com/ :-)

Try downloading an NWC file I put there : http://www.fortunecity.com/underworld/bandicoot/434/nwc/cestuned.nwc

I'm sure other free providers accept direct NWC upload, but I don't have too much time to test it now.

Hope this helps,
Marsu

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Jun-1999

This helps me. Finally a web server that accepts NWC files!

For working on web pages, I highly recommend FTP Explorer, a freeware program available from (for example) http://www.compusmart.ab.ca/clix/pages/software.htm
This provides an easy way to transfer files to and from the web server.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Jun-1999

Another good (and free) ftp client program is ws_ftp, available all over the place (download.com, tucows, etc.)

Marsu - sorry, but the fortunecity link gets treated as text in Netscape (which defaults to unknown mime-types as text). It _might_ be worth a try to email them and ask them to associate the .nwc mime-type as "application/octet-stream". This worked with sympatico, Canada's nation-wide ISP, so it might work with fortunecity??

Another option: put a note on your page asking Netscape visitors to right-click on the link and select "Save As..." - that works as expected.

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowde on 18-Jun-1999

The link worked perfectly for me with Internet Explorer 5.

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jun-1999

...as long as you use the lasted (1.55b) version of NWC!

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Jun-1999

Yes. Apparently, IE defaults unknown file mime-types to binary instead of text (incorrectly, it could be argued... but in this case it works to our advantage).

Be that as it may, there are still some of us who will put up with shortcomings in Netscrape in exercising a choice in one of the very few areas where we still _have_ a choice.

Reply 9 offered by: Peter Vasey on 19-Jun-1999

In reply no. 2, Blair said <it is necessary to ZIP them first. This is unfortunate, because it make it harder for visitors to access the files.> Winzip, a trial version of which is freely available on the net - go to http://www.winzip.com - will make a self extracting .exe file from the zipped folder. The recipient then does not need Winzip to unzip the files, and as far as I know most if not all servers accept .exe files. I registered Winzip - it's extremely useful for archiving, comressing some files to almost a tenth of their original size, and will span floppies if you need to transfer files larger than a single floppy can hold. HTH, Peter.

Reply 10 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 21-Jun-1999

Winzip self-extracting exe's: nice for some purposes, but ONLY works on M$ systems?

Let's not take the power of choice away from our users...

Reply 11 offered by: Peter Vasey on 21-Jun-1999

Yep, Stephen, but NWC only works on M$ systems .......

(Mac users, get your prayer mats out!!)

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 22-Jun-1999

Well, NWC does work on MacIntosh... with an emulated PC in it. so .Exe can be used there (as I use Mac diskettes (not progs) on my PC).
Instead of having Winzip+explorer+W*FTP, I prefer to use WindowsCommander (http://www.ghisler.com/ ) which does all what they do, in a single interface which is really powerful. IMHO of course, and maybe 'cause I'm used to that good old NortonCommander 2... though this graphic interface is much better. But having a direct access to commands and managing files into archives directly is _so_ cool :-)

NWCly yours

Reply 13 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 14 offered by: Alvaro Medina on 27-Jun-1999

Even if I dont plan to publish on the net my .nwc files, by now, I have downloaded files from many sites. Ones had the files in .zip, others in .nwc. In those, one was read as text, which is a bit strange, but can be saved anyway, and no pro; But anyway its a mess. The only site where there is .nwc files as is, and downloaded with no troubles, is the NWC Scriptorium (http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/). I must say I use Opera as browser, so its not just browser problem. It would be very useful if someone in the Scriptorium write some lines to this forum, as they handle it very well.

Reply 15 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 04-Jul-1999

"The only site where there is .nwc files as is, and downloaded with no troubles, is the NWC Scriptorium (http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/). "

..and please feel free to submit compositions to the Scriptorium. It's free, though you have to be happy with the format that we've decided upon. I even do the uploading for you!

However, I think you'll find that my homepage has NWC files as is and they should be readily clickable without reverting to being interpreted as text. Please try
http://www.pcug.org.au/~apurdam/noteworthy.html

Andrew

Reply 16 offered by: Mike McCawley on 26-Oct-1999

I have a web site on AOL (http://hometown.aol.com/jubilatum/songs.htm) that seems to have worked just fine for the last two years. For all that may be said against the monolths like AOL, sometimes it's just easier to use them.


#1183: Copying preview to clipboard
Copying preview to clipboard

(1183)

Submitted by: June on 18-Jun-1999

I have a piece with measure numbers.

If I go to Page Setup,
click Preview,
click Copy, (to clipboard as .WMF)
and paste in Publisher or Word,
half of the bar numbers get cut off.

This is because the bar number is
placed across the
MIDDLE of a bar line,
so only half of the bar number
is displayed when I paste the
page into another application.

What is a solution?

I can't print some of my work
until I can print with complete
bar numbers.

If I have missed something please
awaken me to it...

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Jun-1999

Just a guess, but have you tried increasing your left margin width?

Reply 2 offered by: June on 18-Jun-1999

Yes. problem still there

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 18-Jun-1999

I was tearing my hair out when this thread came up. How do I take a WMF file and put it into Word. I've tried various imaging programs but they don't work.

Is it better to import in WMF format, i.e. can you do more inside the host file, than in BMP format.

Thanks for any help
Peter

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1999

As Blair has just suggested, i'd have talk about margins. But as you say it did'nt solve, I found a turnaround that may be acceptable (it was for the score I have).
Simply configure your page setup ("Options" tab) to display staff label on "all systems".
This is acceptable if:
1. all staff names are short enough. In my case, they are S., A., T., B., but for intruments, normalized abbreviations exist (don't ask me, i dunno in English)
2. all staves have different names (demanded by WNC).
3. you are okay to have it on each page. But you can supress them into your final editor.

Hope this helps!
Marsu

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 18-Jun-1999

To June: I forgot to mention where you can find the file I tested. It's the one referenced in http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1182.htm#reply3
To Peter: yes it is better in WMF than BMP format.
Note that you need much memory to edit them in Word.
And that PaintShopPro (I got 3.12 version) works perfectly with .WMF files. I used it for all the chorals of St John's Passion of JSBAch to display in slides on a 10 meter screen. I used Copy to Clipboard in NWC, and decided of the final size in PSP (I use Ctrl-V to paste in a new picture).

hope this helps

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 18-Jun-1999

Got it.

Isn't the Internet wonderful!

Many thanks
peter

Reply 7 offered by: June on 18-Jun-1999

It's okay Marsu, I don't want to tell the musician what instrument they are supposed to be playing every time they get to a new line. I'll have to do my cut, copy and pasting with the sticky tape and paper method. :(

(I'm mainly printing individual parts)

Thanks anyways.

June

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Vasey on 19-Jun-1999

With great confidence, having always had 100% success with it, I tried my favourite - Page Plus. BUT same problem as June. This has to be classed as a bug. Sorry, but over to you, Eric.

Peter.

Reply 9 offered by: Steven Johns on 19-Jun-1999

Hey'all, When that gets fixed up could yous add the "bars silent" feature too? Like as an option in de page setup when single instrument tracks are printed.

Coolness,
Steve.

Reply 10 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Jun-1999

June - Am I missing something here.

Why do you need to paste into Word to print out individual parts?
You can do that from NWC using Page Setup to display one part at a time.

I can only say that the fault must be with Word - the metafile contents are complete within the file.

If you need to import into a document to add graphics or whatever - try Coreldraw or import into Microsoft Publish and use the Crop function to 'uncrop' - that is make the space around the image larger.

Unfortunately the little diamonds on Space-Not-Preserved -Text appear when you copy to file or clipboard.

Despite Marsu's suggestion beware of using Paint Shop Pro with metafiles - it can only handle them as a bitmap image.
The ability to rescale without distortion - the main advantage of the metafile is lost.
Coreldraw is much better - it retains the metafile format but is a lot slower and less user friendly.

Reply 11 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Jun-1999

I forgot.
Copying the page as a File (Placeable Metafile) is a better solution because you should then be able to Insert the file into Word.

Reply 12 offered by: KJ. on 20-Jun-1999

*** Why do you need to paste into Word to print out individual parts? You can do that from NWC using Page Setup to display one part at a time.

Every single band/orchestra on the face of the planet needs individual parts to play. Well I need it for adding unique copyrights/titles/notes and other info/notation.

*** I can only say that the fault must be with Word - the metafile contents are complete within the file.

So? The bar numbers have been cropped in half.

*** If you need to import into a document to add graphics or whatever - try Coreldraw or import into Microsoft Publish and use the Crop function to 'uncrop' - that is make the space around the image larger.

Why shouldn't it work first time?

*** Unfortunately the little diamonds on Space-Not-Preserved -Text appear when you copy to file or clipboard.

*** Despite Marsu's suggestion beware of using Paint Shop Pro with metafiles - it can only handle them as a bitmap image. The ability to rescale without distortion - the main advantage of the metafile is lost. Coreldraw is much better - it retains the metafile format but is a lot slower and less user friendly.

Cool.


#1184: Slur (and tie) location
Slur (and tie) location

(1184)

Submitted by: David Barnes on 21-Jun-1999

A new tip describes how to ensure that a slur is positioned above (or below) notes in cases when the default is to do the opposite. This is fine for just editing but I need to print also and a print preview seems to reset the slur location. The main reason I want this is to be able to get the slur and tie markings out of the way when using the staff layering feature (above the notes for the upper staff and below for the lower would be ideal). Any thoughts?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Jun-1999

What's more, simply playing the file resets it also. If you print right away after making the change, it seems to work.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 22-Jun-1999

Anyway, it doesn't seem stable enough for me to use it. And I often "misplace" the stem of 3rd line notes (especially on alto parts) ofr slurs purpose (to make them higher). So I can't use this tip (http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip7.htm#slur ), which performs an audit note stems.

Reply 3 offered by: David Barnes on 22-Jun-1999

I'll try printing it immediately after fixing the stems (Thanks to Fred for msg #1184 (reply 1))but I would like to be able to control the location. Unless my submission went wrong I have added to the wish list (user control over the location of slur and tie lines relative to the notes tied and slurred). If this is easy to do and popular perhaps we will see it in a future release.

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 29-Jun-1999

What we need is a way to select and edit ties and slurs to set their direction. This capability would complete (I think) the features needed to make staff layering work (like horizontal adjusting the position of notes, which we just got).

While we are at it, if we can edit a slur, how about an option to vertically adjust the start and end points? This would give us the capability of tilting slurs, which can make the score look a little nicer.

Hairpin Crescendos would give me 80% of what I need, this another 10%.


#1186: DS and flow problems
DS and flow problems

(1186)

Submitted by: Robert Lim on 24-Jun-1999

I am currently in the process of putting a Strauss waltz on to NWC, but I am having trouble getting the flow directions entered as written.

After the introduction, there are a number of sections each with master repeats and special endings, and then a "DS al fine" which indicates the section is to be played through without repeats until the start of the next section.

i.e.: INTRODUCTION <segno> A A B B <Fine> CC <DS al Fine>
(A B - go to next section) - this last is a consequence of executing the <DS al Fine> command.

The problem is: after a <DS> command all master repeats are ignored unless you use a <coda> command. Also, all other <DS> commands appear to be ignored. There has been some discussion on this in the Newsgroup, and in one post Fred Nachbaur wrote
>the double bar lines I had inside the first ending for >visual purposes actually DO something!
Fred, what *does* the double bar do?

Now, am I missing something, or if not does anyone think there is the basis for a "wish" here? I was thinking thusly:

After a <DS> has been executed, the flag is reset on ecountering (say) a <section close> or maybe a <section close> followed by a <section open>. Similarly the <DS al Fine> could possibly (and with care) also be reset in this way. The <Coda> command could then be reserved for the true ending of the piece.

Help, please!

Bob

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Jun-1999

I don't know!! Repeats, special endings and flow directions are areas where I still have perennial problems. In the particular case I mentioned, the double barline inside the body of the first ending "intercepted" the flow to the second ending. I was hoping someone else could shed light on this that even a logic-challenged fellow like me can understand :-)

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 25-Jun-1999

Robert, I think your problem arises because your "fine" is not a "fine". That is, it is not the the end of the entire piece; it is just the end of a movement. NWC expects a fine to indicate the very last bar line of an entire piece.

I understand that Strauss Waltzes are meant to have a break between sections - to allow the dancers to get their breath back, change partners, allow the band to get the beers in or whatever - and should really be considered as a suite of waltzes. You usually see a pause (fermata) marked over the double bar at the end of the section to indicate the break. Of course this is inconvenient in concert situations and the entire collection of movements is played without a break. The concert band I play in find this can make for a very long (and tedious)concert item so we usually leave out most of the repeats.

I have digressed a little but this leads to a sort of solution to your problem - treat the sections as separate pieces.

You then get a different problem... how do you stick the sections together so they appear as they do in the original sheet music? Well, until Eric grants a wish allowing concatenation of NWC files for printing, I think you have to make do with cut and paste to a WP package or similar or just cut (with scissors) and paste (with paste).

HTH

Stephen Randall

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jun-1999

For printing, there's no reason you couldn't glue the sections back together. Open the first section in one window, the second section in another. Copy a staff at a time (without clefs, key and time sigs as appropriate) from the 2nd window, and Paste to the end of each staff in the 1st window. Repeat for the remaining sections. If you do a lot of this sort of thing, do up a macro to reduce the tedium.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Lim on 26-Jun-1999

Thanks for all the advice! As ever - this forum is the best.

I don't need to print as I am using my own copy of the miniature score - I just thought it would be a neat way of demonstrating repeat features in NWC, even though, as Stephen pointed out, they are very seldom played in their entirety. Next stop - the wish list.

Btw, Fred, you - "logic challenged"?? (and this is the man who fraternises with fractals .... :~}

Bob


#1187: Lyrics in MIDI file
Lyrics in MIDI file

(1187)

Submitted by: Ken Jentsch on 25-Jun-1999

Is there a way to include lyrics in the MIDI file exported by NWC? I thought I saw info on this somewhere, but can't find it. Maybe I was dreaming.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 26-Jun-1999

NWC does not currently include the lyric text in an exported MIDI file.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 28-Jun-1999

Though NWC doesn't import it, you can get the text out of a midi file. Refer to msg #943#Reply4 . There'll still be some "clean up" to do.
HTH, Marsu

Reply 3 offered by: ...is still ill on 28-Jun-1999

sorry, i've read not "export" but "import". I'd better double check when I'm still under medicines.

Mad


#1188: How to get an Empty Staff ???
How to get an Empty Staff ???

(1188)

Submitted by: Sam on 28-Jun-1999

Hi,
The 'Staff Layering' feature is an useful workaround to many limitations (like Having stem both directions...)

But... consider if I need to do this (Stem Up & Down) only at (say) 20th bar. I have to separate the Melody and Alto right from the 1st bar. Because adding bars w/o notes in it does not align with bars in the other staff (w/ notes)

Is there any way-out ?????
To get an Empty Staff w/ OR w/o bar lines...

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 28-Jun-1999

Easy.
What you need is not an empty staff, but a staff that doesn't display anything. Which is not directly possible.
But if you simply copy in your Alto part what you have in your Melody staff during (say) 20 bars, ou got what you want :-)

HTH,
      Marsu

Reply 2 offered by: Sam on 28-Jun-1999

Oops...
A neat and simple way....
thanks marsu...
-Sam

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 04-Jul-1999

I would probably solve that problem by using chords if possible. One can make tails go in opposite directions with two-note chords in many situations, which may be all you need (if I understand the problem).

A

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 07-Jul-2000

Now, the reply is simply: get 1.70 version :-)

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul on 08-Jul-2000

BTW, if empty staves are needed, they're already lying at the Scr.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Jul-2000

Scr = NoteWorthy Composer Scriptorium = http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

Reply 7 offered by: groove kid on 08-Jul-2000

kinda of similar thing...
how would I notate chord slashes?
" / "
?
4 to the bar, somtimes with crochet rests.
can I hide crochet notes in the background and sit " / " over them?

thanks!!!

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Jul-2000

> can I hide crochet notes in the background and sit " / " over them?

Yes, you certainly can. Or hidden rests, for that matter, if you want the staff for display only. An example is:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ftp/rock/frogsong.nwc

where the top staff is for the rhythm guitar. (Use Print Preview to see what it actually looks like when printed)

Reply 9 offered by: deb on 09-Jul-2000

new version, can't read it

Reply 10 offered by: Grant on 10-Jul-2000

Then upgrade. It's free and you'll be glad you did.

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Jul-2000

Version 1.70 is our latest, and is free to download for all previously registered users. You can also purchase an upgrade, if you prefer. See the http://NoteWorthyComposer.com/upgrade.htm page for details.


#1189: A thought
A thought

(1189)

Submitted by: Arjupooda on 28-Jun-1999

You know all the work-arounds that everybody has created, shouldn't they be added to the next release because they have been solved for you. And things like the drum converter, Barry or somebody wrote a program to do it... so why couldn't it go in the program as well? Also bar repeat, maybe the % sign can be used because it looks just like one of the notation for repeating last bar. Also many others. I wonder because I am wondering if it will be better to wait or to buy one of those mega notation programs. I do not want to do this because Noteworthy has the most efficient method for entering music and printing. SO all I want to know is what can we expect?

Yours truly

Reply 1 offered by: Arjupooda on 28-Jun-1999

What is the name of the thing that looks like one of these stretched out:
<

This one goes under a group of notes to tell the musician to play louder gradualy. There is also the opposite:
>

Does NWC have this one? What is it called? I have been writing this one on the music after the print. Please forgive me that I do not know.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Jun-1999

Those are called "hairpins", for lack of a better word. There is a pair of them in the Boxmarks font, but they're on the small side. I use them for short, fast fades or swells, (together with volume mpc's for the sound) and use cresc. / decresc. for the longer ones.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 29-Jun-1999

about < and > : if you use a postscript printer, you may refer to msg #188 , but I fear this doesn't work on all PS printers. At least I can't make it work with the HPLJ4+PS I have at work. No time to investigate rite now...

About including external solutions into NWC: sure it'd be wonderful :-) but it's a lot of work, even if you have the source code for it. Reusability of program is possible only with "common interfaces"... Especially when you want to keep mastering every single line of code (which is my own technique, not the better for sure on some projects).

About Boxmarks font, I'll probably have some time during end of summer to add some chars in it (or in another font). Maybe the version of NWC for the 3rd mill. will include more than we expect :-) There is still 550 days before it after all ;-)

NWCly yours

Reply 4 offered by: Peter on 29-Jun-1999

Workarounds are really the creative ways that users of NWC (or any other program for that matter) have found to do things that were not designed into the program. They range from the pretty simple, such as adding notes or rests to both staves when using layering to get the alignment just right, to the very complex, like Marsu's hairpin solution for PostScript printers. Some are even encouraged by the program's author, like the ability to incorporate user fonts in a piece.

You really must decide what you want to do with the program. If you really need to produce typeset quality output for virtually any situation that could arise, then NWC may not be the best solution for you. Likewise, if you want to produce production ready MIDI output for everything from Bach to Shoenberg to Jethro Tull, NWC probably won't get you there. These uses need the right tools for the job (read Finale, Cubasis, Cakewalk, and $$$£££¥¥¥)

For me and many others, NWC is an excellent fit. It fits my budget, it runs flawlessly on almost any computer you ask it to (right Fred and Richard?), and it has an easy learning curve. It does 80% - 90% of what I want to do, and another 5% with various workarounds. Part of the fun of NWC is finding a way to accomplish that 5%. Take away the fun of creativity in workarounds, and making music with NWC will become a lot like writing with Word/WordPerfect -- technically excellent but really boring. We all have our wish list items that would make NWC "perfect" in our eyes. Unfortunately, if all of these were implemented, we would have a combination of Finale and Cakewalk, with a price tag of the two combined.

My bottom line: Give us an upgrade every 6 - 12 months implementing the top couple of wishes and I'll be thrilled!! (especially if haripins are included <REALLY BIG GRIN>)

--Peter

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 29-Jun-1999

We don't need "a combination of Finale and Cakewalk". A few well-chosen features can make a big difference, which we tend to get each release.

The one big thing preventing me from getting the printed scores to look the way I want is (you guessed it) HAIRPIN CRESCENDO symbols. Everything else is infrequently needed (glissando, etc), or can be worked around.

Reply 6 offered by: Richard on 29-Jun-1999

I wonder why on Earth you should pick on Fred & me ?
Strange !!!

Seriously though, I 100% agree with your sentiments.

I am recently feeling rather pleased with myself for adapting Warren Porter's way of getting n-tuplets into Noteworthy. Having adaped this I have also managed to get a three four bar at the same time as a four four bar and OK it doesn't look good but if I want to print - I get as close as I can to a realistic copy and then touch up with a DTP package.

I can't imagine ever being able to afford the wizz bang software packages unless I win the lottery and even then, I can't imagine any package being more user friendly than NoteWorthy. On top of which there are a great bunch of people to help with any music topic you could imagine, both users and NoteWorthy artware. I am quite happy with all that NoteWorthy gives me and look forward to version 2 which I think is probably on the horizon now.

BTW I am hanging on to my troglodite systems but the time is rapidly approaching when I will have to etc etc ...

Rich.

Reply 7 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 30-Jun-1999

I was recently asked by a friend to evaluate Sibelius for his school, and they gave me a copy for a month. While you can do a lot more with it than with NWC: hairpins, Ossia staves, guitar chords, more text items, swing, etc. Yet even if someone gave me the program for free, I would still use NWC for almost all my music and only do the few pieces that really needs a special feature with another program.

The ease of use of NWC really hit home yesterday when my 9 yr old daugther entered a simple song all by herself from only watching me use the program.

My biggest wish list item is hairpins and transposable guitar chords (Text and/or frames).

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Edwards on 30-Jun-1999

yes, hairpins are a must. I also think that sloping slurs, and slurs/ties above/below notes are also needed to produce professional looking music

Secondary (but still important IMHO) are page breaks and staff suppression/multiple rests, and I still have a niggle about note head alignment on simultaneous chords.

Peter

Reply 9 offered by: Blair Dowden on 04-Jul-1999

I would suggest that the user control sloping slurs by setting vertical offsets for the start and end points. Having the program do it is a very difficult task, because it is so subjective.

Reply 10 offered by: Daizzo on 06-Jul-1999

I think it'd be a cinch to add hairpins to Noteworthy as they'd be implemented exactly the same as doing slurs and ties...

Reply 11 offered by: Steve Bacher on 14-Jul-1999

Like slurs, yes. Like ties, no. Slurs are associated
with two points on the score; ties are associated with
a solitary note (or chord).

Now here's a question: how would NWC handle a hairpin
without dynamic markings on both sides? Would it always
just "gradualize" the progression from the current dynamic
on the left to the current dynamic on the right? (Which
means that crescendo and decrescendo hairpins would actually
functional identically.) In scores you often see, for example, a crescendo hairpin in a "p" environment followed by
an explicit "p". Doesn't that mean a crescendo followed by a
sudden piano? "p" to "p" wouldn't do very much. :-)

- seb

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-Jul-1999

A hairpin, I assume, would just be a graphic without any midi attributes.
It would be a sign for the performer not the software.
Similar to the status of marks such as Sforzando in the current set of Dynamic Variance.

Reply 13 offered by: David W. Wolfe on 18-Jul-1999

The "hairpins" that a lot of you are mentioning would be a nice addition to NWC. As I don't know any of your backgrounds in music, I don't mean to insult anyone's intellect. A piano followed by a "hairpin" crescendo followed by a piano that you see in scores means you build the volume for the length of the hairpin then drop back down to piano suddenly. There is no implication as to how loud you get, but most musicians increase by 2 or 3 levels. For example, from piano to mezzoforte.

I would also like to see the repeating measure symbol (%) implemented. I have found a work around, I have a music symbols font. I define it as a user font and place text right on the staff in an empty measure. However, NWC only counts measures that have a note or rest, so my measure numbers get screwed.

Multi-measure rests would also be nice, as would short-cuts. These are notes that have hash marks across the stem in the staff. A single hash mark means to divide the note into 8ths, 2 hashes for 16ths, 3 for 32nds.

I'm probably wishing too much, too.

Reply 14 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Jul-1999

I would hope a hairpin crescendo would have a dynamic setting on the right side, just for convenience. Maybe even the left side too.


#1190: Staff layering and note stems
Staff layering and note stems

(1190)

Submitted by: Anna on 01-Jul-1999

I've been trying to transcribe our choir pieces to Noteworthy and found the staff layering feature very very handy. However, to save space, I'd like to print the file in the layered mode(e.g., Sop/Alto, Tenor/Bass). Question is, is there a way for me to fix the look of the stems for the eighth, sixteenth, etc. notes? I've notated the notes in such a way that they have the same stem directions. So when the staff are layered, the eighth notes looked like sixteenth notes... (this do not happen when I enter the notes in 1 staff as vertical chords!)... Help please...

Reply 1 offered by: Richard on 01-Jul-1999

Anna,

The only way that I have found to overcome this is to make a chord of the notes each time it happens.

So , If you have an eighth note in the Sops ( say a C) and an eighth note in the Altos (say an E), you will need to go to both of those staves and put a chord of a C and an E in both parts. This then looks right when layered.

It is just to be hoped that the whole piece is not entirely eighths and sixteenths. If it is I would suggest that layering is not the way to go in this instance.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Anna on 01-Jul-1999

Thanks. That's a good work-around. But doesn't give me another problem? After printing, I have to undo all the chords if I want to listen to the individual voices...

Reply 3 offered by: NWC-Support on 01-Jul-1999

Why are you notating both parts with the same stem direction? If you use the chord feature, the stem directions would be forced into opposing directions, and you should do the same in the leyering feature. You can move a notehead to the right in one part using the Edit Selection feature.

Reply 4 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 01-Jul-1999

Here's another idea. I don't know how hidden staves work yet, but I'm sure I'll find out soon.

I suggest you add extra staves just for layering purposes. They would off course have to be muted. Use quarter notes for the bottom of the two notes that are to be laid atop one another. That way the flag(s) remain up on the top stem, and no extra flags from the bottom. You would then probably want to "hide" the two staves "with" the flags so that they can be played.

If this is clear as mud to you, send me a file you want changed, and I'll send it back to you with the changes I just tried to explain.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 01-Jul-1999

I was answering few hours go when Lose95.2% crashed (and it suddenly turned to Lose100% :-( ).
So here is my contribution (parts of it are in replies 3 & 4) again:

You should use stem up for S+T parts, and down for A+B parts.
To put stem up on a whole staff, go to that staff, type in Home, Shift+End, Shift+UpArrow.
do the same with Shift+DownArrow for stem down.

You may have to increase room for lyrics for A+B parts.

If there are too much special cases (chords you have to add, exceptions in stem directions...), you may also want to create 4 additional staves as Ken suggests. Hence you will be able to print on any format you want: 2+2 or 1+1+1+1 staves. Moreover, you can in that case put lyrics on top of staff on S+T parts when using layering.
Look at http://musique.fr.fortunecity.com/zouc/0/nwc/jenesuis.nwc to see how I do this.
It's only an example, I didn't spend too much time on the 2+2 version, just enough to make it readable along with the 1+1+1+1 version.

HTH,
Marsu

Reply 6 offered by: Anna on 05-Jul-1999

Thanks for your replies. I'd just like to comment on some of them...
Reply #3: NWC-Support
Reasons why I use the same stem direction: 1. Because that is how it looked like in the original piece? 2. Using the chord feature, the stem directions would be forced into opposing directions only for different note durations, otherwise I can use the same stem direction
Reply #4: Ken
I'll try your suggestion. Does this mean I have to disable the "increase note spacing for larger note durations" option in the page setup? My prayer is that the quarter note will align with my eighth note...
Reply #4: Marsu
I've already used that type of notation. But I was also thinking of separating the Sop 1 and Sop 2, etc.

Reply 7 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 05-Jul-1999

You're right. The quarter notes WON'T line up with the eighth notes. I'd forgotten about the beats not lining up. Well, then maybe a separate staff for each of the voices so you can listen to them individually, and extra staves for what you want to print. (I guess I should have tested my "theory" before advising) At least you can copy and paste one "playable" staff to each "printable" staff. After that, you can "Insert Chord Member" using Ctrl+Enter. Just mute the two staffs for printing use only. I hope THAT works. :( So sorry. I tried. :)


#1191: Help...Copyrigth...
Help...Copyrigth...

(1191)

Submitted by: Jubal Baca on 02-Jul-1999

Hello NWC users:

The copyrigth it is reserved by the author of one musical
score. NWC to allow this.

Any NWC users can change the copyrigth...Is this truth ?

There is some way to detain that ?

thanks... chau...chau...

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 02-Jul-1999

As far as I know (AFAIK), the copyright information is as well alterable as the rest of an NWC file, i.e.:
any registered user can change any NWC file
any non-reg'ed user cannot change anything definitively in any NWC reg'ed file, i.e. (s)he cannot save it: i.e. (s)he can make changes, print, and quit (losing changes).
But a non-reg'ed user can save (up to 10 times per file) changes in a non-reg'ed NWC file.

So there is no *secuirty* about copyright in NWC file. Not more, after all, than on any printed score if printed on normal paper (some expensive paper protect themselves against photocopy). Not more either than Audio-CDs since anyone that owns a CDRecorder can duplicate them, breaking the law.

Note finally that NWPlayer allow the final user to (dis)play your score (+information, copyright) without allowing to make changes. But no *read only* version of an NWC file exist --yet ?

Hope this clarifies,
Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: Daizzo on 06-Jul-1999

That's a great idea, sort of like the document protect thing in Word

Reply 3 offered by: W.E. Gardner II on 31-Jul-1999

I saw in one of the earlier replies about special paper containing a watermark. Anyone who has an Epson Stylus Color 740 (and I'm assuming any newer model (probably the Stylus Color Photo 700 and the Stylus Color 900) can do a watermark when you print. You can select from theirs or you can create your own using paintbrush (it has to be a Windows Bitmap (.bmp) in order to do it). Very handy if you want to keep from photocopying


#1192: New User with no instructions
New User with no instructions

(1192)

Submitted by: Amy Dykes on 03-Jul-1999

How do i start? My help folder tells me nothing, and there are no instructions. I need to write in s piece of music to confirm my counts, but i can't seem to get started. Please help me.
thanks
Amy

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 03-Jul-1999

During your evaluation, you have access to all of the help file information, as well as the materials at our web site. Once you order, the tutorial in the User's Guide is the best place to start.

Reply 2 offered by: Amy Dykes on 03-Jul-1999

ok, thanks

Reply 3 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 04-Jul-1999

NWC has context sensitive help. For instance, click on Insert in the top menu, then highlight (don't click on) Key Signature. Then hit F1 and the help for that function will appear on screen.
Do this for a couple hours and you'll be familiar with a lot of the functions.
Gordon


#1193: Stem Length for Beamed Notes
Stem Length for Beamed Notes

(1193)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 04-Jul-1999

When I compare an NWC score with other printed music, it seems that the stem lengths for beamed notes are longer. Try this example: 8th note at 2nd F above middle C, 16 notes at first F and G above middle C. Beam them.

My guess is the rule is that the shortest stem should have the length of an un-beamed note. In this example, I think the top of the beam should be where the second beam line is. Maybe the software assumed the entire note collection was 16th notes when calculating the stem lengths.

Does this make sense, or am I out to lunch? I think the scores would look a little nicer if the stem lengths were a bit shorter.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 05-Jul-1999

IMHO you are right. The actual note lengths are not really relevant, since you get the same effect even if all the note are semiquavers.

I looked at some Associate Board (ABRSM) exam music - they do take care to publish accurately - and they print beamed quavers (on a 19pt clef) with stems of 6mm (including the note-head. Beamed semiquavers are about the same length (possibly very slightly longer), so the 1/16th beam goes inside the 1/8th beam so to speak. I think that even 1/32nd notes have similar length stems although it was difficult to find a decent example.

Icouldn't find any example where they shortened stems off-clef to get them to fit in though.

On a page publishing note they not only extend and justify the last system, but also increase the staff spacing (ie the spacing between one instance of the group of staves and the next)to fill the page.

Two more for the wish list.

peter

Reply 2 offered by: Claude Tamplenizza on 06-Jul-1999

I agree about stem lengths but since we're talking wish lists, how about these ones, found in Massenet's 'Manon': - tied notes including a rest INSIDE the ties.
- 1/2 notes with double or triple bars on the stems.

Reply 3 offered by: Damien Hall on 06-Jul-1999

"1/2 notes with double or triple bars on the stems."

Wouldn't that be a tremolo marking?

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Jul-1999

It could be, but that is normally shown as short (ie disconnected) beams between the stems of two notes. On a single note it just means repetition of that note, the speed depending on the number of beams.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant Hicks on 06-Jul-1999

I think Damien's half right. The usual convention is to read two beams crossing a half-note stem (or over a whole note) as meaning even 16th notes, but to treat triple beams as indicating an unmeasured (as-fast-as-possible) tremolo. This would mean you're out of luck if you want to use triple beams as shorthand for even 32nd notes. I think you'd write out the first few notes (say, the entire first beat or even first half of the measure) in actual 32nds, and then use the 3-beam shorthand for the rest of the measure, perhaps with a "simile" marking to make things perfectly clear.

What's "normally shown as short (i.e., disconnected) beams between the stems" is a different type of tremolo entirely - the rapid alternation of two *different* notes, essentially a trill but usually wider than a second. This is called a "fingered tremolo" when written for strings, in contrast to the rapid repetition of a single note, which is a "bowed tremolo".

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Bacher on 14-Jul-1999

You can do tied notes with a rest inside the ties by
inputting the two notes to be tied, tying them, and then
inserting a rest in between. In fact, you can insert
just about anything in between two tied notes, as long as
you tie them (with nothing inside) first (and as long as
the "anything" doesn't include another instance of the
note being tied).

Just curious: what is the musical interpretation of the
tie across a rest?

- seb

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Jul-1999

A tie through a rest would be meaningless, since a tie means that the two notes are effectively combined into a single note.

A slur through a rest might be meaningful, e.g. in string music you might want the player to play the notes on a single bow, with a rest inbetween. This would be similar to a bowed staccato (Mozart uses this alot.)

Reply 8 offered by: Richard on 15-Jul-1999

Fred,

Surely a tie through a rest would be OK if you had two voices on one stave (Tenor and Bass for example) or a chord with notes of varying length?

Rich

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Jul-1999

Good point. True enough, with multiple voices on one staff, _anything_ can (and does) happen!


#1194: no playback when iconized or playback
no playback when iconized or playback

(1194)

Submitted by: yonatan lehman on 08-Jul-1999

Whe I Iconize NWC or if it isnt the current window
then "playback" stops. This is a nuisance for example
if I try to adjust the volume using a different program,
NWC stops the playback.

Thanks
Yonatan

P.S.
(hint hint why I can't I adjust volume, stereo, voicing, balance interactivly - the various midi sequencers come
now where near to NWC as far as data entry and printing is concerned - but NWC has a long way to go on the interactive
(real time) controls -it real needs a "mixer" view, or even
better - sliders with choosable function (to save space)
for each staff (say on one side of the window)

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 08-Jul-1999

I think your problem is almost certainly due to your MIDI settings. In NWC, go to <Tools>(on the menu bar)<Options><Midi>, then set the <Port Usage> to 'Always'. Then NWC should play all the time, even when minimised or not the active window. HTH, Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 08-Jul-1999

See also: msg #466, msg #830


#1195: Jazz chords
Jazz chords

(1195)

Submitted by: Lightz on 08-Jul-1999

How can I type (using the "insert text" tool) chords for jazz tunes? more specifically, chords which have the sharp or flat symbols in their names?

Basically what I need is either a font containing these 2 symbols.. I need the ascii code for them.

I'm just about sure that there isn't one here who uses this to write jazz and even cares about my question, but still..

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Jul-1999

There has been considerable discussion of this both here and in the newsgroup. There are some musical fonts available at the Scriptorium (e.g. "Bach") at
http://www.noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com

which might do the job for you. That being said, if you plan on publishing your NWC files as on a website, it would be wiser to avoid exotic fonts, (sticking only with the "de facto standard" font "Boxmarks"). This leaves basically two options:

1: Use lower-case "b" for the flat symbol, and shift 3 for sharps.

2: Mix a standard font (e.g. TNR or Arial) with the native NWCV15.TTF font for the sharps and flats. (The ASCII equivalent for sharps is lower-case d, for flats it's lower-case f). Warning: this approach can be frustrating to get the proper spacings.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Jul-1999

Yes - There are some of us that use chord symbols in our scores.
I use Fred's method.
Use the lower case B for flats and the Hash on Shift/3 for sharps.
If you need the Dim symbols hold down Alt and type 0176.(°)
For Half-Dimished (m7b5) use Alt and type 0216.(Ø)

Reply 3 offered by: Greg Kuhnert on 31-Jul-1999

Chords ..... This is personally the only thing lacking from this product ..... I had a bit of a play at putting chords above a stave with the lyrics function - and using underscores for beats without a chord. This is personally a BETTER method than using text - But the problem is a piece of music with only melody, lyrics, and chords - NWC does not allow a "melody part" to include parts both above and below the stave (at least not that I can find).

Conclusion: I have not purchased this product - but may consider doing so if there was a dedicated "chord" version of a lyric track - Also required, would be transposition of chord symbols. The behaviour of the chord track would need to allow rhythm to be entered for the chords (and not printed). Eg: chords over a bar of melodic rests - with text or lyrics it only allows one chord per bar (doh!)

Theres my two cents worth anyway.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Aug-1999

Put this on the wish list.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 02-Aug-1999

To put lyrics (or chords, in your case) both above and under a staff, duplicate the staff and superimpose them. Set lyrics above for one, and under for the other.

About transposing chords:
if NWC could transpose C#m, could it also transpose Do#min? The same chord, but its name in another language... (guess which :)

I've found a way to do it with macro recorder, but it ain't really quick. Algorithm is:
go (yourself) to each teXt item,
(now macro:) copy the text,
switch to a text file containing lines of pair of chords: normal + transposed (one text file per transposition),
search for text (call search in notepad, paste text, enter),
get right part of line (transposed chord),
copy it,
get back to NWC,
replace text.

It does work, but still a bit tedious since you have to go to each text item.
Using the "lyrics way" as Greg K. does it, could improve usability of this trick :-)

HTH,
Marsu

Reply 6 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Aug-1999

The big advantage of using the Lyric Editor for chords is that the beams dont become broken as they do if you insert text.
However the tedium of adding _ underscores to avoid notes makes this method a bit hard to live with.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 03-Aug-1999

THe "_Space_Space" sequences are, imho, only tedious when we do not know where we are.
Personally I insert a break line to each lyric "line", and a double one between verses (or musical phrases, it depends).
This helps not to get lost, but is often insufficient.
What would be *very* helpful is to get at the place (in the lyrics) matching the place where is cursor in the staff is. Let's go to http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm ...

Reply 8 offered by: John Kavanagh on 12-Aug-1999

One problem that I had doing this was that all the symbols I wanted weren't easily available. You can use b # m and numbers from the regular keyboard, and o for diminished chords, but to get the half-diminished sign (theta ø), you have to hit alt+0248, and the delta sign is only available in Symbol or Math fonts. I used Bach, as Fred Nachbaur suggests, but I was happier when I created my own font.
All the symbols I need for chords are available as capital letters: A-G are in their normal positions, and I use H for the half-diminished sign, J for delta, S for sharp, and so on. It's quick now that I'm used to it.

I also have the symbols for making chord fake sheets in a word processing program.

I made the font using the free demo of an earlier version of Fontmaker, available from http://www.high-logic.com

I would be happy to send you my font as a .ttf file if you like. The downside is that it may replace the font Lydian if that's installed on your computer, and of course if you share files with people who don't have that font installed the symbols will show up as garbage.

The number of symbols we actually need is small enough that
thay could be incorporated into a modified Boxmarks font,
which still has a lot of empty characters.

John Kavanagh

Reply 9 offered by: Greg Kuhnert on 14-Aug-1999

I have thought about the chord dilema a little more - I have a solution (for my own purposes). Is it possible to have a staff that one can layer, but not have the notes print - Eg. Include the rhythm of where the chords appear, and have the lyrics above the notes containing chord info. Then superimpose this rhythm part with melody. The effect is having lyrics below melody line, and chords above matching above in the correct rhythmic locations.

One more feature request; the ability to "hide" individual notes/rests from printing - especially useful when doing layering.

And another request; fonts included with NoteWorthy for all the symbols people seem to want - dim etc. If it were standard as part of the package, there would be no hassles with file portability. Lastly, also included in this font - guitar chord fingering symbols would be great <grin>. Thats a little harder - but would be nice.

I dont own noteworthy yet - but with the above features, I'd buy in a flash.

Greg

Reply 10 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 11 offered by: Andrés on 28-Jul-2000

Hello! I only want to say that I have some good ideas for people who love jazz.I am thinkin about share our chords and riffs and some standars to learn more.Mail me!
.

Reply 12 offered by: Kalisten on 31-Jul-2000

"boxmarks - the de facto stand" ?
Do you guys really believe in that?
Why don't NWC put it in then?
This is really freaky, is NWC 25% company supported and 75% user supported?

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jul-2000

> "boxmarks - the de facto stand" ?

As the first font specifically designed specifically for NoteWorthy, and the one that's still in the broadest usage, I'd say this is an accurate description. This may change, however, once NoteRow is in public release.

> Do you guys really believe in that?

Which guys would you be referring to?

> Why don't NWC put it in then?'

Presumably because different users have different requirements. NoteWorthy supplies six user-fonts slots that can be used to incorporate as many (or as few) custom fonts as you wish.

> This is really freaky, is NWC 25% company supported and 75% user supported?

Not sure about your percentages, but yes: NWC users (most of them) believe in the product, find it extremely useful, flexible, stable, cost-effective, and versatile. If you'd prefer software on the other end of the spectrum, buy something from Microsoft. Oh, wait a minute... you already did. So sorry...


#1196: Search and replace
Search and replace

(1196)

Submitted by: Robert Lim on 10-Jul-1999

I can't find an earlier reference to this so here goes.

Most text editors include this function as a matter of course. Does anyone out there think that a form of search and replace, possibly limited in scope, would be a useful addition to NWC?

Some instances that spring to mind:

Search for all minim (half-note) rests and replace with two crotchet (quarter note) rests (a common convention in 3/4 time).

All those "enharmonic key spelling" problems that get aired from time to time.

I'm sure there are more.

Bob

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jul-1999

Yes, I've wished for a search-and-replace facility on several occasions, especially for the enharmonics situation. Interestingly, while such a facility is common in most other apps, I haven't seen it in music scoring or sequencing programs (at least not in the ones I own). Such a function would therefore be a real coup for NoteWorthy Artware if it were implemented.

Meanwhile, there's at least a partial workaround. Maybe most people are aware of this, but I wasn't until recently. CNTL V (Paste) can be used to overwrite an existing selection; you don't have to first delete the selection to be replaced. Simply CNTL-C (copy) the desired selection to the clipboard, then highlight (select) the section to replace, then CNTL-V.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Jul-1999

Music Works - an Aussie sequencer will do the enharmonic changes.
But (whisper) - the editor is bloody slow in transposition and has several other frustrating features.
Cakewalk has a very useful event editor.
I'd like to see something similar in NWC also.

Reply 3 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 13-Jul-1999

I seem to recall that Sibeluis features quite a sophisticated search and replace facility.

Reply 4 offered by: Diazzo on 13-Jul-1999

Man, I've found a few different times when I could use a search replace. I had to do it manually and can't exactly recall when it could have been SO useful!

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 26-Jul-1999

Yes, a S&R function could be helpful.
But I see it in two distinct states:
one for text items, i.e. locate where the teXt item containing "A5+" has been placed
one for musical items, in which we could enter part of score (or paste it from somewhere) to locate where it may be in a full score. This would be helpful when you decide to change the them of a fugue for instance :-)
I think this is not too easy to implement, especially 2nd !!

NWCLy yours,
MAD


#1197: Chord or accompaniment
Chord or accompaniment

(1197)

Submitted by: Antoine on 14-Jul-1999

I recently download NCW as an evaluation and it works great. I'M not a composer neither a pro in music. For now, I'd like to know how I can add chord or accompaniment over the staves, i.e. B, Dm, Fm7 and so on.

Thanks. Antoine

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Jul-1999

Press the X key (or Insert ==> Text) and you can put text expressions (including chord names) just about anywhere you want.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Jul-1999

Please ask your questions in one place only.

See the JINGLE.NWC sample for a demonstration of a text based solution to your question.

Reply 3 offered by: Antoine on 16-Jul-1999

Hi there
For those who are trying to answer my question concerning the MIDI connection from computer to Technics I resolve the problem. All I had to do was preset the keyboard in GM (General Midi).
Thanks to all.
This forum is... fantastic and NWC is very easy to use. I love it.

Thanks


#1198: keyboard vs NWC
keyboard vs NWC

(1198)

Submitted by: Antoine on 15-Jul-1999

I own a KN930 Technics keyboard and I would like to connect it to my computer. I bought MIDI adaptor that is pluged in joystick port and when I open the keyborad, the screen doesn't display anything.

Is there anyone who can help me... Thanks

Antoine

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Jul-1999

All the help you need should be right there in the NWC help system. Look up "FAQ: Recording a Live Midi Performance" and "Midi Input Active."


#1199: Changing key in the middle.
Changing key in the middle.

(1199)

Submitted by: Michael King on 16-Jul-1999

Greetings O helpful Noters! (is that a good word!?)

My problem is thus: I am in the midst of transcribing a Christmas carol out of this book I got today. In the middle of it, okay, not quite the middle :) it wants me to go from D major to Eflat major. The book shows a double line followed by the new key. When I try this I get both keys! Argh! Help me please? I tried editing it, I tried deleting the two sharp signs and it don't work. Any suggestions would be greatfully appreciated.

BTW, Noteworthy is a great program.

Sincerely,
Michael King

Reply 1 offered by: Michael King on 16-Jul-1999

It would appear that the writer of the above msg. is a bit of a twit, who can't tell a sharp sign from a natural one!
Having witten the aforementiond message I can get away with saying nasty things like that! <Big grin> I went back to NoteWorthy and tried it again. There it was two sharp thingies and three flat thingies. For some reason I hit the home button and looked at two sharp thingies. (I'm hung up on 'thingies' today) Then I hit end and looked at two natural and three flat symbols. Well, duh! It appears that NoteWorthy is smarter than me! How embarrassing! Can't tell a natural from a sharp. Oh well, back to transcribing.

Abashedly yours;
Michael

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 17-Jul-1999

I've noticed that, on key changes, for some reason NW will change the old sharps/flats to naturals and then add the sharps/flats for the new sig. Looks kind of cluttered, but it works.
I've transcribed songs with 3/4 key changes...I love what that can do to a song.
Regards,
Gordon

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jul-1999

This has traditionally been the correct way to indicate key changes; the first key is "undone" by the naturals, and the new key sig accidentals added. Look at any classical score, this is the way it's done. That being said, modern typesetters often ignore this.

Reply 4 offered by: Michael King on 17-Jul-1999

Gordon, Thanks.

Fred, I did not know that! Lazy typesetters!

Thank to you all.

Reply 5 offered by: Joy Byford on 19-Jul-1999

Along similar lines, has anyone else experienced the problem of key changes not being very obvious when they happen to coincide with a new line of the score? As far as I understand it, the convention in music publishing in this case is to 'warn' of the forthcoming keychange at the end of the previous line. Noteworthy does not do this automatically, and doing it manually means inserting the keychange in the 'wrong' place (so that if the page format was changed so that this would no longer be the point of line break it would look very strange). Anyone else relate to this; is it worth adding to the wish list?

Reply 6 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 19-Jul-1999

Joy, I have seen this in some of the music I transcribe, but since I never print the music I transcribe, it's no problem for me.
I just transcribe music then play it back for my own pleasure. This gives me a change to hear once again the folk and gospel songs of my youth. Very enjoyable!
Gordon

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Jul-1999

Same goes for clef changes (quite common in classical scores). I've worked around this by saving the "courtesy clefs" at the end of a line for last, with the idea being that once everything is done it's unlikely that I'd want to change the page layout. There _have_ been exceptions, though... with funny-looking results.

Reply 8 offered by: Steve Bacher on 10-Aug-1999

I've noticed the key change at end of line bug as well.

Clef changes aren't as big a problem, since I adopt the convention of putting the changed clef as the last thing in
the prior measure, rather than starting the measure off with the new clef.

- seb


#1201: Two notes but play only one
Two notes but play only one

(1201)

Submitted by: Roberto Pontes on 18-Jul-1999

I don`t speak english very well, but I`ll try to explain my problem. How do I put two same notes (one after other) and make only the first one be played. In sheet it appears with a legato (I don`t know if it`s the right word to say).

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Jul-1999

There are two different things -- a "slur" (also sometimes called a legato), which simply makes the notes smoother. The other is a "tie" which connects two notes of the same pitch into a single longer note. Select the first of the two same notes, and press /

Reply 2 offered by: Drake Donahue on 18-Jul-1999

Most likely you want "Tie/", keyboard shortcut "/"


#1202: Publishing
Publishing

(1202)

Submitted by: Cathy Gill on 19-Jul-1999

Does anyone have any info on getting songs published (as in,
with a record company)? Someone I know uses NWC and wants to
go big time.

Reply 1 offered by: Joel Cress on 07-Sep-1999

Musician's Friend ( http://www.musiciansfriend.com ) has been posting some great articles by Taxi, a publisher/independent-musician go-between service, both on publishing and home recording. They might answer some of your questions.

I have also read that simply registering your works with the U.S. Copyright Office is the first step to getting your works recognized. Publishers apparently do periodic reviews of recent submissions for useful works to their targeted genre. It certainly is worth the try!


#1203: Do I give up now?
Do I give up now?

(1203)

Submitted by: Michael King on 20-Jul-1999

Okay, I searched and searched. I practically read the entire off-line forum. I still can't figure it out! And, I know it can be done, but how??

What? Oh, I suppose I should tell you my problem. <hehe> This here piece of music has a tie that crosses several bars. There are intervening measures that have a note on the same line/space. I want to ignore those notes and only tie the two notes that are supposed to be tied. How do I get NWC to ignore the notes in between?? help?

Thanking you in advance -
Michael

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jul-1999

What you have is a slur, not a tie. A tie can't possibly go past another note of the same pitch. Enter slurs by selecting all but the last note of the group you want slurred, then press ; (semicolon key).

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 20-Jul-1999

You must be thinking of a slur (keyboard ;) rather than a tie (kbd /). What you describe makes no musical sense since a tie implies that the note is continuous throughout its duration over the written notes and therefore there must be a note filling the bar in each bar over which the tie continues.

That said, it does make sense that there should be an extra note at the same pitch in an intervening bar if the note is to be restruck while being sustained, but only a few instruments can do that :<)

Reply 3 offered by: Michael King on 20-Jul-1999

Oh, well, it appears that yours truly has done it again! Once again I leapt without looking for the soft landing. THUD! If I had merely read the difference between a tie and a slur, I wouldn't have wounded my ego again. SIGH Thank you folks very much for setting me on the 'write' path.

Slighty bleeding,

Michael


#1205: How do I get a "pause" ?
How do I get a "pause" ?

(1205)

Submitted by: Samuel Charles Devaraj on 22-Jul-1999

Can any of you tell me how do I get a "pause" in NWC (the half-circle with a dot ?

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Oakes on 22-Jul-1999

It is called a "fermata", and is under the
Insert / Tempo variance menu item.

Reply 2 offered by: Samuel Charles Devaraj on 22-Jul-1999

Hi Stephen,
Thank you verymuch for the prompt reply....
I got it....
- Sam

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 27-Jul-1999

Funny, in French the "pause" term is used for whole rest...
the "pause" you mention is called "point d'orgue", i.e. organ point (since only organs can keep the sound running for hours --except some instruments with a special technique called "infinite breathing" as recorder/flute for instance)
And not to mention bowed instruments when player is good enough not to let hear the direction change of the bow ;)

Reply 4 offered by: Carlo Zerri on 12-Oct-1999

In italian language, that sign is called "Corona", that means crown.

Reply 5 offered by: Leo on 14-Oct-1999

I'm used to hearing it called the fermata, but I have also heard people call it a "bird's eye." Referencing to Marsu's post that said "(since only organs can keep the sound running for hours --except some instruments with a special technique called "infinite breathing" as recorder/flute for instance)," I believe the technique is called "circular breathing," (at least that is what I have always heard it called) and it is not dependent on the instrument, but rather the instrumentalist. It's a very difficult technique to learn, I can only do it for a short period of time (I play clarinet), but I have heard/seen it done on trumpet, clarinet, and many other instruments.

Reply 6 offered by: John Gillings on 15-Oct-1999

Regarding cyclic breathing, I heard from a reliable source that Kenny G has set an official world record by sustaining a single note on a saxophone for 45 minutes.
That may be the "official" (Guinness?) record, but I'd bet there are some Didgeridoo players for whom 45 minutes would be a light warmup!


#1206: Spacing between bar and the first note
Spacing between bar and the first note

(1206)

Submitted by: Samuel Charles Devaraj on 22-Jul-1999

Ideally, the spacing between the adjacent notes and the enclosing bar lines is expected to be equal. But in NWC the spacing between the starting bar line and the first note is always more compared to the spacing between first and second note (also to that of second note and ending bar line).

Is there anything wrong with my settings ?

Or is it supposed to be that way ???

Thanks in advance
- Sam

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Jul-1999

There are no settings that affect that kind of layout. You can increase spacing (if you really want to) by using Insert Text to add preserved width spaces, but you cannot reduce spacing.


#1207: midi files to wav files
midi files to wav files

(1207)

Submitted by: Roland LANIEL on 24-Jul-1999

Can anyone please tell me how to record my NWC files (or MIDI files) on to a CDR ? As far as I know NWC files (or midi files) must first be converted into .WAV files and this I can't do. Any suggestion as to an available programme of conversion.
Thank you in advance.

Quelqu'un peut-il me dire comment enregistrer sur CDR les fichiers NWC (en passant par un fichier midi si nécessaire.)
D'après ce que je crois il faut convertir en .WAV et ça , je sais pas faire. Merci d'avance.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 24-Jul-1999

There have been a number of threads dealing with this. Try msg #1003 and msg #928 for starters. HTH, Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Jul-1999

The simplest way is to download a shareware copy of Cool Edit from shareware.com or some other shareware server.

You can play and record your midi file as a .wav using this software.
The result may not be as good as CD quality but it's not bad.
Your sound card must be full-duplex being able to play and record at the same time.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 27-Jul-1999

Roland,
Les deux références ci-dessus sont en effet très utiles.
Le principe est simple : convertir le fichier NWC (ou MID) en WAV nécessite de le faire jouer. Autrement dit, si tu as une heure de .nwc, cela te prendra une heure.
Ensuite il faudra transférer tes fichiers wav en pistes audio, et cela n'importe quel logiciel livré avec graveur
est censément capable de le faire...
Il est plus "fiable" de faire cela en deux passes (NWC/MID => wav et wav => audio), car cela évite de "planter" des gravures... (ou gravage, puisque d'aucuns ont décidé de barbariser).
Dernière chose: le .nwc est parfois meilleur que le .mid généré avec: en effet, les points d'orgues et respirations ne sont pas exportés en midi.

A+ et bon courage
                                    web.master@mail.dotcom.fr

Reply 4 offered by: Roland Laniel on 27-Jul-1999

Merci webmaster. C'est ce que j'ai eu de mieux. On m'a branché sur cooledit et Audio composer qui ne marchent pas jusqu'au bout.
Mon graveur est Philipps et je n'ai pas de doc sur le transfert de fichiers audio sur CD. Mon vendeur ne comprends rien aux fichiers audio. Je suis donc dans le caca.Puis-je garder cette adresse et, éventuellement, te relancer quand j'aurai un peu progressé avec Philipps ?
Merci en tout cas.

Reply 5 offered by: DorkPixie on 10-Aug-1999

Or you could try Wingroove, it allows you to make wave files from midi's

Reply 6 offered by: Roland Laniel on 11-Aug-1999

Thank you Dork. My problem is practically solved.


#1208: recording NWC files onto CD
recording NWC files onto CD

(1208)

Submitted by: roland LANIEL on 27-Jul-1999

I asked if anyone could help in suggesting a way to record NWC files onto CD(R or RW). Someone suggested "COOLEDIT":
Cooledit admits "Cooledit cannot convert midi files into wave files."
Someone else suggested "AUDIO COMPOSITOR":
Audiocompositor admits that "AC will only take you as far as the wav file; you'll need another software to get onto CD"
Grateful to the authors of suggestions but the problem remains.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 27-Jul-1999

As written earlier ( msg #1207#reply3 ) the piece of software you need is a software such as EasyCD Creator, Toast Pro or other. You should have one along with your CD Recorder, but it is often "LE" (Light Edition, or should I say Limited Edition :( ) softwares.
Basically, when you get WAV files (44100Hz, stereo, 16bits), you'll need to create a description of your Audio-CD; in some software, it's with glisser-déplacer (dragNdrop?), sometimes selecting files one by one. As I do this work on McIntosh, I can't help you much further, but many people here have helped others with the same troubles.
As-tu essayé de downloader le "Offline Forum" ? Tu peux y faire toutes les recherches en local sur toutes les questions/réponses déjà faites ici (ce qui m'a permis de trouver en 3 secondes les références msg #928 (déjà citée) et msg #1130 ...). Une aide précieuse pour tous sujets.
P.S je ne suis pas le webmaster de mail.dotcom.fr :-) C'est juste un "alias" créé pour gérer le site d'un ami...

HTH,
web.master@mail.dotcom.fr

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Jul-1999

Roland

As I remember your question was:-

"As far as I know NWC files (or midi files) must first be converted into .WAV files and this I can't do.
Any suggestion as to an available programme of conversion."

Despite your reply Cool Edit does do the conversion from midi to wav.
I use this method often.

Reply 3 offered by: Marsu on 28-Jul-1999

Barry: NWC to MID conversion lose sometimes some info... (I think of Fermata and breath marks)
A good way is to record what your soundcard produces when F4 in NWC ... if your mix table allows you to do it (my old SB16 softwares do)

HTH,
      Marsu

Reply 4 offered by: Roland Laniel on 28-Jul-1999

to Barry:
Thank you Barry. I was told by "Cooledit" himself (itself? herself" that what they offered was NOT a CONVERSION. I am not good enough to decide if what they offer is good enough for me.
Anyway my problem is solved by audiocompositor and easyCD.
Thank you all the same for your interest and suggestions.
All the best !

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Jul-1999

Your right - I dont know if the quality would be suitable although I think Fred Nachbaur uses Cool Edit to produce his audio from midi - perhaps we should ask him.

I use Cool Edit to convert sections of downloaded midi files with Spectrograph to determine the harmonic structure of chords I cant make out by ear - so my quality requirements are different.

I have downloaded Auto Compositor (demo).
I'd be interested in your experience with the software.
I use an AWE32 with an 8MB ram and I wondered if I could actually use a larger sound font (like Chaos12) unloaded but accessed through AC for playback.
It seems this may be possible - true?

Reply 6 offered by: Roland Laniel on 29-Jul-1999

hi Barry,

The full version of audiocompositor is much better than the demo.
I cannot answer the rest of your question because i just dabble in music and my experience with audiocompositor is very,very limited.
You'll find someone !

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Jul-1999

Yes I use CoolEdit for recording midi files, the quality is no better and no less than the quality of the original midi. For that matter, Windows' "Sound Recorder" would work ok too, but doesn't allow much in the way of editing or post-processing (noise reduction, filtering, etc.)

I've even used CoolEdit to fix a big (3 second) tape dropout in an old recording that's precious to me, by splicing in that same riff from another part of the song. The result was seamless, and a lot less fiddly than cutting and splicing reel-to-reel tape.

Reply 8 offered by: Roland Laniel on 29-Jul-1999

wow !

Reply 9 offered by: Byron Dickens on 29-Jul-1999

I, too use Cool Edit, but in a slightly different manner. I use NWC to notate my song and then export it to a MIDI/audio sequencer where I tweak the backing tracks and then replace the guitar and vocal parts with audio. I use Cool Edit to record the playback of the whole thing.

I'm pretty sure that you could record playback from NWC in the same manner, though.

Hope this helps.

Reply 10 offered by: Roland Laniel on 30-Jul-1999

Hi, Fred,

If I understand you correcty you transfer music from a tape onto your computer or a CDR.

If so , I would be very interested in the means and the methods of doing so.

Salut

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Jul-1999

It's really quite simple in principle. Connect the output of the tape deck (e.g. 4-track) to the line input of the sound-card, open CoolEdit (or other wave recorder) and record. Save as a 44,100 Hz. stereo 16-bit wav or raw pcm file, from where it can be post-processed, tweaked, converted to mpeg (mp2 or mp3), saved to CD-R, even recorded back onto tape :-)

In practise, there's a lot of fiddling, everything from getting the instrument (track) balances right, setting levels, adding the right amount of reverb/chorus etc, noise reduction... you can spend alot of time until it's "just right" or as close as you can get....

Reply 12 offered by: stumped on 31-Jul-1999

You wanted to get audio versions of your NWC files onto CD, right?

If you just wanted the files, you could just burn them on...

But if you wanted the music, just do midi out from NWC into a synth, and then record the stuff through "line in" with software, and master the CD that way.

I don't use a synth though. I get my band to play the music and we record it with DAT or something and then use a studio to master the music.

REAL MUSIC!

Reply 13 offered by: Roland Laniel on 01-Aug-1999

Thank you. I shall have to think and act.

Reply 14 offered by: RAYMOND DAVIS on 31-Mar-2000

you should use WINAMP - to convert your midi files to wave format.
THIS IS WHAT YOU DO:
GO INTO options THEN GO TO preferences AND YOU WILL SEE A SECTION HEADING FOR output plugins, YOU CAN CHANGE IT THERE, IF YOU CHOOSE nullsoft diskwriter plugin IT WILL ASK YOU FOR A LOCATION ON YOUR DRIVE TO WRITE wav FILES TO AND THEN YOU JUST CLICK ok TO RETURN BACK TO THE MAIN PLAYER SCREEN. GOODLUCK !!! send me some e-mail and let me know how you got on - ALSO - I am looking for osme decent midi files for backing tracks (Popular music)

Reply 15 offered by: Paul Wilhelmsen on 31-Aug-2001

Winamp's diskwriter plugin won't write midi files to wav's.
it only switches mp3 to wav

Reply 16 offered by: Gary Shannon on 02-Sep-2001

Try Gigasampler. The higher end versions will create audio disk files straight from midi. The quality depends on what instrument sample disk you have, and the best ones are quite expensive, but their general midi sample disk is much better than most hardware midi boards.

check it out at http://www.nemesysmusic.com/ and listen to their mp3 demos.

Noteworthy plus Gigasampler (or Gigastudio) makes a dynamite combination!!


#1209: trill
trill

(1209)

Submitted by: affzan on 28-Jul-1999

how can I insert the command "trill" in my music sheet?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 28-Jul-1999

Look at msg #565 , msg #58 or msg #740 .
Instantly found with "Offline Forum", see http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm ...

HTH,
      Mad

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Jul-1999

The simple answer is use grace notes.

Reply 3 offered by: DorkPixie on 12-Aug-1999

32nd notes is the best way to do trills, in my opinion.


#1210: playback question & slurs comment
playback question & slurs comment

(1210)

Submitted by: carolyn conyers on 30-Jul-1999

Background: I use my computer keyboard exclusively for entering notes in Noteworthy, just because I've worked out a fairly speedy way to do that. I play back the scores (just using Noteworthy) to proofread, since I occasionally miss entering an accidental. What I would like is a somewhat better playback sound. Most music is vocal - solo line plus piano accompaniment. What I use now for the melody line is the "french horn." For accompaniment, I use one of the piano sounds. Can anyone suggest a more effective setting? I do want the melody line to stand out, and french horn does that pretty well without being obnoxious, but the accompaniment parts could use some help.

Just now catching up on reading a huge number of forum entries, but want to add my voice to the need for flexible slurs. Need control on whether the slurs go above or below the notes and also sloping, since the present slurs tend to look rather bizarre when NWC places them. So, I usually don't use them at all, and that's not good either. Occasionally I will put in a "general" message in text, like "pedal freely" or something, hoping the accompanist will interpret in a reasonable manner. Hmmm....

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 30-Jul-1999

Some people use woodwind sounds (oboe, clarinet) for vocals, which often works quite well. Problem with these (and french horn) is that if you're doing orchestral vocals (opera, etc.) you lose the vox in the "real" instruments.

I've been using combined sounds for vocals; the "main" staff is set for jazz guitar (a uniquely different sound from any of the orchestral instruments), then duplicate the staff with one of the voice pads - choir oohs, choir aahs, voice lead... this allows me to give a different "character" to different vocal parts.

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 31-Jul-1999

My songs are set up the same way. My favorite for the vocal/solo line is the clarinet, although I also use violin, viola, banjo, recorder, and others depending on the sound I want.
I believe MIDI offers about six "types" of piano, and I often change the regular staffs to one of these. Depending on the song, a voice that sounds good with one song will sound different with another.
Experiment.
Yamaha makes a soft synthesizer that uses the CPU rather than a sound card. I think it sounds much better than any sound card I've ever had. Fred told me about it and gave me the web site. If you want to DL it, I'll try to find the site again. It will make any of the voices sound better.
Regards,
Gordon

Reply 3 offered by: Michael King on 31-Jul-1999

My personal favorite is to use trumpet for the vocal, church organ for the treble accomp., and string ensemble or tuba for the bass clef. Try it! You'll like it! :)

Michael


#1211: Notation for upper octaves
Notation for upper octaves

(1211)

Submitted by: Mark Prince on 31-Jul-1999

I am working on a piano solo arrangement, and it will require using the upper octaves of the [88-key] piano. How do you use the software to show that the notes are to be played an octave higher than written, so that you don't have ledger lines running sky high above the staff? [seems like this might be called an "octava", but my jargon is rustier than my playing].

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jul-1999

Insert a clef (press C on the keyboard) and specify treble clef, octave up. It's as easy as that!

Reply 2 offered by: PeterEdwards on 02-Aug-1999

But I don't think I've ever ever seen a treble clef with an 'octave up' directive. And particularly not in piano music. The only such shift in common use is the 'octave down' to denote that the clef is for tenor rather than soprano/alto. (Or does someone know differently?)

No, we definitely want an 8vo facility for piano music. Another one for the wish list.

Reply 3 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 03-Aug-1999

My version (1.55b) shows octave up AND down can be selected for the treble clef.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 04-Aug-1999

Peter, if you do not want to use the up-shifted clef, which works correctly musically speacking either, then try with boxmarks font.
Define font User1 as Boxmarks 16
Enter text item with the string '8v' at staff position 6, not preserving space, font = User1;
Enter text item with '__________' as long as necessary (start with some space to go after first text item), staff position 10, font=staff lyric, not preserving space;
Enter text item (copy the first one and modify it) with 'w' as string at the position you want to stop your octave shift.

But as a flutist/pianist/guitarist, I assure you that 8va sign for octuve up is comprehensive. With flute I often have either 4 or more ledger lines up, or 8ve up clef. I prefer 2nd notation of course. With guitar the "text" solution (I mean 8------------ written above) is more used. But any musician hould be able to read any of this, some will feel more comfortable with certain notation that others (but imho no one will be at ease with more than 4 ledger lines, we agree I guess).

Hope this helps,

Dominique

P.S. Ask me for an example if I'm not clear enough.
Boxmarks font can be found at the scriptorium ( http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/ )

Reply 5 offered by: Ken J on 04-Aug-1999

If a person had to go above the staff, then that staff could be hidden while a "better looking staff" was put in place for looks and muted.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 05-Aug-1999

BTW, to write above a "Soprano" staff, we could use the "Treble Clef" on 3rd line instead of 2nd line, but this is so rare that I'm sure only one or two people here can read it.
Anyway, this is out of scope of NWC for now. Unless you insert it as text (on a muted staff then).

A propos, does someone have a reference on which instrument uses which clef, and their lowest+highest notes?

Musically yours,
                                        Dominique

Reply 7 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 05-Aug-1999

I suppose you meant "use the Treble Clef on 1st line instead of 2nd line", because the Treble Clef on 3rd line would do the contrary. Anyway, the usage is then to use the C Clef (what is its correct name in english ?) on 1st line.

Reply 8 offered by: Peter on 05-Aug-1999

But back to Mark's problem - I think the easiest thing is to insert the text "8va" (staff italic should look good) at a good looking place above the staff. Then add text "-" as needed to convey the meaning to the performer, finishing with "|" at the end of the octavo section. I find this easier to read than an octave shifted clef - they're just too subtle to notice quickly. Of course, I am assuming that this is for a live performer, not for MIDI playback. I would agree with Fred's solution for that purpose.

HTH,
Peter

Reply 9 offered by: Steve Bacher on 10-Aug-1999

Why choose?

Use *both* "octave down" treble clef and "8va---" text!

Then it will play back correctly and print well too, assuming the extra treble clefs aren't too annoying/confusing.

Btw, all of the same applies to lower-octave bass as well,
as if you couldn't figure that out on your own. ;-)

- seb

Reply 10 offered by: Steve Bacher on 10-Aug-1999

Yeah, yeah, I meant "octave up", not "octave down."

- seb

Reply 11 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 01-Mar-2000

Extra clefs aren't just confusing, they're also inappropriate - standard scores don't have to put in an extra clef each time they include an 8va. section. Violin clef would be, as already suggested, a pretty obscure answer even if Noteworthy allowed it, and from what I've seen of treble clefs with an 8 above or below these are _not_ an instruction to the player. Some of my recorder scores, for instance, use a treble clef with 8 above for the descant line to show it sounds an octave higher than written; not as an instruction to play an octave higher.

Reply 12 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 01-Mar-2000

NWC 1.70 will be the answer. It is now possible to hide any object on the staff. Then, when you need too include an 8va section, add a hidden Treble Clef with octave up, and 8va--- as text. At the end of the section, insert a hidden Treble Clef at standard octave, and --| as text.

Thus, it's OK both for printing and for sounding, without the pain of making a hidden staff.

Reply 13 offered by: Blair Dowden on 01-Mar-2000

Warning - when you hide a clef, all subsequent clefs (at the beginning of each line) will also be hidden. To get around this, insert a non-hidden clef at the start of the next printed line.


#1213: Hidden
Hidden

(1213)

Submitted by: Tsubasa on 02-Aug-1999

Is there anyway that we can use hidden staffs?
like the ones in the sample "moonlite sonata"?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 02-Aug-1999

Easy.
Go in Page Setup (Alt, F, G) and select "Contents" tab.
There you ccan hide/unhide each and every staff.

Hope this answers your question,

NWCly yours,
Dominique


#1214: Hearing Sound
Hearing Sound

(1214)

Submitted by: Gabrielle Hebert on 02-Aug-1999

I have just begun using NC. After using the program and exiting, when I go back into NC later I have no sound coming from my speakers. I finally realized that if I quit and restart Windows 98, everything is OK. But later it happens again. I have never had this happen before. Can anyone help? Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 02-Aug-1999

When this happens, goto Tools | Options | MIDI, then press OK. If you get an error, the most likely reason is that something else is using your soundcard's MIDI synth, thus preventing NWC from using it. If you do not get an error, you may have some kind of setup problem on your computer which requires reinstalling your soundcard's drivers.


#1215: Player Note Resolution
Player Note Resolution

(1215)

Submitted by: Stumpy on 02-Aug-1999

Do you think it would be good for the palyer to have the option of adjusting the note resolution shown on playback? For most of my midi songs look awful when they are shown in player. (especially the swing ones and they are only to 8t)

Also, could you add a little panel to change the midi channels used because my midi module's instrumental channels start at 3 and go to 16 as 1 and 2 are default for something else, and when I play other people's midi files they usually start on channel 1.

Remercie des types, d'Australie :)


#1216: Hidden notes for a specified section
Hidden notes for a specified section

(1216)

Submitted by: Tsubasa on 03-Aug-1999

how do you hide only a highlighted section
and how do you assign the each sections into the hidden groups

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 03-Aug-1999

There is no way to hide some objects for now. Maybe in some next version, ask for it in the wish list :-)

The best solution (yet) is to create a separate staff containing rests until the measure you want to play "hidden" things. Name that staff "Hidden" for example.
To hide that staff, open the Page Setup (menu File, Page Setup), select the "contents" tab (left most), and un-check the staff named "Hidden" (or whatever name you gave) in the right list.

Hope this is clear,

Dominique


#1217: burning a CD
burning a CD

(1217)

Submitted by: Roland Laniel on 04-Aug-1999

Thank you to
Marsu, Barry Graham, Fred Nachbaur (merci!) Byron Dickens, Stumped.
Owing to your help I burnt my first personal CD with my home-made music on it. Not terribly good, I must say but ...

Reply 1 offered by: Stumped on 04-Aug-1999

Hey Roland, That is too cool!
Now that you've worked out how to do it,
let your creativeness run wild and
have a great time.

Believe me, it's easier to work out Noteworthy than
mastering CDs! Pity you didn't live next door, then I
could hear some of your stuff.

Stumped.

Reply 2 offered by: Roland Laniel on 05-Aug-1999

Thank you yourself I would never have succeeded without "a little help from my friends".HAve a good time !

Reply 3 offered by: kathy on 22-Aug-2000

how do you burn a cd. I have the HP 9300 series. I have mp3 files. I cannot get the cd to work on my cd player.
help

Reply 4 offered by: ah choo on 23-Aug-2000

you need a special kind of CD ROM drive with special
software to burn (make) music and data CDs.
contact your local computer store for more info.
Make sure you shop around so you don't get ripped off.


#1218: help...Lyric
help...Lyric

(1218)

Submitted by: JUBAL BACA on 06-Aug-1999

Hola NWC users:

P.Example: I have a melody that it has 20 notes. I need put
lyric sence notes 10. It is possible with NWC...?

Thancks for all... chau...chau

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 06-Aug-1999

I'm not exactly sure what you mean, but if you have an introduction for 10 notes without lyrics, use the "underline character" to bypass those notes. You should be able to find help in your online help file.

Reply 2 offered by: John Ford on 10-Aug-1999

And to expound a little bit, make sure you put spaces between the underline characters. Do NOT use:

__________

as place holders for the 10 notes. Instead, use:

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

-- John


#1219: Classical music discussion forums?
Classical music discussion forums?

(1219)

Submitted by: Kat LaFrance on 06-Aug-1999

Hi, I am looking for a good on-line classical music discussion forum. Do any of you know of any?

Thank you very much,

kat

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 07-Aug-1999

You could have a look at the NWC newsgroup. There's a link somewhere at this site that will take you there. You could also do a websearch for those keywords you typed. I found some matches using all four words.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 10-Aug-1999

There are several newsgroups dedicated to classical music.
They would be a good start. They are at rec.music.classical, and rec.music.classical.contemporary,
rec.music.classical.guitar,rec.music.classical.performing, and rec.music.classical.recording

A

Reply 3 offered by: Kat on 10-Aug-1999

Thanks. I appreciate the information and will take a look at the links.

Reply 4 offered by: John in Brisbane on 16-Aug-1999

Kat, I see you made it here. Hope that this has been helpful. Regards, John

Reply 5 offered by: Kat LaFrance on 16-Aug-1999

Hi, John! Yes, I did make it and yes, it has been VERY helpful. Thanks to you and everyone!


#1220: How to get copyright for your own arrangement?
How to get copyright for your own arrangement?

(1220)

Submitted by: Mark Prince on 07-Aug-1999

Let's say you are toiling away on your new arrangement of a piece that is already copyrighted, but you think you have many better ideas for the piece. Can you just APPLY for a copyright for your new arrangment without permission from the current copyright holder, to protect you before you have finished your new arrangement? Also, when you finish your new arrangement, how do go about getting it finally copyrighted? Do you then have to obtain permission from the current copyright holder, or negotiate with the current copyright holder? Or does the sytem work in ways that I have not mentioned?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 08-Aug-1999

The right to make an arrangement rests with the copyright holder - usually the publisher.
You can get permission to create a new arrangement.

The copyright attachs to the created work - just add the copyright symbol, your name and date.
This gives botton-line protection.

If you want better protection register the arrangement with your local copyright office.

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Horne on 10-Aug-1999

To an extent it depends on which country you live in, since the laws are different around the world. You did not make this plain in your original posting. Assuming that you live in the UK you need to get permission from the original copyright holder before you do anything. Once you have that then as long as the copyright holder doesn't object you have copyright on the arrangment. There's no need to lodge anything anywhere. The law says it's yours. But before doing anything contact the PRS.

Reply 3 offered by: Mark Prince on 11-Aug-1999

To clarify my original posting, this question would pertain to United States law. Also, I would like to get some clarification as to what constitutes "create". Does this mean you are putting the arrangement to paper notation, or does "creating" also apply to one's experimenting at the piano in the privacy on one's home?

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 11-Aug-1999

Something is not "created" under US copyright law until it is "fixed in a tangible medium." That means: written down on paper (or shirtsleeve), recorded on tape, placed into a computer file, carved into granite, punched into a player piano roll, etc. You can fool around on the computer all you want (in private): but the created and copyrightable entity is some sort of record for posterity.

caveat: In the unlikely case that the opinion of your local judge differs from mine ... you must have misunderstood me, that's it.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Aug-1999

In an interesting twist, Canadian copyright law states that copyright is owned from "conception." However, proving it could be rather difficult, unless your judge is psychic :-) ... which is where it's nice to have it "fixed in a tangible medium" - and we're back to square one!

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 16-Aug-1999

*Square* medium? No CD nor vinyl then! ;-P
More seriously, basically, the "concept" is rarely "copyrightable". An idea is not copyrightable either, i.e. if you think of a new kind of plane, you must do a prototyp of it...
concerning music/literature, any mean that allow you to re-produce your creation can be enough, though it's better to use "classic" media.
In France you need to deposit a "physical" copy of it --i.e. for a computer file, either a printout, either a physical media, preferably un-erasable-- to get a copyright, but they do not ensure any protection: they will only prove you're the owner if *you* (or someone for you) pleague against someone.

When you want to copyright something, make sure tyhat what you write didn't come from some forgotten memories or so. Sometimes we re-write something we herad many years ago... At least for some measures. I do not know the maximal length that is authorised (I mean allowed), but you may "quote" music in your own work.

Question: if I record myself on a record tape/computer file, and someone steals it, can I attack him/her if (s)he declares my work as his/her own one? (I suppose answer differs according as I still have a duplicata or not)

Reply 7 offered by: Joel Cress on 07-Sep-1999

Barry Graham is correct in saying that the right of arrangements (called "derivative works"), as well as public performance (except for few exceptions, such as performance during worship services) rests with the copyright holder. You must have permission or pay royalty for the right to reproduce the work by any means. Be careful here, for as little as one measure of a copyrighted work has been protected by U.S. courts for infringement. The "Happy Birthday To You" song is a good example of a song that has been aggressively protected (can you believe it?) by the copyright owner.

Concerning copyright protection: you must register a work with the U.S. copyright office if you want to pursue litigation in the U.S. court system; however, "common law" copyright is still accepted for establishing the date of creation. Unfortunately, the time of copyright ownership for any piece of work begins at creation, not upon filing it with the copyright office. However, if you are simply wanting to register your work and there is no fear of infringement in the works, then who needs to know?

Finally, there are several replies concerning international differences in copyright law. This no longer applies based on an international copyright law treaty that has been accepted this decade by most industrialized nations. If you register your work with your copyright office, then that copyright is internationally recognized. One drawback of the international copyright treaty that caused the U.S. to balk for a while, is that the copyrighted work does not need to be clearly marked (or marked at all) for an owner to pursue infringement litigation. A copyright infringer is defenseless in this case (guilty until proven innocent).

Notice that Hal Leonard publishing has recently been pursuing litigation against MIDI sites where the system administrators have unknowingly posted uploads of copyrighted MIDI files, even when the copyright information has been removed from the file itself. Be carful!

Reply 8 offered by: Sean Gilfillan on 06-Dec-1999

Hello.....I didnt know who else to ask but here i go. How do i copyright a name. Not a regular name but something i came up with? I want to copyright it now so no one uses it. Please reply to my email address. Kind of like when Pat Riley copyrighted three-peat...

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 09-Dec-1999

1) You can't copyright a name. You may use a name as a "Trademark" and you may register that trademark with a state or Federal office (i.e. the US Patent and Trademark Office, whose web page is given below): you may also sue someone who uses it in a context that might confuse your customers.

2) I'm not a lawyer; I don't even play one on TV. Check out the general information here, for information from someone with a clue about the subject.

http://www.uspto.gov/web/menu/tm.html


#1221: printing
printing

(1221)

Submitted by: David Joseph Moorman on 07-Aug-1999

7 August 99

Dear Sir or Maam,

I was wondering if there is a way to make the printed copy have some of the text printed in color. Most of my songs are hymns with multiple verses (sometimes many) and being able to have the third verse in red, for example, would help keep your eyes aligned to the proper area when singing. That way your eyes would not accidentally stray to an incorrect verse line as your eyes move down the page.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 07-Aug-1999

Not at the moment, David, nor is it possible to have different fonts for different verses e.g. italic for the middle verse. One for the wish list perhaps? All is not lost however - set the number of lyric lines to your total number of verses, but leave the non standard ones blank, export the final version into a publishing program and then add the missing verse(s) in whatever font or colour you wish. See also msg #771 , msg #767 , msg #713
Peter

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 16-Aug-1999

Maybe is it simpler to export the *complete* work as Peter suggests it, and change the color of you lyrics in the separaet program --I know you can do it with Word (exporting pages as .WMF files, see preview), just double click into the picture, and select the elements you want to change color (Alas, you can't drag a box around them for multiple selection). Though this needs much memory to work, it works. But it is quite painful (I just tried it again) since you must click on each syllable, select the text, and change the color (but you can use Quick keys for this: {Home, Ctrl-End, Ctrl-D, Alt-C, R} in French version, I guess it's the same on US one, so macro recorder can help).

Finally, Peter's suggestion may be good (not to include the lyrics you want to colorize) but you'll have to place the lyrics yourself.

Haha! Last chance: I just retried once more, and finally it's less painful as I thought.
Once you have selected a syllable (and that's the hard part when objects overlap), use Ctrl-D to access properties, select the color (use the first letter of its name), strike Enter to valid; and then the TAB key will select the next item :-) :-)
So it will be a repetitive work, with no fiddling with the mouse!! Macro recorder will definitely help then. I just recorded a macro for it (the keys I gave just above) and it works fine. I'm using Word6, but I see no reason why it shouldn't work with newer versions (except that µ$ has strange policy about compatibility)

Hope this helps,
                            Dominique

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Vasey on 16-Aug-1999

Definitely a 'why didn't I think of that' answer, Dominique! Excellent solution, and I've taken it a bit further. I've plugged Serif's Page Plus on a number of occasions (see links in my earlier answer) because it correctly imports the NWC metafiles. So I tried its companion program, Draw Plus, to modify the lyric lines. (Copy and paste the metafile from preview, then <Arrange><Ungroup> to access individual items). And it works beautifully, with whole lines of text being selectable at once. The odd item goes funny, for example boxed bar numbers are filled in black, but selecting them and changing their fill to 'none' cures that one. There may be other minor glitches I haven't spotted, but I'm sure they'd be easily corrected. And of course with a metafile in a drawing package, now is the time to add those tricky hairpins and glissando marks!
Peter.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Bowers on 18-Aug-1999

If you are editing a WMF object you should be able to select many syllables at a time by holding the shift key down while selecting them with the mouse. Then all the colors could be changed at once.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 19-Aug-1999

I'd like to; Word doesn't allow this, and PSP changes it into bitmap. Even PhotoShop doesn't recognize that vectoriel format (what a pity, btw!) So what do you use to edit a WMF file?
TIA,
      Mad

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Bowers on 19-Aug-1999

Sorry, I use word, I left out a very important step. I have done this a lot with MetaFiles and It is easy to leave things out that I take for granted.

When the WMF pictures are placed in Word they are grouped into sections. You can edit individual items in the section but cannot select multiple items. If you select the grouped section and issue the ungroup command then all the items in the group are split apart. They can then be multiply selected and edited a lot easier.

It appears that each staff is a grouping. I normally click on the beginning bar line of the staff. You know it is right when you see the resizing icons appear at the corners of the staff. Then you can do an ungroup command (I normally right click to get the pull down menu but I am sure there is another command to do the same thing). When done you can leave them un-grouped or select one item and issue a re-group command (again, I use the pull down menu) and all the items that were previously grouped will be put back together.

Grouping is useful for moving sub pictures around that were made from many primitives.

Hope this helps. It is terribly slow going in the picture editor until I get it ungrouped and then appears to speed up considerably.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Bowers on 19-Aug-1999

Well, it looks like it lets you do everything on multiple selections except change the text (fonts, colors, sizes, etc).

Back to the drawing board.

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Bowers on 19-Aug-1999

Ok, this was bothering me so I tried it in Powerpoint 97. (Again, you have to ungroup the metafile). Powerpoint does allow you to multiple select (shift or cursor drag) and modify all the text qualities at once.

In fact, it was so easy to do in Powerpoint (and fast) that I may use it for a lot more of these.

Reply 9 offered by: Peter Vasey on 20-Aug-1999

Or (ref reply no. 7) back to the Draw Plus-ing board.


#1222: Second time only
Second time only

(1222)

Submitted by: Nigel Horne on 10-Aug-1999

How do I indicate that a line in the score is to be played "second time only"?

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 10-Aug-1999

To *indicate* that a section is to be played second time only, insert "second time only" as text (do I hear the sound of grandmothers sucking eggs?)

To actually get NWC to play it second time only, include the section in a 2nd time special ending. This would also be a valid way of indicating it in a score but over-long 2nd time bars are a pain in the neck!

Stephen Randall

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Horne on 10-Aug-1999

Marking that line as a 2nd special ending didn't work. Naturally I'd tried that before posting.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 10-Aug-1999

Your note didn't indicate whether you were using "local repeat" or "master repeat" -- special endings only work for the latter.

Reply 4 offered by: Nigel Horne on 10-Aug-1999

I used master repeat. The 1st and 2nd time bars (known as special endings to NWC) in that section work fine as they should. But that's wandering off topic since I'm interested in 2nd time only indications, not 1st and 2nd time bars.

Reply 5 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 11-Aug-1999

I can only think of "2nd special ending" for the "2nd time only" part, and "1st, 3rd, 4th... special endings" for the other part. If you would send the section to me in an NWC file attached to an email, I'll be glad to have a look at it and see why the "2nd special ending" didn't work. (unless it was because you didn't had the other "ending" numbers to the 1st ending.

Reply 6 offered by: Nigel Horne on 11-Aug-1999

Thanks for the offer, NWC file on it's way.

-Nigel


#1223: Where is The Scriptorium?
Where is The Scriptorium?

(1223)

Submitted by: Ludovico Mayer on 12-Aug-1999

The link to The Scriptorium http://noteworthy.beyondtheweb.com/
dont work. Any body know what happen with that

Thanks.

Ludovico

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 12-Aug-1999

The fellow who has been hosting the site for free for the past year (my son) is in the process of moving. We're presently waiting to see if he wants to continue to host it once he's got his server up and running in his new location. If not, we'll be looking for a new home for the Scriptorium.

Stay tuned...

Reply 2 offered by: Ludovico on 24-Aug-1999

Thanks, Fred.

I'm waiting.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Aug-1999

It's back! Thanks to the generosity of Matt Johnson at vadu.com, and with hard work by Matt and our webmaster Andrew Purdam, the Scriptorium is back online at:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

Please update your bookmarks and drop in for a visit.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 28-Aug-1999

Sorry, forgot the bang before the URL... here's the clickable version...

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

Reply 5 offered by: Ludovico on 01-Sep-1999

Thanks very, very much Fred.

Ludovico


#1224: At my own pace....
At my own pace....

(1224)

Submitted by: larry kincheloe on 14-Aug-1999

How do I use my MIDI keyboard to select the pitch for notes I want to enter at my own pace, not live
- step time?

1.Tools: Options, Record tab
2.If not set, select the Input Device Driver for your system
3.MIDI tab - set MIDI Port Usage to While Active or Always
4.Tools: MIDI Input Active

I followed the above directions but #4 'MIDI input Activie" is always gray.

Any suggestions????????

Thanks,
Larry

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 14-Aug-1999

Here are the reasons why this would be gray:

- You do not have an editor window open
- A song is currently playing back in NWC

If you have a song playing, stop it. If you do not have an editor window open, then note entry would have no place to go.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 16-Aug-1999

If you enter notes "at your own pace", then you'll have notes with unsignificant lengths. You could then easily put them all at the same length by selecting the whole staff (home, Shift+End) and typing the numpad key matching the most used length --let's say quarter: type in '3'.
If you want to remove all bar lines, go to the beginning of the staff, and type in:
Ctrl-Right, BackSpace
Ctrl-Right, BackSpace
...until you get to the end. This will do.
Now you can go back to the beginning, and start to set note lengths to their correct values.

But instead of all this, I'd personally create a slooow staff to playback along, and then record at a slow -but steady- pace.

Hope this helps,
Dominique


#1225: A partner
A partner

(1225)

Submitted by: Kenneth Scott on 15-Aug-1999

I am looking for someone, who would be interested in working with me to create Arrangments for brass Bands.

This would be a none profit project. the only motive I have is- I play for a brass bands who's music collection can alway do with growing. I feel with the help of someone I can acheive this.

Please send me an e-mail If you are interested I will return any e-mails.

As I said before this is a non-profit project. Only for FUN!!!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 15-Aug-1999

A good place to do this would be the Noteworthy newsgroup, at !news://news.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc
If you can get to it, you'll probably find some willing participants.

A


#1226: Need a composer to write in music to a song
Need a composer to write in music to a song

(1226)

Submitted by: DrakeKay on 16-Aug-1999

I have writen a song. So far all I have is an acoustic guitar part and a vocal part. I'm looking for something to fill this song out. If you are interested in helping a struggling musician, email me.

Reply 1 offered by: Becky on 12-Dec-1999

Drop me a line and we'll see what's going on. :)

Reply 2 offered by: Johnny on 01-Feb-2001

I think I could help you out, check out my site and see if it interests you

Johnny

http://www.geocities.com/marquez_jd/Lyrics_Poems_To_Music.html


#1227: Key Signature when recording
Key Signature when recording

(1227)

Submitted by: Peter Edwards on 16-Aug-1999

I've made a click-track (channel 10) with the correct time signature (obviously) and the desired key signature, but the record window (ie after pressing f4/f6) only picks up the time signature.

To get the key signature, and thus the music correctly represented, I have to force accidentals, enter the key and transpose by 0 which seems unduly complex. Am I missing something?


#1228: guitar fret noise
guitar fret noise

(1228)

Submitted by: DrakeKay on 16-Aug-1999

Have you ever listened to an acoustic guitar solo and heard a sounds like fingers sliding up the strings before the next note was played? If so, that is what I am trying to produce in a piece Im writing. I'd like to have this noise played right before I play my next chord, cause I intentionaly play this sounds when I perform the peice live. I have tried a few ways to reproduce it. Ive tried adding the patch for the sound for the first note of my next chord, and then changing the patch back to the original. This does not sound the way I'd like it too. Please give me a few idea's.

Thank you
Drake Kay

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Aug-1999

Put the fret noises in a separate staff (you'll probably want to make this a "hidden" staff). It's fiddly, but well worth the effort. (Same goes for the chiff noises on flutes, etc.) You can then set the timing exactly the way you want it, without having to do patch changes on the fly.

Also note that the character of the noise changes with the pitch selected; higher pitches give the effect of sliding faster.

Reply 2 offered by: William Mierisch on 05-Sep-1999

I use a SoundBlaster Live! soundcard, and it the sound patches available there is an actual patch for guitar fret noise which, when random pitches are selected, provides a convincing finger-sliding-on-the-fretboard kind of sound. Don't know how useful this will be to you, but it definitely helps make my acoustic stuff sound far more realistic than it ever had before. Again, the key is to not use the same pitch for every slide, as that sounds just as artificial as not adding them at all.

Reply 3 offered by: g.sharp on 04-Jan-2002

heh.. well i was here with a question but this form answered it thanks... -gs


#1229: convert ncw file- midi
convert ncw file- midi

(1229)

Submitted by: DrakeKay on 17-Aug-1999

I'm about to convert this piece that I've written to a midi file, and I'm not sure which program to use. Any suggestions?

Thanks
Drake Kay

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Vasey on 17-Aug-1999

Couldn't be easier, Drake - using NWC's <File> menu, either <Export> or <Save As> a Type 1 MIDI File. That's all there is to it.

HTH, Peter.

Reply 2 offered by: DrakeKay on 17-Aug-1999

Thanks, now how do I add the vocals? Laffs,,

Reply 3 offered by: Peter V. on 17-Aug-1999

Can't using NWC, so you're back to square 1! Nor can NWC import lyrics - have a look at some previous threads, for example msg #1187
Peter


#1230: reset MIDI controllers?
reset MIDI controllers?

(1230)

Submitted by: Joon Choe on 17-Aug-1999

I'm doing midi/digital sequencing with Cakewalk Pro Audio, but am using Noteworthy for all my notation/note input purposes... (exporting NWC to MID and importing the MID into Cakewalk)... so I go back and forth between Cakewalk and Noteworthy a lot. But when I change some MIDI controllers in Cakewalk, then switch over to Noteworthy, it uses those changes... is there any way to reset all MIDI controllers to default in Noteworthy?

thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Aug-1999

Yes. Hit F6 (stop) a second time.


#1231: 1812 Overture
1812 Overture

(1231)

Submitted by: Michael King on 18-Aug-1999

About five years ago I bought my first CD player! I immediately went nuts buying CD's. Including three, yes three, copies of Tchaikovsky's Fourth symphony. On one of those CD's was the 1812 Overture. Far out I thought. Wait! What's this?! There is the Mormon Tabernacle Choir SINGING what appears to be a hymm to the first part of it. I had never heard this before. Now comes the QUESTION! Where can I get those words? As some of them are sung very softly or drawn out, I cannot make them out. Does anybody perchance know where I might find the words? If it will help, I can give you the start. Help? Please? Thanks.

Michael King

Reply 1 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 19-Aug-1999

If I remember correctly, this part of 1812 contains a Russian Orthodox liturgical hymn -"tropar"- which starts with the words "Spasí, Góspodi, ljoúdi tvojá..." (in Church Slavonic), meaning "Save, o Lord, Thy people...". In Tsarist Russia, not only the "people" but also the name of the reigning Tsar (and sometimes even his family) was mentioned in the hymn and I don't now remember the name of the Tsar in 1812. If your interested, I can send you the full text (modern version) and music (NWC, of course)as sung today in the Russian Orthodox Church, but certainly Tchajkosky's version is more elaborated and meant for a bigger choir than the version actually used in the Russian Church today.

Best wishes
Paul

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 19-Aug-1999

Two suggestions:

1. They are singing the old (imperial) Russian National Anthem.

2. They are singing 'God the all-terrible! King' which is hymn number 491 in 'Hymns Ancient & Modern Revised'.

Reply 3 offered by: Michael King on 19-Aug-1999

Paul and Peter:

Say you two aren't saints are you?:) I thank you both for your replies. I just started the CD and it starts out "O mighty God, preserve us from jeopardy", then it trails off so I can't understand what they are singing. Darn male voices anyhow!

Paul, I would love the words and music. Thank you very much!

Peter, where do I find that hymm book? Never mind, I'll just have to go looking for it I suppose.

Once again my thanks.

Michael King
Mykul1@earthlink.net

Reply 4 offered by: peter edwards on 19-Aug-1999

Hymns Ancient & Modern is the Hymn Book of the Church of England and only easly available in the UK (I would think). But fear not! Follow the link from NWC to 'The Cyber Hymnal' and there you will find 'God the Omnipotent!'

http://tch.simplenet.com/htm/g/godtheom.htm

HTH
Peter

Reply 5 offered by: Michael King on 20-Aug-1999

Thanks again. I thought I was going to have to fly off to Jolly Old England and steal, I mean buy a copy!:)

Reply 6 offered by: John in Brisbane on 22-Aug-1999

My choir sang it last year for a gig with the Royal Marines and the Russian Army Orchestra and a somewhat mercurial Russian General conducting. It's a fantastic sing (particularly the bass voices) and was a great series of performances. I have the English lyrics but it will take me about 36 hours to post. I also have the SATB in Eb. Regards, John

Reply 7 offered by: Michael King on 22-Aug-1999

Gee, John, only 36 hours? What are you waiting for, an invitation? :) Just kidding! Thank you for the info. Best regards;

Michael King

Reply 8 offered by: Serafim Evgenievich on 08-Apr-2001

This Troparion translates into English as
"O Lord, save Thy people
and bless Thine inheritance.
Grant victory to Orthodox Christians
and grant us Thy great mercy."

There are many, many musical scores to this Troparion, which, before "God Save the Tsar" was the Russian National Anthem. I think I know which music you are talking about, the one which seems to be most popular in our weekly Liturgies, but do not know the composer.

Reply 9 offered by: Serafim Evgenievich on 08-Apr-2001

The Tsar in 1812 was Alexander II. I think that the section you may be referring to in the 1812 Overture is "Bozhe Tsarya Xrani" - "God Protect the Tsar" - which became the Russian National Anthem after the previously referred to Troparion "O Lord Save Thy People" - a part of the Eastern Orthodox Liturgy whether Russian or not - which, before "God Protect the Tsar," was indeed the Russian National Anthem. Can't remember when the National Anthem was changed, but the most recent was composed by Lvov. I do know that "Bozhe Tsarya Xrani" is played briefly in the 1812 Overture; cannot recall "O Lord, Save Thy People" being part of it.

Reply 10 offered by: Serafim Evgenievich on 08-Apr-2001

The English translation of "God Protect the Tsar" is
"God Protect the Tsar, He who holds power;
Reign for glory, for our glory.
Reign to the terror of our enemies,
Orthodox Tsar!
God Protect the Tsar!"

"Bozhe Tsarya Hrani
Silni derzhavi
Tsarstvui na slavu,na slavu nam.
Tsarstvui na strax vragam
Tsar Pravoslavni
Bozhe Tsarya Hrani."

Reply 11 offered by: Joe Music on 08-Apr-2001

QUICK! Name a well-known overture written between the years 1811 and 1813.

Reply 12 offered by: Grant on 09-Apr-2001

Actually, JM, I tried but couldn't come up with any. None of Beethoven's overtures was written in 1812 (according to the New Grove dictionary, the closest is the Fidelio overture of 1814). I thought of Mendelssohn and Weber, but 1812 is about 10 years too early for either of them. Schubert wrote an overture in D major in that year, but it's not "well-known". So I'm at a loss. What am I missing?

Reply 13 offered by: Stephen Randall on 10-Apr-2001

How about these not so famous operas presumably with overtures by Rossini:

L'inganno felice

Ciro in Babilonia

La scala di seta

La pietra del paragone

L'occasione fa il ladro

All first performed in 1812 and possibly written the same year. Although the premier of L'inganno felice was on 8 January 1812 - not a lot of time to get the production together.

Perhaps almost qualifying as famous is Tancredi (I've even played the overture) which was first perfomed on 6 Feb 1813 and therefore was probably finished during 1812. I'll go for that one.

Information from http://rick.stanford.edu/opera/Rossini

Stephen

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 10-Apr-2001

Rossini - of course! That's what I was missing.

Prolific son of a gun, wasn't he?

I can console myself with the fact that none of the overtures you mention - not even Tancredi - seems to merit the description "well-known".

Reply 15 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Apr-2001

The only one I've ever /heard of/ is La scala di seta, and that's just because the overture is on a sort of "best of GR" CD I own. So I guess it's well-known if you happen to have that particular record. :)

Reply 16 offered by: Joe Music on 10-Apr-2001

Sorry, the "well known" was gratuitous!

I heard the question (without the "well-known") on a music trivia panel discussion at a classical radio station several years ago. Of course, the question draws laughter, because "1812 Overture" is definitely wrong.

If the time interval is expanded a bit, say 1809 to 1815, then indeed one can find "well-known" in Beethoven.

As for the start of this thread, the first time I ever heard the 1812 overture, on a vinyl record, it had the Russian chorus (group at beginning, men's chorus at cannonade). I don't have the liner notes anymore, but I do recall that the opening was supposed to be a "well-known" Russian church hymn to the Virgin.

It is said that song is best in Italian or French, less so in German or English. But Russian is the only language in which a composer tried to drown out the chorus with cannons.

Reply 17 offered by: Artur on 12-Apr-2001

Also have this great cd. It's Essentials Classic (Sony), isn't it?

Reply 18 offered by: Max Magee on 13-May-2001

This is what I can make out, although the fourth and sixth lines are kind of sketchy (at best).

Mighty Lorrrrrdddd,
Preserve us from jeopardyyyyyyy.
Take thee now our faaaaaate
and glowwwww briiiight in peniteeeeence
and bee-eeee with me
o'er trecherous and cruel and unease and through all and bring peace.
O mighty Lord hear our lowwwwly prayerrrrr,
and by the liiiiight shining fully, light.
Grant uuuuus, O Lord, peaaaaaace agaaain.
<music>...

Reply 19 offered by: Andy on 13-May-2001

oh, I hear this in the 6th line now:
o'er our trecherous and cruel our heaven peace and to our land bring peace.

Reply 20 offered by: Joe Music on 15-May-2001

Regarding the sixth line, however it may be translated:

A Russian-speaking friend (who did not have access to the chorus in Russian, alas) tell me that the extra length (numerous syllables) of that line is a characteristic of some Orthodox Church music. Apparently, some of the words are conjugated in a way that introduces many syllables, and since the prayer has a rather fixed content, it is necessary to squeeze it all in.

Reply 21 offered by: Spinoza on 26-May-2001

I think the 6th line says:

O'er Trecherous and crue and grand unease and to our land
bring peace.

And, I think the 8th line says:

And by Light, Shinning Holy Light, Grand us oh Lord Peace
again.

But I am not sure.

Reply 22 offered by: Jason Hall on 20-Jul-2001

i have gathered the lyrics from this page and put the right ones in one place, here:

Mighty Lord,
Preserve us from jeopardy.
Take thee now our fate
and glow bright in penitence
and be-e with me
O'er trecherous and cruel and grand unease and to our land bring peace.
O mighty Lord hear our lowly prayer,
and by light, shinning holy light, grant us oh Lord Peace again.
<little music>
O mighty Lord hear our prayer.
...

But, The overture was not written in 1812, it was written around 1880. A little known fact is that Tchaikovsky never actually heard it the way he wrote it.

Reply 23 offered by: Casey on 22-Jul-2001

Understandably, Tchaikovsky felt this piece was "very noisy" and "with no artistic merit," which is true, especially for his music, but it is still a good, inspiring piece--the use it was supposed to serve when comissioned for the opening of the Moscow Exhibition. It was written to commemorate Napolean's retreat for Moscow (hence the French National Anthem that gets buried in the melee of runs and, what the original score calls for, "all the bells of Russia"). The singing was not part of the original intention. This was brought into the picture by a performance in the U.S. after World War I. It seems to have stuck, and other orchestras have picked it up.

Reply 24 offered by: lionvoice on 30-Aug-2001

Hey all,

I remember browsing this post last year...wow. Anyways, can someone maybe give me the name and any other pertinent info regarding a CD that has this 1812 overture w/ vocals? I just have the mp3 and am very much interested in purchasing the "legit" version. Please email @ mcarlyle@iastate.edu with any info...thanks!

Mitch

Reply 25 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Aug-2001

I hope this doesn't come across as being condescending, but did you try to read the ID3 tag in the mp3? Often they have the name of the original CD. In WinAmp you can view the ID3 info by clicking the middle button on the left.

Fred

Reply 26 offered by: Joe Music on 31-Aug-2001

While you are trying to find the 1812 CD with vocals, if there is a used (vinyl) record shop in your area, have a look. I remember having a record with the Russian chorus included. It was probably recorded in the early 1970s.

Reply 27 offered by: Jarred on 01-Sep-2001

I think the Tsar was Alexander I

Reply 28 offered by: lionvoice on 01-Sep-2001

Fred,

Thanks for the advice...looked at the ID3 tag, and fate was not in my corner. No luck...but thanks a mil for the suggestion! Take Care.

Mitch

Reply 29 offered by: Artur on 05-Sep-2001

Has anyone here tried audiogalaxy to find this song?
I have this program and can seek it out if asked...

Reply 30 offered by: andre rivera on 22-Sep-2001

ok...i love the 1812 Overture. i love it so much that it inspired me to write a script. now, the beginning part of the song (the hymn) has been a mystery for me as far as lyrics are concerned. i have gotten a few words hear and there, but someone here got practically all of it, but not ALL of it...

the last line is VERY HAZY for me and i'm gonna guess on this one

Mighty Lord,
Preserve us from jeopardy.
Take thee now our fate
and glow bright in penitence
and be-e with me
O'er trecherous and cruel and grand unease and to our land bring peace.
O mighty Lord hear our lowly prayer,
and by light, shinning holy light, grant us oh Lord Peace again.
<little music>
O mighty Lord hear our prayer
and save our people
forever FOR-EV-ER

then the boom that starts out the music
...

Reply 31 offered by: mike rodgers on 25-Sep-2001

this is so funny. i have long enjoyed the 1812 overture and have always wondered what the lyrics to the beginning were. it wasn't until tonight, however, when i finally decided that i just had to find out what they were. upon finally finding this site i thought "crap, august 1999, all this stuff will be outdated by now." but low and behold someone replies w/ the full lyrics 2 days ago! hahaha...awesome!! thanks everyone!!!!!

Reply 32 offered by: Bob Merritt on 26-Sep-2001

As I recall, it's "our treacherous and cruel enemies and to our land bring peace." An appropriate prayer at this time...

I was hoping to find the whole prayer here, but it seems I know as much as anyone maybe :-(

Reply 33 offered by: Clay Ramsey on 02-Oct-2001

This particular chant has long fascinated me.

Actually I had never heard it until 1995 when Andrew Litton, conducting the Dallas Symphony Orchestra, perfomed the 1812 Overture to kick off a night of Russian CLassical Music. Being a freshly degreed Russian Major from Texas A&M, I was really upset that I could not attend (it was a sellout), so I had to listen over the radio.

The DSO brought over 2 Russian Chorale Tutors, and tought the affiliated chorus to sing the pieces, and to do so properly. As I listened over the radio, tears began streaming down my cheeks, it was THAT beautiful. And correct, to my ear.

Fortunately, it came out on CD, and it is one of my cherished recordings. It has become the standard by which I judge all 1812 recordings I have / hear. A close 2nd is one recorded in Mineapolis in the early 60s (I think) that featured actual muskets and bronze cannon from the US Mil. Acad. @ West Point as well as a massive carrilon on site. Truly magnificent.

I have also found a wonderful Russian recording with those incredibly deep basses that Russian Chorales seem to thrive on.

Does anyone have link to the lyrics IN RUSSIAN?

Reply 34 offered by: Owen Ozier on 11-Nov-2001

Glad to see this discussion alive. I tried to find these answers in 1998, but with little success. It seems that the
intervening years have served the internet well. Thanks to Casey for the historical tidbits and to Clay for the DSO info; I've gotten CD's from them before.

Reply 35 offered by: Keith Hardy on 03-Jan-2002

Surfing the 'net in an effort to find the Russiona lyrics to the hymn opening the mighty 1812 and delighted to have come across your site.

I certainly share Clay's desire to locate the Russian lyrics. I have an old tape of Eugene Ormandy the Philadelphia Orchestra - not marvellous quality at all and my Russian simply isn't good enough to get the words (Lord I have troubel with choirs in English!).

To all those experiencing difficulty in getting lyrics perhaps I can offer some sympathy. I worked in Moscow in the mid 80s and regularly went to the state-owned music stores 'Melodiya'. Ravaging through the 'gramplastinkis' there were the usual favourites and occassionally a really good find for next to nothing. But alas never once did I come across the 1812. Worse still the store staff had never heard of it. My local contacts could never give me an explanation why it wasn't avaialble. So I left empty handed and never once heard it played there.

So, I join your ranks as a frustrated 1812 chaser. But I am grateful for the leads where I can at least get the English language version (though I do not expect them to match the chilling Russian voices but would still be happy to settle for one). I understand ABC FM Radio here in Asutralia a couple of months ago played an excellent choral version. I'll follow that up and post the results.

Reply 36 offered by: glenn on 10-Feb-2002

thank you all, i used to have this cd and always wondered about the chorus lyrics. this is my favorite version of the overture. does anyone know which orchestra this is?


#1232: Duplets
Duplets

(1232)

Submitted by: Bill Powell on 21-Aug-1999

When writing in Simple time it is easy to include a triplet but I cannot find a way of writing a duplet when writing in compound time; ie, to divide a single beat (dotted crotchet) into two equal notes. I have to do this:
(quaver + semi-quaver tied)and ...
(semi-quaver + quaver tied)
Which of course is not the correct way to notate it.

Does someone know how this can be done?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 21-Aug-1999

I just use two dotted eighths (quavers), beamed if applicable.

Reply 2 offered by: Bill Powell on 22-Aug-1999

Thanks Fred, for your suggestion but two dotted eighth's is not the correct way to notate a duplet in compound time. I am a music teacher and my printed examples have to be correct.
In simple time a triplet is beamed with a "3" to tell the performer to divide the beat into 3 equal parts.
In compund time a duplet has to be beamed with a "2" to tell the performer to divide the beat ( which is normally divided into 3) into 2 equal parts.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1999

Sorry, there's no notationally correct way of doing this at this time. My suggestion works from a midi (playback) standpoint, but I agree that it's right from a visual (theory) standpoint.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1999

Well, ok... I spoke a bit too soon. There are ways of post-processing NWC printouts using the Print Preview Copy function, to generate either a bitmap or a windows metafile of the current page. From there you could edit the file further in an external application. Several folks have worked with metafiles (see the recent "Printing" thread for some tips). I've successfully used the bitmap option followed by editing in Paint Shop Pro (and subsequent conversion to PostScript format for publishing) to do things like upside-down clefs and similar shenanigans.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 23-Aug-1999

At the time being, Fred's answer is the best answer (but you can also use Word with WMF format).

Hoping this will be possible in next version (don't know when it's planned though), so don't despair :-)

If you're in a hurry, the simplest way is dotted eights (which _is_ correct but not much used), and manually (I mean not in NWC) removing dots and adding a *2* at the proper place.
BTW, that's how my li'l brother understood a duplet in compound measure :-)

HTH anyway

Reply 6 offered by: Bill Powell on 23-Aug-1999

Thanks from "down under" for all your help. I can now work my way around the problem. Great support.

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 01-Sep-1999

An addendum re: dotted eighth's. If this is not a "notationally correct" way to represent duplets, someone tell Benjamin Britten. He did it that way more than once.

Reply 8 offered by: Bill Powell on 02-Sep-1999

Thanks Grant,
My original question has been answered by others who understood that I simply wanted to know if there was a way,using "Noteworthy Comp" , to notate a duplet in the correct way. Clearly it is not - but I can now get around it.
I'm sure you are right about Benjamin B. Most astute of you.

Reply 9 offered by: William Mierisch on 05-Sep-1999

Well, this whole stream just reinforces in my own mind that the one really pressing notational need for NWC (which I LOVE), is a need to notate in tuplets other than 3. I will just keep requesting and crossing my fingers... It really is about the only thing missing that I just can't seem to live without. This is especially true when I am inputting Debussy and the like!

I just had to rant...

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 05-Sep-1999

N-tuplets can be done (with a little work) in version 1.55. Here is how. This example is for a 5-tuplet taking the place of 2 eighth notes.

1) Insert the 5 notes and beam them. Insert text just before the notes, Preserve Width off, and use Staff Italic to insert a "5" with leading spaces so it appears in the right place. Use Print Preview to make sure it will look right in the printout.

2) That was easy. Now we must clean up the mess in the other staves. We have added 3 extra eighth notes, so we must compensate by adding 3/8 rests to the other staves. In my example I have a quarter note below the 5-tuplet, so I stretch it by adding a dotted quarter rest. If there were two eighth notes I would stretch both with dotted eighth rests. Now, select the rest, edit it (Ctrl-E) and set the Vertical Offset property so the rest appears below the staff. Now you can manually white it out on the printout. This will produce a stuccato effect on the playback. You could fix this by tying in notes instead of rests, but there is no way to hide them.

3) That looks OK, but sounds wrong. We are playing 5 notes in the space of 2, so we Insert Tempo before the 5-tuplet, and use a value of 5/2 times the original tempo. In this example the tempo was 80, so the new tempo is 80x5/2 = 200. Put the tempo back to 80 after the 5-tuplet. Turn off the Preserve Width and Display Tempo checkboxes so the tempo does not appear on the printout.

4) If you do Audit Bar Lines, the song will be trashed. This can be fixed by adjusting the Time Signature. We have added 3 eighth notes, so the original 3/4 gets converted to 9/8 (3/4 + 3/8 = 6/8 + 3/8 = 9/8). Do this for each measure in the n-tuplet column, then set the next measure back to 3/4. Of course, this will look wrong in the printout.

This example file can be downloaded using (unfortunately only) Internet Explorer:
http://music.acmecity.com/recording/273/5_nTuplet.nwc

Reply 11 offered by: William Mierisch on 14-Sep-1999

To Blair Dowden's reply:
Thanks, first off. Yep, I've played with all that, and it just never is all that successful, never mind the expenditure of labor for the process. I need something that will look AND sound right, and having mulitple versions just seems like an awful waste. It would seem that if triplets are possible to program in, so, too, would multiples other than 3.
Another triplet related gripe, to keep with my theme, is the fact that importing midi files with triplets NEVER works quite right and requires extensive labor to tweak.
But, as I always say, NoteWorthy is still, in my opinion, ht best bang for the buck you could want...

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-Sep-1999

Importing triplets is a common problem with big band files.

The best work around is to set up a macro with the old Win3.1 recorder that will convert the 16th/8th/16th group to a true 1/8th triplet.

Many NWC users use macros to do all sorts of neat things like clef changes etc.

If you have access to the Scriptorium there is a link to the source of the macro recorder and there is probably a suite of NWC macros on the Scriptorium or elsewhere at this site.

If you have difficulty with this Email me - I may be able to help.

Barry Graham


#1233: trills
trills

(1233)

Submitted by: mrtsl on 22-Aug-1999

How do you insert trills?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Aug-1999

This was just discussed in msg #1209 Click on this link and see.


#1234: GM Instrument Patch for MIDInight Express
GM Instrument Patch for MIDInight Express

(1234)

Submitted by: Jaime Jordan on 22-Aug-1999

I know that thie really has nothing to do with NWC but I figured maybe someone could help me. How do I get the instrument patch so I can use MIDInight express to make MIDI into WAVs... I have the shareware.. and it says to use the program Mellosoftron, btu that is for creating a new patch from scratch.. I don't know how... i just want the patch that corrsponds to GM Midi sounds and is in .prg format.... if anyone has any info it would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!
~Jaime Jordan~

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1999

As it says in the Midnight Express help file, the freeware player comes only with a very basic and "brutally hacked" (their words) collection of wave sounds. The idea is to give you the player for free, then you buy their CD of the actual GM (and GS and XG for that matter) wave samples.

Reply 2 offered by: Jaime Jordan on 22-Aug-1999

I noticed.... well then does anyone know a way to go from MIDI to WAV for a few songs that are between 2:30 and 5:00 in length that won't cost me anything and doesn't require a lot of hoopla? ultimately I am trying to make MP3's for MP3.com

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1999

Well it depends on how good your sound card is. If it's acceptable, simply record the midi or nwc file while it's playing using a wav recorder (this has been discussed extensively in past threads) and then convert to mp3 using any of a number of available mpeg encoders.


#1235: Please Help!
Please Help!

(1235)

Submitted by: Matt Olsen on 22-Aug-1999

Hi, I have a problom. I play guitar, and when Nothworthy transcribes guitar parts it puts them in standard music notation. Is there anyway to get it in TAB notation. PLEASE HELP!!!

Thanks,
-Matt

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1999

In a word, no.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 23-Aug-1999

In more words: go to http://www.guitar-pro.com/
You should be satisfied (as I find it almost as easy as NWC). This shareware (299 FRF/1840 BEF/90 DEM/101 NLG/~49 USD) exists in English, French, German, Spanish, Italian, Dutch and Portuguese, so you should find *your* language, am I wrong?

But I still hope that NWC will do this in a new version (2.x?).

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 24-Aug-1999

Perhaps a bit off the topic, but I note that some programs, such as Midisoft, allow one to print the schematic chord above the music staff (as well as chord name). Would something like this be of interest or of help to any NWC users as a potential Wish List item?

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 offered by: M. R, and K. B. on 08-Jan-2000

So Matt did you end up figuring out your guitar problems? We hope you did!

Reply 6 offered by: skram on 08-Jan-2000

yeah mate.
definitely.
encore and melody assistant and stuff do it.
I reckon noteworthy should do it - make them more kickass.
there are plenty of guitar fret fonts around, users might even be able to edit one of the fonts in noteworthy and set it to the font name, and print out a chart with the characters for certain chords.
but yeah sure, either we do it or noteworthy.
what do you folks have to say 'bout that idea?

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 8 offered by: Raybones on 29-Apr-2000

Hey, Matt forget the tab crap and learn how to read real music notation. I'm sick of guitarists acting like such hardcore musicians but they refuse to actually study music theory...I think they're too scared that they may actually learn something..too much like homework, huh? Do you want to be a robot, or do you actually want to understand what it is your doing musically? I am sometimes embarrassed to call myself a guitarist because of this slack-assed attitude associated with many modern guitar players. Luckily, we have people like John Scofield who are real musicians that happen to play guitar.


#1236: MP3 to MIDI
MP3 to MIDI

(1236)

Submitted by: Matt Olsen on 22-Aug-1999

Is there anyway to change an MP3 to a MIDI file?? PLEASE tell me if there is.

Thanks,
/Matt

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1999

The short answer -- no. The long answer -- there are programs that purport to convert wav files into midi, but the results are, to say the least, unpredictable. (If you want to experiment with this, you'll have to first convert the mp3 back to wav format using an mp3 decoder, or more simply by recording it as a wave whilst playing it on your mp3 player.)

This question seems to come up quite regularly (see earlier threads), and my answer now as always is to use this as a challenge to work on your ear training and transcribing abilities! Have fun.

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 23-Aug-1999

This question recently came up on another NG I frequent, this is one of the answers. I have no experience with this product whatsoever.

"The program is called "WAV2MID" and it costs about £49.95 (Sterling) - so about $70 and you can get it from:

http://www.audioworks.com
"

If anyone wants to give this a go, please post and tell us how well it worked for you.

HTH,

Sue

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 24-Aug-1999

AudioWorks has arleady been discussed. Refer to:
msg #1160
msg #464
msg #585
msg #995

HTH, NWCly yours,
Dominique

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Starfield on 26-Aug-1999

I have tried WAVE2MID and it is sort of OK with simple tunes on single clear instruments (I tried it on the descant recorder and with whisteling) but it is hopeless on anything else. I think that it is expecting too much for a programme of this type to recognise multi instruments.

Reply 5 offered by: Jason Stewart on 04-Aug-2000

Is there any way to convert MIDIs into MP3s

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 07-Aug-2000

Not directly (that I know of). The usual way would be convert the midi file to .wav and then convert the .wav to .mp3. This whole topic is discussed at length in msg #1003.

Reply 7 offered by: Brad on 20-Aug-2000

Is there any way to Convert Mp3 to Mod,XM, or S3M??
Please Reply Thanx

Reply 8 offered by: mASTER on 13-Oct-2000

digital ear

Reply 9 offered by: Computer_ Wizzard on 05-Nov-2000

Well just follow this to convert mp3 to midi

To download the 2 programs mentionned email me and i'll send them to you.

First Launch MP32WAV and convert the mp3 into wave

Next launch sound2mid or wave2mid and convert the wave into midi

simple as that

Computer_Wizzard

.-""""""""-.
/computer \
| wizzard |
|, .-. .-. ,|
| )(__/ \__)( |
|/ /\ \|
(@_ (_ ^^ _) I know it, I know it all
_ ) \_______\__|IIIIII|__/__________________________
(_)@8@8{}<________|-\IIIIII/-|___________________________>
)_/ \ /
(@ `--------`

Reply 10 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Nov-2000

Ah - Computer Wizard - I have been searching for so long for a simple solution to this problem.
I have a short section of mp3 (150Kb) I would like to convert to a midi file.
Would you be willing to convert it for me.
I will post the resulting midi file in the NWC newsgroup so others users can evaluate the effectiveness of your simple method.
Reply here with your email address if you are willing.

Reply 11 offered by: lil pimp 006 on 10-Nov-2000

where do you get wav2mid

Reply 12 offered by: Son Goku on 12-May-2001

Is there any way to convert an mp3 into a midi with a mac? If there is, then please tell me.

Reply 13 offered by: Barry Graham on 13-May-2001

I don't mean to sound flippant but this is the truth.

The only reliable way to convert the mp3 to a midi file with your mac is to play back the file many times and transcribe what you hear by ear.
I'm sorry but this is the only way it can be done (and will be for many years to come).

If you do have a reasonable ear you may find the "Musicians CD Player" useful (download a trial version from
http://www.ronimusic.com ).
It will allow you to record sections of the mp3 for playback in a loop with the option to change pitch and/or speed.

Reply 14 offered by: Bob  on 21-Sep-2001

Is there anyway to change an MP3 to a MIDI file?? PLEASE tell me if there is.

Thanks,
from :Bob

Reply 15 offered by: Grant on 21-Sep-2001

Hey, Bob: have you met Matt? It appears you two have a lot in common.

Reply 16 offered by: Joe Music on 21-Sep-2001

I only know of one reliable way for changing an MP3 file into a MIDI file. Here it is:

(1) Put your MP3 file onto a diskette.
(2) Give the diskeete to someone who is reallly big, really mean, and preferably somewhat drunk.
(3) Have your friend say "This [censored] is a [censored] MIDI file, and if any of you [censored] disagree, I'll [censored] your [censored]."

Reply 17 offered by: noman on 12-Nov-2001

There is a program that will take a mp3, and do all the conversion itself. It is called Widi. (www.widisoft.com)

The demo version doesn't let you save the .mid file, and as said before, the results are unpredictable. You'll have to use nwc to clean up the resulting midi, but most of the notes you want will be there.

At least it got all the important notes I was looking for.

Reply 18 offered by: Steve on 24-Jan-2002

You may want to check out Intelliscore. It converts directly from MP3 to MIDI. It also lets you use your analog instrument or voice as a real-time MIDI controller, like a MIDI guitar but without the special hardware.

You can download a trial version from http://www.intelliscore.net. The trial version will let you save the first 15 seconds of the MIDI file.

Reply 19 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Jan-2002

Steve:

I was a beta tester for Intelliscore Polyphonic.
I regret to say mp3/wav to MIDI still has a long way to go.
Despite my wanting the software to perform I couldn't produce a useable MIDI from any multi-part score no matter what settings I used.

The best tool I have for this purpose is Roni Music's - Musicians CD Player with the mp3 plug in.
This allows you loop a wav/mp3/CD in sections and transcribe what you hear.
It will also transpose/tune the output or slow down/speed up in combination. (Useful when lifting the bass part out of the mud)!
There are several more recent tools there I haven't tried.
http://www.ronimusic.com

Reply 20 offered by: Sakis ok28-Jan-2002 on 27-Jan-2002

Is there anyway to change an MP3 to a MIDI file?? PLEASE tell me if there is.

Thank you!!!
Sakis.

Reply 21 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Jan-2002

This is the third question on this topic with the same wording.

Looks like this is a setup for someone else to answer promoting some commercial software which claims to convert wav to mid but, as usual, fails to deliver.

I have tried them all - they don't work with multi-part scores - end of story.
When they do I will be right in line to use them.
In the meantime aural transciption is the only way.

Reply 22 offered by: JiGG on 30-Jan-2002

one great site to find all freeware tools is www.webattack.com

You'll also find mp32wave and wave2midi progs there.

Reply 23 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 30-Jan-2002

Barry: You may be right about the commerical plugs, but not necessarily. I am told that anything involving M**P**(numeral) is hot on search engines, particular for the ex-N**pst**r crowd. As you know, this forum can be reached directly from a search engine. I suspect that the miscellaneous postings come from outside, in that fashion, by individuals who don't even know what site they are on. Note that they are often from names that do not appear elsewhere in the forum, or in any other context. The threads often go months at a time, without response. The N**Pst**r crowd has no interest in music publishing or composition.

Reply 24 offered by: Grant on 31-Jan-2002

This doesn't explain why three of the messages have exactly the same wording, down to details of capitalization, misspelling ("anyway" rather than "any way") and the double question mark.

It's not likely that 3 people all hit on these details independently, nor is it much more likely that persons 2 and 3 liked person 1's posting so much they just copied it unchanged and signed their names to it. I like Barry's explanation much more than either of these.


#1237: Trills?
Trills?

(1237)

Submitted by: Nick on 22-Aug-1999

I noticed that the example .nwc file, "Moonlite" by Beethoven has very complicated things I want to do, like trills and stuff. I tried copying and pasting the notes onto a new music file, but it didn't work. And the tr~~~~~ was merely just some text. Does anyone know how to do trills easy like in Moonlite without resorting to Multi Point Controller? Cause trills with that when I use it sound awful.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Aug-1999

This file contains hidden staves that actually do the sounding, whereas the staves you see are muted.

See also the reply to the other recent thread on this subject.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 23-Aug-1999

For now, if you don't know how to make "hidden" staves appear, go in "Page setup" window (Alt, F, G), in Contents tab, and uncheck "Hidden" checkbox. Enter, Ctrl-G, 126, and you'll see how trill is *really* implemented in that piece.

HTH,
      Dominique

Reply 3 offered by: Bob Shiffman on 29-Aug-1999

Nick, you have to do trills and ornaments the hard way: written out in notes. This is one instance where I wouldn't want some automatic feature; there are too many stylistic variables. If you have to hide the nuts and bolts, go ahead, you can make a "presentation" staff like the samples. Since I am more interested in the midi output I just leave the raw notes visible.

Reply 4 offered by: jane hamilton on 19-Sep-1999

I want to second Schiffmans' reply for the best results you really should enter the notes yourself (that's what they did in the beginning of printed music) this will give you the most control over the actual sound and if you are having someone else play the music they will not have to guess which period (in music history) your ideas of ornamentation are from for their own performance execution.

Reply 5 offered by: Rick Geibel on 26-Oct-1999

My experience is that wind instruments sound better with pitch bends. Percussion and plucked strings sound better with disrete notes. Bowed strings depend on the effect you want.


#1239: Files Wiped Out!  Help
Files Wiped Out!  Help

(1239)

Submitted by: Joe on 27-Aug-1999

I uninstalled the free on-line (unregistered) version of NoteWorth Composer using the Window NT uninstall utility. And then installed 1.55b which I received in the mail yesterday. When open the .nwc files produced with the unregistered version, the staffs are blank - no notation. Did my old files get wiped out when I uninstalled the unregistered version? They were not stored in the same place on my hard drive. How can I recover these files?

Reply 1 offered by: Chris on 27-Aug-1999

I'm not much of a windows expert, but it seems to me that if you saved them into a folder you created, then they shouldn't have been touched. However, if you saved them into the default folder within the program, or into a folder you created within your main NWC folder, they are probably gone. If you know someone who is a real computer whiz, they may have recovery software to help you out. I'm curious as to why you uninstalled the unregistered version. When I first registered (and for all subsequent upgrades), I've just allowed the new version to overwrite the old. Good luck in finding the files.

Reply 2 offered by: NWC-Support on 27-Aug-1999

It is recommended that you uninstall older versions before doing a full re-install of the program with a newer version.

As for uninstalling, none of your own songs will be removed by the uninstaller. Only files that were installed by the setup program are removed by the uninstaller. Unless you named your files with the same names as the sample songs, your files will still be present (provided something else did not remove them).

See also: msg #1034

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 31-Aug-1999

Joe, could you precise what you mean by : "hen open the .nwc files produced with the unregistered version, the staffs are blank - no notation." ???
this would mean that your file exists, but that NWC cannot open it properly. One thing you could try is closely watching the status bar (the lowest part of the application window) while opening your files.

Otherwise I'm thinking of a problem with
. either the font (which I doubt, since NWC'd tell you), if it could not be uninstalled properly;
. or the default color. To check them :
  1. start NWC.
  2. Create a new score (Ctrl-N, Enter, Enter) or open an existing one (any is ok).
  3. Open the Options window (Tools menu, last item (Alt, T, O)
  4. Go to the Editor tab (leftmost)
  5. If Background and Actives Staff colors are the same, here is your problem. Change the Active staff color for example, and look if this change something (Type Enter to validate, since this is not applied otherwise).

Hope this helps,

Dominique

Reply 4 offered by: Timothy Jarrett on 09-Nov-1999

If Joe's problem is the same as mine, "the staffs are blank - no notation" means that you get a staff (or more than one, depending on the file), but no clef, no notes, no bar lines, nothing. Opening a blank file, manually adding a staff, and attempting to enter a clef or a note had the same end result - nothing was visible.

Holding down the space or enter key to enter a series of rests or notes repeatedly scrolls the screen horizontally but has no other effect.

Reply 5 offered by: Tim Jarrett on 26-Nov-1999

I figured out the problem on my system. Hopefully this will help other NT/Windows 2000 users.

Apparently there is a chance that you may not have sufficient permissions to install fonts properly if you are not logged into your NT/Win2K session with the proper privileges. For me, I had to log in as the administrator of my local computer, even though my domain login had been given administrative rights on my local computer, before I could successfully install the font after uninstalling NWC.

I wonder whether this is an NT-specific issue in general or an issue with the NoteWorthy installer, because this is the only application with which I have had this problem.

Anyway, after logging in as Administrator and performing the install, my font is back and I can compose happily again.


#1240: Is anyone interested in......
Is anyone interested in......

(1240)

Submitted by: Mark Brady on 28-Aug-1999

Helping me arrange my song. I have written a ballad with my 12 string guitar and recorded the vocals in cakewalk. What I need is for someone to create or sequence a drum track and a bass track and maybey a piano. I don't have the foggiest clue as how to sequence even though I have just purchased Noteworthy composer. It will take me months to figure out how to sequence a song with this program. I don't have and midi equipment. For the interested person(s), I will send the song over in whatever format you require, along with the lyrics and a beat sheet with chords. If I use your arrangement ideas, even with live musos, I will send you a copy of the finished CD with your name on the credits of course. I know this is a big ask but for some of you pros out there, this won't take you long and I am so close to having a good song finish.
If you are interested, you can reply to my e-mail as well as this message board. Many thanks

Mark Brady

Reply 1 offered by: Jubal Baca on 01-Sep-1999

Hi Marck:

May be I can help you... I'm a NWC users... Chau...Chau

Jubal

Reply 2 offered by: Derek on 01-Sep-1999

I'll give it a try. Send me the midi & I'll see wot I can do.
PS I play 12 string also!

Reply 3 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 04-Sep-1999

If you would be willing to send it to a beginner, then send it on over to me.

KenJ

Reply 4 offered by: Mark Brady on 04-Sep-1999

Thank you for all your replies. I was overwelmed by the response I got to my request. I have selected one version
of arrangements that some kind person worked on, and am currently recording the song to it. When the song is finished (about a week), you should be able to hear it on mp3.com. Just do a search for Mark Brady, and you should see "Where am I". Thanks all
Mark


#1241: Making The Notes Diffrent From A Bb Instrument To
Making The Notes Diffrent From A Bb Instrument To

(1241)

Submitted by: Billy on 29-Aug-1999

Please Help Me,
Im Trying To Make A Sax Quartet And The Tenor Sax Is In Another Key.
So I Dont Want To Rewrite All Of The Notes,

Please E-mail Me ASAP
BDSax@yahoo.com
Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 29-Aug-1999

There are two ways. On the Tools menu there is a Transpose Staff option that will transpose all the notes on the staff. You have the option of changing the playback to match the notes, or leave the sound as it is but move the notes.

Even easier if you want to change the sound but not the notes is to use the Midi tab of the Staff Properties dialog (F2), and set the Tranposition value.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 31-Aug-1999

Billy,
refer to msg #375 , this would light the way.
Also msg #531 or msg #505 :-)

You can view them easily with the "offline forum" (that's how I found those references) : check http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm

HTH,
Mad


#1242: What do these Dynamic Markings mean?
What do these Dynamic Markings mean?

(1242)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 29-Aug-1999

Can someone tell me the exact meaning of the following dynamic markings not found in Noteworthy Composer?

1) fp (f bigger than p), which I think means play the next note forte, but go back to piano after that.

2) rf and sf (again, the f is bigger). This I can't figure out.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Aug-1999

fp = fortepiano. ("strong - quiet") You're right, it means to play the note with a loud attack, and then fade it off. This is best accomplished using a volume mpc, linear sweep, with a rather sharp decay.

sf = sforzando. ("forcefully") Similar to fp, but with a more gradual (and less extreme) decay. Again, volume mpc's can be used to do this very well.

rf = rinforzando. (re-inforced, accented). Very much like a convention accent (select the note and press > ). That being said, string players are likely to interpret this more like an sf.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Aug-1999

Thank you. Now I have finally been lured into the wonderful world of MPC. The MPC sets the midi volume, while the standard dynamics use velocity. I find it hard to make them match. I am not happy with the dynamic volume defaults - I have to turn the volume on my speakers way up, and get distortion. Is there some was to change the defaults, or do you have the set them on each dynamic. Is there some place that explains all this stuff?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Aug-1999

The volume default is at 127 (full volume) unless changed by:

1: Setting the staff volume in the Staff Properties (F2), midi tab, or

2: Using a volume mpc, or

3: Using a dynamic marking with an override to the default volume.

The last volume set remains in effect until changed again (e.g. changing dynamics without overrides only affects the velocity, not the channel volume).

There have been quite a few messages on the forum on this topic, I'd suggest downloading the offline version and doing a search for "volume", "mpc", and "dynamics".

Welcome to the wonderful world of multipoint controllers. You'll find it's an area full of possibilities, implemented in a way that most other sequencers can only envy.


#1243: MIDI output volume.
MIDI output volume.

(1243)

Submitted by: David Gray on 30-Aug-1999

I have a MIDI electric piano, and like to play Noteworthy songs out to the piano. The trouble is, the volume is always set to maximum (127), regardless of the Staff volume setting. This is frighteningly loud with the piano's volume knob in its "normal" position.

The only way I seem to be able to override it is to put a dynamic marking at the beginning of the score (eg, "p"), but as soon as Noteworthy encounters an "f", it's way too loud again. Of course, I can use the volume knob on the piano, but is there a way to set the general MIDI output volume, either from Noteworthy or Windows?

I have a Creative AWE64 sound card.

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 30-Aug-1999

It is not clear what problem you are having with MIDI volume. MIDI Volume is totally under your control, not set to 127 as stated. You can set the volume from the following places:

- in Staff Properties
- in a Dynamic expression
- in a multi-point controller

If you are unhappy with a volume setting, you should change it in one of these places.

Reply 2 offered by: David Gray on 30-Aug-1999

I am trying to control the volume using the Staff volume setting. But it seems to have no effect on the MIDI output volume. Setting it to any number, even zero, still results in maximum volume output.

Using dynamics in the score works fine. But not the Staff volume.

However, the Staff volume works perfectly well when playing songs via the PC speakers. The problem only occurs when I try to play songs out to the piano.

I am using MIDI channel 16 to send to the piano.

What am I missing here?

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 30-Aug-1999

Maybe your piano doesn't accept the volume control ? Strange...

Reply 4 offered by: NWC-Support on 30-Aug-1999

If your keyboard does not respond to the volume changes sent by NWC, then there is obviously nothing that can be done from the NWC end to resolve this.

However, you might try changing the MIDI velocity settings in a Dynamics marker. Reduce the velocity setting, and see if this helps. It would be very unusual for an external keyboard with synthesizer to ignore both MIDI volume and velocity changes. Surely it will respond to one or the other, if not both.

Reply 5 offered by: David Gray on 30-Aug-1999

The piano does indeed accept volume commands, but only if I put a dynamic marking in the score (eg, "p"). It's just that it completely ignores the Staff Properties volume setting.

If I, for example, set the Staff Properties volume to 40, the song will be played at maximum volume until a dynamic marking in the score (eg, "p") is reached. Whatever Staff Properties volume I use, the output is the same (very loud), until a dynamic marking is reached.

Thanks for your replies. The fact that the piano responds to dynamic markings, but not the Staff Properties volume, made me suspect that it's something within Noteworthy. But clearly this phenomenon is something peculiar to my setup or the way I'm using it, so I'll look further into it this end. Thanks again.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 31-Aug-1999

Did you try to export to a midi file, and run that file (out of NWC)?

Or did you try to set -1 in the midi volume in staff properties? (btw, if you put 64 in the staff properties, and then NO MPC nor Dynamic change it (i.e no MPC on volume, and all dynamics have -1 for midi VOLUME, I'm not talking about veocity), this shoud be correct...

HTH,
Dominique

Reply 7 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 31-Aug-1999

David,

Do you know that the dynamic marking (eg, "p") may change both the volume and the velocity, which are two different midi controls ? This may explain why your keyboard doesn't accept the Staff Properties volume (because it doesn't respond to this controller) but accepts the dynamic (if it changes the velocity).

Reply 8 offered by: David Gray on 31-Aug-1999

Thats it!

Thanks Olivier... it appears that my piano doesn't respond to MIDI volume commands; but it does respond to note velocity commands. Fiddling with the two different overrides in a dynamic expression proves it.

Thanks to everyone who responded.

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Aug-1999

A remote possibility - check that you've got "Local Off" if your keyboard has a switch or menu setting for this. It could be that if local is on, then only the local (on-unit) volume control has any effect.

Reply 10 offered by: David Gray on 01-Sep-1999

The piano doesn't have a "local off" setting. However, I have found that the "multi timbre" setting is the culprit. There are pros and cons for having it set 'on' or 'off', but one effect of turning it 'off' is that the piano no longer responds to MIDI volume commands. The documentation doesn't mention that.

This, coupled with the fact that I had never really grasped the difference between MIDI volume and note velocity, caused my confusion. For anyone who's interested, the piano is a Technics PX224.


#1244: Controller Numbers
Controller Numbers

(1244)

Submitted by: Nathan Noel on 30-Aug-1999

I was wondering if anyone knew the controller numbers so I can select different patches. I have a Sound Blaster 16. Any help would be appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 02-Sep-1999

Instrument patches can be set initially with the Playback Instrument dialog (Staff menu).

Later in the staff, you can modify patches with Insert | Instrument Patch ("I" from the keyboard).

AFAIK, NWC won't let you arbitrarily set controllers, though the Insert | Multipoint Controller
lets you fiddle with volume, tempo, pitchbend, breatcontrol and stereo pan.

If you'd like to tweak other things, send a wish to the Wish List (elsewhere on this site).

Andrew


#1245: What's that percentage in the corner?
What's that percentage in the corner?

(1245)

Submitted by: Joshua Blake on 31-Aug-1999

Does anyone have any idea what the little [1%] is in the staff information box on the status bar means?

It doesn't seem to do very much and only stays between 1% and 4%.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 31-Aug-1999

See msg #945.

Reply 2 offered by: quasi niente on 31-Aug-1999

Wow... it shows how clever you need to be just to get your computer to help you make music!

quasi niente


#1247: hiding a staff
hiding a staff

(1247)

Submitted by: mike on 04-Sep-1999

I've heard that you can hide a staff from view (like in the sample Moonlite--I heard that the trill was just inserted text and the actual trill was played on a hidden staff). How do I do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 04-Sep-1999

On the menu bar, choose "File", "Page Setup", Contents (tab) and click off the box of the staffs you desire to hide.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Sep-1999

If you have one or more hidden staves that you don't want displayed when someone uses NoteWorthy Player, you have to put them into a group named "Hidden". Putting staves in groups also makes it easy to hide/unhide the entire group with one click in the Staff Properties window as described above.


#1248: Spoken words
Spoken words

(1248)

Submitted by: Becky Wilkins on 04-Sep-1999

How can I include rhythmically spoken words, and/or claps or snaps in rhythm? What I need is a way to enter an "x" with a stem. Is this possible?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 05-Sep-1999

Sort of possible, depending on how good it needs to look. You can create the appearance of a rhythm marker using Insert Text, using a Times Roman "|" with a large (18pt) font and a separate bold Arial "x" (10pt). Have fun trying to get them to line up. Then you need to deal with holding the place in the song. You can insert an equivalent rest, place it below the staff, and white it out (by hand). Or you can use a hidden track (visual work on one mute staff, the real playback on another hidden staff).

Here is a small example:
http://music.acmecity.com/recording/273/RhythmMarker.nwc

This would work better if the rhythm marker was a single symbol in a special font.

Reply 2 offered by: jane hamilton on 19-Sep-1999

I use spoken word in many of my pieces and have done so for many years and with many different music software programs and it is always a compromise. Performance practise is such that what works best is to use the center line of your staff notate out the rhythm and insert text about it using the word 'Spoken' or 'whisper' or even more detail. All of the singers I have ever worked with have understood this immediately. When you need to return to sung words insert the word 'sung' or 'sing' and they will do so.
The great thing about this solution is that it is common practise and noteworthycomposer can handle it (meaning it looks correct).


#1249: I don't want my midi stolen!
I don't want my midi stolen!

(1249)

Submitted by: John on 05-Sep-1999

I made a song in NoteWorthy and converted it to a midi file to be played as the embeded background to my web page. Does anyone know of a way I can embed within the midi file something that would not allow someone to download the midi and print out the sheet music through NoteWorthy?

If anyone has any suggestions please post here or email me privately at jpb@stny.rr.com

Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Sep-1999

I believe that Crescendo (the version you have to pay for) allows this option. However, it still has to get into your computer, and anyone who's not averse to poking around in the browser's cache directory will be able to find it no problem. (I know, I've done it!)

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 06-Sep-1999

If all you're worried about is someone *printing* your work,
why not "adjust" some of the the notes so the translation
from MIDI back to NWC looks really horrible, but sounds the
same. A few really bizzare time changes (1/4 with lots of
bar lines is a rather arresting sight :-), key changes,
double dotted notes and odd length rests should do the
trick. Anyone with enough patience could edit it back to
presentability, but at least you've made them work for it.
Don't forget to give people a way to contact you to request
a copy if they really want one.

Reply 3 offered by: Guenter Nagler on 23-Sep-1999

that it is not stolen can only be prevented by not distributing the file.
To prevent from displaying or printing score or from editing
notes there is a midi crypt utility at http://www.hitsquad.com/smm/programs/SMF_crypt/

it can be played with normal player but notes are modified
and corrected with pitchbend, all notes different and encoded method with a key that it can't be decoded back without knowing exact method. If trying to edit/display/print then should get nonsense notes.

Guenter

Reply 4 offered by: Michael Hewison on 26-Sep-1999

A midi file on your web page will only sound as good as the sound card the in the machine of the person listening to it.
The sound you hear is produced by your sound card. Why not record your song as a wave file and put that into your Web Page. That way they can hear it as you hear it and they can't rip off your midi file (.wav is an analogue file of sorts).

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Sep-1999

Wav files are extremely large, and therefore not suitable for most internet applications, except for very short (a few seconds) snippets. Various compression schemes are in use, ranging from RealAudio to MPEG with at least a couple other formats. The most popular at this time seems to be MPEG mp3. Even then, figure on about 1 megabyte per minute for reasonable-sounding performances.


#1250: Midi tempering program
Midi tempering program

(1250)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Sep-1999

I've just uploaded to the newsgroup a beta version of a program to temper midi files according to pre-defined or custom-made scale tempers. It's actually an adjunct to my "Harmonic Analyser", and all are invited to participate in beta-testing the program.

If you want the program and don't have access to the newsgroup, email me.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 08-Sep-1999

Fred,
It'd be nice to have it. Just one question (but I think I know the answer since Midi doesn't make the difference): is C# the same note as D flat ? In the same score I mean.
But at least we're not really able to set key signatures to *real* tempers, not only "tempered". Violonists will appreciate!

Marsu

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Sep-1999

Yes. For tempers that have different values for the two enharmonics, you have to decide which one you want it to use. (Usually, a given piece will have one or the other, seldom both.)

Prog's on its way!

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 08-Sep-1999

I have another question. How do you deal with chords ? Maybe with several channels, but then can you have several instruments playing together ?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 08-Sep-1999

You can have one, but not both. (I.e. multiple instruments/ no chords, or single instruments with chords). A "sequel" is in process for piano/harpsichord music (for example), which splits each tone to its own channel. Stay tuned! ;-)

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Sep-1999

The "sequel" (called "Piano-Tuner") is in beta, you can download it (and also the other harmonic and tempering utilities) at:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/midiutil.htm

Try out Piano-Tuner on NoteWorthy's "moonlite.nwc". Fascinating.


#1251: Using PGMusic's Band-In-A-Box for harmonization
Using PGMusic's Band-In-A-Box for harmonization

(1251)

Submitted by: Joel L. Cress on 07-Sep-1999

I just "discovered" this great notation tool the other day. Only a couple of uses and I was sold! Why not for $39? This will be a great tool for publishing for copyright -- my sole intention for this product.

I use PGMusic's Band-In-A-Box for all music development and performance (see http://www.pgmusic.com). I consider this software to be one of the great accomplishments of creativity to be implemented in software. If you aren't aware of their latest improvements, it is definitely worth your time to investigate!

Are there any other users of Band-In-A-Box that also use NWC? Specifically, has anyone used BiaB to add SATB, or to generated vocal/piano arrangements? I would think that importing MIDI files from BiaB, following certain procedures (styles, harmonies or the like in BiaB) would be an outstanding time saver in NWC!

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 07-Sep-1999

One problem you may find with importing harmonies is that BIAB generally use the top three voices for the basic triad and places the added notes (6ths and 7ths) in the 4th or lower voices.

You end up with a lot of crossing in the lower parts involving quite a bit of cut and paste.
Apart from that it works well.

I limit BIAB to solos to fill out big band arrangements, the occasional piano backing under solos (but a bit mechanical).
I prefer to write bass and drum parts myself.

Reply 2 offered by: Joel L. Cress on 23-Sep-1999

In fact, I have been successful using NoteWorthy Composer and Band-In-A-Box to generate an arrangement that I felt was adequate to register for copyright. To hear a MIDI version of the song, access:
http://www.homestead.com/cressjj
The Music Related page has a NoteWorthy Composer section, where I show the first page of the orchestration score: melody, piano and bass. I also discuss how I used Band-In-A-Box and NoteWorthy Composer together. The entire process is quite enjoyable and very satisfing!

Reply 3 offered by: Joel L. Cress on 23-Sep-1999

That site is supposed to be:
http://www.homestead.com/cressjja
I apologize for the multiple posts.

Reply 4 offered by: bil on 03-May-2001

hi gang!

i have been trying for 16 hrs to get biab 8 to work on my g4. i am losing my mind!! i down loaded midi mngr.like they told me,-but no-not a peep.it just will not talk to my jv1010 through my fast lane motu face. pleeease help.

bil.


#1252: Some Essential Copyright Information
Some Essential Copyright Information

(1252)

Submitted by: Joel Cress on 07-Sep-1999

This message is posted as a reply to another query on down the list, but I felt that this information is important enough to merit a new discussion.

Who owns the right to an arrangement? Any arrangement (called "derivative work"), as well as public performance (except for few exceptions, such as performance during worship services) rests with the copyright holder. You must have permission or pay royalty for the right to reproduce the work by any means. Be careful here, for as little as one measure of a copyrighted work has been protected by U.S. courts for infringement. The "Happy Birthday To You" song is a good example of a song that has been aggressively protected (can you believe it?) by the copyright owner.

Concerning copyright protection: you must register a work with the U.S. copyright office if you want to pursue litigation in the U.S. court system; however, "common law" copyright is still accepted for establishing the date of creation. Unfortunately, the time of copyright ownership for any piece of work begins at creation, not upon filing it with the copyright office. However, if you are simply wanting to register your work and there is no fear of infringement in the works, then who needs to know?

Finally, there are several replies concerning international differences in copyright law. This no longer applies based on an international copyright law treaty that has been accepted this decade by most industrialized nations. If you register your work with your copyright office, then that copyright is internationally recognized. One drawback of the international copyright treaty that caused the U.S. to balk for a while, is that the copyrighted work does not need to be clearly marked (or marked at all) for an owner to pursue infringement litigation. A copyright infringer is defenseless in this case (guilty until proven innocent).

Notice that Hal Leonard publishing has recently been pursuing litigation against MIDI sites where the system administrators have unknowingly posted uploads of copyrighted MIDI files, even when the copyright information has been removed from the file itself. Be carful!


#1253: Tenor to bass clef
Tenor to bass clef

(1253)

Submitted by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 07-Sep-1999

I know that there's been a lot of replies to this one before, but none of them seems clear enough for me:

The exact step by step recipy to change a A-flat major Trombone staff written in tenor clef to similar sounding bass clef

Changing clefs are easy, moving up and down the same, but what the heck with the key???

The best (in my opinion) would be a table telling:

Step one: Copy the entire staff (incl. clef sign) to a new staff (added with ctrl-a)

Step two: Change clef by selecting and ctrl-e to change

Step three: Transpose staff according to before mentioned table, up or down n semitones. Key should now be changed automatically

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 08-Sep-1999

To change clef:

Start by forcing accidentals across the whole stave
Next delete the old clef and key and insert the new one (and key).
Now select the entire stave and shift it up or down to the correct location for the new stave using CTRL/UP or DOWN
Finally audit accidentals to remove redundancies.

(note that you may end up with the wrong enharmonic
spellings for some notes - this is one thing I don't like
in NWC - for example, in D minor, all the C#'s may end up
being written as Db Yuk! Maybe one day NWC will fix this
- hint hint).

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 08-Sep-1999

Why bother with accidentals ? When you change clef and don't change key signature, the accidentals don't change.

(optional) step one: copy the entire staff

step two: change clef by selecting and ctrl-e

step three: select the entire staff and shift up or down to the correct location, using ctrl-up or ctrl-down

Reply 3 offered by: Erling Andreassen, Norway on 09-Sep-1999

Thanks to you both, so far so good. But how about the before mentioned table? How many steps up/down between the different clefs?

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 09-Sep-1999

Look at the first note of the line, and the last sharp or flat of the key signature on the clef. The relationship should be the same on the new clef.

Say you're converting a song in D (2 sharps) from one _very wierd_ clef to another. The second sharp is on a "C" line or space -- say the third space from the bottom of the original staff. Say the first note is on the second line from the bottom (three steps down).

So: put the key signature into your new even wierder staff, and see where the second sharp appears (say, top line). Paste your notes in, and simply shift them up or down until the first note is three steps down from the sharp (in this case, the third space from the bottom.) You might have to shift a whole octave (7 steps) up or down also, to get the notes back near the center of the staff....

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Sep-1999

Sure hope this works...

-----------------------------------------------------------------
| FROM: TO:> | TREBLE | ALTO | TENOR | BASS |
| \/ | - - - - - - - | - - - - -- - | - - - - - - | - - - - --|
| TREBLE ---> | --- | up 6 | up 8 | up 12 |
| ALTO ---> | down 6 | --- | up 2 | up 6 |
| TENOR ---> | down 8 | down 2 | --- | up 4 |
| BASS ---> | down 12 | down 6 | down 4 | --- |
-----------------------------------------------------------------


#1254: Im not sure, But I could use some help.
Im not sure, But I could use some help.

(1254)

Submitted by: Joseph Richmond on 08-Sep-1999

I have searched the database, alibet quickly, but have found nothing on my subject. My question is simple. I need to find a way to Encode .wav files as Midi files. The reason is this, I am in the process of creating a site for the Disemination of Art, Literature and MUSIC. However, the sever I wish to go with, "Will not support .mp3 files". In all other respects the server is excellent, and has superb pings, reputation, etc. A 7 min, 20 sec .wave file is 75MB and is thus unsuitable. Midi files, being as widespread and common as they are, seem the next best choice to .mp3 files. I have considerd Skins, but do not want to mess with such an ( In my opinion ) and obscure format. Of course, I am not that knowlegable about computers and this is why I am making this post. I am only hoping this is an open forum for all, otherwise, I may very well have stepped on my ba***. Thank you for your time and consideration.

Sincerly,

Joseph Richmond

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Sep-1999

Hi Joseph,

Yes, your question has been posed before; the upshot of it is that while there are programs that purport to convert wav to midi, they only work with very simple sounds - i.e. little or no polyphony, and only harmonically pure sounds like flutes, whistles, etc.

For recorded music, mp3 is the medium of choice for publishing on the internet at this time. Why won't your ISP allow mp3's? If it's because of the (admittedly very real) concern about piracy, perhaps you could explain to them what you are doing and why... perhaps they could make an exception if convinced that anything you post will be fully and completely free of copyright infringments.

Failing that, I'd suggest getting NoteWorthy Composer and creating your own midi files!

Reply 2 offered by: Joseph Richmond on 08-Sep-1999

First off I want to thank anybody and everybody for any help that has been and will be proffered. :)
I believe that I should make several things clear. I have sent several emails to the webmaster at the server, but have yet to recieve a response. It is stated in the posted acceptable use policy that any account with .mp3 files in it will be deleted because they do not want the accounts to become storage areas. I had not thought of piracy, how would you pirate .mp3 files? Hmmmm. Makes you wonder if RealPlayer G2's copy to disk option as files.
As for music In general *humbly* I am a rank novice. I found a utility that when given a set of parameters will generate random music, but, the results are at best eirie and at worst downright wierd. As for getting noteworthy... Hmmm... I only want to convert existing music to compression format that is acceptable for most servers.
Making my own music *snickers* It would be worse than the stuff created by my random generator, but why not? Im always trying to learn stuff anyway.

Oh, yes. If you would like a forum to post your work, I would be glad to do so on my site. submit any files to my email address, Fineview@Localnet.com. Dont forget to add information about the author, so I can credit its creator.
As well as any other information that is applicable ( Ie:links to YOUR site, your email address if you want, etc. )

Thak you once again for your time and consideration in this matter, and I will seriously consider that app...

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 09-Sep-1999

Joseph,

Perhaps it would help if you understood *why* there is
a difference in size between WAV format and MIDI and why it
is difficult to convert WAV into MIDI.

First, WAV format is (as the name suggests) a digital
representation of the actual sound waves which comprise
the sound. Imagine measuing the amplitude of the sound
wave lots of times. Each sample is either 8 or 16 bits and
the samples are taken at 8KHz, 11KHz, 22KHz or 44KHz (KHz
is thousands per second). So, at the lowest resolution (8 bits) and lowest frequency (8KHz) you need to store 8000x8
bits per second or around 480KB / minute. At the highest
it's 16x44000 or a bit over 10MB/minute.

MIDI is a completely different method for storing sounds.
Instead of saving the wave form, it stores the "notes" as
if played by a musician. Since it only takes a few bytes to
say "play middle C for 10 seconds", MIDI tends to be
significantly more compact than WAV format.

NWC format describes the notes too, so converting between
MIDI and NWC formats is possible in both directions.
Converting MIDI to WAV is quite easy too, just "play" the
MIDI file and record the WAV data just like any other sound
source. Going in the other direction isn't quite so easy.
The software would have to be able to pick out each "voice"
and figure out a sequence of notes which would reproduce
the sound. Some would say that for even moderately complex
sounds, this task is all but impossible, or would involve
a representation that is so complex you would not gain
much in space.

As has been mentioned, there *are* programs which are
claimed to be able to convert WAV files into MIDI, but
most of the comments I've seen are that they are dissapointing.

MP3, on the other hand, is a method of compressing WAV like
data to reduce the amount of storage. It relies on two
things, first, the data streams tend to be reasonably
predictable and may be sparse (that is, contain long
repetitive sections). Second, the psychology of perceiving
sounds involves the brain focusing on only some parts of the
actual wave form. MP3 algorithms can identify the important
bits and supress the unimportant bits, thus saving space
without changing the sound enough for most people to
notice (though it would probably look very different on
an oscilloscope)

The connection between piracy and MP3 is very real. Consider
that a CD containing an hour of music in stereo 16 bit 22KHz
in WAV like format takes up 600MB. Storing that on a server
and/or copying it across a network would be prohibitively
expensive, so there is little incentive for anyone to do it.
On the other hand, if the same hour of music could be stored
in (say) 6MB or even 60MB, the whole picture changes
drammatically. Suddenly it's feasible for you to pirate the
tracks from the latest CD or even the whole thing and make
it available to the world at large via the web. I don't
know the exact compression ratio, but I've seen claims of
70 hours of music on a 4GB disk from reliable sources.

Naturally the record companies are terrified of MP3 and are
doing their best to stamp it out. For example, intimidating
ISPs to refuse to store MP3 format files under threat of
copyright infringement lawsuits.

What they *should* be doing is actually *exploiting* the
new format and cashing in on it, but that's another story...

Reply 4 offered by: Joseph Richmond on 09-Sep-1999

^_^ Yes I do understand the difference between .wav and .mid files and I had the felling this would happen.
*sigh* I am going to have to rethink the way Im doing this.
Thank you all for your time and consideration in this matter.

Reply 5 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 09-Sep-1999

I am just beginning research on this subject, myself. MY angle, however, is checking out all the info on WAV file compression. There seems to be a lot of info out. How about YOU working that angle as well. Finding software that will compress WAV files without too much loss. I've seen ratios of 10:1 and 30:1 given. I am only in the preliminary stage, and have not tried any sofware as of yet.

KenJ

Reply 6 offered by: NWC-Support on 09-Sep-1999

See also:
- msg #1236
- msg #464
- msg #585
- msg #715
- msg #995

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 09-Sep-1999

If your server doesn't accept MP3s, for the reasons Fred mentions, maybe the VQF is accepted, since less known. It is of beeter quality than MP3, but less programs do read it (though there is a plug-in for win-Amp, for instance). It's so good in fact that I believe it's the base of the MP4 format (which keeps track, also, of who creates the file and so on, allowing editors to track piracy).
You'll find details on http://www.vqf.com/faq.php3 with everything you need to try yourself.
mainly, it's of higher quality for a smaller size, but needs more % CPU to be read (30% instead of 15-20% for example, depending on your CPU).

HTH, but take care about copyrights. Look at what happened to www.lyrics.ch!!! You may want to honour a singer or any artist, if (s)he doesn't agree with publishing the lyrics or extracts, you'll be against the law!
Long life to your site anyway :)

Reply 8 offered by: Joseph Richmond on 09-Sep-1999

Hmm. .wav file compression would be nice, I have seen that some limited compression was included with win98. As for Obscure fomrats, it is only obscure now. I could offer a player ( Or links to such on my page ). The music that I am offering is from cd ^_^, in specific, it is classical music. As a matter of fact, since I am activly seeking outside sources of info, I have been VERY carefull to document any and all sources and give credit where it is due. I do not mean anything mean or malicous or Illegal, I simply want to distribute such material. I will look into and seriously consider the suggested options. Once agian I want to thank everybody for their time, effort, consideration and enthusiasim in this matter.

Humbly yours,

Joseph Richomnd

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Sep-1999

-------------------------------------------------------
| FROM: TO:> | TREBLE | ALTO | TENOR | BASS |
| \/ | - - - - | - - - - | - - - - | - - - - |
| TREBLE ---> | --- | up 6 | up 8 | up 12 |
| ALTO ---> | down 6 | --- | up 2 | up 6 |
| TENOR ---> | down 8 | down 2 | --- | up 4 |
| BASS ---> | down 12 | down 6 | down 4 | --- |
-------------------------------------------------------

For additional octaves, add or subtract 7 as required.

HTH :-)

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Sep-1999

Oops... forgot that the Forum is html, therefore in proportional fonts on most browsers. Select the table with your mouse, CNTL C to copy to clipboard, then open NotePad, WordPad or PFE (or other text editor using proportional fonts) and open a new file, CNTL V to paste.

Fred

Reply 11 offered by: Joseph Richmond on 09-Sep-1999

I have not idea what that was ^_^. Was it meant for me? Well anyway, I have been looking at both .wav compression ( Which as far as I can tell, bites. ) and .VQF compresion, ( But I forgot to get a player. ). I think I will try the .VQF, I will just have to add a link to a player.

Reply 12 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Sep-1999

Oops again. (I'm on a roll...) This should have gone into the "Tenor clef" thread. Sorry about that.

F

Reply 13 offered by: Peter Vasey on 10-Sep-1999

Joseph, it seems that the root of your problem is not converting wave to MIDI, but rather that your server won't accept mp3 files. What about disguising them by creating a self extracting .exe file with Winzip or similar compression utility. All your recipient needs to do is run the .exe file to retrieve the mp3. Your server will not know you're posting music unless he checks the .exe (or you tell him!). Just a thought, Peter.

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 10-Sep-1999

If you're planning on posting classical music you got from CD, keep in mind that the *performances* are probably still under copyright even if the performed material is in the public domain. This is one very excellent reason for making your own MIDI or NWC files, since these are *your* performances and therefore you own the copyright.

Reply 15 offered by: Joseph Richmond on 10-Sep-1999

I was hopeing for suitible compression so that the music could be drawn from the server and played that way. As for not telling, I tend to shy away from lying or withholding information. My own preformances? I realy would have not clue how to do so. I am no musician. I do understand, however, what you are saying about 'preformances'. I did not know this, but it is probably better that this was addressed. As for the root of the problem... Yes, that is correct. The .mid format seemed the best choice, and may still be. Still, knowing what I do now, I have to seriously
rethink my strategy.

Humbly Yours,

Joseph Richmond

Reply 16 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Sep-1999

The difficulty with streaming audio (as it's called when you "play while downloading") is that you either accomodate those with fast modem connections (e.g. cablemodem, T1) and offer high-quality files like mp3, or you accomodate those unfortunates amongst us (at this time probably still the majority) that rely on conventional phone lines, and settle for much lower quality (e.g. "RealAudio").

The other aspect is required system resources. I at first offered mp2 audio on my website, to accomodate those with lesser machines than Pentium. Since then I've found an mp3 player that will run adequately if not superbly on as little as 486DX2-66, so have replaced with mp3... albeit still somewhat hesitantly.

Reply 17 offered by: Joseph Richmond on 11-Sep-1999

http://www.spaceports.com/
It has occured to me, that my base problem is with the provider itself. If I was to find a different provider, I would not have this problem. Granted, I appreciate the help in finding the best audio format for my site... But it may be better if I just find a different providor. *sighs* And it was so good too. The link above is to the homepage for the providor I wish to go with. As for streaming, what about .asf files?( Audio Streaming Format ) It is decent quality, proven track record and high compatiblity? Once again, thank you for your time, consideration and enthusiasm.

Ever your Humble servant,

Joseph Richmond

Reply 18 offered by: Sue Morton on 11-Sep-1999

Hello Joseph,

I do believe your other main problem, besides your provider, is the fact that you cannot *legally* rip your music CD's and post the songs without express WRITTEN permission from the Publisher, Copyright holders, etc.

I have wanted to put some of the songs I sing in church onto a web site to share with other christians looking for songs for worship.

For those songs where we have purchased the printed scores, and performed the music live, those recordings are fine as we "own" the performance. (Assuming the printed material we purchased gives that permission, many do but you still have to be careful. Some purely allow live performance but no recording for any sort of "distribution", even free.)

However, I have also purchased several songbooks and accompaniment CD's/tapes, and have sung these in church as well. I cannot put recordings of these onto my web site as permission is extended only to live performance using these materials. So even though I "performed" the song, because I used the CD/Tape in the performance I must get written permission to post these to the web.

Actually, the same thing could be true of MIDI files you sequence, if the printed material does not give permission to "distribute" your performance. Of course, much classical is in the public domain, as already mentioned, and so this wouldn't apply. But someone's ARRANGEMENT of the music might be protected... ah, it can get complicated.

See WWW.PRS.NET -- The Classical Music (MIDI) Archives. Wonderful music available for downloading there. Perhaps you might put links on your page to this source...

Good Luck!

Sue

Reply 19 offered by: Joseph Richmond on 11-Sep-1999

The Basic Beethoven -- Disc 2 - Ludwig Van Beethoven (Simon Addison & The English Philharmonic Orchestra) - Symphony No. 5 in C Minor Op. 67 -- Allegro con brio .
That is the only classical song on the site. The other music is misc. stuff.
Heh. Maybe I should cut music alltoghether? The chances, in reality, that I would be prosected are slim, though the grounds would exist. It is like a tape. You are not supposed to copy, but you do anyway, and only use it for personal use. You dont get sent to jail, but it is illegal.
Hmmm. I will keep in mind what I have been told.

Humbly Yours,

Joseph Richmond

P.s. : If you are looking to post "Origional Prefromances" I would be happy to do so. :)

Reply 20 offered by: marsu on 13-Sep-1999

Well, when you say "It is like a tape. You are not supposed to copy, but you do anyway, and only use it for personal use. You dont get sent to jail, but it is illegal.", I can't read it without this thought: on some tapes (or any material) you *may* make a *single* copy for your *own* usage. Et encore, I can't use photocopies of scores I bought, in concerts: I do have to use the original.

But displaying copies on a web site means copying for anyone, so you're breaking the law.

on another reply: "What about (...) creating a self extracting .exe file" : you put away all Unix+Mac+Amiga+other users. Unless you plan to put .gz, .sit, and so on.

To Sue: where's your site? :)

Reply 21 offered by: Sue Morton on 13-Sep-1999

Hi MAD Marsu,

Thanks for asking about the web site! Sorry to report, it's not up (for now), for just the reasons being discussed here. We (the church) are very concerned about copyright. If/when it comes back, I'll let you know! :>

If I may make a brief (unsolicited and uncompensated) plug for a web site of original christian music, see my friends' site: http://songsofpraise.org

Contemporary up-beat praise style, completely free for worship and personal use, CCLI registered but no fees requested. Many of these are very very nice, I have sung several in my church. (If you want to hear yours truly singing one of them, see
http://www.mp3.com/artists/22/songs_of_praise.html
and look for the song "I Praise You, My Father". I can use all the fans I can get! :>) )

Nice folk, my internet friends from Texas!

Sue

Reply 22 offered by: Gordon Fry on 31-Jan-2002

I am trying to burn MID files to CD using my PC software and it is not compatible. Does anyone know how I can convert MID files to WAV??? Or know software that can be used with my CD burner?? I have Roxio Project Selector software. Any help would be appreciated. If you can please email me at fryg63@yahoo.com, thanks Gordie

Reply 23 offered by: Grant on 31-Jan-2002

There's been a lot of discussion about this issue on the online forum. For example, you might want to look at msg #2219.

If you don't find what you need there, you might want to do your own search. Just click on the "Search Messages" link at the top of this page.

HTH


#1256: Playing songs through the PC's speaker...
Playing songs through the PC's speaker...

(1256)

Submitted by: Paul on 10-Sep-1999

Does anyone know of a program that is capable of allowing NWC files to be heard/played through a PC's speaker?

I have a laptop that I have loaded NWC onto that has no soundcard installed. I am able to hear Windows sounds through the PC speaker however I don't seem to be able to enable anything within Windows that alows NWC to do the same.

I can therefore only assume that I need a third-party program that can do this.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

BTW I'm using Windows 3.11 so it has to be 16 bit.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC-Support on 10-Sep-1999

See msg #930

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP


#1257: Metafile Output
Metafile Output

(1257)

Submitted by: Barry Graham on 15-Sep-1999

I recently upgraded from Coreldraw4 to Coreldraw 5.
(I know I'm way behind but this version was dirt cheap - less then $20US and I'm mean ).

In the past the metafiles I exported from the NWC print preview copy where distorted (notes displaced vertically - ties appearing as filled ellipses) making the use of Coreldraw impractical.

I'm happy to say CD 5 handles NWC metafiles quite well.
Now I can add marks from the CD music symbol library, make my own and use stretchable dynamic hairpin symbols.

Saves a lot of time adding marks as text and fiddling with their alignment.

I'm sure other users have used Coreldraw to enhance NWC scores but I thuoght I'd pass this on if your seriously producing performance parts.

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 15-Sep-1999

You intrigue me.

I'm looking for a cheap way of creating _portable_ metafiles (for web access) from NWC scores. What formats does CD5 create?

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-Sep-1999

NWC already creates placeable metafiles from copy in the print preview and the copy special option in the editor.

Coreldraw has comprehensive import/export and conversion on output that handles most graphic formats.

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 16-Sep-1999

Stephen,

>I'm looking for a cheap way of creating _portable_ >metafiles (for web access) from NWC scores.

I'm not sure if this is what you mean. There's a rather
good freeware utility called "IrfanView" which seems to
be able to convert just about any graphic format into
anything else. The home page is http://stud1.tuwien.ac.at/~e9227474/

I tried reading a WMF file from NWC, there was no apparent
distortion or displacements and I was able to convert it
into GIF and JPG formats, again with no apparent
distortions. Since it's not a picture editor, it won't let
you modify anything. Obviously once the score is in GIF
or JPG format, you won't be able to get it back into NWC.

Even if this isn't what you're after, have a look at this
utility, it's really very good, and the price is right :-)

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 16-Sep-1999

Stephen,

If you plan to give a web access to scores, don't forget that proprietary formats are not portable to non microsoft viewers. If you really want portability, use JPEG or GIF, maybe PostScript or PDF, but I don't think that other formats can be understood by unix systems, for example.

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 16-Sep-1999

Thanks, all.

>don't forget that proprietary formats are not portable to non microsoft viewers. If you really want portability, use JPEG or GIF, maybe PostScript or PDF.

I don't. I really want. And I use a non-M$ viewer. (I briefly used an earlier M$ viewer (back when they called it a "browser". I got tired of the documentation lying about what it would do. I used to use a M$ editor. I got tired of them changing file formats on me. I say, come da revolution, there gonna be a real rope shortage in Redmond.)

I know that MS-Wind metafiles are not portable, and Adobe metafiles are (but their generators are expensive.) I don't know about other possibilities.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Sep-1999

> I know that MS-Wind metafiles are not portable, and Adobe
> metafiles are (but their generators are expensive.) I
> don't know about other possibilities.

I use PostScript. Full platform compatibility, there's a great (and completely free) viewer/ manipulator (Ghostscript/ GSview), the writer is probably already on your system (Applewriter printer driver on FILE) and it can include any desired objects, metafiles, fonts, etc.

I have an info page on GSview at my site at:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/gsinfo.htm

Reply 7 offered by: Steve Pearson on 17-Sep-1999

Just wanted to add that Fred led me to Ghostview. Very good utility.

Because of my (real)work, I also use Acrobat 4.0 (the full version). Offers a lot of the features I see folks occasionally want such as adding text, longer titles, etc. Essentially you can insert text, sound clips, pencil sketchings, whatever else you want. Can also edit the text and materials already on the pdf page. The program can be obtained fairly economically on the net through ebay (although I expect there is probably some freeware or shareware that will do the same thing).

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Sep-1999

... and I in turn was turned on to Ghostscript by marsu, for which I'm forever grateful. I should add that GSview does _not_ allow such insertions as Steve mentioned, though I have had some success in importing entire pages (e.g. score title pages) into PS files generated out of NWC using another lovely free program called PFE (Programmer's File Editor), which happily handles very large text files.

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 17-Sep-1999

Thanks again. I've installed ghostscript, and it looks as you say: it should do everything that I need. I have a postscript printer installed, and have created PostScript files to test the procedure, _but_:

When I print to my (HP6) PostScript printer from Netscape Navigator, I get a "Print to file" checkbox.

When I print to the same from Noteworthy Composer, I get no such checkbox. Huh?

The checkbox appears/vanishes similarly on a native HP6 printer driver, so it's not something squirrelly in this printer driver installation

One possible caveat: my registered copy of NWC is not on another machine, so I downloaded an evaluation copy for this testing. Is this a limitation of the evaluation copy? (If so, I can just swap software around a bit.)

Reply 10 offered by: Fred on 17-Sep-1999

Hmm.. maybe it has to do with the unregistered copy, but I rather think not. Check the Properties of your "virtual printer", in the "Details" tab (assuming Win95) it should say "Print to following port": this should be "FILE (Creates a file on disk)". Sending output to this printer should behave just like sending to a "real" printer, except that the output is diverted to a disk file.

btw - Some apps (e.g. ms word) don't let you specify a .ps extension. You have to use the default .prn extension, then rename it later.

Another caveat: in the "PostScript" tab, set PostScript output tab to "Optimize for speed." If you set it to "Optimize for portability (ADSC)" your PS files will end up about 3-5 times as big, with no advantage to offset their mammoth size.

Last tip of the day: if you're publishing your PS files, I suggest compressing them using either PKzip (Winzip) or gzip. (You'll typically get a 5-8 times reduction in size.) The advantage to gzip is that your audience won't even have to unpack them, GSview will decompress them on the fly.

Reply 11 offered by: Steve Pearson on 22-Sep-1999

This was posted in the newsgroup, but thought I would post it here as well in case it is of help.

At least in Adobe Acrobat 4.0, I have discovered a utility called the Distiller which automatically converts the nwc files into pdf without the hassles and need to create, paste and convert metafiles. I just select the "distiller" printer, and it creates the new pdf file neat as a pin.

Not sure if the other Adobe Products have similar utilites, but folks could check.


#1259: recording taped songs on to CD.
recording taped songs on to CD.

(1259)

Submitted by: Roland LANIEL on 17-Sep-1999

Fred suggested that you could record taped music (I am here talking about taped songs such as you can hear on the radio) and transfom it into wav files recordable on to a CD.
I am not sure I understood rightly. I tried but failed miserably.
Would Fred or some one else be more explicit ?
If it is impossible just say so ! Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 17-Sep-1999

Hi Roland,

I have created WAV's out of cassette material this way: I have run a line from the stereo out (headphone out) of the cassette deck to the line in on the sound card.

I play back the cassette and record it with Cool Edit (one of many wav recorders available). Now I have a WAV file of whatever was played back from cassette. (Usually it needs a little cleanup. There are pop/hiss remover programs available for this.)

From there, you can take the WAVs through a CD burner program. Or make MP3 files out of them, or whatever.

This same process can be used to create CD's from your favorite vinyl.

HTH,

Sue

Reply 2 offered by: Roland LANIEL on 18-Sep-1999

The sound volume is very very low and I can't increase it. Any idea why not ? Thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Sep-1999

1: Bad cable? Wrong cable? (must be 3.5mm = 1/8" _stereo_ plug to go into sound card).

2: Low output level from source? If so, try the sound card's mic input (carefully!)

3: Line input volume and/or master volume set too low in sound card's mixer applet? (or Win95's volume control applet).

4: (depending on sound card) - analog audio jumper setting?
Some sound cards share the line input with the CD input.

Reply 4 offered by: Roland LANIEL on 18-Sep-1999

Thank you Fred. Always full of good advice. I'll check everything I can.Merci

Reply 5 offered by: Roland LANIEL on 19-Sep-1999

Thank you to Sue and Fred. Right cable, right every thing but wrong connexion : "mike" not "line in."

Reply 6 offered by: MO on 09-Dec-1999

I downloaded cool edit and i tried to do this but the cassette was playing but i couldn't record it... If anyone can provide some help it would be greatly remembered.

Reply 7 offered by: john thompson on 13-Jan-2000

Remember that to set your recording volume, do this:

1. double click on the speaker icon in the system tray in the lower right of your screen
2. from the Volume Control menu choose "options", "properties"
3. in the "Adjust volume for..." window, choose "Recording"
4. in the lower window that says "Show the following volume controls:", check all the controls
5. click Ok and then select or unmute one recording source at a time until the recorder starts


#1260: blank spaces for unmeasured piano music
blank spaces for unmeasured piano music

(1260)

Submitted by: jane hamilton on 19-Sep-1999

I was trying to transcribe (for a student who just broke his little finger on his right hand) Mompou's 6th prelude (which is for left hand alone). The music is without barlines and travels [as most one-handed pieces do] from one staff to the other.
The original music is printed without rests in the quiet staff, which makes sense as there is only one 'performer' the left hand. However I couldn't find/figure out a way to get the placements correct without those rests and even then it didn't really look right. Nothing I could find in FAQ or other forums spoke directly to this. I would prefer for it to look as it does from the printer, what about Satie or even my own work- we use the same techniques and pedagogically it is useful- thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Sep-1999

The printed score only wraps at bar lines. If there are no bar lines you will only get one truncated line. So you should use bar lines.

You can't hide rests, so all I can suggest is to put the rests in, select and edit them (Ctrl-E) and set the Vertical Offset so they appear below the staff. Then white them out by hand.

Reply 2 offered by: jane hamilton on 19-Sep-1999

Blair (and whoever eric is) why is this true? What is the process that made it so difficult to have unmeasured music. In the *real* world it is very common and I am running into this problem even with large measures that have alot of information (eventually the staff size is just too small to be readable) cutting a measure in half (for example) is a poor solution in the middle of a piece and implies that there is some sort of a downbeat accent where in fact there is none, and writing in text to say ignore bar lines just doesn't work- we are trained too well to do that.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Sep-1999

I can only suggest that you take a small trip to the NWC homepage and submit a wish to the wishlist. One of the most wonderful things about NoteWorthy is that it's a continually evolving product, unlike many programs where "what you got is all you'll get". Eric (the author of the program) is very receptive to user suggestions, and if you take a look at the "wishes granted" list you'll realize that a lot of the features we now take for granted were implented in answer to requests just like yours.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 20-Sep-1999

Jane,
I have to say as Fred says: add this to the wish list, it may be realized (as it has benn for some of my wishes).

But if you really do not want to have bar lines, you can hide them by making them print further than your printer can, i.e. out of margins : try to reduce right margin until the bars get out (you may need to really print, though the print preview is useful.). For example, I just tried with a 0.6 cm on right margin on an HP Laser 5, and the bars are not printed.

HTH,
         Dominique.Portier@free.fr

Reply 5 offered by: ...forgot to mention on 20-Sep-1999

...that you can decide where NWC does a line break that way.
But you lose the ability to change on the last minute, which paper/staff size you use (which is a *great* functionality imho)

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Sep-1999

Another thought to follow up on marsu's suggestion:

Leave out the bar lines as you desire, and do a print preview. Take notice of which note is the last to appear on the staff, or perhaps at a reasonable "breath mark" point, and put a bar line there. This will cap off the staff, without any other bar lines. (Surely no-one would interpret the line at the end of the system as a new downbeat??) Repeat the print preview / insert barline process until the end of the free-form section.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 21-Sep-1999

Just a question about the original subject: you wrote
>The music is without barlines and travels [as most one-handed pieces do]
>from one staff to the other.
>The original music is printed without rests in the quiet staff, which makes sense
>as there is only one 'performer' the left hand.

I'm not used to piano, not enough to understand why a pianist would still need two staves instead of one if playing only one hand. There are two staves not because there are two hands, but because you may need to play notes so far apart that two staves are needee to notate them easily, avoiding ledger lines. And including differing clefs.
So why not to use one single staff, and changing clef where necessary ? This is not harder to read, since there is already clefs changes in usual 2-staves scores; moreover, you won't lose place for an empty score...

Am I wrong somewhere ? Or do I overestimate pianists brains capabilities, which I doubt (managing 10 fingers plus two feet ain't easy!) ?

Just a thought...

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen Randall on 21-Sep-1999

I think Marsu's conclusion in Reply 7 is correct but his argument is the wrong way round.

There are two staves because there are two hands and each has its own staff. If the composer puts the left hand part on the upper stave for convenience or to make a musical point (e.g these notes, although played with the left hand are part of the theme being played by the right hand), it is usually marked "LH" and similarly a right hand part written on the lower stave is usually marked "RH".

Taking Jane's case, a single handed part would logically be written on a single stave. But why should logicality have anything to do with it? As Jane says, the convention seems to be that one-handed pieces are written on two staves. Perhaps the look of a single stave would be too off-putting for a pianist. And if you need two staves for the correct look, why not spread the notes between them?

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 21-Sep-1999

A piano has two staves because the instrument has such a large range, not because there are two hands. It's fairly common for both hands to have notes on the same staff, and pianists are accustomed to reading hand actions that cross staves. It's much easier to read a broken chord or run that flows continually up, than one that is broken in the middle by a clef change (and concomitant mental shift.)


#1262: Timpani Drum Roll
Timpani Drum Roll

(1262)

Submitted by: Michael Hewison on 26-Sep-1999

Has anyone come up with a neat way to show a Timpani Drum Roll? It's the note with the bars across the staff. I need to produce a conductors score and can't afford the space that 3 beats of 1/32 takes up (a bar is the width of the page.) I am trying to get this finished before Sept 28,1999.
Thanks in advance
Mike

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Sep-1999

Get Barry Graham's Boxmarks font, which includes the tremolo markings you're referring to. Put this on the staff you use for printing. If you also want to have the NWC file playable with the timp rolls audible, put them on a hidden staff.

You can download the Boxmarks font from the Scriptorium, at

http://www.vadu.com/nwc

HTH


#1263: Layering and Slurs
Layering and Slurs

(1263)

Submitted by: Zach on 26-Sep-1999

The layering feature would be very useful for the choral music that I'm attempting to notate in Noteworthy. However, when a slur is placed on a group of notes, it blocks the other staves notes, which are on the next staff. The only way to change the slur's position is by changing the notes' stem direction, and that will confuse the heck out of the sopranos and altos (and tenors and basses, pretty much everybody). Please let me know if you've found a way around this.

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 27-Sep-1999

Personally, I'm not satisfied with this aspect of the program, as well as other issues brought about by layering staves.

I do very much like the idea of layering, I can make practice tapes of individual parts as well as print them out separately for the singers. I would like to be able to layer them into traditional SA and TB staves (I also need SSA single staff from three staves) and have the resulting score print as if it was notated that way originally.

I am hoping that in a future release, NWC will internally combine the layered staves into a single staff, simulating it being keyed in that way, and then present it visually as such...

We'll see what the experts on this forum have to say about workarounds, I've not found any that satisfy me.

Good Luck!

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 27-Sep-1999

Specifically for this problem I would like to be able to position slurs where I want them.
Possibilities are:

1. Over the note heads. (or under if stems are up)
2. Over the stems.
3. Between the stems (i.e. a bit shorter than normal)

I would also like to be able to slope them (or even better to have them sloped automatically, but then adjustable).

Ties are also a problem in layering and it would be nice to be able to specify whether a tie is bowed up, or bowed down.
At the moment if the stems are down the tie is up, and vice versa, which causes a nasty clash when you layer a tied alto g with a tied soprano b for instance.

I've just installed a copy of NWC for a friend and noticed that we have not had a new version for nearly six months! Does this pressage something big?

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 28-Sep-1999

I'm tempted to say: add this to the wish list.
This being said, I konw by own experience that some wishes are realized; and that with the (late) autumn often comes a new version :-)
But only God and Eric know when the next issue is to come.
6 months is a bit short, 9 months is better for a complete pregnancy :-)

NWCly yours

Reply 4 offered by: David Barnes on 29-Sep-1999

This subject has popped up more than once before and I guess will keep doing so until it gets sorted.
I agree with Sue that "..workarounds, I've not found any that satisfy me." but I have tried the following and have found them better than doing nothing.

semibreves - you can set the stem direction either way, forcing any slur (or tie) to be positioned correctly without actually changing the score (or confusing the singers/players)

In some other (rather limited)cases I have added an occasional stem-down note as a chord member to a tied step-up note thereby forcing the slur above the slurred notes. As long as the added note appears in the lower line (alto or bass) and layering is turned on then the printed appearance of the whole score is acceptable although it becomes a nuisance when printing just one line.

Finally in (even more limited) cases applying a position offset to some of the notes can at least move them out of the way of what would otherwise be an overlapping slur. Don't move them too far or the confusion created may be even worse.

Also it's worth considering if layering may not be necessary for a particular piece. I believe that slurs work better in a single staff with chords combining stem-up and stem-down notes and certainly everything is fine if you print four separate staves in which case you don't need to worry about stem direction.

Hope this helps (and that NWC keeps getting better!)

Reply 5 offered by: Cliff Taylor on 29-Nov-1999

I've just started using Composer for four-part barbershop arrangements and these often involve slurs (we call 'em swipes") in one or more parts against held or counter-movement in other parts. I'm using layering with stem direction identifying parts in standard barbershop notation. After a few frustrating days of overlapping slurs and ties I discovered that I can get the ties and slurs to lean the way I want them (toward the "outside" of each staff) by duplicating the other part's note in a chord with the part that owns the staff - e.g. adding the baritone note to the bass staff chord that starts the slur or tie. The only problem is when beamed notes are involved, since automatic beams doesn't work right with split-stem chords! (Wish it did.) Only one set of stems get beamed, the other one stays separate. Ugly. Here the solution is to use a quarter-note in the chord, which hides "under" the beamed eighth/sixteenth note. Of course, this won't always work either, but most of the time is solves the problem.
Cliff

Reply 6 offered by: Eric M. Bram on 29-May-2001

I agree with Peter. I want more control over the way slurs are positioned. I also notate for barbershop music, which requires layering. The lead and tenor tracks are on an upper staff with a treble clef, the baritone and bass tracks are below, on a lower staff with a bass clef. Treble and baritone parts always have stems up; lead and bass parts always have stems down.

The main problem is, with this software (version 1.70) slur marks are for some reason located very far from the notes -- sometimes way above the ends of the stems. This often causes problems with barbershop notation. For example, sometimes the slur mark for the baritone (stems up, remember) in the lower staff actually extends above the slur mark for the lead (stems down) in the upper staff, with both slur marks obscuring the lyrics in the middle.

Nearly changing the slur direction from "upward" to "downward" for the baritone (for example) won't help, because that will usually deposit the slur mark right on top of the bass notes.

What is needed is the ability to vary the staff position, such as is possible with "expression placement" -- on an individual slur rather than a universal basis -- to move the slur marks down closer to the note heads.

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-May-2001

Good points. I myself sometimes resort to editing the NWC output in PDF (using a drawing program that can edit PDF) in order to place the slurs where I want them. Related to this: Is there much of a need for "dashed" ties? I encounter these when lyric lines have different numbers of syllables.

Reply 8 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 31-May-2001

I too write for 4-part singing. I use to put the notes for e.g. Tenor 1 (stems up) on one 1st staff and Tenor 2 (stems down) on the 2nd and then layer them together. Problems occurs with downward slurs which tend to interfere with the lyrics. In melismas, I put the two voices together on the 1st staff as “chords” and make all slurs here go upwards. I place the 1st (Tenor 1) note (stem up) of the melisma on the 2nd staff, and then fill out the remaining part of it with rests. I slur the whole “note-and-rests melisma” downwards (which makes the slur be put rather high up, beginning from the 1st note). I make the rests “invisible” and use the placement mechanism to move them downwards, until I get the slur where I want it (using layering).

Sometimes, I cannot use the 1st note because the length isn’t right, or so. I then use a rest in this position too. I don’t make this 1st rest invisible, as this makes the slur disappear as well, but I use the colouring mechanism to make it white and then move it upwards out of the staff, using the later invisible rests for pressing the slur downwards.

It’s a bit tricky (I hope I make this clear, English is not my 1st language), but after a while this doesn’t take too much time, and the printed result is mostly very nice. Nevertheless, I would very much appreciate an easier and more direct way of controlling the position of slurs (they are really too far away from the notes). I would also welcome a mechanism for shortening the stems of individual notes, in order to avoid low notes interfering with the lyrics.

I did put these proposals on to the wish list long ago, without success. Perhaps somebody who masters the English language better, should try again.

Best wishes,

Paul


#1264: Using the extra Midi controllers of the soundcards
Using the extra Midi controllers of the soundcards

(1264)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 29-Sep-1999

One thing that has really put me off with NWC is its admiteddly limited inability to utilise the various midi controllers that are available in a soundcard.

Considering the problem of being unable to use extra midi controller features of the various soundcards, due to limitations on hardware compatibility for FX addresses, it would seem useful to enter one more Controller Type in the Multi-point Controllers' Controller menu. E.g. "other controller" could be used, where the user will have to specify the address of the Midid controller in an extra field and the drag bars will range from min to max, whatever that may mean for the effect.

The user will have to refer to her/his soundcard manual to fully utilise this feature, and I believe it would circumvent alot of heavy programming. Even better, a help file could include a table of controllers and their addresses for major soundcards, whereby the inexperienced user can find which FX lies where.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 01-Oct-1999

Yes. I agree that at least rudimentary access to controllers would be handy, and I would have thought fairly easy to put in. I guess we should remember that NWC is a Notation and COmposition program more than a MIDI-based program. Still, add it to the Wish List at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm
because if enough people "officially" ask for it, it often happens.

One problem that I imagine may arise is the variety of MIDI players interpreting the controllers in a variety of ways. Short of posting your NWC files to the newsgroup for feedback on how it sounds on other systems, there's no way of telling how things may sound. Still, provision of controller input would allow users who want it and need it to create songs with a much shorter development cycle (ie avoiding having to post-process with a more MIDI oriented program).

A

Reply 2 offered by: Shane Turner on 02-Oct-1999

That is also a major thing for me.. Even adding in a relatively simple controller like chorus and reverb, which almost all other midi programs support, can't be done.. Each time I want to add it in, I have to export my nwc file to a midi. Think how nice the controllers would work with nwc's already very good controller setup, which lets you do nice fade ins and fade outs. As far as it not being standard, perhaps.. but they already have five controllers there (volume, tempo, pan). Instead of having a menu of five controllers, have a menu like in most programs of all 128 and let you select the one you want. That would be excellent.
I have submitted this to the wishlist several times last year.. maybe since we're all on a roll here I'll do it again. :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 05-Oct-1999

I did put the exact text above into the wish list right before posting it to the forum, so its already there. In any case, the comment field could specify on what board the .mid was written on using what addys as what effects for the uninitiated, therefore it would sort of circumvent the hassle a bit. BTW, I think that tehre is a convention as to the addresses for the effects so that all the sound cards can play the same .mid in the same way (correct me if I'm wrong).

For me it would be one heck of a help. I can't afford a midi keyboard and I am forced to score composing directly on the computer. Yes, that is right, I write a song exclusively on a PC and colour it up by tweaking with each single note (It takes AGES), but it is one hell of a confidence boost to listen to yor song EXACTLY as you'd like it (after a year or two). In the meantime you listen to it hundreds of times and you process it even more so that it becomes even better. IT is slow, but it is worthwile.

My point is, such an addition on NWC would make NWC-score-composing sound less artificial. And I'd love that.

Reply 4 offered by: Jim Cook on 23-Dec-1999

My "soundcard" is a Yamaha QY-70 hooked to a cheap wavetable card via MIDI. Without the ability to embed messages to the QY's controllers, I can't use any of the GX capabilities. This is about the only thing that keeps me from wholehearted endorsing NWC. Of course, scanning scores or even just piano sheets would be very nice...


#1265: New Music OCR Program
New Music OCR Program

(1265)

Submitted by: Steve Pearson on 02-Oct-1999

Like some other folks, I tried Midiscan for a while, and was a bit underwhelmed.

Happened to run across a new shareware program, however, that appears to be fairly accurate and easy to use (at least compared to Midiscan). It is called Sharpeye. A fully functional trial version can be downloaded at http://www.visiv.co.uk/. I doubt it would be suitable for sophisticated works, but I found that it converted scans of my NWC pieces (including lyrics) almost flawlessly. [Author's note: that may reflect the sophistication of my work]. It even did a creditable job with a marginal copy of music I scanned.

In any event, some folks out there might want to download and play with it. For the true programmers, the developer has even included code notes.

See also msg #485 msg #555, msg #603, msg #861 msg #1111 for other discussions of music OCR efforts and programs.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 04-Oct-1999

Thx for the info.
I'll try Sharpeye ( http://www.visiv.co.uk/ ) asap.

Other links you specified in this forum are accessible via are msg #485 , msg #555 , msg #603 , msg #861 and msg #1111 ; do not forget to specifiy the '!' before submiiting an http or item number URL :-)

Note: SharpEye 1.08 is 1.1 Mb

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 04-Oct-1999

I was wondering why the links weren't working . . . Guess I should check out the "help" files every now and then. Thanks for the tip!

P.S. Quick add on to prior message. One cannot "print" from Sharpeye (another program which integrates Sharpeye apparently does that). However, it still may be useful in producing a workable midi from a scan.

Reply 3 offered by: Chris on 06-Oct-1999

I haven't experimented before with OCR scanning for music files. Friends of mine have and, like Steve, were underwhelmed. Since I recently purchased a scanner, I thought I'd give Sharpeye a trial. I must say that I'm rather impressed. I scanned single and multiple line parts and found virtually no errors. Even when exporting the scanned file as a midi and then opening it in NWC, I found very few errors. The horror stories I've heard about the amount of editing required when working with this type of software don't seem to apply to Sharpeye. I'd highly recommend that you all give it a try.

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 07-Oct-1999

Odd -- I tried SharpEye on three scans, and it failed miserably on all of them. Two used an older form of eighth notes, with a slanting straight sided flag, and it wouldn't recognize them at all. The other used more normal notes, and was a clean scan, but many notes were missed altogether, no accidentals were found, and most chords were missing all but one or two notes.

I just uninstalled it.

Cyril

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Pearson on 07-Oct-1999

I suspect there will always be some limitations on OCR. If folks run into a problem, they may want to play with resolution (300x300dpi is standard; the program can also use 400x400), or brightness and contrast. The "help" menu gives some pointers in these areas.

Anyway, the program just seemed to work better than Midiscan, so thought I would note it for others to try.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 08-Oct-1999

Well, I tried it also, with a file I had previously scanned.
It's from DonGiovanni, duet between DG and Zerlina (La ci darem la mano).
As I scanned this by hand and saved it into compressed tif, the 1st trouble I had was that image was no correctly read; I had to convert it into .bmp to be able to read it. After this, the conversion was rather long (I use a 486dx2/66 with Win95, 32Mb), but finally got a result rather good (much better than MidiScan who doesn't like a variable number of staves).

The good points I see in it are:
- lyrics are recognized quite correctly, and you may get them from the NIFF file;
- the GUI is nice in one point: left-clicking in the main window makes moving the image in its window, with a '+' cursor on it moving in real-time. Very useful to add/correct items that were not recognized. But CapellaScan is much better on this part (it superimposes both), though much less cheap...

It may be useful for people who can't stand midiscan no more...

HTH

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-Oct-1999

I tried it to scan in Beethoven piano sonatas. It did an excellent job translating the TIFF file into notation. It skipped over grace notes and trills, and did not handle certain cases with two voices on a staff (like beamed notes in both directions), but all it did was replace dropped notes with rests, so the rest of the piece was OK.

The problem comes when you export to MIDI, then import it into Noteworthy. Some errors are clearly due to SharpEye, such as transposing some staves up two octaves. I think other problems are caused by Noteworthy's MIDI import.

My opinion is that this program is only as useful (for us) as Noteworthy's midi import. If importing a good midi works well for you then give this program a try. If midi import is a disaster for you then don't bother. My experience was that most of the piece imported well, but some parts were trash.

If ShartEye could export directly to Noteworthy (or NWC could import NIFF) I think the results would be much better.
I wonder if Noteworthy would release its file format, and if it is reasonably usable by a third party? The ability to scan music reliably would be a huge productivity boost.

Reply 8 offered by: Don Ruckman on 09-Oct-1999

Steve, thanks for the info. about Sharpeye. I also used Midiscan some time ago and found it totally useless; see message #485 (I think); Archive 400-499 'Importing NIFF files' Reply 8. I tried Sharpeye with the same file I used in the Midiscan trial, and found Sharpeye to be infinitely better and actually useable. My sample was simple, single staff, single note (Trumpet music)and the corrections required were minimal. I imported the MIDI file into NoteWorthy just fine. I plan to do additional evaluations.
Of course, the music can be printed once it is imported into NoteWorthy. I did not imported the unedited music into NoteWorthy, but perhaps the minimal editing required would be easier in NoteWorthy.
The cost of $50.00 US, is not excessive, compared to others.
Thanks for the find
Don Ruckman ruckdr@jps.net

Reply 9 offered by: John in Brisbane on 16-Nov-1999

I have been using NWC for someime, and SharpEye since the time of the first posting here. It behaves very well with most music fonts and less well with others. After a while you can almost predict before hand how well it's going to perform. (I have used it for simple and choral scores - I don't know about other programs but I have needed to scan dissimilar score types on the same page as separate entities, e.g. SA plus piano and SATB plus piano.

Clearly the fermata etc which are scanned don't make it into the Midi export file, but the scanned lyrics do. This is a great bonus, but I haven't been able to view these in NWC as I have in other software.

I will be looking very keenly for a notation package which can accept NIFF as an import. I hope that NWC is there as well.

Regards, John


#1266: Guitar Soundfont snooping
Guitar Soundfont snooping

(1266)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 05-Oct-1999

I own an SB64Gold w/t 8MB ram. I use an very good soundfont of this size for the purpose of score composing. However, its' guitar samples are relally poor. If ne1 has or knows were to find decent guitar (classic, clean, distorted, overdriven and overdriven palm muted) samples (prefferably in .SF2 format) I will be much obliged.

Reply 1 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 06-Oct-1999

Sterghios:

Please visit http://listen.to/sblive and look for the soundfont page. You'll find there some guitar soundfonts and links for other sites hosting more of them.

I think it's a good start point.

Reply 2 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 06-Oct-1999

Sorry, I forgot the initial bang.

I mean http://listen.to/sblive of course.

Reply 3 offered by: Shane Turner on 08-Oct-1999

I ordered the EMU soundfont CD right off the sb live page. It only costs about $10 which is outrageously low priced for a sample cd. Some of the guitar samples on it are quite good (if used properly). But if you're patient enough they do rotate the samples on their website once a week, and eventually they will post the guitar samples.

Reply 4 offered by: sterhgios Moschos on 08-Oct-1999

If its the cd they had for the SB64, it is rather crappy,I have found. I just cant find some good way to reproduce guitars in a realistic way I am afraid.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Oct-1999

Perhaps the problem is not so much the sound patch itself, as the way it's sequenced. Guitar music relies heavily on notes being held over, especially in arpeggios. If you sequence them as single notes, it sounds more like a piano with the sustain pedal off. I posted a user tip some time ago with a suggestion that might help. Also I've put a couple sample files using this technique on the Scriptorium (Sor studies and Beethoven Adagio).

HTH

Fred

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Pearson on 11-Oct-1999

Similar problems with securing an acceptable guitar sound. Fred's sample did a nice job. I suspect that a nylon guitar with a lot of reverb (if offered by the soundcard) might also "help".

I have tended to use an Ensoniq over the years(one of the real ones, not the clones) because I like its wavetables. For guitar, I use "Atmosphere" (patch 100).

Not sure what the Soundblaster "live" is like, but the Awe 64 Gold Guitar (and Atmosphere) samples were horrible. Tried the card, tried some downloads, gave up, and went back to the old trusty Ensoniq PCI 1370. If you happen to have a spare PCI slot, etc., might give it a try. The cards are pretty cheap on ebay. (P.S. Curiously enough, I prefer the 2mb wavetables over the 8 mb downloadable tables)

Reply 7 offered by: Shane Turner on 20-Oct-1999

In answer to Sterhgios:

No, its not the one with Awe64, its a relatively new collection made in the past year directed at SB Live users.
Comes with 500 soundfonts.. the nylon strings soundfont is 8mb in size with almost all the notes sampled. Also, depending on the velocity, you get a sharp pluck sound or a smoother fingered sound. But, like I mentioned, it only _sounds good if used properly_ ... cant have it play like a piano or harpsichord. :-)

You can get MIDI guitars too, we have one at my college studio. Great for people who want more accurate guitar "strums" and pitch bends. I think they cost almost as much as a keyboard though, which is a disadvantage if you're short on cashola.

Reply 8 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 20-Oct-1999

Yes I know. I also suffer from the fact that the only music I can play on the guitar is the intro to "smoke on the water" and... that's about it really. So a midi guitar is not a healthy idea for me pocket. As for proper playing? You should have a look in the refining I do on my pieces so that they do not sound like Lt. Commander Data of the Starship Enterprise is playing them, i.e. completely colourless. The bad thing is I don't own a midi keyboard either, and, yes, it takes ages to write a song 100% on NWC.
But it can be done.

Reply 9 offered by: Shane Turner on 21-Oct-1999

Well, you play guitar better than me already :-) As you can guess I am limited merely to the keyboard. Which is all right, its just hard to get a realistic guitar... strum.. heheh.

I know exactly where you're coming from.. for the first few years when I got into midi I didn't have a keyboard.. positioning the notes one by one takes so long. The best thing I ever got was a keyboard last year.

Reply 10 offered by: Tokajiaszu on 12-Jan-2001

Ladies and Gentleman!

First please excuse me for my not-too-good english
Just a tip on guitar sampling.
The most samles I tried at higher sounds had a strange noise.
Perhaps sampling higher sounds (one-two octave higher) can help.
And one more tip. If you play on a real guitar, not only one string sounds, you can hear the harmonics of the just played note on the other strings, too, and, the whole guitar housing resonates. This is very hardly modellable.
Perhaps with using multiple samples, and a special eax preset...

If you know good guitar fonts or gm/gs banks, please email me.


#1267: Flanging with SB64!
Flanging with SB64!

(1267)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 05-Oct-1999

I was fooling around with NWC one day when I realised that I can achieve universal flanging on a midi song that may be played by SB64. If one writes multiple (e.g. four) times the score for e.g. drums and base andd asigns them to a different channel, using chorus and reverb from the SB64 control panel, the soundcard renders the .mid as if tehre was a flanger effect on it. If ne1 is interested for an example email me and I will post to you an .nwc file that shows how it is done.

Reply 1 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 06-Oct-1999

And the question is: Is this a bug or a feature?

For me it's usually a bug of Creative's soundcards. Whenever the same sound patch is assigned to different MIDI chanels and the same note plays at the same time in several channels the dreaded flanging effect may appear.

In symphonic music, were all five strings groups (violins 1 and 2, violas, cellos and double basses) are assigned to different channels but all use the same patch (usually, String Ensemble 1), this annoying effect may appear if two or more channels play exactly the same note.

To avoid it I usually insert a Pitch Bend mpc at the beginning of all string staves, to detune slightly the channel's sound. Usually values of +400 and -400 (to create an 800 difference between channels) are enough to get rid of this flanging effect.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 06-Oct-1999

I'm not sure of this effect on other cards (as SB16 for example).

On a more general way, you may refer to http://www.winjammer.com/Enhancing_Title.htm too.

HTH

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 07-Oct-1999

Another way to avoid the dreaded flange is to use a sequencer that allows time sliding and move the voices apart a few ticks in time.
This was the only way I could get a unison multi-voice chord to sound on an SB16 without choking.
Adds a bit of presence to piano and guitar chords too.

Reply 4 offered by: Shane Turner on 07-Oct-1999

This isn't a bug or a feature. It happens on plenty of other soundcards and midi controllers, even the nice $2000 alesis synth I use at the studio. There's several different names for this effect, one is: "constructive interference" I also believe (but dont quote me) its called "crosstalk cancellation" (could be wrong).

---Basically, its what happens when you take the exact same sound sample and play more than one of it at almost exactly the same time. It literally starts cancelling itself out.

A way around this is to use different samples. If I need more than one string section at the same time, I use string ensemble 1 and string ensemble 2, and pan them apart. This generally helps.

Another thing that helps is adding the REVERB effect to your midi file, which smooths out the interference. However, since NWC still doesn't have controller support, this feature has to be added externally.


#1268: Looking for cooperation...
Looking for cooperation...

(1268)

Submitted by: sterghios Moschos on 05-Oct-1999

I have been using NWC seen February 98 and I have to say it is one of the most exquisite pieces of composing software. Indeed, I find the program so useful that I have deicided to compose songs exclusively on it. However some things like lyrics and guitars (ok, single string instruments too) are impossible to reproduce in a satisfactory way. For this reason I am looking for musicians that know the NWC program quite well and are interested in composing some progressive modern music through it and other media. If anyone is interested I will send through .nwc files and the appropriate soundfont for their proper audition.

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 10-Oct-1999

I suggest you look at the ntworthy.news group at !news://news.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc

Also, I don't understand what you mean about lyrics. I thought that were quite easy to use.

A


#1269: How do you make...
How do you make...

(1269)

Submitted by: Aaron Saraco on 07-Oct-1999

Is there any way, in NWC, to make those notes that sort of... It's hard to describe... It goes from one note to a different note, but not like in increments, in one sweep... I just can't get that word!
I've heard this effect in other MIDIs, such as Final Fantasy 5 Fierce Battle and FF6 Fierce Battle, if you've ever heard those.

Reply 1 offered by: Shane Turner on 08-Oct-1999

Oh yeah, I know what you're talking about :-). Great songs, those ones, Nobuo Uematsu rules :-)

The feature you're looking for is called pitch bend. Where one note sweeps down into another. Check out the multi-point controller (in noteworthy, hit the "L" key.) A window pops up, and in it you can select the pitch bend option. (You'll see what I mean when you get there). Also be sure you have "linear sweep" selected.

Reply 2 offered by: Aaron Saraco on 08-Oct-1999

Hmm... How do you actually USE the pitch blend? I can't figure it out.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 08-Oct-1999

not blend, bend :-)

refer to msg #905 and links in it (at the bottom), or look at the online help in NWC.

HTH

Reply 4 offered by: Aaron Saraco on 08-Oct-1999

Thanks! And now, as a special little treat to you, here's a link to a near-complete MIDI soundtrack for Final Fantasy 6 (by, as you indicated, Nobuo Uematsu). Some of the best MIDI aroundhttp://www.telusplanet.net/public/troutman/midi/ff3midi.zip
Unfortunately it's missing a few songs, such as the full Opera House suite. I don't know why. That's some of the best music in the game.
Oh, and don't judge Nobuo by the Final Fantasy 8 soundtrack. It's really bad, especially for him.

Reply 5 offered by: Shane Turner on 20-Oct-1999

Thanks for the midis, Aaron. If you're really into turning the music into midis, you can find the whole soundtrack on cd at www.gamemusic.com, or www.animenation.com.

Oh, and I have to disagree about the FF8 soundtrack, it really is his best work to date. He experiments with way more tones, textures and styles than he did in final fantasy 6, which is probably why we in north america don't tend to like it as much, its too easy to reject new ideas. (It seems lots of people in north america limit their tastes in music to such a small range of musical genres). Besides, Uematsu thinks its his best work to date, and I'd rather agree with the original composer than a few meager and soon-forgotten critics anyday.

Reply 6 offered by: Aaron Saraco on 20-Oct-1999

Hmm. Maybe the samples I heard happened to be the worst songs from the soundtrack. Well, whatever. All I know fore sure is 6 has better music than 1-5, and 7.

Reply 7 offered by: Aaron Saraco on 21-Oct-1999

Well, I have a handful of MIDIs (those all sound awful, but I can't rely too much on those... What they call "intro" is nothing of the sort), and 4 MP3s. The battle music which is good, but a bit repetitive for me. The victory music, and most people agree on this, is a disgrace. The first part of the ending is a piano solo which sounds kind of nice at first, but it just gets boring. And although the final battle is cool, it's a joke compared to FF6.

Reply 8 offered by: Shane Turner on 21-Oct-1999

MIDIs can only do the original music so much justice, after all it's only somebody's interpretation of what they heard.
Also, just like a movie, it really helps if you have played through it first.. that way you understand how the music fits the settings. As I have finished it and have the soundtrack recorded (and ordered myself a copy) I can assure you it is way more complex.
As far as the "final battle" once again it is a matter interpretation.. FF8 has so much more going on in it.. the interwoven piano lines and percussion... and many other subtle details... to say nothing of far better sound and sample quality.. its far more interesting to listen to than FF6 which was limited by technology to only 8 tracks. So we have to agree to disagree there :-)
Another thing interesting about FF8 is since it is Uematsu's last FF work.. the integration of many themes from all the other works in the series throughout the soundtrack. You can pick them out in the backgrounds.. etc :-)
Thats why turning this stuff into a MIDI file is so hard, so many details! Also.. how can you turn the introduction Liberi Fatali into a MIDI file? That would seriously lose something without the chorus singing in latin :-)

Reply 9 offered by: Aaron Saraco on 21-Oct-1999

Well, that's why there is no MIDI of it. What I got was just a completely different tune that was not the intro. Don't know where the heck it came from. Also, I don't know if it's his last work. I heard that FF9 either will be some other guy or him and some other guy.
Well you're right, we'll have to disagree about the final battle. I just can't get over 6's, no matter how primitive the technology was -- it's just... I don't know.
For some much better quality FF8 midis than I got before, go here. http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Zone/9936/ff8/midi.html
Any song title that's a link has a MIDI. Unfortunately, you have to search for the MIDI in your temporary internet files, since it just links to an HTML file that plays the MIDI.

Reply 10 offered by: Shane Turner on 22-Oct-1999

Thanks. There's also a FF8 soundfont file out there too, I don't know if you have an SB Live or SB AWE card but if you do.. the link is:
http://members.xoom.com/TSSF/ss.html

And there's some midis there made specifically for the soundfont.. marked for "awe".

Hey, and thats cool about the final boss music. I like em both.. ff6 is neat especially because I like organ music.. I just really like ff8's as well. :-)

Reply 11 offered by: Aaron Saraco on 22-Oct-1999

Well, I'll get an SB Live... What does a soundfont do?
The MIDIs I got from the most recent link I posted are way better than the previous ones I got. I especially like "Ride On"... That's just beautiful.
It's true what you said about the other FF themes being in the soundtrack... I can't really judge for myself too much since I'm getting MIDIs, but Sephiroth's Theme(FF7)/Ancient Weapons (FF5)(they're the same thing) is in "The Successor". Also, something a lot like the FF7 main theme is in "Premonition".
Well, I'm more optimistic about FF8's soundtrack now, since from the old MIDIs, I referred to the game as "Nobuo Uematsu's Drunken Rage".
You can find the old MIDIs here:
http://www.rpg-haven.com/rpgmidis.html
Tell me if these are from the game or not. Well a few of them are.

Reply 12 offered by: Aaron Saraco on 23-Oct-1999

Oh, and another thing -- Let's make sure I know what the Final Battle IS. It's "The Extreme", right?

Reply 13 offered by: Shane Turner on 23-Oct-1999

Yeah, its The Extreme.. Actually its "Legendary Beast," "Maybe I'm a Lion"(bizzare but interesting piece, fits EXTREMELY well with the events happening on screen), and The Extreme.... the one that starts out slowly with the distorted vocals.. then breaks into the rhythmic piece with piano and synth.
Have you heard the original piece, or just the midi files?

--Shane

Reply 14 offered by: Aaron Saraco on 23-Oct-1999

It's kinda strange how it works out. I have nothing of Legendary Beast, a MIDI of Maybe I'm a Lion, and an MP3 of The Extreme. Oh wait, I have a MIDI of that as well. gameinfonet.com used to have the entire soundtrack on MP3, but now I can't go there for some reason!
You're right, Maybe I'm a Lion is strange. But I can imagine that it fits the scene well.
By the way, that link you sent me about soundfonts -- Did you hear what they call the intro? Why do people insist that that's the intro, even though it's clearly not?

Reply 15 offered by: Shane Turner on 27-Oct-1999

No.. the intro song is the introduction from the demo, not
actually from the game. I can't even remember this song in
the final game.. lots of music was changed from the demo to
the final product.

Yeah, and never judge a soundtrack by the midis. Uematsu
never wrote those midi files.. some people did, by ear, so
they aren't even the exact right notes. Also, depending on
your midi equipment, the sound could completely suck too.
The only thing you can sort of get an idea from are mp3
files, recordings of the actual soundtrack. Like "a one
winged angel" midi.. no chorus singing carmina burana in the
midi files... or the fully orchestrated ending theme from
ff8... a midi file just doesn't cut it.
As another example, if you heard a really crappy midi
version of Beethoven's 9th, that doesn't mean the 9th
symphony sucks. The midi file does.

Reply 16 offered by: Shane Turner on 27-Oct-1999

OK, a soundfont is a collection of sounds that can be played
via midi. So it is possible to record sounds from the PSX,
and turn them into a soundfont.. so when you play a midi
file, it will sound "close" to the original. It has many
other uses too, because you can record any instrument in
real life and play it back in a midi file, giving midis a
much more realistic sound.

Reply 17 offered by: falkon2 on 25-Nov-1999

Hey.. lets try listing all the 'flashback' melodies that we can find.

Like previously mentioned, the Premonition track has some stuff that sounds like the FF7 main theme.

Has anyone played FF5? You know the mountain music has a cadence which is identical to Force Your Way. Anyone noticed that?

Reply 18 offered by: LemmHead on 25-Nov-1999

"Not I", said the Lemming.
I mean, I've played through FF5 all the way, but I don't see the tie-in to Force Your Way. Hey, that rhymed. Wait. No it didn't.
What do you mean by "cadence"? I'm stupid like that.

But anyway, I can notice a blatant Sephiroth theme in "The Successor". Actually, that dates back to FF5, since the Ancient Weapons theme is basically the same thing.
In "Fithos Lusec Wecos Vinosec", part of it sounds SORT OF like Kefka's theme. It's not too definite, though. I wonder what "Fithos Lusec Wecos Vinosec" means, anyway. I looked it up in a Latin dictionary, wasn't there. They use it an awful lot; it's even the name of the special arranged soundtrack CD!
Oh yeah, and the Victory song! Just kidding!
P.S. I hate what they've done to the victory song.

Reply 19 offered by: falkon2 on 28-Nov-1999

While I can't say I like the Victory Theme in FF8 either, it IS an improvement over the jumble of notes in FF7! Hey Square! Bring back the old fanfare!

Anyway, I notice in the final boss music ("The Extreme"), the guitar solo near the start that sounds startlingly like Vincent's Theme (FF7), and there is, of course, the trademark repeated bass (FF4-FF6 battle themes).

Final Fantasy Main Theme, of course, makes it's usual appearance at the end of the game, but for some weird reason, they decided to scrap the crystal theme and put it in "The Loser", albeit in a heavily modified form. Drat.

Lemmhead- does your email address work? I'll send you two short midi files for you to compare.

Reply 20 offered by: falkon2 on 28-Nov-1999

Ah, another thing. At the start of "The Castle", you hear a variation of the odd music you can hear in the 2nd Tier (FF6 final boss). I mean, it sounds like music they play at those grandiose official functions, not while fighting a BOSS.

Reply 21 offered by: LemmHead on 28-Nov-1999

Yeah, my e-mail address works. Did you send them already? Because if you did, then I didn't get them.
I was wondering if The Prologue (FF theme) was in it, so that answers my question. Is that in 7? If so, it's been in every FF game. Same with The Prelude (crystal theme).
I think the best version of The Prelude is in FF6. They finally slowed it down from 1-5, which makes it a lot nicer. Although FF7 had more realistic sounding instruments, they eliminated some of the background stuff and so it just didn't cut it, in my opinion.
"You be dissin' the best part of Dancing Mad?"
Uh, what I mean to say is, are you downplaying Dancing Mad 2nd tier? Not to sound aggressive or anything... I love that part, I think it's so suspenseful! In my opinion, it's okay to slow the music down a bit during the fight... Actually, the best part is probably the Kefka part, but I was just babbling. One thing I really love is how in part 3, you can hear Kefka's theme really softly in the background. That is so spooky!

Reply 22 offered by: falkon2 on 30-Nov-1999

Ah, so it does work :) Hang on, I'll arrange a midi from the mp3 of the boss theme I have, then send both to you.

Well, I'm not against it or anything- it just doesn't sound like a life-or-death situation that Sabin & Co. go through at that time. Thats just my opinion, of course :)

The final tier captures Kefka's personality perfectly. There's the part where they beat the drums like crazy, then it suddenly cuts to Kefka's Theme, then it goes back to the drums again - truly visualising the insane character that Kefka is.

The Prologue is played (as usual since FF5) after you finish the game, during the Ending Cutscene/Credit Roll, the Prelude (crystal theme) was omited from the game except for when you lose, though even then it sounds totally different. I like the new chords they added in, though.

I also just remembered - Eyes On Me is a huge collage of previous FF themes. You can hear a bit of Terra's Theme, Celes Theme, and Tifa's Theme throughout the music. There might be more, but I haven't been able to pick them out.

Reply 23 offered by: falkon2 on 30-Nov-1999

Oops.. just re-read your post.

Yeah, the Prelude is played at the splash screen in FF7 (New Game/Continue) and the Prologue is played during the credit roll.

Reply 24 offered by: The Jester on 13-Jul-2000

I have noticed them mixes in the Eyes on Me song at least the Terra and Cles ones

Reply 25 offered by: The Jester on 13-Jul-2000

and the Little Aries house thing where Barret and the crew are in Aries' house, well that song seems to tie up with the Celes song, just a Lil' ta wee bit :)

Reply 26 offered by: daggart on 17-Apr-2001

Fithos Lusec Wecos Vinosec
Idont think it really means anything in any foreign language. however, if you rearange the letters, you get "Succession Of Witches"(the name of another FF8 track) with the word "Love" left over
Interesting

Reply 27 offered by: Quisty on 20-May-2001

Hi everyone! Does anyone have the ending theme of FF8 in midi file? PLEASE send it to me.
quististrepe17@hotmail.com
I can give you an other midi of FF8 just say witch one, I almost have them all.
Some people asked for the midi file of Liberi Fatali, I have it.
But please send the ending theme to me!!! I'm looking for it everywhere!
So help me and do me a faviour.

I really like FF8 and FF9. Just this morning, I have finished FF9. And now I'm sad because it is all over...

(I know my english sucks, because I'm dutch)
Thanx!

Reply 28 offered by: Roselie on 12-Jul-2001

Does anyone have Melodies of Life from FF9?? If anyone does have it...please send it to me at scoolgirlz@hotmail.com. I like the english version. I also like to have Eyes On Me fromm FF8. Please if anyone has that send it to me!! I have the urge to listen to the midi files.

Reply 29 offered by: Dave on 05-Sep-2001

Hi, I'm David from Indonesia.
Is there anyone who can play music, especially in composising ?
You can contact me, there's many that we can discuss.
All 'bout music.
I want to learn about composising more.
As Nobuo Uematsu fan, I just want to make a song like he does.
And I believe that someday I will.
But I need more practise and suggestion.
Please,.. Is there someone could help me ?
Is there someone can teach me the practical way ?
Or maybe you know about your friend that can play music, please introduce him/her to me.

Please...

Dave,-

Reply 30 offered by: Robert on 23-Jan-2002

I just came across this site, and I thought, Hmm interesting. So here goes. I know what you mean by trying to get the MIDIs to sound like the original. Its such a pain. Anyways, does anyone have any MIDIs of Conde Petie from FF9? Any tips on using Noteworthy Composer as a whole? And whats the best MIDI player to use?


#1270: Solo Line?
Solo Line?

(1270)

Submitted by: Robert Floyd on 08-Oct-1999

A piece of choral music I'm trying to notate has an extended solo at the beginning (a full two lines worth). I'd like to be able to print just the treble staff for the beginning rather than a bass staff with nothing but rests. Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-Oct-1999

This can't be done in Noteworthy. It can be done by copying the page (from Print Preview) into a paint program or desktop publisher, and re-arranging it yourself.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 11-Oct-1999

Well, in fact you can do it within NWC, but you'll have to use two times the same paper sheet for the first page : one time with the solo alone (a real solo then ;-), and a 2nd time fiddling with upper margin, without the solo, to make the systems appear under the already-present solo.

You'll need to reset margins to normal for the following pages, and it's better in that case to have 3 separate files : one for the solo, one for the rest (first page), and the third for the following pages.

hoping your printer accept twice the same page without jamming (you'll need to re-enter it yourself in any
case).

do not hesitate to ask for details if i'm not clear enough.

HTH,
        Dominique


#1271: New user needs help to format staff display
New user needs help to format staff display

(1271)

Submitted by: LFJ on 08-Oct-1999

How can I have the score drop down one line instead of scolling to the right? What I mean to say, how can I get it to "auto wrap?" Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-Oct-1999

The display does not wrap - it is always a continuous line. You can use Print Preview to see where the lines will wrap on the printout.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 11-Oct-1999

Let me add that tihs is much more usable than any other notation program I know.
Do not bother about line breaks, it's correctly managed by nwc. Especially when you use the same file to print orchestral (full) scores as well as solo parts.

imho.


#1272: repeats cause verse skip.
repeats cause verse skip.

(1272)

Submitted by: Arlene Rogers on 09-Oct-1999

I have a song, that begins with a repeated introduction. I entered the Master repeat bar at the beginning, and the master repeat bar at the end of special ending 1. The piece plays fine through special ending two. However, I have 2 verses listed next. NWC then skips highlighting the first verse and goes right to the second verse. This means it skips the repeat for the second verse. Why does NWC not recognise the first verse?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Oct-1999

A couple things to check:

1) All repeats, flow directions, and special endings have to be inserted on all bars under normal conditions. (The facility to be able to have some bars repeat, etc. and some not is very handy for special purposes, but for the usual work where all staves should follow each other you have to be sure to explicitly say so.)

2) Be sure you don't have any double barlines or section close barlines inside the repeated section. These can produce unexpected results.

If still no joy, why don't you post the file on the newgroup, and someone I'm sure will help figure out what's wrong.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Oct-1999

>...inserted on all bars under normal conditions

er... I meant "all staves", of course. SAT.

Reply 3 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 20-Oct-1999

Logic tells me that NWC would look for verse one lyrics to be attached to music ending with special ending one. Therefore, I suggest you leave lyrics for verse one blank, and put verse one into verse two window, and verse two where verse three would normally be. Feel free to email me.


#1273: Change of Key when importing from midi
Change of Key when importing from midi

(1273)

Submitted by: Jean-Louis on 11-Oct-1999

The only way I found to do that is to edit the midi file (using tools from Günter Nagler) and to manualy add a "key" command.

Do you know other way to do that ?
Inside NoteWorthy Composer ?

Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Oct-1999

Do it manually after the import is complete.

If a key signature is not present, add a C Major key signature to the staff, and proceed as follows.

Once a key signature is present, then use the change key signature procedure, as outlined in the latest User's Guide (Bersion 1.55, Page 21), help file (Common Question #6), or the forum thread at msg #3.

See also: msg #1026,msg #1089, msg #762


#1274: Printing 500 songs
Printing 500 songs

(1274)

Submitted by: Sam on 11-Oct-1999

Hi all,
I need to print around 500 songs (*.nwc files)....

Is there any way to automat the process ?
Like...I give the folder name and NWC prints all the *.nwc files in it.

I know I can open an nwc file from command line
("nwc32 \samples\jingle.nwc", in DOS prompt, opens the jingle.nwc)
Is there any way to print na nwc file in this fation....

thanks in advance
-Sam

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Oct-1999

There is no elegant way to automate the process of printing multiple files within NWC. Your best bet might be to load a group of files, in blocks, and perform a File | Print and Close on each file, in sequence. Once a batch is finished, start a new batch. The size of each batch depends on how much memory you have on your system. The more memory you have, the more song files can be loaded at one time.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 11-Oct-1999

If all your files are in the same directory, I can see two ways: a .bat file under dos, or a macro-recorder solution.

for the .Bat file, think of the "start /w " command to add to each file name (obtained in foobar.bat with "dir /w *.nwc > foobar.bat); for the macro, remember that you can memorize the current file name into the clipboard (provided you don't use it for something else).

Sorry, ain't got more time tonite for more details, ask for more if you can't find out.
but first of all, r u sure that all your files are in correct layout state (Landscape||Portrait,...) ?

HTH,
     Dominique

Reply 3 offered by: Sam on 12-Oct-1999

Dear Mr. Dominique,
Thanks for your hint....

The DOS batch file approach seem OK ( I am more comfortable with DOS)
I understand that I can start NWC with a .nwc file using "start /w"
But... how do I ask NWC to print it... and then exit (so that I do not have 500 NWCs open)

Page layout of all the songs are OK...
Even if it is not, it is OK because I am printing it for verification only...

thanks in advance

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 12-Oct-1999

There is no known way to make NWC print automatically.
But as it is always the same process:
  Enter (in WinFile/Explorer), to open the file;
[then in NWC:]
  Enter(if you have tips activated), to close the tips window;
  Ctrl-P,      to call the print window
  Enter,        to validate
  Alt-F4      to close NWC
[then in WinFile/Explorer]
  Down arrow    to go to next file. then go to step 1: Enter...
and that's why I proposed the "macro" way.

But the batch approach is correct, since the '/w' option of "start " make the dos session Wait for the called program to close. Hence you won't have 500 NWCs simultaneously, only one at each time.

To create your batch file, copy all your files in a temporary directory, then type:
dir /w *.nwc > foobar.bat
notepad foobar.bat
[remove the 4 first lines and 2 last lines; type in
[enter]start /w
select and copy this (linefeed included), and paste it before each name : Ctrl-Right, Ctrl-V, Ctrl-Right, Ctrl-V...
you should now have each filename, one per line, with start /w before it.]
Now run it:
foobar

for instance, if you got file1.nwc and file2.nwc in the current directory, the command hereover will create foobar.bat containing:

Le volume dans le lecteur C n'a pas de nom
Le numéro de série du volume est 253D-14ED
Répertoire de C:\Mes_documents\madmarsu\music\partitio.ns!\Temp

FILE1.NWC       FILE2.NWC
2 fichier(s) 100 087 octets
0 répertoire(s) 82 124 800 octets libres

and after edition:

start /w FILE1.NWC
start /w FILE2.NWC

Hope this is clear enough :-)

P.S. Do not forget to feed your printer :-)

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Pearson on 14-Oct-1999

Dominique: I am a relative dunce with DOS commands and batch files.

I ended up with a batch file that looked like start /w "file.name". The batch file would bring up the file. However, it would not automatically print and then close the file or program. What am I doing wrong? Better yet, could you perhaps post or email the bat file? I suspect it could be useful for many folks who need to print multiple NWC files.

(P.S. I also tried a macro with the windows recorder. However, I am not sure how to get it to pause and allow me to select the file for printing and/or how to cause the macro to run several times in a row. Essentially, when I recorded the macro and selected a file during the recording, the macro [logically] would thereafter only select that file and print it. Any suggestions?)

(P.P.S. to Eric: any chance we could get Noteworthy in the next version to simply print through windows as a registered extension?)

Reply 6 offered by: Sam on 20-Oct-1999

Hi,
I have tried to solve this, using a automation tool called "Rational Visual Test" (RVT). I have written a script (see below) to automat Open-Print-Close cycle using RVT.
The script is well commented to make it easy to understand every line of code.

This RVT allows us to simulate key-presses and mouse-clicks apart from many other useful features...
Visit "http://www.rational.com/products/visual_test/index.jtmpl" to know more about "Visual Test"

An Evaluation version of this is available in this location... but I have not tried it
(My script was written using licenced version... hope it works in evaluation version as well)

Please Cut & Paste the following text in say 'notepad' to view this properly...

To execute...
1. Open RVT

2. Cut & Paste the following text in a new file in RVT. Save it as <filename.mst>

3. Click on <Test/Compile...>

4. click on <Test/Go>

5. Do not use keyboad/mouse till the script is over.

'===========================================================
'PrintNWC.mst
'===========================================================
'This script was written in "Rational Visual Test 4.0r"
'The script language look (somewhat) like the good old "BASIC"
'Visit "http://www.rational.com/products/visual_test/index.jtmpl" to know more about "Visual Test"

DIM NWC_File_Name	As String
DIM Count	As Integer

'Executes NWC (please check the location of nwc32.exe in your machine and change the following line if required)'
run "C:\progra~1\notewo~2\nwc32", NOWAIT , SW_NORMAL

'Opens the text file containing the file names of all the .nwc files that need to be printed.
'(please check the location and name of the text file in your machine and change the following line if required)'
'To creat this "songlist.txt", type "dir *.nwc /b > songlist.txt" (without "") in DOS prompt
Open "c:\t\songlist.txt" For Input As #1

Count=0 ' Inititalising the Count

Do	'Repeats "Open-Print-Close" cycle till the end of "songlist.txt"
LINE INPUT #1,NWC_File_Name	'Reads the .nwc filenames, one at a time

WMenuSelect("&File\&Open...")	'Invoke "Open" dlgs that .nwc file in NWC
Play "c:\t\"+NWC_File_Name	'Types the folder name + file name (U may need 2 change the folder name)
WButtonClick("&Open")	'Clicks "Open" button

WMenuSelect("&File\&Print...")	'Opens the "Print" dlg
WButtonClick("OK")	'Clicks "OK" to start printing

'sleep 2	'Uncomment this line and change the value if required

WMenuSelect("&File\&Close")	'Closes the .nwc File and Clicks on "No" if "Save Confirmation" dlg appears
If WFndWnd("Save Confirmation") <> 0 Then WButtonClick("&No")

Count=Count+1	'Keeps a count of howmany files were printed
Print "Printing "+NWC_File_Name	'Displays the filename being printed
Loop Until EOF(1)	'Loops Until EOF is reached

Print "Number of files Printed : "+ str$(Count)	'Displays howmany files were printed.
Close #1	'Closes "songlist.txt"
End	'Terminates the Script
'===========================================================
'End of PrintNWC.mst
'===========================================================

I'll be happy to help, if you have any problem using this script...

Please give your feed back (even if it works perfectly ???)

Happy Printing
- Sam

Reply 7 offered by: Sam on 20-Oct-1999

Oooh... the format of the script looks horrible...
Whatever indentation I had given seems to have lost...

Please note that, any text which appear after a single quote ( ' ) is a comment...
If you insert few tabs after each ', it will be more readable...

However, if you are viewing the script in RVT, you may not have the problem, since RVT has syntax coloring...

thanks
-Sam


#1275: transferring midi from Noteworty to Band-in-abox
transferring midi from Noteworty to Band-in-abox

(1275)

Submitted by: Robert Beohm on 12-Oct-1999

Any way I can transfer a complete score from Noteworty to
Band-in-a-box and then arrange the chord playback in band-in-abox? How do I get the score NWC file transferred into
Band-in-abox step by step-I am a novice-Please help.Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-Oct-1999

You can import the melody line into BIB but not anyother voices.
When importing you must know the channel that contains the melody in the midi file.

Reply 2 offered by: Joel Cress on 14-Oct-1999

See http://www.pgmusic.com under Tech Support FAQ to see a good article about importing MIDI into BiaB to create new styles. However, it appears that you want BiaB to be able to determine chords directly from the MIDI file; BiaB does not have this capability (I don't know of any product that does, due to the complexity of melody to chord assignment).

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Oct-1999

Actually, the Cubase family of sequencers (and probably others) display the chord of the moment as the file is playing. It's usually not too far off, but often tries to include passing tones in the chord description, coming up with some pretty exotic-looking chord designations...


#1276: how can I change the dinamics?
how can I change the dinamics?

(1276)

Submitted by: Carlo Zerri on 12-Oct-1999

With my soundcard (SBlive basic) I hear the p dinamic as ppp
(too soft) and f as fff, so that the range is not as a real performance. How can I change the sensitivity of my soundcard without change the dinamics?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Oct-1999

I don't think you can change the range of your soundcard, but you can change the range of your dynamics by clicking the "Over-ride default velocity" checkbox. For instance, p is defaulted at 45. If you change it to p(60,-) it will be as loud as mp is by default.


#1277: NWC Library
NWC Library

(1277)

Submitted by: BennyBoy on 13-Oct-1999

Anyone know of a place to download a lot of NWC composed files? Like a music library?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard on 13-Oct-1999

The NoteWorthy Scriptorium has been set up by NoteWorthy users and includes all sorts of useful files and information together with a database of NoteWorthy files supplied by users.

The address is http://www.vadu.com/nwc

HTH.

Rich.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Oct-1999

You might also enjoy the NWC webring, at:

http://www.webring.org/cgi-bin/webring?ring=nwcring;list


#1278: How to move a staff after the beginning?
How to move a staff after the beginning?

(1278)

Submitted by: Carlo Zerri on 14-Oct-1999

In some score, one or more staffs begin after the beginning of the score, but after.
Ex: a vocal staff may start after an instrumental intro.
Is it possible to do this, or the only choice is a series of empty bars?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 15-Oct-1999

See the discussion in msg #1270


#1279: Sound font ftp site open
Sound font ftp site open

(1279)

Submitted by: Richard DeCosta on 15-Oct-1999

ftp://soundfonts:soundfonts@207.140.1.221/

Come give & take!

Reply 1 offered by: Sterhgios Moschos on 29-Oct-1999

At Last!

Man you are the best.
Can you provide however better connection info?
What is the Ip? ftp://soundfonts:soundfonts
or 207.140.1.221
because the entry you have given looks more like a email addy.
Port?
L/P or is it Anonymous?

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 02-Nov-1999

This syntax is for non-anonymous FTP:

ftp://user:passwd@address

It is equivalent to this FTP connection:

ftp 207.140.1.221
user: soundfonts
passwd: soundfonts

Reply 3 offered by: Matt Kent on 29-Dec-1999

I want these soundfonts from your ftp server too. But i haven't got a cluse what you lot are talking about - can you tell me how i get onto your ftp site and i'll gladly come and 'give and take'.

Matty K

Reply 4 offered by: John Gillings on 31-Dec-1999

Matty,

> can you tell me how i get onto your ftp site

Well, in theory, you should just type

!ftp://soundfonts:soundfonts@207.140.1.221/

into tyour browser and it should connect you. It doesn't
work for me, but that might have something to do with the
firewall I'm behind.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Dec-1999

Doesn't work for me either (no firewall here), I just get the message "Server not responding."

Reply 6 offered by: dave hall on 23-Jan-2000

and no luck here either- any chance of an idiot guide......?

Reply 7 offered by: dave hall on 23-Jan-2000

and then there was light.....
ftp://soundfonts:soundfonts@207.140.1.221/
in address bar gets you there (or it did me anyway)
thanks for a top site- will be adding to it some more....

Reply 8 offered by: johnny duchesneau on 30-Jan-2000

Didn't work for me.

Reply 9 offered by: Confused! on 12-Feb-2001

It did work for me to find the server but the PW was wrong
USR: soundfonts
PW: soundfonts

Have the PW been changed?

Reply 10 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 12-Feb-2001

Try using "GetRight Browser" instead of any ftp client or web browser. It works great with download-only ftp connections.

Hth

Reply 11 offered by: Artur on 14-Feb-2001

Even in GetRight Browser, it sends me that message (in the bottom of the browser) disconnected from server

Reply 12 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 14-Feb-2001

You're right. I tried to enter "soundfonts" for username and password as mentioned at the beginning of the thread but it didn't work.

Actually, it was several months ago when I had last logged in and downloaded an amountful of sf's. I have to admit that just a few of them are useful.

http://www.hammersound.net appears to be a better resource except for its "strange" cgi download script which causes GetRight confuse handling the process.

Regards

Reply 13 offered by: Artur on 16-Feb-2001

Thanx Ertugrul for the page, I found it very nice, but this question maybe a little late..... how the heck do I use sound fonts?

Reply 14 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Feb-2001

Artur, your question in the message 13 seems to imply that you don't have a soundcard that supports sound fonts directly. If this is the case, you can still experiment with these using a shareware program called "Audio Compositor" available from http://home.att.net/~audiocompositor/ .

If your is indeed sound-font based (the later Sound Blasters) then you might want to spend some time with the documentation and help files for a rundown on this.

Reply 15 offered by: Artur on 17-Feb-2001

do you know if Awe32 does that?

Reply 16 offered by: Fred on 17-Feb-2001

Yes. A search on Google for "AWE32 soundfonts" turns up lots of results.

Reply 17 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Feb-2001

If your AWE32 has an expansion slot on the side of the card you can add 30 pin SIMMS in pairs.
2x2Mb, 2x4Mb or 2x16Mb.
A pair of 4Mb SIMMS are the easiest to find and cost less than $10US - with these you can load an 8Mb soundfont.
The cost of a pair of 16Mb SIMMS (if you can find them)is the nearly the cost of an SB Live value card.
So if you want to use soundfonts larger than 8Mb you'd be better off with a new Live card.
Try http://www.hammersound.net and search the Soundfont Collections on the site.


#1280: strange effect of breath marks on playback
strange effect of breath marks on playback

(1280)

Submitted by: Grant Hicks on 16-Oct-1999

I've noticed that if I insert a breath mark with delay into a score and then begin playback at any point following the breath mark, the playback only begins after a delay which is proportional (identical?) to the breath mark delay I've specified. This gets on my nerves. Is it a bug or merely a feature whose utility I haven't yet fathomed?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Oct-1999

Thanks for the report. I confirm your finding. We will fix this in the next release.

Reply 2 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 16-Oct-1999

The same thing happens with Fermatas.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Oct-1999

The same fix applies for fermata delay.


#1281: quarter tone
quarter tone

(1281)

Submitted by: saeed on 17-Oct-1999

I like to know that if i can play back a quater tone flat or sharp using N.W composer shareware version

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Oct-1999

It can be done using pitch bends, but it is not easy. Details can be found at msg #504.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 17-Oct-1999

Also check a suite of programs by NWC enthusiast Fred Nachbaur, which diddle around with several aspects of harmony and temperament in MIDI. They can be found on the Noteworthy Scriptorium (a user based archive of many things NWC) at http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Fred's stuff is at
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Harmony

A


#1283: Rachmaninoff
Rachmaninoff

(1283)

Submitted by: Dudley on 18-Oct-1999

Anybody know where I can find a few NWC files for Rachmaninoff or Holst?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 18-Oct-1999

Directly, I think there is none. But you may refer to msg #1277 to get to good NWC sites.

You may also look for midi files thnaks to http://www.prs.net/midi.html or http://www.prs.net/midi_src.html ...

HTH,
Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Oct-1999

I have two Holst songs at http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/Choir/1724/#choir

You may want to look at the Gustav Holst web page at http://wso.williams.edu/~ktaylor/gholst

Reply 3 offered by: Brett Hope on 10-Nov-1999

Try the "Classical Music Archives" at http://www.prs.net/midi.html#index

The Rachmaninoff 2nd Piano Concerto is there and a good rendition of "Bless the Lord, O My Soul". There may be more. Anyway, it's a fabulous source for classical MIDI music.


#1284: Bad format when using Pick Up Notes
Bad format when using Pick Up Notes

(1284)

Submitted by: Jaicket on 18-Oct-1999

The type of music I write always involves a pick up note, this is a beat in a bar of its own at the start of the tune, which is made up in rhythm at the end. Although NWC tells me how to Audit Bar lines with a pick up note, it doesn't say how to align the page properly, because on a print preview, the sections begin and end at all the wrong places, can anyone help?

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 19-Oct-1999

I must have missed this. How do you audit pieces with a pickup note?

Reply 2 offered by: Jaicket on 19-Oct-1999

Instead of having perfectly set out music (such as 4 bars per line, or something similar) when you involve a pick up note, it becomes a bit complicated, but INSTEAD of having 4 bars per line, you have the pick up note, plus the first 4 bars in the first line, then 4 bars in the next, etc, etc, then the last one has 3 bars plus the remainder of beats left over by the pick up note.

"Help" gives clear instructions on how to audit these types of music : You simply change the bar line to a double, then audit as usual, but it seems impossible to align these in the printouts or print previews... HELP, pleeeeeeease!!

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Oct-1999

Audit bar lines has nothing to do with the printed output. That depends on the contents of the measures, so it was a coincidence that you got exactly 4 bars per line each time. You can fiddle with things like staff point size and margins, or pad certain bars with (Insert Text, preserve width on) blanks to make them wider so they break sooner.

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 20-Oct-1999

Ah. I'd been temporarily adding rests to fill the first measure, and then removing them.

I have noticed that some publishers use a double bar at
the end of each line (musical line, not physical printed line)--even where it falls in the middle of the measure. I think that if you do this, Noteworthy will place printed-line breaks at the double lines if that is
"convenient."

Reply 5 offered by: Jaicket on 20-Oct-1999

I've basically given up on the idea of professionalism on this thing! It seems that if you want justification with pick up notes, you just have to insert rogue bar notes to even things up..... it looks better than it did, I swear!!

Maybe this feature will be yet improved upon in later versions...?

Reply 6 offered by: Victorious Jaicket on 20-Oct-1999

Hang on... an earlier message gave me sight to fix the problem, provided you are willing to take the time, it is possible to pad out the lines by entering lines of lyrics, but of course, this makes ugly words appear on your music.

I looked up help on Lyrics, and from there I worked out that by entering something like ___ ___ ___ (using underscores instead of words) it's possible to spread out the bars without having text appear, and the more underscores/less spaces you use, the more space you leave... and what's even better is that it doesn't even look out of place, if it's done in moderation!

Thanks all for your help, but I eventually used my own initiative!!!

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 21-Oct-1999

Jaicket,

I don't understand the need you had to use Lyrics (or teXt items, which is another solution) for your problem.
Or, more precisely, I do *not* see the relation with "pick up notes". Whatever the notes or bars are, NWC will act the same, i.e it will place line break where it is logical.

Anyway, when you mention "I've basically given up on the idea of professionalism on this thing", I'm sure you've been missing a great part of NWC capabilities.
I don't say that NWC can do everything, but usually it does it more quickly and more properly than many other "tenors" of scoring programs.

And a specially good thing with NWC, is that you can act on it by submitting wishes on the wish list... I know that some wishes get realized, often at the perfect time when I needed it deeply. I especially think of ...lyrics, since I "met" NWC in a version which did not have this, and that decided me on registering the program. I also "eventually used my own initiative" more than once, but never regretted to use NWC. And to ask questions on this forum either, thanks to the other users.

I still can't figure what your trouble was, maybe it was not clear enough? Often a good small example (an .NWC file you upload somewhere in which you put an extract of your file which causes your trouble) is the best explanation. But this is more convenient on the newsgroup I think, since you can attach files there.

Hoping that your solution is convenient,

NWCly yours,
   Dominique

Reply 8 offered by: Jaicket on 21-Oct-1999

I can assure you, my problem was possibly not very common, but 100% genuine, and an apparent flaw in NWC. For those of you interested, I've included two files of the same song in a newsgroup email with the subject "Miracle Lyrics: Solved"

I have added the request into the wish list, but since you lot don't know what I'm blabbering on about, there's every chance he wont either, so, I guess I'll just carry on the way I'm doing.


#1285: Player piano
Player piano

(1285)

Submitted by: Kevin McCoy on 19-Oct-1999

I just started college this fall, and am constantly being amazed at all the cool stuff they have in the music department. I haven't even gotten into the midi lab, yet. But by far the coolest thing I've seen was a player piano that worked on MIDI. When I saw it in use, it was playing the accompaniment to a trombone solo. A laptop computer ran the software, and connected to this black Yamaha upright piano. The keys and pedals moved according to the MIDI commands, causing real hammers to hit real strings -- no synthesized sounds here, a nice way to overcome what is in my opinion the biggest limitation of MIDI, that is to say, the inability of synthesized sound to be on par with acoustic instruments.

Has anyone else seen anything like this? I was thinking that many percussion instruments would be relatively easy to turn into this sort of MIDI device. Wind instruments would present an interesting challenge...

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 20-Oct-1999

Until last year I worked just around the corner from the famous Harrods department store in London. They have a player piano on every floor. I sometimes spent my lunch hour just admiring the phantom piansts. In their music department you can buy the pianos and also software to play on them (Is this really in midi format? I seem to recall it was sold as ROM cartidges) The best bit is that you can buy performances by particular pianists.

Regarding midi wind instruments. I have seen a blown midi input device. I haven't managed to get my mouth around one and I'm not sure what principle it operates on. However, it looks a bit like a childrens toy soprano sax. I understand that it can be progammed to generate pitches according to the fingerings of a range of woodwind instruments and to generate volume information according to breath pressure. I have a mail order catalogue somewhere with some more details which I will pass unless someone else provides more complete information before I unearth it.

But the point about the player piano is that it is a midi (or whaterver) output device. The mind boggles to think how you could achieve a midi controlled wind instrument output device - or does anyone know of one?

To avoid the problems of controlling emboucher perhaps something like bagpipes would be the easiest to achieve. Project for a rainy day - build some midi bagpipes.

Reply 2 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 30-Oct-1999

A friend of mine had/has (he moved to La Jolla, California, a couple of years ago, and I haven't seen him for a while) had one of those, an upright Yamaha Disclavier (sp?) While he is a Computer Science professor at U. of Cal., San Diego, he is also an talented musician, and he will improvise on the piano, recording the midi, then edit the midi to fix wrong notes, polish the timing, etc., etc., and finally print out a score.

AND -- if you go to www.deger.com you will find a source for a midi bagpipe, except I think it only records, it doesn't play back.

Cyril

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 31-Oct-1999

Cyril wrote:

...... a midi bagpipe, except I think it only records, it doesn't play back.

That's a relief!!

Barry Graham

Reply 4 offered by: Allistair Bywater on 18-Nov-1999

You may be interested to know that you get MIDI'd pipe organs as well. About 10 yrs ago I went to a concert of Carlo Curley's in a nice church in Hammersnith (London, England) near the flyover. Partway through a piece, we suddenly saw him stroll into the body of the church and sit down to listen to his own performance. It created quite a stir!

I was in Harrods a couple of years ago, pity I missed the Midi/player pianos.


#1289: Detuning Noted from within NWC
Detuning Noted from within NWC

(1289)

Submitted by: stergios moschos on 29-Oct-1999

Now this is gonna be a good one.
Is it possible to detune slightly a note from within NWC?
What I mean is can one make a B sound something between B and B# for example?

I am asking because this would enable multiple usage of channels assigned the same instrument yielding a more "realistic" sound for e.g. violins or two guitars playing the same notes at sync. This would more sound like two guys that have manually tuned their guitars, but as usual tuning would not be absolutely perfect. Soundfonts on the other hand use e.g. one guitar sample zone that then can be assigned to two channels. But that will not sound like two fellas playing the same notes at sync. Detuning one of them just a trifle will make it sound more realistic!

(P.S: Am I asking for too much maybe???)

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Oct-1999

You can use the Pitch Bend controller to detune one of your parts. Details can be found in msg #905, and other links in that message.

Reply 2 offered by: Stan on 31-Dec-1999

You can do this using a "multi-point controller." Just for grins, I made a file called "badpiano.nwc" which sounds like a bar-room piano. It uses 3 pianos playing in unison, but one is tuned a little high and one a little low. So it sounds like the 3 strings of each piano note are a bit out of whack. The only unrealistic part is that they are all exactly out of whack by the same number of cents. However, the beat notes you hear change with the pitch since the absolute difference in frequency changes as you go up the scale.


#1290: Fermata on the bar line
Fermata on the bar line

(1290)

Submitted by: Peter Edwards on 31-Oct-1999

I've just been notating some early music (Purcell) which places a fermata on the double bar line. This, I take it, is meant to be a GP silence (to let the echo die down?) before the next section starts. NWC however seems to apply it to the next note.

Now I know that a breath mark is the preferred option, but even if I put a breath mark on one of the conductor part (with the desired break figure) it still doesn't seem to work.

Help!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Oct-1999

Noted. We will fix this in the next release (provide the ability to center the fermata over a following bar line).


#1291: Bagpipe music gracenotes
Bagpipe music gracenotes

(1291)

Submitted by: Jim Quinby on 01-Nov-1999

Bagpipe music has a number of standard gracenote embellishments, ranging from 1 to 4-5 quick (32-nd) notes tied together. They go under the names of grips, pinky birls, tarleuths, doublings, etc. NWC provides tied gracenote notation, but entry can become tedious.

Here's my question: can a user customize the note toolbar with CUSTOM notes (in this case custom gracenote patterns)? In other words, I would like to create buttons (icons) for inserting these grips, birls, etc.
Can this be accomplished with NWC?

Thanks from a new NWC user,
Jim Q.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 02-Nov-1999

You could investigate using the Macro Recorder which came with Win 3.1.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Nov-1999

Although you can customize the toolbars, you cannot add arbitrary new capabilities, such as what you want. As suggested above, a macro capability seems to be closer to what you want. The capability you want is not natively supported in NWC.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 05-Nov-1999

In the mean time, creating yourself a library NWC file of these things would probably suffice for quick copy/pasting.

A


#1292: Chord Progression Theory.
Chord Progression Theory.

(1292)

Submitted by: Drake Kay on 05-Nov-1999

I know this has little to nothing to do with noteworthy composer.. Though I own this program. I am having trouble understanding chord progressions for guitar,, specificaly how they tie in with scales modes and vice versa,, I really need a hint to something to help better understand chord progressions,,, is there some shareware or online read that I may look into.. or is there a book out there that I can spend hard earned money to learn this... Please help,, Im struggling...
sincerely
Drake Kay

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 05-Nov-1999

The following web page has some useful stuff on the Jazz side of things.

http://www.outsideshore.com/primer/primer/index.html

Reply 2 offered by: Dorian Barker on 25-May-2000

I dont have much time. So... e-mail me and we will meet at a chat room or something.

Dorian


#1293: Hymn Verses
Hymn Verses

(1293)

Submitted by: JohnW on 05-Nov-1999

I'm very new to NWC (I only bought the prog today

Having transposed some hymn lyrics under staffs, I want to add several other text verses below the staffs (in the method of a hymn book) but be darned if I can find out the way to do it

Help please

TIA

JohnW
Scotland, UK

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Nov-1999

Currently, you cannot add the extra verses at the end of your score using NWC. However, there is a work around. If you are printing or publishing a piece of music, you can create the effect using NWC in conjunction with some other page layout program. You goto File | Print Preview, view the last page, then use Copy to create an image of the page. You can then load the image into page layout programs and add the other verses.

See also: msg #526, msg #552, msg #1097, msg #117, msg #431, msg #528, msg #868

Reply 2 offered by: JohnW on 17-Nov-1999

I have tried <preview> then copy to clipboard. I opened up Word97 and pasted the clipboard but it was such a big picture, it took a long time to get the copy on to the page and re-size it.

Perhaps one of the early replies about printing, cutting and glueing wasn't a bad idea!!

JohnW
Scotland, UK


#1294: Importing Triplets
Importing Triplets

(1294)

Submitted by: Simon Biber on 06-Nov-1999

How can I make it automatically make triplets when I import a MIDI file? It sounds awful playing with dotted-note approximations.

There's too many of them for me to do it all manually.

Simon.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 07-Nov-1999

You can really speed up the conversion process using a macro.
Once the macro records your keystrokes it only requires one key combo to convert each 1/8 and 1/16 note group to triplets.
Try the Scriptorium for the source of the old Win3.1 macro recorder or download the Old Dos file from Microsoft.

Reply 2 offered by: Rick Knight on 27-Nov-1999

Barry, can you clarify this further? I am not sure what sort of macros you are talking about. Besides, I find that NWC does not always create the same note sequences for every triplet. This is a real problem particularly for importing jazz MIDI files, and I think NWC needs to address it in the software. Perhaps there can be a selection in the Import Wizard to "recognize triplets"?

Note to self: Let NWC know about this.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Nov-1999

Rick,

You may be right about the grouping of imported triplets.
I find that if you import at the same resolution the grouping is usually the same.
At a 1/16th resolution the group is usually 1/16 - 1/8 - 1/16 but it depends on how the original midi file was written.

Even so you can write different macros for each case if you wish.

Did you check the scriptorium for the source of the macro recorder?
If not go to the Microsoft site and download the 'Old Dos' zip file.
If you have a copy of Win3.x - it should also have a copy of the macro recorder.

Get back to me after you get a copy.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Nov-1999

While at the Scripto, download Andrew's ntworthy.rec collection of Recorder macros. It includes several different triplettising macros, plus a bunch of other neat tools.

Reply 5 offered by: Dinka Doo on 01-Dec-1999

someone has got to tackle this huge software limitation, and add a triplets import feature to noteworthy. have they even thought of it?

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Dec-1999

Agreed to the first point, and yes to the second. There was quite a lengthy discussion on this topic on the forum some time ago. It should be noted that even much more expensive (and complex) sequencer programs have difficulty importing triplets (let alone n-tuplets), so it appears that the coding for this sort of thing is quite tricky. That being said, maybe it'll happen in a future release if we all wish for it -- a great many such wishes have already been "granted."

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 8 offered by: William Kreamer on 03-Dec-1999

Importing MIDI triplets: If you are adding a part to a .nwc composition. Try changing the time signature from, say, 4/4 to 12/8. Specify dotted quarter to the old quarter note tempo. Triplets will come out as eighth notes.

Reply 9 offered by: dinka on 03-Dec-1999

12/8 time is admittedly pretty useless. when music is in triplets it's 99.99% of the time written in 4/4. (unless it's a waltz). When a file is imported, all the note's timings are read and notated in their proper time, for example as eigths and stuff. it wouldn't take much at all to add a few more lines of code to notate triplet notes when nwc comes across them.


#1295: uneven lines in preview and export.
uneven lines in preview and export.

(1295)

Submitted by: Paul Borisoff on 08-Nov-1999

I submitted this last year. This year I have a new computer with s3 verge video card and new monitor.
My resolution is 800 x600

Printing is fine, but any form of export, capture or driver produces a picture file with uneven staff lines.
Zooming way in will usually even it out. Printing from the affected program produces same bad results.

Happens in all programs.

The initial noteworthy screen is fine and so is the printing. Preview and any other rendition through clipboard or file is ill.

Submitted by: Paul on 08-Sep-1998

In Print Preview the staff lines reproduce unevenly. Some bleed together as one thick one. Changing resolution doesn't help.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 08-Sep-1998

This happens in many programs (MS Word, for example). Which resolutions did you use? Did zooming in resolve it?
Does it print okay regardless?

Reply 1 offered by: MMario on 08-Nov-1999

This happens with a lot of programs. As long as zooming in fixes it,and it prints okay; it is something you have to live with, unless you want to go to the expense of getting acustom monitor which will display entire page at full resolution.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Nov-1999

This problem is called "aliasing", and the way around it is (appropriately enough) "anti-aliasing." I do my final preview edits using Ghostscript/GSview, which support anti-aliasing in its screen display (click Media --> Display Settings --> set Text Alpha and Graphic Alpha to 4 bits. While you're there, set your resolution; about 100 dpi would be the limit for 800x600). Here's how it works:

1: Install the "Applewriter Plus" Postscript driver on your computer (from the Windows installation disk), connect it to "File".

2: From within NWC (or whatever other application) print your files to this "virtual printer". It will create a .prn file wherever you specify. I suggest renaming it with a .ps extension for consistency with the rest of the world, though GSview will still open it with the .prn extension.

3: Open the file with GSview. You can use ALT-TAB to switch back and forth between NWC (or whatever) and GSview.

Make your changes, and re-print to the same file (overwriting the original one). GSview will detect if the file has been changed, and reload it. Note: if you get funny errors, just go back to page 1 (shortcut: press the G key).

HTH
Fred

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Nov-1999

It is important to understand that the resolution of your display/monitor is probably vastly different from the resolution for your printer. When using NWC's File | Print Preview feature, you are viewing the printed music material converted to the resolution of your display. It is perfectly normal for some visible distortion to appear, since not all of the detail sent to the printer can be shown all at once on the monitor screen. As you zoom in, you start to view smaller sections of the printed page, and the added detail sent to the printer becomes "viewable" on the monitor.

When creating graphics from the meta-file data in NWC's File | Print Preview feature, you need to select your graphic's display resolution carefully. If you intend for it to be viewed on screen, it is better to target a roughly 72 dpi graphic resolution. If you intend to print the graphic, you should use the resolution of your target printer (common resolutions are 300 dpi and 600 dpi).

See also: msg #64, msg #140, msg #263, msg #431, msg #713, msg #767, msg #871, msg #874, msg #1115, msg #1183, msg #1221


#1296: poor preview image...
poor preview image...

(1296)

Submitted by: Paul H. Borisoff on 08-Nov-1999

I have put the problem of poor image export quality forward several times. With the same questions asked so many times by other and seemingly never answered in a straight forward way, I am concluding that NWC cannot export a descent images to any word processing, ghostwrite, publisher, corel draw program. It just doesn't seem possible to improve on an image that the Nwc program produces poorly to start with.

It has been suggested that the monitor resolution is to blame, being lower than the print.

My question is how come NWC doesn't resolve this issue with a clear method. It is a shame that such a beautiful program can't export and that one would have to pull out ones hair to find a work around.

If there is a way to do this, then say so.
Otherwise admit that it won't.

The most logical method seemed to be the apple ps driver trick. The results however were worse than ever.

I have been trying to do this for six months and I am tired.
From what I can make of it, really, is that NWC has programing shortcomings.

Paul

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 08-Nov-1999

I've had problems with importing images to some programs.
But I suggest the problem is with those programs rather than the metafiles generated by NWC since the same image produces different results in different applications.

Until recently I used Coreldraw 4 which seemed to displace the notes against the staff lines.
But the same image imported beautifully into Microsoft Publisher.
I recently upgraded!! to Coreldraw 5 and the problem has disappeared.

Don't blame NWC for the quality of the images - it's probably your other applications.

One thing I have noticed is that the print driver affects the image - I get a better image using a generic Laserjet driver than using the HPLJ4L driver that came with the printer??

Perhaps thats worth a try.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Borisoff on 09-Nov-1999

Finally what seems to work is to print to the Paper Port driver, and then save out the resulting image a jpg file. Then I put the file in Microsoft Word using 1/2 inch margins. The resulting staff lines look bad but print up real well. It seems that what you see is not what you get.
(wysNwyg)

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-Nov-1999

A vector metafile is preferable to any form of bitmap if you intend to change the size of the original to fit the format of a document.

Enlarging or reducing a bitmap creates the jaggies.

Also JPEG has only two formats 24 bit colour and 8 bit greyscale.
If your score is monochrome a 1 bit (black and white) GIF saves a lot of disk space and will occupy considerably less space in your document.

As a comparison - original image 1024x768

Colour 24 bit JPEG - 120kb on disk - 2.3Mb unpacked.
Greyscale 8 bit JPEG - 104kb on disk - 786kb unpacked.
Colour 8 bit GIF - 345kb on disk - 786kb unpacked.
Monochrome 1 bit GIF - 19kb on disk - 98kb unpacked.

Note how compressed the JPEG format is.
Even the 256 colour GIF occupies 3x the disk space of a full colour JPEG - but if unpacked size (in your document) is important then 256 colour GIF is a reason colour substitute being only 1/4 of the size of an unpacked JPEG.

Did you check out the print quality of an imported metafile?

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 11-Nov-1999

Monochrome RLE (run length encoded BMP) or monochrome or four colour GIF are by far the file formats of choice for black and white bitmaps of text and lines.

JPEG is a "lossy" format, which introduces anomolies into the picture which can be very obvious with straight black and white.

I have always found that exporting a metafile from NWC print preview worked pretty well except that CorelDraw 4 (must be an Australian thing to use an app that is four major updates old!) would displace things.

A


#1297: Cents
Cents

(1297)

Submitted by: Mr. Byrd on 08-Nov-1999

Does anyone know how to convert deviation from equal temperament in cents to NWC's pitch bend number? If so I would like to know, also. thanks in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Nov-1999

Multiply cents by 40.96.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 11-Nov-1999

Fred, I was just wondering about this the other day. Is it part of the MIDI spec that says pitch bend value is a linear function of cents? (It may be other than 40.96 if the global pitch bend is other than two semitones).

Is this something you measured?

A

Reply 3 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 11-Nov-1999

And just to fill some knowledge gaps in my head, ¿how many cents are there in a semitone?

Thanks in advance for any reply,

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Nov-1999

1 semitone = 100 cents (by defintion). 1 semitone = 4096 midi pitch-bend units ("MPBU" to coin an acronym) by implied definition. The default midi pitch-bend range as defined in GM is +/- 1 whole tone, or a range of 4 semitones. Total numeric range of MPBU is 16384 (128 * 128), ergo 1 semitone = 16384/4 = 4096. So 1 cent = 4096/100 = 40.96 MPBU.

Reply 5 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 12-Nov-1999

Thanks, Fred, for a very clear and complete answer to a rather silly question.


#1298: In search of a song: Jesse
In search of a song: Jesse

(1298)

Submitted by: Francois Venter on 09-Nov-1999

Does anybody know where I can get a copy of the following song in MIDI, NWC or sheet music format: Jesse of Joshau Caddision ?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 11-Nov-1999

Try entering the phrase into Altavista, or some other search engine.

Reply 2 offered by: Milton on 12-Nov-1999

Probeer hierdie adres http://ingeb.org/
As jy nie regkom nie e-pos vir Frank. Sy e-posadres is ook op hulle webwerf.


#1299: Help! I can't see!
Help! I can't see!

(1299)

Submitted by: Christian Vind Ludvigsen on 09-Nov-1999

I'm working on my first string quartet, and when writing for the first violin, the high notes disappear up in the tool-bar. What can I do to move all four staves just a bit down on my screen, so I can see what I'm writing. I know that Beethoven was deaf, but I'm (partly) blind, and it is not making it any easier. Is there anyone out there who can help me?

Reply 1 offered by: Milton Webber on 09-Nov-1999

Have you tried increasing the verticle size of the staff?

Find it under Staff, Staff Properties. Click on Visual and adjust the Upper Verticle Size

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 09-Nov-1999

An even quicker way to do this is to click on the 1st violin part (or whatever your top staff is) and then press F2. This will bring up the staff properties window. Then procede as stated in the previous post. This technique is also helpful if you feel your staves are running to close together. I generally adjust upper and/or lower depending on the layout. You can also use this technique to adjust placement for printout (i.e. add vertical height to staves to fill out a full page).

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 11-Nov-1999

If you care about the printout you should reduce the lower Vertical Size of the bottom staff by the same amount you increased the upper staff.

It would be nicer if the top of the viewing area on the screen was the set to the highest object on the top staff when that is above the top of the staff region. Something to wish for. Then you could see everything without messing with the printout. I often have this problem.

By the way, if you have trouble seeing, there is a zoom option on the View menu and the toolbar.


#1300: Notes sound as though accented - cure??
Notes sound as though accented - cure??

(1300)

Submitted by: Brett Hope on 10-Nov-1999

When I enter notes into NWC from my computer keyboard, the resulting MIDI file sounds as though each note has a heavy accent. Piano scores sound as if the notes were pounded out by a hack pianist; every trumpet note is attacked sharply etc. Many MIDI files imported from the internet have the same problem.

I try to soften the sound by slurs, inserting "Legato" on every staff and putting "Tenuto" marks on every note. These help some, but it's still not the smooth effect I'm looking for. I play the resulting MIDI files on a Roland XP-80, and the accents are still there, so it's not just my computer's sound system.

I have a very old SB16 sound card in my computer. Could this be the problem? Will a Sound Blaster "Live" card improve things, or is there another card that works better?

Thanks for any help.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Nov-1999

Try decreasing the MIDI Velocity settings for your imported work. This is done via the Dynamics item.

Reply 2 offered by: Brett Hope on 10-Nov-1999

Thanks for the prompt reply. Reducing the staff Velocity setting seems to serve only to reduce volume. The accents are still there, just softer. I'll experiment some more, but if anyone has any other ideas, they will be appreciated.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Nov-1999

Your biggest problem is that SB16 OPL-3 FM synth. Everything sounds like a cheap electric piano... you'll experience a world of difference with a decent wave-table card.


#1302: Sound Quality
Sound Quality

(1302)

Submitted by: Richard Hart on 12-Nov-1999

This is the best software for score editing - great.
Please can anybody give me any tips on improving sound quality. I have a Soundblaster 16 card at the moment.
I want some piece of kit that I can link to an amp and speakers to give really good, authentic sound. Do I need a better sound card (if so which one) or do I need another piece of kit to generate the sounds.

Thanks,
Richard.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Nov-1999

Agreed that the SB16 FM synth sounds are... well, awful. You basically have two options:

1) A software synth that uses wavetable sounds in RAM. Prerequisite: a fast computer. Even my 300 mHz K6 sometimes stutters during real-time play of dense scores. There are several software packages that use readily available soundfonts, I'm presently evaluating Audio Compositor which seems ok so far.

1a) A less CPU-intense software wave-table program is Wingroove (works acceptably even on a 486-DX2/66). But it also doesn't sound the greatest (imo). Also, I believe it doesn't allow other soundfonts than the one that comes with it.

2) Get a new soundcard. Most AWE64 owners seem to be happy with their unit, as are SBLive owners (with the caveat that SBLive appears to have "funny" dynamics characteristics, making some midis sound way too quiet). These, incidentally, also support the use of alternate soundfonts.

2a) Get a soundcard with a dedicated on-board wavetable synth. I'm very happy with my Yamaha DB50XG-based board.

btw - if your SB16 is one of the ones with a wave-blaster plug-in slot, you can get a DB50XG and plug it right in, using your existing drivers and software.

Reply 2 offered by: Christian Peter on 12-Nov-1999

There is another way to get really realistic
sounds, that is never mentioned here,
because (I suggest) it is professional and not
cheap:
Use professional Samplers
like EMU ESI 4000 (128MB-Sample-MEMORY),
AKAI 5000/6000 (256MB-Sample-MEMORY)
or the so called GIGA-SAMPLER (unlimited Sample-MEMORY)
and Samples-CDs containing the sound (instruments),
you like.
(i.e.
The Synclavier - Sample-Library-Collection,
The Ultimative Piano Collection
- Steinway D, Steinway C, Fazioli F228,
- Bösendorfer 225
Peter Siedlaczek's Advanced Orchestra (1-5+ Up97)
- Full Sinphony Orchestra Samples (great!)
or any Style and instrument, you like.
and so on...

Have a look at:
http://www.bestservice.de/
)

That means a pratice, for sure, you need to use samples
in size above at least 128MByte!

Best Regards
Christian Peter

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 14-Nov-1999

Fred missed one. You can use the MIDI outs of your SB16 to drive a better midi "box" of your choice. eg some Yamaha and Roland keyboards have excellent sounds. Goldstar also to a simple box which takes midi in. I used it for a long time before upgrading to an on-board card which can take soundfonts. The only problem with external MIDIs is that they are normally not upgradable (ie loading new sounds into them is difficult).

Regards
Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Bob Boren on 16-Nov-1999

Hi,

I was facing the same problem as you describe, plus I needed to make sure that whatever I changed to would work with the games that my kids use on our computer. I ended up getting a used Roland SC-88VL Multi-timbral sound generator. I picked it up for around $200. It either plugs into your Midi port on your computer, or your serial port with a special set of drivers. When you un-plug it from your system, it goes back to the normal sound card for game play.
I've used it with my home computer via the midi input and a laptop via the serial input, and both work great. I'm very impressed with the sound capabilities of this unit. I'm in the middle of composing a symphony right now, and this device has really helped out with the orchestration. It will output to your stereo via RCA plugs, so you can listen and tape. These things are pretty expensive new (around $500 bucks or more; Roland's newest unit costs almost $900 bucks), but it was pretty easy to find a used one. The pros probably upgrade as often as they can, and they trade in their old units...
Bob


#1303: Autochording
Autochording

(1303)

Submitted by: Gord on 13-Nov-1999

I have a few hundred songs written in a treble clef melody line. I would like to automate the process of creating the bass clef chording (no hand writing of all the notes, or keyboard play input) and correct to suit after. Is their any way to accomplish this? These songs are psalmody.
Thanks in advance for your replies. (Their is no original music notation to scan in for this either so that option is out)

Gord

PS Great forum!

Reply 1 offered by: Becky on 19-Dec-1999

The best thing I could tell you would to be use the enter text function to put the chord names above the staff. That will at least be understood by other musicians. Hope that helps!


#1304: A#/Bb accidentals
A#/Bb accidentals

(1304)

Submitted by: Phil on 14-Nov-1999

I've noticed that when transposing a staff into another key, where accidentals are present, Noteworthy insists on putting in A#s instead of Bbs, even if transposing into a flat key. Is there a way of specifying preferences re accidentals?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Nov-1999

Not directly, or completely. That is, you have your choice of all-flats in non-scale accidentals (flat keys), or all-sharps (C or sharp keys). However, let's say you have a simple piece in D minor harmonic (one flat, plus all occurrence of C sharped), by default the C#'s will show as Db's. You can change this by 1) forcing accidentals, 2) transposing 0 steps in a sharp key (e.g. G), 3) change the key signature to F/Dm (1 flat), and again transposing 0 steps.


#1305: Guitarmusic
Guitarmusic

(1305)

Submitted by: Hein Berkers on 14-Nov-1999

Hello, I’m a guitar player with medium skills. My stile is fingerpicking. I’m always in search for good arrangements to play. The most of them are to easy or to difficult. So I began to arrange songs by myself. I want to get in touch with anyone that has guitarmusic or arrangements for me. My favorites are standards arranged for guitar. Modern, classic, blues, country it doesn’t matter. They have to be in normal notation and not in tabulator. In exchange I have some of my own compositions and arrangements to offer.

Reply 1 offered by: Eamonn FitzPatrick on 15-Nov-1999

Hein,
If you are into "Shadows" music it would be worth looking at http://scofa.muse.com.au where you will find info on guitar sheet music - Shadows originals and many modern standards arranged for guitar. Hope this helps.

Eamonn

Reply 2 offered by: Jeff Brown on 24-Nov-1999

Great! I'm in the same boat. I have my own website (http://www.guitaricon.com) with some of my stuff posted in
standard notation and tab. I have been trying for some time to typeset music scores for display on webpages. Most music notation software is designed to not do this, which is why I just bought NoteWorthy.


#1306: Editing Lyrics
Editing Lyrics

(1306)

Submitted by: JohnW on 17-Nov-1999

Wouldn't it be nice to be able to directly edit your lyrics after they have been attached to the music without having to leave the score.

Unless you guys know better, the only way I can get to edit the lyrics is to have to go back into the lyric page, edit and then back into the combined score to see whether the editing has been effected in the right place.

JohnW
Scotland, UK

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Nov-1999

Lyric editing in the score would be nice, but it is difficult to achieve. A simpler improvement would be to position the cursor in the lyric editor when you enter it at the word at the insertion point you were at in the score. Add your thoughts to the wish list.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 18-Nov-1999

Finale has that capability (as well as a more workable sequencing capability). I wonder if Eric might be able to do something similar (wish list?) with Noteworthy, without at the same time destroying its capability of readily copying the lyrics into a wordprocessor? The latter capability is very helpful.

I'll pop off a quick wish list note.

P.S. I played around with Finale, but still much prefer Noteworthy for my purposes.

Reply 3 offered by: JohnW on 30-Dec-1999

I also added it to the wish list.

For a non-trained musical person like me, NWC is brilliant and really helps me to understand some of the intricacies of music.

John

Reply 4 offered by: Gord on 12-Feb-2000

OK my bits too,

NWC very nice but in need of some major upgrade for print control, staff management/manipulation. Consider I am writing some stuff for psalms using no bars. Makes for brutal control. Finale is far superior for this kind of manipulation.
Consider open ended staff lines
Clef sign on first line only
Scaling (for output) eg based on page display size or percentage
Lyrics laid out before, middle or end of notes
Auto harmonizing
Lyric presentation control
8 count notes

Keep trying,
Gord

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 12-Feb-2000

It should be pointed out that almost all of the previous poster's "objections" can be easily accomplished using NWC. Others, such as automatic harmonisation, are the composer's job, not the scoring program's. Also, it bears noticing that the poster used an invalid email address.

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 12-Feb-2000

Not so fast, fred.

Lyrics presentation is truly a weak point of NWC.

I've managed to get by with 100-copy one-page runs, but I'm looking a larger lyrics-intensive project and ... NWC's inability to use the horizontal space efficiently in the lyrics layout may push me to Finale. I'm estimating that, counting bloat caused by internal fragmentation across lines and pages, I'm looking at 50% paper waste -- and I could pay for Finale 2000 with the paper savings on a 10,000 - sheet production run.

Now, I don't like Finale. It has a flat learning curve, and the NWC keyboard interface is superior. I still can't figure out how to pay for the extra time it will take to use. I'd probably still input in NWC, then export to midi and import into Finale. But Finale has two features that may be critical. Shape notes (7-note Aiken scheme, in particular) is one. The other is the way that lyrics syllables can be centered under notes, and can use the space under the measure bar lines. I know in your typical pop sheet music the syllables are seldom less than an inch apart -- but hymns are lyrics-intensive. This one feature could turn a four-line hymn into a three-line hymn about half of the time (or conversely, NWC packs a three-line hymn into four lines about half the time.)

[Aside: Note that since this forum is visible to spambots, my e-mail address is invalid -- but a human will have no trouble sending me e-mail.]


#1307: Easy MIDI keyboard record
Easy MIDI keyboard record

(1307)

Submitted by: Dan on 18-Nov-1999

I've checked the FAQ, User Tips, Forum and Newsgroup and cannot seem to find anything on this.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

The MIDI keyboard record feature is what brought me to buy Noteworthy. To be able to play on the keyboard and then view the output and have the output 90% or better consistant with what you played is the problem. The sensitivity of the score seems to be greater than I would like. The user would like to type on the piano keyboard and the quarter notes be quarter notes most of the time. Hey, They are not a perfect pianist but have been recorded and published on a small scale for classical and gospel music.

Any ideas?

Thanks much,

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 19-Nov-1999

In Tools/Options, go to the "Import" tab and set options there. Try various settings of Note/Rest resolutions to find what is best for you.
Those settings are also used for record.
HTH,

Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 22-Nov-1999

Another thing that may help would be to set up a metronome track (a single bar of woodblock with a local repeat of 200 would do it! Put an accent on the first beat to help you find it.).

Then when you record, NWC will play the metronome to help you keep in sync with the start of a bar.

A

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 23-Nov-1999

I too (that's tee double-oh), lack keyboard skills when recording.

I have found that setting the tempo low, adding a click track and selecting the record to buffer option work well for me.

If you record to the buffer you can import your recording to a track several times using variations of the note and rest resolution until you are happy that the combination offers the best result.

When importing to a track all the import dialogue boxes are presented so that you can select the clef split point, note range and note resolutions,etc.

But do not be surprised if your recording looks like a collection of cut toe nails! - mine always do.

Reply 4 offered by: Dan on 23-Nov-1999

Thanks much for your help. My mother who is using the system is not not very computer literate buts is an accomplished performing pianist and wants just to

1) Hit record on the computer
2) Play her song on the MIDI keyboard
3) Hit stop pm the computer
4) Print out the lyrics

Your suggestions should help in the setup to help her do this to the extent that Noteworthy is able. Thanks again.


#1308: Beamed notes and gracenotes
Beamed notes and gracenotes

(1308)

Submitted by: Jim Quinby on 18-Nov-1999

I notice that after gracenotes are inserted between 2 or more beamed notes, the beam is broken. Is there a way to preserve the beamed notes and include the gracenotes?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Nov-1999

The current version does not let you insert anything between beamed notes.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Jun-2000

The next release, version 1.70, supports this notation construction. It will be available soon.


#1309: Gliscendo (Default values for Pitch Bend)
Gliscendo (Default values for Pitch Bend)

(1309)

Submitted by: Maxime Houle on 21-Nov-1999

Hello. I'm want to make a gliscendo with the trombone and authers instruments. What is the default for descend for one subtones, one tones and etc... Thank you for your helping...

Maxime Houle

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 22-Nov-1999

The range for pitch bend is (numerically) -8192 to 8191.
The unofficial default for MIDI is for this to be -2 semitones to +2 semitones. This value can often be changed by special control messages (can't be done in NWC, but can be added later by a MIDI sequencer program).
I think you'll find that -1 semitone is -4096 and +1 semitone is +4095. I'm not sure that the correspondence is guaranteed to be linear, but I think Fred found out that it was anyway.

A


#1311: Multiple Notes
Multiple Notes

(1311)

Submitted by: Jeff H. on 22-Nov-1999

I've been using NWC for only 1 month.. I have the shareware version. I need someone's help ASAP. On sheet music that you buy from retail stores, they have multiple notes on one staff (ex: quarter quarter quarter; and right below it on the same staff is rest half quarter). How can I do this with NWC? Also, if I want an F & G to be played at the same time (half note), how is this possible. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Nov-1999

I take it you are trying to make chords. To do this, place the first note as usual, then place the other notes using Ctrl-Enter (hold down ctrl key while pressing Enter).

Putting a rest in a chord requires use of the stem direction tools (the notes with arrows sticking out of them, also on the Notes menu). If the rest is at the bottom, press stem down, place the rest, then press stem up, then place the other notes in the chord as described above.

By the way, there is no "shareware" (ie. free) version of this program. You have an evaluation version to try out. If you like it, then please buy it. I'm glad I did.


#1313: Rolls for notes...
Rolls for notes...

(1313)

Submitted by: Jason on 24-Nov-1999

I've been trying to place some of my choral music from my Community choir onto NWC and i've come across a song that has a "roll" next to a chord.
(I'm not sure if "roll" is the correct musical term, but it looks like a long squiggly line going vertical).
Does anyone know if NWC has this feature to place this into the selection? If so, can someone tell me how to do it? Thank you all for your time and cooperation.

Jason,
E-mail: jbadwi@yahoo.com

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Nov-1999

What you see is a fast arpeggio.
The chord notes are sounded one after the other.
There is a symbol for it in the Boxmarks font - download from the Scriptorium - the address can be found on this site.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 24-Nov-1999

You can get the Boxmarks font at http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ftp/helpful/boxmarks.zip

This will make you score look right. There are several ways to make it sound right. The simplest is to place grace notes in sequence before the chord. Each grace note should be tied. If this does not sound right, you may have to use regular notes on a hidden playback track.


#1314: SB PCI128's 10 Drum Kits
SB PCI128's 10 Drum Kits

(1314)

Submitted by: Tristan Badger on 26-Nov-1999

I'm using NWC with a Sounblaster PCI128, which apparently has 10 different drum kits, and I want to know how I tell NWC (if possible!) which one to use. I imagine I set the staff to channel 10 as usual, and then play with the Controller 0 and Controller 32 settings to choose between them? If anyone knows, or does this, please let me know, as I haven't got a PCI128 manual, and don't seem to be able to read the ones online despite having Acrobat 4.0.

Rescue me from the boring standard drum kit please!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Yves Grasset on 26-Nov-1999

That's not the bank you have to change (Controllers 0 and 32). Different kits are on different programs (instruments).
See msg #315


#1315: Recording output of Sound Canvas into WAV
Recording output of Sound Canvas into WAV

(1315)

Submitted by: Bob Boren on 30-Nov-1999

Hi,
I've got a Roland Sound Canvas (SC-88VL)that can hook into either my midi port or a serial port. I can connect it to my home stereo to make recordings on a cassette deck via RCA - plug cables. Does anybody out there know if it's possible to record the output of the Sound Canvas into a WAV file (without just using a microphone). Maybe there's some kind of "loop back" connection that can be made, or something like that?
Thanks
Bob

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Dec-1999

If your sound card supports full duplex operation, you can directly record the play back of NoteWorthy Composer using digital audio capture software. The "loop back" is done directly within the card.

There has been much discussion about this over the years, although not specifically about your brand of hardware. Some forum threads you might review include: msg #1003, msg #430, msg #654, msg #1130, msg #928, msg #1207, and msg #1208.

Reply 2 offered by: Michael McIntyre on 09-Dec-1999

I do this all the time with just a cheapo Sound Blaster 16 Value Edition. I have the line-out on my Sound Canvas ported through the line-in on the soundcard so that its on-board mixer can mix SC output with .WAV audio.

This used to be important back when games still had MIDI soundtracks, so I could have both music and sound effects coming through the same set of speakers.

If you check out <a href="http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/music.html">my music page</a> you can hear some .RA files that I recorded using this very setup.


#1319: Upgrading problem
Upgrading problem

(1319)

Submitted by: Bruce J. Clark on 02-Dec-1999

I am a registered user of NoteWorthy Composer. The program NWC32.EXE is in folder C:\NoteWorthy Composer. My old version is 1.50, so I downloaded yesterday the new 1.55 version. When I try to run the upgrade, the setup can not find the NWC32 to upgrade it. The failure message seems to indicate it is looking in C:\Windows. I have tried moving both the old copy and the upgrade to various locations and I always get the same message.

Any suggestions? Thank you.

I really like the program, and have used it extensively for some classical arrangements and for some transpositions.
Bruce Clark

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Dec-1999

Assuming you are using Windows 95 or Windows 98, you either:

- are trying to use the 16-bit upgrade on your 32-bit copy of version 1.50

- do not have the complete set of files from the 1.50 installation (missing files will cause the upgrade to fail)

You can try manually selecting the correct upgrade target folder, or you can simply download the complete 1.55 setup program.

Reply 2 offered by: Bruce J. Clark on 05-Dec-1999

The NWCUPG32.EXE upgrade seems to assume that all the NWC files are in the \windows directory. I finally got the updating done by copying the NW*.* files to the Windows directory, doing the upgrade, then copying back to my directory for the Composer: \NoteWorthy Composer. When I tried to use the browser, it would not show up the
\NoteWorthy Composer directory, I suppose because of the long name. Perhaps the browser in NWCUPG32 needs upgrading!
Anybody else have a "long name" problem?
Bruce Clark

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Dec-1999

If the upgrade is unable to find the approproate file "foot print" for the 32-bit version 1.5 edition of NoteWorthy Composer, the search will fail and the upgrade may "default" to the Windows folder. Moving the NWC files is not necessary. Even if this happens, you simply press the folder button and select the appropriate folder. You still may get errors, though, since the search did not find the corrcet set of files that matches a valid copy of NWC.

As I said before, assuming you are using Windows 95 or Windows 98, the search may fail and default to the Windows folder if there are any missing files in your NWC installation. If you deleted any of the original files installed during the original setup, then the upgrade will not find the correct folder during its search. This usually will not prevent you from upgrading, although you will have to manually select the appropriate folder by pressing the Folder button before selecting Apply.


#1320: triplets, quitlets, ecet. and gace notes
triplets, quitlets, ecet. and gace notes

(1320)

Submitted by: Eliezer Rubinstein on 04-Dec-1999

I downloaded NWC just yesteday and i liked it. While Composing A Piano Peace I came across the need to write a"Septole" (seven eights for one one half) I did not see the way to do it (I often write "quintoles", "Septoles" ect.)
Second : I tried to enter a Grace note but it was not played right (it seemed it was skiped) I had to enter a Doted Sixteens to get the rihgt thing. this, of course, changed the measure to something odd.
Best regards
Eliezer Rubinstein

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Dec-1999

The short answer is the NWC only support triplet note groupings. Among many others, you can review msg #24, msg #185, msg #858 (a search will yield many others).

Reply 2 offered by: Mike on 06-Dec-1999

All of these work-arounds seem to be for note lengths less than 1/4. How about writing a quarter note pentuplet (whatever you people want to call them) such as appears in "The Pines of Rome/Pines of the Appian Way"? I guess that I should also add that I don't care about the MIDI playback, but I do wish the score would print correctly.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 06-Dec-1999

About grace notes: grace notes "steal" time from the following note. If there are notes on other staves above the grace notes, time is not "stolen" from them so they will start playing at the same time as the grace notes, which may be why you do not hear them. The solution is to place grace note rests (press =, then space) in front of the other notes.

If you think the grace note rests look ugly, select them, do ctrl-E, offset them so they appear above the staff, then manually white them out.

About n-tuplets: I use the method in the bottom part of msg #185 If you want 7 eighths in the space of 4 (I think that is what you want), then multiply your tempo by 7/4 before the notes, and put it back to what it was after the notes. You can hide the tempo changes. If you have notes in other staves below the tuplet, you will have to pad them with an extra 3/8 worth of rests. Again, you can move the rests below the staff and white them out by hand.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Bacher on 10-Dec-1999

Grace note rests - what a concept!

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 10-Dec-1999

Yeah! Now we just need staccato rests, and rest chords! ;-)

Reply 6 offered by: gert quintens on 19-Feb-2000

I think it's up to Noteworthy to write a little updating, making it possible to insert duols, quartoles, etc., just as they did with triplets.
This can't be so hard to do!


#1321: bug
bug

(1321)

Submitted by: dinka on 04-Dec-1999

I wrote a song that started with a half note in the first bar. When I exported as a midi file noteowrthy stuffed up my song and started the first bar of the midi file with the half note that should have been in a bar of its own (as written in the midi file).
in other words my song got taken totally out of alignment. I had to insert 3 and a half more beats into the start of the song and export again. so noteowrthy had no logic in exporting my file. any musician would read the song and play the note on the 3.5 beat as i had written and then play the next bar. in future i will remember to treat noteworthy as a dumb non-musician :)

Reply 1 offered by: dinka on 04-Dec-1999

as a note to my last message i had written out a chord sheet for my song. the midi wasn't aligned with my song as i had expected noteworthy to create a midi properly. i found this highly annoying.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Dec-1999

What you are describing is just how MIDI files work. MIDI files are just the performance of the piece. They do not include bar lines, so you bar line placement in NWC is irrelevant to the resulting MIDI file after an Export operation.

See msg #926 for more details.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Dec-1999

You can either - pad the first bar with rests or insert a Section Open barline after the pickup note.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 06-Dec-1999

"When I exported as a midi file noteowrthy stuffed up my song and started the first bar of the midi file with the half note that should have been in a bar of its own (as written in the midi file)."
..."any musician would read the song and play the note on the 3.5 beat as i had written and then play the next bar. "

What are they doing reading the midi file? Wouldn't they just read the printout?

btw: A double bar after an anacrusis will allow the Automatic bar feature to work, in case by export you actually meant using the autobarring feature.

A

Reply 5 offered by: Unimpressed by try-hards on 20-Dec-1999

"any musician would read the song
and play the note on the 3.5 beat
as i had written"

This is perfectly logical.

You guys tried to mock this but you're crazy.

firstly, i created a lead sheet using Noteworthy.
the first bar had a quaver in it.

when I exported the ntoeworthy file as a midi file, and tried to record my chords to it the midi file had been stuffed by noteworthy.

......
when i played chords along to it the song was out of whack.
......

I'm right.
I expected noteworthy to put the note in the right part of the bar and it didn't.

""""
MIDI files are just the performance of the piece. They do
not include bar lines,
""""

of course they do. MIDI files contain bars, measures, whatever you want to call them. I can record a midi file and the first note of it can be on the 3.5 beat! :)

""""
You can either - pad the first bar with rests
""""
Thanks Barry, this is what I said I did===
quote: I had to insert 3 and a half more beats into the start of
the song and export again.

Andrew didn't read what I wrote... he said:
"""What are they doing reading the midi file? Wouldn't they just read the printout? """

I never said they read the midi file. I said they would read the song, or the lead sheet i created with noteworthy.

Thanks anyway!!
just thought I'd clear this up

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Dec-1999

> MIDI files contain bars, measures, whatever you want to call them

No, they do not. Although they do include key signatures and time signatues, they do not include any other notation convention that would indicate where bar lines should be placed.

FYI: MIDI files also do not include repeat signs, jumps/flow redirections (CODA/SEGNO/FINE), fermatas, etc.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 20-Dec-1999

you quoted "MIDI files are just the performance of the piece. They do not include bar lines..."
and replied "of course they do. MIDI files contain bars, measures, whatever you want to call them. I can record a midi file and the first note of it can be on the 3.5 beat! :)"
I'm tempted to think that you use NWC to load MIDI files and save your work only in MIDI format. In which case I confirm that you'll lose information such as bars, since it DOES NOT exist in midi specifications.
On the contrary, NWC saves (in NWC format) much more information than MIDI files do. Even if NWc does not read everything from midi files, it just exports them correctly.
If you start a piece with an uncomplete measure, it will be saved as so in midi files, which just contains the notes and length. So when trying to re-import the thing, NWC will automatically place bars in what you call wrong places... since it supposes that the first measure is complete, for the reason that there is no way is MIDI format to tell where the bar should be. If you use NWC format, no trouble!

HTH


#1322: Symbols for Fermata, DalSegno, etc
Symbols for Fermata, DalSegno, etc

(1322)

Submitted by: Vince Brennan on 05-Dec-1999

How can I put these symbols on top of the staff for violin compositions? I've looked all over the interfaces and don't find anything that helps.
TIA

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 05-Dec-1999

I'm not sure if I'm answering your exact question, but here goes. All of the D.S., D.C., coda symbols and etc..., are under flow direction. Those will automatically print above the staff at whatever point you insert them. Fermata is listed under tempo variance, along with several other terms and markings. The window for these items has a staff position setting. I generally use 10 or 12 and this fits nicely over most parts. I also like to shut of the preserve width setting. It would be nice if the flow direction window allowed the same flexibility in setting staff position and preserving width. Hopefully this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 06-Dec-1999

NWC has the DS, DC, Code, etc stuff as special inserts, under Insert | Flow Direction.
The reason for this is that on playback, NWC actually implements the flow instructions, playing repeats, jumping to segno's, fines, codas etc.

A


#1323: transposing a hymn
transposing a hymn

(1323)

Submitted by: Linda on 06-Dec-1999

Is it possible to scan a hymn from a hymnal, in order for it to be transposed for a musical instrument other than a piano or organ? I was asked if I could do this with a hymn, and since I do not play, I would like to scan rather than putting in each note. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 06-Dec-1999

The have been numerous debates over the capabilities of scanning software for music, often within this forum. Generally, the consensus is that it is often easier to enter the parts manually than to edit all of the errors scanning software makes. With that in mind, see the thread under msg #1265. I have used the Sharpeye software mentioned for single and multiple line scores (including keyboard/piano parts), and have found it to work reasonably well. The limitations are that you then have to export your file as a MIDI from Sharpeye and then import to NWC, which may cause you some problems. If you're comfortable with the importing and exporting, then I'd recommend you try out Sharpeye. http://www.visiv.co.uk/

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 07-Dec-1999

Note that there are thousands of MIDI hymns on the net, and several of the major MIDI sequencers use NWC and post .NWC files. What hymnal, and what hymn, are you after?

Reply 3 offered by: Linda on 08-Dec-1999

The hymn I am trying to transpose is "Go, Tell It on the Mountain" found on page 57 of "CHRISTIAN WORSHIP A Lutheran Hymnal" copyright 1993 by Northwestern Publishing House. To those who responded: Thank you for taking the time to reply, and thank you for your help. :)

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Pearson on 08-Dec-1999

Go to http://www.lutheran-hymnal.com/lutheranworship/alutheranworship10.htm.

Someone has kindly set all the hymns in the Lutheran hymnal iinto midi format. The hymn you are looking for is 504.

You will be asked to save the hymn to disk. Then use either a notation program such as NWC (import the midi) or sequencing program to transpose the key and print. Hope that helps.

Reply 5 offered by: sam samuel on 24-Jan-2000

The song you are looking for is at this address
http://www.tch.simplenet.com/ttl/ttl.htm

this uses nwc

cu

Reply 6 offered by: Chris on 20-Nov-2000

Hi, can anyone transpose the hymnn, "Angels We Have Heard On High" ? I have to sing it on the 17th of Dec and I would like it to be 2 or 3 octaves lower. thanks for your help, Chris

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Nov-2000

Chris: Do you really mean 2 or 3 /octaves/ lower? Or do you mean 2 or 3 semitones (half-steps) lower, or 2 or 3 scale notes lower?

Unless I miss my guess, what you really mean was that you want a hymn originally written in (say) key of G to be transposed down to (say) key of D, in the baritone range one octave below the treble clef.

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 21-Nov-2000

See at the Christian Classics Ethereal Hymnary, http://ccel.org/cceh/0000/x000095.htm , which has NWC scores of two arrangements. Transpose at will.


#1325: TRANSPOSING INSTRUMENTS
TRANSPOSING INSTRUMENTS

(1325)

Submitted by: Daniel Cox on 10-Dec-1999

I am currently orchestrating a musical wirtten by a friend, and wish to use Noteworthy. Does anyone have a list of instruments and how many semitones to transpose them with eg:
Eb BARITONE SAX (+21) FROM C

in particular:
fl, ob, clt, tpt, trom, b. guit, guit, vln, cello, viola, percussion and drums.

thanx

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Dec-1999

Most of them will be found in "Compass.nwc", a compendium of instrument compasses and transpositions available at the NWC Scriptorium,

http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Click on the "Other Useful Files" link. Also check out the "Brasband.txt" file which gives more info on brass instruments.

If memory serves, guitar and bass weren't included; fortunately, these are very easy. Guitar - written in treble clef, sounds one octave lower than written. Bass (electric or acoustic) - written in bass clef, sound one octave lower than written.

Reply 2 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 13-Dec-1999

You may also refer to http://www.nifty.ne.jp/forum/fmidicla/htmls/ichou.html which is the table of transpositions I use most of the time.


#1326: Different rhythms on same staff
Different rhythms on same staff

(1326)

Submitted by: Michae McIntyre on 13-Dec-1999

This topic came up in a November message, but it wasn't answered to my satisfaction. I don't think the person who answered the original question understood what was being asked, so I'll ask again, more clearly this time.

I'm weak on theory, so I don't know the technical term for what I'm trying to do.

In piano music, you often have two or more rhythms going on the same hand, and each rhythm line has its own rests and such, even though it's all written on the same staff. It's not quite the same as merely needing to put a rest in a chord, since the rhythms can be completely different.

Cakewalk does this automatically, based on where in time you place the note. Say you place two quarter notes on the beat, then insert a third quarter note between them. It draws an eigth rest above the first quarter note, and an eigth rest after.

I can't find any way to accomplish the same thing in Noteworthy without putting the extra rhythms on a totally separate staff.

Is this what layering is supposed to address?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Dec-1999

That is exactly what staff layering is for. You put one "voice" on one staff, with all the beams up, and the other voice on the lower staff with the beams down. Where there are no separate voices you have to put the identical notes in both staves. Check the "layer with next staff" box in the upper staff's properties (F2), and on the Page Setup dialog, Contents tab you have to check the "Allow Layering" box.

You can make "chords" with a note and a rest on a single staff, but this does not let you do everything you need to do two voices properly. Once you accept you have to do it, layering is easier.


#1327: gliscendo
gliscendo

(1327)

Submitted by: Paul on 14-Dec-1999

hi,

i am trying to write a gliscendo for the piano using NWC. I looked at the tip files, but i am not getting a clear answer. can someone help explain how to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Dec-1999

Glissando usually refers to a smooth slide in pitch from one note to another, which can be accomplished using pitch-bend MPC's (multi-point controllers. See help file). However, in the case of a piano, it would by necessity consist of a bunch of fast notes in series. Try using 1/32, 1/64, or tripletised 1/64 notes (depending on how fast you want them). Also experiment with using "grace notes" to do the piano slides.

You might want to look at an example, a good one is Andrew Purdam's "Rip It" boogie-woogie composition, available on the Scriptorium http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 14-Dec-1999

Grace notes are the easy way to do a glissando, but you don't have control over the timing. Example: 3-note chords on both treble and bass staves. If the glissando is only on the bass, then precede the chord with three tied grace notes. The treble notes must be preceded with three grace note rests, to prevent it from playing at the same time as the grace notes. If the glissando is for both staves, then precede the bass notes with 3 tied grace notes then 3 grace rests; precede the treble notes with 3 grace rests then 3 tied grace notes.

See also msg #1320 (reply 3)

Reply 3 offered by: Paul on 14-Dec-1999

Hi,

I hope glissendos will be supported in NWC one day. While it's okay to emulate it on the computer using 1/32 notes, it's more important for me to have correct notation in software so i can print it out.

Reply 4 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 14-Dec-1999

The Boxmarks font (available on the Scriptorium) has the notation you need.

KenJ

Reply 5 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 17-Dec-1999

I'm going to be a bit pedantic -- please no brick-bats!

First, to be absolutly correct, a smooth change of pitch is a portomento, while what you get on a piano is a glissando. However, almost noone uses the terms correctly, so if you hear glissando the person speaking will PROBABLY mean a smooth change. (Unless they are playing a piano, then they will be correct, but probably won't know it.)

Second, the suggestion using grace notes is NOT a glissando, but an arpeggio (the word is derived from harp, on which such things are common). For that, you play a series of notes which form a chord in quick succession, holding them until the chord finishes. In a glissando you play a series of diationic or chromatic notes, NOT holding them, just a quick sounding of each note. The intervals are as small as you can make them (on a piano it is hard to get both the black and white keys, so you get a diatonic sequence, ditto on a harp -- the pedels won't move that fast!).

Cyril

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Dec-1999

Thank you for that. So the wavy line in front of a chord means an arpeggio, which can be done using grace notes as I described above. A glissando is shown by a diagonal line drawn between two notes, is that right?


#1328: 'Record' does not work for me!
'Record' does not work for me!

(1328)

Submitted by: Giulio on 16-Dec-1999

Hello,

I have a GeneralMusic Keyboard, WS-2, and a SoundBlaster Compatible Audio card, NTWC 1.55b, and a midi cable. I have connected the midi cable correctly - 'out' into 'in' - after some desperate attempts.

Now I have managed to make my 'old' Gem WS-2 play midi files transmitted from the PC. The problem is that I can't record anything from the keyboard to the score. When I hit play, the keyboard play the already-existing staffs, but doesn't add the new one I'm playing. Also, when I try to record a staff in a new file, choosing 'file', 'song templates', 'piano', 'rock', and also after having inputted some whole rests in the blank score, ... nothing can be recorded.

These are all the options available in the whole configuration. Hope that anyone can help me, I'm getting mad about that! :) Sorry for bad english.
Giulio

**** Control Panel - MIDI ****

MIDI Output - Single Instrument :

- Roland MPU-401
- Ges WS-2 (I added it with 'add new instrument')
- Microsoft GS Wave Synth
- Yamaha OPL2/OPL3 Synth

**** NTWC Options ****

'MIDI' Folder :

Available Play Devices :
- MIDI Mapper
- Roland MPU-401
- Microsoft GS Wave Synth
- Yamaha OPL2/OPL3 Synth

Devices Used to Play Back :
(when I select Roland MPU-401 the keyboard plays the file)
(when I select Microsoft GS Wave Synth the PC plays the file)
(when I select both, both keyboard and PC play the midi file, toghether, there is also a small delay from the keyboard, I was wondering how to eliminate it)

Play Options :
- from current measure
- always

'Record' Folder :

Input Device : Roland MPU-401 (only device available)
Echo MIDI input : yes
Echo Input to Play Device : Roland MPU-401
Echo to MIDI Channel : use original channel
Import Options : Record Group (or New Window - both tried, nothing happens)

Also, when I try to record, 'MIDI Input Active' button is selected.

When I try to record I hit 'record' (obviously:)

**** WS-2 Settings **** (argh!)

The WS-2 has a 'MIDI' button that leads to a 7-pages menu.

1° page) channel selection : I have the midi channel match the same channel in the staff
2° page) common midi channel : off
effect1 channel : 15
effect2 channel : 14
sequencer midi channel : off
copy all global : off
3° page) input filter note : off (if I turn it on 'on' the keyboard stops playing th midi file)
input filter prog. : off
input filter contr. : off
input filter damper : off
4° page) out filter note : off (also tried 'on'. I guess that this page is the one that enables midi output in my WS-2)
out filter prog. : off
out filter contr. : off
out filter damper : off
ext / int clock : int
5° page) section local off
1:on 2:on 3:on 4:on 5:on (WS-2 can let 5 instruments play together - if I set these ones on 'off' I can't hear any sound coming from the keyboard's speakers)

Important : the keyboard has an internal synthetizer. What I can't do is to record, and I also can't use the keyboard as a simple MIDI instrument - can't have the PC playing what I input from the keyboard.

I'm getting mad trying to understand if a possible problem can be in the soundcard, or into the keyboard (I also have thought of a serious hardware problem!)

Hope that someone experienced can help me. Sorry again for confused english. Giulio

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Dec-1999

As you point out, you need to isolate where the problem exists. You need to independently test your MIDI cable, MIDI keyboard, and your computer. By testing each separately, you should be able to find the problem.

See also: msg #896 (reply 5)


#1329: recording and playing back on cd
recording and playing back on cd

(1329)

Submitted by: STEPHEN T. HAWBAKER on 16-Dec-1999

I am trying to record a song I wrote and burn a CD for a gift for someone at Christmas.

I think I need to convert the MIDI file into a Wave file.

Am I dreaming about being able to do this or is it doable.

Please help

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Dec-1999

See msg #1208, along with the many other threads on this subject here on the forum.

Reply 2 offered by: René Verhoeven on 17-Dec-1999

You can make a WAV file as follows :

Step 1 : Connect an audio cassette deck (or a second computer) to your computers soundcard output channel and record the song on an audio cassette.
Step 2 : Connect the same audio cassette deck to your computers sound card input channel, play the audio cassette and record the sound in a WAV file using Microsoft Sound Recorder(usually found on your computer Windows 95 under programs/accessories/multimedia).

Happy fiddling and Happy Christmas of course.


#1330: MIDI to Wave - interference.
MIDI to Wave - interference.

(1330)

Submitted by: HAWBAKER on 17-Dec-1999

The recording worked but there is much background noise - any suggestions ?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 17-Dec-1999

Check your recording options and try setting them to CD quality (44,100 Hz). That may help.

There are also several freeware and shareware wave editors (such as Goldwave) that have hiss/pop and other filters/functions. Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Dec-1999

If you are using a software synthesizer, it is not uncommon to get very poor results. If this is the case, refer to your synthesizer docs for details.

In any case, you may get better results recording your sound card output to tape, then digitizing your taped output sent to the line level input of your card.


#1331: Problem with Composer
Problem with Composer

(1331)

Submitted by: Bruce J. Clark on 17-Dec-1999

While constructing score for Vivaldi Gloria, I ran into a problem where voices holding a slurred long note (specifically in measures 45-50 of #1, Gloria in Excelsis) refuse to turn off or change entering measure 48. The voice notes of measure 47 carry right on even through the rest measure when only the piano/orchestra is playing. If I start on the middle of the slur, measure 47, the voices shut off properly. The "instrument" was the Voice on "Aah". It happens also for some other instruments, but not for the default. I don't know how to attach a NWC song to this message, but I have a little abstract of this problem which behaves just like the full score.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Dec-1999

Check out the Common Questions section of the help file, section "Play and Sound Application Questions", question #5, "Why does a note sometimes keep playing all through an entire song, as if it were stuck on?"

This is also discussed on our web site at:
http://NoteworthyComposer.com/faq2.htm#stuck

See also: msg #996


#1332: Section Transposition
Section Transposition

(1332)

Submitted by: Eliezer Rubinstein on 17-Dec-1999

In my way of composing i often have the need to transpose SECTIONS ONLY. Right now one can only transpose an entire Staff. Can anyBody come forward with a hint? (Does Nobody compose Sonatas?)
Best regards
E. Rubinstein

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 17-Dec-1999

Highlight all notes you want to transpose, and hold down Ctrl-Shift while using arrow keys to move up and down.

KenJ

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Dec-1999

This will not fix the accidentals. You can copy the selected portion of the staff into a new file, transpose it there, and copy it back. It would be nice if the Transpose command worked on a selected portion of the staff.

Reply 3 offered by: Eric James on 20-Dec-1999

But can you change the transposition in the midi setup. Much of the music I do is from classical manuscripts where clarinets, horns, trumpets, etc. play in different keys. The horns sometimes have to change key in the middle of a piece. If they have been set up as "horns in Eb" say, and need to change part way to "horns in C", how do I change the pitch of the playback but still maintain the original notation?

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Dec-1999

Following on from the previous post.
In big band writing the saxes often double on clarinet and flute sometimes in the same piece written on the same staff.
You can change the patch but you can't change the pitch transposition.
It's O.K. for written parts to copy, transpose and paste back into score but the playback is affected.
This problem isn't restricted to NWC - you face the same dilemma with other notation programs.

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 21-Dec-1999

If you have the saxophones playing the same music as, say, flutes, copy the flute staff to another staff, change its MIDI characteristics, transpose it as desired, then _hide_ it. Your playback and score should both be as desired.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 22-Dec-1999

replying to #3: if the (playback time) transposition is not further than one tone, then you could use an MPC with pitch bend change. You can alter the tonality up to one tone (two semitones) lower, or higher.
Simply add another MPC when the transposed part goes back to its normal tone.
I just created a sample file (unregistered version to make copy possible for unreg'd users) at :
http://www.multimania.com/madmarsu/Nwc/C-or-Bb.zip
(also http://www.multimania.com/madmarsu/Nwc/C-or-Bb.nwc if you do not have trouble with direct-downloaded .nwc files.)

HTH!


#1334: How do I do Trombone slides?
How do I do Trombone slides?

(1334)

Submitted by: Jeremy on 18-Dec-1999

Hi y'all...
New in the neighbourhood - I do sequencing of show music for a local theatre group, which involves the notating of band parts, and I'm stumped as to how to get a smooth slide up and down in the style of a trombone (as if it were being played live!)

I'd be really gratfeul if anyone could shed some light.
Thanks,
JEREMY :o)

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 21-Dec-1999

You use multi-point controllers ("L" command) to do a pitch bend. Two good examples of its use for trombones are at
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ftp/classical/purgallo.nwc and
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ftp/anthems/alfcolbo.nwc

I think an example will explain things better than I could. The only point left to discuss is the fact that most MIDI machines are set to a 2 semitone range, two sharp and two flat making four semitones in total. A trombone gliss is normally further than that and you'll see how that causes notation problems. The best way around it is through using a hidden performance staff and a muted display staff.

Regards,
A


#1335: Noteworthy 2000?
Noteworthy 2000?

(1335)

Submitted by: Jay de Jesus on 18-Dec-1999

I am not biased: Noteworthy Composer is the BEST tool I've ever used for composing music. I have to say that its simplicity is actually its best asset! I loved the fast way one can input notes in the score. What I personally do is use a midi keyboard to input all the notes without minding the note duration (all eight notes firest) then go back to the score again and manually selecting each note by editing it to it's proper note duration. The best feature is the playback. Why nobody else does it just blows my mind!

Anyway, my question really is: With all other software companies coming out with new versions for the next millenium, when can we see an all new, all improved Noteworthy Composer? =)

Reply 1 offered by: Michael McIntyre on 19-Dec-1999

You know, it's funny you mentioned this...

I agree with you that Noteworthy is the best I've ever used. I haven't played around with other packages extensively, but when you compare $400 to $39 there's not much point in really getting to like something or other than package X can do better, is there? :)

The way Noteworthy lets you change note durations is simply its best feature IMHO. I am a really lousy keyboard player, and up until now I've had to do all of my sequences by manually entering the notes. Lots of mouse clicks, lots of time. Step Record with Cakewalk and what do you get? A bunch of eigth notes. Well, you can go to the piano roll view and fiddle around with the stupid little dashes to get the notes to the length you want, but you can't change them on the staff view. You also can't enter tied notes longer than one measure in length without resorting to the piano roll thing.

Enter Noteworthy. Record as eigth notes, then play with the rhythm to your heart's content without having to delete and re-enter notes. Tie, un-tie, dot, un-dot... It's wonderful!

I've gotten more use out of my controller keyboard in the last month or so than in the past two years. Noteworthy's interface is perfect for people like me who can't play well enough to get anything like a usable recording, but who can peck out the notes on a keyboard a little more quickly than moving the insertion cursor up and down the staff every time.

I really, really like it! Now I just need to learn more about music theory so I can spend less time trying to figure out what works and what doesn't.

Reply 2 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 19-Dec-1999

It really isn't all that hard to use the "modulation" wheel on your midi keyboard to change note durations. I find THAT very convenient as well. If you have the same thing on YOUR'S, I would think it would be much easier to do it the same way and eliminate one step (changing note duration).

KenJ

Reply 3 offered by: Jay de Jesus on 19-Dec-1999

ummm... I think it's unanimous that Noteworthy is a great software, but would anyone know when can we expect a new version like a Noteworthy v.2.0 or something? Or shouldn't I hold my breath? =)....

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 20-Dec-1999

One thing that I find even more useful than changing the length of the notes, is changing their height !!!

Simply select the note (or phrase), use Ctrl-Shift-Up or Ctrl-Shift-Down and the faulty note entered via (midi- or computer-)keyboard is now correct!! Maybe do I think this because I usually enter notes in correct rhythm (just take a tempo slow enough and it's easy) but I do make many mistakes on the note itself... :-)

BTW, I hope that v 2.00 will not appear before third millennium (which is in less than 400 days from now), but maybe 1.56 (or 1.60?) will appear soon ? I was used to more than one version per year :-) ...and since 1.10 version, I've never been disappointed!
NWCly yours, Dominique

Reply 5 offered by: Jaime on 02-Jan-100

NWC is the best program I have ever used. I don't have a MIDI interface, so I must enter the notes by hand, and NWC is the only program that I can enter notes with the keyboard vs. just the mouse. I wish it had more support for quintuplets and stuff, though. I am an amateur composer, and this is the easiest notation software to use, and I definitely recommend it to all.

~Jaime~
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/Choir/5700/

Reply 6 offered by: Sad on 06-Jan-2000

I'm under the impression that Noteworthy has come to a halt. There's been no major upgrades for years. Unfortunately if it doesn't pick up soon I'm leaving! I can't bear all these add on external stuff to do basic notation work -- it's crazy and beyond a joke! No offence to you NWC just get a move on!

Reply 7 offered by: jaydj on 06-Jan-2000

I have to agree with you there. All they have been updating is the "user tip" and registered user's page thingy. Why can't they upgrade the proggy itself. I mean, there's so much technology needed to make Noteworthy .... umm... "note-worthy!" Features like staff manipulation, better interface, and the like! I swear, this program could be the BOMB if only they keep the R&D working overtime!

Reply 8 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 07-Jan-2000

Well it seems to me that NoteWorthy say in their literature that upgrades will be free for all 1.XX versions but when we reach version 2 it's payout time.

It has been a long time since the last upgrade so let's just hope that something is in R & D as you put it but announcements are rarely made in advance of a release.

The only real question would be if we do get an upgrade soon, will it be a freebee 1.something or other or a paying 2.0

To my way of thinking, I have had so much value out of this product with so little trouble that if and when we get an upgrade that needs more money, I will NOT be complaining.

Rich.

Reply 9 offered by: Cassel be dahl Vekhet von Schluter on 07-Jan-2000

I am very uncertain of whether Noteworthy will be releasing a new version. Many software companies I am in contact with inform clients of coming releases/upgrades. My company does the same: we make information of this to customers when we contact them or post information.
So I would like to ask Noteworthy on behalf of all. Will there be a new release and how long before it comes out of development?
And excuse me your box is too short for my email address.

Reply 10 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 07-Jan-2000

I think you all have your answers now 8-)

Rich.

Reply 11 offered by: Gillespie on 08-Jan-2000

Is v1.70 to keep us happy for 2000 or is this an interim release?

Reply 12 offered by: Stephen Oakes on 09-Jan-2000

Personally, I think this is an interim release. They *must*
be working on V2.0, and it must contain some of the more
requested features such as tuplets and (hopefully) multi-
staff selection. The new features in this release are
relatively minor ones (although very welcome).

If not, I fear I will need to move on soon.

Reply 13 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 10-Jan-2000

After having had a brief look at the 1.77 beta version, I'm happy to say that it contains some improvements which - for my needs - are extremely valuable. All my wishes seem to have come true! - Well, I still have two wishes left but when these are fulfilled, NWC will be perfect. So, I'm preparing for soon stopping to wait for another upgrade:-).

Paul

Reply 14 offered by: Jenny Morrill on 13-Feb-2000

Is there really a 1.7 beta? All I can find is the 1.55b. Or am I not looking hard enough?

Reply 15 offered by: Grant on 13-Feb-2000

You might want to look here:

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcpreview/


#1336: moving notes or passages
moving notes or passages

(1336)

Submitted by: Bryan Wylie on 19-Dec-1999

Is there some way to select note or passage and move it to a different position on the staff? eg from E to Ab, or from C1 to C2.

Bryan

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Dec-1999

This was just answered in msg #1332

Reply 2 offered by: Bryan Wylie on 19-Dec-1999

<<This was just answered in msg #1332>>

Missed that, thanks Blair

Bryan


#1338: Mp3
Mp3

(1338)

Submitted by: Jose on 20-Dec-1999

How can I save noteworthy in format MP3?

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 20-Dec-1999

Hello Jose,

You cannot directly save NWC files as MP3. You can, however, record an NWC file (while it is playing) to a WAV file, and then use one of the conversion utilities to create an MP3 from a WAV.

I know of one product that can record directly to MP3 format, without first recording as a WAV. See "Internet Audio Mix" product, at http://www.acoustica.com.

Good Luck,

Sue

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 20-Dec-1999

Also try http://www.musicmatch.com/. In the settings, you can specify the source of the file (i.e. a midi file on disk as opposed to a CD). It is freeware (unless you want to upgrade). Be sure to set your recording standards up to 44,100 Hz (or similar) to get the best quality without the hiss.

I posted a similar inquiry in the newsgroup. Some folks also like CoolEdit (another downloadable shareware or freeware program). Hope that helps.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Dec-1999

Thanks for the Music Match tip Steve.

I checked out the site and read through the informative documentation but found no mention of MIDI in any of it.
Could you confirm that you can record direct from midi to mp3 - it didn't appear to support this.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Pearson on 20-Dec-1999

I know what you mean. My initial impression was that it would only record from a CD, but . . .

Go to "Options", "Settings", "Recorder" and select "System Mixer". Then start to play the midi file and record it into the MP3 format. (A few other settings are needed to tell the program where to store the MP3 file; also naming the file being recorded is a bit awkward).

Another nice feature that I have not played with yet is the auto "mp3 snippet", where one can set it to simply record a short mp3 sample file. Figure it might be a nice way of letting folks hear what you intended your midi to sound like, rather than what their soundcard does to it.

P.S. I am sure there are a whole host of great mp3 converters out there that are easy to use. Any other suggestions out there?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Dec-1999

My favourite is "Easy MP3" which is a pretty sophisticated front-end for the original (DOS-based) Fraunhofer MP3 program, l3enc.exe. It sets up the jobs as processes rather than as tasks, and runs great in the background with no noticeable interference with other apps you've got running. It allows you to process a whole whack of wav files in one go, and (best of all) it's completely free.

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Pearson on 21-Dec-1999

Fred, thanks for the suggestion. Do you have a quick hyperlink to the program. I tried doing some advance searches and came up with a bunch of other programs/freeware. Probably be quicker if I have a site reference (if you have one handy). Thanks.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Dec-1999

Dug into my history file and came up with:

http://hem.netlink.se/~sbe1243/mp3frontends.htm

but the link to easymp3 is dead... ::sigh::

Reply 8 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-Dec-1999

In the "for what it's worth" column, the following are some step by step instructions for recording midi into mp3 format by use of MusicMatch. I find the results to be remarkably free of hiss.

1. On the MusicMatch Menu:

(a) "Options", "Settings", "Recorder": choose System Mixer.

(i) The System Mixer, by the way, is the "thingy" volume control or
comparable control on the system tray in Windows 95 or 98. If it is not
visible, go to Control, Multimedia, and check the box to have the volume
control appear on the system tray. Remember to right click it for the full
body of controls. Depending upon the system mixer, you may have to get to a
different screen to set up recording options. Make sure it is set to record
"all", "mixed output" or something comparable (depending upon the mixer).

(b) Immediately below the System Mixer setting in MusicMatch, indicate the
directory desired for the mp3 output.

(c) Unless one pays for the upgrade, select the "Near CD Quality" mp3, if
that option is not already selected.

2. Recording.

(a) On the Music Match bottom most recorder, type in the desired title for
the mp3 song (i.e. the name of the song without all the path stuff). (This
can be edited later, if needed or forgotten, but it is easier to find the
file in your mp3 output folder if you name it right away).

(b) Open Windows Media Player 4.0. Go "File Open," "Browse", make sure it
is displaying "Media Files (all types)" and go to and select the desired
midi file. The file will start to play immediately. Fine. Just pause and it
will begin over again once you hit the play button.

(c) On the bottom Music Match recorder hit "Start" to begin recording.

(d) On the Windows Media Player, hit "play" to begin the midi masterpiece,
and kick back until its over. You may want to temporarily open the system
mixer if it displays levels to make sure you are not overdriving.

(e) Music Match will automatically convert the playing into mp3 format.
You will find the file in the mp3 output directory you selected. It can be
played either on MusicMatch or the Windows Media Player.

Reply 9 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-Dec-1999

One last postscript (hopefully!).

I found I was also able to record into the mp3 format by playing Noteworthy (Good!) and my "rack" style Midisoft Audio Pro. Trying to play in from my main sequencing program (Midisoft Studio 6.05) caused crashes. Barry Graham also reports he could not use Cakewalk, so there may be something that creates a problem when attempting to record from a sequencing-capable program (other than our friendly NWC).

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Dec-1999

If possibly depends on whether the sequencer pages the soundcard or other midi output directly, or via the midi-mapper. On some occasions I've had trouble with Cubasis for this reason, yet on others it was actually helpful that Cubasis bypasses the midi-mapper software.

There's a utility driver set called "Multimid" which can be useful to sort out midi-paging problems, especially if you have more than one midi device. It actually came stock with my dual-device soundcard and was installed by its install program to allow it to bypass the native volume control applet, replacing it with its own XG control panel.

Reply 11 offered by: Hydrostatic on 07-Jan-2000

A better way to convert midi to mp3 is to completely bypass the souncard's midi hardware and use a software midi synthesizer that allows hard disk recording thus preventing any hiss. A free program called Timidity does this extremely well but you'll have to go looking for Gravis Ultrasound compatible patches. They're not too hard to find. The only problems are that entire patch sets can be huge (8mb+) so take a while to download and use up lots of RAM.

The positive thing about this is the patch sizes are only limited to the amount of memory you computer has because they do not use the soundcard's RAM. If you have lots of memory you can have higher quality instruments.

Just export the score as a midi file and play it through Timidity!

Reply 12 offered by: carlos on 28-May-2000

I wanth the mp3

Reply 13 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 14 offered by: Sue Morton on 30-May-2000

Bar Code:

If you have a duplex card (one that can play MIDI and record a WAV at the same time), then this is very easy. You do not need to go outside the card (speaker out -> line-in) to do this.

1) Open a WAV or MP3 recording software program (Cool Edit, Internet Audio Mix, Windows Sound Recorder, MusicMatch Jukebox, etc.). Put it into record mode, but don't start recording yet.

2) Open NWC and load your file (or if playing .mid, open Windows media player or other MIDI player and load your .mid).

3) Start recording with the WAV/MP3 recorder.

4) Start the NWC or .mid file playing.

5) At end of song, stop the WAV/MP3 recorder and save your file.

Depending on what soundcard you have, you may have some setup to do with it's own software to enable simultaneous playback and recording. (For example, if you have SB Live then you have to open the Creative Mixer and set MIDI as the recording source.)

In a very basic form, the above is one way to do it. You can alternatively use a software program that reads your .mid file directly and creates the WAV or MP3 without involving your soundcard. The previous responses to this post deal with that.

If you don't have a duplex card then my procedure will not work. You will have to use one of the software programs that bypasses your card entirely.

HTH and Good Luck,

Sue


#1339: Hearing the keyboard input
Hearing the keyboard input

(1339)

Submitted by: Bryan Wylie on 20-Dec-1999

I can transfer notes from my Roland PC 200 onto the staves in NWC, but I cannot actually hear the notes as I input them. I can then play the score using the instruments of my choice.
How would I configure things to hear each note as I input it from the keyboard. I have a SB AWE32

Bryan

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Dec-1999

Click on Tools > Options > Record tab - then enable the Echo Midi Input option and select the device and channel required.

Reply 2 offered by: Bryan Wylie on 21-Dec-1999

Magic!

Many thanks, Barry.

Bryan


#1340: Extracting parts from "C" score to print parts
Extracting parts from "C" score to print parts

(1340)

Submitted by: BillC on 22-Dec-1999

AS a new user, I've used 4 staff bracket to create condensed, non-transposed score of instumental work. Typically, I have multiple voices (i.e., 3 clarinet parts, etc.) on a single staff. Now I want to extract each voice individually to transpose and print as 1st clar, 2nd clar, etc. I need help of experienced users/composers. Do I open a second window, copy single staff to it then transpose or is there a better way. I'll check forum and gratefully accept advice via e-mail. thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Starfield on 23-Dec-1999

I am not clear about whether each clarinet part is on it's own stave. If this is true the just go to file,page setup and put a cross next to only the part that you want to print. You can look to see how this will appear in file, print preview (there are also icons for these functions). You can agjust the font size and margins in page setup until the preview looks good. Tools, transpose will let you take the stave up the 2 semitones you need. Also do a tools, audit note stems after the transpose.
You don't need to save this changed file if you want to keep it the way it was.
Good luck - Barry

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Dec-1999

If you have multiple voices on one staff, there is no way to separate them except copy the staff and delete the voices you don't want. Next time put each voice on its own staff and combine using the staff layering facility. Then separating is easy.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 23-Dec-1999

On the Scriptorium http://www.vadu.com/nwc there is a utility called "Splitter" which can separate multiple voices on one staff. Go to the "Useful Files from NWC users" section.

Reply 4 offered by: Harry on 24-Dec-1999

hiya!! I'm wondering if noteworthy has looked at adding these utilities into the software or will I have to use half a dozen apps ust to get a decent print out of Noteworthy? considering that the external utilities are for functions that I'd expect in a notation program

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Dec-1999

Depends on your philosophy, I guess. Personally I prefer separate apps for separate functions, rather than trying to do everything in one bloated package that has more buttons and menus and stuff than I know what to do with... MS Office comes to mind, though there's others also (Corel Suite 8, etc.) Give me a decent core program and a few helper apps anyday.


#1341: downloading a score to print
downloading a score to print

(1341)

Submitted by: Neil Deupree on 23-Dec-1999

I found the link to Stephanos in the Cyberhymnal, but when I try to download the tune to look at it, I can't get the file to open right. I downloaded the Noteworthy Player. Can I use that somehow? Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Dec-1999

See msg #760 and msg #1088.

Note that the player does not support printing. You need to purchase NoteWorthy Composer for that task.


#1342: beam button
beam button

(1342)

Submitted by: PB on 24-Dec-1999

How do I get the beam button to be able to click on?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Dec-1999

You have to select some notes to beam(or unbeam) first.
NWC does not enter beamed notes only unbeamed ones.

Then you have to select the group to be beamed and the beam tool is enabled if the note group is valid for beaming (no intervening rests and durations must be less than a quarter note).

You can automatically beam the whole active staff using TOOLS> AUTOMATIC BEAM - NWC does it for you!

Hope this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 24-Dec-1999

To add just a bit to what Barry said... I always use auto beam first. However, if you wish to beam groups of three or more, you need to select/highlight those notes and click the beam button twice. This will first remove the beam(s) from those notes and then add a beam to all of those selected. You can also use the keyboard shortcut of ctrl-B instead of the beam button if you wish. One last thing, if you are doing triplets. Select the three notes and beam them together, then click the triplet button. Depending on the range of the notes, you may want to play with stem direction for beamed notes as well.

Reply 3 offered by: PB on 25-Dec-1999

i highlight the certain notes that i want to beam and the thing still isnt able to click on.

Reply 4 offered by: PB on 25-Dec-1999

nevermind i got it thank you ^_^


#1343: Harmoniserr
Harmoniserr

(1343)

Submitted by: Badu on 24-Dec-1999

Does anyone know of a good harmonizer? i want to harmonize a melody with four flutes. so the first flute will play the melody and the other three flutes (or strings) will play the harmony. .......I have a melody line and the chords. (for each bar, and sometimes there are several chords in one bar) thank u!

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 25-Dec-1999

Why not put the "melody line" by itself on ONE staff, and then add another staff below it to put the "harmony" on?

KenJ

Reply 2 offered by: badu on 26-Dec-1999

I was wondering if there was some software that could do this quickly except for crappy band in the box

Reply 3 offered by: Joel on 27-Dec-1999

"badu"

It is quite interesting that you consider Band-In-A-Box "crappy," yet it is the only product providing harmonizing capability that seems to come to mind!

I would suggest, friend, that you not take music theory at just about any college or university. Since Band-In-A-Box is taking campuses by storm, it is going to be quite difficult for you to avoid it. I believe that these professors understand why. You obviously don't.


#1344: exporting error
exporting error

(1344)

Submitted by: paul on 24-Dec-1999

hello...
when i export a song into midi file, some channels are louder than others, and my themes can't be heard...but when i play the nwc file, it sounds great...whats wrong

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 25-Dec-1999

It may be your player. For instance, "I" use a softsynth to playback midi files using XG, and have the very same problem YOU have with volumes of staves. I don't have a solution, though. I'm getting an XG "writer" and hope THAT solves my problem. I'll be watching this thread for any ideas anyone ELSE has.

KenJ

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 29-Dec-1999

Perhaps also check that you are using different channels for each staff (I presume that is your intention). It may be that you have different volume levels set for each, and the volume commands are played in a different order when exported?

Actually, I doubt this, but it is worth checking.

A


#1345: Note Velocity when using MIDI keyboard
Note Velocity when using MIDI keyboard

(1345)

Submitted by: Ross Werner on 27-Dec-1999

I have a touch-sensitive MIDI keyboard--is there any way to have Noteworthy pay attention to the note velocity when I record? For some reason it won't import the note velocity, either when I import a MIDI file or when I play using the keyboard.

I know it's not they keyboard's fault, because I used another MIDI recorder and it records the velocity perfectly. Then I saved the MIDI file, but when I imported it into Noteworthy all velocity settings were gone. Is this not a feature in Noteworthy or do I just not know how to do it?

Thanks,
Ross

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Dec-1999

NWC does not use "per-note" velocity settings. It uses velocity settings based on the current dynamic setting. On import, velocity settings are ignored.


#1347: converting tracks from a cd to a midi file
converting tracks from a cd to a midi file

(1347)

Submitted by: Steve Jones on 01-Jan-100

I do a lot of singing in church and would like to find out if I could record a song from a cd, then seperate the tracks and delete the vocals, so I could use them for accompanimant and save myself about 8 bucks for one soundtrack you buy at the local christian book store. I have cakewalk professional 5?

Reply 1 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 04-Jan-2000

Try this AnalogX program called Vocal Remover. It's a freeware program and comes in DirectX and Winamp versions.

It work well for a single voice but it still leaves the reverb and echo behind.

Download from http://www.analogx.com/contents/download/audio/vremover.htm


#1348: Beaming conventions?
Beaming conventions?

(1348)

Submitted by: Michael McIntyre on 02-Jan-100

This is more of a general composing question than anything else. I'll admit I've been doing a lot of composing/arranging even though my knowledge of theory is weak. I know just enough to be a danger to musicians everywhere. :)

My question is about beaming conventions. I've seen different groupings used in different works, and I'm wondering if there are any hard and fast rules. Noteworthy's automatic beam feature groups notes according to one beat. Two eigth notes get a beam, four sixteenths, etc.

Most of the music I've seen written is not grouped this way. I'll admit it makes some sense, and it's easier to read than some of the alternatives, but it also seems to waste space.

I've seen a lot of music where all the notes are connected with straight beams across the entire measure, and also quite a bit with long runs of 8th or 16th notes beamed in such a way that you have a beam slanting up for several notes, and then another down for several notes. The division points don't seem to have anything in particular to do with the quarter note (or whatever the bottom number of the time signature is) boundaries.

I've also seen situations where if the dominant note in a measure is the 8th then the entire measure gets written that way, such that any quarter notes are written as tied 8ths, etc. (same applies for 16ths or whatever) with the whole mess beamed.

As a performer, I find this harder to read than if the quarter notes were written as such, but I have used something like this in one of my scores.

There's a repeating bass line that goes quarter-eigth-quarter in three parts, and the remaining part is dotted_quarter-quarter. I wrote these as quarter notes tied to eigth notes because it looked better when viewing the entire score.

I'm wondering what the rules are for governing this sort of thing so my scores don't look amateurish.

I'd appreciate any general guidelines, links, book recommendations, whatever to steer me in the right direction. Thanks in advance!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Jan-100

As you've realised, there are conventions, but there are as many ways to break the rules as there are rules. The way I was taught is summarised below:

General rule: Beam groups of one beat (as NWC does by default). Exception: if the notes have the same value, you can beam them all together as long as you don't beam across the "imaginary bar line" -- i.e. the middle of the bar in 2/4, 4/4 and 6/8. In 3/4 you essentially don't have such an imaginary bar line, so you have to group per beat. An especial "no-no" is having notes that cross the imaginary bar line: in other words, in 2/4 you can't have a dotted quarter followed by an eighth, instead you "should" use a quarter and two eighths, with the quarter tied to the first eighth. The two eighths can be beamed together.

That being said, even way back in Mozart's time these rules were ignored if the result was an easier to read score. Nowadays it's very common to see syncopated rhythms written "as sounded" with dotted notes, etc. rather than the "respect the imaginary bar line" rule. Use your judgement.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Jan-100

I agree with Fred.
But respect the musicians that will play from your score.
It is much easier to sight read parts that are grouped on either side of the centre of the measure.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 14-Jan-2000

Fred wrote: in other words, in 2/4 you can't have a dotted quarter followed by an eighth, instead you "should" use a quarter and two eighths, with the quarter tied to the first eighth. The two eighths can be beamed together.

Wow. this leads to hard-to-read scores. IMHO of course: the less items there are, the quickest to be read. But this needs some (little) more knowledge in reading music.
Note that a quarter tied to 2 8ths is oftenly played as such, i.e. you hear the first attack, and then heard a simili-attack on the first eighth, which is to be avoided if you pretend to play music rather than notes. It is a typical novice mistake.

On the other hand, a double-dotted note is hard to read... Especially if it crosses the "imaginary bar line", which I'd consider as a fault. So what Fred says (quoted hereover) is true if the quarter is just before the "imaginary bar line".

Whatever the rules are, as they may change, the principle is to help the reader to understand the music. That's why, in beaming notes who have lyrics, one *shouldn't* beam 8ths (or 16ths,...) which have separate syllables.

But in instrumental scores, the "imaginary bar line" is most often the rule, as long as you don't mix different rhythms on different beats. Once more, your score must be easy to read --even from the first time. Writing syncopes as 4 8ths beamed 2 by 2 with a tie is not necessarily the most readable. But for not trained readers it may help to play it correctly... though the accent may not be played on the "contre-temps".

Writing music is as writing books. You don't write for anyone, but for a part of them.

HTH,
   Dominique

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Bacher on 19-Jan-2000

marsu said one shouldn't beam 8ths or 16ths in vocal music
on separate syllables.

I know that this is common practice for many publishers, but I disagree, and a recent survey on CHORALNET on this
question showed (IIRC) a majority in favor of beaming
syllables. I think it makes the score easier to read,
just as it does for instrumentalists; and syllables are
already shown by the presence or absence of slur marks.

The unbeamed appearance looks old-fashioned to me; more
contemporary scores seem to be opting for beaming.

- seb

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Edwards on 19-Jan-2000

Yes, I think that is right. When (sight-)reading music the first thing is to get the timing right, and that means (IMHO) beaming the quavers etc.

It's a moot point whether pitch or word placement comes next, but for precision in reading pitch a beam is a lot less fussy and distracting than a series of individual tails.

The words themselves are fairly obviously positioned on the relevant notes whichever system you use.


#1350: New Thread: Percussion Sounds
New Thread: Percussion Sounds

(1350)

Submitted by: Angelique on 03-Jan-100

I have version 1.50. I can play the DRUMREF file, but I can't figure out how to either get these sounds into my score, or how to recreate them. I've read everything in the "help" section, but I am not close to finding an answer.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Jan-100

Set the staff containing your drum track to midi channel 10.

Reply 2 offered by: Angelique on 03-Jan-100

Thanks a ton! It works!


#1351: printing multiple tunes
printing multiple tunes

(1351)

Submitted by: joe mc cool on 03-Jan-100

Please,

How can I print more than one tune on the same page. At the
moment I am turning the page upside down and re-inserting in the printer, but this is not very elegant.

I'd really appreciate an email reply.

thanks

joe mc cool

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 03-Jan-100

You can't, without using tricks like the one you did. The other way is to copy the tunes to the clipboard, and paste them into a word processor or publishing program.

Reply 2 offered by: joe@benburb.demon.co.uk on 03-Jan-100

Yugh :-(

thanks anyway.

joe

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Starfield on 03-Jan-2000

Try re-inserting the paper the correct way around and setting the top margin so that it is big enough to miss what you have already printed. It works well and is easier than some of the fancier methods. Regards Barry

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 14-Jan-2000

Playing with the margins is a good solution.
But you also may refer to msg #771 for better solutions.

HTH,
   Dominique


#1352: transposing a piece of music
transposing a piece of music

(1352)

Submitted by: joe mc cool on 03-Jan-100

Please,

I am a complete newbie and know very little about musical theory.

I play Irish traditional music on the penny whistle, which has only six holes. My understanding is that the when blown the sixth hole represents a D, ie the space immediately below the staff.

Sometimes I come across pieces of Irish music that extends down below the staff to B or A.

Can Noteworthy transpose this music upwards so that I can play it on my whistle and how is this transposing done automatically ?

thanks

joe mc cool

Reply 1 offered by: joe@benburb.demon.co.uk on 03-Jan-100

Ah, I got this sussed myself.

Thanks anyway.

Piece of cake.

joe


#1353: Symbol {
Symbol {

(1353)

Submitted by: Jose on 03-Jan-100

When I put the symbol "{" before a chord, nothing hapend, but in the samples yes ( I don´t now the name in english for the effect maybe "harpeged chord"

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Jan-2000

The text symbol has no effect on playback. The sample has a hidden track that you are hearing. To see this hidden track, use the menu option File | Page Setup..., Contents tab. Under the Groups box you will see the hidden track.


#1354: remembering options
remembering options

(1354)

Submitted by: joemccool on 03-Jan-100

Please,

I know that on page setup I can tell NWC to number the measures, but how do I get it to use this as default.

It seems that I have to go to page setup each time I want to print. This is a pain.

I want all my measures numbered, all the time.

thanks

joe

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 03-Jan-2000

Open a new file. Put in the basic settings you desire. Then save the file (whatever name you want) as a template. It should show up whenever you select "File," "New" from the menu. Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: joe@benburb.demon.co.uk on 03-Jan-2000

hmmm,

I'll try that, but I am not so sure it'll work.

Most of my files, the vast majority, are imports of MIDI files, so I am not starting off afresh.

still, thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 03-Jan-2000

On the import files, just copy the staves into the "new" file that you created with the template. Standard window copy keys work fine. That is, after importing the midi, (1) drag-select a staff, (2)use control-C to copy; (3) open a new file using your template; (4) control V to paste the copied staff into an empty staff.

If in your template, you selected numbered measures, then they should be numbered.

P.S. Be sure to save the template file in the NWC template folder so it shows up.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 14-Jan-2000

But you may also use a macro (with the macro recorder. Refer to the NWC Scriptorium, http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Macros ) if your design is always the same.
Simply record the action you make (typically, Alt,F,G, Ctrl-PgDn, Alt-L, Tab, B, Enter)

HTH,
   Dominique

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 offered by: Steve on 15-Jan-2000

man, I am sick of all these add on crap - I want a complete application

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew on 15-Jan-2000

Please give us an answer!! :)

Reply 8 offered by: Steve on 23-Jan-2000

hello? hello? hello?
I ask you for this and you never answer.
thank you
i will await your new first reply answer.

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Jan-2000

Pretty hard for anyone to answer if you just post your spam without a return address.

Reply 10 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Jan-2000

Demanding an answer, without first actually asking a question, seems to be an exercise in futility.


#1355: simplifying tunes
simplifying tunes

(1355)

Submitted by: joe@benburb.demon.co.uk on 03-Jan-2000

Please forgive my niavete(?) and thanks a lot for all the help I've received so far.

I play traditional Irish music and NWC is proving incredibly useful for learning new tunes.

Irish music is inclined to be repeatitive. Each eight bars are repeated. But when I convert midi files (most of my source is midi) NWC does not show the REPEATED BAR LINES. I have to insert these myself. It is no big deal, but I was hoping that NWC might be able to make the job a bit easier for me. Is there any way that I can print, or present the music in such a way that recognising the repeats is easier. For a beginner like me it is sometimes difficult to decide if a section is _actually_ repeated. A note or two may be different, but the difference is not worth retaining. But I have to study a complete section before I can decide.

At the moment I dump the score out to the printer and mark the repeated sections with a pencil. Then I go back into the score on screen and use EDIT AND CUT to delete them and insert LOCAL SECTION CLOSE etc. It would be handy if I could do this on-screen.

Any tips ?

Perhaps I am looking "jam on it".

TIA.

joe.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Jan-2000

The problem is not one with NWC, but rather with midi... since the midi standard does not include any facility for "repeats", everything has to be spelled out, as it were. I don't know of /any/ software that automagically recognises repeated sections in a pre-existing midi file.

Reply 2 offered by: joe@benburb.demon.co.uk on 04-Jan-2000

Thanks a lot Fred.

I realise that NWC cannot automatically construct repeats from midi files. As I said, sometimes only one bar will have, say, one note different from the previous section. NWC is not _that_ smart :-) And, as you've pointed out, midi files do not contain repeat instructions.

I was hoping for some general tips on how best to recognise the repeats and feature them.

thanks again

joe.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 14-Jan-2000

As you mention the problem, I once had to make a score shorter (cost: one-page constraint), and here is how I proceeded.

If your score is a one-staff score, then proceed like the following. Otherwise do the same on each staff (though it should give the same result on each staff).

First of all, play the whole thing. You'll notice some measures that ring you a bell --measures that are the same as others.
The problem is to ensure they are the same.
So you simply duplicate the measures wanted: add a new staff, pad with empty measure up to the first supposed repeated measure, and then copy there the measures you *think* are the same. Or better, copy from there to end.
Now, play the two staves, one being played on left channel, the other on right channel (set this is in StereoPan, Midi Tab of "F2" window). If a note is different, you'll immediately hear it. Then stop, replay if needed to locate it, and cut the measures that are the same, as you already do.

It is better to use empty measures (I mean with whole rests) rather than one empty measure repeated n times, since it's easier to compare the two staves on screen when aligned.

Proceed like that until you get to to the end of the score.

Example:
Suppose your tune is composed of 4 thems: A, B, C, D in the order ABBACBBD.
You can easily hear the B them, and then create a staff with: [silence until first B][rest of tune minus first B = BACBBD], so you got in parallel:
ABBACBBD
_BACBBD
On that case, you may check that the two "B" sections are *really* identical, and you'll note where it starts and ends. Then you go on, and in the "work" staff you try:
[silence until first A, i.e. nothing][ACBBD]
This gives:
ABBACBBD
ACBBD
You can now precisely identify the two A's, and so on.
Finally you may make a score with:
MasterRepeatBegin + A + |: B :| MasterRepeatClose + C + |: B :| + D

Hope this was not too obscure...


#1357: Corrupted Data
Corrupted Data

(1357)

Submitted by: Angelique on 04-Jan-2000

It seems like I'm doing nothing but asking questions! But I have searched through the FAQ and old forums and I can't find the answer to this (and no wonder! I can't figure out what "keywords" would fit this!)

I wrote out some bass and treble parts a while ago, and today I added drums (now that I know where they were hiding!) This worked just fine with another score, but on this score the data got scrambled. I think it happend when I accidentally right-clicked on a measure (it was the only boo-boo I remember.) After that, my screen was frozen and I had to close the file (fortuantely I had previously saved my data.)

Now the program is doing this: If I highlight the drum staff while playing back the entire score, the drums work fine, but the treble staff continues playing on and on, even when it's supposed to be silent. If I highlight the treble or bass staff, the drums quit their first pattern and go into the second pattern at a particular measure that is many bars ahead of where the second pattern is supposed to start. This happens *even after* I deleted all the incorrect bars and re-entered the information manually (not cut-and-paste.)

I know that sometimes the internal data does not match the visual. However, I don't know how I messed this up or how to fix it. I've tried cutting and pasting onto brand new staves, but this didn't help. I don't want to re-enter the entire score from scratch!

A note about the original score and the cut-and-pasted staves: when I highlight the original (messed up) score and I try to get a "staff play," the command is "greyed out." However, if I highlight a cut-and-paste staff, I can play that staff with the "staff play" command (not that it works correctly!)

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 04-Jan-2000

You can send me the NWC file to me through email if you like, but the first thing I would double-check are the "flow direction" commands, including "repeats", which need to be included on each staff for them to "match up".

KenJ

Reply 2 offered by: Angelique on 04-Jan-2000

Dear Ken,

Thanks for the offer, but I finally "fixed" the problem by redoing a lot of the work manually, saving it every bar or so. Therefore, sending the file wouldn't help any more! However, I would still be grateful for suggestions on preventing or untangling this problem in the future.

I did figure out one boneheaded thing I did: remember I said that the "staff play" on the original staves were "greyed out"? I had forgotten that, in order to hear the duplicate staves to see if they were working, I had muted the original ones!

Angelique


#1358: printing glitch with boxmarks
printing glitch with boxmarks

(1358)

Submitted by: Ian Wesley on 04-Jan-2000

G'Day

I was writing out some instrument parts last night and came across the following glitch. I was using the Boxmarks font for multiple rests and rehearsal letters. When I went to print preview, the automatic stave wrap failed - ie - the printing appeared to continue beyond the margin of the page. Also, when I used the right-arrow curcor key to scroll through the stave, I would reach a point where the scrolling would stop and then eventually jump to another point further along the stave. This only happened with one of the staves. I tried copying the whole stave to a completely new file, but the problem was still there. The file is not long (only 3 A4 pages of music) and I have had no problems with any of the other instrument parts. I finally solved the problem by removing the rehearsal letters. Does anyone have any bright ideas what went wrong?

Ian

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Jan-2000

This can happen if you have a gosh-awful-long measure that's too long to fit on the page (or screen). Usually this only occurs in "free-form" music (no time signature, and not enough bar lines) or in, say, something in 12/4 that's all in 1/64's and you're trying to print it with a 20-point staff size. Solution: add a bar line where you want this big measure to be split. Alternately, (for the screen) zoom out (the "-" magnifying glass) or (for the printer/preview) select a smaller staff font-size in Page Setup.

Reply 2 offered by: Ian Wesley on 04-Jan-2000

Thanks for the ideas - but I don't think that is the exact problem - the offending sequence had a double bar line, a single bar with a boxmark mulitple rest, a single barline, a boxmark rehearsal letter and another single bar and boxmark multiple rest character followed by a double bar line. It was just like any other sequence in the same piece, as far as I could see, but I will check the file carefully tonight to see if there is something amiss.

Thanks again

Ian

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 04-Jan-2000

Do these "rehearsal letters" involve long text strings? If so, your problem may be because text strings that cross a bar line do not wrap when the staff wraps (ie. the string does not get split). The solution is to divide up the text string so it does not cross a bar line where the line wraps. I don't understand the cursor problem. If it still happens, perhaps you could post a copy of the song.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Jan-2000

The symbols for multi measure rest do not occupy any time space in the measure - it's really an empty bar containing text - this could be the problem.
Add a whole note rest in the 'multi-rest' bars and fit the symbol around it.
If you add a rehearsal mark before the bar with 'preserve width' off you can lose the rehearsal mark off to the right of the end of the system.

Sorry but this is a problem that Boxmarks can't solve!


#1359: ...problems...
...problems...

(1359)

Submitted by: Juju on 04-Jan-2000

Is it possible to include duolets or quintuplets in our compositions?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 04-Jan-2000

I believe a duplet can be done by dotting the notes. For quintuplets, see message msg #1320


#1360: How could I get fixed-width measure?
How could I get fixed-width measure?

(1360)

Submitted by: Alfred Kook on 06-Jan-2000

Hello,

The width of measure is determined by counts of notes.
Therefore, on the paper, a staff has defferent number of
measure.

I want to get somewhat one staff, one line horizontaly,
has four measure with fixed width.

How could I get fixed-width measure regardless of the number
of notes?

Please, give your help...

Thanks you.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Jan-2000

NWC adjusts measure widths based ontheir content. There is no way around this.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 06-Jan-2000

That being said, you do have some control over this by adjusting content -- example, use strings of blank spaces to widen the measures. Also experiment with staff font size and "adjust for longer note duration" or however it's phrased (in Page Setup) to get the spacing you want (use Print Preview to check it).


#1361: Why won't the guiro sound work?
Why won't the guiro sound work?

(1361)

Submitted by: Angelique on 06-Jan-2000

For those who haven't heard of it, the guiro is a Latin percussion instrument. Noteworthy Composer offers two guiro sounds. So far my percussion sounds work great, but for some reason the two guiro sounds are absolutely silent. This happens if they are on a staff alone, or if they are mixed with other percussion sounds. If they are mixed in, the other sounds are fine; it's only the guiro that are muted.

(Btw, they work when I run the DRUMREFtest file.)

Angelique

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 06-Jan-2000

Are you sure you have the right clef? Note that the drumref.nwc sounds are on two staves; the top staff is treble clef, the bottom is bass clef.

Reply 2 offered by: Angelique on 06-Jan-2000

Fred asked if I was using the correct clef. Yes, I am. The guiro is on the treble clef and I am using the treble clef (and I didn't accidentally move it up or down an octave.)

Angelique

Reply 3 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 07-Jan-2000

Just to check the obvious, are sure you have assigned your guiro staff to MIDI channel 10? It's a MIDI requirement: drums don't work in any other channel.

Reply 4 offered by: Angelique on 07-Jan-2000

Yes, my MIDI is set to channel 10. I think I may have an (unfortunate) answer, however; the problem might be my sound card.

Last night I loaded Noteworthy Composer onto my new laptop. I copied the troublesome score onto the laptop, and it plays just fine, guiro sounds and all. As far as I can tell, the sound settings on my laptop and desktop are the same; the only difference is the sound cards and their drivers (brand-new vs. ancient.)

I would still welcome suggestions on making it work on my desktop, though!

Anglelique

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Jan-2000

Here are some other things that occasionally help:

- Longer duration notes
- Harder struct notes (use an "fff" dynamic)
- PLaying the part alone (without other parts playing)


#1362: Printing problem
Printing problem

(1362)

Submitted by: Bryan Wylie on 07-Jan-2000

I'm having a problem with printing some scores. I'm using an Epson Stylus Color 600 with W95 - it normally works fine with no apparent difficulties.
Visualise printing on A4 paper in portrait format, with each bar containg a large number of very short notes, plus a clef sign, key signature and various other bits and pieces. There comes a point where there is not enough width to fit all the notes in, and those at the right hand side are simply lost.
Is there some way to reduce the size of the staff - ie the point size - so that more characters can be fitted in?

Bryan Wylie

Reply 1 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 07-Jan-2000

In File->Page Setup->Options you can set,in points, the size the staff should be printed. Try lowering a bit the default size and check the page preview to see if your measure fits in.

Reply 2 offered by: Bryan Wylie on 09-Jan-2000

Works great, many thanks, Ramon

Bryan


#1364: Fee for Arranging
Fee for Arranging

(1364)

Submitted by: Steve on 07-Jan-2000

Anyone out there do arrangements for a fee? - a work for
hire situation? I'm curious how you charge: hourly / by
piece? Rates?

- Steve

Reply 1 offered by: Phil on 07-Jan-2000

I quote on individual jobs.
I work it out as a rate of $22/hour.
I am quite fast so I do several jobs and make more than $30/hour.
Noteworthy is quick to type in notes.
I type in the chord names or write them in.
NWC is also quick for importing midi files and touching them up.
Though there's no guitar tabs yet, but I stamp them on after print and then photocopy. Would be nice for them to be built in or have a tool to detect chords and print the chord symbol above. Other programs do this okay but they are not Noteworthy.
So arranging can be profitable.
I advertise on my internet site.


#1365: Playback while inputting
Playback while inputting

(1365)

Submitted by: Ian Hinton on 08-Jan-2000

I have been inputting notes into staves by using the computer keyboard and the mouse. I have now purchased a MIDI keyboard that is working correctly, but can't find a way of hearing the notes I am inputting into the staves. The input is working correctly, as I can see the single notes or chords being registered on the pentagram, but I can't find any way of hearing the notes as I play them. I can only hear the music when using F5 to play it.
I have gone through all the options in the configuration, but I can't seem to find the solution.
Is there anything I can do?

Reply 1 offered by: skram on 08-Jan-2000

what about midi thru?

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Jan-2000

> I have gone through all the options in the configuration,
> but I can't seem to find the solution.

It is on the same option tab as where you selected your recording device. It is at Tools | Options | Record. Enable "Echo MIDI input" and the other two boxes, and off you go.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Johnson on 10-Jan-2000

Midi thru is the same as Echo Midi Input to prevent any confusion. :)


#1366: "Octavo" mark
"Octavo" mark

(1366)

Submitted by: Bryan Wylie on 09-Jan-2000

Is there a way to insert an "octavo" mark - to specify that the notes should be played an octave higher (or lower) than they are written on the staff.

Bryan Wylie

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Jan-2000

You can insert a Clef symbol and set the Octave Shift. If you want the usual 8va---- notation you have to insert it as text.


#1367: Scriptorium update
Scriptorium update

(1367)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Jan-2000

The Scriptorium is open for business for files in NWC V1.70 beta format.

We've set up a separate file area for these files, since they won't be readable by V1.55b. To reduce confusion, we'll maintain this separation at least until V1.70 reaches final release, at which time the files will be combined into the main database.

Note that the search engine _will_ find all files matching the search criteria in both file areas.

A few files have been posted for beta testers to experiment with, more will undoubtedly follow shortly.

Reply 1 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 16-Feb-2000

16 Feb 00
I suggest that contributors to Scriptorium 1.70
submit their scripts in "skeleton" form... no
dynamic or tempo inserts. As current NWC versions
operate (I'm told), not all inserts can be deleted.
If/when newer NWC versions come on line, such a
feature might not be necessary, but until then, new
mods would be much "cleaner" with a stripped-down
base script.
R C Vanderburgh rcvandy@erinet.com

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Feb-2000

I can't imagine who would have told you that inserted items cannot be deleted. In any event, that isn't (nor has it ever been) the case. Anything you can insert, you can edit or delete.

The submissions to the Scriptorium vary as greatly as do their creators. Some are very "bare-bones," others are exquisitely dressed to give top-notch visual output, or detailed midi performance, or both. The new features in NWC (esp. "hide anything" from the visual aspect, and "access any controller" from the midi aspect) will, I'm sure, result in a lot more files that incorporate this kind of detail.

If you really want an NWC file with no additional dynamics, mpc's, or text inserts, you can always export it to Type 1 midi, and re-import it.

Reply 3 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 23-Feb-2000

23 Feb 00
Thanks for your comments. I have found some instances where select/delete does not work. Is there some other selective method? How do you find (let alone delete) invisible settings. I will keep in mind using export/import MIDI.
RCV

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 23-Feb-2000

'Invisible' items are only invisible as far as printing, print preview, and NoteWorthy Player are concerned. In the edit window they show up as a light grey (which can be changed as desired in Options). Text and other items that take up 'zero width' have a little diamond-shaped glyph that you can grab for editing or deletion.

Selection can be accomplished using various methods:

1: Place the cursor before the item and press SHIFT + Right Arrow.

2: Place the cursor after the item and press SHIFT + Left arrow.

3: Use the mouse to position before or after the item, then click and drag to select.

Once selected, the item (or multiple items if more than one is selected) can be edited using CNTL-C, ALT-Enter, or Edit Selection from the Edit menu. Delete is easiest to accomplish by pressing the Delete key.

HTH...
Fred

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Feb-2000

Oops... one qualification. The point about selecting and editing multiple items only applies to the new V1.70, presently in beta. In V1.55b and earlier you could only edit a single item at a time. However, you /can/ delete a selection containing multiple objects in any version.

Also, the use of ALT-Enter for editing is new in V1.70 beta. For 1.55b you have to use CNTL-E or use Edit-->Selection.

Reply 6 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 24-Feb-2000

24 Feb 00
Hello Fred, I have applied what you have recommended to the classical songfile: Fur Elise (Beethoven), as it is available for use by both my copies of NWC 1.55b and 1.70 Beta 2. In both cases, thorough (visible) deletion of non-note/rest artifacts left two apparent crescendos in measures 1 thru 8. BTW, how do I decipher "5 2 1" or large X or Y?
Using MIDI conversion/reconversion appears to "clean" the script, although some beamed sixteenth notes were incorrectly converted to thirtysecond notes.
Thanks for your continued help.
RCV

Reply 7 offered by: Fred on 24-Feb-2000

I don't have that file here with me, but I suspect you're hearing output from the hidden (sounding) staves, as compared to the visible (muted) staves. Go to Page Setup, and in Contents make sure that all staves are checked as visible.

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 24-Feb-2000

Fred is exactly right: the staves that actually make noise are hidden and must be unhidden from Page Setup. Then you can delete the dynamics from them.

As to the other stuff, "5 2 1" and other inserted numbers are suggested fingerings. The large X and Y are what you get when you don't have the Boxmarks font installed. With Boxmarks installed these turn into crescendo and decrescendo hairpins, respectively. (If you edit the text item containing the X and Y you'll see that it specifies the "User 1" font, and if you look at the Fonts tab of Page Setup you'll see that "User 1" is set to Boxmarks.)

Boxmarks (and the new Crescendo font for longer hairpins) can be downloaded for free from the NWC Scriptorium (http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html)

Reply 9 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 27-Feb-2000

27 Feb 00

Hello Grant,
Using NWC 1.70 I was unable to modify anything in songfile beet2721 (1st Mov't Moonlight Sonata), even by setting everything to "visible" in Page Setup. Attempts to "clean" the file by nwc to mid to nwc conversions scrambled triplet constructs.

RCV

Reply 10 offered by: Grant on 27-Feb-2000

You're butting your head against the "staff layering" feature. File/Page Setup shows that there are 4 staves, but even if you select all four for display, you'll see only three. This is because the first two staves are overlaid (which makes possible mixed rhythms like the dotted 8th/16th rhythm of the melody against the triplets of the accompaniment). What's probably happening is that you're trying to delete items from overlaid staff 2 when your current active staff is staff 1.

If you go back to the "Contents" tab of Page Setup and uncheck "Allow Layering", all the staves will show up separately and you should have no trouble editing them to your heart's content.

As to the triplet import problem, I can't help you there. This is a longstanding complaint. Some have suggested keyboard macros as the answer.

Reply 11 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 27-Feb-2000

27 Feb 00
Hello Again,
Thanks for the explanation. I suggest new editions of the helpfile/manual include an explanation of staff layering.

RCV


#1369: Copying sections and inserting them
Copying sections and inserting them

(1369)

Submitted by: David Lake on 10-Jan-2000

I have a composiotion with 5 verses which are not duplicates of each other note wise.
I have a repeated refrain which I am trying to insert between the verses. I highlight the refrain and select copy, then attempt to paste it inbetween verses. No luck, it does not paste.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Jan-2000

I need more details. When you copy, is the menu Copy item enabled (not gray)? Assuming you paste somewhere in the staff, is the Paste menu item enabled?

Reply 2 offered by: David Lake on 11-Jan-2000

I highlight the passage I want to copy and using the mouse , press copy.
I then go to the insert point and attempt to paste. Nothing is grayed out.
The editor thinks I've done the paste (it lets me undo) but nothing appears on the screen.
1. It also would be handy to be able to copy the three staves involved. I am using the piano score with vocal accompaniment.

Reply 3 offered by: David Lake on 11-Jan-2000

Dumb old me. Iwas trying to copy the vocal line with the lyrics.
I took out the lyrics and did my copying.
I then added the lyrics and all is well.
I still would like to copyy more the one staff at a time.


#1370: Display notes in real-time
Display notes in real-time

(1370)

Submitted by: Bobby Crosby on 11-Jan-2000

Hello,
This isn't a question about Noteworthy but I am after something that will complement my use of Noteworthy as an effective learning tool. (sorry I can't use the newsgroup)

Does anybody know of a freeware or shareware program that displays notes played on a MIDI keyboard on my computer screen in a treble and bass clef?

For example, if I played the note D in the treble clef it would highlight that note in the clef on the screen for as long as I hold it. It would also have to work with chords and show accidentals.

I have been looking for something like this for a long time and I would appreciate any replies. Thank you.

Bbbi

Reply 1 offered by: Bobby Crosby on 15-Jan-2000

Please help me, I need some help/
Is there any program to do this?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Jan-2000

I haven't seen any programs that do this, perhaps it doesn't exist (which would explain why you haven't received any replies). There is a program called "Midi Monitor" which you can download for free from various ftp sites, it was written for Windows 3.x but works fine on Windows 95. It will show you the midi events as you play them, although in text format (not as a graphical note representation).

Reply 3 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 21-Jan-2000

I don't know if i correctly understand your need but, if you need a training tool, you may find on:
!www.earmaster.com
a nice program you may download for trial. It is able to compare your Midi keyboard Input with a lot of random exercises. For example, here is the help for the "Chord identification exercise":
EarMaster plays a random chord chosen from among the selected chords and transposed to a randomly chosen key. Push Play again to hear the chord once more.
Answering the question:
You can answer the question in four different ways: by name, on the screen-piano, on the note sheet or via MIDI.

You may also have a try on !www.earpower.com where you'll find two small training programs.

Bruno

Reply 4 offered by: Andy on 23-Jan-2000

Hi,
I would love the same program that does as the guy above illustrated... Can any body here program it, or does someone know a better place to look for this?
Thanking you with high regards,
Andy.


#1371: flageolettes
flageolettes

(1371)

Submitted by: christian wollin on 11-Jan-2000

Is it posssible to write flageolettes in NWC?


#1372: Boxmarks will be back... soon
Boxmarks will be back... soon

(1372)

Submitted by: Marsu on 13-Jan-2000

Hi to all, and happy new year to any of you.

For some reasons, Barry Graham has decided not to keep on working on the Boxmarks font that many of us use.
Before deciding this, he asked me if I wanted to maintain the font he created, and my answer is YES.

I've made some enhancements to the Boxmarks font, but before releasing it I'd like to know which chars are the most missing.

You may answer to this forum thread or, better, write me directly.

I'll try to release the new version of the font at the same time as NWC 1.70 (not beta) will be delivered.
This give you some time, and the best thing you can do in the meanwhile is to test this NWC beta!!!
It is a version that gives you more ease than ever, and the more you use it the more you like it.
This 1.70 version has been already heavily tested by some users, for more than some months. It leaded to a stable, easy-to-use and consistent program that gives you more flexibility to write your own scores.

NWCly yours,

         Dominique                     marsu@europe.com

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Jan-2000

Happy New Year, Marsu. I am glad you are taking on the Boxmarks font. The thing I want the most is a way of stringing characters together to make hairpin crescendos.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Eidson on 13-Jan-2000

Marsu,
Thank you for continuing this great font!
My only problem with it is the multi-measure rest symbols always have a small space in the middle. This isn't a big problem but I am a bit of a perfectionist when it comes to music. If there is any way to make a character the entire rest symbol (not just one side of it) I would appreciate it.
Good luck and thanks again,
Joe

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Jan-2000

I just discovered a hairpin crescendo font in the user tips at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip7.htm#cresc

I wonder if what you are adding to Boxmarks is equal to or better than this? I would like to know before I commit to using another custom font in my songs (makes it harder to share files, etc.)

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 28-Jan-2000

It's the same font, by Pierre Schmidt. Hopes are that the longer hairpins can be incorporated into Boxmarks, to augment the small ones already there. There is ongoing discussion about this, stay tuned...

Reply 5 offered by: lurker on 28-Jan-2000

With all the development and testing has anybody considered including the fontS into v1.70 release? (not beta)

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 29-Jan-2000

I've already emailed marsu privately with one wish list item for the combined Boxmarks/Crescendo font, which is a pair of hairpins shorter than the shortest ones in Crescendo, but longer than the ones in Boxmarks. Now that I've found this thread I'll add a couple more:

1. the "snap pizzicato" symbol, a circle with a vertical line entering it at the top (see, for example, the Bartok 4th quartet, 4th movement).

2. crescendo hairpins that begin with a slight gap, to indicate continuation from the previous system (yes, I know Liquid Paper can be used to achieve the same effect, but really . . .) Also diminuendo hairpins that end with such a gap.

On the other hand, how much room is there in a combined Boxmarks/Crescendo font for new symbols? Does it make sense to combine these two fonts when the result could be an impoverished symbol set? Why shouldn't they be, in fact, two separate fonts?

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 29-Jan-2000

add to my list:

3. an upside-down fermata until such time as NWC's own font has one.

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Jan-2000

Another two cents' worth -- I'd like to see the existing symbol mappings retained for reverse compatibility with existing scores using previous versions of Boxmarks. As to the number of symbols allowed - in principle there are just over 250 usable map positions, which should be plenty. That being said, many of them would require ALT 0xxx code entries (or click and copy using charmap.exe) so perhaps the most commonly used symbols should be mapped to the "normal" (direct keyboard access) slots. My preference would be _not_ to have multiple fonts, I'd rather put up with the nuisance of ALT mappings.

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 30-Jan-2000

(I'll refrain from discussing the relative worth of 2 cents Canadian vs. 2 cents U.S. . . .)

Another thing occurred to me as I was looking at a set of parts today (I usually read scores, not parts). It seems traditional to represent multi-measure rests (up to a certain point) by combining symbols representing 1-, 2-, and 4-measure rests. The 1-measure rest is our familiar whole-rest sign; 2 measures of rest are represented by a 'block' the width of a whole rest but covering an entire space between staff lines; 4 measures are a similar block covering two staff spaces. So, for example, a 7-measure rest is a 4-measure rest plus a 2-measure rest plus a 1-measure rest, all within the same "visual" measure (that is, without bar lines separating them), with a large number '7' above them.

I don't know whether the 2- and 4-measure rest symbols are still in frequent use (but probably: the parts I was reading were published in 1952). If they are, Boxmarks should probably have them too.


#1373: polyrythms (3 against 2...)
polyrythms (3 against 2...)

(1373)

Submitted by: Leo Lopez on 13-Jan-2000

Is it possible to hide the "3" on top of the triplets if you are in common time, but one hand (of a marimba solo) will be playing triplets for most of the piece while the other hand is playing 8th notes? I don't want to write each hand in a different time signature. can someone help me out? I need to know if this is possible before I purchase the software.

-Leo

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 13-Jan-2000

This and many similar operations can be accomplished on the new V1.70 beta, by using a (hidden) different time signature (e.g. 12/16) and inserting the "real" (displayed) signature as text.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 14-Jan-2000

Fred, have I missed something? My crotchets still line up with each other on the two staffs, whatever the time signature, whereas what is wanted here is that dotted crotchets (in 12/8) line up with crotchets (in 4/4).

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Jan-2000

Sorry, I didn't explain fully. As an example: treble clef plays triplet 1/8's against straight 1/8's in the bass in 2/4 time. Assign 6/8 time signature to _both_ staves, add phantom 2/4 sig using text insertion. In the treble staff, enter the notes as usual. (Beam groups of three for "implicit triplets".) In the bass staff, enter 1/8's separated by 1/16 (hidden) rests. The performance may therefore be more marcato than you'd like, in which case have a separate (hidden) staff in which the bass notes are dotted 1/8's, and mute the visible staff. Unfortunately, we can't (yet) beam notes across rests (even hidden ones).

Reply 4 offered by: David Wallace on 08-Feb-2000

I have one rather sneaky way around this using 3/4 or equivalent time. You can imitate a 4/4 time signature by using a dotted note of half the intended length. For instance, a 4/4 quarter note can be imitated by a dotted eighth in 3/4 time.

Just use beamed eighths as your triplets and dotted 1/16 notes for your "eighths" in 3/4 time.


#1375: Sound Card
Sound Card

(1375)

Submitted by: Bryan Wylie on 17-Jan-2000

I'm thinking of updating my computer soon. ATM I have a SB AWE 32 sound card. Has anyone any recommendations for a card which would give better results with NWC - without breaking the bank of course - <G>

Bryan

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Starfield on 17-Jan-2000

From what I have read and heard the Creative Soundblaster Live! is well worth buying. UK prices shouldn't be too bad. This card also comes with digital input and output and is currently the top of the range. Good luck - Barry

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Jan-2000

I have an AWE32 with 8mb RAM on board.
I love it!
If I ever upgrade it will probably be the SB Live.

Reply 3 offered by: Bryan Wylie on 18-Jan-2000

OK Barry, thanks. I find the SB AWE 32 quite good,but it does not support all the dynamics in NWC so I was looking for something a bit more comprehensive.

Bryan

Reply 4 offered by: Shane Turner on 21-Jan-2000

I'd reccomend the sound blaster live as well. Its cheap, and depending on your system ram, you can use soundfonts 32mb in size. For me its invaluable.. the 32mb of soundfont capability lets me do music that is pretty good. The only downside of course is the lack of MIDI controller support in NWC, so you won't have any reverb, chorus, effects, or envelope settings available.

Reply 5 offered by: Bryan Wylie on 22-Jan-2000

Thanks, Shane.

Bryan


#1376: recording mp3's onto a tape
recording mp3's onto a tape

(1376)

Submitted by: Al on 18-Jan-2000

Is there any way to record songs on your computer, onto a
tape? Please Help.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 19-Jan-2000

Sure. Use or split off one of the "line out"'s on the back of your soundcard and run those into your tape deck. You may have to get an adapter to convert to speaker plugs from the mini jack. Those are available at most stores that carry audio equipment.

You can hear the tape deck through your computer by simply running lines from the "out"'s of tape deck into the "line in" plug or plugs on your soundcard. Again, you may need an adapter to go from a speaker plug to a mini jack.

Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: waynez on 28-Mar-2001

I've tried using an adapter from my 'headphone out' jack on my laptop to my RCA jacks on my receiver, but the sound is horrible --- clipped and ugly

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 28-Mar-2001

Depends on which RCA jacks you use on your hi-fi. If you use the phono jacks, yes it will sound clipped and ugly. Use one of the line inputs (AUX, Tape, CD, Video, etc.) and you should be alright.

You might have to reduce the volume level using your computer's volume control applet. Headphone outputs are a little "hotter" than standard line outputs.

HTH

Fred N


#1377: MIDI Multi-Point Controller
MIDI Multi-Point Controller

(1377)

Submitted by: Laanan Fisher on 19-Jan-2000

Hello. Love the program!

I've got a quick question. Is there anyway to use a different controller than the current list, ie tempo, pitch, volume, etc.?

I have the SBLive! card and I can have quite a bit of effects mapped through with my MIDI, chorus, reverb, distortion, flange, etc.

These effects are mapped into controller values usually in the mid-90's. I've tried to find a way of manually selecting the controller I need, but to no avail.

Does NoteWorthy work that way with the soundcard, or is that MP Controller dialog an internal feature seperate from it, ie, controlling volume, pitch and such without the soundcard?

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Jan-2000

The multi-point controller does control the synth directly; e.g. controllers 7 and 10 for volume and pan. The pedal controller (64) is handled by the "insert pedal marking" command. Other controllers have not been implemented yet. The only way to insert them is to "massage" your midi files after export using an external sequencer or midi editor.

Reply 2 offered by: Shane Turner on 21-Jan-2000

Seems everybody asks about this once a month or two... they really should integrate controller support, it would be extremely useful. As it is, to use controllers I have to export my NWC file as a MIDI, edit it. Of course, once its a midi, I can't import it back in, because I'd lose all my dynamics and controller settings. Maybe a good item to send to the wish list again.

Reply 3 offered by: Laanan Fisher on 22-Jan-2000

Yeah. Sorry about that guys. After I wrote that, I noticed you could look at past threads, and I found tons pertaining to the subject.

- lf


#1378: mf2t source code
mf2t source code

(1378)

Submitted by: Per Aronsson on 19-Jan-2000

I recently found the program mf2t, which is exactly what I've been looking for. However, I could not get it to work properly. I downloaded the source code, unzipped it on a PC, and compiled it on a Digital UNIX machine. The midifile used is the enclosed 'example2.mid'. Hopefully, there is somebody out there who might realize instantly what is wrong by seeing the error message below....?

Running the program:

magritte:~/mf2t>mf2t example2.mid
MFile 1 4 96
MTrk
0 TimeSig 4/4 24 0
Error: unexpected running status (midifile.c)

Compiling the source code:

magritte:~/mf2t>make -f makefile.unx
cxx -O -c midifile.c
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 178: In this declaration, "readtrack" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
readtrack() /* read a track chunk */
^
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 293: In this declaration, "badbyte" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
badbyte(c)
^
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 303: In this declaration, "metaevent" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
metaevent(type)
^
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 363: In this declaration, "sysex" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
sysex()
^
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 370: In this declaration, "chanmessage" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
chanmessage(status,c1,c2)
^
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 488: In this declaration, "msginit" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
msginit()
^
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 500: In this declaration, "msgleng" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
msgleng()
^
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 506: In this declaration, "msgadd" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
msgadd(c)
^
cc: Warning: midifile.c, line 516: In this declaration, "biggermsg" is
declared with both internal and external linkage.
biggermsg()
^
cxx -O -c mf2t.c
cxx -O -c crack.c
cxx mf2t.o midifile.o crack.o -o mf2t
cxx -O -c t2mf.c
cc: Warning: t2mf.c, line 488: In this statement, "realloc(...)" of type
"int", is being converted to "pointer to char".
buffer = realloc (buffer, bufsiz);
----------------^
cc: Warning: t2mf.c, line 490: In this statement, "malloc(...)" of type
"int", is being converted to "pointer to char".
buffer = malloc (bufsiz);
----------------^
cc: Warning: t2mf.c, line 530: In this statement, "realloc(...)" of type
"int", is being converted to "pointer to char".
buffer = realloc (buffer, bufsiz);
--------------------^
cc: Warning: t2mf.c, line 532: In this statement, "malloc(...)" of type
"int", is being converted to "pointer to char".
buffer = malloc (bufsiz);
--------------------^
cxx -O -c t2mflex.c
cxx t2mf.o midifile.o crack.o t2mflex.o -o t2mf

----

I'm grateful for any hints on this. (cxx is a C++ compiler on digital
UNIX)

Yours sincerely,
Per Aronsson


#1379: MPC... Please HELP!!!
MPC... Please HELP!!!

(1379)

Submitted by: Mark on 21-Jan-2000

Hi all,

I have been mucking around with NWC since 1996. Love it!

Just a few questions which has annoyed me over the years: what is a "mpc", what do you us it for, how does it improve the music?

I have tried to get my silly head around what's written about it in the "Help" files; no success though, so I now turn to your collective consciouness to help me out a little!

In appreciation, Mark

P/S. e-mail me if interested in K 466, K 467, Schone Mullerin, Beethoven Sym no:5 (NWC files)

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 21-Jan-2000

I use MPC's for controlled variations in tempo and volume (you can also do pitch bends with MPC's but I haven't found occasion to do much with that).

For example, if I'm transcribing something that has a 4-measure accel. from one tempo to another, I'll insert an MPC. The change can be done at a single constant rate or broken down into several shorter contiguous changes, so you get some control over the *rate* of tempo change rather than just the beginning and ending tempos.

The use of MPC's for volume is similar, and is (afaik) the only way to achieve a crescendo or decrescendo on a held note in NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 21-Jan-2000

You can do dynamic variances on held notes if you click the "Override default volume" in the variance dialog and specify the starting and ending channel volumes. E.g.:

pp(0,25) -- cresc. -- ff(0,120) gives a smooth crescendo from volume 25 to 120.

Similarly, you can use accel. and ritard. statements to smoothly change tempi without the use of mpc. The only requirement is that the starting and ending tempi be on the same staff as the tempo variance.

mpc's are, however, the only way to do pitch changes, either in steps (absolute) or smoothly (linear sweep) over the given range, as defined by the resolution setting.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 21-Jan-2000

>>You can do dynamic variances on held notes ...

Yes, I suspected there might be *some* way to do it from something someone said on the NG. But I didn't know what the way was - thanks.

>>Similarly, you can use accel. and ritard. statements to smoothly change tempi ...

But not with any control over the *rate* of tempo change unless you want to insert a bunch of intermediate tempo markings.

Reply 4 offered by: ST on 22-Jan-2000

To change the "dynamics" of held notes.. you actually have to adjust the volume settings. For example.. say you play a chord for two bars.. If you set the volume at zero at the beginning and at 90 at the end, and select the "linear" box, it will do a nice, long, fade-in, a great effect.
Of course, this depends on your MIDI card too, some older cards don't support this.


#1380: Type 1 MIDI --> Type 0 MIDI...?
Type 1 MIDI --> Type 0 MIDI...?

(1380)

Submitted by: Brian Havey on 21-Jan-2000

I know this isn't exactly a Noteworthy Composer question but is there any way to convert a type 1 MIDI file to a type 0 MIDI file without ripping the file open? I don't think it can be done with Noteworthy Composer... do you know of any programs which can do this?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 21-Jan-2000

NoteWorthy Composer can do this.
Use File>Export> then select Type 0 from the arrow list.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Jan-2000

The NoteWorthy Composer Scriptorium at:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

has some links to some helpful utilities. Follow the "Other helpful files" link and see what you find.


#1381: Overide default MIDI volume
Overide default MIDI volume

(1381)

Submitted by: Mark on 22-Jan-2000

Hi all, again!

I have noticed that using the "Overide default MIDI volume" function alters the volume of the other notes that come after its insertion...

Why does this happen?

Can it be prevented?

Thanking you in advance, Mark

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Jan-2000

You can learn more about MIDI volume, as set in NWC, from the following past threads:

msg #57, msg #540, msg #1103, msg #1243

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Jan-2000

It would also be a good idea to review the online help for the settings in the Dynamics dialog box. These explain the Volume and Velocity settings, although not how to best take advantage of them.


#1383: Instruments & Human Voices
Instruments & Human Voices

(1383)

Submitted by: Julius Martin on 22-Jan-2000

For NWC payback, which musical instruments mostly closely mimic human voices?
<Voice> <Instrument>
Soprano ==>
Alto ==>
Tenor ==>
Bass ==>
----------
Mezzo Soprano ==>
Baritone ==>
???

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 22-Jan-2000

Depends somewhat on the sound card (or sound font, if applicable) that you're using, as well as personal taste. The woodwind sounds (esp. oboe, clarinet and bassoon) can be used to good advantage in many cases. Exception: orchestral work where you don't want the vox to be confused with the "real" woods. I find that in such a situation it's beneficial to combine two different sounds (on two staves, one of which is hidden). I like 27 (jazz guitar) for the "main" sound (typically set at volume 105 or so), and 53, 54 or 86 (choir oohs, choir aahs, choir pad) for the other staff (at lower volume, typically around 85-90). Using different patches like this also helps differentiate between different voices (e.g. in duets, trios, etc.)


#1384: sharp and flat
sharp and flat

(1384)

Submitted by: jean-Paul Quelen on 22-Jan-2000

I want to insert the notes :

C Bflat A Csharp bar line

D C(Natural accidental) Bflat A D ... (Credo Mess E moll - Bruckner)
automatikly with a synthe

but the Key signature is C major and the notes are after "audit bar line "

C Asharp Anatural acc Csharp bar line
D C(no natural accidental because bar line) Asharp Anatural D ...
The sound is almost the same but the B flat is not a A sharp
and I have some trouble to change this easier ...

Reply 1 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 14-Feb-2000

At a guess, just don't use any Audit functions after you've fine-tuned the accidentals the way you want them.


#1385: burning CD's
burning CD's

(1385)

Submitted by: Sean on 22-Jan-2000

I would sincerely appreciate if someone could explain to me how to adjust and set the volumes on MP3's before burning them on to a CD. I use WINAMP to convert MP3s to WAV. All the songs are recorded at different volume, thus i have to keep adjusting my volume on my cd player. You can e-mail me at am_sidhu@hotmail.com. Thanks alot.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 22-Jan-2000

Best if you adjust the volume while recording the wav from the mp3 (using the Volume Control applet). Another way, assuming the volume is not too far off, is to use a wav editor's "amplify" option.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 22-Jan-2000

The MusicMatch Jutebox has a "normalization" setting which supposedly eliminates volume differences in recorings. It determines the "peak" volume during recording. I have not tried it yet, but may meet your needs. Could be that WinAmp has something similar.

MusicMatch can be found at !www.musicmatch.com

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 22-Jan-2000

Should have double checked the hyperlink instructions first. The musicmatch player is located at !http:/www.musicmatch.com

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Pearson on 22-Jan-2000

I give up. I can't type either. I think I'll go hide in shame. http://www.musicmatch.com

Reply 5 offered by: Shane Turner on 22-Jan-2000

I've done this several times.. using the WinAmp diskwriter plugin. The winamp volume doesn't affect the .wav file because this is a direct wav-mp3 conversion. What you have to do is import your quiet (or too loud) .wav files into an audio editing program like Creative WaveStudio (which comes with any soundblaster) or CoolEdit (you can download it and use a trial version for free indefinitely). Then in the programs use the amplification option to adjust the volume of the .wav files to a suitable level.

Reply 6 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 24-Jan-2000

Shane, my dearest of ladies, would you show the divine grace and kindness to partake with us the site on which cooledit may be found?

Yours humbly,

StV

:)

Reply 7 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 24-Jan-2000

you can email it to me if you wish

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Jan-2000

Cool Edit is available at http://www.syntrillium.com

Reply 9 offered by: Shane Turner on 25-Jan-2000

Looks like ya beat me to the punch :-)
The main reason I mentioned this is that there is a lot of tools available on the web that don't require you to spend any money, especially if you're a student like me without a lot of cash to throw around. Winamp is absolutely free, and cooledit can be used indefinitely (with some features disabled but still useable). Of course, after a while, you might end up registering it (like I did.. after 2 years)...

And by the way, Sterghios, I'm male last I checked, so I'll take that crack about me being a lady as a friendly joke :-P


#1386: My TAB key has flipped out!
My TAB key has flipped out!

(1386)

Submitted by: Angelique on 22-Jan-2000

All of a sudden, my TAB key no longer places a bar line in a measure. Instead, it works as the TAB key might if Noteworthy were not opened; it brings up another program that has been hiding in the background.

I can't imagine what I did to change the function of the TAB key. Yes, I closed Noteworthy Composer and opened it again, and that didn't help.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Jan-2000

Maybe your ALT key is stuck?

Reply 2 offered by: Angelique on 22-Jan-2000

That was it! I would never have thought of that! Thanks!


#1387: I need some help with .wav to cd conversion....
I need some help with .wav to cd conversion....

(1387)

Submitted by: Grrrr-e-a-t on 22-Jan-2000

How can a put a .wav file onto a cd so that when I put the cd into my stereo, the cd will play?

Every time I try to do this the stereo always tells me that no disc is inserted, so I imagine that it can't read the file on the cd. Is there any software that can do this? Can Windows do it?

Please help.
thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Jan-2000

Your CD burner should have come with software such as Adaptec's Easy-CD Writer, which allows you to write wav file data as audio. There are two audio formats, ISO something-or-other, and Joliet. I've used Joliet, appears to work fine. Note also: you have to write all the tracks in one session; if you write them in multiple sessions, the audio CD will play fine on a computer CD ROM, but not on the ordinary run of home, car or portable CD players (they'll only recognise the tracks written in the first session). Finally, use CD-R CD's only; though the idea of erasable CD-RW discs may be appealing, they won't play on any except the newest home CD players.


#1388: Ritardando Question
Ritardando Question

(1388)

Submitted by: Angelique on 23-Jan-2000

In the past, I have added the "ritardando" command the middle of a bar, and it has worked perfectly. The music has slowed gradually until it reached the new tempo (posted in the next measure.) In the past, I have always added this to the top (melody) staff.

Now I am trying to add this command to a rhythm staff. It won't work! The only thing playing are the drums. Why won't they slow down? (Later on in the same score, the ritardando command still works for all the instruments, including drums!)

Reply 1 offered by: Angelique on 23-Jan-2000

Well, I found out how to make the ritardando work-- by tricking the computer!

I inserted the "before" tempo just before the retardando, although technically there is no need to do this, because the score is already playing at that speed. Of course, the "after" tempo is inserted right after the ritardando. Now it works!

I think that it always worked before because the tempos always happened to be added within the staff that contained the ritardando. This time, the ritardando appeared within a staff that did not have it's own tempo markings.


#1389: What I need...
What I need...

(1389)

Submitted by: George Libber on 23-Jan-2000

chord splitting
triplets
glissando
crescendos
handwritten fonts
chord detection
bars silent automatic (over 2 bars) on page setup
string bowings
automatically adjust staff with changed clef
dimmuendos
instrument ranges (range checking)
also, nonlinear bar lines on following staffs
quarter tones
arpeggio on 4 strings behind the bridge
molto vibrato
tremolo
double time
large time signature
lip
tutti
jazz shortcuts
crossing clefs with beams (eg. Debussy)
percussion note heads (also triangles)
chord slashes for guitar parts
lute tabs
fingering (piano and strings)
double stop detect (also parallel fifths)
portamento (very important)
jete
trills (why is there no trills?)
arco
pizz
very slow vibrato marking (very common)

I found some others in my work, I will tell you when I would like these. When these are done your program will be good.

Dr George Libber, PhD (mus)

Reply 1 offered by: Angelique on 23-Jan-2000

I would like some of those things, especially quarter-tones and percussion notes, too! But you have listed some things that are already part of Noteworthy Composer.

For example, triplets even have their own icon on one of the tool bars. It's a little "3" symbol between the "bar" and "grace note" icons.

You can insert crescendos and dimmuendos under "Insert/dynamic variance."

I'm sure other people will come up with other features I have overlooked.

Angelique

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Jan-2000

In the future it would be appreciated if you posted your comments either to the newsgroup or to the forum, not both.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve on 23-Jan-2000

Do you make the rules here Fred?

Reply 4 offered by: Andy on 24-Jan-2000

Obviously some of you who replied in the newsgroup did not understand that the guy is asking for notation not effects stuff to play out his midi.

chord splitting
Very useful when recording a harmonies to be split into strings or brass.

triplets
It does do triplets.

glissando
Yes this marking would be nice.

crescendos
as above.

handwritten fonts
Yes, probably not that hard to do.

chord detection
Yes, for jazz organ, guitar, etc.

bars silent automatic (over 2 bars) on page setup
I love the idea. I make do be making a big font with |-12-|.

string bowings
Yes. Noteworthy must be useful to the student or amatuer for writing violin, cello, viola, and bass.

automatically adjust staff with changed clef
Very good idea. It saves mistakes when you change a clef and don't transpose up properly using CTRL up+down.

dimmuendos
For sure!

instrument ranges (range checking)
Agreed

also, nonlinear bar lines on following staffs
Very important. This is a basic rule of notation.

quarter tones
Who cares?

arpeggio on 4 strings behind the bridge
Yes, there are others too. Useful for strings.

molto vibrato
tremolo
double time
All useful

large time signature
I've found tis to be common. See any study of orchestration.

lip
tutti
jazz shortcuts
Yep, I'm into that a little.

crossing clefs with beams (eg. Debussy)
Yes, as in from bass to treble and vice versa.

percussion note heads (also triangles)
Yeah!

chord slashes for guitar parts
Needed for the jazz or pop musician.

lute tabs
God idea.

fingering (piano and strings)
Yes. Especially for notating harder music and for students/teaching.

double stop detect (also parallel fifths)
portamento (very important)
jete
Might be nice.

trills (why is there no trills?)
Need trills. There are different kinds. Very useful.

arco
pizz
Yes.

very slow vibrato marking
May be useful to me.

What do you think? :)

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 24-Jan-2000

re: Piano Fingering - The 1.70 Beta makes fingering notation (using Insert Text) MUCH easier than before. The text can be centered above the notes, and you can now insert it between beamed notes.

Other effects you want (such as trills) can also be done using Insert Text, using the Boxmarks (or some other musical character) font.

Reply 6 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 24-Jan-2000

Mmm..., yes and then users like me jump in crying "Hey,I wanna hear this being played! I want to play the music I write using NWC you know!"

So, either this proggie becomes a strict WRITTING tool (and looses its users like me and others) or, it follows a process of incorporating features under both aspects simultaneously (developing slowly, but fulfillingly). Maybe those of us who know how to write programs could offer some scripts to NWC so that this proggie advances faster you know? (e.g. linux)

I 'd rather wait, than go.

As for Dr. Libber, sir, hold your horses will you? I don't think NWC has 10-50 programmers adept in midi AND scripting programs in the same time, working 12-hour shifts (like PhD students like myself) on this program alone.

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 24-Jan-2000

I want both too. The 1.70 Beta makes doing both a bit easier with its ability to hide notation. So you can write one thing to get published and another to playback without resorting to a hidden track.

I assume this program is aimed at both publish and playback, so I think its time a few more playback features were added.

Reply 8 offered by: Steve on 25-Jan-2000

Hey guys, To me there's no difference between notation and the midi sound. In other words when Noteworthy has added another marking, it does the same to the midi, for example, dynamics, mp... the marking is made and the midi output is changed as well! So what's the problem? If they add trills, they'll just play a midi command (I'm no good at understanding midi) like up and down note to get the trill effect thru midi. Don't make people confused about the issues and what Noteworthy can and can't do.

Cheers

Reply 9 offered by: Blair Dowden on 25-Jan-2000

Noteworthy does not officially have a trill. So if I want one I do it with grace notes, hide them (in the Beta), and put a trill symbol above the note. It looks right and sounds right. So can Noteworthy do trills? I say YES, it gives you the flexibility to do them, and many other things the author may never have thought of. Its not that confusing.

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 03-Feb-2000

About trills and some other "automatic" stuff:
As there are as many ways to play it as there are persons, I perfer that NWC doesn't make trills itself.
As to "automatically adjust staff with changed clef", which would be awful: Never had the need to *simply* change a clef? And nothing more? I _don't_ want NWC to transpose my scores automatically. The keyword here is "don't let your computer do something you don't want to".
Also, "instrument ranges (range checking)" may be helpful for people writing scores to be played by real players. But is directly limiting if you want to write "pure midi" music. I know that a trumpet can *not* play a C6, but midi allows this... Why would you want to limit it?

What is essential is that NWC plays/writes the same thing.
Chi va piano va sano!

ANd now I got to go further in the 1.70 beta...2!

Reply 11 offered by: Steve Bacher on 04-Feb-2000

The answer to all of marsu's points is: Options.

Why not an option when inserting a clef that asks you whether you wish the notes on the staff (from the position of the clef to the next clef or end of staff) to be adjusted or not?

Why not an option to check or not to check ranges for assigned instruments?

NWC could do trills with options the same way. Picture this:

Insert Trill

Specify Alternate Note (sharped, flatted, etc.)

Specify Granularity (16th notes, 32nd notes, etc.)

Start trill on: (root note, or alternate note)

Specify Duration:

(Apologies for not being able to think up good terminology for the above.)

Of course, there is the problem of how to associate the trill with a single note of a chord. Also double trills (Waldstein sonata comes to mind).

- seb

Reply 12 offered by: Mate on 05-Feb-2000

Easy!

Highlight note, select insert trill.
NWC adds a squiggle after the note you've selected.
When NWC plays back the note it plays a trill sound to the note (usually up half a semi-tone?)

I'd love to see this added!

Bye!

Reply 13 offered by: Steve on 05-Feb-2000

I assume this program is aimed at both publish and playback, so I think its time a few more notation features were added

Reply 14 offered by: Denny on 05-Feb-2000

marsu wot planet do you live on???

Reply 15 offered by: ah choo on 27-Aug-2000

Sterghios wrote:
Mmm..., yes and then users like me jump in crying "Hey,I wanna hear this being played! I want to play the music I write using NWC you know!"

I think you missed the blatantly obvious point here, adding notation necessitates adding the midi functionality. you didn't say that you thought the ideas were good, you just panicked because you thought the sky might fall down :-). when they add trill, of course the midi will sound like a trill - you're just worried for no reason!
when is the next version?! I can't wait!


#1390: What is "Override default note velocity"?
What is "Override default note velocity"?

(1390)

Submitted by: Clive on 24-Jan-2000

Hi,

I wonder if you could fill me in on what exactly is "Override default note velocity"?

Does it actually change the rapidity of a note's decay?

Thanks kindly, Clive

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 24-Jan-2000

You should check out the help file. To quote:

MIDI velocity controls how hard a note is struck (or blown for wind instruments).

From experience, I've noticed no difference in decay. I think what it does is change the characteristics of the attack envelope only.

Reply 2 offered by: Michael McIntyre on 06-Feb-2000

Note velocity is, as has been said, how hard the note is struck. (On my keyboard there are two wires. You break contact with the first wire when you touch the key, and the time it takes for the key to contact the second wire determines the velocity.)

Noteworthy controls dynamics with key velocity instead of volume changes. The option in question lets you change this behavior if you want the notes to be struck harder or softer than the default for a given dynamic.

Not all synths support note velocity, so you might have to use volume control to achieve the same result. Think of it this way. You have a piano that's miked and piped through an amp. How hard you strike the keys determines the strength of the signal going into amp, and the volume level on the amp determines the overall volume of the sound produced.

You can have softly-struck notes at a high volume that actually sound louder than quickly-struck notes at a low volume. The main difference is tone color.

I'm pretty sure that good synths do change the shape of the envelope in response to velocity changes. Higher velocity = sharper attack, but don't hold me to that.


#1392: Suggesting a midi keyboard...
Suggesting a midi keyboard...

(1392)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 24-Jan-2000

And now for the big one. I think it is high time that I bought a keyboard for myself. Don't need no fancy 10 million sample Doulby hyper duplex quasi-surround para-15 wall-mounting speaker keyboard, just a large fretboard, with a pitch bend, modulation bend, volume bend, multi-purpose bend (if they pack them all together on one machine) that I can jack into my PC to play via my soundcard (SBLive!, you now know why I do not need a proper keyboard).

Any suggestions please???

StV

PS: I think something around the $150 scale would be ok.

Reply 1 offered by: John Hall on 28-Jan-2000

I use an EVOLUTION MK-7 for note entry and find it very good. I have not experimented with anything else it can do as I only require it for entering music in a much easier way than via the computer keyboard. I do not do it in real time, but enter everything as a long line of crotchet notes and chords, and sort out rests, bars, different types of notes etc afterwards.
It cost me £39 (around $50 I would imagine)and had 37 'small' keys (not really suitable for "playing" music.

Reply 2 offered by: Shane Turner on 28-Jan-2000

I got a Yamaha PSR-530 xg and its the best thing i ever bought.. even tho it was a little pricey (probably around $500 us) but when you're getting a keyboard.. remember that you WILL be using it practically every day.. make sure its something that you're happy with.
My keyboard has touch and release sensitivity and xg capability which makes it very versatile. I'd suggest you test the keyboards out in the store.. see if you enjoy playing them. Buying a keyboard.. as a musician I would recommend it is a decision you do NOT rush.. be sure you're satisfied with it.

Reply 3 offered by: Bill Clarida on 28-Jan-2000

For reply 2:

I read your reply (PSR530) with interest. I am currently using a borrowed PSR510 and find it very helpful but unimpressed with the sample quality of GM 128 voices. I am considering PSR540 and was unsure if NWC supported the 480 XG voices; any problems using them? How do they compare to GM voices? Thanks

Reply 4 offered by: Shane Turner on 31-Jan-2000

Ya, sorry for taking so long to get back to ya.. heheh.

First, ya Noteworthy DOES support all the XG voices.. you have to enter the values in the MSB and LSB boxes on the "instrument" menu... and the XG values are recorded in a table that comes in a book with your keyboard.

XG has its strong points and weak points. As far as I know (since I've never used a PSR-510) it does have better sample quality. There's also a nice "acoustic setting" which you can turn on that gives the instruments a GREAT rich sound. It has fairly decent string samples (not nearly as good as my SB live samples i bought on CD) but still awesome for use as backup strings. Also touch (& release) sensitivity.

Not all the samples are great of course.. you kinda have to scan thru them.. but that's the same with any synth.. you're just not gonna find perfection on ONE synth/keyboard.

Of course.. its not the samples that matter so much as it is the way you make use of them... cool thing about XG is the range of effects available to the composer... its practically as versatile as an "analog synth", except with samples. That's a bit down the line for noteworthy of course.. but if you're like me you'll be using the keyboard for a variety of stuff, not just noteworthy.. and there's plenty of XG midis out there.

Check out the demos on the keyboard too.. there should be like 10 songs.. composed by independent people and put on the keyboard.. not all of them are "great" but they really show off some of the nice features of the keyboard. If u get the chance.. play around with it a bit before making the purchase.

Its really a toss up.. features/quality vs. $$ For me.. it worked out just right.. I use it along with my SB live constantly.. its great.

Reply 5 offered by: Michael McIntyre on 03-Feb-2000

All this stuff about Yamaha XG aside, what you need is a controller keyboard. If it has decent voices, that's icing on the cake, but you don't NEED anything more.

I bought this one from someone on the internet many years ago, long before the advent of the world-wide web, and it has served me well.

It's a Fatar 72-key controller keyboard with pitch and modulation wheels. Velocity sensitive keys, but they're not weighted, and there's no aftertouch. It's made predominantly of steel, and is obviously designed to take a beating on a regular basis.

They're called controller keyboards, and all they do is transmit MIDI data to external synths, such as your SBlive. You ought to be able to pick one up pretty cheap, in any number of different configurations.

I think I paid somewhere around $100 for this one in like-new condition. Maybe check Ebay.

Reply 6 offered by: Sterghios on 26-Feb-2000

Thanx mike, that was really what I was looking for. In any case my SBLive provides all the effects and the sample capacity I need to play. And my main "sound source" if I may call it as such, is my sound card and NWC.

Thx mate


#1394: Help needed with repeats
Help needed with repeats

(1394)

Submitted by: Peter Vasey on 25-Jan-2000

Being rather out of practice, I've ground to a halt with a tricky repeat sequence. 'Twould be easy if Da Capo didn't stop earlier special endings from repeating. The piece is divided into 6 sections - call them A, B, C, D, E and F. They need to play in the following sequence:

A B C B D E A B C B D F

Any ideas pleeease!

Peter

Reply 1 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 25-Jan-2000

The easiest way I see, would be to copy and paste section B (if you don't mind it being in the score twice) and insert it between C and D. Then all you would have to do is make section E the 1st special ending (followed by a Master Repeat Close), and section F the 2nd special ending.

KenJ

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Vasey on 26-Jan-2000

Thanks, Ken. I've already considered that workaround - OK for playback, but since the repeated section B is quite long, not so convenient for printout of 30 or so copies for the choir involved. Anybody else out there??

Peter.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 26-Jan-2000

If you just need a score to sing from, rather than to play back, how about using a DC al Coda with added text saying "play all repeats on DC".

It would look like this (if you follow my attempt at graphical illustration - @ = coda sign):

| |1 |2 |@ |DC al Coda (play all repeats on DC)
A |:B | C:|D |E ||

Coda
|F||

Ken's solution can go in the hidden staves.

Or another (non-playback) idea, using V1.70's facility to specify where staff breaks occur:

Verse 1 A [staff break]
Verse 2 C [staff break]
Verse 3 DE [staff break]
Verse 4 A [staff break]
Verse 5 C [staff break]
Verse 6 DF [staff break]
Chorus B

HTH
Stephen

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Randall on 26-Jan-2000

I just looked at that reply as it appears in the forum. So much for fixed width fonts! The spaces got stripped out. Here is another (less elegant but hopefully better reproduced)attempt at my first offering:

[A] Master repeat Open [B] 1st ending [C] master repeat close, 2nd ending [D] coda sign [E] DC al Coda "play all repeats on DC" Coda [F]

Stephen

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Vasey on 27-Jan-2000

Thanks, Stephen, it looks as though I'm going to have to 'fudge' this one, and use two copies of the piece, one for printing and one for playback. It's just as well that the human brain is capable of continuous reprogramming!! Peter.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 28-Jan-2000

Could you do something with hidden local repeats?


#1395: Making a bunch of staffs into one
Making a bunch of staffs into one

(1395)

Submitted by: James Broffard on 25-Jan-2000

Hi,

I downloaded Bach's goldberg variations, and once opened the midi up and looked at the score, I found that it was impossible for me to try and convert the six staffs into two. The treble clef is dispersed among many channels, as well as the bass cleff. How do I copy these clefs onto one so I can simply print it out with treble and bass. I tried deselecting the "map each channel to a new stave" option, as well as increasing the chord option to seperate staves to the max on the import options. Any ideas?

Thanks,

-James

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jan-2000

Put each staff you want on one track on the same midi channel, and each staff you want on the other track on another midi channel. Export as Type 0 midi. Re-import, select "map each channel to a new staff" then edit the import ranges so that only two staves are imported, each with the full range of C0 - G10. That should do it for you.

Reply 2 offered by: James on 26-Jan-2000

Hey Thanks! That worked out well.


#1397: tie  &  slur
tie  &  slur

(1397)

Submitted by: Teresa on 26-Jan-2000

I have a problem with ties and slurs, the sound usually doesnt’t stop.

Somebody told me that I must check flats, sharps and the other symbol (natural) that I don’t know the name in english into the bar lines.

I did that but the problem sometimes continuous. I misunderstood or I didn’t check well?

I am sorry for my english.

teresa

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Jan-2000

Slurs have no effect on playback. Before you tie two notes, make sure they both have the same accidentals (sharp, flat or natural). You can't fix the notes after they are tied, so untie them, fix the accidentals, then re-tie them.

Don't be sorry for your English. It is much better than I can speak in any other language.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 26-Jan-2000

Actually, you _can_ fix the accidentals while the notes are tied. Simply select the "tied-to" note, and observe the status of the accidentals radio buttons. You can click the appropriate button (or use keyboard 7, 8, 9) to correct any errors.

Reply 3 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 27-Jan-2000

"Slurs have no effect on playback."

Fortunately this is not exact. All notes affected by a slur are played legato, while note not slurred are played tenuto or marcato or... well, not legato.

Thanks to this it is much easier to attain a good phrasing in NWC than in other programs.

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 27-Jan-2000

I was not aware of the effect of slurs. I tend to make the whole song legato, because I think it sounds better, so the effect of slurs is lost.


#1398: How do you make quintuplets?
How do you make quintuplets?

(1398)

Submitted by: Mark on 26-Jan-2000

How do you make quintuplets? Please help!

Reply 1 offered by: Chen Siang on 26-Jan-2000

There are you ways perhaps:

1) Beg Noteworthy to develope "n"-tuplets!

2) Make a semiquaver triplet followed by a 2 semi's:

In order to lengthen the triplet semiquavers into quintuplet semiquavers, you need to increase the note duration in real time by a fraction of 6/5's.
Thus if your tempo is 100 notes/min, insert the new slower tempo for the triplets at (100 x 5/6) notes/min.

In order to shorten the 2 semiquavers into quintuplet semiquavers, you need to decrease the note duration in real time by a fraction of 4/5's.
Thus if your tempo is 100 notes/min, insert the new faster tempo for the 2 semi's at (100 x 5/4) notes/min.

A bit clumsy but works OK... HTH

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Jan-2000

This idea can be simplified somewhat. Let's say you want to play five 1/8 notes in the time normally taken by 4. Increase the tempo by a factor of 5/4, then reset it again afterwards. (Example: if you're at mm=100, change to mm=120 with a hidden tempo indication, then reset to 100 after the quintuplet group.)

This is made even more elegant in the new version 1.70; we can now make it look right as well as sound correct. Adding the ---5--- indication is easy; simply insert it as text. The new alignment options make this a lot easier than it has been in the past. But there's a couple problems: first, your time signature will be messed up for the bar containing the "extra" notes. Solution: insert a new time signature (to continue the same example, if you're in 4/4 you'll have an extra 1/8 note. So for that bar, change the time sig. to 9/8, and make it invisible. Change back to 4/4 in the next bar. Second problem: you might have to correct your other staves for the "extra" note. Solution: insert an extra (hidden) rest. If you need the previous note to continue sounding through the rest, use a hidden pedal mark. The ability to hide virtually anything is a powerful new facility that has only begun to be explored.

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Bacher on 28-Jan-2000

These are good suggestions, but I can't see how I can use them with a piano score that has 5 against 2, or 5 against 4.

Sadly, I had a piece composed with quintuplets that I had to change to duplets + triplets when I scored it in NWC.

- seb

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Jan-2000

In the sample file (referenced above) I have an example of 5 against 2, in Bar 3.


#1399: J B L Pro Audio & Noteworthy
J B L Pro Audio & Noteworthy

(1399)

Submitted by: John Hall on 28-Jan-2000

I am considering buying a Compaq Presario 1247 with the above audio system.
Will I be able to play noteworthy files through that system, and if so what are they liable to sound like from this notebook.
I would need an answer to this very soon please.

Reply 1 offered by: Bruno Hecquard on 28-Jan-2000

Could you please give more informations about the system you have the project to buy?
Is the JBL Pro Audio some kind of loudspeaker system or does it include some synthesizer?
If it is only a sound system, you have to look at the sound card or sound chip included in your Compaq portable.
If it's described as a wavetable sound card, then the sound produced should be as good as the one you could obtain on a workstation PC fitted with say a 128 PCI sound blaster.
If it's a minimum sound chip (16 bits Sound blaster), you will hear your music but not the instruments sounds you may expect.

Reply 2 offered by: John Hall on 28-Jan-2000

Bruno
The problem is that I don't know anything about JBL Pro Audio. All I know is that it is the system in the Compaq, and the salesperson told me it was compatible with Soundblaster 64 (which I have in my desktop). I was not too sure he knew what he was talking about and hence the question.
If I were to present the shop with a midi music file and ask them to play it for me, do you think that would solve my problem?
Thanks however for your previous reply.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-Jan-2000

I use a Compaq laptop (1265) with a JBL ProAudio. It "plays" Noteworthy and midi materials. Must say, the wavetables (or whatever it uses, perhaps FM synthesis)stink, so the sound is not very good. Depending upon which instruments you prefer, you may have better results.

I was able to get "somewhat" more acceptable sounds by installing DirectX7 and using the Microsoft Soundfonts that come as part of that. You may want to visit the Newsgroup for a discussion in that area and how to access the soundfonts through dmidi or by installing the DmusicProducer. (P.S. The sound is "better" but still not real good).

P.S. If this a laptop, and you want to be able to input midi from a keyboard or guitar, it may be a bit of a challenge to find the correct peripherals. I am certain whether your unit has USB ports. It is my understanding, however, that there some USB peripherals for midi input.

Hope that helps.


#1400: following the notes while playing
following the notes while playing

(1400)

Submitted by: Chris on 28-Jan-2000

i have written many songs on noteworthy but when i want to play them back it stays on the first bar. it wont follow along with whats playing. it does it on the samples that were already on the program but not with any of my origionals. is there a way to make it follow along?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 28-Jan-2000

Be sure that you have a staff selected that indeed goes "all the way through." If you select a "short" staff before playing, it will only to the end of that staff.

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 29-Jan-2000

thank you for the reply fred. could you be a little more specific about what you mean? i dont mean the sound stops, it will play the whole song. you know how when it plays the notes turn red as they are played? well when it gets to the end of the screen it will stop. i want it to move the score along so i can see what is playing. do you understand? im not really sure how to word it correctly.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jan-2000

Without taking a look at your actual work, it is very hard to know what you are doing wrong. One possible explanation: if you do not add any bar lines to your work, play highlights will not be able to follow along past the end of the screen.

Reply 4 offered by: chris on 31-Jan-2000

that did it!

thank you!


#1401: How do I add reverb or chorus to my MIDI file?
How do I add reverb or chorus to my MIDI file?

(1401)

Submitted by: Brian Havey on 28-Jan-2000

How does one add a lot of reverb to his MIDI file? It seems Noteworthy Composer can't do this... I have a AWE32 sound card; is there a way I can adjust the reverb manually through the sound card? - or - Do I need to purchase special software to do this? If so what kind do you recommend?

Thank You!

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 29-Jan-2000

Probably only be able to give a generic response. However, here it is.

Under the Playback Instrument screen are boxes to allow one to change the controllers (0) and (32). If your soundcard supports chorus and reverb (which I think the AWE 32 probably would), you may be able to check the card and wavetable documentation to determine what controllers to assign to what program. Somewhere in the forum I discussed the process of selecting additional sounds available through the Yamaha XG wavetables. Fairly complex.

Another solution is to find a shareware or other program (I suspect the AWE 32 disk should have something of that nature) that has midi controls for chorus, reverb and other effects. Makes life a lot easier. Then, if you prefer to create in Noteworthy, do so, and export as a midi to those programs. The midi controls on those programs can control the playback as to chorus, reverb, modulation.

By the by: I love my Ensoniq PCI and its wavetables. Its mixer has chorus, reverb and other effects. A 1370 or 1371 can be picked up off ebay for typically $ 10-15.

Also, don't overlook the Yamaha XG50, 60 and 100 soft synth series. They have pretty good wavetables and support several effects. Fred Nachbauer swears by them. Some of the additional programs (i.e. instruments) would have built in reverb, etc. and therefore would avoid some of the complexities trying to introduce those components by use of the controllers noted earlier.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 29-Jan-2000

Just remembered: It was tough getting Noteworthy to recognize the additional instrument sounds without playing with the controllers, so ignore my final comments.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Jan-2000

Controller 91 (generally controls reverb depth) will be supported in NWC version 1.70, via the Multi-point Controller item. This will first appear in beta 2.

Reply 4 offered by: Shane Turner on 31-Jan-2000

Controller 91???!!
GOD BLESS YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks!

Reply 5 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 01-Feb-2000

Really good news! Thanks for supporting Controller 91.

Is it the only addition to the list of supported Controllers?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Feb-2000

No. You get some others. The list is controllers 1,4-6,8,11-13,91-95. The new beta will be released later today.

Reply 7 offered by: Brian Havey on 01-Feb-2000

YEESSS!!! This makes Noteworthy perfect for me!!

Reply 8 offered by: Steve Pearson on 01-Feb-2000

Uh, oh. Sounds like I need to learn some technical stuff and figure out what each of those controllers do and whether to insert them on the Controller 0 or 32 in Noteworthy depending upon which card or softsynth driver I am using. Anyone know of some good basic references or guides? (Suspect it may be card dependent, but . . .)

Alternatively, are the noted controllers already incorporated in the new categories under the multi-point controller? (Like depth, chorus, etc.). If someone happens to know, could save me some time trying to puzzle the matter out.

Now, if there was just an easy way of making the additional instruments available and visible (such as the extended sets under Yamaha XG) . . . .

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 01-Feb-2000

I just installed the beta. Don't worry about learning controller numbers.

The list is Tempo, Volume, Stereo Pan, Breath Control, Pitch Bend, Modulation Wheel, Foot Controller, Portamento Time, Data Entry MSB, Balance, Expression, Effect Controller 1, Effect Controller 2, Effects (Reverb) Depth, Tremolo Depth, Chorus Depth, Celeste Detune Depth, and Phaser Depth.

So far the help mentions only the first 5. I hope they get time to document the rest before 1.70 goes final. Otherwise I'll be needing either a good MIDI reference or a lot of time to experiment.

(Phaser Depth?)

Reply 10 offered by: Shane Turner on 01-Feb-2000

Steve, in regards to the extended XG sets, you can use all the XG voices. In the manual that comes with the XG synth (at least with mine) is a list of all the instruments.. along with their MSB and LSB values. If you open up the instrument menu in noteworthy you will notice that underneath where you select the instrument.. is an msb box and an lsb box. Just enter the corresponding values into those boxes and whammo, there you go.. you're using that instrument!

Reply 11 offered by: Daddy-O on 01-Feb-2000

well tie me up and skin me what do we have here?

Reply 12 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-2000

> (Phaser Depth?)

Yup. Not how deep you aim your sci-fi stun gun. Phasing is similar to chorus and flanging, but uses a faster and usually more extreme modulation. The effect is that whooshy-trippy 60's acid-rock sound.

Reply 13 offered by: Steve Pearson on 02-Feb-2000

Grant and Shane: thanks for the clarification and help.

Quick aside: I had upgraded my Yamaha S-YXG50 softsynth a while back. Could no longer find the instrument controller info which used to be in the help file. Apparently was included with the earlier version that came with the actual card, but not with the subsequent upgrade.

In any event, had installed the older card and software and was able to retrieve the instrument tables. Have the older help files if someone might need them. The older help files also explain the various controllers are by number.

P.P.S. Took me a while to figure out before, so I'll relay this on for what it's worth (and hope I'm right . . .): Contoller 0 in Noteworthy is the MSB and Controller 32 is the LSB mentioned by Shane. (Did I get that right).

Reply 14 offered by: Bryan on 23-Dec-2001

I have too much reverb and chorus in my software. I know it's not the sound card because I recently mistakingly did something to my software that caused it to do this. Play help me because this is hindering my writing process.


#1402: guitar chord symbols
guitar chord symbols

(1402)

Submitted by: George O'Sullivan on 29-Jan-2000

Does anyone know of a font that has the pictorial representation for guitar chords as I use guitar chords quite a lot.typing in the text is unsatisfactory

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 04-Feb-2000

I once tried to copy the font package/program for guitar chords from Midisoft without success. I am not personally aware of anything currently available for Noteworthy.

If your handy, maybe check with the folks who do the boxmarks. They may be able to provide the mechanics for creation (or import) of the symbols if you can find or create them. See msg #1372.

Perhaps also post the matter as a Wishlist item. Noteworthy is good about incorporating suggestions if there is enough interest.

Reply 2 offered by: Warren on 27-Jan-2002

I do have a font for chord symbols, im not sure which letters correspond to which chords but they are all there i think. I stumbled on this and if for some reason anyone still wants this i have it. Later

<><
Warren

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 27-Jan-2002

Search the Internet for fonts called "Frets" A, B, and C.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 28-Jan-2002

You can find them at http://www.fontfreak.com/ding-f.htm , called frets; the .zip file contains fretsa, fretsb, fretsc, and a text file.

Hope you know the chords, since there is no char-by-char description.
But it seems to me that they are in some logical (chromatic by type) order.

HTH.
My "allchar.xls" file was first made to notate the chord name of these chars...


#1403: Using "record" feature to key-in parts
Using "record" feature to key-in parts

(1403)

Submitted by: Bill on 29-Jan-2000

As relatively new user, I will appreciate help using the "record" feature to key-in single line parts (i.e. 2nd trombone, etc) from midi keyboard. After entering bass line, I want to "record" single parts from midi keyboard; 3rd trombone entered OK in bass clef but 2nd trombone part was "recorded" in treble clef. Questions - how do I force part to be entered in appropriate clef? or how do I transpose treble clef to bass clef? I have chosen destination to be to "record group" rather than "new window" or "buffer" Any/all suggestions appreciated. Bill

Reply 1 offered by: Michael McIntyre on 30-Jan-2000

It makes the clef determination for you, based on the range of notes you've played. I just piddled around with this, and if your part spans a wide range it will automatically generate multiple staffs in different clefs.

If it picks the wrong clef (which it seems to always do for trombone range parts) your only option is to change the clef manually. Page 21 of the manual.

FWIW Noteworthy also shares this problem when importing trombone-range parts from MIDI files.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Jan-2000

Unfortunately there's no way any program can know from a midi file what clef to use, since clefs are not specified in midi (though time signatures are, and key signatures are optional; some programs, e.g. Cubasis, don't even export these).

Reply 3 offered by: Hugh Greer on 06-Feb-2000

The only way I found to ensure the use of the bass clef was to play such music an octave lower on the midi keyboard, then tranpsoe up an octave in Notewaorthy - quite a quick operation.


#1404: Changing font size
Changing font size

(1404)

Submitted by: LordGallard on 30-Jan-2000

Is there any way to change the font size so that I can actually read it when I print it out?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 30-Jan-2000

From the File menu select Page Setup... The Fonts tab lets you control the font sizes for everything.


#1407: Voice in staff one is not right
Voice in staff one is not right

(1407)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 01-Feb-2000

I enter most of my music in the Vocal Accomp. mode. I usually assign the vocal staff a voice like Violin or Trombone or something like that so it stands out from the other two staffs, which are usually one of the pianos in MIDI.

I've been using the Yahama SXG Driver, and this arrangement works fine. Last night I noticed I had the Yahama OPL2/OPL3 Synthesizer (is must have come with my new computer). I changed to it and the treble and bass staffs sound terrific, even better than with the XSG Driver, which I did not think would be possible. BUT now, the Vocal line does not sound above the bass and treble clefs.

Does anyone know why this is happening? I enjoy hearing the Vocal staff voice rising above the accompainment, but I also like the better quality of the OPL2/OPL3.

I don't understand why the OPL2/OPL3 would subordinate the Vocal staff.

All help appreciated,
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-2000

By "rise above" I presume you mean volume of sound rather than pitch? If the former, it's true that different synthesizers have different instrument balances; however, being both Yamaha products I would think this to be insignificant (I have a DB60XG, my wife has a SoftSynth, we've never noticed any untoward incompatibilities). That being said, you can change the relative volumes of your instruments either by 1) using dynamics (pp, mp, f, etc.) which changes note velocity, or 2) changing channel volume settings (press F2 and click the Midi tab).

If by "rise above" you mean pitch, try changing to a different instrument patch that contains more harmonics (overtones), like perhaps oboe or one of the vox patches (53, 54 and 86 are some you can experiment with).

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 01-Feb-2000

Thanks Fred:
I'll bet the problem has to do with instrument balance. It used to be that a clarinet could be heard above the pianos, but no more. Perhaps I need to change to a voice with a different pitch. I'm going to try changing volume and pitch.
The vox patches mean nothing to me. I asked about a year ago about accessing voices above 128 and got some excellent answers; unfortunately I was never able to understand them well enough to make anything happen.
Thanks again for the fast response, you're one of the constants in this group. BTW, I see you changed your e-mail since I last looked.
Regards,
Gordon


#1409: Triplet chord
Triplet chord

(1409)

Submitted by: Drew Duvall on 02-Feb-2000

How do you do triplet chords?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 02-Feb-2000

Make your chords as usual (all the same time duration, e.g. 1/8ths) by using CNTL Enter to add members or CNTL BS to remove them. Select the three chords to be tripletised and click the triplets button on the toolbar.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 04-Feb-2000

But once you have turned the group of notes into a triplet you can't edit the chord any more. You have to remove the triplet (or untripletize), edit the chord an then re-tripletize.


#1410: Spacing of notes
Spacing of notes

(1410)

Submitted by: D. V. Nguyen on 03-Feb-2000

I am composing a song, but I can not use note worthy template because I am having trouble controlling the space between notes In the first staff all the notes seem to space evenly, as I progress to the second staff, the note space farther apart. I follow the FAQ section and try the recommended action and it was to take off the check mark on duration on the option tab butit does not work. Any other suggestion??

thanks,

DVN

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Feb-2000

Perhaps you are inserting dynamics, text, and similar objects? If you have the "Preserve Width" box checked, each of these objects will take up space. If this is the case, you can select them, then press CNTL E to edit; click the checkbox off.

Some other things, like MPC indications, will always take up space in the edit window, but will disappear when printing. You can use Print Preview to see how things will actually appear when printed (or when viewed using NoteWorthy Player).

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 07-Feb-2000

If I understand your "as I progress to the second staff" correctly, you may have be expecting NWC to provide WYSIWYG.

When editing, you only see one system (perhaps with multiple staves) on the screen at one time. You can think of this one system extending as far past the right hand end of your screen as necessary. So the second staff down the screen is actually a second part that would play simultaneously with the first staff rather than being a continuation of the first staff. The notes in the second staff will align with those in the first staff that would need to sound at the same time and therefore the spacing will depend on what notes you have already entered in the first staff.

Use of the single system when editing makes life a lot easier than WYSIWYG would as you only need to move left or right to get to the measure you want and presumably saves on the processing time when inserting new notes. The line and page breaks in the score only get dealt with when printing and can be checked using print preview.

HTH

Stephen

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 27-Sep-2000

I think I may have a problem similar to what D. V. Nguyen describes, and I don't think the replies really deal with it. The first file I did had twelve staves. At the beginning of each staff, the spacing of notes was reasonable, but as one progressed to the later measures, the spaces got progressively longer. This happened in all the staves. There were no dynamic signs or other stuff that might have taken up space. The second file just had generally too damn much space after any white note head. I tried to find out what to do about this, and found a lot about how to increase space after a note and nada, zip, zilch, and bugger-all on how to decrease it. It's not a WYSIWYG problem, either; there is too much space after the notes on the print-out must as there is on the monitor.

Reply 4 offered by: David Ripley on 28-Sep-2000

I posted this response to another thread, but it may be relevant here also... I've had some situations where exceptionally long measures (with correspondingly widely spaced notes) are created in a piece when NW decides that only a couple measures can fit on a line. (A piece can start out with four/five measures per line, and then all of a sudden I get two measures on a line due to the specific note content of the measures.) Anyway, I've had good luck with fooling around with the margins. Sometimes setting the left and right margins just slightly larger and smaller can make a big difference in the way the whole piece is layed out. I've gotten around alot of strange measure layout problems this way.

Reply 5 offered by: Art thompson on 28-Sep-2000

Also, try going to page layout, and reducing the staff font size down from the default of 26.


#1412: Drum Fills
Drum Fills

(1412)

Submitted by: Peter Hall on 05-Feb-2000

Does anyone know where I could obtain some drum fills to put into .nwc songs. I have used the rhythm templates in NWC already but want to add some fills.
Please help!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Michael McIntyre on 07-Feb-2000

There's not much good news for you here, I'm afraid. There are plenty of drum track files to be had on the net, even including drum fills, but Noteworthy does a particularly lousy job of importing drum patterns, in my experience.

Here's a good example.

http://www.galent.com/camelot/music/toto/Rosanna.mid

Listen to it with Media Player or Cakewalk or something. Nice drums, don't you think? Now import it. It's tragic.

What I'm saying is you really need to find patterns that someone has done in Noteworthy format (I've only found a few), or spend hours tweaking botched imports, or just do the fills yourself from scratch.

Noteworthy is a wonderful, versatile program, but it does not handle percussion gracefully at all.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 07-Feb-2000

I have a file of drum patterns in NWC format.
If you would like a copy Email me.

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP


#1413: Fantasie Impromtu
Fantasie Impromtu

(1413)

Submitted by: John Fear on 06-Feb-2000

Does anyone have a NWC file of Fantasie Impromtu??? please include the link if you do....thank you

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Feb-2000

The first place to check for (especially classical) pieces is the Scriptorium, which happens to have the piece you're looking for.

http://www.vadu.com/nwc


#1414: Chord diagrams
Chord diagrams

(1414)

Submitted by: Larry Allen on 06-Feb-2000

How do I place Chord diagrams above the trebel cleff? There must be a way. Anyone know?

Thanks Larry

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 06-Feb-2000

NWC doesn't support chord charts directly.
However, if you are sure of what key your gonna be in, you can use a chord font like Seville and enter the chords as place text. This seems to work fine once you know what chord corresponds to which character. Transposition is a pain, tho'.

A

Reply 2 offered by: Marco Losavio on 14-Feb-2000

Where can I get Seville font? And Jazz font?
Thanks for the attention.
Marco Losavio

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Feb-2000

Try using a search engine to find the specific fonts you're looking for. There are several shareware fonts (but not the ones you mention) on the Scriptorium, at:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Click on "Other Helpful Files"

Good luck!

Reply 4 offered by: alex on 23-Oct-2000

How can i learn the notes on the base and trebel cleff so i can rember them?

Reply 5 offered by: Art thompson on 24-Oct-2000

Treble spaces - F A C E
Treble lines Every Good Boy Does Fine

Bass spaces - A C E G (Not a great acronym)
Bass lines - Good Boys Do Fine Acts ( or make up your own!)

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen Randall on 29-Oct-2000

Bass spaces:

All Cows Eat Grass (or so my music teacher told me!)

Reply 7 offered by: Art Thompson on 29-Oct-2000

Very nice. The ones out my back window confirm what your music teacher told you. Back to the original topic - Chord diagrams. I suppose one of you ambitious types could make a font of chord diagrams. Also, I saw a program for sale in Circuit City that did support them; don't remember the name(Music Writer??), or how it compared to NWC in other ways.If that's really important to you, then I guess the (cow eating)grass may be greener elsewhere. I'll stick with NWC, thank you.

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Oct-2000

Don't know about yours, but when it comes to eating grass, the cows around here are outstanding in their field.

Back OT, there is presently a guitar chords font by Steve Allen in beta. The latest version that's been posted AFAIK is still available on the newsgroup, in his post of 6 June 2000.

Reply 9 offered by: bug on 30-Oct-2000

You know how with Noteworthy you can choose the key
signature in that window? I like that. It's cool.
The same could be done for guitar chords which are
changed in transposition same as the key signature.
shouldn't be too hard? :) *hint* *hint*
have a nice day. [bug]

Reply 10 offered by: Art thompson on 30-Oct-2000

Which window? the one I'm looking at cows through?

Reply 11 offered by: Joe Music on 30-Oct-2000

I have seen TrueType fonts with guitar frets posted on download sites, presumably free, but one can't be sure if they were pirated. I'd refer you but since I don't play guitar, I didn't keep the fret fonts. Try a keyword search.

However, I haven't come across a font with note-head (piano) chords. Apparently all (or nearly all) music publishing programs, including NWC, construct them dynamically from user input.

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 31-Oct-2000

I have a font called "Seville" - dont know where it came from possibly a legacy from long-since uninstalled program.
It seems to have fret diagrams of major/minor chords based on the character typed in.
Is this what your looking for?

Reply 13 offered by: Grant on 31-Oct-2000

For what it's worth, my recollection is that Seville was distributed with a notation program (Finale?) and is copyrighted.

Reply 14 offered by: Art thompson on 31-Oct-2000

Jazzfont.com has some cool looking fonts, including Jazzcord and Swingcord. not free, though.

Reply 15 offered by: Joe Music on 31-Oct-2000

Regarding fret fonts for guitar:

There are fonts called "frets", "frets A", "frets B", and "frets C". I am not sure whether these are free, shareware, or whatever. Decide for yourself. A font MAY be free even if it has a copyright notice, depending on what the copyright holder has to say about that. Here are a couple of URLs that I found with a search engine:

http://www.fontfreak.com/ding-f.htm

http://www.dingbatpages.com/arts/music.html


#1416: Merging NWC files w/ a voice file?
Merging NWC files w/ a voice file?

(1416)

Submitted by: Missy on 07-Feb-2000

I'm not really sure what I'm trying to say here, but I was wanting to make a CD as a Valentine's Day present for my boyfriend. I don't have a CD burner or anything. I was hoping maybe there was a way to use the nwc file and convert it another program maybe where I can add in my voice. I've just recently thought about this. I was just going to set up a tape recorder next to the computer and play back the music and sing with it that way, but the quality would be horrible. Is there a way to do what I'm wanting to do or am I just wishing? Any help would be extremly appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Feb-2000

Any good wav editor would work for you. My editor of choice is CoolEdit from Syntrillium Software (both the 1.53 Win3.x version and CoolEdit96). The process involves:

1: Recording your nwc file as a wav file,

2: Recording your voice via the mic input on your soundcard as another wav file,

3: Mixing the two wav files.

The process could be combined into a single step, where you record your voice along with the playback from nwc, but might be harder to get the mix right. The separate approach lets you play with relative levels "after the fact."

There are also (generally quite expensive) "virtual studio" programs from Steinberg (Cubase) and 12-tone Systems (Cakewalk) which allow even more flexibility. The learning curve can be quite steep on these, however.

Reply 2 offered by: Missy on 07-Feb-2000

Thank you so much Fred! I'll probably go with the first method for this week, since the second one is too expensive and the whole idea was for us to NOT spend money on each other this year. After I get the files made, is it possible to transfer it to a CD or am I still going to have to use a tape player to get it so he can use it? Do I just save the files to the disk? I need it so that most any car or truck CD player will be able to recognize it. Sorry for all the questions, but I'm kinda new to this whole area of computers.

Reply 3 offered by: Aurura on 14-Feb-2000

Dear Fred,

I also aprreciated your reply to Missy... But, being a novice, I don't even know how to record my files as MIDI. I have only been using Nc to write, playback and save scores.

How do you record files as MIDI, how do you convert them into .wav files, and how do you get that to come up on CoolEdit?

I've recently downloaded the trial verstion of CoolEdit 2000, and don't know where to begin on either of these programs.

Frustrated,
Aurura

Reply 4 offered by: Aurura on 14-Feb-2000

Dear Fred (again),

Please "scratch" that last message I sent off. I actually found out for myself how to make the recording and .wav file (quite unexpectedy). The only delima I have now is how to compress the file to its smallest size while storing as much of the quality as possible. I know that, since I'm trying to merge voice and .nwc file in CoolEdit, my answer is problably in CoolEdit. But maybe it might also have something to do with how I save the file in Nc?

So far, I've tried saving it as a compressed nwc file. Should I try some alternative that you may know of?

Thanks for Your Time,
Aurura

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Feb-2000

Now that you have a (very big) wav file, you've got an actual sound representation of your performance - be it from midi (or NWC), voice, whatever. There are several ways of reducing the size (and compromising quality to varying degrees). The most popular right now is MPEG Level 3, aka "mp3". I believe that CE2000 has an mp3 codec built-in, you should be able to "Save As..." and select MP3. If not, there are various MP3 encoders available for free or cheap on the net.

If you intend to publish on mp3.com or other mpeg repository, you should record your original wav at 44.1 kHz, stereo, 16-bit. When you encode the mp3 it should be stereo, 128 kbps. To play MP3's, you can use WinAmp, Media Player II, or any of a host of other similar players. Have fun!


#1418: Newer NWC Songs
Newer NWC Songs

(1418)

Submitted by: John Fear on 08-Feb-2000

I am looking for a place where i may find some newer NWC songs along the lines of Mandy Moore, Backstreet Boys, things that NORMAL(little joke) teenagers would be interested in.....thanks a ton

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Starfield on 09-Feb-2000

What is a "normal" teenager???

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 09-Feb-2000

I think it's a mythical beast, like the tooth fairy and the honest lawyer.


#1419: A wish: Header and Footnotes
A wish: Header and Footnotes

(1419)

Submitted by: Allan Snider on 09-Feb-2000

Some control over the header and footnote area of the page would be greatly desired for subsequent pages of a print. What I really need is the part name (along with the page number) on subsequent pages. Using staff labelling on the top system gives an undesired (and ugly) indentation on subsequent pages. What would be really great is to allow some kind of expression to be entered for the page number, something like "Flute - ${page}" or some such...

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Feb-2000

Great idea Allan - add it to the wish list.
The parts would look much better with the instrument name at top left on the page (I agree the staff name indent is not attractive).
An option to add the instrument name to the page number as a footer would certainly help when taping the pages together.

Reply 2 offered by: BOOM BOY!!! on 13-Feb-2000

easy mate, go to:
Preview
and then:
Copy
to copy to clipboard. Then:
...Paste into Word!

You have FULL control of your cool, smooth and sexy Noteworthy Composer score output!

Reply 3 offered by: Allan Snider on 14-Feb-2000

Thanks for the tip. I tried it, but still found it tedious as you have to copy and paste one page at a time and play with the margins and size scalings for each. But thanks again, I didn't even think to try that. For now, I think I'll just stick to manually adding text ('x') at observed page breaks (which unfortunately in themselves cause pages to break at different bars, but eventually you get it right).

Reply 4 offered by: coon on 26-Feb-2000

I would like more features like this...


#1421: NWC-friendly Web Servers
NWC-friendly Web Servers

(1421)

Submitted by: Allen Cole on 09-Feb-2000

I'd like to know what web servers currently support the .nwc file type. I have had no response from Tripod in trying to get them to carry it--and zipping is a bad option for me because my .nwc files are short examples for an educational site.

So far, it looks like Earthlink, Sympatico and NetIdea support the files, but they are not free servers like Geocities, Tripod or Xoom.

Anybody know of a friendly spot?

Thanks,

Allen

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Feb-2000

Acme City at http://www.acmecity.com lets you upload .NWC files, but only Internet Explorer can read them. This is a good question - I would like to know if there is a better spot.

Reply 2 offered by: Allen Cole on 10-Feb-2000

I just received news that http://www.tripod.com now supports the files. MIME type is application/nwc.

I have tested this in Netscape. It brings up the application just fine with one left-click on the hyperlink. All my files are embedded as "condensed NWC" files.

This may now be our best spot. The reasons:

1. It's open to the public just like GeoCities
2. It allows business-related content (unlike GeoCities)
3. It supports FTP loading and FrontPage extensions
4. It has servers around the world
5. It allows subdirectories

My website is constructed entirely in FrontPage 98 and appears to be having no problems.

http://members.tripod.com/allencole

Reply 3 offered by: new funny guy on 10-Feb-2000

geoCities does support businesses and has done so for several months. Don't see why you can't upload NWCs to geoCities... when I was there I could upload whatever format I wanted.

Reply 4 offered by: Allen Cole on 18-Feb-2000

The problem is not in the uploading. The problem is in how the files transfer to your computer from the server when you click on the hyperlink. Apparently, the default method is as a text file. For this reason, I was getting text on my screen, rather than a binary transfer of the .nwc file.

Tripod now recognizes the .nwc file extention as an application, and therefore transfers the file as a binary. With this in place, I can have my browser automatically activate NWC when it sees the file type. This was previously impossible because the file wasn't sent as a binary.


#1422: Trills
Trills

(1422)

Submitted by: John Fear on 09-Feb-2000

I need to know, how to write trills without putting in about 16 32nd notes.....please help me!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 09-Feb-2000

If you're looking for the visual effect of a trill, use the trill symbol available in the Boxmarks font (which you can download from the NWC Scriptorium at http://www.vadu.com/nwc).

If you're looking for the aural effect of a trill, there's currently no substitute for lots & lots of little notes.

If you want to combine the two, create a hidden staff to play the trill and a muted staff to display it.

I'm sure that better trill handling has been requested a number of times, but just to be sure, why not go to the wish-list page and drop your coin in the well too?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Feb-2000

Don't forget those magical key combos CNTL-C and CNTL-V for making those gazillion little notes. :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Feb-2000

Grace notes make for a quick and easy trill. If there are notes on other staves, they may need to be padded with grace note rests to prevent them from playing too soon.

Reply 4 offered by: the other funny guy on 10-Feb-2000

just give up we are never going to f******* get this stuff.


#1423: pause in looped MIDI
pause in looped MIDI

(1423)

Submitted by: Bob DuCharme on 10-Feb-2000

If I use NWC to create a two-bar piece of music, export it to MIDI, and then use it in a web page with this code

<embed src="abc.mid" autostart="true" loop="true">

the playback is looped, but there is a noticeable pause between each repetition. Does anyone know how to get rid of this so that the pulse continues smoothly during the playback?

thanks,

Bob
bob @
snee.com

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Feb-2000

A midi file has to be 'compiled' or reorganized from tracks to a continuous sequence before playback.
That is probably the cause of your delay.

Since it's only a few bars why not put a local repeat with a large number of repeats and leave out the HTML loop.
If you need a REALLY large number of repeats you can cut and paste the local repeat several times in sequence.

If you leave the loop in there will be a pause for 'compile' everytime the file ends and restarts.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Feb-2000

It is also not uncommon for the "start of play back" sequence to have a slight delay at the beginning. This may also be the cause of the delay, since even though you have specified loop play, the sequencer started by the browser probably still goes through its startup routine before the start of each new loop. One reason to do this is to let the device have time to change to the instrument assignments that usually appear at the start of a MIDI file sequence.

Barry's advice is probably your best bet: increase the size of your loop, thus reducing the frequency of your loop. Depending on its complexity, the file should still be relatively small.

Reply 3 offered by: Bob DuCharme on 11-Feb-2000

Thanks very much!

Bob


#1424: Audio recording n'worthy files
Audio recording n'worthy files

(1424)

Submitted by: John on 10-Feb-2000

When I connect the headphone out socket on the computer loudspeaker to the microphone input of the tape recorder, noteworthy files make dismal recordings.
Is it possible to fit something in between to get a good recording? If so where do I get it?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Feb-2000

Connecting a headphone output into a MIC input is just asking for distortion. If you want to make a tape, at a minimu, you should take the line level out of your sound card (if it has one - most do these days) and connect it to a line level input on a tape deck. On many sound cards, you might require a 1/8" adapter cable to convert to stereo audio cables.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 10-Feb-2000

If your tape deck doesn't have line-in jacks (as is the case with many low-end "blasters"), you can get an attenuator cable from Radio Shack that reduces the level by about 40 decibels, allowing you to patch from your Line Out (or speaker/headphone out) on your soundcard to the mic input of the tape recorder. Still won't give great recordings, but at least you won't have all that clipping distortion.


#1425: Printing features
Printing features

(1425)

Submitted by: Marco Losavio on 11-Feb-2000

Hi,
I'm evaluating Noteworthy. During printing I have these problems:
1) The AUTHOR field is printed near the first staff. How can I set the position of the author field?
2) Is there any way to print clef and key ONLY on the first line?

Thanks for your time.
Marco Losavio
mlosavio@libero.it

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 11-Feb-2000

1) Change the area used by the top staff in Staff Properties (F2). Or insert the Author informantion yourself as text. This way you can put author information on the left side as well.

2) This can be done in the 1.70 Beta by hiding Clef and Key symbols.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Feb-2000

Just adding to Blair's suggestion.
Reducing the top margin in Page Setup will allow extra room for the increase in the upper staff limit.

Reply 3 offered by: Marco Losavio on 12-Feb-2000

Thank you for your sugestions.

Blair has written:
>1) Change the area used by the top staff in Staff
>Properties (F2).
Excuse me, but I haven't understand what's the option to set into the Staff Properties dialog.

Blair has written:
>2) This can be done in the 1.70 Beta by hiding Clef
>and Key symbols.
Are you sure that this works? I want to print Clef and Key symbols only on the first row.

Barry has written:
>Reducing the top margin in Page Setup will allow extra
>room for the increase in the upper staff limit.
Reducing top margin NoteWorthy doesn't increase the distance between the Author field and the first staff line

Bye
Marco

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Feb-2000

>Blair has written:
>>2) This can be done in the 1.70 Beta by hiding Clef
>>and Key symbols.
>Are you sure that this works? I want to print Clef and Key >symbols only on the first row.

Yes, this definately works in 1.70. If you add a new hidden clef and key in bar 2, then these will not appear in later systems. We specifically desgined it to work this way.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 12-Feb-2000

Blair has written:
>1) Change the area used by the top staff in Staff
>Properties (F2).
Excuse me, but I haven't understand what's the option to set into the Staff Properties dialog.

Staff Properties (F2), Visual tab, in the Vertical Size group box, increase the Upper value. This is the number of spaces (measured in note size) that will be left above this staff on each line. If this spreads the staff sets out too much, decrease the Lower value on the bottom staff.

Reply 6 offered by: Marco Losavio on 13-Feb-2000

Thank you very much. Excuse me but I hadn't understand. Now all works fine.
Bye
Marco Losavio


#1426: Problem with lyrics
Problem with lyrics

(1426)

Submitted by: Norman Goldberg on 11-Feb-2000

Help, please, someone!
I'm writing a song using the following setup;
A four bar piano solo intro followed by a two bar vamp (repeated twice)at bars 5 & 6.
The vocal intro runs from measure 7 to and including measure 22.
The chorus begins at measure 23 where I have a "master repeat open" and ends at measure 42 where I have the 1st ending and "master repeat close".
The second chorus lyrics must begin at measure 23, but I have not found a way to do this, despite the fact that I have specified 2 lyric lines in the lyrics configuration. Instead, the second chorus lyrics begin at measure 7 under the vocal intro.
What is it that I'm doing wrong?? How can I get this to work??I would appreciate an answer from some kind soul as soon as possible. Thanx in advance

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 11-Feb-2000

To summarize: you've got Local Repeat Open at bar 5, Local Repeat Close at bar 7. At bar 23, you have your Master Repeat Open, at bar 42 (beginning) 1st Ending, and at bar 43 Master Repeat Close. Right? That should work. Other things to watch out for: repeats and special endings should be on _all_ staves. Also there shouldn't be any double bars or section open/close barlines which could confuse the flow. Hope this helps...

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Feb-2000

See page 17 of the User's Guide, or press the Help button and review the special characters that can be added to a lyric (specifically the underscore character, '_').


#1427: Tremolo/Mandolin Parts
Tremolo/Mandolin Parts

(1427)

Submitted by: John in Brisbane on 12-Feb-2000

Any tips or short-cuts please to notating tremolo parts for mandolin such that the MIDI output also refects what it should sound like. I have given a little bit of attention to editing the raw MIDI event records but concluded that macros to convert the 'score' in ABC notation would be somewhat easier for me to achieve. I would appreciate your inspired thoughts. Regards, John

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 12-Feb-2000

The tremolo can be accomplished in midi output simply by playing many successive 1/16 or 1/32 notes (depending on the desired speed of tremolo). If you don't like the visual aspect, hide the "played" staff and have a separate visual-only (muted) staff for printing.

Reply 2 offered by: John in Brisbane on 14-Feb-2000

Thanks Fred. Re the actual notation I was hoping that there may have been a method which reduced the very many keystrokes involved in this operation, perhaps some form of macros written to convert a particular valu note to (say) sixteenths. The other tip to hide the score would be very useful. Regards, John

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher on 14-Feb-2000

To enter a repeated series of identical notes:

(1) Enter the first note.
(2) Select the note and hit CTL-C.
(3) Position the cursor after the entered note and hit CTL-V.
(4) You now have two identical notes. Select them,
and hit CTL-C.
(5) Position the cursor after them and hit CTL-V.
(6) You now have four identical notes. Select them,
and hit CTL-C.
(7) Position the cursor after them and hit CTL-V.

...

Get the picture?

- seb

Reply 4 offered by: Allan Snider on 14-Feb-2000

Hmmm. Seems to me the ideal solution is to have a proper sampled mandolin tremolo for the midi instrument. The pieces I'm working on have Mandolin parts tremolo'd for the entire piece. If anybody out there happens across a Mandolin midi sample please pass it on. So far, the closest I've come up with is Dulcimer or Acoustic Guitar (steel) guitar. Bleh.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 16-Feb-2000

Erm... To enter repeated notes, strike Enter repeatedly...
But if you want to enter pair of notes, enter the first one, the second, and then copy/paste as Steve explains.
Note that I usually do this like that:
- place the first note
- place the second note
- Shift-Left twice (this select the two last notes entered)
- Ctrl-C (or Ctrl-Ins), but no move
- Ctrl-V (or Sihft-Ins) : this replace the selection by...itself
- Ctrl-V (Ctrl-V, Ctrl-V...) to duplicate them.

* Note that you can make a macro that does this: take the last two notes, make them 64th or 32th, then copy/paste them the number you need for a complete beat.
Note that Ctrl-Z (undo) undoes actions one by one, so you may remove the pairs one by one ;-), not note per note.
BTW, do not forget to push the undo-limit to its maximum value (100, it's set to 16 by default).

Just in case it may help.
                    Marsu

Reply 6 offered by: John in Brisbane on 16-Feb-2000

Thank you all for the replies. I have just wriiten a series of macros for ABC that does a fairly good (but incomplete) job of writing 1/16ths. There are some ABC conventions that I won't waste a lot of time trying to convert via macro, but will fix manually.

I guess that what I had in mind for NWC would operate something like:

Highlight the notes of a particular value in a given stave
Run the macro
Nominate the new (shorter) note value
The macro deletes the current note and inserts the appropriate number of notes of the chosen value.

The ABC macro I have written converts all notes which are an exact multiple of 1/16ths to the required number of 1/16ths - not as flexible as the routine above but acceptable enough for my purposes.

CHANGE OF SUBJECT - One of the handy features of ABC when notating jigs and strathspeys is the ability to change a pair of existing equal value notes to dotted/half or half/dotted values. Does this function exist in NWC.

Thanks for your patience. Regards, John

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 16-Feb-2000

Many users of NWC use the Win3x Recorder to run macros that do just the tasks you describe.
For example I use one macro to convert the 16th/8th/16th combination imported from 8th triplets in midi files to true 8th triplets.
And another to convert imported dotted 8th/16th pairs to straight 8ths.

There are some macro routines available at the scriptorium and the Recorder can be downloaded as OLDDOS from Microsoft.com.
If you would like some macros (or advice on their use) Email me.

Barry Graham

Reply 8 offered by: John in Brisbane on 17-Feb-2000

Thanks Barry for the advice - I'll do the recommended digging first and will contact you again when I know a little bit more about what I'm tackling. Regards, John


#1428: More than 16 channels?
More than 16 channels?

(1428)

Submitted by: Bob Dorisio on 12-Feb-2000

Is it possible to use more than 16 channels in a composition by using a second sound bank? If so, how is that done in NWC? And will it then export to MIDI?

Reply 1 offered by: not the real funny guy on 13-Feb-2000

Hi Bob,

Using more than 16 channels is a hardware thing.
Not much software supports more than 16 channels.
When you think about it though, You can get by without more than 16 channels. Even for orchestral composition or multilayered techno stuff you don't need any more than 16 channels.
Maybe you need to look at your application and try and do it more efficiently?

not the real funny guy, (but one of the funny guys)

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Feb-2000

The MIDI standard does not support more than 16 channels with one device. However, by using more than one device port, you can get around this limitation. If you have more than one device, you can select them via Tools | Options | MIDI. Then, you can seelct which device to use on a per-staff basis in Staff Properties.

Example: You can use up to 16 channels of your sound card's internal synthesizer, and 16 more channels via an outboard synthesizer connected via a MIDI cable (usually to the joystick port of the sound card).

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 14-Feb-2000

When I tried this (to mix the different sounds) the two devices were slightly out of synch, which was a good imitation of a beginner's band.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Feb-2000

Right on Blair.
If one (or more) of your device is a software synth. the delay in processing the midi note ons in the software synth will certainly put them out of sync.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 14-Feb-2000

>>When you think about it though . . . Even for orchestral composition . . . you don't need any more than 16 channels.

I've run up against the 16-channel problem at least once. Even when I think about it.

Be that as it may, when I save an NWC song requiring more than one playback device to a MIDI file, I'm not at all happy with the results. t seems that the Windows 98 Media Player won't use more than one playback device at a time. Is this even supported? How would I go about making it work?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Feb-2000

Correct. The Midi Mapper, and by extension the Media Player, only support 16 channels. You can map to multiple devices within those 16 channels, but that is it. In addition, using multiple devices more or less precludes mass distribution, as most people will not be able to hear the parts beyond those on the first device (or, in the case of some players, the additional parts will be played on the single device, just making everything sound wrong).

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Feb-2000

Amen to that! In sequencing orchestral work, it's a constant struggle to fit everything into 15 channels (channel 10 is unusable, being strictly for percussion instruments; you can't even us it for pitched percussion like timpani). Part of the reason is that I like to double the strings on two different sounds, since the string ensemble sounds on most cards lack the detail required for fast passages. By using multiple devices on my system, it can sound fine to me but I have no idea what's going to happen on other peoples' systems. So I grin and bear it... and double instruments on a single channel if needed.

Reply 8 offered by: dude on 16-Feb-2000

the other funny guy was right.
you work out how many sections there are in a standard orchestra - that's less than 16 including percussion. th trouble comes when you use more than one channels for string sounds, separate channels for individuals instruments eg. bass clarinet etc.
cheers

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 17-Feb-2000

How can you help assigning separate channesl for individual instruments? If I assign multiple staves to the same channel, they play back with the same instrument patch regardless of my "Staff Properties" settings. If you mean having different instruments *serially* on the same channel, wouldn't this be too limiting? ("No, I can't add the bassoons to this chord, the clarinets are already playing.")

Also, it was my understanding that certain effects (e.g., pitch bend) were applied on a per-channel basis, so assigning all strings (or even all violins) to the same channel is out if you want one section to be playing a glissando others are not.

I'll admit that this is one of the times I'd rather be wrong. If there are ways around these problems I'd love to hear about them.


#1430: Hiding a Staff
Hiding a Staff

(1430)

Submitted by: John Fear on 13-Feb-2000

How do you hide a staff....i have seen it done on many of the samples noteworthy includes........but i do not know how to do it myself...please help

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Feb-2000

On the Page Setup dialog, use the check boxes in the Contents tab.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Feb-2000

As a PS to Blair's post - if you want the staff(s) to be hidden when using NoteWorthy Player, assign them to a group called "Hidden" (has to have a capital H). Assigning your hidden staves to their own group also helps in hiding/unhiding the whole bunch of them with one click in the Options/Contents tab.

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP


#1434: What's the easiest way to...?
What's the easiest way to...?

(1434)

Submitted by: Brian Havey on 15-Feb-2000

What is the easiest way to get your transcriptions from Noteworthy to a bitmap or jpeg file? I tried copy and paste but the score came really small and pixelated... and it seems I can't open the .wmf files... help?

thanks,

Brian Havey

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 15-Feb-2000

There's an excellent little freeware utility called
IrfanView which will read and convert many graphics formats
including WMF, GIF, BMP and JPG. You can obtain it from
http://softwarecenter.net/irfanview.
I wasn't able to COPY and paste from the print preview
window into IrfanView, but I was able to COPY to a WMF
file, which I could OPEN with IrfanView and convert into
JPG, BMP or GIF format.

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 15-Feb-2000

Sorry, should have left of the "." at the end of that
link. Try:

http://softwarecenter.net/irfanview


#1435: Multiple MIDI output
Multiple MIDI output

(1435)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 16-Feb-2000

Maybe the answer to my question is in Windows and not in NWC... Thank you in advance for any response.

I have both speakers and an external MIDI device. I would like to configure either the MIDI mapper or NoteWorthy Composer, so that output goes to both outputs, but I don't know how to do that. Maybe it is not possible at all ?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 16-Feb-2000

This is probably possible using a virtual midi driver called "Multimid". My system has this installed to allow my Yamaha sound card's control applet take over the native volume control thingie; it should be configurable to pipe output from one device (e.g. your soundcard's midi hardware) to another (e.g. your external synth).

Multimid is quite commonly available, you should be able to find it by using a good search engine such as Google.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 17-Feb-2000

A search gave me the following page: http://www.modemss.brisnet.org.au/~mlevoi/midi.html with two similar programs, MultiMid 1.08 and Midi Loopback 2.51. I can not try them before tonight, but it seems by their description that they won't do what I want to:
- they can allow multiple programs to send output to one device
- they can allow one device to send output to another
- but apparently they don't allow one single program to send output to multiple devices.

Anyway, I will get one or both, and try. Thank you for the tip !


#1436: pls help.. newbie
pls help.. newbie

(1436)

Submitted by: elaine on 16-Feb-2000

I am wondering which of these software is good:
NoteWorthy
Mozart
Cakewalk Overture
Cakewalk Score Writer (this demo looks the same as Overture)

I don't know much about composing or writing songs. Please give me some comments on the above software... like which one has more essential functions and which is easy to use, etc. Thanks!!

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 16-Feb-2000

I've tried Mozart and found it very frustrating and limiting. The "model" has lots of assumptions which mean you spend more time trying to figure out a way *around* the limits of the system than just doing the work. For example, one which I remember is that Mozart INSISTS that all bars be filled with exactly the right number of beats, and note spacing was forced to be proportional to note length. When writing something with an anacrusis, you have to add a phantom beat and then specify that it is "hidden". No matter what you do, it simply isn't possible to completely eliminate the effect of the hidden beat on the printed output. I seem to remember it was also not possible to change time signatures (or clef?) without also changing key.
About the only thing that Mozart had which Noteworthy lacks is n-tuplets. Although it also has multiple bar rests, there was no control over the width of the bar, so for small numbers (3 or 4 bars), the multi bar block actually ended up being wider than the rests listed sequentially. I ended up using the "white out" method of implementing multi bar rests.

Mozart is WYSI(approximately)WYG, which IMHO is simply inappropriate for editting musical scores. It also has (had?) a totally proprietary file format, thus preventing any use of the work in other programs. NoteWorthy can read and write MIDI which makes failes somewhat interchangeable.

Note that since switching to NoteWorthy some years ago, I haven't bothered to keep up with updates to Mozart, so some of the issues may have been addressed. However, most of my complaints were about fairly fundamental architectural issues which I can't see being changed without radical redesign.

I haven't tried any of the Cakewalk family so can't comment on those.

Reply 2 offered by: John Taylor on 16-Feb-2000

Dollar for Dollar you just can't beat Noteworthy! I can't remember how many up grades I've been through with Noteworthy, all for less than forty bucks.

I use Noteworthy to write arrangements for concert band and a 17 piece swing band. It is simple to use, very user friendly, produces professional results and is back by the best support staff on the web (where else do you get bug fixes in less than 24 hours?).

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 16-Feb-2000

NoteWorthy Composer is by far the best value for money if you can live with some of the necessary work-arounds.

I echo John's comments about Mozart - the lack of midi support is frustrating.

IMHO Cakewalk Overture is only a grossly overpriced version of Scorewriter that has few additional benefits other than the ability to extract parts and some extensions to those provided in Scorewriter.

Scorewriter is the better alternative in the Cakewalk family if your budget is low.
It costs twice as much as NWC but if you really need the additional features it provides then the extra cost may be worth your while.

Summary: NWC - best value for money.
Scorewriter - pay twice as much for more features.

The choice is yours.
Check out the evaluation or demos at both sites and work out for yourself if the extra expense of Scorewriter is justified.
Be warned though - you will need to spend a lot of time evaluating both packages before you really know them.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Bacher on 17-Feb-2000

I gave up on Mozart very quickly when I realized that it
had no capability for chords - only single-line scoring.
I don't know if chords were added since; this was several years ago.

- seb

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Eidson on 17-Feb-2000

I have been looking into another program not on your list called Sibelius. It looks to be *the* choice if you want professional-quality scores.
I have been trying out the demo and it's fairly easy to use but does take time to learn.

The one thing that I like about it over Noteworthy is that everything I have seen suggested to the wish list is in this program. (staff crossing, special noteheads, n-tuplets, etc.)
There is a downside though and that is the price. ($599 public, $299 academic)
Noteworthy is simply the best program for your money, but check out the Sibelius demo if you want to compare another program (besides the ones on your list)

http://www.sibelius.com

-Joe

Reply 6 offered by: C. T. B on 26-Mar-2000

I've used Sibelius's demo for a couple of months and Finale for several years. If you're going to go into that price range, Finale is only choice.

I also, use Noteworthy for when I have transport it to some other computer for others to work with, since the cost of having someone else get the program to read my stuff is negligible.

Reply 7 offered by: Sue Morton on 26-Mar-2000

A friend of mine swears by Personal Composer. (It does make very pretty scores, I have some from her). I don't think she's ever used NoteWorthy Composer, as she's had PC for a long time.

I've never used Personal Composer, I've no idea what sort of MIDI support it has, etc. The full version is $199, they have lite versions too. There is a download available.
http://www.pcomposer.com/

As I said, I've never used (I downloaded the demo once, but never installed it). I just have too much fun with NWC to bother! But you might want to take a look and see if it's worth it to you.

Sue


#1437: Need help!!!
Need help!!!

(1437)

Submitted by: Stefan on 17-Feb-2000

Hey, i'm trying to find this song...I've heard it...Classical..All i remember is the repition...umm...right hand plays A C E over several times slowly while the left hand plays deep, low chords...can you help me out? thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Feb-2000

Could describe the first movement to Beethoven's "Moonlight" Sonata... or not... :-)

Reply 2 offered by: Stefan on 17-Feb-2000

Thank you verrryy much!!!!

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 18-Feb-2000

The Classical Themes Index at http://sd.znet.com/~iwamura/page2.html can often answer such questions.


#1438: Well-Tempered Clavier in mp3 format
Well-Tempered Clavier in mp3 format

(1438)

Submitted by: John Grant on 18-Feb-2000

Several selections from BACH's WTC are available at http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/42/john_lewis_grant.html

This are performed using Gigasampler, the Steinway B sample, and Cakewalk. For anyone who's interested in the capabilities of the program (or in Bach played on the piano) you may want to check it out.

All criticisms and comment via the email provided at the site are welcome.

John Grant


#1439: Crescendo/Decrescendo during a long note... help!
Crescendo/Decrescendo during a long note... help!

(1439)

Submitted by: Clive on 18-Feb-2000

Okay, I'll admit defeat... utter defeat and gross frustration!

I have been trying to make NWC do a crescendo or decrescdo whilst a long note is being played but have not had any success over the last few years. That's right, years...

Please, please, please; would someone kindly send me a line of music with 2 whole notes: show me how to make one play a cresendo and the other a decrescendo! I have tried both methods ie the example in VOLTEST.nwc (which does work on my soundcard) and mpc... I have tried and tried but don't understand in the slightest how to use mpc's at all!!

In shame for failing miserably and in need of acute assistance, Clive (Australia) with thanks!

Pssst: I'm trying to do the above for Schubert's string quintet (1st movt); how about my sending it over and perhaps your very kindly putting in those elusive changes in volume for me!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Feb-2000

Look at the voltest.nwc file, that's all you need to do. Before the note is sounded, there is fff(-,127). This means that velocity is not overridden (that's why the dash instead of a number), but that volume is overridden to 127. At the end of the note is a ppp(-,2). Again, no velocity override (which would be meaningless anyway, since the first note is still sounding), but volume is overridden to 2. The decrescendo in the second bar therefore causes the volume to be smoothly decreased over the course of the second and third bars.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 19-Feb-2000

Clive,

I assume you're using a wavetable soundcard or module (or a software synth).
Because if you're using an FM card/synth - volume changes through a held note don't work - the card only responds to note on velocity.


#1440: Convert wav into cd-audio
Convert wav into cd-audio

(1440)

Submitted by: Soren Lyster on 18-Feb-2000

I have a problem. I bought a Phono preamp from Terratec to digitally record my old vinyl records onto my computer, and then move them onto a cd, so that I could play my old records from a cd on my stereo. Pretty neat, but my SB-Live soundcard can only record in wav-foramt, and my regular cd-player don't know that format. How do I convert it?? Looking forward to hearing from You

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Feb-2000

Your CD burning software should be able to burn an "Audio CD" from your WAV files. Check your CD burning software documentation for more details.

Reply 2 offered by: Bill on 02-Apr-2000

Yes, your cd software should make this distinction as you are preparing to read to the hard drive for later recording to cd. You shoul at some point be prompted to leave the session open or close the session. If you close the session, you will be able to play it from any cd played. If not, your cd drive will sit there and spin with a confused look on its face.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Apr-2000

What's more, if you make an audio CD do it all in one session. Otherwise your home or car CD player may only "see" the tracks created in the first session. (Your computer's CD ROM drive will however see the tracks created in subsequent sessions.)

Reply 4 offered by: Soren Lyster on 05-Apr-2000

Thanks for all your help. You were all right...never thought it would be that simple! Thanks again.

Gratefully
Soren Lyster


#1441: How do I make trills?
How do I make trills?

(1441)

Submitted by: dude_tangen on 20-Feb-2000

Like the subject says, How Do I make a trill, They are hard. Please help.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Feb-2000

See http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1422.htm

This has also been covered in other threads. btw - A really good resource is to download the "Offline Forum", which then lets you search for any keywords in the standard Windows Help format.


#1442: Master Repeat Closed and Master Repeat Open
Master Repeat Closed and Master Repeat Open

(1442)

Submitted by: Kjell Tangerås on 21-Feb-2000

Sometimes you need a Master Repeat Closed followed by a Master Repeat Open. When I am doing so, there is a gap between the two symbols. In another program I've been using, Notator, there is a symbol like a Master Repeat Closed put together with a Master Repeat Open. Is it possible to find something like that i NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Feb-2000

This isn't directly supported at this time. However, with the forthcoming V1.70 (presently in beta) a fairly convincing workaround can be accomplished by inserting the second set of dots as text, and making the Repeat Open barline invisible (for proper playback).

Reply 2 offered by: Kjell Tangerås on 22-Feb-2000

Playback is not the problem, it's visual. I need a symbol like a Master Repeat Closed and a Master Repeat Open put together, the two in one.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Feb-2000

The visual solution was to insert the dots as text. Proper placement can be tricky. Another solution is to get the line to end with the Repeat Close, and the next line to begin with the Repeat Open. NWC 1.70 helps you do this by letting you force line breaks. Select the Repeat Close, edit it (ctrl-E), check the Force System Break box, then adjust the lines above if the last line is stretched too much.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Jun-2000

and the final release of version 1.70 supports proper display of a repeat close followed immediately by a repeat open...


#1443: Override default MIDI volume
Override default MIDI volume

(1443)

Submitted by: Mark on 22-Feb-2000

When using the above feature, does p{-,100} mean 100% of the normal volume for piano and f{-,75%} mean 75% of the normal volume of forte?

Thanking all in advance!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Feb-2000

No. The numbers are absolute, with the maximum being 127 (full volume or velocity) and the minimum (in midi) being 0. However, note that 0 has a special meaning in NWC, so in practise the minimum volume or velocity is 1.


#1444: Flow Direction with Repeat as Last Bar Line
Flow Direction with Repeat as Last Bar Line

(1444)

Submitted by: Brian on 22-Feb-2000

If I have a Master Repeat Close as the ending bar, is there any way that I can get a flow direction (D.C. al Fine) to both look correct and be executed the second time through the repeat?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 23-Feb-2000

For a Da Capo instruction strictly you should have a second time bar after the Master Repeat Close, otherwise the DS will be actioned before you get to the MRC but as a shorthand a DC inside the last bar is OK.

To get the repeated section to repeat do the following:

1 Insert an invisible MRC immediately after the MR Open. This disables the repeat altogether.

2 Insrt an Invisible Local Repeat Open immediately after the invisible MRC, and an invisible LR Close (with repeat count 2) just before the final MRC.

3 Insert the DC instruction between these last two bar lines (you get LRC, DC, MRC).

And there you are. A bit of a palaver an d surely something for the wish list to correct.

Reply 2 offered by: Brian on 23-Feb-2000

Great Solution! It works exactly how I wanted.
Thank you!


#1445: swing 8th notes
swing 8th notes

(1445)

Submitted by: Phatboi on 22-Feb-2000

Does anyone know how to make NWC playback swing 8th notes? If you write it in triplet form it just doesn't sound quite right. Any ideas?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Feb-2000

The best (only?) way is to have tempo changes in each bar to give whatever swing effect you want. Sounds scary, but it's really not; once you have one bar the way you want it, just copy it and paste new copies of it to your heart's content. Dominique Portier wrote an excellent User Tip on the subject called, IIRC, "NWC plays Jazz".

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 25-Feb-2000

Thanx Fred :-)

I'm having too much work for now so couldn't reply.
The exact link is http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip6.htm#jazz

Note that the solutions I provide in jazzy.zip are just examples. jazzy1.nwc is roughly 2/3|1/3, and jazzy2.nwc 3/4|1/4. Both are with a "normal" tempo of quarter=100 bpm.
The values to give to the tempi depend on the "normal" value and the swing effect you want, please refer to the tip.
If someone think it's useful, I can give a CGI|javascript|program which gives you the values automatically. I've already made a spreadsheet in XL format for this.

don't hesitate to contact me!

Jazzily yours,
Dominique


#1446: Printer problem
Printer problem

(1446)

Submitted by: Thurein on 23-Feb-2000

Hi!
Just recently I've changed both drum and toner for the laser printer "Panasonic KX-P4410". But I still have one problem that is when a paper starts to feed in, the roller stops turning or sometimes it roll but does not feed the paper in. I've tried to over come the problem by cleaning the roller and also the bottom block which sits beneath the roller. This problem is happening for about four months.
Do you think the relay which trigger the roller not operating properly?
Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 23-Feb-2000

Uh, this forum is visited primarily by people who are interested in one particular brand of music software. You might find people more interested in, or knowledgeable about, printer hardware, elsewhere: The manufacturer's site, hardware repair forums or newsgroups, even neighborhood bars.

Reply 2 offered by: Jeremy Ewen on 23-Feb-2000

Stephen is correct, of course, but let's keep it friendly. I had a similar problem with my old Kyocera F1000 laser printer a few years back, and I tried everything to stop it happening, from increasing the upward pressure in the paper tray, to swapping the rubber rollers with the printer at work (!) and it still didn't do the trick. In the end, I realised that the main reason for it was that the place I kept the printer and paper was DAMP and this was preventing the paper from being picked up properly. As the mechanism was expecting to receive paper a certain time after the rollers started rotating, but didn't, it switched itself off and displayed a paper jam fault. I've since kept my computer/organ room nice and warm, and have never had any further problems. Another reason for your jams could be the thickness of the paper - my Kyocera will only take stuff heavier than about 100gsm by manual feed.

Reply 3 offered by: Fisher on 27-Jun-2001

I have a panasonic kx-p4410 and my problem is: it says toner empty and it is a new toner. Now it will not print as it keeps saying toner empty. Can you help. Thank you.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 28-Jun-2001

Even regular NWC users might have a problem with something else, and come here for advice. Presumably, others with similar interests are likely to face the same problems.

But I don't think that's what's going on here. If one owns, let's say, an "Acme Mark III Gerbil Feeder" and runs out of food pellets, the logical thing to do is go to a search engine and type in "Acme Mark III Gerbil Feeder." The search engine will deliver any page it has found that has those words. The NWC forum has been in business for years, and is regularly crawled by search engines. Thus, an outside user - who does not know that this is a music software site - need only click on the search engine's link to be led directly into the forum thread in which the Gerbil Feeder was mentioned. After a while, so many Gerbil Feeder enthusiasts respond that the forum goes higher on the search engine results.

If you don't believe me, wait a few months, then try "Acme Mark III Gerbil Feeder" on a search engine such as Google. Watch this forum thread pop up!

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jun-2001

It may pop up, but this kind of thing is so far removed from NWC on a computer, we would definately kill it (either the replies or the whole thread, depending on the thread).

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 30-Jul-2001

Just for fun, today (July 30, 2001) I searched for "Acme Mark III gerbil feeder" using the Google search engine. Sure enough, this thread showed up!

NWC can kill the thread if it wants, but the above is not a real product, so I don't think that many pet enthusiasts will be finding their way here.


#1447: fermata position
fermata position

(1447)

Submitted by: Peter Din on 25-Feb-2000

Hello

I can't place a fermata just on a note. Please Help me.

Peter

peterdin@wanadoo.fr

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Feb-2000

Make sure Preserve Width is not checked. NWC will then automatically center the Fermata when you print.


#1448: Noteworthy Player
Noteworthy Player

(1448)

Submitted by: W.Tuerlins on 26-Feb-2000

I made a CD with an enormous lot of NWC music for people to listen to.I use NWC Player but every time the NWC player comes up in minimise format. Is there a way to make NWC Player come to screen in maximised format (i.e. full screen)
I looked at previous messages which seems to indicate that this is impossible. Is this truely the case?

Reply 1 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Feb-2000

There is no reason why the player would come up minimized by default. What are you using to start the program?

Reply 3 offered by: W.Tuerlins on 26-Feb-2000

Thanks for your reply.Perhaps I was not clear enough and my English may not be up to scratch.Noteworthy Player when started does not come up in minimised form, but I always have to push a button to make it full screen i.s.o. about half a screen. Is there a way to make the programme start full screen?

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Feb-2000

No, you cannot set the screen size for the player. It comes up in a default size that cannot be changed until after it is open. The user can then change the size as required.

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP


#1450: Roland GS
Roland GS

(1450)

Submitted by: Clive on 27-Feb-2000

How can I make Roland GS the default patch list?

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 27-Feb-2000

I'm not sure if there is a way to directly do that,however, there is an option you could use. Make a template for your scores with the Roland patch set under staff properties. If you use the standard templates, just open each, change the patch under staff properties and do a "save as" to the templates folder. Then start all of your new files by opening through the templates. This would give you the type of function you're looking for.


#1451: Stereo Pan - What is right?
Stereo Pan - What is right?

(1451)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 27-Feb-2000

I am using the Stereo Pan property in the Staff Properties dialog give my piano music sound more depth. I find that adjusting the values just a little bit (eg. from 64,64 to 56,72 sounds good. I would like the left hand to come out the left speaker so it sounds like I am facing the piano. My question: is there a standard for doing this. Is a lower value supposed to be left or right? Or is this a pointless question because nobody sets up their speakers to be left and right anyway. I can't tell how my speakers are supposed to be set up.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Feb-2000

0 is full left, 127 is full right.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 27-Feb-2000

I just realized that my speakers are meant to hang on the monitor, so left and right are defined. A high stereo pan value makes sound come out the left. So, is the problem with the speakers, the sound card, Noteworthy, or your information (how do you know?).

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 27-Feb-2000

I believe it's defined by the MIDI standard. The problem doesn't seem to be NWC (it works fine for me). Might you have your speakers connected backward?


#1452: Differant Keys
Differant Keys

(1452)

Submitted by: Pepsiman8 on 27-Feb-2000

I am putting the song "Normandy Beach" on noteworthy composer. It has a bunch of instraments in differant keys. How do i tell the staff what key the instrament is in???

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 27-Feb-2000

On the Midi tab of Staff Properties (F2) there is a Transposition value you can set.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Feb-2000

If you are entering the notes from a 'concert' score (all staves in the same key) Enter the Name, Clef and key for each staff (very important) - then just enter the notes as you see them - then transpose each staff to the correct transposition for each instrument in Tools> Transpose Staff with the option 'Adjust Playback' enabled.

If you are entering notes from a 'transposed' score (all instruments in their transposed keys) - you must set up each staff in it's correct key before you enter the notes.
Set up each staff with the correct name, clef and key signature - then under the Staff details Midi tab set the sound/playback transposition to give the correct sound at 'concert' pitch.

EXAMPLE: Concert key C
TRANSPOSING INSTRUMENTS
Alto Sax - Treble Clef - Key A - Playback transposition -9
Tenor Sax - Treble Clef - Key D - P/B transposition -14
Baritone Sax - Treble Clef - Key A - P/B transposition -21
Trumpet - Treble Clef - Key D - P/B transposition -2
Clarinet (Same as Trumpet)
And others:

"NON-TRANSPOSING" INSTRUMENTS (in Concert Key)
Trombone - Bass Clef - Key C (No transposition required)
Piano - Grand Staff - Key C (Treble and Bass Clefs)
Flute - Treble Clef (No transposition required)
Piccolo - Treble Clef - Key C - P/B transposition -12
Guitar - Treble Clef - Key C - P/B transposition -12
String Bass - Bass Clef - Key C - P/B transposition -12
Drums - On channel 10 - convert to notation to 'midi notes'.

Once the staves are set up in this way.
Click on each staff in turn and enter the notes as they appear on the 'transposed' score.

Hope this helps!

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 27-Feb-2000

I think this requires some clarification. The string bass and guitar sound an octave lower than written, so their transposition is -12. The piccolo, though, sounds an octave higher than written, so its transposition should be +12.

Other "C" instruments that sound higher than written are:

celesta: 1 octave higher (transposition +12)
xylophone: 1 octave higher (+12)
glockenspiel: 2 octaves higher (+24!)
antique cymbals: 2 octaves higher (+24)

All the transposing instruments Barry lists sound lower than written, so their transpositions are negative. An E-flat clarinet, on the other hand, sounds a minor third higher than written so would have a transposition of +3.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Feb-2000

Thanks Grant:

My error - the Piccolo should be +12 transposition.

Reply 5 offered by: Pepsiman8 on 29-Feb-2000

Thanks for the help guys.


#1454: v1.70h beta and SBLive
v1.70h beta and SBLive

(1454)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 28-Feb-2000

Hi again. I was looking through the midi controllers in NWC v1.70h beta when a set of strange things started to happen. For some obscure reason, the controllers did not work. Now I am sure that my soundcard (SBLive Plat) has those controllers and in the same addresses and I am fairly adept in MIDI and the use of the controllers to be sure that I was not using them incorrectly.

Initially I used MPCs to adjust reverb. That worked. Then I added a second MPC for Chorus on the same staff, but it didn't have an effect on the playback. Removing that and trying another controller had the same result - it did not play in playback. Removing the reverb didn't fix the situation - instead, it did not go and re-adding it with different settings did not work either. Only modulation seemed to have some minute effect. It could be my ears playing up, I don't know.

I restarted the PC and followed another sequence - started with chorus. That worked, but adding Reverb on the same staff had no effect and so on and so forth. I know it must not be the soundcards' fault, because using Cubase that comes packaged with the card didn't produce the same effects - the controllers worked fine. The only thing I can infer from this is that either there is a minute incompatibility problem here between NWC and SBLive, or there is a bug in the prog.

I would like to know if other users that use an SBLive experience the same problems - Shane?

I also noticed that for some reason, when in the staff properties or an instrument patch a selection of a different bank is made by ticking the box and putting numbers for bank and controller 32, the actual selection is affected by the selection in the sample selection window above, either one adjusts it previously or after the different patch is selected. Any reasons to why this is happenning?

StV

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Feb-2000

There's presently quite an involved discussion around SBLive! issues on the newsgroup. If you have newsgroup access, it might be worth your while to join in on this. From what I gather, effective use of the SBLive! is a little trickier than it appears at first.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Feb-2000

Not quite sure I understand the patch problem but the Program change must always follow the Bank change.
This means that if you change the bank - the channel retains the previous program (patch) until a program change message is received - the new patch will be come from the new bank.

Reply 3 offered by: Shane Turner on 01-Mar-2000

I'm not on the newsgroup (and am too lazy to wait 1/2 hour to download the recent postings to it) so here's the info you need:

You need to use environments. Go to Audio HQ (the little icon that appears in your system tray) and click environmental audio. You'll get a window with a slider across the bottom, and options in the middle, and 4 tabs across the top: master/source/midi/options

Select /midi (duh :-) Under there you can map effects to controllers of your choosing. Be sure that chorus is mapped to controller 93. Go back to /master and be sure that chorus is turned up and not sitting at 0%.

Then in your midi file when you select controller 93 (chorus) it will work just fine. At least it does for me.

The great thing is that you can map other effects beside chorus too... explore that environmental audio window, learn it well. You've got some professional effects available right there just begging to be used, and there are so many combinations.


#1455: midi to mp3
midi to mp3

(1455)

Submitted by: Yohan on 28-Feb-2000

How to convert midi files directly to mp3 files without loss of quality?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Feb-2000

Both requirements ('directly' and 'without loss of quality') are impossible to fulfill, but can be approximated. MP3 is a 'lossy' compression system, which means that you will never get exactly the same out of it as what you put in. However, it's considered good enough for most applications, especially at the higher bit rates (128K and above).

Similarly, mp3 is a way of compressing wav files, which are an actual sound recording. Your midi first has to be recorded into a wav format before it can be converted to mp3. That being said, some utilities (e.g. CoolEdit) have a "Save As..." option which let you convert to mp3 directly after recording, making it appear as if it's converting the midi directly to mp3. Internally, however, it's still recording and processing a wav file.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-Feb-2000

I use a mp3 ripper/jutebox called MusicMatch (http://www.musicmatch.com/). I provided some detailed instructions in the newgroup under the foregoing heading. I just select "system mixer" as my recording device and it seamlessly creates an mp3 out of the midi being recorded. (Another nice feature is it's automatic fade ins, fade outs and soundclip creator features).

I have not noticed any hiss or pops. The mp3's seem to come out identical in quality and sound to the midi's. (P.S. I did upgrade to full CD quality from Near CD quality. However, it does not make that much of a difference).


#1456: Albert Ammons Shout for Joy Sheet Music
Albert Ammons Shout for Joy Sheet Music

(1456)

Submitted by: Mike Roberts on 28-Feb-2000

I would like to find sheet music of 'Shout for Joy' by Albert Ammons. Can anybody help?

Mit freundlichen Gruessen,
Mike

mike@harding-roberts.freeserve.co.uk

Reply 1 offered by: Michael King on 28-Feb-2000

Mike,you might try the Choral Public Library Domain; WWW.cpdl.org. They have an extensive library of choral music. Hope this is what you are looking for

Michael

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 29-Feb-2000

Using the NorthernLight search engine ( http://www.northernlight.com/ ) with query:

+ammons +"shout for joy"

I got about 70 hits, including this page:

http://miltonsweb.mse.jhu.edu/research/folkindex/S08.htm

containing the index reference:

Shout for Joy
1.Ammons, Albert. Roots N' Blues - The Retrospective (1925-50), Columbia Legacy 47911/47912-15, Cas (1992),
cut#3.25

I suspect this is a recording, rather than sheet music. But
it shows that the references are out there, you just have
to search for them.

If NorthernLight doesn't find what you're after, try
AltaVista ( !http::/www.altavista.com/ )


#1457: Recording Drums from Keyboard
Recording Drums from Keyboard

(1457)

Submitted by: K. Brown on 29-Feb-2000

I use my keyboard for step-recording choral arrangements and then export the accompaniments to MIDI files, but I don't know much about drums to write in drum parts. Is it possible to record my keyboard's internal drum patterns to NWC to put into MIDI accompaniment arrangements I make for my choir? If so, How?

Reply 1 offered by: Sly on 04-Apr-2000

I write the drum parts out with noteworthy......but I would imagine you could use the import option in noteworthy and let your keyboard play the part......then noteworthy would write out the part ........then you would use the general midi drums in the computer to play back the part. Hopefully you have the awe64 live soundcard so you can load good drum soundfonts to play back with the music that you want to record. Otherwise you won't like the drum sounds.
I load all my soundfonts into my soundcard so they sound like real instuments. Good luck I hope I was some help to you. I never pick up an instrument I do it all with noteworthy and my soundcard.......heheh....

P.S Im assumming your keyboard is plugged into you computer......so that noteworthy will get the signal....and write out the drum part for you.


#1458: non-metrical music
non-metrical music

(1458)

Submitted by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 01-Mar-2000

Psalm tones, for example ... I want to produce sheets where the words are neatly lined up under the tone, but can't work out how to do this: the number of syllables to be sung to each note varies from verse to verse. This sort of thing is normally notated with white notes and black notes without stems: any way of doing this with Noteworthy?

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 01-Mar-2000

I'm not sure I understand all of your question (my native language is french), but maybe I can help you for a few points.

1) If you want to have less syllabes than you have notes, look at online help about Lyrics, particularly the use of underscore ( _ ) character.

2) If you want to have more syllabes than you have notes, maybe it will be possible in NWC, using hidden notes, but I'm not completely sure of that.

3) I don't think it is possible to draw notes without stem. Maybe for white notes if you use whole notes instead of half notes (possibly chorded with a hidden half rest in 1.70), but there may be problems near the bar lines.

Reply 2 offered by: Niels Grundtvig Nielsen on 01-Mar-2000

Olivier, me semble que vous avez bien compris; mais aussi, de votre réponse, que cela que je cherche à faire ne sera pas possible. Peut-être qu'un nouveau mode "No audit", plus quelque chose pour indiquer où les paroles devraient s'associer à la note suivante, plus un noir sans queue. Y'a qu'à ;-}
------
Looks to me as though Olivier did understand, and also that what I'd like to do can't be done. Perhaps we need a new "No audit" mode, plus some way of specifying which syllable starts on the next note, plus a black note-head without a stem. Not much to ask, really ;-}

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 01-Mar-2000

It is possible to have more words than notes. Just use underscores ('_') to connect the words that go together on the same note. NWC counts underscores as alphabetics but prints them as spaces.

Reply 4 offered by: Jeremy Ewen on 01-Mar-2000

I was quite interested to see this query as I have to copy out the psalm into Noteworthy once a month when we do one at our church. I use the underscore to keep the first part of the verse under the chanting note, and it's a real pain to do when you're used to hitting the space bar between words normally! Sometimes I have problems when a double chant doesn't fit the page properly, but I get over this by endless adjustment of the staff size, lyric font size, and page margins. As our psalter is printed with semibreves for the chanting and last notes, with minims inbetween, I don't have the problem of headless notes! But perhaps Neils is doing something in the plainchant line.....


#1459: mute one voice in a staff?
mute one voice in a staff?

(1459)

Submitted by: Dane Hutchins on 04-Mar-2000

I sing barbershop harmony. BBS sheet music is generally written with two parts singing on the treble staff and two parts on a bass staff. Is it possible to playback just one voice on a staff? i.e., playback only the Lead voice if the treble staff contains both a Lead and a Tenor voice. Can this be accomplished on NWC 1.55a?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 04-Mar-2000

Yes, if you put each voice on a separate staff and combine them using staff layering. This is the easiest way to input the notes anyway. If both voices are already on the same staff, I suggest you copy the entire staff to another staff, then delete all the notes for one voice on each staff.


#1460: Font for Pedal Markings
Font for Pedal Markings

(1460)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 04-Mar-2000

Is there a way to change the font size of the pedal markings? It does not seem to use any of the fonts in the Font tab in Page Setup.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 04-Mar-2000

No, since it's one of the characters in NWCV15.ttf. Guess you could (using V1.70) hide the pedal mark, and insert a visual one using text (with one of the user fonts set to NWCV15).

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 04-Mar-2000

Right, so it makes no sense to change the font. And it scales with the staff size. Unlike other staff notations, it does not have a standard size, and I would sometimes like it a little bigger. Well, its not very important.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 04-Mar-2000

On a couple occasions (using V1.55b) where I wanted virtual (unplayed) notes indicating alternative phrasing, I actually set up two of the User Fonts to different sizes of the NWCV15 native font; one for rests, and one for notes (using the grace note characters since the 'real' note stems are apparently drawn, not font-based). Add Boxmarks and Crescendo, and it pretty much uses up the user-definable fonts.


#1461: How do I access other banks on Roland XP-80?
How do I access other banks on Roland XP-80?

(1461)

Submitted by: JP on 05-Mar-2000

I just bought a Roland XP-80 and have been having a ball. But I'm having trouble with one aspect: using noteworthy to access multiple patch banks. If the keyboard is in general midi mode, everything works fine (all voices work on all channels just fine). If I change the voice bank on the keyboard to one of the presets or user banks, then only one channel will play from noteworthy (the others just disappear) and only in the voice the keyboard is sitting on... I don't know how to access PR-A, PR-B, PR-C, users banks, or different percussion banks (especially any combo of the above simultaneously) - can this be done with noteworthy?

Thx

JP

Reply 1 offered by: nat on 05-Mar-2000

i have one but i don't think you can do this.
the general midi mode seems to be the only one you can access.
i'd like to know if it is possible.
maybe we can email roland?

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Mar-2000

I THINK you can do this but you will need to know the controllers used to access the Roland banks on your device (check the Roland manual under Using Banks).

Firstly set up NWC to use the Roland as a sound device (you've probably done this - but here it is anyhow).

Under menu TOOLS>OPTIONS>MIDI(tab).
Select the devices to be used for playback from the List of Available Devices in the left-hand column.
Move the devices to the Devices To Be Used For Playback list on the right using the ->> arrow.
You can have several devices in the Playback list - one of these should be your Roland instrument.
Exit out by pressing OK to get back to the Score Editor.

Next set up EACH staff to use one of the selected playback devices.
From Menu STAFF>STAFF PROPERTIES>MIDI(tab).
Select Playback Device from the list of devices you created previously. (Your Roland instrument).
Select the Channel that will be used by this staff - Channel 10 for your drums.

Then:-
In the box where it says "Playback Instrument"
Click on Change.
Select the Patch and Patch List Type for this staff.
(select Roland GS - I guess)

(Now comes the part that depends on your sound device)
From your Roland manual find out how to access the additional banks on your instrument - there should be information that tells you what values for Controller 0 and Controller 32 you need to access your other banks.
(As an example - on the AWE32 I have - you only use Controller 0 - a 1 here would access bank 1 - I can ignore Controller 32 - but your Roland may be different.
On some devices Controller 32 is used to access variation tones or drum kits - READ YOUR MANUAL).

Enable Select Different Bank.
Enter the required values in the Controller 0 and Controller 32 boxes.

Drums: Must be on Channel 10 - check you manual to see if a different bank is required for the drumset you want and enter the Controller values required.
On the Roland and many other devices (AWE family with the GS or Chaos soundfonts/ Wingroove) you can actually select a drumset,(even in Bank 0), by using a different Program (patch) for the Drum Channel.
The following are recognized by GS and Wingroove.
I believe that they are Numeric 0 based but if this doesn't work add one to the values given or select Numeric 1 as the Patch List Type.
Select Numeric 0 (or 1 if I'm wrong) as the Patch List Type.
Enter the drumset number from the list below.
Standard 0(1)
Room 8
Power 16
Electronic 24
Jazz 32
Brush 40
Orchestral 48 - includes tuned tymps.

They may be others around 25/26 - perhaps SFX at 60 and other emulations MT32etc. at other numbers.

See how you go!

Reply 3 offered by: JP on 08-Mar-2000

Ok I finally found some documentation - and for anyone else with an XP80/60, here's the link:

http://www.rolandus.com/SUPPORT/DOCS/SUPNOTES/XP60FAQS.HTM

It's section XV, (next to last section, so scroll to bottom) - it gives a chart... I'll go ahead and write the main ones below - for the rest of the chart (addon boards, etc) see the link above.

Patch Group Patch Number Ctrl0 Ctrl32
----------- ------------ ----- ------
User 1-128 80 0
Preset A 1-128 81 0
Preset B 1-128 81 1
Preset C 1-128 81 2
Preset D(GM) 1-128 81 3

So if you wanted to access patch 32 in Preset B, you'd just put in 81 for Controller 0, 1 for Controller 32, and then choose patch 32. Easy when you have the chart!

JP


#1462: Notate a drum track?!
Notate a drum track?!

(1462)

Submitted by: Onion face on 05-Mar-2000

HELP!

I have written some music for our funk band and need to notate the grooves in the standard drum notation from a midi file.

I know that Noteworthy cannot do it but can you recommend an alternative. I checked out a site that had a workaround for NWC but it is miserable as far as I am concerned.

If anyone can recommend a fix please let me know. Is there a specific drum notation program anywhere? Free or shareware? I don't want to spend any money at the moment until I get serious with writing music because I'm mostly a player and have only tried writing some original stuff for the band.

Anyway I need to notate a drum track fast! Please help. I want to be able to do it myself next time so please no offers to do it. Thank you, I anticipate a solution by tomorrow!

yours,
Onion face (leader of the onionheads)

Reply 1 offered by: onion head on 06-Mar-2000

HELP, I NEED HELP! PLEASE!

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Mar-2000

Check out the Scriptorium http://www.vadu.com/nwc and get Barry Graham's Drum program (in Other Helpful Files from NWC users). There's a BASIC (DOS) version (which I use often) and also a VB rework which I find somewhat more difficult to use. This allows you to convert from midi to notation, or vice-versa. Once you get the hang of it you can create a notation track in about two minutes. Then mute it and hide the original midi track and you have a file that's both printable and playable.


#1463: recording piano to treble and bass cleft as played
recording piano to treble and bass cleft as played

(1463)

Submitted by: Berrien Sutton on 05-Mar-2000

I just purchased noteworthy have been trying to record from a piano via midi; how do I get the notation to show up on both the treble and bass cleft scores as it is played on the piano; I want to print sheet music out, but it all shows up on the treble cleft

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Mar-2000

Under TOOLS>OPTIONS>RECORD(right-most tab)
Import Options - Buffer Only.

Record your piano track over a pre-made rhythm click track. The recording won't appear.
Create a Grand Staff - Treble and Bass Clefs for the piano you have just recorded.

Make the Treble Staff active - click on it.
Under STAFF>IMPORT RECORDING
(This operates the same as Midi Import)
In Step 1 select the resolution required for notes and rests.
Notes depends on the smallest duration in your recording - quarter note for rests is usually OK.
In Step 2 make the Maximum Single Chord Size large (60+).
In Step 3 - which displays the track and channel of your recording - Click on Edit.
Select the range of the notes to be imported into the Treble Staff.
eg. C5 to G10
CLick Ok and continue to finish of Import.
Only the notes C5 and above are included on the staff.

Click on the Bass Clef staff.
Repeat the Import Recording steps:-
(The recording is still in the buffer).
At Step 3 - Edit and select the range of notes below your split point. eg. C0 to B4.
Complete the import steps.
The Bass Clef should contain the notes below your split point.

This should work.
I sometimes overlap the ranges at the split point so I can include some notes in the Clefs of choice - to complete chords (for example)- then delete the duplicates in the other clef.

Hope this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Mar-2000

Also, you can have NWC make a guess at the two staff split points by setting the following in Tools | Options:

1. In the Record tab, select: After recording, import staff into "New Window"

2. In the Import tab, set the "Maximum single track chord size" option to something between 12 and 24.

This defines the largest number of semitone that should exist within a chord. When NWC sees something larger than this, it will locate the center tone in the performance, and split the performance into two tracks, one above the center tone, and one below the center tone.

Reply 3 offered by: dooby on 06-Mar-2000

okay cool, but can it automatically separate at B below middle c?


#1464: Triplets
Triplets

(1464)

Submitted by: Tom Servo on 05-Mar-2000

Is there any way to get the thing to import eigth note triplets as triplets and not as two dotted sixteenth notes and a sixteenth note? Or does this only happen in the shareware version?

Reply 1 offered by: Tom Servo on 05-Mar-2000

Forgot to ask above...why does it import with the C Major key signature, and LOTS of accidentals? Same thing with transposing? or is that only in the shareware version?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Mar-2000

The triplets issue is one that several folks have put on the wish-list for future improvement. Aside from manual touchups (which in some cases can be speeded up using macros) there's nothing that can be done about this at present.

The key signature issue is not NoteWorthy's fault. The Key Sig specification is optional; in other words, not all sequencers (for example Cubasis) export this when creating the midi. NWC therefore has no way of knowing what the intended key signature is. You can usually fix this up by forcing accidentals (all notes will how have an accidental), insert the desired (actual) key signature, and then transpose by 0 steps. This will fix most of them, though you still will usually have wrong enharmonics (such as Gb instead of F#) to fix up by hand.

On transposing, have a look at the help file.


#1465: Getting Piano.exe to work with NWC
Getting Piano.exe to work with NWC

(1465)

Submitted by: Haymo van Wyk on 07-Mar-2000

Further to Message #1054, marsu's reply no. 13, and Fred Bachbaur's exuberant reply, about using piano.exe for keyboard entry of music in NWC:
I'm running Windows 98 second edition,
am registered user of NWC 1.55b,
using Creative Vibra 128 soud card,
downloaded piano21.zip(version 2.1) and had it self-extract.
Now how do I get it to work with NWC?
I get lost at the point where the driver has to be installed - sorry Marsu, but I do not understand your, nor the author's instructions.
Fred, can you please help?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Mar-2000

Sorry, Haymo, I don't have Win98. For Win95, I simply right-clicked on the oemsetup.inf file, selected Install, and that was that. Double-click the .exe and away it goes.

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 13-Mar-2000

Hello Haymo,

To add the Piano driver to Win98, go to Add New Hardware in the control panel.

Click "next" until you are asked whether the new hardware is in the list, then choose "no". (Or, if no new hardware was already found on your system, you will be asked if you want to search for it. You don't.) Whatever is presented, don't search your system, just get straight to the bit about
choosing hardware from a list. (Depends on what's on your system as to what screens will be presented to you.)

Once you have the list, scroll down the category list to "Sound, video and game controllers" and click "next". Now you will be able to use "have disk" button and go find your Piano driver. It should install without issue.

Hope this helps,

Sue

Reply 3 offered by: Haymo van Wyk on 22-Mar-2000

Thank you, Fred and Sue.
Fred, your instructions seemed to work, and
Sue your instructions worked beautifully,
Piano is installed on my computer.

But, please help a dunce who has never used MIDI input:
Please spell out, step by step, how to use PIANO and how does one get notes played in Piano to register in NWC?

Since posting my first request for help, I've upgraded to NWC 1.70 b2h and I'm very happy to be able to force a system break. My thanks to the development team.


#1466: Songfile Concatenation
Songfile Concatenation

(1466)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 09-Mar-2000

9 Mar 00
I would like to be able to connect all or part of one songfile with another one. Using instructions on pages 29-30 I'm getting what I want on to the Windows clipboard, but am denied the paste option either in NWC editor or Windows' WordPad editor. Can someone help?
Thanks, RCV

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Mar-2000

You have to do this from within the score editor, and you have to do it one staff at a time.

Reply 2 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 09-Mar-2000

9 Mar 00
Thanks for the reply. Regular copy/paste does indeed work for one staff at a time (pasting to current or new songfile); but Special Copy does not paste, although it appears to put multiple staffs on to the Windows clipboard.
RCV


#1467: Arpegio's
Arpegio's

(1467)

Submitted by: Drake Kay on 10-Mar-2000

Is it possible to create a four note (or more) Arpegio, where each note sounds to the end of the last note in the arpegio? And also to adjust the time of each notes starting point within the arpegio?
The effect is to recreate a guitar chord played fast and like an arpegio.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Mar-2000

The simple solution is to use grace notes that are tied to each note in the chord. You can't control the timing this way.

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 10-Mar-2000

Why couldn't you just build the arpeggio through chords which are tied to the final chord. For example, on count one, enter one fast note (32nd or 64th), with a tie, then enter that same note, plus the next note of the arpeggio in a chord, etc... until you've built to the full chord.
G
D D
B B B
G tied to G tied to G tied to G

Another possibility might be to use "pedal down" and "pedal release" under the insert menu.

Reply 3 offered by: Shane Turner on 10-Mar-2000

That's how I used to create strumming effects.. by using a tie on progressively bigger chords. its kind of a pain.. try using the recording feature instead (unless you don't have a keyboard)

Reply 4 offered by: chris on 11-Mar-2000

Sorry that my first post came out wrong, the letters of the chords should have shown up as stacked G, then G-B, G-B-D, etc.... However, I tried the pedal feature and it gives the exact same effect. Just start with one note and keep adding/stacking the chord (using whatever rhythms you wish). Before the first note, enter pedal down, under insert menu (or keyboard shortcut U), then after the final chord, enter pedal release. This takes almost no time and is a snap to do.


#1468: noise in WAV recording
noise in WAV recording

(1468)

Submitted by: Thomas on 13-Mar-2000

Hi.

I've been trying to record my MIDI compositions to WAV using the OUT-to-IN method talked about on this forum, but I'm getting a lot of background noise. It seems like this method of recording is extremely sensitive. I have to lower the mixer volume to almost nil or I get distortion, and even at the lowest possible setting I'm getting the noise. Is there something I could be doing wrong, or is it likely because of my sound card (Yamaha OPL3 SAX), or is noise normal for this type of recording?

-T

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Starfield on 13-Mar-2000

It looks as if you are connecting the high level loudspeaker out to the low level microphone in. This can only result in a very noisy recording. Use line in and if possible line out. But why are you recording this way? See thread # 1003 in the off-line forum.

Reply 2 offered by: Thomas on 13-Mar-2000

Yes, I was using the microphone-IN. That didn't seem right to me either, but it was the only way I was able to get anything at all. For some reason, Line-IN isn't recording anything. I hope I'm identifying these connections right (I'm pretty clueless about this stuff). Basically, I've got the green, blue, and red connectors on the sound card, and it's my non-educated guess that green is OUT, blue is IN, and red is microphone. There are only 3.

I read the offline thread about MIDI to WAV before I started, and it appeared to me that connecting IN to OUT, starting a WAV recorder recording, and then starting the MIDI player playing was the best (in fact, only) way to get faithful recordings of Yamaha XG MIDI. All of the MIDI2WAV programs out there rely on their own sound fonts, which is not going to give me the results I'm looking for.

Thanks for your help!

-Tom

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Mar-2000

I suspect that your problem may perhaps have to do with your mixer settings. Check it out if your sound card has its own mixer applet. If not, it may hook into the native Windows Volume Control; bring up sndvol32.exe (on some systems it's a little icon in the system tray). When it comes up, it typically defaults to "playback volume" mode. To change to "Record Volume", select Options --> Properties --> and click on Recording. Make sure the available checkboxes are all enabled and click OK.

Unless your soundcard is really unusual, you shouldn't have to muck about with cables at all. For instance, on mine (a SB clone with a Yamaha daughterboard) the volume control for the midi signal output is shared with the CD player (under the perfectly valid assumption that you'd rarely, if ever, want to play midis at the same time as your CD player). On others it might be shared with the Line level volume control.

You can experiment with this as follows: if using CoolEdit, select Options --> Display Monitor VU level. This way you can see if the signal is getting to the wave input port. Then play a midi, and muck about with the various playback and recording volume controls.

Hope that something in this ramble points you in the right direction.

Reply 4 offered by: Thomas on 14-Mar-2000

Ahhhh ... I didn't know about the Options->Properties for changing to recording volume. Yes, Line-IN was in fact turned off. I haven't tried it yet but I have a hunch in should work now. I'll try it without cables first.

Thanks a billion!

-Tom

Reply 5 offered by: Charles Hall on 18-Aug-2001

Make sure your computer chasis is grounded corectly. Touch your hand to chasis and record a wave file. Did this reduce noise? Thats what I thought. check your computer ground path, and as a last resort attatch a wire from your computers chasis to a water pipe.


#1469: Track splitting.
Track splitting.

(1469)

Submitted by: David Gray on 13-Mar-2000

I have been unable to use the track splitting function, where a recording is split onto separate staves according to pitch ranges. On the Staff / Import Recording dialog, the Track Number field will not accept any value except zero.

I am recording to 'Buffer Only'. I have tried changing the Options / Import / Track Splitting Options, to no avail.

My MIDI keyboard is assigned to channel 1. My sound card is an AWE64. I am using NWC 1.70 beta 2H.

What am I doing wrong? Have I misunderstood what this function does?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 13-Mar-2000

The track number will always be zero, since only one track can be captured at a time by NWC during recording.

After you have recorded your performance, each invocation of the Staff | Import Recording will import a new staff into your song, based on that recorded performance. You can vary the pitch range to import muliple staves, usually for creating a left and right hand part of a single piano performance.

Reply 2 offered by: David Gray on 13-Mar-2000

Thanks.


#1470: Rehearsal Numbers/Score
Rehearsal Numbers/Score

(1470)

Submitted by: Nicole on 14-Mar-2000

I just got Noteworthy Composer and I have this major Transposing assignment due soon but for some reason I can't figure out how to add rehearsal numbers and how to make a score. I'm sorry but I'm totally clueless with this.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Mar-2000

You can add rehearsal marks using plain text; press 'x' to bring up the text insertion dialog; choose an appropriate font size, if you don't like how it looks you can select the text item and edit it by pressing CNTL-E.

If you want fancier-looking rehearsal marks (with little boxes around them) get the Boxmarks font from the Scriptorium http://www.vadu.com/nwc and click on the 'helpful files from other NWC users' link.

Printing your score is pretty much like any other Windows application, you click on File --> Print, or click the little printer icon in the tool bar. If you want to see what it's going to look like before you commit to paper, select File --> Print Preview.

I'd also suggest spending some time with the help system, unlike many applications which don't really help much, NWC has a very well designed and informative help system.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-Mar-2000

To get a good idea of how to set up your score click on menu File > New and select the Quartet Template.
Complete the Score Info dialogue box if you wish.

When you exit the Score Info box a four staff score of a string quartet will be displayed with the first staff (Violino 1) selected and highlighted.

Then click on menu Staff > Staff Properties (or press F2).

There are 3 tabs here:-
1. General
This is where you add the staff name, select/add the group (strings, woodwind etc.) and the type of ending bar (usually a section close but your piece may end with a repeat close).
2. Visual
Spacing above and below the staff (note positions) to control spacing between staves.
The type of staff -Standard, Upper or Lower Grand Staff (the one displayed is Orchestral).
A check box to enable layering the staff with the next staff below (leave this for now).
3.Midi
Leave the default values for most items to begin with.

Transposition:-
If your are entering staves from a transposed score you may have to change the value for the sound transposition for transposing instruments.
A clarinet (for example) is written 2 semitones above concert pitch - so you would enter the transposition as -2 to return the written note pitch to midi concert pitch.

Playback Device:- This arrow list will show the sound devices currently installed - select the device you wish to use.
If there are no devices listed go to menu Tools > Options > Midi (tab). A list of available sound devices on your system are shown in the left box.
The devices that are available to NWC for Playback are shown in the right box. If you highlight a device you can move it from between the left and right boxes using the ->> arrows between the boxes.

Channel - You can share a midi channel between the same instruments on different staves but if your score does not exceed 16 staves then assign a different channel to each part. The Playback Instrument box at top right allows you to assign an Instrument Patch to the channel selected.
Click on Change to see the Violin patch assigned here.

If your staff is a unpitched percussion instrument it must use Channel 10.
Pitched instrument should not use Channel 10.

To add more staves to the score click on the large + icon.
Each staff you enter should have:-
A Clef
A Key Signature (even if it is C major or A minor) otherwise transposition will not work correctly.
Time Signature.
Set up all Staff Properties by clicking on the staff to highlight it then press the F2 function key.

When you have your full score set and before you enter any notes and rests - Save the score in the Template folder so you can use it again when creating new scores.

Hope this helps - but do read the help files as Fred suggested.

Reply 3 offered by: Nicole Martin on 15-Mar-2000

Hey Guys, THanks so much for helping me.

I'm finally getting used to the program and I definatly will be reading the help files!!


#1471: Gong?
Gong?

(1471)

Submitted by: Damien Hall on 15-Mar-2000

I am sure the answer to this is apparant, but how exactly does one make a gong (tam-tam) sound?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 15-Mar-2000

This doesn't seem to be a standard MIDI sound. I have one sound font (27.3mg Symphony Hall Bank.sf2) that has a gong on Channel 10 at the lowest C# on the piano keyboard. This However, other sound fonts I have don't contain it.

If you have a card capable of playing soundfonts, you might look around (following the links from www.ntworthy.com) for one you like that contains this sound. Otherwise I don't know what to suggest.

If you do find a solution, please let us know. Good luck.

Reply 2 offered by: Damien Hall on 16-Mar-2000

Unfortunatly I only have the buggy Wingroove at my disposal (laptops aren't known for their excellent sound cards). I believe I remember reading somewhere where someone had come up with a marginal solution by combining the sound of a couple intruments (or playing something else at a very low tone).

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 16-Mar-2000

For about $40 U.S., you can get Audio Compositor. This can take .mid files and translate them into .wav files, bypassing your sound card entirely. It will read E-mu SoundFont 2.0 (.sf2) files as well as Kurzweil instrument files (.krz) and a couple of other types, then use the sounds contained therein to generate the .wav. Even if you then play this through your crappy old sound card, it'll probably sound a lot better than using the card to render the MIDI stream into sound directly.

There are probably other programs around that do this too. I got A.C. basically on Fred Nachbaur's suggestion. If you're interested you can find it at http://home.att.net/~audiocompositor/

See msg #1003 (reply 49) for Fred's comments.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Mar-2000

The tubular bells sound at low pitches makes a believable gong on my sound card.

Reply 5 offered by: Damien Hall on 16-Mar-2000

Perfect! Thank you Fred, I'll try this out.


#1472: adding song titles
adding song titles

(1472)

Submitted by: Cindy S on 15-Mar-2000

Is there a way to add song titles in the middle of a piece? I was arranging a medley and wanted to place the names of the songs at the beginning of each, but found I was unable to. I tried to use the Lyric function, but that didn't work very well, as it tried to follow the note patterns and messed up the spacing.

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 15-Mar-2000

Enter them as plain text, positioned above the stave.
Place the cursor at the position you want the text, pess
X, and enter your text string in the "Expression" box.
Adjust the Staff Position (0 is the centre, 7 is above
the staff). Turn off Preserve Width if you want to allow
notes to appear directly under your text.

Reply 2 offered by: Cindy on 16-Mar-2000

Thanks, I'll give that a try!


#1473: adding a heading
adding a heading

(1473)

Submitted by: Cindy on 15-Mar-2000

Is there a way to add the title of your piece to all of the pages, rather than just the first title page?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 15-Mar-2000

Only by using Insert Text, as described in the previous thread. You can insert text above the visible part of the screen, and see it in the printout. Use Print Preview to check it is where you want it. I suggest adding things like titles after the song is ready, as changes to the song can affect text position.

Reply 2 offered by: Cindy on 16-Mar-2000

Thank you

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Bowers on 16-Mar-2000

You can also add this request to the wish list.


#1474: Updates
Updates

(1474)

Submitted by: Cindy on 16-Mar-2000

I have a question about updates that maybe someone could answer. When the updates come out -how much do they cost/ Or does it vary from time to time?

By the way, I must say that I like this website/forum. I have been using NoteWorthy Composer since December, and I absolutely love it! This forum is very informative. I never receive as quick a reply from other websites as I have here!

Thanks!

Cindy

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Mar-2000

See http://noteworthycomposer/upgrade.htm

Your registration licenses you for all NoteWorthy Composer version 1.* releases that you download.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 17-Mar-2000

Yes, that means more than 5 years with many upgrades at no cost, since october of 1994, and such fantastic upgrades !


#1475: Sustained Note Fade
Sustained Note Fade

(1475)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 18-Mar-2000

18 Mar 00
I would like to fade a whole note tied to a dotted half in the next measure, from f(100) to p(10). Dynamic Variance doesn't seem to work, but it would appear that multi-point control (MPC) might. Please tell me what MPC settings and control placements to use, or suggest an alternative.
Thanks, RCV

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 18-Mar-2000

Are you using the 1.70 beta? If so, then place your cursor right before the whole note. Select the multi-point controller from the insert menu, or keyboard shortcut L. Under the MPC tab, set the controller to "volume," and the style to "linear sweep." At Setting: Initial: move the slide bar to 100. Click to check Setting 2 and set the time offset to 7. Then move that slide bar to 10. This will give you an even "linear sweep" which lasts for the 7 counts of your tied group and decreases in volume from 100 to 10.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Mar-2000

See also: msg #1126

Reply 3 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 19-Mar-2000

19 Mar 00
Hello Chris,
Many thanks for the MPC details... worked fine with NWC 1.70 2h!

RCV


#1476: Noteworthy to Finale?
Noteworthy to Finale?

(1476)

Submitted by: Paul Nordgren on 20-Mar-2000

I use Noteworthy since several years and am very happy about it. I'll probably never buy Finale, both because of the cost and because it's said to be very difficult to learn.

A friend of mine, however, uses Finale. Is there a way to create and send NWC files so that they can be imported into Finale?

Paul

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 20-Mar-2000

Finale is very powerful with lots of options. It is, correspondingly, more difficult to use. For my purposes, I found Noteworthy to be an ideal program.

Currently, a Noteworthy file could be exported to a midi format and the midi imported. Although I have not tried this, Finale does have a lyrics screen that might allow lyrics to be separately paste/copied from the Noteworthy lyrics screen. There may be some other folks out there who have actually worked regularly with both programs who can better comment on the matter.

I think there is NIFF format that has been proposed as a uniform standard. I am not sure, but that format may allow for transfer of lyrics between programs. Gurus like Fred Nachbauer, Sue Morton, or the like may have additional information in that area.

Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 20-Mar-2000

Guru? :> I think I'll let Fred stand alone in that category. But thanks for the vote of confidence!

Reply 3 offered by: chris on 20-Mar-2000

Paul-

I'd say you would have decent success exporting the file as a MIDI from NWC and importing into Finale (with regards to the notation, not so sure about how to do the lyrics). As I'm sure you've seen before, some MIDI files look like a nightmare on import, while others look pretty good without almost no editing. I think this is due to the difference in how the MIDI file was created. Those which were played in through a MIDI instrument will have all kinds of weird ties and note lengths, while those which were created with a notation and/or sequencer tend to be more precise. I have a friend who uses Finale, so I'll try to send him a NWC created MIDI file and see how it imports into Finale, and then let everyone know how it works.

Reply 4 offered by: chris on 21-Mar-2000

I exported several NWC scores as MIDI files and imported them into Finale 2000. For the most part, it worked well. For a couple of files, the import options in Finale had to be adjusted, but it ended up looking mostly like the original NWC score (grace notes didn't work, but imported as 16ths). A couple of the files were for saxophone quartet, so both the tenor and baritone sax parts imported into Finale as bass clef (which of course, in the MIDI, is where those notes would sound). However, overall, I'd say you could exchange files with your friend in this fashion reasonably well.

Reply 5 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 22-Mar-2000

Thanks a lot - I'll give it a try (and this fourm is wonderful).

Paul


#1477: Pitch Bend over an Octave
Pitch Bend over an Octave

(1477)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 20-Mar-2000

Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue begins with a continuous octave slide by clarinet, which I would like to simulate with NWC. My attempts using MPC Pitch Bend (which appears to be limited to a half tone) haven't worked. Is there a way?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Mar-2000

Short answer: no. The default pitch-bend as defined in the General Midi spec is +/- 1 whole-tone, or a total range of 4 semitones. Longer answer: If your synth supports the pitch-bend range controller, you could expand this to an octave, but it won't necessarily work on anyone else's synth or soundcard. Even so, you'd have to insert this using another program, since NWC (probably wisely so) doesn't offer this as one of the available controllers.

Longest answer - you can simulate this quite believably using many overlapping 4-semitone sweeps with volume fade-ins at the beginning and fade-outs at the end. The sweep sections would alternate between two different staves; the volume up on one overlaps with the volume-down on the other, for an almost seemless sweep for as long as you like.

I simulated the sound of a theremin using this approach, you can check it out by downloading

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/nwc/impendum.nwc

btw - Most players actually can't do a true glissando on that introduction to Rhapsody in Blue; the good ones play a chromatic scale for the first (lower) part, and only do a gliss on the last few notes at the top. This would be relatively easy to do in NWC. Only the truly amazing players can make a true gliss on this, and it should be noted that they use a very similar approach as outlined above -- a series of much shorter glisses that blend together apparently seamlessly.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 21-Mar-2000

That's a very good tip. How about adding it to the User Tips page ?

Reply 3 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 21-Mar-2000

Better yet, add this and other forum gems to the next version of the manual and helpfile where alphabetizing makes it easier to find.
RCV

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Mar-2000

Actually this exists, sort of, in the "offline Forum." It's arranged as a standard Windows Help file, so you can do all the usual things, like search and browse by topics or keywords. Well worth the download. Many a question has been answered for me by using this resource.

Another good resource is the newgroup archives, available from the Scriptorium. You just need a good text editor (not sure if WordPad would cut it; I use PFE) and then you can search for keywords or phrases.

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 27-Mar-2000

Fred,

I downloaded and tried your "impendum". It is a little jewel! (literal translation from french, but I hope it can be understood). Thank you for it.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Mar-2000

Thanks! :)


#1478: Guitar Cords
Guitar Cords

(1478)

Submitted by: Zoe on 20-Mar-2000

I was just wondering if there is any way to put the chords above the staff and like a slash or something for every chord played.

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 20-Mar-2000

Put your cursor where you want the chord name, then use insert text (keyboard shortcut X). In the 'Expression' window type in your chord name (i.e. C7, d min, etc...), and pick the 'Display Font' you want (maybe 'Staff Bold' for this function). You can do the same thing for the slash (using the forward slash key). If the text isn't large enough for your needs, use the page setup: fonts tab to set a user font to a larger point size. If you are interested in guitar tablature, then NWC doesn't directly have this. However, I have seen guitar tab fonts, which I'm sure you could download from somewhere on the net. After installing that font in your fonts folder, you can set that as another of your user fonts using the same procedure just described.


#1479: just a simple New line
just a simple New line

(1479)

Submitted by: Tamas on 21-Mar-2000

Hi to everyone!

I hope somebody is able to help me...
I want to insert a new line in a staff.
So I want the same staff to continue on the next line as you reach to the end.
For example I introduce a clef, a time notation, four notes, the same again but I want this second "group" to appear in a new line when I print.

I hope you understand.
Please help

thanks in advance
Tamas

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 21-Mar-2000

I can see two interpretations of what you say. Please excuse me, but I'm french.

1) You want to add another staff to the score.
-> Insert -> New Staff (or click on the [+] button in the toolbar)

2) You want do decide where the system break occurs.
-> This doesn't exist in current version, but you can have it in 1.70 beta.

Reply 2 offered by: Tamas on 21-Mar-2000

I wanted the second...
So it's not possible???

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 21-Mar-2000

It's possible in version 1.70, now in beta. I must say that I've found the various 1.70 beta versions quite stable for betas, and many of us in the NWC user community have already started using 1.70 for all our work, not just for testing.

So the answer is, yes, you can have what you want as long as you're willing to (a) wait until 1.70 becomes official, or (b) use a beta version of the product.

Reply 4 offered by: Tamas on 22-Mar-2000

And how can I get the beta version?
I didn't see it on the product home page.

Tamas

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Mar-2000

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcpreview

Reply 6 offered by: Tamas on 22-Mar-2000

Thanks for your answers.

Sincerely
Tamas


#1481: Choosing Music Notation Software
Choosing Music Notation Software

(1481)

Submitted by: Steve on 22-Mar-2000

Excuse the lengthly note, but wish to provide background:

Using Midisoft Session to get melody to midi, then wish annotate/print it for a choir. Frequently sing six+ parts, and wish to combine multiple voices per staff (where legible). Used to use NoteWorthy, but (the older version) did not allow for changing of font (to CP1251/Cyrillic) so switched to Passport's MusicTime. Am sufficiently frustrated with software to consider a switch/upgrade.

Features that concern me:

a) an ability to CUT n' PASTE lyrics
b) margin control (able to increase left/right margin - for holepunching -
but leave the others smaller)
c) during step entry: selection of note duration through "fast keys",
rather than point n' click (this is the only shortcoming of my choice
to use MidiSoft)
d) support for "legato" "staccato" and normal "note fill" (notice that
some programs generate notes that are "held longer")
e) vastly prefer support for long file names (currently my MusicTime
Ver 3 doesn't)
f) usually combine Soprano and Alto in one staff, and when typing the
lyrics under the resultant chord, MT3 wants me to double up lyrics
(ask for explaination if you need it) - current I work around this
by typing the lyrics under one voice, then cut n' paste the other
voices in after the lyrics are finished
g) must be able to select CP1251/Cyrillic fonts for lyrics, titles, etc
h) allow to lack of time signature; some chants require me to change the
time signature for every stanza - this could be a product of "folk
melodies", but wish to cover it too. If I didn't need to specific the
number of beats per bar, it would assist greatly
i) not extremely necessary; but would be handy to allow lyrics above the
specified staff (for short solo's, etc)

I realize that with my current set-up, there are work-arounds for most
of my problems, but am quickly determining that with all my work-
arounds, I might as well just use a draw program!

Thanks for your assistance, and feel free to email your constructive
advice/notes.

I will monitor the replies to all my postings, and subject to sufficient input,
will put a summary on the alt.music.midi newsgroup in a while.

Posted to:

Newsgroups: alt.music.midi,cakewalk.general

Cakewalk's site: http://www.cakewalk.com
Could not find a user forum other than the USENET groups

NoteWorthy's site: http://www.ntworthy.com
http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/active.htm

Passport's new owners' site: http://www.gvox.com
http://www.gvox.com/cgi-bin/Forum4/HTML/000013.html

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Mar-2000

Noteworthy supports all these things, if I understand them.

d) It supports Legato, Stacatto and default, but you have no control over them.

f) Multiple voices is supported with staff layering. You can give each layer is own set of lyrics, or assign two "verses" to a single layer.

h) Time signature may be omitted (defaults to 4/4), or hidden in the new 1.70 Beta. You can put any number of beats in a measure regardless of the time signature (unless you do the Audit Barlines command). As long as the number of beats matches, the bar lines will line up properly.

Unconditional YES to the rest.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Mar-2000

Hi Steve,

Since you've already used an older version of NoteWorthy, why don't you give the 1.70 beta version a test-drive yourself? As you probably know, V1.xx upgrades are free to registered users, and you can find out first-hand whether it will suit your purposes. Most if not all music software packages will have their own core of enthusiastic adherents, and in my experience NoteWorthy users tend to be more exuberant than most; take that into account also, if you get stuck with a "how the heck do I ... " there are lots of helpful folk happy to lend a hand.


#1482: A Quicker Way of Converting Midi into Wave
A Quicker Way of Converting Midi into Wave

(1482)

Submitted by: Kobina Ofosu-Donkoh on 23-Mar-2000

Is there a software that can quickly convert standard midis into wave, without going through the long recording process? Kind of like a ripper of midi to wave? I always have to use a recording software (Total Recorder) to record my midis as wave files, and that takes forever, since I have to play the entire length of the song. Please, help! Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 23-Mar-2000

Depending on the speed of your processor, and the density of your midi, you might get some speed improvement over real-time recording by using Audio Compositor. On simple midis (four or five voices) and a P300, it's typical to get about a 2:1 ratio.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 23-Mar-2000

I think it depends a lot on what sound file you're using. I used Audio Compositor on a P300 to process a midi with about 6 voices using a 60-meg soundfont bank and the process-to-playback ratio was more than 4:1. (It probably gets better with smaller sound files.)

Reply 3 offered by: Brian on 23-Mar-2000

You also might try WinGroove. The only draw back is that it uses its own voices (which are really nice, but not better than SB LIVE in my opinion) to build the WAVE with. Its between 2:1 to 3:1 for me and I'm on a P166.

http://www.cc.rim.or.jp/~hiroki/english


#1483: Legato: how long does the effect last?
Legato: how long does the effect last?

(1483)

Submitted by: Clive on 24-Mar-2000

Hi,

I wonder if someone could kindly tell me how long the "legato" effect lasts for after insertion?

How do you revert back to the "normal" performance style?

Thanking all in advance, Clive

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 24-Mar-2000

The legato and staccato performance specifications last until you turn them off again. Any other performance spec reverts to the marcato performance style.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Mar-2000

The effect lasts for the entirety of the staff, or until you change the performance style to something else. It does not have an impact on any other staves in the score.

Reply 3 offered by: Clive on 24-Mar-2000

Dear NW-online,

Is the effect of "legato" terminated when another style is inserted, even if the latter style has no effect upon the style of performance?

Thank you, Clive

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 25-Mar-2000

Empirically, yes. I tried "cantabile", which certainly does the trick.


#1484: Sound Recording
Sound Recording

(1484)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 24-Mar-2000

This is a little off-topic, but I am trying to make MP3 files from an old record. Does anybody know of a good sound recording program that accepts microphone input? The built-in Windows recorder is useless, and things like RealJukebox only work for CD's.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 24-Mar-2000

I like CoolEdit (I use both the 1.53 16-bit version and CE96). Their current version is CE2000, but is over four times as big as CE96. I understand that CE96 is still available at some shareware sites.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Mar-2000

I'm green here - but does the line in work as a recording input.

Reply 3 offered by: Sue Morton on 24-Mar-2000

On an SB Live, line-in works terrific as a recording source, and much less "noisy" than mic-in. I'd assume that would be true for other cards as well.

Blair, you might look at www.tracertek.com, they've some inexpensive products specifically for recording and cleaning up old vinyl in preparation for making your own CD or MP3.

Good Luck,

Sue

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Mar-2000

If you are recording line levels, then the "Line In" is what you should use for input. If you are using one of those 1/8" plug microphones, that should be plugged in to the MIC input.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 25-Mar-2000

Thanks. I will try these out and see how well they work.

Reply 6 offered by: Bruno HECQUARD on 31-Mar-2000

Could you indicate on what kind of media is your "good old days record"?
Depending on the source, you will have to choose the mic input or the line Input, may be through your HIFI system if its a vinyl record.
If it's a vinyl record, you could benefit from the use of specialized recording software like CD Spin Doctors. This application is part of the Adaptec Easy CD Creator "DE LUXE" Suite, usually delivered with a lot of CD recorders. It includes an automatic track separation utility based on the silence between tracks and also an optionnal "scratch" removing utility, specially intended to clean old records. You need free disk space as it first records to memory, then performs track separation and cleaning before saving to .wav files. You would then need to download from the web an .wav to .mp3 converter.

Good luck
Bruno

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Mar-2000

I am using an ordinary vinyl record. Is it better to use the line out from the tape deck, or the mic? And can I get the software you mentioned without owning a CD recorder?

Reply 8 offered by: Fred on 31-Mar-2000

Assuming you have a magnetic (aka "dynamic") cartidge on your turntable (most do), you'd be best off taking the signal from your "Tape out" or "Record Out" outputs from your stereo, and feed into the line-in jack on your audio card. The reason is that magnetic cartidges have to be equalized to give the proper frequency response.

You'd get sound by running the magnetic cartridge directly into the mic input, but the frequency eq. will be all wrong; it'll sound excessively bright and tinny, no bass to speak of.

If you don't have a CD burner, you can still record the wav file, edit it/ noise reduce, etc. and convert to mp3.

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Mar-2000

Here is what I do:

I connect the turntable to the proper input on a stereo receiver, then use the tape output (which is a line level) to send the signal to the Line In of a sound card. The stereo balances the turntable input, and usually provides the necessary ground terminal (I assume you have a 3-wire out from the turntable).

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Mar-2000

That makes sense. Now, to find the right software to remove the crackles and pops.

Reply 11 offered by: Grant on 03-Apr-2000

If you have $100 to burn, you might check out DARTPro 32 (http://www.dartech.com). I've used this and it's great for pops & clicks. I've had some trouble removing low-level surface rumble (not hiss), but I don't know if there's *any* software that handles that well. They also have a $50 package (DART CD-Recorder Version 3 Plus) with many of the same features, which would probably also serve, and a $400 product (DART Pro 98) that has a lot of cool things you probably don't need.


#1485: adding Russian and Greek true fonts
adding Russian and Greek true fonts

(1485)

Submitted by: Larkin Griffin on 25-Mar-2000

I read the comments by the European users of NoteWorthy Composer, and I must agree with them. NoteWorthy Composer would be enhanced by the inclusion of fonts from languages other than English. Please, is there any way to make the program recognize Russian and Greek true fonts from Windows95? I successfully added those fonts to Windows95, but they still are not showing on the NWC listing.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 25-Mar-2000

You can add any font you like to NWC. There are four user-definable font slots (User 1 through User 4). Click on one of them, then Edit. I suggest using User 3 and / or User 4 for this, since many of us use User 1 and User 2 for the native NWCV15 font and Boxmarks, respectively.

You can even edit NWC's "system" font assignments if you like. Note however that this will also change the font used by the applicable system action; example, if you change "Page Title Text" to another font, this is the font that will be used for the page title.


#1486: Bach's Badinerie
Bach's Badinerie

(1486)

Submitted by: Sterghios Moschos on 25-Mar-2000

Hi people. I have been doing an exhaustive search for Bach's Badinerie on the net as a MIDI file. Certainly, I have found loads of versions, others good, others bad. However they all suffer a fundamental flaw; they lack the introductory moderato part before going into the allegro melody, we all are so familiar with. It is strange, since all the CDs I have listened to and my guitarist's guitar scores have the moderato part. If anyone has a MIDI inclusive of the moderato part, I would be very grateful if you could forward it to me or tell me where to find it.

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 26-Mar-2000

Sterghios,

"Badinerie" is just another descriptive form, rather than
the title of a specific piece

I'm guessing that the Badinerie you refer to is the
finale from the J.S. BACH Orchestral Suite #2 in B Minor,
BWV 1067.

That would mean that the "introductory moderato part" is
most likely the Minuet (previous movement) from the same suite?

A quick search found several MIDI versions at
http://www.prs.net/bach.html including the complete Suite by P.&B.Párkányi. I downloaded movements 6 (Minuet) and 7 (Badinerie) and loaded them into Noteworthy. Without my
score I can't be certain, but they look complete with all
parts present and correct. The MIDI is clean, with no
cross staves and only a few weird note lengths (for the
grace notes) using a straight default import into
Noteworthy. The ornaments sound correct but might need
adjusting for a clearer printed score.

While you're there, why not download the entire suite and
hear it in the context that Bach intended?

Reply 2 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 27-Mar-2000

John,

Thanks for the lead. I apologise for the misuse of the term but I lack in-depth knowledge of the various terms, as I am not a proffessional musician, rather a hobbyist (I hate this particular term too, but, lets face it, I am) that slowly learns on his own amongst being engrossed in research science!

I will follow your suggestion about listening the whole suite, yet I bet it is nothing on MIDI as compared to an orchestra playing it. Strange, why do people that organise those Bach collections or "Summer Classics" and stuff like that put only excerpts and not the whole thing? I know they are really big, yet as you suggest, the audience miss out on the beauty of the whole story.

S

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 28-Mar-2000

Sterghios,

>Strange, why do people that organise those Bach
> collections or "Summer Classics" and stuff like that
> put only excerpts and not the whole thing? I know they
> are really big, yet as you suggest, the audience miss
> out on the beauty of the whole story.

Interesting point. I think the answer is because that's
what sells. People only want to hear the bits they know,
so that's all anyone plays, so that's all people know etc..
I self fulfilling cycle that winds us into smaller and
smaller exerpts, perhaps for shorter and shorter attention
spans.

I had a sudden "realisation" recently that most of the
music my concert band plays now is "medlies of popular
hits". When I first started playing in bands they
certainly existed, but they were relatively rare. Now they
seem to dominate.

Now, I don't want to go all purist and insist that if
you're going to listen to a Beethoven symphony then it must
be the COMPLETE symphony (with all repeats, at Beethoven's
tempo markings, no matter how ludicrous, and played only on
"authentic" instruments played in an "authentic" style).
Far from it, but I worry that by only concentrating on
the popular bits, people miss out on so much!

Reply 4 offered by: Sterghios on 31-Mar-2000

John,

You are quite right. I think it all really started with that "hit" collection called "Hooked on Classics" back in the 80's. At least that is when I noticed it.

It is nice though to see that people far from this genre of music have come closer to it by this fragmentation of the compositions. I happen to be more of a rocker than a classical music fan though I have started to listen increasingly more and more to classical music. What that made me realise was that more and more of what are known as underground metal bands (those groups of two to six (or sometimes sixteen!) teenagers that want badly to play non-mainstream/pop/recored-label-favouurite music) that I follow religiously as quite a few of them are very competent and imaginative musicians, are starting to make covers of excerpts of classical compositions, or even better, marrying the two genres together.

You probably think, oh my God, Sacrilege! But, I assure you, it is very pleasant actually and very original. Should this intrigue you as a concept, try to find CDs from bands like HAGGARD (a hungarian 15-member band with strings, harps, harp, brass, distorted guitars, base and drums), PROMETHEAN (room style music with distorted guitars, drums, string section and a flute - get their first CD), THERION (operetic metal - get the Theli CD or the next one), SEPTIC FLESH (operetic metal), etc. etc.

Of all, I suggest Promethean. I suggest you have a good look, since they are signed to some conspicuous european label that I cannot even remember its' name. Alternatively, I can make a few MP3s and send them to you.

S

Reply 5 offered by: Mathwhiz on 24-Jun-2001

I think Bach was bery cool.


#1487: note duration values stuck?
note duration values stuck?

(1487)

Submitted by: Bill on 27-Mar-2000

I have a problem on "play" feature. At a specific point in score, a written whole notes continue to sound (like a drone on bagpipe)as though it is stuck, until I "stop" play. This happens when using Yamaha PSR 510 as midi playback and when selecting the sound card of my computer for midi play back. Please share any/all suggestions you may have.

Thanks

Bill

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 27-Mar-2000

By far the commonest cause of the "stuck note" phenomenon is tying a note to another note of the same written pitch but a different accidental (e.g., b-flat to b-natural). This is especially common when the tie crosses a bar line, and the accidental is placed on the first note but not on the second.

The problem is compounded by the fact that the accidental wouldn't be displayed on the second (tied-to) note even if it were present, so there's no way visually to tell that it's missing (except perhaps highlighting the note, if it's not part of a chord, and looking to see whether the one of the accidental note tools is selected).

Reply 2 offered by: Bill on 28-Mar-2000

Grant: Thank you for reply - your suggestion is "right-on target", I made the correction and it works. I still don't know why NWC doesn't recognize accidentals tied across a bar line or why that caused the tone to stick but thanks to you, I can now correct it. Its nice to have smart and helpful people on the forum.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Mar-2000

Another cause of stuck notes can be use of the Pedal controller. Though it's not the original poster's difficutly, I'm adding this here because it might be found by someone reading this thread in the future.

I discovered it while debugging a stuck note problem in the game I'm helping out with; leaving one particular scene would cause a long sustained note (using the Pedal controller) to hang into the next midi (using DirectMusic midi in DX7). The fix was to preface each midi file with a Reset controller (121), which instantly releases any hung notes and also fixes any potential problems with pitch bends, etc.

Reply 4 offered by: Eamonn FitzPatrick on 30-Mar-2000

I have had experience of the "stuck note" problem also, but found quite by accident, that if I stopped the playback and started it again the problem was solved ! In most cases I've come across, the problem occurred when the first note of a piece was tied, especially across a bar line.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 30-Mar-2000

Eamonn - I'll bet that if you examine your tied notes, you'll find that they have different accidentals. I've never encountered stuck notes involving correct ties (between notes of the same pitch).


#1488: Using the noteworthy software
Using the noteworthy software

(1488)

Submitted by: Bill Cameron on 28-Mar-2000

March 28, 2000

Why can't I play something on my keyboard and have it notated on the computer so that it can be printed. I can do it using the computer keyboard only. Why? Please help ASAP.

Thank you,

Bill Cameron

Reply 1 offered by: Gio on 01-Apr-2000

First of all do you have a midi port in your sound card? if you do then thats good. right now second question, is it a midi keyboard? if yes this is also good. connect the keyboard to the computer and then install the keyboard as a midi input. the easiest way to do this is by opening noteworthy composer and to click on the keyboard button on the taskbar. Then follow the instructions when it says do you want to install a midi recording device and then when you want to record your peice use the keyboard to play it in after clicking the keyboard button, Hope it works!!

Reply 2 offered by: Bill Cameron on 07-Apr-2000

Thank you, for your help. I finally am able to play from my keyboard and have it printed. The only problem is that is doesn't print the rythms. Why? Is there something that I can do to make it prints the rythms as played? When the tune is played back, it is played back as it was recorded.

Thank you, for your help in this matter.

Sincerely,

Bill Cameron

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Apr-2000

It is not totally clear what you mean by "doesn't print the rythms" in your message. Perhaps you are using "step time" note entry, rather than real time note entry. You should be using the Tools | Record command to record your performance, after loading up a rhythm or metronome source for use during your recording. For more details, refer to page 27 of the latest NWC User's Guide.

Reply 4 offered by: LG: Life's Good on 14-Apr-2000

I think you need to adjust the 'quantization'
Set it to quarters or eights or make a metronome track and record to it.

PS: was anyone else born in a log cabin?


#1490: Problem (Bug?)
Problem (Bug?)

(1490)

Submitted by: Stefan D'Amollito (Italy) on 31-Mar-2000

Hallo forum.

I have tried out the Noteworthy Composer program and the least I have to say is that it is an excellent tool for scripting and composing in MIDI sequence, particularly for the price it comes in. However I came across a problem, that could nevertheless be my own ignorance in the use of the application. In my attempt to use a different patch from the soundcard, that patch being on a different bank, I ticked the select a different bank option, and gave the appropriate numbers in the boxes, the left box being the bank, the right box being the patch. I cross checked the numbers to be sure that I had given the right values, and that I had done. But the patch, not the bank, the patch did not change no matter what value I gave it. This was resoluted by selecting one name from the list in the options above, where the GM samples names are shown.

I assume that to be a program problem, so I decided to present it here. I suppose the soundcard is not a problem, as I tried the same on an SBLive! and a YamahaXG, with the same results.

Gracie

Stefan

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 31-Mar-2000

Stefan - The two boxes are the Midi Controllers 0 and 32.
They are used in different ways by different soundcards to address the banks on the soundcard.
They are NOT bank and patch numbers.

If you have one of the SB family of cards (AWE32/64 etc.) you use only the Controller 0 box to address the bank no. leave the 32 box at zero.
Select your patch from the patch list above.

Reply 2 offered by: Stefan D'Amollito on 01-Apr-2000

Thank you Mr. Graham. One more question if I may. Is there a way to see a synopsis of all the basic elements for each staff, like a table of inforation for example? what I mean is a set of columns, giving staff name, staff number, and the various default midi properties assigned to each staff via the staff properties option? I think it would be very helpful for the designation of panning &c.

Stefan

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Apr-2000

Not exactly what you want - but you can get a list of all staves with some of what you need.
Just type R or use the menu item TOOLS > Score Review.


#1491: Lyrics - adding several verses
Lyrics - adding several verses

(1491)

Submitted by: Chris on 31-Mar-2000

Is it possible to create a page which has the lyrics for the first verse under the satff, an dthen the lyrics to teh next few verses underneath the staff - similar to the way you'd see songs written in a hymn book or fake book - other than by writing th elyrics out separately in a word processor and overprinting the page with the music on?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 31-Mar-2000

Sure. CNTL-L to get into the lyric editor dialog, configuration tab, select number of desired lyric lines. Then you go to each lyric tab to enter the verses. They will be printed 'on top' of each other in your printed output or print preview.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 31-Mar-2000

Noteworthy cannot print the extra verses underneath the score. You'll need to import the NWC-generated WMF file into WordPerfect or Adobe PageMaker (or your favorite desktop publisher or high-end word processor), and insert the extra verses with some other tool.

You're English, aren't you?

American hymnals generally put all verses between the staves, although some only put the first 3 or 4 verses there.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Mar-2000

Yes, it can be be done and it is almost easy. Just insert the lyrics you want using Insert Text (with the Lyric Font) under the last line in the song. The only hassle is the limitation in the amout of text you can insert. The way around this is to insert the verses in two columns, as is often done anyway.

It is best to do this after the song is laid out, otherwise the text will move.

Note to NWC Support: Can you increase the length of the text field so text can span an entire line?

Reply 4 offered by: John V, Settembrino on 12-Apr-2000

I finally found a music program that will allow me to do plain song. The problem I am having is installing lyrics. Musictime has an easy way to install lr\yrics but it would not allow me to do plain song. From what i read in these responses, you have to do a lot of cut and pasting. Happy I found noteworthy but very dissapointed in the lyric department. Please help!

Reply 5 offered by: Funk me baby on 14-Apr-2000

Hi John,

I had the same trouble as you... for a moment!
I simply noted the first verse, and then copied the page (in Print Preview) as a meta file.
I pasted this into Microsoft Word, and add paragraphs underneath for my other verses.
Noteworthy is the coolest!

FMB

Reply 6 offered by: Chris on 17-Apr-2000

Thanks for all the responses.


#1492: More sounds
More sounds

(1492)

Submitted by: Robert Young on 31-Mar-2000

How can you create sounds for midi. I've downloaded some, but how can you make them? If you understand what I am taling about, please help.

Reply 1 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 01-Apr-2000

Robert,

This question indicates that you lack experience in MIDI. Instead of hunting for answers in teh forum,. I suggest you go first through a on-line book about What is MIDI, how you use it, how you implement sounds (not necessarily of instruments) as what are calle dsamples (i.e. samples of the sounds) on your sample database device (or sampler) and how at the end of the day they can be used by a MIDI device to play music.

A very good online MIDI book is found at the MIDI Technical Fanatics Brainwashing Center http://www.borg.com/~jglatt/

I wish someone had directed me to it three years ago it would have not allowed the no-end misery of figuring out how the damned system works!

Good luck, and if you have any questions feel free to email me.

S


#1493: Using NWC teaching music
Using NWC teaching music

(1493)

Submitted by: Kjell Tangerås on 02-Apr-2000

I'm looking for people with some experience using computers in Music Education, Primary and/or Secondary School.

I myself have just started using NoteWorthy Composer teaching children at the age of 10-12.

Are there people somewhere who are experienced or are having interest in this topic?

Do you know about links that could be useful?

Kjell Tangeraas

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Apr-2000

There is an NWC v1.5 mini manual on the Scriptorium that you are free to download and print out.
It might be a useful guide for your students.
I think the address is http://www.vadu.com/nwc
but if I'm wrong someone will correct me (they usually do).


#1494: Drum notation
Drum notation

(1494)

Submitted by: desperate on 02-Apr-2000

I'm working on a BIG project and need to find a drum notator. Something that works like Noteworthy. Is there any other shareware I can buy that can do the job? It will also need to import some midi drum tracks. I am very desperate for this, and hope you won't mind asking here because I am a registered Noteworthy user and have contributed to this forum occasionally.

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 02-Apr-2000

I don't do much with percussion, so please forgive if I'm off base here...

When you say you want to find a 'drum notator', are you really saying you're looking for something that will generate canned rhythms into MIDI for you?

If I have understood correctly, Band-in-a-Box can probably do most/all of what you need.

If I have not understood, well, sorry I wasn't much help!

Sue

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Apr-2000

There is a utility in the Scriptorium that will convert a midi drum track to notation (or drum notation to a midi drum track).
You will find it at http://www.vadu.com/nwc

There are two versions - one written in Qbasic and another written in Visual Basic.

If you need help with this contact me.

Reply 3 offered by: desperate on 06-Apr-2000

I need Xs for the drum track... can I do this easily with Noteworthy or is there a specifically shareware drum notation program that I can use as a companion to Noteworthy. please, please, please, let there be one

Reply 4 offered by: Fiona Wilkinson on 14-Nov-2000

Hi there - I'm also desperate for a drum notation software that will work in tandem with NWC, once which includes Xs and everything else. I've tried that DrumKit software from Scriptorium but unfortunately after downloading the zip I can't seem to open the .exe file (Run time error). I'm using Windows 95. How can I download DrumKit and will this software notate the drum parts correctly using the Xs?

Many thanks
Fiona

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Music on 14-Nov-2000

I believe that what Fiona and other users would like to see is not what the "drum kit" does, unless I misunderstand its usage. What is needed is the ability to have the notes on a staff appear as X-heads if the staff property is chosen as "drum," or something like that.

Reply 6 offered by: Artur on 17-Nov-2000

Sometimes, (if that serves as consolation) not even great editors (such as Dover and Breitköpf & Härtel) use drum notation with diferent note heads, they just put notes in the first and/or last space of a stave and that is the part playing. But that happens in scores with symphonies that I've seen and they are usually for triangolos and etc.

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 17-Nov-2000

Don't credit Dover with any special music publishing expertise. They're just a bunch of guys with a stack of public-domain scores and a Xerox machine.

Reply 8 offered by: Art Thompson on 17-Nov-2000

If your writing drum notation,that is x's for drumheads, what do half notes and whole notes look like?

Reply 9 offered by: Joe Music on 17-Nov-2000

An X with stem (and possibly flags or beams) would represent quarter notes and those of shorter duration. An open-style X, rather like a very bold X with white paint stripes in the center of the strokes, represents the note-head for half or whole notes; except that the half-note has a stem.

I do not know if that is standard. But I have seen it. The problem is that at low resolution, it is difficult to discern the open crosses.

Reply 10 offered by: Grant on 17-Nov-2000

Another option is to use a standard open notehead with an x inside it. (I don't know whether I've actually seen this or just now made it up, but, either way, it seems to make sense.)

Reply 11 offered by: Fred on 17-Nov-2000

As an interesting side-note, the Selkirk College Professional Music Program (originally an offshoot of Berklee) in the town where I live encourages drummers to be familiar with standard notation (ordinary everyday noteheads) in addition to the x-shaped noteheads. It makes me wonder whether this is not at least partially due to limitations in existing midi scoring programs (the school uses Performer, which AFAIK doesn't support x-shaped heads either).

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Nov-2000

The 'x' is used to denote a cymbal.
A crash cymbal is a 'x' within a circle.
Open hi-hat can also be written this way but most often + and ° above the note are used to denote closed and open.
Durations of half note(minim) and whole note(semibreve) use the open note shaped like a diamond.
Drums with skins use the normal noteheads.

One problem of drum notation is that it's non-standard.
From my experience the position of crash, ride and hi-hat cymbals - snare, bass and tom-toms seems to be fairly standardized among arrangers here in Oz so I don't have problems when copying for them - but from reading books and scores from other countries there does seem to be variations.
Some of this is discussed in the text file that comes with the Drumkit program available on the Scripto.

I'm not a drummer - but correct non-verbal communication between composer/arranger and drummer is essential when you depend on the part to convey the message.
Providing the notated parts in the correct form for a drummer is just as important as when writing for any other instrument.

Most high-end midi score programs (and some less expensive ones) support drum notation including mapping between midi and notation staff positions.
They also provide rhythm markers for guitar and piano comping.

Unfortunately NWC does not provide support in software for these items.
"Point me to the wish list"!!


#1495: 10 Instrument Orchestration Layout in Noteworthy??
10 Instrument Orchestration Layout in Noteworthy??

(1495)

Submitted by: Mike Jutan on 02-Apr-2000

Hi everyone!

I'm doing a project for school which requires me to expand a piano piece into a full orchestration for 10-12 or so instruments (i.e. Piccolo, Flute, Bassoon, Clarinet, Bass Clarinet, Alto, Tenor, Bari Sax, Trumpet, Horn, Trombone, Tuba)

For this, I need to create a score with all the parts on it. As you all probably know, the "groups" of instruments must be attached together on the score (right after the name of the instrument, i.e. Sax Family is together, etc.)

How do I do this in Noteworthy? If you know what I can do please email me at sprinter@hotmail.com!

Thanks a lot!!
Mike :)

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 02-Apr-2000

Mike-

Under staff properties (F2) for each staff, select style as orchestral. This will give you bar lines which run from the top part through the bottom, which is standard for band and orchestra scores. To separate the instrument groupings, under staff properties, set the staff vertical sizes (listed as upper and lower) to a larger number between each group. For example, set the lower vertical size for bass clarinet at 15, and the upper vertical size for alto sax at 15 also. This will give you a nice visual separation between the groupings. You should also select showing staff labels for at least the first system under page setup. If you want to add group names to the right of the staff labels, you can do this by using right justified text insertion (available in the 1.70 beta version). However, it can be hard to get the spacing right when doing that. I'd say that the staff lables alone should be sufficient to make a nice score.


#1496: More Realistic Timpani
More Realistic Timpani

(1496)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 02-Apr-2000

I was looking for a softer sounding tuned-drum than the General MIDI Timpani patch produces (especially with fast drumbeats), and found Steel Drums (#115) to be an improvement. Feedback?

RCV

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-Apr-2000

The GS soundsets and many of the GM soundfonts have tuned timps on patch 48 (or 49 depending on the patch number system) on the Channel 10 percussion channel.
These may be better than the timps in the GM timp patch.

Reply 2 offered by: RCV on 03-Apr-2000

Hello Barry,
Thanks for the response. But how do you get a tuned anything on Channel 10?

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 03-Apr-2000

Patch 48/49 is the Orchestral drum patch, and it assigns all notes between low F (the space directly below the bass staff) and the the F one octave higher to timpani at notated pitch.

Be aware, though, that not all cards may support this patch. For example, my PC at home (SB32 AWE Gold) does; the noname card in my PC at work seems not to.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 03-Apr-2000

P.S. for more info on the Orchestral drum patch (and several others) see the file drum.nwc in the Helpful Files section of the NWC Scriptorium:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#NWCFiles


#1497: adjust position of rests within staff
adjust position of rests within staff

(1497)

Submitted by: Christian Wollin on 03-Apr-2000

Is it possible to adjust position of rests within the stave in NWC ?
Thanks
Chris

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Apr-2000

In the future, consider asking your question in only one place, so it is easier to locate the answer.

From the newsgroup:

-------------------
You can shift rests vertically with shift control up/down arrow or select the rest and change its vertical offset in its properties box.

HTH
Peter
-------------------
In version 1.55, you can enable experimentation (Tools | Options) then edit a rest's properties by selecting it and pressing Ctrl+E.

In the next release (1.70), you can move a rest by simply selecting it and using Ctrl+Shift+Up/Down arrow keys. Version 1.70 is currently in beta, and can be found via the "What do you want to do?" box on our home page.

-> http://noteworthysoftware.com


#1498: MIDI notes and acoustic notes
MIDI notes and acoustic notes

(1498)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 04-Apr-2000

I have recently become aware that the MID note system is far from the acoustic note system, i.e. on the full piano fretboard the lowest note is not the lowest note MIDI can produce &c. On the page I read that, it also said that the note numbering that was given from program to program in relation to rela notes differed, resulting to G1 being G-2 in some MIDI's &c.

Has anyone got a comprehensive list of the MIDI notes in relation to acoustic ones for NWC (staff positions included)?

Additionally for the guitar specifically, are the piano middle C, which ???? on MIDI starting with 1 and ????? on NWC (staff position for the G key please)?

Thanx for the help,

S

PS: I am asking because I come across piano patches that the same note on the fretboard produces sounds differening by an octave in different patches.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Apr-2000

Midi has 128 notes 0 - 127 this is more than the standard 88 note keyboard so the range extends beyond the normal piano.
For this reason many midi manufacturers ignore the lower end and start the Cn number system an octave (sometimes 2) above the base midi note so it more or less aligns with the keyboard.
NWC documentation does not do this but uses the full midi range from C0 to G10 (0 to 127) and adopts Middle C as C5.
The note above is C#5 and the note below B4.

This places C3 two lines below the Bass staff.
C4 in the 2nd space from the bottom in Bass staff.
C5 as described.
C6 in the 3rd space from the bottom in Treble staff.
C7 two lines above Treble staff.

Many sequencers refer to Middle C as C4 and some as C3.

The guitar is a non-transposing instrument but like the double bass sounds an octave lower than the written note for the instrument. (On the other hand a piccolo sounds an octave higher than it's written note even though it is technically a non-transposing instrument).
A guitar playing written C5 (line below Treble Clef on the guitar part) sounds as C4 at concert pitch.
The low E string on the guitar (written 4 spaces below the Treble staff) sounds as E3 - one line below Bass staff.

Hope this helps!

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 05-Apr-2000

>>The guitar is a non-transposing instrument . . .

Not if you adopt the standard definition of "transposing". I've seen plenty of references to guitars, piccolos and double basses as transposing instruments. Their parts are easy to read compared to other transposing instruments because they're in the same key as the nontransposing instruments. But they're not notated *at* their actual pitch, but an octave higher or lower - which makes them transposing instruments.

The definition of "transposing instruments" in the New Grove begins: "Instruments for which the music is not notated at the actual pitch of the sound, but is transposed upwards or downwards by some specific musical interval. Transposition is traditionally reckoned relative to the pitch C; an instrument 'in C' is non-transposing (or transposing by an exact number of octaves), and an instrument, for example, 'in F' sounds F when C is notated." The parenthetical case covers guitars et al.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Apr-2000

Why should I argue!
Guitar is a transposing instrument Sterghios.
I'm so sorry for the misinformation - but I guess that was not the core of your question.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 05-Apr-2000

So sorry. Next time I'll try to correct misinformation only if it's directly relevant to the specific question at issue.

Reply 5 offered by: Sterghios on 11-Apr-2000

Thanks guys - both.

I believe that the forum's goal is really the discussion of ideas and knowledge so Grant, don't think that your input is not welcome. The more we know and learn the better. And it also corrects us from making mistakes. Indeed, I personally prefer seeing a discusiion under a topic diverting a bit, as in that way information related (not necessarily closely) to the topic is also presented and discussed.

Thanks for the help. Maybe this thread, a bit corrected should be added into the Help file or User's tips pages for future reference. What do you think Support?


#1499: Trombone voice too soft?
Trombone voice too soft?

(1499)

Submitted by: Steve T. on 04-Apr-2000

If you're writing a piece with a trombone part in it, and you want the trombones to be heard without reducing the volume of the other instruments (since the trombone voice is too soft... I'm a trombone player and always play out), simply change the voice to trumpet instead of trombone. This will make it sound louder. This works in part because trumpets and trombones are directly related as brass instruments. Anyone that's played either a bass trumpet or soprano or alto trombone can attest to that.

Also, the trumpet voice works well for tuba parts as well.

Reply 1 offered by: HC11 Eater on 14-Apr-2000

When I run out of channels (my synth has 8) I also put french horns on the trumpet patch. There is an advantage of doing this sometimes if the patch doesn't sound right when you play it in it's real life range. (like as Steve suggested, Tuba sounds good on a trumpet patch)


#1500: Glissendo ?
Glissendo ?

(1500)

Submitted by: Peter Din on 05-Apr-2000

Hello

On one violin part, I must scribe a glissendo for G to D7. Is it possible to
write that on NWC ?

Thanks

Peter Din

Reply 1 offered by: Steve T. on 06-Apr-2000

Using multi-point controllers, at least as far as I'm aware, no. They don't go that far down. Sorry.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 06-Apr-2000

You have to do it step-wise. Pitch-bend mpc's can go +/- two semitones, for a total of four semitones per step. A good way to do it is to have two staves on different channels, but with the same volume, pan and instrument patch settings. Use short volume fades to overlap the steps. You can do very believable glissandos with as great a total interval as you want (or have the patience for) using this approach.

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 11-Apr-2000

Yet another very helpful user tip, as presented in teh earlier thread concerning the use of NWC exclusively. I have tried it after seeing the presented example .nwc file, and admittedly it is tiring, but efficient in overcoming the limitations of MIDI. How does one overcome the flange effect that is produced though at the points we both staves play in union?

S

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Apr-2000

Unfortunately, the flange effect can't be eliminated completely because of the non-zero time between sending two midi events even with the same "midi" time. (It is, after all, a serial protocol). However, it can be minimised somewhat by 1: putting a slight stereo pan difference on the two channels used for shuttling back and forth, but not enough to be distracting, 2: making the volume fade-ins as short as practical (example; if the gliss is happening over a half-note per four-semitone sweep, try an overlap of 1/16 or even 1/32 note for the volume sweep up/down). 3: If possible, use an instrument that does not approximate a pure sound; the "whistle" sound I used to simulate a theremin is probably the worst-case scenario. On more complex sounds (string ensemble, etc.) the flange will not be nearly as noticeable.


#1501: Accessing additional percussion banks in soundfont
Accessing additional percussion banks in soundfont

(1501)

Submitted by: Bill Griffith on 05-Apr-2000

I have an SB Live Value card and am experimenting with different soundfonts. It's really mindboggling after having had an AWE64!

There's one thing I haven't been able to do with NWC, though. A lot of the big soundfonts have several different percussion banks (bank 0 may be rock drums, bank 1 may be jazz drums, etc.), and yet I can't access any but the first.

I've tried every combination I could think of in NWC's MIDI staff properties, but I only ever get the first percussion bank.

An example: My soundfont has 128 melodic instruments + 5 percussion banks. Patch 0 is the first percussion bank; patch 1 is the Acoustic Grand Piano; Patch 2 is the Bright Acoustic Piano; etc.

How do I access percussion banks 2-5? I've tried changing the patch bank with Controller 0, Controller 32, and both, and have tried combining those changes with different patch selections (which end up being nothing or melodic instruments).

MTIA

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 05-Apr-2000

The alternate banks aren't sequentially numbered. Try this: in Staff Properties, go to the Instrument tab, set the Patch List Type to "Numeric, 1 Based" and select 41, 49 or 57 from the patch list. 41 is the "Brush" patch, 49 is "Orchestra" and 57 is "Sound Effects".

There's a file at the Scriptorium that shows what sounds you should be hearing from each of these patches. Go to http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#NWCFiles and download "drum.nwc". I've tried these patches with my AWE64 Gold and they work like a charm.

Good luck!

Reply 2 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 11-Apr-2000

Another way of circumventing this that ignores the General MIDI protocol (and therefore will not sound the same as a .mid or .nwc file on another sequencer/pc) but is very easy to do and nifty in accenting drums properly is to create an extra melodic preset for each kit. You can add this to the same bank on the soundfont (if there is an empty slot) or another one. This is done via Vienna in Creative products. The benefit of this is that you can use any number of staffs to write the drum line on any number of channels, accenting each struck drum/cymbal as required on a per-staff basis. This increases the realism feel of the playback significantly.

Using channel 10 for drums means that you can send only one volume controller command at a certain time. E.g. You want a loud base drum (kick) with a soft crash cymbal sound to be played simultaneously (written as a chord). This cannot be done on one staff, for controllers regulate playback en masse, not specific notes on a a chord.

Lets say you write two staves, one for the kick and one for the cymbal and use different accent or volume controllers on each staff to be effected at the same time point, but both staves are played via channel 10. The synth will execute one of the two commands only resulting in either loud or quiet playback of both staves (i.e. both cymbal and kick). This is true even when you use an accent on one staff and a volume on another, since they control different MIDI controllers, but both send the message to the same channel, resulting probably in an average of the two commands being played back (low volume and fff accent result in low volume, loud volume but pp accent results in low volume).

If however you assign different channels to the different staffs, then the playback will be as required, since the controllers are directed to different channels and do not interfere with eachother. GM, however, will not playback drums on a channel other than 10, but piano. So you need to assign a melodic preset that actually contains a drumkit to that staff played on another channel. In this case, the two sounds will be played with the different volumes since the controllers are directed to different channels.

Needless to say that this is very helpful for variably interaccented chords on any instrument (different chord member notes played at different volumes) but I cannot think of an example of this. Humanisation is greater however if this is done in piano chords (simultaneous strike) as each finger in reality plays at a different volume (different attack velocity). Maybe this way will humanise the guitar chords better, as at low tempi, beamed 64ths do not resemble strums some times.

Just an idea.

S

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Apr-2000

"You want a loud base drum (kick) with a soft crash cymbal sound to be played simultaneously (written as a chord). This cannot be done on one staff, for controllers regulate playback en masse, not specific notes on a a chord."

Interesting - but I prefer the following method.

You can vary the note velocities since they are tied to each individual note.
Volume controller should be used for track volume (mix balance) not accents.
Dynamics (on melodic parts) should be implemented with Expression controllers - that's what the Expression controller is designed for.
Velocity should be used for accents.

Create the various percussion instruments on separate staves by all means but use velocity for the accents.
In your example the kick drum can be assigned a high velocity and the crash cymbal a lower velocity.
The velocity is assigned to the note not the channel so the distinction is maintained even when the drum and cymbal share the same channel.
You can then use Channel 10 for all the percussion output.

The same can be applied to piano chord or guitar chords which can be further enhanced by sliding the chord notes slightly apart in time to humanize the attack.

Reply 4 offered by: Sterghios on 11-May-2000

I apologise, but I fail to understand this. Can you be abit more clear? As I understand it, attack velocity marks how hard the keyboard is hit. In a soundfont, one can map samples based on attack velocity, right? Does therefore attack velocity correspond to mf, f, p, pp etc.? Or do these correspond to the Expresion controller? Because I always thought that the later holds true. Volume is the Hard MIDI controller and Expression is the soft (or something) MIDI controller effecting in a sense the same result, provided NWC does not include there some obscure humanisation algorhythm. If mf, ff etc. correspond to the expression controller, then how can one implement the Attack Velocity whilst scripting? In real instruments, the "attack velocity" corresponds to mf, f, pp etc., or am I wrong? And finally, ALthough I do use volume for track mixing and expressions (mf, fff etc.) for colouring (accenting), what benefit shall I reap by using the attack velocity?

S

Reply 5 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 12-May-2000

In NWC, dynamics markings (p, mp, f, ff...) affect attack velocity (a note attribute) and not Expression (a channel attribute).

So, in MIDI it is technically possible to have several notes in a chord with different attack velocities. To implement this in NWC though you need to use separate staves (tracks) mapped to the same MIDI channel and prefix different dynamics markings to each note in the chord.

BTW, the overall volume of a sequence in MIDI (at least in Creative's Live implemetation) is the sum of attack velocity, Volume controller and Expression controller.

Hope this clarifies.

Reply 6 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-May-2000

Sterghios I'll try to be a bit clearer.

I don't mess with soundfonts to achieve diffent attack velocities I don't need to.

The velocity is contained in the Note On message (in fact in NWC the Note Off message is also a Note On message with a velocity of zero). So each note has the velocity built in.
I usually write the basic drum parts into separate tracks so that I can get different velocities on snare,cymbals, kick drum etc. and vary these according to where the accents are applied.
All these notes are sent on Channel 10 which will respond to any dynamic controls on that channel.
So changes in Volume (Controller 7) or Expression (Controller 11) on channel 10 will increase the dynamic output on the Channel over and above the effects of the individual velocities attached to each note.

Understand that the Expression controller works like a percentage (in 128 steps) of the current channel Volume.
So you are right - the actual dynamic output of each note is something like Volume x Expression/127 x Velocity/127.
(Someone will correct my assumption here - I'm sure - but if any of these factors is zero there will be lttle dynamic output).
A change in any of these factors changes the sound level (I'm trying hard not to use "Volume" as a descriptor of dynamic output).

Just going back over what I said initially:

Volume (Controller 7) is Channel "Balance".
Conventional wisdom says use only at the head of a track but I prefer to use it also when a track moves in and out of solo or background.

Expression (Controller 11) is "Dynamics" (swells/fades or 'dynamic variance' in NWC language).
The advantage here is that you can set swells/fades with Expression (remember this controller is a percentage of the Channel volume) and if you need to re-balance the track you need only change the Volume controller not every expression mark in the track.

Velocity I use exclusively for "accents" and small pushes in the melodic line to make the performance live.
I never use this as a dynamic device (to increase volume) only to provide accents.
And I prefer this to adding > over notes since I have more control over how heavy the accent is this way.

Note that you cannot achieve swells or fades on a held note with velocity because it only acts at Note On.
Any dynamic change while the note is held can only be done with Volume or Expression.
(And since Volume is "Balance" this leaves only Expression).

I have, for a long time, had troubles coming to grips with how dynamics are implemented in NWC. Now that we have Expression available as a dynamic controller I would hope that this becomes the basis for "dynamic variance" in the future.

This is all IMHO of course but it's based on a lot of research and discussion with mid producers on the net - I don't think I'm one-out in this area of midi implementation.
But your free to ignore all this at your leisure!


#1502: Using layering - is there a better way?
Using layering - is there a better way?

(1502)

Submitted by: John Gillings on 06-Apr-2000

I was trying to notate some piano music with a common
pattern in the right hand 3/4 time - two lines -
the top one minum followed by two quavers, (I think
that's "half" note followed by two "eighth" notes) the
bottom thread was a crotchet followed by a minum chord
("quarter" note rest followed by a "half" note chord).

To enter this I had to place the rest first (stem down)
then add the minum (stem up) as a chord member. I could
then add the minum chord in the bottom thread (stems down),
but I couldn't add the quavers as belonging to the top
thread, they always added onto the end of the minum chord.

To get around this, I had to use layering. That wasn't
too much of a big deal, except what to do with all the other
bars? I ended up copying everything to the new stave.
Naturally that causes an issue with editting and changing.
Is there a simpler way to just "blank out" the intervening
bars? (or is that a new feature in the next release).

Is there a way to notate the (fairly common) pattern,
without layering that I've missed?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 07-Apr-2000

The NWC 1.70 beta release (available at http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcpreview ), makes layering much easier, mainly because it allows you to hide notes. You can simply pad out the parts of the layered staff you don't need with hidden rests. There is no longer any need to have any duplicate notes.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 07-Apr-2000

If I understand your question, there is a solution with the next version. I did not try it, but it should work.

As before, you place the rest first (stem down) then add the minum (stem up) as a chord member. Now you add another rest (stem up) and the minum chord (chorded with this second rest, stem down). Then you add the quavers.

Ok, you can do it with current version, but the additional rest is ugly. The great thing is that, with NWC 1.70, you can hide this rest. Fine, isn't it ?

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 07-Apr-2000

Oh no you can't! Or if you do you also have to hide the minim chord. A chord including its rest can only have one visibility property.

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 08-Apr-2000

By the way, in 1.70 you do not even have to pad the layered staff after the last part you use.

Simply insert a bar line just before the end, and mark it invisible. The double bar will show up on the screen but NOT in the printout, and it plays back properly.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 11-Apr-2000

Oops, forget that last statement. It does not work. You must pad to the end of the song with invisible rests.


#1503: Exporting a fermata...
Exporting a fermata...

(1503)

Submitted by: Clive on 08-Apr-2000

Hi,

How do you export a fermata from nwc to midi format?

Thanking all in advance, Clive

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Apr-2000

You have to "fake it" by doing a tempo change at the point where you want the fermata. The reason is that the fermata is not a native midi construct, but provided for our convenience in NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Apr-2000

See also: msg #80, msg #259

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 03-May-2000

Nothing seems to have changed since archaic versions.

I think NWC can simply fix the problem translating the fermatas and breath marks to tempo changes exporting to a file.

I repeat what Andrew had said three years ago: appr. "If NW ArtWare bla bla fixes these little problems they will have a program with no equal."


#1504: Bells Used Chart
Bells Used Chart

(1504)

Submitted by: Mer Boel on 08-Apr-2000

I am writing music for handbell choir, and I need to put a "Bells Used Chart" below the title of my piece and before the start of the music. Normally it is done as a Grand Staff (with treble and bass clefs), with solid noteheads with no stems, showing all the pitches (handbells) used in the piece. Is there a way to do this in NWC? I've downloaded the 1.70 beta 3 (I am a registered user). Thanks for any help!
p.s. I just discovered the "layering" technique, and am fairly thrilled with this ability - since another requirement in handbell music is a fixed split (at C#5/Db5), now I can enter the more complicated rhythms on 2 staves and then layer them.

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 09-Apr-2000

Hi Mel,

From your description, it sounds like you could use the NWCV15 font as one of the user-fonts, and insert 'noteheads' as text where you want them on the staves. (Of course, this would be for printing only and wouldn't play.)

(I'm not familiar with handbell notation, so please forgive if I've misunderstood your post...)

Sue

Reply 2 offered by: Mer Boel on 10-Apr-2000

I can imagine that working - but how do I show it as a separate staff, before my piece starts, without having it count as measure #1? And noteheads won't "play"?
Sorry to be so ignorant about NWC - I have been using it for awhile, but not to do these more complicated edits.
---Mer

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Apr-2000

Start your song with enough hidden rests on both staves so they take up the first line.
Then you can insert what you want as text. If you use hidden quarter or eighth note rests you have better control where the text goes. Bar lines can be hidden. You can insert a (non-hidden) Section Close bar line at the end of the top line if you want.
When you play back there will be a long wait, unless you insert a very fast (hidden) tempo, then set it right at the start of the second line.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 10-Apr-2000

From Mel's comment "And noteheads won't 'play'?", I deduce that he's unfamiliar with the use of NWC for MIDI sequencing and has been using it for notation only.

Mel: If this deduction is right, you're missing half the fun. Assuming your setup is right (a topic too large for me to go into here, but many many people will be willing to help), you can use your computer's soundcard (or external MIDI device) to play back the music you're notating in NWC. I find this invaluable for finding errors by ear that my eyes haven't caught, and just for the sheer enjoyment of immediate feedback.

If I've misconstrued your comment, please excuse me.

Reply 5 offered by: Mer Boel on 10-Apr-2000

Thanks everyone for the responses. Now, if I use the hide-it method, how do I get measure numbers for the "real" part of the piece to show up? Also, is there a way that I can have every measure numbered? That is also the convention in bell ringing music.

The midi capability is GREAT for catching wrong notes, I've been guilty of quite a few, nothing like hearing it to tell.
---Mer
p.s. I'm a she, and it's Mer, not Mel.

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 10-Apr-2000

Oops. Sorry, Mer. My eyes must have been crossed. (I was reading "Mel Boer"!)

If you use hidden measures as suggested above, you're probably out of luck when it comes to measure numbering. There's currently no way to exclude hidden measures from the measure count. (Several people have recently requested enhancements to cover this situation, but none has been implemented.) If you need numbers and don't mind the extra work, it would probably work to insert the measure numbers as text items by hand.

Alternatively, you could notate the music in one .nwc file and the bell list in another, paste the "print previews" of the two files together into another program and print from there. I haven't personally done this so I can't offer instructions, but I've seen postings from people who have and they might be able to help.

Reply 7 offered by: Sue Morton on 10-Apr-2000

Hi Mer,

(Sorry for my initial typo to your first post. It's probably what got everybody started calling you 'Mel'.)

Re: "Noteheads won't play". I had recommended using the NWC supplied font as TEXT... so that you could get a notehead without the stem. Since they would be considered TEXT symbols by NWC, and not real notes, during MIDI playback you would not hear them. That's what I meant.

But having read through all the posts, I think the two separate NWC files is a great idea, then you can notate in whatever way you'd like for the "Bells Used" file (and who cares about playback!), and still have measure numbering etc. in the actual score since it would be separate.

Hope we've helped you, please post back if you have more questions. Good Luck!

Sue

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Apr-2000

I don't know exactly what you want the first line to look like.
If you don't need staff lines in it,
you can start numbering the measures at zero,
and force a line break after the first measure.

Reply 9 offered by: Mer Boel on 10-Apr-2000

Some great ideas, THANKS. I may try some combination of these to see what the effect is. This is one great bunch of helpful folks!
---Mer


#1505: slurs/ties
slurs/ties

(1505)

Submitted by: Nicolette Ferreira on 09-Apr-2000

When a song has more than 1 verse, tied notes may be applicable to one verse and not another. When entering the lyrics, NWC does not take notice of slurs and ties so how can you adjust the lyrics to ignore the slurs/ties in any verse? Is it possible?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Apr-2000

Placement of lyrics is affected by slurs and ties - a lyric is assigned to a tied or slurred note set. If you want to skip a note you can enter an underscore instead of a word and it will not appear. If you want two words to share a note (or slurred note set), you can separate them with an underscore (eg. "two_words") and they will appear as two words (eg. "two words").

In the 1.70 Beta there is a new note property that lets you choose if it is to be assigned to a lyric or not. However, this does not really help the multiple lyric problem.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Apr-2000

In earlier releases, there is no way to override the syllable attachment behaviour where notes are skipped when they receive a slur or tie.

However, the 1.70 feature does help here. In version 1.70 (currently in beta), you can use the Lyric Syllable property to force a lyric on a note that receives either a tie or a slur. Once this is done, you can skip this syllable in some lyric lines use the underscore (_) character surrounded by spaces.


#1506: Netscape 6 Preview Crash
Netscape 6 Preview Crash

(1506)

Submitted by: Blair Dowden on 09-Apr-2000

I am using the new Netscape 6 Preview.
It crashed every time I tried to open this Forum.
It worked OK on the Beta Forum. Then I responded to a
message in this forum using Internet Explorer, and now Netscape 6 can open it
without crashing. Has anyone else had this problem?

Another complaint about Netscape - the edit control does not
word wrap, so these messages look ugly.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Apr-2000

I don't know why Netescape would crash. Obviously, it has some bugs that need to be worked out.

If you look at the source for the submission form, you will see that we use a "WRAP" tag on the TEXTAREA control of the form. This is specifically there for the Netscape browsers. IE wraps automatically, without the need for the extra WRAP tag. If Netscape 6 doesn't even respond to the WRAP directive, then I would venture to guess that there is not much we can do to overcome it from our end.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 11-Apr-2000

Its not as stable as your Preview was. It does render pages faster than IE.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Apr-2000

To fix the text wrapping problem in Netscape 6 (or Mozilla M15, which I am using now)
it seems that you need to use the " WRAP=virtual " keyword.
This is what Mozilla does on their bug reporting page ( http://www.mozilla.org/quality/help/bug-form.html ).
This page displays correctly in IE 5 and Netscape 4, so it should be safe to make the change.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Apr-2000

Change made...we will monitor for any possible problems...

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Apr-2000

Thank you for the quick response. I can confirm that it now wraps properly in Netscape 6, which makes it a lot nicer to use!

Reply 6 offered by: Netscrape stinks on 18-Jan-2002

No matter *what* I try, I can't get Netscape 6 to wrap a Textarea. What garbage.


#1508: newbie: What is...
newbie: What is...

(1508)

Submitted by: Thomas Black on 11-Apr-2000

Hey, I'm relatively new to all this MIDI and music stuff, but I think the PC and the net is gonna teach me faster than a man or a book, plus it's cheaper! So, what exactly is tenuto and fermata? Also, how do I do a slide over a few notes just as I do it on my bass? This pitch shift thingy seems to be limited to a few semitones only...

Thanks dudes.

Mr. TB

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Apr-2000

Tenuto means "held", so hold the note until the very moment the next one sounds. In practise, very similar to "legato", which means "smoothly." A fermata is a pause; think of it as a momentary abrupt tempo change (slow-down), which is how you have to notate it in NWC if you want the resulting exported midi to contain the pause.

The pitch-bend range is, as you point out, plus or minus two semitones, for a total range of four semitones. If you need longer slides, you have to resort to trickery like several shorter slides merged together by fading the volume in on one, while fading it out on the other. A bit fiddly, to say the least...

Reply 2 offered by: Thomas Black on 12-Apr-2000

Oh, cool. So basically tenuto is the opposite of staccate right? As for the fermata... I kinda miss that one - I'm sorry for my ignorance. So lets say you want to jump from a 120 tempo to a 95. Is that a fermata? Or is it a pause that is sort of additional to the bar, exceeding the limit of the time signature? If I still aint got it then can you direct to a file anywhere that contains that fermata thing? Like the scriptorium, I think it's called.

Thx Fred.

Mr. TB

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 12-Apr-2000

You've probably seen a fermata without knowing its name. It's basically a semicircle, thickened in the middle, with a dot under it. Think of the CBS eye logo missing its lower lid.

A fermata is placed over a note or rest to indicate that that note or rest is to take more time than it would otherwise. After the fermata the pace of the music picks up exactly as it was before, unless a new tempo specification intervenes.

Reply 4 offered by: Mr TB on 13-Apr-2000

Thanks for teh help. So basically it extends the capacity of the time signature passively in a sense, by increasing the alloted timeto the bar universally in teh score, but without permitting the intrduction of notes.

All the other parameters, like accelerando, do they function on playback? Anywhere I can find what they mean so I can stop bothering you with my silly ignorant questions?

Mr TB

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 13-Apr-2000

The NWC help file contains a section that describes all of the musical terms used in the program. From "Help Contents" search for "faq" and then under this heading select "Music terminology".

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 13-Apr-2000

To answer the other part of your question: from experimentation I conclude that most of the tempo variance items have the same effect, which is to mark the beginning of a tempo change. The directon of change is determined solely by the tempo settings before and after the variance. That is, if a fast tempo is followed by a slow one, the music will begin to slow at an intervening tempo variance, even if that variance happens to be "accelerando" (Italian for "speeding up").

The only tempo variances that don't work this way are fermata and breath mark, which cause a hold (fermata) or gap (breath mark) of the specified duration if a delay is specified and are ignored otherwise.

The only dynamic variances that have any effect on playback are "Crescendo" and "Decrescendo". The others are ignored (even "Diminuendo", a synonym for "Decrescendo"). Like the tempo variances, Crescendo and Decrescendo merely determine where the change begins; the direction of the change (soft-to-loud or load-to-soft) is determined by the actual dynamics that surround the variance.

I'm out of time for now, so I'll leave the effects of the "Performance Style" items as an exercise.

Reply 7 offered by: MR TB on 18-Apr-2000

You're cool brother.

Thanx

Mr. TB

Reply 8 offered by: Newyorker on 18-Apr-2000

Where you located man?


#1510: Printing 2 or more staff
Printing 2 or more staff

(1510)

Submitted by: Carlos Acuna on 12-Apr-2000

Hello, i need to print 3 staff, but each after the other, because it´s a three part song,
Please tell me how can i do this.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry  on 12-Apr-2000

Hi - if you click on File -> print preview you will see how the printed page will look. Click on File -> page setup and look at the various tabs to see what can be changed. I am not sure if you have more than 3 staves, if so just select the ones you want to print on the contents tab of page setup. Good luck - Barry

Reply 2 offered by: Carlos Acuna on 12-Apr-2000

the problem is that i want to see the full lyrics of one staff, and then continue with the second and so on.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 14-Apr-2000

If I understand, you have one staff with three lyric lines.
You want the music to repeat three times with the correct lyrics underneath.
The only way to do this is to copy the entire staff, and paste it twice.
Then put all three lyric lines in the same verse.


#1511: A song...
A song...

(1511)

Submitted by: Joseph Hansche on 13-Apr-2000

Hi all. I'm sorry-- this is kinda off topic... I'm looking for a midi or NWC file of a song by George Benson called "Affirmation"... It was originally written by Jose Feliciano. If anyone knows where I can find the MIDI of this song, or if you have it, please e-mail me. Thank you. Also, anyone knows where to find the mp3, I'd like to get that also. Thanks again,
- Joe

Reply 1 offered by: YAHH ARR WOOOOOHHH ARRRRGH! on 14-Apr-2000

You could also try asking the MIDI JAZZ newsgroup on usenet.
Maybe we could have a requests page on the Noteworthy Scriptorium?
Then if anyone is feeling talented they could transcribe a tune?


#1513: Classical music in lead sheet form
Classical music in lead sheet form

(1513)

Submitted by: Surround Sound HIFI System, High Power 16,000W on 14-Apr-2000

I was wondering if any Noteworthy users would be interested in notating some Classical piano sonata melody lines with the chords?

Anything by Liszt or Beethoven would be great. I love their stuff. (Bach didn't believe in chords so don't bother notating any of his stuff in lead sheet form. :-)

Take care and enjoy the music.

Shaken, not stirred.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 14-Apr-2000

And when you're done with that, how about producing some paint-by-number versions of great Impressionist paintings? Anything by Monet or Cezanne would be great!

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 14-Apr-2000

re: Bach didn't believe in chords...

See http://www.standingstones.com/bachharm.html for a different opinion on that.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 14-Apr-2000

... which only shows that the person who wrote the analysis believes in chords.

One thing I notice is that many of the chords identified are added-note chords such as major 7ths, minor 9ths and so on. In contemporary styles such as jazz, such chords are used as entities in themselves; in Bach's music it's more appropriate to describe them as the instantaneous results of voice leading.

If you examine the non-triadic chords in Bach's music, you'll see that the extra notes are usually passing tones, suspensions, anticipations, appoggiaturas and other devices of melodic construction. That is, they are dictated not by harmonic considerations but by melodic ones.

Which is not to say that chords were entirely foreign to Bach's thinking - the chorale settings, for example, can be understood as primarily chordal in construction. It is true, however, that his thinking was considerably less chordal than that of most composers in later eras. For example, compare the melodic quality of the lower voices in Bach's chorales to the much less interesting lower voice parts in, say, 19th-century hymn settings.

Reply 4 offered by: John Gillings on 16-Apr-2000

> the person who wrote the analysis believes in chords.

Well, it varies. Consider, for example, Prelude #1 from
the first book of the Well Tempered Clavier. It's really
just a sequence of arpeggiated chords. On the other hand,
think about any of the fugues. It just doesn't make sense
to talk in terms of chords.

What we've got here is a clash in thinking about music.

Much modern (commercial) music is "vertical". It's written
as a chord progression with a (mostly single) melody
layered on top and a backing rhythm. Many people,
(particularly amateur and self taught musicians) think
"vertically" - it's well suited to playing "rhythm" piano
and guitar.

In contrast, there is "horizontal" thinking, more common in
players of monophonic instruments. This concentrates on a
melody or melodic line, somewhat ignoring the vertical
chord structure.

Either mindset in itself is incomplete. To say "Bach didn't
believe in chords" illustrates this point. The chords arise
from interactions between the polyphonic voices. The chords
are "there" (though usually far too complex to describe!).
You just cannot reproduce the music in terms of the
chord structure, it's too coarse a description.

Similarly with Beethoven, Liszt, Mozart, Brahms, etc... it's
not really possible to come up with a meaningful
chord/melody representation. Too much gets lost.

Now, I'm not criticising "vertical" thinking. Indeed, as a
largely "horizontal" thinker, I often wish I could think
more vertically as it seems to be the key to improvisation
and the ability to quickly and simply reproduce what I
hear. The point is that there is some music that is easily
broken down into chords, and there's some that's not. To
attempt an "easy play" score of a Beethoven Sonata is, as
Grant suggested, rather like a paint by numbers grand
master.

Get the "real" score and have a go. There is quite a lot of
very good music that is accessible to even the worst of
self taught pianists with atrocious technique (and I speak
from long personal experience!). All you need is the ability
to read it.

Reply 5 offered by: Lil' kid on 17-Apr-2000

John,
I would like to thank you for your post --- I have got a better understand of things. Thank you.
I would also like to play classical piano but most of the scores I've looked at are written to complicated for my playing ability.
Can you recommend some slightly simplified arrangements of classical piano music where the piece is mostly intact?
Would these arrangements be public domain and/or would I be able to obtain some for free on the internet?
Thanks again.

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 18-Apr-2000

John - regarding the 1st WTC prelude, I already mentioned the chorale settings as examples of Bach's use of chordal writing, so I was not denying it was possible. On the other hand, even this prelude, chordal as it looks, has its melodic aspects. If you examine it closely, you'll see that the chords being arpeggiated are, with very few exceptions, consistently in 5 parts -- and, in fact, these parts move very much as chorale voices would, even displaying melodic characteristics such as suspensions (bass, m. 2; soprano, m. 3; and so on). This is a far cry from the Alberti bass of the Classical period, not to mention the oom-pah accompaniment of the Romantic waltz or the chord notation of contemporary popular music.

Kid -
There is a lot of music specifically written for beginners, which you might find more interesting than simplified versions of more difficult pieces. You should look up Bach's "Notebook for Anna Magdalena Bach"; sonatinas by Beethoven, Hummel and others; Beethoven's "easy sonatas", opus 49, "Für Elise", and the first movement of the "Moonlight" Sonata; Schumann's "Album for the Young"; the first few books of Bartók's "Mikrokosmos", etc. You can also find graded collections of classical music, from beginner's level on up, in almost any music store. If money is a problem, you might check the local library. Some of them have sheet music in their collections.

As to finding music on the Internet, I have no personal experience with this but I'll share some information posted on the NWC newsgroup: there's a list of Internet music sources at http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/freeshee.htm

Good luck.

Reply 7 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 01-May-2000

I don't assume the problematic of harmony as simple as progressing chords or bass line etc. I think that harmony is a total method of thinking, combined of both the chordal structure and the progression of the melodic architecture.

As I've observed, Bach is the first and the most important composer-philosopher who built his harmony as a means of thinking. This can obviously be extracted from most of his works, for instance the adagio of the Violin Concerto in E BWV 1042


#1514: MP3 or WAV to MIDI
MP3 or WAV to MIDI

(1514)

Submitted by: Hans Lommen on 14-Apr-2000

Is there a possibility to get *.mp3 or *.wav files to a MIDI file? And if so how?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 14-Apr-2000

This is one of the all-time great perennial questions.

Opinions differ. There are apparently programs that can handle simple .wav files (for example, those containing a melody played by a single solo instrument). The consensus opinion, though, is that it's not really possible to write a program to generate a MIDI file from an arbitrary .wav file.

For much more on this check out these threads: msg #1236, msg #1160, msg #1003, msg #995. I found these by searching the offline forum. I know there are some more recent postings too, but they're eluding me at present.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 16-Aug-2000

I didn't read all of the previous links ( msg #995 is of interest)
but it seems that http://www.intelliscore.net/demo.html now contains the version 3 of their software.

Not good for your aural training, but such a time gain.

HTH, Dominique

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 16-Aug-2000

In case some people want a good unzip FREEware (so you won't be haunted by your conscience) :
!ftp://members.aol.com/ghisler/minunzip.exe
(info taken from http://www.ghisler.com )

CU L8r

Reply 4 offered by: again on 16-Aug-2000

new link ? monophonic :
http://www.midi.ru/w2m/ WAV2MIDI MP3 WIDI Music Recognition System

Reply 5 offered by: pliakos on 20-Mar-2001

wav to midi?
Please Help!!!

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 20-Mar-2001

Scroll up to the top of this page. You can follow the links in Reply 1 to find other threads where this question is discussed.

Reply 7 offered by: reimundo carlos on 30-Mar-2001

yo tambien busco la respuesta.
agradecere a cualquiera que me pueda informar sobre los adelantos.

Reply 8 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 30-Mar-2001

yo tambien busco la respuesta.
agradecere a cualquiera que me pueda informar sobre los adelantos

Yanlýþ geldin gálibâ... Ne diyorsun? Anlamadým.

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Mar-2001

I weiße auch nicht.

Reply 10 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 31-Mar-2001

That's the difference between

Je n'en sais rien,

and

Je ne sais pas.


#1515: Override main key signature
Override main key signature

(1515)

Submitted by: Carlos Acuna on 15-Apr-2000

Hello, my staff need to change the key signature during the song, is there any way of overide the first key signature, because, it reflects, the other key signatures.

Thank you

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 15-Apr-2000

Just insert the new key signature (Insert menu, Key Signature) where you want it.
It will automatically cancel the previous key signature.

Reply 2 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 17-Apr-2000

This actually brings me to one of my wish list items. I would like the inserted clef sign to be smaller that the main clef at the start of the stave, as you see in most printed scores.

I know it can be done by hiding the inserted clef sign in Ver 1.7 and then inserting a text item at a smaller font size, but that is a lot of extra work.

Roelie

Reply 3 offered by: Freddy and the Pharoahs on 18-Apr-2000

Yea, the mighty scarab calleth me,
he sayeth,
"Get by with thee granted wishes,
and ask no more.
For no more is to be given,
lest Artware is purchased by the software lords on high."


#1516: convert winamp files to wav. files
convert winamp files to wav. files

(1516)

Submitted by: Susan on 15-Apr-2000

Where can I find a conversion utility to convert my music files (winamp) to wav. files so I can burn the music to my CD Burner? (( I have a HP Cd-Writer Plus 8250i )) Where can I find a wav.exe file?

Reply 1 offered by: Ian Wesley on 17-Apr-2000

WinAmp can write .wav files directly. Go to Options-Preferences (right-click the funny wave symbol in the top left hand corner of the WinAmp screen) and then go to output plugins. Select the nullsoft diskwriter output at which point you will be asked to select a directory for output.

When you play your selection, wav files will be created in the selected directory. On my version, this happens at about twice normal playback speed - a bit like high-speed tape-tape dubbing. Remember that wav files can be large, so lots of drive space is required.

Another point to remember - when you burn a CD, if you want it to play back on any CD player, you must burn it in one go.

Ian

Reply 2 offered by: Amit Kohli on 07-Jul-2000

Hi Ian,
Thanks - the info you posted was really helpful. I got the part where you said that ausio CDs need to be burnt in one go - i.e. save enough stuff to fill a cd and then burn it. One more question please, can I use adapted software to burn the cd - if yes, would you please tell me how.
Thanks
Amit


#1517: SoundFonts and external banks
SoundFonts and external banks

(1517)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 15-Apr-2000

I'd be glad if there's anyone to tell me how to include SoundFont devices or external banks in my NWC's, or if it's possible? [I'm lucky enough to have a SB Live Platinum ;) ]

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Apr-2000

You cannot embed your sound fonts in a *.NWC file. You can use them, however, provided your synthesizer supports them (as you know, the SB Live does support them).

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 17-Apr-2000

Thank you.
Well, but what is the bank selection in the MIDI dialog box,then?

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 11-May-2000

Its a shame really that for so long none of our colleagues out there have provided you with the answer. It seems to me that there is an unspoken law that a new creative user must graduate to adulthood by finding out how his/her equipment functions on his/her own by trial and error. I don't like this attitude and therefore now that I have spotted your thread I will help you to my best of knowledge. I apologise for not assisting you earlier, but a trip to greece combined with an infernal crash of my PC that caused me to install linux and forget windows and doors and conservatories, kept me away from the net.

So.
You wanna work with soundfonts. Open Audio HQ and under that select Soundofnt. Now you got a few tabs to play with there. On the first, the one you are on when the app opens, is where you load and unload them. I assume you know a bit but, a soundofnt is a collection of instrument/sound samples that have been mapped and characterised in such a fashion so that their playback produces -or tries to produce- (not necessarilly, but usually) a realistic instrument sound. The samples are combined/mapped totally or partially on the MIDI keyboard range (128 notes, 0-127) to achieve this, and that on its own constitutes an instrument. So for instance 10 piano samples are mapped to a range of keys centering on the key each sample was obtained by, so that playing every key under MIDI will resemble piano. Samples can also be mapped according to how hard a key is pressed (known as attack velocity). Additionally, the MIDI key range a sample covers can overlap with another samples' range (so if keys 023-033 have a rain sample, you can put a thunder sample to be played back on range 030-045, or 023-033, or 020-050 or even 000-127, in which case every note on the MIDI keyboard
will play the thunder sample, accompanied by the rain sample in keys 023-033). Technically, in an instrument you can put any number of samples to be played back.

MIDI doesn't playback necessarily one instrument only. This is a bit tricky. MIDI has 16 stereo playback channels per synthesiser. SBLive has three; two hardware synths (Live A and Live B) and a software synth (Wavesynth; this has its own samples and is frankly very cacky!). At any timepoint, a single synth can be playing 16 voices simultaneously, but not necessarily 16 instruments only. This is because a "voice" can be mapped to correspond to 1 or more instruments found in the soundfont. This is not controlled in NWC itself, but in the soundfont, because that is what contains the voices. NWC and any MIDI sequencer just tells the voices what notes to play and how.

In the soundfonts, a "voice" is known as a bank. This bank therefore, can contain any number of instruments. For the specific back, each instruments' properties can be tweaked to differ from the template instrument, but the template itself remains unaffected i.e. the piano instrument described above can be placed in the centre in stereo sound (known also as panned to the centre) in the tempalte, yet a bank can be configured specifically to playback the piano panned to the right. Another bank can continue to play it at teh centre, if not instructed otherwise. Also the bank can be adjusted to affect the playback of all the instruments it contains. So if you set a global control under a bank to modulate the playback, all instruments included in teh bank will modulate. I.e. the piano will modulate, and pan to the right as well.

Finally, there can be 128x128=16384 different banks, because the addresses of banks are described by two numbers that range both from 0-127. I.e. it is like a table of 128 rows and 128 columns, containing 16384 cells. The number of possible instruments and samples is infinite. The only limit to the story is the amount of memmory your PC has, so, if you want to take my advice, start collecting some dosh for a memo upgrade. Want to know why? Go to http://liste.to.hammersound and you'll get my point!

So going back to the soundfont app in Audio HQ, the first window allows you to manipulate the loading of soundfotns onto memmory. The way I understand it is that the first loaded SF (soundfotn) is the primary SF, whose used banks are used by MIDI sequencers. Secondary SFs fill up the gaps, i.e. the banks left free by the primary SF (i.e. those that the soundfont does not map any instruments to). To do this, the used banks in the secondary SF must be mapped to the addresses of the empty banks of the primary SF, or else they will be (unfortunately) loaded and (yet) disregarded by the sequences. So if the primary SF uses banks 000-000 through to 000-110, the secondary SF's banks, in order to be played back must be mapped from 000-111 to 127-127 (i.e 000-111 to 000-127 and 001-000 to 001-127 and 002-000 to 002-127, and so on and so forth). Secondary SF banks are known also as external banks.

The second tab claims that allows you to manipulate the banks themselves, which is quite amusing considering the fact that to load/unload a bank, the corresponding SF must be loaded/unloaded first! And all it contains too! The one thing you can really do here is check what banks are occupied and by which soundfont. So you can then open Vienna and map the banks of the SF you which to load to empty slots. It does have its use...

The third tab controlls the amount of memmory allocated to soundfonts. I believe the default to be 12MB. That can easily change by dragging the bar to.... <drum roll> ...the 1/2 of your maximum physical memmory! So if you are running a 32 or 64 MB RAM PC, I hope for your nerves' sakes the shops are open for you to go and upgrade! As you can hear, even the 8mb SF provided with the live! that contains a large number of sounds is rather not convincing of fantastic quality. That is because the samples used are limited and far from the real McCoy. Go to Hammersound and you 'll come accross a SF known as Campbells' Piano that is 25MB big! That is ONE piano. And the guy has posted thre of them, each at that size. I really hope the shops are open mate!

S

PS: Hope that helps a bit!

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-May-2000

If all that didn't confuse you - try this site.
http://atlas.hemmet.chalmers.se/livecenter/showpage.php?id=14
"Soundfonts How To ?"

Check out the entire site - there is much there to interest an SB Live user.

I don't know how the Live card addresses soundfonts in banks but on my AWE32 you can load different soundfonts into User Banks 0 to 127.
Bank 0 is the default bank - I have a user 8Mb soundfont in there that I use as my default but (if I had more memory) I could load other soundfonts in Banks 1 to 127 and since I have to load them I know what is in each bank!

OK - so you have loaded some soundfonts into the user banks - how do you reach them and use them in NWC.

First under Tools>Options>Midi(Tab) select the Live Synth that you would like to use as your playback device.
(I'm sorry I don't have a Live card - this is a bit intuitive - It's important to use the correct synth or the sound will be less than you expect - a Live User might help here!)

Once you have selected your Live synth as a playback device
you can assign each staff in your score to use whatever Bank you have soundfonts loaded in your Live card.
For example you may have the Chaos 8Mb GM sf loaded in the default user (0) Bank and a good Violin (one instrument) sf loaded in Bank 1.

To set the playback instrument for each staff use the menu options Staff>Playback Instrument and select the instrument patch for the instrument using this staff.
(you should set up the staff using Staff>Staff Properties but it's easier to explain the Bank set up from the Playback Instrument dialogue).
You can do this for all your GM instrument sounds that use the (0) default Bank.

Now if you want to use the Good Violin sf in Bank 1 then
in the Staff>Playback Instrument dialogue ignore the patch list for the moment and Enable "Select Different Patch Bank".
Most Soundblaster cards use Controller 0 only to select banks. (the Live may be different - check your documentation).
To select User Bank 1 on the AWE32 I would enter 1 in the Controller 0 box.
If the soundfont in bank (1) contained a complete GM list of instruments you could select your patch from the list in this dialogue box.
In this example the Good Violin is the only patch in the soundfont so you would select "Patch List Type" as Numeric 0 based or Numeric 1 based depending on how your card selects patches.
When either of these is selected the patch list will show numbers rather than instrument patch names.
Select 0 or 1 in the Patch List to select the Good Violin single sound in the soundfont in User Bank 1.

Hope this hasn't confused you more!
If I have made mistakes here someone will correct me - they always do!

Good Luck - Barry

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 16-May-2000

to Sterghios A. Moschos and Barry Graham;
Thanks, I've been using the sound fonts.


#1518: How can I add phrase marks above the music??
How can I add phrase marks above the music??

(1518)

Submitted by: Martin Harvey on 16-Apr-2000

I am wanting to add a phrase mark above (or below) a section of music, and I was wondering if anyone knew how to do this?

If this can be done... is it also possible to add different phrase marks to different parts (i.e. the soprano phrase and the bass phrase starting and finishing at different points)??

Many thanks for your help!!

Reply 1 offered by: Martin Harvey on 16-Apr-2000

... I am also wanting to know how I can move a phrase mark from above to below the music, and vice versa, or can I not change this?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Apr-2000

By phrase mark, I'm assuming you mean slurs. Highlight all but the last note of the group you want slurred, and press ; (semicolon), or use the slur tool in the toolbar. Note that this is NOT the same as a tie, which is / on the keyboard; a tie will tie two notes of the same pitch into a single longer note, whereas a slur will give a more legato effect.

In V1.55b of NWC you have no control over the slur direction; it takes the direction defined by the note stem direction of the first note in the group. However, in V1.70 (presently in beta) you can force the slur (or ties, for that matter) in either direction.

For independent slurs on two voices on the same staff, use the layering feature to visually combine two independent voices onto a single staff.

Reply 3 offered by: Martin Harvey on 17-Apr-2000

You say that you can "force" the slur in either direction, regardless of the stems being up or down, in v.1.7 (beta), but how do you do this?? I have downloaded this new version, but still cannot solve my problem.

Many thanks, Fred!!

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 17-Apr-2000

If you select the first note of the slurred group for edit, you should see a "Notation Properties" dialog box with a tab marked "Notes". Select this tab and then choose "Upward" from the "Slur Direction" list box.

Note that changing the "Slur Direction" property on any of the other notes in the group will have no effect.

Hope this helps.


#1519: error in sound recording
error in sound recording

(1519)

Submitted by: Paul on 18-Apr-2000

I don't know if anyone can help me but here goes:
I have a sound recorder attachched to the computer, but it won't record. It's not the microphone because it still picks up sound and plays them throught the speakers as they happen, but when I try to record it picks up nothing.
I have tried to change the setting for recording (Windows 95) but it alls seems to be fine. I've also tried using another sound recording program (Waveflow) but it still didn't work.
Can someone tell me if I'm doing anything wrong or what?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Apr-2000

Not sure what you mean by "sound recorder attached to the computer." Do you mean a tape recorder? How is it attached? It should work properly if you connect the Line Out connector on your computer's sound card to the Line In (also sometimes called Record In) on the tape deck.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 18-Apr-2000

You may also want to check your "volume control" settings to assure that the right "input" is selected. The volume control (at least in Windows) is the little speaker on the systray to the lower right of the screen. Right click it for Volume Controls. Click "options" on the menu bar. Check the recording settings and controls to make sure the line you are using for input is selected.

Depending upon your sound card, you may have a different volume control. However, they tend to be somewhat similar.

Hope that helps.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 18-Apr-2000

Did not read your message closely enough. Apparently you have already worked with the volume control. Ignore the last message. That will teach me to comment before I have my quota of coffee.


#1520: Instrumentations
Instrumentations

(1520)

Submitted by: Newyorker on 18-Apr-2000

Hi,

Would somebody please fill me in on some standard instrumentations for college and high school bands. I would like to touch up some arrangements I've put into Noteworthy.

My question is:

What are the BASIC and STANDARD instrumentations for HIGH SCHOOL, COLLEGE, and UNIVERSITY 'stage bands' and 'concert bands.'

Once I have this info I can finish up some works and perhaps offer some complete oringinal arrangements through your user Scriptorium.

Take care,
Newyorker

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Apr-2000

Seems there are as many definitions of bands as there are bands. One resource that might help on the topic of brass bands generally is on the Scriptorium in the "Helpful Files" section, it's a text file condensed from a rather lengthy discussion on the topic on the newsgroup. From there, poke around on the web... and have fun!

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 18-Apr-2000

Since you gave your name as Newyorker, I'll assume you are looking for the standard instrumentation of American concert and stage bands.

Concert Band: Piccolo, Flute 1&2, Oboe 1&2, Bassoon 1&2, Clarinet 1,2&3, Bass Clarinet, Alto Saxophone 1&2, Tenor Saxophone, Baritone Saxophone, Cornet 1,2&3, Trumpet 1&2, Horn in F 1,2,3&4, Trombone 1,2&3, Baritone, Tuba and whatever percussion is needed. Other instruments can be added, but are less commonly used: English Horn (usually doubled in an Oboe part when needed), Alto, Contralto and Contrabass Clarinet, Soprano and Bass Saxophone and String Bass (sometimes included with the Tuba part). Also, more recent composers often use Trumpet 1,2&3 instead of having 3 Cornet and 2 Trumpet parts).

Stage Band: Alto Saxophone 1&2, Tenor Saxophone 1&2, Baritone Saxophone, 4-5 Trombone parts, 4-5 Trumpet parts, plus a rhythm section including Piano, Bass and Drum Set. Saxophone players are sometimes required to double on Flute and Clarinet, as well as the lead Alto sometimes playing Soprano Saxophone, and the rhythm section often also includes a guitar and an auxillary percussion player.

Hopefully I haven't overlooked anything, but these should give you an idea of what instruments you'd need to write for.

Reply 3 offered by: Newyorker on 20-Apr-2000

Thanks Chris I'm indebted to you!


#1521: Bar numbers / Metronome marks / Pauses / Fingering
Bar numbers / Metronome marks / Pauses / Fingering

(1521)

Submitted by: David Miles on 18-Apr-2000

6 Questions...

1. How can I put in bar numbers when they do not automatically appear?

2. I have made up one main score for a band. Is there any way that Noteworthy can print out each part seperately without me having to cut-and-paste?

3. How can I put in metronome marks using note symbols?

4. Can I put in pause marks?

5. How do I enter fingering on parts?

6. Can the print-out be shrunk down to say twelve staves per A4 sheet?

I have a fully registered version of Noteworthy Composer v.1.7 (beta).

Many thanks for all your help, guys.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 18-Apr-2000

1) Select "Page Setup" from the "File" menu, then go to the "Options" tab in the resulting dialog box and select the appropriate "Measure Number" and "Measure Start" options.

2) For each part, go to the "Contents" tab under "File"/"Page Setup" and hide (deselect) all but one staff, then print. You may find, however, that in some cases you want to cut and paste anyway - for example, if you want to compress a multi-measure rest into a single symbol. (For multi-measure rest and other useful symbols, see the "Boxmarks" font in the "Helpful files" section of the NoteWorthy Scriptorium, http://www.vadu.com/nwc).

3) Insert a "Tempo" item. The easiest way is to position the cursor and type 't', which will bring up a dialog box allowing you to select a note and the corresponding mm number.

4) Yes, it's one of the items under "Tempo Variance" (position the cursor and type 'e'). I don't know whether you're looking for a fermata (bird's-eye) or breath mark (comma), but both are available.

5) Insert the fingering numbers as text items (position the cursor and type 'x'). I use the "Staff Lyric" font for this, but the choice is up to you.

6) Go to the "Options" tab under "File"/"Page Setup", and select the appropriate "Staff Size (in points)". I don't know how big "A4" paper is, but a size of 18 points will put 12 staves on 8.5 X 11 paper.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Apr-2000

re: 5) For fingering, I prefer to use the Page Small Text font (it is smaller).
Also, on the Insert Text property sheet, select Justification: Center and Alignment: Next Note.
To see these options, go to Tools | Options, on the Edit tab unselect Smart Properties Insert. If you do this, you only need to set the text properties the first time; after that all you need to do is change the number each time you insert text.


#1522: More on MIDI to NWC Conversion
More on MIDI to NWC Conversion

(1522)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 18-Apr-2000

Past discussion has aired the triplets problem concerning MIDI to NWC conversion, with no apparent solution other than manual rewrite. I have found that this anomaly extends beyond triplets to what should be homogeneous arpeggiated eighth or sixteenth notes. For example, the PRS (Pierre R Schwob) CMA (Classical MIDI Archives)files perform nicely via Windows' MIDI player, but translate poorly in *.nwc. Specifically, the Rachmaninoff 2nd Piano Concerto score, beginning at measure 9 of the 1st movement, should be scripted as all eighth or sixteenth notes, but shows up as mixtures of sixteenths, thirtyseconds, dotteds and ties.
If NoteWorthy cannot find a practical remedy, perhaps some of us users could team up to speed up the rewrite process. There's a lot of good MIDI stuff out there... anyone interested?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Apr-2000

I think that what you're running into is midi files in which the creator intentionally made the file hard to import into /any/ sequencer. The trick is: precede your file with a short rest... double-dotted 32nds are great, they make a heck of a mess of any importation. The reason is that sequencers (including NoteWorthy) assume that the event at time=0 corresponds to the downbeat. Adding that short pause slides everything over, making the importation illegible. I've done it myself on several occasions where I didn't want the midi file to be messed with.

True midi fanatics don't let this stop them, of course; but it is an effective deterrent to the casual would-be importer.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Lim on 21-Apr-2000

It's also possible that some of these files (particularly the piano parts) were created by someone directly recording the output of a MIDI keyboard. This gives a more "humanised" performance, depending of course on the ability of the player, but the result when translated strictly in notation terms (since computers have to follow rules) is as you describe.

You may get better results by altering the "shortest note/rest settings, though this can distort trills and other ornaments.

Reply 3 offered by: Kerry Kelley on 04-May-2000

I've run into another problem concerning MIDI >> NWC conversion, only with MIDI files *created* with NWC. Specificly, NWC seems unable to import staccato, tenuto, accents, slurs, volume settings, multi-point controls, etc. in its own MIDI exports. This means that either I have to keep a NWC copy of every MIDI I make, or go in and insert these components back into the MIDI manually.

I think it would be great if NWC could detect these things when importing from MIDI, if only from its own MIDI exports.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-May-2000

Perhaps you should add this to the wish list on the home page.

Reply 5 offered by: Soap™ on 12-May-2000

Fred,
How do you fix a midi file that has been skewed a 32nd, so that you can import it correctly?
Son of a pitch™

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-May-2000

If a 1/32 has been added to the beginning, you'll see the downbeat starting with a 1/32 rest... at least on some staves. Delete that rest on each of the staves. (On some staves, you may have a 1/16 rest, or longer; you'll have to break up the longer rest in a way that results in a 1/32 rest being the first item on the staff; then delete it). When you've done that, check to see that the thing still plays properly. Yes? OK, export it back to midi, and re-import. Should be fine now.

Fred™


#1523: Hairpins!
Hairpins!

(1523)

Submitted by: Martin Harvey on 18-Apr-2000

How do I put in "hairpin" marks to represent crescendo, and dimuendo? i.e. < and >

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 18-Apr-2000

There are two files you might find useful. The first is the "Boxmarks" font, and the second is the "Crescendo" font. Both are available under the helpful files section at the scriptorium:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Boxmarks has many useful music symbols which are inserted as text, including a couple of hairpins. Crescendo is specifically for hairpins, and includes many of various lengths. These are both true type fonts, which you can use by setting them as user fonts through the page setup in NWC.


#1524: SharpEye Lyrics/XG Playback/Quad Playback
SharpEye Lyrics/XG Playback/Quad Playback

(1524)

Submitted by: John in Brisbane on 19-Apr-2000

Pardon the mutiple subjects, but I'll be brief.

I have read some debate here in the past, but for my purposes (folk tunes and choral scores) I find that SharpEye saves me quite a lot of time and effort in notating tunes One task that I hate doing in NWC is typing and aligning the lyrics, but is one that Sharpeye potentially saves a lot of pain. When I import a SharpEye Midi into NWC I lose the embedded lyrics after I export. I don't want to abandon my beloved NWC for tidying up the final score (particularly special repeats and transposition) but I'm stymied. Am I missing an existing solution or is there one in sight. Lyrics are pretty fundamental to us old fashioned folkies.

XG - I have a Yamaha XG daughter board, and while I don't treat NWC as a sequencer, how can I choose the XG instrumentation when I play back on NWC?

Quad Playback - Can someone please direct me to a resource so that I can figure out how to play back the four channels of SATB scores over 4 channels of audio. I'm not chasing huge amounts of audio separation, just enough for each part od the choir to hear their parts (reasonably) unambiguously. If I have to install extra sound cards I will quite happily. (As an aside has anyone had any real life experience in 'directing' a choir rehearsal using Midi rather than (say) a piano?

Thanks for reading this. Regards, John

PS I won't have a chance to check this until after Easter. Enjoy the holiday season.


#1525: My tempo won't change!
My tempo won't change!

(1525)

Submitted by: Angelique on 19-Apr-2000

I have search the archives, but haven't found a problem like this. I have Noteworthy Composer installed on both my computers, and my tempo commands have always worked just fine. Now, all of a sudden, I can't get either computer to follow my tempo commands! For example, if I have the first section at 130, and then I add a new tempo of 90, it won't change!

Am I making some mistake that is so obvious I can't see it, or has my program suddenly gone wacko?

Reply 1 offered by: Ian Wesley on 19-Apr-2000

I had a similar problem the other day. In my case, I had a hidden stave with another tempo which activated immediately after my visual stave tempo, despite the hidden stave being muted. So, I suggest you check for other tempo markings, particularly on hidden staves.

Ian


#1526: Recording Midi files from external instruments
Recording Midi files from external instruments

(1526)

Submitted by: Richard Johnson on 19-Apr-2000

can anyone tell me how to record midis from instruments? what i want to do is play some tabs on an electric guitar and save them as a midi on my computer, but i don't know how to plug it into my computer, and i don't know how to save the midi, thank you for the help, please email me @ duraiden@yahoo.com if you can go into detail on this.

Reply 1 offered by: Curtis S on 26-Apr-2000

Your instrument needs a MIDI output. Alot of the electronic keyboards have this but I am unaware of any guitars having a MIDI port.
Curtis S

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Apr-2000

What you need is a "Guitar Midi-Controller".
Roland make a pickup with a midi interface that connects via midi in.
Another is the Shadow pick up system.
But be prepared to pay - big time.

Reply 3 offered by: JD on 24-May-2000

I have the Roland GI-10 interface for guitar with the digital pickup system for acoustics. It works very well, but, as I stated here in my most recent problem posting, the quantizing during recording is awful. If you play notes at any faster a pace than 1/8 notes at approx 70bpm, your recording will turn to mush and all the notes are piled into what the software perceives as chords. Also, the interface and pickup together are not that expensive (I paid a total of 350 for the pair)


#1528: Recording Both Voice and Music At The Same Time
Recording Both Voice and Music At The Same Time

(1528)

Submitted by: Kobina Ofosu-Donkoh on 20-Apr-2000

Folks,

I need to record midi as wave and at the same time sing along as the midi plays while recording. So that i will be able to have both voice and music together in one wave file. I have a soundblaster live soundcard and a Total Recorder software, plus of course a microfone. My problem is that the recorder only one at a time, that is either voice through the mic. or middi through the soundcard. How can I get to record both voice and music at the same time? What am i doing wrong? Is there a special recording software to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Sue Morton on 24-Apr-2000

Hello,

The SBLive has a recording option called 'what u hear' that will do what you want.

For more information on using your SBLive, visit one of the SBLive newsgroups at NEWS.SOUNDBLASTER.COM. These two NG are pretty good:

creative.products.sound_blaster.live
creative.products.sound_blaster.live.music

HTH and Good Luck,

Sue


#1530: Changing from 2 staves to 1.
Changing from 2 staves to 1.

(1530)

Submitted by: Susan Harvey on 22-Apr-2000

I am writing out piano music (including lyrics) which go from two staves ti one staff during the course of the piece. How can this be acheived effectively on Noteworthy Composer v.1.7 ?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Apr-2000

This is not supported. I would suggest dividing the song into two pieces, one with 2 staves and the other with one.

You can use the new 1.70 line break facility to get the first piece to finish at the end of the page. To do this, you insert a bar line at the very end of the piece, give it the Section Close style, and set the Force System Break option. This looks wrong on the screen, but is correct in the printout.

On the second piece, use the Page Setup dialog to turn off Title Page Info on the Options tab. If you are doing measure numbering, you can set the starting measure number on the same tab. And you can hide the leading time signature.


#1531: MIDIFILES
MIDIFILES

(1531)

Submitted by: Claudio Araujo on 22-Apr-2000

I would like to know the intern format of MIDI file.
Where can I get some specification about the construction of this kind of file and/or how to read it and use it in a C or java Program?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Apr-2000

Start here:

http://www.borg.com/~jglatt/


#1532: Reconding from Yamaha PSR530
Reconding from Yamaha PSR530

(1532)

Submitted by: Carlos Acuna on 24-Apr-2000

I want to record from my yamaha PSR530, but none input is done, but it plays, anything that i wrote in the staff, can someone help me.
Thank you

Reply 1 offered by: Michiel on 21-May-2000

I have the same problem with my Qs7 synth.
When I press the stop button in NWC for the second time it sais that all ports and channels will be reset, and then I can do midi-input for a very short moment.
When I use cakewalk I sometimes can record and then the input-indicator will ligt up. But the notes come after each other with a period of approximately 4 seconds and the duration of all the notes is the same.
I hope someone has a solution.
thanks

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-May-2000

In NWC, go to Tools | Options | MIDI | Port Usage and set it to Always.

If that fails to help, then you have a with one of the following:

- the computer's software driver setup (reinstall to correct)

- the sound card's MIDI port

- the keyboard

- the MIDI cable

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-May-2000

Also, follow the procedures spelled out in the User's Guide if you are unsure how to record or do not know the difference between step-time and real-time note entry in NWC.

Reply 4 offered by: JD on 24-May-2000

I would check the midi setup, as well. It is the bane of these tools that, if one thing is overlooked, it is usually the midi port (I default to ch. 1 for all startup files). I also have three or four instrument definition files, but make sure that I am only using one for the first draft.

Reply 5 offered by: Shane Turner on 06-Jun-2000

It should work, if you follow these tips. I've been using my PSR-530 with noteworthy for the past 2 years, its awesome!


#1533: Forcing Carriage Returns in Lyrics
Forcing Carriage Returns in Lyrics

(1533)

Submitted by: Rob Moore on 24-Apr-2000

I would like to print some songs with each new lyric line starting on a new line like this:
(staff notation)
Row, row, row your boat
(staff notation)
Gently down the stream.

The only way I can even get close to this is by varying font and staff sizes, but this gives generally unsatisfactory results. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Apr-2000

Your best option is to join the 1.70 beta test, which includes a system break option on bar lines.


#1534: MDA to MIDI file format
MDA to MIDI file format

(1534)

Submitted by: prioritaire on 25-Apr-2000

Hi,
Anybody know how to convert a .MDA (yamaha clavinova) file to MIDI so I can import it into Noteworthy?
Thank you.
prioritaire

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Apr-2000

Not familiar with that format, but if you'll email me a short sample, I'll have a look at it and see if something can be done. It may be a standard midi file with a header, or something like that.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Apr-2000

I had a look at the files you sent, and they don't look even remotely like standard midi files. I've also searched the web for conversion utilities, to no avail. However, all is not lost; it just means that you have to take a hardware approach.

I've successfully done this with drum tracks programmed into an ancient Korg drum machine; if it work with that, it should certainly work with your Clavinova.

You'll need a cable to connect from your soundcard joystick port to the "midi out" connector on your Clavinova. Such adaptor cables are readily available at most music stores or computer stores, usually around $20 or so.

Then, you'll need to set your midi in on your computer to be the "MPU-401" joystick port input. The idea is to record into your computer while the Clavinova is playing the MDA file. NoteWorthy can do this -- with only one drawback; it doesn't allow midi synchronisation. When I did it, I used Cubase (which does allow midi sync), exported the result to midi, and re-imported into NoteWorthy.

Hope this helps...

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: Hartmut on 06-Jan-2001

You will find conversion utilities at http://www.giebler.com


#1535: Measure-numbering Concatenated Songfiles
Measure-numbering Concatenated Songfiles

(1535)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 26-Apr-2000

After joining two or more songfiles into a single file, I would like to be able to renumber measures (starting with 0 or 1) within each section. Is there a way?

Reply 1 offered by: Al on 19-May-2000

No, sorry.


#1536: Why does it sound awful???
Why does it sound awful???

(1536)

Submitted by: Nicole on 26-Apr-2000

Ok I'm arranging this peice for my grade11 music class. Everyone knows about the concert pitch thing (different instruments have different key signatures) but I was wondering if when I playback and it sounds sharp is it because noteworthy doesn't relize it's in different key signatures or is it an actually wrong note, Cause I think I'm doing it right.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Apr-2000

Well, hard to say... but I'd guess that if it sounds awful, it's probably wrong.

Noteworthy doesn't know about transpositions unless you tell it. For any transposing instruments you have to tell it how many semitones to move the pitch up (or down). For example: for an 'Eb' instrument you would have to set staff transpostion to +3 or -9, depending on which direction it's transposed.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 27-Apr-2000

There are two transposition charts which I think would be helpful to you at the user tips section. First;
Instrument to instrument transposition guide by Garnett Lee Henley at
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip5.htm#transpse
and the second;
Instrument transposition chart by John White at
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip3.htm#trnschrt
which links to
http://members.aol.com/mandminst/chart.html
In addition, you can have a look at my Prelude at the NWC Scriptorium (www.vadu.com/nwc)
I hope these do some favour

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Lim on 27-Apr-2000

Nicole,

Assuming your problem is caused by not having the transposition set correctly, I recently came across a very comprehensive list of instruments at

http://www.nifty.ne.jp/forum/fmidicla/htmls/ichou.html

The column "key+" shows the number of semitones and the direction required. Note that the clef is not always specified!

Reply 4 offered by: Randolph M. Roeder on 01-May-2000

Click on file in the upper left of the "main" NoteWorthy
screen and then click on history. Click clear,then, cancel.
I'll bet the "awful"-ness you hear has absolutely nothing
to do with intervallic clash and everything to do with the
with the strange things that can and do occur with data
storage . Use of multi-point -controllers within a piece
has , in my experience , caused episodes of internal
havoc that effect unrelated noteworthy files seemingly at
random. Frequent use of the F9 refresh button during compo-
sition can help but the clearing out of the "history" file
has shown itself to be the best "cure" for such gremlins.
Further still , use of m.p.c.'s is not neccessarily the
"ground zero culprit" of "awful"-ness. It seems at times that having too many similiar sounding files, files differ-
ing by just a hair , may send out the troubles as well. An
example for myself would be having identical tunes in my
music files as well as in the "sent" file of my mailbox. At
times I'll find a "corrupted" composition which was fine the
day before , then discover that the identical version that
I had e-mailed to a friend the day previous remains intact
in my "sent" file. This is an ongoing difficulty for myself
and would love to know what experiences others have had with
this .Please feel free to e-mail any trouble shooting tips!

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-May-2000

Screen refreshing and clearing your history file has nothing to do with resetting mpc's. Most difficulties with stuck controllers can be cured by pressing F6 twice (or once, if the piece being played is already stopped). This does the following:

Resets all pedal controllers and sends a note-off on every note on every channel (stops stuck notes)
Resets all pitch bends
Resets all volume controllers

It does not at present reset some other controllers, e.g. expression. At this time, you either have to a: reset the controllers within your file, or b: use an external midi reset option (such as is frequently provided in the mixer applet for sound cards) to accomplish this.

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 01-May-2000

My first troubleshooting tip would be to reinstall NWC.

In my experience (32-bit 1.55, 1.55a and various 1.70 beta versions), bad sounds in playback are exclusively due to user error (bad transpositions, wrong notes, and so on) or to the longstanding bug that allows ties between notes with different accidentals. I've never had the occasion to use 'F9' or to clear out the file history. (If it comes to that, I can't imagine why clearing the file history would have any effect on what you call "episodes of internal havoc".) Nor do symptoms of this kind ever seem to come up in the newsgroup.

Unless you're using the 16-bit version (with which I have no experience) or use NWC in odd ways (e.g., extremely long sessions), the likely explanation for your symptoms is either that there's an installation error or that there is some problem with your PC that shows up when you use NWC.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-May-2000

Extremely long sessions -- odd? Around here they're de rigeur! :)

Reply 8 offered by: Randolph Roeder on 07-May-2000

"awful sounding" playback can and does occur, and no , it
does not necessarily have to do with transposition.
Seemingly unrelated notes are a matter of subjectivity ,
but when a single staff , without mpcs , constructed of
mere undecorated note entrys, plays back with pitch
variation of its own design , out of tune with itself
much less with any other staffs on the page , there exists
a problem that transposition obviously does not address.
The overall pitch standard wavers in these situations .
It's a real problem within either the program or the computer. The overall result once again is akin to having
a live ensemble where in the piano is out of tune with the
winds i.e. the group has to tune up with itself, rather
than merely finding the "right key" or refreshing their
grasp of musical fundementals.

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 08-May-2000

I wasn't for a moment suggesting that you don't hear bad playback that's unrelated to user error.

I merely said that such a thing must be very rare, since I don't remember seeing it as an issue in the Newsgroup or (until now) on the Forum, and that if it is occurring, it's most probably not the fault of NWC.

In the example you cite, NWC should be sending only note-on and note-off events to the playback device. If the playback pitch is wavering, this implies either that (1) NWC is sending pitch bend events or (2) the problem isn't in NWC. If you believe (1), then either NWC is conjuring the pitch bend events out of thin air, or the pitch bends are legitimate. The latter can happen when the staff you're playing from shares a channel with one or more other staves that contain pitch-bend MPC's. (Yes, even if a staff is muted, its MPC's are still part of the MIDI stream and will affect other staves on the same channel.)

Reply 10 offered by: Randolph on 09-May-2000

Thanks gentlemen , I very much do appreciate your
sharing of your time and experience. Maybe some day
I'll be able to triangulate the exact problem.
Cheers .

Reply 11 offered by: Nicole on 09-May-2000

Ok I fixed the problem. I figured out what i was doing wrong and it was pretty stupid. anyways thanks for everyones help!!!!


#1538: hiding a part of a staff
hiding a part of a staff

(1538)

Submitted by: Carlo Zerri on 27-Apr-2000

Sometimes I have a three staffs score, but the intro is only of two staff. How can NWC print correctly and hide a staff in the beginning?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Apr-2000

This can only be done (as far as I've found) by printing your score in two or more sections. See earlier threads regarding exporting NWC score output to other programs (e.g. word processors, etc.) or search the offline forum for tips and techniques.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 28-Apr-2000

It would be ever so easy to suppress staves where they are totally blank or totally hidden on any particular system (with user choice in the matter, of course). Do add it to the wish list (I have, and sometimes wishes do come true)!

Peter


#1539: beaming notes
beaming notes

(1539)

Submitted by: Carlo Zerri on 27-Apr-2000

Often in piano score some notes are beamed between the rh staff and the lefth staff. Can I simulate this with NWC?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 27-Apr-2000

Short answer: no.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Apr-2000

Longer answer: under some conditions, using V1.70. By hiding the rests and adjusting staff spacing, you can approximate this (I say approximate, since you can't actually join the beams; however, you can at least make them pretty close to being on the same line.)

Reply 3 offered by: Pat Ross-Ross on 02-May-2000

Pity. This particular feature is pretty much a necessity for keyboard polyphony and multi-octave arpeggiation. (Imagine notating the 48 without it - messy, very messy.)

Is there any indication that the folks at Noteworthy are considering adding this in the near future?

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 03-May-2000

I remember a notation/midi generation program called Lime able to that. Pity that I don't currently have it nor I know where to get.
NoteWorthy must add that feature and many more which "others" have at once!

Reply 5 offered by: Pat Ross-Ross on 05-May-2000

I actually use Lime as my workhorse notation programme. My only real complaints with it are regarding the quality of the fonts, and a certain lack of user-friendliness. (It originated on the Mac platform, and it shows in its lack of compliance with Windows conventions.)

I've been looking around for a replacement that suits my requirements (and pricepoint isn't one of them), but, although I like the look of Noteworthy's output, I can't seriously consider as more than a toy as it stands right now.

Reply 6 offered by: Sterghios on 11-May-2000

Lime..., based on apple..., which is based on Unix...

Does that mean that it functions under Linux? If so can you please direct me to where I can download it, under the provision that it does (decent, or better than NWC) MIDI playback?

Come to think of it, I wonder how come NWC doesn't ship yet in Linux format. I don't know if people have asked for it, but I am sure that it would make alot of users happier. I for once have windoze on my PC only to write music with NWC and use fully my soundcard. But I guess the pitfall here lies in the lack of Linux drivers for the majority of the soundcards out in the market; even those that do have linux drivers, they show (intentionally?) limited capabilities. Life is so much easier with Linux...

Sterghios


#1540: More than triplets
More than triplets

(1540)

Submitted by: Carlo Zerri on 27-Apr-2000

How can I insert group notes with more then 3 notes (more than triplets)?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 27-Apr-2000

Strictly speaking, you can't. Noteworthy does not support odd subdivisions other than triplets (not that I and many others haven't asked). However, in some circumstances there are effective ways to simulate them. These circumstances are either (1) you don't care how the music looks, only how it sounds, or (2) the music doesn't mix different subdivisions of the beat simultaneously (e.g., there aren't quintuplet eighths in one voice against regular eighths or sixteenths in another).

First of all, if you care how the music looks, it's a necessity to be using the Beta Test version of NWC 1.70, since its feature set is much richer than that of 1.55. If you don't already have 1.70, go to www.ntworthy.com/nwcpreview and download it. You won't be disappointed.

Given the features of 1.70, the easiest way to simulate odd subdivisions visually is to change the tempo and time signature to accommodate the extra notes and then make the changes invisible (almost any object can be rendered invisible in 1.70). To take an example, one piece I'm writing has 32nd-note quintuplets that take up the first 1/4 of a 2/4 measure at the tempo (quarter = 138). At the beginning of the measure I change the time signature to 17/32 (2/4 = 16/32, plus 1/32 for the extra 32nd note in the quintuplet), and increase the tempo to (quarter = 173), which causes 5 32nd notes to play in the time of 4 at (quarter = 138). Immediately after the quintuplet I change the tempo back to 138, and at the end of the measure I change the time signature back to 2/4. 1.70 lets me make the time signature and tempo changes all invisible. Finally I beam together the 32nd notes and insert a slur and a text "5" over them to simulate a quintuplet marking. (1.70 also lets you control the direction of slurs and ties.)

In my case all the other voices have rests while the quintuplet is playing, and it's a simple matter to insert an invisible 32nd rest to fill out these measures, although in fact that's not necessary because the rests last through the full measure and a whole rest fills a 17/32 measure as easily as a 2/4 measure. If there were 8th notes sounding simultaneously with the quintuplet, I would insert a hidden 32nd rest after each 8th and either rely on its shortness to keep listeners from noticing it, or mute the visible staves and supply hidden staves where the 8th notes are actually extended by being tied to 32nds.

However, the mechanism outlined above wouldn't work if the quintuplet 32nds were to be played simultaneously with 4 regular 32nds or 2 regular 16ths. But if you really don't care how the music looks, you can still achieve a reasonable effect by finding a tempo that will allow you to notate both groupings correctly. For example, to notate 5 quarters against 4 you could notate your quintuplet as a series of quarters (5 * 4/16 = 20/16) and your quadruplet as a series of quarters tied to 16ths (4 * 5/16 = 20/16), then increase the tempo by 25 percent to account for the extra quarter note in each voice (20 16ths in the place of 16). Needless to say, this would end up looking a little funky, but it would sound just fine. (In fact, if NWC could allow you to hide a tie to a hidden note, it might not even look too bad.)

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Apr-2000

Wow, Grant, you should really submit this as a user tip, or as an addition to the FAQ!

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Apr-2000

For an example of quintuplets, see http://homes.acmecity.com/music/recording/273/NewFeatures.nwc

Netscape users should use http://homes.acmecity.com/music/recording/273/NewFeatures.zip

Reply 4 offered by: Michael Powell on 29-Apr-2000

Blair. NewFeatures.nwc ia a very nice, clear, and concise example of how to adjusts for n-tuplets, rests within barred notes, as well as uses of the Boxmarks fonts.

Until NoteWorthy Composer can handle these things (wishful thinking hint, hint), everyone should download this example and refer all future inqiries to this message thread.


#1541: duplets?!?!?
duplets?!?!?

(1541)

Submitted by: Katie Roberts on 30-Apr-2000

Is it possible to get duplets on noteworthy? and as another question can I get broken chords as well? They appear in the samples given by noteworthy but I cant seem to find out how to insert them into a composition.
any suggestions?
thank you

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Apr-2000

Duplets can be achieved by using dotted notes. For example, if you want two (duplet) 1/8 notes in the space normally taken by three ordinary 1/8 notes, use two dotted 1/8ths.

The broken chords (arpeggios) are best done using two separate staves. The first (visual) staff is muted, and shows the chord (optionally using an arpeggio marking such as is available in the Boxmarks font). The (hidden) sounding staff actually "spells out" the arpeggio, either using a series of grace notes tied to the chord, or using a series of 1/32 or 1/64 notes.

Reply 2 offered by: Katie Roberts on 30-Apr-2000

thank you very much it was a great help!

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 30-Apr-2000

In the 1.70 Beta you can do the arpeggio using tied grace notes, and hide them. This way you don't need a hidden staff.
When the chord spans two staves use grace note rests to ensure the notes play in the correct order. For example, bottom chord has 3 grace notes then 3 grace rests, top chord has 3 grace rests then 3 grace notes.


#1542: Sheet Music
Sheet Music

(1542)

Submitted by: James on 01-May-2000

Where can I get free sheet music from musicals on the web?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-May-2000

Here's one place to start:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/freeshee.htm

Be sure you check out the "other links" sites for ones that aren't on my site.


#1543: Automatic creation of natural accidental
Automatic creation of natural accidental

(1543)

Submitted by: Anders on 02-May-2000

When I create a new song with (for example) an E Flat Major key signature Note Worthy Composer automatically creates a natural accidental in front of the notes with the Flat accidentals (a, b, e). How can I turn this off?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-May-2000

That's exactly what it should do. If you don't want naturals shown on B, E and A, write in C major. :)

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 02-May-2000

I'm a bit confused. It doesn't put those natural accidentals in new songs (I've tried a few seconds ago). It does it when you use the key signature having one allready.

But if you insert a C Major key signature (at the beginning or when there isn't any preceeding one) you will see an F natural accidental which shouldn't have been there.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-May-2000

Firstly - each staff should have it's own key signature - the key signature in the first staff is not automatically copied into each new staff.
You can create the first staff with it's clef, time and key signatures - add new staves - then copy and paste the clef, key and time signatures into the new staves sharing the same parameters.

When you set up a staff it should have a key signature before you enter any notes.
Always enter a key signature even if the key is C major or A minor because NWC needs a key signature in the staff to correctly transpose the entire staff to another key (for example a transposing instrument originally scored in concert pitch).

If you add a key signature after notes with accidentals are entered you can change the displayed accidentals to match the key signature.
Use the menu TOOLS > TRANSPOSE STAFF then set the Staff Transposition to 0 (zero) semitones and press OK to exit and update the accidentals.

If you enter a note using the Arrow keys and Enter key
it should NOT add an accidental unless you have the Natural attribute selected and this should cancel after entering the first note.

I can only repeat your problem if I have the NATURAL attribute set on the Toolbar with the PERSISTENT NOTE TOOLS
set ON (that's the little dropper bottle).
Try turning this off.

If you are Step Entering notes from a midi keyboard the notes entered will be given accidentals only if the note is not diatonic in the staff key signature.

Hope this helps in some way.

Reply 4 offered by: chris on 03-May-2000

One more thing to add to the comment that NWC shows an F natural when you select C major as the key signature. This is shown in the editing window only, and does not show up in print preview or actual printed scores.

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-May-2000

Good catch Chris!

Reply 6 offered by: Anders on 05-May-2000

Thanks a lot you for your answer Barry it solved all of my problems


#1544: Delete text above bar line
Delete text above bar line

(1544)

Submitted by: Carl P. Olson on 02-May-2000

This problem probably has a very obvious solution, but it has stumped me so far.

I am having trouble deleting some text I inserted well above the bar line, staff position 15 o4 16, to indicate the original composer, with the Preserve Width box unchecked. The cursor moves above the bar line just fine, but I can't get the bar line to move down so I can see what I'm deleting. When I try to do it blind, the delete key just starts removing the bar line. Is there a way I can delete text above the bar line without removing the notes?

Any help with this would be appreciated, just for future idiot-proofing.

Thank you in advance

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-May-2000

Go to Staff Properties, then temporarily increase the vertical spacing for the staff. You can now see what you are editing.


#1545: Optimizing import function
Optimizing import function

(1545)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 03-May-2000

Does NWC have any plans to optimize importing?

At least two points are urgent to me:

1) Dynamics. Volume changes can easily be transcribed as dynamics and dynamic changes.
2) Pitch bends. Tempered midi files have no resemblance with the imported NWC. I think an optimized control on pitch bends will solve that.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-May-2000

These are items that you should add to the Wish List.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 05-May-2000

Thanks Barry Graham, I already did.

Reply 3 offered by: Soap on 12-May-2000

What about the idea a couple of years ago for gray scaled notes denoting volume. This would enable you to insert dynamics as you can "see" what the pitch is after import.
Son of a pitch.

Reply 4 offered by: Soap on 12-May-2000

...as you can "see" the volume, I meant to say...
Son of a Pitch™

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 12-May-2000

Soap:
Excuse me but I couldn't understand.
What's that gray scaled notes?

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 17-May-2000

[question mark]

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-May-2000

I would guess that "Soap" is not planning to answer your question. I suspect that the idea of gray scaled notes is basically this: the darker the note, the louder its volume. We do not plan to use colour in this fashion, as is clear from the new features in version 1.70.

Reply 8 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 18-May-2000

Thanks to NWOnline.
Well, do you have any further plans for import optimizing?

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-May-2000

Sure, we have many plans. However, until we have something that is actually available in product form, we do not discuss it in any detail.

Reply 10 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 19-May-2000

All right, that seems to be a "merchantillistical" answer, what I mean is if we could expect some actual improvement in midifile importing. But I assume (and hope) that's included in your reply.
Thanks


#1546: Trade jazz fakes
Trade jazz fakes

(1546)

Submitted by: groove kid on 04-May-2000

Hi I'd like to trade jazz noteworthy files with other users. If you have transcribed any tunes or notated head arrangements please let me know.

Please note that I am happy to trade tunes only when they are are out of print, to be used for educational or non-commercial purposes such as education or practice. I play in a big band and quintet and I have found it useful to put some arrangements I have purchased into Noteworthy as I can print the music bigger (print a part on two pages instead of one) and so I can hear an arrangement I haven't heard before, and things like that.
As a publishing musician myself, I deeply respect copyright concerns!

So that is what I'm interested in.
Please email me at businessnet@bitsmart.com.
Thanks guys!

Reply 1 offered by: groove kid on 04-May-2000

Should be: ...please note that I am happy to trade tunes only when they are are out of print, OR to be used for educational or non-commercial purposes such as education or practice...

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-May-2000

I have a couple of charts for medium and big band that have been transcribed from disk and therefore not in print.
Some in NWC format others in Cakewalk Scorewriter format.
The NWC charts probably need to be worked over with Boxmarks to get rehearsal marks and multi-measure rests.
Let me know.


#1547: Enharmonic Transposition???
Enharmonic Transposition???

(1547)

Submitted by: Jim Lendvay on 04-May-2000

If if transpose a part and it ends up in the key of C-sharp, how the heck can I get it to read in D-flat?

Seven sharps is confounding my French Horn Player (also a Noteworthy owner).

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 04-May-2000

I love synchronicity. I answered this very question yesterday on the "preview" forum. Here's what I said:

Try this:

1. Tools/Force Accidentals
2. Change key signature from 7 sharps to 5 flats
3. Tools/Tranpose Staff/0 semitones
4. Tools/Audit Accidentals

This will probably give you the result you're looking for.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-May-2000

Funny thing about brass players - they love flat keys!
As an Alto player I prefer C# to Db everytime.

I wrote a piece for a big band a few years ago that put the troms in G - one trom player suggested it would be better in a flat key.
I rewrote his part in C with F# written as Gb.
He wasn't amused!

Reply 3 offered by: Brenda McNenny on 05-Jun-2000

Funny thing about guitar players - they HATE flat keys!


#1549: 3 Minor (Key) Problems
3 Minor (Key) Problems

(1549)

Submitted by: Steve Allen on 08-May-2000

Three related questions:

1. I have a piece in Gm, NWC insists on displaying Gb's when I want F#'s. Is there any way to globally change the Gb's to F#'s? It's a lot of work to change each occurance individually! Perhaps some combination of steps involving force accidentals, transpose 0 and audit accidentals?

2. A piece in F#m, NWC insists on displaying F naturals when I want E#'s. Is there a clever fix?

3. A piece in C#m, NWC insists on displaying C naturals when I want B#'s. Is there a clever fix?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 08-May-2000

You forgot Dm with a Db leading note!

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Allen on 08-May-2000

I left out Dm deliberately because there is a fix:

1) Highlight the Dm key signature and keep it highlighted -- you'll change it twice.
2) force accidentals,
3) change key signature to G (major)
4) transpose 0 steps,
5) Force accidentals
6) change the key signature to Dm,
7) Audit accidentals

Of course other accidentals may be altered by this procedure, but the C#'s will come out OK.

I posted this message hoping to uncover a Dm-style fix for Gm, C#m, and F#m.

Here's a fix for Gm that, it seems to me, should work but doesn't:
1) change key signature to the user defined key signature Bb, Eb, F#.
2) Transpose 0, This should (but doesn't) turn Gb's to F#'s.
3) Force accidentals.
4) Change key signature to Gm.
5) Audit accidentals.

Variants of this fix *should* work in minor keys that don't involve double sharps. (They would work in minor keys with double sharps if user defined keys could include double sharps.)

Now that I think about it, if transpose 0 worked in this fashion, I might be able to globally change any accidental to its enharmonic equivalent using a similar procedure. Example: a Dm piece with a bunch of Ab's that I wish were displayed as G#s, including one particularly ugly passage that reads (using n for a natural, b for a flat) A bA nA bA nA. Proposed solution:

1) change key signature to the user defined key signature Bb, C#, G#.
2) Transpose 0. This should turn Ab's to G#'s.
3) Force accidentals.
4) Change key signature back to Dm.
5) Audit accidentals.

All Ab's are now G#'s.

Could I be on to something here?

Steve

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-May-2000

I hope so - but should these workarounds be necessary?

Reply 4 offered by: dopey on 09-May-2000

Okay there's probably something I missed but I imported a piece written in Bb.

I add the key signature for Bb yet all the As are still all sharps. (#)

What I do?

Reply 5 offered by: dopey on 09-May-2000

ok, I must give you some more info.

I imported the melody line only because I added chords above the line with the text feature.

The melody uses some accidentals.

What I'm asking is, how can I force a key change so it summarises the notes, ie. turns A# into Bb when I add key signature Bb?

Reply 6 offered by: Barry Graham on 09-May-2000

This is probably more steps than you need - but if I'm wrong someone will correct me.

1. TOOLS > FORCE ACCIDENTALS
2. TOOLS > TRANSPOSE STAFF Set transposition to 0 zero - OK
3. TOOLS > AUDIT ACCIDENTALS

You may not need step 3.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-May-2000

Steve - here's something to add to your bag of tricks: use the custom key signature option. For example, in Gm, change to a custom key sig containing Bb, Eb and F#. Then do the usual transpose 0, force accidentals, change to a standard Gm key sig, and audit accidentals.

Reply 8 offered by: Steve Allen on 09-May-2000

Fred: try the sequence you describe with a Gm piece that contains a few Gb's. It won't transform the Gb's to the desired F#'s.

---------
Added thoughts regarding minor keys:

Here's a more complete analysis of NWC's minor scale difficulties. I'll use the letter n to denote naturals and ## to denote double sharps. The potential problems concern the 6th and 7th degrees of each scale.

Cm defaults to An and Bn -- OK
C#m defaults to A# (OK) and Cn (should be B#)
Dm defaults to Bn (OK) and Db (should be C#)
D#m defaults to Cn (should be B#) and Dn (should be C##)
Ebm defaults to Cn and Dn -- OK
Em defaults to C# and D# -- OK
Fm defaults to Dn and En -- OK
F#m defaults to D# (OK) and Fn (should be E#)
Gm defaults to En (OK) and Gb (should be F#)
G#m defaults to Fn (should be E#) and G (should be F##)
Abm defaults to Fn and Gn -- OK
Am defaults to F# and G# -- OK
A#m defaults to Gn (should be F##) and An (should be G##)
Bbm defaults to Gn and An -- OK
Bm defaults to G# and A# -- OK

(To review these problems yourself, enter a Cm melodic scale with an Cm key signature and successively transpose it up by half steps. When you get to D#m force accidentals, switch the key signature from D#m to Ebm, and transpose 0 steps. Same for G#m and A#m.) Thus, ignoring the accidental-heavy keys, one should avoid Gm, C#m, and F#m when using NWC. If you use these keys, be prepared to do a lot of fixing. All are common keys so this is a significant problem.

It appears that NWC defaults to C over B#, F over E#, and naturals over double sharps, no matter what the key signature. Since NWC also chooses flats to display accidentals in flat keys, we get the Dm and Gm problems. Interestingly, I checked each of the problem scales in Cakewalk Express (a budget sequencer with limited notation capabilities) and it displayed every scale perfectly, double sharps and all.

Reply 9 offered by: Steve Allen on 11-May-2000

Given NWC's minor-key shortcomings, what's the best fix? Let's explore the possibilites by means of an example. Suppose F natural occurs in a piece with an A major (3 sharp) key signature, do I want NWC to display F natural or E#? It of course depends upon context and we can't reasonably expect NWC to know that. In addition, some people are uncomfortable with E#'s, they prefer F naturals even when E#'s are technically correct. It seems to me that there are several possible solutions.

(1) Provide a search and replace (S&R) command that can, say, change all occurances of F5 to E#5 in a group of selected notes or chords. Follow that S&R command with an AuditAccidentals command and you'll clear out any unnecessary F#'s that remain -- as might occur if F# alternated with F natural several times. If the highlighted area contains chords in which a requested replacement is impossible, NWC could highlight the offending chord, report "Can't change the selected item" and stop. (Or perhaps issue a warning similar to those transpose staff periodically issues.)

(2) NWC could make a distinction between major keys and their relative minors. If the relative minor is specified, NWC defaults to the accidentals likely to occur in that minor key. Example continued: if F# minor is specified, NWC defaults to E#. If A major is specified NWC defaults to F natural. Perhaps NWC could display in non-printing text "F#m" or "A" below a 3 sharp key signature to indicate which key has been defined.

(3) Enhance NWC so a zero-semitone TransposeStaff command works with user-defined key signatures as it now works with standard key signatures. (I'm inclined to say that TransposeStaff should have worked this way in the first place.) Continuing the example: To get E#'s in our piece, (a) force accidentals, (b) define the key signature F#, C#, G#, E# (A major + E#), (c) transpose 0, which changes the F naturals to E#'s, (d) force accidentals, (e) restore the original A key signature, and (f) audit accidentals. All those F naturals are now E#'s. If this sounds involved, remember that it's much easier than separately changing a bunch of F naturals to E#'s, particularly if F naturals occur in chords. If you want F naturals in one part of a piece and and E#'s in another, then bound the change area with an A major key signature. F's beyond that key signature won't be touched.


#1551: Where can I find a good beat?
Where can I find a good beat?

(1551)

Submitted by: Acrah on 09-May-2000

I like playing at the sime as my computer. Usually I prefer to just get a beat to play and I improvise to it. Anyone know where I can find some good beats?

Reply 1 offered by: Son of a Pitch on 12-May-2000

hey... easy.
Just search the net for "drum patterns" or "midi files" and grab some grooves off them.
SOAP.


#1552: pitch band
pitch band

(1552)

Submitted by: Michiel on 09-May-2000

Can the pitch band have higher values than 8192 or something in NWC? If the answer is no, I think I have a little problem.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 09-May-2000

Strictly speaking, the problem is not with the numeric range of the pitch bend MPC, but with the setting of a separate MIDI controller that determines how the numeric value of the pitch bend is interpreted. Be that as it may, NWC unfortunately doesn't currently allow you access to this other controller (which, according to my feeble understanding, is not interpreted in the same way by all soundcards or other MIDI devices).

However, you may want to look at msg #1477 for a hack that can be used to work around the current pitch-bend MPC limitation.

Reply 2 offered by: Michiel on 09-May-2000

Thanks for the tip.


#1554: I am stuck
I am stuck

(1554)

Submitted by: Jordan on 11-May-2000

I am writing a symphony and I have the first two movements done but I cant get anything that sounds good out of my head! Think I should just take a few days off? I have been working for weeks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-May-2000

Yes. :)

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Oakes on 11-May-2000

No, just go for a wander around outside, relax a bit and let the sounds come to you. Or steal something.

Reply 3 offered by: groove kid on 12-May-2000

Reverse-Engineer some Beethoven or Debussy.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-May-2000

Hello Stephen Oakes.
Good to see you around again!

Reply 5 offered by: Charles Sonnier on 15-May-2000

Read a book about harmony and counterpoint while listening to Mozart. Then take a long walk.


#1555: Fusing staffs together?
Fusing staffs together?

(1555)

Submitted by: Kals on 14-May-2000

I am using NoteWorthy Composer 1.55b.

I have been wondering if there is a way to automatically fuse staffs together, and automatically generating chords or something...

Thanks

Kals

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 15-May-2000

It sounds to me like you're describing Staff Layering, which is an experimental feature in 1.55 (it becomes official in 1.70). It's described in the "User Tips" section of this web site: http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#layer

Reply 2 offered by: Kals on 15-May-2000

It...it worked... thanks!

Reply 3 offered by: Kals on 15-May-2000

Well... almost. What this does is mainly just putting them one over another.
I was thinking about actually fusing them, so that it would automatically make the chord arrangements and change the keys so that it respects the clef or something... not just crushing a symbol over another, it looks like some kind of alien music :)

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-May-2000

One way to actually fuse them together is to use the following trick:

Delete all staves except the ones you want to merge.
Put all the remaining staves on the same midi channel.
Export (Save As... in V1.70) Type 0 midi.
Re-import the midi into a new NWC file, you can then copy the resulting single staff and paste into your original arrangement.

Do this before you spend much time tweaking (dynamics, etc.) because they'll be ignored on re-import.

It should be noted that with V1.70's new "hide anything" feature, the "alien music" problem has been overcome. As noted in the program help file, layering was an experimental feature in 1.55x, whereas it is fully implemented in the new release.

Reply 5 offered by: Kals on 15-May-2000

Thanks a lot, however, I can't find anything about version 1.7 on this site... it looks like 1.55b was the latest release. Maybe it's an upgrade patch or something?

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-May-2000

No, V1.70 is presently in beta-testing. You can either wait for it to go into public release, or if you want to take part in the beta-testing program just go to Noteworthy's site at http://www.ntworthy.com and you'll see the link to the beta area.

Reply 7 offered by: Kals on 16-May-2000

Fred:

I downloaded 1.7 and your method works perfectly! Thanks a lot!


#1556: Which is the best synthesizer to use?
Which is the best synthesizer to use?

(1556)

Submitted by: Dan Pergau on 15-May-2000

Good morning from gorgeous Ottawa, Canada.

This is my first visit to this forum so I'll apoligize in advance for any errors I have/will make =)

I am looking at buying a synthesizer to hook up to my PC for both composing and playing... which synth works best with NoteWorthy? I am using Windows 2000 and have seen the grief that 155a has giving some Win2k users.. I'll try out 155B when I get home or just wait anxiously for 1.7 =) Any ideas and help is greatly appreciated!!

Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-May-2000

Welcome Dan and greetings from wonderful Melbourne, Australia.

I guess you mean a keyboard synth - yes?
As long as your keyboard is GM capable and can send midi messages via the keyboard midi out port and receive messages thru the keyboard midi in port you should have no problems.

If you intend to use the keyboard as an external sound device take a good listen to the GM sounds on the models you check out.


#1557: Running NWC under Linux
Running NWC under Linux

(1557)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 16-May-2000

Hiall.

Just as a question. How many of you registered users out there use Linux, or would rather use Linux and would be happier to see NWC run under it? I personally find the idea very appealing, as the only use for windows I have is running NWC, the rest of my needs being accomodated by a Linux distribution I have installed on my PC.

S

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-May-2000

I would be happy to re-install Linux/Xwindows if NWC were available for that platform. Unfortunately, I had to give up on Linux because there just aren't enough good music programs available for it yet. What I'd really like to see is a version of Wine that actually works... then we could use the apps with which we're already familiar on a more stable platform.

Reply 2 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 19-May-2000

Fred, you couldn't be far from right. Things are slowly turniung up for Linux, as the user base grows by the day. Admittedly it is not half as user friendly it is portraied to be and the RTFM approach doesn't really help... I am however forced to run a dual; boot box just because the software isn't yet available and wINE is pathetic. Its only fo rmusic that I keep the win partition and nothing else. WHy should I be forced to do that though?

Reply 3 offered by: Nigel Horne on 31-May-2000

I disagree with your comments about Wine. Whilst it's true that it's slow for bloatware like Word (well what else do you expect - it IS an emulator after all), I find it's fine for the music software I use. I can happily use both NWC and Finale 2000 on Linux when using the latest Wine.

-Nigel

Reply 4 offered by: slig on 31-May-2000

i'll drink to that!


#1559: Widening note spacing / fingering spacing.
Widening note spacing / fingering spacing.

(1559)

Submitted by: Susan on 19-May-2000

1. Is there any way of widening the note spacing further than the set duration of the note to make room for long words in lyrics?

2. I have been entering fingering on parts above and below notes, and this looks fine on screen. When I print the fingering appears to the left of the note especially at the beginning of bars. How can this be prevented?

Many thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 19-May-2000

In 1.70, you can select your fingering and open properties(right-click menu)/expression placement (tab)/justification (pop up list) then select "right" or "middle" through your intension.

In 1.55, you can try faking the program by adding one or two spaces before your character.

(I generally use lyrics for fingering but mine are not for piano, so I insert some upper or lowercase arrows from symbol font)


#1560: just wondering...
just wondering...

(1560)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 19-May-2000

How much for an acoustic bas?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-May-2000

How much have you got? :)

Seriously, for something kinda ok, figure on about $2000. For something really good, how much have you got?

Reply 2 offered by: Takahiro Tamiya on 21-May-2000

Do you mean DoubleBass ? In Brassband and WindEnsemble, this is called AccousticBass . I know below
For Beginner, about $1500 - .
This material of surface is layered wood.
For AmaturePlayer about $3000 -,
This is made by single wood at factory.
For Professinal use, about $10000 - .
This is hand-made .
For Solo use , about $20000 - astronomical. :)
This is old instrument.
If you you use in orhcestra , please check bows.
And, if want , you better choose dealer.

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 22-May-2000

Well, I was talking about the guitar-shaped electroacoustic basses. I bought one on Saturday, an Alliance VP, handcrafted, hidden pickups, for £300.

I bought that instead of an double bass or an electric one for three reasons; a) you can play it without an amp b) you can plug it in an amp c) it is rather cheaper and easier to carry about than a double bass.

Thanks for the advice guys!


#1561: Widening note spacing to make room for lyrics etc.
Widening note spacing to make room for lyrics etc.

(1561)

Submitted by: Susan on 20-May-2000

Is there any way of widening note spacing to make room for long words in lyrics etc.?

Many thanks for your help.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-May-2000

This is done automatically.


#1563: RE:  Widening note spacing to make room for lyrics
RE:  Widening note spacing to make room for lyrics

(1563)

Submitted by: Susan on 21-May-2000

Sorry, I wasn't clear enough when I asked this question before....

I am using Noteworthy Composer V1.70 to write out piano music with lyrics. In some cases, the tune is split between treble and bass clefs. I have found that if there is a long word in the lyrics at the point where the tune moves between clefs, the note spacing is not widened to make room for the longer word; instead, the lyrics jump to a lower line (where more than one lyric line is in use) or get printed on top of one another.
Is there any way to correct this?

I hope this is a little clearer.
Thanks again.

Reply 1 offered by: Susan on 24-May-2000

Please help me, someone!! If this can't be done... say so!!

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-May-2000

I do not understand what you are asking. It is also not clear what you mean by "asked this questions before" in your post.

In NWC, a lyric is assigned to one staff. It does not switch between parts. Each syllable is measured, and space is automatically made available for it under its assigned note.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 24-May-2000

I think you're trying to do something that NWC is just not set up to do. NWC associates a given set of lyrics with one and only one staff; having the lyrics jump from one staff to another is bound to be unsuccessful.

By the way, what is "piano music with lyrics"? Most people, when dealing with lyrics, write out the individual vocal line(s) with lyrics and then provide a separate, wordless accompaniment on piano or other instruments. (I know piano teachers tell you to make the instrument sing, but I don't think they intend this to involve actual words.)

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-May-2000

I found the prior message (I thought your question rang a bell): msg #1561

You can do a lot of little tricks with lyrics to get to a satisfactory result. It is not clear what you are trying to do, but here are some tricks to consider:

- In version 1.70, you can have the lyric line skip whole note sections by using the Lyric Syllable note property (selct the notes, press Alt+Enter).

- You can combine two syllables such that they attach to a single note by separating them with an underscore.

- You can move lyrics around using the Alignment feature

- You can use staff layering to perform some interesting lyric tricks by overlapping a staff and using it for special lyric situations

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-May-2000

"Piano music with lyrics" - The lead sheet is almost universal as the method of presenting a song for sale.
The lead sheet has a vocal staff with lyrics and a grand stave piano accompaniment below usually with chord notation.

It's the recognizd way to submit a song for copyright registration.

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 24-May-2000

Barry, you're describing exactly what I was - a vocal staff with lyrics and separate staves for the accompaniment. If I read Susan's initial posting correctly, she is dispensing with the vocal staff and assigning the lyrics to the piano staves. At least this is how I interpret the odd behavior she sees "at the point where the tune moves between clefs" [I presume she really means "staves", not "clefs"]. If this isn't what she's trying to do, why is she having trouble at all?

Reply 7 offered by: Susan on 25-May-2000

By "piano music with lyrics" I mean a score of very simple piano music (2 staves) with lyrics in between the two staves. This is for Christmas Carols etc. so that the pupil can "singalong" the words in his head as he plays.

This music is being created solely for my piano pupils, and I do not intend publishing it!!

There seems to be some difficulty in understanding what I need to do. Basically, in plain english... I need to know how I can widen the spacing of notes. I need to widen them further than the "increased spacing for longer note durations" option.

I hope this is a little clearer!!

Many thanks for your help so far.

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 25-May-2000

So, you have the two standard piano staves, the melody switches from one to the other, leaving some bars with nothing but rests, and you want to assign lyrics.

I think you have to use both staves for lyrics. The lyrics can be set so they both occupy the same line. You have to assign an underscore for every note where you don't want the lyrics to appear. For example, if the bass line has chords, each one needs an underscore because the lyrics are on the other staff.

If for some reason you want to increase note spacing, you can do it by padding a lyric with underscores, like ___this___.

I hope this helps. If not, tell me what I don't understand about your problem.

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 25-May-2000

The other thing to try would be to insert text items containing nothing but blanks and give them the "preserve width" attribute.

Reply 10 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-May-2000

You do not need to use the increase note spacing for longer durations. Extra space is added to a note automatically if it is needed by the attached lyric syllable.

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-May-2000

The scenario of placing a lyric in a piano grand staff is also covered by the tutorial in the User's Guide, if you are unsure of how to set this up.


#1564: Pedal release not executed when immediate down
Pedal release not executed when immediate down

(1564)

Submitted by: Cyril on 21-May-2000

Hi everyone who reads !

I've got a little problem when playing back : when a pedal release mark is immediately followed by a pedal down mark, my keyboard keep the preceeding notes running. It's quite annoying, because in piano pieces, it's very often used. Is there a simple solution, or is it due to my MIDI keyboard (Yamaha PSR-540) ?

Thanks a lot in advance

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-May-2000

I was able to test this on a PSR-520, and did not have the problem you describe.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Eidson on 21-May-2000

One solution I may have to offer:

Make sure that the Pedal Down marking and the Pedal Up marking are on the same channel -- sounds like a simple thing to fix but I've been stumped on this one before when I had the treble / bass staves on different channels.

-j

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-May-2000

I have the same problem on my DB60XG. Must be a Yamaha thing (or a "Some Yamahas" thing). If there is no intervening note between the pedal-off and the next pedal-on, the pedal hangs. Something I've learned to live with by putting an un-sustained note between the two events.

Reply 4 offered by: Cyril on 28-May-2000

Maybe a small explication I have found while testing my keyboard : in fact, when you release a note, the default reverb effect make the sound to continue during a small period. If the pedal is pressed while the sound isn't over, the remaining volume is maintained. So I was able to solve the problem by creating a third staff (on the same channel), where I insert a small rest before pressing the pedal back on.
It looks like :
|o d d o |
|%Ped S.. * %Ped S.. *|

where % means a sixteenth rest, S.. a double-quoted quarter rest, o a quarter note and d a eighth note for example.
I hope you have understand !
Thanks a lot for your advices !


#1566: Importing MIDIs-Stacatos
Importing MIDIs-Stacatos

(1566)

Submitted by: Partical_Man on 22-May-2000

I was wondering......... I have the shareware version of NWC, and when I import MIDIs, there are no stacatos or dynamic markings. I need to know if it does this in the registered version.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 23-May-2000

You'll find the registered version behaves the same way as the unregistered version in this regard.


#1569: Right Lyric Order with Repeats in Melody
Right Lyric Order with Repeats in Melody

(1569)

Submitted by: Terry Jones on 23-May-2000

Help - I've tried the FAQ's & the offline Forum but can't find an answer to this one:

I have a tune which goes AABAAB (It's actualy "Fairest Isle by Purcell)
Musicaly it's easy enough to do A(repeat A)B(repeat the whole lot) to give AABAAB but the verses go:

A Verse 1 part 1
A Verse 1 part 2
B Verse 1 part 3
A Verse 2 part 1
A Verse 2 part 2
B Verse 2 part 3

I could write the tune out "flat" as AAB (repeat) with two flat verses
Lyric line 1- V1.1, V1.2, V1.3
Lyric line 2- V2.1, V2.2, V2.3

But this seems rather inelegant as you don't need to do this musicaly.

I can get it to work with just one verse by:
A (master repeat) B
Lyric line 1- V1.1
Lyric line 2- V1.2, V1.3

And there are one or two other combinations which seem to work with one verse.
But I've tried all sorts of combinations of master & local repeats, redirections etc. and I haven't been able to find any combination which lets me write
A(repeat A)B(repeat the whole lot) musicaly and gets the lyrics right.

I'm using Version 1.55b (32 bit), but I've just downloaded the V1.70 beta 4 if that's got any new features which help ... on which note ... help please! <G>

Thanks - Terry Jones

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-May-2000

If you are simply trying to get the lyric to highlight in a particular order, you should know that this is not always possible. When you are combining different repeats and flow directions, NWC will not always highlight the same lyric that you think should be sung. You basically just have to live with this limitation, at least for now.


#1570: Staff layering
Staff layering

(1570)

Submitted by: Roger Eineichner on 24-May-2000

Sorry for any non-musical terminology, I'm just trying to help out my son with a homework assignment here... He wrote something that has 3 staffs, but his teacher has asked him to combine the first two onto one staff. I figured out how to do the staff layering, but it mushes the rest from the second staff with the note on the first, which makes it hard to read. But if he removes the rest from the second staff, it shifts everything over so his measures aren't in sync. Is there any way to maintain the alignment but "hide" the staff 2 rests when they are layered?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-May-2000

Normally, you would simply move the rest up or down to avoid the collision. If you select the rest, you can move it using Ctrl+E to edit its properties.

Reply 2 offered by: Roger Eineichner on 24-May-2000

Thanks for the Ctrl+E tip. I also did a little more reading in the forum and discovered the cool new "hide" ability in version 1.7 (ALT+ENTER) so that also gives him what he wants.


#1571: How can I convert midi to wave?
How can I convert midi to wave?

(1571)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 24-May-2000

I'm using NWC to convert .nwc to .mid. Now I need to convert .mid to .wav so I can put my songs on a CD.

I downloaded an app called WAVMaker III but can't get it to run. It asks for .prg files which are not included and I don't know if (or how) to make them.

It's supposed to be an evaluation copy, but unless I'm missing something, it's too seriously crippled to be any good.

Can anyone help me convert these files to .wav? I would appreciate it.

Regards,
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 24-May-2000

This has been discussed any number of times in this forum. Check out msg #1003 and msg #1207, for example.

Reply 2 offered by: david on 07-Feb-2002

hi
you can convert midi to wave by jetaudio.or you can write ypur midi files on cd then put it in cdrom and use a cable from cdrom output to your sound card and write it by jetaudio or windows recorder.

best regards
david

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 07-Feb-2002

also msg #2219 .
if you don't want to use your sound card, you may audio compositor, but on a 166MHz Pentium (not PIII!) it takes 30 minutes for 3 seconds.
On more recent PCs, it takes much more, and you can use soundfonts.
HTH!

Reply 4 offered by: Niko on 10-Feb-2002

Well, there are all sorts of software components you could use... but to keep it simple and to do away with the need for downloading all this stuff. Just use your current Midi composer and good old windows Recored. Set your system Mixer (Windows Mixer) to record nothing but Midi or Synth and appon hitting the record button in the windows recorder, Hit the play button in your midi software. That will record the samples in real time to your hard drive as wav files. If you have any problems... Try using the Midi Mapper as your "Midi Play Device" (This you set up in your midi software. Oh and by the way... I hope you have a Full Duplex sound card.

Best of luck...

P.S. Alternative... Download a Win amp plugin at http://www.blorp.com/%7Epeter/midihelp/ to do this for you...

Cheers


#1572: Quantizing and recording
Quantizing and recording

(1572)

Submitted by: JD on 24-May-2000

Why is it that when I record all of the notes seem to get bundled together in a mass of dischordal pileups instead of the fluid 16th, 32nd, or even 64th notes that I am playing in real-time recording mode ? I have done this a number of times on both keyboard (Roland/Yamaha) and guitar (GI-10) using Passport MusicTime, and it seemed very straightforward to setup and use. I can't seem to make a go of it in NWC. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks In Advance.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-May-2000

You can:

- Set defaults for import in the Tools | Options | Import tab

- Import a specific sequence with custom settings via the Staff | Import Recording command

Reply 2 offered by: JD on 25-May-2000

ok I recorded about 6 measures by pressing the record button. After the recording was complete, I pressed stop (which is supposed to place the recorded performance in a buffer). When I went to Staff, Import Recording, I got an error saying "There is not any music in the recording buffer. You need to record a performance before this command can be used."
As for the first suggestion about the Tools|Options|Import , The following are the settings that are in use currently - Notate Pedal Marks - Checked; Automatic Beam - Checked; Insert Instrument Changes - Checked; Detect Compound Time - Checked; Note Resolution - Sixtyfourth Note; Rest Resolution - Sixteenth note; Seperate MIDI channels - Checked; Maximum single track chord size - 48
I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong, but it's been a few evenings' time trying alot of things that aren't working...
Help :(

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-May-2000

If the buffer is empty, then nothing was recorded. You need to check your MIDI input setup. First, make sure you can do step entry (Tools | MIDI Input Active). Then, load up a rhythm template and start recording. Play something on the keyboard in time with the rhythm. After you press Stop, your performance will be in the buffer.

Reply 4 offered by: JD on 26-May-2000

Ok, I opened and loaded a rhythymn template. When I went to start the recording process, I got an error which stated that the file had been created by a registered user and that I couldn't change the file. I also tried opening a new score first and then opening the template, but with the same results.
Help (still)...
tia

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-May-2000

You have to use File | New

Reply 6 offered by: JD on 26-May-2000

I'm afraid that this just may not work. I've been successful at using step entry on the keyboard but as soon as I try playing anything with any more resolution than a quarter-note, everything becomes jumbled. Strange that software should act this way...

Reply 7 offered by: JD on 26-May-2000

SUCCESS!!! I got it to record and it did play back a single right hand. SO, how about the same thing without a rhythymn template ???

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-May-2000

Possible, I suppose, if you've got "perfect time" :)

Seriously, the purpose of the rhythm template is to give you a "metronome" to play against, preventing that mess of 64ths and other strange creatures in your midi import.

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-May-2000

Exactly. You can create any rhythm file that you want. It can be as simple as just a tap on the ride cymbal, or whatever. NWC uses this rhythm play back in order to analyze your performance. Without it, your performance would be unbounded rhythmically, and the resulting notation would be unpredictable.


#1573: What can I do with this SoundPack?
What can I do with this SoundPack?

(1573)

Submitted by: Gordon on 25-May-2000

I downloaded the 27Mb Unison SoundPack this morning, and am trying to find a place to install it.

It's supposed to be GM, although enhanced in some way.

I would like to use it in NWC, but I've heard that NWC's sounds are picked up from the soundcard or the soft synth. Is this true?

It looks like my soundcard is a Riptide PCI Audio Device (never heard of it!) It came installed on an HP Pavilion. If the Unison SoundPack is compatible with my Riptide, where would I install it?

My goal is simply to get the best sound I can so that I can convert the .nwc files to .mid, then to .wav.

I can figure out most things, but .sf2 and .dls files are very confusing!

All help appreciated
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-May-2000

Hi. I don't think that your sound card will directly support sound fonts; but there's a way you can "render" midi files generated by NoteWorthy into wav files, that you can then listen to using any wav player, or convert to mp3 and listen to with mp3 players, etc.

I know of three such rendering programs:

TiMIDIty (free but a little tough to get the hang of. Windows GUI still under development)

Audio Compositor (easy to use, reasonably priced shareware)

Awave (some interesting options, slightly less reasonably priced shareware).

Reply 2 offered by: Sue Morton on 25-May-2000

Hi Gordon,

I'm not familiar with your card, but I would guess that your sound card does not support soundfonts. I'm not familiar with the Unison Soundpack either, but I am familiar with the Unison GM Bank of Soundfonts, I will presume that's what you have (.sf2 is an extension for soundfonts).

(Soundfonts are akin to typeface fonts for printers -- you can 'add' them to your soundcard's synth bank and then the card will render the instrument sound according to the soundfont that is loaded. SoundBlaster Live cards use Soundfont technology.)

My guess is that you are limited to the sounds made by the synth on your card. Unless you want to buy and install an SBLive card and deactivate your synth (I'm pretty sure HP Pavillions ship with an onboard sound module on the motherboard, not a separate card you can remove).

Best best is to call HP Customer Support if you don't have product manual that describes your sound card.

HTH and Good Luck,

Sue Morton

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Allen on 26-May-2000

1. Are there any non-soundblaster cards that support soundfonts?

2. TiMIDIty is an intriguing product, but when I tried it I was unhappy with the results. When it renders piano music it sounds like someone is continually mashing the pedal. After a few inquiries, I discovered that TiMIDIty is supposed to sound that way. If anyone has managed to make TiMIDIty sound good, I like to hear about it.

Reply 4 offered by: Sue Morton on 27-May-2000

Offhand I can't think of any other cards that support soundfonts natively. But there is a software-soundfont manager available, I just cannot recall the name right now to save my life!

Fred, I think you use/have tried this software?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 27-May-2000

Yes, the three I know of are listed in reply 1. The only one I've used on occasion is Audio Compositor, to check how my work will sound on Creative systems. I find TiMIDIty a bit incomplete yet, and Awave is way more than I need for this particular use.

Reply 6 offered by: Sue Morton on 28-May-2000

Sorry, Fred, I thought you listed those programs in reply 1 because they would convert midi to wav for Gordon. I didn't know they would also use soundfonts to render the MIDI sound when the card itself doesn't support soundfonts.


#1577: transposing for a b-flat instrument
transposing for a b-flat instrument

(1577)

Submitted by: David  on 28-May-2000

I have to transpose something in "Es" and I was wondering if that is E-flat or just E. Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-May-2000

"Es" is E-flat. "B" (in German scores) is B-flat. You can usually tell from a score what the transposition is; for example, if the un-transposed instruments are in Eb (three flats) and the transposed instrument is shown with a key signature of C (i.e. three steps sharper), then the instrument must be in Eb. Another example: if the violins, etc. are in Eb and the transposed instrument is shown in Bb (one step sharper), then the instrument must be an F instrument. And so on.

Reply 2 offered by: dave on 30-May-2000

thank you very much for the help!

Reply 3 offered by: Martin Segerstråle on 30-Jun-2000

Just to clear some things up, Es and B are very generally used as markings for E-flat and B-flat. Only English-speaking countries use the -flat markings. All European countries except for the UK use the Es and Bb markings.

...just in case...

/Martin
maseg@earthling.net
http://welcome.to/maseg/

Reply 4 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 03-Jul-2000

All European countries except for the UK use the Es and Bb markings...

...except France, Italy, Spain (I suppose Portugal too) that use Mi bemol and Si bemol for the above.


#1578: A dumb question...
A dumb question...

(1578)

Submitted by: Mark on 29-May-2000

Is it possible to "write" a score by playing it on a midi keyboard instead of typing it in?

Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 29-May-2000

The only "dumb" questions are those that are NOT asked.

You certainly can "play" a score in from a midi keyboard.

You can do this as "step" entry.
Select the duration for the note/s and play in the pitch of the note/s from the keyboard.
Use the "keyboard" icon on the toolbar to do this.
If your keyboard has a pitch wheel and a modulation wheel you can use these to select durations and dotted durations without having to select them on the screen or through the qwerty keyboard (see the Help file).

You can also "record" in realtime.
Select a rhythm template from among the samples provided (or create your own rhythm track - a measure with a large number of local repeats) to give you a metronome rhythm to play against.
Click on the "Record" button and play along - click on Stop when complete.

Depending on how you have set up the Import Options for recording the data may appear in a new window, a "record" staff group or will remain in the buffer and will not be displayed at all.
The settings for recording can be found in the Tools - Options - Record.

If you have selected Buffer as your import option the recorded data will not appear on the screen but must be imported into a staff using menu Staff - Import Recording.
This method has the advantage that you can control how the data is quantised and where the staff split occurs in a piano grand staff.
Read the Help section on Importing Midi files to understand this method.

With any of these import options you can always import the recording buffer into another staff with different settings if you are not happy with the original try.

I would suggest that you read the Help files on Step and Realtime erecording methods and also the sections on connecting your keyboard and setting up the Midi ports.

Hope all this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 13-Jul-2000

And if you don't have a real midi keyboard, you may have a fake one, thanks to piano21.exe !!

You may get it via :
http://nwcnewsbyemail.listbot.com/cgi-bin/subscriber?Act=view_message&list_id=nwcnewsbyemail&msg_num=439
(note: my email addresses in this post are no more valid)

It's already been discussed, but I don't remember if it was in the forum or/and the NG.
I bet it can be found in the offline forum ( http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm ), though.

Hope this helps!

Marsu


#1580: midi keyboard entry onto stave
midi keyboard entry onto stave

(1580)

Submitted by: Betty Coleman on 30-May-2000

When entering notes on the stave from a midi keyboard in the key of C and playing a Bb note, why do I get an A with a # on the stave instead of a B with a b against it. - I don't get the problem with the pc keyboard entry.
Can I change this somehow or do I have to use manual entry for all accidentals.
Your help would be appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-May-2000

NWC favors sharps when the piece is in the key of C, or any key that includes a sharp. If you are in a flat key, it will favor flats. You can re-spell after the fact by forcing accidentals, temporarily changing the key to include a flat, then using transpose 0 semitones to re-spell the staff.

See also: msg #1304,msg #3,msg #762,msg #786,msg #939


#1581: Document Exchange Format
Document Exchange Format

(1581)

Submitted by: Nigel Horne on 31-May-2000

A few years ago a format was proposed that would allow different formatting programs to exchange documents. It fell by the wayside becuase the big guns like Coda weren't interested. Can anyone remember the name of that format and where I can find out any information about it?

-Nigel

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-May-2000

I believe you're thinking of NIFF, "notation interchange file format" and you're right, it doesn't seem to have caught on. My attention has been directly lately at ABC, which is a text-based (and therefore editable) notation format which shows promise, and is more of a grass-roots thing rather than a proprietary format being pushed by the big guns.

Does anyone have any direct experience using ABC?

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-May-2000

See also: msg #821

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Allen on 31-May-2000

At http://mistral.ere.umontreal.ca/~belkina/NIFF.doc.html there's a document dated March 2000 called "The Current State of Niff."

Reply 4 offered by: Nigel Horne on 31-May-2000

Thanks for the info and URL about NIFF. Any one have any further pointers about ABC? I've not heard about this.

-Nigel

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 31-May-2000

Re ABC: Start here...

http://www.musicaviva.com/abc/index.html

and check out his resource links, especially the ABCyclopedia.

Reply 6 offered by: Nigel Horne on 01-Jun-2000

Thanks.

-Nigel

Reply 7 offered by: Harald Schollmeyer on 10-Jun-2000

http://www.s-line.de/homepages/gerd_castan/compmus/notationformats_e.html

...gives an excellent overview over various
notation formats.

Greetings,
Harald


#1582: anyone have standards in Eb and Bb?
anyone have standards in Eb and Bb?

(1582)

Submitted by: piano boy on 01-Jun-2000

if you have notated jazz standards in Eb or Bb could you email them to me? I am a piano player and I have already notated some Eb and Bb but it would help me if some one could send me their transpositions. I have bought stacks of books of jazz and funk tunes in C but I don't have the time to transpose and write everything into other keys. (even though it is quick to do in NOTEWORTHY -- once you have done the Eb version you can easily do the Bb version... which is what i REALLY like!) i am working with okay players but i don't trust them to transpose everything, especially when i have paying gigs. i have regular gigs and this would help greatly. otherwise i will just go solo with a bass player and drop the alto sax and trumpet.
cheers to noteworthy!

Reply 1 offered by: piano boy on 01-Jun-2000

PS, I am running version 1.55 which is VERY VERY good!
so if you can email them in that format I will be grateful.
(doesn't matter what key you have it in... I can transpose to the key I have printed in the books)
cheers

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Eidson on 02-Jun-2000

I have a 6-piece jazz combo (set, bass, piano, trumpet, sax, trombone) and I do all of the writing / arranging for the group. We play parties and dinners regularly and are farily well-recieved, even by the non-jazz community. :)
I can send you a list of songs that I have done, I would be very interested in trading some stuff because we are running out of new stuff to do. The most common key is F but there are a few Eb and many Bb charts.

-joe


#1585: Making a chart look like a chart
Making a chart look like a chart

(1585)

Submitted by: Nice with spice on 07-Jun-2000

I wrote a ska chart with piano, bass, guitar, sax, trumpet, and trombone and now I want to print the pages out so the chart is like a book.

What I mean is, print it out to the printer so the first page is piano on its own, the next page is bass, the next page is guitar, the next page is sax, the next page is trumpet, and the next page is trombone.

You know, print it out just like a chart I'd buy at a shop.
I also would like to just be able to save this as a PDF so I can dump it on a web site.

Then all the music is there... no fiddling by selecting one part, printing, selecting the next part, printing, et cetera et cetera. I reckon to do this would be a massive bonus.

Keep it up dudes! This is one kickass piece of engineering.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 07-Jun-2000

>...

I don't know a shortcut for now. You should exclude the parts which you don't like to print at the moment (from page setup | contents) and print.

>...

See user tips section. Fred has a solution.

Reply 2 offered by: Graham Howe on 07-Jun-2000

I've already done something like this: I scored each part as a separate score, then copied the pages of the score (using the "copy" facility in "Print preview" to pages of a "Wordpad" document.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 08-Jun-2000

If you wanbt to do a lot of general-purpose manipulation of the image (print) file from Noteworthy, then I suggest that you get software that will help you.

If you happen to have Adobe Illustrator, then try this: In Noteworthy, use "Print Preview" to look at your finished composition. Use the "Copy" command and create a placeable Metafile. Illustrator (at least, Illustrator 8) can open the Metafile as if it were a drawing (which it is). You may need to scale the opened Metafile by maybe 33% to fit on a page. You may also need to ungroup objects and release compound paths (if you have the software, then you know what I am talking about). Save it as an Illustrator file, play with it whichever way you like, and export it as a bitmap image or PDF.

I have been doing this lately, in order to re-position my Noteworthy composition so that it appears on the page the way I want it to look.

There are other ways of doing this, I suppose. Adobe Illustrator is NOT a cheap program! But if you are an "academic" user, then there is a reduced-price educational version available at college bookstores and similar places.

If there are others of you who know of better (i.e., cheaper) ways of doing this, maybe the rest would like to know.

Reply 4 offered by: Nice with spice on 12-Jun-2000

I think you misunderstand. I want to just click a print option for every staff to print on its own page.

Reply 5 offered by: Nice with spice on 14-Jun-2000

Did you think my idea was good or bad? would this be a standard feature with other good programs?

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Jun-2000

I personally don't have a problem with printing parts using the program as it stands, but your idea is neither "good" nor "bad." If it's something that you would like to see, I'd suggest posting it on the wish list that NoteWorthy Software maintains for the purpose of getting suggestions from users. A great many wishes on this list have been granted, yours might be also, one day... but only if you post it!

Reply 7 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 15-Jun-2000

'Posting it in the wish list... but only if you post it!'

I've never understood this bureaucratic requirement. Doesn't NoteWorthy monitor this forum regularly? Why do we need to repeat in the wish list (which has a tiny box unsuitable for all but the most trivial wishes) what it's being said here?

NoteWorthy Software is not an enormous company and hardly it can be thought that one part of the company doesn't know what the other do, so I really can't understand why the posting in a separate wish list may make a difference for a good idea to be considered.

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jun-2000

For those that prefer NOT to have a place to post wishes and make suggestions, you are free to not avail yourself of this system.

Reply 9 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 16-Jun-2000

NW Online,

You answer the wrong issue. The point here is wether NW _requires_ to repeat in the wish list a wish already stated in the forum (as suggested by Fred) for it to be considered.

It's your forum, it's your site, it's your software, so you make the rules. But please clarify.

Reply 10 offered by: John Ford on 16-Jun-2000

I don't know, it seems to me that if you really want a feature, taking a moment to cut and paste out of your original message into the wish list (and oh, by the way, the wish text box scrolls - you can write pretty much as much as you want) shouldn't be that big of a hardship. A number of ideas presented in the forum have also been retracted as a result of ongoing discussion. And others have been expanded as a result of ongoing discussing. By putting it in the wish list, you intentionally let the author know that you would like a particular featuer, as well as the specific details of the feature. I would rather that the author spent his time programming these fine updates to NWC based on wishes submitted, than spending his time weeding out specific wishes from the forum.

Thanks,

John

Reply 11 offered by: Blair Dowden on 16-Jun-2000

The problem with the wish list is that from our point of view it is a black hole. It would be nice to see what other wishes are there, and maybe even vote on them.

Reply 12 offered by: Steve Bacher on 16-Jun-2000

I think one rationale for not being able to read other wishes on the wish list is that it gives Noteworthy Support a rough idea of how much in demand a given wish is.

If everyone looked at the wish list who wanted hairpins, or n-tuplets, or what have you, and saw that it had already been wished for, they wouldn't post their own wish. Then such requests would not show any more urgency than requests for some obscure feature that only one person thought of.

So, don't worry that your wish has already been wished for. Ad your voice to the throng. History has been made by the movements of great masses of people.

- seb

Reply 13 offered by: Michael Powell on 16-Jun-2000

Steve,

While you're right about the voices of many, I would tend to go with Blair's thought about a tally of affirmative votes for a particular wish or enhancement.

Part of the problem with the many voices theory is that there may be some who feel strong about a particular wish but are reluctant to post as they may feel it falls on deaf ears or that it is a dumb request. Those of us who have been using the program for some time know this isn't the case, but a newbie who may have a real good suggestion could be intimidated or maybe not know that they can post wishes and suggestions.

I know personally that for about the first year that I used NWC, I really wasn't aware of the Forum and it's ability to stimulate thought about enhancements or that several of the things that I might want to see changed were already discussed.

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 16-Jun-2000

I've also asked for a published wishlist because sometimes I forget whether I've posted a request already and don't really want to be in the position of making the same request over and over. If wishlist items were published in more or less the requesters' original words, I could at least get an idea of whether I recognized my own phraseology and, if not, persuade myself that I'm seconding someone else's request and not my own.

On the other hand, if the kind folks at NWS don't mind seeing me make the same requests again and again, then I'll just go ahead and do that.

Reply 15 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Jun-2000

I don't know how the topic got from printing staffs to voting on a wish list, but here's my input: Among my other shareware programs there IS one that has a votable wish list. I don't know the methodology. Apparently, the software company uses a free-response input form, same as NWC. Sooner or later, reasonable ideas for changes are posted so that users can vote. But those of us who are not professional programmers have no idea of the effort or cost factor involved in various kinds of changes.

Reply 16 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 18-Jun-2000

What does NWConline think on voting ? Please answer.
An other method is that each time someone thinks a new wish he opens a thread on it, we will discuss and improve it, then each interested one copy it to the wish list...

Reply 17 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 19-Jun-2000

Blair,

I had "wished" an open wishlist months ago and I've always preferred it to the current one which is more like a wish fountain.

Steve,

I don't agree with you. If you have a browse on the forum, you can see that one's declaration on a topic encourages others that have parallel or contrast ideas -as this wishlist discussion made me act to note my own view.

So, I think an open wishlist designed similar to the forum o reinforced with something like a poll or an "I agree" radio button would be best.


#1586: Writing Marches
Writing Marches

(1586)

Submitted by: Jordan on 09-Jun-2000

Anyone have any tips for writing a good classical style march. I have been inspired by some of the great marches and dances by Mozart :)
Anyone have good rythems that I could use? Any tips would be greatly appreciated :)

Reply 1 offered by: David Keeffe on 19-Jun-2000

I always start with a structure. The typical "military march" commonly has the following form.

[Main section]
Intro - main tune - secondary tune

[trio section] in contrasting mood, often a more majestic tune
short lead-in - main tune - secondary tune

[reprise main section]

[optional reprise trio main tune] (especially if it's good)

Then, as for rhythms, keep in mind that marching feet need a very strong one-two pulse, and that syncopation should be used carefully, especially across barlines.


#1587: The NWC History list
The NWC History list

(1587)

Submitted by: John Marchington on 10-Jun-2000

How does the History list know where to find its contents and is it possible to edit the filepaths relating to those entries?
I manually deleted an obsolete folder that my own NWC files were part of, forgetting that the History would no longer be able to access my files. (The files themselves are fine).
I can re-enter all the names but it would be easier simply to change the filepaths in the History to their current ones.
I've checked the registry but they're not there.
Thank you in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Jun-2000

If you must, you can edit the NWC.INI file, which in version 1.55b will be in your Windows folder. In version 1.70, the file will be in the same folder as the program, unless the file is marked "Read-only", in which case it will be in the Windows folder as well.

Reply 2 offered by: John Marchington on 10-Jun-2000

Thank you for your response. Not surprisingly, it worked a treat. Perhaps there have been others who have wondered about it too.


#1588: Tablature
Tablature

(1588)

Submitted by: Steve Langford on 10-Jun-2000

Might you know of a computer program for digitizing in tablature that interfaces with NoteWorthy Composer .nwc files? Please respond directly to s@TheRiver.com in addition to posting to this forum, if that is not asking too much. Thanks! :-)

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 11-Jun-2000

You can export it to midi, then open with encore (e-mail me to get the old still freeware version) and then select it to make the tab, or the painful way : use the text in the editor...


#1589: staves with chord name and rhythm without note
staves with chord name and rhythm without note

(1589)

Submitted by: J.Yakushimaru on 12-Jun-2000

It somes times happes that�@we have to write staves�@that contain only chord names and beam with rhythm�Awithout note.Often for staves for guitar and piano(jazz and light music).How can we do this in NWC ?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Jun-2000

This is easy to accomplish using the new V1.70. The final beta is, I believe, still available from

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcpreview

One example that uses this is "A Song About Frogs" on the Scriptorium, http://www.vadu.com/nwc

The file itself can be directly downloaded from

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ftp/rock/frogsong.nwc

Reply 2 offered by: j.yakushimar on 27-Jun-2000

Thank you for comments given to the question.

Unfortunately,I cannot find a way. I would like to write a staff include only chord name and rythms marking(only beam showing quarter ,eighth,sometime it include rest).

Currently I use whole rest and chord name and include rythms mark by handwriting.

Could you give me more detailed explanation ?

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 28-Jun-2000

Does your melody line consist of rhythm markers and standard rests? If so, write your music entirely with rests. Hide the rests you want replaced with markers, then insert the markers as text. Use the text alignment options (align center, over note head) to make sure the text goes on top of the hidden rest.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Allen on 29-Jun-2000

Currently NWC can't hide noteheads. It would be very nice if it could print beams and stems without noteheads.


#1590: Recording live performances with dynamics??
Recording live performances with dynamics??

(1590)

Submitted by: Brian Havey on 14-Jun-2000

I recently purchased an Alesis synthesizer and wished to record a live performance into a MIDI file. I tried using Noteworthy but it doesn't add any dynamics, as in: how soft or loud I play. I was curious if anyone has any recommendations on cheap or free software that could do this. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 15-Jun-2000

See msg #1592.


#1592: Using NWC with Organ
Using NWC with Organ

(1592)

Submitted by: Rob on 15-Jun-2000

The church to which I belong has a Walker digital organ with MIDI capability. Our music director would like to hook up a laptop to it so that he could play something and have the laptop record it with MIDI so that he would be able to have the laptop play back what he recorded for the choir to sing while he stands in other parts of the church to see how our voices are projecting. He has Finale on his machine in the office, but says that, as nice as it is, it is also pretty complicated. NWC looks like it could be very useful for him, but first, we have a few questions:

1) How well would NWC handle something like that Walker?

2) When he buys a laptop, what kind of sound card (and
other options) should he get to have the best results
(without needing an enormous $$$)?

3) How does NWC handle the recording of dynamics? I tried
NWC at home with a simple keyboard, and it captured the
note durations okay, but not the dynamics. This could,
however, be due to my old computer and sound card.

Any ideas?

Thanks!
--Rob

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Jun-2000

NWC does not at present import dynamics, either from a live performance or from an imported midi file.

As to hardware requirements, virtually any sound card would suffice, especially if you'll be playing back through the external midi device such as your organ. That being said, you do need a way for the computer to pass midi information in and out; probably the simplest way to accomplish this is to use a midi adaptor cable which plugs into the joystick port of every sound card with which I'm familiar (the popular Creative line included).

Reply 2 offered by: Rob on 16-Jun-2000

Fred,

Thanks for your reply. For our specific purposes, the dynamics may not be very critical - just as long as we can get the organ to play back the accompaniment during rehearsal so our music director can concentrate on working with the choir instead of playing the organ.

That said, and without taking away from the benefits of NWC, is there, perhaps, a program more appropriate for our purposes. Maybe all we need is something that would record the MIDI, with dynamics, etc., without necessarily having to put it into notation. As I mentioned in my original question, our music director DOES have Finale on his office computer, but would like something simpler for the laptop for this purpose.

Any suggestions?
--Rob

Reply 3 offered by: Harald Schollmeyer on 16-Jun-2000

There are specific programs to play back MIDI files.
NoteWorthy and Finale both can write MIDI files which
can be played back e.g. by the Windows Media Player
(comes with windows).
But it might be more appropriate to use a simple sequencer
program like Cubase or Cakewalk as you can alter the tempo
and mute/un-mute tracks (e.g. the choir, the pedal, etc.).
I use Finale personally. There are two dedicated Finale
forums on the web, see
http://www.cmp.net/finale/
http://forums.codamusic.com:82/~techsupport
to which you can post any Finale questions.

Greetings,
Harald

Reply 4 offered by: Rob on 19-Jun-2000

Harald,

Thanks. I did a little more looking around on cNet, and found what looks like a GREAT program for our purposes: Anvil Studio (http://www.anvilstudio.com). In my experiments with my keyboard, it was much easier to record to get note durations, and DOES record dynamics, all with sheet music notation as well!

It remains to be seen how well this will work with the organ, but this seems to be better suited to it.

One additional benefit of Anvil Studio is that it is free. The costs come in when you add certain feature modules (e.g. printing), but at least one may use the program's many built-in features for free and decide which (if any) additional modules to purchase.

Thanks again!
--Rob


#1593: NWC Forum or NWC Newsgroup
NWC Forum or NWC Newsgroup

(1593)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 15-Jun-2000

What are de differences in purposes between this 2 "forums"?
Does the NWC team participate in both ?
The obvious advantage I see in the NWC forum is that without email address and with a pseudonym I am protected from unsolicited mail as spam.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 15-Jun-2000

One major difference between the two is that some people can't get to the Newsgroup. For example, the computer network where I work has a firewall that prevents access to newsgroups on private servers.

That difference aside, the Forum seems more focused on specific product questions and the Newsgroup is a more free-wheeling discussion with off-topic posts, exchanges of music (you can post .NWC and other files to the Newsgroup), and a sense of camaraderie and community.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jun-2000

One is web based, the other is NNTP based. We keep the web forum pretty much "on topic" and periodically aggregate the content in a Windows help file.


#1594: How to improve upon the violin's sound?
How to improve upon the violin's sound?

(1594)

Submitted by: Mark on 15-Jun-2000

Hi,

I have a SB-64 card, reasonable speakers, as well as hard drive and RAM to spare. Could anyone advise me as to how I can improve upon the tone/sound of the Violin patch?

[Although I have used NWC for several years, I have yet to become familiar with midi terms such as soundfont and wavetable; kindly bear with me...]

Thanking all, Mark

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Jun-2000

The biggest single thing I've found to make solo violin, viola and 'cello patches sound more realistic is the use of volume mpc's to swell and fade the sound. Next biggest is the (careful) use of the mod wheel controller to simulate vibrato.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 15-Jun-2000

You say that you have enough memory, so using a soundfont would give the best at all result. You can find free soundfonts from !ftp://207.140.1.221/ and you can find out information about the usage at this forum.

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 15-Jun-2000

See msg #1517 for a good starting point.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 16-Jun-2000

Mark,

To my knowledge the AWE64 does not make use of system RAM but requires an on-card RAM module to load sound fonts.
The AWE32 can use a pair of 30 pin SIMMS as card RAM but the 64 module must be purchased from Creative and it's expensive.

Try Fred's suggestions and if this is not satisfactory consider an SB Live card which overall would be a more economic solution than purchasing a RAM module.
Downloaded soundfonts should give a better result than the synths that come with the card.


#1596: Search function
Search function

(1596)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 16-Jun-2000

Apparently there are 2 search functions : one on the top on the screen which search on files in the site, the other that you access with "new message" and search in the forum, apparently even in the old part of the forum. Is it possible to have a more direct access to the search in the forum. For me it is the most important and most useful of the 2 functions.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Jun-2000

You might consider downloading the offline forum, which gives you full search capabilities in the forum. The online search is there primarily to help someone avoid posting a duplicate question. The offline forum is meant to be used as more of a resource.

Reply 2 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 18-Jun-2000

" The online search is there primarily to help someone avoid posting a duplicate question." This is very important because duplicating information in many places means loosing easy access to it !
The online search also allow to find the information if it already exist so it SHOULD BE PROMOTED.
" the offline forum,... gives you full search capabilities in the forum ... is meant to be used as more of a resource."
I have downloaded it but the search on it does not give the same answers as the online search !
By the way you should be aware that the telephone situation is not the same in the US and elsewhere : we pay for the duration on local (as internet) connections; So we are reluctant to download huge files and we prepare most of our messages offline. When we access the SEARCH on line on the new message screen it is too late : our message is already typed and we send it without searching in most of the cases !
I think that having an easier access and a reminder of the search in the top the screen will decrease the number of threads having praticaly the same subject !

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 20-Jun-2000

Sorry for this, I'd like to reply to Jean only, but he never gave the @.
Jean, you're right, downloading may have a non-neglecting cost in Europe; but
.1/ many free (trial offers) FULL-FREE offers may help, though I do not recommand it; (change of conf each month, and the email address also, unless you use www.fairesuivre.com or so)
.2/ you can be paid while on the internet, starting 3FRF/h; if you can read french, go and see
http://www.winbe.com/parrain.php?parrain=marsu@europe.com
for details. I use it (as you can see ;) and it gives me back the money I spend for internet phone calls. And more next month. More over, this program gives you many useful tools such as AFP news, CDrom/MP3 player, RealTime-RolandGarros scores...
I'd like it to play midi or NWC also, but I kindof need some DLLs for this!

About offline forum, I've to say that it's my first place when looking for some info. It would avoid endless threads such as "how to convert wav to midi" if anyone would use it more.
If an upgrade of it could be available... ;)
...since it doesn't fit in a diskette, and I'm accessing the *Net with a PowerBook (McIntosh) :(
Hopefully, nw[cp]setup.exe are small enough to fit on it :) Thanx Eric! :) :)

Best regards,

Dominique


#1597: Wish list
Wish list

(1597)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 16-Jun-2000

I have found a screen to enter a new wish but no way to consult the list of existing wishes : it does not seems constructive to duplicate an existing wish with only a small modification !
It also may be usefull do discuss the wishes : my experience has shown that 2 or 3 persons working together have more and better ideas that if they work alone. The problem is that too many persons together may mean chaos or dinosaur !

Reply 1 offered by: Michael Powell on 16-Jun-2000

Jean,

There is a related conversation to your post. Look at "seemsg #1585 (reply 6)" and the following replies.

Reply 2 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 17-Jun-2000

Thanks for the direction even if the reply number is not the best in the thread. I have missed it because the tittle on "chart" as nothing related to wish list !


#1600: Bulletin: ntworthy.nwc newsgroup status
Bulletin: ntworthy.nwc newsgroup status

(1600)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Jun-2000

The newsgroup at news.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc is unavailable, or at the least unreliable. There appears to be a DNS problem with the ezusa.net site that is causing the problem. For this reason, you may experience problems connecting to the newsgroup.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Jun-2000

In the mean time, you can try using this direct link to the newsgroup. It seems to work at the moment.

news://63.106.178.10/ntworthy.nwc

Reply 2 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 17-Jun-2000

Thanks for this . I did have problems this morning.

This new address looks like something we should all keep off line just in case.

Rich

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jun-2000

Yeah, I think we are going to change to the raw IP address on all of our links. I always found the name server lookup for news.ezusa.net to be rather slow, even when it works.


#1602: Wish on special long notes used in psalms
Wish on special long notes used in psalms

(1602)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 19-Jun-2000

I plan to enter a wish on special long notes used in psalms.
(See also "measures and lines" thread 687 reply 3 by Marsu.)
These notes are represented (in commercial music) as a whole note with a simple or double vertical bar (same vertical size as the note)on each side of it.
They are called in french "note carrée(=square)" the whole note being a "ronde(=round) " that look like ||O|| or |O| sometimes the O is overprint by an X.
"This kind of note have no specific duration, it's used to sing all the text that needs to be sung" before a change of note.
With NWC the words should be separated by "_" instead of space.
We should define in the wish
1) the shape of the special note : 1 or 2 vertical bar each side, Xed or not (it is obvious that we cannot have all !). That means 1 new character in the NWC font.
2) its duration : fixed (2 to 4 times the lenght of a whole note), variable according the length of the text the true parameter is the number of syllables but as I don't know a way to count them the number of characters will work this is more difficult to implement but is more realistic.
3) the present capability of NWC to accept and play an abnormal number of notes between bars should be kept working.

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 19-Jun-2000

> (See also "measures and lines" thread 687 reply 3 by Marsu.)

I think you mean: msg #687 (reply 3) (read Help for knowing how to embed a link to a previous message).

About the "carrée", I didn't quite agree with marsu. In all old music that I did see (and sing), a carrée had the duration of two whole notes. I believe that the note which means "continue until the end of this part" is a carrée with a stem. Anyway, this can be used only in scores where the notes can span two or more measures, which is not possible within NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 19-Jun-2000

You are right on the reference : I read help after preparing my message but forgot to include the code...
For the time beeing I put whole notes (and correct them manualy) instead of special and my NWC accept several full notes plus others notes (too many to be strictly legal) between normal bars and play them without complaints!
On the most of the partitions I have, the special notes look like a full note with short bars (same height as the note). The name of "carrée" was given by my wife, she is a musician (I am only a PC man)...
Dids any one already entered a wish on this subject ? There seems to be many readers working for religious singing in the forum...

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 19-Jun-2000

Indeed, I also work on hymns for a choir (not originals) and have had need of "extra-long whole notes" that span an indefinite number of syllables.

As the previous replies pointed out, the easiest way to do this is to simply tkae advantage of NWC's ability to allow however many notes the user wishes to place in a measure -- as long as the bars are not audited.

Since very few of these notes appear in a hymn/psalm, I just edit the printout manually by first inserting extra notes, then using white-out.

Although I would like to see this feature in a future edition, unless I miss my guess it is hard to implement in software, as there would have to be an additional provision for specifying how many syllables of lyrics attached to the note, and there might be a different number of syllables for multiple verses.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Jun-2000

With the soon-to-be-released version 1.70 you can put away your bottle of white-out. Notes can be hidden, and replaced with a text glyph; in fact, the soon-to-be-released revision of the user-designed "Boxmarks" font contains a breve glyph.

Reply 5 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 20-Jun-2000

Well, I added this wish to the wish list several months ago, and I still hope to have it fulfilled sometime...soon?
I would prefer the carée with two vertical lines on each side and no stem.

For the time being, I work around the problem by inserting the carée as a text symbol (from an "external" music font), but it would be much nicer and easier to have it among all the other notes in NWC. So, if more people add this wish to the wish list, may the fulfilment will come faster?

In fact, this is the only improvement I'm still waiting for. Otherwise, version 1.70 is now perfect for my needs, and I think it's fantastic that I'm given this new software for free - having paid only $39 a few years ago.

Best wishes

Paul

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 20-Jun-2000

Hi all,
as Fred points out, "in fact, the soon-to-be-released revision of the user-designed "Boxmarks" font contains a breve glyph.".
I'm going release the revision in the beginning of next month; I'll try to take into consideration every proposal that were made. In particular about new items, or changing the size of the breve note (the one Jean C. needs).

Hoping you can wait the 2 or 3 weeks until then!
I also need to look carefully at the new version of NWC; maybe some chars could disappear and let their place to another one.
Best regards to all,

Dominique aka Mad aka Marsu

Reply 7 offered by: P. J. Mudge on 25-Jun-2000

I should also find it useful if the breve (I believe you call it a "double whole note" on the other side of the Atlantic) were included as one of the standard note symbols (equal to eight crotchets (quarter notes)). This is best represented by a square symbol - two thick horizontal lines and two thin vertical lines - but occasionally one sees it as two breves (whole notes) run together.
The "long" is a breve with a stem, and the "large" is a "long" extended horizontally (as far as I remember). How many beats they are worth depends on the context.


#1603: Writing A Symphony?
Writing A Symphony?

(1603)

Submitted by: Drakhan Valane on 19-Jun-2000

How would one go about writing a symphony? And what are the standard instruments for one?

~Drakhan Valane~

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jun-2000

My suggestion for a first step to symphony writing would be to listen to a lot of symphonies. As to what constitutes a symphony, that's changed a lot over the years. When the form was invented around Haydn's time, it had a definite structure and instrumentation; as time went on, more and more possibilities were explored, even by Beethoven's time the "four movements" rule was starting to be broken, and other instruments came into accepted use. Nowadays, just about anything goes - "symphony" essentially meaning "sounding together." The idea being that the orchestra is treated as a single instrument, played by the conductor.

Assuming that you want to write a symphony in a classical style, a typical instrumentation might be (I'm sure someone will correct any errors here...)

Woodwinds: 2 each flutes, oboes, bassoons. Sometimes a pair of clarinets. Cor Anglais also a possibility.

Brass: 2 French horns, sometimes alto and/or tenor and/or bass trombones, sometimes trumpets. Timpani.

Strings: 2 groups of violins, consisting of four-six per section; violas (2-4), cellos (2-4), basses (1-3). The number depends partly on how many other instruments you have, and how much noise they're making. The strings are the backbone of the orchestra.

Hope this gives you a starting point.

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 20-Jun-2000

Drakhan,

A difficult question. Perhaps if I rephrased it as "How
would one go about writing a novel? And what are the
standard characters in one?" it might help you appreciate
how open ended it is.

Although Fred's literal definition is correct, "a
symphony" has a fairly well defined meaning in music theory.
It's not so much a "form" as a "style" of writing, but
one thing that is common to the majority of works with
the title "symphony" is called "sonata form". It's difficult
to define in this type of forum, but in essence, it's a
stylistic framework in which to play with thematic material.
There are a number of fairly loose rules about themes
(usually two), harmony, development and structure. Sorry
that's a very imprecise description, but it's not a very
precise subject!

I'd recommend find a book on music theory, and, rather than
listening to lots of different symphonies, choose just a
few (that you like!) and either find someone elses detailed
analysis, or try and produce your own (though it might be
a good idea to avoid Beethoven or later composers as things
started getting very complicated).

Not being a composer myself, I can't give you any advice
from experience, but I suspect the most important
prerequisite to writing ANY music is to have some sounds
inside your head trying to get out. They don't have to be
long or complex (look at how simple the themes in most
of Beethoven symphonies are).

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 20-Jun-2000

>>> How would one go about writing a symphony? And what are the standard instruments for one?

The real answer to these questions is that if you have to ask, you're not ready. The first step, as Fred says, is to listen to a lot of symphonies. Ideally, IMHO, you'd familiarize yourself with *at least* the following:

- the last 6 Haydn symphonies (99 through 104)
- the last 3 Mozart symphonies (39-41)
- all 9 Beethoven symphonies
- the 4 Schumann symphonies (particularly #4)
- the 4 Brahms symphonies
- the last 3 Tchaikovsky symphonies
- a smattering of other Romantic symphonies, including the Berlioz "Symphonie fantastique", the Franck, the Saint-Saëns 3rd, one or more by Mendelssohn, Dvorak and Borodin.
- several Mahler symphonies, including #5 and #8
- the Sibelius 2nd and 7th symphonies
- symphonies by Shostakovich (#1, 5, 10) and Prokofiev (#5, 6)

In addition to listening, you should also acquire study scores (some libraries have them) and follow along. When you're done with this, you'll have a very good idea of what instruments can be used, and - if you've really been paying attention - how symphonies are constructed. For more information on the construction of symphonies, it pays to do some reading too. There are many fine books of music theory that have descriptions of the major musical forms, including several that are very important in symphonies, such as the "sonata-allegro", song, and rondo forms. You might also look up a 2-volume Penguin paperback called "The Symphony", edited (IIRC) by Robert Simpson, which has critical discussions of a large number of works by a much broader range of composers than I've mentioned above.

Only after all of this will you be ready to write a symphony that's anything more than a toy.

[Fred: You are basically describing the orchestration of the Classic and early Romantic periods, i.e. before about 1820 or 1830. If you can find a cor anglais in any symphony of that period, Berlioz perhaps apart, I'll eat my hat. <If I can find my hat.> As late as the 1880's, the mandarins at the Paris Conservatoire were insisting that Franck's symphony couldn't rightly be called a symphony because it contained a cor anglais part.]

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jun-2000

A broad topic indeed. To Grant's excellent recommendations of symphonies to listen to and available resources, I'd like to point out that there are several symphony movements (both classical and contemporary) on the Scriptorium. Just go to http://www.vadu.com/nwc and enter "Symphony" in the search field.

I stand corrected on the Cor Anglais issue, I incorrectly assumed that since Wolfie used one in Die Zauberflöte (which is of course not a symphony) that it would be considered acceptable in symphonic work of the period. /NOT/.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 20-Jun-2000

He unaccountably slipped my mind when I was listing important symphony composers to know & study, but Anton Bruckner should certainly be on the list - not only for the quality of his symphonies, but because he did some things no other symphony composer has ever done, and if you don't know his work you'll have missed something important. The first movement of the Bruckner 7th Symphony is on the Scriptorium, and it's a fine example of his style. You might also look up the 4th ("Romantic"), and, for a real wild ride, the 8th ("Apocalyptic"!).

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Jun-2000

According to Chuck Berry ("Rock and Roll Music"), when modern jazz is played too darn fast, it sounds "just like a symphony."

Mr. Berry's music has been very popular, and he must have made a lot of money from it, so I trust his judgment.

On the other hand, he also recorded the "Ding-a-ling" song.

Reply 7 offered by: Bob Boren on 21-Jun-2000

I agree with most of what has been said so far - except for the crack about Chuck Berry!!
A couple of other thoughts:
1. Get a good book on Orchestration. I have Alfred Blatter's "Instrumentation and Orchestration" and am quite satisfied with it. I think I heard about the book on this message board a long time ago. Also, try to talk to some people that know about this subject. The book will get you part way there, but it's easy to make mistakes. I'm in the middle of composing my first Symphony now(first and second movements done - third started). After I finished the first movement I gave a copy of the score to the music director of the local orchestra that I play in (I'm the principal cellist). He pointed out a few mistakes that made my piece almost impossible to play for some wind and brass instruments. Being a string player, I didn't know much about the wind and brass instruments. One mistake I made was the range for my french horn parts. I was using the book's ranges as a guideline and what I wrote was within the limit, but I had the first horn playing in the highest three or four notes possible for the instrument for too long a period of time. He told me that the horn players would probably throw things at me if I handed them a part like that-nearly impossible to play. Also, I had some important lines for flute too low in their register. Flutes are easily covered when playing in their lower range, so you have to be very carefull not to cover them with the other instruments playing at the time. Another thing that was pointed out to me was lack of articulation marks on the wind instruments. To sum up, he told me to "look at lots of scores".

The list of works to study in one of the previous messages was good - I would add two Symphonies by Schubert - the "Unfinished" and the "Great C Major". IMO, Schubert took what Beethoven did and brought it to a new level with these two works.

Reply 8 offered by: Martin Segerstråle on 21-Jun-2000

I think everything said here is correct and certainly useful. But I think you shouldn't follow too much rules if you write music - not nowadays. Mozart and Haydn, even Beethoven sometime, did it because the musical style of their time demanded it. However, you don't have to follow rules anymore. Listen to some really modern music and you'll get my point. I'm currently writing my tenth symphony, available on the Scriptorium at http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ in the classical section, and the only rules I follow are concerning orchestration. Like how one chord should be followed by another of this kind and that chord should be followed by the opposite and such. I'm not interested in rules, because - I wouldn't follow them anyway.

That's just my opinion...

Martin Segerstråle, composer, 15 yrs.
Finland.

Reply 9 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 21-Jun-2000

Hey Martin,
I just listened to Movement 2 of your 9th... I love it!

Reply 10 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 22-Jun-2000

In addition to Grant's list -as a second step:

Szymanowski Symphony no. 3
Berlioz Symphony Fantastique
Webern Symphony, op.21
Messiaen Turanghalila Symphony

Reply 11 offered by: Bill on 22-Jun-2000

the first step to write a symphony is to buy finale or sibelius or music press.

Reply 12 offered by: Bob Boren on 22-Jun-2000

Bill,

What's this, advertising competing products on this board? Noteworthy Composer works quite well with large scale pieces.

Reply 13 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 23-Jun-2000

Now why would I buy another product? Why would one need Sibelus or Finale?

Reply 14 offered by: Ertugrul on 23-Jun-2000

That's impossible to understand. NWC does need more features but it's capable of undertaking large projectswith its current condition. I completed a whole music for a stage play with only "minimal post processing" such as implementing microtonality and adding some files together, with 1.55b!
I've been trying many different notation procesors such as ones notated in the post and others ie Lime, Mozart etc. but all of them are =very hard to use=. In addition, except for Mozart which seems to have borrowed many things from NWC [ ;) ], require a midi keyboard or you have to battle with your mouse! The only important (to me) feature that Finale, Lime and Sibelius have and NW lacks is microtonal accidentals and I'm currently working on a font wich will temporarily solve the problem.

Reply 15 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 24-Jun-2000

What are microtonal accidentals, and why do you need them?

Reply 16 offered by: Grant on 24-Jun-2000

Microtonal accidentals would be a way of specifying pitches that aren't part of the standard Western 12-semitone scale. These would be notes that fall "in the cracks" between the keys of a piano, such as C half-sharp, A quarter-flat, and so on.

As to why you would need them, it depends on what you're trying to do. Traditionally in Western art music they're not necessary. However, many non-Western styles of music use microtonal intervals, and so does some 20th-century Western music, notably the music of Alois Haba (a pioneer in this respect), Harry Partch and Ben Johnston. Other composers who generally stick to the 12-note tempered scale will occasionally make use of microtonal intervals, Bartok and Bloch being two examples. Microtonals also have a place in jazz, although they're generally not notated as such (e.g., the "blue" third). I understand there is some experimentation with non-traditional tunings in pop music as well, but I don't know any details.

Reply 17 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 24-Jun-2000

Grant appears to supply satisfactory information and I can only add some names such as Ivan Wyshnegradsky and the remarkable Mexican composer Julian Carrillo (and of course some contemporaries as Fred Nachbaur).

In my spesicifical situation, microtonal accidentals are needed to notate Turkish-Middle Eastern 17 note scale, which needs an additional flat and an additional sharp symbol.

I can also suggest some www resources on microtonality such as
http://www-math.cudenver.edu/~jstarret/microtone.html
http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/10/microtonal_music_by_prent_rodgers.html
and a search through popular engines will supply more.
For 17 note Turkish system, you can download and listen to the VQF files at
!www.idrive.com/ertugrulinanc/shared
and for comparison between the Arabic implementation, I would suggest
http://www.farid-el-atrache.com/

Reply 18 offered by: Bethaney on 28-Jun-2000

I don't know if any of my suggestions will help, I'm not a professional or anything but I figured it wouldn't hurt to put in my two cents! :O)

about 3 years ago when I was in 8th grade, I wrote my first song then got a little ambitious and tried to make a full band arrangement (which by the way, didn't work very well, partly because my teacher wasn't increadibly helpful...) but also because I didn't know much about the different insturments I knew alot about woodwinds because I play clarinet and flute, but the rest was a different story. I asked my classmates what range they could play in and that helped, but I didn't really know what kind of parts a specific instrument played in a band arrangement. so, my suggestion to you is, in addition to what all these other suggestions are saying (which by the way, are all very good) learn about the instruments and get to know them. not necessarly learn how to play them, but learn about them and understand them. it's kind of hard to write for somthing you know nothing about, (believe me, I know this from experiance!!!) :O)

so anyway, that's my two cents, take it for what it's worth...

Bethaney

Reply 19 offered by: Artur on 28-Jun-2000

I've just finished a 35 minutes symphoinie, it's easy:
Slect as many instruments as you like,
You must have at least three movements:
1 fast
1 slow
1 faster

after that, you select the theme, each part must have a different theme and the others may interfere, but the theme
must be visible to the audience.

Reply 20 offered by: Martin Segerstråle on 28-Jun-2000

Artur,
beware, now you're making up rules. Don't. First of all, to say it's easy to write a 35 minute symphony is easy if you just follow rules. But to make it more interesting (here we go again), don't follow *any* rules.

That's my opinion.

/Martin
maseg@earthling.net

Reply 21 offered by: Artur on 28-Jun-2000

I said that because I made in four months 796 mesures
The musicians order specify that you must have that, the key signatures must be like this also: (Tonic-Subdominant/Dominant-Tonic)(C-F/G-C).
my symphonie is like this:
1st movement:E, 144(per quarter), 5 minutes (98 measures)
2nd : A, 92, 4'55'' (118 measures)
3rd: E, 60, 5'5'' (71)
4th: E, 144,60,160,100,160, 10 (328)
5th: E, 52,100,52,100,52,160 (181)
If you like, it was an old rule (not necessary anymore) the measures numbers must be divible by 4!

Reply 22 offered by: Artur on 28-Jun-2000

forgot to add:
in the 3rd movement is like this:
60, 42,60

Reply 23 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 30-Jun-2000

Agreed with Martin.

Those obligations were broken as early as from Beethoven's #6 on.

Reply 24 offered by: Martin Segerstråle on 30-Jun-2000

Thanks, Ertugrul. You're right about Beethoven. And Artur - it's exactly such rules as those about the measure numbers that wreck your music.

You bind yourself too much.

But it's your choice, of course.
/Martin
maseg@earthling.net
http://welcome.to/maseg/

Reply 25 offered by: Joseph Sowa on 15-Jul-2000

How to write a symphony? It's a difficult question. In the discussion I've seen pretty much every possible opinion, so I guess I'll add my own.

Do listen to as many symphonies as you can, getting the scores and following along, if possible. However, also get a book on music theory and study that. It will make the "rules" more clear.

Taking into account that one doesn't have a bottomless wallet or infinite time to listen to symphonies, these are my suggestions:

* Beethoven: 3,5,6,9
* Borodin: 2
* Bruckner: 4,9
* Brahms: any of the 4
* Copland: 3
* Franck: 1
* Haydn: The London symphonies
* Kalinnikov: 1
* Mahler: 1,2,5,9
* Mozart: 40, 41
* Rachmaninov: 1,2
* Saint-Saens: 3
* Schubert: 8,9
* Sibelius: 2,3,7

Sorry, I tried to keep it short. If I had to pick the 3 most important to listen to, I'd say Beethoven's 9th, Bruckner's 9th, Rachmaninov's 1st (or one by Mahler).

==

Anyways, the basic movement structure (with examples) of a symphony is:
1) fast -- Allegro (in sonata form)
2) slow -- Adagio
3) fast -- Minuet or Scherzo
4) depending on era
very fast -- Allegro

Reply 26 offered by: Joseph Sowa on 15-Jul-2000

[continuing on as if I didn't accidentally submit the message]

Classical era would have the 4th be a very fast (like Allegro assai)

Romantic it would be slower and more victorious

There are also conventional breaking of these rules, such as having 5 movements (by inserting an extra in the middle), reversing the order of the Adagio and Scherzo, or just having a single movement symphony.

==

I won't expound on orchestration; it has already been done. Suffice it to say that if you study the various scores of the reccommended symphonies, you should figure it out. As a note to Fred Nachbaur, they did use the English horn in classical symphonies, although rarely. The example being Haydn's Philosopher symphony (somewhere around his 50th). Books on orchestration I reccommend are Walter Piston's, and those by ??? Del Mar.

==

In conclusion, just write what comes to you. It will turn out fine. Write as many symphonies as you can paying no attention to length or perfection. After you have done this, then you can make it long and perfect. No offense, but the response "I you have to ask how to write a symphony, you're not ready" is very stupid (in addition to being paradoxical unless someone teaches it to you without you asking.)

Well, I hoped this all helped. I look forward to seeing you as the next Beethoven or Mahler.

- Jospeh Sowa

P.S. - By the way, don't break the rules, just bend them.

Reply 27 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Jul-2000

We shouldn't confuse rules with obligations. The points listed as rules hitherto have appeared to be obligations only. In fact, I need to repeat that, there are no such strict rules in musical composition. I know many theoricians who dictated rules, non of whom are -musically- alive but almost all of the "giants" of music history are those who "broke the rules".

So, there are no obliging rules but some guiding information or structural frames which can easily be learned from books as well as reviewed online.

I can suggest two resources for beginners from Penguin Music books:

1) Introducing Music
2) Introducing Modern Music

both by Otto Karolyi [I earn no commissions :) ]

In addition, here is an online composition course for beginners:

http://portoweb.com.br/compor/defaultT.htm

And here are some other useful links:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~fields/gems/0.htm
http://www.und.nodak.edu/dept/mcr/
http://www.essentialsofmusic.com/
http://english-www.hss.cmu.edu/music/theory.html
http://www.musical-theory.com./
http://www.andymilne.dial.pipex.com/

Furthermore I, a self taught/teaching composer, will be glad to share any kind of knowledge or ideas if requested.

Reply 28 offered by: Milton on 08-Nov-2000

How do you write a symphony?

Reply 29 offered by: Joe Music on 08-Nov-2000

RE: Reply 28. See the original question at top.

"And the music goes 'round and 'round ..."

Reply 30 offered by: Art Thompson on 08-Nov-2000

A very good question. It's about time someone had an opinion on the subject.
A good example of rules meant to be broken are Bach's rules on harmonization. He didn't write the rules, he just was so consistent in what he did, that people who studied Bach's work 'discovered' his rules. He broke his own rules whenever he felt like it.
Rule 1: A symphony is a piece written for orchestra.
Exception:Unless you want it to be for something else. Then just use the word symphony in the name (e.g. "Symphony for 8 ocarinas").
Rule 2: A symphony must have 3 or 4 movements, usually in trio-sonata form.
Exception: Do whatever you want. But a single movement symphony might be more traditionally called a 'Sinfonietta'

Ahh.. tradition. That's the crux of this thread, I think. The rules that some have stated are traditional, almost statistical observations on the conventions used by 18th and 19th century composers. As Ertugrel put it, don't confuse this with obligations. The only real obligation is that you observe range limits and notation conventions for the individual parts, if you want to be able to perform it other than with Midi.

Reply 31 offered by: Art Thompson on 08-Nov-2000

I'm not knocking the conventions, mind you. The sage advice above about listening and reading scores should not be underestimated. NWC is a great tool. 20 years ago (when I was a yout'),notation was an acquired skill, and learning about theory and conventions came with that skill. Now one can learn to notate in an afternoon, but the ear to brain connection is a much slower learner.

Reply 32 offered by: Artur on 14-Nov-2000

I see that many of you sugest some symphonies to hear, specially Beethoven's ones, but I think that you are sugesting only the 3, 5, 6 and 9th because these are the most famous, but some (like the 7th and 8th) are far richer (if there's such a thing) than the 5, and I think that if one is going to learn from hearing sich symphonies, do as I did, buy the conductor scores for ALL nine and watch his evolution listening to ALL of them. I recommend Beethoven's nine because they are easy to comprehend and because they are not many.
PS I agree greatly with #25 and #26.

Reply 33 offered by: Paul Andrews on 07-Mar-2001

All you budding symphonist should take time to study the Simple Symphony by Benjamin Britten. A masterclass in writing for strings.
Anyone interested in symphonic form should look at what Mahler has done in his middle symhonies. Compare No.5 to No.6 you will find the latter in a traditional 4 movements and one of the greatest symphonies ever written.

Reply 34 removed by: SYSOP


#1604: Too BIG notes
Too BIG notes

(1604)

Submitted by: Robert Waniek on 20-Jun-2000

When I`m printing a nwc-file the notes are very big.
How can I change it?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jun-2000

Change the staff size in File --> Page Setup --> Options tab.


#1605: 1.70 has been released
1.70 has been released

(1605)

Submitted by: Blair DowdenBlair Dowden on 21-Jun-2000

Has anyone noticed that version 1.70 has finally been released? Anyone nervous about using a Beta product can now get the "real" thing. Check out the new Print Preview - one (right) click get you a fully zoomed view of the place where you clicked.

I was surprised to see the wording "shareware version" on the Noteworthy site. It suggests that you don't have to pay for it. I think "evaluation version" would be better. Are there really two different versions?

Reply 1 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 22-Jun-2000

Yes, of course, I've waited for this so long, so I immediately downloaded the new version. The "Upgrade" file, however, didn't work on my computer (or was I too impatient?), but installing the entire programme again worked fine (I'm a registered user and gladly recommend this superb, inexpensive software to all friends).

Paul

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 03-Jul-2000

Blair, you wrote:
>I was surprised to see the wording "shareware version" on the Noteworthy site. It suggests that you don't have to pay for it.

Unless you live in the same country as I, where people sometimes doesn't want to understand the difference between share- and free-ware, shareware means that you do not have the right to use the product freely. You'll have to pay in some manner some day.
Evaluation version are different: imagine an evaluation version of a WordProcessor: you'd have access to bold and underlining, but that's all. The other cacpabilities are just promises. Sometimes true, sometimes not.
Just as a much higher priced product to write scores. You can't do anything with it, since it's an evaluation version.

But shareware authors have different vision of their program; sometimes they limit the product too (ex.: you would write only 4 measures with NWC), sometimes not (just a message at the startup or end of the program). Sometimes some functions are limited (in NWC, you can't save the same file more than 10 times), or you're limited to a certain duration of use (morally, 30days with NWC. After your consciousness will haunt you until you give the authors the reward they merit. Or throw away the program, for your misfortune).

Anyway, the ASP (not µ$, but the association or Authors of Shareware Programs) try to make the difference clearly.

As a Share/card/free-ware author myself, I conceive this may not be clear for anyone :)
Especially here in France :(

HTH,
Dominique


#1606: Breath marks positions
Breath marks positions

(1606)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 21-Jun-2000

My present song has 1 lyric below treble clef and no lyric below bass clef.
When I enter "breath marks" with the "best fit" default option the 2 breath marks are not one above the other. The treble mark is after the middle of the space between the notes, the bass mark is before it.
Is this normal or a bug ?
Help is not sufficient. Please clarify what I should obtain with
- best fit,
- before other staff signature,
- after other staff signature,
- at next note/bar signature.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Allen on 21-Jun-2000

I agree. Please give us more documentation on these features.

What, for example, are "other staff signatures?" Are they accidentals? Notes? Text?

What are the effects, if any, of right, left and center alignment when "best fit" is selected?

As far as I can tell, "before other staff signatures" and "after other staff signatures" give identical results. If so, why the distinction?

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Jun-2000

Best fit will obviously not align the item with items in other staves. If you select "before other staff signatures" then the item will be placed exactly that way: it will be placed before a time, key, or clef signature that appears in any other staff at that location. Selecting "after other staff signatures" will force it to appear after (to the right) of those items if they appear in that same location on other staves. If a breath mark appears at the exact same position on all other staves, you can chose either one to make them align vertically, since no time, clef, or key signature would be present in the other staves at that position.

An example: Open the JINGLE.NWC sample file. Select the "Lively" instruction, then go to Expression Placement. Set the Alignment to "after other staff signatures" and see what happens. The item is displaced to the right, now appearing after the key and time signature in the lower staff.

Bottom line: If you are unsure, try different values to see what you get. Different situations often require different settings. Although it is not guaranteed that all desired results are possible, it is often possible to get a satisfactory result.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Jun-2000

If you want your breath marks to line up, you need to place them before notes that line up. If not, your are better off faking one of them with text, which can be padded with blanks. The new Print Preview makes it easier to check the alignment.


#1607: nwc crash
nwc crash

(1607)

Submitted by: please add split on 22-Jun-2000

I recorded a midi file of a choral piece played in block piano style. I exported it as a type 0 midi file. I used the chord splitter and split it. when I try to import import the file noteworthy just has an error and crashes. i can't understand why. all i want to do is do a choral piece for this weekend. please tell me what went wrong. why can't the chord splitter go in the program, there are three versions. please help!!! what do i do?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Jun-2000

Without the actual MIDI file, it is hard to know what is causing your problem. I would suspect a corrupted or malformed MIDI file, as this will sometimes cause NWC to crash. For more diagnosis, you need to send the file to us.


#1608: How do I handle slight verse variations?
How do I handle slight verse variations?

(1608)

Submitted by: Carrianne Bernatis on 22-Jun-2000

I have written in my lyrics and music for verse one. I now want to write in the lyrics for verse 2, but the rhythm and pitches are slightly different from those of verse 1. How can I handle that? I want to put in small, grace note-like notes that will allow readers to see the variations made for verse 2. Does anyone know how to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-Jun-2000

You can add grace notes, but they do not affect lyric placement. To place two lyrics on one note, separate them with underscore (eg. one_two). To skip a note, just enter a single underscore (eg. _), or a hyphen by itself between sylables (eg. lit - tle). These tricks should let you line up the lyrics.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Allen on 22-Jun-2000

Carrianne,

I'm currently working on an add-on font for NoteWorthy, called NoteRow, that may allow you to do what you ask. Could you send me a copy of your score so I can see exactly what you're trying to do?

Steve


#1609: Gooey stuff!  Oops, I mean GUI stuff!
Gooey stuff!  Oops, I mean GUI stuff!

(1609)

Submitted by: Twenty one on 23-Jun-2000

I've been seduced by the Noteworthy interface again after a long period of inactivity.... ah, musical inactivity, of course. =)

Buttons and windows and clicks work perfectly for most places but after putting in a new work into Noteworthy I found a few things that would make my intimate moments with Noteworthy much more satisfying.

I have noted a few things below. I'm sure this information will be of value to Noteworthy as they continue to refine their gorgeous creation: Noteworthy Composer.

1. would be awesome to be able to edit the Channel value and Track name from the score review. Just put the values in fields so we can double click and change. (I have wanted this many times, eg after wacking in a whole score and having to go through and change the channels to hear it... also when copying in tracks from various files)

2. the Page Setup window has got to be wider. I write a piece with 20 tracks and those extra clicks every time I want to copy out a different part is very annoying. (going from Preview to Contents you have to click the little arrow)

3. full screen mode. This would really help me focus more on what I'm doing. I am a great believer in desktop area. if the menu and top bar and start bar could disappear (keep the toolbars there though) while I'm adding phrases and choruses my life would be so much more pleasant. (hit a function key to turn off full creen mode)

I'll remember to jot the other things down next time I'm in Noteworthy having a great time.

If you also agree that these would increase your efficiency (no pun) or have other suggestions please put down your thoughts.

mmm I feel creamy.

Reply 1 offered by: John Ford on 23-Jun-2000

Make sure you put you ideas on the wish list. Wishes are granted and most of yours make sense. It may take a couple of versions revisions to get there, but many of the requested items have finally appeared in version 1.7. Granted, Eric doesn't seem to implement wishes that make the program something it's not; however, wishes that enhance that balance between notation/sequencer seem to find their way in.

John

Reply 2 offered by: Dirty little red bug on 28-Jun-2000

Would it be possible to also add a non-linear view? I don't know how difficult to do but would you consider that a big step forward?

This would be really good for me so that I can see when my symbols, dynamics, chords and lyrics, go across the bar line and get chopped off when I save the page as a WMF and import into Word.

Otherwise, could Noteworthy please put in an outer margin when the image is saved as a WMF from the preview screen to stop bar numbers and other things getting chopped off.

Thankyou with Kindest Wishes,
The Dirty little red bug.

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP


#1610: Thanks for 1.7, & system breaks question
Thanks for 1.7, & system breaks question

(1610)

Submitted by: Carolyn Conyers on 23-Jun-2000

So far the transition to 1.7 has been utterly seamless! Thanks!
Question: I've just finished entering a score. In some parts of the score, notes within a bar are pulled out quite wide for what appears to be no reason (other places the same type passage appears and prints fine). In still other places some bars are squashed together too much, again for no apparent reason. This makes the printed score look a bit strange in places. Would it help to use the "system break" feature and would that both contract where appropriate as well as spread out other places, or would I end up with a mess? Obviously I'm asking before I do this, because this is a rather long score and I would prefer to not screw it up! Many thanks. Your replies and insights are always great. Beautiful use of the Internet - yes?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 23-Jun-2000

Without seeing your actual file I can't answer whether the system break would help any. However, first find out what's causing the measures to be spaced excessively; usually there's a text or other expression item that has Preserve Width on, or something like that.

Also, are you aware of the "Revert to Saved" option in the file menu? Play/experiment all you like; you can undo all your changes since the last save using the File --> Revert command. Rather like a super-heavy-duty "undo" button. :)

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 23-Jun-2000

System Breaks stretch out the score; they do not compress it (although I wish they would). I would guess in your case the line is stretched because the next line begins with a long bar that would not fit on the previous line. Well placed System Breaks can even up the score. I use them all the time and recommend them. Just add them one at a time and check the results with Print Preview.

Reply 3 offered by: Carolyn Conyers on 25-Jun-2000

Thanks, Fred and Blair, for your insights. I will keep them on file. In this case it was "operator error" - big surprise, huh? What happened was that there was no bar line in the upper voice where there should have been one. I missed it, since the upper voice has nothing for several bars at that point in the score. The absence of the bar line caused the gross stretch out of the preceding bar. Thanks for the tips, and I shall go forth with no fear of using system breaks! Cheers! Oh, and by the way, Fred, your Web site is a hoot!


#1611: Problem beaming chords
Problem beaming chords

(1611)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 23-Jun-2000

When I have 2 notes of equal height in a chord one has stem up the other has stem down that is the current representation.
The problem arise when I try to beam two chords and I have 2 notes of equal height in at least one of it : NWC beams only 1 note in the chord... From what I have seen, the normal representation is 2 beams one with stem up the other down.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 23-Jun-2000

Are you making a chord (with Ctrl-Entree) or using layering??
just to know.
bonne semaine!

Reply 2 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 23-Jun-2000

I am making a chord with Ctrl-Enter.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 23-Jun-2000

If I understand your problem, I'm afraid I have bad news. NWC simply refuses to beam stem-up and stem-down notes simultaneously. This has been true for quite some time.

You could go to the wish list and request a change, but to be honest I doubt you'd get very far, since you can work around the problem using staff layering .

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 23-Jun-2000

My sense is that it's precisely because of this and other limitations in the chording algorithms that the staff layering feature was developed. I can't recommend it too highly for multiple-voice staves.

Reply 5 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 27-Jun-2000

Marsu you have asked the good question : thanks to you I have discovered what the layering funtion is ! :-)).
But I am very angry :-() against the way the help is written : there is no cross-reference from "chord" to "layering" (or the reverse): I have searched for all the occurnce of the 2 words...
There is no definition of what the layering function does so I have skiped this function that was not important enough to be described !
So I have gone to the old forum and readen (some hours even if this time is not lost) the 65 threads on it ! I have discovered that information has been given once upon a time in 2 files : http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/files/xprmntl.zip and http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/usertip2.htm#layer unfortunately they have vanished and cannot be found...
I am new on the internet and before I had no access to the forum and no way to know the experimental functions ! The help should take into account the poor guy that has just it!

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jun-2000

You do not need these files anymore. You can get a layered file by selecting File | New | SATB. This will give you a new file that uses layering.


#1612: Expression placement
Expression placement

(1612)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 23-Jun-2000

In the help Keyboard guide if you look from D to Y most the "adds a ..." key give "expression placement" tab in notation properties screen.
S adds special ending does not have it. So special endings ( at the beginning of a staff) may over write a clef and are not readeable in this case.
With the expression placement you may have forced special ending after the clef...

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Jun-2000

I do not understand what you are trying to say here? Are you using the latest version (1.70)? Some changes were made in this release that make special ending behave much more as expected when you place them. If you have a specific problem, feel free to explain it further here, or send in a sample via e-mail.


#1613: Fermata & Breath Mark in new toolbar
Fermata & Breath Mark in new toolbar

(1613)

Submitted by: Gordon Isbell on 24-Jun-2000

I *love* this new toolbar! It's now so simple to insert all the dynamics.
The one question I have is that I can now click to insert the Fermata and Breath Mark, but I still have to Ctrl+E to assign a duration to them.
Am I missing something? These icons seem to be worthless if I still have to perform another task to make them operatable. What am I missing?
Thanks all,
Gordon

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Jun-2000

I suppose it depends on whether you use these to actually assign durations, or whether you use them strictly as performance instructions (as do I). Reason being that the assigned delay durations don't export to midi, as the midi protocol doesn't have a "pause for n ticks" instruction; you have to assign tempo changes anyway to make the effect exportable to midi anyway.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Jun-2000

Well, the quick insert tools are meant to add symbols quickly to your score via point and click. Custom settings for delay in the fermata/breath, or override settings in the dynamics, are better left to manual editing through the properties interface. We do not want to slow down or otherwise complicate the quick insert method.

Reply 3 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 24-Jun-2000

Thanks Fred and NoteWorthy:

This makes perfect sense. Your reasons, Fred, never occurred to me because my music is only created to be played on the computer; it is never printed for a performance. This would make all the difference!

Thanks again,
Gordon


#1614: File-Open Default
File-Open Default

(1614)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 24-Jun-2000

Is there a way to change the "file | open" default from "SAMPLES" to a target path of my own choosing?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Jun-2000

Tools | Options | Folders | Song Files

Reply 2 offered by: RCV on 24-Jun-2000

Thanks, NWS!

RCV


#1615: NWC to Mac
NWC to Mac

(1615)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 24-Jun-2000

I have a piano student who is trying to run NWC on an iMac DVSE (OS 9.04 161 MB RAM) with Virtual PC Windows 95 conversion software. Program invocation appears to be OK, but following "play" both existing and new songfiles produce an echo which lags the original sequence by a few seconds. Any ideas as to a cure for this?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Jun-2000

I do not know why this would happen, but I can tell you that NWC does not do this itself. There must be something in the Virtual PC software that is causing the echo. Does it sound like an effect (like delay or reverb)? If so, there might be adjustments available in the Control Panel.


#1616: compatibility
compatibility

(1616)

Submitted by: Anna on 24-Jun-2000

I have the version 1.55b, and I think there is a new version? what is the new version and how many versions have come out since the 1.55b?

This is the version I run and it also also the version my my family has. (my mother even worked out how to insert chords to the music she arranges for church using the text tool which is very good because she is not good at other computer programmes). I also have two friends who I work with on various music projects. we find noteworthy very good and cost effective for our work. (we all do have our own licence, which is better than one of us having one expensive programme)

so if the new version is 1.7 is better than the one i have then we should upgrade. will all our works still open in the new version? i would like to know this and then we can all upgrade at once. what are the issues for us?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Jun-2000

> I have the version 1.55b, and I think there is a new
> version? what is the new version and how many versions
> have come out since the 1.55b?

The current version is numbered 1.70, and is the next version after 1.55b. (There were a number of intermediate 1.70 beta versions, but the one presently on NoteWorthy's site is the final public release.)

> so if the new version is 1.7 is better than the one i have
> then we should upgrade.

Definitely better, many more options available. Upgrading won't cost you a penny as you are registered users, simply download it and install it (uninstall 1.55b first if you want to use the same directory).

> will all our works still open in the new version?

Yes. But works generated with 1.70 will not open in 1.55b. (Believe me, you won't want to go back anyway.)

> what are the issues for us?

The only conceivable "issue" is learning to use the new facilities. But again, take my word for it; it will be well worth the effort.


#1617: guitar chord symbols
guitar chord symbols

(1617)

Submitted by: dog boy on 24-Jun-2000

hey dude,
okay i know how to put text above the line for what chords to play but is there a guitar font i can install to do the guitar chord diagrams? you know, like i could easily install a user font to type in above the staff. (like if i made a page that showed what computer key made what chord diagram, and just set the staff properties to 20 above so the chord symbol would fit in)
so any of you guys tried this? and if so what is a good chord font to use? it has to look groovy man or the keyboard dude will freak.
thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul on 25-Jun-2000

Have you tried the NWGuitar?

http://www.vadu.com/nwc

(go to other helpful stuff section)

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 25-Jun-2000

I must be nearsighted, but I could not readily find NWguitar on the Scriptorium site.

Steve Allen does have a very good NRGuitar font program that he is currently testing. Go to the Newsgroup for further info. Mr. Allen's primary submission is dated 6/06.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jun-2000

Correct, the guitar font is not yet on the Scriptorium. We do sincerely hope that Mr. Allen will allow us to post it (and his NoteRow font) once these new fonts reach final release status. Meanwhile, as pointed out in the previous reply, you can help beta-test these by picking them up from the newsgroup.

Reply 4 offered by: Bob Landry on 25-Jun-2000

Seville Regular is a TrueType font
File size:121 KB
Version: Altsys Fontographer 3'5 8/18/94
Each type key is a guitar tablature.


#1618: Printing layered composition.
Printing layered composition.

(1618)

Submitted by: Bob Landry on 25-Jun-2000

My layered file, when printed, turns out in very small print. My other files print fine.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jun-2000

Check your staff size in File | Page Setup | Options. Increase as necessary.

HTH...


#1619: Hidden bar lines in 1.70
Hidden bar lines in 1.70

(1619)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 26-Jun-2000

All the new stuff concerning bar lines in 1.70 is wonderful. I really love the possibility of having a hidden bar line at the end of a system, and even at the end of the whole staff. Thank you very much for that.

On the other hand, there is a little issue with these hidden bar lines: when the cursor is right after a hidden bar line, it appears as if it is *before* the line. I'm sorry I didn't see that before the end of the beta testing.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jun-2000

We will release a service pack for 1.70 sometime in the summer. This will be handled by the service pack and in future releases.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jun-2000

---------------------------------
Bug: Hidden items should still be spaced apart in the editor, for easy editing.

Status: Confirmed; Fix completed; Release target 1.70 SP1
---------------------------------

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 03-Jul-2000

So Service Pack, in fact, means "bug fix"?
I thought it was feature addition only.
But wasn't this term first used by µ$? ;-|

Anyway, thanks for the correction.
Even if I never had the throuble nor others.
KUTGW,
Dominique


#1620: Layering and vertical size
Layering and vertical size

(1620)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 26-Jun-2000

I don't know if the following issue already existed before 1.70: I just discovered it today.

I wrote a SATB score, and adjusted all vertical sizes of all staves, so that they don't overlap. Then I layered S+A and T+B, and found that the Alto and Tenor parts were then overlapping. The problem is that the lower vertical size used under S+A is not that of the Alto part, but that of the Soprano part !

I think that it should be:
- either the lower vertical size of the lowest layered part;
- either the maximum of all layered vertical sizes.

Your opinion ?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jun-2000

> - either the maximum of all layered vertical sizes.

Coincidentally, we handled this last week. This is what future editions will do.

---------------------------------
Bug: When layering, the size of all of the layered staves should be considered when vertically placing the staves into the system. Currently, only the top staff in the layer is considered and the rest are ignored.

Status: Confirmed; Fix completed; Release target 1.70 SP1
---------------------------------

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 26-Jun-2000

I am a delighted user ! Thank you again for that and for item msg #1619.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Jun-2000

Does this mean that the staff height will be the largest value in all the layered staff sizes?

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jun-2000

Yes.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 26-Jun-2000

Whereas before only the first staff was considered. This means many existing pieces will now be laid out differently. I am surprised you are willing to introduce this backward incompatibility, considering the effort you spent avoiding this for text placement.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 27-Jun-2000

Only if you've been sloppy with your staff sizes in the first place! ;-)

You do have a point, but I'd much rather have the revised version. And anyway until a few days ago (release of 1.7) staff layering was officially an experimental feature, so of course none of our experimental files could ever have been considered as finalised (could they?)

Peter

Reply 7 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 27-Jun-2000

Anyway, Blair, if you fear the modifications, here is a way you can be sure you'll have the same layout: whenever a staff is layered with the one above, set its sizes to 0.

This will be OK with experimental 1.55b (because only first staff sizes are used) and also with final 1.70 (because max(0,n) = n).

I *want* the revised version. ;-)

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 27-Jun-2000

I agree, it should be made to work right, and the problems it causes are easy to fix. But people are going to complain. Better make it clear in the release notes what is going to happen.


#1621: Danny Boy
Danny Boy

(1621)

Submitted by: Clive Sidney on 26-Jun-2000

Has anyboby transcribed Danny Boy (Londonderry Air) as an NWC file? I would be grateful for any comments...

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 26-Jun-2000

No. But I have a midifile. I'll send you if you mail me.


#1622: how to hide
how to hide

(1622)

Submitted by: Bethaney on 27-Jun-2000

I just barely downloaded NWC 1.70 (so you'll probably see me on here alot!) :O) so how do I hide notes, rests, and other symbols?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Jun-2000

Select the desired item or items (i.e. highlight it by click/dragging with the mouse or using Shift + L or R cursor on the keyboard) then either "Edit | Selection" with the mouse or CNTL-E (or ALT-Enter) from the keyboard, and click on the "Visibility" tab. Viola. :)

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jun-2000

The help file explains each of the new features, and how to activate them. It is in the Common Questions section.


#1623: lyrics and fonts
lyrics and fonts

(1623)

Submitted by: Bethaney on 27-Jun-2000

I wrote a song in spanish then translated it into english, I would like to keep the spanish lyrics in regular font but italicize the english lyrics so that it doesn't look like the song has two really long verses. I know NWC doesn't do that, but does anyone know of a work-around?

Reply 1 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 27-Jun-2000

I don't think that you can use 2 fonts but if you wish only to have 2 different looking verses you may use lower case for one and upper case for the other!

Reply 2 offered by: Michael Powell on 27-Jun-2000

The alternate verse could also be entered utilizing the Text Editor command.

Reply 3 offered by: Vito Evola on 29-Jun-2000

Have you thought about two lyric lines and offsetting them (one in positive and one in negative) so that they might be lined up? This might work...

Reply 4 offered by: Michael Powell on 30-Jun-2000

Another susggestion, now that we have 1.70, would be to use two different staves and use the Staff Layering function. You copy the staff with the lyrics to a blank staff below it. Then you can write your lyrics in English on the first staff and in Spanish on the second and offset the placement of the lyrics in the second staff. Then use the layering function and you will have lyrics on one staff in English and the other in Spanish.

Reply 5 offered by: Ken Jentsch on 03-Jul-2000

I also would opt for Staff Layering. But why couldn't I just have two identical playing staves with their own lyrics? That way the lyrics of BOTH staves would highlight correctly... wouldn't they? Be sure to adjust the settings of the lyrics lines, though, so they don't overlap.

KenJ

Reply 6 offered by: Bethaney on 03-Jul-2000

I tried making two staves exactly alike and making one italicized and the other regular but when I changed one staff the other changed too... otherwise I'd love to do the stave layering! it would be tonz easier!

by the way all, thanx for all your suggestions.

Bethaney


#1624: text editor
text editor

(1624)

Submitted by: Bethaney on 28-Jun-2000

What is the Text Editor Command, where do I find it and how do I use it?

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 28-Jun-2000

Either follow Insert | Text... from the menu bar or simply press "x" on your keyboard.


#1625: um... don't know what to call it so just read....
um... don't know what to call it so just read....

(1625)

Submitted by: Bethaney on 28-Jun-2000

alot of my songs that have lyrics have sections w/out lyrics and thus far I've been putting in dashes, however, reading some of these questions and answers, I get the feeling there's a way to do it w/out the dashes, anyone want to tell me how.... (or maybe I'm misinturpeting somting.... I dunno)

<hope you all don't get too sick of me....>

Bethaney

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 28-Jun-2000

Select the notes (and rests!) that you want to attach lyrics to/stop attachment and then right click. Select the notes (or rests) tab and paly around with 'lyric syllable' settings.

There you can force an attachment (even to a rest or slurred note) or prohibit attachment. The default is of course to attach to unslurred notes and the first note of a slurred sequence, but not to other items such as rests and grace notes..

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 03-Jul-2000

...with the 1.70 V!

Reply 3 offered by: Keith on 15-Aug-2001

Peter's right. That's the correct way to do it. But a quickie way to line things up is to use the underline character, not the dash. The underline won't show up at all.


#1626: Exporting to a word document
Exporting to a word document

(1626)

Submitted by: Bill POwell on 28-Jun-2000

When I copy/paste a musical fragment to a word document the final bar line (or double bar line)is always omitted. I can't select it.
The same applies to the bracket at the beginning of a piano score.
Does anyone know how to overcome this?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jun-2000

Are you using version 1.70 (the newest release)? If not, you should do so, as it will fix your problem.

Reply 2 offered by: Bill POwell on 28-Jun-2000

Thanks for your reply re exporting to a word document.Actually I have downloaded the latest version and that raises two more questions:
1. I would like to uninstal the existing older version before installing the new but can I do this without losing all my saved files? If not how can I save them?
2. Is there some info available as to what improvements, added features etc are on the new version?

You see I'm a bit of a novice when working with pc's but I really appreciate your assistance.

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 28-Jun-2000

In fact, none of your files is deleted when you uninstall a program. But there might be conflicts if you've saved your documents to the same folder with the program.

In order to avoid that possiblity, copy all of your files to a different folder.

You don't need to uninstall the former version at all. Simply choose "no" when the 1.70 installation asks if you like to keep the older version.

You can view release notes available at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/history.htm for a complete list of improvements.

Reply 4 offered by: Bill Powell on 29-Jun-2000

I have installed the latest version of NWC as advised but the problem still exists:

When I copy a NWC file and paste it into a word document the last bar line (or double bar line) and the bracket around the two staves (on a apiano score) are omitted.

When selecting it is not possible to hi-light the bracket or the final bar line. Surely I must be doing something wrong.

As a music teacher I am writing documents and tests for students.These documents require music examples to be included.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 29-Jun-2000

Have you tried increasing the left and right margin sizes?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jun-2000

Links to answers to your upgrade questions are right there on the upgrade page.

Using version 1.70, I am unable to reproduce your problem. The grand staff brace and final bar line both appear after a Print Preview Copy operation.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jun-2000

However, I should note that Word 97 does a very poor job of importing the graphic if passed via the clipboard. It does a much better job if you pass the graphic via a metafile. I do not know why Word does this, since both mechanisms use the same format. Very strange...

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jun-2000

I sent you an example via e-mail that demonstrates an *.wmf copy using the JINGLE.NWC sample song. As I indicated in the e-mail, I will be glad to do the same with your song to show you how to do it.

Reply 9 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 30-Jun-2000

As I understand that Bill is trying the copy special feature (will he correct me if I'm wrong) so the beginning and ending bar lines (section open/section close) aren't included.

I suggest simply adding them manually (to the staff of course :] ).

In case of misunderstanding, I'm mailing what I mean to Bill.

Reply 10 offered by: Bill Powell on 01-Jul-2000

I really appreciate all the help which has been offered. It is great to know there is so much sympathetic support out there.
I did not know about copying from the print preview and that seems to have fixed my problem - even though it is a longer procedure. I really thought that selecting and copying direct would be simple enough when only 7 or 8 bars are required on most occasions.
Cheers to all.


#1627: Default settings: help
Default settings: help

(1627)

Submitted by: Vito Evola on 28-Jun-2000

I seem to have "lost" my default settings.

What I'm interested in are the margins for stave, etc for vocal & accomp.
It gives me 26, but that seems a little too much.

any help?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-Jun-2000

You may want to open a new file, put in your preferred defaults, then save it to the NWC Template folder (with whatever name you want). In the future, the default template will then be listed under the "File", "New" menu.


#1628: Lyric offset: bug?
Lyric offset: bug?

(1628)

Submitted by: Vito Evola on 29-Jun-2000

With 1.70 whether I give a positive or a negative value to the lyric offset command, it puts the lyrics closer to the staff (with bottom). I don't remember this happening in the earlier version.

Could I be doing something wrong, or might this be a bug?

Thanks!

PS
It IS a Great program!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jun-2000

In the past, the program always automatically fit the lyrics under or above the staff by increasing the staff size as needed. It no longer does this if you use a negative offset. When using negative offsets, you have to size the staff manually from Staff | Properties.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jun-2000

---------------------------------
Bug: The lyric editor automatically makes room for lyrics in the staff, when possible. It shouls not do this if the lyrics use a negative offset, as the user is intentionally trying to shift the lyrics out of the primary staff area.

Status: Confirmed; Fix completed for version 1.70
---------------------------------


#1629: SAT (3voices)instead of SATB
SAT (3voices)instead of SATB

(1629)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 29-Jun-2000

How to obtain a SAT (2 treble + 1 bass clefs : 3 voices)template for layering ?
Apparently I cannot delete the second bass clef of SATB template.
Can I define SAT myself from scratch or has SATB some particular caracteristics that I cannot generate ?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jun-2000

Yes, you can delete any staff but the last remaining one in a score by simply selecting it, then pressing Ctrl+D (Staff | Delete Staff).

Reply 2 offered by: John Kavanagh on 12-Jul-2000

I had the same problem, if your question is how to save a new file as a template, or an existing one you've changed to suit yourself. Once you've deleted the bass staff or whatever, go to File, Save As... and save it to the template folder with a new name. Then it will show up as an option when you want to create a new file.


#1630: multiple instruments
multiple instruments

(1630)

Submitted by: Paul Grecay on 29-Jun-2000

Hello...I am new to nwc so I don't know where to find out how to have several instruments play at once. For example, I would like to have the reed organ play the treble and the oboe play the bass. Can this be done with nwc? As it seems to me now, I can have one or the other but not both...any help would be appreciated!...thanks.........Paul

ps...I am new to this kind of music...all of my background is in piping (highland bagpipes) which only utilizes one staff and alot of gracing.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jun-2000

Well, your actual capabilities are dependent on your sound card/MIDI device. However, it is very unusual these days for a MIDI device to support less than 10 separate instruments simultaneously.

In NWC, you select the instrument for a staff from Staff Properties. Each staff can be assigned its own instrument. You can even change the instrument within the staff, using the Insert | Instrument Patch command. Try it out. I bet your system can handle it.

You should be sure that each staff is assigned a unique MIDI channel, unless you know why you want two staves to share a MIDI channel. This is generally handled automatically by NWC. MIDI channel 10 is generally reserved for drum kit sounds.

You might want to try looking over some of the samples that come with the program, as well as those of our users (check out the links here on our site).

Lastly, the user's guide that is included with the product covers some of this as well.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Grecay on 30-Jun-2000

Thank you... I have been experimenting with the downloaded demo version...I just ordered the registered version. I am really enjoying this...it is a great way to learn music ... I just arranged a little Bach score and after adding phrasing and a few other dynamics it sounds absolutely beautiful. Thanks again.

Paul

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 01-Jul-2000

You can post your arrangements, compositions or anything NoteWorthy to the user sponsored Scriptorium at http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Reply 4 offered by: Paul Grecay on 02-Jul-2000

Thank you so much for the information. I am going to post my arrangement of a little Bach piece from the St. Matthew Passion. While I don't necessarily have a special interest in religious music I am enormously attracted to anything by J.S. Bach. Having said that, I have little musical training outside of my celtic background in piping and this is my first foray into working with a staff (particularly the bass staff) and notation. So please don't laugh. I worked on this arrangement for a rather odd reason. If I could, I would love to be able to play Bach's keyboard works...particularly the 3 part inventions and his organ works. So dream on...but when I was a young boy (and here is where you have to keep from laughing) I took accordion lessons and learned some of the rudiments of music. I discarded the accordion over 40 years ago and would never tell a soul that I could play one. But several weeks ago I purchased a used one and realized that good music can be coaxed out of some very odd instruments...and since I don't have a pipe organ and I can't play one anyway, I took a second look at this strange little squeeze box and here is what I saw. We have a keyboard with free reeds and several stops available on the right hand...a bellows to control volume and some dynamics...and on the left hand we have a base register with buttons for the lower notes...again with several stops. There are also buttons for major, minor, seventh and diminished chords. I reasoned that if I arranged the music to use these bass buttons...I could produce an arrangement playable within the constraints of the instrument. To do this, required some simplification so I eliminated where necessary any notes in the left (button) hand that were being played in the right hand. No chords are used (that would be cheating) and the result is sort of like a reed organ redition using the available keys. If you are still reading and have an interest in Bach or unusual arrangements I would appreciate your critique...be gentle...this is my first time. In any case, this NWC software is helping me develope facility with reading and understanding the music...it's a real kick for me. I just wish I had taken keyboard lessons from childhood. Thanks for reading!...Paul Grecay, Lewes, Delaware


#1631: Wish List
Wish List

(1631)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 30-Jun-2000

When we write into the forum, I think we have a good GUI:
- we don't need to type in our name and e-mail if we configured it;
- the space provided for the message is wide enough;
- the text wraps automatically.

But when we use the wish list <http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm> this is awful:
- we always need to retype name and email;
- the space is tiny;
- the text goes outside of the space provided, with a scrollbar.

Please can you do anything so that we don't fear to post a wish ?

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 30-Jun-2000

Oups ! It seems that the "!" convention doesn't like the ">" character as the end of an URL.

I meant http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm .
(With a space after the URL, so that the final dot is not included)


#1632: NWC to PDF again
NWC to PDF again

(1632)

Submitted by: <ertugrulinanc@ixir.com> on 30-Jun-2000

Have you ever tried NWC to PDF conversion nowadays? I did. Here is what I get: none. We can't use Fred's method through GhostView because "print to file" option does not come up with the print dialog. Printing via PDF writer results with so awful images that don't even have noteheads. (Embedding all used fonts doesn't work.)

So, one can suggest copying the print preview. I tried it. When I chose Windows metafile, I got a very small image taking the one third horizontal space of a wordpad doc (portrait A4 with default margins). Saving the wmf as a file resulted as same as the distorted pdf I got through PDF writer.

I uninstalled and re-installed NWC (1.70 final) but nothing changed.

Ladies and gentlemen, we have three serious bugs, two of which related to each other:

1) Absence of print-to-file option,
2) Bad resulting printing through PDF writer,
3) Bad resulting metafiles when saved, small images (in contrast to former versions' huge ones) if preview copied to clipboard.

Meanwhile, why is bitmap file option always disabled?

Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 30-Jun-2000

Try using the Acrobat Distiller as your printer instead of the PDFWriter. The PDFWriter has some limitations that seem to not work well with Noteworthy. The Distiller, on the other hand, works great. I tried it on a 1.7 file.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 01-Jul-2000

I was having problems with this also. Fred Nachbaur suggested printing to a Postscript printer -- I've had good success with an Apple printer driver -- and using its "print to file" option, which creates a .prn-named file that is actually a postscript file. A simple Ghostscript script can print from that prn file to a pdf-formatted and .pdf-named file. Another hint: make sure you have Adobe Acrobat reader 4.x for double-checking the final product.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 08-Jul-2000

Acrobat Distiller is out of price for me.
but Fred's solution works well: use GhostScript and GSView.
More details on Fred's site: http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/gsinfo.htm

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/pstips.htm may be helpful (for A4/legal porting)

If you've got Lose98 or worse, you shoud have the Apple Color PS printer driver available on your CD. It works great.

HTH!

Reply 4 offered by: Jim Chapman on 09-Jul-2000

I agree with these comments. I can't afford Distiller and PDFWriter dropped noteheads, clefs, etc. What to do? I haven't tried this yet, but I suppose one could use the Windows print driver to print to a file. Then the recipient would have to "copy /b lpt1:" or something like that, assuming they have the port captured.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Jul-2000

Yes, you can use the DOS COPY /B command to dump a PostScript file directly to a printer ... but it has to be a PostScript printer. Much better IMO to tell the user to load the file into GSview, from where it will print to anything for which you have a Windows driver.

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 10-Jul-2000

Here is an alternative: If you own a drawing program that can "save as PDF," then try creating a placeable Windows Metafile (WMF) via the "print preview" function in NWC. Bring the WMF into the drawing program (you may need to re-scale it) then save as PDF.

I do this all the time using Adobe Illustrator as the drawing program, although I imagine it would work in Corel Draw and similar programs. (Incidentally, there is some capability to edit the appearance within the drawing program).

Reply 7 offered by: Frank Kolwicz on 11-Jul-2000

I have just used CorelDraw 7 to edit and print a file from NoteWorthy via the "print preview and copy to placeable metafile .wmf" method. The only problem I ran into was that the stems of the notes got slightly shifted and I had to push them back where they belong. That could be a serious problem, if you have lots of staffs and measures to edit as they had to be done each individually.

But CD7 allowed editing of everything: the notes, the stems, the flags, the staff and the text - all seperately from each other. It was just what I needed to put in the extensive notes I'm using.

Thanks for your help,

Frank


#1633: Improving placement of slurs (and ties?)
Improving placement of slurs (and ties?)

(1633)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 01-Jul-2000

The automatic placement of slurs is rather ugly when you use layering...
Short term solution :
Is it possible to patch rapidely (at least for slurs I have no experience of ties) the rules stated in "placement of slurs and ties" thread 911 "see!msg911#12" ?
I quote the rules with the modification in upper cases :
> The direction of slurs are now determined by the first
> note of the slur: if the stem of the first note is
> upward, then the slur will be underneath the notes.
> If the stem of the first note is downward, then the slur
> is extended above the notes. If the first note is a split
> direction chord OR A PART OF A LAYERED STAFF, then these rules are reversed.
This way the slur on layered staves will be on the side of the stem without any work around.
Long range solution :
A shorter slur that may fit between 2 consecutive notes or their stems (as in the commercial partitions I have seen) that makes easier their vertical placement (shift up or down) with freedom also for the direction of the curvature (up or downward) or the tilts.

Reply 1 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 01-Jul-2000

"Seemsg #911 (reply 12)" or seemsg #911 (reply 12)
Which is the good coding ?

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Jul-2000

I am not clear on your question. Version 1.70 now allows you to place all slurs above (upward) or below (downward) the notes in a staff. Simply select all of the notes in the staff, goto Properties, and change accordingly.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Lim on 02-Jul-2000

I think what Jean is suggesting is the default placing of slurs should be at the stem end when a staff is layered with another. This does pose some immediate practical difficulties:

Some scores only require layering for part of the piece.

The only way Noteworthy at present would know that a staff was part of a layer would be if layering was enabled (with me so far?)

BUT

With many scores I have found it necessary to turn layering off temporarily whilst entering notation, to avoid confusion with elements already present on the other staff or staffs.

Use of the new colour attributes could alleviate this problem, but I haven't tried this method yet.

Bob

Reply 4 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 03-Jul-2000

Sorry my fault : I was note aware of the possibility to select notation then the properties button on the mose that give a very big choice of actions including the direction of stem and slurs. This is very convenient with layering : you select whole and put stems and slurs in the good direction!
Sorry NWC fault : I have found in the help ctrl+e that does not give all these possibility. Please improve the help at the summer release : this will avoid most of my stupid questions!
I think that the second part of my intervention is still valid : a shorter slur will give more flexibility on vertical placement and use less vertical if placed at the height of the note instead of farther than the stem!

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 03-Jul-2000

> a shorter slur will give more flexibility on
> vertical placement and use less vertical if
> placed at the height of the note instead of
> farther than the stem!

I second this demand. It would be great to have a control on the vertical placement of the slur, sometimes farther than the stem, and sometimes at note head (particularly when layering).

Reply 6 offered by: Artur on 03-Jul-2000

I think that not only the slurs could be "heighted" but also the note stems, there are some times that there is a part in the layered score that needs shorter note stems to not come over the other parte., also, there should be a smaller note (cue) that could help when there are too many parts in only one staff.

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 04-Jul-2000

Slurs can sometimes be raised with careful placement of hidden grace notes (or maybe grace rests - I have not tried that). Also, is a "cue" note not the same as a grace note?

But yes, what I would like is for slurs to become separate objects (rather than a property of the leading note), so you could set properties like starting and ending height.

Reply 8 offered by: Artur on 04-Jul-2000

Cue notes are notes that have the same value of the real note and the same size of appogiaturas (with no slash)
It appears when you have a part score (for example) in an orchestra that after a long rest needs some reference on what is another part doing, the some of the other part appears like small notes...


#1634: Odd playback delay on one particular file
Odd playback delay on one particular file

(1634)

Submitted by: Michael McIntyre on 02-Jul-2000

I'm in the process of working up a new song. I haven't gotten very far. Just a few bars on a few staffs with local repeats to keep things looping.

There's nothing particularly unusual or demanding about this file, but it's causing something quite odd. When I play any part of the file, whether it be all the staffs, one staff, from the beginning, from the middle, etc. there is a long delay before playback begins. The delay is so long that twice now I have killed Noteworthy via ctrl-alt-delete because I assumed it had locked up.

I've tried all the usual stupid stuff as far as making sure Noteworthy is the only application running, etc. and this one particular file always does this.

Very strange. I have absolutely no explanation.

Any thoughts?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Jul-2000

The repeat loop is your problem.
Try lowering the number of repeats.

Reply 2 offered by: Artur on 03-Jul-2000

This happens when there are too many measures to play and/or you have a fermata before where you are going to play. I hate this fermata delay, but the measures can be because your processing capability is going lazy.


#1635: Printing partialy entered song
Printing partialy entered song

(1635)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 02-Jul-2000

I have tried to print a partialy entered song with Soprano partialy entered, Alto completed, nothing in Tenor. Soprano is declared as layered to Alto but at page setup layering is not allowed. Lyrics have been declared and entered only in the Alto staff.
Printing or print preview do not go farther that what has been entered in Soprano. Is this a bug or a feature ?
I think that, for checking purpose, all that has been entered should be printed even if not all the part have been completed.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Jul-2000

It is always best to print a collection of staves that are of equal length. NWC does not force this issue, but you will get better results that way. Results will vary when the bar line count and measure duration do not match between parts in the printed system.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 12-Jul-2000

A ma connaissance, NWC prévisualise/imprime jusqu'à la fin de la "topmost" portée.
You still may add "rest measures" (whole rest + bar) at the end of the unfinished business :-)
(BTW, I often use this technique when writing fugues, for a better navigation between staves)

HTH!

Dominique

Reply 3 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 13-Jul-2000

The remark made by Marsu is very interesting. This looks like the bug report in msg #1620 (reply 1) : "Currently, only the top staff in the layer is considered and the rest are ignored."
Does the same fix or a similar one correct the problem : it is easier to check on paper a total view of what has been already entered than a partial view on screen.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 13-Jul-2000

Our reply (Reply 1) is the official answer. As Marsu pointed out, you can pad an incomplete staff with whole measure rests to conform to NWC requirements.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 18-Jul-2000

moreover, I find it's more easily to see what's done and what's not on screen:
1. go to any staff
2. simply type 'End' key : you'll be at the end of the staff
3. use pgUp or pgDn to move up/down one staff (you may also use the vertical scrollbar if present)

You'll perfectly see if there are missing measures!

HTH,
Dominique


#1636: Parameters of layered staves
Parameters of layered staves

(1636)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 02-Jul-2000

With Layering we need commands that apply to:
1)all the staves eg. sizes of staff or characters (as they seems to be defined in page setup which is common it is OK).
2)group of layered staves eg. up and down vertical sizes. What is the result in case of discrepancy between the values of layered staves?
3)each staff for maximum flexibility in special cases eg. the SATB template with different lyrics for each staff.
Cases 1 and 2 may be implemented with special commands or by defining the value 0 as meaning "the same value as in the other staff(ves)" even if layering is off in the page setup.

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 03-Jul-2000

Sayng this here won't have any difference to Nw, go to wish list and write down all of this, so that they maybe will do some changes.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 03-Jul-2000

I think it is a good idea to submit ideas for improvement to this forum for feedback before posting to the wish list.

As for layering sizes, now it uses the values from the first staff in the layer; the next release is supposed to use the largest of the values in all the staves in the layer. This seems adequate to me.

Reply 3 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 10-Jul-2000

In see msg #1620 (reply 1) I have found :
"Bug: When layering, the size of all of the layered staves should be considered when vertically placing the staves into
the system. Currently, only the top staff in the layer is considered and the rest are ignored.
Status: Confirmed; Fix completed; Release target 1.70 SP1"
This may solve (without further development except inclusion of this function in help file) my problem of setting the parameters of 2 layered staves by etting one to the minimum (eg. in template) and playing with the sizes of the other.
With Layering defined in S and T staves, it may or may not be allowed in page setup.
Does the bug correction apply in both cases ?
Does this apply only to upper and lower vertical sizes or to other parameters ?
What about "staff size" defined in page setup|options? My understanding was that page setup (and its parameters) was common to all the staves.
I am not happy with the present situation (only the top staff) because I put the lyrics below A staff (up to 4 lines) or the B staff (5 lines or more) and I wish to put sizes in other staves to minimum values by default.
Please clarify all these questions.

Reply 4 offered by: Artur on 10-Jul-2000

>Status: Confirmed; Fix completed; Release target 1.70 SP1
I wonder when will this come out...

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Jul-2000

See msg #1619 (reply 1)

Reply 6 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 12-Jul-2000

Does this means that I'll have answers to my questions only in the summer new help ?


#1637: guitar links
guitar links

(1637)

Submitted by: marsu on 03-Jul-2000

Int'l users:
http://www.laguitare.com/tablature.html
You'll find there some links to other interesting places.

For francophones only:
http://www.ifrance.com/accoustic/
mais aussi
http://www.OuAcheter.Net/guide/Loisirs/Musique/Partitions/
(for drums either)

Reply 1 offered by: geoffrey on 05-Jul-2000

Hello.

What do most of you use to notate a drum track?
I would like to notate a drum track from my midi file but I don't know how to do it?
What do I need to do?
I need to do the drum notes with the crossed heads.
Thankyou. I am very happy with the Noteworthy score.

Thankyou.
Geoffrey Hyder.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Jul-2000

I use the utility "Drumkit" by Barry Graham, available from the Scriptorium, to re-map the midi drum notes into the more-or-less standard ones used in drum notation. The original midi drum track is then hidden, and the notation staff muted so that it works aurally as well as visually.

The crossed noteheads aren't possible yet, what I do is put an "x" as text over the note to represent rimshots, etc.


#1638: Notra Dame Victory March
Notra Dame Victory March

(1638)

Submitted by: Tony on 04-Jul-2000

Does anyone have a NWC or midi file for Notra Dame Victory March?
Please e-mail me if you happen to have one. Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 04-Jul-2000

there's a site on the web that contains more thatn 9k midid files, if you know the composer, it should be worth to pay a visit:
http://www.prs.net


#1639: Dynamic Variance bug?
Dynamic Variance bug?

(1639)

Submitted by: Andrew Johnson on 05-Jul-2000

The help text for 1.70 (love all the new features BTW!) explains how dynamic variance works, and states that only "cresc." and "decresc." actually affect the MIDI output.

I want "dim." to do just that, so I inserted a hidden "decresc." as well as the visible "dim.", but it seems that the presence of the "dim." dynamic variance object stops the "decresc." from doing its job! I can (and do) work around the problem by inserting the "dim." as a text item, but it seems a bit silly that I have to do it this way.

Am I being unreasonable in wanting "dim." to be made MIDI-active like "decresc."? As a programmer myself I can't believe it should be that difficult to do.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Allen on 06-Jul-2000

I agree, a dim. that effects midi output would be an easy and useful enhancement. Dim. is less than half the length of Decresc. so scores with lots of dynamic changes would look significantly less cluttered.

Reply 2 offered by: Brian on 06-Jul-2000

The "decresc." item will still do its job if it is put after the "dim." instead of before it.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Jul-2000

We will consider this.


#1640: User Fonts #1 to 6
User Fonts #1 to 6

(1640)

Submitted by: Raul Robledo on 06-Jul-2000

I cant find in the Help Menu the procedure to define the User Fonts # 1 to 6, to be used to Insert Text.
Is there a NWC feature or is related with the fonts used by Windows ?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 06-Jul-2000

Go to File/Page Setup and select the Fonts tab. You'll see a list of the fonts currently in use. Double click on one of the User fonts and a dialog box will come up allowing you to select the font and edit its characteristics.

Reply 2 offered by: Charles on 09-Jul-2000

Are all the characters in the Noteworthy font run out?
Can they add drum heads and chord slashes this way?

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 10-Jul-2000

No, there's still plenty of room in the NWC font. If you want symbols added, go to the wish list (click on "site map" at the top of this page and then follow the link to the Wish List) and ask for them. The Boxmarks2 font, which is AFAIK still under development, may also have room, although I don't know if there's still time to squeeze new things in. You might send mail to the developer (marsu@europe.com) and ask.


#1641: Alto Sax Range
Alto Sax Range

(1641)

Submitted by: Daniel on 06-Jul-2000

I am currently orchestrating a show for production in October and I have included an Alto Sax part. I have nearly finished my work, but then suddenly I realised I did not know how high or low an alto sax could go.
Please could someone tell me what is the lowest note it would be able to play and its highest.
And finally..... When you use the transpose function I know for an Alto Sax you transpose it by 9, but is it up 9 or down 9?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson  on 06-Jul-2000

The written range for the Alto Sax is from the Bb below middle C to the F# above high C. Keep in mind that the lower notes will be harder for some players to play and also out of tune.

As far as transposing, you should set it to -9, making the G on the first space above the staff sound like a Bb on the staff.

-joe

Reply 2 offered by: Eamonn FitzPatrick on 07-Jul-2000

Further to Joe's helpful advice, the Compasses.zip file at the Scriptorium is a very useful piece of kit for any composer not familiar with instrument ranges. It would be well worthwhile downloading it, Daniel.

Eamonn

Reply 3 offered by: chris on 08-Jul-2000

To add to Joe's response....

If you are writing for younger players, then F natural above high C is the highest note in the normal range of the horn. Generally, only higher quality/pro-model horns have a high F sharp key. Also, Selmer (and possibly others), did make some altos many years ago with a low A key. Finally, the range for all saxophones can be extended about one octave above the normal range through the use of altissimo fingerings. Some advanced saxophone literature does make use of the altissimo range, but I would suggest only using it when one knows that the intended players are quite well-trained.

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 6 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 7 offered by: Daniel on 17-Jul-2000

Thank you to all those who sent info to help me.
What is SYSOP??

Thanks again

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jul-2000

SYStem OPerator -- that is, the owner of the forum site. Messages are generally only removed if they are inappropriate to the discussion at hand.

Reply 9 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 10 offered by: Daniel (me again) on 05-Aug-2000

Thanks for all of your help. Next problem. I have written the part out now but I have written it for an instrument in C (eg flute) do I transpose +9 or -9 so it is written for an Eb instrument.
Thanks!

Reply 11 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Aug-2000

For Alto Sax +9 to written pitch (should sound -9 lower than written pitch).

Reply 12 offered by: Daniel on 10-Aug-2000

Thanks for your reply. Next and last question before I submit my orchestrations I promise!

Please could you let me know what the highest and lowest note the sax could play when written as an instrument in c (eg a flute)

Thank You

Reply 13 offered by: johnti on 10-Aug-2000

It is best to stay within the range of the staff. This is the best approach because in the lower range the sound gets increasingly flatter so you need to have professional (experienced) musicians to work in this area for good results. For the higher notes it's a similiar issue: they notes become increasingly more difficult to control. That's not to say that your work is too hard to play, it's just that you don't want a performance to go not so good because many of the instrument parts weren't written in their best (optimum) range. It basically comes down to two things:
1. what is the purpose of your composition? Is it a clarinet concerto? If so keep the difficulty to this part and let the rest of the orchestra take it easier.
2. who is going to play your work? if they are your band members and you know how good they each are write a little above what you know they can do. If it's for a school orchestra keep it easy and don't ask for instruments like harps and things they won't have. make it easy and fun.
Writing material more difficult than it needs to be can spoil a piece - this is mostly related to your accompaniment. For example, the piano part for a choral piece is usually quite rudimentary because the focus is on the choir.

Reply 14 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Aug-2000

Amen to all that Johnti.
Here's a quote from Bill Russo in his book "Composing for the Jazz Orchestra" - I keep it in mind whenever I score a chart.

"Technically, it is always better to err on the side of simplicity than on the side of complexity.
Music which is beneath the technical level of the musicians will be played well.
Music that is the slightest bit too hard may not be played at all!"

As an Alto/Baritone player I totally agree with your comments.
Alto and Tenor written in the 2 octaves D to D"
on the parts is a safe bet.
For Baritone the lowest notes on the horn are safe (Bb or A as the case may be) but I hesitate to write above the staff unless Bari is doubling the lead or you only have 3 saxes.
It sounds so much better in it's characteristic low octave.

Reply 15 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Aug-2000

Daniel - I didn't answer your question with my last reply.

Alto (range in concert pitch)
Range Db4 - Ab6 Safe 2 octave range F4 - F6

Tenor (range in concert pitch)
Range Ab3 - Eb6 safe 2 octave range C4 - C6

Soprano is pitched an octave higher than Tenor (Ab4 - Eb7)
Safe 2 octave range C5 - C7 but for most players the upper notes are difficult to play in tune for any but the most skilled players and the lower notes lack power.

Baritone (range in concert pitch)
Range C3 - Ab5 (most modern instruments can reach down to C3).
Safe range C3 - C5 (middle C) but best below Bb4.

Johnti's reply is sound advice.

HTH

Reply 16 offered by: daniel on 11-Aug-2000

Is concert pitch when the instruments are played or when they are written?

Reply 17 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Aug-2000

Concert pitch is the actual note sounded. For example, a B-flat instrument will sound a B-flat where the score shows a C.

Reply 18 offered by: someone on 16-Nov-2001

if u play the low B flat into your knee you can get out an A or sometimes a really out of tune A flat. On a professional saxophone it can go up to an F# but not on a beginer's. Any note higher than that is an altissimo note and is very hard to play and to get in tune.


#1642: Double-Whole notes
Double-Whole notes

(1642)

Submitted by: Artur on 07-Jul-2000

I don't understand why doesn't Nwc has any double-whole
notes, we can select 4/2, but no double-whole note to fill the measure, if anybody thinks of replying by saying that the measure can be filled by one whole rest will do, WRONG!
To the player it seems as only the half of the measure and I know that because I'm getting a lot of complains in J.S.Bach's Mass in B-, because it looks that only half measure is to be played...
Why can't NW fix this?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 08-Jul-2000

Artur,
The font boxmarks2 should fix this (for readers at least; you'll need to hide the corresponding two wholes in the score for corect playback).
The current beta version has this double-whole just a bit too small, though usable, and it will be corrected.

BTW, you could also divide all lengths by 2, and write your score in 4/4!
But some readers may be afraid of 32th... ;) ...though they should not be played quicker than the 16th in 4/2!

To do this in NWC 1.70, select the whole staff (End, Shift+Home), and press '-'. That's all. You just have to change the time signatures.
You may not want to re-beam things, as lyric have not changed (typically, different syllables are NOT beamed).

hope this helps!
Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 08-Jul-2000

Oops!
Just forgot: you should also change the tempi!
Hint: before changing the Base (quarter, half...), select the Tempo value and copy it (Ctrl-C). Then change the Base (half becomes quarter, in your case), and paste (Ctrl-V) the value back in the Tempo cell (which has been updated automatically) to keep the same real value. Usually the automatic change is helpful, but we're in a special case!

NWCly yours,
Dominique

Reply 3 offered by: Artur on 08-Jul-2000

I'm sorry, but I'm not allowed to change the tempo, if Bach wanted 4/2 (which was considered alla breve, so I just hid the 4/2) I can do nothing, the music really changes, it's psycollogical, the player sees it in a different way.
I use boxmark2, but it doesn't have the rest.
The rest is the problem, since the whole rest looks just like half measure and 2 wholes look like too many notes in the staff.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Jul-2000

In our tests, the whole bar/measure rest handles 4/2 time just as it should.

Double whole notes are not supported. You can tie two whole notes together. If you wish, you can hide them and use work around fonts to get the double whole note appearance.

Reply 5 offered by: Artur on 08-Jul-2000

I can do all of that, the whole rest works as a full 4/2 measure, but that's not the point, it doesn't look right, it seems to the player (that only sees he's part) that there's only half of the 4/2 in the measure, and that makes him make a mistake in an orchestra.
I still don't know (and understand) why won't you put a doublw-whole note in Nwc.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred on 08-Jul-2000

> I still don't know (and understand) why won't you put a
> doublw-whole note in Nwc.

Perhaps it has to do with priorities. In the three years I've been using NoteWorthy Composer, I personally haven't had the need for "double whole notes" even once. Other users may find it absolutely essential. I can only suggest posting your request to the wish list, the more people that suggest a given feature, the more likely it will be that the request will be considered for a future release. (Also have a look at the "wishes granted" list, to get an idea of just how many such requests have been honoured in the past.)

Reply 7 offered by: Artur on 08-Jul-2000

already done, but thanks.

Reply 8 offered by: Steve Allen on 11-Jul-2000

Artur wrote:
> if Bach wanted 4/2 I can do nothing.
I agree, 4/2 and 3/2 are totally different from 4/4 and 3/4.

Noteworthy on line wrote:
> If you wish, [you can] use work around fonts to get
> the double whole note appearance.

Personally I prefer to call them "supplemental" rather than "work around" fonts. ;-)

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Jul-2000

> supplemental

Works for me.

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 12-Jul-2000

About reply 5:
Artur, a whole rest takes a full measure, even if it has 3, 4, 5 or 8 quarters in it!!
Maybe your readers should be reminded of this?
I've never seen TWO whole rests in 4/2 measures, so I wonder what the problem is. Except the reader's knowledge in music theory.
About double-whole, I'm gonna edit the "supplemental" font and fix it asap --within the current week.
HTH,
Dominique

PS. About r8: 4/2 differs from 4/4, in "unprepared" minds. But you agree, I suppose, that the tempo remains the same, if you divide lengths by 2, as in r1? just curious :)

Reply 11 offered by: Artur on 14-Jul-2000

NO, you are NOT right!
4/2 DIFFERS from 4/4 OTHERWISE, WHY WOULD BACH WRITE IN 4/2, NOT IN 4/4?YES HE HAD THE POSSIBILITY, BUT NO! HE WANTED THE 4/2 AND I´VE SEEN PROFESSIONAL SCORES AND THEY SHOW A DOUBLE-WHOLE REST! SO IF NW WANTS ITS PRODUCT TO LOOK PROFESSIONAL, INSERT THE DOUBLE-WHOLE REST!!!

Reply 12 offered by: observer on 14-Jul-2000

so does shouting make you right?

Reply 13 offered by: observer 2 on 15-Jul-2000

possibly

Then again, 4/2 and 3/2 are different from 4/4 and 3/4. In that 4/2 has 8 quarter notes in a measure and 4/4 only has 4. I think what marsu was trying to say is that they're related rather than flat out differning only in "'unprepared' minds."

About the whole rest, it technically only fills the space of 4 quarter notes. Having it fill a whole measure is the convention of the slacker publishers.

- observer 2 (a.k.a. Joseph Sowa)

Reply 14 offered by: John Aldridge on 16-Jul-2000

According to my copy of "Rudiments and Theory of Music", "A semibreve rest is used for a whole bar's rest in any time except 4/2, when a breve rest is used".

Reply 15 offered by: grant on 17-Jul-2000

>>>Then again, 4/2 and 3/2 are different from 4/4 and 3/4. In that 4/2 has 8 quarter notes in a measure and 4/4 only has 4.

Strictly speaking, it doesn't matter how many quarters there are. Both 4/2 and 4/4 indicate that a measure contains 4 units; the only difference is how these units are notated. In 4/4, the unit is quarter notes; in 4/2, half notes. As long as the quarter in 4/4 has the same duration as the half in 4/2, the difference between these two signatures is a visual one only.

That said, a visual difference is not necessarily negligible. Unless checked by a metronome, a musician is likely to play music slower if it's notated in "longer" notes. The problem is that notational practice has changed over time, generally in favor of "shorter" note values. (Note, for example, that the English term for "double whole note", the longest note in current use (and that rarely), is "breve", which is from the Latin word meaning "short". All the rest of the notes we use today are shorter than short.) This means that old music may look slower to today's musicians than it did to the composer's contemporaries. For this very reason, contemporary editions of pre-Baroque music are often printed with the note durations cut in half - e.g., 4/4 for 4/2, 3/4 for 3/2 and so on.

Reply 16 offered by: marsu on 18-Jul-2000

Thank you Grant, that's exactly what I wanted to say. Much more better explained.

No need to scream for that, Artur!!

A beat is a beat, and a quarter may be a beat as well as a ...quarter(!) of a beat, that was what I was trying to expose.

Now to YOUR problem : if you've seen double-whole rests, then could you send me one (scan or hand-draw), so that I can add it in boxmark2.ttf ???
For on my side, I've NEVER EVER seen one, even (or specially?) on old scores made by old engravers. So I've absolutely no idea of it may look like.

And am I wrong if I say that, at Bach's period of time, noone had ever written 64th? So where would be the problem if dividing EACH note and time sigs? (just teasing, but in fact a serious discussion I already had with music teachers)

NWCly yours,
Dominique

Reply 17 offered by: Artur on 18-Jul-2000

I had no intention to shout whatsoever, but I did so because after explaining my points on and on, marsu wouldn't "get it".
Thanks John, you really understood me!

Reply 18 offered by: Grant on 18-Jul-2000

And is it your contention that typing something in all caps somehow makes it easier to understand?

Reply 19 offered by: Grant on 26-Jul-2000

For what it's worth (which is probably precious little at this point), I was looking through the score of Frank Martin's "Petite symphonie concertante" tonight and noticed that it contains one and only one 4/2 measure. In this measure, a whole rest is used to indicate an empty measure; a half measure's rest is indicated by two half rests (I assume because the whole rest is already spoken for).

I don't buy the "slacker publishers" explanation either. This is quite a nicely printed edition by the "Wiener Philharmonischer Verlag" of Vienna (and if the Viennese don't know music, who does?). Does anyone seriously think that the publishers couldn't afford the time and/or ink to engrave an extra whole rest in the empty 4/2 measure if they thought it was the correct notation? In an edition of 150 pages? Pshaw.

Reply 20 offered by: marsu on 27-Jul-2000

Finally, where could I see a "breve rest" ? I still have no clue about its shape...

Reply 21 offered by: Artur on 01-Aug-2000

Is it difficult for NW to input a breve?

Reply 22 offered by: Peter Edwards on 02-Aug-2000

Grant suggested that a half measure rest needed to be two be two half note rests, but in fact NWC handles it quite nicely. If there is only one whole note rest in the bar then it covers the whole bar. If it is there with further notation in the bar then it assumes its correct (ie one semibreve) value.

So a whole (semibreve) rest is sufficient for a whole bar's silence - whatever the length of the bar (from 1/64 to 4/2). But when can we have a breve (double whole note) as a genuine note length? Please.

Reply 23 offered by: Grant on 02-Aug-2000

I didn't suggest that it *needed* to be two half-rests. I suggested that it *made sense* for it to be two half-rests, so as to avoid confusion.

The alternative would be to use a whole (semibreve) rest to mean both "a whole measure's rest" and "a half-measure's rest" in different staves of the very same measure. I suppose you could defend this (and I understand why NWC can handle it) - but to ordinary human musicians I think it could be a bit confusing.

Reply 24 offered by: Peter Edwards on 02-Aug-2000

Honestly I wasn't actually trying to be contentious here, but in 3/4 or 4/4 time (if you halved the time values, as has been suggested above) you'd expect to see a minim rest, so in 3/2 or 4/2 it should/ought/could be a semibreve rest. So Noteworthy in this instance allows us complete freedom of expression. Hurrah!

Reply 25 offered by: Artur on 03-Aug-2000

Wouldn't it look better with a breve?

Reply 26 offered by: Artur on 10-Aug-2000

Will Nw do it?

Reply 27 offered by: Grant on 10-Aug-2000

NW almost never makes promises like this, particularly about enhancement requests. You just have to make your wish known and then hope and pray.

Reply 28 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-Aug-2000

In reply 20, marsu wrote :
> Finally, where could I see a "breve rest" ? I still have no clue about its shape...

I must check, but I think that a "breve rest" is twice as high as a "semibreve rest" (extends from 3rd line to 4th line), but half as width.

And I think there also are "two-breves rests" (two breves is a long ?) which are twice as high as the "breve rest" (extend from 2nd line to 4th line).

However, I only saw these on the "pre-staff" section of early music sheets, where there is a clue on how the music was originally written.

Reply 29 offered by: Grant on 11-Aug-2000

The breve rest may be the same as the 2-measure rest I requested on another thread (msg #1372 (reply 9)).

Various combinations of 1-measure (whole; semibreve), 2-measure (double whole; breve) and 4-measure (quadruple whole; ?) rests are used in parts to denote 2 to 7 consecutive measures of rest (2, 2+1, 4, 4+1, 4+2, 4+2+1).


#1643: missing notes?
missing notes?

(1643)

Submitted by: john d. on 08-Jul-2000

i finally got around to downloading 1.70, but after attempting to install it multiple times on my computer, when i try to open a document on it, only the staffs show up. i can play it, but nothing is displayed. what's wrong?

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 08-Jul-2000

See if the files have hidden notes.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Jul-2000

Your colors must be screwed up. Go to Tools | Options | Color while in the editor. Change your color settings such that you can see things.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 09-Jul-2000

As I recall, I also saw this symptom after installing one of the 1.70 beta versions. It's rather disconcerting (HELP! I've lost all my notes!), but in my case it went away after I rebooted the PC.

In general, it's a good idea to reboot after installing new software, even if the installation program doesn't do it for you.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Jul-2000

During the beta, it was possible to have a conflict between NWC version 1.70 and earlier versions, speicifcally in the editor's color scheme. We made changes for the final beta and ultimately the final release that should totally have eliminated this problem (where a reboot was needed).

In the final 1.70 release, occasionally we have received support requests from users that have their editor setup for white background and white defaults for printing and/or in the editor. These are not NWC defaults, and yet somehow users manage to end up with these settings. The simple solution is to change your color options such that you can see your songs in the editor and when printing.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 10-Jul-2000

Thanks for the clarification, but I'm still a little confused. I had already uninstalled all previous versions of NWC when I ran into the problem I described above. How could there have been a conflict between 1.70 and previous versions when the previous versions were gone?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Jul-2000

The problem in the earlier betas was directly caused by having run an older version of NWC prior to running the new copy. You may have later uninstalled the older copy, but Windows would still remember the Window styles from the older version for the NWC editor until you reboot the machine.

In the earlier betas, this could be solved by either rebooting or going to Tools | Options | Color in the new version and pressing OK. We removed the need to do either of these in the final beta. We made the internal Window's name for the editor window different from earlier NWC versions, thus avoiding the conflict.


#1644: Drum notation
Drum notation

(1644)

Submitted by: Yell on 08-Jul-2000

Can I draw cross instead of note for cymbal playing ?
if yes, how to proceed ???
Or is there another software to write for drum playing??
Thanx !

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 08-Jul-2000

Please see:
http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1637.htm#reply2

Reply 2 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 3 offered by: groove kid on 08-Jul-2000

What is another shareware program I can use in tandem with Noteworthy just to notate drum tracks?
Please reply to me off list!!!
Thankyou.


#1645: More parts (melodies) in one staff
More parts (melodies) in one staff

(1645)

Submitted by: Flavio Corgnati  on 10-Jul-2000

I like to use a NoteWorthy Composer evaluation. I think OK, and next days I want order it.
My question: it is possible write two melodies in one staff?
I'm writing songs for a chorus with four parts and usually the melodies for TENORI 1° and TENORI 2° are both in one staff.

Thanks and compliments.

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 10-Jul-2000

Yes, I do that all the time, for exactly that purpose. It's routine. Although it is possible to make "chord notes" on a single staff, the best way is to first create the separate melodies on two staffs, then merge them into a single staff. They can later be un-merged for separate editing, if you wish.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Jul-2000

You merge them through staff layering, which is a two step process:

1. Enable Staff Layering in File | Page Setup | Contents

2. Layer a staff from Staff | Staff Properties | Layer with next staff

See also: msg #1555, msg #1326

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 11-Jul-2000

Staff layering has other advantages other than making entering notation for two voices easier. For playback you can assign different instruments for each voice, or send each voice to a different speaker, or mute a voice. This can be useful for practicing. You can even display each voice in a different color.


#1646: Layering in Player
Layering in Player

(1646)

Submitted by: Artur on 10-Jul-2000

When I open a music that has layered parts in the Player, the player gets confused, I usually use more than a group when layering staves, I use the one marked with Layer w/ next staff and the one to be layered. I really wish that we could also select what to see in the player, because it's difficult to visualise with only two groups separated.
Nw, how did you do to make (saw this in Moonlite) the player to show only one group (or more) ?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jul-2000

From the Player help file:

<quote>

NoteWorthy Player will only show the first two viewable staff groups in a NWC score file. The first staff group is identified by the first staff in the score. The player always displays this group. A second, when it exists, is generally displayed in the lower notation window. However, if the second group is named Hidden, then it will not be displayed in the lower notation window. You can also use additional display groups (beyond the first two viewable groups) in your score, but only the first two viewable groups will show up in the viewer. Note that all groups and their parts can be seen if loaded by NoteWorthy Composer itself. Sound effects, tempo changes, or other effects such as chord appregios could be added in these hidden areas, and they would not clutter the view of the score seen by the listener.

Note that the view of your score in the player is similar to a print preview. The listener will not see you hidden items, such multi-point controllers, sound patches, or hidden tempo marks, even if they are present in the viewable staff groups.

</quote>

Reply 2 offered by: Artur on 10-Jul-2000

Thanks, but it still doesn't answer why it doesn't layer

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jul-2000

It does display layered staves, showing items as defined in the visibility attribute, if both are in the same group, and if the name of that group is not "Hidden".


#1647: c:\windows\nwc.ini and 1.70
c:\windows\nwc.ini and 1.70

(1647)

Submitted by: Steve Allen on 11-Jul-2000

I'm now using nwc 1.70 exclusively. Can I remove c:\windows\nwc.ini?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Jul-2000

Yes.

Alternatively, you can mark the NWC.INI file that is in the NoteWorthy Composer program folder as "read-only" and force it to use the copy in your Windows folder.


#1648: zooming in on lyrics
zooming in on lyrics

(1648)

Submitted by: Lawrence Yates on 11-Jul-2000

Since I uploaded the new version 7.0 I can't zoom in on the lyrics (zooming in on the music before going to lyrics doesn't work). The lyric editor text is so small I can't read it - any ideas,

All the best,

Lawrence

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 11-Jul-2000

I am not sure what is going on here. The screen zoom used to affect the lyric font size, but now it does not. I think this is a good thing, but it does not explain your problem. Have you checked you lyric font size to see if for some reason it is small?

Reply 2 offered by: Michael Powell on 11-Jul-2000

I've noticed this too and it appears that in 1.70 the size of the lyrics in the Lyrics Editor will be equivalent to the size of the font that is chosen for Staff Lyrics. Which in my opinion is not so good as it makes editing much more difficult because you have to increase Staff Lyrics font size to work on the lyrics and then decrease it back to the optimal size for printing the piece you are working on.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Jul-2000

Correct. The lyric is now shown in the size and style specified in File | Page Setup.

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul on 11-Jul-2000

In the previous versions, zooming at the main window used to effect the lyrics editor and it was the same with the betas. That was a fault which is now corrected because when you zoomed out to view all the parts, say, in a full orchestral score, it was impossible to see the lyrics.

But it's seen that viewing the lyrics in their actual font size doesn't either make some users happy, so, what about a fixed font size for lyrics editor?

Or maybe an independent zooming function? (Ummmh... I think this is too much.)

Reply 5 offered by: gub on 14-Jul-2000

The lyrics work awesomely for me! thanks noteworthy


#1649: Accents marks for two voices on one staff
Accents marks for two voices on one staff

(1649)

Submitted by: Laura on 11-Jul-2000

Okay, I've got two soprano lines on one staff, differentiated to indicate Sop I and II with up and down stems.

But I can't seem to figure out how to put an accent on beat one that doesn't get buried in the staff. Ideally I think the accent should go on the very top of the staff, but it will only put it in the middle.

I can't combine the two voices so that they share the same stem because the firsts are singing a dotted quarter note and the seconds are singing a half note.

Any resolutions to this?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Allen on 11-Jul-2000

1. use sf
2. Enter accents as text, using ">", and place them wherever you wish. Accents should go outside the staff, not within the staff where NWC places them.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Bacher on 12-Jul-2000

I also noticed a bug in 1.70 along the same lines.

When I have an up-stem note and a down-stem note together, and place a marcato (underscore) on it, it's invisible. Delete the down-stem note and the marking magically appears,
under where the down-stem note used to be.

As a workaround I did an "insert text" of a real underscore and set the location to be conjoint with the following note, but I shouldn't ought to have to do that. Plus, it puts extra space before the note where I added the manual marking.

- seb

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 12-Jul-2000

>>Plus, it puts extra space before the note where I added the manual marking.

Only in the Edit view. If you look at Print Preview you'll see that the space disappears. (NWC has to leave a little extra room in Edit for the gray diamond that represents the text item for selection and editing.)

Reply 4 offered by: Laura on 12-Jul-2000

I still can't get it to go directly over the note. The problem is, because the first sopranos are singing a different rhythm, I have had to place a slightly different lyric above the staff. Consequently, I can't get the lyric and the "text accent" to line up with one another so that they will appear ON the beat, rather than before or after or both.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Jul-2000

Assuming that you're using V1.70 -- when you enter the text accent > select the "Expression Placement" tab. Click the "Preserve Width" box OFF. Set Justification to CENTER. Set Alignment/Placement to "At next note/bar". That should fix it up for you.


#1650: NWC to PDF -- advanced users only, try this!
NWC to PDF -- advanced users only, try this!

(1650)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-Jul-2000

Regarding PDF from a NWC file:

I have access to a variety of special software (e.g. the full Adobe Acrobat, Illustrator, etc.) so I personally don't need to fool around with PDF problems. But I used to have them! So I sympathize.

Advanced users, try this: If you own font conversion software, make a Postscript Type 1 version of NWCV15 and call it NWCV15ps. Install the Poscript font using Adobe Type Manager.

Then (the tricky part) edit the win.ini file in the Postscript-True Type font substitutions section, so that NWCV15=NWCV15ps.

After re-booting, try it out. Go to NWC and print using Adobe PDFwriter (the cheap one!). Be sure that both NWCV15 and NWCV15ps always embed, and allow font subsetting for True-Type fonts only (not Postscript fonts).

The resulting PDF file works for me. Would anyone else out there like to try it? NO GUARANTEES! AT OWN RISK!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Jul-2000

Interesting approach - but it still requires a paid-for program. As I understand it, GSview does essentially that automagically when exporting to PDF -- for free!

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 12-Jul-2000

You are right, Fred. I have both the commercial (Acrobat, Distiller) and free (Ghostscript/GSview). My main reason for trying the round-about method was because I like to post-edit the printable image (not the music itself), and I do this in a drawing program (Illustrator). HOWEVER, another user informed me (off-line) that my proposal to create Postscript font and edit win.ini is VERY system-specific, and probably would not work for anyone else. Moral of the story: Forget I ever mentioned the topic!

Incidentally, if there are any readers out there who didn't already know this: NWCV15 font creates notes by drawing things such as note-heads, stems, and flags separately. So a NWC file is a lot more like a drawing file than a word-processing file. I believe that this approach is used by similar programs as well.

Reply 3 offered by: johnti on 13-Jul-2000

<<<<
NWCV15 font creates notes by drawing things such as note-heads, stems, and flags separately
>>>>

yeah! so why don't we have drum noteheads yet =)
:-)
i'm sure it's just got to be on the drawing board under careful attention!!

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 13-Jul-2000

Regarding drum-heads and other symbols (such as barred whole notes), a partial solution already exists, depending upon what you want to do:

The NWC file contains information for creating MIDI as well as information for printing the sheet music. It is possible to enter music notation symbols as TEXT (user-defined font) that will print on your sheet music, but do not attach to any MIDI even if you put them in the staff. In other words, placing a music symbol as TEXT "looks like" music when printed, but does not "sound like" music when played as MIDI.

If NWCV15 doesn't have a symbol you need, then browse the Internet for a freeware music font (they exist) for use as a user-defined text typeface.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve on 13-Jul-2000

No dude, that just won't work.
Noteworthy needs to have the drum heads to have beat values, eg. crochet or quaver. Otherwise it's just not going to happen. We can't fix everything. Stuffing with hiding layers and finding fonts just can't be expected of every user who needs to notate a drum track.

I mean it's silly really... you can implement huge symphonies with Noteworthy but you can't do a drum track. I'm certain it's not that hard for Noteworthy to do.

Why won't Noteworthy talk about it? Please!!!

Reply 6 offered by: Frank Clark on 13-Jul-2000

I would like to teach my son how to write drum tracks for band practice.

Reply 7 offered by: arova on 13-Jul-2000

i'll second that motion

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 14-Jul-2000

To Steve: Its not that hard once you have the right font. Just enter the beat using hidden notes or rests, then insert the text right over them (using the align center, center over notehead options). Yes, custom noteheads would be a lot nicer.

Reply 9 offered by: Michael Powell on 14-Jul-2000

Blair:

Steve's point was that although there is a work-around via hidden rests, placement of text, etc., it should be such that user wouldn't need to use work-arounds. I believe what he is looking for is the ability to notate drum tracks no different than he would a melody line or any other instrument or voice line. That would mean the drum notation would have beat values. As a composer of not only classical and liturgical music but jazz and pop, I would whole heartedly second his request for the ability to notate drum tracks.

And yes, before everyone leaps all over me, I have requested this type of feature on the wish list as well as other enhancements. Which is why I would be all for the suggestion(s)that were listed and discussed on the forum at msg #1585 (reply 6) through msg #1585 (reply 17) of having the wish list posted so that users could see and possibly vote on future enhancements.

Reply 10 offered by: Ertugrul on 16-Jul-2000

I have the same point with Steve. Yes, NWC is as good for being open to user supplements but do we have to complete all gaps -most of which are owned by "others", the worst part- ?

I wish for microtonal accidentals since I met NWC almost periodically, for instance. I can partially get them using a font which had been installed by the demo of those "others" (I can't remember which one) but I have to battle with allignements to make the symbol look like an accidental belonging to the succeeding note and I have to review the score for re-entering in the case of using the note as key signature.

Regarding the priorities, I, a registered NWC user, need those accidentals in 90% of my music.

The worst point at this subject, as I precalled, is that those "others" (not essentially 10X price of NW, one of them is only $65) already have the facilities that we request.

Now, it's the time to wish again.

Reply 11 offered by: Steve Allen on 17-Jul-2000

Blair Dowden wrote:
>Its not that hard once you have the right font. Just enter
>the beat using hidden notes or rests, then insert the text
>right over them (using the align center, center over
>notehead options).

The problem with this solution is beams. Each of those text notes would be unbeamed, making all but the simplest rhythms very hard to read.

My preferred solution for the present: allow users to hide the heads of notes, but not the stems and beams. Custom noteheads could then be entered as text, centered on the hidden noteheads. Ctrl+v and the right arrow key would allow you to enter the custom noteheads fairly quickly. With this enhancement NWC could not only do a better job with percussion, it could also do a much better job producing charts. There would be some vertical alignment problems, x noteheads, for example, would have to be moved up or down a half space to meet the stem properly, but I could live with that. It would also be useful to add a percussion "clef" -- the black rectangle that spans spaces 2 and 3 of a percussion staff. While the percussion clef could be inserted as text after each line break, it would be a real pain to do so. In fact a percussion clef by itself would be a significant enhancement to NWC, since much orchestral percussion music is notated on conventional staves.

Ertugrul wrote:
> I wish for microtonal accidentals
Do you mean sharp and flat signs with arrows on them?

> I have to battle with alignments to make the symbol look
> like an accidental belonging to the succeeding note
Is it a vertical or a horizontal alignment problem?

> I have to review the score for re-entering in the case of
> using the note as key signature.
I don’t understand.

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Jul-2000

Somehow, this thread turned into a discussion about drum note-heads. Very well!

It IS possible to change the appearance of NWC's standard note-heads so that they appear as "X" or whatever, without the need to edit the notes one-by-one. The technique changes the appearance of the note-heads only (does not affect stems or anything else)and can be used for some or all of the staffs (some can be left unchanged).

Here's the catch: The technique is relatively no-brainer and does not require much time, BUT it requires the use of a drawing program capable of opening and editing a Windows Metafile (WMF). Adobe Illustrator does it, and I am told that Corel Draw and some others do it. The picture editor within MS Word will NOT do it, nor will most paint-type programs.

To see if your drawing program can do it, create a small NWC composition, then use File>Print Preview to copy to a placeable Windows Metafile. Try to open the WMF in your drawing program. It will probably look too big -- that's a feature of WMF, not NWC -- if so, scale it down to size. Does it look OK? Can you select the individual elements and move them around? If so, then you have what it takes.

The same technique can be used for putting "barred whole notes" in the document, I beleive (I am currently checking this out).

Please understand that the technique makes no changes whatever to the NWC file, nor to the music output. All it does is allow you to change the appearance on a document to be printed.

If this interests you, and you have the technology, please let me know via E-mail (not the NWC forum) at ra849@yahoo.com what kind of note-heads you would like to see. I am not a drummer, or even a musician, so keep it simple. The technique is limited!!! Right now, I can replace quarter-note heads (incl, eighth, etc.) with a cross (X)and open-note heads (half, whole) with an open-cross. Stems and flags are preserved. Before I let everyone know how to do it, I want some feedback regarding what needs to appear.

Time limit: Wednesday, July 19, 2000 5:00 PM PDT.

Reply 13 offered by: bug on 31-Jul-2000

Re the drum track issue, this suggestion that people will spend hours creating each and every drum head seems ridiculous to me. The assumption with having a drum track in notation software is that the software WILL also import from the drum track on channel 10 of a midi file. There is NO way that I'm going to DIM (do-it-myself) - all this mucking around. If it comes to the point where Noteworthy doesn't implement drum track notation (which seems like a pre-requisite for working music notation nowadays) then I'm very afraid I'll will have to bite the bullet and save up for some other software that does. This is my realistic consideration of the matter.
Thank you.

Reply 14 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 31-Jul-2000

May I suggest that SYSOP at NWC remove this thread (which I started!) My original recommendation, I later learned, would not be suitable for those whose software setup is not exactly the same as mine (unlikely). My suggestion regarding drum-heads also would not work for everyone. I am concerned that future readers of the off-line forum will get onto this thread and be led astray.

If the topic of drum-heads is still alive, it can be re-started by its advocates as a new thread. As for PDF and similar topics, that has been discussed at great length by other users familiar with the technology.

Reply 15 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Aug-2000

There are numerous cross links to this thread, making removal difficult. For now, your disclaimer should be enough.


#1651: Multiple Licences?
Multiple Licences?

(1651)

Submitted by: Andrew Summers on 14-Jul-2000

Hi,
I'd like to purchase Noteworthy for my school. How much do multiple licences cost? How much for 5, or 20 copies?
Is there a password protect feature when you save the music files?
I will check back on Monday.
I look forward to your reply.
Kind Regards,
Andrew Summers.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 14-Jul-2000

Go to Noteworthy's site map, or,

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/sitelicense.htm

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Jul-2000

See http://NoteWorthyComposer.com/sitelicense.htm

NWC does not contain password protection schemes for files. If you are doing this for a school system, you should be planning a more universal solution. One that you can use on any or all files, not limited to just NWC files and the NWC programs.


#1652: nested triplets
nested triplets

(1652)

Submitted by: Reidar Bornholdt on 15-Jul-2000

I am entering a Dave Brubeck Chorale and have run across
a case of what I can only call nested triplets. They are
eighth note triplets except that the 2nd note is actually triplet sixteenth notes. NoteWorthy won't do it.
------3-------
(8th (16th 16th 16th) 8th)
-----------3------------
I am stumped. Is there a trick that will at least
sound right?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Jul-2000

Hmm.. good one! What you could do is enter the notes "straight"; i.e. 1/8-1/16-1/16-1/16-1/8. Before the first 1/8, enter a tempo 50% greater than your normal tempo (e.g. if it's at 120, enter 180). Before the first 1/16 enter a tempo 50% greater again (e.g. 270). After the last 1/16, back down again (e.g. 180), then at the very end return to your original tempo.

Now, to make it work right with other staves may be a problem, because your time signature will be wrong. You'll have 7/16 in the time of 1/4, so you'll have to add 3/16 to other staves on the beat on which this grouping falls.

Depending on exactly what's going on, you might even be able to make it look right in a printout, using the "hide almost anything" feature of NWC. For example, if there's just a single 1/4 on the other staff, you can write the 1/4, followed by a dotted 1/8, and hide the 1/8; also mute it by using a hidden dynamic with velocity override = 1. Put a pedal down before the 1/4, and a pedal up after the hidden 1/8 and it even sounds right again! :)

Finally, if you plan on auditing barlines, you'll have to add a hidden time signature change to keep the audit from mucking it all up. Example - if the original sig is 4/4, you'll have to change it to 19/16 (16/16 + 3/16) for that bar, then change it back to 4/4 at the next bar.

Reply 2 offered by: ded jorge on 16-Jul-2000

Better idea. Put in a bar rest and write it on the printout.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Allen on 17-Jul-2000

Reidar Bornholdt: Is there a trick that will at least
sound right?

ded jorge: Better idea. Put in a bar rest and write it on the printout.

And how will those written in notes "sound right"?

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Allen on 17-Jul-2000

I'm posting on the NWC newsgroup an approximate solution to your problem. The message is titled "Nested Triples." Notationally, the solution is ugly as sin, but it sounds good. It also illustrates a important point: In many cases, NWC user can, with careful use of tied, dotted, and double dotted 64th notes, closely approximate the sound of arbitrary tuples. Notation is another matter, though that may change to some extent when I finish my Noterow font.

Aside: It would be nice if NWC scores could be posted to this forum. Perhaps archiving them would be too difficult.

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Jul-2000

Here is a suggestion using staff layering. Write the triplet out in (I assume) eighth notes. Hide and mute the middle note. On the other layer, enter the triplet in 16'th notes, surrounded by hidden 16'th rests.

As for posting music on the forum, if you have a web page put it there and post the link.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Jul-2000

Just for completeness: NWC does not support nested triplets.

You can get close to the right play back oing something like:

(8th dotted32nd dotted32nd 32nd 8th)

but the visual representation is not directly supported in NWC.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jul-2000

Those of you with newsgroup access might want to check out Steve's thread on this topic, to which I've replied with two more solutions that both sound exact. The last variation is very near to looking right also -- the only remaining problem being that the "beamlet" on the hidden 1/16 note does not get hidden.

Reply 8 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Jul-2000

I got a chance to try my suggestion. It is simple and it works, but the middle note of the faster tripet did not line up with the middle note of the slower triplet, the way I expected. Does this mean that NWC does not correctly support LAYERED triplets (ie. bug), or is my expectation wrong?

I suspect the faster triplet is more stretched out than it should be, but this can be adjusted. It looks a bit funny - I wonder how the original score looked.

See a short example at
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/Choir/1724/NestedTriplet.zip

Reply 9 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Jul-2000

Sorry, GeoCities changed things. Get the file at

http://www.geocities.com/blairdowden/NestedTriplet.zip

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jul-2000

Blair, that one didn't work for me either. I don't understand how the layers can be expected to line up, since the entire group in the lower layer isn't tripletised, only the 1/16ths... which gets back to the original problem.

For you and anyone else without newsgroup access, I'll post the file referenced earlier at:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/other/nested2.nwc

Reply 11 offered by: Stephen Randall on 20-Jul-2000

How about going into compound time just for the difficult section. e.g. instead of 4/4 use 12/8? Then you can easily get constructs like quaver, 3 x triplet semiquaver, quaver (1/4 note, 3 x triplet 1/8 notes, 1/4 note) in the space of one beat.

However, if you have untripletted (is there such a word?) quavers or shorter in the same measure another problem arises; how do you get two/four notes in the time of one compound beat? This has been discussed elsewhere and maybe this problem would be easier to solve.

Another point to consider is that the whole score will have to go into compound time to get the beats to line up correctly in the other staffs.

What is else is happening in the same measure as the nested triplet?

Stephen Randall


#1653: System Breaks
System Breaks

(1653)

Submitted by: Janice Hopper on 15-Jul-2000

I apologize in advance if I've missed obvious info (I did look!)

I've downloaded the new version (1.70) and I understand there is a way to improve the way the printouts look by using system breaks. I just can't find out HOW to do this!

Where is the documentation that I'm missing?? Any hints or help available?

I love the program and have been using it for several years. The way it prints is really the only gripe I've had with it.

TIA --

Janice in Duluth, GA

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jul-2000

At the bar line where you want a system break (must be on the top staff), select the bar line and get into the Properties dialog (Alt-Enter or CNTL-E) and check the box that says "Force System Break (top staff only). It's documented in the help file under Bar Lines.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Jul-2000

See also: msg #1622


#1655: How to make bitmap, GIF, JPG from NWC
How to make bitmap, GIF, JPG from NWC

(1655)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 16-Jul-2000

If you already know how to use the Windows Metafile feature with one of your other programs (drawing, word processing)that will open or place a Windows metafile, then you don't need this message.

For those of you who have Windows 95 or later, and would like an easy (and free) way to make bitmap images (GIF, JPG, etc.) from Noteworthy Composer, here's how: Go to http://www.irfanview.com and download the free "Irfan View" software. Within NWC, Use File>Print Preview and if necessary go to the page you want to image. Within Print Preview, use the Copy feature to create a placeable Windows Metafile (not the clipboard). Exit NWC, then use Irfan View to open the metafile. You may need to scroll through the "open files of type" for EMF/WMF to find your file. It will open at high resolution, so if you see white space you are looking at a magnified empty corner of your image. [Caution: Do not save the file as BMP or TIF at this point, as it may be too large for the software to handle, and your computer may crash.] Use Image>Resize/Resample, choose "percentage of original" to re-sample your image down to a manageable size. I suggest 24 or 32 percent of the original, which will make it the size you think it should have been in the first place. Then, save it as a GIF or JPG. That's all you need to do!

However, there will probably be a lot of white space in the margins that you should crop. Irfan View doesn't do that directly, but you probably have a program (such as Kodak Imaging, an accessory with Windows 98) that allows you to open the image, select a rectangular area, and copy it to the clipboard. You can then open Irfan View, use Edit>Paste, and save the cropped image in GIF or JPG

I have placed a small sample of the result on my own web site, along with a link to Handel's Hallelujah chorus separated into four individual Soprano, Alto, Tenor, and Bass parts, free for the download. The URL is http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/index.htm. The sheet music was created using NWC. I put the it into PDF format using Acrobat Distiller, but I suppose I could have used Ghostscript instead.

If you wonder why a GIF or JPG derived from NWC is not as sharp as your think it should be, that is a feature of the low-resolution monitor display at 72 or 96 DPI. The original Metafile created from NWC is at 300 dpi printer resolution, I believe.

Incidentally, the Windows metafile created from NWC contains "vector" drawing information, meaning that it may be editable (for appearance) if you have a compatible drawing program.

Reply 1 offered by: Arova Heart on 17-Jul-2000

Thank you Robert

I am very grateful for this information.

I am very lazy and I have found what works for me is to print my works on a laser printer and scan it in. This might sound silly but I find that if I scan it at screen resolution the resulting image is perfect.

Have a good life.

Arova

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Jul-2000

Using GhostView, you can simply make JPG's from NWC's:

1) Follow the NWC to PDF thread submitted by Fred Nachbaur at the user tips section,

2) While printing from GhostView, select JPEG insteat of PDF,

3) Convert your JPG to the desired format if necessary, using, eg Paint Shop Pro from http://www.jasc.com

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Jul-2000

Correction:

> ... select JPEG instead of PDF

I meant instead of PDF write, in printers section (and of course you should surname the file as .JPG)

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Jul-2000

Arova Heart's suggestion (print and scan) does indeed usually produce sharper screen-resolution images (if you have a scanner). It IS possible to get sharper screen-resolution images from the technique I described, but it's a long story. Ertful's suggestions to use Ghostscript is also fine, for those of you using Ghostscript, but in most cases the JPG output will not be as sharp as print/scan. If you are only trying to make a GIF or JPG from a very small section of NWC, then with your NWC file open and the section displayed, use "print screen," then paste the clipboard into whatever program works for you. This produces the sharpest results.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Jul-2000

Sorry I misspelled your name, Ertrugal :-(

Reply 6 offered by: John Gillings on 21-Jul-2000

IrfanView does do cropping, just select the area by dragging
then choose Edit->Crop.

I'm having a bit of trouble convincing Noteworthy and Irfan
view to generate a high resolution image. The best I can manage is 652x940. Is there a trick to increasing the
resolution?

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 21-Jul-2000

You are right about cropping in Irfan View! Since I have access to other programs as well, I never thought of using it for that purpose. DOH.

As for high-resolution images: in NWC, if you go to File>Print Preview and copy a placeable Windows metafile, the metafile appears to be at printer resolution 300 pixels per inch (I could be wrong). I believe that Irfan View has a maximum file size (in pixels) that it can comfortably handle, but a more heavy-duty program (e.g. Photoshop) can handle it.

If you use PDF techology (Acrobat or Ghostscript) then you have more control over this and could, in principle, create very high-resolution images. But I don't think it is worth the effort. The NWC symbols are not intended for lithographic artwork, and I doubt that much would be added to visual clarity by going to higher than 300 dpi resolution.

If your problem is that you want to make images for the Internet, you are stuck with screen resolution like it or not. Whether or not an NWC image will be easy to read depends upon staff size (I find that 20 is better than the default 16), lyric size (I find that 12 points is best), and other factors.

Maybe someone else on the Forum could advise you better than I could? Since I have access to heavy-duty image processing software, I often use a cannon where a flyswatter will do (then, miss with the cannon!).

Reply 8 offered by: Fred on 21-Jul-2000

One thing I've found that greatly influences the readability of reduced (low-resolution) images is antialiasing. Most image manipulating programs (such as PaintShopPro, which I use) allow antialiasing when reducing images; in PSP it's in "Resample Image".

Another way to proceed is to use GSview. In Media -> Display Settings, set Resolution as desired to give the smaller image; 96 dpi is about the lower limit of readability. Set depth to 8 bit/pixel, set text and graphics alpha to 4 bits. Then use its Edit->Copy command, followed by Edit-Paste To to create a bitmap, which you can then manipulate (crop, etc.) in even something as rudimentary as MS Paint.

Reply 9 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 23-Jul-2000

Fred knows what he's talking about.


#1656: The Wish List
The Wish List

(1656)

Submitted by: ded jorge on 16-Jul-2000

Does the wish list operate like a standard filing system?
It goes in there as permanent storage?
Or is it a working document?

Can I view what's on the wish list?
Are Noteworthy users allowed to vote on the priority of items on the wish list?
Can Noteworthy do a user surver: either on the software itself or a sruvey on wish list items?
We could place a value out of 10 for which feature we want.
The items with the biggest values get earmarked for the next version?

What do others feel about this?

My impression is that Noteworthy is a very versatile program doing everything you basically want (except drum tracks), but yet I sense that there is a long term wait between versions and users don't know what to expect in the next version.

Comments?

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Jul-2000

> Can I view what's on the wish list?
> Are Noteworthy users allowed to vote on the priority of items on the wish list?

These points had been discussed in another thread which I can't remember at the moment and open wish list (or discussing wishes at a forum-like platform) was "wished" by some colleagues.

Reply 2 offered by: Michael Powell on 17-Jul-2000

Maybe it's time to revive the wish list debate. See messages at thread msg #1585 (reply 6) through msg #1585 (reply 17) and somewhat related thread at msg #1650 (reply 3) through msg #1650 (reply 12). Much discussion about the wish list and the "wish" of some of us users to be able to see what has been wished for. The main thought was to have the list posted and to possibly give users the ability to vote on future enhancements or see what has been proposed.

First, let me say that I am a very satisfied user of NWC. It is a tremendous program and more than worth the cost. I have tried Sibelius, Cakewalk, and some of the others on the market, and for my money, NWC is the best, period. However, there is always room for improvement.

Currently the wish list operates in a black hole. I believe most who have posted on this forum are reasonable human beings and know that all wishes cannot and will not come true, just as some wishes have come into being. This being the case, I believe it would be beneficial for all to see what has been asked for. Not so that more demands will be made on NWC, but just to see if other users have like wants and desires. As it stands now, none of us know what's been asked for and we can only guess as to what may or may not be under consideration.

The voting aspect would be a bonus and I think helpful to NWC not only to see what a majority of users may want, but maybe to eliminate wading through countless posts to the wish list trying to tally if it has been asked for previously or not. Then again, I could be wrong. Just wanting it to be a win-win for all as this is such a great product with a passionate group of users.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 17-Jul-2000

It would also help to discuss items on the wish list, to add, refine or remove bits from each suggestion.

For example I have asked for editable slurs where you can specify the end points, but others might have a better way of doing it.

Another example is n-tuplets where one suggestion is to specify the number of notes in a specific time (eg 7/4) but others have been suggested.

One disadvantage of 'the black hole' approach is that some features are rarely asked for because people don't realise that they need them - but just think of the enhancements we now have which we can no longer do without (staff layering for instance). Another is that there is never any feedback about what is possible. Something apparently very easy could be quite tricky with the file set-up that NWC uses, whereas other apparently difficult enhancements might be terribly easy - we just don't know.

For what it's worth I favour a much more open discussion about possible enhancements. Wish list here I come!

Peter

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Jul-2000

I agree with the above. As for editable slurs, if you happen to own a drawing program capable of opening and editing a Windows Metafile (WMF), you can do it now.

Reply 5 offered by: gub on 17-Jul-2000

Noteworthy is so left wing. they remove any posts that aren't totally square and don't JOIN IN on the discussion. as for the wish list they won't get in on that too because they are on a high horse and won't INTERACT. remove this post if you must but you guys need to be more realistic and more interactive. if you don't like this post instead of deleting RESPOND TO IT FOR A CHANGE!!!
said nicely,
gub

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 18-Jul-2000

To Robert: under Win95, I used to use Word 6.
But new versions of that kind of software sometimes does less than earlier versions (remind of BACKSPACE key in PaintBrush, after Ctrl-V was done, for instance).

To gub: what meals "left wing"? As a left-handed person, I'd take that for a compliment ;) but as per the rest as the message, it seems not. Just increasing my english vocabulary.
Now to your subject: "they don't join in"... Ain't this forum a forum for users? I prefer that NWC's staff don't reply to each and every thread --they've got much better to do: improving software, and study wish list.
What they do, and do at their own rhythm; even if there are things I'd like to see, I'm globally satisfied of the NWC progression. Have you ever lost your work using NWC? I never did. Not the same with other "professional" programs!!!!
BTW, I usually learned more by users --because they are more numerous and all over the world: 24/24h, 7days a week.
But things written by NWC are usually efficient, and rarely need some more explanation.
I already created 3 lists about NWC. Why not a 4th for a discussing-wish list? If I do this, I'll set the following rule: be constructive. The goal is to achieve "usable" wishes. Not dreams, but things that have to come true.
The current "black hole" list has an enormous advantage: you propose what you need, not being influenced by others --i.e. you keep your own freedom of mind. Which is priceless.

Written nicely tambien,
Dominique


#1657: NCW Player
NCW Player

(1657)

Submitted by: Henry Robertson on 17-Jul-2000

A couple of questions about the Noteworthy Player if I may. Is there any way to permanently change where the player first opens to look for music files? When I bring up the player and click on the 'open' icon it always goes to 'my documents' I'd like to get it to open into my NCW Composer directory where I keep all my music files.

Question two is; why does the player sound so much better than the composer when playing back a midi file? When I open a midi file in the composer the sound and timing are usually off, sometimes quite a bit. Opening the same midi file with the player gives a good sounding song. I've tried varying the settings that come up in the composer when opening a midi file (rests, notes, etc) but it still never sounds as good as the player version.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 17-Jul-2000

The player "cheates" by playing the midi file, not the (imperfectly) imported tranlation used by Composer.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jul-2000

I suspect it's because your midi mapper is mapped to a different device than the one you have activated for Composer. Remember that Player /always/ uses the midi mapper, whereas Composer lets you select whichever devices you have available. If the midi mapper happens to be mapped to a different device (e.g. wavetable synth) than you have set in composer (e.g. OPL3 FM synth) then your sound will be very different indeed.

Try this. In Composer, under Tools --> Options --> Midi tab, select the Midi mapper as your only playback device. Everything should now sound identical in Composer and Player.

If you want to change where the midi mapper points to, open the Multimedia applet, midi tab in Control Panel.

Reply 3 offered by: Henry Robertson on 17-Jul-2000

Ah so, I see said the blind man. Thanx for the info, Blair and Fred, that would explain a lot.

Happy music to all.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 18-Jul-2000

Have you tried to set the "working directory" to the one you'd want, in the .lnk file (shortcut) ?
I can't test right here, but usually this works.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jul-2000

This does not work in the Player, at least not in Windows 95,98, NT 4, and 2000. We will try to make this better in the next version.

Reply 6 offered by: Henry Robertson on 18-Jul-2000

Thanx for giving me a clue, marsu. I right clicked on the desktop shortcut and selected 'properties' in this there is a box where you can specify the 'Start In' directory. i entered C:\program files\noteworthy composer and TA DA! there were my music files.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jul-2000

Henry, what version of Windows and Player are you using? I am surprised that this worked for you unless you are using Win 3.1.

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jul-2000

or the 16-bit edition of Player...

Reply 9 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 18-Jul-2000

Perhaps you are confusing the effect of right-clicking on the icon for the Player itself, versus right-clicking on the icon for a Shortcut that leads to the Player?

Reply 10 offered by: Henry Robertson on 18-Jul-2000

Welp, I am running Windows 98, I believe the second edition and version 1.7 of the NWC Player. I right clicked on the shortcut that I have on my desktop and then left clicked on 'properties'. In the box that says 'Start in' I put C:\program files\noteworthy composer. I also tried putting 'maximized' in the box labeled 'Run', but that didn't change anything and I still have to click on the icon in the upper right to get the full page display.

Hope this helps.

Reply 11 offered by: Henry Robertson on 18-Jul-2000

Oh yea, I am also using the 32bit version of 'Player'.

Reply 12 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jul-2000

Well, if you are getting the 32-bit edition of the Player to respond to the "Start in" property on a shortcut, I am quite impressed (since this is not supported at this time, and does not work on any system that we have here).

Also, if you are saving your files inside the NoteWorthy Composer program folder, I would recommend that you reconsider this. Storing files inside program folders is usually not a very good idea.

Reply 13 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jul-2000

Robert, I do not understand your comment. The properties of an EXE file do not include a "Start in" property, so it would be unusual to confuse this with the properties for a shortcut.

Reply 14 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Jul-2000

NW Online wrote:

> Well, if you are getting the 32-bit edition of the Player
> to respond to the "Start in" property on a shortcut, I am
> quite impressed (since this is not supported at this time,
> and does not work on any system that we have here).

Works here too! (Win 95 OSR2.5) Wonder if it has to do with the common controls update? In any case, it's a dandy feature, intentional or not.

Reply 15 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jul-2000

Correction. I need to go to school on the whole "Start in" shortcut property thing.

The "Start in" property of a shortcut to the Player does seem to work in many cases, but not all. I tried a shortcut on the desktop and that seems to work. Shortcuts selected via the Start menu do not seem to respond to the "Start in" property. Shortcuts to programs not residing on the C:\ drive seem to rarely work as expected.

I guess the bottom line is that if it works for you, great, but be aware that your mileage may vary.

Reply 16 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 19-Jul-2000

My point about Shortcut versus program itself: In Windows (98, at least) a shortcut icon has its own set of properties (as a shortcut) that are unrelated to the program or document linked. When I want a custom-made icon for a program or document, I cannot change the appearance of the icon for the program or document itself. But I *can* create a shortcut to the program or document, then change the icon for the shortcut! This seems to be a property of Windows, unrelated to NWC.

For example, suppose you want to have all of your NWC compositions with a "Jazz theme" have a different icon than those with a "Science fiction" theme. You can find free software that will convert small bitmaps to icons. Perhaps you would make a small saxophone icon to represent Jazz, and a small Saturn icon to represent Sci-fi. Then you would create a folder for Jazz documents, and a folder for sci-fi documents. Next, create shortcuts to the folders, then use "properties" to change the folder icons. This does nothing to the files themselves, just to the appearance of the folder shortcuts. It will only work on your own system. If you want it to work for someone else too, you will have to send them your icons and tell them to create shortcuts and change the properties.

I do things like that all the time ("Idle hands = Devil's workshop").

Reply 17 offered by: Fred on 19-Jul-2000

addendum: the information for the 'shortcuts' (links) is all contained in files with a .lnk extension. For desktop links you'll find them in \Windows\Desktop. Presuming that your friend has the same kind of directory setup, you could send him the .lnk file along with the .ico (icon) file. In general though, I agree that simply creating the shortcut from scratch would be easier.

Reply 18 offered by: marsu on 27-Jul-2000

About sending .lnk files : with Lotus notes at least, I didn't try with others: when you select the .lnk file and join it as an attached file, then the linked file (.exe for example) is joined. Not the .lnk.
The sole turnaround I found was to rename the shrotcut file to .link instead of .lnk, and the people who receives it must do the contrary.
Or zip it :-)
just in case...


#1658: Drum-head notes: see my reply 12 re PDF
Drum-head notes: see my reply 12 re PDF

(1658)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Jul-2000

Those of you who want drum-head notes, and want them right now, see me reply number 12 on the thread regarding making PDF files from NWC.


#1659: The 'bars rest' problem
The 'bars rest' problem

(1659)

Submitted by: John Hawkes on 17-Jul-2000

I have just found a reasonable ‘workaround’ for the problem of ‘bars rests’ in instrumental parts (provided the number of such bars is not too large).
Suppose I have a sequence empty bars: highlight from (and including) the end barline of the first bar up to (but not including the barline of the last bar) and from the visibility menu select ‘never display’. Move the rest in the first bar above or below the stave somewhere ‘out of the way’ then insert your favorite text notation for the number of empty bars (e.g. using boxmarks) with its width set to zero just before the insertion point for the rest in the first bar. On printing (and indeed on preview) it will be seen the hidden bars occupy a much reduced (although still finite) space. The rest in the first bar can then be ‘whited’ out. The notation for the number of bars rest may need padding out with spaces at the start to make it more central in the gap left by the invisible bars. The great thing is that the bar count remains correct! (the number of hours I have previously spent checking and writing in the bar numbers doesn’t bear thinking about) The problem is that with a large number of empty bars (say > 10) the gap left does become excessive, but for up to 5 or so it seems to work fine. Perhaps someone can suggest some improvements?

Reply 1 offered by: Eric James on 18-Jul-2000

I use the Boxmarks symbol. When printing out individual parts I first go through and number every 10 bars, again using Boxmarks. I have given up on Noteworthy's bar numbering because it counts every bar line. So half measures and multi-bar "second endings" are counted. I don't happen to agree with this, hence my own numbering system.

If I'm going to indicate 10 bars rest I first erase the ten whole-note rests, then, using Boxmarks with "preserve width" selected, key in: [10] and hit the space bar 4 times. This centers everything in the bar nicely. Oh, the cursor should be placed on the second space of the staff. I like the look of this. It's far better than any of the other makeshift things I've tried.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 18-Jul-2000

Go to the wish list and ask for a "don't count this bar" property on the barline.

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 21-Jul-2000

Hmmm, interesting, this has always been an issue for me.
With a bit of experimentation, it looks like it's better
to hide ALL the rests and inner bar lines. Using the
Boxmarks sequence "[n]" (possibly with leading or trailing
spaces). Use expression placement Preseve Width, CENTER
justified and Alignment "at next note/bar". I'm not sure
exactly what that means, but it seems to give the best
result.

As it happens, most of the multibar rests in the score I
tried this on have a text rehersal mark at the beginning
of the bar, so it may also be necessary to add some text
(a single space?) at the beginning of the bar with
LEFT/BEST FIT to stop the multi bar rest from overlapping
into the previous bar. For long runs of rests, it may also
be worth moving the text towards the middle to help balance
the white space.

Now if we could just compress the white space from the
invisible bars, I'd would be reasonably happy with this
solution. I'd prefer to have the computer count the bar
lines though and generate the number automatically.

Now that we've got the concept of bar line properties,
the obvious way to implement multi bar rests properly is
to add properties "start multi bar rest" and "end multi
bar rest". Note that these should NOT be mutually exclusive
to allow constructs like:

notes | 8 | 8 | 2 | notes.

So how about it guys? Should be easy!


#1660: Scriptorium has a new look
Scriptorium has a new look

(1660)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jul-2000

Hi all,

This is to announce the result of a lot of hard work in giving our Scriptorium a "new look" to go along with the new level of professionalism in NWC V1.70.

The new layout was designed by Ramon Pajares Box, <RPajares@ince.mec.es> with the able assistance of Andrew Purdam and grunt-work by yours truly. Rob Dahl graciously allowed us the use of his nifty spinning web-ring logo.

In addition to a greatly improved appearance, there is now more information in the main database listings. Now included for each entry are the name of the file creator, and the piece's running time, in addition to the information previously provided. The use of style sheets and Verdana font makes the result far more compact and easier to navigate than before.

Netscape users: you have to enable style sheets in Edit -> Preferences -> Advanced in order for this to work. IE users: this has been tested in IE, though not by myself; please let us know if there are any glitches. Opera users: you've got it best of all -- for some reason, the presentation is even better looking than it is in Netscape.

Enjoy!

Fred, Andrew, Ramon and a cast of thousands...

http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 18-Jul-2000

Houba! Just come back from there, and was impressed.
Wow! I love that "out-of-screen" look, as well as the
And is it just an illusion, or is it even quicker than before?
Anyway, it's simply GREAT!

Now I'll send my files ;-)

Reply 2 offered by: Martin on 19-Jul-2000

I most say the same - it simply looks better and plays better now. Especially the "who-wrote-it-and-how-long-is-it" thing directly with the work names is great!

Keep it up!

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 19-Jul-2000

Marsu - yes, it "seems" a lot faster because the database uses tables for each composer, so you get to see what's loaded so far (before, you had to wait for the whole page to load before you saw anything).

Martin - glad you like it. Thank Ramon for insisting on the "who submitted" and "running time" entries.

Come to think of it, the use of tables was his idea too...

btw - Andrew and Matt have managed to get the new Verdana font to appear in the cgi sections ("more" links and search engine), so the look is consistent throughout.

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-Aug-2000

Just a question: what is the difference between "enable style sheets" and "disable..." ? I can't see any different look.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Aug-2000

If you disable style sheets, you will see whatever font style and size you set as default; when enabled, the font style will be Verdana (or similar font if you don't have Verdana on your system) and the size will be as defined in the page. If you don't see a difference, check that your setting in Edit -> Preferences -> Appearance -> Fonts is set for "Use document specified fonts" (this is the default).

Reply 6 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-Aug-2000

You are right, now that makes a difference. I tried it, it all became impossible to read because of a too small font ! :-( I reset this option to "use my own font", and now all is OK. Too bad for Verdana.


#1661: vibrato
vibrato

(1661)

Submitted by: Harold Crow on 19-Jul-2000

Howdy Folks!!
I want to get the violins to do unison vibrato.
What is the symbol for that? I also want to do
a trill note but I can't find how to do it,
Thanking you!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 19-Jul-2000

There is a trill symbol in the Boxmarks font (see the Useful Files section of the NWC Scriptorium, http://www.vadu.com/nwc ) This is visual only and has no effect on playback. For playback there's no alternative to writing out the trill in notes of appropriate duration.
Many files contain visible but muted staves for the correct look and audible but hidden staves for the correct sound. To mute a staff, press m to bring up the Mute List and check the appropriate box. To hide a staff, uncheck it in the Contents tab of the Page Setup dialog (reached from the File menu).

I don't know of any symbol for unison vibrato. Do you mean having every member of the violin section perform vibrato with exactly the same frequency [and amplitude]? Good luck making this happen in real life.


#1662: STAFF
STAFF

(1662)

Submitted by: Val nico on 19-Jul-2000

Hi everybody,

Is it possible to return the staff to a next line ?

Can we modify a note in a chord without erasing the chord ?

How can I add instruments ?

Can you give me example of your own creations ?

Thanks, Nico

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Jul-2000

In order:

- Insert | Bar Line (Decorated) | Force System Break

- Edit | Remove Chord Note (Ctrl+Backspace)

- Staff | New Staff adds staff parts, Staff | Staff Properties can be used to assign instruments, and Insert | Instrument Patch can be used to change instruments inside the staff

- NWC comes with some song samples. Many more can be found via the links on our web site.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 19-Jul-2000

>> Is it possible to return the staff to a next line ?

It may be useful to point out that there is a difference between what you see in the Edit (default) mode and what you see in printouts or Print Preview. NWC is *not* a WYSIWYG editor. During editing, each staff occupies a single line only that must be scrolled left and right once it gets wider than the edit window. There is no way to fold a staff so that it occupies multiple lines in the window. When NWC prints (or Print Previews), however, the lines are then folded more or less the way you would expect.

The "Force System Break" feature that NoteWorthy Online mentions is a way to override the default folding behavior for printing, but has no effect (other than displaying a little gray "paragraph" symbol) while editing.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Jul-2000

The best place for samples is http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 19-Jul-2000

About the chord editing;

You'll need to move the cursor to the appropriate position (onto the line or space where the desired note of the chord stands) for Ctrl+Backspace to work. BTW, -unfortunately- you cannot remove a rest which is a chord member without deleting the whole chord.

HTH


#1663: Piano: Partitures
Piano: Partitures

(1663)

Submitted by: MDj on 20-Jul-2000

Hi, who know sites of partitures for Piano Free!!!???

thanks in advance
MDj

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Jul-2000

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/freeshee.htm

Reply 2 offered by: bug on 21-Jul-2000

okay I'll bite...
what is a partitude?
a sheet music?
any old piece of paper?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Jul-2000

As I understand it, a partiture (German "Partitur") is a score, especially if separated into parts.


#1664: Sound Blaster Live!...
Sound Blaster Live!...

(1664)

Submitted by: Clive on 20-Jul-2000

Hi all,

I mainly use Noteworthy for orchestral and chamber music. I am about to buy a Sound Blaster Live! soundcard to replace my old SB PCI 64. What difference in sound should I expect?

Thanking all, Clive

Reply 1 offered by: Martin on 20-Jul-2000

big difference... but... beware that...the only sound that's no good is the timpani...in the sound blaster live...when played back in noteworhty composer...it goves a short, and light sound...doesn't sound like what timpani should be like at all...where as the pci64's or the awe64's...have much better sounds on the timpani...and maybe other instruments..

Reply 2 offered by: Curtis S on 26-Jul-2000

Also, alot depends on the Soundfont you load.

Ciao for now!
Curtis S

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 27-Jul-2000

Yeah, as Curtis said the soundfont matters. For good samples head off to http://www.Hammersound.net and be prepaired for a large phonebill!

S

Reply 4 offered by: Chris Reid on 11-Aug-2000

I bought a SB Live! X-gamer card, and now when I try and load NoteWorth, my computer freezes. Any idea how to fix this? I've tried re-installing NoteWorthy, but that doesn't work. Any and all help would be apprecitated.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 11-Aug-2000

Check to see if you can play standard midi files via the windows Media Player (any version). If so, NWC should behave identically if you set the playback device to "Midi Mapper." If not, you have some sort of conflict. Check it out in Control Panel -> System -> Device Manager. Watch for little yellow exclamation points... and go from there.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Aug-2000

Reinstalling NWC will almost never help in solving problems like this. You have a setup problem with your new hardware. It is either:

- a resource conflict (go to Setting | Control Panel | System to investigate)

- improper or incompatible device drivers for your hardware (this includes leaving your old sound card drivers installed after you have removed the hardware, or installking the wrong drivers for your new hardware)

- faulty hardware (this is unlikely, but always a remote possibility)

The bottom line: when an application stops working correctly after you install new hardware, your investigation should focus on the new hardware and its drivers. The application failure is just a consequence of the larger problem.


#1665: OK, I need help on something
OK, I need help on something

(1665)

Submitted by: Kals on 22-Jul-2000

Some guy wanted me to make a midi for him after a song he taped on his tape.

So, it's quite hard, and I can't seem to find the notes which would match the music, and sometimes there are sounds in the background (he said he taped it from a movie) which are somewhat disturbing.

If anybody has any tips or something on how I can manage through it...

Reply 1 offered by: logineck on 22-Jul-2000

Well, with transcribing I just just the thing over and over and play along with a piano or synth until I get it right. Then I record it with a midi sequencer and import it into Noteworthy. (Noteworthy does have a record feature though I don't use it with more complex jobs like transcription where I end up re-recording phrases and stuff) Of course, a really good understand of all the scales, modes and keys works too.


#1666: Deleting  several measures at a time
Deleting  several measures at a time

(1666)

Submitted by: Walter Rimler on 23-Jul-2000

Is there a way to delete a section by measure number? For instance, is there a command that will delete measures 10 through 20 in staff 1? When making deletions it would be a lot easier to do it that way rather than by blocking the measures and then deleted them, especially if you are deleting these measures 10 through 20 from a number of different staffs.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 23-Jul-2000

I unfortunately don't know such a command but it's worth wishing about more effective usage of measure numbers and go to command or a useful find/replace command.

About your problem, there are some tips on using the conventional ways. For instance, you like to delete from m10 through m 20. Firstly, go to (Ctrl+g) m10. Then, select the preceeding measures with Ctrl+Shift+Right Arrow up to the 20th and delete.

The Ctrl key has such useful functions as in selecting or going to measures or moving an octave higher/lower (Ctrl+Up/Down Arrow). One of the best "traditional" functions of NWC, which I most appreciate, is that you can select -almost- anything (except for signatures, clefs or rests) and move up/downwards by Ctrl+Shift+Up/Down Arrow.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 23-Jul-2000

Excuse my fault;

> ...preceeding measures

Should be "succeeding measures"

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Lim on 24-Jul-2000

Don't forget that you *can* move rests vertically by selecting them individually.

When combinations of notes and rests are selected then shift+ctrl+up/down arrow only moves the notes - which is what is usually required.

Reply 4 offered by: Walter Rimler on 24-Jul-2000

Thanks for the information and the tips. I'll try them out and see what happens.

--Walter Rimler


#1667: Centering lyric syllables under the note
Centering lyric syllables under the note

(1667)

Submitted by: Jim Ross on 23-Jul-2000

NWC appears to align the beginning of a word or syllable under the note to which it is tied. Is there a way to change this and have it center the syllable under the note instead?

Thanks for a great product that even a non-musician such as myself can use.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Jul-2000

This might do it for you. Select all the notes on the staff, CNTL-E or Alt-Enter. Click on tne Notes tab, and set the additional note spacing to 1. (You'll have to do this on all staves in order for the notes to line up across the staves.)

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 24-Jul-2000

This would work, but there are at least two drwabacks:

1. It extends the width of each bar. In other words, although there is plenty of room to place the lyrics 'centred', adding extra note spacing will increase the size of the bar unnecessarily.

2. Lyrics are still placed relative to any accidentals (on this stave, or any other!), Which is a right pain!

I don't know whether multiple submissions to the wish list by the same person is effective (I doubt it), but please can anyone who agrees submit something.

Peter

Reply 3 offered by: Ed Luck on 26-Jul-2000

I use insert text and put
in spaces to get certain
lyrics and chord symbols
directly under the note.

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 11-Aug-2000

Jim and Peter, I added my vote to the wish list.


#1668: I don't know how to print
I don't know how to print

(1668)

Submitted by: Paulo on 26-Jul-2000

when I make print preview, just apears one line!
Can you help me?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jul-2000

Have you added bar lines?

See also: msg #209

Reply 2 offered by: Paulo on 01-Aug-2000

thanks!!


#1669: NWC Music has been posted on MP3.com!
NWC Music has been posted on MP3.com!

(1669)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 26-Jul-2000

At last! but not least, I have found the time to sit my lard a*se down and post my music on MP3.com. The band name it has been posted under is "...of Shadows" and it was finalised tonight, 22:42:40 on the 26-7-00, so it might take a while for it to become available for you to listen to.

Thanks for all these years of unearthly, questions, answers and debates. Thanks for the advice and teh support. Thank you Notewrothy Artware for this brilliant proggie that has allowed me to do the thing I love most in my life: write music.

Thank you all again. And please do not hesitate to comment on my music.

Special Thanks to: Sue, Fred, Steve, Blair, NW online, Eric, Marsu, Barry, and all of you I forget.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jul-2000

How about adding a link here...

Reply 2 offered by: Sterghios on 27-Jul-2000

Will be done once the stuff is made available by MP3.com.

Thanks!

:)

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 27-Jul-2000

Ok, 3/4 songs have been made available. The link to the webpage with my music is:

http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/144/of_shadows.html

Enjoy, and please email me with your comments!

Thanx,

Sterghios

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 27-Jul-2000

Hi, Thx for the info, I just made a jump to http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/144/of_shadows.html , but as I had to install XMMS so I gave up the listening part. DL is in progress.
Is the nice photo on the right, your standing portrait?

Just curious :)


#1670: Repaint Text Problem
Repaint Text Problem

(1670)

Submitted by: Steve Allen on 26-Jul-2000

In v. 1.7 scores with long text entries, I find that NWC sometimes doesn’t repaint the entries completely when I scroll them into view from the right, i.e. scroll backwards through the score to reveal the entry. I know that F9 is an option, but it shouldn’t be necessary.

Steve

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jul-2000

Well, the F9 function exists for just this case. It is true that we could make this unnecessary, but at the expense of speed/performance while you scroll through the staff.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Allen on 26-Jul-2000

I thought it might be a problem NWC didn't know about, a consequence of the longer text entries allowed in v 1.7. Perhaps someday, when we're nostalgically reminiscing about those slow 2 giga-hertz computers we used to use, wondering how we survived with 100 gig hard drives, you can look into it.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Jul-2000

Yes, those days will be interesting, especially with Fred still using Windows 3.1 on a 2GHz computer. Fred will have to look around, of course, but will find a manufacturer that still provides Win 3.1 drivers.

So, this seems like a good thread to inquire as to the Windows 3.1 users. How many Windows 3.1 users lurk in this forum? If you use Windows 3.1 and the 16-bit NWC 1.70, we would be interested in a reply from you in this thread.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 27-Jul-2000

As NoteWorthy Support pointed out, I still use (and like) Win3.11. But I do have a dual-boot system, and can use either at will.

Curiously, to run Win95 OSR2 on my AMD K6-II/500, I had to install a patch so that the CPU wouldn't outrun the "operating system." No such patches were necessary under Win3.11, and I've demonstrated to myself on many occasions that apps load and run faster on the simpler GUI.

I believe that there are still quite a few people running slower computers (486, Pentium 75-133) who would benefit from using win3.x. What's really curious is how many of these people (including, for instance, my brother) who installed Win9x "just because it's there" and now have to take an extended coffee-break while their machine boots.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Jul-2000

I knew you were there Fred. I was not intending to belittle your use of Win 3.1. Rather, I am acknowledging your dedication.

- Eric

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 27-Jul-2000

Well, not 3.1 for me, but 3.11 . As Andrew (I think) pointed out long ago, it's much better for video drivers.
I'm using it on only an old laptop (486SX, an expensive thing at its time). I finally gave the multiboot on my desktop PC, so I also use the 32 bit version too!
I didn't try the 32bit on my 3.11+Win32s though. Fred, did you?
Marsu

Reply 7 offered by: oops on 27-Jul-2000

...gave UP the multi...
Sorry, it'sgetting late (or early rather)

Reply 8 offered by: bug on 28-Jul-2000

Me! I use Noteworthy on 3.11 as well! I still keep my workhorse sequencing computer with DOS and win 3.11... I still use the dos voyetra sequencer that came with my original sound blaster pro. I haven't found a more efficient midi sequencer ever.

(my other computer is a 750 with 128meg ram and the windows 98 running on it is incompatible with everything except noteworthy) Netscape crashes every day at least twenty times.

But yeah, the win 3.11 computer has an old HP laserjet 3. with Noteworthy I get great scores off it. I am thinking of starting a publishing company on that computer! it also has word 6 so I can make my own templates for the music.
Noteworthy is kickass.

so whether you support it in the future (I'll still run the latest win3.1 version) is up to you. don't let it hold you back if you can add drum tracks tho!

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Jul-2000

marsu - yes; the 32-bit version of NWC runs fine on Win3.11/win32s. Since a specific 16-bit version is available, though, that's what I use. Another 32-bit app that run fines under this system is (thankfully) GSview.

Reply 10 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 28-Jul-2000

I use a laptop with Pentium-100 clone, Windows 98, 64 Meg RAM. I have indeed observed that the operating system sometimes bogs it down: Supposedly, my machine should run faster than it does on a number of Win3.1-compatible applications that I have. So, here's my question: Is there a free, (legal!) "downgrade" to Win 3.11 +32s that any of you know about, that could be installed and run as an alternative to Win98 ?

Reply 11 offered by: Joy Byford on 08-Aug-2000

I'm a Windows 3.11 user (16bit version)who lurks in this forum. (Just that an earlier post asked for us to make ourselves known.) I do actually now also have access to a new PC running Win98, but have kept NWC on my original machine - to avoid the hassle of transferring my registration to a different PC.


#1671: Help!
Help!

(1671)

Submitted by: Samitude on 27-Jul-2000

I have a cd burner on my computer with internet access. I would like to record some songs from Real Audio and Midi files onto my own cd. I don't have any software to do that that I can get to work. Do you know of any free download software on the web that will let me do this?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 27-Jul-2000

well, maybe in msg #1006#reply26 or somewhere else in that thread (60kb, 115 items. The longest?)

It's periodically asked for, so you shoud find it easily on this forum ;)
And don't hesitate to download the "offline forum" for more extensive search ( go to http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/offline.htm )

HTH, Marsu

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-Jul-2000

I used MusicMatch to directly create mp3 files (as well as wave files) from 171 midi files. (It can be used for either purpose. The Wave files are better for creating a conventional CD). Let's see if I can do this right (so there is a hyperlink): the discussion and instructions are in !msg#1338.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-Jul-2000

Let's try again. See msg #1338.


#1672: Song Title on multiple pages
Song Title on multiple pages

(1672)

Submitted by: Bob Williams on 28-Jul-2000

Is there a way within NWC to print the Song Title on each page (perhaps along with the page number) on multiple page printouts? My musicians continue to separate the pages, and have problems identifying the second page of two different songs.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jul-2000

NWC does not currently include this capabilty. Fir now, you canb use the Text Expression tool to add marks like this on each page, since NWC does not support it as part of its feature set.

Reply 2 offered by: bug on 30-Jul-2000

Well I either tape pages together or make a header in MS Word and paste in an exported wmf file from Noteworthy and give these sheets to the band. Also in Word I use a page number footer.

Reply 3 offered by: Bob Williams on 01-Aug-2000

Thanks for the ideas. I've decided to set up a Word document with a header that has the title and a footer that contains the group's name and the printing date. Both print at the very edges of the paper (above and below the NWC print). After printing the parts, I reload the printer, and print the header and footer document from Word. This seems easier than saving the print preview files for each page for each part, and printing everything from Word.


#1673: Any NWC experts in Yorkshire, England?
Any NWC experts in Yorkshire, England?

(1673)

Submitted by: David Watson on 30-Jul-2000

Seeking some basic tuition (nothing fancy) in Noteworthy Composer from anyone who lives in Yorkshire, UK. Will pay a good rate! Please reply by email.

Reply 1 offered by: bug on 31-Jul-2000

Any gigging musicians from Brisbane, Australia?

Reply 2 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 04-Aug-2000

Not in Yorkshire, but Brummie land. If it suits you, then msg me m8!

Sterghios

Reply 3 offered by: Robin Withey on 10-Aug-2000

Where you at? I'm no expert, but I know the basics, and I live in Yorkshire.

Having said that, I'm going on holiday, so I hope you're not in a hurry.


#1674: Special Endings and Bar Lines
Special Endings and Bar Lines

(1674)

Submitted by: Nahum Reduta on 31-Jul-2000

Excuse me if this has been posted earlier...

While sequencing, I noticed that placing a double bar line (one measure) after a first ending disrupts the expected flow--instead of jumping to the second ending the second time around, the flow continues through the first ending.

Also of note:
-Two of the staves have notes that tie into the endings.
-Replacing the double bar with the single restores normal flow.

Here's a diagram if it helps:
I|: | <6m> | 1st || <8m> :|I 2nd || |. . .

Reply 1 offered by: Nahum Reduta on 31-Jul-2000

Listening to it again, I noticed that the notes tying into the ending "hang" the second time through, since the flow actually *skips* the first ending measure to the measure after the double bar line.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Jul-2000

A Double Bar Line behaves as the start of a new section. When encountered, it ends the previous special ending/repeat sequence.

Reply 3 offered by: Nahum on 01-Aug-2000

Well, the double bar was necessary to mark off the next 8 measures as a distinct section. I was hoping the master repeat close would take care of the special ending, since it is the accepted resolution.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Aug-2000

I've run into this difficulty also, in which a double bar-line behaves as a section close, when all I wanted it to do was act as a visual cue. Perhaps it would be better to have the double barline behave just like a single barline, reserving the "end of section" functionality for the Section Close barline? Other opinions on this?

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Aug-2000

Backward compatibility makes it impossible for us to make a simple change like this. This is a feature request, and will have to be handled as such.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 01-Aug-2000

I can understand the worries about backwards compatability, but can't imagine that anyone would have used a double barline in such a manner, especially since (AFAIK and IMHO) it was never documented as such, and has never musicologically had any significance in flow-direction terms.

A double barline is used for key changes and musical section delimiting, but is otherwise identical to a single barline.

However, can I suggest a compromise and additional barline features?

Any conversion to a new upgrade/version retains the existing behaviour.

The default behaviour in future is no effect on flow direction, but it is available if required.

In the same dialogue box there is an option to in/exclude the barline from the bar count.

Constructively yours
Peter

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 01-Aug-2000

>>>has never musicologically had any significance in flow-direction terms.

I don't think this is quite true. I've seen sets of variations where the variations are separated from each other by nothing more than double (narrow) bar lines. When a variation contains an internal repeat (as they commonly do), this repeat is supposed to return only to the beginning of the current variation.

This certainly looks like "significance in flow-direction terms" to me. Interestingly, though, the NWC double-bar doesn't have this characteristic, although "Section Close" does. This seems to contradict the contention that "a Double Bar Line behaves as the start of a new section."

Reply 8 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 02-Aug-2000

I believe Peter Edwards hit the spot: In the next edition of NWC, have a check-box option for the double bar line.

Reply 9 offered by: Steve Bacher on 11-Aug-2000

A user option for "repeatability" of a special or double bar line sounds like a good idea to me.

BUT... it's better on a case-by-case basis. Some scores you'll want this on, some you won't.

A "repeatworthy" attribute on bar lines would be best.

- seb


#1675: Image print drivers
Image print drivers

(1675)

Submitted by: Adam on 31-Jul-2000

Hello, Do you know of any print drivers I can install to Windows to allow me to print documents as images? Such as gif, tif, jpg, or eps? This would shortcut printing me works for the Web and imaging for other uses. If you had any suggestions I would like to hear them.
Kind Regards,
Adam Fowler.

Reply 1 offered by: MMario on 31-Jul-2000

Any of the Microsoft office suite will print those formats

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Jul-2000

Here are some very recent threads that discuss this kind of effort: msg #1655, msg #1650, msg #1632, msg #1626

Reply 3 offered by: bug on 31-Jul-2000

Yeah I know about all that but I want a specific print driver that outputs as images. not postscript or prn or pdf. ta!

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 31-Jul-2000

You already have an image print driver built into NWC. Go to Print preview, then copy to a placeable windows metafile. This can be placed into programs such as MS Word. But if what you want is direct a GIF or JPG, get the free "Irfan View" from http://www.irfanview.com and open the WMF into irfan View, then save it as GIF or JPG or whatever. You will need to re-scale to a smaller size, and maybe crop (can be done by irfan View).

If what you want is software that creates a "printer" directly to a GIF or BMP or JPG file, and that is accessible from any program that allows printing, there is software available for download and purchase on the Internet. I've tried some as demos, but they are not cheap and did not do anything for me that I couldn't do by other means. Use your browser to search for "print to bitmap" or "print to GIF" and see what you get.

Reply 5 offered by: Ian Adams on 13-Feb-2001

If you are not using windows 2000 then you can use SuperPrint50 from Zenographics www.Zeno.com. About 50 bucks and you can create Tif printers, Gif printers, BMP Printers and JPG printers.


#1676: SUSTIAN PEDAL SCREWS TIES ON OTHER STAVES
SUSTIAN PEDAL SCREWS TIES ON OTHER STAVES

(1676)

Submitted by: Siamese Cat on 31-Jul-2000

I am restoring a MIDI file that was awful in creation. I have it about 80% correct now. I wanted to change something: A HARP part. The part I wanted to change was with a sustain pedal marking. In the part it is a nice up and down arpeggio pattern. Also in the area several ties were in other staves. When I put the PEDAL DOWN feature in the staff it cut all the ties in half! Only half of the tie would play, leaving non-tied parts hanging in the silence. It did that to all ties in the piece equal or greater than quarter tied to half, in 4/4 time. I then deleted the pedal mark and it STILL did that and left the pedal on! I closed the file without saving and opened it again. (I had saved it in NWC format for editing)IT STILL DID IT! HOW DO I FIX IT?? If you know E-MAIL why to me. My adress is siamesecat00@xoommail.com.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jul-2000

It's quite possible that the creator of the midi didn't want anyone to "reverse engineer" it by importing into a sequencer. (We have our ways... )

The only way I know of that something on one staff can affect what happens on other staves is if the same midi channel is assigned to two different staves. Might be something to check out.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Aug-2000

It is also possible that the use of the sustain pedal is creating more demand for "voices" than the sound card is capable of delivering. This would cause things like note drop outs, where the overall sustain of notes is shortened in order to meet the demand from new notes just starting to play.

Reply 3 offered by: Stuart Ravn on 13-Aug-2000

I hate that. It's happened to me many-a-time. There's a limit to "polyphony" (how many notes can ba played at one time), so you might have too many notes playing during the ties.


#1677: Setting slur direction on chords containing rests
Setting slur direction on chords containing rests

(1677)

Submitted by: Grant on 01-Aug-2000

... you can't. Or rather, you can but it has no effect. This appears to be because the object whose slur direction property is relevant is the rest, and when you edit the chord there's no tab for the rest's properties. You can change direction all you want under the "notes" tab, but it makes no difference.

The only way to get a non-default slur direction on a chord containing a rest is to change the rest's properties before adding any notes to it (or, more usually in practice, after deleting all the notes from it). This is awkward.

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Lim on 01-Aug-2000

Yes, I've run into this one. I think it applies to ties also. Didn't think to change the rest stem properties, tho' .....

Bob

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 01-Aug-2000

No, it doesn't apply to ties, since rests can't be tied (take a look at the "Rests" tab the next time you edit a rest - no "Tie Direction" property). Editing a chord displays the "Notes" tab, where the tie direction is easy to change.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Aug-2000

We confirm this as a bug. It will be corrected before next release.

---------------------------------
Bug: A split stem chord containing a rest does not recognize the slur direction set from the Notes tab in Notation Properties.

Status: Confirmed; Release target 1.70 SP1
---------------------------------


#1678: Channel surfing?
Channel surfing?

(1678)

Submitted by: Grant on 01-Aug-2000

In the "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing" department, I read in a MIDI reference recently that it's possible to change channels in the middle of a MIDI track. I've poked around a little in the NWC help file but don't see any indication that NWC supports this.

I think this would be a useful feature for those of us doing orchestral notation in NWC. Quite often you have more than 16 instruments in the score, although fewer than 16 play at any given time. With the one-channel-per-track model, it can be difficult to manage this.

Imagine a case where you want to introduce a 17th instrument (say, a shakuhachi) that plays only when either the flutes or the clarinets are silent, but can't realistically share the flute or clarinet staff. You could assign the shakuhachi to the flute's channel when clarinets are playing and to the clarinet's channel when the flutes are playing, but because you can't switch channels in the middle of a track, you'd have to create two NWC tracks for it, one for each channel that the shakuhachi will be playing on, and overlay them, making sure to insert the appropriate invisible rests in whichever staff isn't playing at the moment. Or you could create two hidden shakuhachi tracks and a third track for display/printing that displays the combination of what's on the two hidden tracks. Either of these would be a lot of work, which would get even worse if you had to have the shakuhachi jump among 3 or more channels.

If NWC supported changing channels in the middle of a track, you could just create a shakuhachi staff and choose a free channel whenever you wanted it to play.

Would this be a difficult enhancement to make?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Aug-2000

Changing channel assignments on the fly (or "channel surfing", as Grant put it in his delightfully droll manner) is big on my wishlist also. This would certainly greatly improve NWC's functionality, especially with those big orchestral works. (Richard Woodroffe has mentioned how nice this would be also.)

Such a tool could make quite a mess, though, if you're not careful. It would be especially difficult to post-process a Type 1 midi file that results from this, since presumably the channel changes would occur within the same track.

Also it bears pointing out that NWC is certainly not the only sequencer/scoring program that lacks this facility; the versions of both Cakewalk and Cubasis that I own do not allow channel changes within a track.

Nonetheless, it would certainly be a boon for more advanced users.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 04-Aug-2000

I agree fully on the helpfulness of channel surfing. The capability is one of the primary reasons I use a second sequencing program in addition to Noteworthy (not that I would ever change from Notewothy, mind you).

Reply 3 offered by: getwidit on 08-Aug-2000

I can see the advantage but with the major flaw of making a MIDI file I don't believe this feature has a very high priority (unless NWC wants to add a huge inherent bug in the software). I truly believe that adding drum notation will be the biggest step forward.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 08-Aug-2000

I'm afraid I don't understand your objection. What do you mean by "the major flaw of making a MIDI file" and "a huge inherent bug in the software"? It is part of the MIDI specification that the channel is allowed to change in the middle of a track. I don't see how supporting this feature could be considered "a huge inherent bug". (Anyway, if you're afraid it would cause trouble, you could simply avoid making use of the feature.)

I understand that there's a lot of interest out there in improved drum notation in NWC, but I truly have little need for it myself. If this is going to turn into a game of dueling priorities, I'll see your drum notation and raise you n-tuplets.

Reply 5 offered by: m@zb0 on 08-Aug-2000

1'm s0rry gr@nt bu2 1 d0n't l1ke y0ur t0ne! y0u h@ve @ ver1 self0bsessed t0ne 1n y0ur mess@ges @nd 1 d0n't l1ke 1t! th3 questi0n 1sn't 1f, bu2 wh3n w1ll th3y @dd th3 dru~ tr@ck fe@ture?

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 08-Aug-2000

Gee, I'm sorry if my posts offend you. We're even, though. Yours has offended me.

I'd like to think that n-tuplet support, like improved drum notation, is more a matter of when than if. In any event, there's probably room for both large and small improvements in NWC's future. Compared to drums and n-tuplets, I suspect "channel surfing" would be a relatively small effort, and would be worth considering.

w0u£d you £1ke ~y p0$t$ @ny b3tt3r 1f 1 typ3d th3~ £1k3 th1$?

Reply 7 offered by: m@zb0 on 09-Aug-2000

y0 m@n, 1f y0\/ c0ul4 d0 th@t 1 w0uld th1nk y0u w3r3 t00 c0o1! gr00v7 m@n!

Reply 8 offered by: Stuart Ravn on 20-Aug-2000

Look, Mazbo, you know that's irritating.
I don't even see why you type like that when it shows your lack of intelligence. If you want your voice to be heard, don't garble it!!!


#1679: the whole rest
the whole rest

(1679)

Submitted by: this one is from Marsu!! on 01-Aug-2000

i've found in a William Byrd Mass's the symbol of the whole rest. I'll make it. But if someone knows where I can find his " mass for 4 voices in Gm or Bb", that'll be cool to me.

Okay, i confess, i'm not marsu, but his brother, and he told me to write this here (he's lazy on the beach...;-), especially for Artur. i hope i didn't make a mistake, so.. @+
n-der


#1680: SB 64 vs SB 128
SB 64 vs SB 128

(1680)

Submitted by: Clive on 03-Aug-2000

What would the difference be between these 2 cards if used to playback a nwc file... say of a symphony.

Reply 1 offered by: Malcolm Dale on 05-Aug-2000

I had the AWE64 and then I upgraded to the PCI128 and it was a nightmaRE. In the end I took the 128 out and put the 64 in. None of my software could find the 128 and it didn't sound as good. I love listening to my Piano Concerti with the AWE 64. If you want to hear how it sounds, go to http://www.mp3.com/MalcolmDale and listen to or download the Field Piano Concerto No 2 made with Noteworthy and AWE64

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Lim on 06-Aug-2000

If you're currently using the PCI64 (as opposed to the AWE 64) then compatability should not be an issue.

I made exactly this switch a couple of months ago. In theory the PCI128 should be capable of sounding 128 simultaneous notes - double the amount of the 64.

In practice this depends on the appropriateness of the drivers and which windows version you are using. There has been a lot of discussion about these issues in the pci128 newsgroup (creative.products.sound_blaster.pci128).

I happen to like the sound of the 8meg. "waveset" (version 4 or higher) apart from one or two niggles. E-mail me direct if you want more information.

Bob


#1681: Special Endings
Special Endings

(1681)

Submitted by: David Ripley on 03-Aug-2000

I am working on a piece which has special endings (1st and 2nd endings, etc.) which take up more than one measure. Is there any way to make the horizontal line associated with the special ending symbol extend over multiple measures i.e. the entire special ending? I am more concerned at this point with how it looks than how it plays back.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Aug-2000

Currently, NWC does not support any extension to this line beyond the first measure.


#1682: How to get rich with Noteworthy
How to get rich with Noteworthy

(1682)

Submitted by: Malcolm Dale on 05-Aug-2000

Thanks to Noteworthy, I now have a page at
http://www.mp3.com/MalcolmDale with
a lot of John Field's works available in
.MP3 format which you can listen to or download
free and I get paid! I also have 2 CD's which they have
made of the music and if you buy the CD's I get half.
There are 2 full score piano Concerti there which I sequenced using only Noteworthy and the turned into .MP3
I haven't got rich yet, in fact I haven't made any money,
but I will if enough of you go and download some of the music.

Reply 1 offered by: Smih Caglar on 12-Aug-2000

Dear Malcom Dale,
You are doing the kind of thing I am planning, I hope you'll get enough doing this. Could you please explain me how you turn your NWC files into MP3 or vica versa ?
Yours, Semih

Reply 2 offered by: rkarloff on 15-Aug-2000

i also have an mp3.com page with mp3s made from midis made in nwc. except mine are original works.
anyways, to make a midi into an mp3 there are several steps. first make the MIDI, then record the MIDI into a WAVE file(most recording software records into WAVE by default), then the last step is to convert the WAVE file into MP3. To do this you need specific software. You should be able to to find freeware to do this. Try "Blade Encoder" for this.
Otherwise you need to make sure the mp3 is set to certain specifications that mp3.com details is if you want it on there.
Also, you should know it is very hard to make money at mp3.com especially if all you have are sequenced recordings your trying to sell and not live performances. but there are a lot of people on mp3.com that do do well there using sequenced recordings but they are professional and have very expensive equipment.

RK


#1683: Best soundcard for NWC/midi files...
Best soundcard for NWC/midi files...

(1683)

Submitted by: Clive on 05-Aug-2000

Currently I have a SB 64 and use NWC mainly for orchestral or chamber pieces. I am very keen to get a better soundcard. Which would be the best soundcard for playing NWC/midi files?

Thanking all!

Reply 1 offered by: Gordon on 06-Aug-2000

I have the SBLive! card and love it. It uses SoundFonts. I'm not using any of the SoundFonts that came with the card; rather, I collect them off the net and customize the Soundbank to get the instruments I like.

It's a lot of fun and the sound is better than I would have thought possible coming from a computer.

I have 128Mb of RAM and have found that to be very helpful when loading the large soundbanks. One can load total soundfonts up to 1/2 the amount of their RAM (I can load fonts up to 64Mb). Some of the large General Midi banks run about 60Mb, so you see the need for lots of RAM.

I started with the 8Mb bank that came with SBLive! then took it to Vienna and swapped out the instruments I did not like for those I found on the net (primarily Hammer's site.) I now have what I think are the best of the piano, violin, trumpet, etc., instruments.

I bought the card from Amazon.com for $99US.

Regards,
Gordon


#1684: Extra Channels?
Extra Channels?

(1684)

Submitted by: JD Harding on 05-Aug-2000

Does Noteworthy support more than 16 channels, or is there a plugin/modification that forces noteworthy to use more than 16? I'm using a Yamaha SW1000XG card, which has 32 part compatibility, and I'd like to use the other 16 channels available.

If Noteworthy doesn't support 16 channels, then that's deffinently something Noteworthy -needs-.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Aug-2000

Unfortunately, that's not something that has anything to do with NoteWorthy. Rather, the 16-channel per device limitation is a characteristic of the GM (General Midi, not Motors) specification.

Of course, if you have additional devices, you can map them for additional banks of 16 channels. In Tools -> Options -> Midi Tab, your total playback devices will be shown on the left, and the ones made available for NWC on the right. Most people will set this to the midi-mapper, so that whatever device is assigned in midi-mapper will automagically be used by NWC. Note, however, that the midi-mapper only allows a single device. (Isn't Windows wonderful?) To NWC's credit, you can use the actual devices themselves. For instance, you could put both your MPU-401 device and also the OPL-3 FM synth into the right pane, giving you 32 channels (2 sets of 16). Then, in the Staff Properties -> Midi tab you can assign which device is used for every staff.

Note that your sound card has up to 32 voices, not channels. That means you could (theoretically, at least) have up to two notes playing on each channel at any particular time; more than that, and notes will be dropped. (This is also called the card's "polyphony".) This is /not/ the same as the number of midi channels!

Reply 2 offered by: JD Harding on 05-Aug-2000

No. The card has up to 1,267 voices, 64 note polyphony, and 32 parts. You're thinking of a soundcard. This is a tone generator card. When using XGedit, it allows editing for 32 seperate instruments (parts/channels).

--

For anyone who's interested, go to http://www.mp3.com/jdharding to hear music composed using Noteworthy.


#1685: Question about Banks and Instruments on SBLive!
Question about Banks and Instruments on SBLive!

(1685)

Submitted by: Gordon on 06-Aug-2000

After bragging to Clive about the SBLive! card, I find I have a question concerning the same card relative to NWC.

In the SoundFonts section for the card, I enter a Soundbank in Bank 000. Then I enter various instruments into Banks 001, 002, 003, etc. When I want to use these individual instruments in NWC, I simply change the Bank number to the one I need. OK so far.

Now the problem: Some of these individual instruments have more than one version (and these versions show up under the Instrument Number to the right of the Bank Number in SBLive! I don't know how to change the Instrument Number in SBLive! so that the instruments plays in NWC.

Does this make sense? I hope so.

All help appreciated,
Gordon


#1686: My Roland JV-1010
My Roland JV-1010

(1686)

Submitted by: Casey on 06-Aug-2000

If you own one of these, you know how useless the manual is. I'm having trouble getting everything working. When I change the instruments in Cakewalk, the name of the instrument in cakewalk and the sound that comes out do not match, unless the JV-1010 is set to general midi. I'd appreciate any ideas on how to know what I'm changing instruments to if I'm using patches or other settings.

Reply 1 offered by: James P on 10-Aug-2001

Goto Lilchips.com and download the patch match editor for jv-1010
I use mine with cbase. (on the rare occasion i can be bothered to play with due to it's uselessness!!!!!!

Reply 2 offered by: jimc on 10-Dec-2001

This may be a bit late for my 2 cents, but you can tweak the Cakewalk .ins file from LilChips to fit the format of ntwpatch.ini and select all patches and drum kits from within Noteworthy Composer using Bank Select messages. It works great with my JV-1010.
If the reader is interested, email me offline and I'll mail you a copy of my ntwpatch.ini.


#1687: Cyber Hymnal
Cyber Hymnal

(1687)

Submitted by: Anthony Licata on 07-Aug-2000

What happened to the Cyber Hymnal? My browser stalls when
attempting to go there. Has the URL changed? I love this
valuable source of hymns.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Aug-2000

This one works:

http://tch.simplenet.com/

so do this, just the first few that came up in a quick search on Google:

http://www.collegestreetbaptist.org/hymnal/hymnal.html
http://www.thirdmill.org/worship/tch/index.asp
http://www.internationalbibles.com/services/cyber_hymnal.htm

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 08-Aug-2000

tch.simplenet.com works for me.

<shameless plug>Check out the new MIDI files at the
Christian Classics Ethereal Library: http://ccel.org/cceh

Regarding which, I have a question. Webmaster wants to know what mime type to set for .nwc files?

Reply 3 offered by: Anthony Licata on 09-Aug-2000

Thank you.
I tried it once again and it works now.
Your responses were appreciated.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Aug-2000

Regarding mime type - safest and 100% reliable one is application/octet-stream (same goes for any other suffixes that you want handled unconditionally as binary).

Reply 5 offered by: Harry on 19-Jan-2001

Found it!

www.cyberhymnal.org

:')

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 20-Jan-2001

Harrys's URL for the Cyber Hymnal (shown immediately aboe) is correct as of January 20, 2001. I just checked it.

Be sure that you use that exact URL -- If you don't, you may be re-directed to an unrelated web site.


#1688: Ties and slurs
Ties and slurs

(1688)

Submitted by: Anna on 08-Aug-2000

First of all, thanks for your newly released version (v1.7). I find your enhancements very useful...

Now the question... I have been notating a choral piece with S1 and S2 parts, A1, A2, etc. I've initially used the layering feature to separate the 2 soprano parts. However, when I layer both staffs for printing, there are measures that doesn't look good, since both parts have notes on the same pitch (position) but differing durations (i.e., the other note is no longer visible).
So I try vertical chords to make the s2 note visible... but then, I encounter another problem, S1 has a dotted half note, S2 has a half note and a quarter note (time sig is 3/4) all on the same pitch (E). The dotted half note should tie to the note on the next measure but instead ties to the quarter note. Did I miss a command or property? Is there a way for me to specify which note should be "tied" or "slurred"?
Thanks...

Reply 1 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 08-Aug-2000

Why not treat your chorale score as you would an orchestral ensemble or symphony... print each part separately? Layering can be confusing; I find it most useful for condensing staff structures which are too large to fit on my monitor screen, all at once.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 08-Aug-2000

Anna, your problem with staff layering is easily overcome. Just select one of the overlapping notes for editing and change the "extra note spacing" property to some value other than 0. Generally 1 is enough, though on rare occasions I've gotten as high as 2 -- never higher.

For example, imagine you're overlaying a stem-up quarter note and a stem-down half-note on the same pitch. (If you're British, that's a crotchet and a minim respectively.) Simply highlight the stem-down note, press <Ctrl>-e, go to the "Notes" tab if you're not there already, and change "extra note spacing" to 1.


#1689: MAC Compatibility
MAC Compatibility

(1689)

Submitted by: David G. Moose on 09-Aug-2000

Does anyone know how to enable MAC users to use noteworthy songs?

Reply 1 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 2 offered by: Dave Moose on 09-Aug-2000

I've tried converting the files to midi type 0 and midi type 1 files and the MAC still does not recognize them.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Aug-2000

MAC users cannot directly use *.nwc files. However, as you point out, MAC users can play MIDI files. In NWC, if you save your work as a Type 1 or Type 0 MIDI file (File | Save As | Save as type), then a MAC user could hear your song. If the creator is not set properly on the MAC, the file should still open correctly if it has the .mid extension. If it does not, then try opening the file using QuickTime, which should be able to play it.

See also: msg #405, msg #822, msg #1131, msg #1257


#1690: chord with rest for part of duration
chord with rest for part of duration

(1690)

Submitted by: Maximilian Weiss on 09-Aug-2000

NoteWorthy is the best program I've found so far and it's going great, but I have one minor problem. I want to put a chord in so that each note of the chord is added a beat later. I put in the first note, but I can't put a rest on top before the next note of the chord. Does anyone know how to do this???

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Aug-2000

If I understand your question correctly, probably the easiest way to accomplish this is with layered staves. This way all elements of your structure will be controllable. That being said, you /can/ combine notes and rests on a single staff, if 1: the rest is placed first, and 2: the notes have a longer duration than the rest (e.g. you can have an 1/8 rest and "stack" notes of a dotted 1/8 or greater.)

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 09-Aug-2000

Are you trying to do a "roll-up", where the notes are played in sequence but held down? If so, then this can be done by notating the full chord, then placing a grace note for each note before the chord, in the sequence you want to play them. Then tie each grace note to the chord.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Aug-2000

An example is shown in bar 164 of "moonlite.nwc" in the NWC sample folder.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 10-Aug-2000

Another way to go about this would be to break the chord down into individual "beats", enter a new chord for each beat, adding notes one-by-one to each succeeding chord, and tie them all together, e.g.:

1st beat: C, tied to
2nd beat: C/E chord, each note tied to
3rd beat: C/E/G chord, each note tied to
4th beat: C/E/G/C chord

This may not look pretty, but the sound is right.


#1691: Gershwin
Gershwin

(1691)

Submitted by: Malcolm on 09-Aug-2000

is his music in the public domain in Australia?
what about the United States?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 10-Aug-2000

Don't know about Australia, but in the U.S. anything written before 1925 should now be in public domain. This would include "Rhapsody in Blue" (1924), but not, say, "An American in Paris" (1927) or "Porgy and Bess" (1935).

Reply 2 offered by: Malcolm on 10-Aug-2000

Is there an index of public domain works?

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 14-Aug-2000

>Don't know about Australia, but in the U.S. anything
>written before 1925 should now be in public domain

This does not match my understanding of Australian
Copyright law. I believe that works revert to public domain
50 years after the death of the composer, independent of
the date the work was written. So, anything written by
anyone who died prior to 1950 is safe. George Gershwin
died in 1937.

I'd get this checked out with a real lawyer before doing
anything potentially actionable...

Reply 4 offered by: johnti on 15-Aug-2000

Hi All, I'm also interested in Malcolm's question:
is there a register of public domain works anywhere in the world?


#1692: tee pee thing
tee pee thing

(1692)

Submitted by: Maximilian Weiss on 11-Aug-2000

hey, i have another little nitpick thing. Does anybody have a font or something so I can enter in the little tee-pee thing over notes that means accented and really short. I forget the name of the it, but I hope everybody knows what I'm talking about. Thanks again.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Aug-2000

Isn't there one in Boxmarks?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Aug-2000

Yes, there is one in Boxmarks (on z). If that's the only special symbol you need, consider using the caret (on shift 6 on north-american keyboards).

Reply 3 offered by: Rich Woodroffe on 11-Aug-2000

There's even on in the NoteWorthy font itself but I think it's for future expansion.

To use it, assign the NoteWorthy font (NWCV15.ttf) as a user font and then use the character B.

Rich


#1693: Can changing video cards change audio properties?
Can changing video cards change audio properties?

(1693)

Submitted by: Clive on 11-Aug-2000

I have just changed my video card from an i740 intel 2D/3D to a Riva TNT2a-based one. Strangely enough the audio properties have also changed! Each set of instruments is heard with greater clarity and definition, however there seems to be less "glow"/resonance at the time. Does this makes sense?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Aug-2000

The only thing that might make sense is that your new video card is radiating less electrical noise than your old one. That's one of the problems with having sound gear inside a box containing very fast circuitry; it's inevitable that some of it will get picked up. Video circuitry is especially nasty in that regard. That's why, whenever possible, you should put your sound card in the slot furthest away from the video card. (Of course, if your sound and video are included on the main board, you don't have much of a choice...)

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Aug-2000

One other possibility: are you sure that you did not have any resource conflicts when the old video card was present. If you did have them, once it was removed, the resource conflict could have disappeared, allowing Windows to detect the conflicting hardware, and subsequently allow you to use it (where you may have been using a differenbt synth on the card prior to the change).

Sometimes adding new hardware causes the BIOS plug-n-play to reassign IRQ and other settings. This might also have the effect of making a sound card device work fully, where maybe it only worked partially before the change.


#1694: show a limited portion of the accompanyment staff
show a limited portion of the accompanyment staff

(1694)

Submitted by: Paul H. Borisoff on 12-Aug-2000

I want to show a small portion of the treble melody-line of the piano accompanyment for a few measures and then do a similar event a little later for a few more measures.

I would rather not have a blank staff (for the piano) running throughout the piece; only a little piano melody line through a couple more difficult areas.

Can one cause certain areas of staff not to print or take up paper space. Kind of like accompanyment 'vignettes'.

Thank you

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Aug-2000

These messages are still valid: msg #35, msg #172, msg #299, msg #463, msg #597, msg #1538

Reply 2 offered by: Artur on 12-Aug-2000

These are called ossia mesures, they come to explain a passage or substitute it, I (personally) don't think Nw is going to input that, but you can do like this:
Use a User font as NWC15.ttf, this comes with Nwc, then insert a text with only spaces, this font will make then an ossia, but it will be blank, so input in handwriting the notes you want.


#1695: re-beaming, differently
re-beaming, differently

(1695)

Submitted by: Paul H. Borisoff on 12-Aug-2000

I used autobeaming for a 4/4 time staff line containing eight notes. Autobeam paired them up in 4 sets of two notes each. I want them to be in 2 sets of 4 each. Perhaps I will try changing the time signature to 2/4 but other parts of the music will be inversely affected.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Aug-2000

You are correct. NWC auto beams within the beat. If it is just a few measures, it is easiest to do alternate beaming manually. For larger passages, you can temporarily change the time signature to 2/2 withihn the passage, then change it back.


#1696: NoteWorthy Composer for a friend.
NoteWorthy Composer for a friend.

(1696)

Submitted by: Stuart Ravn on 13-Aug-2000

My friend has a Mac, but wants NoteWorthy Composer without having to pay all the money for VirtualPC or something like that.
My question is, why hasn't a Mac version of NoteWorthy been written?

Thank you,
<a href="mailto:atero@pobox.alaska.net">Stuart Ravn</a>

Reply 1 offered by: johnti on 13-Aug-2000

Because they have to add a drum track feature first!

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Aug-2000

We do not offer a MAC version. If we were selling one, we would not be keeping it a secret.

Reply 3 offered by: Stuart Ravn on 15-Aug-2000

That wasn't my question. My questioon was WHY aren't you offering a Mac version?

Reply 4 offered by: Gordon on 15-Aug-2000

The answer to this is the same as it is for all other programs written for PC's only.

Would you write a program with a total potential market of about five customers?

Remember when Adobe wrote for only the Mac. If they had not decided to write for the PC, Adobe would be only a dim memory.

Reply 5 offered by: bug on 15-Aug-2000

well, 5 isn't very fair these days.
there are more macs than ever before and with the net now who needs pcs? you can go out and buy a mac that does everything and its hardware is better than the pc.

music recording, sequencing and notation, and graphic design and publishing has been the domain of the mac for ages. in fact there are some awesome notation programs that have only been written for the mac and its only in recent years that they've converted them for PC as well.

so for what its worth noteworthy has more important development issues than writing a mac version. there are lots of MAC notation programs out there, but PCs are noteworthy's staple diet :-)

Reply 6 offered by: Marsu on 16-Aug-2000

Well, I bet the trouble is, try to find an available C++ Mac Developer!
I personally have the same trouble. The same goes for Linux, btw.
Note that Mac users are much more than 5% when talking about music!!! Moreover, they are more connected to the I*net either.
Should I add that ProTools was designed for Mac ?
Please don't talk about what you ignore.
And managing a so-called minority is not a loss, but a proof of an open mind. (Don't reverse my assertion please)

JIC, HTH, Marsu

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 16-Aug-2000

Marsu, your English is usually quite good. However, I think you misunderstand the English meaning of "ignore", which is "refuse to pay attention to; pretend not to see". "Talking about what you ignore" is almost an oxymoron in English.

I think what you really wanted to say was "Please don't talk about what you know nothing about."

<I'm just trying to be helpful.>

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 16-Aug-2000

Sorry for that, Grant.

Note that in French, "ignorer" has the two meanings.
It seemed to me that it was the same in English, but after all ENglish is my 3rd language :-/
Hoping you weren't offended, anyway.

Brgds, and thank you for the compliment :^)

Dominique

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 16-Aug-2000

Two meanings? I was aware of one, which is "not to be aware of" or "not to know". Is the other one equivalent to the English meaning? If so, is this a case of English influence on the French meaning? How could the Académie let this happen???

(English "ignorant", by the way, still has the meaning "unaware, unknowing", without the connotation of intentional disregard that has become a necessary part of "ignore". Go figure.)

Reply 10 offered by: Stuart Ravn on 18-Aug-2000

...Getting slightly off subject...

Anyway, I agree with Marsu. More than half the people I know use Macs, and a lot of them want a descent, well priced MIDI sequencer. But they don't want to pay for an emulator to get a PC only sequencer.

I was quite annoyed, Gordon, at your question, "would you write a program with a total potential market of about five customers?", one, because it's a foolish statement to make because there are just as many Mac users as PC users that want to have a sequencer, and two, it's a rude thing to say. And I wasn't asking NoteWorthy to write for Mac only.

I, and most people who have used both Macs and PCs, believe that Macs are much easier to use. The next computer I get will be a Mac, and I will still want to use NoteWorthy on it, which is another reason I asked my original question.
Lastly, I would prefer ignorance did not answer my questions, but rather the NoteWorthy Staff.

Reply 11 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 22-Aug-2000

I gather that many NWC users use it (as intended) to compose music and create playable tracks, whereas others (such as myself) are non-musicians who like its easy-to-use interface for creating sheet music. Maybe many users are in both categories.

The last time I checked, MACs were fairly popular among the educational set. Perhaps many of them would be potential customers for the sheet-music capability, if they do not also have access to a PC. I have no idea regarding the size (in terms of dollars) of the potential market. It might be worth NWC's time to find out by asking around at some schools. Asking current users might be the wrong approach.

Just a suggestion! Hey, remember that NWC, like anything else, presumably goes where the money is.

Reply 12 offered by: Peter on 17-Sep-2000

I assume that Grant has chosen, whilst correcting Marsu's English, 'to ignore' the elementary grammatical prescription that no sentence shall end with a preposition. I believe that the sentence in question should read: "Please, do not talk of that, about which you know nothing." May Marsu accept my appreciation for writing in a manner which was, I am sure, understood immediately by all.
I am, also, just trying to help.

Reply 13 offered by: Grant on 17-Sep-2000

Dear Peter,

The "rule" about not ending sentences with prepositions was invented and promulgated by people who believed that the best guide to the proper use of English was to be sought in the classical languages. In fact, it is perfectly natural in English to end sentences with prepositions, and the best authors have been doing it at least since Chaucer's day, despite the grammarians' best efforts.

I think Winston Churchill said it best when he said: "This is the sort of nonsense up with which I shall not put."

Yours in extreme helpfulness,

Grant

Reply 14 offered by: Steve Bacher on 18-Sep-2000

OK, try making this sentence not end with a preposition:

"No Macintosh is easy to write software for."

- seb

Reply 15 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 18-Sep-2000

How about:

"No one finds it easy to write software for a Macintosh."

As was pointed out, ending sentences with prepositions is natural in English, under certain circumstances. The same applies some other European languages in which a root verb has a meaning modified by a preposition. In fact, German includes the preposition in the infinitive form.

In English, there is a difference between "to believe" and "to believe in." Examples: I do not believe in the tooth fairy. I do not believe a certain politician's statements. Fairies are hard to believe in. But if I wrote that fairies are hard to believe, it would mean that generally speaking, fairies exist and are liars.

To bring this around to the topic of music, I invite all of you to think of the number of times in popular music (especially in the early 1960s) where the syntax was slaughtered. Proper syntax would have disturbed the rhythm.

Reply 16 offered by: Stephen Randall on 20-Sep-2000

I quote Sir Ernest Gowers in "The Complete Plain Words": "Do not hesitate to end a sentence with a preposition if your ear tells you that is where the preposition goes best."

I would recommend this book, originally intended as a sort of house style book for the British Civil Service, as a highly readable, unstuffy source of good advice on how to write clearly. If only more British Civil Servants paid attention to it!

Gowers quotes the following extreme example with four consecutive prepositions at the end of a sentence, reportedly used by a Governess to a child "What did you choose that book to be read to out of for?" Gower points out "She said what she wanted to say perfectly clearly, in words of one syllable, and what more can one ask?".

Stephen Randall

Reply 17 offered by: Fred on 20-Sep-2000

Don't remember the author of this little bit of nonsense, but it's stuck with me all these years...

"I lately lost a preposition; I thought he'd hid beneath my chair.
And angrily I cried, "Perdition! Up from out of in under there!"
Correctness is my 'vade mecum', and straggling phrases I abhor,
And yet I wondered, "What should he come up from out of in under for?"

:)


#1697: Break barlines
Break barlines

(1697)

Submitted by: Artur on 13-Aug-2000

Does anybody know how to brak barline between staves and/or make a Grand/Orchestral (together)staff?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Aug-2000

Could you elaborate on your question?

You can force a system break from Bar Line properties (select the bar line, then Edit | Properties).

You can also set grand staff styles in conjunction with the orchestral style, if the grand staff style is not the first staff in the system.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 14-Aug-2000

What Artur may be asking is how to construct a system of staves in which the barline does not run uninterrupted from the top of the system to the bottom, but rather has gaps between various groups of staves within the system For example, in an orchestral score, you might want each instrument family (woodwinds, brass, percussion, strings) to have its own continuous barline, with gaps separating the families.

(If not isn't Artur's question, I apologize, but this is one of the first questions that I asked myself when doing an orchestral score in NWC.)

The only way I've found to do this is to use staff layering. Imagine, for example, that you want a barline gap between second bassoon and first horn. All your wind and brass staves should have their Visual Style set to "Orchestral" so that their barlines connect with the surrounding staves. Then, below the second bassoon, create a new staff and give it the "Standard" visual style, and edit the second bassoon staff to turn on the "Layer with next staff" property. When you enable layering in File/Page Setup, you'll end up with a layered second bassoon staff that is connected to the staves above it (the rest of the woodwinds) but disconnected from the staves below it (the brass section).

Of course, if you're layering the bottom staff of a grouping anyway (e.g., you're constructing a "Bassoons" staff using layered 1st and 2nd bassoon staves) then you don't need to invent a third layered staff - just change the Style property of the lower of the existing staves.

Am I making this too hard? If there's an easier way of achieving this effect, I'd love to hear of it.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Aug-2000

To expand only slightly on Grant's post -- there is quite a bit you can do using the "dummy staff" layered under an actual staff. For instance, you can put bracketed (grand staff) pairs in the middle, even bracketed staves without continuous barlines (as can be handy for vocal lines such as sop and tenor, where you don't want the barlines interfering with the lyrics). Though it seems fiddly, it's really not too hard once you get the hang of it -- and easier to do by experimentation than to try to explain it.

Reply 4 offered by: Artur on 15-Aug-2000

Grant got it, and I think it would be amaselingly nice to have a feature to do it, without using dummies and others, because they can screw things up when you export to midi. (e.g. try to open in winjammer and you´ll see lots of empty staves.)

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 15-Aug-2000

Artur, your reply makes me think of someone has written earlier.
I think there is a way not to export the "dummy" staves, but I cannot check it reite now.
Try to search on the "offline" forum.
BTW, your question leads me to an advice: make the layout as you want, but ONLY when you're done with entering "musical" (rests, notes, lyrics) data. Bar breaking can be done after; and the same goes for staff breaking (since it may change, depending on paper size)
On another side, the trick indicated by Grant may easily be automatically with that good old macro recorder, since it is always the same process (except placing the new staff at the proper place)
Here is the process in the most stable way, which is not exactly the same one would do "normally":
1. go to the staff where you want to break barlines under it (not in the macro)
2. edit properties of the staff (F2), and allow layering (I think Alt+Home will go to first tab), Validate (Enter)
3. select the whole staff (Home, Shift+End, Ctrl+Ins)
4. Create the new staff (Ctrl+A), copy the origin staff (Shift+Ins)
5. Edit its properties to "standard", upper size=8, lower size=8 (not to interfere with real size)
6. Open the menu for moving the staff to the place you want (stop recording the macro just before starting to move the staff)
7. Place the staff where you want.
The macro automatize the steps 2 to 6 incl., so you just have 3 actions to do now. Ain't that easy? :)
Of course, it doesn't replace the ability (that NWC doesn't offer (yet?)) to break bar without breaking the "system".

[Sorry if you find some error in the process over here, but I'm currently stuck on a VT100 terminal with no graphic capability, so writing this from memory]
If someone is interested, PLMK, I'll create and send the macro file. (This is much more quicker to do than a TT Font! ;)
HTH, Dominique


#1698: Pedal glitches
Pedal glitches

(1698)

Submitted by: Stuart Ravn on 15-Aug-2000

There is a problem with the pedal command on NoteWorthy. The "Pedal Down" function works properly, as all the notes within it's range are sustained. But "Pedal Realease" doesn't entirely work. It stops notes past it from being sustained, but it does not stop the notes that were within the "Pedal Down" range. Is this fixable within the program?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Aug-2000

This seems to be dependent on the implementation of the pedal command in the actual synth or soundcard. NWC simply sends the commands - it's up to the synth to determine what to do with it.

Try this: put at least one note between the Pedal Off and the next Pedal On. This fixes that particular problem on my XG synth. (On occasion I've even inserted a short "dummy" note, with velocity override set to 1, to accomplish what I needed.)

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Aug-2000

Fred is exactly correct. NWC does not control how the synth actually performs the sustain pedal instruction.


#1700: Flow direction anomaly
Flow direction anomaly

(1700)

Submitted by: Paul Powell on 16-Aug-2000

I have a unique problem which could probably be solved with a lot of copying and pasting, but am wondering if there is a simpler solution (boy, I hope so!). Here is the problem:

I have a song which has the following details (in the order they appear on paper):

Begin song
segno
master repeat open
Last time to coda
ending 1 (dal segno)
ending 2 (master repeat close)
ending 3 (master repeat close)
coda

The problem is between the first and second endings... it'll go to the segno as it should, but when it gets to the "to coda" mark, it immediately goes to the coda, since it was flagged by the dal segno. Is there a way to make it conditional (as it should be in this song)?

I realize I could probably have the song play as it should by just copying and pasting and not having any flow direction controls to it, but that would be a lot of work!! Please advise if there is a way to control it the way it's written. Thanks! :)

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Aug-2000

From your details, it is not clear why your Coda section is not simply a fourth ending in a series of master repeats. Maybe you can rewrite it that way.

Otherwise, the branch to coda will *always* be executed the first time it is encountered after the Dal Segno.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Powell on 16-Aug-2000

Yeah, I was afraid of that.

However, the coda isn't exactly a 4th ending in this particular song... I did think of a simpler work around with this in mind, however...

The segno actually goes back almost to the beginning of the song... there's actually a lot of music in between the segno and the master repeat open. However, I just thought about it a ways... I will simply delete the segno-coda section, and add the repeated part of the song (copied and pasted) to the first ending, and call the coda a 4th ending. :) Thanks for your thoughts... it should help! :)

--Paul

Reply 3 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 17-Aug-2000

With tools like NWC available, why bother with contorted flows? Even simple repeats are easier to read in a continuous format. After all, complex flows were invented to save the manual-score-writer unnecessary pen-strokes, but are not needed now.

Reply 4 offered by: Artur on 18-Aug-2000

What you can also do is to copy as a non-repeated hidden staff(all the repeats like they should sound) and make a viewable-only staff, for printouts.


#1701: What is a "waveset"?
What is a "waveset"?

(1701)

Submitted by: Clive on 18-Aug-2000

What is a "waveset"? How is a 8 meg waveset better than a 2 or 4 meg set?

Pardon these daft questions...

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 18-Aug-2000

"Waveset" also known as "Sound font". It's a collection of actual recordings of instrument sounds, usually with different variations corresponding to different velocity ranges, to give (for example) the different timbre of a piano played softly, or struck hard.

Larger sound font collections are larger because they have more sounds, more dynamic variants within each basic sound, more complex sounds, or combination of the above. All other things being equal, larger sound font files will give truer renditions than smaller files.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 29-Sep-2000

As I understand it (correction invited) Wavesets are not exactly the same as soundfonts. Wavesets are used by Creative SB PCI cards (and Ensoniq??). I believe they have a proprietary format that hasn't been released to third parties. There are currently only three wavesets available 2, 4 and 8 Mb. These provide different quality versions of the same sets of sounds (bigger is better). Soundfonts, on the other hand come in a many more flavours and are often produced by third parties, based on recorded samples from a variety of sources.

Stephen Randall

Reply 3 offered by: Neo on 20-Dec-2000

Well Stephen you seem to have it right. Either way. All I can say is that Presently with my new SBLive Player. The 8MB Soundfont provided sucks big time compared to my previous SB Vibra128 8MB Waveset. Someone proove me wrong and tell me where I can Get a descent SoundFont.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 20-Dec-2000

You're on the right track - I'm amazed how many buy a Live card than whinge about the sounds that came with it instead of loading a good soundfont.

Try hammersound - all the soundfonts you can eat!
http://www.hammersound.net

Depends on the sound you're after.
For the big-band stuff I do the Chaos 8Mb suits me fine.
It's all I can get to fill my AWE32 + 8Mb RAM.


#1702: notes without staves
notes without staves

(1702)

Submitted by: Joseph Guix on 19-Aug-2000

I would want to use the tip offered by NWC to prepare exercises of rhythm, but if I do what is said, I don't see the stems and the beams of the eigths or the sixteenths.
What can I do ?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Aug-2000

Would you please be more specific about what you are doing?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Aug-2000

The NWCV15.ttf font contains notes (used by the program for grace notes) with 1/2, 1/4 and 1/8 duration. These are mapped to F, G and H. You can use these in any word-processor such as Corel WP, Word, etc. for simple staff-less rhythmic exercises. (Sorry, no whole notes; maybe a lower-case "o" in a bold Arial would work for this).

Alternately, use a general-purpose musical font; a few are available at the Scriptorium.

Reply 3 offered by: Joseph Guix on 21-Aug-2000

Please see the newsgroup with attachments.
Thanks.


#1703: Effects
Effects

(1703)

Submitted by: Aaron Fitzgerald on 19-Aug-2000

Please help me, I am new to noteworthy Composer, and i'm still not to sure on how to use many of the functions.
But what I would really like to know is:- are there any ways of creating sound effects; such as an explosion, or a train speeding up as it goes down the tracks?

Please help and many thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Stuart Ravn on 19-Aug-2000

Doing this is fairly simple, but the sound effects are usually pretty low-quality on a computer. You'd hear them better on an electric keyboard. All you do is add a stave and select the instrument as what sound effect you want to use. The sound effects are down at the very bottom of the instrument list. Then enter a note (C3-C5 range is best) and specify how long you want the sound effect to be on. I've found that Seashore is the best quality sound effect on my computer, but I probably have a different instrument set than you. So you'll have to do some fooling around with instruments until you get the right one.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Aug-2000

It depends on your sound hardware. Some cards include the ability to create your own sound effects, then load them for purposes of play back in NWC or other MIDI software. Other cards simply supply the standard effects called for in the General MIDI spec. Check with your sound card docs and manufacturer's web site to determine its capabilities.

Reply 3 offered by: aphid on 06-Sep-2000

i have a sound blaster live card, and it comes with a program that i think might be what you need, (or a reasonable facsimile thereof)
Vienna SoundFont Studio.
It will let you set up a wav file as an instrument.
so if you want an explosion or a train, you can have one that sounds as good as you can record it.
There is already alot on the web about SoundFonts, but I will tell you that not all sound cards will let you use them. (unless you get several programs to do several different things).
If your soundcard does support them, you can use them with NWC. If not, you can find another way, i'm sure... but i'm quite sure that the sound effects in the regular MIDI instruments aren't quite what you're looking for..


#1704: XG/GM MIDI Instrument Sets
XG/GM MIDI Instrument Sets

(1704)

Submitted by: Stuart Ravn on 19-Aug-2000

Where can I d/l a <b>FREE</b> *.IDF MIDI Instrument Set file off of the 'net? Preferably and XG, but I'll settle for GM if an XG is nowhere to be found.

P.S.: *cluelessly* What does XG stand for, anyway?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 19-Aug-2000

You can get a description of idf files at:

http://www.pgmusic.com/techfaq.htm#2-9

As mentioned in the article, microsoft has an idf editor that might be of use to you if you're interested.

XG is Yamaha's proprietary extension to General Midi. It includes GM, but also includes a substantial number of refinements. Needless to say, if you want to make the most out of XG files, you need a Yamaha synth.

Roland has a similar GM extension called GS.

For more information, go straight to the source, at:

http://www.yamaha.co.uk/xg/


#1706: how do turn NWC files to wave files?
how do turn NWC files to wave files?

(1706)

Submitted by: Drummer Boy on 20-Aug-2000

how do turn NWC files to wave files?

Reply 1 offered by: Stuart Ravn on 20-Aug-2000

WAV files are MUCH bigger than MIDI files, and to turn NWC files into MIDI files, go to "Save As", and on the drop-down for the file type, select "Type 1 MIDI file".

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Aug-2000

This topic has been discussed extensively in this forum. You can either:

1) Download and install the offline version and search it

2) Use the search facility that is shown when you start a new post/thread

Reply 3 offered by: Malcolm Dale on 11-Nov-2000

What I do is open the .NWC file then reduce the page
to half-size using the "restore" button. Then I open
the program "Wave Studio" which comes with the Sound
Blaster and reduce that on size - so I can see both
programmes on the screen at once. Then just hit "record"
on the Wave Studio and "PLay" on Noteworthy and BINGO.
Make sure your mike is turned OFF or you'll pick up
extraneous noises like passing cars and dogs barking.
Note - a 256k Nwc file turns into a 200 MEGABYTE .wav file.
You have been warned.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Nov-2000

Just to be a little more precise about the resulting wav file size: at 44,100 Hz, 16-bit, stereo (the format for recording to CD), it works out to about 10 megs per minute. So that "256k" NWC file must have run about 20 minutes to create a 200 meg wav file.

Converting to mp3 (at 128kbps, stereo) shrinks that back down to about 1 meg per minute (a 10:1 compression).


#1707: opening old NWC files
opening old NWC files

(1707)

Submitted by: Todd Ferguson on 21-Aug-2000

Does anyone know how to get the latest shareware version to open old files that are saved on a disk? Some are saved within a shareware version all on a disk, and have been unzipped and still will not open. The NWC Open dialog box of the shareware program installed on my computer now doesn't find and song files or NWC files in the files on my disk. A reacurring error message that I receive : "the system cannot read from the specified device."

Please help me become someone who can help others.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Aug-2000

Sounds like you have an actual system problem here. Perhaps your floppy drive has had it, or the floppies themselves have gone bad. The error you're getting means that your system can't even read the data, let alone do anything with it.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Aug-2000

All newer NWC versions can read files created by older versions. In this case, you are getting a system level message that is indicative of larger problems, unrelated to opening older version files.


#1708: opening zipped NWC files
opening zipped NWC files

(1708)

Submitted by: Todd Ferguson on 21-Aug-2000

How do you extract NWC files from a Zip file to NWC installed on my computer? That is, how can I play my WinZip files/songs? I keep getting the error message: Severe Error When testing/extracting WinZip was unable to read file #1 in the Zip file.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Aug-2000

Are these zip files on floppies? If so, see previous message. If not, does your installation of WinZip properly open other zip files? If yes, then the files containing the nwc archive is corrupt; if no, then re-install WinZip.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Aug-2000

If:

1) Your ZIP file contains valid NWC files
2) The NWC files have the *.nwc extension
3) You are using the latest version of NWC

Then you can simply drag an NWC file out of WinZip and drop it onto NoteWorthy Composer. If this fails, then one of the above statements are not, in fact, true.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 22-Aug-2000

Quick add-on comment if one or more of the files are corrupted.

If Winzip lists several files, try just selecting one of the other files to see if it will extract.

If the entire file is corrupted, there used to be a utility called pkzipfix.exe. Probably somewhere on the Web. However, it seemed to be able to fix a lot of corrupt files.


#1709: Single/multiple stave lines
Single/multiple stave lines

(1709)

Submitted by: Charles Winter on 22-Aug-2000

Greetings,
Would it be possible for a staff to be set up with one or two lines only? This would be useful for timpani, other instruments with few notes, mallets, cymbals, bass drum, and other percussion (eg. a triangle or some such - standard drum kit uses the normal stave but with crossed note heads)
Have these been considered for your next release?
Does Noteworthy have a reference such as 'the study of orchestration' to ensure that they cover these standard notations?
Is quite a good program and has good potential.
Kind Regards
Charles Winter.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 06-Sep-2000

You'd better ask this on the "wish" page :
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/wishlist.htm

HTH,
Dominique


#1710: Installing on Windows 2000
Installing on Windows 2000

(1710)

Submitted by: Pierre Archambault on 23-Aug-2000

Is it possible to install Noteworthy Composer 1.7 on Windows 2000 and will it run correctly?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Aug-2000

Excerpt from our download page:

Minimum System Requirements: Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows NT 4, Windows 2000 or later

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 24-Aug-2000

However, be aware that some manufacturers of sound cards have not yet caught up with W2K for all of their products. So if your question is because you are considering whether to upgrade to W2K on a system where NWC is currently working OK, check that your sound card has suitable drivers.

If you have already got W2K up and running and are satisfied with audio performance, you can have a high level of confidence that NWC will work - 'cos Noteworthy says it will and Noteworthy is very nearly always correct :>).

Also,I believe there are a number of "early adopters" around the forum who can confirm satisfactory operation under W2K. Personally, I am a "late adopter" having just said a sad farewell to W3.1 and a reluctant hello to W98 so I can't offer any personal experience under W2K.

Stephen Randall

Reply 3 offered by: Martin Segerstråle on 26-Aug-2000

Yes, it works. I've had W2K for some time now and except for the wavetable (which is not nice since the drivers come with Windows and aren't straight from Creative) it works fine. Just remember to install the program in another folder than your W98 or W3.x copy, because W2K uses different settings concerning MIDI. otherwise you'll have to change the settings every time you change operating systems. That is, if you're using two operating systems at the same time, like I'm doing.

Reply 4 offered by: Don Edwards on 11-Sep-2000

One useful trick I've found with W2K (and this is on my machine where I am the administrator - but I don't routinely use the administrator ID) is to rename every install program Setup.EXE immediately before running it.

This causes W2K to ask if you want to run the installation as your logged-in userid, or as Administrator - for which you have to provide the proper password. Some software that integrates with the OS, *must* be installed as Administrator.

After the install, of course, I rename the install program again. Usually to a name that tells the software *and* *version* that I installed, example, Noteworthy Composer 1.70.exe


#1711: Strange bug in 1.70
Strange bug in 1.70

(1711)

Submitted by: Mark Anderson on 27-Aug-2000

My latest song (which newsgroup users will remember: "3-D Suite in A-Flat") has a minor printout problem when I make the trumpet-only part (I wouldn't want a trumpet player to read off a piano score :) ). I worked around it by just getting rid of the Mod Wheel MPCs (and no, I haven't done testing to see if every MPC causes this), since this version is for printing and not playing, but here's the setup.

A barline ends the measure. The first entry in the next measure is a Mod Wheel MPC to simulate vibrato. The note that is to be vibratoed follows. On Print Preview and the actual printout, the note that has the vibrato is squished much closer to the barline than all the other notes that begin measures that do not have Mod Wheel MPCs.

As I said, I worked around it, but I still thought I should submit it. :) I've got an example file, if you need it to further understand.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Aug-2000

Yes, I've found that problem also. Anything between the barline and the first note (even if it's invisible) will cause that squishing effect. Like you, I work around it by adding a couple text spaces with Preserve Width On.

That problem (and no, I don't think it's unfair to call it a bug) started with one of the betas, in which items were compressed together more in answer to user requests.

My concern is not so much having to use a workaround per se, but what will happen with files that have the extra padding if/when the problem gets corrected.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 29-Aug-2000

I like this bug.

I'll have to figure out something invisible I can insert in each measure to squeeze out all that extra white space...


#1712: noteworthy plays 1/2step to high
noteworthy plays 1/2step to high

(1712)

Submitted by: Dorothy on 27-Aug-2000

I have been using my noteworthy composer for over a year and so far it was great--until I bought a new computer. Now when I use it to play music back, it is 1/2 step to high (i.e. D is really D-sharp which means D-flat is D). Since I use this program to accompany me on my cello it is extremely important that the keys are correct (I cross checked the keys with a tuning fork, my keyboard and a metronome which also plays a perfect A natural (A440). There must be a way to correct this--anyone?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 27-Aug-2000

The work-around is to do Staff Properties (F2) for each staff, and on the Midi tab set the Transposition to -1.

I don't know the cause of the problem. You could try Tools | Options |Midi and change the sound driver you use.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Aug-2000

Blair is exactly correct.

Assuming you are not already using NWC audio transposition, your sound card's tonal center must be incorrect. You can work around this kind of problem using the Staff Properties | Midi | Transposition field, but then your song's will sound incorrect on other machines.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Aug-2000

Just had a thought... (ouch). You didn't say what kind of sound your computer came with. If it happens to be Yamaha XG (or, I believe, Roland GS), then you could adjust the Master Tune sysex parameter. You'd have to put the appropriate sysex command into a midi file, and play the file first thing after booting. It would then stay in that tuning as long as the computer was on, and nothing else did a full reset or changed the master tune.

Reply 4 offered by: Artur on 29-Aug-2000

I´m sorry, but I use a Awe32 and , more than having a sound that is almost like an orchestra, it tunned perfectly, so I figure it is rude to say that Nwc plays it above, your sound card plays it above...

Reply 5 offered by: Robin Withey on 31-Aug-2000

I had a similar sort of problem, only more selectively. I found that certain instruments played off-tune in NWC on my sound card. When I first heard songs using these instruments, I immediately thought that they had been recorded wrongly (I've had plenty of experience of .MID files downloaded from the internet that were just too awful to listen to!). However, when I listened to the original .MID files using Media Player, they sounded fine.

I never figured out what the problem was, but I recently bought a new sound card, since my on-board sound did not support MIDI (or microphone) input. Immediately, the problem went away!

Anyone know of any problems with on-board sound chips (I think it was a Yamaha chip)?

Robin Withey

Reply 6 offered by: Art thompson on 01-Sep-2000

Really decent sound cards can be had for under $40, I think I'd give it a try. Or put a capo on your cello! (just kidding)

Reply 7 offered by: Dorothy on 02-Sep-2000

Thanks everyone. So far I'm using the work around offered by Blair. Eventually I'll probably change the sound card on my computer (when I get the time). I assumed that being a new computer the sound card would actually be better then my older one (boy was I wrong). Anyway, I appreciate everyone's imput. Once again, Thanks.


#1713: Display problem
Display problem

(1713)

Submitted by: Stephen Randall on 27-Aug-2000

I recently upgraded the driver for my graphics card to fix a problem my son was having with a new game. The game works fine now but... something seems to have screwed up NWC's display. As I noticed this the next time I used NWC after installing the new driver, I guess the advice will be "wait until the driver gets fixed". However, on the offchance that I have uncovered a glitch in NWC, I relate my symptoms and current set up here.

THE SYMPTOMS:

When I scroll left (i.e backwards) through a score I get spurious horizontal lines (I can provide a screen shot if it would help). I note that Steve Allen reported similar behaviour in the Forum recently and was advised to use F9 to redraw the screen (see msg #1670). However, I find that F9 often does not get rid of the lines.

Having played around some more I find that the spurious lines are always attached at their left hand end to some element of the score that extends beyond the left hand edge of the screen, generally a note that is within a beamed group, a tie or a slur. (The lines appear as if the topmost part of the element has been smeared to the right). If any part of the score element to which the spurious line is attached is off screen to the left, F9 does not remove the line but instead extends it to the right hand side of the screen. However, if I scroll further left so that I can see the whole of the element to which the spurious line is attached (i.e the whole of the beamed group of notes or the whole slur or tie), F9 removes the spurious line. If there is a mixture of on- and off-screen attached elements, F9 only removes the spurious lines attached to those that are wholly visible.

The problem disappears if I set the graphics hardware acceleration to notch 2 (basic acclerator functions).

Display resolution and colour depth seem to have no effect on the behaviour - i.e. it still happens.

The speed at which I scroll left does not have any influence on the behaviour.

The lines consistently appear whenever the result of scrolling leaves a score element straddling the left hand screen boundary.

The lines also appear when NWC scrolls the sore left during playback as as result of a repeat.

THE SET UP:

CPU: Pentium III @ 500 MHz

RAM: 128Mb

Graphics card: ATI Rage 128 with 32 Mb Ram

Graphics Driver: ATI2DRAA version 4.12.01.6269

NWC version: 1.70 32 bit.

With the graphics acceleration fully enabled NWC is just about unusable [:o( with it disabled most games are just about unplayable [:o( so I get it in the neck when I forget to re-enable acceleration after my session with NWC.

Any thoughts please?

Stephen Randall

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Aug-2000

I too have an ATI Rage, and had bizarre problems under Win95 (all was --and still is-- well under 3.11). In my case the symptom was a strobing mouse cursor, and occasional glitches as you describe. As in your case, the problem(s) went away if I used "basic-only" hardware acceleration settings. I took the problem to ATI, who (to their credit) spent quite some time stepping me through installing the latest drivers, etc. etc. The problem persisted - until one especially bright tech asked me to try turning off the "3d" mouse cursors. I did that, restoring the good old boring mouse cursor, and all my troubles vanished. (Needless to say, I got rid of /all/ that buggy "Plus!" stuff post-haste!) Haven't had a display problem since.

HTH...
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Aug-2000

Just to reiterate what we have stated in the past: when a display driver fails to adequately implement some of its graphics functions, there is nothing that we can do from within NoteWorthy Composer to overcome this. The only true solution is for the manufacturer to correct the bug(s).

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 04-Sep-2000

As ever, NW-Online is right. ATI Support provided a long list of suggestions, the last of which was to try some beta drivers that are hidden away in a dark corner of the ATI web site. After exhausting the other suggestions (and myself), I crossed my fingers and went for the beta drivers.

I am happy to report that my display now does what NWC tells it to, and my fears about using beta system software seem to have been unfounded in this case - the new drivers haven't introduced any unwanted "features" elsewhere.

Three cheers for ATI Support!

Stephen Randall


#1714: Music from Cape Breton
Music from Cape Breton

(1714)

Submitted by: Kiriel on 28-Aug-2000

A friend of mine is after information about and musical notation for music from Cape Breton - in particular two pieces of music called "Ys" and "It's time". If you can help, please send me an email to kiriel@cybergal.com.

Thanks very much
Kiriel


#1715: Beta Testing
Beta Testing

(1715)

Submitted by: Joe Hansche on 29-Aug-2000

Does anyone know what it takes to become a beta tester? I enjoyed the enhancements from 1.5 to 1.7, and I'd like to test beta versions in the future. Any info is appreciated. Thanks.
- Joe

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Aug-2000

We are not in any open beta test at the moment. Our beta test procedures are developed in conjunction with newer versions. Beyond this comment, we do not plan to offer any further details or comment at this time.


#1716: Instrument Percent
Instrument Percent

(1716)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 30-Aug-2000

What does "%" (percent) mean, preceding the staff name (lower right info bar)in the display?

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 30-Aug-2000

I once stared at this question, and I pulled it to 99% (filling the staff with crap) I got an message that said that beyond that point Nwc could crash at any time and present some bugs... I don't know why there's a limit and since you brought it up, it would be nice to know.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Aug-2000

It is the percent of maximum used by a staff. When you approach 100%, the staff is full and cannot get any longer.

Reply 3 offered by: denise on 30-Aug-2000

of course, that 99% is way more than adequate for just about any piece unless you have a way crap computer

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Aug-2000

One more thing: the total possible size of a staff is independent of your computer. Some computers may not have enough memory to even use all 100% of a staff size. In the end, you are limited to about 12000 items in a staff, if I remember correctly.


#1717: First line indentation
First line indentation

(1717)

Submitted by: Dan Doxzen on 30-Aug-2000

Can anyone tell me how to get the first line of music to indent? I've been naming the staves with a few periods or commas and whiting them out on the printed copy. There has to be an easier way.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 30-Aug-2000

Hold down the Alt key, and press 0160 on the numeric keypad to produce a blank character that you can use to name a staff with. This removes the need for whiteout.

We can wish for a proper indent command.


#1718: Please help!
Please help!

(1718)

Submitted by: Ryan on 30-Aug-2000

Somebody please help me! I'm in 7th grade top band and when playing some songs, it has DS al Coda. I keep forgetting to ask the director and can't find what it means ANYWHERE!!! I was promoted the second week of school and they had already gone over the music. :-( Help, please!

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 30-Aug-2000

D.S. al Coda is an abbreviation of the Italian phrase "dal segno al coda", which means "from the sign to the tail".

If you'll look back in your part you'll see, somewhere, a symbol that looks like a big S with a slash through it and probably some dots as well. This is the "Segno", or sign. When you see "D.S.", this is an instruction to go back to the Segno and start playing from there. At some point you'll encounter the phrase "al Coda", which means that you jump to the place (generally near the end) marked "Coda" and continue playing from that point until the end.

I hope this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: ah choo on 31-Aug-2000

congratulations for the promotion!

Reply 3 offered by: Art thompson on 01-Sep-2000

It just doesn't seem fair that they expect 7th graders to know Italian!

Reply 4 offered by: David Palmquist on 17-Sep-2000

Grant's message mentioned playing until you come to the expression "al coda."

I think it's more common to find the coda sign, a circle with a cross on it. We sometimes call it a "gunsight."

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Sep-2000

Art, I was under the impression that in Italy, the seventh graders know Italian.


#1719: deleting tempo markings
deleting tempo markings

(1719)

Submitted by: Walter Rimler on 30-Aug-2000

How do I delete tempo and dynamic markings without deleting nearby notes? The older versions of the program did this, but 1.70 seems to have a flaw in this regard.

Thanks for any help.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Aug-2000

The procedure is the same as always. You can either position to the right of the item and press Backspace, or position to the left and press Delete. Either way, you are protected by the Edit | Undo feature. If you miss, simply Undo and try again.

Reply 2 offered by: Blair Dowden on 31-Aug-2000

I prefer to select the item (either with the mouse, or shift-Arrow) and delete it. The dynamic is represented by a little diamond. If there is lots of stuff in the same place, it can be hard to know which diamond is for which item.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 31-Aug-2000

One advantage of the select-then-delete method is that once you've selected the item, you can edit it (<Ctrl>-e) and see if it's the item you think it is before you delete it.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Lim on 02-Sep-2000

.... glad to see someone else is still using <ctrl> E (a one-handed operation) as opposed to <alt>+<enter> (a two-handed operation - unless you are Van Cliburn).

Bob

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 02-Sep-2000

Whether <Alt><Enter> is a one- or two-handed operation depends on your keyboard even more than your handspan. My desktop keyboard has two <Alt> keys, one at each end of the space bar, so I could (if I wanted) press <Alt><Enter> with my right hand alone. On the other hand, my laptop has only the left-hand <Alt> key. (And I can press <LeftAlt><Enter> one-handed on either keyboard, but only at the expense of an awkward stretch.)

As to my use of <Ctrl>E, I suspect I have an automatic bias toward left-hand <Ctrl> key combinations dating from my early computing days when I used emacs a lot and really built up the strength in my left little finger.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Sep-2000

Aha! Now I realise that my left-hand CNTL key bias comes from CP/M! :)

Reply 7 offered by: Blair Dowden on 03-Sep-2000

Left-hand CTRL sequences are used a lot in EMACS, the unix editor, which is older then CP/M.

Reply 8 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 04-Sep-2000

Out of curiosity I checked some facts on the web and it turns out that CP/M was first completed in 1974 while the first EMACS appeared in 1976.

So EMACS is not older than CP/M. They're both the same age, very roughly speaking. :-)

Reply 9 offered by: Art thompson on 06-Sep-2000

This is all very interesting, but some of us are still struggling with deleting tempo and dynamics. I'm a new user, and so far this seems to be the only interface problem I'm having. Does it have anything to do with the "preserve width" feature?

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 06-Sep-2000

The first part of this thread talks about deleting non-preserved width items, such as tempo and dynamics. If preserve width is on, you do not have this problem because the items take up a lot more space. If you want to get rid of non-preserved width items, select a section of the staff, and on the Expression Placement tab you can make everything have a preserved width. However, the score will look ugly.

About EMACS and CP/M - I just assumed anything to do with Unix was ancient. Obviously that is incorrect.

Reply 11 offered by: Art thompson on 07-Sep-2000

Thanks. sounds like a great suggestion. I think i'll try leaving 'Preserve width' on until it finalized, then turn it off. This seems to work, althought the score does look cumbersome until you change it. ALSO, I suddenly seem to be able to grab the diamond better on non preserved markings,and now feel slightly er,uh you know...


#1720: Writing for Organ
Writing for Organ

(1720)

Submitted by: Nathan Uhl on 31-Aug-2000

Is there a way that i can get an organ template on NoteWorthy? If not, is there a waay to get something that faintly resembles an organ staff? If someone knows, please write back.

Reply 1 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 01-Sep-2000

Assuming you are referring to pipe organ scores, a piano staff with one added staff (Ctrl a)would take care of two manuals and pedal.


#1721: saving chords with ties as midi
saving chords with ties as midi

(1721)

Submitted by: Dan Mozell on 01-Sep-2000

I have measures in a piano piece where some notes in a chord last longer than others. For example, the top note in a chord is a 16th. A middle note in the chord is a 16th tied to another 16th. If I save the file as a Type I midi, that midi file doesn't recognize the tie. The note that should be tied (last for an 8th) is only a 16th. Do I have to write another staff to get inner voices to translate properly when saving as MIDI? Thanks for your help.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 01-Sep-2000

Dan, I tried but I can't reproduce your problem. I suspect that the generated MIDI is correct and you may be basing your complaint on the way the MIDI file looks when you re-import it into NWC. This is misleading; NWC has some funny ways of handling rests in imported MIDI files that I don't quite understand but that can play havoc with niceties like this.

If you have a MIDI disassembler (there's a link to one at the NWC Scriptorium, http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html ), you might want to run your MIDI file through it. I think it will confirm that NWC is doing the right thing - on output, at any rate.

Reply 2 offered by: Dan Mozell on 01-Sep-2000

Thanks for your reply. You're correct! The midi is really OK. It's when I import the MIDI back in to Noteworthy that it get's messed up.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 02-Sep-2000

Noteworthy won't "correctly" import two notes with the same starting point and different ending points on from the same MIDI track. Its behavior is documented--always give both notes the shorter duration--so I don't know that you can call it "incorrect." But it's never been what I wanted to happen.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 03-Sep-2000

Writers of software (myself included) regularly document behavior that's objectively incorrect, if only to insulate ourselves against customer complaints. This doesn't make the documented behavior any more desirable.

In the case of MIDI import, I don't think there's any reason NWC couldn't be better at handling simultaneous notes of different duration, except perhaps that it wouldn't be particularly easy code to write. Maybe this is an area where we could hope for improvement in version 2.0. (Although it isn't particularly high on my personal wish list.)


#1722: Just for interest, which soundcard do you use?
Just for interest, which soundcard do you use?

(1722)

Submitted by: Clive on 02-Sep-2000

I use a SoundBlaster PCI 64 with a 4mb waveset. I have tried SB Live! and did not like it at all, though I am sure I did not have the correct setup...

Which card do you use?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Sep-2000

Yamaha DB50XG. (Now more-or-less replaced by the newer SW1000XG.)

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 02-Sep-2000

Creative Vibra 128 with 2, 4 and 8 Mb wavesets. Its supposed to be the same as a PCI 128, except it doesn't support 4 speakers, only 2.

Spec for the PCI 128 says I should have 10 midi drumsets but I have only found one so far. Can anyone suggest where to look for the other 9?

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 03-Sep-2000

I use the Ensoniq PCI (which I think is equivalent to one of the Soundblasters). Love its wavesets!

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 offered by: Artur on 04-Sep-2000

I use an olde SBAwe32, but the sound is perfect! and more than that , it is an Orchestra!!

Reply 6 offered by: ah choo on 04-Sep-2000

okay punk don't delete me again.
All I said was a had a soundblaster 16!
but I do have several synths and recording decks that make all the difference! :-P

Reply 7 offered by: Gordon on 04-Sep-2000

I have the SBLive! which is the cumulation of all things good in the consumer-priced sound card world. I have about 50Mb of sounds loaded (a 40Mb custom version of GM, and 10Mb of wonderful instruments from HammerSound) that capture the sound very well.

This is the sound I've been looking for for years. The closest I've come before this was with the Yamaha Soft Synth 100.

Reply 8 offered by: Clive on 05-Sep-2000

Hi Gordon,

How do you get hold of a 40MB soundfont?!

Thanks, Clive

Reply 9 offered by: Gordon on 05-Sep-2000

Hi Clive,

http://www.hammersound.net has plenty of soundbanks that run from 30 to 60Mb. He also has many great individual instruments.

Cadenza is a great one at 50Mb, Jurgen at 60Mb, Fluid and Unison are smaller. If you only want a GM, one way to make it exactly what you like would be to gather some individual instruments you like, take the GM to Vienna and swap out the instruments. You might also put instruments you like into the high positions of the bank that currently have instruments you don't use. (Most everything from 100 to 127.)

I believe the rule of thumb is that the size of the soundbank can be half the size of your RAM. I have 128Mb RAM, so I can load a soundbank up to 64Mb.

SBLive! puts an icon on your desktop. One of the selections is SoundFont. You can go there and add and delete all your instruments, up to the limit noted above. I love it. I can be playing a song in NWC, stop it and select another instrument from the list in the installed SoundFonts, and resume playing in a few seconds. If I no longer like an instrument, I delete it from the list and add another.

Hope this answers your question.

Regards,
Gordon

Reply 10 offered by: sterghios A. Moschos on 08-Sep-2000

What's even more, you can get a single instrument soundfont that is even larger. Every semitone sampled, at three different dynamics layered so that when used for MIDI the soud changes according to attack velocity, with different playstyles. Easily over 80MBs. But that is how you get realistic playback.

BTW, I do have an SBLive, and with NWC, I don't even need a fretboard/keyboard (just hours and hours and hours and hours and...)

Sterghios

Reply 11 offered by: Art thompson on 08-Sep-2000

I have a SoundWave Pro by SIIG, witj 6MD wavetable. Sounds real good, and only about $30 - $35.

Reply 12 offered by: Mantas on 11-Apr-2001

I just bought creative PCI 128. Nothing spectacular, but it's good one. The problem is I don't know how to make it support 4 speaker. Can you help me? Thanks.

Reply 13 offered by: Fred on 11-Apr-2001

There's a jumper on the board to configure for 2- or 4-speaker use. As I recall, it's nearby the output jacks.

On the topic of this card, does anyone know if any other wavesets exist for this (other than the 2, 4 and 8 meg files that come with it)?

Fred

Reply 14 offered by: Mantas on 12-Apr-2001

Thanks to Fred for his answer. Unfortunately I have another question. If I connect front speakers to "speaker out", where should I connect rear speaker? Thanks again.

Reply 15 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Apr-2001

Sorry, I should have answered more fully. The jumper selects Speaker output or Line output. For 4-speaker systems you apparently have to select the line output option, because the built-in amplifier is only a stereo (two channel) device.

For four-speaker systems you have to use the line out jacks, and use amplified speakers. The jacks on the card are as follows (starting from the end furthest from the joystick port):

1: Speaker Out jack. The manual then promptly contradicts itself by staing "Connects external devices such as a cassette, DAT, or minidisc player for playback and recording."

2: Microphone input jack.

3: Line Out (Front) jack.

4: Aux In/ Line Out (Rear) jack.

So you'd presumably use jacks 3 and 4 for the two pairs of amplified speakers. You also have to set it for four-speaker use in softare. Right-click the mixer icon in the system tray and click "Configure 3D audio". In the window that then opens, you have to select 4-speaker mode.

Hope this works for you.

Fred

Reply 16 offered by: Mantas on 13-Apr-2001

Now I can fully enjoy the sound of all four speakers, thanks to Fred

Reply 17 offered by: David Nielson on 23-Sep-2001

I might be a bit off-topic but I have a question and this seems to be a good place to ask...

I have a Soundblaster PCI 128 and I want to load a soundfont. The card itself has no memory on it. (I've looked at the card and there physically aren't any memory chips.) It happily works with the 2, 4, and 8 meg wavesets Creative supplies, but I have a killer soundfont and Vienna says I don't have a soundfont-compatible card, and I want to use this soundfont because it's sooooooo cool......

It does seem to like these things called "wavesets", as opposed to soundfonts... is there any way to convert between the two formats, perhaps? Is that how I'm supposed to do it?

Thanks

Reply 18 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Sep-2001

Hi David,

No, the PCI128 doesn't support soundfonts. Its "Wavesets" are a kind of soundfont, in that they are a representation of the sounds you hear, but there the resemblance ends.

I tried without success to find additional wavesets, it appears that Ensoniq made them deliberately arcane, preventing aftermarket wavesets. Then they went bottoms-up, and were absorbed by Creative, who sold the Ensoniq cards under the name PCI128.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings,

Fred

Reply 19 offered by: Robin Withey on 24-Sep-2001

One thing you could try is the Yamaha Softsynth (or whatever the name is), which uses software to render the soundfonts, rather than hardware. I only ever tried their demo version, which has a few limitations, but the commercial version (unless you go for the super-deluxe model) is still cheaper than a soundcard that supports soundfonts.

Robin

Reply 20 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 24-Sep-2001

Wait a minute; Yamaha SYXG supports external banks, but, does it also support soundfonts?

Reply 21 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Sep-2001

No, you're right. What you hear is what you get. Again, it's some sort of proprietary encoding. It appears to be hidden inside a virtual device driver, with an arcane name like sxgxgknl.vxd. Good luck trying to crack that!

Fred

Reply 22 offered by: Robin Withey on 26-Sep-2001

Oops! Sorry for the bum advice. I obviously didn't try very hard with Softsynth, and I don't need it any more, 'cos I went and blew my money on an SB Live! (and a very worth-while investment if I may say so!)

Of course, as soon as I buy what I think is state of the art, I discover Creative now have this Audigy series, and the Live! series is old hat!

Robin

Reply 23 offered by: Will on 06-Feb-2002

Hmm, I'll just join in with this discussion..I have a Creative Vibra 128 which does the job though
I am considering getting a SB Live so I can play games...ect. with Chunk free sound. Whenever I play a big game, Wolfenstien, AVP2 and the other big games, I get chunky sound which kind of spoils the game for me.

Two quick questions:
How good is the SB Live. Is it worth it or should I go for a more recent one?
And does anyone know what I could do to improve my Vibra 128's sound? Like maybe dissabling the Legecy device in Device Manager or something?
Would bigger wavesets help? I've got 2,4 and 8mb ones at the moment, but only use the 8mb as "The bigger the Better" says. Can you get bigger wavesets for a Vibra 128? Where from ..ect..ect.?

Pls Hlp if you can, I'm dieing to play Games with Chunkless sound...
THANKS

Reply 24 offered by: Stephen Randall on 06-Feb-2002

I too have a Vibra 128. AFAIK there are no wavesets available other than the 2, 4 and 8 Mb varieties distributed with the card.

To improve the sound of NWC playback:

a) buy better speakers.

b) use a good soft synth - I tried some demo versions from the Yamaha web site and they were quite impressive. However, for my limited purposes (proof listening) it did not seem worth the expense of registering and they are now long past their use by date.

c) print the music and get a good band to play it.

HTH

Stephen


#1723: Sound Font Help
Sound Font Help

(1723)

Submitted by: Frank Colosa on 03-Sep-2000

I have a ESS1869 chipset in my soundcard. This under normal circumstances does not support soundfonts. But, when I recently installed Windows 2000 and listened to a MIDI, all the sounds were messed up. I checked the Multimedia settings in Control Panel, and I noticed that the preferred playback device was Microsoft GS Wavetable. It has bad (but not FM Synthesis bad) MIDI playback. I was wondering how that could be added to my soundcard like a soundfont. I tried using my normal playback device and it doesn't work. I went back to Windows 98 (I used dual boot) and everything was normal, and the GS Wavetable was gone. Does anyone know how Windows 2000 added a new Wavetable to my soundcard and if so how I can do that so I don't have to go buy another soundcard that is compatible with SoundFonts if I don't have to. Thank You.

Reply 1 offered by: Frank Colosa on 03-Sep-2000

By the way, if it wasn't clear, the Microsoft GS Wavetable was added with Windows 2000 and wasn't previously selectable.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Sep-2000

Windows did not really add a new wave table to your card. Rather, it established a new MIDI driver on your computer that behaves like a new MIDI device. This is a "virtual device" in that it only exists in computer software, not actually on your sound card. The driver then renders MIDI instructions, converting them to digital audio, which is then sent to the sound card for play back.

Does this answer your question?

Reply 3 offered by: Frank Colosa on 03-Sep-2000

Thank you for the response. It answered most of my question. I just was wondering if it is possible for me to find new such drivers as I haven't run across them before. If so, where?

Thank you again
-Frank Colosa

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Sep-2000

In your case, you are using one that comes with Windows 2000, but probably was licensed by Microsoft for inclusion in Windows. Various manufacturers offer software synthesizers, including Roland and Yamaha. Similar technology is also bundled with some cards, such as the SB Live.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Sep-2000

My guess is that the GS wavetable with W2K is similar, if not identical, to the wavetable used by MS's DirectMusic extension to DirectX. It's basically a simplified version of Roland's GS sounds, and it makes sense that they'd use these in W2K, having licensed them from Roland already for Dx6 and up.

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 03-Sep-2000

I liked the Yamaha software synthesizer while I had a trial version of it, but it expired and now I can't find out where to get it. Does anybody know where I can buy a copy?

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Sep-2000

Yamaha has been restructuring their site. New URL of the softsynth line is at:

http://www.yamaha-xg.com/ssynth/index.html

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Sep-2000

As a PS - I've found that even the lowest-requirement softsynth (S-YG20) is "chunky" in NWC, even on a fast computer, leaving drop-outs especially during screen refreshes but also at other times. Yet it works fine with midi players, leaving about 90% system resources idle (on an AMD K6/500, playing a midi with six tracks) according to Wintop.

The problem happens in Player also, but it appears to be less pronounced.

Anyone have any solutions to this?

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Sep-2000

This is probably caused by the note chase that both products do while playing. We are considering an option that turns this off when play back quality is the priority.

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Sep-2000

Yes, turning off the note chase would be a welcome option, especially since it can be confusing when using soft synths, due to the inherent latency (even using DirectSound the playback delay is noticable).

Reply 11 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Sep-2000

Last weekend I upgraded my son's computer.
I added a Compaq business sound card which came with the ESS1869 drivers.
When it was installed it ALSO accessed the MS/Roland wavetable.
The card itself was so quiet it was next to useless (no diagnostic software provided) so I payed the difference and changed it for an SB16 which was satisfactory (for my son's purposes that is - head-banging techno!).

Now - I've found the folder containing the Win/Roland dls but I cant find a way to reinstall it.
Can anyone help? - Is it specific only to this soundcard.

On the same lines - I have DirectX 7 installed on my computer and can playback using the DX7 wavetable using a little Direct Music player Fred suggested and the Direct Music Producer.
Is there any way to access this wavetable through Windows Multimedia Player or through the control panel?
It doesn't appear among the devices!
I cant find the dls in a search of my system but it's obviously there.

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Sep-2000

Barry - I can't help out with your install problem. I've only recently (and with great trepidation) installed the most stable version of W95 I could find (OSR 2.5) and won't be ready for W2K for at least two more generations of "new bugs for old" :)

But on the DirectMusic scene: the "drivers" for DM-midi are imbedded deep within the operating system itself, which is presumably why you can't uninstall DX7.0a once installed. It therefore doesn't show up as an available device in your midi mapper (or anywhere else for that matter). I suspect that the GS midi driver in W2K is precisely the same set of wavetables (or very similar) to the DX7 ones, so if you can get the GS thingie working again you should be home free.

I've requested DX7 DirectMusic support from my two favourite software companies: NoteWorthy Software and VanBasco Software to include DirectMusic support in future product updates; the response from both was essentially, "Well, we'll see..." My main reason for requesting it was that I was working on a game project where such a facility would have been really handy; does anyone else out there have similar needs or wants?

Reply 14 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Sep-2000

Throughout my adventures of installing Windows 95/98/2000 on a variety of equipment, I have noticed that the MS software synth is only installed for some sound cards. This might have something to do with MS licensing, but I am not sure. I do not know how to get it to install in the general case, only with specific sound cards. Maybe someone else knows if it can be done...

Reply 15 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Sep-2000

Thanks Fred and Eric,

I finally found the dls buried deep in the System32 folder.
It only appeared as a midi mapper option after installing the Ess card - since uninstalling this card it doesn't appear.

The dls is still available to the Direct Music player and DM producer.
What surprises me is that it is not available as an option for the Win Mediaplayer via the Midi Planner.

Reply 16 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 17 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 10-Sep-2000

My advice... Don't get Win2k, get WinMe (millenium edition) It should be out soon. I only have it because it comes on new Gateway computers! (I also have an SBLive! value soundcard too!)

Long live DOS!


#1724: Adding two notes without chord member command
Adding two notes without chord member command

(1724)

Submitted by: Paulo J. M. Menegaz on 03-Sep-2000

Please help me.
I'm trying to add more than one note at the same position (time) and at the same staff without using the chord member command. (The other notes are a kind of second answer to the main score)
I've seen many files (.NWC) on the NET like this, but I couldn't find how to do that.
If you know, please tell me.
Thanks...

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Sep-2000

If you want more than one note at the same time position in the same staff, then the only way to do it is with the chord member command.

If you are willing to use more than one staff, then staff layering can also be used to accomplish this.


#1725: Everything's blank after installing 1.70!!
Everything's blank after installing 1.70!!

(1725)

Submitted by: Taylor Anderson on 04-Sep-2000

I've been a long-time Noteworthy user, and love the package. I was so excited this morning to finally install 1.70 and try the new features, but after installing it, I went to open a song and ALL of the staves are blank!

The really strange part is that if I PLAY the song, **IT'S ALL THERE.** FOr some reason, nothing shows up at all.

I tried creating a new song, but new notes don't appear, either.

HELP!

--Taylor

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Sep-2000

see msg #1643 especially Noteworthy Support's replies.


#1726: convert cd to mp3
convert cd to mp3

(1726)

Submitted by: izea on 04-Sep-2000

Is there a way to convert songs on a cd to mp3 so that I can file them in my hard drive for an unlimited amout of time?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Sep-2000

Yes. You need a CD ripper and an mp3 encoder. My favourites (both freeware / cardware) are Exact Audio Copy (eac) -- a very accurate ripper http://www.ExactAudioCopy.de/ and BladeEnc -- a very accurate mp3 encoder, especially at higher bitrates (better fidelity). Because of copyright insecurities in some countries, the executables aren't available at his home page (though the source files are); but you can get the Windows executable BladeEnc082.zip from http://home.swipnet.se/~w-82625/skeleton/DL.html -- then go to Tord's homepage at http://home.swipnet.se/~w-82625/default.htm for further information, and to pick up a Windows frontend if you don't like command-line programs. The one I use (and like) is BladeBatch by Eugene Loginov.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 05-Sep-2000

Also look at http://www.musicmatch.com/. Process is pretty simple and automatic. The freeware version is "near CD" quality. The small fee for an upgrade gets one to CD quality. (Of course, "near CD" quality is pretty good and occupies less space on your hard drive).

Reply 3 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 01-Apr-2001

> ñk-ñjkñ-

Ben de seni!


#1727: How I can add beats...
How I can add beats...

(1727)

Submitted by: Early on 04-Sep-2000

How I can add to my song some beats, such a drum, or another sound without melody, y cannot add of the editor, are other sj of make this?

The Note Worthy is excelent tanks by a lot of work.

Reply 1 offered by: subminiature pcb relay on 04-Sep-2000

check out the samples in the sample directory. there is also a percussion demo on the user scriptorium. you can also record a midi drum track and import it to see the pitches for the sounds


#1728: How about this for a wish: lyrics that sing!
How about this for a wish: lyrics that sing!

(1728)

Submitted by: Clive on 06-Sep-2000

I noticed that there is software around for turning written text into spoken words. Is there any chance NWC version X could include software which "pronounces" and "sings" lyrics to tune? Hey, how about say an Elvis voice or perhaps even a Pavarotti?

Reply 1 offered by: Eric James on 06-Sep-2000

What a neat idea! I wonder, though, what people normally choose as a "voice" for their vocal lines.

Reply 2 offered by: fugit ishuo on 06-Sep-2000

I either just sing with the music,
in which case I mute the melody line but follow it as it plays.
Otherwise I or use the best instruments for my sound card.
Organs are usually fair as are strings.
I consider the suggestion of yours very futuristic.
I would like basic features such as chord splitting and percussion tracks.
Also, one function that I require often in my compositions is single line staffs.
I have grown up with these at school and orchestra.
It would be expected for timpani, triangle and other instruments, also for many ethnic instruments which I usually am writing the music down for.
Could you consider these things please? I would much appreciate these things to do in the program otherwise is there a better program you suggest to me?
Thank you

ISHUO

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Sep-2000

"Singing Lyrics" in various voices (and languages) are available already with other software. I have a demo on a different product that I rarely use because I prefer NWC. But here's the catch: It seems that "singing lyrics" is VERY, VERY hardware intensive. Big memory, high speed, top end. I can't imagine that would be a useful addition to NWC even though it would be nice. Every product has its niche.

Reply 4 offered by: John Gillings on 06-Sep-2000

Will it come with a free bucket? ;-)

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 06-Sep-2000

I use "choir ahs," which sounds fairly good on a modern midrange sound card, but appears to be an alias for "untuned buzz saw" on my 6-year-old el cheapo card.

"Voice ohs" retains something of the timbre of the lumbermill even on my newer card.

This doesn't get enunciated words, of course.

If you must try to do _that_ on the cheap, it seems to me that you could go a long way playing clever games with a syllabary encoded in a sound font. (The old sweat-vs-money tradeoff...)

Reply 6 offered by: Robin Withey on 07-Sep-2000

Yes, as someone else said, nice idea, but the effort involved has to make it a low priority.

Robin Withey

Reply 7 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 09-Sep-2000

Guys and gals, we can't even get the mid-range soundcards to produce a decent rhythm guitar sound - make them sing???? I honestly don't think it's gonna be anything appreciable. Plus it will need a bucket...

Reply 8 offered by: David Potvin on 14-Nov-2000

8-() Dudes, I've seen a lot of weird things in my time, but this - wow - is really going over the top!

First of all, we've got the synthesizers, in order to replace instruments we can't get for performing live...

Second, we've got the sequencers, in order to make them play the right thing at the right time - as if live musicians couldn't!...

Third, we've got smaplers, in order to fine-tune the quality of the sounds we create for the two latter...

AND NOW, YOU WANT TO REPLACE THE SINGERS?!? 8-)

Come on, dudes, there are a lot of things we need to work on already on this program before we replace Helmut Lotti with our Sound-Blaster, no?

So let's write, and let's keep live performing to those who are going to READ the charts we print! Okey-dokey?

Reply 9 offered by: Art Thompson on 14-Nov-2000

Agreed. But just for fun, someone should create a sound font that sounds like Charlie Browns' parents. Wah wuh wah wah wah wuh.

Reply 10 offered by: Grant on 14-Nov-2000

I find you can get a reasonable facsimile of this by using the trombone patch with pitch bends.

Reply 11 offered by: Joe Music on 14-Nov-2000

Besides NWC, I own another music program created by a company in Frnace. It has "singing lyrics" in either French or English.

To me (Je ne parle qu'un peu de francais) the French "singing" sounds great, but the English "singing" sounds awful.

Reply 12 offered by: Clive on 14-Nov-2000

Yeah, it was just a fun post! I have a shareware program called "Willow Talk" which dictates aloud written documents; not totally convincing but lots of fun and very useful when I am too lazy to read stuff, especially work-related academic (boring) papers.

I am a fan of Schubert Lieder hence you could appreciate how neat it would be to have some of these NWC's file actually sung! "Leise flehen, meine Lieder..." bla, bla, bla!

I am going to make a silly prediction: NWC will have such a function by 2010! Hehehe...

In the meantime, how about hidden slurs - pretty please!

Yours, Clive


#1729: NWC developer network?
NWC developer network?

(1729)

Submitted by: ah choo on 06-Sep-2000

I have a suggestion and would like your and Noteworthy's comment on it...

I would like to propose that we organize a group of noteworthy users to act as researcher-developers to speed up development time for the features on the drawing board.

They would of course have to sign a confidentiality agreement (and of course have programming skills in psuedo code or plain code).

See, there are many features that users have developed but they haven't yet been integrated into the software. For example, people have written code for chord splitting and drum tracks yet it's not in the software and I suspect some users would forfeit those things because it's not easily accessible.

I believe that something like a NWC developer network would facilitate development by a large factor. Additionally it would give the company more time for sales and customer service. I believe that with a notch up in development Noteworthy will become the industry workhorse for musical notation.

Reply 1 offered by: Robin Withey on 07-Sep-2000

Hmm.. not sure about this one. I'd certainly like to get hold of details of the file format at least, so I could fix things like MIDI import handling triplets properly (HINT, HINT!). On the other hand, this is a shareware product, not open source. Noteworthy do want to make money out of it (and they deserve to!). There's also the problem of quality control. If every Tom, Dick or Harry had the opportunity to mess with the code, testing the mods becomes that much more complicated.

So, on balance, nice idea, but I can't see Noteworthy going for it, for perfectly valid reasons.

Robin Withey

Reply 2 offered by: ah choo on 07-Sep-2000

>>>On the other hand, this is a shareware product, not open source.

Wasn't suggesting open source. Was suggesting that applications for sidemen developers be taken, so that there's a bigger group of guys doing the groundwork for features on the wish-list.

>>>> Noteworthy do want to make money out of it (and they deserve to!). There's also the problem of quality control. If every Tom, Dick or Harry had the opportunity to mess with the code, testing the mods becomes that much more complicated.

yada.
tom, dick and harry is your invention.
I want to know that the company has an ongoing development so that they can better grant some customer needs, and this was a suggestion to that end.
if it were volunteer based this would not impact on the price, and there are users who have skills and can contribute.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 07-Sep-2000

Not being a software developer, I wouldn't know. But...
Would it be possible for NWC to enable "plug-ins"? Those of you who use a product such as Adobe Photoshop know what I mean. A better analogy would be sound fonts for sound cards.
Unless I miss my guess, though, adding a plug-in feature to NWC might be a major coding change, or cause more headaches than it's worth.

Reply 4 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 09-Sep-2000

Not a bad idea at all I say. Although I doubt the extent to which it will all remain voluntary, when NWC picks up and starts being more successful. Okay, at that level NWA could pay, but, lets get there first.

As for plugins, I think it can all get way too messy from a compatibility point of view - MIDI isn't as simple as graphics. One plugin will work with my card but possibly not with yours. Plus added costs for the user. I think the first idea is more viable. As for open source... Naaah...

But judging from the absence of a NWS reply, I guess sneeze cast the cube...

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 10-Sep-2000

It takes a lot of time to get a new developer up to speed and to evaluate and integrate the results, so the work done is not "free". Then there is the risk of the volunteer developer not finishing the job successfully, or letting the source code get loose on the net.

Plug-ins would take a re-write of the product, so that approach is definitely not worth it.

Maybe there is a way of licensing the source code so that only Noteworthy can sell the product, sort of a restricted open-source. Even then, there is a lot of co-ordination (to prevent people wasting their time duplicating work) and integration of people's submissions. All a big risk. Look at the Mozilla (Netscape 6) effort - it has taken an awful long time and the result is still very buggy. There is a lot to be said for a small, tight software team. In my experience productivity declines exponentially with the number of developers on a project.

I am pretty sure that, right or wrong, our role in the product is not going to change very much.

Reply 6 offered by: ferguson on 11-Sep-2000

> It takes a lot of time to get a new developer up to speed > and to evaluate and integrate the
> results, so the work done is not "free".

Volunteer work is not free? :-)

> Then there is the risk of the volunteer developer not
> finishing the job successfully, or letting the source code > get loose on the net.

Then there is also the equally damaging risk of the space shuttle crashing into the noteworthy building. :-)

> Plug-ins would take a re-write of the product, so that
> approach is definitely not worth it.

Agreed!

> Maybe there is a way of licensing the source code so that > only Noteworthy can sell the
> product, sort of a restricted open-source. Even then, there is a lot of co-ordination (to prevent
> people wasting their time duplicating work) and integration of people's submissions. All a big
> risk. Look at the Mozilla (Netscape 6) effort - it has taken an awful long time and the result is
> still very buggy. There is a lot to be said for a small, tight software team.

Agreed. However isn't noteworthy's current development team comprised of... 1? Wouldn't another person increase work done by 75%-100%? This has been my experience.
I also think it's time for noteworthy to go into the next gear and be more focused on current needs of notation software. I mean, they could be writing web browser player plugins (ala nw player) and a hundred other user wants isntead of us hanging on for basics like chord splitting, staff merging and drum notation.

Reply 7 offered by: ah choo on 11-Sep-2000

<<<<<<<<<< Then there is the risk of the volunteer developer not finishing the job successfully, or letting the source code get loose on the net. >>>>>>>>>

To me the addition of features by volunteers would be at a lower level, ie, psuedo code, stand-alone code or with the core libraries of noteworthy that are totally useless on their own. Work could be assigned component based - "okay steve, here's the noteworthy file format, write a noteworthy player screensaver."

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Sep-2000

The key, then, to either after-market plugins or add-ons, or to proprietary additions written by outside programmers, would be the release of the nwc file format. Or rather, all of the file formats; this has changed over the versions and any new software would presumably have to be reverse-compatible to earlier file formats. If NoteWorthy Software were to take this option, it would be a bold step indeed, and as far as I know a "first" for the industry. Such an action could well be the proverbial double-edged sword, in the sense that purveyors of other softwares could use NWC-file importability as a selling feature for their products. OTOH, it could mean increased sales of NW Composer. All in all, it's a decision I'm glad I don't have to make...

Reply 9 offered by: Dave Seidel on 11-Sep-2000

As I said in a reply posted earlier today in the "NWC on Linux???" thread, I'd to be able to use NWC as the front end to Lilypond (http://www.lilypond.org), which is a very interesting and powerful text-based language for typesetting music, and is free (as in GNU) software. NWC is far superior to any notation editor available on Linux, and I doubt that will change anytime soon.

The key to doing anytthing like this is to have the NWC file format spec, so that tools can be written to translate between the different formats.

Reply 10 offered by: ah choo on 11-Sep-2000

Okay then.
I ask...

Is Noteworthy just going to play the home market and support with one developer...
OR...
get 1 or more programmmer(s), developer network or other plan to bring the software to the next level?

Until they get drums and other basic features that the other programs have, I believe that Noteworthy will primarily remain a beginner/amateur tool. (it's just not equipped for the music industry yet)

Additionally, the benefit is that by the addition of more functionality, Noteworthy will become the first choice for the professional and home musician/composer alike. Let's say that the improved Noteworthy sells for $40 with the same or better features as Program X that sells for $120. Wouldn't this scenario be equally beneficial to:
1. Noteworthy
2. The current customer base
3. The new customers as a result of development

What do you think?

As a separate suggestion:
Another alternative would be to develop a "professional" edition which has far more advanced features. Add drums to the current version and it can be the workhorse for years to come while you develop the pro version.

I would love to know what Noteworthy's wishes are. If they aren't interested then those who feel like I do are barking up the wrong tree. If they give us an idea of what they would like to do, it will help us ALL to suggest the right things in the future! Please work with us!

Thank you.

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Sep-2000

"...Until they get drums and other basic features that the other programs have, I believe that Noteworthy will primarily remain a beginner/amateur tool. (it's just not equipped for the music industry yet)..."

That could easily be taken as an insult by anyone -- like myself -- who is not a beginner/amateur and considers NWC to be entirely adequate. And which music industry? 90% of the work I do doesn't even involve drums, and that which does uses the virtual drummer in my synth. It's a lot more polite.

Reply 12 offered by: jorge mejian on 12-Sep-2000

okay people who need drums, SPEAK UP!!!
I JUST CAN'T WAIT ANY LONGER

Reply 13 offered by: arova on 12-Sep-2000

WHoaw, Fred, from reading your stuff for a while I thought you were positive towards the addition of new features but this is a back step for you.

And why must people quote the little bit they don't like?? Why can't you agree on anything the others say? This seems to be a habit from people who use usenet, always bickering and carrying on - saying what they want and stamping their name on it!! :-) :-)

But, I digress...

I reckon the drum notation is as important as the treble clef. Most performed music has drums - drummers don't always improvise, many of them can read and make arrangements work quite well... why ridicule the importance of drum notation?

Re the people who use Noteworthy:
What do the gigging musicians think about how fundamental it is to be able to notate drum tracks properly? What do the band directors think about how fundamental it is to be able to notate drum tracks properly? What do the college music students think about how fundamental it is to be able to notate drum tracks properly? And the arrangers? And the composers?

(so really, just because you use synthetic sampled [non-musician] sounds, doesn't mean the program can't be patched to allow music to be written for real drummers.) Drummers exist in most every live band!

And I agree with one of the above, why won't noteworthy say anything? Please these guys are beggin' you.

This has kinda deviated a bit but I agree about whether Noteworthy is going to a remain in the backwoods. Are they looking at development or still sitting on their laurels with occasional walks to the coffee machine? Just because Fred Nachbaur can do without drum notation doesn't mean the program can't have it. In fact, if it doesn't, and Noteworthy doesn't give me a hint soon, I know what to do with some moeny I lately scored.

ps: i'd never record in a studio that didn't work with real drums -- that'd be a joke.

Reply 14 offered by: Stephen Randall on 12-Sep-2000

Ah Choo writes: "Until they get drums and other basic features that the other programs have, I believe that Noteworthy will primarily remain a beginner/amateur tool. (it's just not equipped for the music industry yet)"

There is a lot to be said for a "beginner/amateur tool". There are a lot of us beginners and amateurs around.

When I bought NWC V1.30 I was highly delighted with its capabilities and thought it excellent value for money. Since then, at no extra cost to me, all sorts of extra functions and capabilities have been added. But also my capabilites and need for functions have increased. There are now some areas where my ambition outstrips NWC's capabilities (notably n-tuplets, percussion notation, comprehensive control over part extraction from scores) and as features get added I see new possibilities for further enhancement. However, that does not mean that its value for money has decreased in any way - NWC still does what it did when I bought it ... and more ... and it isn't costing me anything.

The decision I (and other users) have to make is - do I stay with NWC and hope it will catch up with my ambitions or do I pay £(insert large number here) to get another piece of software that caters for my every need?

The answer to that depends on how much I value my hobby. At present my answer is: not enough to warrant buying more software. I can live with NWC's current limitations (but I hope they will be overcome). Other users may place different values on these things.

If NWC turns into a full-feature/high-cost package in its next incarnation (V2.0?) - well, it just goes on the list with other similar packages that I might buy if I win the lottery. If it turns into a full-feature/low-cost package - well, hip-hip hooray! my order is on its way.

It is nice to be able to express our opinions on how NWC should develop and to nudge Eric into whatever direction we feel most useful but we need to recognise that when we bought whatever version of NWC we have, we made a judgement that it was worth what we paid - the trial version doesn't hide any of the shortcomings. The subsequent ZERO COST enhancements are pure bunce. For what it is worth, my opinion is that NWC's main distinguishing characteristic is its low cost. I hope that it will maintain this so that it will continue to allow amateurs like me to dabble and improve. It is nice to know that pros like Fred can get such good results with the same tool.

Returning to the subject of whether volunteer developers would be a Good Thing. Maybe they would, but there is a big risk that they could be a Bad Thing. We have the evidence of Eric's good work to date that he can cut the mustard. Suppose coding your pet wish gets allocated to a.n.o. volunteer developer who is keen but incompetent, or competent but finds it difficult to give the unpaid work any priority. I don't suggest that the would-be volunteers who have contributed to this thread fall into either category - but who would select the volunteer developers (how much more difficult is it to refuse an offer of free help than to sack someone?) Who would manage the volunteers? Who would resolve disputes? Eric could end up spending so much time chasing volunteers that he has no time to do the development himself.

I suggest that we maintain our patience, continue to nag Eric (with dollops of good humour attached) to add the enhancements we personally wish for, and promote the sales of NWC to others so that if Eric needs help he will be making enough money to employ a dozen software engineers.

Stephen Randall

Reply 15 offered by: R C Vanderburgh on 12-Sep-2000

I'm with Fred (Reply 11). I use NWC a lot in my piano teaching, and don't need special drum notation nor other non-classical specialties.

Reply 16 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Sep-2000

The issue I had with the previous post was the exact statement referenced. I have no disagreement with the rest of the post; if all of us started posting about everything with which we agreed, every thread would become even longer than the now-famous "midi to mp3" thread.

I also am not opposed to progress and improvement. It comes down to priorities; for some, the highest priority is n-tuplet handling, for others it's drum notation. It also has to do with attitude - if someone were to request something from me personally, that would have a better chance of success than if it were phrased as a demand containing hidden threats (if you don't... then I will...).

Finally, I'd like to point out that at the Selkirk College Professional Music Program (an offshoot of Berklee School of Music) here in town, drummers are taught to read standard musical notation in addition to the specialised "drum" notation. I showed one of my scores with drum notation processed using Barry Graham's "Drumkit" program to the drum instructor, who assured me that any professional drummer would be able to read it. Given that, I'm not inclined to add my voice to the demand for special drumhead shapes, or other shaped notes for that matter.

Reply 17 offered by: Grant on 12-Sep-2000

Regular readers of thie forum won't be surprised that I'm with Fred on this one, for what it's worth.

Might I also mention that references to "the music industry" make my skin crawl? As though music were something to be cranked out on a production line like hot dogs or minivans. Ye gods.

Reply 18 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 12-Sep-2000

Fred has a good point, as usual.

As someone who used to work in marketing (not sales) in an industry note related to music, I would note this general principle: Don't spray-paint an orange yellow in hopes of competing against a banana. And, just because someone already has a banana, that doesn't mean an orange wouldn't be a nice complement.

Reply 19 offered by: ah choo on 12-Sep-2000

"I would note this general principle: Don't spray-paint an orange yellow in hopes of competing
against a banana. And, just because someone already has a banana, that doesn't mean an
orange wouldn't be a nice complement."

okay, re the drum notation... all I'm asking for is a some cream with my banana - I can't afford the orange. give me drum notation or give me death!

Reply 20 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Sep-2000

Well, death is inevitable. Drum notation, OTOH, is optional.
We can only hope for you that you'll get the latter before the former.

Reply 21 offered by: ah choo on 13-Sep-2000

Might I also mention that references to "the music industry" make my skin crawl? As though
music were something to be cranked out on a production
line like hot dogs or minivans. Ye
gods.

well, well well Grant! our experiences differ! most musician/composers I'm aware of and work with all have been very creative musically, writing things all the time. if you want to complain about people churning out music Beethoven and Bach must have been the biggest crooks at that game. :) might I mention that Noteworthy is ideal for the musician who needs to notate music quickly for arrangement, transposition or transcription - it's so handy - I see nothing wrong with writing lots of perfectly good music. (to re-assure I'm not talking about what is perceived as mainstream music - britney spears, et al)

i was talking about the music industry I work in, as a songwriter and studio musician (jazz and live recorded pop music - swing, ska, rock). it's not unusual for me to notate several songs in a week. as a writer I have to cultivate the creative writing process by writing whenever I feel that I have to. (not writing by default, altho I can work out arrangements when i'm not feeling overly creative) my main instruments are piano, keyboards and drums - I really would like to be able to notate a drum track in noteworthy, even if only to reference it in performance.

I'm all for the incredible benefit Noteworthy is to students -- indeed, it's the best one out there for that. i'm just suggesting that those extra key features will give noteworthy that much more prominence, without any alteration to the interface. (my attitude was initally eager suggestion, not a begging plea! I was after some feedback, also from Noteworthy)
additionally, because noteworthy is quite good at what it does I'm convinced that it has much more potential than it is capable of at the mo'. at the rate it's going i imagine many potential customers are passing it by.
so n-tuplets and drum notation it is! when are the completions dates Noteworthy? October for drums? November for n-tuplets? (feedback to that would certainly re-assure me and allow me to confidentally recommend it)

ah choo

Reply 22 offered by: ah choo on 13-Sep-2000

<<<<<< Well, death is inevitable. Drum notation, OTOH, is optional. We can only hope for you that you'll get the latter before the former. >>>>>>

hehehehe :-) that all depends on Noteworthy

Reply 23 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Sep-2000

Way back in reply #5 I said it was unlikely we could use plug-ins. As pointed out by subsequent threads, that is not true - the NWC file can be treated as an interface for plug-ins. It would take some effort (but I think not a lot) to document the file format, but the benefit is that people could write extensions without further involvement from Noteworthy. Useful extensions would be a better Midi import, and a NIFF import so we can make better use of scanning software. I am sure people would come up with other goodies.

I can't see how it could hurt business, unless there is a better program we should all be using but don't only because we are stuck with all our NWC files. I don't think that is the case! Being able to export to other programs would increase the appeal of Noteworthy Composer.


#1730: Triplet bracket placement
Triplet bracket placement

(1730)

Submitted by: David Ripley on 08-Sep-2000

What sets the baseline for the placement of the triplet bracket? When note stems go up well beyond the staff, the bracket will move up automatically, but when the notes are low, it won't go down beyond a certain point.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Sep-2000

I assume by your question that your scenario involves notes with the stem going up. As you move the notes downward, the triplet bracket will move down with the stem tips. If you go down far enough, the stems will start getting longer, so that they comply with the standard that requires the stems to extend up to the staff center line. The triplet bracket will, therefore, always appear in the same place, above the stem tips.


#1731: Chord member insertion
Chord member insertion

(1731)

Submitted by: Mark Harris on 10-Sep-2000

I have been using Noteworthy since the beginning. When I upgraded to 1.70 released version, I no longer can use control+enter to insert a chord member note. What am I doing wrong? Help!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Sep-2000

That functionality remains identical in the new release. The only times I've run into difficulties with this feature is when I've to chord different durations with the same stem directions, etc. To put it very basically:

1: If using the same stem direction, only notes of the same duration can be chorded.

1a: If the notes have the same duration, you can choose either the same or opposing stem directions.

2: If chords containing different durations are needed, you have to use opposite stem directions.

The other possibility I can think of is that you have some other object between the note you're trying to chord, and the insertion point. The insertion point (cursor) has to be immediately to the right of the note.

Reply 2 offered by: Mark Harris on 10-Sep-2000

Fred,
Thanks for the reply but these are not the case. I know and undersand all that you have stated (they're also pretty lear in the Help iles). I can insert a chord member if I use the menu command but it's like my control key is disabled on my keyboard. I haven't doe anything except upgrade Noteworthy.
Any other suggestions?

Reply 3 offered by: Artur on 10-Sep-2000

Some keyboards use this system:
One Ctrl key is for Control
The other is for Control Grand.
I don't know if this is of any help, but maybe Nwc accept this keys differently.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Sep-2000

Mark - please don't take this the wrong way, it's certainly not intended as a criticism... I'm just wondering if maybe there isn't something wrong with your keyboard; your last post has several missing letters, in an otherwise perfectly spelled post.

Reply 5 offered by: Mark Harris on 10-Sep-2000

Fred,

No offense taken. In my rush I didn't even re-read my responce. The missing letters are just operator error (typing too fast for my abilities!)I thought of the keyboard 2nd and tried an older one I have. It didn't seem to matter.
I also tried the 2nd control key, to no correction. I think there must be some change to my config file - control + C is no longer copying and control + V lo longer pastes. Again, this was working until my upgrade. I'm at a loss and not too great with 98 and config.sys. Any more help would be appreciated.

Reply 6 offered by: bluey on 11-Sep-2000

this happened to me when i installed 1.70. I can't remember what i did but i got it sorted pretty quickly. try messing around with the options, thats probably what i did, i just cant remember.

good luck with it.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Sep-2000

NWC does not offer any function or mechanism where you can disable the keyboard shortcuts. This mechanism has not ever been altered in NWC, although additional shortcut have obviously been added. NWC uses the standard Windows procedure for implementing the shortcuts, and has done so since it was first released.

Do the keyboard shortcuts still work in the older version of NWC? What version were you using prior to upgrading to version 1.70? What else has changed on your computer?

Reply 8 offered by: Mark Harris on 24-Sep-2000

Everyone,
Thanks for the help. It ends up that my keyboard IS the culprit. Only the control key functions are the issue. I replaced it and all is well. Thanks all for the support.

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Sep-2000

Thanks for following up.


#1732: 1.70 review.
1.70 review.

(1732)

Submitted by: william cootz on 10-Sep-2000

i was disappointed to find that in version 1.70 the most terribly frustrating thing for me hasn't been fixed -that when you click the preview tab in page setup you lose the contents tab. i hate that so much it slows me down 5 seconds every time i print out a different part. in fact can you make the page setup so i can change the size but not let me make it too big. i hate the little arrow.

i like the right click to enter a note. can you also make a note menu so i can choose quaver or crochet etc. i would like that. also I'm not sure about up and down arrows to select a channel number in properties - i like a selection list with all the numbers i can see at once.

otherwise i am happy. i have upgraded from version 1.4 or 1.5 i'm not sure. but it looks nice and the preview screen is much improved.

however, i still cannot use noteworthy as my sole notation program. i have also purchased another program for around the same price because it does drum notation. it's interface is not good and it has much fewer features. i was surprised not to find drum notation in the noteworthy program yet. is this an oversight on your behalf? i don't understand the difficulty.
why can't you add a drum icon so when i click enter to enter a note the note has a drum head?
i also found the import much improved, it understands my midi imports much better and i am grateful. i have had no problems with my last lot of work. (however i can't print it in noteworthy because i cant print the drum parts and i don't want my parts to look different, and i also want to print a conductor score for the percussion parts but this is not going to happen)

Reply 1 offered by: John on 10-Sep-2000

I've been waiting for drum notation since 1996.

Reply 2 offered by: Carl Bangs on 15-Sep-2000

I had the same problem until I realized that the slider underneath in that window scolls back and forth sideways, and there is no a problem at all.

The other day I wondered what had happened to my hidden notation until I noticed that I had made it the same color of gray as the background.

Duh!

Carl


#1733: staff titles
staff titles

(1733)

Submitted by: bluey on 11-Sep-2000

how do you put in the titles of the staff.

like this (Guitar)- Then the staff here

i've seen it in Fred Nachbaur's songs. its driving me crazy trying to figure this out

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 11-Sep-2000

Go to file, page setup and enable staff labels (several choices)

Then right click on the staff to get to the "properties" box and type in the name of the staff.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Sep-2000

In some of Fred's songs, I think he also uses a unique trick using the Insert | Text Expression tool, combined with rightward justification and Preserve Width disabled.


#1734: GM Drums
GM Drums

(1734)

Submitted by: Jane Billing on 12-Sep-2000

How do I get GM Drum note map into Noteworthy so that I can access and use the individual drums sounds, i.e. congas, shakers etc? All the patch maps go up to 127 but not beyond. GM drum sounds start at 160. I have tried copying the ini files from another music program into Noteworthy but still can't access these sounds. I am a Latin player and NEED them! Anyone advise, Snedgear can you answer this!!!
Jane

Reply 1 offered by: LOCOBOY on 12-Sep-2000

AREN'T THE CONGAS AND STUFF IN THE D TO G AREA ABOVE MIDDLE C? I GUESS IT DEPENDS ON YOUR SYNTH OR SOUND CARD. MY ROLAND HAS THEM IN THE AREA I SAID ABOVE. I WOULD LIKE THE DRUMS TO LOOK LIKE DRUM MARKS AND NOT NOTES TOO

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Sep-2000

This is hardware dependent, but the fundamentals apply to all devices. The general MIDI specification only allows for 128 (0-127) patches. Some keyboards and things will internally number their instrument sound banks. Do not confuse these numeric assignments with general MIDI patch numbers. If you have a drum kit numbered 160, you would have to select it in a different fashion via the MIDI standard. Some allow drum kit changes by selecting different patches on channel 10. Check your hardware's documentation for how to do it with your equipment.

Reply 3 offered by: Jane Billing on 13-Sep-2000

Thanks for the quick replies, chaps. Unfortunately, SoundblasterLive doesn't provide any documentation. One has to rely on whether or not someone has answered questions in their forum. However, I will look for patches in channel 10. What I need to know is can Noteworthy software can support General Midi drums if I find a source to download?
Jane.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Sep-2000

A great resource is the sample file "drumref.nwc" that comes with the product in the "samples" directory. It tells you which notes to use for which sound.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 13-Sep-2000

Well, the SBLive has a large amount of functionality. For starters, you should work with the default MIDI channel 10 drum sounds. The sample file drumref.nwc will introduce you to these sounds. Once you get used to working with these sounds, you can try branching out into all of the additional sounds you can get out of your card.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 13-Sep-2000

Then you can start exploring new capabilities by visiting http://www.soundblaster.com/resources/

Reply 7 offered by: Jane Billing on 14-Sep-2000

Thanks again for your replies chaps. I'm not concerned about drum notes on the staves as I am well trained in music and it doesn't bother me. I will try the file route to see what sounds there are. Despite this problem I have still managed to produce a stonking backing track!!
Jane

Reply 8 offered by: Art thompson on 15-Sep-2000

Whatever a stonking backing track is, I'd sure love to hear it !


#1735: need to know a notation symbol
need to know a notation symbol

(1735)

Submitted by: need Help.... on 13-Sep-2000

Hi!

I need some help on the NComposer... i have no clue how to do this " { "symbol its used on a piano chord and i don't even know what its called.
and i need it to complet a music sheet i'm doing.
please e-mail me if you know what i'm talking about and/or know what commands are to do that note.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 13-Sep-2000

Get the Boxmark2 font at http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Fonts and insert your symbol as text.


#1736: Illustration for workbook
Illustration for workbook

(1736)

Submitted by: nancy on 13-Sep-2000

Need a piano keyboard graphic for illustration in workbook. Can anyone help? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Sep-2000

Here's one I just ran into a couple days ago, and dug out of my history list:

http://www.shirleykaiser.com/skimages/misc/


#1737: special notations
special notations

(1737)

Submitted by: raymond stoll on 14-Sep-2000

Hello folks,

I've been dabbling a bit with Composer trying out some things, doing exercises, and looking at others people's composer works, and I have been delighted with what I have found so far. I haven't been trained musically but I have been interested in the study of music for a long time.

I was exploring the resources Composer has including the boxmarks font which somebody recently wrote about here in this forum. I imagine that the people credited with the font are users of the software and this is encouraging.

As an example, I used the font in Microsoft Word and typed out characters to see what they were. I found that they were all recognizable symbols. But I couldn't find how to add them to my music in Composer. They weren't under any of the menus or buttons. Do I have to buy this font? Will it work with the registered version?

Thank you for you efforts.

ray

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Sep-2000

Ray, the boxmarks font includes instructions on how to use it in the ZIP file. This, and other fonts, can be used in NWC by:

1) installing them on your system
2) in NWC, select a font in the File | Page Setup | Fonts area, specifically User 1 though 6
3) use symbols from the font via the Insert | Text Expression

You can find other fonts at the user sponsored NWC scriptorium ( http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ )


#1738: Copy from Print Preview
Copy from Print Preview

(1738)

Submitted by: Art thompson on 14-Sep-2000

I was a little dismayed that the "copy as" .BMP option is unavailable in 32 bit. Why? WMF files are poorly supported in Win 9x, except as part of a clip file. Still, I found a great piece of freeware that views and converts these files effectively: http://softwarecenter.net/irfanview/

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 14-Sep-2000

Welcome to the party! Yes, the File>Print Preview>Copy to placeable WMF works with Irfan View (this topic arises every few months).

You should also know that the WMF can probably be opened and edited (visually, not musically) with a good drawing program, if you happen to have one. That's because the WMF is inherently more like a drawing file than like a paint (BMP) file.

If a BMP or GIF is what you want, you can do it via WMF/Irfan View, or Print-to-file via Ghostscript/Ghostview. See the Noteworthy archives for lots of discussion.

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 20-Sep-2000

Still waiting for our friendly sponsor to weigh in on this one. Why can't I have a Bitmap?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Sep-2000

The bitmap option is not supported in the 32-bit edition of NWC Print Preview Copy.

See also: msg #140

Reply 4 offered by: Paul C. on 26-Sep-2000

I see I prefiously posted this in the wrong place... so I have copied it here:

For setting up another person to receive your WMF (metafiles), I find these utilities helpful:

I use Winzip to compress the files prior to attaching them to email. Winzip will also allow you to make a self extracting zip. So, the recipient merely double clicks on the file to open.

If the recipient does not have Winzip, he may get a freeware named Aladdin Expander 5.0 from www.tucows.com. The neat thing about Aladdin Expander... if there is only one file in the zip, when the recipient double clicks on it, it will open and place the unzipped file in the same folder with the zip. If there are a number of files in the zip, Aladdin will make and name a subfolder, and place the expanded files in there.

There are two ways to view and print the WMF files clearly enough for my standards. If you know more, please inform me. (1) Open the WMF files with ACDSee, a Viewer Utility (may also be found on tucows).
There are a number of versions there. I have an older 2.41. The recipient can download a shareware to use for 30 days, or buy for $35.

The WMF may be printed from ACDSee. It will be clear, sharp, no fuzzy, jagged edges on anything.

You may Insert a Picture in MicroSoft Word, and chose your WMF file. (Insert>Picture>From File, and chose your WMF). Once it is on the page, you will have to resize it to fit.

This is neat, because you can put one WMF of music on each page in a multi page Word file. Then, IF the recipient has the NWC font installed (I send them the font, as well as Boxmarks.ttf and Crescendo.ttf) they may then open the Word document, and simply hit the pinter button, and print the whole thing out, page by page.

In both of these methods of sending and printing sheet music will produce good, sharp pages. Other picture
viewers, such as MS Photo Editor, Arts & Letters Picture Perfect, will open the WMF, but will be very jagged, grainy, and not at all suitable for reading.

I downloaded the upgrade from my previous 1.52 to 1.70. The width of copy area issue has already been taken care of in the newer 1.70 version. The metafile copy no longer cuts off the measure numbers along the left side.

Reply 5 offered by: Art thompson on 26-Sep-2000

Thanks. The insert into Word option does work nice. That mostly solves my problem of converting the NWC file so I could fax it or email it. Don't double click on the image to edit it though. Yikes!

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 26-Sep-2000

And, as has been pointed out many times in the forum, Irfan View http://www.irfanview.com is a free viewer that will open Windows metafiles and convert them to bitmap, GIF, or whatever.

Reply 7 offered by: Art thompson on 26-Sep-2000

Irfanview has crashed on me when I try to print from it. anyone else have that problem?

Reply 8 offered by: Paul C. on 26-Sep-2000

OK, I tried Irfan View. The results were about the same as the other unacceptable programs I mentioned in a previous post. This is only a rough approximation, and not suitable for reading. Notes were misshapen, staff lines were uneven, some thick, some thin.

This is very much what the Ghostview printing did, too.

ACDSee prints as clearly and sharply as if you print directly from NWC. Same with my method of placing the WMF file into MS Word. With so many PC users having Windows and Word, this is probably the best method for most recipients.

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Sep-2000

Art - no, the current version of Irfan-view (V3.21) has been perfectly stable on my system. If you can document the sequence of events that causes a crash, I'd suggest sending them to Irfan. He's very receptive to bug reports, suggestions, and general comments.

I'd also like to point out that Irfan view is freeware, unlike ACDSee which is over $74 Cdn (presumably $50 US)... and does not allow file modification, whereas Irfan view lets you crop, resample/resize, change color parameters, and even includes a filter package. Pretty hard to beat, in my book...

Reply 10 offered by: Paul C. on 27-Sep-2000

Well, Fred, does your Irfan View have the jagged edges and rough, grain appearance on the WMF's? Is there a setting I can change to improve it on my computer?

Reply 11 offered by: Joe Music on 27-Sep-2000

Nearlt all of the time, Irfan View opens a WMF at 300 dpi resolution. This is just great for text, and not bad for objects with curves in them (note-heads, clefs, etc.) However, horizontal and vertical lines (although sharp) are not of uniform thickness, presumably due to something mathematical regarding the 300 dpi resolution versus 72 or 96 dpi screen resolution. Down-scaling the image results in similarly non-uniform results. So, for some users, Irfan View would not be the best choice for NWC to WMF to GIF image conversion.

I have Adobe Acrobat (full version) and have found that using Acrobat Distiller to print from NWC, I get similarly irregular line widths. In fact, the results are quite ugly. Something similar happens with Ghostscript/GSview. BUT Adobe PDF Writer, which comes with Acrobat, does a marvelous, sharp job. From the PDF file produced by PDF Writer, I can select all or part of the image, copy it to the clipboard, and paste it into Irfan View for a sharp image (then, save to GIF).

I conclude that the underlying problem is inconsistency in how WMF and PDF are interpreted at different resolutions. Although I haven't tried ACDsee, presumably its reputed sharpness is due to some strategy that is posess by Adobe PDF Writer, but not by Adobe Acrobat, nor by the direct interpretation of a WMF file by Irfan View.

Printing (rather than making images for display on the web) is a different matter. I find that files created from NWC by PDF Writer produce prints that are as clean and sharp as those printed to paper directly from within NWC. However, files derived from NWC by Acrobat Distiller do not look as good, even though Distiller works great with (say) MS Word. I have found that WMF files from NWC can be opened and visually edited in Adobe Illustrator, and the resulting printout is sharp, with one exception: I have sometimes had to sustitute Postscript text fonts for TrueType text fonts for maximum clarity.

It may also be that these various programs interact with other in mysterious ways that vary from user to user.

If ACDsee works for you, go for it.

Reply 12 offered by: Fred on 27-Sep-2000

Thanks, Joe. I'd long ago abandoned trying to do anything with .wmf, due to inconsistencies in behaviour even within microsoft application environments. If I really need a bitmap-type image (as is necessary for doing strange things like upside-down clefs, etc.) I use the export to .bmp option in the 16-bit build. Otherwise I use GSview, with consistently excellent results.

Incidentally, to get GSview to give a good screen display, you have to set the display settings to give anti-aliasing. Instructions for this (and an A-B comparison between GSview and Acrobat Reader) are given at:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/aboutst.htm#postscript

This anti-aliasing can be used to good advantage to give reduced-size "previews" in gif or other format, using the GSview File-->Copy command, then pasting into a .bmp file for conversion to .gif or .png using PSP, IrfanView, etc.

Reply 13 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Sep-2000

> lines are not of uniform thickness, presumably
> due to something mathematical regarding the 300
> dpi resolution versus 72 or 96 dpi screen resolution.

If you created the WMF from NWC Preview, then the DPI of the WMF matches the printer. If the printer is configured for 720 x 720 DPI, then the line thickness will vary when displaying at 300 DPI, for somewhat obvious mathematical reasons (300 does NOT divide well into 720, for example).

Reply 14 offered by: Art thompson on 28-Sep-2000

Are you saying that NWC looks at the Printer resolution before building the WMF file? That's good to know, since many of us could set our printer to 1200 dpi if we so choose.Then distill it down to whatever resolution needed. I'm still confused, though. The WMF is object based. Is it resolving each object (note, etc.) at the printer resolution?
I hate to be a pain, but you still didn't say WHY the BMP copy function is no longer supported. If it wasn't on the dialog box grayed out, I might not have even thought to ask. But it is, and i'm askin'.
I wouldn't have started this thread if Photoshop 5.0 could process the wmf. I still have trouble believing it.
Finally, since my mommy taught me to be nice when hassling someone: I showed some of my music to a Composition professor at the local university. When I told him about NWC,he was quite suprised. He said "Really, I thought you were using Finale."

Reply 15 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Sep-2000

Yes, that is exactly what I am saying.

Reply 16 offered by: David Ripley on 29-Sep-2000

It would seem like a nice feature if the resolution of the WMF could be set independently from the printer resolution. (I imagine, however, that the fact that it is tied to the printer resolution to start with somehow has to do with the internal way in which the WMF file is being created.) It just seems a little silly to tie the resolution of a file used to achieve portability to the printer attached to a specific machine. (What if you had an old dot matrix printer on the machine you were using, but the file was ultimately going to be printed on a typesetting machine? This is obviously an extreme example, but you get the point.)

Reply 17 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Sep-2000

Well, the term "resolution" is not exactly correct for WMF files. The term "coordinate system" would be more appropriate. NWC uses the printer "resoution" as the basis for establishing the "coordinate system" used to in the WMF file.

Reply 18 offered by: David Ripley on 29-Sep-2000

Thanks for the terminology clarification. I agree entirely. I still wonder if it is a little undesireable/unrealistic to have the coordinate system for the objects within the WMF based entirely on the resolution of a printer attached to the system.

Reply 19 offered by: Joe Music on 29-Sep-2000

Just for fun, I have been fooling with the PPD (postscript printer description) files, as these are editable with Notepad. Don't try this at home, folks, as it seems to be a copyright no-no. But I changed the "standard" resolution intended to accomany a real printer, to one that was an integral multiple of the monitor screen. I then specified this as the "printer" within NWC, then created a WMF. Guess what! The resulting WMF, when opened in Irfan View, looked really great.

Similarly, I discovered that the reason my Acrobat PDFwriter gives very nice images from NWC, whereas Acrobat Distiller (from the same CD-ROM) does not, was that PDFwriter was set to "screen resolution" whereas Distiller was set to a standard printer resolution.

Mathematics, indeed.


#1739: blank staff (lines only, no notes)
blank staff (lines only, no notes)

(1739)

Submitted by: Roy Summerfield on 16-Sep-2000

On page 26 of the Users Guide it says you can hide chosen symbols,so you can print, for example, blank manuscript paper, perhaps, a top staff of music, with the lower staffs lines only, to be worked on in pencil first. But when I follow the instructions, I get nothing, How is it dine?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Sep-2000

What do you mean by "I get nothing" in your question? If you hide all of the items in a staff before printing, you will only get staff lines when you print. To hide everything:

1 - Press Home
2 - Pres Shift+End
3 - Press Alt+Enter
4 - Click Visibility
5 - Set "Shown on printed page" to Never
6 - Press OK

Reply 2 offered by: Roy Summerfield on 19-Sep-2000

Yes - it works! I musthave been doping something wrong.

Something else - it is a pity you can not enter expression symbols like ,"hairpins" (crescendo, decrescendo lines) easily as is possible I think on some other software. I hope this can be added to NWC sometime.


#1740: boxmarks font
boxmarks font

(1740)

Submitted by: lil ole me on 17-Sep-2000

is noteworthy planning on adding this or a similar font to noteworthy composer soon? i am getting very frustrated with the symbols not having values and whenever i create a new song i have to reconfigure one of the user fonts and remember what it is. okay i don't want your patches or workarounds for this, like templates or whatever, i just want to know if the notations are going to be added or not.
thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Steve on 17-Sep-2000

Fair Comment... What is the answer??? Thanx!!!


#1741: Sheet Music?
Sheet Music?

(1741)

Submitted by: awally on 17-Sep-2000

Hello

This rather indirectly relates to NWC, but I think it's the only way to contact this great number of musicians. Does anyone know where one could download/view piano sheet music for free?

(:

-awally

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Sep-2000

Here's a starting point:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/freeshee.htm

Have fun!

Reply 2 offered by: ah choo on 18-Sep-2000

and when you've finished with Fred's comprehensive site you can surf around for MIDI files on the internet, and when you find one that sounds sequenced (strict tempo) you can usually import it into noteworthy with remarkable results

Reply 3 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 26-Sep-2000

I have tried Fred's site in particular Choral Public Domain Library. I have no problem downloading PDF or NWC to disk but for MIDI my Pc just play them but does not download to disk.
What is the problem ? Bad setting of my Netscape 4.6 ?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Sep-2000

Your browser has midi files associated either with an external midi player, or Netscape's internal player. To save to disk, right-click on the link, then Save Link As...

Reply 5 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 02-Oct-2000

Thanks ! Now I have some midi files on my disk.
next question : how to translate them to NWC or play them? I think that it has to do to import but this is not documented in Help file index and my user manual is very out of date (see an other thread !

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 02-Oct-2000

There used to be an Import option on the File menu, but it's been removed. Now you just Open the file and NWC notices that the extension is .mid and behaves appropriately.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Oct-2000

You can use File | Open to import the files, or simply drag and drop them onto NWC.

Reply 8 offered by: Artur on 06-Oct-2000

There´s a nice place to find some free sheet music in *.pdf:
www.sheetmusicarchive.com, served me well, but it isn´t very complete, so that you may be a little disappointed.
HTH
Artur


#1742: trade combo charts
trade combo charts

(1742)

Submitted by: bizboy on 19-Sep-2000

hello, please email me your NWC jazz combo arrangements and i will send you mine. miles davis quintet transcriptions and stuff, notated but with limited dynamics and other symbols. most are alto sax, trumpet, tenor sax, bass, and i scanned in my handwritten chords for piano and opt. guitar. email.
bizboy

Reply 1 offered by: carlo on 27-Apr-2001

What charts are you looking for?


#1743: Playing back tenuto
Playing back tenuto

(1743)

Submitted by: Ramón Pajares Box on 19-Sep-2000

Of all Performances styles used by NWC, only legato, tenuto and staccato affect the play back of the song they are in.

It seems that legato and tenuto play notes longer (up to the full duration of the note) and staccato shorter (ideally, a 50% of the note duration, but I’ve noticed that most of the time it’s closer to a 25%). A legato playback can also be achieved in NWC on notes affected by a slur or a tenuto mark (a dash above a note) and a staccato playback on notes with a staccato mark (a point above or below the note).

But I’m puzzled about NWC rendering of the tenuto mark and style, especially by its lack of practical difference with legato.

I’m not a trained musician (well, I should better state that I’m not a musician at all) and I’m not certain about what I’m saying but I think that a note played tenuto should be played without decay but not longer.

Normally players don’t maintain the same strength during the full duration of a note. In attack time the note is played stronger and then the sound gets weakened towars the end. A tenuto marking instructs the player to maintain the same force during the full duration of the note, but without being prolonged and glued to the next note. That is, a clear separation between notes is very important in a tenuto performance.

In my music book, a German one in fact, the dash over the note is not called tenuto but détaché (a French word which means separated) and the accompanying description insists more on the separation between notes than on the prolongation of the sound. To me, then, this means that tenuto (or détaché, if they are the same thing) is a kind of long staccato, where the note is played a bit shorter than the normal style, to stress the separation with the next one.

Therefore, my ideal playback duration series for a note in different performance styles would be:

- legato: 100% of the note time,
- normal: 90%,
- tenuto: 80%,
- staccato: 50%,
- martelé (a single quote above or below the note, not in NWC): 25%.

Are those values sensible for a trained musician or does this reverts to a misunderstanding out of my own ignorance?

I hope there is not a clash between American and European musical culture in this tenuto matter, and I would like to hear to your reactions for my own musical enlightement.

Reply 1 offered by: Art thompson on 19-Sep-2000

Your on the right track, but performing music is more than just the mathematical interpretation of note durations. The actual use of these styles vary by composer, the time period (Baroque, etc.) and the tempo. For example, in very slow tempos, the tenuto generally implies an oh-so-slight ritard, creating an almost imperceptible anticipation towards the next beat. This is a good example of why midi playback has difficulty recreating the nuance of human performance.
A tenuto on a long note, such as a half or whole note, would imply as you suggest - to remind the performer to hold the note for the full duration. Whether it is played without decay would still depend on the interpretation, or other dynamics.
Other considerations include the instrument itself. Attacks and decays on a woodwind cannot be duplicated with a pipe organ.
Okay, enough!

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Lim on 19-Sep-2000

We are back in the sequencer v notation processor conflict. NWC generally doesn't lean towards note by note modifications of performance style. For my part I'm still more than satisfied by much of the current version's features - just getting the program(me) to play the notes as written seems equally important (n-tuplets and sequential time signatures for instance).

Having said that, allowing global modification of the performance style definitions on a per-file basis would go some way towards resolving conflicts between different periods and performing traditions.

I'd also like to add one more symbol to Ramón's list:

Staccatissimo (circumflex above note) = short duration + increase in dynamic level.

Bob

Reply 3 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 21-Sep-2000

"...allowing global modification of the performance style definitions on a per-file basis..."

Oh! Thanks for expressing it so well! I would like to find this feature in a future NWC release.

But my main concern remains: Is it a reasonable musical practice to have tenuto and legato as synonims? There are accepted synonims as decrescendo and diminuendo or ritardando and rallentando, but can we assume the same for tenuto and legato?

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Randall on 21-Sep-2000

My interpretation is that Tenuto applies on a note by note basis i.e. if a note is marked tenuto you should hold this note somewhat longer than normal - maybe even adding a bit of rubato and delaying the start of the note that follows. Legato applies to the transition between notes i.e. the transitions should be smoother than normal. Indeed, both legato and tenuto could apply at the same time.

For a clarinet player (me for example) legato would indicate: don't tongue between notes or, if you do, use "la" tonguing rather than the normal "de" or "tuh" tonguing. Whereas, a note marked tenuto might quite legitimately be given a smart smack with a "tih" sort of tonguing.

Having read the last paragraph, how about this? Legato relates to note attack (less), tenuto relates to note decay (longer).

Stephen Randall

Reply 5 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 21-Sep-2000

Stephen,

Thanks for your reply. It clarifies somewhat the matter to me.

Not being a clarinet player myself, I only grasp a bit what you say. I've read before about the "tuh", "la", "de" tonguings and I think I understand in general terms your example, but not in detail.

But your last sentence is most helpful. Thanks again for taking the trouble to answer my question.

Ramón Pajares

Reply 6 offered by: Art thompson on 21-Sep-2000

Well said by Stephen. Rubato - "to borrow time", borrowed from the next beat or measure, without interrupting the flow, as a fermata would. From a woodwind players point of view, If you merely indicated "legato", I would play the notes as smoothly as possible,in one breath, but still give each note some delicate attack. A slur across the notes would tell me to attack only the first note in the sequence.
As I alluded to in the earlier reply, a piano or organ must attack each note, so only duration can be used to achieve the desired effect.


#1744: Wishing for leger lines
Wishing for leger lines

(1744)

Submitted by: Art thompson on 19-Sep-2000

Here's a 3 part wish: Whene editing, have an optional feature that inserts leger lines as you go above or below the staff, so you know where you are, OR, have the note that the cursor is on indicated in the 'context sensitive' help bar, and/ OR.. how about a feature that lets you hear the notes as you scroll up/down, or to the right. It would be helpful to hear the notes as you scroll through a measure,controlling the rhythm with arrow keys. dontcha think?

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 20-Sep-2000

Good ideas.

Yes, getting the right pitch when entering a note that needs to be on a leger line can be tricky. To develop Art's idea further, how about having the note (showing the selected note value and pitch plus any slurs, ties, accidentals and performance indications)that would be inserted when you hit the enter key "ghosted" until you actually hit the key?

A feature that sounds the note as you scroll up and down could be pretty irritating but might be useful at times. The act of composition could become a perfomance in its own right! Issues to consider: how long should the note sound for? - I often want to zap up and down the stave and it would get awful frustrating to have to wait for all the intervening notes to finish playing before I can enter the one I want; should a chord sound if the control key is held down while the cursor keys are used?

A feature to play as you step left & right through a score would be handy but needs either to allow toggling on or off or have special keys (i.e. not the cursor keys) assigned to the play+step function - are there any unassigned function keys?. Issue to consider: what should happen with tied notes?

Stephen Randall

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 20-Sep-2000

You are absolutely correct, Stephen. Any feature like this you would want to be able to toggle on and off. An old 3.1 editor that I had did have this feature, and it was kind of fun to be able to play scales with one finger. Being able to hear the note before you place it can definitely speed up your entry.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher on 20-Sep-2000

Other notation packages I've used had, I believe, a very short note-sounding duration when entering notes, and it was quite useful.

As far as "ghosting", you can always enter your note wherever the cursor happens to be, then select it and use
Control-Shift-arrow to move it up and down until you get it where you want it.

Also don't forget that Shift-arrow will move the cursor up or down by an octave. This is helpful sometimes.

- seb

Reply 4 offered by: Art thompson on 20-Sep-2000

An excellent tip. NWC has a robust choice of keyboard shortcuts;it's hard to remember them all. Thank you NWC for putting those shortcuts in both the dropdowns, and the hover help. It's helped my learning curve alot.
Anyone not using those shortcuts - I recommend hiding the mouse behind the monitor for a few sessions.


#1745: fit to page
fit to page

(1745)

Submitted by: ah choo on 19-Sep-2000

would be a really groovy feature in page setup options.
especially for my two or more page single part printouts - i would love that soooo much. just divide the height available on the page (in points) by the height of the staff, then divide up the extra space by the number of staves (-1) and add it between each stave.

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 20-Sep-2000

Another good idea!

I had considered suggesting letting NWC pick a point size to fill the pages. Ah Choo's idea gets around the problem of shifting the breaks in the stave as the size changes.

You could end up with really spaced out music - Groovy, Man! ;)

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 21-Sep-2000

I strongly agree.

Moreover, besides the "force system break", it would be great to have a "disallow system break" option, so that the "fit to page" doesn't place a break at a place where it would make the reading difficult...

Reply 3 offered by: Marilyn on 29-Sep-2000

I find fit to page an *extremely* attractive idea. :-)

Reply 4 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 07-Oct-2000

I do not see what you wish to achieve.
It seems to me that NWC already see how many staves it can put in a page and share the remaining vertical space to put it between staves.
I prefer a "fit to page" function that choose the best compromise between font and staff sizes and put my piece in 1 2 or the number of page I have entered as a parameter...
But this is probably a different function.


#1746: Ya know...the one that goes like...
Ya know...the one that goes like...

(1746)

Submitted by: Graham Pond on 20-Sep-2000

I've got an interesting request. Can anyone tell me the name of the peice that is used in the Bugs Bunny Cartoon with Elmer Fudd when Bugs is playing a barber on Elmer Fudds head? It's a quick peice and very lively. I know this isn't a lot to go on, but it's all the info given to me. I can hear the peice in my head, but don't even know who it was composed by. If you know what I'm talking about great, please give me a hand and send a message to my address.

Thanks
Gremlin

Reply 1 offered by: Michael Powell on 20-Sep-2000

It is from Gioacchino Rossini's opera "Barber of Seville".

Reply 2 offered by: Bugs Bunny on 20-Sep-2000

*/*/*/*/ munching carrot

hmmmm, what do we have here? CARROTS!!! MORE CARROTS!!!!!!

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Sep-2000

I don't recall the cartoon (showing my age)!

But if you are thinking of the aria from "Barber of Seville" that goes La,la,la,la,la,la,la,la,la,la,..la,..la, and then mentions Figaro, the aria is "Largo al Factotum." You can find it on Karaoke Opera CD, if you're into that. It's suitable for baritone, but difficult!


#1747: Back to vacation
Back to vacation

(1747)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 20-Sep-2000

How to retrieve what has been posted between the date of my departure and now ?

Reply 1 offered by: gordon on 22-Sep-2000

How about clicking on Message Archive and/or Recent Activity. They're to the right of Active Contents that you click on to get here.

Reply 2 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 23-Sep-2000

I have found experimentaly that "active contents" is sorted by date (or perhaps message number). So I have gone down the list till my date of departure. I may have missed so few answers to old questions. So my (stupid) question has a too simple answer !
Normaly I look at "recent activities" which is easier for day by day use, and was not aware of the advantage of sorted "active contents".


#1748: Notation of notes that should be played one octave
Notation of notes that should be played one octave

(1748)

Submitted by: Bodo Fuhrmann on 21-Sep-2000

Is it possible in any way to insert a dotted line over the staff with a (8)e.g.
(8).............
to say, that the notes should be played one octave higher or lower(often used in piano staffs)?

Thanks bodo

Reply 1 offered by: Robin Withey on 21-Sep-2000

Well, you could try just inserting it as text. If you want it to sound right as well, insert a new clef with an octave shift. You can hide that if you don't want it to appear on the print-out. Oh, and don't forget to put a (hidden) normal clef when you've finished.

I agree it would be nice to be able to do this properly, rather than working round it, but being able to hide things, plus of course layering, are the biggest bonuses to me of version 1.70. Not that I used NWC all that much before that, but I use it a lot now, and I find the more I use it, the more features I find. It pays to fiddle!

Robin Withey

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 21-Sep-2000

Bodo -

Robin's suggestion is a good one but you have to be careful about the clef.

If a staff break occurs during the 8va, the new staff will be printed with the current (hidden) clef. If you care how the printout looks (as I assume you do or you wouldn't want the 8va bracket in the first place), you will need to find out where staff breaks will occur and, if necessary, insert the correct visible clef.

If you care how the playback sounds, you'll then need to follow this with another hidden clef to get the right octave displacement.

- Grant

Reply 3 offered by: Robin Withey on 21-Sep-2000

Good point - correction accepted!

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 24-Oct-2000

To get round the invisible octave clef problem when the 8va extends over two systems you can layer the stave with another stave which contains a visible ordinary clef and invisible bar lines/rests etc.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Edwards on 24-Oct-2000

There is a problem with the dashes after the 8va, in that they don't expand with the bar when the bar is justified for printing.

To cure this put the dashes on the empty stave (see above) as multiple text/rest pairs. That is a visible hyphen/space followed by a hidden demisemiquaver rest. Use ^C and ^V to copy lots of them. These will expand as the bar expands. Play around with text alignment ('best fit' is not the best here) and insert a right justified hyphen at the beginning of the bar to fill in the gap.


#1750: mid to cd audio
mid to cd audio

(1750)

Submitted by: sheldon on 23-Sep-2000

i need to convert music recorded in mid format on a yamaha
disklavier to wav so that it can beburned onto a cd rom
to play as regular music on a conventional cd audio player

can anyone suggest how to go about doing this

also, does it have to be in wav format to make it play
on a regular cd music player

thanks for all replies

sheldon

Reply 1 offered by: Carl Bangs on 23-Sep-2000

n-Track Studio is a good audio editing program found at:
http://www.fasoft.com/

Carl Bangs

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Sep-2000

This as been extensively covered here:

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1003.htm

Most CD burner software requires that input be in .wav format. So once you've recorded your midi as a .wav, 44.1 kHz Stereo 16-bit, you should be home free.

Reply 3 offered by: Martin Gascon on 25-Oct-2000

I've tried an excelent software: it is Audio Compositor. You can use large soundfount files to give your songs really good sound (instruments), no matter your soundcard is poor.
I cant remember the website, but you could search with any search engine.
Once you get the .wav file, just burn it to CD.


#1751: Specifing  midi sounds on a certain line..
Specifing  midi sounds on a certain line..

(1751)

Submitted by: Snaredude on 23-Sep-2000

can someone please tell me how to do this:
Put the low tom sound on the "F" line
Put the medium tom sound on the "A" line
and put the high tom sound on the "E" line
thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Lim on 24-Sep-2000

I don't have NWC to hand to work out the details, but you can use the "transpose staff" option (with the MIDI on channel 10) to put the notes on any line of the staff. You may have to layer 2 or more staffs with different transpositions to achieve your requirement.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Sep-2000

There is a wonderful program by Barry Graham called "Drumkit" on the Scriptorium. This lets you convert your drum sounds from the silly General Midi mapping (which you use for playback) into standard drum notation (which you use for visual printouts). You then hide the GM staff, and mute the standard notation staff... and you have the best of both worlds.

The remapping can be modified by changing an ini file.

The way it works is: you copy your GM drum track into a new file, and export it to midi called "drums.mid". Run Drumkit on it, it creates a new midi file which you then re-import into NWC, then copy the resulting staff into your original work.

The program will also go the other way, from standard drum notation to GM.

I use it whenever I publish a piece with drums, and want the score to be visually correct. Thanks Barry!

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 26-Sep-2000

My pleasure Fred!
Drake Donahue's Visual Basic version is more flexible allowing you to save your midi>notation conversion map.
And you don't need Qbasic or a DOS prompt.
But the documentation leaves a lot to be desired.
Drake - if your still hanging around here - how about a written tutorial?


#1752: Is it possible...
Is it possible...

(1752)

Submitted by: Jahonas on 24-Sep-2000

To transpose a drum roll with noteworthy?

Reply 1 offered by: Sterghios moschos on 25-Sep-2000

Transpose a drum roll? you mean to another pitch. Or to a tom-tom? In any case, drums are an instrument you cannot really transpose unless you physically have 20 or so toms! So I assume that you mean one of the two above...

What exactly do you wanna do?

Reply 2 offered by: Jahonas on 25-Sep-2000

All I want to do is add a "-" to the stem of a note, indicating a drum roll. that or a "z"

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Sep-2000

Aha! Yes, it's easy to put a "-" on the note stem. Simply put it in as a text item with preserve width off, alignment "at next note/bar". Justification depends on whether it's stem up or stem down; if stem up, enter "(space)-" and set justify = left. If stem down enter "-(space)" and set justify = right.

There are actually better tremolo symbols available in the "Boxmarks" or other fonts, available at the Scriptorium.


#1753: sound card disaster
sound card disaster

(1753)

Submitted by: Eric James on 25-Sep-2000

I have a new computer which came with a Sound Blaster 64V PCL card. While there is a great deal more presence to the sound than what I had from my old card, it's representation of the French horn sound is terrible. It sounds like a very loud muted trumpet. I am almost afraid to try other sounds for fear of what I may get. This is most distressing since I'm a horn player myself. Is it possible to tweak the card in any way or do I have to buy a different one. I usually
use Noteworthy's playback function just as a "spellcheck" for notation errors but I don't think I can live with such an obviously wrong interpretation of a sound. Other than that, though, Noteworthy has never sounded better.

Eric James

Reply 1 offered by: Sterghios Moschos on 25-Sep-2000

Do I take it from teh name of the card that it is all but a Creative Soundblaster product? I've never heard of this one... Does it support soundfonts? If yes then go to www.listento.Hammersound and have fun. If not....

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 25-Sep-2000

I checked the creative website and can't figure out which card you have. I'm guessing you mean 64 Voice PCI card.
In the meantime, change your patch for the horn part to bassoon. Then you won't be comparing it to the sound you know and love. Also, seriously, if your using regular little PC speakers, try hooking it up to your stereo, or even a large boombox. I use a couple of little Advent speakers (RS 2000 for you audiophiles). What a difference good speakers make

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 26-Sep-2000

I think that the PCI 64 uses wavesets like the PCI 128 that I have. If this is the case, make sure you are using the 8Mb waveset rather than the 4Mb or 2Mb versions. Bigger means better. I find the french horn sound quite reasonable on the PCI 128.

I also use the playback facility mainly for proof reading (proof listening?) and duff sound reproduction can be frustrating - was that a consecutive fifth or just the sound card honking?

Stephen Randall

Reply 4 offered by: Chris on 29-Dec-2000

I have a SB PCI 128 and a LIVE! Platinum card, and I find that generally speaking, the 128 is a very decent card. It's main limitation is not the hardware itself, but the apperant lack of support by Creative/Equisonic. It, like it's counterpart PCI 64, comes with 2, 4 and 8 meg wavesets. They don't seem to plan on EVER releasing any larger wavesets, so if you can't live with the somewhat unrealistic sound emulation I would recommend the Live! Value for your $. It's around $40 if you buy online (try pricewatch.com), and has around 90% of the features of a Live! standard. This card, unlike the PCI 64/128 family, has substantial large-soundfont support that can be found for free on the web. For general Midi, I recommend the 28MB "unison.sf2", which can be found for free download in numerous places (try an "FTP search").

If you would like to contact me, you can do so through this e-mail form: "http://www.geocities.com/anti_trnd/page2.html"

-Chris <><


#1754: violin bow movement notation
violin bow movement notation

(1754)

Submitted by: Ralph Robledo on 26-Sep-2000

I am using NWC to write music for violin. I should like to include special notations for the bow movement. Is it possible to insert special characters designed for that purpose or, if anyone knows about any font available that could be used to insert such caracters ?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Sep-2000

Up/down-bow markings are available in the "Boxmarks" font, as well as other musical fonts (available on the Scriptorium).


#1755: Vertical alignment of staves
Vertical alignment of staves

(1755)

Submitted by: Stephen Reynolds on 26-Sep-2000

The uses I would have for NoteWorthy Composer are a bit unusual, but I see messages in this forum from others with similar concerns, so there may be hope. Currently I am comparing versions of a folksong tune, and I have been trying to put each version on its own staff and align the staves so that the corresponding measures of each version will be directly above/below one another. The tune is in 3/4 time (versions printed as 6/8 I can just convert to 3/4). The first problem I encountered was that one singer doubled the length of a note in one measure, so that that one measure (only) was in 4/4 time. Even though the number of noteheads in that measure was the same as in all the other versions, the amount of space taken up by it was substantially longer both on the monitor screen and in print. I have found no way to overcome this, and it buggers up the vertical alignment. The thing in Page Setup/Options seems to have no effect at all.

Second, the early measures on the staves are of reasonable length (physically--nothing to do with the number and length of notes in them!), but about a third of the way through the song each note begins to take up more space. By the end of the song, the bars are ridiculously far apart. I should be able to print the whole song on three pages, and if the spacing of notes remained the same throughout the song I would be. But with each note in the later measures claiming a huge envelope of personal space, in fact it reqires eight pages, which pretty well destroys the utility of the whole project.

Can anyone tell me what is going on and what can be done about it?

Stephen Reynolds

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 27-Sep-2000

For your first problem: Where Singer A has the double length note insert the standard length note as per the Singer B staff. Hide this note. Then insert a double length note as a text item. If you want it to play back as Singer A sang it add a fermata with the correct delay on this note.

For your second problem: Err, um ...! Over to somebody else? What you describe seems very odd behaviour - perhaps you could post an example to the newsgroup.

HTH

Stephen Randall

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 27-Sep-2000

I'm guessing that the fermata, or ritard, is what's actually happening in the sung version. Unless the Guitar, or banjo, or whatever, actually plays something on that 'extra' beat to cause the ear to hear it stressed as a beat.
It's unlikely that a folksong would have one measure of a different meter.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 27-Sep-2000

You can see it for yourself. My source for this is Bob Copper, 'Songs and Southern Breezes: Country Folk and Country Ways' (London: William Heineman, 1973), p. 294. Bob Copper transcribed the song from oral tradition (no guitar, just the unaccompanied voice). He gave a time signature of "3/4 4/4"; the song is 3/4, but the sixth and tenth full measures have four eighth notes (quavers) and a half-note (minim), whereas all the rest have notes that add up to 3/4. So these two measures are where the 4/4 comes in. People do hear these things differently sometimes, but an experienced person like Bob Copper is not likely to make a half-note out of slightly lengthened quarter-note that could be indicated by a tenuto or fermata, especially when it interferes with the time signature.

I find that notes taking up excessive space is a chronic problem. There are instructions on how to increse the space after a note, or, to look at it from the other end, how to move the following note to the right. What I need is to reduce the space, that is, to move the following note to the left.

Reply 4 offered by: David Ripley on 28-Sep-2000

I may be totally off base here, but I've had some situations where exceptionally long measures (with correspondingly widely spaced notes) are created in a piece when NW decides that only a couple measures can fit on a line. (A piece can start out with four/five measures per line, and then all of a sudden I get two measures on a line due to the specific note content of the measures.) Anyway, I've had good luck with fooling around with the margins. Sometimes setting the left and right margins just slightly larger and smaller can make a big difference in the way the whole piece is layed out. I've gotten around alot of strange measure layout problems this way.

Reply 5 offered by: Art thompson on 28-Sep-2000

Since it is transcribed from oral tradition, and unaccompanied, I can't decide whether to claim "I stand corrected" or not. In the interest of forum etiquette, I stand corrected.
see the other thread on note spacing regarding your other problem.

Reply 6 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 28-Sep-2000

About the 3/4 versus 4/4 :

If I understand, the different versions of the tune can't be played together, but you want to do a visual difference between all of them. You can then do the following.

- where you have a 4/4, insert the new 4/4 time signature at the beginning of each such measure, and add a 3/4 time signature after its end.

- if the other part keeps the 3/4, you may add the same 4/4 + 3/4 time signatures, then add an extra quarter rest, and hide all three items.

Reply 7 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 28-Sep-2000

Thanks to everyone for responding to my problem.

Part of the problem was an unintentional dynamic which I have deleted. That straightened out most of the staves. But the original problem of 4/4 measures in a 3/4 tune remains.

David Ripley: It doesn't seem that the condition you describe is what's bugging me. There are no exceptionally long measures, just two with a minim or half-note where a crotchet or quarter-note would be expected, and the program doesn't seem to think that there are too many measures on the staff--they are all there, but won't align. See the next part of this reply.

Olivier Miakinen: I did as you suggested, putting the 4/4 signature at the beginning of each 4/4 measure and the 3/4 signature at the beginning of each immediately following one. It still puts a long, long space after the minim, even though it is programmed not to put longer spaces after longer notes. I don't know what to do about this, and the affected staff will not align with the others.

Oh, yes--no, I don't want to play all of the versions simultaneously. If I did that, the presence of the two 4/4 measures in one version and not in the rest would bugger everything up. But I only want a visual comparison of the notated airs.

Art Thompson: I don't know if you 'stand corrected' either. I think the original song is available on a cassette, but I don't have it. Anyhow, in this kind of work I have to trust my source unless I have an overriding authority--someone who listened to the original song and found that the oddball note is not really twice as long as the expected quarter-note would do, but as far as I know there is no such thing, and as I said I thing Bob Copper is not likely to get such a thing wrong.

Thanks for the comments, and if anyone knows how to get NoteWorthy to stop putting extra space after the minim I will be very grateful!

Reply 8 offered by: Art thompson on 29-Sep-2000

I can not for the life of me recreate this measure growth problem

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Sep-2000

Indeed. NWC will not randomly add to your measure length. One of the following MUST be true for this behaviour to occur:

1 - mismatched bar lines or vertically misaligned durations, where a measure on one staff differes in length from another staff at the same time (horizontal) position

2 - one or more expression items inserted in a staff that have Preserve Width enabled

3 - File | Page Setup | "Increase note spacing for larger note durations" is enabled

4 - extra space allocated to a note via the "Notes" property sheet (Extra Accidental or Note Spacing)

5 - an extra long lyric syllable attached to the notes in question

6 - and, most obviously, a series of smaller duration notes on another staff that are occupying the time space of a longer duration, single note in the staff that you are viewing (which would obviously cause extra space, so that the series of shorter notes would not overlap with notes in the other staff that are to occur later)

If you unsure how to proceed or have any doubts about this, please send us a sample, so we can identify which of these points applies to your scenario. A sample is worth a thousand words...

Reply 10 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Sep-2000

See also: msg #1009, msg #1410, msg #484, msg #554

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Oct-2000

Thanks for the sample. Your problem is #1:

1 - mismatched bar lines or vertically misaligned durations, where a measure on one staff differes in length from another staff at the same time (horizontal) position.

I will elaborate:

--> In staff "Staff-1" bar 7, you have notated 4 quarter note beats. In all of the lower staves, in the same bar, you have correctly 3 quarter note beats. This results in the bar lines in "Staff-1" to be misaligned with the other staves inthe piece. You cannot put a 4/4 measure (although you do not label it as such) on top of a 3/4 measure in other instruments. This does not work, and is improper notation construction.

--> In "Staff-7" bar 10, you notate 3 3.5 beat bar (you have an extra 8th note in the bar), but all other staves have the proper three beats.

--> In bar 11, you again notate 4/4 on top of 3/4, but this time you even include a time signature change in "Staff-1" but "Staff-2" through "Staff-12" remain in 3/4 time at the same bar. This again is improper notation construction.

--> In "Staff-10" bar 12, you are missing a 16th note that would complete a full 3/4 bar. All other staves contain a proper 3/4 measure at this bar.

--> I do not understand what is supposed to happen on your ending, but I padded all bars in other parts with hidden rests to match the longest measure in whatever staff contained it.

I have attached a version of your piece in an e-mail that shows you how you can still notate this contradiction, although I do not know how any actual group of performers could ever play it successfully withoutu turning the invisible rests that I added into visible ones. Even then, the notation is contradictory to the time signature, so I suspect that it would be difficult for most musicians to follow.


#1756: Inserting lyrics
Inserting lyrics

(1756)

Submitted by: Stephen Reynolds on 27-Sep-2000

I open a new file, get the staff started, and then try to put a text under the staff. Whenever I try to begin with the first letter, I get the notation properties box. I think I have dealt with all the things in the box, but it still wants something and will not tell me what. No help from help; the obvious thing, a step-by-step set of instructions on how to put both the music and the words on the screen, is nowhere to be found. Why not? Why can't the help file tell me what I must do to underlay text to the notes?

Stephen Reynolds

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 27-Sep-2000

Perhaps you're talking about adding lyrics. If so, try searching for "Lyrics" in the Help file.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Sep-2000

The "Lyrics" command on the Edit menu is used to add lyrics. Until you add notes, though, the lyrics will not show up in the staff. Press the Help button in the lyric editor for more details.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Sep-2000

The User's Guide also covers this quite extensively, including step-by-step instructions.

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 27-Sep-2000

OK, I can do it now. Thanks!


#1758: Key Transposition
Key Transposition

(1758)

Submitted by: David Lake on 29-Sep-2000

I need to change the key for a piece I am working on.
I want the staff to change at the same time and play the new key. I can do one or the other but not both.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Sep-2000

Use Tools --> Transpose Staff --> select number of semitones up or down. Turn "Update Playback Transposition" OFF. Repeat for each of the staves.


#1759: Copy and Paste score to send E-mail.
Copy and Paste score to send E-mail.

(1759)

Submitted by: JoAnn Larsen on 29-Sep-2000

I'm a new NoteWorthy Composer user. Is there a way to copy/ paste your score/piece so you can send it via E-mail. I use Microsofts Outlook Express a offline E-mail program. Have tried the copy command but doesn't seem to work. What am I doing wrong.

I would appreciate any tips that may be helpful.

JoAnn Larsen

Reply 1 offered by: Art thompson on 29-Sep-2000

Many topics related to this have been posted ad nauseum. See msg #1738 for the latest. I think for your purposes, copy and paste into Word (assuming you have Word 97 or later). I don't use Outlook, but I'm sure it can email a word document.

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 29-Sep-2000

By the way - you'll have to C/P each page of your score 1 page at a time from the Print Preview option

Reply 3 offered by: JoAnn Larsen on 29-Sep-2000

The piece that I have written I can copy it to Windows/ clipboard. Went into Assessories in Windows to view what I had saved. I tried to save it so I could send it as a attachment in my E-mail program. I can attach the Midi to E-mail with no problem. My Word Processor is Microsoft Works, haven't been able to copy and paste it there either. This piece that I am working on I would like to send it to a family member via E-mail but it looks like it can't be done.

Could you explain what a WMF file is?

JoAnn Larsen

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Sep-2000

The way I've done it is to use the Print Preview "Copy" option to copy to the Windows clipboard. Then open Word (I have an older version, V6.0). Use Edit --> Paste, and the image of the page appears. Click on the image, and a scroll box appears. Now you can click-and-drag the image at the click points in order to fill the page (or proportion it any way you like). Unless your version of Works is /very/ old, it should work similarly.

As I understand it (or perhaps misunderstand it), a wmf file is essentially the same thing, except that the data is saved to disk as a *.wmf file instead of just copied to the clipboard. Such a file can then be imported into Word or other microsoft apps.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Sep-2000

If your family member is also using Windows, another alternative is to simply send the NWC file, and refer your family member to the freeware NoteWorthy Player program. This way, they can see and hear your work.

Reply 6 offered by: Artemis Smith on 30-Sep-2000

> "Can you explain what a WMF is?"

A WMF contains visual drawing information (text, graphics). It is not a music file. That is, it is not like MIDI. So matter how you send a WMF and no matter what your friend at the receiving end does with it, it cannot be "played" as music.

See the above comment regarding NWC files and Noteworthy Player

Reply 7 offered by: JoAnn Larsen on 30-Sep-2000

After I copied my score to clipboard. I was able to get it into my word processor and was able to send it. Sent it to myself to see if it worked. I did send NWC file to a family member and the web site so she could download the program.

JoAnn

Reply 8 offered by: JoAnn Larsen on 30-Sep-2000

Thanks for all your help.

JoAnn

Reply 9 offered by: David Potvin on 14-Nov-2000

Yeah, well, there's one thing with the .WMF files and MS Word Processor, based on a true story! Here it is:

I had to send my boss on board a ship a part of Moonlight Serenade I arranged for him; no harm there, even if he's 4000 miles from me, I'll E-Mail it to him! So I did copy it into .WMF - 3 pages, 3 files - and sent it!

He replies to me that he received the file, but once opened, he got a lot of letters instead of notes! HE DIDN'T HAVE THE FONT ON HIS COMPUTER!!!

So if you need to E-Mail charts or parts and decide to do it via a Word document, make sure he's got Noteworthy Player OR Composer installed, or they'll receive gibberish!

Reply 10 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Nov-2000

I did something similar.
I had written a manual for NWC v1.3 then updated it for v1.5.
When I posted it off for inclusion on the Scriptorium the same problem occured.
What had happened was the original manual used wmf's created from v1.3 and they looked OK because the NWCv13.ttf was still installed on my system along with the NWCv15.ttf so everthing looked alright at my end but when Fred and Andrew opened the files - garbage.
Thta was I redo I didn't anticipate!

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Nov-2000

FYI: All old version NWC named fonts are available from our FTP site:

ftp.noteworthysoftware.com

We make all the older fonts available for just this reason (to support older WMF files that used them).

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 14-Nov-2000

Unless you have a very old version, MS Word allows font embedding. I'll bet you didn't know that (I didn't). I imagine that there are other word processing programs that do likewise (certainly, that's the whole point of using PDF files rather than .doc files).

Whether or not your E-mail program would correctly send and receive a Word document with embedded fonts is anyone's guess.


#1760: Notation Soft with MIDI support of pitch and durat
Notation Soft with MIDI support of pitch and durat

(1760)

Submitted by: Javier on 29-Sep-2000

Hi ppl!!!

I am trying to get a good software that supports MIDI import and interprets correctly pitch and duration of the notes and puts them in a printable multi-staff tablature also. In addition, I would like to print the final results.

I have recently tried Noteworthy Composer, and it seems to be very good, but it doens't recongnize the duration of the notes, e.q. if it is a whole or a half or quarter either.

Do you know if it is exits that?.

Thnxz.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Sep-2000

NoteWorthy Composer does, in fact, measure note lengths during import. You have control over how precise this operation is handled via the note and rest resolution settings, set from the Import Wizard and/or Tools | Options | Import.

Reply 2 offered by: javier on 01-Oct-2000

Do you know if the setting of the Import are taking into account when you also import music from a MIDI device, e.q. a keyboard?

Probably, a choice could be to try to create a .MIDI file from my keyboard --I do not how to do it -- and then import de .MIDI file to get the staff.
Do you think it would work?.

Thank for your help.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Oct-2000

When you play from a MIDI keyboard in real time using the Tools | Record command (or toolbar button), the resulting automatic import is based on the settings in Tools | Options | Import. However, you can also manually import after using the Record commmand by using the Staff | Import Recording command.

See also: msg #141, msg #1463, msg #1469, msg #1572, msg #1578, msg #932


#1761: Text Chords
Text Chords

(1761)

Submitted by: Tom on 30-Sep-2000

I am trying to write piano and bass parts using
text i.e.C G7 F#6 and am experiencing problems.
In one case the print out is missing parts of the
piece which are clearly shown on the screen. In another
case the program wont let me add any more chords unless I pan out and in the end the part is so small I cant see it to to add any more to it
Any suggestions ?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Sep-2000

I am not exactly sure what you are describing, but I will try to guess what is wrong based on your information. You need to actually have notes in each bar if you want NWC to work as expected. If you are just placing text, you may be able to see this info in the editor, but printing will not work as expected. If you do not want to see the notes, you can always hide them.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Hansche on 01-Oct-2000

Yes... Actually, if you had a whole rest to each meausre and hide it, you will get just the bars and the chord names. Also another way to do this would be to change the text expression properties of each of the chords and set it to "Preserve Width". Hope this helps.
- Joe

Reply 3 offered by: Tom on 02-Oct-2000

thanks for your reply. I am using preserved width but
how do you hide parts of the piece ?
I am trying to arrange for big band ie 5 saxes 8 brass
and rhythm does anyoneone have any charts or info I can play
about with
regards
Tom

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Oct-2000

Depends on what you want to hide. If you want to hide an entire staff, go to Page Setup --> Contents and unclick the ones you don't want to see.

If you want to hide individual items, select the item (highlight it) then press CNTL-E or ALT-Enter (or Edit --> Properties) and click on the visibility tab. You can select whether it's default (i.e. things that are normally visible like dynamics will be visible, things that are normally hidden like mpc's are hidden), always visible, never visible, or only visible if on the top staff (handy for things like flow directions).

Here's a file for you to play with. No saxes, but /lots/ of brass! :)

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/nwc/iolafin.nwc


#1762: Noteworthy on Mac's
Noteworthy on Mac's

(1762)

Submitted by: Joe Mooney on 30-Sep-2000

I am trying to use noteworthy to help my children learn to play piano, at my teachers request. I am a Macintosh person and have a iMac DV SE,a 2000 version. I have installed Virtual PC 3.03 and am running Windows 95. I am also using NoteWorthy Composer 1.7.2. The problem is that with playback of the pieces there is and echo that follows about a bar behind on most compositions I have received from our teacher. This doesn't happen with all the pieces only some.Additiionally the instrument type really doesn't vary and they all sound the same. I suspect it is related to the sound card emulation but I am not sure. Does anyone have experience with NoteWorthy on Macintosh machines and do you have any suggestion?. Thank you in advance for your help :-) Joe Mooney

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Sep-2000

Are you sure that it is not the files themselves? If you send us an example, we can at least eliminate the file as the source of the issue.

Reply 2 offered by: Guinevere Boswell on 05-Oct-2000

Why can't I get the old songs and lyrics on Cresscendo like I used to so I could sing along.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Oct-2000

Guinevere, I think you may be looking for support in the wrong place. Perhaps this link will get you to the correct support location: http://www.liveupdate.com/

Reply 4 offered by: Kevin_Raven on 22-Oct-2000

I couldn't help but noticing that you put an apostrophe after the word 'mac.' Apostrophes should only be used when there is a possesive (as in the mac's greatness) or in a contraction (as in, Windows computers aren't as good)

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 22-Oct-2000

Ah, but I believe that Noteworthy Support is grammatically correct here. The reason is that "Mac" is indeed a contraction for "Macintosh." If it were not a contraction, then the remark about not using an apostrophe would be correct.


#1763: Edit song title
Edit song title

(1763)

Submitted by: Stephen Reynolds on 01-Oct-2000

I want to change the title in one of my files. The Help file is almost no help at all with this sort of thing. If you don't know NoteWorthy's exact phrasing for whatever it is you want, a search is fruitless. When you finally find something that looks relevant, it is likely to be a description of what some command does. In this case, the Info command may be what I want. But what the hell is the Info command? I can't find it anywhere on the menu bar. Why can't the Help file on Info command (or any other) tell how you actually do it? And meanwhile, how do I edit a song title? I'm sure it is much easier to do this than to fund out how to do it.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Oct-2000

See page 4 of the User's Guide.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 01-Oct-2000

Page 4 is blank in my User's Guide (NWCUG152-Rev1 (c)1988)

I think what you're talking about is discussed in a note (no, the alphabetic-sequence type of note) in the "Creating a new file" section. (page 5 here).

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Oct-2000

Your version is quite old. The titling and authorship is almost the first thing discussed in the current User's Guide.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Oct-2000

You are quite correct, however, that the procedure to change the info is in a note, even inthe 1.70 version.

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 01-Oct-2000

>>Your version is quite old.

True, and it's all your fault, for shipping all those upgrades free :-)

I'm using 1.7 now. (But I have convinced two other people to buy it.)


#1764: User's Guide Online
User's Guide Online

(1764)

Submitted by: R C Vanderburgh on 01-Oct-2000

Since many of us have outdated User's Guides (snail mailed with original order), how about putting a continually updated, comprehensive guide online? Including the info on the CD now being mailed to new NWCers.

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 01-Oct-2000

Absolutely! Put yourself in the place of someone who has downloaded on a trial basis and is deciding whether NoteWorthy will meet his/her needs. The Help files, frankly, suck. It does no good to be told constantly that the word you have typed in doesn't exist in the files, especially if you have already tried five or six ways of stating what you are after. And when you do guess right about how to ask for it, it does no good to get a summary of what a given command will do but no clue about how to issue that command, which you are not likely to find in any menu you can access from the menu bar--odds are it's in a dialog box, but what keystroke will get you that box? The 'Help' files refuse to tell! And then you get the answer: Look in the User's Guide--which you don't have yet! Just try to find 'user's guide' in Search on the web site! During the past few days I have several time spent hours trying to find out how to do something that took seconds once I finally found out. Please either upgrade the help files so that they help, or put the User's Guide online, or both! I really like your system, when I can find out how to use it!

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Oct-2000

I second the motion to have the user guide available online, preferably as a pdf or gzipped postscript file. Though I have both copies of the guide, I've developed an aversion to hard-copy... if it's on my computer I'm less likely to "misplace" it, and I can easily refer to it and keep it in the background where a quick Alt-Tab brings it to the focus.

Reply 3 offered by: ah choo on 02-Oct-2000

Yes. Productive thoughts. Well done guys.

I maintain the help file for the software at work and its a big job. It's easy to patch users who upgrade their software but the help is always much harder to update and distribute that the software. I'm thinking that the best thing to do is just have it on the web site.
The upside of all of this is that I've never had
to use the online help in Noteworthy, it's too easy. :-)

[All's I want is the Page Setup window fixed (so I don't have to click the tiny arrow after using Preview), and have a drum track and Noteworthy will be perfect.]

happy noteworthying.
ah choo

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 09-Oct-2000

ah choo is surely right about the difficulty of keeping help files up to date. But they should be helpful, but something as elementary as including in the description of a command the keystrokes needed to get the dialog box containing the command--isn't that obvious? If you want to dig a hole, it's good to know what a shovel does, but it's a good deal better if you also have a shovel.


#1765: New, excellent method for GIF images from NWC
New, excellent method for GIF images from NWC

(1765)

Submitted by: Joe Music on 02-Oct-2000

This notice will be of interest to Windows 95/98 users of NWC who want to make sharp GIF images of simple sheet music for display on Internet web pages. I realize that this topic is not new. But what I have here is new. The hyperlink to the necessary software is given below.

The method is free, fast once installed, and relatively no-brainer. It does not require Ghostscript. It is specifically intended to produce images with sharp line art and text from NWC when seen at computer monitor resolution. It would be useful for small compositions, or portions of them, such as church hymns or folk songs. Monitor resolution is just too coarse for complicated compositions.

This method has nothing to do with transmitting MIDI files or NWC compositions intended to be printed as sheet music. Nor does it have anything to do with using a WMF as a placed object within a program such as MS Word. It is strictly about creating GIF images for monitor display via the Internet.

Here is the concept: NWC can export a placeable Windows Metafile (WMF) via File>Print Preview>Copy. The WMF can be directly opened as an image in the free "Irfan View" software, then converted to another format such as GIF. Those of you who regularly follow the NWC Forum already know this.

However, the WMF resolution (dpi) depends upon the resolution of whichever printer has been set up for use by NWC. Typical printer resolutions are multiples of 300 dpi. As a result, the WMF image is too large for display on the Internet, and so it must be scaled down. The end result of starting with a file at the wrong resolution, then scaling it to the correct resolution, results in a fuzzy-looking final product. Small details are often hard to read.

My method is simple: I have created a free "dummy printer" that is installed by the usual method in Windows 95/98. The resolution of this device is optimized for the purpose of creating a web-ready image. Within NWC, the "dummy printer" is set prior to going to Print Preview to create the WMF. The resulting WMF is at monitor resolution and does not need to be re-scaled. All you need to do is open it in Irfan View, crop it if you wish, and save as GIF. The "dummy printer" does allow a wide range of resolutions to be selected, to achieve different effects. However, it cannot be used as a real printer. It is strictly a means of manipulating WMF resolution.

The resulting GIF image has line art that is very sharp, and text that is also very sharp. Some of you may find it a bit jaggedy, but artistic mellowness is not the goal. In many cases, the spacing between staff lines will not be perfectly uniform, but this may happen even when using expensive image processing software.

If you want to try it on a "beta test" basis, then it can be downloaded at:

http://www.scshop.com/~joemusic/dummyres.htm

You will see a sample image on the web page. Remember, "beta test" is not for everybody. But I haven't found any difficulties yet. It is for Windows 95/98, not 3.1. I have no idea whether it would work on NT or ME.

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 02-Oct-2000

For those of you who need to see clickable hyperlinks:

http://www.scshop.com/~joemusic/dummyres.htm

--JM

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 02-Oct-2000

Joe,

Thanks for an interesting toy. A nice, lateral solution. However, as I reported earlier, this is one problem I haven't been able to reproduce. Indeed, I WANT to get a higher resolution WMF file, but I cannot get it more than screen resolution. What am I doing wrong? I've tried your printer at several resolutions, but still I get exactly the same sized image every time. I even added 600 and 1200 DPI, still no change in the size or resolution of the WMF file generated. What am I doing wrong? Even with real printers capable of 1200 DPI, I can't get Noteworthy to generate a WMF file larger than my screen.

Can someone give me a click by click description of how to get this problem?

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 02-Oct-2000

I wouldn't know how to solve the problem of *higher* resolution on WMF. In fact, for all I know the limitation is in the WMF format itself. My solution was to get *lower* resolution.

If you happen to own a high-quality drawing program, it may be able to open the WMF as a drawing object. For example, Adobe Illustrator will do this. Presumably the resulting file can then be manipulated within the drawing application, and saved or printed at a higher resolution.

As for Irfan View, there is a maximum limit on the pixel dimensions it will handle. If you attempt to exceed the size (which would happen at high resolutions) it seems that irfan View downscales the image somehow. I do not know the details.

Remember, folks, my "dummy resolution" is ONLY intended for those of you who wish to make sharp GIF images of line art, such as from NWC. I have tried it within Adobe Illustrator and it also works very nicely for obtaining images (rather than drawings) at screen resolution.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Oct-2000

John,

When you say the image is always the same size - do you mean on your monitor or in a Word document or in a graphics package.

The beauty of WMF is the ability to rescale without distortion (as long as the resolution is suitable).
How does the resolution appear when the image is stretched ( in Word or whatever).

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Oct-2000

Joe, that looks like exactly what the doctor ordered for dealing with NWC .wmf files. But I can't seem to get it installed on my system, it finds the .inf file and is obviously reading it since it comes up with "Dummy Resolution" as a printer to install, but when I click Next it tells me "Windows is unable to gather file information for this printer." I've tried different locations for the .inf and the .ppd printer definition files, even tried installing from within the windows/system directory, but no go. Could it be because I already have another printer on the system that uses pscript.drv and psmon.dll? (And no, making it not the default printer doesn't help either.)

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 02-Oct-2000

John, why are you wanting to create GIF files -- oh, I understand to be visible from a web browser; but PDF files are smallers, display better, and are just as editable (i.e. practically speaking, not.) PDF files are, I think, about as portable -- who doesn't have and can't get Adobe Acrobat reader and/or Ghostscript? PDF files can be displayed or printed at whatever resolution, and appear sharp but non-jagged.

I've been generating PDF files for the sake of people who don't have NWC (mac / unix users, for instance) -- I publish NWC, PDF, and MIDI files. If someone can't get to _any_ of those, um, it's time to trade the TRS-80 in on a computer.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Oct-2000

John, what are you using to determine the "resolution" of the WMF files that you create. As I explained in another thread, WMF files do not really have resolution, but do have a coordinate system. The actual resolution used to display a WMF file is purely a decision made by the displaying application.

The utility introduced in this thread simply allows you to specify the coordinate system that would be used by NWC when the WMF file is created (since NWC bases the coordinate system on the printer metrics). Whatever you are using to display the WMF, it might just always make the resolution match the screen size.

Reply 8 offered by: Joe Music on 03-Oct-2000

Fred: I will contact you by E-mail to discuss installation of the Dummy Resolution device. No doubt there are variations in installation on systems other than my own, and no doubt this problem can be fixed.

Stephen: Indeed, PDF is the right way to transmit sheet music intended for printing, ar larger compositions. The only reason to use GIF is to show an "immediate" music graphic on a web page. But if you size the graphic well, and if it is only one page, the GIF should be readable enough if printed (for something simple such as a folk song or hymn).

John: Noteworthy Support knows what they are talking about regarding what you are trying to do. I can only guess that maybe you are trying to print at higher resolution than is supported by whatever kind of (real) printer you are using. The choices of resolution offered by a printer are determined by the printer driver. For example, I have a (commercial) printer driver that offers up to 2400 dpi resolution, but that's because the actual printer, which is designed for commercial art, will do that. It's useful for magazine-quality color separations, but I cannot see what benefit such resolution would offer for NWC sheet music: 300 dpi is just fine.

Generally, the WMF format is a vector drawing file. When a WMF is opened in a drawing program such as Adobe Illustrator, it remains a vector drawing file. But when opened in Irfan View, the WMF is rasterized to a bitmap image and no longer retains its identity as vector drawing. It is the process of conversion from vector to raster that underlies the usage of "Dummy Resolution."

Reply 9 offered by: John Gillings on 04-Oct-2000

Thanks for the suggestions. My "real" target printer is 1200dpi.

The display program I'm using is IrfanView. I follow the directions of saving a WMF file, then open it in IrfanView. No matter what I do it comes out 652x940 pixels. I thought this peculiar as descriptions elsewhere had described the image as being much larger than the screen and having to resample downwards. That Joe found it necessary to dream up his inventive hack to "fix" this problem that I can't reproduce just makes me more curious.

What I was trying to achieve was to import the WMF file into IrfanView at fairly high resolution, export in some other format (maybe TIFF) so I could then import it into a graphic editor to manipulate it.

I've had similar issues with IrfanView importing high resolution images, but that was my mistake, I had "Fit image to Window" selected. I'm using IrfanView V3.25, but I've also tried a few versions back to 3.05 with the same results. It seems to always do "Best fit to desktop" with these files.

Aha! Just tried 60dpi and I now get an image 559x807, so it looks like it's IrfanView doing the resizing. That's odd because I have other large images in different formats (TIFF and JPG) which open at their "correct" size. I've been through the options lots of times but can't find anything which would affect this.

Reply 10 offered by: Joe Music on 05-Oct-2000

Yes, there is a downampling issue, but think of the user base. If you own a good drawing program, try importing your WMF there.

In any case, my method for creating "dummy resolution" merely involved hacking a generic Postscript printer description file (editable in Notepad) to allow different resolutions other than the original choices offered. Since there doesn't seem to be much need for this except among those of you who have the samrts to do it yourself, I will remove the software and description of its usage from my web page in the near future.

Reply 11 offered by: Art thompson on 05-Oct-2000

It has been discussed elsewhere that importing into Word gives a satisfactory image. If you then save the page as HTML, it automatically converts the image to a GIF. You can then right-click on the image to save the image by itself.

Reply 12 offered by: Joe Music on 05-Oct-2000

True. However, I have found that the exported GIF from MS Word (save as HTML) does not have the correct resolution for my needs. Perhaps this is user-definable, but it never gave me the control I wanted. Actually, I have many high-priced image processing programs that suit my own needs just fine, without the need for hacking or work-arounds. But I thought that my "free advice for the low-budgeted" might be useful. If not, ignore it!

Reply 13 offered by: Fred on 05-Oct-2000

John - rather than speculate on how Irfanview handles .wmf importation, I dropped a line to the author. Here's the scoop (his reference to "height/width info in the header" presumably means that the exporting program puts that there, based on current printer resolution; which explains the interdependance between printer resolution and observed import size of the raster image).

>Hi Irfan,
>
>How does Irfanview deal with .wmf vector files? What determines which
>"resolution" it uses when opening the file? Is there a way of "telling"
>it what the dimensions of the imported raster-based file should be?
>
>Sorry if this has been answered, I did look through the Help and FAQ
>sections and am none the wiser....
> [...]

Hi,

WMF: in most cases is there a width/height info in the header ...
If not, maximal desktop size ...


#1766: New excellent method revisited
New excellent method revisited

(1766)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Oct-2000

(I tried posting this in the "New excellent method..." thread, but for whatever reason it wouldn't let me...)

For whatever reason, commonly available .wmf readers such as Irfanview import .wmf files at the resolution specified by the resolution of the default or active printer when the file was created. The problem with, say, 300 dpi is that the note stems are still but one pixel wide. Resizing them to a lower resolution causes most of them to disappear, resampling (i.e. applying anti-aliasing) makes them grey and fuzzy.

Joe, I got your system to work by simply copying your resolution definitions into my existing printer definition file (defprtr2.ppd, as supplied by Adobe with their Generic PostScript printer driver... I've recently switched to this because the Windows one crashes on some files for no good reason). What a great idea!! The low-res gif images produced using your method are far superior to resampled hi-res images.

If anyone wants to do an A-B comparison, have a look at these files:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/other/test96.gif

(96 dpi)

and

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/other/test300.gif

(resampled 300 dpi)

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 03-Oct-2000

Indeed, Fred's two samples show the difference. (Fred: I just sent you an E-mail suggesting how to fix your installation problem. I hadn't read your above message first. I now see that you found the solution yourself).

NWC users: Remember, it is asking too much of your computer monitor to have it display anything complicated at monitor resolution. My "Dummy Resolution" method is for simple things. A GIF image showing just how well the method works is on the page where I put the software:

http://www.scshop.com/~joemusic/dummyres.htm

If you have installation difficulties, I suggest that (1) You read the accompanying instructions dummyres_readme.txt, or if that doesn't help, use Notepad to open the DUMMYRES.PPD file and take a peek at what I did. Knowledgeable users can figure out what to do from there.

Reply 2 offered by: MMario on 03-Oct-2000

Did you reverse those two samples? because on my monitor the resampled 300 dpi is VASTLY superior to the other in clarity, legibility, crispness, etc. etc. etc.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 03-Oct-2000

I'm sure that Fred put the samples in correct order. On my monitor, the scaled 300 dpi looks better, too. There is a reason.

My method of "Dummy Resulution" achieves one purpose only" sharpness of the line art (and text). In certain situations, particularly when there are a lot of staffs (staves?) or notation on a page, the staff size has to be kept small in order to fit everything in. In such a situation, using "Dummy Resolution" is counter-productive. In fact, when the music is complicated, PDF format is the way to go.

As I stated originally, "Dummy Resolution" works best when the desired GIF image is of something relatively short and simple, such as a folk song or church hymn without many staffs (staves?). That allows the staff, lyric, and text sizes (within NWC) to be set large enough for "Dummy Resolution" to play with. See the sample "Break Forth, O Beauteous Heavenly Light" on http://www.scshop.com/~joemusic/dummyres.htm

It is a matter of personal taste. Sharp images can be made fuzzy (or, anti-aliased) more easily than fuzzy images can be made sharp.


#1767: How do I...
How do I...

(1767)

Submitted by: AcquiredPower on 03-Oct-2000

-control the length of a crescendo/decrescendo -set the change in the dynamic level from the begining to the end of a crescendo/decrescendo -increace the amount of white space between each note -put a triplet beam above the notes even if the note stems are down -create a 'sffz' sforzando??

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Oct-2000

-by positioning the second dynamic where you want the crescendo to end -by adjusting the dynamic before and after the crescendo -by using File | Page Setup | "Increase note spacing for larger durations", or adding spacing from Note Properties, or by adding blank text between notes, or by adding blank lyrics with long, blank syllables using the underscore -the triplet mark goes with the stem direction -Insert | Text Expression

Reply 2 offered by: AcquiredPower on 03-Oct-2000

thanks for the help and the quick responce.


#1768: Notation across Staves
Notation across Staves

(1768)

Submitted by: Janene Broere on 05-Oct-2000

I am new to Noteworthy (brilliant piece of Software) and seek assistance. I am notating a piece of music that runs across the bass and treble clef - it is for harp or piano and in the piece of music I have, the 2 staves are treated as one ie left hand running to right hand. I cannot seem to duplicate this in Noteworthy. I don't care about the midi aspects only the printed part. I can do a 'fix' by inserting rests and hiding but then cannot beam the semiquavers or slur across the staves.

Does anyone have a solution or is it not possible?

Cheers

Janene

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 05-Oct-2000

Janene,

Interesting problem. I tried creating two staffs, bass and treble with top and bottom spacing such that the middle C's coincided. That way you could stay in (say) the bottom staff and place notes that would actually appear in the top staff. Unfortunately it appears the minimum spacing at top and bottom is 8, so the staves don't get close enough.

Now, if you *REALLY* don't care about MIDI playback, you might make do with something along these lines, just for the cross over parts, placing the notes in whichever stave you're running from, but at a position so they display in the other staff. You'll need to white out the ledger lines. For example, I have treble and bass with spacing of 8. A run of 4 quavers from A in the bass up to D in the treble. If I enter the notes as A, B, G, A in the bass clef, the G and A appear to be C and D in the treble clef. I can beam and/or slur across the whole group. The only visual problem is the extra ledger lines and the discontiguous spacing.

Noteworthy support - I'm sure there's a really good reason for not allowing the top and bottom spacing down to 6, but if that were possible the Cs would coincide and these runs would be feasible.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Oct-2000

Each staff, even those combined into a piano grand staff, are actually independent entities when it comes to notes and stuff. Your best bet is to do whatever you can by using hiddden rests in the staff that is not used during the run. So, when the part runs from the bass clef staff into the treble clef staff, just add hidden rests in the bass clef staff to show that the music is flowing from one staff into the other. You will not be able to combine the note beams and slurs, but the absence of notation in the other staff should make the run fairly clear.

Reply 3 offered by: Mark Browse on 06-Oct-2000

I've managed to create a beamed group that 'jumps' from one stave to another by the following method.

I noticed that if you make the last note of a beamed group invisible, the beam does not become invisible but 'hangs' to the right. I also noticed that when the last 2 notes of a beamed group are the same, the beam is always exactly horizontal and the length of the stems of all the notes in the group (and hence the vertical position of the beam) can be adjusted depending on the pitch of those final notes.

In my piece there is an arpeggio-like accompaniment that passes from the left hand to the right. The first 3 notes (quavers, or eighth-notes) are in the left hand. Having written these, I inserted 2 'dummy' notes, beamed the whole lot and made sure the stems were pointing up. The dummy notes were made invisible, so that the beam stuck out to the right. I padded out the rest of the bar with invisible rests in the left hand.

The right-hand part starts at the fourth quaver. I put in 3 invisible rests so the first note would occur at the correct point, and then completed the right-hand part with beamed quavers. As it happened, Noteworthy made the beam in the right hand exactly horizontal too (with stems down).

By adjusting the pitch of the invisible 'dummy' notes in the left hand I could line the left-hand beam up with the right-hand one so they looked like a continuous line. The staves have to be a certain distance apart (say 15 minimum) or you might find you can't get the stems short enough.

The result looks fine in my piece. I don't think it would work in every conceivable situation, because it relies on the beams being horizontal. But it's worth playing round with the possibilities. If you could manually specify the length of note stems you could do almost anything. (It's on my wish list!)

As a final refinement, you can insert a MPC before the invisible 'dummy' notes to make them inaudible as well (and another after them to turn the sound back on).

Incidentally, if you make the *first* note of a beamed group invisible, the stems and beams of all the other notes disappear too, leaving you with disembodied note-heads. So far I haven't found a use for this. Any ideas?

Reply 4 offered by: Art thompson on 06-Oct-2000

Quite a discovery. This allows one to write something resembling Plainsong Chant - With whole notes indicating long durations and filled in notes shorter. The actual durations are determined by the performer, and the appropriate rhythm determined by the text. Modern Composers like George Crumb have also used 'stemless' notes for similar effect.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Bacher on 06-Oct-2000

I hadn't thought much about the fact that a beamed group with two identically pitched notes ends up with a strictly horizontal beam, but now that you mentioned it, I realize why some of my scores look really, well, cruddy.

Isn't it conceivable that someone - me, for instance, now that my attention has been drawn to it - might report this to Noteworthy Support as a bug, and that Noteworthy Support might even go and fix it?

Should that occur, your cross-staff beaming solution will fail.

Always dangerous to depend upon chance behaviors of software.

- seb

Reply 6 offered by: Art thompson on 06-Oct-2000

I wouldn't call it a bug exactly. NWC appears to do fine with a finite set of beamed note choices - 3rds, 2nds, a few 3rds and a fourth, for example. If it doesn't fit those known choices, it just makes the beam straight. A solution might be to give the beam 'properties' that the user can modify. Or allow the user to control the 'Beam lookup table', if that's how it's done. There are just too many note combinations, for the program to handle each one to the users' preference.

Reply 7 offered by: ah choo on 08-Oct-2000

I thought the most obvious solution would be to slur the two notes on the one stave. Then continue the notation on the other stave! I'm sure I've done this before... very easy :-)


#1769: point size vs page size
point size vs page size

(1769)

Submitted by: Alfie on 07-Oct-2000

Hi All,
I have a part for a piece I printed out and
when I set the point size to 19 the music
only covers about 40% of the page but when
I set the point size to 20 the music takes
up one page and a third of a second page.
Why can't I set a point size to 19.5?
Why doesn't the music automatically fit to the page size?
Thank you for your help.
@lfie

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Oct-2000

What version of NWC are you using? Would you please e-mail me your file for review?


#1770: NWC Songs
NWC Songs

(1770)

Submitted by: Hank Robertson on 08-Oct-2000

Hi guys, I have entered a couple of hundred songs into NWC notation (note by note and sign by sign, since I don't play an instrument) (mostly country/western types) that I wouldn't mind e-mailing (or whatever) to anyone who wanted them, however, am I correct in assuming that this would violate copyright laws? Yes, no, maybe? (Don't want the men in blue to descend upon me) ;-)

Have fun and keep the music flowing.

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 08-Oct-2000

There is a section at the NWC Scriptorium regarding copyright law that may address your concerns.

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/copyright.html

You can check individual works at the Music Publisher's Association web site. This site can also help you get in touch with whoever holds the copyright to a song so that you can arrange the work with permission.

http://www.mpa.org/

Reply 2 offered by: Hank Robertson on 09-Oct-2000

Okey dokey, thanx for the info.


#1771: [Linux] NWC success under Wine
[Linux] NWC success under Wine

(1771)

Submitted by: Matt Johnson on 08-Oct-2000

Just a short note to say that after a very crude and tiny hack to the Wine source code and a little font magic, I have successfully got NWC running under Wine.

I won't go into the gory details, but those of you who are interested, post here or mail me. If there's sufficient interest I'll document the procedure and get some downloadables together.

--MJ

Reply 1 offered by: Matt Johnson on 09-Oct-2000

Ok, there's a downloadable available with the necessary files and bare bones instructions.

ftp://vadu.com/pub/scripto/helpful/nwc-under-wine.tar.gz

Regards,

--M

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Horne on 19-Apr-2001

I'll have a look, thanks.

In the meantime here's a post from comp.emulators.ms-windows.wine.

>Noteworthy Composer (www.ntworthy.com) displays blank staves - no
>notes

It's a TrueType handling problem as you have seen (the
GetCharABCWidths trace).

I have tried a quick and dirty patch and found that indeed
implementing TrueType correctly should fix this app as the
notes are displayed as a TrueType font.

You can have some hope for the future as - AFAIK - Codeweavers lists
this as a goal for Wine 1.0, and one of the Wine contributors (Huw
Davies) is said to work on it.


#1772: Handwritten font
Handwritten font

(1772)

Submitted by: Aver Idge on 09-Oct-2000

Could somebody make a handwritten version of the noteworthy
font or tell me how to do it? I would absolutely love that
if it's possible. thanx

Reply 1 offered by: Art thompson on 09-Oct-2000

Do you mean something that looks a little crooked,or less than perfect,as if it was hand-written?

Reply 2 offered by: Aver Idge on 09-Oct-2000

No something, stylish, attractive, in a handwritten style,
and easy to read. like the Finale music software jazz font.
Has anyone made a font before?

Reply 3 offered by: Art Thompson on 10-Oct-2000

I know that CorelDraw can create or modify fonts. I'm sure there's plenty of other programs as well. A time consuming but rewarding project, I'm sure.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Oct-2000

You can change TEXT fonts in NWC but the note font is fixed to the NWC15 font (as far as I know) so the note style will always be the same - Eric will correct me if I'm wrong.
Even if you make a font it would require a change in program structure to read it.

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Edwards on 12-Oct-2000

Unless you replace the NWC15 font with another of the same name ;-)

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Oct-2000

Correct. NWC uses its own font for the noteheads and stuff, and is not user configurable.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred on 12-Oct-2000

Such a hand-style font is installed if you download/ install Sibelius' "Scorch" browser plug-in. Be aware, however, that it's mapped differently than the NWCV15.TTF font required by NWC. That being said, if you had a suitable font editor, you might be able to modify the symbols in NWCV15.TTF if you know what you're doing. (I don't, so won't attempt it...) :) Don't forget to make a backup of the original font just in case...

Reply 8 offered by: Aver Idge on 13-Oct-2000

I don't see a consensus in what you guys are saying.
All I'm asking for is can I use a font program to customise the Noteworthy music font?
Yes or No?
I know I can change the user fonts - I mean, even Comic Sans is a better font for chord names.
But I want to use more stylish symbols for clefs and notes and things like that.
I thought Windows fonts were scalable, so if I change the Noteworthy fonts and keep identical proportions shouldn't Noteworthy show it the same?
Everybody else patches Noteworthy to suit their needs - why can't I!
Another font would suit me much better (ok so I'm a bit fussy) but if I can do it would others be interested?

Reply 9 offered by: Steve on 14-Oct-2000

I made a few changes to the music symbols in the Noteworthy font and copied the nwcv15.ttf font back into the windows font directory and Noteworthy no longer recognised it. Why is this? Why can't I personalise the font. I feel that this is a bit of a pity in that we can't do this. I think it would be good to allow the customer to choose from two or more fonts, specifically one handwritten for jazz, or other more antique styles. The final engraved score does generate a reaction in the musician - it can also be a reflection of the composer - how he has his music published. I think this is all worth putting some more effort into. If there's a patch that can be made to build a couple of extra fonts I believe that would be a step in the right direction. Thank you for your consideration in this matter.

Reply 10 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Oct-2000

A font like the Finale "Jazz" font would be nice.
But then NWCv15.ttf "swings" better than most of the fonts I've seen in similar programs.
I'd move drum notation above a new font in the priority for my wish list.

Reply 11 offered by: Joe Music on 14-Oct-2000

Steve:

The NWCV15.ttf can indeed be "personalized" with a font editor. I've done it. But, of course, it cannot be distributed (read the copyright notice).

I also had a problem trying to put my personalized font in the Widnows fonts folder. I believe the problem may be in one of three categories:

(1) Your font editor inserts changes to the font identification information without telling you about it; or,

(2) You have changed from the imported coding to some other style of coduing (ISO-Latin, or whatever); or,

(3) The way that Windows wants fonts to be installed, de-installed, or changed is to use the "remove font" or "install new font" menu commands from within the font control panel, rather than just moving files into or out of the font folder. Also, you may need to re-start your machine after changes.

Suggestion: If your font editor allows you to create Type 1 fonts (Postscript) as well as TTF, and if you have a drawing program (such as Adobe Illustrator) capable of finding a font and exchanging it with a different one, then you might try making a separate Type 1 variation, installing it (it does not go in the Windows fonts folder) using Adobe Type Manager (free), and take it from there.

Reply 12 offered by: Chris Lea on 08-Dec-2000

Google dropped me on to your forum. It is indeed possible to create a custom font. A friend of mine did this for me recently, on the request of my tenant, who likes my printing (I trained to be an Architect way before computers took over the routine drafting work). If you had a preference for notation in a particular style, and were able to furnish a sample of your writing, my friend and I could probably furnish you a completely customized font in your own handwriting style, for a fee.

Reply 13 offered by: Joe Music on 11-Dec-2000

Oh, there's no doubt that it is possible to create custom music fonts, fonts that resemble a certain handwriting style, and so forth. The situation with NWC is that notes are assembled in software from a combination of font elements and drawn elements. A custom font would do nothing about the drawn elements - stems and beams. Also, flags (for eighth, sixteenth, etc.) are separate font items. That is, there is no "sixteenth note" in the NWCV15 font.

Reply 14 offered by: Rae Ecklund on 03-Jul-2001

Anyone out there doing digitizing handwriting into personal
fonts?

Reply 15 offered by: FranMan on 04-Jul-2001

Hey guys,
Did you notice the jazz font new at the Scriptorium? I downloaded it and it works, but it doesn't seem legal as the author has only modified the font. I don't know...

Reply 16 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 05-Jul-2001

I just took a look at that font (both the usual way, and in my font editor). I was going to comment regarding the above question by FranMan, but decided that (1) I couldn't make my comments brief enough, and (2) I'm not an authority.

Moving right along ... In Windows, there is a difference between a "font name" and the "file name" given to a font. For the original NWCV15, both the font name and the file name are the same. It doesn't have to be that way. I could have a font named "Tymes Old Etruscan" with file name "tymoe" or even "banana." Fonts are listed by font name, not file name, in the Windows 9x font folder. Some applications expect that certain standard fonts will have particular file names. But not usually.

Suppose you have the original NWCV15 installed. If you download the jazzy font, then double-click on its file to see it in the font viewer, you are in for a surprise. It will look like the original. That is because Windows ignores the file name, looks internally to see "NWCV15," notices that a font with that font name is already installed, and displays the installed version. To see the jazzy font as it really is, you must first uninstall the original font. (Don't forget to put it back!)

A side issue: Do not place backup copies of the original and the jazzy font in the same folder. When installing a font, Windows looks for the font name, not the file name. Both the original and jazzy version are perceived as being NWCV15. Confusion will result if the fonts are not archived in readily distinguishable locations.

I could have named my "Banger" drum-head font as NWCV15 internally, but felt that (1) It might be treading on NWC's turf, and (2) Inexperienced users could get it intermingled with the real version, especially if both font files were installed, and cause themselves numerous headaches. It is easier to hex-edit a WMF output file, since a new one can be created in the event of error.

Reply 17 offered by: FranMan on 06-Jul-2001

I do like your idea of naming Banger as such that way you can have both fonts installed and used whenever needed. The directions for the jazz font ARE very clear, however, and the jazz font does work as it is supposed to.

Reply 18 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Jul-2001

You mean, you read instructions first?

Reply 19 offered by: FranMan on 06-Jul-2001

Who said I read the directions FIRST? No, I read them after I mess up my computer to find out what went wrong. Then I call the company and complain that the directions weren't noticable, and they give me a new computer. JUST KIDDING... I am propbably the only person who is half computer geek and half direction follower! Go ahead, call me crazy!

Reply 20 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Jul-2001

Far be it from me to call an instruction-reader crazy!

In other news:

I believe that I have figured out how to use both ordinary notes and X-head notes (or some other style) in the same file, without altering the NWC program. My "Banger" font made a universal substitution, changing all ordinary notes to X-heads. But what about, say, a combination of vocal, piano, and percussion staves, where you only want to change the percussion? Perhaps it's do-able! I have tried my method on a few test files, and it seems to work.

Stay tuned. I have to see if this also works on more complicated files. If it doesn't, then I won't release it (and won't even say what I've done, other than that it does not involve a drawing program or other graphics editing).

No promises!

Reply 21 offered by: FranMan on 06-Jul-2001

COOL! Will this eventually lead up to having a combination on ONE staff? (Maybe with the layering feature)

Reply 22 offered by: FranMan on 06-Jul-2001

Robert-
You know what you said about only the font deigner can change the internal font name? Well, I just edited the jazz font to become jazzme. You have to replace all occuraces of the font name including the one that is spaced out near the bottom.

Reply 23 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 07-Jul-2001

FranMan -- I assumed you changed the jazzme font name using a hex editor. So was wrong about only a font editor being needed for that purpose. What I meant was, the file name and the font name are two different things.

Actually, some fonts cannot be changed with a hex editor (or even a font editor) due to some sort of checksum encoding (to prevent changes). But that's mostly for very unique, proprietary fonts, I'm told.

I will let the forum know the ahem, score, regarding my method for making notation changes, by this coming Thursday (July 12, 2001). So far, it works for me, but I have not tested the method on very complicated compositions, such as those with layering and color effects.

Reply 24 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 09-Jul-2001

As I wrote above, I have been working on something. Here it is:

Power users only: I have found a way to modify WMFs output from NWC in such a way as to allow a variety of changes to the musical notation. This is a generalization of the technique used by my own "Banger" font and the jazz-style font posted on the Scriptorium.

This is for use with NWC v.1.70 32-bit. If the program is upgraded in the future, the method may or may not work with the new version.

The new method shows how modification can be applied to a portion of a WMF, rather than globally. One application is to change an individual staff to drum x-head notation without affecting ordinary-note staves in the same composition. No doubt there are other applications. Just for fun, I provided the capability to change note-heads into little smile-faces or frown-faces.

This method is not for the timid; but if you can compose music, you can do this. I cannot guarantee that it will work all the time, but I have tested it on a variety of WMFs output from NWC, and so far it works.

A sample of what can be accomplished is at:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/misc/hackit.htm

From there, you can also download a ZIP file containing the necessary items, and instructions.

Either this works for you, or it doesn't. If not, keep in mind that I am not a programmer, and therefore I cannot provide further assistance. This is a "works for me" technique that I am passing along to those who might benefit. If any of you, inspired by the method, are able to improve upon it, then be my guest.

The font that comes with the ZIP file is user-modifiable to suit your own purposes, if you happen to have a font editor.

Reply 25 offered by: Peter Bowers on 09-Jul-2001

This might have an easier solution, perhaps the ability to enter a different font per staff. This would allow a combination of percussion notation and "normal" notation if the resulting staves were layered.

Reply 26 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 09-Jul-2001

Indeed, Peter. But that would require a significant program change to NWC. Meanwhile, there's my (hopefully temporary) solution).

Reply 27 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 10-Jul-2001

If you downloaded my "hackit" yesterday, go back and re-load it from my site. There was a small mistake that needed correction. Also, more symbols have been added. This should be the "final version."


#1773: NWC to MS Word
NWC to MS Word

(1773)

Submitted by: Stephen Reynolds on 09-Oct-2000

Now comes the next step: doing musical examples in NoteWorthy Composer and then transferring them to a typescript in Microsoft Word. Can anyone tell me (step by step--just naming some procedure I don't yet know how to do won't help) how to go about this? This is the thing that will determine whether NWC will meet my needs.

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 09-Oct-2000

Assuming you're running the latest version of NWC

1. In 'options' turn off 'title page info' (unless you want the whole page). If you want just a snippet of music then it's best if that's the only thing in the file - it's more complex to select something from a larger image, but it is possible!
2. Go into print preview.
3. Select copy and (for simplicity) 'clipboard'; 'metafile' works as well but there are more steps.
4. In Word go to the desired insertion point and press 'Control V'.
5. The image will be too big (probably). Right click on it and select 'format picture' and 'picture'. You can now crop the picture to size. You can also resize (i.e. magnify)it in the 'size' tab if you want.
6. Select 'wrapping' and probably 'square style' and 'both sides' and there you have your image in the middle of the text.

Don't try to edit the picture however - it tends to fall apart!

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Oct-2000

> 5. The image will be too big (probably).

It shouldn't be. We made changes in version 1.70 that corrected the problems found in earlier versions.

---------------------------------
Bug: Print Preview Copy sends improper sizing information to the clipboard.

Status: Confirmed; Fix completed for version 1.70
---------------------------------

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 09-Oct-2000

If you can find a printer driver that allows custom page sizes, you can select the exact size and shape of your example without having to crop or scale it. I used the "MS Publisher Imagesetter" and selected a page size of 25mmx50mm with staff size of 20pts to generate a short sequence of notes.

I had a quick look around a Windows distribution CD to try and find a "standard" printer with customisable page sizes. There wasn't anything obvious. If you find one, install it on your system as "print to file" and use Printer Setup in NWC to select a suitable page size. Don't forget to reset your margins.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 10-Oct-2000

I didn't mean to imply that the picture was too 'too big', but I like a bit of excess margin for safety, which can then be cropped.

Instead of setting a custom page size it is easier, I think, to set the margins in the options tab with small top and left margins, and quite large bottom and right ones.

I didn't cover WMF files, but for the record:

3. Save as a WMF file.

4. In Word choose 'Insert/Picture/From File'. Also choose 'Link to File'. Then if you change the NWC snippet you can recopy it to the original WMF file, and then in Word choose 'Edit/Links' Select the link and update it.

Reply 5 offered by: ah choo on 10-Oct-2000

Woohoo! Congrats Noteworthy!

Now I can copy straight from Print Preview to
Word; awesome! A 5 minute saving in one!

Now we need to do is increase the width of the Page Setup window from 410 to ~500 so I don't have to click that dinky little arrow every time I want to copy out one of every 16 or so parts in a work. :-)

On another thing (not a Noteworthy thing) how do I set Word 97 to paste in with "Float Over Text" unselected by default? ...so that it gets treated like an object instead? (to illustrate how I tried to find a solution myself, after changing an image to "float Over Text" off I was unable to select "Set Autoshape Defaults" when right clicking the picture.)

Thank you! Have a wonderful day.

ah choo.

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Pearson on 10-Oct-2000

Quick add-on for those strange people (typically lawyer/songwriters) who still use Wordperfect. Technique also works fine also in Wordperfect. Full page sizing is simple. Simply right click the graphic after importing, select size, full width and height. The page is instantly converted to a uniform full page size.

Reply 7 offered by: Paul Coats on 14-Oct-2000

If you email as attachment the Word document to another person, if he does not have the Noteworthy and other fonts (Crescendo, Boxmarks, etc) that are used in creating the music, he will not be able to view and print the music. It will appear only as staves with no noteheads, clef signs, etc.

Simply send him the required fonts, NWCV15.ttf, Boxmarks.ttf, Crescendo.ttf, which are in your fonts folder. The recipient must install these in his Fonts folder, and he is ready to go.

This method does solve one problem... after you go to all the trouble to set up your margins, etc, editing for appearance, if your NWC file is opened using a different printer, the layout is all different. But if it is saved as a *.wmf, and viewed and printed from Word or ACDSee, everything is fixed in position as you intended.

Another advantage, if you save all the individual parts as wmf's, and insert all into the same Word document, to print you simply open the file and hit the printer icon. One simple step.

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Oct-2000

Good point Paul.

You are making good a case for the third-party fonts to be included with the installation or (better) an NWC marks font incorporated with NWC.

Reply 9 offered by: Paul Coats on 22-Oct-2000

Stephan: If you only want to insert a single line as a musical example you may do as I do...

(1) Highlight the measures to be inserted into MS Word.

(2) In the toolbar, click Edit, and click Copy Special.

(3) Open your Word document, and place your blinking cursor where you want the musical example to be placed.

(4) Right click and click paste, OR, use the keyboard shortcut, Ctrl V.

You may have to grab the corners and resize. Left click on the example, and a box will appear around it. Resize it.

The music will be printed in blue. So, right click on the musical example, and in the Picture tab, where it says Color, click the drop down and chose Black & White. Click OK. Now the example is printed in black. To get rid of the box, hit the Enter key. Continue typing your text.

Reply 10 offered by: Paul Coats on 22-Oct-2000

To see an example of the results of the above... this page was created in just this way:

http://www.geocities.com/harrir/saxophone/Common_Transpositions.html

Reply 11 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 22-Oct-2000

Paul: Nice work, and clearly explained. I have a question for you: Did you make the text-with-staffs part of your web page by saving as HTML from MSword, or some other method? The save-as-HTML from MSword will convert images to GIF, but I never had good results (to my satisfaction) with the image quality, compared to other technologies at my disposal. Yet I see that your staff images were about as good as can be expected.

Reply 12 offered by: Paul C. on 22-Oct-2000

Well.... to be honest, Harri, the webmaster, does all that. He has me submit my articles to Sax On The Web in MS Word, and he takes it from there. I think there is a way in Word to make your web pages.

Reply 13 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 23-Oct-2000

Aha! So, I went and asked a webmaster (not my own, someone else's) and he showed me what to do. I had been using some sort of funky settings on my computer that were ruining my attempts to save as HTML with images converted to acceptable-looking GIF. It was a user-specific problem due to incompatible printing applications. You steered me in the right direction. Thanks.


#1774: Why does the midi sound so mono?
Why does the midi sound so mono?

(1774)

Submitted by: Sarah on 10-Oct-2000

Hi, I always use ntworthy to make midi and it works well, but one thing i can't figure out is that all the midi files i made with this program sound so mono, the sound is not so clear (especially when the midi contains "string ensemble"). When i listen to other midi files I downloaded from various sites, they all sound so good and don't seem to have the problem i have with the ntworthy. So i think that it is not a soundcard problem. If anyone knows how to solve this please help. Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Art thompson on 10-Oct-2000

In the staff properties under MIDI, the stereo pan defaults to 64 - dead center. Adjust each staff up or down to get your stereo mix.

Reply 2 offered by: Sarah on 10-Oct-2000

Yes I know that function and it does improve the sound, but still when the string is being played some little noisy sound comes out

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Oct-2000

1: Try different string sound patches. There is quite a difference on most synths between Strings1, Strings2, and the corresponding SynthStrings sounds.

2: Check which device you have selected in Tools--> Options--> Midi. If you select the midi-mapper device, then whatever you have set in the midi-mapper (accessible through Control Panel --> Multimedia --> Midi) will be used by NWC also. All other things being equal, the sounds you get from NWC will be identical to the ones you hear in your midi player.


#1775: lyrics ( underline)
lyrics ( underline)

(1775)

Submitted by: JoAnn Larsen on 11-Oct-2000

How do you add underline at the end of lyric phrase?
Example:

Change my Heart, O God,_____

JoAnn

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Oct-2000

Underlines disappear on the score.
Why not use ...... instead?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 12-Oct-2000

You can use alternate characters available in most fonts. E.g. in Times New Roman you can use ALT 0150 (looks like this ––– ) or ALT 0151 (looks like ——— ) ... fiddly but workable if you make a string of 3 or 4 of them, then copy / paste as required.

Reply 3 offered by: JoAnn larsen on 12-Oct-2000

Barry, Yes, I found out that underline disappears on the score. I tried your suggestion but it lengthens the size of the measure, so that didn't work.

Fred, I've printed your note and will try your suggestion.
I'm a new NWC user, I'm learning from the message BB's.

Thanks,

JoAnn

Reply 4 offered by: JoAnn Larsen on 12-Oct-2000

Fred, I have printed out your message and have gone back to NWC program....I don't quite follow what you are talking about....You mentioned ALT 0150 and ALT 0151 don't know what you mean. Please explain! I'm not to formular with Fonts in NWC.

Thanks,
JoAnn

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Oct-2000

These are character codes. The easiest way to deal with them is by selecting them in the Character Map program that comes with Windows. Microsoft has moved it around quite a bit, but it is always somewhere in the Start | Programs | Accessories folder tree, if you have it installed. Sometiems it is in the System Tools folder underneath Accessories.

If it is not installed, you can install it from the Windows CD using Start | Settings | Control Panel | Add/Remove Programs | Windows Setup. In Windows 98, it is in the System Tools section.

Reply 6 offered by: Blair Dowden on 14-Oct-2000

Just hold down the Alt key, type 0151 on the numeric key pad, then release the Alt key.


#1776: Performance style -( brackets)
Performance style -( brackets)

(1776)

Submitted by: JoAnn Larsen on 11-Oct-2000

Don't know really what you would call this.

I have a phrase of notes that over top of the notes you have a group of notes in brackets...don't know really what you would call it. I have done keyboard art to explain what I'm talking about. How do you add this to your score?

|---3---|

JoAnn

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Oct-2000

This looks like a triplet. Select the three notes, then press the triplet tool, or Edit | Triplet.

Reply 2 offered by: JoAnn Larsen on 12-Oct-2000

A triplet that it, I knew what it was but couldn't think of what it was called....I followed your directions, edited my score....that put the triplet brackets where I wanted them. I'm a new NWC user, coming here sure does help.

Thanks,

JoAnn


#1777: Suspended Cymbal
Suspended Cymbal

(1777)

Submitted by: Kenny on 12-Oct-2000

I have tried making music that matches a recording that I heard exactly, the only thing is that I cannot get a suspended cymbal part correct. If anyone can tell me what the note is, please email me or reply to this message. Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: ah choo on 12-Oct-2000

you can check out the drum reference in the Noteworthy samples for the note, then to suspend the note try doing a breve first then add a bunch of 32nds after it with the pp dynamic


#1778: Octives and Chords
Octives and Chords

(1778)

Submitted by: JoAnn Larsen on 12-Oct-2000

I am working on a piece that has Guitar chords at the top. I would like to add Octives and chords in note form on the bass line. Where can I find a list of your Major and Minor chords.

For example: I know that a C chord is played (c e g) but when it comes to your Minor chords snf Minor 7th's even though I play the Piano I have forgotten a lot of my chords.

Thanks,

JoAnn

Reply 1 offered by: Art thompson on 12-Oct-2000

You need a beginners book on Music Theory (and/or a few music lessons) if you want to know what chords are and how to build them starting from any note. Otherwise, your local music store would have a guitar book that is chock full o' chords, and you figure out what the notes are from the chord symbols. The first suggestion might be a little harder at first, but more rewarding in the long run. The piano is the perfect instrument to 'see' the logical patterns in chord structure.

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 12-Oct-2000

For example: C-E is a major third and C-G is a perfect 5th, which is what makes C E G a Major chord. C -Eb is a minor third, so C Eb G is a Minor chord. See...nothin' to it!

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 12-Oct-2000

Crash theory course:

Major scale is defined by the following "steps":

W-W-H-W-W-W-H

where W is whole tone (two semitones), H is half tone (semitone). So major scale of C is C-D-E-F-G-A-B-C, scale of A is A-B-C#,D,E,F#,G#,A, scale of Eb is Eb-F-G-Ab-Bb-C-D-Eb, and so on.

Chords are derived from the major scale. Major chord is 1, 3, 5 (for example: in key of C, major chord = C, E, G. In A, = A, C#, E. In Eb = Eb, G, Bb; etc.)

Chord Structure Example (in C)
major 1, 3, 5 C, E, G
minor 1, b3, 5 C, Eb, G
dom 7 1, 3, 5, b7 C, E, G, Bb
maj 7 1, 3, 5, 7 C, E, G, B
min 7 1, b3, 5, b7 C, Eb, G, Bb
dim 1, b3, b5 C, Eb, Gb
full dim 1, b3, b5, bb7 C, Eb, Gb, Bbb
half dim 1, b3, b5, b7 C, Eb, Gb, Bb
augmented 1, 3, #5 C, E, G#
sus 2 1, 2, 5 C, D, G
sus (sus4) 1, 4, 5 C, F, G

Reply 4 offered by: JoAnn Larsen on 12-Oct-2000

Art, Thanks for your note...I'll have to look through my music books for these chords. I need to go back and do a little studing on my chords. I took Piano for about 5 years, surprising what you loose when you don't stick with it.
You must either know your music or have been working with NWC for quite a while.

JoAnn

Reply 5 offered by: JoAnn Larsen on 12-Oct-2000

Fred,
Thanks for the Crash theory course. I took Piano for 5 years surprising what you forget when you don't keep up with it.
YOu must either know your music or been working with NWC for quite a while.

JoAnn

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 13-Oct-2000

There are music theory courses on-line. Most are pitched (ouch!) towards beginners, but I have come across some with chord charts for piano or guitar. Use your search engine.

P.S. -- "Octaves."

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Oct-2000

fwiw - my favourite online music theory course (and the one I've recommended to quite a few people already) is Gary Ewer's site at:

http://www.musictheory.halifax.ns.ca/


#1779: Percussion
Percussion

(1779)

Submitted by: Nathan A. Cunnningham on 15-Oct-2000

I am not too familiar with this forum or anything, but I do have a problem. I have made a great song (in my opinion) and I can't export it to midi without losing percussion and some of the parts. How can I get the percussion to work in midi? Please write back through email and in this forum. Thank you!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Nathan A. Cunningham on 15-Oct-2000

I have a SB Live! Value and I'm using my percussion in noteworthy by setting the staff to channel 10.


#1780: I use Noteworthy for...
I use Noteworthy for...

(1780)

Submitted by: steve on 16-Oct-2000

Composing...
Transposing parts...
Sheet music from MIDi files..
Songwriting... and
Transcribing...

There are three things I look forward to being added to Noteworthy: drum notation, guitar chords, and different engravement styles, (I've come up to 3 wishes after reading other people's needs) but overall Noteworthy is a great tool. :-)

What do you guys use Noteworthy for?

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 16-Oct-2000

Composing
Tranposing parts
Arranging
Rewriting band parts to remove awkward turn-overs
Studying scores - I find the exercise of transcribing scores reveals much that I miss from just reading or listening.

I use the midi playback facility for a) proof reading (proof listening?) b) to get an initial impression of whether my composition stinks or not c) score study.

My top three wishes relate to score editing: 1) n-tuplets 2) percussion notation 3) transposition by specified interval (e.g. minor third, perfect fifth etc.) rather than number of semitones - this would allow implementation of an improved note spelling algorithm so that we don't have to, for example, change the D sharps to E flats after transposing. Tweaks that enhance playback facilties are not unwelcome but figure much much lower in my wish list.

Reply 2 offered by: beer glynt on 16-Oct-2000

Heyaz,
I don't know if it's really on the cards but wouldn't it be a good idea to add guitar chords as well as the drum notation and kill two birds with one stone? (okay I'm not into feathered-friend carnage but that old phrase seemed to do the trick)
beer glynt. (classical beer drinker :-)

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 16-Oct-2000

I sing in a choir, and use Noteworthy to prepare MIDI tracks of my own part, for rehearsal. I also use it to print sheet music of my own part isolated from others, so that I can see what I am doing (being a poor sight-reader). NWC absolutely beats any alternative I know of for those purposes, and I have access to the big programs.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 16-Oct-2000

I use NWC for:
arranging
"quick notation"
composition (when I have time, which is never)

I'd like to see:
1,2 and 5 line percussion staves working,
n-tuplets generalised
transposition worked out a bit better to avoid "respelling"
guitar chords being transposable would be nice
selective copy and paste - or merge/split of staves
selectable notehead shape
cue size implemented
muting of specific notes

I must get to the wish list...

Reply 5 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 17-Oct-2000

Transcribing old folk/western, and spiritual/gospel songs so I can hear them and sing along once again.

This is the most fun and is a very personal form of satisfaction.

BTW, I see Andrew Purdum has resumed posting. I'm happy to see this because he's always been a wonderful and willing resource.

Gordon

Reply 6 offered by: Artur on 17-Oct-2000

Editing my compositions, but I never have enough time to do it, so I compose much faster than I edit. I'd like that Nwc could make us select wich parts are going to be on a certain system, for I sometimes want only the playing parts to be showing in the printout, and in the next system I want every body to be shown out, but that's impossible to be made.

Reply 7 offered by: don on 18-Oct-2000

HI folks, please tell me about copyright; can I charge people for arranging music for them even if they don't own the music? For example, if there is a band playing in a concert hall can i charge them to arrange their music if they are playing contemporary musics? thank you.

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 18-Oct-2000

First, the owner of the copyright has the exclusive right to (that means nobody else can) make "derivative works" (that is, arrangements) AND to perform the work in public.

If the band has obtained permission to perform the work, and the band has also obtained permission to modify the work for their own performance (two different things!) then you may perform that activity (arranging) as an "agent" of the band doing "work for hire", and take money for it. Otherwise, NOT.

If the band doesn't have those rights (and you haven't obtained those rights), your taking money means that you have not only violated copyright, but you've caused financial harm to the copyright holder -- and are subject to more serious legal penalties.

I'm not a lawyer, and there are undoubtedly nuances of this that I couldn't understand if someone explained it to me. But I believe that this is accurate so far as it goes.

Reply 9 offered by: Robin Withey on 19-Oct-2000

I use Noteworthy for...

- Learning songs for various operatic groups I belong to.
- Listening to other people's compositions / arrangements

I'd also like to use it for creating my own arrangements of songs, if I had the time.

Listening to other people's compositions often involves importing MIDI files, so my number one wish is for NWC to do this properly (i.e. triplets).
It would also be nice if bar lines were inserted automatically as you record. I know you can do automatic bar lines afterwards, but this messes up accidentals.
My third wish is for user-definable key settings. I tend to record with one hand on the PC keyboard and one on the MIDI keyboard, so I don't want to use the mouse, and I want all the keys I use most on the same part of the keyboard. NWC is pretty good in this regard, with lots of the keys on or near the numeric pad, but not all of them.
For the same reason, a method of changing the note duration for one note only, or changing the last note without having to select it would be nice.

Most of these are personal preferences, because of the way I work. NWC is a great product, and I use it exclusively for recording music. I do have other programs, but don't use them because they don't measure up to NWC for ease of use. Keep up the good work!

Reply 10 offered by: Paul Coats on 22-Oct-2000

Saxophone Quartet, and larger sax ensemble compositions and arrangements. Soon I will have many of these for sale.

Composing and arranging for jazz band.

Reply 11 offered by: Art Thompson on 22-Oct-2000

I started using NWC to do a composition project and finish a long overdue Music degree. I plan to continue enjoying the great features of NWC long after the project is complete.

Reply 12 offered by: David Potvin on 14-Nov-2000

I work on a cruise ship showband, so I use Notheworthy for:

Arrangements,
Transcriptions, and
Writing last-minute chasers!

Now here's my problem: my saxes play flute and clarinet too! When I replay my things, in order to make sure everything is at its right place notewise, they can play their own sounds, with the patch change option! BUT A FLUTE DOESN'T PLAY IN THE SAME KEY AS A SAX! Neither does a Clarinet and an Alto Sax! WAAAAAH!

Complementing the patch change, what I REALLY look forward to see is:

-A PITCH CHANGE OPTION!

...also in addition to ALL the wishes I've seen in this reply list! Thanks!

P.S.: to the Noteworthy programmers: my god, we're a demanding bunch, aren't we? ;-)

Reply 13 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Nov-2000

Same problem.
You can change the patch to check the sound but you have to do a cut/transpose/paste to get the parts looking right.
Many of the requirements for dance band writing are lacking.
Please add your voice to the wish list.

Reply 14 offered by: Clive on 14-Nov-2000

I have a hearing problem - sensorineural deafness. As every orchestral practise leaves my ears ringing for 4 to 5 days, I use NWC instead to "play" the pieces I would otherwise love to do in real time. Makes me feel understand music and the role of conductors better as well.

Reply 15 offered by: Peter Edwards on 15-Nov-2000

To achieve different transpositions on the same staff you could use layered staffs, one for each instrument. When the instrument is silent use hidden bar lines and whole rests.

Reply 16 offered by: Chris on 14-Apr-2001

I use noteworthy in my High School Choir. I place it all together(as many LONG hours it may take) and bring it to choir, and make demo tapes. I also use it in my Church choir were I am Director. It's really nice to let them listen to something I have, instead of going over and over with rythms and notes when I can just hand it to them.
If there was a change I would say, to be able to just write chords.


#1781: Changing Instruments
Changing Instruments

(1781)

Submitted by: Jeff Lohr on 16-Oct-2000

Does anyone else have the problem with your instrument changing from let's say trumpet to sound effects such as the gun shot?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 16-Oct-2000

Do you mean changing in midstream, or just not coming out the way you expect? If it's the latter, you should probably check the channel assignment of your trumpet staff. Channel 10 is reserved for percussion in the General MIDI specification, so if your trumpet staff is assigned to this channel, you should change it. (Highlight the staff in question, press F2, select the Midi tab and change the value in the "Channel" box.)


#1782:  HELP ME!!!!!
HELP ME!!!!!

(1782)

Submitted by: Nathan A. Cunningham on 16-Oct-2000

I am using version 1.55b and I can't get the percussion to work after I export my file to midi. I set the percussion to channel 10, and it plays while in NWC. My card is and SB Live! Value and I would gladly appreciate any help with this.

THANK YOU,
Nate

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Oct-2000

What are you using to play the MIDI file?

Reply 2 offered by: Nathan A. Cunningham on 17-Oct-2000

I am using winamp to play it, and I tried media player. I have also tried just using the .nwc file in the noteworthy player. None of these play my percussion tracks. But it still works if I play it in the NWC.

Thanks for the help,
Nate

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Oct-2000

In NoteWorthy Composer, go to Tools | Options | Midi and make sure that the "Devices used by play back" field contains only one device, MIDI Mappper. Now, NoteWorthy Composer will behave identically (as it pertains to play back) to these other programs. For more tips, consult the authoring guide in the NoteWorthy Player help file.

Reply 4 offered by: Nathan A. Cunningham on 14-Nov-2000

Thank you all for your help, I got it to work!

Nate


#1783: Version 1.55a and Windows Me - compatible?
Version 1.55a and Windows Me - compatible?

(1783)

Submitted by: Esther Nui on 16-Oct-2000

I am a registered user of NoteWorthy Composer and the version I own is Version 1.55a and it is possible that I also used a different email address at the time.
However, since I obtained the program, I have just purchased a brand new PC and the operating system is Windows Millenium.
I understand that there is a 1.7 version and judging from the forum, a better version. My question is: do I install the 1.55a version on Windows Me and then upgrade from that. OR is the download version of 1.7 a completely new version and should I install that instead?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Oct-2000

The choice is up to you. As a registered user, you are already licensed to use version 1.70. You can reduce the effort by directly installing version 1.70 on your new system, then activating it with your registration from your User's Guide.


#1784: BIRD TWEETING YOUR MUSIC
BIRD TWEETING YOUR MUSIC

(1784)

Submitted by: Gordon Bennett on 17-Oct-2000

I used "Bird Tweet" as the instrument patch for all staves of Beethoven's "32 Variations in C Minor"(downloaded from the classical archives).

The effect is quite intriguing, especially for bird lovers.

Reply 1 offered by: Jeremy Ewen on 17-Oct-2000

Talking of birds, shortly after we bought our first CD player back in 1987, we started our CD collection with William Christie playing some harpsichord works by Johann Caspar Ferdinand Fischer, which according to the sleeve notes was recorded in deepest France. The amazing thing is that in the quiet bits you can distinctly hear a bird chirping in the background - sounds like a Robin to me - and the effect in this relaxing music is absolutely stunning! So much for the perfect studio recording.

But to return to the previous posting, where would I be able to find the birdsong soundfont on the net, and would I be able to use it on my Soundblaster PCI 128 which uses Ensoniq wavetable modules.

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Bennett on 17-Oct-2000

"Bird Tweet" is included in the "Instrument Patch" list that comes with Noteworthy Composer version 1.70(and probably with other versions as well).

The Instrument Patch list includes piano, organ, accordion, etc. You simply use "Bird Tweet" as your instrument. Beethoven's 32 Variations sounds like a forest full of birds at dawn.

It is possible that sound cards have a similar instrument list but I am not sure if they do or how you would get it to work. I am not an expert on sound cards. I am using SoundBlaster Live! which I just bought recently. The instruction manual is about the size of the New York telephone directory.

Good luck.

Gordon Bennett

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 18-Oct-2000

Jeremy asks if he can use a soundfont on a PCI 128. AFAIK the answer is no :^( The PCI series of cards use wavetables which are not the same thing at all. There seem to be only three varieties of wavetable: 2, 4 and 8 MB which provide improving quality versions of the same sounds. I have not come across any source of wavetables other than Ensoniq/Creative. Neither have I found softare that will generate wavetables. I suspsect that the format a) is proprietary and b) hasn't been released to third parties.


#1785: tremolo
tremolo

(1785)

Submitted by: Thomas on 17-Oct-2000

Hello, anybody can explain me how to write a tremolo note on a staff ??

Thanks in advance ...

Reply 1 offered by: Graham Howe on 20-Oct-2000

You need to download the "boxmarks font", which you can find in "useful tips"; this contains a tremolo sign which you can place in the appropriate position on/over the note.. It's fairly easy to place over semibreves and breves, but placing it in the right position on notes with stems can be a little tricky. You'll have to use the print preview page to ensure you've got it right.


#1786: gospel music composers
gospel music composers

(1786)

Submitted by: nancy on 18-Oct-2000

Anyone out there use Noteworthy in composing Gospel music,particularly Southern Gospel and Convention style?

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 19-Oct-2000

Not sure, but came up with some sites by searching "nwc gospel music midi". One possibility: http://creatormagazine.com/art/tech/9810henderson.html

You may want to experiment around with some variant search terms on the web.

Reply 2 offered by: Karen on 20-Oct-2000

http://www.sharesong.org


#1787: Midi files
Midi files

(1787)

Submitted by: Kay Honeycutt on 19-Oct-2000

I have a Technics Keyboard with a SY-FD20 Digital Disk Recorder. Can I save a file on disk from the keyboard and read it into Noteworthy? Is so, how?

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 19-Oct-2000

When opening the file, go to "type: song files" inside the diskette directory you find the file you saved.

Reply 2 offered by: isnardi on 02-Feb-2001

I have a technics key board series kn 2000, but I,ve got problem onflopy disk drive (SY-FD20).how I can get the replacement the flopy drive.where?.

Reply 3 offered by: isnardi on 02-Feb-2001

sorry I'am forget...how much the price of flopy disk drive SY-FD20(DIGITAL DISK RECORDER) for technics kn 2000.
thanks.


#1788: Repeats
Repeats

(1788)

Submitted by: Artur on 19-Oct-2000

I know that many of you want to say to me that all of my questions about this is in the repeat files in Nwc. But I think this is a bug, and that there's no answer to it:
I have a song with this layout closely to the end:
Flute
Violloncello
Piano staff
Layered piano staff (but is no longer noted at this point)
Another piano staff.
and I am trying to repeat a section but the Nwc just acts as if it had already been repeated. I'm using two master repeats barlines.
I need this section repeated , but Nwc is driving me crazy. can anyone help?


#1789: Yet another method for NWC to PDF
Yet another method for NWC to PDF

(1789)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 19-Oct-2000

Those of you who follow the NWC forum know that PDF-format files of your NWC sheet music can be created in one of three ways:

(1) Export your composition on a page-by-page basis as placeable Windows Metafiles (WMF) from File > Print Preview > Copy. Then, place the WMFs in a compatible program that can read WMF and export PDF. Programs that can do this (such as Adobe Illustrator) tend to be costly and not owned by just anyone.

(2) Purchase Adobe Acrobat (TM) "not just the Reader" which is expensive, but is also the ultimate solution. An educational license is available.

(3) The cheap way: Create a Postscript (TM) file using compatiable printer driver software, then convert the Postscript file to PDF format using the free Ghostscript and GSview software. More about this is at Fred Nachbauer's site: http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/

But there is another way, that not many seem to know about: There is a shareware program (downloadable) that will create PDF files using the same simple paradigm as Adobe Acrobat PDFwriter. That is, it creates a phantom printer accessible from any application (such as NWC) that will print, and does the conversion to PDF format in a single step. The regular license is something like US$50, but for those of you who meet the educational license requirements, it is only US$20, very reasonable. It is from a Taiwanese software supplier called Zeon:

http://www.zeon.com.tw

I have tested the trial version. Caution: I have not exhautively exercised it, just took a quick look. If you try the Zeon product, be sure to do the following after installation: When selecting the "DocuCom PDF Driver" from within NWC, go to the printer's Properties dialog box, and be sure to check "embed all fonts." If you fail to do that, the NWCV15 font will not appear in your output.

I do not act as a shill for Zeon or anyone else. There may be other shareware or commercial products out there that do the same thing, but I haven't come across them. Yes, yes, Ghostscript is the freebie method. But I know that there are a lot of schools using NWC for internal distribution of music. The advantage to using Zeon DocuCom (or Adobe Acrobat) is that once it's set up then using it requires little by way of user instruction.

Note that any product has its own features and limitations. Decide for yourselves. One reason that Acrobat is so costly is that it will do many things besides convert files to PDF.


#1790: Importing Dynamics
Importing Dynamics

(1790)

Submitted by: Codey Whitt on 19-Oct-2000

Is there a way to import dynamics on nwc that i havent fond yet?

Reply 1 offered by: Karen on 20-Oct-2000

No Corey, it's not possible as yet.
There have been a few ideas kicked around such as grey scaled notes for velocity and direct interpretation of note velocity into ppp to fff but it would be very hard to implement. Besides if you are going to be recording to a midi file with such performance effects then it's hardly likely that you are also going to be recording to a strict, boring and lifeless metronome so that Noteworthy can also interpret the notes. You can do a mix of both though - record sections into Noteworthy then paste it with the associated dynamic. Or perhaps record the whole thing strict tempo and then go through and add the dynamics - which to me is the better way; then you just add the right markings for that part of the piece


#1791: Instrument to Trombone and then have it PLAY it?
Instrument to Trombone and then have it PLAY it?

(1791)

Submitted by: Jamie Severson on 19-Oct-2000

PLEASE HELP!

Is there any way to make a bass clef and set the instrument to Trombone and then have it play the notes/song exactly like a real trombone would play? Given the key that a trombone is, is different than a piano.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 20-Oct-2000

I don't understand what you're trying to achieve. Trombone parts are all written at concert pitch. What you see should be what you hear.

Are you trying to treat the trombone as a transposing instrument? Why?

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 20-Oct-2000

If you're asking if you can transpose, then the answer is, yes, you can. If you're writing in concert pitch, use the Tools -> Transpose Staff select the number of semitones to transpose and check "Update staff play back transposition".
If you've written transposed notes, then go to the staff properties dialog, select the Midi page and adjust the Transposition.

However, if you're writing for a trombone in bass clef, then you DON'T transpose. For the most part trombone music is written in concert pitch in Bass, Tenor or Alto clef depending on how high or low it is.

The only place where trombone music is transposed is in brass bands, where it's sometimes written in treble clef, transposed up an octave and one tone (Bb). Most trombone players I've ever encountered prefer bass clef, concert pitch.

Reply 3 offered by: Paul Coats on 22-Oct-2000

The transposition of trombone up a 9th, written in treble clef (same as tenor saxophone), is referred to as "trombone treble clef". Such parts are also made for "baritone treble clef", which is traditionally written in bass clef at concert pitch also.

The reason for such parts... when a young trumpet or cornet (Bb instruments) player is switched to low brass, usually in second or third year of playing, perhaps in junior high school, he might be switched to valve trombone or baritone horn. These instruments are acoustically Bb instruments, but the players usually read in bass clef at concert pitch. By transposing up a 9th, into treble clef, the player will read music and use the exact same fingerings as he would have if playing trumpet.

But many teachers now find, as with languages, a full immersion is best. The sooner the player learns the fingerings for reading in standard bass clef parts, the better. Such low brass treble clef parts are found less and less often.

If you must make a part, the transposition is the same as for tenor sax.

In marches you will many times find parts labeled "Bb Tenor Saxophone and Baritone Treble Clef".


#1792: XG controls
XG controls

(1792)

Submitted by: Codey Whitt on 20-Oct-2000

Does nwc have a "resonance" and "cutoff frequency" controler because this controler can DRAMATICALY change the sound to a more realistic sounding instrument in XG.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 20-Oct-2000

No, afraid not. I'd suggest getting XGedit, which is the "de facto" standard for editing XG midi files.

http://www.yamaha.co.uk/xg/html/software/s_xgedit.htm


#1794: natural signs
natural signs

(1794)

Submitted by: Graham Howe on 20-Oct-2000

How can I show a natural sign in text, for example, in guitar chords?

Reply 1 offered by: Art thompson on 20-Oct-2000

assign font NWCV15 as a user font in page setup. the Natural sign is a lower case e.


#1795: copywrite
copywrite

(1795)

Submitted by: Dan on 21-Oct-2000

I've created a piano song which has grasped the attention of quite a few people that I don't know. They strongly encourage me to copywrite the song so that I can sell it. How exactly would I go about copywriting it? Is there any government notices or other legal papers that need to be filed?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 21-Oct-2000

I'll bet you get a dozen, incompatible answers to your question, often from users (such as myself) who don't know a thing about copyrighting original works of music. But there are also NWC users who are real musicians who really do know.

There are variations from country to country, too.

Until you get "sound" advice, I suggest that you put something such as "Copyright [year] by [your name], All Rights Reserved" where everyone can see it, and make sure that anyone who gets access to your music knows that you are not intending to freely release it into the public domain.

In the U.S., copyright law has changed within the last couple of decades.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 23-Oct-2000

Dan,

I suggest you get down to your local library, which almost certainly has books on making your way in the music industry. These should have the information you need. You might even call the library and ask the reference librarian to look this up for you.

(Actually, I have such a book myself, but it's at home and I'm not. If I get a chance I'll look this topic up and post what I find.)

Reply 3 offered by: Steve on 25-Oct-2000

In the United States once you put your music in a "fixed form" (ie sheet music, or a recording) you own its copyright. What you're asking is how do I register my copyright? Go to http://www.loc.gov/copyright/. They have the forms you need available for downloading. The site should answer all your questions. Be prepared to do a lot of reading.

- Steve

Reply 4 offered by: Matt Souther on 18-Nov-2000

I went to the Copyright Office's website a while back to figure out how the system works, after several people had urged me to copyright my music. As far as I could tell, your works are actually protected by copyright law the minute you write them. Registering is too expensive for an amateur like me, but if you intend to sell your pieces, I believe that's the next step.

Reply 5 offered by: K. Fitzsimmons on 26-Nov-2001

I believe there is something called a 'Poor Man's Copywrite.' What you do is make a cassette or CD of your music (or poems or whatever) and write a letter stateing the date,what is on the tape, who wrote the music and lyrics if any and who the performers are and sign the letter. You address it to yourself and take it to the post office to be stamped. Don't use a regular stamp...have the post office stamp it so that the stamp shows the local and date. When you receive the envelope at your residence....don't open it. This is a poor man's copywrite and as far as I know it is legal. My son did this a few
years back with all the music he composed. Then he contacted the u.s. government copywrite office and requested
the needed forms for a proper copywrite. It only cost about
$20.00 for each cassette and CD that he filled with his
music.
know it is legal.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Nov-2001

Yes, the "Poor man's copyright" is certainly legal, but ineffective. Unfortunately this is one of those urban myths that refuses to die.

Copyright is one thing; you own the copyright to a piece of intellectual property from the moment of conception (in Canada, anyway; it's similar in the US but I don't know the exact wording). However, proving that you own the copyright is an entirely different matter. The burden of proof is on you to convince the court that you own the copyright. The only truly fail-safe proof is a registry with the copyright office. Something like a sealed envelope sent by registered mail is too easily forged.

Another myth is that registering your work with a royalty association (such as BMI or ASCAP) is an effective way of protecting copyright. Not so, and the royalty associations will generally be quite clear in disclaiming any connection with the copyright office.

Such methods may be of limited use as circumstantial evidence, but only if backed up by an actual copyright office registry.

Fred

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Edwards on 26-Nov-2001

Does getting the music performed and recorded help? Iwould have thought that that would prove that you'd had the necessary intellectual processes. Even better if you can get it published with a copyright notice.

Peter

Reply 8 offered by: Joe Music on 26-Nov-2001

Sadly, most of the information and mis-information concerning copyrights revolves around four basic issues:

(1) How can I make copies of everyone else's materials without paying them?

(2) How can I prevent everyone else from making copies of my materials without paying me?

(3) Who's going to know?

(4) What are they going to do about it?


#1797: Where to sell my sheet music online?
Where to sell my sheet music online?

(1797)

Submitted by: Karen on 22-Oct-2000

I checked out net4music.com and it said, "and we pay you 40% of the sale price." And I yelled out: "No, I don't think so." There's no way those punks are going to get more than half of the profit from my work. Are there any sites that ask a decent fee, say 10 or 15%?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 22-Oct-2000

Out of curiosity... If your sheet music were published as hard copy and sold via music stores off-the-shelf, what percentage of the sale price would you get?

Reply 2 offered by: Dee Hays on 29-Oct-2000

If you get 40% of the sale price, that's a heck of a good deal. If you were to go through regular publishing avenues, you would be lucky to get %5 of the sale price. Remember the sale price is NOT all profit. Out of the portion they keep, publishers have to pay all their expenses to market the product, pay their overhead, pay their employees, etc.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 29-Oct-2000

Perhaps the publishers could cut their overheads by posting lead sheets as electronic images either in a common format (pdf for example) or in a form that could be imported into a inexpensive notator like NWC (possibly in NIFF format if NWC supported that).
That way the publisher would reduce printing, shipping and warehouse/retail storage costs.
The product would be easily accessible and wouldn't require a user to purchase a whole book of songs just to get one lead sheet.
That way everyone wins - the composer could get a higher %, overheads are reduced and the end users only pays for what is required.

Reply 4 offered by: kela Alale on 07-Jul-2001

please tell me more on how to sell my music


#1798: Tempo variance in MIDI exports
Tempo variance in MIDI exports

(1798)

Submitted by: Brian Maskell on 22-Oct-2000

When NWC exports a song as a MIDI file, it appears to lose tempo variances, specifically breath pause and fermata. Is this a bug or a feature, or I am I doing something wrong.

Why do I want to do this anyway? I need to play several songs in succession and since I need to do it at least four times an automatic tool is highly desirable. Such a tool exists for MIDI files but not, as far as I am aware, for NWC files - unless you know better!

Reply 1 offered by: Karen on 22-Oct-2000

Use Noteworthy Player instead?

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Oct-2000

See msg #13 (reply 4), msg #1047, msg #663

Reply 3 offered by: Brian Maskell on 22-Oct-2000

Use NoteWorthy Player instead? Am I missing something here; I can see no sign of a "playlist" facility on NoteWorthy Player.

Reply 4 offered by: Karen on 22-Oct-2000

There's PlayList.Bat in the forum you can configure.
Noteworthy also said they are going to add a playlist feature in reply to someone's playlist.bat solution.


#1799: Non-contiguous 1/8 beams
Non-contiguous 1/8 beams

(1799)

Submitted by: Jim on 22-Oct-2000

Is there a way to beam two eight notes with an eighth rest in-between (as in a 6/8 time march)?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Oct-2000

Yes, but it's a bit fiddly. Put a 1/8 note where the rest should be, and hide the note using the Visibility tab = never. Now insert a rest as text (using the NWCV15.TTF font, the 1/8 rest is lower-case o. Set its alignment "at next note/bar" with Preserve Width off.

Now you've got what you need visually, but you still have an errant note. Insert just before it a hidden ppp with velocity override = 1, and put another hidden dynamic afterwards to restore the desired dynamic level.

Told you it was fiddly... :)

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 23-Oct-2000

You can also use the layering method described in the User Tips section off the home page. The advantage to Fred's method, i think, is that you only have to do it once. Then copy/paste the whole kitn'kaboodle as you need it.


#1800: Reinstalling Windows
Reinstalling Windows

(1800)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 23-Oct-2000

Due to Windows errors I plan to format my C: disk and reinstall Windows.
Noteworthy is on D: (my programs) and songs on E: (my data) and should be safe.
Does Noteworthy write something in base regitery ? In this case I am forced to reinstall it.
What does Noteworthy write on C: disk and where ? Is it sufficient to save these files and put them back on C: ?
x.ini file(s) ?
the shortcut y.lnk ?
My registered user information ?
any other file ?
Do you plan to issue shortly (15 days ?) a new version ? In this case I'll wait and install it after formating C: ...

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Oct-2000

When you are done reinstalling Windows, you can either reinstall NWC (preferred option), or you will need to do the following two things, in order:

1 - Reinstall the Nwcv15.ttf font
2 - Open NWC, then re-register using File | Register

You will lose shortcuts and file associations unless you reinstall.

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 23-Oct-2000

I would also back up anything on D and E that I couldn't live without. A C:format can be a deadly thing.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Oct-2000

Obviously, our remarks were targetted only at recovery of NoteWorthy Composer, and not intended to minimize the overall concerns of formatting a hard disk. Many people are surprised to discover how much data is lost after a hard drive crash or reformat. Good backups are always essential if you want to avoid major data loss. However, many applications have a bad habit of also keeping a substantial store of information in the Windows registry. It is very difficult to recover this information, even with good file/folder habits and complete file backups.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Oct-2000

A trick I've used successfully on a few occasions is to simply reinstall the same version of Windows over the existing copy. This generally will preserve registry settings, application associations and things like that while replacing any Windows dll's etc. that have gone missing, gotten corrupted, or whatever.

Of course, if your problems stem from defects in the registry itself, a reinstall won't make it any better. But it generally doesn't make things any worse, and it's a lot less trouble than if you start completely from scratch. (been there, done that too. On several occasions....)

Reply 5 offered by: René on 24-Oct-2000

Do not reformat your hard disk drive unless :
1 : you get by bad block or bad sector errors (or other hardware related errors)
2 : you exactly know what you are doing.
Disk drives are formatted by the manufacturer creating bad block tables and other hardware related info. Most hard disk drives are not capable of reconstructing such info and a reformat might cause you some problems for the remaining lifetime of your computer system.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Oct-2000

I have never seen a hard disk that has been preformatted for a target OS. René seems to be referring to a low level format of your hard drive. This is often an option in disk tools that come with the drive, and in the computer bios. If you are tempted to do this kind of thing, you might be better off using a utility such as SpinRite ( http://grc.com )

Reply 7 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 24-Oct-2000

My problem is that I have an IBM Aptiva. IBM gives an Windows licence but not the Windows CD! Just a "Recuperation and diagnostics CD" and says that it, in some cases (often I have been told), reformat the C: disk. It is supposed to reinstall a clean original image of all the programs preistalled...
I suffer probably of corrupted or mismatched dll(s) but I have gained nothing by reloading the one that crashes more often from the .CABS (compressed Windows OS files).

Reply 8 offered by: Art thompson on 24-Oct-2000

Those OEM Disks are very annoying. How old is the PC? If you've been adding and deleting programs for a year or 2, maybe it's time to clean house. Are the D & E Drives just partitions? If you start from scratch, you can change the partition size to suit your needs better. Also you will get rid of lots of junk that you probably forgot was there an won't miss. So make a Windows Startup disk. Copy you CD ROM device driver onto it. Backup all your critical files. Befriend a Geek with a Windows disk (you already have a license).Buy some of his/her favorite beverage. Both of you take a swig and go for it. It's a very cleansing experience.

Reply 9 offered by: Art thompson on 24-Oct-2000

Ok, Ok, its also very dangerous if you're not sure what you're doing, and your friend lies about how much they know. My wife almost killed me the last time I did it, but it is survivable.


#1802: non-pitched note notation
non-pitched note notation

(1802)

Submitted by: Moray on 24-Oct-2000

...and by that I mean the little crosses you get attached to note stems to indicate either spoken words set to rhythm or, I suppose, certain percussion marks. I'm interested in songs so don't know that much about percussion, but you certainly see these in songs (especially musical theatre) to indicate a spoken passage set to a specific rhythm.

How do you do it? Can you do it?

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 24-Oct-2000

At this time you can only do it as text and it's difficult to get it looking reasonable. This request shows up fairly regularly. Please add your voice to the wishlist to increase the chances that it will be implemented in a future version of NWC.


#1803: Uneven reproduction
Uneven reproduction

(1803)

Submitted by: Ian Petticrew on 24-Oct-2000

I upgraded to v1.7 recently, since when I have noticed that Noteworthy appears to "hesitate" periodically over some notes. It appears to be an intermitent problem, and I am not able to predict under what circumstances it happens.

Anyone had this problem?

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 24-Oct-2000

Is there anything else going on at the same time using up CPU cycles? Are you using a software synth like WinGroove?

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Oct-2000

There is nothing in the 1.70 upgrade that would specifically trigger this. The basic mechanics of play back in version 1.70 are very similar to those in version 1.55, provided you are using Windows 95, 98 or ME.

However, web service pack 1 includes an enhancement in the play back area. You can now turn off the note chase that normallt occurs when playing back a song. This will certainly reduce the demands of play back on your system. This can be useful when you want to most accurate play back possible.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Oct-2000

Did you change to a different play back device when upgrading to version 1.70? This might be causing your problem.

Reply 4 offered by: Ian Petticrew on 25-Oct-2000

Sorry - forgot to mention that I have changed my sound card from an Soundblaster AWE32 to a Sound Blaster 'Live 1024'. This hasn't had any effect on other sound programs I use so i didn't suspect it may be behind the problem.

The processor I use is a Pentium 2 450 MHz with 256MD RAM.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Oct-2000

Try selecting only the MIDI Mapper in Tools | Options | MIDI | Devices used by play back. Other than that, you could get service pack 1 and turn off the note chase.


#1804: notation
notation

(1804)

Submitted by: Tyler Stafford on 25-Oct-2000

I was wondering how to laye not on the same beat without having to make a new staff. (ie-bass drum music).
thanx

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Oct-2000

I do not understand your question. It would probably help if you explained in a little more detail what you are trying to do.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Oct-2000

You are limited by your sound card. You certainly can have 5 notes in a chord, all triggering at the same beat.

----- Original E-Mail Message -----
I was wondering how to layer notes like in marching bass lines. I want to be able to have 5 different tones of bass drum hit on the same beat.


#1805: Music without bar lines
Music without bar lines

(1805)

Submitted by: Peter Larsen on 25-Oct-2000

I sing with a group that performs Renaissance-era sacred vocal music. It was suggested to us by an expert in the field that we should try reading the music without bar lines, so I entered a large portion of one piece into NoteWorthy without bar lines, only to discover that it would not print properly. When I try to print the file, I get the staff lines extending to the left of the left margin, with one line of notes and lyrics for each staff extending off to the right.

Can NoteWorthy be made to properly print a piece that has no bar lines?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Oct-2000

No. You can still do what you want, though. Simply add hidden bar lines in appropriate places.

Reply 2 offered by: bug on 29-Oct-2000

Create a hidden bar line, select and copy it,
then press Ctrl-V whenever you need it again.


#1806: grace note duration
grace note duration

(1806)

Submitted by: Igor on 26-Oct-2000

When using grace notes, it doesn't seem to matter what time duration is chosen as far as playback is concerned.

Is there a way of changing the duration of the grace note during staff play?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Oct-2000

Grace notes are currently fixed length.


#1807: Connecting keyboard to PC
Connecting keyboard to PC

(1807)

Submitted by: Mark on 26-Oct-2000

I cant seem
to connect my keyboard to my PC. I have a casio CT-470, old but not that
old, and a Soundblater 128 OEM. I purchased a midi cable and connected it up
as follows -

Fitted into the joystick port then connected the midi IN wire into the
keyboards midi OUT and vice verser. But no sucess. And i was wonder if you
could help me out.

do i need to switch "logical" on or off. How is
this done ?

Do i need to check any drivers?

So if you could please help me out, i would be very greatful, im sorry if it
may seem a bit obvisous what im trying to achieve but im new to computers.

Almost forgot to mention, i also tried to use the keyboard in sequencing
software but no joy. The software is called Massiva and is freeware

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Oct-2000

In Tools -> Options -> Record tab (you'll have to click the "right" button to get to this tab, it's the last one) there is a pulldown for Input Device. Click on the pulldown, you'll see your available midi in devices. One of them should say something like "... MPU midi in" or "MPU401..." That will be the device to select for your external keyboard.

HTH
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 27-Oct-2000

For those of you who found this thread and happen to own a computer without a lot of ports -- There's a product called MidiDock traveler that can hook a Midi keyboard to the parallel (printer) port. I use it on my old laptop. It's the cheapest and smallest method I know of, if your computer won't allow you to install more hardware. No doubt there are competing products as well.


#1808: text
text

(1808)

Submitted by: Tom on 27-Oct-2000

how do you add the flat symbol as text. eg instead of writing B(flat) I had to use A# as I can't find the symbol for the (flat)

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 27-Oct-2000

Let me re-phrase the above question. Regular users know that NWCV15 can be set as a user-defined font and used as text. But NWC doesn't have ordinary alphabet, and the process for setting text does not allow individual keystrokes to be set in different typefaces, as one could do with a word processor. So, what is the solution?

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 27-Oct-2000

Not sure if I understand. I use a small "b" to indicate a flatted chord: e.g. Bb. I also use staff bold (non italic) for my chords. Does that help?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Oct-2000

1: You can enter the 'B' as ordinary text (TNR or whatever) with preserve-width on, followed by the 'b' (flat symbol) in NWCV15, again with PW on.

2: You can enter the 'B' as ordinary text followed by two or three spaces, alignment 'at next note/bar', justification 'right'. Enter the 'b' in NWCV15, same alignment, justification 'left'. (Note that the space in NWCV15 is unusable, you have to any necessary padding using another font.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 28-Oct-2000

As an exercise, I was thinking of creating a "musitext" font that would be a regular text font, but with a few of the more obscure keyboard items replaced with common music symbols. That is, with "musitext" one could type ordinary upper and lower case (English) letters, and numerals, and some common punctuation. But items such as tilde, ampersand, at, backslash, and a few others would be replaced by music symbols (sharp, flat, natural, degree, mini-notes) that would fit in with the text. This would be accomplished by ordinary keystrokes (that is, NOT using the ALT key).

There are only about 8 candidates for replacement. Any suggestions? Also, would it be better to use a Sans or a Serif font?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 28-Oct-2000

Why /not/ use the ALT characters? That would give you 128+ characters to work with.

As to font, my personal preference is sans, but traditionally music publishers seem to prefer serif fonts. I'd say go with a generic TNR-style font.

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 28-Oct-2000

Actually, on second thought, maybe I /will/ use the ALT characters. Originally, my reason for wanting to use standard keys was that I do most of my work on a condensed keyboard (laptop) that has no number pad. It is a nuisance to use the number lock. I could use the character map, but that's also a nuisance.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Oct-2000

Use the toolbox approach -- create an nwc file that has your desired characters, perhaps separated by rests for convenience, which you can open below your work-in-progress, and from which you can copy items for use in the work. ;-)

Reply 8 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 30-Oct-2000

A winning idea, Fred. :)

Reply 9 offered by: Mad on 07-Nov-2000

...I'd even add something to Fred's proposal : in order not to use 1 of the 10 slots of your history, you can save such "tools" files into your Templates directory.
Either you save thoses tools file into the template directory itself, or you create a Subdirectory in this latter one, called "&Tools" so you can use Ctrl-N, Alt T to get to it. In this directory you can put all your tools or reference files, such as the guitar chords, instrument ranges, and so on.

Nevertheless, and as I *finally* got an unlimited access to *Net, I'll try to see for the musictext font.
When I'm done with the boxmark2, of course! But this should happen quite soon, for the same reason.
I just need to know what character you can easily access. For me it's ²&é~"#'{([-|è`_\ç^à@°)]+=}£$¤%ù*µ§!:/
but I'm sure it's not your case!!

NWCly/Fontly yours,
                                            MAD


#1809: Railroad Tracks symbol
Railroad Tracks symbol

(1809)

Submitted by: Todd on 28-Oct-2000

I don't know what the official name is for "Railroad Tracks" in a song, but it is a double hash mark that means to break at that point in the song. How do I do this in NoteWorthy?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 28-Oct-2000

The easiest way I know of is to simply enter two slashes as text (not within the lyrics). You can put them wherever you want, among the lyrics or within the staff. Probably, you will want to choose a normal (non-italic) or bold font of a slightly larger size than usual. This is accomplished under File > Page Setup >Fonts to specify a user-defined font. Then, when you place the text, choose your font.

I have also seen pre-drawn marks of the kind you require (more artistic than two simple slashes). I'm not sure, but believe they can be found in the "Boxmarks2" font accessible from the NWC user links. As before, you would need to define it as a user font.


#1810: program help
program help

(1810)

Submitted by: jj on 28-Oct-2000

why do doesnt the program automaticly beam the notes together when they are inputed and when i put the time sign. to 4/4 and i put four 1/4 notes it doesnt make a new measure.. please help

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 28-Oct-2000

Noteworthy Composer allows you, the user, to choose whether or not notes will be beamed. It also allows you, the user, to choose where the bar lines (measures) are put. This is a very nice feature, since not everyone wants the music to appear the same way when printed. I will leave the specific instructions for someone else.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Oct-2000

If you go through the tutorial in the User's Guide, you will know how to handle both of these situations, and more.

Reply 3 offered by: dsv0 on 29-Oct-2000

where is the users guide i havethe demo right now

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Oct-2000

http://www.NoteworthyComposer.com/order.htm#package

Reply 5 offered by: Paul Coats on 12-Nov-2000

You can enter a string of notes, then at the top, click Tools, and Audit Barlines. This will automatically place barlines for you, but it is easier to just hit the Tab key as you go. You really need to learn the keyboard shortcuts... this is the secret to speed. I enter without use of a midi keyboard, and can type in music at amazing speed... I even impress myself. LOL! From the Help section print out these keyboard commands, and keep them posted near you while you are learning. Soon you will find you are typing away with speed.

Reply 6 offered by: Art Thompson on 12-Nov-2000

NWC is great because it offer several ways to learn the keyboard shortcuts.Print it as as Paul suggested. Also, hover the mouse over the toolbar button for a second and it will provide you with the shortcut. Each item on the drop-down menus shows the shortcut as well. Now, here's the trick: After you looked up the shortcut,resist the urge to Click! Use the shortcut. You'll be zipping through notation in no time. This is also true of just about any Windows program. Put the mouse out of reach for a few day.


#1811: convert midi's to piano sheet music
convert midi's to piano sheet music

(1811)

Submitted by: Jose pena on 29-Oct-2000

any body know of a good site where i can get free converter of midi to piano sheet music..by the way,,,if any body has "the doors" panio sheet music then give me a message....on ANY song,,,,but i would perfer "love street"

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Oct-2000

Our freware player program will notate a MIDI file, but it does not support editing or printing. NoteWorthy Composer will let you do more, including editing and printing.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 30-Oct-2000

As a quick add on, the "maximum single track chord size" and "note range" options on the import midi menus can be used to split into customary piano tracks on the full program.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Longhurst on 30-Dec-2000

try www.oddrealm.com for piano sheet music :-)

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 31-Dec-2000

... and don't forget to check out NWC Scriptorium at http://www.vadu.com/nwc where you can search for a particular instrument.


#1812: Free, original font
Free, original font

(1812)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 31-Oct-2000

I have created a music notation font -- free public license. This is NOT a general-purpose font, and probably would not be of much use as user-defined text within NWC (I am working on something for that, too).

This font is called MusiSync2000. It is intended for in-line placement of a series of notes just as you would place text within a word processor. It could be used for learning the rhythm of songs by hand-clapping (that is why I created it) but it cannot express pitch or chords.

See for yourself:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/musisync_info.htm

Feedback is welcome, but I am not a professional font designer (nor a professional musician) so don't expect much!

Reply 1 offered by: guy on 03-Nov-2000

Could somebody make a jazz font for NWC? please :)

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 03-Nov-2000

If someone does make a Jazz font, it won't be me. My "Musisync2000" font was something I created for my own purposes, and am now releasing.

I know that there are some of you out there who downloaded my font. Stay tuned: Based on some other feedback, I am making some changes to improve its readability and transportability. This will not be a big deal, but the revision "MusiSync2001" will be up in another day or so. Same URL.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 09-Nov-2000

The MusiSync2001 font is now posted on-line. Go to the URL shown above for MusiSync2000, and follow the links to the new page.

I know that there are several dozen of you who downloaded the original MusiSync2000 font. Please regard it as "obsolete" and use MusiSync2001 instead.

The new font is slightly better drawn. It has ISO-Latin rather than symbol encoding. This means that the notation can be more readily converted back-and-forth to plain text with ordinary text editors.

The placement of symbols in the new font is not necessarily at the same keystroke locations as in the old font.

Character widths are now integer multiples of the space width, rather than proportionately spaced. This will allow alignment of symbols on two text lines.

Please discard the original 2000 font if you have it, and use the 2001 version instead. As before, it is free public license.

Side note: Regarding a Jazz font, or any other specialty font intended to show an alternative note style within NWC. Noteworthy actually "assembles" most notes from individual components: note-heads, stems, and flags. Merely creating a different font would not mean that the font could be used as an alternative to NWCV15. For certain applications, there IS a way to achieve variations without hacking the NWC program, but it requires the use of an outside commercial drawing application that most don't have.

As the organist said, "The composer of this Fugue called for bright foundations, so I'm wearing red underpants."


#1813: Noteworthy Scriptorium update
Noteworthy Scriptorium update

(1813)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 01-Nov-2000

For those who haven't found it yet, the Noteworthy Scriptorium (at http://www.vadu.com/nwc) is a library/archive of many things of interest to NWC users.

Most recent development is a reworking of the Search page for the database, making it very easy to find specific items. Try it at http://www.vadu.com/nwc/dbmain.html#search

Regards,
Andrew

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 01-Nov-2000

Sorry, the first address didn't quite come out right.
It's http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

A


#1814: Play before transcribe
Play before transcribe

(1814)

Submitted by: Wayne Leman on 01-Nov-2000

I am a new (registered) user of NWC. I used to use PianoMan, an MS-DOS program, with which I could play notes on my keyboard and when I was satisfied with them, I could transcribe them. I have not found this function in NWC, but need it. My ear is not good enough to know what the notes will sound like as I am composing unless I actually play the notes.

I saw something in previous messages about this, but am unsure if it meant that a play-before-transcribe function is available in NWC.

Is it?

If not, it is a much needed function. Now, to get the same thing I have to switch between two different programs, a keyboard player, and NWC, and both take over the MIDI mapper, not allowing the sound to come from the other after the first program has been used.

If NWC does not have a play-before-transcribe function, what are some solutions the rest of you use (besides having a piano, which I don't own, beside your computer) to sound out music you are composing before transcribing?

Thanks,
Wayne

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Nov-2000

It is not obvious from your question whether you are trying to do real-time or step time entry. I am guessing that you are doing step time entry. In this case, you can simply turn off Tools | MIDI Input Active while trying to find the note, then turn it on again when you are ready. Of course, it would probably be easier to just delete the notes that proved to be wrong.

In real-time, you capture your performance using Tools | Record. You can edit it afterward to fix mistakes. You can also do it repeatedly, and throw out efforts that were not good enough.

Lastly, NWC is fully capable of sharing the MIDI port with other programs. Check the Port Usage option in Tools | Options | Midi. However, not all other programs support such a capability.

Reply 2 offered by: Wayne Leman on 01-Nov-2000

>It is not obvious from your question whether you are trying to do real-time or step time entry. I am guessing that you are doing step time entry. In this case, you can simply turn off Tools | MIDI Input Active while trying to find the note, then turn it on again when you are ready. Of course, it would probably be easier to just delete the notes that proved to be wrong.<

I'm sorry, but I do not know what this means. What I am trying to do is sound out the notes on my computer keyboard, so I then know what notes to put in NWC. I need to hear the notes come through my computer speakers. It is too much of a bother to keep experimenting with different notes on NWC, then listening to them, then erasing them, trying again, until I get it right. I'd like to be able to hear notes as I press a key, then go back and record those notes. Ideally, it would be nice if NWC could remember the last 20 or so notes I have played, to save me time re-entering the notes by hand on the staff, but my major need is to be able to hear the notes.

>In real-time, you capture your performance using Tools | Record.<

I haven't been able to hear the notes yet as I hit any keys. Sorry if I'm not making myself clear.

> You can edit it afterward to fix mistakes. You can also do it repeatedly, and throw out efforts that were not good enough.<

I have done this and it is tedious with NWC. It would be a big help if I could hear the notes one at a time then I could record them once I get the notes right.

>Lastly, NWC is fully capable of sharing the MIDI port with other programs. Check the Port Usage option in Tools | Options | Midi. However, not all other programs support such a capability.<

I'm sorry, but I don't understand this. What does it mean to check Port Usage. What am I supposed to check? What do I look for? What do I change? How do I get both the sound to come from both programs, NWC and the other program (Aldo's something or other, which has a piano keyboard I can play on, which I need in NWC).

I'm sorry if this isn't clear. I can keep trying if it isn't.

Thanks,
Wayne

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Nov-2000

Based on what you have written, I am guessing that:

1 - You have a MIDI keyboard
2 - You have the necessary MIDI cables connecting your keyboard to your computer
3 - You have the necessary MIDI drivers installed so that your computer can communicate with the keyboard
4 - Your MIDI keyboard does not have an on-board synthesizer
5 - You want to hear what is played on the keyboard

If this is the case, you simply need to setup the MIDI echo feature from Tools | Options | Record.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Nov-2000

Upon further review, it looks like you do not have a MIDI keyboard. If this is the case, you have two options:

1. You can hear what you just entered by playing it back after you enter it. You can configure play back to start from your current position, which helps to hear what you just entered. This is done from Tools | Options | Midi, right next to the Port Usage feature mentioned before.

2. You can use PIANO.EXE to find the notes. See msg #1054 and msg #1465 for more details.


#1815: 1.7 text expression is awful!
1.7 text expression is awful!

(1815)

Submitted by: Angelique on 01-Nov-2000

The new version of NWC puts text expressions right above or smooshed up next to the notes! There doesn't seem to be any way to put them *next* to notes with any space between them, even if you put hard spaces after the text expression (which I used to do.) If you want to copy or cut and paste the expressions or the notes, there is no way to isolate them! Am I missing something?

Reply 1 offered by: Art thompson on 01-Nov-2000

Between the Preserve width function and the alignment options, I've had no problem putting text anywhere I want it. You can move it up or down easily just like notes or anything else - by selecting it, then hold down both shift/ctrl and use the up/down arrow keys.

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 01-Nov-2000

Also, make sure you're selecting the little 'diamond' associated with the text for cut/paste/edit operations. That may be what your missing - not sure what you mean exactly.

Reply 3 offered by: Paul Coats on 12-Nov-2000

I really like the new text expression. The ability to right justify or center has come in very handy. This is one of the first of the new features I have really taken advantage of.

Reply 4 offered by: David Potvin on 07-Dec-2000

Angelique, try this:

With your text, in "Expression Placement", put it "Center" and "At Next Note/Bar", then where your text is, just add spacebars, and look at where your text is positionned, and just add or remove spacebar characters until it's where you want it!

You can also put it "Left" or "Right", but each spacebar is full when with those options, and counts for half when centered - gives you more precision on the positioning!

Now MAKE SURE IT IS "AT NEXT NOTE/BAR"!!! I use it myself, and I SWEAR to you it works! Hope it helps!


#1816: The lyric box is tiny! Who can see it?
The lyric box is tiny! Who can see it?

(1816)

Submitted by: Angelique on 01-Nov-2000

I recently download the latest NWC version. In the old version, if the "view" was large, it was easy to see the lyrics you were typing into the lyric box. Now they are teeny-weeny no matter what. Is there a way to make these look larger as you are typing them in?

Reply 1 offered by: Art thompson on 01-Nov-2000

Download the service pack(s) and your troubles will be solved. BTW, an email to registered users alerting them of service packs would be dandy

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Nov-2000

In version 1.70, the lyrics are shown at the size you have specified in File | Page Setup. We changed this in service pack 1, so that they are now shown at a fixed size. You can either increase the size in Page Setup, or get the service packs at:

http://www.NoteworthySoftware.com/nwc170sp.htm

Reply 3 offered by: Angelique on 04-Nov-2000

Thanks for the help! I downloaded the service pack and now it's easy to read.


#1817: Wish List
Wish List

(1817)

Submitted by: Art thompson on 01-Nov-2000

I just submitted this to the wish list. Thumbs Up or Down??

For each type of insertable object (text, dynamic,etc.), allow an option so that when that object is inserted, it is automatically selected. After inserting , I almost always want to change something in the properties, such as visibility. It would save a lot of keystrokes.

Reply 1 offered by: Robin Withey on 02-Nov-2000

Yes please, that would be very useful.

With a previous program I used to use on my Atari ST, I could change the length of the note I just entered, without changing the default note length. With NWC, if I want to do this, I either have to change the default length before I enter the note (not too fiddly, but I often forget, plus it means I usually have to change the length again for the next note), or I have to select the note after I entered it, which interrupts my flow. I'm afraid my keyboard skills are not up to recording in real time!

Robin Withey

Reply 2 offered by: Art thompson on 02-Nov-2000

Yes,Yes. I wasn't thinking of notes specifically, but that could certainly be user selectable too.

Reply 3 offered by: Paul Coats on 12-Nov-2000

I wish for a way to save a page, in a similar manner as copying as a wmf in the Print Preview, to another format, such as TIFF or JPG, or some other sort of more universal picture format.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 12-Nov-2000

As has been discussed elsewhere in the forum: You can make a WMF from NWC, then open the WMF with programs such as the free Irfan View

http://www.irfanview.com

From there, you can save it as JPG and so forth. Given this capability, there seems to be little reason for NWC to change the program.

You may need to adjust the resolution (DPI) of your printer before creating the WMF, as the WMF resolution is related to that of the printer selection.

Reply 5 offered by: Paul Coats on 13-Nov-2000

JPG's made via this method (I use a similar viewer program, ACDSee 2.41), as well as BMP's, TIF's are too grainy, and to me, unreadable.

I would like to be able to save directly to a picture format, without going to a wmf first.

I also downloaded IRFANVIEW, and found it to be not nearly as good for opening WMF's as ACDSee. The WMF's opened by IRFANVIEW looked just like the jpgs, and other picture files I convert from WMF's. However, ACDSee opens WMF's, and will print them as sharply as printing directly from Noteworthy.

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 14-Nov-2000

I was browsing through the Bonus CD-Rom that accompanied my copy of Norton Systems Works, and guess what -- there was a trial version of ACDsee. So I tried it. This was a version from 1998, not necessarily the most recent.

I made a placeable WMF of a NWC file. My default printer is at 300 dpi resolution. Both ACDsee and Irfan View opened the WMF. Here's the interesting part: The image dimensions (in pixels) were different in the two programs! With a little math, I was able to attribute this to the fact that there is often confusion beteen the nominal 72 dpi screen resolution, and the nominal 96 dpi screen resolution. Both programs gave images that had to be down-scaled to proper viewing size, by a facter of 3 or 4. When down-scaled, the images from both programs had the usual fuzzies due to this procedure.

From time to time, a WMF does indeed produce a very grainy, low-resolution image when opened in Irfan View (I have not tried to duplicate the result with ACDsee). The reason seems to have something to do with inappropriate resolution (DPI) of the printer at time of WMF creation. It seems that if the printer is at high resolution (such as 600 dpi) then the WMF is down-sampled or something like that, producing an inappropriate result. Whether the problem lies in the WMF from NWC, or in the interpretation by Irfan View, I do not know.

As discussed elsewhere, the resolution of the WMF is dependent upon printer resolution at time of WMF creation. If you have a printer (such as Acrobat Distiller) that allows 72 dpi or 96 dpi resolution, or "screen" resolution, then you might find that the resulting WMF looks better when converted to an image file (JPG, or GIF would be better).

If you have a PostScript printer installed on your system, and are a knowledgable user, it may be possible to add 72dpi or 96 dpi dummy resolution to the PPD file, using a text editor. Do so at your own risk!

ACDsee and Irfan View are very different programs, not simply clones.

Again, if you own Adobe Illustrator or, I believe, Corel Draw and similar programs, you may be able to open your WMF there.

The bottom line: Is direct creation of an image a useful wish-list feature for a future upgrade to NWC? Although I personally do not need it (having access to advanced technology for handling WMF, as well as PDF generation) maybe other users would like it. How often do we, the users, want to create web-ready images versus printable documents?

Reply 7 offered by: Paul Coats on 10-Dec-2000

I do exactly this, and have been forced to use Finale for whole pages.

For inserting only a line or two, such my these articles on Sax On The Web:

http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/1389/saxophone/Beginner_Corner1.html

and

http://www.geocities.com/harrir/saxophone/Common_Transpositions.html

Were created using the Copy Special feature of NWC, and inserting these examples into MS Word.

But for Tim Price's Lessons On Sax On The Web,

http://www.geocities.com/saxontheweb/Price/Sept00.html

I have been having to do these in Finale, and saving as a TIF. We are soon to convert these TIF's to pdf format (Adobe viewing). But I would like to do this out of NWC.

Reply 8 offered by: Joe Music on 11-Dec-2000

I create PDF out of NWC via Adobe Acrobat (not just the reader). It can also be done by printing a PostScript file then conversion into PDF using Ghostscript. If NWC wants to add the capability for direct PDF generation, without the need for the user to hook up other software, then I imagine it would have to license the technology -- and that would drive up the cost of the program. I suppose that would also be true for certain other bitmap formats.

Reply 9 offered by: Art Thompson on 12-Dec-2000

My limited experience with copy special was that the hidden objects showed up in the graphic. Light gray, but there nonetheless. This seemed most unhandy, so I quit trying to use it.


#1819: Andy's question 1818 ?
Andy's question 1818 ?

(1819)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 02-Nov-2000

Andy asked a question in a message numbered 1818, which disappeared after I responded. Fortunately, I copied its message into my web page in order to understand it (he tried to put a lot of &nbsp in it), and the copy is here: http://www.teaser.fr/~omiakinen/andy.html .

My responses are:
1) Insert Master Repeat Open/Close barlines.
2) Select notes, then beam them (Ctrl-B).
3) Select notes, then tripletize them (Ctrl-T).

All that can be found in the online help.

I hope this helps, Andy.

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 02-Nov-2000

Oh, I didn't read the first paragraph about "song word". Search "Lyrics" in the online help.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Nov-2000

The originator/author of message 1818 used an inappropriate/invalid e-mail address, so the thread had to be removed.

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 02-Nov-2000

Ok.

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 07-Nov-2000

For late readers of the forum : please note that I won't keep indefinitely the link to the message of andy (andy.html). I you read this thread after december 1st 2000, you may expect that the link won't be available.

Thanks.


#1820: Dynamcis
Dynamcis

(1820)

Submitted by: Cory on 02-Nov-2000

Hello--

I am new to this program and I am wondering how to make Noteworthy perform dynamics. Do you just put in the dynamic markings or is there some intra-control that I need to adjust...please E-mail me your response. Thank you

Cory
beep621@aol.com

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 02-Nov-2000

Placing dynamic markings should do what you want. See
Insert=>Dynamic.. or select the dynamic from the palette
on the left. You can also add dynamic variances (cresh,
dimin etc...)


#1821: Alto Notation Help
Alto Notation Help

(1821)

Submitted by: Angelique on 04-Nov-2000

It's been years since I sang in a chorale, and I was a soprano. Now I'm writing some choral music, and I am not sure the best way to write the alto parts. Can anyone tell me if it's more common to see many notes below the staff, or to see notes on the staff with an octave shift?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 05-Nov-2000

The alto range sits quite nicely on or near the treble clef and in modern music that is the clef that is invariably used.

A few ledger lines are quite acceptable (you'd only need two in normal music, although I have seen, but possibly not heard ;<), altos singing the F below middle C - that's getting a bit low!)

Nowadays the only octave shift in use is that for tenors on the treble clef, sinc a lot of their range is above the bass clef.

HTH
Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 05-Nov-2000

I sing with a SATB choir, and have never seen the Alto part with an octave shift. It seems that Peter's advice is right on the mark. As for tenors, sometimes they get a treble clef with an octave shift, sometimes the Bass clef with ledger lines.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant  on 05-Nov-2000

>>sometimes they get a treble clef with an octave shift, sometimes the Bass clef with ledger lines.

In my experience this depends entirely on whether the tenors get their own staff or not. It's only when they share a staff with the basses that bass clef is used.

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 06-Nov-2000

Agreed. I usually find two kinds of scores for SATB choirs:

First kind :
- Treble Clef for Sopranos
- Treble Clef for Altos (with ledger lines)
- Treble Clef with octave shift down for Tenors
- Bass Clef for Basses
Note that too many times, the octave shift down for
Tenors is forgotten, but everybody knows that it is
implied.

Second kind:
- Treble Clef for Sopranos and Altos
- Bass Clef for Tenors and Basses

Among these two kinds, the first one is always preferred
by the singers (although the second one saves paper).

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Nov-2000

Interestingly the second method is universally used in hymn books. The saving of space is obviously an advantage whenyou have 600 and more hymns to print, but an added advantage is the fact that you can play them! Reading off four staves is way beyond me: and quite a few others it would seem, since you often see a piano equivalent score underneath, marked 'for rehearsal only'.

Reply 6 offered by: Artur on 06-Nov-2000

There's an other clefs group:
Soprano: C clef in the 1st line
Alto: C clef on 3rd line
Tenor: C clef on 4th line
Bass: F clef
Nwc has the C clef for tenor and alto, but not for Sopranos

Reply 7 offered by: Angelique on 06-Nov-2000

Let me be more specific and see if everyone still agrees. I am writing music for a women's choir. There are two soprano parts and two alto parts. As someone mentioned, most of the alto parts are within the staff. However, there is a small section in which one of the alto parts goes down to the F and E below middle C.

(I didn't think this was weird, because I can reach these notes easily, although one of the people who responded didn't seem to think this is too realistic. Maybe it isn't; when I said I was a soprano before, it wasn't because I was *suited* to be one-- they just desperately needed people who could sing acappella. I'm better at singing low than high! So altos-- tell me if this is too low for most of you!)

So-- do I keep this part with all those notes with little lines below the staff? Or do I write them within the staff and say "sing these an octave lower"? (It never occurred to me to write them with a bass clef! In fact, wouldn't that mess up people who sing, but don't play another instrument, and who therefore don't know how to read the bass clef?)

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 06-Nov-2000

Angelique,

I sing a lot of choral music and my experience is as follows:

1) I can't remember ever seeing an alto section being asked to sing the E below middle C. I think I've seen F below middle C once or twice, but let me assure you that's a real stretch for most altos.

2) Use the ledger lines. I've absolutely never seen an 8va shift in any vocal part (except for the shifted treble clef itself in tenor parts).

3) Bass clef is never used for female voices.

4) Artur is right that there are clefs named for the voice parts, but except for the bass clef (which is standard), not one of the clefs he lists is ever used for vocal music, at least not in the English-speaking world and not in the last 100 years or more. (Also, the soprano clef I'm aware of is not C clef on the first line but G clef on the first line.)

I hope this helps.

- Grant

Reply 9 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Nov-2000

Gosh, I didn't see many replies from persons whom I would guess sing Alto!

Our church choir often has male/female switching in the Alto or Tenor parts depending upon who is available. Two females regularly sing Tenor, and can reach the mid-baritone range including the E below middle C. Of course, it does not have the sound characteristics of a male voice in that range. I do not know whether this compass is to be expected of other Altos, but I gather from the above replies that it is unusual.

Although the compass for a Bass ought to be much lower (and for quality Basses, is), experience indicates that men who can convincingly go below A flat (at the bottom line of the Bass clef) are not that easy to find. It seems to be an ethnic thing: Russians yes, Irish no, by and large. If the music you are writing is intended for church performance, keep in mind that chrches in general tend to be identified with particular ethnic segments of the population, at least where I live.

Any other comments about that?

Reply 10 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Nov-2000

Oops, poor choice of musical language! A-flat is not the bottom line of the Bass clef: that's G. What I meant was that many run-of-the-mill amateur Basses (such as myself) cannot convincingly reach that bottom line (G). By "convincingly" I mean in a manner that reassures the listener that the singer could go lower routinely.

Reply 11 offered by: Robin Withey on 07-Nov-2000

Well, I consider myself to be a baritone, not a bass, but I have no problem getting below the stave (down to a D on a good day!). Mind you, you don't see many parts where you have to do that!

(Oh dear, we seem to be slipping off-topic rather!)

Anyway, I noticed that some of the templates posted on the scriptorium use the Alto clef for the alto line. Logical, I suppose, but I've never seen it used in practice.

Reply 12 offered by: Grant on 07-Nov-2000

Robin's correct. The files "Four-Part Voice.nwc" and "Blank Four-Part Voice Score.nwc" from "blanks.zip" have alto clef for the altos and tenor clef for the tenors. Anyone who tries to use these templates to create a vocal score is going to be unpleasantly surprised at the singers' reactions. (Interestingly, another file in the same collection, "SATBacc.nwc", gets things right.)

The offending files should probably be fixed so as not to mislead anyone into thinking these odd clefs are of any actual use when writing for voices.

Reply 13 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 08-Nov-2000

... and have been as I type. Thanks Grant.

Andrew


#1822: SP1 and SP2
SP1 and SP2

(1822)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 05-Nov-2000

I have done a search on SP1 and SP2 in the NWC Forum : there is nowhere an announcement of their release. Why ?
I know that I should have gone to NEW and see their anouncement but putting the information also in the forum should have been a good thing !
I also wish to see on the download page the date of last modification of NWC and the level eg. 1.70 SPx.


#1823: Cannot record real time performance
Cannot record real time performance

(1823)

Submitted by: John Hilton White on 05-Nov-2000

When I play anything in real time on my MIDI keyboard into a Noteworthy file all, I get is a series of notes of the same length corresponding to that which happens to be highlighted in the note tool bar at the time. I've tried to follow the instructions on page 27 of the latest User's Guide as far as possible and have found no reference to this problem in either the FAQ's or this Forum. Could you please suggest what I might be doing wrong? many thanks, John.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 05-Nov-2000

You need to have a preexisting staff of "something" already there. I use a metronome beat staff (or, if I am simply developing accompaniment, the melody line).

The record feature will then work correctly and accurately mirror the duration of the note inputs from your midi input device in the new staff or buffer, depending upon which option you selected under the "options, record tab".

Reply 2 offered by: John Hilton White on 06-Nov-2000

I use the piano template and give it a name but I always get the same result.
cheers,
John.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Nov-2000

Are you confusing two different methods of note input?

Your first mail shows that you are entering in step-time mode - i.e. you've set midi input active, so each note (or chord) is entered as if with the enter key, with the note attributes as pre-set.

What you are trying to do is input in real time, and for that you need to press the record button instead.

Now NWC will play the existing track (you must have an existing track) and you can play along with it. Press stop and the newly recorded track will appear in its own window, and you can cut and paste from there into the original window.

A trick for a totally blank score is to write a click track. If you send it to channel 10 (see staff options/midi) then the click will be percussive (rather than a note), the percussion instrument depending on the entered pitch.

This only needs to be one bar long, but repeated repeatedly. Use the local repeat feature to get as many repeats as you need, like this:

|:o o o o ¹ºº:|

Set tempo to suit.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Nov-2000

Are you really following the instructions on Page 27 of the User's Guide, section "Record play from a MIDI keyboard?" If not, this is the section you need to use as a basis for recording.

From your question, it sounds more like you are following the step-time entry instructions, which is the next section of the User's Guide, "Remotely input notes from a MIDI keyboard." This section describes step-time entry, which uses the note toolbar to determine note duration.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Nov-2000

See also:
msg #825, msg #292, msg #392, http://NoteworthyComposer.com/faq3.htm#recrdlv

Reply 6 offered by: John Hilton White on 06-Nov-2000

Thanks everyone for your helpful replies. I've tried Peter's trick of a repeated click track on channel 10 but, although I get the notes appearing on one or two new staves after I have pressed the stop button and can then get them to play, I cannot see or hear the notes as I play them on my midi keyboard. Is there any way I can make the notes visible and audible as I play them?
Cheers,
John.

Reply 7 offered by: John Hilton White on 06-Nov-2000

By jiggering around with my midi keyboard controls, I've now managed to get the notes to sound when I play them, but they don't appear onthe score until after I stop the recording. Is this normal?
cheers,
John.

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Nov-2000

You can hear them through your sound card using the Echo feature (msg #1339, msg #1365). You will not see the notes until you are done playing and press the Stop button.

Reply 9 offered by: John Hilton White on 06-Nov-2000

Once again, many thanks to all for solving my problem.
Cheers,
John.


#1824: Tremolo notation
Tremolo notation

(1824)

Submitted by: David Hill on 06-Nov-2000

Apologies if this has been raised previously! I need to be able to show/print a tremolo on two alternating notes, i.e. two notes beamed with "floating" beams. Has anyone found a decent workaround for this? Part of the problem is that if the beams are "texted" in, you still need to be able to show two notes of a certain length which should only take up the space of one.

(I know I can create the sound needed with actual repeated notes on an invisible staff - it's the printing that matters.)

Thanks

David Hill
Oxford UK

Reply 1 offered by: Art Thompson on 06-Nov-2000

The NWC ornamental font, created by some other dedicated NWC user, has some very nice single, double and triple "hash marks". Both ascending and descending. From Vibe or Marimba music I've seen, this should work nicely.
http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/files/nworn.zip

Spacing the notes exactly the way you want may require layering, if you want a slight visual offset between the top and bottom notes without adding beats to the bar.


#1825: Opening a midi file
Opening a midi file

(1825)

Submitted by: Bob Williams on 07-Nov-2000

When importing some midi files, an extra 32nd rest is inserted at the begining of a passage. Then, all the following notes are offset by 1/32 of a beat, causing many notes to be tied together to get the proper duration. Although NWC plays it correctly, it almost impossible for a performer to play them off the printed music. I do have a sample file to help explain this. Any help?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Nov-2000

This has been discussed in another thread, but I can't seem to find it right now.

The long and short of it is that some midi artists (myself included, on certain files) will intentionally make it difficult to re-import a midi file. Often you can fix this by deleting the leading rest (you have to do this on all staves, which may mean breaking longer rests into shorter ones; e.g. change a 1/4 rest into a 1/32 plus a double-dotted 1/8, then delete the 1/32), then exporting to midi and re-importing. Alternately, do a barline audit; you still may have touch-ups to do using either approach.

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 08-Nov-2000

I don't have any experience with this, but here's a thought - open the MIDI file with a sequencer and delete the event(s) that cause the offending import. I presume these would be one of the first few events. What do you think, Fred?

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 08-Nov-2000

Place a Section Open barline at the correct position for the start of the measure in each staff then do the Audit Barline trick on each staff.
Otherwise pad each staff with enough rests to make up the beat count to a full measure and Audit Barlines.
You may still get some strange notation though!

Reply 4 offered by: Bob Williams on 08-Nov-2000

Fred, I’m curious as to why one would publish a MIDI file, but make it difficult to take apart? If you want to preserve your intellectual rights, wouldn’t it be better to publish in a format that can’t be disassembled? Some web sites I’ve found do not allow downloading of the MIDI file. I arrange music for our church’s brass ensemble, and understand copyrights, so I’m careful about using other people’s work.

I’ll try the tricks that you and others have described. Its really weird looking at a 32nd note tied to a 16th tied to another 32nd all in the same measure, even worst when they cross a bar line!

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Nov-2000

It's not so much a matter of protecting intellectual property, as it is a matter of not wanting inaccurate scores floating around. I often take "performance liberties" on the midi renditions, which if imported back and converted to a score would give an inaccurate impression. Similarly, I might combine, say, bass and alto trombones on a single channel, which when re-imported would again give the wrong idea (the original "visible" parts having been omitted from the midi because the staves were muted during export). And so on.

In almost all cases I provide either the original NWC file or a pre-digested PostScript score in addition to the midi, so there's really no reason for anyone to tear into the midi itself; it's provided solely for the purpose of listening.

In other cases I put a brief pause at the start of the midi in anticipation of concatenating it (e.g. the "mondo-midis" of The Magic Flute).

As to not allowing downloads of midis -- that's easy to get around. I've done it just to prove it can be done (same with mp3's, or whatever). In my case, I publish my work because I /want/ people to have it; I'd just rather not that they messed with "perfection." (relatively speaking of course) ;-)

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Nov-2000

Afterthought -- check out miditrim.exe, one of Günter Nagler's free DOS midi utilities. I think it's also included in his shareware Windows "midi utilities" version.

http://www2.iicm.edu/Cpub#freemidi

A zipped-up collection of all the DOS utilities is also available on the Scriptorium.

Reply 7 offered by: Paul Coats on 12-Nov-2000

After import of a midi, I have padded with the correct rests, the saved again as a midi. Then, imported again. Sometimes this will keep you from having to "clean up" the things a barline audit will not.


#1827: vertical scrolling while playback
vertical scrolling while playback

(1827)

Submitted by: Garnet K on 09-Nov-2000

I am led to believe this is possible with ver 1.70 but I can find out how to do it. Any hints ?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Nov-2000

Just do it -- while playing a file, the vertical scroll bar is now active, and you can move it up and down at will.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Nov-2000

PS - you need to have the web service packs installed for this to work. Perhaps that's why your copy won't scroll.

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwc170sp.htm


#1828: FILE FORMAT
FILE FORMAT

(1828)

Submitted by: Nathan A. Cunningham on 14-Nov-2000

I was wondering if there are any 'clean' ways to convert midi's to wav or mp3 formats. I have tried using the cheesy windows sound recorder, and suffered the fact that it only lets you record in segments of 60 seconds. If anyone knows of a program or technique to accomplish this, I would be very greatful.

THANK YOU,
Nate

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Nov-2000

There's a major thread on this topic at:

msg #1003

Reply 2 offered by: Nathan A. Cunningham on 15-Nov-2000

Thanks, and sorry for wasting space.

Nate


#1829: Drum-head notation in WMF: possible.
Drum-head notation in WMF: possible.

(1829)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 16-Nov-2000

Under limited circumstances, it is possible to have X-head or other alternative note-heads appear in the printout of a NWC composition, when a placeable WMF is used. This does not affect the NWC prgram or original NWC file, nor the MIDI, only the WMF.

A WMF contains references to fonts used. If a hex editor program replaces "NWCV15" with some other 6-character font name in the WMF, then the substitute font will appear when the WMF is placed within MS Word or orpened in a graphics program. If you have a hex editor, try it with the Symbol font and see.

A free hex editor called "frhed" is downloadable. Search for it.

Thus, it is possible (without violating NWC's copyright) to create a substitute font, with ordinary note-heads replaced with something such as crosses or diamonds. Drawn objects, such as stems, ties, and beams, are not affected. It is also possible to replace the 5-line staff with a single line.

I have tried this strategy myself, and it works.

Is anyon else interested? If so, give me feedback.

Important: This is not a method for creating a jazz font, or a "handwritten" font. It is only for substituting note-head shapes.

Important: The technique cannot select a single staff within a multi-staff composition. It is a global operation that will change every note-head within a WMF. If you want to have one staff with ordinary note-heads, and one staff with drum-crosses within a single composition, then you would have to create separate NWC compositions with separate WMFs, and interleave them.

I am neither a drummer nor a professional font creator. But the technique involved here, once I finish the font, is free and relatively no-brainer.

If there is consensus as to what style of note-head is needed, I will proceed. But otherwise, not.

Reply 1 offered by: Matt Souther on 18-Nov-2000

I would be interested in a font that would let you write out drum parts for jazz, etc.... I've been trying to work out a full ensemble jazz arrangment of one of my pieces over the past few days, and the entire rhythm section has me sort of confounded. I'm not a drummer either, but I think the X or diamond head would be a welcome option. One question though: would it affect all of the notes in the staff, or just selected ones? I believe the bass, snare, etc. are regularly notated with the usual black circle, and I wouldn't want those to be changed.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 18-Nov-2000

Unfortunately, my method is global: it affects every note-head in a WMF the same way. All filled note heads (quarters, eighths, etc) would change to one thing, all half note heads would change to another thing, all whole note heads would change to a third thing. Also, contrary to my original believe, there is less flexibility in where stems would attach to note heads.

Unless I got a lot of responses all indicating that this is what was needed, I wouldn't bother with the font. So far, every response (most off-forum by E-mail) have indicated, as with your reply, that this is not what is needed. So I probably won't do the font.

I know there are a lot of readers of this forum other than the contributors. Another thing I posted a couple of weeks ago got about 30 hits within the first day. The only place where the URL was given was on this forum.

Reply 3 offered by: David Potvin on 29-Jan-2001

Sensible, but useless!

My best suggestion for putting cymbal notations or diamong characters instead of black heads is through BitMap, not Metafile! Of course, you'd need to install the 16-bit version next to the 32-bit everybody has, but it works nice!

Better still, you get to draw your OWN PERSONALIZED cymbal header! ;-) Once done - with Paint or any other BMP editor - you can insert the chart into a Word text file, even adjust the exact size you want it, and Voilà!

Although I'd still prefer to see a header option in the next version...


#1830: Change in articulation marks?
Change in articulation marks?

(1830)

Submitted by: Grant on 16-Nov-2000

I recently upgraded to version 1.70 service pack 2 and I'm now seeing what I think is a change in behavior.

In previous versions, I'm almost certain it was possible to put both a staccato dot and a tenuto mark on the same note. (This is common notation for a separation that is not as marked as with a staccato dot alone.) It now appears that this can't be done.

Am I right that this was previously possible? What are the chances of enabling (or, if my memory is correct, re-enabling) this notation?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Nov-2000

Staccato and tenuto marks are mutually exclusive in NWC. This behaviour is unchanged in version 1.70.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 17-Nov-2000

Hmmmm. If you say so. I'm off to the wish list then.


#1831: When you wish upon a .........
When you wish upon a .........

(1831)

Submitted by: Art Thompson on 16-Nov-2000

I wish that I could control which items are affected by the persistent note tool. For example, I would like to lock in the stem direction and not sharps or flats.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Nov-2000

I agree that selective control over tool persistence would be useful. However, the example you cite doesn't require this -- the note direction buttons are already persistent, remaining in effect until you change them.

Reply 2 offered by: Robin Withey on 17-Nov-2000

Yes, the ubiquity of persistence can be a pain sometimes!

For example, you rarely want dots or accidentals to be persistent, but if you turn persistence on for some other reason, you have to remember to turn them off every time. For this reason, I rarely use the persistence tool.

If we're on the subject of wishes (and it's sort of related to persistence), one useful trick that would save a lot of time would be the ability to define note-length "patterns". For example, music written in compound time (e.g. 6/8 - that is the right term, isn't it?), frequently has the repeated pattern crotchet, quaver (or quarter note, eighth note for you Americans). It would save a lot of time if the step editor automatically alternated the note lengths.

Mind you, that's a fairly esoteric request. What might work nearly as well is a method I liked in a sequencer I had on my Atari ST. There, if you tapped the space bar while holding the note down, the note length increased for one note only. A boon for us useless keyboard players that have no hope of recording in real time.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Nov-2000

How about this as a proposal for persistence handling: hang onto only the items that have been selected when invoking the persistence tool. So if you have, say, accents (only) selected when clicking the tool persistence button, then you'll get a series of accented notes, with all other attributes (accidentals, dotted time, etc.) only in effect for the current note.

Reply 4 offered by: Art Thompson on 17-Nov-2000

I like that idea even better. A sort of 'fluid' persistence.
Robin,like you I don't record in real time, but tap away at the (computer) keyboard. I find it easiest to Cut/paste most repeating rhythms, then go back and change the pitches. Unfortunately, if the rhythm is a triplet containing chord note, you have to delete an individual pitch if you want to change it, or its accidental. Now, here's the rub...
You have to "un" triplet it before you can add the note back in,then "re" triplet it. It's enough to give you Chalfonts!

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Nov-2000

Alternating patterns and triplets are good candidates for a macro - enter as a series of same duration notes then invoke the macro to change the durations/beam/tripletize whatever!
(Why ever did $soft drop the macro recorder for Win95)?

Reply 6 offered by: Robin Withey on 20-Nov-2000

On the subject of macros, I use a very useful shareware program called Macro Magic, to be found at www.iolo.com.

It's far more powerful than the old MS recorder (which I found unuseable). I haven't tried it with NWC as yet, but that's only because I never thought of it.

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 24-Nov-2000

I found macros really really useful for composition.
I gave up on M$ recorder when I went to Win 95, (though the 3.1 recorder does actually work, sort of).
I sometimes wish NWC would have its own macro recorder for keystrokes etc. But a third party recorder would probably be just as handy.

Reply 8 offered by: David Potvin on 07-Dec-2000

Hey, Art!

Stem direction is NOT, repeat NOT controlled by the persistent note tool! It is persistent by itself, when activated - unless we don't have the same version of NoteWorthy...

As for the persistent note tool, it would be nice to have a selective option for each selection; for example, if you want legatos, or grace notes, or marcatos for a long time, and NOT accidentals caught with them, well, if there were two options, say "," for staccatos, and <shift>+",", or (') for persistent staccatos, it would just be an improvement, without fracturing your skulls over macros!

Opinions?...

P.S.: Art, I totally agree with you, as for the triplet chord members!!!


#1832: Help!
Help!

(1832)

Submitted by: Andy on 18-Nov-2000

How can I make "double note"?
Like this:
|
|
O|
O|
|
|
O|

"O" is the note.

Reply 1 offered by: Andy on 18-Nov-2000

How can I make "double note"?
Like this:
---|-----
---|-----
--O|-----
--O|-----
---|-----
---|-----
--O|-----

"O" is the note.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Nov-2000

I'm not sure I understand what you're looking for, and since no-one else has answered I suspect I'm not alone. If you want more than one note at a particular time (sharing the same stem) use the "chord" function. Enter the first note, then move the insertion point up or down as needed and enter the second note by pressing CNTL Enter, and so on. More information on this is in the "Chord Member" part of the help file. Click on "Index" in the help system, enter "chord" in the "Type the first few letters..." field, and there you go.

Hope this helps.

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: Andy on 19-Nov-2000

Thank you very much, Fred!
I've solve my problem!
Thanks a lot!
Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you!

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Nov-2000

I know that there are some of you who may think that Andy's question would have answered itself had he known the correct term, "chord." Evidently Fred was able to figure it out. But hear this:

In Paris (yes, France) I came across a vending maching with instructions that read, in French, "Insert your credit card. This machine does not accept credit cards." I can passably read French but thought perhaps my idiom was obsolete. So I pressed a button to translate into English. It read, "Insert your credit card. This machine does not accept credit cards."

The confusion, in both languages, was caused by using the same term to mean a special vending-machine card (issued locally) rather than an international banking card.


#1833: Placement of dynamics etc.
Placement of dynamics etc.

(1833)

Submitted by: Clive on 18-Nov-2000

You know, I still like how the old versions placed dynamics, tempi, etc. How do you simulate it in the current version? Is it "before" or "after next staff signature"? Please help!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Nov-2000

"Before other staff signatures" emulates older version behaviour


#1834: Accents like this: ^  --before it's too late!
Accents like this: ^  --before it's too late!

(1834)

Submitted by: Matt Souther on 18-Nov-2000

I've been working on my first full jazz arangement for jazz ensemble, and just inserting the short, hard accents that look like teepees as the text symbol "^". It's a boundless pain trying to align all of those suckers over their respective notes, though... especially since I have to re-align them every time I transpose, separate, or harmonize a part. And this for all five saxes, four bones, four trumpets, and all the accompanying personnel... gaaah! I'm at my wits' end! Needless to say, I've already requested the feature (it must have sounded like I was begging), but if anyone else has their own crafty way of inserting ^'s, tell me! Please!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Nov-2000

The text thing is not hard at all... if you choose the right alignment. Use "Preserve width" OFF, "at next note/bar" alignment, and "center" justification, and it will follow your notes regardless how you format them. This method places the accent squarely over the note head; ideal for downward-pointing note stems. If, for upward note-stems, you'd prefer the accent to ride over the stem, then preceed the ^ with two spaces.

Then copy the item, and paste it before every note that needs this indication. My method is to use the mouse to position the insertion point, and CNTL V on the keyboard to do the pasting.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: David Potvin on 07-Dec-2000

Also, if you want to explore some other musical fonts - i.e. musicator, finale, etc. - just assign one of them to User 1 - or any other - and look for the marcato character! I use one of them for my own jazz arrangements, and it's BEAUTIFUL! Shame to say that it ain't a NoteWorthy Font, but... well, all in good time!


#1835: Women's and Men's Parts
Women's and Men's Parts

(1835)

Submitted by: Ralph Bressler on 19-Nov-2000

I am new to Noteworthy. When I have rests on the treble clef, lyrics do not show up even though their are notes on the bass clef for the men's part. Also, Noteworthy seems to calculate rests incorrectly at times. When rests are placed in one part so that another part is singing alone, the alignment of the measures seems "out of whack". Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Nov-2000

1: Lyrics - each staff is capable of being assigned its own lyric line(s). This gives tremendous flexibility in having different voices perform different lyrics at different times.

2: Noteworthy counts rests correctly, but you have to be aware of what happens when you "chord" notes and rests together. The "effective" duration of any chord will be that of its shortest member. So if, for instance, you chord a quarter note with an eighth rest, the calculated duration of the combination will be one eighth.

For more information, these topics are covered quite well in the supplied help system, as well as the user manual.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 20-Nov-2000

Stick with it, Ralph. NWC does a good job for chorus (I use it all the time for that) once you get the hang of it.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 21-Nov-2000

Both notes and rests have a property (select the note/rest and press Ctrl-E) called Lyric Syllable that let you decide whether or not a lyric should be attached to it.


#1836: Searching for Friends
Searching for Friends

(1836)

Submitted by: Utkarsh Ayachit on 20-Nov-2000

Hi All!,
I am 20 yrs old guy from Pune(India). I am an amature Piano player(I dare bot call myself a pianist) and a composer. I basically compose for the Piano but now I am trying my hand at the orchestra. I would like to know more people like me who would liove to share their knowledge and expertise with me.

Reply 1 offered by: A on 24-Nov-2000

Have you tried rec.music.compose, rec.music.makers.piano, etc?


#1837: Do I need software drivers for my Midi keyboard?
Do I need software drivers for my Midi keyboard?

(1837)

Submitted by: Chris on 21-Nov-2000

Hi everyone :-)

I was wondering whether I need to have software drivers for my Midi Keyboard, which is a Yamaha PSR-270 General Midi Keyboard. I have a Midi cable (the cable with the Midi in/out plugs at one end, and the pin socket at the other that plugs into the soundcard of my computer) but my computer, or any programs such as Noteworthy Composer dont recognise the keyboard as being connected. I purchased a Midi keyboard quite a while ago now with the intention of using it with a program such as Noteworthy Composer, but have been unable to do so. I would really like to get it working, as I think it will be a great help with my upcoming GCSE Music coursework.
I would really appreciate any help on setting this up! :-)

-Chris

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 21-Nov-2000

I have a Yamaha PSR 310. Not sure if they work the same, but I need to press "Record, 0" or "Record, 2" simultaneously on the piano keyboard controls to set it to set it for use with my midi programs.

If that does not work, make sure you have the cables correctly plugged in. Also, you may need to check your Windows multimedia and Noteworthy midi settings to make sure that they are correct.

If you are like me: Lastly, if all else fails, check the instruction book that came with your Yamaha.

Reply 2 offered by: Chris on 21-Nov-2000

Hi, thanks for your reply, Steve. All the record and MIDI options are set to on, and are ready to go. The cables are firmly secure. The instruction book that came with my keyboard gives information on how to use the keyboard MIDI functions, but nothing about setting up your computer, because it is a keyboard manual.
My keyboard is not mentioned in my multimedia settings, which is where the problem lies I think. I need some way of telling my computer that my keyboard is attached. I think I might need a MIDI driver, but I dont know which one to use, and where to get it. :-S
Any more info anyone? I urgently need this to be workin! thanx in advance,

-Chris

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Nov-2000

Chris, if your sound card was correctly installed, you should already have the midi driver for the external midi port installed. It's usually called something like "Ext MIDI Out" or "MPU-401 Midi Out". If any of the devices have "MPU-401" in it, that'll be the one.

The other thing that often trips people up is that the midi cable marked OUT has to go to the jack on your synth marked IN, and vice versa. It's like your stereo - the tape deck's LINE OUT has to go to the amplifier's LINE IN.

Reply 4 offered by: Chris on 21-Nov-2000

Thanks for your reply Fred!

I downloaded the MPU-401 driver a while ago, but everytime I tried to select it in Noteworthy Composer, it said something about ports... something about available ports or something I cant really remember sorry.
So is this MPU driver used to input Midi into my computer? I already have a driver set up for playing Midi. But... this driver now fails to play Midi, because I must have messed it up when trying to get the MPU driver working last time :-S

Can someone please give me directions on how to set my computer up to play and receive Midi? Do I need this MPU driver again then?
Thanks everyone for your help, more info required! :-S

*I will be eternally grateful to the person who sorts this out for me! :-) *

-Chris

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Nov-2000

Aha. The thot plickens. My preceding post was based on the (erroneous) assumption that you wanted to send midi output from the computer TO your keyboard. Going the other way, sending midi FROM your keyboard to the computer, is another animal.

First get your original playback driver working again, probably the easiest way to deal with this is in Control Panel --> Multimedia --> Midi tab. Click "Single Instrument" and select your playback device in the pulldown menu. (Obviously, unless you want to play through your keyboard, this will /not/ be the MPU-401 midi out port). Then, in NWC, use Tools --> Options --> Midi tab to select Midi Mapper as your playback device. (This will normally be the only entry in the right-hand panel.) That should restore your playback to the soundcard's midi output (or whatever you have set in the Multimedia Midi tab).

Then go to the Record tab and select the Input device. This will usually be fairly obvious, unless you have something like "virtual piano" installed it will be the only one available. Again, it'll often be called something like "MPU-401 Midi In" (though mine calls it "OPL-3SA midi in". Go figger.)

You'll probably also want to check the "Echo" box so you can hear what you're playing through the computer's sound card. Again, select the playback device (midi mapper). In "Echo to channel" you'll normally want the default (original channel).

That should (hopefully) do it for you.

Reply 6 offered by: Chris on 22-Nov-2000

Hi Fred! Sorry if I mis-directed you before! :-S

You

OK so now I have MIDI playback happening nicely again now :-)

now... In the Options/Midi tab, there are two available play devices. The Midi Mapper, and Yamaha OPL2/OPL3 Synthesis. If I choose either of them, the playback is fine. In the Record tab, there is no device to choose from in the drop down list! what to do?! DO I need to find, download and install the MPU-401 Midi In driver then?
*just as a recap, I need to use my keyboard to record in noteworthy :-)*

thanx for your help!

-Chris

Reply 7 offered by: Chris on 22-Nov-2000

hi everyone... just a bit of an update...

I went to Add New Hardware in Control Panel, and it searched for plug and play devices. It found 'Roland MPU-401' so I went ahead and installed.. now I can select this driver from the drop down list in the record tab in noteworthy without an error message popping up. I then turned on my keyboard and clicked 'record' in noteworthy. It then said 'recording' at the bottom of my screen for literally a second, then nothing.. it was just the score as it was before nothing else. (not that I had a lot of time to record stuff anyway!!) sooo.... I went into Control Panel/Multimedia/MIDI tab, clicked on 'Roland MPU-401' and then clicked the 'add new instrument' button, and followed the directions. I then exited and restarted my computer. After it had booted up again, I went back into noteworthy, and clicked 'record'. still the same results!!! i cant record!!! Am I on my way to gettin this thing sorted? PLEASE HELP!!!

-Chris

Reply 8 offered by: Fred on 22-Nov-2000

OK, sounds like you're on the way. Now thoroughly read the NWC help file on how to record. Note that you have to have a playable staff -- in other words, it only records while playing. And it makes good sense, too; it's the only way of insuring that what you record will be in midi sync. So make yourself a click track however many bars long, and hit the record button. You'll hear the click track while recording, keeping you in sync.

Reply 9 offered by: Chris on 22-Nov-2000

Yup ive read the help file, ive turned on Midi input active (for inserting notes into the staff, which is what I really need to be able to do). I make some tune up, then click record.. start playing my keyboard, when recording finishes, there is no sign of what ive just played!!!
Everything in the Noteworthy settings is set to exactly what the help file says. Im not getting error messages anymore, but my computer still does not hear my keyboard!!! I still need more heeelllpppp!!!!

thanx,

-Chris

Reply 10 offered by: Chris on 22-Nov-2000

HEY GUYS!!!!! IVE SORTED IT OUT!!! ITS NOW WORKING!!!!! GOD IM SOOOOO HAPPY!!!!!
Once id sorted the proper drivers out, and the computer STILL couldnt hear my keyboard, i was clean out of ideaz... but just as an afterthought i switched the IN and OUT leads at the back of my keyboard, and hey presto! it works!!!! thanx to everyone for all your help, I really really appreciate it!! ever need any help with stuff, just e-mail me :-)

see ya around!

-Chris :-)

Reply 11 offered by: Art Thompson on 22-Nov-2000

Well, Fred, you've sorted out another one. Just tell us where to send the checks.

Reply 12 offered by: Danny on 09-Nov-2001

I have a yamaha opl-3sax sound card and a psr 300 keyboard
can anyone tell me if i should buy a midi interface or midi adaptor? can i build one?how?

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Nov-2001

Considering the low cost of a joystick port - to - midi cable, it's not really worthwhile to build your own. Essentially they involve only a few parts (a optocoupler and a few support parts) but by the time you pay for the parts you'll be pretty close to the cost of a pre-made cable.

If you do a websearch for "midi cable" you should find plenty of sites detailing the actual electronics inside the cable.

Fred

Reply 14 offered by: John on 08-Jan-2002

Hi everyone
I came across this board by accident in a search for help myself.
I have a Yamaha PSR2000 and am trying unsuccessfully to connect it to my PC. I have bought a cable which came with a drivers disk, for PC to Keyboard, using the "To Host" socket on the PSR2000.
My son got Cubasis VST v3 for Christmas and we still can't get it to work! Any ideas? The driver on loading offers only the option of COM2 but that is my TA and I need to change it to COM1. Also I know not how to set up the Cubasis side - yes I have read and followed through the manual etc., but still to no avail.
Many thanks
John


#1838: MPU-401
MPU-401

(1838)

Submitted by: Chris on 21-Nov-2000

AHHHHH MIDI is drivin me round the bend!!!

I just installed the MPU-401 driver, but when I open Noteworthy Composer, it says 'Can't access this COM port. Make sure this COM port is not in use by another program.'
WTF?!! By the way, at the top of the error message box it has Roland Serial MIDI Driver. Also, when I try and record, it says 'Your selected MIDI input device is failing to open. Would you like to go to the Record options to investigate' AHHH! ive had my MIDI keyboard 2 or 2 years now, and still havnt got it to work with MIDI!! ANYONE PLEASE HELP ME!!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Nov-2000

My guess is that you have an MPU-401 driver that's meant for a serial midi interface (i.e. via one of the computer's COM ports), and you've got it connected to a port that's... um... in use. Like maybe your mouse is on that port, or something.

You shouldn't need an outside MPU-401 driver. Every sound card I've seen comes with the MPU-401 driver _for_the_soundcard's_ midi/joystick port. If yours doesn't, go to the manufacturer's website for direction.

Reply 2 offered by: Chris on 22-Nov-2000

Yes indeed the MPU-401 driver I have is a serial midi interface.. wrong one then I take it? Ive removed it now anyway because of the problems in my previous post.

Im not exactly sure what my sound card is...

-Chris

Reply 3 offered by: Can on 02-Feb-2001

MPU-401+driver


#1839: TR
TR

(1839)

Submitted by: jj on 21-Nov-2000

how can i put a tr in noteworthy

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Nov-2000

As text, using the Text Expression tool. If you want it to sound, you will have to put in the notation yourself to emulate what you expect the "tr" to do. An example can be seen in the moonlite.nwc example.

See also: msg #58, msg #632, msg #740


#1840: NWC Version 1.70 Plug-in for Winamp
NWC Version 1.70 Plug-in for Winamp

(1840)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Nov-2000

If you use WinAmp to play songs on your computer, you may be interested in our most recent new release. The NoteWorthy Composer Version 1.70 Plug-in for Winamp has now been released. Once installed on your system, the plug-in works in conjunction with WinAmp to provide a play list function for *.nwc files. Simply drag and drop any of your existing *.nwc files onto WinAmp, and they will play in a similar fashion to *.mid files.

For more details, simply explore the rest of our web site: http://www.noteworthysoftware.com

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Nov-2000

If you are not familar with WinAmp, it is a freeware audio player, supporting play back of many types of media files, including MP3, WAV, and MID files. It also has a play list function, so files can be grouped together for play back.

For more details, you can visit the WinAmp web site at: http://www.winamp.com

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 22-Nov-2000

Wow! Absolutely positively way too cool! Hats off to NoteWorthy Software on another 'coup'.

Reply 3 offered by: Art Thompson on 05-Dec-2000

Winamp is great, and you've added a very nice enhancement. Thanks.


#1841: Men's Quartet arrangements
Men's Quartet arrangements

(1841)

Submitted by: Michael Morrison on 23-Nov-2000

Does anyone know of a site or an individual who has used Noteworthy for Men's Quartets, preferably spirituals.

Reply 1 offered by: Mark Cloud on 01-Dec-2000

Michael,
I have used Noteworthy to write several Quartet peices. I write for our Men's Quartet occasionally, when we change a tune significantly from the way it was written. I use a standard piano staff at times, and sometimes, if the song gets like the old time "convention" style songs, (Like the Happy Goodmans, or the Statesmen) I use staff layering. The new features of rest placement and note placement are used as well as the system break.
If you need more info, or anything else, email me.
Also, there is a site on the web for shape notes, but I can't recall where...

Mark


#1842: realistic instrument sounds HeLp!
realistic instrument sounds HeLp!

(1842)

Submitted by: Chris on 23-Nov-2000

Hi everyone!

Does anyone know how I can use the realistic instrument sounds on my keyboard when recording Midi rather than the ones that im already using at the moment? The piano sound is not bad, but the drum sounds are cr*p, especially the crash cymbal which sound like the wind blowing rather than a cymbal!! I know it is possible to use realistic sounds somehow, because my mate does it (he uses Cakewalk) and the keyboard and computer at school does it as well! (that uses Cubase) any info would be greatly appreciated!

-Chris

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 23-Nov-2000

Well, Chris, looks like we've come full circle. :) Now that you have your external keyboard working for recording, it shouldn't be too hard to set it up for playback. Set your playback device (in Control Panel --> Multimedia --> Midi tab) to the "MPU-401 midi OUT" port, keeping NWC set to the midi mapper. Your midi output should now be rerouted through the external keyboard (presuming you have the cables properly plugged in) ;-)

Now, to record that sound, you have to connect the AUDIO output from the external synth to the LINE IN on your soundcard. You might have to play around with the recording settings in the volume control applet, but assuming that your soundcard is "full duplex" (most of them are nowadays) you should be able to record the midi playback using any decent wav recorder application.

Have fun!

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Chris on 23-Nov-2000

Hi Fred! Ok your instructions are for recording the keyboard to a .WAV file? this would be helpful, but what I originally meant, because I dont think I explained it well (as usual!) is:

I have a program called Evolution Midi. Its the sort where you record a track say, of a piano melody, then on the second track put some bass, and on the third put drums, etc until you have your song. The thing is, when I choose an instrument for each track, i record the track for say drums, but the drum sound is really cr*p, so I was wondering how to record the tracks with the cool sounding instruments off my keyboard, rather than the cr*p sounding ones that are on the computer. I hope you know what I mean!!

thanx for your help,

-Chris

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 24-Nov-2000

No Chris,
What Fred was suggesting is what you need to do.
Basically, if you can send midi signals from the keyboard to the computer, then all you need to do is configure the computer to send midi signals back to the keyboard (where the funky sounds are).

If you can use the computer to drive your midi keyboard, then you'll get the sounds you want.

Fred went on to suggest how you could get those sounds back through your computer speakers, but that may sound worse than playing it through your keyboard.

1) Make sure the MIDI connections (out of computer and into keyboard) are available and working
2) Make sure your keyboard will respond to midi coming in to it thru a cable.
3) Set up the midi playback device in NWC to be MIDI OUT (ie the cable).
4) Hit Play.
5) Scratch head to work out what you did wrong
6) Fix it
7) Hiw Play again
8) Shout "woohoo".

HTH
Andrew

Reply 4 offered by: Chris on 25-Nov-2000

ok guys I can sorta see where your coming from, but im at tad confused now... (sorry!)

can you please explain again, step-by-step sorta thing? I am totally new to this MIDI thing :-S In Noteworthy, and the other program, I set the output device as Roland MPU-401, which is the MIDI input device I use. But when I play my recordings, I dont hear any sound!! :-(
What do I have to do to check whether my keyboard is recieving data?
I bought a foot switch/sustain pedal for my keyboard today.. once ive got the groovy sounds sorted, will I be able to use the sustain when recording Midi?

Thanx for all your help guys I really appreciate it :-) I just cant wait until I get this sorted!

-Chris


#1843: Dynamic Variances
Dynamic Variances

(1843)

Submitted by: Mr. Puig on 23-Nov-2000

My Midi player doesn't seem to support dynamic variances, that is, I insert a crescendo or diminuendo, or whatever, and it doesn't change a bit when playing it back. Is there any application I can install in order to achieve this?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 23-Nov-2000

You have to have a dynamic before and after the variance. For example, if you have a pp at the beginning, then a crescendo at the second bar, and a ff at the 10th bar, then it will play pp for the first bar, then gradually increase volume to ff at the tenth bar.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 26-Nov-2000

It might also be worth mentioning that dynamic variances don't have any effect on notes already sounding unless you've fiddled with the default MIDI volume setting of the preceding and following dynamics. The sample file "Voltest.nwc" shows an example of this.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Bacher on 01-Dec-2000

Also, it only works for crescendo and decrescendo, not for
diminuendo or any of the others, unless something's changed.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 01-Dec-2000

Something's changed. It now works for dim. too.

Reply 5 offered by: Art Thompson on 01-Dec-2000

Per the help text from Version 1.70 with both service packs:

"Only the Crescendo , Decrescendo , and Diminuendo styles exhibit the variance behavior described above. "

It also says this about dynamic commands:

"By default, a dynamic does not alter the MIDI volume of the channel being utilized to play back the current staff. You can change this behavior by overriding the MIDI volume behavior and specifying a MIDI volume of your choice. If you specify a override MIDI volume value of "-1" then no MIDI volume change will be triggered. "

I'm confused by this. It seems like its telling me that dynamics are not effective unless you manually override them. That doesn't seem to be the case, does it?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Dec-2000

By default, dynamics only effect the MIDI velocity of a note. If you want to change MIDI volume, you have to manually override the volume setting.

See also: msg #57, msg #1390, msg #1381

Reply 7 offered by: Art Thompson on 01-Dec-2000

ahah! so my sound card is responding to velocity changes. Thanks, that helps explain some behaviors, such as unexpected dynamics when plying back MIDI's on a MAC.
I apologize for reading the help 3 times and not making the distinction.


#1845: Multi-Bar Rest - Urgent question
Multi-Bar Rest - Urgent question

(1845)

Submitted by: Daniel Pergau on 24-Nov-2000

Good morning from cold Ottawa, Canada.

I am arranging a piece of music for a handbell choir and I'd like to use a multi-bar rest marking for a 4 bar tacet. Can this be done with this software?

Sorry for the urgent request on my subject but I want to have this for tomorrow and this is my first chance to look at it =)

Thank you in advance!

Reply 1 offered by: Daniel Pergau on 24-Nov-2000

Nevermind... I guess one should look before the panic question/leap as it were =) Many thanks to David Palmquist for his tip!

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 24-Nov-2000

Daniel,
Wander over to http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ , and specifically http://www.vadu.com/nwc/faq.html for lots of helpful suggestions.

Regards,
Andrew


#1846: InStRuMeNt SoUnD pAtChEs
InStRuMeNt SoUnD pAtChEs

(1846)

Submitted by: Chris on 25-Nov-2000

Hi... from what ive read from somewhere on the web, ive come to believe that you need to get additional instrument patches to replace the cr*p sounding General Midi ones.. is this true, or have I just picked up wrong information?
thanx :-)

-Chris

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Nov-2000

The following links should keep you busy on this subject: msg #1302, msg #1085, msg #1266, msg #1375, msg #1461, msg #1496, msg #1501, msg #1517, msg #1573, msg #1594, msg #1664

Use the offline facility if you want to find even more.

Reply 2 offered by: Chris on 26-Nov-2000

yeah I downloaded the offline forum the other day and looked through it, but I think my best bet is to do what someone else suggested which was to 'use the MIDI output' or something so I can use the sounds on my keyboard. If anyone can give me detailed instructions on how to do this, I would be very grateful!

feel free to e-mail if you prefer :-)

kta@gamezdemon.fsnet.co.uk

thanx, Chris


#1847: Instruments and chords
Instruments and chords

(1847)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 27-Nov-2000

Hello everyone!

First off, I only started composing. I play guitar (from Classical to Rock) and people consider me a virtuoso. I am familiar with bass and piano, but I lack knowledge on other instruments.
I have some good ideas to compose a symphony, I already have the instrument ranges. However, I have a problem. What are the limitations of string, brass and woodwind instruments regarding chords, triads, etc. I would really love a detailed explanation on this. Could anybody help me?
Thanks,
Caesar Vane

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Nov-2000

Brass and woodwinds -- just one note at a time. Strings - it helps to actually imagine (or draw out) where the chord notes would fall on the instrument itself. Violas, 'Cellos and Bass are tuned C - G - D - A, and violins are tuned G - D - A - E. So, for example, it would be impossible to play a low G and B at the same time on a violin.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 28-Nov-2000

Double Bass is tuned E A D G (ie in 4ths)!

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 28-Nov-2000

Except that some double basses have an extension on their first string to allow them to play a full octave lower than the cello's lowest note, the C below the bass staff. Then they're tuned

C A D G

In the orchestral scores I've seen that take advantage of this, the composer will generally divide the bass part in octaves if it goes below low E, to accommodate cases where some (or all) of the basses are lacking this feature.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 28-Nov-2000

... except that it occurs to me that a mention of double-bass tuning is more or less out of place in a discussion of chords. Double basses practically never play chords, except perhaps the occasional fifth. Usually, if a composer wants more than one note at a time out of the basses, he or she will divide them.

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Eidson on 28-Nov-2000

My advice:

You should familiarize yourself with the instruments of the orchestra before writing a piece - simply knowing the range isn't going to tell you how to write for the ensemble. (ex: a horn player can play a high C [written C] but it is not a good note to repeat over and over in a melody) Listen to music that fits the genre you are composing for to give you ideas on how things can be done.

As a composition student myself, I am still learning about the scoring of the orchestra and the techniques used by the great composers. I suggest the book "Principles of Orchestration" by Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakov. You can find it on Amazon.com for $18.

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 28-Nov-2000

The Rimsky-Korsakov is good, but it's more concerned with how to combine instruments effectively than it is with the capabilities of each instrument considered separately. Therefore I'd recommend the R-K as a secondary text.

To learn to write for the various instruments, I'd recommend either Walter Piston's "Orchestration" or Cecil Forsyth's "Orchestration". The Piston is about 50 years old but is still recognized as a standard textbook on the subject. The Forsyth is closer to 100 years old, but it's very entertainingly written and is available in a cheap Dover edition for about $14.

Reply 7 offered by: Little Caesar on 28-Nov-2000

Thanks a lot. Surely I'll buy the books. In the meantime, would it help to study classical scores, i.e. Mozart's horn arrangements, string quartets, and flute concerts, just to name a few examples? I'm a fast learner, you know, and I grasp everything right away. I'm very keen.

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 28-Nov-2000

All this and modesty too!

It certainly couldn't hurt to study Mozart (ever!), but his orchestration, while good, is a far cry from the type of thing possible today, and pretty limited in its use of resources. IMHO some other composers whose orchestration repays study are Schubert, Tchaikovsky, Ravel, Sibelius, and Bartok. (I'm sure others can and will chip in with their suggestions as well.)

Reply 9 offered by: Chris on 29-Sep-2001

My Advice:

Be yourself. Sure, it may help to listen to how other composers score and blend their insturments but do what you think sounds good. i have tried to find a range of composers who compose with the style that I do but so far I can not find any yet I have won competitions for my compositions and many words of encouragement from people who are considered 'high on the musical ladder'. I believe that be yourself and what you believe sounds good. Borrow and orchestral instument and work with its effects and sounds or listen to someone else. You will find that something you will hear will inspire you e.g. a clarinet playing mid-range notes softly and gently. Also fiddle around with a computer program for composers (make sure it is good quality) and listen to how certain instument blend.

Reply 10 offered by: gary shannon on 29-Sep-2001

While someone early in the thread pointed out that the woodwinds and brass can only play one note it is standard practice for the orchestra to contain 2 or more of each of these instruments. It is entirely possible, therefore, for the flute SECTION to play a two note chord. Likewise for the clarinet SECTION, oboe SECTION, etc.

Reply 11 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-Sep-2001

Ah, yes. The Bass section of our choir is well-known for its elaborate chords, despite the fact that the score shows only a single note for the Basses.


#1848: Beams and rests
Beams and rests

(1848)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 27-Nov-2000

Also, is there anyway to place a rest between beamed notes, for instance 1/8, 1/16 and 1/32 beamed together and a 1/32 rest between the 1/16 and the 1/32. I've seen score written this way, but cannot do it with NWC

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Nov-2000

You can only at this time do this by entering the rests as "text" items using the NWCV15.TTF font. If I recall correctly, there was a user tip on this subject.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Nov-2000

This is not support in NoteWorthy Composer. Some users have faked this construction by adding the rest as text, or by using a layered staff, simple notation on a single staff where a rest is inside the beam is not supported.


#1849: Dynamics placement
Dynamics placement

(1849)

Submitted by: Carolyn on 27-Nov-2000

I seem to remember that you used to be able to designate precisely where you wanted a dynamic to be placed above or below the staff. I can't do that anymore - the dynamic takes its own space, no matter what, which means it sometimes places itself on a note, a lyric word or whatever. Any solution or workaround? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Nov-2000

You can move any dynamic as before, by selecting it and pressing CNTL-E or ALT-Enter (or Edit Selection with the mouse). Then adjust its vertical placement as desired.

With V1.70 there is an added functionality: simply select the item (dynamic, text, etc.) and CNTL-SHIFT together with the up- and down-cursor keys to move the item vertically (just as you've always been able to do with notes). You can even move multiple items in the same selection at once. The rule is: if the selection contains any notes, only the notes are moved; otherwise, all items are moved by the same amount.

If you want access to all the properties tabs when you first enter an item, then go to Tools --> Options --> Editor tab and turn off "Smart Properties Insert".

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Nov-2000

The "Preserve Width" option on the Expression Placement tab will enable you to specify that any expression should maintain its space on the staff.


#1850: MP3 to VQF
MP3 to VQF

(1850)

Submitted by: Jim Thompson on 01-Dec-2000

Is there software to convert wave or MP3 files to VQF.
Also anyone own or have have info on a Media Vision midi adapter.

T.I.A.

Jim

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 01-Dec-2000

On your first question,

http://www.vqf.com/

On the second,

http://www.google.com/search?q=%22media+vision%22+midi&hl=en&lr=&safe=off&btnG=Google+Search


#1851: Piano notation (pedal)
Piano notation (pedal)

(1851)

Submitted by: Joe Eidson on 01-Dec-2000

I was wondering what the proper notation for the 'sostenuto' pedal [middle one] on the piano was? The typical "Ped." is for the sustain, but is there a special symbol for the sostenuto?

My friend told me that it was "Sos. - - -" but I was wondering if anyone could confirm this?

Thanks!
Joe Eidson

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 02-Dec-2000

There's only convention in 1C (the left one) and 3C (the right one - but this one has LOTS of them) but sostenuto is generally marked by the pianist, because if there's a note that should be sounding and should be held but the hand can't play it at that time, just leave it there and it will be quite clear that the pedal should hold it.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Eidson on 02-Dec-2000

Artur --

Thank you for your reply! I haven't ever seen the notation for it before, your help is appreciated. I realized today that it might not be necessary for the pedal to be down at this point, but I have to play it that way due to my 'amateur' piano skills. :)

Thanks again,
Joe Eidson


#1852: Force System Break?
Force System Break?

(1852)

Submitted by: Steve on 03-Dec-2000

I wish to use the Force System Break command, but cannot find it in my registered copy of NoteWorthy Composer. I see from previous posts that it is supposed to be in the Insert | Bar Line (Decorated) menu, but it's not.

Any ideas why I can't find the command?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Dec-2000

Best guess: you aren't using version 1.70 of the program.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve on 03-Dec-2000

Thanks. I didn't know there was a later version. Is it possible to be notified by e-mail of future upgrades?

Steve

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Dec-2000

We don't do that anymore, at least for now. You have to check pro-actively, either by e-mail to nwcinfo@ntworthy.com, or by going to the newstuff.htm page on our site.


#1853: Announcement - New Command Summary
Announcement - New Command Summary

(1853)

Submitted by: Andrew Purdam on 03-Dec-2000

I am very pleased to announce that the new Command Summary is now available at http://www.vadu.com/nwc/command.html

Originally by Barry Graham, it has been updated to match version 1.70 by Richard Woodroffe, both long-time Noteworthy users.

The original was in Publisher (.pub) format. Additional versions in PDF (Adobe) and PostScript formats are also provided and are suggested as the ones to download, as they have all the necessary font information included, as well as avoiding any problems created by different printer configurations.

Each version contains the following sections archived into the appropriate zip file:

NWCCSfacia - Cover page and contents (4 pages)
NWCCSs1 - Introduction (14 pages)
NWCCSs2 - Control and File Menus (18 pages)
NWCCSs3 - Edit and View Menus (14 pages)
NWCCSs4 - Staff and Insert Menus (28 pages)
NWCCSs5 - Notes and Tools Menus (22 pages)
NWCCSs6 - Window and Help Menus and Index (12 pages)
NWCCSs7 - Exercises (47 pages)
NWCCSs8 - How Do I? - Examples (4 pages)

Download it and read it. It is excellent.

A

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 04-Dec-2000

Download that command summary, folks. It is good.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 04-Dec-2000

It is now also available as one single PDF file (Zipped to 1.1Mb). Simply click to
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ftp/documentation/NWCCS.zip

You will need WinZip (or similar) to unzip the file and Acrobat Reader v3 or 4 to read it.
Both products are more or less free at www.winzip.com and www.adobe.com

A

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Dec-2000

WinZip isn't free, but it is inexpensive, and a very good value.

Reply 4 offered by: Art Thompson on 05-Dec-2000

Hats off to you guys that must've worked extremely hard on this. Excellent job.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Dec-2000

The credit really goes to Richard Woodroffe, who not only did the lion's share of updating the previous version, but also added a great many refinements and other additions. Thanks again, Richard!

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 06-Dec-2000

As was noted, WinZip is not really free. If any of you need an un-zipper that really is free, browse the net for something called "CAM unzip" on the usual freebie download sites. CAM will also make zips. It is somewhat less versatile than WinZip, but does the job at the right price.

Reply 7 offered by: Andrew Purdam on 06-Dec-2000

Okay, okay. WinZip is NOT free, as I mistakenly stated above. However, it is fairly cheap and incredibly useful. There are other ZIP readers about, too.

A

Reply 8 offered by: Art Thompson on 06-Dec-2000

It is most unusual for NWC to weigh in with an editorial commment. As purveyors of a product marketed in a similar manner as Winzip, I can't blame them.


#1854: Please help me with slurs!
Please help me with slurs!

(1854)

Submitted by: Mattcraze on 03-Dec-2000

Okay, here's my problem: I have the two notes I want slurred together, I select them both, then hit the slur button. When I play it though, it plays the two notes regularly and doesn't slur them at all! What could be causing this, and how do I make them slur? please reply!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Dec-2000

What you're looking for is called a "tie". It's on the / key, as opposed to a slur which is on the ; key. Visually, the tie will have the ends almost touching the notes, the slur will have the ends a short distance away from the notes.

A slur will make the transition between notes more smooth, especially at the longer note durations, whereas a tie will make the single note continue without interruption.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 04-Dec-2000

A minor point - if you want to slur or tie two notes then you must only select the first note of the pair.

Reply 3 offered by: Little Caesar on 04-Dec-2000

No, I think that what Mattcraze means is that the slur does not make the transition between two notes smoother. The tie works for the same note, but as far as I understand, Mattcraze talks about two different notes slurred together.
Although a musician will understand it and play it properly, NoteWorthy doesn't.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 04-Dec-2000

I think NWC does what it can.

In its default performance style, NWC introduces a little space between notes. Slurring removes these spaces (as does using tenuto marks or the "legato" performance style). In this sense NWC does honor the slurs.

However, in real life a slur not only connects notes but also changes the attack characteristics of notes under the slur. NWC slurring doesn't seem to do this, and this may be what Mattcraze is referring to.

I don't know enough MIDI lore to know if it would be possible to smooth out the attacks of slurred notes, or, if so, how difficult this would be. I suspect it's not trivial if possible at all. Comments? Would this be a worthwhile enhancement request?

Reply 5 offered by: Art Thompson on 04-Dec-2000

It's easy for a program like NWC to implement a style such as 'stacatto', since it impacts only the duration of the note. I'm not up on MIDI lore either, but Legato would imply holding the notes for their full duration, with some attack for each note. Slurring indicates no attack on subsequent notes, if possible. This is possible on wind instruments, and bowed strings. The soundcard,I'm guessing, would have to know to 'skip the attack' and just change pitch.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Dec-2000

The only way I've found to do a believable slur (such as for guitar hammer-ons and pull-offs) is to /tie/ the notes, and insert the appropriate pitch-bend and channel volume increase between the tied notes.

I suppose you could also change the wavetable sounds if you have an editable sound-font based synth, and use the modified sound (with less attack) on a separate channel, then employ the staff layering tricks to sound the two (different) notes on different channels. But it would be next to impossible to make such a beast playable on other peoples' hardware.

Reply 7 offered by: Steve Allen on 05-Dec-2000

NWC doesn’t support it, but there is MIDI controller 68, which is supposed to omit the attack. Does anyone know if there are sound cards that support this controller?


#1855: Getting bars to line up
Getting bars to line up

(1855)

Submitted by: Alisha on 04-Dec-2000

I am having trouble getting my bar lines to line up on sheet music with more than one staff. The first few measures are fine, but then they start getting just a little bit off. Is there a way to fix this? Thanks,
ALisha

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Dec-2000

Each vertically aligned bar must contain the same overall length, in terms of note duration. When the bar lines do not line up, it is because the duration in the previous measure is different for one or more staves than the others.

See also: msg #1755, msg #1410, msg #537

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Coats on 07-Dec-2000

Yes, this is a great way to check yourself. If barlines do not line up, you are missing beats somewhere. I also use Finale, and though it warns you if you have too many beats in a measure, if you have too few... you may not notice.

So, look for a missing note or rest.

Reply 3 offered by: david palmquist on 08-Dec-2000

I solve this problem by creating a new "dummy" staff at the bottom. I then simply enter time signature and create one bar with the appropriate number of quarter notes to fill it, add a bar line, and copy that bar ad nauseum. I then use the staff properties feature (F2) to set all staves to upper and lower grand staff. This causes the bar lines to extend up and down to the next staff, and can always be changed to a different style when you finish the input. I now have a visual check on whether or not I've entered the right number of notes/rests into each bar. The moment you miss, the bar lines stop lining up.

Reply 4 offered by: Aver Idge on 11-Dec-2000

ummm, I read somewhere that one of the rules is that bars should NOT line up with following staves. (can someone confirm? otherwise I'll find the book where I read it) the reason is to improve sight-reading. If at a glance all the bar lines look the same, then it is so easy to start reading the same or the wrong staff when the musician looks back at the music. I know this is so true from experience
ie.
| . , . , | . , . , | . , . , | . , . , |
| . , . , | . , . , | . , . , | . , . , |
| . , . , | . , . , | . , . , | . , . , |
it's better if it goes:
| . , .. | . , . , | . , ., | . , . , |
| . , . , | . , . , | . , . , | . , . , |
| . ,., | . , . . | . , . ,|. , . , |
if you know what I mean.
Don't align the bars just so it looks perfect as in the process you frustrate a musician who tries to play it

Reply 5 offered by: Alisha on 11-Dec-2000

Well, actually, as a musician, I prefer it if the beats (and thus the bar lines) line up -- it makes it easier for me to see how my part falls in with all of the others.

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 11-Dec-2000

"Aver Idge" wrote:
>>>bars should NOT line up with following staves.<<<

I can't believe this is true. All the notation references I've ever seen insist that notes and rests should be carefully aligned with those on surrounding staves so that the relative timing of events is immediately clear. So, for example, if one staff had 2 half-notes and the one below it had a four quarters, the second half note on the top staff should be placed immediately above the third quarter on the lower staff, making it immediately clear that they occur at the same time. This practice would naturally lead to aligned bar lines.

I can almost imagine "don't-line-up-bar-lines" as a rule of thumb for neighboring *systems*, but I've never actually heard of this before.

Reply 7 offered by: Steve Bacher on 11-Dec-2000

It seems that the "don't line up bar lines with surrounding staves" poster was referring to different systems on the same page, not different staves within the same system.

- seb

Reply 8 offered by: Taylor Anderson (andersot@ugsolutions.com) on 01-Feb-2001

Okay, so if we DO want to align the bar lines on all systems for printing, what does it take to do it?

If I have a (short) song with (for example) 24 measures, and I want three measures on each system, with four systems on each page, two pages total, how can I convince NoteWorthy to align the bar lines from system to system?

Right now, print preview is putting three measures on some systems, but putting five measures on some systems and then s-t-r-e-t-c-h-i-n-g two measures over other systems... which just doesn't look great.

Oddly enough, it seems that the measures that contain *more* notes (eighths and sixteenths) are the ones that Noteworthy ends up making *shorter*... and the measures with a whole note or two half notes get stretched.

Thoughts?

--Taylor

Reply 9 offered by: Fred on 01-Feb-2001

Haven't tried this myself, but this should work, if your only concern is how it looks, not how it plays:

Enter your music as successive staves in a multi-staff system. For instance, if you have a single vocal line with piano accompaniment you want to print, enter it as 12 systems. The first line would be staves 1-3, the second line 4-6, etc. The barlines will always line up under these conditions.

You'll have to suppress printing of clefs and time signatures on the lower systems. If you explicitly specify a clef and time signature on each subsequent "pseudo-system" (i.e. every 3 bars) then set the visibility attribute to "never", that should take care of this aspect.

HTH, let us know how it goes.

Fred


#1856: keyboard to computer
keyboard to computer

(1856)

Submitted by: gnuckel on 05-Dec-2000

I´ve got a keyboard that I tried to plug into
my computer, I am sure that I got the "midi in/out"
plugs right, and I´ve set the MIDI input
active command but it still doesn´t work!?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Dec-2000

Why are you sure that you have the plugs correct?

When things don't work, you should suspect problems in this order:

1) Cable in and out are reversed

2) Sound card MIDI device driver is not properly installed

3) Cable is defective

4) Sound card MIDI port is defective

5) External Keyboard MIDI port is defective or misconfigured

The only way to be sure which is the problem is to rule out each of these, one by one.

See also: msg #1023, msg #1102, msg #1328, msg #138, msg #1532, msg #1807, msg #1837, msg #184, msg #329, msg #896


#1857: Ghostly notes
Ghostly notes

(1857)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 05-Dec-2000

Hello everybody, here's Caesar, the modest...
I have downloaded some NWC, some of them compositions from you people, and believe me I loved some of them. However, I have noticed that there are some tricks I don't know:
1. Some notes and rests appear to be grayish, instead of black, sometimes in the background of a regular score.
2. I have seen too many "mpc" and I have no clue what they are for or how to use them.
3. I have seen, in a single staff, two sets of beamed notes, one pointing upward and the other downward. How on earth do you do this? I've tried and tried, but it never works out.
Thanks in advance!

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 05-Dec-2000

1. These notes/rests/symbols are hidden. Go to properties and select the visibility tag.

2. They are multipoint controllers which send midi commands to the output stream. There are lots of them covering dynamics, tempo, pitch bend and many more. read the help files and look at the examples. Above all, experiment!

3. Layered staffs. You can superimpose two or more staffs on top of each other. You need to enable it in Page setup/Contents (just why you have to is a mystery) and then select Layer with Next Staff in Staff Properties. If you unlayer some of the examples you have seen then all will be revealed (so to speak).

Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 06-Dec-2000

LC,
Please point yourself to http://www.vadu.com/nwc/faq.html in particular and http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ in general.
This will help you heaps.

A

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 06-Dec-2000

I assume that the originator of this stream is new to NWC, or maybe just rying it out. The gist of the replies is that there is a difference between what is seen on the computer display, what is printed on paper, and what is played in MIDI. These are all controlled by the user.


#1858: driver for printer
driver for printer

(1858)

Submitted by: Carma on 05-Dec-2000

I have a Panasonic KX-P4410 Laser partner. I had it on my old computer and I want to hook it up to my new one but lost the driver or whatever you use to put in the computer to make it run the printer. Is there anyway I can find one or anyway that I can hook it up to use it with my new computer? Thanks for any help you can give me.

Reply 1 offered by: Art Thompson on 05-Dec-2000

http://www.panasonic.com/support/software/printers.html

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Dec-2000

That one is in Windows 95's library of stock printers. Start --> Settings --> Printers, double-click Add New Printer, follow it through to the available printers list, select Panasonic in the left pane, select KX-P4410 in the right pane.


#1859: using sounds off keyboard!
using sounds off keyboard!

(1859)

Submitted by: Ben Folds on 06-Dec-2000

how do I use the realistic sounds off my keyboard when recording MIDI, rather than the crappy General Midi ones already on the puta? if any1 can give me detailed instructionz i would be v grateful... sum1 said summat about using the MIDI out ports, and to check whether the keyboard is receiving data or summat.. how do I do this??

thanx in advance!

- B Folds

Reply 1 offered by: Robin Withey on 07-Dec-2000

Hi Ben,

What you need to do is to choose the right MIDI output option.

Go to the Tools menu, and pick Options. Now click on the MIDI tab (if it isn't visible, you may need to use the arrows next to the tabs to scroll the tabs).

You will see a window on the left showing available payback devices, and one on the right showing devices used. The available devices will depend on your system setup, but the one you want will probably be called "MIDI Out", or "MPU-401 Out". If you can't see anything like that, you haven't set up your MIDI ports properly yet, so toddle along to the Windows Control Panel, or your sound card manual. You should also remove the sound card device from the used devices list.

BTW, my keyboard is so old that it isn't even General MIDI compatible, so my sound card is the much better option.

Robin Withey

Reply 2 offered by: Ben Folds on 08-Dec-2000

hi!

when I choose MPU-401 as the output device, as im inputing notes, I now just hear the notes being played through my keyboard and not through the PC speakers, where as before I heard the sound coming through the keyboard and PC speakers. now when I press 'play' in noteworthy, i get no sound!! so I change my playback device back to Midi Mapper, and it plays, but still with the crappy sounds!! help me, someone! i need decent sounds!!

thanx! :-)

- Ben


#1860: music notation
music notation

(1860)

Submitted by: Carl Bangs on 06-Dec-2000

I have recently found a book which answers most of the question about the placement of notation symbols, tempo and other textual elements, dynamics, slurs, ties, style, etc. It is the "Essential Dictionary of Music Notation" published by Alfred Publishing Co.

Rules of course are made to be broken, but while the characterization and plot are weak, this book is very helpful.

Carl Bangs
Fenwick Parva Press

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Dec-2000

See also: msg #444


#1861: Leaving no trace
Leaving no trace

(1861)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 07-Dec-2000

Hello everyone!
I would like to use my spare time at work to compose a little. However, due to regular inspections by the systems department, I would uninstall NWC right after using it, saving my files on floppy. It seems an easy task, but I'd like to be sure the program leaves no trace, you know, at the start menu or when going to the set up/ add-remove program section, after uninstalling it. Is there anyway to get caught, considering they don't monitor it from a remote machine? Can I compose and get away with it? Please, don't throw petty morals on me, just answer. THANKS!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Dec-2000

NoteWorthy Composer is one of the few programs that cleans up after itself effectively, without deleting any files that have been added or modified since installation. Any files that you create on the hard drive (even if in the NWC directories) will not be removed. So it's not even necessary to save your work on floppy, though of course it's a good idea just in case something goes wrong. OTOH, if you do create any files on the hard drive, you will have to manually remove them.

It also removes its registry entries, in case you fear someone poking around with regedit. The one file I know of that it leaves behind is nwrgstry.ini in the Windows directory. This remembers you as a registered user when, for example, uninstalling in order to install a new version.

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 07-Dec-2000

If you're using a network machine, they can monitor just about anything if they want to. Even w/o a network, they can be tracking everything from on time to keystrokes, if they so desire. It depends on the resources of your IT dept.

Reply 3 offered by: Caesar's Boss on 07-Dec-2000

Get back to work!

Reply 4 offered by: Little Caesar on 07-Dec-2000

LOL
I actually work on a laptop that I plug in myself and has nothing to do with the network. It is a small company, nothing compared to when I used to work at Nasdaq. Anyways, Fred's post gave me an idea, but I'd like to make sure whether the legend Note Worthy Composer remains at the Add/Remove Programs function in the settings area.

Reply 5 offered by: Caesars' Manager on 07-Dec-2000

You're Fired! Turn in your laptop. But first show me how to use this NWC thingy. I want to be a composer, too.

Reply 6 offered by: Paul C. on 08-Dec-2000

Apparently NWC leaves something in registry, as when you install it again it will already have your name and NWC registration information.

I am not sure if it removes the NWC font from the C:/Windows/Fonts folder. You will have to check.

You can work your files from a floppy, instead of saving them in Samples folder. This is fine, as NWC files are very small, especially now that they are compressed. In fact, if you drop them into Winzip, or some other compression program, you will get no further compression. Most of my NWC music files are around 2K-3K now. So you can put everthing you could write in the next 1o years on one floppy!

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 08-Dec-2000

It knows about your registration not because of any registry entries it leaves around, but because of a file it leaves in the Windows directory. To quote Fred from earlier on this page:

"It also removes its registry entries, in case you fear someone poking around with regedit. The one file I know of that it leaves behind is nwrgstry.ini in the Windows directory. This remembers you as a registered user when, for example, uninstalling in order to install a new version."


#1862: Best-vOICE-chOICE
Best-vOICE-chOICE

(1862)

Submitted by: Little Caesar (fired) on 08-Dec-2000

What would you consider the best choice to emulate operatic voices regarding NWC instrument patches, besides Synth Voice 1? Is it the same for baritones, tenors, basses, altos, sopranos...?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 08-Dec-2000

If you want it to really sound like the human voice, I don't know. But on my general-MIDI system, believe it or not the built-in instrument that most effectively gives pitch (for practicing vocal range) is Marimba.

Reply 2 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 09-Dec-2000

The choices I use (for say... a SATB composition) are Piccolo or Violin for soprano, Oboe or Soprano Sax for alto, Clarinet for tenor, and Tuba or Cello for bass. It gives a nice sound in my opinion.

~Drakhan Z. Valane~


#1863: Missing bars on first measure
Missing bars on first measure

(1863)

Submitted by: Mike Kelly on 08-Dec-2000

When I create a score that uses a one-line staff i.e for a solo insturment, the bar on the left side of the first measure of each line is missing when I print. Any way to fix this?

Thanks,
Mike

Reply 1 offered by: Little Caesar fiddling NWC at his new job on 08-Dec-2000

You do not really need it. Most musicians do not insert a barline before the very first measure.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Dec-2000

It's actually considered standard practise to not have a beginning barline or "cap" on the staff if there is only a single staff in the system. The present behaviour was provided due to user request; early versions of NWC did insert the cap even on a single staff.

If you do want the cap, simply create a second staff; there doesn't even have to be anything in it. Layer the first (actual) staff with the second. Voila. Print and Print Preview will now be displayed with the beginning barline.

Reply 3 offered by: Brian on 09-Dec-2000

If you want something more ornate, you can also change the staff's style from "standard" to "orchestral."

Reply 4 offered by: Mike Kelly on 09-Dec-2000

Fred and All:

Thanks for the 'standards'. I've been reading music for years but this is the first time I've had to pay attention to the details. It's good to know I can choose, and that it's not a defect in NWC.

Mike

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Pearson on 11-Dec-2000

Not totally appropos to the issue, but if you might be posting pieces to the net, you may want to add a further introductory bar with a rest before the piece (unless there is already a reasonable rest with a pickup note). Some of the softsynths out there take a moment or two to "fire up" and may miss a note if the piece begins right out of the gate.


#1864: writing scores
writing scores

(1864)

Submitted by: Thomas Walkden on 11-Dec-2000

I am having problems keeping the bar lines together.
Can anyone help on how to write a fall off a note and the sign to repeat the previous one or two bars

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Dec-2000

I am not clear on your question. If you care to elaborate, perhaps I can help.

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 11-Dec-2000

The markings it sounds like you are looking for are included in the boxmarks font, which is available at the scriptorium.

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

Install boxmarks as one of your user fonts under page setup-fonts tab and you should be good to go.


#1865: beam note tool
beam note tool

(1865)

Submitted by: peter wood on 12-Dec-2000

I am a new registered user of this product and find that the beam note action does not respond despite trying all the various ways of activating it . I have selected the notes and the tool stubbornly refuses to activate HELP!

Reply 1 offered by: Little Caesar on 12-Dec-2000

You have to make sure that the ALL notes you are selecting are 1/8, 1/16, 1/32, or 1/64, exclusively. If by chance you are highlighting a rest, a 1/4 of anything else among the notes you are trying to beam, stubbornly, the command just won't work.

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 12-Dec-2000

If your using it properly you would select some expected multiple of notes, such as 2 or 4 or 8 eighths, 3 or 6 triplets, etc. Then hit Ctrl-B and away they Beam! If that doesn't work, then you really do have a software issue. Try reinstalling.
btw, Beaming is a 'toggle' function; if you Ctrl-B any notes that are beamed, it un-beams them.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-Dec-2000

And there's always Automatic Beam in the Tools menu.

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 offered by: Little Caesar on 14-Dec-2000

I'm Sorry:
What annoys me quite a bit is to be unable to place a rest between beamed notes.

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 14-Dec-2000

I'd like to be able to beam across barlines and clef changes. I'd also like to be able to make a clef change within a triplet (or other n-tuplets, once NWC has them, but let's not go down that road).

Reply 7 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Dec-2000

And if only we could be able to beam across staves.

Reply 8 offered by: chris on 16-Dec-2000

In response to Little Caesar's comment that it is annoying not to be able to beam over rests...there is a way. At the newsgroup an example of how to do this was posted by Fred way back on 3-11-00. There are many other helpful tricks and workarounds that have been shared at the newsgroup, so if you haven't done so already, you might want to visit there. There is a link in the site map here at the NW website.


#1866: Chromatic scales
Chromatic scales

(1866)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 12-Dec-2000

This is a question related to composition per se, rather than the use of NWC, taking advantage of the great people around here. Which chords I can make the chromatic scale work over best, say, starting at E, F, F#, G, etc.? Or do I have to build a chord progression around it?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 12-Dec-2000

I'm not 100% clear on your question, but regarding using the chromatic scale over chord tones:

Say you have a C major chord (C E G) going to a G (G B D) - you could just go chromatically from C until you reach a chord tone in the G chord. It depends on the effect you would like in your music. It may help to view the chromatic tones as 'passing tones' instead of making each note part of a chord.
Does this make sense? I just got out of classes, finals start soon and my brain is fried! :)

-Joe

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 12-Dec-2000

As Joe mentioned, in your example the f & f# could act as passing tones in a c chord, or E minor, Eb, etc. Passing tones tend to be of short duration, unless your trying to achieve a certain effect with your dissonance. My Composition professor teaches theory, then suggests ignoring all theory during the composition process. So - write what sounds right to you! Or to your boss.

Reply 3 offered by: Caesar's Boss on 12-Dec-2000

They all sound good to me. What was that? Eh? Dadburn hearing aid battery is low.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-Dec-2000

Chromatic triplets over a diminished chord works well - starting on a chord note each chord note falls on a beat.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Bacher on 18-Dec-2000

Why not go to the master? Check out what J. S. Bach does
with the King's theme in "A Musical Offering" to see how
he makes gold out of chromatic hay.

- seb


#1867: MIDI and Visual Basic
MIDI and Visual Basic

(1867)

Submitted by: Art Thompson on 13-Dec-2000

A friend of mine is programming in Visual Basic. Apparently VB has no command built in to send note info to the sound card (it can open a wave or midi file). He wants to send individual "play" commands to the card for chime like sound effects. Anybody know how to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: René Verhoeven on 13-Dec-2000

Although playing with Visual Basic since quite some time I never tried to do anything with sound. I suppose it has something to do with the use of 'libraries'. The problem is to find out which ones and to know how to use them. A good start might be
http://members.tripod.lycos.nl/midisoft/

Good luck !

Reply 2 offered by: René Verhoeven on 13-Dec-2000

Yes ... me again. Sorry but links to midismpl.exe and llstream.exe in the page mentioned in Reply 1 are not correct.

Use these ones :
<http://support.microsoft.com/support/KB/ARTICLES/Q181/3/60.asp>

<http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/Q186/4/93.asp>

or send me an e-mail so that I can forward you the sample-files.

Reply 3 offered by: Art Thompson on 14-Dec-2000

Thanks to Rene for the quick response, and to all the others that make this forum so useful and at times, enlightening.


#1868: Length
Length

(1868)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 14-Dec-2000

I know, I know this question has been asked before, but I just can't find the thread. Whenever I fill a bar with 1/32, or 1/16, for instance, that particular bar becomes mighty long, rendering other staves at the same bar with, say, fourths, a little more difficult to read due to distance between notes. How can I make reduce the length?

Reply 1 offered by: Art Thompson on 14-Dec-2000

As Emperor Joseph said to Herr Mozart:"Too many notes"


#1869: Layering
Layering

(1869)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 14-Dec-2000

I already allowed layering on "Page Setup...", however, whenever I insert a chord member it looks like a regular chord. How do I achieve layering, after allowing it?
Thanks,
Caesar vane

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 14-Dec-2000

Not sure if I fully understand your chord question. However, after allowing layering, you still need to go to Staff Properties to tell NWC which staffs to layer.

You may have to fiddle a bit with rest placements, as well as note stem and slur/tie direction.

Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Dec-2000

If you select File | New | General tab, the "SATB" template will give you a very simple starting point for working with layering. You can use Staff | Staff Properties and File | Page Setup too review the property settings that enable layering. This is also covered in the version 1.70 User Guide "How To" section.

Reply 3 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 15-Dec-2000

Yes but if you have paid your licence a long time ago you have just an obsolete user guide. When do you plan to put it on the site (eg in pdf format) for dowload by old users.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 15-Dec-2000

Jean - go to the Scriptorium http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ and download the new V1.70 Command Summary. You'll be glad you did.

Then, you can translate it to French for us. ;-)

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Dec-2000

Or, if you paid for a license a long time ago, and haven't paid since, get the upgrade: http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/replace.htm

Reply 6 offered by: Jean Cifrane on 30-Dec-2000

THe command summary seems (I have still not readen the 171 pages)to be very good.
It seems to be too big to be translated by one man ! I may volonteer to 10 % of it if there are other volonteers and many people asking for French translation....

Reply 7 offered by: Pierre Dechargé on 06-Jan-2001

Jean,
Bonne année et merci de répondre. Oui j'ai vu les messages sur la traduction. Désolé pour ce coup mais je pense que cela n'est pas nécèssaire car il me semble aussi avoir vu d'autres réponses dans ce forum disant en gros "Pourquoi ne pas traduire en Grec, en turc, en allemand, etc...". Dans certains sports, la langue officielle est une telle et tous les athlètes qui pratiquent ce sport comprennent. Pour moi, si j'écris mal en anglais, je le comprends suffisament pour tirer plein de solutions à des problèmes que je me pose. Merci à tout ceux qui ont oeuvré à la rédaction de ce user guide.

Reply 8 offered by: Yves Grasset on 08-Jan-2001

Hello,

I've volunteered a while back on the Newsgroup to translate it into French. I should begin soon. If you're ready to help, please contact me and tell me what you're willing to translate.

About Pierre's remark:

It isn't _necessary_ to translate it into French, Greek, German, ... But if someone wants to do it, why not? And even if it helps only one person, well, it's been useful.

And, besides, I guess that you know the francophones' legendary ability (and enthusiasm) for foreign languages. ;)

YG

Reply 9 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 08-Jan-2001

Pierre's message (in French) indicates that although he may not write English well, he can read it well enough. It is the same for me, in French. I own a French-language application and have no trouble understanding its help files.

But I believe that a percentage of NWC users are entirely new to electronic music. For them, the tutorial is the first place to go, rather than to the help file. But human behaviour being what it is, I expect that most new users simply turn on the program and attempt to learn it via help.

Reply 10 offered by: Jean CIFRANE on 08-Jan-2001

I don't go often to the news group...
As has offered here earlier I volonteer to translate 20+-5 pages of the commands. Please define more precisely what I have to do...

Reply 11 offered by: Yves Grasset on 10-Jan-2001

Section 2 is 18 pages long. Is it OK for you?

If so, please send me an e-mail, and I'll give you more details.


#1870: Moving a staff
Moving a staff

(1870)

Submitted by: J. Jones on 15-Dec-2000

I find it difficult to move a staff where I want it to go. If it is at the bottom of the score and I want to move it three up, for instance, what number do I pick?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 15-Dec-2000

If you're moving it upwards, it goes above the staff you select with "move". If you're moving it downwards, it goes below the staff you select.

Reply 2 offered by: J. Jones on 15-Dec-2000

Sorry, but that just doesn't work. For one thing, there is no command saying move staff up or down. Also, it doesn't say if staffs are numbered from top down or vice versa. If they are numbered from top down and I want to move the sixth staff to the second position, choosing #1 will not put it there. Maybe I have a corrupted version of the program?

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 15-Dec-2000

Tt works like this:

1. Select the staff you want to move.
2. Start the "move staff" dialog (alt-S V)
3. Move the highlight (with mouse or up/down arrow keys) to the name of the staff beyond which you want to move the selected staff.
4. Click the "OK" button.

When selecting the target staff, Fred's instructions are correct. When you're moving a staff upwards, it will move past the selected staff and end up above it. When you're moving a staff downwards, it will (again) move past the selected staff and end up below it.

Reply 4 offered by: J. Jones on 15-Dec-2000

Ok. I think I've got it.

Thanks for the help!

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Bacher on 18-Dec-2000

Well, you gotta admit it's confusing.

Why not just have the Move Staff menu say "Move staff to
BEFORE (or AFTER) the selected existing staff"? And then,
of course, you need to include a "*TOP OF SYSTEM"" (or
"*BOTTOM OF SYSTEM*") entry to allow moving the staff to
the very top or the very bottom.

I had no idea it worked the way you describe here. It's not
what I would call intuitive; it usually takes me several iterations to get the new staff where I want it.

In fact, why not change "New Staff" to insert the new staff
right under (or over) the currently highlighted staff?
(Naah, then we need a top/bottom placeholder again...)

- seb

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Dec-2000

Easiest way IMO would be drag'n'drop, as in Winamp playlists.


#1871: adjust volume of a MIDI file
adjust volume of a MIDI file

(1871)

Submitted by: thomas on 18-Dec-2000

hello, I have a MIDI file and am wondering how to lower its volume.

I'm making an animated Christmas card with the MIDI playing in the background... the viewer can click spots on the card and a short .WAV file will play too... everything is fine except the MIDI is too loud leaving the WAV sounds uncomprehendable. I've edited the .WAV's to full volume level and it's still not enough. Lowering the MIDI volume level seems my only hope.

Is there a program that can do this task? (Import a MIDI file > lower volume level > export to MIDI)

Hoping someone can help this Santa in time for the big day. Thanks for you consideration.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 18-Dec-2000

Since you are in the NWC forum, it may be that you have Noteworthy Compose. If so, open the midi file in Noteworthy. Right click each staff and select "Properties". Select the midi tab and lower the "Part Volume" to the desired level (127 is highest; 0 is silent). Do that for each staff, as desired for balance at the generally reduced volume levels and then save as a midi file.

The midi play back should then be softer.

Reply 2 offered by: thomas on 19-Dec-2000

Thanks for the reply.

Yes, I am a registered NWC user and tried your advice.

The problems I'm having with this method begin when I open the MIDI file in NWC. The import is not accurate, upon playing it back in NWC there are glitches in rhythm on some notes which throw off the composition (it is a basic version of Jingle Bell Rock). Note that I am using the default settings for MIDI import.

Overlooking that, when I lower the "part volume" under the "staff properties" it does indeed lower the volume so no worries there.

Then I try saving as a MIDI but upon playback the file has no sound at all. I've tried both type 1 and type 0 formats.
I've even tried saving as a MIDI after importing and doing no adjustments at all and still get no sound.

Any other ideas for how to pull this off in NWC? or another method altogether? Fingers crossed.

Thanks again.

Reply 3 offered by: thomas on 19-Dec-2000

Update:

I got the MIDI export troubles sorted out. Now I'm able to import the MIDI > lower volume > export to MIDI and get good results on volume. The only problem is the glitches that appear on import. It's mostly a rhythm issue. Just an off note here and there. Any tips on getting an accurate import? There seem to be many options for importing but again, I'm using all the default settings.

Thank you for your consideration.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Dec-2000

NWC is not a MIDI file editor. If your songs start out life in NWC, then you can easily lower the volume prior to exporting to MIDI. If you have songs that are only available in MIDI format, you would do better to edit the MIDI files with a program better suited to this task. For ideas, you might start with these past threads: msg #1825, msg #1103, msg #848

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Dec-2000

One of Günther Nagler's midi utilities lets you adjust volume and/or velocity of pre-existing midis. I think it's even called midivol.exe. In any case, you might browse his available utilities at:

http://www2.iicm.edu/Cpub#freemidi

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Pearson on 20-Dec-2000

Glad you got the midi import and volume working okay.

Not sure of the exact problem as to rhythm. You may want to play with the Note and Rest Resolution Settings and "Detect Compound Time settings on the import screens to see if that helps.

If you want to send the piece to me via email, I can try opening it in Noteworthy and/or some of my other sequencing programs. I would need to know where the errors occur, however.

Reply 7 offered by: thomas on 20-Dec-2000

Problem solved.

I just opened the MIDI file in Cakewalk Pro Audio 9, lowered vol on each track, saved as MIDI, and it is a perfect copy of the orig MIDI only quieter now.

Thanks to everyone here for the feedback and Happy Holidays to all - this Santa is back in action!


#1872: It's time for hidden slurs, accents, staccatti...
It's time for hidden slurs, accents, staccatti...

(1872)

Submitted by: Clive on 19-Dec-2000

I am adding the following to the wish list:

1) Hidden slurs, accents, staccatti...

2) "Fake" staccatti; we all know how yuk these sound in midi - I reckon we should the option of placing staccatti which appear in print but not played.

So come on and respond in the affirmative!

Reply 1 offered by: Little Caesar on 19-Dec-2000

C'mon! It surely depends on your sound card. For instance, in my PC at home staccati does not get a very good effect. Whereas in the laptop I use at work it sound almost perfect. I, personally, see no use in including that sort of things. Rather, they should strive in adding features so that with the NWC alone you can write EVERYTHING you can put on a score, including the crescendo sign, beaming notes with rests in between, beaming notes from one clef to another, from one barline to another, etc.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 19-Dec-2000

The two approaches are not mutually exclusive. In an ideal world we would be able to hide things so as not to clutter up the score but to improve playback, and display things so that the score looks correct.

An example of the first is hiding staccatto marks and triplets when a 'simile' directive achieves the same visual effect with less ink. And of the second, a beam over a rest which has no effect on playback but which is aesthetically correct.

NWC is both a typographic program and a sequencer program and manages both well. That's not to say it's perfect. It still has omissions which we can hope will be included soon, and it still has obvious errors which ought to be corrected ASAP. But it isn't an ideal world, so :-(

Peter

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Dec-2000

A great many of the apparent dichotomy between playback and visual considerations can be easily overcome using separate staves for playing and printing.

Agreed that things would be different in a perfect world - but probably also more involved. At least we have one program that's capable of doing both very well, if not always at the same time.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Pearson on 19-Dec-2000

Quick addendum on Fred's comments (which are good).

If you are posting the music on the web and if you do not want the hidden "playing" staves to be visible under the new browser "plug in" being developed by Noteworthy (as currently configured), be sure to have them labelled as part of a "hidden group" under the "Properties, General Options" tab, as well as marking the parts as "non-visible" under page set up.

Noteworthy's note on the matter (in a newsgroup response) is as follows (and may be more understandable than mine):

"Although it is true that we may revisit this behaviour, the plug-in
currently follows the exact same display rules as NoteWorthy Player. If you
name any staff after the first with a group name "Hidden", it will not
appear in the Player or the plug-in. See the Authoring Tips of NoteWorthy
Player for more details."

Reply 5 offered by: Clive on 19-Dec-2000

Regarding hidden staffs, I find that extra staffs take up extra RAM (I have 128 MB on a PII 450) and have a slightly deletarious effect on sound quality on my computer.

Anyway, I have always thought it a little inconvenient not to be able to work-on the score which is both seen and played.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Dec-2000

As a quick-and-dirty benchmark, I loaded a file with 18 sounding staves (Overture to The Magic Flute) and duplicated a few of them and muted them. Total RAM used (code plus data) was about 2 megs according to WinTop. So, if you've got 128 mB of RAM, you're going to have to run 32 instances of NWC each with this many staves to use up half of your available RAM.

There really shouldn't be any effect on sound quality with hidden (muted) staves, since they don't even output anything into the midi stream. So I'm not sure where this perceived difference would be coming from.

Reply 7 offered by: Clive on 20-Dec-2000

Ooops! I must have been imagining re: effect on RAM/sound quality! Thanks for straightening me out Fred!

By the way, your Magic Flute's great!! WOW!!

Regards, Clive

Reply 8 offered by: Little Caesar on 20-Dec-2000

By the way, Fred, the Konich dar Nacht aria is great. I have a question thought, what do those "q" mean?

Also the Papageno arias are great, I had a wonderful time playing Karaoke (I have a strong baritone voice) with it.

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 20-Dec-2000

All those 'q's mean that you don't have the Boxmarks font installed on your computer. By all means run right over to www.vadu.com/nwc and download it. It's free and it'll make your NWC scores look a whole lot better.

(In Boxmarks, 'q' maps to a double hash-mark indicating a measured tremolo in 16th notes.)

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Dec-2000

> Also the Papageno arias are great, I had a wonderful time
> playing Karaoke (I have a strong baritone voice) with it.

Thanks. Nice to hear of someone actually using the Karaoke function. Just out of curiosity, which karaoke player are you using?

Reply 11 offered by: Little Caesar on 21-Dec-2000

No, I mute the vocal staff and sing along with the orchestra, with the NWC itself. Thanks for the wonderful Magic Flute Project. I am planning to entry the whole L'Elisir D'Amore score. Singing Nemorino despite I am a baritone would be great.

Reply 12 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Dec-2000

Doh! Of course... ::slaps forehead::

Good luck on L'Elisir D'Amore! Looking forward to the result.

Reply 13 offered by: Clive on 21-Dec-2000

Off the original topic... Is anyone embarking on a Beethoven Symphony or Mozart Piano Concerto project? I would like to contribute...

Reply 14 offered by: Fred on 22-Dec-2000

You might have a look at Ramon Pajares Box's site:

http://www.nil.es/rpajares/index_e.htm

Also, Martin Segerstråle has done a couple movements from Beethoven symphonies, they're on the Scriptorium

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/


#1873: Installation Problem - lost note display in 1.7
Installation Problem - lost note display in 1.7

(1873)

Submitted by: Drew Kellas on 19-Dec-2000

I recently installed the 1.7 version (replacing 1.55). When I opened a file I was working on previously (in 1.55) the file opened with all the staves showing and the playback worked (after I had selected the playback device) but, other than bar lines, no other information displays. No notes or lyrics!

Can anyone help me as to what to do in this case?

Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 19-Dec-2000

I had this problem when I installed 1.70. Rebooting the PC made it go away.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Dec-2000

The need for a reboot was removed prior to the final release of version 1.70.

In this case, you might have a conflicting set of color preferences. Visit Tools | Options | Color, and confirm your color scheme.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Dec-2000

See also: msg #1643

Reply 4 offered by: Drew Kellas on 19-Dec-2000

Thanks! The reboot worked!


#1874: Notes with letters inside
Notes with letters inside

(1874)

Submitted by: Ralph on 20-Dec-2000

I am a music teacher and I need to give my pupils examples
where the notes have the corresponding letter (A-G) inside.
Is there any way to do that with NWC ?
It is very difficult to paint and write mannualy it over the printout.

Reply 1 offered by: Blair Dowden on 20-Dec-2000

Yes, I found a way. I tried inserting text over the note (Expression Placement: Justification Center, Alignment at next note), but the note hides the text. However, you can do this:
1) Make a new staff directly under the original.
2) Copy the contents of the original staff into the new staff.
3) Make all the notes invisible (select all the notes, Ctrl-E, select Never on the visibility tab.
4) Now you can insert text over the invisible note. Pick a suitable font. You can change the text colour using the Visiblity tab, Item Colour combobox. You can change the color selection for "Hightlight 1" in Tools | Options | Color.
5) Layer the two staves (On first staff, F2, Visual tab; activate with Page Setup | Contents tab.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 20-Dec-2000

A more roundabout way would be to create a placeable metafile (WMF) using Print Preview > Copy. The WMF can be opened and edited any way you like as a drawing item, with Adobe Illustrator (and probably Corel Draw, etc) if you happen to own that kind of software.

Note to everyone: Is there a lot of demand for a font that has notes with letters inside, appropriately positioned on a staff, that can be used as ordinary text in a word processing document (not inside a music program)? If so, then I might crank one out in my spare time. No promises!

Reply 3 offered by: Van W. Williams on 29-Jan-2001

My music instructor told me about Noteworthy, and I am considering purchasing it. He was not aware of a way to put note letters inside the note symbols, but it would be a helpful addition to new students learing the notes!

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 03-Feb-2001

I am now beginning work on a font for other purposes. There is some space left over (unused characters). I could possible create some "notes with letters inside." Although any font can be used as "text" within NWC, this font would not be a substitute for the actual notation font. In other words, you could not compose music and have the letters appear inside the notes. But as "text" (within a word processor) I could do it.

Space is restricted. I have room for one style of note only (say, quarter notes) in a limited range (on the treble clef, say the A just below middle C, to the C two octaves above middle C). The note would be depicted with an appropriate position on the staff, with leger lines when necessary. The letter would be a capital, in white, sitting within the black note head.

Is this of interest? Respond here on the forum. I can't promise I'll do it, but I might.


#1876: transposition
transposition

(1876)

Submitted by: Thomas Walkden on 21-Dec-2000

I am changing the key in one of our band arrangements to suit our vocalist. The original arrangement is in G changing to Ab and she wants it in F changing to Gb. Now I have copied all the parts and when I come to move the bass part down a tone, the part is rewritten in F changing to F#. I realise that soundwise Gb and F# are the same but I would like him to be in Gb the same as the piano. Do you know of a simple way to do this ??

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 21-Dec-2000

1. select the staff
2. force accidentals (Tools/Force Accidentals, or <alt>t f)
3. edit the F# key signature to change it to G-flat
4. audit accidentals (Tools/Audit Accidentals, or <alt>t c)

This should do it. Note that if the staff contained courtesy accidentals (accidentals that are not strictly necessary but were inserted as a hint to the performer), then "Audit Accidentals" will remove them and you'll have to put them back by hand.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 21-Dec-2000

Oops. Step 4 should be "transpose 0 semitones", not "Audit accidentals".


#1877: Port Usage and Creative Live SoundCard
Port Usage and Creative Live SoundCard

(1877)

Submitted by: Steve Pearson on 21-Dec-2000

Not sure if anyone else has had this situation, but thought I would note it if anyone else runs into the problem.

After installing my new Creative Live card, I was getting the error messages:"Midi Device Failing to Open . . .". No matter what I did on selecting devices (Creative S/W; SB Live Midi Synth; Midi Mapper), I could not get rid of the message or get the program to start. (The sound card, by the way, worked fine on other programs). Even tried reinstalling NWC.

The final solution. I had NWC, Options, Midi, Port Usage set to "While Active" (which had worked fine with my Ensoniq PCI card). When I changed that to either "Always" or "While Playing", the problem disappeared.

In any event, thought I note the situation and solution in case others face something similar in the future. Appears just to be a peculiarity with Creative Soundblaster cards.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Dec-2000

We routinely use the "While Active" port usage setting on a variety of Creative hardware: SB 16, SB AWE 64, and the SB Live.

Have you tried switching back to "While Active" now that you have the problem worked out? I suspect that it will work for you. Make sure that this the only change that you make...

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 21-Dec-2000

Tried it. Same problem arose until I returned to the "While Playing" option. I started getting error messages when I first installed the new Creative card. However, the program would start and seem to work normally. After a while, however, noteworthy would not even open and would give me the error message no matter what device I used.

May just be a peculiarity of my system or system, perhaps. In any event, I was able to apparently work around it and just wanted to note the workaround in case someone else runs into the situation. Creative cards are pretty common

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Dec-2000

You might want to consider looking for a driver update. The condition you describe is not normal, and perhaps a driver update would correct it.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Pearson on 23-Dec-2000

Thanks. Already had the most recents drivers (I wonder if that might be the problem?)

In any event, not a big deal, and, may just be a peculiarity of my particular setup or overall computer hardware.

Thanks for the suggestions. My overall thought was simply to have the post in case anyone else ran into the situation. Not worth any more time on your part.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Pearson on 28-Dec-2000

Very strange. Program started working correctly again with the "While Active" option chosen. Wonder if the grinch just visited by computer over the Christmas holiday?


#1878: Re: MIDI Programming
Re: MIDI Programming

(1878)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 21-Dec-2000

I remember a thread on the subject but just can't find it now. Here are some URL's that may help anyway:

http://www.modemss.brisnet.org.au/~mlevoi/midi.html
http://www.sdf.se/~simon/clavier.html
http://www.harmony-central.com/MIDI/dev.html

HTH


#1879: need expert help
need expert help

(1879)

Submitted by: pete peters on 23-Dec-2000

I am looking to give a present to a classical music fan.
I am tring to find out.what the top 100 classical music pieces of all time, are generally considered to be.
any help anyone could give me would be greatly appreciated.
please e-mail me.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Dec-2000

It depends whom you ask. This could end up being a fun thread, here is my list of favourites, in no particular order:

Schubert: "The Trout" Quintet, String Quartet #15, "Der Hirt Auf Dem Felsen"
Beethoven: Pathetique Sonata, Symphony #3, "Spring" Sonata, Octet
Mozart: "The Magic Flute", Symphony No. 40, Symphony No. 25, "Don Giovanni", "Eine Kleine Nachtmusik"
Mendelssohn: "Scottish" Symphony, A Midsummer Night's Dream, Octet
Bach: Brandenburg Concerti
Dvorak: Symphony No. 8, "American" Quartet
Haydn: The "London" Symphonies
Tchaikovsky: Symphony No. 6, "The Nutcracker"

So much good music... I'd better stop before I fill up all 100 myself!

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 23-Dec-2000

Here's a few from me (no order):

Bach: Violin Concerto in E; #347 "Was Gott tut, das ist wohlgetan" from BWV 250~252, 3 Choräle zu Traungen
Beethoven: Symph.s #5, #9; Quartet op. 127, Grosse fugue op. 128; Lieds
Smetana: Vltava from Ma Vlast
Lizst: Symph. poem "Preludes"
R. Strauss: Tod und Verklörung
Steve Reich: Drumming
Webern: Sonata for Cello and Piano, Orchestral Variations op. 30...
Fred Nachbaur: Void of Sensation (no kidding)
Witold Lutoslawski: Concerto for Orchestra, Concerto for Cello and Orchestra, Chains, Novelette...
Schubert: Der Tod und das Mãdchen (and else)

finally
Ertugrul inanç: ...not composed yet... ;)

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 26-Dec-2000

I was sure I'd be able to find a "top 100" list compiled
by someone or other, but after a few attempts I'm giving
up. Obviously this is entirely a matter of taste, there
is no objective means for rating a piece of music.

You can't trust "popularity" as it's so variable, and is
heavily influenced by exposure. There's a kind of snowball
effect. For example, the Vivaldi Four Seasons was written
in 1725, but it was hardly played AT ALL, by anyone, between
about 1750 and 1930. These days there are thousands of
recordings and it gets regular airtime. Who knows, in a
decade or so it may go out of fashion.

I did find a link to a book called "Classical Music : The
50 Greatest Composers and Their 1,000 Greatest Works"

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0449910423/105-2457590-0551903

I haven't got the faintest idea what criteria was used to
choose them, or if this is worthwhile list.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 26-Dec-2000

It's a bit late, but I can't resist.

Questions to ask yourself: (1) Orchestral, small group performing? (2) Vocal or not? (3) Any favorite instrument? (4) Any favorite time period or style? (5) Religious theme, maybe, or definitely not? (6) Country of origin?

My own tastes in classical change with time, as I do not play an instrument (except for voice).

If you think your friend would like orchestral, also consider "non-classical" orchestral such as big-band samba.

Reply 5 offered by: redraider4421 on 31-Dec-2000

thank you everyone for your help. It was greatly appreciated.
please feel free to continue to e-mail me on this topic as there is no such thing as too much information.

Reply 6 offered by: Robin Withey on 02-Jan-2001

Hi Pete,

If you're looking for a broader opinion, the UK radio station Classic FM (which you can hear on the web, by the way) holds an annual poll of the top 300 classical compositions. The piece that has come top ever since they started the poll is (rather surprisingly) Bruch's violin concerto.

If you want to check out the complete list, see http://www.classicfm.com/pages/whats_on/HoFame/HOF2000.htm

Robin Withey


#1880: Scanning Sheet Music
Scanning Sheet Music

(1880)

Submitted by: Michael Aron on 23-Dec-2000

Does anyone know of a software that will allow me to scan sheet music into the computer and translate it into either NWC format or MIDI format? That would save me loads of typing!

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 23-Dec-2000

SharpEye at http://www.visiv.co.uk/ (shareware) is currently being discussed at the ng.

Reply 2 offered by: Jim on 30-Dec-2000

Try this link: http://www.notation.demon.co.uk/cscan.htm

Reply 3 offered by: Paul C. on 12-Jan-2001

I have used several scanning (OCR) programs, all with poor results. In fact, they were so bad, it was faster to enter the notes on a new document rather than try to fix what was gotten from scanning.

One program I tried was OMER which is made to use with another notation shareware Melody Assistant. Because it was being discussed on a website where I am a columnist, the manufacturer really worked with me trying to help solve the problem... no luck. I tried everything, all sorts of resolution settings, just got garbage.

I have the latest Finale 2001, which has a built in scanning/OCR feature. I got ONE usable scan after trying it for several months. Nothing I did ever made any difference.
Now maybe it is just stupidity on my part... but I like to think of myself as above average. But I can't make them work. I would like to see a demonstration by a software supplier and see it proven. I would love to be proven wrong , but I think this is a waste of time with the current programs.


#1881: Instrument Numbers?
Instrument Numbers?

(1881)

Submitted by: Hank Robertson on 24-Dec-2000

OK, I know that there is a way to add the instrument numbers to the instrument names when you call up the 'instrument patch' function in 'staff properties' because I used to have it that way, however I have forgotten which file I had to edit to add the numbers to the names. I have tried editing the nwcpatch.ini file and adding the numbers there, but they still don't come up on the listing. HELP! (grin).

Reply 1 offered by: Hank Robertson on 24-Dec-2000

Never mind, just found the answer. I wasn't putting the number BEFORE the equals sign. Thanx anyway.


#1882: Combining Staves?
Combining Staves?

(1882)

Submitted by: Stefan on 24-Dec-2000

Is there a way to combine two staves? Please e-mail me. Thanks

Stefan
Smash105@aol.com

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul on 24-Dec-2000

Layering function may be what you're looking for.

First of all, allow layering at file/page setup/contents, then go to the staff you like to layer with (the one above the other) and bring up staff properties pressing F2. Jump to tha "visual" tab and check "layer with next staff". That's all. You can pass through staves by pgUp/pgDown as when they are non layered.

Ertugrul


#1883: Postscript Printer Driver for W98SE
Postscript Printer Driver for W98SE

(1883)

Submitted by: Rich Nagel on 25-Dec-2000

Hi Folks,

On my WindoZe 3.11 PC I had previously installed the Postscript printer driver and Ghostscript in order to create PDF files from NWC scores. In W311 the Postscript driver was listed as such in the "Add Printers" section ("Postscript Printer" <G>). After upgrading to Windows 98 SE, I don't see a PS printer driver, but a bunch of others that are close, I'm not sure which one I should install. There are a lot of Apple Laserwriter models listed (as well as other manufactors), all with a "PS" suffix after the model number. Any ideas of specifically which one would be the best to create .PS printer files for use with Ghostview/Ghostscript?

Thanx for any info,

Rich Nagel
richnagel@compuserve.com

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Dec-2000

All the Applewriter series use the same Windoze printer driver pscript.drv. However, it's a bit woosie, and can actually crash the generating application under some conditions.

I'd suggest getting Adobe's "Generic PostScript Driver" V4.3.1 (free). When you configure it, don't worry about the printer definition files, just use the default generic one it comes with. Connect it to "File" and away you go.

http://www.adobe.com/support/downloads/5b22.htm

btw - there's a new version of Ghostscript now available (V6.50) which reportedly contains significant improvements to the PDF conversion algorithms. Going along with that is a new (V3.5) version of GSview, which takes advantage of the new features. However, please note that these no longer work properly under Windows 3.x (for which you'll need to stay with Ghostscript 6.01 + GSview 3.4). For further information see my page on the subject:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/gsinfo.htm

Reply 2 offered by: Rich Nagel on 26-Dec-2000

Hi Fred,

Many thanks for the info -:) I'll try the generic PS driver and the new version Ghostscript that you suggested.

Again, many thanx -:)

Rich


#1884: Roland XP-30
Roland XP-30

(1884)

Submitted by: John Bates on 26-Dec-2000

Got a new Roland XP-30 synthesizer for Christmas. I was wondering if anyone has had experience attaching this, or something close, as the external midi device for Noteworthy. I've edited my ".ini" patch, and can get instrument changes, but everything is writing to a single staff. If I try to write in multiple staves, I get a single instrument playing ALL the staves!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Dec-2000

For those that do not know, the Roand XP-30 is a MIDI capable keyboard. I gather that you want to play output to it, and capture notes played from it (your question is a little confusing). Once you have the necessary cabling from your computer to a MIDI keyboard, and the necessary MIDI drivers are installed on the computer, NWC can both play back to the device, and receive note data from it.

You setup play back to the device by configuring NWC for its use via Tools | Options | Midi | Devices used by play back. Then, in Staff | Staff Properties | Midi, you make sure this device is selected in the "Play back device" field. You use the Instrument defintions in the staff, combined with the staff MIDI Channel assignment, to control what instrument is heard.

You can setup for receiving MIDI data from the keyboard from Tools | Optiond | Record. You can further establish preset Import options when capturing live performances using Tools | Options | Import. The two commands that activate MIDI input are:

Tools | Record: This is used to capture a live performance that is performed while the currently active score is played

Tools | MIDI Input Active: This is used to enter notes in a step entry fashion. You can use the Pitch or Mod wheels to select note durations, in possible conjuction with your computer keyboard and mouse, then enter notes or chords that will be placed into the staff using the currently selected note properties.

For more details, see the User's Guide Tutorial section, Common Questions section, and various other areas here at this web site.

See also: msg #1100, msg #1461, msg #1102, msg #1224, msg #1532, msg #517, msg #896

Reply 2 offered by: John Bates on 27-Dec-2000

My problem has been simplified somewhat, and thank you. But, there is still a major problem remaining. I can both recieve MIDI information from, and playback music through the XP-30. I'm used to having about 16 staves (in NoteWorthy), selecting a unique instrument for each staff, adding notation and playing the song right then and there. For most of my playback through the XP-30, I'm planning on using the Orchestral expansion set, which contains better sounding versions of the instruments I'm usually using. But when I select this patch on the keyboard, whichever instrument that is selected dominates the playback! That is to say, there isn't a different instrument playing on each staff, but they all play on the same one, regardless of the changes in instrument selection in NoteWorthy. Also, the keyboard appears to choose which instrument to play them all on depending upon which one the bottom staff is set on (if it is a Tuba, #35, then they all playback as a Tuba, or whatever #35 is in the patch I have selected). Now, if I mute the bottom staff, the keyboard looks for the next staff up that isn't muted to determine the instrument to playback on. I'm hoping this makes a little sense...

The main problem is that I can only play back through the keyboard on one instrument at a time, not a full orchestra as I'd like to. What do I do about it?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Dec-2000

What happens when you play the samples?

If you still only hear one type of instrument, you need to consult your keyboard documentation to figure out how to get it to handle multitimbral parts. I see from its specs that it should handle it.

If the samples play properly, then you need to do the same with your music. Make sure that you assign different MIDI channels to each staff.


#1885: Hearing notes while editing
Hearing notes while editing

(1885)

Submitted by: Sandy Sansing on 26-Dec-2000

Does anyine know how to hear the currently selected note (position on the staff) while editing a staff? Much of my composition is based on hearing the notes I want to place, and being able to hear the note that related to the space or line I was working with would help a lot.

Any ideas or suggestions?
-Sandy

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Dec-2000

The best way would be to add a midi keyboard or controller to your system to play in the notes.
That way you could try the notes on the keyboard and when each section of the tune sounds good to the ear then enable NoteWorthy's Step Input tool and play the notes into the score.
A small 49key keyboard controller with limited functions should cost less $100US - I guess.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Dec-2000

You can also hear what you just entered by doing the following:

1) Go to Tools | Options | Midi and set field "Play" to "from insertion point"

2) Enter a note, or notes, then move the insertion point left so it is just behind the note

3) Press Shift+F5, which will play just the active staff, starting from the insertion point


#1886: Need help!
Need help!

(1886)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANÇ on 27-Dec-2000

(The following message has also been posted to NoteWorthy and SBLive newsgroups.)

After I reinstalled win98 caused by a total system crash, I downloaded and set up the latest drivers and utilities of my Live Platinum as I yet had to because my cd-rom driver is on repair and I cannot access the original files.

But I got irritated recognizing that all but the 2 mb sf banks have gone and most of the creative launcher bar is empty. The recorder, Vienna and many else are absent. I'm totally cut-off since a Live soundcard means midi sequencing and midi sequencing 8 mb bank for me.

Every kind of assistance appreciated.


#1887: [un]synchronized playback with master repeats
[un]synchronized playback with master repeats

(1887)

Submitted by: Carrie on 27-Dec-2000

My problem: on the 2nd ending to the song being played back, the top staff plays (and is highlighted), but the bottom staff isn't highlighted, yet is playing something from I don't know where in the score. It isn't synchronized, but only on this second and last ending to the end of the song. In addition; in the 2. ending if I were to highlight the bottom staff, it will play what is written, but the top staff doesn't play at the same time.

I can only think I've pressed a key or clicked something without knowing about it that is doing this, because I've done the same 1. 2. endings with master repeats on another song and have had no problems like this.

I'm not playing back through the midi keyboard (I'm still learning about all this stuff and am keeping it simple right now...). For the time being I'm just using 'Maestro WaveSynth' for my playbacks - I've searched the archives and the one message that had something related to this wasn't the same thing.

I hope this makes sense - and I hope someone has an idea of what I can undo to try and fix it - I've tried re-inputting the second staff notes, as that seems to be the problem staff, but it hasn't helped.

Thanks in advance,
Carrie

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Dec-2000

Without seeing the file, my best guess is that you have not assigned your repeats and endings to all staves.

For more on this, please refer to msg #1180.

Reply 2 offered by: Carrie on 28-Dec-2000

Thanks ~ I'd forgotten to put in the first ending (!) I guess after 3am I was a bit fuzzy... all's well.


#1888: how do i get it to play "swing"
how do i get it to play "swing"

(1888)

Submitted by: Mike on 28-Dec-2000

i cant seem to figure out how to get noteworthy to play in "swing" mode, if you know what i mean. I know that i can just use a quarter note and eighth in a triplet, and have done that, but its so much easier if i could just assign swing in teh beginning, Can anyone help me?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 28-Dec-2000

As far as I'm aware NWC just doesn't support this. Rhythmically, what you see is pretty much what you get. I know you aren't the only one who'd like to see this feature, though, so perhaps you should go to the wish list page on this site and add your voice to the clamor.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 28-Dec-2000

There isn't a handy button or menu command to do this. The way you've been doing it gives a reasonable swing, (though for a real jazz swing feel you'll have to do tempo changes at each note).

If the triplet feel is okay with you as far as how the playback sounds, you can hide these rather messy-looking staves, and write additional (muted) staves in straight 1/8ths to make it easier to read.

An example is "Alleycat" available at
http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/educate.htm#guitar

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 29-Dec-2000

A quick and dirty way to achieve a swing feel is to create a tempo track consisting of quaver note rests with alternating tempo markings (slow followed by fast) before every rest. e.g crotchet = 60, rest, crotchet = 120, rest etc. You will need to experiment with the relative speeds to get the overall speed and "swinginess" right and then just copy and paste or use repeats to get the correct number of bars.

I find this often gives a rather more flexible and satisfactory outcome than the triplet method. The down side is that some heavy duty arithmetic is needed if you want to do a rallentando or change to "straight eighths" at the same overall tempo.

HTH

Stephen Randall

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Dec-2000

Check the User Tips section of our web site. The tip titled "How to Make NWC Play Jazz" shows a pretty good way to do this.

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 09-Jan-2001

Hi all,

I just submitted a continuation for the tip titled "How to Make NWC Play Jazz", which, IMHO, eases the arithmetic needed for computing the new tempo values.

This formula gives tempo values for feelings 3/4 + 1/4, or 2/3 + 1/3, or 5/8 + 3/8, or 3/5 + 2/5, ..., (n+1)/2n + (n-1)/2n with any value for n. The values are T1 = n/(n+1) * T and T2 = n/(n-1) * T (T is the original tempo).

Examples:
n=2: T1 = 2/3 * T, T2 = 2 * T; feeling = 3/4 + 1/4.
n=3: T1 = 3/4 * T, T2 = 3/2 * T; feeling = 4/6 + 2/6 = 2/3 + 1/3.
n=4: T1 = 4/5 * T, T2 = 4/3 * T; feeling = 5/8 + 3/8.
n=5: T1 = 5/6 * T, T2 = 5/4 * T; feeling = 6/10 + 4/10 = 3/5 + 2/5.

If my hand made computations are OK, this gives for T=120:
n=2: T1=80 T2=240 feeling 3-1
n=3: T1=90 T2=180 feeling 2-1
n=4: T1=96 T2=160 feeling 5-3
n=5: T1=100 T2=150 feeling 3-2


#1889: confusion, confusion.....!
confusion, confusion.....!

(1889)

Submitted by: Richard Longhurst on 28-Dec-2000

hey everyone

I have got a general MIDI keyboard, and I use noteworthy to produce scores, but I also compose using software such as cubase and cakewalk etc. anyway when ive made a song and saved as a midi file, the instrument sounds are really acky, but ive heard from someone that it is possible to route it all through your keyboard, so the intruments on the finished MIDI recording sound more realistic. so... in noteworthy I set the playback device as Roland MPU-401, but then when i press a note on my keyboard, i hear no sound come out of my pc speakers, and also if I play back a score I hear no sound coming through my pc speakers..! what exactly am I doing wrong?? basically as an end result, I want to save my song that ive composed as a MIDI file, and I want the instruments in that MIDI file to sound realistic :-) is this possible, or have I gotta stick with rubbish sounds?

thanx for your time ppl! :-)

- R.L

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 28-Dec-2000

You have to route the audio from your external keyboard back into the line input (or in some cases the mic input) of your soundcard. Then you need to use the mixer applet to choose that input for recording (and/or playback) and set levels appropriately. To record the "cool" sound from your external keyboard, you'll also need a wav recorder such as CoolEdit. (The one that comes with Windows is only good for up to a minute or so, since it doesn't write directly to hard drive and is therefore limited by available RAM.)

Reply 2 offered by: adva on 29-Dec-2000

hello
im looking for rock piano sheet music along time
please if anybody knows where i can fine it.. tell me.
tnx
(pearl jam..metallica..RHCP.and more)

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Dec-2000

You don't say what kind of keyboard you have. Does it include a synthesizer? Does it include its own speakers and amplifier? Does it have a headphone jack?

If the answer is "No" to all of these questions, then you are forced to use the synthesizer sounds supported by your sound card. Once you get the necessary connection between your MIDI keyboard and the computer, you can use the Echo feature in Tools | Options | Record in NWC to trigger your internal sound card sounds using the external keyboard.

Note that the quality of sounds you hear when a MIDI file is played is primarily dependent on your sound card. The MIDI file only contains performance data (what notes to play, how loud, when, and what kind if instrument). The sound card's capabilities ultimately determine what you hear when playing the MIDI file.

Reply 4 offered by: Richard Longhurst on 29-Dec-2000

in reply to adva's question, you could try oddrealm.com :-)

ok thanks for all your replys. My keyboard is a
Yamaha PSR-270. It has its own speakers and a headphone jack. What do you mean by synthesiser? and amp? its has two lists of songs on it, one list for normal use, and one list titled 'GM voice'.
Is it therefore possible to create and song on my computer, and save it as a WAV file, but with the realistic instrument sounds intact? thats basically what im trying to do. Would this be possible without buying a new soundcard?

So basically when I have my song in cakewalk or whatever, make it play through my keyboard, out the headfones socket, into my mic socket on my computer and record it on a WAV app? If so, how exactly do I get my song playing back through my keyboard?

thanks everyone!

R.L

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Dec-2000

A synthesizer is the device that creates the sounds you hear when you play MIDI files, and when you play the keys on your PSR-270. Your PSR-270 keyboard does not include a real piano, trumpet, snare drum, or any other kind of analog instrument inside of it. It synthetically creates these sounds using what is commonly referred to as a synthesizer. The actual technology used by a synthesizer can and does vary, but it always is about reproducing sounds from digital performance data. The notes you enter into NWC fall into the realm of digital performance data.

If you want to hear your PSR-270 through your computer speakers, you will need to connect the audio output from the keyboard into a "Line In" jack on your computer's sound card. If your computer sound card does not have a Line In jack (most do these days), then you probably will not be able to get a satisfactory sound from the keyboard into your computer.

You can also use a digital, MIDI connection between your PSR-270 and your computer, using the PSR-270's MIDI input and output ports. You need a special MIDI cable that connects your PC to a MIDI in and out cable (see http://www.hosatech.com/SBC195.htm for an example). Once you have the cable, and the supporting device driver installed, you can then use your MIDI keyboard with other MIDI software, such as NoteWorthy Composer. If you plan to go this route, look around this forum for more on this. Here are some links to get you started: msg #1837, msg #1884

Reply 6 offered by: Richard Longhurst on 30-Dec-2000

oke doke, I already have a MIDI lead, and have successfully set up my external keyboard to work with noteworthy and various other midi programs, but the sounds are sh*t lol. So, correct me if im wrong, I need to buy a new soundcard, then the instrument sounds in noteworthy will be more realistic, then I can save my song as a MIDI file, and then convert it to a WAV... so the end result will be my groovy song with realistic sounding instruments? If so, can anyone recommend a soundcard within the sorta £30-£40 price barrier which will fit my needs? thanx every1!

R.L

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Dec-2000

Assuming you are happy with the sounds of your PSR-270, and your sound card has a "Line In" input, why wouldn't you just use it?

Reply 8 offered by: Richard Longhurst on 30-Dec-2000

because playing my keyboard through the line in socket will only let me record what im playing at that particular moment to a wav file wont it? I want to create songs a track at a time like you can in cakewalk and cubase. Is this possible with your method? thanx for your help!

R.L

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Dec-2000

There is a difference between composing a song and creating a WAV file of your song. If it were me, I would try to use the equipment already in my possession. As far as I can tell by loking at your keyboard specs, your keyboard supports multi-timbral, multi-channel MIDI operation. Therefore, you could use it:

1) while composing, or writing, your songs with NWC or other MIDI composition tool, one part at a time

- and -

2) while capturing your completed song to a WAV file

Your strategy may differ from mine. You might want to spend some time with your keyboard's user manual to learn more about it and then decide.

Reply 10 offered by: Richard Longhurst on 31-Dec-2000

What I want to do is compose a song track by track in some MIDI program or other, then convert the result midi file to a WAV file... BUT if I were to do that at the moment, the drums would sound like cardboard boxes, and the piano like god knows what... so I need the instrument sounds to be realistic when im composing and in the finished MIDI file, so that it will sound good in the final WAV file. Thats why im asking whether a new sound card would be the answer, because then when im creating my song, the instruments will sound cool, so when I convert the song to WAV, it will sound wicked! I hope you know what I mean, the sound card I have at the moment is a sound blaster 16, which is really as basic as you can get! thanx everyone for helping me to sort this out! I just need to get over this last hurdle! :-)

R.L

Reply 11 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 03-Jan-2001

Let's start like this.

A MIDI file contains NO sounds. None. And a WAV file contains no notes -- just sounds that might correspond
to some particular combination of notes played
on some instrument -- or might correspond to the traffic
noises on a busy street, or words spoken in an angry
debate in an election committee meeting.

The MIDI file is like a list of instructions, something
similar to:

at 1:15:00.00 PM, start the trumpet playing high "D".
at 1:15:00.10 PM, stop the trumped.
at 1:15:00.11 PM, start the trumpet playing high "E".
...

and so on.

Think of it as an electronic score. Give it to a good
musician with a well-maintained instrument, he will play
it and it sounds great. Give it to a kid with a kazoo, and,
well, cover your ears.

Noteworthy is the "word processor" for the score. Your
sound card or synthesizer is the electronic musician.

So: create your MIDI file, ignoring how bad it sounds. So
long as the notes are right, the musical score is good.

Then put the MIDI file on a floppy disk and take it to your friend with the very expensive synthesizer, and let _him_
create the WAV file (that is, let his synthesizer follow
the electronic directions to "perform" the music (all of this, of course, being done by computer programs in the
computer, sound card, or synth) and record the result in
a WAV file.

So there are two questions:

1) What hardware, software and method will you use to
create the MIDI file? (perhaps Noteworthy Composer)

2) What hardware, software and method will you use to
perform the MIDI file and record the result?

With this distinction in mind, some of the answers people
have been giving may make more sense.


#1890: sb16 and soundfont
sb16 and soundfont

(1890)

Submitted by: spoonman on 28-Dec-2000

Hey all,
I (still) have a Sound Blaster 16!! Just the other day I found out I could play midis through the Quick Time movie player. Quick time used a soundfont that works with the SB16 and I was wondering if its possible to use it in Noteworthy Composer instead of the standard midi sounds that are no good.

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Dec-2000

NWC can play any MIDI device that includes standard Windows MIDI drivers. As far as I know, QuickTime does not provide a standard Window's driver to access its capabilities. You probably have to save as a MIDI file, then play it in QuickTime to get its benefits.


#1891: I am willing to pay for version 2.x....
I am willing to pay for version 2.x....

(1891)

Submitted by: Clive on 29-Dec-2000

Dear Noteworthy,

For years I have used your product and believe me, it has given me so much enjoyment and fulfilment. Occasionally I have erred and been perhaps a little critical here on the discussion board. The service you provide is tops and your responsiveness to users' view is much apprecaited!

So propose you charge us for version 2.x! We have all already received so many free upgrades... I for one will feel much better for it!

Come on fellow users, respond in the affirmative!!!

Thank you, Happy New Year!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 29-Dec-2000

I agree. NWC V1.x has been the best software bargain ever. Like most of us, our family has to mind our pennies pretty closely, but fair is fair. V2.x -- bring it on. I'm on the list.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-Dec-2000

Sounds good to me, too.

Reply 3 offered by: Joseph-Marie Belanger on 29-Dec-2000

We are paying almost once a year For Cakewalk.
Why not for NoteWorthy !

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 29-Dec-2000

I guess we will have to pay to register v2 anyway since the registration only covers v1.x

Mind you if V1.8 has the features I've had on my wish list for so many years I'd be happy to re-register to get them.

But why should I complain - how many upgrades and added features have I got over the past 6 years for FREE - all for the amazingly low registration fee.

Reply 5 offered by: chris on 29-Dec-2000

NWC is very close now to covering all of the situations I need it for (and the workarounds shared amongst the users take care of most situations the software doesn't directly support). I would gladly pay another registration <or a smaller upgrade fee ;-) > to get the last few wish list items I'm looking for. Thanks to Noteworthy for this nice piece of software.

Reply 6 offered by: Clive on 30-Dec-2000

Thanks for the responses! Come on everyone, lets keep it up and really let Noteworthy know how much they are appreciated!!!

Since I am here, I might give my wish-list a little plug again:

1) n-tuplets
2) hidden slurs and staccatos
3) staccatos that are printed but not played
4) ability to slur within slurs

Thanks Noteworthy, Happy New Year!

Reply 7 offered by: Art Thompson on 30-Dec-2000

We have all used this forum to be critical of NWC at their own expense. Happy New Year to NWC and all you forum users that have made this a cool forum. Also, thanks to NWC for making my Senior Project a pleasant composing experience. I couldn't have done it without ya.

Reply 8 offered by: Adam Tucker on 30-Dec-2000

Yes, I agree, its the best little music programme I use, and so easy. The printed scores are second to none. I'd pay for a new version if it gave even more.

Reply 9 offered by: Mark on 30-Dec-2000

Agree!! Three cheers for Noteworthy!

Reply 10 offered by: Pierre Decharge on 02-Jan-2001

I use so Noteworthy and I agree with you to re-registered.
French users write me Please. English is not easy for me and I want exchange with you.

Reply 11 offered by: ian on 04-Jan-2001

i love you

Reply 12 offered by: Jean CIFRANE on 05-Jan-2001

Pierre have you seen msg #1869 (reply 4) and msg #1869 (reply 6) ?
I am French.

Reply 13 offered by: Marco Voli on 19-Jan-2001

Add me to the list of happy people asking to pay again.
IMHO the current version, with its great new feature,
could have been labeled as version 2.0.

As it has been told, most of us are non-professional musicians, so we can not justify hundreds-dollars
investments, and I guess and hope that NoteWorthy Artware
will consider a good price for version 1.x owner.
But, please, let us pay, I really *want* you continue to
develop your (OUR!) program.


#1892: order of instruments
order of instruments

(1892)

Submitted by: kat on 29-Dec-2000

hello to everyone. I am arranging a piece for my class to play but I am unsure as to the order of the instruments when scoring them. I know that it would go flute, oboe, clarinet but for the others (alto sax, tenor sax, barri sax, trumpet, trombone, euphonium) i'm not sure how to arrange them. I'd appretiate any help you could give me. Thanks :o)

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 29-Dec-2000

Score order for a full American symphonic/concert band would be:

-Piccolo
-Flute
-Oboe
-Bassoon
-B flat Clarinet
-Alto Clarinet
-Bass Clarinet
-Contralto Clarinet (if used)
-Contrabass Clarinet (if used)
-Soprano Saxophone (if used)
-Alto Saxophone
-Tenor Saxophone
-Baritone Saxophone
-Cornet or Trumpet (in some cases, there are three Cornet parts, followed by 2 Trumpet parts, in others, just 3 Trumpet parts)
-Horn
-Trombone
-Baritone/Euphonium
-Tubas and/or Basses/String Bass
-Percussion (usually melodic percussion first)

"See msg #1520" for a bit more discussion.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 31-Dec-2000

In fact, the order on the score as well as the placement on the stage fully depends on the composer's or in some cases performers' preference. Actually, the common practice have also changed through time. For instance, in the Baroque era, "German style" was common in which the first and second violins were placed right and left wings to obtain a stereo effect, the Violas were in the middle (Bach is said to have commented on why he liked playing Viola that he preferred to be in the middle of harmony), the continuous bass consisting of Viola da Gamba and Harpsicord in the back-most middle and finally the winds (if exist) in front of the bass.

Speaking of the score order, the following classification has been general through the Classical and Romantic times:

1)Woodwinds (Piccolo, Flute, Oboe, English Horn, Clarinet, Bassoon), from the highest to the bass with the exception of Oboe and Clarinet latter of which is more effective higher than the prior (unless it's Bass [A] clarinet)

2)Brass (French Horn, Trumpet, Trombone, Saxophones, Tuba)

3)Timpani

4)Other pitched percussion such as Marimba, Xylophone

5)Percussion without pitch such as cymbals, bass drum

6)Piano (Identical. May be placed anywhere else after the winds or before the strings)

7) Harp, Celesta (may be placed within pitched perc.)

8)Strings (Violins I&II, Violas, Violoncellos, Doublebasses)

HTH

Reply 3 offered by: Kat on 31-Dec-2000

thank you both for your replies, I really really appretiate the effort you put in and it answers my questions perfectly. Thanks again.

Reply 4 offered by: John Gillings on 10-Jan-2001

I you're the conductor, arrange them the way *you* feel
most comfortable with. Tradition is all very well, but it's
not compulsory.

If you're not the conductor, start with one of the
suggestions here (though I'm not sure I like the idea of
saxophones between trombone and tuba as suggested in reply
2 - seems highly unnatural!).

Ask the conductor that if they're happy with the order.
If not, ask them what they'd like. It's then a simple task
for you to print a score in any order they want.


#1893: printer properties
printer properties

(1893)

Submitted by: Grant on 30-Dec-2000

I'm formatting a score for printing to a file in landscape using the Apple LaserWriter Plus driver. This is not my default Windows printer. When I save and re-open the file, the printer and orientation info is lost, which makes the Print Preview display incorrect. In order to get the correct display, I have to go into Printer Setup and reset the printer & orientation.

I'd rather not have to do this. Is there any way that NWC can (or might in the future) store away enough info in the .nwc file to make the Print Preview correct for the intended output device?

Reply 1 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Dec-2000

NWC does not currently support page orientation or page size through its direct page properties. The paper size and orientation is based on the printer settings, so they have to be configured for a file before printing (as you pointed out). You could also change the defaults for the printer, but this would implement this change for all future NWC prints to that printer.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Dec-2000

I've been trying to get into the habit of putting my printer settings (e.g. PostScript drv, A4, Portrait) into the info fields so I remember what the heck I did when I have to go back and re-print after an edit, or what-have-you.

I agree that it would be handy to have these setting remembered internally, but fear what might happen on other users' systems if they don't have that particular driver set available...

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 30-Dec-2000

>>>You could also change the defaults for the printer . . .

If I understand you, this would solve the orientation problem but not the need to reset the printer each time I edit the file. If this is wrong please let me know.

It would be nice if NWC itself could have a default printer assignment that differed from the system default.

In the meantime, I note that you say "NWC does not currently support" what I'm asking for. I'm off to the wish list.

Thanks.


#1894: Page contents
Page contents

(1894)

Submitted by: Grant on 30-Dec-2000

Would it be possible to have a separate "Page Contents" property for edit mode? It would be nice to have a "composer's view" (e.g., showing all the staves) that is different from the "consumer's view" (only those staves that are formatted for display). I imagine the "consumer's view" would be in force for printing, print previewing and NWP, and the "composer's view" in NWC edit mode. In particular, I'd like not to have to change the visibility of hidden staves manually when switching back & forth between edit and print preview.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 31-Dec-2000

Good touch. The editor window may display the hidden staves say, in different tone. A hide/show toggle button as mute/play one would also be a good supplement. I think this is a good wishlist item.


#1895: Music Composition Contests
Music Composition Contests

(1895)

Submitted by: Matt on 30-Dec-2000

There is a website where you can compete in music composition contests on the internet. You just have to submit your song in midi format. It just started so there isnt too much going on there but it looks like it will be cool.
Check it out the address is:

http://yourcontests.homestead.com/home.html

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 31-Dec-2000

"Opportunities for Composers"
http://www.radio.cbc.ca/programs/2newhours/composerstuff.htm


#1896: "The Messiah Project" complete!
"The Messiah Project" complete!

(1896)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Dec-2000

Just in time for the new millenium, "The Messiah Project" has been completed and is available for your enjoyment on the Scriptorium, http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ or jump direct to http://www.vadu.com/nwc/messiah.html

This has been a collaboration of several individuals:

Matt Johnson
Mark Anderson
A Christopher Hall
Richard Woodroffe
Grant Hicks
Carl Bangs

Kudos especially to Matt and Mark, who co-ordinated the project and sequenced the lion's share of the files.

This brings our number of files on the Scriptorium to over 500 (not counting the midi exports, WinAmp playlists, etc.) Concatenated "mondo midis" also available, as are zip files of all the NWC files for each section.

Thanks guys! You did a marvellous job, one that we can collectively all be very proud of.

Happy New Year to All!

Fred


#1897: Roland Sound Canvas vs. Audio PCI vs. Wingroove
Roland Sound Canvas vs. Audio PCI vs. Wingroove

(1897)

Submitted by: Mark E. Cloud on 31-Dec-2000

Hello, everyone!
I'm doing a comparison of the Audio PCI, (with the latest 4 meg waveset), Wingroove, and Roland Sound Canvas.
I have the Audio PCI, and the Wingroove. The Audio PCI blows the Wingroove away -- on certain instruments. It seems that Hiro (Wingroove creator) chose to augment more "pop" instruments (i.e. guitar), and these sound good on wingroove. I use mostly orchestral instruments, so the French Horn on the AudioPCI sounds worlds above the Wingroove. I don't, however, have any comparison with the
latest Roland Sound Canvas -- I'm speaking of the software wavetable emulation, not the sound card or the box.
Has anyone heard it? How does it compare with the Wingroove; The Audio PCI. I'm thinking of moving to a mobile notebook platform for the music I write. This would only be possible with a software emulation program like Wingroove or Roland. One used to be able to download a demo of the program, but that seems a thing of the past.
If anyone has some info about this product from Roland, please post or email and let me know. You might save me 70 bucks and some disappointment.

Mark

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Jan-2001

The VSC (the version I have) sounds pretty much like the DirectX Microsoft Synthesizer since the MSS is based on the Roland soundset.
I'm disappointed with the brass sounds but the latest version may be better.
If you're seeking a soft synth have you considered a Yamaha soft synth - I use an SyXG50 Nova Station version and that sounds better (for my needs) than VSC.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 01-Jan-2001

Just to add to Barry's comments: DirectX 8 is out now, and unless my ears are seriously playing tricks on me, they've improved the sound considerably from DX7 (perhaps a higher sampling rate?). And yes, the sounds were directly lifted from the Roland SC sounds. The only drawback is that for Win95 you need to use a dedicated DirectMusic midi player, since the "Microsoft synth" doesn't show up in the list of available devices. (AFAIK it /does/ show up in Win98). So there's the completely free (and legal) way for you to sample the Roland sounds. (I actually used this soundset in one of my published tunes, "Lachrymosa")

I personally really like the Yamaha XG sounds, and the SYG50 soundset sounds almost indistinguishable from my dedicated XG firmware card.

Reply 3 offered by: Mark Cloud on 01-Jan-2001

Barry, Fred,
I just downloaded and tried the Yamaha softsynth S-YXG50 from the Yamaha web site. Again, for "pop" and modern synth sounds, it sounds great. But the orchestral sounds --the French Horn, Brass, Strings, etc. sound very inferior to the AudioPCI. Have you ever heard it? This might help you understand. I will post a .mp3 file on my web site today of one of my orchestral compositions that will show you what I currently have. The thing I'm looking for is a better flute, maybe some punchy brass, but the AudioPCI French Horn is great. If they have improved the XG, that may make a difference. I'll check into that.
Give me some time to post that .mp3...have a listen if you don't mind and tell me what you think. :)

Reply 4 offered by: Mark Cloud on 01-Jan-2001

The .mp3 is online with the midi files, now. BTW, my site is listed in the Noteworthy User sites, but here it is anyway:

http://www.geocities.com/mcloud10

then follow the links to the midi files.

Mark

Reply 5 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 07-Jan-2001

I think the Audio PCI French Horn is great (but only on the 4 Meg waveset, not 2 meg)! I have a SB Live! now, but the French Horn on the 8 Meg Soundfont bites. :( The tuba sounds better, though.

Reply 6 offered by: Bob Boren on 16-Jan-2001

I bought the latest copy of Roland's Virtual Sound Canvas. I bought it mainly because I have not had much luck piping the sound from by SC-88VL (sound canvas box) into my sound card to allow me to convert to wav files. I wanted to be able to put my compositions onto audio CDs. VSC does have the capability to save directly to WAV from within the program, and it's pretty slick.

Sound quality - it's way better than Wingroove (at least the version I had about a year and a half ago), but it's a far, far cry from my SC-88 box. The strings and most of the woodwinds sound OK; the brass and kettle drums are not what I would call acceptable. Also, you can only have 16 voices, not the 32 that I can get with my SC-88.

I found a way around my cd-creation problem. I picked up one of the new Philips shelf stereos that has a cd-recorder built in. I connected that to my SC-88 via gold cables and now I am getting very good recordings. It's not the "cheap" solution, but it works well for me, and gives me a good system to play back my music as I'm composing. The Philips unit costs around $500.

By the way, I've not heard any sound card or "virtual" sound generator that comes close to my SC-88. When you buy these things new they cost quite a bit (the newest version from Roland is almost $900). There is a good re-sale market on these things. I bought my SC-88 used a couple of years ago for just under $200 out the door, including both Midi and serial cable adapters. It works with either my laptop or my desktop. The sounds are very good, and highly adjustable.

Reply 7 offered by: Michael Scully on 02-Mar-2001

What exactly is "Virtual Sound Canvas"? It sounds like software. Where do you get it? I've been searching Roland's website (rolandus.com) and I don't see it.

Thanks.

Reply 8 offered by: Bob Boren on 02-Mar-2001

Virtual sound canvas is a software program. It's made by Roland but sold by a company called "Edirol". You used to be able to find the sound canvas stuff (hardware and software) on the Roland site but a while back they moved all of it to the Edirol site. I think Edirol is a subsidiary but I'm not sure.

Virtual sound canvas is pretty cheap (under $50). I uses a similar sound set to the Roland Sound Canvas hardware, but as I said in my previous message the software's sound quality is not nearly as good as the hardware.

Reply 9 offered by: Prashant Vaibhav on 05-Jan-2002

Ok so the soundcanvas might be real cool for MIDI, but considering the price, I see no reason to use it. I have SBLive! and I'd rather download the Roland SC88 soundfont off hammersound.net and load it into my soundcard. It sounds REALLY good that way (talk about 8-point interpolation!). Also, you can use any kind of instrument for MIDI using soundfonts. That's why I chose SBLive instead of yamaha's SW1000XG. I have bought yamaha s-yxg50 (and have tried s-yxg100) which sound very different from roland but since both of these companies are those which set standards, just about ANY midi file rocks on yamaha. the sound quality isn't too good for the yamaha softsynth but it's okay, esp because it effectively emulates the XG effects etc. Anyway, I think a yamaha XG and Creative SBLive is a much better combination than roland's external sound modules. of course if you compose your music especially for a particular synth, even wingroove (and it's 1 mb waveset) can sound awesome (like those sample MIDIs made by Hiroki himself.)


#1898: Sound card help!
Sound card help!

(1898)

Submitted by: Richard Longhurst on 01-Jan-2001

hi everyone!

I was in PC World today, looking at some soundcards. There was one with something like 2mb hardware wavetable, and 264 voices and 21 drum kits or something like that. If I buy this card, are the instruments in programs such as NWC, Cubase and Cakewalk going to sound realistic now? at the moment I have a sound blaster 16, and the instrument sounds are not very authentic. thanx for your help!

R.L

Reply 1 offered by: Mark Cloud on 01-Jan-2001

Richard,
Well...some of the NWC users like the XG from Yamaha, some, (like me) prefer the AudioPCI, but you have to have a PCI slot in your computer (the 4 meg updated set is the best). Let's see...there is the Sound Blaster Live! and Live! Value, (which support sound fonts), and then there is
the AWE series from Creative, also (These may support sound fonts, too). I haven't heard the Roland Sound Canvas yet (which is the inquiry of the previous post), nor have I heard the new Voyetra/Turtle Beach Sound card that Dell computers installs as its premium sound card.
I suppose it depends on what you want to do with it --
Midi, .mp3, .wav? You may want to search the archives...others have answered this question before. I hope this helps without confusing the issue. There are a LOT of cards and options out there!

Mark

Reply 2 offered by: Mark Cloud on 01-Jan-2001

Richard,
Sorry, I forgot to add the main thing I wanted to say...
The sound card's ability to sound realistic is dependent upon the Wavetable quaility of the card. For example, the PCI from Trident has a 1.0, 1.5, 2.0, 4.0 and 6.0MB wavetable option in its setup. The more MB, generally, the better the sampling of the instrument sounds, hence better quality music. Trident's 6.0MB wavetable, however sounds very cheap compared to the AudioPCI 4MB table(dated 12/97).
Most manufacturers of Sound cards seem to cater to the users that like more modern music forms. The Yamaha S-YXG50 software wavetable (which uses your existing sound card, but processes midi through its own wavetable) sounds better than the AudioPCI in its bundled samples, which is more contemporary music (hip-hop, jazz, etc.). It doesn't do justice to the Brass instruments such as the French Horn, Trumpet, etc.
Roland does also make more expensive midi units that plug via a USB plug into your computer, and don't forget that you can purchase a full blown professional keyboard that has great sounds. If you're like me, that option is too expensive.
'Nuf said, I'll shut up. Shop around first, before you buy!! :)

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Longhurst on 01-Jan-2001

ok I have a budget of between £30-£40... I dont require professional results, I just want the drums to sound like drums instead of cardboard boxes in NWC and other MIDI programs :-) So the more MB the card has, the better quality of sound, or the more voices available? I currently own a soundblaster 16 soundcard, and the instruments are not very authentic.
What I want to do is...

1) create a song track by track in a program such as cubase or cakewalk using my MIDI keyboard
2) Save the song as a midi, then convert to a WAV file
3) convert WAV file to MP3 format

I know how to do each of the 3 things above, but with my current sound card, the instruments are not very satisfactory. Will the sound card I saw which cost about £35 which had 2Mb wavetable suffice for me? bearing in mind I dont want professional results, just instrument sounds that sound similar to the ones on my Yamaha PSR 270 keyboard which I am more than happy with.
Thanx for your help everyone!

R.L

Reply 4 offered by: Mark Cloud on 01-Jan-2001

Richard,
Creative sells the identical card that I use, but they now call it the Creative Ensoniq PCI card. It uses the same basic type of wavetables that I use, and, as a matter of fact, the creative and Ensoniq people updated the Audio PCI I have so that the driver I use on my systems shows to be a SoundBlaster PCI 64 card. You can check it out at:

http://americas.creative.com/sound/ensoniq/

and by the way, the card is just $29.99 (USDollars)

The only thing is that Ensoniq claims that the wavetables for the new Creative card isn't exactly the same as the original Audio PCI card. Go figure with the updates and all. It should suit your needs. You'll need a PCI slot, though. Hey! I use mine to record .wav's and convert to .mp3 files. You can hear what my card sounds like by going to:

http://www.geocities.com/mcloud10

Then follow the links for the midi files. You will find the first entry to have an optional .mp3 file. Download it and you'll get a pretty good idea of what the card sounds like.

Mark

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Jan-2001

The SB16 is a very old card these days.
The FM synthesis on these cards was OK in the early days of computer sound but it lags far behind now.
I would think the SB Live Value or OEM version is the best way to get the sounds YOU want - not those the manufacturer provides.
If you don't like the sound you can download soundfonts from 2 - 90Mb that take upto half your system RAM and you can down load them free from Tommy Hammer's site.
The problem with wavetable cards (I may be wrong)is that you are stuck with the card sounds and limited with the size of the wavetables.
Soundfonts are the way to go.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Jan-2001

Barry wrote: "The problem with wavetable cards (I may be wrong)is that you are stuck with the card sounds and limited with the size of the wavetables."

Essentially correct, in that the sounds are on ROM and cannot be changed. However, to use mine as an example, there are some 600+ sounds available -- and to be quite honest, I haven't even heard them all in over two years of owning the thing. Add the convenience (turn on the computer, it's all there; no loading soundfonts or any such thing) and I'm still glad I opted for the firmware variety.

Another thing to consider is that SBLive-type cards use system RAM for the sound fonts - so if you've got "just enough" RAM right now, you'll have to get more in order to make use of those nice 32 meg etc. soundfonts. So that $99 easily becomes $199...

Reply 7 offered by: Art Thompson on 02-Jan-2001

Actually, RAM is really cheap right now, so now's the time to upgrade if your running a paltry 32 or 64 MB. My question is: there are so many SBLive cards out there that I'm confused. I've heard you talk about them in previous threads, but what's the difference? I saw an SBLive "Value" for $48, and a "platinum 5.1" or "pro" or something like that for $200. It boggles the consumer brain. Your expert opinions, please.

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-Jan-2001

By no means an expert opinion but....

If all you want is to be able to access good soundfonts for playback the cheapest version of the Live (value or OEM)is all you need.

If the software packaged with the more expensive versions attracts you go for that.

The expensive version comes with a front bay for plugs and includes digital output - if you need that.

Again - if it's only the sound that interests you then you gain little by spending more.

Check out the alt.music.midi and comp.music.midi archives for lengthy discussions on this topic.

In Australia at the moment the Value card sells for around $90AUS ~ (around $50US).

Reply 9 offered by: Richard Longhurst on 03-Jan-2001

whats the difference between voices and instrument sounds regarding soundcards?

thanx :-)

R.L

Reply 10 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Jan-2001

Unfortunately, there is not a standard nomenclature that is used by all manufacturers. However, the term voice is often used to describe how many simultaneous instruments or sounds can be produced at one time by the synthesizer. For example, a 32 voice synthesizer will generally support 32 simultaneous notes when a pure instrument patch is select (overlapping or layered sounds might consume more voices). Another example would be if you play a simple C Major triad through a synthesizer, this would typically be referred to as using three voices of the device.

The instrument sound is the type of sound that is used by the synthesizer to play a note. This is also referred to as a sound patch, and to confuse things, will occasionally be referred to as a voice.

Reply 11 offered by: Tarigan on 16-Mar-2001

I needed to know where I can down load free for trident soundcard driver?

Reply 12 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 16-Mar-2001

Have you tried http://www.windrivers.com ?

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Mar-2001

Or http://www.trid.com/videcomm/download/download.htm


#1899: Forum Status: Name and E-mail Cookie
Forum Status: Name and E-mail Cookie

(1899)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Jan-2001

If you had previously set your name and/or e-mail in a cookie, to be retrieved when you post in this forum, you will have to repeat the procedure. The system cookie for this mechanism expired at the end of last year, so your browser will ignore that information until you do it again.

You can repeat the procedure at http://www.ntworthy.com/cgi-local/nwui.cgi?form=setup or by clicking the Help link at the top of forum pages.


#1900: Wav
Wav

(1900)

Submitted by: Tom on 02-Jan-2001

Does anyone here know how to by any chance convert MP3 song into wav files if so please e-mail me at cox450@yahoo.com

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Jan-2001

Three ways that I know of:

1: Play the mp3 while recording it in a separate wav recorder application. The least desirable, since it will include any analog noise that your sound card may introduce. Requires full-duplex sound card (most are these days).

2: Use l3dec.exe (included in Fraunhofer's classic l3enc package). This is the approach I use.

3: Use WinAmp's DiskWriter output plug-in. I've also used this, it works well.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-Jan-2001

Try RightClickMP3 - (it's free).

http://execpc.com/MrShannon

Once installed all you do is right-click on an mp3 to convert to a wav file.

Or right-click on a wav file to convert to mp3.

For the latter conversion bitrates upto 320 kbps can be configured.

Reply 3 offered by: matthieu on 12-Jun-2001

hai,

i'm looking for the nullsoft diskwriter plug in but i don't seem to find it on the winamp page. Is there somebody who could tell me where i can find it or can email it to me? Thanks.

Reply 4 offered by: eric on 30-Jul-2001

to put a mp3 into a wav just take CDEX , its a powerfull and FREE program that i use to make my mp3 , you can anything you want with this program just by a simple click of the mouse , he got a friendly GUI


#1901: musical software
musical software

(1901)

Submitted by: pradeep bhatt on 04-Jan-2001

Hi,
I am a student of IIT first year computer science
I want to make a software which would take as input
notation file and play it in piano or any other instrument
This is to be done in indian classical music.
Can you help me I guess this software is a bit similiar to
networthy composer.
plz send in any kind of help
pradeep

Reply 1 offered by: Giuseppi Musico on 04-Jan-2001

I assume that your project is intended as a learning experience, because there are many products (including NWC) that already do the kind of thing you wish to do. This is an established technology.

If you want your program to accept "musical notation" as input, then you need to know that notation comes in a variety of formats. The output to an electronic keyboard would probably need to be MIDI.

Here is the catch: Output to an electronic instrument may not sound credibly similar to Indian classical music if the instrument's synthesizer does not include acceptable imiations of the instruments you choose. This is a problem that affects everyone. There are synthesizer programs that will run in your computer without an external instrument, and "sound fonts" that go with certain hardware and software to improve the sound quality.

There are many readers of this forum who have experience with the details, as far as music, perhpas not computer programming. BUT, you are asking for an on-line tutorial in a very complicated subject. That is not realistic. Rather than looking for information here, I suggest you simply take a course in electronic music, offered through the music department at your university. Even community colleges offer such a course, nowadays.


#1902: Repeat patterns
Repeat patterns

(1902)

Submitted by: Henry N on 04-Jan-2001

Hi all,
I'm trying to do the following tasks and can't figure out how, though I've searched thru the whole site (both online and offline) so please help.

1. For guitar, I'd like to play a chord in some certain pattern throughout the whole song, so right now I have to write chord members for each chord which is rather tedious, so I'm wondering if there's anyway, I could create a pattern with the first chord (say Am), then apply the same pattern for other chords in the songs (say Dm, or E7)

2. I'd like to do the same thing for bass.

3. I'm also looking for a tutorial/instruction on how to create the drum sounds. I've tried the drum sample then copy-n-paste the sounds I like onto my active staffs, but I'd like to find out the right way to do it.

Your help is much appreciated :) Thanks.

--Henry

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Bacher on 04-Jan-2001

I'm presuming that you're creating the guitar chord patterns by notating the notes and chords explicitly.

You can create the pattern you use for a measure's worth, or whatever, of the D chord; then select it with the mouse and then paste it repeatedly. To make another chord, select the pasted sequence and use the Control, Shift and arrow keys to move the notes up and down; then apply accidentals as appropriate.

Hope this helps a bit.

- seb

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 05-Jan-2001

Please explain more "play a chord in some certain pattern"


#1903: How can I get a tril?
How can I get a tril?

(1903)

Submitted by: James Koenig on 04-Jan-2001

In the moonlight midi example that comes with note worthy there is a tril at a bar around 30 or so. How can I get one in my own work?

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 04-Jan-2001

The trill symbol is available within the boxmarks font, which is available at the scriptorium.

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

You can install this as a user font under page setup-fonts tab. You will find many useful musical symbols within boxmarks. To get a correct sounding playback for trills, you must also use a hidden staff, which is an exact copy of your visible/print staff, except that the trilled notes are written out as sixteenths/thirty-seconds, etc... The hidden staff is the one you want to play, while the visible staff should be muted. To see how this was done in the example, go to page setup-contents tab. You can do the same buy naming any staff you want hidden as "hidden" in the staff properties-general tab.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Jan-2001

See msg #1075, msg #434, msg #632


#1904: Flats, Sharps, Accidentals...
Flats, Sharps, Accidentals...

(1904)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 05-Jan-2001

Hi everyone! Hope you enjoyed your holidays.
I would like to ask a few questions, from which I have got too many answers and my mind is baffled.
When you place, say a # sign on a G note, to make it G sharp,
1. Does it remain sharp for the rest of the score until an accidental sign appears

or...

2. I remains sharp only within the same bar, as NWC does...

Also, what special cares do you consider one should have regarding enharmonics, in order for the performer to read easiest?
Thanks so much for your help.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 05-Jan-2001

An accidental outside of the key signature is considered to be in effect only during the current bar. That being said, it is common practise to explicity show the return to the key signature in subsequent bars using a "courtesy accidental". For instance, if you're in A minor (no sharps or flats) and have a G# in one bar, all the following G notes at that octave will be understood to be G#. If there is a G (natural) in the next bar, or even a couple bars later, a courtesy natural would usually be added as a reminder that we're back in the key signature.

One fine point: Technically, especially in older scores, an accidental was considered to apply to those notes in all octaves, which is how NWC behaves. However, in more recent times it has become standard practise to explicitly indicate naturals in other octaves. When using NWC, it's good to keep this in mind; for instance, if there is a G# on the second line from the bottom of the treble staff, and another one at the top of the staff, you would mark the second one with a sharp also.

Enharmonics depend on the "key of the moment". For instance, if you're in A minor, G# would be usually be spelled G# instead of Ab because G# is the "leading tone" (the 3 of the dominant E major chord). However, if you're in C minor, it would more likely be Ab, since Ab is the 3 of the subdominant (F minor). In other words, there is no "magic bullet", you have to look at each situation and figure out what's happening harmonically.

In chromatic runs, it is standard practise to use sharps going upward, and flats coming down. This minimises the number of accidentals required.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 05-Jan-2001

I had a few problems getting used to that NWC convention mentioned in Fred's #2 paragraph. It can get complicated when you have a lot of chromatics,thick harmonies, hidden staves, etc.
The courtesy accidental is often in parentheses. Tough to get lined up right in NWC. A nice addition to version 2??......

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 05-Jan-2001

Fred wrote:
>>In chromatic runs, it is standard practise to use sharps going upward, and flats coming down

Even this is dependent on context. Normally diatonic pitches are used where possible. For example, in C minor an ascending chromatic run would still use E-flat, A-flat and B-flat rather than D-sharp, G-sharp and A-sharp. Also, the leading tone in a minor key is spelled as a sharp seventh (e.g., G-sharp in A minor) rather than a flatted tonic (e.g. A-flat in A minor). This is also generally true of the leading-tone to the dominant (e.g., F-sharp in C major or minor), which would be spelled as a sharp 4th rather than a flat 5th, even in descending runs.

The famous descending chromatic scale that ends the introduction to Beethoven's "Pathétique" sonata is an interesting case in point. The first part of this scale is played against a C-minor triad in the left hand, and consists of the C natural minor scale plus D-flat, B-natural, A-natural, F-sharp and E-natural. Then the left hand plays a dominant 7th on G, and as the chromatic descent continues, the D-flat is replaced by a C-sharp. So in this case, the context that determines note spelling is not even the current key, it's the current *chord*. (My interpretation of the C-sharp is that it's the sharped 4th of the G-major scale, which is used in preference to the flatted 5th of that scale.)

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Randall on 08-Jan-2001

Re: Fred's first paragraph.

Please can I put in a plea to writers to avoid curtesy accidentals other than in exceptional circumstances. I don't think I am alone in finding that they more often than not trip me up when I see them as I worry about whether I missed an accidental earlier in the bar or missed a key change.

Probably the only circumstances where I would find it better to have one than not are:

a) when a tied note with an accidental extends over a bar line and the same note occurs unmodified in the "tied into" bar. (In this case NWC would need an accidental as well - is this actually required by normal notation conventions?)

b) when an accidentalized note at the end of a bar is immediately followed by the same note un-accidentalised in the following bar.

Other than this, if I feel the need for a reminder, I can add an aide-memoir in pencil.

Stephen

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 08-Jan-2001

Stephen, I think you may have a less receptive attitude to courtesy accidentals than some other performers I know. It would be interesting to hear other opinions. Personally I rarely run into a courtesy accidental that I wish weren't there.

Of course, the problem would be drastically altered if it NWC supported the practice of enclosing accidentals in parentheses. This would clearly identify them as courtesy accidentals and spare you the worry about what you might have missed earlier. (It would also presumably spare them from the ravages of Audit Accidentals.)

In any event, don't forget that you can use that handy pencil to scratch out any accidentals you don't want to see.

Reply 6 offered by: Art Thompson on 10-Jan-2001

Like any convention, too much of a good thing is too much. Judicious use of courtesy accidentals are most welcome, And I can't think of a time where I've seen them over-used in published scores. Let common sense be your guide.If your reviewing your own music, and are not sure whether the accidental applies or not, then surely someone sight reading it might have the same question.

Reply 7 offered by: John Kavanagh on 15-Jun-2001

I agree with Art and Stephen. In fact, excessive use of courtesy accidnetals is not only sometimes confusing, I find
it kind of irritating - as if the copyist is patronizing me.
The conventional notation is perfectly consistent, and not hard to remember. I do like the convention of the accidental only affecting only one octave.

I may add a not to the wish list - I wish Noteworthy treated accidentals (and stemming) the way it treats beaming - i.e. if you change something manually it stays changed through clean-ups, refreshes, and transpositions. I don't know how many times I've transposed a minor-key peice and lost all the leading tones that I've manually changed from flats to sharps.

Reply 8 offered by: Jay on 23-Jun-2001

I am apparently of the very old school and find courtesy accidentals irritating. I also don't know when 'convention' changed for the accidentalizing of different octaves but have only noticed it in the last 10 years [or less] and find that it clutters things up more than clarifies.
Mostly in my own scores I have found that using established [older] conventions work fine unless the mode[scale] is unusual and then key signature doesn't help at all. In that case [Bartokian] key signatures in performance will neccessitate accidentals on all the notes so affected. BTW the transpose in Noteworthy is hopeless when using mixed key signatures.

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Jun-2001

I guess that makes me an "old schooler" also. I too find courtesy accidentals more of a distraction than a help, unless they're made smaller and in parentheses. Similarly, I prefer having accidentals assumed to apply to all octaves, when I see the accidental "repeated" later in the same measure on a different octave my feeling is "well, DUH!".

But on work that I publish I grin and bear it, putting in courtesy and repeated accidentals on octaves... the peer pressure thing, I suppose....

Fred

Reply 10 offered by: Peter Edwards on 25-Jun-2001

Jay,

Unless I've misread you you are claiming that the 'old' convention is that an accidental applies to all octaves.

That just isn't so!

I would guess (correct me someone) that it has always been the case that accidentals only applied to the line on which they were written. Before barlines became standardised of course accidentals would have to be repeated in any case. After barlines were introduced it would then have become accepted at some point that an accidental applied for the duration of the bar, but I've never seen an occurrence(not that I've looked exhaustively) of the accidental applying to a different octave in any older music, so I'd say that it has never been the convention.

Peter

Reply 11 offered by: Yves Grasset on 25-Jun-2001

I've only seen two "old" scores, original edition facsimile(s?) of Nicolas de Grigny's "Livre d'Orgue" and François Couperin's "Goûts Réunis", both works dating from the early 18th century. In both of them:

1. If you have, say, an "accidentally" sharped C, and then another C-sharp one octave higher, it's got an accidental sharp, too.

2. Both have, of course, bar lines, but if you have several notes on the same line in the same bar, all have got the accidental, not only the first.

3. If you have a C-sharp, and then a C right after the barline, it's got the courtesy accidental. (But it hasn't if it's in the middle of the bar.)

4. For key signature, the accidentals (?) are indicated at each appropriate place of the staff. E.g. a piece in G major would have sharps on the fifth line and on the first space.

HTH,

Yves


#1905: wanted:  transcriber
wanted:  transcriber

(1905)

Submitted by: Susan Michaels on 05-Jan-2001

I am looking for a person to transcribe already scored scored songs/words into Noteworthy from a variety of other formats for a book project. The project should be about 200 songs. If interested, please contact me at the above email address. Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: Virginia Sykes on 12-Jan-2001

Maybe. Depends on the time deadlines and money.

Reply 2 offered by: Alex Wallace on 09-Apr-2001

Hello Susan,

I'd like to know more about the kind of music you want transcribed. Also, please contact me and let me know more about the pay and weather you want any kind of reference.

Thanks,

Alex Wallace


#1906: arranging for orchestra
arranging for orchestra

(1906)

Submitted by: charli 2na on 08-Jan-2001

I wrote a song, a slow, hard-rock, ballad mix, and I thought it would sound good as an orchestra piece. Does anyone know any sites that could help me arrange it, because I've never done anything like this before and what I have at the moment sound very dull.

thx

Reply 1 offered by: Paul C. on 09-Jan-2001

This is beyond just a NWC problem. You need to study orchestration. You need to know the ranges of instruments, their tone in different ranges, how they sound mixed in various combinations.

I can advise no better book that Sounds And Scores by Henry Mancini. www.jazzbooks.com Comes with CD examples.

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 10-Jan-2001

See msg #1603 for a rich discussion on a related topic


#1907: solo part on piano score
solo part on piano score

(1907)

Submitted by: Rhiannon Schmitt on 08-Jan-2001

Is there a way to make the solo (descant) staff above the piano accompaniment part smaller than the piano staff? I want the piano part to include the solo part only as cues and need to shrink it to save space. I would ask my dad, Fred Nachbaur, for help... but, alas, his line is busy since he's on the net! Help!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Jan-2001

This cannot be done in NWC. All staff notation is the same size in each staff.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 08-Jan-2001

Although that cannot be done "in" NWC, it can be done "to" a WMF exported from NWC, if you own a drawing program capable of opening and editing a WMF like any drawn object.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Jan-2001

Hi Rhi! Nice to see you here. "Joe" has really the only solution to this, but be forwarned: it's fiddly. Especially since you essentially want to compress only in the vertical direction so that the time still lines up. You'll end up with a lot of little short fat notes unless you go to extraordinary effort.

Think you're best off to forego the cue notes staff...

Dad guy Fred


#1908: sb live 1024
sb live 1024

(1908)

Submitted by: Paul on 09-Jan-2001

I have just installed a SB live 1024. When I first installed it, I could play NWC files no problem (I started off with the Hallelujah chorus!). However, I now find I can't get any sound from NWC files.
I have reinstalled the program, everything works fine, the environmental audio, the live experience, the diagnostics. Midis play fine through audio hq and windows media player, but not noteworthy.
I have tried all combinations of devices, and set the options to "always" and "while playing".
Help!

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 09-Jan-2001

Have you tried this:

First of all, have a check on Start/Settings/Control Panel/Multimedia/MIDI.
The "single device" should be set to A: SB Live! MIDI Synth. Then open NWC and;

Tools/Options/MIDI; "Devices used by playback" should be in the following order:

1) MIDI Mapper
2) B: SB Live! MIDI Synth
3) Creative S/W Synth

[The SB Live! MIDI Out (C400) is used for external devices so it's not to be included in this list.]

Hth,
Ertugrul

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Jan-2001

Here are some links to help:

msg #1782 (reply 2): This is a different problem, but the solution is appropriate. If you can get play back to work from Media Player, then you can get play back in NWC by selecting the MIDI mapper device.

msg #921 (reply 2): If you have previously used more than one play device, this reply gives you something to think about. Your staff properties may also have the wrong device (or no device) selected.

msg #1664 (reply 6): If you cannot get MIDI play back to work at all, this is good advice.

See also: http://NoteworthyComposer.com/faq3.htm#playback

Reply 3 offered by: paul on 09-Jan-2001

Thank you both, I have now successfully got it to work with this help

Paul


#1909: Big City in NWC-format
Big City in NWC-format

(1909)

Submitted by: René Verhoeven on 09-Jan-2001

I urgently need an NWC-version of Big City (Tol Hansse). I have to add some strophes and remove the triple refrain at the end. I found a midi-version on the Internet but importing in NWC does not work (note duration is completely messed up, re-editing would take me to long).

Does someone out there have an NWC-version 'today' and, if so, could you please send it to me by e-mail ?


#1910: Pitch
Pitch

(1910)

Submitted by: Montgomery Arce on 11-Jan-2001

I just downloaded NoteWorthy Composer for testing purposes. By fiddling a bit now I pretty much know how to use it, although I presume there is much more to it.

My problem is the following, I have been composing piano pieces for years. Recently I entered the world of orchestration, and have handwritten scores for a symphony, based on a huge piano piece of mine, which I already entried in NWC. I turned out to sound much better than I thought.

I have heard that some intruments in an orchestra are transposed. I wrote, for instance, the trumpets, french horns, clarinets in regular notation. i.e. first line from the bass clef is G, second is B and first line from the treble clef is E, second is G and so on.
Is this right? I mean, will I get that very pitch from the performer?

THANX IN ADVANCE!!!!!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 11-Jan-2001

Here's the poop:

Yes, certain instruments transpose. That is, given a particular written note, they sound some other note instead. For example, the French Horn sounds a perfect 5th (7 semitones) lower than written. For example, when it encounters a written C, it actually plays the F below that.

(This is not quite a matter of having the lines and spaces of the staff meaning a different note, as you imply. Instead, we refer to "written pitch" and "concert pitch", and the notes as they appear on the staff have the same "written pitch" as a nontransposing instrument. For example, the bottom line of the French Horn's treble staff is still an E (in written pitch), but when the Horn player actually plays the note, it sounds an A (in concert pitch).

The way to achieve the correct transposition in NWC is to use the Transpose Staff tool, making sure to leave the "update staff playback transposition" box checked. For example, if you wrote for the Horn at concert pitch, you would transpose its written representation up 7 semitones (because the horn is written a 5th higher than it sounds), but you would want to introduce a corresponding playback transposition of -7 so that the staff continued to play back at concert pitch, which is what "update staff playback transposition" does.

The transposing instruments in the standard orchestra & band are:

Piccolo (sounds an octave higher than written)
Alto flute (sounds a fourth lower than written)
Cor anglais (sounds a fifth lower than written)
E-flat clarinet (sounds a minor third higher than written)
B-flat clarinet (sounds a major second lower than written)
A clarinet (sounds a minor third lower than written)
Bass clarinet (sounds a major ninth lower than written)
B-flat soprano sax (sounds a major second lower than written)
E-flat alto sax (sounds a major sixth lower than written)
B-flat tenor sax (sounds a major ninth lower than written)
E-flat baritone sax (sounds a major thirteenth lower than written)
B-flat bass sax (sounds a major sixteenth lower than written)
French Horn (sounds a fifth lower than written)
B-flat trumpet, cornet & flugelhorn (sound a major second lower than written)
D trumpet (sounds a major second higher than written)
E-flat trumpets and cornet (sound a minor third higher than written)
E-flat bass trumpet (sounds a major sixth lower than written)
B-flat bass trumpet (sounds a major ninth lower than written)
B-flat euphonium (sounds a major ninth lower than written, if in treble clef)
Glockenspiel (sounds two octaves higher than written)
Celesta (sounds an octave higher than written)
String Bass (sounds an octave lower than written)

It's worth noting that the correct notation for the octave-transposing instruments is to avoid NWC's "octave up" and "octave down" clefs and use regular clefs with -12 or +12 semitone transpositions instead.

Reply 2 offered by: chris on 11-Jan-2001

Many of the wind instruments are not in the key of C/concert pitch. It would take a fairly long response to cover all of the transposing instruments, and even then, there are some variations. Your best bet is to get a book on orchestration, which will not only tell you how to transpose for the needed instruments, but will also show the ranges and best ways to write for the various instruments. There are several previous discussion threads dealing with this. Some more recent ones are:
msg #1906
msg #1847
msg #1603
If you haven't already done so, there is more on this at the scriptorium http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ and at the newsgroup (there is a link on the site map). You might also want to download the offline version of the forum where there are many other discussions and suggestions on this.

Reply 3 offered by: David Potvin on 29-Jan-2001

To REALLY simplify everything that could be said about that, here's just about the best way to decipher transposing instruments:

When it is said that you have a Bb trumpet, it means that when the trumpet plays a "C", you'll hear a concert Bb! A F French Horn, when it plays a "C", you hear an F!

So, an "X" instrument, when playing a C - always plaing a C - will give you an X!!! Eb Alto Sax plays a C, it's an Eb!

Why bother with endless lists of instruments and interval differences when it's so easy to make a mistake of a minor third down or up?!? THIS is the best way! Use it myself, never been fooled!

Good luck!

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Jan-2001

Your system has one problem; is the Eb instrument transposed a minor third up, or a major 6th down? This is where relative intervals are completely unambiguous.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 29-Jan-2001

David,

I think just about everybody goes about it the way you do, i.e., an instrument in key X plays the pitch X when it plays a written C. However, there are at least two ways in which this is insufficient:

1) (the one Fred's already pointed out:) *which* X? The one immediately above, the one immediately below, the one in the octave below that? Take a look, for example, at the entries for B-flat soprano sax, B-flat tenor sax and B-flat bass sax in my original response. It's certainly true that they all play a B-flat when they encounter a C, but it's not the same B-flat, and it makes a difference.

2) There are some instruments which, under traditional notation, transpose differently depending on which clef is used. In scores from the 19th century and earlier, French horns are written a fifth higher than concert pitch when the treble clef is used (this is also modern practice), but when the bass clef is used they're written a fourth *lower*. An even weirder practice is still found today in notation for the B-flat euphonium, which can either be written at concert pitch (i.e., non-transposing) in the bass clef or a major ninth higher (transposing) in the treble clef.

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-Jan-2001

Ah, if music were easy, everyone would be a musician.

As I am fond of asking my choir director, "B#, Cb, what's the difference?"

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 29-Jan-2001

About $1.00.

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen Randall on 30-Jan-2001

One complicating factor is that for some instruments a note name is used to specify the size as well as the transposition (sometimes). For example, tubas come in many varieties. Orchestral players probably use F or C tubas most frequently; concert band players most often use Eb or Bb (actually double Bb abbreviated as BBb); brass band players use Eb and BBb almost exclusively. The sizes go smallest - F then Eb then C then BBb - largest. The name refers to the pitch of the fundamental note. In general, orchestral parts are written in concert pitch using bass clef. An F tubist would play the same pitch as a C tubist using a different fingering/harmonic combination and the choice of instrument is up to the player.

In Concert band parts there are occasionally different parts for BBb and Eb instruments (particularly in late 1800s, early 1900 pieces) Where the composer wants to use the different "weight" of sound from the two instruments - but both would be written in bass clef at the pitch that the instruments sound. In most cases only one bass clef part is provided and the choice of instrument is up to the player - again the fingering/harmonic combination to achieve a particular pitch will depend on which instrument is played.

For brass band parts, the Eb and BBb instruments would have separate parts, both using treble clef; the Eb tuba would be written transposing down a major 13th (written middle C sounds Eb below the bass clef), whereas the double Bb would be transposing down a major 16th (written middle C sounds Bb below the bass clef). In this case the fingering/harmonic combination is identical for any particular WRITTEN note. The pitch of the note that comes out, however, will depend on which instrument is playing it.

HTH

Stephen Randall (part time BBb tubist).


#1911: Alesis QS7 keyboard & recording
Alesis QS7 keyboard & recording

(1911)

Submitted by: Chris on 11-Jan-2001

I am a new NWC user, who is trying to get it to accept input from an Alesis QS7 keyboard. We bought the Alesis cable to go from the back of the QS to the DB25 connection on the back of the Pentium computer. As I understand that, it doesn't really go through a soundcard at all. Is that why I am having such trouble trying to get NWC to recognize notes from the Alesis? Playback works great through the Alesis, but I can't seem to get NWC to record from it. Any help would be much appreciated! Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Jan-2001

In Tools --> Options --> Record you need to select the input device. This is in a pull-down box which shows all your available devices. One of them should say something like "[your sound card] MPU-401" or "... MPU Midi In" or something to that effect. This is the midi input via the 25-pin joystick/midi port on your soundcard.

If still no go, check your keyboard's manual to insure that you have it set to output midi signals via its MIDI OUT jack. Try turning LOCAL on / off, that really shouldn't matter but it's something to try.

Finally - the obvious - you've got the MIDI IN of the cable connected to the MIDI OUT on the keyboard?

HTH,
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Jan-2001

This sounds more like a "To Host" cable than a MIDI cable. For those that do not know, many keyboard manufacturers have added direct serial port access to their MIDI functions. This eliminates the need for a full MIDI setup on the computer. Normally, PC "To Host" cables are DB9 female on the PC end, and DIN 8 on the keyboard end, and are based on RS-232C serial port communication to and from the PC. The pertinent HOSA cable can be seen here:

http://www.hosatech.com/DBK100.html

The keyboard in question does support a "To Host" serial connection:

http://www.alesis.com/products/qs71/

Chris, if this is news to you, you probably want to take a little time to review your Alesis documentation and learn about this connection. I assume Alesis documents this port and its capabilities. If you don't find detailed information on this aspect of your Alesis keyboard, here are some things you need to consider when setting this system up:

- you must have the proper serial cable connected between your PC and the Alesis

- if this is a secondary PC serial port, you should make sure that it is enabled (usually set in the PC bios)

- you need to install the Alesis serial driver for this connection: http://www.alesis.com/downloads/software/serial_driver/

Once this is done, according to the Alesis web support page, the new driver for this serial port will be named "Alesis Serial MIDI Driver Out" within the system. You should be able to select this in NWC from Tools | Options | Midi.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Jan-2001

Upon reviewing your original post, I see that you indicate that play back is already working. If this is the case, then it is likely that your serial port is functioning and you have the necessary MIDI driver installed. When setting up record in NWC, you need to:

- select the correct input device driver from Tools | Options | Record

- set Tools | Options | Midi | Port Usage to either "While Active" or "Always"

- open an editor window

- activate Tools | MIDI Input Active

- press and release a key on the MIDI keyboard

If you do not see a note show up in NWC, then the note was not received by NWC. This usually implies a setup problem, either on the PC or in tyhe keyboard. You should first check your Alesis docs to see if MIDI output (from the keyboard to the PC via the serial cable) is controlled somewhere in its setup as an optional capability. If you are sure this is setup right, then it would probably be a good idea to check the driver setup configuration, as described in the help text.


#1912: looking for Classic Rock Songs
looking for Classic Rock Songs

(1912)

Submitted by: Nathan on 12-Jan-2001

Hello, I've tried looking through the web-ring and other search engines, but I can't find any Classic Rock songs that I want.

I'm looking for Styx "Come Sail Away", and Journey "Don't Stop Believing", both for Piano

If you have one of these two files please e-mail me or leave a URL on this post.

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 13-Jan-2001

I don't know if these are the files you are looking for, but I found "Come Sail Away" at http://theduchess.simplenet.com/music/comesailaway.mid and "Don't Stop Believing" at http://www.zianet.com/jw_laurie/Sounds/dont_stop_Journey.mid. They may not be piano, but with a little touch up in Noteworthy, you can make a convincing piano score (?)

Reply 2 offered by: Swami on 13-Jan-2001

Journey has a midi page at http://journey.simplenet.com/journey/sounds/midi/index.html. It contains two versions of "Don't Stop Believing." There are a total of 16 different versions of that song in Midi format. You can try the Styx song at http://www.groovynet.com/groovycards/midi/

Reply 3 offered by: Josh Hampson on 22-Apr-2001

Get Napster. It's not that hard to find them.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 23-Apr-2001

Napster only has mp3 files NOT MIDI!


#1913: How to delay the start of an embedded midi?
How to delay the start of an embedded midi?

(1913)

Submitted by: Swami on 13-Jan-2001

I would like my midi to continuously loop, but to start only
after a 5 second pause. This is the code I'm using, but it
doesn't work:
<EMBED SRC="http://mylocation.com/mymidi.mid"
ALIGN="RIGHT" WIDTH="0" HEIGHT="2" autostart="true" volume="80" loop="true" delay="5" hidden="true"><NOEMBED>
Can anyone tell me what I'm doing wrong?
Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2001

Where did you get the idea that a DELAY parameter is supported in this way when embedding MIDI files? We have not seen any documentation on a DELAY parameter, so cannot offer any assistance.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2001

The EMBED tag is documented well for Netscape at:

http://developer.netscape.com/

The DELAY parameter is not an official poarameter, but could be optionally supported by a plug-in. Since you are embedding a MIDI file, support for a DELAY parameter would have to be provided by the user's MIDI player invoked by the browser. I have not seen such a parameter documented by MS or Netscape.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 17-Jan-2001

Your other option maybe to use a sequencer to add five seconds of 'space' at the beginning of the midi file.

Rich.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jan-2001

Except that this would introduce the delay during looping also.

Hey, I have the solution, go back to a 33.6 modem like I have. Then everything will take at least 5 seconds to load! :)

Reply 5 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 17-Jan-2001

I thought a delay on looping was also required

R.


#1914: crescendo, chord, compressed rests
crescendo, chord, compressed rests

(1914)

Submitted by: franman on 13-Jan-2001

I am considering registering this program, but I have a few questions. Can NWC make crescendos like
________
<________ ?

Can NWC do chords?

and finally, can NWC do compressed rests such as |----2---|

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Jan-2001

> Can NWC make crescendos like ________ <________ ?

Yes, with a suitable "user font" such as "Crescendo" (available at the Scriptorium, http://www.vadu.com/nwc )

> Can NWC do chords?

Yes.

> and finally, can NWC do compressed rests such as |---2---|

Yes, again using a suitable user font (in this case "Boxmarks", also available at the Scriptorium).

Looking forward to welcoming you as a new registered user! :)

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 14-Jan-2001

THANK YOU! I have downloaded both fonts!

What I should have asked about the chords is how to make them besides creating a text box....

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 15-Jan-2001

I too need some help on chords, although I know you can't actually link them automatically to the music, so a text expression is as close as you can get.

The problem is that (AFAIK) you have to use two different fonts (and therefore two text expression) to produce a chord symbol like C#7 properly. The letter can come from an ordinary font, and the sharp and number from NWC, but it's all very fiddly.

Anyone got a good way of achieveing this?

Peter

Reply 4 offered by: Blair Dowden on 15-Jan-2001

The Bach font (link to it at http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Fonts
) contains both text and music symbols, so it should let you enter chord symbols in a single string. I have not personally tried it.

Reply 5 offered by: FranMan on 23-Jan-2001

Peter-

I found some tips from Fred Nachbaur in msg #1808 (reply 3)


#1915: 2 rhythms
2 rhythms

(1915)

Submitted by: charli 2na on 13-Jan-2001

Hey all,
This may sound strange but I wrote in this idea in 5/8 time, but I could easily tap a 6/8 rhythm over the top of it without it sounding stupid. I was wondering if
anyone knows how to write this in because I'm stumped on
how to do it. (Would this be something to do with
those triplet things that have a 5 instead of a 3?)

Reply 1 offered by: Art Thompson on 14-Jan-2001

DO the 5/8 eighths have the same duration as the 6/8 eighths, or does one 5/8 bar have the same duration as a 6/8 bar? In either case you'll have a rough go of it in NWC. I don't know how other packages would fare

Reply 2 offered by: charli 2na on 14-Jan-2001

I think I know a way it could be done. I could put it in 4/4 and have triplets on one staff and 5-lets on the other, but NWC doesn't do that, so I can't test it. Does that sound right?

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 15-Jan-2001

If you don't particularly care how it looks, you could set the time signature to 15/16 (or 30/32) and notate your 5/8 in units of 6 32th notes (dotted eighths) each and your 6/8 in units of 5 32 notes (eighths tied to 32nds) each. Since 6 * (dotted eighth) equals 5 * (eighth + 32nd), this will give the correct 5-against-6 sound.

By toying with invisible notes you might even get an acceptable looking score out of this, but I wouldn't count on it.

Reply 4 offered by: charli 2na on 16-Jan-2001

Thanks Grant, your method worked perfectly. It's no problem with way it looks cause I don't plan to print it any time soon.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 16-Jan-2001

I wrote: Since 6 * (dotted eighth) equals 5 * (eighth + 32nd)

Oops. I was wrong. 6 * (eighth + 32nd) equals 5 * (dotted eighth). But the idea is the important thing.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Jan-2001

Minor point - you don't even have to bother with inserting the oddball time signature; NWC doesn't care if you omit it, just be careful not to do a barline audit afterwards.

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 16-Jan-2001

That's true. I always put the time signature in and then hide it. The one advantage of doing this is that it allows NWC to honor the whole-rest-equals-one-measure convention in empty measures.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 22-Jan-2001

...and now what if you want a third voice that contain 4 equal notes within the same measure ?
Just count all in "first-common-multiple" of 4, 5, and 6, which is 60: now you just have to enter a 60/32 measure, with your "1/5"notes becoming 12 32th (which is a dotted quarter), the "1/6" are a 10 32ths, and the "1/4" 15. Ain't that simple :)
Guess only a computer can do this anyway. Except drummers of India maybe?
Nevertheless, you can get a sample of this technique at http://www.multimania.com/madmarsu/Nwc/4-5-6.nwc or
http://www.multimania.com/madmarsu/Nwc/4-5-6.zip .

Thank you Grant for that interesting funny thing !
Eric, could we have a 64th time sig. please?

Reply 9 offered by: charli 2na on 23-Jan-2001

You could still have 4 equal beats in 30/32 with dotted quavers tied to dotted demi-semi quavers, but it gets really messy when the lead and solos comes.

This would be good on a later version - bars with different meters being able to play at once and take the same amount of time. I've seen and heard it before.

Reply 10 offered by: Peter Edwards on 23-Jan-2001

Particularly 6/8 against 2/4.


#1916: Barbershop Quartet Songs
Barbershop Quartet Songs

(1916)

Submitted by: Rod  on 13-Jan-2001

Does anybody share an interest in Barbershop Quartetting using NWC as a learning tool?

Reply 1 offered by: Charley Garrett on 17-Jan-2001

Yes!!!! This is my main use of NWC. I enter all my BBS arrangements into NWC, using 4 staffs. Then I can overlap the staffs to have a pretty normal looking layout, but the main point is that I can control the volume or mute each staff independently. I use that feature to create (for my own use) voice predominant cassette tapes for me to play in the car, so I can rehearse as I drive.

My main hassle is to find the time to key the arrangements in. Do you have any hints to make that go any faster?

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Bacher on 17-Jan-2001

You can do virtually everything in NWC using the computer keyboard - you rarely if ever need to touch the mouse if you are a "power user". For example, using the PageUp and PageDown keys to move between staves is a real timesaver.

Copying and pasting similar passages, and then using the arrow/shift/control key combinations to make small changes, is another way to speed up entry.

After some time you can become real speedy at entering fresh scores, if you are a reasonable typist.

- seb

Reply 3 offered by: Sean on 18-Jan-2001

Many of the guys in the group I work with can't read music, and NoteWorthy has been a great tool for learning new music.
For decades, we have used part tapes as the preferred method of learning. This meant that at least four guys had to find the time to get together to learn the song well enough to commit it to tape. Now, with NoteWorthy, I can write an arrangement and e-mail it to everyone. Those who can't read can highlight their parts and still hear the complete arrangement. This makes actual rehearsal time much more productive.

Reply 4 offered by: Charles Shedd on 21-Jan-2001

I am a new user and Barbershopper. I have keyed in several songs and have found it to be an excellent learning aid.

One thing I can't figure out how to get the labels for tenor, lead, baritone and bass to print out in the layered format. The upper staff shows tenor and the lower Baritone. Any sugestions would be welcome.

Does anyone know if there is a source of Notworhty files for barbershop song?

Reply 5 offered by: Grimblefritz on 24-Jan-2001

Press F2 for staff properties, where you will find under the General tab a Name field. This can be printed before the first measure of the score (only measure 1, not first measure of each page.)

I also do quartet arrangements, plus full SATB arrangements for choir. I distribute my songs for members to playback using NoteWorthy Player; however, there are some things that are needed in the Player to make it truly useful as a practice device. See the following message thread for my suggestions, and please second the motion if you agree.

see msg #1925 (reply 3)

Reply 6 offered by: Grimblefritz on 24-Jan-2001

Charles, after reading your post more carfully :o I caught the layered part of it. Have you tried using text expressions in each staff, with preserve width selected, and placing the text adjacent to the first note?


#1917: Transposition and enharmonics
Transposition and enharmonics

(1917)

Submitted by: Messer Sagredo on 16-Jan-2001

Hi all!

I'm having trouble with transposition tools while working on MIDI files.

a) I open a MIDI file, and I first notice that, no matter what is its original key signature, it is always shown as a C-major key. Is that correct? With other notation applications I often get the correct key signature.

b) At this point all accidentals are obviously "odd".
Then, I apply "Force Accidentals", and change the Key Signature at the beginning of each staff.
After this, I apply the "Transpose Staff" with 0 semitones, always to each staff.
[I also tried to select the "Audit Accidentals" and use those options in all possible combinations]

c) However, the result is the same.
Enharmonic accidentals aren't always correctly placed.
Example:
- original score is B minor (# on F and C)
- after all those operations, I get every E# as a natural F.
Other example:
- original score is G minor (b on B and E)
- after Force Accidentals+Insert Key Signature+Transpose by 0 I get every F# as Gb

How can I better manage those enharmonic notes?

Thanks to everybody and greetings from Italy!

MS

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 16-Jan-2001

(AFAK) I don't think there is a way to fix your problem with the enharmonics... I'm sure others can suggest workarounds or maybe there is a solution, but I always have trouble with the leading tone as well (F# instead of Gb in g minor)

-joe

Reply 2 offered by: Messer Sagredo on 17-Jan-2001

Thanks Joe...I hope somebody can help me, at least I'm not the only one experiencing this problem.
Should I find any way to workaround the problem by myself, I'll post here the solution.

Ciao!

MS

Reply 3 offered by: Messer Sagredo on 17-Jan-2001

...but please my friends help me if you can!

MS

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Randall on 18-Jan-2001

We are discussing improvements to NWC's transposition capabilities on the NG. See the thread "Mary's Lamb and her Bear ..." We had a bit of topic drift! One strand of the thread has now been updated to "Improved transpositon (was Mary's Lamb ...etc)"

There are some suggestions there on how NWC could improve its transposition algorithm to get the spelling after transpoition nearly always right. If you think the ideas useful, please add your weight on the wish list.


#1918: Midi Input
Midi Input

(1918)

Submitted by: Mark on 16-Jan-2001

To make a chord, you have to hold down ctrl and then insert the note where you want it. However, this does not work when inputting with a midi keyboard. How can I input chords (with notes of different time-values) with my midi-keyboard?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Jan-2001

To enter a chord, you play a chord.

You cannot, however, enter a split-stem chord using a MIDI keyboard. This function can only be done with the computer keyboard or a mouse.


#1919: Best sound card...
Best sound card...

(1919)

Submitted by: Little Caesar on 17-Jan-2001

Hi, everyone!
I would like you to help me once again. How do I know which sound card am I using in my computer?
Whenever I use the laptop, I get a very realistic strings sound, and a crappy woodwinds voice. On the other hand, at home, in my PC I get an organ-like strings sound and a very realistic woodwinds and brass sound. Some pieces sound right in one while sounding horrible on the other, and viceversa. In some cases I get a reverse cymbal sound out of a tuba.

What is the best sound card for NWC, and how can I obtain it? (I'm very bad at hardware stuff)

Reply 1 offered by: Clive on 18-Jan-2001

Can't beat a SB PCI 64 or 128! Some would swear by SB AWE cards as well.

Leave the SBLive! alone in my opinion - I have it as well and it does not seem to simulate real orchestral sounds whatsoever!

Reply 2 offered by: Gordon Isbell on 18-Jan-2001

The SBLive! uses soundfonts, so if you have 128Mb of RAM or more, you can go to, for instance, Hammersound and download the best instruments individually or GM soundbanks that you ever heard. I regularly add or delete a soundfont with Vienna and create a soundbank that is perfect for the music I'm using.

Don't know about the other cards Clive mentioned; I only know I love my SBLive! It gives me the sounds I've spent years looking for!

Regards,
Gordon

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 20-Jan-2001

Clive,

If I understood you right, you say that Live cannot simulate orchestral sounds. May I ask, have you tried the 8 MB bank or may there be a problem in your speaker stuff?

Reply 4 offered by: Art Thompson on 26-Jan-2001

I just installed an SBlive on the advice of some of you folks. I think it sounds pretty decent, and I haven't got into the soundfont business yet. Real speakers are a must(keep them away from your monitor and floppies).
I played with Vienna - what a Gordian knot that is. The help is hypertexted to death, so you can't read more than 3 sentences on a page. Anybody know of a tutorial out there, or a manual? I'm just not getting something about the presets, pools, banks, etc.

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 27-Jan-2001

Vienna is for editing/making soundfonts and I agree that it isn't so flexible. You can found some alternatives among many other music software most of which are share/freeware and least executable demos at !www.hitsquad.com/smm

If you want to load and use existing soundfonts you don't need any Vienna or else. Just select "Sound Font" from "Audio HQ" and click "Load..."

If you are curious about where you can find existing soundfonts, !www.hammersound.net is the best place to start from.

Hth,
Ertugrul

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 27-Jan-2001

The links are;

http://www.hitsquad.com/smm
http://www.hammersound.net

Reply 7 offered by: Martin on 02-Feb-2001

IMHO, Live! is definitely the best sound card around. If you use the Reverb controller plus the Live! Concert Hall environment, it doesn't get much better. I admit the oboe's kinda crappy, but download the WT_Oboe soundfont, and you've solved the the problem. Live! forever!!

Reply 8 offered by: Art Thompson on 05-Feb-2001

Thank you Ertugral for the most useful reference.

Reply 9 offered by: Art Thompson on 08-Feb-2001

I downloaded a Cello font from Hammersound, and loaded it into my SBLIVE. I typed about 32 bars of Bach's D minor cello suite into NWC, and WOW. Like having Yo Yo Ma in my living room. Can't wait to try some classical guitar fonts. Any suggestions?


#1920: NWC above other similar softwares
NWC above other similar softwares

(1920)

Submitted by: Tardy on 18-Jan-2001

I just downloaded the shareware version of NoteWorthy Composer and I'm evaluating it in order to buy it but I'd like to know what made you guys choose it above similar ones like finale or allegro or anyother, thanks so much...

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 18-Jan-2001

For me it was initially based on price vs. functionality. I've stayed with NWC, however, instead of moving on to Finale or Sibelius mainly because of speed and ease of use. Just load the program and within seconds you can be entering notes, unlike the other mentioned programs that require extensive setup every time you use them.

There /are/ a few, more advanced scoring "devices" like multiplets, cross-staff beaming, beaming across barlines and things of that nature that NWC doesn't do (or at least doesn't do gracefully at this point in time) for which you'd need one of the high-end packages; however, I personally haven't had the need.

The best advice I can give is to give the programs that interest you some serious testing; this is the whole purpose of evaluation software. Like any tool, scoring programs and sequencers have to fit the user, not the other way around.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Eidson on 18-Jan-2001

As a long-time user of Noteworthy, the best feature is (IMHO) the speed that you can enter music.

I own Finale 2000 and Sibelius; both are great programs for professional use but have a much larger learning curve than NWC. For professional-quality printing/engraving, these are the two that I recommend. For quick and easy use, go with NWC.

I usually enter a score into Noteworthy first, then transfer it to Sibelius after I'm sure I have all of the mistakes out. :)

-joe

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 18-Jan-2001

I own or have access to several programs. My main application is layout of music for a choir, and extraction of MIDI for my own singing track. NWC gets me there so much faster and easier than the others. I don't need things like 5-tuplets. Other members of the choir tell me the same thing.

If I need to do anything fancy in terms of printing, I can open the WMF from NWC in a drawing program and edit it like any other drawing object.

Reply 4 offered by: Robin Withey on 19-Jan-2001

I'm with Fred on this one - it's value for money that makes Noteworthy my choice.

As a strict amateur, I can't justify spending several hundred pounds (or dollars) on music software. Also, being a totally crap keyboard player, I find sequencers too difficult to manage, and NWC is by far the best program I know on the PC for step-entry of music. (Actually, it doesn't quite match up to Sequencer One Plus on my old Atari ST, but that's buried in my attic somewhere).

With a few more features (which I have added to the wish list), it could be just the program I need. As it is, it's good enough, and better than anything else I've seen for my purposes.

Reply 5 offered by: JoelC on 19-Jan-2001

NoteWorthy has been the perfect supplement to Band-In-A-Box (BiaB), my primary song creation tool. I can export BiaB songs as MIDI and import them into NoteWorthy in short order. The first time I did this, having never used NoteWorthy before, it took about 30 minutes to import the song, add repeats, arrange the parts and staves, add the lyrics, and print the final arrangement.

I printed the output on a laser printer and submitted the finished work for copyright registration.

As you can see by other testimonials, this software is worth the investment even if you have other music notation software. It is intuitive, easy to use, well supported, well documented, and the perfect tool for songwriters.

Reply 6 offered by: Chris R. Lee on 19-Jan-2001

I agree with the previous replies, except that 5-tuplets, 13-tuplets and worse are an integral part of Beethoven's and CPE Bach's music.

Presumably, the basic architecture of Noteworthy doesn't lend itself to this function. It's a handicap, but not a very serious one.

Regards

Reply 7 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 20-Jan-2001

Most of what-to-be-said seems to be said but I can't stand :)

NWC is to be the number one from three viewpoints:

1) It's a two-in-one software. That's it generates scores not too lower in quality than those mentioned popular programs as well as it sequences midi probably more efficiently and powerfully than them and very little less than, say, Cakewalk. None of those famous, popular and expensive notation programs can handle such midi generation and of course vice versa. Recently, I don't even export my NWC's to midi unless I will use them as semi-products in CSound or else.

2) NWC is the easiest notation processor and midi sequencer to use. I had learnt entering music, adding staves, changing instruments etc. in minutes! Actually, NWC was the first ever notation software I had ever seen and neither Finale, nor Sibelius, Melody/Harmony Assistant, Lime etc. could ever beat that first impression on me.

3) NWC can have no close opponents on price/performance ratio. Don't forget the 2-in-1 point! Can you have Cakewalk for $20 and Finale for another $20?

On the other hand, I have to admit that NWC has serious gaps to fill on both wings. All four of the others, for instance, support microtonal accidental marks, a very prior point for me 'cos my music IS microtonal. One can say that I can supply those accidentals using a user font; yes, I've already been working on such a font, but how about including them in key signatures etc. And many more points some of which are already mentioned in or out the of the thread.

Going back to "for NWC" side, one point shouldn't be missed: the best user/customer friendly support (warmest thanks to Eric, Beth and the entire crew) and this community formed through the forum, newsgroup, consequently beyond, such as the Scriptorium. NWC is as far as I know the only software program formed and developed on users' direction and NWC community is a to-be-legendary space which draws its members higher and higher.


#1921: Differences between SB AWE 64 and AWE 64 gold?
Differences between SB AWE 64 and AWE 64 gold?

(1921)

Submitted by: Mark on 18-Jan-2001

What are the differences between SB AWE 64 and AWE 64 gold? Please help and thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jan-2001

I think this is best left to the manufacturer:

http://www.soundblaster.com/compare/compare.asp

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 18-Jan-2001

If you are thinking about buying, go a "Live" or "Live Value", depending upon your budget. I got an AWE gold once and promptly resold it. The "Live", however, is a good card.

Reply 3 offered by: JoelC on 19-Jan-2001

The AWE-64 Gold has gold-plated RCA stereo outputs, S/PDIF output capability, and 4MB of RAM on the card. I purchased the E-Mu music creation package that included the card, cables, and software including Cakewalk. This was a good purchase at the time, although there is no question that the Live! value is superior to this card, even though it lacks the gold-plating. However, if ISA is a must, the argument is moot.

The AWE-64 Gold allows you to expand the on-board memory to something like 28 MB. You need another 4MB (about $40) to match the SB Live! factory-supplied soundfont ability. Of course, the Live! allows much larger soundfonts to be downloaded and used.


#1922: lost file associations
lost file associations

(1922)

Submitted by: spoonman on 20-Jan-2001

This could be hard to understand.
I lost the association for .nwc files. So I re-associated them from the file types tab, but without any paramaters. Now when I open more than one from a folder, another instance of NWC opens and wont play.

So can someone please tell me what's in their "Open" action after Nwc32.exe

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Jan-2001

You need to re-run the setup program which installs NWC and sets up the file associations.

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 21-Jan-2001

There is nothing after Nwc32.exe, but then down below "Use DDE" is checked. The form is filled out with "DDE Message:" containing "[Open(%1)]", "Application:" containing "NWC32", "DDE Application Not Running" left blank, and "Topic:" containing "System". Good luck!


#1923: noteworthy to cd's
noteworthy to cd's

(1923)

Submitted by: joan on 21-Jan-2001

Please consider me at kindergarten level in computers (at best). I have several public domain songs taken from our church hymnal and written them Ito Noteworthy to experiment with arrangements. I want to transfer them either to tape or CD. I tried a song with .nwc extension directly into our stereo system, but that did not work. What additional software and hardware do I need? As I said, I know nothing.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Jan-2001

Joan - this topic has resulted in some of the longest threads in forum history. As you might guess from this, there are lots of different ways of accomplishing this, from the simple to the sublime.

But -- assuming that you have a tape recorder or CD writer on your stereo system -- probably the easiest way is to get a cable that goes from your computer to your stereo. This cable should have a "1/8" (3.5mm) stereo phone jack" on one end, and two "RCA plugs" on the other end. The little phone jack end plugs into your computer's sound card; either "line out" or "speaker out", depending on the particular card you have. The two RCA plugs connect to your stereo inputs, any of "Aux", "Line", "CD" will work. Once you've got this hooked up, you should be able to play any sound file from your computer through your stereo (including midis, NWC, mp3's, even the kids' game noises).

Once you've got that happening, assuming that your tape deck or CD recorder is set up to record from the stereo, you're home free. Set your recording levels, press "record" and start the computer playing whatever file you wish to play. Done!

HTH,

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Art Thompson on 22-Jan-2001

Be careful: if your sound card has a "speaker out", it may put out at levels that will blow up your speakers (and your ears). Always start with the Stereo and the PC volume all the way down, then turn the Stereo up to where you would normally have it. Then turn the PC sound up a fuzz, until you get an acceptable level.The PC volume might be much lower than you normaly have it for the PC speakers.

Reply 3 offered by: Grimblefritz on 23-Jan-2001

Joan,

I suggest you get the newest Virtual Sound Canvas from Roland -- the VSC-883H.

First, you get wonderful Roland sounds. Not as good as the Roland hardware, but better than most PC sound cards. Definitely better than most SoundBlaster cards.

Second, the new version has the ability to save MIDI output directly to .WAV files, which you can then burn to a CD or render to MP3 or whatever. Since the VSC has to render MIDI to analog anyway, there is no loss of sound quality. It simply saves the analog output to a .WAV file rather than just playing it.

Third, few if any PC sound cards produce even average sound quality when you attempt to record either their line or speaker outputs. There is quite a bit of noise. Ditto that for attempting full-duplex recording within the sound card.

The VSC is definitely the easiest solution -- and I've tried pretty much every option you'll find on this forum. And, it is the best quality I've found yet.

$60 from www.edirol.com (that's Roland's site, you might find it for a few $$ less elsewhere)

Also, don't think you can get a deal by purchasing the $29 VSC from PG Music, the Band in a Box people. They sell the 2.x version, which does not save to .WAV. You'll still have to spend another $30 to upgrade to the 3.x version.

Reply 4 offered by: Arnold on 20-Mar-2001

There is a great midi-tool, including a midi-to-wav converter called Timidity. You can download from

http://www.stardate.bc.ca/eawpatches/html/default.htm

It's a lot of data (21 Mb) because it uses its own midi-patches. Go to the mentioned URL, click "Getting TiMidity++", click the link "Easy TiMidity and Eawpatches installer & updater", click the link "Download the installer" and be patient, really patient. It takes a lot of time but it works perfectly. The site explains also why it is so difficult to convert midi to wav or mp3. You can also take a look at

http://www.goice.co.jp/member/mo/timidity/

Converting the WAV's to MP3 use MusicMatch Jukebox, WinAmp etc. ...

Have fun!
Arnold (from Holland)


#1924: beaming
beaming

(1924)

Submitted by: FranMan on 21-Jan-2001

Is there any way do beam notes so the result is something like this?
* *
__|_|
|
*

where star = note head, | = stem, and _ = beam

Please change the variable width in your browser to a mono spaced font to correctly see my beautiful drawing!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Jan-2001

NWC requires that all members of a beamed group have the same stem direction.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul on 20-Mar-2001

A very good question, because I have the same problem. Beaming notes in the way, you suggest is often used in scores for organ music (Bach for example). I suggest you put your request on the NWC wishlist.


#1925: Wishes...
Wishes...

(1925)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 23-Jan-2001

<quote>

Here I am again.

1) Microtonal accidentals. I have a solution for you :) Let's make it "including user defined text information in/as key signature" so that you won't have to design anything. In addition, for example, percussion clef will be applicable -as a user font character.

2)

A)Beams and triplets spanning barlines.

B) Beaming crockets and halves.

C) Beaming between different staves and between notes having contrast stem directions.

3) n-tuplets other than triplets.

4) More flexible text information on header section. This is important for, say, including subtitles for/of pieces.

I'll soon be back...

</quote>

Let's have fors, againsts and suggestions...

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 23-Jan-2001

I heartily endorse Ertugrul's suggestions, except possibly for one I don't understand:

2B) Does "crocket" mean "crotchet"? What would it mean to beam halves? How would you distinguish a beamed crotchet (quarter) from a quaver (eighth)? How would NWC treat these on playback?

When we're talking about improvements in beaming, let's not forget the ability to beam over rests. There are hacky ways to do this now but they're a royal pain and not always effective. From the NG I get the idea this would be a popular enhancement.

Along with more text flexibility, I'd like to see a standard slot for lyricist information in the File/Info; this should show up in a printout above the top staff at the left, opposite the author's name.

It would be nice if the user could have some control over the positioning and shape of slurs and ties.

Finally (?), I'd really like to see a fix to the long-standing bug whereby NWC allows the user to tie two notes of different pitch (e.g., C-sharp and C-natural). Judging from the Forum and NG, this has got to be the biggest time-waster in the whole product.

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 23-Jan-2001

<h1> 2C ... That's exactly what I need! </h1>

Reply 3 offered by: Grimblefritz on 23-Jan-2001

I'd second most of these. Not sure about beaming halfs and quarters, though.

I'd also like to see the ability to insert "decorative" slurs and ties (such as a dotted line tie when a lyric syllable is double in one verse, single in another.) I'd also like the ability to control slurs and ties by repeat -- in other words, apply the slur/tie in first pass, skip on first repeat, apply in second, and so on. Great for working out lyric timing.

Another great addition would be chording in some fashion other than the current "only two note durations, and they must be stacked" approach. The two note duration I can live with. But entering C major chord with C-G quarters and E-F walking eighths is a sorely lacking feature. Also, I'd like to be able to combine rests and notes, regardless of duration.

And on the NWC side:

1) Ability to click on a measure and play from there.

2) Ability to mute staves.

3) Ability to hide staves.

-- all of the above current NWC capabilities

4) Master volume slider built into the player.

5) Master tempo slider built into the player, range from 10% to 200% of scored tempo. Master tempo imposed as a percentage over the scored tempo setting(s).

6) A special NWP format that NWC can save to. Can be read by NWP but not NWC. Allows pieces to be published, but not read/modified, via the internet.

I do vocal arrangements (SSAA, SATB, TTBB, etc) and like to provide my singers with NWC scores and NWP to use for practice. The above items would greatly facilitate the use of NWP as a practice tool, and #6 alleviates many worries about "publishing" original works on the internet.

And, lastly, the ability to import/export NIFF. For me, especially to import. SharpEye music scanner is great, but of little value without some means (other than MIDI, which results in a less than desirable score) to import its output.

My two-cents worth.

Reply 4 offered by: Random Pavarotti Syndrome on 24-Jan-2001

1. Play in reverse, fast forward & rewind during playback.
2. Inverting\retrograding notes for 20th century music. Like flip-h and flip-v in images.
3. Beaming over a rest.
4. Random note generation via Ctrl+R or something like that.
5. Time sigs that change back and forth each bar without putting a new one in each time. 6/8<->4/4.
6. Customizeable beaming arrangemets for uncommon time sigs.
eg. 7/8 into groups of 4 quavers then 3 or 5 then 2.
7. In the goto box; anchors to Chorus 1, Verse 3 etc. a-la html.

Reply 5 offered by: Grimblefritz on 24-Jan-2001

Here's another one. Since layering is the only way to achieve certain effects, how about a keystroke (maybe the [ key?) to either 1) toggle layering on/off as in the page setup dialog, or 2) toggle layer with next staff on/off for the current staff as in the staff properties dialog? Or at least a menu option in View to do this.

Reply 6 offered by: FranMan on 26-Jan-2001

Grant -
How _do_ you beam over rests with those "hacky" methods you mentioned?

Reply 7 offered by: Angie on 26-Jan-2001

I hope all this leads to software that will produce shaped notes for sacred harp or the "stamps-baxter" singing school style note heads--and quickly!


#1926: No FTP! very important!
No FTP! very important!

(1926)

Submitted by: JG Stratton on 23-Jan-2001

Does anyone know were I can download Noteworthy composer from an HTTP not FTP? the computer I am using is on a network and wont allow anything that is FTP. Thanks for your help.

JG

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 23-Jan-2001

Don't know about that, but you can order and get a CD via mail at http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/order.htm


#1927: sites to submit
sites to submit

(1927)

Submitted by: Dave Grohl on 23-Jan-2001

Hi there! im currently working on transcribing a piece of music from a CD I have. When im finished I would like to submit it to some websites so that other people can learn to play the song if they wish. Does anyone know of any sites where I can do this?
Thanx for your help

- Dave

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 23-Jan-2001

A couple of preliminary thoughts.

1. Before doing anything with the song, you should determine whether it currently copyrighted (if someone other than you composed/created/performed it), and, if so, secure the requisite consent from the author

2. There are all sorts of sites to which one may submit music, including the NWC Scriptorium. Choices might depend upon:

(a) Format (midi? mp3? nwc? sheet music, other?)
(b) Genre (country western, rock & roll, rap, religious, etc.)

Once the appropriate type of site is determined, a search on the Web through one of the search engines could reveal the best potential sites for the work.

Reply 2 offered by: Nate Mendel on 24-Jan-2001

The mp3/midi music site on about.com leads to many other sites with users own interpretations of songs. But theres alot to look through, I'm guessing its Foo Fighters or Nirvana songs you've got, so there should be a few sites dedicated to these well known bands.

Good Luck

Reply 3 offered by: Dave Grohl on 24-Jan-2001

I want to submit the finished .NWC file.. people can then open it in noteworthy and print off the sheetmusic. The song is by Coldplay. I know of one site called www.oddrealm.com where people can submit their transcriptions of songs, many of which are in .NWC format.

Thanx for your replys :-)

Dave

Reply 4 offered by: someone on 27-Jan-2001

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/


#1928: Printing problem
Printing problem

(1928)

Submitted by: GJ on 25-Jan-2001

Hello.

Does anybody know how to set up a printer so that when you have a song that you have written that has two staves and is 2 pages long, but for some reason, you just can't seem to get it to print out the first staff on the second page?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jan-2001

Not enough information in your post to give an exact answer, but I suspect that there's something "funny" about your file; for example, not all staves of the same length, or perhaps barline errors... if you could post a file somewhere (for example, on the newsgroup) I think that you'd make it easier for someone to help you out.

Reply 2 offered by: David Ripley on 26-Jan-2001

Try increasing the top (and perhaps bottom also) margins in NoteWorthy Composer. I have seen this type of behavior when Noteworthy is set to print within margins set physically in the printer (or printer driver).


#1929: Fitting staffs on to One Page
Fitting staffs on to One Page

(1929)

Submitted by: Bal Snow III on 26-Jan-2001

I'm trying to make a quick warmup sheet and i haven't figured out to get it to all fit on to on page. It will sometimes put the last bar like on a second page or finish it at the bottom

Any help is great
Bal

Reply 1 offered by: Bal Snow III on 26-Jan-2001

I'm using the blank staff paper you can get off of the site in it working fine now. Thanks anyways

Bal


#1930: size of compressed rests
size of compressed rests

(1930)

Submitted by: FranMan on 26-Jan-2001

Using the Boxmarks font, I make compressed rests, but 48 bars of compressed rests looks just as long as 12 measures of compressed rests. How can I make compressed rests look longer so the musician has a visual to go by?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 26-Jan-2001

Fill the bars with "dummy" rests (entered as text using Boxmarks) with actual rests of the proper duration, then make them invisible. :)

Fred


#1931: Fun with math?
Fun with math?

(1931)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 26-Jan-2001

This is a fun thing, along the lines of "what does the scroll lock key do?" rather than a serious music notice.

I know that many of you are music educators, and I suppose that many of you are schoolteachers. Check out my method for "improving math test scores":

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/satire/mathtest.htm

Reply 1 offered by: David Potvin on 05-Feb-2001

Very interesting, but tell me: what does it have anything to do with NoteWorthy Composer?

I'll tell you: I graduated from high school WITHOUT the last math degree, then from the Conservatory in Quebec City! My advanced math is so lousy that my head hurts when someone asks me a trigonometry question!

BUT! I never had any problems with my rythmic and harmonic calculation problems!!! And I'm a drummer - faced with more rythm-related complications than anyone else - except maybe contemporary music-playing pianists!

So.... what's the point?!?

P.S.: I must admit, NoteWorthy aside, that it looks good!

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Feb-2001

The point is: There is no point!

But there is a sneaky hidden agenda: A search engine might find my "math" page and be found by educators, who might follow the links within my site, and thence be led to NWC.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Feb-2001

Hee hee... graceful recovery! :)

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 11-Dec-2001

¿¿¿The link at the bottom doesn't lead to a page that includes any NWC link???

However, on a more serious subject, did someone else discovered another (SERIOUS or REAL) use to the scroll lock key, as discussed (too longly!!!) on msg #920 ? Other than in Excel (as I stated in reply 2, rediscoverd 2 years later in reply 10) and old MSDOS mode?
I think I saw something on this in the µ$-GUI reference for developer guide, which was coherent with excel behavior.

But please guys (and ladies), do not be as foolish as you were at that time !

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-Dec-2001

The link at the bottom does lead to a NWC link -- two of them -- on my other pages with music content (Hallelujah, and music fonts). But the link is not on the "writings" page that directly indexes the "math" page. The reason is that a lot of the material there is fictional or satirical. Not a good spot for a serious link. To get from my "writings" page to my main index, you have to click on the chimpanzee.

A for the scroll lock: wasn't it the case in DOS that the scroll lock could somehow be used to prevent a long text file from scrolling all the way through to its bottom? There was no way of scrolling back (upwards) through the file once it scrolled through. I am thinking of 1970s technology.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 13-Dec-2001

Yes, the Scroll Lock had such a usage, as it had too on IBM/VT100 terminals.
It still works under plain dos at least; in dos-in-windows (plain screen or windowed) you have to use the "Pause" key instead. (it may be named "Break"; it's on the right of ScrollLock)
To check it, start a Dos window, and type the command:
dir c:\ /s
(Ctrl+C to stop it; funny, Ctrl+Pause doesn't work any more...)


#1932: More Instruments
More Instruments

(1932)

Submitted by: Prince Tony on 27-Jan-2001

Any way to add more instruments to this program?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Jan-2001

This is discussed in the FAQ here at our web site. This has also been discussed at length in past forum threads. Here are some to get you started on the subject:

msg #1630, msg #1085, msg #1100, msg #1517, msg #1573, msg #1007


#1934: note spacing vs syllable spacing
note spacing vs syllable spacing

(1934)

Submitted by: Stephen R. on 27-Jan-2001

When I add extra note spacing, perversly enough the lyric syllable does not move with the note; it stays where it was, and consequently now appears to the left of the note. Two questions: 1. Will it also print to the left of the note, or is the displacement just in the screen display; and 2. how do I increase the spacing between lyric syllables (I have tried putting in a bunch of hyphens, and (again, perversely enough) if the syllable is under a slurred group of notes, it increases spacing within the group, not after it. How do I get spacing of notes and syllables to align?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 27-Jan-2001

A vexed question. Often my lyrics and notes don't align in the first place.

You can add space before a lyric syllable by using underscores (_). These are treated like letters for spacing purposes but print as blanks. So, for example, if you need to shift the second syllable to the right, you might try 'tra-_la-la' instead of 'tra-la-la'.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 29-Jan-2001

Actually I quite like this behaviour since it allows one to put the lyrics as centered as possible under the note, unfortunately this does extend the overall physical length of the piece.

But as a general thought, lyric placement does need to be rethought somewhat in NWC since:

1. I have never(?) seen printed lyrics left aligned with the notes. They should be centered on the note as far as possible.

2. With an accidental the lyric does move to the left which is tolerable in the main, but not when the accidental is on another staff! If you have say a G#7 chord notated with all its sharps on one staff then a short syllable on another staff becomes totally detached from its own note!

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen R. on 29-Jan-2001

Thanks! Yes, it works. I find that if I move a note 1 degree to the right, the syllable under it needs four underlines to move an eqivalent distance.

It seems to me that usually a syllable is centered under a single note but left-aligned under a slurred group of notes--is it not?

Stephen R.


#1935: removing special endings
removing special endings

(1935)

Submitted by: ross on 27-Jan-2001

How do I remove special endings from bars without deleting the contents of the bar?

Thanks,

Ross

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 27-Jan-2001

Treat it as any other object, i.e. select it (highlight), then press the DELETE key. Or put the cursor (insertion point) before it and press DELETE, or after it and press BACKSPACE.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 27-Jan-2001

I would add: The "handle" for the special ending (the place where you need to highlight) is an inconspicuous gray diamond, probably located above the staff near the beginning of your special ending notation. If your previous attempts to make a special ending go away have also made the notes go away, then you were highlighting too many things.

Reply 3 offered by: Ross on 27-Jan-2001

Thanks!

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jan-2001

FYI: Special endings do not use the diamond handle for selection purposes, as the diamond is used only for expressions that do not preserve width. A special ending is not considered an expression. To select a special ending, simply select its numeric component.

Reply 5 offered by: ross on 28-Jan-2001

I've got rid of them now, but when I tried it with them, it didn't work at all, which is why i wanted to get rid of them. the 1st time ending was 2 bars - was that anything to do with it?

cheers,
Ross

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jan-2001

I don't understand your question.

Reply 7 offered by: ross on 28-Jan-2001

whoever sent reply 6 sounds automated. is it? (sorry if i've offended you!)

R

Reply 8 offered by: Joe Music on 28-Jan-2001

You're right, it does look automated. But then, the question is rather hard to parse, isn't it?

Actually, I'm not even sure that it came from NWC, seeing as how the E-mail isn't specified.

No matter. What the heck was the question?

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jan-2001

This reply really did come from official NWC online support. I left the e-mail off purely for efficiency. If someone spoofs us (official support), the pertinent reply or thread will be deleted.

Our question pertained to the quote in reply 5: "was that anything to do with it?"

I do not understand this question.

Reply 10 offered by: ross on 29-Jan-2001

my question was that why wasn't my 1st time bar working? was is something to do with the fact that the 1st time bar was actually 2 bars or not?

cheers

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Jan-2001

No, it shouldn't matter how long the n-time endings are. The problem might be a number of things, including but not limited to not having the same Special Endings on all staves.

Reply 12 offered by: David Potvin on 01-Feb-2001

Biggest guess of all:

First of all: how many staves do you have in this file?
And then: did you put a special endint to ALL your staves at the same bar?

Because you DO need to put it to EVERY STAFF; and don't worry, it'll only show on the first staff and be invisible on the others when the selected visibility is "default" (gray on screen, and not at all on the printed page)! If you don't have it on all staves, you'll have funny results! ;-)

I know, because I heard Tommy Dorsey's "Song of India" with a trumpet solo in the middle of the clarinet melody, and the drum bridge bruising it simultaneously!!! ;-)


#1936: NWC browser plug-in
NWC browser plug-in

(1936)

Submitted by: Joe Music on 27-Jan-2001

Just in case you hadn't already noticed --- There's a free browser plug-in for NWC. Go to the main page to find it.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 27-Jan-2001

Note however that this is still officially a "beta", which is perhaps why its existence hasn't been broadly publicised... :)

Reply 2 offered by: Hank Robertson on 27-Jan-2001

I found it, I downloaded it, I installed it, it WORKS!
Hey guys, it's that simple. Thanx for another great mod.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 28-Jan-2001

It works better than I had imagined. Looks great. Display and plays. Incidentally, it is also a good way to create a web image of a portion of music: Create it in NWC, open it in the web browser (where the software automatically creates a screen-optimized image), capture the screen image, put it into an imaging program, crop, save as GIF.

Of course, all that is unneccessary, since the browser plug-in will show and play your entire composition!

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Jan-2001

Agreed. I'm not normally a big fan of plug-ins, since many of them are "cripple-ware", and I prefer to launch the (external) standalone program in such cases.

However, the NWC plug-in actually has functionality over and above the comparable standalone program (NW Player). Gorgeous piece of work! If I dare say, it makes the Scorch plug-in look almost amateurish by comparison.

(btw - I got a real kick out of the error message when the "pull the rug out" bug in Netscape 6 does its number!) Interesting also that Noteworthy Software found a way to hook into this (by launching Notepad) when even Netscape's own "Quality Feedback Agent" is oblivious to it.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jan-2001

Thanks for noticing this Fred. Although, technically, the problem in Netscape 6 is not what is detected by the NWC plug-in, it is a close approximation of when the problem occurs. The trick of opening NOTEPAD with the error text was born out of necessity. There was no other way, at the time the error scenario was developing (from the plug-in's perspective), to present an error message to the user.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 29-Jan-2001

Is there a way to get the plugin to start playing the music immediately on opening the page?

What I have in mind is putting the Wild West musical we have just finished performing onto our web site so that others can see if they would like to perform it too (in our very humble opinion it was a corker!).

This would start with the Overture playing in the plugin (and automatically looping?), while viwers could read the preamble. Then they could scroll through the text and the plugin would pop up every time the viewer came to a page with a song on it (the big advantage of this over a midi file being that the lyrics scroll in time to the music).

But an automatic start to each song would/could be useful.

Peter

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Jan-2001

Agreed. I just tried to see if the [autostart="true"] specifier (not sure if that's the right term) works as it does for most midi plugins -- no go. Another one that might be convenient would be [loop="true"].

Reply 8 offered by: Joe Music on 29-Jan-2001

Gee, such a great plug-in, and we want more???

Work-arounds for those who know how to code web pages:

(1) Have both a MIDI and NWC version. It's easy enough to get the MIDI to autostart while the user takes a moment to read the static information presented by the visual NWC. You will have to ensure that the MIDI switches off before the NWC activates.

(2) Insert a GIF message (animated with colors) saying something like "WOW! You can hear and see my composition! Click the start icon |> shown below!"

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Jan-2001

Yes, we're a funny bunch aren't we. Give us an inch, we'll ask for a mile. It does, however, indicate how strongly we collectively feel about NWC; I suspect that NoteWorthy Software would get quite worried if we stopped complaining. :)

Reply 10 offered by: Blair Dowden on 30-Jan-2001

The value of this feature to me is to make it easy for non-NWC users to view a file on a web page. But to be easy, the plugin should install with one or two clicks, with no hunting around for anything. That part is not quite there, but its still in beta, so I am hoping.

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Jan-2001

The approach to installing the plug-in is essentially complete. When you say "hunting around" in your question, to what are you referring?

Reply 12 offered by: Blair Dowden on 02-Feb-2001

When I click on the icon I get sent to browser plugin page at http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/plugin.htm Then I have to "hunt around" (ie. read) until I find "I understand the rules of beta 9a" and click on that. I would hope that when users click on the icon they would be taken directly to the download, where they have the option to install with a single click.

Reply 13 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Feb-2001

We are adding support for the autostart="true" specifier in the final (non-beta) release. We are not going to support a looping option, at least for now.


#1937: Selecting an existing dynamic
Selecting an existing dynamic

(1937)

Submitted by: Beverley on 28-Jan-2001

How do you select a dynamic? I can insert them but once I've moved on with my composition, I can't figure out how to go back and select the already-inserted "cres." in order to move it, delete it, etc. I'm sure it's simple, but it is eluding me.

Ditto with inserted text, etc. The only thing I can select are notes & rests.

Thanks,
Beverley

Reply 1 offered by: David Potvin on 29-Jan-2001

Hi!

I almost believe that you either have a malfunctioning version of Noteworthy, or you have an old one!

Dynamics - and everything else - are selected the SAME WAY as the notes and rests! I know for a fact that with the keyboard, it's easier than with the mouse; when selected, anything can be moved vertically by holding Ctrl and Shift, simultaneously with the vertical arrows!

Now it THIS doesn't work, it's not you; it's your software or your computer!

P.S.: have you tried the font with all the ornaments, and the Crescendo font? I usually put the built-in cresc, put it never visible, then place a graphic Crescendo; makes really neat charts, and it plays it on MIDI, too!

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 29-Jan-2001

Here's a guess: you're running into trouble with items whose "preserve width" attribute is OFF. You can't select items like this by highlighting them directly; instead you select their "handle", which is in the form of a little gray diamond. If you select the appropriate diamond, you can do anything with the item that you want to, including editing its properties, or deleting it entirely.

One thing to try is to place your cursor in about the right spot and then, holding down the shift key, press the right-arrow or left-arrow key. This will select the next available item, which you can edit (<Ctrl>-e) to see if it's the one you want. If not, unselect the item by pressing the arrow key again (without shift), then select the next item (<shift>-arrow), edit it (<Ctrl>-e), and so on.

Reply 3 offered by: Beverley on 29-Jan-2001

Right you are - I did not have preserve width on. I figured the diamond had something to do with it, but I was clicking, right clicking, double clicking, etc on it. I did try selecting it once, but obviously missed or something.

It's working great now, thanks!

Beverley


#1938: Instrument - and pitch - changes!
Instrument - and pitch - changes!

(1938)

Submitted by: David Potvin on 29-Jan-2001

Hi!

I use Noteworthy to the maximum of what it can offer, and there's one thing that still irks me, especially when I write for my band (a 7-piece showband on board a cruise ship)

My 2 sax players also play flute and clarinet; obviously, an Eb alto, a Bb Clarinet and a C Flute don't play in the same pitch! So when I use those, I'm forced to create 2 or more staves - with different instrument patches AND pitches related to them - for ONLY ONE player, then combine them into a muted staff for printing!

The bummer is that if I need to change something in it, I need to revise all staves - muted and active - and it becomes a real pain in the rear-end!

Is there something I missed in the help file about that, or am I righteously outraged? Is there a pitch change option included in the patch change that I didn't notice?

Please help me simplify my life!!!

Signed: a slave to the transposition devil!

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 29-Jan-2001

Staff layering is what you want!

For each instrumentalist allocate as many contiguous staves as instruments played. Then set up each staff according to the instrument. Turn on staff layering (Page Setup/Contents) and layer the musician's staves. You will need to set the contents of the temporarily silent staves to invisible so that the rests don't conflict with the active staff.

If you run out of midi channels then assign one channel to each player and put an instument patch at the beginning of each active secion on a staff. I take it they can't play two instruments at once so the potential conflict can't happen.

HTH
Peter

Reply 2 offered by: David Potvin on 31-Jan-2001

...8-!

Hey, that works, actually! I kick myself in the derrière for not having thought of that on my own! Thanks a lot, buddy!

Well, you can laugh at me, doing staff layering with a whole s***load of copy-pastes so that everything matched the other line!!! 8-()

Although, I wouldn't mind having a pitch change option in the wish list, but this does the trick! Thanks again!!


#1939: brass quintet music
brass quintet music

(1939)

Submitted by: JANO on 29-Jan-2001

i need brass quintet music files.

Reply 1 offered by: someone on 29-Jan-2001

http://www.vadu.com/cgi-bin/nwc/search.cgi?type1=Instruments&string1=brass&AndOr=Or&type2=&string2=&excltype=&excl=&SortBy=Composer+Name&Display=File+Data

Reply 2 offered by: David Smart on 24-Apr-2001

Hi,
My name is David, I am an arranger and below are listed my Brass Quintet arrangements with price list:-
UK Sterling
1) Largo - Handel £25.00
2) Rondo from Abdelazar - Purcell £20.00
3) Pavane in Blue £25.00
4) Love Changes Everything £25.00
5) The Simpsons Theme Tune £25.00
6) Livin' La Vida Loca! £25.00
7) Spitfire Prelude £25.00
8) Riverdance £25.00
9) My Love £20.00
10) Nimrod £20.00

Prices exclude postage & packing.

Hope this helps.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew Lincoln on 03-May-2001

Hello David.
We may be interested in purchasing some of your brass quintet arrangements. we're particularly interested in the simpsons, riverdance, spitfire prelude and la vida loca.

Regards
Andy Lincoln
Tuba
English Brass Quintet
www.chopper.f9.co.uk


#1940: Fonts for lyrics
Fonts for lyrics

(1940)

Submitted by: Stephen R. on 29-Jan-2001

Several questions about lyric fonts: first, when I try to install a user-defined font, NWC just ignores it and uses the default font; what am I missing?

Second, how can I enter lyrics in the Cyrillic alphabet (I have Cyrillic fonts in Word).

Third, is it possible to compose lyrics in MS Word and then import them into NWC? If so, how?

Stephen R.

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-Jan-2001

I haven't had problems using alternate fonts for lyrics, but maybe that's because I stick to varieties of TNR/Arial, etc. Are you sure that you are choosing your desired user font in page setup?

As for composing in Word then transferring lyrics: Use copy (highlight, CTRL-C) in Word. When you have your Lyrics window open in NWC, paste using CTRL-V. It will not paste the font, nor any special formatting, just the keystrokes. If your composition has more than one set of lyrics, you will have to do this separately for each lyric set (easiest is to first paste all lyrics in one place, then cut-and-paste lyrics within NWC).

You can also copy lyrics out of NWC and paste them into Word.

Don't forget to manually hyphenate the lyric syllables.

Reply 2 offered by: someone on 29-Jan-2001

For your second question; does your OS have support for Cyrrilic alphabet, ie Russian or otherwise lang support?

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 29-Jan-2001

Just to double check, make sure of the following (assuming you are using Windows 98 or equivalent).

1. Go to Control Panel, Fonts: is the Cryllic font installed? If so fine. If not, you will need to install it.

2. In Noteworthy, go to page setup and select font. For lyrics, select the desired cryllic font and size. It should work (I was even able to have lyrics done in guitar chord grid patterns, so it should work for you as well).

3. Once you have the cryllic font and size seleted in a base file, you may want to save it to the NWC template folder with an appropriate name (such as "Cryllic"). Then, whenever you desire cyrillic lyrics, you can just choose "new" and that particular template.

Hope that helps.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Jan-2001

1 and 2) You can define the font for lyrics from File | Page Setup | Fonts | Staff Lyric.

3) You can copy and paste lyrics as simple text using Ctrl+C and Ctrl+V in the lyric editor. Only the text itself can be passed this way. Formatting done in Word or elsewhere is not supported in the staff lyric.

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen R. on 30-Jan-2001

I have Windows ME; I do have Russian language support, and can compose texts in Russian in Word (not, however, in any of several fonts I have downloaded--I am still working on this). But when I try to bring the Cyrillic into NWC it ignores me and goes right to the default font. Yes, I do the Page Setup Fonts procedure, but to no effect.

Stephen R.

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 30-Jan-2001

It may be that your strategy, or choice of font, is somehow out of the ordinary.

I have multi-language support (see your Windows setup). Although I did not try any special Cyrillic font, Arial and TNR have Baltic language support as "ALT+0nnn" characters. I tried them, and they work just great within NWC as lyrics. I did not even have to change my default font (for me, TNR).

Could it be that your characters are being chosen within Word by a command-keystroke combination that is not otherwise recognized? For example, the standard fonts allow the combination CTRL+' followed by e to produce the e-accent (French) within Word, but this is specific to Word.

Reply 7 offered by: David Potvin on 01-Feb-2001

VERY HARD TO BELIEVE!!!

The Font Selections in the Page setup Menu is very accurate! I use them myself, and whatever font I wat to modify, it uses it to perfection; it even follows the size change when I resize my chart!

The Staff Lyrics line that you modified should give you what you told it to give! I once assigned a foreign musical font to this line - ran out of "user font" lines! - and got screwed when they asked me to put lyrics to one line!!! ;-)

Make sure you do assign your russian font to the "Staff Lyrics", and no other, otherwise, you could wake up someday with surprises when you print - as it did to me!!! User 1 and others will do you absolutely no good there!!

Good luck!

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Feb-2001

Why don't you send us a sample that demonstrates the problem?

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 20-Feb-2001

Thank you all for your replies. I will try to do as you advise and let you know how it works. I apologize for not responding more promptly; my computer crashed disastrously and it took some time to get it back up, and more to restore the lost files (those I composed in Word or NWC will simply have to be done over from scratch). Robert Allgeyer's report of Baltic fonts successfully imported into NWC gives me the idea of trying that myself--es varu rakstiit latvju valodaa "Word"-aa, un arii leis'u valodaa--I can do it in e-mail too, but it comes out nonsense at the other end, so I have used the Baltic fonts only in Word so far. I'll see if I can get them into NWC. If I want to bring a font into a NWC template, do I use the same procedure described on pp. 28-29 of the User's Guide?

Stephen Reynolds

Reply 10 offered by: Stephen R. on 21-Feb-2001

Well, I tried. I composed a text in Cyrillic in Word, copied it to the clipboard, and pasted it to the Lyrics window, where, no matter what font I specified, it was immedately converted to gibberish in the Latin alphabet. So I redid the same text in Slovak Latin orthography in Word, copied, pasted, and the results were that some of the "special" letters (s hacek, at least) came out all right; most (c hacek, for example) were converted into the same letter minus diacritical; and some (z hacek, for example) were displayed as boxes. Print preview showed exactly the same. (For Allgeyer kgs/ponas: I haven't tried Baltic yet, but the letters I used as examples are equally found in Lithuanian and Latvian, so I am tolerably certain of equal failure there.) There is supposed to be a character map that gives the numbers to use with ALT to get the same letters, but my system (Windows ME, Office 2000) simply does not have any such thing. So I went on the internet and did a search--it has to be there somewhere. All I found, however, was tables for Western European languages. Si queria escribir en espanol, todo seria muy facil. Alas, what I want to do is to set Lyrics in Slavonic, and so far NWC has consistently frustrated all my efforts. I have activated all the multilanguage resources I am aware of in Windows, including the keyboard, and I can do most of what I need in Word, but it cannot, so far, be done in NWC or done in Word and transferred to NWC. Obviously I am missing something here, because everyone else can do it. It's frustrating.

Stephen R.

Reply 11 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 21-Feb-2001

Stephen, I am certain that there is no inherent difficulty using whatever font one wishes (whether or not it is Latin encoded) in NWC lyrics. I have even tried it using a symbolic font that shows pictures of animals! This is with Windows 98.

Under certain circumstances, moving fonts from one application to another may cause an encoding change. For example, I can open a WMF from NWC in either Irfan View or Adobe Illustrator, and it will look correct. But if I open the same WMF on the same computer (all other things equal) in a certain "brand X" drawing program, the NWC font is re-encoded so that letter of the Latin alphabet appear in place of the NWC musical notation. Thus, the problem has to to with the interpretation of fonts by the "brand X" program, not by NWC or by Windows.

How are you getting access to the specialized Russian or Cyrillic characters in your word processor? If they are selected by keystroke combinations rather than coosing them directly from the character map, that might be the problem. In French, there is no difficulty using "CTRL+singlequote" then "e" to produce the accented-e character in MS Word. Once placed in a document, the character is no longer a keystroke combination, but a single character. Could it be that whatever you are using is remembering the special characters as keystroke combinations? Try selecting your Russian characters from the character map, inside or outside NWC.

There is one other possibility: Some fonts have multi-language support that involves more than 256 characters. When a non-Latin set is chosen, the font reader internally re-maps the font. For example, some of the well-known web fonts have Arabic, Turkish, or Hebrew characters that do not appear on the standard character map. If this re-mapping information is not passed across programs, then there will be a problem. Have you tried copying your character from the source word processor to an application (not in the same software suite) other than NWC?

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer (read this!) on 21-Feb-2001

Aha! I realized what I'm doing that Steven is probably not doing.

I use a freeware program called "Character Map Pro" by Alexandre Gorbatchev. It is widely available on the Internet -- just use your search engine to find it. My version is 1.81, but there are later versions. This is the program that will appear for me, whenever I request a character map (because I customized the shortcut).

Character Map Pro not only gives a larger image than the standard Windows character map, it does something that the standard won't do: It allows the user to access the non-Latin character set of multilanguage fonts. There is a drop-down box that allows you to locate, for example, the Cyrillic character set in and font that has one. Then, by double-clicking the characters, you can copy them to the clipboard and paste them wherever. This is what I have been using, and it works. It does not require any other special capabilities.

But if you rely on the standard Windows character map, it keeps you in the Latin set, even if you have multi-language capability installed.

A good choice for Cyrillic with mild serifs is "Georgia," free from Microsoft and part of the new browser updates.

One difficulty with Character Map Pro is that it copies at 8 points, like it or not. This doesn't seem to matter to NWC, but does matter if you paste into a word processor document.

Reply 13 offered by: Stephen R. on 21-Feb-2001

Liels paldies!

I'll see if Alexander Gorbachev (any relation to Mikhail, I wonder?) can solve the problem. And I have been composing on the keyboard when possible, but the trouble is that what I am doing now is not Russian (or Ukrainian, Bielorussian, Serbian, Bulgarian, Macedonian, Backa Ruthenian, etc,) but Slavonic. I have not yet found a font that allows me to enter all the letters from the keyboard (so before I even get to NWC there is a problem), and at least one adds diacriticals by means of "dead" keys. But if I just skip the diacriticals for now, and go from the Gorbachevian Character Map as you suggest, that may work. I'll certainly give it a try. I expect Estonian might be easier, come to think of it, because the umlaut letters exist in Western European languages too--but then there's the unrounded "o", isn't there. So it really would experience the same difficulties as Lithuanian, or Slavonic.

Thanks again!

Stephen R.

Reply 14 offered by: Robert Allgeyer (here's proof!) on 21-Feb-2001

Take a look at this:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/rus.htm

The proof is in the picture, and the printout.

Reply 15 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 23-Feb-2001

Yes! Many thanks, Mr Allgeyer! Character Map Pro does the job. In addition, for Slavonic I need CyrWin to switch to the "alternative keyboard"--that way I can enter most letters from the keyboard, and need to resort to ALT + 0XXX only for a few of them. With these two programs I am finally getting the job done. Your example is quite convincing (although the text is gibberish; also one letter is Ukrainian rather than Russian, but that just proves that it will accommodate any language if you have the proper font).
I have successfully used both the "Staroslav" and "Irmologion" Slavonic fonts. Russian, Ukrainian, etc. would be a piece of cake by comparison.

Paldies jums!

Stephen Reynolds


#1941: Wav to midi
Wav to midi

(1941)

Submitted by: trinh on 30-Jan-2001

how would you turn a .wav file into a midi file???

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Jan-2001

Simple answer: you don't. Lots of discussion on this can found by using http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1514.htm as a launch point and following the links provided therein.

Reply 2 offered by: Little Caesar on 01-Feb-2001

What about the other way around?

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 01-Feb-2001

Once more, with feeling: this is one of the hottest topics ever to hit the NWC forum. Check out msg #1003 and msg #1207, for example.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Pearson on 02-Feb-2001

There is something of a brief tutorial on these and related subjects at http://www.hitsquad.com/smm/tutorials.html

Perhaps might be helpful

Reply 5 offered by: Grimblefritz on 02-Feb-2001

Easiest and best midi2wav I have found is the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas (VSC-883H). You can pick it up at http://www.edirol.com/ for $69. Superb sound, incredibly simple. Just load your MIDI file in the VSC player and click the Audio Convert button.

Reply 6 offered by: Grimblefritz on 02-Feb-2001

oops! that should be VSC-88H3


#1942: Duplets, Cues
Duplets, Cues

(1942)

Submitted by: FranMan on 30-Jan-2001

Two More Questions
--------------------------------------------------------
1. Can NWC create duplets?

2. Can NWC make small notes that may be used for:
     - Optional instrument cues
     - Slighly different melodies for different verses

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 30-Jan-2001

I think the answers to your questions are:

1. Not directly. However, two dotted notes will take the space of three undotted ones (e.g., instead of duplet eighths use two dotted eighths). This method of creating "duplets" is not just a hack; real, highly respected composers have been known to use it (e.g. Britten).

2. Not directly. It is possible to hack around with grace notes but the results are (in my experience) usually quite iffy.

Reply 2 offered by: David Potvin on 01-Feb-2001

Well, Grant, Benjamen Britten was a puritan, I even believe he would have used quarter note triplets in a 6/8 bar where he could have used straight quarter notes (with two 8ths tied in the middle, of course)!!! I've seen it from others!!

As to FranMan, for #2, it happened to me once, and here's a suggestion: use a layered staff where you put invisible rests in the rythm of the melody you want to cue, then with the NWC Ornament Font, find the grace note character, and place one at each rest you have, in the position: centered and at next note/bar, and see what it does!

Once the staves layered, if the melody overlaps a whole rest in the main line, select the rest and move it so it goes under - or over - the staff, as desired!

As to beaming the 8th notes and smaller... your best bet would be to copy it into a BMP file with the 16 bit version, and edit it with Microsoft Paint!

Good luck!

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 01-Feb-2001

>> I even believe he would have used quarter note triplets in a 6/8 bar where he could have used straight quarter notes

You must mean *dotted* quarter note triplets. A regular quarter note triplet takes up the time of two "unmodified" quarter notes, and so would take up only 2/3 of a 6/8 measure.

I'm not sure I could conceive even a puritanical reason why you would want to use dotted quarter triplets instead of simple quarters, but I don't doubt it's been done.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Eidson on 01-Feb-2001

For my final project in AP Music Theory (junior year of HS) I submitted a short piece that I had written that had the sort of "quasi-polyrhythm" of eighth notes in 6/8 over dotted-quarter triplets, which you are talking about. Later I rearranged the piece and found regular quarter notes in 6/8 (those measures acting like a 3/4 bar for some, 6/8 for the others) are much clearer to the performer. :)


#1943: Lyrics in repeat after key change
Lyrics in repeat after key change

(1943)

Submitted by: Rosemary Stoker on 31-Jan-2001

I am having a problem adding a second verse of lyrics after a key change. This is what I have done so far: 1st verse, first ending, second verse, second ending, chorus; key change; then I continued on in lyric editor using the same line 2, adding the next verse of lyrics, first ending in new key, repeat. Now this is where I am having a problem. I need to add a second line of lyrics after the key change. (Note: The song plays correctly)

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Jan-2001

Simply add the second lyric line, and use an "_" (underscore) for each syllable in the first lyric line that does not have a corresponding second line syllable.

Reply 2 offered by: Rosemary Stoker on 31-Jan-2001

Thanks. I had tried that but neglected to space between underscores.


#1944: fermatas in browser plug-in
fermatas in browser plug-in

(1944)

Submitted by: Grimblefritz on 02-Feb-2001

Okay, I've read up on the fermata and breath mark issue with exporting to MIDI. I can deal with that, though it would be nice if NWC would generate the required mpc for me on export. But...

In the browser plug-in these two notations are also ignored. Is this an oversite? Or is the plug-in player really just converting NWC to MIDI first and then synchronizing the display during playback?

FWIW, playback is correct in the standalone Player.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Feb-2001

Fermatas are currently ignored in both plug-ins. This is a consequence of the play back engine used, which is that of the standard Windows MIDI MCI sequencer.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 03-Feb-2001

I've wished that fermatas were implemented as pairs of MPC tempo changes -- I thought that would be easy to import cleanly into a music notation editor, as well as be played accurately with the dumb MIDI players.

Breath marks were not in any music I was familiar with before I started seriously exploring some other traditions in the last two or three years. A hidden "double bar -- rest -- double bar" would give the same musical effect when played, again without causing major damage when imported into a music notation editor.

Reply 3 offered by: Grimblefritz on 04-Feb-2001

Yes. As I suspected and confirmed in the support post above, the plug-in uses the Windows MIDI engine rather than using the NW engine. I'm sure there are great reasons for this, but for performance purposes it can introduce some major issues.

Fermatas are relatively simple to convert to MPC absolute tempo changes. For example, I had a piece with a quarter note fermata that had a duration of 8/16s (using the default 1/16 unit of variation), causing the note to play for a total of three beats (12/16s). My tempo was 90, so an MPC tempo absolute from 30 to 90 with one quarter note duration achieved the same effect in the MIDI stream.

Now, the problem comes in if you have repeats which vary the tempo. My 90 changes to 102 on the repeat, but when the MPC is encountered, the 30-90 tempo is imposed. So, for a wish list item, how about a relative option for the values? The MPC could be set to 33%-100% and NWC would use the current tempo to compute the actual values.

Breath marks are used quite often in choral music, and if you are making practice compositions (as I do) they are very important. I quickly found the hidden dbar-rest-dbar notation work around. It works and survives bar audits, unlike just inserting a hidden rest.

Both of these work arounds are simple mathematical conversions. I hope Eric sees fit to add them to the MIDI export routines as an automatic feature. Perhaps as an optional "render fermatas and breath marks in MIDI" option.


#1945: different number of staves, same song
different number of staves, same song

(1945)

Submitted by: FranMan on 02-Feb-2001

I have some music that starts out in unson (one part, one staff) then splits into three parts (three staves). can I recreate this in NoteWorthy?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant  on 02-Feb-2001

Not in one print command. However, you could layer the staves in order to print the pages where the parts are in unison, and then unlayer them for the pages where they diverge. If you want different systems on the same page to have different numbers of staves, then this method won't work; in that case you'd have to do some cutting and pasting from Print Preview into another application and print from there.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 03-Feb-2001

Since I work with choral music, I have to do this all the time. Having access to other software, I find that the easiest solution (for me) is to create a WMF or PostScript file from NWC, then edit it with a drawing program. But this solution is not accessible to most users.

I suggest that the capability to shift between single and multiple staves in a single composition might be a useful upgrade feature.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 03-Feb-2001

It would seem to be fairly easy to program a feature that treated staffs with only hidden items in the current system as actually being temporarily hidden themselves.

Peter

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 03-Feb-2001

Thank you all for the tips, I have added my request to the wishlist.


#1946: What is the function of the plug-in? n/t
What is the function of the plug-in? n/t

(1946)

Submitted by: John on 02-Feb-2001

What is the function of the plug-in?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 02-Feb-2001

There are actually two plug-ins. One is an extension to your web browser to allow you to play NWC files that are embedded in web pages. The other is an extension to WinAmp to allow you to add NWC files to WinAmp playlists.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Feb-2001

Follow the links on the home page to read the plug-in descriptions.


#1947: Editing .wmfs, deleting unused staves
Editing .wmfs, deleting unused staves

(1947)

Submitted by: David Motz on 03-Feb-2001

Hi,

I'm trying to print a score on the fewest number of pages possible. It's a choir piece with handbells, trumpet, timpani, and organ. When an instrument's staff is empty across the width of the page I would like it not to print, but I understand that NWC does not support this feature yet. (I hope this feature is included in a soon to be released upgrade...)

What I am trying to do now is use the print preview to save each page as a .wmf file and then open the pages in Paint Shop Pro to delete the unused staves and combine the smaller systems on fewer pages. However, when I print the new .wmf versions, the print quality is not as high. The overall size of each items is the same whether I print from NWC or the .wmf but the edited .wmfs look "pixelated" as if Paint Shop is doing a poor convertion of the vector data to a .bmp file.

If I use Paint Shop to print the files they always look this way. If I use an image viewer to print the NWC .wmfs they look perfect. If I use the viewer to print a file I have edited and saved with Paint Shop it looks better than printing with Paint Shop, but the curves look much blockier, and the staff lines don't look even as they do when printing the NWC .wmfs. What is going on here?

Is there a program I can use to edit the files which will not degrade the print quality, or is cutting, pasting and xerox copying the original NWC printout the only way to do this and still look good?

Thanks for you help,

David

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 03-Feb-2001

Before you try anything else, try this:

The resolution of a WMF exported from NWC is determined by the resolution of whatever printer is selected at the time. This is because the WMF comes from "print preview."

If the default printer is too coarse, or even too fine, the end result may be pixelated. Optimum seems to be 300 DPI. It may be counter-productive to set an excessively high resolution.

If that doesn't do the job, another method would be to split your composition into a number of separate compositions, containing different staves. Create separate WMFs from them, and paste them as independent pictures into your word processor. Crop excess white space.

Since I have a lot of software, my own solution to the problem is to create a PDF document from NWC, then edit the PDF as a drawing object in Illustrator.

As you wrote, it would be a good added feature for NWC to handle blank staves.

Reply 2 offered by: David Potvin on 05-Feb-2001

Here's a tip that works - from personal experience;

Try copying it as a .BMP file instead of a .WMF! Of course, you'll have to install the 16-bit version, but it doesn't degrade the file when you open it with Paint Shop!

Notice that what they said earlier about the resolution of the printer you selected is so true it hurts!

P.S.: has anybody ever tried to open a .WMF file from a computer that does NOT have NoteWorthy installed in it? If you did, you'll understand why I love converting into .BMP's!!!

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Feb-2001

Metafiles will open OK on another computer if the computer has the required fonts installed.

Reply 4 offered by: David Motz on 06-Feb-2001

I thought I had seen references in the archives to .bmp files, but I didn't see the option. So, if I install the 16 bit version that available? Sounds like it's worth a try.

I did try setting my print resolution to 300 dpi, but it just makes the NWC native print output look not so nice. At 600 dpi laser printout from NWC looks absolutely beautiful. I didn't have any better luck with editing the metafiles that way either. If I had Illustrator I would definately try that with PDF files. As it is I've just done a cut and paste job. I just hope the cut lines and tape don't show on the copies...

I'll try the 16 bit version and see what happens. I really hope that the ability to supress blank staff printing is added to the next version. If it's version 2 I'd be thrilled to pay for it for this feature alone. Another thing on my wish list is the ability to change the measure numbers at any measure.

Thanks for the advice.

Reply 5 offered by: David Potvin on 06-Feb-2001

You're most welcome!

Uh... I've got a question mark in my face, now: Changing the measure numbers at any measure...?!?!? What does THAT mean?!? One thing would be nice in the program is the option to either put rehearsal letters, OR highlighting a specific "rehearsal" bar number... But... changing it?!? I don't understand...

Reply 6 offered by: David Motz on 06-Feb-2001

Well, I was printing out the trumpet part from the score I've been working on and it starts out with, say, 24 measures of rest. So, with boxmarks I can get a very nice looking rest of that duration, but it only takes up one measure, so the measure numbers are all wrong. I fixed that by setting the first measure number to 24 which worked fine.
But, when the trumpet is again out for an extended time I cannot fix the measure numbers by any way that I can figure out without monkeying around and printing twice and then cutting and pasting again. Am I missing something?

I was thinking that after each extended rest I could reset the measure number to the correct number to match the rest of the score.

Are you getting around this with invisibility settings? I just thought of that as I was typing this. I haven't played too much with that. Maybe I should try that.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Edwards on 07-Feb-2001

I think one of the problems too is the counting of repeat bars and partial bars (where the Master Repeat is in the middle of the standard bar). At least it would be nice to have an ability to state whether a bar should be counted for the purposes of numbering.

Peter


#1948: korg 05R/W instruments definition
korg 05R/W instruments definition

(1948)

Submitted by: manu on 04-Feb-2001

Hello,

I want to use the korg 05R/W with NWC. Is there any .ini file to get the good patches names and numbers ?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Feb-2001

You can edit the ini file however you wish to give the patch names you want. Perhaps, if there enough people writing new ini patch lists, we could start a library of the on the Scriptorium?


#1949: newbie simple  editing question
newbie simple  editing question

(1949)

Submitted by: manu on 05-Feb-2001

Hi,

Is it possible to listen the note you're entering with the mouse ?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Feb-2001

See msg #1885.


#1950: Drum X-head font for NWC -- here it is -- maybe!
Drum X-head font for NWC -- here it is -- maybe!

(1950)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Feb-2001

Attention experienced NWC users who want to place X-head drum notation within NWC and have it track note positions:

I am working on a font that I believe will do the job. Before I complete it, I have placed an "Alpha Test" version for download, so that I can get feedback before I finish. This veriosn is very incomplete, but I do not want to put a lot of work in if I am doing the wrong thing (I do not play drums, myself).

The concept is simple: My font is used as a LYRIC font, not a TEXT font. Recall that lyric syllables track note positions. You would create your drum staff within NWC in the ordinary fashion, then make the notes (except for rests) invisible. Using the lyric editor with my font, X-head notes (visible in the editor) are entered as lyric syllables. They track the note positions horizontally, and are adjustable vertically. I believe I can extend the method to allow for beamed note groups, triplets, etc. My font leaves ordinary letters of the alphabet in the CAPITAL letter and punctuation keystrokes.

The font itself, instructions, and a NWC sample can be downloaded at:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/Ndrum1.zip

Please, only those who already know how to use NWC should look at this. I need feedback before I continue. My E-mail address is in the README note accompanying the font.

Reply 1 offered by: chris on 07-Feb-2001

Robert-

Looks great so far! I played with it a little bit, and am impressed with how nice it looks in print preview/printout. One suggestion, I wouldn't worry too much about using the open x's for half and whole notes, since x-headed drum notation generally doesn't have anything of a higher value than a dotted quarter (in my experience, at least). Keep us posted and upload the final version once you've finished your work. Thanks.

Reply 2 offered by: David Potvin on 08-Feb-2001

Well, you see, here's the reason why I wouldn't use it! What about cymbal rolls?!?

Besides, there's more to it than just X headers! Tom headers are just under-used, because they're just plain unknown to non-drummers! But I'd be very happy to use them! And what about Triangle signs?

There's just too much going on about percussion writing to just finalize it into a single font! Unless someone finds a way to superimpose a font over a note header and masking the black header to replace it with the symbol desired... Looks like a challenge!!!

I gues I'll stick to writing stuff with NoteWorthy, and hand-write my drum charts! ...until a new version fulfills my dreams...!!!

Reply 3 offered by: johnti on 08-Feb-2001

hi Folks!
Can someone please tell me how easy this solution will be to use? for example, will I have to manually put in each note or can I just import a midi file to drum notation or can I convert an already imported drum track into drum notation? thanks for any help; I really appreciate Robert's effort in doing this. users have been asking for this for a few years now so it will be well received in any form - then we can all make it really cool. I got another musician friend into using noteworthy - he asked "does it do drums" and I said somebody is working on it. too busy to check it out myself but best wishes to you all!
johnti.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 08-Feb-2001

As the author of the font (that is, if I decide to go ahead and finish it), here are my replies:

(1) Regarding cymbal rolls, etc: Any custom-made font can put in any kind of symbols. BUT they would not be controlled from the NWC control panel, they would be used as "lyrics," meaning that they would have no effect on MIDI. Since there are already fonts with various symbols that can be used as "text," I don't see that it would be useful to re-invent this.

(2) Regarding changing the note-head to various styles: That would have to be done by NWC. It is possible to do it globally (that is, for every note on every staff) by manipulating a WMF. BUT unless your composition consists of nothing but staff for a single kind of instrument (all tomm-toms, etc.) this is not useful.

It would be possible to use my method for a couple of different styles -- say, X-head and something else. It would be better to have one custom font for X-heads, and another for the "something else." But only one or the other could be used in a single composition. I wasn't planning on doing more than one font.

(3) My approach does nothing to the MIDI. It is merely a way of changing the appearance of the printout (or WMF) in a manner that over-writes the NWC notes with a different style. It overwrites the entire note, not just the head. Incidentally, the method could be used with "handwritten" or "jazzy" note styles, but I am not working on that.

(4) My decision point as to whether to proceed will be sometime in late February. If I do proceed, the font should be done by the end of February. If I do create the font, it would be free. Meanwhile, I need more feedback. I have figured out how to do beams. I assume that with drums, there is no need for slurs and ties. Is that right?

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Eidson on 09-Feb-2001

Slurs are not used very often, but ties are used all over the place.

ex: half-note snare roll tied to an eighth, follwed by an eighth rest (in 3/4 time)

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 09-Feb-2001

Ties are possible.

Reply 7 offered by: Cirrus storm on 09-Feb-2001

Sounds too hard for me to use in my music. WHy doesn't
noteworthy composer do this to their program
thanx,
cirrus

Reply 8 offered by: FranMan on 11-Feb-2001

Robert-

        For heads that are usually open like the half note, you use squares, somewhat like <>. At least, that is how it works in Musicals. Other than that change, the font as it is is good enough for me! Thank you for making it!

Reply 9 offered by: Barry Graham on 11-Feb-2001

In reply to Johnti

On the Scriptorium there is a program of mine that converts a drum track in a midifile to drum notation that can be imported into NWC.
And it does the reverse - write the drum notation then export and convert the to midi drums to get the sound.

The program uses Qbasic but there is a Windows version created by user Drake Donahue that will do the same but the documentation is lacking (where are you Drake?).

The resulting notation still has the notehead problem.
(No cymbal, crash cymbal or open percussion heads - because this is an NWC problem not mine.

The program uses default positions that I'm familiar with but you can customize both versions to what ever suits.

Reply 10 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 16-Feb-2001

I haven't gotten much encouragement regarding the font project. I will leave the un-completed version for awhile before I take it off my web site.

Since it would take a lot of work, and have little benefit, I will not complete the font. But the concept I described does work. For those of you who have a font editor and want to try it yourself, the trick to making beams and ties as "lyrics" (or, text) is to create zero-cursor-width glyphs. This allows several items to be superimposed.

Reply 11 offered by: Nahum Reduta on 24-Feb-2001

If my ten years of marching percussion have taught me anything, the font as it stands now wouldn't be effective. For the occasional cymbal crash, it works all too fine. But using it for complex rhythms and drum set notation is a challenge. However, you're a few steps ahead of providing us with a worthy X-head font. Here's some pointers if you decide to press on later:

-One style of X-heads resembles the double-sharp more than a plain X. And as for whole/half notes, imagine a regular whole note squeezed into a rounded diamond. Thicks on one slant, thins on the other slant.

-You'll need to include partial beamed eighths and other flagged notes. Also consider stems of different heights so notes on different "tones" can beam together. Don't worry about ascending/descending beams.

-Have a look at the Noteworthy font itself (NWC15.ttf, I think). If you don't mind the wait, try downloading trials of other visual MIDI manipulation programs, esp. those which accomodate percussion notation, and check out their fonts. (btw, if anyone objects to such "reverse-engineering", now's the time to speak up)

-Make sure it plays well with the standard notation. This is especially important for drum set notation.

-Try to use the keyboard layout in an inventive way.

Hope this helps. If you've given up, the least you can do is show the rest of us how to make fonts or where we can find info online. [NR]

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 24-Feb-2001

I did indeed look at those other things... I own several notation programs, and have looked at published percussion music (although I do not know the significance of what I see).

Fonts do not need to be reverse engineered, in general. I did take notice of the kinds of noteheads you mentioned.

To make use of beamed groups, a font to be used as "lyrics" within NWC would need to have sets of pre-constructed beams, as well as closures for beams, to span "syllables."

This is all possible, BUT I believe of such limited utility that I have expended my font-making efforts elsewhere.

For an interesting example of what is possible to do using a font -- without a notation program -- look at "MusiTone2001" on my web site:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849

MusiTone allows synthesis of note chords and beams - including some tilted beams -- in a font! It is of little practical use, merely developed as a training exercise for myself. The font is for a word processor, not NWC.

Reply 13 offered by: lurker on 25-Feb-2001

I've been browsing this forum every so often and have done so for two if not three years. In that time Noteworthy Artware has made very little improvements as far as features for this period. Sure there have been minor fixes and additions but basically it's the same boat it was when I started dabbling with the software. The key features for me would be integrated guitar chord notation, optional font styles (including handwritten), and percussion notation (including single line staves for triangles, etc). Is anybody with me?
Thanks for letting me share this.
lurker

Reply 14 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 25-Feb-2001

Without a doubt, NWC could use a few key enhancements. My (limited) understanding of the way the program works seems to indicate that allowing drum-X notation, fasola (shaped notes), handwritten-appearing notes, gregorian chant notes, and whatever, might all be possible if users could choose from notation fonts on a staff-specific basis. Currently, only text allows the user to choose fonts that vary from place to place. The lyric font is selectable but global. The notation font is not selectable.

Allowing a choice of notation font would not, by itself, allow users to make use of notation fonts from other programs (besides, that would be a no-no). But it would be possible, without too much brain strain, to create a variety of custom fonts that have the same encoding as that of NWCV15, assuming that this font is permanent (not a good assumption). Merely changing the appearnace of a note has no affect on the MIDI -- if that is the intention. But it would be a more complex program revision to have the MIDI output change in response to changes in appearance.

For those who did not know, NWC does not generally use pre-assembled notes. In general, notes are assembled from components consisting of a mixture of font-objects and drawing-objects. Note-heads are font objects, as are accidentals, flags, clefs, and so forth. Staff lines, leger lines, note-stems, beams, ties (and perhaps other things) are drawing objects, not part of the font. It is possible to create a custom font that replaces the note heads with whatever -- I have done it as an exercise. Likewise for the other font objects. But a change of font would not be able to turn the straight note-stems into, for example, curves, nor would it be able to turn beams into the appearance of hand-scratch.

As for tablature, if all you want is the appearance of tablature in a NWC composition (not linked to the MIDI), then there are some free fonts running around that can be used as user-selected text. I believe -- but am not certain -- that fonts known as Frets A, B, and C are available on the Internet for general usage. But if they are free, then Noteworthy Software itself could not re-distribute those fonts as part of a commercial product.

As for microtonal notation, the experts have their own say. But microtonals link to the MIDI, and thus are more complex than merely permitting user-selectable fonts on a staff-by-staff basis.

I myself already own other programs that have the kinds of features commonly mentioned. But since I do not need those features, I use NWC for the simple reason that it is easiest to use, by far.

About two weeks ago, the "Dilbert" comic strip had a character called the "feature creep." Those of you who have ever worked in the business end of technical products (as I have) know that there will always be requests for additional features, many of which require major changes to address small market segments. It would be a waste of Noteworthy's efforts to invest in program changes that would primarily be of interest only to those who already own a major, expensive commerical product. Or, extensive changes could make the program less attractive!!! Those of you who find Netscape Navigator 6 more of a pain than NN 4.7 know what I mean.


#1952: Microtones
Microtones

(1952)

Submitted by: Art Thompson on 09-Feb-2001

Ertrugral has mentioned in this forum about the need for microtone notation to accomodate his needs. After watching a compelling performance of an Indian Violinist, my total ignorance occurred to me:
What does microtonal notation look like?
Why do we in the US ignore it so completely in our education systems? Is it too hard for us?
In college I remember Harry Partch mentioned in passing, but that's about it. What is your (all you fellow forum users) experience on this? Where does one learn more?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 09-Feb-2001

One problem is that different people have different definitions of "microtonal". The composer and pianist Ferruccio Busoni once suggested a scale of third-tones (dividing the octave evenly into 18 notes instead of 12); I have a recording of a string quartet by Lejaren Hiller that divides the octave into 24 quarter tones.

The microtonal notation I've seen most often is specifically adapted to the 24-tone scale, and uses a sharp sign with a single vertical line to mean "1/4 tone sharp" and a sharp sign with three vertical lines to mean "3/4 tones sharp. There are equivalent 1/4 and 3/4 flats as well (IIRC, the 1/4 flat has a little straight tail extending to the left from the top of its vertical, and the 3/4 flat has extends this same tail to the right as well).

For other microtonal systems, I've seen notation that uses little up and down arrows to the left of the note (and accidental, if any). If a number is specified above the arrow, this is the number of cents (100ths of a semitone) by which to sharpen or flatten the note relative to equal temperament; in the absence of a number, 50 cents (a quarter-tone) is assumed.

I don't know of a single reference on microtonal music, though there may well be one.

I hope this helps.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 09-Feb-2001

Dear Art,

It's great to hear that someone else hears my scream. Regarding Harry Partch or Julian Carrillo, it's impossible to write down microtonality in standard notation just implementing additional accidentals since they invented their own systems. I'm ignorant about Partch who developed a 43 tone system but I know that Carrillo, the outstanding Mexican composer, kept standard note durations on a single lined staff and "represented fractions of each tones numerically." (Karolyi, Introducing Modern Music)

If we come back to standard notation, we will see some different or modified accidentals such as flats turned 180 degrees vertically or sharpes with more or less horizontal or vertical lines; arrows or dashes attached to any place of the mark or +/- signs, up/down arrows or some other symbols used with or without the default accidental mark.

In Turkish/Eastern musics (excluding far-eastern, Indian and Byzantine with custom notation systems), notating specific tones has been a problem and, ironically, a matter of challenge as notation itself. Through the history, notation was seldom used just in order to include scales, examples and such things in theoretical works and music was thought orally. That caused a huge repertory to be lost along a millenium! But there have always been some attempts;

Farâbî (Alfarabius; d.930 AD), Safiyyuddîn Urmevî (d. 1391 AD), Abdulkádir Merâgí (1360?-1435 AD; legendary composer, performer, theorist and instrument maker with many books and unfortunately no compositions remaining) had all used “ebced” notation. That’s employing one or more letters of Arabic alphabet for a specific “note” in the tone system. This practice remained for centuries. Kutb Nâyî (“master Ney player”) Osman Dede (1652?-1730) and Kantemiroglu (Dimitri Cantemir, prince of Moldavia under Ottoman suzerainity, 1673-1723) developed different versions of this system and both notated an amountable of pieces of themselves as well as other composers. In a somehow similar fashion, Hamparsum Efendi (Hamparsum Limonciyan, remarkable composer of Turkish classical and Armenian Religious musics, 1768-1839) used letters of traditional Armenian show to notate the notes, durations, repeats, bars and sharps (enharmonics were used instead of flats). His system, which was made by the order of the Sultan Selim III, also an outstanding composer and performer, spread widely and served for two centuries. Armenian religious music is still notated with this system and some musicians still learn it to be able to decipher old manuscripts. I’m planning to learn it as well.

Ali Ufkí (Alberto B.L. Bobowski, 1610?-1675?) was the first musician who used the Western notation system in writing Turkish music. But he remains standalone until the 19th century in wich Western music oficially “entered” Turkish court. In 1828, Sultan Mahmud II (also a composer) apointed Guiseppe Donizetti (1788-1856, elder brother of Gaetano who used to call him “Il Turco”) as conducter and teacher of the royal band “Muzika-i Humâyûn”. Donizetti served until his death and trained numerous musicians, many of whom were talanted in both genres of music. From that time on, Western notation became the standard with its major opponent, Hamparsum system.

Until Rauf Yektâ (1871-1935, composer, theorist and performer) used some special accidentals to notate his unique but accoustically and practically wrong 24 tone system, the pieces were written without any additional marks. Musicians learned them orally and the score was not more than a leading note to remember. (What a fate! I recently notate my pieces in the current NWC just like this.) Rauf Yektâ used a flat with open navel, a flat with a cross dash on top of its stem, a sharp with two horizontal and one vertical lines and a sharp with three vertical and two horizontal dashes.

Hüseyin Saâdeddîn Arel (1880-1955), being a talented lawyer but having too insufficient knowledge in music theory and composition, took this system and brought up to a chaos. He replaced the open naveled and top dashed flats with the backward naveled one and the one with a dash on the middle of the stem. Unfortunately, his accoustically, logically and traditionally wrong tone and notation system has been being taught as the standard.

Composer and musicologist Yalçin Tura, whose 1988 book “Türk Mûsikísinin Mes’eleleri” (Problems of Turkish Music) is a real manifestation on several topics including theory, offered two additional marks to notate the at least a thousand year old traditional 17 tone system: the backward naveled flat and the sharp with one vertical and two horizontal dashes which I’ll call little sharp for -what we may call- diminished semitone. The standard sharp and flat gained their former non-12tet functions with a new interpretation. I currently use this notation that has international references.

Arabic music implements the dashed-stemed flat instead of the backward naveled.

I saw in the score that Özkan Manav (1967, contemporary Turkish composer writing eclectically in modern styles) used a flat with an arrow attached at its bottomside and a sharp with one attached to its top right corner, to notate quartertone glissandi in his “Wanderings - Gezinmeler”.

I observed in the samples of Anthony Cornicello’s doctoral dissertation on Tristan Murail’s “Desintegrations” that Murail, in that work, and Scelsi, in “Quattro Pezzi per Orchestra”, used the backward naveled flat, the little sharp and others.

Turkish folk musicians, although there is no practical or theorical diference with the classical dicipline, use flat 2, flat 3, sharp 6 and sharp 7; with related numbers located outside the top right corners of the standard marks.

Many notation programs, namely Finale, Sibelius, Lime, Melody Assistant and Harmony Assistant include most commonly used microtonal accidentals in their standard package. This was the major gap I found in Noteworthy Composer. Later, I realized two points: First, those “other” programs didn’t include every mark used in microtonal notation, second, Noteworthy’ this and many other gaps could be filled by “third party” support in some conditions.

Later, I started to grab out some marks from several fonts and prepare a font dedicated to accidentals. I hope it will soon be ready for alpha-test. But we need two major and one minor improvement at the “Expression placement” property on NWC side:

1) “Locate as key signature” or “insert custom text expression” into key signature with location options “just before” or “just after” the signature;
2)“Locate just before/just after the key signature”;
3)“Locate just before/just after the next note” (“at next note/bar” or “before all other staff signatures” don’t do)

As a related subject, we can have percussion clef or other seldom used clefs as text expression but we need again the same imprevements, maybe with the addition of “locate as clef signature” or “locate just before/after clef signature” or even “locate between clef and key signatures” or better “input custom text expression” within key signature with “just before/just after” options.

These are my most prior wishes.

Hth.

Ertugrul

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 09-Feb-2001

Thanks Grant,

[>]
...different people have different definitions of "microtonal"...
[/]

For instance, Turkish/Midle Eastern music is NOT microtonal. Its additional intervals are wider than a semitone but narrower than a whole tone. But it DOES need microtonal accidentals because those marks mean whole tone minus specific tone.

Some other instances:

Ivan Wychnegradsky (Russian composer, later emigrated to France, pupil of Scriabin) got the 24 tone scale by tuning a piano a quarter tone lower and using it together the "normal" one.

Harry Partch divided the octave into 43 intervals and built a complete theory explained in his book "Genesis of a Music"

Alois Haba used 1/4 and 1/6 intervals and wrote operas. He also built a "non-thematical" style on that tone system.

Mexican pioneer composer Julian Carrillo divided a tone into 1/4, 1/8 and 1/16 tones. He composed symphonies and concertos in this system.

Several distinct composers as Ernst Bloch, Bela Bartok, Karlheinz Stockhausen and others have used microtonality within their music.

Addition to my previous reply:

Turkish composer M. Ekrem Karadeniz divided the octave into 41 "commas and built a system depending on Pythagorean theory and his teacher Abdulkádir Töre (of Eastern Turkistan origin). He unsuccessfully tried to explain Turkish music based upon his system in his book "Türk Mûsikísinin Esaslarý ve Nazariyesi". He naturally used numerous accidentals to notate his system.

Reply 4 offered by: Art Thompson on 10-Feb-2001

Wow.

Ok, ignoring for the moment the systems unique to individual composers, and largely unused since, let's focus on the scales that have lasting cultural significance, as the Turkish 17 note scale you mentioned, which survives a milennium. What is the structure? You mention a flat 2, for example. Is that a 1/4 tone above 1, or a 1/4 tone below a major 2nd? How can Turkish music not be microtonal if it squeezes 17 notes into 1 octave. Please explain further, if you would.

Reply 5 offered by: Art Thompson on 10-Feb-2001

By the way, in Joni Mitchell's recording of the song "Paprika Plains" (Album: Don Juan's reckless daughter), the piano is about a quarter tone off from the orchestra. Makes for an interesting dark harmony

Reply 6 offered by: Fred on 10-Feb-2001

Since there is such a wide range of meaning behind the term "microtones", I thought it safe to comment on an approach I've used: use existing notation, modifying its meaning. For instance, if you wanted a 17-tone equal tempered scale, you could use:

C C# Db D D# Eb E F F# Gb G G# Ab A A# Bb B

Given 7 note names and two accidentals (# or b), this idea could be continued up to scales containing 21 tones per octave. If you also include the double-flat and double-sharp symbols, you have (in principle) enough symbols to do up to 35 tones per octave.

For purposes of intelligibility to others, a "definition" document would of course have to be added to the scores files.

Reply 7 offered by: Alain on 11-Feb-2001

You can read (if you can and if yon want), the book of
Vincente Mendoza "panorama de la musica traditional de Mexico".(in american language olso )
Microtone = space samaller than half tone .
Julian Carillo, an indian, began his artistic career in the street, as a popular violonist ther, he understook musical studies, first in Mexico, the in Germany, at Leipzig.
Since 1895, he has been composing works in quater, third, eights of tone, for which he made make microtones instruments.
We remind Preludio a Colon for voice and microtones instruments.

Bests Regards
Alain

Reply 8 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 11-Feb-2001

Hi all,

Firstly, I must apologize for causing you to wait for the reply. I have been facing a problem when I press the reply button; an error message comes out and I can't reply. Eric kindly mailed me an alternative url so that I can do now.

Fred,

The practice you mention is similar to what Tura offers and I use, contrasting at one point that eg C# is higher than Db in our way. The bacward naveled flatted D is the enharmonic of C# and "little sharped" C of Db. But, for sake of following a more or less common method, I must use special characters.

Alain,

Thanks for the information about Carrillo. "Preludio a Cristobal Colón" is really a good example on his microtonality.

And Art...

Let's at first make a definition of microtonal interval. If it is "an interval smaller than whole tone except semitone" then Turkish tone system is microtonal. But if we say "an interval smaller than semitone" we cannot mention that. Why?

The "special" interval, or maybe "interval class" used in Turkish/Midle Eastern music is smaller than a whole tone but larger than a semitone. It varies approximately from 2/3 to 3/4 tone. The rest, ie 1/4 to 1/3 tone isn't used as is. It's "widened" to "minimum" semitone.

So what is "minimum semitone"?

Actually, the whole thing is about the harmonic series. Have you ever run Fred's Harmonic Analyser? Enter 33 for number of harmonics to be taken into account. What you will get is an equally tempered scale consisting of 17 notes. n harmonics of a fundamental note produces (n+1)/2 pitches. Turkish tone system consists of 17 intervals and those are produced by 33 harmonics. So, the smallest melodic interval to be used within this system is 33/32.

I hope I will soon prepare an article on this issue including some examples, NWC's and comprehensive diagrams. I'm afraid those accoustical stuff is not so clear for most of us, so I'll include some basic information on harmonic (overtone/subtone) series, interval ratios and scale formation.

I'm going to announce both here and at the newsgroup.

Best Regards,
Ertugrul

Reply 9 offered by: Jeremy Ewen on 13-Feb-2001

Just in case people here aren't aware of it, I thought you might like to learn of Graham Breed's microtonal website, at http://www.cix.co.uk/~gbreed/

It's a mine of information, not just on weird 12-tone temperaments. On some of the links you can actually listen to some MIDI tracks composed using microtones. Very interesting.

Jeremy

Reply 10 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 13-Feb-2001

John Starret's Microtonal Music site with plenty of links:

http://www-math.cudenver.edu/~jstarret/microtone.html

and some others:

http://www.harmonics.com/lucy/
http://www.bikexprt.com/music/
http://www.panix.com/~ro/tuning/tuning.html
http://www.tiac.net/users/xen/xh/

By the way, let me announce a really qualified website on Turkish music, including articles about Turkish tone system, notation and theory besides useful information on composers, compositions, recordings as well as free downloadable scores:

http://www.turkmusikisi.com

Unfortunately, they're only in Turkish. But those of you who are interested can request an English version by mailing to alitutan@turkmusikisi.com as I have already done.

Oh, this doesn't mean that I won't keep my promise; I will prepare the article I mentioned.

Reply 11 offered by: Art Thompson on 19-Feb-2001

Thanks to all. This has been a great thread. Ertugrul, thanks for your postings, which flow like poetry.

Reply 12 offered by: Stephen R. on 23-Feb-2001

My thanks too to Ertugrul for raising the issue and for his learned exposition of the use of microtonic intervals (more accurately, of intervals expanded by microtonic degrees) and of notation systems in the Near East. I want to expand the discussion briefly--I am writing from memory and cannot cite sources, so that's all I can do at this point.

There is a set of modified sharps and flats used by Iranian musicians to designate the intervals they use.

In India, it is customary to divide the octave into twenty-two, rather than twenty-four, intervals. (I believe Mieczyslaw Kolinski wrote an article on this).

Byzantine chant also makes use of such intervals, and divides its scales into three groups: "diatonic" (employing whole- and half-tone intervals similar to those of Western music), "chromatic" (employing augmented seconds), and "enharmonic" (employing microtones). In the nineteenth century, a commission of the Greek Church divided the octave into sixy-eight parts; a revision of this system went to seventy-two. All authorities agree that the psalts do not actually observe these extremely fine intervals, and in practice an octave of twenty-four intervals (or twenty-two, as proposed by the Romanian cantor Anton Pann, apparently with no influence from India) would be adequate to notate the chant on the staff. Since this chant continues to employ neumes, there is no official system for transcribing it to the staff.

There are a number of items that have been proposed on the wish list that seem to me to need support: some form of microtonic notation--is there a consensus that quarter-tone signs would suffice?; a reciting note for psalm tones and the like; and shape note, both four- and seven- shape. Let's bug the honchos of NoteWorthy until they add these.

Stephen R.

Reply 13 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 23-Feb-2001

Apart from the notation, does someone know if there is a solution for « sounding » a score with microtonal intervals ?

As far as I know, even with a pitch bend, it is impossible to have a chord with two notes in the same channel, if both notes do not belong to the same tempered scale. This means you should use one channel for each pitch, which limits to 15 different pitches (one channel is reserved for drums).

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 23-Feb-2001

I don't think the situation is this dire. If you're using exact quarter-tones, it should be possible to produce any possible chord using just 2 tracks. Just bend 1 track upwards or downwards by a quarter tone and leave the other one alone.

Reply 15 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 26-Feb-2001

> If you're using exact quarter-tones, it should be possible
> to produce any possible chord using just 2 tracks.

You are absolutely right. But which of the existing microtonic scales would content with exact quarter-tones ?

Reply 16 offered by: Grant on 26-Feb-2001

Well, the 24-note equal temperament scale, for one (used e.g. by Lejaren Hiller and Ivan Wychnegradsky, mentioned above), not to mention the short plunges into microtonality by composers like Bloch and Bartók. Some of Haba's music, I believe, was in strict quarter-tones as well. In addition, one of the historically attested tunings of the ancient Greek "enharmonic" genus was very close to modern quarter-tones.

Stephen R. suggests above that Byzantine chant can in practice be adequately notated by a 24-note scale. I'd also be interested in finding out more about the 22-note Indian scale Stephen mentions. Depending on how the division is done, might not a 24-pitch scale be adequately close? (I wonder what the average pitch discrimination really is of a listener raised in the Western European musical tradition.)

Reply 17 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC on 26-Feb-2001

Stephen wrote:

<>
There is a set of modified sharps and flats used by Iranian musicians to designate the intervals they use.
</>

I've just provided a copy of a Iran Santur method and I could observe their way of explaining the tone system as well as their notation. They pragmatically divide the tone into four "strict" quartertones and use a special flat and a special sharp for the interval (I'll include the notation in the article as well as in the font). This workaround doesn't cover the theoretical tone system but brings out an easy way in learning the music. And I must admit that it's much more better than the current "official" Turkish "explanation"

<>
There are a number of items that have been proposed on the wish list that seem to me to need support: some form of microtonic notation--is there a consensus that quarter-tone signs would suffice?; a reciting note for psalm tones and the like; and shape note, both four- and seven- shape. Let's bug the honchos of NoteWorthy until they add these.

</>

I suggest you re-read my previous replies. I'm insistent that if sufficient text editing/placing options are provided, we can supply not only microtonic notation, but almost whatever we need/want with user fonts.

Robert Allgeyer's drum notation font is, imo, a genious approach as it brings up the usage of lyric lines, avoiding the necessity of a secondary layered staff.

Olivier wrote:

<>
Apart from the notation, does someone know if there is a solution for " sounding " a score with microtonal intervals ?

As far as I know, even with a pitch bend, it is impossible to have a chord with two notes in the same channel, if both notes do not belong to the same tempered scale. This means you should use one channel for each pitch, which limits to 15 different pitches (one channel is reserved for drums).
</>

Download Fred's marvellous midi tempering tools. I made a whole dramatical music sequence with their help.

On the other hand, if you have more than one midi port (eg SB Live! offers three), you probably wouldn't run out of channels. (I currently have 5 available midi ports, 4 of whom simultaneously)

Reply 18 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC on 26-Feb-2001

Some words about Byzantine Music:

As it survived till today, it's not practically different -in intervals and genera- than the mentioned Middle/Eastern system. Going further, I can say that it's almost the same -except for unique melodical patterns- with Ottoman/Turkish classical art music. Now I can hear nationalistic objections from both some Turks and Greeks, even hopelessly claiming each one derived from the other, but this is nonsense for both situations. One can -particularly correctly- comment that this is caused of living together for 6 centuries but we have theoretical works surviving from the 10th century, that unites the entire system of near east with as far as Ancient Greeks.

Byzantine Liturgy has a unique notation. There has been also several approaches on explaining the tone system. All of those are, as mentione above for Arabic, Persian and Turkish systems, pragmatical. ne of the most popular ones is the "tonos" division, in which the octave is divided into 30 equal parts and each specific interval consists of a certain number of "tonos"'s.

I had wrote some studies in this fashion. None of them is Byzantine chant but the intervals are tempered according to the "Tonos" system.

They're available in my "List of Works" page: (the midifiles are tempered)

http://ertugrulinanc.8m.com/compositions.html

Warning: The host doesn't let NWC files to be executed. You'll need to download them.

Reply 19 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 22-Apr-2001

Perhaps you haven't noticed;

My promised article serie has begun at
Eastern Tone System
for those interested.

Regards...

Reply 20 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Apr-2001

This is msg #2050 for those viewing this thread offline.

Reply 21 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 20-Aug-2001

Third of the articles has been posted.

Reply 22 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 20-Aug-2001

msg #2198 fails to link to the thread.

Reply 23 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 20-Aug-2001

Interesting. It misleads to 1/2198 when used within the text context. However, works properly when used barely.

So, I'm repeating the report:

Third article on Eastern Tone System has been posted as msg #2198.


#1953: Midi stuff
Midi stuff

(1953)

Submitted by: Owen Pigott on 10-Feb-2001

Hi someone please help me. I have several midis that i somehow want to turn into a single midi file where they all play consecutivly. Any ideas email dvergatal@hotmail.com

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Feb-2001

midicat.exe available from Günter Nagler's site:

http://www2.iicm.edu/Cpub#freemidi

Unless the midis are already in Type 0 format you'll also need his midi1to0.exe, and (optionally, if you want to convert back to Type 1 afterwards) midi0to1.exe.

Have fun!

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 10-Feb-2001

Depending upon the number, you could import the midis into Noteworthy, highlight the relevant stave, and copy paste onto the prior tune.


#1954: Soundblaster Live Cards
Soundblaster Live Cards

(1954)

Submitted by: Jeremy Ewen on 11-Feb-2001

After all the positive comments on this range of cards, I'm really tempted to upgrade my SB PCI128 card for a Live value or 5.1, so that I can use Soundfonts. The thing I would like to know is, do any of the Live cards have an amplified speaker output? The PCI128 that I have has around 5 watts per channel and is really good because I do not have powered speakers.

Reply 1 offered by: Art Thompson on 11-Feb-2001

As far as I know - No. All the SBL's are the same basic card, with different software features affecting the price.
But you can pick up a 'decent' sounding set of speakers with Subwoofer for about $40.Add it to your SBL budget. The SBL supports front and back speaker sets, by the way.
I went with an SBL Value based on the advice from this forum, and am quite pleased.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 11-Feb-2001

The Live! Value lacks digital output while Platinum has "Live! Drive" for midi in/out, spdif in/out and secondary line in.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Feb-2001

The manufacturer has the answer:

http://www.soundblaster.com

Another good resource:

http://www.soundblaster.com/compare/compare.asp

In short, the Live! does not have an amplifier built into it. This is usually a very good thing if you want higher quality audio.

Reply 4 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 15-Feb-2001

Live! Value lacks Digital output? If you mean digital audio output, you are quite mistaken. I have an SBLive! value and it came with digital speakers and an option to switch between digital and analog output! Unless Gateway2000 switched to "real" SBLive!s instead of Value (and my computer is lying to me), Value *does* have digital output.

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 15-Feb-2001

You could try a soundfont that emulates the Roland soundset.
Try http://www.hammersound.net
Check the 12Mb Chaos font I'm told that's based on the Roland sounds.

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Feb-2001

Drakhan,

I might be mistaken but as far as I know from a last year's magazine essay, which is old enough for computer technology, Live value supports digital/optical output through an additional card which you need to pay for. Creative may already have changed the policy or the essay may be totally false.

http://www.soundblaster.com would be the best place to check.

Reply 7 offered by: someone on 17-Feb-2001

To Roland seekers:

I have installed the VSC 88 which I had downloaded sometime ago and I think it's wonderful! Especially the percussion, solo strings and some brass, namely the trumpet and tuba, are much better than Live 8MB sf. But...

It suffers from a 500 msec. delay even in my PIII 550 Mhz. + 128 MB RAM w. SB Live! Platinum. I don't face that problem with Yamaha SY-XG 50. If you decrease the delay from setup, it tackles.

The driver is from 1998 and I did a websearch for a newer release but there isn't any downloadable one. I had found mine from a personal site which offered a crack with it so I cannot post the URL.

Except for the delay problem which prevents the synthesizer from being used together others, it can be worth paying ~$60 for the full version.

Reply 8 offered by: Grimblefritz on 18-Feb-2001

I purchased the VSC88 recently. The sound is terrific, even on an old P200/Pro with an SB16. There is the delay, which is not a problem for me as I was simply looking for better sound during playback. But the big reason I purchased it ($69 from www.edirol.com) is that it can render MIDI to WAV with the click of a button.

Reply 9 offered by: Art Thompson on 19-Feb-2001

back to the Live Value debate. I believe that the newest version includes digital out.

Reply 10 offered by: Kevin on 24-Feb-2001

I have a Live! Value that came with a computer I purchased in Sept of '99 which includes digital I/O via 1/8" jack.

Reply 11 offered by: Robert C. Nichols on 24-Mar-2001

I Just purchased a new PC with a Soundblaster Live card
installed.
When I play my NWC Files the sound has completly changed from my Old Soundblaster Card AEW64. The Sound got bad to worse.

Any Hints??

Thanks

Robert

Please E-Mail Me at: RCN1@ix.Netcom.Com

Reply 12 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 24-Mar-2001

Probably, your default midi device is Creative S/W Synth. It's not rather good, except for the drumset. Change your default midi device (Control Panel > Multimedia > MIDI) as A: SB Live MIDI Synth.

For NWC, you can refer to the linked screenshot of Tools > Options > MIDI. (Don't take "Yamaha SXG Driver" and "Roland VSC-88" granted; they are additionaly installed in my system.)

http://ertugrulinanc.8m.com/_misc/midi_ports.gif

Hth and regards.

Reply 13 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 24-Mar-2001

[Excuse me for the inconvenience. My d@mn host did it again. The .gif file isn't accessible. Let me try writing the list down: (Sysop may remove the previous reply) ]

The "Single Device" in Control Panel > Multimedia > MIDI will be:

A: SB Live MIDI Synth

The sequence of "Devices used for playback" in NWC's Tools > Options > MIDI must be as follows:

A: SB Live MIDI Synth
B: SB Live MIDI Synth
Creative S/W Synth.

Hth


#1955: adding slash marks
adding slash marks

(1955)

Submitted by: Zane Johnston on 12-Feb-2001

I'm new at this stuff and I can't figure out how to add "slash marks",i.e. chord symbols on top,4/4 time, 4 slashes per measure...
I see them in many charts, but I can't figure out how to use NWC to place them in my score.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Feb-2001

You can use the slash (lives with the ? on your keyboard) entered as text using the x or X key command. For an example of how this can be used for rhythm indications, have a look at:

http://www.netidea.com/~fredn/nwc/frogsong.nwc

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Feb-2001

Oops... forgot to mention that the tremolo marks on the slashes come from an external font, specifically "Boxmarks" available in the "Helpful files" section at the NWC Scriptorium:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/


#1956: Layering, Slur and Tie direction
Layering, Slur and Tie direction

(1956)

Submitted by: Steve Pearson on 13-Feb-2001

Did not find this in some brief checking, so I'll toss it here with apologies if I overlooked the tip elsewhere.

For layered parts, I have known that one could simply highlight the entire stave and then hit shift "up arrow" or shift "down arrow" to change the direction of stems in the entire stave before layering the staff. (i.e. stem up for the soprano, stem down for the alto, etc.)

Had not realized that the same could be done to change all tie and slur directions for an entire selected staff in a single step, prior to layering. Simply select the staff, right click for properties, go to the "notes" tab, and select the slur and tie direction (upwards for soprano and tenor, downward for tenor and bass).

duh!


#1957: Sheetmusic on the net
Sheetmusic on the net

(1957)

Submitted by: Steven on 14-Feb-2001

Hello.

I play the piano and luv Noteworth Composer. I would like to
know whether anyone has or knows of any sites that contain
nwc. files for download, preferebly popular music.

I have already gone to the www.vadu.com/nwc/ site but it doesnt contain very popular music.

Please if anyone knows of any sites
give me the information.

Thankyou

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-Feb-2001

Because of copyright issues most public post sites tend to avoid songs on which copyright still exists.
Unfortunately they become a repository of older out-of-copyright works and the occasional excellent piece of original contemporary work.

Reply 2 offered by: someone on 14-Feb-2001

Have you explored the links at

http://www.ntworthy.com/composer/userlinks.htm

?

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 14-Feb-2001

Barry's remark is very appropriate. There is a tendency among Internet users to assume that everything is free. Even "free" (at no charge) items often come with restrictions on use. Also, a lot of items that can be downloaded are not at all "free," merely easy to find.

Popular music, and recent compositions of any kind, are almost certainly not free. There is a good chance that if you come across something popular -- for example, sheet music for a Beatles song -- it has been placed on the Internet in violation of copyright. Hobbyists sometimes do this, and it appears that in some cases the copyright holders look the other way if there seems to be no harm done. But that does not mean that the item is free and legal.

Some artists intentionally make their works freely available. The copyright holder (originator) is merely extending rights to other persons, often under restricted conditions. To put this another way, if something is actually free, it may still be copyrighted and usually is.


#1958: Triplets
Triplets

(1958)

Submitted by: Monty Arce on 14-Feb-2001

What is the difference between three quarter notes and three tripletted dotted quarters in a 3/4 measure?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Feb-2001

Three dots and a triplet designation.

There is no audible difference, but one is definately easier to understand from a performer's perspective.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Feb-2001

It's rather like the difference between the sound of one hand clapping, and the sound of the other hand clapping.

Seriously, a dot increases the length of a note to 150% (fractionally, that would be 3/2). Tripletising reduces the length of the note to 2/3. So triplet-dotted notes equal the unmodified note. (3/2 * 2/3 = 1)

I can't think of a situation offhand where there's a reason to use the tripletised dotted notes... unless it's as a joke, as I suspect the question may have been.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 15-Feb-2001

This very topic came up recently in another thread (!) and it seems to me you could make the argument, tenuous though it might he, that dotted triplets make sense in some circumstances. For example, in 6/8 meter, if you have a melody in even dotted quarters, an interpolated 3/4 measure might be easier to read as a triplet of dotted quarters than as three undotted quarters, because the context already has the performer thinking in dotted quarters. This is mere hypothesis, though, and I haven't tested it.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 15-Feb-2001

For some reason, there are a lot of hymns that use 6/8 time, I believe becuase they were based on Irish folk melodies. It may well be that the tripletted-dotted-quarter combination would be easier for a singer to interpret if th rest of the music were in steady dotted-quarters. However, most of the 6/8 hymns I've seen use quarters, or dotted quarters follwed by eighths.


#1959: Sound Canvas SC-15 DB - With PCI ?
Sound Canvas SC-15 DB - With PCI ?

(1959)

Submitted by: Gilad on 15-Feb-2001

Hi !

I have the great DB SC-15 from Roland.
I replace my motherboard to one without ISA slots,
and got soundblaster live value.
But I miss the great midi sound of roland.
Doe's anyone know where I can get midi PCI card
with connector to SC-15 ?

Thanks in advance,
Gilad.

Reply 1 offered by: Bjoern on 23-Jan-2002

I've just been looking for a solution to the same problem, and it seems as if some or all of Turtle Beach's PCI soundcards still come with a Waveblaster Connector. I'm currently looking for a second hand Montego or Montego II...


#1960: Treble to Bass clef from PDF files
Treble to Bass clef from PDF files

(1960)

Submitted by: Howard on 18-Feb-2001

Is it possible to copy a PDF file with music in it (on a treble clef) to NoteWorthy Composer to change it into a bass clef to print out?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Feb-2001

Short answers:

Manually: yes

Automatically: no

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 18-Feb-2001

If you have a scanner, scan in the printed music, save in tiff format and use a music OCR program such as Sharpeye (www.visiv.com) to convert into a midi file. Then use Noteworthy to open the file and make the adjustments.

Depending upon the length of piece and skill on the keyboard, it may be simpler to simply play in the music if you have a keyboard. Noteworthy has sequencing capabilities.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 18-Feb-2001

A PDF document cannot normally be edited in Acrobat Reader, or even the full Acrobat. But PDF files can be opened as drawing objects in programs such as Adobe Illustrator (and some others, I believe) if you own one of them. You would then ungroup the image, select the treble clef, delete it, and enter a bass clef from a suitable font. You would still need a music font installed. Or, you could manually draw a bass clef.

Another strategy, if you don't have a drawing program or a scanner, but do have a good paint (image) program: Open your PDF file in Acrobat Reader, magnify it to 100% or whatever looks best. Use the image select tool, and select the entire page (one page at a time). Copy to the clipboard. Paste the image, which is now a bitmap, into a suitable program. There, erase the treble clef and pencil in a bass clef.

If you have GSview (Ghostscript) you can open the PDF file then export or print it as an image, to be edited in your image program.

But in general, I believe the advice given by the others is more to the point.

I assume you are aware that when you change the clef, the music is NOT merely lower on the same scale notes. The center-line of the treble clef is B. But the center line on the bass clef is D.

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 20-Feb-2001

Note for Steve's reply:

SharpEye supports tiff's only "principally". It actually works with b/w bmp's, which must be very very clear for the program to be able to recognize.

I have some PDF extracted bmp's and the program doesn't see anything.

I'm afraid this music ocr thing is not much different than wav to midi utopia.


#1961: sound modules
sound modules

(1961)

Submitted by: Christopher Clark on 22-Feb-2001

am interested in purchasing a sound module because
my computer's sound card just isn't cutting it for me.

i am quite niave on the subject and wanted to ask
what kind of sound modules work best with noteworthy?
i am looking for a more authentic and realistic sound
when i hear my music played back.

I am a classical composer, but i do want a wide range of electronic insrumentation. i might want to try my hand at composing some rock music someday.

does notheworthy work well with any different type of sound module? i've tried doing the research myself, but it's like trying to learn a new language. one sound module that seemed to be appealing was the Korg i40M. does anyone have one?

when i purchase a sound module i know i will need midi cables connecting it to my computer's hard drive, but will i also need additional memory or a new program? would the module come with such a program, should i do need it?

i need help. someone please enlighten me! sound modules don't seem to be cheap. so i want to make the best choice i can.

i sure could use a little guidance. thanks in advance for responding.

:)

~christopher

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Feb-2001

There is no right answer regarding your question. The most affordable way to do expand your MIDI capabilities is to focus on your computer's built-in capabilities. Consider getting a better sound card, or expanding the current one's capabilities. For example, if you have a SoundBlaster Live, explore the world of Sound Fonts. If you search on sound fonts in this forum, you will find a number of threads to get you started.

If you insist on buying an external sound module, it would probably be a good idea to visit a retail outlet or web store, and explore the kind of modules that are available.

Reply 2 offered by: Bob Boren on 22-Feb-2001

I have a Roland sound module (I think the model number is sc-88vl) which I picked up used a couple of years ago for around $200 from a music shop in Santa Monica, Califonia (on the street next to the prominade). The Roland name for these products is "Sound Canvas".
I'm very satisfied with the module. I use it with both a laptop and a desktop machine. It hooks into the desktop machine via a midi cable. No software is required, but as I remember you have to set it up in control panel to be the source of the playback, instead of your internal sound card.
I use a serial cable to connect to the laptop. This takes a special driver which can be downloaded from Roland's website.
The main reason I went this way instead of a better sound card: I have 4 kids who use the desktop computer for everything from games to homework projects, and I didn't want to install a new sound card that may have caused problems with the games. I also wanted to be able to switch between the desktop and laptop machines and have the same set of sounds to work with.

These sound modules work pretty good - I haven't heard any sound cards that are as good myself (but there are probably some out there that I don't know about). Buying one new is not cheap - I think the current Roland model is almost $900. It has more capability than mine does (more sounds, new samples of strings, more voices) but the one I have works just fine for me. I'm also a classical composer, working on a symphony at the present time. The Roland unit does a really nice job of playing back my score.

Good Luck!

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 22-Feb-2001

If you have a slow CPU by contemporary standards (even an original Pentium at 100 MHz may be "slow" in this context), then you may find that processing complex music results in inaccuracies. Moral: before you spend a lot of money buying fancy peripherals, make sure that they are compatible with the overall capability of your system.

On the other hand, even a "slow" system can sound good if you live within its capabilities. For example, I doubt if Eric Clapton can process 32-bit instructions at a clock rate of 100+ MHz.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Feb-2001

I really like my Yamaha DB50XG "daughterboard." It's rather like a dedicated module, except that it simply plugs into any SB16-type card with the "waveblaster" plug-in header plug. You can find them on ebay occasionally, though they're in pretty high demand and therefore still fetch a good price.

AFAIK, the implementation I have (complete with the main soundboard) is still available from http://www.mediatrix.com -- it's called the Audiotrix 3D-XG. It does require an ISA slot (not all mainboards have them these days) but on the bright side it requires very little system resources, running fine on a 486-33 or 386-40. So you could conceivably set up an older "spare" computer, running Win3.1, and use that as a dedicated "module" via the joystick port for midi I/O ... at about 1/3 of the price of the Roland module.

Fred


#1962: Shaped Notes
Shaped Notes

(1962)

Submitted by: J McLain on 23-Feb-2001

Is there any way I can turn the standard round note format into the do, re, me, fa, sol, la, ti, do, format. Does anyone know if there are any plans or any hopes that this will ever happen.
Thank you for your time
J. McLain

Reply 1 offered by: joan on 22-Mar-2001

I am looking for the same type program because the music we use in church is in shaped notes? I am looking for other people who may have similar interests in music.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 23-Mar-2001

I don't know about NWC's plans in this regard. There are competing programs that can do shaped notes (a.k.a. Fasola), but if your main application is church music, you may find that the learning curve is too steep.

You might try contacting someone via this web site:
http://www.fasola.org

It is some sort of educational site for shaped-note music.

Reply 3 offered by: J McLain on 24-Mar-2001

The learning curve is no problem. I Have punched in many songs using the available round note format (no problem) It only poses a visual challenge. For me it is just more visually apealing to see the shaped notes. I also want this for Hymn music. Those of us who have studied this type of music, are trained to know what a note sounds like by its shape or appearance, not where it is at on the staff. So you can see what a disadvantage we face with round notes, (it is like looking at a foreign language) it just isnt readable by the methods we have been taught. Oh well enough rambling. Maybe someday.
John

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 24-Mar-2001

Sorry, I was not clear in my previous posting.

The "learning curve" I referred to was not regarding musical notation. I was referring to learning how to use another software program.

Reply 5 offered by: J McLain on 27-Mar-2001

Your right Joe. That is always a steep curve.


#1963: Create folders?
Create folders?

(1963)

Submitted by: Stephen R. on 23-Feb-2001

I would like to group my saved song files in NWC into several folders. As usual, the help files tell me nothing useful, and so far I don't even know whether this is possible, much less how to do it. Can someone advise?

Stephen R.

Reply 1 offered by: Hank on 23-Feb-2001

Hmmmmm.. Seems like the easiest way would be to right click on your desktop, go to "new" in the window that opens, then click on "folder". Rename the new folder to "My Music" or whatever you like. Then open the new folder and repeat the process inside the new folder, naming the sub-folders with whatever groups of music you like.
You can then direct NWC to start out in the folder you created on the desktop and open whichever sub-folder you want in the NWC window.

Hope this helps - The Hankster

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 23-Feb-2001

I imagine the reason it hasn't been covered in the help file is that NWC can write to any specified directory, as can most (if not all) Windows applications.

Hank's suggestion works if you want your music files on the desktop (physically, this puts them into the Windows\Desktop directory) but any valid directory will do. The default directory can be set in Options, but you can always override the default by browsing to the desired directory in the Open File / Save As... dialogs.

Reply 3 offered by: John Gillings on 26-Feb-2001

The "Save As" dialog allows you to select any existing
folder - it also allows you to create a new folder. Click
the icom of a folder with a kid of starburst on the top
right hand corner. This will create a folder called
"NewFolder" which you can then rename. You can also use
right click on any file or folder in the directory list
to perform normal file maintenance - copy, rename, delete,
etc...
This is true for any application which uses the standard
windows dialogs. That's why it's not documented specifically
by NoteWorthy.

Reply 4 offered by: Artur on 27-Feb-2001

Also, the first time you use "Save" command, it works as "Save as"


#1964: sound modules and keyboards
sound modules and keyboards

(1964)

Submitted by: christopher Clark on 24-Feb-2001

I've been trying desperately to become more educated on the subject of Midi Keyboards and Sound Modules. It's as if everything is written in French. I am at a lost with technical terms and other items listed under the speficiations when i look at keyboards online. maybe someone can help me.

I've been trying to figure out what my best option would be to improve the sound quality of the music i write with Noteworthy. I have concluded that i do not want to expand on my computer's internal parts. The main reason being that it isn't my computer.

The type of music i compose consists of many different instruments from strings, to electric guitars, woodwinds...i use them all. so i don't want to constrict my range of instruments and sounds to choos from. what is the term for how many instruments a keyboard can play? is that "polythany" (excuse my spelling!)?

I also do not want to limit how many different instruments i can write for in one song. Currently, i have one composition that has 16 different instruments, each having chords and what not. So, something that can play many insruments at once. Is this what they call "channels"?

Ultimately, my goal is to be able to write anything from a rock song (with a couple of guitars, drums, and a keyboard), to paino concertos, to band and symphony scores. i would like something that has a realistic sound with it's instruments(although it doesn't have to fool everyone, just me...and i'm not that hard to fool!).

it would also be nice to be able to record my music onto a CD or cassette to show off with my family and friends.

so, something with many istruments, can play up to at least 16 instruments at once, and has somewhat of a realistic, rich sound. oh, and completely Noteworthy friendly. can anyone reccomend a good, not too pricy keyboard or sound module? or perhaps an internet site that could help me learn and explore the options i have.

My budget will allow me to go up to $1,000 for what i want. Maybe higher. This, after all, is just a hobby.

Many instrumets, good sound, can play a symphony, module or keyboard...help!

Christopher
CBC1973y@Yahoo.com


#1965: transposing notes
transposing notes

(1965)

Submitted by: Peter on 26-Feb-2001

My problem is trying to transpose notes only and not the entire staff. I have been unable to do this to date and would be incredibly grateful for a break through.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 26-Feb-2001

Individual notes can be transposed by selecting then use the Ctrl/Up or Down Arrows followed by adding any accidentals.
To transpose a passage - create another staff with the original key sig.- copy and paste the section to the new staff - use Tools/Transpose to set the new key.
Cut and paste the section back into the original score.

Reply 2 offered by: someone on 26-Feb-2001

You meant Ctrl+Shift+Up/Down, didn't you?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Feb-2001

If you wish to specifically transpose a selected range of notes, you need to cut and paste into a new staff temporarily.

You can also move a selection up and down using Ctrl+Shift+Up/Down Arrows, as described above.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 27-Feb-2001

Clarification: There is a difference between *moving* one or more notes up or down (because they were originally placed incorrectly), and *transposing* a complete composition (or section of music) because you want to play it in a different key.

If a note is *moved* one position upwards, the movement might corresponding to a semitone (half-step), two semitones (a whole step), or something else.

Highlighting one or more notes, then using SHIFT+CTRL+up or down arrow *moves* the notes. Only in some cases will this be the equivalent of a key-change transposition.

Reply 5 offered by: peter on 28-Feb-2001

Thank you Joe Music, Noteworthy Online, Barry Graham and someone, for helping me out. You found the answer.


#1966: Keyboard Shortcut
Keyboard Shortcut

(1966)

Submitted by: Taran on 26-Feb-2001

Is there any Keyboard-shortcut for the "MIDI Input archive"-button (the button which activates the step by step MIDI input with an external MIDI keyboard)?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Feb-2001

Alt+T, then I...


#1967: Automatic file backup
Automatic file backup

(1967)

Submitted by: Tim on 26-Feb-2001

Hi, I was just wondering. Is there anyway to have noteworthy back up your file as your working on it so that you don't have to lose an hours work if the power goes off. I seem to remember this feature being on a previous version..I could be wrong...Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Feb-2001

Tools | Options | File | Auto save/recovery


#1968: Another NWC wishlist
Another NWC wishlist

(1968)

Submitted by: Kevin M on 26-Feb-2001

I hope I'm not being horribly redundant. I've scanned over the forum's more recent threads, and spotted another wishlist; but there are some things missing which I feel would be very beneficial to NWC's later versions.

1) 8va, 8vb controls which function in playback. Using hidden staves for playback and other staves for printing is fine, but it strikes me as a "brute force" solution, and it's a pain to edit both staves down the road if you want to change something major. Scoring parts more than 3 or 4 ledger lines above or below a staff quickly becomes unreadable. Addition of trill and arpeggiation controls would further help to make hidden staves unnecessary.

2) Make the Insert toolbar editable by the user. While this is a fantastic addition to the program, I would love to be able to rearrange the buttons, add my own and pull the ones I don't use.

3) Playing of grace notes. Currently Noteworthy plays grace notes as a short burst of notes beginning at the point where the arrival note would have played. Grace notes, by definition, should sound before the impact of the arrival note. Or possibly make it the composer's choice, as a property of the grace note(s).

4) Ped. symbol should (in my humble opinion) function as a pedal release and pedal down in one. Currently, if the pedal is down, and you add a following Ped. symbol, no release occurs.

5) Simply for cosmetic reasons, addition of linear ("hairpin") crescendo/decrescendo symbols would be nice to have available. Currently I can only add a Cresc. or Desresc. symbol leading to a new dynamic. This makes the notation of swells and other expressive dynamic shifts quite bulky.

6) Playback in loop could be handy in some applications. (Not sure if NWP supports this?)

7) Percussion notation- yes, I admit- I am a percussionist, most of the time. It would be very handy to be able to add some common percussion notation, such as rolls, notes with x heads instead of standard dots, flam grace note (normal grace note with a slash across it), and + signs in the place of the stacatto dot (mallet notation for dead stroke). All of these can be accomplished by hand after printing, but the computer can always do things more neatly. Also, not so much for scoring, but for individual parts, the ability to insert multiple bar rests and the infamous "repeat last measure" symbol (including multiple bar versions) would be invaluable.

8) Lastly, I've discovered a bug regarding printing a score with measure numbers. I recenly scribed a piece, wherein the first 5 or 6 bars were each a repeated section. Using the Local Repeat controls, I was able to reproduce the score precisely. However, in printout, on lines where the first bar begins with a repeat sign, the measure number is 1 too low. Example: measure 3, the first bar of the second line on the page, is marked as measure 2 because it starts with an Open Local Repeat control.

Let me close by saying that Noteworthy is already a great tool. I've been a registered user for years, and I have no intentions to shift to another notation program. I post these suggestions in the hopes that I might help make a good program better still.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 27-Feb-2001

Kevin, just a comment on your grace note request. Exactly how a grace note is rendered depends on a number of factors, and I doubt there's really a single "correct" way to render them that would satisfy everyone.

In the music of the Classical period, for example, grace notes are almost invariably sounded on the beat, not before it. However, they're usually not as short as NWC makes them. Often they take up as much time as the note they precede, and sometimes they actually take *more* time. (In cases like this there are better terms to use than "grace note", but the notation is indistinguishable from NWC's grace notes.)

In my opinion the current implementation of grace notes is appropriate only for a small minority of cases. In most pre-Romantic music you'd want the grace note to sound on the beat but have a longer duration. In most modern music you'd want the grace note to sound before the beat.

In the past I have also requested a change to the handling of grace notes, but one that would take into account the various uses this notation has been put to over the centuries. I'd be opposed to any change that merely substitutes one fixed interpretation for another. Rather, I'd like more user control over the placement and duration of the grace note.

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 27-Feb-2001

It would be nice to distinguish between appogiaturas (grace notes with a distinct duration)and acciacaturas (very short and written with a slash). And also to be able to slur them to their associated note within the ambit of a larger group of slurred notes.

Reply 3 offered by: Kevin M on 27-Feb-2001

To follow up.. I've discovered the NWC scriptorium and have begun fiddling around with some of the items found there. Nonetheless, I think NWC should be able to natively support some of these features, and use them appropriately in MIDI playback.

Grant, I agree that the user should have control of grace note timing.

I begin to realize, upon writing this, that I know absolutely nothing about NoteWorthy Software and the people behind it. So I can't say anything about their software development team. Regardless, NWC remains a fine piece of work, which with some minor updates, could become much better.

Reply 4 offered by: Artur on 27-Feb-2001

Your list is nice, but has some things to reconsider:
> 2)Already does.
> 4)there's the pedal down and the pedal up signatures, so that what you said has no fundament.

On the other stuff, I support ya!

Reply 5 offered by: John Gillings on 27-Feb-2001

Just to clarify Artur's comment about toolbars -

Go to "View" menu, choose "Toolbars", click "Customize"
on the "Toolbar List" dialog, select toolbar "Insert" and
change it any way you want, or create your own toolbars!

Thanks to Artur for pointing this out, I'd never noticed
it before. I'm sure it will be more than Kevin M was
expecting.

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 28-Feb-2001

Artur, about pedal marks: it is certainly true that sometimes "pedal down" markings are used in printed music without intervening "pedal ups", and that this implies that the pedal should be released (as physically it must) before being reapplied. Kevin would just like NWC to behave in the same way, inserting the implied "pedal ups" into the MIDI stream as necessary. There's certainly some sense to this, though it would be merely a timesaver rather than a necessity (if you want the effect of "pedal ups" in your music without visible markings, you need only insert invisible ones).

Reply 7 offered by: Kevin M on 28-Feb-2001

Regarding editable toolbars- you're right, you can edit the existing toolbars and add new ones- but only with the tools currently provided. For example (unless I'm using an outdated version and don't know it) I can only set up a toolbar with a handful of time signatures- 4/4, 3/4, 6/8, common, and cut time. I would like to be able to add buttons for odd times- 7/8, 9/16, 5/4, and so forth. (As a percussionist, much of the repertoire I deal with was written in the last 50 years, and complex time shifts are very common.)

Create a new toolbar, then look at the list of "Fast Insert" tools available. Surely you would agree that there are a million more such tools that could be useful.

Regarding the pedal controls.. Maybe I'm out of line to ask.. Does anyone else consider the use of invisible notation symbols and even invisible playing staves to be a cumbersome solution to relatively simple problems?

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 28-Feb-2001

Cumbersome yes - simple no!

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen Randall on 28-Feb-2001

Kevin M wrote:

Does anyone else consider the use of invisible notation symbols and even invisible playing staves to be a cumbersome solution to relatively simple problems?

I think that in many cases the problem is not so simple. Problems that invisibility solves often arise from a divergence between what is written and what should be performed - i.e.where a human performer would apply "interpretation" to the written score. Examples include trills, turns and other ornaments, subtle volume and tempo changes, swing rythms. Midi needs to be told EXACTLY what to do. A human performer "just knows" and would probably find it difficult to follow EXACT instructions anyway. Hence the two versions - visible for us humans, invisible for MIDI.

Admittedly, standard music notation is probably not the easiest medium to use to specify a midi performance; that is why some of the workarounds to get the midi version to sound right are so clunky.

The only Place I can think of where invisibility solves a problem with the "human version" is the n-tuplet workaround - and who knows, perhaps this will become redundant with version 1.80 or whatever?

Stephen

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Feb-2001

Re: cumbersome - my take is that it's only cumbersome at first; after awhile, "it's just the way it's done." It really helps to be conversant with the standard windows actions (cut, copy, paste, undo) as well as effectively combining mouse and keyboard techniques.

Re: pedal marks. For Yamaha DB50XG users (and probably other XG synths), the proposed "auto-pedal-up" would not be of any use, since these synths don't recognise a pedal-up until the next note is sounded. So you'd have to add an invisible pedal-up object anyway. FWIW...

Reply 11 offered by: Joe Music on 28-Feb-2001

When we think about it, folks, traditional music notation is very strange. The letters run A-G, but most of us learn scales beginning with C. We (in Western music) have a combination of whole steps and half steps, learned before we realize its compromised connection to small-integer fractions of a base tone. We use arbitrary staffs with accidentals, rather than just numbering the notes 1-12. And so on, and so forth.

Any difficulties with music notation are just a reflection of the difficulties inherent in creating a printed page that contains information not expressed in the technology of whatever musical device (instrument or MIDI) is actually playing the music.

To this, add the illusion that a human musician is necessarily performing whatever was originally written, and the illusion that the original composer created a work in which every symbol was a precise expression of authorship intent. Hah! Remember "Switched-On Bach"?

Reply 12 offered by: Fred on 28-Feb-2001

> Hah! Remember "Switched-On Bach"?

Yup. In fact I have it on CD and still listen to it occasionally. Also have SOB 2K, I find I actually like the original analog Moog version better!

Fred N

Reply 13 offered by: Stephen Randall on 01-Mar-2001

"When we think about it, folks, traditional music notation is very strange. The letters run A-G, but most of us learn scales beginning with C."

These are things that have puzzled me for a long time.

Why does the "natural" major scale start on C and not A? Was the first "natural" scale a minor one? If so, why isn't G pitched at G#? Have our tastes in scales changed? Did a non sharpened leading note sound OK when the letter names were decided? Or were downward scales the source of lettering? If so, why do the letters go backwards?

Who decided that pitches should be named by letters? And when was it agreed? It must have been before Bach's time because he very often used the letter/pitch relationship to add another level of interpretation to his music.

Our concept of scales also implies a concept of "sameness" for pitches separated by whole octaves. Is this "sameness" just a western thing or is it universally recognised in all musical cultures?

Stephen

Reply 14 offered by: Artur on 01-Mar-2001

First:
The notes start at A becuase A is the most fundamental note in frequency (A1= 440Hz, not to beconfounded as the third lowest A on the piano, for this is the A3 I'm talking about).
Everything is related to C because it is Do, from Medieval times.
Do-C, Re-D, Mi-E, Fa-F, Sol-G, La-A, Si-B.
This notes were taken from a himm, the melody was that every new line started at a new note in the C Major Sacle.
The natural scale is the minor becuase....
Wich is the minor scale from the first major one (C)?
A, and A is the natural note....

Reply 15 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 01-Mar-2001

That reminds me...

When the choir director says "Sing A,"
I sing "Eh?"

Reply 16 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Mar-2001

And when he says in a thick German accent "Sing H" (pron. Hahh) you sing "huh"?


#1969: Effects - DSP, Reverb, Chorus
Effects - DSP, Reverb, Chorus

(1969)

Submitted by: Taran on 27-Feb-2001

I have a YAMAHA PSR 540 keyboard, and with it I can make lots of effects (about 100 or so) like 'rotary speaker', 'distotion', 'auto wah', echo, tremolo, trill and so on.
They sound really good on my keyboard. Therefore i'd like to use them, but I can't find any way in NWC how I can use them (Not in any MIDI sequencer, btw).
Also, this keyboard has XG-sounds(about 500) and normal sounds(227). The normal sounds sound better than the XG-sounds. However, NWC takes (like any other MIDI sequencer I am aware of) the XG-sounds, and I cant find out how I could let him pick the normal sounds.
Any one knows how I can fix these two problems?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Feb-2001

Some of the FX are available as multi-point controllers. To learn about these, I'd suggest downloading the "Command Summary" from the Scriptorium http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ and printing it out. There's a /lot/ of information there.

The rest of them, especially the XG-specific ones, are best added "after the fact" using a good XG utility like XGedit.

Regarding XG sounds, these are accessed by selecting a different bank number in Controller 32 (leave Controller 0 at 0). There is, again, an Excel file of the various XG patches in the various banks at the Scriptorium, in the "Useful Files" section.

Note that your mileage may vary. Consult your keyboard's patch list to verify that the sounds are the same as in the Excel file, good chance you might have even more available. Also verify that your implementation of XG does indeed use Controller 32 to select different patch banks.

HTH

Fred


#1970: What's happening lately with Noteworthy Software?
What's happening lately with Noteworthy Software?

(1970)

Submitted by: David Potvin on 27-Feb-2001

I'd really like to know a lot more about the week-to-week, or month-to month activities of Noteworthy Software...

For example, what can be expected as far as new releases, how's the developping going, what "wishes" are being worked on, deemed unrealizable or on standby (so we can keep from pissing off the developpers with the same wishes all the time!)... that sort of thing!

Updates and news on the site's front page could be a good idea, too!! How 'bout that?!?

Reply 1 offered by: someone on 01-Mar-2001

gd'idea

Reply 2 offered by: Robin Withey on 02-Mar-2001

It would be a nice, yes! Give us a taster of things to come.

Of course, I don't know what other commitments Noteworthy have - is this wonderful program something you do in your spare time? In which case, please excuse us hassling you for commitments.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 02-Mar-2001

Actuallt, I think it's a *bad* idea. I used to be in technical marketing years ago (it is a business, not sales, kind of thing), and I spent much of my time trying to explain why "upcoming products" were not upcoming. It is a slippery slope: Customers begin to rely on future predictions; they are not happy if they arrive (because they were expected), and are enraged if they don't arrive (because they already made plans).

I believe the stock market works much the same way, e.g.: "XYZ Corp announced record high earnings today. XYZ stock dropped 20% on the dissappointing news, as analysts had expected more."

Reply 4 offered by: David Potvin on 03-Mar-2001

I understand the concerns on that behalf, but I'm more concerned of getting fed-up with waiting for upgrades, and going elsewhere, just to find out that I bought another program with the features I'm looking for AT THE SAME TIME I BOUGHT THE COMPETITION'S PRODUCTS!!!

There's a nice thing called fidelity - something you might be familiar with - and it would be a shame to abuse of one's faith in something!!! If version 1.+ or 2.0 is to come out in 5 days, at least, I'll know; if it's in 5 months, well, I'll be patient! Knowledge is power, gentlemen; customers - like cruise passengers, the domain I'm working in - hate to be in a weak position!!!

So you're free to consider the "expectations-disappointment" point of view, but also consider what I just said... I'd hate to become a "former NTW user" in your face, especially for those reasons!!!

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Mar-2001

David - I understand your frustration.

I found NWC 1.1 on a program compilation CD which raised my interest.
Finally getting web access I registered just in time for version 1.3f.
I've waited patiently for some of my wishlist items to appear - they are all improvements to notation that have been requested since the wishlist first appeared- but to no avail.
Even had to write my own workarounds like Drum.bas and Boxmarks to make my parts readable for the players in the band.
Along the way there have been some pleasant surprises with the upgrades - like midi keyboard input and the addition of midi controllers.
Other upgrade items - like layering - I really have no use for at all.

NWC has some outstanding features:-
* Qwerty keyboard input is a stand out.
* Ease of printing another.
* Print quality is excellent - very readable.
* Print preview copy and copy special are great tools.
* The price is right.

But:
Finally I had to bite the bullet and buy another product to achieve the output quality I need.
I still use the qwerty input when writing a score but export elsewhere to add marks, print the parts or produce a midi file.

Pity - NWC is a good product, I believe in the shareware concept and applaud Eric's continual free upgrade policy but I couldn't wait forever - life's getting shorter and there are still plenty of arrangements to do.

Reply 6 offered by: David Potvin on 04-Mar-2001

I'd like to thank Robin Withey, Robert Allgeyer and Barry Graham for their input on this question, and I also understand very well the points being brought here - that's what makes this forum such a good place for trading information!

What I'd like now - either as a closing argument or a continuing one - is some input from NoteWorthy themselves!!!

Do you think I could hear from them soon? Even a threat letter would be appreciated (!) because it's a sign that they show some concern...

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 04-Mar-2001

My, we are a rowdy bunch! Within recent memory, many of us were quire excited by the addition of staff layering, additional note properties, and free plug-ins to other programs. I myself found staff layering extremely useful for SATB choral music, and the keyboard input can't be beat. Even our music director admits that the NWC printout looks better than famous-major-name printout.

So what if many of us use a second program for enhancements not found in NWC? Remember, the more features a program has, the more it bogs down. Don't believe me? Try using a recent-version major drawing program.

The real issue is not how to revise NWC to make it capable of nearly anything, but rather which specific enhancements add value and are most necessary, yet do not require total overhaul. I really don't know.

To change the topic slightly: When you think about it, why is MIDI still used? Is it in memory of Elvis? Whatever the reason may be: It's serial, it's slow, it's not capable of many things, but it's the standard! Likewise, think of all the effort spent on trying to make digital music sound like a "real" instrument, when the acoustics of many real instruments are based upon compromised tonality.

Maybe NWC is fine just as it is. I know that the thought causes many of us to shudder, but I suspect that most who read this forum are the more advanced users anyway. There is such a thing as "market niche."

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Mar-2001

There is much truth in what you say.

I forgot to mention that NWC is the most robust Windows program I have ever used - this is probably due to it's unbloated state and the programming skill of the team.

Eric has said (I can't quote since I don't archive what happens here and the newsgroup) - that NWC is not a sequencer and it is not a midi file editor.
I assume then that the program's major use is a "composer".
It fulfils this function very well - the qwerty input makes life a lot easier for those of us that are keyboard impaired.

But David's use is similar to mine - production of parts for pop and contemporary tunes for reading musicians to sight read on the job.
The notation capabilities may be fine for choirs and quartets but there is a serious shortfall in the area mentioned.
I'm happy that the notation is suitable for the majority of the users - you got your wishes granted - I had to buy mine elsewhere.

I take pride in what I present to musicians - if the output doesn't meet my standards I'd rather manually copy the parts - which I have to do for rhythm parts in NWC scores because of the lack of rhythm markers, drum notation, repeat bar symbols. Boxmarks was a product of that frustration.

My reply to David pointed out the good points of NWC and I would like to think that "all good things come to those who wait" - but (despite my fondness for NWC - it was all I had for many years) there comes a time when even the loyal user has to move on.

Reply 9 offered by: David Potvin on 08-Mar-2001

Yes, Robert, we definitely are a rowdy bunch! As for MIDI, I somehow believe it's misused a lot - especially when you mention live performances! As I probably mentioned elsewhere, I use MIDI almost exclusively - when editing or reproducing a song for edition - for catching up with my ears what my brain could have missed! (sounds weird, said like that, but it's basically that!) ;-)

But now, there's a specific member which happens to be present in most other discussions in the forum, BUT HAS NOT SHOWN UP HERE! NOTEWORTHY SOFTWARE! Don't they have something noteworthy to say about my question? Pun intended! Or is it that they're looking for a politically correct way to tell me to shut up, and be patient, and all good things come to those who wait!?!?

You know, my dear friends developpers, programmers and managers of NoteWorthy Software, any answer would have pleased me, except one: none!

Now you know what to do.

Reply 10 offered by: Robin Withey on 08-Mar-2001

I have noticed in the past that Noteworthy Software never reply to discussions regarding improvements to the program. Probably a sensible policy, since people might think they were promised things and complain when they didn't happen, but frustrating all the same. The only time we get news about bug fixes and improvements is when they actually happen.

Robin Withey

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Mar-2001

> something noteworthy to say about my question?

I am not exactly clear on the question, but it appears to be a demand like: "tell me what you are doing"

We maintain a web site where all new releases and other product announcements are made. This forum is part of the web site. Rather than wait for someone to ask what we have available, and then respond, we proactively announce things when they become available.

When we get a bug report, we verify it and will often announce our intentions to include a fix in the next release.

However, we do not pre-announce feature (product enhancement) plans. Plans, schedules, and priorities change, and we do not intend to make these decision cycles public.

In short, when we have something to say or announce with regard to new features, you will find summary links at:

http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/newstuff.htm

We also usually provide announcements here and in the newsgroup as well.

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 08-Mar-2001

Sounds reasonable to me, NWC! As I explained above, pre-announcement is not always a good idea, even when (as is usually the case) the customers want to know.

Besides, as I recall, that has consistently been NWC's policy for as long as I've had the program

Reply 13 offered by: Art Thompson on 08-Mar-2001

I have also notice NWC's reluctance to join certain discussions, and have decided that they are very wise in this regard. Forums have an anonymity (is that a word?) which tempts us to be more aggressive than we might otherwise behave, such as in a face to face meeting.They give users a lot of leeway in this forum.I think that NWC's terse and laconic style keeps them above the fray, where they belong.

Reply 14 offered by: David Potvin on 09-Mar-2001

AH! THANKS! That's all I needed to know from you!

Shame that it took so long and so many speculations about the answer you gave me!

As for the deep origins of the question, it comes to the fact that there's been a certain consistency with the new releases, plug-ins and service packs, and now it seems to have... I don't know... sort of stagnated! Maybe I'm wrong, but I bought the version at 1.30, and inside 6 months, I ubgraded thom there to 1.55 and 1.70! ...that was almost 2 years ago!

Hope that it explain my concerns, and why this question! I just want to make sure NWC's still alive!...

And Art... yes, it is a word!

Reply 15 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Mar-2001

Although 1.70 is our most recent major upgrade, there has been other things happening since then: plug-ins for browsers and Winamp.

A release history of NWC since Oct 1994 can be found at:

http://noteworthycomposer.com/history.htm


#1971: problems with recording
problems with recording

(1971)

Submitted by: John on 01-Mar-2001

I have some problems with recording from a MIDI-keyboard. I made a connection between my "Technics KN-550" keyboard and my PC via MIDI-cable. I also made all the settings listed in the HELP-file, but when I want to record some notes, the right notes aren't recorded correctly. I tried everything, but the PC always receives the wrong notes. Does anyone know, how to solve this problem?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Mar-2001

When notes appear when you play on the keyboard, but they are at the wrong note pitch, this means that either:

1) You have a faulty MIDI cable, or more likely

2) You have a faulty MIDI Input device, or

3) you have a faulty MIDI keyboard

On the other hand, if by "wrong notes" you mean they are the wrong duration, you can find the solutions at the following threads dealing with MIDI keyboard input:

msg #174, msg #1307, msg #128, msg #141, msg #1102, msg #1026, msg #1198, msg #1224, msg #1328, msg #1807, msg #1823

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 01-Mar-2001

or 4) your keyboard's "Transpose" button is depressed... :)

Reply 3 offered by: John on 01-Mar-2001

I think I'll try to change my MIDI-Input-Device. Otherwise I'll have to buy a new MIDI-cable.

Thanks

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Mar-2001

FYI: It is very rare for a cable to be faulty and still allow communication between the keyboard and the PC. If you are experiencing random notes in NWC when you play on the keyboard, this strongly suggest a problem in your PC. It could be a buggy MIDI input device driver for your sound card, or it could be the sound card itself.

If you are using a sound card that is integrated into the motherboard of your PC, it is not uncommon for the MIDI input capability to be faulty out of the box (unfortunately). I have seen this personally on numerous "value" PCs.

Are you using a sound card, dedicated MIDI card, or an external MIDI interface to connect your keyboard to your PC?

Reply 5 offered by: John on 01-Mar-2001

I'm using a soundcard from ESS Technologies. My MIDI-Input-Device is MPU-401. I tried everything, but it still doesn't work. Is it possible that I get e "newer" version of my MPU-401-Device?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Mar-2001

Do you have the MPU-401 play device working (from your PC out to your keyboard)? If not, you should get this working before drawing any other conclusions about the problem.

I would recommend that you try to find an updated driver for the MPU-401 functions of your sound card. If this doesn't work, you may not be able to get it to work.

Reply 7 offered by: Robin Withey on 02-Mar-2001

I have a similar problem with an SB-PCI128 soundcard - occasionally, some of the MIDI channels (but not all of them) start transposing. Result - cacophony! This is usually preceded by a loud, high pitched scream from the card.

The problem only seems to affect playback under Noteworthy - if I try to playback .MID files under media player, there is no problem.

The only solution appears to be to shut down the PC, wait a while and restart.

Spooky, isn't it?!

Robin Withey

PS - I blame Fred! The first time it happened, I was listening to his rendition of the Queen of the Night aria from "Die Sauberflöte".

PPS - only joking, Fred!


#1972: Conversion from abc
Conversion from abc

(1972)

Submitted by: Bryan Creer on 02-Mar-2001

Noteworthy is popular in our area (Sussex, England) for exchanging and printing folk music. Its only drawback is that it doesn't have access to the huge collections of traditional music in abc format. To get over this, I have written a programme to convert between abc and Noteworthy format files (and back). This is available as shareware from http://members.aol.com/abacusmusic/ which has a link to the abc homepage for those not familiar with the format.

Bryan

Reply 1 offered by: jay on 15-Apr-2001

I don't know how many people outside of folk [especially celtic trad music] need this- as I teach pennywhistle I have used and found that Tabledit works very well for the job you have as shareware- Anyone interested should try both- j

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 16-Apr-2001

Where can we get free scores in abc?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Apr-2001

Start here: Frank's ABC site

This has recently been reorganised, so may be a little rough to navigate at the moment.

Reply 4 offered by: Jean CIFRANE on 20-Apr-2001

I have seen some months ago the discussion in this forum and in the user's forum on a musical OCR shareware that was rather good but as no interface to NWC except MIDI that gives poor translation. Is it possible to use ABC or to write a translate program ?
Sory I have not succeded in finding the SEARCH funcion to this forum to be more explicit for the name of the shareware and its interface other than midi...

Reply 5 offered by: Jean CIFRANE on 22-Apr-2001

More information :The notation standard (?) used is NIFF (Notation Interchange File Format) and the musical OCR program is Sharp Eye that you can find on http://www.visiv.co.uk/ . By the way I don't like the price of their future version 2.
Do you have a translate program for ABC or NWC (to and) from NIFF ?


#1973: print page eject
print page eject

(1973)

Submitted by: webb comfort on 02-Mar-2001

How can I mark a point on a staff which will tell the print program to start a new page? When I am doing a medley, I sometimes need to make sure that there is extra space at the bottom of a printed page so I can paste in some source reference citations.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Mar-2001

NWC does not have a "start new page" command. You would need to write each page separately for this kind of thing in NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 02-Mar-2001

Although there is no automatic "new page" command in NWC, the effect you want is easy to get. When you lay out the page in NWC, use an extra-large bottom margin. Check out the results in Print Preview. If necessary, make use of forced system breaks as measure-bar properties.

Don't forget that the size of the printed music varies according to staff properties and page properties. If you are using lyrics, this will also affect the layout according to font size.


#1974: Can slurs and ties be hidden?
Can slurs and ties be hidden?

(1974)

Submitted by: John on 02-Mar-2001

As the sound of midi notes often end too abruptly for orchestral sounds, a hidden tie to a subsequent hidden 1/32 note would come in very handy!

Currently, I am using the Pianoforte's sustain pedal to effect a convinving end of phrase!

Can slurs and ties be hidden?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 03-Mar-2001

Oh that we could hide them! Slurs and ties are hidden only if the first note is hidden, which is the exact opposite of what you want.

One workaround is to insert an invisible 'legato' instruction - this lengthens the playback of all the notes and should achieve the desired efect. You turn legato off by inserting any other performance style ('sotto voce' and 'volta subito' are two of the less intuitive styles that work here!)

Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Mar-2001

AFAIK, the only instructions that have any effect are "legato" and "staccato". The rest simply cause a return to the default "marcato" style.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 05-Mar-2001

Sorry, I thought that was what I said.

To turn legato on you can use 'legato'. There is no specific instuction to turn it back off, but as you say, any performance style (except staccato) turns legato off.

My point, I think, was that even counter-intuitive instructions like 'volta subito' do this. (And IMHO they should not)

I'm not sure that 'Marcato' is the right negative for 'Legato'. To me it implies a much more marked style of playing. What we need is a specific 'effects off' instruction, and leave 'sotto voce' and 'simile' etc to do nothing.

Peter

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Mar-2001

Agreed. My post was not meant to contradict what you said in yours, merely to (hopefully) make the situation more clear.

Another possibility for a return to "neutral" performance style would be Naturale (used commonly for strings to indicate a return to normal bowing style after such instructions as sul ponticello, col ligno, etc.)


#1975: I must be stupid
I must be stupid

(1975)

Submitted by: J. McLain on 03-Mar-2001

I Read the entire 1003 thread (186 Threads Long) and still do not know how to convert my NoteWorthy files into MIDI's. Could someone please tell me how, and please do so like I am 6 years old please. Thank you.
J. McLain

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 03-Mar-2001

Click File (upper left corner of window). Click Save As... which opens the Save As... dialog box. Click the little pulldown arrow near the bottom of screen where it says "Save as Type". Select Type 1 midi file. Enter or change the filename as desired. Click Save.

Reply 2 offered by: J. McLain on 04-Mar-2001

Fred,
Thanks, that was a huge help. Sometimes it is the simple things which pose the biggest problem.
Now if someone could tell me how to get my Audio Compositor to covert my file into a piano solo, that would be great?

I wrote several piano solo's with NWC, but when I coverted them to WAV's, it sounded like a music box or something. Imagine my horror.
Please help.
Thanks
J. McLain

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 04-Mar-2001

The sound quality of a WAV file depends upon the quality of the software (synthesizer or sound fonts) that converts MIDI instructions (from NWC) into digitized sound. That is, the WAV is not a property of anything in NWC. It is the same with real instruments: junky piano = junky sound. Other contributors to this forum know a lot more about this than I do, and there are many other forum threads devoted to the subject.


#1976: Why???
Why???

(1976)

Submitted by: Zeke on 04-Mar-2001

Sometimes when I am writing a song a not will be held out past it's proper duration. I have no idea if it is something wrong with my computer or not. This has become a real problem and hinders the quality of my compositions. Can any one help me, please?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Mar-2001

The most common reason for held notes is different accidentals on notes tied across a barline.
Highlight the second note of the tie (select the one to the right of the barline). The toolbar will show the status of the accidental on this note.
The accidental should agree with that of the first note in the tie - if it does not correct it now.
Be aware that implied accidentals on the first note are not always obvious.

Reply 2 offered by: Zeke on 04-Mar-2001

thanks that helped


#1977: Soprano, Alto, Tenor, or whatever
Soprano, Alto, Tenor, or whatever

(1977)

Submitted by: Monty Arce on 05-Mar-2001

Which is the best accepted way of presenting an Operatic aria to the singer of performer, in its simplest way, with piano accompaniment or, say, a string quartet?
Of course, supposing that, in time, the aria is intended to be performed with a full orchestra...

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 05-Mar-2001

Piano. Not only is it easier to find one pianist than 4 string players, but it's usual for singers to rehearse to a piano accompaniment.


#1978: guitar chord letters
guitar chord letters

(1978)

Submitted by: shirley smeaton on 06-Mar-2001

can someone please tell me if it is possible to put guitar chord letters in a treble staff rather than notes.
also I want to print a blank staff page for guitar is this possible?
thank you
shirley smeaton

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 06-Mar-2001

You can place "text" wherever you wish. The "text" can be from any TrueType font installed on your computer, whether or not it consists of letters. Find a font that contains the desire combination of letters, numerals, accidentals, and perhaps other symbols, and specify it as one of your user fonts in page setup. (Does anyone know a particularly useful font for this purpose?) The text can be placed within a staff, if you wish, at various heights; or it can be placed above or below the staff.

If you wanted fret-diagram notation (finger charts), a font with the right notation can be chosen as a user font and placed as "text." On the Internet, there is a package of 3 fonts called Frets A, B, and C. I believe -- but am not certain -- that these are free for home usage. (If you find them, be sure to read the restrictions, if any.)

You can use NWC to print blank staff paper. NWC does not do this automatically, though. Instead, create a "composition" with several staffs. On the top staff, insert enough garbage notes to expand the width of the staff (see the effect in print preview). Then, hide the notes on the top staff.

But if you have no need other than blank staff paper, there are free resources on the Internet that specifically do that. You may also discover that your word processing program has blank music staff paper as a template -- possibly as an optional feature somewhere on the original CD-ROM.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music2 on 06-Mar-2001

One other thing -- if you place letters in your staff *instead of* notes, then you can't get a MIDI output. However, you can place notes in the usual manner, make them invisible, then superimpose your letters as text. The printout will show the letters, and the MIDI output is derived from the (hidden) notes.


#1979: Re WHY???
Re WHY???

(1979)

Submitted by: Zeke on 06-Mar-2001

Sorry, I lied. The notes still sustain without cease. Any more pointers?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 06-Mar-2001

Tying two notes with different accidentals is far and away the commonest reason for this symptom. (It doesn't have to be across a bar line; it just usually happens that way.) In fact, even if you've already checked for it, it's still the likeliest explanation. I suggest you look again. (And again. And again.)

If you have newsgroup access you might want to post the offending file there. No matter what the problem is, someone on the newsgroup is sure to discover it. Or click on my name above and send it to me, and I'll look at it and, if you want, post it to the newsgroup on your behalf.

- Grant

Reply 2 offered by: Carl Bangs on 07-Mar-2001

If you have an Midi editing program, such as "Cakewalk," a view of the Midi file in the keyboard mode will make it very obvious where the "cypher" or stuck note begins.

Carl

Reply 3 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 07-Mar-2001

The most likely situation is in a measure in which an accidental occures near the beginning on, say C. Then the last note is also a C, but while it is affected by the accidental there is no sharp or flat sign directly in front of it. If it is then tied to a C in the next measure you will get the stuck note, even though the two notes look the same. To add to the confusion, once you add the accidental to the note in the second measure it, too, is invisible. The only way you can tell for sure is to select the notes in question (one at a time) and see if one of the accidental selectors in the tool bar is active.

Cyril

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Eidson on 07-Mar-2001

Also, check to see that there are no sustain pedal controllers on the track -- if you've forgotten to put the "Pedal Up" symbol in, the stustain pedal will remain active. Quite nasty! ;)

Reply 5 offered by: Bob Boren on 07-Mar-2001

Much like the Cakewalk keyboard solution mentioned above, if you are using a midi sound module with a display (or Virtual Sound Canvas) you can look at the display and see which midi channel is sticking. My roland Sound Canvas unit has a display that makes this problem stick out like a sore thumb.


#1980: Announcing New NWC Service Pack  and Plug-in
Announcing New NWC Service Pack  and Plug-in

(1980)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Mar-2001

We just released the following:

NoteWorthy Composer Service Pack 3:
http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/nwc170sp.htm

NoteWorthy Composer Browser Plug-in 1.70.2:
http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/plugin.htm

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 08-Mar-2001

I notice that SP3 displays the accidental of tied-to notes in the editor. This is a nice feature, because it will undoubtedly make it easier to find and fix "stuck" notes. Thanks, NWS.

Observations:

1) It would be nice if these accidentals could be made (optionally) visible in the printout. Many scores restate the accidental on a tied note at the beginning of a new system.

2) With or without (1), it would be nice if courtesy accidentals could be (again, optionally) printed in parentheses.

3) I hope that this change doesn't redirect attention away from better overall handling of tied notes in a future release. It should be possible, for example, to tie notes of the same pitch regardless of spelling (e.g., F-sharp and G-flat). More important, NWC should not visually resolve a tie to a note of a different pitch - that is, if an F-sharp bears a tie and is followed by an F (not sharp), the tie should not terminate at the F but should continue off to the right, the way it would if the F were, say, a G instead. This single change would virtually eliminate the incidence of "stuck notes" in NWC scores.

Reply 2 offered by: Zeke on 10-Mar-2001

I downloaded them and applied them to my NWC and I didn't notice any difference whatsoever. How do you use all that cool stuff that is in the downloads?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Mar-2001

In general, the content of the service packs is not intended to change NWC in any dramatic way. These are bug fixes and subtle enhancements designed to polish the NWC 1.70 release.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-Mar-2001

The lack of noticeable change (for most users) is due to a lack of noticeable bugs! Another reason to like NWC.

On the other hand, I can think of two or three major-name software vendors (not in music) who released product "upgrades" with howlers. One of them inadvertently deleted(!) an important feature. For another, the U.S. Enlgish language installer did not work as described, even though it was from a U.S. based company(!), suggesting that nobody at headquarters (at least, nobody who spoke English) had tried it out before release.

Reply 5 offered by: Michael E. Landon on 14-Mar-2001

I'm in the process of putting the browser plug-in to work on my web-site, but it would be nice if there was a little more info with it instead of just the examples. I can hack the sample pages to get the html info, but some general end-user info would be helpful (especially when I'm asking those who visit my page to add the plug-in to their browsers).

I'm a tad concerned that those who are not tech-heads (or familier with NWC) may have problems when trying to install the plug-in. The download page is not real clear (IMO) on instructions for the "technically challanged" end user.

I expect enough people to shy away from installing it because they are paranoid (will it let viruses on my machine?). With the info available, I believe there are many who will download the install program and think that's it (not run the installer), then wonder why it doesn't work and curse the stupid programmer for designing such a stupid web-site that needs this stupid plug-in that didn't work (there are enough people who have that opinion of me already).

So, it may be a little early yet, but are there going to be better installation instructions on the download page? The install program itself is great, I just don't have much faith in the average user to get that far on their own.

Also, I noticed in the tested browser list that AOL was not mentioned. Is the plug-in AOL friendly or are they just SOL? Don't touch the stuff myself.

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Bacher on 14-Mar-2001

I haven't downloaded Service Pack 3 yet. On the web page it says:

Printing now uses file name rather than song title

Why??? This doesn't sound like something I want. I use all kinds of file names to differentiate between versions of a song. Is this at least an optional feature?

- seb

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Mar-2001

This is poorly worded. The filename of the song is sent to the print spooler, rather than the file title. It does not have any effect on how the page looks when printed.

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Mar-2001

> Is the plug-in AOL friendly or are they just SOL?

AOL is not, in itself, a browser. It simply embeds browser windows inside its interface. Those browsers are supported by the plug-in.

Reply 9 offered by: Steve Bacher on 14-Mar-2001

Oh.

That's very different.

Never mind.

- seb

Reply 10 offered by: Michael E. Landon on 15-Mar-2001

> AOL is not, in itself, a browser. It simply embeds browser windows inside its interface. Those browsers are supported by the plug-in.

Technically true, but many web-pages have had to provide "AOL Friendly" as alternate content since AOL has been known to sometimes make "improvements" to the browser. In theory it should work, but I would feel more comfortable if I knew it had actually been tried from AOL.

Michael

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Mar-2001

> comfortable if I knew it had actually been tried from AOL

Now you know, becuase we have...

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Mar-2001

>AOL sometimes makes "improvements"to the browser.

Indeed! One example is the AOL "ART" compressed graphics format. It can interact with other graphics formats in undesirable ways, under certain circumstances. I just discovered this when I visited someone with AOL and looked at myown web pages (I don't have AOL, myself). AOL graphics compression can be turned off, as a user preference.

Reply 13 offered by: markus on 23-Mar-2001

May I assume that the downloadable version of 1.70 is with the service pack patched to it, or do we need to download the service pack seperately?


#1982: Piano.exe revisited
Piano.exe revisited

(1982)

Submitted by: Fred on 09-Mar-2001

There is persistent interest in using a "virtual piano", allowing the computer keyboard to function as a piano keyboard for real-time performance entry into NWC. This has been covered, albeit somewhat confusingly, in earlier threads; particularly http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1054.htm but here is a step-by-step installation and usage procedure for Win9x (tested with Win95 OSR2.5 and Win98SE):

1: Get the program. Two available download sites are:
http://wuarchive.wustl.edu/packages/ultrasound/util/windows/00Index and
http://wuarchive.wustl.edu/packages/ultrasound/util/windows/piano21.zip Note: it must be the 2.1 version, the earlier one won't work properly.

2: Create a directory (folder) somewhere on your hard drive, e.g. c:\Program Files\Piano and unzip the contents of the Piano2.1 zip file into it.

3: Create a shortcut on your desktop, in a desktop folder, or in your Start menu to point to piano.exe.

If you just want to play your virtual piano without necessarily importing the performance into NWC, that's all it takes. Double-click on the piano icon, and you should hear music. Click OK and away you go. If it doesn't work, check Options to insure that local echo is on. Also check that you have a device assigned in your midi mapper (Control Panel -> Multimedia -> Midi).

But assuming that you want to use piano with NWC, you'll also have to install the piano.drv driver. A tried and true method is as follows:

4: Control Panel -> Add New Hardware. Click NEXT as needed to get to "Search for hardware?" Check NO (Windows can't possibly find it by itself, since it's virtual not actual hardware), click NEXT.

5: Click "Sound, Video, Game controllers", NEXT. Select "Standard Game Device", click HAVE DISK. Click BROWSE, browse to your piano directory. It will find oemsetup.inf as the only available entry; select it, click OK, OK.

6: It will now show "Piano MIDI In Port". Click OK, Finish.

7: Restart your computer for good measure.

Using Piano with NWC:

In NWC's Tools -> Record, select Piano In port. Turn local echo ON.

Create a click track however many bars long. A good choice is the side-stick sound, low C# (second leger line at the bottom) in bass clef.

Launch piano. In Options, set local echo OFF. (unless you have a multiple midi driver such as Hubi's Midi Cable or Multimid installed. Otherwise there will be conflicts as both programs try to use the port).

Start NWC recording. Shift the focus to piano (by clicking on the NWC icon in the bozo bar), and play your tune along with the click track. When done, shift focus to NWC and hit stop. Your performance should now appear in a new window.

Have fun with your virtual pianie!

Fred

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 09-Mar-2001

PS:

To uninstall piano, go to Control Panel -> Multimedia -> Devices. Expand the Midi Devices and Instruments tree. Select Piano Midi In, click Properties. Click REMOVE, OK, OK. Delete the piano directory and everything in it, delete any shortcuts you've made to piano.exe. That's all there is to it, no registry entries are made by this program except those associated with the driver install (which are removed when you remove the device driver). Restart, delete pianodrv.drv from your Windows/system directory, done.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Mar-2001

This is -also- a "user tip", don't you think so?

Reply 3 offered by: Raul on 05-Apr-2001

I followed the steps described exactly, but nothing happens
in NWC when I play in the Piano program.
I have checked and repeated the installation stèps and settings. NWC does not receives the output from the Piano program.
Is there any way to find out what is happenning ?

Reply 4 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 07-Apr-2001

I just checked Fred's instructions and all worked OK. (Only one correction -

Shift the focus to piano (by clicking on the piano icon in the bozo bar) NOT NWC ICON.
If this is not working for you, are you are sure that you are 1. using a click track? 2. Clicking on the record button in NWC 3. Have the Piano Midi In port selected as the input device in Noteworthy.

Rich

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Apr-2001

Good catch, Rich. The only other error AFAIK is that the first URL given for downloading piano.exe is in fact just a directory listing of the files at that site. The correct URL is the second one, repeated here in the new URL format:

Get Piano here

Reply 6 offered by: Gabriel on 09-Apr-2001

I am a new user, and have difficulties to understand the instructions.
I couldnt find in HELP how to create a "click track", what is the "side-stick sound" neither what is the "bozo bar".
Can any of you explain me ?

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Apr-2001

Hi Gabriel,

A "click track" is simply a staff containing only metronome clicks. There are two reasons for needing this: 1) it allows you to play in time, greatly reducing your need for editing later, and 2) NWC requires that a file by played simultaneously while recording.

The "side stick sound" is a drum sound, such as is made by hitting the stick onto the rim of the snare drum. It makes a great metronome sound. Set a staff to channel 10 (the percussion channel), with bass clef, and a whole long series of low C# notes (on the second leger line below the staff). Easiest way (assuming 4/4 time): enter the four notes, sharp the first one, enter a bar line after the last one. Select (highlight) the four notes and the barline, press CNTL C to copy, then CNTL V as many times as you like to make a whole series of them. Set your tempo as desired... you have a click track.

"Bozo bar" -sorry- is computer geek-speak slang for that bar at the bottom of the screen, where your start button is located and where all the icons of actively loaded programs show up. I'm not even certain what it's supposed to be called, maybe "Start menu"?

Hope this helps...

Fred

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 09-Apr-2001

"Taskbar".

Reply 9 offered by: nwcfan on 15-Apr-2001

Perhaps NOTEWORTHY could consider adding an option to automatically do a click track when you click the RECORD button? I am too lazy to create a metronome track - my time is valuable - so this would be an excellent feature

Reply 10 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Apr-2001

The Rhythm templates in File | New are there for just this purpose.

Reply 11 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 16-Apr-2001

Fred,

Is there any glossary for that computer geek? Well, I learn alongside but I still don't know, say, AFAIK or the "h" in IMHO. (Remember the cu18r thingie?)

;)

Reply 12 offered by: Grant on 16-Apr-2001

Humble. (Often not meant literally.)

I entered the phrase "glossary of internet terms" into altavista (http://www.altavista.com ) and got a whole bunch of hits. Some of the glossaries thus found are more complete than others.

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Apr-2001

Other than Grant's suggestion, I don't know of any one site that has these arcane bits of knowledge. I do as you do, either figure them out or ask someone.

AFAIK is "As far as I know"
OTOH = "on the other hand"
YMMV = "your mileage may vary"
ROTFLMAO = "rolling on the floor laughing my adenoids off" (or other body part starting with 'a')

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 17-Apr-2001

re: ROTFLMAO -

One of the glossaries I found yesterday renders this as "Rolling on the floor, laughing my aft off", which is mildly clever.

The most elaborate version of this that I've encountered is ROTFLMAOSTC, which is "Rolling on the floor, laughing my a** off, scaring the cat."

Reply 15 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Apr-2001

> YMMV
Sounds like the cat meowing. :)


#1983: Ever Wondered?
Ever Wondered?

(1983)

Submitted by: Joe Music on 09-Mar-2001

Have you ever noticed that from time to time, comments appear on the forum from new names that do not appear to have tried NWC? That is, it seems that the person is not a potential new user, but someone who came to the forum directly, without seeing any other part of the NWC web site, or even knowing that there is a NWC program?!

I now realize why this may occur: The NWC forum activity is read by search engines (e.g., Yahoo!). A search inquiry may lead a random Internet cruiser directly into the forum, without going through any other part of the site.

This is not unique to the NWC forum. Many other user groups have their user-to-user/newbie communications listed. I suppose it is usually a good thing.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Mar-2001

This is very true. You can tell that things like "Convert MIDI into WAV" and "Mini Discs" are topics that draw surfers that have no experience with NWC. So far, no harm done...

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Mar-2001

> The NWC forum activity is read by search engines

So I can find something when I search for my name :)))


#1984: Teepee accents
Teepee accents

(1984)

Submitted by: Daner on 09-Mar-2001

How can I get a teepee (sp?) accent on a note? Yes, I know that the same effect can be gotten in an MIDI by just putting an accent and a staccato on a note, but for visual purposes, I would like to know how to put a teepee sign above a note. If there is no way, then this should definitely be a feature in future NWC versions because teepee accents are so basic and essential musically and should be included in the program.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Mar-2001

Insert text before the note, using the caret symbol (shift 6), preserve width off, alignment "at next note/bar", justification centre. The "Staff Bold" font is a good choice for this.


#1985: Channel 10
Channel 10

(1985)

Submitted by: Nahum Reduta on 10-Mar-2001

Not NW specific, but hoping people can help...

Recently, I discovered that changing the instrument patch on ch. 10 (on my SB PCI card, at least) offers a different percussive set than the default set. For instance, one set features toms tuned lower than the default, another offers a remapped set appropriate for concerts or marches, yet another has techno/house stylings. The perc sets seem to vary with the patch groups (pianos, organs, guitars, brass, etc.). I've been searching for information related to this online, with no success. Anyone care to help?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Mar-2001

This feature is not standard in General MIDI, so it will vary based on the type of sound card/synthesizer you are using. The best way to find out what your synth can do is by reviewing its documentation.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 10-Mar-2001

The AWE family cards use the GS preset maps as follows:-
(Subtract 1 if your card is zero-based rather than 1 based)

Standard........Patch 1
Room Set........Patch 9
Power Set.......Patch 17
Electronic Set..Patch 25
TR-808 Set......Patch 26
Jazz Set........Patch 33
Brush Set.......Patch 41
Orchestral Set..Patch 49 (inc. tuned timpani)
Sound Effects..Patch 57
MT-32 Set.......Patch 128 (Drums at low pitches and effects at high pitches)

Reply 3 offered by: Nahum Reduta on 10-Mar-2001

Thanks a lot. Now to find out just what each tone sounds like. Glad to have a starting point.

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Mar-2001

I know this was discussed before but it's related to the topic:

Some synthesizers treat patch #48 (String Ensemble 1) on ch. 10 as Timpani, between the range of F2 and E3. I've tested this with several synths:

SB Live MIDI Synth (A and B)supports
Roland VSC-88 Soft Synthesizer supports

Creative S/W Synth doesn't support
Yamaha S-YXG 50 (and 100) doesn't support

Hth

Reply 5 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 23-Mar-2001

What I do is create a font with the specific sounds I want and put it on an arbitrary address. This allows playing each drum instrument on a different channell, which is usefull for putting effects on them, or recording them onto a multitrack as a wave file for downstream editing. With a single channel, all the MIDI controller changes affect all teh drums and cymbals and so do the effects. If you also want to do downstream processing, you cannot separate each drum sound (as would be the case in a studio recording).

Keep in mind though that by doing this you forsake the General MIDI standard, and the file will not playback teh same on somebody else's PC /MIDI instrument.


#1986: Stereo Pan and Channel Sharing semi-Bug
Stereo Pan and Channel Sharing semi-Bug

(1986)

Submitted by: Nahum Reduta on 10-Mar-2001

(while I'm still here...)

Seems that the stero pan in [Staff Properties] is ineffective when two staves share the same channel (even when the effect is set for both channels). However, stereo pan for the staves/channel works when set as MPCs. Other effects might be affected in this way, but I have yet to check.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Mar-2001

If you try to set stereo pan and volume on more than one staff that shares the same MIDI channel, you are creating a value collision. Only one value is going to end up being used, and it may not be the one you want. This situation is similar (but not exactly like) having two people dialing on one phone line. If you setup two or more staves that share the same MIDI channel, you need to decide which one of the staves is going to control MIDI functions like stereo pan and volume. After you decide, only change these settings in that staff, and not any of the other staff parts. This will avoid value collisions and unpredictable behavior. You can use Score Review to find staves that share the same MIDI port/channel.

Reply 2 offered by: Nahum Reduta on 10-Mar-2001

Forgot to mention that the effect settings were the *same* for both channels. Only when both staves contained the same effect settings through MPCs did the expected effect take place for the channel.

Reply 3 offered by: David Forcey on 15-Mar-2001

I have also occasionally found that a staff on its own channel sometimes refuses to pan correctly. I've found no rhyme nor reason to when this occurs. I've "fixed" it by trying yet another unused channel.


#1987: MP3 to MWA
MP3 to MWA

(1987)

Submitted by: Rakesh Amaram on 11-Mar-2001

I keep hearing about this MWA format. Is it really all it's cracked up to be? I have all my MP3's at 128 kps. Is there a program to convert these to this MWA format? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: NWC user on 11-Mar-2001

This is not an MP3 site.

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-Mar-2001

Well - If I wanted to record a song directly from Noteworthy Composer to WMA I might do this:-

1. Use MusicMatch Jukebox - the freely downloadable version.
2. Set the recording source to System Mixer.
3. Set the output to Windows Media 128kbps
4. Open NWC and load my score file.
5. Press record in MusicMatch.
6. Press Play in NWC.

You can play NWC files, midi, mp3 or wav in Musicmatch and record as mp3, wav or WMA.
(Thanks to Steve Pearson for the original tip).

Reply 3 offered by: Zeke on 12-Mar-2001

Where might I find this MusicMatch Jukebox?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Mar-2001

http://www.musicmatch.com

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Mar-2001

I highly recommend db PowerAmp Music Converter for any kind of format exchange including wav/mp3 to wma, except for vqf. It's freely downloadable at http://www.dbpoweramp.com/

Note that you'll need to download several plug-ins individually.

The use is as easy as NWC! You just right-click on the requested file(s) and click "convert to...". Then a pop-up menu appears including the recently supported formats (subject to which plug-ins you have installed). Then you follow the wizard.

It supports both Blade and Lame mp3 encoders, the latter of which is my preference because of variable bitrate option.

Hth


#1988: newbie's wishlist
newbie's wishlist

(1988)

Submitted by: stefan on 12-Mar-2001

Hi,
just got this progeramme and registered it immediately,great programme so far!
a couple of things id like to see - i put this in the wishlist form, but thought id see what others might think about this....
1) support for quintuplets, septuplets etc (this really is a drawback for me)...I gather several people would like this too. i saw some of the workarounds, but it would be really nice to have this accurately and easily done.

2) just an off the wall thing for us "contemporary" composers...it would be neat to have an inversion, retrograde, and RI feature: highlight a group of notes then hit "retro" and it will reverse the order of pitches (i.e., play it backwards) - the inversion would reverse the intervallic direction of pitches, and the RI would combine the two. great for tweaking little cells here and there...then all we need to do is adjust the rhythm in the new group.Probably pretty easy to do mathwise in terms of programming.

thanks! great work so far!
best,
sdb

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-Mar-2001

The inversion to a midi file can be done using MidExp available at the Scriptorium. http://www.vadu.com/nwc
It's written in Qbasic but there is a compiled version courtesy of Fred Nachbaur.

The retrograde was/is possible using an early version of a popular sequencer (it strolled out before Marie Antoinette could eat it).
The problem here is that you have to compile the midi in memory with decoded durations then work from the back to front to rearrange the stuff. A task with which I did not care to cope.
Perhaps this is a challenge for a programmer with better chops than me.


#1989: SHUFFLE ???
SHUFFLE ???

(1989)

Submitted by: Nekito on 13-Mar-2001

I'm trying to write shuffle, but I can't find the way to specify to the program the shuffle indications (like ... 2 eights are equal to a triplet ... or something like that).

Can anybody help me?? Please!! :-(

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 13-Mar-2001

NWC does not support this option. However, there is a tip on how to create this effect with tempo changes in the Us1TALips section of our web site, if you want to pursue that method.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 13-Mar-2001

Us1TALips is a great resource. UserTips is even better! Was that a yu[pz, er a typo?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 13-Mar-2001

My network connectivity seems to be more and more prone to these problems. I guess NNTP and HTTP post data does not get parity checks or other checksums, as this is happening pretty much lately. That should read:

"the User Tips section of our web site"


#1990: Help!  Centering rest, etc.
Help!  Centering rest, etc.

(1990)

Submitted by: Patti on 14-Mar-2001

Hi!

Could someone tell me how to get my whole rest to be centered in the measure. I just began using NWC again today after a long (several years!) break and I can't remember how I did this.

Also, is there any way to do this:

I want to combine rhythms in the treble - I want to have (in a 4/4 measure) 2 half notes in the high treble with this rhythm under it (still in the treble) - eighth rest, quarter rest, eighth note, quarter rest, quarter rest. Can this be done?

Thanks!

Patti

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Mar-2001

Whole rests are cenetered automatically when printing.

Your rhythms can be done, both with split stem chords (using stem direction), or with staff layering.


#1991: Rest directly below a note,below the staff etc
Rest directly below a note,below the staff etc

(1991)

Submitted by: LeRoy J Bell on 15-Mar-2001

-----------------
-------dd--------- How do you place the rests in
--d------------d---
-----------d------ directly below a note in a bar?

3 NWC doesn't want to do this
Note where the 3 is it would be in between staffs, and below a large count note,so as to add filler melody, and not to go out of count per bar. I dont know the musical term for such a rest, sorry.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 15-Mar-2001

Your diagram is not clear to me, but I think I know what you're driving at.

If the rest is longer than the note you want to combine it with, you can do this using "stem down" for the rest and "stem up" for the other note(s). You must enter the rest first, then the notes (use <Shift><Enter> to make the notes simultaneous with the rest). Be aware that NWC considers the combination of rest and notes to be a single "chord" whose duration is that of its shortest component.

If the rest is not longer than the note you want to combine it with, you must use staff layering to achieve the effect you want.

Reply 2 offered by: Ramón Pajares Box on 16-Mar-2001

<Shift><Enter> ?

I'd think it's <Ctrl><Enter> instead.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 16-Mar-2001

You're absolutely right. I never get this wrong in practice, but then my brain doesn't know what my fingers know.


#1992: MIDI Instruments
MIDI Instruments

(1992)

Submitted by: Ziggy on 15-Mar-2001

I read a particular msg about being able to change the way a MIDI instrument sounds. Well, the responses partly answered my own question regarding being able to find more sounds etc. However, I don't know where to find new sound cards or the Roland thing mentioned. Can anyone help me?

Zig

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 15-Mar-2001

What control you have over your instrument sounds depends totally on your sound card (or external synth). At one extreme, with for instance a basic SB16, you have no control. At the other end of the spectrum, with for instance an SBLive!, you have virtually unlimited possibilities by using different sound fonts. You can even edit/create your own sounds, if you have the patience to learn how, and then to do it. In between, there are synths such as Yamaha XG or Roland GS families which allow modifying sounds using different patch banks and/or controllers and/or sysex (system exclusive) messages.

Identifying what kind of sound card you have would go a long way in getting help from other users of your device.

Reply 2 offered by: Ziggy on 23-Mar-2001

Thanks! Out of curiosity, how can I really identify it? I know where I can get another card real cheap, but I need to know what I have now. Also, I used to have percussion on my MIDI, but now none plays. Any idea what could have caused that?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 23-Mar-2001

Open your Control Panel, double-click on Multimedia, select the midi tab. Your available devices will be shown there, and will give a good indication of what kind of sound card you have. For instance, it might say something like ESS Solo Synth or ?? whatever.

As to why your percussion doesn't work, that's not one I've run into before so can't be of much assistance there. But do make sure, while you're in the midi tab of system/multimedia, that "Single Instrument" is selected, with the appropriate midi device highlighted. (If it's set to the MPU-401 option, you won't hear much of anything since this is for the external midi connection via the joystick port).

Fred


#1993: NWC 1.0
NWC 1.0

(1993)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Mar-2001

I know this is an odd request and I'm also aware of the version history but you can treat it as some kind of fantasy:

I've been to NWC since v.1.3x and I wonder how its primitive ancestor looks like. Can I download it anywhere?

Regards

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Mar-2001

We contemplated this on its 5 year anniversary, but elected not to do it. It might show up at some point.

Trivia about 1.0:

-the program was not called NoteWorthy Composer
-its file extension was not *.NWC
-did not use a "true type font" for notation
-did not support undo
-could be run on a 80286 with Win 3.1 in "standard" mode
-its $39 license fee is still accepted by all version 1.* versions

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 16-Mar-2001

Ertugrul - I have NTW 1.0a if you would like to try.
I sure there will be no problem sending it to you since you are a registered user!
It's about 480kb zipped - let's know.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Mar-2001

Uhm...there was no such release from us.

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Mar-2001

I'm interested with Barry's suggestion. (You can either send to my Yahoo! account or put temporarily to your site and just post the url.) But, what about what Eric has just said?

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 19-Mar-2001

Yes - Eric is right. (There was no version 1.0A).

I found NoteWorthy originally on a compilation CD of MIDI programs, utilities and files "Sounds, Music & MIDI" produced by Australian company Sprint Software.
The CD was produced in Feb 1995 and I purchased it about the same time.
The CD has both version 1.0 and 1.1 sitting side by side in the Windows Multimedia section of the CD.

The version 1.0 zip file is titled NTW10A.zip (hence my error) the file date is 11 Nov 1994 (Sprint Software acquisition date I guess).
The version 1.1 zip file is titled NWC11.zip (NoteWorthy becomes NoteWorthy Composer) dated 12 Dec 1994.

I tried version 1.1 and searched locally for a later version without success.
When a friend got connected to the Web in 1996 version 1.3e was current and I first registered with this version.

Ertugrul - I don't have a web page up and running.
I will forward by Email.


#1994: bar ending
bar ending

(1994)

Submitted by: Cindy on 16-Mar-2001

Is there a way to get rid of the default bar line at the end of a piece. I sometimes use that one, however, if I choose the repeat one,or any other one for that matter, I end up with the one I chose as well as the default one at the end of the piece. I would like to be able to overide the default one, without having to white it out after printing.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 16-Mar-2001

Select staff, F2 (or Staff --> Properties), General tab, Ending bar pulldown, lets you select "Section Close" (default), "Master Repeat Close", "Single", "Double" and "None."

Reply 2 offered by: Cindy on 16-Mar-2001

Thank you very much for that helpful hint.


#1995: iMac and PC playback
iMac and PC playback

(1995)

Submitted by: John Smith on 16-Mar-2001

When I go to a website and play a midifile, it sounds very different depending on the type of player being used. For instance, Crescendo seems to make the instruments seem the truest, while QuickTime makes a jumble of things. Also, compositions seem a lot different when accessed using an iMac than when using a PC.

Is there anyway to make sure that one's composition, once it's posted on the Internet, will sound the way one intended it to sound, no matter which playback program is being used and no matter which, Apple or PC, type of computer is being used?

Thanks for any help.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 16-Mar-2001

Not if you post it as a MIDI file. Then it's at the mercy of whatever MIDI playback equipment the individual listener has.

Your best bet is to capture the playback from your own preferred MIDI renderer and post that. You could, for example, record the music in a .WAV file and then convert that to MP3 (for size & speed). Most sound cards do a good job reproducing recorded sounds even if their own MIDI capabilities are minimal.

Reply 2 offered by: John Smith on 16-Mar-2001

The problem is that the MP3 file is so much larger than the midi file and takes so much longer to load.

Or is it becoming more common on the Internet for MP3s to download faster, or for them to play while downloading (I guess that's called streaming). If so, is there a way to add streaming software to one's website so that visitors would be able to quickly hear the MP3's?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Mar-2001

Faster download rates are getting more common, but are not a given; where I live, for instance, nothing faster than 57.6 is even available yet. This restricts streaming bitrates to 24kbits, mono... which leads to another problem; very "lo fi" reproduction.

In other areas, high-speed connections are available but are still very expensive; especially in Europe and Asia.

The best way, IMO, to provide mp3's is to simply post them; that way anyone can download them and listen offline.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Pearson on 19-Mar-2001

Lot of compromises are needed.

I provide short mp3 soundclips (15 seconds) to let folks know what the music should sound like.

I also let folks know the card for which the midi's are optimized and that the midis may sound "different" (e.g. awful) on other sound cards, so there are fewer surprises.

Not sure if that helps, but . . .

Reply 5 offered by: John Smith on 22-Mar-2001

Thanks, Steve, for the information and advice. It's something I've long been wondering about--that is, if people would hear my compositions as I heard them, should they be using a different soundcard.

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 22-Mar-2001

It might help if you think of a MIDI file as an very precise (electronic) score, with instructions like:

Saxophone:

Play E-flat above middle C -- now!
stop -- now!
Play 3 decibels louder for awhile.
Play F ...

etc.

Every saxophonist playing this EXACTLY as you wrote it, will sound exactly the same? NOT! Tone quality can make a world of difference.

Your users don't have a saxophonist -- they have a sound card -- perhaps very cheap (the saxophone, clarinet, and trumpet sounds from the electronic equivalent of yellow kazoo, brown kazoo, and red kazoo respectively); perhaps very expensive (CD-quality samples crafted from recordings at the Boston Philharmonic).

And some instruments seem to be be done fairly well by many sound cards -- harpsichord, trumpet, hammand organ. Some instruments really seem to show the quality of the card -- choir "ah"s, for instance.

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 22-Mar-2001

Indeed. The four Basses of our choir can execute complex polyphony -- all while singing the same notes *exactly as they were written.*!

Reply 8 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 02-Apr-2001

It seems that « execute » is the good term...


#1996: Drum Stuff
Drum Stuff

(1996)

Submitted by: Ralph Johnson on 16-Mar-2001

Where does one find faq and tips for drum music.

(Jazz, etc)

I want to do compound triplets, (3 groups of 4sixteenths) and maintain the groupings. Unfortunately when the triplet icon is applied to the groups. The beam changes to 12, 16ths.

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 19-Mar-2001

1) Take your grouping, highlight the entire thing and press CTRL+T ... this will make the group into triplets

2) Highlight the group you want to be beamed (as opposed to one beam) and press CTRL+B two times.

3) Repeat step 2 for the rest of the groupings. The only problem with this method is the |-3-| will not change to any other number (yet!)

Hope this is clear to you, if not, leave a message :)


#1997: anyway I can convert MIDI's into mp3's or Waves
anyway I can convert MIDI's into mp3's or Waves

(1997)

Submitted by: Mr B on 17-Mar-2001

just want to know because I want to burn some video game music that I miss from my childhood long ago and I got all the MIDI's but need to find out how to burn them if at all possible

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 17-Mar-2001

There are numerous options and programs discussed at length at various points in the forum. Use the search engine to tie into some of the threads. You can probably find a thread or term that relates to the particular player you prefer (CoolEdit, MusicMatch, etc.)

Reply 2 offered by: John Ford on 19-Mar-2001

Hi,

Try Shareware Music Machine at:

http://www.hitsquad.com/smm/

They have lots of free and low cost shareware, music related software that will allow you to record the output from NWC (or any other MIDI source for that matter).

The bottom line is that you will need another program to capture the MIDI output from NWC to record it to a WAV or MP3 file (which is what you'll need to put the songs on a CD).

Hope this helps.

John

Reply 3 offered by: Arnold on 20-Mar-2001

There is a great midi-tool, including a midi-to-wav converter called Timidity. You can download from

http://www.stardate.bc.ca/eawpatches/html/default.htm

It's a lot of data (21 Mb) because it uses its own midi-patches. Go to the mentioned URL, click "Getting TiMidity++", click the link "Easy TiMidity and Eawpatches installer & updater", click the link "Download the installer" and be patient, really patient. It takes a lot of time but it works perfectly. The site explains also why it is so difficult to convert midi to wav or mp3. You can also take a look at

http://www.goice.co.jp/member/mo/timidity/

Converting the WAV's to MP3 use MusicMatch Jukebox, WinAmp etc. ...

Have fun!
Arnold (from Holland)

Reply 4 offered by: Dave on 26-Mar-2001

You can convert an NWC file to a wav file using Windows sound recorder. Have both programs running and visible, convert the new sound recorder file to highest quality using the configure button, then comes the trick. To get around the 60 second limit press record, let the sound recorder record silence till it stops, then go to edit/copy then edit/ paste-insert to get as much time as you need for your music. Save this lengthened file as BLANK.WAV. Now open the BLANK ssound recorder file, press the record button, then press the play button in Noteworthy Composer. YOur music will be recorded as a WAV file. Just be sure to save it under a different name using Save As in sound recorder's file menu.

Reply 5 offered by: Chagall on 27-Mar-2001

Check out this archive from this forum, I just found it two days ago, and already put up three of my pieces on mp3.com!

http://www.ntworthy.com/nwcforum/1/1003.htm

Hope that's useful to you.

Chagall
http://www.mp3.com/chagall

Reply 6 offered by: Paul C. on 31-Mar-2001

You can do the same as Reply #4, but Windows Sound Recorder only handles 60 seconds.

Go to www.goldwave.com and download Goldwave and Lame (an MP3 encoder).

Install as directed.

You now can record NWC playing to Goldwave. Then, from Goldwave, save as an MP3. Select the file attributes you want, sampling rate, etc.

If you save as a WAV, chose 44.1 khz sampling rate, 16 bit stereo, and you can use Adaptec to burn a CD that can be played in any CD player. Make your own CD demos!

For some heavy duty work... Power Tracks 7.0 (get 6.0 demo version to try this out) from PG Music (Band In A Box), www.pgmusic.com. It is about $32 with manual and CD. This is a 48 track recording program.

You can save NWC as a MIDI type 1, and drag and drop the midi onto the Power Tracks icon (or its shortcut). It will open Power Tracks, put each MIDI channel on a separate track. You can pan these left to right, add chorus, reverb, other effects, including EQ. You can add wav tracks (vocals from mic, etc).

This work can be saved (cannot save in the demo version) as a wav or MP3.

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Apr-2001

I've mentioned this in another thread but at the risk of boredom I'll mention again here.
You can record a midi or an NWC file direct to mp3 format using Musicmatch Jukebox. (The free version works fine).
Download at http://www.musicmatch.com

Set the recording source to system mixer.
Set Output to mp3 128kbs bitrate.

In Windows volume control mixer set midi as a recording source.

Load a file into NWC and play.
Press record in Musicmatch.

It's that simple.

User Steve Pearson sent us this tip some time ago.

Reply 8 offered by: Jay on 15-Apr-2001

What I do is set my recorder from the soundcard (SB value live!) on and the setting to 'what you hear' and then playback the midi file either through NWC or having exported a midi file through the SB card's playback. I imagine that other soundcards offer similar things-j


#1998: Lyrics, clefs
Lyrics, clefs

(1998)

Submitted by: FranMan on 17-Mar-2001

Hi, I'm finally a registered user. I have 2 more questions.
1)Why are the lyrics in NWC left justified instead of centered under the note as in all the books I've seen?
2) How do you convert a G Clef to a bass clef or the reverse? Sometimes in imported MIDI it is neccesary to do this to print a part that doesn't have more legger lines than a truck could hold.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Mar-2001

> How do you convert a G Clef to a bass clef or the reverse?

You mean transforming an existing clef? Just select it (highlight it), right click and select properties (or press Ctrl + e or Alt + Enter), select the desired clef from the pull-down list box at the "Clef" tab.

If you add a new clef, just press "c" and do the same thing with described above.

Hth

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Mar-2001

I've just been able to figure out another probablity that you may have meant: You want to some king of transpose the staff with one clef to its correspondent with other.

Say, you have a treble-cleffed staff containing music with the lowest note F3. First of all, "force accidentals" from "Tools" menu. Then, change (or insert) the clef as described at the previous reply. Now, select the portion you like to move to bass clef. Press Ctrl + Shift + Upward keys until the F3 is placed at the second_from_top line of the staff, that is where the clef is placed. Lastly, select "transpose staff" from "Tools" menu and leave the "0 semitones" value as is, in order to restore the sans explicit accidental outfit.

Hth

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 18-Mar-2001

I move notes from a treble clef to a bass cleff all the time (I sing bass, and prefer to read it on an F-clef rather than an octave down on a G-clef).

If the original music is on a G-clef (octave down), simply select (highlight) all of the notes), then SHIFT+CTRL+uparrow, 5 times. This moves all of the notes up. (Ertrugral was saying the same ting). De-select the notes, then change the clef from G-clef to F-clef. Do not change the key signature.

For the benefit of new users: moving notes up or down is not the same thing as transposing! If I have a melody written, in key of C, then moving all the notes up 1 (with no other changes) is *not* the same as having the same melody in the key of D. But for changing clef as described, the combination of moving notes and clef change is equivalent to an octave shift, for which there is no need to change the key signature.


#1999: nwc samples
nwc samples

(1999)

Submitted by: ross on 19-Mar-2001

Are there any good sites out there with good nwc samples on?

Thanks.
Ross

Reply 1 offered by: John Ford on 19-Mar-2001

Hi, Ross -

I would suggest that you start by browsing the links from the NoteWorthy Software web site. Go to:

http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/sitemap.htm

and select "NWC Registered User Pages". From there you should click on the link to the NWC Scriptorium, which has a repository of wonrderful NWC files in almost any style you can imagine. Also on the Registered User Pages, you will find links to a lot of people's web sites who use NWC. You should also check out the newsgroup. There is a wealth of various genres of music posted there; however, you'll have to sift through the messages to access the attachments.

There's a lot out there to listen. Plan a lot of time and enjoy the music.

John

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 19-Mar-2001

Here are the URL's of some places mentioned above:

NWC Scriptorium:
http://www.vadu.com/nwc

NWC Newsgroup:
!news://news.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc

Hth.

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 19-Mar-2001

> !news://news.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc

Hmmm. Remove the "!".


#2001: Using Media Player files in NWC
Using Media Player files in NWC

(2001)

Submitted by: Paul on 20-Mar-2001

I know that you can load MIDI-files into NoteWorthy Composer, and then edit and print the score. With the MS Windows Media Player for example, you can copy your CD's to your computer's harddisk. I would like to use my favourite music in NWC as well. The only problem is the fileformat: Media Player uses WMA-files.

Does anyone know a site where I can download a utility-program which converts WMA-files into MIDI-files (or NWC-files)?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Mar-2001

WMA files are audio files, similar to WAV and MP3 files. Although some will tell you that it is possible to convert these type of files into MIDI files, in general it is not really possible. You can look through this forum for past threads on this topic. Here are some links to get you started: msg #1236, msg #1514, msg #995

Reply 2 offered by: Aseem Kishore on 20-Mar-2001

No there isn't. Here is why:

MIDI is a thing where the computer knows exactly what notes are being played.

WAV, MP3, WMA, etc., are all just sounds that have been recorded.

You can't always convert sound to music. Record yourself talking, and try to convert that to music. The computer can't do it and neither can you. To us, we can hear different pitches on WAV and MP3 and whatnot, but the computer cannot. Just like we can understand many different accents of the same language and can understand many different people who speak the same language, but the computer can only understand one specific voice at its own unique specific wavelength and frequency.

Sorry, guess you'll just have to work on your transcribing skills.


#2002: Replying to forum messages
Replying to forum messages

(2002)

Submitted by: Grant on 20-Mar-2001

The NWC Forum entry page contains instructions for embedding links in forum messages and replies (to other forum messages and to URL's). However, I rarely come in via this page, and if I want to embed a link it's usually in a reply. I'm never sure I remember the instructions correctly, so I end up having to go back to the entry page to refresh my memory.

It would save me a lot of time (and others as well?) if the same information could be included on the "Reply Form" template, which is always where I am when I discover I want to embed a link and have forgotten how.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 20-Mar-2001

Good idea! I used to be able to remember things, but with advancing age . . .

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Mar-2001

How's that?

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 29-Mar-2001

Excellent! I can "take a hint."

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 29-Mar-2001

Excellent. Many thanks from the memory-impaired.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Mar-2001

One more thing:

We took this opportunity to improve the link embedding scheme for the forum. As of now:

- Links embedded using the !http://domain mechanism will now be handled properly, even if you don't add a space at the end. For example, including just a link inside of parentheses will now be handled correctly (the link will not include the ending parentheses).

- A new named link is now supported and documented in the hints. It allows you to link to any internet resource and use a more human readable description of the name which will be seen in the message body.

For example, writing:

!link(Our Web Site=http://noteworthysoftware.com)

will show up as:

Our Web Site

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 30-Mar-2001

[Eric wrote]
- A new named link is now supported and documented in the hints. It allows you to link to any internet resource and use a more human readable description of the name which will be seen in the message body.

For example, writing:

Our Web Site

will show up as:

Our Web Site
[/Eric]

Excellent! Thanks.


#2003: NWC Review Posted on Ciao.com
NWC Review Posted on Ciao.com

(2003)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 23-Mar-2001

Hiyall!!!

Long time no see, I know, but what with my PhD taking the bulk of my time, I really dont surf that much any longer. Let alone write music (bugger...). But the good thing is I am getting publications and my work (gene therapy for those that don't remember) will take me to three conferences this year, so I'll be in San Diego on the 23-27 June and in Denver in October, so those of you that live around there and might wanna say hi and go for a drink, please email me. I'll be happy to meet all those that I have been talking to over the past four years!

Anyway, I posted a review on NWC on the review website www.ciao.com. Please go and have a read, so that if I'm wrong or missing something, I can change it.

Thanks, and see ya all!


#2004: Better midi-playback.
Better midi-playback.

(2004)

Submitted by: Thomas on 24-Mar-2001

I need a software with wavetable midi playback. And it has to be free. Any help would be appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 24-Mar-2001

http://www.yamaha.co.uk/xg/

great software but I can't get it to record a wave file while playing the MIDI :(

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Mar-2001

Thomas - I second the motion for the Yamaha softsynth software. It's excellent, even the most basic one SYG20 (for machines with low system resources) is quite good, and the higher ones are fantastic. Not quite free, but not expensive either.

For free, you can get DirectX 7.0a or later (8.0 has been recently released) which gives Roland GS wavetable sound for free. But with a problem - on Win95 it doesn't show up as an available device, so you have to export NWC output to midi and use a standalone DirectX (DirectMusic) midi player. AFAIK this is different in Win98, and you can actually select the "microsoft synth" device.

Joe - since softsynths use the wave playback device, you have to have a card that's "full duplex", i.e. capable of recording a wav whilst playing another one. We've done it successfully on my wife's old machine. If your soundcard is full duplex, it should be possible. In Control Panel -> Multimedia -> Audio tab, be sure that both the playback and record sections have a suitable device enabled.

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 24-Mar-2001

[snip]
...this is different in Win98, and you can actually select the "microsoft synth" device.

Fred

[/snip]

No, at least I cannot. It's not available among any device listing (W98SE). DirectX 8 and DMusProd are installed.

Suppose I missed smth. I should've done?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Mar-2001

Interesting... now I'm really out of my depth. I tried it on my wife's machine, and same result as Ertugrul. Yet on the brand new machine we have at work, it's there... maybe it's a mainboard software issue, or ?? Perhaps someone more knowledgable about the fine points of &micro;soft could jump in here and explain what this is all about.

I think that support of DirectMusic would be a really nice feature in NWC, it would help assure that what we write is indeed what the listener will hear. And with care, DirectMusic can be made to sound quite good. (An example is the "Lachrymosa" on my mp3.com site.)

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 25-Mar-2001

[Fred wrote]
...Yet on the brand new machine we have at work, it's there... maybe it's a mainboard software issue, or ??
[/Fred wrote]

I have Abit BE6-II. What mainboard does your work-machine have?

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 25-Mar-2001

I have DirectX 7.0 on W98, and it does not show up as a selectable device, either within NWC, or as a system multimedia component of "My Computer."

But the DirectX is installed and functions when called by its own verification software (play its own music, etc.).

Although I don't know the details, I surmise that DirectX must be explicitly called by something else.

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 25-Mar-2001

I found this site:

http://www.clefmusic.freeserve.co.uk/direct.htm

If you scroll down the page, it provides a link to download a free utility called "Loopback," described as a "virtual MIDI cable" that allows DirectMusic to be driven from any MIDI-compatible application such as C*W*. Presumably, it would work with NWC???

There is also a link to download "DX-MIDI," a free player along the lines of the Windows Media Player, that seems to play MIDI using the DirectX sound rather than the system default.

I say "presumably" and "seems to" because I am not at my own computer today, and cannot verify any of this. But the files are there for the download. You may also need DirectX 8, rather than 7 (there's a link for it).

Reply 8 offered by: Joe Eidson on 25-Mar-2001

I'm aware of the full-duplex requirement, but the Yamaha is different somehow. I figured out how to make mp3's this weekend and finally (after 2 years of trying!) made a cd with the Yamaha sounds. I will post detailed instructionson the forum in the next day or two (if there is any interest)

Reply 9 offered by: Barry Graham on 26-Mar-2001

Re:- DXMidi
I had some correspondence with the author when he offered the beta version named DirectMidi.
I pointed out that this program name is already in use (Fred suggested Direct Midi as a DirectX player some time ago).
It will use the Direct DLS but requires a faster machine than mine (233 Mhz). The features described sounded good - it would be one way to ensure compatibility between midi users but alas I couldn't try it.

I also confirm that DirectX does not appear as a device option in Win98.
I'll check out the midicable suggestion mentioned above.
Thanks for the info.

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Mar-2001

To Ertugrul: I'll check the mainboard when I go back to work on Wednesday.

To Robert: Hubi's Midi Cable (loopback) works only to loop together existing (and available) devices. (I use it all the time - it's great stuff. I put it in my start menu so it's always in my bozo bar, I can thereby change devices on the fly regardless of what software I'm using, without going through the CP->Multimedia rigamarole). The microsoft synth device still need to be made available, such as by loading the DM Producer software and running it in the background, as suggested on the DM site you pointed out.

To Joe: I'll be interested to see your instructions. On my wife's old machine we simply played the midi in VanBasco, (nwc wasn't an option at the time because it did not yet have the facility to turn off note-chase), opened CoolEdit, and hit record... and away it went.

To Eric and crew: would it be a major operation to include DM support in NWC? It seems so simple from the outside. :)

Fred

Reply 11 offered by: HarddiskLover on 24-Dec-2001

You can also connect a Keyboard or a Synthesizer
with your Soundblaster. With a MIDI-Cable.
"My Computer can play on a real Synthesizer"


#2005: Noteworthy and VST Plugins
Noteworthy and VST Plugins

(2005)

Submitted by: Roberto on 24-Mar-2001

Does anyone have any experiance of using NWC with Reactor, Pro 5 or any similar (VST) software.
Thanks in advance,
Roberto

Reply 1 offered by: Roberto Clark on 06-Apr-2001

I'm just sending a reply to my own message, as it's not getting much response.
I use NWC with the Creamware Pulsar II set-up and it works brilliantly, but I'm also having problems running Native Instruments Reaktor and their Hammond Organ plugin. It maybe possible to get that NI stuff going by setting the drivers though. I think if you want to get all the VST plug-ins and the tasty new E-Magic stuff you might have to import midi files or maybe switch over completely.

Reply 2 offered by: Roberto on 16-Apr-2001

The latest developments in the Noteworthy vs VST plug-in epic.
I'm 95% convinced that you can't get VST plug-ins to work with Noteworthy, but Native-Instrument's stuff definitely. In the Reaktor installation you get a 'generator synthesizer' driver that can be accessed by NWC in options/midi. The only snag is, its out of time! Luckily, in Pulsar, you get a set of ASIO drivers, and when 'soft-wired' the latency comes down to a healthy 15ms.
So, that's me alright then. Except, that Logic are bringing out some tasty plug-ins, (Rhodes piano and DX7 emulators), and do they come with the 'generator synthesizer' type drivers?
If anybody's using a HD recording system without midi like Cool Edit, then maybe Cubase and Logic drivers come as standard as well.
I'll keep everyone, (who's interested), posted of the latest developments.
Roberto


#2007: noteworthy midi
noteworthy midi

(2007)

Submitted by: phil on 25-Mar-2001

I am evaluating NWC and can't produce notes on the display score via a general midi keyboard. Help!!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Mar-2001

This question is asked often. In order to diagnose your problem, you will need to try several things.

Start here: msg #1856

Then, if necessary, work your way to other linked threads.


#2008: Melon Collie
Melon Collie

(2008)

Submitted by: Megan on 25-Mar-2001

Does anyone have the .nwc for the piano on "Melon Collie and the Infinite Sadness" by the Smashing Pumpkins. I'm not too good at picking out cords or figuring them out, so if someone could send me the .nwc file, I'd really appreciate it. Thank You! ~Megan

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 26-Mar-2001

I downloaded a MIDI file and combined it into a piano part for you download it at http://www.milwaukee.k12.wi.us/53rd/Melon%20Collie%20and%20the%20Infinite%20Sadness.nwc

If this doesn't work, let me know.

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 26-Mar-2001

Ooops! the link should be http://www.milwaukee.k12.wi.us/53rd/Melon%20Collie%20And%20The%20Infinite%20Sadness3.nwc

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 26-Mar-2001

P.S. The file will probably come up as jibberish. This is OK, just go to File:Save As... and save it as something with *.nwc at the end.


#2009: Drum Notation
Drum Notation

(2009)

Submitted by: Steve on 26-Mar-2001

Hi,
I was going to get Noteworthy a while ago but didn't.
Does NWC have drum notation capability yet?
thanx!
steve

Reply 1 offered by: dragon faith on 26-Mar-2001

your journey has brought you here,
but the answer cannot be found where you seek it.
therefore, go and seek elsewhere,
and you shall find what you seek.

dragon faith

Reply 2 offered by: Steve on 26-Mar-2001

WHAT are you talking about?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Mar-2001

NWC does not support drum head notes or percussion clef. You can always find the list of new features from the history list at our web site:

http://noteworthycomposer.com/history.htm


#2010: Transposition
Transposition

(2010)

Submitted by: Albert Ransom on 26-Mar-2001

Hi everybody!

I am a new NWC user. I am currently done in an orchestration of some old pieces of mine. I did a fair job doing it, however, I am not very keen at transpositions. I already know how to do it in NWC, but I don't know the rules for each instrument.
Can anybody out there provide me with the details of each instrument of an orchestra, telling me like -12 (an octave lower), or -3, -5, and so on? I assume that the instruments you don't mention are scored at concert pitch.
Thanks in advance!

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 26-Mar-2001

The command summary includes the information you need. Get it from the Scriptorium at http://www.vadu.com/nwc

Hth.

PS: I remember an earlier thread on this issue but I failed to find it.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 27-Mar-2001

You're probably thinking of msg #1910, where I gave a long list of transposing instruments and their transpositions. (Unaccountably, I left out the contrabassoon, which sounds an octave lower than written.)

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 28-Mar-2001

Certainly.

Reply 4 offered by: Paul C. on 31-Mar-2001

Oboe, flute, violin trans = 0
(C trumpet = 0)

Bb trumpet, cornet, clarinet, soprano sax = -2

Eb clarinet = +3

French Horn, English Horn = -7

Eb Alto Saxophone, Eb Alto Horn = -9

Bb Tenor Saxophone, Bass Clarinet, Baritone Treble Clef = -14

Eb Baritone Saxophone, Eb Contrabass Clarinet = -21

(All saxophones and clarinets are written in treble clef.)

Trombone, Euphonium, Cello, = 0

Almost all else are 0.

Reply 5 offered by: Paul C. on 13-May-2001

Oh, I forgot!!! For my favorite instrument, bass saxophone, NWC cannot go to -26 as required, so I fudge, and set it to -14, like tenor sax, and know that the bass sax line is sounding one octave higher than the bass sax will play it... Hah!

Really, I DO write for sax ensemble, with some bass sax parts.

Reply 6 offered by: Paul C. on 13-May-2001

Bb soprano clarinet, Bb trumpet, Bb soprano sax are transposed up one whole step... so you set the midi playback to -2 (to make it sound down two semitones. This is reached by highlighting the desired staff, and at the top Staff > Staff Properties > Midi tab > Transposition, and set the semitones there.

So, if you compose a piece in, say Concert Pitch F, the Bb clar, tpt,sop sax parts will be in G, and all notes trasposed up one whole step from concert pitch.

Similarly, the Eb alto saxophone and Eb alto horn will be transposed up a major sixth, to concert D. The transposition on the Midi tab in NWC will be set to -9 to make it sound at concert pitch.

The F French Horn and English Horn will be transposed up a major 5th from concert F to C on their parts. The transposition on the Midi tab in NWC will be set to -7.

Tenor sax and baritone treble clef is transposed up an octave plus a whole step, to G, the midi tab to -14.

etc.

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 14-May-2001

Baritone?!!!!

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Edwards on 14-May-2001

A workround for larger transpositions is to use the octave shift on the clef.

To make this look right hide the shifted clef and layer the staff with a staff holding just the normal clef.

Peter


#2011: Scanning Software for Music
Scanning Software for Music

(2011)

Submitted by: David Palmquist on 26-Mar-2001

Scanning Software for Music
Check out http://ace.acadiau.ca/score/others.htm#Scan

It appears there are a number of programs available that will allow you to scan sheet music and save it to midi format. If this is the case, you should then be able to open the midi file in NWC and edit it.

I don't know if it works, but if anyone's interested, it's something you could try.

Reply 1 offered by: Jon Rosen on 30-Mar-2001

We have tried using several of these programs to transcribe some Broadway shows and I can only say that they are a long way from being very useful. When you have a complex score, the programs have a hard time identifying all the notes, rests and other notation. When there are multi-note chords, for instance, it would often drop several of the notes. When a whole note is played over a quarter or eight rest, it would either ignore the whole note, or forget to add the rest which throws every off. I can only say that listening to the results of many of our attempts at transcription were pretty painful.

I have found that using a good keyboard to enter the notes myself actually is faster than trying to go back and change all the mistakes in an OCRed score.

OCR SHOULD be able to work well. Printed music is quite regular and shouldn't be that hard to interpret with scanning software. However, it appears that the programs are still a long way from being "good enough".

Jon

Reply 2 offered by: Paul C. on 31-Mar-2001

I have tried the scanning/ocr in Finale, OMeR, and one other scanning program. All were equally useless. I had the same results, that is, faster to enter from scratch than to fix the numerous errors.

Changing scanning dpi, or music font size to be read did not seem to affect the results.

Reply 3 offered by: Grimblefritz on 01-Apr-2001

SharpEye Music Reader does a very nice job for me, and the MIDI output is fine. However, there are three options for saving files from SharpEye -- native .mro format, MIDI, and NIFF.

NWC can read the MIDI output of SharpEye, but as with the other comments here the result in NWC is usually more work to correct than it would be to enter it from scratch.

NWC doesn't support NIFF (either variation) so that option is of little use.

The native .mro format is obviously of no use to NWC; however, it is plain text and relatively simple to parse. I had considered writing a converter from .mro to .nwc, but hit a major snag in that NoteWorthy won't release the file format for .nwc files. Unfortunate, since a score that took me almost 3 hours to transcribe manually took only 45 minutes to scan and clean up using SharpEye.

Bottom line -- until NWC supports NIFF, scanning is pretty much useless.


#2012: NWC and winamp plugin
NWC and winamp plugin

(2012)

Submitted by: Graham Howe on 27-Mar-2001

I recently downloadd the NWC Winamp plugin, but now all my NWC files are displayed as Winamp Media files which (a) makes them indistinguishable from my midi-files and MP3's and, more importantly, (b) makes it impossible to open NWC files by double clicking on them, as they automatically open to Winamp. Any suggestions, please.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Mar-2001

You set this up in the Winamp program.

-> In Winamp, goto Preferences (Ctrl+P)

-> Select Setup | File types

-> Unselect the "nwc" extension

Reply 2 offered by: Graham Howe on 02-Apr-2001

Yep! It worked a treat! Thanks for your help!


#2013: sheet music
sheet music

(2013)

Submitted by: adva on 27-Mar-2001

hello all!
someone here has the Queen - "Bohemian rhapsody" sheet music?
if you do, please send it to me, its very importent
thanks
adva

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 27-Mar-2001

Maybe somebody does (I don't). But for something that recent, the sheet music is likely to be copyright protected.

Reply 2 offered by: Pretty Dumb on 01-Jun-2001

Recent??? Haha, Bohemian Rhapsody was written in the 80s...

Reply 3 offered by: Rich. on 01-Jun-2001

That is recent for copyright.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 01-Jun-2001

I think what "Pretty Dumb" is trying to say is that he/she wasn't born until afterwards. Actually, wasn't "Bohemian Rhapsody" from the '70s?

Folks, someday Megadeath and Eminem will be "Golden Oldies."

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 01-Jun-2001

Joe, I wish you'd learn to mis-spell correctly ;-)

It's "Megadeth"... and if you asked our 15-year-old, he'd tell you that both groups mentioned are already ancient history.

Reply 6 offered by: Rich on 02-Jun-2001

New great rule for copyright. If it was written before you were born - use it. If it was written after you were born, find someone younger than you :-)

Reply 7 offered by: David Palmqusit on 10-Jun-2001

Careful of rules of thumb - they can get you into really serious trouble.

Copyright - in Canada the basic rule in the copyright act is:

Term of copyright
6. The term for which copyright shall subsist shall, except as otherwise expressly provided by this Act, be the life of the author, the remainder of the calendar year in which the author dies, and a period of fifty years following the end of that calendar year.

I believe in the US the rule is 75 years. If you live there, you should check - your law is probably available on the web.

The Canadian copyright act can be seen at http://www.cb-cda.gc.ca/actfull-e.html#s6

The Canadian copyright act has provisions covering ownership of copyright in 1924, so it appears the law was significantly changed or introduced in that year. I believe music written before 1924 is now in the public domain, as, in Canada at least, would be anything written by anyone who died before 1951, or instance, Glenn Miller, Fats Waller.

The works of Duke Ellington (d.1974) and Irving Berlin (d.1989) are still protected in Canada and the US as long as they were written after 1923.

I am NOT a lawyer, and my advice is worth exactly what you paid for it - NOTHING. I do recommend finding out the rules before going offside, though, rather than guessing at what the law is.

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen Randall on 18-Jun-2001

As always, please take the following comments on legal matters to be as unreliable as any rumour you might hear. I am not a lawyer my comments are based on my uncertain memory of something or other I read somewhere, some time. CHECK before acting on it!

I understand that there is an international convention on copyright that makes the terms of copyright where a work is published apply in all other countries that are signatures to the convention. So, in the UK for example, the duration of copyright on a work published in the US will be lifetime plus 75 years and for a Canadian work it would be lifetime plus 50 years and you could be liable under UK law if you infringe the copyright of such works.

I believe that there are some countries around (Russia?)that are not signatories to the convention. I wonder what would be the status of stuff published on a web site hosted in a non-signatory country?

Stephen


#2014: teno notes
teno notes

(2014)

Submitted by: Carlos Acuña on 28-Mar-2001

hello, i´m trying to find how can i write "teno" notes, that is in spanish, i don´t know for english, the note is like |o|, and when it is the same note for the whole frase of lyrics until another note is found.
There is another note that someone can help it is call "epentesis", it is an optional note for the lyrics and sylable words.

Reply 1 offered by: Paul on 28-Mar-2001

This is an answer to your first question. I think that I know what you mean. This note |o| is called in English a double-whole note or breve (brevis in Latin). As far as I know, is this type of note not yet available in NWC. I have already added this item to the NWC Wish List.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 28-Mar-2001

You could insert the symbol as a text item if you find a font that contains it. I think that the the "Bach" font, available from the Useful Files section of the NWC Scriptorium (http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Fonts) may have it, but I wouldn't swear to it.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 28-Mar-2001

Oops. The link above incorrectly includes the right parenthesis. The correct link is:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Fonts

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 28-Mar-2001

One of my own free fonts (MusiSync) has the |O| note. It can be found from:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849

The symbols can be used as "text" within NWC. However, this font (and its companions) are not general-purpose symbolic fonts, and are not specific to NWC. I advise you to look around for alternative fonts, if |O| is what you really need.

I recall that there was a font called "Notes" that could be found on the usual free-font sites. It was not specific to any music program. Whether or not it is still available (or whether or not it is really free). I do not know.


#2015: Multipoint controller??
Multipoint controller??

(2015)

Submitted by: Althea on 28-Mar-2001

I've just finished my very first (and second) midi. There's a problem though... The midi's game music and it's supposed to repeat over and over again. I have to make the music fade out somewhere at the end, but how? I know the multipoint controller's essential here, but I have absolutely no idea how to use it.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 28-Mar-2001

My suggestion would be to download the NWC Command Summary, from the NWC Scriptorium at http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ and click on "Documentation" to go to the Command Summary page. This includes an extensive tutorial on the use of mpc's which should be helpful.


#2016: midi exports, but no sound
midi exports, but no sound

(2016)

Submitted by: Jon on 29-Mar-2001

I am trying to export drum stuff to a midi file. I can export it fine and all but when I try to open the file in something other that NWC, it looks like it is playing, but there is no type of sound or anything coming out, and it is not something wrong with my system, and I also made sure that the MIDI Mapper was the only thing selected in the "Devices used for play back" box in the tools menu. Please help. Thx

Reply 1 offered by: louie on 29-Mar-2001

Did you close NWC before opening the other program? Some programs have to have uninterrupted access to the midi device right from the word go.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Mar-2001

You do not necessarily have to shut down NWC. You can device "Port Usage" options from Tools | Options | MIDI.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 29-Mar-2001

Um... You do have the volume control turned up?

Reply 4 offered by: Jon on 29-Mar-2001

Hey, thx it works now. AND OF COURSE I HAD MY VOLUME TURNED UP... what do you think I am... stupid? I'm not sure whether it was the close NWC thing, or the port thing, but I changed both and it works now.... thx

~Jon

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Mar-2001

Either would have probably done it. And as to the volume control issue... been there, done that. Many times. Gives me an opportunity to exercise my blond side. :)


#2017: layers and rests
layers and rests

(2017)

Submitted by: Doug Lowe on 29-Mar-2001

I'm working on an SATB piece in which the tenor has several measures of rests while the bass is singing. When I layer the tenor and bass, the rests from the tenor staff appear on the layered TB staff, superimposed on the bass part. Is there a way to hide these rests?

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 29-Mar-2001

select them and on the visibility tab select hide

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Mar-2001

Set the Visibility tab's "Show on printed page" option to "Never" or "On Top Staff" for these rests and you are done.

Reply 3 offered by: Doug Lowe on 29-Mar-2001

Wow, I'm impressed by the features as well as by the quick response. I've been using the evaluation version for about a week now and I think I'm sold.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-Mar-2001

No only that, you can (if you wish) move the rests higher (or lower) than their usual position at center staff. That way, you can have both rests and notes show together, in case one of your voices needs a reminder to remain silent.

Reply 5 offered by: Jeremy Ewen on 29-Mar-2001

C'mon, Doug, dig deep and get yourself the full version. Fifty million of us can't be wrong!


#2018: MIDI to WAVE - instructions for wavetable synths
MIDI to WAVE - instructions for wavetable synths

(2018)

Submitted by: Joe Eidson on 29-Mar-2001

** Note ** I know this isn't really related to Noteworthy, but I figured I would post here anyway. Many people have had problems with MIDI to wave (including myself, took 2 years to figure this out) and hopefully this will be a solution that others can use. Use at your own risk! :)
-----------
1) To download the Yamaha SYXG midi driver, go to (http://www.yamaha-xg.com/ssynth/index.html)
Install it, then continue

2) After having a wavetable MIDI driver installed, go to
(http://www.ntonyx.com/vac.html)
and download the virtual audio cable. Install this program, then continue

3) For a wave editor, go to
(http://www.goldwave.com/release.html)
(Or use another program of your choice)

4) Open the control panel (My Computer / Control Panel) then click on Multimedia

5) Under the Audio tab, change the Playback device to "Virtual Cable 1 Out" and change the Recording Device to "Virtual Cable 1 In"

6) Click the MIDI tab and make sure that the Yamaha (or other softsynth) is selected

7) Open Noteworthy Composer (or other MIDI program) and select the song you want to record -- Make SURE you know the duration of your song

8) Open GoldWave (or other program) and click on File / New. Type the length of your song (plus a few seconds) and hit OK

9) A window should pop up labeled "Device Controls" -- if not, click on Tools / Device Controls

10) In the device controls window there should be a small icon that looks like a dot and a checkmark, click that and go to Device. Set the Output and Input to the "Virtual Cable 1 Out / In" respectively

11) Hit record on the device controls window and switch over to Noteworthy (this is why you need a few extra seconds) - hit play in Noteworthy.
** NOTE ** If you can hear your song playing through the speakers, you have done something wrong. Make sure the Multimedia settings in the Control Panel were done before any other programs were opened.

12) After your song is over, you can save it as a wave file, then convert to MP3 if you wish. A good converter is AudioCatalyst. It can be downloaded here:
(http://www.xingtech.com)
Click on MP3 Audio, then go to "Purchase and Download Now"

To get your sound back, go to Control Panel / Multimedia and change the "Virtual Cable" settings in Playback and Record to their default
-----

If anyone has any additions or corrections, please let me know. Good luck!
-joe

Reply 1 offered by: Ron on 21-Nov-2001

Ohmigod, isn't there a simple way to do this. So many acronyms, drivers, converters, editors, correct and incorrect sequences, files, codes and to top it all there seems to be 127 shareware options. I just want to convert my lil ol midi file to wav so I can burn it to cd.
Ron

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 24-Nov-2001

Joe Eidson's posting is quite helpful. For those of you who don't understand why it is so complicated: "Converting" MIDI to WAV is like "converting" sheet music to sound at your local bistro. To do the latter, you have to hire a band with the proper instruments. To do the former, you need software that can access a digital database of musical instrument sounds (if you have one), or synthesize them digitally (if you don't).

This is very unlike, say "converting" an MS Word document into Wordperfect format; in this case, the fundamental information is much the same, only how it is arranged in the file is different.

There are a variety of software programs that can "convert" MIDI to WAV, with more or less acceptable results, depending upon the versatility of the sound database or synthesisis. Those of us who already have such capability would know it. Joe E's posting provides a (relatively) simple and not-too-bad-sounding method, for those of us who don't already have the capability.

Reply 3 offered by: dj sommax on 31-Dec-2001

NO you just have to download winamp.
There you go to the output otions an choose the "cd writer output plugin". In that way you can convert your files much easier......

Reply 4 offered by: Micolithe on 03-Feb-2002

my god... you people have to make this seem harder than it already is. just list a freeware midi to wav converter!

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Feb-2002

Musicmatch Jukebox freeware version.

Now how to do it could be a little harder!


#2019: midi problem
midi problem

(2019)

Submitted by: Althea on 30-Mar-2001

When I play back my song in Noteworthy Composer, it sounds perfectly ok. But when I use another program (eg. windows media player) to play the song, it sounds really distorted! What is wrong?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 30-Mar-2001

Check to see that you have the same device set in your midi mapper. (Midi mapper is just Windows' way of assigning a "default" midi device.) Go to Control Panel --> Multimedia --> Midi tab and select the same device as you have set up in NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 30-Mar-2001

... To learn what is selected in NWC; go to Tools > Options > MIDI and see what the topmost device in "Devices used by playback" is.


#2020: Nashville Number System
Nashville Number System

(2020)

Submitted by: tbao on 30-Mar-2001

Does NoteWorthy support Nashville Number System?
TIA.
Tom

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Mar-2001

If I understand correctly, you're referring to the harmonic functions system used for country music (all uppercase Roman numerals, with modifiers e.g. I VIm IV V). NWC supports it in the sense that you can add anything you like as text, and position it just about anywhere you want it. It does not, however, automagically analyse your chords to determine what the chord function is.

Reply 2 offered by: Kent Dugan on 06-Apr-2001

Better late than never. Nashville borrowed heavily from Piston and Persichetti, which I learned almost 40 years ago. I guess renaming it for a country town makes it legit? Not trying to be snooty. No offense.

Reply 3 offered by: Leland McKenzie on 20-May-2001

Uhm.. Not to be an INTP (Look it up. it's a personality type), but the Nashville Number System utilizes Arabic neumerals, not Roman. Roman numerals are used in Common Practice Theory analyzation. They're similar, but not quite.

CPT is meant to be used to analyze scores of early baroque to early 1900's eras. The NNS is more versatile, in that it can represent "color" chords that one normally couldn't use in CPT.

Personally, I use a mixture of both when I notate charts. I use Roman with the color intervals as arabic, i.e. IV^2 to represent 4^2 or an F2 in the key of C. It just works easier, IMO, than establishing a key and having to write 2 different keys for a song. Just write one chart, and everyone can follow.

It's rather jazzish, but hey, it works. I can testify that it works better than strict letter chords, because my praise band spent one whole practice one night trying to transpose a song from F to E. Later on, I brought in a song charted in my little hybrid, and when we had to lower the key, it was perfect. We still used the same chart, without having to rewrite every single chord.

Give it a try sometime. You might just like it.


#2021: Adding key shortcuts
Adding key shortcuts

(2021)

Submitted by: Jon Rosen on 30-Mar-2001

Is there a way to add shortcuts to commands that don't have them? I make a LOT of use of the Audit Bar Lines command and I hate having to use the menu all the time. A keyboard shortcut for this command would be heaven. I believe all products should have this automatically available so that the user can customize the system the way they want to.

Jon Rosen

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 30-Mar-2001

You could use a macro.
Try the NWC User Scriptorium http://www.vadu.com/nwc
I think there are some macros and access to the Windows macro recorder there.

Macros are simple to write (you supply the key strokes and the recorder records what you input.
A set of macros can be assigned to different key combinations (eg TAB/A for Audit barlines, CRTL/T for transpose to trumpet pitch etc.).

They can sure cut down the time required to carry out tasks like transposition, clef change, producing triplets etc.

NWC is about the only music program I know that provides keyboard input for most commands making it very suitable for the macro approach.

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 31-Mar-2001

If you don't mind dictated commands, I have been using Dragon Dictate for years. Very easy to set up the key macros under a verbal command (i.e. "sharp" "flat" "key" "clef" "up" "down" etc.

Reply 3 offered by: Jon Rosen on 31-Mar-2001

Thanks for the replies. I actually just made the second most cost-effective software purchase ($29.95) I have ever made last night, the first best being the $39 I spent on Noteworthy Composer :-) After just 6 hours of trying out EZ Macros, I decided it would be another $30 VERY VERY well spent! It solved not only my problems with Audit Bars but allowed me to do some incredibly fast and sophisticated music entry quite accurately. I will describe below for anyone interested:

I am transcribing musical theater scores which have fairly regular note patterns, but often quite complex ones. I have found that I can't play the keyboard well enough to record the music (even one staff) into MIDI and then open it in Noteworthy and get a good transcription. My timings are always off enough that even with very large quantizing, I always end up with lots of changes to make. I have found it easier to simply pound the notes at no specific tempo into Noteworthy directly (with MIDI input active but not recording MIDI). The problem this creates is a stream of notes of a single duration with no rests. If I had enough hands, I guess I could add the rests from the computer keyboard while playing the notes on the piano keyboard, but it would be tough (BTW, I liked the idea of using voice input to do some of this and I might try that soon too).

In any case, typical bass lines in my scores will be a stream of rest/quarter/rest/quarter... for most of the page. Before this meant typing in a rest in between each note after I was done entering the notes.

With EZ Macros, I was able to easily create a keyboard macro that added the rests in the right place and the appropriate bar line immediately after the bar. By positioning the cursor at the front of the stream of notes, I was able to convert this bass line in about 1/10th the time it had taken me previously!

I had even more spectacular success with a treble clef phrasing which needed to be: dotted eighth, sixteenth, dotted eighth, sixteenth (tied to), dotted eighth, sixteenth, quarter, bar line. Converting that sequence one note at a time was back-breaking. I created an EZ Macro that did the whole seven note sequence in one keystroke! Amazing!

Why did I use EZ Macros instead of the Microsoft one suggested in the Noteworthy User Tips section? Well, I tried that one and it was not very reliable, and it had a relatively poor interface. It also didn't allow for easy editing of the macros manually (very important I found, recording the macros added a lot of spurious mouse movement commands that couldn't be eliminated). I downloaded EZ Macros from American Systems and tried it out, and within a few hours, realized that I would need this to make Noteworthy even a more powerful product.

I am NOT a shill for American Systems, I promise. I just think it, like Noteworthy, is a terrific, small, reliable piece of software and it adds tremendous value for almost no money.

Link to their website is: http://www.americansys.com/

Good luck and thanks for all the comments.

Jon

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 01-Apr-2001

Glad that worked for you Jon.
I forgot to mention that I never use the mouse with the Windows macro recorder - everything can be accessed in NWC using keystrokes eliminating the need for mouse movement.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Bacher on 04-Apr-2001

Why not just the normal Windows menu shortcuts?

E.G. Alt T B for Audit Bar Lines.

- seb


#2023: Printing from NoteWorthy Composer 1.70 to PDF
Printing from NoteWorthy Composer 1.70 to PDF

(2023)

Submitted by: Tony Pitt on 31-Mar-2001

When I print to Adobe Acrobat from NWC 1.70, I get a PDF file that has the staves, note stems and tails and text visible, but the head of every note is missing. I've tried telling it to embed the NWC font, but it makes no difference.

I'm using the Adobe PDF Writer 3.02 and Windows 98SE.

Can anyone suggest a fix?

Thanks,
T

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 31-Mar-2001

I had a similar difficulty when I first tried to get PDF from some applications (including NWC). The problem permanently went away when I did something or other ... but I can't remember what! I believe it has something to do with the PostScript printer that sits behind your PDF technology. It has nothing to do with the NWC program.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul C. on 31-Mar-2001

Click Start > Settings > Printers.

Right Click on Acrobat PDF Writer.

Click Properties.

Click Details tab.

Click Setup button (on the lower left of the Details tab.

Click Fonts button.

Click Embed All Fonts, Click OK, and close out all of this.

You should now have the fonts embedded.

Test it be sending a PDF to a friend who DOES NOT HAVE Noteworthy. Ask him if he can see all the notes, etc.

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 31-Mar-2001

The PDF Writer is not as robust as the Acrobat Distiller. I discovered errors periodically with the PDF Writer and therefore went exclusively with the Acrobat Distiller. Nary a problem since. See if that helps you as well.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 31-Mar-2001

The above responses sound correct, but I haven't had problems with PDFwirter or Distiller, once I ocated the probelm (whatever it was).

Helpful hint: Among the properties of PDFwriter/Distiller is the resolution. The output from NWC is a combination of font objects and drawing objects. The appearance of your finished PDF file will be a bit different depending on whether you choose "screen" resolution of 72 DPI, or printer resolutions of 300 DPI or greater. You might also try having your PDF file open at 100%, rather than fit-to-width, if they are being viewed on-screen.


#2024: fractal music
fractal music

(2024)

Submitted by: charli 2na on 02-Apr-2001

I want to try and make a fractal song and I'm wondering if there are any strict rules that go with it? Is it like arranging for random notes or does it go much deeper than that?
Any websites about them?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Apr-2001

There are as many "rules" as there are fractal composers, and as many variants on the rules as there are fractals. As in other areas of composition, rules are generally summations of "what works, and what doesn't."

Some fractal programmers essentially just find a neat sequence, and assign instrument patches to them, believing that the fractal's raw purity should not be compromised by meddling. My preference is to use the fractal sequence simply as a starting point, from whence I compose the rest of the piece using "conventional" means. Some of my fractal pieces are at my My mp3.com site.

A good starting point for finding out more about fractal music creation is Fractal Music Lab. An older but still excellent site is The Fractal Music Project.

Above all, have fun, and let your creativity go nuts!

Fred


#2025: WAVE or AIFF to MIDI Posibble?
WAVE or AIFF to MIDI Posibble?

(2025)

Submitted by: Hens on 02-Apr-2001

Hi! i need to know if there are any freeware softwares outhere that convert wave or aiff files to MIDI formats.
Thanks
Hens

Reply 1 offered by: Hens... on 02-Apr-2001

I forgot to metion that I am using a mac g4, that this freeware could be for the mac

Thanks
hens

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 02-Apr-2001

Opinions differ. There are apparently programs that can handle simple .wav files (for example, those containing a melody played by a single solo instrument). The consensus opinion, though, is that it's not really possible to write a program to generate a MIDI file from an arbitrary .wav file. If I understand correctly, AIFF files would present the same problem.

For much more on this check out these threads: msg #1236, msg #1160, msg #1003, msg #995.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 02-Apr-2001

As regular readers of this forum know (also see the above message threads), WAV to MIDI is in general not possible, or unsatisfactory except in limited circumstances.

To clear the confusion, there needs to be an understanding of terminology. WAV and MIDI are not different *formats* for the same thing. They are entirely different things.

A vinyl record (remember those?) is a different *format* of recorded music from a tape, or a CD. Each *format* has benefits and limitations. But in the realm of ordinary music, each *format* can be closely compared to the other in terms of the end result, audible sound. It is possible to convert between them, with little loss.

Likewise, BMP, GIF, and JPG are different *formats* for an image. Each has its benefits and limitations. It is possible to convert between them, with some amount of loss depending on the information content. In many cases, little or no easily detectable loss.

But WAV and MIDI to not contain the same kind of information. WAV is a digitized representation of a sound waveform. MIDI is a sequence of program instructions. They are not different *formats* of the same kind of thing.

Reply 4 offered by: Jbal on 03-Apr-2001

Hello:
I have seen the program WAV2MIDI in INTERNET. I don't know if it work well. Chau...chau... Jbal

Reply 5 offered by: Jbal on 03-Apr-2001

Hens: I send you...

WAV-2-MIDI 1.0
Windows 95 / 98 / NT

Wav-2-Midi is a stand-alone application that converts a wav
file containing audio of a guitar playing, to a Midi file with
the same information.

This version of Wav-2-Midi is capable of monotonic note detection,
as well as an auto-velocity detection feature (which can be turned
off, if the user wishes). Also the sensitivity of the note detection
algorithm is adjustable, allowing you to configure the conversion to
your own playing style.

The appearance of the application is also user-specific, allowing you
to adjust the colors and appearance of all text and buttons. Other
options for display incorporate skins which you can make yourself to
make the application look like you want it to, with a personal touch.

Also included is a Wav Editor for playing and recording wav files, as
well as a Midi File Player for listening to the Midi files produced by
the conversion.

Shareware: unregistered Version will only convert Wav file less than 10
seconds long. Also the unregistered version will not allow you to turn
off the splash screen on startup.

Screen Shot 1
Screen Shot 2

For more, contact 9638792@student.ul.ie or padraig_myers@hotmail.com

Download Software
File is 5299952 bytes long.

Download Times
14.4k Modem 28.8k Modem 33.6k Modem 56k Modem 1-Channel ISDN 2-Channel ISDN T1
49.1 minutes 24.5 minutes 21.0 minutes 13.3 minutes 12.6 minutes 6.3 minutes Less than a minute

Reply 6 offered by: Barry Graham on 04-Apr-2001

49 min!! I hope I could transcribe the piece by ear in a shorter time than that.

Reply 7 offered by: Jakob on 04-Jan-2002

There are several programs I found:
AmazingMidi
Wav2Midi
MP32Midi
DigitalEar

search for these terms in a search engine and you will find alot of stuff about converting wav files to midi, how it works and what to do to get reasonable results.
Shareware versions are available but mostly do only parts of the song. I am experimenting with AmazingMidi right now. Its shareware limitation is 30 days of use, but it converts the whole song!
Worth a try.

Good luck

Reply 8 offered by: david palmquist on 15-Jan-2002

Digital Ear is part of the NWC download - I think it's version 1.70 with web service pack 10?

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2002

The NWC setup download contains NWC, and not any other programs.


#2026: NoteWorthy Player wishes
NoteWorthy Player wishes

(2026)

Submitted by: Grimblefritz on 02-Apr-2001

I'd like to solicit feedback on a few ideas, all.

1. A special "Save as" format from NWC to create a .nwp file. This file could be read by NWP but not NWC. This would make it more secure when posting songs on the web.

2. The ability to mute staves in NWP. Shouldn't be a problem in the stand-alone player, but might need to be based on MIDI channels in the WinAMP and plug-in variations. I use NWC for choral music, and post to the web for practicing. W/O a staff mute, I have to create separate versions for each vocal part.

3. Related to the above -- staff hide.

4. Ability to scroll through score when not actively playing, and the ability to "click and play" from any point in the score. (Or, ability to "goto measure" and play from there.)

I'm not sure if these are easily attainable in the player, but they all exist in the composer so I'm hoping they'd be relatively easy -- at least its not having to invent all new stuff.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Apr-2001

Re: 1 through 3: I agree these would be good features.

Re: 4: This facility exists to a degree in the browser plug-ins, in which you have a scroll bar that you can drag anywhere into the piece once it's started playing. A Goto Bar xxx would be nice.

Reply 2 offered by: Kent Dugan on 06-Apr-2001

You mean like Control-G (the GoTo bar feature)?

Reply 3 offered by: Grimblefritz on 06-Apr-2001

Yeah, like that, except in the Player(s).


#2027: mute list suggestion
mute list suggestion

(2027)

Submitted by: Grimblefritz on 02-Apr-2001

I'm going to add this to the wish list, but thought I'd put it here for comment.

I think it would be very handy to have the same group level selection capability in the mute list as exists in the "File,Page Setup" dialog for hiding staves.

In other words, in vocal scores I often label the various staves as "Vocal", "Accomp", "Brass", "Winds", etc. In Page Setup, it is then very easy to hide an entire group of related staves.

Having a similar ability to quickly mute an entire group would be terrific.

Reply 1 offered by: Roelie Oelofse on 04-Apr-2001

Just last night I was wishing for exactly that, I would add my vote for such a facility.

Roelie


#2028: Where can I buy legal rock midis?
Where can I buy legal rock midis?

(2028)

Submitted by: Swami on 02-Apr-2001

I have purchased several 1960's era rock midis in the past, but did not retain the address of the site(s). Can anyone suggest one or more sites that have a good selection of such music and allow a prospective buyer to preview it?

I am only interested in sites that offer sale with license.

Thanks.


#2029: *.wav
*.wav

(2029)

Submitted by: Andrew Thompson on 03-Apr-2001

HELP!!!! I NEED to hand in some vital coursework in 2 days and i was wondering if anyone knows how to convert *.nwc into *.wav or if it's even possible. I've got 1.70 running on Win ME

HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 03-Apr-2001

Follow these instructions:

msg #2018

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 03-Apr-2001

... although to some observers the instructions therein might seem like overkill. There are, in fact, many ways to convert NWC files to WAV, the simplest of which, if you have a full-duplex sound card whose MIDI output you find acceptable, is simply to play the file in NWC through your card and record the card's output in a recording application. I use SoundForge, which came, I believe, with my sound card.

You might want to look at msg #1003, which explores the topic in exhaustive (and perhaps exhausting) detail.

Reply 3 offered by: Jope Music on 03-Apr-2001

Remember that the quality of the WAV file depends upon the sound card software/hardware. If you have a choice of computers, create the output on the one with a better sound card or synth.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Eidson on 03-Apr-2001

Grant - if you have any instructions on how to record MIDI to wave using the Yamaha XG synth that are any easier than the ones I posted, I would love to hear them.

Reply 5 offered by: chris on 03-Apr-2001

Joe-

See msg #1997 (reply 4)

My computer has a Yamaha S-YXG50 softsynth, and this method worked just fine for me.

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Eidson on 04-Apr-2001

Chris -- hrmmm strange, I'm using the Yamaha S-YXG100 on my machine and that method does not work for me. Maybe my shoddy sound card is not full-duplex after all.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Apr-2001

Joe - Yes... I wonder if some cards are perhaps, for lack of a better word, "half-duplex". The softsynths, of course, tie up the playback wave device during use, but the recording device should be left open and available for use. It's interesting (and very ingenious!) that you could get it to work by using a multi-wave device client, so your method would, I'm sure, come in very handy for people with the same or similar setups.

Perhaps it would be a good idea to post a followup to your post specifying exactly what sound card on on-board chipset you have, so that others with the same setup can find the thread using the search facility.

Reply 8 offered by: Grimblefritz on 04-Apr-2001

There is also the consideration of stereo vs mono, 32/16/8 bit, etc. The SB64 uses 16-bit stereo playback, and with some effort you can record in 8-bit. Sounds like crap, though. Partly because of the 8-bit record, but mostly because the SB cards have really noisy circuits.

The Yamaha synth is immune because you are "recording" the wave information it generates to "play" the MIDI. The virtual cable is just a metaphor for taking the wave info generated by the synth and saving it to a file instead of (or in addition to) sending it to the sound card. In other words, no noise, loss, or distortion.

I use the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas. I had to pay $69 to get it, but it sounds better (I think) than the Yamaha. And, to convert MIDI to WAV all you have to do is open the MIDI file and click a button.


#2030: Lyric Lines
Lyric Lines

(2030)

Submitted by: Jeremy Ewen on 04-Apr-2001

I'm having trouble getting enough lyric lines of a certain font size to fit beneath a stave.

To make the singing (and playing) of Psalms easier at my church I normally copy out the chant and then put in the verses below in the usual way. Provided that the psalm does not have too many verses this is Ok. But the one for this Sunday has 15 verses, and I have managed to get around this by having two identical staves, layered, with 8 verses on one and 7 verses on the other. I then set up the spacing below the stave containing the last 7 verses to it's maximum (60 places). Unfortunately I can only then use a font size of 8 points which is a bit small for our congregation. If I use a larger font the first 8 verses expand upwards and collide with the stave and the last 7 verses do the same thing and collide with the first set of verses!

Can anybody think of a workaround for this one?

Reply 1 offered by: MMario on 04-Apr-2001

When I've had similar circumstances I have just doubled the length of the music - putting two verses of text on each line

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Apr-2001

You are limited to 60 positions below the staff. There is no way to get around this that I can think of at the moment.

If you have another staff below this one, you could add a third hidden staff layered with the lower staff, copy all the notes from the top staff, hide them all, then add some lyric lines aligned with the top of this staff. This obviously only works if you have the staff below. You will also have to do some work to make sure everything is invisible on this staff, since it will clash with the real staff at this position.

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 22-Apr-2001

IF LYRICS HAD A SPARATE COLOR MENU, You could make one of your optional colors black and the another one white. Make a staff under the staff with the verses under it. Change the staff color to white. Make the lyrics and choose black as your color for them. Move them (and the staff) accordingly. But Lyrics can only be the color of the staff so this can't happen....


#2031: Newsgroup trouble
Newsgroup trouble

(2031)

Submitted by: Grant on 04-Apr-2001

Suddenly I find it impossible to connect to the Newsgroup server. Is there a general problem or is it just me?

Reply 1 offered by: B. Jean on 04-Apr-2001

No you are not alone
They keep asking me a username and a password

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 04-Apr-2001

I have been facing it, too. OE produces a "408 Authenticity Required" while Opera brings out a dialogue box asking for username and password. What's interesting is that the dialogue box includes a text message: "This news server _has_been restricted." So I suppose it's intentional.

However, I've asked Eric in private and been waiting for reply.

Reply 3 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 05-Apr-2001

Me too !

Seems to be a problem we all are having. But there seem to be small periods of time where it's OK.

Rich.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 05-Apr-2001

I wonder if ezusa have silently pulled the plug on us?
I hope Eric will be able to find out. Unfortunately, short of driving to their office and walking in the door, one is restricted to phone calls to perhaps an answering machine, and e-mails. Neither guarantees a reply, and we all wait with bated breath. In the meantime, let's all have a cup of tea. ;-)

A

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 05-Apr-2001

Quick straw poll.
Just saying that
1) ezusa have simply gone "private" and require a username and password, and
2) they provide Eric with one to distribute to us

Hands up who's newsreader CANNOT support passwords on newsgroups. (Just one reply per newsreader is sufficient, thanx). This may be a purely academic question, of course.

A

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Apr-2001

We don't know any more than the rest of you. Whatever happened, it is the whole news server, not just our group. Stay tuned...

Reply 7 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 05-Apr-2001

At the moment, it seems that it will now let you connect to download but not to post.
Seems that there is a problem that they are perhaps in the process of resolving .

Fingers crossed

Rich.

Reply 8 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 05-Apr-2001

It seems to be back up and running, with one caveat.

I just succesfully posted an item and then saw it on the group.

However -- just before I had looked and seen two threads, one the advice about the service pack, and one "test" thread. When I went back (with "show all messages" selected) both threads seemed to have vanished.

Cyril

Reply 9 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 05-Apr-2001

Just to put down the period:

It's all up and running right now.

Reply 10 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 06-Apr-2001

And down again! Could this be related to the DSL provider, Northpoint, going belly-up?

Cyril

Reply 11 offered by: Stephen Randall on 06-Apr-2001

But now it seems to be back down and not running again - OE reports: 408 Authentication Required

Reply 12 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Apr-2001

It is down again...This is outside of our control, but maintenance is sometimes required. I think patience is the best medicine in this situations...

Reply 13 offered by: FranMan on 06-Apr-2001

I have never been able to access the newsgroup. It always takes a long time pretending to connect and the displays an error message stating the the server must be down. It may just be my internet service which tells you to set every server to the same proxy server except e-mail.

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 06-Apr-2001

That may be a different problem. Unlike a lot of newsgroups, the NoteWorthy newsgroup is on a private server that your ISP may not give you access to. For example, I can't access the newsgroup from work because the people who maintain our firewall require all newsgroups to be on the company's own newsgroup server, which rules out private groups. I had a similar problem reaching the newsgroup from my sister's AOL account.

Reply 15 offered by: Grant on 06-Apr-2001

... this news just in: it appears to be working again. This is so much fun.

Reply 16 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 06-Apr-2001

FranMan,

A possiblity is that it may be a matter of connection speed. Try increasing the time-out limit for the server, in your newsreader.

Hth

Reply 17 offered by: FranMan on 07-Apr-2001

Yes I'm sure that the time-out limit is the problem. My modem being twice as slow as the 56k modem take a long time for everything. But how on Netscape Messenger could I change this limit? Is there a way to change it in the dial up networking folder? I downloaded Callwave and I think connection speed is the problem for it's software as well. Thanks for any help!

Reply 18 offered by: Lionel Modra on 12-Apr-2001

April 12.
Seems the news server is down again. Anyone else having this problem? (Error message follows).
Header download for the 'ntworthy.nwc' folder did not complete. Account: 'news.ezusa.net', Server: 'news.ezusa.net', Protocol: NNTP, Port: 119, Secure(SSL): No, Socket Error: 11001, Error Number: 0x800CCC0D

Reply 19 offered by: Robert Clark on 16-Apr-2001

The Noteworthy newsgroup was down on Mon 16th Apr (as well as the Logic audio one)
Roberto


#2032: NoteWorthy Composer Service Pack 4
NoteWorthy Composer Service Pack 4

(2032)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Apr-2001

We just released the following:

NoteWorthy Composer Service Pack 4

What is in Web Service Pack 4?
-------------------------------
1. Fix: The Script field, set from File|Page Setup|Fonts|Modify and disabled in SP 3, has now been restored

2. Improvement: Lyric placement under notes is improved, especially when accidental spacing exists on the note

3. Improvement: Spacing of notes is now consistent, regardless of whether or not the note is adjacent to an invisible item

4. Improvement: A staff can now be moved up or down to a new position in the system using Ctrl+Shift+Page Up/Down

5. Improvement: Beams between a note in the staff and another note extending well above or below the staff now include a slant for improved appearance

Reply 1 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 04-Apr-2001

With the change in spacing in the vicinity of invisable items, will there be any simple way to track down all the inserted spaces so the spacing doesn't go from zero to too much?

Cyril

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 04-Apr-2001

Thanks for all fixes and improvements, especially for 1 and 3 that I had reported.

Thanks indeed for also 4 and 5, which are really great improvements.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 04-Apr-2001

Eric,

In the table on the service pack page, the last line for 32-bit NWC reads:

1.70 (32-bit) + Web Service Packs 1-3 | None (you are up-to-date)

Some might conceivably find this confusing. It should say "Service Packs 1-4".

Reply 4 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 05-Apr-2001

Thanks also for number 2 which I reported.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 05-Apr-2001

Many thanks for 5.
I wonder if the beams alter a little too enthusiastically, though this is probably a personal judgement call.

Reply 6 offered by: David Potvin on 06-Apr-2001

Thanks indeed for #5!!!

There were a lot of things which I needed NWC 16bit in order to transfer my charts in BMP for fixing beamings that were superimposing into each other; now, that's no longer necessary because of improvement #5!!!

And, Andrew, you're allowed! Honestly, I don't find that too bothersome, although if it DOES bother you on one instance or another, just transfer it into a .BMP with NWC 16 and modify it to your heart's desire... That's not a criticism, just a passing suggestion - one which I've been using a couple of times succesfully before...

So, thanks NWC!

Reply 7 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 06-Apr-2001

Thank you for all. About #3, I had a problem of notes spacing, but my poor english prevented me from explaining it here. I will try and see if this is fixed.

Reply 8 offered by: Artur on 06-Apr-2001

Man, I've gotta tell ya...
This software is the most beautiful one on the market and has just turned better.
Keep up guys!
P.S. loved the #5

Reply 9 offered by: Artur on 06-Apr-2001

At first I had only read the text when I wrote that reply, and I said I loved the #5, then I installed the ServicePack, and I've found nothing changed. Could some one explain it to me, for I thought it was inverted beams that they were refering to?

Reply 10 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Apr-2001

We are surprised that #5 is the most popular change. I expected #2 to be the most popular, given the wish list submissions. Is it really true that the beaming logic enhancement is the most popular improvement in SP 4?

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Apr-2001

Inverted beams? Please explain...

NWC does not, even with SP4, beam notes of opposing stem directions.

Reply 12 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Apr-2001

No 2, then no 3 have made my day - thank you.

I can't see any difference in 5 (although obviously there is one?) and the multi-flagged note stems are still too long which is the partial cause of inappropriate beaming.

Peter

Reply 13 offered by: FranMan on 06-Apr-2001

I like #2, but after the first verse, the lyrics on _some_ notes seem to go back to the way they were before the fix...

Reply 14 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Apr-2001

FYI: We are working on a remedy to the spacing problems related to enhancement #2. An update should be available in the next 48 hours.

Reply 15 offered by: FranMan on 09-Apr-2001

THANK YOU! This is a great program, and I wish there were a Mac version.

Reply 16 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 10-Apr-2001

I didn't try the #2 yet, but I'm sure that I will love it !
Anyway, I still have *my* spacing problem, and I will start a new thread for that. I also still would like to know how I can cope with the staff style (msg #2034).

Reply 17 offered by: John Gillings on 11-Apr-2001

The trouble with users... give them an inch!

I like the beaming enhancement, but it only affects *pairs* of notes beamed. Three or more notes is still beamed with a straight line, regardless of the relative locations of the notes. Any chance of extending the algorithm to include longer groups? Maybe there is a need for a note property to adjust the angle of the beam? Something like a toggle for flat vs angled then a a "knob" with values: 0 for the default algorithm + and - values to increase or decrease the "enthusiasm" (as Andrew coined :-)

I'd guess that the trouble here is although most people could draw an aesthetically pleasing beam for a given set
of notes, there may not be a simple algorithm to describe the line. (hmmm, maybe the line which minimises the sum of the absolute differences in stem length from standard stem length?)

Come to think of it, these code paths must be in the general vicinity of multiplets, so maybe while you're in there... ;-)

Reply 18 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Apr-2001

The change does NOT just affect note pairs. The change only affects beams with respect to notes that extend far above or far below the staff. ARe you, perhaps, expecting it to do other things?

Reply 19 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Apr-2001

I too didn't observe much change in behavior with multiple note beams. Just as an experiment, try this (on treble clef), an actual voicing of a Bb7 chord in my current project:

B (below the first leger line)
F
A
D

Beam them together. You get a nice slanted line. Now move the last note (D) up and down. Here are the results:

C or lower: straight line
D or E: slanted line
F or above: straight line

My preference would be a slanted line for any final note higher than A.

Reply 20 offered by: John Gillings on 12-Apr-2001

Thanks Fred, I hadn't found any combinations of 3 or 4 notes that gave me other than a straight (flat) beam. It looks like there's a threshold for the minimum length stem. Once it's reached, the beam falls back to flat line.

My preference is for the beam to follow the natural contour of the notes as closely as possible. Like I said, the algorithm to deal with all cases would be horrific, so I can well understand the NWC developers sticking with something fairly simple!

Reply 21 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 12-Apr-2001

I confirm what I thought before I tried it : I really *love* the feature #2. Before this improvement, I decided not to use any lyrics and add it by hand, but now it is really beautiful. Many many thanks.


#2033: Change of melody line.
Change of melody line.

(2033)

Submitted by: Paul Sherry on 06-Apr-2001

Is there any way I can indicate (other than text) when a melody line changes from one stave to another? For instance, with a dotted line?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Apr-2001

The program itself makes no distinction about which staff is considered to be the "melody line" of the song.

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 06-Apr-2001

But you may use a very convincing line found in BoxMarks font (see http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html)


#2034: Staff style
Staff style

(2034)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 06-Apr-2001

I will try to explain a problem that has nothing to do with spacing of notes. Please excuse my english again.

I often have a score with a 4 voices choir, and a piano accompagnement. As normal, I select « style orchestral » for the voices, and « upper/lower grand staff » for the piano.

The problem is that the appearance is wrong.

We should have a thin vertical line from staff 1 to staff 6, plus a thick vertical line from staff 1 to staff 4 (with oblique lines above staff 1 and below staff 4), plus a curly brace from staff 5 to staff 6.

The thin line and curly brace are OK, but the thick vertical line continues after staff 4 (up to staff 6), and there is no oblique line below staff 4 (neither below staff 6, anyway).

Could this be fixed in a future release ?

Many thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 15-Apr-2001

This looks like one of the only BUGS I have seen in NoteWorthy Composer. It seems as if any time you choose the orchestral option on any one staff, all the staves then have the thick vertical line. This bug was in NWC 1.55b (or what ever)as well.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 15-Apr-2001

Is this really a program bug? My understanding is that compound staves are derived from templates. Presumably, all that is required is an alternative template.

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 20-Apr-2001

I don't think there is whatever magic in templates. By the way, I believe that templates are just normal scores. The only thing that makes compound staves is the choice of a staff style (Edit Staff - F2).


#2035: New Dell Computers - SB Live! Platinum 5.1 (NOT)
New Dell Computers - SB Live! Platinum 5.1 (NOT)

(2035)

Submitted by: Jill on 07-Apr-2001

Just wanted to let people know that I spent 2 grand on a new Dell Pentium 4 system, "upgraded" from Dell's Santa Cruz soundcard (plain awful for General MIDI files, apparently it is not encoded for them) to a Soundblaster Live! Platinum 5.1 card, which my husband then tried to install for me. Turns out the brackets that Creative includes for this sound card are not compatible with Dell computers, they go the wrong direction for installation. We called both Creative and Dell and they both said there was nothing they could do about the incompatibility. Unless you can hold this soundcard up with tape inside a Dell Pentium computer, or create your own metal or plastic brackets to hold it up, you will not be able to install it.

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 07-Apr-2001

It just so happens that I live in Santa Cruz (CA), a well-known surfing location.

It has been my observation that many surfers repair dings to their surfboards using duct tape.

Perhaps there is some sort of cosmic relationship going on here?

Reply 2 offered by: Jill on 08-Apr-2001

Hahaha, maybe. Strange doings going on in CA these days. ;)


#2036: Drum X head font revisited
Drum X head font revisited

(2036)

Submitted by: FranMan <m53rd@yahoo.com> on 07-Apr-2001

What if some one with a font making program made an EXACT copy of the Noteworthy font (keep the name and the size of the notes the same) except for changing all the heads to X heads? Couldn't we then take the origional font out of the folder and put in this one for a drum staff? We could even replace the G clef with a drum clef such as []. Have we already tried this idea? I was just wondering....

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 07-Apr-2001

I have, in fact, tried it. It works. No problem.

If the phony-font is named NWCV15 (internally, not just the file name) and installed in place of the real thing, then you get X-head, or flying pigs, or whatever you put into the font. The catch is that the effect is global: You cannot have ordinary note heads on one staff, X-heads on another.

If the phony-font is named something else of 6 characters, such as BANGER, and if a hex editor is used to change "NWCV15" into "BANGER" for a particular NWC output file, then the file will use "BANGER" rather than "NWCV15" when it prints.

However, there is a catch: I would not be able to distribute such a font, not even to NWC users, unless I custom-draw the characters that are in common (for my own private use, that's not necessary). The reason is that the NWCV15 font is the intellectual property of you-know-who. A version that primarily copies the existing characters, with a few changes, would be a bad-boy product.

Musical symbols, as such, cannot be copyrighted as a typeface in the Unites States. But the computer data that draws the symbols, being a computer program, is subject to copyright. This applies to derivative works. But symbols re-drawn from scratch, even if in the same character locations, would be just fine. Again, this is in the United States. In some other countries, such as Germany, the look of a typeface can also be copyrighted, although I do not know if NWCV15 is unique enough for that.

It would certainly be a no-no to distribute a re-drawn font if it contained information that implied it was a product of Noteworthy Software.

The bottom line: If you happen to won a font editor program, and want to try changing the note-head shapes, or substituting a double-bar clef for the G clef, it will work.

Keep in mind that note stems are drawn in NWC to match the right or left note side, depending on stem direction. But you might not like the appearance with X-heads, if you want the stem to meet at the upper-right or lower-left corner. The workaround would be to displace the X characters, and remember to also displace the notes in NWC in the opposite direction. This is a big deal for a small problem.

The ultimate solution would be for Noteworthy Software, in a "version 2.0" release, to allow a staff-by-staff selection of notation font.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 07-Apr-2001

One other thing: Certain items in a NWC file are directly drawn, not from the font. This includes staffs and note stems, and a few others. So changing the font would not change ordinary NWC stems into custom squiggles, or change the staff into dashed lines, etc.

Reply 3 offered by: Marc on 07-Apr-2001

Greetings

I simply don't understand the problem then.

All the users who want to notate tracks with X heads will be satisfied if Noteworthy "ENDORSES" your font. I mean, they endorse all the other hings users have done. They "endorse" Noteworthy websites, user created utilities. Why can't they endorse the X head fonts? Then they won't have to create one themselves!

I just don't get it! LOL

Marc

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 07-Apr-2001

Yes, endorsing sounds good, but if NoteWorthy is not willing to do this, then can't we work with Robert Allgeyer's drum font? I don't know if it would be too much work, but it seems that you could put the charaters from his drum font in their correct positions and size them down to the correct size. You would then, of course, rename it to NWCV15.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 08-Apr-2001

Makes no difference to me. Here's my E-mail address.

But I would absolutely have to know what style of X to put. The three basic characters are the note-heads for whole notes, for half notes, and for quarter (and shorter) notes. presumably, a standard X will work for the last of these. But what about the others? Bigger X? Diamond? Solid?

Keep in mind that the way stems meet the note-heads is not adjustable by a font.

Also keep in mind everything I wrote above. If you want your music to have both standard and X-head notes, you will have to create separate files (one for each style) and put separate WMFs into a document, or something like that.

Although I'm not exhibiting the desired X-head font at this moment in time, there are a number of X-head characters in the "MusiSync" font, free at my web site

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849

and while you are there, be amazed by the "MusiTone" fonts.

I do this as a penance for my off-notes in the choir.

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 08-Apr-2001

I mentioned this in my first reply, but it bears repeating:

A font is recognized not by its filename, but by its internal name. The file name can be changed by anybody. But the internal name can only be changed with a font editor. This, I can do, but the average user can't.

So, it does not help to create a font internally called [whatever] with file name NWCV15 in order to "fool" your system. At best, it just won't work. At worst, you will confuse your system.

Incidentally, to see what I am talking about: Most of you have a font called "Symbol." That is both its file name and internal name. If you have a hex editor (free ones are available), take a WMF file exported from NWC (NOT the program!) and find and replace "NWCV15" with "Symbol." Then place the edited WMF into a word processing document. Presto! Except for drawn objects (staff, beams, stems) the notes and symbols have turned into Greek. :-)

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 10-Apr-2001

Here is "Banger":

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/misc/bangerfont.htm

Done de novo, not trampling on NWCV15.

Reply 8 offered by: FranMan on 10-Apr-2001

Thanks for banger, but I can't download it. I got to the site, but when I clicked the download button, everything worked find, but the downloader never was able to connect to the server. It just stayed there saying it was connecting to the server. I don't really need this font, but others might.

Reply 9 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 10-Apr-2001

Try disabling your download manager (I guess GetRight?) and let your browser do the job.

Reply 10 offered by: FranMan on 10-Apr-2001

It IS my browser that is doing the job, and a bad job its doing. I only worded it that way because a separate window comes up for downloading.

Reply 11 offered by: FranMan on 10-Apr-2001

The problem, according to Netscape, is that the file to download does not exist. Also, why do I need a hex editor when MS Dos Edit seems to do the job just fine?

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-Apr-2001

Opps, somehow the ZIP file was corrupted on the file server. I will re-upload Banger today when I get the chance.

As for the DOS editor, maybe it works-- but since I don't use it, I wouldn't know.

Incidentally, although I do not recommend it, if you make a backup of the NWC executable and edit NWCV15 to Banger, then the program will display and print X-head notes directly. Again, this is not recommended!

Reply 13 offered by: FranMan on 11-Apr-2001

I thought you could do that with NWC, but you're right it is _risky_ business

Reply 14 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-Jan-2002

For those of you who have used my "Banger" font to make x-head notes in a WMF exported from NWC: Another user has posted a comparable font on the Scriptorium. The methodology is virtually identical. However, his instructions are more accessible to the average user, since they do not require a hex editor. Therefore, the "Banger" font is obsolete. I will remove it in the near futire. Anyone who is already using it may continue to do so.

Since there is more than one message thread on this subject, I am posting this notice in duplicate.


#2037: WAV to Real Audio
WAV to Real Audio

(2037)

Submitted by: Marc Et Gardenne on 07-Apr-2001

Greetings composer fans

Tell me...
Does anybody know of a free WAV file to Real Audio file converter?
I you know of one or another solution to go WAV to Real Audio please hit me back a message.

Cheers
Marc

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Apr-2001

RealProducer Basic is free, and just might suit your needs.

Reply 2 offered by: Jill on 08-Apr-2001

I upgraded to the Plus version from the free basic version, because you can edit the Real Audio files with it, and do more creative things. But there are probably less expensive utilities out there that do the same thing. Real Producer Plus costs 149 dollars. Expensive for just straightforward converting for slow-speed modems.


#2038: NWC Web Service Pack 5
NWC Web Service Pack 5

(2038)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Apr-2001

We just released the following:

NoteWorthy Composer Service Pack 5

You no longer have to download multiple service packs in order to get up to date. There is now a single download that corresponds to whatever version 1.70 variant you have currently installed.

What's in Web Service Pack 5:
=================================
Fix: Lyric spacing is now fixed such that lyric syllables will not collide
---------------------------------
Fix: Key shortcut for tempo expression field in Tempo properties tab
---------------------------------

Reply 1 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 10-Apr-2001

Well, I've already installed service packs 1 - 4. Should I still install No. 5 in addition to the others?

Best wishes

Paul

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Apr-2001

You don't /have/ to, but would probably find the improvements (especially #1) significant enough to warrant installing. :)

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Apr-2001

We just released the following:

NoteWorthy Composer Service Pack 6

This service pack does exactly one new thing:

Improvement: A new option in Edit | Lyrics called "Align Syllable Using" which is used to control whether this lyric will be left aligned (the old way that NWC aligned lyrics) or will be centered/justified to the note using standard conventions.

As with all of the service packs, the NWC file format remains unchanged. Files created in SP6 can be read by other users that have any earlier version 1.70 release (although what they see and hear may vary from that which is seen in SP6).

Reply 4 offered by: Jean CIFRANE on 20-Apr-2001

A clarification please : If I download the full version, what do I obtain ? The original 1.70 version or a version updated with all the service packs ?

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Apr-2001

The only way to get a service pack is to download and install it.

Reply 6 offered by: Steve on 20-Apr-2001

I have successfully installed Service Packs 1-4
(32-bit version). I can't seem to get Pack 5 to
install, though. First, the installer can't find
the correct NWC folder (the other packs had no
problem). If I use the browser, the installer still
says there is a problem.

NWC works fine, otherwise. I just can't seem to
install the latest Service Packs. Any suggestions?

Reply 7 offered by: Joe Music on 20-Apr-2001

Can't suggest because I don't know your configuration. But rest assured that there is no problem with the installer itself -- it works just fine.

Even though you haven't changed the NWC folder name, did you make any change upstairs ( such as changing "Program Files" to "Programfiles")?

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Apr-2001

Steve: Service pack 5 was replaced by service pack 6 two days ago. At the time you write this message, service pack 5 is no longer available. What specifically are you trying to do?

Reply 9 offered by: Jean CIFRANE on 21-Apr-2001

From reply 5, I understand that the new comer has first to download NWC 1.70 then nwc32.60 to be up to date.
The problem is that (s)he may not be aware of the existence of service packs and that it is a waste of efforts.
A direct way to download the up to date version would be better !

Reply 10 offered by: Steve on 21-Apr-2001

This is in reply to Number 8. I just want all of the latest Service Packs installed.

I have now gone to Service Pack 7 with the same results. My latest version of NWC is 1.70 with Service Packs 1-4. I am choosing the Service Pack 5, and will choose 6 afterward, but can't get 5 to install. It says I have an incorrect version of the program.

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Apr-2001

Steve: I again do not understand what you are saying. If NWC Help | About says "Service Packs 1-4" then you should select the service pack download that matches this entry. The download table has a clear entry for this, which is nwc32-74. I assume this is what you are downloading.

Reply 12 offered by: Steve on 22-Apr-2001

Okay, here's what I'm doing:

1. I downloaded and succesfully installed the Service
Pack files up through 32-74.

2. I have downloaded 32-75 and 32-76.

3. I double-clicked on 32-75 to install it and the
program could't automatically find the folder where
NWC resides. (It did for 32-74.)

4. I typed in the program folder and click on Continue.
The installer said "Invalid Destination!" and listed
possible causes, none of which seem to be valid
(NWC not installed, program version doesn't match
targeted service pack, a virus problem).

Hope this helps.

Reply 13 offered by: Grant on 22-Apr-2001

Steve, if you successfully installed 32-75 you're done.

NWS's method of packaging service packs has changed. They're no longer incremental, they're cumulative. That is, every one of the service packs available on the download page is designed to get NWC up to the current patch level. 32-70 brings original 1.70 up to SP7; 32-71 brings 1.70 plus SP1 up to SP7, and so forth.

It's no wonder 32-76 complains: it's designed to bring 1.70 plus SP1-6 to SP7 level, but you're already at SP7 having installing 32-75.

Reply 14 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Apr-2001

Quote from service pack download page: "Once you download and install the program that matches your current version, you will be up-to-date (you only need to download the one program that matches your current version)."

Reply 15 offered by: Steve on 22-Apr-2001

Grant,

That's just the problem, I HAVEN'T been able to get
3.75 to install. Looking at my previous posts, do
you have any further advice?

Reply 16 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Apr-2001

Don't know if it would qualify as "advice," but what I'd do is:

1: Uninstall NWC using the CP add/remove programs applet.

2: Reinstall NWC V1.70.

3: Apply the nwc32-76.exe patch.

If /that/ didn't work, I'd start poking around in the registry... and very possibly break the thing so bad I'd have to /completely/ start over... but that's just me. :-)

Reply 17 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Apr-2001

What is 3.75?

Reply 18 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Apr-2001

I wrote:

3: Apply the nwc32-76.exe patch.

... er.. that should be nwc32-70.exe.

Reply 19 offered by: Grant on 23-Apr-2001

Steve, in reply #12 you state:

"I downloaded and succesfully installed the Service Pack files up through 32-74."

My point was that if you've installed the 32-74 file, you're done. I suggest that before you do anything else (unless it's already too late), you start up NWC and look at Help|About. I'm guessing it already says you have service packs 1-7, in which case you're as up-to-date as it's possible to be.

Reply 20 offered by: Steve on 24-Apr-2001

Grant,

Right you are! The "About" shows Service Packs 1-7.
I could have sworn it only said 1-4 last time I
looked (which was AFTER loading 32-74). Oh well,
"All's well that ends well." Thanks for your patience.


#2039: Spacing problem
Spacing problem

(2039)

Submitted by: Olivier Miakinen on 10-Apr-2001

I'm not a good scores "reader", but most musicians that I know, which can read music and execute it instantaneously, have big problems with some scores that I print using NoteWorthy Composer.

Here is the problem, explained with one bar on two staves
(in 4/4):
- 1st staff: four 8th notes followed by two quarter notes.
- 2nd staff: almost the same, but the first two 8th are replaced by one dotted 8th followed by two 32ths.

The problem is that the space which follows each 32th note is the same that the space which follows most 8th note, and nearly the same than the space which follows the quarter notes.

The even bigger problem is on the first staff: now, the space which follows the second 8th is *much bigger* than the space which follows the quarter notes on the same bar. For accustomed readers, this is a real pain because they think that there is a quarter rest between the second and the third 8th notes.

Please note that checking or unchecking the option "increase note spacing for longer durations" doesn't help at all.

Please help me !

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 12-Apr-2001

Je vois votre problème. Faites un troisième personnel qui est caché contenant toutes les
trentes-deuxième notes. Faites-les remplir la mesure. Ceci force les huitième notes pour être
espacé même aussi bien que les notes quartes parce qu'elles sont espacées selon combien
de pièce toutes les trentes-deuxième notes prennent sous chaque note. Bonne chance et si
vous avez besoin de plus de E-mail d'aide au lien ci-dessus. Ce message a été traduit à
Dictionary.com

English
I see your problem. Make a third staff that is hidden containing all 32nd notes. Make them fill up the measure. This forces the eighth notes to be spaced evenly as well as the quarter notes because they are spaced according to how much room all the 32nd notes take up under each note. Good luck and if you need more help e-mail at the above link. This message was translated at Dictionary.com

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 13-Apr-2001

Thank you for your response. I will try it tonight, but I trust that it will work. Why didn't I think to that before?

Thank you also for the « french » translation which is very funny for some words. Automatic translation is an inexhaustible source of joy. I hope my manual translations into an approximate english are also for you a source of joy!

Reply 3 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 20-Apr-2001

Thank you again, FranMan. I doesn't work exactly as you said (with a completely hidden staff), by it works with a layered staff containing hidden notes or rests. Also, sometimes adding space before a note may help.

Anyway, it works now.


#2040: lyrics with diacriticals
lyrics with diacriticals

(2040)

Submitted by: Stephen R. on 11-Apr-2001

With experience, I am learning more and more about NWC. And since I recently figured out how to compose texts in Slavonic on my word processor, I have also been able to do lyrics in Slavonic. NWC handles these better, in fact, than MW Word (Word does not recognize one letter in my Slavonic font, and will not display or print it, while NWC has no trouble with it). But I cannot get NWC to do lyrics in Slovak or Latvian, although these should be a lot easier than Slavonic. I do the lyrics in Word; they do not require a special font as Slavonic does, because it is only a matter of the Latin alphabet with some diacritical marks, and the diacriticals are available with a number of the standard fonts used in Word. However, NWC does not recognize most of the diacriticals and will not display or print them. Does anyone have a solution?

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-Apr-2001

This has been discussed before, in the context of Cyrillic.

NWC is fully capable of inserting whatever you want into the text editor -- even dingbats, as well as upper-code characters (including the ones with diacritical marks).

If your word processor constructs accented characters from components, by using multiple keystrokes, then maybe that won't transfer into NWC (it wouldn't transfer into Notepad, either). But it you choose pre-drawn accented characters directly from the character map, using the clipboard, it works just fine.

Many fonts code the accented characters in a way that the standard Windows character map does not handle well. I recommend that you find a free alternative. "Character Map Pro" is a widely-distributed freebie that allows you to choose whether you are working in the Latin, Greek, Turkish, or whatever character subsets. I know this one works with NWC, at least for Cyrillic and dingbats, as I have used it.

At one point, I had put up a web page showing the technique, but I took it down. Trust me, NWC can handle non-Latin characters.

Also, in NWC Page Setup, on the Fonts selection page, notice that in the lower right corner there is the ability to choose which kind of character set you are working with.

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen R. on 12-Apr-2001

Well, I'm sorry to report that this is just not working for me. As I reported, it does fine with Cyrillic, and not just Russian etc. but Slavonic, which is much more problematic. But when I switch to Slovak or Latvian it does not work. I compose the text in MS Word, using Times New Roman or other standard font. I insert the letters with diacriticals either by switching the keyboard to the lanuguage in question, or by entering them from the standard Word character map--it makes no difference which. I put the text on Clipboard. I test it in Word; the Clipboard is doing fine, and duplicates the text with all the necessary signs. I go to NWC, open a line of lyrics, press Control-V, and I get the text minus most of the diacriticals. It is exactly the same procedure I use successfully with Slavonic.

As for Page Setup > Fonts, I assume you mean the box that appears at the bottom if I click on options. This gives me a choice of "Western" or "Hebrew"--no "East European" or "Baltic," which is what I presumably would want. But then there is no Cyrillic either, and yet I can enter a lyric in Slavonic with no problem.

Stephen Reynolds

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Apr-2001

You can enter lyrics in Word first, but you cannot expect Word formatting to carry over into NWC. An NWC lyric is plain ASCII text. Text created in MS-Word may not appear the same when converted to plain ASCII text. The general rule of thumb is all of the following must be true:

- the font is true-type
- you can select the font in the Window's Character Map program (not the one in Word)
- you can see and copy the character from the Character Map to the clipboard
- the character key code is less than 256
- the character key code does not clash with the underscore, space, hyphen, and CR/LF used in the lyric editor

If all of this is true, you can use the font characters in an NWC lyric and expect it to work.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 12-Apr-2001

>> "The character's key code is less than 256."

Good point, Noteworthy.

A font may contain more than 256 positions (0-255). But only codes 0-255 can be used, unless you have the special capability to use 2-byte characters (Asian fonts).

What happens is that some software will go to the characters numbered above 255, then shuffle them down to the lower range when you specify that you are using a non-latin character set. But this does not work the same way for all programs.

For some fonts, the necessary non-latin characters appear in codes between 129 and 255, in place of the accented latin characters that would be used in (say) French or German. In such a case, there is no need for the software to re-code.

Good example: When ASCII was invented, the Euro currency character did not exist. It actually sits in code location 700-something, I believe. Meanwhile, code 128 is unused. Modern software such as MS-Word can look for a character called "Euro" and re-position it to code 128.

Your best solution would be to find (if possible) a font that used the characters you want, in the ASCII code positions. Failing that, if you have a font editor, you can make a custom code page in which you transfer characters from the non-ASCII positions into the code locations occupied by latin characters that you don't need.

I haven't had a problem with fonts because (a) My language needs are not complex, and (b) When I do need access to non-latin characters, or dingbats, the font in question has coded them into ASCII positions.

Reply 5 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 13-Apr-2001

This is a deviation from the original subject, and from NoteWorthy, but I can't let say that the position 128 is normal for modern softwares.

Modern softwares should be able to communicate through internet with other modern softwares. For that, there exist a number of standardized code pages, defined by ISO. Most of those code pages share some characteristics:
- codes 0 to 127 are identical to ASCII (note that ASCII does not define anything above 127);
- codes 0 to 31 and 128 to 159 are reserved for control characters.

The most commonly used standard is ISO-8859-1, which is often mistakenly called "extended ascii", and which contains almost all characters used in english, french, german, and some other occidental languages, but not the "oe" or "OE" diacritics, neither the upper case "ÿ" (that's why I can't show you these characters in this message). Also they don't contain the Euro symbol.

The *bad* solution chosen by Microsoft was to define these characters (at least Euro, oe and OE, but not uml-Y) in the reserved control zone 128-159. This solution is bad because non-microsoft softwares follow the standard which forbids using this zone.

The *good* solution chosen by ISO was to define a new code page, ISO-8859-15, which is identical to ISO-8859-1, but for the Euro in place of the currency symbol 164 (¤) and the oe, OE and uml-Y in place of other rare characters (I beleive they are the ¼, ½ and ¾ characters at positions 188, 189 and 190).

Actually, the *very good* solution will be to allow 16-bits unicode characters in internet transfers, but it will require some time before all is formalized and implementations follow.

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 13-Apr-2001

Poor Stephen -- all he wanted was to put some Slavonic into NWC lyrics, and we gave him an arcane discussion about font coding! Mea culpa.

Stephen: What font are you using? (That is, trying to use.)

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 13-Apr-2001

These facts are very important. Since the lyrics are being composed in Word before moving them to NWC, it is essential that the technical details be understood, so the end result can be controlled.

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 14-Apr-2001

Thanks for the replies. And don't apologize for the "arcane discussion"; I appreciate knowing why it doesn't work.

Usually I just go with Times New Roman, the default font in MS Word. I have tried with several other fonts that display the necessary characters, always with the same results. How do I access the Windows character map, as opposed to the Word character map? It seems a bit nutty that one would work and the other not, but I guess that what happens when you needn't worry about competition. MS seems to like bad solutions to problems.

Stephen Reynolds

Reply 9 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 14-Apr-2001

my correct e-mail address is the one above--I saw the error too late!

Stephen Reynolds

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Apr-2001

The Windows character map is called charmap.exe and is in the /Windows directory. You can make a shortcut to it on your desktop, in a desktop folder, or in the Start menu.

It's a little clunky to use if you employ the mouse to copy the characters to the clipboard, but it's a good reference for the ALT keyboard codes. Ones you use commonly you will soon remember, or you can make a little cheat-sheet of the ones you employ routinely.

Reply 11 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 14-Apr-2001

Believe it or not, I didn't even know that MS Word had its own character map (I have always used the Windows Character Map, or a freeware alternative).

This point was made above, but it is essential: MS Word, and some other programs, will under some conditions construct accented characters by superposing an accent with an otherwise-unaccented character. The finished character is not a single entry in the character map. Thus, it is not represented by a single byte, and cannot be used in NWC or many other programs.

I have a hieroglyphic font. It can be used in any program, including NWC. As a prank, I took one hymn where I was having trouble singing my part, and re-printed a clone in NWC. But in place of latin lyrics, I used hieroglyphics. When the choir member who stands next to me complained (as usual), I told him that I was having difficulty understanding my part, and showed him my music.

Reply 12 offered by: Stephen R. on 16-Apr-2001

Thanks, all! I spent several hours making a list of the numbers assigned to letters in Times New Roman, TNR Baltic, TNR Central European, and TNR Turkish. When this is finished, it should cover anything I will need in NWC in Latin-alphabet lyrics. That is, if I learn to use it properly. I see that the same number may be assigned to different characters in these fonts, for example to a vowel with a macron in the Baltic font and to the same vowel with a circumflex in the others. It seems like a poor procedure, but there is is. I also now have some of the freeware to control fonts and the keyboard, but I have not yet figured out what to do with it. I'll let you know when I can get a lyric in Slovak or Latvian into NWC--or if I need more help!

Stephen R.

Reply 13 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 16-Apr-2001

This is the right place to ask.

I myself don't have the time to do it, BUT if you know someone with a font editor, or have one yourself (they are not cheap), there is always the following solution: Create a font (or modify one) so that the characters you need are pre-constructed with a variety of diacritical marks. This may not be a difficult operation; presumably, most of your needs are of already-existing characters joined to already-existing diacriticals. It is a matter of cut-and-paste withing the editor.

It doesn't matter what you call the characters, as long as you can pick them from the character map, and as long as there aren't too many of them. Caution: Some code locations are reserved for control characters. Since not all control caharacters are activated in many applications or operating systems, it is common to "sneak" characters into otherwise-inactive control locations. Someone who knows how to use a font editor would also know about this.

Reply 14 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 16-Apr-2001

Stephen,

Does the "Script" property do your work? (Disabled in wsp3, restored with wsp4)

There are some available Scripts as Cyrillic or Middle European.

Reply 15 offered by: Stephen Reynolds on 17-Apr-2001

Dear Ertugrul,

Tell me about the script property. I have no idea whether is a solution to the present problem; how do I access it? I am now compiling a list of the numbers assigned to each relevant character in the Windows (not Word) character map, and I will experiment with this when I have finished. I do wish they would get the Unicode standard in operation in e-mail; then I could even write your name properly!

Stephen R.

Reply 16 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Apr-2001

When you "modify" a font at File > Page Setup > Fonts, you can access the "Script" pull-down list (on the fonts dialogue box), which includes the following character sets:

Western (Default), Hebrew, Arabic, Greek, Turkish, Balticanan, Central European, Cyrillic.

Note that not every font has a script property. (Times New Roman does.)

PS: If you installed wsp3 and haven't upgraded to 4 and 5, the Script property will be unavailable.

Hth

Reply 17 offered by: FranMan on 18-Apr-2001

Make sure that the script is the same in both word and NWC.


#2041: Setup Program
Setup Program

(2041)

Submitted by: FranMan on 11-Apr-2001

I want to give a copy of NWC to a friend, but my name is, of course, in the setup program frome the CD. Is there any way to get rid of it without having to download a new copy?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Apr-2001

You can copy the shareware NWC setup program on the CD to a diskette. However, other areas of the CD contents are protected by copyright, and are only available via purchase.

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 11-Apr-2001

Yes I know that, that is why I want to get my name out of the shareware setup program. I am not trying to do anything illegal that is why I registered in the first place.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Apr-2001

The shareware program itself does not contain your name. The only reason it "knows" your name (such as when you do a re-install on any given computer) is because it remembers it from when you originally registered it on that computer.

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 12-Apr-2001

Do it WON'T show up on my friend's computer?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Apr-2001

No. It's just as if he had downloaded it from the net. Which, come to think of it, might be an easier option for both of you; no need to copy files onto floppy, etc. Just give him the URL, and off he goes.


#2042: Drums in NWC
Drums in NWC

(2042)

Submitted by: FranMan on 11-Apr-2001

Just in case you did not see message msg #2036 , you can now do drums with NWC. THIS INFORMATION IS ENTIRELY THE WORK OF ROBERT ALLEGEYER. There are two ways of using drums in NWC, but first you have to download his font by clicking here and then install it. Now you have two options

1) Make a drum composition as if you did not notice that the heads were round instead of Xed. Then make a WMF image out of this music. If you have your "Old Dos and Windows Files" still installed on your computer, you can then open the start menu, click run and in the box type edit. Once in editor, navigate your way to the file and open it -- IN BINARY MODE. The line width can be anything, but if you type 9999 then the editor will only allow write over things not add. If you do add something, the file will not work. So now that you have your file up, then use the find command to find NWCV15. Press the insert button on your keyboard. The cursor will become a block. Move it to the "N" in NWCV15. Type 'Banger' (without the qotes). Once opened, the notes will have X heads.

2)You can make a copy of NWC to do drums. You can follow the steps described above except You are dealing with the program copy not a WMF. Now when you open "NoteWorthy Drummer" you will only get X headed notes.

The alto or C clef is the clef with the Drum sign which was drawn in the font as || . If you do not have MS dos editor, then you need a hex editor.

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 11-Apr-2001

Sounds like manuscript would be quicker ;)

Congrats on all the hard work, if I used NWC for percussion music I would definately use this method.
-j

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 11-Apr-2001

I have already done option number to and, if it is legal will send it to anyone who wants or I will post it on the web.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 12-Apr-2001

Thanks for the endorsement!

Actually, my own editing method (using a free hex editor) is a no-brainer. The technique is surprisingly easy. Instrutions come with the font.

However, even though I am not in the business of enforcing NWC's rights, I discourage anyone from distributing a knock-off of their program edited to call my "Banger" font rather than NWCV15. I am quite sure that this is a no-no, and it runs the risk of being intermingled with the real thing by accident.

At least in the U.S., it is "fair use" for a registered user to hex-edit his or her own copy to use my font, without residstribution. (That is not a legal opinion, just my own.)

For those of you who really want some X-head notation, try it.

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 14-Apr-2001

For you weekend warriors, I re-posted this message. The "Banger" font is still there.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-Jan-2002

For those of you who have used my "Banger" font to make x-head notes in a WMF exported from NWC: Another user has posted a comparable font on the Scriptorium. The methodology is virtually identical. However, his instructions are more accessible to the average user, since they do not require a hex editor. Therefore, the "Banger" font is obsolete. I will remove it in the near futire. Anyone who is already using it may continue to do so.

Since there is more than one message thread on this subject, I am posting this notice in duplicate.


#2043: Web Service Release Packs
Web Service Release Packs

(2043)

Submitted by: FranMan on 11-Apr-2001

It seems to me that most of the Web Service Release Packs could pass as new versions of NWC. Number five would then be the real Web Service Release Pack but, if NWC does not want to get to version 2.0 then that's fine with me.

Reply 1 offered by: Robin Withey on 12-Apr-2001

The only trouble with this policy is, we'll be expecting something REALLY special for release 2.0! (Not that NWC 1.x isn't special, of course!)

Robin

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 12-Apr-2001

FranMan has a point. Potential new users of NWC might see all those service packs, and come to the erroneous conclusion that NWC is buggy and needs lots of fixes.

The reality is that NWC is one of the least buggy programs I own of any description, and the "service packs" often contain upgrades.

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 12-Apr-2001

Yes, and I felt it semi-hard to explain in my read me to my friend that you had to install NWC1.7 and then the service packs.

Reply 4 offered by: sdp on 12-Apr-2001

Heres an idea,
Why not call them "Enhancement Packs" so it sounds alot better to the new users.


#2044: file conversion
file conversion

(2044)

Submitted by: Wizard on 12-Apr-2001

Is there a way to change mp3 files, to allow songs to be worked on in NWC (key change, instrumentation, etc.)? Can change to wave file, but not to midi, which NWC needs to see, in order to open file in program. Any and all information would be appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Apr-2001

This goes back to the old wave-to-midi question, which has been beat to death on this forum many times.

I heard a good analogy: you can easily make a cake out of milk, eggs, and sugar, but it's rather tough to make milk, eggs and sugar out of a cake.

If transposition is the sole object, there are a number of wave editors that will do the job. CoolEdit by Syntrillium can do this, as can several other programs. A similar operation, changing tempo without affecting pitch, can be accomplished using the freeware program Expander V1.2 by TOTH Laszlo and is available for download at Expander Hompage.

Reply 2 offered by: Jill on 13-Apr-2001

The few WAV to MIDI programs I've seen and tried were laughable, a total joke. I image an MP3 to MIDI program would be the same. One wanted 89 dollars, said it supported polyphonic conversion. So I followed the directions exactly as stated, it even had me tapping out the beat through the whole song, then I opened the result in Noteworthy. Only two staves of music were shown, no melody line, and the bass and alto parts did not remotely resemble the music in the WAV file. I quickly uninstalled their trial version and had my good laugh for the day. :)

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 14-Apr-2001

However, the following might be interesting ...

Presumably, a MIDI file would be a lot smaller even than MP3. If the application were not to publish sheet music, but merely to compress a sound, then it might be useful to do this:

Have the program make a profile of the sounds obtainable from MIDI via the user's sound card. Then, analyze the WAV in terms of MIDI components that "best fit" synthesize the sound. The resulting MIDI file, when played through the same kind of sound card, out to give a credible rendering (he says optimistically). But the MIDI, transcribed into printable notes, might have no resemblance to the original score.

An application for this might be in sending background music (that does not need to be accurate) over the Internet, using the smalles possible file size, without needing to compose directly in MIDI.

Reply 4 offered by: Wizard on 14-Apr-2001

Thanks people, for the replies; but, it seems as though I have more searching to do...I like the analogy about the cake...makes the problem I am facing, quite clear!


#2045: Composer <--> Sibelius file conversion?
Composer <--> Sibelius file conversion?

(2045)

Submitted by: Steve on 13-Apr-2001

Please:

Is there any way to convert .NWC files to the
.SIB format or .SIB files to the .NWC format?

If not, aside from the less-than-satisfactory option of
using a MIDI-file as an intermediate step, is there
any OTHER file format that both Composer and Sibelius
can import and export?

Is this a problem worth anybody's effort?

Thanks! :-)

Steve

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 13-Apr-2001

Clarification question: are you also talking about import and export of lyrics? If so, I suspect NWC may be a bit unique as to its mode of "holding" lyrics, and that particular item may not convert or be carried over through conversion (although it may certainly be possible to copy paste into the Finale lyric box).

Reply 2 offered by: Steve on 13-Apr-2001

Copy and paste of lyrics would present no great problem.
If that were the only incompatibility, I'd be "as
happy as a clam". ;-)

Lyrical questions aside, is it possible in any way to convert most of the other parts of scores, in either direction, between .SIB and .NWC files?

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Eidson on 16-Apr-2001

I'm not sure of any way to directly convert the files... any time I want a Sibelius file from a Noteworthy file, I just print the score and input again. It's usually faster going to Sibelius because I have already written what I want either in an original composition or arrangement.
Sorry I couldn't help
-joe

Reply 4 offered by: Martin Segerstråle on 23-Apr-2001

As a Sibelius user and a former NWC user (though I still use it on some occasions, since it has got features Sibelius hasn't got), I think this would be very practical. Somebody could write a conversion program. Sibelius is able to import Finale scores, for example. Why wouldn't it be possible for NWC to import scores then? I really hope the NWC staff could think about this.

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Music on 23-Apr-2001

Unless there is a big need for that conversion, I doubt that it would be a productive use of NWC's effort. Those of you who have observed the difficulties converting from one common word processing application to another, know what I mean.

In fact, the current NWC format is not the same as that of version 1.55. Keeping up with format changes is always a difficulty.

Someone suggested NIFF, but I don't know whether that is really an emerging standard or not.

Reply 6 offered by: Leland McKenzie on 20-May-2001

In response to Martin in Reply 4,

I use finale for my compositions here at school, but my friend in Chicago uses Sibelius. I've tried to have him look at some of my scores, but he can never get Sibelius to open them properly. This goes for choral and instrumental both. How are you able to do this? It'd help the both of us out greatly.

Reply 7 offered by: Joe Music on 21-May-2001

If I understand the above reply correctly, it underscores my prior comment that file format conversions are often less than expected.

Generally, it is only possible to "convert" from one format to another if the underlying file contains the same information, and if both programs are capable of handling that kind of information. Otherwise, there will be information loss (at best).

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-May-2001

Actually, one of Sibelius' biggest marketing ploys is that it is /supposed to/ be able to open Finale files, much as for instance MS Word and Corel WP are /supposed to/ be able to open each others' file formats... and it's commonly known that such conversions are not always successful, and are usually quite version-dependant.

Leland - you might have a look to see which version of Finale you have, and if the version of Sibelius your friend has does indeed support files from this version. If it says it should, it might be worth a trip to Sibelius support. (Now whether you get an answer is another matter.)


#2046: Lines in lyrics for sustained notes
Lines in lyrics for sustained notes

(2046)

Submitted by: FranMan <m53rd@yahoo.com> on 15-Apr-2001

Scince the underscore is used to put more than one even under one note, is there any way left for me to put a line after a word when there is a tied note such as.___________

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 15-Apr-2001

Use the underscore (or dash) as TEXT rather than lyrics. Be sure to look at the result in Print Preview.

Text and lyrics can be intermingled using the same font, or different fonts.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Apr-2001

The underscore character itself can't be used, but there are a couple other available characters that might be useful:

ellipsis - ALT 0133
horiz. line - ALT 0151

There's also a another horizontal line character (shorter than the horiz. line ALT 0151) at ALT 0150.

Check out your options using charmap.exe.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 16-Apr-2001

Fred's long and short horizontal lines are known as "em dash" and "en dash." His suggestions is better than my original method of using text.

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 16-Apr-2001

But Fred's suggestions give you lines in the middle of the line. I want something at the bottom. (___ not ---) The elipses are somewhat helpful.

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 16-Apr-2001

A longer way:

Make a layered staff. Decrease its lyric offset (make the lyrics line outer) so that its top is aligned to the original ones down. Use ¯ (Alt + 0175) where necessary.

Just an idea... :~|

Reply 6 offered by: FranMan on 17-Apr-2001

I thought of making a layered staff, but because I have only one staff, I would then have a vertical line at the start of every system which should not be there.

Reply 7 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Apr-2001

Hmmm... If only we could control the beginning of the staff as we can do with the end...


#2047: auditing bar lines
auditing bar lines

(2047)

Submitted by: Althea on 16-Apr-2001

The piece I'm notating has an anacrusis/pick up notes in front. I've been to http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/faq2.htm#auditpck and followed the instructions but just couldn't get it right. How do I put in an anacrusis for one instrument and an empty space for the others?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 16-Apr-2001

Best bet: Place a rest (or rests) in the staffs that don't have the pickup notes. Then, hide the rests (highlight the rests, right-click, Properties, hidden).

If you ever "audit bar lines" then the program may reposition your meausres, without pickup. To avoid this problem, either (1) Don't audit the bar lines, or (2) Insert hidden rests before your pickup notes.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Apr-2001

Insert | Bar Line (Decorated) | Style = Double

Use this kind of bar after your pickup note, audit bar lines, then restore a plain bar line.

Reply 3 offered by: Robin Withey on 17-Apr-2001

Does this mean that audit bar lines only works as far as the last double bar line? That is something I wasn't aware of (unless it's in the user manual and I haven't looked). Does this work for other auditing tools as well? Frequently I have wanted to audit (for example) beams, but only in a section of the score. It would be nice (and logical) if these audit tools only worked on the selected section of score, if there was a selection.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Apr-2001

No. What this means is that "Audit Bar Lines" will NOT change the position of decorated bar lines. You can take advantage of this to force it not to move a bar line in certain places.

Reply 5 offered by: Robin Withey on 18-Apr-2001

Oh well, let's take a trip to the wish list!


#2048: OT: Request; some effects or sounds
OT: Request; some effects or sounds

(2048)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 18-Apr-2001

I urgently need the following sounds to use in a background music I've been preparing for a poetry matinet:

* wind
* train
* rain (stormy)
* doorslam/door creak/door open-shut
* steps, walking on wooden floor

Due to the high necessity, any help -either direct supplement or online resource post, yet even some search recommendations- will gratefully be appreciated.

Regards,
Ertugrul

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 18-Apr-2001

Try Program (Patch) 57 on Channel 10 in some of your soundfonts.
You may find sound effects there on each of the percussion notes.

It works with the 8 mb Chaos SF.


#2049: Printing problem
Printing problem

(2049)

Submitted by: Gerald Schjelderup on 18-Apr-2001

Although my music is written properly when I come to print it, the first measure is stretched out all way across the page. After that it prints normal. It appears normal where I have created it but it also is stretched out for the first measure when I go to print preview. Any help?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Apr-2001

A picture is worth a thousand words in these cases. If you send a sample to me along with a reference to this thread, I will see if you are doing anything that does not conform to NWC conventions, and reply back in this thread.

You might also have a look at these past threads, which might be relevant to what you are experiencing:

msg #1410, msg #1635, msg #1855

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Apr-2001

As it turns out, this is an easy one. You are working with a MIDI file. After you import the file into NWC, any edits you make should be saved to an *.nwc file, where they will be retained. In the case of your file, the printing situation is caused by the tempo track staff that appears last. You have two choices for removing this staff:

1 - Go to File | Page Setup | Contents and uncheck this staff

2 - Copy the tempo change to the top staff, then use Staff | Delete Staff to remove the empty tempo track staff

Your print effort will not go much better.


#2050: Eastern Tone System (Was: Microtones)
Eastern Tone System (Was: Microtones)

(2050)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 18-Apr-2001

This is the first section (without particular order) of my promised article. Don't hesitate to express comments.

Regards.
--------

NOTES ON EASTERN TONE SYSTEM
----------------------------

I - FORMATION OF THE TONE SCALE by SUPERCEEDING FIFTHS:

This is a well-known and widely used practice; Pythagorean Method. It was also known and supported in Eastern theory. Now, we’re going to form a scale on D (Yegâh) going by perfect fifths. We will not "invent" the pitches; that’s we’ll presume the existance of 17 intervals per octave and try to find their "place" within this system.

Our way is rather simple. We will progress upward and downward (upward with perfect fourths; inversion of perfect fifths) and try to intersect both directions so that we will have a closed system, a circle.

By fifths, we get the following pitches:

D, A, E, B, F#, C#, G#, D#, A#

And the following ones by fourths:

D, G, C, F, Bb, Eb, Ab, Db, Gb

Now, we all know that the cycle of fifths is never closed (the initial pitch can never be obtained) unless any kind of 'tempering' is applied. At this point, we will interfere in the system and do a couple of little tricks;

First, we will progress the A# to Gb, that’s we will define the Gb as the fifth of A#. (Remember we’re not working in 12tet so that for instance C# is NOT Db. In this circumstance, A# is rather higher than Bb and Gb is lower than F#.) Thus, we have reached the same note, Gb, in both ways. Now, we’ll have a look at their intervallic rations and frequencies (relative to D = 220 Hz.) and explore if they are or can be treated as the same pitch.

We have progressed 9 steps by fifths and 8 steps by fourths to reach the Gb. Let’s formulize both of them:

Fifths	-> (3/2)^9 = ~34.44; divided by octaves => ~1.20
Fourths	-> (4/3)^8 = ~10.00; divided by octaves => ~1.25

220 * ~1.20 = ~264.3 Hz; F + 721 pitch bend
220 * ~1.25 = ~274.7 Hz; F# - 640 pitch bend

You can get the result of these intervallic rations in sequencers as Noteworthy Composer. There is a slight audible difference in the frequencies of our two Gb notes (2735 pb), not much wider than the equally tempered quartertone (2048 pb). This gives us another feature of Eastern tone system: Pitches are not fixed to a single frequency; instead, they are sounded flexibly within a range of frequencies not wider than a quartertone. The two frequencies we have obtained give us the minimum and maximum limits of the Gb (Evc); neutral third of D (Yegâh), in Pythagorean method.

Thus, we have resulted our progression in 17 pitches, moreover, closed our system to a circle:

D, Eb, D#, E, F, Gb, F#, G, Ab, G#, A, Bb, A#, B, C, Db, C#

We will continue our survey further on Eastern tone system.

Ertugrul Inanç,
http://ertugrulinanc.8m.com
!link(ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com=mailto:ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com)

-------
Credits:

Yalçin Tura, who has clarified and explained the system in his book, “Türk Mûsikísinin Mes’eleleri”

Fred Nachbaur, author of “Harmonic Analyser”, a freeware yet powerful software that calculates the pitch bending and cent deviation values for a given interval (harmonic ration).

Reply 1 offered by: Jeremy Ewen on 18-Apr-2001

Before we go any further with this interesting subject, could you please tell me what 12tet means?

Thanks,

Jeremy

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 18-Apr-2001

12tet = 12 tone, equal temperament. The twelve tones are evenly spaced, this is the "temperament" system that midi uses. It's also what fretted instruments such as guitars are pretty much limited to. Its main "feature" is that all keys sound relatively the same, and it's more-or-less what we've become accustomed to especially in pop music. As compared to the harmonic series, the fifth in 12tet is off by just a smidge, but is pretty close. However, the major third and perfect fourth deviate more from the pythagorean "ideal".

12tet is not to be confused with "well" temperaments, which in fact give each key a unique tonality while minimising intervals that sound "bad."

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 23-Apr-2001

Fred

I don't normally query your wise words but I think the error for perfect 4ths and 5ths is identical at .113%. Did you mean minor thirds or sixths?

And also I thought that Bach's 'Well Tempered Clavier' was written to show equal temperament, but I'm pepared to be educated!

Peter

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Apr-2001

Peter, yes you're right. P4 and P5 are both "off" by the same amount, about 2 cents, albeit in opposite directions. Also true that m6 shows the greatest deviation, about 16 cents, with tritone not far behind at about 12 cents, and m2, M7 around 10 cents (all values relative to 12tet).

The idea that Bach's "Well-tempered" refers to 12tet is, as far as I've gleaned, a common but erroneous interpretation. While it's true that 12tet will sound the same in any key, it also loses any key-based nuances. The "Well" tempers (Kirnberger and Werckmeister to name but two) are euphonious in any key (as Bach set out to demonstrate in WTC) while still retaining a unique tonality for every key.

(Shameless plug department): I've just published a suite of three pieces (an electric guitar concerto) that uses a well temperament, should anyone be inclined to have a listen. It's at my ampcast site for free download. And no, I don't have a well-tempered guitar. But my computer does. :-)

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 23-Apr-2001

Since a 5th plus a 4th add up to an 8ve, it would seem that an adjustment in the size of one would require a corresponding (but opposing) adjustment in the size of the other. Of course, this adjustment, whatever its size, would be a larger proportion of a 4th than it would be of a 5th, since a 4th is a smaller interval to start with. Would this be noticeable? I doubt it.

In any event, Fred is correct about Bach's 48. The clavier in question wasn't equal-tempered.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 23-Apr-2001

Actually the mechanism for 'adding' intervals is multiplicative, not additive in terms of frequency. So a fifth plus a fourth is claculated as (3/2)*(4/3) = 2 as one would expect.

Looking at frequencies, the error for the fourth is smaller than the error for the fifth exactly in the proportion of their actual frequencies, and therefore the errors are identical (error/frequency is the same in both cases)

Peter

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 23-Apr-2001

True if you're speaking of frequencies, but this isn't the only way to look at it. You can also speak in terms of cents, and in these terms any given interval is in fact larger in proportion to a 4th (500 cents) than to a 5th (700 cents).

Reply 8 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 23-Apr-2001

My only "instrument" is voice. Without a fixed-pitch instrumental accompaniment (such as piano or organ, voices in harmony can tune to each other. Thus, an /a capella/ choir can attain a "more perfect" fifth than a tempered instrument.

Does this apply in non-Western song as well?

Reply 9 offered by: Peter Edwards on 24-Apr-2001

But we're not talking about intervals, we are discussing how much a particular note differs in equal temperamnent from it's theoretical pitch. The root has nothing to do with it (apart from defining the pitch series).

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Apr-2001

We could easily get into long, drawn-out discussions on this subject (it's certainly happened on rec.music.theory and other groups) while missing out on the practical aspect.
There are, as I see it, two basic reasons why you'd want to experiment with temperaments: the first is for reasons of authenticity for rendering musics from specific times and ethnicity. I believe this forms the basis for Ertugrul's original post on this thread.

The second is to give a whole new bag of tools for new music. Try out some temperaments, and decide for yourself whether they're useful to you. For instance, you might find as I do that the "well" tempers can give a nice silky feel to your music. OTOH, some of the just intonation temperaments sound decidedly "wonky". So, I keep that in mind in case I ever write a piece where I /want/ that particular wonkiness! :)

Reply 11 offered by: Grant on 24-Apr-2001

Peter, I think your reply #9 is addressed to me, but if it is I'm confused. You wrote (in reply 3) "the error for perfect 4ths and 5ths is identical at .113%". You also wrote (in reply 6) "the error for the fourth is smaller than the error for the fifth exactly in the proportion of their actual frequencies".

Now you say "we're not discussing intervals". In what sense can this be true?

Reply 12 offered by: Peter Edwards on 24-Apr-2001

Grant

I was using the expression perfect fourth to indicate a particular pitch a perfect fourth above a tonic (or root) note. You are of course correct in asserting (Msg #5) that the error compared to this interval is greater because the interval is smaller but I don't believe that this comparison means anything since the tonic may or may not be present for the comparison to be made.

Peter

Reply 13 offered by: Grant on 24-Apr-2001

As far as I'm aware, *all* discussions of tuning systems are based on the quality of the intervals produced, not the position of any particular note relative to some abstract standard. If you do any reading in this area you'll see what I mean.

If I take an equal-tempered piano and lower every pitch by 50 cents, I still have an equal-tempered piano. This is because it's not the individual pitches that are important, but the relationships (read: intervals) between them.

Reply 14 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 24-Apr-2001

Typo in the article:

Fifths -> (3/2)^9 = ~38.44; divided by octaves => ~1.20; NOT ~34.44.

(Thanks to Kemal KARAOSMANOGLU)

Ertugrul

Reply 15 offered by: Peter Edwards on 25-Apr-2001

Grant,

I'm not going to get involved in an interminable discussion on this. And there is no need for you to be dismissive and insulting - I have done considerable reading on the matter including Helmholtz's massive tome.

I respect your knowledge and thought in many fields but we all have weaknesses and mathematical matters are obviously not included in your strong points. You frequently point out errors in other submissions - please be man enough to accept the return compliment when you raise red herrings as in msg #5, and deliberately mistate what I have said, as in msg #13. Life is too short.

Peter

Reply 16 offered by: Grant on 25-Apr-2001

Peter,

Of course we don't have to continue this forever (nor do I have any such intention), but I do think a couple of things should be cleared up.

First, your accusation that I've deliberately misstated what you've said is in some sense a compliment, since if I've done any misstatement it was entirely unintentional.

Second, I don't think there's any call for you to be questinging my mathematical competence. I fully understand that musical intervals are determined by vibration ratios, and that adding intervals physically involves multiplying these ratios. However, although tuning is physically accomplished by adjusting vibration rates in conformance with these rules, I would assert that the human *experience* of intervals is better described by the cents system. This is based on the observation that all intervals of a given size (i.e., ratio) are subjectively identical, and moreover that the process of combining two intervals is subjectively an additive process. The human brain experiences a rise of, say, a semitone as the same phenomenon regardless of the actual change in cycles per second - and it experiences a whole tone as twice the size of a semitone.

Given that Fred's original comment about 12tet vs. the harmonic series explicitly referred to the "sound" of the various intervals, I thought I was on fairly firm ground in couching my comments in terms of the additive cents system, which, as I said, I believe conforms best to how sounds and intervals are actually experienced.

As to the "red herring" in reply #5, I don't see it. My first statement exactly echoes an observation by Fred in the previous reply (which hadn't been posted when I wrote mine). The second asserts that the discrepancy (in cents) is a larger proportion of a 4th than of a 5th, which you yourself in reply #12 agreed is true. The problem must be that you object to its relevance, which may be the crux of the matter. You seem to be asserting that you can discuss a tuning system without regard to the sound of the intervals it produces. I don't see how else to interpret your statements that (1) "I was using the expression perfect fourth to indicate a particular pitch a perfect fourth above a tonic (or root) note" and (2) "I don't believe that this comparison [between different tunings of the same interval] means anything since the tonic may or may not be present." Are you saying that it is meaningful to compare, say, the G of equal-tempered C major with the G of Pythagorean C major abstractly, without regard to the intervals these notes make with the other notes of their respective scales? If not, then I apologize for misstating your view (though not intentionally) and would appreciate a clarification. If so, then I must disagree. In my opinion the only meaningful musical comparison between these notes must involve the listener's subjective reaction to them, which in turn must be based on their relations with the other notes of the scale, above all the tonic.

Finally, I apologize for the comment about "do[ing] any reading in this area". This was written out of frustration at our inability to agree on terms. It was uncalled-for and I withdraw it.

- Grant

Reply 17 offered by: Peter Edwards on 26-Apr-2001

Well here's my final 2 cents worth.

1. Apology accepted, and I was wrong to question your mathematical ability.

2. I don't disagree about measuring errors and intervals in cents if that is more meaningful. After all cents are just frequency ratios expressed in terms of 1200*Log2.

3. The thread (started by Ertugrul) is about approximating one theoretical note to another. This assumes a tonic frequency from which notes at other intervals are calculated. The error comparison between the target frequency and the trial frequency is meaningfully expressed as a ratio (or an interval) of those two frequencies, and that error calculation is independent of the tonic frequency. Furthermore it remains constant for a note at that interval from any tonic, regardless of the original tonic frequency chosen.

4. Your IMHO 'Red Herring'. You feel that the error calculation can be extended to include a comparison with the tonic. I don't believe this is meaningful since it gives different error values for the 4th and the 11th. However if you compare the subdominant error a fifth below the tonic with the dominant error a fifth above then the errors are equal, which is what I said all along.

Peter

Reply 18 offered by: grant on 26-Apr-2001

Peter,

About 4ths and 11ths: your right, this is exactly the point at which my earlier comments are vulnerable. I only wish you'd made your objection to this clearer at the time; much typing, offense and apology might have been saved.

The question I was raising, only as an aside, was how the ear & brain make their decisions about whether, and by how much, one tuning of a note or interval differs from another. On reflection I think a number of things go into this, but probably not any sense of the discrepancy as a proportion of the total interval. (And even when I was entertaining this notion, I at least had the foresight to speculate that it was negligible.)

There are a couple of places in your latest replay, by the way, where you state things with which I agree as though you thought I wouldn't agree with them. I would go through these in detail but I really think it's time to put this one to bed.

Grant

Reply 19 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 27-Apr-2001

Guys,

Following your valuable discussion is a pleasure but can't we stay a little on topic? I mean don't [any of] you really have anything to discuss on the main subject, that is Eastern Tone Sytem?

Best Regards.

Reply 20 offered by: Grant on 27-Apr-2001

Point taken, Ertugrul, but you're too late. I think we were already done.

Reply 21 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Apr-2001

Yes, I do have a point of confusion... you said,

>First, we will progress the A# to Gb, that’s we will define the Gb as the fifth of A#.

I'm sorry, I don't see how that works. "Normally" the fifth of A# would be E#. Did I miss something?

Reply 22 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 29-Apr-2001

No, you didn't. It's still E#. Just that I installed Gb as E#. :)

If you continue downward the article, you'll get the solution. There is a slight audible difference (in frequencies) with E# and Gb (which is far lower than F#) so that we can assume them as lower and higher limits of a certain 'pitch area'.

I have a drawn sheme of the situation and I'll try to get it into Cyberia someway.

Regards.

Reply 23 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Apr-2001

Ah, yes! Now it makes sense. I agree, a diagram would really help.

Reply 24 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-May-2001

I am currently reading a history of the Balkans. It says that at the Congress of Berlin (ca. 1877) entertainment was provided by an orchestra that played music appropriate to the various nations present (France, Britain, Russia, Austria-Hungary, Germany, and I'm not sure who else, maybe Italy). The Ottoman Empire was there, but the musicians did not want to deal with the Turkish tone system, so instead played "Rondo a la Turk" and another piece of Western music with a supposedly Turkish theme. The Ottomans were severely insulted by this.


#2051: Adding Percussion into my compositions, what #?
Adding Percussion into my compositions, what #?

(2051)

Submitted by: Sarah on 18-Apr-2001

Hi everyone, I know that this question was asked before, but I need a specific answer. How do you manage to get that list of percussion instruments like on the sample? I go to my line of music, highlight it and right click, and then I choose midi control and then instrument patch, on the general midi list, i don't notice anything that resembles what I'm looking for. If I pick another category from the list, will it be compatible on other computers?

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Apr-2001

You don't have to select any of your music, in fact you don't even have to have any music on your staff yet. All you have to do is assign channel 10 to your percussion staff.

Staff --> Properties (or just press F2)
Midi tab
Channel - use the scroll arrows to select "10".

That's all there is to it. And yes, AFAIK all General Midi synths will interpret channel 10 as the percussion track, including GS and XG extensions.

Reply 2 offered by: Yves Grasset on 19-Apr-2001

> And yes, AFAIK all General Midi synths will interpret channel 10 as the percussion track

Some (usually old) synths have the percussions on channel 16. But I've never met one of those in the real life. ;)

Yves

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Apr-2001

The days of percussion on channel 16 have, by and large, long since faded into the past. As I recall, the original multimedia standards included two channel configurations, one of which supported percussion on channel 16. This was back in the days when computers generally did not come with multimedia capabilities (c. 1992), but add-on kits could be bought that included the CD-ROM, soundcard, and speaker combination. These kits usually came with an FM based synthesizer that only supported a few MIDI channels. The percussion sounds were usually generated by the same FM synthesis techniques, which made for some ugly sounding drum parts.

Channel 16 would seem a more logicial choice, except channel 10 gained momentum in a period where low cost MIDI boxes rarely supported more than one channel at a time. We still have a Roland MT-32 external MIDI box from the 80s. Perhaps this is the device that is responsible for the percussion on channel 10 precedent that exists today.

Reply 4 offered by: Robin Withey on 20-Apr-2001

My keyboard still has percussion on channel 16. It's a Yamaha PSS 780, and it's about 12 years old. Needless to say, I only use it for entering music - I use the PC sound card for playing the music.

Reply 5 offered by: Ivan Rojas on 06-May-2001

Hi Sarah, maybe because this is so obvious, nobody has added it, but just in case you or somenone else have/has the same problem I had: once you set the midi channel to 10, you can change the percussion instrument by changing the pitch of the note.


#2052: Please listen all the capabilities of NoteWorthy
Please listen all the capabilities of NoteWorthy

(2052)

Submitted by: Jorge Valverde on 18-Apr-2001

In this file you can Listen all the capabilities of NoteWorthy it can make you travel around your mind and dreams......Please Listen it:

www.vadu.com/nwc

Find

Jorge Valverde and

Suite No.1 "The Haunted House" - a magical trip-

or www.jorgevalverde.8m.com/comp.htm

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 23-Apr-2001

Folks, this composition is really good. Give it a listen!

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 23-Apr-2001

I've bookmarked Jorge's site and will give his works a listen. His piano concerti have been lying at the Scr. but I wish he submitted others, too.

Regards.


#2053: Transposing from Eb major to Db major
Transposing from Eb major to Db major

(2053)

Submitted by: Nigel Horne on 19-Apr-2001

When I try to automatically transpose from Eb major down a tone to Db, NWC forces the new key to be C# major. Can I force it to Db major?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 19-Apr-2001

Manually change the key to Db then Transpose Staff 0 (zero) semitones.

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Horne on 19-Apr-2001

I'll give it a go, though you'd have thought that transposing by 0 semitones would (by definition) do nothing.

Reply 3 offered by: Robin Withey on 19-Apr-2001

Ah well, it's a bit cleverer than that - it also does an audit of accidentals, apparently.

However, it doesn't quite do enough, IMHO. I had a problem the other day with a piece that changed from C major to C minor temporarily, although the key signature in the score didn't change. Of course, this meant there were a lot of accidental flats about, except that NWC would have treated them as sharps (when entering from MIDI keyboard). There's no way to tell it to treat accidentals as flats by default - you have to either enter the notes manually (which is a pain), or enter them as naturals and then edit them (which is impossible if you want to change one note in a chord).

What I ended up doing was actually changing the key to C minor. To make it look right as well as sound right, I needed to force accidentals just for that section, then change the key to C major, then audit accidentals without changing flats to sharps. That's two wishes, Eric! The first one, to apply audits just to a section, is already in the list. I haven't tried it, but I assume that if I audit accidentals in a section of score in the key of C, flats will be converted to sharps. Wish two is about to appear in the list!

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 19-Apr-2001

An Enharmonic Flip tool that worked on selected notes would be a big asset. Particularly in minor keys.
D minor always attracts a Db instead of C# because the key signature has flats!

Reply 5 offered by: Nigel Horne on 20-Apr-2001

That didn't work. Using a piece in Eb major enter the tonic minor chord, bass clef, Eb, Eb, Gb.
Now transpose down 2 semitones, not updating playback. Manually change the key from C# major to Db major. Transpose 0 semitones. You now have C, F, Enat. This is wrong. The bottom two notes are now a semitone too low, and the top note is enharmonically (is there such a word?) wrong. It should read Db, Ab, Fb. I could live with manually changing all the Enaturals to Fb, but having to manually change the C to Db and G to Ab is wrong.

Reply 6 offered by: Yves Grasset on 20-Apr-2001

That's because the accidentals of the C-sharp and F-sharp are implied. If you change the key signature from sharps to flats, the C-sharp becomes a C-natural. To avoid that, use "Tools | Force Accidentals" to show all the accidentals, and then change the key signature and transpose 0 semitones.

Note that you'll still get an E-natural, even if you respell it as F-flat. So transpose 0 semitones first and respell then.

HTH,

Yves

Reply 7 offered by: Barry Graham on 21-Apr-2001

Ooops - (blush)

Forgot to mention the Force Accidentals step (sorry Nigel)!

Just as well Yves picked up on that.

But the Fb = E problem highlights the need for some form on Enharmonic flip tool - this problem occurs so often on the leading note accidental in minor keys that this really requires a fix.
NoteWorthy has Minor key signatures selectable when adding a key sig - perhaps transposition should be by key rather than by step.
ie Transpose Ebm to Cm to trap those accidental problems.

That wishing well gets deeper every day.
I don't even hear the splash with the ones I've dropped in.

Reply 8 offered by: Nigel Horne on 21-Apr-2001

I just tried the same as the method I mentioned in step 5, except that before starting I enabled "force accidentals". It didn't help - I still end up with the wrong chord.

Reply 9 offered by: Yves Grasset on 23-Apr-2001

Perhaps you haven't forced the accidentals at the right moment. Since NWC seems to automatically audit the accidentals after a transposition, the procedure is:

1.Do the "real" transposition (-2 semitones)
2.Force the accidentals
3.Change the key signature
4.Do the enharmonic transposition (0 semitones)

This way it should work, except for the F-flat.

HTH,

Yves

PS: I guess that the chord you mentionned should be E-flat, _B-flat_ (not E-flat once again) and G-flat. ;)

Reply 10 offered by: Grant on 23-Apr-2001

It should work, *including* the F-flat. The fact that NWC leaves you with an E-natural instead of F-flat in a tonic minor triad in the key of D-flat, IMHO, a bug.

Reply 11 offered by: Yves Grasset on 23-Apr-2001

We agree. I was trying to explain what NWC was probably going to do, not what it should do. Would it be clearer with a comma after "This way"?

Yves

Reply 12 offered by: Grant on 23-Apr-2001

No, that wouldn't make any difference.

I'll admit that the first time I read your post, I thought you said "This is the way it should work . . ." On re-reading, I realized this wasn't so, but I still wanted to make my point about the oddness of the E-natural.

What this really shows is that there's ambiguity in English between two different meanings of "should", one of them expressing moderately strong expectation ("He should be here by 2:00.") and one of them expressing a belief about correctness or rightness ("You should say 'Thank you.'").

Reply 13 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Apr-2001

>The fact that NWC leaves you with an E-natural instead
>of F-flat in a tonic minor triad in the key of D-flat,
>IMHO, a bug.

We agree. As we said before, we acknowledge this as a bug (the triad should be preserved). However, the fix is non-trivial, so it will not appear before the next major release.

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 24-Apr-2001

Thanks. I knew this topic had surfaced on the Newsgroup, but I didn't remember whether you'd expressed an opinion on whether it was actually a bug. It's nice to know this will be addressed at some point.

Reply 15 offered by: Graham Howe on 24-Apr-2001

I read the foregoing discussion with some interest; the issue of E natural/Fb should not arise, as Db major doesn't have Fb (except perhaps as an accidental).

Reply 16 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Apr-2001

The thread resolved into a discussion of transposing the tonic minor chord in Eb to Db.
That's how the Fb appeared.

Reply 17 offered by: Nigel Horne on 25-Apr-2001

That worked fine thanks! Hurray!

As said the Fb's came out as E naturals, but there's only a few of those at the start of the piece before I move from the Dorian Mode into the Major Mode so as I pointed out I can live with that. Excellent, pity I had to do each line one at a time. It'd be nice to mark all the staves (sadly Ctrl-A has been taken by something else) and run the operation once.

Reply 18 offered by: John Paul Tate, III on 28-Apr-2001

NON TRIVIAL!?

>We agree. As we said before, we acknowledge this as a bug
>(the triad should be preserved). However, the fix is non-
>trivial, so it will not appear before the next major
>release.

Why does NoteWorthy Online say that any transposing problem is non-trivial? Do you not realise, first of all, that this is one of the larger discussion topics open now? To me that says that it is a greater problem than NoteWorthy thinks.

Suppose you have Beethoven Leonore overture for which you decide to transpose C Clarinets to the more standard Bb. No, this does not cover the E-natural/F-flat bug - that alone is non-trivial. You have to realise, though, that this bug is not restrained to the E-natural/F-flat transposition. The entire transposing process is a gigantic flop! It is way too much work for a sequencer to simply change the key of a part, much more for an entire piece (as I was getting to earlier.)

Forgive my forwardness, but I do a fair deal of transposing and don't understand why NoteWorthy hasn't changed their approach. Whenever one is to laboriously hand imput a piece (however large), *if it is to be printed*, it will take them to great pains getting everything just so. Reminder accidentals, FLATS in a SHARP key (or vice versa), or anything enharmonic are essential to readability and ease of harmonization. All is well until you TRANSPOSE a part (or piece). All of the above is lost as soon as you make the transposition.

Any way to fix this? Go thru each part and check it against the original to make sure similar enharmonics. Laborious. Tedious. Once you have finished a piece then realise something must be transposed - well, if some of y'all have done it, you know what I mean. All the notes must measure to each other by the same interval size as before.

NoteWorthy Composer shoud try this approach automatically for ALL transposing:

1. Transposing should be by interval or by key rather than by "semitones". Since technically G-flat down two semitones is E-natural, how does the software know you don't want an F-flat? It has no idea.

2. Move entire staff together by the specified transposing interval. First move notes up by basic interval size (ie. minor 6th would be up six steps), then use key sig. or accidentals to change specific interval size (ie. C to Ab is minor 6th. - up six steps and add 4 flats). Accidentals would take care of any notes not properly sized by key signature. This would preserve interval relationship in all cases if done properly.

Since transposing by key in relation to the previous key is just by interval, they would logically work the same way. (Maybe it would be better to transpose by interval since it dosen't necessarily know what key you are in to start with. That I like - freedom to use whatever key sig. with any key.)

If Noteworthy would add a simple search/replace feature, we could get very clean transpositions done in shorter amounts of time. It would also be nice to be able to transpose/change/edit (etc) more than one staff at once.

JP

Reply 19 offered by: Joy Byford on 28-Apr-2001

In response to post 18, while I agree with your analysis of the problems, I think you have misunderstood what NoteWorthy Online meant by the 'non trivial' comment.

When a programmer describes a fix to a problem as non-trivial, he means it would be difficult to implement - usually more difficult than a user would expect. It is not meant in the way that you seem to have understood it, namely that the problem is not sufficiently important to be worth dealing with.

I hope this might clarify the terminology.

Reply 20 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 28-Apr-2001

I, for one, although not a programmer, understood NW's reply the way it was intended.

Reply 21 offered by: Stephen Randall on 30-Apr-2001

Those still interested may like to look up the NG thread: "Mary's Lamb and her Bear ..." where We had a bit of topic drift! One strand of the thread was updated to "Improved transpositon (was Mary's Lamb ...etc)"

There are some suggestions there on how NWC could improve its transposition algorithm to get the spelling after transposition nearly always right.

Regarding the triviality or otherwise of implementing such an algorithm, I'm sure there are contributors to the Forum who are much better qualified than I am to comment.

Stephen

Reply 22 offered by: Eric Lucas on 28-Nov-2001

I would like to see one fix that I think *would* be trivial to implement, to address the sharps-in-a-flat-key problem without me having to pore through the entire score. In this particular case, I read in a MIDI file that had a lot of A#s, and decided to change the key to F. When I was done, all the C#s had been changed to Db, and the F#s to Gb. If that's my choice, I would prefer to leave it in the key of C and read all the A#s, which isn't good either.

I would like to have Noteworthy allow me to set my preferred default spelling for each of the 12 notes in the scale. If this fix were implemented, I could simply go to a dialog box, and tell it that I want all C#/Db's spelled as C#, and likewise for F#/Gb's. Same is true for things like Bb, Eb in keys like G.

Another possibility is to provide a tool that only audits in-key accidentals. In other words, if you change the key to F, it would only audit A#s to Bbs, and leave all other accidentals alone.

Yet another way is to provide a "smart accidental audit", which would audit in-key accidentals to the key spelling, and out-of-key accidentals to their "most common" spelling, using the order of key signatures as a measure of "most common", so the defaults would be F#, Bb, C#, Eb, with ambiguity in the case of G#/Ab being resolved by the key signature. This could be dovetailed with the user-configurable default spelling, as well.

Sorry if this is a repeat of a previous comment. It appears there is a lot of discussion on this general issue, but haven't seen these specific solutions yet.

Reply 23 offered by: DAvid Palmquist on 28-Nov-2001

Going back to the first question in this thread, I thought it might work to transpose UP 10 semitones, than highlight the entire stave, and move it down pressing the ctrl-down keys 7 times.

So I went to try it, and first tried to emulate the problem. Clef, time signature and key signature Eb major, and entered a half-note Eb major scale. I then transposed -2, and lo and behold, I did not get C# major, I got Db major.

I then looked a little more closely at the menu that pops down when you select tools-transpose, and found it gives you three choices for key signature preferences.

So, I think those wonderful people at Noteworthy have solved the problem. Which version were you running? I have 1.70 with Web Update 10.


#2054: Help with my Roland XP-80!
Help with my Roland XP-80!

(2054)

Submitted by: Casey Jefferson on 19-Apr-2001

alright....i've connected everything nicely to the computer, but i noticed something....while i open any midi software, and i played, but suddenly the sound changed automatically! (it will keep on changing, when i stop, it stop, and i play again, sometimes for a couple note, it change again...) what happened? this keep annoying me all the time.....i can't record a song with the sound keep changing......

my computer is pentium 233 MMX, with a sb vibra 128 sound card, is there anything to do with the sound card? or any other reason? anyone experienced? PLEASE HELP!!!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Apr-2001

If you aren't changing ANYTHING else each time you play, but you still get varying results, you probably have a hardware device conflict/problem, faulty cable, or a mis-behaving driver. You have to test each item before you know for sure.

It is also not clear which part of your system is giving you trouble. I have not heard of a SoundBlaster Vibra, and there is no mention of such a thing on the SoundBlaster site.

If you are having trouble with the XP-80, you might need to refer to its user manual, as well as validate that it is operating correctly.

If you are using NoteWorthy Composer, it would also help to describe exactly what is happening in NWC, rather than just referring to "any midi software" when describing the problem.

See also: msg #896 (reply 5), msg #1461, msg #1856, msg #558, msg #1102, msg #1837

Reply 2 offered by: Stephen Randall on 20-Apr-2001

Noteworthy Online Wrote:

... "I have not heard of a SoundBlaster Vibra, and there is no mention of such a thing on the SoundBlaster site."

FYI: The SB Vibra 128 is a cut down version of the PCI 128 sold (I think) only outside the US. AFAIK the main difference to the PCI 128 is lack of 4 speaker support.

When I moved to Windows ME, my Vibra 128 gave a few problems at first - system hangs and crashes, but no specifically MIDI problems. A replacement driver available on SB's Asia web site sorted everything out and it all works fine now. Having lurked around the SB PCI 128 newsgroup for a while, I do not recall any midi problems being reported. I therefore suspect that Casey's problem is more likely to be specific to that particular hardware - faulty cable? faulty XP-80? faulty motherboard?, noisy power supply? ...??

Stephen

Reply 3 offered by: Casey Jefferson on 23-Apr-2001

alright....i've tried it out on my brother's computer, PIII 450, with SB Live value.....but i got the same result....anyway, i'll explain my problem:

ok, i have a midi cable, 15 pin at one end, the other end is midi out and midi in, i've connected the 'midi in' to keyboard's 'midi out', 'midii out' to keyboard's 'midi in'.

i've install NoteWorthy Composer, and also a cakewalk 8.0, even with my brother's computer with the SB live's software (keyboard function in the audio HQ)

no matter which software i use, with a proper setting, the computer will result the same thing when i play on the keyboard, which is while i look at my keyboard's screen, the sound keep changing, from piano to violin, piccolo and so on...sometimes it even don't respond a sound or just hold the note.

well......that's all i think.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Apr-2001

Well, you obviously have a fault somewhere. Since it happens on multiple computers, you know its not the computer.

Are you sure you have the cables connected properly (out and in labels on MIDI equipment are not always consistent)? What happens when you play from the PC out to the keyboard?

Reply 5 offered by: Casey Jefferson on 23-Apr-2001

oh ya! when the computer send data out to my keyboard, it'll be no problem at all! everything play nicely! i think the problem is the cable, maybe i go and check it out with other cable.

by the way....thanks.

Reply 6 offered by: Pezhman on 05-Nov-2001

I have same problem with my SB vibra 128 right now.
I have upgrade my windows from 98 to XP and I've been catched the problem!

Reply 7 offered by: Ajay on 02-Dec-2001

Well, I upgraded my OS from 98 to XP and downloaded the upgraded driver from Creative's site. I faced problems similar to Jefferson. Now XP does not accept the driver and I am wondering wether to Roll back to 98 or change my sound card. If anybody has a solution to this, I would be grateful if you let me know


#2055: Service Pack 7 Announcement
Service Pack 7 Announcement

(2055)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Apr-2001

We just released the following:

NoteWorthy Composer Service Pack 7

This service pack adds:

1. Improvement: Bar lines properties can now be changed for an entire selection, making group removal of forced system breaks much easier

2. Fix: Spacing problems when using the new Standard Rules for lyric alignment to notes

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Apr-2001

A new edition of the browser plug-in that incorporates these new capabilities has also been released:

NoteWorthy Composer Browser Plug-in

The browser plug-in is now at version 1.70.3. This update incorporates the new alignment and formatting capabilities found in NoteWorthy Composer 1.70 + Web Service Packs 1-7.

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 21-Apr-2001

Service Pack 7? Did I miss SP6?

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 21-Apr-2001

Sorry, I didn't see it in the message about sp5

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 21-Apr-2001

OKAY, here's a real problem. I just noticed that my time clock is now screwed up. It starts out at zero then jumps to the final time then to something like 30 seconds then back to the final time and so on. I don't know if the problem is in sp6 or 7 because I installed both at the same time. The total time is fine it is just the play clock. Any help?

Reply 5 offered by: FranMan on 21-Apr-2001

Sorry, must have been my crazy computer....


#2057: Clarification on Updates
Clarification on Updates

(2057)

Submitted by: Greg Walsh on 23-Apr-2001

Major problems with these updates. I have 1.70 with service packs 1 through 5 installed and working nicely. I downloaded Service pack nwc32-75.exe which should be Service pack 6. When I try to install that SP,it states it is Service pack 7 and updates the program to state that the service pack 1-7 is there. NWC32-76.exe which should be Service Pack 7 also states that it is Service pack 7 and then fails to update due to "Noteworthy Composer in not already installed" or "Your existing version does not match the version targeted by the service pack"

Hope this helps. From the look at the messages in this forum. Many are having problems with these updates as well.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Apr-2001

If you have up to Service Pack 5 and wish to upgrade to 7, you need nwc32-75. The numbers mean the following:

32 - for 32-bit Windows, i.e. Win9x
7 - this is an upgrade to service level "7"
5 - this upgrade is to be applied to a system presently at level 5.

In other words, having installed nwc32-75, you're already at upgrade level 7. You can always check this in Help --> About.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 24-Apr-2001

At the risk of redundancy, let me quote what it says on the Service Pack download page:

"Once you download and install the program that matches your current version, you will be up-to-date (you only need to download the one program that matches your current version)."

This means that it's not true that "Service pack nwc32-75.exe . . . should be Service pack 6". Running *any* of these programs, including 32-75, will leave you at Service Pack level 7.

<flame on>
Here speaks a computer programmer: enormous amounts of trouble could be saved if people would read the directions before trying to run the software, or, failing that, at least before complaining when the software doesn't appear to work.
<flame off>

Reply 3 offered by: Steve on 24-Apr-2001

Greg,

Grant speaks from experience (helping ME!). Check
out the NWC Web Service Pack 5 thread for details
on what to do to cure this problem.

Reply 4 offered by: Robin Withey on 25-Apr-2001

Of course, the Solution here is to have the same program irrespective of which version you are upgrading from, and for the upgrade program to check which version you currently have.

Is there a patch generation program that will do this? Seems like a sensible thing to do.

Reply 5 offered by: Greg on 25-Apr-2001

Thanks everyone. I think we can close this thread now. Fred explained the numbering system within the file name and now it makes sense to me. Robins suggestion sounds good but I think that it would make for a much larger file. But I'm not the one that writes the programs, so my comments in that area are only worth 1/2 a cent.

Thanks again

Greg

Reply 6 offered by: Grimblefritz on 26-Apr-2001

Grant

Just my thoughts on the "if users would just read the docs" (paraphrased) comment.

[opinion on]

Here speaks an IT professional who must deal with things from not only the perspective of the programmer but also the end user.

Often what makes complete and perfect sense to the programmer from their technical perspective, is complete and total gibberish from the user's perspective. Of the two, users win unless there is a compelling technical reason they should not, for as we know users are the sole justification for a (paid) programmer's existance.

Therefore, as users are conditioned to the application of service packs in sequential order, meaning that SP1 must be installed before SP2 which must be installed before SP3, and as common thought would support the sequential application of updates that are sequentially enumerated, and as this was the established methodology for prior service packs released for NWC, it was a poor decision relative to the end user to change the service packs to the current scheme. Though there may have been compelling technical reasons to do so, there is no compelling reason from the user's perspective. The only possible justification for the end user is a potential reduction of the aggregate download size in that not every service pack is required to update from SPx to SPy; however, as many users will tend to download every service pack as it becomes available, even this justification is of dubious value.

On the other hand, the "one service pack fits all" approach as stated by Robin would have been an acceptable solution. It simplifies the question for the end user as to which service pack to download. Instead of downloading seven and installing in sequence, download and install one. Instead of having to determine current revision level and relating that to which service pack to download, download and install one. From an aggregate size perspective, for a user who has not updated since the original 1.70 release, the all-in-one approach is likely no larger than the current approach, and a far better deal than downloading seven individual service packs. (Check the size difference between the 32-70 and 32-76 SPs, it is not substantial.) For the faithful updater who remains current with each service pack, there would probably be a penalty.

There is yet another position that would greatly alleviate the problem of aggregate size. Many patching systems carry more weight in the patching program itself than in the patch data. In the case of NWC, there is also the burden of the flashy setup program that wraps the patch. Were the patching program either embedded in NWC itself (preferred from an end user's perspective), or distributed as a separate executable, then the service packs would contain nothing but the patch data. This would help in both the sequential and all-in-one service pack models.

I used to program for a living, and still do write quite a bit of code, and know from experience at several levels that just because something makes technical sense or is possible to do, does not mean that it is the best or even appropriate thing to do to the end user. I also know that most programmers are not able to make that distinction as they are often blinded by the technology. For example, just yesterday I came across a web site that has a very cool menu system -- from a technical standpoint. Very slick, does lots of neat stuff. But it was confusing to the point of being unusable. I called a half-dozen people into my office, from secretary to developer, and all agreed that it was horrible and they would never get past the home page. Here's the topper -- the page had been given a couple of design excellence awards by a few programming groups! No doubt these were for the technology itself and not the usability.

The current NWC service pack scheme is not quite that bad, but IMO it is leaning that direction.

[opinion off]

;-)

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Apr-2001

I suspect that NoteWorthy Software's approach to updates is evolving, as is every other aspect of their software. I found that the sequential approach was getting unwieldy, admittedly because I'm personally something of an experimenter; for instance, I uninstalled/reinstalled NWC several times trying to help chase down an icon display oddity that someone pointed out on the newsgroup; the sequential patches were a bit cumbersome.

Also, the earlier patches were rather "busy", involving several Winzip pop-up windows, whereas the later ones have a more standard-looking BSOI (Blue Screen Of Install). Switching to the parallel approach was definitely an improvement IMO, but I agree that a "one patch fits all" approach would be best. Especially since the patches essentially only appear to replace the main executable (and sometimes the help file); a "universal" patch would basically just have to check the executable and/or help file against a table of valid checksums (CRC's?) for the various upgrade levels.

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 26-Apr-2001

Grimblefritz -

Thanks for the thoughtful comments. I agree that the current NWC patching scheme is not optimal (what is?), and would add in particular that the patch kits behave rather badly when users try to apply the wrong patch. It would have been a lot clearer to all involved if they had merely said something like "This patch kit is designed to upgrade NWC from version <x> to version <y>, but cannot find an installed copy of NWC version <x>." Or, perhaps even better, "... but the installed version of NWC is already at version <y>." Maybe the tool used to create the patch kit executables wasn't capable of this.

In any event, programmers need to be aware that there is a general disinclination to read the instructions. It could have been predicted that changing procedures in midstream would cause problems for users who have applied patches in the past and expect the process to continue working the same way. NWS did do some things that might have alerted the attentive user that something had changed: the contents of the tables were different, as was the naming convention for the downloaded files. Probably a more obvious warning should have been posted in large type at the top of the download page.

Therefore, it's hard to fault a user who wasn't paying close attention for trying to do things the same old way. However, once a user has encountered a problem applying the patch, his or her first step should be (IMHO) to go back to the download page to see if anything about the patch procedures might have changed. It is at this point, if not sooner, that the user would encounter the sentence I quoted above. I've gone over this sentence several times and I must say that although you speak of "gibberish", it seems perfectly clear to me. The least one should get out of it is the idea that if you're trying to download more than one file, you're doing something wrong.

- Grant

Reply 9 offered by: Robert on 06-May-2001

I suppose I oughn't to mention that I had problems loading NWC32sp2.exe, when in reality I was trying to load NWP32sp2.exe then?
Robert


#2058: Searching Forum (Archives Included)
Searching Forum (Archives Included)

(2058)

Submitted by: Calvin Mitchell on 24-Apr-2001

PLEASE tell me there's a way to search the Forum and its archives!!!!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Apr-2001

Yeah, it's on the New Post page (the one you used to post this message).

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Apr-2001

You can also go offline, and search the offline copy much more completely. If you have the 1.70 CD, a slightly older offline copy is also available there.

Reply 3 offered by: Jean CIFRANE on 24-Apr-2001

I pressed the button to add my reply but there is nothing to search on the "Reply Form" I received!

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 24-Apr-2001

Jean, it's not the "new reply" page, it's the "New Post" page. If you follow the "site map" link at the top of this page, select "forum", and then select "new message", you'll see the search field in the section of the page labeled "Before submitting your message:"

At the moment, the URL for this page is http://www.ntworthy.com/cgi-local/nwui.cgi?form=nwcforum


#2059: Remove a tempo notation
Remove a tempo notation

(2059)

Submitted by: David Todd on 25-Apr-2001

I figured out how to add and edit tempo notations, but I can't see how to remove one (without removing a whole bar of the score).

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 25-Apr-2001

Did you try positioning the cursor just to the right of the notation, then backspace? The notation is "grabbed" by that little gray diamond.

Reply 2 offered by: David Todd on 25-Apr-2001

Works like a charm. Tried looking for how to select this and couldn't find it--thanks!


#2060: MIDI instrument assignment limitation
MIDI instrument assignment limitation

(2060)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 26-Apr-2001

I think I've traced a bug. When I altered the list of available MIDI instruments in the Options menu (MIDI tab) then the instrument assignment in each staff was altered too. Consider an available MIDI instruments sequence in the Options menu as "SBLive A", "SBLive B", "Wavesynth". This is then altered to "WAvesynth", "SBLive A" and "Yamaha Softsynth". In a staff that was previously assigned "SBlive A", the staff is then reassigned automatically as "Wavesynth".

S

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Apr-2001

You cannot alter the list of "available MIDI" devices in NWC, as this list represents the devices in your system. The only way to change this is to install new play back devices.

However, you can alter the devices used by play back, and NWC correctly adjusts its play back accordingly after you make a change in this area.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Apr-2001

Just to expand on NoteWorthy Support's explanation, since this was confusing to me at first also:

The left pane in the Options --> Midi tab dialog shows all the midi playback devices that are installed on your system and recorded in the system registry. As pointed out, this is entirely dependant on your particular system, including how many and what kind(s) of sound cards you have, and what devices were installed for each hardware device during initial install.

The right pane lets you select which of those devices are available for use by NWC. The default device is always the topmost device in this listing. The order of the devices will be reflected in the Staff Properties --> Midi tab dialog.

You can easily change the order of the "Devices used by Playback" listing by first removing them all by selecting them one at a time, and clicking the <-- button. Then, "install" them in the order you want them. (I used install in quotes because you're not really adding/removing device drivers, only changing the listing of which ones are made available to NWC).

If your work is intended to be playable by others, a good suggestion is to use only a single device. However, for your own use, there is no reason why you can't order the available devices in any way you want.

Hope this helps. Suggestion to NW Support: Perhaps a numbered list, both in the Tools-->Options--Midi dialog and also in the Staff-->Properties dialog, would be helpful in making this more intuitive?

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: Sterghios on 27-Apr-2001

Yeah, thanks for the correction.

I am talking about the right box, the "selected" devices, not the avilable. If you change that order, lets say from 1,2,3,4 to 3,2,1,4 then in a staff that was previously allocated to play using synth 3, it will now use 1. In terms of GM MIDI it doesn't matter (i.e. playback of the file from others) but when using personalised MIDI settings on synths and banks, it really upsets your settings.

I found this whilst I was trying to use simultaneously the Creative software Keyboard and NWC. The former uses the SBLive A synth when open, and by default, NWC uses the same, as it is the first available synth. Since I use more than one synths in NWC during playback, I had to change the order in the right Box in Properties/MIDI to make SBLive A available. The staff settings were adjusted not to playback from the previously selected synth (e.g. a softsynth that used to be on position 3) but but from the synth that now occupied "position" 3 (i.e. SBLive B). It would be useful for the program to adjust the staff settings so that the staff still plays from the synth one had initially selected (e.g. Soft synth) unless it has become unavailable, at which stage it could use the default synth (i.e. the first synth on the sequence).

S

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Apr-2001

For the record, this feature is working as intended.


#2061: Repeat programming
Repeat programming

(2061)

Submitted by: Gerald Schjelderup on 28-Apr-2001

Would someone kindly suggest to me how you program the part of a repeating section where the first and the second playing are identified.The part, that is, that shown above the stave with a number (1 or 2) and a line indicating the duration of the part. There are examples of it in the samples but I see nowhere a method to effect this action. I do not know the proper term for this but it does in fact create a bridge between the first verse rendering and the second.Thanks for any help you can give.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 28-Apr-2001

That's called a "Special Ending" in NWC. Enter special endings by pressing "S" or "s" on the keyboard.

Note that you can select which ending (1, 2, etc.) or even specify more than one interation for each section. There is also the "Default" ending, which is the path that will be taken after a D.C. or D.S. instruction.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 28-Apr-2001

As Fred said, those are called "special endings."

If you are also using lyrics, be aware that the flow of lyrics within the lyric editor may not work the way you think it should, if you are using special endings with different lyrics. This is more easily learned by doing, than by describing.

Reply 3 offered by: Gerald Schjelderup on 29-Apr-2001

Thanks to you Robert and also to Fred. I have now performed the special endings as you suggested and it registers as such on the score for 1st and 2nd rendering, but when I play it, at the second playing (repeat) it plays the first part over again and ignores the several measures of #2. What am I missing?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Apr-2001

Did you put the same Special Ending objects on /all/ staves of your work? If so, there are other things to look at: double barlines or section-close barlines in the middle of the piece can cause unexpected results. Did you put a section-close barline after the last Special Ending?

Hope this helps.

Fred

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Apr-2001

If you look in the Samples folder, you will see some examples of repeats, along with explanations in File | Info.

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen Randall on 30-Apr-2001

I think the problem in Reply 4 may arise because both 1st and second time endings are ticked in the dialogue box associated with the first ending.

My intuition says that the selection should operate as radio buttons so that each ending would be played only once. However, that shows how wrong one can be to trust one's intuition. Probably because I don't play or sing songs I very rarely come across a special ending that needs to be played, say, for the fist, third and fifth verses. But these occasions do arise and so NWC has provided suitable flexibility to achieve this.

HTH

Stephen


#2062: Help File
Help File

(2062)

Submitted by: Ralph Todd on 01-May-2001

I have been using NWC for a while and now for some reason every time I open it the help file comes up. I close it then everytime I move the mouse over a toolbar or menu - the help file comes back up and is active. Its really annoying and I can't do anything. Anyone else had this problem

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-May-2001

There is no reason why this would be happening in NWC. If it is happening, you must have something really wrong on your system, as NWC does not contain any mechanism that would, or even could, do this. Unlike some other Win32 software, NWC does not use its Windows help file for toolbar tooltips, so there is no reason why its help file would pop-up during simple use of the program (a malfunctioning Winhlp32.exe program might be able to cause this with some other software, but should not with NWC).

Your first course of action should be to check for a virus on your system. Second, you might try running a copy of NWC straight from the NWC 1.70 CD, located in \Programs\Composer\NWC32.exe. If this works, then reinstall NWC from the CD.

If not, you need to find the cause of your problem. What did you do to the system before this first started?

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 01-May-2001

I've seen this type of behavior too, although it's been a while and I can't remember whether I was running NWC at the time. I believe rebooting made it go away.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-May-2001

Good point: A full reboot (complete with power down) is always a good first step before trying anything else. This resets hardware and software, and will often clear the source for transient errors that develop on a system.

Always keep a good backup of your data files. Sometimes, a failing system will not return from a reboot when a disk drive or motherboard is developing a failure.


#2063: PDF guru needed
PDF guru needed

(2063)

Submitted by: Althea on 02-May-2001

We are setting up a sheet music website. For printing convenience, we intend to convert noteworthy files to pdf ones. Please read this: http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/c...tip6.htm#export

If you understand the above "Method for Exporting *.nwc Files to the *.pdf (Adobe) Format" and have the tools to do that, please consider helping us out. We can't afford to pay you but in return, we can still offer you a subdomain website and unlimited POP3 email accounts. Sorry, this isn't much I guess but please help us.

Pls either email me at animemusic@hotmail.com or post a reply with your contact info. Thanks a lot!

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 02-May-2001

Are you using Acrobat 4.0? If so, simply "print" the noteworthy file with the Acrobat Distiller (to whatever directory you have selected). It creates the PDF file.

Some folks also print/convert using the Adobe PDFWriter. I have found it to be less robust and to occasionally run into problems, however.

Someone on the forum found this great freeware pdf program at http://www.ctrlp.com. Works slick as a pin if you do not have Adobe Acrobat.

Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 02-May-2001

Read

http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/usertip6.htm#export

which offers the most flexible and cheapest (free!) method.

Hth,
Ertugrul

PS: And don't hesitate to ask for more...

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 03-May-2001

For those who don't own Adobe Acrobat (the full version, not just the reader), the above user tip is free and reliable. But the "free" software from ctrlp.com is apparently intended for their own customers who need to submit files to them in that format.

The bottom line is that it's not necessary to recruit other NWC users to make PDF files. It's a "do it yourself" job.

Reply 4 offered by: Althea on 03-May-2001

I know it's supposed to be easy to convert. I've tried but somehow always got an error message. Anyway, Fred Nachbaur has kindly offered to help out.


#2064: help with soundfonts and such
help with soundfonts and such

(2064)

Submitted by: camz on 02-May-2001

okay.. i just recently bought a sb live! platinum... which comes with a ton of soundfont stuff. i've begun designing my own sound banks but i have no idea how to use them at all. i would LOVE to be able to use them in NWC, as it is my all time favorite midi composing program. i have learned to read and write music from it, but still the midi format and technology is pretty vague to me. is it possible to load soundbanks and use them with other applications? even if i could write my music in the composer and play it back using a different program i would. i have tried to make my soundbank the only one loaded in the soundfont manager, but this doesnt work. this card's wavetable is pretty nice sounding but i need to be able to add my own instruments. if anybody has any ideas or can tell me if its possible, please let me know. i do not own a midi keyboard, do i have to own one to use soundfonts? in something other than the stupid keyboard program that came with the app cd from the sb live! card? if possible write your reply to find_camus@yahoo.com.. if thats not possible i will check back here later. thanks for your time :)
camus

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 02-May-2001

For sf's with NWC check

SoundFonts and External Banks

thread. Especially replies 3 and 4 clarify the point but never hesitate to ask further.

Try the following for sf's in general:

Hammersound
Soundfonts Newsgroup (might be temporarily down for short periods of time. Don't give up trying if you cannot access at the first time)
HYBRID
The Sound Site

Btw, don't forget to visit S. Christian Collins's website and give a try to his marvellous GeneralUser GS 1.3

Hth,
Ertugrul
A SB Live! Platinum user;
an incredible fan of NWC
and GeneralUser GS ;)

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-May-2001

Please try to avoid linking to forum messages using Web URLs (hopefully, we won't have to force this issue in code). For example, the link above should be:

msg #1517: SoundFonts and External Banks

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 03-May-2001

> hopefully, we won't have to force this issue in code

Just out of curiosity; what's the point with this?

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 04-May-2001

IMHO, the point is that someone who prints this message and wants to read the reference at any later connection is unable to know that this reference was message number 1517.

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-May-2001

I can also imagine that it would throw a wrench into compiling the off-line forum for use with the Windows Help system. Links to other messages would essentially be "dead" if expressed as web URLs.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-May-2001

Yes, links to forum messages should be using the !nnn system so that the offline version continues to work in an offline fashion, without forcing back into the online version.

Reply 7 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 04-May-2001

Thanks. I'll be more careful...

Reply 8 offered by: camus on 04-May-2001

did anyone read my new thread? asking for more help? maybe i shouldnt have made it a new thread.. thanks.
camus


#2065: again, soundfonts...
again, soundfonts...

(2065)

Submitted by: camz on 03-May-2001

(note: i am posting this as a new message in fear that the old thread will be ignored. if that isnt the case please let me know and i wont do it again)

i appreciate the amount of replies i've been getting, and they have been very informative. thanks. but i'm still unable to use my soundfonts. heres what i am doing:
in soundfont > AudioHQ i have the Configure Bank tab open, which inside there is Select Bank: which it has a box of stuff. the first option is Synth and the following ones are 000-127. i load my soundfont (gort's synth) in the Synth option right? i tried putting it in various 000-127 banks but results never changed. when i load gort's synth there the 001 option becomes "used by bank 000". all of the instruments become visible in the next tab, "configure instrument", and i am able to access them using AudioHQ's Keyboard. now for the real trouble. in NWC i do not have an option of Staff>Playback Instrument or whatever. i am using NWC32 1.7. i have only 1 device used by playback that works which is the Creative S/W synth. the other options i have are A: SB Live! Midi Synth, B: SB Live! Midi Synth,
Midi Mapper and SB Live! MIDI Out[2420]. none of these work at all or they dont give me any sound. so i'm assuming i have to use the Creative S/W Synth.
so... i have a new song with a few random notes in the first staff. i go to the staff properties via the right click menu, and select the Midi tab. there it says play back device is Creative S/W Synth, and channel 1. the instrument in the soundfont that i'm trying to access (this could be any; i cant get any to work) is 000-092 Squeeze33, as it says in both soundfont studio and audioHQ. so, in NWC i am still unclear as to how i access this. various things i've tried dont work, as i still get the default synth instruments from the soundcard.
in the instrument tab in staff properties, as much as i understand it now is i have to select patch list type: numeric, 1 based. i select this, and in the Bank Select area i check the box Select a patch bank. now, what do i do? i have tried tons of different numbers in the Controller 0: box, which changes absolutely nothing. in the patch name box i have tried many different instruments but nothing there is changed from the default synth. in other posts i read that i'm supposed to access a menu option in NWC that allows me to "select a different patch bank"? it even says the option exists in NWC Help. but i have no such option. i have played around with this to a horrible extent, trying many different combinations but i still cant break out of the stupid default soundfont of the sb live! card. the SF i'm trying to use is the ONLY one i have loaded in AudioHQ, and it's instruments ARE playable in other apps such as the creative keyboard and soundfont studio. is NWC incompatible with the sb Live platinum? i know its something i'm doing wrong, so if anybody has any ideas please please throw em my way. i appreciate your time and listening to my ramblings. thank you :)
camus


#2066: What is "MOONLITE", included in the NWC samples?
What is "MOONLITE", included in the NWC samples?

(2066)

Submitted by: Modus on 04-May-2001

Hi guys,

I know absolutely nothing about music, but I know what sounds good, and the MOONLITE file included as a sample song with NWC is very nice to my ears -- a bit repetitive, but extremely persistent and emotional. I saved it in MIDI format and looked at the file with Windows Notepad. The description line clearly says it is Beethoven's "Sonata Quasi Una Fantasia, Op. 27, No. 2, The Moonlight Sonata". Yet, I have heard this piece and it sounds completely different -- much slower and brooding.

I would be so grateful if some one could listen to MOONLITE in the NWC samples folder and identify the title or artist. I'm looking for alternate versions of it to listen to, i.e. the many covers for Pachelbel's Canon.

Modus

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 04-May-2001

Just like it says, it's "Sonata Quasi Una Fantasia, Op. 27, No. 2, The Moonlight Sonata".

"Sonata Form" generally contains multiple, contrasting movements. This one has two. The "much slower and brooding" piece you're thinking of is most likely movement #1, the NWC sample is movement #2.

If you buy a recording you should get both movements. I guess the trouble is these days people expect 3 minute songs, rather than having the patience to experience something like this sonata in its entirety with its contrasting emotions and textures. Unfortunately many "best hits of..." type CDs tend to only include fragments.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 04-May-2001

John, you must be talking about the Reader's Digest condensed "Moonlight". The unabridged version is in 3 movements, of which the NWC sample is the 3rd.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Eidson on 04-May-2001

hahah Grant, I was just about to correct the 2-movement response.

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-May-2001

See also: msg #434, msg #632

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 04-May-2001

Gosh -- I thought the Moonlight Sonata was like this: first quarter, full, third quarter, new.

Reply 6 offered by: Artur on 06-May-2001

I've played the 3 movements, the tempo on the file is by Hans von Bülow, one editor of his, the three movements are 1-Adagio 2-Allegretto 3-presto agitato.
This is the one sonata that doesn't correspond to the regular form Not too Fast/Slow/Very Fast

Reply 7 offered by: Artur on 06-May-2001

beethoven hated this name....
he much like Sonata quasi una fantasia, wich is also the Op27 No1 name, he hated when people put names on his work

Reply 8 offered by: iklesteve on 31-May-2001

without wanting to be picky, "Sonata Form" is actually a format for an individual movement, comprised of a Exposition, Development and Recapitulation, and not a form of an entire work.
A good example of Sonata form is the 1st movement of Beethoven's 5th Symphony, where he sets out the main themes, then develops them, and finally returns to them to finish off the movement.

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Jun-2001

To muddy the waters even further, "Sonata" is different from "sonata form". A "Sonata" was originally simply a "sounded" (as opposed to vocal) piece of work; it has come to mean "An instrumental composition, usually for a solo instrument, in three or four contrasting, extended movements." So Beethoven was entirely correct in calling the entire work "Sonata quasi una fantasia."

Then there's the bag of worms that "Sonata form" gets you into, since there are quite a few forms, and even the experts have trouble keeping them all straight. There are first, second and third rondo form, third rondo with development, sonatina form, enlarged sonatina, sonatina form with final D.C., and several types of sonata allegro form.

Finally, there's David Crosby's "Immigration Form", which is "big enough to keep you warm when the cold wind's blowin'" :)

Reply 10 offered by: sam on 25-Nov-2001

Not to make matters any worse, but this piece is a sonata for solo instrument, and the 3rd movement is in sonata form. Talk about crazy, huh?

Reply 11 offered by: Artur on 27-Nov-2001

Actually, that was a false statement, Sam, Sonatas were generally in 4 movements, as were Symphonies as well. Fast-Slow-(Scherzo)Menuet-VeryFast, Scherzo was included by Beethoven in the place of the Menuet, included by Haydn. This 3rd movement was sometimes excluded in sonatas, and that didn´t stop composers to exclude others. Beethoven excluded the 1st here. He wasn´t obligated to make sonata-form in this movement, for it was not the 1st. It was the regular 4th. Thinking like that it´s easier to understand his piece as a whole than general thinking, he didn´t "mess up" or did "modern reformations" to the Sonata, he just excluded the 1st movement and went on.

Reply 12 offered by: Grant on 27-Nov-2001

Don't forget that Beethoven himself called this sonata "quasi una fantasia", which indicates he recognized that its form was unusual.

Reply 13 offered by: Artur on 30-Nov-2001

Don't forget that Sonata quasi una fantasia is also the 13th sonata. He gave this name in regard of the sonata form, which he didn't follow interely in this 2 sonatas. However, the Oupus 27 N1 is complete, with all the 4 movements there.

Reply 14 offered by: Ray on 08-Jan-2002

the sample in labeled moonlite in NWC is not movement 2, its movement 3

Reply 15 offered by: anon on 09-Jan-2002

I think that's what Grant had said in reply 2 :)


#2067: More fonts
More fonts

(2067)

Submitted by: Manuel L. Puig on 04-May-2001

I was wondering whether NWC has alternate fonts for the scores themselves, not text, but the actual scores, to make them look medieval or something like that.
Thanks in advance

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 04-May-2001

I'm assuming you're talking about a "handwritten" font to make a score look like actual manuscript? If it was in a "medieval" font, you would have a tough time recognizing the notation unless you're proficient in the (insert name for medieval notation here - it's slipped my mind) style.

The answer to your question is no, NWC does not support any different fonts for the notes - although if you search the forums you will find a font for percussion noteheads.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 04-May-2001

Repeating myself (sorry about that):

NWC uses a font for note-heads, note-flags, clefs, and a few other things. But note-stems, beams, and many other things are "drawn" rather than derived from a font.

Without a major program change, NWC can be user-hacked to provide an alternative style for the font objects. This was the subject of my percussion font. In the case of Medieval, it would be possible to substitute things like closed or open diamonds for the usual closed or open oval note-heads. But it would not be possible to make the notation change with pitch (as with fasola).

The strategy used by NWC is not unique to NWC. I suppose that most music notation program developers had not imagined that, in a world of computerized music, anyone would find a need for a printout that would look like Medieval script.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 04-May-2001

And that reminds me:

If the monastaries had had computers, the music would have been Midieval rather than Medieval.


#2068: pb with the connection of my external keyboard
pb with the connection of my external keyboard

(2068)

Submitted by: dabkowski on 05-May-2001

I've got a VIA AC'97 Audio Controller (WDM)and can't install an external keyboard.
My OS is Windows Millenium (I don't know if it may be a problem?)
Thanks for your help
CD

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-May-2001

We are not familiar with your equipment. You can look around the forum for other user's experiences with hooking up exterbal keyboards, and you might try checking with the manufacturer of your equipment to see if and how this is supported.

See also: msg #558, msg #1837, msg #1856, msg #1884, msg #1889

Reply 2 offered by: Al Cannon on 05-Jun-2001

If you have a MIDI to 15-pin cable it likely was manufactured with the 5-pin DIN connectors labelled backward...apparently they were made with the thought that MIDI IN and OUT meant at the soundcard, not at the unit. Try reversing the MIDI connectors...I can't tell if this is your setup, but I have seen many folks discover that this was the problem.


#2069: help help please i'm begging now!
help help please i'm begging now!

(2069)

Submitted by: camus on 05-May-2001

okay, i apologise for my previous use of the forums. i have structured my help request now to avoid more ramblings. here is what i am doing:
i have a SB Live! Platinum 5.1 card. what i want to do is use SoundFonts in noteworthy composer. in version 1.7 of NWC i have no "Playback Instrument" under the staff menu, but in 1.5 i do. so i'm assuming that i need to use NWC15.
in AudioHQ, i select SoundFont and i am given a bank configuration menu. theres a combo box that is titled "Select Bank" and the box has a structure like this:
Synth:
001 -
002 -
and so on.
in the Synth slot i have loaded a 8mb soundfont, "Illusion".
in the 001 bank i have loaded Gort's Synth.
Bank 002 is used by bank 001.

now. in the AudioHQ Keyboard i am able to select, view, play and control every instrument contained in both soundfonts. i select Bank 000, which is displayed as
000-[Illusion Bank] I want to access *ANY* instruments but now i will say that in NWC i am trying to access the "Slap/Pop Bass" that exists in instrument 012.

so what do i do in NWC? how do i access these instruments? so far i've tried quite a few of combinations for instrument patches and selecting different patch banks. to no avail! nothing i've tried so far has allowed me to use soundfonts. i'm beginning to think that it is impossible with NWC! others claim they have done it, but what could i be doing wrong? nothing i do allows me to break out of the stupid card's default sounds. i have 128mb of ram to blow on soundfonts, so i dont have to care "if the shops are open". please please somebody tell me what i have to do! i feel like an idiot trying to frustratingly find different combinations in the bank select box. just tell me how i access them. then i can go on to learning the technical information about soundfonts. if i have a soundfont loaded in bank 000, how, in NWC, do i access it? or is it impossible? if so, please NWC add support for soundfonts and banks! :)
camus

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 05-May-2001

Let's see if I can start you on the right path.

1. Are you saying that you have no playback sound cards listed on the NWC "Tools, Options, Midi". If that is the case, go to the Windows control panel and check the Multimedia area (in particular the Midi Tab) to see if all is well. If you do not see the soundcard options there, something is wrong. You may also want to check the System, Devices area to make sure the card is functioning correctly.

If there are any problems with the foregoing, you may need to remove and then reload the soundblaster and the software package option to see if that helps (assuming that you have relevant IRQs to handle the card).

In regard to the Softsynths (once they are correctly loaded), unfortunately Noteworthy is a bit clunky in selecting special instruments outside of the conventional set. You probably need to figure out the controller for a particular instrument program, and then set it under the "Staff Properties" "Instrument" area (assuming that you have selected "A SBLive! MIDI Synth" or "B SBLive! MIDI Synth" and under the Creative Live software, have loaded the particular soundfont banks you desire into the relevant MIDI Synth)

I think there is a good discussion and some good links in the Scriptorium. You may want to visit that.

Reply 2 offered by: camus on 05-May-2001

okay i should have specified my message more clearly... there is nothing wrong with my card... i dont have a midi out device to hook up to my computer so i have to use Creative S/W Synth! is this incompatible? MUST i buy something to connect to my midi out thing? i just want to know what i type in the instrument boxes in NWC to access my soundfonts in bank 000! or am i just ignorant?

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 06-May-2001

Aah! Maybe I see. I happen to use the Creative S/W Synth. It is the "built in" soundfonts that Creative got from Ensoniq (and are the basic general set of programs).

to use soundfonts, you will need to use the Creative A or B MIDI Synth setups on the Creative software. The "S/W Synth" is strictly the build-in soundtables on the card(as I understand it).

Other folks on the forum will probably be of better help in that area (how to select extended sets of sounds and instruments). Again, I urge you to go to the Scriptorium and/or other sites dealing with sound fonts. Several sites have very detailed instructions on use of soundfonts. The information is a bit too complex to summarize in the context of a forum.

Reply 4 offered by: camus on 06-May-2001

thank you for your help.. where is the scriptorium?

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-May-2001

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

Reply 6 offered by: camus on 08-May-2001

well, all in all i tried and searched everywhere, but i couldnt figure this out. apparantly it does have to do with the midi device... and my lack of being able to get things to actually PLAY from the A: or B: SB Live! synths. but other programs let me play through them... which will have to do until one day i can figure this out. n-track studio is among them, which allows you to crudely compose from a piano roll, play and record with other audio formats and mixdown everything into a fully mixed song. but NWC will still play the biggest role in the fact that its the easiest to write music with. it's playback will just be rough-draft.
camus


#2070: Notes on Eastern Tone System II
Notes on Eastern Tone System II

(2070)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 07-May-2001

Second of the article series started in msg #2050
---

II – FROM PENTATONIC TO HEPTATONIC:

My intention in this article series is following a program from general explanation of Eastern tone system to the traditional composition concept in Turkish classical music, that is a flow from objective facts to more subjective, specific ideas and views. That’s why I don’t see anything wrong with interrupting the succession of common methods and inserting a custom hypothesis;

When we go two steps upwards and downwards by fifths, we get the degrees of anhemitonic pentatonic scale. Taking the tonic D, again:

D (1), E (1.125), G (1.33), A (1.5), C (1.78),

There are two large steps, namely minor thirds in this scale: E-G and A-C. If we go on one more step at both directions, we come up with B and F and can form a Dorian scale but what if we stop and fill the ‘gap’ with our neutral third instead?

D (1), E (1.125), Gb (1.2), G (1.33), A (1.5), Cb (1.67), C (1.78),

What we obtain is the heptatonic skeleton of fundamental Eastern scale; two Rast tetrachords with a major second between them.

This circumstance reminds the probability of a common pentatonic infrastructure that has ‘given birth’ to both Eastern and Western systems.

Ertugrul iNANC,
http://ertugrulinanc.8m.com


#2071: ABC@win
ABC@win

(2071)

Submitted by: Lar on 07-May-2001

Does anyone have - know of - heard of - a program to convert ABC to Nwc? I saw it mentioned, but u=nfortunately I can't find it again.
Lar

Reply 1 offered by: Clive Trott on 08-May-2001

Bryan Creer of Abacus music has developed a shareware
program for Windows ,ABC2NWC.
It can be downloaded at http://members.aol.com/abacusmusic

Reply 2 offered by: Lar on 08-May-2001

Thanke you Clive. I could not locate ABC2NWC. Looked and looked, but could not find it. Thank you ever so much.
LAr

Reply 3 offered by: Geoff Walker on 16-May-2001

I convert to MIDI using abc2midi then import the MIDI file into NWC.

Geoff

Reply 4 offered by: Lar on 17-May-2001

Thanks to all of you. The ABC2NWC is ideal. ABC2MIDI is too difficult to install and use. ABc to MIDI to NWC is one step too many. Again, thanks for your help.

Larry Allen


#2072: New Instruments
New Instruments

(2072)

Submitted by: Brandon Ellis on 08-May-2001

I wish to know how i would go about adding more instruments to be able to use in nwc. i've downloaded the ini patches, but still the only thing that works is the general midi. if i select another bank (rolandGS mt-32 kawai k5 etc) all i get are the same general midi instruments. help would be much appreciated

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-May-2001

The possible/available list of instruments is a function of your sound card.

For more details, see: msg #1100, msg #1630, msg #1085

Soundcard/soundfont threads: msg #1573, msg #1375, msg #1471, msg #1496, msg #1461, msg #1517, etc.


#2073: Percussion already
Percussion already

(2073)

Submitted by: D.M.M. on 09-May-2001

I have used noteworthy for quite a while now And it has never had percussion clef capabilities. I inquired noteworthy and was informed that that feture would become available with the next release. This was 3 releases ago. I'm sorry, but how does one expect to be competative if a user can't print a complete score with one's program. It is highly frustrating.

Reply 1 offered by: Yves Grasset on 10-May-2001

I think that the next release means version 2. This feature probably requires major changes to the code.

And BTW, which other "competitive" music software takes users wishes into account?

I know that it can be frustrating to wait for a particular feature. I'm personally waiting for n-tuplets for a long while now. But, as a registered user for five years, I've benefited from so many enhancements without spending one cent that I wouldn't complain.

To quote the newsgroup FAQ, "it may be a Mercedes at a Volkswagen price, but it ain't a Lamborghini (yet)."

Yves

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-May-2001

As Yves pointed out, NWC is already much more than "competitive." I am a registered owner of several sequencing/scoring programs, none of which support clefs other than the usual treble, bass, alto and tenor, and all of which cost many times that of NWC. What's more, with NWC you can create any kind of clef you like using one of the six available user fonts slots. Yes, you'll have to insert that symbol at the beginning of every new system (perhaps requiring some judicious fiddling when printing the score), but at least it's possible.

Also to echo Yves' sentiment, I have wishes for this program also; but even if none of them should ever be fulfilled (and many of them have already) I would still unhesitatingly recommend it to anyone wishing to do serious musical work easily, and at very reasonable cost.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-May-2001

>was informed that that feture would become available

FOr the record, no such statement was made from us, as far as I know. As a rule, we never promise anything that isn't already in alpha/beta testing (as some long time users are well aware).

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-May-2001

Ah, yes, percussion notation......

If you want X-head notes with a percussion (double-line) clef in NWC, here's my solution:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/misc/bangerfont.htm

But what it won't do is create notation with some "normal" notes and some X-head notes. It's all or none.


#2074: Scan input
Scan input

(2074)

Submitted by: tristan cooper on 11-May-2001

Who agrees ? It is time to have the ability to SCAN sheet music directly into Noteworthy or better yet - have the computer READ music via the webcam - imagine !
scanning was possible about 10 years ago with some British software on the Acorn Archimedes computer - is it time to catch up?

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-May-2001

Unless NWC is already working on it, I say that it's a bad idea. As many others have noted, programs that will scan sheet music already exist (I own one myself) but more often than not, are more trouble than they are worth.

Part of the problem is that from the OCR point of view, music notation is a lot less standard than one would think. The greatest likelihood of (partial) success occurs when reading sheet music that itself was printed from a computer composition program, and has access to the font(s) involved. But if the music is that new, then either (a) just get a copy of the digital file from its source, or (b) maybe there's a copyright violation.

When you think about it, OCR of printed music is a "transition" technology.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul C. on 13-May-2001

I have tried three different success programs without what I would call success. It took so long to correct the OCR'd piece that it was easier to start entry from scratch. Right now, forget it.

Reply 3 offered by: Paul C. on 13-May-2001

Sorry, meant to say, tried three different SCANNING programs without success.

Reply 4 offered by: Teresa Rios on 27-Jun-2001

Which scanning programs did you try?

Reply 5 offered by: Tristan Cooper on 28-Jun-2001

I would be very interested to hear of any scanning programs that have been used sucessfully. As an amateur musician, I find it very helpful to hear a piece of music played; this gives me a lot of guidance in the interpretation of the written work.

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-Jun-2001

I have a music scanning program, but I won't mention its name here because that would be unfair: The program functionally works (that is, has no known bugs) but is very inaccurate in interpeting music unless the printed page is very precise to start with. A page that precise probably is freshly printed from a music publishing program -- in that case, it would be easier to simply ask for the original digital file. It is unfair to mention the program's name because it is my understanding that competing programs are also rather inaccurate.

Think of how problematic it is to scan and OCR a printed text document, never mind music. Any fuzziness or distortion on the page may cause the OCR engine to misinterpret what it sees. Even with a clear print, the OCR must be able to recognize several different fonts at several sizes, and allow for decorations such as bold, italic, or underlining.

But a text OCR program has a fair chance of success because most text documents have been created with a limited number of standard typefaces. Also, every word can be compared to dictionary sources, and there are even grammar checks. Thus, a text OCR program has resources to draw on that can help it "guess" what the scanned text is supposed to be. If it misses on occasion, the consequences may be no more serious than the occasional misspelled word.

But music is different. Even such a simple item as the quarter note-head can come in several styles: round or oval, tilted or not. Note flags come in several styles. Notes may be of different sizes (for grace notes, etc) that are difficult to resolve by scanning. The dominance of horizontal and vertical lines can cause confusion if the page is askew. To make matters worse, there is no "dictionary" or "grammar" that can be used. If a chord could be interpreted as Cmaj or Cmin, it could be either. Context is of no help unless the composer wrote in a rigid style that could be referenced. Finally, a wrong note is usually more serious in music than a wrong letter on a text page.

No doubt, very advanced software could be developed that expertly analyzes questionable notes for context and musicological sense, in comparison to nearby passages and to the entire composition. But I doubt if such a program, if one is ever developed, would be affordable to the amateur who simply wants to scan and play a page of music.


#2075: Can't open file!! Help!
Can't open file!! Help!

(2075)

Submitted by: Kat on 11-May-2001

I saved an existing nwc file into a midi file, and now I cannot open it. The computer says,
"The file failed to open. It either does not exist or may be corrupted."

How do I remedy this??? Please respond ASAP!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 11-May-2001

Be sure that the file actually does exist at the location you're trying to load it from. If you moved the file (or deleted it), it will still show up in your "History" (Documents) list.

Did you check the trashcan?

Still can't find it? Use the Windows search facility, Start --> Find --> Files and Folders --> Look In "My Computer".

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-May-2001

This means exactly what it says. How are you trying to open the file? Are you using File | Open or the File | History? You can send me the file, and I will look at it.

Reply 3 offered by: kat on 11-May-2001

I tried to open the file both through the open command as well as with the history. Neither task was successful. I will send over the file shortly. THanks!

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-May-2001

If you tried opening the file directly and it failed, then it is probably corrupted as it says. This sometimes happens to computer files. You should look for the .bak version of the file, if you have kept it around. You might need it. Also, if you aren't making backups of your data files, such as NWC files, you should definately start doing so.

I'll post my results with your file as soon as I receive it from you. Send it to the e-mail address in this post.

Reply 5 offered by: Paul C. on 13-May-2001

Go to wherever the file was originally, find the *.bak, and rename it, changing the extension to .nwc. It should open again in Noteworthy for you.

Reply 6 offered by: Stephen.Hutcheson on 16-May-2001

You can get this message if you try to load a file created by version 1.7 into a version 1.52 copy of NWC. Was this a file you created? (If not, download the latest release. You _won't_ regret it. This is not Microsoft, where a release is a bug redistribution.)

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-May-2001

I assume the problem is solved, as no file was ever sent.


#2077: Harpsichord
Harpsichord

(2077)

Submitted by: Monty Arce on 14-May-2001

Recently I had the chance to go to a barroque concert. I got more than impressed with the live sound of the harpsichord.
The question is:
How can I transfer a piano concerto that I wrote to harpsichord? How does the harpsichord differs from the piano, and more specifically I would like to know about its range and what the scores look like?
I know that the harpsichord does not support dynamics, but how else it differs¿?
Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 14-May-2001

Harpsichord and piano music are generally interchangeable... I assume the only difference is the speed that an individual note can be played (harpsichord plucks the strings, taking more time than the percussive hammer-action of a piano)

-j

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 14-May-2001

> I know that the harpsichord does not support dynamics

That's true for 'authentic' harpsicords but recently, dynamic sensitive and pedalled harpsicords are built, as well.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 15-May-2001

> Harpsichord and piano music are generally interchangeable.

Some harpsichords, like organs, have multiple manuals or evan a pedalboard. Music written for these may be difficult to play on the piano if the composer took advantage of these features.

> I assume the only difference is the speed that an individual note can be played.

Also the fact that notes can't be sustained on the harpsichord as they can on the piano, by holding keys down or by using the pedals. (Imagine, if you will, Debussy on the harpsichord.)

> recently, dynamic sensitive and pedalled harpsicords are built, as well.

IMHO, the fact that something can be done doesn't necessarily mean that it should be done.

Reply 4 offered by: Monty Arce on 15-May-2001

OK, I see piano and harpsicord music are interchangable. So, on the ground that the harpsichord I write for doesn't have pedals, What is its range and what do the scores look like?

Reply 5 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 15-May-2001

I can't comment on range, but there are pedals and there are pedals. Almost all harpsichords have at least two manuals (keyboards) and two or three "pedals". These do various things, such as shift the octave of one of the manuals, or invoke the so-called "lute stop", in which softer, usually leather, plectra (is that the plural?) are used instead of hard, originally goose quill, plectra. Many will also allow doubling of the notes, so that two strings an octave apart are sounded with a single key.

Cyril

Reply 6 offered by: Monty Arce on 15-May-2001

Thanks, but my question still stands...
However, what Cyril mentions about the octave shifts with the pedals sounds baffling. How do I notate that on score?

Reply 7 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-May-2001

<Grant wrote>
IMHO, the fact that something can be done doesn't necessarily mean that it should be done.
</Grant wrote>

So you're against modernised harpsicords? May I ask why?

Regards

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Edwards on 16-May-2001

Have you come across the expression 'Flogging a dead horse'?

AS for Monty's question, I would imagine that you don't notate such things, but write for a generalised harpsichord which is then interpreted appropriately on the available instrument.

Apropos reply #1, my impression is that the harpsichord is the quicker instrument, where much more intricate ornaments can be played. Again these would not be written out but left to the improvisational skills of the performer.

Peter

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 16-May-2001

> So you're against modernised harpsicords? May I ask why?

So you're in favor of modernized harpsichords? May I ask why?

Seriously, what's the point? The harpsichord music we have today was written for an instrument with a certain set of characteristics, which does not include control of dynamics (except through coupling of stops), by composers who were aware of the limitations.

If a performer wants to play this music on an instrument with dynamic control, there's always the piano. At least with the piano there's a presumption that the performance is "inauthentic" and may not agree with the composer's intentions. Modernized harpsichords might lead to performances that are every bit as inauthentic but that nonetheless project an aura of authenticity. While I'm not a hard-liner, I respect the achievements of the HIP (Historically Informed Performance) movement and wouldn't like to see them jeopardized.

I'd see a better argument for modernized harpsichords as vehicles for new music written specificially for them, with the intention of taking advantage of the modernizations - but is there really any serious pent-up demand for such instruments on the part of modern composers? I doubt it.

Reply 10 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 16-May-2001

You ask:

"So you're in favor of modernized harpsichords? May I ask why?"

and answer -as if- for me:

"I'd see a better argument for modernized harpsichords as vehicles for new music written specificially for them <snip>"

I'm not on the side of Early music to be played on modernised instruments. I preferably go after performances with authentical instruments. I don't ever respect a harpsicord piece played on a piano. Scarlatti Sonatas make me headache, for instance. (Remember the latest Händel thread.) So, there is no problem.

Btw, I've been thinking for years, about writing a piece for modern harpsicord, other instruments and -maybe- continuo. But I don't know when to handle.

Regards

Reply 11 offered by: Fred on 16-May-2001

I don't have a problem with authenticity for its own sake, if that's what you want. However, I'd much prefer hearing Baroque string music (for instance) performed on modern instruments (i.e. developed in the Classical era) than those screechy, metallic-sounding baroque violins.

Advances are continually being made in instrument construction (as in other human endeavors) and some changes become accepted, whereas others don't. However, even amongst those that fall by the wayside, there is a compelling reason for their existence; the example that comes to mind is the Arpeggione, for which only one significant piece was written; but what a beautiful piece it is, and had the arpeggione not existed it may have never been written.

So just as I don't have a problem with using antique harpsichords, I also don't have a problem with designing modern ones with dynamics capabilities. Who know, perhaps someone will write a sonata that would not exist otherwise, /or/ (just as valid, IMO) someone will perform a Baroque piece with more feeling and "character" than ever could be possible on a conventional instrument.

Reply 12 offered by: Yves Grasset on 17-May-2001

Ertugrul,

The answer to the harpsichord vs piano, or antique vs modern harpsichord, question shouldn't be dogmatic. The important thing is that it sounds good.

IMO, 99% of J.S. Bach pieces and a good part of Rameau's ones, for instance, sound way better on the piano. On the other hand (and still IMO), Händel's and most of all Couperin's music sounds very insipid if not played on the harpsichord.

Probably just a matter of taste, but try to listen to Bach on the piano without prejudice.

Yves

PS: I may be biased, since I went to a concert last Sunday where Christian Zacharias (at the piano) and the Lausanne Chamber Orchestra played one of Bach's harpsichord concerto, and that was great! ;)

Reply 13 offered by: Joe Eidson on 17-May-2001

[Peter] "Apropos reply #1, my impression is that the harpsichord is the quicker instrument, where much more intricate ornaments can be played. Again these would not be written out but left to the improvisational skills of the performer."

I was referring to the speed that a single note can be repeated on the harpsichord vs. piano. I seem to remember a snipper of music history class that mentioned how the piano was faster in this aspect because of the hammer action.

Reply 14 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-May-2001

Yves,

I'm not dogmatic. I confess being a little 'rigid' and -now, in a more liberal mood- I can say that the performance strictly depends on the performer, whether instrument used.

Regards.

Reply 15 offered by: Peter Edwards on 18-May-2001

[Joe] I see what you mean about a repeated single note in that the hammer is already back in position while the plectrum is still on the wrong side of the string. But my memory snippet says that the harpsichord was capable of more ornamentation. I'm no expert - can any knowledgeable person throw light on this.

Actually I'm not a fan of the harpsichord, especially when it is being used as a continuo instrument in an orchestra, producing weird clanking noises seemingly having little to do with the music being played. But the player always gets a special bow at the end!

Peter

Reply 16 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-May-2001

> But the player always gets a special bow at the end!

It's because he stopped playing... :-P

Reply 17 offered by: Ann on 18-May-2001

In the case of ornaments, I think the misconception of them being easier on the harpsichord than on the piano probably arose from the fact that harpsichord music is very much more ornamented than the bulk of piano music. There was a very good reason for this. The Harpsichord is incapable of sustaining notes, so to avoid having huge blank gaps after playing a long note, the player would twiddle around the given note to fill out. You will notice it especially at the end of sections where there is a great flourish in the final bar, generally arpeggiating the final chord. You will also notice the frequent ornamentation in the pieces recently posted from the Fizwilliam Virginal Book.

Ornamentation in the late 18th century started to take on a different meaning - being applied to the piano, and also to other instruments, it became very much of a decorative nature - enhancing the melody rather than "filling a space" This reached a kind of high point in the works of Chopin and Liszt - far removed from the contrived necessity of the earlier Renaissance and Baroque ornamentation.

I play the spinet -4 1/2 octaves - C two 8ves below mid C to third F above. With only one manual, virtually no dynamic variation is possible at all, and certainly no sustaining.

In the case of Harpsichords (usually 5 octaves) and usually 2 or 3 manuals, a modicum of loudness variation is possible by using the different manuals with the various register stops, but basically Piano and Harpsichord are not interchangeable - Whereas it is no problem to play harpsichord music on a modern piano, it is virtually impossible to play much classical and later works on a plucked instrument - the performing techniques are so very different eg. pianistic music exceeds the range, no pianistic dynamics are possible, no sustaining power using held notes, no sustaining pedal. One of the biggest drawbacks to performing most music beyond the Baroque, I find is the actual depth of the keyboard. The Spinet I play has a depth of less than 2/3 that of a usual piano depth, making it extremely difficult to play some chord clusters without spreading them (hand is permanently in a very cramped position)and the attack of the fingers is quite different. Add to this the black and brown keys which you can't see to play if the lighting is bad, and performing becomes a tad nightmarish sometimes unless one is performing straight baroque continuo-type work!

Hope this clarifies things a bit!

- Ann

Reply 18 offered by: Peter Edwards on 18-May-2001

Thanks for the explanation. Would it also be the case that florid ornaments on the harpsichord could appear to be cleaner than on a piano, precisely because they can't be blurred together since they don't sustain?

Peter

Reply 19 offered by: Ann on 18-May-2001

(Peter), Possibly ornaments might appear cleaner, although this depends on the touch of the performer. The whole manner of playing the plucked instrument is very different from the piano - one has to lift one's fingers from the notes sooner, and precisely to avoid the tongue with the plectrum hovering around the still vibrating string. Certainly if the pedal is used heavily in piano music to sustain harmonies, any ornamentation of the melody can be quite blurred. I think generally clarity is produced not so much by the instrument as by the performer though. Some harpsichords produce more noticeable overtones, depending on which which register is being used, which would blur the ornamentation a bit I suppose. Are there any experts here who could explain this better?

- Ann

Reply 20 offered by: John Kavanagh on 25-May-2001

It seems to me as if you wanted some fairly specific information. I'll try. I don't play harpsichord myself, but I've been in a lot of ensembles with harpsichord.

It's best to write something for a specific player, who will tell you about his or her instrument; they're not as standardised as pianos. That said, here are the two most common models. A good player will likely prefer an authentic-style instrument, even for modern music. Some of Bach's music (the Well-tempered Clavier, for instance) is written for the smaller range, which is the same as the organ keyboard, but his suites and the Goldbergs all need the five-octave, two-manual instrument.

A small harpsichord intended mainly for accompanying will have two ranks of strings and a range of C to e"' (two leger lines below bass clef to three leger lines above the treble clef. The player has a lever to add the second register, or sometimes the second register can be played separately, with a slightly different sound. You can mark sections p or f and the player will play on one or two strings, but he needs a rest to pull the stop lever.

A solo harpsichord usually has a range of five octaves from the G three leger lines below the bass clef. If you are thinking concerto, you're probably safe writing for this range, and you can assume the instrument has two keyboards and three stops. One of the stops will be a "4-foot stop", which will play an octave higher than written. If this is played together with a stop at regular pitch (an "8-foot stop", you don't really hear it as an parallel octaves, more as added brightness. The 4-foot stop can be played separately, but it's usually not very loud.

How it's usually set up is that one of the keyboards (the lower one, I think) is for one of the two 8-foot registers and the 4-foot register, and the upper manual only has one 8-foot. You can couple the registers so all three are played from the lower keyboard, but I don't remember if you can play the upper one separately when they're coupled. I think you can, so you get a big contrast in sound by hopping betwen the keyboards, or playing one hand on each level. For equal contrapuntal voices, it can be nice to play one hand on each keyboard with just the 8-foot stops on - the sounds of the two registers are usually set up to sound a little different. There's usually a "buff" or "harp" sound, which puts felt pads against the strings for a sound like pizzicato strings or a guitar with palm muting, and there's sometimes a "lute" stop which plucks the strings closer to the bridge for a sound like a guitar plucked right at the bridge, bright and snappy. These stops are usually on the lower 8, and as a composer you can expect the buff to be on any solo harpsichord, but not necessarily the lute stop. Some people CALL the buff stop the lute stop.

The big advantage of two manuals is that you can switch quickly from one sound to another. You can specify "lower 8+4" or "lower:8+8+4" or "buff" and be reasonably sure of getting it. You can specify "upper" or "lower" manuals and expect to get two contrasting sounds, depending on what's on the lower. You can write dynamics, sticking probably to three levels like p, f, and ff, and let the player deal with the specifics. If you don't specify anything, most people will play everything on the lower manual with whatever registration balances the ensemble they're playing with, or that they feel suits the music, and use the upper manual if at all for the occasional echo effect.

By the way, a good player on an authentic well-regulated harpsichord can create enough dynamic range with his or her hands to shape a phrase expressively, but not to get the big contrasts and shading possible on other instruments.
For that you need registration and, ideally, two manuals.

A difference between well-written harpsichord and piano music is that harpsichord music has the dynamics written into the texture to some extent: if you want a lot of noise, play a lot of notes. The best way to get a crescendo is to keep adding notes to chords. So you might modify your piece a bit with that in mind.

Is that any help?

Reply 21 offered by: Monty Arce on 28-May-2001

At last a good reply to my question. Thank you very kindly, John.


#2078: albinoni's piece
albinoni's piece

(2078)

Submitted by: hacer on 15-May-2001

hi all,
i've been searching for albinoni's piece "adagio in g minor" for a looong time. is anybody here know how to find this piece's free sheet music (music scores)??? HeLP>>> or if you already have it, could you please send it to me by email? it can be in any format, ps, pdf, html etc...

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-May-2001

Try Fred Nachbaur's Free and Sample Sheet Music Links.

There are lots of sites offering free sheet music linked at that page.

Hth,
Ertugrul iNANÇ

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 15-May-2001

Be careful with copyright! One might justifiably assume that a work composed by someone who died in 1750 would be out of copyright. However, the work popularly known as the "Albinoni Adagio in G minor" was really written in the 1940's by Remo Giazotto based on a tiny fragment of melody and a baseline written by Albinoni.

Stylistically it's much more a "modern" work than anything which would have been written in Albinoni's time.

Dragging the discussion back into the realm of NoteWorthy, you might want to try the Classical Archives at http://www.prs.net/midi.html (or any other MIDI archive) to find a MIDI version of the work. There are 3 versions on the above site. Import it into NoteWorthy and print whatever parts you like.


#2080: display staff names
display staff names

(2080)

Submitted by: David Todd on 17-May-2001

Is there a way to display staff names on the screen (other than the name that appears on the status line when you click on a staff)? I see a setting for printing, but it doesn't show the names on the screen and this would be handy for scores with many staffs.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 17-May-2001

Certainly. You can insert a text item containing the name of the staff near the beginning of the staff -- or anywhere else, for that matter. Keyboard shortcut "x" or "X".

Reply 2 offered by: David Todd on 17-May-2001

Thanks. I was looking for a way to do this more automatically, but this is at least a way to do it. I appreciate your help.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 22-May-2001

You can make the text item hidden so you see it on the screen but it does not mess up your printout. When you insert the text, on the Visibility tab set the Show on printed page item to Never.


#2081: yay! i did it!
yay! i did it!

(2081)

Submitted by: camus on 17-May-2001

i figured this out a few days ago but havent had the time to post it here. i figured out my soundfont troubles (with my sb live! platinum 5.1)
for anybody who may have this trouble here it is.
the sb live! has 3 midi synths. Creative S/W (software) synth and A: SB Live! Midi Synth and B: SB Live! Midi Synth. the only thing i was doing wrong was i only used one of these for playback.. but to access user banks and soundfonts you must have both A: and B: in the Devices Used By PlayBack box in NWC. thats it. :)
thanks for all the help here, because now that i know how to use this, your advice will come in handy :P
happy composing everybody :)

camus


#2082: Percussion volume
Percussion volume

(2082)

Submitted by: Gordon Edwards on 22-May-2001

I've written a percussion piece with one staff containing a snare drum part using Midi channel 10. However, the volume control in the Midi tab of the staff properties window seems to have no effect, the volume being constant independent of the setting. The setting works for a piano piece and I don't understand the problem.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-May-2001

Two possibilities:

1 - Your sound card ignores volume changes on channel 10

2 - You have more than one staff using channel 10, and more than one of them assign volume

You can use Tools | Score Review to eliminate number 2 as a possibility.

Reply 2 offered by: louie on 22-May-2001

I've found the staff properties affect every staff on the same channel, as does multi-point controllers. But the dynamic markings/variance affect only one staff.

I had a song with 2 drum tracks both ch 10 and had one decresc. And the other stayed at its intended volume. That was on a SB16, so no doubt any other card should support this.

hope this helps.
louie.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 23-May-2001

What you need to do is change the VELOCITY of the notes on the track.
Velocity is attached to the Note On message and is independent of channel.
Well almost - velocity, channel volume and channel expression work together to create the dynamic level of the sound from the each note.
Something like Veloc%xVol%xExpress% = dynamic level%.

So even if you set Velocity to maximum the dynamic level will not be at maximum if the volume and/or expression on the channel are not also at maximum.

Confused? - we all are!

I think NWC allows variation in Velocity as an option in dynamic variance. (perhaps Eric can explain this better).

Hope this helps.

Reply 4 offered by: Yves Grasset on 23-May-2001

Here's how I see it:

- VOLUME: similar to the volume control on a hi-fi. Alter the playback if changed while a note is held, thus allowing realistic crescendos & decrescendos for wind instruments, bowed strings,...

- EXPRESSION: "percentage" of the volume. If you set the volume to 64 and the expression to 127 (max. value), the notes will be played at 100% of the volume setting, i.e. 64. If the expression is 64, it will play at 50% of the volume, i.e. 32. If you set the volume in the staff properties and then only use expression MPCs in the piece, you'll have relative dynamics. I.e. you can change the volume of a staff and have the dynamics work accordingly. On held notes, it works like the volume.

- VELOCITY: represents how "hard" a note is played. In consequence, it doesn't alter the playback of a held note. Modern sound cards usually also change the tone of the instrument.

Volume and expression settings affect all the staves sharing the same MIDI channel. Velocity is a property of each note, so you can specify different values for two notes played at the same time on the same MIDI channel (in NWC, only if they're on different staves).

> I think NWC allows variation in Velocity as an option
> in dynamic variance.

It's allowed, but not as an option. The dynamic variation will "look" on both sides to see if there's a difference in velocity and/or in volume. So if your dynamics are velocity-only (i.e. you don't override the volume and you don't insert volume MPCs), it will vary in velocity.

I hope this doesn't confuse things more.

HTH,

Yves

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Music on 23-May-2001

Instead of numbering 0-100%, number 0-110% for louder volume. (according to Spinal Tap)

Reply 6 offered by: Fred on 23-May-2001

Actually midi does Spinal Tap one better by going up to 127. :)

Reply 7 offered by: Gordon Edwards on 26-May-2001

Thanks to all those who replied so promptly & helpfully. It seems that several percussion staves all on channel 10 cannot have different volume levels. However, the dynamic markings affect only one staff & this seems to solve my problem

Gordon


#2083: Polish chars
Polish chars

(2083)

Submitted by: Mietor on 23-May-2001

How can I write text with Polish chars???
Which fonts provide it?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 23-May-2001

Yes, you can write text with Polish or any other characters (even dingbats) if you have a suitable font.

The characters you need must be in code locations 0-255. This means that the characters must be visible using the standard Windows character map. Many fonts contain multiple character sets at higher code locations. Some software can get access to the higher codes, but not the NWC text editor.

Also, if you are using accented characters, be aware that some software creates an accented character using multiple keystrokes (base character, plus accent). The NWC text editor does not work that way -- neither does Notepad. You need to select the accented character as a complete unit, using the Windows character map.

I do not know which fonts would be best for Polish. If nobody else on the Forum knows, I'd start by trying the freely-available international-language fonts that come with recent versions of Internet Explorer, or can be downloaded from Microsoft.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 23-May-2001

Try editing the "Script" property of each font (File > Page Setup > Fonts). There is an "Eastern European" option. After setting that, you can copy and paste via Windows character map (Start > Programs > Accessories > System Tools > Character Map).

Common fonts as Times New Roman, Arial, Courier New provide multi-scripts.

Hth.

PS: Andrew, you can remove the Times New Roman Unicode thingie from helpful files section. Noone needs it as NWC supports "Script" facility.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 24-May-2001

Thanks for reminding all of us about the "Script" property!

Reply 4 offered by: Yves Grasset on 25-May-2001

> PS: Andrew, you can remove the Times New Roman
> Unicode thingie from helpful files section.
> Noone needs it as NWC supports "Script" facility.

The Script command will only work with fonts supporting it. On my home computer (Win 98), the default Times New Roman doesn't. So perhaps it's a little premature to take it away?

Yves


#2084: Midi and NWC Files
Midi and NWC Files

(2084)

Submitted by: Manuel on 24-May-2001

Hi there,

Hope you can help with this: the small NWC icons (the blue piano ones) that appear whenever you see a .nwc, have turned white, like if they were midi's. So, when I open them through NWC they open normally, but when I do it through Windows Explorer they open as midi's, with Windows Media Player. They are not different files. I am talking about the same very files in both cases.
Also, everytime I open NWC a window reading something like "One or more files were not saved..." (I don't quite remember) appear. I tried uninstalling and installing again, and the window still appears.
Thank you very much in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-May-2001

Goto Tools|Options|Folders and check the folder location "Auto Save/Recovery" and make sure it is:

1 - In a directory dedicated to NWC
2 - Is empty, assuming you are not recovering anything

Your file associations can only be fixed by reinstalling NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 24-May-2001

The kind of problem described is not a feature of NWC, but is a problem that occasionally happens with Windows. It is exacerbated if you have a lot of different programs (meaning, a lot of different icons) active on your computer.

If re-installing doesn't help, you may need to manually change your file type associations and icon associations using the Windows Folders Property panel. This is not hard to do (I would step you through it, but I am not currently on a Windows machine).

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 24-May-2001

What strikes me as odd is that media player opens these files. This suggests that they are indeed midi files, and not nwc. You can check this by looking at the file extension; NWC files will be whatever.nwc, and midi files whatever.mid. Note that NWC can "Save As..." Type1 or Type0 midi files, although the default is NWC.

If you don't see any file extensions, enable them by opening Windows Explorer, View --> Folder Options --> View --> Uncheck "Hide file extensions...".

If you still have trouble with the wrong icons displayed, a handy tool is "Tweak UI" (available from microsoft) which includes a Repair --> Icons option.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-May-2001

This may work for you.
In Explorer - click once on one of the midi icons you mention - just to highlight it.
While highlighted - right click on the same icon - a menu appears.
Select Open With .... from this menu.
The Windows File Association dialogue box opens.
Run down the arrow list and find NWC among the applications.
Highlight NWC and enable the box "Always use ....".
Click on OK to exit.
The NWC file should open in NWC and this should now happen in future whenever you double click an NWC icon in Explorer.

Reply 5 offered by: Manuel L. on 25-May-2001

Thank all of you very much. I'll try these options as soon as I am able.


#2085: Max 3 staffs?
Max 3 staffs?

(2085)

Submitted by: Mietek on 25-May-2001

I have porblems with printing > 3 staffs. In print preview I could see terrible view - notes on the whole piece of paper.
All is good when I have max 3 staffs.
I have version 1.70.
At first I thought that I hav eproblem with printer, system etc., but other programs print OK.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-May-2001

Send me an example of what you are describing and we will review it and give you feedback. You might also look at the examples here: http://NoteworthyComposer.com/samples/

By looking at the samples, maybe it will become clear what is causing your trouble.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Eidson on 25-May-2001

I *might* be misunderstanding the problem, but try this:

File -- Page Setup -- Options tab

There is a setting that allows you to change the size of the staves (Staff size, in points). I think the default is 40 points, although I usually print my scores about 14 or 16. Try lowering the number and see if your music prints correctly.
-j

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-May-2001

Your sample contains 6 parts, none of which are the same length. The bar lines don't match up, and the count within the bars don't match among the various parts. Please review the samples and the tutorial in the User's Guide to see how a multi-part score should be notated, and the rules that NWC enforces.


#2086: New lyricfont: does regular, italics, diacriticals
New lyricfont: does regular, italics, diacriticals

(2086)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 27-May-2001

Yesterday, our choir sang at a bilingual English/Spanish ceremony. Suddenly, I realized that in its current version, the NWC lyrics editor only allows one font per composition. So it is not possible to have some lyrics regular, some italicized (as is often used with multi-lingual lyrics). Of course, the text insertion editor is more flexible.

Problem solved! I created a free font that can be used in the NWC lyrics editor (or in Notepad) for either regular or italics characters, also allowing diacriticals. Mix or match, it doesn't matter. This does not require any special software and no hacking of the program. here is the font:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/misc/generiwest.htm

Enjoy!

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 28-May-2001

I wouldn't quite say 'problem solved', although it is a reasonable workaround, because very few people will have the font, so the italics will be gibberish to them.

Your first paragraph is the nub of the matter. I have already submitted a wish to the list that the lyric font can be selected independently for each stave, and then by layering you can have any combination you want.

Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 28-May-2001

I just added my vote in the wishlist for Peter's proposal.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 29-May-2001

Oh, I agree. I wished for that myself. But it didn't take long to cut-and-paste two generic fonts together. Besides, my font allows mix-and match on the same lyric line, if you wish.

Since the font is embeddable in PDF, you can use it for that purpose. But as you noted, it wouldn't work with something such as the NWC browser plug-in.

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 31-May-2001

Thank you for all the fonts you have created. I know this one will come in handy.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 13-Jan-2002

The "Generiwest font is now obsolete. I just posted a much-improved version called "Romital" (Roman and Italic) to the Scriptorium. This font should be adequate for most bilingual situations, where the Roman (non-italic) lyrics are in English, and the Italic lyrics are in other common Western European languages. That is, all of the characters with diacritical marks are in the italic set. Caution: Romital does not use the same character map as Generiwest.

Admittedly this is not the same as having line-by-line choice of lyric fonts. But it does the job for now. If you want to send your composition to someone else, you can freely re-distribute the font, or embed it in a compatible document format.

As long as I'm here... Was there a server problem with the NWC forum during the weekend of January 12-13?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Jan-2002

Server problem: I have been using the server extensively during this period, with no problems. Why do you think there was a problem?

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 14-Jan-2002

[I suppose Robert supposes this because usually there are many new posts during the week-end.]

Robert, I cannot download your romital.zip file from the Scripto!?

Reply 8 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 14-Jan-2002

NWC: The only reason I thought there might be a problem, was that the weekend was quiet, as you noted. It's not that I actually had any problem with the web site.

Marsu: The Scriptorium link didn't work, as you noted. Probably a typo when their page was updated. I'll let them know. But I don't have the font uploaded to my own web site, either. It's not as if the font is a profound contribution to Civilization As We Know It.

I'm still working on that new font mentioned in another thread.

Reply 9 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 14-Jan-2002

One other thing: Currently, I am away from home, using someone else's computer. They have an AOL account. I notice that here, re-loading the pages after posting to the forum does NOT give an update with the new post appearing immediately (as it does from my non-AOL home account). It appears that AOL has some sort of internal page buffer.

I also wonder if automatic installation of NWC plug-ins may go to an original non-AOL browser, lurking unused, rather than to the actually-used AOL browser copy. I can't determine this myself, as I don't want to fool around with the computer settings here.

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 15-Jan-2002

about caching: you may try to ask refresh twice.

Reply 11 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Jan-2002

Last chance to suggest symbols for the new font, as I will start work on it tomorrow.

Marsu: Double-refresh did work. Thanks.

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Jan-2002

The force was not with me! I placed the above message into the wrong message thread. Ignore it. The font of THIS message thread is already on the Scriptorium (and the link to it now works). Now for the correct thread...


#2087: "Staff position" control needed for slurs
"Staff position" control needed for slurs

(2087)

Submitted by: Eric M. Bram on 29-May-2001

For using NoteworthyComposer with "four part harmony" notation, there definitely needs to be better control over the way slurs are positioned -- specifically, variable staff position on an individual slur basis.

Barbershop music requires layering. The lead and tenor tracks are on an upper staff with a treble clef, the baritone and bass tracks are below, on a lower staff with a bass clef. Treble and baritone parts always have stems up; lead and bass parts always have stems down.

The main problem is, with this software (version 1.70) slur marks are for some reason located very far from the notes -- sometimes way above the ends of the stems. This often causes problems with barbershop notation. For example, sometimes the slur mark for the baritone (stems up, remember) in the lower staff actually extends above the slur mark for the lead (stems down) in the upper staff, with both slur marks obscuring the lyrics in the middle.

Nearly changing the slur direction from "upward" to "downward" for the baritone (for example) won't help, because that will usually deposit the slur mark right on top of the bass notes.

What is needed is the ability to vary the staff position, such as is possible with "expression placement" -- on an individual slur rather than a universal basis -- to move the slur marks down closer to the note heads.

Alternatively, how about a toggle to let the slurs travel from head-to-head, the way ties do?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 29-May-2001

And sloping slurs, please? Pretty please?

Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 31-May-2001

I too write for 4-part singing. I use to put the notes for e.g. Tenor 1 (stems up) on one 1st staff and Tenor 2 (stems down) on the 2nd and then layer them together. Problems occurs with downward slurs which tend to interfere with the lyrics. In melismas, I put the two voices together on the 1st staff as “chords” and make all slurs here go upwards. I place the 1st (Tenor 1) note (stem up) of the melisma on the 2nd staff, and then fill out the remaining part of it with rests. I slur the whole “note-and-rests melisma” downwards (which makes the slur be put rather high up, beginning from the 1st note). I make the rests “invisible” and use the placement mechanism to move them downwards, until I get the slur where I want it (using layering).

Sometimes, I cannot use the 1st note because the length isn’t right, or so. I then use a rest in this position too. I don’t make this 1st rest invisible, as this makes the slur disappear as well, but I use the colouring mechanism to make it white and then move it upwards out of the staff, using the later invisible rests for pressing the slur downwards.

It’s a bit tricky (I hope I make this clear, English is not my 1st language), but after a while this doesn’t take too much time, and the printed result is mostly very nice. Nevertheless, I would very much appreciate an easier and more direct way of controlling the position of slurs (they are really too far away from the notes). I would also welcome a mechanism for shortening the stems of individual notes, in order to avoid low notes interfering with the lyrics.

I did put these proposals on to the wish list long ago, without success. Perhaps somebody who masters the English language better, should try again.

Best wishes,

Paul

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Mendenhall on 31-May-2001

I don't know if this is already possible or not, but it would be nice to choose whether slurs appear above or below the notes, rather than anchoring them to the first note.

Reply 4 offered by: Paul Nordgren on 01-Jun-2001

Steve, this is already possible.

Best wishes,

Paul

Reply 5 offered by: Yves Grasset on 01-Jun-2001

To do that select the first slurred note and press CTRL + E In the "Notes" tab, you've got a "Slur direction" drop list where you can choose "Upward", "Downward" or "Default".

HTH,

Yves

Reply 6 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 01-Jun-2001

Perhaps this makes the score to large vertically, but you can fix most of these problems by adjusting the upper and lower vertical size on the "Visual" tab of the staff properties dialog box (right click on a staff, scoot down to the last item, "staff properties" and click on it.

Cyril

Reply 7 offered by: FranMan on 05-Jun-2001

I definately thing we need better controll. Did some one put this on the Wish List?


#2089: .mid to piano score
.mid to piano score

(2089)

Submitted by: Adrienne on 01-Jun-2001

I know this can be done, but how? I've searched,but can't seem to find out how to do this. I want to put some ragtime midis into piano music to play.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Jun-2001

In NoteWorthy Composer, either:

1 - Use File | Open to open the .mid

2 - Drag it from an Explorer window and drop it onto the NWC application window

Reply 2 offered by: Adrienne on 01-Jun-2001

I am familiar with the "import wizard", but how do I get just the treble and bass clefs I need for the piano score? I've tried various things, but I keep getting too many tracks-the minimum was three. I only have two hands! I want to play the piano, not just hear the song.So far nothing is playable for me.
Help!

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 02-Jun-2001

One possibility is that the MIDI track itself has three staffs, played by three "instruments." I have come across many instances of MIDI that do not match the written score, presumably because the altered, electronic rendition sounded better than a literal transcription of the sheet music.

It may also be that notes too far above or below a particular staff are being placed on a new staff ???

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 02-Jun-2001

Or it could be that the third staff is simply the tempo track. Hard to say without more information.

Reply 5 offered by: Adrienne on 02-Jun-2001

Ok, this is for all the musicians out there. This is what I'm doing. Go to:
http://www.perfessorbill.com/index1.htm and then go to MIDI files. Right click any rag to download. Then drop it into NWC and see if YOU can get something decent to play. I'm sure there's a way to do it, but I just don't know how.

I appreciate the time you people are taking to help me. Thanks!

Reply 6 offered by: FranMan on 02-Jun-2001

You can make only two staves if the MIDI is a type 0 file. What I always do is import it like regular and then use File|Save as... and select type 0 MIDI file. (If you want to keep the origional file, you must use a different file name.) Once you have that saved, import your new MIDI file. This time you will want to uncleck the box that says something like map each track to a new staff. This will push all the notes on one staff. Leaving the Max chord size to 18 will make to staves. Usually the notes will line up correctly on the two staves, but if you see too many ledgers below the treble cleff you will want to adust the pitch in the import for that staff so that the lowest note is about middle c, which I /think/ is C5. Need more help, just e-mail me or continue this thread. I will check both daily. Good Luck, FranMan

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Jun-2001

I had no trouble importing many of the MIDI files at this site. In the cases I tried, there was more performance data present than just a single piano part. If you don't want the extra staves, just delete them. You can also force each track in the MIDI file to a single staff by doing the following:

- Uncheck "Map each MIDI channel to a new staff"

- Set "Maximum single track chord size" to 127

Reply 8 offered by: Adrienne on 03-Jun-2001

Does anyone here play ragtime? I mean, as on the piano.Setting it to 127 does help, as well as deselecting the "Map each midi to a new staff". I have fooled with the pitch settings as FranMan suggested. It is better, but still not the "boom chucks" typical of rag in the left hand. I'll keep trying.Thanks.


#2090: Continuing on to next measure..???
Continuing on to next measure..???

(2090)

Submitted by: Mari on 02-Jun-2001

I gotta get this done now and I don't know how and cannot find any lit./help/FAQ nor command file on this:

1)Set up a right hand only,8 note piano introduction, so I let the treble clef be just rests for the left hand staff
2)Now, I want to begin the rest of the music, continuing on with this piano piece, with the next left & right hand staves separate from this first set, but tied to each other as the 2nd set of right & left hand staves...the next measure? Pardon my ignorance, I just hear the music and now I have to learn to write it, and it's for Father's Day. I am not the pianist...she is a by-the-book player and so I must write this just right. Also, I am writing it in a 3 part vocal harmony to record separate tracks for each singer to learn from, since none of them read music! But I have to write those parts just perfect also, so that it will "play" right when "read" by this NWC player, for the singer's recordings.
Question: How do I tie together a new measure of right and left hand staves? Where is that command? I cannot find the { symbol anywhere in NWC lit. or help please reply huntrsart@att.net

Reply 1 offered by: Mari on 02-Jun-2001

Pardon, please reply via this forum, not my email tnx Mari

Reply 2 offered by: Mari on 02-Jun-2001

Is the item I am looking for called the "curly brace" which ties together the right & left hand piano staff? How do i set this up....I have tried what seemed to be every combination of standard, upper grand, lower grand, orch: none presented this curly brace setup....
Question: how do I get a curly brace set up onto a left & right hand piano score? and how do I get the NWC to just continue on making each new set of staves like that for the entire musical piece?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 02-Jun-2001

Set the top staff for upper grand style, set the lower staff for lower grand style. That will give you the curly brace at the start of each system.

Reply 4 offered by: Mari on 02-Jun-2001

tnx i will try


#2091: Simple Problem, please help!
Simple Problem, please help!

(2091)

Submitted by: Mark Hiscock on 02-Jun-2001

Hi,

I'm writing out a drum score and i'm trying to achieve the following in NWC 1.7...

_ _ _
| | | |
X X X X

X X
| |
-

But I can't seem to beam the kick drum notes (the two notes with stems down) as well as the high hat notes (with the stems going up)

Is there a way to do this? I figure there must be...

Many thanks,

Mark Hiscock

Reply 1 offered by: Mark Hiscock on 02-Jun-2001

Hmmm, the spacing has screwed up with my notes..... just going to try that again.....

_ _ _
| | | |
x x x x

x x
| |
-

cheers.....

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 02-Jun-2001

I can't answer your question, but in case you didn't know, it is possible to put X-heads into NWC in many circumstances. Here is the URL for the technique:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/misc/bangerfont.htm

This was first posted almost two months ago.

Reply 3 offered by: Mark Hiscock on 03-Jun-2001

Hi Robert,

Thanks for your reply. I've only yesterday found out about NWC and this forum so i'm a complete newbie when it come to NWC.

Cheers for the tip but I only used x's as I say no other way of representing a note.

The original problem still stands!

Many Thanks,

mark.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Eidson on 03-Jun-2001

I think staff layering is what you are asking for. Noteworthy does not directly support two groups of beamed noted on top of each other, but there IS a solution:

1)Write your top line of notes out as you normally would, making sure all of the stems are up (highlight all of the staves and click the stem up button)

2)Create a new staff and write the second line that should go under #1, making sure all of the stems are down.

3)Click on File / Page Setup / Contents tab -- select the "Allow Layering" checkbox, click "OK"

4)Click on staff number one, go to Staff / Staff Properties (or just hit F2) and click the Visual tab

5)Click the "Layer with next staff" checkbox and hit "OK"

6)Your notes are now beamed together on the top and bottom. They are not permantly together, you can separate the staves again by clicking on staff #1, going to staff properties and uncheck the "layer..." checkbox. If there are any rests in either line, you might need to move them up or down to get the correct look for the music.

Let me know if this works for you :)
-j

Reply 5 offered by: Joe on 03-Jun-2001

(there should be an edit button on these forums...)

my step #1 should say "(highlight all of the notes on the first staff and click the stem up button)"

repeat this step for the downstem notes, but clicking the
stem down button


#2092: missing staves after first "page"
missing staves after first "page"

(2092)

Submitted by: Mari on 03-Jun-2001

wow this is great...but without changing anything as far as setup of this piece goes, by the time I got to the "2nd" page worth of music, suddenly, all the bottom staves are missing from 4 th & 5th pages and by the 2nd page, even a right hand staff disappeared. I save every few minutes, so what else could I be doing wrong? I am novice and quite frankly, only throw bars in to keep down the confusion when playing back a piece to see if right and left hand notes align as melody. I have tried not to tamper with anything fundamental. Please, I have a deadline and must now sleep before churchbells start ringing...You are all quite wonderful to be helping like this. My first problem was answered within minutes...thank my God for fellow insomniacs

Reply 1 offered by: Joy Byford on 03-Jun-2001

I think the biggest clue to your problem is where you said you 'only throw bars in to keep down the confusion when playing back a piece'. If the bar lines do not align across all staves I think you will find that staves cannot be shown as NWC does not know where to position the notes in relation to other staves. Try inserting all the bar lines to see if this solves your problem.

Reply 2 offered by: Mari on 07-Jun-2001

That was an understatement, of course, I am putting in rests as I go along...but calculating the exact rests to fill in between varying notes of the left hand piano staff to match exactly up with exact note desired of the right hand staff, all within measured bars.....come on! Why isn't there an automatic fill in of what-ever you tell it to fill in, in other staves you select to have fill ins, to match up with the active staff that is being written into? And if there is, what do you call that and how do you do it? I have written, gotten wrong, rewrote and got nearly right except for a few bars missing a few beats and because they were on my screen but wouldn't show in the print preview, I went back in and tried to rewrite some more and now I have about 5 completely messed up and only a little bit right versions of the same song. This was supposed to have been done a week ago for a pianist and 6 singers singing 3 part harmony, but at this rate, it'll be me singing alone ...from memory

Reply 3 offered by: Mari on 09-Jun-2001

Okay, it's fixed....after 3 days, finally, when all was good up to the last 2 bars which wouldn't line up for anything...I play and replay until I noticed that the 2nd to last notes may have, when highlighting automatically as playing, been just a hair out of sync, I changed the value of the lagging one by switching around some others values and their closest rests' values, which amounted to the difference of a 32nd of a beat, and then, it all lined up and now prints just as it is AND WAS showing all along in the work area window. a 32nd! And this error was creating about a 6 inch difference in the preprint view of the last 2 bars! But, it's fixed and now I will know to go right to that close inspection of the highlighting when playing to locate any possible errors. Thanks for the help


#2093: Bad MIDI files
Bad MIDI files

(2093)

Submitted by: FranMan on 03-Jun-2001

No, they usually don't sound bad, but they always come out as music with really weird tie combinations like a doted sixtyfourth tied to a thirtysecond. In the MIDI of greatest love of all, it seems that the more you decrease the not and rest values the MIDI file only becomes worse instead of better. Is there any hope for these MIDI files?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 03-Jun-2001

This was probably done by the MIDI author to prevent a sort of 'reverse engineering' to the song. I use the technique for all of my compositions on the rare chance that someone might want to take my material ;) You can create MIDI's like this by adding a doubly-dotted 32nd note rest (or other strange combination) to every staff in the beginning of the piece.

The answer to your question is that it's very hard to import MIDI files with this technique and not have to do heavy editing. Either that or you have a song that uses triplets - NWC does not support direct importing of triplets.
-j


#2094: Text  - SATB and Piano brackets
Text  - SATB and Piano brackets

(2094)

Submitted by: Walt on 05-Jun-2001

Can someone help me with a problem entering text. I would like to print out a piece for chorus. For the first appearance of each part I'd like those parts identified. How do I put an S before the soprano part, an A before alto, etc., and the word Piano before the piano accompaniment? Also, how do I get brackets around the piano part? After the first line, I'd like SATB and Piano to disappear.

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 06-Jun-2001

This is mostly under Staff Properties. Select your staff and choose Staff -> Properties. Under the "General" TAB enter the name, say "Soprano" or "S". You may also want to change the group, say "Voices".

For your piano part, as well as the name and group, go to the "Visual" tab and select style "Upper Grand Staff" for the right hand and "Lower Grand Staff" for the left hand. This will give you the brackets. Note that you can't not have a name for a staff, so you will probably have to label them "Piano RH" and "Piano LH" and live with two labels.

Placement of labels is controlled by File -> PageSetup. Under the "Options" tab you will find "Staff Labels". Choose "First System" to make the label appear once.

Reply 2 offered by: Walt on 06-Jun-2001

Thanks, John, for the information.


#2095: where can i get prg patches?
where can i get prg patches?

(2095)

Submitted by: Morph3 on 05-Jun-2001

hi,

i downloaded wavmaker to try to convert a midi file into a wav file to burn it to a cd, but when WM checked it's instruments it said it was missing a 0.prg patch file and didn't covert it. i've already searched for existing prg files to save but i found nothing. so where can i get these prg files?

ps- if you have the file i'm missing could you please email it to me?

Reply 1 offered by: Tyson on 17-Aug-2001

I am also looking for a place to download PRGs from. Any help would be appreciated.
E-mail if you have a good web site.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 18-Aug-2001

Have you tried !www.polyhedric.com/software/wavmaker/ ?

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 18-Aug-2001

Oops! http://www.polyhedric.com/software/wavmaker/

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 18-Aug-2001

Okay, so they're not answering.
How about you look at
http://www.google.com/search?q=wavmaker
and go from there?

A

Reply 5 offered by: Gary on 23-Nov-2001

Problem is, once you've managed to find some PRG patches to download, where are you going to find the Wav files that the patches refer to?


#2096: Auto Rest Fill-in Command Available?
Auto Rest Fill-in Command Available?

(2096)

Submitted by: Mari on 06-Jun-2001

Is there a command that will fill-in the other bars I specify (in other staves) automatically with the correct measure of rests as I am writing in the notes for the active stave? If not...oh, PLEASE MAKE ONE SOON or there is no hope that I can write a song in under 6 months, if I have to keep going back and figuring out where I need another 1/8th or 1/16th rest or if I need another bar to fill in up to the next chord I give to the left hand or whatever!!!!! Can anyone relate or is everyone out there mathematic or musical genii?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 07-Jun-2001

Conforming with accepted 20th century practice, Noteworthy usually recognizes the whole rest as having any value that fills up an entire measure, regardless of time signature. The only time I've encountered any different behavior is if you are using mixed meter (alternating 6/8 and 4/8 for example, but only writing it once at the beginning).

You might not have a complete measure, or have too many beats if you have to constantly calculate eighth notes.
-j

Disclaimer: I realize that "accepted 20th century practice" could be interpreted as an oxymoron. I was referring to Gardner Read's notation manual and it's treatment of whole rests.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 07-Jun-2001

If all else fails, you can add tiny rests (e.g. 32nds) until the measure is filled up. It will be obvious when this happens because the bar lines will align perfectly. Then go back and consolidate the tiny rests into larger durations (2 32nds into a 16th, 2 16ths into an 8th, etc.)

Reply 3 offered by: Mari on 07-Jun-2001

YOU'RE SO SWEET! I just love this software company and this terrific forum....and ya, like, that is what I'm doing with the little rests and going back and making bigger rests, like a pac-man game in slow motion, or in a bad dream and that's when it occurred to me how logical an auto-feature would be, unless you like pacman in slow motion or don't have deadlines.....and incidentally, I really didn't sign any specific time to this song, it's like, another thing I could care less about, as it appears to be redundant when I plan on telling the music how long to hold each note and there's no percussion to the piece. Hey, I am just the voice of ignorant objectivity here giving some program developer an idea of how to earn her/his bread this month...but that's another subject I know not of....God bless you all and please pray for me, I have no idea why God would give me this job, have to fight to write it in the first place, fight for time on the program to perform it, lose out for a whole year and now fight again for time to perform it and find out that I have to write it for real from out of my head onto paper that a real pianist can play but all the singers only sing from ear and they all need a tape of just their part which I dearly hoped NWC could do for me once I got all 3 voices written besides piano.....I believe that song-writers should earn tons of money...this is hard

Reply 4 offered by: John Kavanagh on 12-Jun-2001

You've probably figured this out already, but if you do each voice on its own staff, it'll be easy to get a tape of each part separately. Either highlight the part you need and paste it into a new file, or save the whole score with a new name and delete all the parts except the one you want, thne go back to the original version and repeat this for each part... Then play that part and tape it. And, having broken my heart this way once, make sure you save a backup copy of the whole score before you start deleing things. And don't forget that Ctrl+Z will undo almost anything.

Reply 5 offered by: Joy Byford on 12-Jun-2001

Further to the previous reply (no 4) there is no need to delete staves to produce a tape of an individual part. You can use the Mute facility to mute any number of staves, just playing one at a time, or any combination you want. In my opinion this is one of the most useful NWC features - I will often enter a whole piece into NWC just so that I can hear 'my' part on its own, then when I get more practised I can mute 'my' part, play the other parts and try to sing along.


#2097: NWC on disk
NWC on disk

(2097)

Submitted by: FranMan on 07-Jun-2001

I know you are supposed to distribute NWC in the compressed form, but would it be OK if I gave an unregistered copy to a friend uncompressed on a disk so she could just pop it in and go? If so, what files MUST be included if not all of them can fit on a floppy?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 07-Jun-2001

Go to NWC's Download page and get nwcsetup.exe (or nwcset16.exe for Win3.x) or copy the corresponding file from the CD. That's all you need, it's a self-extracting install program that creates all the necessary files.

Then get the appropriate web service pack to bring it up to date.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Jun-2001

You can share the evaluation download of the NWC setup program as indicated by Fred. This is the correct way to do it.

Reply 3 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 08-Jun-2001

If you are asking if you can run the program straight from a disk without installing, I'm not sure if that is possible. You may wish to have a confirmation from NoteWorthy themselves, but I believe the installation involves creating an entry in the registry. If so, then running NWC from disk may not be possible.

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 08-Jun-2001

It's possible if you have all the needed files on the disk, but what I was trying to ask is if it is OK to give it to some one that way so that s/he does not have to install it. (I would NOT include my registration number.)

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Jun-2001

I don't see why it wouldn't run from floppy, the registry entries are AFAICT only for the file association and the uninstall data. (There's also a DDE entry, which I know nothing about, but I don't think it's vital.)

However, you'd need nwcv15.ttf installed as an available font, so it hardly seems worth the trouble. Especially since disk operations to/from hard drive are so much faster.


#2098: Mid files
Mid files

(2098)

Submitted by: Jose Fernandes de Assis on 07-Jun-2001

Hello,

Excuse me. I want to transform audio file in mid file. It's not a problem with NWC, but I need to transform instrumental
files in file.mid to my keyboard Yamaha. I know to to do using programs form MP3 and WAV.file, but I don't know how to transform audio in mid file. Is there any program where I can do this?

José Fernandes de Assis

Reply 1 offered by: Jubal Baca on 13-Jun-2001

Hola José:

Te escribo desde Tucumán (uno de los estados de la Rep. Argentina). En la red, hay varios programas que realizan (al menos eso dicen) la transformación WAV --> MIDI.Todavía no he probado si realmente funciona, pero he bajado de la red el programa: WAV2MIDI , el cual no es muy grande. Por lo que se encuentra en la red, los que lo han probado dicen que funciona bastante bien. También he encontrado un programa que permite al PC "oir" la música grabada en un casset (o disco de pasta) y grabarlo como MIDI. Si te interesa, podría buscarlo para darte más detalles. Lo que he visto muchos programas para convertir WAV --> MP3, pero no le he prestado atención porque es un tema que no me interesa (por ahora).

chau...chau... y suerte... Jubal


#2099: EMAIL my music to a non-nwc email person
EMAIL my music to a non-nwc email person

(2099)

Submitted by: Mari on 09-Jun-2001

I am downloading a separate NW Player file. Is that all I need to email, plus the file which contains my music, to allow a recipient of both emails to play the music? Does player "record" or save the file for them to play repeatedly? Are there instructions on how to play & save the music contained within Players files for the recipient to follow?

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 09-Jun-2001

NWP will PLAY any NWC flie on any machine, but the file cannot be changed using NWP, amd e=mailing both the player and the file may take a long time to send and receive. If you want the other person to listen to your music (without a picture of it), turn it into a midi file.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Jun-2001

If you send an NWC file to someone else, your recipients will need to have installed any one of the following on their computer to hear it:

- Winamp and the NWC plug-in (hear it only)
- NoteWorthy Player (sight and sound)
- Browser Plug-in (sight, sound, and print)
- NoteWorthy Composer (sight, sound, print, and edit, but costs money after 30 days)

You don't need to e-mail any of these. You can just link to our site.


#2100: It's done!
It's done!

(2100)

Submitted by: Mari on 09-Jun-2001

Finally! And believe it or not, this song has been written, and plays back to me! Now, I want to make separate staves for each of 3 part harmony, and record each part separately for the singers to learn from, providing I can send them the song by email....again, a deadline is upon us (me) Is there a shortcut to grabbing just the notes that I want out of each chord and copying to a new staff?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 09-Jun-2001

I use the standard Windows keyboard shortcuts: CNTL-C to copy, CNTL-V to paste, CNTL-X to cut. Oh yes, and CNTL-Z to undo. ;-)

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Jun-2001

> grabbing just the notes that I want out of each chord and copying to a new staff?

There is no way to automatically remove single members of a chord in NWC.

Reply 3 offered by: Blair Dowden on 11-Jun-2001

You should have written the song using staff layering, with one layer per voice. Now, the best thing to do is create two more layers (staves), copy the entire first staff into the other layers, then delete the unwanted notes by hand. Yes, this last part is painful, but there is no way around it.


#2101: xg patch/bank list
xg patch/bank list

(2101)

Submitted by: Louie on 10-Jun-2001

Does anybody know if there is a complete patch/bank and drum list for Yamaha XG50 available on the internet?

thanks, Louie.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jun-2001

If it isn't here, it probably doesn't exist:

http://www2.yamaha.co.jp/manual/english/index.html

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jun-2001

PS - it might be similar enough to the DB50XG to make use of the XG files at the Scriptorium:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#NWCFiles

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 10-Jun-2001

Louie,

Reply to my Address and I'll post you the list.


#2102: "passing notes"
"passing notes"

(2102)

Submitted by: Graham Howe on 11-Jun-2001

Does anyone know of a way to score passing notes when they occur in the middle of a chord (rather than at the top or bottom)?

Reply 1 offered by: John Kavanagh on 12-Jun-2001

You mean if you had, say, a half note above and below moving quarters on the same staff? You get that a lot in guitar music and sometimes keyboard... I do it by layering staves -
copy the entire part onto a new staff below it, then change the lower staff to the lower held notes you want and put the moving part and the upper notes on the upper staff. Then layer the parts.

If it's only one note in an entire piece and you really don't want the extra staff, you could draw a note or two in as a text expression using the NWC15 font as one of your user fonts, but you won't hear those notes on playback.


#2103: Chord Names
Chord Names

(2103)

Submitted by: Tillong on 11-Jun-2001

How do I write the chord Name above a chord? Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 12-Jun-2001

Enter the chords as Text objects.
Use # for sharps and b for flats.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jun-2001

See msg #1197, msg #165, and msg #1478.


#2104: emailing glitch
emailing glitch

(2104)

Submitted by: John Kavanagh on 12-Jun-2001

Since I upgraded to version 1.7, emailed files are all arriving corrupted and unreadable. I'm using Eudora Light on Win 3.1 and an old but usually reliable 386. I tried sending the files compressed, uncompressed, and even as MIDI, but no go.

Anyone have similar problems? Should I try relaoding the program?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Jun-2001

This has nothing to do with installing NoteWorthy Composer. You have a problem elsewhere in your system.

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 12-Jun-2001

E-mail on a 386? I didn't even though it was possible. Can you set up our old computer, too? :)

Reply 3 offered by: John Kavanagh on 13-Jun-2001

The thing is, it's worked for years with the same system and the only thing that's changed is the version of the program.
What I can't be sure of is if I sent anything successfully since reinstalling - no Noteworthy attachment comes through readable, but everything else is the same as ever. I thought it might have something to do with compression, since I've noticed that when I re-save an old file, it often gets much smaller.

Reply 4 offered by: John Kavanagh on 13-Jun-2001

And as far as my trusty 386 goes, I'm lucky enough to have a local server that still supports caveman technology. It's a little slow for net surfing, but email's no problem, and until recently I sent NWC files back and forth to my office computer (the one with the good printer) fairly often. Now I have to use discs :-(

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 13-Jun-2001

Well, it's true that newer version of NWC use compressed NWC files by default. However, in all versions, NWC files are binary. The compressed files are more vulnerable to corruption, in the sense that it is harder to recover from a corruption when it occurs. There is no reason, however, for new NWC files to be more likely to become corrupt.

You need to figure out whether your mail system is corrupting all binary files, or just NWC files. Try ZIPping your NWC files and e-mailing them.

If they unzip successfully, then you have your answer. Your mail system may not be preserving the binary nature of NWC files, but is able to preserve other binary types. Look for an option to send NWC files as binary files.

If ZIP files also fail, then your mail system may have become prone to corrupt files.

Reply 6 offered by: John Kavanagh on 15-Jun-2001

Aha. I've figured it out, thanks to the suggestions in your second post, and I post this in case anyone else has a similar problem. It was, as you say, nothing to do with Noteworthy at all.

It was my email program, Eudora. There is an option on it to toggle between sending files in MIME or bin/hex format, and someone (it may have been me) had been playing with the settings and changed it to bin/hex. I switched it back to MIME, and emailed files are just fine. The only change with the new version is the intended good one that the files are smaller and thus transmit faster.

Thanks for your help.


#2105: Font file
Font file

(2105)

Submitted by: Kaz on 13-Jun-2001

How can I get the font file 'NWC extra oranaments v3' which appears on the song file from User's Music Pages?

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 14-Jun-2001

Go to the user tips section of this website (a link is found on the home page for NoteWorthy Composer) and click on the first link you see there.

Reply 2 offered by: Kaz on 14-Jun-2001

I got it. Thanks Fran.


#2106: Yamaha PSS-780 MIDI problems
Yamaha PSS-780 MIDI problems

(2106)

Submitted by: Tim Lux on 14-Jun-2001

I'm trying to hook up my ancient PSS-780 to Cakewalk but despite trying everything I know simply can't get the MIDI stuff working. Anyone have any clues please before I throw the thing out of the nearest window ?????

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 14-Jun-2001

Considering that this is a forum for NoteWorthy Composer, you may not get too much help with Cakewalk. That being said, the most common problem when connecting external keyboards is confusion about midi cables. The cable marked IN has to connect to your keyboard's midi OUT, and the cable marked OUT connects to your keyboard's midi IN.

If this doesn't help, hold off on tossing that Yamaha out the window until one of us can get there to catch it. :)

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Tim Lux on 14-Jun-2001

I know its a forum on NoteWorthy, but someone out there probably uses Cakewalk as well - its worth a shot ! I've checked the cables, still no go. Is there an ancient PSS specific driver needed ?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 14-Jun-2001

> Is there an ancient PSS specific driver needed ?

Probably not, midi is midi. Did you set your midi playback device to "External midi" or whatever your sound card calls the joystick/midi port? Same for midi input device. Does it work in Noteworthy?

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Robin Withey on 15-Jun-2001

I use a PSS 780, and I have no problems with MIDI connections in most programs - I haven't tried Cakewalk, though.

Does the keyboard work with other programs? If not, check that you are using the MPU-401 compatible device (i.e. check that it's installed and working). If it does, there's obviously some configuration problem with Cakewalk - RYFM!

Robin

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jun-2001

I doubt that it is a problem specific to Cakewalk. There are lots of threads here to help you with setting up external MIDI. You should start by working to get MIDI output from your computer to your MIDI keyboard to work. Until this works, you cannot expect MIDI input to the computer to work. You have left out one of the most important parts of the equation. What kind of hardware are you using to connect MIDI cables to your computer? Are you using a soundcard joystick port, a SoundBlaster Live!Drive front panel, a USB MIDI box, a serial "To Host" connection, or something else?

Here are some threads that also deal with this topic:

msg #421 (reply 12), msg #896, msg #1023, msg #1971, 1102, msg #1911

Reply 6 offered by: bass on 20-Aug-2001

just wanted to know if you got your pss 780 working.i am trying myself to get my pss 780 running midi.im running the 1024 soundblaster but im getting no midi sound at all.

Reply 7 offered by: Tim Lux on 27-Aug-2001

I couldn't get it to work with either Noteworthy or Cakewalk. However I did get it to work with Logic Fun, a freebie with a computer mag !! Wierd. Not a bad programme either.

Reply 8 offered by: David Palmquist on 09-Sep-2001

Trying to understand MIDI files and hardware? I just came across a good site which is easy to follow. It's at http://www.northwestern.edu/musicschool/links/projects/midi/pages/whatmidi.html

I'd explore all the links, I think (I've just come to the page so haven't done that yet)

Reply 9 offered by: Paul on 05-Dec-2001

I can get a fee out from the computer to the pss-780 but not the pss-780 to computer I am usin voyetra Midi orchestra. Can any one please help me A new user to Midi recording. Am using a midi din cables.

Thank you in advance!!


#2107: Mordents
Mordents

(2107)

Submitted by: Paul on 16-Jun-2001

When I want to add trills, tremolos, etc. to a score, I can use the boxmarks fonts. But I can't find the "mordent"-sign in these fonts.

Does anyone know which font I have to use, for adding a mordent to a score?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 16-Jun-2001

There are two forms of turns at 'r' and 's' in Boxmarks - are these not what you want?
If not make a request to Marsu in this forum.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul on 17-Jun-2001

Thanks Barry,

But the musical symbol I need looks almost like this: ~|~ (It's the boxmarks sort trill symbol at 'i', but then with a vertical line in the middle of it).

Dear Marsu, do you know where I can find the symbol I need?

Reply 3 offered by: Michael W. Powell on 17-Jun-2001

The symbol you're looking for can be found in the nworn.tff font file. You will need the nworn.zip file. It can be found at User Tips.

Reply 4 offered by: Paul on 18-Jun-2001

Thank you Michael, I've found it. (nworn3.ttf=>Shift+M)

Reply 5 offered by: John Kavanagh on 29-Jun-2001

It's in the Bach font, too. You can get that from the same link, and it has all the elements you need for the fussiest of ornament signs.


#2108: Lead Sheet
Lead Sheet

(2108)

Submitted by: Bert on 19-Jun-2001

Can anyone help me with the chord progression of a certain song. I have TRIED & TRIED myself and can't figure the progression. I have an MP3 file of the song. Can anyone tell me the chord progression by listening to the song. I will be ETERNALLY grateful for your help. Thanx

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 19-Jun-2001

If you give us the name of the song, someone might already know the progression. :)

Reply 2 offered by: Bert on 19-Jun-2001

Thanx Joe, but this song is prob. too obscure for ANYONE......'YOUR MISTER MISSES YOU' by MAZZ, a south of the border down mexico way Tex-Mex flavored popster.

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 19-Jun-2001

I know that this sofeware isn't very good, but have you tryed a Wav to MIDI program.

Reply 4 offered by: Bert on 20-Jun-2001

Thank you FranMan......I have not even heard of a wav to midi file converter.....can you supply a URL or software program name that does this???

Reply 5 offered by: Joe Music on 20-Jun-2001

Oh nooooooooooo..... Not again!..... :(

Reply 6 offered by: Robin Withey on 20-Jun-2001

Given the somewhat erratic nature of such programs (i.e. they don't work!), and the fact that they have been discussed to death on this forum, a possible alternative, assuming you are reasonably well-schooled in music (in other words, better than me!), is a program called Transcribe.
It's a shareware program, available from http://www.seventhstring.demon.co.uk
What this does is basically read in a WAV file and allow you to look at a frequency analysis of parts of the sound, showing you the notes that make up the sound. As I say, I can't make any claims for it, as my musical knowledge is fairly limited, and I've only played with it, but you might find it useful.

Reply 7 offered by: FranMan on 21-Jun-2001

If find that very interesting. If transcribe can do that, then why can't there be a Wave to MIDI program based on this technology that just goes one step further: It also writes music for the notes heard. And Joe, I'm sorry I brought up wave to MIDI, but I couldn't help it!

Reply 8 offered by: Bert on 21-Jun-2001

THANK YOU ROBIN,

Yes, transcribe is EXACTLY what I have been searching for. You simply load a .wav OR .mp3 file...then select a portion of the file and the program will show you the most prominent frenquencies matched against a keyboard showing you the corresponding notes that are being played. I have only used this program for approx. 2 hours and was able to transcribe several measures.....melody notes AND chords.!!!
Program is very highly recommended......Thank you again Robin for leading me to it.

Reply 9 offered by: Joe Music on 21-Jun-2001

Mathematically analyzing a WAV file to find the various frequencies is a well-established technology. Although I haven't looked at the particular program mentioned, based on its description it seems likely to work well.

But instrument tonality and dynamics - as needed by MIDI - are not easily reconstructed from frequency components.

Reply 10 offered by: FranMan on 21-Jun-2001

I would rather just have the notes all pushed together as a piano part than have a program that does nothing at all. BTW how big is transcribe expanded?

Reply 11 offered by: Bert on 21-Jun-2001

FranMan, The exe file is only 611K with just a handful of smaller files. You can use it for 30 days (no handicap) thence they want $30 big ones. I'll buy it for sure.

Reply 12 offered by: Joe Music on 22-Jun-2001

Although I don't need the "Transcribe" program, I took a look at it, and compared it to the scientific program that I would use if I ever had to do that. (The scientific program does not have a music-oriented interface.)

"Transcribe" looks pretty good for its intended purpose. I tried it on some files of piano music that I had. If your WAV or MP3 file -- or a section thereof -- consists of reasonably well-defined notes from a musical instrument, it can help you identify notes and chords. But the user must have some knowledge of musical tonality, in order to distinguish the fundamental note(s) from harmonics. The program does NOT "convert WAV to MIDI" nor does it claim to do so. If the music is polyphonic, non-operatic singing, percussion, or sound effects, then you are out of luck.


#2109: Overture 1812 criticism
Overture 1812 criticism

(2109)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 19-Jun-2001

A while back, there was a thread regarding the words to the chorus parts in Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture. (If you didn't know there were words, you haven't been paying attention!)

I looked around for a reference giving the original words, but didn't find one authoritative enough. However, I did come across this commentary, in "The Music of Tchaikovsky," by Gerald Abraham (New York: Norton, 1946) page 95:

"1812 must be one of the most dreary and repulsive works in the whole of music. ... What makes us unable to call it anything but noisy, vulgar, and empty, is just the actual material used: a hotchpotch of a Russian liturgical theme (bravely demoded from Locrian to diatonic major), ... "

Take that, Peter Ilyich!


#2110: Does anyone know how to notate a "pickslide?"
Does anyone know how to notate a "pickslide?"

(2110)

Submitted by: Blinkman on 20-Jun-2001

I am an avid user of this program, and for a few bands, I compose music...and I realized that of the few tracks I have, none of them contain pickslides (if you are a guitar player, or are into punk and rock...you should know what I'm talking about), and they would sound good...so if anyone could tell me exactly how to make one and implement one, or at least what I should try to do...

Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 20-Jun-2001

If you just want the look of a pick slide, download one of the extra fonts for NWC (sorry, I don't know the URL's off the top of my head). Check the Scriptorium or the User Tips pages for the fonts. You could just insert a note (using the font) with an x notehead and manually draw the wavy multiple-glissando lines after you print the music.

Reply 2 offered by: Blinkman on 20-Jun-2001

Thanks...I am also kind of looking for the sound as well, just wondering how in the world I could make it sound like a pickslide...and the track (or so I call them) that I am working on really, REALLY could use it. Oh well, thanks a lot for your help...now, a Scriptorium? Okay, I'll go for it.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Eidson on 20-Jun-2001

Here is the scriptorium:

http://www.vadu.com/nwc/

As for the sound, I usually just put in a descending scale of notes going from middle range to lower than the normal range of the guitar -- depending on your tempo it could be a string of 16th notes or 64ths... just make the scale the duration of the pick slide. This will not give the *exact* sound, but it's better than silence!

Reply 4 offered by: Aaron Mills on 07-Aug-2001

Here is how I mimic pick scratches, scrapes, and slides...

Depending on the duration of the slide, and the tempo of the song, I usually subdivide the beat into sextuplets or thirtysecond notes, for example a pick slide written as a half note i would just insert random descending notes, maybe 12 tripleted-sixteenth notes or just 8 16th notes, making sure to slur them together so playback is smoother...
Then you insert an instrument patch (shortcut key - i) on the staff just before the notes. Change the instrument to the 'Guitar Fret Noise' midi instrument, and then insert another instrument patch right after the notes, changing it back to 'Distorted Guitar', or whatever...
Try that, and experiment to find the sound you want.
I usually change the register of the notes, and make them extremely low-pitched, because the midi playback, for me, sounds kinda silly and 'twangy' if not, but it all depends on the material and the context of the song...so experiment.
Hope this helps.


#2111: Deleting Text & Creating New Unconnected Staves
Deleting Text & Creating New Unconnected Staves

(2111)

Submitted by: Jared S. on 20-Jun-2001

How do you delete or edit text after you already put it on the music? (without deleting notes of course). And also, how do you create a new staff line with out connecting them. For example, how would you put 2 pieces on 1 page? Sort of like a paragraph ending.

Reply 1 offered by: Joy Byford on 20-Jun-2001

To the left of the text will be a small diamond. This is a kind of 'handle' for the text so you should highlight this then press Cntl-E to edit the text expression.
As for the printing of two pieces on one page, as far as I know this is not possible within NWC. However it can be done by printing the first file as normal, measuring on the paper how far down it comes to, setting the upper margin (within print setup) to this figure, then printing the second file. This is a procedure I use regularly - its a bit fiddly but it works!

Reply 2 offered by: Jared S. on 20-Jun-2001

I tried ctrl+e and it didn't work.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 20-Jun-2001

How I edit text is (1) Highlight the gray (grey) diamond, right-click, choose "properties." The rest is self-explanatory. I do the right-click method because NWC usually provides context-sensitive pop-up menus.

As for the two unrelated staves: You can make placeable metafiles (File:Print Preview:Copy:placeable WMF) that can be independently inserted into a word processing document as scalable images. However, inserting a WMF may cause it to expand to fit available space, so there may be some inconsistency in the relative sizes, if you don't pay attention.


#2112: Roll Markings, "X" notes, Glissandos, Trills.
Roll Markings, "X" notes, Glissandos, Trills.

(2112)

Submitted by: Jared S. on 20-Jun-2001

Does anyonw know how to insert roll markings (for a cymbal, marimba, drum, etc.), "x" notes for non-melodic instruments (triangles, cymbals, temple blocks), glissando notes, and/or trills? I'm trying to publish an individual part from a percussion score and I don't know how to insert those marks with NoteWorthy.

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 21-Jun-2001

If all the heads can be drum heads, then go to http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/misc/banger.zip . This will download banger by Robert Allgeyer. Then create your music whithout X heads. If you have installed you font on your system, you are ready to go. Go to start:run and type in edit and the FULL path of your new creation. One everything is loaded, you can go under the search menu and choose replace. In the find box type in NWCV15 and in the other box type Banger. Close and save, and your piece will now open with drum heads. Glisandos and trills are (I think) in the font Boxmarks you can use this link --> http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ftp/helpful/boxmarks.zip Good luck. As far as I know we don't have any roll marks yet....

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Eidson on 21-Jun-2001

If by roll marks you mean this symbol:

/
/
/

(sorta) under/over/on the stem of/ a note, there is a symbol like that in the boxmarks font.


#2113: Long Measure Rests
Long Measure Rests

(2113)

Submitted by: Jared S. on 20-Jun-2001

How do you insert long measure rests and specify how long they are to be?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 20-Jun-2001

There's no direct support for this in NWC. However, you can use inserted text in the Boxmarks font to simulate such rests.

If you don't have Boxmarks already, you can download it from the "helpful files" section of the NWC Scriptorium. The file boxmarks.zip contains the font file itself, directions for installing it and using it in NWC, and a .NWC file that demonstrates the character mappings. The specific text equivalent for the multi-bar rest is [n], where n is the number of measures.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 20-Jun-2001

My memory was playing tricks on me. It's the "Useful Files" section, not "helpful files".

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 21-Jun-2001

They only problem with that font is that the rests don't look right. There should be a continous bar with the count over it. So you would then want the numbers to be raised and with a bar under them. It would also be helpful to have a character that is a continuation of the bar since 3 measures should be visually longer than two. Are these comments for Marsu?

Reply 4 offered by: John Kavanagh on 21-Jun-2001

Here's what I do: put a rest in a bar, then highlight it and change the visibility to "never". Copy and paste that bar and the (visible) bar line until you have the number of bars you want. If you're using the option for longer space for longer note values, you may then want to change the rests to all quarter or eighth note rests(if it's not a playing part), by highlighting them all and pressing 3 or 4. Then set up Boxmarks as one of your user fonts and put [4] for a 4 measure rest, position -2 and with the text centred. Check the print preview box and fiddle with it, you may have to change the font size or turn the "preserve width" option on or off, but you can create a very professional-looking printed part this way.

Reply 5 offered by: John Kavanagh on 21-Jun-2001

I meant "invisible" bar line.
sorry.

Reply 6 offered by: FranMan on 21-Jun-2001

I don't think I get it, the number still cuts trough the bar of the compressed rests. Maybe I didn't explain this well before, but any professional music that you look at will have the number over the compressed rest sign. This way it goes through the compressed rest.

Reply 7 offered by: J.J.S. on 21-Jun-2001

The boxmarks.nwc sample demonstrates how to use the multi rest.

Reply 8 offered by: Kaz on 21-Jun-2001

I usually use '-'(minus) with 48 point user defined font instead of boxmark.
Of course the text denoting bar numbers should be added.
I prefer this simplicity rather than boxmark's.

Reply 9 offered by: Barry Graham on 21-Jun-2001

Well - I was a "professional" copyist in the 70's and the broken bar with the measure number within the break was and still is standard with most copyists working from contemporary scores. (At least on this little island).
It's neater and easier to do when copying manually.

While this might not be the standard for "old" classical works it was what I adopted for Boxmarks (which was written for my use - with suggested additions).
There is a problem if you want one continuous "bar" mark since it will be of limited width. With two halves it's possible to pad the break with spaces to change the overall width.

You can still do what you want to do - the thickness of the "bar" should be the same as the thickness of a whole measure rest - from memory this would close up the gap and then you can place the number above the "bar" with text of your choice.
The broken "bar" is easier to use since it places all elements at the same text position vertically.
(ie - one line of text entry).
The measure numbers were added to the font following a user request to make this possible.
But it's your choice.
I'm sorry if this does not suit your needs but I no longer service this font - please direct your request to Marsu.

Reply 10 offered by: kidman on 22-Jun-2001

ummmmmmm... WHAT?!

The average user doesn't want to download and try and patch things to get basic music notation in their piece? Correct me if I'm wrong, but Noteworthy Composer seems to be designed for IT personnel, not the musician or composer?!

I just can't grasp that all these extra things are grafted on to the software. Doesn't make sense? How many other users dislike this system? How many potential customers are going to buy if they knew this difficulty? When is Noteworthy going to be complete? ie. all the necessary things users have applied actually get put IN THE SOFTWARE! LOL! no offence, but that's wierd.

what do you think about it?
what does their programmer think about it?
(don't delete this post please, I have a copy.)

kd

Reply 11 offered by: John Gillings on 22-Jun-2001

kd,

Software development is a strange thing. Everyone wants everything YESTERDAY and for nothing. It's just not always possible. Yes multi bar rests is a popular wish list item. I've put it in the wish list myself at least twice. However, things take a while to get to the top of the list and get implemented. There is also the question of how they work in a manner that does not restrict usage. For example, should ALL multiple bars be automatically collapsed? What if I want to keep a few single bar rests as written? What if I want to break them into 8 bar blocks? This is NOT trivial. You also need to consider what is happening on other staffs. Should multi bar rests be ignored or "rationalised" across all staffs.

I'd prefer to wait until the software developers get it right than demand they rush through something that might impose unnecessary limitations.

I believe the most recent version of Noteworthy now a very obvious way to implement multi bar rests in a simple and flexible manner - using bar line properties. By marking a specific bar line as the "start of multi bar rest" and another as "end of multi bar rest" this should provide the user a means for specifying precisely what they want. Maximum flexibility and a simple interface.

Remember that Noteworthy is very inexpensive - TANSTAAFL. There are plenty of other music notation programs which have more features, but you have to pay the price. Not just in money, but also in complexity of the interface. In the mean time, we can make do with hacks like Barry's Boxmarks font. I'm sure Barry be too offended if I say they are a bit clumsy and cumbersome, but at least we can get the desired result with a bit of extra effort. That's it's POSSIBLE to "graft" things on is a credit to the way Noteworthy is structured. Generality and flexibility!

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Jun-2001

No offence taken John.
It was simply a workaround I needed that grew (illogically) with user requests.
If I was to start from scratch again it might make more sense.
Like you I have cast many items into the wish list well - still waiting for my bucket to come up.
Perhaps my wishes for a more comprehensive notation package don't match the requirements of the majority of the users.
Perhaps version 2 - in the meantime I draw my water elsewhere.

Reply 13 offered by: Ann Macfarlane on 29-Jun-2001

I've been writing out interminable orchestral parts recently, and have needed this multi-measure rest a lot - I've been using the NoteRow font very successfully - It gives the bold black line with the vertical line edges and you can insert the number at the top - I prefer it to the Boxmarks one with the number in the middle. I can't remember where I got hold of this font, but I'm sure it was at this NWC site - I've done a cursory browse now, but can't find it, so if you want it, let me know and I'll send you the file. - I actually use this font more than any other for many workarounds.

-Ann

Reply 14 offered by: FranMan on 30-Jun-2001

Ann,
I found the e-mail for the guy who created NoteRow and asked him to e-mail me his font. If I don't get a response from him, I'll ask you to e-mail me NoteRow. I have only question: Can I make to rest bar longer or shorter?


#2115: Mac version?
Mac version?

(2115)

Submitted by: FranMan on 22-Jun-2001

I just read an article saying that any software can be bug free if it is only for one platform. The reason that bugs happen is multiplatforming and that software is no good unless I is usable on both platforms. I'm not saying that NoteWorthy is no good, but I think a Mac version would be nice....

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 22-Jun-2001

May I respectfully suggest that you choose different reading material?

I suspect that NWC's goal is to provide useful, bug-free software rather than to demonstrate multi-platform programming prowess.

Besides, there are some applications (particularly in multimedia) that run only on Mac.

Mac users can find existing music publishing software for them. Also, since NWC does not require the latest and greatest computing capability, many potential users who have Macs (perhaps some schools?) surely can lay their hands on an old PC somewhere.

Reply 2 offered by: Marsu on 12-Sep-2001

BTW, there are now solutions to make Windows application run on a McIntosh. Some are cheap (BlueLabel), some are expensive (SoftWindows), i even believe some are free.
But in any case, you'll have to use MicroSoft software (in fact you emaulate a IBM-PC-compatible on which you run Windows). So you still may crash your Windows as usually; but you won't crash your Mac as often ;^)

Otherwise, if you say "any software can be bug free if it is only for one platform", why then do you want to make NWC run on more than one platform??

Moreover,I don't know about the writer of the article you read, but (s)he seems to ignore the "uncompleteness theory". Look for Gödel's therorem. A good book for this is "Gödel, Escher, Bach -- les Brins d'une Guirlande Eternelle" (Sorry, I do not know the english title, but you may find it easily.)

NWC is on Windows systems, it works quite fine, better than any µ$ Office application I know. Thanks Eric, keep up this good work!

And maybe in Mac OS X there'll be a new wy to make such softwares run on a Mac...
(there is one : run linux on your mac! ;)

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 12-Sep-2001

Marsu wrote: "Gödel, Escher, Bach -- les Brins d'une Guirlande Eternelle"

In English: "Gödel, Escher, Bach -- an Eternal Golden Braid"

I'd like to see a French edition sometime. So much of Hofstadter's word play seems to me to verge on the untranslateable. It must have been a Herculean effort.

HTH

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 12-Sep-2001

Including the play on the initials E, G and B in the title and subtitle

- which the French manages to preserve!

Reply 5 offered by: John Gillings on 12-Sep-2001

>I'd like to see a French edition sometime. So much of Hofstadter's word play seems to me to verge on the untranslateable. It must have been a Herculean effort.

Indeed! The subject of translating word play is covered in detail in the book itself. See the chapter which has and analysis of "The Jabberwocky" translated into both French and German. "'Twas brillig and the slithy tove, did gyre and gimble in the wabe".

A supreme master of the English language.

To tie this note back to the forum - has anyone ever used "Smut" (by Don Bird?), the music typesetting program used by Hofstadter and mentioned in GEB numerous times? The book is now more than 20 years old. When I first read GEB, I was intrigued as to what the program interface looked like. Since that was before bitmapped displays and WYSIWYG interfaces, I imagine it was text based. Does anyone know? Are any of the algorithms used in Noteworthy derived from academic research literature, such as papers published about "Smut"?


#2116: I can't get any percussion working!
I can't get any percussion working!

(2116)

Submitted by: Ryan on 22-Jun-2001

Can anyone tell me how to use percussion with this program...i.e. bass drum, snare, hi-hat, rides....stuf like that. I can't figure it out for the life of me!

~Ryan

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 22-Jun-2001

Assign channel 10 to your percussion staff. Have a look at drumref.nwc in your Samples directory for which notes are which kit instrument. That's all there is to it! Have fun...

Fred


#2117: Problem with midi for Casio WK-1600
Problem with midi for Casio WK-1600

(2117)

Submitted by: patrik on 23-Jun-2001

Hello!

I've got a quite big problem when recording midi from my Casio WK-1600. The tones gets in the score, but just as quarter notes. So if I play "Final Countdown" by Europe, all the notes is quarters! What to do????

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Jun-2001

You use the real-time recording procedure, rather than the step time recording procedure. Full details are in the User's Guide, and also elaborated in our FAQ and in this forum.


#2118: Number of staves
Number of staves

(2118)

Submitted by: James on 24-Jun-2001

Hi

Im using a Piano and vocal template and why can I only get 1 group of 3 staves? Why can't it carry on DOWN the page?

It will carry on, on one line and it all won't print!!?

Any help?
Thanks
James

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Jun-2001

Your question is unclear. Have you looked at the samples to see how a 3 part score is notated in NWC?

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Eidson on 24-Jun-2001

I believe I know what you're talking about. In the editing window (the main NWC program where you add notes), a single stave continues forever and does not look how it appears on the printed page.

Enter your music on the 3-stave template, then go to File -> Print Preview. This will show you how your music actually appears on the page.

Hope I haven't misunderstood! These forums are an excellent place for feedback/help so reply if you still have trouble.
-j

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 24-Jun-2001

The problem of being all on one line my also happen if bar lines are no used. If you do not wish to use bar lines, make them where they should go and then make them invisable.


#2120: I Can't Print To File in NWC!
I Can't Print To File in NWC!

(2120)

Submitted by: Jerry L. Bartachek on 25-Jun-2001

I'm trying to use the hints on NWC Forum for printing a Postscript file in print-to-file. But my computer does not display the check box option for print to file while running NWC.

I am using (at home) Win98, and in MS Word, Excel, etc. I do get the print-to-file checkbox presented to me in the print window. But not with NWC. I have all 4 of the NWC service packs installed, but am stumped why I can't print to a file.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jun-2001

The trick is to set your "virtual printer" (i.e. the Postscript driver) to "Print to File" rather than use an actual output port. When you then "print" to that device, you'll get the save as... dialog box. In other words, it's done by Windows itself, not by the application running under it.

Start --> Settings --> Printers --> right click on your "virtual printer" e.g. Applewrite, Generic PostScript printer, etc. --> Properties --> Details tab -- "Print to following port:" --> select "File: Creates a file on disk". Done!

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 25-Jun-2001

Fred is correct. Also, if you have a "real" PostScript printer that you use for printing, consider making a second "phantom" printer that is set up within Windows as "print to file." Then, to make a PostScript file, simply choose the phantom printer. If you do it often enough, it saves the hassle of checking or unchecking the print-to-file box in the printer control panel.


#2121: News server trouble again??
News server trouble again??

(2121)

Submitted by: Andreas Kryger Jensen on 25-Jun-2001

Hello all,

I have not been able to access the newsgroup lately. Are we having a news server problem again?
I get the following message:
----------------------------------
Configuration:
Account: news.ezusa.net
Server: news.ezusa.net
Protocol: NNTP
Port: 119
Secure(SSL): 0
Code: 800ccc0e
-----------------------------------

Regards,
Andreas Kryger Jensen

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Jun-2001

It's been working fine here. Configuration looks good also.

Have you been able to access groups on usenet? (Not that ezusa is on usenet, it's not, but it might help narrow down a local problem.)

Maybe try unsubscribing from it and resubscribing...

Reply 2 offered by: Andreas Kryger Jensen on 26-Jun-2001

I am able to access other newsgroups on another news server.
I have tryed to unsubscribe and resubscribe, but it didn't work.
Outlook says that it is unable to connect to the server.

Regards,
Andreas Kryger Jensen

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jun-2001

The news server did change IP addresses after the last set of problems. You might want to try completely removing its entry in your newsreader, then re-adding, perhaps with a slightly different name.

Reply 4 offered by: Andreas Kryger Jensen on 26-Jun-2001

Dear all,

I did help after I removed all of it.
Thanks for all your help.

Regards
Andreas Kryger Jensen


#2122: Repeat Last Measure(s) Symbols
Repeat Last Measure(s) Symbols

(2122)

Submitted by: Jared S. on 26-Jun-2001

Does anyone know how to insert repeat last measure symbols?

Also, does anyone know how to insert repeat last (# of) measures symbols and edit how many previous measures to repeat?

Reply 1 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 26-Jun-2001

As far as I know, the feature is not yet supported *coughwishlistcough*

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 28-Jun-2001

Can't you do this with regular repeats?


#2123: Percussion Notation
Percussion Notation

(2123)

Submitted by: Ranjan Ramchandani on 27-Jun-2001

Normal percussion notation does not place the instruments that NoteWorthy Composer supports in the places on the staff that NWC does. I was wondering how I could possibly alter the default notation for percussion, because if I print out a percussion chart its very difficult and rather counterintuitive for me to read it when it is written in a totally different notation.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 27-Jun-2001

Ranjan,

There is a utility that will do this.
Go to the Scriptorium - there is a link on the NoteWorthy home page screen.
Click on the Useful Files from Users link.
Download the Drumkit program and READ the included text file before using.
If you have difficulties or need the Qbasic program get back to me.


#2124: repeats
repeats

(2124)

Submitted by: Mike Halliford on 27-Jun-2001

I'm a newbie, and I was wondering how I could insert repeats into a composition. I looked at the sample, but it didn't explain how to go about this.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 27-Jun-2001

NWC considers a repeat sign to be a type of bar line. Edit a bar line (one way is to highlight it and type <ctrl>e) and you'll see a "Style" box. Expand this (click on the down-arrow to the right of the box), and you'll see a list of options; the last 4 of these are various types of repeat sign.


#2125: Tempo changes
Tempo changes

(2125)

Submitted by: David Lake on 28-Jun-2001

How do I remove a tempo change on a file that has been saved? IE I put in 80 and cannot remove it.

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 28-Jun-2001

Grab onto the grey diamond and press backspace.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Jun-2001

Or just use standard Backspace (delete left) or Delete (delete from right). If you delete the wrong thing, just Undo and try again.


#2126: Cut sign
Cut sign

(2126)

Submitted by: David Lake on 28-Jun-2001

How do i add a cut sign (//)to cause a delay.
Perhaps I am not using the right term.

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 28-Jun-2001

This is not supported by NWC. I just use // as text from the title font. If you NEED this feature, add it to the wish list. You can create the delay you need in play back by using a hidden rest or fermataed hidden rest.

Reply 2 offered by: Kaz on 28-Jun-2001

This is a supplement to Reply 1.
You can use a breath mark (4th from the bottom on the left side toolbar) for actual delay.


#2127: total cost is $39?
total cost is $39?

(2127)

Submitted by: dan goorevitch on 29-Jun-2001

is the total cost $39 or is this a limited lisence? I just want to know the dope up front. Nice forum, helpful spirit, no snobby one-upmanship. I like it. And the product. Easy to use.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jun-2001

If you have downloaded the evaluation, you can see the registered license in the LICENSE.TXT file.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 29-Jun-2001

The above answer from Noteworthy Software is authoritative. But perhaps your question was meant to ask whether the $39 was some sort of "student license," in the way that (say) Adobe Systems may offer a graphics product for $zillions, but with a student license or a limited-edition product for $affordable. NWC does not (to my knowledge as a user) work that way. $39 does it, as I write this. Whether that price will pertain to the future, or whether something new is coming down the pipeline, is anyone's guess (and NWC isn't telling).

Reply 3 offered by: dan goorevitch on 01-Jul-2001

thanks JM. -DG


#2128: NWC forum oddity?
NWC forum oddity?

(2128)

Submitted by: Ann Macfarlane on 30-Jun-2001

I replied to the long measure rest subject and it is listed as reply 13 under the "Recent forum activity" heading, but neither my message, nor the reply by Franman (no. 14) show up when this subject is clicked on - the latest replies to the other subjects seem to show ok, and I'm beginning to wonder if maybe I inadvertantly said something unacceptable! - was my message deleted intentionally?

- Ann (rather puzzled!)

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 30-Jun-2001

I don't speak for NWC, but I've noticed in the past that on those rare occasions when someone posts something inappropriate, there is a "removed by SYSOP" notice where the message should be. If that's not what's going on, then it is some other oddity. Once in a while, file servers take some time to smell the roses, rather than serve files.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Jun-2001

Odd... works here, try hitting your refresh (or reload, or whatever it's called) button. I'm pretty sure that these pages use the nocache tag, but perhaps your browser is ignoring this and loading an old version from your cache.

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 30-Jun-2001

<...>
perhaps your browser is ignoring this and loading an old version from your cache
</...>

That's probably the case. Try deleting the cache files and then refresh the page.

Hth.

Reply 4 offered by: Ann Macfarlane on 01-Jul-2001

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone - I deleted my cache (which must have been extensive, everything clicked away for so long so it was a good spring clean!) but no luck - To be sure, I closed IE and loaded it up again, and still the long measure thread stops at reply 12. As before, no problem with any of the others. I'm not bothered about my #13 reply not showing, but I naturally wanted to see Franman's posting if it referred in any way to mine and thus needs a further response!

frustrated,
Ann!

Reply 5 offered by: FranMan on 01-Jul-2001

The only time this has happened to me, was when I was viewing an old version. As soon as I hit Reload in Netscape or Refresh in IE everthing was fine. So, I have some questions about this. First, does the page just end of does it end regularly with the NW logo at the bottom. Second, can you get to the other replies from the recent activity page or does it just get you the same page. Otherwise, I don't know... do you have another browser handy? If so, try it. Anyway, about my post, I was just saying that I had e-mailed the author of NoteRow asking him to send me the font. If he doesn't reply, I'll take the font from you if you are still willing. And a question about the font: Can you make the bar larger and smaller?

Reply 6 offered by: Ann Macfarlane on 01-Jul-2001

It's actually still a mystery! - All the other threads are up to date, and just this one stops on message 12. It ends with the button saying [Add your own reply] and a line below which is the spinning NW logo + copyright claim. I can click on any of the heading selection links. Oh well - never mind - it seems to be an isolated irritation! If you need the font, write to me at my personal email address. It's a really useful font - great for putting rests inside beamed notes and notating tremolos, wiggly trills, arpeggiated chords,etc etc. The multi-bar rest can be lengthened and shortened as you wish. I can't think why it doesn't seem to be found at this site anymore - must be looking in the wrong place!

Best wishes,

Ann :)

Reply 7 offered by: FranMan on 01-Jul-2001

Ann, the font is mentioned in the scriptorium, but available. The only way to get it is through the newsgroup. If the author does not respond to me in a few days, I will write you for the font.

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Jul-2001

Ann, your reply (msg #2113 (reply 13)) is valid, and the thread appears to be completely standard, nothing out of the ordinary. When you have these problems, hitting F5 is the solution in IE.

Reply 9 offered by: Ann Macfarlane on 02-Jul-2001

Thanks for the help - I will remember the F5 if it happens again - I've just checked the wayward thread, and it is now all there without the F5 solution, so don't know where the last couple of messages were hiding for the past few days! As I said - it's the only time that it has happened to me, so not a big deal. I also said something misleading in my previous post here in reply to Franman - The noterow font can do lots of things but NWC15 is the one to use for the beaming over rests thing. Sorry about that - I use both fonts often and got mixed up there.

Best wishes,
Ann


#2129: Simplified music notation
Simplified music notation

(2129)

Submitted by: Mat on 01-Jul-2001

Anyone knows that whether noteworthy composer supports simplified music notation (using number 0 to 7 instead of the musical symbol) on top of the standard one? I want a musical document contains both simplified and standard notations.....
Thanks

note: if you don't know what i'm talking about, check this page
http://www.a1soft.com/smusic.htm

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 01-Jul-2001

How is the numbering done? By the length of the note or the pitch of the note? If it is done by the lengh of the note you can beg !link(Robert Allgeyer=mailto:ra849@icogitate.com)to make you a font for what you want. If it is done by pitch, you are out of luck unless you put a text expression over every note. HTH -FranMan

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 01-Jul-2001

I agree with everyone who said befor me that this forum should have an edit button. Of course if it did, we would never make another mistake, anyway I MEAN'T to make a link for Robert, but I missed a space here is the link------> !link(Robert Allgeyer=mailto:ra849@icogitate.com)

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 01-Jul-2001

OK, what did I do wrong this time? !link(Robert Allgeyer=mailto:ra849@icogitate.com)

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 01-Jul-2001

We do not allow e-mail links in this fashion. News, ftp, and web links are fine.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 01-Jul-2001

Ah, but I read the forum.

Please don't beg me for a font! I am not a professional font designer. My two music fonts (Musisync, Musitone) were created with great labor. The other special-purpose fonts were patched together from public-domain resources that I had.

If I see some peculiar need that just has to be ansered with a font, I'll think about it. -- but not very hard!

Reply 6 offered by: FranMan on 02-Jul-2001

Robert, I'm sorry, I know you are not a professional, but you DID make Banger for us....

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 03-Jul-2001

Indeed. I was in a good mood that day. Normally, not.


#2130: Bell choir notation
Bell choir notation

(2130)

Submitted by: Steve on 02-Jul-2001

Does NWC support anything to aid bell choirs? Specifically, I'd like to color-code notes. While we're at it, can parts on the same staff be color-coded?

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 03-Jul-2001

I'm not sure what bell choir colour coding looks like, but it is possible to specify colours for any object in Noteworthy.

Select the object(s), right click and choose "Properties" (you may select any number of objects, even if they're different types). Click on the "Visibility" tab. There is an "Item color" drop down to select "default" or any of 3 highlight colours. By default red, green and blue. To change the colours, go to the "Tools" menu and select "Options". Click the "Color" tab - this allows you to change the highlight colours.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 03-Jul-2001

If you happen to own a suitable drawing program, you may be able to import your NWC composition either as a Windows Metafile, or Postscript-PDF if you have that technology. Once in a drawing program, you can do what you like, as the components are individually editable.

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 03-Jul-2001

MS Word can do this too. Just copy paste into word, ungroup, and use the drawing tool bar.


#2131: Sound latency when recording with keyboard
Sound latency when recording with keyboard

(2131)

Submitted by: M.P. on 02-Jul-2001

Hi,
I'm having problems with recording into NWC
with my MIDI keyboard.
When I press a keyboard key, the sound seems to occur
half a second later. This messes up my timing when
I am adding new parts to the existing parts.
Can I adjust this "timing" ?
Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Jul-2001

What is your midi playback device? If it's a softsynth, such latency is normal. You can reduce it greatly on the Yamaha soft synthesizers by using the DirectSound port instead of the default wav port (requires DirectX). This is an option in the SoftSynth control panel applet.

Another possibility is to use your external keyboard's device directly, probably the easiest way to do this is to use headphones plugged directly into the keyboard. You might have to set "Local On" if your keyboard has such a thing.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Milton Orgeron on 24-Aug-2001

I took Fred Nachbur's advice (Reply 1) and it worked fine. Probably that got the delay down to the 80 ms Yamaha says is the minimum from the noticeable 480 ms without using Direct X. At 80 ms there is no noticeable delay. If you don't have Direct X or Direct X Media they are free downloads, search for the web site.


#2132: Forte Piano
Forte Piano

(2132)

Submitted by: Philip on 03-Jul-2001

How can I do a forte piano in a song? I've seen it done with one of the songs on the Scriptorium, so I know it's possible. What's the trick?

Reply 1 offered by: grant on 03-Jul-2001

I've done fp's using expression mpc events. (Watch out. Not all sound cards support the expression controller, and some, including the SoundBlaster AWE64, react oddly to the use of multiple simultaneous expression events, particularly when channel 16 is involved.)

I'd love to hear how others have solved this problem differently.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Jul-2001

Volume mpc's work also. These are what I use when I want to be sure it'll work with as many soundcards as possible. The drawback is that it rather defeats the purpose of having expression control "local" volume, reserving the volume controller for "master" volume; if you want to change the overall volume of an entire staff you have to go through and change all volume mpc's accordingly.

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 03-Jul-2001

just a thought--Could you make two staves, a play and a visual. One the visual, just make text that says fp one the play break the note into two tied notes one the value of forte, the other of piano. Make the dynamics forte and piano under the two notes.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Jul-2001

No. That's because dynamics use note-on velocity, which only occur when a note is sounded. Since the two notes are tied, it is in effect just one note (as far as midi is concerned) so there would be no effect from the "p" instruction at the tied note.

However, if that p instruction had a volume over-ride, it would accomplish approximately the same thing as a volume mpc at that point... except that the volume change would be abrupt, whereas by using an mpc you can do a linear sweep to make the change more gradual (and therefore more realistic).


#2133: Anthony Wilson
Anthony Wilson

(2133)

Submitted by: Lee Nuckols on 03-Jul-2001

Does anyone know where I can reach Anthony Wilson? I would like to do an arrangement of one of his works and would like his permission and advice.

Also on a side note: When you write a multi-part score that has different instruments, how can you identify the instruments in your score. When you print it out how do you get your score to indentify each staff as Trumpet, Tuba, Trombone etc.....

Thanks

Lee Nuckols
Music Ed Major
Murray State University

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Jul-2001

> Does anyone know where I can reach Anthony Wilson? I would
> like to do an arrangement of one of his works and would
> like his permission and advice.

Last I wrote to him he was still at the address as posted on the scriptorium, here's one instance:

http://www.vadu.com/cgi-bin/nwc/txt2html.cgi?src=classical/p/pachcano.txt

> Also on a side note: When you write a multi-part score
> that has different instruments, how can you identify the
> instruments in your score.

File --> Page Setup --> Options --> Staff Labels gives you several choices.

Reply 2 offered by: Lee Nuckols on 04-Jul-2001

Mr Nachbaur,

I have long been an admirer of your work. It was a personal honor for you to reply to my post. Now if only Phillip Sparke and Alfred Reed will reply......

Reply 3 offered by: Lee Nuckols on 04-Jul-2001

Mr Nachbaur,

Thanks for your reply. I have long been an admirer of your work. It was a personal honor for you to reply ot my post.

Now if only Phillip Sparke and Alfred Reed will reply.....

Reply 4 offered by: Lee Nuckols on 04-Jul-2001

ok know I feel dumb. Of course I would make a fool of myself and repeat post 50 times.

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Randall on 04-Jul-2001

To identify the instruments in the score, give the staff an appropriate name (e.g. Flute I/II etc.) in the Staff Properties: General Tab.

Then go to the Options tab on the page set up dialogue and select the appropriate Staff labelling option - probably "first system". This will add your specified staff name alongside the start of each stave.

When extracting parts from a score, I find it useful to insert the instrument name as a text expression at the start of each stave at a staff position of 20 or so and with the visibility set to "top staff only". This puts the instrument name in the top left corner of the first page (below the title).

HTH

Stephen


#2134: Lyrics: font size?
Lyrics: font size?

(2134)

Submitted by: dan goorevitch on 03-Jul-2001

I'm a gonna go blind lookin' at the lyrics in the dialog box! I tried zooming. I zoomed to the max and the font's still the same size in the dialogue box. Any tips, neighbours? -dan

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 03-Jul-2001

Go to File: Page Setup : Fonts, and modify the size of the font you choose for lyrics. I believe that the NWC default is 7 point, but try 12 point.

This changes the size of the font on the printed page, and perhaps that is not what you want to do. But it also changes the size of the text that appears in the lyric editor. You can enter your lyrics, then go back and modify the lyric font size to the intended print size.

One other thing you can do is to prepare your lyrics as plain text, say in Notepad. Then copy-and-paste into the lyric editor using CTRL+C and CTRL+V. The lyric editor uses whatever font you have specified within NWC, not the font you used in Notepad. So you can use large type in Notepad without affecting the result in NWC. (But you cannot use a word processor to apply effects, such as boldface, and transfer that into the NWC text editor.)

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Jul-2001

If you have not yet done so, you should install the latest service pack. Lyrics are shown in 12 pt after the service pack is installed.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 05-Jul-2001

Well, Dan, how's THAT for service? :)

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 05-Jul-2001

Ah, you are right! Lyrics have been showing in the editor at 12 point font size for some time now (yes, I have the upgrades). I hadn't noticed, since I generally use 12 point anyway!


#2135: How do I make font files?
How do I make font files?

(2135)

Submitted by: Paul on 03-Jul-2001

Does anyone know, how to make Windows (music)fonts? Is there a special program needed for this purpose?

Please help me.

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 03-Jul-2001

Here's a response from someone who knows ...

You want to draw? You need a drawing program. You want to do word processing? You need a word processing program. You want to create or edit fonts? You need a program that creates or edits fonts.

If you happen to own a recent version of Corel Draw, I am told that it has some sort of minimal font-editing capability built in. (I don't have the program, so I wouldn't know.)

Otherwise, be aware that the most stripped-down font editor is not a cheap program. The one I used costs something like $100, and has a few bugs. Its big-brother version costs several hundred dollars.

Also be aware that it is not too difficult to make a font that will print well, but much more difficult to make it so that it will look good on screen. This has something to do with "hinting," a capability absent or minimal in the less expensive programs.

If what you want to do is cut-and-paste a variety of individual character symbols (called glyphs) from existing public-domain fonts, then the technique is not too hard to learn. But if you are going to make your own, then you have to be able to draw them. How are your computer drawing skills?

Also be aware that most fonts, even the ones publicly distributed at no cost, are NOT in the public domain. There come with licenses that generally prohibit modifications. That is, you cannot legally take part of MS Times New Roman, and part of MS Arial, and combine the parts to make "Times New Arial" for distribution.

Font editor programs are available on-line as trial downloads (but you will not be able to save your efforts). Shop around, and be sure that the program continues to be supported. There may be some programs out there that continue to be sold, but will never have existing bugs repaired.

Learning to use a font editor is not trivial. Just as owning a music program does not make one a musician, owning a font program does not make one a font designer.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul on 03-Jul-2001

Thank you for the information, Robert.

Reply 3 offered by: Ken Winters on 25-Nov-2001

http://www.high-logic.com/fcp.html

It's free (so far as I can tell) and it seems to work. Go for it. Even has a tutorial.

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 25-Nov-2001

It's NOT free, too buggy and the support is "dead". The tutorial refers to some features that the program does dot have(!).


#2136: NWC version 1.70.8 available
NWC version 1.70.8 available

(2136)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 03-Jul-2001

I see that NWC has just posted SP8 for NWC 1.70. It addresses some popular concerns. Just in time for our (American) national holiday. For the many Brits who use NWC, you can't win them all.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Jul-2001

Wow! Nice additions! And it's one-size-fits-all (just one upgrade file irrespective of present update level). Good show, NoteWorthySoftwareInc! :)

I prefer to think of it as a belated Canada Day present....

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 03-Jul-2001

WOW, you beat Eric, and is it just me or is the SP page not even updated yet? Where is the list of new features?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Jul-2001

Follow the home link at the top of the page, then either visit the Upgrade or special CD page to find out what is new in service pack 8.


#2137: Trouble w. volume change after loop
Trouble w. volume change after loop

(2137)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 03-Jul-2001

OK, I didn't have the chance to get help at the ng so I'm trying here:

I just finished polishing a song which uses 6 playback channels (tracks, staves). While the first three play firstly, the remaining three kepp silent (muted with vol. mpc's at the beginning. Then, after the loop (DS), the first three are muted and the second group's volume is turned on. But something happens and the song turns out a chaos after the loop.

Why does this happen and what can be done?

PS: No errors in mapping channels etc.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Jul-2001

Well, not much to go on here.

>PS: No errors in mapping channels etc.

I'm not sure what the "etc." is here. I assume some sort of error is taking place, correct?

>song turns out a chaos after the loop.

I am not sure what you mean by chaos. One possibility (although not in a "no errors" situation) is that your silent staves have unresolved ties or pedal marks, and when you turn the sound volume up you first hear the chaos that was created by the earlier overlapping of all the stuck notes.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Jul-2001

You can turn the volume on for all staves for the entire piece and then try to isolate the cause of your problem. In a true no errors situation, you have have a device or driver malfunction.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Jul-2001

I read your news post.

Actually your problem happens right before the loop. You have an extra 8th note at the end of Staff-3 (the hidden one).


#2138: Noteworthy Browser Plug-In
Noteworthy Browser Plug-In

(2138)

Submitted by: Paul on 04-Jul-2001

Does anyone know, why the Noteworthy Browser Plug-In doesn't play fermatas and breathmarks?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Jul-2001

See msg #1944


#2139: Quintuplets etc
Quintuplets etc

(2139)

Submitted by: stevew on 05-Jul-2001

I believe I read somewhere about a workaround to get quintuplets etc. - the program only appears to support triplets of that ilk.


#2141: MIDI files
MIDI files

(2141)

Submitted by: Philip on 05-Jul-2001

Okay, I give up. I don't have the time to do a lot of searching, so instead:

What's the difference (assuming there is one) between a Type 1 MIDI file and a Type 0 MIDI file?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 05-Jul-2001

A type 0 midi file has all events on a single track, whereas a type 1 midi file has separate tracks, usually one per midi channel plus a "master track" containing tempi and signatures (although not necessarily; NWC for instance creates a separate track for each staff, even if more than one staff shares the same midi channel).

For practical purposes, there is no significant difference between the two types. Both will play identically in most if not all midi players. However, if you intend your midi to be importable into sequencers (or reimported into NWC), retaining your original track structure (or staves, in the case of NWC) then Type 1 is preferred.

The only other factor that sometimes comes into play is that type 0 midis can sometimes be somewhat smaller, if "running status" is enabled (not presently supported in NWC, AFAIK but can be enabled using an external program such as Günter Nagler's "midcompr.exe").

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 05-Jul-2001

PS - one possible advantage to type 0 is when concatenating several midis into a single large one using a utility such as "midicat.exe" (concatenates midis), which requires type 0 midi for input.

Conversion between the two types can be readily accomplished using programs by G. Nagler and others. (gee, this is starting to sound like an ad for Nagler!) :)


#2142: printing book format
printing book format

(2142)

Submitted by: Herb Stahlke on 06-Jul-2001

Two or three years ago I found a utility on the NWC site that would print a score in book format, with book pagination. Word Perfect has this feature too, but I now use Word 2000, which doesn't. Unfortunately, when my system was upgraded a couple of years ago, I lost that utility and I don't even remember its name. Can anyone point me to such a utility? I've searched the archive under several keyword combinations and found nothing.

Thanks,

Herb Stahlke

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 06-Jul-2001

That was probably Blue Squirrel's "Clickbook".

http://www.bluesquirrel.com/clickbook/

HTH
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 06-Jul-2001

"Clickbook" is a non-free program with many advanced features, according to their web site.

If all you wanted to do was (say) shrink pages and print them side-by-side, so that two reduced pages fit in landscape mode on a single sheet of paper, then you are looking for "2up" printing. Your existing printer driver may have a "2up" capability -- take a look. If it doesn't, then there are some free utilities that will do it. One of them is called, appropriately enough, "2up" and can be found at Simtel:

http://www.simtel.net

Another is called "PCbook2" and can be found at ZDnet:

http://www.zdnet.com/downloads/stories/info/0,10615,77404,00.html

You may also need the VB5 runtime file, if you don't already have it, available from the Microsoft download center (filed under product Visual Basic 5, for your operating system).

These products are all different, particularly with regards to special pagination (or lack thereof) and control over size and placement (or lack thereof).

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 06-Jul-2001

Forget what I just wrote above. The two freeware programs will only work on text files.

Nevertheless, some printer drivers do have a built-in 2up feature, so it is worth checking your existing software. The same applies if you are pasting WMFs into documents -- your document software may have a 2-up capability. Even if it doesn't, you can use landscape layout, two columns, and paste scaled-down WMFs side by side. Admittedly that's more tedious than having it automated.


#2143: Rogues Gallery
Rogues Gallery

(2143)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 08-Jul-2001

For those of you that do not frequent the newsgroup, you may like to take part in a fun quiz that we are running.

So often we get pre-conceived ideas of what people look like which later on we find to be complely from reality. Never more so than on the newsgroup and forum where we never usually get to see what someone looks like.

We have put together a rogues gallery . These are the faces of users from the newsgroup who we communicate with every day - But can you guess who they are just from their pictures.

If you would like to have your picture included, send it to me at the above e-mail address.

If you would like to guess at the names, send your list to me as well. For the moment, I will only reveal how many right or wrong you have. After I think that I have received all of the photos, I will add in a list of names for you to choose from.

The rogues gallery can by reached by clicking the link or by pointing your browsers to
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/rogues.html

Rich

Reply 1 offered by: Richard on 09-Jul-2001

rogues gallery
Well we have our first guess from the rogues gallery pictures.
It's From Joseph Guix. Thanks for responding Joseph.

In the style of the mastermind game, forgetting about my picture at 00 which was given to you (Ha Ha), Joseph managed to get 4 correct with a further
two in the wrong position.

Better luck next time Joseph.

I know that there are a number of people who are intending to send their photo in so I won't publish names just yet.

Rich

Reply 2 offered by: Rich on 09-Jul-2001

rogues gallery

Another photo added today

Rich

Reply 3 offered by: Rich. on 10-Jul-2001

rogues gallery
Wow - so many new pictures in today.

This is really heating up now - take a look - click on the link above.

If you haven't sent your picture yet - what are you waiting for ?

A few days left yet

Rich

Reply 4 offered by: Rich on 11-Jul-2001

Some more photos added today

Rich.

Reply 5 offered by: Rich on 12-Jul-2001

Rogues Gallery

And another two added today.

In answer to a question that I was asked, even though the page is called "Newsgroup Rogues Gallery" you don't have to participate in the newsgroup to get your photo included.
Forum users are equally welcome.

Send in those piccies.

Rich.

Reply 6 offered by: Rich on 13-Jul-2001

Rogues Gallery

And another two to ponder over!

Rich

Reply 7 offered by: Rich on 14-Jul-2001

Rogues Gallery

Updated again today (14th July)

Reply 8 offered by: Rich on 15-Jul-2001

Rogues Gallery

Another one for the gallery.

In a few days time, I will put up the list of names from which you can make your guesses. So if you're thinking of taking part, send in the photos soon.

Rich

Reply 9 offered by: Rich on 17-Jul-2001

Rogues Gallery

Well - things seem to have quietened down with the Rogues Gallery so I think that it is nearly time to add a list of names to the faces so that you all can put in your guesses.

So This coming weekend 21/22 July I will add a list of names to the gallery. If you still want to submit a photo, please try and do it before then or at least let me know that one is on the way.

Rich

Reply 10 offered by: Rich on 18-Jul-2001

Rogues Gallery

The Rogues Gallery has been updated today. It's been updated with one photo of an NWC user and one photo of what I am sure is not a user of NWC although the owner assures me that she's quite musical and she will dance in the dressage to wonderful classics someday.

So we have an additional quiz. Find the owner of the pet. (BTW it's mug 35 that's the pet - none of the other mugs :-)

Only one more user has promised a photo before the weekend so it looks like the list of names will be Saturday or Sunday.

Rich

Reply 11 offered by: Rich on 21-Jul-2001

Well folks,

The Rogues Gallery has been updated today. I am waiting for one more photo to come in and then I'll list the names and the competition can start.

Rogues Gallery

Rich

Reply 12 offered by: Rich on 23-Jul-2001

Well the final photo has arrived and I'm all ready to release all the names but the Scripto server is feeling a bit poorly at the moment.

So as and when !!

Rich


#2144: nwc 12 for windows 3.1
nwc 12 for windows 3.1

(2144)

Submitted by: Anne on 08-Jul-2001

Hi everybody !
I'm looking for NoteWorthy Composer in the french version for windows 3.1
Can you help me please ? thank you !
Anne
P.S. :I'm a french girl. I'm 16

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 09-Jul-2001

Hello Anne,

At the moment, there is not a French version of NoteWorthy Composer. There are, however, many French users and some of them are translating a user manual into French.

This will take a few more months to complete.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: Anne on 09-Jul-2001

Hello Richard !

Thank you for your answer...
How much is the english version nwc12 for windows 3.1 ?

Anne

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Jul-2001

Hello, Anne,

I think that by NWC12 you mean Version 1.2, which is by now a very old version. The current version of NWC is 1.70.8, and has many improvements. I am happy so say that it is also available for Win3.1. If you go to the
NoteWorthy Composer Page you can find out more about it, and even download a trial version to test it on your computer before buying. You can get information about buying the program from the
Order Page.

Regards,
Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 09-Jul-2001

Hello again Anne,

Fred has said it all and so there is no need for me to say anymore except to say that I would encourage you to try it and then purchase it. It's a marvellous program.

Rich

Reply 5 offered by: Anne on 12-Jul-2001

Ok, thanks guys ! I'll see it !
Bye,
Anne


#2145: Stabat Mater -Dvorak
Stabat Mater -Dvorak

(2145)

Submitted by: Andre Marcotte on 08-Jul-2001

Hi,

I would like find the Stabat Mater of A. Dvorak for NWC files. Someone could help me with that, I have looked in many places on the web, but I did'nt yet find it. thanks

Andre


#2146: Hidden Staff
Hidden Staff

(2146)

Submitted by: Harold Timmons on 08-Jul-2001

I recently converted a MIDI File to NWC format. There is 1 staff (Tempo Track)that does NOT appear when I open the converted file using the Noteworthy Composer but the staff does appear when opened using the Noteworthy Player. I would like to make some tempo changes contained within the hidden staff. How can I make it appear in the Noteworthy Composer?

Reply 1 offered by: Ivan Rojas on 08-Jul-2001

Did you check on File/Page Setup/Contents/Visible Parts?

Reply 2 offered by: Harold Timmons on 09-Jul-2001

No I did not, but I have now and it is just what I was looking for. A great big THANK YOU!


#2147: How to change playback instrument on staff
How to change playback instrument on staff

(2147)

Submitted by: Mark Woolsey on 09-Jul-2001

I bought noteworthy primarly to download existing midi files and edit them. I can import and play them just fine, but I'm having trouble changing the instruments on a particular staff (for example, I want to hear it come from an organ instead of a piano). I've used f2->... to change the instrument for the staff, and it says it changed it. However, when I play it back, the sound is the original instrument, not the new one. When I check it w/f2 again, it says the staff should be playing the new instrument. How can I change an existing midi file to playback w/a diff instrument?

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan  on 09-Jul-2001

I'm guessing you checked the option in the import screen. If you tell it to "Insert Instrument Changes", You will see that at each staff there will be a grey number. If you select THAT, then you can change the instrument. Otherwise just delete it and change it the way you tried before, and next time, but sure not to check that option.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 10-Jul-2001

You problem may be caused by one or more instrument patch changes inserted into the staff. An instrument patch change overrides the default setting of the staff but does not show up in the staff properties dialog or the score review. You should check the staff from the beginning to make sure that explicit patch changes haven't been inserted.

Reply 3 offered by: Mark Woolsey on 10-Jul-2001

Thanks for your help. I had not noticed the "Insert Instrument Changes" button. Once I clicked it on, then the grey numbers appeared on the staffs. I changed them & the instrument changed. This brings up another question, tho. Is there a way to change the instrumentation w/o clicking the "Insert Instrument Changes" button?

Reply 4 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 26-Jul-2001

Another possibility which could explain your problem: Maybe there are two staves with the same channel number. You changed the instrument with f2 on one staff, but not on the other.

Check that no other staff has the same channel number than the one you want to specify instrument.


#2148: hearing notes when you place them down
hearing notes when you place them down

(2148)

Submitted by: adam messer on 10-Jul-2001

i've just bought noteworthy composer and i'm a newbie to it so bear with me. i have two questions to ask. when i place down a note i do not hear any sound. how should i make it so that noteworthy plays the sound of the note when it is placed down? secondly, i have a keyboard and i have disabled the feature "MIDI Input Active" from the tools menu.i did this because i did not want the notes to be written on the stave as i played them but what i did want was for the me to be able to hear the notes on the keyboard as i played them. so the second question is how do i make it so i can hear my keyboard on noteworthy composer?

Reply 1 offered by: Martin Segerstråle on 13-Jul-2001

NoteWorthy does not play the note when you add it. Since NWC is almost a text editor, only you write notes and not text, it has no such feature. It's a bit like Word would speak out what you write. (It doesn't.)
Second, to be able to hear what you play, you just have to choose the right input device in Tools->Options->Record. You don't have to have MIDI Input active to hear what you play. Just start NWC and play!

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Jul-2001

See msg #2151 (reply 5)

Hth

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Jul-2001

Meant msg #2151 (reply 2)...


#2149: Expression Placement Defaults?
Expression Placement Defaults?

(2149)

Submitted by: Steve on 10-Jul-2001

Is it possible to have default settings for expression placement? I often want to insert text, dynamics, flow directions, etc. in the same position above the staff each time. Having a default would be great, rather than being forced to change it from whatever the last note or expression was using.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Jul-2001

You could try the Smart Properties Insert option from Tools | Options | Editor, but it may not do exactly what you want (it is close though).

Reply 2 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 11-Jul-2001

I have a similar request (it may even be the same): Every time I start a new file, the dynamics always start below the staff (with smart positioning on). I would prefer the first one to be at 7 or at least where the cursor is for that first dynamic placement.

Reply 3 offered by: Graham Howe on 13-Jul-2001

I frequently face a similar dilemma whilst using text insertion to place chord names over the score; I usually make all my text insertions without bothering too much about where on the stave I place them, then when all are inserted, I highlight the entire stave, then, using ctrl+e, I put in a common value in the expression placement dialogue box. This system is best, of course, if all the text insertions are of the same type, eg. all dynamics, all chord names, etc


#2150: NWC Browser Plug-In
NWC Browser Plug-In

(2150)

Submitted by: Ivan Rojas on 10-Jul-2001

When I press the play button in my Browser Plug-In the score progress OK but does not produce any sound.

By the way the NWC works and sound perfect.

I have the last version 1.70.08 in both cases, and my browser is Internet Explorer 5.5 and the OS is Windows 98.

Any Idea where I have to check?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Jul-2001

You need to check two things:

1. Your MIDI Multimedia settings:

You do this from Start | Settings | Control Panel. In Windows 98, I think it is the Multimedia applet, the MIDI tab. Select the same device for play back that you use in NWC.

2. Check your volume settings in the Windows mixer. In the plug-in, this just means clicking the volume control.

Reply 2 offered by: Ivan Rojas on 16-Jul-2001

Thanks Noteworthy, the solution was the number 1.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 05-Feb-2002

Thanks, sol. 1 worked for me either :)

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 05-Feb-2002

>> 1 worked for me either

Marsu, if you don't mind: it's "too", not "either." "Either" with this meaning is idiomatic in negative statements only, as in "1 didn't work for me either."

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 05-Feb-2002

Ah, yes. Proper English does not use double negatives. But proper French does. I believe that some other Latinate languages also use the double negative.

The idiom is difficult. "It worked for me, too" could be misinterpreted to mean that it worked excessively.

In English, there is no literate equivalent to the French disjunctive pronoun. French "C'est moi!" is literate, but English "That's me!" is not literate, even though it is said.

I mention this because the selective usage of idiomatic versus literate expression, in songwriting, seems to be quite an art form. In Edith Piaf's "La Vie en Rose," there a line, "Et ça m'fait quelque chose." The line (with its elision) makes sense to me when read, but for years I could not understand it when it was sung.

I first learned French several years ago. Other students were younger, and less literate. Many of them could not grasp the concepts of subordinate clause, relative pronoun, or subjunctive mood in French; the reason was that they did not grasp those concepts in English, either.

That's how "either" is used at the end of a sentence!

I still haven't figured out why the French use "plus" in the negative sense, as in "Plus de [la] grammaire!"

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Feb-2002

If you're a Cockney then it would be "It didn't work for me, neither".

Quite wrong but worryingly common and commonplace.

Peter

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 06-Feb-2002

what about of "it worked for me Neither"??
Because in fact, it didn't work. (I was in NWC, not in plug-in, but was a bit tired and didn't notice immediately)
I had to reinstall the plug-in to make it work. (the upgrade process does it well).
Now it works, finally, but I wasn't able to determine the reason why.

Thank you for the grammatical correction, too.
English(es) is(are) not easy to speak nor write, though I fear (good) french is quite hard too!! De facto only a few people use it correctly in France. Time accordance (? "concordance des temps") is rarely properly used; and the use of written words leads to some confusion: "plus de grammaire" can mean "more grammar" (if "plus" is said "plüS"), or "no grammar any more (or no more, if cockney/slang?)", if "plus" is said "plü"... Only the context can help there. Worse, because of use of SMS and email, some people use the "+" symbol to abbreviate "plus" in the "no more" meaning, which leads to confusion...
However, some rules of pronounciation(spelling?) don't change, and I still feel confident in making a program that would be able to hyphenate properly lyrics in french.

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Feb-2002

You could say "Neither did it work for me" when it didn't work and hadn't worked previously, but not "either did it work" when it did and had!

Reply 9 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 06-Feb-2002

"It didn't work for me, neither," is not limited to Cockney English! I hear it (and use it) all the time (USA). I believe that the (n)either is an interpolation to prevent crashing vowels, the way that the French interpolatate (t) in "Y a-t-il [quelque chose]?"

In songs, the French occasionally pronounce mute-e, even though it would not be spoken. In English hymns, verbs ending in -ed ocasionally have it pronounced as a separate syllable.

But it is definitely incorrect, even in colloquial usage, to say "It worked for me, neither," to mean that it did not work.

Where I live, we often simply say "Works for me!" or in the past tense, "Worked for me!"

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 06-Feb-2002

The "t" in "Y a-t-il" is added to avoid "hiatus" : two vowels that would follow.
Exception: the mute-h in "Les haricots sont cuits", though some people tend to say that the "h" should be ignored (which gives "lézaricots", awful)
"Y", as "u" in english, may be considered as not a vowel: "a_ uniform", but "a_N_ old car"; "Y a-t-il", not "Y-t-a-t-il".
Nevertheless NWC browser plug-in keeps on working fine, so bad I don't know how to make it go back to previous page when music is done!

Reply 11 offered by: Grant on 07-Feb-2002

I didn't realize this topic would be of such great interest.

About "It didn't work for me, neither": in the parts of the U.S. where I've lived (Northeast and Midwest), this phrase would be considered quite unusual, bordering on substandard. Educated speakers wouldn't use it except in jest. If Robert hears (and says) this all the time, I suspect he comes from a different part of the country.

Reply 12 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 07-Feb-2002

I have lived in various parts of the U.S. and Canada. As Grant notes, "It didn't work for me, neither" is substandard. Many colloquial expressions are substandard!

But now I live in California. Odds are about 40% that any person I meet speaks little or no English.

Substandard expressions are regional, and vary with time. Among the popular current expressions is "one of the only."

As far as I know, the expression "Me, too!" is used virtually everywhere in the English-speaking nations, rather than "I, also." Example: Who wants pizza for dinner? Reply from John: "I do!" Reply from Jane: "Me, too!" See my remark about the disjunctive pronoun in French.

I am pursuing this drift from the original topic because, from time to time, I encounter poor matches between lyrics and music in songs. The match would have been better had the composer substituted alternative lyrics (more literate, or less literate, as the case may be). Perhaps there are NWC song writers who know what I mean.

Reply 13 offered by: Grant on 07-Feb-2002

Robert,

I meant no disrespect. My purpose was only to correct what I thought was a likely misconstrual of your words, that that particular construction "didn't ... neither" was common and generally accepted in the U.S. My experience tells me this is not true.

I think, by the way, that you may be missing the distinction between colloquial and substandard (actually the gradations are much finer than this, but at least these two are distinguishable). "Me, too" is colloquial, but it's accepted as part of the spoken language by (AFAIK) essentially all educated speakers of American English. "Didn't ... neither", on the other hand, is colloquial but avoided by a large percentage of speakers, who would place it in roughly the same category as "ain't" or double negatives in general.

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 07-Feb-2002

>>you may be missing the distinction between colloquial and substandard

... or maybe you're not. I think I'll quit now.

Reply 15 offered by: Robert A. on 07-Feb-2002

Gosh, I ain't offended nohow.

In Edmonton, Canada (ca. 1970) I was startled by the use of "same difference" to mean "all the same to me." For many years, in various places, I have heard "I could care less" to mean "I could not care less."

We also have this kind of exchange: Q: Should I turn left here? A: Right!

In French, "droit" and "tout droit" mean different things.

Carlos Fuentes (Mexican author, but writing in English) once explained that in Spanish, it is rude to use the direct command verb form. Instead, a polite form should be used (equivalent: "Would you do X?" rather than "Do X!") He then went on to explain that since the polite form became normal, it took on rude meaning, so that an even politer form was neceaasry. In turn, that acquired a rude meaning, so that a yet more polite form had to be invented. By then the circumlocution was grand. So, according to Fuentes, one starts out with the most polite request, but gets no cooperation. Then, one switches to a slightly less polite form, but gets no cooperation. When, at the end, the original direct command form still gets no cooperation, one resorts to swearing.

But alas, I deflected the thread from NWC Browser Plug-In to grammar. Mea culpa.

Reply 16 offered by: Grant on 07-Feb-2002

"I could care less" I understand - this started off as sarcasm. Just as we would say "Oh, what a great idea" sarcastically when we really mean "Oh, what a terrible idea", saying "I could care less" in a sarcastic way conveys the intended message, "I couldn't care less". At some point the expression lost its sarcastic edge, though, and without that it doesn't make a lot of sense.

The one I can't for the life of me figure out is the use, common in blue-collar Boston & environs (but AFAIK nowhere else), of what might be called the "negative of agreement." This induces people to say "So didn't I" or "So isn't your mother" when what they mean is "So did I" or "So is your mother". It's hard to see how sarcasm (or anything else) could explain this.

Reply 17 offered by: Robert A. on 07-Feb-2002

That reminds me...

SOCRATES: Plato, you have as many brains as a dog.

PLATO: Take that back! You know it's not true!

SOCRATES: Very well. Plato, it is not the case that you have as many brains as a dog.

Reply 18 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Feb-2002

One of my favourites - North American English is probably the only dialect in which "Fat chance," "Slim chance," and "No chance" have approximately the same meaning.

Reply 19 offered by: Robert A. on 07-Feb-2002

I believe that marsu would be delighted to inform us that "Ça existe" and "Ça n'existe pas" may have the same practical meaning.


#2151: Hear notes
Hear notes

(2151)

Submitted by: Miguel on 12-Jul-2001

Hi!!!
I want to hear the note sounds while I´m writing them to the staff, but I don´t know how!!! That may help me to place them.
Can you help me??

Reply 1 offered by: Rich on 12-Jul-2001

NoteWorthy does not currently have an option to sound notes as they as placed.

You can play just the current staff you are working on by using shift and F5 and if you set Tools options MIDI to play from current measure of from 1 measure back, it will be of benefit when entering notes.

Rich

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 15-Jul-2001

<quote from reply to a similar question at the ng.>

You need a midi-capable keyboard or a utility such as Piano midi-in port,
which allows you to manipulate your computer keyboard as a midi input
device. Once obtained, you can utilize what you desire as follows:

Create a new document using one of the Rhythm templates of NWC. Make sure
your midi-in program is running and 'installed' into nwc in Tools > Options
> Record | Input Device. Press F4 or select Tools > Record. Switch to your
midi-in software and start playing your masterpiece.

</qoute>

Hope that makes sense.


#2152: Just how many registered users of NWC are there?
Just how many registered users of NWC are there?

(2152)

Submitted by: Mark Cloud on 12-Jul-2001

Now, it must be my insatiable curiosity, but, just how many registered users of NWC are there? I don't believe I have ever made a more worthwhile, cost effective software purchase in my life! I use the program all the time. And now another free upgrade. My, my, my... Thank you, NoteWorthy!

Mark

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 13-Jul-2001

I'm sure that Noteworthy Software isn't telling!

But once in a while, if I post something of obscure interest to users on my web site (not listed anywhere else but on this forum), I quickly get many more hits than there are named contributers to the forum.

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 16-Jul-2001

I don't know... I download your fonts more than once, but if you look on your receipt from registering, it will tell you if it isn't lying...


#2153: please help!
please help!

(2153)

Submitted by: Kris Kta on 13-Jul-2001

Hi, im looking for the piano sheet music to Achilles Heel, by Toploader. Id be really grateful if someone could tell me a website or a person that has this, whether it is self transcribed or not. thank you very much

Reply 1 offered by: Joy Byford on 14-Jul-2001

I have found a website where you can buy a book which includes this music.
http://www.music-makers.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Artists_T___V_86.html
I hope this helps
Joy


#2154: lyrics at bar 16?
lyrics at bar 16?

(2154)

Submitted by: writer1 on 15-Jul-2001

just bought noteworthy so i can do my own notation (not everyone can read my handwriting). as per standard sheet music and how i write, the lyrics don't usually start until several bars into the music, and unfortunately, i can't get noteworthy to start my lyrics where i expect to be able to put it. so how do i do it? i've just notated a piece and i want the lyrics to start at bar 16, but i can't do it! if someone can point out the obvious solution (no workarounds please, i just want it to work easily, a click here and a click there, done, that kind of thing) then this could be the start of a good friendship!
cheers

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jul-2001

Select the starting notes, go to Edit | Properties, Notes tab, and change the Lyric Syllable option to never for the notes that you do not want to have a lyric. You can also use special characters in the lyric to skip syllables, as explained in the User's Guide and Help file.

See also: msg #1505

Reply 2 offered by: writer1 on 16-Jul-2001

fantastic! i'll drink to that!
works like a charm.

Reply 3 offered by: writer1 on 16-Jul-2001

I've been notating more today and doing the lyrics thing, and i have to say THANK YOU again. this is great!
I'll have my songbook out before I know it


#2155: NWC 1.70.9
NWC 1.70.9

(2155)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 16-Jul-2001

Rev. 9 of 1.70 has just been posted.

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 16-Jul-2001

Robert, did Eric hire you to do the annoucements now? ;) Any way, now NoteWorthy is out of excuses.... After 9 comes ten, and ten would be the same as one unless a new version is released!!!!!!!!!!

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 16-Jul-2001

I think it has something to do with time zones. I am 3 hours behind NWC time. So, if they post something during their business day, I will find out about it when I log on mid-morning, or mid-afternoon, depending on the day. Our friends in Europe won't find out until the next day.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 16-Jul-2001

Here in Oz we know tomorrows news today!
(Which is why Andrew is always ahead of the game).

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 17-Jul-2001

FranMan wrote: "After 9 comes ten, and ten would be the same as one unless a new version is released!!!!!!!!!!"

Not in the never-never land of software release numbering. In this particular reality, what comes after 1.70.9 is likely to be 1.70.10, which is not (!) the same as 1.70.1. Software rule #1: Rational expectations do not necessarily apply.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Jul-2001

Ah, but they do in Her Majesty's service, wherein James Bond was Agent 007 rather than Agent 7.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Jul-2001

If James had bionic parts added, would he become Agent 007.1? Or would he get a whole new version number?

'Course, in the States they do away with those leading zeros. Otherwise we'd have had Agent 086 and Agent 099.


#2156: Problems with NWC's Midi
Problems with NWC's Midi

(2156)

Submitted by: Jordan Witherspoon on 17-Jul-2001

Hi. I have a weird problem in NWC that I cna only have 8 staffs and if I include anymore than that, it will give the added staffs a weird midi drum sound. I cant seem to overcome this. It is really frustrating when I am trying to write more large scale works. Is there a fix for this or anything I can do to overcome this?

Also, is there a way to do trills in NWC or do I have to write out the notes manually?

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 17-Jul-2001

When you add a staff, NWC automatically assignes the next vacant midi channel to that staff. This means that if you already have 9 staves and add another, NWC will give it midi channel 10, that's the percussion channel.

You can always manually change a staffs midi channel from Edit > Staff Properties > MIDI.

Don't assign to different staves to the same channel.

Hth.

PS: On midi channel 10, every individual pitch is assigned to a specifical instrument. You can learn them from the sample mididrum.nwc

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 17-Jul-2001

Trills:

NWC has no built-in trill capability.

If you want just the look of a trill, use the trill symbol from the BOXMARKS font available from the NWC Scriptorium's "Helpful files" section.

If you want the sound of a trill, you have to write out all the little notes manually (cut&paste can ease the laboriousness of this a bit).

If you want both, use a visible but muted staff for the look and a hidden but audible staff for the sound.

About Ertugrul's comment "don't assign different staves to the same channel". This is true most of the time, but I've never run into trouble with this as long as the instrument patch is the same on all staves on the same channel. You just have to remember that events are sent on a per-channel basis and that things like MPC's, patch changes etc. are going to apply to all staves sharing the channel.

Reply 3 offered by: anna on 18-Jul-2001

i also have a midi problem.
i have a new motherboard - pentium 3.
i am using onboard audio card set in
bios as soundblaster. this is because
my other computer has the vibra128 now.
so the new computer is using driver
VIAAUDIO.
the problem is when i play my songs in
noteworthy now, the notes are not
played at the same time as the sound.
the music sounds first, then a second
later the music on the staff goes red
to show note being played. how do i
stop this?
i love your software - but i know
this problem is because of my new
motherboard. can you help me please?

anna

Reply 4 offered by: anna on 20-Jul-2001

HELP

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Jul-2001

ALthough you report that you hear the music before the note highlights, I suspect that you are actually experiencing the reverse. It is fairly common for software synthesizers to exhibit a relatively high audio rendering latency (as compared to traditional MIDI synths). There is nothing you can do in NWC to overcome the latency delay built into a synthesizer. If the mismatch between note highlights and the play back audio is distracting, you might want to disable the note highlighting (Tools | Options).

Reply 6 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 20-Jul-2001

Perhaps Noteworthy could add a User inputted "note follow delay time" in an upcoming version if you have a software synth? Then it could be adjusted to your liking. :)

Reply 7 offered by: Fred on 20-Jul-2001

Don't know whether it's applicable to your on-board software synth, but the latency can be greatly reduced in some other products (such as Yamaha's SoftSynth) by using the DirectSound driver. If you haven't already, get the current version of DirectX (free from microsoft) and see if that helps. There may be a setting in the sound configuration utility to select the DirectSound device.

Reply 8 offered by: anna on 21-Jul-2001

thank you for your help.
i understand the things you have said to me.
i will look for directsound with directx.
however, i have test again with some pieces and the midi definitely sounds before the music highlighted. i am not stupid, i can read music.
thank you!
anna


#2157: New Version vs. previous files
New Version vs. previous files

(2157)

Submitted by: Manuel on 19-Jul-2001

Hello,

Just wondering whether do I have to convert my 1.70 files to 1.70.9 and if so, how do I do it?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Jul-2001

This is not necessary.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 19-Jul-2001

As NWC Support pointed out, there is no need to do anything since the file format has remained the same throughout the V1.70 maintenance upgrades.

Even files created with previous versions will load and run properly. It's a tribute to NoteWorthy's careful programming and concern for its users that full compatibility is maintained with previous file formats. When you save such a file in V1.70 (such as after editing it) you are even warned that the "previous version of the program will no longer be able to open it."

Reply 3 offered by: Manuel on 19-Jul-2001

Thanks, but how shall I include the new features in my old files?

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Jul-2001

If you are referring to lyric alignment, this is set from Edit | Lyrics (Ctrl+L) in the Configuration tab.

Reply 5 offered by: Manuel on 19-Jul-2001

I also mean things like these:

-- New: Spacing of notes is now consistent, regardless of whether
or not the note is adjacent to an invisible item

-- New: Beams between a note in the staff and another note
extending well above or below the staff now include a slant for improved appearance

Shall this be corrected automatically?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Jul-2001

These are automatic.


#2158: problem with sustained passing tones
problem with sustained passing tones

(2158)

Submitted by: norb on 20-Jul-2001

hello

this little problem happens when i used a chromatic run (ex. C-C#-D) with tied whole notes. the tones still sound after the bar ends, yielding tonal clusters--beautiful, but not wanted in the current piece. i tried placing an eighth rest at the ends of bars to stop the note, but it still doesn't work.
can anyone help me out on this?

thanks much

Reply 1 offered by: louie on 20-Jul-2001

you have to specify all the notes with the accidental you want.
You wont see the # or b on the "tied-on" notes. but if you highlight the note, you can check if the # or b button is active in the toolbar.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 20-Jul-2001

Actually, with the latest "Web Update" to version 1.70 you will see the accidentals on notes with incoming ties. They'll appear in the "Hidden Notation" color (gray by default).

THe only time you really need to specify an accidental on the destination note is when the tie crosses a barline. On ties within a measure, the normal rules for accidentals apply and the second note will inherit the accidental specified for the first note (unless, of course, you've specified a *different* accidental on the second note).

Reply 3 offered by: norb on 20-Jul-2001

hi again
thanks for the advice. the problem is not with the accidentals, it is with the playback. i don't have accidentals on tied notes actually.
let me describe the situation: what i have is a note(B) sustained over two bars with a tie, that note flattened(Bb) for one bar, and then the next note (A) sustained with a tie over two bars. the track will stop if i mute everything else. when i play the track with the other tracks though, this track will drone on indefinitely even though i don't have anything else after.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Eidson on 20-Jul-2001

What the other users meant by a problem with accidentals is not with your notation, but with a "feature" of MIDI synthesis. If a note has an accidental and is tied to another note, the accidental'd note will sustain forever until it encounters another note with the same accidental.

To (hopefully) solve your problem, highlight the second B (the note that is tied from the first) and see if there is an accidental on it -- the toolbar should highlight either a sharp or flat, but you probably can't see it actually written out on the staff.

Either that or you have a sustain pedal notation on some other track that is on the same channel?

-j

Reply 5 offered by: norb on 23-Jul-2001

joe,

thanks for your interest and reply.
with regard to the notes, the note that received the accidental is not tied. the only tied notes are the ones that are in the key.

this is a most peculiar situation.

norb

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Jul-2001

Send me your file, and a reference to this thread, and I will figure out what is causing your problem.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 29-Jul-2001

From memory: The cause of your problem is a note tie that extends to a mismatched note pitch. I think it was a C# note (in key) to a C natural note two bars later. If you upgrade to NWC 1.70 + Web Update 8, you will be able to see the natural sign on the note that receives the tie.

If you still can't find it, feel free to send me the file again and I will give precise bar numbers.


#2159: Mallet Rolls
Mallet Rolls

(2159)

Submitted by: Lee Nuckols on 23-Jul-2001

Is there any way to write a mallet roll on Noteworthy. When you have three slashes through the stem of the note?

Hopefully I won't have to write them on with a pen after I print them out. Also can Noteworthy play a mallet roll wothout me writing all the notes out on a hidden staff?

Thanks

Lee Nuckols
BME
Murray State University

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 24-Jul-2001

To answer your first question - Yes, NWC can notate the slashes for percussion rolls / tremolo. The catch is that you have to have a special font for the roll symbol. Never fear, because the Scriptorium is here - http://www.vadu.com

Download the font called "Boxmarks" and you should be able to find the symbol you wish to print. You'll have to figure out which key it is, but once you know then just insert text and change the font to Boxmarks.

As for the sound of a mallet roll, you would have to write the notes out on a hidden staff. This takes very little time if you cut and paste the roll instead of actually typing in every 32nd (or whatever).

Hope this helps, I'm tired and I think I have the flu :\

-j

Reply 2 offered by: Lee Nuckols on 24-Jul-2001

Thanks!

Hope you feel better

Lee Nuckols

Reply 3 offered by: Manuel on 30-Jul-2001

OK, I had the same problem. I already downloaded the boxmarks.zip file. Now, after unzipping it, what should I do in order to integrate it to the fonts of NWC. Or should I just copy it from the font file and paste it into the NWC file? What is the procedure?

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Jul-2001

Briefly... Control Panel --> Fonts --> File --> Add New Font.

There's also a Boxmarks.txt file in Boxmarks.zip that should help.

Reply 5 offered by: Jeff Adlon on 11-Aug-2001

The font I prefer for tremelo effect is in the NoteRow font, also available at Scripto. It is my preference because it is bigger and centers in the note step better than the box marks version.


#2160: Rogues Gallery - Names announced
Rogues Gallery - Names announced

(2160)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 24-Jul-2001

The final photo for the Rogues gallery has now been posted and the names have also been listed.
You may notice that the number of names does not match the number of photos.

This is because we have some additional competitions.

1st Competition :
Match the 32 NoteWorthy Composer users to their mugshots.

Here are some additional competitions :

2nd Competition : Name the owner of the horse.
Which Mug claims ownership of Mug 35 (1 point)

3rd Competition : Find the Child
Three of the pictures are the children of NoteWorthy Composer users. Identify the three and say which picture the parent is. (6 points)

4th Competition : Which Photos are time linked
One of the users has submitted two files. A recent photo and one from 'a few years ago'. Can you spot the two photos linked by time? Not Mug 16 - this is treated as one (2 points)

Finally - If you would like to download a Microsoft Word (version 97 or higher) to help you with you selections, it's available from the Rogues Gallerypage or you can download directly by clicking on this link : competition.zip

The zip file contains all the thumb nail pictures and if you extract all the files to the same directory, you will be able to click on the mug number from within the Word file and the picture will be displayed on your default picture viewer. The zip file also contains a plain text file with the information for the competition.

Send me your guesses and I will let you know how many you have got right, and keep a running total on the newsgroup and forum. (Two separate totals, the main competition and then the other competitions added together - don't want to make it too easy yet :-)

Rich


#2161: Guitar notation
Guitar notation

(2161)

Submitted by: Gene C. Martin on 25-Jul-2001

Is anyone aware of an already-made guitar-chord font?
Creating my own is more work than it's worth. Just creating a regular font is more work than it's worth!

Gene.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc@yahoo.com> on 25-Jul-2001

Try Steve Allen's NRGuitar font and its "beta-test-ware" assistant program.

Refer to helpful files section of the Scriptorium for details.

Hth

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 25-Jul-2001

Prowl the usual Internet font download sites for "Frets" A, B, and C. I'm not sure whether or not they are free to the public, but I think so.


#2162: Noteworthy Command reference version 1.70
Noteworthy Command reference version 1.70

(2162)

Submitted by: Kevin Ryan on 26-Jul-2001

The above with service pack 1, 2, &3.edited by Richard Woodroffe with contributions by Fred Nachbaur and Jason Walker is it still available for download? I only got about half of it printed first time around.Where do I now find it on the site? Is it still available ? Thank you

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 26-Jul-2001

You can get it from NWC Scriptorium - click on the Command Summary link.

Since this was, in a sense, a "third party" effort, and not directly produced by NoteWorthy Software Inc. (though published with their consent) it was apparently deemed appropriate to have it available from the independently owned and operated "user support" page.


#2163: Tonal Quality?
Tonal Quality?

(2163)

Submitted by: Hank Robertson on 26-Jul-2001

A few days ago I installed an upgrade from Windows 98
to Windows ME (Oh the pain, the agony - Arrrrghhh!!)
(Not recommended unless you are a complete computer GURU!)
Well, anyway I have not changed audio cards or anything
else, however my tonal quality when playing back a NWC song
is now totally different. I mean that the songs sound like
they are being played with different instruments than before.

Has anyone else noticed this phenomonon? And if so, what did you do about it?

Thanks - The Hankster

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jul-2001

Check and see what device is selected in your midi mapper (Control Panel -> Multimedia tab -> Midi) which will control the device that's used by anything that refers to the midi mapper to determine the device (such as Media Player, even NWC if midi mapper is selected as the playback device).

In NWC you can bypass the midi mapper and choose the desired device directly. When you installed the "new bugs for old" it may have altered the order in which the devices appear in the list.

Not /certain/ that this will solve your problem, but it's worth a look.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jul-2001

You should start by trying each of your available MIDI devices, one at a time, from Tools | Options.

If this does not help, you lost access to one of your soundcard's MIDI synths during the upgrade. You should check the card manufacture's web site for Windows ME drivers, and then update your system with them.

Reply 3 offered by: Hank Robertson on 27-Jul-2001

Thanx much Fred and NoteWorthy, I'll give all that a try.
I've changed the order of the playback deviced and have gotten different sounds alright, it's just that every playback device now sounds different from before (if ya know what I mean). Since I lost so many other things (Grrrr!) when I upgraded and had to find them again, it's quite possible that I HAVE lost a soundcard synth.

Thanx again and wish me luck.

The Hankster

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 27-Jul-2001

>(Not recommended unless you are a complete computer GURU!)

Yup! I've been told Windows ME is the buggest OS Microsoft has ever made. Windows XP is supposed to fix that, but that was actually the purpose of ME!

Reply 5 offered by: Fred on 27-Jul-2001

Yes, there has been a long history of "New Bugs for Old" when it comes to Windows. Bottom line: if your system works, don't fix it!

Reply 6 offered by: Hank Robertson on 28-Jul-2001

Welllllll.... After moving things around in the Multimedia section of the Control Panel, relisting all the MIDI devices in NWC and also getting several update downloads off the net (this is an automatic function of Windows ME that can be activated and searches the net whenever you log on and downloads any upgrades it finds for Windows)I now am back to approximately where I wanted to be in sound quality. I'm afraid that I have to blame Microsoft for this problem. Perhaps one of the upgrades helped? Ah well....

Thanx to all for the advice and the sympathy :-)

The Hankster


#2165: importing midi and note resolution
importing midi and note resolution

(2165)

Submitted by: Jay Hamilton on 29-Jul-2001

I have been trying without success to limit the note value when importing midi files. I change the value[s] to longer ones [32nd notes seem to be the default and I have tried to set it to 8th notes] but the score ends up with 32nds anyway and since the midi file is poorly recorded [so it seems] the amount of work to translate the score into something useable is daunting.
Is this a bug or what am I missing

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 29-Jul-2001

Have you tried also limiting the rest values? I usually set the rests to 16 and notes to 8, but you might try making them equal values if you have not taken this step.
-j

Reply 2 offered by: Jay Hamilton on 29-Jul-2001

Thanks for your response however I had tried changing both rest and notes and just to make sure after reading your reply tried again and there is no change I still end up with 32nds and 64ths! from a midi import.


#2166: Sleigh Bells
Sleigh Bells

(2166)

Submitted by: Nigel g Simmons on 29-Jul-2001

Christmas is coming & I have no sleigh bells! I cannot find any on General Midi> Can anybody out there help me locate ( and explain how to use!!) ???

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 29-Jul-2001

In some implementations you'll find sleigh bells in the basic percussion patch (equivalent to GM "Acoustic Grand Piano") on track 10. In the sound font I'm currently using, it's the B above the treble staff.

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel G Simmons on 30-Jul-2001

Eureka! Many thanks, Grant. It was where you said it might be: And it works. Now I can finish that Chistmas piece in time.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 30-Jul-2001

You're most welcome.

In all modesty I have to admit that I didn't know this off the top of my head. Instead I found it in the file "drum.nwc" that is available in the "Helpful Files" section of the NWC Scriptorium. This is a great place to go for information from the NWC user community.


#2168: Newsgroup trouble again ;(
Newsgroup trouble again ;(

(2168)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 30-Jul-2001

I'm really curious on what the hell is happening to this server so frequently.

440 No posting!

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 30-Jul-2001

The problem has recovered...

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Jul-2001

... or not...

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 30-Jul-2001

It's down again...

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 31-Jul-2001

The ng is still out of response. What's the condition with other users?

Reply 5 offered by: Magrat on 31-Jul-2001

No activity here either. Unable to connect to server.

Sarah

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jul-2001

Same. Netscape 6.1b1 reports "Connection refused by server" even when checking for unread messages.

Reply 7 offered by: Sue Morton on 31-Jul-2001

No connection possible here either for the last three days... is someone in touch with EZUSA and can give us a status?

Sue

Reply 8 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 31-Jul-2001

I decided to be the one who hits the nail with his head and have just e-mailed Ezusa about the situation.

Curious if they will respond.

Reply 9 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 31-Jul-2001

What aquick response!

<From "System Administrator":>

Your message

To: support@ezusa.net
Subject: new.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc
Sent: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 18:24:07 -0500

did not reach the following recipient(s):

support@ezusa.net on Tue, 31 Jul 2001 18:22:45 -0500
The recipient name is not recognized
The MTS-ID of the original message is: c=us;a= ;p=american
systems;l=EZUSA010107312322P9J2G628
MSEXCH:IMS:American Systems:EZUSA:EZUSA01 0 (000C05A6) Unknown Recipient

</From "System Administrator">

I guess Ezusa is entirely dead?

Reply 10 offered by: Andrew on 31-Jul-2001

>I guess Ezusa is entirely dead?

I think the reply meant that it is still alive, but they have no "support". Which is probably accurate. ;-)

I've sent one to postmaster and not received any prompt replies. I'll wait and see what happens next.

A

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jul-2001

Hey! You guys fixed it! ;-)

Reply 12 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 01-Aug-2001

Or not - as the case may be.

Yesterday's brief flurry of activity was just a tease to keep us interested.

Rich

Reply 13 offered by: Bill Mullins on 01-Aug-2001

1 Aug, 2001, 0945 hours
I got in. Reading message now. Was concerned ezusa mighta been caught by the Code Red worm.

Reply 14 offered by: Magrat on 01-Aug-2001

7pm BST. Once again no activity. I could access this morning! Bout 6 as I recall! GRR...I don't remember it ever being THIS bad!

Reply 15 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 01-Aug-2001

After having worked for about half an hour, it's dead now (August 2, 2001 Thu, 00:04 GMT +2)

Reply 16 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 01-Aug-2001

...it's however "accessible" but I'm unable to post.

Reply 17 offered by: Sue Morton on 02-Aug-2001

Still no chance here, haven't even had the brief moments of success y'all have enjoyed...

Reply 18 offered by: Ann Macfarlane on 02-Aug-2001

I had problems a few days ago when I connected to the newsgroup and all my NWC mailbox was inexplicably deleted - I've connected on and off since then, and the mail was filling up again and downloading fine (sporadically). For the first time today, just now, it looked as if all was working again, and on clicking on "get all mail" instead of downloading anything, all my folder was once again wiped out- what on earth is happening? (all my options are as they have always been)

- Ann (even more perplexed!)

Reply 19 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Aug-2001

I've seen weird things like this also (using Netscape). Once it reported 88 unread messages but wouldn't display them (later it turned out there were only 5 unread messages). Another time I had the same thing happen, apparently all message headers gone... but reappeared when the server was in one of its rare moments of coherence.

I suspect all will be well again once it's all running properly. If not, we'll all just have to unsubscribe/resubscribe.

Reply 20 offered by: FranMan on 02-Aug-2001

Why do we need the newsgroup? Can't we just use this forum? I don't know... I'm just asking, but the forum has never crashed!!

Reply 21 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Aug-2001

My take on this is that the two resources fill different needs; the forum tends to be more technical, and gets archived by NoteWorthy Software into the offline version which can be accessed as a Windows Help file. OTOH, the newsgroup tends to be more casual, and has the benefit of allowing file attachments. It has more of a "chat room" feel to it, whereas the forum should - in my opinion - be more of a reference resource.

Reply 22 offered by: Andreas "Xylofonius" Kryger Jensen on 03-Aug-2001

Yahooo, It's up again.

Reply 23 offered by: Sarah  on 03-Aug-2001

Andreas,

It isn't,now! 22:10 03/08.

Sarah

Reply 24 offered by: Andreas Jensen on 03-Aug-2001

Hmm, isn't responding again. *Sigh*

Reply 25 offered by: Walt on 03-Aug-2001

Can someone explain the difference between Ezusa and Usenet?
Maybe switching the group to usenet is the answer.

Reply 26 offered by: Sue Morton on 03-Aug-2001

The WHOIS for ezusa.net lists as Administrative, Technical, and Billing contact:

Porter, Matt (MP2346) matt@AMERICANSYS.COM
American Systems
5424 Rufe Snow #320
Fort Worth, TX 76180
(817)485-6547 (FAX) (817)485-2193

Has anyone contacted him?

Reply 27 offered by: Barry Graham on 03-Aug-2001

A new statistic for Richards list.

"The last message ever posted on the NWC newsgroup - Peanutjake 3 Aug 2001 - (NG R.I.P.)"

Reply 28 offered by: rich on 04-Aug-2001

Let's hope not !

Reply 29 offered by: Ann on 04-Aug-2001

I hope all is restored very soon - I'm beginning to get this urge to do gardening and an overpowering craving for sherbert.

Are these classic withdrawal symptoms?

- Ann

Reply 30 offered by: Jason Walker on 04-Aug-2001

Good Grief!

I leave you all on your own for a week, and you've gone and broken the newsgroup!

I was hoping that I wouldn't have too much catching up to do when I got back, but this is silly.

Jason.

Reply 31 offered by: Rich on 04-Aug-2001

If you're looking for something else to do, you can always try to improve your rogues gallery score :-)

Rich.

Reply 32 offered by: Sue Morton on 05-Aug-2001

Newsgroup still OTL from here...

The company that owns EZUSA.NET has a support e-mail: support@americansys.com

Do we have an official contact to interface with Ezusa? (I'd assume it would be somebody paying the bill) ... If I can help let me know, I'd be happy to start e-mailing around and see who I can scare up.

Sue

Reply 33 offered by: Sue Morton on 05-Aug-2001

FWIW, tracert to news.ezusa.net works from here, but that's all...

Reply 34 offered by: Geoff Walker on 05-Aug-2001

Still down, 19:45 BST (GMT+1). Been down the past two days and only one message showed on Friday.

Geoff

Reply 35 offered by: Sarah  on 05-Aug-2001

Walt,

The group isn't on USENET for one pertinent reason - SPAM. If this group were on USENET, rather than the independent server it is now, it would be swamped with spam like 90% of USENET is now. I know this is frustrating, but I would rather wait until it's fixed, than have to wade through adverts for penis enhancements and porn.

Sarah

P.S. As of 9pm BST, it's STILL down!

Reply 36 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 05-Aug-2001

The one and only cure for SPAM is a moderated group. (eg, soc.religion.islam on the Usenet and turkmusikisi at yahoogroups are moderated to name two)

However, a moderated group would be 'overkill' for Eric. Another idea may be starting a user sponsored (unofficial as the Scripto is) moderated yahoogroup.

Reply 37 offered by: Walt on 05-Aug-2001

Oh, well. I was going to premiere my piano concerto on esuza, but I guess I'll have to give it to the New York Philharmonic now.

Reply 38 offered by: Andrew on 06-Aug-2001

Well, Walt. All I can say is that ezusa has always come back from the dead before. But I'd have to add that this is the longest it has been down for.
If you (or anyone else) wants to show off your piano concerto in the mean time, you only need upload it somewhere and post the URL for it on this forum.

The Scriptorium is still up and working and anybody wanting to send me NWC files is very welcome to do so.
Please visit http://www.vadu.com/nwc/submit.html for details.

Andrew

Reply 39 offered by: Bill Mullins on 06-Aug-2001

Well, it's Monday morning, 8/6, and the NG is still down. I'm not sure when the last time I was able to get into it. the latest DATE I can find is the 1st. I am beginning to wonder if ezusa didn't get hit by the Code Red worm. It is supposed to have shwon up in a couple of variants.

I still say, we need to do something EXTREMELY drastic to the miscreants that create/launch these malicious programs. The vikings had an execution method I find appropriate for the effects these vandals cause. The Vikings would slit a man's bely open and nail a loop of his small bowel to a post. Then they would drive him to run in circles around the post until he had disemboweled himself. Maybe a couple of these - simulcast on CNN and the web would go some distance towards towards curbing such behavior.

I am not really serious about disemboweling the creators of viruses and the like but I am serious that the WORLD needs to get serious about prosecuting such crime. A single virus can cost MILLIONS or even THOUSANDS OF MILLIONS (billions?) of dollars world wide. They drive up the cost of goods and services on a global scale. Every nation that wants/expects to be part ot the community of nations must agree to punish such activities severely. If Outer Slobovia refuses to prosecute/punish a virus creator living in their borders, then their loans to the wold bank equal to the estimated damage can be called in. I thing the threat of wrecking the economy of Outer Slobovia would get the Slobovian officials' attentions.

Or not, as the case may be.

Rant over.

Reply 40 offered by: Sue Morton on 06-Aug-2001

Alright, I can't stand it any longer!

I have e-mailed both support and matt at americansys.com, we'll see what (if anything) they have to say to me. I made it clear I was a user only and could be safely ignored if someone in more authority is in touch with them over the server. I hope that disclaimer will suffice for my meddling! :>

Reply 41 offered by: Sue Morton on 06-Aug-2001

Had a reply back from Matt Porter right away. Here's what he had to say:

We are having quite a bit of trouble with our newsgroup server. We installed the Code Red patch that prevents that nasty worm from spreading. But for some odd reason it made the newsgroup server go haywire.

It's been my life day and night for over a week to get this back up and running. I'm guess worst case we are a day or two away from being 100% up.

Thanks for checking in.

Please let me know if you have any questions.

Sincerely,
Matt Porter
American Systems

So, I guess we hang in there, us nwc newsgroupies! :> Can you imagine, getting hit with the PATCH to the worm??? Egads...

Reply 42 offered by: Andrew on 06-Aug-2001

Gee Sue, you must have asked him really nicely, 'cos he didn't reply to my e-mail to support@ezusa.net

Either way, the server is back up and running now.
Agreed, how ironic for it to be down because of an installed PATCH! But that must mean that they are running a Microsoft server. Bad idea.

Reply 43 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 07-Aug-2001

> 'cos he didn't reply to my e-mail to support@ezusa.net

I got that reply:

<repost>

<From "System Administrator":>

Your message

To: support@ezusa.net
Subject: new.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc
Sent: Tue, 31 Jul 2001 18:24:07 -0500

did not reach the following recipient(s):

support@ezusa.net on Tue, 31 Jul 2001 18:22:45 -0500
The recipient name is not recognized
The MTS-ID of the original message is: c=us;a= ;p=american
systems;l=EZUSA010107312322P9J2G628
MSEXCH:IMS:American Systems:EZUSA:EZUSA01 0 (000C05A6) Unknown Recipient

</From "System Administrator">

</repost>

Reply 44 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 07-Aug-2001

2:30 AM GMT + 2:00

Down again...

Reply 45 offered by: Sarah  on 07-Aug-2001

KNEW it was too good to last!

Reply 46 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 08-Aug-2001

I can download messages but cannot post!

'441 (620) Article Rejected -- Insertion into group (null) of article (null) failed.'

Anyone facing this?

(21:45 GMT + 2:00)

Reply 47 offered by: Andreas Jensen on 08-Aug-2001

I can't even access the server. :-(

-- Andreas

Reply 48 offered by: peanutjake on 08-Aug-2001

Today I can read, but I get an error when I try to post.
Wait till you hear my latest "Kidney Pie."

Reply 49 offered by: Franklin Lyon on 08-Aug-2001

I can't access the server either today. :(

Maybe it will force me to get around to submitting some stuff to the Scriptorium.

Are there any other sites available to host just the news group?

Why exactly is this happening?

Reply 50 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 08-Aug-2001

For the record, I cannot access by 2:25 AM GMT + 2:00

Reply 51 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Aug-2001

To Franklin:

Actually, ezusa.net has been more stable and reliable than the previous service we had, believe it or not. This current bout of illness and ill-temper is highly unusual.

As to why it's happening -- see Sue Morton's post in Reply 41 above. Now isn't that just the height of irony! It's down because of bugs in the patch that's supposed to protect against Code Red. The quintessential microsoft joke...

Reply 52 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 09-Aug-2001

It seems that the ng resurrects at the day time (GMT) up to evening and dies at night.

Reply 53 offered by: rich. on 09-Aug-2001

Well it was down from last night through most of today (GMT) for me. There was only a small window this evening.

Rich

Reply 54 offered by: Ann on 09-Aug-2001

Well - I had downloaded the latest 84 messages earlier, and just thought I would collect any others quickly before reading through them, - connected to the site, clicked on "synchronise newsgroup" and zap - all the messages in my folder disappeared. This is about the 4th time it's happened. I'm really confused. How do I get them back? Why does it happen? (using Outlook Extinguisher)

Totally perplexed,
Ann

Reply 55 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 09-Aug-2001

By 1:30 AM (GMT + 2:00), the group is back alive for another unpredictable period of time.

Reply 56 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 09-Aug-2001

...False alarm.

I tried to post something. Didn^t post, didn't deny either. Silent as dead.

Reply 57 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Aug-2001

To interject a bit of good news into an otherwise gloomy thread: Netscape 6.1 has officially been released! It's gorgeous... they really should have waited for this rather than release the silly (and buggy) 6.0/6.01 nonsense. Also got rid of some rather glaring bugs in the beta.

Netscape 6.1 info

Don't want to register after installing? Just click Cancel.

Reply 58 offered by: Jill on 10-Aug-2001

I would upgrade to the latest Netscape but am afraid to because everytime I do I cannot hear MIDI files. It says something about octet stream and there is no plug in available. I download Crescendo and get the same message and still cannot hear MIDI files. No point in me upgrading if I can't hear them since that is what my website focuses on, so I stick with Communicator 4.77 and have no problems hearing MIDI files. If I could find out what I need to hear MIDI files with Netscape 6 family I would upgrade.

Reply 59 offered by: Jill on 10-Aug-2001

The newsgroup administrator probably installed the patch incorrectly, from what I read there were some important steps to go through to make sure it worked and if you didn't install the patch properly the cure could be worse than the disease. This is probably what happened. If they didn't install the patch correctly the worm could still have gotten in from an infected user who didn't know they were infected, and then they could have tried to remove the worm which ALSO has a few steps you must pay attention to and do so that it can be effectively quarantined and gotten rid of. In any case they are probably going to need to call in an expert to get whatever they messed up fixed again.

Here are two URLs about the Sircam worm for instance, notice the steps you have to go through and if you don't go through all those steps properly it won't work:

http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/pf/w32.sircam.worm@mm.html

http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/w32.sircam.worm@mm.removal.tool.html

Reply 60 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Aug-2001

Jill wrote: "... I would upgrade to the latest Netscape but am afraid to because everytime I do I cannot hear MIDI files. It says something about octet stream and there is no plug in available."

I assume you had trouble with 6.0 or 6.01. You and everyone else, because the "helper applications" thingie didn't work right. This has been fixed in 6.1 and you can assign mime types and file extensions as desired. I associated midis with Vanbasco, works fine.

Also, since it's so different from 4.x, it installs in a completely different directory and puts its profiles in a different place also. You can have both versions on your system with no interaction between them (I do). It initially imports your 4.x profile, but from then on the two versions are independent and cohabitate very peacefully.

Fred

Reply 61 offered by: Jill on 10-Aug-2001

Ok Fred, sounds good, will download 6.1 and see how it goes.

Reply 62 offered by: Jill on 10-Aug-2001

Still not working, can't hear MIDI files with Netscape 6.1.

Reply 63 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 10-Aug-2001

For the posterity:

The newsgroup is dead by 1:00 AM GMT + 2:00

Reply 64 offered by: FranMan on 10-Aug-2001

Does Netscape 6.1:
1. Take up more or less space than 4.7?
2. Support Style sheats?
3. Support XML?
4. Take even long to do things than 4.7?
5. Contain Netscape composer?

Reply 65 offered by: Artur on 10-Aug-2001

I'm acessing everyday from Brazil and haven't got a problem on this forum, is this a local problem?
anyhow, can't you stop saying each time you can't connect here? I'm getting tired of more and more replies that says the time of your problems, get over yourselves, find something useful to do with the internet other than noting down each time you can't connect!

Reply 66 offered by: Rich on 10-Aug-2001

People are useing the forum to talk about the newsgroup that they can't connect to.

No one has a proble connecting to the forum.

Reply 67 offered by: Jeff Adlon on 10-Aug-2001

Was out of town for a couple of days last week and when i came back, I was able to download from the NG. However over the weekend the group quit downloading anything new and on Monday(?) all the entries in the NG's folder on my PC vanished. Now I've gotted two emails that i suspect to be Sicam bugs. I wonder if it got my email address for the NG?

I'm being patient.

Reply 68 offered by: Grant on 10-Aug-2001

>>> No one has a proble connecting to the forum.

Maybe, but try posting an NWC file here.

Reply 69 offered by: Jill on 10-Aug-2001

It could either be Sircam or Code Red, those are the two hot potatoes right now.

About a week ago I was really bombarded with Sircam emails on an email account I use for online purposes; they come with large attachments, but I never open them. I run Norton every day, which checks for Sircam. Even though it takes longer to send and receive mail, it is worth it to set up your anti-virus program to scan all email. And I have one email address I never ever use online for any reason, and it never gets spam or sircam emails.

Newsgroup is different from the forum Arthur, I for one like to know when others who post in the newsgroup can't get in, so I don't think it's on my end somehow.

As for Netscape 6.1 I spent a good part of the afternoon trying to get it to work with Crescendo, now it is working but it only plays parts of the MIDI files. I don't have that problem with 4.77 Communicator so will stick with that for web browsing. Will be using 6.1's Composer though, that program is alot better for creating web pages.

Reply 70 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Aug-2001

FranMan asked:
Does Netscape 6.1:
1. Take up more or less space than 4.7?

Less. But with the qualification that if you count the Sun Java 2 runtime engine, then it takes up a bit more. The base download (without java) is just under 10 megs.

2. Support Style sheats?

Yes.

3. Support XML?

Yes.

4. Take even long to do things than 4.7?

No. The beta and the (what I call) alphas 6.0 and 6.01 were horribly sluggish but the 6.1 release seems to render webpages a lot faster then 4.7x

5. Contain Netscape composer?

Yes.

Reply 71 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Aug-2001

About Crescendo -- just to see if it's gotten any better I downloaded the 5.1 version. As Jill reported, it would not properly play some midi files (Netscape 6.1). So I removed it, and reinstalled into Netscape 4.78; it was marginally better, but still didn't play all tracks of some midis (notably my "The Bridge" midi on my website).

I suspect it's a system resources issue; if you have a dense midi (as The Bridge, with all its pitch bends) you need a screaming fast computer to keep up with it all -- especially under Netscape 6 which does require more system resources.

Crescendo? Bah. Uninstall, dit, done. Back to my native soundcard and VanBasco midi player as browser plugin, which hasn't failed me yet.

Reply 72 offered by: Rich on 11-Aug-2001

Ho hum - yawn

I guess I'll have to get round to using NoteWorthy if I can't use the forum ;-(

Reply 73 offered by: Rich on 11-Aug-2001

Did you spot the deliberate mistake ?

Reply 74 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Aug-2001

Yes, feel free to use the forum...

Reply 75 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 11-Aug-2001

For the record:

By 21:39 GMT, the ng is dead.

PS: Those who feel tired of reading such kind of reports are free just NOT to read them.

Reply 76 offered by: FranMan on 11-Aug-2001

Fred,
Thanks for responding to my questions about Nescape 6.1. You said that with java, it takes up a bit more than 4.7. Is that with a java enabled 4.7 or a base 4.7? Sorry about all this specific size question, but I have a small hard drive...

BTW, as long as Netscape is a little off the topic as far as NWC, does anyone know of a good forum for general tech support. I realize I should as this in a tech forum, but that's the problem... and besides this can relate to MIDI which relates to NWC...

Reply 77 offered by: Joe Roberts on 11-Aug-2001

I guess there's no other way to communicate than through this forum. It's good to see the familiar names here, as well as new ones.

Is there any way to share NWC music files, unless the newsgroup comes back to life?

Best wishes to all,

Joe Roberts

Reply 78 offered by: FranMan on 11-Aug-2001

Yes, actually, there is a way. First get a free web site. You can go to www.20m.com or www.geocities.com to get one. Then upload your files unto the server in --I think-- binary format. Finally, make a line that says, you can download my master piece by clicking here.

Reply 79 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Aug-2001

FranMan said "...You said that with java, it takes up a bit more than 4.7. Is that with a java enabled 4.7 or a base 4.7?"

Hmm.. not sure, having never downloaded a base 4.7. The base 6.1 download is just under 10 megs, and the version of the java runtime engine that I have is just under 5 megs, if that gives any indication. Actual space taken once installed will of course be larger, and will ultimately depend on how large you let your cache grow, and size of imported bookmarks, newsgroups, mail and all that. In other words, YMMV.

Reply 80 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 11-Aug-2001

Francis,

> ...or www.geocities.com...

You cannot upload nwc files there. That's why I had cancelled my site. Most of those "free" servers restrict either the file type itself, or executing it. And -probably- all of them disallow direct linking to files except htmls.

So, you'll need to make an HTML page for each nwc.

Reply 81 offered by: Geoff Walker on 12-Aug-2001

Went to visit my daughter over the weekend. Tried to check NG on Thursday evening. Unable to connect to NG server. Come home this evening (Sunday), still unable to connect to NG. Does anyone know what is happening?

Geoff

Reply 82 offered by: Geoff Walker on 12-Aug-2001

> ...or www.geocities.com...

>You cannot upload nwc files there. That's why I had cancelled my site. Most of those "free" servers restrict either the file type itself, or executing it. And -probably- all of them disallow direct linking to files except htmls.

I am using geocities and you can link to MIDI's OK, but they restrict the filetypes you can post. One possible workaround is to put your nwc file in a zip file and post that. I have found that the free ISP's I have tried all accept zip files.

Geoff

Reply 83 offered by: Andreas Jensen on 12-Aug-2001

At http://www.subnet.dk you can have nwc-files and link directly to them.

Best regards,
Andreas

Reply 84 offered by: Shahar on 12-Aug-2001

How about an alternative to the newsgroup?
Perhaps a moderated newsgroup on usenet, which the users themselves can moderate (a few chosen ones),
or a forum (WWW board) with attachment uploading option (if anyone owns/knows someone who owns a server and can host it) maybe even on ntworthy.com?

Reply 85 offered by: Jill on 12-Aug-2001

"At http://www.subnet.dk you can have nwc-files and link directly to them."

Useful if you speak German perhaps, but most don't. (Though I confess I do know that "Klik Her" doesn't mean to click a lady on the head).

Reply 86 offered by: FranMan on 12-Aug-2001

Yah, I blew that idea, but what about the scripto server maybe Rich would let us upload files there...

Reply 87 offered by: Rich on 12-Aug-2001

Thanks for the complement but the Scripto server is nothing to do with me apart from the fact that I put alot of files on it, and most of the time, like everyone else, I rely on Andrew or Fred to do it for me.

The Scripto Server is owned by the VADU group and is based (
I think) in England. Matt Johnson is the web master there (or perhaps one of a group of web masters) and it is through is kind efforts that we have a Scripto on this server. Mat agreed to host the Scripto after we were unable to continue with the previous Scripto server.

We already are very lucky that Matt and his colleagues allow us web space, and it is quite another thing to request further use particularly since it is quite a different set of rules required to host a newsgroup.

My own opinion is that the good folks at Ezusa are working full out to cure this problem, which is not of their own making, and we give them a bit longer to sort it all out. (Remember that they are probably loosing money while this is going on).If Jill's (was it Jill?) hypothesis is correct, then they will have much to do before all is OKn again.

Rich

Reply 88 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 12-Aug-2001

Daily report for the record:

The news server is dead by 1:40 AM GMT.

PS: What about a moderated Yahoo group?

Reply 89 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Aug-2001

Reply 85 offered by: Jill on 12-Aug-2001

"At http://www.subnet.dk you can have nwc-files and link directly to them."

"Useful if you speak German perhaps, but most don't. (Though I confess I do know that "Klik Her" doesn't mean to click a lady on the head)."

Danish, actually. dk-Denmark, de-Germany (Deutschland). In German it would be "Klicken sie hier". Germans have a way of taking 50% more words to say a given thing, which is why they talk so fast. (Being a dual citizen I can say things like that and get away with it) ;-)

Reply 90 offered by: FranMan on 12-Aug-2001

Well so much for my scripto idea, BUT geocities does work - so of. It does allow for direct link, but not for NWC files, so what do you do? Easy, just change .nwc to .zip and presto, you have a "harmless" zip file. The person on the other end, just has to add .nwc to the end before double clicking. As an example, I used Moon Lite Sonata Movement 2 from the scripto server. Click Here!

Reply 91 offered by: FranMan on 12-Aug-2001

Yipes, they seemed to get a little mad at me, so I deleted the file, but if you want to try this, it worked until I tried to change the file name back to .nwc...

Reply 92 offered by: Jill on 13-Aug-2001

"Danish, actually. dk-Denmark, de-Germany (Deutschland). In German it would be "Klicken sie hier".

"Click on her hair"?
"Hand me the clicker"?
"The clicker is here"?

Ok, sorry. Couldn't resist. :) Took seven years of French and can I speak it today? No. I mean non.

If my transfer rate for Melody Lane wasn't already at close to 40 gig after only two weeks into August, I would temporarily host NWC files, or start a temp mailing list or something. But it's a mess, how do you tell people to stay away from your website???????????????????

Reply 93 offered by: John H White on 13-Aug-2001

Ertugrul has suggested using Yahoo Groups. The only snag there is their reluctance to allow attachments, but maybe that could be overcome with a bit of negotiation.
cheers,
John.

Reply 94 offered by: Andreas Jensen on 13-Aug-2001

I will prefer a newsgroup.

-- Andreas

Reply 95 offered by: Jill on 13-Aug-2001

<I will prefer a newsgroup.>

My sentiments exactly. Only we ain't got one.

Reply 96 offered by: John H White on 13-Aug-2001

I've just e-mailed Bill Pirkle, who runs a small composers' group, asking if it would be possible for his host to host this group, at least on a temporary basis, but I suspect even if it could, the sticking point would be the shere number and size of the Noteworthy attachments involved.
Cheers,
John.

Reply 97 offered by: Tobias Ware on 13-Aug-2001

I think we should wait and see what happens to our ezusa NG. I would hate to lose this wonderful raport we have, if new restrictions or rules are added (via a moderated usernet group).

Had to get my name on the forum too <grin>.

Check out my collection of NWC files at http://talk.to/tobiasware and select the "my music" links.

Tobias "hisself" ware

Reply 98 offered by: Geoff Walker on 13-Aug-2001

I would be careful about moving to Yahoo groups. My daughter, who belongs to a quilting ng, pointed out a problem with their terms and conditions. Go to

http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

And scroll down to "Content submitted or made available for inclusion on the service" to see what I mean - they want free access to your material basically.

My daughter tells me that a member of their group had a quilt design stolen and marketed, and is having a deal of trouble asserting her copyright. (The other side of Jill's problem:-( )

Their group operates on Smart Groups, and they have set the group up as a closed group (membership by invitation), which I do not feel it would be right for the nwc ng, as we want to encourage new members.

I feel we should hang fire for now and see if ezusa sort themselves out.

Geoff

Reply 99 offered by: Jill on 13-Aug-2001

<My daughter tells me that a member of their group had a quilt design stolen and marketed, and is having a deal of trouble asserting her copyright. (The other side of Jill's problem:-( )>

What a terrible shame. I have heard that it is the same on Geocities, Tripod, etc. If you upload files to their server they claim that the material is theirs to do with whatever they want. Unlike a private server where you are paying them money to host your site. Even if your daughter could legitimately claim copyright they could still say "hey you signed this agreement when you agreed to let us host your files." The legalities of this must be providing a field day for lawyers.

On the same kind of subject, this morning I had someone come through who asked for a password to view my Merry Widow song page. (It's a secret password for copyright reasons). Then he emails me back and says "thanks, we will be using your score for our theater production since we cannot find the music." That's great! I worked two weeks on that MIDI file, I spent over 50 dollars to obtain an original score from 1907 from Australia, and this group gets to use my MIDI to make money, when I don't receive a penny in compensation for slaving over the file??? Never again...

Can anyone advise me on how to incorporate a NOSAVE command in html so that people can only listen to a MIDI file, and not be able to save it? I want to incorporate it on the Merry Widow page before I allow another single person in to hear it.

Reply 100 offered by: Andreas Jensen on 13-Aug-2001

The newsgroup is up and running!!! 23:44 (GMT + 1)

But for how long? :-)

-- Andreas

Reply 101 offered by: Andreas Jensen on 13-Aug-2001

Not for very long.
It's down again. (23:48 GMT+1)

-- Andreas

Reply 102 offered by: Sue Morton on 13-Aug-2001

To Jill,

If you make your MIDI's into low-fi MP3's they are of no use to (virtually) anybody. Does require more file space and hosting bandwidth though. HTH.

To Group,

I've just e-mailed Matt again, asking for another status update. I hope he's still "speaking" to me. :> Update on NG server soon to follow (I hope).

Sue

Reply 103 offered by: Jill on 13-Aug-2001

Sue, this is a medley of the major tunes of show, that is why it took me two weeks to sequence. It's not just the waltz. So if I converted to mp3 it would be absolutely huge.

I have seen somewhere some trick for preventing a MIDI file from being saved, but I cannot remember where I found that info now that I need it. Plus not sure if it would be effective for someone who could just go into their browser cache to find it once it was downloaded to be heard.

Possible to add a "request" to have some kind of "no save" option embedded into NWC so that people couldn't save the resulting MIDI file? Probably not, probably just a pipe dream.

Reply 104 offered by: FranMan on 13-Aug-2001

Yes, I'm replyer 100. Anyway, these copyright issues are kind of scary. About making the NOSAVE option in your web page, you can click here to go to a Question and Answer Board that goes with the book HTML 4 for the World Wide Web Fourth Edition, but that anyone is free to use. Yes, I am transfering you from a forum to a forum. Good luck.

Reply 105 offered by: Andrew on 13-Aug-2001

Re: Idea of hosting ng on yahoo/egroups/whatever. Please don't! (Or not just yet). Apart from the restriction/ownership problems with attachments, it means people have to be "live" on the net to read news, and with the number of posts going through the newsgroup, that means a fair bit of conenct time (not to mention that web-based newsgroups are not keyboard-friendly, and normally insist on using the mouse to navigate).

Hopefully ezusa will get their act together soon (maybe change the server so it's not running a Microsoft system?!?). It is a shame they are having trouble, but then so are many other large servers, and hotmail and AOL have had their share of disasters in the past, too.

I'd be interested in what response Sue gets this time! It's been five days since I've been able to connect to the news server. I hope Eric is getting a refund ;-)

A

Reply 106 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Aug-2001

Jill wrote:
"Can anyone advise me on how to incorporate a NOSAVE command in html so that people can only listen to a MIDI file, and not be able to save it? I want to incorporate it on the Merry Widow page before I allow another single person in to hear it."

Won't help much, I'm afraid. Someone who really wants to will find it very simple to save your midi. Even if player/plugins like VanBasco didn't have the save function, you could capture the midi in real-time using a multi-midi client.

However, you can take steps to make your midi a lot more difficult to disassemble into any semblance of a usable score. The simplest such is to precede each staff with a rest, example double-dotted 16th rest. Yes, there's a way around that too, but I think less people will be able to deal with that, than with a simple NOSAVE parameter in html. You can get even fancier by splitting staves, jumping around from staff to staff, stuff like that. Try disassembling some of my guitar midis some day! (And no fair cheating and looking at the NWC) ;-) An example would be Sor-Study in Eb

Fred

Reply 107 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Aug-2001

PS - also have a look at MidiCrypt, a midi encryption utility that scrambles a midi beyond recognition by employing pitch-bends and other tricks. The result is a perfectly playable midi that's absolutely useless for importation into scoring sequencers.

Reply 108 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 14-Aug-2001

John at msg #2168 (reply 93) wrote:
> ...their reluctance to allow attachments...

They do allow. Just use your local mail client software or your Yahoo web account -if exists- instead of posting at the group web.

But as Andreas mentioned at msg #2168 (reply 94), I also prefer a newsgroup but a Yahoo Group is a lot cheaper! (Free)

Hth.

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 109 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 14-Aug-2001

Andrew wrote in msg #2168 (reply 105):
> it means people have to be "live" on the net to read news

Simply not. Select "individual emails" while subscribing or later. Once you download them, you can read them offline and place your reply in outbox for mass-upload. Just like reading an ng.

However, I still prefer a newsgroup out of usenet but those may have at least temporary solutions.

Regards.

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 110 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 14-Aug-2001

Belated daily report:

By AM 5:45 GMT, the news server is dead.

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 111 offered by: Jill on 14-Aug-2001

Fred wrote: <PS - also have a look at MidiCrypt, a midi encryption utility that scrambles a midi beyond recognition by employing pitch-bends and other tricks. The result is a perfectly playable midi that's absolutely useless for importation into scoring sequencers.>

That sounds alot more time efficient then the other thing you suggested, will give it a look.

Reply 112 offered by: Jill on 14-Aug-2001

Yikes, it's 300 dollars. Forget it.

Reply 113 offered by: Sue Morton on 14-Aug-2001

I've a reply back from Matt on the newsgroup server:

----------------------------------------
I'm in the process of moving newsgroups to a new server. I'm now convinced the new server is stable and I'll be moving yours over today.

I'll let you know when it's up.

Matt
----------------------------------------

So it will be very soon now... we will have our NG back...

Sue

Reply 114 offered by: Sue Morton on 14-Aug-2001

Hi Jill,

In surfing the 'net for some MIDI's awhile back, I did run into some sites that had some way of blocking the save of a MIDI, and I did not find a copy of it in my 'temporary internet files' folder as well. I confess I did not try very hard to get it but was intrigued by the method (the MIDI played using standard Windows MIDI player). If can think of what the site was/and or MIDI was, I'll see if I can find the site again for you. Then you can examine the site yourself and see if the technique would work for you... perhaps the site owner would confess as to what they did if so.

Might take me several days to get to this, so don't hold breath but I'll see what I can do.

Sue

Reply 115 offered by: Andreas Jensen on 14-Aug-2001

"So it will be very soon now... we will have our NG back..."

Yahoo, I can hardly wait.

-- Andreas

Reply 116 offered by: Jill on 14-Aug-2001

<Might take me several days to get to this, so don't hold breath but I'll see what I can do. Sue>

Thanks Sue, that would be a Godsend. I think what I saw too had to do with javascript, hiding the file name in it somehow. I too should have tried harder to figure it out, but it was awhile ago. I certainly wouldn't do it for all the song pages on Melody Lane, but certain ones that I worked really hard and are special to me, if they could be protected somehow, that would be wonderful.

Reply 117 offered by: Andrew on 15-Aug-2001

That's Good News about the ng, Sue. Thanks for letting us know. Still not up as I speak.

To anyone who is hoping to keep all their messages, be extra careful with which command you use to get new headers. If you choose to "synchronise", you may lose old messages if you're not careful. This warning is based on what Matt @ Americansys said about moving to a new newsserver. It may mean that all the message IDs change.

A

Reply 118 offered by: Sue Morton on 15-Aug-2001

Still no word from Matt on the ng... I guess that means we have to be patient...

Jill,

Go here:
http://www.hartsvriendin.nl/upwherewebelong.html

This is one of the ones I remembered not finding the MIDI in my temporary internet files... I admit I really haven't looked to see where it might have gone, just happened to think of this URL at this moment. This one does not use a visible midi player to play the MIDI.

Check it out thoroughly and see if the MIDI is truly inaccessible. When I can, I'll keep looking, I know I ran into a site where it seemed more 'normal' but I wasn't able to get the MIDI, although as I mentioned before I didn't try all that hard.

Good Luck,

Sue

Reply 119 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Aug-2001

This site uses the bgsound tag, e.g.:

<bgsound SRC="crazy1[1].mid" LOOP=1>
Two problems: 1: it only works in IE. 2: It's very easy to defeat by viewing page source, searching for .mid, and pasting the result in the URL bar. Example:

http://www.hartsvriendin.nl/crazy1[1].mid

That will launch your usual player (e.g. vanbasco), from which you can save to disk with the click of a radio button.

Hm... maybe we should come up with our own Midi-cryptographical scrambler program.

Reply 120 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Aug-2001

If you know who you plan to send the song, PGP and other cryptographic tools would probably suffice.

If you want a general MIDI cryptographic scrambler, with a generally available reader, it wouldn't take long for a motivated person to crack it, in my oppinion. A dedicated server that de-scrambled the files would be harder to crack, but with enough incentive, probably could still be figured out.

Reply 121 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 16-Aug-2001

For the record:

This is the eighteenth day without the newsgroup.

AM 6:08 GMT

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 122 offered by: Sue Morton on 16-Aug-2001

Thanks Fred. I thought I had tried that -- view the source and then just get the .mid -- and that it hadn't worked. Perhaps I remembered the wrong URL, there were so many when I was searching for that song! And I only have IE, so for me it's hard to know when something will/won't work in all the other browsers (not just Netscape)...

Reply 123 offered by: Sue Morton on 16-Aug-2001

Message received from Matt regarding the newsgroup:

------------------------------------------------------
Your newsgroup is in a new location.

It's at nntp://news2.ezusa.net

Please let me know if you have any questions.

Sincerely,
Matt Porter
American Systems
-----------------------------------------------

Everyone, start your newsreaders!!!!


#2169: Trying to figure out midi import options.
Trying to figure out midi import options.

(2169)

Submitted by: David Palmquist on 31-Jul-2001

OK, let's find out about opening (used to be importing) (downloaded) midi files. There's no help for the following boxes on the step 1 screen - notate pedal marks, insert instrument changes, detect compound time. What is the effect of checking or not checking these?

I can choose anywhere from a whole note to a 64th note for note resolution - if I import a midi file that has 64ths or 32nds, but choose quarter notes or whole notes, what effect does that have for my on-screen display and on playback when the import is complete? I still get 64th notes on the screen. I have a couple less choices for the rest resolution, but selecting whole note rest values still gets me half-rests and dotted half-rests on Night in Tunisia.

In step 2, what happens if I do or don't select map each channel to a separate staff? What's a midi channel versus a midi track? The help button isn't terribly understandable, and is meaningless to me.

Still in step 2, when I set the maximum single track chord size to 3, and import a file with a banjo staff (4 notes in many of the chords), it opens a banjo staff with 3 notes in the chords, and puts the root (1 note) in a separate staff. This would seem to contradict the help message, which I think indicates I would have 4 separate staves as long as the notes were more than 3 semitones apart. In order to split the chords, would I merely import the file, selecting the 3 semitone feature, save the file as a midi, reopen it using the 3 semitone feature, save, reopen, save and reopen, and thus get the 4 note chords separated into separate lines as effectively as the chordsplitter utility someone posted?

Now in step 3, I get a listing of the tracks and channels. I guess it's useful, but I haven't got a clue what it means except I'm probably going to get a whole bunch of staves if it lists a whole bunch of tracks. Is there a problem when/if two tracks have the same channel?

(The F1 key doesn't produce a help message in Step 3).

Any "plain language for the dummy" explanations you could provide would be helpful to many users, I think.

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 31-Jul-2001

You can get a complete description from the Command Summary which is available from the "Scriptorium" a user sponsored site at http://www.vadu.com/nwc

There is also a link on the NoteWorthy home page.

On the Scriptorium home page scroll down to "Other Features" and follow the link to "Command Summary for v1.70".
The section you are interested in is Section 2 "Control and File Menus".
The file can be downloaded in pdf, postscript or MSPublisher format.

But what the heck - download the entire summary (see the "Click here for the complete pdf file" link above the table. You won't regret it.
You will need Adobe Acrobat Reader to read/print the file.
This can be downloaded free from http://www.adobe.com

There's more useful stuff there than I can fit into a reply
If you get the summary and have trouble following the description ask here again.

Good luck!

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Jul-2001

>There's no help for the following boxes

There is help for these items. You can get it by either:

- Right Click method, selecting What's This
- Set focus on the item and press F1
- Use the ? in the top right of the wizard window then click on the control

Reply 3 offered by: David Palmquist on 31-Jul-2001

Thank to Barry and NWC Online. Enough you've given me enough info to satisfy my question(s).


#2170: Playback cancels out notes?
Playback cancels out notes?

(2170)

Submitted by: David Palmquistq on 31-Jul-2001

If I have two staves set up for different instruments, and run a melody on one and a counter melody on the other, if there happens to be a place where both lines are playing the same note, only one speaks. Is this because they cancel each other out, and if so, is there a workaround such as setting the staves to different channels or something?

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 31-Jul-2001

Yes, the staves should be set to different channels, but it is the default behaviour when you create two staves. If they are, and if the problem persists, maybe it is a problem with your sound card or device ?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jul-2001

This is a common difficulty with midi. Two identical tones with either cancel partly, or add to each other in-phase, depending on the pitch, because of the very slight delay between two subsequent notes in the midi stream.

Suggestions:

1: Put the two voices on separate channels as you suggest. This won't get rid of the problem, but will make 2: - 4: possible.

2: Pan the two voices off center; put one slightly to the right (pan about 80) and the other to the left (pan about 48).

3: Put a slight pitch bend at the start of each staff; one about +200 and the other about -200. This will help prevent notes from being perfectly in phase.

4: If your sound card supports reverb, put different amounts of reverb on each staff (e.g. 40 and 60).

HTH

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: David Palmquist on 31-Jul-2001

Thanks guys - you've given me enough info to satisfy my question(s).


#2173: varying note lengths
varying note lengths

(2173)

Submitted by: Rick Cohen on 02-Aug-2001

I just figured out how to connect my Casio keyboard to get it to work with NWC, but all the notes that it imports are quarter notes. How do I get it to import the notes at the length that I play them?

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 03-Aug-2001

There are two ways to use your midi keyboard to enter notes.
1) Stepwise: set the note length using your computer keyboard's 1-6 keys (or the +/- keys) and then enter the note with your midi keyboard (can do chords too, I think).

2) Realtime MIDI import. Setup a metronome track (percussion track (normally channel 10) - do a click or whatever you want, and do a local repeat set at 100 or whatever). Then press F4 and away you go! It will import your performance according to what MIDI import parameters you set (too many details for this post).

HTH


#2174: Rhythm Guitar
Rhythm Guitar

(2174)

Submitted by: Jack Grover on 03-Aug-2001

HI
Does anyone know how to make a decent guitar strumming sound so I can put some rhythm guitar into my songs. Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Aug-2001

Depending on the tempo of your song, you can use a series of 64th notes (or tripletted 64 notes if you want it even faster), each tied to a following chord. Works quite well at most folk/rock/pop tempi (120 or thereabouts). It does end up rather busy-looking, so you might want to put this in a hidden staff, and have a "visual" (muted) staff with either the chords or just chord symbols, depending on preference.

Reply 2 offered by: Andy Mitchum on 26-Aug-2001

I did about the same thing as the first reply. Wrote a piece in cut time and scored chords on one staff using eighth notes. Copied and pasted to fill it out, used automatic beam to connect them, and used staccato markings to get the bar effect.


#2175: Plugin formatting
Plugin formatting

(2175)

Submitted by: Jim Ross on 03-Aug-2001

Is there any way to cause the plugin to display a score in page layout format instead of just one long "song" like you see it in Composer?

Thanks

Jim

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Aug-2001

No, not at this time.


#2176: Instrument Patches
Instrument Patches

(2176)

Submitted by: Stan on 04-Aug-2001

I'm afraid I'm a novice when it comes to all this midi terms. I'm a folk harpist trying to turn composer. I like the wide assortment of instrument patches that comes with NWC, but I was wondering if there is a way to get more, or better patches. Or is the quality of sound more to do with the sound card one has. For instance the cello sounds pretty much like a cello, but the contrabass just sounds like a cello, and the violin is a bit of a streach unless you do some creative notation. I love some of the synth sounds, but again it's hard to get the sounds you want out of some of the instruments.

I guess I'm probably too new at it to get the sounds I really want. Can anyone suggest a midi book for people who are not a computer wiz. Here is my website so you can hear what I'm talking about if you like:

http://www.geocities.com/rhean-rhe/StansMidiPg.html

I don't know if that kind of thing is incouraged here, this is my first time at this board, seems very nice and friendly and helpful.

I would like to learn to do some of the tricks I hear everyone talking about. I'm afraid my composisitons are all straight notation with very little techno embelishment. I don't even have a midi keyboard yet.

Well thanks for any help you can provide.
Stan

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 05-Aug-2001

NWC and other MIDI sequencers don't include patches. It's either your soundcards wavetable or -if your soundcard supports- your soundfonts that include them.

If your soundcard supports soundfonts (ref. your manual), you can download many diffrent soundfonts that include either a single patch or a set of all 127. Many websites stand for soundfont download, HammerSound, The Sound Site to name a few.

Unless your soundcard has soundfont support, you're not miserable yet. You can download and install a software syntesizer for different instrument sounds. Yamaha XG and Roland GS supply limited free trials.

If your soundcard does support soundfonts, you can still use soft-synthesizers.

Hth

Reply 2 offered by: Stan on 05-Aug-2001

Thanks, I will try that.


#2177: Some Roguish answers
Some Roguish answers

(2177)

Submitted by: Rich on 04-Aug-2001

Rogues Gallery

Well as promised, here are the results of the secondary competition - if this NG stays alive long enough for me to type this :-(

(I won't reveal the mugshots in the main competition)

The horse belongs to Sue Morton

The children of NoteWorhty users are :

Mug 19 and Mug 23 are children of Geoff Walker
Mug 24 is Philip, my son.

The time linked photo is mug 14 and is Jason Walker. But which photo is the older version of Jason ?
Besides Jason himself, only Fred got the younger version right.

This should now make things a bit easier for the main competition.

Jill B has sent in a photo of herself but of course, it's too late to enter the competition. I will put the photo into the gallery when the competition is over. It is nice to have a fave to match the writing.

In the main competition, Andew and Fred are tieing with 11 points each but Fred scored 4 in the secondary competition

Rich


#2178: entering Turkish lyrics
entering Turkish lyrics

(2178)

Submitted by: Dave Seidel on 04-Aug-2001

I just started a project for which I will be transcribing a number of Turkish devotional songs (illahileri), and quickly ran into a problem with the lyrics. I realize there was a related thread back in April, but I thought I'd share my solution.

I'm using Arial as the lyric font. For the special Turkish characters, I had to use charmap. However, certain characters won't paste properly into the lyric editor, but instead get turned into ? characters. The ones I've had a problem with so far are: small 'g' with circumflex (0xF0 or 240), small undotted 'i' (0xFD or 253) and small 's' with cedilla (0xFE or 254). (I haven't needed to use the entire alphabet yet, if ever.)

I tried different things, such as changing the font dialog's "Script" setting to Turkish, but nothing I did would convince Noteworthy to allow those particular characters to paste in.

Finally, I ended up opening up the .nwc file in CodeWright (a programmer's editor) in hex mode, which allows editing the contents of a file as a string of hex codes (I had to first figure out that I needed to tell Noteworthy to save the file uncompressed). I found the spots in the file where the lyrics, found the inserted '?' (0x3F) characters, and typed in their correct values.

Once I did that, Noteworthy had no problem displaying the characters properly. What I found most most interesting, though, is that now that I have the right characters in the file, I can cut and paste them with no problem within the lyric editor!

So at least I have a workaround that (at least for me) beats using a font editor, which I don't want to have to find, download, and learn right now. :-)

It seems to be that maybe the problem is that Noteworthy is not really Unicode enabled, or at least some of the components (e.g., the edit control in the lyric editor) are not. I would guess that a hypothetical future version that is fully Unicode-ready might solve all of these problems, but I don't know for sure.

- Dave

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Aug-2001

Yes, NWC is not Unicode enabled. The lyric text is single byte coded (ASCII). I am not sure why you had trouble with the edit control for these characters. We'll see if this can be improved.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 05-Aug-2001

Here's something that may be of help -hopefully. (I'm a Turkish NWC user and very oftenly enter Turkish lyrics)

I have uploaded two nwc files in a zip archive into a Temporary Page. One of the files include the special Turkish characters with Western script, the other with script set to Turkish.

Try copying and pasting the characters from those files and make sure you set *your* documents script to Turkish.

Hth

Reply 3 offered by: Dave Seidel on 05-Aug-2001

Thanks, Ertugrul! That's very helpful. I was hoping you might reply on this thread. I'm doing these transcriptions for Latif Bolat, I don't know if you know of him.

I'm now typing the lyrics in MS Word, then pasting them into Noteworthy, but even in this case not all the characters get pasted properly. It seems to me that the edit control is not using the same font setting for lyrics that the main score window uses, and this may be part of the problem.

BTW, I listened to a couple of your pieces in different temperments and enjoyed them. Some day I will have to get a sound card that will allow me to change tunings.

- Dave

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 05-Aug-2001

I don't know Mr.Bolat but Andrew Purdam does. [ball passed to Andrew :) ]

You don't need a special soundcard for tunings. Just use the pitch-bend controller.

Glad to have been of help.

CU

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 06-Aug-2001

[ball accepted :-) ]

Dave, say hi to Latif from Andrew (percussion and accordion) in Canberra.

Currently playing mainly Macedonian music with Nitya (flute/sax/guitar, also played with Latif in Canberra) and others.

Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: Dave Seidel on 06-Aug-2001

Hi Andrew, I will pass that on to Latif. He will be in my part of the world (northeast US) this fall, and we'll be playing a few concerts together.

- Dave

Reply 7 offered by: FranMan on 07-Aug-2001

I think the reason that the cut and pasting worked after you had put the correct characters in because they were there now. For some odd reason, MS Word does not think that the font Script is installed on my computer, but if I copy some text written in Script, it will then behave.


#2179: Annoying Rogue Note
Annoying Rogue Note

(2179)

Submitted by: Ed Tarento on 05-Aug-2001

When I press F5 to start playing, sometimes another note, a "Rogue Note (RN)" starts and keeps going. I've found that replaying the piece eventually (perhaps after one or two bars) stops the RN. Pressing F6 whilst the score is playing only occasionally stops the RN.

Pressing F6 again might stop the RN but often changes the RN note to a lower note. Once that happens, pressing F6 never stops the RN. I have to go to the top of the loop and try again.

Sometimes the only way to stop it is to exit and restart NW.

I also have the visual and sound mismatch between the notes - usually with notes of smaller duration - so, as suggested in the FAQ, I've changed the colour of the playing note to be the same as the score.

Sometimes the note stops by itself after one or two bars.

The sound card is on the mother board. I was going to try my old 32 SoundBlaster card but it's the wrong bus.

Any ideas?

Windows NT Workstation V4 SP6a
1GHz 256MB RAM (plenty of CPU and RAM available)

I have email'd support but I thought I'd try the forum as well

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Aug-2001

> Pressing F6 again might stop the RN but often changes the RN note to a lower note.

This sounds like a misbehaving driver.

> The sound card is on the mother board.

These are often the ones that misbehave.


#2180: Midi save dosent work?
Midi save dosent work?

(2180)

Submitted by: VintedVooDoo on 05-Aug-2001

I own the new version of NoteWorthy and for some reason either i dont know how to save my created songs as a midi or its not working. Could someone explain how to save a song to a midi file on my hardrive???????

Reply 1 offered by: louie on 05-Aug-2001

1. go to File > Save As
2. click the box that says Standard NWC File
3. then choose Type 0 or Type 1 midi then click save

If that's what you've already been doing but it wont work, you might have to re-install NWC

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Aug-2001

The Export function was replaced by the Save As function in the latest release.

Reply 3 offered by: Jesse on 19-Aug-2001

I have tried them both, and neither of those seem to work. I can save the file, but when I try to open it with another player, it doesn't play anything. (No Sound)

Reply 4 offered by: Keith on 19-Aug-2001

Jesse -
I tried to duplicate your problem and had more success than I expected. I can save as midi with no problem - but I can't hear any sound either. In fact, I can't hear ANY midi file. I recently upgraded Windows Media player to the latest version and I know it worked a week ago. File associations are fine.

I guess I'll be doing some digging to find out what blew up. I'll post if I find anything.
Good luck,
Keith

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Aug-2001

Start -> Control Panel -> Multimedia -> Midi defines which midi device is the Windows default. Many programs assume this default, unlike NWC which allows you to choose the device directly.

The other common problem (I still do it myself sometimes) is to have the volume turned down on the output in question. Check your volume control applet (in the system tray) :)

Fred

Reply 6 offered by: PigBucket on 21-Aug-2001

Another thing to check, and I get caught this way all the time is to check that you close Noteworthy Composer before you try to play the midi file. Obviously there is some contention for the sound card during playback of MediaPlayer and Noteworthy Composer....

Peter.

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Aug-2001

Peter - yes, even after (how many?) version of Windows, microsoft still hasn't implemented a multi-midi client (which Hubert Winkler, author of "Hubi's midi cable" claims is trivial). So only one program can capture and use any given midi device at a given time.

You can get around this with Hubi's Midi Cable (freeware), which gets around that restriction and has other
advantages, such as being able to change midi devices on the fly, say to compare the sound with different midi outs. I put it in my Start menu under Startup so that it's always available in my bozo bar. A right-click on the icon lets me instantly change devices instead of having to go through the control panel maze.

Or if you don't want to muck with this you can use NWC's Port Usage options in Tools -> Options -> Midi tab. Use "While Playing" or "While Active" as appropriate to your situation. If it's set to "Always" then other programs won't be able to use the midi port as long as NWC is running.

Fred


#2182: Help! w/ importing midi file in another sequencer
Help! w/ importing midi file in another sequencer

(2182)

Submitted by: Aaron on 06-Aug-2001

Help!! I created some files in noteworthy and have exported them as both type 0 and 1 midi files, and tried to import them into another program (Reason by Propellerheads). The notation marks show up and play, but the file does not save properly in Reason. I understand this is probably a question more for a Reason help forum, but I'd like to get as much input as I can. Noteworthy is the only program I have problems with, but other than that I love the simplicity and results it delivers. Thanks to the Noteworthy employees for continuing to update a great program!

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 06-Aug-2001

Although I don't have the sequencer program you have, I do have a different one. So far, I've had no problem bring a MIDI from NWC into the other sequencer, and saving the result in that other format. Maybe it depends upon the complexity of the score, or usage of special features. MIDI does not carry all visual notation information, no matter what program you use. That is, MIDI files contain playing instructions, not page layout information. So even if moving from one sequencer to another via MIDI is successful, the results may look different as notation.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Aug-2001

NWC exports standard MIDI files, and generally speaking, doesn't do anything out of the orinary when creating the MIDI sequence. If you are having trouble with other software working with these MIDI files, your best bet is to check in with support for the other product.


#2183: using samples as patches
using samples as patches

(2183)

Submitted by: Aaron on 06-Aug-2001

I have samples on my hard drive that I would like to use as patches or instruments (or whatever they're called). Is this possible? Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Aug-2001

This depends on your setup. If your MIDI setup supports sound fonts, then you can create a custom sound font with your sounds. If you do a little searching for soundfont in this forum, and around the web, you can learn the full details of how to do this.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 07-Aug-2001

...and even if your setup is not soundfont-capable, you can render your midi files to wav by Audio Compositor and use your soundfonts as "instrument file"s.

Warning: you may experience clicks in the resulted wave.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 08-Aug-2001

Aaron,

Further to Noteworthy's reply:
If you have a soundfont-capable soundcard, look for Vienna. I think that early versions of it (at least) are freely downloadable. You'll need to roll up your sleeves a bit to get the sounds working really well, but if quick and dirty suits, it shouldn't be too difficult. Note that these sorts of programs do have a steep learning curve to start with, so maybe Audio Compositor is easier?

HTH,
A

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 08-Aug-2001

You can't make sfs w. Audio Compositor. It stands for converting midi data to waveform using several types of "instrument files" including sf2s.

Btw, it's easy to use, indeed.

Hth.


#2184: Hidden Staff
Hidden Staff

(2184)

Submitted by: Harold Timmons on 07-Aug-2001

Using Noteworthy Composer, I have indicated that a Tempo Staff should be hidden and it is accomplished. However, when played-back using Noteworthy Player, the hidden staff appears. Why? Is there any way to preclude hidden staffs from appearing during playback?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Aug-2001

Two things:

1 - Make sure you have the newest version of the Player.

2 - Read the help section on this topic in the Player's help file: Authoring Tips | Use hidden staff groups to hide details of your music


#2185: PDF and searching
PDF and searching

(2185)

Submitted by: Mark Fields on 10-Aug-2001

I try to connect to the news server only once every 3 or 4 days, and it looks like there is a problem. I remembered the site and found the forum. Cant wait till everythings working good again.

I found some older postings about PDF. Problems is it seems you can only search one archive at a time.

Anyway just checking in with y'all.

Mark Fields

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Aug-2001

Hi Mark,

You might want to download the Offline Forum which is essentially the forum archives condensed into a Windows Help file. You can then do the usual Windows "Find" thing on it to find topics of interest.

Yeah, bummer about the newgroup... we news://news.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc addicts are having severe withdrawal symptoms... like chatting endlessly on the Forum about when it's on and off, with meanderings into other domains. :)

Fred


#2187: tape to wav is slow for others to download
tape to wav is slow for others to download

(2187)

Submitted by: vinny on 12-Aug-2001

I made a tape to wav on my computer but people cant download my song it takes 3 hours any help ?Vinny

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 12-Aug-2001

Convert it to mp3. At the usual 128kbps/stereo/16 bit rate, it's 1/10 the size of the original wav file.

Search the forum (or offline forum), there's been a lot of discussion on various mp3 encoder options.

Cheers,
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 12-Aug-2001

...or convert it to vqf, which takes half size of mp3.
http://www.vqf.com

Hth.

Reply 3 offered by: Matt Miller on 14-Aug-2001

Go to www.dalnetvqf.com for better vqf software not found on vqf.com.

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 14-Aug-2001

AFAIK, all VQF encoders use Yamaha's code. So, what's the difference?


#2188: Opening songs maximized
Opening songs maximized

(2188)

Submitted by: Keith Sheasley on 13-Aug-2001

I noticed a few upgrades ago that, whenever I open a song, it doesn't open maximized - it's only about half as large as it could be (unless another song is open and maximized). In fact, the open dialogue itself opens as small as it can be. It's a simple matter to correct it but it's annoying. Nothing obvious in the registry or an .ini file. Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 14-Aug-2001

Unless anyone else has any suggestions, you might want to take this to the Wish List. NWC does remember various other display characteristics on a per-file basis (e.g., zoom level), so it wouldn't be unreasonable to ask for it to remember window size - or at least maximization state - as well.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Aug-2001

Once you maximize the first song, and leave it open in NWC, any other songs you open will be maximized.

The open dialog, as with most dialogs, is a fixed size. In this case, the dialog is the standard one included in Windows. It does not support resizing it.

Reply 3 offered by: Rich on 15-Aug-2001

This is also annoying when using NoteWorthy player with a batch file since each successive song opens in a non maximised state.

Whilst I am not doubting the answer you (NoteWorthy) gave, I would like to understand what the difference is between what is opened in a non maximised state with NoteWorthy and what is opened in a maximised state in other programs such as Word, Excel, Agent, Powerpoint, Publisher etc etc. Help - please explain.

Thanks

Rich

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Aug-2001

I don't really understand your question Rich. In NWC, the program itself remebers its size and position on your desktop each time you start it. The files that you open do not remember their size and position, and thus open according to the following:

- if nothing is already open, it opens in an unmaximized window
- if another file is open and maximized, the new file opens the same way (maximized)

I do not know exactly how this compares to various MS apps.

Reply 5 offered by: Keith on 16-Aug-2001

Actually, the situation is a little better than you (NoteWorthy) describe. The open dialog in NWC is NOT the Windows standard - it actually IS resizable. There's a handle in the lower-right corner. And it stays the size you make it until you close the program. It just initially opens postage-stamp size - and I'm THAT lazy.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Aug-2001

To Keith -

Huh? What handle? Resize the open dialog? I wonder if we're talking about the same thing -- File -> Open gives a fixed size dialog box in every Windows app I've seen. No handles. Win95 OSR2.5.

To NoteWorthy Support -

My preferred scenario would be to open the first file to the maximum size allowed by the current app window size ("Fit to Window".) So whether or not the app window was restored or maximized, the first (or only -- as in the case of launching by double-clicking the filename in explorer) file would fill the window. With multiple files loaded one can then use Window -> Tile/Cascade as desired to order them.

Reply 7 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 16-Aug-2001

>>I don't really understand your question Rich.

>>In NWC, the program itself remebers its size and position on your desktop each time you start it.

No problem here

>>The files that you open do not remember their size and position
This is the problem. In Excel for example, when I save I spreadsheet, it also saves information about the state of the spreadsheet window when saved. So, if when I save, the spreadsheet is maximized within Excel and Excel is maximized within the desktop, when I click on the spreadsheet from My computer or Explorer, it reopens in exactly the same state that it was saved (ie maximized within Excel)

So in Excel the files that you open DO remember their size and position.

If NoteWorthy did this (both composer and player) it would, for example, resolve the problem of each file opening in a non maximized state when using a batch file to play a list of song files. The files would open in the same state that you last saved them. I think the batch file method is great for stringing a sequence of songs together, particularly from one musical, work etc – but if you want to read the lyrics, it is annoying to have to keep going back to maximize the window. (IMHO)

Is this making sense?

Rich

Reply 8 offered by: David Palmquist on 16-Aug-2001

Sorry I just put this on the wish list before checking the forum. I add my voice to the request.

NWC used to open files at maximum window size and it doesn't any longer. Word does. Excel does. Powerpoint does. IE Explorer does. I don't understand why NWC is costrained by Windows but the MS applications aren't.

At my advanced age (well, I'm 50, ok?) the mouse is more annoying than enjoyable, and making sure the arrow points to that tiny maximize icon is a distraction I don't need. I want to have my files open at a size I can use them, without having to take a couple of extra steps each time. Even a workaround such as a hotkey combination would be better than what it is now.

NWC-Online, I LOVE your program and have been using it heavily for years. I think the problem arose with version 1.70, perhaps 1.5? If can see your way clear to fix it in the next upgrade, I'm sure you will be remembered in the prayers of all registered users!

Reply 9 offered by: Keith on 16-Aug-2001

To Fred -
We are talking about the same thing. File -> Open produces a standard, non-resizable open dialog in every Windows app I can think of - EXCEPT in NWC. File -> Open in NWC produces a much smaller (initially) but resizable open dialog. There's a small handle in the lower-right corner of the dialog for clicking and dragging. I guess it IS possible to defy Windows convention.

To NoteWorthy -
This IS a small gripe - but that's because there's so little to gripe about. NWC is just about perfect. Thanks for a great app.

Reply 10 offered by: Grant on 16-Aug-2001

There are two topics being discussed in this thread. I'd like to comment on both:

1: size of the "Open File" dialog: I'm running Win98.2 and Keith's observation matches my experience. NWC's dialog is resizeable (by grabbing the lower right corner with the mouse) whereas, for example, Excel(97)'s and IE(5.00)'s aren't. Maybe this was something new since Win95.

This is nice, but it would be even nicer if NWC let you select multiple files to open per dialog. I've used other apps that allow this.

2: size of file windows in the NWC editor: Rich is correct about Excel files. When you save them they remember not only whether they were maximized or not, but (if not maximized) where they were relative to the main Excel window. I confirmed this by "de-maximizing" a spreadsheet window, moving it and saving it, then shutting down Excel. When I selected the spreadsheet from Start/Documents, it opened in exactly the same location it had when it was saved.

It seems to me that if Excel can do this, NWC should be able to do it too. (This would, IMO, be even better than just remembering whether the file was maximized or not.)

- Grant

Reply 11 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 16-Aug-2001

Keith wrote in msg #2188 (reply 10):
> EXCEPT in NWC

Not. Many other software supplies resizable open/save as dialogues, Opera Browser to mention one.

Reply 12 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 16-Aug-2001

I wrote Keith wrote in msg #2188 (reply 10). Excuse me, it's msg #2188 (reply 9)

Reply 13 offered by: Fred on 16-Aug-2001

Grant wrote:
"... I'm running Win98.2 and Keith's observation matches my experience. NWC's dialog is resizeable (by grabbing the lower right corner with the mouse) whereas, for example, Excel(97)'s and IE(5.00)'s aren't. Maybe this was something new since Win95."

I can now verify this. The resizing handle only appears in Win98; no such facility in Win95.

Fred

Reply 14 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Aug-2001

Correct. Windows 98 and up, as well as Windows 2000 support resizing Open and Save As boxes. I had never noticed this before...

Reply 15 offered by: Hannigan on 17-Aug-2001

Is this whole thing important? Just grab the mouse and bloody click on the button!

Reply 16 offered by: Grant on 17-Aug-2001

Dear Hannigan -

Some of us, especially those who are fluent on the keyboard, prefer to avoid the mouse whenever we can, especially in an application where it's possible (and faster!) to do just about everything from the keyboard. It is a distraction to have to find the mouse, drag it about until the cursor is in the right place, and then find the right hand position on the keyboard again afterwards.

Presumably the question is of some small degree of importance, or Microsoft wouldn't have expended the effort to have document windows in Excel and other apps remember their state and position.

Anyway, is it so important to you to express your disdain for a topic that some of us thought was worth discussing? Just grab the bloody mouse and click on your browser's "back" button!

Reply 17 offered by: Rich on 17-Aug-2001

Well said Grant, couldn't have put it better.

Reply 18 offered by: David Palmquist on 25-Aug-2001

I'm not going to be hostile, Mr or Ms Hannigan, but I am at an age where I need bifocals. The mouse cursor is not always easy to line up with various icons, lines and handles, and often a minute tremor in the hand moves you off the spot you need to be in.

Bear with us. Most of the input to NWC is far easier with the keyboard than the mouse. The hands move back and forth between the alpha part of the kb and the numeric keypad. Having to move over and grab the mouse is an annoyance, because then you need to look away from the screen to correctly position your hands for your next keyboard entry. No problem once in a while, but it is an unwelcome distraction, and tedious after a while.

A mouse is a wonderful tool, but isn't the best for everything. And you don't get carpal tunnel syndrome from keyboarding!


#2189: Win2K compatibility
Win2K compatibility

(2189)

Submitted by: Elena on 14-Aug-2001

Is Noteworthy compatible with Windows 2000? What other operating systems can Noteworthy be used with?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Aug-2001

Quoted from this web site: Minimum System Requirements: Windows 95, 98, ME, NT 4, 2000 or later

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Aug-2001

(small hand raised in the back of the room)... It's also still available for Windows 3.x (16 bit).

Reply 3 offered by: Bill Mullins on 15-Aug-2001

Elena,
I have been running Noteworthy in an NT environment since I bought it about 3 years ago. In May, I upgraded to Win 2K and Noteworthy never missed a beat (although I had to set up the playback in Noteworthy). The only "problem" involved in the transition to 2K was that the native drivers for my sound card are for caca so I lost sound quality. I am working on getting a better sound card now.

Bill


#2190: Offline forum
Offline forum

(2190)

Submitted by: Andrew on 14-Aug-2001

I note that the latest version of the offline forum appears to be Oct 2000. Isn't it time for a new one?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Aug-2001

We'll consider it.

Reply 2 offered by: Bill Mullins on 15-Aug-2001

Hey, I for one like this forum. It does not seem to be broken in any way that I can see ergo it doesn't need "fixing". I'd rather have a mixer board with sliders for channel volume and pan or the ability to resolve the notes for solfeg notation than a new message board. (grin) Oops, I think I just made a "wish list" entry (giggle). As my Japanese friends might say "Tsure shimas".

Bill

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Aug-2001

>does not seem to be broken in any way

Funny you should mention this. As near as I can tell, you posted this at alomost the same time as I managed to break the forum. It was down for about 3 hours.

I am working on our server configurations and accidentally rendered the forum un-postable. It should be working again now.


#2191: score notes without spacing and measures
score notes without spacing and measures

(2191)

Submitted by: Shane on 15-Aug-2001

I have been using Music Printer Plus for a long time, but they no longer make that program and it's not compatible with today's computers. But I liked that program because you could edit notes wherever you wanted them without having to make it look 'pretty' like a score should look. I could put whatever type of note I wanted, any wherever i wanted it, just move the cursor and press enter. But I was wanting to know if there is a way to score notes in NWC like that, side by side without spaces and bar lines, and measures and stuff? Just for midi playback.

I hope this makes since...
Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Aug-2001

The short answer is no. NWC requires that you use bar lines, and it will add space when necessary during printing.

You can limit the amount of space using the the "Increase note spacing..." option in File | Page Setup | Options.


#2192: Wish List Addition
Wish List Addition

(2192)

Submitted by: Bill Mullins on 15-Aug-2001

This is for printing the music. I wish I could tell Noteworthy how many measures I want to see pn a given line and it adjust stastaff size, font size etc. so as to give me that.

But I'm not gonna go sit in the corner and pout if I don't get it. Noteworthy is STILL the best value for the price in the field.

Bill

Reply 1 offered by: Joy Byford on 15-Aug-2001

I too would appreciate more options in this area. About the most time consuming (and boring) part of producing a printed score is to keep adjusting the point size of the notes followed by print preview until a satisfactory result is obtained. My preference would be to be able to state how many full lines (or full pages for long pieces) are required and for NWC to adjust the size to fit. But like Bill says, this is not a complaint in any way - I think NWC is excellent value for money!


#2193: GREAT NEWS - NEW NEWSGROUP SERVER
GREAT NEWS - NEW NEWSGROUP SERVER

(2193)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 16-Aug-2001

Matt Porter has managed to get his new server going and the newsgroup is up and running on it.

The new address is news2.ezusa.net but depending on your newsreader you may need to specify nntp://news2.ezusa.net

I have sucessfully posted and retrieved a message without destroying any existing threads (but that's with Agent newsreader) -

Richard

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 16-Aug-2001

Great news indeed! I thought I'd be smart and edit the existing profile (Netscape 6.1) -- didn't work. I had to delete the existing newsgroup server and create a new one. Then it worked! Yippee! 14199 messages at the time I tried to subscribe... opted to only download the last 500.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Andreas Jensen on 16-Aug-2001

Yahoo - That is great news.
I am now downloading the messenges.

See you all on the new newsgroup.

Best regards,
Andreas Kryger Jensen

Reply 3 offered by: Jill B. on 16-Aug-2001

Great, but how do I sign up? They asked me twice for a username and password, then said access denied.

I knew I forgot to use anti-perspirant today! They don't like me.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Aug-2001

Jill - sounds like a newsreader issue. Maybe if you let us know which one you're using, someone else using the same program might have an answer.

Reply 5 offered by: Steve Pearson on 17-Aug-2001

Good. Nice to have it back.

All I did was to go to the NWC site map, click on the newsgroup hyperlink, and the newsgroup loaded without a hitch!

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 17-Aug-2001

I downloaded 14,xxx headers oldest of whose is dated 2/2000. Now I'm reading them to feel younger </g>.

For the record:

The "newsgroup trouble" reported at msg #2168 has been solved by moving the newsgroup to the following address:

news://news2.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc

Reply 7 offered by: Bill Mullins on 17-Aug-2001

Hot DIGGETY DOG!!! I was finally able to get to the newsgroup. It was actually quite painless. I just changed the server name in the account properties and there I was. Of course there is a 1 week gap in the posts . . . but at least we are back communicating.

I saw where some were having to reload. Guess OE isn't a complete piece of organic fertilizer. For me the transition was very easy.


#2195: upgrade #9 crash
upgrade #9 crash

(2195)

Submitted by: Don Gomer on 17-Aug-2001

I recently downloaded #9 and now when I try to print preview I get an error message and the computer hangs up and I have to quit the program.

I reloaded #7 and do not have the above program. I´m running a 486 Windows 3.1.

Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: Don Gomer on 17-Aug-2001

correction:
...do not have the above problem...

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Aug-2001

You could start by telling us what the message said.

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 18-Aug-2001

Dunno, Don. I've been using update #9 fairly extensively this week and have had no trouble at all. What does the error message say (ie which part of Windows if having the problem? :-)

Many (not all) "errors" in NWC seems to end up being fixed by installing up-to-date drivers for sound or video cards. Can you start there?

A

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 20-Aug-2001

Just for those waiting with bated breath...
This issue is being followed on the newsgroup, complete with examples. Point your news-reader at
!news://news2.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc
Noteworthy has acknowledged the bug and apparently will release a fix next upgrade.

A

Reply 5 offered by: Don Gomer on 21-Aug-2001

Well, it sounds like NoteWorthy has this well in hand, but here's the message anyway, just in case:
NWC an error has occurred...select <ignore>...
Application Error
NWC caused a General Protection Fault in module NWC.EXE at 002D:1041.
Thanks.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Aug-2001

Yes, based on the address of this crash, it appears as though the problem as described in the newsgroup is the same as this one.

> Can't replicate the Abnormal Program Termination, but Preview does emit
> the exception (Win98).

> I'm upgrading this to a bug-report.
>
> Replication:
>
> 1) Create one staff. Populate the staff with enough notes that, in Print
> Preview, a line-wrap occurs.
> 2) Add a new staff.
> 3) Insert one or two objects (notes, text, tempi...) on the staff. In
> signed time they seem to need to be worth less than 1/2 a measure, in
> free time one or two notes should do it.
>
> Print Preview throws exception. Adding 3 notes also throws exception but
> generates *ahem* interesting Print Preview output. Smells like a
> definite bug in the pagination engine.
>

This is confirmed as a bug. The exception does not occur in the original 1.70 release, but the print engine has never liked parts of varying lengths to be printed at the same time. We will work to get it fixed in the next release.

In the mean time, it is best to make sure that your parts all match up in length before printing.

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 21-Aug-2001

I've never had NWC crash, probably because I do not exercise every feature it has (or, do not do the "user variations" that activate the occasional bug!) But my famous-name image processing program crashes for me all the time, as does my famous-name font program.

Some humor: In the 1970s, I was using a then-novel samll computer with 16K (yes, K) of memory, and a tape (yes, tape) drive. I entered a perfectly legal command, in proper syntax, that caused the computer to rewind the tape, rather than doing the expected calculation. It turned out that my command was a hidden administrative command. The manufacturer thought that nobody would ever ask the computer to do that particular calculation.

More humor: In the 1980s, I was working in industry. My job was to write instructions for some of the workers to follow. To "debug" my work, I gave a copy to a student who was working there on summer break. He had never seen the equipment before, and knew nothing of the process. But he was able to perform the task by following my written instructions explicitly. Later, when the instructions were given to the actual workers, they couldn't do the process. The reason was that they were only choosing to follow some of the instructions, ignoring others that went against their own expectations.


#2196: changing pitch value of existing note(s)
changing pitch value of existing note(s)

(2196)

Submitted by: Gary Smith on 20-Aug-2001

Is there a way to highlight or otherwise "grab" a note which has already been put in place and change it from one staff position to another (ex. change an A to a C)?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 20-Aug-2001

Select it (highlight it) either using the mouse or by holding shift while you use the cursor (arrow) keys, then use CNTL + SHIFT to move the note up or down with the cursor keys.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Aug-2001

See: msg #4, msg #498, msg #1965, msg #1998

Reply 3 offered by: Gary Smith on 20-Aug-2001

Thanks - I thought I remembered being able to do it, but I couldn't remember, nor find it in the FAQs

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 25-Aug-2001

See http://www.vadu.com/nwc/faq.html#3.1
If you haven't yet visited the NWC Scriptorium at
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ I strongly suggest you do so.

A

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 25-Aug-2001

This isn't new info (it has been mentioned many times here), but for the benefit of new users who may have tuned int to this message thread:

"Moving" notes up or down on the staff is not necessarily the same thing as "transposing" the music to another key.


#2197: Spaces
Spaces

(2197)

Submitted by: Artur on 20-Aug-2001

I think that Nwc sometimes makes lots of space between notes when aren't needed so much. Even when I toggle of 'Increase note spacing ...' it is still too large for 16th and smaller notes. Could it e changed?
I have added it to the wish list and I would like to know if it could be done.
There are two things here that I want people to say what they think about: (wish list)
- Toggle on/off for larger not heads
- Toggle on/off to compress spaces and save paper and ink.

Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 25-Aug-2001

I would have thought it would make the music look too crowded. Can't you just reduce the staff size? (Page Setup | Options | Staff Size).

I would like to see
1) choice of note head (mainly for scoring percussion and spoken text)
2) selection of note size (so glissandi etc can be scored more appropriately).

A sliding scale of note space "compression" would be a neat thing, but I'm not sure how often I'd use it.

A


#2198: Notes on Eastern Tone System III
Notes on Eastern Tone System III

(2198)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 20-Aug-2001

(This article has been posted to the newsgroup as well as rec.music.compose, rec.music.early and rec.music.theory groups)

APPENDIX 1: NEUTRAL THIRDS and SIXTHS
-------------------------------------

Neutral thirds and sixths are as important and critical as seconds in the
melodic construction of music in 17 tone system; that's Eastern/Turkish
music.

They are, according to my observation, the basic key to the harmonic
tension-release mechanism of the mentioned musical tradition. In addition,
several genera (Segâh to name the most commonly used) are structured upon
neutral third, thus, it appears to be as important as the perfect fourth and
the perfect fifth.

Here is a table of neutral thirds and sixths, five of which are inversions
of thirds. Five of the thirds and three of the sixths aren't invertible
within the 33-overtone context.

The coloumns are read as follows;

Interval (Ratio) - notated pitch (relative to C, for MIDI applications) -
Pitch bending (negative if in brackets) - Cents value

A) Neutral Thirds

11/9 - Eb - 1942 - 347.41
16/13 - E - (1660) - 359.47
17/14 - Eb - 1480 - 336.13
21/17 - E - (1400) - 365.83
23/19 - Eb - 1260 - 330.76
26/21 - E - (1234) - 369.74
27/22 - E - (1862) - 354.55
28/23 - Eb - 1661 - 340.55
29/24 - Eb - 1132 - 327.62
31/25 - E - (1130) - 372.41

B) Neutral Sixths

13/8 (inv. 16/13) - Ab - 1660 - 840.53
18/11 (inv. 11/9) - A - (1942) - 852.59
21/13 (inv. 26/21) - Ab - 1239 - 830.26
23/14 (inv. 28/23) - A - (1661) - 859.45
28/17 (inv. 17/14) - A - (1480) - 863.87
29/18 - Ab - 1051 - 825.67
31/19 - Ab - 1947 - 847.52
33/20 - A - (1353) - 866.94

Note that, there is a difference of 44.79 c. between the maximum and minimum
values of the thirds (41.27 c. between the sixths). Remember that the
minimum available interval, 33/32, makes 46.73 c. Thus, smaller values than
that are treated within the 'range' of a single 'pitch'. (The same as we
treated E# as Gb in the Phythagorean Method)

---
Credit: Fred Nachbaur, for Harmonic Analyser.
---

Regards,
Ertugrul iNANC
Copyright © 2001

--
Decode adress to reply

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 24-Aug-2001

Thnaks for the info (and the examples in the newsgroup). Wish I had more time to focus on music (Darn work! Unfortunately not talented enough to make a living as a musician). But, at least I'll keep the info in the back of my mind for a potential future application.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 24-Aug-2001

You're welcome. Btw, the NWC file containing the intervals can be found at the Scripto.

---
Decode address to reply


#2199: How do you do a roll on NWC?
How do you do a roll on NWC?

(2199)

Submitted by: Gabe Logan on 20-Aug-2001

I was just wondering, how do you add a roll to a chord? I dont know if I have the correct terminology for it. If anyone has heard Brahms Waltz in A flat, Op. 39 No. 15, what I want to duplicate is that little rolling action in the left hand using NWC. Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 21-Aug-2001

I'm not sure of the correct term either - I'm assuming you mean a broken chord. There are two parts to this question. One is, how to write it so the printed score looks right, the other is to make the playback sound right.

See the sample file "moonlight.nwc" for examples of both. Bar 154 has one. The printing staff contains an italic text "{" character in front of the chord. You may find a more convincing glyph in the BOXMARKS font (the lower case "c" equivalent perhaps?).

The sound is done in a hidden stave (see Page Setup to make it visible). It's written out explicitly with short notes and ties.

Note that you don't actually NEED to do both. It depends on your purpose for scoring. If all you care about is what it looks like, don't bother with the hidden stave. If all you care about is what it sounds like, then just write what you want to hear. If you care about both, you have to do both.

Reply 2 offered by: Kaz on 23-Aug-2001

The explanation John made is quite correcrt.
And this sign is called "arpeggio"(Italian)
so far as it is about bar 154 of Moonlight.

Reply 3 offered by: Keith on 24-Aug-2001

Gabe -
I was wandering through the tips and came across this one under Inserting Symbols. I remembered seeing your question here and thought this might be some small help.

http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/usertip3.htm#arpeggio

Keith


#2200: NWC vs. Sibelius
NWC vs. Sibelius

(2200)

Submitted by: Giuseppe Tagliavini on 21-Aug-2001

I am a musician, just leaving pen and ink behind. I have been told about NWC, and adviced to get it. However, another friend of mine suggests Sibelius instead. I really don't care about the price, or the cost benefit relation. I just want to get the best. Which advantages would you say NWC has over Sibelius or any other.
Thank you

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Aug-2001

First and foremost - ease of use. Do you just want to compose / score / sequence music, or spend a good portion of your time setting things up so you can get started? Is the "learning curve" important to you? If you don't mind doing a considerable amount of preliminary study, Sibelius or Finale might be useful for you.

I'd suggest spending some time with *any* software before committing to it. NoteWorthy Composer lets you try before you buy, to find out whether it will do the job for you. The time spent properly evaluating NWC will be a small fraction of the time it takes to learn the larger programs.

Reply 2 offered by: Nigel Simmons on 21-Aug-2001

I now use nothing but Noteworthy. A friend of mine (a professional composer for Hollywood fils) uses Sibelius, but spends an inordinate time setting up. With Noteworthy, I can be up and running doing compositions & arrangements from solo piano to full brass band & symphony orchestra in minutes!. Yes, there are limitations, but most of these can be got over with various extra fonts available. The biggest drawback I find is the lack of ntuplets (This is a hint for the Wish List!). Try it, you'll like it!

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 21-Aug-2001

Good point. Also, I believe that many users of music publishing programs (myself included) have more than one of them.

It may help to take a look at the kinds of things that users of the programs have posted as examples. The most convenient way to compose voice/piano may be very different from the most convenient way to compose techno-punk, even though the programs are capable of both syles.

Reply 4 offered by: Jubal Baca on 24-Aug-2001

Giussepe:

I am also musician from 52 years ago behind. (I now am 59 years old). I utilize NWC from 4 years ago. I have proven many programs, but I believe that NWC is the easiest of using. The cost of the program is aprox. u$s 39 (that is the one which cost me). I have classical and popular written works for choir, complete orchestra, fantasy for piano and orchestra, etc. I up to now have not had no inconvenient in order to export the works to MIDI 1 or in order to print.

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 25-Aug-2001

If you are going to produce scores for wide-scale publication, you may need to go to Finale or Sibelius just for the "tweakability".

Currently NWC doesn't support
1) alternate noteheads
2) cue size notes (except as grace notes)
3) crossing between staves on a grand staff

If these are common events on your composition, you may need to spend the extra several hundred dollars US and go to Finale or Sibelius. However, if you are mainly producing in-house scores, and not needing the above, give NWC a try. In fact give it a try anyway, 'cos once you've breasted the concept of their infinitely wide score paper (1 minute), and how to move notes up and down on a stave (5 seconds), and how to enter notes in a chord (5 more seconds), you'll be flying! It is truly a joy to use!

HTH,
Andrew

Reply 6 offered by: Kent Dugan on 01-Oct-2001

If you only work in jazz/sing idioms, then you will need Barry Graham's fonts (available free on this site) for rests, lips, rips, falls, etc.
There is no swing feel for playback, a serious limitation for us jazzers.
Noteworthy also does not have transposing chords for lead sheets. If you enter chord symbols, it's just text and nothing happens to it.
Noteworthy will not play those chords, or add rhythm to it for playback. If you need that, go to Allegro (the slightly chopped version of Finale) or Band In A Box. You can also go to Silelius, but the cost is considerably higher.

There are other limitations. You can only group notes in groups of 2, 3 (triplets), or 4. There are no extended n-tuplets, and no combinations of these. I should say that you can have these things in a single part, but scores are not aware, and bar lines won't line up.
Exploding parts from a single staff would be nice, too.

If you import from Midi files, Noteworthy's limitation is that it can't 'guess' the chords from the score, and that it can't correctly interpret triplets. If these features are 'must have', then you may need another program to supplement NoteWorthy.
That much said, there's no better value for your money for everything else that it DOES do, which is nearly anything you need.
Lyrics are especially easy to handle.

You can spend months on any other program just trying to memorize commands and settings. With Noteworthy, it's just a couple of days and you're home free.

And the forum will give you answers faster than anyone else's tech support could imagine. We're rabid, but you've gotta love this little program!

There are lots of other programs, but none much worth looking at.
For doing legitimate composition quickly, NoteWorthy has the most logical commands, and the most flexibility.

Reply 7 offered by: Marsu on 02-Oct-2001

Just a remark on "There is no swing feel for playback, a serious limitation for us jazzers" on the reply above.
YES, there is a way, which I find better than in other programs. Go and see my hint about it: How to Make NWC Play Jazz . Moreover, you can use this for other purposes (such a unequal waltzes, and so on).
If you find this not simple enough, just tell me, I'll give you a javascript page to make it (I already have an XL 4 form, without macros).

About "can't correctly interpret triplets", go and see the macros Andrew has set up on the Scriptorium !

All of this is free, of course.

Otherwise, in any case, if you're concerned about composition, I recommend the use of NWC for its efficiency. If the score is to be engraved by someone else, you can give him the NWC format (and MIDI also) if you really want some special features. A friend of mine did that (he needed to include pictures between some staves) and didn't regret it :)

NWCly yours,
Marsu

Reply 8 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 02-Oct-2001

Kent Dugan wrote in msg #2200 (reply 6):
> And the forum will give you answers faster than anyone else's tech support could imagine

And not to forget the Newsgroup, which is in many occassions much more useful than the web based forum, permitting file attachments.

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 9 offered by: bob on 10-Oct-2001

i own copies of both programs, and find they have different uses. I use NWC for quick work, but often use Sibeleus' superior printing & formatting for final work presentaion.


#2201: Enlarge Printout
Enlarge Printout

(2201)

Submitted by: charlie D on 21-Aug-2001

I'm brand new to this program and I'm having difficulty
when it comes to printing my music. The default size that prints out is much to small. I've searched the program for ways to enlarge the printed music but have been unable
to find the answer. I would like to have no more then 4 measures on each line. I would appreciate your help...

Reply 1 offered by: Keith on 21-Aug-2001

The command you're looking for is File / Page Setup. Under the Options tab, you'll see Staff Size (in points). This can be set from 4 (microscopic) to 40 (about two measures per page. You'll have to fiddle with this and the next tab (Margins) to get exactly what you want, but with a little patience and some experimentation with Print Preview, you'll get it just right.

Keith

Reply 2 offered by: charlie D on 22-Aug-2001

Thank you very much Keith, your instructions were right on
the money. One last guestion...... is there anyway the
color of the text can be changed from the color of the staff? I'm helping senior citizens to learn to play the keyboard and I designate the pitch of each note with the proper note but it would be easier for them if the text
were in different color....Tnanx a gain...... Charlie D

Reply 3 offered by: Keith on 22-Aug-2001

Simple - once you know how. Highlight the 'handle' of the text you entered (that little dot at the left side) and either right-click or hit ALT-ENTER to bring up the properties box. On the Visibility tab, one of the options is Item Color. You can select from Black, Red, Green or Blue. Not a decorator's palette, but it gets the job done.

Keith

Reply 4 offered by: charlie D on 22-Aug-2001

Keith... I had discovered that color change box you describe....but what I would like to do is keep the staff black and just change the color of the text. I need both items to be different colors. The color itself is immaterial
I'm really learning a lot from you and for that I thank you profusely.....After this question I promise I won't bother you again......tnx....Charlie D

Reply 5 offered by: Keith on 22-Aug-2001

Charlie -
Maybe I misunderstood. I thought you meant the actual words you enter as text. If you're referring to the notes themselves, the same instructions apply. As a matter of fact, you can change the color of the time sig, the performance style, pretty much whatever you like just by highlighting and bringing up the properties box (ALT-ENTER).

And no bother at all. That's what the forum is all about.

Good luck,
Keith

Reply 6 offered by: Keith on 22-Aug-2001

By the way, if I STILL didn't cover your question, let me know.
Keith

Reply 7 offered by: charlie D on 22-Aug-2001

Hi Keith......You've answered all my questions and I'm up and running. I'm very impressed with this program. I've been looking for a program like this for a long time. I need to transcribe music to the EZ PLay format for the people I'm teaching. That's where the letter of the note is superimposed on the note itself. This program comes the closest to doing that. The people I'm teaching are senior citizens who don't have a lot of time to learn how to read conventional music but still want to learn to play the keyboard....... Thanks once again... Charlie D

Reply 8 offered by: Andrew on 25-Aug-2001

Charlie,

ALso visit http://www.vadu.com/nwc . It is a user-created website full of useful Noteworthy stuff.

Andrew


#2202: chord symbols
chord symbols

(2202)

Submitted by: Kelly Roberti on 24-Aug-2001

Hi

Could someone please tell me how to simply place chord symbols, such as CM7#11 above a staff of music to create a fundamental lead sheet???.....I can't seem to find the tool anywhere.

thanks
Kelly Roberti

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Aug-2001

A technique is covered in the User's Guide. You can also learn about it here: msg #1197


#2203: Sound cards, sound fonts, .nwc --> CD-R burning:
Sound cards, sound fonts, .nwc --> CD-R burning:

(2203)

Submitted by: Steve Langford on 24-Aug-2001

Using my new 1.2G Athlon CPU/Asus A7V133 motherboard, I would like to burn CD-R or CD-RW with TDK 16/10/40X burner. I want to play original .nwc files through sound fonts, employing an appropriate, best-bang-for-the-buck sound card. I am looking at SB AWE64 Gold, Value, and Live! cards but am open to other suggestions. Is there a Web page that already describes the best routes to take, in order to convert .nwc files to CD-ROM disks, employing state-of-the-art Sound Font technologies, please?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Aug-2001

This effort has been discussed many times in the forum. If you have not done so, you should get a copy of the offline forum and search for threads that have CD-R and/or "Full Duplex" in them. Here are a few threads to get you started:

msg #1208, msg #928, msg #1003

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Langford on 24-Aug-2001

I thank Noteworthy Online for its kind guidance. But I have not found much specific advice at the forum regarding which sound cards are best for handling sound fondts, these days. Can somebody please respond specifically to this part of my question?:

"I am looking at SB AWE64 Gold, Value, and Live! cards but am open to other suggestions."

Which cards should be avoided like the plague, and why? Which are really the best available PCI sound cards? Which do almost as well as the best but are affordable? And so on . . . please.

Thanks! :-))

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 24-Aug-2001

SB Live series, preferably Platinum. You can always install a soft-synth of Yamaha and Roland, thus, experience the advantages of all the three systems.

Hth

---
Decode address to reply

PS: I recommend General User GS as a total soundbank.

Reply 4 offered by: Steve Langford on 24-Aug-2001

Thanks for your specific suggestions. A friend has been aiming me toward the Live Value card. Much appreciated! :-)

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 25-Aug-2001

Don't get AWE64 Gold. They are old technology and now difficult to get extra memory on (they only have 4 Mb).

If you want brilliant sound, get a card that uses your system's memory (and get lots of system memory - at least 256M) then go for broke on a card that uses it and get a good soundfont (or two or three). With soundfonts, bigger is not always better, but some of the really good oens are quite huge.

This is assuming you have an unlimited budget. :-)

Reply 6 offered by: Steve Langford on 25-Aug-2001

Thanks, Andrew and all,

Settled today on SB Live! MP3+ 5.1

Your guidance has been greatly appreciated.

-Steve-

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 27-Aug-2001

I have a question about the Live! Platinum. I want to upgrade from my AWE64 and the Platinum looks like a great card, except that it comes with something they call a "Live Drive" that takes up a full-width disk bay. I don't have any bays to spare. Does anyone know if the Platinum can be installed without the Live Drive?

Reply 8 offered by: Peter Edwards on 28-Aug-2001

I have this setup, and as far as I can see the drive bay bit is not actually required - it just has extra inputs and outputs connected by a ribbon cable to the main card.

Actually I've never managed to get my live bay working (driver problem with W2000 ? , or does the bay need to be installed? - I'd be grateful for some input on this one myself).

If no-one comes up with a definitive answer I'll disconnect mine tonight and report back.

Peter

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Aug-2001

Grant, I think you can use a SB Live without the Live Drive. Beware, there might be a problem with the joystick port MIDI behaviour using the latest drivers, and latest card (5.1?) (the drivers might assume use of the LiveDrive for MIDI), so there may be some difficulties. I cannot test this, as our only SB Live 5.1 is integrated into a Creative Blaster PC motherboard, which has the Live Drive integrated into the front of a special ATX case (unlike the PCI card, our version does not have any back-side ports, and you must use the MIDI ports on the front for MIDI, as the joystick port will only work with analog joysticks, not MIDI or digital joysticks).

However, why would you want to do this? If you compare the SB product line, you'll notice that you are paying a premium for the Live Drive (maybe you have found a good deal somewhere??). In real world tests, I have not been able to hear a difference between the SB Live Value and the SB Live Platinum. If you don’t have space for the Live Drive, you might be able to save yourself some money. If you are comfortable installing PC components, you could also buy a new case with more drive bays and move everything over.

Also, I recently tries making the switch from an AWE 64 Gold to a SB Live in our sound studio computer (Pentium II - Windows 98 SE). We ended up switching back to the AWE 64 Gold. The input (recording) side of the SB Live mixer would only allow a single audio source to be recorded at one time. The AWE 64 input mixer allows selection of multiple input sources for recording using tools such as CoolEdit. I was unable to get the SB Live to support this.

Reply 10 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Aug-2001

Peter: My Blaster PC, which includes an integrated SB Live on the motherboard and a built-in Live Drive in the case, is running Windows 2000. PC shutdown and power saving modes do not fully operate, but the Live Drive is functional (I have not tested the IR remote control mechanism).

Reply 11 offered by: Grant on 28-Aug-2001

My reason for wanting to upgrade is to have access to the larger soundfonts that my AWE64 doesn't have room for. My reason for interest in the Live! Platinum over, say, the Live! Value is not compelling.

As to the Live's inability to mix multiple sound inputs, I don't know if this would trouble me or not. Mostly I'm interested in producing high-quality instrumental MIDI sound. The only other thing I've used the sound card for (beyond game soundtracks) is recording from old cassettes & LP's in order to write CD's, and I think for that I could live with a single input source at a time.

Reply 12 offered by: Drakhan Valane on 28-Aug-2001

The only difference between the different cards (X-Gamer, P3+ is the software bundle, for the most part. The platinum versions come with the extra drives. If you only want 2-4 speaker support, go with the Live! series, if you need 5.1 speaker support, go with the Live! 5.1. If you really want high quality audio and/or use professional recording equipment, you may wish to check out the new SB Audigy in a few weeks. You really should check out soundblaster.com if you want information straight from the source.
~Drakhan

Reply 13 offered by: Grant on 28-Aug-2001

I did check out soundblaster.com, but I don't trust it. It looks mostly like marketing hype to me. The site itself answers very few actual questions, and some of the answers it does give are self-contradictory. Also, when I asked a question via their site they ignored me.

Reply 14 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 28-Aug-2001

Grant wrote in msg #2203 (reply 13):
> Also, when I asked a question via their site they ignored me.

They're d@mn good at that!

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 15 offered by: D on 31-Aug-2001

Have been using SB Live Value for some time now and have been very pleased. The card accesses up to 1/2 the available memory (320 MB) for active sound fonts. I've used the WIndows sound recorder to create wav files that I then burn on to a CD. Not much software with a white box Live Value, but the price was right and the sound is great!

Worked fine with included drivers on WIN98, but crashed W2K until I loaded W2K drivers from the Creative web site.

You will need to pick your sound fonts carefully. I agree that bigger is not always better, but it usually is so. A well crafted general midi sound font is most convenient, but some of the single instrument or small ensemble sound fonts may generate more realistic sounds to your ears. I've found that the combinations of sound fonts you select for your music will also affect your perception of the individual instruments. A pair of sound fonts that are not very realistic played alone may sound better when played together.

Reply 16 offered by: John Ford on 05-Sep-2001

Grant -

The Live Drive (which does take a 5 1/4" drive bay slot) is not required to be used; however, I have found mine to be very convenient. I've found that the "Microphone 2 input (1/4" plug) on the front is cleaner than running my microphone into a miniplug adapter on the back of the card (The back connection tends to generate a lot of electrical hum). It's also a lot easier to get to the front than the rear. There is also a headphone jack on the front with volume control, which can be configured to mute (or not) the speaker connections (which are on the back of the card) when listening with headphones. Like I said, not required, but definitely convenient. I found my Live Platinum on sale for $99 about a year and half ago, so I couldn't resist, since it normally sold for $199 list (but usually never dropped below $149).

My $.02 worth

Thanks,

John

Reply 17 offered by: John Ford on 05-Sep-2001

And after I hit send, I realized I forgot to mention that the MIDI connections are on the front of the Live Drive, as well. This makes it a lot easier to connect/disconnect my MIDI keyboard. They are true MIDI connections, not a game port (so you don't need the Y-adapter for the game port).

Sorry for replying to my own reply. I'll pause now to make sure I didn't forget anything else...

Nope. That's all. Good luck with your new sound card purchase.

John

Reply 18 offered by: Steve Langford on 07-Sep-2001

First, sincere thanks to all who have contributed to this "Sound cards, sound fonts, .nwc --> CD-R burning:" thread. You have been very helpful, and I appreciate it.

My friend Dana Hawkes, who has a nice site at

<http://www.tidepool.com/%7Edanad/viol.html>

bought the same Sound Blaster Live! MP3+ 5.1 card that I did. He has given me permission to share his concise instructions for making soundfonts work in NoteWorthy Composer:

. . . . .

Have used sfs in nwc....
--- start- programs- creative- soundblaster live!- audio hq
--- from there.. click on 'soundfonts'
--- click top tab 'configure instrument'
--- go down the 'select instrument' list til you get to the instrument that
you would like to change to sf (don't worry none of this is permanent)
---say you chose oboe from the list.... then click 'load'.... find the oboe
sf that I just sent.

Now, in nwc:
--- tools
--- options
--- under the MIDI tab, in 'devices used by playback', remove all but
'A:SBLive MIDI synth'

now when you assign oboe to a staff, you should hear your sf.

. . . . .

Please note that if you use

Reply 19 offered by: Steve Langford on 07-Sep-2001

[Sorry, I fat-fingered the post above, and it went out before I was finished; continuing . . . ]:

[Please note that if you use . . . ] the same card as Dana and I use, and if you have a rather complete installation of the software, then when you bump your cursor against the top-center border of your monitor screen you will find it trivially easy to get to the

AudioHQ | SoundFont

place in Dana's instructions. (Dana was unsure as to whether or not I had that feature installed.)

I hope that the gist of these instructions will be helpful even to people who do not have this particular card.

* * * * *

NEW SUBTOPIC (related to SoundFont issues):

"Where Can Freeware Soundfonts for Early Instruments Be Found?"

I hope that the new MIDI standard (about which I have only heard a rumor) will soon be out and will include soundfonts for such early instruments as:

viola (sopranino all the way to violone, but more typically soprano through viola da gamba range)[Aside: The cello soundfont that I have inherited from a friend has considerable vibrato. But instruments of the viola family, unlike modern violas, are fretted (usually with 7 frets), and according to established orthodoxy were almost never played with vibrato; certainly they were not played with the more-or-less constant vibrato that modern cellists use (sometimes I use vibrato, though). The tone of the viola da gamba has been said to be the best of all instruments in resembling the sound of a man singing (though I have heard such claims for other instruments, too). When things go right, the tone is hauntingly penetrating and "crystal clear".], lute, rebec, vielle, recorder, krumhorn (crumhorn); tambourine, timpani, and other percussive instruments; cornett, sackbut, rauschpfeife, shawm, curtal, tabor, rackett, regal, sordun, serpent, hurdy-gurdy, cittern, rommelpot, naker, gemshorn, and shaker (percussion?). . . and probably lots more that I still have never even heard of.

I am not at all familiar with most of those instruments. But I believe that public-domain soundfonts for them should be included in the new MIDI standard, so that people who delve into Early Music will not all be forced to purchase commercial soundfonts every time they want to play otherwise free sound files.

Whether or not soundfonts for such obscure instruments can become part of the new MIDI standard, I hope that some of you can point me to a public-domain sound bank that already contains soundfonts for at least SOME of them.

Thanks again for all your help! :-))

Steve

P.S. Don't forget to visit http://www.tidepool.com/%7Edanad/viol.html ;-)


#2204: ...Tempo...
...Tempo...

(2204)

Submitted by: Jubal Baca on 24-Aug-2001

Hello NWC friends:

I am user registered of N.W.C. last version. I need to know:

Does it be possible change the "TEMPO" general of a musical score?. Do I ask because I have a musical work of 30 minutes of duration. Within the score, there is much Rall, Accell, and "tempos". I want that the work is executed an a little over rapid (that now their duration is of 26 minutes). Changing all the internal "tempos" it of the work is an enormous work.

Bye. .Bye. and thank you...Jubal

Reply 1 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 24-Aug-2001

I think it is not possible. Maybe you can ask for "relative" tempo variations instead of absolute ones, in the wish list.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 24-Aug-2001

At the moment, the only way to change the tempos is manually.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Aug-2001

(not for the faint-hearted)

I just had a crazy thought that just might work. Export your file to midi, and play the midi on VanBasco Midi Player (freeware). It allows you to control relative tempo in realtime; set the tempo to where you want it. Use a multi-midi client such as Multimid (buggy in Win9x) or Hubi's Midi Cable (much better) to route the midi output into another loopback node, connected to the midi input of NWC; record the "performance". Finally take the newly imported tempo track and paste it into the ORIGINAL NWC file.

Reply 4 offered by: Andrew on 25-Aug-2001

One thing I learnt at an early age with NWC is to create a separate "conductor track". Then it was much easier to adjust tempo settings.


#2206: Yamaha PSR 420 - Recording  real-time
Yamaha PSR 420 - Recording  real-time

(2206)

Submitted by: angei on 24-Aug-2001

I am a complete novice to using music packages on my PC, and am having real trouble finding out how to switch from recording point and click style with the mouse to playing the notes straight in on my keyboard. Which menus do I have to go to, and what should I input on them? Also I seem to be getting a delay between playing in, and hearing the music. Please reply in idiot language!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Aug-2001

Regarding the sound delay: msg #2131

Regarding real-time recording or step-entry from a MIDI keyboard: See the User's Guide, which covers this topic.


#2207: Transposing for a Concert Band from a MIDI file
Transposing for a Concert Band from a MIDI file

(2207)

Submitted by: Adrian on 24-Aug-2001

I am trying to arrange a midi file into a concert band part using Cakewalk. The only problem is trying to transpose the specific parts such as the trumpets which play a Major 2nd lower than concert pitch into their relevant parts. Someone told me that the whole midi file is at concert pitch but when i try altering the pitch of the trumpets a major 2nd lower, it sounds completely out of tune. I thought this was maybe because the file was already correctly transposed, but when i (primitavely) played the notes on the screen with my trumpet, along to the actual trumpet part they sounded different.
I know this is probably a simple/stupid question but i really need some help as i am completely stuck.

THANKS IN ADVANCE !!

Reply 1 offered by: Joy Byford on 24-Aug-2001

For a start this forum is for Noteworthy Composer not Cakewalk! I can't comment on Cakewalk as I do not have it.
However if you open the MIDI in Noteworthy Composer then transpose the relevant staves (Tools|Transpose staff), there is an check box marked 'Update staff playback transposition' to make the playback sound the same as before - this is what you need to check to overcome your problem.
I hope this helps
Joy

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Aug-2001

For the trumpet:-
Select the Trumpet track in track view
From the menu - Mark > From Start - Thru end
Edit > Transpose +2 semitones.
In Track View set the Key column to -2.
The Staff view will show the trumpet at correct pitch but the playback will sound in concert pitch.

HTH


#2208: yamaha psr 420  real time input.
yamaha psr 420  real time input.

(2208)

Submitted by: angei on 26-Aug-2001

thank you for answering to my first query. I have already checked the user guide, but being a complete novice found it very hard to understand! Is it possible that the sound card isn't up to the job? (I hope this isn't the case as it is a brand new pc!) Or could it be that I need a driver?
When inputting from the keyboard as well as a terrible delay the notation just streams out the highlighted note in the notation toolbar, without changing. Input devices are just MPU 401, should there be another input Device?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Aug-2001

You need to follow the "Record Play From A Midi Keyboard" procedure, not the "Remote Input" procedure.

If you think you have a setup problem, see msg #1532 and msg #1102.


#2209: ... TEMPO 2...
... TEMPO 2...

(2209)

Submitted by: Jubal Baca on 27-Aug-2001

Hello NWC boys:

Creating a staff "TEMPO" in the score, it is very comfortable in order to work and listen to the score. The problem is, when I need to print each staff, one for each group of instruments. Could one transfer, automatically, the annotations of the staff "TEMPO" to each one of the staffs of the score, it so that each individual instrument have the "TEMPO" included in the staff?
Placing the TEMPO in each staff, it is easy, but it is very laborious.

This question makes it because the musicians prefer that the TEMPO is incorporate in the score of the instrument and not like a staff separated.

Bye...Bye...Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 27-Aug-2001

Technically you could do this with staff layering but you would have to have individual tempo tracks for each stave. It would be faster to just create one tempo track and then copy the tempo markings and paste them to the rest of the tracks.

(ex: highlight the tempo mark, press CTRL+C, click on the first stave and press CTRL+V...repeat as necessary)

:)

-j

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 04-Sep-2001

I'd try and pursue the overlay method.
Have all your staves set out with TEMPO at the bottom.
In page setup, Enable overlays, hide the staves you don't want, leaving your desired stave(s) and TEMPO.
Edit staff properties for your remaining stave(s) so that it overlays the TEMPO one.
Of course, your TEMPO stave should have barlines and rests with the Visibility property set to Never.

HTH,
Andrew


#2210: Track length-cd burning
Track length-cd burning

(2210)

Submitted by: tripitaka on 29-Aug-2001

why does a 5 min track get cut to 1.30min when burnt onto CD? this happens in both MMJB and adaptec easy cd platinum.
I want the track on CD to play at a freinds childs funeral, so please please help, its no good if it will cut off half way through.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 29-Aug-2001

This certainly isn't normal behavior. You must have a bug somewhere in your system. Are you getting any error messages?

One possibility (it happend to me once) is that your PC can't keep up with the rate at which the CD/R drive is demanding data. You might try a disk utility to defragment your hard drive, which would improve the data transfer rate.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Aug-2001

Your WAV files have to be sampled at the proper CD Audio rate, and in stereo. Perhaps you sampled at a slower rate, and your burning software is simply burning your samples to CD without informing you of this mistake.

Reply 3 offered by: tripitaka on 30-Aug-2001

Cheers folks,No error messages, however i think i got it cracked now with your advice.
i cleared some space and defragged the hard drive, then resampled the music file at max quality. I also took the CD writer down to 1x speed. It seems to have worked. Thanks again for your help. Never had this problem before and hopefully won't again! typical it happened for something so important! anyway the CD is ready in time for the funeral. Thanks again, it really means a lot to the parents.


#2211: Unwanted percussion sounds
Unwanted percussion sounds

(2211)

Submitted by: Manuel on 30-Aug-2001

Hi!
I am in the process of orchestrating my opera now.
For that purpose, I have a visible and a hidden staff for each instrument. However, I insert a new staff, give it the String Ensemble 1 (or anything else) sound, and it sounds like a whole load of percussion intruments playing together.
I once fixed the problem by ignoring a new staff, then inserting another, but that doesn't help now. How can I solve it?

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 30-Aug-2001

Your problem is that NWC assigns MIDI channels in ascending order as you add staves, and you've reached channel 10, which is reserved for percussion. You can fix this by changing the MIDI channel in the Staff Properties dialog.

Reply 2 offered by: Manuel on 30-Aug-2001

Thanks, Grant. But what channel should I assign?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Aug-2001

Anything but 10...you may also want to avoid using one used by another staff.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred on 30-Aug-2001

> Thanks, Grant. But what channel should I assign?

Whatever channel is available. You've got your choice of 1-16, with 10 reserved for percussion. You can get an report of which channels are in use by clicking Tools -> Score Review.

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 30-Aug-2001

...and if you run out of channels, use the second midi port that you probably have.

Reply 6 offered by: Paul C. on 09-Sep-2001

You can assign all similar instruments to the same channel. For example, Trumpet 1, Trumpet 2, Trumpet 3 may all be assigned the same channel. French Horn I & II assigned the same channel. All trombones assigned the same channel, etc. EVEN THOUGH they are on different staves, the instruments with similar sounds can be assigned the same MIDI channel.

Reply 7 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 10-Sep-2001

...however, this will cause the loss of more precise control on divisi parts (each trumpet etc.) *Everything* you apply on the channel (velocity, pedal, volume, expression, pan, pitch-bend, chorus, reverb...) will be applied to *all* parts using that channel.

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 10-Sep-2001

Ertugrul wrote: "*Everything* you apply on the channel (velocity, pedal, volume, expression, pan, pitch-bend, chorus, reverb...) will be applied to *all* parts using that channel."

This is not entirely true. Velocity is applied on a note-by-note basis. Since NWC's default implementation of dynamics uses note velocity, dynamics are immune to the effect Ertugrul notes.

I think it's important to understand that any solution to the running-out-of-tracks problem involves a tradeoff. Ertugrul correctly points out a problem with the multiple-staves-per-channel solution, but his own suggestion in reply 5 also has a serious drawback, which is that you may compromise the portability of your file. Not every computer has a second MIDI port, and even on those that do, many applications (e.g., the Microsoft media player) will exploit only one at a time. Any staves assigned to channels on the second MIDI port will be lost on systems with only one available port.

Of course, if you're planning to play your music only on your own computer, or to record your computer's MIDI output as a .wav, .mp3 or similar file and distribute the result, then the portability issue doesn't arise.

Reply 9 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 18-Sep-2001

You're obviously right. However, Winamp and some other popular players support multiple midi ports. But that's not the point;

If you're after real portability, ie the sound quality preserved, MIDI technology is not the solution at all. You'll need to record it as wav and convert as desired. (Grant also points this in a different aspect.)

---
Decode address to reply


#2212: Music of the Spheres ???
Music of the Spheres ???

(2212)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 30-Aug-2001

This is a true story. I just have to share it on the forum:

I do not compose music (not a trained musician). But this morning, I thought I'd like to try my hand at setting some established music (say, a nineteenth-century hymn) to a more complex composition.

When I was reading the morning newspaper, I came across my horoscope. It reads:

"If you're hoping to achieve a noteworthy success today, you're going to have to earn it through effort and application. Thinking big does not yield proportionate results."

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 30-Aug-2001

Looking forward to hearing your arrangement.

Reply 2 offered by: Keith on 30-Aug-2001

Wierd story, Robert. You'd better get to work. You apparently don't have a choice anymore.


#2213: Using soundfonts in Composer
Using soundfonts in Composer

(2213)

Submitted by: Steve Langford on 01-Sep-2001

Hi! :-))

I have searched recent archives for "soundfonts" (sic.), to no avail. Although I hope to use soundfonts to good effect in such applications as Cakewalk Audio Pro 9, it would be really nifty to be able to use them within the NoteWorthy Composer-and-Player arena, too.

I hope that somebody can point me to prior messages on this topic and that this question will elicit some detailed instructions for making soundfont pathces work nicely within the NoteWorthy product line.

In case it matters: My sound card is SB Live! 5.1.

Thanks!

-Steve Langford-

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 02-Sep-2001

Here is what I replied to a similar question on the ng (!news://news2.ezusa.net/HjrAcgZLBHA.312@ezusa05.ezusa.net):

Load your sf's to empty banks using Audio HQ > Sound Font. Then note the
banks you installed the fonts and the patch number of the instruments
included in them. Go to NWC. Using either Staff Properties > Instrument or
Insert > Instrument, select your sf's bank at controller 0 and your
instrument from the list. You can change your list format to 0 based to
avoid confusion.

For a GM soundfont, try General User GS. It has amazing solo string and wind
patches, especially the solo violin is marvellous. I couldn't have
downloaded Music Man, yet. The server seems to be dead. tgsf99 -imho- sucks.

---

Her's my banks for a guidance:

#0 GUGS 1.3
#10 AWE Organ
#42 JEUX

Hth

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 03-Sep-2001

It seems to be quite a bit of effort and trouble unless you are making permanent recordings for another medium (e.g. .wav). For everyday playback it would be nice to have a way of loading the correct sound fonts automatically when the song is played.

This does not seem feasible at present, but as a half-way-house is there a way of loading the fonts automatically at startup rather than doing each one by hand?

Peter

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 04-Sep-2001

Steve, also visit http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Soundfonts

I've just updated it to reply to this very question.
Hopefully it will help, and if you have any questions, let me know so I can improve it.

Peter, yes, I agree it would be handy to have happen automatically. Unfortunately, I don't think there is a standard "library call" that would work across the several different types of soundcards. It's a pretty poor effort on the part of the midi standard (something should be in place after so many years), but that's the midi standard.

Andrew


#2215: Rogues Gallery - the answers
Rogues Gallery - the answers

(2215)

Submitted by: Richard Woodroffe on 02-Sep-2001

The answers you have all been waiting for are now on the Rogues gallerypage.

If you don't see the names under each picture - click refresh.

I have removed all of the children, pets and pictures of other users that no longer wanted them displayed.
There is an additional photo of Jill B ( Melody Lane ) who was too late to enter the gallery for the quiz.

Have a look at the names - Do they fit the faces you thought they did ?

Here is one strange statistic. Out of the votes for Andrew (Purdam), five said the photo was Andrew but again, five thought the photo was me !
Dunno what that says Andrew.

Perhaps Ann McFarlane would also reveal which user looks like her husband. Dying to know who it was.

Rich.


#2216: PLEASE HELP!
PLEASE HELP!

(2216)

Submitted by: Kris on 04-Sep-2001

hey, if I wanted to use the realistic sounds off my keyboard when recording MIDI, do I require any extra hardware, or is there a way of setting this up? Please any help would be greatly appreciated!

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 04-Sep-2001

If your hardware (keyboard/soundcard) can handle soundfonts/samples, you can experience them without the need of additional hw.

If the contrary, you'll need to purchase some hardware able to that.

Hth

Reply 2 offered by: Kris on 04-Sep-2001

I have a Sound Blaster 16 sound card, and a Yamaha PSR-270 Midi Keyboard

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 04-Sep-2001

I assume you mean that your want your MIDI, when played back, to sound like your keyboard. Why not simply feed the MIDI into your keyboard? It would be the same hardware you use for input.

Reply 4 offered by: Kris on 04-Sep-2001

Thats exactly right! Thats what I want to happen, but I havnt got the first idea on how to actually get that to work.. please I need hellllp!

Reply 5 offered by: Gary Shannon on 04-Sep-2001

Assuming you have both MIDI cables plugged into your keyboard, click the "tools/options" and select MIDI. You should see something that says "midi out" in the list. Select that one and it will send the midi stream to your external synth.

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 06-Sep-2001

Good advice, Gary. I knew that the MIDI could be fed back to the keyboard, but couldn't advise how to set it up, because someone else set it up for me! Doh.


#2217: Roland XP80
Roland XP80

(2217)

Submitted by: Sam Chan on 04-Sep-2001

I have a few questions on the subject of playing drums on the XP80 I wonder if you would help me.

- One of the ways I would like to use the XP80 is as a drum machine while I am playing another instrument (e.g. guitar). I would like to be able to start and stop a drum pattern/loop and also be able to change patterns/loops in the middle of a song. I'd like to be able to use a foot pedal to do this since my hand will be occupied. Could you tell me how I can do that please? I tried to figure out from the manual but didn't go very far. I don't want to be tied to a fixed sequence for the entire song.

- Can I assign the pedals to play specific keys/notes on the keyboard so that I can trigger an RPS drum pattern/loop with a pedal?

- Do you know where I can get great/natural sounding drum patterns/loops that can be used on the Roland XP80?

Reply 1 offered by: Karin Clark on 28-Jan-2002

Hi you need a control pedal on say pedal 1
so you hit, system, contol and contol again to get into the pedal asign menu. if you select 100 which is start stop you should be able to get RPS to work...Have fun!

Re Drum loops...E mail me and I will send you some. depends what you want. regards Karin.
Karinathome@aol.com (I am in the UK)


#2218: Asistance required (Notation)
Asistance required (Notation)

(2218)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 04-Sep-2001

I have been -some sort of- commissioned to compose a work for 4 musicians: a cellist, a harpist, a percussionist and a vibraphone player.

The harpist will probably play more than one instrument, some of which will be tuned different than 12tet. (I'll decide on the tunings and the # of harps.) All harps can span the three-octave+ range.

The cellist is "accustomed to play in different tunings/systems". No problem on that side.

The vibraphone (actually "Maragophone") is capable of playing 53 pitches per octave, 12 of which is selected at once.

The percussion will consist of pitchless instruments. A kudüm and cymbals will be included. There will be some drums as well.

What I need to know is:

1) How is the vibraphone played (with mallets like marimba or Xylophone?) and how is it notated (with couple-staves as in Piano?) Also, what is the range of the vibraphone?

2) How is the pitchless percussion notated? What does a percussion clef look like? I know the single-line staff and that'll be worked-around. However, how will I insert instrument changes (not in MIDI, indeed)?

I know there are talented percussionists around (Andrew?) and all help will be appreciated. This is *urgent*! The concert is to be held on November (in Vienna!)

Regards

PS: I'll prepare the score in German, is there anything wrong with the linked file (names, order of inst.s etc.)?

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 1 offered by: Andrew on 04-Sep-2001

1) Vibes are played with mallets much like marimba and xylophone. You can play two mallets per hand, but don't change distances between mallet pairs too frequently, (or make them too far apart).

2) Pitchless percussion is fairly flexible, but the norm is a single line with a || clef. Can be scored on five line stave for percussion that has more than "on and off", though (eg congas - have a high and low but are classed as non-pitched). Normally, notes will be positioned in the spaces rather than on lines. This gives you the opportunity to use NWC pretty well as is (maybe with hidden percussion lines to implement it sound wise). Simply name the parts to coincide with which space you are using, eg
Ride
S.Tom
Snare
L.Tom
Bass
HHat
is often how drum kits are scored.
w.r.t. midi implementation, use a hidden stave (or two or three) and keep your visual percussion as clear and tidy as possible. You'll find enough cymbals in General Midi percussion (esp if you use patch 49 on SB - Classical Music Percussion). What is a kudüm?

A

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 04-Sep-2001

Andrew wrote in msg #2218 (reply 1):
> What is a kudüm?

First of all, thanks millions. The playing technique of the kudüm was discussed at the ng within the last couple of weeks. I'm extracting from there:

"Joe, Andrew and others who mention,

"The predominant percussive instrument in Mevlevî (and by its influence classical) music is "Kudüm", a double drum, made of leather face worn over a hemispherical copper or clay body. (Similar to the Tabla). It's played using
wooden plectra with felt endings called "Zahme". Three classes of 'beats' are implemented in Kudüm playing;

"1) Right plectrum on the right drum;
"2) Right plectrum on the left drum;
"3) Left plectrum on the left drum.

"Kudüm is pitchless, however, the sonorities of the beats 2 and 3 reasonably vary (probably because of the location the plectrum hits; #2 closer to the centre). That's why I've been using pitch-bending in Kudüm simulation."

The referenced "Andrew" is you, btw. ;)

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 3 offered by: Paul C. on 09-Sep-2001

Vibraphone is written all in the treble clef, from F below the staff to the F above, a three octave range.

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 10-Sep-2001

Thanks, Paul.

---
Decode address to reply


#2219: Still trying to convert MIDI to WAV
Still trying to convert MIDI to WAV

(2219)

Submitted by: Mario Magpale on 05-Sep-2001

Greetings, everyone. I've been tearing my hair out trying to find a way to convert MIDI to WAV using the Yamaha S-YXG100 SoftSynthesizer......I've tried many methods, among them using Sound Recorder and Windows Media Player together, as well as using Total Recorder, both without success.....

Anyone know of a solution?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Sep-2001

msg #2018 might help, if you're one of the unfortunates who can't use the direct approach.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Mario Magpale on 05-Sep-2001

I tried your method, but it doesn't work.....The song can still be heard through the speakers, and I made sure that I switched the settings <i>before</i> I opened any of the programs I needed to record.

Thanks anyways..... =(

Reply 3 offered by: Robin Withey on 05-Sep-2001

I can't vouch for this solution, but I just read it in a magazine today. They recommend a product called "Total Recorder" from High Criteria ( http://www.highcriteria.com ). It's not free, but very cheap (the magazine says about £8 GB), and apparently it uses its own virtual sound driver that grabs things that other programs miss.

Alternatively, depending on your sound card, it might simply be a matter of fiddling with the mixer settings.

Robin

Reply 4 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 5 offered by: John Gillings on 05-Sep-2001

Just did this yesterday. I used "SoundForge CD Architect" which came with my CD writer.

Start the recorder, then play back the MIDI file. I found the first few attempts weren't very good (levels too low and noise). The trick"was to make sure the recording settings are correct.

For Win95/98:

Open the Windows Volume control
From "Options" select "Properties"
Click "Recording" and ensure MIDI and/or WAV are selected
Click "OK"

The window title should change to "Recording Control"

Now adjust the recording levels. Make sure things you don't want are muted (like in my case a "live" microphone! - the source of the noise), and the things you do want are set at a reasonable level.

SoundForge has a neat level meter which retains peaks - this allowed me to play the track through to find an appropriate level.

Reply 6 offered by: Mario Magpale on 06-Sep-2001

It's strange, the problem seems to be that my Wave Out channel is completely occupied by the wavetable emulator when I play MIDIs, therefore I only record silence. And here I thought Yamaha's SoftSynth supports DirectX.....

I tried the virtual audio cable program, it ended up crashing my sound card drivers instead.

There's gotta be a way......

Reply 7 offered by: Mario Magpale on 06-Sep-2001

To add, my soundcard is an old SoundBlaster 16, but I know it supports full-duplexing.....Could that be the problem?

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 06-Sep-2001

The old Soundblaster 16 was not full duplex but there was an upgrade file from Creative that was supposed to make AWE cards and the Sb16 work in full duplex.
The file sbw9xup.exe is still available from the Creative site.

Reply 9 offered by: Mario Magpale on 07-Sep-2001

Well, I've downloaded the drivers, and the method's still not working, although the Virtual Cable drivers no longer crash my system.

Wave out is completely occupied with playing the MIDI using the wavetable synth, whenever I try, I get these messages:

MMSYSTEM003 The driver was not enabled. (I get this when trying to play a MIDI file while a recording program is running.)

MMSYSTEM032 The specified format cannot be translated or supported. Use the Capabilities function to view supported formats. (I get this message when trying to record after playing a MIDI file.)

Ugh, maybe it is my sound card.....

Thanks for all the help everyone, nonetheless.

Reply 10 offered by: Drew Harrison on 08-Sep-2001

For midi to WAV conversion I use an application called WINGROOVE. It is ideal for this, but it does tend to change the sound of some of the instrument as it appear to use its own synthesiser. It is very easy to use. It is very cheap (about $40 - I think) but worth every cent.
If you do a google search for wingroove you'll find it easily.

Drew

Reply 11 offered by: Mario Magpale on 08-Sep-2001

Hmm, I already have Wingroove. In some circumstances, it's instrument set is superb in a few of the songs that I plan to convert. For others, it simply sounds horrible, as some instruments aren't supported by Wingroove. It then tries to substitute it for another (i.e. drum set replaced by a piano)

I just recently downloaded Audio Compositor.....any good soundfonts that anyone would like to mention?

Reply 12 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 08-Sep-2001

General User GS 1.3

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 13 offered by: Charlie van Becelaere on 13-Sep-2001

How about Midi2Wav? I bought it a couple weeks ago (about $15) and it seems to work very well. It's got decent instrument sounds, and converts things quickly and easily.
Check it out at http://www.midi2wav.com/index.html
(I have no financial or other interest in this program, it just seems to work well for me.)
Charlie

Reply 14 offered by: Jean Gallais on 15-Sep-2001

Have you ever tried with Winamp? it can read a MIDI file and output it in a WAV file. The result is good with Quicktime's 'General MIDI' synthesizer.
Good luck.

Reply 15 offered by: Mario Magpale on 19-Sep-2001

Quicktime has a GM synth? I didn't know that....

How do I get WinAmp to use Quicktime's GM synth?

Any ideas?

Reply 16 offered by: Grimblefritz on 22-Sep-2001

Roland Virtual Sound Canvas -- costs about $89, but the results are incomparable, and it is as easy as clicking a button.

Reply 17 offered by: Chad Chadwick on 26-Nov-2001

Winamp easily converts MIDI to WAV. The link below will take you to a simple tutorial:

Winamp MIDI to WAV

-CC

Reply 18 offered by: jezd from chile on 07-Feb-2002

in Winamp is Very easy, only select the option cd writer and you have it, one wav file.

Reply 19 offered by: Molasar on 11-Feb-2002

Ok guys, here's the deal:

I'm using a fair setup, using TotalRecorder to convert MIDIs into WAVs, using SoundBlaster's WaveTable Synthesizer (8Mb samples, nice sound) and Yamaha's SXG SoftSynth (outstanding sound). Everything works fine until you move up to professional sounding WAVs...

What's the problem? Simple. TotalRecorder records sound from the soundcards Analog to Digital Converter, which means that both synths output first goes thru the soundcard's Digital to Analog Converter, then back thru the Analog to Digital Converter, so as to be converted back to a digital stream and saved to disk (a WAV file). All this internal flow causes a good -72dB noise level... with NO MUSIC sounding at all!!!! This is ok for in-home work, but not for professional CD recording. TotalRecorder's "Software" recording setting works beautifully, (as with Virtual Audio Cable) 'cause you get absolutely no noise (you get a "pure" digital stream), but TotalRecorder (VAC, too) uses an MME driver (bad performance) and, although you can redirect Yamaha's SXG's output to that driver, you can't with the SoundBlaster's synth. SO, if you, like me, are playing MIDIs with sounds playing across 2 or more softsynths, you're in trouble... The result? Only SXG's sound get's recorded (with gaps, glitches and all..). What did you expect with an MME driver?

The "pro", super noiseless solution? Get a software that can record or "grab" the digital data stream that reaches the Digital to Analog Converter input of your soundcard. Something like a logical Y splitter. One part goes to the DAC, the other to your disk.

What software does this? Beats me... Searched the net for over 3 months and no dice... Think we need to let Microsoft continue it's WDM drivers and HighCriteria (makers of TotalRecorder) pop up with this kind of software...

Anybody seen this kind of software, by the way?


#2220: Quick question about my XP-30, think you can help?
Quick question about my XP-30, think you can help?

(2220)

Submitted by: Lyrikal on 06-Sep-2001

At the moment, I'm too broke to go out and buy a DAT or something to record my beats off my MPC. So, for now I have to just save the sequences and songs I make on a floppy (too broke for a zip drive too) until I get the needed materials. Since I'm also yet to get a memory card for my Roland, problem is, I'm wondering, when I save "Performance" data on my XP-30, I don't know how to load it back up; or is it supposed to do that itself? One more thing about that, is there a way I can save more than one peroformance setting to my internal memory at a time to be recalled?

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 06-Sep-2001

Is it just me? or is this forum rapidly diverging from its intended purpose? I see more and more queries about general midi, soundcards, keyboards, recording etc... and less about NoteWorthy.

Certainly there may be a pool of expertise in the readership, but I'm rather surprised at the tolerance of NoteWorthy for the increasing traffic unrelated to the NoteWorthy product (indeed, some even about competing products). What's an XP-30 and how does it relate to this forum? Why don't you ask in a forum hosted by the manufacturers of the product?

On the one hand, it may not be appropriate to blow away anyone who deviates from the straight and narrow. Some excursions (or "ratholes") are inevitable and acceptable, especially if they have some tangible link to NoteWorthy, but I really don't read this forum to learn the ideosyncrasies of J-random XP-30's (what ever that may be!)

Nothing against Lyrikal! Please don't take it personally, your question just happened to be the last straw - "do I have to read yet ANOTHER thread on something completely unrelated to NoteWorthy"?

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Sep-2001

John, we try to maintain a "everything in moderation" philosphy on this. Nobody wants to use a forum where most of the discussion is about posts that were deleted, or other posts that weren't but should have been (at least, I hope not). This one isn't near as far off topic as some non-music hardware/software questions, so I don't see the harm in giving it the freedom to develop into something. The title is clear enough as to the nature of the thread. Something productive might come of these discussions. If you don't have, and don't care about, an XP-30, then maybe just ignore posts to this topic.

Now, if the whole forum starts turning into an XP-30 support channel, we will adopt a different stance on this. AN XP-30 is obviously not our product, and I suspect only a small percentage of our customers actually use an XP-30.

Reply 3 offered by: Graham Howe on 08-Sep-2001

I am familiar with the XP50 and XP80, not the XP30, but I hope this will be of help.

If you save your performance data as part of your sequence, it should indeed automatically re-load whwen you play the sequence. As for saving performance data pro se, you can either write it to one of your user performances. Another easy way of doing it - and this works for individual patches or for the whole user memory - is to save the patch data as "sysex" in a sequence, using the "utilities" facility - even if you don't record a song to go with it - and then recall it simply by pressing the start button on your sequencer. I hope this is not too confusing.

By the way, for me, this question was by no means "off topic", as I find that by far the easiest way of scoring music on NWC is to make a midi file using my XP, then simply importing it to NWC; the quantising feature on XP is such that there is rarely too much "tidying up" to do as a result.

Reply 4 offered by: Lyrikal on 08-Sep-2001

I was getting confused about when you said something
about saving patch data as "sysex". I have no idea
what you meant. Could you please go a little deeper
into detail for me. Maybe I'm completly wrong, which I
really hope I'm not, but it seems as if you were
trying to explain to me a way to save info on my
floppy that could play the whole song back, keyboard
sounds and all, when I load it back up on my MPC
sequencer. True or untrue? Holla back at me.......

You cna e-mail me directly also at lyrikal_inq@yahoo.com


#2221: HELP! Is there anyway to make it play softer?
HELP! Is there anyway to make it play softer?

(2221)

Submitted by: Daniel on 07-Sep-2001

I am composing a midi with NWC 1.70 +9.
The song should be soft, but when NWC playbacks it, it sounds like MAD. For example, when I first ask it to playback the song, it's like bang!...bang!...bang!
Is there any way that I can make it to play softly?? As I would play on a real piano?

I know the Performance Style is not working, but is there any way to make it play softer?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Sep-2001

Insert | Dynamic

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 07-Sep-2001

You also have control over volume at the system level. If you're running 32-bit Windows there is probably a loudspeaker icon on your taskbar. Click on this and it will open a "Volume Control" applet where you can adjust output levels to your satisfaction. The same applet can be found (on NT, at least) at Start/Programs/Accessories/Multimedia/Volume Control. There's also a volume slider in Start/Settings/Control Panel/Multimedia.

Reply 3 offered by: Gary Shannon on 07-Sep-2001

You can add dynamics all through a performance to give it a more life-like feel. Take a look at my NWC rendition of Beethoven's 6th Symphony for an example of performance dynamics for crescendos in a mostly very soft piece.

Beethoven 6th

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Eidson on 08-Sep-2001

You might also try adjusting the staff volume from the default (?) 127 (the maximum volume level)

It's under Staff Properties / MIDI


#2222: dynamic variance on sustained notes
dynamic variance on sustained notes

(2222)

Submitted by: Tex on 07-Sep-2001

Is there any way in NoteWorthy to change the dynamic level of a note that is being sustained throughout several bars? It seems to only change the dynamic when you start a new note, and won't work if the notes are tied over several bars.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred on 07-Sep-2001

Dynamics affect "note velocity", which is directly associated with each note; changing this while a note is playing will not change the loudness of that note, only subsequent ones.

The best way IMO to change loudness of a held note is to use mpc's (multi-point controllers) to do a "linear sweep" of either the volume or expression controller. The "NWC Command Summary" on the http://www.vadu.com/nwc/ includes a tutorial on this, should you be interested.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Fred on 07-Sep-2001

Oops. Blew the link. Here it is again.

NWC Scriptorium


#2223: midi input and key signatures - HELP PLEASE
midi input and key signatures - HELP PLEASE

(2223)

Submitted by: Bonnie Morton on 08-Sep-2001

I know there have been several threads related to transposition, accidentals etc. but I still can't get my midi input into the right key.

Using record play from a Midi keyboard, I open the waltz rhythm template (in key of C? - except there is no key notation on the cleff)and start playing along. My song is in E flat. When I 'import recording' it shows up on a staff in C with accidentals.

I 'insert/key signature E flat' on the import staff, 'tools/force accidentals' and then 'transpose staff' 0 to no avail. My staff music is still full of D sharps etc.

I've only been using NoteWorthy for about two weeks, so I hope the veterans out there can provide some help. I'm obviously missing something.

All help appreciated.

Bonnie

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Sep-2001

This procedure just changed in the most recent releases, and some of the documentation is out of sequence.

If you are using the latest NWC update (1.70 + Update 9), then a Transpose of 0 semitones won't really do anything unless the piece is in one of the ambiguous key signatures. You can use the Tools | Audit Enharmonic Spelling command to respell into a new key.

Reply 2 offered by: Bonnie Morton on 08-Sep-2001

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU -- stay tuned for my next challenge! - Bonnie


#2224: Help! How can I add the "tr" to a note
Help! How can I add the "tr" to a note

(2224)

Submitted by: polar on 08-Sep-2001

as title

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 08-Sep-2001

The "tr" and "tr~~~~" are simply text expressions.

Go to Insert / Text -- this will bring up a box and you can type whichever you would like. To make the sound of a trill, you must create a hidden staff. Check the Moonlight example in the Samples folder.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 08-Sep-2001

There is a trill symbol (and much more) in the Boxmarks font which you can get from the Helpful Files section of the NWC Scriptorium. This font comes in a .zip file with instructions on its installation and use.

Inserting the symbol, of course, makes no difference in the sound you get when you play the file in NWC or export to MIDI. For that there's no alternative to writing out all of the little notes that make up the trill.

You can, if you wish, get both the look and sound of the trill at the same time by inserting the trill symbol on a visible but muted staff, and writing out the trill in full on a hidden but audible staff.

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 09-Sep-2001

A simpler while lower quality trill can be achieved by adding invisible grace notes if you want to survive the double-staff trouble.

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 12-Sep-2001

Personally I prefer to use MPCs on (usually 2 or 3; 1 or 2 for mordants). Do not forget to reset the normal tuning as the last action in the last MPC :)
This allows you not to add extra notes nor a hidden staff.
It even allows you to make it sound more real (as on a true grand flute, some trills don't sound exactly well; with Pitch bend you can do that :)

I think it's already in the users tips, (...a bit of searching...) yes, Olivier wrote it:
http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/usertip3.htm#trillmpc

HTH,
Marsu


#2225: Is there anymore instruments I can choose besides
Is there anymore instruments I can choose besides

(2225)

Submitted by: Daniel on 08-Sep-2001

Does anybody know how can I add more instruments to the instrument list?

In the Patch List Type, there are several sound banks I can choose, but I can't find a better piano sound in those "Patch Type"s.

Please help me. Thank you.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 09-Sep-2001

Patch lists don't contain additional patches; they're just alternative list formats that you can manipulate by appending/changing the nwcpatch.ini file.

You need to install one or more of software synthesizers or (if your sound device is compatible) use soundfonts. Have a search the forum archive for several threads on topic.

Hth

---
Decode address to reply


#2226: SoundBlaster Live! EAX Technology
SoundBlaster Live! EAX Technology

(2226)

Submitted by: Paul on 09-Sep-2001

Does NoteWorthy Composer support the EAX Technology used on Creative SoundBlaster Live! Audiocards.

When the answer is "yes": How can I use this in NWC? Do I have to use the NWC MultiPoint Controller then?

I am looking forward to your advise.


#2227: Server Move
Server Move

(2227)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Sep-2001

We are shifting our noteworthysoftware.com site over to a new server today (Monday). If you experience any troubles, just try again in a few hours.

This forum (on ntworthy.com) will not be impacted by this current move.


#2228: sound fonts
sound fonts

(2228)

Submitted by: tobiassimms on 12-Sep-2001

i have windows 2000 and a awe 64gold card when i try to load sound fonts it tells me that the there is no sound font device on my system and tells me to find thees @ creative labs but i carnt find any could you please help

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 12-Sep-2001

It's reported that w95/98 drivers for Live! series crash in w2k. I don't know know case in AWEs but might be identical. Try downloading the latest drivers for your device and installing them.

!link <(Sound Font Newsgroup=news://news.silco.com/silco.hammersound.soundfonts)> is generally a good place to ask help on such issues.

Hth,

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 12-Sep-2001

Excuse me, I mistyped the link. Here it is:

< !link (Sound Font Newsgroup=news://news.silco.com/silco.hammersound.soundfonts) >

Reply 3 offered by: Tim Stewart on 28-Oct-2001

I had the same problem, and the solution is simply to change your sound card! How about trying a Creative Sound Blaster Live Player 5.1 PCI OEM card? They are cheap, and they work.

I hope this helps.

Regards Tim

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 29-Oct-2001

Funny, I'd have said "the solution is not to use Windows 2000"...

Ertugrul, no need to use '<' and '>' chars for URLs. simply type it prefixed by exclamation mark, or if you want to use the "link" format, do it use specified in the Hints for forum page :)
But in any case, it seems that the "link()" format does not (yet!?) work with nntp URLs...
Best regards,
Dominique

Reply 5 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 29-Oct-2001

text format does work with news:// tag, but !news://url doesn't do. The angle brackets were mea culpa :(

---
Decode address to email


#2229: Inverted G clef
Inverted G clef

(2229)

Submitted by: Kaz on 13-Sep-2001

Does anyone know how to insert "Inverted G clef"?
This is necessary to notate Mozart's (or believed so) small piece "Upsidedown". ---I am afraid I don't know exact name of this work in English. But I believe some people can remember what it is.

Thank you

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Sep-2001

The way I ended up doing it was to edit the clef, making it upside down, using a graphics editor. I exported it as a bitmap using the 16-bit version Print Preview, then edited using Paint Shop Pro. In the 32-bit (Windows 9x) version you can do the same using WMF (Windows metafile).

You can see the result at my Educational music page (you'll need GSview to view this).

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 14-Sep-2001

Do you want me to add it to boxmark2 (in that case I'll add the three clés) ?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred on 14-Sep-2001

Well, I don't need it anymore, and I guess it depends on how many more people want to do the Mozart inverted retrograde... ;-)

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Kaz on 16-Sep-2001

Thank you guys.
I went to Educational Music and found you have already made it.
Actually I haven't printed it yet. But I think I can with the instruction in your reply.
I don't think it should be involved in Boxmark2 either.
Because no other music in the world needs it but the Mirror.

Thanks again.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 17-Sep-2001

... and maybe a few pieces from the Musical Offering.


#2230: Noteworth Visability
Noteworth Visability

(2230)

Submitted by: Gary Shannon on 14-Sep-2001

I'm happy to see Noteworthy getting more attention. In a recent nntp newsgroup post someone asked if they should get Sibelius or Finale, and most of the responses advised the poster to get Noteworthy :)

Keep up the good work Noteworthy folks!

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 14-Sep-2001

COOL!

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 16-Sep-2001

Been there, done that :)

---
Decode address to reply


#2231: Percussion Notation and Diddles
Percussion Notation and Diddles

(2231)

Submitted by: Bill Buchanan on 15-Sep-2001

Anyone out there know if there's a plugin that will let me use diddles? I've searched through Noteworthy and I can not find anything related to it. I'm trying to write a rudimental snare solo, but I really can't unless I fave diddles! I REALLY don't want to have to write 32nd notes! Please help!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Sep-2001

Hi Bill,

Not being a percussionist, I wouldn't know a diddle from a doodle, or a dawdle for that matter. ;-)

I take it, though, that it's some sort of tremolo marking. Perhaps one of the symbols in one of the alternate fonts would do the job for you. There are a number of musical fonts available at The Scriptorium , most of us seem to use Boxmarks2 simply for portability reasons. But if a suitable symbol isn't in this font, you can check out the others and specify that this font is needed to properly view your work.
As regards the playback, this can be accomplished using a hidden "sounded" staff, containing the notes explicitly (32nd notes). Use of COPY/PASTE can make this a lot easier.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 17-Sep-2001

One way to make things easier, if the "diddle" (as in paradiddle?) is a set pattern that gets used a lot, is to create a .NWC file containing a prototype diddle. You can then keep this file open in a separate window, and cut & paste from it into your snare solo wherever you need it.


#2232: New Playback Instruments
New Playback Instruments

(2232)

Submitted by: Some Guy on 16-Sep-2001

Is there a way to get new playback instruments? Like, after importing a midi, is there a way you can save the instrument that file used for a particular staff?

Reply 1 offered by: Gary Shannon on 17-Sep-2001

The instrument patch is part of the midi file and is automatically saved in both the midi and in the nwc file when you save it. You don't have to do anything.

Reply 2 offered by: Robin Withey on 18-Sep-2001

That's true up to a point, but all that's saved is a number. What instrument that number represents is down to convention. Since the General Midi convention was introduced, there's a pretty good chance your midi or nwc song will sound the same on all PCs and most modern keyboards, but my old Yamaha PSS-780 isn't GM, so if I use it as a playback instrument, things can sound pretty weird, particularly since the percussion channel is channel 16, not channel 10 as in GM.

Robin

Reply 3 offered by: Robin Withey on 18-Sep-2001

Sorry, I got side-tracked there, and forgot my point, which was that although GM instruments are standard, the quality can vary, depending on the sound card, and whether or not it supports sound fonts (there are plenty of threads in the forum on sound fonts). If you're looking to use special effects, for example, these are not all standard, so if you "roll your own" sound fonts, or use someone else's, a third party will not get the effect you intended.

Robin

Reply 4 offered by: The Guy that Posted it on 19-Sep-2001

thanks, I'm kinda a newbie to stuff like this.


#2233: "x" notes
"x" notes

(2233)

Submitted by: Jaydj on 18-Sep-2001

Could anyone please advice on how to properly notate "x" notes. I have a composition where I need to notate a rap. Any help will be appreciated! Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 18-Sep-2001

Now listen up, homies, gonna lay this down.
Yeah you better pay attention 'cause I ain't no clown.
What you gotta do for x-notes when you're laying rap
Is a two-stage process, so that it's a snap.
Is lay the rhythm down using ordinary notes
Then hide those "[censored]" as I'd say in quotes.
How you do this is the hidden attribute, homie.
Then to make some Xs showing where the notes should be,
Place them one by one, where you like, as text.
That's another music problem solved, Jack. Next?

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Sep-2001

ROTFLMAOSTC!

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 19-Sep-2001

Brilliant!
(Whatever Fred said and double).

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Sep-2001

"...Whatever Fred said"

Rolling On The Floor Laughing My [censored] Off, Scaring The Cat.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 19-Sep-2001

You said it, Fred! By the way, I thought that rap was notated using M and F rather than X.

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 19-Sep-2001

No, "mf" stands for "mezzo forte".

Reply 7 offered by: FranMan on 20-Sep-2001

Well, that about "raps" up this thread!

Reply 8 offered by: ben on 12-Oct-2001

and they said musicians were crazy...

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 16-Oct-2001

...I won't dare to modify this estonishing reply of Joe Music!, but I'm pleased to announce that there will be a "x" symbol in next boxmark2 release. Hoping it'll be better than an "x" text symbol!
I had included it after my hard disk crashed, from the backup I made 5 months ago :(. I just now have to re-create symbols as (/\/\/\ and some others, and I'll let you know where to DL it.

Brgds,
Dominique


#2234: More control over layout
More control over layout

(2234)

Submitted by: Tom Gutnick on 18-Sep-2001

I'm trying to figure out how to get more control over the print layout. I know that I can insert a bar line and specify "Force system break", which potentially adds more spacing. But how can I go the other way? In other words, how can I specify that I don't want the staff break right where NWC is doing it, but a measure later, and just scrunch everything on that system a little closer together.
(It's like justifying text -- if you only ever justify your lines by adding spaces, it looks a lot worse than when you're using a system smart enough to sometimes remove fractions of spaces.)

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Sep-2001

NWC allows you to force a system break, but you cannot prevent one from happening when the notation extends to the margin.

If you have not done so already, you might want to uncheck "Increase note spacing for larger note durations" in File | Page Setup | Options.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Sep-2001

A technique that sometimes gains you extra space is to go through your staves finding things that take up space, and either do without or change the alignment attributes. For instance, you might have dynamic markings with Preserve Width on to place them without collisions; replace with Preserve Width Off and whatever alignment, adjusting manually to avoid collisions.

Another thing to keep in mind is that things on *all* staves affect space required. So if you have something "before other staff signatures" on one staff, and something else "after staff signatures" at the same place on another staff, you'll use up excessive space.

Beam notes wherever possible (and still musically correct) as unbeamed notes take up a tad more space.

HTH
Fred

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Sep-2001

Another possibility is to set the page margins to be very narrow (large print width).

The WMF output from NWC (print preview:copy:placeable) can be scaled within a word processing document or a drawing program.

Consider using a non-standard page size (extra width) within NWC.

Random suggestions, I admit. But I have found that NWC gives me better control over printin than brand X, if one is willing to be creative.


#2235: using roland expansion card
using roland expansion card

(2235)

Submitted by: Christian Wollin on 19-Sep-2001

I have a Roland 1010 Sound module with an orchestral expansion card. I can´t figure out how to use the sounds on the expansion card in Noteworthy Composer. The Roland JV 1010 i more or less the same as Roland JV 1080 and JV 2080. Can anyone help.
Thanks
Chris

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Sep-2001

Since this box supports many more than 128 instruments out of the box, I assume the techniques to access additional sound banks would be the same for the internal sounds, as well as add-on boards. Your manual should spell out how to access additional sounds.

Usually this is done by sending bank select messages. You can do this in NWC from the Instrument selection, either from Staff Properties, or in mid-performance from Insert | Instrument Patch. If the Roland box supports bank select changes, the manual should spell out the settings for Controller 0 and Controller 32 (which combine to form a bank select).


#2237: Help with Yamaha PSR-340/MIDI Mapper
Help with Yamaha PSR-340/MIDI Mapper

(2237)

Submitted by: ALT on 19-Sep-2001

Hello. I have a serious problem apparently with using my PSR-340 with NoteWorthy. I do have the MIDI cables connected to IN to OUT and OUT to IN. Since I have a SoundBlaster Live! card, I had to purchase a special adapter for the joystick/midi port. Since doing so, I have not been successful in communications between the two devices. In fact, just recently, NoteWorthy keeps giving me the error of "The following play devices have failed to open properly: MIDI Mapper. This problem must be fixed before proceeding". It hasn't given this message to me before. I went in to Control Panel and adjusted my MIDI IN. I have in NoteWorthy adjusted my MIDI IN. My keyboard is supposed to have yes/no options for Keyboard Out,Accompaniment Out, ExtClock, and InitSend, but instead, I have dashes and cannot change them. When I try to record, it won't let me because of the MIDI mapper. I can't even press the MIDI input button because of the MIDI mapper. Any help would be extremely appreciated. Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 20-Sep-2001

Your MIDI Mapper error could be caused by one of three things:

1 - You have selected multiple devices for play back, including the device used by the MIDI Mapper (you should not select more than one device unless you know what you are doing)

2 - You have another application running that is using the MIDI Mapper, or the actual device that is mapped by the MIDI Mapper (try closing other apps to correct this)

3 - You have a setup problem with the MIDI Mapper (you need to fix your system setup in this case)

As for getting your MIDI cables to work:

1 - If you are using a LiveDrive attached to your SB Live, you MUST use the MIDI ports on the LiveDrive

2 - IN/OUT assignments are not always labeled consistently, neither on joysticks MIDI cables nor keyboard MIDI ports (don't be afraid to try the reverse connects if all else fails)

You can also search this forum for lots of examples of others not being able to get their external MIDI connection to work at first. Fixes vary; faulty drivers, faulty MIDI cables, cable connections reversed, faulty soundcard, faulty keyboard; anything could be wrong. You just have to try and narrow it down.

Reply 2 offered by: Geoff Walker on 22-Sep-2001

Go to Tools/Options on the menu, Select the "Midi" tab and set your playback device to "SB Live! MIDI Out" so that you connect directly to the MIDI output port rather than via the MIDI Mapper and see if that works

Geoff


#2238: Prismer sequencer
Prismer sequencer

(2238)

Submitted by: Rick on 20-Sep-2001

In the course of trying out a number of shareware MIDI sequencers, I found that PRISMER seemed to have all the features I wanted. But when I tried to contact the manufacturer (Creative Tech Korea), I got nowhere. Does anyone out there know what happened to PRISMER? It's a shame if all the development work was done for nothing!

Reply 1 offered by: Keith on 20-Sep-2001

Rick -
I turned this site up using Yahoo - searching on Creative Tech Korea.

http://www.blastershop.co.kr/tomanager.asp

The reference mentioned Creative Tech Korea, but the page is mostly _in_ Korean. There's an obvious connection to Creative Labs. Don't know if this is the same company. Good Luck.

HTH,
Keith

Reply 2 offered by: Rick on 20-Sep-2001

Thanks! I'm not sure if it will lead anywhere, but it's worth a try. Too bad my Korean is so rusty! ;D


#2239: American National Anthem
American National Anthem

(2239)

Submitted by: Ian Samson on 21-Sep-2001

I am looking for the American National Anthem, A Star-Spangled Banner, with the words, if available in PDF or NWC format. Otherwise, please send me a URL and I will key it into NWC myself.

This is from a life-long USA supporter in South Africa, me!

Thanks very much.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 21-Sep-2001

NWC Scriptorium > Anthems & Military Music

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 22-Sep-2001

Currently, the fashionable song in the U.S. of A. is "God Bless America." The song goes back many years -- It may be that the overtly religious connotation is a response to current affairs.

Otherwise, a lot of Americans (I am one) prefer "America the Beautiful" (Oh beautiful for spacious skies...etc.) to the official "Star Spangled Banner" since its lyrics are more positive.

If you are looking for something that is characteristically American, try the well-known Sousa marches.

Of course, for the many British readers of this forum, you can burn the candle at both ends using "My Country 'Tis of Thee / God Save the Queen."

Reply 3 offered by: Ian Samson on 24-Sep-2001

So, where does one find "God bless America" or "America the beautiful"? I have tried both search terms and the database comes up with a fat zero.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 24-Sep-2001

I did a search using Altavista (+MIDI +"God Bless America")and came up with a bunch of hits, including the following:

http://members.tripod.com/~son_struck/pmm.html

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 24-Sep-2001

... although, having just listened to their version of "America the Beautiful", I suggest you may wish to look elsewhere. The harmonic setting is decidedly non-traditional.

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 24-Sep-2001

"God Bless America" was written by Irving Berlin, at about the time of WWII. I believe it is still under copyright, meaning that the music ought not to be freely available on-line. Certainly, it is possible to purchase copies of the sheet music at (American) music stores, or on-line from Internet vendors.

I am not certain whether "America the Beautiful" is recent (copyrighted), or older (public domain). As for "My Country 'Tis of Thee," certainly the melody is public domain, and the words are widely known.

Incidentally, I have come across non-standard versions of "America the Beautiful" that I believe are optimized for amateur choral singing. There are several verses to the song. The first, most well-known, is not particularly jingoistic. Some of the others are.

National anthems, and related patriotic songs, often become controversial with the passage of time. Consider the Marseillaise (France), with it blood flowing in the fields. Consider "Deutschland Ueber Alles," with its interpretation that was not intended (and could not have been intended) by the writer. Even in America, a folk song such as "This Land Is Your Land" is criticized for meaning "This land isn't yours (Natives) any more, it's mine (Europeans) only!" Needless to say, any song mentioning God is criticized by nonbelievers, believers of other persuasions, some believers who don't specifically believe that, and critics of "the dominant paradigm."

Reply 7 offered by: Grant on 25-Sep-2001

The lyrics to "America the Beautiful" were written by Katharine Lee Bates in 1893 (and revised in 1904). The melody, as I understand it, is even older. Both should by now be in the public domain.


#2240: Fifths
Fifths

(2240)

Submitted by: Ian Samson on 21-Sep-2001

I want to key in Saint Saens' Aquarium from the Carnival of the Animals, but NWC doesn't allow FIFTHS. How can I do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 21-Sep-2001

Clarify your question. I'm not familiar with the score, myself, but maybe another user is familiar with it.

Are you trying to transpose the music by a fifth? If so, it's easy with NWC. Or, do you need to create 5-tuplets (five notes played in the time normally occupied by four), in which case that's not easy -- but I believe there are work-arounds available.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 21-Sep-2001

I'm not aware of any problem that NWC has with 5ths. I think Ian is looking for quintuplets.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 21-Sep-2001

Ian, assuming that you're after quintuplets, let me make a few suggestions.

NWC doesn't officially support these, but there are partial solutions available to the determined user. How successful they are depends on what you're after.

It's relatively easy to get the aural effect of 5 notes in the space of 4. If the quintuplet happens all by itself, all you need to do is to enter the 5 notes and temporarily speed up the tempo to 5/4 of its normal value so that the 5 notes pass in the time normally allotted to 4. Other staves sounding simultaneously will have to be padded appropriately with rests or tied notes.

If other staves have a different rhythm while the quintuplet is happening, you'll have to find the least common multiple of the simultaneous subdivisions and notate the rhythms accordingly. For example, if you're dealing with 5 against 4, the least common multiple is 20. Divide this number by the number of equal divisions in each rhythm to get the length of each note - so, in this example, each note in the quintuplet will be 20/5, or 4, units long, and each note in the quadruplet will be 20/4, or 5, units. If both of these subdivisions are happening in the normal space of, say, 4 16th notes, the most straightforward thing to do is to increase the tempo by 25% (old tempo * 5/4) and use 64th notes as the basic unit. Each note in the quintuplet can then be written as a straight 16th (4 64th units) and each note in the quadruplet as a 16th tied to a 64th (5 64th units).

If you're also in the market for a score that will look correct when printed, the problem is harder. There are things you can do with hidden items (notes, rests, time signatures) and perhaps a bottle of Wite-Out to get close to the intended visual result, but there are certain things that just can't be done. For example, if you're dealing with notes beamed together, you'll find that hiding a note also hides its stem and the tie to a subsequent note (good), but doesn't hide partial beams, such as those on the stem of a 64th beamed with 32nds (bad).

If you decide to try what I've suggested and run into specific problems, post back here and I'll try to help.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 21-Sep-2001

>>partial beams, such as those on the stem of a 64th beamed with 32nds

As we all should know, there's only 1 partial beam on a 64th beamed with 32nds. I meant a 64th beamed with 16ths (as in the 5-against-4 example above).

Reply 5 offered by: Ian Samson on 22-Sep-2001

Thank you, Grant. I will certaily try your suggestions. The piece of music for those who don't know it, is Saint Saens' Aquarium from the Carnival of the Animals which is available for download in PDF format from some sites.

Reply 6 offered by: bluey on 22-Sep-2001

I just saw this on TV about a week ago, it was performed in Germany by 2 sisters on 2 pianos plus some other musicians.
I really liked it, and I was wondering if are there any of the pieces out there on midi?

Bluey

Reply 7 offered by: Matt Westwood on 20-Oct-2001

I'd like to add my own comments on this for the support of indefinitely variable groupings (i.e. not just 3, not just 5, but 11's and 17's, as used in (for example) bar 86 of "The Gnome" from Mussorgsky's "Pictures", where you get 11 semiquavers grouped in a 3-crotchet bar, and also some of the rather more complicated things going on in Holst's "Neptune".

Yes okay, there's a work-round - I can change the time signature to 11/16 or 17/16 or whatever, but this doesn't help much when I want to play notes in the standard pattern in another stave (there's examples of 5 against 4 all through Rachmaninov's G-major prelude, and he even runs triplets against 5-groupings in some places. Not only that, there are places where you get 5-groupings *and* six-groupings all in the same bar, which makes artificially modifying the time signature somewhat tricky.

I gather that this is on the wish list - but do we have any idea about whether this functionality is to be addressed? If so, then the program will be even more ultra-wonderful than it already is.

Keep up the good work ...


#2241: Yet another newsgroup trouble
Yet another newsgroup trouble

(2241)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 21-Sep-2001

Server not found
Code: 800ccc0d

1:45 (GMT + 2:00)

Is anybody else out there facing this problem?

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 21-Sep-2001

Yes, there's apparently something wrong with the server. I've been getting the same error code.

Reply 2 offered by: Alain Rolland on 21-Sep-2001

Hello
It's the same
"Serveur introuvable"
What happens?
bye

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 21-Sep-2001

Tell me they didn't put news2 on a microsoft server, and if they did, tell me they didn't catch W32.Nimda.A@mm ... this one makes Code Red look like a picnic.
!link(Symantec info=http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data/w32.nimda.a@mm.html)

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 21-Sep-2001

Whose turn is it, to contact Matt?

Reply 5 offered by: Bill Mullins on 21-Sep-2001

Ah, so that explains it. I hadn't tried to connect to the NG for a few days. When I did, I kept getting that blasted "server not found" error message.

(sigh) Oh well, maybe it'll be back soon.

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 21-Sep-2001

I'm afraid it's as serious as what we had in the latest crash.

---
Decode address...oh, you know!

Reply 7 offered by: Geoff Walker on 22-Sep-2001

I had similar problems.

"Unable to connect to server" last night and
"Connection refused to server" this morning.

Geoff

Reply 8 offered by: Magrat on 22-Sep-2001

You saying it IS that blasted Nimda worm or whatever it's called? I had some stuff I wanted to upload, c'est la vie. On a brighter note, I installed Windows XP Pro today and I love it! My system runs like a 1.4Ghz Athlon SHOULD (unlike under ME, when it ran about half-speed!) and I love the new look. As you all know, I'm the last person who would be shouting M$'s praises from the roof, but I think they've finally got it right! I've never had the ability to Hibernate before, but I like the fact I can go to bed, still leaving everything open. Sorry advertisement over! Just HAD to share.

Reply 9 offered by: Joe Roberts on 22-Sep-2001

It's still out as of 22/09 17:30 GMT.

Fred, I think you're right. It's uncanny that this happened with Nimda spreading in the same kind of coincidence earlier with Code Red. It's too bad Matt has to go through this again. I wish there were some way we could help. Maybe time to move over to Apache and begone with IIS.

Joe

Reply 10 offered by: Andrew on 22-Sep-2001

ezusa COULDN'T still be on a Microsoft server after last time, surely? Could they? ... They could, couldn't they?
I can only assume they got hit again. Anyone confirm this?

Reply 11 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 22-Sep-2001

It's 2:15 GMT. The newsgroup is up and working.


#2242: Playback
Playback

(2242)

Submitted by: Jeff Davis on 22-Sep-2001

Hello:

No matter what instrument I assign to a staff, everything plays back as if it's a harmonica. What could be the problem?

Thanks,

Jeff Davis

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Sep-2001

It could be that you have an instrument patch command in the staff itself. For the harmonica patch this would look like:

{#023}

If you select this and press delete, it will be gone and the instrument you assign in Staff Properties should be active.

Another possibility: you may have another staff on the same channel, with harmonica assigned to it. You can use Tools -> Score Review to look for duplicated channel assignments.

HTH

Fred


#2243: I can't get percussion
I can't get percussion

(2243)

Submitted by: Tessa Roberts on 23-Sep-2001

I can't seem to get any percussion at all except woodblocks which is really annoying me. There simply isn't an option on my playback instrument list of any untuned percussion, i.e. drum kits/timpani. I looked at some of the old questions and it says set it to channel 10 - WHAT? I don't know anything about channels? Help me!

Reply 1 offered by: Keith on 23-Sep-2001

Hi, Tessa-

I agree. Woodblocks would get very boring. Here's how to set the channel. Highlight the staff you're going to set to percussion and hit F2 to bring up the staff properties. Click the MIDI tab and you'll see CHANNEL at the bottom. Just set it to 10 and you've got a drum kit.

Having done this, I suggest you next visit the
NWC Scriptorium
and download the Starks/Purdam classic DRUM.NWC. It will provide a permanent reference for you.

Hope this helps-
Keith


#2245: multiple flow direction commands
multiple flow direction commands

(2245)

Submitted by: alper on 27-Sep-2001

hi,
first d.c. instruction (d.c. al coda) works allright, to coda jumps OK, but the next d.c. instruction (just a d.c.) does nothing (except disabling master loops).
I tried d.s. and dal segno instead, but to no avail.

Is this normal behaviour? Are multiple flow direction commands not possible?

thanks

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Sep-2001

Multiple flow direction commands are not supported.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 29-Sep-2001

...and it's a real problem for playback/visible concordance sequencing multiple DC/DS pieces as ones that Fahte frequently posts, for instance.

Another problem is that master repeats and special endings are not granted after flow direction.

Now to the wishlist...


#2247: Ellington conference in Hawaii
Ellington conference in Hawaii

(2247)

Submitted by: David Palmquist on 01-Oct-2001

I plugged Noteworthy Composer to the webmaster for the Duke Ellington Festival and Duke Ellington Conference planned for Hawaii next April (check it out at www.HAPA2.com/Duke). Steve liked what he saw, and has added a link to the NWC site.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Oct-2001

Wow, neat! Right there in the menu frame. Also nice that they used your quote, and a very good quote it is. :)

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 01-Oct-2001

Indeed. Hopefully, visitors to that site won't be fooled into thinking that it's just a MIDI player! Interestingly, easy-to-use NWC is advertised near another product that makes the opposite claim -- "for geeks." Different strokes for different folks.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Oct-2001

Hey, that's no fair! Geeks can use NWC too, just look at me for example... ;-)

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: David Palmquist on 01-Oct-2001

So, if you like Ellington (I'm not talking the common, commercial stuff like Satin Doll and A-Train, but I am talking about Creole Love Call, Washington Wobble, East St. Louis Toodle-Oo, Mood Indigo, Daybreak Express, Reminiscing in Tempo, three Sacred Concerts, Black and Tan Fantasie, Far East Suite, Madness in Great Ones, Happy-Go-Lucky Local, Harlem, Perdido, C-Jam Blues, Main Stem, Caravan or any of the other 2000 or 3000 pieces he wrote or co-wrote between 1923 and 1974), why not join us on the Duke-LYM discussion list? Duke-LYM is free, and you can check it out by sending the message "subscribe Duke-LYM" to majordomo@concordia.ca; you can unsubscribe at anytime too.

Also, why not consider a weekend at the Ellington conference in Hawaii next April, or a week or more at the Ellington cultural festival. Details at www.hapa2.com/duke

Reply 5 offered by: Barry Graham on 02-Oct-2001

Yipes! - and Cottontail - written 20 years before it's time.

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 02-Oct-2001

Thanks for the Ellington playlist, DAvid and Barry. I do like Jazz in general but I have remained a newbie for years. Such kind of what-to-listen guidance really helps and is never found widely.

---
Decode address to reply


#2249: Forum Changes
Forum Changes

(2249)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Oct-2001

The forum has now been moved onto our primary noteworthysoftware.com web server. Information that you have previously saved in a cookie (your name and e-mail address) will have to be recreated for the new server. Follow the help link for details on how to set up defaults for use in the forum.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 03-Oct-2001

If you experience any problems with the forum, please post them as replies in this thread.

Reply 2 offered by: Jeremy Ewen on 03-Oct-2001

Is this why the subjects in the list of postings had all gone back to blue again (and therefore looked as if I had never seen them before)?

J

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 03-Oct-2001

>Is this why the subjects in the list of postings had all
>gone back to blue again?

Yes. Your browser doesn't realise that www.noteworthysoftware.com is the same as www.ntworthy.com and therefore doesn't recognise those new URLs.

btw (to NWS), the cookie delivery works fine. It however doesn't delete the old ones, which is no big deal, but thought I'd mention it.

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 04-Oct-2001

Will ntworthy.com be still available or will you abandon it completely (except this automatic redirection)?

---
Decode address to reply

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Oct-2001

It will continue to work the way it does now (redirects to noteworthysoftware.com).

Reply 6 offered by: FranMan on 08-Oct-2001

Excuse me for being so ignorant, but what is the point of having 3 servers and not using 2 of them for anything but redirection?

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Oct-2001

I don't know what you are talking about.

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Oct-2001

At the moment, we have two servers: our new one and the old one. Changes to DNS entries can take a long time to go into full circulation, so not all of our domains are, as of yet, routing directly to our new server. We specifically have planned the transition such that there is no loss of service. During the transition, the old server remains in operation, although it only redirects traffic to the new server.

We will still be doing domain redirection even when all DNS routing resolves to our new server. Don't confuse a domain redirection as a sign that there are more servers in play. This is not the case.

Reply 9 offered by: Joe Music on 09-Oct-2001

In other words, it is one piece of hardware with several names, rather than several pieces of hardware.

It is analogous to a woman retaining usage of her maiden name so that she is recognized in her career, even though she may have legally changed her surname upon marriage.

Reply 10 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 10-Oct-2001

Well, maybe Eric will soon remove this entry but I can't keep myself:

LOL!

Reply 11 offered by: marsu on 16-Oct-2001

Eric: Thanks to keep the short name working. It's much more easy to enter :)
Joe: a woman's surname is legally only her father's one. Getting married gives her an extra surname, but the "old" one is the only really legal. The new one is just a "usename" that she *can* use. Well, at least it's like that in France... :)
Ertugrul: why should "Sysop" remove that reply?

Reply 12 offered by: Grant on 16-Oct-2001

Marsu,

I think things work differently in the U.S. Here, if a woman chooses to change her name when she marries, I believe the new name is her legal name. For example, all of my wife's documents (Social Security card, driver's license, etc.) are in her married name. Many women choose to keep their maiden name (last name before marriage) as their middle name when they adopt their husband's last name, but not all. My sister, for one, merely replaced her last name with her husband's. Her maiden name (i.e., my last name) appears nowhere in any of her legal documents.

Is this off-topic, or what?

Reply 13 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 16-Oct-2001

In Turkey, we have lived some changes through the short history. At first, it was as Grant described. Then, they allowed a woman to keep her birthname after getting married, plus her husband's name.

The crap has begun when they allowed a *divorced* woman to carry her ex-husband's name.

Marsu wrote in msg #2249 (reply 11):
> Ertugrul: why should "Sysop" remove that reply?

Because it's too OT and empty. A bare LOL may be useful in an NG but I think rules are more strict here. Anyway, it's there for a week...

---
Decode address to email.

Reply 14 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 16-Oct-2001

In Canada, anyone can legally change their name(s) to anything you like. You just have to do a public notice (usually a notice in a local newspaper for a few weeks running suffices), and fill out some forms, and of course pay your money. You could change your name to Fool Donkey, if you were so inclined.

A local artist with a multi-syllabic Germanic name changed his name a couple years ago. He wanted the name to be just "Angel" but had to have both a first name and a surname. So, his legal name is now "Angel Angel."

F

Reply 15 offered by: Grant on 16-Oct-2001

Note to Ertugrul: It's not at all uncommon in the U.S. for divorced women to keep their married name. I don't think it generally causes a problem.

Note to Fred: Every time election day rolls around there's another story in the press about some candidate who has tried to have his name legally changed to (and printed on the ballot as) "None of the Above". This is, IIRC, not usually allowed. However, I do seem to remember a story about a man who succeeded in having his name legally changed to "Absolutely Nobody".

Reply 16 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 17-Oct-2001

A famous popstar (String?) had had his name changed to an unprintable/nonpronouncable character. He seems to have given up later.

About the surname: I agree that it's not generally a problem. However, in a patriarchal society as here, the name, when it's the ex-husbands name esp., can be a problem for the him.

Reply 17 offered by: Grant on 17-Oct-2001

You're referring to Prince, who indeed seems to have abandoned the weird symbol he once adopted. The whole story just goes to show that a name with no pronunciation is a contradiction in terms. Even the print media, who had the symbol because Prince had sent bitmaps of it to the major media outlets (!), resisted using it, referring to him as "The Artist Formerly Known As Prince". This in its turn acquired a shorthand pronunciation of "Taskap". At this point I suspect Taskap realized the folly of the endeavor and gave it up.

As to "String", I think you mean "Sting" (though "String" conjures up some funny images). "Sting" is, of course, not the name he was born with, but he's never (to my knowledge) tried to replace it with a symbol.

Reply 18 offered by: Grant on 17-Oct-2001

For The Artist Formerly Known As Prince, I wrote "taskap". I should have written "Tafkap".

Reply 19 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Oct-2001

And now that he *has* given up this silliness, he's The Artist Formerly Known As Tafkap.

Reply 20 offered by: Grant on 17-Oct-2001

In other words, Tafkat.

Reply 21 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 17-Oct-2001

Yes, it was Sting whom I meant. However, I inserted the "r" intentionally. Long story...

Reply 22 offered by: Olivier Miakinen on 18-Oct-2001

About unpronouncable name: I remember the story of a guy who wanted to have his name on its car plate. Because it was impossible to choose the plate of one's car in his country (I believe it was in England), he decided to change his name to the actual plate's letters, maybe TXL or WFT...

Reply 23 offered by: louie on 18-Oct-2001

I heard about that one, he changed to C 539 FUG. Personalised plates were too expensive for him, but instead he paid alot less for a name change.


#2250: Writing Cresc & Dim signs (< and >)
Writing Cresc & Dim signs (< and >)

(2250)

Submitted by: Allan Albrecht on 04-Oct-2001

Pierre Schmidt submitted this user tip. I loaded the cresc.ttf into c:\windows\fonts folder and defined user1 as crescendos. Item 3 in his write-up says "Insert the text:........." Where and how? This has me stumped. I need some more info on how to do this. Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Oct-2001

Where? Wherever you want a crescendo or decrescendo hairpin. Position the insertion point where you want it, usually before a note below the staff.

How? Press "X" or 'x' to insert text. In the text dialog box:

Text Expression tab: "Display Font" - select User1. "Text Expression" - type A, B, C, etc. for various sizes of crescendo, or a, b, c, etc. for decrescendo.

Expression Placement tab: "Staff Position" - can be used to move the item vertically. "Preserve Width" - off (unchecked). "Justification" - usually "left" is most appropriate. "Alignment/Placement" - "best fit" or (my preference) "at next note/bar".
Visibility tab: leave at default.

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Allan Albrecht on 04-Oct-2001

Thanks. There was no mention in the write-up about using "X" or "x" to insert text. I'm a new user (a few weeks) and not very proficient at this yet. I just received version 1.7 in the mail and I am impressed. My brother got me hooked on Noteworthy. I've tried a few others (demos) but thusfar this has the shortest learning curve.

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 04-Oct-2001

In defense of Pierre and others who submit these tips: it's not possible for the tips to include every detail. Inserting text, for example, is a basic function of NWC and it would clutter the tips if each one had to include a set of instructions for doing it.

Remember that a lot of information can be gleaned from the Help file supplied with NWC. In the case of inserting text, though, it's even easier since there's an "Insert" pull-down menu on which one of the choices is "Text". You can learn a lot about using a product just by inspecting what's available via the pull-downs.

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 04-Oct-2001

The command reference is the best cook-book for doing in NWC. Not only basic operations but also workarounds and "hacks" are defined with the help of embedded pictures.

You can download it from the Scriptorium.

---
Decode address...

Reply 5 offered by: Allan Albrecht on 04-Oct-2001

Thanks again. I downloaded the entire book.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 05-Oct-2001

What might not be apparent is that the cresc and dim signs will not do anything to the actual playback dynamic.

You still have to put in a cresc or decresc (or dim) and a target dynamic to get any playback effect, but judicious use of the invisible attribute will hide these on the printed score.

Peter

Reply 7 offered by: David Palmquist on 12-Oct-2001

Son of a gun!!! I had no idea that putting in a target dynamic would actually cause the dim and cresc to do something to the playback. I thought they were just text symbols. I tested this feature just now and it works. This is neat - thanks for the info.


#2251: "bank" of accompaniments
"bank" of accompaniments

(2251)

Submitted by: Jinggo Atillo on 04-Oct-2001

In my Yamaha keyboard, there are preset "banks" of acompaniments, e.g., ballads, jazz, rhumba, etc. complete with percussion instruments. Is there a similar nwc. bank from where I can download the files so that I can copy and paste them to my notation?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Oct-2001

No, there isn't such a "patterns" facility built into NWC. Some people use a program called "Band In a Box" which does this, but is rather limited in other ways (i.e. notation). You can export your patterns from BIAB and import into NWC to do further work, or you can create your own patterns (especially ones that you plan on using frequently) and save them as separate files, from which you can copy / paste into your new work.

You also might be able to "record" the patterns from your Yamaha keyboard, but in my experience recording drum tracks from an external drum machine, synchronisation can be a bit challenging since NWC does not have a "synchronize to midi clock" option. That being said, it *is* possible; an example is my song Allergic to Love whose drum track was imported this way from an ancient Korg drum synth.
Fred


#2252: Poor sound quality trying to record from NWC to CD
Poor sound quality trying to record from NWC to CD

(2252)

Submitted by: Ed on 07-Oct-2001

On my Win NT W/s 4 sp 6a with SoundBlaster compatible card 1GHz CPU and 256MB RAM

I have 2 players
- NWC 1.70 web update 9
- Microsoft CD player Version 4

I have 2 recorders
- Creative Wave Studio 4.06
- Quartz Audio Master Freeware 4.6

I can record without problems using MS CD Player with either of the recorders
However, when I use NWC with either recorder I get this problem

- I start playing a song in NWC
- as I open either recorder all is still OK
- as soon as I start recording, some "pops" can be heard, sometimes sort of "in time" with the NWC song
- when I stop recording but keep either recorder open the pops continue for some time.
- as soon as I close either recorder the pops stop

I also exported both Type 0 and 1 midis and tried those Windows Media Player 6.4.07 and had the same problem.

Any ideas?

Thanks

Ed

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Oct-2001

I don't have a solution for you, but since no-one has jumped in yet I thought I'd post an answer, even if it may not solve your difficulty.

Someone recently reported the same or similar problem on the newsgroup. The fault is not with your players or recorders, rather with the sound card itself which essentially renders the midi stream into a "wave" (analog sound). You didn't specify what kind of sound card you have, but I suspect it might be a SBLive! or similar wavetable card.

There are a number of possibilities. If you don't hear the clicking when playing the file, only when recording, it could be that you're actually hearing noise from your hard drive. If the sound card is a PCI card (i.e. not part of the mainboard) you might try moving it to a different slot. Or it could be that you're getting a bit of "stuttering" caused by slow hard drive response; be sure you have Ultra DMA or ATA100 enabled (assuming that your system is capable of it). Another possibility might be to try setting up a RAM drive, and recording to it instead of directly to the hard drive.

I don't think the other person with this trouble ever solved it directly. You might check to see that you've got the most current drivers for your sound device, failing that you might consider a program such as Audio Compositor which renders the midi file "virtually" (not necessarily in real time). I'm not sure if this will run under NT, however.

Hope this gives you something to work with.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: James Williams on 15-Oct-2001

I think that the most likely answer is that the velocity of the notes is too loud, causes audiowave "peaks" where on a normal amp you get distortion, in MIDI land on computers you get popping. Essentially, the "fff" parts of a track, or the loudest or fullest in sound are likely to cause popping. You should try lowering the level of the dynamics, say from fff to ff or even to f if there are lots of staffs. This should decrease popping. This is a common problem with loud MIDI sections.

Reply 3 offered by: Ed on 16-Oct-2001

Loudest is mf. I tried all staffs (staves?) down to MIDI volume 10 (from 127) but the same thing happened.

Reply 4 offered by: Stephen Randall on 16-Oct-2001

There have been some "issues" with crackles and pops on SB PCI 128 cards. Creative got itself in a bit of a pickle with this card as there are umpteen different versions of hardware and a few less than umpteen different drivers per operating system.

Creative runs a newsgroup for users. I lurked there for a while until I was happy with my PCI 128 running under WMe. Last time I looked in about 4 months ago, it seemed that drivers were available for SOME varieties of PCI 128 for WNT and W2K that didn't pop or crackle but the problem hadn't been sorted for all hardware versions. I admit I didn't pay too much attention as it was not my OS.

Perhaps a trawl through the Creative NG might at least help to identify if others have the same problem.

Stephen


#2253: Lyrics begin part way through a song
Lyrics begin part way through a song

(2253)

Submitted by: Allan Albrecht on 07-Oct-2001

Where the lyrics are the same for all voices, I'm OK. But when the lyrics change for a couple of voices, I don't want to put in all the lyrics, just the lyrics that are different from the rest of the voices (in this case the song is set for TTBB). I've found a solution using periods for syllables and they don't show up in the printout clearly so unless you're looking for them, you might not notice them. I believe someone has mentioned underscore (_). Does that leave a blank?

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 08-Oct-2001

You can indeed use underscore characters (separated by spaces) to skip notes but you doo have to count up the affected notes. An alternative is to set the note property to 'lyric syllable never': you can select a whole section at once for this purpose.

Peter

Reply 2 offered by: Robin Withey on 08-Oct-2001

The "lyric syllable never" solution I have found much neater than putting dozens of underscores. The only thing to be aware of is that it works for ALL lyrics on that note, so if you are using several lyric lines on the same stave (which it sounds like you are doing), you will have to use the dummy lyrics approach. If, however, each part is on a different stave (even if the staves are layered), disabling the lyrics for specific notes is a better approach.

Robin

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Oct-2001

If you are already using periods, then just replace the periods with underscores and voilà.

You can also use note properties to force selected notes to be skipped when attaching lyric syllables.

Reply 4 offered by: Allan Albrecht on 08-Oct-2001

Thanks to everyone who replied to my query.

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 09-Oct-2001

Using underscores for "missing" lyrics is not hard to do, if one has the song memorized. I just sing it to myself, and tap out the underscore as I go.

Do not attempt this if you use your computer while singing in the shower, due to risk of electrocution hazard.


#2254: MIDI keyboard displaying numbers instead of notes!
MIDI keyboard displaying numbers instead of notes!

(2254)

Submitted by: Andrew Grieve on 08-Oct-2001

My keyboard has worked in the past, but after connecting it up it is not displaying the notes when I hit a key on the musical keyboard. Instead it puts a #001 as if I have pressed the first instrument on my musical keyboard.

I'm sure someone has come across this before
what is the way to fix it?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Oct-2001

This sounds like a faulty sound card MIDI interface. If you say it has worked before, then you may want to review what has changed on your computer since it last worked. An incorrect driver setup for yoru sound card MIGHT cause this, although a hardware fault is more likely.

In general, the best way to locate the source of a problem is to verify each individual part of the system until you isolate the faulty component. It helps if you have access to q working MIDI setup to do this. Once you do, you should verify the proper working of each component:

- test the cable to make sure it works
- test the MIDI keyboard to make sure it can both send and receive MIDI events properly

If both of these work, then you can focus on your sound cards and its MIDI driver as the source for the problem.


#2256: Yamaha XG1000 Patch Info for NWC  .ini file?
Yamaha XG1000 Patch Info for NWC  .ini file?

(2256)

Submitted by: Simon on 10-Oct-2001

Hi ya:

I'm looking to patch Yamaha's xg1000 instrument parameters into NWC's .ini file. Can anyone help me with this?

I really would like to be able to use all the above-and-beyond GM instruments that this software synthesizer is to supppose to offer.

Email response would be great.

Thanks for your help!

Simon

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Oct-2001

The difficulty is that the .ini file only (essentially) specifies the text to be displayed for any given instrument patch. It does *not* allow you to specify which bank a particular sound resides in.

That being said, you could write separate .ini's for each bank you intend to use, and simply arrange them in sections; e.g. [XG Bank 0] (general midi), [XG Bank 16], etc. However, you'll still have to specify the bank when you choose any sound not in bank 0.

There's a couple NWC file of the "lowest common denominator" of XG instrument and drum sounds (based on DB50XG) that should work fine on the XG1000. You can always expand it as desired for the additional capabilities of the 1000, if you do I'm sure that it will be a welcome addition to the Scriptorium.

!link(Scriptorium Helpful Files Section=http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#NWCFiles")

Cheers,
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Oct-2001

Let's try that link again:

Scriptorium Helpful Files Section


#2257: Opinions on best General MIDI Soundfont?
Opinions on best General MIDI Soundfont?

(2257)

Submitted by: M. P. on 11-Oct-2001

Hi,

I was wondering what people feel is the best General MIDI
Soundfont to download from the HammerSound Site and others.
Since the 'better' ones tend to be very large, I want to
avoid downloading all of them and trying them out for
myself. (Since I only have a dial-up connection, this would
take a very long time). The GeneralUser SF was mentioned
in this forum and I agree that it is pretty good.
But I would like something with the 'best' solo
orchestral instruments. I am using the Audio Compositor program (together with NoteWorthy Composer)
with 192 MB of RAM. Thank you for your help and
your opinions.

M.P.

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 11-Oct-2001

General User GS 1.3 by Christian Collins (about 25 MB) is the best complete set, especially for his wonderful solo strings, piano, winds and others. (There are very few patches that I think should be revisited.)

You can get it free from Christian's websit at:
http://www.sccmusic.250x.com/

In addition, I use AWE Organ and JEUX for organ sounds. (Actually I haven't used them yet but they remain loaded so that I can play the files sequenced regarding them correctly.) You can get them free from the Scriptorium helpful files section.

Hth.

---
Decode address to send mail.


#2258: NWC for Mac!
NWC for Mac!

(2258)

Submitted by: the boogieman on 12-Oct-2001

can the NWC staff please make a version for Mac?????

Nobody loves mac

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 12-Oct-2001

Yup, I'm a mac lover, too, but also, see msg #2115

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 12-Oct-2001

(I mean alas, also, sorry!)


#2259: Notation
Notation

(2259)

Submitted by: Rodney Walker on 12-Oct-2001

Is there a utility or patch that can be used to convert the notes to "Shape" notes?

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 14-Oct-2001

Search the forum archive for "shape notes". There were looong discussions.


#2260: exporting nwc files into text documents
exporting nwc files into text documents

(2260)

Submitted by: Denis Donnelly on 13-Oct-2001

I am writing a songbook. I am using NWC for the music and MSword for the text. I want to have both text and music included. Does anyone know how I can export nwc files into my word document? Is there an easy way to do this?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 13-Oct-2001

File -> Print Preview -> Copy. Select either Clipboard, then shift focus to Word (or whatever other program supporting Windows metafile images), select Edit -> Paste. Or select Placeable Metafile, save to disk, load or shift focus to Word and Insert -> Picture -> From File. Browse to where you save the .wmf file.

HTH
Fred


#2261: Variant melody/rhythm for verses
Variant melody/rhythm for verses

(2261)

Submitted by: Joe McCauley on 16-Oct-2001

In a song with multiple verses, there may be places where one of the verses uses a slight variation in rhythm (and possibly the pitch) due to an extra/missing syllable or two or a different cadence in the lyrics. In printed music I've seen this is usually represented with the primary melody shown in full size notes, and the variant rhythm/melody shown in smaller notes and rests, with the lyrics for the affected verses aligned to these notes. Is there a way to do this in NoteWorthy?

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Oct-2001

Not directly as a "predefined" function in NWC, but it is easy enough to do:

Regarding the large/small notes: Keep in mind that virtually any font (including NWCV15 itself) can be specified as a "user" font and used as text. Text can be placed virtually anywhere in relation to the staff and its notes. You can use grace note symbols as "text" for the little notes. Be aware that "text" and "lyrics" are two different things.

In the lyric editor, you would specify several lines of lyrics. Wherever a verse has a "missing" syllable, use the underscore character. This does not print on your music, but causes the lyrics to skip a note.

Keep in mind that the above strategy works fine for the printed page. But it will not cause your verses to sound different, since the text-inserted notation are not "real" notes interpeted by MIDI.

If you want to squeeze multiple words onto a single note withoutrunningthemalltogetherlikethis, you can use the infamous non-breaking space, at code .0160 on the character map, just before the inverted exclamation point. The non-breaking space looks and prints as a space, but is not interpreted as a space by the NWC lyrics editor.

Hope that helps.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Oct-2001

One more thing: You may wish to have some lyrics in a regular font, some in italics. The NWC lyrics editor allows only one font. But I pieced together two public-domain fonts, one regular and one italic, as "Generiwest." This free front is available on a link for the NWC user tips page. How it works is that regular characters are selected as usual from the keyboard, but italic characters occupy the upper codes, selectable from a character map. There is some capability to add diacritical marks, too.

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 17-Oct-2001

Yet one more thing: If the NWCV15 font, used as "text," does not have the notes you need, try using my "MusiSync" font as "text" for your grace notes. This free font is at:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/musisync.zip

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 18-Oct-2001

Robert, thanks for the replies!!

However, the correct link for your font is :
http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/fonts/musisync.zip

P.S. I LOVE your Music Fonts page !!!

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 18-Oct-2001

Thanks, Marsu! I don't know the correct URL for my own web pages!!! I'm getting old.

As of yesterday, one of my free fonts, "MusiQwik" is now on Simtel.net (Windows 95/98 collection, Desktop publishing, fonts). If you know anyone who wants to put just a few bars of simple melody in a word document, MusiQwik will do it. Then, perhaps the user will get interested in a real music publishing program such as NWC.

Incidentally, that's how I first came across NWC a few years ago -- Not knowing the technology at the time, I thought that I could accomplish my goal with a font. After fooling around with this and that, I located NWC and have loved it ever since.

Reply 6 offered by: John Ford on 19-Oct-2001

Regarding the ability to allow multiple words on one note, you can also accomplish that with the underline character. Just make sure there are no spaces used.

For example, to put the words "My Song" on a single quarter note, just type:

my_song

NWC interprets it as one word, but prints the underscore as a space. Of course, to skip a note, be sure to use spaces between your words and the underscore. For example, if you've to three notes, but only want "my song" to display on the first and third, just type:

my _ song

Thanks,

John


#2262: Web Update 9
Web Update 9

(2262)

Submitted by: Bob Williams on 16-Oct-2001

I recently upgraded to web update 9. It changed a lot of the transpose feature, which I use a lot on midi files. A file I just downloaded and converted to NCW does not transpose properly. I have followed the links and hints, and cannot get a bass clef D# to physically move to a Eb. Tuba players hate sharps! Is this a bug (feature) in the latest update? I'd try downgrading NWC to a lower level to test this out if I had the proper exe file, but its not avaliable on the web site.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Oct-2001

I don't understand what you are saying.

What key is your piece using, and what key do you want it to be in after transposition?

Reply 2 offered by: Bob Williams on 16-Oct-2001

The midi file imported without a key, but with many accidentals. I inserted a key of C. Then I used the old trick of forcing accidentals, inserting a key signature of Eb Major (three flats), then performed a transposition of zero. Previously, this would physically change the bass clef D# (as imported) to Eb (as wanted). Under the web update 9, it is not changing the 'spelling'.

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 16-Oct-2001

I recommend "Favour Flat Keys in Ambiguous Cases" doing the transposition.

Let us know if this either doesn't work. Or better, upload the problemmatic file to the Newsgroup where you would probably have more intensive assistance.

Hth

---
Decode address to email.

Reply 4 offered by: Bob Williams on 16-Oct-2001

I've tried all the settings on the Transpose dialog box, none seem to help. I'll forward a copy of the file to the Newsgroup as you suggested. Thanks.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 16-Oct-2001

You no longer use Transpose 0 to re-spell notes. You use Tools | Audit Enharmonic Spelling for this purpose.

Reply 6 offered by: Bob Williams on 16-Oct-2001

Great! Works just like I wanted it to! Thanks!

Reply 7 offered by: David Palmquist on 18-Oct-2001

Hot damn! These NWC people think of everything, don't they? I love this program!


#2263: OT: VQF.com down
OT: VQF.com down

(2263)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 16-Oct-2001

"VQF.com is now shut down. The VQF format is now out-of-date. We feel it is negligent to continue representing the format as a "cutting edge" one when it is no longer such. This site may reopen with the release of 192kbps VQF. Until that point, however, it will remain closed."

http://www.vqf.com

What do you think? Have Yamaha stopped suppoting the format, which unfortunately but aparently failed to challenge mp3?

---
Decode address to email.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 18-Oct-2001

Well, this is bad news.
For VQF (or SoundVQ) IS *much*more* better than MP3.
Really; and it's particularly audible on "plain chant" or solo voices.
I'll keep on saving my own CDs in VQF format, though (I usually put 15 to 18 CDs on one, with better quality than MP3 for a smaller bitrate.). But in any case, REAL CD quality is (yet) the best, and I listen to my VQFs only in "bad audio conditions": on my PC, and when I can, in my car or bus or subway... I hope a friend of mine will be able to "hardcode" VQF player as it was made for MP3.
However it's the best format when you want to send a piece of music to someone else, letting him/her know if the CD is worth buying.

It seems that it happened to VQF the same as V2000 (VCR format with stereo, good image even at slow motion or paused, "recto-verso" tapes) against VHS (mono, unreadable image when paused, tape with one side only but a huge library behind). Commercial reasons made it fail, though it was better technically (though you can protect against piracy much more efficiently with VQF than MP3!! )

LiquidAudio may be a reason, too. It's better than MP3, and music companies promote it... (probably because Yamaha wanted royalties on their SoundVQ format!)

MP3 is definitely bad.
If you find it good enough, then you don't need CD quality!!! and an old Adlib16 should be pleasant to your ears...

Musically yours,
Dominique VQF user.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 18-Oct-2001

oops! Forgot to mention:
http://www.yamaha-xg.com/soundvq/index.html is still open :)
as well as the "old" VQF.com page : http://www.vqf.com/software/


#2264: BSOD
BSOD

(2264)

Submitted by: Bob on 17-Oct-2001

I use NWC so much I can't remember with which update it started, but if I hit the stop button (F6) while no song is playing, it bluescreens me and noteworthy crashes. You might ask why I'd try to stop it while no song is playing - well, sometimes I hit stop just as it's reaching the end of playback. Anyone else have this problem? It seems like it would be an issue of what MIDI playback devices I have activated, but I still get the problem with only one activated, and none in use by other programs, as far as I can tell... Ideas? Suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Oct-2001

This sounds like one of two things:

1 - You have a MIDI setup/driver problem; the driver crashes under the heavy load of receiving many note off events in fast succession.

Resolution: Check your manufacturer for the latest MIDI drivers. Also, if you caused this by updating your drivers, then go back to the driver version that was working.

2 - I have also seen this when a MIDI feedback loop is created, usually when one or more external MIDI boxes (such as a MIDI keyboard) are interconnected to the computer. Sometimes, in the setup process, a MIDI feedback loop is created where MIDI events sent by the computer out get echoed on its input port. If you also have the NWC MIDI echo feature enabled, this creates a feedback loop that can be haxardous to your computer's health.

Resolution: Avoid MIDI infinite loops.

Reply 2 offered by: Mark Cloud on 17-Oct-2001

Bob,
I had a similar problem when I upgraded my motherboard and went to an AMD K6-500. In my case, Noteworthy would play
for about 1 min. and then freeze on all notes. I did absolutely nothing to change the program before or after the upgrade. The solution was to reinstall Noteworthy. It sounds to me like a corrupted file somewhere. Anyway, by reinstalling you will assure yourself that there is nothing wrong with the Noteworthy. You'll also solve your problem of not knowing which upgrade you have. :)

Mark

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Oct-2001

This probably won't cure Bob's problem, but to address one of the issues pointed out by Noteworthy Support: you can easily avoid midi infinite loops and their attendant hazard to your computer's health by using Hubi's Midi Cable to patch your devices together. In addition to making dealing with multiple devices easy as pie, it also contains a "fuse" feature which prevents such feedback loops.

One place to get it is Hitsquad

Reply 4 offered by: David Palmquist on 18-Oct-2001

When I accidentally hit F6 (stop playback) when I haven't first started a playback, I get an hourglass for about a second or two. I figure the program is just searching memory to try to find out what it's supposed to be stopping because the F6 works instantaneously if there is a playback going when you hit it. You probably have a similar problem, but are bluescreening for some reason instead of getting an hourglass.

I'm running Windows ME with a fairly large memory but a slower chip. The problem, such as it is, did not occur before I upgraded to 1.70 version 9.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 18-Oct-2001

David,
Hitting F6 when NWC is not playing performs a MIDI reset.
The hourglass displays to indicate the process is running. While this you may notice on the status bar (bottom line of NWC main window) that this action is reported : "Performing full reset on each port and channel..." :)
NWC doesn't look into its memory if it should stop something it's doing: I believe it "knows" it perfectly well because it was well enough designed, Thx to Eric.

BTW, the F6 key ("Stop command") is documented in the inline help as :
"This command is used to stop or cancel a currently playing score. It can be quickly activated from the keyboard using the F6 key.

If a score is not currently playing, all the open MIDI device ports will be reset. This is a good way to quiet or shut off stuck notes, should this ever happen."

NWCly yours,
Dominique

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Oct-2001

If you press F6 when not playing, NWC sends note off messages for every possible note on every possible MIDI channel. This can be the cause of a short delay.

If you have your port usage set to While Playing, an additional delay can occur while NWC opens the MIDI ports. The quick opening, using, and closing of the MIDI ports could also be the cause of some problems for poorly behaved MIDI drivers.


#2265: Winamp file, convert to Midi?
Winamp file, convert to Midi?

(2265)

Submitted by: Donna Stefani on 19-Oct-2001

I have to admit, when it comes to music, in other then enjoyment of listening, I'm clueless. The love of my life, however, is a musician, & I'm attempting to assist him & have downloaded the trial version to evaluate whether it will be useful to us. So, I have all of these Winamp files that aren't recognised by NoteWorthy Composer when I try to open them up in the program. Is there some way to convert them into something that is recognized by the program?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 19-Oct-2001

Unfortunately, no. It's because most Winamp files (mp3, vqf, wav, etc.) are not merely music files in the sense of midi or nwc files, but are representations of actual sound recordings. It would be rather like asking for a program that "converts" a spoken-word cassette tape into a Word document, except that the music "conversion" would be even more difficult.

There are a number of experimental programs available which can render very simple sound files into approximate midi equivalents, but none can be said to reliably "convert" music to midi.

Reply 2 offered by: Donna Stefani on 19-Oct-2001

Well, that's discouraging. So, how hard would it be to modify the program to accept those type of files? I know, I'm really asking for too much now aren't I?

Reply 3 offered by: Grant on 20-Oct-2001

Think of the files NWC understands (its own format plus MIDI) as the equivalent of musical scores, and the work NWC does as the creation and editing of such scores.

Now think of the files that Winamp understands (mp3, wav and so forth) as recordings of actual musical performances. Obviously NWC can't do its main thing with such files without converting this back to score format. It would be, as Fred aptly said, akin to asking a word processing program to edit an audio tape.

Even if there were a reliable way to convert the Winamp style of file to MIDI or native NWC (and AFAIK there's not), you'd probably never see this as a feature of NWC itself. It would make much more sense to have a separate program to do the conversion and then use NWC to edit the result.


#2266: Web Update 10
Web Update 10

(2266)

Submitted by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Oct-2001

NWC 1.70 + Web Update 10 is now available.

This update focuses on bug fixes:

-- Fix: Exception in Print or Print Preview when the bottom staff is shorter than other staves in the system

-- Fix: File open failure on MIDI files that are accessed from Explorer

-- Fix: Automatic key signatures added to systems during printing can occasionally be incorrect when key changes are performed within a repeating sequence


#2267: New to composing for male vocal groups...
New to composing for male vocal groups...

(2267)

Submitted by: Joshua Day on 19-Oct-2001

Hi, everyone!

I am new to Noteworthy Composer and to composing for male vocal groups and vocal groups in general, but I am definitley not new to the music world. I love to write and I love to perform. However, I have never written anything for TTBB before, and now I am suddenly trying to put something together for a holiday show. I'm wondering if anyone can offer any "do's and dont's" and helpful hints for arrnaging parts for male vocal? I have Noteworthy layout down pat, so I'm really just looking for a little music theory 101 here. How do the male parts overlap, when can I use dissonance without sounding like somebody popped a vocal chord, what kind of chord intervals work best for male voices, and are pleasing to the ear?...those sort of things. Also, where might I find some helpful TTBB music files to guide me? Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Oct-2001

I can't advise you on the music theory, not being a musician, but I can offer you the following observation based on experience singing in a choir:

The range from A3 to D4 (slightly more than an octave below middle C, to just above middle C) seems to be comfortably within the singing range of most adult males who can sing at all, regardless of whether an individual's nominal range is tenor or bass. For women, the same applies one octave higher. That is why most common melodies and church hymns are written in that range.

If you can keep a part in that range, you improve the chances that randomly-chosen singers will be able to perform it. If you go above or below, then you are more likely to need singers with better voice training, or who specialize in tenor or bass. (A professional singer can go both above and below that range.)


#2268: Suggestions for the next version of NWC
Suggestions for the next version of NWC

(2268)

Submitted by: Joshua Day on 19-Oct-2001

Hello again,

I just wanted to compliment the staff at Noteworthy for the design of an EXCELLENT notation program. I'm sure Finale and Sibelius do some pretty incredible things, but NWC is perfect for what I want to do, and is well within my budget.

I had a few ideas for what could make NWC an even more incredible program that would rival some of the earlier notation programs put out by Passport (now G-Vox):

1. Graphical insertion of slurs that allowed the ability to change the shape of the arc. Also, the slurs are a little too calligraphic, which is a distinguishing feature of ties.

2. The numbers in the notation font are the wrong font (see the time signature). This isn't really important, but I thought I'd mention it. See the font "Notes Normal.ttf" available somewhere on the net for the standard number font that I have seen in print. It's a bold font that's hard to describe.

3. I love the fact that NWC is so customizable because it is entirely font based! However, even though I like using the hairpin font supplied on the scriptorium, I think hairpins should be integrated into the actual NWC program.

4. Any way to make the note sound as you enter it on the staff? This would be very helpful. Of course, there is something good to be said for silence if you are composing or copying quickly, so maybe this feature could be toggled on or off with a button like the persistent note tools?

The ability to write as many doggone notes in a measure as you want without the computer beeping at you (as it did in Passport Rhapsody) is an awesome feature. It allows you to do whatever you want. If the above four items could be implemented, I would be ecstatic. This is an incredible notation program. I love using it in conjunction with Cakewalk Pro Audio 9 for the awesome audio and print experience. Thanks, guys. I look forward to more updates in the future.

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Oct-2001

My own user remarks:

(1) My understanding of the NWC program lead me to believe that graphical slur positioning would require a very major revision of the program. It would not be impossible to have a "slur" font with numerous choices that could be inserted (by the user, or by program logic) as "text." However, since the NWC editor is not WYSIWYG, there could be difficulty in aligning the slurs with the corresponding notes. Meanwhile, be aware that a placeable WMF, or in some cases a PDF printout, may be openable for graphical editing in drawing programs such as Adobe Illustrator.

(2) I believe you are correct about the font used for the time signature. NWC seems to have lifted its numerals from one of the GNU public-domain fonts. A different choice of font-face would have been more standard.

(3) I suppose it would be possible for NWC to have a hairpin font, used as "text," with program logic selecting the correct size. But see my remark about WYSIWYG.

(4) I don't know anything about sounding notes when typed, so no comment there.

Reply 2 offered by: Joshua Day on 20-Oct-2001

Hi. Thanks for your remarks. Just a thought...maybe the program's entire back-end structure would not have to be revised to incorporate better slurs? Apply the same logic to the slur that is applied to the beaming of notes. First, if I were writing the program I would make the slur "thinner" than the tie, or just a solid one or two-pixel line all together. Then I would make it so that the end points started just above the starting and ending note heads. Just like the beams ascend or descend and connect notes at the end of their stems, the slurs would arch up or down and connect notes above or below thier note heads. Slurs could also be a separate entity (with the gray diamond in front of them, like the fermata) so that they could be positioned like any other element in the program.

A couple other things I've noticed are that there are no "hold" lines (underscores) for lyrics. These lines indicate that a note should be held. Also, one thing I would like to be able to do is get the first ending mark to span over a few measures. However, as I said before, this program is very usable and excellent the way it is. One of these features I mentioned just might be $500 feature on all the other notation programs available. Why in the world are these other programs priced so high?

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Oct-2001

As an exercise, I tried manipulating NWC slurs in a drawing program. That allowed me to make any change I wanted to do, since slurs are "drawing objects" (not font objects).

The difference between NWC using its logic to tilt beams, versus slurs, is that more than just the endpoint positions would have to be altered on a slur. The curvature vectors would have to be altered -- a more difficult logic problem. Merely moving the endpoints, without adjusting the vectors, produces a very funny-looking slur.

It would indeed be nice if NWC had automatically-generated lines to show an extended lyric syllable. meanwhile, the problem can be solved by either (1) Entering underscores as "text" on the same line as the lyrics, or (2) Using N-dashes or M-dashes (see your character map) in the lyric editor.

Yes, it would be nice if NWC extended the first ending bracket over several measures. Perhaps this can be solved using the same strategy as for extended lyric lines.

As to why brand X costs so much, who knows?

[Comment to regular forum readers: I will have very reduced access to the Internet for awhile. So if I do not reply when expected, that is why.]

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 21-Oct-2001

Thanks for speaking up about the time signiture font. I have been meaning to mention that, but it was such a tiny problem, I just let it slip. As for an explanation of it, I would say an old-style font something like the handwritting in the Declaration of Independence, but with bold on. As far as the slurs go, I think that just allowing the user to control the amount of spaces above the note would be an inprovement. It could be some menu like the one for lyrics that controls how far below (or above) the staff they are placed. Certainly this would not be a major revision of the program. As for the endings, if they are going to revise them, then I would like to have the ability to close the box off at the ending measure. As for sounding notes when typed, I think that would boost the price considerably because for this program, I would be like changing Word into a program for the blind that says every letter typed.

Reply 5 offered by: Joshua Day on 22-Oct-2001

Hi again! Thank you for following this thread. I realize now that I should have posted a few of these requests in the suggestion box. I might get around to doing that someday. For now, I would like to direct you to the Noteworthy Scriptorium. I emailed a font revision to the web master and he has placed it on the site. This revision of the original NWC font replaces the time signature number font with the correct one. As far as I know, this change does not affect any other numbers in the program. I tested it before I uploaded it. The link is here:

www.vadu.com/nwc

Click on Helpful Files, and then go to Fonts. The revised font should be somwhere towards the middle. You have to hand it to Andrew for hosting that awesome web site. The thing that makes Notewrothy Composer so great is that you can make the printed sheet music as complex or as simple as you want. Complexity can be added through musical glyphs in the different fonts that people submit. The scriptorium even has a jazz replacement font so you can pretend you're writing like Miles Davis if you want! :-)

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 22-Oct-2001

Just a few remarks:

* About reply 2 ("(...)there are no "hold" lines (underscores) for lyrics") : you can use Alt 0150 (–) and Alt 0151 (—) for that purpose. Though it won't just adjust itself, it may help. Enter it as text or within lyrics.

* Robert (r.3), what are "N-dashes or M-dashes" ???

* And finally, for persons using Postscript, I developed long ago some hints+tool for hairpins : see Crescendo/Decrescendo converter for NoteWorthy Composer (for Postscript printers) for more details. For remarks, use my e-address here (marsu@musiciens.com), not the old one there.

NWCly yours,
Dominique

Reply 7 offered by: Cyril N. Alberga on 22-Oct-2001

Marsu:

The codes you listed in your first item are the N-dash and M-dash you asked about in your second. They are "dash"es whose length corresponds to the size of a lowercase "n" and "m" in the font.

Cyril

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 22-Oct-2001

As I understand it, the terms used in the printing biz are "em dash" and "en dash". I mention this only because Scrabble players in the audience might conceivably find the words "em" and "en" useful to know.

Reply 9 offered by: Joseph JAFFRES  on 09-Jan-2002

I sent many times in the suggestion list your own suggestion about :
"Any way to make the note sound as you enter it on the staff? This would be very helpful. Of course, there is something good to be said for silence if you are composing or copying quickly, so maybe this feature could be toggled on or off with a button like the persistent note tools"

I agree completely with your text.

Noteworthy is very friendly and this note sounding possibility should be very useful.

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 09-Jan-2002

well, if this feature appears some day, it HAS to be toggled on/off!
What would be cool either would be to choose the length of the note played (either a very short note, either the real length (or half)), maybe the instrument (but not the volume); and why not, the other notes that are already entered (vertical reading).
Joseph, by "suggestion list", I suppose you mean the wish list :)

BTW, there IS a way to have the sound when you enter the note: simply use the virtual piano : go and see 3rd link of msg #1054 (reply 13) (18Kb) :)


#2269: Orchestral Parts Notation
Orchestral Parts Notation

(2269)

Submitted by: John Wunderlin on 21-Oct-2001

Hello, I just spent several hours notating a horn part for a performance I have next week. I thought I'd give my feedback for this type of usage:

1) It would be nice to be able to see text that is beyond the top of the displayable area. I added some text that appeared at the top of the first page, but with a placement of '30', you have to guess where the selection box is and get lucky.

2) I would like to have the '^' type accent as a real note type, not just text. It works ok as text, but if there is an accidental, you have to mess with adding spaces to place the note correctly.

3) Cresc, Decresc symbols. I tried the font option, but it's hard to line up the placement correctly on multi-measure cresc/decresc's. I would REALLY appreciate real symbols for this!!!

4) Multi-measure rests. PLEASE ADD THIS TOO! I used text, which works, but then I can't use measure numbers.

5) Add a 'page break' feature to allow breaks to occur where I want them, not where they happen to fall.

If I had items 3 & 4, I would be a very happy camper. As it is, the program worked well, but then I had to hand-write in the cresc and measure numbers.

Transposition was almost flawless- this function saved me a lot of grief!

Keep up the good work!

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 22-Oct-2001

John,
do not forget to mention all this on the NWC Wish List :-)

Best regards,

  Marsu

Reply 2 offered by: John Wunderlin on 22-Oct-2001

Done! Thanks- I'm not very familiar with this site yet.

Reply 3 offered by: chris on 22-Oct-2001

In regards to the multi-measure rests idea...keeping the correct measure numbers when using the boxmarks multi-measure rest marking is possible. You merely need to insert those measures of rests into the score, and then use the visibility options to hide them. Insert your boxmarks multi-measure rest marking in the middle of the hidden rests, making sure to use 'center' alignment and 'preserve width'. When you print, or print preview the score, it will now have the multi-measure rest marking, but all measures will still have the correct measure numbers. Once you have more than about 16 hidden measures, however, this work-around doesn't look as good. You could always use groups of 16 measures or less if you had a very large number of consecutive rests in a certain part.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 23-Oct-2001

On a similar theme NWC always counts a barline whether you want it counted or not (except interestingly when there are no notes or rest between successive ones), so that Master Repeats and Double Bar key changes appearing legitimately in the middle of a bar are counted when they shouldn't be.

I've already 'wished' that there could be a way of excluding such bars from the count, and perhaps this could be extended so that a bar line can have a user specified barcount increment. Then one could use hidden local repeats to skip the Tacit section.

More radically, perhaps NWC can implement a multi-bar symbol such that the user need not enter anything for that number of bars. The bars would still line up on multi-stave pieces.

Naturally the stave with these skipped bars would (optionally) be suppressed as appropriate on the printed page where multiple staves are printed - thus satisfying another wish too! On single stave printout however they would be collapsed into one repeat bar.

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Randall on 23-Oct-2001

To see text that has a placement of 30 just increase the upper vertical size of the staff (from the Staff Properties dialogue) to something greater than 30.

HTH

Stephen

Reply 6 offered by: John Wunderlin on 23-Oct-2001

Thanks! That works, but then I have to set the size back to 16 for printing. This is an acceptable workaround, though.


#2270: Placement of accents
Placement of accents

(2270)

Submitted by: Cyril N. Alberga on 22-Oct-2001

While on the subject of things to add (I've already been to the wish list).

Could we have control over which end of a note (head or stem) an accent is placed? This is needed in (at least) two cases.

1) Two notes with the same pitch but differing stem directions. The accent is often lost in the clutter.

2) Two layered notes whose heads are close togeather. In this case an accent my be hidden by the head of the "other" note, or it may be impossible to tell which not the accent belongs to.

Cyril

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 22-Oct-2001

Hear, hear! I'd like to see this type of control not just for accents but also for other articulation marks (tenuto lines, staccato dots) and fermatas.

A third case where this would be useful is any chord with both up and down stems.

I added this to the wish list as soon as staff layering appeared in the product, and I'm glad to see others requesting it too.


#2271: Slurs and ties
Slurs and ties

(2271)

Submitted by: Allan Albrecht on 22-Oct-2001

Basically I'm using Noteworthy to write music for male choruses and I use the SATB sample (modified for TTBB). Is there any way to set the default direction of slurs and ties before you input the music. When unlayered, the first tenor and baritone lines are stem up, and 2nd tenor and bass are stems down. So, when I'm working on first tenor or baritone, it would be nice if all slurs and ties are upward and for the 2nd tenor and bass the slurs and ties would be downward. This makes it easy for the singers to follow. Righ now it's a pain in the neck having to change the slur and tie positions manually. I appreciate the fact that it now possible to edit slurs and ties, There was some forethought put into the programming. Would you please put this on the wishlist for us that write choral music? Thanks!

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Randall on 23-Oct-2001

Select the whole staff contents, Right Click, Properties, Notes, Slur direction - Upwards or Downwards as appropriate.

HTH

Stephen

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 23-Oct-2001

briefly:
1. add this to the wish list
2. use the macro recorder (details on the Scriptorium, section "Helpful files" to have a shortcut key for this.
For ex. you can record the following sequence :
<Shift+Right> <;> <Alt+Enter> <Alt+Home> <Alt+s> <U> <Enter> <Right>
and affect it to <Alt+;> for "Upward-Slur"-ing of the note at the right of the cursor.

HTH,
Dominique


#2272: New NGs on Digital Audio, Soundcards and Soundfont
New NGs on Digital Audio, Soundcards and Soundfont

(2272)

Submitted by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 23-Oct-2001

New groups have been established on dedicated servers:

!news://news.upmetalstudio.dhs.org/ums.digital-audio
!news://news.upmetalstudio.dhs.org/ums.soundcards
!news://news.upmetalstudio.dhs.org/ums.soundfonts

Regards.

---
Decode adress to reply

Reply 1 offered by: Artur on 23-Oct-2001

Sorry, but -even though it has not a thing to do with the matter- why do you put this "Decode adress to reply"?

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 23-Oct-2001

Do you think ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com is a valid email address without being decoded?

Actually it lies in my mail/news signature and I just copied/pasted this message from an already sent news message. A bit laziness. I should have changed it to "...to send email" maybe.

I stopped posting my email account as is because of spam.

Hth

---
Decode address to send e-mail ;)


#2273: Scriptorium (or vadu.com) down ??
Scriptorium (or vadu.com) down ??

(2273)

Submitted by: marsu on 23-Oct-2001

it is now 22:27 (GMT+1), I'm at home and can't access to the Scriptorium.
at 14h (GMT+1), I couldn't either from the office, but at that time I thought it was the proxy.

It seems not.
Does someone experiment the same troubles?
If yes, does anyone know a reason why?

NWCly yours,
Dominique
P.S. If needed I got a mirror of the FTP part (3rd of october).

Reply 1 offered by: grant on 23-Oct-2001

I experience the same problem. "URL not found" for /nwc, and "404" for an error page.

Reply 2 offered by: FranMan on 23-Oct-2001

Yah, I get the same message. It must be the server because it can't even find vadu's main page!

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Oct-2001

fyi - the http still isn't working, but if you absolutely positively need to pick up a file you can get it via ftp.

Fred

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 24-Oct-2001

It's 23h19 (GMT+1) and it's active now (It wasn't some hours ago)

Enjoy it! :)

Thanks to people of vadu.com !

Reply 5 offered by: Andrew on 25-Oct-2001

Whilst I'm the person who updates the site, I'm not the one "in charge" and have no clue as to what happened. It seems that all is well again except that the [More] link (txt2html.cgi, for you Perl lovers out there) is busted. I am seeking clarification as to the errors, but as my questions as yet remain unanswered and the answers lie half way around the world, I can - like the rest of us - but wait patiently.

A


#2275: Blues Bass
Blues Bass

(2275)

Submitted by: RJT on 23-Oct-2001

Hi folks, I am using NWC as an aid to learning bass. I am studying blues which has a shuffle feel to it. The music I have just says play blues shuffle but is written as if it is played straight. How do I tell NWC to play shuffle style? Thanx.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 24-Oct-2001

Thomas, have a look at this hint and don't hesitate to contact me for examples.

NWCly yours,
Dominique

P.S. One site that may interest you : http://members.fortunecity.com/lyricslib2/lyrics_lib/Other/blues.html

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Oct-2001

An approximation of a shuffle feel for practise purposes can be achieved by using triplets. For instance, a quarter note and an eighth note "tripletted" together gives that "dum -da dum -da" feel, though it ends up sounding considerably more square than actual jazz/swing performances. For as easy as it is, however, it might be all you need. An example is here:
Alley Cat - as in the example, you can write out your visual staff "straight" and use hidden (but sounding) staves to do the actual swing work.

Cheers,
Fred


#2276: Rossini's Petite Messe solennelle
Rossini's Petite Messe solennelle

(2276)

Submitted by: Jean Marc on 24-Oct-2001

Is Rossini's Petite Messe solennelle available anywhere in nwc or midi format ?
I could only find the Kyrie.

Thanx,
JM

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 25-Oct-2001

I found "Cum Sancto Spiritu" on http://ftp.sunet.se/cma/midi-n-s.html#ROSSINI
and surtout la page suivante :
http://www.multimania.com/choregiens/Musique.html

Funny, I fiund your Christe's transcription in http://www.channel1.com/users/gsilvis/ :)

HTH,
Dominique


#2277: string section instrument patch
string section instrument patch

(2277)

Submitted by: beefy on 24-Oct-2001

hello

does anybody know what kind of "chord" is made by the string section family of patches (slow strings, tremolo strings, etc.)? my guess is that it's just octaves and unisons, otherwise if you inserted a note, you'd get a chord of that note, and that's not what you'd want.

thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 25-Oct-2001

This is a rather big question, and one that could be done injustice with a simple answer. The simple answer being "Yes, string patches generally contain only octaves and unisons." However, in any complex sound there will be harmonics which fall on or near frequencies of other tones in the scale.

In organ patches is is very common to add fifths. There are also pad and FX patches that intentionally add fifths. But these are AFAIK the only ones in which other tones are specifically added to produce the sound.

So far the discussion has been based on relatively modern wave-table cards. The older FM synthesis cards (SB16 etc.) are a different can of worms, in that they produce all their sounds "on the fly" by adding together simple waveforms. What's under the hood in these synths as they attempt to create more complex sounds is anyone's guess.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 25-Oct-2001

I think the effect aimed at in the string ensemble patches is of a number of string instruments all playing the same pitch. Yes, as in any sound more complicated than a sine wave, there will be overtones, but it's safe to say that most listeners will interpret a note in any of these patches as representing a single pitch, not any kind of chord.

There are organ stops I can't stand because they sound to me like two instruments playing a perfect 5th apart, which is tolerable in Gregorian chant but objectionable in music with a strong harmonic component such as Bach or Franck. The fact that I have no such reaction to any of the Midi string ensemble patches (at least the ones I've heard) tells me that they don't contain any over-strong overtones.


#2278: NWC on Linux
NWC on Linux

(2278)

Submitted by: Codey Whitt on 24-Oct-2001

I was wondering, is NWC on linux a possibility cause I really love your software but even with WINE I cannot use it under linux. So I was wondering if you were going to add more OS that NWC will run on. Plus, there are very few notation programs for linux and the ones that I have found are not anywhere as good as yours. And most of them are the kind where you have to type in all of the notes into an input file and the program makes a PostScript file for you. And that isn't good for us people who like to use their keyboards to enter notes into the program and get playback. So would you please take it into consideration to make NWC for Linux also?

Codey Whitt

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 25-Oct-2001

NWC *can* run on Linux with Wine.
See the item related to it on the Scriptorium : http://www.vadu.com/nwc/helpful.html#Wine
Thanks to Matt Johnson. I first tried to use NWC with Linux Mandrake 7.0 but I had troubles with the NWCV15.ttf font; Matt's solution gives the necessary instructions on how to make it work!

HTH,
Dominique

Reply 2 offered by: marsu again on 25-Oct-2001

Just a thought : I first tried to use Wine with the KDE GUI; Matt's using Gnome. It *may* do some differences.

Anyway, Here is what Matt wrote in the .tar file (Readme file) :
---8<------8<------8<---
NWC under Wine MINI-HOWTO
Matt Johnson <matt@vadu.com>
---

Well, here's the bare bones of the instructions.

If you aren't experienced in Linux operation, this patch isn't for you.

1) Obtain the latest Wine source code. Using CVS to obtain source is generally a good idea.

2) Change directory so that you are within the root of the Wine source, i.e. you are about to run './configure'.

3) Do: patch -p0 < ../path-to-this-directory/nwcfont.patch
One file should be patched with no rejections.

4) Build Wine and install it.

5) Copy the .pcf.gz files in this directory to a place where your X font server can find it. This generally means in a directory below /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/ .
Remember to run mkfontdir in the directory after adding them in!

6) Do: xset fp rehash
This -should- tell the font server to reload fonts. However, it's not guaranteed to succeed. You may need to restart X to get the fonts to be seen.

7) The fonts have a foundry of "noteworthy".
The output of: xlsfonts | grep noteworthy
...will show if the fonts have been correctly installed.

8) Run NWC under Wine!

Have fun! If you have problems, then you can mail me at matt@vadu.com, but I make no guarantee that the above procedure will work, nor that I will help you via email. :)

DISCLAIMER: This patch is not supported either by the developers of Wine, or by NoteWorthy Software. Problems running NWC under Wine are not the responsibility of either of these parties.
---8<------8<------8<---

Reply 3 offered by: Codey on 25-Oct-2001

Thanks, I'll try that when I get home. Sorry I didn't look in the help section first.


#2279: note on - note off in real time
note on - note off in real time

(2279)

Submitted by: Victor on 28-Oct-2001

Hi ! Sir

I need a Api or dll funtion for know the note ON and note OFF in real time when the file midi play.
I need this to show in a window the note ( C, C#, B, ...) when the note is executed.

You can provide this to me ?
excuse me my english..
Best regard
Victor
ARGENTINA

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 28-Oct-2001

I use a program called "Midi Monitor" which does what you describe, including reporting other events (channel change, controllers, etc.). You can filter out any events that you're not interested in, or filter out any channels you don't care to have reported.

The program was originally packaged with early versions of Windows 3.x, the version I have is "Midi Monitor Application, V2.01, Original by Microsoft Corp. (c)1991, Enhancements by Jamie O'Connell 1993". It's commonly available on several ftp sites, and works fine under Win9x.

Just found an http site to download it from:
Programmer's Heaven
Have fun!
Fred


#2280: WinXP and NWC
WinXP and NWC

(2280)

Submitted by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 29-Oct-2001

Hi guys/gals.

Anyone tried NWC on WinXP yet? Or will the program work fine on it?

sSs

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 29-Oct-2001

Sorry, but I don't want to be an alpha-tester of microsoft product any more.
I now never use the last version of *any* µ$ product.
I prefer to wait for the correction... (such as Word 6.0c for Word6, and so on)

P.S. How many are the users of microsoft products ?
None. There is only beta-testers.

P.P.S. It seems that NWC runs fine with Mandrake 8.1 :)

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 29-Oct-2001

One point is clear that NWP Browser plug-in will NOT work on WXP/IE6.

---
Decode address to email

Reply 3 offered by: marsu again on 30-Oct-2001

but NWPlug-in WILL run fine with any netscape version >or=3 :^)

Reply 4 offered by: Ertugrul iNANC <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 30-Oct-2001

...plus Opera 3.x/4.x/5.x ;)

---
Decode...

Reply 5 offered by: Sterghios A. Moschos on 30-Oct-2001

yeah ok.... what about XP???

Noteworthy Support, a reply please?

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Oct-2001

Each of our downloads includes a list of system requirements. If NWC didn't run on Win XP, the NWC download page would say so.

We have now explicitly named Windows XP as supported, for those that want to see it in addition to the general "Windows 95 or later" statement.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Oct-2001

The newest version of the browser plug-in setup should now work with IE 6.

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 05-Nov-2001

Well done Eric! I suppose IE6 is the minimum required with XP btw ?

About XP, Sergio, have a look at http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/nwcforum/2/2054.htm#reply6 : for me this means that XP is compatible with NWC.

HTH :)

Reply 9 offered by: marçu on 05-Nov-2001

oops, sorry Sterghios, I've misspelled your name.

Reply 10 offered by: Robin Withey on 05-Nov-2001

Yes, I can confirm - NWC works with Windows XP. Several other programs I have don't, and neither does my scanner, but NWC does!

Robin

Reply 11 offered by: Steve Pearson on 07-Nov-2001

Robin, totally off topic, but . . . I think the newer versions of Windows use something other than Twain for scanning. Not sure if you can simply add the various Twain "dll's" to the operating system. The manufacturer of your scanner may also have a software update.

Reply 12 offered by: Robin Withey on 07-Nov-2001

Thanks Steve. I did check, and they did have a Windows 2000 driver, but that didn't seem to work. I might have to fiddle a bit.

Anyway, we're way off topic here, just thought I ought to reply.

Robin

Reply 13 offered by: Kent Dugan on 19-Nov-2001

You should try reinstalling your scanner. Sometimes a new OS will confuse older software.

Reply 14 offered by: Robin Withey on 20-Nov-2001

No, been there, done that. I cheated in the end, and set up the machine to dual boot with XP or 98.

Thanks for the suggestions, though, and oops, we're drifting off-topic again!

Robin

Reply 15 offered by: John on 26-Jan-2002

How did you get it to work with XP - I can only get the player plug in but not the composer to work ?
Also its a pity the composer doesn't have a predefined set of chords rather than keep constructing them.
John

Reply 16 offered by: Robin Withey on 27-Jan-2002

I just installed it, and it worked first time, no problem.
As regards inserting chords, one way you could try would be to have a "song" containing pre-prepared chords and cut and paste them as required. Not ideal, admittedly, but quicker than puting them in a note at a time, if you don't have a keyboard.

Robin


#2281: searching the online forum
searching the online forum

(2281)

Submitted by: Grant on 31-Oct-2001

Is there any way to search the online forum other than the new message submission form? If there is I can't find it.

I often want to search the forum before (or while) replying to a post, and I find that I have to navigate back to the submission form to start the search. It would be nice if there could be a forum search link at the top of each forum page, particularly when you're viewing a message thread and preparing to respond.

(The search link in the black stripe at the top of the many of the pages is a site search and doesn't seem to include the current forum contents.)

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Oct-2001

At the moment, the online forum search is only on the new message form, as you point out. We will try to improve this.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 31-Oct-2001

Thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 02-Nov-2001

A new Search Messages link is now available from within any existing thread, as well as the active and recent index pages.

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 05-Nov-2001

Very nice. Thanks again.


#2282: portamento,appogiatura
portamento,appogiatura

(2282)

Submitted by: Sanjeev Bhatt on 02-Nov-2001

Hi,
I am newbie using noteworthy composer. Can someone tell me is there a support for features like portamento,
appogiatura in NWC or NWplayer.
if yes how ?
thanx in advance
Sanjeev

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 05-Nov-2001

Welcome Sanjeev!

I'm not sure about "appogiatura", but it seems to me that "grace notes" are what you need. use the "=" key to specify when a note has to be a "grace note" (i.e. its length is taken from the following note, and printed smaller. Not /ed though)
For portamento, you can use MPCs; it's limited to 4 semitones though, but have a look at http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/nwcforum/1/1477.htm#reply1 and listen to the splendid piece (impendum) Fred has written. It shows how you can use it for portamenti beyond this limit.
(if you open the file, use File/Page Setup/Contents to click on "hidden" and see the "theremin" staves, where the MPCs are really used)

Hope this helps!


#2283: Control of Highlight
Control of Highlight

(2283)

Submitted by: PeterJ on 05-Nov-2001

Hi:

I registered several years ago, and use your program almost daily. Often I want to copy a portion of a staff that is duplicated later on the same staff. The standard procedure is to highlight the area of the staff to be copied, use control-C to copy, and use control-V to paste to the new location. However, when the part to be copied is longer than the width of the monitor's screen, it becomes difficult and frustrating to try to "hit" the right boundary of the portion to be copied "on the fly". It is usually easier to go beyond the right boundary, even to the end of the staff, and then edit and delete the additional portion after it has been copied-and-pasted in this undesirable fashion. The copy-and-paste works fine!! It just takes extra effort to edit the end points. Am I missing something? If I click on a left boundary and then drag the mouse, darkening the area to be selected, is there some way that I can control the speed at which the music scrolls when I reach the right-hand side of the screen? Maybe a control code (for measure-by-measure) or something that has passed me by? Thanks for your help.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 05-Nov-2001

I think your "problem" is that you use the mouse too much.
The "measure-by-measure" exists : it's Control+Left or Control+Right.
Use Shift to make the selection.
Example: Ctrl+G, 5, Enter, Shift+Ctrl+RightArrow(5times)
will select from the measure 5 (incl.) to measure 10 (excl), whatever the size of your screen or zoom.

A reason why I enjoy NWC so much is its easiness of use with the keyboard. I rarely use the mouse indeed!!!

Hope this helps either :)

Reply 2 offered by: marsu again on 05-Nov-2001

P.S. you're not obliged to sue Ctrl+G + number to go to the measure you want to. A simple click may be quicker :) (especially if on screen, and not on the same staff)

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Nov-2001

In summary, you can select notation in a staff by pressing and holding the Shift key while moving around. You can move to the next bar line (right or left) by holding the Ctrl key down while moving right or left with the arrow keys. You can combine both of these by pressing and holding the Shift and the Ctrl keys, and moving right or left with the arrow keys.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 05-Nov-2001

You learn something new every day! I also have been in the habit of selecting many meausres using the mouse. I should have realized that NWC would have a way of doing it from the keyboard, as described above. (No doubt, also described in the instructions, but hey...)

Reply 5 offered by: PeterJ on 06-Nov-2001

Very neat solution, indeed! Thanks for your help.


#2284: Choir Aahs
Choir Aahs

(2284)

Submitted by: PeterJ on 05-Nov-2001

Try this simple experiment. Position a single whole note anyplace on the staff, such as 2nd-line G in the treble clef. Select "trumpet" as the MIDI instrument, hit "play", and you get a single note with a duration of 4 beats. The same holds true if you select "Voice Oohs" as the instrument -- there is one long note. If, however, you select "Choir Aahs", you get 4 separate pulses instead of a single note! It is hard to tell if there is any separation between the pulses -- as I write this, I'm thinking that I could probably answer this by slowing the tempo down radically. Anyway, the pulses create the wrong musical illusion. Is this something that you are aware of? Or is it designed to operate this way for reasons that escape me? In the long scheme of things, it is a minor point, but important for vocal effects, since there are only two choices (Aahs and Oohs). Thanks for a fine program.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 05-Nov-2001

Never noticed that behaviour.

Could you please give some details on your OS version, NWC version, sound card model and driver ?

In the meanwhile, you may try with tempo twice slower and another with a tempo twice faster. Do you hear the same thing AT THE SAME PLACES? It could be the sample on your sound card, because there is no reason that NWC would act like this (the midi events are the same).

HTH!

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Nov-2001

Whatever you hear, it is a function of your sound card. The Choir Aahs sound of your sound card probably contains a modulation effect that you are interpreting as separate notes.


#2285: using a keyboard to notate?
using a keyboard to notate?

(2285)

Submitted by: dan goorevitch on 08-Nov-2001

I have a Yamaha PSR-248. I've got it plugged into the computer but... nada. I read the help file, which reads:
1. A MIDI input device must be provided: The Record tab in the Options dialog allows a MIDI input device to be established. The pertinent field is labeled as Input Device. Once a legitimate MIDI input driver is specified and accepted, NWC is able to receive MIDI input.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Nov-2001

What is your question?

When setup correctly, NWC can take input from a MIDI keyboard. The trick is to:

1 - make sure your cables are connected correctly

2 - use the correct MIDI drivers for your sound card

3 - select the correct driver from Tools | Options | Record

If you establish all of this correctly and it still does not work, then you may have faulty hardware somewhere (faulty sound card port, cable, or keyboard).


#2286: Lyric Refrain - Note Chasing
Lyric Refrain - Note Chasing

(2286)

Submitted by: Peter Edwards on 09-Nov-2001

The new user tip posted today certainly works, but there could be problems using the bottom staff if, for instance, the notes don't exist in the right places for the syllables, or perhaps if the staff size is altered.

More effective would be to duplicate the staff with the lyrics and layer it. Put the refrain lyrics on one staff with just one lyric line, and the verse lyrics on the other with as many lines as required. Mute or assign midi channels to taste.

And there is no need to count up and undescore notes without lyric syllables, just select the whole lot and mark them as 'Lyric Syllable/Never'.

HTH
Peter

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 09-Nov-2001

(just in case: the tip is at http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/usertip9.htm#refrain (named "Adding Refrain Lyrics So They Highlight During Note Chase for Every Verse")

Peter, when first reading the tip I supposed the staff had to be layered; but it is not.

Though your solution has the following inconvenient : the "Refrain" will be highlighted just one time, or I have misunderstood sthg.

btw, I suppose this tip works for single voice work, for I don't see how it can be done for SATB without piano for instance (unless using a layered staff)

HTH

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Edwards on 09-Nov-2001

If there is only one lyric line then it is always highlighted however many repeats, hence my suggestion for a 'refrain' staff. In fact if there are more repeats than lyric lines, then the last line is repeatedly highlighted as necessary.

And yes, for SATB the layered approach is the only practical way to go - unless someone knows better ;-)

Peter


#2287: words of the song
words of the song

(2287)

Submitted by: Mikamun on 09-Nov-2001

Hello, I would like to know how to insert the words of the song like in the exemple of Jingle bells.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 09-Nov-2001

You can invoke the Lyrics editor by selecting Lyrics from the Edit pulldown menu, or by using the shortcut Ctrl-L

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 09-Nov-2001

You also have to tell the lyrics editor how many verses you wish to use (this can be changed later, if you wish).

The copy (CTRL+c) and paste (CTRL+v) commands work in the lyrics editor. You can also paste text that was copied from some other program.


#2288: note chasing highlighter
note chasing highlighter

(2288)

Submitted by: shawn on 11-Nov-2001

hi, the notechaser during playback does not automatically scroll (to the right) when chasing the notes during playback of the songs that i create. But it does work when i play one of the demos that came w/ the software..
any ideas, tanx shawn

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen on 12-Nov-2001

The only time I've seen this is when playing a piece with no barlines.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 12-Nov-2001

idem for me.

In case you don't want to display bar lines, first add them (easily with menu Tools|audit Bar lines) then hide them:
select one, edit its properties (Alt+Enter, "visibility" tab, show : Never); then copy that one and replace the others with it. (quicker than selecting them one by one to hide them). on keyboard you just have to use Ctrl+Right arrow, Shift+left arrow to select the next one.

HTH :)

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 12-Nov-2001

Note chasing also *seems* not to work if you have one staff shorter than the others and if that staff is the current one (i.e. highlighted) when you start playback. NWC stops chasing when it comes to the end of the current staff - which seems quite a reasonable thing for it to do. To ensure that NWC chases to the very end, make all the staffs the same length or make the longest staff current before starting playback.

HTH


#2289: How do I hide the entire staff?
How do I hide the entire staff?

(2289)

Submitted by: Philip on 13-Nov-2001

I can hide everything in the staff, but when I try to hide the staff also the lines are still displayed (albeit with no notes, etc.) Any ideas? Did I miss something? Any help would be appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 13-Nov-2001

File, Page Setup. Then unmark the parts that are to be visible. The unmarked parts will also not print.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 14-Nov-2001

Steve, I suppose you meant "Then unmark the parts that are to be INvisible" :)

a precision too: in the File/Page Setup window, it's in the "Contents" tab.

And if you don't want to hide the staff plus its contents, for example to display notes but not the staff, then the following procedure will do the trick:
on the intended staff, select all the objects you want to keep visible. Assign them a specific color (highlight 1, 2, or 3 that you specifiy to be black). Then select nothing and press F2 (staff properties). Assign it another highlight color that you specify to be white.
That way the staff disappears, but the elements you specified remain.

Oh, and to specify which highlight color is what, go to Tools/Options/Color tab (a file must be open).

Last remark: the colors options are "general" to NWC, not to a specific file. This means that if you send your file, then another user will probably see it not as you. You need to document it in some way, such as in Information section: "highlight color 1 = black, highlight color 2 = white"

HTH!

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 14-Nov-2001

Oop. That's what I get for posting something on the "fly". You are absolutely correct. Thanks!

Reply 4 offered by: Philip on 15-Nov-2001

Thanks guys! Helped alot!


#2290: e-mail group
e-mail group

(2290)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 14-Nov-2001

I have recently joined the e-mail list on the viola web site http://www.viola.com. It has a forum on yahoo which is not as well organised as noteworthy but has a phenomenal usage. This is because you can opt to receive all new messages as e-mails so 1 you are alerted and 2 it is much easier to reply in the course of daily activity. This would be nice on noteworthy too. Does anyone agree?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Nov-2001

I've been on a few mail lists in the past, and generally found them to be a nuisance. Just my two bits' worth.

Peter, have you visited the NWC newsgroup? It might be just what you're looking for.

Cheers,
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 18-Nov-2001

I make big use of the Recent Activity page on this forum.
The newsgroup at !news://news2.ezusa.net/ntworthy.nwc is a regular newsgroup, which means you can download articles (and attaachments) and read offline if you prefer.

A


#2291: Eb Tuba in Bass Clef --> Bb Bass in Treble clef
Eb Tuba in Bass Clef --> Bb Bass in Treble clef

(2291)

Submitted by: Paul Whyte on 14-Nov-2001

Does anyone know how I can transpose music written for Eb tuba in bass clef, to, Bb Bass in the treble clef?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Nov-2001

You can change the clef either before or after the transpose, but I would transpose first using Tools | Transpose, then change clef using the Change Clef Procedure.

Reply 2 offered by: John Gillings on 15-Nov-2001

Note that tuba music in bass clef is usually CONCERT PITCH,
regardless of the key name of the instrument. The treble
clef music is typically transposed.


#2292: Character Map Pro
Character Map Pro

(2292)

Submitted by: Messer Sagredo on 15-Nov-2001

Hello everybody!
I've read some time ago about a freeware called "Character Map Pro", by Alexander Gorbatchev, useful utility for easier copy/paste of non-standard chars inside lyrics.
I've tried to search for it on the Internet, and what I could find is the following URL:
www.softpile.com/Desktop/Fonts/Review_02752_index.html
from which it's not possible to download it.
Moreover, Gorbatchev's homepage, www.alexdg.com, contains a mere "be..." and nothing more.
Anyone could help me in sending me that application (it's freeware) or telling me where it can be found?
Thanx a lot,
MS

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Nov-2001

The first hit on Google returned this:

Download CMP

Cheers,
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Messer Sagredo on 15-Nov-2001

Well... great!

I used Google too but couldn't see that URL, God knows why...

Thanks a lot, Fred!

MS

Reply 3 offered by: Andrew on 15-Nov-2001

Hey! This is pretty good.
Working at 800x640, I can't read M$'s Char Map.
This one's certainly more readable.

A

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 16-Nov-2001

Indeed, "Character Map Pro" is very good. Other good, free programs are "Typecase" and "Characteristica." They can be found at Simtel and maybe other download sites. Each of these has its benefits and quirks.


#2293: confused about concert keys
confused about concert keys

(2293)

Submitted by: Fred Crouch on 15-Nov-2001

This is really not a software question. I am an organist. A brass quintet has been hired to play at an upcoming wedding. Their arrangement of Trumpet Voluntay is in "the concert key of B flat" (per one of the trumpet players)

So, my question is - in what key should my organ music be? I apologize if I have wasted time on this board with a very dumb question - but all the brass players I usually play for play this in the Key of D (just as my organ music is written).

Reply 1 offered by: John Gillings on 15-Nov-2001

Fred,
"the concert key of B flat" means just that. You are a
concert pitch instrument, so you will play in Bb. The
quintet should provide you with the appropriate parts for
their arrangement.

Don't be too concerned with the details, that's their
problem! but in case you're interested, the Bb brass
instruments will be playing in the key of C.

Reply 2 offered by: Kaz on 16-Nov-2001

Hi everyone!
"The Bb brass instruments will be playing in the key of C" that John said sounds a little bit confusing.
I think "When a Bb brass instrument player plays the C scale (CDEFGABC) it sounds like Bb scale (BbCDEbFGABb) in concert key" is what he wanted to.
But this is not always true.
For example, Bb tuba players often play music notated in concert key. That is, when he plays C he pushes valve 1 and 3. The trombone is originally an instrument of Bb key but always played in concert key. And the Frenchhorn is much more complicated.
I may be saying too much detail. If so I am sorry.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 17-Nov-2001

Don't be sorry I STILL don't understand the concept.

With a piano, when I look at sheet music with the note for middle C, I press the key for middle C. The piano plays the tone for middle C (fundamental in the neighborhood of 256 Hz, or so).

With a Bb instrument, when I look at sheet music with the note for middle C, what key(s) do I press? Having pressed them, what tone do I get?

To Bb or not to Bb, that is the question.

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 17-Nov-2001

The trombone and tuba are both concert pitch instruments (i.e., play a C get a C). I do have a book that says the trombone is a Bb, but it looks like it a case of change in definition (flamable used to mean inflamable or something like that). The difinately-Bb-intruments, the trumpets, WILL be playing in the key of C when the piano plays in Bb, but because the trumpet's a Bb instrument, C sounds like Bb. The french horn is an F instrument, the F sounds like a C, so yes, it does get complicated, and even more so when you consider that with just the holding of a valve the trombone switches to the key of F making it sort of a french horn, but that's nothing to worry about... In general, bass clef instruments are C instruments and G clef instruments are whatever-the-origional-designer-want's instruments. And, IMHO, organ is a how-can-you-be-so-coordinated? instrument!

Reply 5 offered by: FranMan on 17-Nov-2001

P. S. I have no sympathy for trumpet players who can't play in concert key (and make the rest of us transpose because of it...)

Reply 6 offered by: David Palmquist on 19-Nov-2001

Let a clarinet player who doubles on sax confuse you a little. Instruments are said to be pitched in different keys because the musicians read from parts that have been transposed - thus "transposing instruments." Transposing the written part makes life a lot easier for the musician who plays more than one instrument.

Consider the Bb tenor sax and the somewhat smaller Eb alto sax. A certain finger position will produce one pitch on the tenor and a different pitch on the alto due to their different sizes.

If the tenor and alto were to be played in unison, the two players would have to use different fingerings to get the same pitch. If you regularly "double" between various members of the sax family, it can be difficult to remember different fingerings. If you see a D on the staff, it's best if you finger it the same way on any of your instruments. Since the instruments are a different size, thought, that fingering will produce one pitch on the first instrument and a totally different one on the other. To correct for this, you transpose the written note to where the player will natually use the right fingering to get the right pitch. This makes life a lot easier.

If you want the pitch you would hear if you play F on the piano, you would write a G for the tenor sax and a D for the alto.

Now, clarinet and sax - that's always a challenge, because they don't have the same fingerings, and often a sax player will accidentally use a clarinet fingering, with unintended results...

In the days when every household had a piano, and everyone bought Tin Pan Alley charts for vocal and piano, the C melody sax was developed so the player could play along with the family without having to sight-transpose.

Hope all this clariried things a little.
David

Reply 7 offered by: David Palmquist on 19-Nov-2001

Sorry about the typos on my preceding posting.

Reply 8 offered by: Robin Withey on 19-Nov-2001

You know, all these years, and I never knew that! I just thought wind players were awkward sods who liked to be different!

It just goes to show how educational this forum can be.

Robin

Reply 9 offered by: Fred  on 19-Nov-2001

Thanks to everyone who replied - I have Trumpet Voluntary at home in B flat so I don't have to write it out in another key to accompany the quintet and I learned much that was interesting. Now if any of you know how to get the general contractor to work harder so as to finish our parish sanctuary renovation in time for Christmas Mass (we were supposed to have the dedication yesterday but it is postponed sometime ago....) Thanks again.

Reply 10 offered by: John Gillings on 20-Nov-2001

Transposition in general....

Trombones mostly read concert pitch (bass tenor or alto
clefs), but in some cases, most often brass band music,
they read treble clef transposed into Bb and up an octave.
However, you can read this as if it were tenor clef concert
pitch with a few accidentals adjusted ;-) A useful trick
to know is that Eb transposed music in treble clef (eg:
alto or baritone sax) can be read as bass clef concert
pitch, again with accidentals adjusted.

Some instruments ignore the issue of different fingerings
for different sized instruments. For example, the recorder
family traditionally reads concert pitch no matter which
instrument. You just have to learn the different fingerings.
Live with it!

The ironic thing about transposition is that the intention
is to make things easy so that people only need learn
one set of fingerings for all instruments in a particular
family. The reality is that you actually INCREASE the
number of fingerings you need to learn. For example, there
are commonly 3 types of sax: Eb, Bb and (rare) C, so 3
different fingerings would be required if everyone just
read concert pitch. With transposition, there is in theory
just one, but the reality is you would need to be able
to read "normal" transpositon, concert pitch, plus
transpositions for each of the other instruments.

The other effect is to royally confuse all those folk who
play concert pitch instruments (as evidenced by this
thread ;-).

>In the days when every household had a piano, and everyone
> bought Tin Pan Alley charts for vocal and piano, the C
> melody sax was developed so the player could play along
> with the family without having to sight-transpose.

Technology to the rescue :-), my piano is a Clavinova
which can be transposed into any key. When my daughter
took up the clarinet, she very quickly learned to set
the piano into Bb so sounded the same notes as the clarinet.

Reply 11 offered by: Kaz on 20-Nov-2001

Jhon's comment is quite right. And I was able to understand all of it. I am a contrabass player now and used to be a trombone player and sometimes play the oboe and the recorder too.

Well, then I have an idea I have been thinking of.
The viola usually use alto clef (sometimes G clef).
But how about using G clef and regarding it as a transposed instrument in the key of F (perfect 5th low).
I think one reason why violin players can't play the viola is this alto clef.
May be there lies a lot of historical background though.
What do you guys think?

I am sorry the discussion goes further from NWC.

Reply 12 offered by: Barry Graham on 21-Nov-2001

Well - I think the Alto clef is the C clef.

Reply 13 offered by: David Palmquist on 21-Nov-2001

I know nothing about the G clef, so I can't comment on that. A couple of thoughts though, about John's posting. He mentions his daughter being able to set her clavinova to Bb to play along with Bb transposing instruments. If she were one of those individuals fortunate enough to have perfect pitch, I wonder how that would confuse her?

John also suggested "With transposition, there is in theory
just one, but the reality is you would need to be able
to read "normal" transpositon, concert pitch, plus
transpositions for each of the other instruments." I disagree. In reality, you seldom refer to the untransposed scores, unless you're discussing whether or not a written note is correct and your conductor has to check the score. Then you need to decide if you will ask him to confirm your written note or its concert pitch equivalent. Sometimes takes a minute or two to agree which you're talking about. That's always fun!

No, the reality is it is the copyist who extracts each part from a composition or arrangement written in concert pitch, and does all the transposition for you. All you've got to do is play the prescribed fingering (and lipping) for the note you see on the page.

Someone mentioned recorder - I have an alto which I seldom play but I think it had instructions that suggested playing either in concert pitch, using all sorts of new fingerings, or playing in a transposed pitch, using the fingering one would normally have been accustomed to on a soprano.

The doubling player normally works from a chart transposed for the instrument.

Think about the pit orchestra reed player, who might have to play clarinet, 2 types of sax, and flute. S/he's so busy juggling horns and tryning to play the difficult charts that s/he simply does not need the added aggravation of reading something in concert pitch, and trying to decide if it needs to be transposed a major second or a fifth. Just give him/her the part written in the appropriate key for the instruments, and life becomes a breeze.

Reply 14 offered by: David Palmquist on 21-Nov-2001

That's why NWC is so great. It does most of your extraction and transposition for you - no need for copyist to extract/transpose parts!

Reply 15 offered by: marsu on 21-Nov-2001

Well, if I've well understand what you're saying just the reply before (reply 13), yes, NWC does most of the transposition work, and no (you need to know the new clef (not key) and the number of semi-tones to transpose higher/lower).

BTW, when you want to print a conductor score, two options are available.
* Either you print it with scores written as the separate parts will be, i.e. in each instrument pitch, and the conductor has to transpose the right parts when it reads it (for example, a C major chord may be read as C, D (for Bb instruments to play a C), C# (for instruments in Eb to play a E), and so on, which can be confusing for him/her;
* Or you print it all in "concert pitch", which is much more easy for him/her to read --but s/he won't read what YOU are reading (if you're not playing a C instrument), so if there is an error in the transposition word (copyist fault), s/he would shout to you "No, F!!!" where you should read an Eb... Funny ain't it :)

In the latter case, you will need two versions of the "transposing instruments" if you want to print rapidly both conductor score and separate parts (or you want to be puzzled each time you have to print in concert pitch or transposed pitch). NWC is really great for this (you just need to duplicate the original staff and transpose it definitely.
NWC does this really easily, and even gives a way to search for enharmonic spellings :) :)

What NWC does't provide though, is the other clefs. I know 7 of them, four with Ut (C) symbol (line 1, 2, 3 (Alto clef) and 4 (Tenor clef)), two with G symbol (line 1 and line 2 (soprano clef)), and two with F symbol (line 3 and line 4 (Bass clef)).
Those clefs *can* be used not only for sight-transposition (as learn in Conservatoire), but sometimes for very high or low notes. Personally I prefer using 8va or 8vo symbols :)

Oh, and if I may dare to give an advice: when writing (composing) for "transposed instruments", start writing the conductor score in concert pitch (i.e. as if all instruments were C instruments). This is much more easy to read :)
When all the work is done, and it sounds as you want, then duplicate the staves that need to be transposed, and do it properly. Hide them (and mute them either!!!) unless you want to print them.
And if you want to print what I call "ensemble score", then you will print the transposed parts together, not the concert pitch. This is what I do when playing flute with clarinet in Bb and french horn, all of us reading the same sheet...
Never forget to mention in the score name the pitch written ("Clarinette en Ut", "Clarinette en Si b" for instance) or you'll experiment strange harmonies :)

HTH

Reply 16 offered by: Joe Music on 21-Nov-2001

OH NOOOOOOO......

After reading all of the above, I can't play piano anymore!

Reply 17 offered by: David Palmquist on 22-Nov-2001

Wanna buy a well-used clarinet?

Reply 18 offered by: marsu on 22-Nov-2001

It depends... Is it in C or Bb? ;)

Reply 19 offered by: David Palmquist on 23-Nov-2001

A

(but I really only have a Bb, and don't want to sell)

Reply 20 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Nov-2001

I've got a C, C#, Db, D, Eb, E, F, F#, Gb, G, Ab, A, Bb, B and Cb guitar. Capo included at no extra charge.

Fred

Reply 21 offered by: Joe Music on 24-Nov-2001

Capo included at no extra chrage? How about a Godfather?

Reply 22 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Nov-2001

Godfather included only if you're late in payment.

Reply 23 offered by: David Palmquist on 26-Nov-2001

Ohhh, this is getting awful. Emailed to me today:

d.c. al capone: you betta go back to the beginning, capiche?
- Richard Rosen, Silver Spring MD
dill piccolo: a wind instrument that plays only sour notes.
- Sandy Steinberg, Walkersville MD
diminuendo: the process of quieting a rumor in the orchestra pit.
- David S. Dubov, Fairfax VA
eardrum: a teeny, tiny tympani.
- Judith Clark, Washington DC
More, but I wouldn't want to get silly about it...

Reply 24 offered by: Michael Alfera on 17-Dec-2001

Hello, I have a few more comments to add to this topic.

The idea of transposing instruments originally started with the old French Horn. Back then, it was simply called the "Hand-horn". It had no valves, and it could only play the notes that were on its partials based on its tuning.

I'll explain: -- If the horn was tuned to F, you'd be able to play these notes, ascending:

F-F-C-F-A-C-Eb-F-G-A-B-C -- etc, it does continue.

If the horn was tuned to A, you'd get:
A-A-E-A-C#-E-G-A-B-C#-D#-E -- etc

Now how did they change the tuning of the instrument for different situations? They put in "crooks" -- lengths of tuibing that either shortened or lenghthened the length of the pipe, thereby changing the pitch.

Now, think for a second: You are a hand-horn player, and your instrument is tuned in C at the moment. On the page in front of you there are three notes: C-E-G (regular ol' chord). You play them. Now, the music says to switch to A crook. Then, the composer wants you to play the notes: A C# E -- basically a transposition of what you just played, C-E-G.

Here is the key: Even though you are playing DIFFERENT pitches with the A-crook, it is still the same RELATIVE feeling in your LIPS to play A-C#-E as it is to play C-E-G. So the composer WRITES C-E-G. This may clarify:

IF THE COMPOSER WRITES C-E-G:
this crook: Makes this sound:
B B-D#-F#
A A-C#-E
F F-A-C

And this all applies, even if the composer writes JUST C-E-G.

Well, this little old idea caught on. It really helped the instrumentalists, and who cared about that poor old guy up there at the podium that has to read a zillion different transpositions?

And that's how it all started.

Also, to help with transpositions:

C played by a Bb instrument (ex. clarinet, trumpet) is really a Bb.
C played by an Eb instrument (ex Alto Sax) is really an Eb.
C played by a French Horn (an F instrument) is really an F.

Got it? :-)

Reply 25 offered by: Joe Music on 18-Dec-2001

Got it! The keyboard analogy would be my first toy piano. its notes were Red, orange, yellow,...etc. Major chord would be red-yellow-blue.

Reply 26 offered by: Francis Beaumier (FranMan) on 19-Dec-2001

Trumpets used to do this to way back, I think. That's why the trombone was prefered (and, from what's been said, why it stayed in C...)

Reply 27 offered by: Kaz on 20-Dec-2001

Got it!
But why is this transposed sheet music for horns(relatively classical) used still now?
Modern horn players don't have extra crooks.
Almost all instruments are in key F or Bb.
When they play the music notated in D for instance, they have to read it with minor 3rd down transposition, or use a special fingering for D. And these should be done in real time.
Why do horn players have to be suffered from these difficulties?

Reply 28 offered by: Joe Music on 21-Dec-2001

Why do keyboard players have to suffer from white and black keys? What is convenient in the key of C is inonvenient in any other key. Why to Tenors have to suffer from Sopranos, and vice-versa? It is a cruel world. Who says that there are no longer any crooks in music?

Reply 29 offered by: Francis Beaumier on 21-Dec-2001

One word about transposition, it's TRADITION! I think thats basically it. As for pianos, I'm so used to the black keys now that I would not have it any other way....

Reply 30 offered by: Artur on 22-Dec-2001

As I recall from studing Beethoven´s horn´s parts in orchestral pieces, the hand-horn coul play

if slowly:
(not transposed yet) C-C-E(flat with some help of the hand)-G-C-D(idem)-E(idem)-F-G

if somewhat faster:
C-C-E(idem)-G-A-Bb-B-C-crhomatic afterwards till G

Reply 31 offered by: Artur on 22-Dec-2001

Horn players still suffer from this in late scores because the scores are ment to be played in period instruments, not modern ones, so, this is like playing a harpischord part in piano, two different instruments.


#2294: MIDI / MP3
MIDI / MP3

(2294)

Submitted by: John Hall on 16-Nov-2001

Is it possible to change midi files into mp3 files, and if so , how?
If a programme is required, what is it called and where can I get it?
I require this information so thatI can import my midi (or nw) files into the programme ULTIMATE DANCE.

Reply 1 offered by: Nels on 16-Nov-2001

I just converted a midi to an mp3.
The method I used was a two-step step process.

First off, I recorded the midi to a .wav file. To do this you need something like Cakewalk or Sonar (definitely not Windows' Sound Recorder). I'm sure you can find one on a search engine if you search for wav recorder if you don't already have one.

Then, I encoded the resulting .wav to mp3. Audiograbber or Xing work well. Here again, use a search engine to find these.

I don't know of any one-step programs that will do this, and the quality of output might be suspect.

Nels
http://i.am/nels

Reply 2 offered by: D on 16-Nov-2001

John,
I'm not sure why Nels is so much against the Windows sound recorder, but it may have to do with the apparant 60 second limit on recordings. To get around it, launch the sound recorder, record 60 seconds of silence (just press the record button with no sound being played on your computer). When it's done, go to Edit/Copy then Edit/Paste Insert. The length on the right hand side of the sound recorder should now read 120 sec. You can then Edit/Paste Insert as many multiples of 60 seconds as you require. Don't worry about being exact, you can trim it later. Be sure to go to File/Properties and convert the file to 44,100 stereo PCM. Now save the file. I use the name Blank.WAV When you're ready to record, launch sound recorder, then load blank.WAV. Record your music, stop the recording when the music is over, then go to Edit/Delete after current position too trim off any excess silence. Add any effects in the Effects menu, then use File/Save As to save your music under a new name (leaving blank.wav unchanged).
At this point you can burn the file onto a CD. To convert it to an MP3 file I use a program called Wav2MP3 (sorry, I don't recall the url). It's fast, easy and the files sound great. Good Luck!

Reply 3 offered by: Steve Pearson on 17-Nov-2001

There are numerous forum discussions that might be helpful in this area.

My personal favorite: musicmatch. It is free and will directly record a midi into an mp3 format without the intervening need for a wave file. The files are clean and have no need for editing or cleanup of hiss or other problems.

I think Fred (Nachbauer) is CoolEdit fan. I have not tried it, but if Fred likes it, it must be good.

Reply 4 offered by: Barry Graham on 17-Nov-2001

Steve,
Since your original tip on Musicmatch I've been using the software to create mp3 from midi.
But more often I need to enhance the output - so I record as a wav in Musicmatch and use Cool Edit to improve the quality before converting the wav to mp3 back in Musicmatch.
(Thanks for the tip)!

Reply 5 offered by: Sam on 17-Nov-2001

Are there any programs that do that with Yamaha XG yet? I know theres a way using virtual cables, but i have an OLD computer and sometimes the notes wont play because the computer cant handle it. And it has to go straight to mp3 because its prog rock, and you cant fit 30 minute songs in wav when theres only 200mb of hard drive space. :(

I do know there has been problems with changing XG to wav for a while, but surely there must be a workaround now.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Nov-2001

> Are there any programs that do that with Yamaha XG yet?

Presuming that you mean XG of the softsynth variety (SYG-20, 50, etc.) I'm sorry to say there is no easy answer. Your computer has to be capable of simultaneously playing and recording, and on some systems the "virtual cable" seems to be the only way of accomplishing this. Even with this functionality, however, if your computer has trouble keeping up with SYG playback in real-time, it certainly won't keep up with the added system resource demands imposed by the recording process.

Probably the only recourses are: 1) get a faster computer with a larger hard-drive, or 2) get a program such as Audio Compositor and spend a lot of time trying to find soundfonts that even remotely resemble the XG sounds. My vote would be for 1), even if you have to pinch pennies for awhile to finance it. I'd further suggest keeping your present computer around, for those times when your "main" machine is chugging away at mp3 conversions, downloading large files, and stuff like that.

Fred

Reply 7 removed by: SYSOP

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 30-Jan-2002

go and see msg #1236 (reply 22) , it may help.
otherwise midi => wav => mp3 should be the right path.

HTH


#2295: New to Noteworthy-Sop., Alto line Writing
New to Noteworthy-Sop., Alto line Writing

(2295)

Submitted by: Dana Holt on 17-Nov-2001

I'm trying to write accompaniment to a song, but I can't figure out how to use Noteworthy to write two differing parts on the treble clef (okay, can anyone guess that I'm new to this?) I've tried putting one line with stems up to designate one line and stems down to designate another part, to be played at the same time, but Noteworthy doesn't want to do it that way. It wants to give full value to each note one right after the other, and it's making the measures play too long. Does that make any sense? And can someone help me figure this out? Thanks

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 17-Nov-2001

Hi Dana.

Set stem up, enter the sop note. Set stem down, enter the alto note by pressing CNTL at the same time as ENTER.

This works great for many situations, especially when the time values are the same. As you get more experienced you'll one day discover the wonderful world of staff layering, which allows you to do multiple voicings with (almost) arbitrary time durations on a single staff.

Welcome, and enjoy NWC!

Fred
(not affiliated with NW Software, but a major NWC fan)

Reply 2 offered by: Dana Holt on 17-Nov-2001

I've done that. :-) But it's when I have the sop. line holding out a half note and at the same time I have the alto with two quarter notes. Noteworthy won't let me do it that way.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Nov-2001

Although you cannot always maintain sop and alto lines without using layering, you certainly can do a half note on one voice and two quarter notes in the other if you follow Fred's directions. To repeat them (customized for your given example):

- Set sop stem direction (it should be up)
- Set half note duration
- Enter the sop note
- Set alto stem direction (it should be down)
- Set quarter duration
- Add first also note using Ctrl+Enter (or Insert | Chord Member)
- Lastly, add the second alto note

Done.

FYI: For advanced arrangements, you can quickly start using layering by creating a new file (File | New) and selecting the SATB template.

Reply 4 offered by: Joe Music on 18-Nov-2001

Perhpas Dana (and other new users) would like to know what "layering" is!

Layering allows two staff lines to be merged together (superimposed). That way, the lines of music can be entered independently (e.g. one for Soprano, one for Alto) then layered for printing, so that Soprano and Alto appear on one staff line, as desired. Since the notation entry is independent, you can do whatever kind of stem direction and timing you like (more or less).

Reply 5 offered by: Blair Dowden on 19-Nov-2001

Staff layering not only makes it easier to enter the notes, you can get other benefits. For playback, you can assign different instruments to each voice, or mute one. You can hide one of the layers. You can even make the notes on a layer a different colour.


#2296: midi
midi

(2296)

Submitted by: Ewan on 18-Nov-2001

I've recently bought a Roland Midi Keyboard controller and have connected it via a breakout cable to the joystick port. I can't seem to get the computer to recognise its presence (all the sequencing software I have been using says that there is "No Midi IN available). I have tried "enabling the joystick port" but no success. Is there any simple way of getting the computer to recognise the keyboard?.
Ewan

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 18-Nov-2001

Have you tried reversing the midi IN and OUT cables? Usually, the cable marked midi IN has to go to your keyboard's midi OUT, and vice versa. But not always...

You can't hurt anything by hooking them up wrong, so it's worth a try.

The other thing is to be sure that your midi-in device is selected. In NoteWorthy Composer, this is in Tools -> Options -> Record. There's a pulldown box for Input Device, clicking it should show as one of the options (or perhaps the only one) something like "Brand X MPU Midi In" or "External Midi In".

HTH
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Robin Withey on 19-Nov-2001

You say you've tried enabling the joystick port. How about enabling the MIDI port? I had an old, non-plug'n'play sound card that had jumpers for the joystick and the MPU-401 (i.e. MIDI) port, and by default, the MIDI port was disabled, 'cos the manufacturer assumed that most people would only want the joystick (probably correctly, but why disable it when you can have both at once?) The point is, although they use the same physical port, they use different internal configurations.

BTW, I never got that card to work for MIDI input - only output. I recommend buying a new (or newish) card, if you have a really old one (and if you had to enable the joystick, it sounds like it is). Also, make sure you've got all the software drivers installed - I never got a sound card's MIDI port to work out of the box (and I've had a few) with the standard Windows drivers.

Robin

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Nov-2001

You need to install the External MIDI driver for your sound card's joystick port. If you are unable to do this, then perhaps your joystick port does not support MIDI functions.


#2297: Two-line author information
Two-line author information

(2297)

Submitted by: Dan De Hainaut on 18-Nov-2001

Is there a way to enter multiple lines in the File Information--Author field? Example: a composer and a lyricist each with his/her own line flush left above the first system.

I can manage this by entering two separate text inserts in the score, but getting them to align properly is cumbersome. Moreover, if I make any other edits or adjustments that change the horizontal size of the staff, the text messages follow the staff and end up on the wrong part of the page. Ugh.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 19-Nov-2001

Dan,

except using third-party software, I don't know other mean.

The only thing I know is that adding this (or taking care of this) at the latest possible moment is a good thing; moreover, specifying the text items as "Page text" as Display font, and "Right" Justification (in Expression Placement tab) helps a lot.
When it's correct, and if you need to edit separate scores as well (i.e. not the whole stuff), you may want to copy the text items on each staff, but prior to this specify them to be "printed only when on top staff": in Visibility tab, _S_how on printed page: "On Top Staff".

Hope this helps!

Reply 2 offered by: Dan De Hainaut on 19-Nov-2001

Thanks, Marsu.

The Page Text--Right Justified trick should make the workaround that I've been resisting a lot more effective.

A multiple-line author field is still on my wish list, though.

Dan

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 20-Nov-2001

My preference (although there's no reason why we can't ask for both) is to have fields for the lyricist on the left and the composer on the right.


#2298: Noteworthy Composers Webring
Noteworthy Composers Webring

(2298)

Submitted by: NWCRing Ringmaster on 19-Nov-2001

NOTICE:

The Noteworthy Composers Webring is under new management.

Adam Bodkin has passed the baton to me, I now hold the RingMaster position for the (formerly Yahoo) Webring for Noteworthy Composers.

Thank you Adam for all your hard work and diligence over the years. It has been and will always be appreciated!

For those of you with outstanding requests for membership in the NWCRing, you should now have an e-mail from the new system, approving or denying your membership application. Look for this e-mail at the addy you submitted with your ring application.

If you have not yet created a webpage or have not joined the Noteworthy Composers Webring, why don't you do so today? :>

A couple of great free hosting sites are

http://www.geocities.com and
http://www.tripod.com

It is very easy to build a webpage using the online site builders available at each of these hosts.

If you have your webpage, and wish to make mention of your use of Noteworthy Composer software, please apply to join the webring! Go here:

http://dir.webring.com

This is the home of the new Webring (formerly Yahoo webring). You'll need to create a Webring ID (that's your userid) and apply to the NWCRing from the ring's hub page:

http://q.webring.com/hub?ring=nwcring

Click the button "join this ring".

If you were already a member of the Yahoo Webring version, you have received (several, sorry) e-mails from the new system, that you need to migrate your ring. Please do so at your earliest convenience, thank you.

Thanks everyone for your participation. There are currently 31 sites in the ring and I'm sure we could have a whole lot more! :>

Regards to all,

Sue Morton
NWCRing RingMaster


#2299: No visible note appearing on NWC in Windows 2000
No visible note appearing on NWC in Windows 2000

(2299)

Submitted by: Michel on 21-Nov-2001

Hello,

I have downloaded the trial version "NoteWorthy 1.70 - 32 bit.exe" for Windows 2000 and installed it properly. But unfortunately while wanting play a sample (ie MOZART) : I can listen to the music but I can't see any note. This makes the use of NWC impossible for me.

What can I do ? I have the same trouble with "setup_nwc170_10.exe" version.

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 21-Nov-2001

Michel, you don't say whether you've rebooted your PC after installing NWC. Twice, immediately after installing a new version, I have seen the same symptom you are describimg, but each time the problem went away after I rebooted my computer.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 21-Nov-2001

This should not happen. However, if it does, you should reboot your computer (not simply logout, but actually cycle the power).

You could also visit Tools | Options and check your color settings.

Reply 3 offered by: Michel on 22-Nov-2001

Many Thanks to Grant for his help : that solves my trouble.

I was driving mad not being able to try this software.

To NWC-Online, if this can be solved on a next version it would be great.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 22-Nov-2001

[Who was driving me??]

Michel, address your request to Bill G. instead !
If it could be resolved once for all in next version of their so-called "Operating System", what a relief!!!

Bonne fin de journée,

MAD (Marsu A.K.A. Dominique)

Reply 5 offered by: Robin Withey on 22-Nov-2001

Yes, I've had problems with other programs having invisible bits because of colour settings, including the help in one Microsoft product (BizTalk - and that can't be fixed by rebooting - I have to select the text in the help to be able to read it), so I'm afraid the blame for that one must be laid at the feet of Mr. W. Gates.

Robin

Reply 6 offered by: David Carson on 27-Nov-2001

I'm not sure if I am experiencing the same problem, or a different one. I have been using NWC for a long time now, but only recently put Win2000 on my computer at home.

Here's my situation: I'm using 1.70, latest update, with Windows 2000, service pack 2. When I start NWC, no files open yet, everything looks fine. When I open _certain_ music files, the icons that I expect to "come to life" remain grayed out. Moreover, when I move the mouse cursor outside the music area, it disappears. If I move this "invisible" cursor over the icons, they change slightly, but still do not get painted correctly. Once I have opened one of these files, icons on other applications are affected as well.

This does not happen with all files, only a few I've found so far. I would include an example .nwc file here, but I don't know if I can attach it here. Shall I send it somewhere else?

Note that I never experienced this problem until I moved to Win2000.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Nov-2001

I would be very surprised if this behavior varied from file to file. The situation that you describe sounds very much like a display driver problem (there may be other things going on as well, but the icon painting problem sounds very much like display problems). Since you recently upgraded to Windows 2000, this seems even more probable. You should probably:

1 - Check to make sure that your graphics card is compatible with Win 2000

2 - Check with the manufacturer for the latest Win 2000 drivers for the graphics card

Reply 8 offered by: David Carson on 29-Nov-2001

I suspected the video driver too, of course, but I was using the latest driver from Leadtek.com for my card (a GeForce 256 DDR). This is a driver for Win2000.

Well, I decided to go ahead and try a reference driver from nVidia instead. This is basically the same driver, but Leadtek has added some of their own stuff to the one that was giving me grief. NWC works like a charm now -- no mouse weirdness anymore.

Oh, by the way, the behavior definitely WAS on a file-by-file basis. Perhaps there is something common to those files that exercises the driver in a way that the others do not. At any rate, all my music files seem to work now.

Thanks,
David


#2300: recording autorhthm
recording autorhthm

(2300)

Submitted by: levinT on 21-Nov-2001

I can record all keyboard press tones of my keyboard but I cant record any inbuilt rhythm features. Any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: levinT on 21-Nov-2001

I didnt make my question clear. I am recording with a cakewalk software and I cant record any rhythm feature of my keyboard. This is for clarification

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 21-Nov-2001

If I understand your question: You are using a keyboard that can play a background rhythm (samba, western swing, polka) while you play the keyboard. But when you try to output the keyboard to your computer via MIDI, you do not get the background.

This is normal. Unless you have a special keyboard that internally creates MIDI to correspond to its own rhythm (do any exist?), the rhythm is a synthesized sound file that is not in MIDI format. Before you ask: The sound file cannot be converted to MIDI by a software or hardware product.

As an alternative, you can try the following: Many music software products, including Noteworthy Composer, have a variety of background rhythms composed in the program's native format, that can also be converted to MIDI. Instead of using your keyboard's sythesized rhythm, try playing along to one of the program rhythms from your computer. Then, you can add your keyboard track to the pre-existing rhythm track(s) on your computer.

Reply 3 offered by: Robin Withey on 22-Nov-2001

Well, FWIW my ancient Yamaha PSS-780 outputs its rhythms to the MIDI port.

Robin

Reply 4 offered by: LevinT on 22-Nov-2001

Joe & Robin,
THanks.

Robin,
Did you assign or import any instrument definition in cakewalk software to record your rhythm part ? Please let me know if you did any process for it. I can record keypress notes with the source as MIDI. I tried to set the channel to 10 to record the rhythm from my keyboard but it doesn't work. I would appreciate any suggestions.

Reply 5 offered by: Robin Withey on 23-Nov-2001

I hope I answered this one in my e-mail direct to you, but for the benefit of anyone else who might be interested, I'm afraid I couldn't be of much help. I don't use Cakewalk (this is a Noteworthy forum, after all!), and I've never made any serious effort to record the keyboard rhythms in any other package - I just know they work from a bit of fiddling, and from my keyboard manual. Actually - it might be fun to have a go with this at the weekend. I'll let you know how I get on.

One slight hiccup is that the Yamaha PSS-780 predates General Midi, so the percussion is on channel 16, not 10, although the instrument to note mappings are the same. Another is that the rhythms come across as multiple channels, and I haven't looked at whether you can filter incoming MIDI events by channel on NWC (I know - RYFM!) In fact, I've never done real-time recording on NWC. Being such a bad pianist, I do it all in step time.

So, not much help, really, but I might have some ideas over the weekend.

Robin

Reply 6 offered by: Robin Withey on 26-Nov-2001

Well, I tried it, and it worked, sort of, but it's not very easy, mainly because of the limitations of my keyboard, rather than NWC (perish the thought!), so I won't bore you with the details.

The main difficulty is in synchronising staves. You have to have a stave long enough to hold the music you are recording (or to play along with it - please correct me if I'm wrong - this is the first time I've used real time record in NWC). I find it virtually impossible to press the start button on my keyboard at the right time, and if you subsequently remove leading rests, your notes look a mess (due to bar lines in the wrong place).

Which leads me to a new wish - how about an "audit note lengths" option, that tidies up the stave, removing unnecessary tied notes etc, at the same time as, or just after, auditing bar lines? I've encountered this problem with importing MIDI files as well, when the file has some awkward time signature changes that NWC doesn't pick up, so the bar lines are out of sync. You have to wade through the score, correcting all the tied notes manually.

Robin

Reply 7 offered by: LevinT on 26-Nov-2001

Hi Robin,
Thanks for your efforts. I will give it a shot with Noteworthy composer too (I personally feel the whole thing sounds much less complex with Cakewalk though). I am glad to see the kind of assistance one can expect in this forum. Thanks once again.


#2301: Preventing download of audio file?
Preventing download of audio file?

(2301)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 26-Nov-2001

Offhand, do any of you know how I could put a sound file (MP3 or other audio format) on my web page, so that users can play the sound, but NOT download and save the sound file? That is, I want to prevent unauthorized re-distribution.

I am looking for something simple that can be encoded in the HTML, maybe with Javascript, but not a fancy Java or CGI solution. I am not worried about stopping determined hackers, merely preventing the casual user from using no-brainer methods of saving a file.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Nov-2001

I believe the <EMBED> tag might offer some protection against direct downloading.

That being said, it doesn't take much chutzpah to open your wav recorder while playing the streaming file. (I've done that myself, I'm almost ashamed to admit. However, it was in the interest of "research.") ;-)

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 26-Nov-2001

I'll give it a try. I'm not worried about an informed user making use of auxiliary software or devices, just mom-and-pop. Here's why: I was thinking of recording a song with obvious political content, then posting it on my web site. It may or may not be "fair use" if not for profit, but I may try to secure the necessary permissions. In any case, the lyrics alone seem to fit under the "fair use" doctrine.

Here are the lyrics. Caution: Not for everybody. They can be sung to the tune of "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" if you remember that one:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/satire/mwsobl-entrance.htm

This is "The Man Who Shot Osama bin Laden" and it's quite funny, if I do say so myself.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 26-Nov-2001

Yes, it is very funny.

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 26-Nov-2001

I don't think that tag offers much protection. The user could easily view the source and plug in the path to the song. IMHO a casual user could do that.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 27-Nov-2001

Well, I'd like to have to original version of the lyrics either, btw. Do you know where one can find them ? Idem for "Hurricane" song of Bob Dylan?

Otherwise, I wonder which nation you're talking about ("From out of the west, a nation came, the future in its sight"), unless you're talking about a *certain* vision of the future. It reminds me of the 'AEIOU' motto of old Austria (but there "Austria" should be replaced with a part of America).

IMHO, the worst thing that could arrive to O. BL would be to be judged in the La Haye international trial.

Finally, to protect your sound file, you could try to open the embedding HTML file in a new window (target="_blank, you know) with options that removes the icons and menus (so one can't click on "view source"; and adding a javascript that react on each "righ-click" event (to prevent pop-up menu). I'm sorry I don't have in mind the exact scripts; but you can easily find this in a javascript reference, for both.

HTH!

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 27-Nov-2001

just wanted to add that one mustn't see any relation or resemblance between "Hurricane" and O.BL!!!

And if you wanna make fun of such situations, I prefer that kind of humour ...

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 27-Nov-2001

Tried to remind of JavaScript. If I remind well, here is how to make the window alone:
<A HREF="javascript:void(0)" onClick="ProtectedWindow = window.open('theguywho.html','song','width=325,height=330, status=yes, directories=no, toolbar=no, location=no, menubar=no,scrollbars=no, resizable=no');" >Your window without scrollbars nor menu</A>

You may omit parameters, but only starting by the last ones (default values are "NO").

For right-click, the following source should help (look at it here :
---8<----
<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>no right click</TITLE>
<SCRIPT LANGUAGE="JavaScript1.3">
function yaunclick() {
alert('Sorry, you do not need this :)');
}
function noclick(scx) {
if (("Netscape" == navigator.appName) && (3 == scx.which)) {
yaunclick(); return false;
}
if (( -1 != navigator.appVersion.indexOf("MSIE")) && (2 == event.button)) {
yaunclick(); return false;
}
}
document.onmousedown = noclick
</SCRIPT>
</HEAD><BODY><PRE><B>
Essayez de cliquez droit !
<HR width="75%">
Try to do a right click!
</B></PRE></BODY></HTML>
---8<----

HTH either!

Reply 8 offered by: Artur on 27-Nov-2001

Recently prs.net has done something similar to its entire site, you could ask to the webadmin to help you.

Reply 9 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 27-Nov-2001

Thanks, I'll look into those possibilities. Again, I do not need high security. But many items on my web site are completely free and redistributable. Since my "song" is a derivative of someone else's work, I want to make it clear that this one is NOT redistributable (or commercially playable) by erecting some sort of barrier. Users who surmount the barrier would do so in full knowledge that they are cheating.

It's always possible to play audio, then record it from the speakers using an ordinary analog tape recorder.

Marsu: I liked the fake movie posters, especially "Turbinator." The lyrics (not sheet music) to the original "Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" are posted on the Internet and can be found using Yahoo. I don't recall the URL but it is not hard to find. Other than the title, keywords might be "Gene Pitney" (who recorded it). Keep in mind that the original is from an American cowboy movie. It would lose its impact if I made the revised lyrics too multi-national. To put that another way, there's no "Jean Wayne." But I may change the lyrics from "American troops," only because it doesn't sound harmonious. "George Dubya Bush" sounds better, but I probably won't use it.

Reply 10 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 27-Nov-2001

Fred wrote in msg #2301 (reply 1):
> That being said, it doesn't take much chutzpah to open your wav recorder while playing the streaming file

That's my weekly work. Mappings, BBC 3, Naxos... I record in 48 KHz. 16 bit stereo, 188 KB/sec. and encode using lame/variable bitrate - high quality, with the min. of 256 bitrate, 48 KHz. Stereo.

I'm sure that maintainers of those online music services know this way, too.

Reply 11 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 27-Nov-2001

Marsu wrote in msg #2301 (reply 7):
> For right-click, the following source should help (look at it here :

Marsu,

Left click, holding the button down; then right click, release the left button. You are hacked :)

Reply 12 offered by: marsu on 28-Nov-2001

No need to release the left button indeed.
One could do this instead :
---8<---
<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>no right click</TITLE>
<SCRIPT LANGUAGE="JavaScript1.3">
function yaunclick(action) {
alert('Sorry, you do not need this ('+action+') :^)');
}
function noclick(scx) {
if (("Netscape" == navigator.appName) && (3 == scx.which)) {
yaunclick(scx.which); return false;
}
if (( -1 != navigator.appVersion.indexOf("MSIE")) && ((1 == event.button)||(2 == event.button)||(3 == event.button))) {
yaunclick(event.button); return false;
}
}
document.onmousedown = noclick;
</SCRIPT>
</HEAD><BODY><PRE><B>
Essayez de cliquez droit !
<HR width="75%">
Try to do a right click !
</B></PRE></BODY></HTML>
---8<---
but there still are ways to hack this:
either with left+right mouse down (closing the alert window with SPACE or ENTER, NOT with the mouse) and then releasing the right button; or, even simpler for those who have a "Win95 compatible keyboard", using the right-click key (on the left of right Control key) ... :)
'Tis Windows which is hacked!

Oh, a much simpler way to write the script over here:
---8<---
<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>no right click</TITLE>
<SCRIPT LANGUAGE="JavaScript1.3">
function noclick() {
alert('Sorry, you do not need this :^P');
}
document.onmousedown = noclick;
</SCRIPT>
</HEAD><BODY><PRE><B>
Essayez de cliquez droit !
<HR width="75%">
Try to do a right click !
</B></PRE></BODY></HTML>
---8<---

And, finally, there is a way to get the source file in *any* case if your browser is well configured: go and get the file in the cache directory :)
That's the way I sometimes get midi or NWC files :)

a Programmer's Proverb: what someone has done, someone else can undo it...
absolutely no protection is definitely sure. It's just a matter of time or worth the benefits vs efforts!

Reply 13 offered by: FranMan on 28-Nov-2001

Sure you can hack those ways, but what about the obvious: turn javascript off.

Reply 14 offered by: marsu on 29-Nov-2001

well, if you turn JavaScript off, there is a large amount of web sites you won't be able to see properly.

For safety (and processor perf.) reason, I usually disable Java. Which restricts my web visibility (for ex., http://sodaplay.com (Fred & Andrew, you'll like it!) is not usable without Java.

Disabling JS make a lot of sites unusable.

As disabling auto-loading of images (I used to do it prior than using cable connection) makes your surf go 100 times faster, but nowadays everyone (but NWC, thx to them!) uses "graphics" menu, often omitting the ALT= tag which would make it usable without the pictures...

The same applies for new applications (NWC is an exception here too) : I saw a basic tetris using more than 1 Mb in disk space , whereas I know another one that uses 4 Kb (4096 bytes)... (handy.com is its name)

HTH!


#2302: Looking for NWC player for MAC
Looking for NWC player for MAC

(2302)

Submitted by: Michel on 28-Nov-2001

Hello,

A friend of mine is only having a MAC. She would like to listen to NWC files. How is this possible ?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 28-Nov-2001

"only" having! She got the best computer in the world (si c'est un G4)...

Well, the only way I see is to install a "virtual pc" in it; use Blue Label (the lightest but efficient and cheap), or SoftWindows (which does not emulate MS-DOS), or "VirtualPC".
The 2 latter are expensive (SoftWindows includes Windows' licence)
In any case you should buy a windows licence (Win3.x is enough!!! Since you can't buy it any more, look at abandonware sites, such at LTF)

I think Wine cannot run on Linux on Mac (but I may be wrong).

Another way: save your NWCs files as MIDI files, and she'll listen with QuickTime!

HTH (En espérant que ça t'aide...)

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 28-Nov-2001

A MAC can be made to run Windows apps, as marsu points out, but NWC does not come in a native MAC version.

Reply 3 offered by: Michel on 28-Nov-2001

Too bad .

Reply 4 offered by: FranMan on 28-Nov-2001

>She got the best computer in the world (si c'est un G4)..

Yup!


#2303: How to generate a MIDI file from NWC
How to generate a MIDI file from NWC

(2303)

Submitted by: Michel on 28-Nov-2001

Hello,

I have tried NWC. It works fine to create your own songs. But I can't save my songs as MIDI format : the MIDI file is generated but with no sound ..... I am using Windows Media Player which works fine with other sounds file.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 28-Nov-2001

To my knowledge, if you save in MIDI format, it saves exactly as you hear the file in NWC (i.e. if some staves are muted, they won't be exported. Hope I'm not wrong)

BUT there are 2 types of Midi, type 0 and type 1; did you try both formats?

And finally, did you close NWC prior to listening with Windows Media Player? In some cases (in NWC, go to Tools/Options/Midi, Port Usage : select "While Playing" to have the minimum of interaction) the midi port can not be opened, but in that case you should see a warning message.

HTH either!

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 28-Nov-2001

If above is not sufficient, you may read msg #2180, msg #2016, msg #1798 !

Reply 3 offered by: Michel on 28-Nov-2001

Great,

I did not close NWC prior to listening with Windows Media Player ..... And I did not know I had to . But now after closing NWC it works in both format (which did not work in both format before)

Thanx

Reply 4 offered by: Grant on 28-Nov-2001

You don't have to close NWC if you change the value of the "Port Usage" field under Tools/Options/Midi. This field controls how long NWC keeps control of the Midi port, preventing other applications (including Media Player) from having access to it. I've set mine to "While Playing", which causes NWC to leave the MIDI port free any time that it's not actively playing a file.


#2304: Second ending following master repeat
Second ending following master repeat

(2304)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 28-Nov-2001

I have looked everywhere in the forum and faq's for a solution but without success. How do I create a final bar second ending (terminating in a double bar) following a master repeat close?
many thanks
Peter Crossley

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 29-Nov-2001

I'm not sure that I understood your question well; but I think what you need is :
1. edit the staff properties (R key than select the one you want)
2. in "General" tab, select the Ending bar you want.

Not sure this is what you ask for. Could you try to ascii-draw it, such as :

|:.......|_1 :|...|_2...||

?
(warning : more than one space become one space.)

HTH?

Reply 2 offered by: Peter Crossley on 29-Nov-2001

Marsu,

Very kind of you to help. The format of the last two bars is as follows:
1 penultimate bar is first time repeat terminating in a master repeat close
2 the last bar is a second time repeat terminating in a double bar.

I cannot find a way of "jumping over" the master repeat close to insert the last bar, but as you suggest the technique is probably more subtle than I am assuming.

regards
Peter Crossley

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 29-Nov-2001

Forgive me if I've misunderstood, but it sounds as if you are trying to use the Staff Properties 'Ending Bar' as the Master Repeat Close.

Instead change it back to 'Section Close', then just insert an ordinary bar line and change its style to MRC. You can then insert special endings into the two bars as required.

HTH
Peter

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Crossley on 29-Nov-2001

Yes this seems to diagnose my ailment accurately. Many thanks.
Peter


#2305: question about 1812 overture
question about 1812 overture

(2305)

Submitted by: Crystal on 28-Nov-2001

What are the best websites to go to for information about the 1812 overture that would be useful to a student for info for a seminar? And also where would I find the lyrics to the opening? (I believe they are in German) and I would need a translation of them.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 29-Nov-2001

I know this has been discussed before.
In the NG I think, but also here: a simple search gives msg #1231 and msg #2109. In msg #1231 (reply 4) there is a link to the lyrics (which seems dead), and on reply 10 there are russian and english lyrics.

HTH!

Reply 2 offered by: Bill McCance on 22-Jan-2002

I don't know if this info will be in time but there is a site called band-chat.org where registered members acan post questions. the site is full of professional musicians, performers and educators. I think they could give you enough info to un several seminars. There is no fee for joining and if you are a serious musician t's a great place fr discussion

Regards,

Bill


#2306: Multiple tunes on a page
Multiple tunes on a page

(2306)

Submitted by: Peter Crossley on 30-Nov-2001

I have checked out the past correspondence on this but was wondering if there is now any feature on NWC to allow you to edit multiple tunes on the same editing screen and insert titles for each so that they can all print on the same page. This is a common requirement for Scottish country dance music.

Regards
Peter Crossley

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 30-Nov-2001

There's still nothing in NWC itself that will support this directly, but I'm sure there are ways to achieve the desired result by copying out of NWC's print preview into some other application such as MS Word or a graphics package. For starters, there's information on this at msg #1773 and msg #1655.


#2307:  Help! 5-lets and duplets
Help! 5-lets and duplets

(2307)

Submitted by: Joseph Smith on 30-Nov-2001

Does Noteworthy composer have the ability to write 5-lets and duplets and if so how??

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 30-Nov-2001

Duplets are relatively easy, if you mean two notes in the time of 3. Just dot the two notes (e.g., 2 dotted eighths take up the same time as 3 regular eighths). This may seem like a hack, but a number of composers have regularly written duplets this way, including Britten and Bliss. (Maybe it's a British thing?)

Quintuplets are harder, and the only current way I know of to write them in NWC is definitely a hack. For a detailed description I don't feel like repeating here, see msg #2240 (reply 3).

Many, many people have asked for better native n-tuplet support in NWC. It probably wouldn't hurt to add your name to the list by going to the Wish List page.


#2308: Laszlo Kalmar Midi's
Laszlo Kalmar Midi's

(2308)

Submitted by: Joseph Smith on 30-Nov-2001

Does anybody know where to find some good Laszlo Kalmar Midi files??

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 02-Dec-2001

Try http://www.google.com/search?q=Laszlo+%2BKalmar+%2BMidi

Hth


#2309: mac support?
mac support?

(2309)

Submitted by: raejae on 01-Dec-2001

I'd just like to say I'm one of many ex-windows users who jumped ship to Macintosh when Mac OS X came out because of its wonderful stability and UNIX base... in any case, this is the only program that I just can't find a replacement for. You can't find this kind of ease of use in any notation program for the Mac... so I was wondering if you guys were planning Mac OS X support at any time in the near future?

-raejae

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Music on 01-Dec-2001

I'm just an ordinary user, who does not speak for Noteworthy Software. But based on previous message threads that have appeared on this forum:

(1) It seems unlikely that NWC will be ported to Mac.
(2) If it ever happens, then we'll find out when it is released. NWC has the policy of not announcing future plans (a policy that I agree with!).

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 03-Dec-2001

I'm in the same position as Joe Music ; look at msg #2302 .
HTH !


#2310: jpeg file to noteworthy
jpeg file to noteworthy

(2310)

Submitted by: urpo tienhaara on 02-Dec-2001

Someone is sending me a file of 68 pages of music in a
jpeg file. If I have the pages printed out, I could then
enter the notes one by one. Is there a way of directly
transfering the jpeg file into a noteworthy file? Probably
some editing may be necessary. Would a scanner allow one
to copy music from scores into noteworthy composer files?
I already have two websites both featuring music made by
Noteworthy Composer
http://www.dreamwater.org/music/operaurpo
http://www.geocities.com/operaurpo

Reply 1 offered by: Robin Withey on 03-Dec-2001

There have been a number of discussions on this forum about programs that allow you to convert images to NWC (or at least MIDI). There are none in the recent activity, but if you hunt around in the archives, you'll probably find something.

The short answer is, the one program that was mentioned that was shareware at one time no longer is. All the rest are 100's of dollars, and people have reported rather poor results. Still, maybe some people have better news since this was last discussed - I would be interested too, if anyone has any more news.

Robin

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 03-Dec-2001

Well, first of all if you decide to use a software to get midi from pictures, you do not need to print them and scan them later !! Any good picture-program can be used to make a correct bitmap format(BMP, TIFF or GIF file, depending on the soft you'll use).

If the music is not a new one, then you may find it already done on the net; it's always to good to perform some search prior to starting such a work.

As Robin just wrote, it's a long discussion and no software produces satisfactory results.
I used MidiScan for that purpose, and it was not too bad; though it's a bit expensive, and the GUI is really not as smart and efficient as NWC's one. In Midiscan i was just correcting time signature and then export it to midi, and did all the rest of the work in NWC.

Other softwares were mentioned in msg #991, msg #485 and msg #603.

I do not recomend any of them (nor midiscan).

NWC is quick enough to enter the notes. If you're a piano player and have a midi keyboard, then it's still quicker. But entering the notes/elements of staves directly with PC keyboard (let the mouse alone, there are quick keys for each action and it's worth the (tiny) effort learning them) is my preferred way.

HTH,
Marsu, happy reg'd user


#2311: helo
helo

(2311)

Submitted by: Francis on 03-Dec-2001

how to record a tune using the midi keybord ? i tried to do but the note duration is not changing - i mean you press a particular key for any duration - but the note is typed only in one either minim, crotched or the hilithed one only. need helpp to solve this.

Reply 1 offered by: Robin Withey on 03-Dec-2001

There are two ways to enter music using a MIDI keyboard - step time and real time. It sounds like you have been using step time, which is the way I always work (being a lousy pianist!).

When you work in step time, the notes are always entered as whichever length is highlighted at the time. As you can see, the various note lengths are displayed on the menu. Just click on the one you want, and then play the notes you want on your keyboard. You have to click a new note duration every time you want to change durations. I personally find it easier to use the keyboard shortcuts for this, rather than the mouse - 1 on the number pad changes to semibreve, 2 to minim and so on.

If you're a better keyboard player than I am, you might prefer to use real time recording. I've never really used that properly, and it was I bit hit and miss when I did, but I'm sure the majority of subscribers to the forum do it this way, so someone else will be able to explain it to you.

Robin

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 03-Dec-2001

? I'm only a user; I don't use a true midi keyboard, only a virtual one (msg #1054 (reply 13)), but it is the 1st time I hear of this problem.

Did you create a staff long enough to be played while recording?
Did you try to enter different notes, or chords, or rests ?

Reply 3 offered by: Keith on 10-Dec-2001

I generally use the step method simply because it gives me neater and more predictable results. But recording isn't difficult - just kind of... odd.

First, you have to have something to play before you can record. Simple enough. I usually make a kind of metronome staff which allows me to record, and also provides a guide for the beat. If you're going to record a waltz, for example, create a blank staff (be sure to add the 3/4 time sig.) and enter three quarter notes and a bar. Now copy the notes and bar and paste enough times to complete your recording.

To record, hit F4, or click the record icon. Your metronome staff will begin to play. Just play along with it - carefully. When you're done, stop the recording (F6 or Stop) and your recorded notes will appear - in a file by themselves.

At this point, you'll have to provide any dynamics, dotted notes, slurs, etc. But if you play well enough, a good deal of the work will have been done for you.

Hope this helps,
Keith

Reply 4 offered by: Allistair on 12-Dec-2001

I use the playing along method most of the time and it works well. Just remember to go to the Options -> Import tab and select the appropriate length of note and rests. Then if your timing's as wonky as mine, you will frequently get 100% accuracy.


#2312: Slur preferences
Slur preferences

(2312)

Submitted by: Webb Comfort on 04-Dec-2001

I do mostly vocal music, 2 parts per staff, but by layering. I would like to set a preference that says "on this staff ties and slurs are always upward", or downward. I know I can go thru and change them by hand after the fact, but that's a pain. Is there someway to set this preference before I even start putting in notes, and have every tie or slur set the way I want it when it comes up?

Reply 1 offered by: Richard on 04-Dec-2001

AFAIK there is no way to set this preference.

What you might like to try is to enter the complete stave without any slurs. When you have finished, select all of the notes in the stave ( position to beginning of stave and hit shift + END , then edit (ALT + ENTER)and do a global change from the notes tab selecting upward or downward as appropriate from the slur direction box.

If you now go through and put your slurs in - they will all be the required direction.

If you are one of those people that pputs the lyrics in before the notes so that everything looks right as you are creating your masterpiece, then this method is no good.

I would suggest that you just put in the slurs as you go along so that the lyrics are correct. Don't, at this stage, worry about the direction.

When you have finished the stave, and the lyrics are lined up correctly because you have all of the slurs in place, then use the method above to select all notes and change the slur direction.

Hope this helps.

Richard

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Dec-2001

In short, you can change slur directions very quickly for a whole staff by:

- Press Home key
- Press and hold Shift key, then End key (Shift+End)
- Press Ctrl+Enter
- Change the slur direction in the Notes tab (and if necessary the Rests tab)
- Press OK

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 04-Dec-2001

Of course this is also valid for ties either :)

Reply 4 offered by: Ramon Pajares Box on 05-Dec-2001

> In short, you can change slur directions very quickly for a whole staff by:

>[...]
> - Press Ctrl+Enter

Ctrl+Enter?

I think you'd mean either Ctrl+E or Alt+Enter. Ctrl-Enter does nothing.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Dec-2001

Pardon me, Alt+Enter


#2314: Note stem width
Note stem width

(2314)

Submitted by: arovo on 06-Dec-2001

Is there any way to stop Noteworthy from printing note stems with like only a hairline width? This is something that has been annoying me for ages but I have kept to myself. I would love to be able to set the width of the note stems to half a point or several points (depending on the size). I usually print out at about point size 24, and the note stems look hairline. I use a deskjet printer. I have the same problem on laser printers but it is a little more bearable because there's more contrast.

Let me also say that Noteworthy is just great. I have never had it crash in all the years I have been using it. Which is more than I can say for the $x,000 applications at work which fail regularly.

Thanks all, hope you have had a great year. I haven't been on for over a year, since I haven't needed any help! Just make note stem width settable for me! ;-)

arovo

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 06-Dec-2001

Dear Arovo,

At that size it may appear a little thin indeed. But why on earth do you need to print it so big? I usually print in 17 or 18 maximum (choir), sometimes 14 or 15 (piano printing).
Currently I don't see any wat to specify the width of note stems; but if you want to "officially" wish it, better go at the wish list (here) and express it there.
Is there any reason why you need to print at such a size? If it is because lyrics are too small, you can specify their size without changing the staff size (go to menu _F_ile|Pa_g_e Setup, Fonts tab).

HTH,
Marsu, happy reg'd user

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 06-Dec-2001

Oh, and if you didn't came back for a year, you may not have the latest version. It's worth the !likn(upgrade=http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/upgrade.htm) :^)
Idem for Internet plug-in !!

Reply 3 offered by: FranMan on 07-Dec-2001

This looks like a rather symple job for those who have a font editor (?) Just replace the old font with the modified one.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Dec-2001

The note stems (as well as slurs, ties, and barlines) are drawn objects rather than font objects.

One possible approach might be to Copy to metafile, then use an image editor such as Paint Shop Pro, which contains various filters to post-process the image.

Probably the best would be to suggest a user-selectable stem width to the "wishlist". Many of the features we now take for granted were originally requested by users, as the "Wishes Granted" list demonstrates.

Reply 5 offered by: Arovo on 07-Dec-2001

Thanks guys.

Hey Marsu, I've been notating a lot of songs this year and the template I've worked out for them (am writing a songbook with leadsheets in the jazz format - lyrics, melody and chords) works nicely at around 22-24 points. fits about 32 bars on page, with lyrics. and I know about the font sizes tab - been using that to print out the lyrics in my own font. I've been printing the piano arrangements smaller tho. I'll patch the NWC update too - thanks for the reminder.

I'm with you Franman, if somebody can make a new version of the jazz font and standard font, that would be fantastic.

and Fred, I think the wish-list is the way to go... let's all ask for it!

Thanks again!


#2315: Lyrics on top of staff
Lyrics on top of staff

(2315)

Submitted by: Jane Smith on 06-Dec-2001

Does anyone know how the Lyric command can be used on top of the staff? (so that guitar chords can be added)

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Dec-2001

Set Alignment to Top in the Lyric configuration.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 06-Dec-2001

You might also consider placing your guitar chords as "text" rather than "lyrics." Text can be placed nearly anywhere, and you don't have to use the same font as the one you are using for lyrics.

If you are looking for some fingerboard diagrams, search the Internet for free fonts called "Frets" A,B, and C.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 07-Dec-2001

You can find the frets fonts there. Refer to another JoeMusic's post : msg #1414 (reply 15) :)

hope this helps!


#2316: converting analog music to wav
converting analog music to wav

(2316)

Submitted by: Sammi D on 07-Dec-2001

I want to convert music that is on an audio cassette tape to digital form. Does anyone know of any software that can do this???

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Dec-2001

Any "Wav recorder" program will do this. Even Windows' native Sound Recorder, although the total record time will be severely limited unless you resort to some "trickery."

I use CoolEdit, but this also does a lot more than just record wavs, giving extensive editing control also.

The more recent releases of Exact Audio Copy (a precision CD ripper) include rudimentary wav recording/editing features... for free.

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 09-Dec-2001

If you happen to own an Iomega ZIP drive, the accompanying software includes a sound recorder that can create a much larger file than the one that originally came with Windows.


#2317: Best Simple Keyboard?
Best Simple Keyboard?

(2317)

Submitted by: David Massar on 07-Dec-2001

Can someone recommend a lo cost, simple midi keyboard for a NWC beginner? I'm not a keyboard player, and need it only for composing, not performing. No sampled sounds needed. My PC has a USB port. Inexpensive would be good. Please advise, Thanx!

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 07-Dec-2001

I use a virtual one, please refer to msg #1054 (reply 13). Direct link : http://wuarchive.wustl.edu/packages/ultrasound/util/windows/piano21.zip

I do not know how to install the "virtual piano driver" on NT/2K/ME/ systems though.

HTH!

Reply 2 offered by: David Massar on 07-Dec-2001

Marsu

Thank you for introducing me to this amazing bit of free software! This confirms my conviction that it won't take much or cost much to have the same thing in the shape of a piano keyboard, i.e. white and black keys that do what my computer keys are doing with virtual piano. I would still like that simple piece of hardware... any idea who makes one?

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Dec-2001

Check out your local music store, Casio and others make inexpensive keyboards with midi in/out ports. There are also dedicated midi controller keyboards available (i.e. no built-in synthesiser), but ironically they can be more expensive than a complete synth. I suppose it's a demand issue, and how many units are produced in a run, etc.

In any event, you should be able to find a keyboard for well under $100 if you shop around. Even less if you get lucky and find a used one at a yard sale, etc.

Good luck,
Fred

Reply 4 offered by: D on 07-Dec-2001

If you have a sound blaster card (live series)the blaster key would bE a good choice for your purposes. It sells for $99 or less.

It uses the sound blaster card's sound fonts and will let you play with or without recording the notes into your composition. I find that helpful when trying to find just the right notes for my compositions.

Reply 5 offered by: David Massar on 08-Dec-2001

Thank you all!

Reply 6 offered by: Joe Music on 09-Dec-2001

Don't forget to check your local Goodwill store (if in USA).

I am not kidding! Around this season, some keyboard manufacturers produce relatively inexpensive MIDI keyboards. They may not be general-MIDI complaint, but that's not what you need, anyway. They are put on sale, for Christmas. After a while, some of them show up in mint condition at the used merchandise places. Our local Goodwill has one.

However, you would still need a way to get the MIDI into your computer. That usually requires a separate interface (hardware plus driver) that is not cheap. Not the kind of thing you would find at Goodwill.

Reply 7 offered by: David Massar on 09-Dec-2001

Thanks for the tip Joe. The problem is time to find it that way! Speaking of interface, if the keyboard says it has standard midi in/out, will it work with my PC (USB port) and NWC? I'm assuming it will, but if I buy mail-order it could be a drag if I'm wrong!

Reply 8 offered by: Joe Music on 10-Dec-2001

I don't know about USB, but I have the feeling that the standard MIDI will NOT directly connect to the USB or any other port on your computer. Perhaps there are some computers with a special-purpose MIDI port built-in??? Does anyone know better?

I connect my keyboard to the parallel (printer) port on my non-USB laptop via a small piece of hardware (with accompanying software driver) called "Mididock." There are also other products that do this kind of job. My technology is several years old, so I'm not familiar with the latest products. But I recall that my interface, which was a basic, low-end (but good) device, cost somewhere between US$50 and US$100 at the time.

Once the interface is installed and working, it is transparent. The keyboard directly works with NWC, in the way you would probably expect. However, my model keyboard, also low-end, does not permit the software to specify which "instrument" is being synthesized. It always gives piano, unless another "instrument" is chosen at the keyboard console itself. To put this another way, I cannot simultaneously play several tracks with different "instruments" through my keyboard.

Also, the low-end keyboard is not sensitive to dynamic key touch. That is, a note plays the same regardless of whether the key is touched gently or struck hard.

Just thought you should know that there are reasons why inexpensive keyboards are cheaper than the professional models! Nevertheless, my keyboard uses digital samples from a real piano, so it sounds pretty good.

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Dec-2001

"Standard midi out" means that the keyboard has the 5-pin DIN connectors for midi input and output. While midi uses a serial protocol, it will *not* just plug into a serial, parallel, USB or firewire port on your computer.

As Joe has pointed out, midi<->serial and midi<->parallel interfaces are available, and probably USB also.

However, most people (myself included) use the joystick port on the computer's soundcard; on most soundcards, there is a driver available (usually called "MPU-401 midi in/out" or "External midi in/out"). If your soundcard (or computer with onboard sound) supports this, all you need is an inexpensive cable that plugs into the joystick port and gives you the two midi connectors in a "Y" cable configuration. They'll usually even have a joystick cable so you can still use the joystick at the same time.

Cheers,
Fred

Reply 10 offered by: David Massar on 10-Dec-2001

Yes! My computer does have this joystick port, and I found the cable you're talking about for $19 on the web from a discount place called "cables 'n more" (http://www.cablesnmor.com/goto/midi-cable.html)

Found what looks like a good starter keyboard on the web also, from Amazon.com of all places. The Yamaha PSR160 for $89 incl. shipping. (+ 12 bucks for the power supply cord)

I'll let you all know how it works out!

Thank you again for all your help!

DM

Reply 11 offered by: Barry Graham on 10-Dec-2001

Make sure the selected keyboard is General Midi compatible.
Some have their own patch list which may render them less than useful for MIDI use.

Reply 12 offered by: Joe Music on 10-Dec-2001

You learn something new every day! My computer (a laptop) does not have a joystick port, or a joystick.


#2318: Truncate printing
Truncate printing

(2318)

Submitted by: Ken Whitesell on 07-Dec-2001

I'm using the hard line break at specific locations to cause certain measures to start on a new line. When I do that, the measures prior to that are expanded to fill the line. What I'd really like to do is have them take up their default width, so the remainder of that line is blank.

I've verified that the "Extend last system" box is not checked, and that only seems to apply to the last line.

I've used the hint of putting hidden text in the line to cause the rest of the line to be compressed. That works well enough, except the 5 lines of the staff continue to the end of the line.

What I'd really like is for that line to look like a short line, leaving the rest of it blank. So far, I've come up with the following ideas:

1) Print to a PDF file, then edit it using Acrobat.

2) Use "White-out", "Liquid Paper", or Correction tape.

3) Use a piece of blank paper to cover the empty staff.

I was kinda hoping to find some way a little less manual. Anyone have any ideas?

Ken

Reply 1 offered by: FranMan on 07-Dec-2001

Short reply: There is not way that is more automatic than those.

Long reply:
Ok, the only thing I can think of is "electronic White-out". After the notes you want on that line, make a measure of white text. Make sure a least of your text fields has "preserve width" checked, and make your text as long as you need. With this method you can white out the staff with the text you put. I suggest making five text fields of ___________________ and positioning them so that they cover the lines. After all that, place a final barline, make it end the line and hide it. (Pretty bad, but it works...)

Reply 2 offered by: Joe Music on 09-Dec-2001

You might try creating several NWC files, each with a one-line portion of your music (use cut and paste). Then, create placeable WMFs using Print Preview: Copy. Finally, place the separate WMFs into a word processing document.

Incidentally, Acrobat (even the full version) is not really intended to be an "editor" of PDF files. But some drawing programs (such as Illustrator) do the job.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 10-Dec-2001

You could also create as many NWC files as needed, with each one having the last system being one that has to be short.
Just print all of them on the same sheet, using the "top" margin to print them lower and lower.

Pretty "dirty" solution too, but it works either !
(don't forget to remove page number, page title... on the not-first page)

HTH :)

Reply 4 offered by: Ken Whitesell on 10-Dec-2001

Thanks all for the ideas. But they're all more work than it's worth to me. (Although, using the blank text over top intrigues me. I'll give it a try for grins'n'giggles.) I was mostly wondering if I had just missed a setting or command or something simple like that.

Bottom line is, I'm happy enough to live with the blank space. That'll be good enough for me.

Thanks again.
Ken

Reply 5 offered by: John Kavanagh on 19-Dec-2001

Sometimes white space would be preferable, but this will
at least fill up that space with blank staff lines.

End your line with a "section Close" or what ever.

Add a bar or two of rests. Highlight the rest bars, then right-click or got to properties and make the visibility "never" for those bars. Make a line break at the end of the invisible section.


#2319: Virtual Piano and NWC HELP!
Virtual Piano and NWC HELP!

(2319)

Submitted by: David Massar on 08-Dec-2001

Can anyone help me to install "Virtual Piano" and make it work with NWC? I'm new to all of this.

I downloaded and unzipped the VP program, and I can open and play it by double clicking on the Piano icon. But there is no installation program with it, and I'm having trouble with the instructions in the 'readme' file... they say:

"add piano.exe to your favorite program group using Program Manager's File/Add command" Program Manager? Don't know what that is or where to find it.

"install 'Piano Midi Driver' using Control Panel: Drivers/Add/Unlisted..." My control panel has no "drivers" in the menu.

I'm using Windows ME, btw.

Also, once I've done this, how do I enable NWC to work w/the Virtual Piano?

Help me if you can! THANK YOU

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Dec-2001

msg #1982 might hopefully give more insight when installing this on 32-bit Windows builds. I don't know if it's been tried with ME, but can't see why it wouldn't work.

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 08-Dec-2001

msg #1982 by Fred.

Hth

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 08-Dec-2001

Sorry Fred :) We hapened to be online at the same time...

Reply 4 offered by: David Massar on 09-Dec-2001

Fred

Excellent information… thank you very much! The install worked and the programs are working fine together. Now it’s learning curve time. I am a NWC newbie, so the following might be stupid questions, but here goes anyway…

I couldn’t find the rim shot sound you suggested, but found that the woodblock in the general midi list playing a high note sounds fine for click track. I created it and hit record, then switched to Piano. At this point, the virtual keyboard plays the WOODBLOCK also. So I change to acoustic piano, and the metronome starts playing ACOUSTIC PIANO. I’ll bet it’s something simple I’m doing wrong, but I can’t get the click track doing it’s own thing. Tried adding and selecting a new staff, but this seems irrelevant since when I hit stop the tune I played shows up in a new window on it’s own staff anyway. (Is that normal?). IN ANY CASE, I find it very difficult to play the virtual piano with any accuracy, partly because there’s a slight delay in the keystrokes. How can I use the VP to add notes one at a time to the staff? Can I select a type of note from the toolbar, then use VP to select each note? If I do play something live, is there a way to ‘quantize’ a sequence of notes, so that the minor errors in timing are corrected?

Thank you for all your help, Fred and/or anyone else who has time to reply!

David Massar

Reply 5 offered by: Robin Withey on 10-Dec-2001

David,

The rim block is a percussion sound. This means you have to set the MIDI channel to 10, and play a particular note, rather than set a particular instrument. I'm at work at the moment, so I can't give you the particular note you need, but there is a percussion chart in the examples folder that lists all the main percussion instruments. To set the MIDI channel for a particular stave, click on that stave and press F2 (off the top of my head - I might have got the wrong key, so try the Staff menu and select properties). Now click on the MIDI tab and choose 10 for the channel number.

As for the woodblock sounding like a piano, that's because you're using the same channel for the rhythm as for the melody. Again, change to a different channel as above.

HTH
Robin

Reply 6 offered by: David Massar on 10-Dec-2001

Robin

Got it.. THANK YOU

DM


#2320: Autocomplete cookies
Autocomplete cookies

(2320)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Dec-2001

It seems that in the transition from the ntworthy.com to noteworthysoftware.com domains, the cookie that automatically fills in your name and email address in forum replies has expired.

If you delete the two ntworthy.com cookies, then go to get new ones !linke(here=http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/cgi-local/nwui.cgi?form=setup) your autocomplete will work again.

Fred

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Dec-2001

Darn. Let's try that link again. Click here to get new cookies.

Reply 2 offered by: Keith Sheasley on 16-Dec-2001

Thanks for the cookies, Fred. Very handy. (And I didn't get you anything.)


#2321: "No Viewer Available"
"No Viewer Available"

(2321)

Submitted by: Bob Hall on 09-Dec-2001

I have created some html with an "embed" tag in it to run an nwc file remoteley over the web. It works fine when I test it with my PC, but doesn't work for a friend's PC.

He gets an error message that says:

"There is no viewer available for the type of object you are trying to open. The following information is available about this object:

Address of object:
http://www.classicalfree.org/music/grace-1.nwc
Content type:
application/octet-stream
Possible location of viewer:
http://note...plugin.htm"

Noteworthy Player _is_ installed on the PC that doesn't work. The samples play with no problem on his PC and in Explorer under Tools | File Types, there _is_ an association between Noteworthy Player and nwc file types. This may not be significant, but Noteworthy _Composer_ is installed on the PC that does work. The following code runs on the website:

<center>
<table border=1 width=500 class=white>
<tr><td ALIGN=CENTER class=red><b>PLAY</b></td></tr>
<tr><td>Click on the blue triangle-shaped start button below to start
<br>Click on the magnifying glass with a (+) in it to enlarge
<br>Click on the magnifying glass with a (-) in it to reduce</td></tr>
<tr><td><embed src="music/grace-1.nwc" width=500 height="250" pluginspage="http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/plugin.htm" type="application/x-nwc"></td></tr>
</table>
</center>

The type is set to application/x-nwc (not sure why the error message thinks it's octet-stream). The PC that doesn't work is running Windows 98 with internet explorer 5.5 through netzero.net. The PC that does work is running WinME with AOL 6.0.

Any thoughts?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 10-Dec-2001

There is no need to have NWPlayer installed.
What you need is the NWPlug-in.
Refer to http://www.noteworthysoftware.com/composer/plugin.htm (as correctly specified in your embed statement)

You don't need to remove NWP!! you can have it or not, as you may have (or not) NWC.

The trouble seems to be either IE5.5 with win98 WITH netzero.net
the plug-in works with win98, with IE5.5 either; what is namezer.net ?

And first of all, did you install NWPlug-in? I tried your nwc file and it works fine for me.

HTH!

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Dec-2001

If you are using the EMBED html tag, then your visitors MUST have the plug-in installed in order to view your content.

>Content type:
>application/octet-stream

If you are planning to use the EMBED, you should really also be setting the correct NWC MIME type for the object as indicated on the plug-in download page.

Reply 3 offered by: Joe Music on 10-Dec-2001

In other words, "Noteworthy Player" and "Noteworthy Plug-In" are two different things.

Reply 4 offered by: Bob Hall on 10-Dec-2001

Ok, do I have this straight? The way it works is that when you install the plug-in it notifies the browser of its existence so that when the browser encounters a file with the appropriate MIME type it knows what to do with it.

Anybody know what files/registry entries are referenced in this process? I think the IE settings are in HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE/Software/Microsoft/Internet Explorer/Plugins/Extensions. What about Netscape? Where are they located? I downloaded the plugin and told it I had IE and Netscape, but do not see any references in the registry tying Netscape to nwc.

I can see a potential for human error if I send new visitors to the plugin.htm page. The first link is to "Composer". If the visitor has no idea what a plugin is or why it's required, they might click to the "Composer" page, get lost, and/or download "Player" and wonder why things don't work. Just a thought: Would it be possible to move the link to "Composer" lower down on the page (below the fold), so that the Plugin download was more prominent?

I'm going to get my "beta tester" to check his control panel to make sure the "plug in" is installed. I'll let you all know how it all turns out. Thanks for all the feedback: Joe Music, NoteWorthy Online and Marsu.

Bob

PS: I checked the control panel on my own PC and I didn't have the plug in, but I did have composer and player, and it seemed to work on my PC. I have since downloaded the plugin also.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Dec-2001

> but do not see any references in the registry tying Netscape to nwc

What makes you think you should see registry references for Netscape? Hint: The MIME type association is inside the plug-in, as dictated by the Netscape Plug-in Spec. Microsoft no longer conforms to the spec, having instead forced a proprietary method on developers.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Dec-2001

Your comment about the plugin page makes sense. It has now been changed.

Reply 7 offered by: Bob Hall on 10-Dec-2001

>> Your comment about the plugin page makes sense.
>> It has now been changed.

Thanks. Appreciate the rapid response. You guys are great!

Reply 8 offered by: Bob Hall on 10-Dec-2001

Thanks also for the "hint". I checked out Netscape's plugin tutorial and it answered all my questions.

http://developer.netscape.com/docs/manuals/communicator/plugin/basic.htm

Reply 9 offered by: Bob Hall on 11-Dec-2001

>>I'm going to get my "beta tester" to check his
>>control panel to make sure the "plug in" is
>>installed. I'll let you all know how it all
>>turns out. Thanks for all the feedback:
>>Joe Music, NoteWorthy Online and Marsu.

Here's the "end-of-the-story". After installing the plugin everything works perfectly. Thanks again for your patience and all the feedback.


#2322: Spacing between lyric lines
Spacing between lyric lines

(2322)

Submitted by: Grant on 11-Dec-2001

Sometimes for legibility's sake I'd like to be able to get a little more white space in between lyric lines in printed output. Is there a way to do this that I've missed, or should I rush off to the Wish List with it?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Dec-2001

Here's a workaround. Let's say you have two lyric lines; specify three instead. Put your lyrics into #1 and #3, leaving #2 blank. Voila. Now you have a lot more space.

Unfortunately, there's no way of changing the width of that newly acquired space, since font size is global for lyrics. So mayhaps a trip to the wish list would be appropriate.
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Dec-2001

The vertical space used by each lyric line is based on size of the font, and is fixed as such. You can perform tricks such as a blank lyric line or layers, but there is no direct way of nudging a little more space between each line.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Dec-2001

Oh, yes! (light comes on, the little bell rings) NW Support mentioned Layering! By tweaking the lyric displacement and/or lower staff clearance, one should be able to get pretty fine control.

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 12-Dec-2001

You can also use this technique (layering) to vary the lyric positioning on individual systems/bars/notes.

For instance if the melody drops very low for a couple of bars then you might want to move the lyrics down temporarily, which isn't possible with just one stave, so you just put those lyrics onto a layered stave in a different position.

Peter

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 13-Dec-2001

Hi people, it seems that we already discussed such a topic some time ago. (...) I just found where: msg #912 (reply 14) , but I guess at that time there was some other threads talking about it.

Marsu Always Descending-in-past


#2323: Midi to Wave to CD
Midi to Wave to CD

(2323)

Submitted by: Michael Marks on 11-Dec-2001

I've checked the archives and in any case I knew *how*. But I still need help. I tried to use Noteworthy to play and Goldwave, Windows Recorder and Gamut Voice Catcher to record, but in all cases the play trips and sounds choppy and uneven, at least at the required record settings. I've closed all programs,even background ones, and still the choppiness. Why? Dont' I have enough resources with a Celeron 466Mhz, 120MB ram and 4 gigs free hard drive space?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Dec-2001

The one thing you didn't specify was what creates the source sound -- i.e. what kind of sound card you have.

It could very well be that if you have a wavetable-type synth (AWE64, SBLive!) that the 466 mHz processor doesn't quite have what it takes to render the midi in real-time *and* record to hard drive at the same time.

Audio Compositor /might/ be a solution for you, as it renders the midi into wav by allowing it to take as long as necessary to avoid "skips". Other things to check: is DMA enabled on your hard drive? Does it work alright with simple one or two-voice midis? (If so, it's most likely a resource deficiency.)

HTH
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Michael Marks on 12-Dec-2001

Thanks for the reply

I have a C-Media CMI8738/C3DX PCI Audio Device. I don't really know if it is based exclusively on Wave-Table synthesis or on FM synthesis since both are mentioned in the booklet.

DMA is enabled. Midi plays quite fine otherwise. In fact if the sampling rate is low and it's set for mono, the record and play devices work together just fine. But my software will not allow me to make a music CD from a wave sampled at less than 44.1 and stereo.

So I guess I'll have to rely on that Audio Compositor thing. I'll let you know how it went when I've acquired it.

Thanks again Fred.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Dec-2001

>choppy and uneven

This is symptomatic of an underpowered computer, although the specs you indicate are vastly capable of digital audio recording to hard disk. Things that can make a PC with good specs actually go slow include:

- a fragmented hard disk
- some other program/task running in the background that is hogging CPU cycles
- some types of hardware faults, including some memory/cache faults, errors on the hard drive, and excessice heat

For starters, you can make NWC less demanding on your system for purposes of recording. Make sure you are using 1.70 + Web Update 10, then go to Tools | Options | Editor and turn off the "Chase playing notes" option.

>In fact if the sampling rate is low and it's set
>for mono, the record and play devices work together
>just fine.

Well, this confirms that you at least have full duplex capability, and tends to indicate there is a horsepower deficiency or problem as described above.

>But my software will not allow me to make a music
>CD from a wave sampled at less than 44.1 and stereo.

Most digital audio software allows you to convert a WAV sampling rate and double a mono channel to create the necessary stereo sample. However, this is NOT the right way to do this, as the quality of your WAV is only as good as the original sample rate that you use.

If the problem persists, and you really want to get to the bottom of this, I would do 2 things:

1 - Run a task monitor and determine if some process is excessively using your processor, bogging it down. If so, consider eliminating the offending process.

2 - Benchmark your PC to determine if you are really getting 400 MHz of performance. There are many choices in the benchmark software arena. One example is available at Passmark Software.

Reply 4 offered by: Michael Marks on 14-Dec-2001

Thanks again Noteworthy and Fred. I find Noteworthy an *extremely* useful aid to my modest endeavours, which include teaching classical guitar and arranging for a folk band I play in, and the ability to put the midi stuff on CD is going to be even more useful.

Well, Audio Compositor works, no skipping on playback of the wave file.

I've started to check out my computer, find the leaking lemon juice, so to speak. Task monitor shows that NOteworthy uses 100% of my resources. Other midiers use about 35%, but there is still skipping when used with a recording device. I'm still to register Passmark Software so as to get a comparison chart for the numbers it's throwing up.

I'll see what I can do from here on in. At least I have a solution in Audio Compositor.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Dec-2001

>Task monitor shows that NOteworthy uses 100% of my resources.

Please follow the advice we gave above, and this will no longer be the case.

Reply 6 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 15-Dec-2001

Specifically -- turning off the note-chase feature. If this is on, NWC will report using almost all available CPU time (even though if other processes require time slices, it will happily release them as needed).


#2324: The browser plug-in
The browser plug-in

(2324)

Submitted by: FranMan on 11-Dec-2001

The browser plug-in has no direct Opera 6 support. You have to select "other browser". Will this be fixed?

Reply 1 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 12-Dec-2001

I've just tried. If you upgraded from Opera 5, it works.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Dec-2001

Fixed?

Opera, in its wisdom, embeds its version number into its uninstall string. The uninstall string appears to the only reliable way of determining if Opera is installed, and where it is installed. Because of this situation, we cannot anticipate ahead of time how the next release of Opera will appear on a user's machine. Generally speaking, we have no great desire to chase Opera releases as they change their version numbers, and thus the uninstall string. The Other browser selection is available for just these kind of situations.

However, in this case we will chase the Opera 6.0 release, and update the plug-in installer accordingly. If Opera 6.1 comes out tomorrow, and the uninstall string is changed to reflect this (since it currently uses 6.0 in its identity), the automatic detection will again fail.


#2325: Imputting Notation with Guitar
Imputting Notation with Guitar

(2325)

Submitted by: Paul on 12-Dec-2001

Can I use guitar equipped with midi with noteworthy software to imput chords in real time. I would also like to "pick" the melody line? If so, what additional equipment is required? Would Cakewalk be better for this purpose?

Reply 1 offered by: Allistair on 12-Dec-2001

There are two ways, 1st is to use the MIDI input active (the keyboard symbol). Each chord you strum will be entered as such, the note length will be determined by the one you have highlighted (minim, crotchet, quaver etc.)

2nd, use a rhythm track (some are there, or make your own), press F4 and pick your tune out in time with the beats. Adjust the Tools -->Import tab for best results depending on the rhythms of the tune. You will have to set your input and output devices differently. If you don't have an output device then you're left with method 1.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 13-Dec-2001

Of course you can also entering chords with the 2nd way.
As a matter of fact, everything you play as midi will be recorded.
Even if you make arpeggios of your chords, they may be notated as such; the precision depends on (you of course, ;) and) Tools|Options|ImportTab: NoteResolution and RestResolution.

HTH!


#2326: overlapping scores
overlapping scores

(2326)

Submitted by: webb comfort on 12-Dec-2001

I do 4-part vocal arrangements. Normally the lyrics go between the 2 staves; but sometimes when the bass part (say) has an alternative rhythm, they need a separate lyric line, and this is put at the bottom of the lower staff.

But then, if there are triplets, NWC puts a big "3" beneath that staff, which dumps right on top of that lyric line. By using the vertical size parameters in staff properties, I can make that lyric line slide lower below the staff, to avoid this.

Now, the real problem. I don't know how NWC allocates staves to a printed page -- how it decides to put 4 rather than 5 staves on one page. But when I adjust the bottom lyric line as I described, NWC doesn't even look at this when allocating the staves to the printed page, because that low line of lyrics may print right on top of text which happens to be above the next staff on the page. I would have thought that they would have used all information about a staff line (lyric lines, text, other special data - like the triplet thing) when allocating staves to a printed page, and not let anything overlap. But they don't do that. So is there any way to force more space between staves on the same page? Or is this a wish-list item?

And thanx in advance for any ideas or suggestions. NWC is a great tool -- but just a pain in the butt once in a while. :-)

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Edwards on 12-Dec-2001

Have you tried increasing the upper staff size of the top staff,or the lower staff size of the bottom staff so that all the features you mention fall inside the blue rectangle which appears when you select the staff?

You'll need to move the lyrics (adjust the offset) to the right place, but be careful. It's fine if the offset is positive - the staff size stays put and the lyrics move. If you make the offset negative however the staff size reduces sharply and you have to reset it. NWC has stated in the past that this is by design! :-(

Peter

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Dec-2001

A couple things:

1 - Staff Properties will allow you change the size of any staff, although it does change the size for the staff in all systems when you print.

2 - You can move lyrics around using the Configuration tab. You can align them above or below the staff, and move them closer or further away from the staff boundary set in #1 above.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 12-Dec-2001

But why does changing the Lyric Offset to a negative value also change the staff size?

Peter

Reply 4 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Dec-2001

There is still a bug in there somewehere. NWC has always adjusted the staff size to fit the iascc lines that you configure. The negative offset is confusing it.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 12-Dec-2001

[iascc?] Please disregard the extraneous word...

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 12-Dec-2001

I use NWC to print SATB choir music, often with the extra Bass lyrics below that staff, as was mentioned. Using all of the features available in NWC, I have so far always been able to solve positioning problems.

In the worst-case scenario, try this: Place your extra lyrics as text, rather than lyrics. That way, they can be positioned wherever you like. Be sure to use the same font as you do for the lyrics. Also, be sure that the individual syllables relate to the notes. This might involve placing the syllables one-by-one, rather than as a continuous line of text. Also be sure to look at the result with print preview.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 13-Dec-2001

Another hint: you may want to use a layered staff for the bass line where the triplets occur. I remember using such a trick for an alto passage.
Another possibility is to use an extra lyric line for your staff, but this may be somewhat confusing.

Example: suppose there are 4 notes by measure, and the 2nd measure has notes that are too low and over-impress the lyrics.
Then: 1st lyrics wil have:
ta da ta da _ _ _ _ ta da ta da
2nd lyrics will have:
_ _ _ _ tee dee tee dee

if you choose the extra-lyric-line solution;
the same lyics can be used with the 2 layered staves (but each has 1 lyric line). The layered staff's height, to my knowledge, ha no influence to the real height, so you can place your lyrics a bit lower.

Such a trick can also be used to enter more than 8 lyrics line.
Or to make more space between lyrics lines.

HTH!


#2327: Yet another percussion question !!  Mallet Rolls
Yet another percussion question !!  Mallet Rolls

(2327)

Submitted by: Bill Barto on 13-Dec-2001

Has ANYONE ever come up with a super way to get Mallet rolls on a cymbal to give that mellow, non-staccato "swish" sound over a couple or more measures WITHOUT hearing the tap of the stick on the cymbal for every 32nd (or less) note that is notated? I have several things I'm trying to sequence and while I'd LOVE to use a nice soft mallet cymbal swish, all I have ever been able to get is (the same) thing I get with Tympani rolls - TOO perfect and TOO staccato to sound legit. I even tried (and came real close but no cigar) using a REVERSE cymbal patch but still couldn't avoid the tap-tap-tap etc. of the stick on the cymbal. Are there NO mallet patches around that will do this does anyone know? I'm determined to make this work one day. But any help would be greatly appreciated. It's frustrating.

By the way, whoever figured out the slur so we could actually do Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue (the sweeping clarinet at the start) you're to be commended. Thanks. Now can someone come up with a way to do this mallet cymbal swish too? Here's a challenge for yunz!!

Bill Barto

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 14-Dec-2001

About rhapsody in Blue, I think Fred had sent a small NWC file that started like that.

About mallet, I don't know what you're talking about, except if you're talking about maillet, but it may be a language problem :) I do not know any patch about it, but what you could do is ask a friend that really plays drums to record one, and put it as sound fonts.
Or edit your soundfont and remove the beginning of the sample, leaving it without the 'tic' :)

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Lim on 14-Dec-2001

Marsu,

I think this
will clear up your linguistic query.

However, your solution (to kill the initial attack on the cymbal hit) is probably the most practical one.

Bob

Reply 3 offered by: Robert Lim on 14-Dec-2001

I now find the term in French is "mailloche".

See http://www.km-regensburg.de/projekt/projekt2000/Schlagzeug/percwb_f.htm

hth,

Bob

Reply 4 offered by: Bill Barto on 14-Dec-2001

THANKS so far for the responses folks. I do appreciate the replies. I've been discussing this with Fred as well and it appears that since Noteworthy one has ONE Channel 10 percussion track, that his "overlap" idea that he used with the clarinet slide won't work. But I do like the idea of eliminating the "tap" of the stick on the cymbal however how would YOU attempt that since it's almost required to use 32nd or 64th notes to create the full measure or multiple measures of this long cymbal swish? That means you'd have to eliminate the tap of the cymbal from EVERY 32nd or 64th note you key in - am I correct in assuming that?

Anyway, I know this will stay up till archived and I will continue to try to make this work somehow so if anyone has any other ideas please post. But thanks for those who have so far.

Bill Barto

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Dec-2001

Just a note in case there's any misconception: The reason that NWC has only one percussion channel (ch. 10) is that there /is/ only one such channel, as defined in the General Midi spec.

My first suggest to Bill was to use the multiple notes, but at a very low velocity (pp to p), adjusting the other staff channel volumes lower to compensate (allowing "normal" velocities to be used for natural-sounding attack timbres).

Just had another thought: if you have one of the soundcards that supports two or more midi devices (such as SBLive!) that are otherwise identical, then the "ping-pong" approach would work by alternating between devices (instead of between channels, as in the slide demo).

Fred

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Dec-2001

>Noteworthy one has ONE Channel 10 percussion track

If I understand this correctly, this is inaccurate. You can have multiple staves (parts) that all use MIDI channel 10. Nothing in NWC stops you.

Reply 7 offered by: Bill Barto on 14-Dec-2001

You're right. I am confusing terms. NOTEWORTHY doesn't have only ONE channel 10. General MIDI as Fred says has only one channel 10. YOu CAN have multiple staves all assigned to channel 10 but whether or not you can utilize this same kind of "slide" that Fred came up with for the clarinet is questionable. I'm still trying however. I AM going to beat this monster that's bugged me for so long. Why General Midi is soooo limited when they COULD have done much more in the way of instrumentation is beyond me. I don't know that much about it but I have to believe that it could have been better since not everyone has modules, keyboards or anything more than their computers with which to make music.

Thanks again to all for the added ideas and thoughts. Still plugging away trying to make it work.

Bill

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 14-Dec-2001

Yes, GM is limited. However, keep in mind that it's a very old protocol. It did leave room for a lot of features that were originally deemed un-necessary by many, and this is really the only reason it's lived as long as it has. If nothing else, its restriction to 16 channels and bitrate of 30-odd kbits/sec make it challenging at best to compose/realise more complex musics.

Yamaha and Roland both came up with proprietary (yet partially compatible) midi extensions, while other manufacturers have used their own System Exclusive (sysex) controls to accomplish more than the GM spec allows.

In a way, it's gotten even worse... There has been ongoing work on a new Midi II spec, but the last time I looked (a couple years ago) there was little agreement on how it should be implemented. Each special interest group and major manufacturer has its own agenda, with the result that there's little room for consensus.

Like it or not, it seems that the present midi spec is the best we can hope for in the foreseeable future. :-(

Fred

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 17-Dec-2001

I agree with Fred about Midi: it's an "ancient" norm, if we can call ancient things that are +/- 20 years old. But it works, even better than hoped.
About how to suppress the attack: I had in mind to edit the soundfont itself, but as I don't have a card (nor software) which is capable of soundfont-ing, I do not know if this is possible. Suppose so though. At worst, you can re-create a new one by recording all the different souns to create a new one; in which you will edit the wav file for your mallet sound, cutting off the attack.
It's funny, because doing this with an old amig aor atari would be easy... Hope there is a solution for editing/modifying soundfont --I do not mean while playing, but once for all. Just as you would "prepare" a piano to make special honky-tonk or Cage's music. You don't do it will playing ;)

BTW, does someone know a software that allows my PC (AMD K6 3D 300MHz, W95/3.11) to use soundfonts? I'm now using Yamaha softsynth to enhance(/Replace!) my SB16. But I still can't hear properly the wonderful orks that use Organ soundfonts for example...

Reply 10 offered by: Bob on 17-Dec-2001

Marsu, have you tried Audio Compositor? I think a 300MHz PC would not be able to render complex files in real time, but you can process any MIDI with any sf2-type soundfont and listen to the results as a WAV file.

hth,

Bob


#2329: yamaha psr 170
yamaha psr 170

(2329)

Submitted by: robert mcnay on 15-Dec-2001

does anyone have any problems with the psr 170 and if u have found a realy good Cheap $200 or less keyboard with midi please tell me

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Lim on 16-Dec-2001

What problems do you have? I have a PSR-330 which I bought second hand for UKP 65. So far I have been able to play the synthesiser *from* NWC. Haven't yet tried keyboard input *to* NWC.

Reply 2 offered by: Keith on 16-Dec-2001

I use a Yamaha PSR-220 and I have never had any problems with input to or output from NWC. Works like a charm. I wouldn't trade it.

Reply 3 offered by: Michael Lewis on 30-Jan-2002

I have a Yamaha PSR-170...I'm waiting to get a Sound Blaster Live 5.1 to check it out.


#2330: slight problem....
slight problem....

(2330)

Submitted by: Jacob on 17-Dec-2001

Middle C is softer than every other note. It occurs only on some instruments. A lot of the instruments sounds slightly different than they used to as well. It's happened before, but righted itself somehow. Now, two years later, it's happening again. Is this a problem with my cpu, or did I accidentally do something to the noteworthy software?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Dec-2001

There is not the doing of NWC. There is no option that would only have an impact on one note pitch.

Reply 2 offered by: Keith Sheasley on 17-Dec-2001

If all your instruments sound different, an unlikely but possible cause is an incorrect midi playback device selection. Check it at Tools, Options, Midi.


#2331: advanced search in this forum
advanced search in this forum

(2331)

Submitted by: marsu on 20-Dec-2001

Good evening,

as I won't be ther efor some days, I wanted to know how I could read what would be posted here while I'm offnet.
Here is what I found:
To know which posts are from 4th of December of 2001, click the Search Messages link and enter
04-Dec-2001 [Enter]
Better, you can look for some periods:
1[2-5]-Dec-2001
will return the messages containing posts from 2001/12/12 to 2001/12/15 :)
Looking for 1st, 11, 21, 31 of November?
.1-Nov-2001[Enter] et voilà, you got them!

It does work with names either: if you look for posts about SB16 OR SB32, enter SB[13][62]

This is the power of regexp (REGular EXPressions), from unix, which you had (regexp, not unix ;) in µ$Word 6, but not later... so bad!

But it is *here*, and I love it.

More, it should work too in the Scripto either, IIRW (it accept regexp either).

* Holy and Merry Christmas to all,
* Have a fine end of the Year,
* a funny Euro-start for who is concerned,
* and a Happy New Year to anybody!

Best regards,

Marsu

Reply 1 offered by: Peter Crossley on 08-Jan-2002

So why hide it? Would it not be a lot easier to have a separate date-range search feature? I am particulary interested for example in seeing every message since a given date
regards
Peter

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 08-Jan-2002

Well, it's not "hidden"; it's only using advanced search.
to my knowledge, dates are used as the rest of the text, and they are not specific items (except thay are between italic signs); so a search by chronologic order would not be easy to implement.

However, you may have access to such a chronological way: the number of the thread is in chronological order.

Moreover, you can use the offline forum for such a usage with much more facility.

HTH!

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Jan-2002

We will be modernizing all aspects of the web site, including forum interaction, as the year progresses. We will keep this in mind.

Reply 4 offered by: david palmquist on 15-Jan-2002

Modernizing... sounds like perhaps a version 2 coming up? I'm not sure if I look forward to that or dread it (grin or sigh?). Please, please, please, NWC folks, take it easy - don't change anything for the sake of change. I've seen too many wonderful programs go from being elegant in their simplicity to being difficult to use because every conceivable bell and whistle is added. You have a great product now, don't overhaul it too badly. Please.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 15-Jan-2002

Well, supposing you're talking about a "site version 2", I'm completely of the same opinion of David.
However, I don't fear that such drastic changes -just for sake of changing- happen in the bad way, having noticed that the changes I've seen --and I've seen many, since (I think) Nov.1996!-- are always done in the "good direction".

"Small is beautiful" is one motto that made Unix so versatile and powerful. It seems that this is the case for NW either :) (That reminds me when NWC came with one single font allowing more flexibility, instead of DLLs for fixed sizes: smaller, but better! )

So I'm confident with what will appear :)

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2002

Regardless of what is happening with the program, we plan to modernize the forum, not for complexity sake, but rather ease of use. First changes will be retrofit, later a new design all together may appear. The retrofits will start showing up soon.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 17-Jan-2002

Hmm, it seems you already made some changes, as links appear underlined when mouses passes over... Unless it's a network-upgrade of IE 4 at the office :)

Reply 8 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 17-Jan-2002

Correct. Changes so far:

- new link styles

- new recent activity link style (should be more friendly to those that use the visited link color to decide if they have read a certain reply)

- new and reply forms now start out with keyboard focus for more efficient typing (one less mouse click required)

Reply 9 offered by: marsu on 17-Jan-2002

After having tested it:
1. great
2. great
3. great

Thank you Eric!

Reply 10 offered by: Michael Powell on 18-Jan-2002

NoteWorth Online wrote:

"- new recent activity link style (should be more friendly to those that use the visited link color to decide if they have read a certain reply)"

Prior to the changes to the site, when you selected an activity link all of the related replies changed to the visited link color. Now it appears that only the specific reply that is selected will show the visited color, which could give the impression that some of the responses in the thread have not been read when in fact they have. I was wondering if this is/was the intended design? Not knowing programing or web designing, I don't know if it is even possible to show, on any given day, what responses have been potentially read versus what new response have been added since last viewing. In any event, the new enhancements to the forum look great. Keep up the good work!

Reply 11 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 18-Jan-2002

It makes each reply have its own "visited" status. This was required for IE, which did not consider the #reply[n] portion of the URI to be significant when showing with the visited color.

There are better ways, but they require cookies or logins, both of which we are considering.

Reply 12 offered by: Robin Withey on 22-Jan-2002

Sorry, but I like it better the other way - click on one link and it marks all the replies to the same answer as read (since I will have read them all at the same time).

Ideally I suppose, what is wanted is to mark all the current replies as read, but then when new replies come along, to leave them as unread. But I suspect that is getting too complicated.

Robin

Reply 13 offered by: marsu on 22-Jan-2002

well, Robin, the previous behavior was not satisfactory if you came back later, and that new posts had been added to the same thread: they were marked as read, though they were not.

Reply 14 offered by: Peter Edwards on 22-Jan-2002

I'm with Robin on this one. Clicking on multiple replies, going in and out of new windows is slightly tiresome :-(

Peter

Reply 15 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Jan-2002

The previous forum marked replies to threads as read and it was difficult to pick up a new reply.
With this version you can see immediately replies you have not read directly but you have to click on all links to replies in a thread to mark them as read.
I prefer this method but a "Mark All As Read" button, like that provided in Email and News software would be useful.

Reply 16 offered by: Robin Withey on 22-Jan-2002

Yes, the "Mark all as read" option would be a good one, provided it worked per message.
I suppose there are arguments for and against the new solution. Being a tidy type of person, who likes to see that all the messages are read, it's a pain to have to click on every link to mark them as read. On the other hand, I can see that marking all the replies to a message as read means that you can't (as easily) tell when there are new replies.
The solution is the one I gave earlier - when you click on a reply, all the replies so far are marked as read. I can see it wouldn't be a trivial solution, though - is there a way of marking links as visited, except by actually visiting them? I bet if there is, it would be browser-specific (i.e. you would have to do one thing for MSIE, and another for Netscape etc.)

Oh well, don't try too hard, Eric! You've got an almost perfect music software application to perfect ;-)

Robin

Reply 17 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 22-Jan-2002

This is a browser function not under the control of the web site. The new link style simply tricks the browser into thinking each reply is a new page. Given the current forum architecture (statically served pages, altered dynamically only as postings occur), there is no way to mark all links as read from the server end.

Let's wait and see what happens...

Reply 18 offered by: Robin Withey on 22-Jan-2002

I suspected as much! Oh well, keep up the good work!

Robin

Reply 19 offered by: marsu on 24-Jan-2002

Just thought this morning that if we could have the most-recent entries sorted by thread plus replies, it could be more easy to know which thread is completely read or not, even if not all the lines are marked.
I'm not thinking of the same presentation as in the "Active contents" page, where only the titles of the threads are visible.
Would this be easy to do, and first, would it be ok for Robin and Peter?

BTW, a thing that could be useful either: in the Reply window, if we could see the title of the thread, it would be helpful. Just before sending *this* reply, I wondered if I was replying to the right thread. I wasn't; I was about to reply to the 2353 thread instead of 2331 (I saw it via the URL). just a thought...

Reply 20 offered by: sam on 25-Jan-2002

I never had that problem with the new replies before.
I think its because the browser remembered seeing up to post 2000 #12 eg. when a new post came it shows up as new because there was no 2000 #13 the last time it was at the page.
Im running IE 5.0

hope that makes sense.


#2332: ancient music : noteshapes
ancient music : noteshapes

(2332)

Submitted by: marsu on 21-Dec-2001

As I don't remember who is especially interested in this kind of music, I'll give this information to anyone woh is interested. After all, it's been discussed more than once in this forum :)
on the Thesaurus Musicarum Latinarum, there is a page that describes briefly the names of noteshapes, and the code used to notate it (as text!!) in TML text.
Not very useful for NWC itself, but may be of interest for some users though.
But I'll keep on using NWC, even for old gregorian chant!

NWCly yours


#2333: Improved WMF to images in IV
Improved WMF to images in IV

(2333)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 22-Dec-2001

For those of you who have used "Irfan View" to open a placeable WMF exported from NWC, then convert it to a graphic image: The recent version of IV does a much better job of reading high-resolution WMFs than did the version of a few months ago.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Dec-2001

Thanks, Robert... I'm off to Irfanview to pick up V3.61.

Fred


#2334: soundfonts
soundfonts

(2334)

Submitted by: Gammadragon on 23-Dec-2001

Does anyone know where I can get a Roland MT-32 soundfont?

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 23-Dec-2001

I guess your using a Creative sound card.
Check in your AWE control or Audio control panel.
On the AWE cards there is an option to emulate the MT32 in the drop down list that selects the available synth.
It will use the GS sound set but address the patch numbers according to the MT32.


#2335: Generating chords from melody.
Generating chords from melody.

(2335)

Submitted by: Phan-Anh NGUYEN on 23-Dec-2001

Does it exist any software which generates chords which reasonably fit the input melody file ?
Thanks.

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 23-Dec-2001

I believe Band-in-a-Box will do what you want, but there isn't an automatic generator for NWC.
-j

Reply 2 offered by: Phan-Anh NGUYEN on 23-Dec-2001

Hi Joe. Thanks for your prompt reply. I am using the last version 11 of Band-in-a-Box and unfortunatly this feature is still missing ! - P.A.NGUYEN


#2336: playing a string of MIDI files
playing a string of MIDI files

(2336)

Submitted by: Francis Beaumier on 23-Dec-2001

I've got software that will play MIDI files in a row from a play list, but what I really want to do is to specify the files it can use and have it create a random order (and play the songs in that order). Does anyone know of a *free* program that will do this?

P. S. I know this is not about NWC, but it is atleast music related...

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Dec-2001

Many free players have a "shuffle" feature that will play your playlists in random order, including but not limited to Winamp and VanBasco Midi Player.

Cheers for the holidays,
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Francis Beaumier on 25-Dec-2001

Thank you. I choose choice B because I don't want to get involved in Winamp (for no real reason...:) Merry christmas!


#2337: version 2!
version 2!

(2337)

Submitted by: beeri on 23-Dec-2001

Is there any talk of a verion 2 of NWC coming out in the near future? or in the future at all?

One which will include the features of Finale but maintain the unbeatable NWC's ease-of-use?

Reply 1 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 24-Dec-2001

The topic arises from time to time. I don't speak for Noteworthy Software, but their policy has always been NOT to make advance announcements. Many other users agree with this.

Keep in mind that NWC is an affordable, easy-to-use, relatively small (byte size) program. The more features are added, the more it has the potential to become just like those other brand X programs. Many users, including myself, own or have access to one of the fancier programs on those rare occasions when we need it.

That said, there are a number of features that would (I believe) enhance the value of NWC without radically changing the nature of the program. This has also been discussed on many forum threads, and doubtless in the wish list. Among the more popular requests are N-tuplets (other than existing triplets), re-positionable slurs, and alternative notation fonts.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 24-Dec-2001

One other thing: I suspect that many NWC users are not taking full advantage of the program's capability to export placeable Windows metafiles (WMFs) from Print Preview. These can be placed into a word processing document. There, they can be cropped and re-sized. (Cropping can be used to eliminate excess staves or white space where you don't want them.) Pictures and text can be added. Or, a WMF (which is a vector drawing object) can be converted to a bitmap graphic image for display on a web page, using a free application such as Irfan View.

MS Word, and presumably other word processors, allow an imported WMF to float, so that it will superimpose with text or other items. Floating text boxes can also be created (be sure to use a transparent background for those, not a white background).

Reply 3 offered by: luis emiro  on 07-Jan-2002

no se nada de ingles solo español me gustaria que este programa estuviera en español paraque todospodamos disfrutar de este exelente programa

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 08-Jan-2002

I'm not good at español, but here is what I understand Luis wrote (in my poor english) :
''I do not know any english, only español; I'd like that this program would be in español for we all could enjoy this excellent software! ''

"Traduttore traditore" italian proverb says, I hope my translation is good enough though :) Punctuation is mine!


#2338: big band arranging
big band arranging

(2338)

Submitted by: alan stokes on 24-Dec-2001

as an ex - pro musician/arranger, I would like to try my hand at arranging for an electronic big band i.e:- 4 trumpets, 4 trombones, 5 saxes, piano, guitar, bass and drums. what software is available, which would generate realistic sounds of these instruments, and would allow me to input the musical parts for each instrument, and then hear the final result played? any suggestions?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 24-Dec-2001

Well, I think you've come to the right place. NoteWorthy Composer would fit your bill from a software standpoint.

As to the sound you get -- that depends on your hardware (and/or "firmware", i.e. soundfonts in the case of SBLive! etc. sound cards).
What other software is out there? Tons. Some of it very involved, some of it very limited. NoteWorthy Composer falls somewhere in the middle, combining a surprising versatility with an almost legendary ease of use.

Fred Nachbaur

Reply 2 offered by: Barry Graham on 25-Dec-2001

Alan,
Reply to the link above and let's set up a dialogue.

Reply 3 offered by: Bill McCance on 19-Jan-2002

I use noteworthy for arranging for concert bands and I too like a reasonably realistic voice for instruments. Most sound cards are designed with games in mind and therefore the authenticity of a sax or trumpet is not of the highest priority. There is some real serious hardware and software out there which unfortunately requires serious finance. I have made do with the Yamaha XG software. Whilst not brilliant it is an improvement on the bog standard soundcards. Let me know how you get on, I'd also be interested in seeing and hearing your arrangements.

Cheers,

Bill


#2339: Yamaha Motif 8
Yamaha Motif 8

(2339)

Submitted by: Mike on 25-Dec-2001

Does anyone know how to work the Motif 8? If so I was wondering how to play one of the programmed beats, along with playing something with the keyboard's Piano Setting?

Reply 1 offered by: Yamaha US on 09-Feb-2002

There is a whole web site devoted to support for the Motif. Go to www.motifator.com and you will find lots of information. In the Behind the manual section of that site there is a tutorial on how to use the preset patterns for writing your own songs.


#2340: how do i put an mp3 onto a cd?
how do i put an mp3 onto a cd?

(2340)

Submitted by: wilma on 26-Dec-2001

how do i put an mp3 file onto a cd? i have a cd burner. it writes at 24x rewrites at 10x and reads at 40x. please help me, do i need special software?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Dec-2001

Your CD burner should have come with all the necessary software, usually Adaptec's "Easy CD". Drag 'n' drop your mp3 files in the Create Audio CD window, set your options, and burn away!

Cheers,
Fred


#2341: radio shack midi keyboard HELP!
radio shack midi keyboard HELP!

(2341)

Submitted by: benji on 26-Dec-2001

I have a Radio Shack MD-1160 Midi capaple keyboard, and I can't get it to work on NoteWorthy composer... or another sequencer/composer for that matter. Please help me! I have a cable, and it's hooked up... I can't find anything wrong... but I know something isn't right! Help!

benji

Reply 1 offered by: Keith Sheasley on 26-Dec-2001

Benji - If it doesn't work at all, start with the basics. Remember that Midi-IN at the computer connects to Midi-OUT at the keyboard - Midi-OUT at the computer connects to Midi-IN at the keyboard. Also, in NWC, check Tools/Options/Midi and Tools/Options/Record to be sure you've selected the right device.

Hope this helps,
Keith

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Dec-2001

From looking over the manual, I see that your keyboard has an on board synthesizer. Since your keyboard has an "on board" synth, focus on getting your computer to be able to trigger the keyboard from the computer, via MIDI out, before working on anything else.

- First, connect the cables. Follow the instructions in the "MAKING THE MIDI CONNECTIONS" section of your manual.

- Second, select the correct external MIDI device for play back in NWC. This is set up from Tools | Options | Midi | Devices used by play back (select an use only one device at a time while you are setting up).

- If this fails, you will need to diagnose your problem (See msg #1856 (reply 1)). Search for past threads to see how others have solved problems.

Reply 3 offered by: benji on 27-Dec-2001

well, i looked at my cable, and it doesn't have the in/out on the computer end of the cord, but a 15 (i think) prong connecter for the sound card. It also has something that attaches into the joystick controller on the sound card attached to it. I don't have anything to plug that into. I shouldn't think I would need one, but just making sure.

benji

Reply 4 offered by: Joy Byford on 27-Dec-2001

This sounds like my own connector cable. The spare connector at the computer end is to plug a joystick into if you wanted to use one at the same time as your midi cable was plugged into the joystick port on the soundcard - so you are right that it is not necessary to connect that bit. The midi in/out confusion usually happens at the end you plug the leads into the keyboard - do try swopping them round to see if it makes a difference, even if you THINK you've done it right.
This helped me, I hope it may help you too.
Joy

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 27-Dec-2001

Correct. The in/out MIDI connectors are for the keyboard end.

Reply 6 offered by: Benji on 08-Jan-2002

What do you mean trigger the keyboard from the computer. I get the idea of what you mean, but how do I go about doing that? Thanks for the help.

Benji

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Jan-2002

If your keyboard has on-board synthesis, NWC can "play" the keyboard from the computer via the MIDI interface between the two. You need to:

- connect the correct cables in the correct way
- select the correct MIDI Out device in NWC that designates that MIDI output to your keyboard
- you need to make sure that device is selected for each staff in Staff Properties | Midi | Play back device

Reply 8 offered by: Benji on 10-Jan-2002

Well, I get that. What I'm trying to ask is what to do once inside the NoteWorthy program, how to "play the keyboard". Is there a special button, or am I just ignorant... or blind? Thanks for ALL of your help.

Benji

Reply 9 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 10-Jan-2002

I do not know what you mean by your "play the keyboard" question.

Reply 10 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jan-2002

The only "button" in NoteWorthy Composer the determines your playback device is in Tools -> Options -> Midi. The device(s) listed in the right pane will be the available devices. You can use the left-right buttons to add/remove devices. Normally you should only have one entry in this pane; however, more than one are allowed. You can then specify on a per-staff basis which device each staff uses. This will then be in Staff Properties -> Midi tab, Playback Device pulldown. Just be careful about publishing sequences that use more than one device, as not everyone will have more than one device available.

Hope this helps.
Fred


#2342: S--- vs. F---- vs. NWC et. al.
S--- vs. F---- vs. NWC et. al.

(2342)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 27-Dec-2001

The New York Times has published an article by Marcia Biederman, on the subject of S--- v. F--- music notation software. It is a general discussion, not a technical review. The article mentions that there are other program available in a lower price range, but does not mention what they are. I read the NY Times article re-printed in one of my local papers, in California.

This might be a good time for you various NWC enthusiasts to see if the article has been re-printed in your area; if so, let the newspaper know that there are alternatives.

Reply 1 offered by: C. R. Lim on 30-Dec-2001

There is currently a discussion along these lines on the rec.music.classical newsgroup. Not a usual topic for this forum. I've added my 0.02€ worth ........

Bob

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 30-Dec-2001

Ah, I should have been more explicit in my first message.

Although the NY Times is not what I would call "family" newspaper, the reprint was in the computing and technology section of a widely-read "family" regional newspaper. The readers of that reprint would be a mix of computer-savvy (not musically savvy, necessarily) individuals, and clueless persons who perhpas have a home computer but don't know what to do with it. There is little likelihood that any of them would tune into to a musician's newsgroup or discussion forum.

Reply 3 offered by: C. R. Lim on 31-Dec-2001

I wasn't implying any connection, though come to think of it, the original post in r.m.c. may have been prompted by the NYT article. I just thought it interesting that here was *another* opportunity for getting NWC mentioned :-)

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 03-Jan-2002

Do you know where we could read (electronically) this discussion?
Yet I only found this (from there )

Having read what I saw, I'll kkep on using NWC !!!

Happy new year and euro to all,
NWCly yours,
Dominique


#2343: Digital Ear
Digital Ear

(2343)

Submitted by: Jean Cifrane on 27-Dec-2001

I have seen on Simtel announcement of "digital ear" that say
that it can transform AUDIO to MIDI with good quality.
Look at http://www.simtel.net/pub/pd/55886.shtml
http://www.simtel.net/pub/pd/55886.shtml
Does some one with more knowledge than me as tested it?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Dec-2001

Yes, I've tried that one -- along with several others. It does work, to a degree, and might be useful for creating midis from relatively simple and clean input waves.

Digital Ear is better than some of them, in that it also "imports" dynamics and volume changes. The drawback is that the resulting midi can be very "busy", albeit somewhat more accurate than most of the simpler programs.

However, its best use (and the same goes for the others I've tried) is as a random-tone midi generator to give ideas for avant-garde aleatoric compositions. ;-)

Fred


#2344: recording sound  from Media Player
recording sound  from Media Player

(2344)

Submitted by: peti on 27-Dec-2001

I would like to record the sound played (stream) by Media Player. Could anybody help with a suggestion?
Thank you very much
and have a
Happy New Year.

Reply 1 offered by: Henry Robertson on 29-Dec-2001

I dunno about ALL types of Media Player output, but Windows media player will make you a nice .wma file from a CD track by hitting the CD Audio button on the left side of the fully open player and then the Copy Music button at the top. Hope that helps a bit.

Have fun
The Shadow

Reply 2 offered by: peti on 29-Dec-2001

Hi Shadow, and TK for your advice. It does work...
i actually wanted to record the sound played on Media Player from a radio station for example. i would appreciate your thought on this.

Regards,
Peti

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 29-Dec-2001

If you have a full duplex soundcard, you can select the recording source as wave, open your favourite sound recorder along with win mp and record while playing.

That's what I do and it works. If your device allows, record in 48 kHz.

Hth,
Ertugrul


#2345: two or more instruments playing in unison
two or more instruments playing in unison

(2345)

Submitted by: jlenzner on 27-Dec-2001

When two or more insruments (each on their own staffs) are notated to play the same note in unison only one instrument plays back.The others are cancelled out. I was told that this is a limitation of my sound card.Can anyone recommend sound cards that do not have this limitation?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 27-Dec-2001

Just about every synthesizer will do this, at least to some degree. The reason is that you're using the same sound patch, starting at almost the same time, therefore the same waveform is added to itself. In "real" instruments, there will always be minor differences between instruments playing unison, which the ear can discern and therefore identify two instruments.

Whether the waves from your sound card cancel or reinforce will depend partly on the pitch; this is because even though two midi events at the same time *appear* to be simultaneous, they're not really; there will be a slight time delay between them because midi is a serial protocol.

So much for the academic aspect. You can improve the sound of your unisons using one or more of the following techniques:

1) use a different sound patch, if available and appropriate, for the two voices. E.g. Grand Piano and Bright Piano, or String Ensemble 1 and String Ensemble 2, etc. Or use a different patch bank, set for a different soundfont (SBLive! users mainly, but might be a useful technique for other hardware setups also.)

2) put a slight pitch bend on one or both voices. E.g. put about +200 on one voice, and -200 on the other.

2a) pan the two voices left and right of center (only really effective when used in conjunction with the pitch-bend trick, since otherwise the unison will just appear to come from center-channel.)

3) Mute one of the unisons (e.g. by using the volume controller set to 0) and make the other one correspondingly louder. (Don't forget to restore the volume after the end of the muted note.)

HTH

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: jlenzner on 28-Dec-2001

Fred,

Thanks for the info. I'll try your suggestions.

Jack


#2346: File Conversion
File Conversion

(2346)

Submitted by: Henry Robertson on 28-Dec-2001

Hi guys, I know this subject has been hashed over before, but bear with me (and don't hit me with any large ugly sticks, please). I have some CD music that I have been assured by several music store people has never been printed in sheet form. Naturally I would like to have it in this form. Now I know that the Windows Media Player will make me a nice .WMA file from the track and I found a very nice program at downloads.com called dBpowerAMP that will rip the track and make a very nice sounding .mp3 file or a .wav file or will convert one to the other. I have seen oodles and gobs of questions dealing with converting NWC files to MIDI and other file types. Still with me? Ok, good. Now to the meat and potatoes of this bit. Has anyone found any software that will take a .wma file or a .wav (yeah, yeah, I know, you can't get there from here) file or an .mp3 file or any other type (except MIDI of course, if I could get there, I could get to NWC) and turn it into something that Noteworthy Composer can recognize?

Thanx and keep up the good work.
The Shadow

Reply 1 offered by: Patrick O'Clock on 29-Dec-2001

As someone said, that's "trying to convert a hamburger back to a cow".

LOL!

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 29-Dec-2001

Wav to midi phenomenon has been discussed on this forum several times. To sum up:

Midi is a set of commands that lead the soundcard to produce sounds in particular quantitive attributes. For instance, "play a C5 semiquaver in crotchet=120bpm, using patch #3, on channel 14, volume=127..."

A wave file, on the other hand, is a digitised sound data.

Converting a wav to midi efficiently will require superb artificial intelligence, more than Kubrick can imagine!

There are, however, some expensive software packeges that *claim* to be able to convert wav to midi. Never pay them a penny! ;)

Hth,
Ertugrul

Reply 3 offered by: Henry Robertson on 30-Dec-2001

Thanks guys, I was afraid of something like that.
Ah well, back to the drawing board.

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 30-Dec-2001

Yeah, sorry Henry. It would be nice...

But, believe it or not, you already have "superb artificial intelligence, more than Kubrick can imagine" at your disposal. And it's free. It's that incredible machine we call the human brain. It just needs to be trained, and it's top-notch ear-training to work out what's happening in a piece of music and transcribe it to NWC. Hint: start with an easy one, and work your way up from there.

Good luck, and above all have fun with it!

Fred

Reply 5 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 01-Jan-2002

Fred's reply reminds me...

I sing in a choir. From time to time, another member of the Bass section (who is a much better singer than I) complains to me, "Can't you read music?"

My reply is, "Of course I can read music. This note is C# of eigth duration. That note is E of quarter duration."

What he means to ask is, "Can't you SING what you READ?"

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 01-Jan-2002

Robert Allgeyer wrote in msg #2346 (reply 2):
> I sing in a choir...

And you often claim not being a musician.

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 02-Jan-2002

> My claim of not being a musician.

Actually, I do claim to be a musician, by virtue of singing in a choir.

Alas, it is the other members of the choir who dispute my claim. I am merely conceding the point to the majority!

Reply 8 offered by: Geoff Walker on 02-Jan-2002

Henry,

If after listening to a track a few times, you can whistle, hum or play the melody on your favourite instrument, then you are half way to being able to transcribe it. It's not easy and takes time and many, many playings of the track to ensure you have it just right. However, it is the most reliable and accurate method. If you have a really good ear, you might even be able to extract the harmonies - I'm afraid I can't and usually have to then work them out after taking down the melody.

Good Luck

Geoff

Reply 9 offered by: Henry Robertson on 02-Jan-2002

Thanx again for all the comments guys.
I have arrived at the conclusion that there isn't yet a method of 'turning the hamburger back into the cow' (grin).

I found a couple of programs on download.com the claimed to convert .wav files into .midi files, they were freeware so I tried them. Welllll...... to make a long story short, Conway Twitty's "Tight Fittin' Jeans" came out the other end of the tunnel sounding like "Kitten On The Keys". (In C# Major no less) LOL.

I deeply appreciate all the comments and wisdom shown by everyone at this Forum.

We now return you to your regular programming.

The Shadow.

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 03-Jan-2002

Geoff's remark made me think of this:
nowadays NO program is able to transform complex sound (wave multi-timbral and/or polyphonic) into "simple" midi events.
BUT some of them can do it with one single instrument playing only one note at a time. Such as you singing with your own voice.

So if you're not (yet ;) trained to notate what you hear (reverse part of "can't you sing what you read?" ;), you can listen to your CD with headphones, and record on your PC (in WAV) what you SING along... Then a program (for example, look at msg #995 ) could transform your output (or input?? I'm lost here) into MIDI.
Of course you'll have to do it with each "voice" you'll identify on the music you listen to!! This is anyway a good training for listening music and learning polyphony :)

Notating by ear (and NWC) is not as difficult as it may seem first. I did it with a 4 voice choir (Absalon fili mi) and got it right finally! (or _NWCly_ should I say). Playing the score along with the CD is of good help either.

Hope this helps !


#2347: my great idea
my great idea

(2347)

Submitted by: preiszner on 29-Dec-2001

Hi All,
I have a dream about a collection of wonderful pieces written on one musical theme by lot of composer.
I`ve started to realize my dream on my homepage. (Compose Together Variations)If somodody belive that it could be a good game, and want to help me, please visit my website for the details:
http://preiszner.tripod.com/preiszner/id7.html
I hope that we will have a good fun!
Happy new year to Everybody!

Miklós

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 03-Jan-2002

It seems interesting :)
Maybe you could define two types of themes : one "easy" for non-trained composers, and another a bit more complex for advanced composers. Though your theme with 4 notes can be developped very "far" (such as the B-A-C-H(Bb) signature, or in the Musikalisches Opfer (Musical Offering))

Did you mention it on the NWC NG? I know people there who can be interested :)

Happy new musical year!

Reply 2 offered by: Preiszner Miklós on 03-Jan-2002

Hello Marsu,
You are absolutely right. Now I see that "theme" is a very coplex idea. I`ve decided to separete themes at least two category: well-known calssical theme, never-heard new theme. I agree with you, but can you write me what do you think about,what kind of themes could be easy? (for example - IMHO - to compose a piece on a famous clasiccal theme is much more harder than on a new theme)
I am sure that there will be more "winner" theme.
Thank you for your comment!! I will think about your though. Please write me anytime if you have any other comment!
Thank you again!
Happy New Year!!

Miklós

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 03-Jan-2002

Pedantically, BACH is Bb A C B ;-)

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 03-Jan-2002

Oops!! You're right Peter, it's not B that is B, it's H :)

About themes, Miklós, in fact a "well known" them *may* be used more easily. For ex., refer at "Mica Mica parva stella" (in latin), aka "twinkle twinkle little star", aka (in french) "Ah! vous dirais-je, Maman", on which Mozart (W.A.) did a lot of brilliant variations for piano (I never could go further than 3rd var.).
IMHO, for fuga variations, the shorter the theme, the easiest to play with.

the sole limits are the personal ones :)

Reply 5 offered by: Preiszner Miklós on 03-Jan-2002

You are right, Marsu. You`ve convinced me. The variability of a theme is not depends on that how known it. The variability maybe depends on the charachteristic parts of the theme, the less the better.
Your though about the fuga variations is very valuable. Maybe I should make a separated section for contrapunctal themes. (there will be more cathegory than theme:)

Miklós

Reply 6 offered by: Grant on 04-Jan-2002

Miklós, I visited your site last night and looked at the themes posted so far. I think there's a useful distinction to be made between themes and motives. For example, I would call the "BACH" a motive, not a theme, and I would have a hard time coming up with a way to write a "variation" on it. For example, you could call "HACB" a variation on "BACH", but this doesn't take you very far. To make a piece out of this, you could extend it by adding further variations on the motive, but now you're developing, not varying. (It's hard to imagine calling the first movement of Beethoven's 5th a set of variations on da-da-da-DUM.)

The traditional set of variations has as its theme a fully developed melody, generally in the form of a complete period, that contains enough interesting features so that some can be held more or less constant (so that variations can be recognized as being related to the theme) and some can be changed. Which features are held constant and which are changed in each variation is the choice of the composer, but in general there can't be so few that the variations can no longer be related back to the theme. Take a look at any of the great variation sets and you'll see that their themes are fully developed in this way: for example, see Bach's "Goldberg" Variations; Mozart's K. 331, 1st movement; Beethoven's "Eroica" and "Diabelli" Variations; Brahms's "Handel" and "Haydn" Variations; and so on.

(One exception to the above is the Passacaglia or Chaconne type of continuous variations, where the variations take place in the context of a continuously repeating bass line or harmonic pattern which is often only a few measures long. But you're not proposing that we write variations of this type.)

Of the 5 themes currently posted on your site, I would say that only #1 fits the model of the "traditional" theme for variations. #3 and #4 are, I think, just marginally long enough to make a successful set of variations out of (although I love the Bartók excerpt and have considered in the past using this for a set of variations of my own). On the other hand, #2 and #5 are IMHO much too short for variations - though obviously they're prime candidates for development.

Reply 7 offered by: Preiszner Miklós on 05-Jan-2002

Hello Grant,
Thank`s for your really considered comments, it is very useful for me. I see that I`ve drafted my idea in a wrong way, beacause I didn`t want to develop a "classical variation serie", my only idea was lot of muisic on one musical "though". This though could be a classical period (and we can make real variations on it)or just some note that we can`t vary, that only can inspire us to develop longer though from it, or I think - in an extreme situation - the "papapa pam" from the 5th can be a though for us for make music on it. So, thank you for noticed me, beacause I`ve used "variation" expression very misunderstandable way. I am sure that I will separete "themes" to two cathegory: "short musical thoughs, mottos" and "periods, full melodies". The first cathegory is for contrapunctal works (fuga, passacaglia bass etc...)the second for "variations" (in classical meaning)
Any comments, about it?
It was a good idea, to write to this forum!:)
Thank you!

Miklós

Reply 8 offered by: Grant on 05-Jan-2002

Thanks for clearing this up, Miklós. Even if you are guilty of drafting your idea in the wrong way, I suspect I'm just as guilty of misinterpreting what you wrote based on my own assumptions about the word "variations". In any event, I'm certainly familiar with the idea of a set of pieces based on the same short musical "germ" (see my "Little Star" Suite on the Scriptorium, which is a set of 5 short pieces -- NOT "variations" -- all based on the head motive of "Twinkle, Twinkle Little Star").

(Vaughan Williams used the term "variants" for one of his works, indicating that it wasn't intended to be a set of formal variations. This might be a useful term to use in this context.)

Do you anticipate choosing two themes for the project, one from the "melody" class and one from the "motive" class? Or will there after all be just one theme chosen?

Reply 9 offered by: Preiszner Miklós on 07-Jan-2002

Hello Grant,
Of course there will be two winners. One-one from both cathegory. Thanks for noticed me! I`ve fixed it on my page.
You`ve helped me a lot!! Thank you! (your "Little star" quartet is wonderful, I especially appreciated the french style Overture and the fugue with that nice augmentation at the and)

Miklós

Reply 10 offered by: Grant on 07-Jan-2002

I'm glad to help. (And thank you for your kind comments on the Suite. It's always nice to hear appreciative words from a discerning listener.)


#2348: Recording to CD
Recording to CD

(2348)

Submitted by: bob Howard on 30-Dec-2001

I want to know if it is possible to record my composition direct from Notworthy to rewritable CD. Can anyone help please?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 03-Jan-2002

Not sure of what you mean.
If you want to save your NWC files directly (as FILES) on a CD-RW support, it can be done as on any magnetic media if your CD-RW is formatted as a re-writable media.

If you mean recording it as an AUDIO track, it can be done as if it was on a CD-R. But you have to know that many CD-readers cannot read CD-RW media --it's not related to the format, but to the reflection/color of the disk itself.

BTW, I didn't try myself to record audio tracks on a RW, not (yet) being sure to re-use the RW support; theoritically, it should be feasible anyway, so I'll try it some day :)

If I did not answer to your question, could you please ask it again more "detailed" ?


#2349: Instrumental Solos
Instrumental Solos

(2349)

Submitted by: H. Rodriguez on 30-Dec-2001

While writing a piece for say "Jazz Ensemble", how do I indicate to other band members 1. continue playing the designated measures as a continuous loop during a single instrument solo, 2. solo is about to end and other instruments re-enter at a bridge or coda???

Reply 1 offered by: Barry Graham on 30-Dec-2001

Q1. Place the loop section in a Local Repeat.
Mark with text "Repeat (under solo) until directed".
(assumimg it's an 'open' solo).
Q2. The following section could be marked "Play when directed" or "on stick".


#2350: having a song ascend as it is repeated
having a song ascend as it is repeated

(2350)

Submitted by: Francis Beaumier on 31-Dec-2001

Is there any way to have a song repeat x number of times (well I guess that parts easy) with the trasposition going up chromatically each time. i.e. it gets higher and higher until glass shatters when you try to sing it :)

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Dec-2001

You can do this only within limits - the limits being the default pitch-bend range as defined in midi. You can modulate up (or down) one semitone at a time by using special endings, each of which contains an appropriate pitch-bend instruction on each channel (usually but not always this means one on each staff).

At the beginning, set pitch bend to -2 semitones (-8191). First special ending set it to -1 semitone (-4096), second ending to 0 (0), third ending to +1 semitone (+4096), and fourth ending to +2 semitones (+8191).

Probably won't shatter glass, but it might stretch a few vocal cords as you're singing along, especially if the first time through is already near your limit. ;-)

Fred


#2351: Converting A WAV Into A MIDI
Converting A WAV Into A MIDI

(2351)

Submitted by: Dan Winkler on 01-Jan-2002

How Do You Convert A WAV Into A MIDI? i heard that CDs use MIDI files And I would Like To Take Some OF My Music For My CD player. I HAve A Couple WAV File THat I Need Converted Into MIDIs. I Am thankful for any feedback

-Dan

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Jan-2002

One more time. You can't. Do a forum search on this topic, if you want to know why in gory detail. (Gory because, as someone pointed out, it's like converting a hamburger into a cow.)

Fred Nachbaur

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Jan-2002

Reading this again... you can't convert a wav into a midi, but you can burn a wav onto CD. (Whoever told you that audio CDs use the midi format had it all wrong.)

All you need is the software that came with your CD burner, usually "Easy CD" by Adaptec.

Reply 3 offered by: Henry Robertson on 02-Jan-2002

Sorry Dan, apparently can't be done with todays technology. I just went through the same question, scroll down and read the thread "File Conversion".

Good luck
The Shadow

Reply 4 offered by: Dan Winkler on 02-Jan-2002

Thanks Fred,Henry. I guess I Cant. But Now I Know That I Can Burn My Wavs Strait Into My CDs! Thanks, Dan

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Bubar on 23-Jan-2002

That is not entirely accurate. There are numerous programs that can (will try anyway) to convert your wav file into midi. The best freeware wav to midi converter is ScoreExtractor 1.0 by Roman Yakimenko, nut it has many faults.

If you are willing to pay $80US for a higher quality program, you may want to consider Digital Ear 4.0 by Epinoisis Software. One conversion and you'll agree that this is truly great software. If you plan to do alot of wav to midi work, this is for you.

There are plenty of other programs that do the same job:
-Intelliscore Polyphonic 4.0
-AmazingMIDI 1.60
-AKoff Music Composer 2.0

Good Luck.

Reply 6 offered by: Marsu on 23-Jan-2002

Well, the place where I found the most detailed explanations is the the official AMM FAQ, and for the subject of this thread, go directly to the 2.07 paragrah ...

STH !

Reply 7 offered by: Stephen Randall on 24-Jan-2002

What a useful reference. It's a pity NWC doesn't get a mention in the list of notation processors.

Stephen

Reply 8 offered by: Barry Graham on 24-Jan-2002

Steve:

If you send a note to Jim Higgins at the FAQ I'm sure he would add NWC to the list.


#2352: Newsgroup problems
Newsgroup problems

(2352)

Submitted by: C. R. Lim on 02-Jan-2002

Maybe it's my newsreader, but all messages after 3 Dec. appear to have been deleted. When I try to post I get an error 441 "Article rejected"
Happy New Year anyway,

Bob

Reply 1 offered by: Richard Woodroffe on 02-Jan-2002

And I thought it was just me.

Seems there is a problem then

Rich.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Jan-2002

Yes, it actually started last night (about 10:00 PST Jan. 1st). It's odd in that messages for the last few weeks have been deleted, but older messages are still accessible.

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: Preiszner Miklós on 02-Jan-2002

I can`t post to the NG, and I can`t read new messages. Can somebody know about the causes?
In another hand, Happy New Year to everybody!:))

Miklós

Reply 4 offered by: Geoff Walker on 02-Jan-2002

There's something odd happening. There are no messages to download, but messages from the last three weeks or so are suddenly marked as unread. I can't post either.

Geoff

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Jan-2002

It appears to be fixed now (14:30 PST, 2 Jan 02). However, the server has apparently refreshed the recent entries, so they'll probably show up as unread in your news readers.

Fred

Reply 6 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 02-Jan-2002

I'm afraid I missed the entire party this time <g>


#2353: Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC
Upcoming new music font for SATB in NWC

(2353)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 02-Jan-2002

In a few weeks I may have some spare time that I intend to use as follows: My main use of NWC is to print SATB choir music. I would like to create another font that can be used as "text" within NWC to achieve some effects not otherwise available (or hard to do). No promises! I may or may not find the time.

Since the font is primarily for my own use, I already know what will be in it: (1) A variety of "tilted" slurs, of going up or down from one position to an octave, curved upwards or downwards, at several lengths; (2) Some "dotted" ties, used when there are a different number of syllable per lyric line; (2) Pre-made "reminder" accidentals in parentheses; (3) Pre-made notes slightly smaller than regular NWC notes, but bigger than grace notes; (4) A few pre-made X-head notes for spoken word; (5) A few multi-measure rests.

There may be a few spare code positions left over. Do any of you have a suggestion as to what I would put there? Let me know by E-mail: ra849-at-icogitate-dot-com (decode to reply). Expiration date: January 15, 2001.

Please limit suggestions to those useful in SATB choral, not otherwise available in other NWC user fonts.

Reply 1 offered by: Francis Beaumier on 02-Jan-2002

How about notes like |O| which come up in chant like songs.

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 02-Jan-2002

Yes, that's part of my original plan. Single and double bard around the whole note.

Reply 3 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 02-Jan-2002

Robert Allgeyer wrote in msg #2153:
> Expiration date: January 15, 2001

Isn't it too late to announce? ;~)

Reply 4 offered by: C. R. Lim on 03-Jan-2002

One for the wish list to Eric: Some tenor parts use a double treble clef (that sounds weird, doesn't it?).
I can't think of any kind of workaround for this which would print and play correctly.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 03-Jan-2002

supposing it's for 15/01/2002 :)
For ||o|| notes, it's already present in the boxmarks font, or in boxmark2. If you want |o| note, please tell me.

Current version of boxmark2 beta (with a .nwc example) is at http://www.multimania.com/madmarsu/Nwc/boxmark2.zip
More details WILL be available in the boxmark2 page :)

What is a "double treble clef"?

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 03-Jan-2002

Is January 15, 2001 too late to announce? Hah! Not for me! While mere computer geeks may have had a Y2K problem, sophisticated musicians have a Y2K+2 problem! Thanks for pointing this out, my friend in Istanbul.

I'm not sure what a double-treble clef is. Any example on-line of artwork that I can look at?

Keep those comments coming.

Reply 7 offered by: Peter Edwards on 03-Jan-2002

A double treble clef is just two single ones side by side, but it's rare to find it in modern typography.

I you want to use it then it is easy enough to put it on the first system (just type a treble clef twice) but I can't see how to replicate it on subsequent systems :-( except by doing it the hard way.

Peter

Reply 8 offered by: marsu on 03-Jan-2002

Peter, your explanation on how it looks is clear.
the reason why someone invented it, I have no clue, especially if the notes are read the same (2nd line is still a G I suppose). The usual G clef 8lower is good enough, so unless you want to print an already existing score, I don't see the need.
Is it used on ancient music only?

Reply 9 offered by: Grant on 03-Jan-2002

The double treble clef is identical in function to the treble clef with hanging '8', but in my experience the double clef is much, much rarer. I've personally only seen it in very old (100+ years) scores; modern ones always have the hanging '8' clef.

There's a third equivalent clef that looks like a combination of the standard treble clef and a C clef centered on the third space; I've only seen this in French scores (e.g., IIRC, the Duruflé Requiem, published by Durand).

Since all of these clefs mean exactly the same thing, I don't see any reason that music with either the old double treble clef or the combination treble/C clef couldn't and shouldn't be transcribed using the equivalent hanging '8' treble clef that NWC provides and that (AFAIK) all tenors know how to read.

Reply 10 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 04-Jan-2002

Useful or not, specialized clefs would not be suitable for a text font, since they would not be automatically printed on each system. But you knew that!

Reply 11 offered by: Grant on 04-Jan-2002

I think that depends. A number of text items are sensitive to the placement of system breaks, but that doesn't make them unusable. I'm thinking, for example, of long hairpins in the Crecendo font, which have to be broken into two short hairpins if they happen to cross a system break. Once you're doing this degree of print formatting, it's not much more difficult to determine where the breaks fall and then insert text clefs in the appropriate places.

However, having said this I'll stick to my previously expressed opinion, which is that special octave-lower treble clefs aren't really necessary (unless for some reason one is aiming to reproduce the exact look of a score that uses them, in which case NWC is probably not the right tool in the first place).

Reply 12 offered by: Francis Beaumier on 06-Jan-2002

>While mere computer geeks may have had a Y2K problem, sophisticated musicians have a Y2K+2 problem!

Well actually, Y2K refers to the series of problems that were supposed to happen in 2000 and beyond. I guess this was one of the ;-)

Reply 13 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Jan-2002

Ah, I found the correct message thread, this time!

This is the font that I will start to work on, January 21, 2002. Last chance for suggestions!

Reply 14 offered by: marsu on 21-Jan-2002

Well, this is just to say that I've added "reversed" (I mean upside down) clefs in current beta of boxmark2. So there is no need to include them to your font, if you intended to do so.

I'll soon give more details on *new* beta of boxmark2, anyway (it's not yet on the scripto).

Bon courage for the font generation process :)
BTW, which software do you use for this?

P.S. I can send you the current beta, but I don't have your mail. Please send it to me at marsu@europe.com if interested ;)

Reply 15 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 21-Jan-2002

Thanks, Marsu. You found my correct E-mail.

Why use an upside-down clef??? Never mind, it's probably some musical style that I can't sing, unless I am standing on my head!

For all who are curious: I use "Typetool," a light font editor by the folks who make FontLab. It does some things, doesn't do others. But it will create a TT font, if you do not need professional results (professional fonts have more extensive hinting, and possibly bitmap inclusion for small point sizes). I understand that most current work in fonts is in 2-byte unicode, which TypeTool cannot do.

A good idea is to get the "Font properties editor" for Windows from the Microsoft web site. This allows you to enter a lot more information in the font's properties. For example, you could enter the purpose of the font, or how to use it.

I expect that my new slur font will be done in a few days.

Reply 16 offered by: marsu on 22-Jan-2002

The upside-down clefs were included for people like australians (for me) who live in the other hemisphere :^)

More seriously, it was included to allow some "special" music sheet such a Mozart's work that you can play with the score upside down. (you'll have to enter the key signature by hand though, even if I have also included the bemol (plus natural and sharp, which was not needed indeed) in the font either, they can not be placed automatically at the end of the staves (which is the beginning, in upside-down presentation).

Oh, I couldn't resist to add this: you're talking of the "Font properties editor" for Windows, by µ$. But do they mention somewhere that TrueType font was invented by Apple, and that windows 3.1x would never have been what it was without this new format of font?? In a programmer book they wrote, they intensively talk about all the advantages it has, why windows is now so quick and flexible for wysiwyg (sic), but only at the end of that book do they mention that TT fonts were made available thanks to Apple... well, let's say it was fair enough from µ$ to mention it once :)

PS. Typetool is visible at http://www.fontlab.com/html/typetool.html (USD 99).
P.P.S Do not buy TransType if you want to make fonts for Mac, too. Get TTConvert, freeware (on macintosh): go and read the interesting page of ebionite:
http://members.tripod.com/~ebionite/fonts.htm

HTH!

Reply 17 offered by: Barry Graham on 22-Jan-2002

"The upside-down clefs were included for people like australians (for me) who live in the other hemisphere :^)"

That's only because you believe you live in a right hand rule universe.
I live in a left hand rule universe - it is you who is upside down! ;)

Reply 18 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 22-Jan-2002

I sing Bass. But with an upside-down clef, I can sing Mozart's music Bass-ackwards!

Reply 19 offered by: marsu on 23-Jan-2002

Oh, Barry!! Telling me that I'm living in a right-hand rule universe is ALAS so true... Because I'm left-handed, and 'tis each day that I can see this world is made by/for right-handed persons!!!

Except the Command-C/Command-V (oops, Ctrl-C on a PC), which is much easier for left-handed persons (not to mention the Alt+F4 which is contrary to elementary rules of type-writing)...
Finally, being a left-handed person is not so bad provided you leave the mouse to the right of the kbd: most of the quick-keys are made with the left hand :^P

Well, what about to leave France and go southern?..

Oh, btw, who think that W.A.Mozart was also a left-handed person?? He was told to have a "diabolic" left hand for it was rather difficult for pianists... Personnally I think that it's typical for a left-handed person. I always found annoying the left-hand parts on a piano (well, at least for the first beginning years).

Being a contra-bass singer, if I sing upside-down I go back in the past, when I was a contra-soprano child. Thanks Mozart!

Reply 20 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 27-Jan-2002

Here is a beta test version of the font, for experienced NWC users only:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849/fonts/NWslur-betatest.zip

I expect to have it finalized in a few days. Meanwhile, any comments?

Reply 21 offered by: Robert "the font is done" Allgeyer on 30-Jan-2002

The NWslurs font is now posted on the Scriptorium.

Reply 22 offered by: Peter Edwards on 31-Jan-2002

Very good, particularly the upside down pause, but a few points to query:

Would it be possible to make the space character smaller so that it could be used for fine tuning character spacing.

Could the accidentals have a bit of trailing space so that they sit more naturally (sorry) before the note.

I like the 75% characters, but could you include clefs too so that clef changes (always notated at a smaller size) can be accommodated.

***********

As always with add-on fonts, it does result in non-portable files, and we are running out of user fonts once we've loaded NWCV15, Boxmark2, Crescendo and NWSlur. There are vast acres of space inside NWCV15 that could be used for the fixed characters/symbols at minimal effort, and those of variable length (crescendos etc) are surely ripe for development as drawn objects. One can only live in hope!

Peter

Reply 23 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 31-Jan-2002

Peter:

I will post a slightly-revised version of the font in the near future (the font file has a version number, so you will be able to tell which is which).

(1) Smaller space: Rather than change the existing space, I will add a reduced-size space at another code location. There are a couple of unused locations that I reserved for just such afterthoughts.

(2) Accidental space before notes: Yes, to be adjusted.

(3) Reduced-size clefs: If there are enough code positions left, yes. Meanwhile, you could use the font at different point sizes.

As for portability, that is necessarily a problem whenever non-platform fonts are used in any application. My fonts, besides being free, are embeddable in PDF or word processor documents that support embedding. The NWslurs font is intended for occasional use when you need to print something immediately (I will use it for SATB hymns).

Reply 24 offered by: Peter Edwards on 31-Jan-2002

Thanks for prompt response.

A possible problem with a small space (especially in Character Map utilities such as 'Typecase which I had not come across before) is being able to find it - by its very nature you can't see it!

Yes certainly one can use fonts at different sizes, but this uses up a precious user font. Hence my earlier final point about fonts in general. cetainly you can embed these in some programs, but not in an NWC file, and hence my request for an enhancement, either to be able to embed font files (particularly in the Browser Plugin), or that NWC addresses the problem directly. In the meantime your fonts are very welcome and solve some otherwise intractable problems.

A hint to users if I may. To hide a slur, tie a slurred hidden grace note to the front of the first note. Then you can pop in one of Robert's improvements.

[BTW this technique can also be used to lengthen the playback of staccato notes - a side effect, I believe, already posted to the Newsgroup by Fred]

Peter

Reply 25 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 31-Jan-2002

> [BTW this technique can also be used to lengthen the playback
> of staccato notes - a side effect, I believe, already posted
> to the Newsgroup by Fred]

Indeed. And discovered by Peter -- just to be perfectly clear about giving credit where due.

Fred

Reply 26 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 31-Jan-2002

I just submitted version 1.02 of the font to the Scriptorium (look for it in a couple of days). I added a micro-space at the letter "t". I also made some adjustment to the cursor width on the accidentals, but you need to read the instructions (accompanies the font) for best results.

For reasons of vertical scaling, I was not able to include properly-sized clefs. You can always get them from NWCV15 defined as a user font.

If anyone else has more suggestions for this particular font, keep them bottled for awhile, as I don't have more time to work on it.

Reply 27 offered by: marsu on 01-Feb-2002

Robert,

thank you very much for the new font.
However, some characters are redondant with some other fonts; it may be a good thing (only one font to include), but may be what a pity not to coordinate all these efforts in new fonts! the "p" character (upside down pause) was already in boxmark2, as well as the double-whole (the one with double bars).
It would be a good thing to have one place to coordiante all of this, what do you think of this? Since it seems many (well, some) of us have the ability to create fonts, which gives many new possibilities to the users :^)

Fontly yours,
Marsu

Reply 28 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 01-Feb-2002

I agree that it would be good to have some coordination with the various fonts projects in process.

I believe that the majority of user needs can be accomplished with one more-or-less standard font, with other fonts dedicated for specialised needs ("jazz" looking fonts, ancient music, etc.). Ideally it would also have a nod from NoteWorthy Software, perhaps even being included in the distribution package.

I personally keep my fonts files to a bare minimum, and find it a real nuisance to have to load specialised fonts for individual files. It's different, of course, in published material where custom fonts can be embedded in pdf or ps files. But for nwc files that are published or otherwise distributed, I think it best to have a de-facto "standard" such as Boxmarks has been for the last few years.

Just my two bits' worth...

Font regards,
Fred

Reply 29 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 01-Feb-2002

Good ideas! Actually, I was aware of the symbols in other user fonts, since I looked at them first. But there were a couple of symbols in the other fonts that I use regularly, so I put them into my own font (to keep fonts to a minimum, as you wrote).

Tilted slurs, as a user-defined font, is a bad idea. I am hoping that my "NWslur" font will soon become obsolete.

Incidentally, I only work on fonts when I am away from home (using a laptop) rather than watch silly programs on TV. I do not know how our world-wide friends find their local TV, but some of the ones here (USA) are particularly asinine. I did most of the work for "NWslur" while avoiding "Judge Judy."


#2354: Where can I find and MIDI Cable?
Where can I find and MIDI Cable?

(2354)

Submitted by: Alice Spiller on 02-Jan-2002

Where can I find a MIDI cable to connect my ctk-471 Casio Keyboard to my computer? I've checked Radio Shack and Office Max.
Alice

Reply 1 offered by: Stephen Hutcheson on 02-Jan-2002

You're looking in the right neighborhood. The big electronics and computer stores -- Fry's, Computer City, CompUSA, Best Buy -- would also be worth checking. But, hey, you have internet access -- why not do a Google search for it?

Reply 2 offered by: Keith Sheasley on 02-Jan-2002

I got mine at the Cables N More site a few years back and they work fine. Currently $19 for the cables and $4 each for the extensions (highly recommended).

http://www.cablesnmor.com/midi-cable.html

Hope this helps,
Keith


#2355: Wav to Mp3
Wav to Mp3

(2355)

Submitted by: Dan Winkler on 02-Jan-2002

I Bet You Cant Do This But Can You Change A WAV To A MP3? Its Probably That Same Old Analogy For The Answer. But Thanks For Answering Me Anyway! --Dan

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 02-Jan-2002

Yes, an mp3 is basically a compressed wav. You need an "mp3 encoder" to do the conversion. Probably the easiest would be MusicMatch Jukebox, but if you're computer geeky you shouldn't have too much trouble getting the excellent freeware encoder BladeEnc to work. You can also get several optional Windows front-ends, if you don't like the command-line interface. (This is what I use. The front end I prefer is called BladeBatch.)

HTH
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Ertugrul iNANÇ <ertugrulinanc-at-yahoo-dot-com> on 02-Jan-2002

I use and recommend db PowerAmp Music Converter, which can use Lame Encoder as well as Blade Encoder, and can convert between wav, mp3 and wma.

Lame Encoder is advantageous because it can use "variable bitrate" in encoding.

I thought db PowerAmp was freeware but after about a years use it started to pop out nag screens. I don't know how much it costs, though.

Wav to midi is like converting a slice of bread into a sandwich, by analogy <g>

Hth,
Ertugrul

Reply 3 offered by: Dan Winkler on 03-Jan-2002

Thank You Very Much! Its Helped Alot! --Dan

Reply 4 offered by: Micolithe on 03-Feb-2002

i know of a freeware convertor called CDex 1.30 you can find the link on audiogalaxy.com's hardware/software page, but you need to go to the site, because no downloads from ag actually work.


#2357: Yamaha PSR-340
Yamaha PSR-340

(2357)

Submitted by: ALT on 03-Jan-2002

Hello. I have noticed with my Yamaha PSR-340 that whenever I have a floopy disk in the drive, my MIDI In/Out features are disabled. When I leave the floppy disk out when I turn the keyboard on, I have full MIDI support. It's not really a question, but if this advice helps anyone that's good. I don't know if it's supposed to do this, but it just works that way.

ALT


#2358: midi mapper won't open
midi mapper won't open

(2358)

Submitted by: Stephen on 04-Jan-2002

There is no playback; the red notes proceed as usual but there is no sound. I get a message that the MIDI mapper has not opened properly. In the past, playback problems were always caused by grumpiness and rebooted solved them. This time it does no good. Evidently the MIDI mapper needs a shot of graphite. What should I do? (I have Windows ME and Office 2000 Pro). Can I reinstall this critter, and if so how?

Stephen

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Jan-2002

Stephen,

With the information available, about all that can be said for sure is that "it's broken." Sometimes reinstalling Windows can help in such situations, but I'd only recommend that as a last resort. It's unlikely that Office would have anything to do with it, unless perhaps you happen to have a Word document with embedded midi open at the same time as you try to run NWC.

I'd suggest first poking around in Control Panel -> Multimedia -> Midi tab. It should normally be set for "single instrument", with an available playback device selected (highlighted).

If this doesn't help, more information about your hardware and software setup would be helpful. Can you play midis using Media Player or other midi player? Does your wav device work normally? (i.e. can you play mp3's or wav's?)

Good luck,
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 04-Jan-2002

Stephen,

It may not be necessary. Your symptoms sound very much like something that happened to me last night. I happened to be playing a MIDI quietly in the background using Media Player, when I tried to start playback in NWC (I have the MIDI Port Usage option set to "While Playing"). I got the message about the device failing to open, and from then on was unable to play back from NWC, even after a reboot. It wasn't until later that I thought to check the volume control applet. Somehow the MIDI volume had been set all the way down to zero, and changing it back to its usual value fixed the problem.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen on 07-Jan-2002

Thanks, Fred. Where should I look for the volume control applet in question?

The current state of affairs: I did look in Settings > Control Panel > Multimedia etc., and removed and reinstalled the relevant stuff. The result: the same message, but now referring not to MIDI Mapper but to SB16 MIDI Out (330). So I went back to Settings and looked again at everything. This time I noticed that while I had been operating with SB16 MIDI Out (330) for playback, I had another opption: Creative Music Synth 220. Well, thought I, let's try it. It did make some difference: with this creative thing, I still get the message that it's not opening properly, but if I go through the drill of checking to see which component is not opening, as far as the message that this must be corrected before proceeding, and then hit 'Cancel', I go back to my NW file--and it goes ahead and plays! It's a nuisance to have to go through this rigmarole each time, but now I can hear the files again. I do not understand this at all, but I'm pleased to be able to put my ears to work again.

The Sound and Multimedia file also tells me that I have no driver for Wave Device for Voice Modem, and it cannot find one anywhere. I don't know if that can have anything to do with this problem

Stephen

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 07-Jan-2002

Hi Stephen,

Sounds like you have one pretty confused system. There /could/ be a bearing with the missing modem wav device, glad you mentioned that. We had a similar kersnuffle on the machine at work (Win98SE - close enough to ME for the parallel to be interesting). The way we finally solved it was as follows:

1: Control Panel -> System -> Device manager. Remove everything under Sound, Video and Game Controllers.

2: Restart, and let it go through the process of finding everything again. In our case we didn't need the original driver disks, but it would be a good idea for you to have them available in case it asks you for "updated drivers" or whatever.
What's interesting is that the numbers after your midi devices apparently refer to the IO address; interesting, in that 220 is usually used for the legacy SB16 sound, and 330 for MPU-401 or other synth (e.g. your Creative Music Synth). [As an aside, you'll probably find your sound quality is considerably better using the CMS (once you get it working right), since the SB16 "FM synth" is normally only interesting for legacy (read "old") games that require this compatibility.]

If it still doesn't work after removing/refinding all the hardware devices, try it again from Safe Mode (hold F8 while rebooting, then choose the Safe Mode option). On several occasions I've found redundant device drivers in Safe mode that don't show up in normal mode, but still manage to gum up the works.

If all else fails, check the Creative site for updated drivers for your sound card specific to ME.

Good luck!
Fred
PS - the Volume Control applet normally lives in your system tray as a little speaker icon. If not, you can launch it manually by double-clicking on sndvol32.exe in the Windows directory.

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Jan-2002

Part of your Reply 3 message makes me think you might be selecting multiple devices for play back in NWC. Make sure you are only selecting one device for play back in NWC, especially when you are using the MIDI mapper (selecting multiple devices should only be done if you are sure that you have multiple devices to use, and then there is not any real reason to use the MIDI mapper).

Reply 6 offered by: David Palmquist on 15-Jan-2002

Stephen, I understand WindowsME does not include midimapper, so it's no sense hunting around for it.

I fooled around with NWC's reply no. 5, and that fixed my playback problem. The Control Panel icon in ME is named Sounds and Multimedia, and you'll want the second tab, which is AUDIO. I've toggled off the "use only preferred devices," and everything seems to be working.

Reply 7 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2002

This started in Windows 95. Internally, NWC still works with something called the MIDI Mapper device. Externally, though, users think of it as a Multimedia area of the control panel.

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen on 04-Feb-2002

This problem is solved. I followed all the good advice offered in this thread, and something clicked--what I'm not sure, but the playback is fine again.

Stephen


#2359: Instrument Patch - ntwpatch.ini
Instrument Patch - ntwpatch.ini

(2359)

Submitted by: Alan LaQuay on 05-Jan-2002

It has probably been posted before, but I can't locate anything related....

I have a Casio CTK-519, and I just modified the ntwpatch.ini file to account for all of the instruments in the tone bank. My problem is, that the CTK-519 is zero relative (Piano 1 is tone #000), But when I select Piano 1 from the instrument patch list, it inserts a [001]. Any clues? Thanks in advance.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 05-Jan-2002

The instrument patch number displayed on the staff always starts from 1. This doesn't effect what is actually sent to the device.


#2360: Creating a classical guitar midi file
Creating a classical guitar midi file

(2360)

Submitted by: Michael Marks on 05-Jan-2002

After using NoteWorthy for quite a long time, I thought I'd pretty much covered all the bases where keying in a score was concerned, but I'm beginning to suspect there are some unwritten rules about creating a guitar midi file by entering notes in NoteWorthy. I once saw a score in the NWC Scriptorium where each note (pitch) was enter on a different stave. What was that about? Does it have anything to do with something I read on the Classical Guitar Midi Archives, about the fact that guitar strings frequently ring out beyond their stated values, and anything else would not sound authentic?
Are there any other unwritten rules?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 05-Jan-2002

Yes, if you just enter the note durations verbatim from a score, you'll end up with a very chunky midi rendition. When a real guitar player realises a piece, the "rules" are: 1: Don't move a fretting finger until you have to, 2: Don't damp a string unless it sounds bad. So by treating each string as a separate instrument, allowing note durations to ring on in accordance with the above guidelines, a more realistic performance is attained.

As to other unwritten rules - there are only possibilities for improvement. So I wouldn't call them "rules" as much as "tricks" or techniques. For instance, hammer-ons and pull-offs can be made more realistic by applying an abrupt pitch bend + volume increase on an already-sounding note, rather than sounding a new note. Another example: real players get different timbres by playing closer to or further from the bridge, as needed; this can be emulated by mixing in varying amounts of, say, "acoustic steel guitar" patch to the classical nylon patch sound. An example is here.

Really the only "rule" I can think of is to set staff transposition to -12 so that it correctly sounds an octave lower than written.

HTH
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Jan-2002

Oh, yes, one other thing. Chords can be played "as written," or arpeggiated by "rolling" the right-hand fingers off the string. By appropriately interspersing simultaneous chords with arpeggiated chords, you gain another dimension of expression.

Sometimes arpeggiations are marked as such explicitly (usually the closing chord of a piece), but it's one of those "unspoken rules" that even other chords may - at the performer's discretion - be arpeggiated if considered appropriate.

Music for the guitar tends to involve the performer in the process of composition a lot more than most other instruments. You'll hear this on good recordings by, say Parkening or Bream, where apparent "liberties" are taken but are always tastefully and effectively done.

Fred

Reply 3 offered by: Michael Marks on 06-Jan-2002

Thanks. I get it. I'm going to re-do some of my stuff in this light. It looks a lot more tedious, so I guess you would only do this if the midi is what's important.

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 08-Jan-2002

I suppose doing the same for Cello (Suite of JSBach) or Harp can be of some interest either :)

About harp though: I read on the web site of audio compositor, that sometimes the soundcard keeps on producing sound even after the note off event (in the paragraph where they explain why there can be hundreds of simultaneous sounds on a 32-voices system). I suppose that, in that case, the midi driver (tries to) produce the sound as if it was a real instrument, making some kind of "resonance" after sound is off ?

What can be of some interest for more "real" sound, is to make open strings (or not played string on a "barré") resonate (some harmonics appear) where needed. But I think this becomes somewhat complex, and that is one of the reson why a "virtual" piano will never sound like an actual one. Well, not before they take care of that (which is not yet to my knowledge).
Particularly noticeable on the Cello Suite of Bach played by Paul Tortelier :)

my 0.02 euro contribution...

Reply 5 offered by: Stephen Randall on 08-Jan-2002

I notice that the upper end of the Roland digital piano range offers "sympathetic resonance". I take this to mean that the piano digitally simulates the effects of the presence of non-struck strings. Can a Roland owner comment?

It should be possible to adapted the technique to enhance the digital simulation of a guitar or other stringed instruments by adding resonances from undamped strings. Perhaps it already has.

Stephen

Reply 6 offered by: Jeremy Ewen on 08-Jan-2002

Having downloaded Fred's guitar piece as he suggested, I would like to know how he got the chords to spread out whilst still showing in a vertical line on the staff. I suppose I could look into the file a bit but I'm a bit lazy.....

Jeremy

Reply 7 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Jan-2002

Hint: Page Setup, click the box so there's a checkmark in the "Hidden" group, OK. I suggest maximising the window...

Fred

Reply 8 offered by: Michael Marks on 08-Jan-2002

Well Jeremy, let me answer for Fred. Go ahead, study the piece. Hint-hint - hidden staffs for sound, silent staffs for display. I've just finished looking and listening to it in greater detail and learned a lot. Very subtle combination of arpeggiation, pitch bends, and tempo, volume and instrument changes to create the variety of tone and expression on the classical guitar. But how did you do the harmonics, Fred? ('cause I can clearly identify it as harmonics)

AS it turns out I have Roland. It features reverb, delay, chorus and TVF (don't quite know what this last one does). So there's bound to be lots of residual sounds which Roland Sound Canvas touts as contributing towards realistic human performance. And it sounds great, but sometimes I think that you have to choose your effects very carefully and more specifically to mimic the types of over- and under-tones of the particular instrument: a general soft mushiness does not necessarily lend authenticity to specific instruments. What do y'all think?

Reply 9 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Jan-2002

Michael -

The harmonics in this piece (and a couple others I've done) were done by switching to the "dulcimer" patch (#16). On my particular sound system (Yamaha XG) it's quite realistic, but users of other synths have told me that it - simply stated - sounds awful.

I'm under the impression that Roland GS and Yamaha XG sounds are quite similar, an impression borne out by the fact that /most/ of my sequences sound ok on DirectMusic Midi (which is a subset of Roland's patches).

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 09-Jan-2002

Ah Fred, dulcimer again :)

Talking about such hidden staves, how did you compose (to my surpise and pleasure) the birds' song at the end of the Papagen[oa] duet?
I know you used the "bird tweet" instrument (patch?) but by sightreading it, it seems to me that it shouldn't sound as it does. Did you have lessons from Olivier Messiaen ??
I don't know on other synths, but with my old SB16 it's pretty pretty, as with SoftSynth50. Thanks for it!

Reply 11 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Jan-2002

No, marsu, I can't take credit for anything as exotic as that... I just mucked about with it until it kinda sounded right. ;-)

Fred

Reply 12 offered by: Grant on 09-Jan-2002

Not to worry. That's what Messiaen did too.

Reply 13 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jan-2002

I'd wager that the birds use a similar approach also. ;-)

btw - marsu, you're the first person to notice (or at least comment on) my little joke here. There's another "special effect" on the Queen of the Night aria if you're interested.


#2362: Windows XP and Printers
Windows XP and Printers

(2362)

Submitted by: Renaissance Man on 07-Jan-2002

This is way off the subject but I thought I would share my experience with other readers of the forum. I use an old Kyocera F1000 laser printer for b+w work, and loaded the "digitally signed" driver included with XP and all seemed well ...... until I tried printing a landscape format NWC file (and also Excel spreadsheets in landscape format) when after an even longer delay than normal the page printed with at least half of the page contents in the wrong place. I new it couldn't be a Noteworthy problem because it affected Excel aswell, so I started adjusting print spool settings, etc, all to no avail (and much wasted paper).

After much scratching of head I remembered getting an old DOS version of AutoCAD to print through the Kyocera using the HP Laserjet Series II setting, so I loaded this driver (again digitally signed) and bingo!, everything is OK again!

I suppose there are other message boards that might find this useful, but I thought fellow Noteworthy users should benefit first.


#2363: How do I add Trills in the form of a letter?
How do I add Trills in the form of a letter?

(2363)

Submitted by: Chase Hatmaker on 07-Jan-2002

How do I add Trills in the form of a letter?

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 08-Jan-2002

Click before the note you want trilled and insert text (right-click, notation, text)

You can either type "tr" and make it italic, or you may add the wavy lines for longer trills by pressing the ~ key (tr~~~)

Note that this is only the graphical trill, it will not affect playback.

-j

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 08-Jan-2002

There's also a readymade "tr~" symbol in the Boxmarks font, which you can download from the Helpful Files section of the NWC Scriptorium.


#2364: How to create instrumentals
How to create instrumentals

(2364)

Submitted by: james roberts on 09-Jan-2002

I am trying to create take a song and take out the lyrics and keep the instrumentals

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 10-Jan-2002

I'm not sure of what you mean, but supposing you want to have just the instruments and not the voices staves on an existing file (midi you import, or nwc), the simpler is to mute the voices staves.

Simply type M and check which staves you don't want to hear.

(you also could delete the staves you don't want, but this is irreversible when you have saved and closed the file.)

HTH

Reply 2 offered by: D on 11-Jan-2002

Assuming you don't want to see or hear the lyric staves, first go to the tools menu and select 'mute list'. Click on the check boxes next to the lyric staves to mute them.

To remove the lyric staves visually, go to the file menu and select 'page setup' and under the 'contents tab' click on the check boxes for the staves you want to see. This way the lyric staves will remain part of the file, just won't be visible or heard.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 11-Jan-2002

However, if there are tempo changes in muted staves, they will actually have effect (yes, even when muted).
The same goes for Fermata and breath marks.

IIRC, when exporting to midi, breath marks and fermataes are not "exported".

That's why I had talked about deleting the staves :) Just don't save your file in that case!

PS. This is so until current version (1.70.10) and may change later.


#2365: Noteworthy vs Encore4.5?
Noteworthy vs Encore4.5?

(2365)

Submitted by: Maximus on 09-Jan-2002

I have been using Encore for composing primarily because I like the ability to link, via midi, with Audio Compositor and play orchestral soundfonts in real-time.

Does anyone know if Noteworthy Composer can do the same?

Max

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jan-2002

Yes, NoteWorthy Composer's output can be sent to any available midi device, either via the midi mapper or directly.

Reply 2 offered by: Andrew on 10-Feb-2002

If you are wondering if NWC does "live" loading of soundfonts into soundcards, the answer is no. However, any soundcard that supports soundfonts and has a midi driver will be able to work with NWC, it's just that you'll have to load the soundfonts by hand.

A


#2366: Multiple bars with rests
Multiple bars with rests

(2366)

Submitted by: Allan Albrecht on 10-Jan-2002

My musical ability is somewhat limited and so is my composition ability. Anyway, I'm looking for a symbol that looks something like this: |=====7=====| which denotes there are 7 bars of whole rests. These are found in pieces where the accompaniment is separate from the vocal rendition. Help!

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 10-Jan-2002

This is available in "third party" fonts, which you can install onto your system and then assign to one of the "User" fonts slots.

Specifically, the "Boxmarks" font that many (perhaps most) of use use contains these symbols. You can get it at The NWC Scriptorium, in the "Helpful files" section.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 10-Jan-2002

I would add that if you want to keep the bars aligned properly, I suggest the following:
1. Enter all the measures with rests (since it's for rests:) ;
2. select all these measures (and inside bars) and rests and choose Visibility : Never (you can do it with one selection, then press Alt+Enter, then "Visibility" tab)
3. at the "center" bar, enter the symbols you mentioned above, with visibility Always and "preserve width" on.

That way:
- the playback will be ok
- the bars will be proprely aligned when printing more than this staff
- it will take room for one bar only when printing this staff alone
- the number on the bars will be correct.

HTH, and I think I should put this on the hint page :)

Note: this is available for repeated measures (with .//. symbols) also, you simply have to enter the music at each measure (copy/paste :), hide it the same. With local repeat bars, it would be misaligned and numbers wrong.

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 10-Jan-2002

oops, language confusion. Please read:
3. at the "center" *measure*, enter...
and
- it will take room for one *measure* only when printing this staff alone

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 10-Jan-2002

Also, keep in mind that the multiple-measure rests are being entered as "text," meaning that they are not interpreted if you create a MIDI output file.

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 11-Jan-2002

...unless you entered them hidden as I indicated :)

Reply 6 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 11-Jan-2002

Yes, Marsu, the multi-measure rests would be in the MIDI, if the user follows your instructions :)

Being lazy, I sometimes place a multi-measure "text" rest over a *single* invisible notation rest. In this case, the MIDI will have only one rest. That is what I meant :(

Reply 7 offered by: Allan Albrecht on 11-Jan-2002

Thanks everyone for your suggestions. I'm a little busy at the moment but as soon as I can get to it I'll let you know how I made out. I downloaded the files recommended but haven't installed them yet.


#2367: Scanning sheet music
Scanning sheet music

(2367)

Submitted by: Allan Albrecht on 10-Jan-2002

Recently I had a problem where I lost all my NWC files due to PC problem. I have hard copies of all my lost music but I would like to rescan them into NW. Some I have to edit for minor errors, some I have to add a few more bars. Is there any way to do this, save rewriting them all?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 10-Jan-2002

First of all, really sorry for you!!

Don't you have any copy of some of them, either on the NG if you posted it, or on the scripto?

Otherwise, you *may* scan them but the results vary a lot depending on the software used.

You may read msg #2310, msg #603, msg #555 and some others threads about OCR.

Sometimes it's quicker to re-enter the score entirely, depending on its complexity (and length!).

Hab mut! (have guts?)

P.S. Try to keep copies of your files on some other devices. Diskettes (you don't have an i-mac, do you?) are an easy way, since NWC files are *small*; but CDs (RW or not) are simpler for complete backups.
You may also send them to a webmail you own (but no backup is done by the providers usually).

Hope this helps!


#2368: MIDI Playback disabled
MIDI Playback disabled

(2368)

Submitted by: Danzo on 11-Jan-2002

After installing drivers for my Ensoniq Sound Blaster PCI64, everytime I restart my PC I get this message " MIDI wave set can't be loaded, MIDI playback has been disabled" how do I go about enabling it? please help

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Jan-2002

This is obviously some kind of setup problem, or perhaps your computer doesn't meet the minimum requirements for the card. This question is best addressed further with the maker of your sound card.

Reply 2 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 11-Jan-2002

First, see if the wavesets even exist. Look in Windows\System, you should have three files called eapci2m.ecw, eapci4m.ecw, and eapcmi8m.ecw plus there might be a default.ecw (just a copy of the presently active waveset).

To enable a waveset, right-click on the mixer icon (sort of a cyan coloured icon in the system tray) and bring up the configuration utility. Select the desired waveset, the 8 meg one will give the best sound.
However, I suspect that your problem runs deeper than that. Have a look in Control Panel -> Multimedia -> Advanced (or Devices, depending on Windows version) and look at the available midi devices. You should have two listings for Ensoniq, the internal midi (this is the one that uses the wavesets) and external midi. Look in Control Panel -> System -> Device Manager and see if there are any exclamation points.

Either way, I think what I'd do first is to remove all the PCI128 device drivers (in the Multimedia section) and also remove everything related to this card in the System section, then do a complete re-install.

HTH
Fred

Reply 3 offered by: Danzo on 16-Jan-2002

thank u very much, it works


#2369: MIDI Keyboard will not record
MIDI Keyboard will not record

(2369)

Submitted by: Tom Tranter on 13-Jan-2002

I have used my keyboard in the past to enter notation via the record option before, but for some reason it won't work now. I have a Creative SoundBlaster Live soundcard, and I know my MIDI keyboard is connected correctly as when I use the Creative Keyboard I can play from my MIDI connected keyboard. I have tried using only the MIDI Mapper as the selected playback device, and my record tab has MIDI IN selected as the recording device. Also, there are no problems playing MIDI files within Windows or from within NWC. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 14-Jan-2002

Make sure you turn on Tools | MIDI Input Active, and make sure you don't have other MIDI software running at the same time as NWC. Usually the correct SB Live MIDI In device includes the string "SB Live" in the name, so a device named "MIDI IN" may not be the correct driver.

Reply 2 offered by: Tom Tranter on 14-Jan-2002

Well, I managed to get it working. I have an older Casio 630 Keyboard. In order to get it working I need to change instruments on the keyboard. That seems to send some data over the MIDI channels which allows my computer to start receiving the MIDI signals. Anyway, all is well now and thanks for the response.


#2370: help for rhythm
help for rhythm

(2370)

Submitted by: Marco on 15-Jan-2002

when I select new ---> Rhythm , then I can select only dance,latin,metal,polka,rock and waltz.....
Where can I find other rhythms?
Help me please....
Thank you for your response....

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 15-Jan-2002

Welcome aboard.
You can find a lot of files at the scriptorium.
Particularly in the helpful files:nwc files section, where Barry and Andrew have put two files that are particularly of interest for your case : rhythms.zip and drumpatterns.nwc .
As the link ofr the latter is currently wrong on the scripto, here it is!

My greatful thanks to that two persons, once more :)

And don't forget that the files you can find in models, are standard NWC files. Only are they placed in the Template/Rhythm directory, and you can add some at will.
You can also create other directories, which will appear as tabs in the Template window (see this tip

HTH!


#2371: Crystal Soundfusion Sound Card Problem?
Crystal Soundfusion Sound Card Problem?

(2371)

Submitted by: Giacomo on 15-Jan-2002

My problem is the following: I’ve used for year this environment to enjoy myself and friends playing MIDI files:

THE PAST:
PC Pentium 133, 32 MB RAM
Sound Blaster AWE 32 ISA
Windows 98
A MIDI cable rightly connected to the game port of the AWE and to…
…a Roland E66 Keyboard. Noteworthy or simply things such as VanBAsco Karaoke player just to send output fm PC to my Roland…
(I know how to connect the MIDI cable :-) ...I remember years ago that I discovered that I had to plug MIDI OUT din6 connector of the cable to the MIDI IN port of the Keyboard and vice versa ... :-))

OK, THE PRESENT

now I’ve just set up this:

HP Kayak XU 800 PIII 600, 128 MB RAM
Crystal Soundfusion integraded audio
Windows XP
...the same cable, the same Keboard

BUT THE ONLY THING I CAN HEAR WHEN I PLAY MIDI ARE SOUNDS FROM PC SPEAKERS.....

I’ve tried everything....to set up Crystal properties to play MIDI through SoundFusion GS port, External MIDI....really any possible choice of set up in Control Panel and so on...

Some sounds come out from Keayboard speakers but are NON-SENSE sounds, with different midi instruments, how if signaling from PC to Roland is „confused...dirty...“ and they are some sound every maybe 10, maybe 25 maybe 5 seconds....ding, dand...., driin, pow, pow....slash!!

I’ VE ALSO TRIED TO SET UP WIN98 AGAIN BUT RESULTS ARE THE SAME SO I SUSPECT THAT IS SOMETHING RELATED TO THE SOUND CARD THAT ANYWAY IT WORKS FINE FOR OTHER PURPOSES...I.E. THE GAME PORT SUPPORTS WELL A JOYSTICK..

I read of this MIDI debug, where I could found it? Or if you have some idea? Some address to suggest me?...

THANK YOU VERY MUCH IN ADVANCE FOR ANY ANSWER YOU COULD GIVE ME…

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2002

By "same cable" I assume you mean a cable that connects from a sound card's joystick port and terminates in a MIDI IN and MIDI OUT connector.

You then say: "Some sounds come out from Keayboard speakers but are NON-SENSE sounds"

This would tend to indicate a buggy external MIDI driver, but could also indicate a more serious fault in the joystick port hardware. Sometimes, cables connected incorrectly can also cause this.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 15-Jan-2002

Another XP victim?

I'm not sure this is the proper page, but have a look at : http://www.clubic.com/m/pilotes/1227.html (sorry, clubic.com is in french, but this page is in english :)
Also http://www.hp.com/cposupport/personal_computing/support_doc/bph07512.html , theoritically for HP Pavilion PCS, but you may find somewhere interesting.
the HP help center ( http://www.hp.com/cgi-bin/cposupport/ccsearch/start ) may be a good start.

HTH!

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 15-Jan-2002

at the HP help center, enter "hp kayak xu800" as "product :)

Reply 4 offered by: Giacomo on 15-Jan-2002

Thanx everybody for answers. I think your suggestions will be useful. Anyway is not a cable problem (used up the day before :-))...I've also suspected a fault in HW but I don't explain myself on how is possible that joystick works fine...probably is something related to a bug in drivers!!
I don't think is related to XP at all but probably the Crystal drivers are somewhere bugged.
I'll continue to investigate up to the day that I'll buy a 25$ PCI SoundBlaster IRQ programmable!!!! with the always working IO 220/330, IRQ5, DMA1 and 5!!!! (playing Roland and DOOM III on XP? why not?!

Anyway I'll accept other suggestions...

Reply 5 offered by: Giacomo on 21-Jan-2002

just FYI…

I’ve installed a Creative Soundblaster PCI 128…

EVERYTHING WORKS! As I suspected so considerations are:

Microsoft: they LIE when on their knowledgebase saying that „old“ analogic joistick are not supported on XP (the „not connected“ problem) because with SB I was able to see and connect than use my“old“ Sidewinder Precision Pro on the SB game port.

HP: they LIE giving responsibility of problems on their PC with Crystal board to XP issues...problems are related to Crystal or maybe to its drivers...

Now I can play, everything, Roland and videogames...
So, to all guys who want to connect their PC to MIDI devices: DO NOT BUY Crystal or other "blaster compatible" boards. Take an Original SB....

Best Regards,


#2372: insert a 1/2 duration note on a 1/4 chord member
insert a 1/2 duration note on a 1/4 chord member

(2372)

Submitted by: Michel on 15-Jan-2002

I have troubles to insert a white note on 2 black chord member notes :

On a 3/4 time signature :
insert E note (1/4 duration)
Ctrl+insert
____________________

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2002

A couple things:

- Your 1/2 note must be completely above, or completely below your existing 1/4 notes

- If you set the stem direction of the existing 1/4 notes, you should set the opposite stem direction for the half note, or no stem direction at all

If, for some reason, you cannot conform to these rules, your primary option is to use Staff Layering.

Reply 2 offered by: Michel on 15-Jan-2002

I have troubles to insert a white note on 2 black chord member notes :

On a 3/4 time signature :
insert E note (1/4 duration)
Ctrl+insert G note (1/4 duration)
- - -
Ctrl+insert B note (1/2 duration) : this is impossible

How to do this ?

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2002

Key this in exactly:

0
Down Arrow
Down Arrow
Down Arrow
Down Arrow
Enter
Up Arrow
Up Arrow
Ctrl+Enter
Up Arrow
Up Arrow
2
Ctrl+Enter

Reply 4 offered by: Michel on 15-Jan-2002

Then, my problem is this when I key exactly :

0
Up Arrow
Up Arrow
Enter
Down Arrow
Down Arrow
2
Ctrl+Enter
Down Arrow
Down Arrow
3
Ctrl+Enter

Reply 5 offered by: marsu on 15-Jan-2002

This cannot be done yet.
You should try to use layered staff instead.

It is not the difference of lenght that causes the problem, it's the mix of up/down stems which crosses (down stem of a note higher than a note with up stem)

Si tu veux plus de détails sur les possibilités "layer", cherche dans le forum ou l'aide en ligne, ou écris-moi :)

HTH!

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 15-Jan-2002

See above: "Your 1/2 note must be completely above, or completely below your existing 1/4 notes"

Reply 7 offered by: Michel on 15-Jan-2002

I have just bought your software to key in classical music : I do this job for a choir : we sing DVORAK. I did not write this music, but he did. I need to sing his music.

Thanks for enhancements.

Reply 8 offered by: C. R. Lim on 15-Jan-2002

Michel,

What you wish to do is possible, but you have to use "staff layering" to accomplish this. The half-note is created on a separate staff which can then be superimposed on the chord containing 1/4 notes. You can also adjust the horizontal position to make the notation clear. See also the "SATB" file in the "templates" directory

If you are not sure how to proceed, Marsu or one of the other francophone users would surely be happy to help you.

HTH,
Bob

Reply 9 offered by: Michel on 16-Jan-2002

Thanx for this,

But as already explained to Marsu, I have to manage 8 staffs : 4 voices + 3 organs + 2 orchestral reduction.

This is Dvorak music : and the problem I am having is on the organ staff : you will certainly understand it is already complex enough to manage, so that I don't have to add another staff to by-pass these problems.
I'm really expecting enhancements on this.

Anyway, thank you again for your help.

Reply 10 offered by: Peter Edwards on 16-Jan-2002

Forgive me if I'm wrong, I get the impression you have not yet considered/understood the concept of staff layering.

Have a look at a file Organ Example that I submitted to the Scriptorium. Bar twelve has an example of what you are trying to do.

In fact there are eight staves, all visible, but only four show on the page because they have been layered in pairs.

It is a very powerful and flexible concept with few drawbacks, and one well worth getting some practice with.

Peter

Reply 11 offered by: Michael Powell on 16-Jan-2002

Michel,

The other thing to consider is if you are only entering the music into NWC for rehearsal purposes so that it "sounds" as written and if you are not concerned about the visual appearance of the score (i.e. that it looks exactly like the music you are keying in), you can accomplish what you want on a single staff by using a combination of tied and untied quarter notes.

Hope this helps.

Reply 12 offered by: Michel on 18-Jan-2002

Thanx to all of you.

Indeed I have tested the layering capabilities that I did not know (neither investigate) earlier. But anyway, I find it as a non acceptable work-arround on the music I am scripting because much too heavy. So far I have been typing this classical music song with limitation on Organ staves :
from bar line # 274 to # 365 I have been unable to type my notes in chord member on following bars :
276 - 277 -285 - 306 - 338 - 348 - 349 - 350 - 351 - 357 -362 ....
Don't you think it would be a pity to create a fake staff to enter rests from bar #1 to bar #275 and then fill with rests until problems encountered on bars mentionned above ?
I do.

I regret it because so far I felt confortable enough with NWC to buy it. I wish I could tell other members of my Choir to buy it as well soon with enhancements.

Reply 13 offered by: Peter Edwards on 18-Jan-2002

There are at least two ways round the problem of lots of empty bars.

The quick and dirty one is to insert a time signature of 99/1 (for example), a semibreve(whole note) rest and a bar line. That covers 396 crotchets (1/4 notes) in one go. Then put the proper time signature when you get to the point you need it.

More elegant is type say ten bars of semibreve rest/bar line in an otherwise empty stave. make them invisible. Then press the following keys:
home
shift+end
control+C
end
control+V as many times as you want

and in about 30 seconds (I timed my own clumsy efforts) you can get 200 empty bars.

BTW you can get one empty bar in seconds flat - just ask who's buying the next round ;-)

You might also find that there are other places in your score apart from the ones mentioned where perhaps layering will improve the look. e.g. where slurs or beams need to be duplicated - which can't be done on one staff.

HTH
Peter

Reply 14 offered by: Grant on 18-Jan-2002

Peter, I'd be wary of the "quick and dirty" approach because NoteWorthy has been very clear about not supporting staves with different numbers of measures. This isn't to say it won't work, but if it should happen not to, I imagine the response from NW Support would be "don't do that".

Michel, I agree that it seems a lot of work to create an almost-empty layered staff for the sake of one measure, but I've found that the extra work is tolerable in practice if you use cut-and-paste as Peter has suggested. It's always possible that the next release will bring a solution to this problem, but even if not, I still think NWC's flexibility and ease of use (not to mention the low price) make it the best notation software available for most uses.

Reply 15 offered by: Peter Edwards on 25-Jan-2002

A slower but effortless method of getting an appropriate blank staff is to open your piece of music and turn the recorder on. Make sure that there is at least one midi event (from your keyboard) at the point where you wish the blank staff to finish and , lo and behold, you have a staff with whole bar rests and all the appropriate time signatures in it too.

But there are some oddities.

The clef on the recorded staff is usually but not always the treble clef.

Why in 3/4 time are the whole bar rests dotted minims rather then semibreves? (Not really a problem since you can select them and press 'full stop' and '+' to correct this.

What is the purpose of the a second staff in the recording window? This extends up to the bar with the last time signature change in the original.

On the subject of proper recording, it would be a nice feature if the clefs and key signatures from the original staff were picked up in the recording window so that we did not have to force/audit accidentals to get the recorded music into its proper format.

Peter

Reply 16 offered by: Michel on 25-Jan-2002

The need is basic :
being able to provide electronic sound support to a choir.

To do so, I have the booklet of the song we sing in besides my computer and I need to copy the notes of the book on the computer to get a playable sound.

NWC is very convenient to key in notes on a staff (i.e. soprano) then another one (i.e. tenor) and so on for all the voices. But it becomes more tricky when you need to key in either piano or organ staves or orchestral reduction staves : because already melodies were grouped by the author on different staves but still you can have 2 or 3 melodies in a single staff for the piano for instance. There is the limitation of NWC that I encounter. So if I need to create extra staves to by-pass NWC current limitations, it is quite difficult to be able to key in notes for all voices , page after page on the booklet by keying note for a staff from the booklet, then jump to the next staff (very convenient with Page Up/Down) but then needing first to know if it is the real staff or the fake one needed for NWC. And on top of this , NWC does not support, as of today, capability to jump from staff to staff but stay on the same measure : this is where I get lost when copying from my booklet , being currently at the measure nu
mber 240 and finding a limitation on the piano. I create the staff, add the 239 rest, fill up my notes. Then I continue to key in on the "normal" staves untill I find the same problme on measure 319 : when jumping from normal staff to fake staff : the current position is lost : I was at measure 319 and when getting to fake staff I go back to ... 240 (which I do not know since numbering is put on the top staff only).

This is all I have , no instrument to plug so that I could record.

That's all folks.
Thanx for tips anyway.
Looking for next NWC upgrade.

Reply 17 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Jan-2002

>provide electronic sound

If you are only interested in the sound, then you do not need layering (even though it is the proper way to do SATB arrangements). You can just use ties to create the sounds of the different voices. Layering is still the best approach, though, as you can mute speicifc voices, print out various voices by themselves, etc...

>And on top of this , NWC does not support, as of today, capability to jump
>from staff to staff but stay on the same measure

Please explain. Unless you use a different bar structure on different staves, you should be able to do this without a problem.

Reply 18 offered by: Grant on 25-Jan-2002

What Michel wants is the ability to jump from measure <n> of one staff to the same measure on another staff, even if one or more of the intervening staves has fewer than <n> measures. This is, IMHO, a reasonable thing to want to do: for example, if you're entering music one staff at a time, and you are keeping parallel hidden and muted staves, and the staves you're working on happen not to be contiguous.

Most text editors I'm familiar with have this ability. As you move up or down between lines, when an intervening line appears that is shorter than the one where you started, the cursor moves to the end of the short line - but when you then move to a line at least as long as the original one, the cursor resumes its original position.

There seems no a priori reason why NWC couldn't treat a sequence of <page up> and <page down> keys the same way, by remembering what the current measure was when the "paging" started and making that measure current on any staff that's long enough.

Reply 19 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 25-Jan-2002

You have a point. We shall see.

Reply 20 offered by: marsu on 28-Jan-2002

Just a hint for Michel (and others :) about the current measure number (useful to know how much empty measures you have to add, for your problem): simply type Ctrl+G, et hop, the number displayed is the current measure number on that staff. Échap to stay here.

C'est simple et pratique.

Note: if you do this *prior* to use pgUp/pgDn keys, you can memorize (simply with Copy/Paste) the current measure number where you were before changing of staff :)

Eric: what about to show the current measure number in the status line, after staff name for instance?

Reply 21 offered by: Michel DELMOTTE on 28-Jan-2002

Thanx about the hint but it does not solve the problem.

Because when using pgUp/pgDn keys : if you reach a staff with fewer measures (i.e. 239) then the one you were in (i.e. 319) : you are forced to stay at this measure (i.e. 239) :
==> We would need instead some mechanism like "persistant note tool" : allowing you to navigate from staff to staff :
- either with the current mode
- or with the new expected mode : staying on the current measure .

Reply 22 offered by: marsu on 28-Jan-2002

Yes Michel, and I think Eric has understand this need, by reading his reply 19 :)

Now with another hint:
some of my own "templates" files are filled with staves which have hundred (in fact, 128, for some reasons) rests measures (with no time sig.).
This allows me to insert the music where I need it. I always have a lot of extra measures, who allow me to move up and down across staves whithout trouble, as long as the measures are complete (particularly the one I'm writing).

At the end of the editing process, I remove the remaining extra measures (3 keystrokes per staff).
Add I constantly keep an extra staff, to
- keep some items that appear often (pp, ff, special MPCs...)
- transpose a part of a staff (copy from origin, paste&transpose in that extra staff, cut/paste to where needed)
- keep rest measures

HTH :)

Reply 23 offered by: Michel on 28-Jan-2002

I did not know that online@ntworthy.com was Eric. Hello to Eric then.

I thought already as you to start from such templates but I find it not easy to manage because if you do so in a SATB + organ template , you don't know which rest was intended from which was in from the template definition :
i.e. I'm currently keying an "Agnus Dei" which starts with an organ play for 20 measures, then Basso only until 22 then soprano until 40 then other voices ..... And Since it takes time to key this at night after work I do this over several nights (which I do not complain about by the way). But since I need to retrieve my song in the same context as when I left it the night before this method of using templates with plenty of rests is not affordable.

Plus the fact that you have to remove useless rests ...

What would be great ,by the way, would be to have an automatic bar line entering based on the time signature : as it was the case on a former tool I used.

Reply 24 offered by: marsu on 28-Jan-2002

Well, I clearly see your kind of working for music after working "tout court", as I live(d) it too.

Something I used to find where I was after re-opening a file not yet finished, is to store that information in the ..."Info" window, as I explained in msg #2378 (reply 4)

Otherwise, the "automatic" beam is not a bad idea; however, the "Audit _B_ar lines" tool is already useful. (Warning: if no time sig. is present, it assumes C (4/4); and expect that the first measure is complete, i.e. no "anacrouse", unless you fill it with hidden rests).

"Undo" works fine with it anyway (as with the rest of NWC), if you don't like the results.
Bar line is also usable with the '*' sign on the numpad (an old wish that one, from a right-hand user (was it Sarah?)). I prefer the tab key.

HTH...


#2373: velocity to compression ratio
velocity to compression ratio

(2373)

Submitted by: Shonni on 16-Jan-2002

I'm tracking midi kick drums to audio using Cubase. If my kicks are at 120-127 velocitys, what are some good compression, threshold, bass, LM, HM, and Treble settings I can use to keep from getting distortion in my car speakers? (I'm EQing on the Avalon preamp)

Reply 1 offered by: C. R. Lim on 16-Jan-2002

I'm sure if you repeat your question here or here you will get some more relevant answers.
Do come back if you need help on Noteworthy!


#2374: on play
on play

(2374)

Submitted by: gérard on 17-Jan-2002

Why ihave not sound when i rest on play? thank you

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 17-Jan-2002

Gérard, I answer you in french in a separate mail.

À tout de suite :)


#2375: Layering
Layering

(2375)

Submitted by: Evan on 18-Jan-2002

Hi...I would like to know how to layer scores...like say i wanted to have an orchestra template and i wanted to layer basoon 1 and 2... how do i do it????
Please help!!!

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 18-Jan-2002

1. choose the two staves you want to layer. These must be next to each other in the score (not separated by any other staves). Then, on the upper of these staves, bring up the Staff Properties dialog (pressing <F2> wll do it), go to the Visual tab, and check the box labeled "Layer with next staff". Click on "OK".

2. Now bring up the Page Setup dialog (<alt>fg) and go to the Contents tab. Check the box labeled "Allow layering". Now the staves will appear one superimposed over the other.

You can edit your staves while they are layered (moving between staves using <PageUp> and <PageDown>), or edit with the staves unlayered and layer them only to check that they'll appear correctly in the printout. I find it easier to do most of my work with the layering disabled, but others prefer to edit with layering turned on so they can tell right away how the end result will look.

One useful feature for layered staves is the ability to change the directions of stems, ties and slurs. Stem direction can be changed by selecting a note and pressing <Shift><UpArrow> or <Shift><DownArrow>. Slur and tie direction can be changed by selecting the note where the slur or tie begins, bringing up its Properties dialog (<Ctrl>e) and selecting the desired direction from the "Slur Direction" or "Tie Direction" list box.

(These instructions assume you want to layer only 2 staves together. For more staves, just select "Layer with next staff" on all but the lowest.)

Reply 2 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 20-Jan-2002

Keep in mind that layering visually superposes whatever is on the layered staves (unless something is hidden). This is not necessarily the same thing as constructing chords on a single layer. In particular, if beamed notes at different pitches are layered, then both sets of beams will appear. If you inadvertently have stems pointing in the same direction, layered eighth notes may appear to be sixteenth notes.

If you do need stems pointing in the same direction, consider using chords rather than layering. If you sometimes need stems the same direction, other times opposite (as with SATB harmony with "moving" notes), then use a combination of chords and layering. You can use hidden rests to occupy un-needed measures.


#2376: Text size
Text size

(2376)

Submitted by: Brian Nedvin on 19-Jan-2002

Could someone please tell me how to increase the size of the lyric text. I've been to page setup and have been able to change the size of the title text, but have had no success in altering the size of the lyric text. I thank you in advance for your time and help. in peace, Brian Nedvin

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Jan-2002

You do it the same way. Go to File | Page Setup, click on the Fonts tab, then doouble click Staff Lyric, then you can change the typeface, style, and size from the Font dialog box.


#2377: getting started
getting started

(2377)

Submitted by: PETER FORD on 19-Jan-2002

I have recently purchased a Casio wk1300 keyboard and NOTE WORTHY COMPOSER. My aim is to teach myself music, to play the keyboard and to use Noteworthy in conjunction with my keyboard. I am using USB Midisport 1 x 1 interface that is installed correctly.
To date I am unable to either send or receive any data from the keyboard. I am 69 years old but fully conversant with PCs and the use of many aspects of Noteworthy. I would be most grateful if some kind person could explain the communication proceedure to get my keyboard fully working, at present, the more i read the more confused I become. Many thanks. Peter Ford

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 19-Jan-2002

Let's start with determining what works, and how you know it works. You say:

>using USB Midisport 1 x 1 interface that is installed correctly

What did you do to verify that it is installed correctly? This statement seems inconsistent with your next comment:

>To date I am unable to either send or receive any
>data from the keyboard

After you have successfully installed the box and the cables, sending and receiving from your MIDI keyboard is a simple process.

Sending from NWC to the keyboard: Select the external MIDI device in Tools | Options | Midi | Devices used by play back. When first doing this, make sure that this is the ONLY device that you configure for use by play back.

Sending from the keyboard to NWC: Select the external MIDI device in Tools | Options | Record | Input Device. Then, start a new file with File | New, enable MIDI input from Tools | MIDI Input Active, and notes you play on the keyboard will appear in the active staff. Once this works, you might want to try your hand at real-time recording using Tools | Record.


#2378: Setting individual staff sizes
Setting individual staff sizes

(2378)

Submitted by: Simon on 20-Jan-2002

It would save me a lot of paper if an accompanying part could be printed at a smaller pitch than the 'main' part. Page Setup|Options|Staff Size is OK as a universal setting. But is there any way to override it for individual staffs (which would still have to remain lined up, of course!)?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 21-Jan-2002

I fear this is currently not possible, at least directly with NWC alone.

You could try to export the pages to an image- (vectoriel) or word- processor software and reduce (in height) the staves you want to, but it would be a lot of work.

However, you may play with the heights of the staves (for instance, reduce them to 8, which is the minimum currently) : in the "Visual" tab of the Staff Property (F2 or Alt,s,p, or click menus Staff|Staff Properties...), set Vertical Size "Upper" and "Lower" to 8.

HTH!

Reply 2 offered by: Simon on 21-Jan-2002

Thanks - I submitted my request after I'd tried various workarounds like this, without much success.
I guess I'll add this to the wishlist.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen Randall on 22-Jan-2002

I have recently been doing a lot of part extraction from a NWC score. It occurred to me that it would also be useful to have a "top staff only" staff size as well as a "default" staff size.

I often found it necessary to tweak the staff size to avoid a final page that is mainly blank space. However, as NWC only has a global staff size, it doesn't remember, for example, that the clarinet part, needed to by 14 point after I have set the staff size to 16 to make the tuba part extend to the bottom of the page. Finding the optimum size for each part takes quite a bit of experimentation. When I come back to the piece again, I can imagine that I am going to have to do all that experimentation from scratch.

See you at the wish list.

Stephen

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 23-Jan-2002

Well, Stephen, I think you could use the "info" windows to store that kind of information.
On my side, I use it to remind the "printing conditions": margins size, paper size/orientation...
And with in-progress files, I use this as a reminder of what is done and what is not:
go and see "Absalon fili mi" absalonf.nwc in http://madmarsu.multimania.com/Nwc/ directory, then click on the "info" icon (I cannot copy/paste it here, since the font is not fixed, and spaces/tabs are condensed into a single space).
(x means terminated)
Very useful indeed!


#2379: Stuck Notes
Stuck Notes

(2379)

Submitted by: Evan on 22-Jan-2002

Hi, i am transcribing the overture to The Marriage of Figaro into NWC and i am having trouble with notes sticking after the ties have stopped. I have looked in the help and i did what it said, butit didn't work...anyone willing to help???

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 22-Jan-2002

If you make sure that notes on both sides of a tie (especially across a barline) have the same accidental, it /should/ work. The accidental will show up in grey, which means it's there as a courtesy for you but won't show up in printing (as should be).

HTH
Fred

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 23-Jan-2002

Also be sure not to be confused between slur and tie.
I'm often, because in french there is only one word for both...
The tie is on the right of the note.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 23-Jan-2002

...and slurs won't cause a stuck note, like a tie could do if not terminated properly.


#2380: soprano clef
soprano clef

(2380)

Submitted by: david savir on 23-Jan-2002

I need a soprano clef. Any ideas on how to patch one into the dropdown list of clefs?

The soprano clef resembles alto and tenor, but its middle is on the bottom line of the staff: C appears in the position of E in the treble clef.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Jan-2002

You can insert the clef visually as text, by setting one of the User Fonts to NWCV15.TTF. The text character for the alto/tenor clef symbol is "c". Experiment with the font size to get it the proper size. You can then insert a standard clef (such as treble or alto) as a hidden item, and adjust your note positions to suit. If you also want proper playback, use transposition on that staff as needed. (-2 on treble clef should be right).

You'll also have to duplicate the text clef after every system break, either "natural" or forced.

Fiddly, but it should work for you.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 23-Jan-2002

Funny that you have to use that clef (Clef de sol 3).
Only a few people can read it, and it's mainly used for *high* parts (it's written one octave higher than the Clef de Sol 2 (the one you find usually on right hand piano part), in fact it's over the other one. I saw it once for very high parts on a flute/piccolo piece. I prefer the 8vo sign much better :)

If you have some key signature, you also have to enter it "by hand", the same way Fred explained for the Clef.

Of course, a single copy of all these items simultaneously will allow you to paste it at will where you need it.

For playback, I'm afraid you'll need to create a hidden staff and copy the music in it (select all, copy, paste in the new (with treble clef), and move twice in down direction). Don't forget to mute the "soprano" clef-ed staff, for the key signature on it wouldn't sound correct. (even if transposed 2 tones (4 semitones) lower, the minor interval are not on the same location in the scale...

HTH :)

P.S. The same kind of problem occurs with the other Clef d'ut and clef de fa. But they are rarely used (viole de gambe, theorbe essentially)


#2381: mpc
mpc

(2381)

Submitted by: e on 23-Jan-2002

how do i use the multi point controller?
like what can it do to enhance a score's playback?

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 23-Jan-2002

Multipoint controllers can be used to stepwise or gradually change any of a broad range of midi controllers, including but not limited to pan, volume, expression, reverb, chorus depth, and even things like tempo which aren't strictly speaking midi controllers.

My suggestion is to download the "NWC Command Summary" from NWC Scriptorium, this has a fairly extensive "learn as you do" tutorial section on the use of mpc's.

Regards,
Fred


#2383: Notation for spoken parts in a song
Notation for spoken parts in a song

(2383)

Submitted by: Allan Albrecht on 25-Jan-2002

I've run across a situation where some words are spoken rather than sung. There are all kinds of notes on the toolbar but not this. Actually, I soppose I'm looking for something that doesn't have a notehead, instead it is replaced by an'x'. The stems would be the same as regular notes to maintain the integrity of the timing. Any help out there? I looked at the drum beat in NWC15 but that really doesn't turn me on, where you have to convert the score to a metafile and work on it with a wordprocessor.

Reply 1 offered by: Steve Pearson on 25-Jan-2002

Assuming you do not desire any music to be played in the relevant measures, could you simply have a non-visible rest, and then insert text at the appropriate locations to signal the words?

Another option (if you need the words placed where the beat would be and/or want to use the Lyrics option (control l): type in notes in the staff in the desired beat; select "visibility, never" under properties for the notes; use the multipoint controller to set volume in the relevant measures and staff to zero; finally, use insert text ("x") to insert the appropriate "marker" as desired within the staff.

I am not quite sure of your situation, but those may be options. If not, provide some additional detail.

Query to some of the gurus out there: do the box fonts or one of the custom font packages maybe have a symbol/note for the written word?

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 25-Jan-2002

Wasn't very clear on the first option I suspect. My thought was to insert the "x"'s or whatever in the staff via the text tool ("x"), and then insert the spoken words below those "x's", again using the text tool.

Reply 3 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jan-2002

A workaround would be to use an ordinary "x" (as text) as the notehead, perhaps in a sans-serif font such as Arial or Verdana, with the stems fashioned from the ALT 0124 character. Place them before a hidden rest. If the x is aligned "at next note/bar", justification Center, and the "stems" are preceded by a space, alignment at next note/bar, justification left, it seems to work out quite well. I've posted an illustration here and will leave it there for awhile.

Regards,
Fred

Reply 4 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 26-Jan-2002

PS - you have to view this in NWC itself, the browser plugin doesn't really do it justice...

Reply 5 offered by: Allan Albrecht on 26-Jan-2002

It looks like I didn't explain myself clearly enough. I need a note on which the notehead is replaced by an "x". I've seen this type of notation used on printed music. Thanks for the suggestions so far.

Reply 6 offered by: Peter Edwards on 26-Jan-2002

In reply 1 there is no need to replace invisible rests with invisible notes. Just set the rests (in the desired rhythm) to 'lyric syllable/always'.

Reply 7 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 26-Jan-2002

Actually, your request is a solved problem.
Solution: go to my music fonts page, indexed from:

http://www.icogitate.com/~ra849

Download the font "MusiTone." This font has a variety of x-head notes, including some with flags etc. Install it, then make it a "user font" in NWC. I'm not sure what point size to use.

Do your music using ordinary notes with the spoken lyrics. Then make the notes invisible. Place MusiTone as text where the notes are, one by one (do it one by one, and they stay aligned). Don't try this with beamed notes, though.

If, however, you wish to globally replace ordinary note heads with x-heads in all parts of the composition (leaving no ordinary note heads), then go to the Scriptorium (link from the NWC home page), and find the user font files. There's one that does the job. How it works is by replacement of the notation font in an exported WMF, which you then place into a word processing document.

Reply 8 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 26-Jan-2002

Correction: The font you want from my page is "MusiSync," not "MusiTone." Don't worry if the description of the font doesn't sound like it meets your needs. I put the X-head notes in, too.

Reply 9 offered by: Allan Albrecht on 28-Jan-2002

The temporary solution I came up with was to place an 'x' (page font) above or below the notehead. As I'm not really worried about producing a midi file, this does the trick. Thanks for the suggestions, I've downloaded several font files now and I'll have to find out what's in them once I've got them unzipped.

Reply 10 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 28-Jan-2002

Look on the Scriptorium for the new "Bongos" font. It might be useful.

Reply 11 offered by: Allan Albrecht on 29-Jan-2002

Note to reply 10. I downloaded Bongos. Thanks.


#2384: Editing Text above staff
Editing Text above staff

(2384)

Submitted by: RC on 26-Jan-2002

I did search on this but couldn't find answer to solve my problem. After I have prepared a score, including guitar chord letters (e.g., C, G7) above the staff, I sometimes discover that I need to change those letters. Is there any way of deleting one entry (such as C) and change it to another (say G7) without deleting everything on the staff itself?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 26-Jan-2002

Try these: msg #1761 (reply 4), msg #1167, msg #142

Reply 2 offered by: RC on 27-Jan-2002

Thx much -- Got just the answer I needed.


#2385: help
help

(2385)

Submitted by: e on 27-Jan-2002

how do i make trills and things without having to hide staffs and make a lot of 32nd notes?

thanx

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 28-Jan-2002

You can also use MPCs for trills. Play with the "pitch bend" controller, using "absolute" as style, "32nd" as Time resolution, 1 as sweep res;
then you can use 4 values to 4 notes.
duplicate (do not redo, but copy/paste) as much as needed.
don't forget to finish with 0 as value for pitch.
8191 is plus one tone (2 semitones)
-8191 is minus 2 semitones

HTH.

Note: I used this to make trills more realistic on flute (where they are often not perfect tuned), by using less correct values for pitch.
2nd note: it's less readable (some months later) than hidden staff...

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 11-Feb-2002

See an example file here

NWCly yours,
MAD


#2386: Please give me some tips...
Please give me some tips...

(2386)

Submitted by: Everett Wade on 27-Jan-2002

I know these may have been already answered, but I don't really know how I'd search for them because I don't know the correct terminology. I need help with stuff like note slides, like were you smoothly slide up to another note. Also fading volume stuff... doesnm't it have something to do with the mpc's stuff? I don't know how to implement these things, so if you could just tell me where to find threads already on it, or explain it, I'd really appreciate it.
Ev

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 28-Jan-2002

Go to the Scriptorium, in Command summary and look at page 67, section 4.

The whole documentation is really worthy.

HTH!

Another approach is to try and test. Move juste one parameter at a time.


#2387: how to submit your own nwc files to the database?
how to submit your own nwc files to the database?

(2387)

Submitted by: Everett Wade on 28-Jan-2002

how? I can't find anything on it. Am I just blind? I have a feeling it's all in front of me...
Ev

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 28-Jan-2002

Which database??
If you're talkin about the Scriptorium, go here where everything is explained and up-to-date.
Be sure to read it completely, and to send files achieved preferably.


#2388: New font on Scripto: Bongos
New font on Scripto: Bongos

(2388)

Submitted by: Robert Allgeyer on 28-Jan-2002

I just posted another font, "Bongos," on the Scriptorium. It is intended for those of you who export WMFs from NWC into a word processing document. Using Bongos (in the document, rather than in NWC) you can add X-head notation in lines, with or without connecting horizontal. The font is very flexible, allowing beamed notes, triplets, etc. to 1/16 duration.

The font is very specific: Some contemporary church music (particularly Latino) has a hand drum accompaniment below the choral parts. That's what "Bongos" does.


#2389: mpc help
mpc help

(2389)

Submitted by: e on 28-Jan-2002

hi, i got told how to make a trill using the mpc, but all i can do is make a wierd grace note sound. Please can someone tell me how to make a trill with the mpc. Please use language that i can understand, seeing that i am 13 years of age. And can u please tell me what the things look like in detail please.

Thank you kindly,
e

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 07-Feb-2002

"e", I'll try to put an NWC file that show this on my website ASAP (as soon as possible).
HTH! (Hope This Helps)

NWCly yours

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 11-Feb-2002

I've done it.
You may find an NWC file on trills1.nwc

HTH!


#2390: Goldberg Variations
Goldberg Variations

(2390)

Submitted by: Sam on 29-Jan-2002

Hi, I am looking for nwc or midi of Bachs Goldberg Variations. It goes by another name which I dont know, so does someone know its original name?

I have tried to search "Goldberg" at the scriptorium but there were no matches.

- Sam

Reply 1 offered by: Grant on 29-Jan-2002

Sam,

It's also known as the "Aria with Thirty Variations", and it's number 988 in the Schmieder catalog of Bach's Works; you'll see this as the BWV number or occasionally as the S. number.

Reply 2 offered by: Grant on 29-Jan-2002

By the way, I don't know of any NWC versions of the Goldberg Variations, but there are several MIDI versions on the J.S. Bach page of the Classical MIDI Archives.


#2391: FM synth implementation of chorus effect
FM synth implementation of chorus effect

(2391)

Submitted by: Ryoung on 29-Jan-2002

Hi, I have been trying to learn how to program my sound card. I have been successful at reading midi files and programming my sound card's fm synthesizer so that it gives a rough estimation of the way the music is supposed to sound. For simple midi's my little routine seems perfectly adequate, but for more complex songs it is painfully clear that more needs to be done.

I have been trying to find out how chorus control is programmed into the FM synthesizer. If anyone can explain chorus effects on attack, decay, sustain, and release or any other relevant attributes of the FM synth, I would be most thankful.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 29-Jan-2002

Unfortunately, the FM synths (SB16 compatibles, AdLib, etc.) do not support chorus, reverb or expression. Channel volume is implemented, but rather poorly; there isn't much change until you get near the bottom, then the volume changes abruptly.

Even pan is badly implemented, only panning to about six discrete position, IIRC. So you can't do a smooth pan, it will always sound stepped and choppy.

The best idea is to dump the FM synth entirely. It's perfectly adequate for background noise in games (which was its primary intent), but is practically useless for serious music work.

Although, with the interest in retro synthesisers, I'm sure it won't be long before someone writes a concerto for SB16 FM synth. ;-)

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: Steve Pearson on 29-Jan-2002

Re Fred's comment: I wonder if John Cage's 4'33" would be suitable?

Seriously, however, decent wavetable cards are very inexpensive these days. Rather than spend hours trying work arounds with an FM card, I would urge you consider getting a different card. The SoundBlaster Live (Value) is a well-supported, highly used and inexpensive card. (I do not know what kind of computer you have, but if it is less than three or four years old and has a PCI slot, should be able to carry the soundblaster).

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 30-Jan-2002

4min33s should be ok :)
(Note: 4'33'' is an angle measure, not a duration, if you want to respect standard abbreviations)

About SBLive: inexpensive? The first time I saw one, its value was about 300 USD (1800FRF). Hope it's not so expensive now.
Does it have its own memory, or does it use the "main" memory, btw?

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 30-Jan-2002

SBLive 5.1 is about £30 (+VAT). It does use main memory.

And perhaps 4'33" is correct - it's a little known fact that the title was actually a reference to the angle by which the sustain pedal had to be depressed to achieve the authentic performance.

Peter

Reply 5 offered by: Ryoung on 30-Jan-2002

Thanks for all the help! That will save me some serious future headaches!

I'm sure I will get a new sound card sometime in the near future.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 30-Jan-2002

about a new card: be sure that the driver is available for the combination of your version of operating system(s) and the card you plan to buy.
Never believe a seller on his/her sole words.

And finally ask if you return the product back if not suitable to your PC configuration (it happens)

HTH!

Reply 7 offered by: Ryoung on 30-Jan-2002

Will do.

The beast I have now is a strange one anyway. It is, I think, a Crystal Logic card that supports two modes of operation: Windows Sound System and Sound Blaster Pro compatible. I think the Windows Sound System is significantly more advanced since Winamp will play at high quality the Bohemian Rhapsody sample midi I have been working with. Unfortunately I can't use the Windows Sound System mode since the application I am developing for will not be under Windows.

Reply 8 offered by: Steve Pearson on 01-Feb-2002

Quick note on sound card costs and then I'll be quiet.

SB Live (Value) can now be readily obtained for less than $ 70 U.S.

If downloadable soundfont capacity is not needed, I have always liked the wavetables on the Ensoniq PCI. Those are available for around $ 20 US.

The Yamaha XG's are also pretty good and can be acquired quite cheaply.

Not sure where you are located, but some good deals can be found on ebay (provided you only buy from folks who have good ratings)

Reply 9 offered by: Everett Wade on 01-Feb-2002

John Cage's 4'33" was also 4 mins 33 seconds long.
Ev


#2393: Transposing Imported Midi Files
Transposing Imported Midi Files

(2393)

Submitted by: Douglas Carter on 29-Jan-2002

I have been a Noteworthy user now for a few years, and am always glad to see at least trhree updates to the program per year. Howevr I seemed to have lost something in the las update when it comes to transposing midi files. I alo use Musictime Deluxe and when I want to place files on the web I use Noteworthy. Therefore I make a midi file of the MT file and open it in Noteworthy. What I find is , say a file in Eb comes in with the notes sharpen insead of flattened, and I ca no long correct it. HELP!!

Reply 1 offered by: David Palmquist on 30-Jan-2002

Go to Tools, Transpose... When you click there, you'll get a little popup menu which allows you to set key signature preferences at the bottom. That should work for accidentals too, I think (but I haven't tried).


#2394: Different Line Thickness in printing Metafiles
Different Line Thickness in printing Metafiles

(2394)

Submitted by: Beppe Torchio on 30-Jan-2002

Whereas I manage to get near perfect printed scores with the "copy from preview" feature, the end product exported to, say, Word Files or Page Maker files, is always printed with lines of different thickness, in random fashion.
Can anyone help......? This It is the only hurdle towards a perfectly printed score, worthy of publishing. This fault shows up whether one exports placeable metafiles,or clipboard (Windows format Metafiles).
Thank you all.
Beppe Torchio

Reply 1 offered by: Simon Gray on 30-Jan-2002

The way I've managed to overcome this same problem is:
1) Print to file (*.prn)
2) Open the .prn in Ghostscript
3) Convert to tiff format (*.tif)
4) Insert the .tif file, as a graphic, in the word processing application (I use StarOffice).

Good luck!

Reply 2 offered by: Beppe Torchio on 30-Jan-2002

Simon, thanks so much, specially for the prompt reply... I'll follow your "steps"..... Regards.Beppe Torchio

Reply 3 offered by: marsu on 30-Jan-2002

This can happen if you make some enlargements (vertically) to the image file.
You can experiment the same if you stretch an image (for example, a screen copy) in Word.
Try to stretch the image at various values, and you'll find the correct one.
HTH!

Reply 4 offered by: Robert Allgeyer on 30-Jan-2002

When a WMF is copied from NWC, its resolution (dpi) is equal to whatever resolution happens to be set for the selected printer, at the moment the WMF is created.

Suggestion: Either increase or decrease the printer resolution, before you create the WMF. Generally, if a WMF (at 300 dpi or less) is scaled when placed in a document (the usual situation), the round-off error may be noticeable, even if printed to the same printer used when the WMF was created. If possible, create the WMF at 600 dpi. If necessary, install a phantom printer (to file) at the necessary resolution, just to be used when the WMF is copied out of NWC.

Just a few weeks ago, I used 600 dpi WMFs from NWC in MS Word, at various scales, and was delighted with the printouts.

A WMF copied from NWC includes white-space margins when inserted into applications such as MS Word. Thus, even if page size and margins are identical in NWC and in the word processor, the placed WMF is scaled down to accomodate the double margins. Be sure to crop excess.

Using WMFs is tricky. I have two non-music applications that did not correctly calculate WMFs (from any source) when placed. Symbols were misaligned. On the other hand, inspection of a WMF from NWC, using a professional drawing application, shows that the WMF is correct.


#2395: Update now available 1.70.11
Update now available 1.70.11

(2395)

Submitted by: David Palmquist on 30-Jan-2002

Noteworthy folks, quit hiding your light under a bush, you have no need to be shy! Please give us a short note in __this__ forum when you update the program, so those of us who visit it often will know. I went a whole week without knowing release 1.70.11 had come out.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 30-Jan-2002

Hmm, this reminds me Luke 11:33...
1.70.11 was available from 18/01/2002, and without your thread, David, I still would not know.
Thank you!
Now I know I have to use a "mind it" (see http://www.netmind.com/ ) on the upgrade or what's new page.

Reply 2 offered by: David Palmquist on 30-Jan-2002

Glad Marsu spotted my message. NWC folks, my first post sounded like a bit of a rant - not intended by any means. I have been delighted with your product for years and I truly appreciate every aspect of it (well, except default window size, but that's an old topic).

Thank you and keep up the good work!

Reply 3 offered by: Hank Robertson on 03-Feb-2002

Just do as I do, every time you log on to the NWC site check the 'NEW' stuff first, then go to the forum. <G>.

Reply 4 offered by: Artur on 04-Feb-2002

I've expecting Nw to say something, because whenever they do, they say what the new stuff is. I don't like the new version of improvements list that they built, I can't tell what are .11 improvements, .10 ones and so on... Still waiting

Reply 5 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Feb-2002

The new stuff is listed on the upgrade page.

Reply 6 offered by: marsu on 05-Feb-2002

The .10 to .11 new fixes can be known by making a "diff" between the current upgrade page and the previous one.

btw, the changes are listed in chronological order, so last changes are topmost.


#2396: Hammond B3
Hammond B3

(2396)

Submitted by: Michael Lewis on 30-Jan-2002

Anyone know of where I can get the Hammond B3 soundFont that has the "Lelsie" Effect?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 01-Feb-2002

one www.google.fr search gave me this:
http://www.soundfont.com/downloads/sonido_hammond.asp (9.95 USD)
http://www.sonicimplants.com/Products/B3downloads.htm (4.95 USD, don't know the differences)
fan page (some interesting details): http://www.barryrudolph.com/ingear/bottomline/sonicimplantsb3.html
and a ring page .

HTH!


#2397: Keyboard to sound card plug
Keyboard to sound card plug

(2397)

Submitted by: RC on 30-Jan-2002

I have a laptop with limited sound-card plug-ins -- only microphone and earphone jacks. What will be needed when I want to enter music from my keyboard to my computer?

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 30-Jan-2002

If you don't have a suitable MIDI/joystick port, then your other choices are dependent on what ports are in your computer. You need a MIDI interface. These come in a variety of schemes:

- USB
- Serial Port
- PCMCIA card

You can search for these in this forum to learn more about what others have chosen. Naturally, you can only use a scheme that employs a port that exists on your computer.

Reply 2 offered by: RC on 31-Jan-2002

I have PCMCIA slot and a while back saw some software advertised that, if I understood right, made it possible to use PCMCIA for joystick entry. Did I interpret you correctly about joystick? Is that the best (only?)way of achieving MIDI In to a computer? I will also do some searches of this forum. Thanks.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 31-Jan-2002

No, you don't want a joystick connector (on desktops, these ports ten to support dual use as a MIDI port). You want a device that gives you a MIDI interface capability (see above).

Reply 4 offered by: RC on 01-Feb-2002

OK - got it clear in my head this time. Thanks. Will look for means of either plugging in to my PCMCIA slot or a USB port. Will do search now.


#2398: Sound Blaster Audigy Platinum Ex
Sound Blaster Audigy Platinum Ex

(2398)

Submitted by: Michael Lewis on 01-Feb-2002

Is this a good one to pick? I would think it would be..

Reply 1 offered by: E. Rubinstein on 02-Feb-2002

I do not know about the audigy platinium Ex, I myself use The Sound Blaster Platinum Live! and I am most SATISFIED (See www.creative.com)Hope I helped


#2401: What are you favorite original *.nwc files?
What are you favorite original *.nwc files?

(2401)

Submitted by: Everett Wade on 03-Feb-2002

What are your favorite original compositions done by other nwc users in the scriptorium database? The only one I liked that much was Fred Nachbaur's "Caverns" that came with the program... Anyone else know of some real good ones? I'm not much of a fan of atonal music.
Ev

Reply 1 offered by: Joe Eidson on 03-Feb-2002

I really like "Caverns" as well. I have some original pieces that I really like, mainly for video game scores. Anyone else?

Reply 2 offered by: Artur Soares on 04-Feb-2002

I personaly like my ones, of course. I've got symphonic works, concerto ones, sonatas, chamber music and when I decide to listen to something I listen to them.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen on 05-Feb-2002

"Caverns," definitely. "God save the Queen" and "Jingle bells" are not exactly original with NWC, and "Jingle bells" is a very unimaginative tune at best. But "Caverns" is fun, and is something new that NWC gives us.

Stephen

Reply 4 offered by: Robin Withey on 08-Feb-2002

I hope you're reading all these, Fred!
I like "Caverns" too. And how many of you have heard Fred's "Fractal Suite" - well worth a listen.

Robin

Reply 5 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 08-Feb-2002

Yes... [blush]. Thanks, guys.

Fred

Reply 6 offered by: Everett Wade on 08-Feb-2002

I can't find any of you guys compositions in the scriptorium... Mine should be up in a while. I'm more of an improvazationalist on the piano, so my nwc's aren't the best.

Reply 7 offered by: Elliott on 08-Feb-2002

I have yet to find a piece on the NWC Scriptorium which fits my taste. The style of music therein seems obsolete at best. Personally, I find 'Caverns' annoying. Apologies, Frederick.

Reply 8 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 09-Feb-2002

'Salright, Elliot. No offense taken.

Part of the difficulty is that almost all of the music composed in the last century is still under copyright, so we can't post such works on the Scriptorium even if we may have sequenced them for our own enjoyment.

Have you looked over the (admittedly sparse) collection of originals in the Rock/Country/Pop/Jazz section?

Reply 9 offered by: Andrew on 10-Feb-2002

Well, being an artform, I think all the compositions are going to be appreciated according to taste. I think there are some splendid compositions on the Scriptorium, in a large variety of styles (not just atonal), and recommend those that haven't yet visited it to check out
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/usercomp.html and
http://www.vadu.com/nwc/inmemoriam.html

w.r.t. the tunes sent with the NWC distribution, they are just examples, after all.

A


#2403: Harmonic Analyser V2.3 released
Harmonic Analyser V2.3 released

(2403)

Submitted by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Feb-2002

Only slightly off-topic: slightly because this program operates on midi files, not NWC files directly...

Version 2.3 of the "Harmonic Analyser" midi tempering suite has been released. Create, modify, import any of a large number of scale temperaments, then use the results to temper pre-existing midi files by one of two methods: "MidiTemper" is appropriate for single-line tracks (no chords), and "PianoTuner" for overlapping notes or chords on a single track. Either tempering option can now be called directly from the main program without having to export the data first.

Many other refinements. Works under DOS or most flavours of Windows (exception being keyboard issues under Win 2K).

Harmonic Analyser page

Cheers,
Fred


#2404: excess space after first note under slur
excess space after first note under slur

(2404)

Submitted by: Stephen on 04-Feb-2002

Now there is a new problem: some (only some) groups of notes under a slur have a large space between the first and second notes of the group. This is not related to the 'Increase note spacing for larger note values' thing under Page Setup>Options; I turn this off, and the extra space appears regardless of the length of the first note. Also it is not affected by the presence or absence of an underscore before the syllable in the lyrics. I cannot find any difference between the syllables that get this extra space and those that don't. But it occurs frequently enough to bugger up the page count, e.g. things that would fit easily on one page otherwise take up two because there are so many of these unwanted extra spaces after notes. Does anyone out there have an explanation and treatment for this phenomenon?

Stephen

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 04-Feb-2002

I've never observed slurring to cause extra note spacing, perhaps if you posted an example on the newsgroup someone might be able to figure out what's causing it.

I'd have a look at items on other staves, since NWC lines up the note times it could be that some item on another staff is taking up space, forcing the additional space on all staves. Text items with "Preserve Width" checked on comes to mind, but even the "Best Fit" and "Before Other Staff Signatures" alignments can cause added space to be used in some situations.

Fred

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Feb-2002

Adding a slur to a note will not cause a note to take more space. You can confirm this by simply selecting the note and clicking the slur tool button. If the actual width of the note changes when you perform this action, then please send your example file to us, as this shouldn't happen.

Reply 3 offered by: Stephen on 05-Feb-2002

Hello Fred! It's not 'preserve width' either, and there is only one staff. NWC Online: It is not the slur itself that does it; but it is under some slurs that it shows up. Removing the slur only causes the notes to distribute themselves over the following syllables of the lyrics and tells us nothing. But removing the lyrics does tell us something; it causes the spacing to return to normal. So it is something connected with the lyrics; but what? If I am to send you a sample file, how do I go about it?

Stephen

Reply 4 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Feb-2002

A bit of experimentation shows that the lyric syllable (under standard rules) will not extend beyond the centre of the last notehead of a slurred (or tied) sequence of notes.

Intiguingly the space after the first note is much larger than the spaces after subsequent note in the sequence.

This is a distinct improvement on the old lyric alignment where the syllable stopped well short of the second note.

So a long syllable will extend the spacing after the note, but it is the syllable that is doing it, not the slur or tie.

HTH
Peter

Reply 5 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Feb-2002

A bit more thought (driving in to work) and more experimantation!

Adding a slur does in fact increase the note spacing to the next note (for a sufficiently large syllable) because it moves the start of the syllable to the start of the first note, but the total space occupied stays the same (approximately) because there is now less space taken before the note.

Reply 6 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Feb-2002

Hah, I did not think of the possible effects of a lyric syllable. Yes, under default behaviour, a slur can change note spacing as lyric syllables get reformatted.

Reply 7 offered by: marsu on 06-Feb-2002

did some tests myself, and the only case where it does some changes, is when lyrics are too long, such as in psalmody: "bless_the_lord_my_soul" under one single note (breve or whole), and lyrics are set to "standard rules".
In any other case, it's the same.

Reply 8 offered by: Stephen on 06-Feb-2002

Aha! I wasn't hallucinating! Now can someone tell me how to move the notes together again? Marsu: can one now bunch syllables under a single note? How? For a long stretch of recitative this would be useful, but my understanding has always been that NWC didn't permit it.

Stephen

Reply 9 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Feb-2002

You can put syllable together as on pseudo-syllable by linking them with underscores. These print out as blank spaces. Default behaviour is that the note is centered on the syllable. If you want it at the start of the syllable just tie an invisible grace note to the recit note.

Being more adventurous, you can layer another staff and insert invisible rests in the rhythm of the chant - very effective when playing back. (Note to NoteWorthy - please can we have the ability to chord an invisible rest with a visible note then one wouldn't have to use a separate stave :-)

Reply 10 offered by: marsu on 06-Feb-2002

some points:
1. Peter: the grace note hint seems a bug to me; NWSupport, will it keep this behavio(u)r? Knowing that specifying "Lyrics Syllable" as "Always" to the grace note removes this hint. (You can also set "never" to the grace note, and "always" to the non-grace" note; experiment for 8 combinations (grace,non-grace,slur=> 8 possibilities))
2. Stephen: use '_' instead of spaces to make more than one word/syllable being attached to one note. This is available since NWC 1.20 I think :)
3. Stephen: you can also add notes and specify them *not* to have lyrics (useful for some short notes before the next long one, in psalmody)
4. Peter: you can have a rest "chorded" with a note, provided you enter the rest first, and the note be longer than the rest. But the "visibility" is for the chord in its entirety.

HTH!

Reply 11 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Feb-2002

1. Sorry - I should have said that you have to set Lyric/Always

2. That's what I said too :-(

4. Yes I know you can. I think I'm a couple of steps ahead of you here ;-)

Peter

Reply 12 offered by: Stephen on 09-Feb-2002

Thanks, everyone. Is it possible, when this phenomenon of more space after the first note of a slurred group appears, to shorten that space to make it the same as the spaces between the other notes?

Stephen

Reply 13 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 09-Feb-2002

Yes. Just add blank text that keeps its width, or add extra note spacing to the later notes in the slur sequence.


#2405: Transposing and note markings
Transposing and note markings

(2405)

Submitted by: RC on 04-Feb-2002

I know that there are a ton of prior messages on transposition and I have gone thru many of them but maybe my question is just too simple.

I have a song entered in key of C. I want to have it restated with notes for key of G - 5 semitones lower. When I do Tools/Transpose Staff and enter -5, the notes get restated but all F notes now have sharp symbol attached. I don't want that. If I do a Key Signature change to G, then two sharps are shown for the signature. I simply want the song produced in Key of G, with no F sharp symbols on individual notes. I would also like to have the single sharp signature for F given at beginning of the staff.

Hope I have made this plain. By the way, I can't say enough about how much I am impressed by the Notworthy program. I am a rank amateur but am getting a lot of use out of it.

--RC

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 04-Feb-2002

I am not totally clear here, but did you have a key signature in the staff before the transpose? If not, you need one.

See msg #122

Reply 2 offered by: Everett Wade on 04-Feb-2002

If something is in the key of C and you just move it down to G and have the C key signature it will sound like you're hitting a flat note everytime you come by that F. You need the F sharp for it to sound right.

Reply 3 offered by: Barry Graham on 05-Feb-2002

I think he is saying that the F# shouldn't show because it's specifed in the key signature.
I would say Eric's reply is the answer.

If the original key signature is C or Am you should place the appropriate key signature at the start of the staff.

Yes - I know - C and Am don't have a key signature but NWC will place a non-printing natural sign as the key signature when it is entered for these keys.

If you dont have the C (Am) key signature in place when you transposes NWC doesn't know the key your coming from and supplies the necessary sharps/flats to preserve the intervals.

Rule: Always add a key signature before transposition even when the key is C /Am.

Reply 4 offered by: RC on 05-Feb-2002

OK - I've got it now. This is one area where it seems that the solution is not intuitive and the Help falls a bit short. Maybe I just fell a bit short in figuring it out. When I entered the Key of C for the staff before transposing, the appearance of the natural sign troubled me a bit. Thank you -- that does the trick alright. The Key must be entered even for C (and Am you say tho I have no experience with that yet). - - - - The playback of the transposed staff is another question that puzzled me until I figured out that one must go into Staff/Staff Properties and then set the transposition at zero -- that is, after the note changes have taken place -- if you want to hear the playback at the new pitch.

Thanks again.

Reply 5 offered by: Grant on 05-Feb-2002

About setting the transposition back to zero: you can do this manually after transposing, or you can just make sure the "update staff transposition" box in the transposition tool dialog is unchecked.

If this box is checked, the effect of transposition will be visual only, because NWC will automatically fiddle with the MIDI transposition in the staff's properties to exactly counteract the transposition. Why? So that you can write for a transposing instrument at concert (sounding) pitch and then transpose the visual representation so that an instrumentalist would play the score correctly. For example, you wouldn't want the clarinet part in an orchestral score to play back a C in MIDI, if in fact an actual clarinetist would read the C and produce a B-flat.

If you want the playback sound to track the transposition, just make sure "update staff playback transposition" is unchecked when you use the transposition tool. Then NWC will not go to the trouble of counteracting the transposition in the staff's MIDI properties, and what you see will be what you hear. (IMHO this should be the default, but we don't always get everything we want.)


#2406: Orchestral reduction for piano
Orchestral reduction for piano

(2406)

Submitted by: Doree  on 06-Feb-2002

I am a music student and a project that I have been assigned is to take a full orchestral score and re-write it for piano (reduction). I am having so much trouble. I need to put 3 or 4 note in the right hand and the same in the left. The note values include everything from a dotted eighth to a whole note. I cannot seem to get the stems to include 3 or 4 notes each, of differing note values. Is this possible to overcome?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 06-Feb-2002

Doree, it seems your problem is like the msg #2372 thread.

I'd suggest either to use layering, or to simplify the score.
The latter happens frequently when reducing an orchestra to piano, though I never did this myself, but saw it often on choir scores.
The reduction must be playable, and having notes of different lengths would mean to lift up the fingers at various times while keeping the others down. This happens in some scores, but not with 4 lengths! and keeping fingers down reduces the mobility of the hand.

I think that a big part of this kind of work is to determine which notes are important and have to be kept, and which are to be ignored. IMHO of course, but it seems to my ears that this is done that way on reduction scores I was on Enchanted Flute for instance.

HTH!

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 06-Feb-2002

You are limited in what you can do in one staff, but you can overlap multiple staves using layering.

Reply 3 offered by: Peter Edwards on 06-Feb-2002

Certainly layering helps, but this is one instance where there is still a problem even using that technique.

Once notes have tails (almost certain if there are four different note values) then the stacked tails don't overlap properly. Thus if the notes are quaver beamed, then they look like semiquaver beams, and if they are tailed they look like nothing on earth.

Hence a previous request for alterable stem lengths.

BTW the standard NWC quaver beamed note stem is actually too long to start with (IMHO of course). Most of the music I have shows the beam of a treble clef E (bottom line) having its beam resting on the D line, whereas NWC has it touching the F line.

Peter

Reply 4 offered by: Everett Wade on 09-Feb-2002

Actually you can use 3 staves for piano, two treble and one bass, I've seen it done before in Debussy's preludes(solo piano peices.) A little bit harder to read, but piano wizzes like my mom can /sightread/ it. Sick eh?
Ev


#2408: NWC vs PrintMusic
NWC vs PrintMusic

(2408)

Submitted by: Lito Saulo on 06-Feb-2002

Hi,
I'm currently evaluating these 2 products. I'm new to notation. They seem to be comparable except that PrintMusic is more expensive. Can someone who is knowledgeable about these 2 comment on this please?

Reply 1 offered by: Ted Kuster on 06-Feb-2002

PrintMusic works on the Mac. I have a friend who uses it because he has a Mac, but I'm close to getting him to switch to a PC so he can use Noteworthy. PrintMusic claims to produce cross-platform output using HTML, but so far that feature hasn't worked. The only way I can see my friend's charts play back is by going over to his house and watching on his Mac. Not impressed.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 07-Feb-2002

Lito: welcome to NWC. It is a good product, reliable, inexpensive, easy to use and quick to learn.
For notation purposes, it has some limitations that won't be troublesome unless you make some special music or want to reproduce exactly some scores. But most of the time there is one or more "workaround" which will help you to do what you want.

Ted: please let your friend keep his Mac! He has a *reliable* operating system (much more than any Windows), and if he really want to use NWC, he can: install BlueLabel or some other PC emulator. An emulator for Win3.11 is enough (and quick enough on a Mac), since NWC also work with this version of windows. And leaving Mac to Windows may be a risk for his nerves... IMHO of course; though I do not know any person who left Mac to Windows and was happy of the change. Even after years of use.

About PrintMusic: where can we find a "demo" version? And will it be as good as the "real" version?

About NWC: the "demo" or "shareware" version of NWC is fully functionable, except copying to a reg'd file, saving (limited to 10 times), and some text items are added on printing non-reg'd files (this does not apply to reg-d files, such the one you'll find on the scriptorium, which will allow you to be convinced of the printout quality of NWC)

Do not hesitate to ask for details, since many users as I am are ready to help.
The Command summary may help too!

HTH

Reply 3 offered by: Everett Wade on 07-Feb-2002

I've used macs for a long while and comps with Windows... even though windows crashes sometimes IMO it is waaaaaaay better. Macs are so so so confining. Less software, less compatibility blah blah blah...
And I'm a computer nerd so it's easier for me to tinker with windows... mac OSes aren't too good for tinkering, they're too graphical.. bleh
Ev

Reply 4 offered by: Lito Saulo on 07-Feb-2002

The latest version of PrintMusic runs well on a PC! It is actually not a bad notation program. But NWC is pretty good too! And cheaper!


#2409: Synchronizing sound and score highlight
Synchronizing sound and score highlight

(2409)

Submitted by: NGUYEN Phan-Anh on 06-Feb-2002

When I play .nwc files on my computer (Windows 98, AMD XP 1700+, Mother card's Sound device) the sound is played a short time later after the corresponding highlighted score.

Is there any way to synchronize playing sound and score highlighting ?

Thanks for your support.

Reply 1 offered by: Fred Nachbaur on 06-Feb-2002

Hi Nguyen,

I don't think there's much you can do about this. This has been reported before with on-board sound devices, also with Yamaha SoftSynth drivers.

NW Software - perhaps it would be worth considering a "note chase delay" option for a future release? A similar delay timer has been incorporated on the VanBasco Karaoke player, to help synchronise the karaoke lyrics on sound devices with noticeable latency.

Reply 2 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 07-Feb-2002

Perhaps. I would say, though, that it is not one of our highest priorities at present.

Reply 3 offered by: NGUYEN Phan-Anh on 08-Feb-2002

Thanks Fred for your kind reply.
I also don't think we can do something about this unless NoteWorthy considers it.
I wonder what would be the highest priority at present ?

Reply 4 offered by: Elliott on 08-Feb-2002

The same system should be integrated into MIDI record. When I record through my serial MIDI cable, a small delay (about 1 sixteenth note, usually) lies on the new staff in relation to the music already composed.


#2410: comping slashes
comping slashes

(2410)

Submitted by: Ted Kuster on 06-Feb-2002

I write for a salsa band. In some of the extended improvisation sections, my piano and bass players are accustomed to seeing four slashes per bar that mean "comp," which means play a more or less pre-established pattern over the chords given under the staff. For midi playback I write out the pattern, but for printing I want to hide the notes (not the bar lines) and replace them with these 4 slashes per measure. I tried using the Boxmarks font to produce the slashes as text, but I can't get them to fit reliably between the bar lines, as the bar lines seem to get squeezed when the notes between them are hidden. Is there a good way to get this effect?

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 07-Feb-2002

Ted,
making one text item with '////' (in boxmarks or boxmark2 font) will make slashes to be too far away;
making 4 text items (preserve width off) of a single '/' will show only 3 of them if they are placed one each before a quarter. (the first one is on the same location than the second)
However, if the first quarter is replaced by dotted eight plus a 16th rest, with the '/' between them, then it works.
It may not be a solution in any case though.
I'll add the '////' symbol as a single character in a new version of boxmark2, which should solve your problem, but I can't do this before next week.
An example of what I just wrote is available here soon.
HTH!

Reply 2 offered by: Ted Kuster on 07-Feb-2002

Marsu, you are a genius. Thanks. I await your new font release eagerly.
Ted


#2411: bar lines and whole rests
bar lines and whole rests

(2411)

Submitted by: jmb on 08-Feb-2002

I've been writing songs purely for printing purposes.
I have a song where the lyric staff(top) has no notes in it for the last four measures of the song. So I wanted to put four measures with a whole rest in each one to fill up the end of the score. But when I do this, the bar lines don't match up with the ones on my other staves. I just want the score to look uniformed, but my top staff is now shorter than my other two, even though they have the same amount of beats. Am I just overlooking something? If someone can please help me i would really appreciate it. (I hope I explained the problem enough)

Thanks,
jmb

Reply 1 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Feb-2002

If you send a copy of the e-mail to me, I will have a look and let you know what is wrong.

Reply 2 offered by: marsu on 08-Feb-2002

Maybe there is a measure which doesn't have the same amount of beats.
Did you check each staff with the "audit Bar lines" Tool?? (Alt t, b)

This require to have a "Time Signature" (g shortkey, menu Insert|time siGnature), which must be on each and every staves.

(Note: if the first measure is incomplete (anachrouse), fill it with hidden rests first)

Note to Support: I just tried (with vocalacc template), and if the time sig. is added only on first staff, then the audit doesn't work properly (try with 7 quarters plus 3 whole rests on top staff, and 20 on staves 2 and 3). Add the 4/4 sig. on top staff only; audit bar line on staff 2, then 3, then 1. re-audit staff 1. Re-Re-audit staff one. The whole rests are changed to dotted half rest plus a quarter rest, one each time)
Note to the previous note: I just retried from scratch, and couldn't reproduce it?? I must have done something on the first try. But the strange behaviour happened, even if I'm not able to reproduce it now :(
Found out: insert a bar line before each rest, but without any time sig. (or with, it does apply too)

Conclusion: make sure you have set time signature to EACH staff BEFORE inserting bar lines.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 08-Feb-2002

Thanks marsu. Your bug report was received. A fix will be in the next release.

Reply 4 offered by: jmb on 08-Feb-2002

Thank you! I audited the bar lines, and realized when I changed a measuer to 2/4 time, I forgot to change it back to 4/4! As you can tell, I'm new to writing music, I'm a self taught musician and I just recently learned how to read (music, that is [ha ha]), and what I know about writing I've learnd through NWC. I really appreciate your help. It's saved me a trip to the looney bin!!!

Thanks again,
jmb


#2413: NWC-files ==> MP3
NWC-files ==> MP3

(2413)

Submitted by: Paul on 11-Feb-2002

Is there a program which can convert NoteWorthy Composer-files into MP3? I would like to put my NWC-files on an audio-cd; WinOnCd however does only support .MP3 and .WAV files if you want to make an audio-cd.

Please help.

Reply 1 offered by: marsu on 11-Feb-2002

As there is an NWC plug-in fro WinAmp, and as winamp can record to MP3 format, I think the solution is obvious.

Otherwise, go and search for MP3 in this forum, as the subject (format convertions) has been many times explained/discussed.

HTH.

Reply 2 offered by: Paul on 11-Feb-2002

Thank you Marsu,

I downloaded Winamp and the NWC-Winamp plug-in. I hope it'll work.

Reply 3 offered by: NoteWorthy Online on 11-Feb-2002

Winamp may not work. In the versions for which I am familiar, the optional plug-in must redirect its output through a Winamp input in order for its output to file features to work.

You can still do it, though. You can either:
1) Save your NWC files as MIDI and use a MIDI-to-MP3 converter

2) Use a recorder, such as MusicMatch Jukebox to record an NWC song while it is playing. You need full duplex soundcard support in order to do this.

These, and other options, are discussed in numerous past threads (see the search mechanism).

Reply 4 offered by: marsu on 11-Feb-2002

Oh? Didn't know this. I must be lucky on that one. I must admit that it works, but I don't know why. Mystery of Windows' applications & drivers...